Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Sunday, May 22nd, 2011, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:30]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, here else would it be?

[00:00:36]

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[00:00:59]

tgm4883:

you have to edit the playback profile

[00:01:01]

tgm4883:

on page 3

[00:01:05]

tgm4883:

of the playback settings

[00:02:54]

sailerboy:

so bob2x or bob2xhw?

[00:03:41]

wagnerrp:

sailerboy: do you have an ATI card?

[00:03:59]

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[00:04:08]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, yes

[00:04:10]

sailerboy:

:(

[00:04:11]

sailerboy:

lol

[00:04:12]

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[00:04:22]

wagnerrp:

onboard or discrete?

[00:04:22]

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[00:04:30]

sailerboy:

discrete

[00:04:48]

wagnerrp:

replace it

[00:04:56]

sailerboy:

lol

[00:05:01]

sailerboy:

i can't really afford to do that

[00:05:05]

sailerboy:

does mythtv not work on ATI?

[00:05:25]

wagnerrp:

sure you can, you can pick up a GT210 for about $25

[00:05:26]

sailerboy:

at all?

[00:05:32]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, i'm a student

[00:05:36]

sailerboy:

i really can't afford anything

[00:05:42]

sailerboy:

the computer was a gift

[00:05:57]

sailerboy:

so are you saying that mythtv will never work on an ati card?

[00:06:00]

wagnerrp:

sell blood

[00:06:03]

sailerboy:

:|

[00:06:04]

wagnerrp:

its not up to mythtv

[00:06:14]

wagnerrp:

ATI does not produce worthwhile linux drivers

[00:06:14]

sailerboy:

answer the question then

[00:06:18]

sailerboy:

will it or will it not work

[00:06:34]

wagnerrp:

it might

[00:06:34]

sailerboy:

seems to play just fine, other then the fact that the video is duplicated

[00:06:37]

wagnerrp:

its really hit or miss

[00:06:47]

wagnerrp:

and you run into funky issues like that duplicated video image

[00:08:15]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, there's no way around it?

[00:08:21]

sailerboy:

i just wasted an afternoon?

[00:08:43]

Beirdo:

sure there is... buy an nvidia card :)

[00:08:48]

wagnerrp:

as tgm4883 stated, the duplicated video image is caused by using the bob deinterlacer filter

[00:08:49]

sailerboy:

i can't afford to

[00:08:54]

wagnerrp:

but the better alternative is to just replace the card

[00:09:05]

sailerboy:

ok, so i should remove the bob2 deinterlacer filter

[00:09:08]

sailerboy:

and choose a different one?

[00:12:29]

wagnerrp:

but as the saying goes, youre merely fighting a symptom

[00:12:41]

wagnerrp:

the problem being junk drivers

[00:13:15]

sailerboy:

ok, fine, lemme fight the symptom

[00:13:17]

sailerboy:

i have no choice

[00:13:18]

sailerboy:

kk?

[00:13:55]

sailerboy:

so what should i do wagnerrp ?

[00:14:08]

wagnerrp:

use something other than the bob deint filter

[00:14:13]

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[00:14:49]

sailerboy:

if i tried that and it's still duplicated?

[00:16:45]

wagnerrp:

did you hit next all the way through? or escape to back out?

[00:16:51]

sailerboy:

escape

[00:16:53]

sailerboy:

to back out

[00:17:23]

wagnerrp:

so you in other words you never saved the changes

[00:17:28]

sailerboy:

lol

[00:17:29]

sailerboy:

ok

[00:17:36]

sailerboy:

cool

[00:17:41]

sailerboy:

it works now

[00:22:26]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, because of aformentioned fail ati drivers

[00:22:31]

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[00:22:31]

sailerboy:

does the hdmi out not work either?

[00:25:35]

wagnerrp:

HDMI out should work

[00:26:54]

sailerboy:

erm

[00:26:55]

sailerboy:

i mean audio

[00:26:57]

sailerboy:

audio out

[00:27:01]

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[00:29:29]

wagnerrp:

that should be handled by the HDA driver in ALSA

[00:29:38]

sailerboy:

heh

[00:29:38]

wagnerrp:

completely independent of the ATI drivers

[00:29:39]

sailerboy:

should be

[00:29:50]

sailerboy:

i have the alsa hdmi as my audio source

[00:29:55]

sailerboy:

it's unmuted in alsamixer

[00:30:25]

wagnerrp:

audio... source?

[00:30:35]

sailerboy:

um

[00:30:47]

sailerboy:

on general

[00:30:52]

sailerboy:

where it says audio system

[00:30:56]

sailerboy:

audio output device

[00:31:12]

wagnerrp:

output, not source

[00:31:23]

sailerboy:

right

[00:31:43]

sailerboy:

the volume says 0% though

[00:31:54]

sailerboy:

when i try to do volume up in the frontend

[00:31:57]

sailerboy:

and it doesn't go up

[00:32:10]

wagnerrp:

digital outputs cannot support volume control

[00:32:23]

wagnerrp:

rather, passthrough outputs cannot

[00:32:39]

sailerboy:

ok, so i have to disable internal volume controls?

[00:33:27]

sailerboy:

still not working :(

[00:34:03]

wagnerrp:

the internal volume controls should be automatically disabled if using a passthrough output

[00:34:20]

sailerboy:

well

[00:34:20]

sailerboy:

ya

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[01:02:58]

sailerboy:

ok wagnerrp, i got it to work

[01:03:02]

sailerboy:

but mythtv still doesn't work

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[01:03:36]

sailerboy:

nvm

[01:03:37]

sailerboy:

got it to work

[01:05:04]

sailerboy:

i have to set the hdmi as the default

[01:05:12]

sailerboy:

then set the sound output to the default, not the hdmi

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[02:11:13]

GWG:

I need to seek the collective advice of the group.

[02:11:53]

GWG:

I'm thinking of upgrading my backend, as it has been running almost continuously for over 3 years now.

[02:12:15]

GWG:

I was trying to figure out what the best considerations were in upgrading in most people's opinions.

[02:14:23]

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[02:17:01]

[R]:

GWG: ?

[02:18:58]

GWG:

Why the ?

[02:19:31]

GWG:

What is the most important things to look for in a set of backend specs?

[02:19:43]

sqiush102:

GWG, i'm in the same boat as you

[02:19:44]

wagnerrp:

disk space

[02:19:47]

GWG:

Basically, I'm trying to get some ideas

[02:19:52]

GWG:

I'm set on that

[02:19:54]

wagnerrp:

expansion slots

[02:20:29]

GWG:

I have 6.5TB I'd take with me to the new system

[02:20:37]

GWG:

So, an ATX board

[02:21:43]

GWG:

I'm running a MicroATX right now, in an ATX case.

[02:22:09]

GWG:

It is hard to find a good server board. You up the specs too much and you end up with gaming rig features

[02:22:55]

kormoc:

GWG, http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx? . . . Motherboards

[02:24:58]

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[02:25:46]

GWG:

kormoc: No option there if you want AMD though.

[02:26:21]

kormoc:

GWG, so the AM2, Socket C32 and Socket G34's are fakes or?

[02:27:01]

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[02:28:23]

GWG:

The latest AMD specs are AM3 though

[02:28:57]

wagnerrp:

and C32/G34?

[02:29:34]

GWG:

wagnerrp: Pricingt

[02:29:49]

GWG:

I need to factor pricing vs power

[02:29:53]

kormoc:

So you want a server board for a commodity cpu?

[02:30:25]

wagnerrp:

what exactly are you looking for?

[02:30:29]

GWG:

I don't need a literal server board. I consider the backend to be a server

[02:30:40]

GWG:

It doesn't act as a frontend and its headless.

[02:31:34]

GWG:

I run a server for 3–4 years before I start thinking of replacement

[02:31:57]

GWG:

Basically, I'm trying to think what I might need to prepare myself for the next 3–4 years

[02:32:12]

wagnerrp:

obviously you have specific needs, since you say youre concerned about getting into 'gaming rigs'

[02:32:34]

GWG:

The things I've always looked for in the past are a good number of SATA ports, longevity, and a firewire port for channel changing a cable box.

[02:33:07]

wagnerrp:

most i can find on an AMD board is 6 ports

[02:33:09]

GWG:

Any large number of SATA ports seems to get you a bunch of high grade graphics features that a basically headless machine will never use

[02:33:17]

GWG:

I found 8

[02:33:21]

wagnerrp:

erm, 8 ports

[02:33:24]

wagnerrp:

yeah

[02:33:41]

GWG:

I'm just trying to figure out what I'm missing.

[02:33:50]

GWG:

If I'm shelling out a few hundred, how am I future proofing

[02:33:55]

wagnerrp:

even on ones that have both 3G and 6G ports, no more than 8

[02:34:08]

wagnerrp:

so if you want more, just figure on a decent controller card

[02:34:14]

wagnerrp:

you want 4DIMM slotas

[02:34:15]

kormoc:

GWG, so get a sata card and don't worry about on board ports

[02:34:24]

wagnerrp:

dont worry about upgrading

[02:34:36]

wagnerrp:

because by the time you get around to it, the socket will no longer be compatible

[02:34:49]

GWG:

When I built this system, DDR2 was state of the art

[02:34:52]

GWG:

Now there is DDR3.

[02:34:56]

GWG:

I expect that sort of thing

[02:35:10]

GWG:

But I'm worrying about 3–4 years of supporting the board before I move to the next socket

[02:35:59]

GWG:

I'd love to prepare for cablecard, but that's never going to happen for me

[02:36:35]

wagnerrp:

which has nothing to do with the motherboard anyway

[02:36:40]

GWG:

Yes

[02:37:12]

GWG:

But the fact that Time Warner Cable is never going to support Copy Freely means I'll probably still need the firewire port to change the channel on a cable box

[02:37:21]

GWG:

At least until someone puts a network cable on

[02:37:37]

wagnerrp:

ive got one of these sitting in my basement... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128444

[02:37:48]

wagnerrp:

8 ports, firewire, plenty of room for expansion

[02:37:57]

GWG:

wagnerrp: The irony is...

[02:38:06]

GWG:

That is exactly the board I was planning on buying

[02:38:29]

GWG:

Not from Newegg, as I found a vendor that's offering a bundle discount with a CPU

[02:38:38]

GWG:

But how is it?

[02:38:53]

wagnerrp:

no problems in the 30 hours ive used it

[02:38:55]

GWG:

I'm still regretting the Asus board I bought 3 years ago

[02:39:21]

GWG:

What processor do you have running on it/

[02:40:17]

wagnerrp:

phenom 2 560

[02:40:45]

wagnerrp:

if youve got a microcenter around

[02:40:58]

GWG:

wagnerrp: Also, you centered on where I'm planning to buy it

[02:41:00]

wagnerrp:

the board is $100, processor is $90, and theres a $40 off combo deal

[02:41:03]

GWG:

They are offering the bundle discount

[02:41:54]

GWG:

I was going to go up to the Phenom II X4 965 3.4GHz

[02:42:07]

GWG:

The Phenom 2 560, I gathered, has no L3 cache

[02:42:17]

wagnerrp:

all phenoms have L3 cache

[02:42:25]

wagnerrp:

thats what differentiates them from the Athlon IIs

[02:43:06]

wagnerrp:

more L2, no L3

[02:43:11]

wagnerrp:

and theyre generally a bit slower

[02:47:26]

GWG:

I might have misread the literature

[02:48:38]

Beirdo:

OK, got the HDPVR killer boards all ready to go, waiting for the relays

[02:49:26]

Beirdo:

might as well program em

[02:50:16]

GWG:

Beirdo, what is an HDPVR killer board?

[02:50:36]

Beirdo:

a board that kills the HDPVR on demand

[02:50:41]

Beirdo:

i.e. power cycles it

[02:52:15]

GWG:

Interesting

[02:52:19]

GWG:

How did you build that/

[02:55:37]

Beirdo:

ummm, made a circuit board.

[02:56:41]

wagnerrp:

lies, LIES!

[02:57:13]

Beirdo:

Of course, it does help go be an electrical engineer :)

[02:57:18]

GWG:

I'm not one

[02:57:31]

wagnerrp:

you designed the board, you had someone else make it

[02:57:48]

wagnerrp:

:P

[02:58:18]

Beirdo:

well, actual manufacture of the PCBs was done in Malaysia

[02:58:26]

Beirdo:

design and assembly by me

[02:58:43]

GWG:

what is the control interface?

[02:59:02]

wagnerrp:

when i think 'circuit board', i think the actual board, not including the soldered on components

[02:59:08]

wagnerrp:

is that incorrect?

[02:59:17]

[R]:

Beirdo: your insane

[02:59:28]

[R]:

Beirdo: in such small quantitties... isn't that expensive?

[02:59:29]

wagnerrp:

what did you end up doing for your relays?

[02:59:35]

GWG:

Everyone is insane in some way

[03:00:37]

Beirdo:

I ordered new ones from Mouser

[03:00:52]

Beirdo:

GWG: USB

[03:01:14]

Beirdo:

and no, it wasn't expensive. about $3/board for the first run

[03:01:53]

GWG:

Do you intend to market this?

[03:02:15]

wagnerrp:

jya: been using the mbuffer thing for zfs send/receive

[03:02:19]

wagnerrp:

works fantastic

[03:02:45]

Beirdo:

kind

[03:02:46]

jya:

wagnerrp: yes, the difference in speed is phenomenal.

[03:02:47]

Beirdo:

kinda

[03:02:50]

Beirdo:

anyways...

[03:03:21]

GWG:

Mine doesn't crash that often

[03:03:54]

jya:

wagnerrp: BTW, about UDF ; quickly gave up... write access is very buggy in linux.. couldn't write more than 120GB on the disk

[03:04:19]

jya:

reported a full file system at that point

[03:04:24]

wagnerrp:

heh

[03:05:06]

wagnerrp:

guess its back to FAT

[03:05:07]

Beirdo:

mine buggers up enough that I care. Other people have the same issue. I'm basically selling them pretty much at cost

[03:05:32]

wagnerrp:

shame, it had promise

[03:06:11]

jya:

wagnerrp: actually used NTFS instead ; write access was okay. And for some reasons with FAT32; I could run rsync ten times, and it would find files it didn't copy the previous times

[03:06:52]

jya:

I read that the posix section of ZFS is finally up and running in alpha version of the zfs drivers on linux

[03:06:55]

jya:

about time...

[03:07:13]

wagnerrp:

for some reason, ive just never trusted the ntfs3g drivers

[03:07:20]

wagnerrp:

zfs on linux would be interesting

[03:07:43]

wagnerrp:

right now im using JFS images for my iscsi-boot frontends

[03:07:51]

wagnerrp:

would be interesting to switch those to ZFS

[03:07:58]

wagnerrp:

and have the backend actually be able to manipulate them

[03:09:35]

jya:

wagnerrp: at work; using ZFS for all server file systems now... It's so nice to work with... snapshots is so amazing..

[03:10:26]

wagnerrp:

whenever i need to update my frontends

[03:10:31]

wagnerrp:

ive got a base image i update

[03:10:44]

wagnerrp:

snapshot, clone, copy a few KB of config files on top of each

[03:10:48]

wagnerrp:

and theyre ready to boot

[03:10:56]

jya:

I played with opensolaris for a few days ; each time you install something, the system automatically creates a snapshots. If you're doing a system update, it automatically add a snapshot entry on the grub boot loader; it's a breeze to revert

[03:11:12]

jya:

wagnerrp: you're snapshots are on freebsd right?

[03:11:17]

wagnerrp:

yeah

[03:11:17]

jya:

how is myth on freebsd ?

[03:11:22]

wagnerrp:

limited

[03:11:28]

wagnerrp:

the backend works just fine

[03:11:33]

wagnerrp:

but there is next to no tuner support

[03:11:44]

wagnerrp:

ive only got my HDHR on it currently

[03:11:45]

jya:

vdpau is in freebsd too right?

[03:11:52]

wagnerrp:

supposedly, never tried it

[03:12:44]

jya:

the only thing I'm fed up with freebsd; are the updates.. so painful when you're used to the binary updates of ubuntu... Can't wait to have an equivalent feature-set in linux

[03:12:54]

wagnerrp:

i tried getting my PVR-150s running a few months back

[03:13:02]

wagnerrp:

got the drivers loaded and running

[03:13:05]

wagnerrp:

can do manual captures

[03:13:19]

wagnerrp:

but theres something funky with the ioctls that mythtv isnt happy with

[03:13:20]

jya:

I tried using nexenta (solaris kernel, ubuntu user-base) but there's a long way to go for tit to becomes a proper alternative

[03:13:35]

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[03:13:58]

wagnerrp:

you can do binary packages in freebsd

[03:14:05]

wagnerrp:

but they only make the available for the release versions

[03:14:42]

jya:

I quickly gave up with the binary packages in FreeBSD.. If you ever installed something through the ports ; it breaks many things

[03:14:54]

wagnerrp:

what really bothers me is that ports cant handle an upgrade

[03:14:56]

jya:

depedencies are broken and are a pain to fix.

[03:15:15]

wagnerrp:

you have to manually uninstall something before you can update it

[03:15:31]

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[03:15:57]

wagnerrp:

gentoo really took he whole concept of the ports tree, and made it functional

[03:16:45]

jya:

yeah... I managed to lock myself out of the system last time.. Port default openssl is 1.x ; 8.2 is still 0.9.x ; so openldap got linked to 1.0 ; this broke the system because the base authentication plugin tried to load ldap ; conflicting ssl version -> crash

[03:17:25]

jya:

I found a post on how to change the versioning so there can't be any conflict between say openssl ports and base; but it's not easy to do.. plenty of patches

[03:17:49]

jya:

it's something ports do not handle well unfortunately.. conflicting version between ports and base

[03:18:25]

jya:

never played with gentoo

[03:18:27]

wagnerrp:

there are a handful of managers that try to improve on it

[03:18:50]

wagnerrp:

they parse the index file, and figure out what all needs to be done to install/upgrade

[03:18:58]

wagnerrp:

but theyre all painfully slow

[03:19:20]

wagnerrp:

the ports tree was never designed to operate in that manner

[03:20:19]

wagnerrp:

gentoo operates on the same basic premise as freebsd

[03:20:35]

wagnerrp:

but instead of having each port operate independently, and use make to do everything

[03:21:10]

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[03:21:11]

wagnerrp:

there is a helper application that scans the tree, and decides ahead of time what its going to do

[03:21:15]

jya:

I use portupgrade personally

[03:21:35]

jya:

how to make your machine unavailable for days...

[03:21:44]

jya:

portupgrade -r -R gnome3

[03:21:59]

wagnerrp:

since the files are designed in a language intended for such scanning, it happens much faster than something like portupgrade will manage

[03:22:07]

jya:

it will stop every 5 minutes asking you to check the default setttings.. so painful

[03:22:33]

wagnerrp:

ooh, and it determines all the settings at the beginning

[03:22:53]

wagnerrp:

i /really/ hate that with ports, where you have to do that config dialog as you come to each port

[03:23:46]

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[03:26:51]

wagnerrp:

jya: speaking of gnome3, do you know what the graphical requirements are?

[03:27:04]

wagnerrp:

is just opengl enough, or do you need some specific opengl features

[03:27:29]

jya:

yeah; unless you're in front of the machine .. it's awful.. So you start portupgrade ;you come back 30 minutes later finding waiting for a config

[03:27:56]

wagnerrp:

right, thats what portage (gentoo) does so much better

[03:28:01]

jya:

wagnerrp: no I haven't checked... I gave up trying to compile and restored from a previous snapshots

[03:28:19]

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[03:28:20]

wagnerrp:

the program goes out and makes all those decisions at the beginning

[03:28:46]

wagnerrp:

printing out what options will be used in the compile, letting you confirm, or break out to make changes

[03:28:51]

jya:

my server as a nvidia 9400GT card; and now that I've upgraded the kernel, the nvidia drivers doesn't load so I'm still in console text mode

[03:29:00]

wagnerrp:

and then the only time it bothers you again is if the compile fails

[03:29:24]

jya:

I don't think freebsd will ever go far in the user land for that exact reason...

[03:29:42]

jya:

I think the only thing saving FreeBSD from being forgotten at this stage is ZFS

[03:30:07]

jya:

still using freebsd on my network gateway

[03:31:11]

jya:

that NAT doesn't support stuff like sip, msn video etc... I've been wanting to migrate this box to linux for years.. Problem is that I'm so familiar with ipfw and use plenty of weird rules to forward ports, prioritise packes, use queues etc.. don't know how to do it in linux iptables

[03:33:15]

wagnerrp:

msn video puts IP addresses in the data packets?

[03:35:31]

wagnerrp:

i actually moved to PF about five years ago

[03:36:03]

jya:

wagnerrp: yes it does... natting anything udp with freebsd nat is hopeless..

[03:36:07]

wagnerrp:

never much liked the design of ipfw, where the 'config file' is just a script that calls a command to load a bunch of firewall rules

[03:36:18]

jya:

does pf includes its own nat system? all kernel based?

[03:36:44]

wagnerrp:

firewalling, nat, and queues

[03:36:57]

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[03:37:14]

jya:

and it supports things like SIP or anything requiring packet inspection?

[03:37:38]

wagnerrp:

it does support some forms of packet inspection

[03:37:42]

wagnerrp:

checking on sip...

[03:37:49]

jya:

maybe it would be easier for me to move to pf; than moving to linux for my gateway

[03:38:22]

jya:

I've written extensive scripts on that box to manage switching route according to the outside connection

[03:38:58]

jya:

this box is connected to one SHDSL link and two DSL2+ ; it directs the traffic accordingly, and monitor how the two DSL2+ line are going and switch accordingly

[03:39:52]

jya:

right now what I did is that the two DSL2+ are managed by two cisco modem (which supports SIP, Yahoo voice, MSN voice, etc..) ; and I use ipfw forward on the freebsd to redirect the traffic

[03:40:03]

jya:

this let me get around the lack of SIP support in natd

[03:40:23]

jya:

but I'd like to just have cheap dsl2+ modem in bridge mode; and do everything on the router...

[03:40:30]

wagnerrp:

i found this... http://www.bastard.net/~kos/pf-voip.html

[03:41:02]

wagnerrp:

but it refers to using STUN, which seems to be a mechanism implemented on SIP clients to allow them to discover the real IP address, and allow operation behind NATs

[03:42:16]

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[03:42:50]

wagnerrp:

you could also use something like siproxd

[03:43:44]

jya:

wagnerrp: yeah ; stuns just help a bit.. but configuring stuns on itself requires an engineering degree

[03:44:31]

jya:

wagnerrp: I've played with siproxd ; gave up quickly as it still only allow one device behind nat to work... On Linux things "just work"

[03:46:45]

wagnerrp:

well look at the bright side

[03:46:52]

wagnerrp:

you guys ran out of IP addresses months ago

[03:47:05]

wagnerrp:

so youll probably be the first to make a real effort at pushing out IPv6

[03:48:00]

Beirdo:

hehe

[03:53:48]

jya:

wagnerrp: I've been hearing about the running out of IPv4 addresses for at least 10 years..

[03:54:04]

jya:

IPv6 should have been compulsory a long time ago according to some

[03:54:29]

jya:

The way I see it; it's just like how we shouldn't be able to chat today, as it's May 22nd

[03:55:16]

wagnerrp:

jya: yeah, well it actually happened, APNIC has nothing left to give

[03:55:28]

wagnerrp:

its in the hands of the individual ISPs and resellers now

[03:56:00]

wagnerrp:

china has been burning through them pretty hard these last few years

[03:57:23]

wagnerrp:

either that, or theyre going to start NATing upstream

[03:57:34]

jya:

still plenty of ISPs wth lots..

[03:57:46]

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[03:57:50]

jya:

I have applied for 4 IP for my new server just last months

[03:57:58]

jya:

didn't even have to lodge a form

[03:58:30]

jya:

my ISP here in Oz; always require a diagram, network schema etc... justifying why I want some

[03:58:59]

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[03:59:02]

wagnerrp:

is it possible to retain the snapshot/clone relationship when sending?

[03:59:19]

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[04:00:20]

jya:

wagnerrp: when you send; you always send up to a particular snapshot

[04:00:32]

jya:

either all to the particular snapshot

[04:00:43]

jya:

or an incremental send, from one snapshot to another

[04:01:18]

wagnerrp:

right, but a new image cloned off another snapshot

[04:01:31]

wagnerrp:

no matter, its only a handful of 4GB images

[04:02:23]

jya:

ah... I haven't tried that

[04:02:40]

jya:

I don't think it should matter

[04:03:36]

jya:

the only thing I found annoying with zfs send; is if you send the root partition; you have to be very careful that all sub zfs partition contains the same tags

[04:03:42]

jya:

snapshots I mean

[04:03:54]

jya:

otherwise sending fail and you have to do zfs send one by one

[04:04:44]

jya:

I made a mistake a while ago by not doing a recursive snapshots, since I haven't been able to send the whole disks with a simple recursive send

[04:09:58]

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Beirdo:

OMG, now this is sweet

[05:14:13]

Beirdo:

I'm glad I decided to do at least ONE more album before bed

[05:14:37]

Beirdo:

Peter, Paul & Mary – In Concert

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rickchristie1:

hey all i need some help with the channel scan in australia

[07:23:18]

aarcane:

What's the current recommended way of using an H23 with mythtv backend ?

[07:23:30]

aarcane:

*H24 Directv Tuner

[07:34:42]

rickchristie1:

ca

[07:35:08]

rickchristie1:

can anyone help me with the channels.conf import error

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rickchristie1:

hi can any one help me with a channels.conf import

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[14:18:59]

adubz:

i do not have pulse audio installed on my system but i am trying to figure out how and why i keep getting a .pulse directory placed in my home directory after every reboot there is also a .pulse-cookie

[14:19:22]

adubz:

i know what happened i had installed a gnome app and it installed pulse so then i force removed everything the megabytes of removal was the same as install i also did apt-get autoremove

[14:20:06]

wagnerrp:

could be some application that intends to use pulseaudio

[14:31:06]

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[15:08:12]

NickHu:

Hey all

[15:08:31]

NickHu:

I was just wondering, is there any sort of featureful frontend that doesn't require a computer?

[15:08:38]

NickHu:

I was thinking games consoles etc.

[15:08:58]

NickHu:

Perhaps even DVD players, the minimal the better

[15:11:13]

lyricnz:

there is a web interface, but it's pretty basic

[15:11:22]

lyricnz:

and there are plugins for various embedded things

[15:11:37]

wagnerrp:

game consoles are computers

[15:11:45]

lyricnz:

like XBMC which could run on xbox, or appletv etc

[15:11:59]

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[15:12:15]

lyricnz:

sure they are technically, but consumers don't think of them like that

[15:13:44]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: I was expecting a less pedantic answer -.-

[15:13:50]

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[15:14:10]

NickHu:

lyricnz: Xbox could work... But softmods require you to install gamesaves and I don't have an action replay

[15:14:32]

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[15:15:41]

wagnerrp:

neither the xbox nor the appletv have enough power to be a worthwhile frontend

[15:16:09]

wagnerrp:

you can slot a crystalhd decoder into an appletv, but it still doesnt have enough memory for an HD frontend

[15:16:42]

NickHu:

I fail to see why there isn't a decent front end for Wii

[15:16:44]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: I don't have a HD capable tuner anyway

[15:16:44]

NickHu:

Also, what is an AppleTV? I've heard of it, but I'm unsure of what it does

[15:18:24]

NickHu:

Perhaps something like linux installed on a wii could work?

[15:20:15]

wagnerrp:

an appletv is a 1GHz PentiumM, nVidia 7300, and 256MB of memory

[15:20:39]

lyricnz:

appletv a media player thingy sold by apple. http://www.apple.com/appletv/

[15:21:10]

lyricnz:

need to jailbreak it to install xbmc, then install myth plugin for that. last time I looked, it didn't work that well.

[15:21:15]

wagnerrp:

note, im talking about the old one, not the new one

[15:21:23]

wagnerrp:

the new one is not currently usable by mythtv

[15:21:30]

lyricnz:

sure it is

[15:21:48]

lyricnz:

via xbmc

[15:21:49]

wagnerrp:

and is only usable by xbmc because someone spent a lot of time implementing an undocumented video decoder library for it

[15:21:57]

NickHu:

Wait, guys, is linux on a wii viable or not?

[15:23:19]

NickHu:

Or would a better option be Xbox? I also have an Xbox 360 as well

[15:23:33]

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[15:23:47]

undead_rat:

hey all.

[15:24:03]

** lyricnz shrugs. I use computers, and occasionally mythweb **

[15:24:34]

undead_rat:

i just got a tv-tuner card, and i'm running gentoo. Any ideas on how to configure a pctv 801e?

[15:24:35]

NickHu:

lyricnz: My computer is all out of video outs ;)

[15:24:49]

wagnerrp:

NickHu: when you say you have no HD tuners, that means youre using analog capture?

[15:24:53]

KathleenLePirate:

apparently it's been done: http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Wii-Linux

[15:25:11]

wagnerrp:

would those be framegrabbers, or IVTV cards?

[15:25:20]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: No, it means standard definition satellite tv

[15:25:22]

NickHu:

DVB-S1

[15:25:30]

wagnerrp:

dvb-s supports HD

[15:25:41]

NickHu:

KathleenLePirate: I know this, but is a Wii more powerful than an Xbox?

[15:25:49]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Not where I am

[15:26:20]

KathleenLePirate:

NickHu: not knowing the specs off hand, I would say the 360 is more powerful

[15:26:28]

KathleenLePirate:

probably by a lot

[15:26:34]

wagnerrp:

a Wii is a 950MHz PPC derivative, woefully inadequate for anything HD, probably inadequate for SD H264

[15:26:57]

NickHu:

KathleenLePirate: I'm talking about the first gen Xbox, I can't get into a hacked 360

[15:27:57]

KathleenLePirate:

yeck, neither would be very good

[15:29:01]

lyricnz:

if you just want playback (and not the record/manage UI), then many media players should be able to play content via upnp

[15:29:06]

NickHu:

But which one is *least shit*

[15:29:14]

lyricnz:

including xbox360, ps3, appletv, popcorn hour, etc

[15:29:32]

NickHu:

Hmm...

[15:29:40]

KathleenLePirate:

appletv does standard upnp?

[15:29:53]

wagnerrp:

the 360 has some screwy UPnP limitations that cause problems with mythtv

[15:29:56]

NickHu:

Well, what I want is the ability to watch live TV, and also commercial skipping

[15:30:07]

NickHu:

And that isn't in UPnP AFAIK

[15:30:12]

KathleenLePirate:

nope

[15:30:24]

NickHu:

I'm also thinking about the *lightweightedness* of the frontend system

[15:30:36]

NickHu:

Wii is near silent, uses not a lot of power, and is quite small

[15:31:30]

NickHu:

Actually, seeing as my backend system is like a meter away from my TV

[15:31:44]

NickHu:

Perhaps some sort of USB -> Scart device would be viable

[15:32:06]

NickHu:

And I could run a seperate X server on my TV for the myth frontend

[15:32:43]

KathleenLePirate:

Why not just use tour backend then?

[15:32:47]

KathleenLePirate:

*your

[15:32:59]

NickHu:

I have no more video outs on my card

[15:33:23]

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[15:33:38]

sailerboy:

hey

[15:33:46]

sailerboy:

i have an MCE remote

[15:33:56]

sailerboy:

and it was working fine, but the button mapings were off

[15:34:11]

sailerboy:

so i fixed them, then had to restart the computer for an update

[15:34:18]

sailerboy:

and now my /dev/lirc0 disappeared

[15:35:06]

KathleenLePirate:

NickHu: then maybe your cheapest, easiest, best looking solution is to get one of those switches – I forget what they're called

[15:35:19]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, you either have the worst luck, or you do bad things when messing with your system

[15:35:24]

sailerboy:

lol

[15:35:33]

tgm4883:

how did you try to fix your button mappings?

[15:35:36]

earthnative:

NickHu: I think the Wii is slightly more powerful than an original Xbox, but original Xbox is very well supported. I doubt there is software out there for the Wii that would do better

[15:35:41]

sailerboy:

i edited the lirc.conf

[15:35:58]

NickHu:

KathleenLePirate: Switches..?

[15:37:25]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, which one

[15:37:27]

NickHu:

+ I use two monitors, the card has two outputs. I want mythtv on my tv :')

[15:37:30]

sailerboy:

idk

[15:37:33]

sailerboy:

i've deleted it

[15:37:35]

sailerboy:

uninstalled lirc

[15:37:37]

sailerboy:

reinstalled lirc

[15:37:49]

sailerboy:

over and over

[15:37:51]

NickHu:

Start lirc daemon?

[15:37:52]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, I can't help yo9u

[15:38:00]

sailerboy:

NickHu, tried that

[15:38:04]

sailerboy:

irw won't show anything

[15:38:08]

sailerboy:

and theres no /dev/lirc0

[15:38:13]

sailerboy:

just a /dev/lircd

[15:38:17]

NickHu:

I've never used lirc before, I'm just stabbing in the dark

[15:38:47]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, so lets back up a step. What was wrong with your button mappings?

[15:39:34]

KathleenLePirate:

NickHu: a monitor switch box – you'd be sacrificing a monitor when watching on your TV, but you can get them in DVI or VGA + then convert

[15:39:56]

NickHu:

KathleenLePirate: Yeah, I don't want to do that :P

[15:40:05]

KathleenLePirate:

haha, ok

[15:40:31]

NickHu:

I guess Wii + UPnP would do fine

[15:40:46]

NickHu:

And I could control it from my computer, seeing as it's under a meter away xD

[15:41:03]

NickHu:

Any problems with that?

[15:41:06]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, the play button was mapped to the ok button, the number buttons did a couple of weird things when not in playback mode

[15:41:09]

sailerboy:

i just wanted to change them

[15:41:21]

wagnerrp:

cant you just buy a video card with more outputs?

[15:41:31]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Yeah, sure, MONEY PLEEZ

[15:41:38]

wagnerrp:

chances are it would be cheaper than any external device, and far more useful

[15:41:52]

NickHu:

I already own a wii

[15:42:01]

NickHu:

I don't own another graphics card :P

[15:42:06]

NickHu:

= Not cheaper

[15:42:15]

NickHu:

I swear you guys must be rich :')

[15:42:19]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, not everyone has money enough to buy graphcis cards

[15:42:20]

KathleenLePirate:

but significantly better

[15:42:23]

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[15:42:25]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, so your issue is they did weird things when in playback mode, and your answer was to mess around with config files

[15:42:26]

sailerboy:

NickHu, i went through this yesterday

[15:42:26]

NickHu:

Turning on your computers every time you want to watch TV

[15:42:40]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, right now that's not my issue

[15:42:40]

NickHu:

xD

[15:42:42]

sailerboy:

but yes, it was

[15:42:50]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, so i'm going to say this one time

[15:42:52]

wagnerrp:

if your wii is a meter away from your computer, then youre already sitting at your desk

[15:42:55]

NickHu:

sailerboy: I guess the solution is, BUY BETTER MORE EXPENSIVE STUFF

[15:42:55]

sailerboy:

i've deleted the config files and restore them

[15:42:59]

sailerboy:

lol

[15:43:00]

sailerboy:

it is

[15:43:01]

wagnerrp:

if youre sitting at your desk, chances are your computer is on

[15:43:01]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Yep

[15:43:05]

NickHu:

Yep

[15:43:13]

wagnerrp:

and by 'expensive stuff' a second video card is $25

[15:43:14]

KathleenLePirate:

if you're using the backend...your computer is on

[15:43:23]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Orly?

[15:43:38]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, assuming the computer supports it

[15:43:38]

wagnerrp:

going price for a GT210 on newegg

[15:43:48]

sailerboy:

some computers don't have more than one PCI-E

[15:43:48]

NickHu:

KathleenLePirate: I'm refering to people who have a computer on dedicated to being used as a front end, and then plugged into a tv

[15:43:54]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, based on the number of issues you have had and what you have done to fix them, reinstall the system. If you run into any issues come here and ask about them. If you remove anything or manually edit config files before coming to IRC for help I'll ban you from the mythbuntu channel

[15:44:03]

NickHu:

sailerboy: My computer is awesome

[15:44:17]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i restored them

[15:44:30]

NickHu:

*sigh* I guess I'll need a new power supply

[15:44:35]

tgm4883:

Seriously, you can edit key configs in the frontend

[15:44:44]

sailerboy:

ok, i'm sorry

[15:44:49]

sailerboy:

but after i had edited the config files

[15:44:50]

sailerboy:

i restored them

[15:44:52]

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[15:44:58]

wagnerrp:

sailerboy: in which case cards with three outputs start around $75

[15:45:11]

tgm4883:

you don't know enough about mythtv to start editing things willy nilly

[15:45:14]

NickHu:

Running an i7 + 16GB ram + Asus P8P67 Deluxe Mobo + Nvidia GTS 250 on 650 watts is like on the edge isn't it?

[15:45:14]

wagnerrp:

assuming NickHu didnt already have a Wii, UPnP players start around $100

[15:45:21]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i restored the origional config files

[15:45:22]

KathleenLePirate:

mythtv

[15:45:25]

KathleenLePirate:

oops...

[15:45:34]

sailerboy:

NickHu, meh

[15:45:39]

sailerboy:

you can fit a few more things

[15:45:45]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, you also reinstalled lirc a few times. And lets not forget about the magic you did to the database

[15:45:54]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: If I buy a cheap-ass card, can I use it as dedicated physics, and use the output as myth frontend?

[15:46:00]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i didn't do anything to the database

[15:46:01]

NickHu:

sailerboy: Exactly

[15:46:13]

sailerboy:

it booted up like htat

[15:46:13]

sailerboy:

that

[15:46:19]

wagnerrp:

NickHu: not at the same time, but likely yes

[15:46:22]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, was there a different sailerboy on here yesterday having database issues?

[15:46:48]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: How do I go about doing that...? SLI?

[15:46:53]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i was having database issues

[15:46:56]

wagnerrp:

dont know, never used SLI

[15:47:01]

sailerboy:

but i didn't even touch the database

[15:47:03]

sailerboy:

until you told me

[15:48:27]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, well I don't have time to sit here today and walk you through fixing the lirc issue. I've heard from lots of people that say how easy Mythbuntu is to get up and running. I can count the number of people on my right hand that have as many issues as you have had

[15:48:27]

NickHu:

To use more than one video card you need SLI or Crossfire though don't you?

[15:48:46]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, how the hell is it my fault?

[15:48:51]

sailerboy:

i concede about the ATI cards

[15:49:02]

sailerboy:

but the MCE is supposed to be really well supported (the remote)

[15:49:04]

tgm4883:

NickHu, IIRC that is for gaming and such. If you want to spread the processing across multiple cards

[15:49:11]

sailerboy:

i have a pretty well supported tv tuner

[15:49:11]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, I have an MCE and it works fine

[15:49:17]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, tell me how it is my fault

[15:49:30]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, when did i say it was your fault?

[15:49:39]

tgm4883:

when did I say it was yours?

[15:49:58]

tgm4883:

I told you to reinstall, and that I don't have time today to walk you through fixing the issues you have

[15:50:03]

tgm4883:

and that the issues you have are not normal

[15:50:13]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, fine...

[15:50:31]

NickHu:

tgm4883: Ah, I see

[15:50:33]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, you can try getting someone to help you in #ubuntu

[15:50:48]

tgm4883:

NickHu, thats just a guess, but IIRC that is what those are for

[15:50:55]

NickHu:

But... Here the phrase "might as well" comes into play

[15:50:56]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, or in #ubuntu-mythtv

[15:51:04]

NickHu:

You "might as well" put them in SLI amirite?

[15:52:15]

NickHu:

OH WOW, I can fit more PCI cards than I thought, this calculator tells me 350w for my current system

[15:52:38]

NickHu:

I guess components have got more energy efficient over the years :')

[15:52:41]

wagnerrp:

NickHu: if you use sli, the video outputs on the additional cards are disabled

[15:52:59]

wagnerrp:

i dont believe using an additional card as a physics processor constitutes SLI

[15:53:01]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Ahh, that's not good :/

[15:53:08]

wagnerrp:

since the cards are not linked in any manner

[15:53:25]

NickHu:

By the way, if I have a dedicated physics card

[15:53:34]

NickHu:

Does that mean if it is totally maxed

[15:53:40]

NickHu:

My primary card won't come in to help?

[15:53:49]

NickHu:

Or is it like a buffer

[15:54:07]

wagnerrp:

i dont know

[15:54:12]

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[15:56:27]

NickHu:

GT520 is very cheap indeed

[15:56:28]

NickHu:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/1gb-msi-gt-520 . . . -dl-dvi-hdmi

[15:57:15]

wagnerrp:

i would check and make sure you dont need to keep within the same card series

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NickHu:

Hmm.. Also, how am I meant to decide which one should be my main one?

[16:02:29]

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NickHu:

Okay, #nvidia is pretty ghost-town

[16:06:40]

pladijs:

When using opengl for the GUI, my screen is not updated when entering some menus. if do a xrefresh everything works perfectly again

[16:07:41]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, you said if i asked for more help in #ubuntu-mythtv, you'd ban me

[16:07:44]

pladijs:

slightly different when using opengl for rendering movies: if i exit the playback, the screen freezes displaying the last frame. But the frontend is actually running fine behind the non-updated screen. Again: after doing xrefresh, everything is fine again

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[16:19:21]

wagnerrp:

it took me a second to understand what they were doing here... http://gizmodo.com/5804352

[16:19:46]

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[16:22:46]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: As it turns out, in order to add video outputs with additional cards, they actually need to be of different chipsets, not the same one

[16:23:19]

wagnerrp:

not at all true

[16:23:30]

wagnerrp:

you just have to run not-SLI

[16:23:33]

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[16:24:11]

NickHu:

Well the nvidia website says they need to be of different chipsets

[16:24:19]

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[16:24:29]

wagnerrp:

got a link?

[16:24:37]

NickHu:

Erm, hang on

[16:25:56]

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[16:27:19]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, if i were to get a video card

[16:27:26]

sailerboy:

what would the best cheapest one be?

[16:27:32]

wagnerrp:

well at the very least, i know i ran two 8400s in windows on my desktop to drive three monitors

[16:27:54]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: I read wrong, my bad

[16:28:10]

sailerboy:

gt 210?

[16:28:13]

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[16:29:04]

wagnerrp:

http://www.newegg.com/Special/ShellShocker.as . . . 5-_-05222011

[16:29:06]

wagnerrp:

$15

[16:29:12]

wagnerrp:

and fanless

[16:29:29]

NickHu:

Fanless is a bad thing isn't it?

[16:29:42]

wagnerrp:

why?

[16:30:01]

NickHu:

Because when it overheats you're scr00d

[16:30:24]

wagnerrp:

presumably, a fanless card would have sufficient heatsink that it doesnt overheat

[16:30:36]

sailerboy:

does it support audio-out via hdmi?

[16:30:42]

NickHu:

sailerboy: No

[16:30:46]

wagnerrp:

yes

[16:30:53]

sailerboy:

which one?

[16:30:54]

sailerboy:

lol

[16:30:54]

NickHu:

:P

[16:31:02]

NickHu:

I dunno, I just guessed :'3

[16:31:19]

sailerboy:

i know the ati cards had a dedicated sound card on the graphics card

[16:31:24]

wagnerrp:

the GT series all have onboard HDA devices like your existing ATI card

[16:31:29]

sailerboy:

what about nvidia?

[16:31:30]

sailerboy:

ah

[16:31:31]

sailerboy:

ok

[16:31:52]

wagnerrp:

the 210 supports passthrough AC3 and DTS

[16:32:05]

wagnerrp:

if you want HD audio for use with bluray, youll need a 430

[16:32:19]

sailerboy:

so without a 430, i can't play blu-ray?

[16:32:33]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: All of the GT series..? xD I presume you mean only the ones with HDMI out

[16:32:46]

wagnerrp:

you can play it, you just cannot pass through the HD audio streams on the disk

[16:33:02]

wagnerrp:

you have to downmix in software, or use the lower quality versions (also on the disk)

[16:33:51]

wagnerrp:

i bet you could stream audio through DVI too

[16:35:16]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, i don't really care about hd audio streams

[16:35:25]

sailerboy:

but as long as i can play blu-ray, that's fine

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[17:29:27]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, i ordered the card

[17:32:21]

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[17:32:42]

sailerboy:

gt 210 right?

[17:33:04]

wagnerrp:

should work fine

[17:33:38]

sailerboy:

i'm holding you to this lol

[17:34:24]

wagnerrp:

id say 95% of myth users are running nvidia cards

[17:35:10]

schaze:

hey guys, I am struggling a bit with the mythtv python api (0.24+fixes) – I am trying listen to any events coming from the backend, in the 0.23 api I did this with a modified MythBEConn class which adds the 1 at the end of the ANNounce.

[17:35:20]

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[17:35:56]

schaze:

for 0.24 I looked into the MythSystemEvent class but I it seems to have a bug

[17:36:50]

wagnerrp:

that would be the BEEvent class?

[17:37:19]

wagnerrp:

or more likely depending on what youre doing, the MythBE class

[17:38:05]

wagnerrp:

the MythSystemEvent class is specifically designed for system events

[17:38:08]

wagnerrp:

not just generic events

[17:38:39]

schaze:

Ok, so I best subclass BEEvent in this case I guess

[17:38:42]

wagnerrp:

System events being the handful of events sent once per machine, intended to trigger a command pre-defined in the database

[17:39:02]

wagnerrp:

best just subclass MythBE

[17:39:39]

schaze:

ok, I'll try this and see how much of my old class I can reuse

[17:39:54]

schaze:

thanks!

[17:40:03]

wagnerrp:

add new methods to the subclass, and then override the _listhandlers method with the names of the methods you want to use

[17:40:51]

wagnerrp:

the methods shuld take a single 'event' named input

[17:41:09]

wagnerrp:

when run, the event string will be passed through that argument

[17:41:27]

wagnerrp:

if that argument is none, the method should return a regular expression defining what events it wants to receive

[17:41:48]

wagnerrp:

see the BEEventMonitor class as an example

[17:41:55]

schaze:

ahh, now I understand

[17:42:12]

wagnerrp:

https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/blob/master/ . . . heap.py#L381

[17:42:22]

schaze:

was already wondering about this in the MythSystemEvent and BEEventMonitor

[17:42:52]

wagnerrp:

MythSystemEvent is a special class that should only be used on machines not running a frontend/backend/jobqueue

[17:43:03]

wagnerrp:

BEEventMonitor is an example and debugging class

[17:43:08]

wagnerrp:

showing how to use the event system

[17:43:13]

wagnerrp:

and printing all inbound events to the terminal

[17:45:01]

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[17:45:39]

wagnerrp:

depending on what you need it for, theres also an EventLock class that will listen for a given regular expression, and unlock when received

[17:46:15]

wagnerrp:

thats used on a handful of backend commands that return immediately, and then send an event when complete

[17:46:54]

schaze:

I think I will be fine subclassing BEEvent as I only will pull the events out there and push them in my own event framework

[17:47:15]

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[17:48:02]

schaze:

since I will get the Event string from the backend this will be a peace of cake to implement as my event system already parses this string anyways

[17:48:08]

schaze:

perfect!

[17:48:11]

schaze:

:)

[17:49:42]

wagnerrp:

just a heads up, there is a currently unresolved issue in the event loop, where the backend sends a partial thumbnail generation event, causing the loop to fail

[17:49:51]

wagnerrp:

ive not yet had the time to track it down

[17:50:20]

schaze:

one other question while you are on the line, with 0.23 I had quite some problems with the cache connections when the backend has been restarted while the python program was running I could not cleanly reconnect to the backend

[17:50:43]

schaze:

is there a possibility for this now – or was there one then and I only did not know?

[17:50:54]

schaze:

thanks for the headsup with the issue

[17:51:10]

wagnerrp:

and to be honest, the whole socket code is a big overly complicated mess that needs rewriting

[17:51:34]

wagnerrp:

the cache connections should be reconnecting, and sometimes they do

[17:51:40]

wagnerrp:

not sure what causes the screw up

[17:51:53]

wagnerrp:

probably related to why the event loop isnt recovering from the incomplete response

[17:52:40]

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[17:55:03]

sailerboy:

all right

[17:55:06]

sailerboy:

i got mythtv all set up

[17:55:08]

sailerboy:

on my own

[17:55:11]

sailerboy:

without asking anyone for help

[17:55:15]

sailerboy:

people proud?

[17:55:16]

sailerboy:

lol

[17:55:36]

sailerboy:

so anyone have a mce remote?

[17:55:46]

sailerboy:

and understands how to do the learning feautre for the power and volume switches?

[17:56:34]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i know you said not to bother you, but this is not something i screwed up

[17:56:37]

sailerboy:

lol

[17:56:41]

sailerboy:

it's pretty simple

[17:56:45]

sailerboy:

but i can't find the dvd menu button on the mce remote

[17:56:50]

schaze:

I am stopping the backend when putting the server to suspend and starting it again afterwards, the cached connections never ever reconnected so far. Is there a way to check the connection and force a manual reconnect somehow?

[18:02:28]

schaze:

Ah works like a charm! Thanks a lot wagnerrp!

[18:04:30]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, i'm having a tiny bit of trouble with the sound

[18:04:32]

sailerboy:

it works fine in speaker-test

[18:04:32]

sailerboy:

but i can't seem to get it to work in mythtv

[18:05:40]

wagnerrp:

schaze: you can go into the inner workings of the class to force a reconnect

[18:06:01]

wagnerrp:

or you can delete all MythBE/BECache instances, and let it restart on its own

[18:06:40]

wagnerrp:

basically, that whole group of classes is built on the incorrect requirement that commands and events occur on the same socket

[18:06:56]

wagnerrp:

make the connections one way, and about a third of that code falls out

[18:07:04]

wagnerrp:

and it becomes far more robust

[18:07:47]

wagnerrp:

sailerboy: you arent by any chance using pulseaudio are you?

[18:08:11]

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[18:08:13]

schaze:

I tried deleting all the cached connections but I never got it to work properly

[18:08:17]

sailerboy:

no

[18:08:18]

sailerboy:

alsa

[18:08:20]

sailerboy:

it worked fine before

[18:08:23]

sailerboy:

lemme try one more thing

[18:08:35]

sailerboy:

i also discovered that if you draw the menu using opengl with the ati card, you can't get into the settingw

[18:08:37]

sailerboy:

settings

[18:08:42]

sailerboy:

any tips?

[18:08:43]

sailerboy:

LOL

[18:09:00]

sailerboy:

can i just purge all the settings easily?

[18:09:09]

wagnerrp:

-O ThemePainter=qt

[18:09:19]

pladijs:

this failure of the frontend to repaint itself is driving me nuts. This is using 0.24-fixes, using an ati radeon hd 6450. I've reset the gui painter to QT, The only problem now is that the frontend does not repaint itself when exiting the video player (which uses opengl)

[18:09:41]

sailerboy:

ah

[18:11:00]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, cool

[18:11:03]

sailerboy:

ok, so what i did

[18:11:11]

sailerboy:

was i set up my hdmi sound card as my default card

[18:11:18]

sailerboy:

then i set the audio output to ALSA:default

[18:11:24]

sailerboy:

which worked for me last time

[18:11:27]

sailerboy:

on the fucked up computer

[18:11:33]

wagnerrp:

honestly, i know next to nothing about the audio stuff

[18:11:39]

wagnerrp:

and watch the language in this channel

[18:11:39]

sailerboy:

ok

[18:11:45]

sailerboy:

sorry :(

[18:12:10]

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[18:12:58]

pladijs:

... or is it a problem of focus in the WM

[18:13:10]

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[18:14:40]

pladijs:

this is on openbox

[18:17:16]

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[18:20:31]

pladijs:

same problem with fvwm2. could this be an mplayer issue? what player does mytthv use?

[18:20:54]

wagnerrp:

mythtv

[18:21:58]

pladijs:

pardon

[18:22:16]

wagnerrp:

mythtv uses... mythtv to play video

[18:22:20]

wagnerrp:

it does not use an external player

[18:22:53]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Out of interest, what would happen if you launched mythtv in a seperate x server with no window manager?

[18:23:15]

wagnerrp:

you will still run into focus problems in some places in mythtv

[18:23:17]

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[18:23:43]

wagnerrp:

when a window manager consumes all of a couple hundred KB of memory, there is no sense not using one

[18:24:39]

NickHu:

So... OpenBox?

[18:25:18]

wagnerrp:

openbox, blackbox, fluxbox, fvwm, xfce, ratpoison, evilwm, enlighenment, the list goes on

[18:25:21]

wagnerrp:

plenty of options

[18:25:36]

sailerboy:

NickHu, for ease of setup,xfce and lxde are the best

[18:25:36]

pladijs:

how can i tell what the problem is when mythtv just freezes on the last frame of a movie when exiting. is it a repaint problem? a problem of focus?

[18:25:41]

sailerboy:

lxde is the best imho

[18:25:48]

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[18:25:48]

sailerboy:

since it's based off of openbox

[18:25:48]

NickHu:

sailerboy: I use xmonad

[18:25:53]

sailerboy:

sure

[18:25:56]

sailerboy:

go ahead

[18:26:08]

NickHu:

But if I'm gonna have a x server exclusively for the TV

[18:26:15]

wagnerrp:

of course things like evilwm and ratpoison have no setup, as they have no GUI to speak of

[18:26:16]

NickHu:

No point in having an extravagant window manager

[18:26:20]

pladijs:

alt-tab does not work anymore after the freeze. But when i go to vt1, and back to vt7, the menu is back again

[18:26:29]

wagnerrp:

just keyboard shortcuts

[18:26:54]

NickHu:

Actually, is it even possible to have two different x servers on display on different monitors?

[18:27:02]

sailerboy:

sure

[18:27:03]

sailerboy:

why not?

[18:27:20]

NickHu:

Never bothered dabbling in it

[18:27:33]

pladijs:

NickHu: i had lots of trouble trying to get that done with gdm

[18:27:44]

wagnerrp:

you may have problems running two X servers simultaneously from a single card, but i believe that is even possible now

[18:27:49]

wagnerrp:

its certainly possible with multiple cards

[18:28:09]

NickHu:

Oh it's simple to run two X servers

[18:28:20]

NickHu:

Just I never thought about getting them to display simultaneuously

[18:29:25]

pladijs:

how do i proceed to attach a projector? Do i need to run two x servers?

[18:29:53]

NickHu:

Nah, they should both have the same image

[18:30:06]

NickHu:

(Assuming you're using a laptop)

[18:30:53]

pladijs:

it's on a desktop. The projector resolution is way lower than my regular monitor.

[18:31:19]

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[18:31:21]

pladijs:

I have two outputs, DVI-D and displayport.

[18:31:42]

NickHu:

Well it'll either detect it as two displays

[18:31:52]

NickHu:

Or mirror one on the other

[18:31:59]

NickHu:

Depending on Xorg.conf

[18:32:21]

NickHu:

You don't need a second X server

[18:33:14]

pladijs:

NickHu: i don't have the projector here for another few days, so if you write it depends on some detection, i'll wait till i can attach it before asking more. But thanks for pointing out i do not need to run two X servers.

[18:38:29]

pladijs:

ah, i fixed my repaint-issue: changed on of the "screen settings" in "appearance". "use fixed window size" i think

[18:38:45]

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[18:38:54]

pladijs:

or was it disabling "use gui size for tv playback"

[18:40:22]

pladijs:

is there a way to store the current settings? I have messed around quite a bit with the config. My plan is not to update to 0.25 too fast, but rather stick with 0.24 and restart my config from a saved state if something goes wrong.

[18:42:17]

pladijs:

is it safe to copy the mytchconverg table and recopy it when things go wrong; or are the differences between updates too large for that – even within 0.24-fixes?

[18:42:34]

wagnerrp:

pladijs: all data is stored in the database

[18:42:40]

wagnerrp:

in order to revert, you must revert the database

[18:42:49]

wagnerrp:

it is never considered 'safe' to copy database tables

[18:42:58]

wagnerrp:

use the backup/import utility

[18:44:02]

pladijs:

i see, i'm reading the wiki now, thanks for the pointer

[18:44:06]

wagnerrp:

do note, that means you have to revert /everything/

[18:44:16]

wagnerrp:

recovering the database is an all or nothing affair

[18:44:21]

wagnerrp:

recordings included

[18:44:42]

wagnerrp:

you would not be able to record something on 0.25, and then take it back with you to 0.24

[18:45:42]

pladijs:

I see. with myth, is there any chance 0.24 will become very stable at some point, or do i constantly upgrade to get fixes for real problems, but get new problems alongside?

[18:45:59]

wagnerrp:

0.24 should be considered stable

[18:46:02]

wagnerrp:

and for most users, it is

[18:46:52]

wagnerrp:

aside from the redraw issue (which is more an ATI issue than a myth one), what other stability issues were you having?

[18:48:10]

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[18:48:33]

pladijs:

I got segfault after segfault trying to run two x servers alongside (using kdm). gave up on that though, so that's ok now. mythmusic sometimes crashes (using the search function) now, mythwelcome also has some repaint issues (sometimes its just invisible).

[18:48:46]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, know anything about subtitles?

[18:49:20]

pladijs:

it's not too bad, but i would have thought simple things like mythwelcome would work perfectly by now, given how long they have been around and how simple a task they perform.

[18:49:21]

wagnerrp:

pladijs: trying to run two X servers side-by-side simultaneously on the same card

[18:49:27]

wagnerrp:

youre probably running into resource issues

[18:49:59]

wagnerrp:

simple things like mythwelcome are not used by the majority of devs and users, and IMHO should not exist in the first place

[18:50:05]

pladijs:

it's on an i5 with 4GB of ram, with an ati HD 6450.

[18:50:17]

wagnerrp:

as for mythmusic, file a ticket with a backtrace

[18:50:27]

pladijs:

i really find mythwelcome quite handy for my particular situation (long story).

[18:50:48]

wagnerrp:

pladijs: that ATI card is going to have limited resources that may only allow a single server to operate at a time

[18:51:03]

sailerboy:

ah

[18:51:03]

sailerboy:

ati

[18:51:05]

sailerboy:

and a 6450

[18:51:10]

wagnerrp:

the same can be said about nvidia and intel cards

[18:51:13]

sailerboy:

i'm having enough trouble with my 4550

[18:51:13]

pladijs:

but i was running two x servers on my 486

[18:51:15]

sailerboy:

lol

[18:51:23]

wagnerrp:

you can run two X servers on two different cards just fine

[18:51:24]

sailerboy:

on your 486?

[18:51:26]

sailerboy:

wow...

[18:51:32]

sailerboy:

/awe

[18:51:43]

wagnerrp:

but most descriptions ive seen about running multiple x servers on a single card

[18:51:49]

wagnerrp:

involve running a single server to manage the card

[18:52:01]

wagnerrp:

and then running a pair of nested x servers within that managing server

[18:52:23]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, is there any reason that closed captioning would work yesterday

[18:52:27]

sailerboy:

but not today?

[18:52:37]

wagnerrp:

no clue, done use closed captioning

[18:53:07]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, would it be in the logs anywhere?

[18:53:07]

wagnerrp:

rather, /i/ dont use closed captioning

[18:53:12]

pladijs:

i liked the 6450 because of passive cooling. it's a Dell so i didn't have too many options there. i have a combined back-frontend. what's a good passive card to to that?

[18:53:13]

wagnerrp:

not that you shouldnt

[18:54:16]

wagnerrp:

plenty of low end nvidias with passive cooling

[18:54:22]

wagnerrp:

ive got three of them

[18:54:47]

wagnerrp:

ATI is fine for desktop use on Linux

[18:55:11]

wagnerrp:

but if you intend to do anything graphically intensive, even integrated Intel is better than ATI until they get their drivers in order

[18:55:51]

sailerboy:

wagnerrp, they have been making some pretty nice advances

[18:56:01]

sailerboy:

wine is now usable with an ati card

[18:56:14]

sailerboy:

not amazing

[18:56:16]

sailerboy:

but it works

[18:56:34]

wagnerrp:

i will admit, they have been getting better over the years

[18:56:39]

wagnerrp:

but they have a /lot/ to make up for

[18:56:59]

pladijs:

but after lots of hassle i got this ati to run at 2560x1440. after tweaks such as reported in http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux . . . hers-786335/ i got rid of any tearing.

[18:57:36]

pladijs:

so besides this having been quite a bit of work to setup: would i gain anything from changing the card?

[18:57:49]

wagnerrp:

hardware decoding?

[18:58:21]

pladijs:

i believe so, but i never saw the cpu go up significantly.

[18:58:42]

wagnerrp:

no, i mean mythtv doesnt support hardware decoding on ATI hardware

[18:58:53]

wagnerrp:

for that matter, ATI barely does themselves

[19:00:00]

sailerboy:

how the heck does closed captioning work yesterday

[19:00:03]

sailerboy:

on a screwed up system

[19:00:04]

pladijs:

wagnerrp: but would i notice any of this when watching movies (as compared to gaming)

[19:00:07]

sailerboy:

but on a perfect system

[19:00:08]

sailerboy:

it doesnt

[19:00:10]

sailerboy:

:(

[19:00:25]

wagnerrp:

depends on what they are

[19:00:33]

wagnerrp:

dvd, wouldnt make a difference

[19:00:45]

wagnerrp:

bluray, it would go from full load on two cores, to no load

[19:00:46]

sailerboy:

tv, heh...

[19:02:24]

pladijs:

last question: is there a logfile where i could trace how the card is doing? where framedrops are mentioned etc?

[19:05:12]

pladijs:

ah, got it

[19:07:39]

pladijs:

i'm mainly watching ripped things from a HDD

[19:08:28]

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[19:11:39]

pladijs:

sailerboy: could you share your playback settings? do you use opengl? what decoder and renderer? do any of the ATI users here use vaapi? is it worth looking into?

[19:12:05]

sailerboy:

pladijs, i use the slim preset

[19:12:20]

sailerboy:

opengl for menu settings cause bugs

[19:12:34]

sailerboy:

my playback settings are probably not very optimized but um

[19:13:43]

sailerboy:

just really default

[19:13:57]

sailerboy:

once i get subtitles working

[19:14:04]

sailerboy:

i'll probably play with it a bit more

[19:14:36]

wagnerrp:

pladijs: mythtv does not support vaapi at present

[19:14:45]

pladijs:

these slim presets are not working at all for me. i went with the advice on the link i pasted above.

[19:15:26]

sailerboy:

really?

[19:16:14]

wagnerrp:

you should be using the standard decoder (ffmpeg) with the xv-blit video renderer

[19:16:21]

wagnerrp:

or if you can get it stable, the opengl renderer

[19:16:23]

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[19:16:56]

pladijs:

wagnerrp: i read here http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/VAAPI that i can get it from trunc, also for ati (if i get this right, that is). but my question than still is: would it be worth the trouble?

[19:17:54]

wagnerrp:

pladijs: no, a year ago, our main video playback guy tried to get VAAPI working in trunk

[19:18:16]

wagnerrp:

it worked great with nvidia hardware, but since it only provided a subset of those features through VDPAU, there was no purpose

[19:18:23]

pladijs:

sailerboy: i don't know too much about those settings, maybe i did something peculiar. but i'm playing a 1080p movie here with the slim presets on my config. And it looks way worse than what i had before. don't know that will apply to you

[19:18:38]

wagnerrp:

it worked decently with intel hardware, but there were still some hiccups in the drivers that meant it was not yet production grade

[19:18:42]

pladijs:

wagnerrp: thanks a bunch for saving me hours of worthless tries to get this to work than

[19:18:58]

wagnerrp:

it didnt work at all with ATI hardware, due to lousy, unstable drivers

[19:19:14]

wagnerrp:

since then, those patches have rotted, and no longer function against current trunk

[19:19:45]

wagnerrp:

now a year later, the driver situation may have changed

[19:19:55]

sailerboy:

pladijs, i have no idea aobut 1080p

[19:19:57]

wagnerrp:

but theres plenty of other stuff hes been working on instead

[19:20:54]

sailerboy:

why won't closed captioing work?

[19:21:06]

sailerboy:

:(

[19:21:25]

pladijs:

those irrelevant wiki pages and other documentation floating around are really really confusing for the non informed user

[19:22:07]

wagnerrp:

"This interface is not currently supported by MythTV'

[19:22:14]

wagnerrp:

seems pretty straight forward to me

[19:22:40]

wagnerrp:

one of only four sentences on that page

[19:23:14]

pladijs:

i don't read that on the link above

[19:23:56]

wagnerrp:

bleh... probably wiki cache issues

[19:24:01]

wagnerrp:

are you logged into the wiki?

[19:24:18]

pladijs:

no i don't have an account

[19:24:34]

wagnerrp:

yep

[19:25:00]

pladijs:

you mean i see outdated information because i'm not logged in? is it me or is that horrible?

[19:25:21]

wagnerrp:

yes, that is horrible

[19:25:56]

wagnerrp:

for whatever reason, mediawiki does not flush pages out of the cache when they are updated

[19:27:33]

pladijs:

well its definitely an incentive to get an account. in any case: thanks for pointing that out

[19:29:50]

wagnerrp:

you know what... cache disabled

[19:29:51]

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[19:29:57]

wagnerrp:

no longer an issue

[19:30:07]

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[19:30:47]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, not entirely true. I said if you started changing stuff willy nilly or reinstalling stuff before asking for help that I would ban you

[19:30:50]

tgm4883:

there is a difference

[19:31:18]

wagnerrp:

sphery: ^^^

[19:31:20]

sailerboy:

ok

[19:31:20]

sailerboy:

fine

[19:31:21]

tgm4883:

I have no problems with people asking for help, but it gets really difficult to help people after they have hacked away at things and messed stuff up greatly

[19:31:43]

sailerboy:

i have not hacked at anything

[19:31:45]

sailerboy:

but

[19:31:59]

sailerboy:

my closed captioning worked last night on the messed up system

[19:32:00]

sailerboy:

but not now

[19:32:06]

sailerboy:

is there any reason why that would be?

[19:32:13]

sailerboy:

ntsc vbi thing is enabled in the mythtv-setup

[19:32:20]

tgm4883:

what has changed since then?

[19:32:22]

NickHu:

Hey guys, how does the commercial detection work?

[19:32:30]

NickHu:

Is it just an educated stab in the dark?

[19:32:32]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, well, i reinstalled

[19:32:39]

sailerboy:

like you told me

[19:32:40]

NickHu:

Or is there some other factor making it 100% successful

[19:32:41]

wagnerrp:

NickHu: largely, yes

[19:32:56]

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[19:32:57]

tgm4883:

NickHu, it's not 100% successful

[19:32:58]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: So, it just kind of guesses

[19:33:03]

wagnerrp:

there are several methods that it uses to score possible locations

[19:33:06]

tgm4883:

it's a bunch of different guesses

[19:33:16]

wagnerrp:

and then it does some statistical filtering upon those

[19:33:21]

NickHu:

Ah, well that seems more logical :3

[19:33:26]

wagnerrp:

but in the end, it is just an educated guess

[19:33:32]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, if you reinstalled the same OS, then it should be a setting somewhere

[19:33:38]

wagnerrp:

this is where we think the commercials might be, based off several traits

[19:33:45]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, i really don't recall

[19:33:47]

tgm4883:

Take a look at the backend logs and see if there are any errors

[19:33:48]

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[19:33:50]

sailerboy:

i think i set it up the exact same way

[19:33:53]

sailerboy:

ok

[19:33:58]

NickHu:

From your experience, how accurate is it?

[19:34:01]

sailerboy:

one thing that was weird

[19:34:05]

sailerboy:

was that on this page http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Hauppauge_HVR-1600

[19:34:05]

NickHu:

>80%?

[19:34:06]

sailerboy:

which is my tuner

[19:34:13]

sailerboy:

it says that captioning isn't supported

[19:34:17]

sailerboy:

but it was working fine last night

[19:34:22]

sailerboy:

any reason why that is?

[19:34:29]

wagnerrp:

NickHu: in north america, with north american video, it works pretty well

[19:34:29]

sailerboy:

or is it just that it's outdated

[19:34:47]

wagnerrp:

but then most of the developers are in north america, so the methods and weighting is tuned for our content

[19:34:54]

wagnerrp:

elsewhere, it may not work so well

[19:35:01]

NickHu:

I see

[19:35:23]

NickHu:

I might just turn it on BBC and see how it does :'3

[19:35:28]

wagnerrp:

people in england have reported decent performance using an external script that finds silence, intended as an mp3 splitter

[19:35:36]

NickHu:

(BBC has no ads because it's a public service channel)

[19:35:44]

wagnerrp:

but no one has mustered the motivation to turn it into a proper commercial detection mechanism

[19:36:12]

sailerboy:

tgm4883, no errors related to closed captioining

[19:36:26]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, also, I didn't say don't bug me. I said I had other things to do. IE. I likely would be away from my computer

[19:37:07]

tgm4883:

sailerboy, you are sure it was closed captioning and not just subtitles?

[19:37:51]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: Using an original Xbox with XBMC = Sufficient for SD frontend?

[19:38:14]

wagnerrp:

that depends

[19:38:31]

wagnerrp:

youre using DVB-S tuners, which may very well capture HD and/or h264 content

[19:38:53]

wagnerrp:

the Xbox does not have enough power to handle HD MPEG2, or any H264

[19:39:03]

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[19:39:32]

NickHu:

wagnerrp: In the UK, HD content is exclusively DVB-S2

[19:39:55]

wagnerrp:

and the codec used?

[19:40:29]

NickHu:

I have no idea

[19:40:32]

NickHu:

I'd guess MPEG2

[19:40:56]

[R]:

its mpeg4

[19:41:07]

wagnerrp:

do you have any on hand?

[19:41:07]

[R]:

h264

[19:42:06]

NickHu:

No, my tuner is in the mail

[19:42:14]

wagnerrp:

theres good reason why xbmc proper abandoned that system as a supported device years ago

[19:42:37]

NickHu:

Does no one else see the irony in that? :3

[19:42:49]

sphery:

wagnerrp: heh, that cache is so useless

[19:43:08]

wagnerrp:

sphery: what cache?

[19:43:28]

sphery:

the mediawiki one--since it doesn't update after changes

[19:43:36]

sphery:

is that what you were pointing me to?

[19:43:39]

wagnerrp:

mediawiki has no cache

[19:43:57]

wagnerrp:

just like how trac doesnt display a timeline

[19:44:14]

sphery:

ah, you mean because you disabled it :)

[19:44:26]

sphery:

heh

[19:44:34]

sphery:

anyway, sounds like we're better off without it

[19:44:41]

sphery:

especially once we get the new server(s) in place

[19:44:56]

wagnerrp:

why is it that every time i go for some screws, the screws im looking for are in a bag at the bottom of the jar

[19:45:39]

[R]:

wagnerrp: isn't that sokme law?

[19:45:45]

[R]:

like murphys or whatever

[19:47:16]

sphery:

[R]: perhaps it's McPheely's Law?

[19:47:22]

[R]:

whos that?

[19:47:30]

sphery:

er, McFeely's Law

[19:47:34]

sphery:

http://www.mcfeelys.com/

[19:47:35]

wagnerrp:

i thought murphy's law involved a submachinegun coming out of a holster embedded in ones leg

[19:47:38]

NickHu:

McDonald's Law..?

[19:47:53]

Scopeuk-AFK is now known as Scopeuk

[19:48:42]

sphery:

wagnerrp: heh, Detroit got approval and the $50K it needed in donations to put up a statue of him

[19:48:58]

sphery:

or a group of people in Detroit, that is

[19:50:07]

NickHu:

Muhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muphry%27s_law < I like this :3

[19:50:13]

wagnerrp:

too bad he went into art history, instead of archeology

[19:50:21]

wagnerrp:

that could have made for a great joke

[19:51:52]

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[19:55:04]

wagnerrp:

thousands of years from now, archaeologists trying to figure out how we managed a sudden leap in cybernetics, with no further work on the same level for the next 50 years

[20:01:17]

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[20:02:58]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, nah. The Cybernetics will have killed us all in thousands of years

[20:03:22]

wagnerrp:

who's to say it will be our archaeologists

[20:04:02]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: you around?

[20:04:19]

sphery:

kormoc: you're right--since they cancelled Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles, John Connor will never grow up to lead us to victory over the machines

[20:04:24]

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[20:04:26]

sphery:

stupid Fox--doomed us all

[20:07:15]

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[20:08:07]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: anyway, wondering if there would be any possibility of operating a build slave on a WOL machine in standby

[20:08:23]

bob___:

hello, im trying to use mythnetvision; all is well if the video autostarts but if it doesn't pressing 5 doesn't seem to work on the flash window. Anyone have any idea why that might be? pressing 5 works in mythbrowser, just not over flash movies.

[20:08:28]

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[20:08:55]

sphery:

bob___: it's stupid flash--you need a mouse to use it

[20:09:28]

sphery:

some sites have a javascript control api, that will be available for use in 0.25, but until then, a mouse is your only option

[20:10:18]

bob___:

sphery: ah, thanks. I shall try find a mouse to give it a go

[20:17:52]

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[21:18:30]

sphery:

wagnerrp: Do you happen to know if Undercovers was worth watching or not?

[21:20:26]

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[21:22:34]

wagnerrp:

it was an interesting show, but only had what... 10 episodes?

[21:22:44]

sphery:

yeah, 11

[21:23:01]

sphery:

was cleaning up some cancelled shows and didn't know what to do with that one

[21:23:04]

wagnerrp:

its not bad, leave it for a boring week in between seasons

[21:23:07]

sphery:

maybe I'll watch it--should be quick

[21:23:18]

sphery:

cool, thanks for the input

[21:23:19]

wagnerrp:

or if you need the space, delete it and theres not much harm done

[21:23:26]

sphery:

don't need the space

[21:24:04]

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[21:24:27]

sphery:

Just deleted a couple hundred GB (had 1.1TB free before deletes) and have two 2TB HDD that I had previously "borrowed" sitting around waiting for re-install

[21:24:28]

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[21:25:43]

sphery:

should know how much I deleted in a bunch of hours... (2min/GB)

[21:26:06]

wagnerrp:

hehe

[21:26:17]

wagnerrp:

you and your insistence on ext3

[21:26:29]

sphery:

heh, the file system has never failed me

[21:26:37]

sphery:

(unlike the HDDs it sits on top)

[21:26:53]

sphery:

considering possibly moving to ext4 on my next build

[21:27:10]

sphery:

but I hear zfs is a close second to ext4 on Linux :)

[21:27:33]

wagnerrp:

close being a relative term

[21:27:37]

sphery:

heh, yeah

[21:27:47]

sphery:

didn't someone say F16 is going to use zfs?

[21:27:54]

wagnerrp:

on that scale, fat16 would be a close third

[21:28:17]

sphery:

heh

[21:28:39]

sphery:

yeah, since both zfs and FAT 16 were designed specifically for Linux, that makes sense

[21:31:43]

sphery:

ah, btrfs will be default for Fedora 16 (F16)

[21:33:10]

sphery:

wagnerrp: did you see http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/480687#480687 ?

[21:33:18]

sphery:

users still doing manual override

[21:33:33]

sphery:

aka, AMD proprietary drivers are garbage

[21:34:02]

sphery:

and, really, do the proprietary drivers even support the HD 3200, still? I thought that was EOL'ed?

[21:36:09]

sphery:

and worst part is that the guy is overriding it with an incorrect value

[21:37:25]

sphery:

guess they still have drivers for it... 11.5, so new, even

[21:41:21]

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[21:41:30]

singlegirlarity:

can the more "mainstream" pvrs like Tivo also delete commercials? or is that a myth only thing?

[21:42:05]

sphery:

they allow you to fast-forward over them

[21:42:12]

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[21:42:17]

singlegirlarity:

right....but not auto-delete?

[21:42:41]

sphery:

mythtv is one of the few that attempts to mark them (though, IME, our commflagger is becoming less accurate as networks change the way they encode their recordings)

[21:43:07]

sphery:

in truth, because of the above, MythTV should /never/ be configured to auto-delete commercials (or even auto-skip them, IMHO)

[21:43:43]

sphery:

you should always create a real cut list before transcoding so that you don't cut the good stuff

[21:43:55]

singlegirlarity:

okay

[21:44:01]

singlegirlarity:

cut list?

[21:44:03]

SporkD:

omg, my hvr-1600 is driving me crazy, anyone with experience in these cards around?

[21:44:04]

sphery:

(and, IMHO, you should only transcode if you plan to keep something forever)

[21:44:27]

sphery:

singlegirlarity: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Editing_Recordings + http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Removing_Commercials

[21:44:31]

singlegirlarity:

thanks

[21:45:24]

sphery:

in general, though, with 2TB HDDs for $70 and 3TB HDDs for $120 (and falling), transcoding isn't something you should normally do--instead, skipping commercials at playback makes more sense

[21:45:42]

sphery:

considering a 2TB HDD will hold >300hrs of recordings

[21:45:55]

singlegirlarity:

wow 3TB now!

[21:45:57]

sphery:

(assuming relatively-high bitrate HDTV recordings)

[21:46:24]

sphery:

SporkD: sorry, I've never had a chance to play with an HVR-1600

[21:46:28]

singlegirlarity:

by skipping at playback, you mean fast-forward through them?

[21:46:28]

SporkD:

hey sphery , you have any suggestions.. following the wiki to a T with my hvr-1600 and when modprobe cx18 I get Fatal cannot be found

[21:46:53]

sphery:

not sure... though cx18 sounds too short for a module name

[21:47:13]

sphery:

or maybe not

[21:47:37]

sphery:

I thought all the V4L modules had at least 3 or 4 digits in them

[21:47:49]

SporkD:

well when I lspci I get:

[21:48:00]

SporkD:

01:00.0 Multimedia video controller: Conexant Systems, Inc. CX23418 Single-Chip MPEG-2 Encoder with Integrated Analog Video/Broadcast Audio Decoder

[21:48:00]

SporkD:

02:00

[21:48:12]

sphery:

but not found on a modprobe would indicate your kernel doesn't have the cx18 driver module installed

[21:48:47]

SporkD:

this is a fresh install of mythbuntu

[21:49:21]

sphery:

well, if you hang out here, you'll probably find someone who knows HVR-1600 and Mythbuntu... Or you could try in #mythbuntu, if you like

[21:53:11]

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[22:00:09]

sphery:

wagnerrp: how's this for targeted advertising... During the season finale of Bones, an ad for the local news, "A missing rental van engulfed in flames, inside a mysterious set of bones. Who was the man in the van? Fox 35 uncovers this deadly mystery, after Bones."

[22:06:37]

wagnerrp:

UIPainter?

[22:08:27]

wagnerrp:

sphery: the main menu is ThemePainter, and playback runs through the playback profiles which are completely independent

[22:08:33]

wagnerrp:

what is UIPainter supposed to do?

[22:08:57]

sphery:

it's the override for the theme painter now that we no longer use the themepainter setting in the database

[22:08:57]

wagnerrp:

yeah... i dont even have one of those

[22:09:21]

sphery:

i.e. we didn't want to leave it so that all the users were stuck forever with what they had set before the auto-detection

[22:09:40]

sphery:

but the Qt with capital Q is the wrong value

[22:09:47]

sphery:

it's only working because qt is the fallback

[22:10:05]

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[22:10:11]

sphery:

like using a value of thisvalueismeaninglessbutgivesmethefallback

[22:19:08]

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[22:25:55]

SporkD:

ok, so i have my hvr-1600, having trouble scanning for channels.. anyone around?

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[22:50:08]

echosyp:

Channel(/dev/video0): SetInputAndFormat() failed

[22:50:49]

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[22:53:06]

iamlindoro:

http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

[22:53:08]

echosyp:

what can i do about that

[22:54:00]

iamlindoro:

Don't set the "preset tuner to channel" setting on a device without a tuner... Just as the help text for the option tells you not to

[22:56:55]

echosyp:

weird, cause its not

[22:57:44]

iamlindoro:

You're right, I misread your error message. Don't take messages out of context-- pastebin the whole log

[23:04:43]

** wagnerrp finds it frustrating when people who dont know a thing about orbital dynamics post on internet forums about space elevators **

[23:05:21]

wagnerrp:

its like movies with bad physics, but i actually have the opportunity to yell back

[23:10:12]

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[23:11:17]

echosyp:

http://pastebin.ca/2067170

[23:13:49]

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[23:17:18]

echosyp:

http://pastebin.ca/2067174

[23:18:40]

echosyp:

im at a loss here

[23:19:45]

iamlindoro:

"format_to_mode() does not recognize V4L1"

[23:19:56]

iamlindoro:

You have upgraded to a distro using kernel 2.6.38

[23:20:02]

iamlindoro:

which mythtv does not support

[23:20:22]

echosyp:

i thought i patched it

[23:20:34]

iamlindoro:

Either you didn't, or your patch is wrong

[23:20:38]

echosyp:

to use v4l2

[23:20:40]

echosyp:

:(

[23:21:24]

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[23:21:47]

echosyp:

http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/9789

[23:21:51]

echosyp:

thats what i used

[23:22:05]

iamlindoro:

You'd need to contact Lawrence Rust about that

[23:22:14]

iamlindoro:

since he's not a myth dev and that patch hasn't been applied

[23:22:22]

iamlindoro:

appears his patch has issues

[23:22:52]

echosyp:

ok then

[23:23:19]

echosyp:

im downgrading ubuntu until then, brb

[23:23:45]

iamlindoro:

The mailing list would be the best place to have that discussion, btw-- please don't communicate with him via ticket or it's liable to get the ticket locked

[23:23:59]

echosyp:

noted

[23:24:34]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: I don't think WOL would work well for buildbot as the slave polls the master

[23:25:09]

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[23:25:13]

Beirdo:

I know they have a way to spin up an EC2 though, so maybe there is some sorta way

[23:29:55]

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[23:37:06]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: perhaps i could write a small loop on another machine that would poll the master to see if something needed to be done

[23:37:11]

wagnerrp:

and if so, spool up the slave

[23:41:18]

Beirdo:

yeah. If you need some custom code, they do have a class for "latent buildslaves" that you could leverage

[23:41:38]

Beirdo:

it is all python, which shouldn't slow ya down much :)

[23:41:55]

wagnerrp:

im just thinking, i still have this perfectly good 1.8GHz dual core machine with 2GB (now 3GB) of memory

[23:41:57]

wagnerrp:

may as well use it

[23:42:04]

wagnerrp:

but i dont want to just leave it on all the time

[23:42:17]

Beirdo:

yeah, understood

[23:42:37]

Beirdo:

well, you could schedule it to wake up once an hour and connect

[23:42:45]

Beirdo:

if all else fails

[23:42:53]

wagnerrp:

i could

[23:43:02]

wagnerrp:

when it builds, does it build from scratch each time?

[23:44:14]

Beirdo:

yes

[23:44:21]

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[23:44:53]

Beirdo:

it does a git pull into a directory that persists, then copies the directory over to a build dir and compiles from scratch

[23:45:04]

Beirdo:

installs under the build dir as well

[23:45:40]

wagnerrp:

so its a clean environment each time? fancy

[23:45:58]

Beirdo:

yep

[23:46:13]

Beirdo:

under build/ you get source/ and install/

[23:46:26]

Beirdo:

and it does rm -rf build/ for each build

[23:48:46]

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