| Monday, January 11th, 2010, 00:00 UTC | ||
| [00:00:20] | jst (jst!n=jst@174.12.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [00:01:12] | jst: | Is there any way to remove all the preferences I've set with "custom identifiers?" I don't mind editing the database. I have so many different hosts, names, settings, etc., and it's confusing me. I'd like to be able to just wipe them all out and start fresh. |
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| [00:10:52] | mzb: | I'm attempting to add a "total fire ban" icon to mythlcdserver (in my slightly modified bigclock) |
| [00:11:22] | mzb: | I've got a script that scrapes the appropriate site and sets an snmp variable (on a separate host) |
| [00:11:40] | mzb: | on the MBE I've got a script that runs hourly to update the value |
| [00:11:59] | mzb: | atm I'm simply putting "YES" or "NO" in a tmpfile |
| [00:12:27] | mzb: | would it be easier to set the var in mythconverg somewhere? |
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| [00:13:04] | [R]: | easier? |
| [00:13:16] | [R]: | you either put it in a file, or you run an sql transcation to put it in the db |
| [00:13:30] | [R]: | you either check a file, or you run an sql query to read the db |
| [00:13:36] | mzb: | I'd prefer just to check for the contents (or existence) of the tmpfile (/tmp/fireban) but it looks (possibly) nasty to check from within lcdprocclient.cpp |
| [00:13:52] | mzb: | yes, that's the theory |
| [00:14:20] | mzb: | so if I go for the tmpfile method, do I just do a system call (of some sort) or is there a cleaner method? |
| [00:14:42] | [R]: | well you could um... |
| [00:15:17] | mzb: | even just the existence of the tmpfile would be fine |
| [00:15:48] | [R]: | http://linux.die.net/man/2/access |
| [00:15:52] | [R]: | or you could try stat(2) |
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| [00:16:55] | mzb: | k, thanks ... I'll see how far I get ;) |
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| [00:29:11] | syamajala: | where can i read about setting up recording profiles? |
| [00:29:15] | Joshy__: | 3 errors in 1 hour |
| [00:30:42] | [R]: | syamajala: just go into the frontend and make one |
| [00:31:15] | syamajala: | well i don't know what exactly i want |
| [00:31:34] | [R]: | well if you dont know what you want... |
| [00:31:44] | syamajala: | i mean in terms of the profile |
| [00:32:12] | syamajala: | rtjpeg or mpeg, and the resolution, and all that other stuff |
| [00:32:28] | [R]: | if you dont need anythign, then why bother |
| [00:33:28] | syamajala: | i want to record and be able to save to dvd |
| [00:33:50] | syamajala: | i have 2 v4l cards, 1 pvr-150, and 1 firewire connection |
| [00:34:06] | syamajala: | firewire gets hd |
| [00:34:38] | [R]: | well both are gonna be mpeg2 already |
| [00:35:08] | [R]: | pretty sure you're just going to record exactly what the card puts out/whats coming off of the firewire |
| [00:46:30] | Joshy__: | http://www.silicondust.com/press |
| [00:46:35] | Joshy__: | HDhomerun with cableCARD |
| [00:48:46] | [R]: | oh wow... i think you're the first person to find that |
| [00:48:47] | [R]: | sweet |
| [00:49:02] | AndyCap: | somehow I suspect that's not going to be useful for mythtv. |
| [00:49:16] | Joshy__: | It's still progress. |
| [00:49:20] | mzb: | getting the compiler to like my filename string is getting me confused |
| [00:51:32] | mzb: | dm, going nuts in the heat ;) |
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| [00:54:15] | Joshy__: | How can RX packets have overruns? Like the box can't keep up with incoming traffic? |
| [00:54:25] | sid3windr: | lol |
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| [00:54:35] | sid3windr: | @ r's sarcasm =) |
| [00:55:03] | Joshy__: | sid3windr, I'm used to the sarcasm in this channel. |
| [00:55:10] | sid3windr: | eheh |
| [00:55:29] | sid3windr: | as far as I understood, this is a worse solution than a regular stb with firewire |
| [00:55:44] | [R]: | this? |
| [00:55:58] | sid3windr: | that hdhr with cablecard |
| [00:56:05] | Joshy__: | [R], referring to the hdhomerun |
| [00:56:06] | [R]: | if it were fully supported in linux |
| [00:56:14] | cesman: | myself and others stopped by the SIlicon Dust booth at CES |
| [00:56:17] | [R]: | it would work exactly like the hdhr, except it would pick up all the channels |
| [00:56:18] | cesman: | it doesn't work w/ Linux |
| [00:56:23] | sid3windr: | yeah |
| [00:56:23] | cesman: | WIndows 7 only |
| [00:56:25] | sid3windr: | except that will never happen |
| [00:56:30] | [R]: | of course it'll never happen |
| [00:56:33] | sid3windr: | :) |
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| [02:04:06] | Joshy__: | EFFING FRONTEND GRR! |
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| [02:10:59] | Joshy__: | There's good news at least |
| [02:11:21] | Joshy__: | when I started watching a recording from the hdhomerun, ifconfig's errors jumped from 3 to 21 |
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| [02:17:34] | ckeil: | Hey, I'm having a problem with my frontend freezing during the playback of some shows. I've got a 20 megabyte logfile from my latest run that ended in a freeze, but I can't figure out where the problem is. It generated 20 megs of errors in 5 minutes. |
| [02:18:20] | Joshy__: | pastebin. |
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| [02:37:33] | Nick1: | /nick ckeil |
| [02:37:40] | Nick1: | test |
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| [02:43:16] | ckeil: | test |
| [02:43:28] | iamlindoro: | yes, for the love of god, we hear you |
| [02:43:41] | iamlindoro: | you can create a channel to yourself if you want to do silly stuff like that |
| [02:44:35] | ckeil: | who me? This is the first time ever in my life that i've IRC'd, I have no effing idea what I'm doing. I'm sorry. I'm pretty desperate for some mythtv help, which is why I've delved in here. |
| [02:45:01] | iamlindoro: | yes, you. randomly testing your client in a large channel is a good way to incur scorn |
| [02:45:11] | ckeil: | clearly. |
| [02:47:08] | Dagmar: | In case it wasn't clear earlier, go to www.pastebin.ca and paste in part of those log messages |
| [02:47:25] | Dagmar: | Then tell us the URL |
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| [02:55:31] | Dagmar: | Okay, so apparently not actually that desparate for help with mythtv then |
| [02:57:35] | mag0o: | or he thought the x was the 'help' button |
| [02:59:07] | Dagmar: | I find it questionable that someone _new_ to IRC would be using Vortec |
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| [03:42:18] | Joshy__: | Dagmar, So I'm only getting the packet errors when sending / recieving data to the HDhomerun – Does that strike any bells with you? |
| [03:43:11] | wagnerrp: | well why else would you be using the network heavily, if not to access your network tuner? |
| [03:44:50] | Dagmar: | Joshy__: I am pretty sure I made it abundantly clear earlier. You have a hardware problem if you have more than a VERY small handful of those |
| [03:45:11] | Joshy__: | wagnerrp, that was regarding a previous conversation – Dagmar pretty much said that the packet errors are only logged if there is a problem from the box to the switch. I'm just curious why *all* data is not being affected, only to the hdhomerun? (I have the hdhomerun plus two remote frontends) |
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| [03:45:36] | Dagmar: | I said nothing about any logging. |
| [03:45:44] | wagnerrp: | cant answer about that one, unless you have a bad port on the switch, or your HDHR itself is going bad |
| [03:47:16] | Dagmar: | If your network cables have been chewed on by housepets or loved ones, they're probably bad. |
| [03:47:31] | [R]: | loved ones |
| [03:47:32] | [R]: | haha |
| [03:47:33] | Joshy__: | That's what I'm trying to diagnose. If I'm only getting errors when sending/recieving data to the hdhomerun, it seems to me that the problem is on the hdhomerun end, not the backend. |
| [03:47:36] | Dagmar: | If your home doesn't have decently grounded in-wall wiring, _that_ can screw you up |
| [03:47:44] | wagnerrp: | trimmed, as a weed |
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| [03:47:59] | Dagmar: | So replace the freaking cable on that leg, or go find a crossover cable and connect it directly to something else |
| [03:48:01] | Joshy__: | Dagmar, My cables are well protected, and virtually brand new. they are tucked away in a closet. |
| [03:48:10] | Dagmar: | Who made them? |
| [03:48:33] | Joshy__: | The ones plugged in now? hdhomerun and belkin did. |
| [03:48:36] | Dagmar: | ...and are they actually category 5 rateed |
| [03:48:47] | Joshy__: | cat5e |
| [03:48:48] | Dagmar: | So find another switch |
| [03:48:57] | Dagmar: | I will say this ONE last time. |
| [03:49:16] | Dagmar: | Tx/Rx errors are indicative of a _hardware problem_ |
| [03:49:52] | Joshy__: | Dagmar, I'm not trying to suggest anything of the contrary. |
| [03:50:11] | Dagmar: | You can dance around it all you like, but they're NOT normal |
| [03:50:24] | Joshy__: | I never argued with you about that, either. |
| [03:50:43] | Dagmar: | I can sit here and spam my desktop machine at home from two other machines on the network through my cheap ass switch and not register a single error |
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| [03:51:44] | Joshy__: | as soon as Chuck is over I'll swap the switch. The next guess from there is either backend's NIC or the hdhomerun itself. |
| [03:51:46] | Dagmar: | If the HDHomeRun is communicating over UDP like I suspect it is, UDP packets are not resent if they're lost, and I've no idea why you'd think I would ever suggest they'd be logged |
| [03:52:52] | Joshy__: | Dagmar, good point. the HDhomerun does stream over UDP. |
| [03:53:27] | Dagmar: | I'd also check the _outlets_ |
| [03:53:39] | Dagmar: | Ground loops are just delicious when they span network segments. |
| [03:54:07] | Dagmar: | There's nothing like a little forward voltage to screw things up |
| [03:54:09] | Joshy__: | the backend, the switch, and the hdhomerun are all plugged into the same circuit. |
| [03:54:29] | Joshy__: | They're all in a closet :p |
| [03:54:32] | Dagmar: | But your frontend is apparently not |
| [03:54:54] | Joshy__: | HMM. |
| [03:55:01] | Joshy__: | Correct. |
| [03:55:12] | Dagmar: | ...and I've got news for you. They can all be in the same closet and all be getting equally hosed by a lack of a ground. |
| [03:55:23] | Dagmar: | Just because the outlet has a third hole doesn't mean it's connected to anything |
| [03:56:20] | Joshy__: | This is an old house. The only outlets that have ground are the ones i've personally ran grounds for. I dont' think I ran a ground for the frontend. |
| [03:56:42] | Dagmar: | If this closet is directly over a fluorescent light fixture of the "long bulbs of Odin" kind, that's another thing ethernet doesn't like. |
| [03:57:21] | Dagmar: | If you have one of those fancy special-effects decorations in the closet so that it can look more "futury", please take a bucket of saltwater, and give it all a nice good bath. |
| [03:57:40] | Joshy__: | Huh? |
| [03:58:00] | Dagmar: | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nR24XqGSGE |
| [03:58:05] | Dagmar: | Those things. |
| [03:58:14] | Dagmar: | ...and the flat kind. |
| [03:58:24] | Dagmar: | They will F**K your network connectivity at a range of several feet. |
| [03:58:47] | Dagmar: | I have seen people try putting them into racks before. |
| [03:58:59] | Dagmar: | ...only to have to take them back out in a hurry. |
| [03:59:48] | Joshy__: | Oh, those. No, none in my house.. |
| [04:00:03] | Dagmar: | I have one shaped like a skull tat I use when I actually want to simulate network failures |
| [04:00:18] | Dagmar: | It sits between the firewall and the cablemodem. |
| [04:00:28] | jst: | Is there any way to remove all the preferences I've set with "custom identifiers?" I don't mind editing the database. I have so many different hosts, names, settings, etc., and it's confusing me. I'd like to be able to just wipe them all out and start fresh. |
| [04:00:28] | Dagmar: | Generally, the cablemodem just starts chain rebooting. |
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| [04:01:56] | iamlindoro: | jams, we've gotta get your settings plugin MythUI'd, the lists are filling up with people and their bloody settings bash scripts |
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| [04:06:56] | Joshy__: | Okey dokey, switch replaced. |
| [04:08:37] | Joshy__: | Short of any power craziness – the only thing left is the NIC in the backend. Which only got installed after the onboard gigabit went wonky. |
| [04:08:58] | mrec: | oh dear could it be that the DVB-C code is totally broken? |
| [04:09:21] | Joshy__: | Still have errors. NIC is next. |
| [04:10:12] | Joshy__: | and hdhomerun warranty is expired, grrr. |
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| [04:16:29] | mag0o: | swapped the cable on the backend that may have caused the onboard nic to go wonky? |
| [04:16:54] | Joshy__: | Yeah, that was gone long ago. |
| [04:17:23] | mag0o: | used a diff port for the backend in the switch/router? |
| [04:20:02] | Joshy__: | I've changed switches. |
| [04:20:30] | Joshy__: | I have an idea. |
| [04:20:42] | Joshy__: | I'm gonna continue recording, but kill the playback on the frontend. |
| [04:21:08] | Joshy__: | HRMMMMMMMM |
| [04:21:15] | Joshy__: | errors seem to have went away. |
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| [04:23:32] | Dagmar: | what NIC chipset is in the frontend? |
| [04:23:45] | Joshy__: | UM. Just a second... |
| [04:24:12] | Joshy__: | 02:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168B PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet controller (rev 02) |
| [04:24:32] | Joshy__: | Not connected at gigabit. |
| [04:24:56] | Joshy__: | watching a HD video on the same frontend. |
| [04:25:14] | Joshy__: | Seeing if I get errors again. |
| [04:25:18] | iamlindoro: | Joshy__, That particular driver has been *extremely* buggy for me in the past |
| [04:25:26] | Dagmar: | It wouldn't be the first time there was a dodgy realtek chipset |
| [04:25:31] | Joshy__: | Heh. |
| [04:25:42] | iamlindoro: | Joshy__, Haven't seen packet loss, but complete dropouts for long moments at a time were not unusual |
| [04:25:43] | Dagmar: | Just grab any other NIC in your house and try that--disabling the onboard NIC of course |
| [04:27:08] | Joshy__: | Only NIC i have handy is a Kingston. Worth a shot at least |
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| [04:51:12] | orly_owl: | Can IRblaster be used to control a TV? |
| [04:51:16] | orly_owl: | through mythtv |
| [04:51:22] | orly_owl: | turn it on and off etc |
| [04:51:37] | wagnerrp: | kinda |
| [04:51:57] | orly_owl: | kinda? |
| [04:51:59] | wagnerrp: | your better option would be to issue irblaster calls through scripts called by irexec |
| [04:52:10] | orly_owl: | oh ok |
| [04:52:16] | wagnerrp: | your best option would be to just get a programmable remote that could control the tv directly |
| [04:52:41] | orly_owl: | but i could use irexec from mythtv frontend right? |
| [04:52:58] | wagnerrp: | irexec is a independent program that interfaces with lircd |
| [04:53:03] | wagnerrp: | has nothing to do with mythfrontend |
| [04:53:26] | orly_owl: | oh |
| [04:53:30] | orly_owl: | bummer |
| [04:53:39] | wagnerrp: | why bummer? |
| [04:54:12] | orly_owl: | you're saying mythtv wont talk to irexec |
| [04:54:27] | wagnerrp: | you have a remote and a receiver, correct? |
| [04:54:38] | wagnerrp: | and youre using that to control mythtv using lirc? |
| [04:54:43] | orly_owl: | yes |
| [04:55:02] | wagnerrp: | im telling you that irexec is a completely independent program, that interfaces with lirc |
| [04:55:26] | orly_owl: | oh |
| [04:55:38] | wagnerrp: | you can run multiple lirc-aware applications simultaneously, that is the purpose of lircd |
| [04:55:38] | orly_owl: | so mythtv calls lirc which calls irexec |
| [04:55:45] | wagnerrp: | NO! |
| [04:55:52] | wagnerrp: | you press the button on the remote |
| [04:55:55] | orly_owl: | ok |
| [04:56:04] | wagnerrp: | lirc receives that button press, and broadcasts it to any listening apps |
| [04:56:16] | wagnerrp: | mythtv is listening, but is not programmed to do anything for power, so does nothing |
| [04:56:22] | orly_owl: | ah |
| [04:56:36] | wagnerrp: | irexec is listening, and is programmed to send the proper irblaster command to the tv, and thus turns the tv off |
| [04:56:54] | orly_owl: | oh got it |
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| [04:58:36] | orly_owl: | alright that sounds good |
| [04:58:53] | EdWyse_Home: | With my 1080i projector, Radeon HD 3200 and catalyst 9.12 driver, sometimes screens are displaying 2 times, one over the other when using CPU+ and CPU++. Seems to work okay in Normal. Is there a way to fix this in CPU++? |
| [04:59:33] | wagnerrp: | first, you should almost certainly be using Slim |
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| [04:59:45] | wagnerrp: | second, that is a know issue with ATI and their buggy drivers |
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| [04:59:59] | wagnerrp: | E_REPLACEWITHNVIDIA |
| [05:00:00] | EdWyse_Home: | Why slim? |
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| [05:00:41] | wagnerrp: | slim is just a base profile that should work in nearly all circumstances, assuming you have sufficient CPU power for decode and deint |
| [05:00:47] | EdWyse_Home: | I had NVIDIA before but was having bigger troubles with their closed source drivers than I was with ATI, so I switched it. |
| [05:01:00] | wagnerrp: | ATI has closed source drivers as well |
| [05:01:12] | EdWyse_Home: | I know, bastards all of them! |
| [05:02:03] | EdWyse_Home: | ok, well Chuck is on... I'll play with slim later. |
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| [05:03:09] | wagnerrp: | thats right, tere was an episode tonight |
| [05:03:29] | iamlindoro: | two, even |
| [05:03:52] | wagnerrp: | well it just showed up as one episode to me, two hours |
| [05:04:14] | wagnerrp: | i really wish the listings had split them up |
| [05:04:17] | wagnerrp: | but oh well |
| [05:04:43] | wagnerrp: | at least its a halfway decent 12GB, instead of the mediocre 5.5GB 2hr Dollhouse eps |
| [05:14:09] | wagnerrp: | aww... seriously... WTF |
| [05:14:23] | wagnerrp: | youre not allowed to use the real actors of the show youre watching in an ad |
| [05:14:39] | wagnerrp: | you might make people like us watch it, thinking they missed part of the show |
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| [05:39:35] | clever: | wagnerrp: isnt that how they did it in the old days, take a break and have the news dude do an ad? |
| [05:40:34] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp, I mark cutlists as I watch, andthat one took me more than a long moment to figure out |
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| [05:44:07] | wagnerrp: | so why can he not remember this stuff beyond half a minute? |
| [05:47:15] | iamlindoro: | Heh, I just like that the background of the "train station" is the street he was on in the opening |
| [05:47:22] | iamlindoro: | new low budget Chuck :) |
| [05:47:58] | wagnerrp: | yeah, the 'regular effects' are pretty cheesy |
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| [06:38:54] | justinh: | chuck's back? wicked :-) |
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| [06:50:29] | wagnerrp: | my god man... go back to bed |
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| [07:32:18] | michaelm: | Has anyone experienced a problem where the guide shows up behind the playing video in live TV? |
| [07:35:20] | jst_home_: | I've seen that in one of my test settings where I run the frontend in a window under vnc |
| [07:36:15] | jst_home_: | but never on a dedicated frontend... |
| [07:36:34] | michaelm: | Hmm, I'm running the frontend on a OS X machine. My backend is on Mythbuntu. |
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| [07:36:54] | michaelm: | just_home:Have you found any solution for it? |
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| [07:37:25] | jst_home_: | michaelm: unfortunately no, it's been low priority to look into as well, given that it's in a test setup here only |
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| [07:38:54] | jst_home_: | michaelm: are you using hardware for video decoding on the mac? |
| [07:38:57] | michaelm: | Is the problem likely a video scaling problem where the video doesn't scale to PIP size? Or is it that the guide isn't coming to the foreground? Does anyone have any ideas? |
| [07:39:13] | michaelm: | I believe so. I have it set to OpenGL. |
| [07:39:19] | jst_home_: | k |
| [07:39:29] | michaelm: | Even when it is set to QT it doesn't work though. |
| [07:39:34] | jst_home_: | I'm software only, the whole way, on the test system, so it's not just that then either |
| [07:39:35] | michaelm: | I'm not sure if QT is in hardware too though. |
| [07:42:16] | michaelm: | Is there an OS X specific mailing list for MythTV? |
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| [07:42:42] | jst_home_: | Not that I know... |
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| [07:45:36] | justinh: | thought the only video renderer you could use on OSX is Quartz |
| [07:45:41] | michaelm: | Pressing s is the proper way to bring up the program guide in Live TV right? |
| [07:45:56] | justinh: | no idea |
| [07:46:11] | justinh: | see the manual's key definitions list :) |
| [07:46:12] | jst_home_: | depends on your key bindings, but 's' is the default AFAIK |
| [07:47:01] | justinh: | wonder what G is used for by default... |
| [07:47:02] | jst_home_: | michaelm: if you hit the up/down arrows, do you see the guide flickering as you hit the buttons? |
| [07:47:12] | michaelm: | Ok thanks. Just wanted to make sure I am invoking it the right way. I didn't change the key bindings. |
| [07:48:00] | jst_home_: | justinh: "Adjust Recorder" it seems (brightness, contrast, etc) |
| [07:48:01] | michaelm: | Yes, Also if I run the video in windowed mode I can actually see the guide. It has guide data and I can change channels from the guide. |
| [07:48:34] | justinh: | jst_home_: heh. sometimes I find mythtv's default keybindings incredulous |
| [07:48:51] | jst_home_: | justinh: yeah, you're not alone there... :) |
| [07:49:32] | michaelm: | One binding that really annoys me is that when playing back recorded video enter is mark bookmark. |
| [07:49:43] | justinh: | ahh G is for .... picture adGustments. meh |
| [07:49:57] | michaelm: | I would think most people would want enter to play/pause |
| [07:50:16] | justinh: | the great thing is you can redefine them all to your heart's content |
| [07:50:29] | justinh: | and if you find a better way, submit patches ;-) |
| [07:50:54] | michaelm: | Yeah, I have been meaning to re-map it on my remote. |
| [07:51:11] | michaelm: | I doubt it would be a good idea to change any of the key bindings though because I'm sure it would mess other people up. |
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| [07:51:20] | michaelm: | The new people like me just need to get used to it. |
| [07:52:56] | justinh: | michaelm: sometimes you have to mix things up to get improvements |
| [07:53:19] | justinh: | nobody wins if you do things wrong forever ;-) |
| [07:53:42] | michaelm: | I do think it would be an improvement to have enter be play/pause. Cause that is what is is in most other HTPC software. |
| [07:53:57] | michaelm: | Not to mention that enter starts the video from the media library. |
| [07:54:07] | michaelm: | You would think it would start/stop video during playback. |
| [07:54:39] | michaelm: | But like justin said I can re-map it if I want to. |
| [07:56:39] | justinh: | Enter is SELECT by default, which is sensible IMHO |
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| [07:59:45] | clever: | space is also select |
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| [09:28:50] | dan4dm: | 7/pa |
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| [10:17:01] | Dibblah: | justinh: Congrats on getting a patch committed :) |
| [10:17:54] | justinh: | cheers :) |
| [10:18:01] | justinh: | hardly the 1st though |
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| [10:20:28] | justinh: | my 1st ever patch was for dbox2 :) |
| [10:23:14] | quicksilver: | anyone suffering worse UK DVB signals this month than normal? |
| [10:23:28] | quicksilver: | my SNR has droppd to 4.6/4.7 sometimes, and that isn't enough for my cards to lock. |
| [10:23:49] | justinh: | noticed things have been a bit glitchy since the move to QAM64 across the board |
| [10:24:06] | justinh: | signal level is brilliant, but maybe it's been the snow on my aerial |
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| [10:25:21] | gbee: | quicksilver: have you checked to see if they are doing maintenance in your region? |
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| [10:28:43] | quicksilver: | gbee: no. |
| [10:29:15] | quicksilver: | nothing listede at http://www.ukfree.tv/txdetail.php?a=TQ339712 |
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| [10:30:22] | quicksilver: | on bad days even having trouble with BBC1, traditionally my most reliable signal. |
| [10:30:24] | justinh: | might be snow in yer aerial or something then |
| [10:30:36] | quicksilver: | The antenna guy said they would be turning crystal palace's power up this year |
| [10:30:42] | quicksilver: | maybe that will put paid to my problems for good. |
| [10:30:52] | justinh: | or maybe not |
| [10:30:59] | justinh: | they're moving to qam64 in 8k mode too |
| [10:31:10] | justinh: | YMMV :) |
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| [10:33:11] | quicksilver: | eventually the WAF will fade and she'll push me to sky or freesat |
| [10:33:24] | gbee: | freesat ftw |
| [10:33:35] | justinh: | for the wife :) |
| [10:33:52] | ** gbee doesn't consider Sky very good value for money ** | |
| [10:33:52] | justinh: | Sky won't give you any higher WAF in the long term |
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| [10:34:13] | justinh: | everybody I know who has it has had a few STBs now |
| [10:34:13] | quicksilver: | she's not thinking long term |
| [10:34:19] | quicksilver: | she's just annoyed by the current situation :) |
| [10:34:25] | quicksilver: | however freesat may be a good route. |
| [10:34:37] | justinh: | tried a freeview box? |
| [10:34:50] | justinh: | see if that pulls stuff in any better |
| [10:35:10] | justinh: | could be cheaper/less hassle than putting a dish up, if you sort the aerial out |
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| [10:40:58] | ** gbee has both DVB-T and DVB-S tuners, best of both ** | |
| [10:41:15] | ** _ben wants to setup a machine like that ** | |
| [10:42:00] | _ben: | what -S card do you have gbee ? |
| [10:42:17] | gbee: | Nova-S |
| [10:42:25] | gbee: | Hauppauge |
| [10:42:25] | _ben: | not S2? |
| [10:42:47] | justinh: | you don't need S2 yet |
| [10:42:55] | gbee: | not yet, Nova-S cost me £5, S2 would have been £60 and they aren't even broadcasting in S2 yet |
| [10:43:20] | justinh: | all hail cheap tuner cards :) |
| [10:43:23] | gbee: | so I'll wait for the price to reach sensible levels before grabbing some S2 cards |
| [10:44:15] | gbee: | heh price of the Nova-S2 has actually gone up to £100 ... wtf? |
| [10:44:33] | justinh: | demand ;-) |
| [10:44:58] | gbee: | that's serious demand |
| [10:45:35] | ** gbee wonders if we've any friends at Hauppauge UK who would cut a deal for UK devs ** | |
| [10:46:12] | ** justinh suspects vendors profiteering ** | |
| [10:47:31] | gbee: | stoth was pretty surprised when I talked about the price of their tuners rocketing up in the UK |
| [10:48:18] | justinh: | I'm appalled but I wouldn't say I'm surprised |
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| [11:00:40] | ivor: | gbee: are you using your -S for freesat or something else? |
| [11:02:44] | justinh: | btw.. last time I ever try to do a job properly. Paint hasn't dried on the damn sledge & the snow is disappearing fast |
| [11:03:19] | ivor: | justinh: ooh was going to ask how you'd got one. so you're still watching paint dry!!! |
| [11:03:23] | ivor: | ffs. |
| [11:03:40] | ivor: | how much paint did you use? |
| [11:03:49] | justinh: | didn't go mad with it |
| [11:03:51] | justinh: | it' |
| [11:04:00] | justinh: | duh. it's not strictly painted yet. |
| [11:04:10] | justinh: | the primer is awful. shouldn't have bought the cheap stuff |
| [11:04:34] | justinh: | well I say cheap. A tenner a small tin. FFS |
| [11:05:14] | quicksilver: | justinh: our freeview box does slightly better than my capture cards, yes |
| [11:05:31] | quicksilver: | justinh: not quite sure why. less interference around maybe |
| [11:05:32] | justinh: | put it in the smallest room in the house with a fan heater & it was still very tacky yesterday |
| [11:06:35] | justinh: | I shoulda done what I was gonna do in the 1st place. Build it, take it out unfinished, dry it out THEN paint it when the snow's gone |
| [11:06:58] | justinh: | but nah, I thought "do a proper job first time for a change". Last ever time |
| [11:07:50] | justinh: | as far as the snow's concerned the overweight lady may not be singing yet though, so it may get its inaugural run yet |
| [11:08:25] | ivor: | we're still covered with it. no sign of it going anytime soon. |
| [11:08:42] | justinh: | quicksilver: generally the tuner hardware in standalone gear is better than the junk they put in PC hardware |
| [11:08:58] | quicksilver: | possibly so |
| [11:09:06] | justinh: | quicksilver: plus, the innards of PCs is no place for sensitive RF devices |
| [11:09:06] | quicksilver: | although the STB cost less, all-in, than one of the tuner cards :) |
| [11:09:14] | quicksilver: | justinh: yes, that latter point was the one I was thinking of |
| [11:09:44] | justinh: | you could prolly improve any pci tv tuner no end by decoupling the PSU lines better |
| [11:10:00] | justinh: | and improving grounding |
| [11:11:36] | gbee: | ivor: freesat |
| [11:11:38] | octavsly: | archive to DVD. Does anybody use it? I noticed that the mythburn.py is not changed for a long time. Furthermore, it does not work as expected. (many different errors at many places). I remember it used to work. |
| [11:11:38] | octavsly: | is there any truly GPL, Linux based HTPC outhere? |
| [11:12:04] | sid3windr: | everyone's mythbox? :P |
| [11:12:08] | justinh: | octavsly: yeah there's this thing they call 'MythTV' |
| [11:12:13] | octavsly: | I know |
| [11:12:20] | octavsly: | I use it, but I mean any comercial solution? |
| [11:12:59] | octavsly: | where I can start from what they provide and then customize it a bit to turn it in my box? |
| [11:13:00] | gbee: | snow here disappeared overnight due to rain |
| [11:13:31] | gbee: | and it's still raining |
| [11:13:59] | octavsly: | gbee: there is some snow here too, but the temp is >0 |
| [11:14:58] | ** justinh has often wondered why anybody would want to archive shows to DVD... ** | |
| [11:15:22] | octavsly: | to give to some old guys not knowing what to do with an USB stick... |
| [11:15:38] | justinh: | oh I bet they could come up with something ;-) |
| [11:15:45] | octavsly: | DVD => plug and play |
| [11:16:03] | justinh: | I've oft tried mytharchive. Seldom succeeded |
| [11:16:34] | justinh: | mythtranscode always seemed to barf on the recordings I tried it with |
| [11:17:07] | octavsly: | I did write a nice DVD one year ago, but not anymore. So if I understand correctly DVD writing is not really used |
| [11:17:11] | justinh: | FWIW though, MythArchive is easier to use than some commercial DVD recorders |
| [11:17:20] | octavsly: | if it works :-) |
| [11:17:48] | ivor: | gbee: do you do anything clever to organise your freesat and freeview channels since they overlap? |
| [11:17:50] | justinh: | the one my inlaws have is indecypherable |
| [11:17:51] | octavsly: | I did try to find the errors but I think the main problem is the input formats... too many |
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| [11:18:50] | ivor: | gbee: I was trying to think if there's a clean/clever way to collapse duplicate channels (and also +1 channels). |
| [11:21:19] | gbee: | clean, not really, clever, not exactly, but if you rename/renumber the channels to match there freeview counterparts it will eliminate the duplicates from the EPG |
| [11:22:03] | justinh: | I'd prolly give identical channels the same callsign/channum – or maybe just callsign & adjust channel priority according to which gets the better signal |
| [11:22:22] | ivor: | really? hmm, didn't notice that. although i mostly use mythweb for scheduling. |
| [11:22:41] | gbee: | one advantage is that should you ever use livetv, BBC One is always http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/1 regardless of which tuner it happens to be using |
| [11:23:19] | justinh: | BBC One has its own ticket? Cool :D |
| [11:23:25] | ivor: | :) |
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| [11:23:40] | gbee: | I only keep one of the regional variations for each channel visible, since they are normally all on the same mux there is no advantage to having them all available |
| [11:23:51] | gbee: | bah, auto-replace |
| [11:23:55] | ivor: | was thinking being able to hide and treat +1 channels as simply another scheduling opportunity would be neat though. |
| [11:24:02] | gbee: | numero one |
| [11:25:16] | gbee: | ivor: maybe, although for those who use livetv it would be inconvenient |
| [11:27:20] | ivor: | gbee: peope use livetv???! tsk. |
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| [11:28:36] | justinh: | ivor: ironically, the more channels people have it seems the more likely it will be that they rely on live tv |
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| [11:29:05] | gbee: | disengage brain, engage remote |
| [11:29:40] | justinh: | hey, maybe that's why all STB UIs are so slow & crap. If it takes half an hour to zap around the whole channel suite everybody will miss something worth watching :D |
| [11:30:05] | justinh: | not to mention *always* displaying channels people aren't even subscribed to |
| [11:30:41] | justinh: | then again, the majority of Freeview & Freesat kit could do with better UIs, if only to hide the junk people don't really want |
| [11:31:31] | ivor: | gbee: doh, didn't realise that it merges them if the channel numbers match... (hangs head in shame) |
| [11:31:42] | justinh: | ivor: channums & callsigns IIRC |
| [11:31:55] | justinh: | or is it channums and/or callsigns? |
| [11:32:10] | gbee: | callsigns for scheduling purposes, channums for EPG |
| [11:32:25] | gbee: | consistency, thy name is not MythTV |
| [11:32:37] | justinh: | heh |
| [11:32:43] | justinh: | not yet anyway ;-) |
| [11:32:56] | ivor: | and callsigns for mythweb... (just checked) |
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| [11:35:11] | justinh: | inconsistency within mythtv is going to be very Dodo-like quite soon I suspect :-) |
| [11:36:04] | justinh: | soon being a very relative, relaxed term |
| [11:36:36] | sid3windr: | and "quite" relaxing it even more? ;) |
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| [12:18:10] | TauPan: | hi... I'm just looking at http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Video_capture_card and wondering if there's a dual dvb-t + analog card you can recommend. |
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| [12:22:14] | octavsly: | TauPan: depebds what are your requirements |
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| [12:26:48] | TauPan: | well, pci-card, good linux support, preferably out of the box on debian testing, it should be able to use dvb-t and analog tuner (european cable) at the same time... hm, that's about it, I guess |
| [12:27:14] | octavsly: | recording form both of them? |
| [12:27:18] | TauPan: | yup |
| [12:27:28] | octavsly: | at the same time? |
| [12:27:33] | TauPan: | or recording on one and watching on the other |
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| [12:27:35] | TauPan: | yup |
| [12:27:41] | octavsly: | that's tricky |
| [12:27:47] | octavsly: | usualy you can only acess one at a time |
| [12:27:48] | ** TauPan is surprised it is. ** | |
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| [12:28:07] | octavsly: | hardware encoding fro the analog? |
| [12:28:12] | octavsly: | or not? |
| [12:28:14] | TauPan: | ah |
| [12:28:19] | TauPan: | I see the problem... |
| [12:29:03] | TauPan: | well, hardware encoding from analog is not a strict requirement... I can live with a little more cpu usage if I can get simultaneous usage of analog and dvb |
| [12:29:08] | octavsly: | this hybrid PCI cards can only access one at a time unless they are more expensive. Furthermore, some have hardware encoding while others do it in software |
| [12:29:31] | octavsly: | I know cards which can use only one at a time |
| [12:29:45] | octavsly: | Hauppage HVR1100 if I remember correctly |
| [12:29:58] | TauPan: | the problem is I have exactly one free pci slot, so I can't use the old pci card (because the video card has a huge cooler which obstructs a pci slot) |
| [12:31:05] | TauPan: | this one? http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Hauppauge_WinTV_HVR-1100_series |
| [12:32:00] | octavsly: | yes |
| [12:33:49] | octavsly: | for these hybrid cards |
| [12:34:17] | TauPan: | looks like the HVR 4000 can use analog cable + dvb simultaneously |
| [12:34:31] | octavsly: | since you cannot access both of them at the same time and since in mythtv you need to put two tuners, you need to create groups to let mythtv that they cannot be accessed at the same time |
| [12:34:47] | octavsly: | could be, I have no knowledge on that |
| [12:35:19] | TauPan: | looks good http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppau . . . _with_MythTV |
| [12:36:40] | justinh: | pretty sure the hvr4000 doesn't let you use more than one part at the same time |
| [12:39:06] | octavsly: | also no CI |
| [12:39:22] | TauPan: | there's separate ci module available, but I don't need that |
| [12:39:57] | TauPan: | dvb-t only, until there's a decent digital cable here... the cable company doesn't offer hd at the moment anyway, so I'm not paying more |
| [12:40:41] | TauPan: | justinh: what makes you so sure? the wiki page seems to contradict you. |
| [12:42:23] | justinh: | ah maybe it's just the fact it can't use DVB-T & DVB-s/S2 at the same time then |
| [12:42:49] | TauPan: | yeah, that's not possible |
| [12:44:24] | TauPan: | I doubt it's a real problem, since the satellite feed would probably contain most channels that the cable feed carries |
| [12:44:56] | justinh: | then again, the wiki page isn't exactly specifically saying you can use any of its devices simultaneously |
| [12:45:35] | TauPan: | what are "multiple frontends"? |
| [12:45:43] | justinh: | just that |
| [12:45:58] | justinh: | it's a *quad* *mode* tuner card |
| [12:46:16] | TauPan: | the link I pasted from linuxtv looks like it's possible, but maybe I misunderstand it |
| [12:46:45] | justinh: | AFAIK only one or 2 of the hauppauge hybrid tuner cards allows simultaneous usage |
| [12:47:15] | justinh: | and IIRC the analogue portion of at least one of those doesn't work in linux yet, or didn't last time I looked |
| [12:47:49] | justinh: | if you're desperate to have analogue AND digital simultaneously available maybe USB could be an option |
| [12:48:13] | justinh: | being restricted to only one PCI slot is rather lame though |
| [12:48:19] | TauPan: | the paragraph says "MythTV v0.22 support multiple frontends and works fine." which I interpret as "I can use multiple frontends with mythtv 0.22 with that card" |
| [12:48:24] | justinh: | you're jinxing yourself there |
| [12:48:50] | justinh: | TauPan: nowhere does it say *at* *the* *same* *time* though |
| [12:49:12] | TauPan: | well, I'm not ready to buy a new mainboard just yet |
| [12:49:36] | justinh: | few people ever are :-) |
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| [12:56:31] | TauPan: | oh, I could use a pci-e card |
| [12:59:23] | TauPan: | hm, or I could drop the "simultaneous" requirement... I will rarely need it, I guess, since mythtv schedules recordings pretty well |
| [13:00:14] | justinh: | on your head be it. I limped along with one tuner for something like a whole week |
| [13:00:34] | justinh: | and that was before multirec came about :) |
| [13:00:48] | justinh: | personally I don't really even watch much TV |
| [13:01:01] | TauPan: | do you know which hauppauge cards might support simultaneous recording/viewing? |
| [13:01:21] | TauPan: | so you built a tv-server for your family? ;) |
| [13:01:49] | justinh: | TauPan: none that currently have working analogue in linux |
| [13:02:17] | justinh: | I build the DVR so that my wife & I were freed from the shackles of TV scheduling |
| [13:02:22] | justinh: | *built |
| [13:02:58] | justinh: | works pretty well. We don't see many ads & my wife wastes way less time by watching all her soaps with time compression :D |
| [13:04:02] | TauPan: | I had a pretty extensive recording schedule half a year ago, then discovered that it actually led to me watching none of it at all, since "I could watch it whenever I wanted", so I ended up deleting it all and uninstalling mythtv. |
| [13:04:27] | TauPan: | now I reinstalled mythtv and find myself going all overboard again ;) |
| [13:04:38] | pat_: | yeah, overboard is good |
| [13:04:40] | justinh: | I have like three season's worth of The Wire & Spooks to watch but I just can't be bothered |
| [13:05:04] | pat_: | I've got 5 dvb-t tuners and can record all the broadcast channels simultaneosly |
| [13:05:22] | justinh: | just deleted the Royal Institution Xmas lectures. Utter pap |
| [13:05:25] | TauPan: | ok, my main requirement is a card that uses less cpu than my 15 year old hauppauge with mono sound ;) |
| [13:05:31] | pat_: | not much get recorded though and I hardly use more than 2 tuners |
| [13:05:40] | justinh: | TauPan: then you need hardware encoding |
| [13:05:46] | TauPan: | yup |
| [13:05:58] | justinh: | very few hybrid/dual tuners have that |
| [13:06:04] | TauPan: | *sigh* |
| [13:06:11] | TauPan: | I was afraid you would say that. |
| [13:08:14] | octavsly: | but there are some |
| [13:08:18] | octavsly: | HVR1300? |
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| [13:08:41] | octavsly: | as far as I remeber it has a hardware encoding |
| [13:08:41] | TauPan: | why do the *lower* numbers have *more* features apparently? |
| [13:09:09] | justinh: | octavsly: hybrid, but single use |
| [13:09:16] | octavsly: | yes |
| [13:09:21] | justinh: | works in linux though, always a bonus :) |
| [13:09:47] | octavsly: | single use= not simultaneous use of the DVB-T / analogue |
| [13:10:10] | TauPan: | yup |
| [13:10:26] | TauPan: | but the hardware encoder for analog-tv is more important, actually |
| [13:11:03] | octavsly: | remember my questions at the beginning? first try to look at requirements then start searching. It is really important |
| [13:11:22] | TauPan: | sure, but who is *clear* about his requirements in the beginning? |
| [13:11:41] | TauPan: | I just discovered that the hardware decoder is actually more important than simultaneous viewing for me. |
| [13:11:51] | octavsly: | correct, but it takes very little exercise to do it. |
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| [13:14:22] | TauPan: | I was clear about my requirements, just not about their priorities, the need to prioritize only arose after you guys informed me that I could not have everything on my list. ;) |
| [13:14:39] | octavsly: | :-) |
| [13:15:39] | TauPan: | good linux support is actually the hardest requirement, I don't want to have to patch my kernel |
| [13:15:55] | justinh: | you don't always have to do that |
| [13:16:06] | justinh: | most times you can likely just build modules yourself |
| [13:16:20] | octavsly: | most of the old (or not too new) cards have that... |
| [13:17:13] | justinh: | ahh the old myth that HDTV themes *should* display more info with teeny tiny fonts & still be usable. Meh |
| [13:18:05] | TauPan: | oops |
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| [13:18:33] | TauPan: | linuxtv wiki says the two frontends on the hvr 4000 can explicitly *not* be used simultaneously |
| [13:18:46] | TauPan: | ( http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppau . . . l-dvb_driver ) |
| [13:19:19] | TauPan: | so I could get the 1300 which has a hardware encoder and fulfill the most important requirements |
| [13:19:32] | TauPan: | (and maybe get a pci-e card later) |
| [13:19:38] | TauPan: | (or a new mainboard) |
| [13:20:05] | justinh: | or just build a proper backend :-) |
| [13:20:40] | justinh: | mythtv has a networked architecture for a reason y'know |
| [13:21:39] | TauPan: | yeah ;) |
| [13:21:55] | TauPan: | I'm currently using my networked laptop as a portable tv-set, which is neat ;) |
| [13:25:57] | gbee: | justinh: the post about font size completely misses the point that those things are themable and entirely in the hands of the themer |
| [13:26:24] | gbee: | making a request to the developers that mythmusic use a smaller font is just odd |
| [13:27:40] | TauPan: | it looks like the the 1300 (pci) seems to be the best option at the moment, since 1700 (pci) is not fully supported yet, and the rest is just overkill and doesn't fullfill any more important requirements... I can wait with that until my home-server plans have progressed. |
| [13:28:02] | justinh: | but but.. but.. with 2 pixel high fonts you could display millions of tracks onscreen. Who cares that grandad justinh won't be able to read it without his binoculars :D |
| [13:28:03] | antgel: | gbee: yep, i was going to get another dvb-s2 card, but at that price i'll give it a miss for now |
| [13:28:39] | TauPan: | antgel: did you mean to highlight me? |
| [13:30:05] | antgel: | TauPan: eh? |
| [13:30:23] | antgel: | ah, no. i was replying to gbee's comment ^^^ about the price of the dvb-s2 cards |
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| [13:31:02] | TauPan: | ah, must have been before I joined. |
| [13:32:09] | TauPan: | ok, then thanks for the extensive support... I'll tell the shop he needs to send you guys your usual fee. ;) |
| [13:33:08] | ** justinh considers changing his nick to HauppaugeShill again ** | |
| [13:33:40] | TauPan: | hmm, no donate link on the mythtv page? |
| [13:34:17] | justinh: | where would the money go, when all contributors & coders are anonymous, masked strangers? |
| [13:34:23] | justinh: | or is it stranglers? hmmm |
| [13:35:47] | TauPan: | well, the ffado project has an interesting concept, they use donations for buying hardware that is not yet supported |
| [13:36:12] | TauPan: | but that's probably more interesting if you're a driver developer |
| [13:37:03] | TauPan: | anyway, kthxbai ^_^ |
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| [13:41:07] | ivor: | justinh: where would the money go?? parties drugs and hookers? |
| [13:41:40] | ivor: | simples. |
| [13:42:08] | GreyFoxx: | other than the drugs part it sounds pretty good ;) |
| [13:42:59] | ivor: | i think they're optional. |
| [13:45:26] | octavsly: | what about building a comercial HTPC based on mythtv? |
| [13:45:44] | octavsly: | some box in china tuned for mythtv? |
| [13:45:53] | octavsly: | I mean with the donations |
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| [13:46:24] | octavsly: | then people can buy the stuff and customize it further... I have seen many wanted this |
| [13:46:39] | octavsly: | only after that the dope part :- |
| [13:46:42] | octavsly: | :D |
| [13:46:47] | justinh: | myth still has some way to go before it's even half ready for that |
| [13:46:53] | justinh: | I dunno if you've noticed |
| [13:46:57] | octavsly: | simplify |
| [13:47:04] | octavsly: | I did :-( |
| [13:47:06] | justinh: | myth isn't ready yet |
| [13:47:30] | octavsly: | Why do you think commercial products are more mature? |
| [13:47:35] | justinh: | if you end up making it just another dumb DVR, what is there to differentiate it from all the hardware junk? |
| [13:47:50] | octavsly: | myth is too complex for the average user anyway |
| [13:48:09] | justinh: | octavsly: I don't, but putting the developers in-line for litigation wouldn't be my idea of fun |
| [13:48:09] | octavsly: | most of them cannot grasp what is all about |
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| [13:48:20] | octavsly: | :D |
| [13:48:47] | octavsly: | what exactly do you mean litigation? |
| [13:48:51] | octavsly: | by |
| [13:49:28] | justinh: | I mean people suing the company when $box doesn't do what it says on the tin cuz they is too damn stupid to use it |
| [13:49:43] | octavsly: | then you have to seel it in Europe |
| [13:49:46] | octavsly: | sell |
| [13:50:03] | octavsly: | first |
| [13:50:09] | justinh: | I also mean people who hold patents for certain things like mpeg decoding coming after the project... |
| [13:50:21] | justinh: | headaches nobody needs |
| [13:50:29] | justinh: | things are different in the real world |
| [13:50:34] | octavsly: | what about the dreambox guys? |
| [13:50:44] | justinh: | what about them? |
| [13:50:54] | justinh: | they use hardware for decoding & junk |
| [13:50:54] | octavsly: | they have a linux based machine |
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| [13:51:52] | octavsly: | you mean the MPEG is handeled in hardware untill it reaches the TV? |
| [13:52:15] | justinh: | yup |
| [13:52:36] | justinh: | all those boxes do is dump mpeg to disk & decode it with dedicated hardware |
| [13:52:57] | octavsly: | PVR 350 does that isn't it? |
| [13:53:19] | justinh: | used to. No longer supported :D |
| [13:53:28] | octavsly: | OK :-) |
| [13:54:06] | justinh: | look, I've spoken with enough brain-dead entrepeneurs who see dollar signs when they first encounter mythtv to know how risky it'd be to go into business with it |
| [13:54:19] | ivor: | and technically they should be paying for an mpeg license. maybe they are. |
| [13:54:43] | justinh: | ivor: really, even if they're only using chips from $vendor ? |
| [13:54:47] | ivor: | yup |
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| [13:55:07] | justinh: | they're prolly paying to use the DVB logo too then :) |
| [13:55:44] | octavsly: | so, what stops the (bad) guys to run after you now? |
| [13:55:55] | octavsly: | scale? |
| [13:56:20] | justinh: | in theory, nothing |
| [13:56:45] | octavsly: | ... shoot first ask questions later |
| [13:56:50] | ivor: | there's no benefit for them to doing it. |
| [13:56:55] | ivor: | basically. |
| [13:57:13] | justinh: | yet |
| [13:58:15] | octavsly: | if you would have a huge selaes but no profits they will not be happy either, and not run after you, am I right. The basic question is, can mythtv be LEGALLY comercialized? If yes what needs to be met? |
| [13:58:43] | justinh: | licence all the codec usage, placate possible patent suitors |
| [13:59:16] | justinh: | for starters |
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| [13:59:35] | justinh: | negotiate contracts with listings providers |
| [14:00:15] | justinh: | get hardware certified to conform to local regulations where you sell it |
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| [14:00:38] | octavsly: | that's all right, it needs to be like that |
| [14:00:53] | octavsly: | otherwise it's a mess around us |
| [14:01:03] | octavsly: | time-out I nedd to gp |
| [14:01:04] | octavsly: | go |
| [14:01:28] | justinh: | it's all moot anyway. few people have been adventurous enough to sell mythtv boxes ready made |
| [14:01:50] | justinh: | it's not any kind of get rich quick scheme by a *long* stretch |
| [14:02:00] | justinh: | when most people realise that they get the hell out |
| [14:02:04] | octavsly: | it's not about that, it's about superiour technology |
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| [14:02:38] | justinh: | it' |
| [14:02:47] | justinh: | duh it's more about what end users need/want |
| [14:03:20] | justinh: | consumers are stupid :-) |
| [14:03:29] | octavsly: | the main problem is that most of them don't care about their liberty |
| [14:03:39] | justinh: | why should they? |
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| [14:03:50] | octavsly: | they just pay for stuff and then realize many doors are locked |
| [14:04:00] | justinh: | hey ho, que sera |
| [14:04:12] | octavsly: | ? |
| [14:04:29] | justinh: | there are generally more important things people like to concern themselves with |
| [14:05:05] | justinh: | I, for instance, couldn't give a rat's ass if stuff is open or not, so long as it works for me Jack |
| [14:05:27] | octavsly: | I do, beacuse I cannot do anythinganymore with that product if it misbehave |
| [14:05:59] | justinh: | take it to its ultimate extension & everything will end up as a DIY kit job |
| [14:06:00] | octavsly: | and support from big companies is crap....also improving nowadays |
| [14:06:27] | octavsly: | sorry for my ignorance but waht's DIY kit job? |
| [14:06:36] | justinh: | all Joe Schmoe wants to do is sit down in front of the toob & watch some stuff |
| [14:06:44] | octavsly: | Shmoo |
| [14:07:05] | octavsly: | I need to go to a meeting |
| [14:07:11] | octavsly: | later |
| [14:07:23] | justinh: | probably |
| [14:08:21] | quicksilver: | one day a big name DVR builder might decide mythtv is a good basis for their box |
| [14:08:34] | quicksilver: | they'll already *have* license for all the patents anyway |
| [14:08:43] | quicksilver: | but it may never happen |
| [14:08:52] | quicksilver: | you can never predict the kinds of decisions these guys make. |
| [14:09:36] | [Peter]: | it would have a much higher probability of happening if the network protocol stayed backwards compatible between versions |
| [14:10:28] | quicksilver: | wouldn't matter for a combined be/fe though |
| [14:10:34] | justinh: | it never will :-) |
| [14:10:38] | justinh: | in all likelihood# |
| [14:10:41] | quicksilver: | which I would have thought was a much more likely retail proposition. |
| [14:11:11] | quicksilver: | I would guess not, too, but I think it is a subsantial outside chance. |
| [14:15:58] | justinh: | after trying out the beta of boxee on a windows machine the other day I don't fancy their chances much |
| [14:17:18] | quicksilver: | I have a feeling that something wii-based, PS3-based, or base on existing STB estates (Sky or freesat in the UK, e.g.) is much more likely to succeed |
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| [14:17:46] | justinh: | getting manufacturers to agree on a platform is the stumbling block |
| [14:17:53] | quicksilver: | although I was amused to see that although the waf of myth's UI is pretty low, the UI of my parent's DVR is incomprehensibly awful |
| [14:18:05] | quicksilver: | (some generic japanese hifi brand DVR – don't remember which) |
| [14:18:13] | justinh: | you ever seen a DVD?HDD recorder Sony make? Good gawd |
| [14:18:18] | quicksilver: | it's a complete maze of menus and tiny fonts |
| [14:18:35] | quicksilver: | don't Sony ones have a PS3-like interface? XMB and so on? |
| [14:18:38] | justinh: | yep. menus written in Japlish to go with the japlish manual |
| [14:18:44] | justinh: | no not the inlaws' |
| [14:18:53] | justinh: | XMB sucks donkeys anyway |
| [14:18:57] | quicksilver: | ah. OK then the one I'm talkin about could be one of those. |
| [14:19:06] | quicksilver: | XMB's not great but it is a lot easier to understand than this one was. |
| [14:19:12] | justinh: | ooo look it goes whoosh! |
| [14:19:25] | justinh: | now then, which menu item is selected again...? ;-) |
| [14:19:43] | justinh: | oh yeah it's the one in text that's only slightly too small to read... |
| [14:20:00] | justinh: | and marginally brighter than the others |
| [14:20:23] | justinh: | mythtv gets a hell of a lot right, compared to a lot of other stuff |
| [14:20:27] | quicksilver: | it does |
| [14:20:35] | justinh: | ever seen Sky+ ? |
| [14:20:37] | justinh: | jees |
| [14:20:39] | quicksilver: | the worse problems we have are actually with the remote control button assignment |
| [14:20:47] | quicksilver: | which is my fault, because it's not a very appropriate remote |
| [14:21:00] | quicksilver: | I should just by a better one so the button meanings are more obvious. |
| [14:21:13] | jduggan: | justinh: seen skyHD? it got alot better, only more sluggish |
| [14:21:18] | jduggan: | :S |
| [14:21:23] | jduggan: | win/lose |
| [14:21:36] | justinh: | yeah, and the way is totally clear to put help screens in – problem is many themers wouldn't bother, knowing how varied remotes can be |
| [14:21:54] | justinh: | jduggan: better? I've seen the screenshots. it's wide, is all |
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| [14:22:01] | quicksilver: | the generic problem I have with Myth is that when you've got an item "selected" there are three actions you can take |
| [14:22:08] | quicksilver: | "select", "go right" and "menu" |
| [14:22:14] | quicksilver: | (is that true?) |
| [14:22:15] | justinh: | go right? not anymore |
| [14:22:24] | quicksilver: | I'm on 0.22 |
| [14:22:35] | justinh: | you can't go right on an item in 0.22 |
| [14:22:37] | quicksilver: | and it's a bit hard to remember which you need when. |
| [14:22:57] | justinh: | SELECT er.. makes an action happen |
| [14:22:58] | quicksilver: | go can in the "find program" listings |
| [14:23:00] | jduggan: | justinh: osd is much better, it has tv window in the guide, little improvements, oh, when you scroll the osd to a channel or show on a later time you can also now hit 'i' to see show info |
| [14:23:03] | justinh: | MENU brings up a menu |
| [14:23:11] | quicksilver: | but sometimes select brings up a menu |
| [14:23:13] | jduggan: | like virgin |
| [14:23:26] | quicksilver: | well, sometimes select brings up a dialog with choices, at least |
| [14:23:37] | justinh: | quicksilver: a load of work is being done about this. see recent tickets like #6814 |
| [14:23:44] | quicksilver: | I will take a look |
| [14:23:53] | quicksilver: | I know it's not easy |
| [14:24:00] | justinh: | started the ball rolling & others have ran away with it :-) |
| [14:24:20] | justinh: | we'll get there :-) |
| [14:24:44] | justinh: | jduggan: you mean they didn't have a live tv window in the guide before? ROFLMAO |
| [14:24:59] | justinh: | and didn't have INFO? good grief |
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| [14:25:32] | justinh: | I've seen their 'recordings list' stuff. they have like 5 items onscreen at once! |
| [14:25:57] | quicksilver: | justinh: yes, that's the kind of thing. |
| [14:26:13] | ** quicksilver is encouraged at the kind of comments in the comments ** | |
| [14:26:17] | justinh: | no vid previews, fair enough (I hate those anyway) but really elemental stuff you'd take for granted |
| [14:26:44] | justinh: | and remember Sky's UI is subject to focus groups & all kinds of extensive research |
| [14:26:49] | justinh: | we don't do too bad |
| [14:27:19] | justinh: | with a clearly laid out remote even the way 0.22 is it's not too hard to work out what you're doing |
| [14:27:34] | justinh: | it's intuitive at a basic level that way |
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| [14:29:28] | justinh: | arghhh blimmim firefox. how can it end up being so unresponsive displaying a 404 page?! |
| [14:30:26] | patdk-wk: | firefox is always unresponsive for me |
| [14:30:32] | patdk-wk: | even when it's not even doing anything |
| [14:30:58] | justinh: | there has to be a non-sucky linux web browser somewhere |
| [14:31:04] | octavsly: | opera? |
| [14:31:12] | patdk-wk: | opera 10 sucks :( |
| [14:31:19] | patdk-wk: | I do like opera though |
| [14:31:23] | jduggan: | chrome? |
| [14:31:24] | jduggan: | :p |
| [14:31:31] | octavsly: | it is still faster then koinqueror/firefox |
| [14:31:31] | justinh: | never used it. Oh wait.. I did try it once |
| [14:31:44] | octavsly: | if I need something fast, i use opera |
| [14:31:48] | justinh: | I don't care about faster.. I just want it reliable |
| [14:31:51] | patdk-wk: | opera 10 broke all support for ipv6 |
| [14:32:00] | octavsly: | very reliable also |
| [14:32:07] | octavsly: | never core-dumped |
| [14:32:12] | justinh: | people rabbit on about mythtv being buggy but I can count the number of times I've had to kill it on one hand |
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| [14:32:42] | ** patdk-wk can't remember the last *buggy* issue he has with mythtv ** | |
| [14:32:53] | ivor: | justinh: yeah it normally kills itself. :) |
| [14:33:11] | justinh: | actually no |
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| [14:33:28] | justinh: | runtime for runtime, mythtv beats FF hands down |
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| [14:34:13] | mjj29: | patdk-wk: I'm using ipv6 and O10 fine |
| [14:34:29] | patdk-wk: | windows or linux? |
| [14:34:31] | mjj29: | linux |
| [14:34:35] | patdk-wk: | it's completely broken in linux |
| [14:34:40] | patdk-wk: | and a reported/known issue |
| [14:34:47] | patdk-wk: | 10.10? |
| [14:35:03] | mjj29: | oh, hmm |
| [14:35:16] | mjj29: | the one machine which is on is actually only 9.51 |
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| [14:35:35] | mjj29: | my laptop and desktop are both powered off so I can't check |
| [14:35:57] | patdk-wk: | well, I checked my home system, work, and laptop |
| [14:36:00] | mjj29: | (I'm using O9.51 in kiosk mode as the browser on my mythtv box, which works very nicely) |
| [14:36:01] | patdk-wk: | all 3 broken |
| [14:36:04] | patdk-wk: | all 3 are 10.10 though |
| [14:36:22] | mjj29: | I had thought I'd upgraded to 10 of some sort on at least one |
| [14:36:27] | patdk-wk: | http://groups.google.com/group/opera.linux/br . . . e5f7f46fb1e0 |
| [14:36:28] | mjj29: | but probably not 10.10 |
| [14:37:04] | mjj29: | ok, so it just uses IPv4 all the time? |
| [14:37:11] | patdk-wk: | no |
| [14:37:14] | patdk-wk: | it will try to do ipv6 |
| [14:37:21] | patdk-wk: | but all ipv6 dns requests fail |
| [14:37:23] | justinh: | heh no packages of Opera are available for this version of ubuntu |
| [14:37:35] | patdk-wk: | so if it doesn't get an ipv4 dns reply, it's broken, ipv4 works fine |
| [14:37:49] | patdk-wk: | what version? :) |
| [14:37:56] | justinh: | godknows/cares |
| [14:38:01] | justinh: | 8.10 I think |
| [14:38:16] | patdk-wk: | I don't think 8.10 is supported anymore :) |
| [14:38:22] | patdk-wk: | even by ubuntu |
| [14:38:48] | justinh: | obviously I care so much I know exactly which version it is |
| [14:38:49] | mjj29: | patdk-wk: I mean, if it's a dual-stack host and you get both ipv6 responses and ipv4, it'll use the ipv4 one? |
| [14:38:49] | justinh: | Not |
| [14:39:08] | justinh: | heh it's 8.04 |
| [14:39:09] | mjj29: | in which case I may not have noticed it, since my hosts are all dual-stack |
| [14:39:15] | gbee: | I like opera a lot, although it's not perfect, a few minor irritations |
| [14:39:19] | patdk-wk: | mjj29, yes, but it won't get a ipv6 response, cause the dns request for the ipv6 one is broken |
| [14:39:36] | mjj29: | gbee: oh, I use it everywhere |
| [14:39:47] | patdk-wk: | I try to use opera everywhere |
| [14:39:50] | patdk-wk: | works for most things |
| [14:39:59] | patdk-wk: | makes ebay pages have large white parts though |
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| [14:40:19] | gbee: | bugs/broken stuff in the little used features (content blocker etc) |
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| [14:41:02] | justinh: | hardly use ebay these days |
| [14:41:11] | gbee: | and the UI feels flimsy compared to firefox, hard to really explain what I mean there |
| [14:42:56] | patdk-wk: | I just ordered a bulk supply of sata cables from ebay |
| [14:43:42] | octavsly: | how much? |
| [14:43:51] | octavsly: | per piece |
| [14:44:24] | patdk-wk: | $0.60 |
| [14:44:51] | octavsly: | OK, usual price, 50cm? |
| [14:44:58] | patdk-wk: | I totally don't get the whole sata controllers though |
| [14:45:06] | patdk-wk: | 18", I think that is 50cm |
| [14:45:15] | gbee: | in conclusion I use Opera and not firefox, but I'm not 100% content with Opera either |
| [14:45:17] | patdk-wk: | I wanted 10" :( |
| [14:45:43] | justinh: | said the actress to the Bishop |
| [14:45:52] | patdk-wk: | you can get 4port pci sata |
| [14:46:00] | patdk-wk: | but you can only get 2 port pcie x1 |
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| [14:46:09] | patdk-wk: | and pci has 1gb bandwidth |
| [14:46:11] | octavsly: | interesting |
| [14:46:15] | patdk-wk: | and pcie has 2gb |
| [14:46:21] | octavsly: | per x1? |
| [14:46:33] | patdk-wk: | per pcie 1.0 x1 |
| [14:46:43] | justinh: | like you can really get 1Gb/sec out of a HDD |
| [14:46:50] | patdk-wk: | a sata port does 2.5gb per port (at 300) |
| [14:47:08] | patdk-wk: | justinh, when you use 5 drives on that port? |
| [14:47:10] | octavsly: | isn't 3Gb/s? |
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| [14:47:26] | patdk-wk: | 3Gb/s signalling rate, 2.5gb data |
| [14:47:29] | justinh: | sure, if the controller is PM aware |
| [14:47:31] | octavsly: | ok |
| [14:47:51] | justinh: | for a home DVR it's all moot :-) |
| [14:47:51] | gbee: | err no – the sata spec supports 3Gb/s but no harddrive could ever achieve that, 99% can't even achieve 1.5Gb/s of Sata 1.0 |
| [14:48:31] | patdk-wk: | well, I am using my dvr as my iscsi target :) |
| [14:48:43] | justinh: | you'd probably be lucky to hit 200MB/sec in real life |
| [14:49:08] | gbee: | 1.5Gb/s = 187MB/s, the fastest harddrives max out at less than 130MB/s |
| [14:49:23] | gbee: | SSDs are a different matter entirely |
| [14:49:36] | justinh: | tests I've done on common PM chipsets gets around 120MB/sec doing randomish access read/write |
| [14:49:36] | patdk-wk: | gbee, if you discount the onboard cache of the drive |
| [14:49:46] | justinh: | meh. cache doesn't count |
| [14:49:56] | patdk-wk: | normally not :) |
| [14:49:58] | patdk-wk: | just saying |
| [14:50:14] | justinh: | at least in terms of useful throughput it doesn't ;-) |
| [14:50:23] | octavsly: | hdparm -t /dev/hda (isn't it?) |
| [14:50:31] | patdk-wk: | but it still makes no sense to me |
| [14:50:35] | patdk-wk: | why have 4 ports on a pci card |
| [14:50:39] | patdk-wk: | but only 2 on pcie |
| [14:50:48] | justinh: | because! |
| [14:50:59] | patdk-wk: | in order to get 4 on a pcie card, it's x4, and not many motherboards support more than x1 ports |
| [14:51:08] | justinh: | you're saying it like nobody makes 4 port PCIe cards. which of course is incorrect :) |
| [14:51:19] | gbee: | it's probably just because that's all the available controller chips currently on the market support |
| [14:51:27] | patdk-wk: | I'm saying no one makes 4 port pcie x1 cards |
| [14:51:49] | justinh: | funny, cos I bought one not so long back |
| [14:52:03] | patdk-wk: | I've been looking and can't find one |
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| [14:52:36] | justinh: | so cos you can't find one you think nobody makes one? heh |
| [14:52:51] | justinh: | I found it stocked by a MAc bits supplier |
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| [14:54:10] | justinh: | trying to remember where I got it from now |
| [14:57:39] | justinh: | doh it's pcie 4x |
| [14:57:41] | justinh: | heh |
| [14:59:21] | justinh: | isn't PCIe compatible on the speed rating level, so if you can physically fit a 4x card in a 1x or 2x slot it'll work albeit at a lower speed? |
| [14:59:40] | patdk-wk: | physically no? |
| [14:59:43] | patdk-wk: | electrically yes |
| [14:59:51] | patdk-wk: | a 4x card is longer than a 1x slot |
| [15:00:02] | justinh: | well duh but apparently some 1x slots are open ended |
| [15:00:03] | patdk-wk: | but you can install a 4x slot, and wire it for 1x |
| [15:00:14] | patdk-wk: | well, if that is the case, sure :) |
| [15:00:22] | patdk-wk: | I haven't seen any on my systems though |
| [15:00:38] | patdk-wk: | the boards I normally see are like x8 slots, that are wired up for x1 or x4 |
| [15:00:47] | mjj29: | I believe justin is correct |
| [15:00:59] | mjj29: | but I also believe he has me on ignore, so won't have seen that q-: |
| [15:01:23] | patdk-wk: | mjj29, I just haven't seen any :) all mind have ends on them |
| [15:02:19] | Beirdo: | !notice |
| [15:02:19] | MythLogBot: | This channel (#mythtv-users) is logged — http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1 |
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| [15:02:28] | Beirdo: | muhahah. It's still alive. Good |
| [15:02:42] | ** Beirdo pats MythLogBot on the head ** | |
| [15:02:44] | ** patdk-wk applies standard disclaimer ** | |
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| [15:25:34] | quicksilver: | patdk-wk: the main bug I have with mythtv is that poor signal sometimes kills the frontend and sometimes (worse) freezes it. |
| [15:25:48] | quicksilver: | technically these may well be driver bugs. |
| [15:26:16] | patdk-wk: | poor signal kills the frontend? |
| [15:26:24] | octavsly: | I have the same |
| [15:26:26] | justinh: | broken streams should never hang software, in the typical ideal world scenario ;-) |
| [15:26:50] | justinh: | technically they shouldn't cause hardware problems either but stuff happens |
| [15:26:52] | patdk-wk: | I would put that down to, bad streams kill the frontend, not poor signal :) |
| [15:27:18] | ** patdk-wk doesn't have a poor stream problem ** | |
| [15:27:18] | octavsly: | furthermore I have a DVD with errors which I copied on HD. mplayer is the only one skipping the bad part. All others, including mythvideo exit. |
| [15:27:18] | octavsly: | mythfrontend sometimes crashes on bad signal |
| [15:28:00] | justinh: | if you can reproduce it that easily maybe it's time to get the debuggeriser out |
| [15:28:03] | justinh: | :) |
| [15:28:07] | octavsly: | I mean a BE of > 30000. |
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| [15:36:05] | Dibblah: | 30,000? That's more than 9000! |
| [15:36:28] | Dibblah: | And I assume you mean BER? |
| [15:37:20] | justinh: | BER spikes of that high, you must either live near high powered radar or a taxi office |
| [15:37:33] | justinh: | or radio pirate |
| [15:37:38] | justinh: | or tesla coil |
| [15:37:53] | justinh: | welding shop... |
| [15:41:59] | octavsly: | Dibblah: yes BER |
| [15:42:40] | octavsly: | strange, what I have noticed is that the BER goes high at certain times |
| [15:43:10] | octavsly: | I am living close to a high-tech campus... 1km away |
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| [16:12:18] | elmojo: | iamlindoro: any thoughts on how many seconds past a chapter we should use to determine if we jump back to the beginning of the current chapter or jump the beginning of the previous chapter |
| [16:12:46] | elmojo: | the initial patch uses 1 sec but maybe that's a little quick |
| [16:14:04] | patdk-wk: | I like 5sconds :) |
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| [16:15:20] | elmojo: | patdk-wk: is that in-line with other video/music players? |
| [16:18:40] | patdk-wk: | no idea |
| [16:18:45] | patdk-wk: | I think most others use 2seconds |
| [16:18:54] | patdk-wk: | and I find it annoying as hell, I always have to hit it twice |
| [16:19:03] | patdk-wk: | and sometimes don't do it fast enough |
| [16:19:20] | patdk-wk: | cd's are 2 seconds atleast |
| [16:19:30] | elmojo: | I currently have 1 second which I gather would make you even angrier |
| [16:19:52] | patdk-wk: | hell, I would be fine with 10 seconds, but I can see how that is too long for some |
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| [16:20:59] | elmojo: | 5 seconds seems reasonable |
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| [16:29:22] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v iamlindoro | |
| [16:33:08] | iamlindoro: | elmojo: three "feels" like a good number, but in the end it's a matter of taste I think |
| [16:33:23] | iamlindoro: | elmojo: just as long as we don't gain another setting :) |
| [16:33:35] | iamlindoro: | five is fine too |
| [16:33:43] | iamlindoro: | (just getting in to work, sorry for the delay) |
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| [16:35:06] | elmojo: | iamlindoro: I made the change to 3 seconds already and it seems to work well... thinking much more and it may be too long |
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| [16:35:19] | iamlindoro: | sounds good |
| [16:35:59] | iamlindoro: | If a user needs more than three they're legally dead anyway |
| [16:36:32] | elmojo: | good point |
| [16:36:59] | elmojo: | ok... uploading a new patch with 3 seconds and various clean-up |
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| [16:37:11] | iamlindoro: | cool |
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| [16:37:59] | elmojo: | looks like commskip uses 2 seconds |
| [16:38:17] | iamlindoro: | remaining consistent is even better :) |
| [16:38:24] | elmojo: | nitpicking I know but don't want to have to keep changing it |
| [16:38:44] | elmojo: | patdk-wk might get mad at that |
| [16:38:48] | iamlindoro: | not a nitpick at all, I think consistent behavior is really important |
| [16:39:53] | iamlindoro: | Feel free to be effusive about how much fun you've had with Arclight since last night in-channel ;) |
| [16:40:53] | patdk-wk: | hehe :) |
| [16:41:02] | elmojo: | but others might feel dejected and left out |
| [16:41:06] | patdk-wk: | I hardly ever use chapter forward/reverse though |
| [16:41:22] | iamlindoro: | elmojo: Let 'em, theyl;l get their hands on it eventually ;) |
| [16:41:29] | iamlindoro: | they'll |
| [16:41:51] | elmojo: | or maybe they'll submit patches and get an early beta release :) |
| [16:42:46] | iamlindoro: | One can dream |
| [16:44:15] | antgel: | elmojo: thanks for sharing arclight! ;) |
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| [16:45:13] | ** jams downloads arclight from rapidshare ** | |
| [16:45:52] | ** iamlindoro hopes elmojo shared the killcode with everyone ** | |
| [16:46:04] | iamlindoro: | the once-per-24-hour-prevent-rm-rf-code |
| [16:48:02] | elmojo: | I didn't know it was on rapidshare... all that hard work for nothing |
| [16:50:01] | sphery: | Does Arclight require an octo-core system with 256GB RAM, like Graphite? |
| [16:50:52] | elmojo: | you also need a water-cooled thermal solution for the CPU |
| [16:51:27] | sphery: | I thought it required LN. Must have made it less resource intensive since I last looked. |
| [16:51:39] | sphery: | (where "looked" means "read a message on the -users list") |
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| [16:54:04] | iamlindoro: | It's all the closed source font code |
| [16:54:21] | iamlindoro: | if it were open source it could probably be done on a Casio calculator |
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| [16:58:44] | rcaskey: | hello all, can anyone suggest a good inexpensive PCI-based tuner for clear-QAM channels only? |
| [16:59:23] | patdk-wk: | hvr-1600 |
| [16:59:29] | patdk-wk: | none-hauppauge, I dunno |
| [16:59:55] | rcaskey: | $90 isn't out of the price-range but just that it's getting into HD-Homerun territory |
| [17:01:05] | XLV: | then get the hd-homerun |
| [17:01:16] | rcaskey: | looking that way, just wanted to ponder my options |
| [17:01:17] | patdk-wk: | I don't see any other pci ones at all, all pcie |
| [17:01:18] | patdk-wk: | or usb |
| [17:01:26] | rcaskey: | are there good USB ones? |
| [17:01:39] | rcaskey: | I just don't have a PCIe slot free but I got lots of USB :P |
| [17:01:57] | patdk-wk: | no idea, never used usb |
| [17:02:10] | patdk-wk: | for anything > keyboard/mouse/bluetooth |
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| [17:04:28] | XLV: | hd-homerun is also location and os agnostic, just as long as you got a wire you can place it anywhere |
| [17:04:41] | XLV: | i'd like if they produced something similar for dvb-s2 |
| [17:04:51] | XLV: | yeah, i know, you can do it with a dm 800 |
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| [17:05:03] | rcaskey: | Any brick-n-morters carry the HDHomerun in the SE? |
| [17:06:17] | rcaskey: | doh, gotta run, thanks all! |
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| [17:12:36] | sphery: | iamlindoro: heh, that's the problem with closed-source proprietary code, like fonts... |
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| [17:14:48] | sphery: | rcaskey: In case you look in here, the Avermedia A-180 works well. The pcHDTV HD-5500 isn't bad, but it's pretty expensive. Other than that, http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/ATSC_PCI_Cards and verify the QAM column. |
| [17:16:52] | ** iamlindoro has about a half-dozen PCI QAM cards sitting on his desk ** | |
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| [17:17:06] | iamlindoro: | more cards than I have PCI closts (or things worth watching) |
| [17:17:11] | iamlindoro: | s/closts/slots/ |
| [17:18:54] | iamlindoro: | The status of 0.22 is that the backend will not build #7519 on 10.6 (please remove this warning from the Wiki once 0.22 is building and running on 10.6), but it should run as of or run SVN Revision 23099 which fixed #7582 |
| [17:19:00] | iamlindoro: | BASIC ENGLISH FAIL |
| [17:19:20] | iamlindoro: | don't try to comprehend the above, it'll only make your ears bleed |
| [17:19:57] | iamlindoro: | It doesn't build (please remove this warning) but it builds! |
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| [17:27:34] | wagnerrp: | so when mel brooks claimed he was putting out a spaceballs 2, he actually meant a cartoon? |
| [17:30:36] | meshe: | spaceballs the animated series |
| [17:30:45] | meshe: | it's actually pretty funny |
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| [17:42:20] | dashs: | Comcast has borked firewire non-broadcast channels here (Colorado). So I need to go satellite. What kind of card should I get? |
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| [17:43:06] | wagnerrp: | you cant use firewire for capture on comcast, so youre moving to a service in which you cant even use it to change channels? |
| [17:43:32] | wagnerrp: | unless thats the 'last straw', thats not a good reason |
| [17:43:33] | dashs: | Is there another option? |
| [17:44:00] | wagnerrp: | im saying no satellite provide offers anything like firewire support |
| [17:44:13] | wagnerrp: | so in that sense, its no better than comcast |
| [17:44:26] | wagnerrp: | except its worse because then you have to use an IR blaster too |
| [17:44:40] | dashs: | Saw that earlier (sigh). |
| [17:45:27] | dashs: | So buy the provider DVR and scuttle mythtv? |
| [17:45:45] | wagnerrp: | i didnt say that at all |
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| [17:46:25] | wagnerrp: | im saying satellite offers nothing like firewire, so switching to them because comcast removed a couple channels from firewire makes absolutely no sense |
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| [17:47:17] | dashs: | couple? All but NBC, CBS, ABC, and FOX? |
| [17:47:47] | dashs: | er, PBS |
| [17:47:55] | wagnerrp: | the point is still exactly the same |
| [17:48:31] | dashs: | Sorry, not getting it. |
| [17:48:38] | iamlindoro: | If you stay with comcast, you have to use an analog capture device like the HD-PVR to get all your channels. If you switch to satellite, you have to use an analog capture device like the HD-PVR to get all your channels AND you have to go through the hassle of switching |
| [17:48:50] | iamlindoro: | therefore, there is no net gain in switching |
| [17:49:03] | iamlindoro: | other than to make your wallet easier to carry |
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| [17:49:59] | wagnerrp: | satellite does not have any form of content, capture-able digitally by mythtv |
| [17:50:20] | wagnerrp: | so switching to satellite because comcast took away most of your firewire channels makes no sense |
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| [17:50:55] | wagnerrp: | unless firewire capture was the only thing keeping you with comcast |
| [17:51:07] | wagnerrp: | i.e. the 'last straw' |
| [17:51:41] | ** patdk-wk doesn't even pay for digital service ** | |
| [17:51:49] | patdk-wk: | but then their digital service has no stations I watch |
| [17:52:03] | dashs: | I do have the option of reducing my comcast package to minimum digital... and it it is/was the the last fscking straw. |
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| [17:55:17] | dashs: | Thanks guys — I can see that you folks have visited this before. |
| [17:58:11] | wagnerrp: | also, unless you live in the mountains with no reception, you'd be better off with an antenna than your 'minimum' package |
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| [18:00:22] | dashs: | wagnerrp: I've been entertaining that thought, too. I need to test over-the-air I'm at an acute angle to Lookout Mtn. |
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| [18:20:10] | robertj: | Anyone know if hdhomerun is available retail anywhere in the SE US? |
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| [18:32:47] | syamajala: | do you have a microcenter near you? |
| [18:33:08] | syamajala: | i know the one near me has them in stock i live in the northeast though |
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| [18:36:23] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc | |
| [18:36:36] | |jonas|: | Hi |
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| [18:58:42] | gizmobay: | What is the command line to tell which version of nvidia drivers I'm using? |
| [18:59:51] | kormoc: | sudo dmesg | grep -i nvidia ? |
| [19:00:46] | gizmobay: | thanks, no vdpau.h for 195.30? |
| [19:07:30] | superm1: | you need libvdpau installed |
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| [19:14:03] | gizmobay: | thanks |
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| [19:32:32] | robertj: | is clear-QAM via my cable company going to be the exact same signal quality as OTA? |
| [19:34:00] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: typically, no. The cable company will further compress the OTA signals. |
| [19:34:20] | devinheitmueller: | They reduce the bitrate to fit more HD channels over the wire. |
| [19:34:50] | wagnerrp: | ive seen usually around 12mbps recordings, while the broadcast in my area are typically 15–16mbps |
| [19:35:08] | wagnerrp: | with the occasional abomination closer to 7mbps |
| [19:35:20] | devinheitmueller: | Of course, my statement is assuming that you are asking about the quality of one of the broadcast channels compared to that same channel delivered via ClearQAM. |
| [19:35:28] | robertj: | devinheitmueller, yes |
| [19:35:38] | devinheitmueller: | Yeah, generally the OTA will be higher quality. |
| [19:37:30] | robertj: | devinheitmueller, unfortunately antenna would be a major undertaking here |
| [19:37:32] | devinheitmueller: | Also depends on the program. For example, they may reduce the bitrate of "Everybody Loves Raymond" more than "Fox NFL Football" (since you are most likely to notice the bitrate issues with fast motion) |
| [19:38:05] | iamlindoro: | and whatever else is on the mux and how decent their cherry pickers are |
| [19:38:36] | iamlindoro: | ie if the multiplex is shared between three high-motion HD sports events, they could all coneivably look like hell |
| [19:38:43] | robertj: | I haven't watched OTA TV in digital so it may be hard for me to tell |
| [19:38:44] | iamlindoro: | er conceivably |
| [19:39:09] | robertj: | iamlindoro, I ordered the charter limited basic last night so I'll let you know if I am part of that 99.9% that can get HD with limited basic :P |
| [19:39:11] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: it's entirely possible you won't notice. Many people cannot tell the difference. |
| [19:39:24] | robertj: | devinheitmueller, I'd like to think I can :P |
| [19:39:32] | iamlindoro: | robertj: It would be a genuine surprise if you didn't at least get locals |
| [19:39:55] | robertj: | devinheitmueller, but seriously, I tend to be able to, my el-cheapo lasik was the best money I ever spent :P |
| [19:40:04] | devinheitmueller: | heh |
| [19:40:40] | robertj: | but artifacting in blu-ray still bugs me alot |
| [19:40:40] | devinheitmueller: | You would be surprised. Take the average American and stick him in front of an HDTV and he wouldn't be able to tell you whether he's watching a DVD or a BluRay disk. |
| [19:41:13] | robertj: | devinheitmueller, no I won't, I have spare HDMI cables for when I visit relatives to change out their RCAs between their HD Cable boxes & TV's |
| [19:41:22] | devinheitmueller: | heh. |
| [19:41:33] | devinheitmueller: | Yeah, I've seen that before. |
| [19:41:34] | robertj: | and if I don't, well then its a trip to biglots :P |
| [19:42:44] | robertj: | Also I get motion sick in the theater now |
| [19:43:18] | robertj: | The first 10 minutes I'm woozy, and then I'm ok, but if it switches to IMAX things feel "normal" again, and then when it switches back it takes me 2–3 minutes to adjust again |
| [19:43:42] | robertj: | But at home motion-flow goes to 11. |
| [19:45:42] | robertj: | iamlindoro, I think I've settled on an hdhomerun though |
| [19:45:49] | robertj: | iamlindoro, but that unfortunately requires patience |
| [19:46:01] | iamlindoro: | HDHR should be fine, many.most people with them seem quite satisfied |
| [19:46:05] | iamlindoro: | er many/most |
| [19:46:26] | robertj: | yeah, the only problems I've heard about are from people runing really early revisions and people not aware that most stuff isn't in clear-QAM |
| [19:46:48] | robertj: | I'm still fuzzy on how the cablecard version of hdhomerun will work |
| [19:47:19] | robertj: | a post on the myth list indicated they thought that maybe providers would be dropping encryption and using a non-enforced copyright flag? |
| [19:47:57] | robertj: | http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2010 . . . /276537.html |
| [19:48:26] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: I'll believe it when I see it. |
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| [19:48:46] | robertj: | I'm not likely to poney up alot more cash/month so I'm fine with the clear-qam |
| [19:48:56] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: beware speculation when it comes to the CableCard stuff. Many people offering opinions/commentary appear to have no idea what the hell they are talking about. |
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| [19:53:17] | robertj: | I really don't think I want the other channels |
| [19:54:03] | robertj: | the only other thing I want is to be able to watch Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood in HD and from what I can tell it's not carried on anything here and I can get like 640xwhateverish online for $2/episode or endure youtube on a 2-week delay |
| [19:55:06] | sphery: | or DVD or Blu-Ray? |
| [19:55:23] | robertj: | sphery, ? |
| [19:55:36] | CyberKnet: | devinheitmueller: Unrelated ... I've really been enjoying your regular posts on kernel.org – just wanted to stay thanks. |
| [19:55:40] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: why is it that you have to go and ruin people's speculation by reminding them of reality? |
| [19:55:51] | CyberKnet: | err... kernellabs.com |
| [19:55:56] | CyberKnet: | man... wrong thing on the brain |
| [19:56:03] | devinheitmueller: | CyberKnet: ah, so you're the one reading that blog. Thanks. ;-) |
| [19:56:03] | sphery: | robertj: just wondered if they're available on DVD/BD--if so, that's another alternative |
| [19:56:19] | robertj: | sphery, I think maybe the first few episodes are already out on BD |
| [19:56:21] | sphery: | robertj: I get all of the TV that I like that's not broadcast OTA by buying DVD's. |
| [19:56:21] | CyberKnet: | sphery: heh |
| [19:56:26] | robertj: | but its still newish |
| [19:56:40] | robertj: | and we do look forward to watching it on Thursday nights because we are boring people :) |
| [19:56:55] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: Yeah, I'm just trying to dispel any delusions that "everything is working great in LinuxTV land". |
| [19:57:20] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: Oh, you're talking about DVD/BluRay. Sorry, wrong topic. |
| [19:57:43] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: Oh wait, you're talking about the Cablecard stuff. My bad again. |
| [19:57:52] | ** devinheitmueller goes and gets more coffee. ** | |
| [19:57:53] | sphery: | robertj: ah, I'm still at least a season behind on most all my TV, so broadcast schedule isn't really a factor in deciding when to watch stuff |
| [19:57:59] | robertj: | are there any inexpensive USB tuners for clear-qam that are worth looking at? |
| [19:58:24] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: yeah, you're reminding people of reality with CableCards instead of letting them live in their purple-sky worlds... it's so mean. :) |
| [19:59:03] | CyberKnet: | Aaah, it's just the world that we live in I suppose. |
| [19:59:10] | robertj: | Honestly the benefit of having an HD Homerun seems...minimalish when used with Myth |
| [19:59:18] | CyberKnet: | We'd love to have digital access to all that content ... but all we will have is the HD-PVR |
| [19:59:29] | sphery: | I was just thinking DVD/BD (possibly with a STB player) is a good alternative to recording for channels you don't receive or a good alternative to "online webisodes" (or whatever they're called) when you like at least 1940's quality or better. |
| [20:00:01] | robertj: | sphery, the webisodes are better than SD by a good bit |
| [20:00:19] | sphery: | though some online stuff (like The Guild) are good quality |
| [20:00:54] | sphery: | yeah, depends a lot on the content and the content delivery mechanism. I find anything at Hulu isn't worth watching unless I'm really in a bind. |
| [20:00:57] | iamlindoro: | soulfire |
| [20:01:08] | robertj: | 10Mbps 640x360, WMP though :( |
| [20:01:09] | iamlindoro: | sfafd |
| [20:01:17] | iamlindoro: | sigh |
| [20:01:54] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: there are USB tuners that do ClearQAM. There's a list in the linuxtv.org wiki. |
| [20:02:13] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/ATSC_USB_Devices |
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| [20:03:26] | devinheitmueller: | Whether you want to go with a USB device in many cases depends on whether you need analog too. Most of the USB devices that provide analog do it via a frame buffer (they don't have an MPEG encoder), and hence they put much more load on your mythbackend since it gets converted to MPEG in software. |
| [20:03:42] | robertj: | I have no interest in analog |
| [20:04:14] | devinheitmueller: | robertj: Ok, well then look at the table in that wiki and grab a unit that has a "Yes" in the "QAM" column. |
| [20:04:47] | robertj: | yeah but I also don't want to end up with one that is "well sorta supported if you have the write git tree" |
| [20:04:50] | robertj: | err "right" |
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| [20:05:54] | devinheitmueller: | Well, I probably wouldn't be the best person to ask then, since I worked on support for 11 of the devices in that table. |
| [20:06:04] | robertj: | hehe :P |
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| [20:40:54] | elmojo: | iamlindoro: is 'use video as timebase' on the chopping block? |
| [20:41:39] | iamlindoro: | elmojo: Yes, though we haven't gotten as much cut out as we had hoped this go-round, so it's still in right now |
| [20:41:45] | iamlindoro: | it should/will go, though |
| [20:42:56] | sphery: | iamlindoro: Remember that the name of the big bowl game is trademarked, so please don't mention it unless you've paid the NFL. |
| [20:43:07] | iamlindoro: | heh |
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| [21:00:26] | justinh: | good grief. when daft ideas gang up & agree with one another ... virtual backends |
| [21:02:52] | ** justinh looks at his paypal account. still no transfer of the Avatar fee I see ** | |
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| [21:02:56] | sphery: | justinh: but virtualization /saves/ money |
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| [21:03:16] | sphery: | I read about it in a business journal |
| [21:03:24] | justinh: | oh yeah I heard that too |
| [21:04:00] | sphery: | If it's a virtual host, it doesn't take any power to run it at all. |
| [21:04:07] | justinh: | it saves companies fortunes by having whole offices run from one server & turning previously useful (and fast) hardware into dumb terminals |
| [21:04:25] | sphery: | imagine doing the same with myth! |
| [21:04:39] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: that's what the cable company is trying to do right now. |
| [21:04:45] | justinh: | productivity sinks to levels so low that the company has to lay people off to stay profitable. therefore it DOES save money |
| [21:04:49] | sphery: | actually, that's a good point |
| [21:04:50] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: except *we* are the dumb terminals. |
| [21:04:59] | sphery: | yeah... |
| [21:05:13] | jvs (jvs!n=jvs@90.146.56.206) has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) | |
| [21:05:19] | justinh: | where my wife works went virtual last year. they're not very happy with the whole thing |
| [21:06:08] | justinh: | I was surprised when I heard it was all Citrix based too. I thought they might've known a thing or two about doing it properly |
| [21:06:44] | justinh: | MS Office & Lotus Notes in virtual machines. It ain't pretty |
| [21:07:52] | sphery: | wow |
| [21:08:25] | sphery: | and soon they'll be able to deploy Chrome OS and use Google Office and get rid of all those citrix servers and storage arrays |
| [21:08:38] | justinh: | and this, one of the world's premier financial institutions mind |
| [21:08:43] | sphery: | and Google will own the company's business secrets |
| [21:08:52] | justinh: | the whole reason behind it was for security apparently |
| [21:09:08] | justinh: | like no admin worth a cent can't lock down an XP box sufficiently |
| [21:09:09] | sphery: | hope they're encrypting all traffic on the network, then |
| [21:09:14] | justinh: | er no |
| [21:09:32] | sphery: | I guess "security" means different things to different folks, then... |
| [21:09:33] | sphery: | :) |
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| [21:10:10] | justinh: | what I really don't get is how frequently it messes up everybody's system images |
| [21:10:46] | justinh: | stuff like printers going missing, docs vanishing.. |
| [21:11:08] | justinh: | oh and the best bit.. they still send CDs in the post |
| [21:11:34] | justinh: | encrypted of course. with the passkey also sent in the same shipment. Yay |
| [21:12:24] | justinh: | you might've heard of one or two big organisations 'losing' customer data over here. that kind of thing ;-) |
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| [21:13:40] | sphery: | heh |
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| [21:14:08] | sphery: | love their sending the key in the same shipment--kind of makes the encryption an exercise in futility |
| [21:14:32] | justinh: | oh when they send docs by email they use PGP. Then phone the customer & tell them the key |
| [21:14:33] | sphery: | A safe with a big read button on it, "Lock override" |
| [21:15:04] | justinh: | not THE PGP btw.. just a program called PGP |
| [21:15:47] | gbee: | justinh: my sister worked for Accenture, in the weeks and months after the huge uproar over lost data, questions in parliament etc, they were still sending client (government and private) data on media in jiffy bags unencrypted, or encrypted with the password on a bit of paper in the same package |
| [21:16:34] | gbee: | bear in mind that Accenture run many of the big government databases, and until last year the NHS patient records stuff was theirs too |
| [21:16:46] | justinh: | I hate to think WTF is gonna go wrong if they ever bring in all the ID stuff |
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| [21:17:07] | justinh: | I think I'm only so dead against it all because of safety concerns |
| [21:17:36] | FRQuadrat is now known as FR^2 | |
| [21:18:29] | justinh: | gbee: you'd be surprised how much still gets stored on paper too |
| [21:18:32] | gbee: | none of these things are secure in way that even an average desktop user would assume for their own data |
| [21:18:38] | justinh: | company emails, printed out & files.. |
| [21:18:44] | justinh: | *filed |
| [21:19:13] | justinh: | gbee: my remote desktop connection is prolly more secure ;-) |
| [21:19:15] | jams: | gbee- the running joke at our place is to create printers with shredders attached |
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| [21:19:31] | jams: | that way all printouts are secrued |
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| [21:19:52] | justinh: | jams: certainly cuts out a middleman :-D |
| [21:19:52] | gbee: | aye and as with the banks last year too, everything gets printed out by employees who don't want to read it on screen and then dropped into the ordinary waste, so if you are prepared to go through the bins outside any bank you'll find a goldmine of information |
| [21:20:01] | jams: | sure does |
| [21:21:45] | gbee: | the NHS IT project was interesting, my cousin is a doctor, so when we all met up last year my sister got to learn just how screwed up it really was from someone who actually had to use it |
| [21:22:04] | ** sphery wonders if jams meant he does go through the bins ** | |
| [21:22:21] | jams: | sphery- not anymore |
| [21:22:24] | iamlindoro: | Porsche came from somewhere |
| [21:22:40] | sphery: | heh, he's retired now |
| [21:22:54] | gbee: | all sorts of interesting things came out of that, such as the fact that there are two incompatible systems (both created as part of the same project) and that printing out something like an X-Ray meant manually moving it between systems etc |
| [21:23:42] | tgm4883: | iamlindoro, you can't get away that easy ;) |
| [21:24:24] | gbee: | fwiw, I don't think anyone prints X-Rays, but I wasn't paying enough attention and we were several pints into the night – the general drift is accurate though |
| [21:24:28] | sphery: | woah... no danielk in #mythtv |
| [21:24:57] | sphery: | The Fast & The Furious: General Drift |
| [21:25:31] | gbee: | sphery: he's there as often as he's not |
| [21:25:53] | sphery: | It seems that way too many companies/government agencies have scary systems in place. I feel my best bet is ignorance. |
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| [21:26:30] | sphery: | gbee: yeah, was going to ask him about whether changing the time-zone check to use MythXML would be an acceptable way to fix SendReceiveStringList(QUERY_TIME_ZONE) called from UI thread |
| [21:26:37] | sphery: | it can always waiut |
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| [21:47:23] | paras: | how can i record from live tv with the "r" button and keep this recording ? it always gets deleted immediately |
| [21:48:10] | sphery: | paras: it keeps recording |
| [21:48:25] | wagnerrp: | paras: exactly as you said, you hit 'r', nd it gets marked as a recording rather than a livetv session |
| [21:48:28] | sphery: | until the end of the current show or until the top-/half-hour point (if you have no listings) |
| [21:48:42] | DjMadness: | anyone know of a quick hack i could do to fix "#CRITICAL – DB speaks schema version 1249, but we speak version 1248" for jamu ? (i am using latest svn) |
| [21:48:52] | sphery: | paras: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Frequently_Asked_Q . . . ecordings.3F |
| [21:49:04] | wagnerrp: | it would only get expired immediately if you are below your minimum required space |
| [21:49:17] | sphery: | paras: though the best approach is to actually make a recording rule |
| [21:49:18] | paras: | but when i hit 'r' again it doesn't show up in the "watch recordings" menu |
| [21:49:36] | wagnerrp: | DjMadness: figure out whoever bumped the schema, and tell them they need to bump the python schema version as well |
| [21:49:42] | sphery: | you hit r once to start it, if you hit it multiple times, it toggles between recording types |
| [21:49:47] | paras: | so you can't record something spontaneously while watching livetv ? |
| [21:49:55] | sphery: | one of which is don't record |
| [21:49:55] | wagnerrp: | in the meantime, you can just bump it manually |
| [21:50:00] | DjMadness: | paras: yes press "r" |
| [21:50:30] | paras: | i only have "record" and "abort record" when hitting r |
| [21:50:56] | sphery: | that means you have no listings? |
| [21:51:06] | DjMadness: | paras: set the default recording profile to no expire |
| [21:51:10] | paras: | you mean epg ? |
| [21:51:12] | sphery: | Myth without listings is pretty much useless |
| [21:51:19] | sphery: | Yeah, the data that fills the EPG |
| [21:51:25] | wagnerrp: | DjMadness: should be in /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/MythTV/MythDB.py |
| [21:51:28] | paras: | i have epg |
| [21:51:38] | paras: | it shows the listings |
| [21:51:46] | DjMadness: | wagnerrp: thanks |
| [21:51:54] | sphery: | and on the channel you're watching when you hit r? |
| [21:52:15] | paras: | i have the listings on every channel |
| [21:52:22] | wagnerrp: | you may also want to check against the binding's author and/or jamu author whether those changes have caused problems with their respective programs |
| [21:53:03] | DjMadness: | okeys |
| [21:53:17] | sphery: | paras: ah, seems like it's now just record on/off |
| [21:53:31] | paras: | sphery, yes |
| [21:54:49] | paras: | btw, can one specify an ALSA device instead of /dev/dsp (OSS) for grabbing the audio from the TV card in mythtv-setup ? |
| [21:54:51] | sphery: | no, it should toggle through all of them |
| [21:55:09] | sphery: | paras: are you using 0.22-fixes or trunk? |
| [21:55:46] | ** wagnerrp prods sphery ** | |
| [21:55:59] | paras: | sphery, 021_p20877 |
| [21:56:04] | paras: | gentoo ebuild |
| [21:56:10] | sphery: | ah, for 0.21-fixes, it definitely works |
| [21:56:29] | ** wagnerrp prods sphery about [23106] and DjMadness's issue ** | |
| [21:56:38] | sphery: | Looks like you have to enable the "Always use Browse mode in LiveTV" setting to have it do more than record/don't record |
| [21:57:05] | sphery: | wagnerrp: did I break something? |
| [21:57:34] | sphery: | DjMadness: what's happening post [23106]? |
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| [21:57:47] | wagnerrp: | DjMadness: looking at it, its just changes to the keybindings table, neither the bindings nor jamu touches either of those |
| [21:57:55] | sphery: | wagnerrp: ah, I broke the python bindings. |
| [21:58:00] | paras: | but usually when hitting "r' during livetv records as long the show is going ? |
| [21:58:20] | sphery: | sorry... forgot to update it. I'm about to update to 1250, anyway, and when I do I'll fix the pythong DB schema version |
| [21:58:32] | DjMadness: | wagnerrp: ye i am checking out the changes as we speak |
| [21:58:44] | wagnerrp: | sounds good |
| [21:58:49] | sphery: | wagnerrp: *and* I'll put in a comment that says to update them right above the dbcheck line that defines current db schema ver |
| [21:59:17] | wagnerrp: | sphery: ive moved all that stuff into a short separate file in the bindings, so you dont have to go digging through stuff to update it |
| [21:59:20] | sphery: | give me 30mins to an hour to finish testing and I'll have it updated |
| [21:59:22] | DjMadness: | sphery: its no problem, i dont expect everything to be fully workng on the trunk version... |
| [21:59:50] | wagnerrp: | sphery: youve likely broken the perl bindings, and mythweb as well |
| [21:59:57] | sphery: | paras: yeah, it should record once as long as you have valid guide data--even if you don't enable the browse mode (if you prefer the "extremely slow channel surfing mode") |
| [22:00:02] | wagnerrp: | i dont know if they do checks |
| [22:00:11] | sphery: | Neither of them checks db schema version |
| [22:00:22] | sphery: | should probably make both do so since they're both hitting the DB directly... |
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| [22:00:50] | sphery: | wagnerrp: so, what's your proposed timeline on the bindings rewrite being committed? I can do it when you feel it's best (though I can't yet test anything). |
| [22:00:55] | wagnerrp: | ok, they only check proto version on the backend connection (since the backend really forces it) |
| [22:00:58] | sphery: | It would be nice to do it with some time before the freeze |
| [22:01:00] | iamlindoro: | sphery: 's fault |
| [22:01:10] | wagnerrp: | sphery: really, im just waiting for some form of feedback |
| [22:01:18] | paras: | sphery, where do i enable browse mode ? |
| [22:01:19] | iamlindoro: | r23106 |
| [22:01:30] | sphery: | IMHO, feedback is much more likely once we commit the change :) |
| [22:02:03] | wagnerrp: | well the purpose of the post to -dev a week and a half back was to get people testing it, and finding bugs |
| [22:02:05] | sphery: | paras: Utilities/Setup|Setup|TV Settings|OSD |
| [22:02:24] | paras: | ok will check |
| [22:02:32] | sphery: | wagnerrp: I say let's commit it. If you have any last-minute stuff, get it up there and let me know and I'll put it in. |
| [22:02:43] | Dagmar: | Odd. |
| [22:02:51] | iamlindoro: | can we hold bindings commits to go in with script fixes? |
| [22:02:51] | sphery: | does RDV_Linux have an updated jamu ready? |
| [22:03:02] | iamlindoro: | tvdb and jame need to work |
| [22:03:03] | Dagmar: | I never noticed MythVideo apparently scanning every half hour before now |
| [22:03:05] | iamlindoro: | er jamu |
| [22:03:10] | DjMadness: | wagnerrp: the fix was good enough it seams :) |
| [22:03:19] | sphery: | ah, didn't know there was a tvdb using the Python bindings |
| [22:03:25] | wagnerrp: | its not |
| [22:03:30] | sphery: | thought it was perl like tmdb |
| [22:03:34] | wagnerrp: | but jamu and miro do |
| [22:03:36] | iamlindoro: | Dagmar: MythVideo doesn't auto-scan... uPnP perhaps? |
| [22:03:42] | iamlindoro: | yep, Jamu, Mirobridge, tvdb |
| [22:03:48] | wagnerrp: | theyre both in python now, written by RDV_Linux |
| [22:03:49] | RDV_Linux: | sphery: No jamu nor Mirobridge have been converted yet to the new bindings. It is my current task. |
| [22:04:05] | wagnerrp: | ttvdb and tmdb, that is |
| [22:04:12] | ** iamlindoro would prefer the bindings updates go in with concurrent script fixes ** | |
| [22:04:17] | sphery: | RDV_Linux: ah, ok... guess we'll have to wait |
| [22:04:22] | wagnerrp: | technically, the other two are python by RDV too... |
| [22:04:40] | RDV_Linux: | sphery: tvdb not tmdsb use the bindings as they do not touch the data base. |
| [22:04:53] | sphery: | nice |
| [22:04:57] | sphery: | that's a great plan |
| [22:05:09] | wagnerrp: | RDV_Linux: did you read any of those ramblings from last night? |
| [22:05:16] | sphery: | we need to either fix the perl bindings or convert all the "real" scripts to python for that reason |
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| [22:05:36] | iamlindoro: | Are we going to need to do anything fancy with the build/install process to handle the old ones already existing? |
| [22:05:54] | iamlindoro: | ie do they import using the same name and could the presence of old python bindings/files cause problems? |
| [22:06:05] | wagnerrp: | the python installer package *should* take care of all of that... i think |
| [22:06:30] | wagnerrp: | ill have to check that |
| [22:06:37] | ** iamlindoro crosses fingers ** | |
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| [22:06:52] | wagnerrp: | they dont overwrite the old versions |
| [22:06:57] | wagnerrp: | it installs to a new folder |
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| [22:07:25] | wagnerrp: | and hopefully the installer recognizes that the old version exists and removes it |
| [22:07:38] | wagnerrp: | if not, ill have to figure out how to make it recognize them |
| [22:08:40] | RDV_Linux: | wagnerrp: No I have not read any of the ramblings my power has been off for a lot of today. |
| [22:08:56] | wagnerrp: | anyway, RDV_Linux, basically ive added a 'override' functions for VideoGrabber.searchTitle(), where it will return the inetref from any matching titles, instead of calling the grabber |
| [22:09:18] | wagnerrp: | im wondering if it would be better to return the title that the user supplied for matching, or the title that the grabber is expecting |
| [22:10:02] | wagnerrp: | basically, the latter would be so it could be properly used in a subsequent MythVideo.searchEpisode |
| [22:11:32] | wagnerrp: | while the former would allow a grabber call to be avoided |
| [22:11:54] | wagnerrp: | although how much that would matter to server loads is probably minimal |
| [22:12:43] | RDV_Linux: | wagnerrp: I am going have to think but I do not remember either Jamu or Mirobridge doing a title search of the videometadata table. Maybe MiroBridge. |
| [22:14:05] | wagnerrp: | basically, this is because the grabber syntax requires an inetref be given to the grabber for '-D' |
| [22:14:31] | paras: | damn, why can't i get any teletext.... it works in nxtvepg.... |
| [22:14:31] | wagnerrp: | while your config file is not applied to title searches |
| [22:15:04] | wagnerrp: | so trying to grab data for 'the office', i would fail because i had multiple title matches |
| [22:15:22] | RDV_Linux: | wagnerrp: I made some search improvements to the old MythVideo.py bindings but mainly to help the bindings rather than my own scripts. The search I changed was flawed and did not account for TV episodes/season numbers. |
| [22:16:10] | wagnerrp: | this is nothing to do with videometadata, just for using the metadata grabbers |
| [22:16:23] | RDV_Linux: | wagnerrp: pl |
| [22:16:28] | RDV_Linux: | wagnerrp: ok |
| [22:16:36] | paras: | can one specify an ALSA device (like ALSA:hw=1,0) instead of /dev/dsp (OSS) for grabbing the audio from the TV card in mythtv-setup ? |
| [22:17:38] | sphery: | paras: yes |
| [22:17:42] | Dagmar: | Yes. Absolutely. |
| [22:17:46] | sphery: | paras: but you're better off using a logical device name |
| [22:18:22] | sphery: | unless you like to put your sound /hardware/ configuration into MythTV (versus putting it in the, er, sound hardware configuration files--the ALSA conf files) |
| [22:18:23] | paras: | sphery, when i put ALSA:hw=1,0 in it, it always gets switched back to /dev/dsp (which is ok, but i prefer ALSA)... |
| [22:18:35] | sphery: | use ALSA:default |
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| [22:18:52] | wagnerrp: | he means for framegrabber audio capture, not for output |
| [22:19:03] | paras: | wagnerrp, yes right |
| [22:19:23] | sphery: | and "I prefer ALSA" is like saying, "I prefer to use MS Bing because it's written in .NET instead of Google, which uses <whatever language that isn't .NET>" |
| [22:19:28] | paras: | i am using the cx88_alsa kernel module for grabbing the TV audio directly from PCI bus |
| [22:19:42] | paras: | no need for passthroo cable |
| [22:20:21] | paras: | well for sound output mythtv accepts ALSA device descriptions, why not for sound input ? |
| [22:20:28] | sphery: | it does |
| [22:20:31] | Dagmar: | paras: Getting ALSA to behave long enough to pin that device down to a specific number is th ereal trick |
| [22:20:54] | sphery: | paras: just have to configure properly |
| [22:21:18] | sphery: | as many times as I have to look up the stupid ticket number for that one, you'd think I'd remember the search terms |
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| [22:23:00] | sphery: | absolutely no config info in the ticket: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/3405 |
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| [22:24:24] | iamlindoro: | Come on, there's a patch right there ;) |
| [22:24:39] | sphery: | heh |
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| [22:24:49] | sphery: | it is easier to look through that than through all of myth's code |
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| [22:25:04] | sphery: | (especially when stuff moves around in the code) |
| [22:25:19] | stephane_: | hi here |
| [22:25:38] | paras: | sphery, looks like it's not in 0.21 |
| [22:26:05] | paras: | but no big problem, i'll be using /dev/dsp1 until then |
| [22:26:08] | sphery: | paras: ah, yeah, it's not |
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| [22:26:31] | sphery: | I forgot (already) that you were using 0.21-fixes |
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| [22:26:37] | stephane_: | i have the problem of a buggy channel when i start mythtv, it opens on it , how do i change the default channel ? |
| [22:26:41] | sphery: | but OSS emu works fine |
| [22:26:48] | paras: | yep it does |
| [22:27:00] | sphery: | it's just using a different API, so unless you /really/ have problems with the method names, there's no real difference |
| [22:27:17] | sphery: | (Oh, and it means your kernel has to be configured with CONFIG_SOUND_PRIME, but no biggie...) |
| [22:27:24] | paras: | was just thinking, mythtv is using ALSA for output, so why not for input... |
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| [22:27:50] | sphery: | yeah |
| [22:28:05] | sphery: | I hope that ALSA dies a quick death and we move all of *nix to OSS4 :) |
| [22:28:41] | sphery: | (only because it has a lot of design improvements as well as usability improvements over ALSA) |
| [22:28:52] | sphery: | ALSA is proof that design by committee doesn't work :) |
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| [22:31:08] | paras: | ok, next question: how can i tell mythtv to move transcoded files into a different directory ? |
| [22:31:18] | iamlindoro: | Three cheers for design by dictatorship! |
| [22:31:26] | wagnerrp: | you create a user job to do so |
| [22:32:05] | kormoc: | iamlindoro: and if you don't cheer, you get shot? |
| [22:32:18] | iamlindoro: | darn right |
| [22:32:21] | sphery: | paras: the built-in transcoder transcodes "in place" so to speek. If you want to move to a non-Myth directory, you can either use user jobs or you can use nuvexport or some other external transcoder |
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| [22:32:48] | jams: | either way you get shot...the cheering is just a way to pinpoint people quicker |
| [22:33:17] | ** kormoc ponders and slowly sneaks backwards out the door ** | |
| [22:34:40] | iamlindoro: | Hooray for web setup apps! |
| [22:34:46] | paras: | great, nuvexport is masked in gentoo.... |
| [22:34:58] | iamlindoro: | Design by dictatorship works! Let me just fire up my... backend IP and... I... |
| [22:35:11] | iamlindoro: | Wait, guys, my backend web setup app isn't working for some reason |
| [22:37:35] | paras: | arrgh where to create user jobs.... i already did define 2 storage groups... livetv and transcoded |
| [22:37:40] | paras: | but where are user jobs |
| [22:37:50] | paras: | 0.22 right ? |
| [22:37:52] | wagnerrp: | mythtv-setup, general settings, several pages in |
| [22:40:09] | paras: | oh yeah, there it is :) |
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| [23:05:48] | stephane_: | i have the problem of a buggy channel when i start mythtv, it opens on it , how do i change the default channel ? |
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| [23:08:00] | justinh: | hahahaha www.protector.com – awesome. Simply awesome |
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| [23:19:00] | sphery: | yay, one more setting killed |
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| [23:23:53] | ** sphery throws a dart at his screen with the "Proposed settings rework" thread displayed ** | |
| [23:25:15] | ** justinh holds back from pressing send on the 'mythtv-users mailing list annoyances' email ** | |
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| [23:42:51] | binder_010110: | i have a question about audio support. i have SPDIF audio working with mythtv using a digital coaxial cable but using a digital fiber cable does not work with mythtv. the digital fiber cable works just fine when watching a dvd with mplayer. any suggestions? |
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| [23:49:21] | justinh: | the type of cable should be immaterial |
| [23:49:44] | justinh: | maybe both digital outputs aren't designed to work at the same time |
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| [23:50:05] | sphery: | justinh: if you hit send, it would actually be one message in there worth reading |
| [23:51:20] | binder_010110: | yeah, that's what i was thinking too but for some reason mythtv doesn't output any audio on the fiber output. i've tried them both together and separate with the same results. it outputs on both because i can switch the source on my stereo while playing a dvd with mplayer. |
| [23:52:02] | sphery: | which means you've configured Myth and mplayer differently |
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| [23:52:12] | sphery: | probably different audio devices |
| [23:52:25] | iamlindoro: | and very likely mplayer w/ pulse |
| [23:52:48] | ** sphery shudders ** | |
| [23:53:20] | kormoc: | So sadly pulse has a feature I'm very interested in :( |
| [23:53:24] | kormoc: | It support airtunes |
| [23:53:33] | binder_010110: | not using pulse because in mplayer i set the ao to alsa:device=spdif and ac to hwac3 |
| [23:53:48] | iamlindoro: | kormoc, we sorta-kinda support it now in trunk |
| [23:53:50] | sphery: | kormoc: you mean audio recordings of people playing air guitars? |
| [23:54:01] | binder_010110: | in mythtv i set the audio to alsa:default or alsa:spdif |
| [23:54:24] | kormoc: | sphery: nah, apple's airport expresses work as remote audio endpoints (they have a speaker jack), so you can setup multiroom audio with them |
| [23:54:36] | sphery: | ah, cool |
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| [23:55:49] | kormoc: | I have it working now with my mythbox with the airport express going line-in to the mythbox and line-out goes to the tv, so if I'm doing music, it goes out the tv or if I'm doing myth, but it'd be nicer to get myth to send out to all of them so if I'm watching tv, the audio is everywhere |
| [23:56:02] | kormoc: | the massive 2 hours of tv per week I get to watch |
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| [23:56:20] | Dagmar: | But it's not about the music |
| [23:56:29] | Dagmar: | It's about having alien-looking artifacts scattered around the house. |
| [23:56:33] | iamlindoro: | kormoc, That's not even enough for all the Chuck this week :) |
| [23:56:48] | paras: | does anyone know how to display teletext pages in vlc ? i'm asking because i want to know if i am able to see teletext pages at all |
| [23:57:00] | Dagmar: | iamlindoro: yeah I wonder what they're thinking there |
| [23:57:49] | sphery: | gotta clear out the eps so they can cancel it, of course |
| [23:58:17] | kormoc: | "We gave it a fair run... at 3:30 am... in Zimbabwe..." |
| [23:58:45] | iamlindoro: | freaking NBC |
| [23:58:55] | iamlindoro: | trying to make themselves a cheap buy for Comcast I guess |
| [23:58:59] | Dagmar: | Three hours of it in two days is actually kind of a serious committment for a sitcom |
| [23:59:04] | Dagmar: | ...and then Heroes directly after. |
| [23:59:06] | iamlindoro: | I feel bad for Conan |
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| [23:59:27] | kormoc: | move to the west coast to get moved back east |
| [23:59:36] | Dagmar: | This is more TV in a few days than I really want to watch |
| [23:59:47] | Dagmar: | I feel like I *have* to cut the commercials just so I can have some non-TV time. |
| [23:59:54] | iamlindoro: | Bearing years of late late night, ostensibly being told the whole time he would get the tonight show, only to have NBC screw him a few months later |
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