Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Wednesday, March 25th, 2009, 00:00 UTC

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squish102:

what is the easiest way to know what version of the database tables i have?

[00:04:09]

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squish102:

two machines and wondering if i can backup tables and restore oon other machine

[00:06:00]

wagnerrp:

'select * from settings where value like '%schema%;'

[00:09:11]

sphery:

or, if using the backup script, just look at the filename ( mythconverg-<schemaver>-<datetime>.sql.gz )

[00:09:13]

squish102:

thanks

[00:09:20]

squish102:

cool

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keith4_:

okay, so I got firewire channel-changing working perfectly. channel scanning isn't supported on firewire, though. so, i figure i have to manually change channels, looking for valid channels

[00:17:40]

keith4_:

but how do I make LiveTV show me the firewire input?

[00:18:10]

iamlindoro__:

You need to add a lineup at SD for your cable company, and fetch the channels from the listings source

[00:18:25]

iamlindoro__:

then you can attach that lineup to the firewire tuner and go through trying channels

[00:18:32]

keith4_:

oh, ok

[00:18:39]

keith4_:

why at SD?

[00:18:40]

keith4_:

oh

[00:18:44]

keith4_:

SD schedule direct

[00:18:46]

iamlindoro__:

yes

[00:18:58]

keith4_:

I thought I did that...

[00:19:29]

iamlindoro__:

Well if you did that then your firewire tuner should have channels associated with it :)

[00:20:15]

keith4_:

but it doesn't

[00:20:35]

iamlindoro__:

Then you did it wrong :)

[00:20:38]

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keith4_:

and yet.... http://keith4.pastebin.com/d53e9a1e7

[00:21:32]

iamlindoro__:

okay, so now go into liveTV, bring up the menu, and change inputs

[00:21:39]

iamlindoro__:

and you should have the option for your firewire tuner

[00:21:54]

iamlindoro__:

If you don't, then something you did before that went wrong

[00:22:52]

keith4_:

i change inputs... says "9: MPEG2TS"

[00:22:53]

keith4_:

but no channels

[00:23:16]

keith4_:

let me delete all channels and start fresh...

[00:24:53]

keith4_:

ah, much better

[00:25:16]

keith4_:

weird

[00:28:44]

keith4_:

thoughts on 100/200/400 mb?

[00:29:09]

iamlindoro__:

The only reason to change that is if it doesn't work at the default

[00:29:20]

iamlindoro__:

And even then, it should seldom matter

[00:29:23]

iamlindoro__:

100 is far more than enough

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[00:31:06]

keith4_:

if, while going through these channels, i can't get any of them. firewire is encrypted?

[00:31:49]

iamlindoro__:

or you haven't set up/primed properly

[00:31:55]

iamlindoro__:

live TV is not the way to test this IMO

[00:32:09]

sphery:

keith4_: you have to use a command-line argument to mythfilldatabase that says, "Yes, I realize that this is a digital capture device, but add the channels, anyway, because I've verified that they all are channels to which I have access"

[00:32:22]

sphery:

I don't think that's the exact name of the argument, but it's something like that :)

[00:32:28]

iamlindoro__:

as live TV will render you unable to go back in without stopping the backend, entering mythtv-setup, changing the start channel, and trying the next channel

[00:32:38]

iamlindoro__:

the first channel that fails, that's what you will have to do

[00:32:57]

iamlindoro__:

better by far to set up a series of 1 minute recordings on each channel, each spaced one minute apart

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iamlindoro__:

0 byte recordings are failures. Anything else is a "good"

[00:33:26]

iamlindoro__:

and make *SURE* you've primed the port

[00:34:08]

wagnerrp:

the presidential announcement is probably going to overrun tonight again isnt it...

[00:34:26]

iamlindoro__:

Good thing there's nothing worthwhile on TV

[00:34:44]

wagnerrp:

need to pick up a rerun of house

[00:34:53]

sphery:

wagnerrp: what pres announcement?

[00:35:00]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, with firewire_tester?

[00:35:05]

iamlindoro__:

keith4, yes

[00:35:09]

wagnerrp:

listed on my schedule as 'presidential news conference'

[00:35:15]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, crap. i'm not having any luck with that

[00:35:21]

wagnerrp:

all the major networks are carrying it

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iamlindoro__:

keith4, if you don't have consistent "success!" with firewire_tester, you won't get any video

[00:35:52]

keith4_:

SAD FACE

[00:35:54]

** sphery rushes to pad his recordings **

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wagnerrp:

:)

[00:36:12]

iamlindoro__:

the success in firewire_tester is a literal transfer of video data from the port. You should be trying with the box tuned to a major network, by the by

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iamlindoro__:

as that's your highest chance of it working

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iamlindoro__:

if you're on HBO or whatever, the chances of it being 5C (and the tester failing) are far far higher

[00:36:55]

sphery:

Reaper is safe...

[00:37:08]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, how about going to the i-know-for-sure-it's-unencrypted NBC HD?

[00:37:12]

wagnerrp:

reaper doesnt seem to be on tonight

[00:37:25]

keith4_:

or should I avoid HD?

[00:37:26]

wagnerrp:

oh, its on CW

[00:37:31]

wagnerrp:

i thought it was on FOX

[00:37:33]

iamlindoro__:

keith4, You know for sure it's available via firewire? Or just that it's available on QAM?

[00:37:43]

sphery:

Nova is safe...

[00:37:48]

sphery:

Yeah, Reaper on CW

[00:38:10]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, let me back up. prior to this weekend, my lame cable company wasn't encrypting *anything*. i've been using a pair of pchtv5500s for years

[00:38:22]

keith4_:

now, with my QAM tuner on my TV, i can only get 5 HD channels

[00:38:25]

iamlindoro__:

keith4, the encryption on QAM and that on firewire have no bearing on one another

[00:38:33]

keith4_:

damn

[00:38:35]

iamlindoro__:

you could get everything via one and nothing on the other

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keith4_:

that's... silly

[00:39:25]

wagnerrp:

thats... cable providers

[00:39:31]

iamlindoro__:

kormoc, Anything happen to mythweb lately that might explain my seeing a blank (header and background but nothing else) screen when looking at the detail screen of any listing?

[00:39:52]

wagnerrp:

they have no intention to provide any quality of service over anything but video out on their own boxes

[00:40:03]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro__: yeah, i just got that

[00:40:18]

wagnerrp:

temporarily reverted back to my old web directory

[00:40:24]

iamlindoro__:

wagnerrp, Yeah, think it accompanies the commits of two days ago

[00:41:05]

wagnerrp:

i refreshed mine around noon yesterday, 20250, so yeah

[00:41:40]

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keith4_:

iamlindoro__, while i was futzing with live TV, the myth backend log shows a pile of "libiec61883 warning: Established connection on channel 63"

[00:46:07]

keith4_:

is that indicative of 'broadcast' mode firewire?

[00:46:32]

iamlindoro__:

keith4, you shouldn't see any such message on a working system

[00:49:12]

iamlindoro__:

Lord, it still weirds me out to hear the president speak articulately

[00:49:41]

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iamlindoro__:

But it never gets old :)

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keith4_:

i think i'm screwed

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aclose is now known as aclose|away

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keith4_:

....i'm going to go blow up the central office

[00:58:12]

iamlindoro__:

Yes, threats of terrorism in a logged channel should help

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aclose|away is now known as aclose

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keith4_:

i kid, i kid

[01:00:41]

iamlindoro__:

;)

[01:01:11]

keith4_:

there's an "output mode" indicator on the front of this box. it says 480i (i connected a tiny SD tv to make sure channel changing was working). does that affect firewire at all, you think?

[01:01:27]

iamlindoro__:

nope

[01:02:03]

keith4_:

well, i just cold booted the box, and now i'm getting some success with broadcast

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[01:02:39]

iamlindoro__:

When/if you get continuous, 100% success with the tester, you should be able to get video on that particular channel

[01:03:18]

keith4_:

is this a problem? "Broadcast: Testing...Dropped 268435456 packet(s)."

[01:03:23]

iamlindoro__:

yes

[01:03:43]

keith4_:

hmmm. it says "success" after that

[01:03:52]

iamlindoro__:

so run the tester again

[01:04:06]

iamlindoro__:

you run tests until you establish it won't stabilize, or that it has completely

[01:04:19]

iamlindoro__:

This is the nasty secret of firewire, it *must* be primed and stable to capture

[01:04:29]

keith4_:

on a run of 50 tests, it says "Dropped n packets" twice, within the first 8 or so

[01:04:33]

keith4_:

repeatedly

[01:04:48]

keith4_:

ooh, wait. seems to stop

[01:04:48]

iamlindoro__:

you need to get to a point where a run the the tester is 100%

[01:04:51]

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[01:05:06]

keith4_:

ok, i'm there

[01:05:12]

iamlindoro__:

so now you can try that channel in myth

[01:05:17]

iamlindoro__:

again, I would *not* try live TV

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iamlindoro__:

try setting up a short recording w/ MythWeb

[01:05:32]

iamlindoro__:

on the channel you are on right now

[01:05:46]

keith4_:

remind me again, why not live TV?

[01:06:16]

iamlindoro__:

<iamlindoro__> as live TV will render you unable to go back in without stopping the backend, entering mythtv-setup, changing the start channel, and trying the next channel

[01:06:16]

iamlindoro__:

<iamlindoro__> the first channel that fails, that's what you will have to do

[01:07:14]

keith4_:

oh. hmm

[01:08:00]

keith4_:

why can't i just start on a working live TV channel, and then change the channel behind the scenes using 6200ch?

[01:08:25]

iamlindoro__:

because when the stream stops, and it will, the backend will hork

[01:08:43]

iamlindoro__:

listen, do what you like, it's really frustrating to argue with people who want to do things their way

[01:08:51]

iamlindoro__:

If it makes you happy, do it your way

[01:08:59]

keith4_:

oh, I know. i do it every day in #nagios ;-)

[01:09:04]

iamlindoro__:

I won't force the benefit of my experience on you

[01:09:19]

wagnerrp:

seagates run REALLY hot

[01:09:32]

wagnerrp:

either that or samsungs have a fault temperature sensor

[01:09:41]

iamlindoro__:

wagnerrp, they get nice and cool once they stop clicking and billowing smoke

[01:09:44]

keith4_:

wagnerrp, my seagates run about 20' F hotter than any other brand

[01:09:57]

keith4_:

either that or... someone temp sensors are worthless

[01:10:17]

wagnerrp:

my samsungs are 23C, 25C, 24C, and 26C

[01:10:27]

wagnerrp:

the seagates are 35C and 33C

[01:10:55]

wagnerrp:

and a pair of WDs are both 29C

[01:11:32]

keith4_:

wagnerrp, actually, i have some 250G seagates that are at 24C and 26C

[01:11:49]

wagnerrp:

those were 750s running that hot

[01:11:58]

keith4_:

but another boy with 750s is at 34. 38, 36

[01:12:03]

keith4_:

boy? box

[01:12:07]

wagnerrp:

i have a 320GB sitting a couple inches above it running at 28C

[01:12:18]

wagnerrp:

320GB seagate

[01:12:26]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, i'm not questioning your wisdom. i'm loathe to go schedule ~200 1-minute recordings, though

[01:12:53]

keith4_:

wagnerrp, same for 640G seagates

[01:12:59]

keith4_:

maybe just the perp-recording ones?

[01:13:19]

wagnerrp:

i mean 2 platters vs. 3 shouldnt make that much difference

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jams:

eh my seagates are running at 21

[01:13:34]

keith4_:

iamlindoro__, how about scripting through all the channels and running firewire_test?

[01:13:35]

jams:

C

[01:14:02]

wagnerrp:

this is with a 90mm sitting behind each 3-pack of disks

[01:14:09]

wagnerrp:

in a cold basement

[01:15:45]

jams:

actually it's a 7 pack

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[01:35:31]

dashs:

Scheduler fail completely very often?

[01:36:16]

dashs:

Backend got 'stuck' then no entries anywhere.

[01:36:33]

dashs:

Can't schedule anything — is there a reset?

[01:41:19]

sphery:

dashs: restart mythbackend

[01:41:24]

sphery:

probably lost mysql connection

[01:41:32]

sphery:

think there's a bug in ubuntu, now, that causes it

[01:41:41]

dashs:

sphery: I rebooted

[01:42:30]

dashs:

Now I'm unable toschdule anything.

[01:42:43]

sphery:

did you repair your DB?

[01:42:56]

sphery:

is it ubuntu, btw?

[01:42:57]

dashs:

How to repair the DB?

[01:43:04]

sphery:

optimize_mythdb.pl

[01:43:05]

dashs:

yes, mythbuntu

[01:43:28]

dashs:

ok

[01:44:22]

dashs:

where is that command?

[01:44:34]

dashs:

er. script

[01:44:36]

sphery:

no idea where mythbuntu puts it

[01:44:49]

dashs:

it's not in path of root

[01:45:01]

sphery:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/376325#376325

[01:45:13]

sphery:

for the ubuntu/mythbuntu bug

[01:45:31]

iamlindoro__:

/usr/share/doc/mythtv-backend/contrib/

[01:45:38]

sphery:

and, it can cause corrupted tables, which need fixed with optimize_mythdb.pl

[01:45:38]

aclose is now known as aclose|away

[01:46:29]

sphery:

iamlindoro__: was wondering... can you run mythbackend --version on ubuntu or do you have to do mythbackend.real --version ?

[01:46:56]

sphery:

dashs: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/User_Manual:Period . . . the_Database

[01:47:02]

iamlindoro__:

sphery, I really don't know... the latter would be true with the frontend, I dunno about the backend

[01:47:20]

iamlindoro__:

sphery, I expect since it's wrapped in the init script that they didn't bother with that for the backend binary

[01:47:39]

dashs:

perl compile failed

[01:47:54]

dashs:

reinstall time

[01:48:01]

iamlindoro__:

eassssssssy tex

[01:48:06]

iamlindoro__:

pastebin the perl error

[01:48:12]

dashs:

gimme that gun

[01:48:20]

iamlindoro__:

more likely you're just missing some perl prerequisite

[01:48:26]

sphery:

iamlindoro__: so the script (for the frontend) doesn't recognize/pass the --version, appropriately?

[01:48:26]

dashs:

yes

[01:48:41]

iamlindoro__:

sphery, Not last I checked

[01:49:01]

sphery:

hmmm... would be nice if it did... might explain why so few actually figure out the --version thing...

[01:49:31]

dashs:

Use MythTV; (require not found)

[01:49:52]

sphery:

need perl bindings

[01:49:52]

iamlindoro__:

missing myth perl bindings... if they don't include those, that seems a major oversight

[01:50:11]

sphery:

yeah, should be in mythbuntu...

[01:50:24]

iamlindoro__:

apt-get install libmyth-perl

[01:50:24]

sphery:

(that's /far/ more important than --version support for the wrapper script :)

[01:50:30]

dashs:

No config found; attempting to find mythbackend via UPnP.

[01:50:30]

dashs:

No backends found. Please copy /root/.mythtv/config.xml from a working MythTV installation instead.

[01:50:53]

dashs:

this a user or root mode scipt?

[01:51:06]

sphery:

run as user

[01:51:12]

sphery:

but as the /same/ user that runs the frontend

[01:51:28]

sphery:

and on a machine where HOME is set and $HOME/.mythtv/ is properly configured

[01:52:03]

dashs:

ok

[01:53:20]

dashs:

cruisng the tables

[01:53:26]

sphery:

cool

[01:53:37]

sphery:

take a look at that post, too, as it says this will keep happening

[01:53:43]

sphery:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/376325#376325

[01:54:20]

dashs:

do i need this aggravation — let me pour another..

[01:58:30]

dashs:

restart backend?

[01:58:43]

dashs:

or just reboot

[01:59:47]

sphery:

restart backend after fixing DB for best results

[02:00:07]

sphery:

rebooting would do it, too, but shouldn't be necessary

[02:00:24]

sphery:

after the ubuntu mysql start script fix, I don't know what's required

[02:01:46]

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[02:02:39]

sphery:

(but if nothing else, a mysqld restart would be required, which means a myth backend restart is required)

[02:04:45]

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[02:07:52]

dashs:

Well, does not schedule, so it's re-install, or comcast dvr

[02:10:17]

iamlindoro__:

I never get why people are so anxious to swat flies with elephan guns

[02:10:36]

dashs:

log say I have no capture cards, so the DB is a wipe, all right.

[02:11:37]

dashs:

In the legacy storage biz, we used to call this a 'show stopper'. Quite appropriate here.

[02:16:34]

dashs:

Thanks for your help, in any case.

[02:17:20]

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[02:19:12]

sphery:

dashs: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/264034#264034

[02:19:21]

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[02:19:40]

sphery:

that would be the 22-cal rifle vs the fly

[02:20:06]

sphery:

much better than the elephant gun (cause you can't afford the elephants to reload those guns)

[02:21:08]

iamlindoro__:

plus, I'm told they're the ideal platform from which to film tigers

[02:21:19]

dashs:

sphery: re-install is a known state.

[02:23:36]

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[02:25:03]

keith4__:

okay, i had to fall back to 'broadcast', because i just couldn't get consistent results with p2p. seems to be working, but it takes 10–15 seconds to tune some channels. am i doing something wrong?

[02:26:05]

sphery:

besides supporting the cable monopoly?

[02:26:19]

keith4__:

right. besides that

[02:26:50]

sphery:

unfortunately, I know less than nnothing about firewire

[02:27:44]

iamlindoro__:

10–15 seconds in firewire is not unrealistic

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[02:28:15]

keith4__:

ok

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[02:36:30]

sphery:

heh, first result of google for prebuffering pause is http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Troubleshooting:Prebuffering_pause

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[02:47:13]

iamlindoro:

WTF, can we go one week without the writers of Heroes forgetting what people's powers are?

[02:47:25]

dashs:

Trying to rescue this: can't even 'watch tv' now. backend log says no valid capture cards but setup has it correct — who is full of it?

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dashs:

recommended distro ?? not ubuntu.

[02:57:57]

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[03:18:36]

sphery:

dashs: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/264034#264034

[03:18:48]

sphery:

and, mythbuntu is a /great/ choice for myth

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[04:04:24]

elfMobile:

so something weird happened the other day. For some reason I have no scheduled recordings

[04:04:49]

elfMobile:

but in mythweb I can see all of them under "recording schedules" yet nothing appears in upcoming recordings

[04:05:29]

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[04:05:32]

elfMobile:

any idea what happened? None of my shows are recording yet (under mythweb->recording schedules) they are still in the databsae somehow

[04:08:37]

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[04:19:31]

wagnerrp:

your schedules are all there, but theyre not matching up to any shows?

[04:19:40]

wagnerrp:

so upcoming recordings is empty

[04:19:53]

wagnerrp:

do you have multiple backends?

[04:20:23]

wagnerrp:

if you have tuners on a slave backend that is not online, shows on its sources will not be scheduled to record

[04:23:49]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, none of that

[04:23:55]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, just one backend

[04:25:24]

wagnerrp:

so you have a bunch of stuff under 'recording schedules', but nothing under 'upcoming recordings'?

[04:25:49]

** iamlindoro_ wonders whether mythfilldatabase is running at all... **

[04:26:01]

iamlindoro_:

(or whether one has a current/valid SD subscription)

[04:26:03]

wagnerrp:

yeah, do you have listings data?

[04:26:17]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, yeah...

[04:26:19]

wagnerrp:

in 'backend status' are your tuners marked as online?

[04:26:41]

wagnerrp:

try kicking it, restart your backend

[04:26:44]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, hmmm....no encoders

[04:26:52]

wagnerrp:

so you have no tuner cards?

[04:27:11]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, I do....don't know what happened. probably an update I did or something

[04:27:33]

wagnerrp:

you have tuner cards, you previously had tuner cards in mythtv, but now none are listed?

[04:28:55]

Lexridge:

I'm having a strange problem. Whenever I tune to a digital channel, the info at the bottom of the screen is incorrect. ie, I tune to ch. 12.1, and the info shown is from 10.1, if I tune to 12.2, the info shown is for 10.1. Very strange.

[04:29:14]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, I bet I know what it was.... I did an emerge --dep-clean. It probably removed ivtv

[04:29:32]

Lexridge:

I have rebooted both ends and it made no difference. Is my database corrupted?

[04:29:33]

wagnerrp:

mmm... gentoo users...

[04:29:47]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, yeah.... I'm ready to swtich ;-)

[04:29:49]

wagnerrp:

what kernel are you using?

[04:30:07]

elfMobile:

wagnerrp, 2.6.27-gentoo-r7

[04:30:17]

wagnerrp:

ivtv is now entirely contained within the kernel

[04:30:32]

elfMobile:

in 2.6.27?

[04:30:40]

wagnerrp:

the 1.3.0 ebuild is just a bunch of userland tools for manual control of ivtv

[04:30:51]

wagnerrp:

mythtv no longer needs it

[04:30:58]

wagnerrp:

yes

[04:32:12]

wagnerrp:

however even if you did a dep-clean, the mythtv ebuild should have ivtv marked as a dependency

[04:32:17]

wagnerrp:

ivtv should not have been removed

[04:35:53]

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[04:37:41]

wagnerrp:

ugh... im getting that crap where mythweb/mythvideo only works once

[04:37:51]

wagnerrp:

then i have to delete the symlinks, and let it recreate them

[04:37:58]

wagnerrp:

i forget what the solution is

[04:40:07]

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[04:42:25]

rogueone:

so, for those keeping track, i purchased new HDDs last night and have my system back up to (almost) normal

[04:42:37]

wagnerrp:

what was wrong?

[04:42:58]

rogueone:

my previous hdd failed, so i bought new one(s)

[04:43:08]

rogueone:

so no i'm having audio issues

[04:44:35]

rogueone:

i have an alc888 hda-intel spdif connection to my receiver. i'm having issues making both non ac3 material and ac3 material play with the same settings

[04:45:18]

rogueone:

with ALSA:default/no-passthrough – 2ch sounds fine, ac3 is played as 2ch

[04:45:39]

rogueone:

with ALSA:default/passthrough – 2ch sounds fine, ac3 is played as extremely loud clicking

[04:46:05]

rogueone:

with ALSA:surround51/either – 2ch is silent, ac3 is played as ac3

[04:46:25]

rogueone:

max audio = 5.1

[04:47:31]

rogueone:

(actually, correct that, alsa:surround51/no-pass – no sound period)

[04:51:40]

rogueone:

i assume there's a way to force 2ch source through using the surround51/pass option, but i'm not finding it. any ideas?

[04:54:34]

wagnerrp:

never used digital audio

[04:57:38]

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[05:01:03]

rogueone:

it's a beautiful thing, assuming it works. before the great hdd crash of saturday, it was working. not sure what's different now

[05:02:17]

wagnerrp:

except that the format is limited to some 1500kbps or so

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[05:18:16]

rogueone:

well, figured it out

[05:18:43]

rogueone:

yay internet. last post on this page: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies- . . . 1077599.html

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artus35:

Good morning

[06:24:20]

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[06:24:40]

artus35:

how can you achieve if you have i.e. DVB-S and DVB-T in your system that WatchTV uses DVB-T as primary source?

[06:24:51]

artus35:

so that you dont need to switch the input

[06:25:07]

wagnerrp:

delete your tuners, add the DVB-T card as the first tuner

[06:25:25]

wagnerrp:

map the video sources back onto the cards

[06:27:11]

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[06:30:11]

artus35:

dvb0 is dvb-t already

[06:30:28]

artus35:

but in the list dvb1 is shown first

[06:33:28]

wagnerrp:

so click 'delete all tuners'

[06:33:36]

wagnerrp:

and add then back in the order you want them to be used in

[06:33:56]

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[06:34:47]

artus35:

then I need to rescan the channels :( ?

[06:34:59]

wagnerrp:

no, thats all stored in the video sources

[06:35:14]

wagnerrp:

just connect the sources back to the cards after you add them

[06:35:20]

wagnerrp:

and youre done

[06:35:29]

wagnerrp:

should take no more than a minute

[06:35:37]

artus35:

ok

[06:37:18]

Captain_Murdoch:

gbee, run mythcommflag with "-v commflag" and with the DEBUGCOMMFLAG env variable set non-empty and you should see lots of debug info, some of which tells you when an aspect change is detected. you can compare what the flagger sees with what you have in the recordedmarkup table.

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[06:38:48]

artus35:

cool wagnerrp

[06:38:52]

artus35:

it worked :)

[06:38:57]

artus35:

thank you very much :) :)

[06:39:23]

wagnerrp:

remember that if something is recording off the dvbt card, livetv will revert to the dvbs card

[06:42:27]

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artus35:

yep thats correct

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[07:41:40]

justinh:

somebody should have a word with avenard

[07:42:33]

kormoc:

I have a word for him... don't think he'd like it tho :P

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dekraf1:

ciao

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Fleck:

hello, i know, this maybe asked many times, but, how do i import transponder list to mythtv? I have DVB-S and need for example 13.0E transponders, i can get them online, but what next? Don't whant to type in manualy...?

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justinh:

hmmm I think I might have a problem. Chain drinking cups of coffee

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[11:06:01]

justinh:

oh, nice: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/commits/376403

[11:08:32]

justinh:

also nice: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/commits/273975

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[11:21:31]

justinh:

yay! Tux the penguin has been dropped. Sadly not permanently

[11:21:54]

Chiliblack:

how dare you

[11:22:02]

justinh:

oh I very dare

[11:22:03]

Chiliblack:

I love tux

[11:22:38]

justinh:

lots of people do. That's not my problem

[11:30:26]

AndyCap:

dropped from where?

[11:35:10]

justinh:

http://lwn.net/Articles/323966/

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AndyCap:

justinh: for one release it seems

[11:56:32]

justinh:

like I said. sadly not permanently

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[12:01:59]

wombo1:

Go the Aussies!!!!!!

[12:02:28]

wombo1:

In case you dont know Tuz is an Aussie

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** gbee gives up on lighttpd **

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gbee:

was under the mistaken impression that it was easier to setup than apache :/

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[13:20:07]

justinh:

hahaha. is tux really Mr Flibble?

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[13:31:34]

RDV_Linux1:

gbee: I noticed last night that you commented about getting sick of your Terra work. I do not think you know the impact releasing that theme has had. I would not have developed ttvdb without see Terra and the unreleased work from iamlindoro and justinh.

[13:31:36]

RDV_Linux1:

The Terra theme has inspired me to write scripts that integrate tmdb.pl with thetvdb.com data and artwork populating the new fields in the scheme 1232 data base. Only with the Terra theme can I see the full potential of the new mythui. I encourage you keep at it. Just turn your protective vest around. The front runners always get arrows in the back from the short sighted.

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[13:35:31]

justinh:

I think that new shape widget could save a heck of a lot of work for everybody involved with theming, past present & future :)

[13:35:42]

justinh:

that, and all the mythui inheritance

[13:35:47]

justinh:

and everything else :)

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[14:52:04]

justinh:

oh ffs. new gameshow on telly to decide which dr who fan can play the part of an alien

[14:52:47]

gbee:

surely that's no great stretch?

[14:53:28]

wagnerrp:

ive seen contests for that sort of thing, but never a full gameshow

[14:53:36]

justinh:

that depends on whether or not it'll be another peter kay abortion

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[14:55:38]

justinh:

ah. I totally misread the page. it's just a competition

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[15:00:21]

elg:

how can I figure out why a show won't record? i'm looking in mythweb and for a bunch of other shows it says the reasons (later, earlier, rerun, etc.) but for some it just has a dotted line around it and no explanation

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[15:01:51]

the_alien:

i had some problems connecting to my mythtv db from my macbook, so made some changes in the user rights. now i cant connect to the backend from the same machine. but from another machine. anyone has an idea what went wrong?

[15:01:55]

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[15:01:59]

the_alien:

btw: hi all :)

[15:02:27]

the_alien:

oh the connect from the console is working too, but the frontend wont connect

[15:02:40]

wagnerrp:

elg: what type of recording is it? record in this time slot every week?

[15:02:56]

elg:

there are a few, but this one is any time this channel

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[15:03:42]

elg:

it is set to only record 3 (but none are currently stored, and it would say "too many" if there were)

[15:03:44]

wagnerrp:

the only time ive seen no explination is when i have a 'record in this time slot', and something other than that show is in that time slot

[15:04:42]

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[15:04:42]

the_alien:

are there any changes from 0.21 to 0.21-fixes?

[15:04:42]

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[15:04:52]

the_alien:

any changes in the db connecting

[15:04:55]

wagnerrp:

the_alien: connecting to the console using the same credentials mythtv is using?

[15:05:22]

the_alien:

wagnerrp: connecting in the console using all mythtv settings as params for mysql

[15:06:03]

wagnerrp:

the_alien: i do not believe there are schema changes allowed between a release version, and a fixes version on subversion

[15:06:05]

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[15:06:32]

the_alien:

wagnerrp: the back and frontend are 0.21 from the ubuntu repos

[15:06:35]

wagnerrp:

the_alien: that said, it is not advised to run disparate versions on the same system

[15:06:59]

the_alien:

now i downloaded the 0.21-fixes for mac os x

[15:07:04]

the_alien:

for my notebook

[15:07:22]

wagnerrp:

the ubuntu repo should be a relatively recent version of fixes

[15:07:45]

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[15:08:07]

wagnerrp:

you cant connect to the backend? or you cant connect to the database?

[15:08:19]

the_alien:

database

[15:09:00]

wagnerrp:

and youre connecting using '--host <whatever>'? youre not connecting over ssh?

[15:09:30]

the_alien:

hm?

[15:09:42]

the_alien:

i can connect from the macbook with the frontend

[15:09:51]

the_alien:

the frontend on the linux machine cant connect

[15:10:15]

the_alien:

so i opened a terminal shell on the linux machine and tried to connect from there with the frontend settigns

[15:10:17]

the_alien:

settings

[15:10:41]

wagnerrp:

the only thing i can think of is that you changed passwords without knowing

[15:10:58]

wagnerrp:

when you 'fixed' your macbook, you broke the connection with the other machine

[15:11:11]

wagnerrp:

although then the backend shouldnt be able to connect either

[15:11:24]

the_alien:

the backend is up and running

[15:11:36]

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[15:11:39]

the_alien:

i can watch tv through the frontend on the macbook

[15:11:48]

wagnerrp:

did you flush all the permissions, and re-do them?

[15:12:01]

wagnerrp:

is it possible you did not add back permission to the machine running the ubuntu frontend

[15:12:34]

the_alien:

i dropped the permission for localhost

[15:12:44]

the_alien:

i thought % would do it

[15:13:07]

the_alien:

then i added the localhost permission after seeing the linux frontend isn't working

[15:13:13]

lucidblue:

hey all, I have an interesting issue and it might have to do with the TV I'm using, I'm not sure the terminalogy, so bare with me here...

[15:13:18]

wagnerrp:

it should permit all

[15:13:39]

wagnerrp:

the backend, frontend, and database are all on one machine?

[15:13:49]

meshe:

is your backend on the same box as he db?

[15:13:57]

the_alien:

meshe: yes

[15:14:16]

wagnerrp:

find the config.xml the backend is using, copy it to ~/.mythtv/config.xml

[15:14:24]

meshe:

hen you should readd localhost

[15:15:19]

lucidblue:

I'm using knoppmyth with a pvr-350 going out via the composit blugs (red,white,yellow) to a CRT, I just upgraded the version, but even last time I had the same issue, the actualy output from the card seems to be outside the viewable area of the TV. So I had to adjust the offsets and such for the myth gui so I could line it up... even the fluxbox desktop is bigger than I can see the edges. thoughts?

[15:15:50]

wagnerrp:

lucidblue: youre using the video OUTPUTS on the pvr-350?

[15:16:00]

lucidblue:

wagnerrp: yes

[15:16:18]

GrahamIRC:

often the problem with analogue connections

[15:16:20]

justinh:

using the blugs

[15:16:30]

lucidblue:

justinh: haha *plugs

[15:16:31]

wagnerrp:

get a video card, the 350 outputs are remain somewhat functional, but are largely abandoned by the devs

[15:16:34]

GrahamIRC:

there may be a service menu on your TV to adjust this

[15:16:42]

elg:

hmm, mythtv-status doesn't show my hdhomerun tuners and these shows are on the hdhomerun

[15:16:54]

elg:

everything's in order in mythtv-setup

[15:16:57]

AndyCap:

GrahamIRC: assuming the tv even has a menu.

[15:17:00]

justinh:

when are you people going to realise that analogue TVs are SUPPOSED to overscan?

[15:17:06]

elg:

and the cli hdhomerun tool says everything is fine

[15:17:10]

GrahamIRC:

indeed – or knobs round the back!

[15:17:14]

meshe:

local connections to the db require a localhost permission but that dhouls only affect the backend

[15:17:35]

lucidblue:

GrahamIRC: I have another input, is it possible that the input on the TV are effected? When I connect a DVD player it doesn't do it?

[15:17:37]

iamlindoro__:

I'm pretty sure Analog TVs (and framegrabber capture devices) are actually supposed to be shot into the sun

[15:17:42]

the_alien:

OH i think i found my error

[15:18:04]

GrahamIRC:

with Nvidia cards that have composite outputs you can sometimes adjust the overscan to a degree using the NV control panel

[15:18:04]

justinh:

iamlindoro__: says mister way too much disposable income :P

[15:18:10]

the_alien:

the lower case L and upper case i look the same in the frontend

[15:18:13]

lucidblue:

justinh: why would it overscan differently for the different devices?

[15:18:17]

iamlindoro__:

justinh: Not so!

[15:18:28]

lucidblue:

GrahamIRC: is this something that I might be able to adjust using the xorg.conf

[15:18:30]

justinh:

lucidblue: maybe because DVDs players don't have desktops

[15:18:34]

the_alien:

now everything works. *sigh*

[15:18:37]

wagnerrp:

lucidblue: different devices and different broadcasters define different overscan

[15:18:38]

** the_alien is feeling stupid **

[15:18:47]

meshe:

hehe

[15:18:53]

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[15:19:25]

wagnerrp:

are you saying the image is overscanned? or that there is actually black space on the screen where there is no signal?

[15:19:27]

lucidblue:

okay, so is that something that I might be able to adjust? if not, that's okay, I've adjusted the gui now, I just feel like that might be a bit of a hack

[15:19:50]

justinh:

lucidblue: no, the pvr350 outputs a fully overscanned PAL or NTSC signal

[15:20:04]

wagnerrp:

there is supposed to be ~5–10% overscan on analog video

[15:20:11]

lucidblue:

wagnerrp: the image is overscanned, so there are parts that I can't see... although when I actually play a show it seems like it's fine

[15:20:14]

wagnerrp:

so that you do not have black space with no signal on the screen

[15:20:29]

justinh:

lucidblue: yes, that's why mythtv has the thing to adjust the GUI size & position

[15:20:31]

wagnerrp:

the overscan still exists during the show, you just dont notice the missing video

[15:20:43]

wagnerrp:

some video cards offer options to adjust the overscan

[15:21:04]

wagnerrp:

be the simplest option, and your only option, is to just use that GUI size and position thing

[15:21:05]

justinh:

and you'd notice that if you were to play TV shows without overscan, there might be funny lines & crap at the edges

[15:21:23]

meshe:

yeah the pvr-350 can be annoying to admin on a tv

[15:21:26]

lucidblue:

wagnerrp: I was thinking that's the case, so it sounds like I should just live with it then... Just wanted to verify that

[15:21:47]

justinh:

or run a freenx or vnc server on the box

[15:22:01]

justinh:

who cares that the desktop won't fit the screen on the TV?

[15:22:10]

lucidblue:

I've got it lined up now, so i'm not going to attempt to mess in the servicer mode...

[15:22:30]

lucidblue:

justinh: I just figured that I had something configured wrong, but it sounds like I don't..

[15:22:33]

justinh:

lucidblue: nor should you, cos that'd futz up all the other inputs

[15:22:46]

** lucidblue nods **

[15:23:01]

meshe:

r ssh forward x and run the frontend remotely :)

[15:23:15]

justinh:

freenx & vnc is a better way to do it

[15:23:27]

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[15:23:29]

justinh:

freenx is altogether the best way IMHO

[15:23:35]

lucidblue:

meshe: I've only got the one TV...

[15:24:13]

lucidblue:

justinh: I've never used freenx, is it the same idea as vnc?

[15:24:21]

justinh:

yes, but better

[15:24:26]

wagnerrp:

freenx is closer to X forwarding

[15:24:31]

meshe:

the solutions we are talking is from another computer

[15:24:43]

wagnerrp:

its a optimized remote X

[15:24:57]

lucidblue:

wagnerrp: nice, I'll try to keep that in mind

[15:24:58]

wagnerrp:

where vnc runs a local X, and does image grabs

[15:25:02]

justinh:

iamlindoro: I need to find out where avenard lives. I want to send him presents

[15:25:13]

iamlindoro:

justinh: Australia!

[15:25:18]

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[15:25:20]

meshe:

wagnerrp: ill have to try freenx

[15:25:25]

iamlindoro:

justinh: I should quote some of the *off list* stuff he's sent me

[15:25:27]

wagnerrp:

justinh: like baking soda from an anonymous sender?

[15:25:38]

lucidblue:

haha

[15:25:39]

JEDIDIAH__:

what does avenard do?

[15:25:48]

justinh:

like my 'mythui theme converter' program on CDROM

[15:25:50]

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[15:25:59]

GreyFoxx:

jedix: What do you mean ?

[15:26:08]

GreyFoxx:

err JEDIDIAH I meant

[15:26:20]

JEDIDIAH__:

iamlindoro: I need to find out where avenard lives. I want to send him presents

[15:26:28]

wagnerrp:

avenard makes forks of 0.21-fixes, and then people come in here or the user list wanting support for something that is no longer mythtv

[15:27:06]

** JEDIDIAH__ didn't know if jh was being sarcastic. **

[15:27:15]

GreyFoxx:

hehe

[15:27:15]

iamlindoro:

He was

[15:27:17]

justinh:

was I saying something?

[15:27:22]

jedix:

I mean nothing!!

[15:27:26]

justinh:

then YES I was being sarcastic

[15:27:29]

** JEDIDIAH__ has contemplated sending Janne a case of beer or somesuch. **

[15:28:14]

justinh:

some people repay their debt by contributing

[15:29:01]

justinh:

though I think I still owe the project a decent theme

[15:29:54]

iamlindoro:

justinh: On the other hand, some people's "contributions" are so toxic as to be unwanted

[15:30:12]

justinh:

hmmm very true

[15:30:36]

iamlindoro:

justinh: As evidenced by the fact that the best thing he can come up with when he's not cutting and pasting other people's code is a better way to handle his stolen filenames

[15:30:40]

justinh:

that's like saying you want me to 'encourage' somebody though

[15:31:17]

iamlindoro:

And in python no less

[15:32:29]

meshe:

ithought he was working on vdpau ;)

[15:32:31]

janneg:

justinh: another one?

[15:33:00]

justinh:

well true, there's Terra now

[15:34:09]

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[15:34:28]

justinh:

note to self..must buy a smaller cafetiere. Completely & utterly wired now. Ooops

[15:36:02]

iamlindoro:

kormoc (if you check the logs) or xris: 20246 broke the detail screen on a listing in Mythweb

[15:36:31]

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[15:36:37]

janneg:

justinh: the finished parts of terra are decent and so are your previous themes

[15:37:18]

GrahamIRC:

are there any plans to make an interface similar to LinuxMCE?

[15:37:34]

janneg:

terra's recording details screen is unuseable. white and yellow on white background

[15:37:37]

justinh:

GrahamIRC: no, but there are plans underway to make the interface good

[15:37:46]

GrahamIRC:

rofl

[15:37:58]

GrahamIRC:

well I like the LinuxMCE idea, if not the current implementation

[15:38:05]

justinh:

the new ui libs are very very nice indeed

[15:38:12]

GrahamIRC:

:-)

[15:38:27]

justinh:

and so are all of the work in progress themes that make use of them

[15:40:01]

justinh:

I think I'll revisit that variable width hack tonight & see what can be done. I may scream for help

[15:40:25]

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[15:41:13]

justinh:

been really bored the last few weeks/months, just vegging out on the couch when I've had free time

[15:41:30]

justinh:

nothing like boredom to restore motivation

[15:41:50]

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[15:43:13]

AndyCap:

nothing like lobotomy to improve vegging out.

[15:45:37]

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[15:46:19]

GrahamIRC:

I can't wait to see them JustinH

[15:46:20]

wagnerrp:

awesome! someone subscribed us to 'MSN Featured Offers'

[15:46:56]

wagnerrp:

or not... the unsubscribe link is not to one that microsoft owns

[15:47:01]

wagnerrp:

a '.cn' address

[15:47:13]

gbee:

janneg: hmm, did I not check in the changes to the recording details screen? It's themed to match everywhere else as I best I could manage

[15:48:52]

gbee:

[20264]

[15:49:58]

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[15:54:14]

iamlindoro:

gbee: Heh, so are we just going with the misspelled version of "label," then?

[15:55:17]

gbee:

got a problem with that? :p

[15:55:18]

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[15:55:38]

iamlindoro:

no sir, carry on sir

[15:55:55]

iamlindoro:

you're looking particularly handsome today sir

[15:57:20]

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[15:57:36]

gbee:

not my mistake, not really inclined to fix it, but maybe paul would, if asked

[15:57:53]

iamlindoro:

If it really bothered me I'd just do it :)

[15:58:02]

iamlindoro:

don't take my teasing personally

[15:59:19]

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[16:00:27]

gbee:

I'm not, really :) ... stupid internet

[16:01:25]

wagnerrp:

when you tell a recording to delete, who deletes it? the primary backend?

[16:05:11]

iamlindoro:

gbee: http://rafb.net/p/bZD00P36.html

[16:05:42]

iamlindoro:

;)

[16:05:50]

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[16:08:06]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +o gbee

[16:08:27]

** gbee lines up the boot **

[16:08:44]

** iamlindoro waves a teary farewell **

[16:08:58]

Mode for #mythtv-users by gbee!n=gbee@cpc1-derb9-0-0-cust304.leic.cable.ntl.com : -o gbee

[16:09:38]

iamlindoro:

stand down, soldier

[16:14:40]

clever:

wagnerrp: im guessing it would be the backend that 'owns' the file(hostname field for it)

[16:14:52]

clever:

but it would depend on the master backend override

[16:16:25]

the_alien:

anyone using a cronjob for an epg grabber?

[16:17:11]

the_alien:

i have a cronjob entered in the crontab, but it isn't executed properly. it is shown in the cron log but nothing seems to happen

[16:17:19]

the_alien:

and i dont know how to look up the error

[16:17:43]

clever:

x * * * * command > /tmp/errorlog 2>&1

[16:17:50]

GrahamIRC:

have you tried running it from the command line to see what happens?

[16:17:52]

clever:

then check the error log after it runs

[16:17:52]

wagnerrp:

or... run 'mail' as root

[16:18:11]

the_alien:

GrahamIRC: yes. it runs

[16:18:15]

clever:

wagnerrp: i generaly avoid it mailing stuff to me, i have 50000 emails cloged up in the system

[16:18:48]

GrahamIRC:

have you specified the full path to the command/script in crontab?

[16:18:55]

meshe:

it's most likly an environment issue, some varaible most likely path that's not set

[16:19:05]

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[16:19:36]

clever:

everything would be explained by saving the output with a redirect and viewing it(or using the email like wagnerrp said)

[16:19:46]

the_alien:

there are absolut pathes meshe

[16:20:13]

clever:

until you get an error, we are all guessing

[16:21:30]

the_alien:

clever: job will run in 1 minute and i put your > /tmp/... after the command

[16:21:31]

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[16:21:38]

clever:

:)

[16:21:46]

meshe:

clever: agreed

[16:22:19]

meshe:

if it runs on command line but not in cron, it's almost always something to do with env/path

[16:22:24]

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[16:22:39]

the_alien:

"can't localt config.pl"

[16:23:04]

the_alien:

locate

[16:23:12]

clever:

find an option to point it to the config and add it to the command line

[16:23:19]

meshe:

cd <dir where script is> && ./script

[16:23:39]

clever:

that may also help if it checks the CWD

[16:23:59]

meshe:

your script is expecting config.pl to be in the CWD

[16:25:47]

the_alien:

CWD?

[16:25:55]

meshe:

current working directory

[16:26:01]

the_alien:

ah k

[16:26:54]

the_alien:

ok with the cd ... &&

[16:26:55]

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[16:26:56]

the_alien:

it starts

[16:27:09]

** meshe nods **

[16:27:46]

the_alien:

seems to work now

[16:27:51]

the_alien:

that would be awesome :)

[16:27:58]

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[16:29:08]

the_alien:

scheduled it for everyday at 3pm. if it wont work i'll be back tomorrow ;)

[16:29:16]

meshe:

assume with crontabs that you are running in /

[16:29:29]

the_alien:

?

[16:29:31]

meshe:

to test if it will run cd / and try to run it from there

[16:30:02]

meshe:

it's still not perfect as your environment variables are still not copied over, but for the most part it will tell you

[16:30:32]

the_alien:

ok it runs

[16:30:55]

the_alien:

scheduled it for now. worked flawlessly

[16:31:28]

the_alien:

it can be so easy. updated the epg from console for over 1 year now ;)

[16:32:33]

meshe:

yeah, i kept forgetting to setup the crontab for mythfilldatabase for about 5 months, kept running manually when i noticed it was getting behind, finally setup a daily cron for it

[16:33:36]

the_alien:

i entered the mythfilldatabase command in the config

[16:33:45]

the_alien:

will do the same i guess?

[16:35:12]

GrahamIRC:

that needs to be run as the myth user tho

[16:35:35]

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[16:35:54]

meshe:

o.O? it does?

[16:35:59]

GrahamIRC:

mythtv usually manages running mythfilldatabase, you shouldn't have to setup a cron job for it

[16:36:22]

GrahamIRC:

yes, because it looks for the config files in the current users home directory

[16:36:31]

meshe:

ahh

[16:36:59]

meshe:

i set up the cron as holly, the user that i run mythfrontend from

[16:37:09]

meshe:

which does have the mysql.txt file

[16:38:38]

meshe:

mythtv wasn't taking care of mythfilldatabase for me, but that might have just been something i missed configuring

[16:38:46]

GrahamIRC:

but MythTV should handle running mythfilldatabase

[16:38:53]

GrahamIRC:

it's in the setup options

[16:39:31]

GrahamIRC:

mine used to be like that – so I'd run it every few days from an x-console

[16:39:40]

GrahamIRC:

but then after an update it just started working

[16:40:48]

gbee:

heh, never realised that Law & Order was an English invention – started as a four part miniseries in the late 70s

[16:40:49]

meshe:

that's funny, i think it works like that on my parents box which is 2 years old now, but my backend that i just built last fall doesn't

[16:41:49]

GrahamIRC:

gbee: not sure we can claim to have invented law & order in the 70's lol

[16:42:21]

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[16:42:24]

gbee:

by default mythfilldatabase would be run automatically and most people might never even know it was doing it's job – so definately something not right there meshe :/

[16:43:28]

meshe:

gbee: that's odd, my production system is a default install of mythbuntu 8.10, i'll have to look into it

[16:43:30]

gbee:

GrahamIRC: :P the tv series – idea/title of the US one seems to have been lifted wholesale from that original BBC 2 series

[16:44:37]

gbee:

only the original was from four perspectives Police/Criminal/Law/Prison – being rebroadcast atm, recorded the first last night

[16:45:08]

meshe:

hmm, i wonder if my trunk install is updating automatically

[16:45:30]

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[16:47:29]

GrahamIRC:

I was just being silly gbee :-)

[16:47:44]

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[16:49:02]

gbee:

guessed that, just thought I'd expand on my point anyway

[16:51:26]

janneg:

gbee: it seems like I missed that commit and my prod system is 1–2 weeks behind

[16:54:11]

janneg:

hmm, it would help if I knew the current revision, thanks gbee

[16:55:16]

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[16:55:40]

gbee:

janneg: I missed the actual html changes from the original commit, which is why I was a little confused

[16:57:34]

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[17:02:24]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux1: I'm not sure the guy yammering on the TVDB talk page has even installed the script, trunk, or appropriate patches... But I clarified that those things are necessary on the page so that there's no confusion

[17:04:28]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux1: Anyway, I'm not wasting any/any more time troubleshooting with him, from his questions it seems he did *something* wrong in setting it up, he should just wait for it to get committed

[17:06:15]

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[17:06:59]

cityLights1:

hi, tell me this: can I use mythweb 0.21 to control mythtv 0.22 ?

[17:07:10]

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[17:07:13]

iamlindoro:

No

[17:07:25]

iamlindoro:

All versions of all plugins, frontends, backends, etc. must match.

[17:07:27]

cityLights1:

thanks

[17:08:12]

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[17:08:18]

cityLights1:

I am using gentoo and a package to build the current mythtv from svn

[17:08:51]

GrahamIRC:

brave man! :-)

[17:08:59]

cityLights1:

I take it that all plugings are in one extra build and I need to enable only mythweb – right?

[17:09:11]

cityLights1:

should I take it from the svn?

[17:09:18]

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[17:09:18]

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[17:09:19]

gbee:

hmm, time portals into the future

[17:09:31]

iamlindoro:

If you're running trunk, there's no reason not to get the most recent revision

[17:09:32]

cityLights1:

gbee!!

[17:09:35]

iamlindoro:

except kormoc broke mythweb

[17:09:36]

iamlindoro:

;)

[17:09:46]

kormoc:

I did?

[17:09:49]

iamlindoro:

heh

[17:09:51]

iamlindoro:

only a little

[17:09:53]

cityLights1:

so mythweb is broke now?

[17:09:54]

gbee:

aye

[17:09:59]

kormoc:

What did I do?

[17:10:14]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: Go to listings, and click into the detail screen for a listing

[17:10:24]

gbee:

kormoc: you know what you did young man!

[17:10:27]

iamlindoro:

20246 caused it

[17:10:29]

RDV_Linux1:

iamlindoro: Just to show my ignorance, I did not even know there was a talk page (discussion). I just started looking at it. Thanks for letting know.

[17:10:38]

** kormoc hangs his head in shame **

[17:10:39]

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[17:11:03]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux1: We can just see if he comes back with logs... I sincerely doubt it's a genuine bug

[17:11:08]

** iamlindoro comforts kormoc **

[17:11:48]

cityLights1:

by the way any other gentoo user here?

[17:12:00]

gbee:

lighttpd instructions on the wiki seem outdated, no mention of the supplied config etc

[17:12:25]

cityLights1:

also, I devided not to buy a an nvidia 7600 agp card, and save up to buy a new motherboard with onboard gfx

[17:12:40]

meshe:

sphery: are you around?

[17:12:48]

** kormoc sets up a listing **

[17:12:48]

shadn_:

Release the Beast!

[17:12:52]

kormoc:

cityLights1, I'm a gentoo user

[17:12:59]

iamlindoro:

someone set up kormoc the listing

[17:13:11]

iamlindoro:

make your time

[17:13:18]

cityLights1:

kormoc: do you have an ebuild for mythweb 0.22?

[17:13:25]

meshe:

all your recordings belong to us

[17:13:47]

GrahamIRC:

are you Facebook?

[17:13:47]

kormoc:

cityLights1, I don't use ebuilds for web apps

[17:13:56]

kormoc:

I just svn co into my htdocs

[17:14:03]

gbee:

s/0.22/trunk/

[17:14:16]

iamlindoro:

.22 n'existe pas!

[17:14:37]

gbee:

and it's an important distinction

[17:15:00]

cityLights1:

kormoc: ok I am kind of new in this, need I just checkout the svn for the mythweb branch?

[17:15:02]

cityLights1:

how?

[17:15:25]

iamlindoro:

cityLights1: Why are you trying to use trunk instead of teh stable release?

[17:15:39]

gbee:

svn co http://svn.mythtv.org/svn/trunk/mythplugins/mythweb/

[17:15:54]

RDV_Linux1:

iamlindoro: You are correct the only way to analyze his problem is the frontend log messages.

[17:15:59]

cityLights1:

thnas gbee, again :-)

[17:16:06]

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[17:16:13]

RDV_Linux1:

O will keep an I eye if he supplies that info.

[17:16:21]

RDV_Linux1:

s/O/I

[17:16:39]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux1: I suspect either a) he has an inetref # set for the episode in question, or b) has failed at the install in some way

[17:16:40]

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[17:16:49]

cityLights1:

iamlindoro: firat I was looking for a version to handle Hebrew UTF-8 well, but now I find it work ok for me

[17:16:51]

kormoc:

Ah! Whoops!

[17:18:39]

Sulx:

what mythweb bug you mean?

[17:19:18]

Sulx:

episode info missing or Use of uninitialized value $size in numeric lt (<) at modules/stream/stream_raw.pl line 22 ? =)

[17:20:40]

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[17:21:10]

gbee:

0.21 should have had no problems with Hebrew UTF8

[17:23:05]

cityLights1:

gbee: shouldnt I use 0.22 then?

[17:23:54]

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[17:23:57]

cityLights1:

I am asking as a newbie , and assume you are a veterne here

[17:24:10]

kormoc:

Sulx, suze is initialized on line 19

[17:24:17]

kormoc:

gbee, iamlindoro, svn up :)

[17:24:30]

iamlindoro:

He is a veteran, and he is saying that there is no reason to run trunk if you need Hebrew UTF8 support, as that should work fine in .21-fixes, the stable release

[17:24:35]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: thanks :)

[17:24:48]

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[17:25:04]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: Yep, looks good!

[17:25:34]

iamlindoro:

Thanks for the fix

[17:26:12]

Sulx:

kormoc: or should...20100 still worked fine..20654 gives that error and "1004_20090324205800.mp4 is an empty file." on page

[17:26:30]

Sulx:

kormoc: should be .mpg...not mp4 =)

[17:26:38]

gbee:

if it doesn't work in 0.21 – well we've had no bug reports

[17:26:51]

kormoc:

Sulx, why are you using the stream mp4 module?

[17:27:04]

Sulx:

kormoc: direct download

[17:27:57]

cityLights1:

ok thanks and bye for now

[17:28:06]

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[17:28:26]

iamlindoro:

"OK, I'm done listening because I don't like the answer, BYE!"

[17:28:40]

kormoc:

Sulx, the only module that modifies the filename is the mpeg4 module... unless you did something weird?

[17:29:26]

Sulx:

nope

[17:29:54]

Sulx:

i'm no perl expert but what does " $filename =~ s/mpg$/mp4/g; " do

[17:30:09]

Sulx:

replaces "mpg" with "mp4" ?

[17:30:13]

kormoc:

Aye

[17:30:24]

kormoc:

oh crap

[17:30:28]

Sulx:

that must be it

[17:30:36]

kormoc:

I copied that into the wrong file...

[17:30:41]

Sulx:

=D

[17:31:06]

kormoc:

svn up

[17:31:15]

kormoc:

or just delete those two lines...

[17:31:30]

Sulx:

yea, commented out those

[17:31:35]

Sulx:

and its working again

[17:31:52]

kormoc:

Wow... talk about a brainfart :P

[17:32:02]

Sulx:

so does episode info =)

[17:32:23]

kormoc:

Aye!

[17:32:54]

kormoc:

it does totally break the iphone/ipod streaming, so it'll only have the nice filename on the raw streamer, but if people use it, why not! :)

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[18:08:51]

gbee:

hmm, this PSU shopping isn't easy

[18:09:52]

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[18:10:23]

dustybin:

gbee: seasonics are nice

[18:10:34]

dustybin:

mines dead silent and solid

[18:11:46]

iamlindoro:

sphery has done a lot of research and spec'ing PSUs lately

[18:11:52]

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[18:12:12]

iamlindoro:

Believe he has a short list that are both highly power efficient and decent

[18:13:12]

dustybin:

iamlindoro: what PSUs do you use?

[18:13:16]

gbee:

looking for the sweet spot – price, efficiency, quality and connections

[18:13:54]

gbee:

current one is a tangle of wires, 60% of which I'm not even using so I have to cram them into an empty 5 1/4" bay which is less than ideal

[18:14:42]

iamlindoro:

gbee: I like the recent trend to make it all modular such that you only plug in the lines you intend to use

[18:14:42]

dustybin:

gbee: does that mean you are looking at modular PSUs ?

[18:14:53]

gbee:

unfortunately so many of the PSUs I'm looking at now seem to offer lots of molex but not much sata – adapters are fine but just add to the mess

[18:15:16]

gbee:

iamlindoro: shows how much I know, wasn't even aware of that trend

[18:15:28]

gbee:

guessing that pushes up the price a fair bit though :/

[18:15:35]

iamlindoro:

gbee: Yeah, it's quite nice, any decent PSU should have that arangement

[18:15:47]

iamlindoro:

naw, even the moderate priced ones are that way

[18:16:33]

gbee:

hmm, cool

[18:16:41]

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[18:17:05]

iamlindoro:

gbee: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/374597#374597

[18:17:18]

iamlindoro:

That's the users list response he wrote that congeals most of it

[18:17:58]

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[18:20:07]

iamlindoro:

gbee: Here's all the 80-Plus certified and modular PSUs: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp . . . ;srchInDesc=

[18:20:10]

iamlindoro:

ugly link, sorry

[18:21:27]

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[18:21:58]

janneg:

iamlindoro: modular plugs are bad for efficiency

[18:22:38]

gbee:

iamlindoro: thanks

[18:22:58]

iamlindoro:

janneg: appears you can still get the highest efficiency rating with modular, but you pay an arm and a leg for it

[18:23:13]

iamlindoro:

janneg: I am sure you're right, it's definitely not my area of expertise

[18:23:27]

iamlindoro:

I mostly just buy what's cheap, adequate wattage, and if it's efficient, hooray

[18:23:35]

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[18:23:43]

iamlindoro:

or at least, always used to-- current two PSUs are efficient models

[18:23:57]

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[18:25:32]

gbee:

not all that sure what wattage I ought to aim for – details like that haven't really stuck with me, I've generally been lucky with PSUs and not needed to replace them that often

[18:26:32]

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[18:27:05]

gbee:

current PSU could be anything upto 8 years old, can't really remember when I bought it :)

[18:28:46]

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[18:37:06]

janneg:

iamlindoro: any sort of pluggable electrical connection has a higher resistance than plain copper wire. sata/molex for drives probably doesn't matter much

[18:37:50]

janneg:

but ATX connectors and connectors for high end GPU shouldn't be pluggable

[18:39:32]

iamlindoro:

janneg: My recollection is that most or all of the modular PSUs have non-modular motherboard and ATX connectors

[18:39:36]

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[18:39:44]

iamlindoro:

I *have* definitely seen the GPU plus s modular, though

[18:39:50]

iamlindoro:

s/s/as/

[18:41:12]

gbee:

hmm, stock/choice at my usual haunts is lousy, best I can find sub-Â£50 is an Akasa 400w Ultra Quiet ... 85% efficient

[18:44:06]

gbee:

damn, maybe not, model number is one off the 80+ version :/

[18:50:47]

gbee:

ahh forget it, I'll wait until I change the case or this PSU fails

[18:55:35]

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[19:13:08]

mattwire:

okolsi_: i launch irexec via a script just before mythwelcome

[19:13:25]

mattwire:

okolsi_: like so: irexec -d /home/mythtv/.lircrc

[19:13:40]

mattwire:

okolsi_: then i start mythwelcome

[19:14:00]

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[19:14:46]

okolsi:

mattwire: don't have much time right now..

[19:15:13]

mattwire:

okolsi: ok, but just wondering if you are starting mythwelcome first or irexec first?

[19:19:47]

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[19:21:49]

mattwire:

seems irexec has to be called with & to background it. -d is not enough. Then it works!

[19:22:10]

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[19:24:58]

thejpster:

Recently, my H264 (BBC HD) playback has been playing up. After a few seconds of video, I get a copy of the video quarter-screen, on top of the full screen video. I've tried all the video output options (XVMC-OpenGL, XVMC-Blit, XV, X11...) and the same thing happens. If I set a cut point, it plays for a few seconds from that point, and then happens.

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[19:29:34]

thejpster:

MythTV Version : 18722, Ubuntu Intrepid, if that helps.

[19:32:09]

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[19:32:24]

wagnerrp:

18722 is just a revision, what branch?

[19:32:58]

wagnerrp:

i.e.: there is trunk and -fixes

[19:33:34]

wagnerrp:

also, xvmc wont do a thing for h264

[19:34:09]

thejpster:

branches/release-0-21-fixes

[19:34:33]

thejpster:

lol @ xvmc. I could have sworn it was doing something ;)

[19:35:03]

wagnerrp:

xvmc will fail, and mythtv will fall back, usually to xv

[19:35:57]

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[19:36:06]

thejpster:

I've tried with -v playback,libav and nothing seems to appear in the logs that coincides with the extra copy appearing

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[19:37:51]

iamlindoro:

thejpster: You're not invoking any sort of PiP mode, are you? When you have both playing, what do you see in the Menu Picture in Picture options?

[19:39:11]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: you see revision 20265?

[19:39:26]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: Is that the mythweb fix? If so, yeah

[19:39:39]

wagnerrp:

yeah

[19:39:47]

thejpster:

I don't see the PiP on the menu when I press M. Is there another menu?

[19:40:17]

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[19:41:00]

wagnerrp:

i really dont understand why people post to mailing lists with incorrect clocks

[19:41:03]

iamlindoro:

thejpster: Just try pressing "V" when you have two windows

[19:41:18]

yunosh:

hi, why does my font configuration dialog only show fonts from the freefont set?

[19:41:23]

wagnerrp:

especially people on the mythtv mailing list, who must have set up NTP at some point during their install process

[19:42:02]

thejpster:

wagnerrp: nothing happens. Interesting, the OSD only appears on the larger copy.

[19:42:35]

thejpster:

wagnerrp: I have a screenshot if that helps.

[19:42:45]

wagnerrp:

sure, post it somewhere

[19:43:01]

wagnerrp:

this is on recordings? not mythvideo?

[19:43:20]

iamlindoro:

thejpster: Out of curiosity, what GPU and drivers are you running, and have you run updates (or automatic updates) any time recently

[19:43:44]

thejpster:

I did reboot recently ;)

[19:45:10]

thejpster:

(II) NVIDIA GLX Module 177.82 Tue Nov 4 14:03:48 PST 2008

[19:45:27]

thejpster:

It's a Socket AM2 GeForce 7100 onboard thing

[19:47:52]

thejpster:

http://www.geocities.com/thejpster/bug.png

[19:48:00]

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[19:48:06]

thejpster:

it happens on recordings and live BBC HD

[19:48:09]

thejpster:

I'll check it again now

[19:48:34]

thejpster:

ooh, Raven.

[19:48:38]

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[19:48:44]

thejpster:

pausey pausey. Ok, it looks OK.

[19:48:54]

thejpster:

now I've got two copies

[19:49:08]

wagnerrp:

do both copies move?

[19:49:16]

wagnerrp:

or is only one playing?

[19:49:25]

thejpster:

both move in sync

[19:49:33]

wagnerrp:

now thats just funky...

[19:49:34]

thejpster:

if I wind forwards / backwards, they stay in sync

[19:49:47]

thejpster:

if I rewind to the start, the bit that played OK (the first few seconds) is now in double-mode

[19:50:03]

wagnerrp:

does this happen in any other player?

[19:50:08]

thejpster:

I was really struggling to find any other bug reports on google

[19:50:14]

thejpster:

mplayer plays just fine

[19:50:23]

wagnerrp:

using '-vo xv'?

[19:50:27]

thejpster:

yah

[19:51:37]

wagnerrp:

i can only think that something is hosed with Xv

[19:51:50]

thejpster:

it did do this until Monday, when I powered it down in my old house and powered it up again in my new house

[19:52:37]

wagnerrp:

i cant believe your computer has the power to run two simultaneous decodes of that video

[19:52:44]

wagnerrp:

meaning its getting duplicated by the video renderer

[19:52:57]

thejpster:

it's only an X2 5200

[19:53:08]

thejpster:

in mplayer, I'm using 98%

[19:53:53]

thejpster:

in mythfrontend, ~110% before, 133% after

[19:54:12]

thejpster:

so, something's duplicated, but not the whole decoding process

[19:55:20]

iamlindoro:

thejpster: Is your new house also receiving from a new transmitter?

[19:55:26]

thejpster:

given the rebooting, I'm inclined to point at the nvidia driver

[19:55:47]

thejpster:

no, still Astra 2D :)

[19:55:58]

iamlindoro:

ah, duh, BBC-HD, DVB-S only

[19:56:21]

iamlindoro:

yes, a driver upgrade may be in order

[19:56:25]

thejpster:

and I've got an episode of Hustle from mid-Feb, which does the same thing

[19:56:44]

thejpster:

although ....

[19:57:04]

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[19:57:13]

thejpster:

nope, that copy of Hustle is playing just fine.

[19:58:06]

thejpster:

when I play these videos, a quarter-size frame flashes up in the first 200ms or so.

[19:58:40]

thejpster:

I've got a second video from early Feb that's OK too (you see the single quarter-frame flash up, then it's OK after that)

[19:59:47]

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[20:00:19]

thejpster:

Oh dear.

[20:00:29]

thejpster:

I am running a jaunty kernel, to make the DVB-S card work.

[20:03:01]

iamlindoro:

Why would you do that instead of just compiling v4l-dvb against the correct kernel?

[20:03:16]

thejpster:

I had trouble compiling v4l-dvb

[20:03:25]

thejpster:

but 2.6.28 has the modules built in

[20:06:19]

thejpster:

because it's DVB-S2, I was trying to avoid the multiproto mess, or whatever they settled with in the end.

[20:08:07]

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[20:10:22]

thejpster:

brb

[20:10:30]

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[20:15:22]

admkirk:

Hi. Could someone help me. I cannot get mythtv-setup to scan my DVB-T channels. I just get Signal timed out. scan/tzap+kaffeine work just fine. I've read through all teh HOWTO's/FAQs I can find

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[20:20:18]

wagnerrp:

admkirk: do you have a multithreaded box?

[20:20:24]

admkirk:

yes

[20:20:47]

admkirk:

I start mythtv-setup with 'taskset -c 0 mythtv-setup'

[20:21:32]

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[20:24:12]

admkirk:

I am running openSUSE 11.1 x86_x64 with these pre-packaged mythtv packages: http://packman.links2linux.org/package/mythtv/87378 (should be pretty recent)

[20:24:13]

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[20:24:39]

thejpster:

right, I'm now on 2.6.28–11 and nvidia 180.37. It does the same thing.

[20:25:04]

admkirk:

DVB card: Asus MyCinema P7131 Dual (saa7133/Philips TDA10046H DVB-T)

[20:25:05]

meshe:

iamlindoro: sorry, what was the name of that dvi capture card?

[20:25:20]

iamlindoro:

Blackmagic Intensity somethingorother

[20:25:28]

meshe:

cool, thanks

[20:25:31]

iamlindoro:

np

[20:25:49]

wagnerrp:

note that card explicitly does not support HDCP

[20:26:25]

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[20:26:54]

iamlindoro:

yeah, she just wants to capture a computer DVI output IIRC

[20:27:15]

wagnerrp:

sounds painful

[20:27:28]

iamlindoro:

I just work here

[20:27:46]

meshe:

heh

[20:27:47]

wagnerrp:

hope you have something that can handle that kind of bitrate

[20:27:52]

meshe:

it's for machinima

[20:28:14]

meshe:

i don't know, i guess we'll see :)

[20:28:21]

iamlindoro:

meshe: I don't understand, though, whatever it's produced in can't render to a file?

[20:28:23]

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[20:28:34]

iamlindoro:

or this is actually being "performed" in a game engine rather than scripted?

[20:28:53]

meshe:

nope, the nvidia drivers do it at a level that even frapps can't read

[20:29:21]

iamlindoro:

In just surprises me that any modern PC game engine wouldn't be capabl of outputting the raw movie to a file

[20:29:26]

iamlindoro:

capable

[20:29:26]

meshe:

do it == 3d/anaglyph conversion

[20:29:37]

wagnerrp:

ugh...

[20:29:44]

wagnerrp:

EVIL!!!

[20:29:50]

meshe:

it's not the game that is adding the effect we want to record, it's the nvidia drivers

[20:29:56]

** wagnerrp crosses fingers as a shield **

[20:30:12]

iamlindoro:

ah, but couldn't that be done after the fact in a compositing/editing program?

[20:30:31]

meshe:

no, the 3d information from the game is gone at that point

[20:30:42]

iamlindoro:

Looks like After Effects will do it, allegedly

[20:31:01]

iamlindoro:

oh well, whatever works

[20:31:34]

admkirk:

any tips on what to try? How do I debug the fault?

[20:32:59]

meshe:

we tried through the svideo out on his video card to a svideo in on a pvr-150 on my computer and the digital->analog->digital conversion resulted in too much of a loss in quality

[20:33:28]

iamlindoro:

meshe: What about just a plain old HD-PVR, then?

[20:33:48]

iamlindoro:

Component out from the PC, capture right into a nice 1080i/720p/whatever h.264 file

[20:33:49]

meshe:

that may be an option since he has component out

[20:34:03]

iamlindoro:

Plus, super super sale on them right now

[20:34:08]

iamlindoro:

$154 shipped

[20:34:12]

meshe:

i saw that, Dell?

[20:34:27]

iamlindoro:

yeah

[20:34:28]

iamlindoro:

http://www.geektonic.com/2009/03/deal-of-day- . . . -165_23.html

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[20:35:38]

meshe:

haha, out of stock

[20:35:50]

meshe:

at that price ;)

[20:35:51]

iamlindoro:

bastads

[20:36:14]

iamlindoro:

Hmm, I just added it to my card, works here

[20:36:20]

iamlindoro:

http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdet . . . p;lid=566643

[20:36:25]

iamlindoro:

oh d'oh

[20:36:31]

iamlindoro:

they'll let you add it to your cart, though

[20:36:37]

iamlindoro:

so they have to honor the deal, I'd just go for it

[20:37:18]

meshe:

hmmm

[20:37:37]

iamlindoro:

Or I suppos you could call their customer service number and try to get them to give you a rain check or whatever

[20:37:40]

iamlindoro:

suppose

[20:38:27]

meshe:

sadly, money-wise, i'm going to have to wait

[20:38:44]

meshe:

heres my local supplier: http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=30194&v . . . re=HAUPPAUGE

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[20:41:54]

meshe:

amazon sells it for $208.37 with free shipping, so only $50ish more

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notz:

hy, someone out there, that have vdpau running with 8200 IGP without audio glitches (720p, 1080i)?

[21:09:11]

admkirk:

I found the solution to my problem. I increased the signal timeout value, and mythtv started finding channels.

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[21:34:36]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: Hi – sorry about not replying yesterday – I did read your response. The hd44780 does have custom characters, but lcdproc doesn't allow client access to them, thus they are more-or-less 'disabled' from my standpoint.

[21:35:20]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: If they were accessible, I could make a bold "R" or animated icons, etc.

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[21:36:39]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: The reason I was even thinking about alternative drivers (other than lcdproc) is to be able to use those features, independent of what lcdproc is doing, thus taking them out of the loop.

[21:38:09]

Goldfisch:

I have two sound cards on my system, one on the motherboard, and one extra plugged in. I am trying to configure the recording inputs. However, I can't tell which device (/dev/dsp or /dev/dsp1) maps to which card.

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[21:52:28]

paul-h:

J-e-f-f-A: Don't let me put you of the idea. If you want to do it go for it.

[21:53:06]

yunosh:

hi, why does my font configuration dialog only show fonts from the freefont set?

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[21:53:45]

iamlindoro:

Because myth only shows the fonts in its share dir

[21:53:57]

iamlindoro:

s/shows/shows and uses/

[21:54:16]

iamlindoro:

share dir and theme dirs, that is

[21:54:52]

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[21:55:04]

paul-h:

J-e-f-f-A: I think if I was doing it I would just replace mythlcdserver and have it talk to the device directly

[21:55:13]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: I'm not trying to be pushy... ;-) The same could be accomplished by patching lcdproc – but then when they make changes, the patches would have to be re-worked, which may be more work than just creating something from scratch.

[21:55:13]

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[21:55:20]

justinh:

hahaha last.fm is going paypay

[21:55:28]

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[21:55:51]

bulle:

justinh: except for the damn merkins, and germans =(

[21:55:54]

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[21:56:17]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: That's precisely what I was thinking of doing, except instead of replacing it, giving it an option to continue to use lcdproc, or to use a 'native' driver talking directly to the device.

[21:56:18]

justinh:

they'll come eventually

[21:56:22]

yunosh:

iamlindoro: thanks

[21:56:32]

iamlindoro:

justinh: So much for that last.fm plugin we've all be clamoring fo^H^H^H^H laughing a^H^H^H^H ignoring outright

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[21:57:43]

paul-h:

J-e-f-f-A: That a good idea but it could be a slippery slope as everyone will want there device supported :-)

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[21:59:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: Yeah, I hear ya... They'd still have the lcdproc support, and if it's not supported by a 'direct' driver, they'll have to wait or code their own. ;-)

[21:59:39]

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[22:00:00]

J-e-f-f-A:

paul-h: But VDR-like support of lcds would be very, very nice... (ie graphical lcds and all) — Speaking of which, I wonder what they do... Humm... will have to research their implementation... ;-)

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[22:01:27]

justinh:

ooo there's always a place for Myth-7seg

[22:02:07]

justinh:

J-e-f-f-A: don't VDR have homebrew display hardware?

[22:02:07]

paul-h:

They probably don't use lcdproc.

[22:02:21]

J-e-f-f-A:

No, they don't. ;-)

[22:03:31]

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[22:03:33]

Fleck:

hello, i know, this maybe asked many times, but, how do i import transponder list to mythtv? I have DVB-S and need for example 13.0E transponders, i can get them online, but what next? Don't whant to type in manualy...?

[22:03:58]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: There is some – one called 'vdrwakeup' – which is serial attached, microcontroller based. Looks like their LCD support isn't 'native', but driven by plugins...

[22:04:18]

bulle:

Fleck: isnt there an option in mythtv-setup where you can import already predefined list of channels, eg channels.conf ?

[22:04:53]

Fleck:

yeah there is, where to get one?

[22:04:55]

justinh:

http://www.cadsoft.de/vdr/remote.htm

[22:05:00]

Chilired:

Does the issue with VDPAU not working on the 9400gt limited to a certain batch or does it affect all 9400gt cards

[22:05:05]

bulle:

Fleck: generate it with the dvb-tools

[22:05:05]

justinh:

mmmm yummy 7-segment displays

[22:05:27]

bulle:

Fleck: dunno if it works that way with dvb-s but thats they way i did it with my dvb-c stuff that needed some massaging to get the channels detected

[22:05:33]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: hehe.... I could make it work with Myth if you want... ;-)

[22:06:05]

Fleck:

bulle yeah, tought there may be better way...

[22:06:32]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: This is more along the lines of what I was thinking of – eventually – Check out the animated gif: http://home.arcor.de/andreas.regel/vdr_graphlcd.htm

[22:06:32]

justinh:

never seen what all the fuss is about with LCD stuff anyway

[22:07:34]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: some people perfer OSDs for everything – I think the less overlaying my video screen the better... ;-)

[22:07:53]

** bulle is the osd type of guy **

[22:08:13]

justinh:

LCD/VFD is no use if you're any distance away from the box though

[22:09:00]

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[22:09:40]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: True, depending on how far away you are, and how big the charcters are. It's tricky to do big chars on a character display, but relatively easy with a graphical lcd.

[22:10:17]

kormoc_:

iamlindoro, around?

[22:10:52]

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[22:11:31]

trumee:

guys, how can i change the brightness/contrast in mythvideo?

[22:11:56]

trumee:

the screen is too dark and the menu doesnt bring up any option to do this

[22:12:01]

J-e-f-f-A:

justinh: For Example – This clock can easily be read across the room – http://jartz.gotdns.com:8008/files/lcd/bigclock_font Chars are 1" tall...

[22:12:21]

J-e-f-f-A:

Ugh... I've got to fix the roof while there's still daylight...

[22:12:34]

** J-e-f-f-A leaves to do that... :-( **

[22:13:56]

iamlindoro_:

kormoc_, just got in, what's up?

[22:17:09]

trumee:

is there no way to increase brighntess in the Internal player in mythvideo?

[22:17:51]

bulle:

trumee: brighness of what ?

[22:18:02]

bulle:

trumee: the osd stuff, or the actual video ?

[22:18:09]

bulle:

damn, phone

[22:18:44]

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[22:19:04]

iamlindoro_:

Utilities/Setup->Setup->TV Settings->Playback, "Use picture controls"

[22:19:12]

trumee:

actual video. The video is too dark

[22:19:17]

iamlindoro_:

then if your card/driver and video renderer supports it, you can adjust such things

[22:19:56]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, do it create a menu after enabling it?

[22:20:29]

iamlindoro_:

It appears in the regular playback menu after enabling

[22:20:30]

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[22:25:04]

sphery:

meshe: here now...

[22:25:21]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: did you finish that theme converter, yet?

[22:25:34]

iamlindoro_:

I was too busy backporting MythUI, sorry

[22:25:48]

sphery:

what good is mythui if it looks like garbage?

[22:26:10]

sphery:

we should have some professional themes that people would be willing to pay for, like the 0.21-fixes ones--or one with flaming video

[22:26:27]

iamlindoro_:

Well thankfully trunk's h.264 playback has finally been fixed

[22:26:42]

sphery:

gbee: the above is a /completely/ facetious remark... mythui looks wonderful

[22:26:50]

iamlindoro_:

I just wish people would stop using those phantom commits without the commit messages or code changes

[22:27:26]

sphery:

yeah, good thing too as I've heard there were a lot of videos out in the wild (the wild, untamed parts of the 'net, that is) that didn't work with it.

[22:29:08]

iamlindoro_:

Hey, isn't that patch you promised the users list past due?

[22:29:16]

iamlindoro_:

I can't backport things that don't exist, dude

[22:29:26]

sphery:

heh, nope... clock stops when I'm traveling

[22:30:03]

iamlindoro_:

You don't even know what FOSS is about

[22:30:11]

iamlindoro_:

Why are you so anti-community?

[22:30:39]

iamlindoro_:

Everyone knows that open source is all about reading the feature requests page and finishing them with a smile, and ahead of schedule

[22:31:16]

iamlindoro_:

Now go help the poor man you tried to foist TMDB.pl on to

[22:31:32]

sphery:

btw, while connecting my computer up tonight, I found something even more funny about the reply on -users that explained to me all about the ssh port forwarding... I sent /both/ the message to which he replied /and/ the reply to his reply using an ssh port forward to port 25 on my mail server (to circumvent the hotel's ISP's garbage mail server--they redirect all port 25 requests to their mail server)

[22:32:08]

sphery:

wow... quick reply to that.

[22:32:39]

iamlindoro_:

$100 on user error

[22:32:49]

iamlindoro_:

most likely a typo

[22:33:13]

iamlindoro_:

but try telling anyone that once they've sworn up and down that there's no chance of it

[22:33:31]

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[22:33:39]

sphery:

it completely is...

[22:33:42]

sphery:

I'm explaining it to him

[22:34:04]

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[22:38:53]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: that conversation is actually scary.

[22:39:12]

iamlindoro_:

which one?

[22:39:31]

sphery:

the one you pm'ed

[22:39:55]

sphery:

btw, you should remove the paste

[22:39:58]

iamlindoro_:

oh, yeah

[22:39:59]

sphery:

(or can I?)

[22:40:02]

iamlindoro_:

go ahead

[22:40:07]

iamlindoro_:

please do

[22:40:11]

sphery:

not authorized...

[22:40:16]

iamlindoro_:

pm it back to me

[22:40:30]

iamlindoro_:

although I don't think that particular pastebin gets indexed

[22:40:45]

sphery:

just figured it wouldn't hurt--just in case

[22:41:20]

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[22:44:28]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, damn my nvidia 7600GT doesnt support XV_BRIGHTNESS

[22:44:33]

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[22:45:31]

trumee:

it isnt that old a card, why dont nvidia support xv controls or is it a driver issue?

[22:45:44]

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[22:45:54]

trumee:

i am running 180.29 nvidia driver

[22:46:13]

notz:

hy, is it normal that mythtv vdpau is much slower than in mplayer?

[22:46:13]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, nVidia *only* supports Xv picture controls on the oldest cards, they dropped it on newer cards

[22:46:33]

iamlindoro_:

notz, What do you mean by slow? They are both offloading to the video card, so speed isn't relevant at all

[22:46:57]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, how do i go about changing the brightness then, using xgamma?

[22:47:01]

sphery:

well, when Myth is doing all the stuff it's doing that mplayer isn't doing, it's slower?

[22:47:35]

iamlindoro_:

Just trying to get an exact sense of what "slow" is supposed to be in the context of the GPU doing all the work

[22:47:38]

notz:

yes, but in mplayer the videos run fine, and in mythtv i get stuttering audio and slower frame Å•ate video

[22:47:59]

iamlindoro_:

Then you are likely using a deinterlacer that is too advanced for your hardware

[22:48:14]

iamlindoro_:

if you have a low end 8xxx series, odds are you can only use no deinterlacer or one field

[22:48:14]

notz:

in mytht i use no deinterlacer

[22:48:31]

notz:

i have use one, it's unusable

[22:48:35]

sphery:

not to mention all the other advanced vdpau features that Myth is using but mplayer isn't (IIRC)

[22:48:52]

iamlindoro_:

yep, Myth has an OSD that it's painting, among other things

[22:49:09]

iamlindoro_:

some of which can be helped by turning off OSD fade from what I understand

[22:49:27]

notz:

ok, but the osd is not displayed most of the time

[22:49:29]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, my laptop has 8400M GS card and this supports xv brightness controls.

[22:49:34]

iamlindoro_:

Also read something lately implying that the CPU governor can hurt VDPAU performance by leaving it clocked too low

[22:49:47]

notz:

i have turned off osd fade

[22:50:02]

gbee:

notz: yes I have an 8200 and have no problems with VDPAU (which aren't endemic to vdpau anyway)

[22:50:14]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, so 7600GT has no xv controls but 8400GS does have it.

[22:50:40]

notz:

gbee: so no stuttering?

[22:50:50]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, http://threebit.net/mail-archive/mythtv-dev/msg08764.html

[22:50:56]

gbee:

no stuttering

[22:51:03]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, That's from one of our core devs, and I trust the information

[22:51:17]

iamlindoro_:

No hardware control for picture adjustments after the 5xxx series

[22:51:42]

gbee:

notz: which version? Which driver? Are you sure you've configured it to use vdpau correctly? h.264 or mpeg2? how much memory have you allocated to the IGP?

[22:51:50]

trumee:

i thought most people use nvidia cards. how do u cope with then

[22:51:50]

notz:

hmm, what driver version do you use?

[22:52:14]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, Actually...

[22:52:18]

iamlindoro_:

http://www.ngohq.com/off-topic/11139-nvidia-l . . . 14-09-a.html

[22:52:26]

iamlindoro_:

Looks like they *did* get added for 8 series, weird

[22:52:29]

notz:

180.41, 0.22 trunk, and in playback lock is that it uses vdpau

[22:52:31]

gbee:

notz: used every single single except 180.135 since vdpau was first available

[22:52:33]

iamlindoro_:

funky!

[22:52:35]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, my 8400GS card does support brightness

[22:52:43]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, No, you're correct

[22:53:01]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, At the time that message was writetn, it was true, but apparently 8xxx series out of nowhere got support, heh

[22:53:21]

gbee:

1080i h.264 stutters on some recordings for the first 5 seconds – but works just fine from there

[22:53:24]

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[22:53:29]

gbee:

using One Field deint

[22:53:53]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, what card do you use btw?

[22:54:00]

gbee:

8200 isn't really capable of Temporal/Advanced 2x on HD h.264

[22:54:21]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, Many cards, primarily an nVidia 9300 and 9800 GT

[22:54:44]

notz:

for me the 720p is nerly working only some time stutters, in mplayer never. but apple test trailers only are working in mplayer nice

[22:54:50]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, so how do you manage without brightness control?

[22:55:01]

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[22:55:36]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, firstly, my brightness is fine, secondly, my television has brightness control, and thirdly, if I really wanted to I could use another renderer that does support picture controls

[22:55:46]

gbee:

no idea what the apple trailers are like – 22Mbit/s BBC HD 2x gives it a decent workout though

[22:56:25]

bulle:

trumee: adjust brightness on the tv instead of mythbox is what i do

[22:56:32]

notz:

mplayer reports 1080p

[22:56:41]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: did you see my "anti Seagate 1.5TB HDD" post?

[22:56:44]

notz:

but i don't know if that is correct

[22:56:48]

sphery:

if so, did you get what I was saying?

[22:56:57]

gbee:

ok, so 1080p should be a breeze compared to 1080i

[22:57:05]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, ok i guess choosing another renderer could be an option to me, since i have a crt which is dark. how can i select some other renderer

[22:57:25]

bulle:

Sphery: what about those disks, what is bad about it ?

[22:57:43]

notz:

so what i can do, what compile options you have?

[22:57:58]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, By adjusting your playback profiles

[22:58:47]

sphery:

bulle: a user asked what people thought because he had read that they had some problems and a bunch of people wrote back talking about all the problems they had with them, so I basically said that he (implying, like the others who wrote back) would have no end of problems with them because he once read that there were problems with them

[22:58:54]

sphery:

i.e. self-fullfilling prophecy

[22:59:29]

sphery:

or, as Mulder would say, "I want to believe"

[22:59:51]

gbee:

notz: dare I push the issue and ask again which version of mythtv you are using?

[23:00:32]

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[23:00:34]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, should i use opengl renderer, does it support picture controls?

[23:00:45]

notz:

0.22 actual trunk version

[23:01:02]

gbee:

latest revision?

[23:01:04]

iamlindoro_:

trumee, Try it and find out, why don't you

[23:01:34]

notz:

yes lates revison from today

[23:01:38]

notz:

http://pastebin.ca/1372242

[23:01:56]

notz:

that's a snippet from my playback log

[23:01:58]

gbee:

and how much memory does the IGP have access to? Default for most boards is 128Mb, you want to at least double that but preferably 512Mb

[23:02:16]

notz:

the same trailer plays perfectly with mplayer

[23:02:46]

trumee:

iamlindoro_, coz i am not infront of my frontend :). but i will give it a go. thanks for the info

[23:02:57]

notz:

without 512 mb nothing was working – so i'm forced to use 512

[23:03:18]

iamlindoro_:

Christ, JYA wants themeing help

[23:03:32]

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[23:04:20]

iamlindoro_:

I started a response, but then I got irritated because he called my MythUI theming manual "out of date"

[23:04:24]

iamlindoro_:

So no help for him

[23:04:39]

iamlindoro_:

never mind it's the *only* 100% correct and up to date source of MythUI theming information...

[23:04:55]

jpabq:

iamlindoro_: Heh!

[23:04:58]

gbee:

notz: yeah, but as other have pointed out, myth uses more surfaces etc for the OSD etc which mplayer doesn't have, but 512Mb should be enough – I'm out of ideas, you shouldn't be having problems, but then vdpau is still experimental

[23:05:01]

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[23:05:36]

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[23:06:00]

notz:

which motherboard you have?

[23:06:47]

gbee:

\s

[23:06:51]

jpabq:

iamlindoro_: It will be nice when *you* write the recording-ui.xml section. ;-) It would be nice to have a window-name table like you have done for the other sections.

[23:06:55]

gbee:

Asus M3N78

[23:07:24]

iamlindoro_:

jpabq, Yeah, kind of lost steam, and having douchebags irritate me about what I have done doesn't compel me to finish

[23:07:42]

jpabq:

iamlindoro_: understood

[23:07:45]

notz:

mine is M3N78-VM

[23:08:07]

** sphery thinks someone should tell Jean-Yves Avenard to let the old themes die an honorable death **

[23:08:24]

iamlindoro_:

jpabq, The really irritating part about it is that I'm going to finish my response, if only for posterity, even though I know that he's going to respond in some way that irritates me

[23:08:59]

gbee:

heh, he's defining the fonts in the base window, not globally

[23:09:04]

jpabq:

iamlindoro_: Good for you. You need to "rise above"....

[23:09:16]

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[23:09:29]

iamlindoro_:

gbee, Yes, covered that he needs to get them out of the window

[23:09:43]

sphery:

what part of "porting" is he doing?

[23:09:51]

iamlindoro_:

Also defended the wiki page, and if he comes back with any sort of lip about it, so help me...

[23:10:01]

sphery:

does he just mean he's doing the widescreen stuff for default-wide?

[23:10:07]

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[23:10:12]

jpabq:

I spend 90% of my time in the PBB (not including actually watching a show). So the recording-ui.xml is the most interesting to me.

[23:10:28]

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[23:10:29]

iamlindoro_:

jpabq, There's a PANTLOAD of eligible information there, so I don't relish writing that one

[23:10:30]

sphery:

gbee: oh, and this is why the earlier facetious comments about mythui looking like garbage

[23:10:34]

iamlindoro_:

as all of programinfo is mapped there

[23:10:37]

PaulWay:

Hi all!

[23:10:52]

gbee:

sphery: nah, he's talking about menu-ui.xml, default themes don't even have menus defined – assumed that even the most basic theme will have their own menus

[23:11:26]

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[23:11:30]

notz:

gbee: are you using alsa for audio?

[23:11:37]

PaulWay:

I'm looking at moving my MythTV backend across to another machine; I'm copying the recording files across to the new machine and once I'm going to NFS mount the new machine's storage from the old machine.

[23:12:01]

iamlindoro_:

gbee, jpabq, sphery: I love that the topic is "Question about new theme" but he's actually just trying to make existing ones work

[23:12:07]

iamlindoro_:

It's a REVERSE BACKPORT!

[23:12:13]

sphery:

gbee: yeah, it was specfically an earlier post: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/376369#376369

[23:12:18]

Chilired:

In the wiki there is a note that there are reports that VDPAU isn't working on 9400gt, is this all 9400gt cards?

[23:12:18]

PaulWay:

I was wondering how plausible it would be to also migrate the mythconverg database across to the new server, and then point mythbackend on the old server at the database on the new server?

[23:12:22]

gbee:

notz: yes – wish I really had a choice, but alsa is all linux offers :(

[23:12:36]

sphery:

where he showed he had no clue about themes (or current status of trunk, for that matter)

[23:13:16]

iamlindoro_:

Chilired, If anyone said VDPAU wasn't working on a a 9400GT, they were mistaken or stupid

[23:13:27]

notz:

gbee: are you using 0.21 or 0.22?

[23:13:54]

gbee:

notz: trunk – no vdpau in 0.21 and no such version as 0.22 yet :)

[23:14:01]

Chilired:

iamlindoro, well I gathered it was working but the wiki said no

[23:14:09]

iamlindoro_:

Chilired, wiki wrong

[23:14:14]

Chilired:

good

[23:14:16]

iamlindoro_:

or wiki wong

[23:14:22]

notz:

no offical, but there is a patch available

[23:14:22]

Chilired:

:)

[23:14:53]

meshe:

sphery: that thread in -users about port forwarding for mythweb, why wouldn't it work, i had external port 8080 forward to 80 on my mythbackend with basic auth and it worked fine

[23:14:57]

notz:

gbee: what linux distro?

[23:15:00]

iamlindoro_:

notz, A patch which is at the same time broken, stupid, and irritating? Yes. Taht patch will get no discussion here. Well, unless we're pooping on it

[23:15:13]

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[23:15:28]

Chilired:

so iamlindoro is it worth the extra 5 squid for a 9500gt or should I be happy with my 9400gt (when it arrives) its only for the hdmi output and myth

[23:15:40]

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[23:15:45]

sphery:

meshe: hostnames and cookie hosts would be all messed up

[23:16:03]

gbee:

if it ain't official, it doesn't count :)

[23:16:09]

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[23:16:40]

iamlindoro_:

GOD DAMN THAT MAROON

[23:16:49]

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[23:16:52]

iamlindoro_:

ok, I'm ok now

[23:17:00]

sphery:

heh

[23:17:01]

gbee:

notz: mandriva 2009 – but I think you are reaching now

[23:17:05]

iamlindoro_:

Chilired, It really probably doesn't matter

[23:17:18]

iamlindoro_:

both should work admirably by the time VDPAU is actually considered a supported feature

[23:17:51]

meshe:

sphery: mine was set up in the default vhost of my backend so if there wasn't a vhost defined for the hostname you put in your browser it would fall back to the default and it worked beautifully

[23:18:10]

gbee:

not that it really matters but before you ask, AMD 4850e (x2 2.5Ghz) 4Gb ram (doubles as my desktop)

[23:18:25]

meshe:

sphery: i'd show you if I was able to control the wifi router that my backend i'm behind now

[23:18:36]

meshe:

s/i'm/is/

[23:19:00]

iamlindoro_:

OK, I am seriously NEVER HELPING HIM AGAIN

[23:19:11]

notz:

gbee: i use debian testing – same processor 2gb ram – unbeleavable

[23:19:13]

iamlindoro_:

Even though I am the one and only person on the dev list to respond to his crap

[23:20:07]

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[23:20:12]

iamlindoro_:

The next time I say I'm answering one of his pleas for help, tranquilize me

[23:20:19]

meshe:

lol

[23:20:38]

notz:

gbee: thanks, i have no ideas what i can change – but know i have the hope that it will work sometime

[23:21:02]

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[23:21:51]

** meshe preps the dart gun and passes it over to sphery **

[23:21:52]

Shadow__X:

hey iamlindoro to have mdadm add another drive do i mdadm --incremental /dev/sdf

[23:21:53]

Shadow__X:

?

[23:22:04]

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gbee:

notz: I'll seek out some apple 1080p trailers to compare at the weekend, but they should be easily playable if I can handle BBC HD

[23:22:29]

iamlindoro_:

I dunno what incremental is, I would just do --add

[23:22:48]

PaulWay:

So has anyone experienced any problems running the master back end on one machine with the MySQL database on another?

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gbee:

not that I'm a fan of vdpau, it's not a stable nor does it work as well as libav decoding

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meshe:

PaulWay: shouldn't matter if you have the mysql.txt file set properly

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clever:

PaulWay: ive done that before to try and cheat and speed things up, discovered that all my cpu load was at the mysqld i didnt move, no gains and more segfaults:S

[23:23:56]

iamlindoro_:

gbee, yeah, the apple trailers are substantially lower bitrate, and CAVLC instead of CABAC

[23:24:00]

iamlindoro_:

tons easier to play

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gbee:

PaulWay: and a solid, reliable network (wifi would be a bad idea)

[23:24:27]

PaulWay:

meshe: ta :-) clever: oh :-( gbee: 100BaseT all the way :-)

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gbee:

personally I just make sure the database is on a seperate physical disk to the media

[23:24:54]

clever:

PaulWay: the problem is that my mysqld had a 400mhz cpu, so rescheduling took 60+ seconds

[23:25:03]

PaulWay:

I'm basically looking at migrating the backend to a new machine, and just want to make the process relatively painless.

[23:25:10]

meshe:

PaulWay: just set DBHostName= to the server where your db is on all myth boxes

[23:25:16]

clever:

yeah you can move the masterbackend easily

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PaulWay:

clever: well, it's going to a 1.2GHz Via CPU, so that might be a little bit of an issue.

[23:25:38]

clever:

i swapped a slave/master with just 1 setting change

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sphery:

meshe: may work, then...

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notz:

gbee: but better than coreavc

[23:27:41]

meshe:

ooh, never seen that before: "#LocalHostName=my-unique-identifier-goes-here" i'm going to use that going forward

[23:28:03]

PaulWay:

The task after moving the back end is to get Minimyth working on an old fanless Via board.

[23:28:10]

PaulWay:

Anyone played around with that?

[23:29:12]

iamlindoro_:

I think my granddad had one of those

[23:30:32]

iamlindoro_:

back in aught-one

[23:31:24]

PaulWay:

What'd be really neat would be a Minimyth that supported suspend-to-ram or suspend-to-disk-over-nfs.

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clever:

PaulWay: ive had suspend-to-ram working with nfs-root, but it was a bit unstable

[23:34:00]

Shadow__X:

iamlindoro, the array shouldnt be mounted correct

[23:34:02]

Shadow__X:

or does it matter

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iamlindoro_:

doesn't matter

[23:37:11]

Shadow__X:

awesome its its reshaping

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Shadow__X:

and adding the new drive

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meshe:

what raid level?

[23:37:22]

Shadow__X:

wohooo thanks iamlindoro

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Shadow__X:

raid 5

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Shadow__X:

5 drives now

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Shadow__X:

well nows it waiting time

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Shadow__X:

lol

[23:39:10]

kormoc_:

iamlindoro, I was gonna ask for a data sample real quick, but I just made one up. I decided to add in the aspect ratio sql query as a job interview question, http://pastebin.ca/1372285

[23:39:23]

** kormoc_ feels deliciously evil. **

[23:40:13]

kormoc_:

I think that anyone with 5+ years of professional SQL experience can answer that one

[23:40:58]

Shadow__X:

whats the answer

[23:41:26]

Shadow__X:

i dont not have 5 years of experience

[23:42:18]

meshe:

i'm waiting for firefox to start again and i'll check it out

[23:42:46]

PaulWay:

kormoc_: sounds like the kind of obscure thinking problem that is really boring in interviews (IMO) :-)

[23:43:07]

Dibblah:

My goodness – Avenard is actually trying to develop forwards instead of backwards!!!

[23:43:16]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, it's for a programming test pre-interview

[23:43:32]

kormoc_:

Shadow__X, that's no fun just asking for an answer :)

[23:43:40]

meshe:

ack, grey window from hell

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kormoc_:

PaulWay, I don't see how it's obscure. It's very discrete and fairly simple if you understand SQL

[23:44:20]

Shadow__X:

there is so much going on

[23:44:58]

iamlindoro_:

kormoc_, hahaha, that's funny

[23:45:30]

iamlindoro_:

ok, am I totally wrong that JYA is making me *insane* that he would rather argue with the right answer than *try* the CORRECT answer I gave him?

[23:45:45]

PaulWay:

Having an interrelationship between the query and the subquery in the order by clause which is then based on an aggregate function is, IMO, obscure.

[23:46:11]

PaulWay:

iamlindoro_: I know not of the situation (and don't wish to, by the sound of it) but no, I would say that that makes you perfectly sensible.

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iamlindoro_:

PaulWay, Well good, I like you already ;)

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kormoc_:

PaulWay, and nested circular joins is any less obscure?

[23:47:27]

kormoc_:

Shadow__X, it's actually not a lot, just worth though it and it should come to ya

[23:47:34]

PaulWay:

kormoc_: no, but I don't see how they're relevant?

[23:47:52]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: it took Kevin K.'s giving JYA the Cliff Notes version of my post about how to make LiveTV work /exactly/ like he wanted it before he even considered trying it.

[23:47:55]

PaulWay:

iamlindoro_: If someone wants to argue with the answer I give, then I tend to say "well, there's my answer, take it or leave it" and walk away.

[23:48:20]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, that's the other way to calculate the value we're asking for, which I find a lot harder to understand...

[23:48:25]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: then, he replied with something to the effect of, "Well, that may do exactly what I want, but it's too much work, so I'm not going to do it..."

[23:48:36]

sphery:

(with the implied--otherwise, I can't keep complaining)

[23:48:42]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, so erm... you'd walk away from a job if they ask you to do something hard and you're an expert?

[23:48:48]

PaulWay:

kormoc_: so the real question with that query is: how do you know if it's correct?

[23:49:43]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, we're using it in mythtv now to calculate the aspect ratio of shows by their aspect ratio markup information and it's correct based upon real world validation?

[23:49:56]

PaulWay:

kormoc_: I'd walk away from an interview if they asked me to do some obscure mental manipulation that a computer is designed to do for me, and based my performance on my answer.

[23:50:25]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, we have similar queries in our codebase that people will have to interact with and modify. If they can't figure it out, how can they fix it?

[23:50:32]

PaulWay:

kormoc_: sure. No problem with it being actually useful.

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[23:51:00]

PaulWay:

If they're looking at a code base, then they shouldn't have to figure it out with no context whatsoever.

[23:51:27]

PaulWay:

If you called the columns "foo" and "bar", would it make it a harder challenge?

[23:51:56]

sphery:

according to people who actually think code obfuscation works...

[23:52:02]

meshe:

why do you need context, you have the query and the dataset

[23:52:20]

iamlindoro_:

ASDFGHKL:DFHKL:GGLSHKL:

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[23:52:21]

iamlindoro_:

I

[23:52:23]

iamlindoro_:

am going to

[23:52:26]

iamlindoro_:

KILL HIM

[23:52:29]

PaulWay:

If I asked you to calculate the factorial of 174 without a calculator, would that qualify you as a theoretical mathematician?

[23:52:41]

iamlindoro_:

please, will *someone* respnd and tell him what a douche he is being?

[23:52:44]

sphery:

iamlindoro_: a black van just pulled up outside your house...

[23:52:46]

PaulWay:

meshe: to know whether the answer you get is correct.

[23:53:58]

kormoc_:

PaulWay, not at all

[23:54:21]

gbee:

sphery: nah a hovering craft from which men are repelling shouting something about a black ball and pre-crime

[23:54:48]

iamlindoro_:

I am seriously wondering if I've gone nuts or something

[23:54:52]

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[23:55:06]

PaulWay:

So I don't see why asking an interviewee to calculate something in their head tells you anything about whether they're actually capable of coming up with a similar statement.

[23:55:20]

meshe:

my system is at 5 load, and firefox won't start, I have to head out, I'll look at that query at home kormoc_

[23:55:47]

PaulWay:

I think a better question is to give them the data, tell it what it means, and then get them to give you an example of an SQL query to determine the best aspect ratio.

[23:56:17]

PaulWay:

Anyway, it's your problem, you have fun with it :-)

[23:56:37]

iamlindoro_:

OK, even better-- he's now copped to having misspelled something... except the thing he misspelled wasn't *IN* the base.xml he pasted for all to see

[23:56:41]

sphery:

gbee: oh, did they bring a computer with that cool UI?

[23:56:57]

iamlindoro_:

So he selectively cut and pasted the parts of base.xml he decided were important

[23:57:14]

iamlindoro_:

and then says

[23:57:16]

iamlindoro_:

"I could see any obvious errors in the output of mythfrontend unfortunately.."

[23:57:23]

iamlindoro_:

Which I assume means "couldn't"

[23:57:38]

iamlindoro_:

even though mythfrontend will tell you *exactly* the line and column of the mismatched tag when it finds one

[23:57:49]

iamlindoro_:

And that's when I shot him, your honor

[23:58:01]

gbee:

sphery: doh, should have known that reference would lead to my favourite subject matter

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