| Wednesday, June 15th, 2016, 00:01 UTC | ||
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| [08:11:51] | stuarta: | morning all |
| [09:43:20] | stuarta: | hmm, mediawiki 1.27 release has slipped back to june |
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| [12:37:54] | stuarta: | dmfrey_: just double checking something, the chromecast bits, they require https??? |
| [12:59:28] | jheizer: | stuarta, not the person you asked, but yes they do. |
| [13:09:40] | stuarta: | thought so, that's the way i configured it |
| [13:09:57] | stuarta: | well configuring, scripts aren't behaving right now |
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| [13:21:15] | stuarta: | hmmm, alcor just broke.... |
| [13:21:18] | ** stuarta fiddles ** | |
| [13:47:23] | stuarta: | damn oob access isn't working |
| [13:47:33] | ** stuarta fires ticket at osuosl ** | |
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| [16:29:58] | dblain: | Toying with the idea of implementing Protocol Buffers (serialization) and gRPC (transport) for the Services API framework. Would this be useful or a waste of time? I don't have much time to devote to MythTV so don't want to waist it if it won't be useful. |
| [16:32:15] | MitchCapper: | whats the benefit dblain? |
| [16:33:47] | dblain: | Protocol Buffers is a binary wire protocol that is language/platform neutral. See https://developers.google.com/protocol-buffers/docs/overview |
| [16:34:17] | MitchCapper: | yeah sorry I am familar with it, its just the protocol itself doesnt seem to have much overhead for any service API usage I can generally think of |
| [16:35:49] | MitchCapper: | i guess if you had a really large recording library there might be some benefit but even with 1000+ it seems pretty good |
| [16:35:53] | dblain: | I'd make it so the proto files would be generated by mythbackend (similar to the WSDL files). This would allow clients to generate classes to interface with it. |
| [16:36:31] | dblain: | There has been some complaints in the past about the size of XML and JSON. |
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| [16:38:27] | MitchCapper: | well it certainly fixes size issues:) |
| [16:40:33] | MitchCapper: | autoclasses have benefits although at least at this point the api space is not so large that moving to json was much hassle, I think the wrapper classes only took maybe an hour or so to write for most of the standard types. |
| [16:42:19] | dblain: | For .net pointing to the wsdl files generates the proxy files within seconds. Protocol buffers would be just another choice (but more choices are not always better, that is why I'm asking :) ) |
| [16:44:48] | jheizer: | Since it is somewher relevant and I just learned about this the other day http://json2csharp.com/ |
| [16:45:16] | dblain: | Also, Protocol Buffers would be a potential replacement for the MythProtocol, IF everyone would want to change to a more extensible protocol. (Not that I'm looking to make this change) |
| [16:46:57] | dblain: | jheizer: nice to know about, but why would someone want to use json to access mythbackend from C# when SOAP is so integrated and seamless? |
| [16:47:47] | jheizer: | I don't. I just knew you were a VS person. |
| [16:48:00] | dblain: | Thanks. Useful link. |
| [16:48:05] | jheizer: | I know I've had to make my share of classes over the years for json services and been all ugh. |
| [16:48:41] | MitchCapper: | SOAP was broken for awhile, JSON allows more fine grained conversion control, and writing json wrapper classes is quick:) |
| [16:49:18] | MitchCapper: | Using JSON.NET over MS's native option is pretty smooth i have to say. |
| [16:49:43] | MitchCapper: | if I get time to round out a few of the other service api wrapper classes ill put them on GH |
| [16:51:52] | dblain: | MitchCapper: I wrote the Services API Framework to initially work with .net SOAP so if it has issues please let me know. Being able to simplly "Add Service" and point to the backend has always worked for me. That said, if you want to hand write json wrapper classes, go for it (I just don't see the benefit) |
| [16:52:43] | jheizer: | Talking about the enum wrapped class? that was broke before and recently fixed |
| [16:52:52] | jheizer: | MitchCapper is that is. |
| [16:53:09] | MitchCapper: | https://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/12510 was the bug i tried to fix for awhile but honestly json was easy enough:) |
| [16:55:10] | dblain: | Can't access server. either something is wrong with it or my connection has a problem. |
| [16:56:44] | MitchCapper: | no its down right now but yeah its the recent class bug that got fixed. |
| [16:57:44] | dblain: | MitchCapper: ah, yeah sorry about that. It took so long to fix since I needed to fix the msvc build first and didn't have much time. |
| [16:58:46] | MitchCapper: | no problems i tried what I could but then just moved on json really is not much hassle. Honestly aside from some of the tickets I currently have open i think the next thing i may try to work on is polling/ notification support for the services api |
| [16:58:48] | dblain: | BTW the workaround would have been to save the WSDL and manually tweak the enum type. But that is all in the past. |
| [16:59:45] | MitchCapper: | as writing a proper frontend remote control that is contextually aware is a bit of a challenge, other than just constant status requests |
| [16:59:54] | dblain: | there is already event notification built in... no one seems to know this. It's part of the upnp stack but is actually standalone. |
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| [17:00:22] | MitchCapper: | this I did not know. |
| [17:01:06] | dblain: | It's a subscribe/publish model that is used by the upnp spec to allow clients to be pushed notifications that the content has changed. |
| [17:01:49] | dblain: | Also, I know stuartm has WebSockets implemented that could also be leveraged |
| [17:02:29] | MitchCapper: | is webstockets in a branch? |
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| [17:03:36] | dblain: | I believe it's in master, but stuartm would be a better person to explain it's current state. |
| [17:04:08] | MitchCapper: | well thanks for all the heads up:) I will be sure to check it out. |
| [17:05:03] | dblain: | For the pub/sub eventing take a look at libmythupnp/eventing.cpp |
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| [17:27:43] | dekarl: | dblain: I'm surprised if the size of *compressed* xml is an issue. We do gzip the xml, right? |
| [17:28:21] | dekarl: | dblain: I'd love to see more work on the enum stuff in the wsdl / service api, now that its works again |
| [17:28:44] | dblain: | dekarl: I think one of the complaints was the time it takes to parse the XML. Binary formats are smaller and quicker to parse as the cost of being human readable. |
| [17:31:52] | dblain: | dekarl: the enum changes were being driven by the need to translate the names for the webfrontend. I'm not sure what the state of that is. I don't want to refactor every enum "just for the fun of it"... we really only need to refactor the enums that will be user facing. |
| [17:34:53] | dblain: | I could take the time I have to help with the WebFrontend, but I've always felt more comfortable working on behind the scenes infrastructure. |
| [17:39:28] | dekarl: | dblain: ahh, i see. I thought it was related to making for better documentation for third parties |
| [17:40:27] | dekarl: | MitchCapper: websockets are in fixes/0.28, e.g. go to the webfrontend and turn a frontend on/off, notice the instant update of the frontend list :) |
| [17:41:08] | MitchCapper: | thanks I will definately take a look at it im generally running master anyway. |
| [17:41:20] | MitchCapper: | just must have missed the commits |
| [17:42:59] | dekarl: | iirc its basically a websockified event connection of the mythtv protocol |
| [17:52:38] | stuartm: | MitchCapper: status events are currently published over the websocket |
| [17:52:49] | stuartm: | in 0.28+ |
| [17:53:51] | stuartm: | they are just rebroadcasted internal events, so may not be as stable as the services API itself |
| [17:54:25] | MitchCapper: | no worries:) |
| [17:54:29] | stuartm: | or as easy to use |
| [17:55:43] | stuartm: | it uses a subscription model, you subscribe to the events you are interested in by name and you'll receive them (otherwise it would just be a firehose of stuff that mostly you don't care about) |
| [17:56:09] | stuartm: | I'll find you an example of it's use in the WebFrontend code |
| [17:56:58] | MitchCapper: | oh I can find it mainly its just knowing it existed that was helpful:) |
| [17:57:54] | stuartm: | https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/blob/4d24d54 . . . uide.js#L161 |
| [17:58:37] | stuartm: | so that's not quite as helpful as I thought in isolation ... need to look at the websocket class, but here it's subscribing to SCHEDULE_CHANGE events |
| [17:59:56] | stuartm: | and rather basic right now, if one is received it simply reloads the schedule data – so it's ignoring any data associated with that event |
| [18:00:25] | stuartm: | much better example here – https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/blob/4d24d54 . . . ings.js#L217 |
| [18:00:42] | stuartm: | where it's actually parsing the tokens for different events |
| [18:01:49] | stuartm: | looks like I didn't quite finish that up, no handler for the UPDATE_FILE_SIZE event and the MASTER_UPDATE_REC_INFO event is only a stub |
| [18:03:28] | dekarl: | dblain: thinking about it. we have a command line channel scanner (and I have no idea if it works at all) but is'nt that a good candidate for turning into a service in the quest for an installation without mythtv-setup? |
| [18:06:57] | dblain: | It might be. I don't have the means to test channel scanning for most of the sources. However, it does raise an issue with long running service calls. I'll have to think about how to implement async service calls in a generic way. |
| [18:08:26] | MitchCapper: | it could be done like the transcoding, schedule a job, then another call to track its progress. |
| [18:08:26] | dekarl: | good point. the websocket with progress events might come in handy there |
| [18:08:52] | MitchCapper: | as the socket provides an instant notification clients who want that can implement it. |
| [18:08:59] | dekarl: | oh, backend work on on-demand-transcoding would be appreciated, too |
| [18:11:38] | dblain: | dekarl: been thinking about that one for a while, most likely be over my head, or at least require too much time. I have a smart TV i'd love to be able to watch recordings and live tv through the backend. The upnp interface works for recordings, but is not wife friendly. |
| [18:13:05] | stuartm: | upnp implementation in so many TVs is basic at best, really disappointing that they don't even bother with metadata beyond the title of the video |
| [18:13:17] | stuartm: | </rant> |
| [18:14:02] | dblain: | stuartm: right there with you. When I implemented the upnp stack I had high hopes... oh well, not like I can do anything about it. |
| [18:14:17] | dekarl: | dblain: does it do HbbTV? I'm wondering if the work on the Web Frontend can be used for a HbbTB Web Frontend, too. They can basically "what comes down the DTV pipe inside TS inside HTTP" |
| [18:14:54] | stuartm: | my Panasonic TV uses Firefox OS, I've been meaning to find out if the UPnP client was written by Mozilla or Panasonic – at least I could apply some pressure on Mozilla, doubt Panasonic would even listen to feedback |
| [18:15:04] | dekarl: | maybe the UPNP work can be repurposed as a kind of MythTV interface for third party clients (hi dmfrey) |
| [18:15:34] | stuartm: | jya: don't suppose you know the answer to that? |
| [18:18:49] | dblain: | dekarl: don't know if it supports HbbTV. I have 2 Samsung 40" 4k TVs (UN40HU6950)... using one as a computer monitor until the room it's going into is finished being remodeled. |
| [18:18:58] | dekarl: | dblain: doh HbbTV is only going to be part of the upcoming ATSC 3.0 |
| [18:20:24] | dblain: | temped to write an app for it to give it a more "frontend experience", but since it doesn't use Tizen (missed it by 1 model year) I'm not sure if it's worth the effort. |
| [18:26:06] | dekarl: | dblain: UN40HU6950*F* ? |
| [18:26:37] | jheizer: | last tiem I tried to UPNP on a tv from myth I just got out of memory errors |
| [18:27:37] | dblain: | dekarl: TV's not showing the *F*. I bought them a couple of years ago. |
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| [18:28:53] | stuartm: | jheizer: ouch, yeah, I've seen some terrible implementations – including ones like that sounds which request full metadata on every single item being served instead of paging the data and loading on demand |
| [18:28:53] | dblain: | jheizer: do you have a lot of recordings? Just wondering if we passed bad data or if the TV just didn't support loading records on demand. |
| [18:29:27] | jheizer: | That was trying to play back |
| [18:29:50] | jheizer: | Sorry for little details, was just joining the upnp should be great but always seems to suck rant |
| [18:30:11] | jheizer: | even digital mpeg2 direct from an antenna failed |
| [18:30:28] | dekarl: | dblain: that's the only manual I found at Samsung's and its not helpful (e.g. does not mention ATSC. but does mention HDMI-CEC) |
| [18:30:38] | stuartm: | jheizer: it will probably be the latter, it probably recurses down the full object tree, loading the full metadata with no filters and since the object tree shows the same recordings, videos and music represented in different ways that will very quickly eat through memory |
| [18:30:44] | dekarl: | do you have coloured buttons, e.g. the "red button" for interactive content at all in the US? |
| [18:30:45] | jheizer: | I wonder what it would do now with cable card and h264 over the wire from comcast |
| [18:31:19] | stuartm: | oh, playback ... hmm, no idea then, trying to fetch the entire file before it plays it back instead of streaming by byte range? |
| [18:31:23] | jheizer: | I had also hoped I could use mobilemyth via its web brower support |
| [18:31:27] | jheizer: | it didn't like that either |
| [18:31:47] | jheizer: | I should go see how it does now assume I still have a lan cable ran to it |
| [18:31:48] | dekarl: | dblain: the manual hints that the four coloured buttons are not available in the US and Canada... So unlikely the firmware has HbbTV active in the US profile |
| [18:31:50] | ** jheizer heads upstairs ** | |
| [18:31:52] | dblain: | it could still be loading the CDS in the background. |
| [18:32:52] | dblain: | dekarl: yeah, no colored buttons on physical remote... they are on the virtual remote but as far as I know the US doesn't have broadcast interactive tv support |
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| [18:34:02] | dblain: | it does allow me to split the screen with a web browser so I can lookup stuff about what I'm watching... not very useful on a 40" tv. |
| [18:34:47] | jheizer: | my LG tv has the colored buttons on the actual remote |
| [18:35:07] | jheizer: | backend not found now when hitting its DLNA input |
| [18:36:15] | dekarl: | stuarta, while we're on the HbbTV Frontend topic. Can we have a special service / dns name like my.mythtv.org that points a requestor back to the internal ip with the master backend matching its version behind the public ip the request came from? similar to my.hdhomerun.net. That would help with TV sets that allow you to only access well known HbbTV sites by adding my.mythtv.org to the big HbbTV site lists |
| [18:37:36] | jheizer: | weird, I must have upnp disabled somehow |
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| [18:42:45] | dekarl: | stuarta, that could also be used for backend discovery for remote control apps on primitive platforms |
| [18:43:33] | jheizer: | Should my Upnp be working based on log? http://pastebin.com/Z4P2DBJQ |
| [18:43:58] | jheizer: | it seems to be starting everything up but kodi and vlc don't seem to find it either |
| [18:45:02] | dekarl: | jheizer: that is (more/less) expected behaviour |
| [18:46:16] | dekarl: | there was a patch floating around the turned the new versions all back to v1/v2 that helped clients with broken UPNP implementation (basically each and every one I tried) |
| [18:46:44] | jheizer: | man |
| [18:46:53] | jheizer: | gupnp-universal-cp is going crazy trying to connect to it |
| [18:47:04] | dekarl: | on which platform are you using vlc? I can point you to the broken pieces for OS X/ iOS |
| [18:47:07] | jheizer: | eventually fell off the list |
| [18:47:15] | jheizer: | vlc and kodi on windows |
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| [18:49:02] | dekarl: | I think this is what Kodi uses https://github.com/plutinosoft/Platinum |
| [18:49:30] | dekarl: | according to https://github.com/xbmc/xbmc/tree/master/lib/libUPnP/Platinum |
| [18:49:37] | stuartm: | kodi/vlc both have broken UPnP implementations |
| [18:50:02] | jheizer: | gupnp-universal-cp |
| [18:50:02] | jheizer: | is too hard to view via as I have too many upnp devices |
| [18:50:03] | stuartm: | VLC guys basically aren't interested in fixing because 'it works for me' |
| [18:50:13] | jheizer: | my HA exposes all devices over upnp |
| [18:50:17] | stuartm: | upnp-inspector |
| [18:51:51] | stuartm: | dekarl: not sure when I'm going to find the time to make the version used configurable, or expose the UPnP server as twice – once as DLNA compliant and the other not |
| [18:52:47] | stuartm: | main issue is that the device description is a hardcoded xml document, can't easily switch version numbers in it based on a setting ... unless there were two different copies I guess |
| [18:52:54] | dekarl: | meh.. http://blog.andrewmarconi.com/2014/10/mythtv- . . . flicts-xbmc/ why do people suggest that Kodi and MythTV are fighting over UPNP server rights? |
| [18:54:48] | dekarl: | @all, if you open bugs for the UPNP compliance topic, please add them at https://www.mythtv.org/wiki/UPnP_Client_Info# . . . UPnP_Clients |
| [18:54:52] | stuartm: | seems like complete nonsense, the problem would be the client only accepting one server per IP and not the server's conflicting |
| [18:55:16] | stuartm: | servers |
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| [19:09:05] | gigem: | dblain: I'm generally for anything that would make it easier/more acceptable for the services api to obsolete the myth proto. Of course, my ability to contribute to such changes is limited and, therefore, so should be any weight given to my opinion. |
| [19:09:49] | jheizer: | I think my issue could be ipv6 related |
| [19:10:29] | jheizer: | At least with gupnp-universal-cp. All its ipv6 requests seem to fail. Same url in the browser with ipv4 works. |
| [19:11:00] | jheizer: | upnp-inspector seems to not be in PPA for xenial even. It was removed and I couldn't get the old package to install. |
| [19:11:13] | dekarl: | is it link local ipv6 with missing scope id? |
| [19:11:32] | gigem: | dblain: On a related note, does the service api allow a backend to talk to itself? If so, that would be really nice and could fix problems like libmythtv running in a master backend context not being able to query anything in programs/mythbackend. |
| [19:11:34] | dekarl: | we've got some work to do around that... MFDB reminds me every other day :/ |
| [19:13:04] | jheizer: | mah my ipv6 address from comcast is gone. That wrecks all kind of havoc when that happens |
| [19:13:22] | jheizer: | So it is just the local address yes. |
| [19:14:23] | jheizer: | http://pastebin.com/B78Jm3Xf |
| [19:14:44] | jheizer: | alright, I need to get back to work. rabbit hole keeps getting deeper from a hey lets go try this. :) |
| [19:15:42] | dekarl: | jheizer: yep, missing scope on link local ipv6 |
| [19:15:54] | dekarl: | "Could not connect: Invalid argument" |
| [19:16:57] | dekarl: | the application that receives the link local address should add the scope of the interface that the address was received on |
| [19:18:01] | jheizer: | got ya |
| [19:18:06] | jheizer: | could be why none of them work |
| [19:18:33] | jheizer: | 5% of the time my "real" ipv6 address from comcast just disappears |
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| [19:18:46] | jheizer: | sucks when all clients are then confused why it is gone |
| [19:22:25] | dekarl: | there is a workaround to have mythbackend bind only IPv4, maybe we should document it prominently... |
| [19:32:16] | jheizer: | blah that still didn't fix it |
| [19:32:21] | jheizer: | ok I give up for real. |
| [19:32:25] | jheizer: | sorry for the noise |
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| [19:52:35] | jpabq: | dblain: libmythui.pro DEFINES USING_QTWEBKIT, but xmlparsebase.cpp checks for CONFIG_QTWEBKIT . One of those needs changed to the other. |
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| [20:41:00] | dblain: | gigem: Not sure what having the backend talk to itself will fix? Don't understand the example you gave. |
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| [20:51:27] | dblain: | jpabq: missed that one. Any idea why the pro file overrides what configure sets? |
| [20:54:14] | jpabq: | dblain: Sorry, no. It has been a fair amount of time since I looked at config options. |
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