Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Wednesday, April 7th, 2010, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:04]

skd5aner:

I can't decide if I want to go with a satelite solution or not... TWC has really pissed me off

[00:00:27]

skd5aner:

abqjp: same here, firewire is worthless

[00:00:45]

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[00:01:57]

abqjp:

Comcast, here, added the 5C almost exactly 1 year before the HD-PVR was announced. I pre-ordered a HD-PVR as soon as I could. I am glad that janneg was able to come up with a linux driver for it!

[00:02:17]

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[00:06:02]

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[00:07:03]

matmatmat:

ok, my problem now is the channel wont change until i restart the backend

[00:07:13]

matmatmat:

the backend is not crashed tho

[00:07:25]

matmatmat:

how should i debug that exactly?

[00:08:06]

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[00:08:22]

matmatmat:

well ok, now the frontend is hanging as well

[00:08:34]

matmatmat:

should i kill it?

[00:10:42]

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[00:15:48]

EvilRick:

hey guys I just installed mythtv on ubuntu. how do I add existing avi and mkv's to the catalog

[00:15:56]

EvilRick:

is the "start bar" supposed to still be there once mythtv starts?

[00:17:46]

mythtimelord:

evilrick the existing video files need to be in directories that are part of your storage groups. if you have not modified their location, i believe that the default on ubuntu is in /var/lib/mythtv/videos

[00:17:52]

abqjp:

EvilRick: the "start bar" insisting on being on top, is a WM issue. You could try a different WM.

[00:19:39]

iamlindoro:

s/WM issue/using compiz issue/

[00:19:51]

iamlindoro:

s/try a different WM/turn off compiz/

[00:21:24]

abqjp:

iamlindoro: heh, I guess I always associated it with the WM, since I typically use ratpoison, and it does not have that problem.

[00:21:54]

iamlindoro:

abqjp, only make the correction out of having troubleshot it a half trillion times :)

[00:24:40]

EvilRick:

will the start bar impact performance or available vide acceleration features available?

[00:24:56]

EvilRick:

can I symlink in /var/lib/mythtv/videos?

[00:26:09]

iamlindoro:

just turn off compiz

[00:26:17]

iamlindoro:

and then it won't be an issue one way or another

[00:26:42]

iamlindoro:

that's in ubuntu's "appearance" menu somewhere (Visual Effects?)

[00:26:48]

iamlindoro:

set to "None," done.

[00:27:01]

EvilRick:

k.. what about using symlinks?

[00:28:44]

iamlindoro:

symlinks are fine

[00:39:57]

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[00:45:36]

mythtimelord:

so i have a laptop running as a remote frontend which works just fine. when i plug it into a tv the menus are displayed on both the laptop and the tv, however when i play a video or watch live tv its only displayed on the laptop screen, has anyone run into this before/ have a solution?

[00:48:05]

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[00:48:10]

sphery:

which mythbuntu had the pre-release 0.22 in it?

[00:48:22]

sphery:

was it 9.04 or 9.10 or both or...

[00:48:45]

mag0o:

i do mythtimelord but i forget what i did to make it start on screen 1

[00:49:02]

sphery:

mythtimelord: the problem is that video drivers only support Xv on a single screen, so you have to do ^^^

[00:49:07]

sphery:

(what mag0o said)

[00:49:23]

sphery:

change the order of the screens so that the TV is the first

[00:49:41]

sphery:

or tell the driver to use the second (if any driver allows that)

[00:49:52]

mythtimelord:

heh i was tryin to avoid xorg.conf :D alas it was to no avail

[00:51:01]

sphery:

mythtimelord: might work to set the Display on screen setting

[00:51:11]

sphery:

in mythfrontend Appearance settings

[00:51:30]

mythtimelord:

hmm i'll try that thanks

[00:52:13]

mag0o:

looks like im using twinview with the nvidia driver

[00:52:44]

mythtimelord:

was looking at the display manager for xfce and it didn't even list the tv but maybe inside myth it'll be a different story since the computer obviously sees the tv

[00:53:20]

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[00:53:32]

sphery:

if it's twinview, you might have to use nvidia-settings to change it

[00:54:14]

mythtimelord:

i don't have nvidia drivers installed on it

[00:54:46]

sphery:

then it's not twinview :)

[00:54:54]

mythtimelord:

yep

[00:55:03]

sphery:

so try the Display on screen setting

[00:55:23]

sphery:

otherwise, your config-less X will become a config-ed X

[00:55:49]

sphery:

(if Display on screen doesn't work, you'll have to do an xorg.conf)

[00:56:18]

mythtimelord:

yeah i'ma go give it a shot now that wintergrasp is over >_>

[01:00:29]

wagnerrp:

ugh... 4.5GB for an hour recording

[01:01:47]

wagnerrp:

chuch was a halfway respectable 6GB last night, but was covered in weather tickers

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[01:04:54]

sphery:

wagnerrp: my Chick last night was 7300558316 bytes

[01:05:14]

sphery:

is it your cable co or your local broadcaster who's cutting bitrate?

[01:05:19]

** wagnerrp slaps sphery with his poor quality recordings **

[01:05:32]

wagnerrp:

dont know, i really need to set up an antenna and find out

[01:06:02]

sphery:

would be interesting to find out

[01:06:52]

matmatmat:

is ppa(testing) the daily builds or something less recent?

[01:07:32]

draioch:

hi folks im looking for a well supported capture card to use mythtv as a PVR can anyone suggest one

[01:08:36]

draioch:

well supported (linux of course)

[01:08:55]

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[01:09:20]

matmatmat:

i think its weekly builds, can i set it to daily builds too?

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[01:19:57]

sphery:

draioch: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/

[01:22:01]

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[01:38:36]

EvilRick:

I sumlinked an external drive into /var/lib/mythtv/videos but I cant see them in the catalog

[01:38:42]

EvilRick:

is there something else I must do?

[01:39:11]

mythtimelord:

yeah once you add files you need to either run mythfill database or hit the menu button and "scan for changes"

[01:39:38]

sphery:

mythfilldatabase won't help

[01:39:39]

EvilRick:

menu button? where is it

[01:39:42]

sphery:

gotta do scan for changes

[01:39:44]

sphery:

MENU = M

[01:39:54]

mythtimelord:

ahh thanks sphery didn't know that

[01:40:02]

sphery:

mythfilldatabase is just for program listings

[01:40:08]

mythtimelord:

gotcha

[01:40:09]

sphery:

should be called mythgetprogramlistings

[01:40:11]

sphery:

:)

[01:40:21]

EvilRick:

I press m and and my options are "about" and "cancel"

[01:40:36]

sphery:

in MythVideo?

[01:40:36]

EvilRick:

tile is system menu

[01:40:47]

sphery:

you need to go to MythVideo first

[01:40:54]

sphery:

Media Library|Videos

[01:41:16]

EvilRick:

I only have media Library->Watch recordings

[01:41:36]

sphery:

You need to install MythVideo, then. It's part of mythplugins package

[01:42:01]

sphery:

EvilRick: you /are/ talking about videos that weren't recorded by MythTV, right?

[01:42:02]

EvilRick:

I'm on it

[01:42:06]

EvilRick:

yup

[01:42:14]

sphery:

ok, then, yeah, you need MythVideo

[01:44:35]

beata:

anyone using IONITX-A-U as a frontend dooing HD playback?

[01:45:19]

wagnerrp:

plenty

[01:45:58]

beata:

good to here thinking about using it as a fe

[01:46:16]

wagnerrp:

better to pick up one of the dual core versions

[01:46:36]

EvilRick:

heh.. this might take a while.. the "external drive" is a 10TB raid array

[01:46:49]

mag0o:

hehe

[01:47:05]

wagnerrp:

thats a big-un

[01:47:14]

wagnerrp:

EvilRick: 0.22 or 0.23?

[01:47:17]

EvilRick:

I must say, its faster than I expected.

[01:47:23]

beata:

wagnerrp: it is dual core

[01:47:31]

beata:

and i though my 5tb was big

[01:47:32]

wagnerrp:

'faster'... you must be running 0.22

[01:47:47]

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[01:47:51]

EvilRick:

can tell untill its done

[01:48:04]

wagnerrp:

beata: ok, i didnt know which letters had which processors

[01:48:13]

wagnerrp:

theres half a dozen of those zotac boards

[01:48:21]

jesse`:

Hey ho. What's the easiest way to forget all previously recorded episodes for a show? I can't seem to find that option in mythfrontend.

[01:48:28]

wagnerrp:

EvilRick: if youre using 0.22, the scan should only take a couple seconds

[01:48:36]

wagnerrp:

if youre using 0.23, the scan could take tens of minutes

[01:48:43]

EvilRick:

took a minue and a half

[01:48:43]

jesse`:

Of course, I could just edit the oldrecorded table, but that just seems wrong.

[01:49:49]

EvilRick:

long filenames are hard to read

[01:49:50]

wagnerrp:

jesse`: do you still have those recordings?

[01:49:58]

jesse`:

No.

[01:50:09]

wagnerrp:

you can either do it one at a time in the frontend

[01:50:22]

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[01:50:34]

wagnerrp:

or you can open sql, and run something like 'update oldrecorded set duplicate=0 where title="whatever";'

[01:50:41]

jesse`:

I can only forget the episodes that appear in the schedule via the frontend, not *all* episodes.

[01:51:20]

jesse`:

Yeah, I guess my method was cruder. I just removed all the records for the show from oldrecorded. What's the duplicate flag do?

[01:51:44]

jesse`:

Anyway, *shouldn't* there be a handier way than editing the table?

[01:51:58]

EvilRick:

it was 0.22

[01:52:25]

wagnerrp:

must have a lot of small files

[01:52:37]

wagnerrp:

EvilRick: have fun upgrading...

[01:52:42]

EvilRick:

nothing smaller than 350 megs

[01:52:42]

** wagnerrp cackles menacingly **

[01:52:44]

mythtimelord:

wagnerrp is .23 going to slow down the searches? or is that only because its in beta

[01:52:50]

EvilRick:

mostly 1 gig and >

[01:52:55]

jesse`:

Some posts I've found suggest that there used to be an easier way.

[01:53:12]

wagnerrp:

jesse`: not that i know of

[01:53:29]

wagnerrp:

mythtimelord, EvilRick: in 0.23, all files now get hashed

[01:53:30]

jesse`:

wagnerrp: Oh, well. Thanks.

[01:53:34]

wagnerrp:

its not a full hash, mind you

[01:53:38]

EvilRick:

jeeeez

[01:53:40]

EvilRick:

oh ok

[01:53:45]

EvilRick:

how much of a hash?

[01:53:48]

wagnerrp:

its based off the file size, and the first and last 128KB

[01:54:06]

wagnerrp:

just enough to positively identify the file

[01:54:21]

wagnerrp:

it lets it track moved files

[01:54:31]

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[01:54:32]

wagnerrp:

without you having to re-download metadata for it

[01:54:46]

EvilRick:

any ideas how to make the interface more legible?

[01:54:53]

wagnerrp:

legible?

[01:55:00]

EvilRick:

Long filenames are impossible to figure out

[01:55:05]

EvilRick:

esp folder names

[01:55:21]

EvilRick:

eg -> Discovery HD – The..

[01:55:44]

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[01:55:57]

wagnerrp:

change the view to one that better handles long file names?

[01:57:59]

EvilRick:

how do I check that hardware assisted decode is happening

[01:58:08]

EvilRick:

its struggling with 1080p

[01:58:15]

wagnerrp:

check your CPU load

[01:58:36]

EvilRick:

other than that :) cpu load is high

[01:58:36]

sphery:

jesse`: in mythfrontend -> Manage Recordings|Previously Recorded, find any showing of the title in question, SELECT (usually Space or Enter), then "Remove all episodes for this title"

[01:58:39]

mag0o:

LOST anyone?

[01:58:45]

sphery:

jesse`: don't do it with direct DB access

[01:59:24]

sphery:

mag0o: mine is recording LOST, but thanks to Dancing with the Stars, they're not showing my enhances episodes

[01:59:27]

sphery:

enhanced

[01:59:32]

mag0o:

:)

[01:59:38]

mag0o:

it's quite good

[02:00:05]

EvilRick:

takes long vor the video dialog to load

[02:00:09]

sphery:

haven't decided whether to watch it tonight or savor it later

[02:00:21]

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[02:00:30]

mag0o:

i'd say this one is worth watching

[02:00:39]

mag0o:

if youve been watching from the first season

[02:01:01]

jesse`:

sphery: I don't see "Remove all episodes for this title".

[02:01:08]

sphery:

mag0o: I have been

[02:01:13]

nwidger:

everytime i open mythmusic the 'Repeat' option is set to 'All'. ive looked through the settings page but havent found any way to have this be set to 'None' by default. is there a way to do this?

[02:01:13]

sphery:

jesse`: what do you see?

[02:01:24]

EvilRick:

Should hardware decode work on an integrated nvidia 8100 – mcp78v chipset

[02:01:25]

jesse`:

sphery: I see "Forget previous", but that forgets a single episode.

[02:01:26]

sphery:

jesse`: you may need to use MENU instead of SELECT

[02:02:11]

jesse`:

sphery: "Menu" takes me back to the Schedule Programs menu, rather than putting up a menu.

[02:02:23]

sphery:

jesse`: then you're doing something wrong...

[02:02:27]

EvilRick:

is there a reason my mouse cursor doesnt work?

[02:02:40]

sphery:

jesse`: you're in Manage Recordings|Previously Recorded in mythfrontend?

[02:02:43]

jesse`:

sphery: Er, hm. "M" for Menu, right?

[02:02:48]

sphery:

jesse`: and it is SELECT, not MENU

[02:02:50]

jesse`:

sphery: Yes.

[02:02:52]

sphery:

so space/Enter

[02:02:53]

wagnerrp:

EvilRick: you have it disabled in the settings

[02:03:15]

sphery:

jesse`: it will only give you those options if you actually have a rule that would record the show

[02:03:18]

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[02:03:27]

wagnerrp:

should be under Appearance somewhere, dont remember where

[02:04:09]

jesse`:

sphery: Oh, shit, my fault. Just a tick.

[02:04:14]

EvilRick:

+wagnerrpshould I use Qt or opengl?

[02:04:22]

EvilRick:

nvidia driver here.

[02:04:25]

wagnerrp:

opengl

[02:05:10]

sphery:

jesse`: language, please, but does that mean you figured it out?

[02:05:42]

jesse`:

sphery: Sorry for the language. Yes, I found I was in the wrong screen, just as you suggested. Silly me.

[02:05:52]

EvilRick:

mouse isnt under appearance settings :/

[02:05:56]

jesse`:

sphery: I got it now, thanks.

[02:06:06]

EvilRick:

ah wait

[02:06:08]

EvilRick:

found it

[02:06:19]

sphery:

jesse`: cool... glad you got it

[02:07:36]

EvilRick:

any way to make the video dialog load faster

[02:08:22]

EvilRick:

takes about 16 seconds to load

[02:08:40]

sphery:

EvilRick: populate metadata and don't use slow drives

[02:08:47]

wagnerrp:

16 seconds to load what?

[02:08:56]

EvilRick:

drives are fast

[02:09:04]

sphery:

the former will likely do you more good

[02:09:09]

EvilRick:

raid 5 read throughput of 500MB/s

[02:09:28]

sphery:

EvilRick: slow drives includes fast hard drives connected via slow links (USB or whatever)

[02:09:48]

wagnerrp:

what do you mean by 'video dialog'?

[02:10:11]

EvilRick:

+sphery, hey I know ..

[02:10:17]

sphery:

and ^^^ (like which view in MythVideo, using directory browse, ...)

[02:10:45]

EvilRick:

these are all connected internally on the machine via sata 3Gbps

[02:10:49]

sphery:

wagnerrp knows mythvideo far better than I, so he's likely to be able to help you much more beyond the basics

[02:10:52]

wagnerrp:

if youre using 'browse mode' it turns off metadata, and rescans the directory each time

[02:11:14]

EvilRick:

using "Watch Videos"

[02:11:16]

wagnerrp:

are you saying it takes that long to enter mythvideo?

[02:11:43]

EvilRick:

Sorry I loaded the mediacenter menus

[02:11:48]

wagnerrp:

when you enter mythvideo (click on 'Watch Videos')

[02:11:55]

wagnerrp:

it just does one huge database lookup

[02:11:56]

EvilRick:

and theres a root menu item called watch videos

[02:12:00]

wagnerrp:

and populates the directories

[02:12:14]

EvilRick:

when I go there It takes 15 seconds to load

[02:12:17]

wagnerrp:

on a system with some 3500 videos, that takes all of less than a second

[02:12:19]

EvilRick:

the screen shows

[02:12:35]

wagnerrp:

what processor is your frontend and sql server running?

[02:12:41]

EvilRick:

Video Dialog Loading, orno videos available

[02:12:59]

EvilRick:

all on one machine

[02:13:03]

mag0o:

s/, /, p/

[02:13:06]

mag0o:

;)

[02:13:08]

EvilRick:

the catalog has a lot of files I guess

[02:13:20]

EvilRick:

but It should just load it as you drill into the structure

[02:13:23]

EvilRick:

not all at once

[02:13:36]

EvilRick:

10TB of videos is a lot of files

[02:13:38]

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[02:13:45]

wagnerrp:

how many files?

[02:13:54]

EvilRick:

dunno never counted

[02:13:56]

wagnerrp:

as mentioned, i have almost no wait time with ~3500

[02:14:14]

wagnerrp:

open mysql, and 'select count(0) from videometadata;'

[02:15:14]

sphery:

and make sure you're not using browse mode, right?

[02:15:42]

leprechau:

does anyone know how to stop mythfrontend from leaving all the defunct pids?

[02:15:48]

EvilRick:

79981

[02:15:54]

leprechau:

I tried the trick of creating the fake 'udevinfo' shell script pointing to 'udevadm info' but that didn't help

[02:16:11]

EvilRick:

i guess its a bit more

[02:16:14]

wagnerrp:

yeah... that may take 16 seconds

[02:16:14]

sphery:

That's 80K videos purchased legally...

[02:16:25]

EvilRick:

YES!

[02:16:29]

** mag0o saw that coming **

[02:16:40]

sphery:

at say, $5/used DVD, that's only $400,000

[02:16:42]

sphery:

nice collection

[02:16:43]

wagnerrp:

that a bunch of split up music videos or something?

[02:17:00]

EvilRick:

yeah I think it may have a lot of music in there

[02:17:16]

wagnerrp:

music wouldnt be picked up by mythvideo

[02:17:23]

wagnerrp:

only standard video extensions

[02:17:33]

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[02:18:40]

wagnerrp:

i think youre somehow picking up a lot of files that shouldnt be in there

[02:18:40]

EvilRick:

ok.. now for the accelerated video decode

[02:18:44]

EvilRick:

how do I tackle this

[02:18:54]

EvilRick:

cause the chipset should handle it I think

[02:20:41]

sphery:

leprechau: either make a link called udevinfo that refers to udevadm or make a wrapper script for udevadm called udevinfo or apply the patch on #6137, which may or may not work and may do bad things to your system

[02:21:13]

sphery:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/6137 for patches or read http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7135 for several of the workarounds

[02:21:18]

sphery:

leprechau: ^^^

[02:21:36]

leprechau:

sphery, I tried the wrapper script in 6137 but I still get the defunct pids

[02:21:40]

leprechau:

I'll look at the others

[02:21:41]

leprechau:

thanks

[02:22:00]

** mag0o just doesn't look at the output from ps and i'm none the wiser **

[02:22:11]

mag0o:

easy fix!

[02:22:27]

sphery:

leprechau: with the wrapper, you'll get the same problem if you can't execute the script or if the script can't execute udevadm

[02:22:38]

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[02:22:42]

sphery:

IMHO, any sane distribution makes udevadm only executable by root

[02:22:52]

sphery:

leprechau: so you may need a sudo in there

[02:23:05]

leprechau:

gotcha thanks I'll play around with it some more

[02:23:17]

sphery:

then again, I can't say that your distro is sane, so that may not be the issue

[02:23:26]

sphery:

but mag0o's fix is also a wonderful one

[02:23:28]

leprechau:

it's archlinux

[02:24:06]

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[02:24:12]

sphery:

leprechau: another solution, disable MediaMonitor

[02:24:18]

sphery:

(works for me :)

[02:25:20]

EvilRick:

must I implicitly set VDPAU ?

[02:25:40]

wagnerrp:

you have to tell mythtv to use the VDPAU Slim profile

[02:26:00]

EvilRick:

why specifically slim?

[02:26:25]

wagnerrp:

because your graphics chip cant handle any of the better deinterlacers

[02:26:43]

EvilRick:

is there a breakdown of chipset vs features?

[02:26:53]

EvilRick:

In case I decide to get a different card

[02:26:57]

wagnerrp:

it simply doesnt have the power

[02:26:57]

sphery:

leprechau: just verified that Qt4.6.2 is still affected by the underlying bug (through a test program, not through Myth), so even upgrading to latest Qt won't help.

[02:27:02]

** sphery wishes they would fix it **

[02:27:08]

wagnerrp:

the deinterlacers run in the graphics shader hardware

[02:27:15]

wagnerrp:

and your chip barely has any

[02:27:36]

EvilRick:

only de-interlacers?

[02:27:41]

mag0o:

EvilRick: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Vdpau

[02:27:46]

EvilRick:

modt of my content is progressive in any case

[02:27:46]

wagnerrp:

only deinterlacers

[02:28:13]

EvilRick:

thats retarded.. I though it assisted decode not post processing

[02:28:24]

EvilRick:

like did some fft transforms

[02:28:40]

sphery:

leprechau: there's another patch at http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/6866

[02:28:48]

sphery:

again, not in MythTV, so no warranty

[02:28:49]

wagnerrp:

thats right... it does full decode in hardware

[02:29:02]

wagnerrp:

post processing is done in software, on the graphics shaders

[02:29:04]

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[02:29:16]

leprechau:

sphery, thanks man ... helped alot

[02:29:19]

leprechau:

I think I got it

[02:30:05]

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[02:30:07]

sphery:

I really don't understand the Media Monitor in the first place. People turn it on, then they complain that, "I put a DVD in the drive while watching something else, and it stopped playing the recording and went to DVD playback."

[02:30:21]

sphery:

if you don't want it automatically doing stuff, don't tell it to automatically do stuff

[02:30:37]

sphery:

Turn off Media Monitor and have jump points for all the useful functions

[02:30:45]

sphery:

but that's just my opinion

[02:32:59]

sphery:

s/People turn it on/People leave it on/

[02:34:08]

justdave:

and then I have the opposite problem, I have the media monitor turned on, but nothing happens when I insert a DVD, I still have to go hit "Play DVD" in the optical disk menu

[02:34:23]

justdave:

which is probably something simple like not having it set to the right device to watch

[02:34:31]

justdave:

but I haven't been annoyed by it enough to go hunt it down yet

[02:34:44]

sphery:

no, I guess it's disabled by default

[02:34:47]

EvilRick:

ok so how do I retrieve metadata?

[02:34:53]

mag0o:

I

[02:35:12]

sphery:

justdave: it may also be due to the fact that it's pretty much broken because of the change from udevinfo to udevadm

[02:35:36]

sphery:

EvilRick: hit w when the video is selected

[02:36:20]

justdave:

now that I'm thinking of it, I'll go look. :)

[02:36:27]

** justdave tails /var/log/messages and inserts a DVD **

[02:36:50]

justdave:

and, kernel says the device with the insert is sr0

[02:36:58]

justdave:

MythTV is indeed set to watch /dev/sr0

[02:37:11]

justdave:

so yeah, must just be the brokenness. :)

[02:37:54]

justdave:

or maybe it's missing the insert because GNOME is auto-mounting it

[02:38:31]

sphery:

yeah, auto-mount breaks it, too

[02:39:12]

** justdave unchecks "mount removable drives when hotplugged" in the gnome prefs **

[02:40:00]

justdave:

booo.

[02:40:03]

justdave:

that sorta fixed it. :)

[02:40:10]

justdave:

now MythTV actually tries to mount it

[02:40:24]

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[02:40:25]

justdave:

and pops an error up on the screen saying the mount failed because the device is write-protected

[02:40:34]

justdave:

well duh, it's a DVD :)

[02:40:47]

mag0o:

hehe

[02:41:01]

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[02:44:45]

mag0o:

man, simon & simon on rtv

[02:46:01]

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[02:52:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

mag0o: where ya been? That's been on for months now... ;-)

[02:52:37]

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[02:52:43]

justdave:

hey, so does anyone know any themes for 0.22 that work good with MythVideo? most of the default set provided with MythBuntu seem to like to cut off the video titles.

[02:53:20]

justdave:

which isn't very useful when looking at a directory of files that all have the first 10 letters in common and the differentiating part of the name is at the end

[02:53:40]

Oleg_:

I don't understand why mythtv doesn't wanna use mplayer during video playback even though I made mplayer my default choice

[02:53:49]

Oleg_:

I never defined any storage directories

[02:53:53]

justdave:

Oleg_: filetype overrides?

[02:54:00]

Oleg_:

what do you mean?

[02:54:17]

justdave:

in the video setup you can define a custom player for each filetype in addition to the default

[02:54:24]

justdave:

I believe you can override it per-file as well

[02:55:11]

justdave:

(via "Manage Videos" in 0.21, via the Info menu in "Watch Videos" in 0.22)

[02:55:23]

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[02:59:01]

Oleg_:

oh, cool thanks

[02:59:11]

Oleg_:

now it uses mplayer for playback

[02:59:31]

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[03:07:06]

Oleg_:

fucking weird. why doesn't mplayer have any problems with playing any hd file, but the internal player of mythtv does?

[03:08:40]

J-e-f-f-A:

Please watch your language...

[03:08:56]

justdave:

depends on the file, different players are better at different things

[03:09:07]

markl_:

how is this bug coming along: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8193

[03:09:25]

justdave:

I find mplayer tends to play just about everything, so I let mine use mplayer for most stuff

[03:09:39]

justdave:

the few things I've run across that mplayer can't handle, the internal player happens to be able to

[03:09:54]

justdave:

the internal player seems to get better with every major release though

[03:11:57]

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[03:21:17]

wagnerrp:

oof... 0B recording tonight

[03:22:32]

wagnerrp:

amazing

[03:23:14]

wagnerrp:

the cable co managed to shuffle their lineup at 9PM... right in between shows in the middle of prime time

[03:25:18]

mag0o:

wow

[03:25:51]

sphery:

wagnerrp: nice...

[03:26:08]

sphery:

does that mean you missed LOST? or some other less important channel?

[03:26:19]

wagnerrp:

ncis la

[03:26:26]

wagnerrp:

ncis recorded just fine

[03:26:31]

sphery:

ah... might have repeats?

[03:26:36]

wagnerrp:

then they shuffled channels, and la failed

[03:26:40]

sphery:

(I'm currently on my NCIS: LA kick)

[03:26:41]

wagnerrp:

yeah... CBS is good about repeats

[03:26:42]

[R]:

why does everyone thing lost is like the best show since sliced bread... its just a tv show

[03:26:56]

sphery:

[R]: it's the last few episodes

[03:27:05]

sphery:

suplly/deman

[03:27:12]

sphery:

er, supply/demand

[03:27:17]

sphery:

wow, I was way off on that one

[03:27:22]

mag0o:

just a couple letters

[03:27:38]

sphery:

but to great effect

[03:28:45]

mag0o:

speaking of lost, i need to add the first season to my netflix queue to review

[03:29:52]

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[03:30:34]

sphery:

now that's dedication

[03:31:21]

mag0o:

hehe, i just added them to the watch now queue, not real dvd queue

[03:32:07]

sphery:

regardless, going back and re-watching them takes some real motivation

[03:32:14]

mag0o:

watch tonights

[03:32:34]

mag0o:

and that's all i'll say about that

[03:33:09]

sphery:

heh, maybe I should stop this NCIS: LA I just started and switch to LOST

[03:33:35]

sphery:

starting LOST

[03:33:41]

mag0o:

:)

[03:34:36]

sphery:

just from the person of focus, I can tell it will be interesting

[03:35:39]

mag0o:

yep

[03:36:53]

sphery:

this may actually be the first time in history that I've watch and episode of LOST before iamlindoro

[03:37:27]

mag0o:

heh

[03:42:17]

** iamlindoro grumbles **

[03:42:23]

Beirdo:

K, that was a fun movie

[03:42:30]

iamlindoro:

This wouldn't happen if I had 80K "legal" *cough* videos

[03:42:39]

sphery:

heh

[03:42:45]

Beirdo:

How To Train Your Dragon. fun times. :)

[03:42:57]

wagnerrp:

well you know... he pulls out all the individual bonus videos off the DVDs

[03:43:24]

iamlindoro:

Heh, oh, ok, so it's only 20K or so "legal" *cough* videos ;)

[03:46:40]

sphery:

then again, maybe he was using one of those DVR's designed by some of our mythtv-users list people that recording everything in 1-minute chunks and then make shows by linking a list of sixty 1-min hunks together...

[03:47:00]

sphery:

Then it's only 1333 hours and 20min of recordings

[03:47:10]

sphery:

which is--strangely enough--almost exactly what I have

[03:48:11]

sphery:

I have 1351hrs 54min

[03:50:53]

iamlindoro:

If Myth were just in the cloud, I'd be done with LOST by now

[03:51:19]

sphery:

heh

[03:52:00]

sphery:

or you'd be wondering how it ended after the men in black dragged you away and put you in that little 4x6

[03:53:11]

iamlindoro:

Why? I have it on good authority that it's perfectly legal. My lawyer will be a lawyer in August.

[03:55:40]

wagnerrp:

HDHR QuickTV is playing CBS just fine

[03:56:09]

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[03:56:45]

wagnerrp:

mythtv is recording CBS just fine

[03:57:22]

sphery:

iamlindoro: oh, I didn't realize you didn't agree to the terms of copyright law...

[03:57:30]

sphery:

if not, then they don't apply

[03:57:56]

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[03:58:51]

iamlindoro:

whew!

[04:00:43]

wagnerrp:

sphery: you should buy justified

[04:01:04]

sphery:

justified?

[04:01:14]

wagnerrp:

justified

[04:01:38]

sphery:

tv series?

[04:01:45]

wagnerrp:

on fx

[04:02:43]

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[04:02:57]

sphery:

heh, sounds good

[04:03:14]

wagnerrp:

who cares about the individual episodes, or the stories, or any of that

[04:03:20]

wagnerrp:

its worth it for the shootouts

[04:03:26]

wagnerrp:

theyre never long

[04:03:29]

wagnerrp:

just amusing

[04:03:46]

iamlindoro:

I have it recorded and only today decided that I would watch it

[04:03:51]

iamlindoro:

haven't seen any yet though

[04:04:16]

wagnerrp:

'if you take one more step, im going to shoot you. thats all ive got to say.'

[04:04:30]

wagnerrp:

*takes step* 'now marsha...' *gets shot*

[04:04:35]

wagnerrp:

'dont say i didnt warn you'

[04:04:48]

sphery:

cool... I'll put it on my list

[04:05:09]

wagnerrp:

its like a whole show based around the scene where reynolds kicks the guy into the engine inlet

[04:06:02]

Beirdo:

Justified?

[04:06:16]

Beirdo:

wasn't that the one written by Leonard Elmore?

[04:06:55]

wagnerrp:

looks like it

[04:07:01]

Beirdo:

sweet

[04:07:06]

Beirdo:

I love his books

[04:07:21]

Beirdo:

he's on my top 10 authors list.

[04:07:29]

Beirdo:

I'll have to watch that sometime

[04:08:33]

Beirdo:

like... in one hour on FX

[04:08:43]

k-man:

you know how when watching a recording, sometimes they show a clip, say in the news, that is much smaller than the resolution of TV, so it only fills half the screen or so, can mythtv not detect that and auto zoom at that point?

[04:08:44]

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[04:09:10]

wagnerrp:

no, but you can hit 'w'

[04:09:15]

wagnerrp:

to cycle through the zoom modes

[04:09:24]

Beirdo:

k-man: you wanna try writing a patch for that?

[04:09:25]

sphery:

or MENU|Manual Zoom for fine control

[04:09:28]

Beirdo:

me neither

[04:09:29]

iamlindoro:

myth *can* auto-fill, though

[04:09:32]

k-man:

wagnerrp: yeah, i know about W

[04:09:37]

iamlindoro:

(but only using software decode)

[04:09:43]

iamlindoro:

ie, no VDPAU

[04:09:50]

sphery:

Manual Zoom was created specifically for those cases

[04:09:52]

Captain_Murdoch:

k-man, Manual Zoom was written for exactly that purpose. I hate those weather alerts

[04:10:01]

k-man:

Beirdo: i'd love to – but before that i'd like to fix the mythcentre theme

[04:10:07]

sphery:

(my big complaint is that sometimes it's hard to tell when the zoom is over)

[04:10:24]

Beirdo:

hey, if you can make it work... I'm sure people would love to test it :)

[04:10:41]

k-man:

Captain_Murdoch: but its no good as the clip might only last a few seconds, by the time you locate the remote, locate the button on the remote and then press it they will be onto the next story and the size will be correct again

[04:10:41]

Captain_Murdoch:

Chesapeake City schools will be opening 2 hours late. Dallas City Schools will be closed, essential personell only. Frederick County schools will be opening 1 hour late...

[04:10:54]

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[04:10:57]

Beirdo:

Muh?

[04:11:08]

sphery:

k-man: or use a new theme designed to highlight the abilities of the new theming engine

[04:11:14]

sphery:

*cough*Arclight*cough*

[04:11:17]

Beirdo:

ohhhh

[04:11:21]

k-man:

sphery: i'm on 4:3

[04:11:32]

Beirdo:

k-man: Arclight works 4:3

[04:11:37]

Beirdo:

just letterbox it

[04:11:38]

Captain_Murdoch:

yeah, would be nice to make it so that 'W' remembers the manual zoom setting so you can use 'W' to test whether you need to unzoom.

[04:11:53]

wagnerrp:

that would actually be an interesting addition to the commflagger

[04:12:03]

sphery:

Captain_Murdoch: cool idea... I may have to work that in sometime

[04:12:09]

wagnerrp:

mark bars, so NVP can autoscale

[04:12:22]

Beirdo:

mmm, bar

[04:13:06]

Captain_Murdoch:

wagnerrp, yeah, it's a hard one to detect though. I'd like for the flagger to detect the actual positions of the letterboxing bars so we can auto-zoom to exactly that point when playing a 4:3 letterboxed video file on a widescreen TV.

[04:13:39]

wagnerrp:

oh? ive seen plenty of auto-crop routines in various DVD rip programs

[04:13:40]

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[04:13:41]

k-man:

Beirdo: i tried it but didn't realise i need to letterbox it. how do you letterbox it?

[04:13:41]

Captain_Murdoch:

actually for the crawlers, we could search for a horizontal and vertical line of black

[04:13:54]

sphery:

yeah, doing that in the flagger (or zoomer :) would be better than the dynamic/real-time stuff

[04:14:00]

Captain_Murdoch:

wagnerrp, those guys have more time than I do. :)

[04:14:04]

sphery:

could be much more accurate if speed isn't a factor

[04:14:13]

wagnerrp:

fair enough... but theyre also open source

[04:14:35]

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[04:14:44]

sphery:

k-man: you can set GUI offsets and width/height location

[04:14:45]

Beirdo:

k-man: go into appearance settings and set the height/width and offsets

[04:14:58]

Beirdo:

it worked great for me

[04:15:01]

Captain_Murdoch:

current 'half' and 'full' zoom modes don't fit my analog USA 4:3 recordings when watched on the widescreen. and manual zoom isn't fine enough jumps right now. I may need to change those to 5%. It think we jump in 10% increments now.

[04:15:04]

sphery:

k-man: though really, IMHO, Arclight looks pretty good squished to 4:3

[04:15:05]

k-man:

Beirdo: ok, thanks

[04:15:07]

Beirdo:

then xsetroot -solid black

[04:15:33]

k-man:

sphery: i didn;t really like it in 4:3, i prefer mythcentre

[04:15:42]

sphery:

Captain_Murdoch: finer resolution on the zoom would be very nice

[04:16:38]

Beirdo:

blah, I'm tired

[04:16:50]

k-man:

anyway, in mythcentre, where do i find the files to adjust the width of one of the fields in the schedule recording page?

[04:17:23]

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[04:21:27]

k-man:

is this the wrong place to ask for guidance on hacking themes?

[04:21:39]

sphery:

mag0o: woah... reflections of...

[04:21:45]

Beirdo:

heh

[04:21:52]

wagnerrp:

k-man: #mythtv-theming would be better

[04:22:09]

k-man:

thanks wagnerrp

[04:22:11]

Beirdo:

k-man: I just have no clue at this point, but #mythtv-theming could likely work :)

[04:23:20]

Captain_Murdoch:

sphery, 5% now instead of 10% increments

[04:23:35]

sphery:

Captain_Murdoch: my hero!

[04:24:08]

Beirdo:

trying to determine a nice feedback algorithm to calibrate current request to current provided. :)

[04:24:13]

Captain_Murdoch:

totally untested, but it was a simple change.

[04:24:21]

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[04:24:49]

Beirdo:

it's like being back in school again ;)

[04:25:36]

Captain_Murdoch:

sphery, and I probably should rework that sometime to actually keep the jumps consistent. right now it's 5% of the current value, not 5% of the initial size.

[04:26:00]

sphery:

ahhhh... that would explain a lot

[04:26:21]

wagnerrp:

but... what happens when you get below 20 pixels?

[04:26:24]

Captain_Murdoch:

still, 5% is better than 10%.

[04:26:29]

sphery:

yeah

[04:26:36]

Captain_Murdoch:

wagnerrp, it ends up looking like Arclight

[04:26:39]

sphery:

especially for SDTV

[04:26:40]

Captain_Murdoch:

:)

[04:26:40]

wagnerrp:

hehe

[04:26:45]

sphery:

hah

[04:27:10]

wagnerrp:

we also would have accepted... 'i realize this is a work in progress, but can you send me the real recording?'

[04:27:31]

Beirdo:

hehe

[04:28:25]

Captain_Murdoch:

it's actually stored as a scaling factor. so it starts at 1.0, then if you zoom in, it multiplies the current value by 1.05, if you zoom out, it divides by 1.05.

[04:31:44]

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[04:32:18]

k-man:

i even posted the question to mythtv-themes mailing list – I wonder if they will be nice to me

[04:32:59]

k-man:

a lot of theme discussion seems to happen on other mailing lists

[04:35:24]

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[04:35:41]

wagnerrp:

oh no, were out of fish

[04:35:41]

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[04:35:47]

wagnerrp:

nevermind

[04:35:57]

Beirdo:

heh

[04:40:05]

Oleg_:

the video has a small artefact problem when I play it with the internal player

[04:40:19]

Oleg_:

I am not sure how to describe it

[04:40:51]

Oleg_:

and it kept giving this message: WriteAudio: buffer underrun

[04:42:04]

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[05:00:21]

sphery:

mag0o: awesome episode. thanks for the recommendation to watch it tonight

[05:01:09]

iamlindoro:

shut up shut up shut up

[05:01:14]

k-man:

sphery: what are you refering to?

[05:01:19]

sphery:

ah, you can start watching it, now

[05:01:23]

sphery:

k-man: LOST

[05:01:27]

k-man:

oh

[05:01:34]

sphery:

tonight's was good

[05:04:03]

k-man:

i never got into lost

[05:05:48]

wolf-x:

i'm using mythNews plugin. I add rrs feed and it get this messages: No cached news.

[05:08:23]

sphery:

k-man: in my opinion, season 1 was excellent, seasons 2–4 were just designed to make sure only the deserving got anything from seasons 5 and 6, which make it all worthwhile

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[06:06:09]

JohnQ:

What is the mechanism which normally runs mythfilldtabase automatically? (Mine seems like it isnt running... and hasnt been running for a few days..)

[06:06:17]

[R]:

the backend

[06:06:23]

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[06:06:51]

JohnQ:

...

[06:08:08]

Oleg_ is now known as _Oleg__

[06:08:23]

wagnerrp:

no, he is serious

[06:08:23]

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[06:08:39]

JohnQ:

I know... he's also correct... but also not helpful.

[06:08:53]

wagnerrp:

schedules direct tells the backend when the next time the scheduling should be downloaded

[06:09:04]

wagnerrp:

and the backend runs it accordingly

[06:09:57]

JohnQ:

Are there settings to influence that which might be bad?

[06:10:22]

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[06:10:23]

wagnerrp:

you can check your backend logs

[06:10:31]

wagnerrp:

to see if MFD is failing for some reason or another

[06:11:11]

JohnQ:

Looks like the logs don't have data back that far.

[06:11:23]

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[06:11:30]

JohnQ:

The last time it ran successfully was 12/19

[06:11:35]

JohnQ:

sorry...

[06:11:36]

JohnQ:

3/19

[06:12:02]

JohnQ:

Logs seem to stop at 4/1..

[06:13:27]

JohnQ:

I'll run it manually for now.. but it's a little disconcerting.

[06:13:44]

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[06:13:57]

wagnerrp:

you do have a schedules direct account that youre pulling data from, right?

[06:14:10]

JohnQ:

Yep. And it's "active" according to them,

[06:14:24]

JohnQ:

Paid until June

[06:14:41]

wagnerrp:

i would just run it manually once

[06:14:45]

wagnerrp:

see if it returns an error code

[06:14:57]

wagnerrp:

you have no longs at all past 4/1?

[06:15:00]

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[06:15:02]

wagnerrp:

is your backend running?

[06:15:17]

JohnQ:

Yeah its running... But no logs before 4/1

[06:15:22]

wagnerrp:

oh, before

[06:15:26]

wagnerrp:

had that backwards

[06:15:27]

JohnQ:

It looks like it only keeps 100 log entries.

[06:15:41]

wagnerrp:

are you looking at the file logs? or the database logs?

[06:15:56]

JohnQ:

database logs I think.

[06:16:03]

JohnQ:

on mythweb

[06:16:10]

wagnerrp:

check your log files

[06:16:22]

wagnerrp:

distros usually put that in /var/log/mythtv/

[06:16:28]

JohnQ:

Yep. Looking

[06:19:23]

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[06:19:54]

JohnQ:

Looks like there is a gap in my logs from 3/19 until 4/5 ... something very odd is afoot.

[06:24:00]

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[06:24:20]

JohnQ:

Very odd... the next entry in my logs after 2010-03–19 is 2017-04–05 ... then after about 10 seconds it goes back to 2010-03–19 ..

[06:24:39]

JohnQ:

My computer was apparently 7 years in the future... but only for a few seconds.

[06:26:38]

wagnerrp:

happens to all of us

[06:26:54]

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[06:28:42]

JohnQ:

I wonder if just rerunning it manually will have cleared whatever issue it had.

[06:29:44]

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[06:29:57]

Jester05:

hello gang

[06:31:23]

JohnQ:

Maybe it was a timezone hiccup

[06:31:26]

JohnQ:

:-)

[06:31:42]

JohnQ:

Anyway.. thanks for the help.

[06:31:47]

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[06:32:59]

justinh:

wheee set the first big rsync away

[06:35:05]

Jester05:

hey, I know this isn't a myth question but i figured this is the best place to get the opinion of developers.. i'm creating a program to "tether" my droid to my laptop to be used as broadband modem. The thing is when I shut it it down I'm having to use "sudo killall openvpn" .. is this the best way to do it? I tried /etc/init.d/openvpn stop but that doesn't seem to be getting it done as my internet doesn't work as normal once the

[06:35:05]

Jester05:

tether is disengaged unless i run the sudo killall openvpn

[06:35:54]

wagnerrp:

doesnt the droid already do that?

[06:36:04]

Jester05:

not from what I read

[06:36:27]

Jester05:

had to install azilink and abd to get it working

[06:36:36]

Jester05:

and create a few custom config files

[06:36:51]

wagnerrp:

i thought nearly any relatively modern phone with bluetooth had that capacity

[06:36:59]

Jester05:

ultimately i'm looking to turn what I've created into an app with gui and tray icon

[06:37:19]

Jester05:

well the tethering I'm currently doing is for USB connection

[06:37:19]

wagnerrp:

except it just gets disabled by your friendly neighborhood cell provider

[06:37:25]

justinh:

considerably lame if the phone can't do that

[06:37:31]

Jester05:

this laptop doesn't have bluetooth

[06:37:59]

justinh:

easy to add with a $2 device though

[06:38:27]

Jester05:

yes but I already have the usb cable.. why bother investing more when this works fine and.. charges the phone

[06:38:34]

justinh:

pfft

[06:38:49]

Jester05:

I have a full text base version of my system working fine

[06:39:06]

Jester05:

I just wonder if I should really be killall'n openvpn

[06:39:13]

justinh:

actually my useless LG junk can't tether to my laptop over bluetooth either

[06:39:26]

Jester05:

granted.. if you're connecting via broadband would you really be running any other vpn's?

[06:39:29]

justinh:

so I just bought a 3G modem for £5 on special offer

[06:39:33]

clever:

ive reverse-tethered my treo before

[06:39:39]

clever:

running the phone off the computers inet

[06:39:48]

clever:

unlimited bandwidth usage

[06:40:11]

justinh:

there you go again, creating new, insane use cases clever :P

[06:40:23]

clever:

the phone isnt registered anymore

[06:40:29]

clever:

so it cant go online the normal way to begin with

[06:40:45]

clever:

reverse-tethering via bluetooth or usb, lets me use its (crappy) browser

[06:41:04]

clever:

a netbook would probly be 200 times better though

[06:41:05]

justinh:

yes, but I've always thought that browsing the net on any phone is the port of last resort

[06:41:22]

justinh:

at least any non-smartphone

[06:41:23]

Jester05:

you are right about the tethering thing tho .. you would think that w/ a droid it'd come factory with that kind of capability

[06:41:49]

justinh:

Jester05: I can see the argument. why would you want to?! this phone is teh aw3som3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[06:43:00]

Jester05:

well ultimately I'm going to be getting a netbook w/ a huge battery so I can take it out to remote locations to help with photography stuff

[06:43:35]

Jester05:

in some of those locations I can occasionally pull cell service so it'd be nice to be connected t the net work able

[06:43:43]

Jester05:

pull weather reports, etc

[06:43:50]

justinh:

I'm so non-plussed by my current phone's connectivity I'm never buying LG again

[06:43:55]

clever:

a usb 3g modem would work fine for that

[06:43:58]

clever:

if you can afford it

[06:44:05]

clever:

might even be able to mount it internaly

[06:44:11]

justinh:

it can't even autoanswer when you're using a bluetooth headset ffs

[06:44:29]

Jester05:

clever, I have no need for an additional modem tho.. i already have a phone that works as a 3g modem

[06:44:45]

justinh:

heh. except it's a piece of crap pain in the nuts to use :P

[06:45:06]

Jester05:

not really i've written up an init.d for it

[06:45:15]

justinh:

sounds like a right pain to me

[06:45:24]

Jester05:

so now its just /etc/init.d/droidlink start/stop/restart

[06:45:31]

justinh:

i.e. no work out of the box == pain

[06:45:31]

clever:

Jester05: youll want udev next

[06:45:50]

clever:

Jester05: when i connect my usb cell modem, it can automaticaly dial it

[06:45:51]

justinh:

having to edit a config file == pain

[06:46:01]

justinh:

but having to *write* stuff for it ? forget it

[06:46:31]

Jester05:

clever, i'd considered that but I think I'd rather just have a tray icon pop up on connection and ask me what I want to do

[06:46:40]

justinh:

I'd be surprised nobody else has done this already though. have you checked to see if you're reinventing the wheel?

[06:46:42]

Jester05:

I may just be charging it at the time..

[06:46:54]

clever:

Jester05: thats even easyer

[06:47:09]

clever:

Jester05: http://hackaday.com/2009/09/18/how-to-write-udev-rules/

[06:47:28]

clever:

when i connect certain usb sticks, it auto-mounts them (without depending on gnome crap), and does a popup

[06:47:38]

clever:

certain mice will change the synergy config file and make syngery reload it

[06:47:43]

Jester05:

yes i've looked for a while.. thus far there's only documentation on the method i've used to get it tethered.. now i'm trying to automate that procedure

[06:47:55]

clever:

and the 3g modem will run a script that preps it and does the popup

[06:48:08]

justinh:

Jester05: what's the phone, to remind me to never buy one?

[06:48:33]

Jester05:

thanks clever def looking into that..

[06:48:55]

Jester05:

justinh, don't worry.. here in a couple days the Motorola Droid will have linux support ;)

[06:49:07]

justinh:

I get 'free' internet on my current phone. it's so crap they should pay me to use it

[06:49:25]

clever:

Jester05: `udevadm monitor` is one of the most helpfull command

[06:49:28]

Jester05:

tho one of the programs you have to use is intended for T-mobile (CDMA encryption) .. but eh who cares the user won't see that

[06:49:32]

clever:

s, just run it and shove the cable in

[06:49:34]

justinh:

connection speed is fast, but the phone cpu is.. meh

[06:49:53]

clever:

it will tell you what sysfs nodes are added/doing events, which you can then info on and get the data you need

[06:50:17]

clever:

the biggest problem with tethering at all on my treo, is that its all software initiated, at the phone

[06:50:18]

Jester05:

alright thank clever

[06:50:27]

clever:

it doesnt even appear as a usb device when you connect it

[06:50:30]

clever:

its just not there

[06:50:40]

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[06:50:54]

clever:

once you run the right app, it begins emulating a usb slave of the right type

[06:51:00]

Jester05:

ohh .. I can put the droid in mem stick mode but i don't believe it can be used as a modem when in that mode

[06:51:30]

clever:

the treo so far has usb serial port mode only, but ive read of a usb disk drive app, for the sd card

[06:51:37]

clever:

to make it into a very expensive SD reader

[06:51:49]

Jester05:

lol

[06:51:57]

clever:

all networking (blutooth or usb) is done with ppp over serial

[06:52:02]

Jester05:

screw that.. thats why i went w/ the droid

[06:52:05]

clever:

you just cant get rid of that damn ppp

[06:52:12]

clever:

even DSL uses ppp

[06:52:16]

Jester05:

yeah

[06:52:22]

clever:

even the 3g cell modem uses ppp, you treat it like dialup and dial #777

[06:52:43]

Jester05:

I think I could probably create a wifi hotspot w/ my droid but I already have it tethered so eh

[06:52:45]

bjd:

hah, aol considering shuttingd down bebo

[06:53:06]

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[06:53:08]

clever:

Jester05: ive seen that mentioned as an app in some comercial

[06:53:36]

Jester05:

clever, yeah i just came across something on it online.. not real interest ATM tho

[06:53:52]

Jester05:

I'd rather get the tethering thing done since I've already invested this much time in it

[06:54:00]

clever:

Jester05: ive turned my laptop into a hotspot before, when the hotal signal sucked

[06:54:21]

clever:

there was only 1 port on the wall and i had to share

[06:54:24]

Jester05:

hotspot via tethered device?

[06:54:29]

Jester05:

ohh

[06:54:30]

Jester05:

ok

[06:54:41]

clever:

turned the router into a NAT and shared the wall socket

[06:54:49]

Jester05:

thats a good idea tho ..

[06:54:59]

clever:

once you have a working network interface, you can NAT out it all you want

[06:55:01]

Jester05:

yeah, I'm looking at building a new server if/when I get find a job

[06:55:02]

clever:

doesnt matter what it is

[06:55:09]

Jester05:

once i build that it'll become a linux router as well

[06:55:27]

clever:

so your laptop could USB tether, and then NAT it out to another 20 laptops

[06:55:37]

Jester05:

yeah..

[06:55:39]

clever:

the bandwidth will disapear fast, but it would work

[06:56:00]

clever:

i know, ive NAT'd 5 computers into dialup before;P

[06:56:24]

justinh:

I did that on my Dad's. not to 5 computers but across 3

[06:56:24]

Jester05:

well my thought is if I have to relocate to a different city for work.. i'll used the tethered phone on my desktop and then route with my desktop until i can afford the new server

[06:56:27]

justinh:

it was horrible

[06:57:01]

clever:

yeah

[06:57:08]

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[06:57:10]

clever:

irc actualy began to lag for the first time

[06:57:11]

Jester05:

yeah..

[06:57:37]

Jester05:

I wonder what my actual connection speed is via tethered g3

[06:57:45]

Jester05:

3g lol

[06:57:51]

clever:

i was getting about 150kb/sec down one day with the usb stick

[06:57:58]

clever:

comparable to my old dsl modem

[06:58:18]

Jester05:

I'm used to 1.5 w/ RR turbo :-\ lol

[06:58:25]

Jester05:

1.5mb.. lol

[06:58:55]

Jester05:

in the mornings and late at night i pull close t 2mb

[06:59:32]

Jester05:

well close to 2mb for a single application.. not to mention i have different messengers going on top of there being other machines all on the same network

[06:59:46]

Jester05:

mythbox's don't pull a whole lot of bandwidth when idle tho ;)

[06:59:49]

clever:

rx: 1.99 kB/s 16 p/s tx: 3.66 kB/s 19 p/s

[06:59:53]

clever:

with things mostly idle

[07:00:08]

Jester05:

eh

[07:00:08]

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[07:00:10]

Jester05:

its something lol

[07:01:10]

Jester05:

what would you guys do if you were probably going to have to move away but were currently dating someone (1 hour long distance relationship currently)

[07:01:23]

justinh:

1 hour isn't long distance

[07:01:27]

Jester05:

we haven't been dating real long.. couple of months.. but I feel like I should end it

[07:01:35]

Jester05:

yeah i now

[07:01:37]

justinh:

see how it goes

[07:01:37]

Jester05:

I know*

[07:02:14]

Jester05:

i dunno, right now I feel like I'm not really committed to it tho.. almost think i'd be better off single

[07:02:50]

Jester05:

I'm only 23 ... I want to see the world.. if I get an opportunity to get out of Ohio and travel the world I don't want something holding me back

[07:03:12]

clever:

23 here also

[07:03:22]

justinh:

I thought everybody your age had **** buddies

[07:04:00]

Jester05:

well I had an FB prior to her lol

[07:04:11]

Jester05:

I miss that dynamic lol

[07:04:15]

justinh:

I'd say that if she already knows you're moving & hasn't ended it..

[07:04:33]

justinh:

then the ball is in your court

[07:04:36]

Jester05:

she keeps holding this blind hope and isn't facing the reality

[07:04:57]

Jester05:

she just kind of pretends like I'm prob not going to be leaving

[07:04:57]

justinh:

heh. I did that once. went out with a girl I knew was going to uni the following year

[07:05:35]

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[07:05:49]

Jester05:

yeah.. I don't feel right continuing to carry on the charade

[07:06:16]

justinh:

she never cared much, nor did I. led to a spot of trouble later on. lessons learned aplenty

[07:06:30]

Jester05:

I'd rather us end it now and stay friends than try to continue it on and end up ending on bad terms and not even being friends

[07:06:41]

Jester05:

exactly..

[07:07:12]

Jester05:

I don't wan to continue to lead ourselves on b/c it'll only make things worse later

[07:07:24]

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[07:07:34]

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[07:07:34]

justinh:

oh rats. turns out my auto backup script for my database hasn't been working. stupid cron (more like stupid user)

[07:07:52]

Jester05:

plus I mean we've been dating long enough that you'd think I'd be willing to settle for Ohio if I really wanted to be with her but I'm not so.. maybe things just aren't meant to be..

[07:08:09]

justinh:

heh

[07:08:16]

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[07:08:21]

Jester05:

lol I've never really used cron for anything

[07:08:25]

justinh:

I gave my wife an ultimatum. move, or we finish

[07:08:52]

Jester05:

well thats just it.. i have a feeling that she'd be willing to move w/ me.. but I'm really :-\ about that

[07:08:54]

justinh:

well, it wasn't so much that as such. more like this isn't working out over 150 miles

[07:09:05]

Jester05:

ultimately I think it just comes down to me not being ready to settle down

[07:09:14]

justinh:

then you never had to ask the question did you ;-)

[07:09:32]

justinh:

you already know what you're gonna do. you bastard ;-)

[07:09:37]

Jester05:

yeah true.. just needed to navigate myself to the truth

[07:09:57]

Jester05:

yeah but i don't know how to do it in a way that won't hurt her lol

[07:10:17]

Jester05:

I mean its not her.. its not like i'm breaking up w/ her to be w/ someone else..

[07:10:20]

justinh:

there are never any guarantees

[07:10:21]

Jester05:

I just want to be free again

[07:10:38]

Jester05:

I don't want to be 'tethered' lol

[07:10:56]

justinh:

I ended a relationship once & it still affected me for a while

[07:11:09]

Jester05:

yeah freshmen yr i ended one too

[07:11:20]

Jester05:

under about the same circumstances as this one

[07:11:26]

Jester05:

at the time didn't think i'd miss her much.. later did

[07:11:47]

justinh:

new town, new place, new friends, parties...

[07:11:48]

justinh:

:D

[07:11:52]

Jester05:

wondering if this wouldn't be the same type of situation.. but w/ the fact that I'm talking to 2 different companies out of state about jobs..

[07:12:12]

Jester05:

yeah i know

[07:12:28]

justinh:

plus you're too damn young to be fretting over this stuff

[07:12:29]

Jester05:

I've got a job if I want it here where I am but.. I don't want to stay in that line of work

[07:12:46]

justinh:

til you have a mortgage & real responsibilities you've nothing to worry about

[07:12:55]

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[07:13:04]

justinh:

and even that doesn't stop some people

[07:13:14]

Jester05:

thanks justinh .. I really needed to hear that from someone

[07:13:24]

Jester05:

my roommate is my age and getting married

[07:13:43]

Jester05:

but he doesn't really have alot going for him in life.. he's kind of content wherever he is

[07:13:47]

justinh:

fair play to them. it suits some peope & works well

[07:14:02]

Jester05:

he's fine w/ just staying here and working wherever he gets a job

[07:14:14]

justinh:

if I'd had stayed in my home town I'd likely be dead now

[07:14:17]

Jester05:

I on the other hand want to get the hell out of here and get into some crazy job

[07:14:21]

justinh:

self-inflicted. it was killing me

[07:14:33]

Jester05:

yeah thats the way i feel here

[07:14:49]

Jester05:

I want to move to the mountains.. CO, UT, ID, MO

[07:14:50]

Jester05:

etc

[07:14:58]

Jester05:

been looking at jobs in AK even

[07:15:14]

justinh:

manchester is no oasis of cool etc.. but it's an improvement on where I was born

[07:15:34]

Jester05:

I'm talking to Raytheon about a job in ND right now.. not real sure that I'd want to move to ND but once I'm in there I'm sure theres some room to move around within the company

[07:15:39]

justinh:

ex-steel town, works long closed. tiny-minded people living for the weekend...

[07:15:58]

Jester05:

yeah

[07:16:02]

[R]:

i have a few friends who work/worked for Raytheon

[07:16:22]

Jester05:

I grew up in a farm town and moved to Dayton for school.. still hate it here even

[07:16:33]

Jester05:

[R], what did they think about the company?

[07:16:36]

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[07:16:39]

[R]:

my one friend quit

[07:16:45]

[R]:

but he hated what he ws doing

[07:16:52]

Jester05:

the position I'm looking at is a Field Engineer's position

[07:16:54]

[R]:

i think they've all liked it... as much as one can like corporate america

[07:17:08]

Jester05:

lol yeah

[07:17:09]

[R]:

i know i love my job, but i hate corporate america

[07:17:16]

Jester05:

what do you do?

[07:17:16]

justinh:

Sun were a good company to work for once upon a time

[07:17:33]

[R]:

i'm a software engineer

[07:17:38]

** justinh shakes his fist at the dot com boom **

[07:17:52]

Jester05:

I'm an EE but looking more toward CEG type jobs

[07:18:04]

Jester05:

really should have changed my major years ago..

[07:18:22]

Jester05:

but since I'm graduated.. haha

[07:18:36]

justinh:

heh. I ended up in electronics because the college I signed up to cancelled the computing course on enrolment day

[07:18:47]

justinh:

rather than do the *right* thing & change college... lol

[07:18:54]

Jester05:

I gotta admit.. not working is great tho .. I worked a ton all thru college but took the last quarter off.. told them I'd be back after I graduated lol

[07:19:28]

Jester05:

but now I'm just kind of living off banked money

[07:19:40]

Jester05:

I haven't worked nor been in school for about 3 weeks now

[07:19:47]

justinh:

hmmm. wonder how much I can pick up a gig E switch for at my local shed

[07:20:13]

Jester05:

I have an 8port dlink gig switch ;)

[07:20:18]

Jester05:

its pretty darn nice..

[07:21:43]

Jester05:

you guys have any issues getting audio to work right in myth? .. I'm running mythbuntu on my frontend but it seems like I can't get 5.1 to work properly .. I think I got it working once but it used "wave surround" for its volume control so myth couldn't control the volume

[07:21:54]

justinh:

hmmm microdirect do an 8 port one for under 50 quids

[07:22:15]

justinh:

Jester05: I don't do analogue audio for surround, so hopefully won't run into any issues there

[07:22:26]

wagnerrp:

ive been picking up crap-o netgear 8-ports for $45

[07:22:34]

Jester05:

you think I'd have better luck w/ optical?

[07:22:53]

Jester05:

wagnerrp, dlink arent that much more if they even are more..

[07:23:02]

Jester05:

and my dlink is solid

[07:23:13]

justinh:

wagnerrp: £1 = $1 in IT gear remember, no matter what the exchange rate, seemingly

[07:23:21]

Jester05:

have a 6–7 yr old dlink 10/100 router thats still kicking too

[07:23:26]

wagnerrp:

ive not had any problems with my netgear stuff

[07:23:36]

wagnerrp:

but the 24-port stuff we have at work fails frequently

[07:23:48]

wagnerrp:

mostly dead fans, which eventually lead to overheat and complete failure

[07:23:53]

justinh:

yeah the 8 port under £50 is a netgear

[07:24:09]

wagnerrp:

but theres some weird 'virus' that they get hit with

[07:24:18]

Jester05:

wagnerrp, why not replace the fans b4 they go out?

[07:24:19]

justinh:

I need a patchbay too.. have to change my home network topology some

[07:24:24]

wagnerrp:

something trips up in one, and it spreads through the network

[07:24:34]

wagnerrp:

they all just start flashing all ports in unison

[07:24:38]

wagnerrp:

no traffic gets through

[07:24:39]

[R]:

have you guys ever heard of a network card driver that doesnt' like switches?

[07:24:41]

[R]:

cuz i've seen it

[07:24:56]

[R]:

its the oddest thing

[07:24:57]

wagnerrp:

Jester05: lifetime warranty

[07:25:03]

Jester05:

i've bought cheaper gear knowing i'd have to replace fans on it as soon as i got it

[07:25:10]

wagnerrp:

easier to just have a couple spares laying around i can swap out

[07:25:16]

wagnerrp:

and send in the old ones for replacement

[07:25:18]

Jester05:

ohh.. still tho that downtime has an expense associated with it

[07:25:55]

wagnerrp:

the 2 minutes spent swapping in a spare is better than the 20 minutes spent cracking it open and soldering in a new fan

[07:25:59]

Jester05:

i'd just buy a more expensive brand.. more than likely if you consider the downtime, you'd end up saving money

[07:26:31]

justinh:

how long do the fans last anyway?

[07:26:42]

wagnerrp:

when you consider the 'downtime' is on an offline compute cluster with no customers

[07:27:05]

Jester05:

ohh

[07:27:07]

wagnerrp:

besides, the switches go down, and most of the solvers we have block until they can re-establish communication with the rest of the group

[07:27:15]

Jester05:

I thought it was for a user group

[07:27:19]

wagnerrp:

justinh: anywhere from 6mo to 3 years

[07:27:21]

justinh:

decided I don't need a fan controller for the new backend. turns out the noise if coming from the PSU which is gonna be pulled out in favour of an 80+ model

[07:27:30]

justinh:

6 months? eew

[07:28:06]

justinh:

so, 80+ PSU, gig E switch.. maybe another TB of HDD or so...

[07:29:09]

kormoc is now known as kormoc_afk

[07:29:27]

justinh:

although maybe 4TB is going to be enough for a while

[07:29:42]

Jester05:

I need to find a job that can combine linux, ee, scuba, backpacking, and possible flyin

[07:29:48]

justinh:

whah? I only put a gig of ram in the new backend? that was silly

[07:29:55]

Jester05:

theres got to be some job somewhere that can use me lol

[07:30:27]

Jester05:

justinh, my MBE/FE is 2g w/ a p4 2.8ghz

[07:30:27]

Jester05:

lol

[07:31:08]

justinh:

wonder if there are any patchbays I can nick from here

[07:33:41]

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[07:46:11]

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[07:54:14]

justinh:

marvellous. one 48-port patchbay at my disposal

[07:59:47]

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[08:01:40]

wagnerrp:

justinh: whats this i recall about you calling us all file squirrels?

[08:02:37]

justinh:

4TB is nothing compared to some people here ;-)

[08:02:52]

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[08:02:59]

wagnerrp:

'oh yeah, im not a file squirrel. ive only got 4tb.'

[08:03:02]

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[08:03:08]

wagnerrp:

only? ONLY?

[08:03:12]

justinh:

lol

[08:03:54]

justinh:

the TV SGs will only be 2TB of that – enough to see us through the winter

[08:03:56]

wagnerrp:

of course redundancy not included, im pushing somewhere around 8...

[08:04:07]

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[08:05:24]

sid3windr:

secret squirrel

[08:05:48]

justinh:

<< Morocco Mole

[08:06:32]

sid3windr:

I expected as much yes :>

[08:06:44]

justinh:

not bad. 11.2MB/sec over 100Mb ethernet

[08:07:08]

justinh:

need MOARFASTR though

[08:08:15]

[R]:

that sounds like something getting close to the practical max

[08:08:45]

sid3windr:

indeed

[08:09:46]

justinh:

come to think about it, I dunno if I ever need gig E yet

[08:10:18]

justinh:

the times I hoof big amounts over the network are few & far between

[08:12:08]

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[08:14:53]

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[08:16:20]

wagnerrp:

justinh: i was actually surprised how much of a difference gigabit made for mythtv

[08:16:47]

wagnerrp:

seeking is actually much smoother with gigabit than with 10/100

[08:17:26]

wagnerrp:

although i only really notice it when in edit mode

[08:18:21]

justinh:

I'll put off spending more money til I really need to I think

[08:18:41]

justinh:

going through one less switch might be an improvement too

[08:18:44]

wagnerrp:

if youve already got 10/100 switches, i wouldnt bother

[08:18:56]

wagnerrp:

but if youre needing to upgrade capacity, by all means buy gigabit

[08:19:05]

justinh:

currently it goes through the router, then upstairs into another switch

[08:20:00]

justinh:

really it could all go through the router

[08:20:29]

justinh:

there'll only be 2 wired devices on the network most of the time. frontend & backend :)

[08:20:59]

justinh:

plus by the time the router dies gigE will doubtless be the norm anyway

[08:21:44]

wagnerrp:

by the time? its the norm now

[08:21:53]

wagnerrp:

its hard to find computer hardware with only 100mbit lan

[08:22:01]

justinh:

wireless routers which come with gigE as standard? heh

[08:22:22]

justinh:

that's what I mean

[08:22:44]

wagnerrp:

you mean those things ive got scattered around the house acting as access points?

[08:22:56]

wagnerrp:

i think all N hardware is gigabit

[08:23:07]

justinh:

I never bothered with N

[08:23:09]

justinh:

nor pre N

[08:23:40]

justinh:

oo one less switch I'll be saving money on standby power too

[08:23:52]

justinh:

not a vast amount I'll agree.. but still

[08:24:21]

justinh:

oh to have a house big enough to warrant access point*s* lol

[08:24:30]

justinh:

one AP does all rooms just fine

[08:24:50]

justinh:

though not in linux, cos wireless stinks in linux on my laptop's adapter

[08:25:22]

wagnerrp:

obviously you dont live in a Farada^H^H^H^H^H^H house with stucco walls

[08:25:41]

justinh:

real brick though

[08:25:58]

justinh:

no drywall junk here :)

[08:26:16]

wagnerrp:

i _can_ put one access point in the center of the house

[08:26:20]

justinh:

though if it was it'd simplify cabling somewhat

[08:26:30]

wagnerrp:

and get marginal signal at the two sides (about 25 feet each way)

[08:27:14]

justinh:

downstairs is approx 10 metres by 7 metres

[08:27:30]

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[09:46:04]

hashbang:

weird. Post switchover in Mendip, we now have 7 live mplexes, but only 5 are carrying SD TV.

[09:48:16]

quicksilver:

the other two are wired up in reverse

[09:48:19]

quicksilver:

they STEAL YOUR SOUL!

[09:48:31]

hashbang:

quicksilver: aha. That's OK, then. :-)

[09:48:59]

sid3windr:

:D

[09:50:01]

quicksilver:

the guy who wired up my roof told me that some time this year they'd be turning up the power at crystal palace

[09:50:04]

quicksilver:

I wonder when that's going to be

[09:53:48]

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[10:21:11]

justinh:

quicksilver: in time for the aliens ocming

[10:22:29]

quicksilver:

makes sense to me

[10:22:57]

quicksilver:

the installer guy did look like a slitheen

[10:23:40]

justinh:

did he fart a lot too?

[10:24:56]

justinh:

ho ho ho, an old equipment lid fitted with rackmount ears makes a very cheap rackmount shelf :)

[10:25:12]

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[10:25:23]

justinh:

and rack strip stolen from the back of a rack makes very cheap erm.. rack strip

[10:26:05]

quicksilver:

http://techpain.blogspot.com/2010/02/lackrack . . . -turned.html

[10:26:31]

justinh:

lack.. that's just 'rack' in a different accent man

[10:26:37]

quicksilver:

right.

[10:26:46]

quicksilver:

lack and lol

[10:27:30]

justinh:

that's er.. nifty though

[10:28:19]

justinh:

hmm now I'm gonna need some patch cables

[10:28:27]

justinh:

and some cat5E cable

[10:28:34]

justinh:

oh look, five reels of the stuff

[10:33:43]

matmatmat:

haha that rack is awesome

[10:34:02]

justinh:

lack

[10:34:06]

matmatmat:

how could that possibly fit like that

[10:34:22]

justinh:

rook at dat lackmounted stuff on dat tabul!

[10:34:35]

justinh:

matmatmat: coincidence, of course!

[10:34:45]

matmatmat:

my gf got the same lamp

[10:35:28]

justinh:

hmm we're all out of patch cables

[10:35:34]

justinh:

have to order more

[10:35:35]

matmatmat:

anyways, having a patch field in the middle of the room is kinda ...

[10:35:43]

justinh:

retarded?

[10:35:48]

matmatmat:

yeah

[10:35:51]

jesse`:

I wonder how long the screws will hold in a table made of pasteboard.

[10:35:53]

matmatmat:

sorta

[10:36:00]

matmatmat:

i got a bunch here

[10:36:09]

matmatmat:

i could send you some over

[10:36:30]

justinh:

jesse`: depends if it's hollow or not

[10:36:57]

justinh:

use the proper kind of screws & it'll be fine so long as you don't stress it too much

[10:37:07]

justinh:

like you wouldn't wanna hang a regular server on it

[10:37:10]

jesse`:

justinh: I don't think they're hollow (I have one), but they're very lightweight.

[10:37:23]

justinh:

or, say.. a 1KW amplifier ;-)

[10:37:29]

justinh:

or a UPS

[10:38:11]

justinh:

I'll be making my cupboard rack from 2x2 I think

[10:38:13]

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[10:38:36]

justinh:

since I have plenty lying around at home :)

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[11:01:15]

matmatmat:

how exactly should i submit an error report for this problem: my frontend sometimes hangs when changing channels, and even if i restart i'm not able to change channels anymore until i restart the backend

[11:02:32]

quicksilver:

I would say that sounds like a driver problem

[11:02:41]

quicksilver:

I have seen things a bit like that when my signal is poor

[11:03:04]

matmatmat:

its the network recorder tuner tho

[11:03:50]

matmatmat:

and it exclusively happens when changing channels

[11:05:22]

matmatmat:

what can i do about it? can someone take a look at the error reports or so, and how can i make them

[11:07:36]

matmatmat:

the frontend doesnt exit, id have to kill it. and the backend doesnt actually crash, its just unusable for recording/live tv until i restart it

[11:07:45]

rabcaway is now known as rabc

[11:08:06]

matmatmat:

so what logs could be of help to troubleshoot this?

[11:10:29]

quicksilver:

OK, my suggestion is clearly wrong then :)

[11:10:50]

quicksilver:

I would create a trac ticket and include the backend log at the time of the problem

[11:10:57]

quicksilver:

and anything else the nice developers ask you for :)

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[11:18:05]

justinh:

oh bugger. 1088 minutes remaining on this rsync

[11:38:11]

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[11:39:38]

xand:

now it's only 1067

[11:42:10]

justinh:

actually 864.. heh. hope it's not as whacked out as windows time estimates are

[11:44:29]

justinh:

grrr. el reg painting everybody who opposed the digital economy bill as a pirate again

[11:56:44]

xand:

ITYM "freetard" ;)

[11:56:59]

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[11:57:30]

wagnerrp:

of course... the only reason to not pass legislation that does nothing but take away your rights is if you have something to hide

[11:58:05]

justinh:

yeah of course, in the eyes of music.biz

[11:58:11]

justinh:

and politicians

[11:58:33]

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[11:59:24]

xand:

music.biz and their puppets

[12:03:34]

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[12:06:54]

justinh:

heh

[12:07:07]

justinh:

reached a conclusion with my 'hmm which printer should I get' issue

[12:07:16]

justinh:

decided on the 'use the work printer on the sly' model

[12:07:50]

justinh:

inkjets dry out in the time between uses in our house

[12:08:05]

justinh:

laser toner settles apparently.. meaning about the same thing

[12:08:18]

justinh:

so, no printer from now on, and a saving of 15W :)

[12:09:30]

Brad-D:

how much would 15W actually save you Justin?

[12:09:46]

XLV:

well thought and cost-efficient

[12:09:52]

justinh:

it all adds up

[12:10:08]

justinh:

15W, at £0.12 per kw/H

[12:10:25]

quicksilver:

justinh: FWIW, I used to have the inkjet drying problem and I don't since I got my Epson R300

[12:10:31]

XLV:

new inks are pretty resilient to drying out though

[12:10:37]

justinh:

yeah well we ain't buying a new printer

[12:10:40]

quicksilver:

justinh: I can literally not use it for 9 months and then get a perfect image out of it.

[12:10:53]

quicksilver:

I don't disagree with the rest of your comments though. If you don't need one don't get one.

[12:10:54]

XLV:

quicksilver, same here with a officejet 6410

[12:10:58]

justinh:

we don't *need* a printer if the one we've got gets used twice in 6 months

[12:11:03]

quicksilver:

agree.

[12:11:37]

justinh:

stupid things take up too much space anyway

[12:12:17]

justinh:

think I'll be moving to a USB bootloader for the frontend too, wake the backend up & shut it down when not in use

[12:13:26]

quicksilver:

probably knacker your backend disks starting and stopping them all the time!

[12:13:45]

justinh:

hell even just shutting it down every night for a few hours will equate to a fair saving

[12:15:40]

justinh:

this is about saving money, not the planet btw

[12:15:57]

justinh:

the planet will be fine in any case. it's the human race running the risk of extinction ;)

[12:17:10]

XLV:

bah.. the rich sobs will probably survive

[12:17:21]

XLV:

they will be the future of mankind

[12:17:45]

XLV:

they'll eat each other afterwards probably, though

[12:17:46]

justinh:

they'll all die out eventually. with nobody left to sanitise their telephones ;-)

[12:29:46]

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[12:40:54]

GreyFoxx:

Justin: I've started migrating all of my stuff to do that as well. My main backend has been moved into a much lower power box, all storage is attached to it. All tuners have been moved into yet another low power box which will be sleeping when not in use, and my frontends are now configured to go to sleep and wake up via the remote

[12:41:04]

GreyFoxx:

I figured it's time to stop wasting so much power :)

[12:42:23]

justinh:

wonder how much ram freenx server takes up & whether it'd run on a really small box

[12:43:10]

justinh:

I really only keep my backend on during the day for er.. extra-curricular activities

[12:43:42]

justinh:

but it's probably only costing me £5 a month

[12:43:55]

justinh:

which is way less than mobile broadband would

[12:44:38]

GreyFoxx:

hehe. I did some math and my recordings only happen on average during 7 hours on any given day, and usually in the evening. So It's worth shutting down the rest of the time, and if I can get the family in the habit of properly shutting down the FE's too even better

[12:45:15]

justinh:

hahahahha.. NSFW... http://enemiesofreason.co.uk/2010/04/07/i-pro . . . -says-brown/

[12:47:48]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: recordings at my house prolly even less than 7 hours a day

[12:48:05]

justinh:

time spent online, using backend box as dhcp server & DNS... oof

[12:48:23]

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[12:48:50]

justinh:

but even if I'd kept my stupid epia system, it'd still be wasting more power than a router

[12:48:58]

justinh:

and I'd still have a router

[12:49:12]

justinh:

I'll figure something out

[12:53:38]

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[12:55:13]

justinh:

15Watts, on 24/7/365 = £12 ish.

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[13:23:16]

justinh:

yay. one waggedy wack

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mag0o:

sphery: did you hit that point where you thought to yourself "self, i've seen this before!!!"

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[14:32:24]

hashbang:

re. justinh GreyFoxx power consumption discussion: I run a single combined MythTV FE/BE system. It's also my firewall, DNS server/cache, DHCP server and my distro repository mirror (rsyncs every evening from midnight). It's a fairly power-hungry Northwood P4 2.53GHz, but I'd need something on for much of that time anyways...

[14:33:20]

hashbang:

when I have a bit more CPU and IO headroom, I'll probably make it my mail server too, so I can switch off my desktop most of the day.

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[14:50:59]

quicksilver:

I wonder if there is a market for a hybrid dual socket, with a lower power chip and a bit fat chip

[14:51:19]

quicksilver:

use the low power chip for idle workloads (like dhcp/dns) and fire up the fat one for video playback.

[14:52:00]

GreyFoxx:

I'm tempted to get a guruplug and try it out as storage/dhcp/dns and possibly as a router

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[15:00:48]

quicksilver:

GreyFoxx: storage?

[15:01:19]

quicksilver:

GreyFoxx: you mean using the eSATA? but that means costly eSATA enclosures and separate power supplies and suchlike annoyances.

[15:01:35]

quicksilver:

I'd have thought storage was the one thing you don't do in that form factor.

[15:02:18]

GreyFoxx:

I don't need enclosures, and with my goal isn't for small or out of the way. It's low power :)

[15:02:43]

GreyFoxx:

esata or usb, depend on what I have laying around at the time

[15:04:11]

quicksilver:

sure. loses some of the elegance though. Un-enclosed drives and wires lying around is ugly!

[15:07:19]

GreyFoxx:

It's not like I would be putting it in my kitchen :)

[15:07:26]

GreyFoxx:

I have a server room for that crap :)

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[15:16:40]

hashbang:

quicksilver: that's an interesting idea. Though, as I understand it, modern CPUs idle better than Northwood P4s (e.g. my Q6600 at peak uses less than the P4 idling, IIRC)

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[15:20:20]

quicksilver:

hashbang: but the guruplug draws 5 watt :)

[15:20:40]

quicksilver:

hashbang: I bet your Q6600 doesn't get close to that

[15:21:04]

hashbang:

quicksilver: sure. :-)

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[15:51:11]

iamlindoro:

!trout oobe wikis are not for first person narrative

[15:51:11]

** MythLogBot slaps oobe with a wikis are not for first person narrative trout on behalf of iamlindoro... **

[15:51:54]

iamlindoro:

Articles should be heavy on the "pedia," light on the "wiiiiiiiki"

[15:52:17]

iamlindoro:

And sentences should never, ever start with "I am," "I have," or "I did."

[15:52:45]

iamlindoro:

In fact, if you use the word "I" at all, it's a great indication it should be on your user page

[15:54:17]

iamlindoro:

also, PUNCTUATION, SPELLING, AND CAPITALIZATION

[15:55:15]

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[15:56:35]

sphery:

mag0o: heh, yeah.

[15:56:55]

mag0o:

I are punctuating.

[15:57:21]

mag0o:

watched it yet iamlindoro?

[15:57:54]

iamlindoro:

mag0o: yep :)

[15:59:19]

mag0o:

the stadium was where i saw a big circle seem to complete

[15:59:55]

iamlindoro:

I was thinking of having a big LOST finale party and showing it on my bigscreen as a charity fundraiser

[16:00:36]

oobe:

iamlindoro, i was wondering about that

[16:00:37]

devinheitmueller:

iamlindoro: sorry, that would be a public performance. You don't have a license to do that!

[16:01:05]

iamlindoro:

devinheitmueller: Actually, that's a really good point

[16:01:24]

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[16:01:24]

devinheitmueller:

iamlindoro: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/ . . . ight-law.ars

[16:01:31]

iamlindoro:

Heh, yeah

[16:01:42]

oobe:

ok cool i see

[16:04:39]

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[16:05:07]

janneg:

oh, that means no 7.1 audio for tv broadcasts

[16:07:03]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: they sell licenses for pubs etc don't they?

[16:07:27]

iamlindoro:

Pretty sure most sports bars aren't paying anything extra

[16:08:24]

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[16:11:52]

rkuris:

I upgraded to 0.22 and even after following the instructions for enabling visualizations, I only have a few of them

[16:11:58]

rkuris:

When I full screen them, most of them are horrible

[16:12:02]

AndyCap:

ah, yes, why keep things simple. http://www.swank.com/other/faq.html#fundraise

[16:12:42]

rkuris:

Are there any other visualizations I can compile or something somewhere?

[16:13:41]

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[16:17:09]

wagnerrp:

ugh... my ISP's mail server is down

[16:19:46]

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[16:38:23]

wagnerrp:

man sphery... youre even slow on the mailing list

[16:38:39]

sphery:

heh, yeah

[16:39:02]

sphery:

I saw your reply, but couldn't justify the rest of mine without sending the beginning--and figured I should mention it's 0.23-fixes only

[16:39:14]

iamlindoro:

I don't believe for a second that there's any modern e-mail client that won't allow a bottom post, even if it means scrolling to the bottom manually

[16:39:22]

wagnerrp:

fair enough

[16:39:35]

sphery:

my private eye found that the guy seems to be using an Android device (G1)

[16:40:14]

sphery:

any Android users in here who can verify the claim that it's impossible to bottom post with its e-mail client?

[16:40:21]

sphery:

wouldn't that client just be g-mail?

[16:40:24]

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[16:41:00]

quicksilver:

I can well believe it makes it rather painful to trim the context

[16:41:16]

quicksilver:

which is normally part of a sensible attempt to bottom-post

[16:41:37]

sphery:

but "painful" != "Can't, email app doesn't permit it."

[16:41:44]

quicksilver:

agreed.

[16:42:20]

sphery:

anyway, we'll see what happens

[16:42:42]

sphery:

perhaps some G1 users will come to his rescue and have a thread on using the e-mail app

[16:43:46]

quicksilver:

taht would be good.

[16:44:05]

quicksilver:

my mythtv-users folder contains 45,000 unread messages

[16:44:17]

sphery:

wow

[16:44:29]

sphery:

I thought I was bad with 9 unread

[16:44:34]

quicksilver:

a few more about the G1 email app would be great.

[16:44:45]

sphery:

(that have stayed unread for about 3 weeks--they're ones I plan to handle when I get time :)

[16:44:55]

janneg:

quicksilver: mark folder as read FTW

[16:45:12]

quicksilver:

janneg: well the reality is I haven't actually read anything in that folder for about 3 years

[16:45:31]

wagnerrp:

closer to about a year and a half

[16:45:32]

quicksilver:

I signed up all enthused about engaging with the community

[16:45:47]

quicksilver:

but for various reasons I found the community less engaging than hoped :)

[16:45:49]

sphery:

I've accidentally deleted my commits folder by dropping my mouse... Strange confluence of actions, I guess.

[16:45:56]

sphery:

(as it even had to confirm)

[16:46:28]

wagnerrp:

ive got daily snapshots on my mail root

[16:46:31]

quicksilver:

no, it's just I deleted all the messages in the folder 1.5 years ago, that's not when I first signed up ;)

[16:46:39]

wagnerrp:

so i could only miss the last couple hours if that happened

[16:46:49]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I treat mine like TV--it's just e-mail.

[16:47:11]

wagnerrp:

meh, it was simple to do

[16:47:19]

wagnerrp:

and doesnt actually take any additional storage space

[16:47:43]

quicksilver:

mailing lists are 'just e-mail'

[16:47:50]

quicksilver:

but my inbox I like to keep safe!

[16:48:23]

sphery:

wagnerrp: wait, you mean like it would appease the "I don't want to install mythfrontend on my dedicated backend" folks?

[16:49:00]

wagnerrp:

its a copy-on-write snapshot, so it only tracks changes

[16:49:04]

sphery:

Yeah, I have found e-mail to be wildly unreliable (the sending/receiving part--thanks to spammers), so I don't really care about any of it. Anything important I get gets moved out of e-mail to somewhere safer.

[16:49:22]

wagnerrp:

it uses as much space as if i just never deleted any email

[16:50:07]

sphery:

yeah--was just joking about some peoples' definitions of "space" on the hard drive

[16:50:30]

sphery:

in these days of 2TB HDDs, space is at a premium... You must conserve your drive space.

[16:52:00]

wagnerrp:

in this case... it seems im using ~1.4GB

[16:52:17]

wagnerrp:

so minus one episode of a sitcom, were it actually on the drives i use for media storage

[16:52:35]

sphery:

wow, that wouldn't even make a dent in GMail's space allocated to each user

[16:52:47]

iamlindoro:

Heh, Comcast has rolled out their 3D channel in my market as of today

[16:53:06]

sphery:

is it watchable on 2D?

[16:53:11]

dewman:

hard drive talk made me do a quick wikipedia search.....

[16:53:15]

dewman:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:5.25_inch_M . . . sk_drive.JPG

[16:53:16]

wagnerrp:

sphery: yeah, i actually started mirroring my old mail accounts to gmail about 5 years ago

[16:53:29]

iamlindoro:

sphery: Don't know

[16:53:30]

wagnerrp:

i think im still only 1/3 of the day towards full capacity

[16:53:37]

wagnerrp:

s/day/way/

[16:53:52]

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[16:53:56]

sphery:

iamlindoro: I'd like a full report after COB, today.

[16:54:12]

iamlindoro:

sphery: ha, SD still hasn't picked up the change, I noticed

[16:54:15]

sphery:

Also, hope it's not Anaglyphs...

[16:54:26]

Beirdo:

blah

[16:54:26]

wagnerrp:

sphery: how else would they do it?

[16:54:36]

sphery:

with the new 3D TV stuff

[16:55:01]

wagnerrp:

do their STBs support HDMI '1.3?

[16:55:13]

wagnerrp:

or have enough uumph for 120Hz output?

[16:55:17]

sphery:

dewman: ok, if that's your drive, you can worry abou the space :)

[16:55:43]

wagnerrp:

i actually dont know if that would require anything more than a firmware update to support 120Hz output

[16:55:54]

sphery:

ok, new position: I hope it /is/ anaglyphs, and people get so annoyed with it that the whole 3D thing dies!

[16:56:03]

wagnerrp:

agreed

[16:56:50]

dewman:

sphery, hehehe.... Always amazing to find old photos of old equipment....

[16:57:11]

sphery:

yeah, amazing how much things have changed

[16:57:26]

dewman:

the one on the right is a 110 meg drive..

[16:58:01]

dewman:

probably draws more power then my dl580

[16:58:38]

iamlindoro:

sphery: It's not anaglyph

[16:58:40]

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[16:59:06]

sphery:

iamlindoro: interesting

[16:59:17]

iamlindoro:

sphery: http://www.comcast.com/Corporate/Programming/sports/3Dfaqs.html

[16:59:36]

iamlindoro:

"And don't forget!"

[16:59:42]

iamlindoro:

"When in 3D mode, the guide will not render properly"

[16:59:43]

iamlindoro:

heh

[17:00:03]

iamlindoro:

heh, make sure your glasses are turned on

[17:01:17]

sphery:

I've been wondering how much http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/430583#430583 is true and how much is just wanting to believe... The guy says that it's hotter when he leaves the channel tuned to a HDTV channel than when tuned to a SDTV channel. Another poster says that input power (Kill-a-Watt, I'm sure) is the same for the box when on HDTV, SDTV channels or turned off.

[17:03:44]

sphery:

iamlindoro: so they're doing side-by-side images... wonder if they're cutting resolution on them

[17:04:16]

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[17:04:25]

iamlindoro:

sphery: Dunno, could always watch it on my POTV and let you know what it looks like

[17:04:30]

iamlindoro:

(Plain Old Television)

[17:04:38]

sphery:

Q. Does everyone watching a 3D TV need to wear the glasses? A. Yes. Everyone that wishes to view the 3D broadcast must have 3D glasses that work with their particular television. Viewers with prescription glasses should wear the 3D glasses over top of their prescription pair. Most new 3D TVs will come with a pair (or more) of glasses. Additional glasses can be purchased – check with the electronics retailer to see where to ...

[17:04:44]

sphery:

... purchase additional glasses and pricing information.

[17:05:14]

sphery:

heh, so if you don't own as many glasses as there are viewers, no one can watch in 3D :)

[17:05:23]

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[17:08:58]

Beirdo:

got some MGD chillin in the fridge :)

[17:09:56]

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[17:10:59]

mrand:

I've been mostly unsuccessful in understanding locale's, especially when (and more imporantly, why) LC_ALL might be required. Does Myth require LC_ALL to be set?

[17:11:21]

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[17:13:58]

iamlindoro:

mrand: In truth unicode/non-latin characters are just complicated in general. Myth's file listings/database insertions/etc. are all wrapped around Qt functionalities to do the same, and the character sets need to match throughout to work properly. the only bit of advice I can offer is that setting everything to UTF-8 for all users seems to be effective and not have any obvious drawbacks

[17:14:52]

iamlindoro:

I don't know that any of us have done a detailed study of which particular locale settings are required to be UTF-8 to work properly when it's so easy to simply set them all to UTF-8

[17:15:21]

iamlindoro:

I will say that the things that are very reliant on UTF-8 local are the grabbers, the python bindings, mirobridge, and mythvideo scanning.

[17:18:48]

iamlindoro:

mrand: However, I have LC_ALL set to NULL on both of my systems, and scanning and the bindings/python scripts work fine

[17:18:54]

iamlindoro:

everything else is en_us.UTF-8

[17:19:15]

mrand:

iamlindoro: Thanks for that. So scanning works even for non-ASCII chars?

[17:19:23]

iamlindoro:

yup

[17:23:57]

mrand:

iamlindoro: I guess the confusion on my side comes from the fact that I've seen random references to LC_ALL, yet it doesn't appear to be written anywhere that it is required, or even suggested. So I'm wondering if they just set LC_ALL to try something, or if it actually fixes something.

[17:23:59]

mrand:

anyway, thanks.

[17:27:26]

justinh:

wahey. got my wack installed in the cupboard under the stairs :)

[17:27:34]

justinh:

next up.. cabling :-\

[17:29:25]

justinh:

power's easy at least. it's already there

[17:29:28]

ivor:

justinh: make sure the cabling looks like this: http://royal.pingdom.com/2008/01/24/when-data . . . becomes-art/

[17:30:18]

justinh:

heh. like there's gonna be *that* much cable

[17:31:09]

ivor:

ooh hometime....

[17:31:28]

mrand:

that's not a lot of cable. hmmm... wonder if I can find the pic I'm thinking of...

[17:33:36]

justinh:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2277/2180039413_f54b142ff4_o.jpg ?

[17:35:32]

justinh:

there's gonna be ooo,, as many as EIGHT network cables, one RF cable... CCTV... and erm.. that'll be it

[17:36:59]

mrand:

yeah, that's impressive.

[17:37:04]

mrand:

That's a lot of fiber

[17:37:44]

mrand:

hrmmm... or maybe too large diameter for fiber

[17:38:27]

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[17:38:57]

dfletcher:

(sorry for re-paste from #mythtv, newbie here) hi stupid question. I go to setup -> settings -> media -> video and put a video directory path in there. I can play videos directly from this dir and sub-directories fine in mplayer. but no files ever appear in the video manager – the files aren't getting scanned. what could I be doing wrong?

[17:39:08]

AndyCap:

mrand: looks like rj45 dangling at the bottom of rack 2

[17:40:00]

sphery:

dfletcher: there were some threads saying that there are problems with CIFS/SMB mounts with video manager

[17:40:19]

sphery:

er, mythvideo

[17:40:22]

mrand:

dfletcher: did you scan for changes by hitting the M button within mythvideo?

[17:40:24]

iamlindoro:

which are moot in light of not having performed a scan ;)

[17:40:32]

sphery:

that's true

[17:40:37]

iamlindoro:

and the video manager no longer existing

[17:40:46]

dfletcher:

what's mythvideo? if I hit "m" I get a useless menu with "about", "cancel"

[17:40:47]

sphery:

yeah, I meant mythvideo

[17:40:51]

sphery:

scanning

[17:41:04]

sphery:

dfletcher: Media Library|Watch Videos

[17:41:14]

dfletcher:

oh ok I'll try from in there

[17:41:52]

dfletcher:

ahhhh "m" is context sensitive :)

[17:41:56]

dfletcher:

thanks guys

[17:41:58]

dfletcher:

that got em

[17:42:05]

sphery:

M = MENU

[17:42:17]

sphery:

different screens have different menus

[17:42:18]

dfletcher:

well yeah but that's just a little odd. because I'm *on* a menu :P

[17:42:19]

sphery:

so, yeah

[17:42:28]

iamlindoro:

You're not on a menu

[17:42:32]

dfletcher:

lol

[17:42:33]

mag0o:

menu^2

[17:42:53]

sphery:

in the main menu he was

[17:42:59]

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[17:43:02]

sphery:

or at least a menu screen :)

[17:43:10]

** iamlindoro yawns **

[17:45:12]

dewman:

I love menus

[17:46:32]

dfletcher:

heh ok now the hard part. hauppauge IR control :) this direct tv box has a USB port I wonder I can use that. the instructions seem to say USB->serial but this has no serial port

[17:47:10]

iamlindoro:

See the wiki

[17:47:37]

dfletcher:

yeah I did. it recommends all these USB to serial converters

[17:48:11]

kormoc_afk is now known as kormoc

[17:48:25]

dfletcher:

but the thing that it neglects to mention is *what you plug the USB into* :P so I assume it must mean PC USB -> USB/serial converter -> serial on the cable box

[17:48:35]

iamlindoro:

You need to read more carefully then :)

[17:51:23]

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[17:52:00]

dfletcher:

"Complete USB to USB cable set for Directv box" :o

[17:52:18]

dfletcher:

um isn't that just a USB cable?

[17:52:44]

kormoc:

only if you want to blow out the power supplies

[17:52:47]

iamlindoro:

no

[17:52:56]

wagnerrp:

two USB hosts cannot connect to each other

[17:53:15]

wagnerrp:

thats why you will never find a USB spec type-A to type-A cable

[17:53:35]

wagnerrp:

the only way something could exist, if its actually using proper USB, is if its an active cable with some client device in the middle

[17:53:53]

iamlindoro:

Which in this case is exactly that

[17:53:59]

dfletcher:

oh the cable box is a host gotcha

[17:54:05]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: sadly that's not true, http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartme . . . ;cp_id=10303 USB 2.0 Cables – A Male to A Male

[17:54:17]

iamlindoro:

he did say USB spec

[17:54:24]

iamlindoro:

that cable isn't USB any more

[17:54:32]

dfletcher:

you can also get an A to mini-b converter that would do it too

[17:54:37]

wagnerrp:

the dont display the USB logo or anything like that do they?

[17:54:53]

dfletcher:

infact some AVR models support both host and device mode, so that cable is actually useful :P

[17:54:54]

iamlindoro:

Mini-b isn't a host connector

[17:55:21]

dfletcher:

yes I know – but as I said I've seen host devices with it. at90usbkey is an example

[17:55:30]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: they claim "A great value on high performance, USB 2.0 compliant cables"

[17:55:54]

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[17:56:22]

iamlindoro:

They may claim it, but A-to-A is still illegal according to USB spec :)

[17:56:42]

iamlindoro:

(though I know you know that)

[17:58:04]

kormoc:

oh, I know, just wanted to point out that even respectable companies claim otherwise

[17:58:14]

dfletcher:

hmm so ok I'll order the $20 USB adapter thing. meantime I'll spend 16 hours setting up LIRC while I'm waiting :P

[17:58:24]

** AndyCap has a stupidly designed usb 2.5" disk that needs A-A **

[17:58:35]

iamlindoro:

usb-like

[17:58:48]

iamlindoro:

or possibly usb-functional

[17:58:55]

iamlindoro:

usb-ish

[17:58:58]

iamlindoro:

but not USB :)

[17:59:04]

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[17:59:49]

kormoc:

AndyCap: http://www.usb.org/about/faq/ans5/ Q6 and Q7

[18:00:21]

iamlindoro:

anyway, for those that haven't figured it out, USB control of a DTV box is just USB-Serial-null modem-Serial-USB

[18:00:39]

kormoc:

aka a usb bridge, no?

[18:01:13]

dfletcher:

so both machines open virtual serial ports? heh and we gave up serial ports ;)

[18:01:39]

dfletcher:

let's throw away serial ports and make serial much more complex! whee! :P

[18:02:00]

AndyCap:

dfletcher: it's much easier for the enduser though. :)

[18:02:02]

kormoc:

dfletcher: You asked for it. You wanted it faster and to support more devices and chaining...

[18:02:30]

AndyCap:

no more DCE, DTE, stop bits, parity settings, etc.

[18:02:43]

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[18:05:55]

dfletcher:

heh I could probably build this bridge actually. I've got a ton of atmega32u2s here, USB capable AVRs – and there's alovely lib called LUFA that has virtual serial support.

[18:06:55]

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[18:09:01]

justinh:

ow. looks like the digital economy bill will go through :(

[18:10:33]

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[18:10:46]

dfletcher:

I build these for a hobby http://fletchtronics.net/bumble-b .. so take 2, solder them back to back. then 2 instances of the virtual serial software, configured to pass data .. maybe 2 parallel 8 bit connections. heh this sounds like a fun challenge now :)

[18:11:31]

iamlindoro:

How are you going to run an instance of the software on the Directv box?

[18:11:45]

dfletcher:

it's AVR software – firmware

[18:11:51]

iamlindoro:

You need to use a USB to serial converter that the DTV box supports on that side

[18:11:52]

dfletcher:

CDC compatible

[18:12:18]

dfletcher:

yes well this supports every linux and windows box I've plugged it into without drivers

[18:12:20]

iamlindoro:

the DTv box expects to see one of its USB to serial adapters, I have sincere doubts about whether your approach will work

[18:12:49]

dfletcher:

if it's CDC based it will work. if it's like FTDI based it wont

[18:12:54]

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[18:13:48]

dfletcher:

hmm I wonder if I can tell before I commit this design with solder :)

[18:15:45]

dfletcher:

ah I could make a program that just randomly changes channels – not actually controlled from a PC or anything

[18:15:56]

dfletcher:

just to see if it's listening

[18:16:06]

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[18:26:45]

dfletcher:

oh hrm and if it doesn't work as-is maybe I can write a clone. my USB board is generic, can set any VID,PID that I want

[18:27:47]

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[18:31:57]

noii:

can anyone think of a reason why mythtv has started failing to recognise duplicates since I updated to the latest stable version?

[18:32:17]

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[18:32:45]

noii:

I'm getting multiple recordings of things that repeat now, and I don't remember changing anything about the way duplicates are detected

[18:33:13]

sphery:

noii: what's your guide data source?

[18:33:25]

justinh:

better than getting missed recordings :-)

[18:34:12]

justinh:

by guess is radio times, and dup matching based on subtitle AND description

[18:34:27]

justinh:

where the description changes as fast as the weather

[18:34:40]

sphery:

yeah, that could easily do it (and makes sense with his address)

[18:35:17]

sphery:

noii: also, make sure you run optmize_mythdb.pl just in case your DB is broken

[18:37:37]

dfletcher:

mmmm I also have some IR leds around here. maybe I should do a DIY blaster. mmmm so many choices :)

[18:37:52]

wagnerrp:

dfletcher: talk to beirdo about that one

[18:38:15]

dfletcher:

found this cool pic http://www.mythtv.org/w/images/3/3d/Geoffholdenhomebrew.jpg

[18:38:25]

dfletcher:

inspiring :)

[18:38:52]

iamlindoro:

Pretty ugly homemade emitter

[18:38:53]

justinh:

yeah, I want my cable STB to look that naff

[18:39:14]

iamlindoro:

creating your own IR emitter is very common, but that level of ugliness is indeed uncommon

[18:39:15]

justinh:

or inspiring... in the sense it's going to impel you to do better :D

[18:39:18]

dfletcher:

I could make it prettier :P

[18:39:22]

dfletcher:

heh yeah

[18:40:24]

dfletcher:

though I suppose I'd rather not dangle anything really. I've had a tivo dangling in front of my entertainment sys since 2001. getting sick of it :P

[18:40:48]

dfletcher:

and heh btw DirectTV killed my TiVO and myth rescued me :)

[18:40:58]

wagnerrp:

a length of heatshrink and a lighter would have made that immensely better

[18:41:00]

justinh:

yeah hacking the box & making a direct connection to the IR receiver is better

[18:41:04]

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[18:41:34]

dfletcher:

justinh, oh heh intesting idea. I did purchase (not rent) that box. I was thinking USB but that's hella simpler

[18:41:34]

justinh:

whoops.. you should only do that if you own the box. ;-)

[18:41:59]

justinh:

damn my rsyncs are slow, but hogging the network

[18:42:11]

justinh:

maybe time to dig out the USB-SATA converter

[18:43:45]

dfletcher:

hey what do you know I recognize some faces in here :) hi GuySoft. Dibblah are you a Drupal user or something? your nick is really familliar too

[18:43:49]

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[18:43:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: Gee, I guess my home-brew transmitter looks a little better... ;-) http://jartz.gotdns.com:8008/files/my_ir_blasters.jpg

[18:44:16]

dfletcher:

heh nice is that heat shrink on there?

[18:44:24]

dfletcher:

or just electricians tape?

[18:44:50]

J-e-f-f-A:

Heat shrink, and then some 'liquid electrical tape' where the heat shrink wouldn't work. ;-)

[18:45:16]

dfletcher:

heh yeah it looks really form-fitted. nice one

[18:45:22]

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[18:46:04]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: You'll notice the front of the IR led was filed flat — that's because it was over-saturating my receivers. Doing that made it work perfectly. ;-)

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[18:49:56]

dfletcher:

oh I guess I just know Dibblah from seeing him around ##electronics :) /me waves

[18:51:07]

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[18:53:46]

** J-e-f-f-A never thought of looking at IRC channels for non-myth stuff before... he doesn't know why... ;-) /me <3's electronics. (I just got my new copy of Nuts & Volts yesterday!) **

[18:54:20]

tzanger:

never liked nuts and volts that much

[18:54:29]

tzanger:

circuit cellar is what I read, but that's even bleh

[18:54:51]

tzanger:

although they had some REALLY good articles about inductor theory and applications

[18:54:54]

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[18:54:58]

tzanger:

and the tales from the dark side has some good stuff in it too

[18:55:00]

J-e-f-f-A:

tzanger: Yeah, and Radio Electronics was better too, but there's not much left out there anymore... we're a dying breed...

[18:55:17]

tzanger:

yes I have a TON of R-E mags from the 80s and early 90s

[18:55:26]

tzanger:

do or did? I can't remember if I got rid of 'em or not

[18:55:34]

J-e-f-f-A:

Doh!

[18:55:50]

dfletcher:

for bathroom reading Make isn't bad :P

[18:55:58]

dfletcher:

that and the mouser catalog :P

[18:56:01]

tzanger:

I loved 'em, but I never looked at them and I'm trying to reduce my packrat instincts

[18:56:04]

tzanger:

heh

[18:56:20]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: Yeah, I just discovered Make myself – pretty neat stuff. A bit pricey though!

[18:56:48]

dfletcher:

yeah I'd rather have that though than the ad model of N&V

[18:56:52]

J-e-f-f-A:

tzanger: yeah, I need to do the same in regards to packrat instincts...

[18:56:56]

dfletcher:

that mag is filled with ads :P

[18:57:00]

AndyCap:

dfletcher: they have ads for laser engravers which are annoying, I want one, but I have no use for one and it's expensive.

[18:57:07]

dfletcher:

hehehehe

[18:57:20]

dfletcher:

I have a use for one, but no money or room for it :P

[18:57:25]

dfletcher:

let's trade!

[18:57:29]

tzanger:

I don't want one

[18:57:41]

tzanger:

gotta get me a metal lathe and a mill

[18:57:52]

tzanger:

I want something a little larger than that 7x14s though

[18:58:06]

dfletcher:

ooh what I really want is a CNC mill. and a laser cutter!

[18:58:14]

** dfletcher needs some serious space **

[18:58:28]

tzanger:

I'll CNC it myself, I just want a good mill/lathe for now

[18:58:50]

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[18:59:07]

** J-e-f-f-A built a hobby CNC – well, about 80% done – needs the z axis motor mount completed and the drivers. **

[19:00:43]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: regarding connecting directly to the box – do you have a link or suggestions on the best way to do it?

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[19:03:33]

justinh:

J-e-f-f-A: not really, just dig around & look for likely places. I'd likely try it with an opto-isolator, use a logic gate or diodes on the IR receiver output

[19:03:39]

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[19:04:25]

justinh:

e.g. OR the signal from the IR receiver

[19:04:31]

tzanger:

what are you trying to do?

[19:04:51]

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[19:05:28]

justinh:

tzanger: make a direct connection to a STB to control it :)

[19:05:59]

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[19:06:02]

justinh:

I've done it before, but I used a switched socket so if the control jack is inserted it disables the normal receiver

[19:07:43]

dfletcher:

hrm I'd be happy for the moment if I could just get the IR blaster working. grr mythbuntu lied during setup and let me pick this device from a menu – and it's not set up. lies!

[19:07:47]

justinh:

the IR receiver was active low, so hooked up the optoisolator to act like it :)

[19:08:45]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: Makes sense. ;-) I just wondered if you had a reference. ;-)

[19:08:58]

justinh:

top my my head / seat of my pants

[19:09:09]

justinh:

like when I added a coax input/output to my minidisc deck

[19:10:27]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: yeah, I'd probably do the same – with an 1/8" jack on the back of the receiver. But then again, I don't have any issues with my IR blaster setup, so I probably won't go through the hassle for now. ;-)

[19:11:13]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: Yeah, I did something similar to ad a coax spdif output on a sat receiver that only had an optical output (years ago)

[19:11:28]

J-e-f-f-A:

'add' even... ;-)

[19:11:42]

justinh:

also added coax in/out to my SB Live card :)

[19:11:55]

justinh:

not enough people hack hardware anymore

[19:13:12]

dfletcher:

jeebus LIRC is a freaking deeper rabbit hole than myth!

[19:13:30]

** dfletcher commits lirc-icide **

[19:15:30]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: Yeah, I know. ;-) I've got an old 'boom box' from ~12 years ago that I 'modded' with new speakers, a small Car EQ/Amp, and some LED lights... But today's tech blow it away basically...

[19:15:33]

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[19:20:14]

justinh:

oh man this is more like it!

[19:20:19]

justinh:

40MB/sec

[19:20:32]

J-e-f-f-A:

nice... between local boxes?

[19:20:46]

justinh:

nah, over USB2.0 to sata converter

[19:21:02]

justinh:

ordinarily I'd just put the disks in the new box but I want a backup

[19:21:06]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: Jeeze, that's pretty darn fast...

[19:21:12]

J-e-f-f-A:

for usb 2.0!

[19:21:36]

justinh:

that's what rsync --progress is reporting

[19:21:50]

dfletcher:

hehehe this solution has the potential to look even more janky than that other pic I linked http://i42.tinypic.com/2zye6j7.jpg

[19:22:07]

justinh:

not on every file mind you, but still a way faster than over the 100mbit ethernet

[19:22:10]

dfletcher:

2 second solution! now I just need a bit of bit-bang code

[19:23:24]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: well, yes & no... ;-) That's certainly more 'flexible' than the 1st solution, which likely required a hardware serial port. and that pic just looks like a 'proof of concept'...

[19:23:53]

dfletcher:

heh well. I can turn that LED on and off right now

[19:24:02]

dfletcher:

so it's working a bit more than a proof :P

[19:24:16]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: just remember, you've got to turn it on and off at 38KHz...

[19:24:21]

dfletcher:

but the software should be better than like toggling it from USB

[19:24:22]

dfletcher:

yeah

[19:24:31]

dfletcher:

but heh that's no biggie

[19:24:39]

dfletcher:

AVRs have nice timers :)

[19:25:18]

** dfletcher hopes his DTV receiver is 940nm **

[19:25:46]

dfletcher:

that seemed the most common when I bought this pack of LEDs

[19:28:01]

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[19:34:11]

dfletcher:

ooh sexy. code. :) http://www.tau.ac.il/~stoledo/lego/AVR-ir/

[19:41:11]

dfletcher:

heh not so sexy code. but it does show how to use a timer to make that 38khz carrier

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[19:56:13]

Wicked:

anyone else having issues with mythnetvision?....i cannot get it to work on latest svn(or any other version) and in worst cases it completely makes mythtv seg fault. http://pastebin.com/nJer7LUC

[19:56:52]

Wicked:

running on ubuntu9.10 64bit

[19:57:25]

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[19:58:30]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: Is the issues you describe with playback of the videos or with getting any to display?

[19:59:08]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: Like do you get results from a search with the Youtube grabber?

[19:59:33]

Wicked:

currently when i search for a internet video using the youtube plugin...i find videos...but as soon as i goto play one...it launches what kinda looks like the browser...but its all blank

[19:59:42]

Wicked:

yea exactly

[20:00:22]

Wicked:

and when i hit esc to go back to the main window...it tends to seg fault

[20:01:11]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: MNV uses MythBrowser to display the videos. Do you have an independant way of testing that MythBrowser is working and/or flash is installed properly?

[20:01:44]

Wicked:

let me go test mythbrowser.

[20:02:29]

wagnerrp:

Wicked: also, did you get a core dump from that?

[20:02:34]

wagnerrp:

if so, backtraces are always nice

[20:02:57]

wagnerrp:

just 'gdm mythfrontend mythfrontend.core', and then 'bt'

[20:03:22]

iamlindoro:

Though in that case, the crash will be in the NSPlugin wrapper/whatever plugin is being loaded

[20:03:28]

iamlindoro:

(so outside of myth code)

[20:03:30]

Wicked:

going to youtube via the browser and selecting a video..it does play

[20:03:41]

Wicked:

wagnerrp, where would it be?

[20:04:52]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: Did you ever have MNV working properly and if you did when was that?

[20:05:10]

Wicked:

RDV_Linux, no never. its always not worked for e

[20:05:12]

Wicked:

*me

[20:06:35]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: Then this likely a setup issue. See the advise from wagnerrp and iamlindoro ^^^

[20:06:35]

iamlindoro:

If you get a blank browser when attempting to pull up a video, then there are flash plugin install issues

[20:06:50]

iamlindoro:

Can't tell you what will fix them, but it's a dead giveaway

[20:06:54]

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[20:07:14]

iamlindoro:

likewise the segfaults are with 99% certainty outside of Myth code (and with 100% certainty outside of MythNetvision code)

[20:07:29]

Wicked:

yea well...normal mythwebbrowser works fine with flash...so im not sure why mythnetvision wouldnt

[20:07:54]

iamlindoro:

MNV *uses* mythbrowser

[20:08:01]

iamlindoro:

once you launch a video, you are outside of MNV

[20:08:02]

Wicked:

yea im not really sure. everything related to mythtv/flash is default

[20:08:56]

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[20:09:02]

Wicked:

yea. guess ill just have to wait it out and hope w/e it is gets fixed

[20:09:31]

iamlindoro:

Or you could provide a backtrace, as mentioned before and actually do something to help the matter

[20:09:55]

iamlindoro:

since I'm the one who would fix any potential issue in MNV and without a backtrace I'm not doing anything ;)

[20:10:11]

iamlindoro:

That said, if you get as far as launching the browser, it's out of MNV's hands

[20:10:58]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: Try a bliptv grabber search. They always show a web page that starts a video rather than a fullbrowser window video. It may help in determining the issue. Any search term that returns results will do,

[20:11:37]

Wicked:

ok

[20:12:25]

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[20:13:54]

Wicked:

well..its loading the webpage....but no video is showing up or playing

[20:13:58]

justinh:

well, new server location is good :) Not looking fwd to pulling new ethernet & coax cabling though

[20:14:00]

Wicked:

like its not finding flash

[20:14:02]

iamlindoro:

So it's a flash plugin issue

[20:14:15]

Wicked:

but other sites it doesnt

[20:14:19]

justinh:

pulling, as in crawling under the floor & dragging. Gah

[20:15:17]

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[20:15:40]

justinh:

but on the plus side, my network & whole house audio cabling will at least be structured at last!

[20:15:40]

dfletcher:

oh heh I've been searching like a madman trying to find the IR codes of DirecTV. I should just set up a receiver, point the remote at it and see what I get :)

[20:15:43]

RDV_Linux:

Wicked: I agree with iamlindoro that this is a flash installation issue. I have nothing more to add,

[20:16:16]

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[20:16:20]

Wicked:

oh well. seemed like a cool thing...guess its still a bit to early to use reliably...

[20:16:22]

wagnerrp:

i love when ML threads go COMPLETELY off track

[20:16:35]

iamlindoro:

Wicked: I feel like you are not listening at all

[20:16:46]

iamlindoro:

If you get as far as the page, and he plugin doesn't load, it's a plugin issue

[20:16:56]

iamlindoro:

not a single line of MythNetvision pertains to that

[20:17:16]

iamlindoro:

Not one character relates to the loading of, use of, or execution of the flash plugin

[20:17:30]

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[20:17:37]

iamlindoro:

So the issue not remotely one of MNV's reliability, or lack thereof

[20:17:51]

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[20:18:06]

Wicked:

except that it relys on what your suggesting is not working. Flash works great in firefox and chrome for me. Its ONLY in mythbrowser that it does not seem to work...which leads to me the conclusion that mythbrowser still needs work to work reliably with flash

[20:18:36]

iamlindoro:

Wicked: And all of the rest of us have managed to make it work reliably, indicating an isolated case of misconfigured plugin

[20:19:17]

Wicked:

well...all other flash related things i use do not have issues with the flash plugin im using.

[20:19:21]

iamlindoro:

MythBrowser is merely a frontend to webkit, a standards-compliant web rendering engine

[20:19:35]

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[20:19:54]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: They're not on the lirc.org site?

[20:19:57]

GuySoft:

hi dfletcher :)

[20:20:08]

iamlindoro:

So to put it another way, you could do a little legwork and figure out what webkit/Qt NSPlugins loading expects, and make whatever changes *today*, or just spend the rest of your life hoping for the mountain to come to you

[20:20:34]

iamlindoro:

But I can promise that the latter will never happen, at least within the context of Myth code.

[20:20:36]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, what are you trying to do?

[20:20:46]

dfletcher:

GuySoft, make a BB IR blaster :)

[20:20:50]

J-e-f-f-A:

GuySoft: IR control of a DirectTV box. ;-)

[20:20:57]

dfletcher:

if it works it'll be nice. userland only, no LIRC

[20:21:36]

Wicked:

its ok. im not a developer and dont know anything about webkit/qt

[20:21:47]

** iamlindoro sighs **

[20:21:54]

iamlindoro:

There is *no* development/coding required!

[20:21:56]

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[20:22:21]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, you mean so it will switch channels using ir?

[20:22:23]

iamlindoro:

Use google, determine where Qt/Webkit expects NSPlugins to live, figure out how your installation differs, fix

[20:23:11]

iamlindoro:

But that's about as far as my patience runs today, best of luck, have fun storming the castle

[20:23:20]

dfletcher:

GuySoft, yeah. I have a hauppage one but setting this up looks more painful than building my own :P

[20:23:44]

dfletcher:

hrm I bet it's some common IR protocol. like rc5 or something.

[20:24:06]

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[20:24:09]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, we did a few games with that in Affordy when i worked there. generally those things are a pain because you have to set them up and put a lot of time in to it

[20:24:38]

dfletcher:

well how else can I get my satellite box to change channels?

[20:25:01]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, satellite its good.. here i just used DVB-T

[20:25:11]

GuySoft:

thats digital on its own :)

[20:25:23]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: So you have an IR blaster that came with your hauppauge tuner already? If it's supported by LIRC, then it might not be as hard as you think...

[20:25:41]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: (although I completly like your AVR thought line too...)

[20:25:50]

dfletcher:

J-e-f-f-A, well mythbuntu already screwed this pooch, I don't want to fix it :P

[20:26:03]

dfletcher:

this IR blaster actually shows up in a menu

[20:26:10]

dfletcher:

but then they don't install the kernel mods needed

[20:26:12]

dfletcher:

FAIL

[20:26:38]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, do you need a hand to compile those modules? that i can do :)

[20:26:39]

dfletcher:

so – I'd have to go in and figure out WTF mythbuntu is doing wrong

[20:26:42]

J-e-f-f-A:

dfletcher: Gee, it should have been a simple menu selection with MythBuntu ( From what I understand...)

[20:26:44]

dfletcher:

or install another dist :P

[20:26:52]

dfletcher:

yeah well "shoulda"

[20:27:00]

dfletcher:

the lirc service won't start

[20:27:11]

dfletcher:

complains about the missing kernel mods

[20:27:18]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, compiling drivers is faster from my expropriate.. once you get it

[20:27:31]

dfletcher:

GuySoft, I know how to do that :P

[20:27:33]

** iamlindoro assumes the appropriate bugs have been filed **

[20:27:38]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, did you try module-asistant? its a sort of aptitude for kernel modules

[20:27:43]

dfletcher:

if I was into building my own kernel, I would not have picked mythbuntu

[20:28:05]

iamlindoro:

Since that would be the courteous thing to do if you're going to publicly complain about it

[20:28:09]

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[20:28:17]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, actually debian kernels are really easy to build.. even i can do it :)

[20:28:30]

dfletcher:

iamlindoro, heh ok I will. I don't mind spending time to make it better

[20:28:41]

iamlindoro:

thanks

[20:28:46]

dfletcher:

GuySoft, the point is I don't want to go off dist

[20:28:50]

iamlindoro:

(bugs to mythbuntu, of course, rather than to Myth proper)

[20:29:00]

GuySoft:

dfletcher, mind you we dont mind if you spend time making the bumble-b even better ;)

[20:29:03]

dfletcher:

that's WHY I picked an ubuntu derivitive – packages managed *for* me :P

[20:29:15]

gnujunk:

use /nick gnujunk

[20:30:10]

GuySoft:

.. its ether that or kidnap a dabian package maintainer

[20:31:51]

gnujunk:

hi i'm having problems getting mythvideo to find videos, everything else works ok. I've checked permissions etc. on folders – all ok. Any ideas?

[20:32:22]

iamlindoro:

gnujunk: Have you read the instructions and scanned for videos?

[20:32:36]

gnujunk:

yes

[20:32:45]

iamlindoro:

How did you go about scanning for videos?

[20:33:09]

gnujunk:

used mythfrontend

[20:33:15]

iamlindoro:

And did...?

[20:34:23]

gnujunk:

went to watch videos after setting up directories. I restarted the backend daemon also

[20:34:31]

iamlindoro:

went to watch videos and...?

[20:34:44]

iamlindoro:

Think you need to read the instructions for real

[20:34:48]

iamlindoro:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Mythvideo

[20:34:59]

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[20:35:02]

iamlindoro:

Since the answer appears to be "no" to both of my initial questions

[20:36:44]

** iamlindoro sends away for his diploma in dentistry with an emphasis in tooth extraction **

[20:37:18]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: you certainly have enough practice at it

[20:37:40]

iamlindoro:

I'm moving on to ears

[20:38:56]

iamlindoro:

Gon' make me a necklace!

[20:39:17]

kormoc:

hehe

[20:39:20]

kormoc:

welp, lunch time

[20:41:42]

gnujunk:

hi, sorry 'bout that. Re-read relevant section of wiki thought scan was automatic after going into watch video! All is well :-)

[20:41:51]

gnujunk:

ta

[20:42:20]

wagnerrp:

gnujunk: it may be for the next cycle, but has never been previously for mythvideo

[20:42:48]

iamlindoro:

gnujunk: Glad you got it, no problem

[20:43:31]

iamlindoro:

Realistically the auto-scanning has a number of complicated moving parts and as such I'm hesitant to say it'll be done for .24 unless I get really motivated

[20:43:47]

iamlindoro:

Depends on how good the API for MFileSystemWatcher ends up being :)

[20:44:03]

wagnerrp:

yeah... depends on external code getting written

[20:44:37]

iamlindoro:

(and also depends on me finding a bunch of time to get it working and poishing it)

[20:44:58]

iamlindoro:

Though certainly I hope for it to happen

[20:45:13]

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[20:45:31]

Satyr:

Greetings- I have a quick question about MythTV- is it cool to ask here?

[20:45:38]

wagnerrp:

yep

[20:46:12]

Satyr:

How many channels can one record at once at the same time, assuming I'm using an HVR-1600

[20:46:44]

wagnerrp:

one analog channel, and one digital multiplex (with however many channels are contained within that multiplex)

[20:47:37]

messerting:

I have recorded five at the same time with my Terratec Cinergy C HD (that are in the same multiplex)

[20:47:59]

Satyr:

So if I wanted to record multiple HD channels I would probably need more than one card or no?

[20:48:42]

messerting:

I'd guess so, since multiple HD channels seldom are in the same multiplex

[20:48:57]

[20:49:00]

Satyr:

Forgive me- I'm not familiar with what a 'multiplex' actually means.

[20:49:16]

Satyr:

I gather they are groups of SD digital channels?

[20:49:20]

iamlindoro:

multiple programs (what you would consider channels) contained within a single frequency assignment

[20:49:27]

iamlindoro:

resolution independent

[20:49:31]

Satyr:

AH.

[20:49:58]

iamlindoro:

you can fit more low bitrate channels into a single frequency width, or several mid-bitrate channels, or one super-huge bitrate channel, or any combination therein

[20:50:07]

Satyr:

When would you find channels grouped together like that? Are they related some how? English vs. Spanish or something like that?

[20:50:14]

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[20:50:35]

iamlindoro:

Entirely at the discretion of the broadcast engineer, but generally optimized for bitrate/bandwidth

[20:50:37]

wagnerrp:

they are on one physical channel

[20:50:53]

wagnerrp:

if youre talking about broadcast, theyre going to be all the channels that specific broadcaster offers

[20:50:57]

iamlindoro:

multiplexing will occur in almost any digital Cable or OTA system in some fashion, though

[20:51:06]

devinheitmueller:

Satyr: depends on whether you are talking about over the air or cable. For over-the-air, the channels are typically related (multiple channels from one provider – e.g. NBC and NBC Weather). If it's digital cable, the channels can be completely unrelated.

[20:51:13]

wagnerrp:

if youre talking about cable, its up to the cable company, and will likely have no rhyme or reason

[20:51:27]

Satyr:

Right- Specifically my provider is Dish Network.

[20:51:35]

Satyr:

I suspect there will be no rhyme nor reason to it.

[20:51:41]

wagnerrp:

then you cannot capture digital channels

[20:51:42]

Satyr:

... as with most things when dealing with them.

[20:51:48]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: In that case you won't have any access to the digital feed of your provider anyway

[20:51:50]

wagnerrp:

you have to go through a STTB

[20:51:57]

iamlindoro:

So your only options are analog capture

[20:52:20]

iamlindoro:

so for the HVR-1600, you could capture one channel from a single set top box at any given time

[20:52:27]

iamlindoro:

and in analog, SD

[20:52:46]

iamlindoro:

If you want to be able to capture HD from Dish network, you will need one STB, and one Hauppauge HD-PVR for each concurrent recording

[20:53:03]

Satyr:

Is the STB the box Dish provides?

[20:53:08]

iamlindoro:

yes

[20:53:39]

Satyr:

So the signal comes into Myth from the STB not the actual line from the dish?

[20:53:50]

iamlindoro:

in the case of Dish network, that is correct

[20:54:03]

Satyr:

Why is that? Something to do with how Disk processes its signal?

[20:54:08]

Satyr:

Dish*

[20:54:22]

iamlindoro:

The dish network signal is entirely encrypted, and thus their hardware must to the decryption

[20:54:27]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: because the signal is encrypted, and ^ bum!

[20:54:33]

J-e-f-f-A:

;-)

[20:54:46]

iamlindoro:

as their boxes provide no capturable digital output, your only option is to capture one of the analog outputs from the box

[20:54:49]

** J-e-f-f-A has dish network too. **

[20:54:57]

iamlindoro:

which can be SD (S-Video, composite, RF) or HD (component)

[20:55:14]

iamlindoro:

in the case of SD capture you have many options to capture the signal from the box. In the case of HD, you have one, the Hauppauge HD-PVR

[20:55:28]

iamlindoro:

In either case, you will need one set top box per concurrent capture

[20:55:36]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: I have 3 Dish SD receivers and capture them with Hauppauge PVR-500 and PVR-250 cards with S-Video.

[20:55:36]

iamlindoro:

and one capture card or HD-PVR

[20:56:00]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: And for the record, the situation in windoze is no different.

[20:56:37]

Satyr:

You mean for other Windows-based PVR software systems?

[20:56:46]

iamlindoro:

yes, that's what he means

[20:56:51]

Satyr:

Damn.

[20:56:53]

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[20:57:00]

Satyr:

I am starting to dislike Dish more and more.

[20:57:07]

Satyr:

So what's the most flexible set up? Cable?

[20:57:16]

iamlindoro:

Moving to another provider would just mean moving to another flavor of frustration

[20:57:21]

Satyr:

lol

[20:57:36]

iamlindoro:

Cable is still predominantly encrypted almost everywhere, with the exceptions being NBC/CBS/Fox/ABC in most places

[20:57:58]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Well, yes and no... Cable companies are tightening up their networks too, so even if you get someting 'in the clear' now, it probably will go 'dark' with little (or probably NO) notice...

[20:57:59]

iamlindoro:

So while you can generally capture *something* digitally without a box, it's equivalent to what you would get with an antenna for free

[20:58:10]

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[20:58:21]

J-e-f-f-A:

Yep.

[20:58:28]

Satyr:

So no matter what you will have to run your signal through the provider's STB first before running it to the home brew PVR?

[20:58:32]

Satyr:

most likely, that is.

[20:58:40]

wagnerrp:

unless youre using broadcast tv

[20:58:44]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: If you want all of your channels in their original resolution, yes

[20:58:57]

iamlindoro:

^^ Right, unless you just "go free" and use an antenna

[20:59:01]

Satyr:

Sure.

[20:59:16]

Satyr:

Which isn't an awful solution if you want "the" networks, right?

[20:59:21]

iamlindoro:

right

[20:59:27]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Check what you can get for HD over-the-air — I get a total of 22 channels (counting all the sub-channels) via ATSC...

[20:59:33]

Satyr:

Not where I'm at... lol

[20:59:42]

Satyr:

NBC, ABC maybe one other.

[20:59:43]

iamlindoro:

many are quite happy with just using an antenna, and generally speaking you are likely to get better quality captures of those netowrks via antenna anyway

[20:59:50]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: Zip code?

[20:59:50]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: tvfool.com

[20:59:54]

Satyr:

83301

[21:00:04]

messerting:

I'm pretty satified with DVB-C, where I get all channels that I've paid for *legally* (in Norway)

[21:00:14]

messerting:

but I'm moving now, and the new place will have IPTV

[21:00:19]

messerting:

that will be a challenge

[21:00:21]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: http://www.silicondust.com/hdhomerun/lineup_w . . . neup_1343320

[21:00:35]

wagnerrp:

DVB-C is different, in that it has conditional access rather than DRM

[21:00:39]

iamlindoro:

Not too terrible, but it could be better

[21:01:07]

iamlindoro:

messerting: The situation outside the US isn't a valid comparison, since we don't have any of those options

[21:01:27]

iamlindoro:

Don't think he would be consoled by knowing what TV he could get if he moved continents

[21:01:38]

messerting:

well, I happen to live in Norway and use MythTV

[21:01:44]

J-e-f-f-A:

messerting: yeah, you guys are lucky out there...

[21:02:00]

iamlindoro:

messerting: Well he happens not to and he asked about his situation, so your experience is irrelevant :P

[21:02:19]

messerting:

well, ok :)

[21:03:23]

messerting:

But what about IPTV? Is that possible at all to get access to in myth?

[21:03:25]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Head over to tvfool.com and click on the "Check Your Address for Free TV" link – at least according to your zip code, you should be able to get a bunch of stations well... http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper& . . . 6b5a195ccfac

[21:03:59]

Satyr:

Only a few unless I go with a monster roof-mount.

[21:04:03]

iamlindoro:

messerting: If your provider is compatible with out IPTV recorder and broadcasts unencrypted

[21:04:09]

iamlindoro:

er with our

[21:04:36]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Yeah, I just looked again... CBS, PBS and Fox basically...

[21:04:37]

iamlindoro:

Our IPTV recorder is very underdeveloped, it is really only supposed to work with a particular french provider, though it happens to kind-of work with a few others

[21:04:53]

messerting:

iamlindoro: this is interesting

[21:04:58]

messerting:

I'll search the wiki a bit :)

[21:05:20]

iamlindoro:

In essence, it may, it may not, you'll probably have to try (and it may be painful getting it set up even if it does work)

[21:05:44]

iamlindoro:

Wish the situation was different, but until we get a very capable dev who needs good IPTV support, it'll probably stay that way :(

[21:06:23]

messerting:

well, I've spent a whole lot of hours on getting dvb-c to work, so it is really sad for me to move to a new place..

[21:06:41]

messerting:

maybe I will look into IPTV, or maybe I'll just give up the whole mediacenter :(

[21:07:20]

messerting:

I'm running 0.22-stable from svn, so it should be easy to look at the code

[21:07:37]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Seems odd to me that there are so many stations at 18 degrees, but only 3 are transmitting... or only 3 digital... strange.

[21:07:40]

messerting:

but to hack the code... dunno :P

[21:08:33]

Satyr:

That's called living in the middle of nowhere.

[21:08:37]

Satyr:

Nothing makes sense.

[21:09:18]

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[21:09:41]

messerting:

iamlindoro: I can't seem to find anything on IPTV directly related to mythtv on the wiki – do you have a link?

[21:09:42]

Satyr:

So my most viable option is to use some kind of provider- thus I must use their box. The only way to capture an HD signal this way is to use component cables?

[21:10:14]

iamlindoro:

messerting: I've never gone looking for it specifically, though there are a few pages that pertain to people's setups with particular services-- just none that I have memorized

[21:10:28]

messerting:

ok

[21:10:29]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: Correct, component outs to a Hauppauge HD-PVR

[21:11:12]

messerting:

(ok found some stuff now)

[21:11:35]

Satyr:

Which means my box needs to have a component out, which I am not sure. I know it has HDMI for sure. So in this set up, what role does the STB play? Does it have to be set at a specific channel or does it do its job just being connected in-line?

[21:11:40]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Here's my map – my antenna points at 103 degrees, so I get all the stations in that direction... http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper& . . . 6bd4dc633ce6

[21:12:02]

wagnerrp:

Satyr: you have to control it with something

[21:12:11]

iamlindoro:

Satyr: The Set top box almost certainly has component out (Red, green, blue)... channels are changed on the box with an IR emitter from the PC

[21:12:11]

wagnerrp:

serial, IR, firewire, whatever

[21:12:25]

iamlindoro:

^ yeah, and sometimes firewire will work for cable, or USB/Serial for Sat

[21:12:34]

Satyr:

So, MythTV will control the box?

[21:12:41]

iamlindoro:

yep

[21:12:46]

Satyr:

funky.

[21:12:56]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Yep, and you hide the remote and take the batteries out of it...

[21:13:07]

iamlindoro:

technically speaking LIRC will, but it's not an important distinction for you right now

[21:13:25]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: The STB becomes a 'slave' tuner to the Myth box.

[21:13:31]

wagnerrp:

rather mythtv will let you run some external command to change the channels

[21:13:35]

Satyr:

And I would suspect the same behavior from a windows based analog such as SageTV or something similar?

[21:13:42]

J-e-f-f-A:

Yes.

[21:13:43]

wagnerrp:

its up to you to make that external command do the right thing

[21:13:43]

iamlindoro:

yup

[21:13:46]

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[21:14:25]

Satyr:

Bizarre.

[21:14:52]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: They are trying to force everyone to use they're PVR solutions...

[21:14:56]

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[21:15:00]

Satyr:

If only I could just pay for the service, unencrypted and let me figure it out.

[21:15:09]

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[21:15:15]

Satyr:

I dislike my DVR Box- it's constantly freezing and rebooting.

[21:15:18]

Satyr:

Daily, actually.

[21:15:30]

wagnerrp:

windows media center is the only solution that can actually directly capture those encrypted channels

[21:15:38]

wagnerrp:

and as a result, you no longer have control over your content

[21:15:52]

wagnerrp:

in that scenario, the content is stored on your hard drive encrypted

[21:16:07]

wagnerrp:

and has to be passed back through the tuner card, and authorized by your cableco on each playback

[21:16:10]

J-e-f-f-A:

^^ and that's only via Cable, with a CableCard tuner.

[21:16:28]

Satyr:

So you can't actually play it without being hooked into the service.

[21:16:32]

Satyr:

That's... stupid.

[21:16:37]

wagnerrp:

YES!

[21:16:44]

Satyr:

How has this not raised more flags.

[21:16:47]

J-e-f-f-A:

You can play it back, on that PC only.

[21:16:56]

wagnerrp:

because hardly anyone builds their own DVR

[21:16:59]

Satyr:

Good god. I had no idea it was this restricted.

[21:17:08]

wagnerrp:

theyre all satisfied with the one the cableco provides them

[21:17:19]

wagnerrp:

Satyr: and thats exactly why they can get away with it being so restricted

[21:17:32]

Satyr:

Terrible.

[21:17:48]

Satyr:

There needs to be a Boston Tea Party of television service.

[21:17:58]

Satyr:

Free the signal.

[21:18:04]

skd5aner:

you're preaching to the choir Satyr

[21:18:14]

Satyr:

I thank you all for your enlightenment.

[21:18:27]

Satyr:

I was being oppressed and didn't even know it.

[21:18:30]

Satyr:

I feel ashamed.

[21:18:54]

iamlindoro:

In the grand scheme of things, there are many more critical things to take a stand on ;)

[21:19:27]

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[21:19:30]

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[21:19:50]

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[21:20:03]

Satyr:

iamlindoro: Anytime I encounter something that is an impediment to doing what I choose, I tend to get ruffled. It's the American way.

[21:20:08]

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[21:20:24]

** Satyr is ruffled. **

[21:20:34]

iamlindoro:

Affrontery is a limited resource, it shoudl be spent on something ennobling ;)

[21:20:53]

skd5aner:

iamlindoro: haha – indeed. Wouldn't the world be a better place if consumer rights on media was one of the only things we really had to "worry" about? :)

[21:21:08]

Satyr:

My capacity to annoy and inevitably achieve my goals is quite an unlimited resource.. I spend it flippantly.

[21:21:10]

iamlindoro:

ie, TV takes second place to clothing the naked, feeding the poor, giving voice to those that have none, etc.

[21:21:21]

iamlindoro:

Once those are all worked out, let's handle TV ;)

[21:21:25]

iamlindoro:

skd5aner: indeed ;)

[21:21:30]

Satyr:

I concede that point.

[21:21:38]

Satyr:

Still..

[21:21:42]

Satyr:

I want my damn TV

[21:21:48]

abqjp:

Some airline is starting to charge for *carry-on* bags!

[21:21:54]

Satyr:

wth

[21:22:08]

skd5aner:

great, now I've got "money for nothing" stuck in my head... "I want my MTV"

[21:22:09]

iamlindoro:

abqjp: It's RyanAir, they've been doing that kind of thing for YEARS

[21:22:12]

Satyr:

It's no longer traveling- it's bodily relocation.

[21:22:53]

skd5aner:

abqjp: good resource – http://www.kayak.com/airline-fees

[21:23:07]

Satyr:

To travel without equipment implies simply moving my person from one location to another.

[21:23:22]

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[21:23:23]

Satyr:

skd5aner: That is a great resource- thank you.

[21:24:13]

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[21:24:38]

abqjp:

iamlindoro: I believe the news article I saw, said it was Spirit Air.

[21:24:57]

iamlindoro:

abqjp: Ah, maybe a domestic started doing it too

[21:26:06]

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[21:28:27]

wagnerrp:

abqjp: you should bring a carry-on full of lead, and see what they say

[21:30:08]

abqjp:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36230023/ns/travel-news/

[21:30:45]

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[21:43:01]

Satyr:

J-e-f-f-A: What kind of Antenna do you use to pick up all of your channels?

[21:43:43]

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[21:43:48]

devinheitmueller:

Personally, I have a $9.95 set of rabbit ears I bought from Radio Shack.

[21:44:32]

iamlindoro:

This is where devinheitmueller posts his view again ;)

[21:44:55]

iamlindoro:

It doesn't count when you can spit on the transmission tower

[21:45:13]

devinheitmueller:

When you said "view", I thought you meant "opinion" and was quite confused for a minute.

[21:46:35]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: A roof-mounted UHF Yagi – Radio Shack 70-mile model – something like 40" long. If you want I can find the exact one on their site...

[21:47:45]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103088

[21:49:34]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: Actually, I switched to a VHF/UHF during the transition as one of our channels stayed in VHF... Here's what I'm currently using – basically the same antenna with a VHF section: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3808570

[21:49:36]

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[21:50:15]

J-e-f-f-A:

Satyr: but since then, that one station switched to the UHF band, so I don't need the VHF antenna anymore... oh well... ;-)

[21:50:42]

rabc:

does anyone know what the best support video capure PCI or USB card is for mythtv for capturing satelitte programs

[21:50:53]

kormoc:

rabc: hd?

[21:50:56]

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[21:51:34]

J-e-f-f-A:

rabc: And when you say Satellite – are you referring to within the US, or outside the US?

[21:51:46]

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[21:51:50]

rabc:

hi kormoc jeffa thanks for the reply

[21:51:59]

rabc:

no HD me in ireland

[21:52:25]

rabc:

can mythtv record sky progs on shedule like sky+ box

[21:52:44]

GrahamIRC:

yes

[21:52:55]

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[21:53:00]

rabc:

hi graham thanks for the reply

[21:53:14]

rabc:

can anyone recommend a well supported card

[21:53:15]

GrahamIRC:

I use myth with my regular sky box

[21:53:36]

GrahamIRC:

the universally accepted card is the hauppauge PVR-150

[21:53:41]

kormoc:

rabc: happauge pvr 150 or pvr 250

[21:53:45]

rabc:

wow thanks

[21:53:53]

rabc:

thats what i was thinking

[21:53:55]

GrahamIRC:

which you connect via composite to your sky box

[21:54:07]

rabc:

aye composite no bother

[21:54:11]

GrahamIRC:

only way to do it if you want to watch encrypted channels

[21:54:15]

GrahamIRC:

picture is ok

[21:54:16]

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[21:54:17]

J-e-f-f-A:

or.. S-Video

[21:54:23]

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[21:54:26]

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[21:54:31]

GrahamIRC:

no S-Video out on my sky box :-(

[21:54:36]

J-e-f-f-A:

ah.

[21:55:06]

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[21:55:06]

GrahamIRC:

have been looking for a linux support h.264 card to replace the PVR-150, but nothing around at a sensible price

[21:55:11]

rabc:

aye composite would be fine thanks

[21:55:30]

rabc:

what about one of those tvix

[21:55:30]

justinh:

GrahamIRC: you could convert rgb to svideo

[21:55:30]

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[21:55:45]

GrahamIRC:

rabc: I would also highly recommend using a dusky control to change channels rather that lirc and infrared

[21:55:52]

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[21:55:54]

justinh:

some muppets have been known to grab rgb with a framegrabber..

[21:55:54]

GrahamIRC:

www.dusky-control.com

[21:56:02]

rabc:

thanks graham

[21:56:05]

rabc:

checking now

[21:56:16]

GrahamIRC:

much more reliable and neater

[21:56:27]

rabc:

wow that is the biz

[21:56:29]

rabc:

thanks

[21:56:32]

rabc:

genuis

[21:56:45]

GrahamIRC:

justinh: no RGB out either I don't think

[21:56:51]

justinh:

or just dump $ky altogether. I mean what's worth having that's not on freeview? :-O

[21:57:00]

justinh:

GrahamIRC: yeah they've got RGB out

[21:57:03]

rabc:

aye fuch sky

[21:57:07]

GrahamIRC:

on the scart?

[21:57:10]

justinh:

yeah

[21:57:17]

justinh:

most sky boxes have it

[21:57:20]

GrahamIRC:

will it make much difference tho

[21:57:24]

GrahamIRC:

mine is out of the ark

[21:57:25]

justinh:

not really

[21:57:32]

iamlindoro:

Or just get an HD-PVR and use that component out to capture Terry Pratchett's Going Postal ;)

[21:57:37]

J-e-f-f-A:

I wonder if they've got s-video on the scart... ;-)

[21:57:42]

justinh:

J-e-f-f-A: nope

[21:57:43]

iamlindoro:

who *knows* how long I'll have to wait to see that

[21:57:51]

GrahamIRC:

I've just got hold of a Hauppauge NOVA-HD-S2 to grab FreeSat and FreeSat HD

[21:58:04]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: wow... seems strange that they'd have RGB, but not s-video.

[21:58:06]

GrahamIRC:

seems to work well

[21:58:06]

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[21:58:33]

GrahamIRC:

I did have a poke around but couldn't find s-video – will take another look one day

[21:58:43]

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[21:58:44]

justinh:

J-e-f-f-A: common on stuff in other euro countries but not on sky

[21:58:55]

GrahamIRC:

also looking forward to Freeview HD if I can get a decent signal

[21:58:56]

rabc:

what about one of these to beat SKY

[21:58:56]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: ah. ;-)

[21:58:59]

rabc:

http://www.dreambox.org.uk/

[21:59:08]

GrahamIRC:

I hate Sky!

[21:59:20]

rabc:

aye fuch SKY

[21:59:26]

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[21:59:31]

justinh:

rabc: you have to contravene your T&Cs to use one of them & you can't talk about it here anyway

[21:59:45]

** iamlindoro refers rabc to the channel rules about Terms of Service and language **

[21:59:58]

rabc:

sorry will keep that in mind

[22:00:01]

iamlindoro:

and to my personal "one warning only" rule ;)

[22:00:08]

rabc:

apologies

[22:00:15]

iamlindoro:

no worries, appreciate the understanding

[22:00:22]

rabc:

was not aware

[22:00:30]

justinh:

we record way more than we can possibly watch, just from freeview

[22:00:43]

justinh:

it's amazing how much there is :)

[22:00:58]

justinh:

most pay TV in the UK is just junk anyway IMHO

[22:01:00]

GrahamIRC:

I don't think I've really watched live tv for a couple of years now

[22:01:10]

justinh:

movie channels show too much straight to disc junk

[22:01:18]

rabc:

aye im more into bitorrent TV

[22:01:22]

justinh:

and if you don't care for sports.. problem solved

[22:01:23]

GrahamIRC:

there are some things I like such as House & 24 that aren't on freeview

[22:01:25]

rabc:

but want myth

[22:01:53]

justinh:

GrahamIRC: so get box sets :) works out cheaper than a year of Sky

[22:02:06]

GrahamIRC:

but Myth is a good way to figure out what you do watch and which channels you could remove from your subscription

[22:02:22]

GrahamIRC:

I don't think my duaghter would

[22:02:25]

GrahamIRC:

forgive me

[22:02:45]

justinh:

I'm looking fwd to that conversation with my son

[22:02:59]

rabc:

so mythtv has a SKY EPG?

[22:03:06]

justinh:

"but muhhh, why can't we get sky? everybody else has sky"...

[22:03:25]

GrahamIRC:

a lot of the stuff I watch is on free to air channels, but definitely not all

[22:03:28]

justinh:

rabc: radiotimes carries a lot of sky channel data

[22:03:57]

justinh:

all the major channels AFAIK

[22:04:04]

GrahamIRC:

I wish we could get full data tho – I'd be happy to pay for that

[22:04:10]

GrahamIRC:

like they do in the US

[22:04:16]

justinh:

some stupid ones like rangerstv or whatever.. not included

[22:04:50]

GrahamIRC:

yeah the radiotimes feed has got better but still not quite all there

[22:04:54]

** justinh vaguely remembers filling in a SD survey a while back **

[22:05:16]

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[22:05:48]

Satyr:

I've got to take off but I wanted to say thanks to everyone that helped me out and answered questions. I'm sure I'll be back, thanks again.

[22:05:51]

jarle:

GrahamIRC: I seem to have EIT epg for more or less all my channels on dvb-s 28.2

[22:06:10]

GrahamIRC:

Yes I did too JustinH

[22:06:29]

Satyr:

Take care all.

[22:06:41]

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[22:06:46]

GrahamIRC:

Yeah I guess you should be fine with EIT, but Sky is a little trickier

[22:07:06]

GrahamIRC:

ok, here's a fun problem that someone might be able to help me with

[22:07:40]

GrahamIRC:

I've got about 700 odd video files in MythVideo which all had Coverart, Fanart, synopsis data etc...

[22:07:48]

GrahamIRC:

you notice I said "had"

[22:08:17]

GrahamIRC:

I did a scan from a remote frontend to add a couple of new videos and all the metadata vanished!!!

[22:09:06]

GrahamIRC:

well I do daily backups (yay me!) so I have a database dump that has the missing data in it, but I don't know which tables to extract from the dump or how best to pump them back in to the live database

[22:09:19]

GrahamIRC:

any suggestions (or just stunned silence?)

[22:09:50]

justinh:

videometadata, but... things will likely have moved around & stuff

[22:10:03]

GrahamIRC:

moved around?

[22:10:37]

wagnerrp:

if you scanned and lost the content, its because the files are no longer where mythvideo expected them to be

[22:10:42]

wagnerrp:

so it flushed them out of the database

[22:11:17]

GrahamIRC:

ah, I also added storage groups – do you think that might be why?

[22:11:58]

wagnerrp:

yes, that would do it

[22:12:00]

GrahamIRC:

I mean the paths to all the relevant files were defined in the frontend setup but I just added them to the storage groups too

[22:12:04]

GrahamIRC:

same paths

[22:12:14]

wagnerrp:

if you want to migrate to storage groups, youre better off doing it in 0.23

[22:12:21]

GrahamIRC:

lol ta

[22:12:29]

GrahamIRC:

I think the horse has already bolted

[22:13:17]

GrahamIRC:

hmm so how can I use my backup to get me back to where I was without wiping all the data about the programs that have been recorded since then?

[22:13:44]

GrahamIRC:

hello btw, wagnerrp – thanks for your help elsewhere it's been invaluable

[22:13:51]

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[22:16:34]

GrahamIRC:

wagnerrp: do you think I could remove the storage groups and restore the tables that you mentioned on mythtvtalk?

[22:16:48]

wagnerrp:

that would work

[22:16:54]

wagnerrp:

in 0.23, the files get hashed

[22:17:01]

GrahamIRC:

cool

[22:17:07]

wagnerrp:

so if you move them to a different location, or from local to storage groups

[22:17:13]

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[22:17:16]

wagnerrp:

it simply recognizes them, and updates the location

[22:17:20]

GrahamIRC:

it feels like 0.23 is due any time now

[22:18:20]

GrahamIRC:

you know I mentioned that I thought vi might be truncating the long "insert" lines when I trimmed the dump?

[22:18:26]

GrahamIRC:

dunno if this is the case or not

[22:19:09]

GrahamIRC:

but figure I could possibly restore the whole db dump to a different database name and then use mysqldump to pull out just the tables I want and then restore that to the live database – good idea or not?

[22:19:43]

mazda01_:

i borked my ubuntu install by trying to upgrade to lucid already. Since I have a backup of the mythconverg database, will it be easy to use the provided restore script that's provided with .22-fixes and later if I do a clean install of karmic again, then install mythtv?

[22:20:17]

kormoc:

GrahamIRC: if it's the same server, INSERT INTO mythconverg.table SELECT * FROM otherdb.table;

[22:20:17]

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[22:20:52]

GrahamIRC:

ok that's a good idea

[22:21:09]

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[22:21:42]

GrahamIRC:

bit of an SQL dimwit here – used to do dB programming years ago on dBaseII on C/CPM but that really is going back!

[22:22:59]

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[22:23:55]

GrahamIRC:

mazda01_: that sounds reasonable – I did a full db restore the other day to my 0.22 and it was ok

[22:24:18]

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[22:28:25]

mazda01_:

GrahamIRC: i just have to make sure that I use a backup created before I borked my ubuntu install and upgraded some mythtv stuff and not all of it though. I am getting an error in mythweb about mythweb being 56 protocol and backend being 50. i should've known better than to upgrade my mythtv/file server's OS to a beta version

[22:29:39]

GrahamIRC:

I have the luxury of a test system and a live system but still doesn't stop me doing stupid things once in a while!

[22:30:18]

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[22:35:49]

sphery:

mazda01_: another possibility is to just upgrade all of your ubuntu MythTV stuff to 0.23-fixes

[22:35:59]

sphery:

IMHO, 0.23-fixes is in better shape than 0.22-fixes

[22:36:28]

sphery:

mazda01_: that way, your existing database will work fine

[22:36:48]

sphery:

I think it's at http://www.mythbuntu.org/auto-builds

[22:37:16]

mazda01_:

sphery: actually i just did that, yesterday the mythtv-backend wasn't upgrading but now it did. Now I have a darn issue with nvidia-glx-96 package not compiling or whatever and I need to run mythtv-setup. Guess I have use ssh -X and run mythtv-setup from my other ubuntu machine

[22:38:35]

sphery:

mazda01_: cool, so you're now on 0.23-fixes everywhere?

[22:39:14]

mazda01_:

sphery: i believe so. i just used aptitude show mythtv-backend and mythweb and they both said .23-fixes. trying to get into my x server to run mythtv-setup now

[22:39:21]

sphery:

I've heard that sometimes the *buntu upgrade doesn't restart things properly, and you have to basically force a restart (most people just ended up lost until they finally rebooted the system, so I'd recommend just rebooting after upgrade :)

[22:39:26]

mazda01_:

sphery: i have to do that to uypgrade the database schema correct?

[22:39:41]

sphery:

mythbackend will upgrade the schema for you

[22:39:53]

sphery:

but it's never a bad idea to use mythtv-setup to verify all goes well

[22:40:10]

rabc:

has anyone any experience of the haupage PVR cards 150 250 350 500 or PVR usb

[22:40:11]

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[22:40:18]

rabc:

and mythtv

[22:40:21]

sphery:

and to prevent the system from doing the infinite respawns (and deleting of backups) that happens if there's a problem during the upgrade

[22:40:34]

kormoc:

rabc: plenty of people have

[22:40:36]

sphery:

rabc: lots of us have used or use the PVR-x50's

[22:40:48]

sphery:

they're the way to go for analog SDTV capture

[22:41:06]

mazda01_:

sphery: so you're saying that I shouldn't have to run mythtv-setup. i should just be able to run the mythtv-backend and all database schema will be ok?

[22:41:22]

sphery:

mazda01_: if the upgrade succeeds, then yes

[22:42:01]

rabc:

thanks for that are they all equally supported for mythtv linux drivers

[22:42:05]

sphery:

if not, it your system will start mythbackend, then mythbackend fails the upgrade and exits, then upstart sees that mythbackend isn't running so it starts mythbackend, which fails the upgrade and exits, then upstart sees...

[22:42:10]

sphery:

mazda01_: ^^^

[22:42:54]

sphery:

rabc: as far as the non-USB ones, yeah. I don't know the USB ones. One thing, though, the MPEG decoder on the PVR-350 isn't supported at all, but it's useless, anyway (you're better off not using it)

[22:43:03]

sphery:

so save your money and get something other than a PVR-350 :)

[22:43:30]

rabc:

ok thanks so a 250 or 500

[22:43:33]

rabc:

PVR

[22:43:42]

rabc:

thanks sphery

[22:44:11]

kormoc:

rabc: if you're going from a satellite, you shouldn't bother with the 500 unless you have more then one receiver box

[22:44:16]

sphery:

rabc: the PVR-150 is basically a lower-power version of the 250. It's newer/replaced the 250.

[22:44:20]

kormoc:

rabc: and the 150 is better then the 250

[22:44:31]

rabc:

thanks

[22:44:33]

sphery:

the 500 is basically 2 150's on a single card

[22:44:48]

rabc:

so the 150 is better than the 250?

[22:44:51]

sphery:

rabc: you can find out which ones are supported (if you want to try USB) at http://linuxtv.org/wiki

[22:45:03]

rabc:

thanks

[22:45:14]

mazda01_:

sphery: i thought mythbuntu enabled the pvr-350 output from the mpeg-decoder. are you saying that that has gone away

[22:45:37]

iamlindoro:

The code in myth which directly addresses the PVR-350 is totally gone

[22:45:39]

iamlindoro:

so yes

[22:45:46]

rabc:

if you download mythtv are the drivers installed default for the x50 haupage

[22:45:56]

iamlindoro:

If you want to use video out from the 350 (god help you) then you need to use the Xorg driver

[22:46:07]

kormoc:

rabc: myth doesn't do the drivers, they are done by linuxtv.org

[22:46:08]

iamlindoro:

rabc, Myth isn't a distro, so there are no drivers period

[22:46:15]

mazda01_:

rabc: ivtv is built into the linix kernel

[22:46:16]

rabc:

ok thanks

[22:46:47]

sphery:

mazda01_: I said the MPEG decoder isn't supported. The TV out can be used as a piece of junk video card that only does 720x480 and plain old Xv display of software-decoded video and absolutely no OpenGL support

[22:46:54]

sphery:

or you can just get a real video card :)

[22:47:07]

iamlindoro:

Sounds great, I'll take the hard, stupid option!

[22:47:08]

sphery:

(granted, that would be 720x576 in P

[22:47:11]

sphery:

AL-land)

[22:47:23]

rabc:

sphery: wha u mean a real video card

[22:47:28]

rabc:

example?

[22:47:35]

sphery:

rabc: video card for output, not capture card for input

[22:47:43]

sphery:

the PVR-x50's are real (and good) capture cards

[22:48:11]

sphery:

the PVR-350 has a very primitive/useless video card--like something to use instead of an nvidia GT220 or whatever

[22:48:15]

sphery:

but you don't want to use it

[22:48:16]

rabc:

ah yea do any of the nvidia cards do capture or are x50 the best

[22:48:19]

sphery:

use a real nvidia card

[22:48:37]

sphery:

keep the capture cards and video cards separate

[22:48:52]

sphery:

jack of all trades, master of none is a bad choice with a mythtv box :)

[22:49:00]

iamlindoro:

racist

[22:49:17]

sphery:

so use a Hauppauge PVR-x50 for capture and an nvidia <whatever> for display

[22:49:22]

rabc:

ok so i could use a nvidia and a WinTV-PVR-USB2 for capture

[22:49:39]

rabc:

or 2 PCI capture careds

[22:49:45]

sphery:

assuming there's v4l support for the PVR-USB2

[22:49:49]

sphery:

but yeah

[22:49:51]

rabc:

1 PCI capture and 1 nvidia

[22:49:52]

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[22:50:05]

sphery:

nvidia for video out/display and Hauppauge for capture

[22:50:10]

rabc:

thats great advice thanks

[22:50:14]

mazda01_:

sphery: thank gosh! all is well again after ubuntu lucid mythtv package releases. i see all my recordings and all my 3 tuners are back up and running. Now to go watch lost from hulu and some other shows I missed.

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[22:50:46]

rabc:

suppose an nvidia with HDMI out would be handy

[22:50:56]

sphery:

mazda01_: yeah, can't miss that LOST--it's important

[22:51:06]

mazda01_:

sphery: heck yeah!

[22:51:13]

mazda01_:

sphery: i mean heck no

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[23:04:59]

GrahamIRC:

wagnerrp: Thank you SO much! I now have all my video metadata back again!!!!

[23:07:09]

GrahamIRC:

Deep joy!

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[23:31:51]

wagnerrp:

sphery: people just dont seem to realize youre a dev

[23:36:25]

GrahamIRC:

does anyone have any suggetions for h.264 encoding?

[23:36:39]

GrahamIRC:

I've been using handbrake which is pretty good if slow

[23:36:53]

GrahamIRC:

and it often burps with large HD files

[23:37:31]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: -users?

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[23:38:00]

GrahamIRC:

might be nice to find something that uses cuda

[23:38:08]

wagnerrp:

yeah.... 'Youre beyond super user Mike'

[23:38:25]

wagnerrp:

'course he is, he had a hand in developing half of what hes talking about

[23:38:41]

sphery:

wagnerrp: if you meant Mark, he did say I was a dev later in the message

[23:38:52]

wagnerrp:

yeah, i see that now

[23:38:59]

wagnerrp:

'i guess youre a developer or something'

[23:39:01]

sphery:

though he may have meant in general... don't konw

[23:39:02]

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[23:39:30]

kormoc:

or something? nice

[23:39:39]

sphery:

I do want to make it so a DB upgrade can only happen from the master backend host...

[23:39:49]

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[23:39:56]

sphery:

I'd love to make it so only mythtv-setup could do it (but I won't be able to sell that one)

[23:40:22]

sphery:

iamlindoro: mentioned that it would be good to only allow a DB upgrade if we didn't use UPnP auto-connect

[23:40:29]

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[23:40:54]

sphery:

or, basically, short circuit the problem and just give DB schema version in the UPnP response and don't auto-connect if it's not the right version

[23:41:12]

sphery:

(which was what he said, but my "summary" didn't explain it well)

[23:41:58]

sphery:

hmmm... if I do that, I might be able to convince danielk to allow me to close his ticket

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