Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Tuesday, July 28th, 2009, 00:01 UTC

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mkrufky:

so, ive been building a LOT of mythboxes lately..... i notice these ones i been making are more robust... either starting with newer codebase is helping, or maybe i just made mistakes on my old ones

[00:02:47]

Dagmar:

Likely the latter

[00:02:50]

mkrufky:

anyway, my questionb — my server at home gets mad whenever the IP address changes

[00:03:01]

mkrufky:

but all the new ones i built just adjhust accordingly

[00:03:08]

Dagmar:

"gets mad" meaning?

[00:03:13]

mkrufky:

now my server at home is running jaunty — ive just been upgrading each time

[00:03:14]

Shadow_M:

maybe dns is nicer

[00:03:22]

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[00:03:25]

mkrufky:

mysql wont start, so mythbackend fails

[00:03:38]

Dagmar:

You hard-coded an IP address into mysql's config

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[00:03:53]

mkrufky:

is that the bind-address in my.cnf?

[00:03:57]

kormoc:

yeah

[00:04:08]

Dagmar:

The moment you do that it'll break if the IP changes because it can't bind to the specific IP address that you told it to use that's no longer on the box.

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[00:04:31]

kormoc:

if you just leave it commented, it'll bind to all ips, dynamically, which is fine if you're inside a private network

[00:04:43]

Dagmar:

That option is meant to be used when you have multiple interfaces/aliases and want the sucker listning on one specific one of them

[00:04:47]

mkrufky:

i have bind-address commented out, so that i can control my frontends using mymote

[00:04:52]

abarbaccia:

kormoc: i thought default was to 127.0.0.1

[00:04:53]

mkrufky:

(ipod app)

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kormoc:

abarbaccia, it's defaulted to be set to that, but if you comment it out, it'll be *, and vanilla mysql has it as commented out

[00:05:40]

twobitsprite:

does mythtv not run in windows?

[00:05:45]

mkrufky:

it *is* default to 127.0.0.1 ... but i have it commented out and i still have this problem .... there's probably another setting somewhere that i probably set a long time ago when i THOUGHT i knew what i was doing.... (nowadays i dont even claim to know what im doing but things usually work out)

[00:07:17]

Dagmar:

twobitsprite: It doesn't.

[00:07:23]

iamlindoro:

twobitsprite, It is possible to compile and run mythfrontend (not the backend) in windows, but it is an unsupported configuration

[00:07:41]

kormoc:

mkrufky, so what's the error in mysql's log?

[00:07:47]

twobitsprite:

hrm

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[00:07:54]

mkrufky:

brb phone call .. .sorry

[00:07:59]

Dagmar:

mkrufky: By default it doesn't bind to *any* IP

[00:08:01]

twobitsprite:

anyone know of a UPnP server (other than the M$ one) for windows?

[00:08:03]

iamlindoro:

twobitsprite, Someone has recently done the work to bring basic backend functionality to windows, but thos patches are still pending and rely on you using an HDHomeRun as your capture device

[00:08:58]

Dagmar:

tcp 0 0 0.0.0.0:3306 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN 14169/mysqld

[00:08:59]

iamlindoro:

twobitsprite, Playon?

[00:09:07]

Dagmar:

Note the 0.0.0.0. It's listening on all interfaces.

[00:09:10]

iamlindoro:

twobitsprite, http://www.themediamall.com/playon

[00:09:21]

Shadow_M:

tversity too

[00:09:30]

Shadow_M:

media tomb

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[00:09:49]

iamlindoro:

twobitsprite, Without a doubt, though, if all you want is a uPnP server, myth would be a bad choice

[00:10:19]

Dagmar:

I know my myth box isn't doing anything at the moment so I shelled over into it, stopped everything, commented out skip-networking and restarted the sqld

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[00:24:50]

mkrufky:

ok, sorry about that

[00:25:16]

mkrufky:

for some reason my mysql.err and mysql.log files are 0 bytes

[00:25:24]

mkrufky:

and nothing at all is in /var/log/mysql/

[00:25:31]

kormoc:

hrm, so when you run the init.d script, what does it say?

[00:25:46]

mkrufky:

init.d/mysql restart ?

[00:25:49]

kormoc:

aye

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mkrufky:

http://pastebin.com/m6a1940d3

[00:26:45]

mkrufky:

everything looks fine there

[00:26:58]

kormoc:

I bet you have some corrupt tables

[00:26:58]

mkrufky:

oh, but this is after ive already reset the IP address

[00:27:07]

kormoc:

ooh, so it's running?

[00:27:26]

mkrufky:

yeah ... apologies — i was explaining earlier then i had a phone call

[00:27:30]

mkrufky:

i'll repeat

[00:27:54]

mkrufky:

all my other backends that ive built lately deal well when DHCP assigns a new IP address

[00:28:03]

Dagmar:

argh I'd help but I'm having low brain power due to lack of food

[00:28:11]

mkrufky:

however, my backend at home cant deal with the IP changing

[00:28:13]

Dagmar:

If it's still effed in 30–60 minutes i'll be useful again

[00:28:23]

mkrufky:

everything works fine

[00:28:28]

Dagmar:

Don't bind it to a specific IP address

[00:28:34]

mkrufky:

this is something id like to just PREVENT from breaking again in the future

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[00:28:37]

** kormoc nods **

[00:28:50]

kormoc:

so is it when DHCP changes while mysql is actively running?

[00:28:50]

mkrufky:

and it is not bound in /etc/mysql/my.conf //. the bind-address is ## out

[00:28:50]

Dagmar:

...or set up some static leases

[00:28:54]

kormoc:

or it changes on boot?

[00:28:56]

** Dagmar goes to find food **

[00:29:10]

Dagmar:

kormoc: Binding to 0.0.0.0 will be unaffected by that

[00:29:20]

mkrufky:

i can do a static lease ... but that doesnt fix the real problem

[00:29:27]

Dagmar:

...and IPs at home shoudln't change like that unless the DHCP server is seriously retarded

[00:29:42]

Dagmar:

We're talking parents-that-are-brother-and-sister retarded, too

[00:29:46]

mkrufky:

clearly something in mysql is making it bind to the old IP address despite the bind-address line being commented out

[00:30:46]

mkrufky:

you're right, but again ..... the cause of the IP address changing is a separate issue — the point is that all the new backends that ive built dont care if the ip changes, and the only backend that I actually care about dies when the IP address changes

[00:30:54]

sphery:

mkrufky: you sure it's not the Network Manager starts/sets up network too late thing?

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[00:31:06]

mkrufky:

sphery: that is ALSO a problem on this machine

[00:31:16]

mkrufky:

i thought that was a separate issue

[00:31:19]

mkrufky:

no?

[00:31:36]

sphery:

I'm pretty sure if network doesn't exist when you start mysql Bad Things (TM) happen

[00:31:41]

mkrufky:

yes

[00:32:07]

sphery:

unfortunately, I don't know any details of how to fix the NM stuff... Most people said they "ripped it out"

[00:32:12]

iamlindoro:

yep

[00:32:25]

iamlindoro:

apt-get remove network-manager network-manager-gnome

[00:32:27]

mkrufky:

maybe thats it exactly

[00:32:54]

mkrufky:

this is the only machine of all the installs that have that NM problem

[00:32:57]

iamlindoro:

edit /etc/network/interfaces and add an assignment for eth0, ifdown and ifup it, and you should be good

[00:32:58]

mkrufky:

how do i rip it out ? ;-)

[00:33:16]

iamlindoro:

see above

[00:33:23]

mkrufky:

iamlindoro: that will solve the problem, but it wont make me happy

[00:33:26]

mkrufky:

oh ok

[00:33:30]

mkrufky:

gotcha :-/

[00:33:35]

Shadow_M:

hey mkrufky

[00:33:56]

Shadow_M:

hey iam

[00:33:58]

sphery:

I think NM"s goal is to not make people happy

[00:34:00]

mkrufky:

hey, Shadow_M

[00:34:11]

iamlindoro:

mkrufky, You're going to want local access before you run the apt-get part

[00:34:20]

iamlindoro:

since you'll lose an ssh connection when you do that

[00:34:24]

mkrufky:

im in front of that box now

[00:34:45]

iamlindoro:

mkrufky, A myth backend shoudl have a static IP anyway

[00:34:48]

mkrufky:

the trubk built one ? its a foot away from me but i didnt try anything yet

[00:34:51]

Shadow_M:

iamlindoro, i dont know if you read before but i finally emailed the scte65scan guy apparently they are brouadcasting information out of the scte65 spec here

[00:34:56]

iamlindoro:

(or a reserved DHCP address)

[00:39:59]

sphery:

"This preview of the upcoming season of Lost is brought to you by your Local Authorized Mercedes Benz dealer." Sounds too long... How about, "This preview of the upcoming season of Lost is brought to you by your LAMB dealer."

[00:40:14]

kormoc:

sphery, yummy

[00:40:15]

sphery:

(don't worry, mkrufky, it's the preview of season 5--I'm catching up :)

[00:40:42]

mkrufky:

;-)

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mkrufky:

ok, i fixed the problem ..... i found some *other* copy of my.conf that i didnt realize was being used instead of the one i changed

[00:44:30]

sphery:

heh, fun

[00:45:29]

mkrufky:

so anyway ... yeah a backend SHOULD be static — i agree ,... i just wanted my setup to be a bit more robust ... such that i can pick up my backend and drop it into somebody else's network and not have to reconfigure everything

[00:46:24]

sphery:

except, of course, myth

[00:46:29]

kormoc:

You know, I think a perfect ending to lost would be if they actually physically lost the last season's masters. That'd be epic amusing

[00:46:30]

mkrufky:

yes

[00:46:44]

sphery:

heh, I'm enjoying S5

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[00:47:51]

mkrufky:

i think mythbackend will still record without having to be reconfigured if i dropped it into another network

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mkrufky:

but streaming wouldnt work until it was reconfigured

[00:49:30]

wagnerrp:

if you set everything to localhost

[00:51:57]

mkrufky:

lol that's not gonna happen

[00:51:59]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, How could streaming or uPnP work that way?

[00:52:07]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, uPnP relies on a real, fixed IP

[00:52:17]

iamlindoro:

and localhost wouldn't allow streaming to myth frontends

[00:52:25]

wagnerrp:

the only way the backend would record would be if everything were set to localhost

[00:52:28]

Dagmar:

Yay good obtained

[00:52:30]

mkrufky:

btw, i think its really strange that this mymote app depends on database access

[00:52:31]

Dagmar:

er food

[00:52:38]

wagnerrp:

otherwise, he would have a different IP, one not set as the master backend

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[00:52:53]

mkrufky:

Dagmar: food *is* good

[00:52:56]

wagnerrp:

so it would think it was a slave and fail trying to connect

[00:53:19]

Dagmar:

mkrufky: Yeah, but while I'm not technically diabetic, I do get downright _retarded_ when I am out of calories

[00:53:29]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, All it would need would be a fixed IP

[00:53:30]

Dagmar:

Anyway, what DHCP server are you using?

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[00:53:46]

Dagmar:

If it's ISC's dhcpd this is easy to work around

[00:53:46]

mkrufky:

a linksys BEFSR81

[00:53:48]

wagnerrp:

assuming the network range is the same

[00:53:51]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, it might not have network connectivity, but it would record

[00:53:56]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, Wouldn't even matter,

[00:53:59]

Dagmar:

Ah... Hmm.. Doesn't that support assignment of static leases?

[00:53:59]

iamlindoro:

it would still record

[00:54:02]

mkrufky:

nope

[00:54:04]

Dagmar:

I know the WRT54g I have does

[00:54:09]

mkrufky:

i wish it did

[00:54:09]

stoth:

mkrufky: you got a minute to test a 2250 patch?

[00:54:10]

Dagmar:

Damn that's annoying

[00:54:15]

mkrufky:

stoth: sure

[00:54:18]

stoth:

(evening all btw)

[00:54:25]

iamlindoro:

hi stoth

[00:54:35]

iamlindoro:

stoth, You can just send me a 2250 and I'll test whatever you like ;)

[00:55:00]

stoth:

hey iamlindoro, mkrufky always said you were strictly an Avermedia guy! ;)

[00:55:02]

wagnerrp:

you could always just add into your mythbackend init scripts to check the IP, and then log into the sql database and change them

[00:55:08]

iamlindoro:

stoth, LIES!

[00:55:09]

mkrufky:

lol i said nothing like that

[00:55:10]

Dagmar:

mkrufky: You don't need to reconfigure anything to have "just" the backend work on another network

[00:55:13]

** stoth grins **

[00:55:22]

sphery:

it wouldn't record without a master backend to tell it to record and if the local IP isn't the one configured as the master backend ip, it would start as a slave... pretty sure wagnerrp is exactly right

[00:55:40]

Dagmar:

mkrufky: Under "normal" circumstances mysqld has no problem working with unix sockets, which is why there's a difference between telling it the string 'localhost' and telling it to use 127.0.0.1

[00:55:44]

wagnerrp:

sphery: hes saying the IP would be set completely statically

[00:55:55]

wagnerrp:

instead of statically defined over DHCP

[00:55:58]

iamlindoro:

sphery, if it's a static IP, it will record fine

[00:56:05]

Dagmar:

UNIX sockets are not IP-based in the least and don't touch the network at all

[00:56:06]

iamlindoro:

been there, done that :)

[00:56:11]

sphery:

oh, I thought we were talking about dropping it on another network

[00:56:18]

wagnerrp:

so the computer would just be disconnected from the rest of the network until he fixed things

[00:56:26]

iamlindoro:

sphery, we are-- I'm just saying that network connectivity doesn't matter if you set a static IP

[00:56:29]

wagnerrp:

assuming the network used different addresses

[00:56:32]

sphery:

I see

[00:56:38]

iamlindoro:

sphery, you won't be able to pull listings/browse, but you can record

[00:56:39]

Dagmar:

mkrufky: I'm assuming you have separate frontend and backend machines, right?

[00:56:54]

mkrufky:

lol, guys... .i know setting the IP as static would have avoided my problem ... i wanted the extra mile and wanted my machine to not bitch if its IP changes .... a recording should never fail — regardless of whatever stupidity happens on my network

[00:57:00]

mkrufky:

meanwhile, i fixed it

[00:57:04]

mkrufky:

so dont worry :-)

[00:57:10]

Dagmar:

It should *not* fail just because your IP address changed.

[00:57:13]

Dagmar:

I'm dead serious about that

[00:57:14]

iamlindoro:

mkrufky, It's more an academic discussion than an argument

[00:57:16]

mkrufky:

yes i have 1 backend and many frontends

[00:57:45]

Dagmar:

So long as the backend lives on the same machine as the MySQL server you should be able to tell it 'localhost' if I'm remembering this correctly.

[00:57:45]

sphery:

when he said a backend should be static, but he wanted his more robust, I assumed that meant it wasn't configured as a static IP

[00:58:34]

Dagmar:

It'll break the frontend machines connecting to the backend and mysqld if that host changes IP but the backend shoudn't be bothered by much at all

[00:59:12]

Dagmar:

...and it's generally time to pull out sawed-off and shoot the router if it's DHCP daemon isn't allowing clients to reobtain their previous IP address

[00:59:39]

Dagmar:

At the halfway mark to their lease expiration time they're supposed to request a refresh of the lease for that IP address

[01:00:00]

sphery:

I'm just saying: bool ismaster = gContext->IsMasterHost(); if (ismaster) { cerr << "Starting up as the master server.\n"; }

[01:00:07]

Dagmar:

Add to that that if an IP address is not currently leased to anyone and it's in the purview of the DHCP server the DHCP server is supposed to honor requests for a specific IP address

[01:00:24]

sphery:

where: bool MythContext::IsMasterHost(void) { QString myip = gContext->GetSetting("BackendServerIP"); QString masterip = gContext->GetSetting("MasterServerIP"); return (masterip == myip); }

[01:01:06]

sphery:

but since it's using BackendServerIP from DB, I suppose it would work.

[01:01:17]

Dagmar:

OUch

[01:01:18]

sphery:

but only for the master backend

[01:01:58]

Dagmar:

WHat was the thinking in having that code look at IP addresses in the first place?

[01:03:24]

sphery:

well, it comes down to the fact that the IP is the only unique identifier of hosts in a Myth system

[01:03:30]

sphery:

patches gladly considered

[01:04:53]

Dagmar:

I've considered it, really I have

[01:05:09]

Dagmar:

I keep hoping I'll have some epiphany about what was going on initially before I start that tho

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wagnerrp:

glenhawk needs work on trying to write readable messages

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[01:40:35]

iamlindoro:

His idea also sounds awful

[01:41:03]

wagnerrp:

honestly, how much power does a tuner card take...

[01:41:12]

Dagmar:

12–15w

[01:41:25]

Dagmar:

Probably as high as 18 for the ones that encode

[01:41:37]

wagnerrp:

i mean idle

[01:41:42]

wagnerrp:

not recording

[01:41:47]

Dagmar:

There's a limit to how much you can draw from a PCI port but I can't remember it

[01:41:54]

Dagmar:

Idle? Probably like 1w

[01:42:06]

Dagmar:

it doesn't take much power for something to sit there and do nothing

[01:42:34]

Dagmar:

I may have to go to Comic Con next year

[01:42:43]

wagnerrp:

im just thinking why move all the tuner cards out to slave BEs

[01:42:51]

Dagmar:

Disney dropped trailers for both Tron: Legacy and Alice In Wonderland there

[01:43:03]

Dagmar:

wagnerrp: Insanity

[01:43:15]

Dagmar:

He's taking his architecture tips from the leprechauns

[01:43:15]

wagnerrp:

you might save 15W total, as opposed to having a full ATX board with all the tuners there

[01:43:56]

wagnerrp:

and i personally just wouldnt even bother running an atom as a file server

[01:43:57]

Dagmar:

Is he plugging the slaves into the neighbor's wall outlets?

[01:44:13]

wagnerrp:

no, but he intends to turn them off dynamically

[01:44:14]

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[01:44:17]

Dagmar:

How can one possibly save power by moving the cards around unless the idea is somehow to turn off the master backend

[01:44:35]

Dagmar:

He's wasting his time doing that

[01:44:40]

wagnerrp:

he wants to make a low power tunerless master

[01:44:46]

Dagmar:

Unused those cards are almost certainly less than a watt each

[01:44:46]

wagnerrp:

and move the slaves out to his FEs

[01:45:05]

Dagmar:

He'll burn more electricity just from increased network load

[01:45:44]

Dagmar:

This is what happens when people theorize without ever bothering with anything as simple as BUYING A KILL-A-WATT to test their theories

[01:46:32]

wagnerrp:

theyre impressed by the advertised 20–30W consumptions of atom boxes

[01:46:47]

wagnerrp:

not knowing that a full machine with a midrange core2 only pulls ~50W idle?

[01:50:12]

sphery:

exactly...

[01:50:15]

xris:

anyone know if deinterlacing is broken in trunk? I can't seem to actually see the deinterlacing work with vdpau

[01:50:50]

sphery:

low power CPU's are easy to find--and don't have mean low performance (like atom)

[01:51:31]

iamlindoro:

xris, it's working here

[01:51:47]

xris:

HMM

[01:51:49]

xris:

hmm

[01:53:15]

iamlindoro:

VDPAU + Temporal 2x on 1080i material

[01:53:57]

xris:

I'm looking at 480i

[01:55:06]

xris:

hmm, and I'm running in auto AIGLX mode.. wonder how to use that to change my refresh rate to 120hz

[01:55:22]

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[01:57:21]

superdug:

sphery: hey! don't talk crap about the atom

[02:01:31]

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[02:01:33]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, the HVR-1800's analog side will not work in Myth at the moment due to a (known) driver bug... when the driver bug gets fixed and you update your drivers, it will work.

[02:01:52]

waterfoul:

myth doesn't seem to be changing the channel on the analog side of my WinTV-HVR-1800 when I tell it to, I get a picture (of channel 2) but it doesn't change at all

[02:02:10]

xris:

iamlindoro: maybe aiglx or something is getting in the way. I don't even know how to see what refresh rate it chose.

[02:02:22]

iamlindoro:

xris, nor I

[02:02:24]

waterfoul:

well whaty can I use to view it, tvtime will only give me the same picture on 2 and all others are a black box

[02:02:56]

Dagmar:

At a guess, you're using an STB (set top box), yes?

[02:03:49]

waterfoul:

no direct connection

[02:03:54]

Dagmar:

..but if iamlindoro says there's a driver problem that means it won't work, he's probably right

[02:04:03]

waterfoul:

*no, direct connection

[02:04:07]

Dagmar:

I gotcah

[02:04:10]

Dagmar:

er gotcha

[02:09:24]

waterfoul:

si what exactly is the driver problem?

[02:09:28]

waterfoul:

*so

[02:09:50]

Dagmar:

A bug that prevents it from changing channels. :)

[02:18:48]

iamlindoro:

It does not handle ioctls properly. At least two linuxtv devs have worked on it, and are working on a solution

[02:23:42]

waterfoul:

ok is there anywhere I can get progress info?

[02:23:55]

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[02:24:01]

waterfoul:

so I know when its fed

[02:24:05]

waterfoul:

*fixed

[02:24:21]

Dagmar:

You can try the mailing list they talk about at http://www.linuxtv.org/

[02:25:41]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, The only place the bugfix is likely to be referenced is the linuxtv commit logs

[02:25:54]

waterfoul:

ok

[02:26:16]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, http://www.kernellabs.com/blog/

[02:26:31]

iamlindoro:

There is some reference to the code cleanup and fixes halfway down that page, and they are likely to post a blog when it's fixed

[02:27:08]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, Actually, it seems there have found a fix, but the changes are not yet committed to v4l-dvb

[02:27:15]

iamlindoro:

http://www.kernellabs.com/blog/?p=551

[02:27:19]

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[02:27:27]

iamlindoro:

but you can probably pull down the branch and try it if you like

[02:27:42]

iamlindoro:

Ah, no, that fix is not all of the problem

[02:27:59]

iamlindoro:

Shadow_M, Confirm your 1800 still does not work after mkrufky's fix?

[02:28:08]

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[02:28:37]

mkrufky:

mo its not fixed yet

[02:28:40]

mkrufky:

^no

[02:28:40]

iamlindoro:

or mkrufky, you may be able to shed some light on whether/when it will be fixed for waterfoul

[02:28:43]

iamlindoro:

there ya go

[02:28:51]

mkrufky:

it should be fixed soon, just isnt yet, unfortunately

[02:29:27]

iamlindoro:

thanks

[02:29:53]

Dagmar:

Make it a monthy ritual to check up on

[02:32:25]

Dagmar:

Once a month it won't be a big waste of yer time, and it's enough of a buffer so that once it gets out of "broken" state you're less likely to be getting it still in the "almost not broken yet" state

[02:35:26]

waterfoul:

where chan i see the broken/not broken status?

[02:36:26]

waterfoul:

according to http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV-HVR-1800 if I build from the repos it should work is this correct?

[02:36:27]

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[02:38:06]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, you are misunderstanding-- both side of the card are *functional*, but the driver has a bug that makes it impossible to change channels in analog, as you are experiencing

[02:38:18]

iamlindoro:

I *promise* there is no further up to date info, as the person *working* on the bug has already spoken

[02:38:26]

iamlindoro:

And it doesn't get any mroe current than that

[02:39:01]

iamlindoro:

So no other repository will fix your problem, and you are not going to see a solution tonight, sorry to say

[02:42:58]

superdug:

iamlindoro: uhhh, he could get the latest svn and fix the bug himself :)

[02:43:42]

iamlindoro:

Yes, well, let me know when that's done

[02:43:53]

waterfoul:

sorry for being persistent but if you look at http://www.kernellabs.com/hg/~stoth/v4l-dvb/ which is linked to by the blogpost above it says "cx23885–417: fix broken IOCTL handling

[02:44:06]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, Did you see who committed that? Now read the scrollback

[02:44:10]

waterfoul:

" does that mean if I grab his repo that will fix it?

[02:44:13]

iamlindoro:

NO

[02:44:16]

Dagmar:

lol

[02:44:17]

iamlindoro:

NO NO NO

[02:44:20]

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[02:44:23]

Dagmar:

So innocent, so trusting

[02:44:28]

superdug:

waterfoul: maybe

[02:44:34]

Dagmar:

Don't believe everything you read in a changelog.

[02:44:34]

iamlindoro:

superdug, NO

[02:44:42]

iamlindoro:

superdug, waterfoul GROUP NO

[02:45:06]

iamlindoro:

"8 days ago Michael Krufky cx23885–417: fix broken IOCTL handling"

[02:45:08]

Dagmar:

Changlogs on beta-level stuff are generally to be considered aspirational more than informational.

[02:45:16]

iamlindoro:

"<mkrufky> no its not fixed yet"

[02:45:23]

iamlindoro:

engage brains

[02:45:39]

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[02:45:40]

waterfoul:

sorry, I just didn't make the connection

[02:45:41]

superdug:

but ... wheres the fun i nthat?

[02:45:59]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, I spelled it out for you quite simply

[02:46:04]

iamlindoro:

"<iamlindoro> I *promise* there is no further up to date info, as the person *working* on the bug has already spoken"

[02:46:13]

iamlindoro:

"<iamlindoro> So no other repository will fix your problem, and you are not going to see a solution tonight, sorry to say"

[02:46:20]

iamlindoro:

I'm not making it up as I go along

[02:46:26]

superdug:

maybe he can't read between asterisks?

[02:46:48]

waterfoul:

ok i'll just watch that blog then

[02:47:07]

superdug:

waterfoul: be ever vigilant !

[02:47:47]

** waterfoul loves rss **

[02:48:13]

superdug:

you know what would be helpful is if people would read what hardware is supported before they try and make it work

[02:48:46]

iamlindoro:

superdug, Is that statement meant to be relevant to this problem?

[02:48:57]

iamlindoro:

or are you just holding forth on what's wrong with people?

[02:49:01]

superdug:

not really...

[02:49:44]

superdug:

I mean to an extent ... maybe ... but I mean it's like the cups mailing list ... with people who have some just released proprietary copier printer and are angry they can't print from linux

[02:50:06]

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[02:50:16]

iamlindoro:

This problem has nothing to do with someone failing to read

[02:51:00]

** iamlindoro sighs, shakes his head **

[02:51:00]

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[02:51:11]

waterfoul:

btw does any one know the best setting to scan comcast dtv?

[02:51:39]

iamlindoro:

waterfoul, There's no "best," just "right"... *most* comcast systems woudl be us-cable and QAM-256

[02:51:59]

iamlindoro:

And be PATIENT

[02:52:12]

iamlindoro:

don't decide it's not working just because you don't find any channels in the first 80 or so

[02:52:22]

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[03:07:50]

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[03:09:38]

kormoc:

I HAVE KILLED THE WIFI MONSTER! The mini has WIFI!

[03:09:40]

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[03:10:46]

iamlindoro:

That's when I was sure kormoc had lost it, your honor

[03:11:22]

superdug:

kormoc: you finally got your mac delivered?

[03:11:40]

** kormoc laughs **

[03:11:59]

kormoc:

So the broadcom WL driver requires 2.6.28, but it's undocumented

[03:12:07]

kormoc:

Not newer, not older

[03:12:22]

superdug:

you put linux on a mac?

[03:13:08]

Dagmar:

Broadcom == poo

[03:13:17]

superdug:

b43

[03:13:48]

Shadow_M:

broadcom is bad stuff i can atest to that

[03:13:59]

superdug:

just use ndiswrapper like all the cool kids

[03:14:04]

kormoc:

the early 2009 mini's have a chipset that's unsupported by b43

[03:14:07]

clever:

ndiswrapper is somewhat unstable

[03:14:22]

kormoc:

the only drivers that support it are ndiswrapper and wl (broadcom's own driver)

[03:14:23]

clever:

i just put up with rtl818x.ko with the 802.11b card i have:P

[03:14:25]

Shadow_M:

ndiswrapper still gives horrible speeds

[03:14:40]

kormoc:

ndiswrapper's version requires SMP disabled, WL requires 2.6.28

[03:14:43]

Shadow_M:

even the native driver gives horrible speed

[03:15:00]

kormoc:

superdug, aye, I did

[03:15:00]

clever:

kormoc: i dont remember having to turn smp off when i used it

[03:16:04]

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[03:16:55]

kormoc:

clever, cause I'm sure you were using it with this specific 802.11n chipset...

[03:17:15]

clever:

ah, i think mine may be b/g

[03:17:44]

clever:

0c:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4311 802.11b/g WLAN (rev 01)

[03:17:48]

superdug:

kormoc: I was about to tell you I'm using WL with my broadcom

[03:17:53]

Shadow_M:

kormoc, you didnt try the native drivers

[03:17:57]

superdug:

but I'm on 2.6.28

[03:18:12]

kormoc:

Shadow_M, b43? I certainly did, my chipset is unsupported by it

[03:18:15]

superdug:

03:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4311 802.11b/g WLAN (rev 01)

[03:18:29]

superdug:

clever: omg lets be friends!

[03:19:01]

clever:

lol

[03:19:04]

clever:

dell d630?

[03:19:10]

kormoc:

superdug, yeah, I was working on 2.6.30.2 and it was just driving me crazy with connecting but unable to set the WPA stuff to the card, 2.6.28 works fine, 2.6.27 fails in a different, special way

[03:20:16]

superdug:

clever: well it's a dell mini-pci-e ... it's an acer aspire one ... I got the broadcom chip to make a netbook hackint0sh

[03:20:29]

clever:

ah

[03:20:44]

superdug:

kormoc: 2.6.30.2 ... you're using a vanilla kernel?

[03:20:49]

superdug:

do people even do that anymore?

[03:21:01]

clever:

superdug: now i remember what my main problem was, the last one

[03:21:16]

clever:

superdug: i was able to connect to a mac filtered network, without proper permision

[03:21:28]

clever:

superdug: and i cant connect at all, to my own network, unfiltered

[03:21:43]

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[03:21:43]

superdug:

that's a clever chipset indeed

[03:21:59]

clever:

yeah, its bypassing the mac filtering at the router

[03:22:08]

clever:

and then refusing to work when it doesnt exist

[03:22:24]

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[03:22:30]

superdug:

though mac filtering for security is the same as a "do not enter" sign on an open lawn

[03:22:47]

clever:

superdug: basicaly, i think the ap wont let unwanted mac's to link to the network

[03:23:00]

clever:

so id have to spoof a valid mac

[03:23:12]

superdug:

clever: capture arp ... spoof ... rinse repeat

[03:23:14]

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[03:23:17]

clever:

yet i'm not doing that and connected normaly without even noticing the security

[03:23:18]

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[03:23:34]

kormoc_:

superdug, you running on a new mini?

[03:23:39]

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[03:23:52]

superdug:

kormoc_: no, I don't own any "real" macs

[03:24:00]

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[03:24:24]

superdug:

kormoc_: but I'm pretty sure I have your wifi chipset in my netbook

[03:24:40]

kormoc_:

ahh

[03:24:45]

kormoc_:

Yeah, I run a vanilla kernel

[03:24:59]

superdug:

what distro ?

[03:25:06]

kormoc_:

I don't really care to have all the random distro patches, I'll apply them myself thank-you-very-much

[03:25:07]

kormoc_:

Gentoo

[03:25:11]

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[03:25:17]

superdug:

ohh wow ...

[03:25:30]

superdug:

gentoo ... vanilla kernels ...

[03:25:41]

superdug:

kormoc: next you're going to be telling me to get the hell off your lawn

[03:25:50]

** kormoc laughs **

[03:25:54]

kormoc:

wouldn't be the first time ;)

[03:26:23]

superdug:

yeah ... I've found pruning off the crap easier than building it all from the bottom up

[03:27:11]

kormoc:

It really doesn't take that long, this mini was a full base gentoo install, from the fsck of the filesystem to myth-setup running was slightly under 3 hours

[03:27:12]

superdug:

kormoc: however, for the b43 to behave correctly ... it still needed firmware ... I got it from the openwrt project I believe

[03:27:23]

kormoc:

Yeah, I had the firmware

[03:27:29]

superdug:

ohh still no go?

[03:27:41]

clever:

b43 broke on me a while ago so i had to switch to ndiswrapper

[03:27:44]

kormoc:

For my chipset, aye, no go, entirely unsupported by the b43

[03:27:52]

kormoc:

WL works fine now tho

[03:28:00]

superdug:

could get one of those wifi to ethernet adapters linksys makes :-)

[03:28:12]

kormoc:

heh, nah, this works fine

[03:28:38]

superdug:

you know ... everyone says atheros cards are a pain compared to broadcom

[03:28:51]

superdug:

yet I've never really had any real problems ... even with madwifi ... wasn't that bad

[03:29:05]

kormoc:

I have a atheros in my server, ath9k, works fairly well, but still has some oddness

[03:30:17]

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[03:31:53]

Shadow__X:

hey everyone something weird is happening after awhile my screen goes to black but no activity gets it to go back i can vnc and use it that way but the monitor still stays black

[03:33:22]

Shadow__X:

from the black screen it went to screensaver then i was able to use the remote to stop that and use it again

[03:40:02]

tank-man:

so the screensaver works, what is the problem?

[03:41:23]

Shadow__X:

screen saver works but it seems thst dpms is having the issue because my screen saver displays images but when i am having the issue the screen goes black and all i see is the mouse pointer

[03:41:36]

Shadow__X:

i can move that around but it still stays black

[03:44:01]

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[03:44:19]

wagnerrp:

you know... i dont understand these websites that do power consumption comparison between systems

[03:44:27]

wagnerrp:

just what are they measuring

[03:44:53]

Shadow__X:

the watts man its all about the watts

[03:45:25]

wagnerrp:

hothardware ran one a while back comparing an atom and a nano

[03:45:42]

wagnerrp:

and they threw in an A64 and Core2 system just for reference

[03:46:08]

wagnerrp:

the mainstream systems are consuming ~180W idle, and 210–250W under load

[03:46:10]

Shadow__X:

but its all relative

[03:46:14]

Shadow__X:

psu chipsets

[03:46:15]

Shadow__X:

cpu

[03:46:19]

Shadow__X:

everything

[03:46:35]

wagnerrp:

i just loaded up the software that comes with my ups, and its currently reading 173W load

[03:46:44]

wagnerrp:

now that is EVERYTHING on my desk

[03:46:44]

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[03:46:55]

wagnerrp:

that means three LCD monitors, my laptop, my printer

[03:47:29]

wagnerrp:

along with my desktop (2.2GHz C2 OC'd to 2.75), 4GB of memory, 3 hard drives, 2 video cards

[03:47:49]

wagnerrp:

and im STILL pulling less power than these systems theyre quoting

[03:48:11]

wagnerrp:

seriously, where are they getting these numbers

[03:50:12]

Dagmar:

Mebbe their kill-a-watt is broken

[03:52:20]

Shadow__X:

maybe they have 1 gtx 295

[03:52:28]

Shadow__X:

those things use alot of juice

[03:52:50]

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[03:53:46]

wagnerrp:

i mean my basement UPS, running 3 systems, 16 drives, 4GB of ram, 2 video cards, a raid card, two switches, a modem, 5 tuners, a phoneline adapter, a couple usb devices, some other stuff im probably forgetting

[03:53:51]

wagnerrp:

is only registering 325W

[03:55:13]

wagnerrp:

surely ive got several times the hardware in there as one of those systems, and im not even double the consumption

[04:17:39]

wagnerrp:

looks like im down to 156W on my desktop now

[04:44:23]

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[04:52:43]

qfe0:

I'm trying to connect a frontend to an existing system with a frontend and a backend. It seems like my new frontend is failing trying to connect to the old backend, (not mysql). Is there a place I should be looking to setup a connection to the mythbackend?

[04:55:06]

kormoc:

run mythtv-setup on the backend and make sure the ip addresses you have set for it are public (not 127.0.0.1)

[04:55:54]

qfe0:

ahh! ok. I'll take a look at that. Thanks

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wagnerrp:

qfe0: note those settings require an IP, hostname doesnt work

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qfe0:

sweet! that was it. thanks again!

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lwizardl:

hi

[05:17:16]

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[05:23:12]

lwizardl:

anyone here know much about video distribution? I'm looking to take a single line from my Mythbox and feed it into 6 displays all showing the same source

[05:35:45]

LiNERROR:

how are you connecting your displays?

[05:52:22]

lwizardl:

I was going to use rg6

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lwizardl:

with the screw on composite connectors. and the use the composite connector for the signal

[05:54:19]

lwizardl:

so basically long rca cables

[05:54:42]

kormoc:

so get a rca splitter?

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lwizardl:

thats what i was thinking

[05:55:50]

lwizardl:

but was just checking to see if there is a better way

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[06:02:16]

LiNERROR:

composite distribution amp...

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[06:27:58]

lwizardl:

th anks

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jduggan:

yawn

[08:27:05]

laga:

ack

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[08:56:19]

|dgs|:

is there anyway to lock the pcm and master mixer levels?

[09:06:29]

juski:

I just set them in alsamixer & stop mythfrontend using the mixer

[09:07:25]

juski:

if you're running it on a desktop machine, erm... just set the levels in alsamixer & disable the desktop volume control – and prolly disable mythfrontend using the mixer

[09:09:59]

|dgs|:

dedicated machine, but still need to be able to change it with the remote

[09:10:28]

juski:

so that isn't locking the mixer levels is it

[09:10:57]

juski:

you can choose which mixer level mythfrontend controls when it changes the volume

[09:11:10]

|dgs|:

just seems like both pcm and master mixer levels always get reset to quite low, and the remote can only increase one of them back up

[09:11:38]

juski:

use alsamixer to set both, then save them with alsactl store IIRC

[09:12:11]

|dgs|:

cool. i'll go have a read up about that.

[09:12:16]

|dgs|:

cheers =)

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[09:38:44]

juski:

http://regmedia.co.uk/2009/07/27/canvas_epg.png looks nice. pity it's just a concept shot

[09:39:10]

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[09:40:26]

juski:

really like the 3d effect they've done there. I think I'll be nicking that

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[09:48:49]

AndyCap:

gah, stupid google. when I search for gizmod I don't want gizmodo

[09:49:13]

anykey_:

juski: very nice, indeed

[09:49:34]

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[09:52:48]

jduggan:

juski: whats the 'concept' shot for?

[09:52:54]

jduggan:

it looks nice

[09:53:58]

juski:

jduggan: el reg on about the proposed common EPG for freeview etc

[09:54:04]

jduggan:

aah

[09:55:07]

juski:

I like that format for the EPG. certainly beats any grid I've ever seen

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[10:00:31]

AndyCap:

well, I dunno, hard to say from one pic though.

[10:01:27]

AndyCap:

it that the listing for itv2 or for whats on the respective channels. except that we cover up two to show our fancy pic.

[10:01:55]

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[10:02:02]

juski:

minor details

[10:02:14]

juski:

no need of the fancy pic at all IMHO

[10:04:31]

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[10:15:13]

patch0:

Hello

[10:16:01]

** patch0 is having an issue getting anything other than the theme background image showing on his myth box **

[10:16:11]

patch0:

It's an Ubuntu Jaunty install

[10:16:52]

patch0:

and I've tried changing video drivers (from nvidia to vesa) but that makes no difference

[10:17:12]

patch0:

I've had a good look around for answers in all the usual places, but I've had no success

[10:22:07]

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[10:34:34]

juski:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=my . . . aq=f&oq=

[10:41:14]

patch0:

That's not the issue, sadly

[10:41:46]

patch0:

Nor is the mesa stuff

[10:41:49]

juski:

ah then your opengl is broken

[10:41:59]

juski:

try mythfrontend -O ThemePainter=qt

[10:42:03]

patch0:

Nor that, this happens with both qt and opengl

[10:42:09]

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[10:42:10]

patch0:

And all themes

[10:42:21]

juski:

install MCE then. bye

[10:43:01]

anykey_:

patch0: did you install freetype?

[10:43:01]

patch0:

I'm happy with myth, it is just this issue, which is a bit of an issue

[10:43:16]

juski:

how can you be happy with myth if you can't *see* it? LOL

[10:43:27]

juski:

tried installing msttcorefonts?

[10:43:33]

patch0:

I've been using it for years :)

[10:43:46]

anykey_:

so what did you change?

[10:43:49]

juski:

so what changed?

[10:44:16]

patch0:

This started after the upgrade from intrepid to jaunty back in April

[10:44:23]

patch0:

But it has been an intermittent fault

[10:45:00]

juski:

I'll be giving Jaundiced Jackoff a miss then :)

[10:45:06]

patch0:

Yeah

[10:45:47]

laga:

patch0: have you checked the mythbuntu forums?

[10:52:29]

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[11:00:21]

patch0:

tbh I think it might be something to do with the session settings for that user.

[11:00:34]

patch0:

i.e. the window manager

[11:00:47]

laga:

try making a fresh user?

[11:00:48]

patch0:

Running the frontend under another user seems to work ok

[11:01:19]

patch0:

so yes, a fresh user might fix it, unless the bug is with the mythtv session set up by Ubuntu.

[11:01:29]

patch0:

in which case that is where the bug lies :)

[11:01:51]

juski:

try deleting the themecache dir in ~/.mythtv/ then

[11:01:59]

laga:

you can try using the mythbuntu session with your fresh user

[11:02:14]

patch0:

yeah, sometimes that fixes it

[11:02:43]

patch0:

I've taken to mounting the cache dir as a tmpfs partition so on reboot the themecache is not present

[11:02:55]

patch0:

but that doesn't work consistently

[11:03:04]

patch0:

I think I'll experiment with the new user

[11:03:08]

juski:

ruh?

[11:03:36]

juski:

mythfrontend *needs* the themecache dir – unless you *want* it to rescale images every time it starts

[11:03:53]

patch0:

that is exactly what I want it to do :)

[11:04:02]

juski:

and if it can't create the dir, god only knows what kind of problems you'd have

[11:04:30]

juski:

why would anybody *want* it to rescale the images every time?

[11:05:21]

patch0:

Because it was fixing the problems I was seeing...

[11:05:36]

patch0:

Or at least it seemed like it was

[11:05:52]

juski:

my bet is on the latter

[11:06:41]

patch0:

Anyway, I'll experiment running the frontend under a new userid

[11:13:52]

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[12:23:15]

** tanderson sends a cookie to stoth for his HVR-2250 drivers :) **

[12:23:29]

Shadow_X is now known as Shadow__X

[12:23:43]

stoth:

tanderson: thx, yummy! :)

[12:23:50]

Shadow__X:

hey stoth

[12:23:50]

laga:

nom

[12:24:02]

Shadow__X:

i would def send you some cookies

[12:24:20]

juski:

me want cookie. me like cookie!

[12:26:38]

stoth:

hey Shadow__X

[12:26:48]

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Shadow__X:

hows the ecookie

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Essobi:

Morning

[12:58:31]

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[13:27:24]

sgtpepper:

guys, is there any plugin around to see LiveTV via mythweb?

[13:27:35]

laga:

not an official one at least

[13:29:53]

juski:

like live tv isn't crap enough already, some people want it streamed in low bitrate flash video

[13:36:24]

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[13:40:08]

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[13:40:12]

backslash7:

Hey folks – Can I use a analog tv tuner card that is not supported /according to your wiki) and just do the encoding by software?

[13:40:15]

backslash7:

It's the Hauppauge WinTV 320

[13:40:17]

backslash7:

Not PVR

[13:40:34]

Shadow__X:

uh if its not supported

[13:40:37]

Shadow__X:

its not supported

[13:40:44]

Shadow__X:

check linuxtv.org

[13:40:51]

Shadow__X:

so see if its supported there

[13:40:57]

backslash7:

but does that mean that the hardware encoder isn't supported or that I won't be able to use the card *at all* ?

[13:41:08]

backslash7:

I have plenty of CPU resources left

[13:41:13]

backslash7:

I don't mind doing it by software

[13:41:22]

Shadow__X:

you wont beable to use the card

[13:41:26]

Shadow__X:

if its not supported

[13:41:27]

backslash7:

ok.. too bad

[13:41:30]

backslash7:

I'll check linuxtv

[13:41:31]

Shadow__X:

that means unsupported

[13:41:34]

backslash7:

thanks

[13:41:35]

Shadow__X:

check linuxtv

[13:41:37]

Shadow__X:

yup

[13:42:07]

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[13:42:15]

tmkt1:

Ola

[13:43:11]

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[13:54:54]

backslash7:

Shadow__X: My card is listed nowhere, neither as working, not working nor unknown.

[13:55:13]

Shadow__X:

backslash7, its not looking good for you sir

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[15:26:41]

pascalou:

hi again

[15:27:23]

pascalou:

iamlindoro: well the store has a wintv hvr 1100, would that works well , they dont have nova T in stocks

[15:27:44]

pascalou:

how would you class taht compared tot he terratec and nova t ?

[15:28:03]

iamlindoro:

I'm not familiar with the 1100, and don't know how various DVB-T cards compare against one another

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[15:34:33]

pascalou:

i can t seems to find a comparison between all teh capture cards online

[15:34:53]

pascalou:

the gpsx guy did a good job when doing his quality charts for webcam support and quality

[15:35:58]

iamlindoro:

I think you are overthinking it

[15:36:55]

iamlindoro:

Grab a well supported card (like the Nova T) and try. Order online if you have to, but get something that has had support for a long time.

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[15:37:16]

iamlindoro:

If *that* doesn't work, then you should be looking very very closely at how to improve your signal quality

[15:38:19]

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[15:45:10]

pascalou:

humm i ve found a review of usb tnt cards and at the end of teh article they said that they gad to cancel the review of pci cards because they were nto able to get a channel lock with any of them

[15:45:44]

pascalou:

thats on the french version of tomshardware (which does a lot less good reviews now than before btw)

[15:46:03]

pascalou:

ermm no , it s on clubic

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[15:56:59]

sphery:

gnome42: Thanks for fixing the missing :'s in the bindValue() calls... Makes me wonder how it even worked since the API says the colon /must/ be there. Would be nice if they actually enforced that rule so I'd have looked more closely.

[15:58:48]

gnome42:

heh, no problem. yeah, I was surprised it worked as well.

[16:01:19]

sphery:

Oh, and I'll leave out the useless size() calls next time--just went with the general approach used by the one query in that file...

[16:02:06]

sphery:

Should have known better, though... I wonder if I wrote that patch before I did the MSqlQuery::exec() return value patches (where I removed a ton of isActive() and size() calls that were useless).

[16:02:11]

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[16:04:23]

J-e-f-f-A:

hehe... just catching up on -users – love the reply to the 'cant compile on W7'... "Uninstall the (unreleased, beta) W7 OS..." ;-) hehehe

[16:04:43]

gnome42:

yeah, cool. Just thought I'd remove them while I was there. :)

[16:05:14]

J-e-f-f-A:

(just noticed that was the dev list, not even -users... Even funnier...)

[16:05:16]

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[16:05:39]

iamlindoro:

Heyyy, nice, getting Comedy Central HD in the next round of HD upgrades next month

[16:05:55]

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[16:06:28]

sphery:

iamlindoro: they should really rename it CoMeDee... It's what SciFi, er, SyFy, would do.

[16:06:44]

iamlindoro:

Now they just need to actually produce The Daily Show and Colbert in HD and I'll be all set...

[16:08:51]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, how did you find out about the hd upgrades

[16:09:22]

sphery:

I would tell gbee that the solution to saving power is to get a single atom system and have it run as your MySQL server, file server, master backend and--running 4 X sessions--multiple frontends.

[16:09:33]

sphery:

but that's not appropriate for dev channel

[16:09:42]

sphery:

^^^ these are the things I learn on the -users list

[16:09:50]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: engadgethd... it's regional, though, not nationwide

[16:10:15]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: Comcast rolls out new channels per-market... but my market has a tendency to get new things first

[16:10:25]

Shadow__X:

yes so i have noticed

[16:10:43]

meshe:

sphery: mysql on an Atom? that is soo not a good idea

[16:11:06]

sphery:

meshe: but, but, but... the list!

[16:11:30]

** meshe laughs as MFD brings the Atom to it's knees **

[16:12:02]

Shadow__X:

according the engadget they are added hd channels that i already get in hd

[16:12:42]

meshe:

sphery: yes, cause everything said on the internet is true *wink*

[16:14:03]

sphery:

meshe: it's not the internet... It's e-mail--not some web page. (Yeah, I know. That's the joke.)

[16:14:53]

meshe:

oh, right sorry, i forgot that you were talking about email not the intertubes

[16:16:31]

Shadow__X:

comcasts extreme 50 only has 5 Mbps upload

[16:16:31]

Shadow__X:

eh

[16:18:20]

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[16:19:01]

** sphery wonders what the other 45 is **

[16:19:26]

Shadow__X:

well its 50Mbps download 5Mbps upload

[16:19:28]

Shadow__X:

which is sad

[16:19:33]

sphery:

really? 50 down?

[16:19:43]

sphery:

nice.

[16:19:50]

Shadow__X:

yeah for 99.99 a month if you have a bundle

[16:20:01]

sphery:

I have a measly 7.5Mbps down and 768kbps up.

[16:20:07]

Shadow__X:

right now i have 30Mbps down and 5Mbps upload

[16:20:12]

Shadow__X:

but its only with powerboost

[16:20:22]

Shadow__X:

sustained its 22Mbps down around 5 Mbps upload

[16:21:27]

sphery:

wow... fastest I /could/ get is 15Mbps down

[16:21:47]

J-e-f-f-A:

When I had comcast, every time they upped their speeds to compete, the entire network slowed down to dialup speeds since their equpment couldn't handle the bandwidth... :-(

[16:21:50]

Shadow__X:

hmm do you have a download cap

[16:22:10]

Shadow__X:

J-e-f-f-A, i actually dont have the problem but it just depends on the people in your area

[16:22:11]

sphery:

No cap for me (TTBOMK)

[16:22:20]

sphery:

though I don't use all that much bandwidth

[16:22:20]

Shadow__X:

its no secret that they oversubscribe

[16:22:22]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: DSL?

[16:22:27]

sphery:

No, cable.

[16:22:44]

sphery:

TWC's unloved offspring (Brighthouse)

[16:23:21]

J-e-f-f-A:

That's why I switched to FiOS the instant it was available... (the week after they were running fiber in my neighborhood!

[16:23:51]

sphery:

I wish there were guys installing fiber around here

[16:23:59]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: Then it's capped – unless your provider's feed itself is that slow.

[16:24:17]

Shadow__X:

hmm

[16:24:24]

Shadow__X:

i would love fios internet

[16:24:43]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: If you can view the logs in your cable modem, you'll likely see a file downloaded at boot time that is named in such a way that describes the speed caps.

[16:24:48]

sphery:

oh, thought you meant limits on how much I could download each month

[16:25:41]

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[16:25:48]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: I had comcast for 7 years, and it was a constant battle with them about poor speed. They kept claiming it was my computer, but if you spent 30 seconds on their own forums, you saw it was a major issue...

[16:26:01]

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[16:26:12]

sphery:

J-e-f-f-A: heh... My cable modem is a generic Terayon from Brighthouse. Probably can't get much off it. Besides, each time lightning (or Brighthouse firmware upgrades) take out the modem, I tend to get a different brand.

[16:26:27]

Shadow__X:

J-e-f-f-A, yeah i know the feeling i had an over 3 week ordeal with them screwing stuff up

[16:26:36]

sphery:

(nice, though, that it's their equipment, so it doesn't cost me anything extra)

[16:26:46]

Shadow__X:

sphery, try to goto 192.168.100.1

[16:26:52]

Shadow__X:

that should give you atleast a bit of info

[16:27:13]

sphery:

ping works

[16:27:23]

Shadow__X:

web browser

[16:27:38]

sphery:

wow...

[16:27:38]

sphery:

cool

[16:27:41]

Shadow__X:

:)

[16:27:42]

sphery:

Cable Modem Information Center

[16:27:53]

Shadow__X:

yeah doesnt give you everything

[16:27:59]

Shadow__X:

but atleast more than what your used to

[16:28:05]

sphery:

"Cable Signal: Connecting"???

[16:28:10]

sphery:

seems its connected.

[16:28:14]

Shadow__X:

thats weird

[16:28:15]

sphery:

"Ranging: In Progress (Step 2 of 5)..."

[16:28:21]

Shadow__X:

lol

[16:28:28]

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[16:28:32]

Shadow__X:

very interesting because it seems like you are connected

[16:28:42]

sphery:

Highest State Obtained: Operational

[16:28:49]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: Are you sure you're not just looking at a log, and you need to scroll down? ;-)

[16:28:50]

sphery:

not there, now, though

[16:28:56]

dorgan1 (dorgan1!n=dorgan@rrcs-97-77-90-180.se.biz.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:29:07]

sphery:

there's no down

[16:29:14]

J-e-f-f-A:

DOH!

[16:29:16]

dorgan1:

hello everyone..I will be ordering a new computer in the next two weeks and I would like to turn my old P4 into a mythbox

[16:29:20]

dorgan1:

does anyone know of any PCI tunercards that have QAM?

[16:29:39]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, yeah

[16:29:42]

Shadow__X:

the wiki knows

[16:29:45]

Shadow__X:

also linuxtv knows

[16:29:50]

dorgan1:

wiki?

[16:29:52]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: Lots of them... ;-)

[16:29:55]

dorgan1:

whats the address?

[16:30:02]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: There are many, and they're categorized at www.linuxtv.org

[16:30:06]

Shadow__X:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki

[16:30:25]

iamlindoro:

go the the wiki, then to ATSC devices, then PCI

[16:30:35]

iamlindoro:

http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/ATSC_PCI_Cards

[16:30:47]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: Out of curiosity, did you ever switch to Dish, or did you stick with Cable?

[16:31:20]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: Still with cable

[16:31:32]

** sphery thinks he's just a ghost on the 'net **

[16:31:59]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: Ah... ;-) I'm still on the fence about FiOS TV ... would cost the same or a little more...

[16:32:21]

sphery:

Dr. Modem has examined your modem.\nDr. Modem's Diagnosis:\n# The modem is fully operational.

[16:32:23]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: But then again, would never have any 'storm fade'... etc... humm...

[16:32:47]

meshe:

storm fade in socal?

[16:32:56]

sphery:

My friends with cable got a /lot/ more storm fade than my DISH network /ever/ got.

[16:33:07]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: I'm fairly happy for now and still get most things via firewire... and have HD-PVR for when I don't

[16:33:10]

iamlindoro:

meshe: norcal :)

[16:33:25]

meshe:

iamlindoro: i thought you were bay area

[16:33:26]

J-e-f-f-A:

C*mcast keeps sending me offers too, but after my horrible internet experiences with them, I don't want to touch them with a 1000-foot pole...

[16:33:34]

iamlindoro:

meshe: I am... which is northern Cal :)

[16:33:47]

meshe:

ahh, ok

[16:33:49]

meshe:

still

[16:33:54]

iamlindoro:

meshe: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Bay_Area

[16:33:55]

iamlindoro:

:)

[16:34:05]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: Actually, that's another plus – Jarod lives in my general area and gets lots of stuff via firewire on FiOS HD... so humm...

[16:34:10]

sphery:

iamlindoro: it's all South from where meshe's at

[16:34:21]

iamlindoro:

Heh

[16:34:23]

J-e-f-f-A:

meshe: New England. ;-)

[16:34:33]

Shadow__X:

J-e-f-f-A, he gets stuff off of firewire on fios?

[16:34:36]

meshe:

J-e-f-f-A: yeah, you'd have to worry about storm fade :)

[16:34:40]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: Yep.

[16:34:45]

Shadow__X:

i thought you couldnt other than local broadcast

[16:35:08]

iamlindoro:

As always, firewire behavior is highly local

[16:35:09]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: Shh! Don't tell Verizon!

[16:35:20]

Shadow__X:

ah ok

[16:35:29]

Shadow__X:

hmm i wish i could get my premiums over firewire

[16:35:42]

iamlindoro:

Just man up and buy an HD-PVR

[16:35:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: In a conversation in the -users list, he's outlined several HD stations that are in the clear over firewire.

[16:36:07]

Shadow__X:

ah ok

[16:36:39]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, yeah except 200 or so for a hdpvr 200 to replace the glass that some idiot smash on my car

[16:36:46]

J-e-f-f-A:

I don't think there were any premim (ie movie) channels on that list though.

[16:36:46]

Shadow__X:

hummm decisions decisions

[16:37:04]

Shadow__X:

i do plan on getting a hd pvr though

[16:37:06]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: No Glass coverage?

[16:37:11]

brad2:

isn't it a little early to get hd-pvr, until .22 comes out?

[16:37:27]

Shadow__X:

J-e-f-f-A, the 200 is the deductible it was 450

[16:37:47]

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[16:37:58]

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[16:38:03]

J-e-f-f-A:

Shadow__X: In MA, glass coverage is 100% ;-) (not subject to the deductable, but only 2 replacements max a year)

[16:38:15]

davidm is now known as Guest83007

[16:38:31]

meshe:

deductable is $300 here

[16:38:38]

Shadow__X:

J-e-f-f-A, oh wow nice yeah i have njm

[16:39:29]

J-e-f-f-A:

meshe: The deductable varies per plan here... I don't remember if mine is $200 or $500... I don't have to use it... My WIFE does, having totalled 2 cars in 5 years... but I don't have to!

[16:39:47]

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[16:39:49]

meshe:

hehe

[16:39:51]

Shadow__X:

heh give her a 1990 honda crx hf

[16:39:59]

Shadow__X:

she'll go to slow to total anything

[16:40:04]

Shadow__X:

and get 50mpg to boot

[16:40:06]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: http://www.fecitfacta.com/screenie.png Jealous? ;)

[16:40:17]

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[16:40:23]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, :( jerk

[16:40:26]

meshe:

i'm at 12 years safe driving, they call me a Road Star

[16:40:27]

J-e-f-f-A:

We lucked out – her last van was a 1997 Grand Voyager – we paid $2500 for it, got $3800... can't go wrong there...

[16:40:32]

iamlindoro:

marrrrrharharhar

[16:40:51]

jduggan:

so

[16:41:01]

jduggan:

this quad lnb i bought

[16:41:09]

jduggan:

has no caps for unused plugs

[16:41:11]

jduggan:

or

[16:41:14]

jduggan:

no weather guard

[16:41:14]

brad2:

iamlindoro: Nice. What made you pick Mac?

[16:41:18]

jduggan:

what should be used?

[16:41:20]

jduggan:

just tape it up?

[16:41:24]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, when i have income ill get ya there

[16:41:31]

jduggan:

s/or/and/

[16:41:39]

dustybin:

os x is the best desktop out there

[16:41:58]

iamlindoro:

brad2: I like it?

[16:42:00]

jduggan:

best is relative to what you want to achieve

[16:42:17]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: You running the backend on a Mac, or just an osx-styled desktop?

[16:42:30]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: That's just a screenshot of my mythweb from my work computer

[16:42:46]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: So neither.. it's actual OS X on a machine without any portion of myth on it

[16:42:59]

J-e-f-f-A:

Ah, so you've got mythweb tunneled... ;-)

[16:43:03]

iamlindoro:

yep

[16:43:20]

Shadow__X:

tunneled through localhost?

[16:43:21]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: hehe... the 127.0.0.1 threw me off... Very nice though!

[16:43:23]

dustybin:

im going to start up a small online business, now im finding that a lot of stuff will not work on os x, i will require windows :(

[16:43:42]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: That's how the tunnels work, yes

[16:43:45]

meshe:

dustybin: bootcamp or paralells

[16:44:00]

dustybin:

meshe: yes exactly what i need

[16:44:11]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, yeah i know i just dont normally do it through localhost is there a benefit doing it that way

[16:44:12]

meshe:

or vmware, or virtualbox...

[16:44:26]

dustybin:

meshe: i require the microsoft office suite, quickbooks (mac versions are cack), and a special windows only quickbooks link to my store

[16:44:49]

meshe:

dustybin: then you're doing it wrong ;)

[16:44:50]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: I'm not sure why one would do otherwise...

[16:44:58]

dustybin:

meshe: why?

[16:45:02]

sphery:

Hmmm... HVR-1250 for $46.99 w/ free shipping after promo code EMCLVNW68 ($5 off) – http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116028

[16:45:13]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, eh yeah i guess also the only thing you got on me there is hbo hd everything else i can do over firewire

[16:45:42]

meshe:

why do you need MS office suite? quickbooks i could kinda see, but a special version that connects to the store?

[16:45:55]

meshe:

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

[16:46:15]

dustybin:

meshe: i will be using cs-cart >> WEBGILITY eCC >> Quickbooks

[16:46:16]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: That's about what I paid for min from Circuit City whey they were still in business... (Not using it currently)

[16:46:22]

dustybin:

meshe: eCC is the link

[16:46:58]

meshe:

dustybin: so you chose to go that route rather than *have* to go that route

[16:47:15]

dustybin:

meshe: after lots of research, i have found this to be the best way

[16:47:16]

meshe:

we our company has no direct link between quickbooks and our shopping cart

[16:47:43]

dustybin:

meshe: so how are orders imported into quickbooks?

[16:47:50]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: Difference being I can reliably do any of mine-- I won't *ever* miss a recording ;)

[16:48:06]

meshe:

dustybin: csv export from the order database

[16:48:11]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, now your just being a bully

[16:48:12]

Shadow__X:

heh

[16:48:16]

iamlindoro:

;)

[16:48:29]

dustybin:

meshe: isnt it a bit messy doing that way?

[16:48:43]

dustybin:

meshe: what cart?

[16:48:52]

meshe:

the accountants don't seem to mind, theyve been doing it that way for 10+ years now

[16:48:55]

meshe:

custom built

[16:48:59]

meshe:

mostly by me

[16:49:00]

dustybin:

aye ok

[16:49:06]

dustybin:

aye nice

[16:49:23]

meshe:

plus the accountants look at and validate the data before it goes into QB

[16:49:49]

jams:

this stuff is really something you have to try out for yourself to make a decision about it.

[16:50:10]

jams:

regarding quickbooks and the like

[16:50:30]

meshe:

if you are starting a businesss, you should probably avoid over-engineering and spending a lot of money up front

[16:50:30]

** J-e-f-f-A prefers slowbooks **

[16:50:45]

dustybin:

this is meant to kick ass

[16:50:46]

dustybin:

http://www.webgility.com/

[16:50:52]

J-e-f-f-A:

and fast cars. ;-)

[16:50:56]

meshe:

get the money coming in then upgrade the pain points

[16:50:59]

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[16:50:59]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[16:51:17]

jams:

the money has just arrived!

[16:52:24]

kormoc:

And your chicks are free?

[16:52:42]

** dustybin looks forward to selling pre-built mythtv boxes **

[16:52:47]

meshe:

the company i work for started with $50 and is a multi-million dollar/year company

[16:52:48]

kormoc:

oh noes...

[16:52:50]

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[16:53:14]

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[16:54:54]

dustybin:

im going to become a mythtv entrepreneur

[16:55:17]

kormoc:

just don't sink anyone else's live savings into it

[16:55:18]

dustybin:

i will employ some of you guys as sales staff

[16:55:31]

brad2:

haha

[16:55:35]

dustybin:

haha im not doing that really

[16:55:36]

Shadow__X:

uh oh

[16:55:39]

dustybin:

no way

[16:55:41]

kormoc:

You couldn't afford me

[16:55:51]

iamlindoro:

nor I

[16:55:56]

Shadow__X:

kormoc, i am sure most places cant

[16:56:03]

iamlindoro:

I do have a nice little chunk of Myth consulting this weekend though :)

[16:56:14]

Shadow__X:

:)

[16:56:34]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, heh, nice

[16:57:00]

iamlindoro:

plus, more playing with new Myth tech without having to pay for it

[16:57:59]

Shadow__X:

thats also good

[16:58:14]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, so... what script do I run to get fanart with graphite?

[16:58:38]

dorgan1:

will a P4+HT with 1GB of ram work well as a mythbox?

[16:58:49]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: You can (for movies) re-run the metadata lookup for each of your movies or (Better choice) run RDV_Linux's Jamu metadata script

[16:58:54]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, depends what you are planning on doing

[16:59:08]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: Jamu is also cron'able to pull in all the metadata for all your recordings too

[16:59:27]

kormoc:

slick

[16:59:37]

dorgan1:

Shadow__X: How so?

[16:59:50]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, what do you plan on doing with it

[16:59:55]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: However it requires applying a couple of patches (like my patch for MythVideo TV support), but all pretty easy and well tested (I've been using it for like six months)

[16:59:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: What are your sources? Standard Def or HD? What type of tuners?

[17:00:06]

kormoc:

I am le sad, the mini's ir reciver is only workable with the apple remote, as it's a usb HID device

[17:00:13]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, have ticket numbers handy?

[17:00:16]

dorgan1:

Planning on recording both SD and HD TV

[17:00:42]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: Please read the Jamu wiki as the initial population of your inetref numbers is involved.

[17:00:51]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Jamu

[17:00:54]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, yeah but inputs qam atsc stb what

[17:00:59]

kormoc:

Righto!

[17:01:01]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: The tickets are referenced in the "downloading jamu" section

[17:01:32]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux: If his movies all already have imdb numbers, he shouldn't have much to do, right?

[17:01:53]

iamlindoro:

(I assume he's working with a DB that already has posters, just no fanart/etc and nothing for his recordings)

[17:02:02]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: It is worth a DB backup just in case, though

[17:02:11]

dorgan1:

Tuners would be Hauppauge HVR-1600 and/or Hauppauge HVR-1250

[17:02:15]

kormoc:

It's a new database right now, I haven't imported in anything yet

[17:02:22]

dorgan1:

and they would be QAM

[17:02:34]

kormoc:

so I could go completely green for everything, as I'm really only interested in oldrecorded

[17:02:36]

iamlindoro:

ah, cool-- Jamu should work nicely for you, then-- a bit of work to set up but well worth it IMHO

[17:02:41]

** kormoc nods **

[17:02:48]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, you also need to know that other than local broadcast you might not get anything else over qam

[17:03:01]

iamlindoro:

I only currently use it to automatically grab fanart/coverart/etc. for all my recordings, but it's fantastic for that

[17:03:18]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: You'd have no problems recording with that system. HD playback might get touchy though – is this only going to be a backend?

[17:03:19]

iamlindoro:

(and all automatic via cron)

[17:03:28]

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[17:03:41]

** kormoc nods **

[17:03:42]

dorgan1:

is it possible to have an Xbox 360 be a front end?

[17:03:44]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: Once your inetref numbers are set up you should be golden, Be aware that any IMDB numbers will be renamed to their TMDB numbers automatically if there is a TMDB entry for that IMDB number. Also graphics are renamed from an IMDB number to a TMDB number.

[17:03:55]

dorgan1:

what would improve HD playback?

[17:03:57]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux, sounds like a plan

[17:04:18]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Having somethng better than an old P4

[17:04:26]

Shadow__X:

:)

[17:04:27]

meshe:

dorgan1: a C2D 2.5Ghz or higher

[17:05:18]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: Umm... as a UpNP player perhaps, but IIRC, it's pretty picky about the formats of what it will play. (although I don't have one myself to est, so take that for what it's worth...)

[17:05:23]

dorgan1:

ahh, yeah guess I have to see how the P4 does and then maybe upgrade the board/processor later on down the line

[17:05:48]

meshe:

that's usually a good route to go

[17:05:53]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: 360 won't play MPEG-2 via uPnP, and won't play NUV containers, making it useless for pretty much all myth recordings

[17:05:55]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: The simulation option is your friend! Please use it as no actual writes to your db or graphics downloads will be donem but you will get to see what would have happened.

[17:06:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: Yeah, strange thing is that my son's PS3 *used* to work with most myth stuff, but now just says "Unsupported Media" (or similar)... dumb...

[17:07:07]

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[17:07:48]

backslash7:

Is there a plugin that downloads tv show episodes from Megaupload, Rapidshare and so on automaticlly?

[17:07:50]

dorgan1:

anyone in here use the xbox 360 as a front end?

[17:08:08]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: My first 'real' backend was a dual PIII 866... with 3x SD tuners (PVR-250 and PVr-500), and a HD-3000

[17:08:15]

meshe:

backslash7: that's a forbidden topic here

[17:08:29]

GreyFoxx:

dorgan1: IT can't really be used for a frontend to recordings

[17:08:29]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: See iamlindoro 's comment to me above ^^^

[17:08:33]

backslash7:

:O Why? It's legal in my country ^^

[17:08:38]

GreyFoxx:

manybe xvid and such in mythvideo

[17:08:40]

GreyFoxx:

but not recordings

[17:08:55]

GreyFoxx:

It's just a very poor choice for a player all around so you might wanna try somethign different

[17:09:08]

GreyFoxx:

That reminds me, I should backport that PCH fix to -fixes

[17:09:38]

dorgan1:

iamlindoro: 360 supports Mpeg 2 playback I believe they added that when they did the NXE upgrade

[17:09:50]

flodin:

I have a DVB card and am able to record multiple programs as long as they are on the same mux. Today I installed a second capture card of the same model (Hauppauge HVR1300). But now I can only record a single channel at a time

[17:09:52]

Shadow__X:

also dorgan1 if you are that worried you can check out mediatomb but i nor anyone else here can provide support for it

[17:09:59]

GreyFoxx:

dorgan1: You can play mpeg-2 that has been recorded via MCE in their drm wrapped formate

[17:10:05]

dorgan1:

i've been using ustream to stream mpegs to my 360

[17:10:09]

GreyFoxx:

but not standard mpeg2

[17:10:16]

iamlindoro:

ustream transcodes

[17:10:18]

GreyFoxx:

unless there has been a recent update

[17:10:22]

sphery:

dorgan1: that assumes you haven't sent your 360 in because you got your 2nd RRoD... :(

[17:10:24]

flodin:

all I did was to add the second capture card (DVB channel 1 instead of 0), and connect it to the same source

[17:10:45]

GreyFoxx:

many of those upnp servers will transcode in the background to "fake" it for defective/incapable players

[17:10:58]

flodin:

both cards seem to work OK, i have tried a channel scan on both of them and both are finding the same channels

[17:11:05]

GreyFoxx:

has there been a recent 360 update I might have missed?

[17:11:07]

dorgan1:

sphery: never got a RRoD

[17:11:12]

GreyFoxx:

Mine was last updated several months ago

[17:11:31]

dorgan1:

GreyFoxx: So i might be able to record it then just use ustream?

[17:11:58]

GreyFoxx:

dorgan1: If ustream with do it for you sure. Just make sure ustream(or whatever) has access to the content

[17:12:16]

dorgan1:

actually ushare not ustream

[17:12:34]

GreyFoxx:

I was unaware that ushare did transcoding. Unless that's recent as well

[17:12:38]

dorgan1:

ahh yeah i can tell myth to put it in the ushare "shared" folder

[17:13:13]

dorgan1:

hmm well i will be ordering my new comp and turning the old one into a mythbox in the coming weeks, so i will keep everyone posted

[17:13:14]

flodin:

am I doing this right? Should I create two different video sources?

[17:13:16]

sphery:

dorgan1: this was from Dec 2007, but I haven't seen a newer version: http://blogs.msdn.com/xboxteam/archive/2007/1 . . . ack-faq.aspx

[17:13:25]

sphery:

dorgan1: do you know of a newer version?

[17:14:04]

J-e-f-f-A:

flodin: If they're the same source, no – one video source.

[17:14:20]

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[17:14:23]

dorgan1:

sphery: hmm nope...guess I will probably have to go the ushare route

[17:14:24]

sphery:

flodin: if they are in fact using the same source, one video source...

[17:14:26]

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[17:14:29]

orogor:

hi again

[17:14:30]

sphery:

hmmm... deja vu...

[17:14:35]

sphery:

J-e-f-f-A is too fast

[17:14:37]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: hehe

[17:14:45]

flodin:

hrm yes they are... same cable connected to both of the capture cards

[17:14:57]

sphery:

flodin: however, when you connect inputs, you specify a number of virtual inputs

[17:14:59]

orogor:

on the way office-> home , i bought a nova-t and bribged back the terratec, conclusion , terratec == poo

[17:15:30]

orogor:

instead of 1 transponder and no channel i get 6 transponders and a hel lot of channels

[17:15:32]

sphery:

flodin: and I /highly/ recommend you do the capture card (not video source) portion of: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/264034#264034 (you won't lose channels/have to rescan if you only do the capture card portion)

[17:16:03]

iamlindoro:

orogor: Glad to hear it!

[17:16:07]

** GreyFoxx compiles -fixes and feels his hitpoints drop by 10% **

[17:16:18]

flodin:

ok i'll try that, brb

[17:16:20]

iamlindoro:

orogor: A well supported card is always worth it :)

[17:16:49]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx: dexterity -5, codecsupport -10, fanart -100%

[17:16:55]

sphery:

GreyFoxx: but -fixes is for real men! (I haven't lost a recording due to Myth while using -fixes.)

[17:17:03]

orogor:

humm i also ned to fix the device numbering in ubuntu , they keep switching

[17:17:37]

GreyFoxx:

sphery: I haven't lost a recording I could contribute to trunk either :) Not since the flakie early days of firewire :)

[17:17:40]

iamlindoro:

sphery: In fairness, I haven't in trunk either :)

[17:17:58]

GreyFoxx:

But I have found a reproducable crash when using iptv the other day

[17:18:04]

iamlindoro:

orogor: That's not ubuntu, that's linux in general-- look up udev rules

[17:18:23]

GreyFoxx:

I have a good idea what's causing that though so hopefully I can get it patched

[17:19:00]

GreyFoxx:

I have had receordings not finish properly and keep going for 18 or so hours. but that was long long ago :)

[17:19:01]

orogor:

got also dhcp not workign correctly to fix

[17:19:20]

orogor:

hummm ,the scan is odd, it loks for analog frequencies it seems

[17:19:31]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: Humm... Just did an svn up on my 0-21-fixes source dir – looks like lots of changes to HDHR... Wonder if it's worth the update tonight... ;-)

[17:19:39]

orogor:

shoudl i not do a channel scan with dvb?

[17:19:54]

GreyFoxx:

And I do have some dvb recording weirdness from last night as well, but I need more testing on that

[17:19:56]

sphery:

I did when we had the problem where digital recordings got the message about something not seen... not starting recording... Went on for like 6 months (and I think it was a race condition)

[17:20:08]

iamlindoro:

orogor: channel scanning is the *only* way to get channels w/ DVB

[17:20:15]

sphery:

I did = I lost recordings due to myth

[17:20:47]

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[17:21:13]

iamlindoro:

sphery: Well if you were following the commits and dev... oh. ;)

[17:22:23]

sphery:

heh... yeah, that one was tough as it only happened once in maybe every 10–20 recordings, so it wasn't reported until long after it became a problem (at least 1 or 2 months)

[17:23:32]

GreyFoxx:

I had a weird one last night I did 8 test recordings of newly scanned QAM channels.... each one ended up as 4 seperate recordings 1 with video+ audio and the other 3 with audio only

[17:23:37]

GreyFoxx:

so 32 recordings

[17:23:47]

GreyFoxx:

and they appeared to all be the same channel :)

[17:23:56]

GreyFoxx:

I haven't looked through the logs for that yet :)

[17:24:20]

sphery:

iamlindoro: besides, even gbee has lost some recordings on trunk and it's not like he doesn't follow the gbee list, I mean -commits list :)

[17:25:24]

orogor:

iamlindoro, it search for france K01 K02 and so

[17:26:36]

sphery:

"Recording will not commence until a PMT is set." That was the issue

[17:27:30]

sphery:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/3031

[17:27:41]

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[17:30:35]

orogor:

should i create a chanbnel.conf file first with another utility?

[17:31:43]

iamlindoro:

no

[17:31:45]

flodin:

sphery: nope didn't work... i got rid of everything and created cards, input sources etc again. Do I need to do something with input groups?

[17:33:09]

sphery:

flodin: no, no input groups stuff

[17:33:18]

sphery:

flodin: so, what exactly is the problem/symptoms you're seeing?

[17:34:08]

flodin:

well if i only have one capture card, I can record one channel and still switch to other channels on the same mux with live tv

[17:34:36]

flodin:

when i add the second capture card, as soon as i set it to record one channel I cannot view any other channel

[17:36:49]

sphery:

flodin: and you've set the number of virtual tuners to >1? (It defaults to 2, IIRC, but verify your config.)

[17:37:01]

flodin:

yeah it's set to 2 on both cards

[17:37:14]

flodin:

if i connect a second mythtv client, they can both do livetv on different channels on the same mux

[17:37:16]

sphery:

flodin: and you're sure that the channel on which you're recording actually carries multiple logical channels?

[17:37:49]

flodin:

does it matter though? Since I have two tuners I should be able to watch any two different channels

[17:38:05]

sphery:

flodin: are you saying that you get stuck on the one mux in LiveTV when it's recording?

[17:39:08]

flodin:

weirder than that. I go to livetv, press R to record, and then i can't switch to any other channel at all. But if I connect two different mythtv clients, they can do livetv on different channels as long as they are on the same mux

[17:39:26]

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[17:39:31]

badabadum:

hooolaaa

[17:39:32]

sphery:

flodin: yeah, when you push R, you're not in LiveTV, anymore.

[17:39:46]

meshe:

you have to back out and watch live tv again

[17:39:47]

sphery:

flodin: you'd have to exit Watching Recording (in progress) playback, then enter LiveTV

[17:40:04]

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[17:40:15]

flodin:

oh ok... that explains that bit. But it doesn't explain why i can't view another mux

[17:40:19]

sphery:

flodin: though the /right/ solution is to actually /schedule/ your recordings instead of stumbling across them in LiveTV and hitting R

[17:40:47]

sphery:

flodin: because you've configured Myth for recordings, not for LiveTV. http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/369358#369358

[17:40:47]

flodin:

i understand that... i'm just explaining a test case

[17:41:01]

sphery:

flodin: do the /last/ suggested approach but read the /entire/ post

[17:41:09]

sphery:

if you don't, any consequences are /not/ my fault

[17:41:51]

sphery:

with that approach, you could actually get the behavior you want without wasting physical tuners on recordings and still making LiveTV a priority

[17:42:00]

sphery:

though, really, the /right/ solution is to not use LiveTV. :)

[17:43:05]

flodin:

well my most pressing concern was that this behavior would indicate that i will have conflicts if i try to record on two different muxes at the same time

[17:43:39]

** J-e-f-f-A only uses LiveTV to test new tuners, inputs or channel-change scripts. **

[17:44:02]

sphery:

flodin: no, it doesn't

[17:44:37]

sphery:

flodin: and, you can map a key to NEXTCARD (using MythControls under Utilities/Settings then Key something or another) and test that both physical cards re in use

[17:44:55]

flodin:

ah... i'll try that

[17:44:59]

sphery:

then, you don't have to reconfigure for LiveTV (if you're not going to use LIveTV)

[17:45:39]

orogor:

humm

[17:46:06]

J-e-f-f-A:

orogor: ground loop?

[17:46:20]

orogor:

what do i do if w_scan and kaffeine can scan and get me a channel list, but mythtv doesn t ?

[17:46:21]

sphery:

GreyFoxx: just anecdotal, but it sounds like most of the people having problems with lossless transcodes get them from firewire--though iamlindoro may actually get some of his that way, so it's probably not all firewire-captured recordings that have issues

[17:46:53]

iamlindoro:

I am able to Lossless TC most firewire stuff

[17:46:59]

sphery:

orogor: what Myth? 0.21-fixes (which works) or trunk (whose channel scanner is broken/being completely rewritten now)

[17:47:14]

iamlindoro:

certain channels are problematic, and last time I worked on that bug it seemed the PTS/DTS was wrong and it confused mythtranscode

[17:47:18]

orogor:

ubuntu package

[17:47:40]

sphery:

guessing you didn't enable any special testing repos, then, so it shoudl be -fixes

[17:47:48]

sphery:

though mythbackend --version would tell you

[17:48:01]

sphery:

orogor: what type of TV?

[17:48:12]

orogor:

dvb-t

[17:48:15]

orogor:

: 20918-openglvdpau2

[17:48:23]

orogor:

branches/release-0-21-fixes

[17:48:51]

J-e-f-f-A:

ooh, vdpau2 is out now? ;-)

[17:48:52]

sphery:

orogor: is this the VDPAU enabled -fixes? If so, I have no clue what's in it/what's broken

[17:49:31]

orogor:

haa escue me i diodn t set card type

[17:49:50]

GreyFoxx:

iamlindoro: That sounds like what I was running into

[17:50:09]

GreyFoxx:

It didn't like the tiemstamps so would freak out and give up

[17:50:18]

flodin:

sphery: great, that was it... the root of the problem was apparently that I was assuming that livetv would pick an unused input

[17:51:18]

flodin:

what if it's the other way around, i.e. someone is watching livetv (you can rant all you like about how it's bad, i'm not going to be able to convince my wife)... and a recording is about to start. Will it pick the unused input?

[17:51:36]

sphery:

flodin: nope... Myth always tries to minimize the number of physical cards in use so that if it later needs to start a recording on a different mux it can

[17:51:54]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx: Yeah

[17:51:55]

sphery:

if you went into livetv and got a different mux, then myth couldn't record something from a 3rd mux

[17:51:57]

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[17:52:17]

J-e-f-f-A:

flodin: It will prompt you, saying "MythTV wants to record xyz on channel 123 in xx seconds, what do you want to do?"

[17:52:21]

flodin:

ok

[17:52:39]

flodin:

thanks a bunch for you help guys

[17:52:58]

J-e-f-f-A:

flodin: With options to "Exit Live TV", "Record and Watch" , etc... (may have the exact wording wrong)

[17:56:44]

GreyFoxx:

anyone around with -fixes and a popcorn hour with the firmware updates since June 1st?

[17:57:05]

** J-e-f-f-A wants a Popcorn Hour! ;-) **

[17:57:08]

GreyFoxx:

Or even just -fixes and using any upnp client o test a patch ?

[17:57:25]

GreyFoxx:

as long as it doesn't break anything I'd be happy :)

[17:57:56]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I won't be home for several hours... could test it later tonight if you don't have any takers by then...

[17:58:02]

GreyFoxx:

ok

[17:58:14]

J-e-f-f-A:

msg me the details... ;-)

[17:58:19]

orogor:

how long odes the eit scan data takes to pop in? in kaffeine it s always displayed at the bottom

[17:59:02]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: http://mythtv.pastebin.ca/1510194

[17:59:15]

GreyFoxx:

Just apply that, and treat a UPNP client to make sure it still works :)

[18:02:33]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I'll give it a shot... Probably 10pm tonight though. ;-)

[18:02:39]

GreyFoxx:

cool :)

[18:02:46]

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[18:07:53]

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[18:09:43]

dorgan1:

hmmm interesting http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/UPnP – show under (UPnP-client hardware): XBOX 360 At least as of trunk 17776M, this is streaming perfectly to XBOX 360 via UPnP.

[18:10:10]

** iamlindoro wonders why people would always rather believe a wiki page than the people who actually know the code **

[18:10:37]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Note that no codecs are mentioned, nor whether it is recordings versus videos, music, et.

[18:10:37]

dorgan1:

iamlindoro: didnt say I believed it...I just said it was interesting...lol

[18:10:51]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Interesting and a misrepresentation of facts

[18:11:06]

iamlindoro:

If all your stuff is Xvid/Divx in AVI, it'll work fine

[18:11:08]

dorgan1:

I was actually about it ask if anyone could confirm this

[18:11:19]

dorgan1:

so i wasnt assuming that it would work :D

[18:11:32]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Surely you can see how obnoxious this appears, right?

[18:11:34]

dorgan1:

i was actually assuming it wouldnt work unless someone was able to confirm

[18:11:55]

iamlindoro:

We have all explained to you the limitations of uPnP on the 360, so quoting wiki pages doesn't make *any* of what you have been told less true

[18:12:08]

kormoc:

I am so confused right now

[18:12:09]

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[18:12:14]

dorgan1:

obnoxious...no...I wasing it throwing it in anyones face and saying the were wrong I was actually posting for reference and asking someone to confirm or deny

[18:12:36]

kormoc:

dorgan1, I don't see anywhere where you asked to confirm or deny?

[18:12:42]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Then once again, with feeling... NO, you cannot watch Myth recordings via Myth's uPnP server on the 360

[18:12:46]

GreyFoxx:

dorgan1: I'm the one who wrote the code to support the 360. IT will even display .mpg files

[18:12:50]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Which is exactly what we told you before

[18:12:55]

GreyFoxx:

NOT even display

[18:13:03]

orogor:

the nova-t can tune multiple channels at once?

[18:13:10]

dorgan1:

iamlindoro: because you had your *action* in there first so I didnt even finish typing the next sentence :P

[18:13:13]

GreyFoxx:

Unless they recently changed the firmware to allow it

[18:13:51]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Even asking for a confirmation is still obnoxious-- you've been told numerous times by numerous people what the limitations are, they didn't change in the last ten minutes

[18:14:05]

** kormoc just has 'FGS GreyFoxx, you didn't UPnP a 360' running in his head... **

[18:14:30]

J-e-f-f-A:

The PS3 used to work, but it seems like they (Sony) have changed it so that it doesn't work anymore...

[18:14:46]

dorgan1:

iamlindoro: i guess if you are wind a little to tight maybe

[18:15:05]

** J-e-f-f-A finds a safe place to rid out the storm **

[18:15:08]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: We are all providing you *free* support, the least you could do is show the tiniest bit of respect

[18:15:10]

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[18:15:26]

iamlindoro:

Everything you have been told is *fact*, making us tell you five times does not endear you to us

[18:15:45]

dorgan1:

i was not refuting the fact, and I was not questioning anyones knowledge all i did was post a link and state it was interesting and before I could even ask anyone to confirm/deny it, you started slamming me

[18:15:57]

kormoc:

dorgan1, and if you check again, the wiki page no longer claims that it works

[18:16:14]

dorgan1:

kormoc: then thats excellent, so my post wasnt for nothing

[18:16:15]

dorgan1:

:D

[18:16:23]

iamlindoro:

Jesus, someone is really trying to make sure they don't get any further help

[18:17:23]

brad2:

it's almost getting painful to watch, haha

[18:17:35]

dorgan1:

there's no reason to pounce on me, no I am not I am just trying to state that some people are apparently wound just a little too tight, all I did was post a link, and not matter whether it was a link to jesus walking on water or a wiki article that stated xbox streaming...you apparently got up ont he wrong side of the bed

[18:18:24]

dorgan1:

i am not trying to be an ass and I am not trying to rub anyone the wrong way and I am not trying to prove anyone wrong, i was just posting a link and asking someone to confirm/deny, had the link been from any other site other than mythtv.org i wouldnt have even posted it

[18:18:25]

orogor:

iamlindoro, me ?

[18:18:32]

iamlindoro:

orogor: No

[18:19:51]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: The confirmation/denial is a way of asking, yet again, whether the thing you asked an hour ago was possible. It's still not. The end. Again, keep in mind that this is *free* support and that you may want more in the future, and that we have given you up to date, accurate answers. Maybe it would be wise to stop making personal attacks

[18:19:52]

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[18:20:17]

kormoc:

Let's chill out guys

[18:20:19]

kormoc:

this is absurd

[18:20:21]

iamlindoro:

dorgan1: Appropriate response here would be "you're right, thanks for the info so far." and leaving it at that.

[18:20:30]

dorgan1:

eitherway I do thank eveyone for the help, like I said had it not been posted on mythtv.org I wouldnt have even posted it

[18:20:53]

dorgan1:

iamlindoro: NO you're not right I wasnt being obnoxious

[18:20:59]

sphery:

dorgan1: I'm sure the guy who said it was streaming perfectly was talking about all his MS-approved video in MythVideo versus MythTV recordings.

[18:21:00]

kormoc:

oh christ

[18:21:06]

** iamlindoro sighs **

[18:21:12]

iamlindoro:

not worth it

[18:21:20]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, apparently comcast is broadcasting a bad table in my area for scte65

[18:21:29]

dorgan1:

sphery: he probably was

[18:21:30]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: does dlou have a workaround?

[18:21:42]

kormoc:

dorgan1, it came across that way, as you didn't word what you (claim) to actually have been after very well

[18:21:46]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I have at least 3 of the devices on the upnp page to test with – the I-O Data LinkPlayer2, the Buffalo LinkTheater HD, and my son's PS3.

[18:21:54]

dorgan1:

whats the favorite myth distro in here?

[18:21:56]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, it seems like hey may have one i have been running commands for him so we shall see

[18:22:02]

kormoc:

dorgan1, there is none

[18:22:12]

dorgan1:

ok

[18:22:14]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: although the only one currently plugged in is the PS3, but that's a quick fix... ;-)

[18:22:20]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: Cool, it's a really convenient way of doing the channel mapping so hopefully he can find something for you

[18:22:28]

GreyFoxx:

So your PS3 wont work anymore ?

[18:22:54]

brad2:

i use fedora, which i think may be a mistake for newbies and rpms.. the dist updates too quickly, and you can easily get behind far enough that your distribution isn't supported by fedora anymore

[18:23:00]

GreyFoxx:

dorgan1: It's best to go with whatever distro you are most familiar with

[18:23:12]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, yeah it would be great, it seems like he can definitely find a work around though so that'll be great

[18:23:17]

sphery:

dorgan1: The favorite Myth distro (for people just starting) is any /Myth/ distro. :) I.e. MythBuntu and MythDora and LinHES are good choices for getting started.

[18:23:20]

dorgan1:

can i use a AMD geode based device as a frontend

[18:23:24]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: My son says for the last month or two it said 'unsupported media' or such – I presumed it was due to a Sony update. I can check it again tonight.

[18:23:33]

sphery:

dorgan1: the frontend needs power, the backend, not so much

[18:23:43]

GreyFoxx:

It likely since since I doubt that would have changed in -fixes

[18:23:47]

sphery:

power = CPU resources/memory

[18:23:49]

dorgan1:

ahh, i always through it was the other way around

[18:23:50]

dorgan1:

ok

[18:23:52]

GreyFoxx:

Though you'd need someone running trunk to confirm

[18:23:53]

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[18:24:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: He hasn't really had much incentive to try it though, since I gave him a dedicated frontend a few months back.

[18:24:07]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[18:24:17]

sphery:

dorgan1: you only need a powerful backend if you're using a 1990-era frame grabber for standard-definition analog caputre

[18:24:25]

sphery:

dorgan1: which you should /not/ be using in 2009

[18:24:51]

dorgan1:

ahh...i guess now that most cards have an on board encoder, CPU power is no longer needed

[18:25:04]

GreyFoxx:

yeah, and digital stuff is preencoded

[18:25:09]

dorgan1:

gotcha

[18:25:17]

sphery:

too slow again

[18:25:18]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I've got a trunk system setup too, don't boot it very often at the moment.

[18:25:51]

dorgan1:

yeah i last looked into creating a myth box i think close to 2000

[18:25:54]

** sphery needs to send Jeff Gillooly to break GreyFoxx's fingers so I can answer first... **

[18:26:06]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[18:26:48]

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[18:27:50]

dorgan1:

how are usb capture cards now a days?

[18:28:04]

jduggan:

wooo

[18:28:05]

GreyFoxx:

Never used one myself

[18:28:06]

dorgan1:

are they better than PCI cards?

[18:28:19]

GreyFoxx:

Though I'm hoping to get a HDPVR which is usb

[18:28:23]

kormoc:

So my current main annoyances with the mini are the following, 1. Reboots dont' work (freezes after kernel sends reboot signal), 2. IR receiver only works with apple remotes, 3. no audio

[18:28:25]

jduggan:

dish on the wall, ct100 ran to lnb... time for dvb-s fun \o/

[18:28:30]

kormoc:

the list is getting shorter!

[18:28:34]

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[18:29:14]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I almost forced myself to upgrade to trunk on accident — didn't have daily mysql backups (well the cron job was setup, but broken!), and I dropped the db on my trunk box, then ran 'mythtv-setup' on my trunk box, and it proceeded to connect via upnp to my 0.21-fixes box and start to update the database... DOH!

[18:29:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: I caught it in the middle of the 3rd update and manually reversed the changes... took a couple of hours, but I was able to get back without losing anything. ;-)

[18:30:01]

dorgan1:

dell offers the Hauppauge HVR-950Q as an accessory for the Studio XPS i am looking to get

[18:30:16]

dorgan1:

is that better than the HVR1250?

[18:30:35]

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[18:30:39]

J-e-f-f-A:

dorgan1: 950 is USB. 1250 is PCIe

[18:31:09]

Shadow__X:

whats better apples or oranges

[18:31:18]

dorgan1:

ahhh then what about compaired to the WinTV-HVR-1600

[18:31:25]

** kormoc likes Apples of the hardware type and Orange juice **

[18:31:56]

kormoc:

but I think if I had a choice, a few apple (hardware) buys a lot of oranges (juice style)

[18:31:59]

J-e-f-f-A:

1600 is PCI, and both the Analog and Digital sides can be used at the same time. (true dual-tuner)

[18:32:27]

Shadow__X:

kormoc, i agree

[18:32:49]

Arpman:

I'm porting the plugins to freebsd, however I get an error "main.cpp:2305:error:aggregate 'satfs statbuf' has incomplete type and cannot be defined – what do i need to do to fix this problem?

[18:33:11]

dorgan1:

J-e-f-f-A: OK so then the 1600 it is

[18:34:27]

dorgan1:

better yet the 2250 which is PCIe

[18:34:33]

J-e-f-f-A:

GreyFoxx: Make that 4 of the devices on the upnp list... I have a Pinnacle Showcenter 200 too. ;-)

[18:34:54]

Shadow__X:

dorgan1, stop blurting out numbers and read the mythtv wiki on whats supported

[18:35:01]

Shadow__X:

or linuxtv to see whats supported

[18:35:09]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, is the mythbrowser part of your patch required if I'm compiling them in separate sandboxes?

[18:35:43]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: Don't know, haven't worked with that kind of setup

[18:35:48]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: I expect the answer is *yes*

[18:35:53]

kormoc:

rgr

[18:36:18]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: I think you will like that patch, I am very proud of it, lots of fun new functionality for MV

[18:37:10]

Shadow__X:

kormoc, hows the mini working out for you

[18:37:26]

iamlindoro:

Especially if you keep TV in mythvideo-- but also check out "W" as the quick-key for metadata download, and ctrl-S as incremental search

[18:38:14]

kormoc:

Shadow__X, other then the three annoyances I said earlier, great

[18:38:24]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: What's the deal w/ no sound?

[18:38:38]

kormoc:

Not sure yet, the driver loads, just nothing output yet

[18:38:47]

Shadow__X:

ah ok hmm

[18:38:56]

kormoc:

might turn into a module option I need to pass in

[18:39:09]

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[18:40:11]

kormoc:

Jamu is just basically a contrib script?

[18:40:22]

iamlindoro:

should be IMHO

[18:40:31]

iamlindoro:

but may need to wait until the tickets it relies on are committed

[18:40:51]

iamlindoro:

But it's nice to have a script that does so much AND uses all the open databases to such great effect

[18:41:18]

kormoc:

Is there any reason the contrib stuff shouldn't be commited in that you know of offhand?

[18:41:45]

** kormoc eyes RDV_Linux for his input as well **

[18:42:42]

iamlindoro:

I think Jamu and the python binding stuff is solid-- but the big mythvideo patch (mine) that it relies on needs Anduin to do it, probably

[18:42:52]

** kormoc nods **

[18:42:56]

kormoc:

Rgr

[18:50:17]

brad2:

iamlindoro: is there anywhere I can look to see a list of the new features in your big mythvideo patch?

[18:51:34]

iamlindoro:

brad2: http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-commits/2009-July/053750.html

[18:51:39]

brad2:

thanks!

[18:51:46]

iamlindoro:

Then you can go to the ticket and read everything after that comment to see what I have added since

[18:51:54]

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[18:52:38]

iamlindoro:

Think after that I added incremental search ("jump to" a letter or specific title), a keybinding for metadata download, and a keybinding to bring up the item detail screen.\

[18:53:40]

iamlindoro:

All fields are already supported in Graphite, too

[18:55:00]

brad2:

wow sounds awesome

[18:56:26]

brad2:

have you been a longtime programmer lindoro? How did you get into myth development?

[18:56:33]

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[18:56:39]

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[18:56:57]

sphery:

I think he just got tired of waiting on the patches I kept promising...

[18:57:07]

iamlindoro:

My sole development work is on Myth, and I got into it by poking at the code and making it do fun things :)

[18:57:19]

iamlindoro:

Well, not *sole*, but the lion's share, anyway

[18:57:21]

brad2:

hahaha

[18:57:39]

iamlindoro:

Waiting for your patches to get committed is much harder than writing them

[18:57:39]

brad2:

that is very cool, i hope to get into myth development someday and contribute

[18:58:03]

sphery:

iamlindoro: I find that when I write patches only for stuff that doesn't affect me/features I dont use, it's not hard to wait.

[18:58:12]

iamlindoro:

sphery: heh

[18:58:18]

brad2:

why is getting patches committed difficult? some sort of rigorous review process?

[18:58:55]

kormoc:

It involves pies, clowns, and lots and lots of cash

[18:59:15]

brad2:

haha ummm okay ;)

[18:59:41]

iamlindoro:

More accurately, a very small dev team, and fairly rigidly defined "kingdoms" within the code

[18:59:43]

sphery:

I.e. things like, "don't let users start with invalid time zone settings," "automatically create a backup before upgrading schema" (OK, that one gets used, but it always just creates a redundant backup), or "keep from attempting and failing to upgrade corrupt databases"

[19:00:16]

iamlindoro:

so it's a matter of waiting for the *one* person allowed to look at and commit your code to have time out of their life/work/etc. to look at what is a pretty large patch and make any changes, then commit

[19:00:35]

sphery:

kormoc: speaking of which, did you get the pie-gram delivered by the clown for #6700?

[19:01:01]

kormoc:

Heh, aye! ;)

[19:01:03]

brad2:

ouch, sounds frustrating

[19:01:24]

iamlindoro:

sometimes

[19:01:29]

iamlindoro:

often

[19:01:31]

iamlindoro:

yes

[19:01:55]

iamlindoro:

On the plus side for the users, the patch went from a simple one to about a dozen new features since I had to wait

[19:02:02]

iamlindoro:

could all be an evil plan

[19:02:15]

kormoc:

to take over the world from Hulu?

[19:02:15]

brad2:

hahaha

[19:02:33]

brad2:

well thank god for the waiting, new features rock

[19:02:37]

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[19:02:39]

peque:

Hey Guys, I have a MBE with 2xHVR-4000 with a Satelite connected to DVB-S, But I cannot seem to find a DVB-T tuner and be able to add it – Says its allready in use – but the HVR-4000 should have a quad-tuner? I've connected 2LNBs,DisQeC on each DVB-S tuner. Connected a DVB-T antenne on the DVB-T but cannot get anything

[19:02:43]

sphery:

heh, even the "show Deleted/LiveTV/expirable space usage on status page" is something I don't use (as I don't use the Deleted recgroup, never touch LiveTV, and never let my system get close to expiring things...)

[19:03:08]

sphery:

I really don't do a lot of patches for things I actually use...

[19:03:33]

brad2:

so what motivates you to do the work,if you aren't using it sphery?

[19:04:01]

iamlindoro:

fear of me

[19:04:03]

sphery:

it's often easier than constantly helping users who break their systems or who complain because they don't know how much space is really in use or ... :)

[19:04:04]

J-e-f-f-A:

hvr-4000???

[19:04:08]

sphery:

oh, yeah, and fear of iamlindoro

[19:04:12]

brad2:

hahaha

[19:04:20]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: It's a analog/DVB-S/DVB-T combo beast

[19:04:34]

peque:

Hauppauge HVR-4000 DVB-S DVB-S2 & DVB-T

[19:05:08]

sphery:

for real, though, much of my patches have been motivated by getting/answering too many questions about something...

[19:05:43]

brad2:

well thank you both, you are doing awesome jobs

[19:06:11]

J-e-f-f-A:

Is it all four at once, or 1-of-4? (not that it'd be of any use to me in the US anyways... just curious)

[19:06:13]

iamlindoro:

Heh, in the interest of full disclosure, neither of us is a "committer"

[19:06:19]

sphery:

heh, I used to do better... been very unproductive lately, but iamlindoro is picking up the slack

[19:06:24]

brad2:

do you know if the mythtv community has some sort of myth coder mentoring program? Or is it much more, people just figure out how to do things themselves, and then get noticed?

[19:06:36]

iamlindoro:

brad2: If anything, it's the latter

[19:06:42]

iamlindoro:

and sometimes don't get noticed :)

[19:06:43]

brad2:

iam: well you still have status above me as "useless end-user"

[19:06:44]

brad2:

haha

[19:06:48]

XLV:

peque, yeah, there might be restrictions using more than one tuner simultaneously

[19:06:56]

sphery:

figure it out, submit patch, see how much that patch gets changed before commit to see what you did wrong :)

[19:07:15]

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[19:07:15]

iamlindoro:

But the dev list and #mythtv are always open to actual coding questions-- the amount of guidance you'll get on them is proportional to the interest of anyone looking at it

[19:07:31]

sphery:

(or notice that gnome42 changed the code from a previously-committed patch because you forgot to put the colons in the bind variable name in bindValue())

[19:07:36]

iamlindoro:

ie if someone cares about what you're trying to do, you'll likely get more help than if it's some whacked out deep-weeds idea

[19:07:36]

sphery:

and that's how we learn

[19:07:54]

brad2:

excellent, thanks for the advice

[19:08:07]

brad2:

i will get there someday :)

[19:08:41]

sphery:

iamlindoro: and, occasionally, even if someone isn't that interested in the functionality, they may look at it if the person has contributed a lot to Myth

[19:08:45]

iamlindoro:

In all honesty, all it takes is opening up the code and changing a few things (even just help text, etc.), and very shortly you have a sense of how things fit together

[19:08:57]

sphery:

reminds me I need to read a certain message on -dev from a certain jus ki

[19:08:58]

iamlindoro:

And what sphery said

[19:09:36]

iamlindoro:

I've written at least a couple patches I had no interest in because a) I was tired of hearing about it (incremental search) or b) the person has done other helpful work

[19:09:43]

iamlindoro:

(also incremental search)

[19:09:45]

sphery:

exactly

[19:10:07]

peque:

XLV Restrictions?? – I'm able to see 2 different streams – when setting the for 2recordings is set(allthough only on the same transponder) – But I though I would be able to see 1DVB-S recording and 1DVB-T recording – or see on in LiveTV and record something on DVB-T

[19:10:13]

brad2:

what other helpful work do people contribute? wiki's, question answering?

[19:10:27]

J-e-f-f-A:

peque: Hauppague's site says it's "Quad Mode", it doesn't say "Quad Tuner", so I suspect you may only be able to use one the card in one of the 4 modes at any one time. (just from a limited google search, etc, I may be completely wrong... ;-) )

[19:10:38]

brad2:

and i have to ask, what is incremental search? :)

[19:10:39]

iamlindoro:

brad2: That stuf, or in this case wrote a grabber for mythvideo and some other very helpful contrib scripts

[19:10:41]

sphery:

hey, I just thought of one of my patches I'm actually using--the huge frequency table fix patch... I wasn't using it at the time, but now that I'm using OTA, I am. :)

[19:11:13]

sphery:

(and I do use mythconverg_{backup,restore}.pl , though I don't rely on Myth to run it for me--yet)

[19:11:13]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: Sorry for the late reply been slaving over a hot keyboard and new script. My comments are Jamu is still limited due to a lack of support of Videos and graphics Storage Groups. Coded but not tested waiting for the 0.22 direction on SGs. My MythDB.py and MythVideo.py binding patches plus ttvdb.py are all good to go.

[19:11:14]

iamlindoro:

brad2: A commonly asked for feature in Mythvideo is the ability to "jump" to a letter in a large collection-- incremental search allows that, or to jump to a specific title in mythvideo

[19:11:30]

peque:

J-e-f-f-a: OK – at that point – So either DVB-S or DVB-T – Busted :-(

[19:12:41]

J-e-f-f-A:

peque: http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV-HVR-4000

[19:12:44]

brad2:

nice! okay enough with the newbie questions, i will sit and listen again

[19:12:44]

brad2:

haha

[19:14:02]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux, no worries, sounds like a plan

[19:14:17]

brad2:

actually one more, so your patches don't show up in "trunk" until the committers approve it? So I couldn't svn at this point and see your mythvideos work?

[19:14:26]

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[19:14:58]

sphery:

brad2: SVN allows you to keep local modifications and does its best to merge changes upstream with yours

[19:14:59]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: I will make the MythVideo.py binding SG aware when the direction is set. Again coded but not tested.

[19:15:17]

sphery:

though if you're doing development for Myth, you'll want a clean SVN working copy to test/create patches

[19:15:35]

sphery:

and, IMHO, if you're not using quilt to manage your patches, you're doing things the hard way

[19:15:46]

** kormoc has a billion svn checkouts... **

[19:15:46]

sphery:

(especially because of the long time involved in waiting for commits)

[19:15:52]

** kormoc is doing it wrong evidently **

[19:16:08]

sphery:

heh

[19:16:09]

peque:

J-e-f-f-A: It says Cannot be used simultanesly – But easely switched – So OK not at the same time? But still shoud be able to use it seperatelly

[19:16:10]

** kormoc re-opens #6700 **

[19:16:11]

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[19:16:48]

XLV:

peque, it may require unloading of module and reloading it with other module options

[19:16:54]

brad2:

cool i will check it out

[19:17:00]

XLV:

peque, that will affect the other hvr card too

[19:17:05]

sphery:

kormoc: more pies and clowns?

[19:17:12]

** sphery shouldn't have said anything **

[19:17:14]

** kormoc laughs **

[19:17:41]

brad2:

do you guys think there is anything wrong with buying a hdpvr right now, just to play around with it on a test machine? will anything in the upcoming (but distant) .22 make it obselete?

[19:18:01]

kormoc:

brad2, of course not! 0.22 will make it fully supported!

[19:18:05]

iamlindoro:

brad2: an HD-PVR is a safe bet for .22... .22 is not distant :)

[19:18:06]

kormoc:

buy buy buy!

[19:18:15]

brad2:

hahaha excellent

[19:18:23]

iamlindoro:

and it will be the newest device supported in .22, too

[19:18:35]

brad2:

i was holding off, because i saw some discussion posts about "now is not the time to buy new hardware"

[19:18:42]

brad2:

but they were probably talking cpu's etc.

[19:18:56]

iamlindoro:

Without knowing the context, I'll say that's possibly what I was thinking

[19:19:00]

J-e-f-f-A:

peque: Yeah, assuming both tuners work in Linux, you'd set the DVB-T and DVB-S tuners up with their respective sources (lineups), but put them in the same "Input Group" so that only one or the other can be used at once.

[19:19:10]

sphery:

I'm considering buying new CPU's for my backends (mainly to get a new mobo with SATA and PCIe)

[19:19:38]

brad2:

are you holding off for .22? Or you are intimately familiar with trunk so you know exactly what you need?

[19:19:48]

kormoc:

brad2, so unlike sphery, I don't use quilt, I do a complete seperate svn checout for each patch I work on, and then create .patch files (svn diff > file.patch) and then apply them to my vanilla ebuilds to build them, this way I'm more certain that I get things very stand-aloneish, but it's a very old school/gentoo way of doing things

[19:19:55]

sphery:

I'd agree, though, that now is not the time to buy untested/unproven CPU's or GPU's (i.e. atom/ion systems for what you /hope/ will work in 0.22+)

[19:19:56]

meshe:

sphery: even my AGP board has SATA

[19:20:51]

brad2:

excellent, new toy this weekend! hd pvr, woot woot. :>

[19:20:53]

** J-e-f-f-A is considering upgrading his backend, since his IVTV 'tinny audio' issue only started when he updated to this Asus mb... All google searches seem to indicate it was fixed long ago, yet I still have the issue on about 1/3 of my ivtv recordings... **

[19:20:55]

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[19:21:34]

iamlindoro:

brad2: Just bear in mind that it is only supported in trunk/future .22, but if all you are doing is playing with it on a test machine, that is safe

[19:21:45]

sphery:

brad2: if doing the multiple working copies approach, I'd recommend you at least do a single svn co followed by tar cjf , then just explode the tar to a new dir for working and--when ready for an svn up--explode the tar in an empty dir, svn up, then tar cjf :)

[19:21:56]

iamlindoro:

I still think it's a "safe" buy, though, as .22 is not far off, and I am very fond of the hardware

[19:22:12]

J-e-f-f-A:

meshe: I gave my son a 'pos' PC Chips MB that has both AGP and PCIe... I bought it for a cheap frontend, but didn't like it, and winblows is happy with it...

[19:23:08]

** J-e-f-f-A needs to sell a kidney so he can buy a couple of HD-PVRs... ;-) **

[19:23:27]

meshe:

J-e-f-f-A: i think my desktop has AGP and PCIe

[19:23:31]

brad2:

it does sound like fantastic hardware, i'm looking forward to seeing what it can do

[19:23:33]

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[19:23:49]

brad2:

i love my mythtv, but right now my recordings are off a hauppauge 250

[19:23:55]

brad2:

they look okay, but not spectacular :)

[19:24:22]

sphery:

brad2: and I'm really only holding off because I have 4 PCI capture cards in 2 backends with 3 HDD's each and I'm trying to decide whether to try to make a single backend with 6 HDD's and 4 capture cards or to stick with 2 backends--and I already have a working system and am already feeling guilty about having just purchased another computer to replace a working system

[19:24:31]

XLV:

brad2, hauppage is about as good as it gets with analog .. and, depending on reception, its not good enough

[19:24:33]

kormoc:

brad2, or what I do, I have mythtv-trunk-clean, I svn up that, and cp -r mythtv-trunk-clean mythtv-trunk-ticket_num or -feature or what not, so it's only one checkout over the wire

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[19:24:57]

peque:

J-e-f-f-A: OK – But have installed the multifrontend drivers, as written about further down the page – But will look into if its possible. As I can see dmesg ain't complaining about missing driver or firmware – so Shouldn't it be working? But I have though about putting them into same recording group – BUT as long as I cannot add the tuner input – Well that's the problems – Says the tuner is already in use

[19:25:06]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: My recordings are off a 250, 500 and HD tuners. The analog recordings are good, but pale in comparison to the HD sources (of course!) — it all depends on what you're feeding them and what your resoltion/bitrate is set to also...

[19:25:23]

brad2:

korm,sphery thanks for the advice, i'm going to start playing in the code and see what i can do. :> probably only break things, but it will be an education

[19:25:34]

sphery:

peque: multifrontend drivers sounds suspiciously like something for whom support will have to be added to MythTV

[19:25:48]

iamlindoro:

It was, a while back

[19:25:53]

XLV:

brad2, to hauppage's defence, a deck dvdrw hdd recorder i have has just a bit better quality

[19:26:26]

brad2:

xlv: don't get me wrong, the hauppauge cards are light years ahead of what i had previously tried

[19:26:27]

iamlindoro:

sphery: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/17832

[19:26:35]

sphery:

brad2: that's how you learn :) Just pick something you're interested in and see if you can make it happen. Feel free to ask questions if you need suggestions/input or just background info or info on future plans.

[19:26:47]

brad2:

every other card i tried before hauppauge was "It would be cool to make a dvr... but the quality of recordings blow, so i won't bother"

[19:27:00]

sphery:

brad2: the weak link in the chain with the analog SDTV cards is NTSC/PAL... Not the card. :)

[19:27:17]

XLV:

brad2, they are.. so even if those have average quality..

[19:27:35]

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[19:27:51]

sphery:

iamlindoro: heh... someone in here was actually trying to make that work.

[19:27:57]

sphery:

guess they were using -fixes?

[19:28:06]

iamlindoro:

I runno

[19:28:38]

meshe:

ruh roh

[19:28:41]

XLV:

brad2, another problem is that many lcd tvs do bad to very bad in sd signal, adding to loss of quality

[19:28:54]

brad2:

i think that could be part of my problem

[19:29:02]

peque:

Well – There a patch "somewhere" I added to the MythTv, and do working – otherwise I wasn't able to see 2 different recordings on the same card, so got multifrontend running, but cannot figure out why I cannot use the DVB-T tuner

[19:29:06]

brad2:

i output to a 50" plasma, and i think the size just explodes the problems for me

[19:29:13]

J-e-f-f-A:

peque: By 'multifrontend drivers', do you mean the symbolic links reference on that page to map /dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend1 to /dev/dvb/adapter1/fronten0 ???

[19:29:20]

brad2:

the interesting thing is.. most drama TV shows look okay

[19:29:31]

brad2:

but sports, forget about it.. i think it probably has something to do with the fast motion?

[19:29:37]

brad2:

i gave up trying to tape basketball games

[19:29:53]

peque:

J-e-f-f-A: No – its was the drivers not symlink

[19:30:15]

iamlindoro:

Sports on the 720p channels is always awesome looking (when they're actuallt shooting at 60 fps)

[19:30:33]

sphery:

iamlindoro: http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1/2009-06-30 [18:38:59] ... Too bad cpwp isn't here so I could let him know it's already in trunk.

[19:30:33]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: deinterlacers perhaps? Or poorly re-encoded signal from your provider?

[19:30:37]

iamlindoro:

Which is why I'd rather watch sports on ABC or Fox than NBC or CBS

[19:30:53]

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[19:30:55]

brad2:

yeah i think that will be the most enjoyable part of the .22 upgrade for me.. basketball in HD

[19:31:04]

brad2:

i think the signal is poorly re-encoded by my provider

[19:31:07]

sphery:

peque: though for the multifrontend stuff you have to run SVN trunk

[19:31:20]

brad2:

in fact, i can't even watch basketball on my TV, in straight live tv (not through myth box)

[19:31:26]

brad2:

the quality is just horrid

[19:31:30]

sphery:

peque: but the needed changes have been made there

[19:31:36]

brad2:

stupid rogers cable, haha

[19:31:45]

brad2:

but with HD it looks nice

[19:31:48]

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[19:31:54]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: ... Because I've seen Comcast's HD here locally, and it was visually blurred on high-motion stuff, they obviously re-compressed it too much. FiOS HD is crystal clear...

[19:31:55]

iamlindoro:

sphery: heh

[19:32:18]

meshe:

brad2: another canuck eh?

[19:32:26]

brad2:

i am, living in mississauga

[19:32:28]

brad2:

hating on rogers

[19:32:29]

brad2:

haha

[19:32:29]

peque:

I know – I am there and running svn.

[19:32:39]

meshe:

Vancouver here

[19:32:46]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: I dunno, in the past 6 months I have seen Comcast take the compression critiques seriously-- The bitrate on all my HD channels is sitting right at a nice 14 Mbit or so

[19:32:50]

brad2:

jeff: makes sense, can't wait to try it out on the hdpvr

[19:33:05]

brad2:

meshe: cool, do you use rogers as well?

[19:33:20]

peque:

But thanks guys – Will look into it tomorrow. Goodbye from Denmark

[19:33:20]

meshe:

nah, rogers bailed on the west coast gave us to Shaw

[19:33:28]

brad2:

iam: how do you tell what your hd show bitrate is?

[19:33:32]

meshe:

probably not a bad thing though

[19:33:58]

iamlindoro:

J-e-f-f-A: bitrate: 14472 kb/s <-- The lowest I can find right now

[19:33:59]

brad2:

can't be worse than rogers, last year rogers refused to pay for TSN 2, so i while living in toronto, i couldn't watch toronto raptors games

[19:34:08]

brad2:

despite paying 50/month for every sports package imaginable

[19:34:09]

brad2:

haha

[19:34:13]

meshe:

ouch

[19:34:20]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: I know some folks locally that switch to FiOS because of it... Perhaps they compress it less in your area, or are getting smarter over time... Last time I saw it was about 3 months ago and I wasn't impressed at all...

[19:34:23]

iamlindoro:

brad2: bitrate is total size in Kb/# of seconds-- but the easy way is ffmpeg -i filename

[19:34:52]

brad2:

iam: ahh gotcha, so i can't find that out on my stb? :)

[19:35:11]

iamlindoro:

I dunno... maybe in some maintenance menu-- but your STB will only be able to tell you the momentary bitrate

[19:35:22]

iamlindoro:

as opposed to over time which (to me) is of more value

[19:36:35]

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[19:36:37]

brad2:

so the usb connection for the hd pvr is no problem? I don't know why, but i always assumed the usb speed would be able to keep up with full HD programming

[19:36:45]

brad2:

err would NOT be able to

[19:36:56]

kormoc:

480 MBit > 20 MBit

[19:37:13]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, how would i search for the largest recording in the recording dir so i can check the bitrate here

[19:37:47]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: ls -S ?

[19:37:56]

iamlindoro:

or rather, ls -alS

[19:38:02]

brad2:

kormoc: good point when you put it like that :>

[19:38:20]

kormoc:

Shadow__X, ls --sort=size | head -n1

[19:38:38]

iamlindoro:

-S wins ;)

[19:38:43]

** kormoc laughs **

[19:38:51]

kormoc:

but I'll forget what that means in a few hours :P

[19:39:04]

Shadow__X:

eh not when you have afew recordings and you are using screen

[19:39:08]

Shadow__X:

it gets chopped off

[19:39:21]

kormoc:

Shadow__X, -S vs --sort=size

[19:39:28]

Shadow__X:

ah ok

[19:39:30]

Shadow__X:

nvm

[19:39:48]

Shadow__X:

whatso head -n1 just makes it display the first one

[19:39:54]

kormoc:

topical trout?

[19:40:07]

iamlindoro:

I think all trouts should be applies topically

[19:40:11]

iamlindoro:

er applied

[19:40:15]

** kormoc laughs **

[19:40:20]

meshe:

head -n2 would display the first 2 :)

[19:40:25]

iamlindoro:

!trout Shadow__X topical

[19:40:25]

** MythLogBot slaps Shadow__X with a topical trout on behalf of iamlindoro... **

[19:40:27]

iamlindoro:

hee?

[19:40:29]

iamlindoro:

er see?

[19:40:32]

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[19:40:41]

Aque0s:

[21:38:14] <Aque0s> hey all

[19:40:41]

Shadow__X:

ah ok i gotcha

[19:40:45]

Aque0s:

[21:39:08] <Aque0s> I have a single Hauppauge winTV-150 PVR card, can I have one video input (cable tv) on my composite video and another video input (security cameras) in the Tuner input?

[19:41:23]

XLV:

Aque0s, the tuner input is just that, the tuner

[19:41:25]

sphery:

Aque0s: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/232857#232857

[19:41:50]

Aque0s:

what is a Tuner? ;p

[19:41:58]

Aque0s:

ty sphery

[19:42:04]

meshe:

Aque0s: you can't use both the svideo and the tuner at the same time

[19:42:12]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, ok so according to this my bitrate is 12296kb/sec

[19:42:15]

kormoc:

Ahh, Encyclopedia Spherynnica strikes again

[19:42:17]

Shadow__X:

just over 12mbps?

[19:42:23]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: yes

[19:42:27]

sphery:

kormoc: heh... :)

[19:42:39]

iamlindoro:

Mbps, but close enough, anyway

[19:42:43]

J-e-f-f-A:

sphery: Dude, you are really quick with useful links. ;-) hehehe... Got them all memorized? ;-)

[19:42:48]

iamlindoro:

macros

[19:43:02]

Aque0s:

meshe, so basically its not possible.

[19:43:04]

Shadow__X:

hmm kormoc you get 480 Mbps on fios?

[19:43:08]

sphery:

I /really/ should put some macros in here for them

[19:43:14]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: He was talking about USB2

[19:43:15]

kormoc:

!stupiduserlinke2 !idiotIhate5, etc

[19:43:16]

kormoc:

:P

[19:43:17]

Aque0s:

i would need a capture card per video input?

[19:43:30]

meshe:

Aque0s: to use them simultaneously, yes, it's not possible, you need another card

[19:43:31]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: FIOS is still 19 Mbit or less

[19:43:34]

sphery:

I think, though, I'm just the biggest user of gossamer's search in the entire world

[19:43:37]

iamlindoro:

(as it's still QAM)

[19:43:45]

meshe:

Aque0s: thankfully pvr-150s can be had for like $30

[19:43:46]

orogor:

with a nova t card, can i recored more than one channel at once, if the transponders are emiting 6 channel at once?

[19:43:56]

iamlindoro:

But keep in mind, FIOS is not *sustaining* 19, it's maxing out there.. just like your cable

[19:43:58]

Shadow__X:

oh ok hmm i dont think the 12Mbps stuff looks bad

[19:44:03]

Shadow__X:

right

[19:44:27]

iamlindoro:

Comcast only looks crap when the averages dip down towards 7000–10000 Kbps

[19:44:28]

** J-e-f-f-A uses gossamer search too, I just don't have it on SPEED DIAL! ;-) **

[19:44:33]

iamlindoro:

but I haven't seen that in some time

[19:44:38]

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[19:44:58]

Shadow__X:

ah ok i like their cable now since they added qam back

[19:44:58]

sphery:

J-e-f-f-A: not bad for my little 7.5Mbps downstream b/w :)

[19:44:59]

Aque0s:

meshe: i dont have another PCI slot :/

[19:45:03]

Shadow__X:

but i dont like thier internets

[19:45:23]

meshe:

Aque0s: see if you can find a pvr-500

[19:45:35]

Aque0s:

nope, not where i live

[19:45:39]

Aque0s:

ive looked

[19:45:39]

XLV:

Aque0s, there are some usb hauppauge with mpeg2 hardware compressor that works with myth

[19:46:04]

Aque0s:

the only ones avaliable where i live

[19:46:07]

Aque0s:

are the 150s

[19:46:12]

Aque0s:

meshe: but, can i have both plugged in but only watch one at a time?

[19:46:18]

meshe:

Aque0s: yes

[19:46:22]

sphery:

Aque0s: yep, following the instructions I posted

[19:46:24]

Aque0s:

ah, cool

[19:46:25]

Aque0s:

okay :)

[19:46:32]

Aque0s:

ty sphery

[19:46:44]

Aque0s:

ty meshe

[19:46:51]

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[19:47:34]

sphery:

heh, meshe did all the hard work... I just posted a link that answered the how, but not the rest of your questions :)

[19:48:49]

J-e-f-f-A:

Aque0s: Got a PCIe slot? You might be able to use a low-profile 150 with one of these: http://tinyurl.com/luuv4y

[19:50:41]

orogor:

sphery, with a nova t card, can i recored more than one channel at once, if the transponders are emitting 6 channel at once? with

[19:50:54]

iamlindoro:

orogor: yes

[19:51:06]

iamlindoro:

orogor: You can record up to the entire contents of a single transponder per digital card

[19:51:15]

orogor:

humm

[19:51:18]

AndyCap:

J-e-f-f-A: heh, that was a little kinky.

[19:51:30]

AndyCap:

I'll take two. :P

[19:51:30]

iamlindoro:

So if the transponder = 6 channels, those are the six you can record with a single DVB-T tuner

[19:51:52]

J-e-f-f-A:

Aque0s: There are even boxes that give you 4 PCI slots in an external box, using one PCIe slot. Pricey though – approx $250 USD...

[19:51:56]

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[19:52:06]

iamlindoro:

orogor: You can set the max number you can record in mythtv-setup, capture card setup, edit the card, Recording options, "Max Recordings"

[19:52:27]

meshe:

J-e-f-f-A: cheaper to buy a new mobo at that point

[19:52:41]

iamlindoro:

meshe: Mobo's are cheaper than $8? :)

[19:52:47]

AndyCap:

meshe: assuming you're able to find one.

[19:52:50]

J-e-f-f-A:

Exactly... although new motherboards have less and less pci slots... ;-)

[19:52:58]

AndyCap:

magma is too expensive

[19:53:02]

iamlindoro:

oh, the box

[19:53:04]

iamlindoro:

my bad

[19:53:16]

iamlindoro:

!trout iamlindoro

[19:53:16]

** MythLogBot slaps iamlindoro with a trout on behalf of iamlindoro... **

[19:53:17]

AndyCap:

maybe some server boards still have mucho pci

[19:53:35]

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[19:53:47]

meshe:

just buy standard ATX boards and not the mATX

[19:53:50]

AndyCap:

oh, maybe search ebay outside of the us helps when looking for dvb-c

[19:53:58]

XLV:

AndyCap, asus p5gc

[19:54:04]

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[19:54:10]

brad2:

when you guys record shows, do you transcode everything? I tend not to transcode anything, so I can keep everything in my "watch recordings" view, am I being stupid?

[19:54:24]

AndyCap:

Well, I found one board, but of course, in the faq for that it says, don't use tv cards in it

[19:54:27]

sphery:

gotta get Intel-based... Seems all modern AMD ones max out at 3 PCI

[19:54:29]

iamlindoro:

I don't transcode anything

[19:54:36]

XLV:

AndyCap, if its not EOLed... last mb with 6 pci slots thats supports c2d/q ( from 45nm ones, only duals )

[19:54:37]

iamlindoro:

disk is cheap, and I like to preserve quality

[19:54:37]

meshe:

brad2: i don't transcode unless i'm taking it with me on my iphone

[19:54:49]

brad2:

ahh okay, that what i thought too

[19:54:57]

brad2:

i would always just buy more drives, haha

[19:54:59]

AndyCap:

brad2: you can transcode and have it in the recordings section though, but if you're recording mpeg, why bother

[19:55:00]

iamlindoro:

I do lossless cut commercials out, though

[19:55:13]

iamlindoro:

and once I do that, move things to mythvideo

[19:55:32]

brad2:

so all of your recordings reside in mythvideo?

[19:55:38]

sphery:

transcode is likely more expensive than new disk space when you factor the energy cost of max'ing out your CPU for hours on end

[19:55:55]

brad2:

how do you do auto commerical cuts? don't you have to verify that each commerical break is correct?

[19:56:03]

sphery:

auto isn't a good plan

[19:56:11]

** meshe uses auto **

[19:56:14]

sphery:

if you like the show/want to archive it, verify it first

[19:56:31]

meshe:

for iphone transcodes that is

[19:56:35]

sphery:

brad2: you can have it automatically /mark/ commercials, but I recommend you don't automatically cut them

[19:56:53]

iamlindoro:

brad2: http://www.fecitfacta.com/seas-epi-sub.png

[19:56:55]

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[19:57:08]

brad2:

makes sense, i think the commercial detection is awesome, but it doesn't work 100% of the time for me

[19:57:12]

brad2:

especially mtv confuses it

[19:57:12]

sphery:

meshe: ah, well, that's different... On an iPhone screen, you can't actually /see/ anything, so you wouldn't know whether the picture was commercial or whether it cut out part of the show

[19:57:30]

sphery:

unless you get a nice pair of magnifying glasses :)

[19:57:32]

meshe:

sphery: try and iPhone before you make statements like that ;)

[19:57:38]

brad2:

iamlindoro: wow your mythvideo looks so much cooler than mine, hahah

[19:57:52]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, likes to show off

[19:58:08]

iamlindoro:

brad2: It helps when you wrote the theme, then wrote the patches to improve the functionality, then rewrote the theme around them ;)

[19:58:11]

sphery:

I just think my TV should be bigger than a DVD disc :)

[19:58:15]

brad2:

if my screens looked like his, i would show off too

[19:58:15]

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[19:58:19]

J-e-f-f-A:

iamlindoro: Yikes, I may go buy that season just for the cover... ;-)

[19:58:28]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: It's not as though I haven't released the theme and put the patches in trac ;)

[19:58:30]

brad2:

iam: you are my new yodo, i will do whatever you say, just teach me your ways

[19:58:31]

brad2:

haha

[19:58:40]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, :) kudos keep up the great work

[19:58:41]

AndyCap:

expensive dvb-c receiver. :P http://contact.ebay.com/ws1/eBayISAPI.dll?vie . . . 190322857058

[19:59:10]

iamlindoro:

brad2: Just takes a lot of time and actually starting to mess with stuff

[19:59:17]

brad2:

iam: which theme are you using?

[19:59:24]

iamlindoro:

Graphite

[19:59:37]

iamlindoro:

http://www.fecitfacta.com/Graphite/Home.html

[20:00:11]

sphery:

iamlindoro: you know, that would look much better with variable-width button lists...

[20:00:16]

iamlindoro:

sphery: hahaha

[20:00:16]

AndyCap:

XLV: hmm, could only find the amputated P5GC-MX. did I get the model right?

[20:00:28]

iamlindoro:

sphery: If you think so, I have a dev list message you can respond to

[20:00:39]

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[20:00:54]

XLV:

AndyCap, well, there are other models with p5gc-something.. the one i am talking about is p5gc

[20:01:15]

sphery:

iamlindoro: just saying because I finally read the e-mail and realized I don't understand the UI goal well enough to help, yet... So helping would take a lot of coming up to speed on mythui/themes. May get around to it, eventually, but not likely before 0.22.

[20:01:32]

sphery:

so I figured I'd try to push helping off on someone else so I don't feel guilty

[20:01:42]

iamlindoro:

sphery: Not I, I've read it and have no idea

[20:01:57]

iamlindoro:

think gbee is likely the only person who can help

[20:02:22]

sphery:

gbee has the benefit of understanding all there is about current mythui and knowing the plan for future mythui

[20:02:40]

XLV:

AndyCap, it might be EOLed

[20:03:44]

XLV:

btw whats the status with pci-e tuners and linux? still problems?

[20:03:57]

iamlindoro:

Nothing about PCIe preventing tuners from working

[20:03:58]

sphery:

think the HVR-1250 is in good shape

[20:04:02]

iamlindoro:

there are a number that work well

[20:04:20]

AndyCap:

ah, found it http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?content=spec . . . jN9RECUHpfLf

[20:04:21]

sphery:

and a number that don't, right?

[20:04:29]

sphery:

but not because of the PCIe

[20:04:33]

iamlindoro:

HVR-1250, HVR-1800 (minus the one driver bug with Analog), HVR-2250 (digital only so far)

[20:04:39]

iamlindoro:

sphery: right, just as with all interfaces

[20:05:52]

brad2:

what programs do you guys use to back up your main mythtv system drives? I use raid to keep my recordings moderately safe, but if my system drive ever went, I would be pooched

[20:05:52]

XLV:

AndyCap, yeap, with beta bios it supports 45nm dual cores too

[20:06:17]

laga:

raid != backup

[20:06:44]

XLV:

AndyCap, got one in mine.. 6320 oced to 2.6GHz.. but i havent utilized but one of those pci slots :/ with a pvr 350

[20:06:46]

brad2:

definitely not backup, but at least it safes me when single drives randomly puke

[20:07:00]

brad2:

saves me even

[20:07:06]

AndyCap:

XLV: time to sell it then. :-P

[20:07:16]

XLV:

AndyCap, using it more as a nmt that anything else

[20:07:50]

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[20:07:51]

AndyCap:

a what?

[20:07:51]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: My OS and DB are on a mirrored 200GB drive, with daily mysql dumps, and that dump is also copied to an external NAS device too.

[20:08:08]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: So if I lose my OS, I can always re-build and restore the DB...

[20:08:28]

XLV:

AndyCap, bah.. i guess sometime ( before linux hasnt any problem with pci-e tuners ) the time/energy etc to get some dvb-s(2) and get a sat dish

[20:08:29]

brad2:

jeff: how do mirror your os? is that a program like acronis?

[20:08:46]

XLV:

AndyCap, nmt=network media tank.. to play content

[20:08:51]

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[20:08:54]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: hardware raid card. ;-)

[20:09:13]

brad2:

ahhh, hahaha out of my league :)

[20:09:23]

AndyCap:

another fancy word for file server. when will it end. :P

[20:09:52]

XLV:

AndyCap, nope, the content is stored in a file server, that one is connected to the tv too

[20:10:08]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: i don't backup/mirror/raid my video drives anymore – had 2 WD 500's die at once when i had it in a Raid5 setup (6 discs), and lost all recordings. Now I just use 6x individual drives with Storage Groups and no mirroring/backup.

[20:10:08]

XLV:

like the egreathd nmts eg

[20:10:40]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: It's just a $30 pcie 2-port raid card. It does all the work... ;-) The OS sees it as one disk.

[20:11:07]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: It has a little buzzer on it in case one of the drives fails.

[20:12:15]

orogor:

J-e-f-f-A, i dont trust that to be HW and do all the work

[20:12:59]

defecatn:

hi, my ubuntu's boxes ip changed and for some reason mythtv is keeping the old ip. also mythtv-setup won't save a new ip I enter. I've restartred teh computer. restarted mythbackend a bunch of times without any luck:(. Does aynone have any idea what I can check? Thanks

[20:13:43]

sphery:

locate all mysql.txt and config.xml files on your drive and edit them

[20:13:56]

orogor:

defecatn, i am also using ubuntu and i have a lot of qsuicrks in mythtv

[20:13:57]

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[20:14:11]

defecatn:

sphery where would those be?

[20:14:17]

orogor:

use locate

[20:14:29]

defecatn:

orogor this is a real drag. let me try locate

[20:14:34]

defecatn:

thanks guys

[20:14:42]

wagnerrp:

well that was a completely failed attempt at drive spindown on my server

[20:14:54]

orogor:

locate config.xml, and do updatedb if it return nothing , then locate again

[20:15:16]

orogor:

grummble backend just crashed

[20:15:19]

wagnerrp:

i go into my card configuration webpage, enable it

[20:15:32]

wagnerrp:

15 minutes later, the timer hits, and my file server siezes up

[20:15:46]

AndyCap:

orogor: sounds like you should learn how to use find

[20:16:07]

orogor:

AndyCap, i think i remmeber you

[20:16:21]

sphery:

why? if you don't mind the security implications of locate (or even slocate), it's fast, but find is slow

[20:16:24]

brad2:

do most people use this raid mirroring strategy to backup their systems?

[20:16:29]

orogor:

find /etc/ -name *config.xml* -print

[20:16:37]

laga:

raid != backup

[20:16:50]

defecatn:

okay guys I found config.xml under my home dir/.mythtv/

[20:16:55]

defecatn:

what do i edit?

[20:16:58]

orogor:

yes, locate is faster, syntax uis easier

[20:17:00]

sphery:

orogor: though config.xml shouldn't be in /etc (or, if it is, should also be linked elsewhere)

[20:17:05]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: I think this is the one I'm using – although I thought I remembered mine having an audible alarm for a failed drive... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816132008

[20:17:15]

AndyCap:

but changing stuff and running updatedb to find it again all the time is stupid

[20:17:28]

orogor:

should be in daily crontav

[20:17:31]

orogor:

b

[20:17:58]

wagnerrp:

J-e-f-f-A: two drives? almost doesnt seem worthwhile

[20:18:00]

sphery:

yeah, if you use locate, you should be automating updatedb

[20:18:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

orogor: When the Bios detects it as one drive, and I have no drivers or software raid in place, it's done in hardware.

[20:18:02]

AndyCap:

case in point: "orogor> locate config.xml, and do updatedb if it return nothing , then locate again"

[20:18:06]

defecatn:

not much to config.xml

[20:18:15]

defecatn:

I don't see a place where the ip settings go

[20:18:19]

orogor:

humm, i can t see which channel are asigned to which transponder, but still the system consider there are many video cards

[20:18:22]

J-e-f-f-A:

wagnerrp: That's just for my OS and database – mirrored 200GB drives currently.

[20:18:27]

AndyCap:

now, if someone were to write a more advanced locate using notify, one would really be onto somthing

[20:18:27]

sphery:

though, I wonder (haven't used locate in forever) if locate now has a daemon program that uses inotify to just keep the DB up-to-date at all times

[20:18:42]

iamlindoro:

locate relies on updatedb

[20:18:49]

wagnerrp:

ah, ive got one of these for that... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816131006

[20:18:51]

iamlindoro:

sudo updatedb && locate filename

[20:19:00]

sphery:

AndyCap: heh, we both went the same place

[20:19:00]

orogor:

AndyCap, it s needed to reindex if he instaled the package today

[20:19:34]

wagnerrp:

although im considering just moving them to the board, and using software RAID

[20:19:47]

orogor:

sphery, nope i dont think so

[20:20:09]

wagnerrp:

im running out of room, and starting a new array with only one port free is a difficult proposition

[20:20:14]

kormoc:

sphery, http://savannah.gnu.org/bugs/?26945

[20:20:18]

orogor:

inotify stuff for desktop stuff is hell slow to index to my taste

[20:20:18]

brad2:

wagnerrp: wow that's a big raid card, hahaha

[20:20:23]

** J-e-f-f-A drools at wagnerrp's raid card... he wants one too... ;-) **

[20:20:46]

wagnerrp:

looks like its gone down in price

[20:20:49]

sphery:

kormoc: so, I guess Beagle is the new locate w/ inotify

[20:20:53]

wagnerrp:

im not sure if they even make it anymore

[20:20:55]

AndyCap:

if they weren't so expensive per port.

[20:20:58]

AndyCap:

sphery: eeww.

[20:21:10]

AndyCap:

that puppy must die.

[20:21:13]

sphery:

agreed

[20:21:50]

J-e-f-f-A:

wagnerrp: I had been running a software raid5 with the 6 on-board sata ports, but after dual WD500 failures, I switched to Storage groups. And just about a month ago, one of the remaining 4 WD500's failed... so lost about 450GB of recordings that time...

[20:22:05]

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[20:22:06]

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[20:22:17]

wagnerrp:

anyway, brad2.... a semi frequent practice around here is independent drives for recording, and a raid array for long term storage

[20:22:29]

orogor:

wagnerrp, which rack do you use with the card?

[20:22:43]

wagnerrp:

rack? i dont have a rack

[20:22:49]

brad2:

wagnerr: are there advantages to your hardware raid card instead of just using mdadm in linux?

[20:23:01]

orogor:

huh how are the drives agenced then?

[20:23:13]

wagnerrp:

agenced?

[20:23:16]

defecatn:

i wonder why mythtv-setup won't save the new ip i add

[20:23:21]

defecatn:

this is driving me nuts:(

[20:23:28]

orogor:

brad2, cpu usage and he can plug 12 drives

[20:23:33]

kormoc:

defecatn, verify you don't have any crashed tables?

[20:23:40]

meshe:

defecatn: sounds like it can't connect to the db

[20:23:48]

J-e-f-f-A:

wagnerrp: when i lost the 2.5TB of recordings (dual 500 fail), somebody at work asked me – "You didn't have a backup?" – to which I replied – "Sure, I backed up my 2.5TB of recordings to 5,320 dvds!!!" Not!

[20:23:50]

orogor:

wagnerrp, where do you put the drives?

[20:24:02]

wagnerrp:

brad2: its all preference, i do a lot of stuff on that machine, so i didnt want to tie up the processor for RAID

[20:24:10]

sphery:

J-e-f-f-A: agreed... it's just tv

[20:24:11]

defecatn:

meshe yeah probably right.

[20:24:20]

defecatn:

kormoc how do i check if i have any crashed tables?

[20:24:21]

sphery:

and--for those shows I care about--I could just buy the DVD's if they don't re-air

[20:24:23]

AndyCap:

J-e-f-f-A: no, no, LTO tape. :P

[20:24:25]

** defecatn = newbie **

[20:24:30]

orogor:

J-e-f-f-A, could do disk to disk to tape if you have the budet

[20:24:36]

iamlindoro:

defecatn: mysqlcheck -u root mythconverg

[20:24:38]

wagnerrp:

orogor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811182551

[20:24:39]

GreyFoxx:

and time

[20:24:43]

GreyFoxx:

takes are crazy slow

[20:24:46]

GreyFoxx:

and low on space

[20:25:08]

sphery:

defecatn: or, better, run optimize_mythdb.pl

[20:25:09]

GreyFoxx:

If you need to backup 2.5TB of data the only timely way is Rsync to another box

[20:25:10]

iamlindoro:

LTO IV isn't bad

[20:25:15]

meshe:

defecatn: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/User_Manual:Period . . . the_Database

[20:25:17]

wagnerrp:

brad2: and i have my file server running freebsd... at the time i bought the card, i was not happy with the software raid options in freebsd

[20:25:19]

J-e-f-f-A:

AndyCap: Hehe... we use LTO at work... even LTO3 is only 400GB native – it would have taken nearly 6 tapes... ;-)

[20:25:22]

GreyFoxx:

And that's AFTER the initial rsync is done

[20:25:23]

brad2:

jeffa: losing 2 drives at once blows. I've lost 4 drives over the past month.. but my backend was generous enough to fail one drive at a time, in an orderly fashion :)

[20:25:24]

iamlindoro:

1.6 TB a tape, I use them here at work-- not hceap, though

[20:25:27]

iamlindoro:

er cheap

[20:25:28]

AndyCap:

LTO4 is 800, so.

[20:25:44]

orogor:

wagnerrp, not rackable and no hot swap?

[20:25:45]

gbee:

pack rats

[20:25:48]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Check again

[20:25:49]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, what's the read/write speed?

[20:26:03]

wagnerrp:

brad2: if i were going to build it from scratch now, i would probably use software raid-z and some cheap 8-port controller cards instead of a hardware raid controller

[20:26:14]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: I am pretty sure.

[20:26:16]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: "iamlindoro changes the tape once a day during backup week" :)

[20:26:21]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: I am 100% sure :)

[20:26:27]

wagnerrp:

orogor: i have 4 3-in-2 hotswap cages in the 5.25" bays

[20:26:30]

iamlindoro:

1.6 w/ compression

[20:26:33]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: that LTO4 is not 800?

[20:26:35]

brad2:

wagerrp: great thanks for the advice, was pondering building a new file server. and what do you use to back up your main system drive?

[20:26:38]

J-e-f-f-A:

brad2: Yeah, it's only TV, so I just switched to storage groups. Much faster imho than software raid too.

[20:26:40]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Yes

[20:26:48]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: then what is it?

[20:26:49]

orogor:

J-e-f-f-A, 6 tapes is ok , it s not like you fill the 2.5T every week and anyway you have a tray to put tape groups no?

[20:26:55]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Again, 1.6

[20:26:56]

defecatn:

meshe thanks.

[20:27:04]

orogor:

a tape robot

[20:27:15]

defecatn:

sphery okay i'm doing that. what am I looking for? something to not say "OK"?

[20:27:15]

J-e-f-f-A:

orogor: I don't have the $$$ for an LTO drive at home. ;-)

[20:27:17]

XLV:

just get more hdds. run raid6

[20:27:18]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: compression is very variable and not useful with video so. 800

[20:27:20]

** sphery is a firm believer that HDD failures are just the Universe's way of telling me I get a chance to do it over again--and make it better this time **

[20:27:30]

orogor:

J-e-f-f-A, neither do i

[20:27:31]

sphery:

defecatn: after that's done, you don't have crashed tables

[20:27:33]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: I get 1.6 on all my tapes at work-- therefore, 1.6.

[20:27:41]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, AndyCap, looks like LTO-5 is 1.6T, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_Tape-Open#LTO-5

[20:27:48]

sphery:

defecatn: so, now you can go into mythtv-setup and change the ip

[20:27:55]

AndyCap:

kormoc: that would be the logical progression yes. :P

[20:27:58]

meshe:

run a mirror set of raids

[20:28:05]

orogor:

kormoc, you can t buy lto5 yet

[20:28:06]

brad2:

sphery: you are a better man than me.. i lose a system drive, i start to openly weep :)

[20:28:10]

defecatn:

sphery okay thanks. let me try. i wonder why ubuntu had my inet ip instead of localhost

[20:28:21]

sphery:

though, if you're talking about the MySQL server IP, you really need to edit mysql.txt and config.xml files

[20:28:22]

** iamlindoro gets the 4.5 TB array on 3 x LTO IVs just fine ;) **

[20:28:46]

J-e-f-f-A:

We typically see about 1.4:1 compression on the data at my job... nowhere near the claimed 2:1 compression...

[20:28:46]

XLV:

eg dell perc5.. 8 sata hdds, -2 cause of raid6.. get a cheap sli mb, use some pci video card, use the two peg slots for percs.. 16hdds-4 for raid6 = 12 hdds.. x1.5TB = 18TB

[20:28:52]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: fine, now put 3TB of video on it and let's see again.

[20:29:07]

kormoc:

ahh, the notes say that manufacturers claim 2:1 is normal compression

[20:29:11]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Why does it bother you so much? The tapes themselves claim 1.6 TB, I'm staring at one now

[20:29:20]

XLV:

also there are some promise/highpoint pci-e 1x controllers with 4 sas ports for 80$ or so

[20:29:26]

sphery:

brad2: the whole reason I've been so unmotivated to work on a major upgrade/reconfigure project for my systems is because the stupid HDD's won't fail on me :)

[20:29:36]

wagnerrp:

brad2: for backups, i primarily use online snapshotting of the file system

[20:29:40]

XLV:

and run software raid on them

[20:29:46]

sphery:

(even though one has been making terrible clicking noises since before Dec 2008)

[20:29:50]

meshe:

XLV: yeah, but isn't the price of sas drvies still crazy per GB?

[20:29:52]

wagnerrp:

i have no redundancy on my boot drives, so if they go, i have to reinstall

[20:29:52]

iamlindoro:

ie http://www.databazaar.com/Inkjet_Cartridge/Pr . . . LTX800G.html

[20:29:54]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: that is not the native capacity though, which is what this started out with

[20:30:01]

XLV:

meshe, you will just use sata hdds

[20:30:07]

wagnerrp:

but considering that can be done in a couple hours, im not too concerned about it

[20:30:14]

AndyCap:

SONLTX800G <-- Fail. :P

[20:30:24]

XLV:

meshe, sata hdd can connect to a sas controller, the other way around isnt possible

[20:30:36]

defecatn:

sphery it didnt' work. do i have to refill my databass everytime for it to take or should the ip have changed after I enter it without mythfill?

[20:30:44]

wagnerrp:

brad2: anything im really concerned about losing, i just copy off to an external drive occasionally and throw it in a drawer

[20:30:46]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Sony LTO 4 1.6TB Ultrium Tape Cartridge (LTX800G) -WIN

[20:30:46]

XLV:

perc5 are like 150$ in ebay with bbue and all

[20:30:50]

brad2:

wagnerrp: looks interesting, i will check it out

[20:31:01]

meshe:

XLV: ahhh, thanks

[20:31:03]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap: Or perhaps you would enjoy http://www.databazaar.com/SiteImages/Products . . . /LTX800G.jpg

[20:31:10]

XLV:

and in the end, its just tv..

[20:31:11]

sphery:

defecatn: what about mythfilldatabase? you don't need to run that

[20:31:18]

iamlindoro:

See giganticest text in the image

[20:31:34]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: technically, thats only 800GB

[20:31:34]

defecatn:

sphery: okay i'm stuck. for some reason a ip it entered that can't be changed with mythtv-setup

[20:31:37]

defecatn:

:(

[20:31:51]

XLV:

meshe, or use port multiplies with compatible controllers ( though, with the price of multipliers, a separate controller is more worth it, if you got slots to spare )

[20:31:54]

sphery:

defecatn: which IP? What error message? What symptoms?

[20:32:15]

wagnerrp:

and besides, you have to buy a several thousand dollar drive to use them (or a several tens of thousands of dollar robotic auto-loader)

[20:32:18]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: I acknowledge that the native capacity is 800, But 1.6 Is what Ig et onto it each and every time, and they are marketed as 1.6 TB tapes-- therefore IMHO 1.6 is a valid and correct answer

[20:32:35]

meshe:

XLV: i'm going to need to add 4 more SATA ports and another tuner card soon

[20:32:39]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: I never suggested them as a valid myth backup option, and I myself mentioned they were too expensive

[20:32:58]

wagnerrp:

well by that standard, you may as well just buy 4TB hard drive backups

[20:33:33]

wagnerrp:

i guess the only reason to use tape any more is longevity

[20:33:33]

defecatn:

sphery I guess the stop utuntu setup used my inet ip and it changed last now. Now mythweb etc can't connect to the master backend. If i do a mythtvfilldatabase it also failes due to it looking for the older ip. I ran mythtv-setup a ton of times and it will allow me to change the ip but then i go back into it and the older ip is there.

[20:33:40]

defecatn:

stop=stock

[20:33:44]

wagnerrp:

theyre rated for decades arent they?

[20:33:54]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: Longevity is why we use them, yes

[20:33:55]

defecatn:

crappy last night

[20:33:56]

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[20:33:57]

defecatn:

sorry

[20:34:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

But they've been playing the 2x compression game for years now... nothing new... Real-world compression is often lower, uness the source is highly-compressible data, like text documents, etc.

[20:34:07]

sphery:

defecatn: MythWeb is configured in mythweb.conf

[20:34:13]

XLV:

meshe, and even if you are out of pci-e slots, just build another pc, write to it over network, thats the cheapest way around it, if you dont mind the increased power bill costs

[20:34:19]

defecatn:

sphery but also i can't fill the databass

[20:34:24]

davidm is now known as Guest79120

[20:34:25]

AndyCap:

J-e-f-f-A: for as long as I can remember tapes.

[20:34:26]

sphery:

defecatn: and mythfilldatabase is likely being run as a different user (and, therefore, using a different config.xml)

[20:34:33]

AndyCap:

i.e QIC-80.

[20:34:40]

sphery:

defecatn: which is why I keep saying locate every mysql.txt and config.xml on your system and edit it

[20:34:47]

orogor:

comercial recording on low priority is only the job starting at nice 20 , right?

[20:34:50]

defecatn:

sphery i didnt see anyhting to edit though

[20:34:52]

sphery:

defecatn: but also, now, edit mythweb.conf :)

[20:35:05]

wagnerrp:

meshe: if youre low on ports, check the users list

[20:35:06]

defecatn:

sphery let me write this down

[20:35:18]

meshe:

XLV: I might make that move next year and upgrade the network to gig and go I-SCSI

[20:35:23]

sphery:

defecatn: verify DBHostName>

[20:35:28]

wagnerrp:

there was some discussion on inexpensive large non-raid cards

[20:35:34]

meshe:

wagnerrp: i will thanks

[20:35:53]

defecatn:

sphery how do I do that?

[20:36:02]

sphery:

in those files...

[20:36:08]

orogor:

there are chainable cards as well

[20:36:08]

wagnerrp:

8-port cards that accepted port expanders up to 100 or so devices

[20:36:22]

sphery:

defecatn: mysql.txt and config.xml

[20:36:27]

defecatn:

sphery okay let me see

[20:36:27]

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[20:36:38]

sphery:

defecatn: and note that some might be right and some wrong

[20:36:40]

meshe:

wagnerrp: nice

[20:37:16]

** meshe is thinking permission issues now **

[20:37:49]

defecatn:

sphery this setup was working well for a long time.

[20:37:59]

defecatn:

sphery I didn't even run a update etc to break it:)

[20:38:02]

sphery:

actually, the code for saving config.xml is borked, so it only works in some very specific situations--and, IIRC, if it already exists, will only work in mythfrontend

[20:38:06]

XLV:

wagnerrp, also, there are some rack cases that take 20 3.5" hdds for 300$ or so.. http://www.directron.com/rpc4020.html

[20:38:47]

sphery:

defecatn: yeah, Myth requires a static IP address

[20:38:49]

XLV:

wagnerrp, cause the costs of 5.25" to 3.5" cages add up in the end

[20:39:02]

sphery:

really needs the MySQL server and all backends to have static IP's

[20:39:05]

AndyCap:

nobody's made a OEM version of the thumper case yet I guess

[20:39:19]

sphery:

so if anything (including your router) decides to change the IP, it will break

[20:39:27]

defecatn:

sphery i'm trying to set it to just use 192.168.0.1 but it won't allow the change to stick:(

[20:39:32]

wagnerrp:

XLV: yeah, it was ~$400 for that case and the four caddys

[20:39:54]

sphery:

defecatn: yeah, that sounds like the Network Manager "virus" (not a virus, just a very bad program, IMHO)

[20:39:55]

wagnerrp:

ill have to remember that for later

[20:40:16]

wagnerrp:

i intend to rebuild off of this from scratch with a small rack in a year or two

[20:40:51]

defecatn:

sphery let me go check those files you told me to. maybe i'll luck out

[20:41:06]

defecatn:

sphery by thanks a lot for your help/time

[20:41:11]

meshe:

sphery: after a great battle with NetworkManager including it's death and ressurection, I was able to finally set a static IP on my machine and keep network manager running for easy vpn access

[20:41:12]

XLV:

also there are a few mbs with 4 peg slots now.. with those and some percs and some case like the above you can stuff lots of hdds

[20:41:29]

wagnerrp:

peg?

[20:41:40]

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[20:41:43]

XLV:

pci express graphics aka pci-e 16x

[20:41:44]

** AndyCap just makes static entries in dhcpd.conf. **

[20:41:45]

wagnerrp:

oh, pci-express graphics

[20:41:46]

wagnerrp:

right

[20:42:09]

XLV:

some amd ones are even not that expensive

[20:42:40]

meshe:

AndyCap: i used to as well until i took down my server than ran dhcpd

[20:42:43]

J-e-f-f-A:

AndyCap: I hope you have your anti-static wriststrap on! ;-)

[20:42:51]

XLV:

sure they run the pci-e slots not at 16x electrical, but thats not a problem, perc ( and all raid controllers ) are max pci-e 8x and will clock down and work ok even in 4x

[20:43:04]

AndyCap:

J-e-f-f-A: that would defeat the purpose wouldn't it? :P

[20:43:17]

wagnerrp:

XLV: the ones that ive seen are all at least x4 electrical

[20:43:21]

XLV:

its not like you need loads of bandwidth to write from tuners, or play back

[20:43:40]

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[20:43:40]

XLV:

wagnerrp, yeah, 8 ports one are 4x

[20:43:50]

XLV:

wagnerrp, there are some 4 ports 1x

[20:43:57]

wagnerrp:

XLV: i mean the mobo slots

[20:44:01]

AndyCap:

XLV: ooh, where?

[20:44:30]

wagnerrp:

the ones for tri/quad sli/crossfire that ive seen have at least x4 electrical slots

[20:48:45]

XLV:

AndyCap, PROMISE FastTrak TX4650

[20:49:11]

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[20:49:31]

AndyCap:

XLV: nice. finally. :)

[20:49:34]

XLV:

andreax, http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/rr2640x1.htm

[20:50:43]

J-e-f-f-A:

XLV – isn't that fake-raid though? (ie: no hardware raid?)

[20:50:46]

XLV:

wagnerrp, yeah, thats what i say, even if they are 4x electrical, a perc or any other 8x controller will clock down and work at 4x.. 4x=1GByte/s

[20:50:59]

XLV:

J-e-f-f-A, yeah, you get those to run software raid

[20:51:18]

AndyCap:

J-e-f-f-A: mostly looking for a SiL3114 replacement.

[20:52:15]

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[20:52:26]

XLV:

if you want hardware raid5/6, you get a dell perc5 from ebay for 150$ or so, bbu and all

[20:52:30]

J-e-f-f-A:

wow, it's SAS? Humm...

[20:52:34]

Shadow__X:

i get my dell mini 10v tomorrow lets see how it goes i think it can be a great mobile fe

[20:53:06]

xris:

anyone have thoughts why compiling mythtv doesn't seem to find vdpau/vdpau.h when it clearly lives in /use/lib/nvidia?

[20:53:29]

kormoc:

xris, that's not a standard include path

[20:53:40]

xris:

kormoc: so where would I go to add that?

[20:53:50]

Shadow__X:

i know i am new but...

[20:53:51]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: as long as you are using only low bitrate SD stuff

[20:54:16]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, no 1080p goodness on a 1024x600 screen?

[20:54:20]

kormoc:

xris, ./configure --help should show you an option to add extra include paths

[20:54:20]

wagnerrp:

XLV: thats actually a bit more pricey than the ones they found on the mailing list

[20:54:24]

Shadow__X:

;)

[20:54:47]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: I have my doubts about 720x480 given the right codec and/or bitrate

[20:54:48]

xris:

wait. /usr/lib/.. that should be lib64

[20:54:53]

wagnerrp:

they were loking at this one http://www.supermicro.com/products/accessorie . . . ASLP-MV8.cfm

[20:55:02]

xris:

oh. /usr/include, not /usr/lib

[20:55:03]

xris:

but still

[20:55:19]

wagnerrp:

and this one http://www.areca.us/products/sasnoneraid.htm

[20:55:20]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, yeah i know its gma 950 and an atom n270

[20:55:21]

XLV:

wagnerrp, thats software raid

[20:55:30]

** iamlindoro shudders at single core atoms **

[20:55:31]

XLV:

wagnerrp, perc5 is hardware raid ..

[20:55:40]

xris:

kormoc: actually, ./configure doesn't say

[20:55:53]

** xris pokes into the qmake files **

[20:55:58]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, its a 10inch laptop with bluetooth and 6cell batt for 192 with a 25 dollar giftcard

[20:56:06]

Shadow__X:

not worth it?

[20:56:17]

Shadow__X:

192 with tax and shipped next day

[20:56:18]

orogor:

yay, backend crahde then frontend

[20:56:36]

kormoc:

xris, qmake -I/path/to/new/include/location?

[20:56:49]

kormoc:

without the vdpau/vdpau.h of course

[20:56:52]

xris:

yeah

[20:57:03]

xris:

well, adding some sed magic to the rpm spec file

[20:57:03]

meshe:

Shadow__X: i have the 1000he great for SD, you aren't getting much better than that though

[20:57:08]

xris:

since it already mucks with such things

[20:57:10]

wagnerrp:

im surprised you can find them for $150 on ebay, because those are ~$500 new

[20:57:12]

AndyCap:

Shadow__X: it's gma950 and not 500?

[20:57:16]

Shadow__X:

meshe, yeah i know it was a joke

[20:57:30]

Shadow__X:

AndyCap, the mini10v is gma950 the mini 10 is 500

[20:57:32]

iamlindoro:

Shadow__X: I think netbooks are perfectly neat, just not sure about it as a perfect mobile frontend

[20:57:42]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, yeah that was a joke as well

[20:57:50]

AndyCap:

Shadow__X: ok. :)

[20:57:54]

Shadow__X:

i feel like i got a great price though

[20:57:59]

meshe:

first think i did on mine was install ubuntu and myth ;)

[20:58:18]

Shadow__X:

meshe, yeah i am going to isntall os ... i mean linux on it

[20:58:19]

meshe:

think*

[20:58:23]

meshe:

thing*

[20:58:30]

wagnerrp:

XLV: are they an old model that companies are trying to offload?

[20:58:31]

XLV:

wagnerrp, its an older product.. theres already perc6 out.. and newer controlles got even faster xor engines on them

[20:58:38]

wagnerrp:

ah

[20:59:04]

XLV:

wagnerrp, perc 5 has iop at 333mhz, new controllers got the new ones iop at 1.2Ghz dual core

[20:59:13]

XLV:

but cost 500$+

[20:59:15]

** dustybin tickles meshe **

[20:59:46]

wagnerrp:

so the perc5 is a very similar card to my areca and the raid6 fasttraks

[21:00:00]

wagnerrp:

they all run off the same intel xor chip

[21:00:19]

orogor:

is Mythcommflag ioniced or only niced when on low priority ?

[21:00:21]

XLV:

wagnerrp, well, the pcb isnt all that different.. the iop chip is what differenciates them

[21:01:42]

orogor:

humm that starts to get boring mythbackend keeps crashing

[21:03:02]

wagnerrp:

so that norco case... the 4020 uses SATA connectors, the 4220 uses 4-channel SAS connectors?

[21:03:37]

XLV:

wagnerrp, http://www.overclock.net/hard-drives-storage/ . . . rd-tips.html

[21:05:18]

CoreDump is now known as CoreDump|cf-18

[21:05:38]

wagnerrp:

yeah, IOP333, same chip most of the PCIe raid6 cards use

[21:05:47]

wagnerrp:

i think 3ware makes their own chip

[21:06:05]

xris:

grumble.. /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lvdpau — but now it's time for a meeting.

[21:06:36]

XLV:

wagnerrp, yeah, norco 4220 has different backplane for the hdds or something

[21:06:55]

kormoc:

xris, verify it's in your /etc/ld.so.conf file (or the like)

[21:06:59]

kormoc:

(the path that is)

[21:07:17]

kormoc:

xris, it sounds like a broken driver install, fedora package?

[21:07:55]

wagnerrp:

XLV: only problem with that is i doubt theres any way to really make a hard drive pack like that quiet

[21:07:59]

XLV:

wagnerrp, instead of connecting 20 sas/sata cable, you connect 5 multi-lane sas to the backplane

[21:08:13]

XLV:

wagnerrp, nope.. it will be loud

[21:08:37]

XLV:

wagnerrp, its only if you have some room to put it that wont bother you

[21:08:47]

wagnerrp:

yeah

[21:09:42]

XLV:

i have run cat5w in conduits from all points needed to storage room. thats where i have the fileserver atm

[21:09:45]

XLV:

cat5e

[21:10:01]

XLV:

4x1.5 linux soft raid5

[21:10:33]

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[21:11:01]

orogor:

huh hoo , ihave 20 myhtcomflag started

[21:11:11]

orogor:

and job limit is set to 2

[21:11:34]

sphery:

but each time mythbackend dies and you restart it, it restarts anothe r2

[21:11:49]

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[21:11:52]

sphery:

(i.e. it doesn't know about the ones that suvived its death)

[21:12:04]

orogor:

doesnt look fort hem i guess

[21:12:10]

wagnerrp:

XLV: same here, at the moment its all just in the basement, with wires snaked through the walls around the house

[21:12:35]

sphery:

orogor: nope, it can only control child processes

[21:12:50]

sphery:

anything else is not Myth's, so it leaves them alone

[21:13:01]

orogor:

i mean t could check how many instabnces are already running before trying to start new ones

[21:13:05]

sphery:

(including children of former Myth processes)

[21:13:25]

XLV:

wagnerrp, and there are ways to transform some funriture to racks.. google for it, some ikea drawers got the exact dimensions needed, you get only rack rails

[21:13:58]

orogor:

can mythcommflag resume, what if i kill them?

[21:14:01]

sphery:

orogor: the right fix is to prevent mythbackend from ever dying

[21:14:02]

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[21:14:03]

XLV:

wagnerrp, eg a patch panel simplifies reorganization of the network

[21:14:03]

wagnerrp:

XLV: id rather just pick up a cheap 18U off creigslist or something

[21:14:11]

iamlindoro:

orogor: No, it cannot resume

[21:14:15]

sphery:

orogor: when mythbackend does die, you should kill them

[21:14:28]

sphery:

and, though it can't "pick up where it left off", it will resume them

[21:14:38]

sphery:

it just starts over, though

[21:14:50]

orogor:

:/

[21:15:02]

sphery:

but if you have multiple processes flagging the same program, it will cause big problems

[21:15:08]

orogor:

also do i have some kind of bug or mythcomm flag is really slow

[21:15:14]

wagnerrp:

XLV: you can often find them on there for well under $100

[21:15:34]

sphery:

orogor: mythcommflag is rather CPU intensive... On my backends, it tends to take almost 2x real time

[21:15:48]

orogor:

ouch

[21:15:54]

sphery:

that's with Athlon XP 2400+ and 2000+ doing HDTV recordings

[21:16:07]

sphery:

and, with a max of 1 job

[21:16:25]

XLV:

wagnerrp, yeah, but thats not a choice for me, i am a continent away from most of the sellers there

[21:16:46]

orogor:

sphery, no way to compress to xvid on the backend then i guess

[21:16:53]

sphery:

not in real time

[21:17:14]

sphery:

I can let it run for many times the recording length if I wanted to

[21:17:19]

sphery:

but disk space is cheap

[21:17:23]

wagnerrp:

you can do standard definition in real time

[21:17:43]

wagnerrp:

but transcoding of HD material is PAINFULLY slow

[21:17:58]

sphery:

yeah, my systems did SDTV in less than real time--generally the biggest slowdown was waiting for the 8min of recording to complete so it could do logo detection

[21:18:10]

sphery:

^^^ being commflagging

[21:18:31]

sphery:

pretty sure my systems can't/couldn't transcode SDTV in real time

[21:18:46]

orogor:

the thing is that 2x compressing + 2x comflagging =4x , then we can record only 1/5 of the time

[21:19:09]

sphery:

orogor: so, don't transcode :)

[21:19:12]

sphery:

HDD's are cheap

[21:19:17]

sphery:

$0.07/GB

[21:19:48]

sphery:

likely costs more in power max'ing your CPU for that long to get a 50% savings in space usage

[21:20:21]

orogor:

yhea maybe i ll pile up another set of drives , annoyingly i bought 2 small drives to do raid 0 on 4 drives thinking i would be io bound

[21:20:38]

brad2:

sphery, do you keep your recordings in the watch recordings menu, or move them over to watch videos like lindoro?

[21:21:27]

orogor:

sphery, then maybe it not even worth commflaging btw

[21:21:30]

backslash7:

Hey folks – I successfully installed mythtv and used it for a couple of minutes. Suddently I wasn't able to watch Live TV anymore :O

[21:21:34]

backslash7:

It said TV Error: StartPlayer(): NVP is not playing after 20000 msec

[21:21:44]

sphery:

orogor: the commflagging will take a lot less time than transcoding, too

[21:21:45]

backslash7:

And that DPMS was Deactivated. It worked fine before

[21:22:06]

sphery:

brad2: I record my TV, then watch, then delete. I do not archive any. If I want to keep something, I buy it on DVD.

[21:22:22]

sphery:

so it stays in Watch Recordings until I watch and delete

[21:23:17]

orogor:

sphery, how many iptv related bugs were fixed in cvs ?

[21:23:28]

sphery:

no idea... I don't use iptv

[21:23:31]

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[21:23:58]

sphery:

backslash7: can you re-start LiveTV? Sounds like it was just a livetv-program-transition issue

[21:24:14]

sphery:

i.e. another good reason not to ever use LiveTV :)

[21:24:37]

sphery:

(though it may have been fixed for 0.22--as gnome42 did a ton of work on LIveTV for 0.22)

[21:24:37]

orogor:

hmmm also i dont know how to manage the sources in mythtv , it s hellish

[21:25:15]

kormoc:

it's not bad... you just say, new source, configure, use...

[21:25:45]

orogor:

analog tv needs an xml grabber , iptv needs 2 other grabbers for the complete programs, dvb need one of these

[21:26:07]

orogor:

iptv can have 4 instances as well as dvb-t

[21:26:40]

orogor:

well not really for dvb-t as channels aren t duplicated along transponders

[21:27:19]

orogor:

plus to get detailled informations on specific shows some grabbers give more iinfos than some others

[21:27:33]

orogor:

that s what i mean by hellish

[21:27:57]

kormoc:

so... drop some sources if you don't want to deal with them?

[21:28:22]

backslash7:

sphery: I just rebooted, hang on I'll give it a try

[21:28:49]

backslash7:

Also, is it a common issue that under Ubuntu 9.04 + Nvidia 180 the TV screen (HDMI) is too big to fit properly?

[21:28:55]

backslash7:

even though the resolution should be fine

[21:29:09]

backslash7:

I can't see the panels

[21:29:29]

orogor:

kormoc, i made an all source and a dvb source both use only eit, the all source is feed by the 3 xml grabbers and the tnt source is supposed to be feed by eit , but it appears empty

[21:29:40]

sphery:

backslash7: that's generally your tv doing overscan

[21:30:37]

backslash7:

sphery: Hmm weird... Worked in Win XP as far as I remember

[21:30:44]

backslash7:

How do I resolve that issue?

[21:31:00]

sphery:

windows may have underscanned for you

[21:31:10]

backslash7:

oh

[21:31:28]

backslash7:

What about Ubuntu? Where would I find that option... nvidia-settings doesn't have anything like that

[21:32:10]

sphery:

many approaches you can use a) underscan in X, b) let it overscan and change nothing (as TV was designed to be overscanned), c) tell Myth to play back video in a smaller area and/or use a smaller window for Myth

[21:32:30]

sphery:

and d) use your TV's controls to scale the image

[21:32:31]

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[21:32:52]

sphery:

and e) if you're lucky enough to have a TV that allows disabling overscan, do it

[21:33:16]

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[21:33:38]

backslash7:

sphery: I'm doing c) right now but I would like to have it set up properly in X

[21:33:43]

backslash7:

I'll try d and e, thanks a lot !

[21:34:34]

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[21:34:52]

sphery:

note that if you use any other than e, there's no way you can have more than 2 of 3 of: a) 1:1 pixel mapping, b) full screen, c) no overscan

[21:35:32]

backslash7:

uh

[21:35:37]

backslash7:

I set my TV to some different mode

[21:35:43]

backslash7:

"just scan" instead of 16:9

[21:35:50]

backslash7:

now it's perfect

[21:35:54]

sphery:

and even if you do e, you may not have full screen (i.e. sometimes the bezel actually covers part of the screen)

[21:36:04]

backslash7:

seems okay right now

[21:36:55]

sphery:

should probably say, "full resolution" instead of "full screen"

[21:37:39]

backslash7:

now the gnome panels are actually overlapping the mythtv window

[21:39:48]

iamlindoro:

That's often/usually because someone is running compiz (and is a bug with compiz)

[21:40:05]

iamlindoro:

The solution is not to use compiz

[21:41:55]

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[21:42:29]

backslash7:

now it's perfect

[21:42:33]

backslash7:

WITH compiz

[21:42:40]

backslash7:

there's an option for fullscreen support

[21:42:46]

backslash7:

tick it and you're all set

[21:42:49]

Shadow__X:

yeah dont use compiz

[21:42:55]

Shadow__X:

its for fools i tell you

[21:42:55]

backslash7:

I'm gonna install openbox anyway though :P

[21:42:58]

Shadow__X:

FOOLS!

[21:43:05]

backslash7:

yea I don't need it on my htpc lol

[21:43:11]

backslash7:

I need something lightweight

[21:43:11]

orogor:

can i see only conflicting recording?

[21:43:26]

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[21:44:16]

backslash7:

Is there a way to make the picture fullscreen?

[21:44:30]

backslash7:

It's only like 70% there's a black border around it

[21:45:06]

backslash7:

got it

[21:45:08]

orogor:

:/

[21:45:14]

backslash7:

sorry for that dumb question

[21:49:43]

orogor:

Grraraa

[21:50:02]

orogor:

it did that again even with a single iptv tunner

[21:50:45]

orogor:

created the file, but didn t created the file recorded nothing , marking the tuner as busy and made an entry in the db

[21:52:56]

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[21:58:02]

gbee:

wtf? A recording I was just watching is now "Recording file cannot be found"

[21:59:05]

gbee:

oh, that can't be good, drive has been taken offline by the kernel

[21:59:18]

janneg:

gbee: hard disc error? I had that with a broken sata cable. the disc randomly disconnected

[21:59:25]

janneg:

to slow

[21:59:31]

janneg:

too even

[21:59:45]

backslash7:

The Picture I'm getting is nearly perfect, it's just not wide enough

[21:59:49]

backslash7:

No zoom level fits

[21:59:57]

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[22:01:07]

gbee:

janneg: thanks, I'll swap out the cable just in case

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[22:12:15]

gbee:

hmm, that's dumb, xfs has no support for mapping bad blocks, i.e. if the disk is anything less than 100% it just won't work

[22:12:54]

sphery:

don't most HDD's map them internally, now?

[22:13:03]

kormoc:

until they run out of extra blocks, aye

[22:13:06]

sphery:

and reallocate "extras"

[22:13:22]

Dagmar:

...by which time you're crazy if you keep using the disk once it's out of those.

[22:13:23]

sphery:

ah, yeah... I thought you were supposed to replace the HDD before it ran out of extras

[22:14:41]

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[22:14:49]

gbee:

hmm didn't know that, smart seems to think the drive is healthy but for a single read failure so I'll see how xfs_repair fairs and look at a new drive while I'm waiting

[22:14:59]

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[22:16:42]

gbee:

anyone know what the difference between the Samsung EcoGreen F1 and F2 is?

[22:17:29]

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[22:17:47]

kormoc:

gbee, second gen tis all afaik

[22:18:34]

gbee:

kormoc: ok, guessed it might be, but ebuyer are stocking both and the F1 is a fiver more

[22:18:36]

sphery:

I heard the F2 is more verdant

[22:18:50]

gbee:

sphery: cool ;)

[22:19:08]

sphery:

yeah, that was a joke, and means nothing regarding it's eco-friendliness

[22:20:32]

gbee:

got it, hence the wink

[22:21:38]

sphery:

just making sure--I didn't want to accidentally convince you to choose one over the other on a bad joke

[22:22:10]

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[22:22:17]

brad2:

which would be the best joke of all

[22:22:18]

brad2:

:)

[22:22:52]

gbee:

always gone with Samsung in the last 3/4 years, never had a problem so I keep going back

[22:23:25]

mzb:

you should be able to force that block to be "retired"

[22:23:41]

gbee:

well I suppose you could point out that a Samsung drive is failing on me right now, but then it _is_ the oldest of the bunch

[22:23:56]

brad2:

i've had 4 western digital drives fail on me in a month

[22:24:03]

mzb:

find out the file that contains the data and make backup (if possible), then zero the block

[22:24:06]

brad2:

luckily their RMA policy just keeps shipping me new ones

[22:24:48]

mzb:

if smart info shows very low error rates you quite possibly have 6mths-2yrs until the drive becomes too hard to manage

[22:25:01]

gbee:

yeah ... lucky ;)

[22:25:18]

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[22:25:42]

janneg:

gbee: f2 has higher data density. a platter less at 1TB i.e. less energy consumption and noise

[22:25:50]

gbee:

mzb: single read fail, no other signs of trouble, it was passing nightly tests until today

[22:26:18]

gbee:

janneg: thanks for that, it wasn't clear from the sales blurb

[22:26:36]

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[22:26:40]

mzb:

gbee, see http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net/badblockhowto.html re reallocating a bad block

[22:26:59]

gbee:

mzb: thanks

[22:27:26]

gbee:

you are a very helpful bunch, I might just try out this 'mythtv' thing you speak of ;)

[22:27:33]

mzb:

heh

[22:28:16]

** mzb needs to wake up ... toddles off for 2nd coffee of the day **

[22:29:01]

gbee:

laga: why did you get me playing C&C again? It's addictive and frustrating, currently struggling with a commando who keeps blowing himself up

[22:29:23]

sphery:

have you tried sending him to counseling?

[22:29:39]

sphery:

Command & Counsel

[22:29:43]

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[22:43:42]

backslash7:

Sorry guys but I can't find out how to stop recording in Live TV

[22:43:47]

backslash7:

I can't switch programs anymore

[22:43:57]

backslash7:

It won't stop recording ^^ All I did was press R

[22:44:07]

kormoc:

it won't until the program ends

[22:44:14]

kormoc:

you told it to make it an actual recording

[22:44:24]

backslash7:

Uhm

[22:44:34]

backslash7:

There is a way to tell it to *stop* again right?

[22:44:41]

kormoc:

go out and cancel the recording

[22:45:13]

kormoc:

sphery or iamlindoro would likely know the exact way to

[22:45:19]

backslash7:

ohh that's the way it works

[22:45:27]

backslash7:

cool sorry I didn't check the recordings menu

[22:45:28]

kormoc:

when you press R, yes

[22:45:32]

backslash7:

thanks for helping me

[22:45:34]

backslash7:

now I understand

[22:46:50]

sphery:

you can also keep hitting r and it cycles through the different recording types--record once, then others, until eventually, do not record

[22:47:25]

sphery:

that only works, though, if you haven't left the LiveTV (now recording) session

[22:47:28]

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[22:47:56]

backslash7:

It's not possible to record one channel and watch another channel at the same time with an analog TV connection is it?

[22:48:24]

sphery:

with one tuner per recording (where LiveTV is a recording), yes

[22:48:28]

meshe:

if you have 2 tuners

[22:48:30]

sphery:

but only one tuner, no

[22:49:26]

backslash7:

all right, I think there's just one tuner in my PVR-250

[22:49:38]

kormoc:

so buy a few pvr 500's and live the high life

[22:50:01]

backslash7:

Nah that's fine I'm gonna upgrade to DVB-C and another card anyway

[22:50:05]

backslash7:

this is just for fun

[22:50:35]

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[22:54:09]

backslash7:

hmm how come I always have to restart after about an hour because Live TV stopped working? After a reboot it works again

[22:55:10]

jduggan:

Add 3 zeros to the end of each frequency (ie 12224 R should be 12224000, Right Circular, 20000000) <- whats 'right circular' and whats the 2000000 ?

[22:57:15]

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[22:59:03]

defecatn:

hi, does anyone know how to change the ip of ones mythtv backend in mysql? my static ip changed last night and i'm in a world of hurt.

[23:05:24]

gbee:

change the IP back?

[23:06:26]

meshe:

defecatn: it's not in the database, it's in the files that sphery told you to look at

[23:06:40]

defecatn:

meshe i looked and see no place for a ip etc:(

[23:06:50]

defecatn:

all of em so far are just generic

[23:08:23]

sphery:

if it really is the /backend/ IP address you need to change, then do it in mythtv-setup and make sure you do Next/Next/Next.../Finish

[23:08:29]

meshe:

actually, i'm wrong, they are in the db

[23:08:32]

sphery:

i.e. don't change it then hit Esc/back

[23:08:42]

meshe:

i've had to change them before when my ip changed

[23:09:05]

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[23:09:17]

sphery:

however, based on what you said about it's not finding the DB (which would prevent mythtv-setup from writing the ip address to the db), you likely need to change the dbhostname value (ip address) in one of those files

[23:09:34]

sphery:

first

[23:10:23]

defecatn:

sphery okay, so where it says "localhost" change it?

[23:10:46]

sphery:

if you have more than one myth system, you definitely can't use localhost

[23:11:06]

sphery:

though it should have an ip address in it (like 127.0.0.1)

[23:11:29]

defecatn:

yeah. okay i'll try again. I was up all night so i'm a bit impaired

[23:11:37]

defecatn:

thanks again guys

[23:11:42]

sphery:

oh, wait... dbhostname can be a hostname

[23:12:07]

sphery:

forgot that it's using the QMYSQL driver, which does do hostname resolution

[23:12:52]

sphery:

but all the backend ip address and master backend ip address stuff has to be IP's

[23:14:55]

defecatn:

i went thorugh this years ago with another isp but i can't remember everything i did

[23:15:24]

defecatn:

also i had to get lirc working with two of the same cable boxes and it was a huge hassle so i'm kind of married now to this install

[23:15:37]

defecatn:

using two of hte same serial blasters

[23:17:15]

kormoc:

So... when the going gets tough, you get married to the problems eh?

[23:18:44]

defecatn:

kormoc unless lirc makes it where we can use two of teh same rf serial blasters to two identical set top boxes I'm stuck:)

[23:19:22]

Dagmar:

Simple electronics can do that for you.

[23:20:34]

Dagmar:

...but generally _black electrical tape_ is sufficient for keeping one from seeing signals meant for the other.

[23:20:45]

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[23:21:13]

defecatn:

yeah i did that but the boxes have the same remote codes

[23:21:26]

defecatn:

so you can't have the same ircommands going ot both

[23:25:07]

kormoc:

defecatn, just gotta update the driver to support multiple endpoints

[23:25:59]

Dagmar:

You can set up multiple instances of LIRC with multiple serial ports

[23:26:16]

defecatn:

i kind of did taht but i had to first compile the driver normally then had to change everything so that i was able to have a second lircd running for the 2nd port

[23:28:15]

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[23:29:32]

Dagmar:

You only need lircd for recieving afaik

[23:29:38]

mzb:

jduggan, I assume you're talking satellite. The first number is probably the LNB frequency, and the second the offset(?) for the transponder(?) you're tuning to

[23:29:48]

Dagmar:

I could be wrong tho, it's been awhile since I've dorked with it at that level

[23:30:46]

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[23:31:14]

defecatn:

it's probably not lircd then

[23:31:14]

defecatn:

it's been awhile:(

[23:33:01]

gbee:

jduggan: ignore all that, use the following "10714000", Horizontal and 22000000 for the symbol rate, leave the rest alone

[23:33:20]

defecatn:

lirc_serial,lirc_serial2

[23:33:37]

gbee:

assuming you are scanning for Freesat in the UK, made a leap there

[23:33:56]

mzb:

depends on the LNB and ... yep ;)

[23:34:12]

gbee:

LNB should be universal here in the UK

[23:34:13]

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[23:34:22]

mzb:

really?

[23:34:54]

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[23:35:59]

gbee:

aye, can't say I've even seen anything else for sale although maybe for enthusiasts wanting to reach some of the European satellites

[23:36:38]

mzb:

I didn't think it was anything to do with what you're receiving (exactly), but more the type of equipment you're using

[23:36:55]

gbee:

but as a rule, anything sold for Sky/Freesat here in the UK will be universal

[23:37:00]

mzb:

iirc, the common LNB freqs are 10700 and 11???-ish

[23:37:44]

mzb:

either way, if in doubt look at the LNB to check :)

[23:37:44]

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[23:37:48]

gbee:

mzb: well the kit is provided by Sky (Freesat followed their standard so that people could keep the same dish/lnb)

[23:37:49]

kormoc:

11???-ish is a very interesting frequency

[23:38:16]

mzb:

yeah, non-numeric frequencies are a bit hard on the calculator ;)

[23:38:20]

gbee:

plus Freesat is on the same satellite network, same constellation

[23:38:42]

mzb:

11300

[23:39:14]

gbee:

http://www.satcure.co.uk/tech/lnb.htm#universal

[23:39:21]

mzb:

(or is that 11250?;))

[23:39:33]

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[23:39:36]

jduggan:

gbee: i did a scan using the astra frequencies in /usr/share/dvb, it found some channels which i put in channels.conf and i can play fine with mplayer... is there anything i need to do special to also view channels on eurobird?

[23:40:05]

jduggan:

not sure theres anything on there i need

[23:41:14]

mzb:

ah, this looks ok: http://www.satsig.net/lnb/explanation-description-lnb.htm

[23:41:25]

jduggan:

i already see much better quality than capturing from stbs :)

[23:41:39]

gbee:

jduggan: nothing special required, but probably nothing worth watching either, mostly utter crap – http://www.lyngsat.com/eb1.html

[23:41:45]

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[23:43:29]

gbee:

jduggan: with 0.21 a full transport scan after adding the initial transport should give you everything that is FTA on both Astra 2A-D and Eurobird 1

[23:43:59]

jduggan:

better than importing channels.conf method then?

[23:43:59]

gbee:

but you'll then spend an hour or two removing all the Eurobird rubbish

[23:45:13]

jduggan:

might have to get that sat finder

[23:45:23]

jduggan:

alot of the channels are like lego :)

[23:46:13]

jduggan:

is there anything like sky's signal strength/quality diagnostic screen in myth?

[23:46:27]

janneg:

probably easier to remove unwnted channels from a channels.conf

[23:47:00]

gbee:

jduggan: Alt-F7

[23:47:22]

janneg:

jduggan: there is, but only in live-tv, ie you need to have at least 1 channel

[23:47:44]

jduggan:

excellent

[23:47:54]

jduggan:

i'll try repositioning using that

[23:48:00]

jduggan:

:P

[23:48:21]

gbee:

and don't get fooled by the porn sounding channels, it ain't porn ;) Movies4Men famously find the tamest softcore then edit out all the sex and most of the nudity ....

[23:48:37]

jduggan:

lol

[23:48:45]

jduggan:

i saw that doing a scan

[23:49:11]

gbee:

you'll find more action in an average family movie

[23:49:16]

jduggan:

haha

[23:49:29]

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[23:50:37]

backslash7:

My remote control is very unpopular but some buttons work even without lirc. Is there a way to map commands to simulated keypresses?

[23:51:04]

backslash7:

Like, I press a button, then tell X if that code arrives send that key press to mythtv

[23:52:23]

gbee:

backslash7: you can just train lirc and create your own config for that remote

[23:56:22]

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[23:56:27]

backslash7:

gbee: really? Like I press a button and tell it what I wanna use it for?

MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

Current users (192):