Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Wednesday, January 9th, 2008, 00:01 UTC

[00:01:09]

wweasel:

Does anyone here have a good recommendation for an OSD theme? I've found the default ones...clunky.

[00:01:34]

sn9:

clunky > gaudy

[00:01:40]

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[00:01:50]

directhex:

no, the default one is really awful

[00:01:52]

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[00:01:55]

directhex:

wweasel, checked the wiki?

[00:02:10]

defaultro:

evening folks. Does DirectTV have more HD channels than Comcast?

[00:02:12]

directhex:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Category:Themes

[00:02:24]

wweasel:

directhex: Yeah. They have a screenshot of each one, but it just shows me one OSD, not really that much info.

[00:02:31]

sn9:

defaultro: hahahaha

[00:02:33]

wweasel:

directhex: I was hoping for a user recommendation :P

[00:02:51]

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[00:03:07]

GreyFoxx:

wweasel: My favourites are Gray-OSD and the one that comes with the Metallurgy theme

[00:03:18]

directhex:

everyone loves blootube-osd!

[00:03:19]

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[00:03:30]

sn9:

defaultro: directv has more if you ask directv. comcast has more if you ask comcast

[00:03:42]

wweasel:

GreyFoxx: Metallurgy is beautiful. I wish I had an HDTV...

[00:04:19]

defaultro:

what are ways to record HD from DirectTV to our mythbox?

[00:04:37]

defaultro:

GreyFoxx, first time I've heard about Metallurgy :)

[00:04:47]

defaultro:

and nice to see you as well. Long time no hear

[00:04:57]

directhex:

defaultro, firewire, full stop

[00:05:02]

directhex:

defaultro, no FW, no HD

[00:05:05]

Kazan:

*screams at this thing*

[00:05:17]

psm321_:

wweasel: i think myth will show you a preview of the osd theme where you select it

[00:05:18]

sn9:

directv has FW, too?

[00:05:22]

defaultro:

so I should get a directtv set top box with FW out then, correct?

[00:05:32]

sn9:

i thought that was a cable thing

[00:05:39]

psm321_:

but FW is likely to be encrypted right?

[00:05:59]

directhex:

directv is a sat network? oh yeah. i'm always losing track of the damned yank networks

[00:05:59]

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[00:06:05]

defaultro:

on my comcast set top box, I can only record local hd that are clear

[00:06:19]

defaultro:

so directhex, you just got confused

[00:06:26]

directhex:

easily done

[00:06:36]

defaultro:

so how? what do i need?

[00:06:38]

wweasel:

brb

[00:06:46]

directhex:

defaultro, no HD from encrypted satellite

[00:06:52]

defaultro:

ouch

[00:06:53]

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[00:06:55]

psm321_:

btw, i remember a while back someone in here was developing a startrek LCARS theme... anyone know the status of that?

[00:06:56]

defaultro:

they're all encrypted

[00:07:11]

Kazan:

oh bloody brilliant

[00:07:21]

Kazan:

ATI thought it would be a good idea, as of 8.30, to ignore custom modelines

[00:07:31]

sn9:

hahahaha

[00:07:37]

directhex:

Kazan, for your safety and convenience!

[00:07:47]

directhex:

Kazan, has anyone ever mentioned to you nvidia > ati on linux?

[00:08:26]

sn9:

the new high-def radeon driver > nouveau

[00:08:44]

sn9:

so there

[00:09:05]

Kazan:

directhex: fuck nvidia with a stick

[00:09:20]

directhex:

Kazan, enjoy your modelines!

[00:09:29]

Kazan:

heh

[00:09:29]

sn9:

nvidia is fine... for windows

[00:09:35]

Kazan:

nvidia is fine... for frying eggs

[00:09:47]

directhex:

nvidia is fine... for mythtv

[00:09:51]

Kazan:

except for not

[00:09:53]

Kazan:

been there

[00:09:54]

Kazan:

tried that

[00:10:02]

Kazan:

first time i willingly acquired an nvidia board in a very long time

[00:10:08]

Kazan:

it did nothing but cause more problems than it solved

[00:10:26]

sn9:

unfortunately, the nvidia binary driver is atm the only real way to go for myth

[00:10:27]

Kazan:

wtf.. composite extension is enabled.... by default

[00:10:29]

Kazan:

should i kill it

[00:10:32]

directhex:

i'm sure you're right. sheer volume of testemonials in the other direction aside.

[00:10:42]

directhex:

right. bedtime.

[00:11:06]

defaultro:

Kazan, you don't like nvidia?

[00:11:16]

Kazan:

nope i don't defaultro

[00:11:18]

sn9:

no nvidia gpu largely means no myth, atm

[00:11:35]

defaultro:

i have my GT6600 for 3 years now and it never gave me a headache

[00:11:38]

sn9:

luckily, nfarce does NOT have to go with it

[00:11:58]

Kazan:

their boards have a long history of overheating, intentionally misimplementing graphics algorithms in silicon to cut corners to squeeze more FPS at the cost of image quality

[00:12:11]

defaultro:

maybe on some cards

[00:12:14]

Kazan:

some rather unprofessional influence on gaming via partnerships

[00:12:17]

defaultro:

luckily, mine was fine

[00:12:19]

sn9:

Kazan: ati is guilty of same

[00:12:27]

Kazan:

and... the game engine i work on removed D3D support thanks to nvidia

[00:12:32]

Kazan:

sn9: not in silicon

[00:12:41]

defaultro:

and my mythbox is 24x7x365

[00:12:43]

iamlindoro:

blackest: Just watched that video-- truly amazing and beautiful work.

[00:12:43]

Kazan:

sn9: not that anyone has ever managed to show me, they've done it in software sometimes

[00:13:20]

sn9:

ati always pandered to the same customer base as nvidia. matrox, OTOH...

[00:13:35]

defaultro:

but i wish, the ATI capture card that my friend lent to me is compatible with linux but looks like not :(

[00:13:58]

sn9:

defaultro: which?

[00:14:25]

Kazan:

this is annoying.. either i get 1080i with fliker, 720p that the TV won't stretch to the entire screen

[00:14:32]

Kazan:

all because of modelines being ignored

[00:14:36]

Kazan:

which is probably an unreported bug

[00:14:40]

Kazan:

because ATI's bug reporting system is GARBAGE

[00:14:50]

sn9:

Kazan: they have one?

[00:15:35]

sn9:

Kazan: you're not going to get far with fglrx and an tcd tv, ever

[00:15:41]

Aval0n:

do they internal blu-ray drives for pc yet?

[00:15:48]

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[00:15:52]

iamlindoro:

Yes.

[00:16:02]

iamlindoro:

That's how my blu-ray movies get into myth ;)

[00:16:04]

Aval0n:

and if I install it in my myth boxen it would play blu-ray movies?

[00:16:19]

iamlindoro:

No.

[00:16:22]

sn9:

Kazan: if you want to use the x1600 that way, you'll need the new high-def xorg driver, period.

[00:16:23]

iamlindoro:

Not as such.

[00:16:24]

Aval0n:

no? =(

[00:16:42]

Aval0n:

you gotta rip em to hd?

[00:16:44]

iamlindoro:

You can, with great effort, RIP the movies.

[00:16:44]

iamlindoro:

And then playing them is the real headache.

[00:16:57]

whodat:

how do i tell if a movie file has been transcoded?

[00:16:57]

Aval0n:

bummer

[00:17:09]

Aval0n:

I wanna be able to just stick the movie in and play it

[00:17:30]

sn9:

Aval0n: not in myth

[00:17:31]

iamlindoro:

Since mplayer doesn't support the audio formats natively, you have to patch it heavily in order to play the ripped files...

[00:17:34]

iamlindoro:

and even then!

[00:17:52]

iamlindoro:

You need a specific mplayer file for *each* movie that specifies the demuxer, audio codec, and audio track.

[00:18:01]

Aval0n:

eek

[00:18:12]

iamlindoro:

So yes. Painful. :) Expensive. :)

[00:18:28]

Aval0n:

lame :)

[00:18:30]

iamlindoro:

BUT when you get it working and FINALLY get everything ripped and set up properly in myth, it's a thing of beauty.

[00:18:50]

iamlindoro:

Good thing disk space is cheap, my Blu-ray and HD-DVD rips account for over a terabyte.

[00:19:10]

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[00:19:40]

sn9:

you must not have very many

[00:19:57]

** Kazan tries to track down an rpm of the avivo driver **

[00:20:12]

iamlindoro:

@ 20 GB a piece, I think 50 movies in a brand new format is pretty damn respectable.

[00:21:53]

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[00:22:22]

sn9:

sorry, i misdid the math

[00:22:35]

iamlindoro:

all good

[00:22:55]

iamlindoro:

A fat chunk of that is Season one of star trek on HD-DVD

[00:23:06]

iamlindoro:

I think moviewise I only have 25 or so... maybe 30.

[00:23:24]

psm321_:

star trek as in the original star trek?

[00:23:25]

iamlindoro:

Including some total *crap* like "Click."

[00:23:29]

iamlindoro:

psm321: yeah

[00:23:33]

Kazan:

guess i'll just have to tolerate this friggen 1080i flicker

[00:23:39]

psm321_:

whats the point of putting something that old on HD?

[00:23:42]

Kazan:

avivo is probably in no state to be used in production

[00:23:48]

iamlindoro:

Because it's a film source, it looks gorgeous

[00:23:57]

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[00:24:01]

sn9:

Kazan: if you want to use the x1600 that way, you'll need the new high-def xorg driver, period.

[00:24:06]

iamlindoro:

Original source film grain far exceeds any HD resolution

[00:24:16]

psm321_:

if you say so :)

[00:24:33]

iamlindoro:

psm321: Hold your opinion until you've seen it ;)

[00:24:49]

psm321_:

:)

[00:24:51]

iamlindoro:

Just cause it looks old doesn't mean it can't be beautiful.

[00:25:17]

iamlindoro:

And at 1080p it really is as I've never seen it before... heck, even Shatner looks good.

[00:25:19]

sn9:

it's not exactly david lean's "lawrence of arabia" either

[00:25:29]

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[00:25:33]

iamlindoro:

Indeed not... but that'd be a great film at 1080p too

[00:25:51]

iamlindoro:

Heck, that movie is magnificent at 720x480

[00:26:33]

Kazan:

sn9: yes.. i saw you assert that already

[00:26:51]

Kazan:

you find me a copy of the avivo driver in an rpm for fc7 and we'll talk

[00:26:59]

iamlindoro:

There are differing qualities of mastering on the new formats, for sure. Actually, another old film that looks phenominal at 1080p is "Enter the Dragon."

[00:27:26]

sn9:

iamlindoro: at 480i, a saying about "pavarotti on a dictaphone" comes to mind

[00:27:37]

iamlindoro:

Although for me, that's part nostalgia. I remember watching that as a little boy with my dad.

[00:27:49]

iamlindoro:

sn9: agreed

[00:27:52]

sn9:

lawrence?

[00:28:02]

iamlindoro:

naw, Bruce Lee :)

[00:28:08]

iamlindoro:

But we agree on LOA too

[00:28:30]

sn9:

enter the dragon, OTOH, is just fine at 480i

[00:28:50]

iamlindoro:

Haha, spoken like someone who hasn't seen All the heavenly glory

[00:29:11]

iamlindoro:

And if that joke makes sense to you, then you too are an Enter the Dragon nerd, my friends

[00:30:12]

Kazan:

sn9: when annoyed by DVI->HDMI... try VGA :D

[00:30:31]

sn9:

Kazan: you mean you haven't yet?

[00:30:33]

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[00:30:44]

Kazan:

sn9: just got annoyed enough to go get my cable and DVI->VGA dongle

[00:30:47]

Kazan:

haha

[00:30:49]

Kazan:

invalid format

[00:30:50]

Kazan:

doh

[00:31:11]

Kazan:

in graphical boot no less

[00:31:12]

Kazan:

ha

[00:31:18]

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[00:32:03]

Kazan:

i think it tried doing the 1080i modeline over vga there

[00:32:09]

Kazan:

ha!

[00:32:19]

Kazan:

1280x720@60 ... and it's not cropped

[00:32:21]

Kazan:

or boxed

[00:32:35]

** Kazan wins **

[00:33:12]

sn9:

when i said the emprex does 1366x768, i meant over vga

[00:33:59]

Kazan:

with my old mobo and the nvidia board i had for xvmc i was doing 1360x768 over DVI->HDMI

[00:34:16]

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[00:35:01]

sn9:

that doesn't really gain you much over vga

[00:35:07]

Kazan:

nah

[00:35:16]

Kazan:

1280x768 without getting cropped or boxed is fine with me

[00:35:39]

Kazan:

mp3lame's package name is "liblame" yes?

[00:36:07]

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[00:36:08]

sn9:

libvorbis

[00:36:14]

iamlindoro:

on ubuntu it may be liblame0

[00:36:21]

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[00:36:22]

sn9:

libvorbis0

[00:36:32]

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[00:36:58]

achew22:

is there any way to echo from myth what it thinks the last pressed button does?

[00:37:19]

Kazan:

mp3lame is in libvorbis?

[00:37:21]

achew22:

from the last IR press?

[00:37:23]

iamlindoro:

no

[00:37:29]

iamlindoro:

liblame0

[00:37:34]

Kazan:

that is what i thought

[00:37:42]

jams:

nope not yet, it was discussed recently about implmenting a irlog thoug.

[00:37:52]

Kazan:

trying to figure out what the fedora name is

[00:38:01]

achew22:

any tips from anyone on ir configuration?

[00:38:07]

sn9:

ah, mp3... codec of the 90's...

[00:38:07]

Kazan:

got it :D

[00:38:12]

Kazan:

lame-libs and lame-devel

[00:38:19]

iamlindoro:

achew22: Using what distro?

[00:38:22]

Kazan:

sn9: which is required for compilation

[00:38:31]

achew22:

iamlindoro: ubuntu

[00:38:37]

iamlindoro:

achew22: Try apt-get install mythbuntu-lirc-generator

[00:38:44]

iamlindoro:

achew22: That will generate a basic one for you

[00:38:56]

iamlindoro:

achew22: And you can edit from there to your heart's content, but it's a good start.

[00:39:15]

achew22:

iamlindoro: I'm already running on that

[00:39:23]

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[00:39:27]

achew22:

iamlindoro: but it doesn't have the back button mapped correctly which is sad

[00:39:31]

iamlindoro:

achew22: Past that, then, you've got to figure out what works for you

[00:39:35]

iamlindoro:

achew22: So just fix it!

[00:39:41]

achew22:

lol I'm trying!

[00:39:45]

** achew22 sobs **

[00:39:58]

iamlindoro:

achew22: post your lircd.conf and lircrc on pastebin.ca

[00:40:03]

Kazan:

hmm

[00:40:08]

Kazan:

lame-libs and lame-devel are installed

[00:40:16]

Kazan:

but ./configure doesn't see them

[00:40:24]

iamlindoro:

that is, ~/.mythtv/lircrc

[00:40:57]

achew22:

iamlindoro I think you may have just fixed it

[00:41:15]

iamlindoro:

achew22: Hehe, I'll take the credit, but I can't imagine I did anything to fix it, probably all your doing ;)

[00:41:52]

sn9:

sudo apt-get moo

[00:42:00]

Kazan:

can mythtv use libs from /usr/lib64?

[00:42:53]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: I don't see why not

[00:42:56]

cafuego:

If it's a 64bit mythtv, it will be doing that already ...

[00:43:08]

Kazan:

iamlindoro: i pointed it at it and it succesfully configured

[00:43:15]

cafuego:

and /usr/lib64 would be a symlikn to /usr/lib in that case

[00:43:20]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: Sounds like maybe just an omission in library path

[00:43:38]

Kazan:

possibly

[00:43:40]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: Ah well, all's well that ends well

[00:43:49]

Kazan:

i got it working so it's all good

[00:46:07]

levander:

Has anyone seen anything about new nVidia cards being worse for myth than older ones? http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/284907

[00:48:44]

iamlindoro:

levander: Well, I cop to using the OpenGL renderer in trunk, but I have a 7600 also, and I am *fairly* certain I have used it with Xv-blit... but don't quote me on that.... anyway, in OpenGL mode it works perfectly.

[00:49:28]

levander:

iamlindoro: Yeah, and it seem OpenGL mode is definitely the future. But for right now, am I better off with an nVidia 6xxx card?

[00:49:48]

iamlindoro:

levander: You running .20.2 or trunk?

[00:50:13]

levander:

0.20.2

[00:50:13]

iamlindoro:

levander: Come to think of it, regardless, it's irrelevant. Save yourself a few bucks, get the older card.

[00:50:22]

iamlindoro:

levander: It'll work with either

[00:50:29]

levander:

Well, there $30 bucks either way.

[00:51:13]

levander:

I'm just looking at the 7200 or 7300 nvidia cards if I get a newer one, is there an advantage to going to 7600?

[00:51:24]

iamlindoro:

levander: roughly speaking, old and new nvidia cards perform identically in myth... various small differences, but I think you can safely go with either, presuming you are using trunk.

[00:51:40]

levander:

No, 0.20.2.

[00:51:52]

iamlindoro:

levander: I can't speak to Xv being missing in the 7600, that sounds a little suspect to me (or newer drivers have come out since to correct the problem)

[00:52:13]

iamlindoro:

levander: Since I can with 90% certainty say I have run in Xv-blit mode on trunk with that card

[00:52:42]

levander:

Thing is, I've got a 7200 GS that I just bought. I can't get rid of some artifacts even though I've turned on deinterlacing. I'm wondering if it's what that guy on mythtv-users is complaining about?

[00:53:04]

sn9:

the 6200 is considerably cheaper

[00:53:04]

iamlindoro:

levander: Anyway, We're talking about a month or two max (probably) before we see a new myth release, you're probably safe getting either... *worst* case scenario you have to go with trunk for a few weeks

[00:53:30]

iamlindoro:

levander: No, he's talking about Xv overlay being missing altogether... that sounds completely wrong

[00:54:01]

iamlindoro:

levander: because he's talking about the actual drawing method for video (more or less) in .20.2 being absent

[00:54:56]

iamlindoro:

levander: But I'm leaving a small margin that whatever he was talking about has been corrected since august in a driver release... certainly 7600s have Overlay support now, I've used it.

[00:54:57]

levander:

iamlindoro: Missing from the nvidia card or missing from myth? Little confused now.

[00:55:11]

iamlindoro:

levander: He says, "Now, it seems all newer NVidia cards lack the old Xv overlay, sadly"

[00:55:26]

iamlindoro:

levander: Which sounds like a crock, since I have that same card and have used Xv

[00:57:07]

iamlindoro:

levander: More or less, what I'm telling you is I have that same card and myth works fine for me, and should for you too :)

[00:57:15]

levander:

iamlindoro: You've been following myth discussions, like on mythtv-users, and haven't seen anything at all about older cards being better right now?

[00:57:48]

iamlindoro:

levander: I skim once a day, and don't recall anything to that effect. I'm also in here 24/7 and I'm certain it hasn't been an issue here

[00:57:59]

iamlindoro:

levander: At least, not when I've paid attention ;)

[00:58:20]

iamlindoro:

levander: worst comes to worst, you return it or upgrade to trunk. Still, I think it'll be just fine.

[00:58:21]

levander:

That's really all I'm chacking. I imagine if it were an issue, there'd be more than one random thread on mythtv-users that I happened across.

[00:58:43]

levander:

iamlindoro: That's what I'm trying to decide, keep fighting myth or return the card.

[00:59:10]

iamlindoro:

levander: I've used myth up to 7000-series nVidia, and there's certainly a few people with lower-end 8000-series cards running myth... have never heard of any mysteriously missing Xv mode.

[00:59:49]

iamlindoro:

levander: Tell me more about the artifacts you've been seeing

[00:59:49]

levander:

Yeah, I'm gonna ignore it. I'll read the thread to learn about myth, but I'm going to assume the guy is just as lost as I am when he wrote that.

[00:59:53]

levander:

Thanks iamlindoro

[01:00:14]

iamlindoro:

no problem... about those artifacts? What output are you using?

[01:00:25]

levander:

I've fixed this problem on an older machine about a month ago (I just been new hardware). And I fixed it by turning on deinterlacing.

[01:00:27]

iamlindoro:

And what's the symptom, more or less?

[01:00:42]

levander:

It's like tickers on CNBC and when there's motion there's blurry in the background.

[01:00:51]

iamlindoro:

Oh, is this your deinterlace jitter from the other night? Was that you?

[01:00:57]

iamlindoro:

ah, ok, I remember that from before

[01:01:10]

levander:

Dman, I hate it when people remember that you can't figure something out...

[01:01:10]

psm321_:

that was me

[01:01:22]

Kazan:

*grimmaces*

[01:01:25]

Kazan:

now the real fun begins

[01:01:29]

levander:

Oh yeah, it completely wasn't me, it was psm321_!

[01:01:33]

iamlindoro:

levander: Well, I remember the problems, not the people

[01:01:37]

Kazan:

i had to backup my mysql databases the hard way (actual file backups)

[01:01:39]

iamlindoro:

unless the people are REAL assholes

[01:01:46]

Kazan:

getting the "in use" crap

[01:01:58]

Kazan:

gives me "can't find file"

[01:02:14]

levander:

iamlindoro: Got any recommendations, besides deinterlacing?

[01:02:16]

iamlindoro:

levander: There's a fairly good chance that, since mythtv-vid branch was merged with substantial graphics/rendering improvements, that this problem is going to be solved for you in trunk/.21

[01:02:18]

psm321_:

levander: sorry i meant it was me the other night having problems w/ deinterlace on

[01:02:41]

achew22:

is there a jumpoint for recorded programs?

[01:02:47]

levander:

psm321_: I was joking around. Not sure if it was yours or my problem that iamlindoro remembers.

[01:02:54]

iamlindoro:

levander: Let me look at my playback profiles real quick

[01:03:51]

iamlindoro:

levander: Which decoder do you user? Standard/libmpeg/libmpeg2, etc?

[01:04:01]

iamlindoro:

Forgive me, I'm working from memory of .20.2

[01:04:48]

achew22:

nevermind on my question I found it

[01:05:44]

Kazan:

joygasm!

[01:05:50]

iamlindoro:

levander: My totally off the cuff suggestions of things to try are: try toggling OpenGL Vsync for timing, experiment with different mpeg renderers, turn off XvMc if you have it on, and try a different deinterlacer (try switching between kernel and linear blend)

[01:06:03]

Kazan:

got my database reimported

[01:06:07]

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[01:06:28]

levander:

iamlindoro: standard

[01:06:29]

sn9:

iamlindoro: am i a REAL asshole, or is my problem more memorable? just wondering

[01:06:39]

levander:

i've tried another one, i thought it was libmpeg

[01:06:45]

iamlindoro:

sn9: Naw, you're neither

[01:06:59]

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[01:07:03]

sn9:

hmm

[01:07:28]

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[01:07:33]

** sn9 can't decide whether that's good or bad **

[01:07:40]

iamlindoro:

It's not bad

[01:08:25]

CCFL_Man1 is now known as CCFL_Man2

[01:09:27]

iamlindoro:

Heyyyyyyy, that's interesting

[01:09:34]

** iamlindoro goes to test something **

[01:09:38]

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[01:09:47]

levander:

iamlindoro: I missed your suggestions, I'm looking at them now.

[01:10:32]

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[01:11:38]

Kazan:

grr i installed kernel src.rpm – no documentation folder with dvb_get_firmware

[01:12:07]

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[01:12:35]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: I can pastebin it for you

[01:13:14]

Kazan:

one from 2.6.23?

[01:13:26]

Kazan:

but... that would be more hassle of finding it to wget it

[01:13:50]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: http://pastebin.com/m31aca6f3

[01:14:01]

iamlindoro:

Kazan: Just paste it into a file and chmod it +x

[01:14:08]

iamlindoro:

This should work fine for you

[01:15:07]

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[01:15:31]

Kazan:

woot

[01:15:32]

Kazan:

thanks iamlindoro

[01:15:51]

iamlindoro:

no problem

[01:16:09]

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[01:16:55]

Kazan:

woot all my tuners are up on my new system now

[01:17:10]

Kazan:

and the udev rules came over just fine after appropriating adjusting pci addresses

[01:17:14]

sn9:

how do i check what the backend thinks its hostname should be?

[01:17:21]

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[01:17:43]

iamlindoro:

To be most sure, settings table in the db is probably the best place to look

[01:18:22]

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[01:26:31]

Kazan:

ok.. so i added two users to htdigest... but mythweb doesn't see them

[01:27:19]

Kazan:

i should say the http auth for mythweb's dir doesn't recognize my password

[01:27:57]

Kazan:

oh.. i got it :D

[01:28:20]

Kazan:

haha

[01:28:24]

Kazan:

i have an infinite loop in the makefile!

[01:28:32]

Kazan:

haha

[01:28:36]

Kazan:

it hasn't been compiling for a whil

[01:28:41]

Kazan:

been sitting at an inf loop

[01:28:42]

Kazan:

haha

[01:30:07]

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[01:30:37]

Kazan:

wtf

[01:30:45]

Kazan:

"clock skew detected. your build may be incomplete

[01:32:21]

mzb:

overclocked? Don't worry about it.

[01:32:41]

Kazan:

nope not overclocked

[01:32:46]

Kazan:

i did change my timezone after svn co

[01:34:15]

Kazan:

could that have been the cause?

[01:34:25]

Kazan:

was seeing a bunch of "modification times in the future" warnings

[01:35:25]

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[01:39:27]

blkorpheus:

apparently not just an ubuntu issue

[01:39:29]

blkorpheus:

http://groups.google.com/group/linux.debian.b . . . a97db455524c

[01:40:38]

levander:

When I change the deinterlace algorith, do I have to restart X? Restart mythtvfrontend?

[01:41:49]

Kazan:

neither

[01:41:54]

Kazan:

it's just a setting

[01:42:09]

Kazan:

it starts up video playback every time you start a recording

[01:42:51]

rxbandit:

Using the eject media, trying to eject a dvd fails. this is on an XBOX. Any ideas on how to trouble shoot?

[01:43:17]

blkorpheus:

so non one here has used the lirc-modules-source package?

[01:44:12]

levander:

In mythtv-setup, the VBI format isn't gonna to affect picture quality is it?

[01:44:16]

levander:

Kazan: thanks.

[01:44:29]

levander:

rxbandit: You're sure nothing is accessing the dvd drive?

[01:44:39]

levander:

blkorpheus: definitely not me...

[01:45:02]

blkorpheus:

thx

[01:45:10]

blkorpheus:

which distro you running?

[01:46:07]

rxbandit:

levander: ya i'm sure. i can umount it manually

[01:46:36]

Kazan:

levander: what type of capture card do you have

[01:46:39]

rxbandit:

let me refrase as far as i know/can tell

[01:46:43]

levander:

rxbandit: You mean the button on the front don't work?

[01:46:50]

levander:

blkorpheus: Mythbuntu.

[01:46:54]

Kazan:

because if you try to do VBI on a Hauppauge card and you're not running the encoder at it's native rez you're going to see problems

[01:47:17]

levander:

Kazan: I've got VBI set to None. That's not bad in any way is it?

[01:47:29]

levander:

It just means I can't view closed captioning?

[01:47:29]

rxbandit:

levander: correct and also the menu "Eject Media" doesn't

[01:47:59]

mzb:

too much noise in #ubuntu, sorry to ask an OT ... but I remember someone in here mentioning it:

[01:48:01]

Kazan:

levander: AFAIK should be fine, you just won't get any closed captioning support

[01:48:12]

blkorpheus:

levander, default setup huh

[01:48:12]

levander:

rxbandit: Let me see if the eject button on the front of my drive works when I have a DVD in it.

[01:48:15]

mzb:

how do I fix the "Volume muted at startup" issue in Gutsy?

[01:48:39]

rxbandit:

levander: Thanks, i'm probably just doing something silly.

[01:49:02]

rxbandit:

mzb: what soundcard do you have?

[01:49:11]

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[01:49:25]

mzb:

VT8233 (onboard)

[01:51:18]

levander:

blkorpheus: Yeah, default setup.

[01:51:35]

rxbandit:

mzb: VIA chipset? Have your tried installing ALSA from source?

[01:52:00]

mzb:

rxbandit: no ... I figured it was a common problem

[01:52:08]

sn9:

that's a losing proposition on ubuntu

[01:52:18]

levander:

rxbandit: When the CD is being used, like when I CD to the directory the CD is mounted on, the button on my CD doesn't work. When I cd out of that directory, it does work.

[01:52:21]

sn9:

and it is a common problem

[01:52:35]

mzb:

so there is a common solution? :)

[01:52:45]

rxbandit:

wouldn't that be nice :)

[01:53:03]

levander:

rxbandit: Right upon boot, I'd put a CD in, do nothing on the computer, and see if the button on the front of it works. If it does, that means to me that something is accessing your drive and not letting go of it as you use your computer.

[01:53:20]

sn9:

sudo alsactl store

[01:53:50]

mzb:

sn9: I've already done that, and checked that asound.state contains the correct values ... etc

[01:54:12]

mzb:

volume applet still starts muted and vol=0

[01:54:15]

sn9:

what about the esd setup?

[01:54:32]

mzb:

using default (not esd)

[01:54:39]

sn9:

use esd

[01:54:45]

mzb:

no thanks

[01:55:06]

mzb:

I use pulse for various reasons

[01:55:11]

sn9:

ah, pulse

[01:55:19]

mzb:

err sorry

[01:55:24]

mzb:

it's gstreame

[01:55:25]

mzb:

it's gstreamer

[01:55:40]

mzb:

gah ... confusion is setting in ;)

[01:55:41]

sn9:

gstreamer can use esd or pulse

[01:56:09]

mzb:

looks like esound is installed

[01:56:33]

sn9:

are you sure the asound.state is getting read on boot?

[01:56:47]

mzb:

not really

[01:58:26]

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[01:58:26]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[01:59:20]

** Kazan waves to xris **

[02:01:08]

xris:

hiya

[02:01:46]

** xris wishes he could use IRC with adium **

[02:02:28]

Kazan:

?

[02:02:41]

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[02:03:05]

xris:

mac version of pidgin.. but since IRC "isn't an IM protocol" they don't use it.

[02:03:17]

xris:

so now I have to have IRC in a separate app/window

[02:03:26]

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[02:03:42]

rxbandit:

levander: i was able to open and close the drive on boot up....

[02:04:14]

Kazan:

um... what is the svn url for the myththemes-extras

[02:04:24]

sn9:

xris: i use xchat even on osx, and not even aqua

[02:04:35]

Kazan:

i don't see it in trunk in the svn viewer

[02:04:58]

Kazan:

oh... it's themes not myththemes-extras :D

[02:04:59]

Kazan:

right

[02:05:05]

Kazan:

that's just what i checked it out as

[02:05:53]

iamlindoro:

xris: Me too, I love adium

[02:07:27]

sn9:

it's actually possible to use even iChat for irc, but yuck

[02:07:33]

xris:

sn9: I just like having all of my chat stuff in one window

[02:07:42]

xris:

colloquy is nice, but separate window

[02:08:01]

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[02:08:03]

sn9:

there are xmpp-to-irc gateways you can use

[02:11:34]

xris:

scary

[02:13:10]

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[02:19:31]

** mishehu yawns. **

[02:20:32]

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[02:27:09]

Kazan:

wtf

[02:27:19]

Kazan:

mythtv-setup cannot find libmythtv

[02:29:38]

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[02:31:50]

Kazan:

wtf

[02:31:59]

Kazan:

it installed in /usr/local/usr/lib64

[02:32:03]

Kazan:

*boggle*

[02:33:07]

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[02:33:32]

falieson:

to get Digital Out (preferably to an optical port) on my Audigy 2 ZS (LEFT: http://images.devshed.com/dh/stories/Audio%20 . . . /16fig03.jpg ) I can use this ( http://www.amazon.com/Sound-Blaster-Digital-I . . . c_rvi_cart_1 ) right? I'm having issues with audio I want to make sure it isn't a bad hardware config

[02:34:20]

sn9:

creative labs stuff only works with creative labs stuff, usually

[02:34:44]

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[02:35:49]

falieson:

sn9: I think they are both creative labs though

[02:36:14]

sn9:

be sure

[02:37:11]

levander:

In mythtv-setup, would having the channel frequency table wrong possibly mess up my picture quality?

[02:37:38]

levander:

rxbandit: I don't know what to tell you, look in /var/log/syslog to see if there's a message when the drive fails to open?

[02:38:24]

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[02:38:48]

falieson:

let's assume (because I think I did this part right) that it's not a hardware issue, what should I look at next?

[02:40:58]

rxbandit:

levander: i'm thinking it has something to do with my fstab, because it doesn't automount the drive when i put something in.

[02:42:02]

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[02:43:34]

rxbandit:

hmm

[02:44:25]

rxbandit:

fstab: /dev/hdb /cdrom udf,iso9660 defaults,ro users,noauto

[02:47:07]

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[02:48:57]

falieson:

hey guys, I'm trying to output spdif too my receiver (optical port) and I'm getting nada return – any suggestions of where to start?

[02:51:47]

jamesd:

falieson, use analog.. it was good enough for your grand-pa its good enough for you.. back in his day he didn't have fancy stereos.. they had a seashell and thought he was really well off when he had too seashells to hold up to his ears.

[02:52:32]

sn9:

falieson: how's your iec958 setting?

[02:53:07]

falieson:

I have IEC958 Optical (not capture or Raw) enabled and maxed out

[02:53:10]

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[02:57:25]

levander:

Is there anyway to leave the little box that shows where you are in the video stream displayed? It's disappearing on me way too quick.

[02:57:38]

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[02:58:35]

levander:

rxbandit: You know, I was just looking at it, my computer ignores /etc/fstab somehow. When I push the CD in, it gets auto-mounted on /media/CDROM. Even though fstab is: /dev/hdb /media/dvd auto ro,user,noauto 0 0

[03:02:52]

rxbandit:

levander: hmmm what method of install did you use? i'm using the new E image.

[03:02:59]

rxbandit:

Xebian

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[03:13:59]

CanadianMan:

i have a htpc with mythtv on it and i would like to get some nice video/audio equipment. Do any of you use audio receivers or HDTVs?

[03:14:34]

sn9:

CanadianMan: probably most do

[03:14:38]

Kazan:

*Boggle* QMYSQL3 driver not loaded

[03:14:56]

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[03:15:11]

CanadianMan:

for audio is the best way to go with optical out on the htpc to the receiver?

[03:15:30]

CanadianMan:

or a receiver i should say

[03:15:35]

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[03:15:44]

sn9:

sure, why not? if you have one, might as well use it

[03:16:31]

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[03:17:09]

sn9:

but, in smaller rooms, a receiver isn't that much better than no receiver

[03:17:55]

CanadianMan:

hmmmm gotcha

[03:18:20]

levander:

Any idea what could be causing prebuffering pauses that only happen like once a minute when watching LiveTV?

[03:19:25]

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[03:25:23]

rxbandit:

levander: hows swap and ram doing?

[03:26:43]

levander:

Damn, I've got a GB of RAM and I'm swapping.

[03:27:32]

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[03:27:46]

levander:

Well, it's not changing, maybe that happened awhile ago. I'll see if it swaps when the prebuffering pause happens.

[03:27:49]

clever:

levander: thats fun:P

[03:28:24]

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[03:30:23]

rxbandit:

levander: do you have video drivers installed ie. nvidia binaries?

[03:32:01]

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[03:33:10]

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[03:33:39]

falieson:

so turns out that the ZS for some crazy reason does not support the digital I/O module

[03:34:20]

falieson:

I'm going to go get a sound card but I'm wondering if there is a difference for (htpc purposes) between the audigy SE and the x-fi extremegamer

[03:34:23]

falieson:

(besides 100$)

[03:34:40]

sn9:

yeah, creative does nasty things like that

[03:35:04]

sn9:

does your board not have its own sound?

[03:35:28]

sn9:

if it does, you're 100% better off with it

[03:35:50]

falieson:

right but I don't think the onboard has digital out

[03:36:03]

sn9:

most recent boards do

[03:36:42]

levander:

rxbandit: Yeah, I'm using the proprietary driver.

[03:36:48]

falieson:

no digital out on it

[03:37:15]

sn9:

whenever you have a board with sound, a sound card is a waste of resources unless it's a high-end professional thing costing beaucoup bucks

[03:37:44]

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[03:38:05]

sn9:

digital out on a board is usually non-obvious, even when it's there

[03:38:25]

sn9:

if it really isn't there, just use the analog

[03:44:34]

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[03:49:07]

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[03:53:08]

CanadianMan:

may be dumb question but is optical out work under linux or do you have to install something and configure a lot?

[03:53:15]

code-r:

Any one here run an ATI card with propiataery drivers

[03:53:39]

clever:

i think i do

[03:53:45]

clever:

half my frontends have ati

[03:53:49]

sn9:

CanadianMan: depends on which driver is needed. for some, it "just works"

[03:53:55]

code-r:

cause my 9200 is JUST not co-operating

[03:54:15]

sn9:

code-r: proprietary drivers no longer support the 9200

[03:54:34]

code-r:

sn9: =( is ther any way to get open source drivers to do video out?

[03:54:36]

clever:

01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc Radeon RV250 [Mobility FireGL 9000] (rev 02)

[03:54:45]

clever:

closest thing i have to a 9200 i think

[03:55:02]

sn9:

that is not really a 9200, iirc

[03:55:02]

code-r:

01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 SE] (rev 01)

[03:55:11]

sn9:

that is

[03:55:16]

code-r:

(WW) fglrx: No matching Device section for instance (BusID PCI:1:0:1) found

[03:55:16]

code-r:

(EE) No devices detected.

[03:55:33]

clever:

if you only have 1 card then you dont need a BusID entry in xorg.conf

[03:55:44]

clever:

without a busid it will default to the 1st(and only) card

[03:55:44]

sn9:

code-r: see? you can't use fglrx with that

[03:55:45]

code-r:

clever: i dont have a busid entry.. lol

[03:55:48]

clever:

lol

[03:55:59]

code-r:

sn9: does open source support tvout..

[03:56:03]

sn9:

yes

[03:56:10]

clever:

none of my ati 'drivers' handle tvout

[03:56:15]

sn9:

but not for every generation of card

[03:56:16]

clever:

but the 'atitvout' cli tool

[03:56:24]

clever:

pokes the video registers without the drivers help

[03:56:35]

sn9:

atitvout is ancient, and should not be used

[03:56:36]

clever:

so all drivers and plain text mode console suddenly can tvout!

[03:56:57]

clever:

it also screws up the freq's and i need to cycle the resolution before the tvout signal is useable

[03:57:22]

clever:

sn9: atitvout is the only thing ive been able to use to get tvout

[03:57:27]

clever:

and it only works on 1 card

[03:57:27]

sn9:

if you have a recent enough xorg, tv-out works with no fuss on some ati cards

[03:57:31]

clever:

rest dont even tvout at all

[03:57:46]

clever:

01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc Rage Mobility M3 AGP 2x (rev 02)

[03:57:50]

clever:

and the one i pasted above

[03:57:52]

clever:

both have tvout

[03:58:01]

clever:

only the rage is actualy able to use it from linux

[03:58:23]

clever:

and even then its unstable and the brightness is off the chart

[03:58:34]

sn9:

clever: tv-out on M3 does not work — i have two or three of them, and the tv-out is dead weight

[03:58:46]

clever:

it does work for me

[03:58:49]

clever:

laptop

[03:59:02]

clever:

atitvout works perfectly in cli mode

[03:59:14]

sn9:

yes, M3 is a laptop chipset. there are no xorg drivers with tv-out for it

[03:59:16]

clever:

and with a few beatings with a blunt object it works in x also

[03:59:59]

sn9:

as the matter of fact, the machine i'm typing this on atm has M3

[04:00:06]

clever:

same here

[04:00:18]

cafuego:

atitvout worked fine on my M1/U9 provided I used a 2.6.22 or older kernel.

[04:00:23]

falieson:

CanadianMan: assuming you have the right setup with creative it should just work (assuming the drivers for your creative labs card is loaded correctly)

[04:00:40]

clever:

cafuego: i cant use the ubuntu 7.10 kernel because it panics on my wifi

[04:00:45]

CanadianMan:

thank you falieson

[04:00:46]

code-r:

ive managed to patch X with gatos patches to get my radeon ve 7000 to work :)

[04:00:48]

clever:

so ive been using the 7.06 kernel on 7.10

[04:00:54]

sn9:

vga out works with a bit of fuss, but tv-out will have to wait until the r128 driver is merged into radeon by alex deucher

[04:01:04]

clever:

vga out on my laptop is eratic

[04:01:14]

code-r:

ill never do it again :(

[04:01:14]

clever:

changing between cli and x causes it to reset itself

[04:01:27]

clever:

then i need to crawl under the desk and hit fn+f8

[04:01:35]

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[04:01:43]

sn9:

m3mirror works fine for me

[04:02:20]

clever:

Cpu0 : 4.2%us, 5.7%sy, 41.5%ni, 0.1%id, 0.3%wa, 45.8%hi, 2.3%si, 0.0%st

[04:02:24]

clever:

something aint right:P

[04:02:25]

sn9:

code-r: xorg is now patched for you

[04:02:33]

clever:

45% of the time spent in hardware irq's

[04:02:34]

cafuego:

oopsie

[04:02:37]

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[04:02:38]

sn9:

code-r: gatos is now xorg

[04:02:40]

code-r:

sn9: so i heard...

[04:02:53]

code-r:

sn9: but how do i get my 9200 working with radeon drivers?

[04:03:09]

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[04:03:23]

sn9:

first, check the old gatos page to see if the 9200 tv-out was supported

[04:03:42]

sn9:

if so, it'll "just work" now

[04:05:01]

code-r:

"Non-AIW 9000 series cards"

[04:05:01]

sn9:

i just looked — 9200SE is supported

[04:05:21]

code-r:

ok.. but all i get is a black screen lol

[04:05:25]

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[04:05:31]

sn9:

http://megahurts.dk/rune/tv_output.html

[04:06:03]

sn9:

forget the patching instructions — if your xorg is recent enough, it's in there

[04:06:38]

code-r:

hmm..

[04:06:41]

** code-r hates radeon **

[04:06:46]

** code-r cant waith till his nvida comes in! **

[04:09:15]

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[04:09:43]

code-r:

hmm no such luck.. i get a really screwed up display..

[04:09:47]

code-r:

you know which im im talking about

[04:09:56]

code-r:

as if the syncs are off..

[04:10:04]

clever:

exact same problem i had

[04:10:13]

clever:

change resolution with xrandr(posibly thru ssh)

[04:10:26]

clever:

or posibly ctrl+alt+page up/down

[04:11:07]

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[04:11:08]

code-r:

"*0 800 x 600 ( 271mm x 203mm ) *60"

[04:11:10]

code-r:

looks right

[04:11:13]

clever:

yeah

[04:11:27]

clever:

but my problem is changing to tvout caused the res on the card to get scrabled

[04:11:34]

clever:

which is fixed by changing the res

[04:12:15]

code-r:

" Modeline "800x600" 40.00 800 840 968 1056 600 601 605 628

[04:12:17]

code-r:

right?

[04:13:00]

clever:

i was going to play with modelines with a scope attached

[04:13:10]

clever:

but when i changed the resolution twice i wound up fixing it!

[04:13:34]

code-r:

hmm i still see

[04:13:36]

code-r:

"(WW) RADEON: No matching Device section for instance (BusID PCI:1:0:1) found"

[04:13:48]

clever:

warning not error though

[04:14:26]

code-r:

yeh but... hmmm

[04:14:44]

code-r:

what version of xorg has this gatos?

[04:15:26]

Kazan:

wtf

[04:15:32]

Kazan:

frontend segfauls upon attempt to startup

[04:16:10]

code-r:

looks like i have 7.1.4

[04:16:26]

clever:

Kazan: i get that randomly

[04:16:28]

clever:

Kazan: retry

[04:16:34]

Kazan:

clever: it's happening consistently

[04:16:37]

Kazan:

new install

[04:16:43]

Kazan:

ok

[04:16:45]

Kazan:

now it's working

[04:16:46]

Kazan:

*Boggle*

[04:16:49]

clever:

lol

[04:16:54]

Kazan:

crashed two times in a row

[04:16:55]

Kazan:

now it works

[04:17:07]

Kazan:

my xvideo is corrupt :/

[04:17:13]

Kazan:

damn fglrx

[04:17:19]

Kazan:

come on... how long at they going to have it broken

[04:17:36]

Kazan:

oh

[04:17:36]

Kazan:

it's just xine

[04:17:38]

** clever hands Kazan a blunt object **

[04:17:40]

Kazan:

ok then

[04:17:46]

Kazan:

xvideo in myth is fine

[04:17:53]

Kazan:

bah

[04:18:02]

Kazan:

frontend segfaulted as i backed out of mythvideo

[04:18:12]

clever:

debug build?

[04:18:17]

Kazan:

nope

[04:18:29]

Kazan:

i enabled-proc-opt in mythtv main

[04:18:30]

clever:

:(

[04:18:35]

Kazan:

athlon 64 x2 4200+

[04:18:40]

Kazan:

fresh install of operating system and everything

[04:18:45]

clever:

ahh

[04:18:45]

Kazan:

i wonder though

[04:18:51]

Kazan:

i think some of my packages have gotten inconsitent versions

[04:18:56]

Kazan:

and i need to run a full yum update

[04:19:01]

clever:

im in the middle of backing up to try and repair aa toasted drive

[04:19:23]

clever:

smells like burnt toast!

[04:19:33]

Kazan:

ouch

[04:19:44]

Kazan:

oooh

[04:19:48]

Kazan:

i enabled opengl painters

[04:19:52]

Kazan:

wonder if that is the problem

[04:20:10]

clever:

that i think would slow the menus or make them invisible

[04:20:16]

clever:

if not working

[04:20:23]

clever:

Jan 8 23:38:09 olddell smartd[5564]: Device: /dev/sda, FAILED SMART self-check. BACK UP DATA NOW!

[04:20:31]

code-r:

how do i figure out what version of Xorg i have ?!?1

[04:20:44]

clever:

code-r: check the xorg log

[04:20:52]

clever:

code-r: posibly /var/log/Xorg.0.log

[04:20:54]

clever:

SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: FAILED!

[04:20:54]

clever:

Drive failure expected in less than 24 hours. SAVE ALL DATA.

[04:21:04]

code-r:

"X Window System Version 7.1.1

[04:21:23]

clever:

theres your answer!

[04:21:33]

cafuego:

"old dell" -. that was always going to fail ;-)

[04:22:04]

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[04:22:06]

clever:

cafuego: yeah the toasted hdd is part of an old dell:P

[04:22:11]

code-r:

why would i get a complaing that mythtv-setup cant find libGL.so.1

[04:22:18]

code-r:

i know it wored before

[04:22:26]

Kazan:

aarg my recording schedule failed to start

[04:23:22]

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[04:23:25]

clever:

Kazan: arg this thing called an 'election' cut my recording off mid way multiple times:P

[04:23:31]

clever:

aarg i mean:P

[04:24:00]

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[04:24:02]

code-r:

"Build ID: xorg-x11-server 1.1.1–47.10.fc6

[04:24:06]

code-r:

there are so many versions..

[04:24:10]

Kazan:

clever: heh

[04:24:23]

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[04:24:28]

code-r:

doesnt fedora have updated versions of xorg?

[04:24:56]

clever:

.

[04:25:50]

Kazan:

grrr crashola

[04:26:23]

clever:

atleast your hdd isnt emiting smoke signals calling out for help:P

[04:26:33]

Kazan:

heh

[04:26:35]

Kazan:

my WAF is

[04:26:39]

clever:

had to delete about 20 hours of shows to make room for the backup

[04:26:39]

clever:

and even then its a tight fit

[04:26:45]

clever:

waf?

[04:28:00]

J-e-f-f-A:

clever: Wife Acceptance Factor

[04:28:05]

clever:

lol

[04:28:10]

clever:

no wife here:P

[04:28:23]

clever:

just me and my dad

[04:28:26]

J-e-f-f-A:

clever: Of course not... You're still in HS, right?

[04:28:30]

clever:

!age

[04:28:35]

clever:

ahh mirc is off

[04:28:38]

clever:

im 20

[04:28:47]

clever:

and i was kicked out of grade 11 back in 2004

[04:29:00]

clever:

ive made the frontend in dads room along with the netboot ones as noob friendly as posibly

[04:29:02]

** J-e-f-f-A was in the 11th grade in 1984... **

[04:29:09]

clever:

boot it and you get a frontend

[04:29:23]

clever:

escape at main menu and you have the choice to shutdown or reboot

[04:29:27]

** cafuego was stuck in Nam in 1984 **

[04:29:33]

clever:

and dad still wont even use it

[04:29:48]

clever:

i cant even get him to look over the tv guide when im doing all the controling for him!

[04:29:57]

clever:

'it doesnt look normal'

[04:31:33]

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[04:31:49]

J-e-f-f-A:

clever: Strange... My dad would have loved MythTV if he was still alive... ;-)

[04:32:04]

clever:

my dad says tv shouldnt rule your life

[04:32:28]

clever:

says he used to record shows on vhs ages ago but never had the time to actualy watch them

[04:32:51]

fryfrog:

VHS, is that a disease?

[04:32:54]

clever:

only diff now is you can store 300 shows on a single device and have a nice ui to manage them

[04:32:54]

J-e-f-f-A:

clever: Well, I agree with him there... It doesn't rule my life... I probably only watch an hour or two a day on average... It's just nice having a huge 'on demand' library of the shows I like...

[04:33:13]

clever:

i watch every single recording

[04:33:17]

clever:

often while it records

[04:33:25]

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[04:33:29]

clever:

fryfrog: its a video tape used in a vcr:P

[04:33:52]

sn9:

i'm not sure my dad would love mythtv so much if he were alive, but one time i made the mistake of pressing play instead of rewind after recording a world cup game — he was pissed to see the final score before the actual game

[04:33:57]

J-e-f-f-A:

clever: hehe... he knows that! he was messing with your head... ;-)

[04:34:09]

clever:

:P

[04:34:14]

sn9:

this was on vhs, of course

[04:34:22]

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[04:34:25]

clever:

sn9: lol

[04:34:34]

code-r:

Option "TVOutput" "NTSC"

[04:34:37]

code-r:

does that look right?

[04:35:19]

J-e-f-f-A:

code-r: Yeah, unless you're in the UK... ;-)

[04:35:44]

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[04:36:10]

sn9:

clever: 7.1.1/1.1.1 is too old for built-in gatos

[04:36:14]

clever:

bbl sleep

[04:36:20]

sn9:

sorry, i meant code-r

[04:36:24]

clever:

lol

[04:36:27]

clever:

bbl:)

[04:37:03]

** J-e-f-f-A 'night guys... (and perhaps gals!) ;-) **

[04:37:06]

code-r:

there has to be binaries for fedora core 6 though!

[04:37:20]

code-r:

1.4 is way to slow to compile it!

[04:38:22]

sn9:

code-r: also, installing fglrx overwrites part of xorg, so you need to reinstall that anyway

[04:38:31]

sn9:

xorg, that is

[04:38:45]

code-r:

sn9: but is there binaries for fc6?

[04:38:52]

sn9:

i doubt it

[04:38:55]

code-r:

=(

[04:39:06]

sn9:

why are you still on 6, anyway?

[04:39:21]

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[04:39:23]

code-r:

sn9: dvb issues... only work on a certain kernel

[04:39:32]

sn9:

really? what card?

[04:39:44]

code-r:

sn9: nova-s

[04:39:54]

code-r:

sn9: wont lock the second the kernel gets updated... its wierd

[04:40:00]

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[04:40:03]

sn9:

hmm

[04:40:19]

sn9:

what about dvb mercurial trunk?

[04:40:40]

code-r:

sn9: mercurial only compiles against new kernels.. and those drivers gives same results.

[04:40:48]

code-r:

sn9: looks like somethign was broken way back when...

[04:40:59]

code-r:

sn9: its really bazzar

[04:41:18]

code-r:

sn9: my SNR goes crazy and my signal is cut 1/2 by changed kernal/HG drivers

[04:41:38]

code-r:

besidse.. htere is no way to upgrade from fc6 to 7 w/o booting :-P

[04:41:40]

sn9:

and nothing has been done about it? somebody in dvb maintainership needs to be bugged

[04:42:06]

sn9:

7? 8 is out

[04:42:11]

code-r:

sn9: i joined the mailing list.. asking my buddy with sames card to replicate and see if its mybe one card

[04:42:25]

code-r:

ok can you upgrades from 6 to 8 with yum :)

[04:42:49]

sn9:

probably not — it's not like debian

[04:42:56]

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[04:42:58]

code-r:

hmm

[04:42:59]

code-r:

hmm

[04:42:59]

code-r:

"Now that Fedora Core 6 is available it is time to upgrade those old crusty FC5 installs. To upgrade from FC5 you can follow these steps:

[04:43:22]

code-r:

wonder if that will work for 8

[04:43:27]

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[04:43:38]

rxbandit:

levander: can you see if you have autofs installed on your xbox?

[04:44:16]

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[04:44:30]

** sn9 is glad to have left redhat-ish upgrades in the past, where they belong **

[04:46:40]

rxbandit:

fedora and upgrade do not belong in the same sentence, thats asking for trouble

[04:47:03]

code-r:

:-P

[04:47:06]

code-r:

well trouble here i come!

[04:51:28]

rxbandit:

:)

[04:51:44]

rxbandit:

good luck, you may need it

[04:55:05]

levander:

Wouldn't you get less prebuffering pauses when you turn on XvMC?

[04:55:12]

levander:

I'm getting more for some reason.

[04:55:35]

levander:

rxbandit: I don't have an xbox

[04:55:39]

levander:

Sorry, I was away

[04:55:53]

levander:

And no, it's not installed.

[04:57:27]

rxbandit:

hmm ok thanks

[04:59:15]

mchou:

goddamn, the networks and the writers need to settle their differences

[04:59:31]

mchou:

all my faves have gone dark

[04:59:48]

sn9:

hey, it's not like the Great Writers' Strike of '88

[05:00:01]

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[05:00:14]

mchou:

that spawned the crappy reality shows

[05:00:22]

sn9:

not in '88

[05:00:34]

mchou:

no, later

[05:00:44]

sn9:

but it turned ST:TNG into reruns for nearly a year

[05:00:54]

mchou:

and in '88 the writers caved too early

[05:01:20]

mchou:

who tf cares about ST

[05:01:49]

sn9:

not as many now as in '88

[05:02:09]

mchou:

there's a reason why Paramount shit canned it all

[05:02:27]

sn9:

there's a reason they didn't in '88

[05:04:52]

sn9:

face it: crappy reality shows are the future of tv

[05:05:42]

sn9:

by the time a better future rolls around, the crap will have already killed tv

[05:06:00]

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[05:08:31]

mchou:

wow wow

[05:08:40]

sn9:

bow

[05:08:44]

mchou:

hillary made a comeback in NH

[05:08:54]

sn9:

you only heard now?

[05:09:24]

mchou:

dude, the polls closed ~ 1 hr. ago

[05:09:46]

sn9:

it was becoming obvious even before they closed

[05:10:15]

mchou:

Tel that to Al Gore

[05:10:23]

mchou:

tell*

[05:10:36]

sn9:

*that* was not obvious

[05:10:42]

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[05:11:32]

psm321:

um... polls closed 4 hours ago

[05:12:04]

sn9:

ah, right — 8, not 12

[05:12:24]

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[05:12:26]

mchou:

psm321: polls were open till 12 EST in some places

[05:12:43]

sn9:

the question was about NH

[05:13:01]

mchou:

sn9: be a smartass somewhere else

[05:13:30]

sn9:

somewhere where this is on-topic?

[05:13:47]

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[05:13:53]

mchou:

it's on topic since it's on TV

[05:14:12]

sn9:

hmm, let's see what else is on...

[05:15:31]

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[05:17:49]

sn9:

hmm, amc is airing the lara croft movie

[05:18:14]

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[05:18:28]

sn9:

cnn has glen beck

[05:18:39]

tank-man:

why are you watching livetv :p

[05:18:58]

sn9:

i'm not — i'm scrolling through the guide data

[05:19:52]

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[05:22:03]

sn9:

oooh, revenge of the pink panther on tcm

[05:24:16]

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[05:26:18]

sn9:

tank-man: ok, NOW i'm watching livetv

[05:26:51]

tjcarter:

sn9: Glenn Beck is amusing. He's a paranoid conservative, but he's funny, so it's okay.

[05:28:37]

sn9:

he's not paranoid; he's just dim-witted

[05:28:54]

tjcarter:

no he's paranoid.

[05:29:10]

tjcarter:

believe me, he's quite paranoid.

[05:29:17]

sn9:

he doesn't have the brains to be paranoid

[05:29:29]

tjcarter:

He may also be dim-witted, but he's most certainly paranoid.

[05:31:02]

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[05:31:23]

tjcarter:

IMO he does have exactly two valid points: open communication is not permitted anymore and this is killing us, and when someone says they want to kill you, believe them. The former describes politics in general, and the latter comes with the caveat that the person who wants to kill you may not have the means to do so--but that doesn't mean you shouldn't believe they don't want those means..)

[05:31:30]

sn9:

ok, maybe in a lyndon larouche sort of way

[05:31:34]

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[05:31:34]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[05:31:45]

tjcarter:

His conclusions as to what to do about those valid points and any others... well.

[05:31:54]

tjcarter:

I did say he was funny. ;)

[05:32:11]

sn9:

he is

[05:32:29]

sn9:

but i put the livetv on tcm, not cnn

[05:33:22]

** tjcarter gets into all kinds of trouble on mailing lists for considering the opposing viewpoint.. **

[05:33:46]

tjcarter:

most notably NFB mailing liss, considering ACB viewpoint. NFB and ACB are full of people who HATE the other.

[05:34:25]

tjcarter:

Doesn't mean their viewpoint is invalid. Misguided often, but not invalid.

[05:34:33]

hachi:

anyone have a PVR-150, can yours tune higher than channel 99 ?

[05:34:35]

sn9:

can't we all just get along?

[05:34:47]

tjcarter:

But occasionally they have a point, and when they have a point it's worth considering seriously.

[05:34:59]

tjcarter:

It should not be dismissed because they said it.

[05:36:25]

levander:

Has anyone had to mess with PCI latency to stop prebuffering pauses?

[05:36:42]

tjcarter:

In the political realm, it's even worse. If a Democrat says something intelligent, Republicans sneer and jeer. Likewise if a Republican says something intelligent, the Democrats cover their ears and hum real loud. Only those sitting on the outside who recognize that both parties are full of morons seem to notice a good idea when it surfaces.

[05:37:02]

sn9:

levander: i have — didn't really have much of an effect

[05:37:55]

levander:

sn9: I'm getting very periodic prebuffering pauses. It's worse wehen I use XvMC. It makes me wonder if it's something with the video card...

[05:38:05]

sn9:

tjcarter: used to be otherwise, but those times are behind us

[05:39:09]

levander:

tjcarter: I've actually gone and looked for an intelligent liberal columnist, can't find one. Been meaning to look into Mark Shields, haven't yet.

[05:39:51]

tjcarter:

levander: Finding an intelligent columnist is hard to do period.

[05:40:19]

sn9:

where's andy rooney when you need him?...

[05:40:40]

levander:

tjcarter: David Brooks is easily my favorite conservative columnist.

[05:41:00]

levander:

NYT has lots of great columnists. Mark Bittman is another one I like on NYT.

[05:41:13]

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[05:41:32]

tjcarter:

levander: my experience is that NYT has few non-liberal columnists.

[05:42:07]

tjcarter:

Of course I don't consider the average Republican a conservative by any stretch of the imagination

[05:42:16]

levander:

tjcarter: I'm not talking about their political columnists. I'm talking about all their columnists. Mark Bittman is food.

[05:42:36]

levander:

And, David Brooks is a conservative columnist at NYT. Although, most yes, are liberal.

[05:42:36]

sn9:

food for what? :)

[05:42:42]

levander:

sn9: food to eat

[05:42:49]

levander:

sn9: cooking food

[05:43:03]

sn9:

he is food to eat?

[05:43:07]

levander:

sn9: yes

[05:43:15]

sn9:

you eat him?

[05:43:20]

levander:

I have, why?

[05:43:35]

sn9:

lol

[05:49:23]

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[05:56:54]

iotis:

need help with a nexus-s settings can someone help

[05:57:13]

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[05:58:00]

levander:

sn9: How did you verify that the setpci command worked? After running setpci, I re-run lspci -v, and the old latency is shown.

[05:58:12]

sn9:

were you root?

[05:58:18]

levander:

yeah

[05:58:22]

levander:

the 2nd time i ran it anyway

[05:58:37]

sn9:

well, it showed the new latency for me

[05:58:43]

levander:

damn

[05:59:32]

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[06:00:58]

levander:

sn9: I've got the noapic boot option set. I had to to get my motherboard to boot. I wonder if that's related?

[06:01:26]

iotis:

can anyone answer a dvb-s ?

[06:01:44]

levander:

I don't even know what a dvb-s is, sorry.

[06:01:50]

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[06:02:46]

iotis:

nice answer

[06:03:11]

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[06:03:34]

sn9:

dvb-s is a satellite receiver card

[06:03:44]

levander:

sn9: You're late. He left in a huff.

[06:03:59]

levander:

Maybe he thought I was being sarcastic. But, I wasn't.

[06:04:01]

sn9:

he knew what it was; you didn't

[06:04:14]

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[06:04:31]

levander:

He's probably just been working too hard on his problem and got testy...

[06:05:02]

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[06:05:16]

sn9:

anyway, noapic is usually a cop-out

[06:05:23]

Kazan:

hmm

[06:05:26]

levander:

Why is it a cop-out?

[06:05:35]

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[06:05:47]

sn9:

it's good primarily for troubleshooting, not for production use

[06:06:15]

** Kazan grumbles **

[06:06:26]

levander:

sn9: It's the only way I can get my motherboard to boot. Other Asus M2N motherboards, they're fixing it by flashing the BIOS. Flashing the BIOS didn't work here.

[06:06:27]

sn9:

there are few boards that really really need it

[06:06:31]

** Kazan wonders why frontend has been segfaulting on his new machine faster than prom dresses come off **

[06:06:46]

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[06:07:04]

sn9:

levander: check to see whether asus has released yet another bios — they did for M2A

[06:07:49]

levander:

sn9: I just tried 0803 and 0804 like two days ago. Unless they released it yesterday.

[06:08:43]

jhulst:

levander: What motherboard?

[06:08:57]

sn9:

and it's still not fixed? maybe it is and you just couldn't tell

[06:09:08]

levander:

jhulst: Just the basic Asus M2N, not one of the variants, the original M2N itself.

[06:09:31]

jhulst:

levander: hmm, I have the M2NPV-VM, it works fine

[06:09:50]

levander:

Well, when it refuses to boot without noapic and the 0804 BIOS, I assumed it wasn't fixed yet.

[06:10:06]

sn9:

levander: try other combinations

[06:10:11]

levander:

jhulst: Yeah, I saw that. Many of the M2N variants, it's already fixed.

[06:10:18]

levander:

sn9: Other combinations?

[06:10:25]

sn9:

of kernel args

[06:10:27]

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[06:10:45]

sn9:

things like pci=nobios

[06:11:00]

levander:

Pffft, I'm thinking I'm just gonna return this mobo/cpu combo. Newegg's only got a 7 day return policy on CPU's, and that's tomorrow for me.

[06:11:21]

levander:

The only reason I'm still working on it is because I'm stubborn...

[06:11:27]

levander:

I get a problem, and I can't let it go.

[06:11:38]

sn9:

like me

[06:12:01]

levander:

sn9: Have you seen all these kids running Ubuntu that just reinstall when they get a problem?

[06:12:08]

levander:

They have no attention span.

[06:12:08]

sn9:

yes

[06:12:16]

levander:

They don't get it at all.

[06:12:19]

psm321:

sn9: i don't think your idea for disabling channels will work... i can't find anywhere it can be done

[06:12:23]

jhulst:

I'm not sure about those Ubuntu people :)

[06:12:41]

sn9:

ironically, many such "kids" are older than moi

[06:12:55]

levander:

jhulst: I run Ubuntu too, it's great software. I just think the Ubuntu community is the AOL of Linux.

[06:12:55]

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[06:13:00]

dserban_:

Hello, I have a silverstone LC14M with a usb hotkeys thingy on the front of it. How do I tell what keycodes myth should accept and what to do with them? I have the mythcontrols plugin installed but when it asks for the key, it doesn't recognize the keycode the usb keyboard is sending. There's also a package in debian called hotkeys that will react to the keyboard, but unfortunately each key is assigned to a command. Can my

[06:13:00]

dserban_:

th accept a command when any of these keys are pressed?

[06:13:10]

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[06:13:35]

jhulst:

levander: true

[06:13:38]

levander:

sn9: I bet the reason setting the latency doesn't work is because I have noapic on....

[06:13:51]

sn9:

dserban_: you may need xmodmap

[06:14:51]

levander:

jhulst: People are using Ubuntuforums.org to chat. No one bitches about people not searching. It's against nature.

[06:15:04]

rxbandit:

leavander: they may be the AOL of linux but they sure package things up nicely and have a really active and helpful forums

[06:15:38]

sn9:

rxbandit: oh yeah? cafuego is in this channel

[06:15:57]

rxbandit:

sn9:?

[06:16:11]

sn9:

he packages what ubuntu won't

[06:16:27]

rxbandit:

ahh ic

[06:16:35]

sn9:

like broadcom firmware, and google earth

[06:16:38]

dserban_:

sn9, thanks that's exactly what I need. Appreciate it very much.

[06:16:48]

levander:

Well, apparently not. Trying setpci on another machine, it didn't work either.

[06:17:10]

levander:

rxbandit: I'm talking about the user community. I think the developer community is excellent.

[06:17:12]

jhulst:

levander: I think the biggest problem are those whose start with Ubuntu and don't take the time to learn it

[06:17:14]

sn9:

levander: maybe you got the syntax wrong

[06:17:22]

levander:

sn9: yeah

[06:17:31]

levander:

this is what I'm using "sudo setpci -v -s 00:06.0 latency_timer=80"

[06:17:44]

sn9:

80? that's not a valid value

[06:17:46]

jhulst:

They expect it to be Windows and expect everything to be catered to them

[06:17:52]

levander:

sn9: it's a hex value

[06:18:03]

sn9:

it's supposed to be decimal

[06:18:08]

levander:

nooooooo

[06:18:12]

sn9:

yessss

[06:18:33]

sn9:

try 128

[06:18:37]

rxbandit:

any time you make things easy for the masses the asshats with also join the bandwagon...fact of life

[06:18:52]

jhulst:

They lowered the barrier of entry too much :)

[06:18:52]

psm321:

EXAMPLES

[06:18:52]

psm321:

`setpci -d : latency_timer=40' sets the latency timer to 64 (40 hexadecimal).

[06:19:06]

rxbandit:

jhulst: valid point :)

[06:19:35]

sn9:

psm321: well, i used latency_timer=248 and it worked

[06:19:38]

psm321:

then again, manpages have been known to be wrong in the past

[06:20:34]

levander:

sn9: When I do that same command I pasted above with 128 instead of 80, I get 'setpci: Value "128" is out of range'

[06:21:08]

sn9:

hmm, on the other hand, maybe i did use f8

[06:21:12]

levander:

hmmm

[06:21:22]

sn9:

nahhhh

[06:21:42]

sn9:

i'm reasonably sure i didn't

[06:22:11]

levander:

I'm wondering if I'm setting the latency for a device I can't set it for?

[06:22:18]

sn9:

also, the "-v -s" is for lspci, not setpci

[06:22:25]

Kazan:

i think i may have to make and submit my first mythtv patch

[06:22:31]

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[06:22:46]

Kazan:

i need to add another name to the list of XVideo adapters known to cause problems in mythtv

[06:22:56]

Kazan:

there is a work around in the code

[06:23:09]

levander:

sn9: From http://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-hw2.html ;: 'setpci -v -s 00:0f.0 latency_timer=ff'

[06:23:23]

sn9:

ok...

[06:23:44]

levander:

But, now I can't get it to work on either machine. I'm doing something wrong here.

[06:23:53]

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[06:24:03]

sn9:

i can check what i did

[06:24:12]

sn9:

Kazan: do it

[06:25:13]

sn9:

rxbandit: compare cafuego's google earth package with my installation script

[06:26:14]

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[06:30:23]

sn9:

levander: ok, i just did "setpci -v -s 5:9 latency_timer=f8" and it worked

[06:31:09]

sn9:

at a # shell

[06:31:10]

Kazan:

sn9: ha! guess what

[06:31:19]

Kazan:

the integrated video card on my motherboard is r400 based

[06:31:23]

Kazan:

so i can remove fglrx and use radeon

[06:31:29]

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[06:31:31]

amrit|wrk is now known as amrit

[06:31:35]

Kazan:

or maybe just use fglrx if it is ok on r400

[06:31:50]

sn9:

Kazan: i thought you said you had a card, not onboard

[06:31:54]

Kazan:

i do

[06:32:00]

Kazan:

i'll pull the card

[06:32:02]

Kazan:

and use the onboard

[06:32:17]

CattyKid:

hello any chance someone could answer a few quick questions?

[06:32:19]

Kazan:

onboard has HDMI anyway :P

[06:32:23]

sn9:

you put an x1600 card in when you have r400 onboard? whywhywhy?

[06:32:25]

Kazan:

CattyKid: no chance at all :P ask

[06:32:43]

Kazan:

sn9: because i didn't know how bad fglrx humped the bunk on r500/r600 series cards and xvmc

[06:32:49]

Kazan:

plus i had the x1600 laying around

[06:32:55]

CattyKid:

lol thanks. im new to mythtv but it seems really great. not installed yet judt looking to build a rig

[06:33:01]

sn9:

fglrx does not support xvmc

[06:33:20]

Kazan:

meant xv

[06:33:21]

CattyKid:

i will be using a p4 with onboard video and 256 mb of ram.

[06:33:26]

Kazan:

typed xvmc out of habit

[06:33:39]

Kazan:

CattyKid: ok

[06:33:49]

CattyKid:

obviosuly i need a tv tuner card and i want one with a hardware mpeg decoder but money is tight

[06:33:52]

sn9:

CattyKid: for a standalone?

[06:34:03]

sn9:

or two boxes?

[06:34:10]

Kazan:

hauppauge pvr-150 for single tuner, hauppauge pvr-500 for dual tuner one board

[06:34:11]

CattyKid:

yes this is all the computer will be used for

[06:34:32]

sn9:

Kazan: two pvr-150's > pvr-500

[06:34:32]

jhulst:

CattyKid: digital tuner or analog?

[06:34:35]

CattyKid:

thanks kazan they are the ones i was looking at

[06:34:42]

Kazan:

sn9: my PVR-500 works flawlessly

[06:34:54]

Kazan:

though.. i think i need to get ivtv tools and check the volume levels on my cards :P

[06:35:24]

CattyKid:

now the problem is the pvr 150 has an analog tuner. i will be hooking cable up to it and im not sure if the digitla broadcasting is for antenna and cable or what

[06:35:40]

sn9:

CattyKid: that's not what i meant. will you be using one box to record and another to playback, or both on the same?

[06:35:57]

CattyKid:

both on the same

[06:36:06]

sn9:

then 256 won't be enough

[06:36:10]

CattyKid:

i just dont want to have a tuner thats useless in a year

[06:36:22]

jhulst:

CattyKid: The PVR-150 will only do analog

[06:36:40]

CattyKid:

okay so itll be useless in a year?

[06:36:43]

jhulst:

Eventually cable will move to digital only

[06:36:48]

Kazan:

no gaurantee that my digital tuner will ever be useful for more than the cable channels they're required by law to leave unencrypted

[06:36:50]

jhulst:

For over the air

[06:37:08]

Kazan:

for all we know they could go completely encrypted, other than those few channels, when they do the switch over

[06:37:08]

rxbandit:

right eventually....the government has never pushed dates back

[06:37:22]

Kazan:

rxbandit: they've stopped moving that date

[06:37:24]

sn9:

CattyKid: the date for cable is 2012

[06:37:26]

jhulst:

CattyKid: Cable tv is not required to move to digital in a year

[06:37:45]

CattyKid:

oh well thats good news

[06:38:15]

sn9:

and even in 2012, they won't be required to drop analog — they'll just no longer be required to have it

[06:38:55]

CattyKid:

actually i have another question about the pvr 500 card. how much is that about?

[06:39:21]

sn9:

CattyKid: however, you can bite the bullet and go all-digital right now

[06:39:37]

Kazan:

which would be silly

[06:39:45]

rxbandit:

now if only we could have some lobbyist of our own to get them to let us do what wish interms of recording and set top boxes

[06:39:46]

sn9:

Kazan: y?

[06:39:51]

rxbandit:

but that is just a pipe dream

[06:40:05]

Kazan:

no analog tuners when most channels are still analog?

[06:40:15]

Kazan:

CattyKid: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116628

[06:40:19]

sn9:

most channels are digital-only

[06:40:22]

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[06:40:35]

Kazan:

um... where are you sn9

[06:40:36]

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[06:40:40]

sn9:

USA

[06:40:42]

Kazan:

where

[06:40:45]

Kazan:

i'm in iowa

[06:40:51]

sn9:

CA here

[06:40:56]

Kazan:

i get 9 digital channels and 79 analog

[06:41:05]

sn9:

OTA?

[06:41:06]

Kazan:

only 7 of those digital channels are useful

[06:41:06]

jhulst:

Silicondusts website has a page where you can see what is unecrypted

[06:41:09]

Kazan:

cable

[06:41:12]

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[06:41:17]

sn9:

oh, i meant OTA

[06:41:22]

Kazan:

i'm only 13 miles from the transmitter but i cannot pull in a clean signal OTA to save my hide

[06:41:37]

Kazan:

dude

[06:41:50]

sn9:

i'm less than two miles, and i get zilch OTA on anlog

[06:41:50]

Kazan:

the pci-express hvr-1800 (dual tuner – one digital, one analog) is less than the pvr-500

[06:42:09]

rxbandit:

is hvr-1800 supported now?

[06:42:27]

Kazan:

rxbandit: probably... someone who hangs out in channel here is a hauppauge employee

[06:42:33]

sn9:

rxbandit: has been for some time; it's the 1600 that gave ppl fits

[06:42:43]

Kazan:

digital side works in 0.20.2

[06:42:45]

Kazan:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppage_HVR-1800

[06:42:46]

rxbandit:

ahh sorry for the confusion

[06:42:51]

rxbandit:

thanks

[06:42:59]

Kazan:

seems like the analog side is still incomplete

[06:43:03]

sn9:

rxbandit: 1600 works too, now — cx18.ko

[06:43:14]

Kazan:

sn9: does the analog side of the hvr-1800 work now?

[06:43:22]

javatexan:

I am using myth.find_orpans.pl to import a bunch of files from backup...The process is asking for info that is lost:chanid starttime, duration, etc. does anyone have insight as to why it is asking for the channelid?, will it break if I put duration 60 and it was a 30 min show?

[06:44:11]

sn9:

Kazan: wiki would know better than me about the 1800 — i researched the 1600

[06:45:08]

minri:

And what is next "best" brand after Hauppage? :)

[06:45:15]

sn9:

anyway, as i was saying, cable systems are quite varied in their digital:analog ratios

[06:45:20]

minri:

For analog TV tuner with MPEG

[06:46:02]

CattyKid:

would i be able to record two channel at once with only 256 of ram using a card with hardware encoding?

[06:46:34]

Kazan:

soon as the hvr-1800 support is complete.. joygasm :D

[06:46:35]

sn9:

CattyKid: not if you watch on the same box

[06:46:45]

Kazan:

i have two open PCI Express 1x slots

[06:47:23]

sn9:

CattyKid: if you use one box, you need more than 256

[06:47:23]

Kazan:

well.. three open slots... not going to be using my PCI Express 16x slot for a video card

[06:47:40]

Kazan:

1GB of ram is probably cheaper than a 256MB stick :P

[06:47:45]

sn9:

yes

[06:47:53]

Kazan:

i can get 1GB ddr2–800 for $35

[06:47:55]

sn9:

$40 for DDR1

[06:48:13]

sn9:

DDR2 is maybe half that

[06:48:13]

CattyKid:

thats true ram is dirt cheap now. hope i can find the right stuff for this pc

[06:48:38]

sn9:

http://dealram.com

[06:48:39]

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[06:48:48]

Kazan:

thufir hawat? (spelling)

[06:49:06]

tjcarter:

2x2GB PC5300 SODIMM for $79 ;)

[06:49:22]

sn9:

sodimm?

[06:49:34]

tjcarter:

lappy RAM

[06:49:36]

CattyKid:

will i need a video card to output over vga to a 1366 by 768 tv? and will my computer with more ram be able to record and watch at the same time?

[06:49:38]

sn9:

i know

[06:50:12]

tjcarter:

I think my iMac uses faster RAM than that or I'd snag it.

[06:50:30]

sn9:

CattyKid: onboard video on a p4 box should be fine for 1366x768

[06:50:50]

sn9:

tjcarter: http://satech.com

[06:50:59]

CattyKid:

aweosme. i just want to say you guys are a huge help

[06:51:44]

sn9:

CattyKid: what chipset does that box have? i815? i915? something in between?

[06:51:55]

CattyKid:

im curious, would this be a good place to ask if people had cards they would be willing to sell? like, used cards?

[06:52:04]

tjcarter:

sn9: I usually go for Kingston or Crucial or something

[06:52:12]

** tjcarter reboots **

[06:52:24]

sn9:

tjcarter: i mean to check what'll work in the imac

[06:52:35]

tjcarter:

oh, I could ask Kingston or Crucial ;)

[06:52:42]

sn9:

no

[06:52:46]

tjcarter:

anyway, I gotta clean crud out of RAM

[06:52:49]

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[06:53:01]

CattyKid:

actually im buying it from a friend for 60 bucks in the next few days so idk. not a bad deal for the hardware

[06:53:25]

sn9:

you don't know anything about the box?

[06:53:34]

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[06:53:35]

CattyKid:

so idk what chipset. why what bearing would that have?

[06:53:49]

sn9:

you said it has onboard video

[06:54:02]

CattyKid:

nope unfortunately just the bare essentials

[06:54:48]

sn9:

[Tue 08 Jan 2008 10:32:54 PM PST] ! <CattyKid> i will be using a p4 with onboard video and 256 mb of ram.

[06:55:02]

CattyKid:

yeah all i know is onbaord video, p4 1.6 256 mb of ram. optical drive maybe a dvd reader and like a 40 gb hdd which i will need to upgrade

[06:55:12]

sn9:

1.6???

[06:55:34]

sn9:

then the video chip will make an even bigger difference

[06:55:48]

CattyKid:

yeah its a pretty old pentium 4

[06:56:22]

sn9:

video chips vary greatly in supported capabilities

[06:56:48]

sn9:

if it's onboard, knowing the mobo chipset says a lot

[06:56:56]

CattyKid:

well i have a geforce 5400 with 256 mb of ram in my main pc and also another pc with a 64 mb card. should i put one of those in and scrap the onbaord video?

[06:57:15]

sn9:

that depends on what it is

[06:57:31]

sn9:

but, geforce 5200 will beat it in any case

[06:57:40]

sn9:

*5400

[06:57:46]

jhulst:

My guess is that a 1.6 pentium will be fine, even with onboard video, it won't be great, but playback will be fine

[06:58:17]

sn9:

it very likely has intel video

[06:58:32]

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[06:58:40]

sn9:

in which case, older is apparently better when the cpu is lacking

[06:58:54]

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[06:58:56]

CattyKid:

hmm thats odd

[06:59:03]

sn9:

XvMC, you know...

[06:59:19]

jhulst:

I was running an AMD Duron 1.3 ghz with onboard video that was decent, especially for SD

[06:59:34]

CattyKid:

any idea where to buy a used video capture card instead of ebay?

[06:59:47]

sn9:

jhulst: intel video is non existent with amd cpu's

[06:59:51]

CattyKid:

yeah i have no plan on anything hd for this machine btw

[07:00:05]

jhulst:

sn9: I didn't say it was Intel

[07:00:05]

sn9:

CattyKid: why not?

[07:00:35]

CattyKid:

i just assumed it wasnt capable. could it be with maybe my 5400?

[07:00:40]

sn9:

jhulst: if it was nvidia 61x0, that's understandable

[07:01:01]

jhulst:

sn9: It was an old chipset, I think it was via

[07:01:38]

sn9:

CattyKid: with HD, it's playback that's the issue. with analog, it's the recording

[07:01:58]

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[07:01:59]

jhulst:

CattyKid: With another graphics card it could work, but how would you capture it?

[07:02:08]

sn9:

jhulst: savage or unichrome?

[07:02:23]

jhulst:

sn9: It was a while ago, I think it was a Savage

[07:02:58]

jhulst:

All I'm saying, for SD I would think that anything with a P4 should be sufficient, as long as there is enough RAM

[07:03:14]

sn9:

CattyKid: even the onboard video can probably handle HD to some degree

[07:03:41]

CattyKid:

okay

[07:03:49]

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[07:03:51]

jhulst:

CattyKid: But you would need something to capture it, a PVR-150 isn't going to cut it

[07:04:03]

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[07:04:13]

sn9:

CattyKid: even if you go SD-only, i strongly recommend investigating an all-digital setup

[07:04:31]

sn9:

you have RCN cable, right?

[07:04:33]

CattyKid:

how much is a good price for the pvr 150 ive seen it from like 60 to 100

[07:04:55]

CattyKid:

yeah rcn how did you know my modem?

[07:04:59]

jhulst:

CattyKid: $50-$60 is good

[07:05:16]

sn9:

[Tue 08 Jan 2008 10:31:02 PM PST] * CattyKid (n=CattyKid@65-78-103-39.c3-0.drf-ubr2.atw-drf.pa.cable.rcn.com ) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:05:31]

jhulst:

CattyKid: There are different versions with different options, Newegg is a good place to get them

[07:05:51]

CattyKid:

thought so. only problem is most of the cards i looked at that were digital did not do hardware encoding

[07:05:56]

jhulst:

You can get one with a remote and blaster if you want, or just a plain one

[07:06:00]

sn9:

CattyKid: but i meant RCN on your tv

[07:06:12]

CattyKid:

yes i do

[07:06:36]

jhulst:

CattyKid: There is no hardware encoding with digital signal

[07:06:45]

sn9:

at least in some places, RCN offers digital HD over 1394/firewire

[07:06:47]

Kazan:

with digital the signal comes to you already encoded

[07:06:52]

jhulst:

The stream is already encoded

[07:06:55]

Kazan:

it's an mpeg2 stream

[07:06:56]

jhulst:

bah

[07:07:12]

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[07:07:40]

sn9:

CattyKid: just put a $7 firewire card in (and make sure it doesn't have a Via chip)

[07:07:42]

CattyKid:

oh really? whats is the price on a digital card, can it also receive analog, and does it require a better cpu?

[07:08:08]

jhulst:

CattyKid: depends on if you have a set top box for your cable

[07:08:26]

sn9:

yeah, rents for STBs vary greatly

[07:08:32]

CattyKid:

i do have a set top box but it will be nowhere near this computer

[07:08:42]

sn9:

move the computer

[07:08:49]

jhulst:

I just bought a HD Homerun that works well, but thats only for unecrypted channels

[07:09:12]

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[07:09:30]

jhulst:

CattyKid: You're going to be paying at least $100 for a digital encoder

[07:09:39]

CattyKid:

alos this is just as much for when i go to college this year as it is for now

[07:09:57]

sn9:

CattyKid: then you want versatility

[07:10:21]

sn9:

a hybrid tuner card

[07:10:27]

sn9:

AND firewire

[07:11:03]

CattyKid:

do avertv cards work? if so what do you think of the avertv purity 3d mce 500?

[07:11:03]

sn9:

cheapest good hybrid cards are about $40

[07:11:36]

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[07:11:45]

CattyKid:

hybrid? that does what digital and analog? and whats the price on those? also does the ard i just posted do digital?

[07:11:50]

jhulst:

sn9: What card can you get for $40?

[07:12:01]

sn9:

[Tue 08 Jan 2008 02:15:57 AM PST] = <tjcarter> AVerTVHD A180 wins for being $40.

[07:12:34]

sn9:

but i saw the kworld atsc 120 for the same price at fry's

[07:12:45]

CattyKid:

is that card comprable to the pvr 150? and what is different about a hybrid?

[07:13:02]

jhulst:

CattyKid: It does digital and analog

[07:13:06]

sn9:

hybrid = digital+analog

[07:13:17]

sn9:

in one tuner, usually

[07:13:54]

jhulst:

Some people have reported really bad analog quality with a hybrid, I'm not sure if that's still the case

[07:14:10]

sn9:

jhulst: with hauppauge, yes

[07:14:37]

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[07:15:14]

CattyKid:

does that have a hardware encoder for the analog broadcasts?

[07:15:39]

sn9:

depends on the card

[07:16:48]

CattyKid:

what about that one?

[07:16:57]

sn9:

the avertvhd?

[07:17:12]

CattyKid:

sorry its really hard to look up stats im on my phone

[07:17:26]

CattyKid:

yes the 180

[07:17:40]

sn9:

you're irc'ing on your phone?

[07:18:19]

CattyKid:

yes windows mobile using pocketchat on wifi

[07:18:22]

CattyKid:

:)

[07:20:52]

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[07:21:28]

sn9:

this is gonna take me a bit — i have maybe 100 browser tabs open in only 384 ram

[07:21:43]

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[07:21:59]

CattyKid:

lol i know exactly what you mean

[07:22:14]

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[07:22:34]

sn9:

kids, don't try this on windows

[07:22:40]

jhulst:

That AcerMedia will only work for Over the air broadcasts, no cable

[07:22:43]

javatexan:

I am using rmyth.rebuilddatabase.pl if I use --answer how do I indicate I just want the default value for that --answer on command line

[07:23:15]

sn9:

jhulst: no clearqam?

[07:23:20]

CattyKid:

thanks

[07:23:32]

CattyKid:

its time to call it a night for me

[07:24:10]

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[07:25:00]

jhulst:

sn9: Not that I see

[07:25:34]

sn9:

well, the ati hdtv wonder uses the same chipset, and it does both

[07:26:43]

CattyKid:

i thank you all so much for your help

[07:26:45]

jhulst:

sn9: Maye I'm wrong, I didn't seem QAM supported listed

[07:26:55]

CattyKid:

it means a lot to me

[07:27:11]

jhulst:

sn9: looks like I'm wrong, the wiki says it does

[07:27:15]

jhulst:

CattyKid: No problem

[07:27:33]

jhulst:

And no, the avertv does not do hardware encoding

[07:27:39]

jhulst:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/AVerTV_HD_A180

[07:27:55]

jhulst:

"Highly unrecommended for analog use"

[07:28:19]

jhulst:

same for the Kworld

[07:28:22]

CattyKid:

they have like info on all the cards?

[07:28:35]

jhulst:

CattyKid: lots of them

[07:28:53]

CattyKid:

aweoms thanks again!

[07:29:20]

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[07:31:24]

sn9:

jhulst: i doubt it would say that about the kworld 120, since it's not yet supported at all

[07:32:17]

jhulst:

sn9: Nope, 110 and 115

[07:34:41]

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[07:34:45]

sn9:

120 is different

[07:35:14]

Kazan:

you buy a kworld ATSC series for it's atsc tuner.. not for it's ntsc framegrabber :D

[07:35:28]

Kazan:

afk now to do some hardware changes

[07:36:15]

jhulst:

agreed, I haven't heard of any hardware encoding hybrids

[07:38:02]

Kazan:

that didn't take long :D

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[07:49:26]

Kazan:

sn9: hehe... want to hear something really funny

[07:49:39]

Kazan:

the onboard r420 won't enumerate the 1280x720 modeline

[07:49:49]

Kazan:

but.. the 1080i modeline doesn't flicker like on the r530

[07:51:02]

Kazan:

bah now i see the flicker :/

[07:51:12]

CCFL_Man2:

there a way to use winders mce guide data?

[07:51:18]

Kazan:

no

[07:51:34]

Kazan:

are you not a north american user?

[07:51:42]

CCFL_Man2:

i am

[07:51:43]

sn9:

what? even my rage 128 could do 1280x768!

[07:51:44]

Kazan:

if you are.. what is wrong with schedulesdirect?

[07:51:56]

CCFL_Man2:

Kazan: nothing at all

[07:52:03]

Kazan:

sn9: yeah.. weird.. it isn't enumerated the modeline over vga cable

[07:52:14]

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[07:52:24]

Kazan:

it did over DVI->HDMI though :D

[07:52:35]

sn9:

Kazan: wait, 768 or 720?

[07:52:44]

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[07:52:58]

Kazan:

720

[07:53:07]

sn9:

did you try 768?

[07:53:12]

Kazan:

didn't see it either

[07:53:39]

Kazan:

ahh geeze not this shiat again

[07:53:50]

Kazan:

it's not sizing it up to the entire image

[07:53:55]

Kazan:

erg the image to the screen

[07:54:18]

CCFL_Man2:

i need a good solution for a quiet frontend that can do decode hd mpeg2, is a video card that decodes hd mpeg2 the best solution?

[07:55:10]

sn9:

Kazan: tell it to use 768 and ignore edid

[07:55:27]

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[07:55:39]

Kazan:

no go

[07:55:45]

Kazan:

fglrx will not accept custom modelines

[07:55:50]

Kazan:

and... radeon wouldn't start :/

[07:55:58]

Kazan:

no devices detected

[07:56:09]

jhulst:

CCFL_Man2: what kind of a machine?

[07:56:17]

sn9:

wait, you tried to use radeon after fglrx was installed?

[07:56:23]

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[07:56:31]

Kazan:

sn9: do i need to strip the kernel module?

[07:56:34]

CCFL_Man2:

jhulst: single cor intel 1.5GHz

[07:56:39]

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[07:56:43]

sn9:

you know that fglrx overwrites part of xorg, right?

[07:56:49]

Kazan:

?

[07:56:53]

Kazan:

how so

[07:56:58]

Kazan:

all it does is install a driver

[07:57:01]

Kazan:

do you mean xorg.conf?

[07:57:04]

sn9:

no

[07:57:13]

sn9:

shared objects

[07:57:29]

Kazan:

well.. i'll yum uninstall it then

[07:57:40]

jhulst:

CCFL_Man2: You will need a decent graphics card, with XvMC probably, http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/XvMC

[07:57:48]

sn9:

fedora? you'll have to reinstall xorg, too

[07:57:52]

Kazan:

bollocks

[07:57:55]

Kazan:

never had to before

[07:58:19]

CCFL_Man2:

jhulst: nothing that completely decodes mpeg2 hd?

[07:58:24]

sn9:

have you ever tried to use an xorg driver after a proprietary binary one before?

[07:58:30]

Kazan:

yes

[07:58:40]

justinh:

nothing that completely decodes mpeg2 hd. nothing

[07:58:46]

jhulst:

CCFL_Man2: Like what?

[07:59:01]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: a cpu can completely decode it

[07:59:31]

DGnome:

CCFL_Man2: I do HD MPEG2 in software on AMD dualcore hardware, works like a charm and if you invest a bit more time and money on it, you can get a very silent system. A good chassis and a good PSU is the key.

[07:59:46]

CCFL_Man2:

jhulst: something so i can use a cpu of 733MHz or more

[08:00:07]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: for a frontend-only box, what you have is plenty

[08:00:09]

Kazan:

i think radeon doesn't have my pci-ids

[08:00:25]

sn9:

Kazan: then it's old

[08:00:31]

Kazan:

radeon or the card?

[08:00:35]

sn9:

radeon

[08:00:47]

Kazan:

i JUST yum updated

[08:00:51]

CCFL_Man2:

well, i just need a frontend system

[08:00:59]

sn9:

Kazan: on F8?

[08:01:04]

Kazan:

f7

[08:01:17]

sn9:

to what version?

[08:02:13]

CCFL_Man2:

i wished that the winders mce extenders can run a linyx bootloader and net root

[08:02:39]

sn9:

extenders?

[08:02:49]

CCFL_Man2:

i want a quiet stb type box i can use

[08:02:58]

Kazan:

sn9: what do you mean "to what version"? i just yum updated today on fedora 7

[08:03:13]

sn9:

Kazan: to what version of the rpm

[08:03:21]

justinh:

a core2 duo mobile cpu can run pretty quietly with the right HSF :)

[08:03:32]

justinh:

infact just about any modern CPU can

[08:03:44]

CCFL_Man2:

hmm..

[08:03:45]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: just stuff something in an antec minuet 300 case

[08:04:24]

Kazan:

sn9: ah.. well apparently it needs to go into radeonhd as well

[08:04:27]

Kazan:

despite being a r400

[08:04:50]

DGnome:

CCFL_Man2: google "silent pc review" for very good silent pc resource :)

[08:05:04]

justinh:

spcr.com IIRC

[08:05:25]

sn9:

Kazan: what? radeon supports x800 and lesser

[08:05:45]

CCFL_Man2:

hmm..

[08:05:46]

Kazan:

yes x800 = r400

[08:06:06]

sn9:

but it has to be a recent build

[08:06:09]

CCFL_Man2:

the linkshit mce extender is a perfect size

[08:06:11]

Kazan:

the xNNN series is the r400 series, the 9000 series is r300

[08:06:13]

justinh:

and what's all this talk of ATI stuff? surely people know ATI isn't the way to go for linux right now

[08:06:40]

directhex:

justinh, sn9 believes ati>nvidia for linux

[08:06:42]

Kazan:

xorg-x11-drv-ati-6.6.3–4.fc7

[08:07:02]

sn9:

directhex: mobo chipsets only, not video

[08:07:06]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: you're not likely to get anything small & thin that can play mpeg2 HD which is PC-based. mac mini on the other hand... yeah

[08:07:39]

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[08:08:25]

directhex:

and Kazan agrees

[08:08:39]

Kazan:

hmm?

[08:08:49]

justinh:

saying that, the linksys MCE extender isn't exactly thin!

[08:08:52]

Kazan:

oh

[08:08:55]

Kazan:

justinh's comment

[08:09:00]

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[08:09:09]

Kazan:

justinh: yeah.. because nvidia are really any better at all

[08:09:15]

Kazan:

both of them have their heads up their butts

[08:09:37]

sn9:

Kazan: 6.6.3 might be the last version without r400 support, i don't remember exactly

[08:09:41]

justinh:

Kazan: nvidia's drivers might have problems in some cases but on balance they're still better than ATI despite being closed source

[08:09:53]

justinh:

one day that might change and FWIW I hope it does

[08:10:15]

sn9:

justinh: anything is better than ati's binaries

[08:10:19]

Kazan:

score

[08:10:23]

Kazan:

radeonhd driver up and running :D

[08:10:27]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: i do have a mac mini, think it can do mpeg2 hd?

[08:10:38]

Kazan:

and detecting 1360x768 modeline!

[08:10:39]

Kazan:

ha!

[08:10:48]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: if it's intel, should be able to do mpeg2 HD

[08:10:49]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: the new mini or the old mini?

[08:11:04]

minri:

sn9: Antec minuet 300 good case for that price point?

[08:11:26]

sn9:

minri: actually, it's pricier than it should be

[08:11:29]

justinh:

should be able to do h.264 HD with multithreaded players too

[08:11:35]

Kazan:

*looks curiously at* "(II) Loading extension XVideo-MotionCompensation"

[08:11:36]

CCFL_Man2:

intel mac mini, single core, 1.5GHz

[08:11:43]

justinh:

all good HTPC cases are pricier than they should be!

[08:11:50]

sn9:

Kazan: meaningless

[08:12:03]

sn9:

justinh: what about bad ones?

[08:12:13]

justinh:

bad HTPC cases are overpriced too :)

[08:12:16]

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[08:12:29]

sn9:

justinh: not one that i got

[08:12:37]

justinh:

infact, call it a HTPC case & hike the price 200%

[08:12:56]

CCFL_Man2:

i love my intel mac mini

[08:13:23]

sn9:

justinh: in fact, i may have singlehandedly convinced the mfr to stop making it

[08:13:25]

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[08:13:39]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: there's a way to find out if it can play mpeg2 HD. get mythfrontend on it & try to play a mpeg2 HDTV file

[08:13:49]

Kazan:

ha the modeline validity check in radeonhd beats radeon and fglrx :D

[08:14:16]

sn9:

Kazan: f7 has a working radeonhd?

[08:14:43]

Kazan:

in updates-testing

[08:14:46]

Kazan:

*winces* .. no xvideo

[08:14:47]

sn9:

hmm

[08:14:53]

DGnome:

my choice of frontend chassis (good psu, cooling and rubber grommets for hdd): http://www.antec.com/ec/productDetails.php?ProdID=00280

[08:14:59]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: i do want an appletv though, they are so cool

[08:15:10]

Kazan:

No 2D and 3D acceleration so far. No XVideo (needs 3D engine for scaling). Still, fullscreen video is working fluently for many users.

[08:15:26]

justinh:

appletv == nothing more than a junk toy

[08:15:42]

sn9:

it can run linux

[08:15:44]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: not good for mythtv?

[08:15:51]

justinh:

appletv == nothing more than a junk toy

[08:16:14]

justinh:

no good for HD, so in the current climate – a waste of time

[08:16:21]

DGnome:

word.

[08:16:23]

Kazan:

radeonhd is too new :(

[08:17:24]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: yeah, and it has only hd connections, component and gdmi, but it can't play hd

[08:17:41]

CCFL_Man2:

hdmi

[08:18:50]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: but of course

[08:19:41]

sn9:

i'm gonna laugh when apple dumps intel in favor of something else

[08:19:41]

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[08:20:06]

justinh:

sn9: what.. like Via ? :P

[08:20:22]

sn9:

no, that would be too funny

[08:21:37]

directhex:

not happening any time soon

[08:21:49]

directhex:

they've got no reason to

[08:22:04]

directhex:

dropping ibm for processors made sense, since ibm wouldn't make them the parts they needed

[08:23:06]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: it's so silly that it can onlt be used on an hdtv but can't play hdtv content

[08:23:06]

sn9:

i didn't say it would be soon

[08:23:32]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: I said they're nothing but a useless toy. I wouldn't say that if I didn't mean it

[08:24:08]

CCFL_Man2:

yeah

[08:24:10]

directhex:

why will it be ever? can you really see intel not manufacturing things like low-power laptop chips, which was the catalyst for dumping ibm?

[08:24:39]

CCFL_Man2:

directhex: x86 is the way to go

[08:24:42]

justinh:

hell my old frontend could output 1080p but no way would a Via C3 CPU handle playing 1080p video :P

[08:24:55]

CCFL_Man2:

i purchased a mac mini because it was an intel

[08:25:07]

directhex:

CCFL_Man2, well, amd64, but the instruction set doesn't matter to intel

[08:25:07]

sn9:

i see apple being unhappy with perfectly-fine intel hardware when something more attractive comes along

[08:25:10]

directhex:

to apple, gah

[08:25:27]

directhex:

sn9, i see that as completely misreading history

[08:26:10]

justinh:

Apple make toys a la mode – they don't go with hardware manufacturers the same way. Hardware choice is both economic & practical for them

[08:26:11]

sn9:

m68k may have had no real future when it was dumped, but look at the cell...

[08:26:35]

directhex:

sn9, cell has no real purpose for almost all computing applications, and especially for desktops

[08:26:41]

directhex:

it kicks for the remainder

[08:26:44]

directhex:

much like itanium

[08:26:48]

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[08:27:09]

sn9:

nevertheless, itanium tanked and the cell didn't

[08:27:21]

CCFL_Man2:

apple had no choice but to use x86, tiger and x86 is nice

[08:27:27]

justinh:

using cell processors means a massive investment in software development

[08:27:29]

directhex:

and you STILL come back to the core problem – apple could not make laptops anymore, because ibm would not make a low-wattage g5

[08:27:41]

directhex:

justinh, and completely wrong for desktop use

[08:27:49]

sn9:

*could* not

[08:27:57]

directhex:

justinh, it's an HPC chip. one that can't do double precision calculations ^_^

[08:28:14]

justinh:

heh

[08:28:22]

CCFL_Man2:

i personally love tiger

[08:28:46]

sn9:

x86's days are numbered, even for desktops

[08:29:03]

directhex:

sn9, if you suggest anything but amd64 as a replacement, you're mad

[08:29:08]

justinh:

I personally hate fanboys. Fanboys who affiliate themselves with manufacturers & OSes & hardware platforms

[08:29:21]

directhex:

justinh, i used to be like that when i was little

[08:29:28]

justinh:

teh core is teh fu7ur3!

[08:29:34]

justinh:

teh cell!

[08:29:44]

sn9:

for now, amd64 is the replacement, but it won't live forever, either

[08:30:08]

justinh:

nothing lives forever. if it did we wouldn't be having this conversation outside a university network

[08:30:32]

sn9:

nor any other conversation

[08:30:38]

directhex:

i've looked at all of these on a professional level. and we might spend a few grand on some cell kit as a toy for some researchers, but it's still completely wrong for 99% of applications

[08:31:02]

sn9:

i never said it wasn't

[08:31:20]

sn9:

it's just an example of diverging paths

[08:31:42]

sn9:

x86/amd64 will eventually diverge likewise

[08:31:52]

directhex:

you implied apple should have stuck with ibm because of cell

[08:32:19]

sn9:

no, you read that into what i said; i did not mean that at all

[08:32:45]

directhex:

then you need to be more clear

[08:33:07]

sn9:

i said that ibm was not like things were with m68k

[08:33:26]

sn9:

the cell was merely an example

[08:33:29]

directhex:

as far as apple were concerned, they were.

[08:33:43]

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[08:33:52]

directhex:

ibm have no interest in a performant laptop-happy chip – they didn't then, they don't now

[08:33:52]

sn9:

exactly, and eventually, intel will be, too

[08:34:08]

directhex:

sn9, eventually... intel won't make chips for desktops AND laptops? wha?

[08:34:25]

sn9:

they will, but apple won't like 'em

[08:34:39]

justinh:

_eventually_ something better will come along, you can be sure of that. whether that'll be x86 compatible or not remains to be seen

[08:35:05]

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[08:35:10]

sn9:

justinh: my point was that they won't care about x86 compatibility

[08:35:19]

justinh:

who cares?

[08:35:56]

directhex:

who's going to build non-x86_64-compatible chips for consumers?

[08:35:58]

CCFL_Man2:

but x86 is industry standard

[08:35:58]

sn9:

but commodity PCs are x86 by definition

[08:36:09]

justinh:

as long as it can do the job at a price that's right I don't think the architecture matters one bit

[08:36:11]

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[08:36:40]

justinh:

and as long as MS rules the roost in the OS stakes (and it ain't changing any time soon, for right or for wrong), x86 will remain

[08:36:56]

sn9:

directhex: many chips are made for consumers, just not for desktops

[08:37:16]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: and free software can be built for it

[08:37:19]

justinh:

I don't think many consumers will care to be honest, as long as stuff 'just works'

[08:37:35]

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[08:37:41]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: in the big scheme of things, free software doesn't count for anything. sucks but that's the way it is

[08:37:42]

sn9:

justinh: that assumes that windows "just works"

[08:37:45]

directhex:

sn9, right, so... you think there'll be ARM chips to compete with intel on performance, with a full range, the manufacturing facilities and support a company like apple wants? MIPS?

[08:38:07]

sn9:

directhex: absolutely not

[08:38:09]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: the upnp libraries are x86 only, unless intel released thesources

[08:38:11]

directhex:

PowerPC? oh wait, that didnt work out so well

[08:38:19]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: i know, sucks

[08:38:33]

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[08:38:37]

sn9:

although, mips is capable, it just won't happen

[08:38:56]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: you know as well as i do that mythtv is way better an most out there

[08:39:15]

justinh:

you get what you pay for. I pay a lot of time

[08:39:32]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: with mythtv?

[08:39:38]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: you can get full upnp sources

[08:39:42]

justinh:

yeah I'm putting time back in

[08:39:52]

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[08:40:03]

justinh:

some people have to. if they didn't, mythtv would never get any better

[08:40:12]

CCFL_Man2:

sn9: oh, official intel or 3rd party library?

[08:40:14]

directhex:

sn9, you're ball gazing about a massive shift in the market, involving billions and billions of cash, a volte face from some of the world's biggest tech companies, and the collapse of intel. that doesn't strike you as a teency bit premature?

[08:40:21]

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[08:40:34]

sn9:

directhex: i am saying no such thing

[08:40:44]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: 3rd party

[08:40:51]

justinh:

sounds more like a grudge of some sort against Intel if you ask me

[08:40:59]

sn9:

intel does not need apple

[08:41:02]

justinh:

fanboyism

[08:41:31]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: well, what i mean is, the mythtv community makes it the best solution, in my opinion, especially with a server-client archetecture

[08:41:36]

directhex:

sn9, no, they don't. but apple's needs fit a product line intel already had – and will continue to have, as long as intel remain in business

[08:41:38]

CCFL_Man2:

sn9: ahh

[08:41:45]

sn9:

for that matter, intel doesn't really need x86

[08:41:56]

directhex:

o rly?

[08:42:01]

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[08:42:04]

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[08:42:05]

sn9:

but it does help

[08:42:12]

directhex:

nah, nobody runs windows, that's true

[08:42:22]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: the problem with OSS is the investment of time/effort/research you have to make. the vast majority of PC users just want to plug stuff in & have it work. For a lot of them, 'free software' means warez

[08:42:48]

justinh:

stop the warez & OSS might have more of a chance

[08:43:00]

Tanthrix:

sn9: What the hell are you smoking? I've had a tiring day, and I could sure use some of it

[08:43:13]

directhex:

justinh, what's why i wuv drm and product activation

[08:43:26]

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[08:43:33]

sn9:

justinh: "stop the warez" means "stop the windowz"

[08:43:56]

directhex:

easy, since nobody runs it, since nobody needs x86 ^_^

[08:44:17]

sn9:

"intel" is not "nobody"

[08:44:28]

justinh:

can't help but wonder sometimes, if some other company with different operating practises was top of the pile, whether they'd be hated so much

[08:44:39]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: most people are idiots, plug and play solutions are usually shit, though some people know open software results in the best end product, despite the work and effort that goes into it

[08:44:55]

directhex:

justinh, good question. look at how much lockdown apple engage in, yet they have a rabid fanboy base

[08:45:10]

justinh:

CCFL_Man2: in all honesty I think what mythtv has is almost unique

[08:45:24]

sn9:

CCFL_Man2: now that's just not true

[08:45:27]

directhex:

right, gotta go to the p00st office

[08:45:59]

justinh:

I'm not using mythtv because it's open source or any reason other than the fact it's the best solution for me. I don't put stuff back in 'for the good of everybody else'. I do it because it suits me to

[08:46:00]

Tanthrix:

Time and time again, it has been shown that when people are faced with overstrictive and borderline unethical products, they bend over ready to recieve them. You'll pardon me if I don't hold my breath for an uprising against Microsoft or DRM

[08:46:01]

CCFL_Man2:

justinh: the server-client model is what i like

[08:46:23]

** directhex sees reality begin to drift slowly away from #mythtv-users **

[08:46:24]

sn9:

Tanthrix is absolutely right

[08:46:43]

sn9:

just look at HDCP

[08:47:00]

** Tanthrix saw reality leave #mythtv-users about 15 minutes ago **

[08:47:09]

CCFL_Man2:

sn9: i prefer professional standards like hd-sdi

[08:47:15]

directhex:

Tanthrix, i have better eyesight than you

[08:47:21]

sn9:

Tanthrix: good riddance

[08:47:48]

justinh:

sn9: if it was common knowledge that one day their TV won't work with their HD-DVD player when some manufacturer revokes a key set and there's nothing they can do to stop it... they might've thought twice

[08:47:52]

sn9:

we don't need no stinkin' reality!

[08:47:56]

CCFL_Man2:

hdmi i hate, bullshit drm

[08:48:02]

Tanthrix:

directhex: But I saw it sooner, ergo that is impossible. And it all began with some crazy comments about apple leaving intel or some dumb shit idea.

[08:48:11]

sn9:

justinh: wrong

[08:48:15]

Kazan:

why is frontend segfaulting so much :(

[08:48:33]

Kazan:

and so slow :/

[08:48:41]

justinh:

ATI ftw!

[08:48:51]

Kazan:

bollocks

[08:48:51]

sn9:

justinh: there is something they can do: buy all-new hardware!

[08:48:57]

directhex:

CCFL_Man2, hdcp is what you hate. hdmi is a cable

[08:49:03]

Kazan:

that has nothing to do with the video card jusinh.. it's NOT in video playback

[08:49:07]

Tanthrix:

justinh: Think twice, yes. And even without that issue, many people are thinking twice about it all together, having recently perfected their dvd collection. There's a big difference between that an an uprising, which is what would be necessary to take something like MS down

[08:49:10]

Kazan:

it's often segfaulting on startup

[08:49:53]

Tanthrix:

justinh: Incidentally, it's refreshing to see someone admit that they work on OSS software for their own benefit, not because they're trying to save the human race, or some other crazy, inflated idea.

[08:50:03]

justinh:

Kazan: I've often been able to make mythfrontend segfault, but that's generally when I've been hacking on it or changing stuff in themes

[08:50:04]

CCFL_Man2:

directhex: i hate hdmi too, expensive and fragile cable and connector, hd-sdi uses rg6 and bnc connectors

[08:50:28]

justinh:

Tanthrix: FWIW I'm not the only contributor who's in this 'for the universe'

[08:50:29]

directhex:

expensive? O_o

[08:50:37]

justinh:

er.. *not* in this 'for the universe'

[08:50:41]

Tanthrix:

hehe

[08:50:41]

Kazan:

justinh: fresh install and it segfaults like a madman

[08:50:49]

hachi:

anyone here got an nvidia video card driving at 1366x768 properly? I see a lot of mythtv users in the nvidia forums :)

[08:50:53]

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[08:51:03]

Tanthrix:

hachi: That's a rare thing, unfortunately.

[08:51:07]

justinh:

makes me puke when I see people go on & on about 'taking over the world' & being all tree-huggy

[08:51:09]

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[08:51:15]

sn9:

Tanthrix: if you know ppl who claim to work on software for inflated ideas, i'd like to meet them

[08:51:20]

justinh:

software communism ;)

[08:51:38]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Though you obviously already know that, having done the research. I did too, luckily before I bought my TV, so I went with a 1080p native set to avoid those issues.

[08:51:48]

Kazan:

hachi: 1360x768 tends to be the cloest valid modeline

[08:51:48]

DGnome:

hachi: I only managed to get 1360x768, no matter what I did :/

[08:51:54]

justinh:

sn9: you know the ones. they all use the word 'awesome' far too much & go around hugging newbies

[08:52:12]

hachi:

DGnome: I can't get 1360x768 right either... it's acting like I've got the timings wrong

[08:52:13]

rooaus:

hachi: What do you mean properly? You mean at 1366 not 1360?

[08:52:22]

Tanthrix:

justinh: I don't object so much to people wanting to contribute just for the sake of the common good, but I do get really irrated by the self-inflated importance a lot of OSS people can have.

[08:52:26]

sn9:

justinh: funny, most i see are more like you

[08:52:28]

hachi:

the card drives it, but the display shows the output wrong

[08:52:36]

hachi:

it's got a black bar on the left

[08:52:58]

hachi:

and the output is neatly squashed down by like 20px in width (the width of the black bar) and sitting there

[08:53:13]

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[08:53:13]

justinh:

that's another line of code committed. one more step towards toppling MS! :D

[08:53:13]

hachi:

it's so close, but this is DVI... why should I have to be playing with timings

[08:53:25]

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[08:53:30]

Tanthrix:

justinh: The same for security freaks, who think any system that's not completely hidden from existence, locked in a basement, with some kind of elaborate port knocking setup is the end of the world. I think it makes them feel like their James Bond or something, that the Russian mob is after their OpenBSD router in their garage

[08:53:47]

sn9:

justinh: the only ppl i see with "awsome" in their mouths are the newbies themselves

[08:53:48]

hachi:

Tanthrix: I thought there were no 1920x1080 displays :\

[08:53:59]

DGnome:

hachi: I think I did it with an fx5200 and an LG Electronics display. Just filled in 1360x768 in the modes section and tadaa.wav

[08:54:06]

justinh:

sn9: have you met anybody who works for canonical?

[08:54:13]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Not at all! They're becoming extremely common these days. Do a search for 1080p on Costco.com, and you'll find quite a few.

[08:54:19]

hachi:

dangit

[08:54:32]

Tanthrix:

hachi: As cheap as $799 USD I've seen for a 37 inch bare bones set

[08:54:44]

DGnome:

hachi: check the xorg logfiles, see what the display says it can handle, that might help you

[08:54:51]

sn9:

justinh: you mean ppl who aren't newbies work for canonical?

[08:54:55]

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[08:54:56]

Tanthrix:

hachi: A lot of them just automatically work since the EDID supports 1920x1080p.

[08:54:56]

justinh:

Tanthrix: heh. I left my development myth box in my router's DMZ for a month & it was hardly even tickled

[08:55:01]

hachi:

they're no help, the display only claims it can handle 1024x768

[08:55:04]

hachi:

bloody annoying

[08:55:22]

justinh:

hachi: EDID is known for not always being the truth

[08:55:39]

hachi:

with TVs it seems to never be right

[08:55:42]

Tanthrix:

justinh: I've seen systems setup a lot worse than that which have been running for years without so much a problem. It's a threat that is greatly, greatly exaggerated. Most data theft and other problems arise from people who already have access to the machines, not mysterious hackers in the dark

[08:55:46]

hachi:

at least, from what I've seen on google

[08:56:09]

justinh:

hachi: sometimes the case with monitors too believe it or not. just take a look at the xorg mailing list

[08:56:18]

DGnome:

hachi: you can make xorg forget edid bullshit and then you just have to play around

[08:56:30]

hachi:

yeah, I did

[08:56:35]

hachi:

but I'm not a modeline guru

[08:56:38]

sn9:

Tanthrix: yeah, but remember the Scores virus?

[08:56:46]

hachi:

and I'm actually puzzled why we have timings to play with over DVI

[08:57:16]

Tanthrix:

sn9: No. Never heard of it.

[08:57:20]

justinh:

Tanthrix: yah but at the same time some people have only themselves to blame when a vuln is exploited & their site gets hacked

[08:57:24]

hachi:

I can't believe that there's a front porch, or a back porch in DVI signals

[08:57:31]

sn9:

Tanthrix: might have been before your time

[08:57:44]

rooaus:

hachi: You may need to disable many of the mode validation checks, not just a matter of mode lines.

[08:57:53]

justinh:

hachi: not so much front & back porch but timing info is still crucial in this digital age. probably more so

[08:57:54]

hachi:

I've already done that rooaus

[08:58:04]

hachi:

that's what the last hour was before this

[08:58:09]

Tanthrix:

justinh: True. It's definately wise to be prudent. And keeping any net visible system fully updated is an absolute must.

[08:58:24]

rooaus:

sorry, wasn't reading scrollback.

[08:58:30]

hachi:

wasn't here

[08:58:33]

hachi:

I was in #nvidia

[08:58:38]

rooaus:

ah

[08:58:44]

justinh:

Tanthrix: and all the cases I've read where thousands of users' details were 'stolen' was probably more due to software error than anything else. badly written net apps

[08:59:15]

hachi:

I only decided to ask you folks because 3/4 of the google pages I see about getting this to work are people saying "Well, I have my mythtv box hooked up to a TV..."

[08:59:17]

Tanthrix:

justinh: A lot of what I've seen is people walking off with laptops, or having them stolen out of their car

[08:59:22]

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[08:59:22]

justinh:

mistyped a URL & got all the customer details!

[08:59:37]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Can you return the TV? ;)

[08:59:42]

hachi:

nope

[08:59:46]

hachi:

not mine

[09:00:30]

justinh:

there are probably some 'hdtv' sets out there with all the right inputs, but which scale everythiing from a lower res than they claim to be, wouldn't surprise me one bit

[09:00:35]

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[09:01:40]

Tanthrix:

I'm not sure I'd take it that far, but it's certainly possible

[09:02:01]

Tanthrix:

Personally, I think we should find the creators of the EDID standard and stab them all in their sleep

[09:02:35]

hachi:

I don't think DVI uses EDID

[09:02:43]

justinh:

hachi: even VGA has EDID

[09:02:45]

Tanthrix:

You think they'd learn from the Y2K bug

[09:02:52]

hachi:

VGA has EDID, I thought DVI didn't

[09:02:53]

Tanthrix:

hachi: DVI most certainly does use EDID

[09:02:56]

hachi:

oh

[09:03:23]

justinh:

Tanthrix: what's been happening increasingly these days is that the word 'standard' has been meaning 'definitive' less & less

[09:03:26]

sn9:

Tanthrix: one day, an employee of a certain company was fired. the next, a mysterious floppy disk appeared at that company. it was infected with the Scores virus. the virus was designed to seek out two specific executables used exclusively in-house at this company and corrupt them. within months, computers around the world were infected, all without being connected to any internet

[09:03:26]

Tanthrix:

hachi: That's the whole problem. The brainacs who made the standard didn't allow for horizontal resolutions not divisible by 8. That's why all these 1366x768 sets don't work automatically

[09:04:07]

sn9:

can you say "collateral damage?" </mister rogers>

[09:04:18]

justinh:

better make tracks & go to work

[09:04:22]

hachi:

what really puzzles me is how my TV has a setting in it for 'input resolution'

[09:04:23]

Kazan:

DVI uses EDID... sometimes to my delight.. more often to my annoyance

[09:04:26]

Tanthrix:

hachi: It really is that simple of a problem in a lot of the cases. And knowing that, the sets aren't often designed to work at that resolution, but instead scale everything from 720p.

[09:04:32]

hachi:

and one of the items is 1366x768

[09:04:47]

hachi:

so I have to assume that there are timings somewhere to get this to work

[09:04:59]

Tanthrix:

hachi: 1080p sets are more or less immune to this, since 1920x1080P can be properly conveyed through EDID

[09:04:59]

Kazan:

most of them accept 1360x768

[09:05:04]

hachi:

I can adjust hsyncstart all I want but I can't get the damned thing to move left

[09:05:21]

rooaus:

Tanthrix: That is a hardware optimisation for gpu manufacturers I thought. There are later nvidia cards that can do non-mod8 hpix.

[09:05:23]

Tanthrix:

hachi: There's a nice little write up here if you're ever curious: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDID

[09:05:29]

Tanthrix:

sn9: Interesting.

[09:05:40]

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[09:06:48]

sn9:

Tanthrix: those were the days

[09:06:49]

Tanthrix:

I just can't even imagine how things can be so poorly engineered sometimes. It literally pains me to even think about it.

[09:06:57]

hachi:

augh

[09:07:06]

hachi:

wikipedia has a way to read DTD on windows and OSX

[09:07:11]

hachi:

but I don't see a way on linux :\

[09:07:42]

Tanthrix:

I can just imagine some engineers sitting around a table somewhere. "Think anyone will ever want a horizontal or vertical resolution not evenily divisible by 8?" ... ... "Nah, probably not. Let's not bother."

[09:07:56]

sn9:

Tanthrix: yes, the Scores virus was poorly engineered

[09:08:02]

** Tanthrix thinks summary executions all around would be a good idea **

[09:08:10]

Tanthrix:

sn9: Was talking about the EDID spec, actually.

[09:08:25]

Tanthrix:

sn9: That virus can't be too poorly engineered if it affected as many computers as you say it did

[09:08:45]

sn9:

Tanthrix: it was never intended to; that's my point

[09:09:05]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Happen to have a windows machine that you can plugin to the TV?

[09:09:15]

Tanthrix:

hachi: You could then use powerstrip to probably get the info you need

[09:09:16]

sn9:

it was only supposed to corrupt two stupid files!

[09:09:30]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Assuming your TV can even do what you want it to do, which is no gurantee

[09:09:31]

hachi:

mebbie... hurrr

[09:09:48]

rooaus:

Tanthrix: Or deciding how they can encode the required information into the tiny ee devices available at the time.

[09:10:17]

Tanthrix:

hachi: http://www.entechtaiwan.net/util/ps.shtm

[09:10:49]

Tanthrix:

rooaus: I know that I am simplifying things a bit, but regardless of how difficult it may have been, it's an amazingly huge flaw

[09:11:33]

Tanthrix:

hachi: Never done it myself, but I've seen lots of instances where people's only recourse was to use that program to create the modeline they needed

[09:11:43]

rooaus:

Tanthrix: The real issue is they didn't allow for the extension of the standard, I believe the extensions were a bit of a hack. :)

[09:13:15]

rooaus:

hachi: Tanthrix is right, powerstrip is the best course of action (imho). It may even have canned modelines for the TMDS receiver your tv uses.

[09:13:36]

hachi:

I'm giving it a shot

[09:15:05]

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[09:15:35]

sn9:

heh, i left the livetv on — tcm is showing WarGames now. the script has become hilarious after all this time

[09:17:15]

rooaus:

iamlindoro: Paul committed a fix for the miniplayer in [15382] I think it will fix your external player probs. Could you update #4222 if it does fix it (or let me know and I will). Cheers.

[09:18:13]

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[09:29:49]

Kazan:

bah

[09:29:54]

Kazan:

is there a way to disable the upnp garbage

[09:30:04]

Kazan:

i find no matter what piece of software it is.. upnp=unstable

[09:30:16]

sn9:

in myth?

[09:30:28]

Kazan:

yeah... i don't even want to compile it in

[09:30:46]

Kazan:

every application on every platform i've ever used that touches upnp is going to crash

[09:31:37]

hachi:

O_o

[09:32:09]

hachi:

that's strange, I haven't had trouble with fuppes or mythtv, or my router, or azureus, or the upnp stuff I've written

[09:32:18]

tjcarter:

http://www.zestuff.com/tshirts/vgcats/27/ <-- they don't have my size. =(

[09:32:21]

hachi:

I think I had issues a few years ago with it

[09:32:21]

** tjcarter want. **

[09:32:27]

hachi:

but not anymore

[09:32:50]

hachi:

Kazan: wouldn't it be a better use of your time to just leave upnp on until you have a problem?

[09:33:37]

Kazan:

hachi: i DO have a problem

[09:33:40]

hachi:

tjcarter: wow... only black... that sucks

[09:34:06]

tjcarter:

hachi: only L

[09:34:13]

Kazan:

frontend is less stable than the tacoma narrows bridge

[09:34:18]

tjcarter:

hachi: L is for small people. I am not a small people.

[09:34:28]

tjcarter:

hachi: and dark blue would also be appropriate =D

[09:34:37]

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[09:34:44]

hachi:

yeah black is so 2007

[14:40:58]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot

[14:41:13]

TheJuice:

never mind

[14:41:20]

TheJuice:

didnt read all the way down :-x

[14:41:27]

TheJuice:

thanks for all the help tho

[14:42:53]

Beirdo:

stupid linode rebooted?!

[14:43:23]

directhex|bsp:

it's Beirdo!

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[15:08:18]

Kazan|ZZzfinally:

morning

[15:08:21]

Kazan|ZZzfinally is now known as Kazan

[15:08:24]

TheJuice:

good morning

[15:08:34]

TheJuice:

i have a nice morning question for u :-D

[15:09:00]

TheJuice:

my mysql.txt on my FE only machine is not there

[15:09:06]

TheJuice:

:-x

[15:09:17]

TheJuice:

is it supposed to be or am i supposed to create it

[15:10:27]

Kazan:

NO SURE

[15:10:35]

Kazan:

NEVER MUCH HAD TO CONCERN MYSELF WITH IT'S EXISTANCE OR NON-EXISTANCE

[15:11:12]

TheJuice:

NVM

[15:11:14]

TheJuice:

found it

[15:11:18]

Kazan:

lol sry

[15:11:22]

Kazan:

capslock

[15:11:43]

TheJuice:

lol

[15:11:44]

Kazan:

was typing without looking and didn't know about the capslock

[15:12:17]

TheJuice:

should the hostname be an IP or can it be like user.place.com

[15:13:01]

Kazan:

could be either i believe

[15:13:06]

Kazan:

my hostname is a name

[15:13:07]

Kazan:

thorin

[15:13:21]

Kazan:

*grumbles*.... why is frontend so fscking unstable

[15:13:37]

TheJuice:

if i installed frontend only, should i have mythtv-setup

[15:13:41]

TheJuice:

cause i dont :(

[15:14:14]

Kazan:

wtf

[15:14:14]

directhex|bsp:

no, mythtv-setup configures BE

[15:14:22]

Kazan:

did you install backend?

[15:14:33]

TheJuice:

yea on a diff computer

[15:14:38]

TheJuice:

and it works fine

[15:14:38]

GreyFoxx:

TheJuice: Just install both on each computer

[15:14:47]

GreyFoxx:

you don't need to actually run the backend on the frontend

[15:14:57]

TheJuice:

hm

[15:14:59]

TheJuice:

tru

[15:15:00]

Kazan:

directhex|bsp: any clue as to why frontend would segfault constantly on a compile from scratch

[15:15:12]

quicksilver:

you can always run mythtv-setup on the other machine

[15:15:20]

quicksilver:

using remote X, one way or another

[15:15:24]

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[15:15:34]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Segfaults at startup or while doing something after the menus are drawn ?

[15:15:49]

Kazan:

both

[15:15:53]

GreyFoxx:

tried to grab a backtrace? What version/if svn what revision?

[15:15:57]

TheJuice:

well the FE is trying to connect to the BE on localhost but i thought i set it to the BE ont he other computer

[15:16:08]

Kazan:

Library API version : 0.21.20071211–1

[15:16:10]

TheJuice:

er i did

[15:16:14]

Kazan:

SVN Branch : trunk

[15:16:20]

Kazan:

Source code version : 15388M

[15:16:34]

Kazan:

i have --enable-proc-opts on... can i still get backtraces?

[15:16:48]

TheJuice:

where else besides mysql.txt do i have do tell the FE the IP of the BE

[15:17:01]

GreyFoxx:

Hmm I've never used that option so I honestly do know how that effects a backtrace

[15:17:26]

GreyFoxx:

TheJuice: mysql.txt just gives mysql connection info, not specific to the backend process itself

[15:17:34]

TheJuice:

arg

[15:17:35]

GreyFoxx:

It can be in one of several locations

[15:17:35]

Kazan:

you've never enabled cpu optimizations?

[15:17:36]

Kazan:

*boggle*

[15:17:54]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: I've had no reason to use --enable-proc-opts

[15:18:03]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: hm

[15:18:27]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: some system info – Athlon 64 X2 4200+, 1GB DDR2–800, FC7 64-bit

[15:18:29]

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[15:18:41]

Kazan:

frontend really doesn't like starting up.. likes segfaulting on startup a lot

[15:18:53]

GreyFoxx:

though hold on, I'll login to home to verify that. These days I just do a tail 1 config.log | sh rather than redoing the ./configure line

[15:19:00]

GreyFoxx:

I might have added it a long itme ago and just forgot

[15:19:12]

Dibblah:

--enable-proc-opts does allow backtraces.

[15:19:26]

Dibblah:

Exact line numbers, etc will probably be incorrect,

[15:19:31]

Kazan:

also have a video playback issue on hd sized frames

[15:19:59]

GreyFoxx:

yup I do have that flag. Musta put it in a long time ago and just forgotten

[15:20:03]

Dibblah:

registers may actually not contain what they 'should' at the point of a crash, so it might misdirect troubleshooting.

[15:20:30]

Dibblah:

GreyFoxx: configure --prev is actually what you want ;)

[15:20:33]

Kazan:

the problem other than segfault – on HD sized frames one of the color fields is vertically offset down by a set number of pixels – the entire image including the OSD overlay

[15:20:50]

GreyFoxx:

Dibblah: I've been doing it this way long before prev came in. It's just habit now :)

[15:22:26]

Dibblah:

Fick. 35 instances of kcalc.

[15:22:27]

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[15:22:34]

Dibblah:

Thank goodness it's not Windows ;)

[15:22:34]

Kazan:

lol

[15:23:00]

Dibblah:

Having the calc button on the keyboard bound is nice for quick stuff. But...

[15:23:28]

Kazan:

hmm... trac search for "calc_hue_base" is turning up nothing in changesets.. wtf?

[15:25:36]

GreyFoxx:

doh, just realized the that the new upnp media builder stuff doesn't take into account people with multiple videodirs defined in VideoStartupDir

[15:26:18]

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[15:26:56]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: happens.... got any idea about my XVideo ghosting problem that only appears to show up on hd sized frames

[15:27:53]

Kazan:

really it's not ghosting.. one of the color channels appears to be misaligned downward by about i'd say 50px (before scaling)

[15:28:00]

justinh:

any UK peeps happen to know the name of the doccy on C4 a while ago which alleged t#how close Russia came to launching a full scale nuke strike on the West?

[15:29:48]

** GreyFoxx fakes 10000 files to test **

[15:29:56]

ivor:

justinh: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/article . . . page_id=1770 ?

[15:29:59]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: hmmmm

[15:30:24]

GreyFoxx:

I've seen a minor scaling/shift recently which was caused by 2 things

[15:30:48]

GreyFoxx:

1 a bug where if you scaling info was defined in your databsae myth would default to 5% which triggered a bug in the nvidia drivers

[15:30:53]

Kazan:

on SD sized frames it seems fine

[15:30:59]

Kazan:

ATI drivers

[15:31:01]

ivor:

justinh: "1983: The Brink Of Apocalypse is on Channel 4 on Saturday January 5"

[15:31:09]

GreyFoxx:

caused a minor gleenline at the bottom of the screen and slight shifting of the laters

[15:31:15]

GreyFoxx:

so the edges of stuff would have a blue/red tint

[15:31:16]

justinh:

duh

[15:31:21]

justinh:

cheers ivor

[15:31:33]

Kazan:

this is more than minor.. appears to be the blue channel – the entire image from that channel is translated down

[15:31:40]

Kazan:

so it's misaligned with the other channels

[15:31:57]

GreyFoxx:

Can't say I've run into that. Got any screenshots or "real" pics of it?

[15:32:00]

ivor:

Kazan: there was a commit about that recently

[15:32:13]

ivor:

wonder if it was just for non-hd logic... 2 secs let me browse

[15:32:22]

justinh:

blimmin show that appears to be slightly interesting & it's only one once. ffs

[15:32:26]

justinh:

*on once

[15:32:34]

Kazan:

ivor: cool, ty for looking

[15:32:41]

Kazan:

i'm looking at the revision log of videoout_xv.cpp

[15:32:55]

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[15:32:57]

tzanger:

good morning

[15:33:02]

GreyFoxx:

looks at videoout_base.cpp too

[15:33:09]

GreyFoxx:

err look I mean

[15:33:21]

Kazan:

hmm

[15:33:26]

justinh:

hmm I thought my box was sposed to be keeping 7 days of old epg data

[15:33:36]

Kazan:

let's see what happens if i set "BrokenI420Hack"

[15:33:55]

tzanger:

I have an upcoming recording "stuck" in the system. it is from yesterday and it showing that it is still recording, but it isn't (I have recorded more shows since this one) — which table is this entry stuck in? I can't find it in record, record_tmp or about a half dozen others I've guessed at

[15:33:56]

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[15:33:59]

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[15:34:02]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Is that still therE?!?!?

[15:34:06]

GreyFoxx:

I thought that was removed

[15:34:11]

Kazan:

oh wait.. it was just pulled out

[15:34:25]

GreyFoxx:

yeah, I made it a db setting, and later it was removed

[15:34:30]

Kazan:

duuuh. i'm a retard... red color in a trac view of a changset :D

[15:34:46]

Kazan:

do you know what "calc_hue_base" does?

[15:34:51]

Kazan:

i have a sneaky suspicion that it's related

[15:34:56]

GreyFoxx:

justinh: should mythappearance be showing up in the regular menus now?

[15:35:04]

Kazan:

though the reported XVideo adapter name is "ATI Radeon AVIVO Video"

[15:35:04]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: should be yeah

[15:35:07]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Nope :/

[15:35:19]

GreyFoxx:

justinh: hmmm It's not showing up in mine, updated about 20 minutes ago

[15:35:22]

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[15:35:34]

GreyFoxx:

Using the classic menu view though so it might be related to that

[15:35:36]

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[15:36:16]

GreyFoxx:

Ok, I see it under the default view, but not anywhere under Classic

[15:36:31]

justinh:

I committed it to classic

[15:36:44]

justinh:

frankly I'm still amazed anybody uses the classic theme

[15:37:05]

Kazan:

oh.. calc_hue_base corrects an off color it appears

[15:37:06]

GreyFoxx:

I never liked the newer ones :)

[15:37:24]

** J-e-f-f-A-work Yeah!!!. UPnP is working well in Trunk 15336 !!! **

[15:37:25]

justinh:

can't make head nor tail of 'DVR'

[15:37:49]

justinh:

'default' seems the most logical to me

[15:37:50]

Kazan:

ivar: find that change yet?

[15:37:50]

GreyFoxx:

me either

[15:38:01]

tzanger:

I have an upcoming recording "stuck" in the system. it is from yesterday and it showing that it is still recording, but it isn't (I have recorded more shows since this one) — which table is this entry stuck in? I can't find it in record, record_tmp or about a half dozen others I've guessed at

[15:38:04]

Kazan:

yeah.. wish i could turn off upnp from even being compiled

[15:38:05]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: heh

[15:38:21]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: anyway I was gonna say that'd be why there's not been a bug report for it – nobody's used it yet! ;)

[15:38:30]

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[15:38:44]

GreyFoxx:

hehe

[15:38:57]

ivor:

Kazan: damnit, can't find it. I'm sure I browsed a change to yuv type logic recently....

[15:39:01]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: for a while (previous svn versions) would either not work, or only work for the first UPnP device to connect... Excellent progress! ;-)

[15:39:19]

GreyFoxx:

hmmm it wouldn't let me get to 800x600. smallest I got get was 800x669

[15:39:41]

Kazan:

ivar: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/14692/tr . . . eoout_xv.cpp ?

[15:39:45]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: What are you using as a upnp client(s) ?

[15:39:50]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: only allows 25% adjustment

[15:40:06]

justinh:

I figured that'd enough

[15:40:23]

GreyFoxx:

I was just using it to resize it for my work desktop

[15:40:30]

justinh:

! lol

[15:40:30]

Kazan:

anyway to tell which format is being selected by frontend?

[15:41:00]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: I've got a couple of Avel LinkPlayer2's (HD w/DVD), a Buffalo LinkTheatre (HD w/DVD), and a music player – Linksys WSML11A (iirc...)

[15:41:02]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Teah, the frontend will spit out a message about the colour space it uses

[15:41:22]

GreyFoxx:

Might have to use -v plackback, but it's

[15:41:22]

Kazan:

greyfoxx: it's not right now.. so i need to set verbose?

[15:41:24]

GreyFoxx:

in there

[15:41:42]

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[15:41:55]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: ... and FF/REW work now. nice ;-)

[15:42:03]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[15:42:15]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: it'd be a dead easy fix – but it's only intended to be a widget to help adjust for overscan

[15:42:22]

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[15:42:44]

GreyFoxx:

I've been mostly working on the video portion at the moment, gonna look at the rest at some point

[15:43:27]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: Any way to 'enhance' the watching of a currently-recording program with a UPnP to not end at the point it was recorded up to when you start to watch it?

[15:43:33]

justinh:

has there been any mention of mythappearance from the upper eschelons? good/bad/indifferent?

[15:43:38]

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[15:43:55]

Kazan:

greyfoxx: i just started with -v all... oh help me

[15:44:02]

Kazan:

and it segfaults affter getting data from settings

[15:44:04]

Kazan:

hm

[15:44:08]

GreyFoxx:

justinh: Nothing specific I've seen other than some "it's about time we had something like that" heh

[15:44:19]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Pastebin it ?

[15:44:44]

Kazan:

hold on.. i need to redirect output to a file next time

[15:44:45]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A-work: even my mythfrontend grinds to a halt and exits when it hits the end of an active recording!

[15:44:52]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: that's cool. so the death-bots aren't gonna hunt me down cos it doesn't use mythui yet.. ;)

[15:44:55]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: Actually that is doable assuming the client cooperates

[15:45:01]

GreyFoxx:

justinh: hardly :)

[15:45:21]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: Infact there is a comment in the code describing just what needs to be done to make that work heh

[15:45:37]

justinh:

actually worried about the code side of it not being up to scratch too

[15:45:55]

justinh:

bit late for that since I committed it myself :P

[15:46:01]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[15:46:15]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: Could it be accomplished by 'lying' to the client about the length of the recording... IE: If it's an hour-long program, even though only20 mins have recorded, tell it that it's an hour long... and if it requests a position > the live point, just jump to a few secs before... (just a thought...)

[15:46:20]

Kazan:

oh.. wow

[15:46:26]

Kazan:

o.. this HD program doesn't have any problems

[15:46:29]

Kazan:

hmm

[15:46:49]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

GreyFoxx: I'll take a look at it... My C++ skills aren't that sharp at the moment. I'm a better engineer! ;-)

[15:46:55]

Kazan:

this other one does though.. i know it's NOT a corrupt recording because i played it on my old machine/install and it was fine

[15:47:03]

Kazan:

i believe one is 720p and the other 1080i though

[15:47:06]

justinh:

I'm a better themer than I am a coder but there's no harm in trying

[15:47:30]

clever:

i can write c++ but it may not be pretty:P

[15:47:30]

justinh:

ugh why has this box forgot its MAC ID?

[15:47:37]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: The proper way is to update the content-length during HTTPRequest::SendResponseFile

[15:48:03]

clever:

GreyFoxx: but the client end would need to understand that

[15:48:12]

justinh:

save its MAC ID, enquire its MAC ID. fine. reset it. read the MAC ID. blank. oops

[15:48:13]

clever:

how is seeking handled?

[15:48:20]

GreyFoxx:

clever: They are suppose to

[15:48:26]

clever:

does the client ask for a byte pos or a second offset?

[15:48:33]

GreyFoxx:

byte position

[15:48:35]

clever:

ah

[15:48:51]

clever:

and is the seek table all at the start of the file or slowly spread over it?

[15:49:02]

GreyFoxx:

they ask for range 0–100 and we respond with 0–100/maxsize

[15:49:09]

clever:

the seek table the client has cached may not be valid for parts past the 'end'

[15:49:12]

GreyFoxx:

so maxsizeneeds to be updated as the file grows

[15:49:26]

clever:

ahh sounds like the byte-range in http

[15:49:29]

GreyFoxx:

clever: If it's mpeg it's just pts all over

[15:49:36]

GreyFoxx:

clever: upnp is basically http

[15:49:39]

clever:

yeah

[15:49:40]

GreyFoxx:

and http over udp

[15:50:01]

Kazan:

2.9MiB log to pastebin

[15:50:21]

clever:

normaly only the last few lines are realy needed

[15:50:30]

Kazan:

normally

[15:50:32]

GreyFoxx:

J-e-f-f-A: It is be doable using what I just described. Can't tes4tit from here though

[15:50:41]

Kazan:

but i need to pull some information that are not right at the end as well

[15:51:05]

jarle:

Looking through my channel table I have some channels with strange channum field: SOme channels have empty channum and some actually have the name of the channel in the channum field, is this really normal???

[15:51:16]

i3ooi3oo:

Damn i feel like i am back a week, remote recompile and setup

[15:52:08]

mkrufky:

Kazan: you were asking me about hvr1800 support a few weeks (months?) ago

[15:52:36]

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[15:52:47]

djc_:

Hey

[15:52:48]

mkrufky:

Kazan: digital is 100% ready now, and is included in 2.6.24, analog is almost ready, devel repository is hosted on linuxtv.org, and should be merged in time for 2.6.26

[15:53:13]

mkrufky:

Kazan: analog, including support for the cx23417 mpeg encoder *and* preview video

[15:53:14]

GreyFoxx:

is 2.6.24 out now ?

[15:53:23]

mkrufky:

2.6.24 will be out probably in a matter of days

[15:53:27]

mkrufky:

thats just my guess

[15:53:34]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, Ive been meaning for a while now to get back with you on that empty file problem with the network recorder

[15:53:49]

Kazan:

mkrufky: yes i was, and it came up last night, thanks for the update

[15:54:08]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: well.. it appears all three (SD, 720p, 1080i) are using YV12

[15:54:22]

mkrufky:

Kazan: you're welcome... came up last night in this channel's logs?

[15:54:23]

djc_:

Logs been running the way you suggested for weeks now.. and there have definitely been instances of it happening.. I just gotta quick find a recent one..

[15:54:29]

Kazan:

you'd think in all the spew that mythfrontend -v all gives you.. it would tell me which video is playing

[15:54:41]

Kazan:

mkrufky: yes this channel, we talked about the hvr 1800 and the 1600

[15:54:54]

Kazan:

it's kinda funny.. a 1800 is cheaper than a pvr-500

[15:55:02]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: hehe actually I was thinking fo adding that

[15:55:29]

mkrufky:

ah, 1600 is ready now, too ... just didnt merge yet

[15:55:36]

djc_:

I gotta go upstairs and find the most recent empty ones so I can find them in the log..

[15:55:36]

tzanger:

I have an upcoming recording "stuck" in the system. it is from yesterday and it showing that it is still recording, but it isn't (I have recorded more shows since this one) — which table is this entry stuck in? I can't find it in record, record_tmp or about a half dozen others I've guessed at

[15:55:44]

i3ooi3oo:

1600 has support now ?

[15:57:12]

jarle:

tzanger: where do you see that it is still recording, in the frontend or in mythweb?

[15:57:16]

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[15:57:17]

Kezza491:

Hi

[15:57:19]

tzanger:

mythweb

[15:57:20]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: so... here is what we got... SD frames (720x480) work fine, HD 720p (1280x720) are fine, HD 1080i (1920x1088) have one channel (Blue i think) shifted down by a bunh of PX

[15:57:28]

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[15:57:28]

Kazan:

including the OSD being affected by that shift

[15:58:11]

justinh:

mkrufky: that was pretty quick work :) amazing :D

[15:58:19]

jarle:

tzanger: I have seen this too, When I went to the status page it told me it was not recording, and it was not showing up in the frontend. I think it just went away by itself...

[15:58:21]

mkrufky:

i3ooi3oo: yes, the driver is located @ http://linuxtv.org/hg/~hverkuil/cx18

[15:58:32]

Kezza491:

Every time i start up my mythfrontend it keeps asking me to "select a default myth backend server" is there away i can make it connect to a server every time by default with out asking me?

[15:58:36]

mkrufky:

i3ooi3oo: except that apache on linuxtv.org seems to be down right now

[15:58:41]

Kazan:

all are using YV12

[15:58:52]

Kazan:

mkrufky: so how has hauppauge been treating you

[15:59:06]

mkrufky:

very well :-D

[15:59:29]

Kazan:

cool

[15:59:30]

mkrufky:

justinh: i didnt do 1600 — that was hans verkuil — the ivtv maintainer

[15:59:38]

clever:

my pvr-150 has been eating way less cpu then the framegrabber

[15:59:43]

mkrufky:

and he's been working on it all year :-)

[15:59:46]

clever:

but im stuck with a very old ivtv driver so vbi is busted

[16:00:01]

mkrufky:

and ive been working on the tda18271 tuner (on the hvr1800) all year

[16:00:28]

GreyFoxx:

Kezza491: add -d to the commandline

[16:00:43]

GreyFoxx:

it will skip the prompt and use one you found before

[16:00:46]

Kezza491:

Ok i wil give that a shot

[16:00:47]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, I'm not sure how much context might be relevant, there was a recording sched for today that shows in the library, but gives 'file could not be found' when one tries to play it.. there are about 1000 lines of log between just before it was supposed to start and just after was to end...

[16:00:53]

justinh:

mkrufky: still though, fast work :)

[16:00:54]

i3ooi3oo:

I would have bought on 2 weeks ago but i left the store and looked it up on linuxtv.org and it wasn't supported. Too bad now i will have to wait till next month for it.

[16:01:13]

Kezza491:

Ahh yes it dose thanks GreyFoxx

[16:01:27]

GreyFoxx:

djc_: yours were the IPTV streams right? Randomly getting 0 byte recordings ?

[16:01:39]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, yeah, actually I think there isnt any file at all

[16:01:44]

clever:

GreyFoxx: i often get the frontend claiming 0byte recordings

[16:01:45]

mkrufky:

justinh: yes

[16:01:52]

clever:

GreyFoxx: and then refusing to play it at all

[16:01:56]

clever:

GreyFoxx: with inprogress recordings

[16:02:14]

clever:

exiting to the menu then back into the recording list clears its memory of that and fixes it

[16:02:16]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, lemme stick that log somewhere you can grab it

[16:02:24]

mkrufky:

i3ooi3oo: just as well... perhaps it might work _better_ next month, anyway ... oh, digital on the hvr1600 isnt supported yet

[16:02:46]

mkrufky:

but it will be soon... just need to write a new driver for the maxlinear tuner

[16:02:50]

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[16:03:54]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, http://jupiter.unwet.com/logexcerpt.txt

[16:04:08]

djc_:

the show in question is the 'Jimmy Neutron' one

[16:04:14]

djc_:

run from 9:30 to 10:00

[16:04:21]

i3ooi3oo:

well the only digital around it through the Cable company and they are now offering PC cards (like pcmciabut not ) but i can't find any linux support

[16:04:28]

Kazan:

wee segfault on trying to start video

[16:04:38]

Kazan:

soon as i figure out this xvideo bug i really need to go ballistic on this segfault

[16:05:26]

Kazan:

yeah it's the blue channel out of alignment

[16:05:30]

djc_:

actually there was one from 9:00 to 9:30 too, which also had the same problem.. but the log is from just before 930 to 1000

[16:06:18]

Kazan:

meng wth

[16:06:30]

tzanger:

hmm, mythweb references QUERY_GETALLPENDING but I can't find where that is defined

[16:06:32]

janneg:

i3ooi3oo: Common Access modules (CAM)?

[16:06:34]

Kazan:

i'm getting lots of stuttering as well

[16:06:48]

mkrufky:

i3ooi3oo: hvr1500q supports digital and analog in expresscard form factor

[16:06:54]

Kazan:

my CPU usage is very low

[16:07:00]

mkrufky:

....and is supported :-)

[16:07:25]

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[16:08:05]

i3ooi3oo:

Cable Cards mainly for Tvio i guess

[16:10:18]

djc_:

BTW, apparently at least one other person found my patch in ticket 3873 useful

[16:10:52]

djc_:

and they were asking *me* if it was going to be included in svn, as if I would know... :P

[16:10:52]

squidly:

djc_: what was the path for?

[16:11:01]

djc_:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/3873

[16:11:11]

i3ooi3oo:

http://cfl.mybrighthouse.com/customer_care/pr . . . default.aspx <- from what i have read (be it a little) they contain the decryption key and such

[16:11:15]

djc_:

multiple iptv recordings

[16:11:24]

squidly:

ahh

[16:11:48]

djc_:

myth binding * instead of a specific multicast port

[16:11:54]

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[16:12:05]

djc_:

so multiple 'network' capture cards streams would commingle resulting in both being useless

[16:12:20]

squidly:

djc_: yea that would be an issue

[16:12:51]

Kazan:

meng... why do i always have problems :D

[16:13:11]

djc_:

not sure how to put it on track to be included into the trunk

[16:14:21]

GreyFoxx:

djc_: It's assigned to me. It's just a matter of my having time to test it that's all

[16:14:36]

djc_:

Oh!..

[16:14:56]

GreyFoxx:

it looks fine so I don't see any reason it wont get in

[16:14:59]

djc_:

Thats good then I guess. Didnt realize you were one of the annonted ones

[16:15:11]

GreyFoxx:

<< greg who the ticket is assigned too :)

[16:15:19]

djc_:

nod

[16:15:59]

djc_:

I suspect my no-file-found recording problem might be related to the same bug that was causing the BE to lock up

[16:16:38]

djc_:

the one with this patch: – m_freeboxchannels.clear();

[16:17:05]

djc_:

just a gut feeling.. somehow instead of locking up its just not recording anymore

[16:17:28]

GreyFoxx:

I've done hundreds of recordings with that one applied and never had a 0 byte recording

[16:17:41]

djc_:

even with multiple iptv recorders?

[16:17:45]

GreyFoxx:

yup

[16:17:50]

GreyFoxx:

I would do up to 8 at a time

[16:17:53]

djc_:

hrm.. ok.. well.. i could be wrong then :P

[16:18:00]

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[16:18:11]

GreyFoxx:

but I really need to try and track down what is causing the lockup that patch avoids in the first place

[16:18:19]

djc_:

unless perhaps its related to a difference in the service provider/transmitter

[16:19:22]

djc_:

unless perhaps its a weird interaction between that bug and *my* patch ;P

[16:19:37]

GreyFoxx:

hehe

[16:19:39]

GreyFoxx:

maybe

[16:20:08]

djc_:

in any case, im sure the tracking down of it is far above my level of knowledge

[16:20:38]

djc_:

in fact im asonished I was even able to come up with the patch that I did

[16:20:50]

djc_:

pure blundering around randomly

[16:20:57]

directhex|bsp:

i3ooi3oo, cablecard will never be supported by myth

[16:21:02]

GreyFoxx:

that's how I prefer to do it :)

[16:21:11]

djc_:

thats... scary

[16:21:13]

djc_:

:P

[16:21:16]

GreyFoxx:

hehh ;)

[16:21:29]

i3ooi3oo:

that sucks

[16:21:42]

Kazan:

heh... i hadn't made the rlimits changes for RT threads yet

[16:21:45]

Kazan:

let's see how it behaves now

[16:21:52]

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[16:22:05]

Kazan:

grrr

[16:22:07]

Kazan:

segfault

[16:22:12]

djc_:

GreyFoxx, you catch that url for my log excerpt?

[16:22:13]

Kazan:

stupid random segfaults

[16:22:27]

GreyFoxx:

oops no

[16:22:39]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: where you able to get a bt ?

[16:22:42]

djc_:

http://jupiter.unwet.com/logexcerpt.txt

[16:23:29]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: how would i go about getting one :P you never said that

[16:23:40]

Kazan:

would ffmpeg or libmpeg2 be better on athlon 64 x2?

[16:23:47]

GreyFoxx:

Kaza:

[16:23:53]

GreyFoxx:

"gdb mythfrontend"

[16:23:59]

Kazan:

getting some prebuffer puases that i wouldn't expect to happen while decoding 720p

[16:24:01]

GreyFoxx:

then after it starts type "run"

[16:24:16]

GreyFoxx:

when it crashes type "thread apply all bt full"

[16:24:19]

Kazan:

kk

[16:24:27]

GreyFoxx:

of course you want logs of all outputs from both :)

[16:24:46]

Kazan:

grrr

[16:24:59]

GreyFoxx:

one cheat is to use "script"

[16:25:00]

Kazan:

why is my performance so low on such a high end system with such low CPU usage

[16:25:04]

Kazan:

*Coughs* onboard audio?

[16:25:50]

justinh:

hmmm our (sh)IT dept still have the laser printer in bits

[16:26:01]

djc_:

bits?

[16:26:03]

clever:

lol

[16:26:20]

djc_:

I remember bits.. we had to clean them out of the chaff box on the paper tape punch

[16:26:34]

djc_:

but if theyve got your laser printer that far, theres probably no hope

[16:26:37]

Kazan:

no debugging systems found

[16:26:57]

clever:

i think you mean symbols

[16:27:01]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Ahhh you need to do a debug compile

[16:27:01]

Kazan:

yeah

[16:27:07]

Kazan:

hands and brain get desynced alot

[16:27:08]

GreyFoxx:

--compile-type=debug

[16:27:13]

djc_:

justdave, perhaps you should consider saving to paper tape instead of laser print?

[16:27:15]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: I know the feeling

[16:27:16]

Kazan:

baah you know how many facking times i've compiled myth now

[16:27:37]

clever:

i just run a debug build on every system!

[16:27:54]

djc_:

er.. 'justdave"

[16:27:55]

djc_:

wtf

[16:27:58]

clever:

and the way i have it setup i only need to compile it twice to upgrade every system

[16:28:07]

djc_:

damn nick completion

[16:28:17]

justinh:

damn lazy IRC users

[16:28:18]

DarK:

is there a working (!) guide on how to setup the remote of a Haupauge WinTV PVR-150 (grey remote with 4 colored buttons on the bottom)

[16:28:36]

clever:

DarK: i managed to do it with little work

[16:28:39]

justinh:

DarK: which one?

[16:28:43]

djc_:

well im used to bash completion, where if there are multiple matches it prompts you rather than just taking one randmly

[16:28:45]

DarK:

Im using mythbuntu

[16:28:46]

clever:

DarK: bigest problem was just getting the ir cord plug to fit

[16:28:54]

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[16:29:16]

clever:

DarK: pluging it in with the card out and in your hands gives you an idea of how much force you need

[16:29:23]

DarK:

clever: if the reciever is a red light, then all is fine?

[16:29:27]

clever:

which i thought was it hitting the edge of the opening for the pci slot

[16:29:39]

djc_:

Force? what does The Force have to do with anything

[16:29:48]

clever:

there should be no visible light from the receiver/blaster

[16:29:55]

djc_:

and I hope you are using the good side rather than the dark side

[16:30:05]

clever:

djc_: the plug needs a fair ammount of mechanical force to get it to fit the last mm

[16:30:17]

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[16:30:21]

djc_:

clever, schwing

[16:30:23]

peoples:

hey guys .. :)

[16:30:27]

clever:

;p

[16:30:27]

DarK:

hmm...what guide did u follow clever ?

[16:30:41]

clever:

DarK: i had allready ready 500 guides getting my serial blaster going

[16:30:44]

djc_:

"The Force" you know, from Star Wars? I was being flippant

[16:30:46]

justinh:

clever doesn;t follow any guide

[16:30:52]

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[16:30:55]

clever:

djc_: i know i have several boxed sets of it!

[16:30:59]

justinh:

clever wrote all the books in the world

[16:31:08]

clever:

justinh: i just merge all the guides in my head and wing it:P

[16:31:16]

DarK:

you're good

[16:31:25]

justinh:

several boxed sets of Star Wars? there've only been like 3 films worth watching though

[16:31:41]

clever:

i dont remember exactly how many i have

[16:31:45]

justinh:

or 0 if you have any taste

[16:31:55]

clever:

and i dont think the dvd table in mysql has been updated to contain them

[16:32:08]

justinh:

I heard a rumour the unretouched (i.e just restored) versions were gonna come out

[16:32:30]

peoples:

i've updated my mythtv to 0.21 and now i'm not possible to update my epg data with mythfilldatabase

[16:32:35]

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[16:32:41]

peoples:

with .20 --> mythfilldatabase --update --mark-repeats --no-delete --file 1 -1 epg.data

[16:32:44]

peoples:

works fine

[16:32:49]

justinh:

I think Lucas would have to die before that happened though, unless I'm wrong & it _had_ happened already

[16:33:00]

justinh:

0.21 isn't out yet

[16:33:17]

peoples:

with 0.21 error : illegal option 'epg.data'

[16:33:32]

justinh:

sounds like you have mixed up versions

[16:33:58]

justinh:

did you forget to remove the old packages before compiling trunk?

[16:34:07]

Kazan:

justinh:i think trunk reports itself as .21

[16:34:32]

clever:

Library API version : 0.21.20071211–1

[16:34:33]

clever:

trunk

[16:34:37]

clever:

Source code version : 15358M

[16:34:45]

justinh:

fucking smartarses

[16:34:49]

directhex|bsp:

i3ooi3oo, blame the hardware companies. the global equivalent, CAM, has been supported for ages

[16:34:50]

clever:

peoples: check mythfilldatabase --version

[16:34:55]

justinh:

it's not 0.21 though

[16:35:06]

clever:

peoples: is it also the same version as mythbackend --version

[16:35:07]

justinh:

still trunk

[16:35:10]

peoples:

justinh: i'm on kubuntu and removed old installation with apt-get remove

[16:35:14]

Kazan:

building debug

[16:35:22]

justinh:

apt-get remove --purge ftw :)

[16:35:36]

peoples:

illegal option: '--version' (use --hel

[16:35:36]

LabMonkey:

anyone know how to turn off the heartbeat in lcdproc 0.5.x?

[16:36:31]

justinh:

peoples: try 'locate mythfilldatabase' & see how many you got

[16:36:44]

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[16:36:53]

clever:

justinh: if he updated myth recently the updatedb may not be up to date:P

[16:37:15]

justinh:

what the feck are you talking about?

[16:37:30]

peoples:

clever: mythfilldatabase dosn't know --version

[16:37:37]

clever:

if he just installed trunk today the database that 'locate' uses may not be up to date

[16:37:41]

peoples:

clever: only 1 mythfilldatabase

[16:37:44]

clever:

peoples: yeah i saw that

[16:37:46]

Kazan:

*sighs*

[16:37:56]

justinh:

which mythfilldatabase – see if it agrees with which mythbackend

[16:37:59]

Kazan:

xvideo corruption on 1920x1088 frames, and segfaulting.... and poor performance

[16:38:00]

clever:

peoples: try 'type mythfilldatabase' or 'which mythfilldatabase' and see if it reports the same one

[16:38:03]

Kazan:

when will the problems end

[16:38:14]

GreyFoxx:

1088 frames? not 1080 ?

[16:38:29]

GreyFoxx:

now that sounds familiar for some reason

[16:38:40]

clever:

he said frames not pixels:P

[16:39:02]

GreyFoxx:

yes, but he means each frame consists of 1920x1088 pixels

[16:39:03]

Kazan:

1920x1088 is the "real size" of the MPEG2 stream

[16:39:14]

peoples:

clever: both the same

[16:39:15]

clever:

didnt read it right

[16:39:37]

Kazan:

"pixel" was implied :P "1920 px by 1088 px frames"

[16:39:47]

clever:

peoples: doesnt sound like there are several mythfilldatabase's

[16:40:05]

Kazan:

480i, 720p ... both are fine... 1080i results in the blue channel being shifted downward (video image and osd)

[16:40:20]

Kazan:

plus i'm getting prebuffering pauses like nobody's business on a machine that is much faster than the old one and didn't get that

[16:40:24]

peoples:

clever: you mean the path right ?

[16:40:27]

clever:

osd goes thru xvideo i beleive

[16:40:28]

clever:

peoples: yeah

[16:40:30]

Kazan:

though.... do i need to do something to update rlimits after editing the config

[16:40:43]

peoples:

clever: yes both the same .. strange+

[16:40:46]

Kazan:

clever: yup i know... that's how i know it's xvideo freaking out not ffmpeg

[16:40:51]

clever:

.

[16:41:01]

Kazan:

and nobody ever answered

[16:41:04]

Kazan:

on athlon 64 dual core

[16:41:08]

Kazan:

libmpeg2 or ffmpeg? :P

[16:41:09]

clever:

Kazan: when you login the rlimits config is reloaded

[16:41:27]

clever:

Kazan: you can do it partialy without a relogin though

[16:41:34]

Kazan:

hmm

[16:41:40]

Kazan:

don't think i relogged after changing it

[16:41:44]

clever:

Kazan: 'exec sudo -i' would basicaly relogin just that 1 terminal

[16:42:03]

peoples:

is it possible to install only myhtfilldatabase vom old version ?

[16:42:12]

Kazan:

no

[16:42:51]

** justinh blames kubuntu **

[16:42:54]

Kazan:

could frontend trying to use realtime threads, while not having permission, cause segfaulting? :P

[16:43:24]

justinh:

Kazan: yeah

[16:43:32]

Kazan:

oooo :D

[16:43:41]

Kazan:

pseudo-random segfaulting?

[16:43:57]

justinh:

but then all kinds of things could too

[16:44:45]

Kazan:

bah.. segfault

[16:44:57]

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[16:45:41]

TheJuice:

bye

[16:45:45]

peoples:

damn ... so it can be a bug ? the wiki on myhtv.org to mythfilldatabase say's nothing about changes .. :(

[16:45:46]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: were you abel to get the bt ?

[16:45:50]

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[16:45:55]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: no.. still compiling the debug build

[16:45:59]

GreyFoxx:

ahhh ok

[16:46:07]

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[16:47:07]

justinh:

peoples: might be a user error too :)

[16:47:25]

justinh:

check the modified dates on all the executables

[16:47:50]

directhex|bsp:

especially libmyth!

[16:47:57]

clever:

and libmythtv

[16:48:06]

directhex|bsp:

ooh, and try "ldd" on things

[16:48:59]

peoples:

justinh: maybe :)

[16:49:16]

peoples:

justinh: all the same dtae/time

[16:49:20]

Kazan:

why does it take forever to intialize the video playback?

[16:49:43]

GreyFoxx:

define forever

[16:49:47]

GreyFoxx:

1 second or 20 ?

[16:49:58]

Kazan:

5–20

[16:50:02]

clever:

i had blown one of the buffers up to try and fix a wifi bug

[16:50:15]

clever:

and it made the startup of videos even slower

[16:50:18]

Kazan:

yay for rthreads :D

[16:50:27]

clever:

and didnt fix the bug

[16:51:06]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: there is one way we init some OSD fonts which causes my NFS rooted frontends to take an extra 6 seconds to start playback. but my non nfsrooted FE's done see that delay

[16:51:21]

GreyFoxx:

other than that I couldn't point at anything specific

[16:51:54]

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[16:51:56]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx: one box, no NFS

[16:52:13]

Kazan:

media storage is 2x250GB LVM

[16:52:41]

Kazan:

yay CPU usage while watching HD using libmpeg2

[16:52:41]

Kazan:

Cpu(s): 16.7%us, 8.9%sy, 44.8%ni, 28.1%id, 1.0%wa, 0.5%hi, 0.0%si, 0.0%st

[16:52:45]

GreyFoxx:

a verbose log with -v most can be helpful narrowing log delays down by looking at the timestamps of the message and see which is taking the most

[16:53:01]

Kazan:

good call

[16:53:07]

Kazan:

i happen to have one of such logs too :D

[16:53:12]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[16:53:47]

clever:

damn crappy scsi emulation

[16:53:59]

Kazan:

oooh.. all tree color channels are misaligned in on 1080i

[16:54:00]

clever:

my pata drives are showing up as /dev/sdx

[16:54:10]

Kazan:

bringing up the od shows that

[16:54:11]

clever:

and its sucking up cpu time in hardwara irq's

[16:54:19]

Kazan:

red channel is in the right spot... blue is the most out of place

[16:54:45]

Kazan:

clever: yeh.. my PATA channel is /dev/sda and /dev/sdb

[16:55:02]

clever:

Kazan: and the high cpu usage in irq's is causing the front end to stutter

[16:55:17]

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[16:55:20]

Kazan:

clever: hmm

[16:55:28]

clever:

zeroing out a 18gig partition

[16:55:34]

Kazan:

ouch

[16:55:39]

Kazan:

ok.. this is obnoxious

[16:55:43]

clever:

smart says it has 24 hours to live

[16:55:44]

Kazan:

WTB: fix for this problem at xvideo

[16:55:50]

clever:

and ive copyed the partition out

[16:55:59]

Kazan:

ooh.. debug build is finished

[16:56:16]

Kazan:

brb a minute.. need to hook up a piece of hardware as well

[16:56:48]

clever:

crashed at 155mb

[16:56:50]

clever:

write error

[16:56:51]

Kazan:

ouch

[16:56:57]

peoples:

k .. mythfilldatabase 0.21 has no offset tag in --file like 0.20

[16:57:06]

clever:

just means it failed to zero the whole thing

[16:57:06]

clever:

i can work arround it

[16:57:10]

peoples:

removing -1 and it works

[16:57:11]

peoples:

:)

[16:57:20]

Kazan:

heh PEBKAC resolved :P

[16:57:42]

clever:

clearing at 2mb/sec

[16:58:51]

clever:

stuttering allmost making it unusable

[17:00:50]

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[17:01:40]

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[17:03:03]

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[17:08:49]

CaptObviousman:

humm

[17:09:01]

CaptObviousman:

so for the cheapass tightwad mythtv builder

[17:09:14]

CaptObviousman:

what's the cheapest well-supported ATSC card I can buy?

[17:09:29]

CaptObviousman:

HD5500 seems like overkill

[17:09:53]

iamlindoro__:

Probably the Kworld 110 or 115... not as nice as the 5500, but once it's set up, it works just the same

[17:12:12]

CaptObviousman:

Kworld 12 is $45 on Newegg, not bad at all

[17:12:45]

iamlindoro__:

Never heard of a Kworld 12

[17:13:05]

CaptObviousman:

hmm, they bundle a remote

[17:13:11]

CaptObviousman:

that seems like a waste

[17:13:13]

iamlindoro__:

No

[17:13:14]

iamlindoro__:

whoah

[17:13:15]

** CaptObviousman looks for card sans remote **

[17:13:16]

iamlindoro__:

don't get the 120

[17:13:22]

iamlindoro__:

it's not supported

[17:13:28]

iamlindoro__:

Like I said, 110 or 115

[17:13:30]

CaptObviousman:

where did you go to look?

[17:13:35]

CaptObviousman:

wiki has a list somewhere?

[17:13:38]

mkrufky:

trust him — its not supported

[17:13:45]

iamlindoro__:

linuxtv.org

[17:13:47]

CaptObviousman:

I do trust you

[17:14:01]

CaptObviousman:

this is why I come to this channel

[17:14:05]

CaptObviousman:

there's smrt people here

[17:14:10]

iamlindoro__:

Believe me, as someone who accidentally purchased one once, wouldn't wish my mistake on anyone :)

[17:14:11]

peoples:

thanks .. bye .. :)

[17:14:15]

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[17:14:15]

mkrufky:

latest supported card lists @ http://linuxtv.org/hg/v4l-dvb/file/-1/linux/D . . . /video4linux

[17:14:46]

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[17:14:58]

CaptObviousman:

those are organized by chipset, I'm guessing?

[17:14:59]

mkrufky:

look at the CARDLIST.* files

[17:15:17]

mkrufky:

those are script-generated, based on the driver .... script runs as developer commits to the repo

[17:16:24]

mkrufky:

yes, organized by chipset

[17:18:14]

CaptObviousman:

just making sure, ATSC = OTA right?

[17:18:53]

Kazan:

mkrufky: hvr1800 is pci express 1x yes?

[17:19:00]

Kazan:

ATSC=OTA HD in NA

[17:19:13]

mkrufky:

Kazan: correct

[17:19:19]

Kazan:

kk

[17:19:24]

Kazan:

i'm loosing an analog tuner for the dumbest reason

[17:19:30]

mkrufky:

Kazan: there is also digital SD broadcast in ATSC

[17:19:36]

iamlindoro__:

Well, ATSC is the television standard... which can be delivered OTA... any ATSC card *should* handle OTA, and many should handle QAM as well

[17:19:38]

Kazan:

true

[17:19:54]

Kazan:

my motherboard has a pinset for COM1 instead of having it's own header on the back

[17:19:56]

mkrufky:

ATSC is not over QAM, iamlindoro

[17:19:58]

Kazan:

so i had to get a bracket and cable

[17:20:06]

mkrufky:

ATSC == 8VSB|16VSB

[17:20:11]

Kazan:

most ATSC cards do QAM as well for cable

[17:20:16]

mkrufky:

yes

[17:20:20]

CaptObviousman:

wonder what the V stands for

[17:20:23]

CaptObviousman:

SB = sideband

[17:20:31]

mkrufky:

QAM capable ATSC cards can do QAM, but QAM is not ATSC

[17:20:35]

Kazan:

the connector at the pins is preventing card insertion

[17:20:40]

Kazan:

for these cards

[17:20:43]

mkrufky:

V vertical

[17:20:44]

Kazan:

it's physically in the way

[17:21:00]

mkrufky:

connector at the pins ?

[17:21:38]

Kazan:

[11:17] <Kazan> my motherboard has a pinset for COM1 instead of having it's own header on the back

[17:21:42]

Kazan:

[11:18] <Kazan> so i had to get a bracket and cable

[17:23:14]

mkrufky:

ah, so you actually use that serial port?

[17:23:33]

mkrufky:

and the connector blocks a pcie slot... that blows

[17:23:39]

Kazan:

normal pci

[17:23:45]

sn9:

mkrufky: the digi demodulator in the kworld 120 is unsupported, right?

[17:23:46]

mkrufky:

that blows, too

[17:23:46]

Kazan:

lost my PVR-150

[17:23:52]

mkrufky:

sn9: which demod is it?

[17:23:57]

sn9:

just a sec

[17:23:59]

Kazan:

but in a few months i can get an hvr-1800 i got the open space for it

[17:24:06]

mkrufky:

i think it's probably s5h1409, and that *is* supported

[17:24:08]

Kazan:

kworld 120 is probably a kworld 110/115

[17:24:12]

Kazan:

probably still nxt2004

[17:24:13]

sn9:

Samsung S5H1409 / Conexant CX24227 (digital demodulator)

[17:24:20]

mkrufky:

Kazan: no

[17:24:23]

Kazan:

no?

[17:24:26]

mkrufky:

sn9: ok, its supported

[17:24:26]

sn9:

Kazan: wrong

[17:24:35]

iamlindoro__:

The 115 can be tricked into being sensed at a 110... the 120 can *not*

[17:24:40]

Kazan:

ah

[17:24:43]

iamlindoro__:

Speaking from experience ;)

[17:24:43]

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[17:24:44]

mkrufky:

sn9: and i think the 120 uses xc3028 tuner, right? or is it an xc5000 ?

[17:24:51]

sn9:

mkrufky: so supporting the 120 should be trivial for mrec's tree

[17:24:57]

mkrufky:

ha!

[17:25:02]

sn9:

yes, xc3028

[17:25:11]

mkrufky:

go use mrec's tree, but dont ask me for help

[17:25:26]

mkrufky:

if you want it to work, then work inthe master branch

[17:25:35]

sn9:

too bad it can't do qam256

[17:25:48]

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[17:25:52]

mkrufky:

and use the xceive tuner there, which *does* already work for other boards that have xc3028 + s5h1409

[17:25:54]

Kazan:

there is one boon to the loss of the pvr-150

[17:25:58]

Kazan:

my sb live can fit in there

[17:26:02]

Kazan:

so i can dumb onboard audio

[17:26:07]

Kazan:

dump*

[17:26:09]

sn9:

there's an xc3028 tuner there now?

[17:26:13]

mkrufky:

hauppauge hvr1500 uses xc3028 + s5h1409 ... works fine

[17:26:22]

mkrufky:

(hvr1500q uses xc5000 — also works well)

[17:26:33]

mkrufky:

both already supported, will be released with 2.6.25

[17:26:36]

sn9:

oh, so the 120 is basically the hvr-1500

[17:26:48]

mkrufky:

nope, not at all, sn9

[17:26:53]

mkrufky:

hvr1500 is an expresscard

[17:26:54]

sn9:

is that cx88, too?

[17:27:02]

mkrufky:

PCIe based on cx23885

[17:27:23]

mkrufky:

if you try to buy one in stores, you'll probably get a hvr1500q instead, and that one is better because it does support qam

[17:28:17]

sn9:

from a software perspective, the one without the q is the same as the 120, though

[17:28:30]

mkrufky:

not in the least

[17:28:47]

mkrufky:

the tuner + demod is the same

[17:28:51]

mkrufky:

but nothing else

[17:28:57]

sn9:

the cx88

[17:29:07]

sn9:

that's something else

[17:29:45]

sn9:

http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/KWorld_ATSC_120

[17:29:59]

mkrufky:

anyway, if you want to know how difficult it would be to add support for the kworld atsc 120.... shouldnt be too much work — the prerequisites are all merged, now

[17:30:00]

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[17:30:26]

mkrufky:

you just have to figure out gpio stuff and basic parameters.... most likely the same frontend configuration for hvr1500 would work

[17:30:26]

sn9:

i should now ask about a card that i already have:

[17:30:36]

mkrufky:

especially the gpio reset — the most crucial

[17:30:55]

CaptObviousman:

humm, here's a Sapphire card that's basically an ATI TV Wonder 650

[17:31:13]

mkrufky:

do you have any doors that just wont stay open?

[17:31:35]

Yggdrasil:

can somone help me out? , im just wondering what data from mythtv-setup is not put into the database.. or in other words what dat afrom mytntv-setup is put into some sort of conf file ?

[17:31:49]

Yggdrasil:

and where are they located.. i think ive got some residually bad stuff in that file.

[17:32:05]

sn9:

i got the powercolor ra330 to work by patching the gpio and remote codes in mrec's tree. last i checked, he didn't merge my patch. i hope you didn't base support for it on what he had

[17:32:11]

iamlindoro__:

Only the database name, address, and login info, which are stored in the mysql.txt file

[17:32:15]

iamlindoro__:

everything else is in the DB

[17:32:24]

Yggdrasil:

mhmm

[17:32:40]

Yggdrasil:

ok,

[17:32:45]

Yggdrasil:

thanks you.

[17:32:49]

iamlindoro__:

np

[17:32:53]

Kazan:

on a pci express motherboard that has legacy PCI slots.. each PCI slot is given it's own dedicated PCI Express lane? so PCI latency means jack?

[17:33:02]

Kazan:

or does it depend on the mobo

[17:33:26]

sn9:

Kazan: usually the legacy ones are tied to each other

[17:33:38]

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[17:33:44]

Kazan:

bah so it's one express lane to the PCI Express to PCI bridge

[17:34:00]

Kazan:

that's so bogus on chipsets that have extra lanes

[17:34:17]

sn9:

kinda like pci-to-isa bridges

[17:34:42]

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[17:35:20]

sn9:

mkrufky: what attracted me to mrec's tree for the ra330 was the promise of software demod, since it has no digi demod hardware

[17:35:38]

mkrufky:

software demod ?!?

[17:35:56]

Kazan:

i hate when boot sits and waits at trying to sync to timeserver

[17:36:01]

sn9:

near as i can figure, that's what he intended

[17:36:14]

mkrufky:

you want to take the un demodulated signal from the tuner and use your system CPU to demodulate it?

[17:36:35]

sn9:

he apparently had someone with an ra330 get dvb out of it

[17:37:03]

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[17:37:06]

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[17:37:06]

mkrufky:

so... turns his pc into a demod... what a waste of $$

[17:37:33]

sn9:

unless the ra330 has a demod the mfr doesn't know about...

[17:37:51]

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[17:38:02]

mkrufky:

its a analog-only device that in software, was able to demodulate dvb signals?

[17:38:16]

sn9:

it's xc3028

[17:38:51]

sn9:

lemme look at the physical card again to see what it has besides that and the cx88

[17:39:39]

Kazan:

GreyFoxx you still here

[17:40:16]

Kazan:

oh... what is the command for monitoring lirc events

[17:40:18]

Kazan:

for testing

[17:40:56]

sn9:

the pcb is apparently geniatech, since it says "X800-VER2.31"

[17:41:41]

sn9:

the rfi shield covering the xc3028 is not removable, so i can't see what else is under it

[17:41:57]

sn9:

the cx88 is definitely outside it

[17:42:19]

sn9:

it has what looks like a buffer ic

[17:42:29]

sn9:

and some other tiny thing

[17:42:41]

** sn9 gets a light **

[17:44:07]

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[17:44:51]

sn9:

one of the smaller ic's is completely unmarked

[17:45:39]

Kazan:

wootage

[17:45:42]

Kazan:

lirc working now :D

[17:45:48]

Kazan:

last things to do: debug frontend

[17:46:00]

Kazan:

anyone know the command to get gdb to generate a backtrace on segfault?

[17:46:19]

sn9:

mkrufky: i asked him about atsc, and he said something to the effect of "when i get around to it" so clearly he thought his code was enough to get digi out of it

[17:46:32]

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[17:46:38]

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[17:47:14]

sn9:

i wonder what this 4-pin white connector on the pcb is for...

[17:47:40]

mkrufky:

sn9: i thought you were asking about software demodulation?

[17:47:41]

Kazan:

yay

[17:47:45]

mkrufky:

strange

[17:47:47]

Kazan:

i found out where the memset is

[17:47:53]

Kazan:

segfault in memset

[17:47:57]

Kazan:

how do i make gdb generate a backtrace

[17:47:59]

mkrufky:

anyway, sn9, the demod and tuner both are supported in the master branch

[17:48:18]

sn9:

mkrufky: what demod? it only has xc3028 and cx88

[17:48:23]

mkrufky:

sn9: if you choose to stick with mrec tree, then you doom yourself to external dependencies and manual updates for every kernel

[17:48:51]

mkrufky:

sn9: but... , if you work in master v4l-dvb ... those changesets go to the upstream kernel

[17:48:58]

Kazan:

zomg... the memset segfaulting is in fglrx_dri.so

[17:49:10]

mkrufky:

sn9: what card are you talking about? kworld 120 / x8000 whatever has a s5h1409

[17:49:16]

mkrufky:

that is the dmeod

[17:49:17]

mkrufky:

demod

[17:49:19]

sn9:

powercolor ra330

[17:49:28]

mkrufky:

ok

[17:50:50]

sn9:

although, i take reports of it working with a grain of salt, because his tree had its gpio seriously screwed up, and he was missing a remote code

[17:50:58]

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[17:51:04]

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[17:52:04]

sn9:

i'm probably the only person ever to even get analog out of it correctly under linux

[17:52:17]

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[17:54:53]

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[17:59:24]

** Kazan admits defeat and gets a stinking nvidia board **

[17:59:28]

Kazan:

segfault in ATIs drivers

[17:59:29]

Kazan:

oui

[17:59:59]

Kazan:

i never had a show-stopping problem with fglrx until today.. not anything i couldn't work around before

[18:00:12]

sn9:

Kazan: nvidia cards work just fine on ati boards

[18:00:46]

Kazan:

by nvidia board i meant nvidia video card

[18:01:17]

sn9:

and by what i said, i meant: what i said

[18:01:31]

Kazan:

ah

[18:01:46]

Kazan:

yes... i don't imagine i'll have any problem with it being an AMD690G chipset

[18:01:52]

** Kazan has newegg overnight him a board **

[18:02:16]

sn9:

well, 690g has other issues, but what the hey...

[18:02:33]

Kazan:

what's wrong with the 690G?

[18:02:42]

directhex:

liar, ati motherboard chipsets are without fault

[18:02:52]

Kazan:

nobody's chipsets are without fault :P

[18:03:10]

mindframe-:

ati = bad for linux

[18:03:14]

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[18:03:19]

sn9:

in <.23, you gotta turn off hpet

[18:03:26]

mindframe-:

i would go with a 7050pv if you need onboard video

[18:03:43]

directhex:

mindframe, just because ati boards send intentionally faulty ACPI data if you aren't running windows, doesn't mean they're not huge linux fans!

[18:03:48]

mindframe-:

but honestly i would get a micro atx w/out onboard video and get the msi nvia 8500

[18:04:00]

mindframe-:

directhex, haha

[18:04:13]

mindframe-:

*nvidia

[18:04:35]

sn9:

directhex: as opposed to intel's completely unusable acpi data?

[18:04:48]

Kazan:

hpet?

[18:05:01]

sn9:

Kazan: yes, high precision event timer

[18:05:02]

Kazan:

i've already got a motherboard, i'm just ordering a pci express

[18:05:05]

Kazan:

order already placed

[18:05:23]

Kazan:

i'm rnning 2.6.23.12–52.fc7

[18:05:24]

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[18:06:06]

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[18:06:10]

sn9:

ati and nvidia have done whatever they could to stifle linux

[18:06:35]

xanium4332:

thats a bit harsh on nvidia

[18:06:54]

sn9:

no, it's not

[18:07:19]

xanium4332:

at least they fix (most) problems when they occur

[18:07:27]

xanium4332:

I know there are some long standing issues

[18:07:39]

sn9:

"some" ?

[18:07:58]

xanium4332:

compared to ati

[18:08:02]

Kazan:

nothing is a bit harsh on nvidia

[18:08:06]

xanium4332:

lol

[18:08:08]

Kazan:

ati is just inept at linux development

[18:08:25]

sn9:

Kazan: ati is inept at software dev, period

[18:08:29]

** Kazan has a long list of professional-related reasons to despise nvidia and their cannot-even-write-d3d-drivers-correctly arses **

[18:08:30]

directhex:

fglrx is a significantly inferior driver to nvidia-glx, any suggestion otherwise is flawed

[18:08:41]

Kazan:

sn9: yeah... it's fairly true... hopefully AMD brought some better code devs around

[18:08:45]

mindframe-:

Kazan, does d3d even matter on linux?

[18:08:54]

Kazan:

mindframe-: no, but it matters in gamedev

[18:08:55]

sn9:

Kazan: they very much have

[18:09:06]

mindframe-:

everyone should have stuck with openGL

[18:09:10]

Kazan:

sn9: then maybe we'll start seeing some better fglrx releases soon

[18:09:11]

xanium4332:

yeah

[18:09:12]

Kazan:

mindframe-: yup

[18:09:29]

sn9:

Kazan: hopefully, we'll see fglrx go away altogether

[18:09:33]

Kazan:

mindframe-: the game i work on no longer supports d3d due to nvidia's inability to consistently conform to D3D specifications

[18:09:41]

Kazan:

(plus we have more opengl devs)

[18:09:42]

mindframe-:

jeez

[18:09:45]

Kazan:

sn9: true

[18:09:55]

xanium4332:

yeah I didn'y mean for this to happen...

[18:09:59]

Kazan:

sn9: more documentation release and see them hop on board with radeon/radeonhd drivers

[18:10:18]

sn9:

Kazan: i wouldn't expect any more major releases of fglrx, ever

[18:10:22]

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[18:10:48]

xanium4332:

sn9, why, cause of a switch to radeonHD?

[18:10:57]

Kazan:

on the other hand... ATI conforms to D3D9 specs a little too well sometimes... an "unsupported feature" that a lot of people used (implemented the same way by both vendors) ATI decided to "Clean up their compliance" and removed it because "officially" according to the d3d9 docs that mode was "unsupported"

[18:10:58]

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[18:11:02]

sn9:

Kazan: btw, it was ati who originally contributed the code that got radeon off the ground

[18:11:08]

Kazan:

radeonHD is already better than fglrx :D

[18:11:16]

Kazan:

and it doesn't even have acceleration support yet :D

[18:11:19]

directhex:

sn9, under NDA

[18:11:33]

xanium4332:

directhex, that's better than nothing at all

[18:11:35]

sn9:

directhex: i meant in the mach64 days

[18:11:40]

Kazan:

directhex: they still did it, and i believe the NDA covered pieces of the code not written by ATI

[18:11:47]

Kazan:

but

[18:11:51]

Kazan:

they're slowly releasing the GPU specifications

[18:11:58]

Kazan:

so.. hopefully soon we'll see another batch of documentation

[18:12:07]

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[18:12:10]

sn9:

there was no nda on mach64

[18:12:13]

Kazan:

and radeonhd will start getting acceleration support

[18:13:08]

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[18:13:34]

directhex:

ooh, a new media center project for justinh to hate!

[18:13:43]

xanium4332:

you read it on digg?

[18:13:48]

xanium4332:

entertainer?

[18:13:50]

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[18:14:17]

sn9:

there are enough old media center projects

[18:14:30]

iamlindoro__:

Heh, give up now, it's *THE* linux media center

[18:14:33]

xanium4332:

this one's new, and with some nice effects

[18:14:47]

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[18:15:22]

xanium4332:

Until another prog. does TV recording (proper management, with multiple backends/frontends ...) mythtv doen't have any competition

[18:15:30]

sn9:

effects? "well, isn't that special..." </dana carvey>

[18:15:35]

xanium4332:

(not the we have 'competition' in the OSS world

[18:15:52]

xanium4332:

I do think mythtv ui could do with a little upgrading

[18:21:10]

directhex:

xanium4332, if you can stare at mythscreenstack.cpp without screaming, go ahread!

[18:21:16]

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[18:22:13]

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[18:22:33]

xanium4332:

directhex, yeah it is a bit of a monster...

[18:22:49]

xanium4332:

'maybe it's time for a rewrite'

[18:22:53]

** xanium4332 ducks and runs **

[18:22:53]

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[18:24:39]

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[18:26:48]

clever:

directhex: ive seen larger cpp files in myth:P

[18:27:12]

directhex:

clever, it's not size, it's design!

[18:27:16]

clever:

ah

[18:27:27]

clever:

havent looked that closely at it yet

[18:28:45]

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[18:28:54]

clever:

directhex: something id perfer with lirc

[18:29:04]

clever:

directhex: is to be able to bind lirc buttons directly to actions

[18:29:29]

clever:

i know its posible to hear the pressing of any button

[18:29:43]

clever:

so it doesnt need them to actualy be named in a lircrc

[18:29:46]

Yggdrasil:

how do i force live tv to start on a ceraint channel ?

[18:30:22]

thos:

hey, does anyone have any ideas why mythtv might not produce any files from recordings? the logs say it has recorded, but no files are ever found

[18:30:30]

iamlindoro__:

You can go into mythtv-setup, and on one of the config screens, you can set what channel to start on... only works for the next time you start that tuner, though

[18:30:55]

clever:

iamlindoro__: i think thats more like editing the 'current' channel

[18:31:02]

clever:

next change you make anywhere updates it

[18:31:43]

iamlindoro__:

clever, ergo the only "only works for the next time you start that tuner"

[18:31:44]

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[18:31:50]

clever:

yep

[18:32:12]

sn9:

mkrufky-away: i think mrec thought it had a demod, since the geniatech x8000-mt is the same board as the ra330, but the ra330 has the demod chip depopulated

[18:38:17]

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[18:38:23]

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[18:38:30]

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[18:41:31]

Kazan:

well

[18:41:34]

Kazan:

now it's time to sit and wait

[18:41:48]

Kazan:

tommorow i will hopefully have a video board that will not cause everything to go buttzerk

[18:42:04]

directhex:

i need to power down this machine to swap the graphics card

[18:42:15]

Kazan:

ttyl directhex

[18:45:02]

thos:

hi, can anyone tell me what sourceid means when recording?

[18:45:50]

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[18:49:26]

Kazan:

mkrufky-away: *bonk* any ETA on the analog side of HVR 1800?

[18:53:35]

amrit|zzz is now known as amrit|wrk

[18:53:47]

sn9:

i3ooi3oo: firewire is how you get stuff from cable

[18:53:47]

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[18:54:36]

dserban:

unless you subscribe to shaw... then firewire or serial doesn't work.

[18:55:20]

sn9:

dserban: canada is a different ballgame

[18:57:25]

hachi:

canada is like a whole nother country

[18:57:37]

iamlindoro__:

A lot like one

[18:57:42]

clever:

canada is a seperate country!

[18:57:43]

clever:

:P

[18:58:40]

clever:

my cable box has a serial port and i have a script to change channel thru serial

[18:58:43]

clever:

but it seems to be disabled

[18:58:54]

clever:

i think i just need to call the provider up and ask to turn it on

[18:59:06]

sn9:

clever: what firmware version is the box running?

[18:59:10]

clever:

not shure

[18:59:18]

clever:

dct4xxx model i think

[18:59:19]

sn9:

check the OSD

[18:59:29]

clever:

i can go into the debug menu which is beyond the normal osd

[18:59:39]

sn9:

the script is only for dct2xxx

[18:59:54]

clever:

i may have just forgoten the exact model #

[19:00:47]

sn9:

i have a dct2xxx, and the channels change fine over serial, but comcrap claims it's disabled

[19:01:50]

clever:

there im in the debug

[19:01:59]

clever:

all i had to do was hit select after powering it off

[19:02:13]

clever:

dct2000 diag menu

[19:03:06]

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[19:03:08]

clever:

sn9: firmware 07.93

[19:03:17]

clever:

sep 09 2004!!!

[19:04:07]

clever:

i appear to also be able to see the exact freq for the currently tuned channel

[19:04:58]

clever:

found the 'top' clone in it!

[19:05:11]

clever:

lots of 'programs' runing

[19:05:27]

clever:

nowonder the osd redraws so damn slow

[19:05:48]

dserban:

clever, I envy you. My provider disables the serial port. Though I'm just going by hearsay... since I've never personally tried it.

[19:05:49]

directhex:

all done

[19:05:49]

sn9:

you do know that the dct2000 is an m68k, right?

[19:06:05]

dserban:

hmm maybe I should, what's needed .. a null modem 9-pin cable?

[19:06:09]

clever:

dserban: ive tried the script from my laptop and it did nothing at all

[19:06:19]

clever:

sn9: no i havent realy looked up that detail before:P

[19:06:22]

sn9:

dserban: no null modem, just straight thru

[19:06:24]

directhex:

Graphics Processor: GeForce 7600 GS

[19:06:37]

clever:

sn9: that may have been half my problem

[19:06:44]

** clever goes to dig for more serial cords **

[19:06:52]

Kazan:

*twiddles his thumbs now had he has to wait for hardware to arrive*

[19:07:06]

dserban:

Hmm straight-through huh... ok, I'll try it later... just bought a commandir to control the two cable boxes :(

[19:07:13]

dserban:

if it works I'm gonna tweak

[19:07:17]

sn9:

clever, dserban: 9600, 8N1, iirc

[19:07:36]

directhex:

suppose i should let windows detect the changed hardware

[19:07:49]

dserban:

sn9, thanks .. it's a motorola dct2224 i think

[19:07:53]

sn9:

press enter after connecting

[19:07:54]

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[19:07:58]

clever:

sn9: i was expecting the script to set the speed for me

[19:08:12]

clever:

sn9: but now that im used to minicom i can probly control it manualy

[19:08:35]

dserban:

i'm sure the wiki has some info for me... do you use a terminal program to do things to the cable box?

[19:08:37]

clever:

but the master currently has both real serial ports in use

[19:08:45]

clever:

ir blaster and printk output

[19:09:13]

clever:

dserban: in the contrib folder of the source(posibly in the package also) is a ton of channel changers

[19:09:25]

sn9:

dserban: firmware 7.73 and later enable serial, iirc

[19:09:45]

clever:

07.93 here

[19:09:53]

sn9:

clever: same here, i think

[19:10:05]

clever:

i may have tested with a diff box

[19:10:13]

clever:

and the master isnt using the box im peeking at

[19:10:51]

clever:

now where did my serial cords go...

[19:11:06]

dserban:

Where do I get firmware?

[19:11:15]

dserban:

My cable provider has to provide it correct?

[19:11:18]

sn9:

dserban: cable provider

[19:11:31]

dserban:

meh and how do I check the firmware?

[19:11:38]

sn9:

OSD

[19:12:00]

dserban:

K i'll play with it

[19:12:27]

clever:

i think the firmware is downloaded thru the cable line

[19:12:36]

sn9:

usually, yes

[19:12:37]

clever:

you have to hit a special button combo to format it

[19:12:46]

sn9:

don't do that

[19:12:47]

clever:

while talking to them on the phone so they send the new version

[19:12:59]

sn9:

no, it autoupdates

[19:13:01]

clever:

ah

[19:13:14]

clever:

must have been reseting and reupdating that we went thru

[19:13:16]

Kazan:

is there a script in the contrib directory to check for files hanging around in the recordings dir(s) that are no longer in the db?

[19:13:27]

clever:

Kazan: yep

[19:13:31]

Kazan:

name?

[19:13:37]

clever:

i forget but it exists

[19:13:44]

clever:

should be obvious from the name

[19:13:53]

iamlindoro__:

find_orphans

[19:13:59]

Kazan:

./myth.find_orphans.pl

[19:14:07]

clever:

myth.find_orphans.pl

[19:14:44]

** clever resumes the hunt for serial cords **

[19:14:56]

Kazan:

55 valid recordings, 0 missing recordings – 55 known media files using 183.0GB

[19:14:58]

Kazan:

yay

[19:14:59]

Kazan:

it's clean

[19:15:38]

Kazan:

now.. what to do with this PVR-150 i have but can't use

[19:16:17]

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[19:16:20]

iamlindoro__:

Security Camera!

[19:16:42]

iamlindoro__:

I have an extra analog card I'm gonna use because my puppy gets penned right in front of the myth box in the living room.

[19:16:46]

sn9:

with hardware encoding? you gotta be kidding

[19:17:03]

iamlindoro__:

wtf is the problem with that, sn9, or are you arguing just to argue?

[19:17:17]

sn9:

zoneminder really likes framegrabbers

[19:17:51]

iamlindoro__:

ZM doesn't care what you use so long as you don't care about using all their features

[19:18:01]

sn9:

ok...

[19:18:11]

iamlindoro__:

And since all I care about is watching my puppy from work, what does it matter to you?

[19:18:37]

** Kazan can get the new AG in HD :P **

[19:18:38]

Kazan:

yay

[19:18:54]

sn9:

beats using it for OTA analog

[19:19:46]

clever:

Kazan: ship it to me:P

[19:20:51]

sn9:

he's probably closer to me, not that i'd have any real use for it

[19:20:52]

clever:

http://deesinbox.com/2007/12/15/the-kittens/

[19:21:46]

iamlindoro__:

I probably *do* have an old frame grabber laying around... I think my closet is where old capture cards go to die... Have at least five in there, ranging from old frame grabbers to an Avermedia M179 (pvr-150 alike), PVR-150, and that Kworld 120 ATSC card...

[19:22:11]

iamlindoro__:

Although, as previously mentioned, no use for the 120... yet.

[19:22:25]

sn9:

you saw what mkrufky-away said about it, right?

[19:22:30]

iamlindoro__:

clever, Do *not* piss off the kittens

[19:22:44]

clever:

:D

[19:22:57]

iamlindoro__:

I saw that he said all the prerequisites were there

[19:23:05]

clever:

ive only got 2 capture cards

[19:23:06]

sn9:

yep

[19:23:10]

clever:

bt484 and pvr150

[19:23:17]

justinh:

iamlindoro__: he didn't say linux***

[19:23:26]

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[19:23:27]

sn9:

484? not 848?

[19:23:39]

clever:

484 or 848:P

[19:23:41]

clever:

not shure which

[19:23:42]

gnome42:

j-rod?

[19:23:53]

clever:

848

[19:24:05]

i3ooi3oo:

iamlindoro when compiling the bleeding edge did i need to remove previous stable (.20.2) ?

[19:24:14]

iamlindoro__:

justinh, who, mkrufky-away? Meh, I'm in no rush to get any more cards working, there's already nothing worth watching on teevee

[19:24:47]

iamlindoro__:

Five working tuners is already five more than is worth watching on 99% of the time

[19:24:48]

justinh:

iamlindoro__: ****mce

[19:24:51]

clever:

i could do with a second capture card

[19:25:01]

iamlindoro__:

justinh, Ahh, hahaha

[19:25:08]

clever:

but the bigest problem would be getting a pair of boxes to be controled by a single ir blaster

[19:25:18]

justinh:

clever: yeah but you either need one with its own onboard audio device or another soundcard :P

[19:25:28]

clever:

id have to either use diff rooms(and slave backends) or serial control

[19:25:37]

clever:

justinh: the pvr150 has its own sound in(and mp3 encoder)

[19:25:43]

justinh:

you got a pvr150?!

[19:25:46]

sn9:

clever: serial > ir, any day

[19:25:48]

clever:

yeah for xmas:P

[19:25:58]

iamlindoro__:

Dude, you're getting a PVR150

[19:26:00]

iamlindoro__:

catchy.

[19:26:10]

** justinh checks around. we're all still here. the world didn't end. OMG **

[19:26:15]

clever:

i could put the bt848 could be put back into service to solve my conflict problems

[19:26:27]

Kazan is now known as Kazan|AFK

[19:26:28]

clever:

but then id need to streal the only remaining digital box

[19:26:36]

clever:

and i cant easily control both thru ir

[19:26:47]

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[19:27:00]

i3ooi3oo:

iamlindoro : I borked my system again :)

[19:27:07]

sn9:

once i got serial control working, i never looked back at ir

[19:27:07]

clever:

if i put the pvr150 in a slave i loose ir receiving on my tvout

[19:27:15]

clever:

but none of the slaves have the cpu power to framegrab

[19:27:33]

clever:

if i had serial i could probly do both from a single master

[19:27:44]

clever:

but id need to find the cords first

[19:27:47]

clever:

thats an idea

[19:27:52]

clever:

im allready out of serial ports

[19:28:04]

clever:

and it should in theory work if i just jam both boxes against eachother

[19:28:08]

justinh:

my dev box currently has a framegrabber inside just to remind me how bad it sucks – and mostly because I'd never actually set up analogue TV in myth before

[19:28:12]

clever:

but what if i did that with a usb serial port!

[19:28:23]

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[19:28:33]

sn9:

unlike lirc_sir, usb serial is perfectly fine for this

[19:28:44]

clever:

jam the usb serial port right onto the box and use a usb extension

[19:28:52]

clever:

no need for a serial cord!

[19:29:07]

clever:

now i just need to find the usb serial port...:P

[19:29:17]

sn9:

well, the screw holes on the side will get in the way

[19:29:24]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, What'd you do?

[19:29:46]

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[19:29:46]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v j-rod

[19:29:49]

i3ooi3oo:

Trying to get the bleed edge to work

[19:30:03]

i3ooi3oo:

so i can work on the mythweb interface

[19:30:04]

gnome42:

j-rod: yeah, that's what I was thinking of :)

[19:30:05]

clever:

sn9: those are removable 90% of the time

[19:30:18]

iamlindoro__:

that shouldn't be TOO bad, but the #1 mistake most people make is failing to remove packaged versions of *everything* first

[19:30:28]

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[19:30:37]

gnome42:

j-rod: anyways, I found that using vbi with bttv card really increases your chnacees of getting those errors

[19:30:48]

i3ooi3oo:

everything compiled fine but can't find the libs for some reason

[19:30:55]

gnome42:

j-rod: so diabling vbi is a workaround that can help

[19:31:06]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, can't find, or finding the *wrong* versions?

[19:31:08]

sn9:

gnome42: crc?

[19:31:12]

clever:

gnome42: which errors?

[19:31:20]

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[19:31:22]

j-rod:

gnome42: thus far, hasn't helped the customer, from what they've reported

[19:31:42]

j-rod:

even more fun, I have one of these cards now, and I can't reproduce the problem, even after moving to an identical chipset box

[19:31:43]

gnome42:

j-rod: oh they already tried disabling vbi?

[19:31:45]

j-rod:

yeah

[19:31:49]

clever:

gnome42: ive got 2 main vbi errors

[19:32:14]

jarle:

so what do you guys use to read the mythtv mailinglist? Kmail doesn't seem to be as comfortable as a normal news-reader would be :(

[19:32:15]

i3ooi3oo:

nopt i tlooks like the make install copied them into /usr/local/lib and not /usr/lib

[19:32:20]

sn9:

clever: crc errors?

[19:32:32]

clever:

random vbi errors in small batches(from the bt848 card and i suspect the cable provider is cutting the vbi data off mid sentence)

[19:32:35]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, that's just a matter of your configure options

[19:32:39]

** justinh uses Thunderbird, threads with unread **

[19:32:44]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, you failed to --prefix=/usr

[19:32:47]

gnome42:

let me pastebin the errors ...

[19:32:48]

clever:

and cpu maxing vbi errors on the pvr150(too old of an ivtv)

[19:33:14]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, So it must have defaulted to --prefix=/usr/local

[19:33:21]

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[19:33:28]

clever:

globaly killing vbi fixes the pvr150 error(and probly the other also) but then i loose vbi/cc(even display from old recordings)

[19:33:43]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, make distclean, ./configure --prefix=/usr, make, make install

[19:33:51]

sn9:

pvr150 is murder on vbi

[19:34:08]

clever:

sn9: an error mythbackend gives says to upgrade to ivtv 0.10.0

[19:34:09]

** jarle would have like to have a news-group for mythtv instead... mail and news is never gonna be the same thing... **

[19:34:10]

Inssomniak:

hi all.. Im entering XMLTV IDs in for some of my channels, and ran a mythfilldatabase, but some of my channels still come up as unknown? (no program info), Im getting the ID's from zap2it

[19:34:17]

clever:

sn9: and that wont compile on my current kernel

[19:34:24]

sn9:

jarle: gmane.org

[19:34:25]

i3ooi3oo:

iamlindoro while you would think that the binaries are in /usr/bin

[19:34:30]

justinh:

don't take this the wrong way anybody but I'm surprised so many people rely on CC data tbh

[19:34:44]

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[19:34:51]

justinh:

Inssomniak: zap2it ceased providing tv guide data quite a long time ago

[19:34:56]

clever:

justinh: i mainly use it to cover over the gaps caused by AUDIO buffer overflows on my framegrabber

[19:35:13]

i3ooi3oo:

will try another "./configure --prefix=/usr" after cleaning up again

[19:35:24]

Inssomniak:

justinh, well Im using the schedulesdirect to update, but zap2it to find the xmltv ids, is there somewhere else to find the ID's?

[19:35:24]

jarle:

sn9: gmane.comp.tv.mythtv.user seems to only have VERY old articles?

[19:35:38]

sn9:

Inssomniak: datadirect logins still work? i should try mine

[19:35:44]

justinh:

Inssomniak: AFAIK the SD grabber should take care of all that for you

[19:36:01]

Inssomniak:

justinh, it doesnt work correctly for atsc channels at least in my area

[19:36:09]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, Log into SD

[19:36:15]

justinh:

ahhh that old chestnut. zap2it had the same problem

[19:36:17]

iamlindoro__:

next to your lineup is a "report" button

[19:36:28]

iamlindoro__:

click that, you will get all the xmlids for your lineup

[19:36:29]

sn9:

jarle: i dunno — ask lars magne ingebrigtsen

[19:36:42]

clever:

iamlindoro__: i think you mean the edit/change button

[19:36:43]

Inssomniak:

I also have the problem of being a cross border TV reciever :(

[19:36:47]

iamlindoro__:

clever, No, I don't

[19:36:52]

Inssomniak:

I get channels from both countries

[19:36:53]

clever:

iamlindoro__: when in there you can hold the mouse over a channel and see the id

[19:36:58]

iamlindoro__:

clever, Try it yourself

[19:37:06]

clever:

*looks*

[19:37:11]

iamlindoro__:

There is a "report" button, it gives you a long list with all the XMLids

[19:37:33]

clever:

ahhh

[19:37:51]

clever:

but you also get that under EDIT(in the tooltip)

[19:38:00]

iamlindoro__:

clever, Yes, but this is far simpler

[19:38:11]

iamlindoro__:

And no need to hover of channel after channel

[19:38:13]

iamlindoro__:

er over

[19:38:21]

clever:

yeah

[19:38:26]

Inssomniak:

SD doesnt seem to do the substreams of ATSC

[19:38:28]

clever:

and you cant realy copy/paste a tooltip

[19:38:41]

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[19:38:45]

clever:

41 24514 MTVCAN MTV Canada is incorrect on my channel setup

[19:38:53]

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[19:39:11]

** justinh tries to remember where he got up to in the secret project.... **

[19:39:21]

clever:

and my reported problem has been passed on to tms:)

[19:39:31]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, In mine it does, but with a caveat... they show up as the same channel number, but don't show the substream number.... so, eg, 3 lines of channel 12

[19:40:02]

iamlindoro__:

So you kinad have to figure it out yourself

[19:40:16]

jarle:

sn9: when searching gmane.com it seems like the myth group has vanished ??

[19:40:18]

mkrufky-away is now known as mkrufky

[19:40:20]

mkrufky:

sn9: ok

[19:40:36]

sn9:

jarle: it probably got unsubscribed

[19:40:44]

mkrufky:

Kazan|AFK: there is a test tree on linuxtv.org ...

[19:40:57]

mkrufky:

Kazan|AFK: and we expect to merge cx23885-video for 2.6.26

[19:41:16]

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[19:41:31]

sn9:

mkrufky: in case you're curious, here's my patch to mrec's tree: http://pastebin.com/f44a13031

[19:42:24]

gnome42:

j-rod: bttv errors http://pastebin.ca/848478

[19:42:49]

jarle:

sn9: I'll send Lars Magne a mail asking him where the group has gone, I would love being able to use gnus for reading the group!

[19:42:58]

j-rod:

SCERR? hrm, I was getting OCERR

[19:43:02]

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[19:43:07]

Inssomniak:

I just verified the XMLTV ID with schedulesdirect and its correct, but still doesnt populate the guide info

[19:43:51]

gnome42:

j-rod: I converted my myth source to use the v4l2 mmap interface for vbi and the problem is greatly reduced. ie the v4l read interface is problematic

[19:44:02]

mkrufky:

sn9: if you want that patch to make it to the kernel, then regenerate it against v4l-dvb

[19:44:26]

mkrufky:

ln -s mrec's tree /dev/nul

[19:44:38]

mkrufky:

er, the other way around

[19:44:56]

sn9:

i'd have to see what's different about the xc3028 support in v4l-dvb first

[19:46:20]

Inssomniak:

I wish there was a way to use more than one lineup for a video source, I need 3 seperate lineups in schedulesdirect just to get all my channels in the list

[19:46:24]

sn9:

ideally, the x8000-mt should get support first, but i don't have one of those

[19:46:41]

sphery:

beata: You can use the frontend to put a bunch of recordings in a playlist and use playlist options to delete them all (mass delete)

[19:47:00]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, you really don't need any lineups at all, if you get clever with it

[19:47:03]

Inssomniak:

?

[19:47:12]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, Because the XMLids don't have to exist in any of your lineups to work

[19:47:24]

Inssomniak:

I was happy entering in XMLTV ids but that isnt working either

[19:47:55]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, That's how I set up my whole QAM setup... you sure it's not working? Did you do mythfilldatabase with --refresh-all?

[19:48:24]

Inssomniak:

refresh-all no I didnt do that, if Im entering in XMLTV ID's can I set the grabber to none?

[19:48:39]

iamlindoro__:

No, the grabber still has to be there

[19:49:05]

iamlindoro__:

but you don't have to have correct lineups set up, just need a valid login and xmlids attached to each channel

[19:49:44]

Inssomniak:

so I can only attach one lineup for the atsc source, but selecting any lineup will work as long as on the SD website they exist there?

[19:50:54]

iamlindoro__:

I'm not sure I understand your interpretation... I live in 95136, for example... I could set up a random lineup for 85718 if I wanted to, but as long as I put the XMLids for the channels in my area manually onto each of my channels, it would pull the right listings

[19:51:56]

iamlindoro__:

eg, the lineup at SD is only an assist to theoretically do the mapping for you... All that reall matters is having an XMLid attached to the channel... and if you do that manually, no matter what lineup you have set up at SD, it will pull the listings for that XMLid from SD

[19:52:16]

billytwowilly:

can anyone point me to a bit of an explanation as to what the mythtv-multrec devel is?

[19:52:29]

Inssomniak:

Well thats what I thought, but some channels just dont get lineups, Ill try the refresh-all thing

[19:52:41]

Inssomniak:

er, some channels just dont get listings

[19:52:51]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, but some of the ones you set manually do?

[19:53:13]

Inssomniak:

iamlindoro, I set all my atsc ones manually, and most work, just some dont

[19:53:53]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, If that's the case it's *sorta* unusual... I have seen it on a single channel in my area, but that channel had both SD and HD equivalents, and so I swapped the XMLid and it worked

[19:54:07]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: what do you want to know ?

[19:54:29]

iamlindoro__:

as in, I solved the problem by getting creative with the XMLids, but never needed to set up another lineup.

[19:54:36]

iamlindoro__:

YMMV

[19:55:03]

Inssomniak:

iamlindoro, thats probably the case for me, HD/SD equivilants, but I figured if I got them wrong, it would just be incorrect listings

[19:55:12]

Inssomniak:

not "nothing" at all

[19:55:20]

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[19:55:24]

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[19:55:39]

billytwowilly:

GreyFoxx: what is it? It was mentioned on a mythtv rss feed I watch but there wasn't any link explaining what it is, just that it might not make it into 0.21

[19:55:42]

justinh:

man I wish the text buttons in mythmusic were gone already

[19:55:49]

directhex:

billytwowilly, digital tv is sent on "multiplexed" or "transponders", i.e. a a large number of channels are sent to a single frequency

[19:56:11]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: I don't know who thinks it might not go in before 0.21. As fa as I know it can go in any day now

[19:56:11]

directhex:

billytwowilly, e.g. in the UK, there are six multiplexes which transmit all uk DVB-T tv and radio channels

[19:56:13]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, I actually went through and goofed with my QAM settings as recently as last night, and found that one side had no listings at all... dunno why, but dupe'ing the HD XMLid worked out ok

[19:56:36]

directhex:

billytwowilly, multirec is a new branch which can record multiple channels from a single multiplex with 1 tuner – e.g. tune to BBC1, record BBC1 and BBC2 at the same time with 1 card

[19:57:11]

billytwowilly:

that's cool, but it's probably of no use to us north americans stuck in the tv dark ages right?

[19:57:22]

iamlindoro__:

it can be used here

[19:57:33]

sn9:

billytwowilly: think clearqam

[19:57:36]

iamlindoro__:

If you want to record, say, ABc and some random religious channel :)

[19:57:41]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: It's of use to anyone using DVB (QAM is fine if you record from cable)

[19:57:46]

directhex:

works with billytwowilly, ATSC

[19:57:47]

iamlindoro__:

The multiplexes where I live *suck*

[19:57:54]

directhex:

bah

[19:58:02]

sn9:

lol

[19:58:03]

directhex:

billytwowilly, ATSC, or QAM cable, will work with multirec

[19:58:41]

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[19:58:51]

billytwowilly:

wouldn't work with encrypted stuff though right? the satellite guys in Canada are dinks.. everything is encrypted..

[19:59:21]

justinh:

not unless your service providers suddenly wise up & make hardware CAMs available, no :)

[19:59:23]

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[19:59:42]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: multirec or not myth wont decrypt those anyway

[19:59:53]

Inssomniak:

iamlindoro, the --refresh-all thing worked!

[20:00:03]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, Good stuff, glad it's sorted

[20:00:07]

directhex:

justinh, CAMs for justice!

[20:00:09]

Inssomniak:

thx for help

[20:00:11]

iamlindoro__:

no problem

[20:00:24]

billytwowilly:

k, it sounds cool then but it doesn't affect me because all satellite providers in canada are dinks.. thanks for the information guys.

[20:01:06]

sn9:

cable != sat

[20:01:07]

billytwowilly:

I look forward to the day when content providers wise up.

[20:01:22]

billytwowilly:

the cable providers are dinks too;)

[20:01:26]

sn9:

true

[20:01:35]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: We can see some clear DVB-S from here, but not many and they are spread over several birds

[20:02:18]

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[20:03:21]

billytwowilly:

GreyFoxx: it seems like too much work. If I had 500 or 600 million to spare I'd setup a satellite or cable provider that use linuxmce boxes and broadcasted unencrypted... but I don't have that kind of money yet;)

[20:03:42]

sn9:

only in canadia...

[20:03:54]

iamlindoro__:

AH! He said the word!

[20:04:04]

iamlindoro__:

The one where god kills a pregnant puppy.

[20:04:07]

GreyFoxx:

billytwowilly: Actually we have the right to decrypt dishnet signals since we don't have the option of paying:)

[20:04:43]

billytwowilly:

GreyFoxx: heh, pm me some info or a howto and I'm there;)

[20:04:49]

** justinh smacks mythmusic. such a waste of screen space **

[20:05:06]

GreyFoxx:

nope, sorry. I don't have a howto, nor do I do it. I just find it interesting that we can

[20:06:00]

billytwowilly:

the whole digital tv thing kind of blows my mind. If they didn't encrypt it we could do so many cool things with it because it's essentially just an mpeg 2 stream.

[20:06:25]

iamlindoro__:

Yeah, but those cool things are exactly why they encrypt it :)

[20:06:34]

iamlindoro__:

because they're cocksuckers

[20:06:40]

sn9:

well, mpeg4 is just around the corner for sat

[20:06:43]

xanium4332:

well thats direct...

[20:07:08]

sn9:

xanium4332: you think dish won't follow suit?

[20:07:17]

billytwowilly:

someone needs to write a letter to the environmental militants about how all this encryption is causing me to waste electicity decrypting and/or transcoding ..

[20:07:32]

billytwowilly:

not to mention all the power wasted idling the beefier hardware needed..

[20:07:35]

sn9:

haha

[20:07:54]

justinh:

you won't be doing much idling when you're playing 1080 in h.264 AVC believe me

[20:08:24]

xanium4332:

sn9, I was referring to the ****suckers comment

[20:08:26]

billytwowilly:

someone will put out a cheap hardware decoder for that and then you won't need a beefy cpu.

[20:08:40]

justinh:

billytwowilly: don't bank on it

[20:08:46]

iamlindoro__:

xanium4332, No no, I said they were COCKsuckers

[20:08:51]

iamlindoro__:

;)

[20:08:52]

Inssomniak:

dish has a lot of h.264

[20:09:02]

sn9:

billytwowilly: i believe the howto involves getting a friend south of the border to receive an access card and ship it to you

[20:09:23]

iamlindoro__:

sn9, No, it's all done in software

[20:09:48]

billytwowilly:

justinh: I'm not banking on it. I'm not buying hardware for another year or two. I want to wait for linuxmce to mature and insteon devices to get cheaper.

[20:09:50]

sn9:

directv used to use access cards, anyway

[20:09:54]

iamlindoro__:

It's just a SoftCAM and a virtual DVB adapter

[20:10:01]

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[20:10:06]

iamlindoro__:

GAH! He said it *again*

[20:10:09]

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[20:10:12]

iamlindoro__:

Someone just tore the wings off an angel

[20:10:29]

xanium4332:

iamlindoro__, who said 'it' again?

[20:10:54]

** billytwowilly tests **

[20:10:55]

iamlindoro__:

xanium4332, billytwowilly said the linux blank blank blank word

[20:10:56]

billytwowilly:

linuxmce

[20:10:59]

iamlindoro__:

GAHHHHHH

[20:11:06]

** iamlindoro__ cringes **

[20:11:06]

xanium4332:

iamlindoro__, ooOOOoooh

[20:11:13]

billytwowilly:

linuxmce

[20:11:33]

xanium4332:

indeed, their first 'demonstration' vid was pretty painful to watch

[20:11:49]

** sn9 tries something new. BSDMCE!!!! **

[20:12:04]

iamlindoro__:

Yeah, they call it "front Row"

[20:12:06]

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[20:12:16]

iamlindoro__:

BSDMCE, that is ;)

[20:12:28]

sn9:

like that's really bsd...

[20:12:45]

iamlindoro__:

It certainly is... not to mention the fact that it's real UNIX, too

[20:12:54]

sn9:

the app?

[20:12:57]

xanium4332:

and 'enterainer' is receiving plenty of attention now it's on the front page of digg

[20:12:58]

iamlindoro__:

The OS

[20:13:09]

directhex:

xanium4332, site is down

[20:13:10]

sn9:

front row is not an OS

[20:13:28]

xanium4332:

directhex, only cause of popularity :P

[20:13:30]

iamlindoro__:

you said "like that's really bsd..." presumably referring to OS X

[20:13:41]

sn9:

no, referring to the app

[20:13:49]

iamlindoro__:

sn9, I'm aware that front row is not an OS, we are not all simpletons, you know

[20:13:53]

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[20:14:15]

justinh:

linuxmce needs new UI graphics & a revamp to make it a '10 foot' paradigm

[20:14:31]

justinh:

with those done it _might_ be a viable concern

[20:14:45]

sn9:

justinh: now you used the word

[20:14:52]

iamlindoro__:

justinh, It's not a bad *idea*... in fact I quit like the idea... but the UI that looks like a bunch of post-its on top of a flikr slideshow is what kills me

[20:15:00]

iamlindoro__:

er quite

[20:15:02]

justinh:

all that stupid swooshing remotes like lightsabers..

[20:15:35]

justinh:

yeah I like the _idea_ of it too. I like the idea of lots of things which happen to be poorly thought out

[20:17:09]

directhex:

like fruitcake!

[20:17:23]

iamlindoro__:

If it were *usable* lord knows it would open up all sorts of tinkering which I know nothing about, eg home automation, etc... Maybe someday.

[20:17:33]

javatexan:

so once I add a movie to mythtv (copy file to mythtv/recordings and run myth.rebuilddatabase.pl on it)...can I still transcode to different format, remove commercials, etc? For some reason, after I add the file to the db it changes the file name to channelid and some other stuff (looks like date,time,etc)

[20:17:41]

iamlindoro__:

But what good is a media center I can't stand to look at?

[20:17:52]

justinh:

they were certainly brave for trying some new ideas in their UI, all power to them for that. but the problem for me is their 'one place for everything' stuff. too crowded

[20:18:33]

justinh:

I installed it on a spare machine & showed my wife. she told me on no uncertain terms that it'll never be in our house

[20:19:08]

javatexan:

justinh: your wife makes the 'technology' decisions in your house too, eh? LOL

[20:19:11]

justinh:

give it to Ozzy Osbourne. if he can use it, you pass the test

[20:19:16]

xanium4332:

it's like a pile of spagetti, what with all that pluto stuff in it

[20:19:30]

justinh:

javatexan: no, but she has a say if she has to use it

[20:19:42]

justinh:

and I dont want to end up being tech support for it either

[20:19:45]

javatexan:

justinh: I know what you mean

[20:20:22]

javatexan:

my wife loves her tivo....so I cant get rid of it, so I am trying to work the two together

[20:20:43]

javatexan:

i almost have it

[20:20:48]

justinh:

funny thing on Sunday. she waxed her car without drying it first. Of course she'd rather ask me than RTFM. I just assumed it was dry by then. Anyway – asking me rather than read the instructions. sounds familiar

[20:21:20]

xanium4332:

javatexan, wrap the powerplugs, then kill the power to the tivo... done

[20:21:25]

javatexan:

justinh: oh yeah...I have to tech support my wifes Mac that way

[20:21:26]

Inssomniak:

anyone with a PCHDTV 5500 card (or similar) ever get the analog part to work?

[20:21:53]

xanium4332:

javatexan, Macs are meant to be techsupportless

[20:22:00]

justinh:

she got her own laptop but it takes too long to boot so she's always on here

[20:22:09]

iamlindoro__:

Inssomniak, It's not hard, you just delete and re-add the card as v4l type... but it's a waste of a nice ATSC card

[20:22:10]

directhex:

i'm on the wife's pc

[20:22:25]

directhex:

though she has a new pc coming in a couple of days

[20:22:38]

justinh:

javatexan: what, like "How do I right click?" ;)

[20:22:38]

Inssomniak:

iamlindoro, Yea I know, probably wont bother, there is only another year left anyways

[20:22:47]

javatexan:

I know...but she will have font trouble from time to time...

[20:23:05]

justinh:

she knows more about MS Office than I do, which I'm glad of :)

[20:23:38]

justinh:

like how to put a bulleted list right when you change the font & it screws up one bullet

[20:23:51]

sn9:

xanium4332: s/are/were/

[20:23:55]

justinh:

always evades me, that one :(

[20:23:59]

Inssomniak:

I just added 2 more ATSC channels, one had a subchannel with more TV.. my local station is going atsc by april at the latest (txmitter already up and running)

[20:23:59]

javatexan:

macs still havent completely figured the font thing out, so each new release we have to get her Graphic Designer fonts working....which all works magical apparently...you call apple support 5 times and get 10 answers

[20:24:15]

directhex:

the wife is free to use proprietary apps if she pays & supports them

[20:24:19]

directhex:

e.g. msoffice

[20:24:25]

directhex:

she seems to use OOo for some reason

[20:24:31]

justinh:

we tried OO. no dice

[20:24:55]

directhex:

msoffice 2007 is so blinking weird uiwise anyway

[20:24:59]

justinh:

not when her work uses Office so much. I know they're sposed to be mostly interchangable but we got unlucky

[20:25:24]

directhex:

if she can, "broken" files are welcomed by the OOo devs so they can fix on a per-file basis

[20:25:28]

sn9:

interchangeable? not according to M$'s own devs

[20:25:55]

justinh:

directhex: a user – with time & motivation to submit back to the project? ROFLMAO

[20:26:15]

justinh:

"should just work.. grrrr. off with it"

[20:26:36]

directhex:

still, office has come down in price to compete with ooo

[20:26:40]

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[20:26:44]

justinh:

bu they don't worry their new open format will solve all the problems

[20:26:49]

sn9:

oh, i thought you were saying ms-office-win and ms-office-mac were interchangeable — never mind

[20:26:52]

justinh:

:P

[20:27:30]

justinh:

"I want to be able to exchange docs with all my linux & mac using friends" "I want to be a tree" etc

[20:28:11]

** tjcarter concludes that nothing like the DDTS-100 exists anymore =( **

[20:28:31]

directhex:

justinh, easy.

[20:28:31]

sn9:

tjcarter: it was "the analog hole"

[20:28:34]

directhex:

justinh, .txt

[20:29:05]

sn9:

and .csv for anything more

[20:29:26]

** directhex is finding windows most unpleasant, considers rebooting to linux **

[20:29:28]

tjcarter:

sn9: it has nothing to do with the analog hole. It has everything to do with most computer speakers are analog and most sound cards you'd plug them into are total crap ;)

[20:29:32]

javatexan:

This is what I have so far running as a cron job. Goto folder where .tivo files saved, convert tivo to mpeg, copy file to ..../mythtv/recordings, add them to mythtb db....Now I need to convert mpeg to mp

[20:30:00]

sn9:

tjcarter: "most" ? show me a pair that isn't

[20:30:11]

tjcarter:

sn9: pair?

[20:30:13]

javatexan:

to mp4 or avi or what ever is best and then rip out commercials

[20:30:16]

sn9:

of speakers

[20:30:16]

tjcarter:

5.1 speakers

[20:30:24]

tjcarter:

those don't come in pairs =D

[20:30:40]

iamlindoro__:

well, two and a half pairs ;)

[20:30:42]

tjcarter:

They usually come in massivelyhuge crates

[20:30:56]

iamlindoro__:

or three pair if you count the woofwoof

[20:31:00]

sn9:

5.1 doesn't usually involve the term "computer speakers"

[20:31:20]

tjcarter:

sn9: Logitech z5300e

[20:31:30]

directhex:

sn9, sure they do. 5.1's been normal for pc speakers since audigy

[20:31:32]

javatexan:

unfortunately as soon as I add the files to the mthtv db, it changes their names so I cant script against the name anymore...does anyone have a suggestion on how to get around it?

[20:31:40]

directhex:

sn9, my dad's 3-year-old high street pc came with 5.1

[20:31:46]

sn9:

ah, creative again...

[20:31:57]

tjcarter:

Creative made the DDTS-100 ;)

[20:32:05]

directhex:

sn9, there are other brands than creative

[20:32:21]

directhex:

sn9, his sound card wasn't creative, it was some a3d thingy. a turtle beach card

[20:32:24]

tjcarter:

The issue for me is that I need a Dolby Digital decoder that has line-level outs

[20:32:27]

justinh:

hmm I think I just managed to coax another few more lines of useful screen info out of mythmusic :)

[20:32:42]

directhex:

tjcarter, why not just use a usb card? that way you avoid in-pc noise

[20:32:44]

justinh:

tjcarter: myth can do it in trunk AFAIK

[20:32:45]

sn9:

tjcarter: go to a stereo shop

[20:33:18]

directhex:

tjcarter, ALL the processing is done away from your pc's electromagnetic innards

[20:33:28]

tjcarter:

directhex: well, the issue there is that a dedicated device will also do upmixing and whatnot.

[20:33:35]

directhex:

tjcarter, seems like an obvious solution to me.....

[20:33:51]

justinh:

I use a couple of little bookshelf speakers & a proper amp for my PC sound. way better than any crappy setup I've heard from 'computer speakers'

[20:34:25]

javatexan:

yeah the computer speakers are mostly trash

[20:34:26]

tjcarter:

justinh: z5300e really are 5.1 gaming speakers

[20:34:35]

sn9:

there used to be tons of dolby digital decoders with line-level outs in stereo shops, for home theater surround before HD

[20:34:49]

iamlindoro__:

I've got those logitech 5.1's on my upstairs myth box

[20:35:19]

tjcarter:

iamlindoro__: I'd like to feed them with some Dolby Digital

[20:35:35]

tjcarter:

from Myth box, from came consoles, etc, etc

[20:35:43]

tjcarter:

game consoles too

[20:35:43]

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[20:35:55]

directhex:

actually, i've got some VERY nice speakers going on, and tbh, there are some really nice pc-grade speakers on the market

[20:36:02]

directhex:

probably not AS good, but for the money, undeniable

[20:36:13]

javatexan:

can Mythtv record from a video camera, from usb?

[20:36:16]

sn9:

unfortunately, stand-alone dolby decoders are now specialty items

[20:36:16]

directhex:

not all speakers are crappy Trust bollocks with tinny bass and trebble

[20:36:17]

tjcarter:

directhex: there's another factor to consider

[20:36:19]

justinh:

javatexan: nope

[20:36:38]

iamlindoro__:

My main box speakers downstairs are all mid-end (is there a *mid* end, when you think about it?) expensivish speakers, though

[20:36:40]

directhex:

tjcarter, the phase of the moon?

[20:36:42]

justinh:

can mythtv make a banana smoothie if I put a banana in a USB socket?

[20:36:46]

javatexan:

cause it doesn't have a channel, right

[20:36:54]

directhex:

justinh, with mythmilkshake installed, yes

[20:36:54]

javatexan:

lol

[20:36:55]

tjcarter:

directhex: if you live in a small apartment, any decent speakers will get you removed ;)

[20:37:13]

justinh:

javatexan: cause USB from HD camcorders needs er.. 'special' treatment

[20:37:16]

directhex:

tjcarter, i have 7.1 speakers, but only room to install 2.1's worth in my current house

[20:37:18]

tjcarter:

mythmilkshake and USB blender

[20:37:31]

iamlindoro__:

justinh, I think there's a linuxMCE tutorial video on Google right now where a heavily accented voice talks you through it.

[20:37:41]

justinh:

I dunno if HD camera formats are supported in linux yet

[20:37:42]

javatexan:

okay...i was under the impression that it streamed mpeg2 like firewire STB

[20:37:48]

justinh:

no no no no no

[20:37:57]

justinh:

they're barely supported in windows even now

[20:38:00]

javatexan:

okay...that makes sense

[20:38:01]

sn9:

tjcarter: ever tried carpeting the walls? works wonders

[20:38:04]

iamlindoro__:

My HD camcorder records AVC

[20:38:12]

tjcarter:

they're supported on the Mac ;)

[20:38:12]

javatexan:

true...macs rock for HD camcorders

[20:38:21]

justinh:

iamlindoro__: you heard my voice on my mythtv promo video? eeewie

[20:38:28]

iamlindoro__:

in 1080i... yes, works decently with the new iMovie

[20:38:33]

javatexan:

on a mac you would swear it was just streaming the mpeg filse

[20:38:44]

tjcarter:

javatexan: on the Mac, it probably is.

[20:38:45]

iamlindoro__:

justinh, Haven't seen your video... link me

[20:39:00]

iamlindoro__:

if you dare ;)

[20:39:00]

justinh:

er... can't remember where it is

[20:39:04]

iamlindoro__:

hahaha, suuuuure

[20:40:01]

justinh:

seriously. had a copy up somewhere, then lost it. there's a mirror around somewhere

[20:40:56]

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[20:41:11]

justinh:

there's this one: http://downloads.mythtvtalk.com/mythtv/videos/LWythpromo.mpg unvoiced

[20:41:16]

justinh:

but then I did a 720p HD one

[20:42:42]

iamlindoro__:

"you just poot dee banana in dee USB socket... LeenooxMCE take a-care of all dee configuration for you."

[20:42:43]

sn9:

at least 720p will play on ubuntu ppc on this 12" ibook

[20:43:37]

justinh:

cant remember which kind soul mirrored it now.

[20:43:46]

sn9:

1080i makes the framebuffer go nuts

[20:44:15]

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[20:46:03]

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[20:46:53]

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[20:48:37]

GreyFoxx:

Anyone tried the new yadif deinterlacer ?

[20:48:45]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, a tiny bit last night

[20:48:50]

fryfrog:

is it easily selectable in the UI?

[20:48:57]

GreyFoxx:

I gotta say I can see a visual difference. Looks nice

[20:49:09]

GreyFoxx:

fryfrog:.... same as when you pick any deinterlacer :)

[20:49:24]

fryfrog:

k

[20:49:33]

fryfrog:

i assume it was added recently to svn trunk?

[20:49:37]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, It looked great, but I was having some issues with the opengl renderer where it would work fine the first time in TV, but hang thereafter, and didn't have time to chase it down last night

[20:49:38]

justinh:

ahh here it is. all 600 MB of it

[20:49:57]

GreyFoxx:

Ahhh I don't use the opengl renderer as I find it uses too much CPU on my box

[20:49:57]

iamlindoro__:

So I just switched back to Xv-blit, watched TV, and went to bed

[20:50:06]

GreyFoxx:

fryfrog: in t he lsat month or so

[20:50:30]

justinh:

heh no v/o on this one either

[20:50:32]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, Ya know... I don't think I tried yadif under xv-blit at all

[20:50:45]

iamlindoro__:

It's a substantial improvement, though, for sure

[20:50:49]

fryfrog:

oh, that isn't as recent as i thouhgt

[20:50:59]

GreyFoxx:

Interestingly I noticed a big difference in cpu usage between playback of QAM (528x480) and PVR250 (720x480) recordings.

[20:51:04]

fryfrog:

I had to stop using the opengl renderer too, i think

[20:51:08]

GreyFoxx:

http://www.phaze.org/mythtv/cpuusage.png

[20:51:14]

directhex:

i'm a little tipsy

[20:51:39]

fryfrog:

its only 4p, lay off the booze ya alchie :p

[20:51:42]

GreyFoxx:

in the middle the 3 spikes are playback of PVR recordings, and the other averages are QAM recordings. the final spike was HDTV from firewire

[20:51:45]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, Now is that with YADIF, or opengl render?

[20:51:54]

Kazan|AFK:

hey GreyFoxx

[20:51:57]

Kazan|AFK is now known as Kazan

[20:52:13]

Kazan:

the segfault was caused by a memset invoked in fglrx_dri.so

[20:52:16]

** Kazan facepalms **

[20:52:29]

GreyFoxx:

iamlindoro: well I think it's yadif and myth...... myth uses more on my box for playback of pvr stuff no matter what, but yadif mad it even more noticable

[20:52:29]

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[20:52:33]

GreyFoxx:

Kazan: Doh!

[20:52:42]

GreyFoxx:

glad to tracked it down :)

[20:52:53]

** Kazan capitulated and has placed a rush overnight shipping order for a pci-e 16x nvidia board **

[20:52:59]

directhex:

fryfrog, 9pm!

[20:53:00]

sn9:

GreyFoxx: what gpu you got?

[20:53:01]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, as I recall, you use fairly low-CPU frontend boxes, yes?

[20:53:12]

GreyFoxx:

sn9: GF4 MX440

[20:53:17]

Kazan:

mx440?

[20:53:20]

Kazan:

*twitch*

[20:53:21]

sn9:

ah, that explains it

[20:53:30]

sn9:

i have one of those

[20:53:31]

Kazan:

you are banned from my presence greyfoxx! :D

[20:53:38]

GreyFoxx:

iamlindoro: That particular FE is a Sempron 2600

[20:53:40]

fryfrog:

directhex: oic, drink as much as you like!

[20:53:45]

GreyFoxx:

the others are celeron733 boxes

[20:53:48]

Kazan:

we spent ungodly amounts of time trying to debug problems with those damn boards in the game i work on

[20:53:55]

fryfrog:

I have one of those too!

[20:53:57]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[20:53:57]

directhex:

fryfrog, i'm on my third perry of the evening

[20:54:02]

iamlindoro__:

GreyFoxx, oh, ok. Thanks, just curious

[20:54:04]

Kazan:

before we ripped out D3D we put those on the officially unsupported list

[20:54:12]

fryfrog:

but i think i switched to GF4 Ti4200

[20:54:20]

directhex:

Kazan, most people do. the geforce 4 mx is a souped up geforce 2. it has no post-geforce2 features

[20:54:21]

fryfrog:

man, Nvidia has gone through a *TON* of GPU names :/

[20:55:33]

sn9:

unfortunately, the mx440 was an improvement over the km400 where it now is for knoppmyth

[20:56:08]

sn9:

unichrome support leaves a lot to be desired

[20:56:22]

directhex:

sn9, s3 graphics has always been shit

[20:56:27]

justinh:

unichrome leaves a lot to be desired period!

[20:56:40]

Kazan:

directhex: yup.. that's the problem.. they make a lot of people think it was a gf4 when it's a gf2

[20:56:43]

i3ooi3oo:

iamlindoro: once again it cp'd the file for /lib to the wrong location

[20:57:05]

directhex:

Kazan, it's not news though. some ati 9000-series cards were really 8000-series

[20:57:08]

directhex:

e.g. 9100, 9200

[20:57:10]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, And you know that from watching the make install, or because the mythfrontend fails to start properly?

[20:57:28]

Kazan:

Dibblah: aye.. annoys the piss out of me that they do that

[20:57:39]

Kazan:

the x1200 IGP is actually an r400 board

[20:57:44]

Kazan:

but you have to use fglrx or radeonhd for it

[20:57:54]

sn9:

s3 is shit to the gamerz, but for the rest, who cares?

[20:58:00]

directhex:

Kazan, so have a supported list. all the cool kids list minimum gpus and exclude lists

[20:58:07]

Kazan:

we're opengl only now :D

[20:58:08]

directhex:

sn9, gamers make the world go round!

[20:58:16]

Kazan:

they just have to pass feature check now

[20:58:18]

i3ooi3oo:

because i deleted all the files in /lib/local/lib prior ro running make install and all the libmyth* file were there after the make install

[20:58:39]

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[20:58:41]

Kazan:

woot Arsenal vs Chelsea!

[20:58:53]

** sn9 finally figures out that directhex is a gamer **

[20:58:55]

iamlindoro__:

i3ooi3oo, Dunno what to tell you, then...

[20:58:56]

directhex:

Kazan, gma900 pisses me off. impossible to play hl2, even on 0 detail!

[20:59:04]

Kazan:

gma900?

[20:59:10]

directhex:

sn9, i've been a gamer for 19 years

[20:59:11]

Kazan:

that an nvidia board?

[20:59:14]

iamlindoro__:

Intel

[20:59:16]

directhex:

Kazan, intel onboard

[20:59:40]

directhex:

Kazan, intel onboard from i855 and low-end i9xx chipsets

[20:59:52]

Kazan:

my gaming machine (i play vanguard: soh) is Athlon 64 X2 6000+, 4GB DDR2–800, Radeon HD 3870 512MB, SB Audigy 4, 250GB SATAII, 22" 16:9 LCD

[21:00:09]

directhex:

the wife's new pc has a similar spec

[21:00:19]

Kazan:

the hd3870s are amazingly cheap

[21:00:25]

directhex:

except it's ati

[21:00:28]

Kazan:

i remember for a while the best cards were pulling $600

[21:00:39]

i3ooi3oo:

well setup is working now that i moved the files to the correct location

[21:00:44]

Kazan:

directhex: which quite frankly are much better for gaming if you give a rip about image quality

[21:00:52]

iamlindoro__:

I dream of a magical day when we have h.264 hardware acceleration in linux... *sigh*

[21:00:58]

Kazan:

plus the best geforce 2 only has 128 unified shader units, double pumped

[21:01:02]

directhex:

iamlindoro, cpu is hardware

[21:01:14]

Kazan:

the radeon r600 series have 320 unified shaders

[21:01:25]

i3ooi3oo:

seems like they are working there (I think mythtv-setup is running)

[21:01:42]

iamlindoro__:

Yes, but "acceleration" implies that something is accelerating it beyond what the CPU can do :)

[21:01:51]

directhex:

Kazan, and are still outpuerformed by nvidia. shaders are not equal, any more than mhz

[21:02:18]

Kazan:

um... outperformed by what? 5% at the cost of significant amounts of image quality

[21:02:35]

directhex:

Kazan, anyway, i boot linbux most of the time, and ati is junk on linux

[21:02:40]

Kazan:

and that's which the catalyst drivers being unoptimized for hd3k

[21:02:44]

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[21:03:00]

Kazan:

directhex: yeah.. they are.. i never encountered a serious problem with fglrx before that i couldn't work around after a little research

[21:03:07]

Kazan:

but... segfault due to a memset in fglrx_dri.so

[21:03:09]

Kazan:

*facepalm*

[21:03:23]

directhex:

Kazan, i've been researching ati versis nvidia in linux for about 4 years now

[21:03:33]

xanium4332:

i didn't think gfx cards acually had different 'image qualities'.

[21:03:34]

Kazan:

nvidia's drivers aren't exactly quality either

[21:03:43]

sn9:

Kazan: you've never had fglrx crash before? seriously?

[21:03:46]

directhex:

xanium4332, it's very subtle most of the time

[21:03:50]

Kazan:

xanium4332: in basic 2d? nope.. in 3d... yup

[21:03:54]

Kazan:

sn9: seriously

[21:03:58]

sn9:

wow

[21:04:09]

directhex:

xanium4332, the differences ramp up as you increase the anti-aliasing

[21:04:17]

Kazan:

sn9: always used it on 9k series boards thugh.. so maybe they're just what it's best at

[21:04:38]

sn9:

it doesn't support most of those anymore

[21:04:41]

xanium4332:

you mean cause the cards render things slightly differently?

[21:04:50]

Kazan:

9600s specifically sn9

[21:04:58]

sn9:

9600 works

[21:05:01]

Kazan:

so unless then dropped support in the last year

[21:05:01]

directhex:

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.h . . . mp;chart=318

[21:05:02]

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[21:05:08]

directhex:

i think i picked the right gpu for the wife's new box

[21:05:10]

xanium4332:

in what way are ati card's pictures 'better' than nvidia's

[21:05:11]

sn9:

but not as well as radeon

[21:05:20]

Kazan:

xanium4332: yes the cards render things slightly differently

[21:05:31]

sn9:

the only possible reason to use fglrx on 9600 is tv-out

[21:05:37]

xanium4332:

not that one card outputs 'better colour' than the other

[21:05:43]

Kazan:

nvidia tends to implement approximation algorithms in silicon isntead of actual imaging algorithms

[21:05:47]

fryfrog:

when did "CMOV is fast no" get added to ./configure of mythtv and what *is* it?

[21:05:54]

Kazan:

it gains them some FPS at the cost of image quality

[21:06:01]

xanium4332:

Kazan, I get the picture now (no pun intended)

[21:06:04]

Kazan:

hence a lot of the game artists i know refuse to use nvidia

[21:07:12]

Kazan:

directhex: look at the boards you're comparing it against – the Overclock and the $600 boards

[21:07:22]

directhex:

on a related note, steam://hardwarepromo/609 for some free half-lifey demos if you haver an nvidia gpu

[21:07:22]

Kazan:

the hd3870 is a $219-$250 MRSP board

[21:07:39]

Kazan:

rm -rf steam

[21:07:40]

directhex:

Kazan, the 8800gt is a £160 part

[21:07:42]

Kazan:

steam is a virus

[21:07:57]

Kazan:

um.. that's the overclocked version not the base version

[21:08:00]

fryfrog:

mmm, i can't wait to get an 8800GT :)

[21:08:10]

Kazan:

i've not been impressed with the average lifespan of those

[21:08:16]

fryfrog:

finally a decent and affordable GPU

[21:08:19]

Kazan:

know several people who had theirs surive less than a month

[21:08:21]

iamlindoro__:

I like steam

[21:08:29]

directhex:

i like steam

[21:08:34]

xanium4332:

+1 for the 8800gt

[21:08:38]

directhex:

it's taken a bloody long time to mature though

[21:08:39]

iamlindoro__:

And content providers should, too... I have purchased probably a dozen games I wouldn't have otherwise

[21:08:43]

sn9:

fryfrog: no likey 6200?

[21:08:46]

fryfrog:

also, wtf is Fribidi?

[21:08:53]

fryfrog:

sn9: Not for gaming

[21:08:56]

Kazan:

steam is a virus

[21:09:02]

sn9:

oh, for gaming...

[21:09:03]

Kazan:

nothing going to change that

[21:09:06]

iamlindoro__:

So you keep saying, without explanation

[21:09:06]

fryfrog:

For teh windows :)

[21:09:07]

GreyFoxx:

fryfrog: font renderer for Hebrew/arabix fonts and such I think

[21:09:15]

javatexan:

steam is not a virus...windows is! ;)

[21:09:15]

iamlindoro__:

I run steam on WINE, works great

[21:09:17]

GreyFoxx:

arabic

[21:09:17]

xanium4332:

Kazan, steam WAS a virus, now it's actually not a bad program

[21:09:18]

fryfrog:

wtf, why is it in mythtv then?

[21:09:25]

fryfrog:

Fribidi formatting no

[21:09:32]

fryfrog:

right under all the opengl/etc stuff?

[21:09:32]

GreyFoxx:

fryfrog: Jewish/Arab people can't watch TV too ?

[21:09:32]

javatexan:

DOD:S rocks!

[21:09:53]

GreyFoxx:

Some people WANT their menus and such in their native language *shock*

[21:10:00]

sn9:

javatexan: windows generates steam

[21:10:04]

Kazan:

xanium4332: i have yet to see any evidence that it's still not a privacy-destroying piece of garbage

[21:10:04]

xanium4332:

GreyFoxx, not if it says 'no'

[21:10:04]

fryfrog:

no wai, not allowed!

[21:10:08]

directhex:

Kazan, other than it exhibiting 0 characteristics of a virus, of course

[21:10:19]

Kazan:

directhex: i should say it's spyware :P

[21:10:21]

fryfrog:

GreyFoxx: then why is it listed under the video... decoder type things?

[21:10:32]

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[21:10:48]

Kazan:

heh in doom the hd3870 is faster than the 8800GT OC

[21:10:53]

directhex:

Kazan, the reporting of how quickly you play etc, or the general use as a drm platform?

[21:11:05]

Kazan:

directhex: yes

[21:11:06]

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[21:11:06]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[21:11:08]

Kazan:

[/vorlon]

[21:11:27]

directhex:

Kazan, don;t make me electrocute you, and blast you with lots of energy weapons

[21:11:34]

GreyFoxx:

fryfrog: I think it's there as it's use for OSD rendering as well, but since I've never enabled it I can't say for certain

[21:11:43]

fryfrog:

oic

[21:12:34]

Kazan:

directhex: heh... basically i refuse to use DRM garbage of any nature

[21:12:51]

directhex:

Kazan, never played a dvd?

[21:13:08]

fryfrog:

no wai, ripped one maybe!

[21:13:13]

Kazan:

directhex: yeah.. normally by means of libdvdcss

[21:13:33]

Kazan:

but the wife got a gorram arccos dvd

[21:13:40]

xanium4332:

directhex, dvd's don't really have 'drm' more just encrption

[21:13:43]

Kazan:

it's a brand new title *gag*hairspray*gag*

[21:13:44]

directhex:

Kazan, so you play with drm then

[21:13:50]

Kazan:

i thought they said they discontinued that garbage

[21:13:55]

Kazan:

i play with stripping DRM off

[21:14:03]

fryfrog:

what is arccos?

[21:14:04]

Kazan:

i don't use software that "plays nice with DRM"

[21:14:07]

fryfrog:

new css?

[21:14:09]

Kazan:

fryfrog: a way to bust DVDs

[21:14:13]

fryfrog:

nice :/

[21:14:16]

directhex:

fryfrog, some new high-end drm of badness

[21:14:23]

fryfrog:

how does it do in old-fangled stand alone dvd players?

[21:14:27]

Kazan:

fryfrog: they put corrupt sectors on the dvd, and just before them they put dvdnav seek instructions

[21:14:27]

directhex:

fryfrog, luck

[21:14:34]

Kazan:

but a lot of drm-ignoring dvd players ignore that instruction

[21:14:38]

Kazan:

and hit the corrupt sector

[21:14:40]

fryfrog:

oic

[21:14:49]

Kazan:

and yes, a lot of stand alone players cannot play them either

[21:14:52]

fryfrog:

lame

[21:14:53]

Kazan:

which is why i believe sony got sued

[21:14:57]

fryfrog:

you should return it

[21:14:57]

xanium4332:

Seems like they shot themselves in the foot a little there

[21:14:57]

directhex:

yay for corrupt sector drm

[21:15:02]

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[21:15:04]

Kazan:

and i was pretty sure sony said they were discontinuing production of arrcos-fscked dvd's

[21:15:08]

Kazan:

but apparently they didn't

[21:15:11]

directhex:

xanium4332, the same company as the famous rootkit cares not

[21:15:23]

xanium4332:

remember corrupt floppy sectors

[21:15:27]

directhex:

steam is positively begnign by comparison

[21:15:28]

Kazan:

stupid medium companies

[21:15:30]

Kazan:

media*

[21:15:31]

sn9:

Kazan: you hate drm and you like ati? ironic

[21:15:43]

EnderTheThird:

Something magical happened today. I plugged in my new motherboard and switched everything over.... and the onboard optical audio worked without a hitch!

[21:15:55]

directhex:

EnderTheThird, easy peasy!

[21:16:00]

directhex:

sn9, aren't you the ati lover?

[21:16:00]

Kazan:

sn9: why is that

[21:16:08]

fryfrog:

EnderTheThird: miracle of miracles, now I know I am wrong and finally believe in the one true God!

[21:16:23]

EnderTheThird:

directhex: it went a lot better than last time. Every onboard device showed up as unknown. Had to RMA the damned thing.

[21:16:30]

sn9:

directhex: no, but it's easy to see how a gamer's narrow mind can make that mistake

[21:16:38]

fryfrog:

OUCH!

[21:16:59]

Kazan:

yeah.. because gamers are dumb you know

[21:16:59]

xanium4332:

It's so depressing when something arrives DOA

[21:17:03]

EnderTheThird:

fryfrog: then everything is as it should be

[21:17:03]

Kazan:

even those of us who write games

[21:17:14]

Kazan:

obviously writing game engines requires no intelligence what so ever

[21:17:16]

xanium4332:

Kazan, well the group in general are like sheep

[21:17:29]

Kazan:

xanium4332: yeah... those gamers wouldn't be in *this* channel though

[21:17:31]

fryfrog:

baaaaaa, baaa!

[21:17:42]

EnderTheThird:

impatient gamers don't last very long with Linux anyway.

[21:17:43]

Kazan:

as a whole gamers are spoiled whiny brats with no concept of how hard it is to make the games they play

[21:17:52]

directhex:

sn9, yes, narrow. you never DID offer any retort to the whole "multi-billion-dollaro companies use opteron, and opteron uses nforce in servers" point

[21:17:53]

sn9:

exactly

[21:17:56]

xanium4332:

EnderTheThird, good, it reduces bug reports

[21:18:10]

sn9:

directhex: because i fell asleep

[21:18:13]

Yahooadam:

as gamers, you often feel that the developers took your money and dont care any more

[21:18:28]

Kazan:

other than flakely USB controllers, i have to say the nforce4 chipset is rather nice

[21:18:33]

Kazan:

flakey*

[21:18:38]

EnderTheThird:

I know I didn't. I didn't get into Linux too much again until the 360 came out (ironic, I know). I decided games were way more fun on the HDTV with surround sound than on my dinky 20.1" monitor.

[21:18:58]

xanium4332:

EnderTheThird, combine the two

[21:19:05]

Kazan:

the games i like, with few exceptions, simply cannot ever be properly implemented on a console

[21:19:21]

directhex:

Kazan, i know a number of devs, including family. i even temped for a developer, and probably have a few credits in the "special thanks" if i read them in detail

[21:19:41]

Kazan:

directhex: i was talking to sn9 sarcastically :D

[21:20:01]

EnderTheThird:

Understandable. I miss faster, more precise control with RTS games, but I always enjoyed FPS more on console anyway. KB&M may be better for control, but my living room is WAY more comfortable, heh

[21:20:03]

directhex:

people are generally quite nostalgic about my cousin's games

[21:20:35]

i3ooi3oo:

that is so wrong to say EnderTheThird

[21:20:51]

xanium4332:

Kazan, lol, I thought you were referring to a terminal, not a *games* console...

[21:21:01]

i3ooi3oo:

FPS games without a mouse are not worth playing

[21:21:03]

Kazan:

rotfl

[21:21:10]

xanium4332:

i3ooi3oo, except halo

[21:21:15]

Kazan:

space flight combat sims without a joystick

[21:21:19]

Kazan:

MMOs without a keyboard

[21:21:32]

xanium4332:

racing on a kb sucks tho

[21:21:37]

directhex:

iamlindoro, no, that's somewhat flawed. playing games on a differet input device to how that specific game was written, that's flawed

[21:21:48]

EnderTheThird:

Heh, never got too far into MMOs myself. Probably for the best because I'd be afraid to lose myself.

[21:21:51]

iamlindoro__:

Wait... what'd I say?

[21:21:59]

Kazan:

some games are simply not really workable on certain input devices

[21:22:03]

directhex:

iamlindoro, playing a keyboard-tuned shooter with a pad doesn't work, playing a pad-tuned game with a mouse is wrong

[21:22:12]

iamlindoro__:

directhex: You must not mean me?

[21:22:12]

directhex:

bah

[21:22:16]

sn9:

hmm, pong without a paddle...

[21:22:18]

directhex:

i3ooi3oo, ^^

[21:22:23]

Kazan:

EnderTheThird: heh.. i played evercrack for about 2 years, now i play vanguard

[21:22:39]

Kazan:

been bonus xp the last few weeks and i've played myself out.. can't bring myself to play for a few days

[21:23:04]

iamlindoro__:

Heh... felt schizo since I'm working on my other computer ;)

[21:23:08]

Kazan:

man.. there was a version of asteroids for windws 95

[21:23:09]

i3ooi3oo:

well i learn for year the precise motion of a mouse without aceleration can't get it down on a thumb stick

[21:23:12]

EnderTheThird:

I've noticed Half-Life 2 (The Orange Box) on the 360 doesn't seem to play quite as nicely as original console-based FPSs. Graphics are fine, but the movement can make me feel uneasy compared to others.

[21:23:14]

Kazan:

i have been looking for that version of asteroids forever

[21:23:21]

Kazan:

because it was the best implementation of asteroids i've ever played

[21:23:39]

Kazan:

arcade games pwn sometimes :D

[21:23:47]

fryfrog:

Kazan: which server did you play on?

[21:23:52]

Kazan:

fryfrog: in everquest?

[21:24:00]

directhex:

i3ooi3oo, there's no challenge to aiming on a pc. the challenge is just how fast you can be. how many soldiers in real life can run around a corner and headshot from the hip?

[21:24:01]

Kazan:

started on maelin then transfered to tribunal during mergers

[21:24:10]

fryfrog:

Kazan: my wife and I used to play EQ to much, we quit and have hopped around from wow to vg to eq2 (casually this time)

[21:24:13]

fryfrog:

Kazan: yar

[21:24:19]

Kazan:

yar?

[21:24:25]

fryfrog:

yar, yes, yarp?

[21:24:27]

directhex:

EnderTheThird, better than the jerky-as-hell ps3 version

[21:24:37]

Kazan:

what vanguard server were you on?

[21:24:44]

Kazan:

you should come back.. it's a lot better than it was last spring

[21:24:46]

i3ooi3oo:

how would is a better question you would hit them with your gun them shoot them while they are on the ground

[21:24:59]

Kazan:

speaking of which *Checks guild website to see if we raid tonight*

[21:25:12]

fryfrog:

That I don't recall, we played in beta and it was just to much for our systems. We tried it a few months after release and it did okay (not great), but we never found any friend/guild.

[21:25:26]

** i3ooi3oo will never smoke crack or play it for that matter **

[21:25:28]

Kazan:

fryfrog: system specs?

[21:25:30]

fryfrog:

Same problem in WoW, no good friends or guild.

[21:25:32]

Kazan:

it runs a lot faster now

[21:25:34]

** sn9 remembers shoot-em-ups with genuine fake guns as the input devices **

[21:25:36]

fryfrog:

3200+ 6600GT

[21:25:36]

Kazan:

WoW >/dev/null

[21:25:40]

directhex:

the wife plays LotR:O

[21:25:44]

fryfrog:

Kazan: oh, yeah it runs much better

[21:25:45]

Kazan:

hmm.. you could probably run on balanced or low

[21:25:45]

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[21:25:54]

** Kazan runs on max settings **

[21:26:02]

fryfrog:

Well, now that the 8800GT is out and I *might* be moving to Palo Alto, we'll get new systems :)

[21:26:04]

Kazan:

but the character animations are still performance-sucking bastards

[21:26:10]

Kazan:

moving to palo alto?

[21:26:12]

Kazan:

i'm sorry :P

[21:26:13]

fryfrog:

But now we play EQII with a great guild and friends.

[21:26:25]

fryfrog:

Kazan: don't be, if I do it'll be because I'll work for facebook!

[21:26:39]

Kazan:

now i really am sorry for you

[21:26:43]

fryfrog:

it is funny, cause the guild is a GLBT friendly guild :)

[21:26:51]

Kazan:

unless you have only a like a 10–15 minute drive to work

[21:26:59]

directhex:

nobody's friendly like a bunch o' queers!

[21:27:00]

fryfrog:

Kazan: I'd live 1mi from FB

[21:27:09]

Kazan:

nice

[21:27:11]

fryfrog:

and get +600/mo for doing it

[21:27:17]

sn9:

bicycle commute

[21:27:18]

fryfrog:

(being 1mi away, i mean)

[21:27:21]

Kazan:

yup sn9

[21:27:21]

fryfrog:

or walk!

[21:27:26]

Kazan:

blade

[21:27:34]

Kazan:

ooh fight! FIGHT IN ARSENAL V CHELSEA!

[21:27:34]

sn9:

no blading

[21:27:34]

fryfrog:

i drive 30–45min now to get to work, i can't imagine living 1mi away

[21:27:41]

Kazan:

bike or blade

[21:27:44]

Kazan:

walking is slow

[21:27:51]

Kazan:

and you cannot jog to work

[21:27:52]

fryfrog:

i'd probably eventually bike, but i need to walk

[21:28:04]

fryfrog:

i broke my ankle like 8 months ago and it could use the useage

[21:28:08]

directhex:

Kazan, fuck arsenal and chelsea

[21:28:18]

Kazan:

heh

[21:28:20]

** tjcarter stumbles upon asciidoc and is floored by it **

[21:28:21]

Kazan:

no red cards issued

[21:28:24]

Kazan:

wasn't much of a fight

[21:28:37]

xanium4332:

sn9, what's asciidoc?

[21:28:45]

sn9:

xanium4332: me?

[21:28:47]

Kazan:

fryfrog: i did web development for 18 months... i cannot stand that shiat

[21:28:56]

Kazan:

i work on real code, not scripts

[21:28:58]

fryfrog:

I'm not a web-dev

[21:28:59]

xanium4332:

sn9, sry that was t [TAB] accident

[21:29:03]

EnderTheThird:

wow, i leave for 3 minutes and everyone turns into a chatty bitch!

[21:29:05]

Kazan:

the 1 hour each direction commute didn't help

[21:29:08]

fryfrog:

At facebook, I guess I'd be kind of a SysAdmin

[21:29:08]

Kazan:

fryfrog: server admin?

[21:29:14]

fryfrog:

Kazan: yeah, more like.

[21:29:15]

Kazan:

that isn't bad then

[21:29:19]

sn9:

xanium4332: tjcarter does not start with S

[21:29:29]

tjcarter:

xanium4332: it's basically an answer to "DocBook is great for computers, but bad for humans!"

[21:29:32]

tjcarter:

http://www.methods.co.nz/asciidoc/

[21:29:33]

fryfrog:

It seems that facebook is recently going 24/7 for monitoring / fixing problems, and I'd be part of that "group"

[21:29:43]

directhex:

fryfrog, shift work?

[21:29:45]

fryfrog:

sounds like a mix of "NOC" and "Sys Admin"

[21:29:47]

Kazan:

WTF!

[21:29:54]

Kazan:

my guild just kicked out two members for something

[21:29:56]

fryfrog:

yeah, mine would probably be 3rd shift, i've been told sun-wed

[21:30:01]

Kazan:

going to have to ask kimja whisky tango foxtrot

[21:30:10]

directhex:

fryfrog, ick. i nearly ended up doing shift work for a gambling co

[21:30:12]

fryfrog:

but a lot of times that ends up different, so i dunno

[21:30:19]

fryfrog:

i don't mind shiftwork

[21:30:28]

fryfrog:

in fact, i usually prefer it above 9–5

[21:30:30]

Kazan:

what was worse than web dev was 1 hour drive each direction :(

[21:30:33]

Kazan:

commuting is the debil

[21:30:40]

Toxicity999:

You guys see entertainer on Digg?

[21:30:49]

fryfrog:

less traffic, more time (if you are the right shift) to do stuff during the day as needed.

[21:30:59]

EnderTheThird:

toxicity999: what was left of it after the Digg Effect, heh

[21:31:02]

directhex:

Toxicity999, site was down when i checked

[21:31:08]

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[21:31:12]

Toxicity999:

Well youtube video still.

[21:31:16]

Toxicity999:

Looks interestinmg

[21:31:19]

EnderTheThird:

Fancy interface, but without recording I have no use for it (yet)

[21:31:21]

Toxicity999:

*interesting too

[21:31:33]

Toxicity999:

EnderTheThird I'd love if it worked with mythbackend

[21:31:41]

EnderTheThird:

Yeah.

[21:31:41]

Toxicity999:

for TV

[21:31:47]

xanium4332:

Toxicity999, maybe we can steal the interface

[21:31:59]

Kazan:

get to making a theme xan

[21:32:03]

EnderTheThird:

xanium4332: that would be nice. :)

[21:32:21]

Toxicity999:

well that's always a possibility too.

[21:32:22]

EnderTheThird:

Myth could use some nifty transitions and effects, heh

[21:32:31]

xanium4332:

definitly

[21:32:41]

Toxicity999:

I love the overlaying for video too, I multitask with video/audio a LOT

[21:32:49]

xanium4332:

it seems to have a got a little 'unmanagable' now

[21:32:50]

directhex:

feel free to attack mythscreenstack.cpp

[21:32:58]

directhex:

that's the home of the menu transitions

[21:33:06]

xanium4332:

directhex, I will once I learn a little C++ :P

[21:33:08]

EnderTheThird:

toxicity999: that's what I love about Compiz Fusion. Changing transparency of windows on the fly is great for that.

[21:33:17]

Toxicity999:

for sure

[21:33:34]

sn9:

xanium4332: no, learn a lot

[21:33:37]

javatexan:

when running myth-rebuilddatabase --file, why does it ask you for the duration anyway...that could/should be calculated to be sure its right....Is the duration important for recordings table?

[21:33:41]

Kazan:

composite and aiglx extensions.. they safe on nvidia-glx?

[21:33:44]

Toxicity999:

oh theres a recorded TV mockup on flickr

[21:33:48]

Kazan:

brb a sec

[21:34:00]

xanium4332:

Kazan, why aiglx, doesnt the nvidia driver provide it's own?

[21:34:05]

Toxicity999:

It does.

[21:34:07]

Toxicity999:

AFAIK

[21:34:21]

directhex:

Kazan, fine.

[21:34:25]

cafuego:

Kazan: compiz on a frontend seems to work fine

[21:34:44]

Toxicity999:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9111235@N06/

[21:34:54]

directhex:

Kazan, at worst, you need to add an option to xorg.conf for "Option AddRGBAVisuals True" or somesucj

[21:34:57]

Toxicity999:

unless you count the ABI mismatch awhile back

[21:35:00]

EnderTheThird:

Don't you guys hate it when the case you buy doesn't have changeable plates for the PCI slots in the back? The case I have just has the "break off" ones that can't be put back on there after they're taken off.

[21:35:01]

xanium4332:

cafuego, except with panels, mythtv doesnt appear infront of them (at least on a default install of ubuntu)

[21:35:02]

Kazan:

xanium4332: thought aiglx was something to do with xgl/compiz/etc

[21:35:02]

cafuego:

it probably makes it run a bit hotter though

[21:35:02]

directhex:

Kazan, nvidia does composite+glx by default

[21:35:11]

Kazan:

kk

[21:35:11]

Toxicity999:

directhex should be automatic on latest X and drivers.

[21:35:13]

i3ooi3oo:

not always

[21:35:19]

cafuego:

xanium4332: The gnome panels? Does here.

[21:35:24]

Kazan:

those newer extensons can be touchy

[21:35:27]

Toxicity999:

it has a blacklist iirc

[21:35:29]

xanium4332:

cafuego, probably just my setup

[21:35:38]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: i just use tape to stick the break-offs back on

[21:35:38]

directhex:

Kazan, aiglx is the works-with-xorg offscreen rendering thing, xgl is the driver-doesn't-support-aiglx alternative xserver

[21:35:39]

Kazan:

oh.. aiglx is opengl acceleration over network

[21:35:42]

i3ooi3oo:

i have had problems with the legacy-drivers

[21:35:59]

Kazan:

no reason for aiglx to be enabled then :D

[21:35:59]

Toxicity999:

XGL is a full on 3d environment, but nothing different end-user

[21:36:05]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: the true engineer's solution :) i might do that if I don't have some extra plates from other cases sitting around

[21:36:14]

Kazan:

brb raiding the kitchen

[21:36:28]

directhex:

Kazan, aiglx is offscreen aceleration rendering, xgl is a hacked replacement x-server to do aiglx features without aiglx support that xorg requires

[21:36:37]

xanium4332:

Kazan, I thought aiglx provided some texture_from_pixmap feature (I think it's that, or something anyway) which allows compiz/.../.... to work. However nvidia made their own implementation

[21:36:39]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: why squander your supply of extra plates? wasteful, IMO

[21:36:49]

Toxicity999:

oh the main entertainer site is still up http://www.entertainer-project.com/ and on launchpad for code

[21:36:58]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: meh, might as well use the little buggers for something.

[21:37:06]

i3ooi3oo:

EnderTheThird: i got tons of them i throw away 30 a week or so

[21:37:54]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: i always want to stick those on boxes i see missing 'em

[21:38:10]

EnderTheThird:

i3ooi3oo: haha. i have a fanless AGP GF 7600 GS just sitting around now. And 1 GB of RAM (forget the type). I might just bring my old 2.8 GHz P4 into work to play with.

[21:38:11]

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[21:38:24]

xanium4332:

Kazan, I think it's better to use nvidia implementation, I think it allows opengl stuff to be rendered on a cube

[21:38:42]

xanium4332:

so if u wobble a window the opengl stuff wobbles as well

[21:38:51]

directhex:

xanium4332, i've kinda lost what youre talking about

[21:39:04]

directhex:

xanium4332, you DO know what aiglx actually is, right?

[21:39:21]

xanium4332:

directhex, desnt it supply the texture_from_pixmap feature

[21:39:45]

directhex:

xanium4332, that's largely it. theres no "nvidia made their own implementation" crap, there's just "driver supports AIGLX or doesn't"

[21:40:14]

xanium4332:

directhex, so how can I have compiz working without xgl or aiglx

[21:40:14]

directhex:

xanium4332, if you have AIGLX, GL-based windows managers can work on xorg. without, you need a special hacked x-server likr xgl

[21:40:32]

EnderTheThird:

i got rid of ATI after about 4–6 months of screwing with it on Compiz. Got tired of it and just ordered a new video card instead.

[21:40:46]

directhex:

xanium4332, aiglx is an extension for xorg – i.e. regular xorg will work with compiz. xgl is a replacement for xorg

[21:41:09]

xanium4332:

directhex, so what's this? http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_nVidia_GL_Desktop_Effects

[21:41:26]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: which ati was it?

[21:41:59]

directhex:

xanium4332, outdated, missing the point in several places, and info on enabling aiglx

[21:42:00]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: 9800 AIW Pro. Bought a GF 7600 GS instead.

[21:42:15]

EnderTheThird:

Too bad the TV in on that AIW doesn't work with Myth though. :-/

[21:42:21]

EnderTheThird:

That thing would rock with Myth, heh

[21:42:43]

xanium4332:

directhex, so where's the line saying you need 'Option "AIGLX" "true"'

[21:42:44]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: i got it working fine on a 9700 mobility by just chucking fglrx

[21:42:51]

Kazan:

gentoo users missing the point? NEVER!

[21:42:59]

directhex:

xanium4332, xorg has implicitly loaded extensions for years

[21:43:07]

directhex:

xanium4332, check your xorg.0.log

[21:43:26]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: this was about 1.5 years ago. I don't think the fglrx or open driver could do 3D accel for Compiz back then, at least not without XGL

[21:43:30]

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[21:43:51]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: open driver had aiglx from the getgo

[21:43:51]

directhex:

xanium4332, my xorg.conf is mostly empty. font paths, resolution capabilities, etc, are all automagic in xorg

[21:43:53]

xanium4332:

directhex, this is no lie. I have no mention of aiglx in xorg.0.log, yet I'm using compiz

[21:44:13]

directhex:

xanium4332, please just take this on trust. you're using aiglx.

[21:44:26]

xanium4332:

directhex, ok

[21:44:31]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: not sure it worked with my 9800 at the time though. but even if it did, oh well. my GF cards are all fanless now anyway, which helps on my noise :)

[21:44:45]

sn9:

xanium4332: case-insensitive search?

[21:44:58]

xanium4332:

sn9, yes

[21:45:06]

sn9:

hmm

[21:45:09]

xanium4332:

quote from now dead gentoo-xeffects: nVidia implements (in)direct rendering itself without using the opengl layer provided by Xgl or AiGLX

[21:45:49]

sn9:

xanium4332: that's because nvidia opengl is not xorg opengl

[21:46:34]

xanium4332:

sn9, but does that mean I'm still using aiglx?

[21:46:52]

directhex:

xanium4332, yes.

[21:47:08]

xanium4332:

directhex, even though I can't find any mention of it in my logs?

[21:47:14]

directhex:

xanium4332, yes

[21:47:24]

xanium4332:

directhex, ok

[21:47:59]

directhex:

xanium4332, if you weren't using aiglx, you'd need to replace xorg with xgl

[21:48:01]

xanium4332:

http://tinyurl.com/2dgljs

[21:48:18]

directhex:

xanium4332, always assume the gentoo wiki is wrong

[21:48:27]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: not really possible with old dell desktop-replacement laptops

[21:48:36]

xanium4332:

directhex, that's gentoo xeffects

[21:49:17]

directhex:

even worse

[21:49:57]

xanium4332:

entertainer's website is back up

[21:50:40]

directhex:

looks a little... well... basic

[21:50:58]

xanium4332:

it looks young

[21:51:09]

xanium4332:

but the videocast ooks pretty impressive

[21:51:18]

directhex:

it looks like a menu system

[21:51:41]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: it actually is possible to use AIW cards with myth, as long as the machine is backend-only

[21:51:56]

directhex:

it COULD be a frontend if it wanted, using gmyth

[21:52:02]

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[21:52:15]

xanium4332:

have you watched the youtube vid, the video behind the menu is a nice effect

[21:52:40]

directhex:

less candy, more meat!

[21:52:50]

moodboom:

hey all – just got mythtv svn working – anyone have any idea why X shuts down when i exit mythfrontend?

[21:53:16]

directhex:

moodboom, buggy x driver

[21:53:22]

sn9:

moodboom: what distro?

[21:53:29]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: with the TV in and everything?

[21:53:45]

moodboom:

sn9 gentoo – installed mythtv from portage, which ran fine

[21:54:01]

moodboom:

sn9 then removed and installed svn version

[21:54:22]

xanium4332:

moodboom, how are you running mythtv?

[21:54:39]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: the trouble with AIW is that you can't separate the tv-in from output. if the box is backend-only headless, output is irrelevant

[21:54:49]

EnderTheThird:

moodboom: you're not accidentally choosing to exit and shutdown, are you?

[21:55:03]

EnderTheThird:

or if that's the only option it gives you when you close the FE

[21:55:04]

moodboom:

xanium4332 running mythbackend in one term (as root), starting mythfrontend from another (as user)

[21:55:26]

moodboom:

EnterTheThird there were two exit options, i chose "exit" not "exit and shutdown" or whatever

[21:55:39]

EnderTheThird:

k, just double checking, heh :)

[21:55:42]

moodboom:

:>

[21:56:20]

EnderTheThird:

sn9: got ya. i'll stick with my PVR 500 and HDHR. I don't really need any more inputs, and my BE is my primary FE anyway.

[21:56:40]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: not to mention the AIW won't encode

[21:57:03]

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[21:57:29]

moodboom:

ok, thanks, going to play some more... i'll likely see you all on my next X session :>

[21:58:18]

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[21:58:18]

EnderTheThird:

i tried to get my cousin's old PC to run Myth. It runs it great, and as luck would have it, he had an old TV tuner in there too. Unfortunately it's an old POS framegrabber that outputs sound internally through an internal cable into the mobo and the audio sync is way the hell off :-/

[21:58:42]

fryfrog:

mute the captur input

[21:58:47]

fryfrog:

you probably forgot that

[21:58:54]

fryfrog:

if you pause, does audio keep going?

[21:58:55]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: if it's a bt878, the sound issue is easily fixed

[21:59:17]

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[21:59:19]

EnderTheThird:

it's a bt878. if you happen to know how to do some of that via CLI, i'll ssh into his machine now and toy around with it :)

[21:59:34]

fryfrog:

EnderTheThird: sure, the alsa command line tools ummm...

[21:59:37]

fryfrog:

alsamixer?

[21:59:39]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: i know how to do it in mythtv-setup

[21:59:46]

fryfrog:

just try "alsa<tab><tab> and see what happens.

[21:59:48]

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[21:59:51]

EnderTheThird:

i wasn't there to finish setting it up because i forgot to bring an internal audio cable with me (didn't even think i'd need it), so i had to mail him one and have him plug it in. i wasn't there to help with the audio

[22:00:10]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: you do NOT need the cable

[22:00:24]

fryfrog:

sn9: *ONLY* if the bt878 card works with the audio driver

[22:00:31]

fryfrog:

some the traces are cut, some don't even have it

[22:00:52]

sn9:

fryfrog: 878 == audio driver support, 848 == none, generally

[22:00:53]

EnderTheThird:

i couldn't get the audio out of there. i tried loading the bt878 snd module manually

[22:01:04]

EnderTheThird:

but i'm not very experienced with sound issues

[22:01:28]

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[22:01:35]

EnderTheThird:

what setting should i look at from mythtv-setup?

[22:01:47]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: for myth, you need oss emulation

[22:02:17]

EnderTheThird:

any idea if that's standard installed for Ubuntu?

[22:02:30]

sn9:

audio device needs changing from /dev/dsp to /dev/adsp1

[22:02:42]

directhex:

sn9, what?

[22:02:44]

sn9:

yes, it is. i thought you had gentoo

[22:03:01]

directhex:

sn9, you're quite, wuite wrong. myth uses alsa directly if youn want it to

[22:03:04]

EnderTheThird:

Nope. moodboom had gentoo

[22:03:14]

sn9:

directhex: for INPUT?

[22:03:51]

sn9:

all the myth docs say otherwise

[22:04:22]

directhex:

oh, input. i've never really cared. death to framegrabbers

[22:04:33]

EnderTheThird:

directhex: agreed

[22:04:57]

EnderTheThird:

but i figure if i can get him up and running with Myth on an old framegrabber, he won't mind splurging for a dual tuner hardware encoder

[22:05:13]

EnderTheThird:

hard to justify $150 for a tuner if you're not a nerd :)

[22:05:19]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: that's the only reason i'm bothering with bt878

[22:05:47]

sn9:

the foot-in-the-door effect

[22:06:16]

EnderTheThird:

exactly

[22:06:36]

EnderTheThird:

i'm ssh/VNC'd into his machine now if you care to help out though

[22:06:52]

sn9:

you'll need to run mythtv-setup

[22:07:05]

sn9:

is it trunk or .20?

[22:07:17]

EnderTheThird:

argh, one sec. forgot to give it a window manager for VNC logins. gotta fix that

[22:07:21]

EnderTheThird:

.20–2

[22:07:40]

sn9:

hmm, i've forgotten what was different in .20

[22:07:56]

EnderTheThird:

i can navigate around if needed. i'm sure it's in there somewhere

[22:07:57]

sn9:

in trunk, go to Capture Cards

[22:08:05]

sn9:

first screen

[22:08:05]

EnderTheThird:

one sec

[22:08:22]

cafuego:

no storage groups, no running water or sewer systems, lousy hospitals...

[22:08:29]

EnderTheThird:

ha, prick won't answer his phone so i can't check if it works anyway

[22:08:29]

sn9:

you also have to pin the sampling rate to 48000

[22:08:40]

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[22:09:08]

sn9:

there's only the one bt878 card, right?

[22:10:15]

sn9:

you have to make it 48000 in the card definition, AND in the Recording Profiles in the frontend's control of the backend

[22:10:30]

EnderTheThird:

only the one, yeah

[22:11:36]

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[22:12:58]

EnderTheThird:

hmmm, it's not giving me a terminal when I VNC into

[22:13:17]

sn9:

xterm

[22:16:34]

EnderTheThird:

no, i mean it's giving me a blank screen when i login remotely

[22:16:46]

EnderTheThird:

just the X cursor

[22:16:51]

sn9:

use the qt painter

[22:17:04]

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[22:17:06]

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[22:18:55]

EnderTheThird:

for everything.

[22:19:20]

sn9:

yes, qt for everything

[22:20:00]

EnderTheThird:

not sure how. kinda new to VNC

[22:20:16]

sn9:

myth's qt painter

[22:20:34]

clever:

i 'fixed' my pvr150 artifact

[22:20:40]

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[22:20:42]

clever:

i changed the recording width to 480

[22:20:55]

clever:

i'll play arround to see what other widths it handles

[22:20:59]

sn9:

clever: was it 720 before?

[22:21:11]

EnderTheThird:

no no, it's not giving me a good session when i login remotely in the 1st place. i think the fonts aren't being found so it won't startup

[22:21:11]

clever:

yeah was 720x480

[22:21:29]

clever:

the artifact is a verticle dashed line

[22:21:30]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: which client are you using?

[22:21:33]

EnderTheThird:

i just get a blank screen when i login to X. i can't start mythtv-setup

[22:21:35]

EnderTheThird:

xtightvnc

[22:21:42]

EnderTheThird:

per the Ubuntu community docs

[22:21:47]

clever:

pair of lines

[22:21:57]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: odd, that's the only one that works for me

[22:22:40]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: which video mode are you using in X on the client?

[22:22:47]

clever:

sn9: artifact is back at 704x480

[22:22:58]

sn9:

clever: try 640

[22:23:11]

EnderTheThird:

it's not finding the fonts. that's why it's not going

[22:23:22]

clever:

sn9: just going to keep lowering it 1 at a time till it goes away

[22:23:29]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: shouldn't matter

[22:23:34]

clever:

688x480

[22:24:10]

clever:

still there

[22:24:23]

EnderTheThird:

saying it can't start the vnc server

[22:24:32]

sn9:

oh, the server

[22:24:43]

clever:

vnc server is tricky on ubuntu

[22:24:56]

sn9:

yes

[22:24:56]

clever:

the default vncserver script tries to use the twm window manager

[22:25:01]

clever:

which isnt installed so it faisl

[22:25:05]

sn9:

yuck

[22:25:17]

clever:

i just replace the vncserver script with a custom one depending on the case

[22:25:28]

sn9:

i typically install twm anyway

[22:25:28]

clever:

mine fires up Xvnc4 metacity and mythfrontend

[22:25:49]

clever:

and with a slight tweak it could easily go gnome-session(a full gnome login) or mythtv-setup

[22:26:30]

EnderTheThird:

hmmm

[22:26:33]

sn9:

clever: part of the point of vnc is to mirror the server's own display

[22:26:39]

clever:

ahh

[22:26:42]

EnderTheThird:

the font paths i entered are the same ones i have at home, so it's weird that it's not working

[22:26:45]

clever:

sn9: then you dont want the 'vncserver' package

[22:27:01]

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[22:27:04]

clever:

sn9: you want to either stick the vnc server into the existing one as a module in xorg.conf

[22:27:14]

clever:

sn9: or use the horidly slow x0vncserver which polls as a client

[22:27:39]

clever:

Xvnc4 :1 -screen scrn 1340x800x16 PasswordFile=/home/clever/.vnc/passwd &

[22:27:43]

sn9:

what about x11vnc?

[22:28:03]

clever:

thats the key line for making your own X server+vnc server with its own 'screen'

[22:28:33]

clever:

using that i can get a fullscreen mythfrontend without affecting whatever is allready on the real screen

[22:28:50]

clever:

ive also gotten a full gnome login on my kde box:P

[22:29:16]

sn9:

i can do that with xdmcp

[22:29:29]

clever:

never bothered to learn that:P

[22:29:35]

clever:

and i cant test 640x480

[22:29:38]

clever:

card is busy now

[22:30:04]

i3ooi3oo:

ttfn time to comute

[22:30:24]

EnderTheThird:

hmm, well this isn't going quite as well as i'd hoped

[22:30:31]

EnderTheThird:

i've VNC'd into it before (i think)

[22:32:17]

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[22:32:19]

clever:

sn9: at 640x480 the artifact has moved noticable to the right

[22:32:22]

tailsfan92:

Helloi

[22:32:41]

clever:

sn9: i suspect it could just be exactly x pixels from the origin

[22:32:48]

tailsfan92:

I want an app that just records live input

[22:32:57]

tailsfan92:

or is this too fancy

[22:33:11]

sn9:

tailsfan92: plenty do that, and yes, this is too fancy

[22:33:13]

at0m|c:

like arecord?

[22:33:19]

tailsfan92:

on linux

[22:33:22]

tailsfan92:

I am a gtamer

[22:33:34]

clever:

mythtv will have a few seconds delay in its 'live tv'

[22:33:38]

tailsfan92:

and want to record myself playing

[22:33:57]

justinh:

ok. new frontend – no more problems playing back BBC recordings. but channel four stuff... stutters before & after ad breaks. not for long but very annoying. it's a blimmin 1.83Ghz cpu ffs you'd think it'd be able to cope with sdtv mpeg2 :(

[22:34:00]

clever:

but you can allways split the video line before it goes into the computer

[22:34:02]

at0m|c:

tailsfan92, look for arecord

[22:34:06]

tailsfan92:

k

[22:34:12]

tailsfan92:

it works on linux

[22:34:27]

at0m|c:

of course

[22:34:28]

tailsfan92:

bye

[22:34:29]

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[22:34:30]

sn9:

tailsfan92: arecord is for audio

[22:34:52]

at0m|c:

ah. he's looking for motion? :]

[22:34:59]

sn9:

duh

[22:35:12]

clever:

'motion' is just to catch 'motion' :P

[22:35:28]

clever:

he seems to want to record video&audio

[22:35:45]

sn9:

yes

[22:35:48]

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[22:35:59]

at0m|c:

tailsfan92> I want an app that just records live input

[22:36:15]

at0m|c:

could be anything. oh well, tourists.

[22:36:40]

sn9:

[Wed 09 Jan 2008 02:32:04 PM PST] ! <tailsfan92> I am a gtamer

[22:36:57]

sn9:

[Wed 09 Jan 2008 02:32:20 PM PST] ! <tailsfan92> and want to record myself playing

[22:36:57]

** at0m|c googles gtamer **

[22:36:57]

clever:

could be a typo:P

[22:36:57]

sn9:

is

[22:36:57]

clever:

gt are close by

[22:36:57]

iamlindoro__:

A gnome tamer

[22:37:04]

sn9:

lol

[22:37:04]

at0m|c:

lol

[22:37:09]

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[22:37:11]

justinh:

aren't gnomes closely related to trolls?

[22:37:16]

iamlindoro__:

He wants to record himself playing with the little people

[22:37:30]

iamlindoro__:

Which I'm fairly certain sounds illegal

[22:37:39]

iamlindoro__:

or at least like the kind of video they put behind a curtain

[22:38:44]

clever:

WHOA

[22:38:45]

clever:

i never even noticed

[22:38:52]

clever:

i dont even own my home folder!

[22:39:07]

iamlindoro__:

me neither, but I'm making mortgage payments

[22:39:15]

sn9:

on a folder?

[22:39:32]

iamlindoro__:

yup.

[22:39:32]

clever:

no idea how ive been able to save stuff to home before:P

[22:39:32]

iamlindoro__:

I own .mythtv now, someday I hope to own Dekstop

[22:39:32]

lsobral (lsobral!n=sobral@200.184.118.132) has quit ("leaving")

[22:39:35]

iamlindoro__:

er Desktop

[22:39:37]

sn9:

clever: 666

[22:39:44]

sn9:

er, 777

[22:40:15]

clever:

sn9: i suspect the video artifact is at a fixed pixel location

[22:40:27]

sn9:

you already said that

[22:40:30]

clever:

and its at near 590 on the 720x480 screenshot

[22:40:43]

clever:

so im going to try a width under 590

[22:40:46]

at0m|c:

sn9, remember my tuner not being recognised after removing g450. pvr350 is in 2nd pci slot, since 1st shares resources w the agp slot. will remove the g450 again, and try to insert the 1394 card in the 1st pci slot. think that may keep prv350 at equal pci ID?

[22:40:46]

sn9:

you can see the dots?

[22:40:51]

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[22:40:53]

clever:

sn9: its more of a dashed line

[22:41:02]

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[22:41:17]

clever:

sn9: -------- but verticle

[22:41:20]

sn9:

at0m|c: i'd recommend pulling the 350 altogether

[22:41:29]

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[22:41:37]

sn9:

tailsfan92: arecord is for audio

[22:42:13]

at0m|c:

sn9: then reboot and then insert it again?

[22:42:14]

clever:

sn9: at 592 the artifact is RIGHT on the edge of the black band the image ends at

[22:42:19]

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[22:42:26]

sn9:

at0m|c: no, put a 150 in its place

[22:42:28]

clever:

much less noticable

[22:42:45]

clever:

which also confirms its at a pixel offset

[22:43:22]

at0m|c:

sn9, i ordered one as second tuner and no one can promise me one to arrive before easter ;)

[22:43:39]

tailsfan92:

yes

[22:43:41]

tailsfan92:

I sawe

[22:43:44]

clever:

sn9: i could push it lower if its a problem:)

[22:43:46]

tailsfan92:

I want video

[22:44:03]

at0m|c:

kino then?

[22:44:05]

sn9:

you don't want a 350 in a headless box — it's headaches all around that way

[22:44:19]

tailsfan92:

does kino do that

[22:44:44]

at0m|c:

it can capture video yes

[22:45:16]

sn9:

tailsfan92: kino is for dv editing, kinda like imovie on the mac

[22:45:16]

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[22:45:16]

tailsfan92:

from my card

[22:45:16]

tailsfan92:

oh

[22:45:16]

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[22:45:17]

tailsfan92:

I already have it

[22:45:36]

at0m|c:

sn9, re: headless – then i keep the g450 there, no other use for it atm..

[22:45:40]

tailsfan92:

can it also simutainoulsy get commantary from my mic

[22:45:42]

tailsfan92:

nm

[22:45:45]

tailsfan92:

bye

[22:45:54]

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[22:45:54]

at0m|c:

cya

[22:46:07]

sn9:

at0m|c: surely you have an old trident somewhere...

[22:46:29]

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[22:46:30]

at0m|c:

nope, g450 was my only card for over 10yrs eh

[22:46:47]

sn9:

i mean before that

[22:47:06]

at0m|c:

before that was ibm ps2 laptop

[22:47:13]

sn9:

oh

[22:47:13]

at0m|c:

and before that was ISA

[22:47:16]

at0m|c:

ehehe

[22:47:33]

** J-e-f-f-A-work has a g450 he's going to use in a dedicated MAME box some year... **

[22:47:48]

at0m|c:

g450's rule

[22:47:57]

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[22:48:08]

sn9:

they're grrreat

[22:48:10]

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[22:49:16]

** directhex is looking forward to bulding the wife's new pc **

[22:49:52]

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[22:50:28]

J-e-f-f-A-work:

directhex: Either build a Linux box or buy her an iMac — then you won't have M$ virsues on your network... ;-)

[22:51:00]

sn9:

macbook pro ftw

[22:51:37]

sn9:

sitting on a linux box, that is

[22:51:57]

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[22:53:50]

EnderTheThird:

anyone able to help me out with some VNC font problems?

[22:53:51]

sn9:

of course, once you're spoiled by not dealing with m$ viruses, you start finding fault with linux and mac

[22:54:03]

directhex:

sn9, one of my office pcs would be a mac running linux

[22:54:24]

directhex:

J-e-f-f-A-work, she'll have dual boot, and needs to learn to love one of the two OSen provided

[22:54:34]

sn9:

the machine i'm in this channel on is a mac running linux

[22:55:35]

directhex:

http://www2.apebox.org/wordpress/wp-content/g . . . IMG_0120.JPG

[22:55:42]

directhex:

multi-layer irony: check the input devices!

[22:57:10]

EnderTheThird:

directhex, you are a walking, typing contradiction

[22:57:19]

clever:

sn9: once i did a scandisk on 'root' from windows and it rebooted to scan

[22:57:19]

directhex:

EnderTheThird, yes!

[22:57:28]

clever:

sn9: it fried a system file and stoped booting totaly

[22:57:42]

sn9:

clever: yes, i've seen that

[22:57:50]

clever:

sn9: another time long ago that got STUCK on and EVERY time i booted it would scan and then not finish booting

[22:58:02]

sn9:

seen that, too

[22:58:08]

clever:

with linux i was able to painlessly netboot my laptop

[22:58:10]

clever:

and fsck the root

[22:58:29]

clever:

then with a smartctrl call i found out the drive had 24 hours to live!

[22:58:41]

at0m|c:

clever, i have the same problem of not continuing the reboot after "shutdown -Fr" with usb disks connected

[22:58:52]

at0m|c:

at least, i suspect the usb disks

[22:59:02]

at0m|c:

always had to Ctrl-D

[22:59:11]

clever:

odd

[22:59:22]

clever:

i often use shutdown -h now;exit

[22:59:23]

at0m|c:

untill i unmounted it while running, then fsck'd it

[22:59:28]

at0m|c:

yea

[22:59:28]

clever:

to logout at the same instant

[22:59:33]

clever:

more .bash_history saved

[22:59:50]

at0m|c:

the logs dont go to .bash_history here

[23:00:35]

EnderTheThird:

Can you guys think of why xtightvnc would show an error that it can't start because it can't find fonts, but then still allow me to login to the vnc session?

[23:01:06]

at0m|c:

EnderTheThird, did you install the fonts on the vnc server?

[23:01:15]

sn9:

EnderTheThird: because the server's borked?

[23:01:29]

EnderTheThird:

the fontPath appears to be valid in /etc/vnc.conf

[23:01:38]

EnderTheThird:

/usr/share/fonts/X11/misc

[23:01:44]

EnderTheThird:

fonts are in there

[23:02:12]

at0m|c:

on the server, right?

[23:02:41]

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[23:02:54]

EnderTheThird:

yeah

[23:02:56]

clever:

found a fun way to test the overscan wizard

[23:03:08]

clever:

i tried shaving a pixel off 2 sides and lost fullscan

[23:03:18]

clever:

now the edgess are covered by gnome-panel

[23:03:29]

clever:

which emulates horidoverscan ratios!

[23:03:53]

EnderTheThird:

clever: overscan wizard? sounds like something i could use. my DLP overscans like a real prick and i have to manually set resolution for Myth FE

[23:04:16]

clever:

EnderTheThird: its a new plugin

[23:04:17]

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[23:04:19]

clever:

in trunk

[23:04:22]

clever:

its under setup

[23:04:27]

EnderTheThird:

but Gnome is still overscanned. Oh

[23:04:44]

EnderTheThird:

I was hoping for a fix for Gnome, heh

[23:04:45]

clever:

myth lost ONTOP when i shaved some pixels off the side

[23:04:53]

clever:

because it was no longer covering the entire screen

[23:05:01]

clever:

causing gnome to cover parts of myth up

[23:05:08]

sn9:

overunderdone

[23:05:43]

clever:

now ive got myth perfectly centered in the useable screen area

[23:05:48]

EnderTheThird:

at0m|c: any ideas?

[23:05:55]

clever:

except it will mess up normal fullscreen when not in gnome

[23:05:58]

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[23:07:09]

at0m|c:

EnderTheThird, no idea's but google and #vnc. and as long as the rest (apart from popup) works, why bother :)

[23:07:54]

EnderTheThird:

well that's the prob, it's not working. i get a screen after login, but i can't get a terminal or anything up there to actually let me run any apps, lol

[23:09:12]

clever:

seperate from the main/real xserver?

[23:10:04]

EnderTheThird:

yeah

[23:10:13]

clever:

could just bypass that prog

[23:10:21]

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[23:10:28]

clever:

make a shell script which does this basicaly

[23:10:31]

clever:

export DISPLAY=:1.0

[23:10:32]

clever:

Xvnc4 :1 -screen scrn 1340x800x16 PasswordFile=/home/clever/.vnc/passwd &

[23:10:35]

clever:

pid=$?

[23:10:42]

clever:

mythfrontend;kill $pid

[23:11:05]

clever:

may need a window manager and some sleeps

[23:11:19]

clever:

i trimed those out to cut down on the spam

[23:11:44]

EnderTheThird:

well i don't get a term or any way to start an app in the vnc session when i login

[23:11:50]

EnderTheThird:

i just get a blank screen with the X cursor

[23:12:06]

clever:

if you use the above script youll get JUST a mythfrontend

[23:12:35]

clever:

can easily be modified to fire up an xterm

[23:12:45]

EnderTheThird:

it does seem to be wiping my ~/.vnc/xstartup every time i try to start vncserver though

[23:12:47]

sn9:

before long, there may well be an ubuntu derivative targeted toward farm animals. cows shouldn't use windows

[23:13:19]

clever:

was watching a military show on myth today

[23:13:30]

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[23:13:31]

clever:

and noticed one of the things was controled by an xbox 360 controler

[23:13:41]

clever:

i hope to god the tank isnt running windows!

[23:13:55]

clever:

o look a bluescreen on the side of a tree

[23:13:56]

clever:

shoot it!

[23:14:10]

xand:

hmm, what did virgin1 do to today's DS9

[23:14:11]

clever:

(tank covered in lcd panels:P)

[23:14:26]

sn9:

clever: watch "best defense" with eddie murphy (1984)

[23:14:30]

clever:

xand: are they retaking ds9?

[23:14:36]

xand:

retaking?

[23:14:45]

clever:

from the dominion forces

[23:14:47]

directhex:

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=10005&page=6

[23:14:52]

directhex:

vnc config, wfm

[23:14:56]

xand:

haha

[23:15:06]

directhex:

clever, nuclear subs run windows

[23:15:15]

clever:

directhex: o shitz!

[23:15:44]

clever:

some1 hit ctrl+alt+del before the reactor melts down

[23:15:45]

clever:

its lockked up!

[23:15:59]

sn9:

clever: yes, we live in a sick, sad world

[23:16:03]

clever:

yeah:(

[23:16:09]

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[23:18:47]

Kazan:

excellent .. my video card did ship today

[23:18:50]

clever:

military stuff like what i was seeing should run an linux or an embeded os

[23:18:55]

clever:

anything but windows!

[23:19:00]

Kazan:

ooh.. USB3 spec soon

[23:19:27]

sn9:

ugh

[23:19:45]

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[23:20:16]

EnderTheThird:

kazan: what card?

[23:20:33]

Kazan:

EnderTheThird: a random cheap nvidia-based pci-express

[23:20:45]

clever:

i got 3–4 pcie ati cards

[23:20:54]

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[23:20:56]

clever:

leftover from upgrades my dad did to xray machines

[23:21:00]

Kazan:

heh

[23:21:04]

clever:

medical machines running windows!

[23:21:10]

clever:

:(

[23:21:11]

Kazan:

i have 2 pci express ati cards laying around, and two being used

[23:21:18]

Kazan:

medical machines running windows should be illegal

[23:21:29]

Kazan:

USB3 is going to have optical interconnect as well as copper

[23:21:35]

EnderTheThird:

kazan: rock on. i just napped an 8500 this week for $70. oh fanless geforce cards, how i love 'em

[23:21:44]

sn9:

clever: that's worse than medical machines running HP-UX

[23:21:57]

clever:

Kazan: the catscan my dad fixes has 4 systems(3 rack mounted 1 desktop in a bigger box)

[23:21:57]

Kazan:

7300 PCI-Express for $30 + $20 overnight shipping

[23:22:08]

clever:

Kazan: all multicore several gig ram EACH and xp pro

[23:22:28]

clever:

1gigbit lan private just for those systems

[23:22:29]

EnderTheThird:

kazan: medical companies/institutions running windows scare me because i don't like the idea of my medical history being locked in with some proprietary company

[23:22:36]

clever:

i think 1 handles the fiberoptic input mainly

[23:22:40]

EnderTheThird:

actually, that's more for prop. software in general, not just windows

[23:22:40]

clever:

another for the raid

[23:22:48]

clever:

a 3rd for the processing

[23:23:03]

clever:

the desktop controls all and does the display work(posibly 3d)

[23:23:05]

EnderTheThird:

but basically, for any company that uses that crap, they're stuck with them forever because all of their medical history files are with them, and migrating would just be a bitch

[23:23:11]

Kazan:

EnderTheThird: they scare me because of STABILITY problems

[23:23:15]

Kazan:

and realiability issues with windows

[23:23:16]

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[23:23:18]

EnderTheThird:

that too

[23:23:25]

EnderTheThird:

heh

[23:23:31]

clever:

Kazan: philips says the drive never needs to be defraged

[23:23:43]

clever:

yet it clearly gets extremely fragmented with time and days 3+ hours to defrag

[23:23:43]

EnderTheThird:

and security. i don't want people to know about my anal fissures, ya know

[23:23:53]

clever:

lol

[23:24:01]

Kazan:

wha huh?

[23:24:11]

Kazan:

heh lol EnderTheThird

[23:24:13]

clever:

EnderTheThird: the latest xp system is actualy a tad more secure then the old pq series

[23:24:14]

EnderTheThird:

^^ joke. you have to have seen The Office. come on!

[23:24:18]

neb_:

Hm

[23:24:18]

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[23:24:22]

clever:

EnderTheThird: the pq series had a dialup modem and bearly any password

[23:24:25]

Kazan:

the office is rubbish

[23:24:29]

clever:

EnderTheThird: you could get into it with war dialing!

[23:24:33]

neb_:

it's interesting, my sister is a doctor and on night shifts they use a PDA

[23:24:41]

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[23:24:46]

** neb_ wonders if they even encrypt wireless traffic **

[23:25:07]

clever:

EnderTheThird: and half the parts can be controled from the dialup console(including the playback of the voices to say hold your breath in 20 languages)

[23:25:16]

robbins876_ is now known as robbins61

[23:25:22]

EnderTheThird:

what about for saying "turn your head and cough"?

[23:25:24]

directhex:

hm, wife's new pc will need AV. do i go with free tat, or pay for somerthing that actually works...

[23:25:38]

clever:

EnderTheThird: the catscan isnt used for that type of test:P

[23:25:39]

Kazan:

hey i have free stuff that works

[23:25:45]

Kazan:

just has annoying popup on daily update

[23:25:48]

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[23:25:49]

clever:

EnderTheThird: and they are static sound files not a whole tts engine

[23:25:56]

sn9:

clever: the need to defrag is a relic of VMS

[23:26:04]

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[23:26:18]

clever:

sn9: ext2/3 ive read in detail how it picks where fragments go

[23:26:29]

clever:

sn9: and i know how good of a job it does

[23:26:48]

clever:

and it lacks any defrag tool but needs it less if you keep a fair ammount free

[23:27:17]

sn9:

would you rather deal with reiserfs?

[23:27:30]

clever:

havent used it

[23:27:56]

clever:

some of the problems with fat is the lack of a freespace bitmap

[23:28:12]

clever:

ext2/3 has the freespace broken into many smaller bitmaps each limited to 1 'block'

[23:28:44]

sn9:

apple's hfs had a freespace bitmap, and it was always corrupt

[23:28:52]

clever:

lol

[23:29:50]

clever:

the pq series catscan was unix based at the core i beleive

[23:30:02]

clever:

i dont think it had an X server

[23:30:20]

clever:

ive never seen the default X mouse cursor or weave patern on it

[23:30:34]

clever:

it rarely even had a mouse pointer in graphic mode

[23:32:05]

bsdfox__ is now known as bsdfox_

[23:33:17]

clever:

the most recent catscans are xp pro based

[23:34:03]

sn9:

they won't dare use vista

[23:35:52]

clever:

its a few months old now

[23:35:56]

clever:

may have came out before vista

[23:36:01]

clever:

also

[23:36:01]

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[23:36:09]

clever:

i see alot of traces of humingbirn

[23:36:14]

clever:

a windows X server

[23:36:30]

clever:

it looks like 90% of the core software is still trying to use an X server

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