MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

Daily chat history

Current users (184):

adante, aloril, And4713, Anduin, AndyCap, anykey__, at0m, Azelphur, baffle, banyan, Baylink, bbee, beata-, Beirdo, benc_, bestis, bjd, blizzard`, BLZbubba, bobgill, brfransen, btwe_afk, Caeles, cafuego, Caliban, Captain_Murdoch, Casper0082, chainsawbike, ChanServ, christ_, clever, ComradeHaz`, CoreDump, Cougar, cynicismic, d0netsFN, dagar, dashcloud, Dave123, derstock, dewman, dherde__, dibbz, DjMadness_, dlblog, dmb, dmz, dougl, dserban__, dustybin, elmojo, eNeRGi, esperegu, etotheipi, EvilGuru, fedorared, feitingen, Flash_, Floppe, foobum, GadgetWisdomGuru, gbramwell, gbutters, ghoti, Gibby_afk, gregl, GreyFoxx, grokky, growler, Gumby, hackman_, hadees, Heliwr, high-rez, highzeth, Igg-man, ikonia, i_is_cat, J-e-f-f-A, jamesd2, jams, janneg, jarle, jbrett, jduggan, joe_k_, jpabq, jpabq-, justdave, justinh, k-man, kabtoffe, KaZeR, keith4, KjetilK, kloeri, kormoc, kothog, KraMer, kurre_, larrikin, LedHed, Linkeroo, Lord_Deathscythe, lotia, Lt_Dan, mag0o, Maliuta, marc_us, mcl0vin, Memphis, Merlina, Metoer, mikeones, MilkBoy, MythLogBot, mzb, npm, nuonguy, nutron, oobe, ozatomic, Patina, paul-h, penghb, pheld, pigeon, pizzledizzle, Pluribus, Prost, purserj, quicksilver, Raptors, RDV_Linux, rhpot1991, RobertLaptop_, rooaus, rossand, rushfan, ruskie, RyeBrye, ServerSage, shadash, Shadow__X, sid3windr, simcop2387, skd5aner, sphery, sphex_, Splat1, squidly, sulx, sutula, tank-man, tgm4883, th1, thefRont, Therock_, ThisOtherGuy, Timrit, toeb, Tomas-, tomaw, tomimo, toorima, totalanni, treeshoe, tris, troyt, Typosu, Virindi, wagnerrp, waxhead, weta, Wicked, xand, XChatMav, XLV, xris, yatesy, zand, zand_, zzpat, _charly_
Wednesday, September 1st, 2010, 00:05 UTC
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[00:39:59] ComradeHaz`: Hi all. mythfrontend crashes everytime I try to update the database (ie scan for changes). Really need some help. I have just renamed a load of files given the situation with brackets trunkating filenames
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[01:06:28] sphery: ComradeHaz`: would need some log files, at least, to help ( http://mythtv.pastebin.com/ please)
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[02:03:33] ThisOtherGuy: hey all – does DataDirect mean the same thing as schedules direct? re: trunk 26033
[02:04:32] wagnerrp: datadirect is the service tribune offers, schedulesdirect is the organization set up to license access to that
[02:04:48] wagnerrp: SD doesnt actually provide data themselves
[02:04:55] wagnerrp: you access the TMS servers directly
[02:05:47] ThisOtherGuy: Thanks! I figured we hit SD which hit tribune
[02:06:26] [R]: so i enabled that dd-grab-all
[02:06:28] [R]: he wasn't kidding
[02:06:36] [R]: it maxed out one of m ycores
[02:07:29] ThisOtherGuy: Thanks [R] – I was wondering how serious he was
[02:08:04] [R]: i was also comm flagging at the same time
[02:08:13] [R]: i'm about to check what was recording at the time
[02:08:15] [R]: but i'm sure its fine
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[02:44:11] sphery: [R]: thanks for enabling it (and for the feedback)... it should be /much/ more efficient in 0.24, when released, but it's good enough, now, with a sufficiently powerful backend to tell people they can use it
[02:44:39] sphery: and they also get the benefits (and so does TMS and, even, SD--since it will likely prevent a lot of false listings problem reports)
[02:44:56] [R]: sphery: it also POUNDED my mysql
[02:45:04] sphery: ThisOtherGuy: and, yeah, it means schedules direct users with suffiencently-powerful backends should enable it
[02:45:18] sphery: [R]: what kind of backend system?
[02:45:25] [R]: core 2 duo 2.1 or so
[02:45:43] [R]: 2.16
[02:45:47] [R]: 2.13*
[02:46:00] sphery: ah, yeah... so a reasonable system
[02:46:06] iamlindoro: non-toy
[02:46:11] sphery: and it would definitely be a challenge for that one with 0.23-fixes
[02:46:13] iamlindoro: it's visible to the naked eye
[02:46:17] sphery: 0.24 should be much better
[02:46:24] sphery: heh, yeah, exactly!
[02:46:41] [R]: i had no problem with my QAM recording... maybe i should do it during an hdpvr recording
[02:47:00] sphery: but on the bright side, it's dual-core, so you still have another core
[02:47:06] sphery: of course, I/O wait could still be a problem
[02:47:56] [R]: is there any way to delete files over upnp? stupid qudestion probably
[02:48:03] sphery: (I doubt either mythfilldatabase or mysql could take 100% of a core by themselves--too much I/O wait involved--so you'll likely have some CPU left for recording/marshalling recording data)
[02:48:13] iamlindoro: Not without a custom extension (ie, not in the current code)
[02:48:35] [R]: sphery: well i have an hdpvr recording starting at 8... i'll try it again then
[02:49:10] kormoc: sphery, FWIW, mysql used 110% cpu time during my run of MFDB --dd-grab-all
[02:49:21] sphery: ah, beautiful! my re-record Nova episodes that were recorded in SDTV as HDTV rule worked!
[02:49:30] sphery: kormoc: heh, I stand corrected
[02:49:46] kormoc: but I'm on innodb, which makes that different :)
[02:49:56] sphery: ah, I'm still MyISAM
[02:50:16] kormoc: Yeah, I have large insert buffers and dedicated read/write/flush threads
[02:50:25] sphery: I am still 0.23-fixes, too, so that will slow my real runs down (I only ran on dev so far just to verify it worked properly before asking xris about it, again)
[02:50:29] kormoc: so it's expected that mine would actually be much less io wait
[02:50:37] sphery: ah, yeah
[02:50:53] sphery: I'm using the I/O wait to temper my CPU usage :)
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[03:02:26] [R]: is there a trutv HD or tvland HD?
[03:03:49] iamlindoro: TruTV HD, yes
[03:03:54] iamlindoro: TVLand HD... dunno
[03:04:59] ** [R] cries **
[03:05:03] [R]: who has trutv hd?
[03:05:07] iamlindoro: Me!
[03:05:13] [R]: satellite or cable?
[03:05:16] iamlindoro: Cable
[03:05:21] [R]: do they actually show hd?
[03:05:45] iamlindoro: yes, there's a bunch of seasons of cops it HD, at least, and probably much of their original programming
[03:06:06] sphery: IIRC that will be a dream come true for [R]
[03:06:10] [R]: HAHA
[03:06:23] iamlindoro: Masterminds and Forensic Files too, apparently
[03:06:23] [R]: i get my cops in hd off Fox, althoug htis like 1 a week only
[03:06:27] sphery: weren't you the one with 300-some episodes recorded?
[03:06:30] [R]: yeah
[03:06:32] [R]: its mostly SD crap
[03:06:33] sphery: heh
[03:06:37] [R]: i just disabled my rule
[03:06:51] sphery: gotta use the new re-record sdtv in hdtv rule!
[03:07:25] sphery: I was just about to pity-watch the 3-part Nova that I got in SDTV just to clear it out, but now I have to wait for the other 2 episodes to re-air in HDTV
[03:08:31] sphery: d'oh... Jay Leno got me. Side-headline on the intro to "Headlines" is "If you paused to read this you have too much time on your hands"
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[03:13:04] banyan: Here's a question for ya — my ATI radeon mobility card shows two images, one on top of the other, when playing back a recording in mythfrontend.
[03:13:25] banyan: what do I have to adjust / tweak to just see everything once?
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[03:15:40] iamlindoro: change your playback profile to slim
[03:15:54] banyan: ok, that's under general?
[03:15:57] iamlindoro: more specifically, you will be not using the Bob2x deinterlacer
[03:16:08] iamlindoro: but you accomplish that most correctly by using the slim playback profile
[03:16:18] iamlindoro: Utilities/Setup->Setup->TV Settings->Playback, Page 3
[03:19:00] banyan: Right you are! awesome. If there was a boss to compliment your help to, I would.  :-)
[03:20:47] banyan: While I'm here, is there a good and not terribly expensive way to convert the audio from an hdmi output to a coax output?
[03:21:29] banyan: I have some old equipment that doesn't support hdmi but has coax digital audio inputs.
[03:21:48] wagnerrp: so use the coax digital outputs on your computer
[03:22:02] wagnerrp: just about any motherboard built in the last couple years has one of those
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[03:23:58] banyan: Not my spankin' new laptop, which I didn't notice only had digital output via hdmi until it was too late.
[03:23:58] banyan: durp...
[03:24:39] wagnerrp: yeah, laptops are a different matter
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[03:27:31] banyan: I was hoping to use the thing as my frontend machine but that's proving to be a bit of drama. mainly owing to the sound issue. I *could* use just a stereo out jack for the short term but there must be some widget that separates out the HDMI digital audio out there you'd think.
[03:28:02] wagnerrp: an A/V receiver
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[03:31:17] banyan: oh, yeah, I could upgrade my Rotel to a version that supports HDMI but that's a $2000 touch.
[03:31:34] banyan: Though I'd love the excuse!
[03:32:02] wagnerrp: well you could probably get by with a (slightly) cheaper A/V processor
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[03:38:20] banyan: Likely but I lurve my rotel hardware... it's just a little long in the tooth (5.1, no HDMI)
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[03:40:01] wagnerrp: if its not 5.1, why do you need optical?
[03:44:26] banyan: The processor is 5.1, rather than 7.1 which anything you'd get now would be.
[03:44:45] banyan: Though I don't know who really needs a 7.1 home system.
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[03:46:39] [R]: my friend has 7.1
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[03:46:41] [R]: hes insane
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[03:46:57] [R]: but has no problem with hooking his ps3 up to my tv with composite cable
[03:46:59] [R]: go figure
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[03:47:53] banyan: Does he actually have 7 channels and a sub?
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[03:48:25] [R]: at his house he does
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[03:50:30] banyan: ya know, that's another option. I googled some boxes that will split out the audio from an hdmi and give it to you via toslink or spdif but I bet a PS3 is no more expensive, and it can still act as a frontend with ample oomph to do what mythtv requires.
[03:50:45] [R]: who the hell buys a laptop at toys r us
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[03:56:30] banyan: Maybe it's a really cool Dora the Explorer laptop.
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[04:09:12] brfransen: I am trying to build trunk on OS X using the osx-packager.pl script and it is giving me a mythconfig.mak not found error and then asks if I made and installed MythTV first? I thought that is what the script was suppose to do? Any suggestions?
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[04:13:11] iamlindoro: brfransen, Myth's build process has changed substantially, and the script is only partially updated to account for it
[04:13:27] iamlindoro: Also, you need to be using a copy of the packager script from *today* if you want any chance of it working
[04:13:39] iamlindoro: but since it's been modified all day, there's every chance it's not done yet
[04:15:01] brfransen: iamlindoro: I am using a copy from today, actually from about an hour ago.
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[04:15:13] iamlindoro: brfransen, then nigle isn't done updating it yet
[04:15:15] iamlindoro: nigel
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[04:16:54] brfransen: iamlindoro: thanks. I had built about a month ago with no problems but wasn't sure if maybe I was missing something
[04:17:11] iamlindoro: You are not missing anything, build process changed with the ffmpeg sync
[04:20:22] brfransen: I saw that the ticket about jpeg plugins was closed but the build I have from a month ago didn't display the jpg previews of the themes or channel icon downloads so I wanted to test that out.
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[04:54:44] Gumby: hi all. I am using the current ubuntu mythtv packages. I am trying to set the X and Y offset however none of the numbers I put in seem to do anything. I am also using the current nvidia drivers for ubuntu and am outputting to a 32" LCD via HDMI (720p). Does anyone have any recommendations?
[04:55:35] Gumby: changing the width and height seems to work great but the X and Y offset seem to have no effect
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[05:06:29] sphery: Gumby: current 0.23-fixes?
[05:06:46] sphery: the version in mythbuntu 10.04 had a bug that made that not work
[05:07:18] Gumby: hrm, ok. tried to search for it but perhaps I was looking for the wrong thing.
[05:07:31] Gumby: oddly enough, the sizing seems to work when I open mythtv-setup
[05:07:52] Gumby: sizing and offset work I mean
[05:07:52] Gumby: hehe
[05:08:47] Gumby: which is why I was messing with it in the first place because I couldnt see if options were checked or unchecked
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[05:21:30] wagnerrp: huh... the mythxml preview generator only works on the backend that recorded the content
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[05:24:12] Beirdo: really? odd
[05:24:20] Beirdo: wonder if that's by design or a bug
[05:24:29] wagnerrp: either that, or its broken on freebsd
[05:24:41] Beirdo: or all of the above.
[05:24:43] wagnerrp: i cant get my -fixes or trunk backends to generate images
[05:24:56] wagnerrp: and the trunk one is recording its own stuff
[05:24:58] Beirdo: weird
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[05:58:03] wagnerrp: sphery: whats with these people taking 45 minutes to run that database download?
[05:58:08] wagnerrp: broken database?
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[05:59:05] sphery: db download?
[05:59:22] wagnerrp: mfd
[05:59:51] sphery: ah, I see, with --dd-grab-all
[05:59:58] wagnerrp: took me all of 4:39, with an old 1.8 opteron and 83 channels
[06:00:03] sphery: AMD quad core system
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[06:00:07] sphery: shouldn't take 45mins
[06:00:24] wagnerrp: thats the first log timestamp to the last, reschedule included
[06:00:26] sphery: I do contend, however, that /many/ distros are shipping very poorly configured MySQL servers
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[06:00:49] sphery: yeah, took me no time at all, but I have only a few channels in my lineup (like 30 or so)
[06:01:20] sphery: even the 2.5min download is strange
[06:01:34] sphery: should have been about 3MB max, so...
[06:01:49] wagnerrp: yeah, but it went so slow
[06:01:52] wagnerrp: 30KBps
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[06:02:30] sphery: for me, on an Athlon X2 6000+ dev box with my 30 channels, I got 44sec from first to last log time stamp
[06:02:50] sphery: 32.4KB/sec download
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[06:03:36] sphery: 17:58:54.342 to 17:59:17 for download of 893981 bytes
[06:04:54] sphery: assuming 32KB/sec for that guy, it would be a 4.7MB listings, so maybe he has way too many channels
[06:05:11] sphery: and one for firewire which has
[06:05:12] sphery: a few hundred (actually it says 502 in the mythfilldatabase output).
[06:05:13] sphery: yeah
[06:05:24] wagnerrp: thats reasonable for a digital cable lineup
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[06:08:42] sphery: heh, I still call it too many channels
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[06:53:32] sphery: wagnerrp: I should have asked Ozzy Lash if his system was down-clocked to the lowest frequency through the whole run.
[06:53:57] wagnerrp: even still, that should only be ~1GHz
[06:54:15] sphery: yeah, but would still affect things somewhat
[06:54:22] wagnerrp: is that multi-threaded?
[06:54:35] sphery: pretty sure it's a single thread
[06:54:56] sphery: we have a lot of room for improvement of it, but it just hasn't been high enough priority, yet
[06:55:02] wagnerrp: even still, that shouldnt be more than twice as slow as my much older architecture
[06:55:09] sphery: yeah
[06:55:16] sphery: did you try while recording?
[06:55:22] wagnerrp: no
[06:55:30] sphery: I'm wondering how much table-locking got in the way
[06:55:33] wagnerrp: my MBE hasnt recorded anything in a while
[06:55:51] wagnerrp: it only has the HDHR, and there hasnt been anything but reruns on broadcast for a while
[06:56:03] sphery: yeah
[06:56:17] sphery: anyway, we'll see what happens
[06:56:41] sphery: we've got 2 success stories, so far, and one seemingly-really-bad story
[06:57:09] sphery: note, also, that the 2 successes are Intel and the failure is AMD... That probably means that it only works on Intel chips.
[06:57:19] sphery: since Atom is an Intel chip, it should work for them.
[06:57:27] sphery: Pretty sure I've got my logic all lined up right.
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[07:04:46] justinh: It has begun: http://twitter.com/paulscott56/
[07:05:11] justinh: "Wonder if it would be legal in SA to do a cloud storage+MythTV VOD system. Would be quite a popular thing I reckon"
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[07:06:03] wagnerrp: just search twitter for 'mythtv' occasionally?
[07:06:25] justinh: I have a search column in tweetdeck
[07:06:35] justinh: a blimmin *long* search string too
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[07:36:35] Gumby: hi all. running mythtv here on ubuntu and trying to figure out which is the correct package to install to get vdpau working. I initially thought I only needed the restricted driver but that wasnt working. I now see there are driver packages with vdpau specifically in the name but they dont seem installable. Anyone have any experience with this?
[07:38:00] wagnerrp: libvdpau
[07:38:28] wagnerrp: starting with the 190.x line of drivers, the vdpau libraries got split out
[07:40:25] Gumby: thanks wagnerrp
[07:40:41] Gumby: hrm
[07:40:47] Gumby: although I seem to have that already
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[07:41:30] Gumby: ii libvdpau1 0.3–2build1
[07:41:31] Gumby: oh wait
[07:41:33] Gumby: nvidia-libvdpau
[07:41:50] Gumby: hrm, nm
[07:42:07] Gumby: libvdpau1 replaces nvidia-libvdpau
[07:44:14] Gumby: I'm only using the 173 version of the nvidia drivers
[07:44:39] Gumby: default restricted drivers for ubuntu 10.04
[07:44:50] Gumby: hrm... actually wait...
[07:45:31] Gumby: that one is not currect
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[07:53:34] Gumby: problem was that I really didnt have the current drivers
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[08:36:36] justinh: heh mythtvtalk.com finally got revamped then
[08:40:22] justinh: ooo a new 3rd party theme which doesn't offend my eyes! http://chriskreutzer.com/blog/?p=29
[08:40:31] toeb: Hi i have a Sundtek MediaTV Pro Stick an its driver reports: "denying to close filedescriptor, please report this issue to the maintainer of your TV application"
[08:40:53] toeb: is this known?
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[08:41:05] justinh: sundtek? never heard of them
[08:41:44] toeb: http://sundtek.com/shop/Digital-TV-Sticks/Sun . . . nalogTV.html
[08:41:57] justinh: see http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Sundtek
[08:42:13] justinh: ouch. no open source drivers
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[08:42:44] justinh: "Sundtek claims to adhere to the LinuxDVB, Video4Linux1/2 API Specifications as far as possible. "
[08:42:57] justinh: I like that. *claims* to adhere to the APIs
[08:43:40] toeb: yes i know... but its pretty much the only choice for dvb-c usb sticks...
[08:44:03] toeb: at least at the time i bought it..
[08:44:17] justinh: it's probably something to do with them claiming to adhere to the API, and mythtv not agreeing with that
[08:44:36] justinh: do other apps work ok with it?
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[08:45:34] justinh: it might even be a permissions issue, since I've just read that they use a userspace application to emulate the API
[08:46:03] toeb: mythtv is working with the stick, and other applications work too.. but the backend somtimes hangs..
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[08:46:35] justinh: so are the other apps which work ok? do they also hang or crash?
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[08:48:26] justinh: man, what a crap website they have
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[08:49:55] justinh: whoah, a 5.9MB shell script. heheheh
[08:50:37] toeb: just had one quick test with kaffeine and it worked..
[08:50:50] toeb: i will test this again
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[08:51:38] toeb: i think most of the time the backend stops working when it tries to change channels
[08:52:03] justinh: denying to close filedescriptor sounds like a problem with permissions or something
[08:52:36] justinh: like myth is trying to stop using the device – i.e. closing it.. it'll do that when it stops recording – i.e. when you change channels
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[08:53:12] toeb: i have set it up to open the device on demand...
[08:53:20] justinh: might be worth getting in touch with sundtek
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[08:54:15] justinh: so what do you see in mythbackend's log? can you post log output of mythbackend up to the point it hangs?
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[08:54:34] justinh: post it in a pastebin though, don't paste it into the channel
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[09:00:48] toeb: can't find it now, next time i will save the log... and come back
[09:05:31] justinh: the log should be saved in /var/log/ I'd think
[09:05:52] justinh: I think you might have meant the *frontend* log. we don't need to see that
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[09:58:37] GlemSom: off-topic: Some years ago I remember seeing RJ45->WireLess adaptors (Simple bridged, WEP or WPA – configures via a mininal webinterface)... Sadly, now when I need one – I'm unable to find one... :/ Anyone know of any products of such kind? (as small as possible)
[09:59:09] toeb: I know where to find the backend logs, i just don't have a log with the failure any more..
[09:59:29] justinh: prolly just as easy to buy a regular wireless switch that can be used in bridge mode
[09:59:42] justinh: my WRT54GC isn't what I'd call huge
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[10:00:41] justinh: toeb: isn't there more than one log file in /var/log/mythtv ?
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[10:09:37] toeb: not really it gets "cleaned up" on a regular basis...
[10:10:47] toeb: and i'v been on vacation so its mostly reschedule logs, the tuner is almost never needed if i don't use livetv..
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[11:12:25] justinh: I have an idea. virgin 1 becomes another Sky piece of crap in a couple of days.. wonder what the programme lineup looks like after that point
[11:14:25] justinh: heh still mostly the same. the fresh prince of bell wossname, star trek: enterprize, jerry springer and home improvement. O the quality!
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[11:26:42] justinh: lol. It'd take over a month to watch all the recordings I've got on my backend
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[11:38:19] justinh: can we please have those funny quotes back in mythweb?
[11:38:34] justinh: e.g. "Any time you skip a commercial or watch the button you're actually stealing the programming. – Jamie Kellner, CEO Turner Broadcasting, 2002
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[13:22:10] GreyFoxx: Anyne here use ffmpeg to encode any of your recordings with aac audio under ubuntu? I'm trying to encode some stuff for playback on my phone and for the life of me I can't get ffmpeg to recognize the fact that it has aac support :) It just keeps saying Unknown encoder 'aac' :)
[13:22:27] GreyFoxx: I'm wondering if there is something special I might need to install or configure
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[13:24:20] justinh: a non-crippled ffmpeg perchance?
[13:24:43] justinh: oh wait – they changed most if not all codec names recently
[13:24:54] justinh: e.g. mp3 was renamed libmp3lame
[13:25:37] justinh: sackin frassin commandline changes...
[13:25:38] GreyFoxx: I've follow the guide here to install mediabuntu repos and then reinstalled the various codec packahes
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[13:25:47] GreyFoxx: and the ffmpeg -formats lists aac as an option
[13:25:55] justinh: weird
[13:26:00] GreyFoxx: but if I use -acodec aac in the commandline it bitches about unknown encoder
[13:26:18] justinh: it's possible it only has decoding support for AAC
[13:26:28] GreyFoxx: ahhhhhh you might be right
[13:26:38] GreyFoxx: the formats output only shows a D and no E
[13:26:42] GreyFoxx: hrm
[13:26:45] justinh: that'll be it then :)
[13:26:47] GreyFoxx: there muyst be a way to enable that
[13:26:55] GreyFoxx: since I see a lot of posts online of people using it
[13:27:14] justinh: thought medibuntu would have everything including the kitchen sink
[13:27:30] justinh: only way to guarantee it is to build it yerself
[13:27:57] GreyFoxx: yeah, I was hoping to avoid that. normally I'd do it, but I hate doing that on package based systems
[13:28:33] justinh: I take the risk.. usually don't even bother uninstalling the ffmpeg packages, since that can cause untold hassle
[13:28:47] GreyFoxx: ok, using libfaac works for encoding
[13:28:53] GreyFoxx: yay
[13:29:27] justinh: I find the way commandline stuff ffmpeg uses changes so often really annoying. they seem to do it just because they can
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[13:43:51] J-e-f-f-A: [R] [from your discussion late last-night] What would the point of TVLand HD be? Since everything they show is really old SD programs... ;-)
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[13:50:46] justinh: that's better. disabled showing of pixmaps in mythweb & now the recordings page loads in < 30 secs
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[14:21:08] J-e-f-f-A: justinh: There's also a setting to paginate it – that helps alot when you've got > 1200 recordings...
[14:21:28] justinh: in -fixes?
[14:21:40] J-e-f-f-A: justinh: Yep. ;-)
[14:23:33] J-e-f-f-A: justinh: Settings -> TV -> MySession -> Page Recorded Programs
[14:23:33] justinh: ahh
[14:23:55] justinh: 16 pages, 50 recordings per page
[14:24:37] J-e-f-f-A: justinh: It also lets me pull up the Recorded Programs page on my cell phone browser... the 'full' version would crash my phone... ;-) hehehehe
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[15:09:01] bestis: mobile version of web front end lists recorded programmes, but the normal mythweb just loads and loads and i don't seem to find any error anywhere, ideas?
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[15:17:07] bestis: umm, ok. wierd, restarted firefox and it loads again :D uhoh
[15:18:49] ThisOtherGuy: Anyone know what version of the crystalhd driver/libs to use?
[15:19:24] ThisOtherGuy: I just get a green screen with the latest from: http://git.wilsonet.com/crystalhd.git/
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[15:50:41] GadgetWisdomGuru: Hmm...don't normally watch, but someone from LinuxMCE is explaining MythTV and such on FLOSS.
[15:54:30] wagnerrp: floss? channel?
[15:54:39] GadgetWisdomGuru: FLOSS is one of the TWIT programs.
[15:54:45] GadgetWisdomGuru: It's on at live.twit.tv
[15:54:56] Beirdo: floss as in teeth or butt?
[15:55:08] GadgetWisdomGuru: Open Source Software show.
[15:55:17] Beirdo: hehe, yeah, I know
[15:55:20] bjd: butt floss?!
[15:55:39] Beirdo: yes. butt floss... otherwise known as a g-string.
[15:55:42] Beirdo: anyways...
[15:56:00] GadgetWisdomGuru: Many of the programs on TWIT don't interest me, but if I hear they are having an interesting guest, I download or tune in.
[15:56:16] GadgetWisdomGuru: 90% of the time, FLOSS doesn't interest me as much
[15:56:20] GadgetWisdomGuru: A few things of late have.
[15:56:29] GadgetWisdomGuru: Linuxmce, I thought, was worth tuning in for.
[15:58:29] Beirdo: and I'm off. hope the bus is on time, not early today
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[16:08:00] justinh: ah so they'd be explaining mythtv 0.21 then :)
[16:09:27] GadgetWisdomGuru: The principles haven't changed, have they?
[16:11:14] justinh: not really, but for some reason I still see linuxmce as .. ahem. sweary
[16:13:50] GadgetWisdomGuru: I am a MythTV purist.
[16:14:36] justinh: I just don't have much love to spare for other projects
[16:15:47] GadgetWisdomGuru: Why is that?
[16:15:53] GadgetWisdomGuru: Love and time are two different things
[16:18:41] justinh: no interest really.. and other reasons I'm not going into here
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[16:38:13] justinh: heheheh the irony of the FLOSS cast being flash...
[16:45:29] GadgetWisdomGuru: Justinh, I watch it using mplayer, actually
[16:45:36] GadgetWisdomGuru: They have an H264 stream you can tap into
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[16:45:56] GadgetWisdomGuru: I once asked if the IPTV recorder in MythTV could record from it. I gathered it could, but someone would have to make it
[16:47:40] wagnerrp: is the IPTV stream RTSP, over multicast, with an m3u playlist?
[16:48:19] wagnerrp: its designed to tap into realtime, broadcast, IPTV
[16:48:23] wagnerrp: not on-demand streams
[16:55:54] GadgetWisdomGuru: It isn't.
[16:55:59] GadgetWisdomGuru: That is why I said someone would have to make it
[16:56:15] GadgetWisdomGuru: But, it isn't on demand
[16:56:17] GadgetWisdomGuru: It is 24/7
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[17:19:26] ServerSage: Hey folks, is there any tricks to speeding up mythweb? I've added the ExpiresActive and ExpiresByType to the apache config per a few forum posts, but it's still slow.
[17:19:42] wagnerrp: upgrade to trunk
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[17:21:40] ServerSage: wagnerrp: Ug, I'll suffer the slowness and wait for trunk to be released stable.
[17:21:43] justinh: I just disabled pixmaps & loading the recordings page is now *way* faster
[17:22:29] ServerSage: justinh: Good one.
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[17:59:26] iamlindoro: So the new Apple TV has no hard drive and you cannot purchase content (rental only)
[18:00:08] kormoc: That sounds like the perfect frontend!
[18:00:11] ** kormoc braces for the kick **
[18:00:14] iamlindoro: heh
[18:00:23] iamlindoro: I do not see the fascination with renting *anything*
[18:00:23] wagnerrp: flash firmware?
[18:00:29] iamlindoro: especially at $4.99 per movie
[18:00:45] kormoc: I rented a few movies for last weekend when I flew to Vegas and back
[18:00:49] wagnerrp: but you can rent it, break the drm, and now you own it!
[18:00:54] kormoc: gave me something to watch while sitting in the airport
[18:01:01] wagnerrp: blockbusters clearing house
[18:01:26] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: yeah, but there's *no* storage
[18:01:35] iamlindoro: ie, it's streamed every time you watch it
[18:02:05] iamlindoro: new atv has no hard drive-- even the hackers can't find a use for it any more... can't even turn it into a crap FE
[18:05:35] sphery: iamlindoro: isn't it also using the A4 chip? And didn't I hear it won't do 1080i/p decoding?
[18:06:19] iamlindoro: sphery: I dunno
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[18:08:13] sphery: iamlindoro: you must not have seen the right PR release.... It' not that it has /no/ storage. It has *cloud* storage.
[18:08:22] sphery: and everyone knows that the cloud is good
[18:08:27] sphery: just like virtualization is good
[18:08:34] iamlindoro: Keeps the sun off my back
[18:08:52] sphery: I do like the clouds on a hot day when playing beach volleyball
[18:09:08] kormoc: but but but, I like *my* cloud, not theirs :(
[18:09:17] sphery: yeah, A4, no 1080i/p : http://www.engadget.com/2010/08/11/upcoming-a . . . -gains-apps/
[18:09:28] sphery: ah, what a step back :)
[18:10:36] sphery: kormoc: yeah, actually that's my main complaint about Firefox 4... Before upgrading to it, I have to set up my own sync server since I don't want to upload my <everything> to their server (sync is built into FF4)
[18:12:37] sphery: Anyway, ATV is a wonderful idea... put an iPhone without a phone on the TV.
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[18:20:58] iamlindoro: GS:JKGHFKGSHFGHSKGHSDF:GSHKFD
[18:21:13] iamlindoro: "Who's going to be the first to slap a frontend on one of these?"
[18:21:22] iamlindoro: Yeah, then we can find out who the fastest idiot is
[18:21:25] ** kormoc laughs **
[18:21:27] kormoc: go go -users!
[18:21:35] sphery: heh
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[18:22:03] sphery: well, there are still some talking about putting a frontend on the iPad, so why not the iPad-without-touchscreen
[18:24:05] Beirdo: I'd love to have a frontend on an iPad. be the only real use I'd have for one
[18:24:19] Beirdo: make a wonderful kitchen frontend :)
[18:25:02] sphery: would actually be cool for that--except for its inability to actually decode typical MythTV recordings
[18:25:10] Beirdo: yeah, well.
[18:25:11] Beirdo: heh
[18:25:20] Beirdo: shhh
[18:25:22] sphery: the whole transcoding thing makes it a no go for me
[18:25:24] sphery: heh
[18:25:44] sphery: I am thinking of doing a kitchen myth box, though
[18:25:44] wagnerrp: Beirdo: nah, bezel is too ginormous
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[18:26:34] Beirdo: well, it's the touchscreen and about the right size for me
[18:26:45] Beirdo: hard to find that combo
[18:26:59] Beirdo: but of course, it wouldn't work
[18:28:07] wagnerrp: 'mythtv is an appliance. i dont upgrade from a buggy, pre-release version without an overriding reason.'
[18:28:29] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: whaaaaaat?
[18:28:42] iamlindoro: where is that?
[18:29:15] wagnerrp: http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2010 . . . /296297.html
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[18:30:51] iamlindoro: ugh
[18:30:53] iamlindoro: people
[18:31:05] iamlindoro: upgrade because it's BROKEN
[18:31:29] iamlindoro: because your version has multiple playback issues, several know mediamonitor segfaults and startup segfaults, and countless other bugs fixes
[18:33:31] wagnerrp: if theres no local storage, where do the apps go?
[18:33:41] wagnerrp: are they downloaded each time you start the device?
[18:35:18] Gibby: J-e-f-f-A: Got the reply back from hauppauge, the pins on the left are ground
[18:35:58] sphery: at least Mike P's response to that "I don't upgrade" post was a /great/ one.
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[18:36:57] wagnerrp: you know... i couldnt bring myself to rent a movie for $5
[18:37:11] wagnerrp: nearly all of the movies ive purchased have been under $10
[18:37:30] wagnerrp: $5 for a one time rental just seems, foolish
[18:37:44] ** kormoc shifty eyes **
[18:38:19] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: not to mention for HD movies you're getting 10% of the bitrate for 50% of the cost
[18:38:33] high-rez: Man I love being on conf calls that get unfriendly
[18:38:34] wagnerrp: 400% the cost
[18:38:49] iamlindoro: ie "here, this is half as expensive, but with 90% less quality, and you can't keep it. What a deal!"
[18:38:50] kormoc: 400%?
[18:39:08] wagnerrp: http://hddvdboxsets.com
[18:39:21] kormoc: ahh, dead tech :P
[18:39:30] devinheitmueller: wagnerrp: well duh, redbox will rent it to you for $1.00, so naturally getting it streamed to you (where no physical goods change hands) should cost five bucks.
[18:39:31] sphery: heh: "Justify is a valid value for <align>"... Well, a) using a valid value ensure the theme will work properly; b) using a valid value prevents others from copying the invalid value when creating other themes, thereby creating new broken themes; c) using an invalid value provides no benefit to the user or the developer.
[18:39:33] wagnerrp: s/dead/cheap dead/
[18:39:38] sphery: I think that's plenty of justification, but...
[18:40:11] wagnerrp: kormoc: of course for anything warner bros, its $5, plus the $1 original HDDVD
[18:40:22] wagnerrp: so $5 for a low bitrate 720p stream
[18:40:26] wagnerrp: $6 for the real bluray
[18:40:54] devinheitmueller: Oh boy! I can get "The Jerk" for $0.99!
[18:41:05] devinheitmueller: Who the heck decides what movies should be remastered in HD anyway?
[18:41:46] wagnerrp: at 1080p, you can actually see the explosives were in the cans, and it wasnt a sniper across the street
[18:41:52] kormoc: I think it's purely the order the film is in the storage room
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[18:42:38] ** devinheitmueller finishes his lunch and goes back to work. **
[18:43:02] iamlindoro: devinheitmueller: regrettably, a fair number of the HD releases are fairly poorly done telecines with no remastering
[18:43:03] wagnerrp: more of a dunch
[18:43:10] wagnerrp: its almost 3pm
[18:43:24] wagnerrp: or linner, if you prefer
[18:43:30] iamlindoro: The shovelware sucks-- and the stuff that they do a cheap release on, then a good release irritates me too
[18:43:34] devinheitmueller: wagnerrp: well, I was waiting for my wife to return with food.
[18:44:17] devinheitmueller: I don't buy any movies, so I don't really worry about HD versus not. I don't even own a DVD player that does HD.
[18:44:26] devinheitmueller: (pardon, I mean a BluRay or HD-DVD player)
[18:51:34] high-rez: wagnerrp: Have you bought stuff from there before?
[18:51:48] wagnerrp: several of us have
[18:51:57] wagnerrp: of course the selection is limited
[18:52:08] wagnerrp: only about 100 HDDVDs ever stamped
[18:52:53] high-rez: Sure :)
[18:53:00] high-rez: But I've got an HD DVD drive
[18:53:18] high-rez: So who cares? :D It all goes on the raid array anyways
[18:55:02] dougl: KjetilK_, still trying to get vdpau enabled on mythbuntu 10.4... did you have to recompile or just enable an option in mythbuntu?
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[19:02:50] dougl: I am using mythbuntu 10.4 when I copy videos to my video directory they still don't show up in myth – what am I missing?
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[19:13:36] mag0o: scan for changes?
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[19:14:45] dougl: mag0o, yeah... thank you = how do I scan for changes?
[19:14:58] wagnerrp: 'm'
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[19:17:13] dougl: m... thanks wagnerrp & mag0o – no wonder I could not find it on the menus
[19:17:35] wagnerrp: 'm' is for menu
[19:18:56] justinh: heh what an intuitive own goal. who'da thunk – M stands for menu
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[19:29:30] dougl: I wonder what other use keys there are... is there a mythtv for dummies page somewhere?
[19:29:42] justinh: try the manual :)
[19:30:50] dougl: man mythtv
[19:31:18] justinh: INFO, or the I key
[19:31:45] dougl: I – k thanks :)
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[19:43:35] skd5aner: TWC sucks donkey balls... (yes, that's probably against channel rules to say that, sorry – but it's worth the slap on the wrist)
[19:44:33] skd5aner: Why they decide, on a too frequent basis, to mess up QAM enough that I have to rescan to get basic broadcast channels is really getting under my skin – along with all their other sins
[19:45:09] dougl: I managed to edit some of the info for my only 2 movies and now they don't show up in my media library
[19:45:09] wagnerrp: because they can
[19:45:18] wagnerrp: and its transparent to all of their desirable users
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[19:45:59] skd5aner: wagnerrp: have to rescan on my TV that uses QAM too
[19:46:03] skd5aner: (no STB)
[19:46:21] wagnerrp: again, its transparent to all of their desirable users
[19:46:23] skd5aner: not nearly as frustrating of a process – but for myth it's a major pain in the ____
[19:46:45] skd5aner: hey... I'm desirable! At least your mom thinks so... OHHH
[19:46:52] skd5aner: (sorry, I'm running on little sleep today)
[19:47:14] wagnerrp: people using QAM on their TVs are stealing cable as far as they care
[19:47:27] wagnerrp: if youre not spending large sums of money on STBs, youre robbing them blind
[19:47:49] skd5aner: unfortunate as that is, I know it's the truth
[19:47:51] wagnerrp: how dare you use that FCC mandate as it was intended
[19:48:46] skd5aner: WHAAAA?! Cable... from the WALL... going directly into a TELEVISION?!?! WITCHCRAFT I SAY!
[19:58:29] sphery: wagnerrp: my 26s --dd-grab-all on an Athlon II X2 240 makes me wonder about those 10's-of-minutes runs...
[19:59:46] ** mag0o points to his p4 results :) **
[19:59:53] sphery: granted, I have a small lineup--only about 800KB download, but that's only 1/4 of the ~3MB ones that people see taking 26 min or 1/5 the 4MB ones that are taking 45min or whatever
[20:00:14] sphery: mag0o: you didn't post to the list, did you?
[20:00:17] sphery: what were your results
[20:00:20] mag0o: forgot to mention that my lineup was right around a 2mb size
[20:00:21] mag0o: yeah
[20:00:26] mag0o: p4 was around 10 mins
[20:00:35] sphery: do you run optimize_mythdb.pl daily?
[20:00:47] ** iamlindoro gives the data point of "who cares, it runs at 3 AM once a day **
[20:01:00] iamlindoro: and further data of "buy a real machine, suckas"
[20:01:00] sphery: but we need to run it at suggested time
[20:01:04] mag0o: no, but i should, shouldn't i?
[20:01:06] sphery: yeah, that one applies!
[20:01:17] sphery: I think if you do, it may have a beneficial effect on this process
[20:01:23] ** wagnerrp prefers the latter argument **
[20:01:23] sphery: I'd need kormoc to verify, though
[20:01:25] iamlindoro: sphery: Well, I mean *roughly* 3 AM, I do suggested runs
[20:01:46] mag0o: i like to build my machines from spare parts, they contain pieces of my soul, that those little robot thingy's in 9
[20:01:48] sphery: yeah, it /seldom/ ever runs during prime time for me, so, like you said, "who cares"
[20:02:00] kormoc: mag0o, how much of that was download time?
[20:02:26] mag0o: hmm
[20:02:36] kormoc: sphery, it should help, but not /that/ much
[20:02:37] mag0o: didn't take note, but probably around 2–3 mins on my dsl
[20:02:39] sphery: ah, I see your post, now... I was in the wrong thread
[20:02:57] kormoc: sphery, that said, we can disable keys for the updates and then re-enable them, which will speed up myisam
[20:04:10] sphery: yeah, P4 3GHz doing a 2MB file in 10min seems reasonable... The AMD quad-core doing maybe 4MB in 45min seems just plain wrong
[20:04:35] sphery: I still think that guy's system failed to freq-up for the process
[20:04:45] kormoc: gotta check download times
[20:05:09] kormoc: if the guy was uhh... acquiring perfectly legal material via bittorrent...
[20:05:17] mag0o: honestly, it seemed much quicker with the dd-grab-all option than a normal run
[20:05:42] kormoc: mag0o, less downloads, compress better
[20:05:43] kormoc: erm
[20:05:53] kormoc: sphery, know if we're compressing the http stream?
[20:05:58] ** kormoc pokes xris too **
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[20:09:33] sphery: kormoc: He said 2.5min for the download, 3 minutes to clear the existing data for his 50-channel source, and 30min to clear the data for his 500-channel source, then (I assume) the remaining ~10min to insert new data. I extrapolated a size of about 4.5MB based on the 30KB/sec most people seem to be getting from the download.
[20:09:44] dougl: right on full 1080p using less that 3% cpu... nice job mythbuntu 10.4 – now all I have to do is get the sound working
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[20:10:04] sphery: kormoc: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/449445#449445
[20:10:12] kormoc: sphery, that's extremely broken, wow
[20:10:28] iamlindoro: s/mythbuntu 10.04/MythTv .23/
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[20:11:03] wagnerrp: dougl: is that 1080p bluray or some dvb broadcast?
[20:11:07] wagnerrp: what processor?
[20:11:09] sphery: yeah, the 30-min to clear 14days listings from 500 channels... I thought maybe he had his mysql data files on the same drive as his recordings, but he said it's a separate disk: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/449511#449511
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[20:12:05] sphery: kormoc: could broken indices cause that type of issue?
[20:12:16] kormoc: I'd have to look at the queries again
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[20:13:10] sphery: kormoc: not sure about compression--but the networks' penchant for reruns makes for wonderful compression for a 14-day grab (i.e. lots of repeated content that's referenced multiple times rather than repeated multiple times)
[20:13:25] skd5aner: So... what's the deal with the dd-grab-all, I read a little of the #mythtv scroll yesterday and just got to your commit sphery...
[20:13:46] wagnerrp: skd5aner: instead of an individual download for each channel and each day
[20:13:53] wagnerrp: it does just one mass download
[20:14:01] wagnerrp: and then considerable time afterward processing it
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[20:14:07] skd5aner: want me to test something on .23-fixes? my existing mythfilldatabase --refresh-all takes a long time
[20:14:16] wagnerrp: causes less load on the TMS servers
[20:14:21] sphery: skd5aner: /never/ use --refresh-all
[20:14:22] sphery: :)
[20:14:24] skd5aner: be happy to tell you how long it takes
[20:14:29] wagnerrp: runs significantly faster since youre not waiting on them to generate it
[20:14:42] skd5aner: sphery: I rarely do, just very few cases
[20:14:45] dougl: wagnerrp, it was some downloaded content... core 2 duo e2140
[20:14:52] sphery: skd5aner: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/449409#449409
[20:15:19] sphery: skd5aner: followed by http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/449426#449426
[20:15:23] wagnerrp: didnt know they made a desktop core2 that slow
[20:15:42] wagnerrp: anyway, it should be good for maybe 7mbps per core
[20:16:02] skd5aner: sphery: so, what would be a good test "time mythfilldatabase" as a baseline and then "time mythfilldatabase --dd-grab-all"?
[20:17:11] sphery: skd5aner: so, basically (for the release notes), --dd-grab-all grabs all 14 days of data (rather than a default run grabbing only tomorrow and +13)--so you always have the most-current data available. It's also much less load on TMS's servers because it's a single pull rather than multiple (we do at least 2 pulls with default options no matter what, and potentially more, if mythfilldatabase determines there are substantial gaps ...
[20:17:17] sphery: ... in the listings for +12 or +11 or ...)
[20:17:29] sphery: of course, you can work your magic to make that understandable/usable info
[20:18:34] sphery: skd5aner: you can use the log output to get a real time and time distribution... I recommend at least: mythfilldatabase --dd-grab-all 2>&1 | tee ~/mfdb.log
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[20:18:40] sphery: you can put the time before that, too, if you like
[20:20:19] skd5aner: sphery: running... I have 3 lineups
[20:20:23] skd5aner: we'll see how it does
[20:23:49] skd5aner: ok, after download – mysqld ~72% CPU 2.8% memory (2GB), mythfilldatabase ~30% CPU 1.1% memory
[20:24:29] justinh: remember back in the day a full run of uk_rt used to take ages and be a nasty cpu hog
[20:24:39] skd5aner: ~4.3MB I think is the approx it retrieved (I think)
[20:25:41] skd5aner: It looks to me like it might be taking up ~100% of one of my cores
[20:26:09] sphery: what system type?
[20:26:25] skd5aner: AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4200+
[20:26:42] sphery: skd5aner: oh, also for the release notes, you may want to encourage people who tried --dd-grab-all on 0.23-fixes to try again after upgrading to 0.24 since there have been some optimizations.
[20:27:11] sphery: i.e. just because they found it didn't work for them on their system on 0.23-fixes doesn't mean it won't work on 0.24
[20:27:53] skd5aner: sphery: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/MyinnAci
[20:27:58] skd5aner: current snapshot of top
[20:28:53] sphery: yeah, looks about like I'd expect
[20:29:05] skd5aner: sphery: yea, will do... I saw that in the backlog of #mythtv (re: kormoc's sql improvements)
[20:29:20] sphery: cool
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[20:30:01] skd5aner: sphery: you interested in seeing the output of the log?
[20:30:08] skd5aner: it's at "Updating programs" now
[20:30:16] skd5aner: when it's finished I can pastebin if you care
[20:30:22] sphery: it would be nice to get the vast majority of DD users to switch to --dd-grab-all since it's better for the users (all days are the most-current data), better for TMS (less strain on servers), and better for SD (since all days are the most-current, they won't get as many invalid listings problem reports)
[20:30:26] skd5aner: if it helps you baseline
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[20:30:37] sphery: especially once 0.24 is released, it should be mostly doable
[20:30:52] sphery: with the possible exception of those Atom or SheevaPlug users
[20:30:57] iamlindoro: sphery: A great use for locales
[20:31:06] iamlindoro: the en_us locale, and en_ca
[20:31:13] sphery: ah, yeah.... could set it as a default that way
[20:31:20] skd5aner: and fr_ca? ;)
[20:31:22] sphery: danielk wanted to wait until after 0.24 for that
[20:31:34] iamlindoro: sphery: Yeah, just saying it's an ideal use for that new functionality
[20:31:35] sphery: which makes sense--let it sink in with some real-world usage data
[20:31:50] sphery: yeah, I hadn't thought of that, so I appreciate the suggestions
[20:33:45] kormoc: sphery, it looks like everyone reporting long run times have multiple sources?
[20:34:03] sphery: iamlindoro: how many sources do you have?
[20:34:13] skd5aner: I'm def. over 13 minutes now, but again – I've got 3 sources
[20:34:16] iamlindoro: sphery: Two which are currently attached
[20:34:25] sphery: he got 6mins with 370 + 60 channels
[20:34:45] sphery: my 26s seems quite amazing, then
[20:34:50] kormoc: it's gotta be the program table clear not being indexed properly
[20:35:21] skd5aner: I bet I could whittle that to one probably now
[20:36:18] sphery: kormoc: ProgramData::ClearDataByChannel()
[20:36:38] skd5aner: I'm going through my last (and biggest) source here now... so will post the log when it's done and you should be able to see where the slow points are
[20:36:40] sphery: DELETE FROM program WHERE starttime >= :FROM AND starttime < :TO AND chanid = :CHANID ;
[20:36:44] skd5aner: happy to provide additional detail
[20:36:57] sphery: yeah, the log would be nice
[20:37:14] iamlindoro: make sure to anonymize it
[20:37:21] iamlindoro: since it contains username and pass
[20:37:44] skd5aner: iamlindoro: ooh, thanks for the reminder
[20:37:51] iamlindoro: np
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[20:39:17] sphery: iamlindoro: ah, I was going to use that for my next year's subscription
[20:39:26] wagnerrp: my god, they ask you to sign up for a /lot/ of /crap/ when youre renewing a credit card
[20:39:41] sphery: renewing a credit card?
[20:39:59] nutron: I'm crraaaazzzyyy, I'm telling my BE to record all sitcoms :/
[20:40:13] wagnerrp: rather, activating a replacement\
[20:40:17] nutron: 200 channels, of pure re-runs, should give me something to pick through
[20:40:41] wagnerrp: do you want to add this credit protection service? no? how about this one? or this one? or this other one?
[20:40:53] skd5aner: very slow on "Clearing from Mon Aug 30 20:00:00 2010 to Thu Sep 16 19:59:59 2010 (localtime)
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[20:47:15] sphery: kormoc: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/vM9vBLXS ... do we need an index that's /just/ chanid + starttime, or would the chanid + starttime + manualid or chanid + starttime + endtime ones cover us?
[20:47:44] wagnerrp: i dont really understand manualid, why is that included in an index?
[20:47:49] sphery: or maybe we need a starttime index by itself
[20:47:58] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, good ?
[20:48:33] wagnerrp: i mean why is chanid+starttime not sufficient for a unique entry
[20:48:49] sphery: it is
[20:49:00] wagnerrp: then what is manualid included for?
[20:49:04] sphery: but that was optimizing a search that included manualid
[20:49:07] sphery: don't know where, though
[20:49:09] wagnerrp: ah
[20:49:19] sphery: (btw, I meant "good question" but was too lazy to type question)
[20:49:52] wagnerrp: last week, i revised the python bindings to automatically use the 'primary' key as its unique id
[20:50:17] wagnerrp: but for those, i had to force it for 'chanid' and 'starttime' only, since requesting 'manualid' from the user just didnt make any sense
[20:50:24] sphery: yeah
[20:50:39] skd5aner: sphery: still running
[20:50:44] sphery: skd5aner: wow
[20:50:49] wagnerrp: in an unrelated note, this is some of the worst hold music ive ever heard
[20:51:06] kormoc: sphery, it should be enough
[20:51:16] sphery: program indices haven't changed since 0.23-fixes, so ...
[20:51:43] ** sphery wants to patch mysql to allow show indices from program; **
[20:52:45] skd5aner: almost done now – marking stuff
[20:53:57] skd5aner: wagnerrp: give me your credit card number so I can call and listen to the hold music to see if I agree with you opinion
[20:54:03] skd5aner: ;D
[20:55:33] wagnerrp: not only is it awful music, and awful quality music, they have it routed through a bad connection
[20:55:45] wagnerrp: im only actually hearing maybe 40% of it between cutouts
[20:57:34] skd5aner: yay... done!
[20:59:55] wagnerrp: nope, still going
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[21:02:04] wagnerrp: WTF? an ION-based mac mini?
[21:02:12] wagnerrp: madness...
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[21:02:32] justinh: but but but.. insert fanboi praise here
[21:02:38] skd5aner: sphery: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/qPzK0iRF
[21:03:26] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: probably one of the people who thinks ION = 9400 graphics
[21:03:43] iamlindoro: as opposed to w/ atom, or a PCIe GPU, heh... the other two "definitions" of ION
[21:03:45] wagnerrp: but they dont even use a 9400M
[21:03:50] bjd: what? no sheeva plug mac?!
[21:03:59] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: They have IIRC, last model
[21:04:00] sphery: skd5aner: so 37m
[21:04:10] sphery: 4.3MB
[21:04:12] skd5aner: Affirmative
[21:04:18] skd5aner: .23-fixes
[21:04:34] kormoc: skd5aner, wget stuff.kormoc.com/chanClearSpeedTest.sql; mysql < chanClearSpeedTest.sql
[21:04:42] skd5aner: r25137
[21:04:44] wagnerrp: right, last years model used a 9400M, but they now have GT320Ms
[21:05:16] skd5aner: kormoc: this is a prod box running fixes... any danger running that?
[21:05:20] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: yeah, but (and I'm just playing devils advocate) if he misunderstood ION to be "anything with a 9400," then by his (wrong) definition the last model is an "ION"
[21:05:33] iamlindoro: so in theory you could still hop on eBay and get his "ION"
[21:05:38] skd5aner: I mean, I could do a db backup, but...
[21:05:39] kormoc: skd5aner, nope, no changes to the database, just timing
[21:05:48] kormoc: skd5aner, no data is harmed in the making of the output
[21:05:58] iamlindoro: then again, kormoc is a notorious liar
[21:06:13] ** kormoc shifty eyes **
[21:07:18] skd5aner: OK... don't take advantage of the nieve trusting guy who wants to help!
[21:07:27] skd5aner: I'll run it in a moment
[21:08:24] nutron: Hmm i'm seeing segfaults of MFDB on the back end under .23-fixes ... hrrm
[21:09:00] sphery: kormoc: That's cool how you designed it to use a buffer overflow in mysqld to gain root access to skd5aner's box... We'll have to be careful not to let the mysql devs know about this one so we can keep using it.
[21:09:11] ** kormoc laughs **
[21:09:23] skd5aner: evil laughs
[21:09:48] skd5aner: I'm sure they were evil laughs... is what I meant to say
[21:10:20] sphery: kormoc: 2010-09–01 16:27:19.482 Grab complete. Actual data from Tue Aug 31 00:00:00 2010 to Thu Sep 16 23:59:59 2010 (UTC)
[21:10:30] sphery: h2010-09–01 16:27:19.483 Main temp tables populated.
[21:10:48] sphery: took 0.001s to put the data into mysql :)
[21:11:01] skd5aner: btw, joking aside, what's the script do?
[21:11:02] kormoc: That's quite nice :)
[21:11:07] sphery: the whole "putting it in the right place" is just so much work
[21:11:24] kormoc: skd5aner, it gives us the execution plan that it's using to wipe out the program tables
[21:11:36] kormoc: and if you'd be so kind to run it with time in front of it too
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[21:12:04] kormoc: My gut is it takes awhile to delete channel by channel and we should use a source id and when we're doing a grab-all, delete based on source id rather then channel id
[21:12:15] kormoc: or do a in clause on channel ids
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[21:12:43] skd5aner: it takes no time at all
[21:12:59] sphery: kormoc: sourceid won't work for users who use EIT on some channels and xmltv/dd on others
[21:13:00] skd5aner: but each time I run it, the count and rows change
[21:13:29] kormoc: right, I'm picking a random channel to profile
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[21:13:34] skd5aner: only delay is in me entering the mysql password
[21:13:46] skd5aner: OK, so do you need "time" in front of it still?
[21:14:00] kormoc: nah
[21:14:26] skd5aner: np – I'll send you 3 runs...
[21:14:42] sphery: so, 12min to clear the 608-channel source, 30s to clear the 40-channel source, and 2min to clear the 74-channel source
[21:15:01] sphery: definitely seem sthat there's a problem with high-channel-count source clearing
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[21:15:54] kormoc: skd5aner, go ahead and do a run with time and -ppassword on the mysql command line, to remove the human factor out of it
[21:16:07] kormoc: and then use history -c to wipe out the history with the password
[21:16:19] skd5aner: kormoc: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/2ba9DJ60
[21:16:21] skd5aner: ok...
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[21:16:26] sphery: Yeah, I definitely can't post my 26s --dd-grab-all times to the list or people will think I'm holding out on them
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[21:17:15] kormoc: should say 0.00 but be nice to know
[21:17:35] kormoc: interesting, some use id_start_end and some use primary
[21:17:48] kormoc: skd5aner, SHOW CREATE TABLE mythconverg.program\G
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[21:20:25] wagnerrp: whats the \G for?
[21:20:32] skd5aner: was gonna ask that
[21:20:35] sphery: horizontal output
[21:20:41] sphery: or vertical?
[21:20:45] sphery: basically not a table
[21:21:00] kormoc: Vertical
[21:21:10] sphery: yeah, I confuse my directions
[21:21:33] bjd: why was mysql chosen btw?
[21:21:36] kormoc: col: val \n col: val \n col: val
[21:21:42] bjd: serious question, not trolling :)
[21:21:51] sphery: why not mysql?
[21:21:51] kormoc: vs col col col \n val val val\n val val val\n
[21:22:13] justinh: performance more than anything IIRC
[21:22:17] sphery: I think it was just chosen because it was a pretty good DB, it was GPL, and it worked.
[21:22:29] bjd: Lots of people seem to froth at the mouth when you mention MySQL – as opposed to say Postgres
[21:22:30] justinh: or just to annoy ubuntu users.. I'd got for that too ;-)
[21:22:39] skd5aner: kormoc: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/7xZDq3QJ
[21:22:43] kormoc: bjd, it applies in reverse as well
[21:22:49] justinh: bjd: people foam at the mouth when others say My Sequel too
[21:22:58] justinh: or my squl :D
[21:22:59] bjd: haha
[21:23:25] Gibby is now known as Gibby_afk
[21:24:29] skd5aner: kormoc: that what you were looking for?
[21:24:34] kormoc: bjd, much like distro choice, it's really a personal preference between the two
[21:24:40] kormoc: skd5aner, aye, and it looks fine
[21:24:46] justinh: thing is, I bet loads of things use mysql & nobody ever realises cos it's embedded ;-)
[21:24:56] bjd: =)
[21:25:00] skd5aner: anything else you'd like to see?
[21:25:04] sphery: I can't wait 'til users don't know they're using MySQL with MythTV.
[21:25:21] kormoc: skd5aner, not yet
[21:25:34] skd5aner: cool, cause I'm probably going to step away for a bit
[21:25:41] kormoc: assuming 0.071 seconds to do a channel, 600 channels should clear in under a minute
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[21:25:55] kormoc: not the 2.5 you seem to be showing
[21:25:59] kormoc: hrm
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[21:26:12] skd5aner: but yea... I'm not shocked it took 37 mins... mfd has always ran poorly whenever I've actually executed it manually
[21:26:48] skd5aner: that said – that's just me... I'm used to it, not saying it's good/acceptable/etc
[21:26:58] kormoc: yeah, better to figure out why
[21:27:13] skd5aner: yea – now that I know I'm the exception, not the rule
[21:27:39] skd5aner: just let me know when you need more details from me
[21:27:43] kormoc: will do
[21:27:44] skd5aner: happy to help make it better
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[21:28:12] kormoc: sphery, so how does the mixing SD + eit channels work?
[21:28:45] sphery: kormoc: channel.useonairguide
[21:29:18] kormoc: so it fills during a MFDB normally and then updates based on EIT or gets skipped during MFDB?
[21:29:26] sphery: basically for those with that enabled, xmltvid should be empty (or at least not match any xmltvids in your xmltv/dd data)
[21:29:55] sphery: we don't support a single channel using both eit and xmltv/dd, so it's an either-or per channel
[21:29:59] kormoc: kk
[21:30:13] sphery: we don't enforce that restriction with code or the DB, but it would be good to do so
[21:30:30] sphery: there was mention of improving that with the setup rewrite
[21:30:58] sphery: to make sure it's set up appropriately, but if you have a way of making it more efficient while also enforcing the restriction, that's even better :)
[21:31:17] kormoc: DELETE FROM program WHERE chanid IN (SELECT chanid FROM channel WHERE sourceid = blah AND useonairguide =0);
[21:31:25] kormoc: something like that *should* speed it up nicely
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[21:32:39] sphery: so, basically, making it a single clear instead of 600 of them?
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[21:36:35] sircolin: what should the permissions be on my music folder pls mythtv:mythtv or current user ?
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[21:38:47] wagnerrp: whatever user runs the frontend
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[21:41:03] sphery: kormoc: So, we call ProgramData::ClearDataBySource(), which calls ProgramData::ClearDataByChannel(), which does identical deletes for program, programrating, credits, programgenres . Also, it's not actually checking useonairguide to determine which channels to clear, but it's using xmltvid != '' (which makes sense from the standpoint that useonairguide defaults to true--though you also need to enable EIT on the source, so it's ...
[21:41:09] sphery: ... not a problem if you're not using it).
[21:41:19] sphery: would it be possible that the programrating, credits, programgenres may be slowing things down?
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[21:43:07] sphery: kormoc: and, funny enough, it seems that we don't even pay attention to the xmltvid when clearing--so we actually seem to wipe the EIT data, too...
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[21:47:42] kormoc: sphery, aye, could very well be the other tables
[21:47:48] kormoc: sphery, I'll profile some tonight and see
[21:47:53] sphery: thx
[21:47:55] kormoc: sphery, but yeah, less deletes the better
[21:48:11] sphery: I'll look into making a change to do a more efficient delete
[21:48:32] sphery: just have to see if anyone else is using ProgramData::ClearDataBySource() and/or ProgramData::ClearDataByChannel()
[21:48:51] sphery: I'll probably also actually pay attention to xmltvid when appropriate :)
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[21:52:06] Beirdo: just a thought on the mythfilldb...
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[21:52:45] Beirdo: is it technically possible to not delete the old listings until we are ready to dump new ones in (minimize the time with deleted listings somehow)?
[21:53:01] sphery: it's much more complex
[21:53:04] sphery: someone did a patch to do it
[21:53:14] Beirdo: Yeah, I would expect it would be more complex
[21:53:24] sphery: but it was a huge change which didn't have a lot of benefits
[21:53:26] Beirdo: but I think it would be much nicer user experience :)
[21:53:46] sphery: Oh, I see what you mean... I think we clear /right/ before dumping new ones in
[21:53:54] sphery: the clearing is actually the slow part
[21:53:55] Beirdo: having all your schedule disappear "randomly" if you happen to look... ick
[21:54:02] Beirdo: ahh
[21:54:25] Beirdo: we can't do something like rename the old table, rename in the new one, dump the old one or something?
[21:54:47] Beirdo: not sure how that maps to mysql-land :)
[21:55:26] Beirdo: I guess that would only work if we are updating every source
[21:55:27] Beirdo: hmmm
[21:55:36] sphery: so on http://mythtv.pastebin.com/qPzK0iRF , for example, source 1 (74 channels) is cleared in 2mins (16:27:24.961 – 16:29:22.417), source 2 (40 channels) in 30s (16:30:43.966 – 16:31:16.250), and source 3 (608 channels) is cleared in 12min (16:32:23.656 – 16:44:21.948)
[21:55:51] Beirdo: wow
[21:56:27] Beirdo: it's not as easy as just "delete all from table where sourceid=3"?
[21:56:51] Beirdo: I guess even that could take some time, but 12 min... wow
[21:58:09] Beirdo: fun and complex :)
[21:58:24] sphery: and the total run time was 34min (of which we've accounted for 14 1/2)... marking first showings took 2 mins, marking last showings took 2 1/2, downloading data took 2mins 20sec, dumping data into temp tables took 5mins (which is another 12)
[21:59:00] Beirdo: yeah, but during that 14.5min, the show info as seen by the user is significantly funky
[21:59:39] Beirdo: not sure if there's squat we can do about it though, that's what I was curious about :)
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[22:01:28] sphery: but as far as empty tables, we only had from 16:29:22.417 – 16:30:30.066 (1min) when source 1 was clear, 16:31:16.250 – 16:32:11.010 (55s) when source 2 was clear, and 16:44:21.948 – 16:51:40.628 (6min 40s) when source 3 was clear. When adding in the clearing time (during which the table is--for all practical purposes--cleared, though, it becomes much worse)
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[22:11:07] Beirdo: yeah. it's those "HUH?!" emails and tickets that I'd be interested in minimizing :)
[22:11:23] Beirdo: but if it's not plausible, etc... well, we do what we can
[22:13:13] wagnerrp: huh?
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[22:13:41] sphery: yeah, we'll see how things go with the optimization efforts first and then see if it's worth additional code to hide what's happening
[22:13:52] Beirdo: yeah
[22:13:59] Beirdo: play it all by ear
[22:14:07] sphery: wagnerrp: he means tickets that would be created if a user sees their listings disappear for 10s of minutes per day
[22:14:44] Beirdo: yeah "I went to schedule a show, and nothing was there"
[22:15:06] Beirdo: or "The guide grid is busted at this time of day"
[22:15:07] Beirdo: heh
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[22:19:10] skd5aner: iamlindoro: can you give me a quick overview of r26063?
[22:19:15] skd5aner: for changelog
[22:20:04] skd5aner: trying to not guess on that one :)
[22:21:20] sphery: he's gone
[22:21:30] sphery: he's stuck in Comcast's timeout
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[22:21:59] skd5aner: eh – anyone else want to give it a go?
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[22:23:02] sphery: basically just makes it so mfdb gets run unless the user says not to run it (by disabling mythfilldatabase in mythtv-setup).
[22:23:31] skd5aner: So, was that setting being ignored otherwise?
[22:23:49] sphery: since running it doesn't hurt, even if it's not used for anything, it makes sense to run it and those who don't want it can disable it
[22:23:53] J-e-f-f-A: Gibby / Gibby_afk – Isn't that what I told you yesterday? ;-)
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[22:24:16] skd5aner: sphery: just wondering if this isn't a bit of a "fix"
[22:24:26] skd5aner: in terms of the setting within mythtv-setup
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[22:24:39] sphery: the setting was being used, but some users weren't running setup, so the setting wasn't being written, so since the housekeeper was using a different default from setup, that means that the default value was only a default if you actually ran mythtv-setup
[22:24:50] skd5aner: ah
[22:24:54] skd5aner: k, thanks – got it now
[22:25:07] sphery: though I don't know how you can run mythbackend without doing mythtv-setup
[22:25:09] skd5aner: I'll add it later – DINNER'S SERVED! :D
[22:25:17] sphery: maybe some distros pre-configure DB's or something...
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[22:51:45] ComradeHaz`: Hi all. f I try to fastforward faster than 3 times the playback crashes and drops me back to the video selection menu. Any clues on how to fix that?
[22:51:51] ComradeHaz`: Using 3.2
[22:51:54] ComradeHaz`: *3.1
[22:52:29] kormoc: you're fast forwarding at 3.1x?
[22:52:37] kormoc: can you do floats in x speeds?
[22:52:54] wagnerrp: no, hes using mythtv 3.1
[22:53:07] kormoc: I like mythtv 3.11 for workgroups
[22:53:07] wagnerrp: mythtv from the future
[22:53:29] wagnerrp: if you fastforward more than twice, you cause a time inversion
[22:53:34] wagnerrp: a rift in the fabric of space
[22:53:45] wagnerrp: that causes playback to fail
[22:54:20] kormoc: Ahh, hence the temporal deinterlacing
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[22:58:28] ** Beirdo is getting sleepy **
[22:59:08] kormoc: when I snap my fingers, you'll wake up and think you're a chicken. 3... 2... 1...
[22:59:11] ** kormoc snaps his fingers **
[22:59:19] ** Beirdo clucks **
[22:59:23] Beirdo: hehe
[22:59:44] ** Beirdo lays an egg... oh wait. **
[23:00:04] wagnerrp: eew...
[23:00:11] wagnerrp: Beirdo poo'd in the channel
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[23:01:01] Beirdo: I should have an LCD for my mythbox by the weekend
[23:01:09] Beirdo: just for fun
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[23:09:23] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: small character LCD?  ;-)
[23:10:30] Beirdo: 20x2
[23:11:49] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Cool.  ;-) One of the things I *intend* to do is improve the functionality of the LCD support for Myth... I've done some mods to my local copy to make the 20x4 screens much nicer, but they wouldn't work well on a smaller screen at this point.
[23:12:05] Beirdo: cool
[23:12:42] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: one of the limitations is that LCDproc doesn't allow you to program the custom characters – if they did, all sorts of new screens could be created.
[23:12:43] Beirdo: I figured I might as well as there might be some tweaking I'd need to do in that code over time, and having no way at all to test it is rather lame
[23:13:02] Beirdo: LCDproc needs to be kicked in the nads then :)
[23:13:22] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Well, you can use the 'curses' driver (I think that's the proper driver) – that just simulates an LCD to your terminal screen. ;-)
[23:13:46] Beirdo: hehe
[23:14:38] Beirdo: besides, always need more bling for your mythbox
[23:14:38] Beirdo: hehe
[23:14:44] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: I've thought of creating a 'new' lcd driver specifically for hitachi-compatible LCDs that would implement such features (re-defining characters, etc) – that could be chosen as an 'alternative' driver to lcdproc, but haven't done much on it.
[23:14:58] Beirdo: nice
[23:15:02] Beirdo: that sounds like fun
[23:15:24] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Look at all the neat stuff folks have come up with for VDR for LCD support – it totally blows away what we have, since we're limited by lcdproc. :-(
[23:15:42] Beirdo: well, how do they access the LCD?
[23:15:47] Beirdo: and why can't we?
[23:16:07] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Ya know, that's a good question – /me should look into that! ;-)
[23:16:37] J-e-f-f-A: !trout J-e-f-f-A why-didn't-you-think-of-that
[23:16:37] ** MythLogBot slaps J-e-f-f-A with a why-didn't-you-think-of-that trout on behalf of J-e-f-f-A... **
[23:16:42] Beirdo: assuming it's open source (which I'm pretty sure VDR is), no reason why their code can't be leveraged that I can think of
[23:16:54] Beirdo: especially if ours is lacking, or stale, etc.
[23:17:24] Beirdo: dunno that many people care too much about the LCD stuff at this point
[23:17:30] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Hehe... Yeah, I'll bet if you looked at the last change to the LCD code it's from me – like 2 or 3 years ago... ;-)
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[23:19:57] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: This site is in German [or dutch? i dunno!], but look how pretty the displays are: http://vdr-wiki.de/wiki/index.php/Display
[23:20:01] Beirdo: wouldn't be too surprising
[23:20:34] Beirdo: that'd be German
[23:21:02] Beirdo: hard to do much with character-based 20x2 though
[23:21:38] RyeBrye (RyeBrye!~ryebrye@67.199.188.189) has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[23:21:58] Beirdo: the graphics LCDs though... nice
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[23:23:31] J-e-f-f-A: Yeah, but much more is possible with the 8 custom characters – you can animate stuff pretty nicely.
[23:23:39] Beirdo: true
[23:24:09] J-e-f-f-A: I've done character lcd programming on microcontrollers, and you can get some pretty decent looking screens.
[23:24:57] kormoc: I'd animate your mom but I'd need a extended charset... OOHHHHH SNAP!
[23:25:06] J-e-f-f-A: Even something simple, like an inverse 'R' for recording, etc.
[23:25:34] ** kormoc blames who ever did the your mom joke earlier **
[23:26:08] wagnerrp: your mom did that joke last night
[23:26:29] wagnerrp: she did that joke all... night... long...
[23:26:39] kormoc: ooh! I've been told!
[23:27:22] J-e-f-f-A: Anyways... way past time to head home... ;-) ttyl.
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[23:33:39] mzb: Beirdo, http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/mythtv/ . . . t_result.jpg
[23:33:46] mzb: ^^ connected to mythfrontend
[23:34:03] mzb: + custom bignum
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[23:45:06] Baylink: Evening folks. Upgrading from 0.22 to 0.23.1 by way of a fresh Packman RPM install to a fresh SuSE 11.3. Is there any reasonable way, these days, to inhale and upgrade the old database, so I can keep the old recordings? I looked through the wiki, but didn't see that covered.
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[23:46:58] Baylink: Hey, Beirdo. Howya?
[23:48:00] kormoc: Baylink, restore the database and run mythtv-setup
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[23:48:53] Baylink: Recorded is the only thing I want to keep; my card database was kinda monkeyed; that won't cause worse problems than it solves?
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[23:51:06] kormoc: just delete the cards and re-add cleanly
[23:51:22] wagnerrp: tell it 'delete all cards'
[23:51:34] wagnerrp: deleting off a single host will not reset the autoincrement
[23:51:41] wagnerrp: if youre looking to keep the card ids clean
[23:54:53] Baylink: Got it. Ok; thanks. I may have larger fish to fry; it appears my Radeon 9600 TVout card isn't supported with newer kernels.
[23:56:18] Baylink: The driver what works with that card only goes up to Xorg 7.4, and I'm running ... [looks] ... 1.8.0?

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