| Thursday, March 1st, 2012, 00:00 UTC | ||
| [00:00:25] | wagnerrp: | Beirdo: dont kid yourself, one of the higher ups recently heard about the 'Balmer Peak', and wants to test it out |
| [00:00:42] | clever: | sounds fun! |
| [00:00:49] | Beirdo: | hehehe |
| [00:01:09] | wagnerrp: | clever: no, youre right... the little chip is the NIC, while the big chip is memory stacked on top of the broadcom chip |
| [00:01:19] | wagnerrp: | likely not something youre going to replace yourself |
| [00:01:23] | wagnerrp: | even if you had a heatgun |
| [00:01:35] | Beirdo: | or a shotgun |
| [00:01:52] | clever: | yeah, even if you can rework a bga package, reworking a bga on a bga would be a nightmare |
| [00:02:09] | justinh: | somebody should take a look at doing things with the new Ti stuff |
| [00:02:18] | [R]: | TI is awful |
| [00:02:26] | justinh: | better than the broadcom junk, and they actually give you data |
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| [00:02:51] | justinh: | Broadcom are like "oh, you want to know what? That'll be $$$$$ please, and this NDA" |
| [00:03:10] | [R]: | they "give" you data |
| [00:03:17] | [R]: | but it is wrong somtimes, and crap, and confusign |
| [00:03:25] | [R]: | i've been dealing with TI crap for like 2 years at my job |
| [00:03:27] | justinh: | no worse than Broadcom |
| [00:03:34] | justinh: | or siliconimage, come to think |
| [00:03:40] | Beirdo: | or Intel |
| [00:03:46] | justinh: | or anybody :-) |
| [00:03:56] | [R]: | theres companies that are good |
| [00:04:00] | [R]: | i had no problems with freescale... |
| [00:04:17] | Beirdo: | I had few problems with Motorola |
| [00:04:17] | justinh: | yeh but what are *they* doing to excite people like us? ;-) |
| [00:04:26] | [R]: | lol |
| [00:04:42] | [R]: | and i think microchip is good, but i havent really done that much with them |
| [00:04:54] | Beirdo: | pffft |
| [00:04:56] | justinh: | they don't do all that much really |
| [00:04:59] | Beirdo: | PICs are crapola |
| [00:05:08] | justinh: | Atmel.. not bad |
| [00:05:09] | [R]: | i got my job to pay for me to go to a microchip conference |
| [00:05:11] | [R]: | it was pretty sweet |
| [00:05:12] | ** Beirdo likes AVRs :) ** | |
| [00:05:24] | clever: | ive got some AVR's laying arround here |
| [00:05:25] | justinh: | but all these SoCs.. wow |
| [00:05:34] | clever: | was trying to hack CEC into an attiny last week |
| [00:05:42] | justinh: | bet most of them are just bought-in IP anyway |
| [00:05:43] | Beirdo: | why bother? |
| [00:05:52] | clever: | but the fuses changed themselves and now its non-responsive |
| [00:06:05] | Beirdo: | ummm, they don't change themselves |
| [00:06:12] | Beirdo: | SOMEONE changed them |
| [00:06:14] | Technophil: | But...the Rpi might be good as a CEC – frontend interface? |
| [00:06:15] | clever: | i think there was noise on the programmer |
| [00:06:17] | justinh: | Beirdo: because spending 2 years to develop a HDMI CEC adpter himself is cheaper than laying out $20 for one :P |
| [00:06:25] | Beirdo: | justinh: must be :) |
| [00:06:28] | clever: | the fuses where constantly changing mid-programming and setting off warnings in avrdude |
| [00:06:52] | Beirdo: | you probably fried the chip |
| [00:06:53] | wagnerrp: | Technophil: better to just pick up a pulse-eight unit, which already has limited support in mythtv |
| [00:07:02] | clever: | Beirdo: i think i just set it to use an external clock |
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| [00:07:12] | Technophil: | how much are they now? |
| [00:07:14] | clever: | and if set like that, it needs one to program it |
| [00:07:26] | wagnerrp: | and would be inline with the same port as your mythfrontend, meaning most of the CEC functionality would actually work properly |
| [00:07:49] | kormoc: | YOu have your fuses set to use an external clock? |
| [00:07:53] | ** kormoc blinks ** | |
| [00:08:05] | clever: | kormoc: they changed on their own due to errors somewhere |
| [00:08:13] | Beirdo: | I've probably programmed more AVRs than anyone else in channel, and have never buggered one... so... forgive me for being somewhat questioning. |
| [00:08:21] | Technophil: | I expect there'd be no cost advatage actually, once you pay for the Pi, The SD card and the power supply.... |
| [00:08:25] | clever: | yeah, this is the first time it messed up for me too |
| [00:08:27] | justinh: | Technophil: £29.99 |
| [00:08:28] | kormoc: | I was fairly sure fuses don't work like that |
| [00:08:38] | kormoc: | given they're fairly… stupid… |
| [00:08:44] | clever: | Beirdo: now that i think about it, its likely due to using a serial bit-banger while linux was set for serial console! |
| [00:09:03] | Beirdo: | omg. |
| [00:09:07] | justinh: | Technophil: it's a very pro looking little box for a one-man band operation |
| [00:09:14] | clever: | i forgot that the serial console was enabled when using it |
| [00:09:15] | Beirdo: | OK, I need to drink more to make up for hearing that |
| [00:09:27] | clever: | i only remembered after bricking it |
| [00:09:29] | ** kormoc gets a headache ** | |
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| [00:09:30] | Technophil: | justinh: Thanks, the economics just wouldn't stack up then would they. |
| [00:09:51] | justinh: | Technophil: unless you really enjoy working out bugs in that kind of thing by yourself |
| [00:10:32] | justinh: | it's likely only a USB-serial adapter programmed with a custom ID, tagged onto a CEC transceiver chip |
| [00:10:44] | justinh: | nothing too fancy |
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| [00:11:06] | Technophil: | justinh: A challenge is always good, its just I've got a lot more meritous challenges I'd prefer to knobble before I dream of doing the Rpi / CEC one...! |
| [00:11:27] | justinh: | oh yeah now I remember. it is, and the guy who is selling it was asking questions on a forum related to tech support for the chip |
| [00:11:52] | justinh: | Technophil: I was tempted to order a pi, but it'll likely end up the same way as my droid tablet |
| [00:12:25] | justinh: | *unused* |
| [00:12:34] | Technophil: | justinh: I plan to get several, but NOT as mythfrontends |
| [00:13:13] | Technophil: | I think they would make great smart home relay controllers attached to ethernet, don;t need the GPU at all really.... |
| [00:13:15] | [R]: | i suppose i could get 3 and learn to juggle... |
| [00:13:25] | justinh: | I might still, but use em for audio clients |
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| [00:13:46] | justinh: | there's literally *nothing* cheap in the networked audio arena |
| [00:14:19] | justinh: | all I want is a nice cheap, small low power client to do squeezeplayer or whatever |
| [00:14:31] | Technophil: | What about using your 'droid? |
| [00:14:36] | justinh: | not end up hacking an arduino (£100+) onto Godknows what |
| [00:14:37] | Beirdo: | that reminds me, need to get home on time today to pick up the compressor |
| [00:14:52] | justinh: | Technophil: no wired ethernet |
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| [00:15:34] | Technophil: | justinh: WiFi? |
| [00:15:56] | justinh: | no, I *want* to use wired ethernet |
| [00:16:02] | Technophil: | ow and BT for the wireless ehadset? |
| [00:16:15] | justinh: | what wireless headset? |
| [00:16:28] | justinh: | real speakers, silly |
| [00:17:05] | justinh: | course the cheapest 'whole house audio' solution is just for everybody to wear their own mp3 player :P |
| [00:17:18] | Technophil: | interesting, I see no principle obstacle to that, other than it would also be slow.... |
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| [00:17:24] | Beirdo: | or to get the neighbors to buy one |
| [00:17:26] | [R]: | you need the bill gates system |
| [00:17:30] | [R]: | where the house knows when you move rooms |
| [00:17:37] | [R]: | and it plays your music when you enter the room |
| [00:17:38] | justinh: | what'd be slow? |
| [00:18:09] | Technophil: | the PII controlled interface performance? |
| [00:18:13] | Beirdo: | George W. |
| [00:18:14] | justinh: | the tablet might actually have a real use if I could get audio clients going |
| [00:18:20] | Technophil: | Not the audio, that would be OK when it got going.... |
| [00:18:29] | justinh: | no, the pi would be headless |
| [00:18:53] | justinh: | just a dumb player outstation :-) |
| [00:19:08] | justinh: | controlled by my phone, laptops.. or the tablet |
| [00:19:24] | justinh: | or some other contrivance |
| [00:19:31] | Technophil: | Ahh you do have a phone.... |
| [00:19:41] | justinh: | yes but it sucks |
| [00:19:49] | justinh: | all the droid phones I've ever seen do |
| [00:20:04] | justinh: | certainly all the ones I'll call 'affordable' |
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| [00:20:54] | justinh: | anyway it's gonna be an ongoing project, and easier than hacking up something with openWRT – easier & less ugly.. and cheaper by far |
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| [00:22:39] | justinh: | I helped a hu |
| [00:22:42] | justinh: | aegh |
| [00:23:12] | grumpydevil: | i've got an old database, and want to clean up a bit |
| [00:23:31] | justinh: | I helped a guy at work botch some USB ports onto some Sweex router he runs openwrt on.. then thought "hmmm, I could add USB audio to this..." |
| [00:23:36] | grumpydevil: | is there a quick way to remove all settings / parameters of no longer used slave backends? |
| [00:23:48] | justinh: | grumpydevil: to what end? |
| [00:24:08] | grumpydevil: | be certain that those old settings are not causing me grief... |
| [00:25:01] | justinh: | there's no way to be certain that you wouldn't get a query wrong & bork your whole db |
| [00:25:18] | grumpydevil: | i moved a slave backend to different IP address, modified its setting in the DB, but i still get stringlist errors on commuication between master and slave |
| [00:25:28] | justinh: | if none of your machines use the old hostnames they can't cause you any problems |
| [00:25:48] | justinh: | there you go |
| [00:25:52] | justinh: | modified the setting IN THE DB |
| [00:25:58] | justinh: | you didn't use mythtv-setup? |
| [00:25:59] | grumpydevil: | mythtv-setup... |
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| [00:26:29] | justinh: | all the host dependent stuff is stored in the db by er.. hostname |
| [00:26:43] | grumpydevil: | although that particular setting happens to be a single value setting in the settings table.. |
| [00:27:05] | grumpydevil: | problem is that if i really want to be rid of all slave settings, i need to clean several tables :( |
| [00:27:11] | grumpydevil: | not just the settings table |
| [00:27:25] | justinh: | you'd need to dig in the code. nobody here would know |
| [00:28:17] | justinh: | a safer route would be to dump videometadata, recorded, oldrecorded etc, start anew & import the old stuff back in – and there's still no guarantee it'd fix anything |
| [00:28:24] | grumpydevil: | was afraid for that... not really willing to ditch that DB, even though it is a test DB, as a lot of recordings are related to it |
| [00:28:58] | grumpydevil: | no video data in that one, just recordings |
| [00:29:07] | grumpydevil: | so recorded could actually be enough |
| [00:29:24] | grumpydevil: | i do not care about re-recording for that one |
| [00:30:00] | justinh: | is it an intermittent issue? |
| [00:30:10] | justinh: | or something that constantly fails? |
| [00:30:13] | grumpydevil: | very consistent. About every exhange |
| [00:30:20] | justinh: | ah right |
| [00:30:31] | justinh: | go back & check everything first |
| [00:30:39] | justinh: | you might have missed something easy |
| [00:30:50] | justinh: | time for bed. |
| [00:31:05] | grumpydevil: | i did a snif on port 6543 and 6544 and saw only exhanges between machines i expected |
| [00:31:21] | grumpydevil: | i'll check again tomorrow... bed time here also |
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| [00:55:38] | frankster: | so im getting double keypresses with mythtv – didnt used to happen. irw only shows one event. |
| [00:56:04] | frankster: | its a devinput driver |
| [00:56:26] | frankster: | no lirc specific driver |
| [00:56:35] | frankster: | any thoughts |
| [00:56:37] | frankster: | ? |
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| [01:13:12] | Rasperin (Rasperin!~ray@70.94.54.58) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [01:13:34] | Rasperin: | Hey guys, I'm having an issue with getting mythtv to work, when running mythtv-setup I'm getting: mythtv-setup: error while loading shared libraries: libmythtv-0.24.so.0: |
| [01:18:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: install from source? IIRC, you need to do an 'ldconfig' |
| [01:20:23] | Rasperin: | J-e-f-f-A: it's an install from source |
| [01:20:23] | Rasperin: | ldconfig cool |
| [01:21:35] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: all of a sudden, MythNetVision is refusing to build because it says the python bindings are missing. However, the ./configure for mythtv indicates that they are being built. I did have to add perl-IO-Socket-INET6. Is there something similar needed for python? |
| [01:22:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: any luck? ;-) |
| [01:22:16] | wagnerrp: | nothing should have changed for the python dependencies in recent history |
| [01:23:52] | Rasperin: | sorry off in another talk with the devs, gimmie a sec |
| [01:23:54] | Rasperin: | :D |
| [01:24:12] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: any tips for debugging that dependency? Do you what file/path it is looking at? I can dig for it in the ./configure script, but if you happen to know off hand... |
| [01:24:32] | wagnerrp: | are you installing to a funky PREFIX? |
| [01:24:52] | jpabq_: | Nope. Never changed the defaults. Never installed myth from any rpm. |
| [01:27:51] | wagnerrp: | open 'python', and run 'import MythTV' |
| [01:30:48] | Rasperin: | J-e-f-f-A: no dice on that |
| [01:31:00] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: rats. ;-) |
| [01:31:20] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: you did the 'sudo make install', right? |
| [01:31:25] | Rasperin: | should it have had some sort of output? (without reading the man pages) |
| [01:31:38] | Rasperin: | J-e-f-f-A: well, I ran it as root, but yes |
| [01:31:46] | Rasperin: | I prefer su – to sudo :) |
| [01:32:33] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: looks like you can specify "-v" to get verbose output. ;-) |
| [01:33:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: Ah – you running 64-bit? If so, I had to add /usr/lib64 to /etc/ld.so.conf |
| [01:33:53] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: then do an 'ldconfig' |
| [01:34:16] | Rasperin: | ah |
| [01:34:34] | Rasperin: | yeah, will do that |
| [01:34:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | Rasperin: btw – I'm running Fedora if that makes any difference – I'm not real savvy to the differences with the different linux distros... |
| [01:35:04] | Rasperin: | I'm running arch |
| [01:35:21] | Rasperin: | (I'm a big FreeBSD fan :) but the radon drivers suck on it, so had to switch to linux) |
| [01:35:28] | Rasperin: | radeon* |
| [01:35:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | radeon? eew... /me doesn't like ATI... d'oh! ;-) |
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| [01:36:22] | J-e-f-f-A: | hehehehe |
| [01:36:40] | wagnerrp: | Rasperin: for what its worth, the radeon drivers suck on linux too |
| [01:36:50] | wagnerrp: | nearly everyone over here runs nvidia |
| [01:37:51] | Rasperin: | oh I know |
| [01:38:15] | Rasperin: | my last N! machines have been nvidia, but hey I have 6 monitors running at once on one card :) |
| [01:38:23] | Rasperin: | I use 5 on average at all times |
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| [01:39:35] | wagnerrp: | 6 on one card? i didnt think nvidia made anything that did more than 4 |
| [01:40:25] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: "ImportError: cannot import name BEEventConnection" is the last thing it says. It does look like it is loading the MythTV python lib. |
| [01:41:05] | wagnerrp: | sounds almost like youve got conflicting versions |
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| [01:41:47] | Rasperin: | wagnerrp: radeon |
| [01:41:57] | Rasperin: | I think nvidia only does 3 |
| [01:42:04] | Rasperin: | if it did four than I'm really really sad |
| [01:42:09] | gizmobay: | In what will be 0.25, does it still use mythtv-setup or is it done through the web now? |
| [01:42:26] | gizmobay: | *through a browser |
| [01:42:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | At my previous employer we had a few machines with quad-display Nvidia cards... |
| [01:42:30] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: I see python site packages in both /usr/lib and /usr/lib64 I will clear both out, and try again. |
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| [01:42:58] | wagnerrp: | Rasperin: we have a 4xDL-DVI quadro at work |
| [01:43:10] | wagnerrp: | based off an old 7950X2 |
| [01:43:53] | wagnerrp: | plus there are a couple low end cards with funky breakout cables for four monitors, low end cards, intended for 2D displays and limited 3D only |
| [01:44:41] | wagnerrp: | jpabq_: did you at any point switch from packages to source? |
| [01:44:43] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: actually there is nothing myth related in /usr/lib64/python. I do always build myth with --libdir-name=lib64, but I guess that does not determine how python is handled. |
| [01:44:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | ^^ That's probably what my previous employer had – as it was a business environment with quad displays, and it did have a breakout cable... |
| [01:45:10] | wagnerrp: | i dont recall off hand if we pass --libdir-name |
| [01:45:34] | wagnerrp: | that would be a no |
| [01:46:05] | wagnerrp: | we use the python executable defined by configure, and let it automatically choose everything else |
| [01:46:12] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: I have never install myth from a package on this machine. |
| [01:46:23] | wagnerrp: | we only set prefix if the specified prefix is something not /usr or /usr/local |
| [01:46:42] | wagnerrp: | at which point its up to you to make sure the necessary paths are in the python search path |
| [01:48:33] | jpabq_: | I did hack mythplugins's configure to build MythNetVision even though it thinks the python binding are missing. It built okay, and *seems* to be working okay. |
| [01:49:46] | jpabq_: | Okay, maybe it is not. |
| [01:52:59] | wagnerrp: | BEEventConnection exists in connections.py |
| [01:53:16] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: I purged /lib/python2.7/site-packages/MythTV, and that seems to have fixed the problem. It has re-build that direction and now everything is okay. Could this have anything to do with the stuff Stuart M was working on? |
| [01:53:23] | wagnerrp: | if it doesnt exist, but something is calling for it, it sounds like youve got mismatched files |
| [01:53:39] | wagnerrp: | i dont know what Stuartm was workingon |
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| [01:54:30] | jpabq_: | Something he was doing regarding the delayed-delete seem to touch a lot of this stuff. |
| [01:55:51] | wagnerrp: | if he touched anything, it would just be static.py |
| [01:56:01] | wagnerrp: | schema and protocol versions |
| [01:57:40] | jpabq_: | I don't know. That was the only place site-packages/MythTV was found. After deleting it, it put right back in the same place. Only difference is, it now works. |
| [01:58:07] | jpabq_: | wagnerrp: thanks for putting me on the right path to track that down. |
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| [02:38:32] | acidfreeze: | does the WinTV-HVR-1600 perform well? |
| [02:38:48] | acidfreeze: | i wanted to make sure i got a good card this time. i had the pvr-150 and it kinda lagged |
| [02:39:08] | lucas^: | I'm using it right now |
| [02:39:24] | acidfreeze: | real fast? |
| [02:39:31] | lucas^: | it's an amazing card but I bought it a few years ago, I'm sure there's better out these days |
| [02:39:36] | acidfreeze: | i would be using it for media box |
| [02:39:40] | acidfreeze: | well i found it for 30 bucks |
| [02:39:46] | acidfreeze: | system pull |
| [02:39:48] | lucas^: | I bought mine for $100, take it and run |
| [02:39:57] | lucas^: | as long as it isn't defective |
| [02:40:10] | acidfreeze: | 30 day warranty |
| [02:40:39] | acidfreeze: | so totally compatble? i have hd so i would use my video card for the hdmi to tv? |
| [02:41:08] | lucas^: | as to whether it 'lags', you have to understand that any card with an onboard MPEG-2 encoder is going to have to spend a little bit of time between the broadcast time and display time |
| [02:41:20] | acidfreeze: | oh ok |
| [02:41:24] | lucas^: | so it's not that suitable for game systems or stuff like that |
| [02:41:40] | lucas^: | I'm not sure how digital tuners work, but that's how it goes for analog signals |
| [02:41:45] | acidfreeze: | i would use it to record shows off cable and watch movies |
| [02:42:01] | acidfreeze: | via llnuxmce or mythtv by it self |
| [02:42:43] | lucas^: | MythTV and your HVR1600 would work great for that I think |
| [02:42:59] | acidfreeze: | what about the hdmi? |
| [02:43:15] | lucas^: | or WMC7 |
| [02:43:25] | acidfreeze: | i would run it coax from my box and then hdmi from my video card to tv? |
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| [02:44:03] | acidfreeze: | and i would then be able to record hd stuff from tv? |
| [02:44:31] | lucas^: | yeah, but before you get too far ahead I'd install the card in your computer and see what sort of channels you get |
| [02:44:47] | lucas^: | the problem is that most cable TV providers encrypt their broadcasts |
| [02:44:50] | acidfreeze: | i would have to use cable box |
| [02:45:19] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: wait – 'coax from your box'? – you mean cable box? |
| [02:45:21] | lucas^: | did you get a long black cable with two IR dongles on the end? |
| [02:45:27] | lucas^: | and a remote? |
| [02:45:28] | acidfreeze: | yea sorry |
| [02:45:56] | acidfreeze: | not sure what you mean |
| [02:46:02] | lucas^: | I've never done it but some people use what's called an IR blaster to transmit remote control signals to your cable box |
| [02:46:04] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: If you want to capture HD with Myth (In the US at least, not sure about other countries), you'll need to capture Analog Component Video with an HD-PVR. |
| [02:46:08] | lucas^: | to change channels and such |
| [02:46:09] | acidfreeze: | i just have a cable box with hdmi |
| [02:46:26] | acidfreeze: | oh ok |
| [02:46:30] | lucas^: | the HVR-1600 comes with an IR transmitter/receiver and a remote |
| [02:46:30] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: All you'll get out of the Coax is SD. |
| [02:46:34] | lucas^: | a badass remote I'll add |
| [02:46:42] | acidfreeze: | oh sorry it doesnt come with it |
| [02:46:52] | acidfreeze: | i dont need it. i will use android for remote |
| [02:46:56] | J-e-f-f-A: | The HVR-1600 will let you tune in clear-QAM only, without the cable box. |
| [02:47:06] | acidfreeze: | oh ok |
| [02:47:09] | J-e-f-f-A: | which isn't likely to be much. |
| [02:47:24] | acidfreeze: | so which is the best card to use with hd cable box |
| [02:47:34] | acidfreeze: | to build dvr box |
| [02:47:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: If you want to get 100% of what you pay for, you'll need the STB -> HD-PVR -> MythTV backend. |
| [02:47:37] | lucas^: | it varies, I get 480p standard cable (channels 1–99) on clearQAM and a few broadcast 720/1080 channels |
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| [02:47:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | And change channels on the STB with IR or Firewire. |
| [02:48:20] | lucas^: | couldn't he use a CableCARD tuner for HD? |
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| [02:48:44] | J-e-f-f-A: | The STB becomes a dedicated 'tuner' to the Myth backend – you Hide the remote in a drawer, as MythTV is the only thing connected to it, and controlling it. |
| [02:48:50] | acidfreeze: | i have a comcast cable box which has hdmi and coax |
| [02:48:58] | acidfreeze: | "black wire" |
| [02:49:05] | acidfreeze: | cable* |
| [02:49:15] | J-e-f-f-A: | You *could* use the HD-HR Prime with Myth- ASSUMING the channels/programs are marked COPY FREELY – YMMV.... |
| [02:49:31] | acidfreeze: | k |
| [02:49:53] | J-e-f-f-A: | The problem is that more and more cable companies are marking stuff so it's not 'copy freely' and thus won't work in MythTV. |
| [02:50:32] | acidfreeze: | so you have to use there dvr |
| [02:50:46] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: I have Verizon FiOS, and two HD boxes feeding Analog Component (1080i) video into HD-PVRs, then into MythTV. I change the channels via firewire. |
| [02:51:01] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: No – not ther DVR, but Yes to their HD STB. |
| [02:51:30] | acidfreeze: | i use comcast |
| [02:51:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: *if* You capture the Component video output with an Hauppauge HD-PVR. |
| [02:51:37] | acidfreeze: | i used to have fios... |
| [02:51:42] | acidfreeze: | lucky... |
| [02:51:51] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: Why did you switch, did you move? ;-) |
| [02:51:56] | acidfreeze: | yea |
| [02:52:09] | acidfreeze: | i used to be in tx... now ga |
| [02:52:44] | ** J-e-f-f-A replaces the first "o" in Comcast with a "u" – because that's what I think of them after being a customer of theirs for 7 years and being *hit on them all the time... ** | |
| [02:53:01] | lucas^: | something tells me I'm not going to like my options when I move out of the Midwest |
| [02:53:02] | J-e-f-f-A: | *by them |
| [02:53:17] | acidfreeze: | yea freaking bill changes more then my wifes mood swings |
| [02:53:43] | acidfreeze: | ok im looking up "HD-HR Prime" |
| [02:53:48] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: So, to summarize, if you want to get HD into MythTV, and get 100 |
| [02:54:07] | acidfreeze: | 100 channels max? |
| [02:54:21] | J-e-f-f-A: | ... 100% of what you pay for, the only sure-fire way is to use a cable-company HD STB feeding Analog Component video into a HD-PVR encoder. |
| [02:54:30] | acidfreeze: | i guess thats fine because most good channels are in that range |
| [02:54:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: hehehe... I hit 'return' by accident... sorry, typing too fast! |
| [02:54:57] | acidfreeze: | lol k |
| [02:54:59] | lucas^: | if it was me and I had the card in hand |
| [02:55:11] | lucas^: | I'd just try plugging it in and seeing what I could get off of ClearQAM |
| [02:55:19] | acidfreeze: | it can be http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hauppauge-74041LF-Win . . . em27c41b8d72 |
| [02:55:22] | lucas^: | I'm guessing comcast doesn't give much of anything |
| [02:55:23] | acidfreeze: | lol |
| [02:55:45] | acidfreeze: | they have bullet proof glass where you pay bill |
| [02:55:55] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: look at the Hauppague HD-PVR – it's a USB device that takes Component HD video (and SPDIF digital audio) IN, and spits out h.264 encoded video to the computer via USB at up to 13Mbps. Incredible quality. ;-) |
| [02:56:24] | lucas^: | jesus that's a good deal |
| [02:56:33] | lucas^: | almost tempted to buy it |
| [02:56:37] | acidfreeze: | they have 2 |
| [02:56:39] | acidfreeze: | im getting 1 |
| [02:57:20] | acidfreeze: | jeff: its 30 bucks.. you don't think i will get hd with it> |
| [02:57:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | If you want to see what you *may* get with your cable provider, take a look at this site... http://www.silicondust.com/support/channels/ Type in your zip-code, and select your provider, and that's what channels other users have been able to receive. |
| [02:57:43] | acidfreeze: | ok |
| [02:58:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: The 1600 will do *clear* QAM – but you're not likely to see anything but the Local channels in clear Qam on cumcast. |
| [02:58:55] | acidfreeze: | so like all the other channels like discovery would not even come in |
| [02:58:56] | acidfreeze: | ? |
| [02:59:15] | lucas^: | so, without a set-top box, with only a TV with an ATSC tuner |
| [02:59:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | And your HD STB will *not* output an HD RF signal for you to tune with the 1600 – it will be down-converted to 480i SD at that point. |
| [02:59:30] | lucas^: | you guys don't get anything but local affiliates you could get over the air? |
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| [02:59:32] | acidfreeze: | i have a cable box |
| [02:59:57] | acidfreeze: | when you say set top box you mean cable box right?> |
| [02:59:59] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: Right, and you probably have it connected to your TV via HDMI now. |
| [03:00:05] | acidfreeze: | yea i do |
| [03:00:09] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: STB= Set-top-box |
| [03:00:14] | acidfreeze: | oh ok |
| [03:00:44] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: So, with HDMI, there's lots of digital DRM (Digital Rights Management) involved -your TV is licensed to decode it. |
| [03:00:54] | acidfreeze: | soabs |
| [03:01:08] | acidfreeze: | netflix all over again |
| [03:01:21] | acidfreeze: | drm and linux... |
| [03:01:31] | lucas^: | Netflix is at least on-demand and available on a billion devices |
| [03:01:34] | J-e-f-f-A: | Myth/Linux doesn't have such licenses, so there is no such thing as an HDMI capture device – well, there is, but it can't capture encrypted content, so it's very limited, and won't capture a vast majority of what's available... |
| [03:01:40] | lucas^: | cable is just ... what's the damn point these days |
| [03:02:07] | acidfreeze: | thats why i people pirate... |
| [03:02:12] | acidfreeze: | bs rip offs |
| [03:02:45] | acidfreeze: | i heard ad on radio today saying to rat out people that pirate for cash rewards like crimestoppers |
| [03:02:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | Capturing via the *Component Video* output is non-encrypted – it's known as the "Analog Loophole" – that's what the HD-PVR does- samples the Component HD video input, and encodes it into h.264 video in real-time in hardware, then sends that to your computer. |
| [03:03:44] | acidfreeze: | alrght im out |
| [03:03:49] | acidfreeze: | have a good one guys |
| [03:03:50] | acidfreeze: | thanks |
| [03:04:02] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: ttyl. ;-) Hope I helped. |
| [03:04:09] | Oleg_: | hi |
| [03:04:13] | acidfreeze: | yea im not doing it |
| [03:04:29] | acidfreeze: | i will just use it to watch movies |
| [03:04:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: Well, MythTV *is* a bit of work, but well worth it... I've been running it for 6+ years now. ;-) |
| [03:05:00] | acidfreeze: | yea i have set it up plenty of times |
| [03:05:05] | acidfreeze: | i had pvr 150 |
| [03:05:15] | acidfreeze: | and old bt878 |
| [03:05:16] | acidfreeze: | lol |
| [03:05:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: Hehehe... I started with a PVR-350, then 250, then a 500. ;-) |
| [03:05:50] | acidfreeze: | that bt787 chipset was bullet proof |
| [03:05:56] | acidfreeze: | 878 or whatever |
| [03:06:00] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: I went HD about 2 years ago. I used a $750 Amazon.com gift card I won at work to buy my HD-PVRs. ;-) |
| [03:06:08] | lucas^: | my old bt878 STB2 card still works |
| [03:06:23] | J-e-f-f-A: | acidfreeze: Yeah, except that the system has to do the encoding. The Hauppauge PVR cards are AWESOME! ;-) |
| [03:06:36] | acidfreeze: | l8te |
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| [03:07:13] | lucas^: | 3–3 Penguins/Stars last 5 min of third period |
| [03:07:14] | ** J-e-f-f-A <3's Hauppauge. ;-) They support us Linux folks very well... ;-) <3 <3 <3 <3 ** | |
| [03:11:21] | lucas^: | I've gotta wonder if Hauppauge / WMC7 / MythTV will still be around ten years from now |
| [03:11:40] | lucas^: | if cable providers continue to lock their broadcasts down |
| [03:11:43] | [R]: | tv is a fad |
| [03:11:46] | [R]: | it'll be gone in a few years |
| [03:11:57] | [R]: | people will actually start going outside |
| [03:12:11] | lucas^: | crazy talk |
| [03:12:33] | lucas^: | sudden death overtime, 4 on 3 |
| [03:12:38] | lucas^: | couldn't ask for a better game |
| [03:12:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: MythTV will always be around. ;-) |
| [03:13:02] | lucas^: | hope so! |
| [03:13:22] | lucas^: | I guess TV isn't going anywhere as long as people still watch football / hockey / baseball etc. |
| [03:13:25] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: until they close the "Analog Loophole", I'll be happily enjoying my HD MythTV system. ;-) |
| [03:13:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | I don't watch many sports at all. ;-) |
| [03:14:10] | J-e-f-f-A: | The only reason I caught the tail end of the Daytona 500 was because it ran over the 10 O'clock news spot due to the crash... ;-) |
| [03:21:15] | lucas^: | shootout |
| [03:21:34] | lucas^: | man I spent hours trying to recover from a F16 upgrade gone bad |
| [03:21:53] | lucas^: | another eight hours at least reinstalling F16 from scratch and recovering backup |
| [03:22:17] | lucas^: | then two hours or so to reconfigure MythTV, manually setting channels and such |
| [03:22:32] | lucas^: | eight hours per mythfilldatabase attempt, took four tries before getting my program listings back |
| [03:22:36] | lucas^: | it's all worth it just to see this |
| [03:30:58] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: 8hrs for mythfilldabase? What are you running on, a 486? ;-) |
| [03:36:37] | lucas^: | i5 |
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| [03:44:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: Yikes – what's your listing source? I use SD and have 500 channels and it takes just 2 mins on an AMD Athlon(tm) II X4 640 Processor |
| [03:47:11] | wagnerrp: | two minutes for a run is a bit dangerous |
| [03:47:24] | wagnerrp: | how many recording rules? |
| [03:47:50] | J-e-f-f-A: | oh, wait, it skipped all the data it already had – that wasn't a 'full' run... |
| [03:48:24] | J-e-f-f-A: | so that was only 1 day of data. ;-) |
| [03:48:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: Lots of rules... let me see... |
| [03:48:45] | wagnerrp: | select count(1) from record; |
| [03:49:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: less than I thought – 102 |
| [03:49:59] | wagnerrp: | getting lots of duplicates on syndicated shows? |
| [03:50:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | yeah. |
| [03:51:38] | J-e-f-f-A: | hehe... Before a little help from sph... My machine was recording something nearly every minute of the day... Because somehow the 'duplicate' flag got set to '0' on my entire DB... Now I've only got a dozen recordings a day... |
| [03:53:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: My "Recording Statistics" on MythWeb shows: Number of shows: 399 Number of episodes: 42839 — sph... was blown away by that. ;-) (DB since 8/6/2008) |
| [03:54:29] | J-e-f-f-A: | My DB would have gone back to mid-2005, but I lost everything in 2008 when my Raid5 lost 2 drives at once... (well one I knew of, and 2nd died with the click-of-death on re-boot... d'oh!) |
| [03:56:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: but assuming 14-days of data, that would still only put a full refresh at about 30 mins on my box. |
| [04:18:05] | lucas^: | I use SD, just thought the download speed was really slow for some reason, around 80 channels |
| [04:24:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: ouch. My d/l speed was 51.1K/s – so about 511kbps ... Definitely not saturating my 35/35 link. ;-) |
| [04:28:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | lucas^: I'm also running a SATA II SSD for my OS/DB – which I'm sure helps quite a bit too... |
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| [06:27:26] | larrikin: | does mythweb currently open files as www-data user or does it setuid somewhere ? |
| [06:28:25] | wagnerrp: | it opens files as whatever user you run apache as |
| [06:29:06] | wagnerrp: | anything that involves setuid would be a bad idea |
| [06:29:32] | larrikin: | okay, hasn't changed then.. I'm not using latest, I'm just curious.. |
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| [06:34:23] | larrikin: | I'm having to chmod everything thats streamable .. my default umask doesn't include any 'other' bits.. I guess setuid -would- be a risk |
| [06:34:38] | wagnerrp: | and it would just be dumb |
| [06:34:52] | wagnerrp: | if you wanted to implement something that would allow access when the apache user doesnt have rights |
| [06:34:57] | wagnerrp: | you would stream it from the backend |
| [06:35:06] | larrikin: | yes |
| [06:35:06] | wagnerrp: | you wouldnt change users to one that had rights |
| [06:35:56] | wagnerrp: | it is a security risk, but more so, its just short sighted when routing it through the backend would have the additional benefit of supporting remote backends |
| [06:35:57] | larrikin: | well hopefully most things will be handled by the backend going forwards |
| [06:36:32] | wagnerrp: | ideally, streaming content will be run through the services API, and optionally the HLS server if transcoding is needed |
| [06:38:09] | larrikin: | btw is there a script that can perform the same function as scaning new music by the frontend ? I'm without a display on my frontend atm.. |
| [06:38:24] | wagnerrp: | not currently, no |
| [06:38:31] | larrikin: | ok |
| [06:38:36] | wagnerrp: | do you have an X server anywhere? |
| [06:39:23] | larrikin: | yes |
| [06:39:37] | wagnerrp: | forward mythfrontend to it instead |
| [06:41:47] | wagnerrp: | actually, if youre interested |
| [06:41:56] | wagnerrp: | mythmusic is already capable of streaming content from the backend |
| [06:42:06] | larrikin: | umm.. okay, that might work if xhosts doesn't complain |
| [06:42:19] | wagnerrp: | it wouldnt be difficult to modify that script to handle the recordings and video content as well |
| [06:42:50] | wagnerrp: | if you cant get the authentication setup yourself, use an ssh tunnel to do it for you |
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| [07:05:24] | larrikin: | it worked, I'll have to remember to force it to run windowed next time..:) it went fullscreen and even after I killed the process I wasn't able to get back to any other apps / had to restart the Xserver |
| [07:07:17] | wagnerrp: | odd |
| [07:08:15] | wagnerrp: | sphery: you ever seen the IT Crowd? |
| [07:08:46] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah--unfortunately, I've seen all of it |
| [07:08:56] | [R]: | unforunately? |
| [07:08:58] | [R]: | its freakin amazing |
| [07:08:59] | sphery: | (meaning there's none to look forward to since they've decided not to do series 5) |
| [07:09:03] | [R]: | i hate it that they cancelled it |
| [07:09:19] | [R]: | why do they always do that? cancel great shows |
| [07:09:49] | wagnerrp: | have you tried turning barriers off again? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nn2FB1P_Mn8 |
| [07:10:25] | sphery: | I have a feeling that's S1E1 where Moss is on the phone |
| [07:10:49] | sphery: | ah, that's Roy's part of the same season |
| [07:10:57] | wagnerrp: | i have a feeling thats S*E* |
| [07:10:58] | sphery: | oh, and many others |
| [07:11:03] | sphery: | yeah |
| [07:11:37] | [R]: | there was the one where he stated to say it, then he just like hung up |
| [07:11:43] | [R]: | started* |
| [07:12:20] | wagnerrp: | stated? you from jahsey? |
| [07:12:30] | wagnerrp: | or bahsten? |
| [07:12:44] | sphery: | now I want more IT Crowd |
| [07:13:17] | wagnerrp: | why was it canceled? |
| [07:14:32] | sphery: | the guy who created it basically said he thought he had met his goals with the show and wanted to move on to something different |
| [07:14:46] | [R]: | i read on the wikipedia there was supposed to be an american version |
| [07:14:54] | [R]: | but the ratings weren't good on the pilot, so it never happened |
| [07:14:58] | sphery: | there used to be an american version |
| [07:15:06] | sphery: | had what's his name from community in it |
| [07:15:10] | sphery: | Jeff |
| [07:16:02] | wagnerrp: | the fat one? |
| [07:16:22] | sphery: | no, Joel McHale... "the cool one" |
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| [07:16:38] | [R]: | haha |
| [07:17:21] | sphery: | though wikipedia now says, "On 30 July 2010, Linehan confirmed that a US version of the show is back on, with possible changes due to negative reactions." and ref's http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-radio/tvandr . . . 888f901e5205 |
| [07:17:26] | wagnerrp: | oh, community... |
| [07:17:31] | wagnerrp: | for some reason i was thinking office |
| [07:17:42] | sphery: | hehe |
| [07:17:48] | larrikin: | 'wilfred' would be another show ruined when they made the american version.. |
| [07:18:23] | [R]: | im still mad that they cancelled Outsourced |
| [07:18:27] | [R]: | i thought that was a good one |
| [07:18:32] | [R]: | got me to watch the movie, which was pretty crazy |
| [07:19:16] | wagnerrp: | hahaha |
| [07:19:25] | larrikin: | hey, I've been sent to India for a work related long stay.. :( you might call it comedy |
| [07:19:32] | wagnerrp: | richmond founded a company called 'goth2boss' |
| [07:19:50] | wagnerrp: | which encourages goths to cheer up and go to work |
| [07:20:10] | [R]: | yeah, taht one was funny |
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| [07:25:06] | wagnerrp: | wow, that was back in 2007 |
| [07:25:38] | wagnerrp: | moss would have been filming both versions at the same time? |
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| [07:44:39] | Vink- (Vink-!~vink@ns.mon-net.org) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [07:44:56] | Vink-: | Hi there |
| [07:45:04] | Vink-: | since few days.. I've a problem on my mthtv box (mythbuntu 0.24.2): I can scan DVB-T channel, but, cannot record or read eit data... and when mythbackend is on, dvbsnoop -nph 0x12 works fine |
| [07:45:50] | wagnerrp: | if dvbsnoop works fine when mythbackend is running |
| [07:45:56] | wagnerrp: | then mythbackend cannot access your tuner card |
| [07:46:13] | wagnerrp: | as it is supposed to lock out access to the tuner card, which would prevent dvbsnoop from doing anything |
| [07:46:48] | Vink-: | mythbackend shows: DVBChan(1:/dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend0): Tune(): Frequency tuning successful. |
| [07:51:42] | Vink-: | I've the logs of mythbackend -v channel,eit here: http://pastebin.com/aCZpa852 |
| [07:55:59] | dekarl: | Vink-: french DVB-T? Do you have network_ID and transport_ID filled in the multiplex? |
| [07:57:01] | Vink-: | dekarl > dvb-t from switzerland cable provider (they put 21 DVB-T multiplex on cable network) |
| [07:57:42] | dekarl: | I'm guessing it could be something similar to http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/10217 |
| [07:58:52] | Vink-: | seems similar.. cable provider add new multiplex yesterday.. probably that issue start here |
| [07:59:32] | wagnerrp: | they put DVB-T on a cable network? |
| [07:59:36] | dekarl: | If they send the correct tables with them its not bad... |
| [07:59:56] | Vink-: | wagnerrp > yes.. dvb-t in clear and dvb-c encrypted |
| [08:00:07] | wagnerrp: | funky |
| [08:00:38] | dekarl: | Vink-: its likely something else, I see this in your log: 2012-03–01 08:48:41.915 DTVSM(/dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend0)::SetDVBService(transport_id: 510, network_id: 1, service_id: 30200): |
| [08:01:01] | dekarl: | btw, that's DVB-S not DVB-T (original_network_id 1 is SES Astra on 19.2) |
| [08:01:45] | dekarl: | very common with cable provider to just put the multiplex on another transport (sometimes without replacing the DVB-S tables with DVB-C cables, makes the scanner very happy ;) |
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| [08:05:04] | dekarl: | Vink-: I was guessing at french DVB-T because that's their (original_)network_id: DTVSM(/dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend0)::SetNIT(): net_id = 8442 |
| [08:05:34] | Vink-: | I've french channel too |
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| [08:06:58] | [R]: | dvb sounds confusing |
| [08:07:00] | adante_ is now known as adante | |
| [08:07:27] | dekarl: | the problem apperas to be that no matching SDT is found: AddFlags: Seen(SDT,) Match() Wait() |
| [08:07:28] | dekarl: | But I'm not sure what that means ;) |
| [08:08:14] | dekarl: | But PAT/PMT have been matched already... would have to look at the source but I'm a bit short on time |
| [08:09:19] | Vink-: | SDT is ? |
| [08:09:42] | Vink-: | ok |
| [08:10:46] | dekarl: | service_description_section which describes what services/channels are available, I think its mostly interesting because you can describe *other* multiplexes... so you just scan one frequency and find all channels |
| [08:11:05] | dekarl: | the T is for table which is made up of sections |
| [08:11:10] | Vink-: | dvbsnoop -nph 0x00 lists programs |
| [08:12:05] | dekarl: | that should like the programs/services on the current multiplex |
| [08:12:13] | dekarl: | s/like/list/ |
| [08:14:05] | dekarl: | can you record ARD/ZDF? (asking about them because they *must* be provided in clear and may not be crypted) |
| [08:16:15] | Vink-: | mythbackend says: ZDDF is recording... |
| [08:17:16] | Vink-: | but, file remains empty |
| [08:18:48] | Vink-: | GetPlaybackURL: '20200_20120301091600.mpg' should be local, but it can not be found. |
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| [08:21:32] | Vink-: | it's most likely network/transport id are not correct |
| [08:32:15] | Vink-: | with mythbackend -v all.. I'v a lot of PESPacket: Failed CRC check 0xb3083146 != 0xf2722266 for StreamID = 0x70 |
| [08:33:55] | Vink-: | google gives me result about a patch writen by... dekarl 10207 |
| [08:35:54] | dekarl: | Vink-: its only half the patch, the other half needs to be written yet. (but that message won't hurt) |
| [08:48:32] | dekarl: | Vink-: another thing to verfiy is the si_standard marked as DVB (instead of MPEG) |
| [08:48:32] | dekarl: | but got to leave for work now |
| [08:48:45] | Vink-: | thanx.. see you |
| [08:49:01] | dekarl: | the si_standard being mpeg would hint at other problems |
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| [08:51:00] | dekarl: | btw, tuning to channel _62 instead of 62 hints that the scanner did not find that channel on a second scan |
| [08:51:44] | dekarl: | looking at my notes at http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/User:Dekarl/Burndown_DVB that could be something like http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/10054 |
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| [10:47:31] | frankster: | I am having problems with double keypresses on my remote. I have chcked irw and that only shows one event. I have disabled the remote in my xorg.conf and confirmed it works by this line "[B[B[B[B[B[B[ 15249.326] (**) IR-receiver inside an USB DVB receiver: Ignoring device from InputClass "Remote" |
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| [10:47:38] | frankster: | any ideas what else to try? |
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| [11:29:53] | drac_boy: | hi |
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| [13:03:34] | dj_who: | hi, why mythtv reports that recording is shorter than ffmpeg reports |
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| [13:08:21] | dj_who: | or at least how can i check duration reported by mythtv (displayed during playback) but in terminal (e.g. ./mythcheckduration /myfile.mpg) i think the difrence between reported length is because each recording at the begining is "bit errored" is about 3s |
| [13:08:41] | dj_who: | any advice? |
| [13:10:26] | tank-man: | you can use mplayer to play the mpeg or nuv files from the commandline |
| [13:11:39] | tank-man: | with the -identify option |
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| [13:44:39] | dj_who: | mplayer is now working for me (maybe because i've compiled my own ffmpeg) i need exact time that is displayed in mythtv because i'm making a ffmpeg transcoder for mythtv that uses mythtv cutlist and supports h264 video + 2xaudio(2.0, 5.1) and dvb-t subtitles) |
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| [14:10:47] | skd5aner: | chrome has decided to constantly crash tabs on me now – thanks chrome |
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| [14:14:07] | skd5aner: | seems to be news sites mainly... memory goes CRAZY |
| [14:14:49] | skd5aner: | and cpu |
| [14:14:51] | skd5aner: | meh |
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| [16:05:32] | CyberKnet: | downloading an iso. 80 megabits / second. schnikeys. |
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| [16:25:15] | wagnerrp: | WTF? |
| [16:25:36] | wagnerrp: | http://www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/ . . . /328886.html |
| [16:25:56] | wagnerrp: | he disguised the name of the movie, but not the fact that it was illegally downloaded? |
| [16:26:07] | wagnerrp: | what kind of 'tard does that? |
| [16:28:04] | cesman (cesman!~cesman@pdpc/supporter/professional/cesman) has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | |
| [16:29:25] | Vink-: | dekarl> I've installed patch #10054, #10207, rescanned channel .. it seems to be better |
| [16:33:36] | Vink-: | I've also set to 'always' the choice for Use acquisition (I do not know exact term in english) |
| [16:34:52] | wagnerrp: | sphery: that's it, they've gone to sh*t.... http://www.extremetech.com/computing/120601-a . . . ased-servers |
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| [16:41:24] | jams: | well i guess Mark K wasn't a fan of the network control interface |
| [16:41:33] | rich0 (rich0!~rich0@gentoo/developer/rich0) has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) | |
| [16:41:47] | GreyFoxx: | It was removed from Torc? I loved it |
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| [16:42:07] | jams: | yep |
| [16:42:18] | jams: | the commit msg is what i found amusing |
| [16:42:50] | wagnerrp: | didnt find it necessary? |
| [16:43:47] | wagnerrp: | ah, well i would agree that the code could stand a cleanup |
| [16:44:13] | jams: | The code is a mess of hard coded behaviours that are inconsistent, high |
| [16:44:13] | jams: | maintenance, include plugin related features and completely at odds with |
| [16:44:13] | jams: | the services API approach. |
| [16:47:55] | wagnerrp: | jams: this is the one that bugged me a bit... https://github.com/Torc/torc/commit/44bf600dbd7f3 |
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| [16:52:40] | wagnerrp: | which really doesnt even make sense |
| [16:53:13] | wagnerrp: | tossing out the control socket because 'its not modular for plugins and such' |
| [16:53:32] | wagnerrp: | and then scrapping a rewritten backend protocol specifically designed to be modular? |
| [16:54:05] | jams: | i'm guessing he has zero interest in unforking |
| [16:55:06] | wagnerrp: | and hes going to have some serious problems trying to pull merges once i start ripping apart mythbackend in the 0.26 cycle |
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| [16:59:21] | jams: | btw wagnerrp I really like the new commandline parser |
| [16:59:39] | wagnerrp: | heh, thanks |
| [16:59:51] | jams: | at first I wasn't for sure about it, but it's so easy to add new stuff |
| [17:00:04] | wagnerrp: | that was written because i didnt want to use the existing one for the mediaserver and jobqueue executables |
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| [17:03:46] | wagnerrp: | to be honest, what was there previously was barely a "parser" |
| [17:04:13] | jams: | long chain of if/then |
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| [18:34:34] | sphery: | wagnerrp: wow... at least that means that they'll stop doing Atom-based systesm |
| [18:35:07] | wagnerrp: | apparently they make boards with Xeons already |
| [18:35:09] | sphery: | that said, their interconnects, etc., were pretty nice |
| [18:35:12] | wagnerrp: | using their custom fabric |
| [18:36:02] | wagnerrp: | well sure... but their fabrics were just standard (real) supercomputer stuff |
| [18:36:27] | wagnerrp: | xeons and opterons just means theyre using CPUs worthy of that status |
| [18:36:36] | sphery: | right |
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| [18:58:17] | wagnerrp: | sphery: im not sure why they wouldnt just build their own by repurposing hypertransport |
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| [19:43:57] | wagnerrp: | sphery: its your project, its their repo in your project |
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| [19:59:53] | peitolm: | wagnerrp: what do you mean by "standard (real) super computer stuff" when referring to the seamicro fabric, looks like a non-standard to me |
| [20:00:48] | wagnerrp: | yes, standard |
| [20:01:12] | sphery: | wagnerrp: hehe, it's actually a project created by Capt M (though I've been added as an owner to allow me to create new repos :) |
| [20:01:26] | sphery: | but I meant it's for them... |
| [20:01:34] | wagnerrp: | a "real" supercomputer, using a bunch of chips on a single shared memory OS, with a custom network fabric |
| [20:02:09] | wagnerrp: | compared to a "nearly there" supercomputer running a bunch of independent systems connected through infiniband |
| [20:02:25] | wagnerrp: | or a "modest" supercomputer where infiniband is replaced with GigE |
| [20:02:29] | peitolm: | don't see any mention of shard memory, numa or otherwise |
| [20:02:52] | peitolm: | these days Infiniband == supercomputer fabric |
| [20:02:55] | wagnerrp: | or "not a" supercomputer where the GigE is replaced with internet |
| [20:03:12] | peitolm: | there aren't that many non-infiniband fabric based supercomputers |
| [20:03:18] | wagnerrp: | peitolm: yeah, pretty much... you dont often see the custom fabrics any longer |
| [20:03:36] | peitolm: | the linebetween "cluster" and "supercomputer" is kind of blurred though |
| [20:03:50] | peitolm: | I can think of 3 off the top of my head |
| [20:03:51] | wagnerrp: | i dont actually know what their internal fabric is, havent found any meaningful information on it |
| [20:03:51] | sphery: | but this is a cloud company |
| [20:03:55] | sphery: | not a supercomputer company! |
| [20:04:08] | sphery: | they sell small water droplets |
| [20:05:08] | wagnerrp: | theres no reason to run independent "cloud" tasks on such a tightly knit system |
| [20:05:31] | sphery: | but the article said cloud! |
| [20:05:57] | sphery: | who should I believe? Someone who understands tech or the journalist who wrote the article? |
| [20:06:18] | wagnerrp: | yeah well i saw some company talking about a hybrid tank to replace the M2, and GE has recently been talking up their hybrid locomotives |
| [20:06:24] | wagnerrp: | but that doesnt mean such things actually exist |
| [20:07:13] | peitolm: | cloud is a marketing rubbish term |
| [20:07:23] | sphery: | http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2156 . . . dor-seamicro talks up the cloud angle a lot more, too |
| [20:07:30] | peitolm: | well yes |
| [20:07:38] | sphery: | and, yeah, I agree |
| [20:07:46] | peitolm: | they're tightly packed, systems, they're not tightly integrated |
| [20:08:20] | peitolm: | they don't seem to have much in the way of storage, so i guess it would all be SAN based |
| [20:08:49] | ** peitolm remembers a 4th interconnect ** | |
| [20:09:16] | wagnerrp: | peitolm: if theyre not tightly integrated, then theres no point to them at all |
| [20:09:28] | sphery: | the timing is funny, though, since SeaMicro just announced their Xeon-based systems on Jan 31, 2012 (or somewhere around there)... meaning they've been "obsoleted" about a month after release |
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| [20:09:40] | wagnerrp: | you could buy single core Atom boards for $100/pop, machine your own case, buy some high end power supply and switches |
| [20:09:55] | wagnerrp: | and pull the same system off with the same hardware for 1/5th the price theyre charging |
| [20:10:30] | sphery: | they keep saying that the "card-deck-sized" mobos are an important part of it |
| [20:11:14] | sphery: | but I agree that the interconnects make it more interesting than a "bunch of loosely-integrated atoms" system |
| [20:11:57] | wagnerrp: | if they arent using some custom fabric, all that "technology" they've developed amounts to zip |
| [20:12:07] | wagnerrp: | and AMD just chucked away $330M for nothing |
| [20:13:02] | sphery: | or chucked away $330M for some marketing |
| [20:13:05] | peitolm: | i think the interconnect is how theyre getting IO in and out |
| [20:13:11] | sphery: | (i.e. they've made the news, today :) |
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| [20:13:21] | peitolm: | it's entirely possible that it is capable of passing messages |
| [20:13:29] | peitolm: | but i've not looked into them too much |
| [20:13:47] | peitolm: | been too busy looking at the other vendors |
| [20:14:03] | ** peitolm does this stuff for a day job, so has a passing intrest ** | |
| [20:14:40] | ** wagnerrp does the "beowulf" thing ** | |
| [20:14:58] | peitolm: | i figured |
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| [20:17:19] | peitolm: | where abouts |
| [20:17:45] | wagnerrp: | cincinnati, educational cluster... ~750 nodes |
| [20:18:12] | peitolm: | cool |
| [20:18:42] | wagnerrp: | nah, its decrepit |
| [20:18:52] | wagnerrp: | patched together with shoestring and bailing wire |
| [20:19:06] | wagnerrp: | spent too much money on nodes, keep spending more money on nodes |
| [20:19:17] | peitolm: | that's always the problem with them |
| [20:19:18] | wagnerrp: | but dont bother beefing up the infrastructure |
| [20:19:45] | peitolm: | had that in the first computational cluster, still it functioned ok as a job farm |
| [20:20:08] | wagnerrp: | it works fine for smaller things, chokes on the big stuff |
| [20:20:38] | peitolm: | gigE or older? |
| [20:20:57] | wagnerrp: | gige, but no proper trunking |
| [20:21:27] | peitolm: | what would you need trunking for? |
| [20:21:54] | wagnerrp: | 24-port switches, 22 nodes to a switch, three switches and 64 nodes to a shelving unit |
| [20:22:05] | wagnerrp: | each switch just gets a single gige uplink to a master switch |
| [20:22:29] | peitolm: | how are the switches aggregated? |
| [20:22:44] | pyrodex: | wow single link to a master switch? suprised they didn't trunk or portchannel |
| [20:22:53] | wagnerrp: | except the "expensive smart 48-port master" is blocking, only 20Gbps backplane fabric |
| [20:23:17] | wagnerrp: | netgear piece of crap |
| [20:23:54] | ** peitolm would be tempted to take out some of the nodes as 'cold spares' and think about making the network a bit fatter ** | |
| [20:24:17] | wagnerrp: | it "supports trunking", but only between switches of the same type, no 802.3ad support |
| [20:24:29] | peitolm: | :( |
| [20:24:36] | peitolm: | what about the 24 port switches, do they? |
| [20:24:46] | wagnerrp: | no, theyre just dumb switches anyway |
| [20:25:03] | wagnerrp: | like $150/pop for 24-port gige |
| [20:25:05] | peitolm: | so they don't do trunking otherwise |
| [20:25:16] | wagnerrp: | like i said, all the money on nodes, none on the infrastructure |
| [20:25:20] | peitolm: | sounds familiar |
| [20:26:00] | pyrodex: | Hmm speaking of all this bonding. If you had to choose in linux what would your preferred bonding mode be for MAX bandwidth across 4 gige links |
| [20:26:13] | peitolm: | depends |
| [20:26:19] | pyrodex: | right now I'm 802.3ad |
| [20:26:21] | pyrodex: | with LACP trunk |
| [20:26:35] | wagnerrp: | well... the only one i was able to get to work was 'mode 6' |
| [20:26:54] | wagnerrp: | which cheats by tossing different ARP packets to different nodes |
| [20:26:55] | pyrodex: | I'm also seeing Excessive broadcasts on my HDHR Prime ports... |
| [20:27:26] | wagnerrp: | we were going to trunk our master file server into the core switch |
| [20:27:51] | wagnerrp: | and even "cheating", with 4x intel gige, i was running ~3.2Gbps to eight nodes |
| [20:28:02] | pyrodex: | I'm thinking home network here :) I have an HP procurve 2810–24 and my main server (mythbackend,smb,etc.) is 4 gige's into the switch and trunked. |
| [20:28:26] | wagnerrp: | but the combination of that sort of trunking, NFS, and our areca raid card caused the machine to panic |
| [20:28:34] | wagnerrp: | never figured out what was actually happening |
| [20:28:39] | pyrodex: | hmm |
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| [20:28:45] | pyrodex: | I am doing that on my areca system. |
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| [20:29:10] | drac_boy: | hi |
| [20:29:10] | wagnerrp: | i could run 400MB/s off the card into /dev/null, or to the card from /dev/zero, with never a problem |
| [20:29:20] | wagnerrp: | i could run off the raid card over NFS, with never a problem |
| [20:29:32] | wagnerrp: | but off the raid card, over NFS, with the fake trunking |
| [20:29:41] | wagnerrp: | it would panic within minutes every time |
| [20:30:13] | peitolm: | sounds like a crazy issue with interrupts |
| [20:30:24] | wagnerrp: | plus there was the minor issue of all the nodes running TFTP off the same system |
| [20:30:37] | wagnerrp: | TFTP and root NFS |
| [20:30:51] | wagnerrp: | TFTP chokes if youve got more than one client pulling at a time |
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| [20:31:43] | wagnerrp: | and if youre trying to start up a job, it would flood the NFS servers request pool, and nodes would sit there stalled waiting for fs access |
| [20:32:03] | wagnerrp: | you try to log in to one of the nodes, and you sit for minutes waiting for it to be able to pull the passwd file |
| [20:32:51] | peitolm: | well, i can see 2 things you might want to do if you haven't already |
| [20:33:47] | wagnerrp: | i ended up grabbing a couple of the nodes, and writing a custom init routine that would pull a copy of the root fs on boot, rsync it periodically, and serve it out to the rest of its shelving unit (64 nodes) |
| [20:34:20] | peitolm: | any local disk? |
| [20:34:36] | wagnerrp: | yeah, the ones i used all had a local 80GB scratch disk i was storing it to |
| [20:34:53] | wagnerrp: | but they had enough memory it should have just been pulling from disk cache |
| [20:35:37] | wagnerrp: | might be worth while to set up a central LDAP for login |
| [20:35:48] | peitolm: | def |
| [20:36:46] | peitolm: | considered anything like cfengine? |
| [20:37:02] | wagnerrp: | dont know what that is |
| [20:38:32] | wagnerrp: | interesting |
| [20:38:50] | pyrodex: | nice amazon refunded my shipping on my entire overnight order because they didn't ship it out in time but they did and it is arriving over the next few days. new htpc's here i come. |
| [20:38:51] | wagnerrp: | we do have a range of systems, since the cluster has been grown organically up from P4s through i7s |
| [20:39:10] | peitolm: | it's a configuration management tool |
| [20:39:46] | peitolm: | great for hetrogenous systems |
| [20:40:31] | pyrodex: | it is nice if you have the same systems, we use it at work for .COM since all the webservers are the same |
| [20:40:50] | peitolm: | it's good for homogeonous stuff as well |
| [20:41:03] | peitolm: | but it's strength is keeping a load of disparate things the way you want them |
| [20:41:44] | peitolm: | i'm a big fan. |
| [20:42:09] | peitolm: | and it can easily cope with cascading configs down from other nodes |
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| [21:17:08] | Shred00: | has mythtv gotten any better at reading "non-compliant" (read: specifications violations for the purposes of copy protection) DVDs in master? or is this really not a mythtv problem and the problem of some underlying library? |
| [21:24:08] | sphery: | it's a libdvdread/libdvdnav issue, but we have updated the mythtv copy of those libs since 0.24, so maybe? |
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| [21:38:37] | CyberKnet: | I still think if someone uses standards violation for copy protection they ought to get fined and have to replace every disc with a standards compliant version. |
| [21:39:51] | CyberKnet: | it's one thing to use a "little used facet of the standard that some manufacturers might not have implemented" ... but it's outright evil to deliberately work outside of a standard like that. |
| [21:40:06] | sphery: | http://xkcd.com/927/ |
| [21:41:47] | drac_boy: | CyberKnet I can't argue with you |
| [21:42:36] | drac_boy: | the one thing I still think about is with regarding to playing dvds on alternative oses tho |
| [21:43:34] | devinheitmueller: | Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity... |
| [21:48:02] | Shred00: | CyberKnet: that's all fine in theory, but real-life is that linux has a problem playing dvds that my dvd player will play and that impacts WAF severely. :-( |
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| [21:49:16] | CyberKnet: | Shred00: I agree. I never play DVDs on Myth because every time I ever attempted to it resulted in pain of one kind or another. I tried four or five times over three or four years (at least a couple of years ago now) and then gave up. |
| [21:49:25] | CyberKnet: | I play DVDs in my blu-ray player. |
| [21:49:39] | CyberKnet: | devinheitmueller: true as well. |
| [21:49:49] | Shred00: | CyberKnet: agreed (on the pain). but it's something that should be fixed rather than just worked-around. |
| [21:50:14] | CyberKnet: | Shred00: Perhaps... I don't contribute any code though, or know anything about DVDs other than pressing play. |
| [21:50:40] | CyberKnet: | This despite having written a program for a previous employer that converted their CCTV info onto DVDs. |
| [21:50:44] | CyberKnet: | so ... *shrug* |
| [21:51:46] | CyberKnet: | Use enough components in a high enough level language and you don't have to have the faintest idea what you are really doing, I guess :) |
| [21:52:08] | CyberKnet: | heh |
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| [23:48:14] | dekarl: | wagnerrp: ^â» if I understand correctly Vi nk- says #10054 does fix a bug for him, time to unlock the ticket? |
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