| Friday, June 17th, 2011, 00:00 UTC | ||
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| [00:22:36] | frodo_: | Hello all. I am running mythTV with an HDHR3-US dual tuner which will not allow me to record two channels at one time. PIP will only display a pip from a sub channel on the active channel being watched. It acts like a single tuner unit, but I can switch tuners and they work, but the system does not do it automatically. Can anyone offer any hints? |
| [00:23:49] | sphery: | you've configured it with multirec, so you'll have to switch cards on one of the views using the MENU or by mapping a key to TV Playback/NEXTCARD |
| [00:25:22] | wagnerrp: | frodo_: you need to configure the device as two separate tuners |
| [00:25:43] | frodo_: | I can switch tuners from the menu, and that works... But when I select two programs to record at the same time the second is flagged as conflicting and won't record |
| [00:25:51] | sphery: | ah, yeah, + what wagnerrp said |
| [00:26:06] | frodo_: | Two tuners... Does that mean two capture cards? |
| [00:26:11] | sphery: | wagnerrp's will fix the first issue |
| [00:26:16] | sphery: | and mine will fix th epip issue |
| [00:26:21] | sphery: | yeah, 2 capture cards |
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| [00:26:55] | frodo_: | Okay.. I'm launching backend now. |
| [00:28:32] | frodo_: | Scan channels on second capture card now... Looking good. |
| [00:28:51] | sphery: | you don't scan channels on each card |
| [00:29:03] | sphery: | you just connect the same video source you've already set up to the 2nd card |
| [00:29:15] | sphery: | since they're getting the video from the same source |
| [00:29:27] | frodo_: | Ah... that makes sense. |
| [00:31:28] | sphery: | make sure if you created another video source you delete it (hit D when it's selected in mythtv-setup) |
| [00:32:04] | frodo_: | Okay, I'm back in and both recordings show they will record no conflicts! |
| [00:32:15] | frodo_: | Totally awesome! Can't thank you enough! |
| [00:37:11] | sphery: | enjoy |
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| [01:34:03] | sphery: | wagnerrp: could this one be due to not scanning for HDHR tuners or whatever? [mythtv-users] Random missed recordings |
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| [01:43:18] | wagnerrp: | ugh |
| [01:43:29] | wagnerrp: | i spend 10 minutes typing up a big response |
| [01:43:43] | wagnerrp: | only to click back over to thunderbird to find you had written nearly the same response |
| [01:44:32] | sphery: | heh, sorry |
| [01:45:02] | sphery: | Since I can't answer faster than you on IRC, I have to focus on the list |
| [01:46:59] | sphery: | on the bright side, neither of us contradicted the other |
| [01:47:20] | wagnerrp: | well, you have to point out threads after you already responded... :) |
| [01:47:21] | sphery: | it's good to be on the same page... united front and all. |
| [01:48:08] | sphery: | heh, yeah, figured you |
| [01:48:12] | sphery: | d say something in here, first |
| [01:48:23] | sphery: | then I could have mentioned I sent a reply |
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| [03:35:36] | ** Beirdo installs cuda on his macbook ** | |
| [03:36:23] | wagnerrp: | dont you have an old G4? |
| [03:39:34] | Beirdo: | that's the powerbook |
| [03:39:43] | Beirdo: | this is a Macbook (Core2 Duo) |
| [03:40:07] | Beirdo: | the powerbook's sitting on the floor at home slowly compiling mythtv |
| [03:40:09] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [03:40:22] | wagnerrp: | wtf... freestyle canoe dancing |
| [03:42:08] | Beirdo: | heheh |
| [03:42:23] | Beirdo: | have beer and canoe... will invent stupid "sport" |
| [03:42:53] | ** wagnerrp abandons the daily show, and starts watching ninja warrior ** | |
| [03:44:52] | Beirdo: | sooo |
| [03:45:03] | Beirdo: | you ever heard of "perf top"? |
| [03:45:16] | wagnerrp: | perf top... |
| [03:45:26] | Beirdo: | yeah |
| [03:45:35] | Beirdo: | perf comes with recent kernels |
| [03:46:11] | wagnerrp: | ive heard of perfmon |
| [03:46:21] | Beirdo: | shows you what's using the kernel from the kernel's perspective |
| [03:46:42] | Beirdo: | or rahter, what's using hte CPU |
| [03:46:52] | Beirdo: | like a gprof type of thing |
| [03:47:29] | Beirdo: | rtl8169 is what... eth0 on my backend? |
| [03:47:47] | Beirdo: | guess that makes sense, I'm recording from the hdhomerun right now |
| [03:48:29] | Beirdo: | ff_find_start_code is using 1.8% of my CPU use |
| [03:49:32] | Beirdo: | the rtl8169 interrupt handler... 4.1% |
| [03:51:01] | Beirdo: | #1 thing... hpet_next_event |
| [03:51:15] | Beirdo: | at 20.7% of the CPU usage |
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| [04:02:18] | Beirdo: | OK, this is lame |
| [04:02:31] | Beirdo: | av_bswap32... 1.7% of cpu?! |
| [04:02:45] | Beirdo: | I think it's commflagging now |
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| [04:11:58] | wagnerrp: | so im watching this show called ninja warrior |
| [04:12:51] | wagnerrp: | its a japanese game show where you have to complete an obstacle course |
| [04:13:04] | Beirdo: | K |
| [04:13:22] | wagnerrp: | theyre making an american version of it, where a bunch of american contestants go over there and compete |
| [04:13:29] | kormoc: | Mt. Midoriyama! |
| [04:13:36] | wagnerrp: | and if one of them win, they get a $250K advertisement contract |
| [04:14:28] | kormoc: | %s/making/made/ ? |
| [04:14:42] | wagnerrp: | now granted, in the 13 years of operation, only three have completed |
| [04:14:44] | wagnerrp: | made |
| [04:14:56] | wagnerrp: | but these people arent competing against each other |
| [04:15:04] | wagnerrp: | theyre competing against the course |
| [04:15:11] | wagnerrp: | what happens if two succeed? |
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| [04:15:21] | Beirdo: | whoever does it faster? |
| [04:15:22] | kormoc: | they both win? |
| [04:15:37] | Beirdo: | or maybe they'll make em sumo |
| [04:16:07] | Beirdo: | Found 1 CUDA Capable device(s) |
| [04:16:07] | Beirdo: | Device 0: "GeForce 9400M" |
| [04:16:10] | Beirdo: | muhahaha |
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| [04:16:29] | Beirdo: | 16 CUDA cores |
| [04:17:32] | wagnerrp: | thats hardly worth the effort |
| [04:17:45] | Beirdo: | it's my macbook |
| [04:17:46] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [04:18:24] | wagnerrp: | yeah yeah, its for development, not use |
| [04:18:36] | Beirdo: | exactly |
| [04:19:05] | Beirdo: | and... my backend has 0 CUDA cores |
| [04:19:06] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [04:19:12] | Beirdo: | headless |
| [04:19:34] | wagnerrp: | yeah well... mine has negative, onboard AMD |
| [04:19:39] | wagnerrp: | :) |
| [04:19:47] | Beirdo: | heheh |
| [04:20:08] | Beirdo: | yeah, that would work with Cg, though, I bet |
| [04:20:33] | Beirdo: | not that I care to mess with Cg again |
| [04:20:48] | wagnerrp: | Cg is dead |
| [04:20:50] | wagnerrp: | OpenCL |
| [04:21:16] | wagnerrp: | so stage 2, they have to lift these three walls and run underneath them |
| [04:21:21] | wagnerrp: | the last one is 110lbs |
| [04:21:39] | wagnerrp: | im just waiting for someone to drop it too early and snap their ankle |
| [04:21:46] | Beirdo: | Cg is not completely dead. It's just a flesh wound. |
| [04:21:56] | Beirdo: | come back here, it will bite you |
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| [04:25:33] | wagnerrp: | oh, im watching reruns from last year |
| [04:27:33] | kormoc: | wagnerrp, there's padding on the bottom |
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| [09:24:35] | slacker-: | hey, what PCIe dual tuner do you recommend? |
| [09:24:40] | slacker-: | dvb-t |
| [09:25:03] | slacker-: | for the use with mythtv obviously.. |
| [09:26:22] | slacker-: | I've read that the dvico stuff has the best reception but I'm not sure how true that is. I've got a single dvico fusion card and reception isn't all that great when the tv connected to the RF out has great picture |
| [09:27:46] | beef-supreme (beef-supreme!~ali@95.76.74.76) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [09:27:47] | beef-supreme: | hello |
| [09:27:49] | beef-supreme: | anyone on? |
| [09:28:11] | beef-supreme: | i'm using windows (on a pc without internet) and i have a tv tuner in it |
| [09:28:34] | beef-supreme: | but the picture i get from the tv tuner is grayed out with red and blue stripes |
| [09:28:53] | beef-supreme: | is it a tv tuner problem or program problem? |
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| [13:15:04] | GWG: | I have another mythnetvision question |
| [13:15:26] | GWG: | If the newest versions move data updating to the backend, where are the grabber config files stored? |
| [13:23:20] | digitlman (digitlman!463e6fd2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.62.111.210) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [13:24:27] | digitlman: | acht...this 2250 is driving me nuts |
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| [13:25:00] | digitlman: | it was sorta wokring in 11.04 x86....but I wanted to start again with 11.04 x64...and I'm having issues |
| [13:25:17] | digitlman: | I have the firmware and drivers loaded for the 2250 |
| [13:26:10] | digitlman: | 02:00.0 Multimedia controller: Philips Semiconductors SAA7164 (rev 81) |
| [13:26:59] | digitlman: | but I stillg et format_to_mode() does not recognize V4L1 |
| [13:27:09] | digitlman: | not sure if that is normal |
| [13:27:47] | digitlman: | when watching tv, I get the front end crashing with VideoOutputXv Error: Could not find suitable XVideo surface |
| [13:31:03] | digitlman: | I am using the lastest xorg-intel video drive from intel (in stable anyway) |
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| [13:41:48] | digitlman: | anybody awake in here yet? |
| [13:43:49] | lyricnz: | nope |
| [13:43:54] | digitlman: | lol |
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| [13:56:17] | digitlman: | I was hoping wagnerrp or iamlindoro would be around |
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| [14:05:33] | lyricnz: | I last saw wagnerrp about 10 hours ago, but I've been on and off |
| [14:06:03] | digitlman: | well, I'll take helpl from anybody |
| [14:08:12] | digitlman: | related to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/mythbuntu/+bug/795416 |
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| [14:08:42] | digitlman: | on ubuntu 11.04 x64 |
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| [14:11:21] | hume: | I have a problem finding a specific channel, I'm in Sweden, using digital cable TV. Anyone about this? The channel is expåected to be in transport 46, but when searching, the backend says time out, no channels found |
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| [14:12:38] | digitlman: | I'm tempted to grab the latest from git and try and upgrade |
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| [14:31:50] | iamlindoro: | digitlman: Why would you need to grab latest git? Just update to the latest mythbuntu packages |
| [14:32:26] | iamlindoro: | ie, http://www.mythbuntu.org/auto-builds |
| [14:33:11] | digitlman: | thanks |
| [14:42:10] | digitlman: | I''m going to get this to work if it kills me |
| [14:44:09] | wagnerrp: | digitlman: are you building from source, or using packages? |
| [14:44:31] | digitlman: | packages |
| [14:44:46] | wagnerrp: | youre using the mythbuntu ppa? |
| [14:45:01] | digitlman: | now I am yes |
| [14:45:10] | digitlman: | updating as we speak |
| [14:45:44] | digitlman: | I've rebult this system 3 times ;-) |
| [14:46:29] | digitlman: | I'm very happy with the hardware, however |
| [15:01:06] | digitlman: | NVR(/dev/video0): Won't work with the streaming interface, falling back VIDIOCGCAP:: Invalid argumen |
| [15:01:08] | digitlman: | hrmm |
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| [15:01:22] | digitlman: | looks like I still have something messed up in the cap config? |
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| [15:02:33] | wagnerrp: | i presume that means its failing V4L2 methods, and fallingback to V4L1 methods |
| [15:02:42] | digitlman: | ahh ok |
| [15:02:50] | wagnerrp: | only neither the -2250 drivers, nor your kernel, supports V4L1 |
| [15:03:07] | digitlman: | wonderful |
| [15:03:50] | digitlman: | so, I need to wait for VL2 support in order to use ASTC? |
| [15:04:17] | wagnerrp: | V4L is analog, ATSC is digital |
| [15:04:31] | digitlman: | yes analog |
| [15:06:13] | digitlman: | it has the latest analog drive...so I take it that the kernel support dropped V4L1, and now I'm screwed? |
| [15:06:34] | wagnerrp: | no, that card and mythtv both support V4L2 just fine |
| [15:06:38] | wagnerrp: | not sure why it would be failing |
| [15:06:43] | digitlman: | ok |
| [15:07:06] | digitlman: | perhaps it is a setting I have missed? |
| [15:08:10] | digitlman: | I *had* this working the first time I built this...but that was with mythbuntu x86 |
| [15:09:54] | sphery: | if you're not on current 0.24-fixes, it could well cause problems |
| [15:10:08] | sphery: | as the patch they were using to build for 11.04 caused breakage |
| [15:10:19] | sphery: | so, again, check out: http://www.mythbuntu.org/repos |
| [15:10:34] | digitlman: | doing that now |
| [15:10:41] | iamlindoro: | wait, you didn't do that yet? |
| [15:10:49] | iamlindoro: | IT wasn't optional when I said it the first time :P |
| [15:10:58] | digitlman: | yep |
| [15:10:59] | digitlman: | lol |
| [15:11:11] | digitlman: | but I have a tendancy to screw things up ;-) |
| [15:11:40] | sphery: | this should unscrew things for you :) |
| [15:11:54] | sphery: | or would it screw things down? |
| [15:12:02] | digitlman: | lol |
| [15:12:04] | digitlman: | who kniows |
| [15:13:34] | wagnerrp: | why would one want to expire scheduled recordings before livetv ones? |
| [15:13:53] | digitlman: | yep, repos are in synaptic |
| [15:14:01] | digitlman: | and update mgtr says I am up to date |
| [15:14:07] | digitlman: | for ..24 |
| [15:14:42] | digitlman: | gonna reboot again |
| [15:15:41] | sphery: | wagnerrp: new patch? |
| [15:15:45] | sphery: | that's crazy |
| [15:16:02] | sphery: | definitely not something we should apply--just tell the user to change recgroup of live tv recordings they want to keep |
| [15:16:18] | sphery: | (and ignore the 2-min or less ones they got from surfing and other inefficiencies of live tv) |
| [15:16:43] | wagnerrp: | feature wish |
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| [15:16:51] | digitlman: | nope: NVR(/dev/video0): Won't work with the streaming interface, falling back VIDIOCGCAP:: Invalid argument |
| [15:17:55] | digitlman: | also seeing Xlib: extension "XFree86-VidModeExtension" missing on display ":1018.0". 2011-06–17 11:16:34.554 MythXGetRefreshRate(): X11 ModeLine query failed |
| [15:18:01] | digitlman: | on the frontend log |
| [15:18:11] | wagnerrp: | woo! i got called a troll! |
| [15:19:23] | digitlman: | I did update to kernel 2.6.39–0 generic......maybe that is the problem? |
| [15:19:43] | zmd is now known as dmz | |
| [15:19:51] | digitlman: | although I think it didn't work before I upgraded... |
| [15:19:58] | sphery: | wagnerrp: after replying to the feature wish? |
| [15:21:24] | wagnerrp: | user wanted to set mythtv to automatically choose the secondary mpeg2 audio track over the default ac3 one |
| [15:21:38] | wagnerrp: | when i questioned why, they claimed it was because it doesnt increase in volume during commercials |
| [15:22:04] | wagnerrp: | so i tell him to just skip them, and im labeled a troll |
| [15:22:12] | wagnerrp: | i think thats a perfectly valid argument |
| [15:25:56] | sphery: | heh |
| [15:26:16] | sphery: | definitely valid |
| [15:26:32] | sphery: | we have code that picks the best for a reason |
| [15:27:51] | sphery: | wagnerrp: what you need to tell the user is that he needs to fix audio decoding so that it incorporates the AC-3 volume normalization so it doesn't increase in volume on Fox when it switches from AC-3 (in show) to MP2 (in commercials) |
| [15:28:09] | sphery: | (and that may actually require a fix in ffmpeg/libav/whatever we end up using) |
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| [15:30:18] | wagnerrp: | the audio format switches? |
| [15:30:27] | sphery: | yep |
| [15:31:04] | sphery: | the actual AC-3 name is dialnorm (for "dialogue normalization") |
| [15:31:13] | sphery: | that's the one we completely ignore |
| [15:31:21] | sphery: | as mentioned by danielk in #mythtv |
| [15:32:24] | wagnerrp: | thats a property in the stream? |
| [15:33:47] | sphery: | yep |
| [15:34:05] | sphery: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialnorm |
| [15:34:29] | wagnerrp: | yeah, looking at it currently |
| [15:34:59] | sphery: | no clue whether fflab actually uses it |
| [15:35:14] | sphery: | er, fflav |
| [15:35:23] | ** sphery tries a new name for ffmpeg/libav ** | |
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| [15:42:13] | digitlman: | should I upgrade to .25 dev repos? |
| [15:43:11] | wagnerrp: | no |
| [15:43:31] | digitlman: | I didnt think so |
| [15:43:45] | digitlman: | that's *really* asking for trouble |
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| [15:48:32] | wagnerrp: | sphery: do you know if alternate languages in broadcasts are labeled as such? |
| [15:49:13] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yes, they should be--that's how we choose the appropriate stream |
| [15:49:30] | wagnerrp: | based off what setting? |
| [15:49:41] | wagnerrp: | locale? |
| [15:51:06] | sphery: | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/479513#479513 |
| [15:51:24] | sphery: | that guy was getting descriptive audio because the broadcaster properlylabelled it, but didn't label the AC-3 5.1ch |
| [15:51:57] | sphery: | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/479698#479698 mentiones how we choose stream |
| [15:51:59] | wagnerrp: | right, but what setting tells it to use the English track? |
| [15:52:05] | sphery: | doesn't say which particular setting it is |
| [15:52:16] | sphery: | but I think it's the same one configured for EIT stuff |
| [15:52:30] | sphery: | I have a feeling iamlindoro knows which |
| [15:52:54] | iamlindoro: | Guide data language prefs |
| [15:52:57] | iamlindoro: | there are two of them |
| [15:53:05] | iamlindoro: | In general settings in the FE |
| [15:53:18] | iamlindoro: | There's actually a couple of settings |
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| [15:53:33] | iamlindoro: | I think it starts with FE language, then falls back to the guide language prefs |
| [15:53:38] | sphery: | so, "Guide language #%1" = ISO639Language%1 |
| [15:53:58] | sphery: | // We should try to get language from "MythLanguage" |
| [15:53:58] | sphery: | // then use code 2 to code 3 map in iso639.h |
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| [15:57:44] | wagnerrp: | we dont have any sort of setting for descriptive audio do we? |
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| [15:58:44] | sphery: | as in "prefer descriptive audio"? |
| [15:58:45] | sphery: | no |
| [15:58:58] | sphery: | I have a patch that removes the "always start with captions" setting |
| [15:59:05] | sphery: | and instead just remembers what you selected |
| [15:59:17] | sphery: | we should do audio the same way if we want to allow users to select descriptive first |
| [15:59:33] | sphery: | (i.e. you enable captions, they're on until you disable them) |
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| [16:10:57] | digitlman: | can somebody look at http://pastebin.com/V4wEkfbD |
| [16:11:13] | digitlman: | I'm stumped |
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| [16:15:19] | Scopeuk: | digitlman, wheres that log from? |
| [16:15:24] | digitlman: | backend |
| [16:15:31] | Scopeuk: | is this a remote host? |
| [16:16:09] | digitlman: | no, front/back combo |
| [16:16:14] | Scopeuk: | ok |
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| [16:18:08] | Scopeuk: | all the errors seam to be the scheduler but i cant get you too much further, maybe turn on verbose logging? |
| [16:18:27] | digitlman: | I thought it was on...it's on all messages |
| [16:18:31] | Scopeuk: | ok |
| [16:18:38] | Scopeuk: | in which case we're beyond my abilities |
| [16:20:41] | digitlman: | shoot |
| [16:21:04] | Scopeuk: | all i could possibly say is if it is otherwise working ust ignore it |
| [16:21:12] | digitlman: | it's not |
| [16:21:19] | digitlman: | can't watch or record tv |
| [16:21:31] | Scopeuk: | ahh ok then thats a problem |
| [16:21:34] | digitlman: | yep |
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| [16:21:45] | digitlman: | maybe I should go back and re-install mythbuntu 32 bit |
| [16:21:46] | Scopeuk: | have you checked all the permissions? |
| [16:21:51] | digitlman: | I think so |
| [16:21:59] | digitlman: | any specifics? |
| [16:22:04] | Scopeuk: | in principal can the backend write to the recordings directory |
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| [16:23:00] | digitlman: | I'll look again |
| [16:24:07] | iamlindoro: | Did you set up the card in Myth as a v4l card instead of as an MPEG-2 encoder? because it somewhat looks like that |
| [16:24:08] | sphery: | seems like it's the V4L1 issue |
| [16:24:19] | sphery: | yeah, that would explain it |
| [16:24:28] | digitlman: | yeah, it's a VL4 |
| [16:24:30] | sphery: | "Delete all capture cards" |
| [16:24:37] | iamlindoro: | It's not, though |
| [16:24:41] | iamlindoro: | it's an MPEG-2 encoder |
| [16:24:46] | iamlindoro: | so you've set it up as the wrong type |
| [16:24:56] | sphery: | then re-configure it as a "IVTV MPEG-2 encoder card" |
| [16:24:59] | digitlman: | I'll delete all and start again |
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| [16:26:57] | sphery: | you likely set it up as a v4l card because you were using a broken mythtv from before we supported 2.6.38+ systems and it didn't offer you the IVTV MPEG-2 encoder card option |
| [16:27:09] | digitlman: | yes |
| [16:27:14] | digitlman: | thats why I was conffused |
| [16:27:20] | sphery: | so, do you have another system, "mal"? |
| [16:27:36] | sphery: | and shouldn't mal be the master backend? |
| [16:27:56] | sphery: | even though jane always thinks it should be the master |
| [16:28:15] | sphery: | er, jayne |
| [16:28:20] | digitlman: | no |
| [16:28:26] | digitlman: | kaylee was the best |
| [16:28:38] | iamlindoro: | Well that's one thing you've got right, at least |
| [16:28:42] | wagnerrp: | yes, but jayne has a tendency to go crazy and then fall asleep |
| [16:28:43] | sphery: | yeah |
| [16:28:43] | ** digitlman sings "A Man Called Jayne" ** | |
| [16:29:30] | wagnerrp: | not something you would want to leave in charge of your mythtv system |
| [16:30:49] | digitlman: | come back and it is sold to the highest bidder...no thanks |
| [16:32:20] | digitlman: | I have video! |
| [16:32:22] | digitlman: | yay! |
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| [16:33:26] | digitlman: | thanks for all the help |
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| [17:21:40] | Muzer: | I don't suppose there are any (unofficial, naturally) plugins in existence or development that use get_iplayer? |
| [17:22:35] | Muzer: | MythVodka is reported as not working any more on the Wiki, I assume this is accurate |
| [17:23:46] | Muzer: | found mythgiplayer, does this still work? Last activity in '09 |
| [17:27:11] | wagnerrp: | http://mythtv.org/wiki/Bbciplayer.py |
| [17:27:37] | Muzer: | oh, thanks |
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| [17:27:44] | Muzer: | I'll have a look |
| [17:27:59] | Muzer: | (mythgiplayer's google code project is actually completely empty :P) |
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| [17:31:14] | Muzer: | wagnerrp: oh, right, that's just the thing in mythnetvision, which isn't brilliant for two reasons (it's flash, and the search has been broken for a while) |
| [17:31:37] | Muzer: | and it's frustrating editing XML files to watch a programme without search :P |
| [17:31:53] | Muzer: | oh, and last time I checked, actually watching programmes was broken too :P |
| [17:32:09] | wagnerrp: | look into fixing it? |
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| [17:32:54] | Muzer: | It'd be better for most people just to have a plugin (unofficial if there are legal issues) that uses get_iplayer... |
| [17:33:09] | wagnerrp: | its probably flash because there is nothing in the BBC terms of use that allows downloading of content outside of iplayer |
| [17:33:26] | Muzer: | hence unofficial plugin :p |
| [17:33:31] | wagnerrp: | if there are legal issues, then we dont support its development, and dont allow it on the wiki |
| [17:33:56] | Muzer: | MythVodka's on there, which used to use get_iplayer, which downloads the things directly rather than being flash... |
| [17:34:44] | wagnerrp: | is also never worked on any released version of mythtv |
| [17:34:49] | wagnerrp: | and... could stand to be removed |
| [17:34:53] | sphery: | why do people assume that FOSS projects are all about the wink, wink, nudge, nudge? |
| [17:35:25] | ** wagnerrp winks at sphery ** | |
| [17:35:34] | ** mag0o nudges wagnerrp ** | |
| [17:35:34] | ** sphery blushes ** | |
| [17:35:46] | sphery: | oh, wait, did I misinterpret? |
| [17:35:48] | Muzer: | I'm not :p |
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| [17:36:05] | Muzer: | Less using get_iplayer for piracy, more because flash sucks :P |
| [17:36:40] | wagnerrp: | sucks or not, if the BBC terms of use doesnt have wording that allows for download, we cant do it |
| [17:36:42] | Muzer: | hell, have it enforce iPlayer rules (delete recordings after 7 days, or don't allow recordings at all) if necessary :p |
| [17:37:29] | Muzer: | well |
| [17:37:47] | sphery: | we will obey the terms of service when we use any service |
| [17:37:54] | sphery: | that is part of our project philosophy |
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| [17:38:16] | sphery: | those who want to abuse services and ignore their terms are free to do so in their own projects, but can't discuss it here :) |
| [17:38:19] | Muzer: | I may have a look at MythVodka and see if I can't get it to work with the latest version... |
| [17:38:19] | Muzer: | or would it be easier just writing a python script for mythnetvision from scratch? |
| [17:38:44] | Muzer: | is it possible to add a plugin for mythnetvision without recompiling the whole thing? |
| [17:39:06] | wagnerrp: | mythnetvision is a plugin, it doesnt take plugins |
| [17:41:57] | Muzer: | OK, I've no idea what happened there :p |
| [17:42:07] | Muzer: | my xchat just spawned a load of empty windows for no apparent reason.. |
| [17:42:26] | Muzer: | sorry |
| [17:42:28] | Muzer: | anyway |
| [17:43:28] | Muzer: | as I was saying, it looked to me like some/maybe all of the "sources" for Mythnetvision are defined in python scripts... I assume then that it's hardcoded to use these, so they can't be used as plugins... |
| [17:43:53] | iamlindoro: | Incorrect, they are discovered |
| [17:44:04] | iamlindoro: | Write a grabber that follows the guidelines, put it in the right spot, and you are done |
| [17:44:19] | iamlindoro: | http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythNetvision_Grabber_Script_Format |
| [17:44:22] | Muzer: | and how strict are the Mythnetvision guidelines? Is it ONLY web stuff or does it allow video to be piped into it as well? |
| [17:44:27] | wagnerrp: | http://mythtv.org/wiki/MythNetvision_Grabber_Script_Format |
| [17:44:35] | Muzer: | I'll have a look |
| [17:45:24] | Muzer: | (and in the mean time, my MythTV seems to be slightly messed up for some reason... it won't load the recordings screen (spends a while loading then comes up with "No recordings available, or screen loading..." or the upcoming recordings) |
| [17:45:36] | iamlindoro: | corrupted database data |
| [17:45:53] | Muzer: | how would I go about rebuilding it? |
| [17:45:58] | Muzer: | or whatever... |
| [17:46:03] | Muzer: | or am I pretty much screwed? :p |
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| [17:46:25] | iamlindoro: | Most common corruption seems to be some bookmark field, sphery knows all about it |
| [17:46:27] | Muzer: | I'll just try restarting the backend... |
| [17:46:35] | iamlindoro: | That is unlikely to do anything |
| [17:47:02] | iamlindoro: | well, unless this problem just appeared this moment, in which case it's worth a try |
| [17:47:14] | Muzer: | ah, it did fix it :) |
| [17:49:01] | Muzer: | oh, another weird thing... you now the programme thumbails generated from the video? For some reason, The Simpsons on Channel 4 always ends up with thumbnails with a horrible pixellated mess (sometimes literally about 54 large pixels dotted about a black square) – I've not noticed it with any other Channel 4 programmes. |
| [17:49:06] | Muzer: | *5, not 54 :P |
| [17:49:25] | Muzer: | any particular reason why that would happen? |
| [17:50:23] | Muzer: | I'm not really bothered as the thumbnails are usually pretty useless to me anyway (how are you supposed to see what a programme is from a randomly-chosen frame?), but I'm just wondering if anyone's interested... |
| [17:52:40] | sphery: | Muzer: first, make sure you don't have a filter set (to only show live tv or something you no longer have): http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Frequently_Asked_Q . . . ecordings.3F |
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| [17:53:12] | sphery: | wait, which did it? |
| [17:53:16] | sphery: | how did you fix the issue? |
| [17:53:47] | sphery: | ah, restarting backend fixed it |
| [17:53:52] | Muzer: | sphery: nah, fixed by rebooting backend :P |
| [17:53:52] | Muzer: | (well, I restarted the database server as well just in case) |
| [17:54:15] | sphery: | maybe doing that ran a script that checked and repaired db tables? |
| [17:54:21] | sphery: | who knows... glad it's working, though |
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| [18:01:40] | hume_: | hi all... anyone around? I'm having a problem changing channels, since doing a new channel search a few days ago, ubuntu 11.04 system |
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| [18:02:43] | hume_: | I can switch between most channels, but a few consistently return "Error: channel change failed". Anyone recognize this? |
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| [18:05:17] | sphery: | hume_: we'd need much more logging (backend, likely, possibly frontend) on a pastebin to even guess |
| [18:05:27] | sphery: | but I will mention that live tv channel changing is kind of a mess right now |
| [18:05:40] | hume_: | ok... paste is coming |
| [18:05:40] | sphery: | especially when you have multiple video sources and/or multiple different card types |
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| [18:10:42] | hume_: | paste is on http://pastebin.com/uXwRy85z, from both back and frontend |
| [18:11:06] | hume_: | I have one card, channels on a few transports |
| [18:12:48] | hume_: | only one source |
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| [18:17:05] | sphery: | signal monitor errors indicate that your channel change is failing at the device level--at least lower level than mythtv |
| [18:17:08] | sphery: | so not much we can do |
| [18:17:18] | sphery: | you'll have to fix your channel changing itself |
| [18:17:28] | sphery: | if it's dvb, you likely need to increase timeouts |
| [18:18:05] | sphery: | if it's analog, you likely need to verify your channel change script exits with an appropriate exit status (0) and/or fix timeouts |
| [18:18:09] | sphery: | timeouts are in mythtv-setup configuration |
| [18:19:39] | hume_: | ok... it's dvb so I try with time-outs. stange thing is that it worked fine until I re-scanned channels a few days ago.. how can that affect this? |
| [18:21:16] | hume_ is now known as hume | |
| [18:23:36] | Muzer: | judging by the options available in the documentation of MythNetvision grabbers, it's not possible to get one to pipe video directly to MythTV or something along those lines... it has to either be via a web page, or in an external video player, am I correct? |
| [18:24:54] | hume: | sphery, I found a thread in the mail archive about something slightly similar, and one question there was about permissions on the adapter. Mine is root:video crw-rw---- is that correct? |
| [18:25:28] | kormoc: | hume, is the mythbackend user in the video group or the root user? |
| [18:25:59] | Muzer: | Doesn't Ubuntu run it as root by default? |
| [18:26:06] | sphery: | think it uses mythtv |
| [18:26:13] | Muzer: | ah, yes, I remember now |
| [18:26:14] | hume: | there is a user mythtv, who is in the video group |
| [18:26:17] | sphery: | groups mythtv |
| [18:26:28] | sphery: | then it should be right |
| [18:27:11] | hume: | ok...I've increased the time-out in the window for capture cards, mythtv-setup, to 3000 ms, still same error.. |
| [18:27:50] | sphery: | not sure what it is, then |
| [18:28:19] | hume: | thing is, three of the four failing channels are not even encrypted |
| [18:28:39] | hume: | could it be somthing related to multiplex...? (I'm just guessing....) |
| [18:29:55] | wagnerrp: | !seen jya |
| [18:29:55] | MythLogBot: | jya is here and has been idle for 7 hours 42 minutes 57 seconds |
| [18:30:03] | wagnerrp: | jya: you around? |
| [18:30:32] | Muzer: | hume: if they're all on the same mux, the ones that fail, there could be a local source of interference or something similar that's preventing them from being received... |
| [18:31:53] | Muzer: | or would that cause a different error? I don't really know much about how tuner cards are handled |
| [18:31:54] | hume: | Muzer, ok... what could that source be? I can receive them with a digital box, just tried it. so the signal seems to be there |
| [18:32:27] | sphery: | or maybe a bad scan of that transport? |
| [18:32:58] | hume: | sphery, i can try to re-scan it, just that one transport, maybe...? |
| [18:33:04] | sphery: | I'd start there |
| [18:33:44] | wagnerrp: | jya: when you get in, curious whether playing 5.1 content in stereo will truncate the extra channels, or downmix them into the front channels |
| [18:46:59] | Muzer: | wagnerrp: so, for now, since MythNetvision doesn't seem to be able to stream video directly from an alternative backend, I'll work on trying to fix the current Flash-using iPlayer grabber first |
| [18:47:12] | Muzer: | then I'll have a look at what it'll take for me to write a get_iplayer plugin |
| [18:47:20] | sphery: | I really want to ask stuartm, "fax clients--like that require analog phone modems? or some of these 'net fax things?" but probably shouldn't get a big OT conversation going in the other channel |
| [18:47:28] | Muzer: | (by backend there I don't mean MythTV backend, I mean some random program) |
| [18:48:03] | sphery: | ideally, you'd just use the mythnetvision grabber you fixed and follow the terms of the service you're actually using |
| [18:48:14] | hume: | sphery, yes. re-scanning makes a difference. but apparently not all of them were on the same mux... still one to find |
| [18:48:35] | Muzer: | sphery: ah, but the computer I'm running on can't handle Flash too well... well, it handles Youtube fine but not iPlayer for some odd reason |
| [18:48:39] | Muzer: | so I can't really do that |
| [18:48:49] | wagnerrp: | what CPU? |
| [18:49:01] | Muzer: | some form of 3GHz Pentium 4 (not sure which one exactly) |
| [18:49:16] | Muzer: | it's not too new a computer, but I can't complain as I got it for free ;P |
| [18:49:20] | sphery: | hume: progress, at least |
| [18:50:10] | Muzer: | yeah, I've never had much luck with rescanning... I assume it's just my card being awful (it's one that came free with the PC, which usually spells trouble, but this one works very well aside from scanning with MythTV :P) |
| [18:50:14] | sphery: | Muzer: so tell BBC about this problem, and ask them to fix their broken service that relies on a PoS technology from Adobe that pretty much requires users to run Windows or Mac OS X |
| [18:50:27] | sphery: | i.e. /affect/ change to make the world a better place |
| [18:50:39] | sphery: | rather than lurking in the shadows doing things you're told not to |
| [18:50:58] | Muzer: | believe me, I've already sent plenty of complaints about that :p |
| [18:51:10] | sphery: | I do understand your frustration with Flash, though |
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| [18:51:24] | Muzer: | the only change that seems to be possible is (Silverlight or proprietary WMP DRM) to Flash |
| [18:51:26] | sphery: | I hate it with a passion--but I just vote by not using the services that rely on it |
| [18:51:33] | Muzer: | the that's cross-platform enough ;p |
| [18:51:37] | Muzer: | *then |
| [18:51:39] | Muzer: | for the companies |
| [18:51:54] | sphery: | yeah, the DRM is definitely the problem, here |
| [18:52:00] | sphery: | and is why HTML5 isn't going to help |
| [18:52:24] | Muzer: | yeah, unfortunately |
| [18:52:53] | sphery: | after all, if they can pipe a JS program to the browser and do auth in there, anyone can copy it and reuse it elsewhere, so you need to control the video |
| [18:53:12] | Muzer: | yeah |
| [18:53:22] | sphery: | of course, there are lots of scripts that illegally copy the flash stream from various sites, so why they're even trying is beyond me |
| [18:53:48] | Muzer: | well, ITV, C4 and C5 are either getting it right or nobody cares enough about them :p |
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| [18:54:33] | Muzer: | actually, and this is an honest question: what can the BBC do in this country if you're using something like get_iplayer which presumably violates their ToS (I haven't checked them myself) – legally-speaking – apart from denying you access to their service? I mean, you never have to sign anything (even virtually) that states you agree to their TOS, do you? |
| [18:55:28] | Muzer: | anyway, I'm going to try to fix this now |
| [18:55:30] | iamlindoro: | Not agreeing to Terms of Service does not entitle you to violate them |
| [18:55:46] | iamlindoro: | It entitles you not to choose not to use the service |
| [18:56:07] | Muzer: | it seems to be embedding HTML into the XML, which can't be good, probably means the parser is broken :p |
| [18:57:13] | Muzer: | huh, I'm confused... some of the things that DO look like valid XML aren't actually in the Grabber Script Format page |
| [18:57:17] | Muzer: | has it changed radically or something? |
| [18:57:27] | sphery: | heh, "Microsoft claims WebGL makes consumer PCs DDoS targets" I've been saying the same thing about client-side JavaScript for years (of course, JS only DoS'es my firefox, whereas with WebGL, you could DoS the entire display--so, effectively the entire computer based on having an unusable UI) |
| [18:57:30] | iamlindoro: | No, the grabber format has not changed |
| [18:58:02] | Muzer: | well, what are tags like <results> and <result> and <pageInfo> and <type> doing? |
| [18:58:12] | Muzer: | actually, type is correct |
| [18:58:21] | Muzer: | well, maybe |
| [18:58:37] | Muzer: | oh, sorry, I may be being an idiot :P |
| [18:58:44] | Muzer: | that's not the output, that's what it's processing, duh :p |
| [18:59:36] | Muzer: | hmm |
| [18:59:54] | Muzer: | it seems to be converting it into some kind of intermediate XML format which it then turns into the final one... how incredibly odd... |
| [19:00:12] | iamlindoro: | It's not odd at all |
| [19:00:16] | iamlindoro: | google XSLT |
| [19:01:24] | iamlindoro: | The author of those scripts built a framework to produce working grabbers from disparate sources, XSL Transforms were an elegant and clever solution |
| [19:01:53] | Muzer: | ah, I see |
| [19:01:55] | iamlindoro: | It would probably be best to spend a few days learning how it works before being opinionated in the channel about how it all fits together |
| [19:02:00] | Muzer: | has he documented the format he uses anywhere? |
| [19:02:20] | iamlindoro: | Read the lib code, it's all extensively commented |
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| [19:10:25] | Muzer: | ah, that's why actual playing is broken! Because it uses some HTML file stored offline to embed the flash, the flashvars for which have obviously changed oslt... |
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| [19:12:31] | wagnerrp: | what kind of recording is 49GB? |
| [19:13:22] | Muzer: | a 7-and-a-half-hour 15Mbit/s HD one? :p |
| [19:13:39] | wagnerrp: | something like that |
| [19:13:44] | wagnerrp: | but what is ~8hrs long? |
| [19:14:02] | wagnerrp: | sporting events are usually 4hrs at most |
| [19:14:13] | sphery: | isn't F1 like 16hrs? |
| [19:14:20] | iamlindoro: | Indy 500? |
| [19:14:26] | Muzer: | wow |
| [19:14:36] | Muzer: | yeah, OK, changing it to a mode that actually uses the internet makes that work :p |
| [19:14:48] | sphery: | I remember some users overseas talking about that one causing them to lose all their recordings to autoexpire when they watched it in live tv |
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| [19:15:06] | sphery: | (because they needed space for the single 16hr show they were watching) |
| [19:15:10] | Muzer: | so now I have tree view working temporarily... probably best to fix that offline HTML file, though, or just get rid of it altogether... |
| [19:15:15] | wagnerrp: | the indy500 is only like 3hrs isnt it? |
| [19:15:28] | wagnerrp: | maybe 2 |
| [19:15:35] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: Getting rid of it isn't acceptable, it's there to allow for fullscreen playback |
| [19:15:38] | sphery: | wagnerrp: plus about 8 hours of pre-race and 2 of post-race :) |
| [19:15:47] | wagnerrp: | the whole event is 6–8 hours, but usually those are broken up into separate 'shows' |
| [19:15:47] | iamlindoro: | (although obviously you're free to do what you want for yourself) |
| [19:15:50] | sphery: | (though with SD, those should be listed as different programs) |
| [19:15:56] | Muzer: | iamlindoro: well, the bigscreen one or whatever it's called goes into fullscreen as soon as the video starts playing |
| [19:16:08] | Muzer: | yeah |
| [19:16:17] | Muzer: | it has an ugly interface before you click on the video |
| [19:16:27] | sphery: | Muzer: which, FWIW, is almost definitely why your P4 can't handle playback |
| [19:16:37] | Muzer: | but AFAIK the web-based one doesn't immediately start playing either (perhaps it was supposed to?) |
| [19:16:38] | sphery: | so if you disable fullscreening on your local copy, you can watch it |
| [19:16:48] | sphery: | as nvidia would say, TWIMTBW |
| [19:16:49] | Muzer: | sphery: nah, it fails in window mode too |
| [19:16:58] | sphery: | (The Way It's Meant To Be Watched) |
| [19:17:06] | Muzer: | heh |
| [19:17:15] | sphery: | so it's not the inefficient scaling in flash causing CPU usage issues |
| [19:17:19] | sphery: | you're sure this is a 3GHz P4? |
| [19:17:23] | Muzer: | yeah |
| [19:17:31] | sphery: | it should be able to decode any web-sized flash in real time |
| [19:17:36] | Muzer: | pretty sure it doesn't work in windowed mode :p |
| [19:17:39] | Muzer: | you've made me unsure now :P |
| [19:17:42] | sphery: | it just can't scale it beyond pixel-for-pixel |
| [19:18:06] | sphery: | it's quite possible that there's still scaling with the not-full screen, too |
| [19:18:15] | sphery: | so I'm saying modify your local copy to not do any scaling |
| [19:18:15] | Muzer: | oh yeah |
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| [19:18:23] | Muzer: | sphery: yeah, I'll give it a try |
| [19:18:25] | sphery: | (i.e. like you would see on the web page in Firefox) |
| [19:18:37] | Muzer: | that's what I mean, it fails in a web page with firefox :P |
| [19:18:40] | sphery: | or in MythBrowser directly (with 1.0 zoom) |
| [19:18:41] | Muzer: | or opera, or mythweb |
| [19:18:44] | Muzer: | *mythbrowser |
| [19:18:49] | sphery: | hmmm |
| [19:18:54] | Muzer: | I think it does, anyway |
| [19:18:59] | Muzer: | just going to double check, you've made me unsure :p |
| [19:19:12] | sphery: | maybe they have a high-enough-bitrate H.264 that it's still too much for your proc |
| [19:19:33] | Muzer: | works when get_iplayer'd in mplayer/myth |
| [19:19:33] | sphery: | on the bright side, at least you don't have an atom :) |
| [19:19:44] | Muzer: | but yeah, minor issue: the volume control doesn't seem to work when using the web, including in mythnetvision |
| [19:19:46] | sphery: | if so, then it's almost definitely the scaling |
| [19:20:00] | sphery: | as colorspace conversion isn't much of a strain |
| [19:20:02] | Muzer: | sphery: my atom on my netbook can handle fullscreen iplayer with flash :p |
| [19:20:13] | sphery: | so all there is is decoding + colorspace conversion |
| [19:20:20] | sphery: | atom on netbook with Windows, right? |
| [19:20:25] | Muzer: | nope |
| [19:20:26] | Muzer: | Linux |
| [19:20:28] | Muzer: | I'm typing on it now |
| [19:20:43] | sphery: | well, the P4 3GHz should be way more powerful than an Atom |
| [19:20:50] | sphery: | so I'm thinking something else is happening here |
| [19:20:58] | Muzer: | oh, wow |
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| [19:21:06] | wagnerrp: | well... on single threaded applications anyway |
| [19:21:11] | Beirdo: | you need to pour beer down yer throat |
| [19:21:20] | Muzer: | a flash-based dialogue just faded out VERY slowly :p |
| [19:21:29] | Muzer: | yep, it's doing it in non-fullscreen too |
| [19:21:30] | wagnerrp: | the dual core atoms should win in multithreaded tasks |
| [19:21:48] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [19:21:52] | sphery: | some web-based UI designers should be sent to mandatory remedial training |
| [19:22:02] | Beirdo: | OMG, wagnerrp admitted Atoms are *ok* at something :) |
| [19:22:10] | wagnerrp: | hey, only the dual core atoms |
| [19:22:15] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [19:22:21] | Beirdo: | like the one in my firewall |
| [19:22:30] | Beirdo: | it gets wasted, really |
| [19:22:30] | wagnerrp: | and i only said in some cases theyre better than another abortive and since abandoned intel architecture |
| [19:22:35] | Beirdo: | heheh |
| [19:22:41] | sphery: | heh, yeah, that's a critical qualifier :) |
| [19:22:51] | sphery: | especially since P4 was worse than P3 |
| [19:22:55] | Muzer: | this one's single-core :P |
| [19:22:58] | sphery: | (and Atom is more like P3 than P4) |
| [19:23:16] | sphery: | I will admit that Atom is more power efficient than P4, too |
| [19:23:27] | Beirdo: | yup |
| [19:23:29] | sphery: | but not more power efficient than modern processors Core i/Athlon II |
| [19:23:36] | Muzer: | hmm |
| [19:23:37] | Muzer: | that's interesting |
| [19:23:48] | Muzer: | in mythbrowser, when the jerkiness is happening, a small amount of orange appears in the weird bar at the bottom |
| [19:23:54] | Muzer: | (the loading bar I think) |
| [19:24:02] | sphery: | so maybe it's the compositing |
| [19:24:11] | Muzer: | as soon as the orange stops, so does the jerkiness |
| [19:24:12] | sphery: | it's drawing additional controls and garbage on top of the video |
| [19:24:18] | sphery: | yeah, that makes sense... |
| [19:24:44] | sphery: | so seems you're right on the edge of being able to play it |
| [19:24:49] | Muzer: | yeah, it IS definitely worse in fullscreen, you are right |
| [19:24:51] | Muzer: | it does happen in window though |
| [19:24:59] | Muzer: | just not as frequently |
| [19:25:08] | sphery: | enough so that any other "distraction", like compositing those controls (or scaling), will prevent smooth playback |
| [19:25:11] | wagnerrp: | danjohn, you mad fool... |
| [19:26:00] | ** Muzer tries iPlayer on his netbook in fullscreen again to check it hasn't changed since last time he looked ** | |
| [19:26:15] | Muzer: | doesn't help that it's one of those ones with the INCREDIBLY slow 16GiB SSDs... |
| [19:26:45] | wagnerrp: | why would your SSD make any difference to flash streaming? |
| [19:27:25] | Muzer: | no, just loading the page in the first place :P |
| [19:27:27] | sphery: | does flash buffer to file? |
| [19:27:32] | Muzer: | I think it does that, too |
| [19:27:45] | wagnerrp: | sphery: in regards to that autoexpire thing |
| [19:27:47] | Muzer: | oh, god, what the hell is wrong with this? I SWEAR this played smoothly last time I used iPlayer on my netbook a few months ago |
| [19:27:59] | Muzer: | in fact, I remember using it connected to my TV and it working fine |
| [19:28:00] | sphery: | wagnerrp: sounds like it was the problem you and Beirdo fixed, right? |
| [19:28:00] | wagnerrp: | i DID break autoexpire weeks back with the FileSystemInfo stuff |
| [19:28:06] | wagnerrp: | and beirdo fixed it shortly after |
| [19:28:08] | sphery: | yeah |
| [19:28:21] | Muzer: | it's HORRIBLE now, even worse than on the MythTV box! |
| [19:28:23] | Beirdo: | well, we kinda fixed it together, you put some code back, IIRC too |
| [19:28:24] | sphery: | which is why I clarified that he'd have to update /and/ make room |
| [19:28:57] | wagnerrp: | thats right, it was that chunk of code i mistakenly deleted |
| [19:29:08] | Muzer: | hmm... what could have changed... |
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| [19:29:58] | sphery: | Muzer: heh, sounds like BBC changed the format/encoding of the stream they're sending :) |
| [19:30:12] | Muzer: | quite possibly :P |
| [19:30:15] | sphery: | probably around the same time they changed the JavaScript API for it |
| [19:30:19] | Muzer: | yeah... |
| [19:30:20] | sphery: | i.e. update site and update video |
| [19:30:29] | sphery: | it's "progress" |
| [19:30:34] | Muzer: | damn, that was a wasted opportunity to check the embed used for the video... |
| [19:30:46] | sphery: | and meant to leave all those users who don't have modern Windows/Mac OS X based systems in the dust :) |
| [19:31:09] | Muzer: | hmm... I think this calls for another complaint :P |
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| [19:33:29] | sphery: | Muzer: out of curiosity, do they have an iphone/ipad app? |
| [19:33:38] | Muzer: | sphery: I believe so |
| [19:33:46] | Muzer: | they also have an MHEG5-based Freesat application |
| [19:34:00] | Muzer: | I've been thinking of using wireshark to find out how it works... |
| [19:34:02] | sphery: | heh, so they have compiled-in auth/protection on that (since it can't do flash), I presume |
| [19:34:16] | Muzer: | is encryption possible with the MHEG5 standards? |
| [19:34:25] | sphery: | I don't know mheg at all |
| [19:34:26] | Muzer: | I'll find out later, anyway :p |
| [19:34:47] | sphery: | still, the best solution is to get you and your 1M closest friends to complain to BBC and get them to open things up |
| [19:35:04] | sphery: | which is difficult for them to do, I realize, because of content owners requirements |
| [19:35:30] | sphery: | of course, we live in a world where someone can sell a patent collection for $900M dollars |
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| [19:35:40] | Muzer: | MHEG5 is used in this country for digital terrestrial and one of the two competing digital satellite companies, I think both now have iPlayer applications but I'm most familiar with the Freesat one (I think the specs used are different, I don't have anything that supports the terrestrial one) |
| [19:36:05] | Muzer: | ouch... this JS stuff is nasty |
| [19:36:05] | sphery: | when patents were meant to provide an incentive for innovation to inventors--not to provide a way for companies to make money by selling patents and suing others |
| [19:36:16] | Muzer: | I have a funny feeling the iplayer website might replace an image with an embedded flash object |
| [19:36:24] | Muzer: | using JS |
| [19:36:38] | Muzer: | I wonder if Opera Dragonfly allows you to see the final post-JS page? |
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| [19:38:23] | Muzer: | ah, yes, it does |
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| [19:41:00] | hume: | sphery, thanks for your help, now almost everything is in place...:) |
| [19:41:15] | sphery: | hume: good to hear--enjoy |
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| [19:41:46] | sphery: | sometimes even a blind pig finds a truffle... (meaning I did more guessing than knowing) |
| [19:42:37] | eddytv: | Was wondering if somebody could answer a question about Storage Groups and NFS mounts, specifically related to MythVideo. I have a combined BE/FE, and several (diskless) FE's. Most storage is local on the BE, defined in a SG. |
| [19:43:21] | eddytv: | But I have some videos that are on a NAS, that is exported via NFS. I'd like to mount that NFS filesystem on the BE's and FE's, and have the videos indexed by the BE... |
| [19:44:11] | eddytv: | I'd like to have the FE's get those videos on the NAS directly via the NFS share, rather than being streamed via MythProtocol from the BE, since that would entail transferring it over the wire twice — once from the NAS -> BE and then again from the BE -> FE... |
| [19:44:54] | kormoc: | sphery, I'm sure a ton of blind pigs find them given they smell them ;) |
| [19:46:15] | eddytv: | Is it possible to configure things that way? So the content stored locally on the BE is sent via MythProtocol to the FE's, but content stored on the NAS is indexed/cataloged by the BE (for metadata purposes) and accessed directly via NFS mount? |
| [19:47:59] | wagnerrp: | you could, but then youre running both a backend and a separate NAS |
| [19:48:08] | wagnerrp: | why not remove the drives from your NAS, and shove them in your backend? |
| [19:48:30] | eddytv: | Right, for now, that's the case — there are some other non-Myth devices that need access to the NAS-based media |
| [19:48:47] | wagnerrp: | non-myth devices that support NFS? |
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| [19:49:09] | eddytv: | Well, I have the NAS configured to serve up the content via both SMB and NFS |
| [19:50:20] | eddytv: | I was just hoping to make the content on the NAS accessible to the Myth FE's without having to transfer it twice and send it via the BE, but still allow the BE to keep track of all the metadata. |
| [19:50:43] | wagnerrp: | you can mount the NFS shares on the frontends |
| [19:50:56] | wagnerrp: | and the frontends will know to use the locally accessible content if it finds it |
| [19:50:57] | eddytv: | Right... I have that working |
| [19:51:05] | wagnerrp: | rather than attempt to stream it from the backend |
| [19:51:14] | wagnerrp: | (even when using storage groups) |
| [19:51:24] | eddytv: | So how do I configure the FE's properly to do that? |
| [19:51:46] | wagnerrp: | you dont configure the frontends to do anything |
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| [19:51:56] | wagnerrp: | you install mythvideo, mount the NFS paths, and youre done |
| [19:52:20] | wagnerrp: | note that they must be mounted in the same location on the frontends, as they are on the backend |
| [19:52:59] | eddytv: | Hmm... that seems too easy. I thought for sure the data was going through the BE and being transferred via MythProtocol to the FE! |
| [19:53:26] | wagnerrp: | if the frontend cannot find the data on the local filesystem that is what would be happening |
| [19:54:08] | eddytv: | OK, thank you very much for the insight! I really appreciate you taking the time to clarify that. |
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| [19:56:43] | ptriller: | Hi, Is there a known bug, that some channels don't get the EPG program info althoug I am sure it is transmitted (my TV gets EPG) |
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| [20:05:40] | sphery: | eddytv: note that MythVideo didn't look for local copies of remotely-indexed videos until after 0.24 |
| [20:05:57] | sphery: | so if you're using 0.24-fixes, it will still stream through the backend |
| [20:06:16] | eddytv: | does "after 0.24" include 0.24.1? |
| [20:06:18] | sphery: | unless you use "local" directories |
| [20:06:40] | wagnerrp: | sphery: oh? i thought that was just standard mythplayer behavior |
| [20:06:41] | sphery: | no, I mean unstable/development has a change that will allow it, but it won't be released until 0.25 |
| [20:07:07] | eddytv: | Ah, great, thanks for that clarification! So can you explain a little more about "local directories"? |
| [20:07:20] | sphery: | wagnerrp: no, different code for recordings and mythvideo--mythvideo's remote file support didn't do things the way the recordings did |
| [20:07:38] | sphery: | now there's a hack with a similar function for non-recording videos |
| [20:07:53] | sphery: | eventually, we should improve our code so all the media file handling is done using the same code |
| [20:09:16] | Muzer: | right! |
| [20:09:36] | Muzer: | I've fixed the problem with the offline HTML stuff |
| [20:09:39] | Muzer: | now just got to fix searches :p |
| [20:09:54] | sphery: | eddytv: as far as local directories, it's definitely not the best approach--and may be dropped in the future |
| [20:10:24] | Muzer: | want me to send a diff or something? Bearing in mind that it's only one, rather big, line that's changed so it'd probably just be easier for me to pastebin the new one :p |
| [20:10:26] | sphery: | eddytv: so, as another question, is transferring it across the network twice really causing problems? I mean, you're using a switch, not a dumb hub, right? |
| [20:10:54] | eddytv: | sphery: LOL, yes, have a gigabit network. I was just trying to be efficient. :) |
| [20:10:57] | Muzer: | if not, tell me the diff command (I'm a little rusty on how to get the ones that people usually use for patches) |
| [20:11:20] | sphery: | eddytv: I'd recommend not worrying too much, for now, unless you see actual problems from it |
| [20:11:37] | sphery: | in the future, we'll have code to track where each file system exists and use the most-efficient path to get it to the frontend |
| [20:11:46] | sphery: | but that requires reworking all our media handling to use the same code |
| [20:12:29] | eddytv: | sphery: ok, but let's say I wanted to try the "local directory hack"... knowing full well it may be dropped in the future, just to see if I notice any difference. What would I have to configure on the FE (and/or BE)? |
| [20:12:39] | sphery: | wagnerrp: https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/f7d050b80 |
| [20:13:11] | sphery: | took forever to find because I forgot that github messages don't have trac user IDs in them, so searching for markk was killing me |
| [20:13:49] | sphery: | eddytv: you'd have to remove all your storage groups, rescan, then configure a mythvideo directory--and make sure it's mounted at the same location on every frontend |
| [20:14:06] | sphery: | and make sure you never enter or scan in mythvideo when any of the mounts are unmounted |
| [20:14:29] | sphery: | basically, do exactly what we did before we had mythvideo support for storage groups |
| [20:14:46] | sphery: | s/remove all your storage groups/remove all your Video storage groups/ |
| [20:14:58] | eddytv: | ah, so you can't mix stuff stored locally on the BE which is streamed via MythProtocol with "local directories" — I'd have to NFS share the mythvideos directory that is on the BE and mount it on each FE? |
| [20:15:24] | sphery: | you'd have to mount the same file system on all frontends |
| [20:15:31] | wagnerrp: | eddytv: are you running 100mbit or gigabit? |
| [20:15:43] | sphery: | and it would index them without host |
| [20:15:52] | sphery: | so they're just files that must be in that location on all systems |
| [20:15:57] | sphery: | he's running gigabit |
| [20:15:59] | eddytv: | wagnerrp: it's a gigabit network |
| [20:16:07] | wagnerrp: | then why do you care? |
| [20:16:16] | sphery: | and this is a "because it sounds more efficient" thing |
| [20:16:18] | wagnerrp: | surely your network has plenty of bandwidth for routing through multiple machines |
| [20:16:23] | sphery: | I've tried to convince him it doesn't matter :) |
| [20:16:37] | sphery: | especially since it's a switch and not a dumb hub |
| [20:16:42] | eddytv: | sphery: OK, thanks for clarifying. The behavior you're describing is what I thought I was seeing (NAS -> BE -> FE instead of NAS -> FE) |
| [20:16:51] | wagnerrp: | i dont think anyone actually makes gigabit hubs |
| [20:17:20] | sphery: | right |
| [20:17:33] | eddytv: | wagnerrp: yeah, it was more a curiosity thing because it seems more efficient to only send it over the wire once... just the engineer in me trying to do it "right" instead of "good enough" |
| [20:17:38] | sphery: | and even on a 100Mb switch, it's likely not a problem |
| [20:18:05] | wagnerrp: | well the 'right' thing would require 0.25 |
| [20:18:06] | sphery: | unless you're also trying to run multiple HDHRs off that same backend NIC |
| [20:18:17] | wagnerrp: | and the 'righter' thing would drop the NAS, and just run samba on your backend |
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| [20:20:02] | eddytv: | wagnerrp: yes, that would be the ideal solution |
| [20:21:25] | eddytv: | but for now, the two are separate. I'll look forward to 0.25 where if mythvideo sees a file is available "locally", it will access it that when instead of via MythProtocol from the BE. |
| [20:21:38] | eddytv: | s/when/way/ |
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| [20:35:04] | eddytv: | Our of curiosity, does anybody know if the "progress bar" (shown during playback) is being enhanced to visually show the current "cut list", similar to what you see when you're in "Edit" mode? |
| [20:35:59] | wagnerrp: | no, no one is attempting to do that at current |
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| [20:39:01] | eddytv: | ok thanks. Was just wondering if it was worth looking in to since it's something I think would be useful. |
| [20:39:51] | sphery: | eddytv: yeah, it's on my list |
| [20:40:10] | sphery: | though it's really coming about as a result of a different project |
| [20:40:25] | eddytv: | sphery: well in any case, that's great to hear |
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| [20:40:48] | sphery: | (am modifying the editor to allow showing the flag list separately from the cut list, and it will allow showing it in any osd, including normal playback one, at the themer's discretion) |
| [20:41:15] | sphery: | but it requires modifying the existing code and separating the ui code from the data code |
| [20:41:15] | eddytv: | nice! that sounds very useful. |
| [20:42:01] | eddytv: | is it a "blue sky" thing, or are you hoping for that to make it in to 0.25? |
| [20:43:28] | wagnerrp: | sphery: such that the flag list would be displayed in a separate bar entirely? |
| [20:43:54] | sphery: | wagnerrp: could be... and the editor allows seeking via flag points as well as cut points |
| [20:44:03] | sphery: | so you'd never again need to import your flag list as a cut list |
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| [20:44:25] | sphery: | just seek to flag points, and verify and adjust, then select, seek to next flag, adjust, select, ... |
| [20:44:33] | Muzer: | RIGHT! |
| [20:44:35] | Muzer: | Fixed the searching |
| [20:44:46] | Muzer: | the BBC had changed a few of their div classes for some reason |
| [20:44:48] | sphery: | main problem with the editor is people try to adjust broken cuts versus just replacing them |
| [20:44:50] | Muzer: | adding spaces on the end :/ |
| [20:45:10] | sphery: | they don't realize that cuts are like doritos--they can eat all they want, we'll make more |
| [20:46:25] | Muzer: | wagnerrp: it's working :) |
| [20:47:00] | Muzer: | what's the best way to make patchable diffs again? |
| [20:47:13] | wagnerrp: | dont know, never done one with git |
| [20:47:26] | sphery: | wagnerrp: guess if I had actually gotten around to checking out assembla and setting up a page for my todo (as Beirdo requested), you could have known about my todo for the editor/progress bar |
| [20:47:53] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: "git diff" or if you're not using a git checkoutm diff -u |
| [20:48:21] | Muzer: | I'm not using a git checkout, so OK |
| [20:49:03] | Beirdo: | Muzer: you want to make a patch with git: git format-patch is the command you'd be looking for |
| [20:49:04] | sphery: | oh, and it will allow separate bars (that could be stacked on top of each other to give the appearance of top/bottom of a single bar) or modes (so you only see flags when in certain modes) or same bar with multiple markers (so you have show in blue, flagged commercials in red, and [ and ] for cuts or whatever |
| [20:49:14] | sphery: | basically, will put a lot of options in themers' hands |
| [20:49:58] | eddytv: | sphery: that sounds really slick :) |
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| [20:54:28] | Muzer: | http://pastebin.com/iHQ8cYsN <-- fixes for search function and fullscreen view for BBC iPlayer |
| [20:54:46] | Muzer: | as you can see, the only changes are updates in the embed code, and changes in the div class names (adding spaces) |
| [20:55:34] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: I'll take a look at it a little later, thanks for having a look (I'm sure it will make a lot of UK dwellers happy) |
| [20:55:47] | sphery: | Why do people seem to think that a site that only hosts links to illegal copies of copyright-protected content is not bad? I mean it's very different from 2600 hosting a link to decss, as there's absolutely no reason to host a list of links to stolen material other than to incite/perpetuate additional theft of that content. (This in regards to the UK Comp Sci student who's facing extradition for creating TVShack web site.) |
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| [20:58:13] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: Though the iplayer embed page is actually completely different in master-- but I wrote the one for master so I can likely make the requisite changes without too much trouble |
| [20:58:22] | Muzer: | oh, sorry |
| [20:58:27] | Muzer: | i didn't realise it'd be different in source |
| [20:58:28] | iamlindoro: | Nothing to apologize for |
| [20:58:30] | Muzer: | if I'd known I would have modified that |
| [20:58:46] | iamlindoro: | The one is master is a "true" fullscreen player |
| [20:58:50] | iamlindoro: | ie, no border |
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| [20:59:10] | iamlindoro: | but requires a number of other changes which are only in master to use, so no use to .24 users |
| [20:59:11] | Muzer: | oh, I see what you mean |
| [20:59:28] | Muzer: | I thought I was on .25 :P |
| [20:59:29] | iamlindoro: | Master permits flash players with accessible APIs to be controlled with the remote |
| [20:59:45] | Muzer: | that's pretty nice |
| [20:59:47] | iamlindoro: | so for youtube, vimeo, blip.tv, and dailymotion, you can control them as though they were being played internally |
| [21:00:10] | iamlindoro: | I "half converted" iPlayer to that format, but since we don't know the iPlayer flash player's API (and BBC won't share it) I can't get much further |
| [21:00:14] | Muzer: | that IS pretty nice |
| [21:00:39] | Muzer: | I assume you've just mapped remote buttons to buttons on the flash object |
| [21:00:50] | Muzer: | oh, does volume control work when playing flash content in the master? |
| [21:00:52] | iamlindoro: | That's not exactly how it works |
| [21:01:14] | iamlindoro: | It doesn't map to physical buttons, the flash player used by those sites itself exposes API calls |
| [21:01:25] | Muzer: | oh, of course, I do have .24... no idea where that idea about me having .25 came from :P |
| [21:01:26] | iamlindoro: | so we make a call to adjust volume, play, pause, seek, etc. though their API |
| [21:01:30] | sphery: | I really ought to fix the Qt-WebKit/Phonon error (most likely caused by old gstreamer, which is used by Phonon), which results in YouTube and other sites failing and showing only a horizontal gray bar in the middle of the video "black box" |
| [21:01:43] | Muzer: | iamlindoro: ah |
| [21:01:55] | sphery: | error on my system, that is |
| [21:02:04] | sphery: | (not in MythTV code) |
| [21:02:09] | Muzer: | sphery: get it to use Xine :p |
| [21:02:12] | Muzer: | easy solution ;p |
| [21:02:12] | iamlindoro: | The four sites above expose a true API... BBC has one, but the calls aren't anything obvious (I've tried) and aren't publicized |
| [21:02:20] | Muzer: | Phonon works better with Xine I believe... |
| [21:02:38] | Muzer: | iamlindoro: and I assume ther's no way to get flash just to list the calls possible |
| [21:02:46] | sphery: | heh, well, when it's a flash object in the web page... |
| [21:02:49] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: nope |
| [21:02:59] | Muzer: | heh, typical Flash :P |
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| [21:03:21] | digitlman: | hey all |
| [21:04:01] | digitlman: | got my video on my HVR 2250 working via IVTV MPEG, but now that I am home, I see that the audio doesn't work |
| [21:04:20] | digitlman: | I am using an HDMI cable |
| [21:04:28] | Muzer: | hmm... so, it wouldn't be technically-speaking too difficult to write plugins for ITV Player/4oD/Demand 5, just quite time-consuming (it took me a while just to change a few div class names in the BBC one, I couldn't imagine how time-consuming it would be to write one from scratch) |
| [21:04:36] | digitlman: | I cannot see anywhere I can even make audio config changes |
| [21:04:57] | Muzer: | (if anyone's planning on doing one of those, please let it be 4oD, I never watch the other two :P) |
| [21:05:24] | iamlindoro: | Muzer: The original author of these scripts turned a couple out a week when he was having fun, and he was constantly improving the API... the real hurdle will be learning that. Thereafter the sites would come quickly |
| [21:06:13] | Muzer: | the API actually seems reasonably straightforward... though there was probably tonnes of stuff I didn't see :p |
| [21:06:34] | Muzer: | I didn't touch bbciplayer_exceptions.py |
| [21:06:50] | Muzer: | oh, that's not much : |
| [21:06:51] | Muzer: | p |
| [21:07:14] | Muzer: | yeah, it does seem relatively straightforward |
| [21:07:29] | Muzer: | just time-consuming as I said |
| [21:07:33] | Muzer: | and probably very frustrating :P |
| [21:07:57] | digitlman: | do I need do something to enable analog audio for the 2250? |
| [21:08:19] | digitlman: | or use the analog audio from the sound card? |
| [21:08:34] | sphery: | digitlman: likely if you play the recording using a properly-configured media player (like mplayer or xine), you'll see it has audio in it |
| [21:08:54] | sphery: | (or, ideally, use a different desktop system with simpler-to-configure audio output to test) |
| [21:09:00] | digitlman: | probably... |
| [21:09:04] | digitlman: | I can test that now |
| [21:09:06] | sphery: | meaning all you need to do is configure mythtv to output to hdmi properly |
| [21:09:34] | sphery: | as I don't know of any way you can capture video without audio on an ivtv card using mythtv |
| [21:09:55] | wagnerrp: | you can use it as a framegrabber |
| [21:09:57] | sphery: | (and I know there's no way to get video without audio on digital DVB/ATSC/QAM capture with mythtv) |
| [21:10:06] | wagnerrp: | you can be using borked drivers which dont properly pull audio |
| [21:10:10] | sphery: | wagnerrp: heh, well, I'd put that in the "not using ivtv" category :) |
| [21:10:12] | wagnerrp: | you could have it set to use the wrong input |
| [21:10:37] | digitlman: | let me check that |
| [21:10:39] | sphery: | you could forget to plug in the RCA audio connectors |
| [21:10:58] | sphery: | but still, assuming the most basic things are properly set up--meaning that it works anywhere |
| [21:11:03] | sphery: | you'd get audio and video from mythtv |
| [21:11:21] | sphery: | so either it's not mythtv or it's a broken audio output configuration in mythtv |
| [21:11:25] | sphery: | and has nothing to do with recording |
| [21:12:07] | sphery: | for me, the first check would be to play the video on a known-working media player |
| [21:13:27] | digitlman: | I just tried with media player and I get no audio |
| [21:13:44] | sphery: | do you get audio with other videos on that media player on that system? |
| [21:13:59] | digitlman: | let me transfer another file over |
| [21:15:03] | digitlman: | the Windows 7 sample video for example lol |
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| [21:22:29] | digitlman: | thanks for the help – it's not myth ...someting else |
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| [21:23:00] | sphery: | check setup of your audio output device |
| [21:23:12] | sphery: | and try playing other videos in mythtv (like using mythvideo with Internal player) |
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| [21:34:46] | Muzer: | hmm, I've just noticed a reasonably big issue... multi-episode audio programmes aren't being detected as audio, because the class name is different... the same with the first search result. I'll try to sort it... |
| [21:47:35] | Muzer: | iamlindoro: fixed, should I just give you the line I changed? |
| [21:48:25] | Muzer: | it's a line you can see in the diff: audioFilter = etree.XPath('./@class="audio"') was changed to audioFilter = etree.XPath('contains(./@class,"audio") or contains(./../../@class,"audio")') |
| [21:54:38] | iamlindoro: | Muzer, Sure, I'll have a look at that as well |
| [21:57:53] | Muzer: | it's quite a horrible solution but I don't believe there's any other way (it assumes the levels between the first episode of a group and the additional episodes is always 2 nodes, which it is now but it could of course change in the future) – just the <li> for the "additional episodes" doesn't have a class at all |
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| [22:58:10] | Hilikus: | is there any integration between boxee and mythtv? all i could find were pretty old threads about it so i want more recent info |
| [22:58:31] | Beirdo: | ummm, likely not by us |
| [22:59:03] | Hilikus: | it found that in boxee i can play the online videos that i can't in mythbrowser/mythnetvision |
| [22:59:54] | Hilikus: | is there any way i can try to improve flash support? my though is that it is possible if boxee is doing it correctly |
| [23:00:59] | Hilikus: | cause i was told a couple of days ago that it can't be fixed since flash is closed source but yesterday i found that flash works fine in boxee/linux |
| [23:04:16] | Muzer: | I assume you have flash installed... |
| [23:04:30] | Muzer: | most things that'll work in flash on Windows should do in Linux as well |
| [23:04:35] | Muzer: | whatever the browser |
| [23:04:45] | Muzer: | they'll probably work less efficiently in Linux, but they'll still work ;) |
| [23:05:46] | Muzer: | anyway, I must be going – thanks iamlindoro, I hope you get those iPlayer fixes committed ready for 0.25 when it comes out |
| [23:06:56] | wagnerrp: | Hilikus: are you sure flash is working in boxee? |
| [23:07:06] | Hilikus: | well, flash works fine, the problem is going fullscreen |
| [23:07:13] | Hilikus: | wagnerrp: yes, it works fullscreen no problem |
| [23:07:17] | wagnerrp: | a lot of times, boxee bypasses the flash player and hits the video files directly with their own video player |
| [23:08:37] | Hilikus: | well, this is tv content so i don't think you can do that, but maybe you can. more than that, at the beginning it had problems for the first 2 seconds and it actually showed the web page but after two seconds it was in fullscreen. that's why i assumed it was just flash in fullscreen mode |
| [23:09:02] | Hilikus: | there was a browser window |
| [23:09:10] | wagnerrp: | tv content, being from... hulu? |
| [23:09:20] | Hilikus: | no, citytv,com |
| [23:09:28] | Hilikus: | hulu doesn't work here |
| [23:09:40] | Beirdo: | heh, I kinda miss CityTV |
| [23:09:59] | wagnerrp: | if they dont use RTMPe, then chances are that boxee is simply hitting the video stream directly |
| [23:10:05] | sphery: | but what about the poor rural Canadians? |
| [23:10:10] | sphery: | everyone forgets them... |
| [23:10:37] | Beirdo: | sphery: if you lived in Toronto, you'd get the same attitude... "screw them, they can move to Toronto" |
| [23:10:53] | Hilikus: | wagnerrp: i thought you couldn't do that with flash content, DRM and stuff. is that incorrect? |
| [23:11:03] | sphery: | heh |
| [23:11:10] | Hilikus: | hahaha toronto sucks anyway :P |
| [23:11:40] | Beirdo: | says the guy trying to watch TV that's from Toronto |
| [23:11:52] | Hilikus: | lol |
| [23:11:57] | Beirdo: | Queen E & John St... |
| [23:12:01] | hadees (hadees!~hadees@72-48-91-73.dyn.grandenetworks.net) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:12:10] | Beirdo: | been a while, but I can still see it in my mind. |
| [23:12:21] | Hilikus: | where are you now? |
| [23:12:28] | Beirdo: | living in Seattle |
| [23:12:34] | Hilikus: | nice |
| [23:12:36] | Beirdo: | at the exact moment, in Portland, OR |
| [23:12:43] | Hilikus: | i;ve always wanted to go to seattle |
| [23:13:07] | Beirdo: | me too. :) I'll be going back in a few hours |
| [23:13:16] | Beirdo: | Portland's pretty nice too, BTW |
| [23:13:31] | Hilikus: | i don't really know where's oregon geographically |
| [23:13:47] | Beirdo: | between Washington State and California |
| [23:13:58] | Hilikus: | oh ok |
| [23:15:03] | Hilikus: | wagnerrp: when you say hitting the video directly, how can this be done? i can't even find the video source |
| [23:16:21] | iamlindoro: | sphery, The people of vancouver were doing their best to turn themselves into rural Canadians this week ;) |
| [23:16:32] | Hilikus: | hahaha |
| [23:16:35] | sphery: | heh, yeah |
| [23:16:57] | Beirdo: | heh. |
| [23:17:01] | ** Beirdo boos at Boston ** | |
| [23:17:18] | iamlindoro: | Yeah, stupid jerks for being better |
| [23:17:23] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [23:17:27] | Beirdo: | exactly |
| [23:17:54] | Beirdo: | the Canucks were the better team, but they ran outta oomph, I think |
| [23:17:57] | Beirdo: | too bad |
| [23:18:14] | Beirdo: | better luck next year... and my Boston-loving coworker must be elated |
| [23:19:15] | Beirdo: | it all comes down to the playoffs |
| [23:20:04] | Hilikus: | they'll probably get rid of luongo IMO |
| [23:20:19] | Hilikus: | not that i think it was his fault |
| [23:20:30] | Beirdo: | yeah, they usually sacrifice the goalie |
| [23:20:42] | natanojl (natanojl!~jonatan@c83-252-237-63.bredband.comhem.se) has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) | |
| [23:20:47] | sphery: | You know, I have never been as important a customer of my cell phone provider since I cancelled my account with them and started using their prepaid plans (which are saving me $25/mo to get more than I had before or $40/mo to get what I was using before). It's amazing how many texts I'm getting about how important a customer I am and how I could switch to one of their contract plans. |
| [23:21:03] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [23:21:10] | Beirdo: | at $0.25 each SMS? |
| [23:23:09] | sphery: | heh, no, $50/mo for unlimited talk, text, and data--and no taxes and no fees (so same as the $70/mo contract plan, but the 22% taxes/fees are included in the prepaid price, which make the $70/mo plan $85.40). Other option is 1500 talk or text (each text = 1min) for $30/mo (again taxes/fees included), and I've never used more than 1300 talk+text |
| [23:23:26] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [23:23:52] | sphery: | seems the Europeans were right--prepaid/no-contract cell service is the way to go (unless you do a family deal, where you may get better with enough lines on the account) |
| [23:24:19] | Beirdo: | or unless you get a grandfathered unlimited data plan |
| [23:24:23] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [23:24:37] | sphery: | grandfathered unlimited data plan at less than $50/mo (including taxes and fees) |
| [23:24:45] | Beirdo: | heck no |
| [23:25:33] | sphery: | and, really, I'm buying prepaid codes from a place that sells the $50 plan for $48.50, and each month has a 10% discount on it, so I can get it for $43.65, all said and done--no taxes, fees, shipping, etc...) |
| [23:25:53] | sphery: | so $43.65 for unlimited talk, text, and data |
| [23:26:08] | Beirdo: | "unlimited" or truly unlimited? |
| [23:26:12] | sphery: | US cell phone individual plans are a rip off |
| [23:26:15] | Beirdo: | many of those have a limit |
| [23:26:24] | sphery: | 100MB at 4G speeds, then they can throttle it |
| [23:26:38] | Beirdo: | right |
| [23:26:43] | Beirdo: | that's not unlimited :) |
| [23:26:45] | sphery: | for $70/mo (minus discounts), 2GB at 4G speeds, then they can throttle it |
| [23:26:57] | Beirdo: | and as I pull > 4G/month usually... |
| [23:27:14] | sphery: | actually, sorry, the 70/mo doesn't have a 2GB speed limit, anymore |
| [23:28:14] | wagnerrp: | Hilikus: very little flash content actually uses DRM |
| [23:28:30] | sphery: | so that's $67.20 – 10% = $60.48 for unlimited text without any throttling |
| [23:28:38] | wagnerrp: | the overwhelming majority of it just directly downloads flv and mp4 files over http |
| [23:28:39] | sphery: | er, unlimited data |
| [23:28:42] | rclark (rclark!~rclark@78-86-112-140.zone2.bethere.co.uk) has quit (Quit: leaving) | |
| [23:28:46] | wagnerrp: | a small amount uses open RTMP |
| [23:28:52] | wagnerrp: | and a smaller still amount uses RTMPe |
| [23:29:02] | Hilikus: | wagnerrp: so if I get the url i could play it with the Internal player? |
| [23:29:06] | wagnerrp: | RTMPe is the only encrypted content |
| [23:29:21] | sphery: | and boxee circumvents the flash stuff on many sites, in violation of the ToS, which we won't do, right? |
| [23:29:31] | wagnerrp: | everything else just relies on links obfuscated by code in the flash player |
| [23:29:35] | sphery: | they download it directly, even when not allowed |
| [23:29:40] | wagnerrp: | many dont even bother with obfuscation |
| [23:29:45] | sphery: | which is why Hulu kept modifying the site to stop them, right? |
| [23:30:04] | wagnerrp: | hulu is one of the few sites to actually use RTMPe |
| [23:30:09] | Hilikus: | i see, i didn't know that |
| [23:30:18] | wagnerrp: | however its weak, and was cracked |
| [23:30:35] | wagnerrp: | initially, boxee was given special access to hulu |
| [23:30:41] | Hilikus: | can VLC or the internal player play these streams? |
| [23:30:43] | wagnerrp: | but the content providers didnt like that, and made them shut it down |
| [23:31:10] | wagnerrp: | so they switched to rtmpdump or something like that, which could download and decrypt rtmpe streams |
| [23:31:25] | sphery: | then again, this year when the contracts come up for renewal and no one signs up and Hulu has to start charging subscriptions for all the content, it won't matter so much :) |
| [23:31:29] | wagnerrp: | but in order to retain semi-legitimate status, boxee had to quit using that |
| [23:31:41] | wagnerrp: | so now they use an internal flash player for it like everyone else |
| [23:31:59] | Hilikus: | i heard about this internal flash player |
| [23:32:07] | sphery: | no one = none of the content owners license their content for distribution on Hulu |
| [23:39:03] | Hilikus: | how do i change the resolution of mythfrontend? i want to check if the fullscreen problem is due to my current resolution |
| [23:39:27] | Hilikus: | i read somewhere that sometime flash has a problem changing resolutions |
| [23:39:30] | wagnerrp: | you mean the X resolution? |
| [23:39:38] | wagnerrp: | no, flash has no problem changing resolutions |
| [23:39:48] | wagnerrp: | the problem is that flash does video scaling in software |
| [23:40:10] | wagnerrp: | and video scaling is a very intensive task, rendered trivial by even antique graphics hardware |
| [23:40:22] | Hilikus: | in 10.1 i think they changed that |
| [23:40:27] | wagnerrp: | flash refuses to use said graphics hardware |
| [23:40:45] | Hilikus: | there's hardware acceleration now |
| [23:40:54] | wagnerrp: | yeah, now they _finally_ support hardware acceleration |
| [23:41:00] | wagnerrp: | technically, opengl support went in years ago |
| [23:41:08] | iamlindoro: | hardware acceleration of the parts the don't matter |
| [23:41:08] | wagnerrp: | but it was buggy and unstable, so no one used it |
| [23:41:42] | wagnerrp: | they only use acceleration for the decoding? scaling and compositing still happens in software? |
| [23:41:50] | iamlindoro: | yup |
| [23:41:53] | Hilikus: | well, i'm just puzzles by the fact that the stupid video plays fine in its window but in full screen it freezes the UI |
| [23:42:17] | wagnerrp: | Hilikus: because of the aforementioned software scaling, colorspace conversion, and compositing |
| [23:42:26] | wagnerrp: | its tedious, demanding work |
| [23:42:42] | Hilikus: | so i thought changing the resolution might help |
| [23:42:45] | wagnerrp: | and flash tries to do that in software |
| [23:42:58] | wagnerrp: | if you change the resolution so flash does not have to scale, then yes, that does help |
| [23:43:05] | wagnerrp: | but you still need to do colorspace conversion |
| [23:43:20] | wagnerrp: | and that does mean you are stuck with your frontend running at a piss poor 720x480 |
| [23:43:37] | Hilikus: | i have a dual core CPU 3GHz. i think it should be able to handle it |
| [23:43:46] | wagnerrp: | you said you had a P4 |
| [23:43:50] | Hilikus: | when? |
| [23:43:59] | Hilikus: | i never said that |
| [23:44:03] | wagnerrp: | maybe someone else said they had a P4 |
| [23:44:56] | wagnerrp: | in any case, i know scaling 480p video to 2560x1600 in flash brings a 2.4GHz Core 2 to a crawl |
| [23:45:15] | Hilikus: | also, the fact that it works fine in fullscreen in seamonkey is even more frustrating |
| [23:46:33] | Hilikus: | i think iamlindoro told me that that still doesn't prove that its mythbrowser, but i can't be sure that it isn't either cause i can't try the browser as standalone |
| [23:46:59] | wagnerrp: | didnt we used to have a stand alone version of the browser? |
| [23:47:18] | iamlindoro: | Hilikus, Remember that mythbrowser is just a thin layer on top of QtWebkit-- that's what the browser is |
| [23:47:37] | iamlindoro: | ie, mythbrowser does bookmark management, and... well, that's more or less it |
| [23:47:48] | Hilikus: | no, i mean, try a standalone (Or just different) version based on QTWebKit that's not mythbrowser |
| [23:49:12] | wagnerrp: | why does mediawiki's search such so hard? |
| [23:49:16] | wagnerrp: | *suck |
| [23:52:47] | sphery: | and the flash hardware accel is only available /if/ the web page is created to allow it |
| [23:53:04] | Hilikus: | do you guys know if i can change X's resolution temporarilly? i.e. without modifying the config file? i just want to try mythfrontend in a different resolution in my current session |
| [23:53:14] | sphery: | i.e. it depends on whether the flash object says to use it |
| [23:53:33] | sphery: | and adobe doesn't promise that it will work or that it won't corrupt the rest of the page, so many providers choose not to use it |
| [23:53:45] | sphery: | so you don't just get it everywhere |
| [23:53:57] | wagnerrp: | right, thats why no one ever used the old opengl support, which was added in '08 |
| [23:55:35] | sphery: | Hilikus: man xrandr |
| [23:55:59] | sphery: | though, really, you don't need to change X resolution--just play the video in a browser that's not scaling the flash |
| [23:56:08] | sphery: | i.e. that displays it as the same size the web page says to |
| [23:58:16] | StevenR (StevenR!~foo@88.97.49.237) has quit (Quit: leaving) | |
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