| Thursday, March 17th, 2016, 00:01 UTC | ||
| [00:01:46] | knightr: | illuminated_, you want mythtv-users... |
| [00:02:07] | knightr: | that said, I would have to say it's a frontend... |
| [00:02:46] | knightr: | it's not provided by mythfrontend though, it must be setted up on an Apache server... |
| [00:03:15] | knightr: | and needs PHP... |
| [00:04:58] | illuminated_: | ok thanks |
| [00:05:17] | knightr: | no problem.. |
| [00:05:33] | knightr: | it's also going away and will be replaced by something provided by the backend... |
| [00:05:50] | knightr: | but not for this time around, it will still be there for 0.28... |
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| [00:17:11] | knightr: | praying that I didn't do a typo this time... |
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| [00:44:08] | illuminated_: | knightr, do you have anything to read about the mythweb being replaced by something in the backend? |
| [00:45:00] | illuminated_: | knightr, sorry for taking so long. I was responding to some other messages |
| [00:45:46] | knightr: | https://www.mythtv.org/wiki/WebFrontend |
| [00:46:19] | knightr: | no problem... |
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| [09:48:20] | stuarta: | nice.... http://www.anandtech.com/show/10152/intels-sk . . . -is-official |
| [09:58:51] | stuarta: | would make a lovely dev box if nothing else |
| [10:02:01] | stuartm: | from the form factor and styling I would say they are targeting the Steam Machine market |
| [10:02:20] | stuarta: | my first thought was gaming |
| [10:07:31] | stuartm: | although the price leaps up if you factor in the need for an external GPU dock and decent graphics card, as well as undermining the compact form factor |
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| [12:15:10] | stuarta: | ugh, completely killed the usb subsystem on my backend :( |
| [12:16:35] | stuarta: | on another note, building a static website with jekyll and github is trivial |
| [12:24:56] | stuarta: | time to reboot this machine |
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| [13:29:11] | stuarta2: | sigh, system didn't come back, will have to wait until I get home to reboot it again |
| [13:33:39] | stuarta2 is now known as stuarta | |
| [13:52:26] | stuarta: | clearly i need to upgrade my microserver to a gen8, which comes with the ilo |
| [13:54:55] | jmcentee: | I think there a licensing problems with the gen8, e.g. you need to pay for it, or be careful so it doesn't end up disabled. |
| [13:57:14] | stuarta: | probably for the console part, hp did that on their servers quite a while back |
| [13:57:29] | stuarta: | but the power controls should still be available |
| [13:57:38] | jmcentee: | you may be right |
| [13:57:43] | stuarta: | i really should check on one of the gen8's i have here in the office |
| [13:57:54] | jmcentee: | maybe windows users complaning :) |
| [13:58:10] | jmcentee: | https://www.reddit.com/r/homelab/comments/2p4 . . . lly_need_to/ |
| [13:58:30] | stuarta: | there was a time where hp's needed a licence for a graphical console, but not for a text console. great for linux users. |
| [13:58:42] | stuarta: | then they changed that, and you had to licence the text console as well |
| [13:59:40] | jmcentee: | I did wonder about a gen7 then a gen8, but never purchased |
| [14:00:21] | stuarta: | the gen8's are really nice, much nicer that the n36 i have |
| [14:01:17] | jmcentee: | the ECC ram always attracts my attention. |
| [14:02:08] | stuarta: | you can also put non ecc memory in if you really want to save a few $ |
| [14:03:51] | jmcentee: | I want EEC for ZFS |
| [14:04:31] | jheizer_: | making me all feel bad |
| [14:04:34] | jheizer_: | just bought a new server |
| [14:04:41] | jheizer_: | ended up with a low end xeon |
| [14:04:56] | jheizer_: | but not a board with any remote abilities and no ecc as I reused my ram |
| [14:04:57] | stuarta: | shiny++ |
| [14:05:07] | jmcentee: | my new(ish) KVM box is getting ready (i5). I have a couple of questions. |
| [14:05:11] | jheizer_: | because it already costs enough |
| [14:06:01] | jheizer_: | sad part is that wasn't even my problem so now I have an 8 core amd setup just sitting here unused. |
| [14:07:40] | stuarta: | jheizer_: i fail to see the problem with that. ;-) |
| [14:08:17] | jmcentee: | stuarta: I have created new VMs for my vitural slaves. Can I just copy /home/buildslave across (e.g. keeping privates keys and .ccache) or do you want to start fresh? |
| [14:08:39] | jheizer_: | Just stinks. It was more than I needed. $500 down the drain and not that much faster really. |
| [14:09:06] | stuarta: | jmcentee: just copy them across, that's fine |
| [14:09:13] | jheizer_ is now known as jheizer | |
| [14:09:15] | jmcentee: | and why am I have to added console=ttyS0 option etc to get on the console of the VMs? |
| [14:09:46] | stuarta: | jmcentee: defaults to the graphical console |
| [14:09:55] | stuarta: | jheizer: ah, now i see the problem :( |
| [14:10:52] | jmcentee: | why do I want graphics on a server? |
| [14:12:04] | jmcentee: | I have also created a debian-testing-64bit VM (your slowest VM) but the KVM server is not ready yet. |
| [14:13:16] | jams_: | for what it's worth in ilo gen8 power controls work but remote console requires a license. |
| [14:13:46] | jams_: | gen6 the console worked for 30 seconds as a "demo" |
| [14:14:04] | ** stuarta only needs remote power control ** | |
| [14:14:41] | jheizer: | FYI #12688 doesn't seem to be a user setup issue. I am having problems as well and especially bad if kodi is in the mix. |
| [14:14:41] | ** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/12688 ** | |
| [14:17:21] | stuarta: | i hate wiki spam |
| [14:17:28] | ** stuarta disables account creation again ** | |
| [14:20:20] | stuarta: | spam deleted |
| [14:21:29] | stuarta: | this wiki spam is getting damn annoying |
| [14:23:23] | jmcentee: | would it be less effort to manually approve accounts? |
| [14:24:22] | jheizer: | of course I go to make a better log for that ticket and it works |
| [14:26:10] | stuarta: | the long term plan is to enable social login, in the hope that these spambots aren't connected to a social media account |
| [14:38:08] | superm1 (superm1!uid4318@ubuntu/member/superm1) has joined #mythtv | |
| [14:42:36] | jmcentee: | stuarta: I have a plan to WoL my server when a build is needed.How does you buildmaster get triggered of a new commit. I could scrap the webpage of the my buildslaves, but that does not fell elegant to me. |
| [14:43:22] | stuarta: | jmcentee: the buildmaster sends a message to the slave via the connection (which is initiated by the slave) |
| [14:43:32] | stuarta: | if it's not there, the build queues |
| [14:46:35] | jmcentee: | yes, I was wondering how the buildmaster knows it needs to do something. |
| [14:46:47] | jheizer: | jmcentee, it has a json api you could query. ex: https://code.mythtv.org/buildbot/json/builder . . . mp;as_text=1 |
| [14:46:59] | stuarta: | it watches git for commits to trigger builds |
| [14:47:00] | jheizer: | I'd assume that last state property changes to queued |
| [14:48:46] | jmcentee: | jheizer: Thanks makes my idea easier. |
| [14:49:31] | jheizer: | More details here. https://code.mythtv.org/buildbot/json/help May find a simplier/faster query. |
| [14:49:43] | jmcentee: | stuarta: does the buildmaster poll git every minute to see if a new commit has happen, of does git inform it somehow? |
| [14:49:55] | stuarta: | curl "https://code.mythtv.org/buildbot/json/builder . . . text=1" |
| [14:50:32] | stuarta: | "pendingBuilds": 37, |
| [14:52:08] | jmcentee: | Just seems like the wrong solution to query that every minute (x3 one for each slave) to see if the KVM server needs to be booted. |
| [14:52:38] | stuarta: | i think it's called in a commit hook |
| [14:54:10] | stuarta: | yes it is, post-commit informs buildbot a change has happened |
| [14:57:38] | jmcentee: | (from someone who does not know git) is git-hub the master/ defacto copy of mythtv. And is that the one that triggers the current buildbot. |
| [15:02:15] | jheizer: | really if one has a build queued, odds are they all do |
| [15:02:27] | jheizer: | make it for one and every 5 minutes and you'd probably be fine |
| [15:09:18] | jmcentee: | true, 5 minutes is probably fine. |
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| [15:18:39] | stuarta: | jmcentee: no, currently code.mythtv.org is the master, github is a slave from that |
| [15:20:57] | jmcentee: | that makes sense. github only has webhooks avaliable, what you do with buildmaster I don't think would be possible with from github. |
| [15:21:30] | stuarta: | oh it would be, relatively easily, have a webhook call into the buildmaster and trigger a build |
| [15:21:47] | jmcentee: | I will start off using the json api. every 5 minutes. my buildslaves are quicker than everyone elses.:) |
| [15:23:11] | jheizer: | Hey! lol |
| [15:24:02] | jheizer: | What is it? My new one is a E3–1246 v3. Basically the cheapest way to get a 4 core + HT. So nothing special. |
| [15:35:42] | jmcentee: | currently I have i5–2500K. the "new" one is similar vintage. |
| [15:36:05] | jmcentee: | going to do backups. |
| [15:40:13] | jheizer: | oh, wow. Surprised there is so much of a different. SSD disks? My builders are on spinning arrays. |
| [15:54:34] | jmcentee: | zfs spining disk, but with a ssd zil and l2arc |
| [15:55:23] | jmcentee: | new box going for just a ssd for the VM's (but with dedup) |
| [16:00:13] | jheizer: | Nice. zfs to 4tb drives, no ssd caches. Too much goes to/from the drives to make it worth it for me really. |
| [16:01:49] | jmcentee: | current box has 4 x 4tb in raidz1 |
| [16:02:50] | jheizer: | also the same |
| [16:02:56] | jheizer: | interesting |
| [16:03:07] | jmcentee: | but only mythtv makes heavy use of the space, so not too much goes back and forth |
| [16:03:52] | jheizer: | hmm, I thought my zoneminder used that array too, but it doesn't. Also only myth. |
| [16:04:25] | jheizer: | Just curious since you build in like 1/2 the time. |
| [16:04:45] | jmcentee: | current box uses Xen. |
| [16:05:23] | jmcentee: | probably down to the ssd as zil and l2arc. |
| [16:06:37] | jmcentee: | l2arc is 50GB so more than enough to cache vms and the little mythtv playback. |
| [16:07:09] | jheizer: | nice |
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| [16:08:14] | jheizer: | for curiosity's sake I'm going to move one of my builders to an ssd |
| [16:09:02] | jmcentee: | the root disk is no the ssd as well, intention was to spin down the zfs disk, but that doesn't happen. Xen does not WoL on that setup. KVM on the new stup does so heading down that route again. |
| [16:20:39] | jmcentee: | currently have probelms. Decided to use debian testing on new KVM host, but .deb packages are not provided by zfsonlinux (debian are going to provide them, but haven't yet) built .deb with KMOD and instructions per zfsonlinux website, but zpool does no moutn on boot. |
| [16:21:02] | ** jmcentee goes to consult google. ** | |
| [16:22:31] | jheizer: | I've randomly found with zfs linux packages over time. estatic that it'll now be a "supported" fs under 16.04 |
| [16:22:43] | jheizer: | *fought |
| [16:23:34] | jmcentee: | and the next release of debian apparently. |
| [16:23:43] | jheizer: | I've also had my days where a libvirt upgrade ends up with it not starting with some cryptic errors. Had that happen a few times. |
| [16:24:22] | jmcentee: | also note, do not use dedup. |
| [16:24:40] | jmcentee: | that keeps tripping me up. |
| [16:26:06] | ** jmcentee ignores the fact he is try a very little zpool with dedup this time. ** | |
| [16:27:03] | jheizer: | I've usually been ok with space enough that I never tried it. |
| [16:27:59] | jheizer: | It must be this disk array. Still moving 50GB 30 minutes later. |
| [16:28:05] | jheizer: | err 20 |
| [16:28:32] | jmcentee: | zfs is not a fast filesystem. |
| [16:29:03] | jheizer: | these drives are on a pcie cheapo controller card. could be that holding them back |
| [16:29:16] | gary_buhrmaster: | jheizer: Have the legal "disagreements" finished regarding including a CDDL package in ubuntu? Last I heard SFC was trying to get canonical to come around to their way of thinking amicably, but were prepared to take further steps. |
| [16:29:56] | jheizer: | I'm not sure. The backlash fighting starting was the last I've read too. |
| [16:32:47] | jmcentee: | according to http://zfsonlinux.org/debian.html which links to https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announc . . . sg00006.html debian is planning to inculde zfs |
| [16:33:40] | jmcentee: | is says "We received legal advice from Software Freedom Law Center about the |
| [16:33:40] | jmcentee: | inclusion of libdvdcss and ZFS in Debian, which should unblock the |
| [16:33:40] | jmcentee: | situation in both cases and enable us to ship them in Debian soon." |
| [16:33:51] | jmcentee: | but I am not holding my breath. |
| [16:34:13] | gary_buhrmaster: | The one group quiet is Larry's lawyers. I will note that they are always quiet before their next $5 billion dollar lawsuit. |
| [16:35:47] | jheizer: | Yeah almost seems like a don't you dare, we'll sue you after the fact battle coming. |
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| [16:47:02] | jmcentee: | yet btrfs was started when Chris Mason was working for oracle. |
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| [17:22:58] | dekarl1 is now known as dekarl | |
| [17:24:49] | dekarl: | knightr: I noticed some untranslatable texts in the frontend, e.g. in recording playback pick a series hit menu, most of the entries are in english but don't appear in mythfrontend_de.ts as translatable strings, I had no success finding them in the source with some that I tried. Do you have an idea where they come from / are translated? |
| [17:27:40] | dekarl: | jmcentee: hmm searching for "buildbot proxy wake-on-lan" does not bring any good results, but the idea of "on on demand buildslaves" sounds good, maybe the people in #buildbot know something? |
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| [17:33:16] | dekarl: | jmcentee: is dedup still a thing? with all the copy-offloading-api work you get copy-on-write copies easily without dedup. |
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| [17:42:07] | gary_buhrmaster: | jmcentee: btrfs was started when Sun owned ZFS, and the CDDL was interpreted by (at least) most of the commercial vendors as not being compatible, and Oracle was interested in a better file system than the existing ones for linux. |
| [17:44:21] | dekarl: | jmcentee: or find a way that our master can reach you network to start the buildslaves. http://www.codelord.net/2009/10/04/writing-a- . . . build-slave/ there are also samples latent slaves for Docker/AWS |
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| [18:58:40] | gary_buhrmaster: | dekarl: dedup is definitely still a thing (in the enterprise space), where billions and billions of copies of the same (for example) email or cat video or source file are stored in your corporate file or backup server. |
| [18:59:48] | gary_buhrmaster: | dekarl: (disk may be cheap, but it is not so cheap by the petabyte) |
| [19:00:39] | dekarl: | gary_buhrmaster: well, i beg to differ. but the enterprise storage sales dudes and dudettes don't want to hear it ;) |
| [19:01:40] | dekarl: | dedup on ZFS is being suggested for very special use cases only in the last years. and only with bucketloads of memory |
| [19:01:55] | gary_buhrmaster: | dekarl: but ZFS dedup is very very memory intensive, and few consumers have sufficiently memory in their home servers such that turning it on does not kill the system. |
| [19:02:10] | dekarl: | but we dedup attachments on our mail servers, too. |
| [19:03:05] | gary_buhrmaster: | dekarl: Right, there is no magic. Every feature has to be examined as to its appropriate use. |
| [19:03:33] | dekarl: | but then we them on generic virtualized gold plated enterprise san storage instead of something specialized |
| [19:03:50] | gary_buhrmaster: | dekarl: As I recall, Exchange (if you are using that) automatically shared copies of the same email between mailboxes. |
| [19:03:52] | dekarl: | s/we them/we run them/ |
| [19:04:43] | dekarl: | gary_buhrmaster: aye, dedup is alot easier when you don't dup in the first place, e.g. by going via the message-id as a strong hint. or by turning "copy api" calls into real "copy-on-write copies" |
| [19:05:08] | dekarl: | but that's something else then generic dedup on generic storage |
| [19:07:49] | gary_buhrmaster: | As more people take privacy seriously, and (directly or indirectly) encrypt their data, dedup is no longer the great reducer it once was. |
| [19:09:28] | dekarl: | thats not a big issue for us, its we have lots of safety, but little security (both translate to the same german word, so its confusing) |
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| [20:53:46] | knightr: | dekarl, can you send me a screen capture? |
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| [20:58:36] | knightr: | if you did a scan in the whole source code and even tried partial strings (some of us unfortunately have the bad habit of concatenating strings which is a PITA for translation) then it suggests it's in the database |
| [20:59:04] | knightr: | or comes from the theme but in something we don't currently parse at this time... |
| [21:03:43] | knightr: | IIRC, the worse thing that could happen with the themes is that the strings would not end up in the right translation file, but I am pretty sure they would be translatable... |
| [21:04:10] | knightr: | I could be wrong but I don't think I am... |
| [21:05:45] | knightr: | if it was new code then sometimes we need to add new folders to parse but if you scan through the whole code you would have found it... |
| [21:06:07] | knightr: | (quite likely twice now with a symbolic link which was apparently added lately...) |
| [21:07:58] | knightr: | I will try to check this tonight on my backend tonight but I have some problem with its video card, I might have to dig up a new one somewhere... |
| [21:10:30] | knightr: | I have fixed some strings recently and I have a few others to fix ASAP but I doubt you are talking about these ones, those are easy to spot (some of them do implicate the database though...) |
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| [21:14:31] | knightr: | dekarl, which theme? |
| [21:14:37] | knightr: | we don't translate all themes... |
| [21:16:27] | knightr: | this might change in the future though but it's not the case right now... |
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| [21:18:31] | knightr: | Steppes, MythCenter, MythBuntu, Arclight, Terra and a few others are... |
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| [21:36:47] | TrinitronX: | can anyone point me in the right direction on which version of mythtv (specifically on "mythbuntu") supports protocol version 88? |
| [21:37:23] | TrinitronX: | Getting an error when trying to use kodi-pvr-mythtv with the version of mythtv-backend I have |
| [21:37:27] | TrinitronX: | Mar 17 15:29:03 saturn mythbackend: mythbackend[6796]: C ProcessRequest mainserver.cpp:1345 (HandleVersion) MainServer::HandleVersion – Client speaks protocol version 88 but we speak 77! |
| [21:43:09] | jmcentee: | Back to earlier conversation, as I am back. If oracle really wanted a better filesystem for linux, they could just change the license on ZFS to GPL, as they own the copyright, but that is against Larry's ethos. |
| [21:43:14] | dekarl: | knightr: http://picpaste.de/mythfrontend-untranslated-recodings.jpeg |
| [21:43:32] | jmcentee: | TrinitronX: https://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Myth_Protocol |
| [21:44:24] | jmcentee: | I thought kodi-pvr-mythtv could talk older versions. |
| [21:44:46] | jmcentee: | 88 is the very latest, I guess just in the master branch. |
| [21:46:28] | TrinitronX: | jmcentee: Thanks! |
| [21:48:31] | jmcentee: | 0.28 is only getting ready to be a release candiate |
| [21:49:31] | TrinitronX: | I take it I should be using the ppa:mythbuntu/0.28 if I want these to integrate well? |
| [21:58:32] | dekarl: | TrinitronX: 88 is since December 24 and is in the upcoming release. pvr.mythtv supports it since December 26, that's version 3.4.3 from that day |
| [22:00:52] | dekarl: | and what you are seeing (Client speaks protocol version 88 but we speak 77) is the client tasting the backend to see what protocol it runs, so it can adapt. That is, your pvr.mythtv supports up to 88, but the backend only needs 77 |
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| [22:01:51] | dekarl: | the client sees protocol version 77 aka. fixes/0.27 and will just happily work with that |
| [22:08:19] | dekarl: | it does this https://github.com/kodi-pvr/pvr.mythtv/blob/m . . . ase.cpp#L298 |
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| [22:10:26] | TrinitronX: | dekarl: thanks for the info! (sorry... just experienced a system hang or crash of some sort... possibly related to AirPlay) |
| [22:10:40] | dekarl: | knightr, that was a good hint, the polish frontend translation hints that the text was in playbackbox.cpp earlier |
| [22:10:45] | TrinitronX: | had to re-read the IRC logs from irc.mythtv.org |
| [22:11:39] | TrinitronX: | so in essence, kodi-pvr-mythtv works well with multiple protocol versions, but it probes first, so mythtv-backend just outputs that message when it tries 88 |
| [22:15:02] | jmcentee: | Thats ,my understanding. |
| [22:15:43] | dekarl: | yes |
| [22:21:25] | TrinitronX: | so it appears: https://github.com/kodi-pvr/pvr.mythtv/blob/m . . . base.cpp#L40 |
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| [22:34:17] | jmcentee: | does the kodi frontend work for you? |
| [22:43:02] | TrinitronX: | jmcentee: Not really... has always been saying "Channel Unavailable" when I try to use kodi instead of mythtv-frontend |
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| [22:45:15] | TrinitronX: | seems like the kodi logs say it is connecting & getting lots of info via the backend though |
| [22:45:36] | TrinitronX: | It definitely says it gets the version of mythtv-backend ok: 16:40:43 T:139698475345664 DEBUG: AddOnLog: MythTV PVR Client: GetBackendVersion: v0.27.6-13-g768d355 |
| [22:46:30] | TrinitronX: | lots of "EPG – UpdateFromScraper – updating EPG for channel ...." messages for all the channels that it gets |
| [22:46:40] | TrinitronX: | but when I try to select one, it always says unavailable... hehe |
| [22:56:09] | TrinitronX: | kinda interesting... it does seem to be able to trigger a record in mythtv-backend, and I can go into mythtv-frontend to watch it |
| [22:56:13] | TrinitronX: | just not live tv in kodi |
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| [23:05:38] | knightr: | dekarl, this is most likely a dumb question but I have to ask... Is this with 0.28 or master or did you install the master/0.28 translations on a 0.27 frontend? |
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| [23:18:15] | knightr: | this is not something which would get stored in the database or comes from none of the usual themes and like you said used to comes from the source code in the past.. |
| [23:20:58] | dekarl: | knightr: its master – minimyth2 to be exact – theme is mythcenter-wide. uhoh the polish translation and minimyth2... I have an idea |
| [23:21:21] | knightr: | Piotr |
| [23:21:28] | knightr: | is the Polish translator |
| [23:21:38] | knightr: | he didn't bundle the other translations I guess.. |
| [23:22:02] | dekarl: | nah, the german strings appear fine. but maybe its a "local" modification |
| [23:22:27] | knightr: | patches... |
| [23:22:29] | knightr: | you mean? |
| [23:22:43] | dekarl: | yes |
| [23:22:43] | knightr: | looks like it could be because I see no trace anywhere of this... |
| [23:22:45] | dekarl: | oh my |
| [23:23:10] | knightr: | except in the past of the Polish translation as you said... |
| [23:23:40] | knightr: | it's master but at what date |
| [23:23:49] | knightr: | is also something I would like to know |
| [23:24:03] | knightr: | this used to be part of MythTV's source code as we saw.. |
| [23:24:54] | knightr: | unfortunately I don't think we can know that now with git... (with SVN we could have with the revision number, with Git there's no way, right?) |
| [23:28:41] | dekarl: | a vanilly frontend does not have these menu options |
| [23:30:11] | knightr: | cute |
| [23:30:20] | knightr: | so that's why only his translation has this |
| [23:31:02] | knightr: | for reasons of his own he doesn't translate all the stock strings |
| [23:31:22] | knightr: | (I believe he said that he is waiting for the MyhUI conversion of the settings) |
| [23:31:30] | knightr: | but translates additional stuff... |
| [23:31:31] | dekarl: | https://github.com/warpme/minimyth2/blob/mast . . . te.patch#L77 |
| [23:31:32] | knightr: | cute... |
| [23:32:43] | knightr: | it's LVR stuff... |
| [23:33:17] | knightr: | it's too late for that now but should we merge this eventually, is this useful? |
| [23:33:48] | dekarl: | I never used it |
| [23:34:10] | dekarl: | it just stood out like a sore thumb when add a series to the playlist |
| [23:35:49] | dekarl: | thanks for going through this with me. I must have had tomatoes on the eyes :) (sorry, that idiom does not translate well, but I guess you can reason about the meaning) |
| [23:36:08] | knightr: | no problemo... |
| [23:36:42] | knightr: | I am there for that... |
| [23:36:55] | knightr: | (and even if I wasn't it would have been my pleasure...) |
| [23:38:51] | knightr: | you could always install that patch in the copy of the repo you use to translate so that they would get extracted |
| [23:39:01] | dekarl: | actually I like the idea of a generic filter / search. Enter "Bruce Willis" and it will filter out everything that doesn't have this string in the a) title b) subtitle c) description d) cast. With our guide data all positions are good candidates. a) Bruce Willis – Die Hard b) <name of talk show with episode title> Bruce Willis c)/d) you can guess them |
| [23:39:57] | dekarl: | having three/four different filters so you can search around like back in the old days, that's not such a great solution with our local guide data |
| [23:40:10] | knightr: | if you commit only the translations when it is time to commit you could actually submit a translation which has more strings than the real MythTV |
| [23:41:02] | knightr: | and only the translator regenerate those files so as long as you patch your copy of the repo before you run lupdate these would not get removed... |
| [23:42:49] | dekarl: | are obselete strings added to the translation's runtime file? |
| [23:43:05] | knightr: | IIRC no |
| [23:43:11] | dekarl: | ^- nvm an academic question |
| [23:43:12] | knightr: | but unfinished I believe are |
| [23:43:22] | knightr: | but didn't used to... |
| [23:43:45] | knightr: | but these are only marked obsolete, etc... |
| [23:43:51] | knightr: | and now "vanished" |
| [23:43:55] | knightr: | (it's a new one...) |
| [23:44:08] | knightr: | depending on what lupdate "sees" in your repo... |
| [23:45:16] | dekarl: | btw, did you see the link to the translation-cppcheck-blog-post the other day? |
| [23:45:47] | knightr: | if they are still there somewhere they will not be obsoleted even if they don't exist in the real repo... |
| [23:46:10] | knightr: | yes but I did not have time to read it entirely yet unfortunately... |
| [23:46:56] | knightr: | how many languages does this support? |
| [23:47:03] | dekarl: | yes, it has a lot of links branching out |
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| [23:48:27] | dekarl: | that is a good question that I have not yet thought about. I was seeing it as a tool to help the authors of the original messages to have a – more or less – consistent language that is easy to follow for translators |
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| [23:49:13] | knightr: | they can do it with glossaries |
| [23:49:20] | knightr: | at least partially... |
| [23:49:35] | knightr: | I played with weblate which does that... |
| [23:49:58] | TrinitronX (TrinitronX!~Trinitron@c-73-3-228-142.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) | |
| [23:49:59] | knightr: | and Pootle with TM does help in that regard... |
| [23:50:24] | knightr: | (weblate too...) |
| [23:51:03] | knightr: | this would be more useful for the main "translation" |
| [23:51:21] | knightr: | I wish the original US English strings were a little more consistent... |
| [23:52:12] | dekarl: | here is a sample that does not translate well to german (I could not find decent *different* words for "resend" and "repeat") https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/blob/master/ . . . ngs.cpp#L114 |
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| [23:52:39] | knightr: | we should have norms as to how thing should be written... |
| [23:52:48] | dekarl: | aye |
| [23:53:06] | knightr: | Some People Seem to Like to Write with Way too Many Caps... |
| [23:53:08] | dekarl: | but that samples was crafted to avoid adding a new setting |
| [23:53:25] | knightr: | which I understand is somewhat acceptable in English... |
| [23:53:27] | dekarl: | Isn't that title case? |
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| [23:54:26] | knightr: | yes |
| [23:54:41] | knightr: | but not everyone use it |
| [23:55:01] | dekarl: | https://musicbrainz.org/doc/Style/Language/English has something about it. That's where I learned about it. |
| [23:56:20] | knightr: | and I am not sure how truly acceptable this actually is for real... |
| [23:56:50] | knightr: | we have a mix of everything |
| [23:57:05] | knightr: | and some people put period at the end of their sentences |
| [23:57:21] | knightr: | while others do not... |
| [23:57:56] | knightr: | and let's not even talk of strings that are build by concatenating... |
| [23:58:05] | knightr: | we have still too much of this... |
| [23:58:12] | dekarl: | Yes, the inconsistency is confusing... |
| [23:58:24] | knightr: | it might work nice for English |
| [23:58:47] | knightr: | but doesn't always work nice for other languages |
| [23:58:56] | dekarl: | but that's the hard language with lots of writers. all other languages have a much smaller team of writers |
| [23:59:19] | knightr: | and we will never ever support RTL languages if we do this |
| [23:59:36] | knightr: | we are concatenating backwards of what they need... |
| [23:59:55] | dekarl: | oh, I thought the bytes are in logical order and are rendered backwards |
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