Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Thursday, May 31st, 2007, 00:08 UTC

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qman:

hello...I got mythtv installed, and everything seems to be working alright, except that it's not controlling my audio correctly

[00:19:19]

qman:

if I rewind TV, the audio just plays live

[00:19:30]

qman:

and it doesn't stop playing when I close mythfrontend

[00:19:56]

qman:

I searched through those faqs a bit, but didn't find a solution

[00:20:15]

qman:

if it's any help, tvtime works flawlessly

[00:20:17]

LUDMIL_MILTCHEV:

I have bunch of videos in a directory and I can play each one individually with Mplayer without any trouble. When I create playlist using: find -name "*.*" -print > playlist.txt, I can play all of the videos in the playlist but the audio is missing. Any ideas?

[00:21:08]

Anduin:

qman: There is something in the main MythTV docs

[00:22:29]

Pogonip:

defendguin; I know this is probably too late, but mythdatabasefill just worked fine for me.

[00:22:55]

Lo_Pan:

hy sid

[00:23:25]

qman:

hmm...is that in the options menu in frontend, or do I have to run setup again?

[00:23:25]

Sid`:

hy indeed.

[00:23:31]

Sid`:

qman: its in mythtv-setup

[00:23:36]

Sid`:

under the tuner configuration bit (first option)

[00:23:50]

Sid`:

you gotta tell mythtv which soundcard has the audio from your capture card on its line in

[00:23:58]

Sid`:

(or just buy a hardware-encoding card.)

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qman:

ok...I really didn't know that much about my card or devices, so I pretty much accepted defaults

[00:27:57]

qman:

I have a Hauppauge WinTV401

[00:30:38]

Sid`:

what chipset does that use?

[00:32:19]

qman:

well, it has a Conexant CX23880 video+audio decoder

[00:32:35]

qman:

according to lspci

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Sid`:

you've obviously got the audio out of the framegrabber hooked up to the line in on your soundcard, tho

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Sid`:

hmm, weird

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[00:35:40]

ubuntuEdgy:

will my server work just as good with no graphic card at all.

[00:36:03]

ubuntuEdgy:

know what i mean ?

[00:36:30]

ubuntuEdgy:

no card at alll

[00:36:37]

qman:

yeah, I have a little jumper cord going from the WinTV to the line in on my soundcard

[00:36:51]

qman:

I didn't even think of it, but I probably should remove that for this

[00:37:46]

qman:

that's how the instructions said to hook it up, and it seemed to work fine with tvtime, but that doesn't have any DVR functions or anything, so it's probably interfering

[00:40:01]

Sid`:

nah

[00:40:09]

Sid`:

you have two options for getting audio out of it

[00:40:24]

Sid`:

either you run that cable to your sound card, and tell mythtv to get its sound from that card

[00:40:47]

Sid`:

in which case it knows to mute line in on the mixer for playback, record the audio and mux it using nuv or mpeg4

[00:41:12]

Sid`:

or you can use something like btaudio (altho i dunno what it'd be if its a cx chipset) and grab the audio directly from a fake audio device presented by the card

[00:41:16]

Sid`:

in which case you don't need/want the cable

[00:43:01]

qman:

should I, perhaps, be using ALSA devices instead of the actual devices?

[00:43:21]

Pogonip:

Mythbackend will not start, gets to "Seem to be woken up by USER" and hangs.

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[01:19:16]

Pogonip:

I could use some help getting mythbackend working again.

[01:20:33]

LUDMIL_MILTCHEV:

exit

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HalonChilled:

hi, I am running the module-assistant to get i2c and I recieve the following error msg http://www.pastebin.ca/524354 any help greatly appriciated

[01:50:48]

mishehu:

unfamiliar with module-assistant, cant really help

[01:52:22]

HalonChilled:

mishehu I am only trying it because I have followed the lirc guide http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Ubuntu_lirc_install completely but i get nowhere when i run irw

[01:52:52]

mishehu:

there is an ##lirc channel I believe, though I don't know how active they are there

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HalonChilled:

mishehu i went to #lirc nobody was on

[01:53:51]

NewCastleScott:

Hello all,My myth does not record and the backend is always crashing.what info can I provide to get some help?

[01:54:14]

NewCastleScott:

my remote is my next issue...

[01:55:44]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, logs typically help out

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[01:57:37]

HalonChilled:

anyone else having issue installing lirc with their hauppague pvr-150 on ubuntu FF?

[02:00:16]

NewCastleScott:

yes and no Im on gentoo

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[02:02:48]

NewCastleScott:

my myth log.file---> http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524384

[02:04:17]

NewCastleScott:

kormoc, I saw it looked like ivtv drivers not responding

[02:04:47]

NewCastleScott:

is mpeg2 not ideal for hauppuge 150?

[02:05:34]

kormoc:

it's all you'll get out of a 150

[02:05:56]

NewCastleScott:

ahh

[02:06:01]

Anduin:

it can do MPEG1!

[02:06:07]

** kormoc laughs **

[02:06:09]

kormoc:

fair 'nuff

[02:06:23]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: your ivtv stuff is broken

[02:07:04]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, did you ever run mythtv-setup?

[02:07:11]

NewCastleScott:

hmmm it works to watch tv though I will remerge them

[02:07:16]

NewCastleScott:

yes

[02:07:22]

NewCastleScott:

I have ran setup

[02:07:35]

kormoc:

ooh, that's not just one log

[02:07:59]

NewCastleScott:

no its the whole file...

[02:08:13]

kormoc:

it's from a few different runs tho

[02:08:32]

kormoc:

tho you have some very odd errors for it being setup right

[02:08:46]

kormoc:

line 1308 and friends

[02:09:09]

XGizzmo:

2

[02:09:32]

XGizzmo:

+

[02:09:48]

NewCastleScott:

I think I was messing with the audio settings then

[02:09:50]

Anduin:

Yeah, 1308 would be cause if you set the wrong card type

[02:09:50]

** kormoc raises an eyebrow at XGizzmo **

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[02:11:12]

mattwj2006:

hey guys something weird just happened

[02:11:25]

mattwj2006:

or rather I just noticed it

[02:11:31]

NewCastleScott:

what else can I provide to see what all the backend crashing is all about?

[02:12:11]

HalonChilled:

does anyone think it will make a difference if i install ubuntu EE instead of FF with my lirc issues, everything else in mythtv runs great on FF

[02:12:30]

mattwj2006:

I am getting a ton of my regular analog cable channels through my HDHomeRun

[02:12:36]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, set up the card correctly in mythtv-setup, truncate the log file and then make it crash, that way we're not looking as tons of stuff

[02:13:08]

NewCastleScott:

if I rm the log a new one will show up right

[02:13:16]

mattwj2006:

they appear to be digital

[02:13:21]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, in theory,

[02:13:21]

NewCastleScott:

Im a linux noob

[02:13:24]

NewCastleScott:

lol

[02:13:29]

NewCastleScott:

its worth a try

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kormoc:

NewCastleScott, you'll need to restart the backend tho

[02:14:31]

NewCastleScott:

no doubt I stopped it and ran setup agin

[02:14:33]

mattwj2006:

I hope my cable company keeps it this way because it is sweet :D

[02:15:03]

mattwj2006:

they are all channels I get all ready but it is nice to watch them digitally on my computer

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[02:15:47]

Pogonip:

Cam someone help me get my mythbackend running again.

[02:17:35]

NewCastleScott:

/etc/init.d/mythbackend restart ?

[02:17:55]

NewCastleScott:

or start or status

[02:19:40]

NewCastleScott:

http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524415 <----- term.output & Log.file

[02:19:54]

NewCastleScott:

Pogonip, did that do it?

[02:19:58]

NewCastleScott:

brb smoke

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NewCastleScott:

Im back any ideas why its crashing?

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Anduin:

NewCastleScott: Your log only shows the frontend crashing

[02:32:01]

NewCastleScott:

anyone got any ideas why Im getting seg.faults?Im tring to watch a recording while its recording

[02:32:41]

NewCastleScott:

yea the backend does it randomly I havent been able to repeat it I dont know the pattern yet

[02:32:57]

NewCastleScott:

it has done it a few times

[02:33:37]

kormoc:

are you using crazy cflags?

[02:33:45]

NewCastleScott:

I know the aperince in settings will kill it right away it even logs me out

[02:33:57]

NewCastleScott:

probably Ill post emerge --info

[02:34:37]

NewCastleScott:

http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524447

[02:35:00]

kormoc:

no, those are not crazy

[02:35:31]

NewCastleScott:

yea I had -O3 for a bit but it sucked...

[02:35:45]

NewCastleScott:

I have been told I have a lot of use

[02:35:49]

NewCastleScott:

flags**

[02:38:06]

kormoc:

you do, largely cause I don't think you really understand what they do, but shouldn't cause this

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[02:39:04]

NewCastleScott:

Ahh acording to emerge mythtv -pv (pretend verbose) ivtv is a use flag I dont have...if I remerge with ivtv added will that solve the seg faults?

[02:39:18]

NewCastleScott:

http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524454

[02:39:30]

NewCastleScott:

is there any more I left out that will do this?

[02:39:33]

kormoc:

might

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[02:40:23]

NewCastleScott:

I also have nvidia chipset for video is it wise to add nvidia to video cards?

[02:40:31]

kormoc:

yes

[02:40:35]

NewCastleScott:

nice

[02:40:41]

NewCastleScott:

I will remerge

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[02:52:18]

LikwidFire:

hey guys i already posted in the zap2it forums, but would anyone know why m guide would be really far off?

[02:53:14]

Anduin:

LikwidFire: If you mean in nice even hours, your timezone.

[02:53:17]

LikwidFire:

time on the frontend/backend is perfect, but time on mythweb is off, could that have something to do with it?

[02:53:47]

NewCastleScott:

kormoc, just another quick one about the video card flag.I dont have a card itself only chipset on mobo is it still safe to add it to video cards?

[02:53:56]

Anduin:

LikwidFire: definitely your timezone

[02:54:17]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, is it a onboard video card?

[02:55:06]

LikwidFire:

weel, my /etc/localtime is corrupt.

[02:55:33]

NewCastleScott:

yes

[02:55:39]

Anduin:

LikwidFire: it is supposed to look that way

[02:55:44]

NewCastleScott:

on board chipset from nvidia

[02:55:48]

LikwidFire:

all it has is TZif^@^@^@^@^@ and a bunch more

[02:56:15]

NewCastleScott:

what distro?

[02:56:22]

LikwidFire:

Gentoo

[02:56:30]

Anduin:

LikwidFire: Yeah, not corrupted, just not right (run date and see)

[02:56:30]

NewCastleScott:

hmm hold on ill link you

[02:56:43]

LikwidFire:

date comes up fine

[02:57:03]

NewCastleScott:

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handboo . . . 1&chap=7

[02:57:12]

NewCastleScott:

set the timezone this way

[02:57:58]

LikwidFire:

yea thats what i did on the initial install

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kormoc:

NewCastleScott, then yes, it's your video card and it's an nvidia

[02:58:17]

LikwidFire:

brb, gotta take the dog out :(

[02:59:09]

NewCastleScott:

wow 27 packages to update

[02:59:48]

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[03:02:18]

Pogonip:

"/etc/init.d/mythbackend restart = No such file or directory"

[03:04:55]

xris:

Pogonip: you compiled from source?

[03:05:39]

Pogonip:

Yes. Something strange though, everything was installed to /usr/local/

[03:06:16]

Anduin:

Pogonip: that is the default for source compiles

[03:06:20]

Pogonip:

I can start mythbackend, but I can't seem to find out where it's actually located.

[03:06:44]

Anduin:

which mythbackend

[03:06:46]

xris:

Pogonip: "local" isn't strange. that's where compiled code goes. the stuff just under /usr/ is for distro/packages.

[03:07:11]

Pogonip:

Oh!, that could be the problem, mythconverg is looking for the distro package.

[03:07:12]

xris:

Pogonip: the other init script came from the packager, not mythtv. you'll need to find another copy of the script

[03:08:44]

** kormoc blinks **

[03:08:51]

kormoc:

mythconverg... looking...

[03:08:54]

** kormoc blinks again **

[03:09:47]

Pogonip:

Sorry, I ment to say the myconverg database still contains the old path information.

[03:10:26]

xris:

Pogonip: db doesn't contain any path info for executables

[03:12:07]

NewCastleScott:

grep?

[03:12:24]

xris:

Pogonip: what are you trying to do?

[03:13:04]

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[03:13:06]

Pogonip:

I need to get mythbackend working again.

[03:13:27]

xris:

Pogonip: repeating myself: the other init script came from the packager, not mythtv. you'll need to find another copy of the script

[03:13:44]

xris:

i.e. you don't get anything in init.d if you compile yourself.

[03:14:03]

xris:

if you want something there, you have to grab one from somewhere else

[03:14:23]

xris:

there are some sample ones in the contrib directory

[03:14:32]

Pogonip:

xris, i'm really new to linux, so bear with me. Where would I get something like that

[03:14:48]

Pogonip:

Sorry, sent that just as your message came in.

[03:15:21]

Pogonip:

One second, i'm going to take a look.

[03:15:31]

** xris should organize those ones in contrib **

[03:16:49]

xris:

Pogonip: hang on

[03:17:29]

Pogonip:

I hate having to ask such stupid questions, but where is contrib?

[03:18:44]

xris:

right in the "mythtv" directory in the source

[03:18:53]

xris:

but hang on. I'm reorganizing it and adding a better init script

[03:22:19]

Pogonip:

thanks. When I run mythbackend -v all, there are several mysql calls. I looked at the table it was calling and the data for mythtvvideo is set to distro.

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[03:30:04]

mattwj2007:

hey room

[03:30:48]

xris:

Pogonip: rerun svn update on your source trree

[03:31:19]

Pogonip:

svn update?

[03:31:59]

kormoc:

Pogonip, you really should learn about source control before attempting to use it

[03:32:58]

xris:

Pogonip: you are using svn trunk, right?

[03:33:07]

Pogonip:

Yes

[03:34:33]

NewCastleScott:

whats the "best" or "better"(cheap) hd card for linux

[03:35:14]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, United States?

[03:35:18]

NewCastleScott:

yes

[03:35:21]

kormoc:

CAble?

[03:35:36]

NewCastleScott:

and is there anything that will descramble dig.cable

[03:35:55]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, no, and asking more will result in a ban. we don't talk about illegal things in here

[03:36:11]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, if you want to capture digital cable, you should read up on the firewire capture options

[03:36:34]

NewCastleScott:

ahh Im sorry I want to use my paied cable service but not pay for another box I am a law abiding citisen I ment no offence

[03:36:37]

xris:

Pogonip: go into that source directory and run: svn update

[03:36:41]

xris:

it will pull down new/updated files

[03:37:14]

NewCastleScott:

kormoc, I thank you for stearing me in the right direction

[03:37:50]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, the wiki has a very nice writeup on it

[03:38:11]

NewCastleScott:

thanks

[03:45:20]

NewCastleScott:

thanks again for the direction to look in I think it would be cheaper to get another box for the cable company.If and when I do what is the "best"route to go to get hd?

[03:45:26]

NewCastleScott:

kormoc, ^^

[03:45:50]

kormoc:

NewCastleScott, firewire capture supports capturing HD

[03:46:02]

NewCastleScott:

best meaning loest cost in my case

[03:46:12]

NewCastleScott:

from broadcast?

[03:46:23]

NewCastleScott:

or over the air?

[03:46:48]

kormoc:

it's the only option for capturing cable HD

[03:46:56]

NewCastleScott:

ahh nice

[03:47:36]

NewCastleScott:

I thank you again.I have 11 of 29 packages updating then I can see if mythtv is fixed I added some use flags

[03:48:07]

NewCastleScott:

I had a hauppauge 1600 but was told it only had support for dig.

[03:48:21]

NewCastleScott:

Im running 150 now

[03:53:53]

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xris:

Pogonip: ok, there's a brand new happily-working init.d script for fedora in the contrib directory

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[04:17:01]

Pogonip:

Do I need to update again then?

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[04:18:24]

xris:

Pogonip: sure

[04:18:38]

xris:

then look for contrib/sysV/fedora.init.mythbackend

[04:18:49]

xris:

and read the little install snippet at the top of the file

[04:20:38]

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[04:22:00]

xris:

time for pie.

[04:22:43]

Pogonip:

Thanks xris

[04:23:42]

** xris hands Pogonip a slice of mango pie **

[04:23:55]

Pogonip:

I think I may be doing something wrong during compile, my bins are not under /usr/bin. I think their in my home directory.

[04:24:06]

Pogonip:

mango pie, nice.

[04:25:00]

xris:

Pogonip: they should be in /usr/local/bin

[04:25:26]

xris:

like I said earlier, when you compile stuff on your own, it goes into /usr/local/.. /usr/ is for packages

[04:25:54]

Pogonip:

I'm not sure if I'm ever going get used to Linux.

[04:26:28]

Pogonip:

I'm viewing that directory as root and they ar

[04:26:31]

Pogonip:

there

[04:26:51]

xris:

did you see the script in contrib?

[04:27:14]

xris:

when someone gives you a path like mythtv/contrib, it's talking about two directories (folders).

[04:27:43]

Pogonip:

Yes. I see the scripts.

[04:28:00]

NewCastleScott:

what distro are you on?

[04:28:06]

NewCastleScott:

sorry off toppic

[04:28:17]

xris:

NewCastleScott: he's using fedora

[04:28:23]

NewCastleScott:

thanks

[04:28:36]

xris:

Pogonip: do you know how to edit a text file in linux yet?

[04:28:54]

Pogonip:

Just like Unix, the only thing about linux that I'm familiar with.

[04:29:17]

xris:

Pogonip: ah, so you have some unix experience. ok, I'll shut up about paths, then. heh

[04:29:33]

xris:

anyway, there are instructions at the top of the fedora.init.mythbackend file that tell you where to copy it to

[04:29:52]

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[04:30:20]

Pogonip:

Oh yeah, I understand the directory and editing, I just can't figure out where Linux stores everything. I spent too much time on windows.

[04:30:30]

jroysdon:

My volume control when playing .ogg music files doens't work. It shows the volume setting going up/down, but doesn't actually change the volume. Volume control works with DVD playback. Any ideas?

[04:30:46]

** MythLogBot slaps xris_bb with a mobile-irc trout on behalf of xris... **

[04:31:01]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris_bb

[04:31:16]

xris:

Pogonip: the init.d stuff is straight out of unix sysV

[04:31:45]

xris:

xris_bb: test

[04:31:59]

xris:

lame. the blackberry irc client doesn't color name-mentions.

[04:32:08]

NewCastleScott:

lol

[04:33:51]

Pogonip:

I know, when I saw the init script looking for mythbackend in /usr/bin I knew I had a problem. When I did my compile, the bins were placed in the source, make install should have moved them.

[04:34:18]

xris:

Pogonip: it does a copy, not a move

[04:34:36]

xris:

and yeah, the init script I just wrote will look in both locations.. /usr/bin/ first, and then /usr/local/bin

[04:35:03]

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[04:37:21]

Pogonip:

I may not have been set to root when I did the make install. DOH!

[04:37:35]

xris:

oh, yeah, that'll make a difference

[04:37:59]

xris:

sudo is your friend (and unfortunately, redhat doesn't seem to understand that well, and doesn't really leave sudo configured by default.

[04:38:51]

Pogonip:

I feel like such an idiot.

[04:39:23]

xris:

just think of it as a mistake you won't readily make again

[04:39:26]

xris:

:)

[04:42:50]

Pogonip:

I think I've had it for tonight. Thanks for the help.

[04:46:33]

xris:

:)

[04:46:39]

xris:

enjoy your rest

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[04:48:49]

Krazylegz:

So, anyone got a link to info about HD-DVD/BD on Linux?

[04:50:58]

Tronic:

Krazylegz: What do you need to know?

[04:51:20]

Krazylegz:

Is it possible, where can I find an internal drive, what are the gotchas.

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[04:51:52]

kormoc:

Krazylegz, afaik, there are no linux br/hddvd players yet

[04:51:59]

Krazylegz:

I didn't think so.

[04:52:03]

Krazylegz:

But...https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedF . . . uRayAndHDDVD

[04:52:07]

Tronic:

It is possible. I would recommend the Xbox external drive, as it is cheap, 3. you need to download the movies from the net instead of using the discs that you bought.

[04:52:28]

Krazylegz:

...?

[04:52:29]

Tronic:

Alternative #3: you need Windows and some hackery to rip the movies.

[04:52:40]

Krazylegz:

Blah.

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[04:52:44]

Tronic:

But it is just far easier to download them rather than using the discs.

[04:52:53]

Krazylegz:

How very unacceptable.

[04:52:54]

Tronic:

And in many countries less (or not at all) illegal, too.

[04:53:04]

Krazylegz:

Well it's illegal in this one. :-)

[04:53:08]

Tronic:

Ripping the discs that you own in illegal in USA and EU, at least.

[04:53:19]

kormoc:

Krazylegz, ahh, their info would work

[04:53:29]

Tronic:

s/in/is/

[04:53:31]

Krazylegz:

But I would still need a drive.

[04:53:46]

kormoc:

Krazylegz, most driver should just work (tm) (r)

[04:53:48]

kormoc:

*drives

[04:53:55]

Krazylegz:

Sounds like it.

[04:54:09]

Krazylegz:

I'm more worried about things like playing it in Xine/mplayer.

[04:54:16]

Krazylegz:

I figure the drive would be fine.

[04:54:49]

Tronic:

Krazylegz: Oh, didn't know that there are rippers for Linux, too, now.

[04:54:59]

Krazylegz:

Shhh.

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[04:56:10]

Tronic:

The recent versions of players work well, except for the new audio formats.

[04:56:45]

Tronic:

H.264 in MPEG-2 TS is only supported by MPlayer, not by anything else.

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[05:01:01]

someninjamaster:

im setting myth up on a new box for the first time and when i try to boot i keep getting a message init: id "c7" respawning too fast: disabled for 5 minutes

[05:04:29]

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[05:17:50]

xris:

someninjamaster: is that from mythtv, or your distro?

[05:18:42]

Sid`:

it's from init. your 'c7' id is respawning too fast.

[05:18:50]

Sid`:

have a look in /etc/inittab for a line that starts c7:

[05:19:06]

Sid`:

and figure out why it needs to be restarted all the time

[05:20:59]

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[05:21:19]

someninjamaster:

i havent been able to ge a sucessful boot yet

[05:21:29]

Sid`:

boot it in single user mode

[05:21:45]

xris:

someninjamaster: what distro?

[05:21:46]

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[05:21:52]

Sid`:

if that doesn't work, boot with the kernel parameter 'init=/bin/bash', then do mount -oremount / ; mount -a; and then edit inittab

[05:22:20]

someninjamaster:

im changing what im doing now

[05:22:55]

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[05:38:26]

mchou:

haha, maybe that's why vista took so long.......

[05:38:46]

mchou:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10554012

[05:39:51]

mchou:

just think of all the spam

[05:39:59]

Tronic:

Too bad that it's not even a new innovation.

[05:40:20]

Tronic:

We have had this in Helsinki city center for a while already: http://citywall.org/pages/about

[05:40:28]

mchou:

the specs are ridiculous!

[05:40:40]

mchou:

core duo for a coffee table?

[05:41:20]

xris:

heh... video encodes for blackberry

[05:41:44]

Tronic:

And of course there is Apple multitouch, not to mention the original http://cs.nyu.edu/~jhan/ftirtouch/

[05:42:05]

Tronic:

For the record, CityWall runs on Ubuntu.

[05:42:27]

mchou:

and the premise that it displays all the photos in your camera......

[05:42:55]

mchou:

what if you have "compromising" pictures?

[05:43:24]

mchou:

the social gaffes boggles the mind

[05:43:46]

Tronic:

Who has a digital camera with wireless connectivity anyway?

[05:43:57]

mchou:

Tronic: nobody yet

[05:43:59]

Tronic:

(and no, mobile phones don't count as cameras)

[05:45:44]

mchou:

haha, is this like cablecard PCs where they can't possibly sell it to the end user, cause it would take a team from you local cable co and MSFT to install :)

[05:46:03]

mchou:

never mind to "keep running"

[05:46:08]

Dagmar:

I have a Sony Vaio that qualifies

[05:47:53]

mchou:

I don't undertand why they couldnt have used an embedded processor to bring the cost down

[05:47:59]

xris:

mchou: thought they made one a few years ago.

[05:48:16]

Dagmar:

probably becaue they're making it from off-the-shelf components

[05:48:23]

mchou:

a pc hidden inside a coffee table is a real waste

[05:48:46]

Dagmar:

If you're only makin' 10–20 it's not worth the troulble to make custom hardware

[05:54:58]

mchou:

but that coffee table would make for a great myth frontend :)

[05:55:22]

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[05:55:48]

mchou:

for the real couch potatoes

[05:56:11]

mchou:

no more need to set up lirc

[05:56:21]

Dagmar:

heh

[05:56:55]

xris:

so, anyone have recommendations on where to get a new mythtv chassis?

[05:57:04]

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[05:57:24]

Dagmar:

Probably newegg

[05:57:32]

mchou:

chassis? frontend?

[05:57:38]

NewCastleScott:

tiger I have found has better prices

[05:57:51]

xris:

I'm trying to build a list, to eventually put it on the wiki. newegg, tiger, pcalchemy, directron...

[05:57:58]

xris:

I know there are a few more decent ones

[05:58:04]

xris:

mchou: be+fe, microatx

[05:58:17]

mchou:

xris: coffee table, man :)

[05:58:43]

xris:

mchou: I could... my coffee table is two big wooden boxes.

[05:58:53]

NewCastleScott:

milk crates

[05:58:54]

xris:

but the coffee table is on the other side of the house from the tv

[05:59:45]

mchou:

so? they should build (ethernet-enabled) wireless HDTV's

[06:00:14]

mchou:

that's much more useful than stinking coffee table :)

[06:00:36]

mchou:

no reaon why that can't be done

[06:00:40]

mchou:

reason*

[06:00:57]

Dagmar:

xris: i think you pretty much named everywhere I've bought from in the last year

[06:01:18]

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[06:02:26]

mchou:

all tuners going external

[06:03:00]

mchou:

almost the same with HDDs

[06:03:03]

xris:

Dagmar: yeah. I just keep thinking someone pasted another store link in here a few days ago, and it had some good stuff.

[06:03:07]

xris:

but I can't find it anymore

[06:03:18]

xris:

mchou: they do that because the external ones cost more and have 1 year vs 5 year warranty

[06:03:40]

Tanthrix:

Anyone have firewire recordings that end early? Seems like all of my 2 hour movies end around 1:40 or later, which is oddly enough often when the movies end, but not what's in the db.

[06:03:52]

xris:

Tanthrix: mine all seem fine

[06:03:55]

mchou:

xris: nah, that's cause ppl accidentally kick external drives

[06:04:05]

mchou:

while they are spinning

[06:04:23]

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[06:04:23]

mchou:

that the reason for 1 yr warranties

[06:04:30]

** Dagmar makes a noise like an abnormally expensive sanding plate **

[06:05:13]

NewCastleScott:

ok I got my backend to crash again here is the log.file---> http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524905

[06:05:18]

mchou:

Tanthrix: that's simple

[06:05:45]

mchou:

your file system is inadequate. check your mythtv logs

[06:06:48]

Dagmar:

NewCastleScott: Frontend logs aren't going to be useful

[06:07:07]

mchou:

NewCastleScott: "Connection timed out. You probably should modify the Master Server settings in the setup program and set the proper IP address."

[06:07:21]

NewCastleScott:

its lo though

[06:07:25]

Dagmar:

That's pretty obviously after the backend has crashed

[06:07:30]

NewCastleScott:

I thought this was backend log?

[06:07:39]

mchou:

NewCastleScott: nope

[06:07:43]

Dagmar:

It wouldn't be trying to connect to the backend if it was

[06:07:47]

mchou:

thats the FE log

[06:07:47]

NewCastleScott:

whare can I find em'

[06:08:01]

NewCastleScott:

I was in /var/log/mythtv/

[06:08:07]

Tanthrix:

xris: I almost wonder if something in the stream is causing it to die, since almost always it ends right after a movie is finished. I've got "Night of the Living Dead" recorded at the moment which had a start/end time of 6:00/7:30, yet only recorded 1:16, just slightly past the credits

[06:08:31]

mchou:

Tanthrix: nope. it's your file system

[06:08:34]

Tanthrix:

xris: Set another movie to record tonight with the backend on --verbose all, so we'll see

[06:08:48]

xris:

Tanthrix: humor mchou.. how big are the files?

[06:09:10]

mchou:

Tanthrix: you'll notice all your long movies have a certain file size limit

[06:09:49]

Tanthrix:

7.2 gigs for this one, on an ext3 partition (Been meanin to switch to XFS)

[06:10:39]

Tanthrix:

There a limit for ext3?

[06:10:54]

mchou:

there is a limit for all filesystems

[06:11:09]

mchou:

it's just a matter of how big

[06:11:32]

Tanthrix:

mchou: Let me rephrase: Am I going up against a limit?

[06:11:52]

mchou:

Tanthrix: doubtful

[06:12:19]

xris:

Tanthrix: 2gigs or 4gigs are the old limits. you've obviously gone beyond that, so that's not the issue.

[06:12:23]

Tanthrix:

mchou: Oh, but you just said that's exactly what it was, and that it couldn't be anything else? The great mchou almighty was wrong? Say it ain't so..

[06:12:57]

Tanthrix:

xris: Well, I'll take a look at the logs tonight to get a better idea of what's going on – it's damned peculiar though since it always seems to end right after the movie.

[06:13:11]

mchou:

where did I say it couldnt be anything else?

[06:13:26]

Tanthrix:

Part of the reason why I haven't investigated until now (Just saw that Jaws ended about a minute before the shark bit the dust)

[06:13:34]

mchou:

what STB?

[06:13:41]

Tanthrix:

Tanthrix: nope. it's your file system (In response to my comment about something in the stream)

[06:13:48]

mchou:

lol

[06:14:06]

NewCastleScott:

/var/log/mythtv/mythbackend.log----> http://gentoo.pastebin.ca/524920

[06:14:15]

NewCastleScott:

its crashing even more now

[06:14:17]

mchou:

that's hardly an exclusive statement saying it cant be anything else

[06:14:25]

Tanthrix:

mchou: Motoralla DCT3142

[06:15:01]

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[06:15:04]

mchou:

Tanthrix: no experience with that one

[06:16:25]

xris:

thoughts? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811204016

[06:17:16]

NewCastleScott:

I keep getting seg faults also that kills front end

[06:17:23]

Tanthrix:

xris: I like the look of it, nice and minalist. (And black instead of silver)

[06:17:50]

mchou:

xris: the first thing I'd remove is the fan speed controller

[06:18:00]

xris:

mchou: well, yeah. and put in auto-speed

[06:18:05]

xris:

and probably quieter fans

[06:18:16]

xris:

needs a psu, too

[06:18:25]

xris:

and for $50 (!!), I could get a vfd

[06:18:35]

Tanthrix:

VFD?

[06:18:40]

mchou:

anyway, that's too steep for that case

[06:18:45]

mchou:

$

[06:18:50]

mchou:

o psu

[06:19:05]

mchou:

if it had a psu then it'd be worth considering

[06:19:25]

Tanthrix:

Best to buy PSU's separate anyway – too often crappy low quality ones are stuck in to cut costs.

[06:19:52]

mchou:

Tanthrix: maybe, but $100 for that case is too steep

[06:20:15]

NewCastleScott:

anyway to resolve seg faults?or pinpoint what ram is beaing eaten

[06:20:33]

mchou:

NewCastleScott: yup. it's in the myth docs

[06:20:55]

mchou:

NewCastleScott: you need a debug compile

[06:21:05]

mchou:

and gdb

[06:21:15]

NewCastleScott:

gdb?

[06:21:25]

mchou:

frack

[06:21:26]

NewCastleScott:

gnome debug?

[06:23:37]

xris:

Tanthrix: vacuum flourescent display.

[06:24:05]

xris:

mchou: there really aren't that many good htpc cases

[06:24:08]

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[06:24:16]

xris:

stupid 16" deep cases, too. my media cabinet is barely that deep

[06:24:50]

qman:

heh, you should try finding one to fit a 32" deep CD changer

[06:25:18]

mchou:

huh??

[06:25:36]

mchou:

cd changer? who uses those any more?

[06:25:36]

qman:

it's no easy task

[06:25:38]

xris:

that's a bit excessive

[06:25:55]

xris:

oh well. I won't have the hardware for the new mythbox until intel does the price drop next month, anyway...

[06:26:02]

mchou:

I thought the whole point to myth box is to get rid of CDs :)

[06:26:23]

qman:

it is, but it doesn't do you any good if you can't get it working *hint*

[06:26:36]

qman:

;)

[06:26:54]

mchou:

qman: huh? if you cant get myth working you dont need htpc case :)

[06:27:27]

xris:

ah, I think I found that site.. frozencpu.com

[06:27:32]

qman:

I've got a pretty nice convertible case that would make a good HTPC

[06:27:44]

xris:

all 4 cases. lol

[06:27:45]

qman:

it's a little on the big side, though, probably too big for your application

[06:28:06]

xris:

qman: yeah, I'm trying to replace an asus pundit, and there's not really an easy way to do that. pundit is nice and tiny

[06:28:19]

xris:

oh, 4 featured products. /me needs to learn to scroll down

[06:28:21]

qman:

I got it because I was tired of bumping into all my towers on the floor

[06:28:30]

mchou:

what's wrong with using the pundit case?

[06:29:13]

qman:

you're probably looking for something small enough that it needs a riser card

[06:29:53]

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[06:29:54]

xris:

heh, or I could get an older coolermaster case from a friend for cheap/free

[06:30:02]

xris:

qman: I don't mind 3u height.

[06:30:02]

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[06:30:08]

xris:

(full height pci)

[06:30:16]

qman:

hmm

[06:30:22]

qman:

I wonder exactly how big this actually is

[06:30:22]

xris:

riser is annoying because of pci vs pci-e

[06:30:37]

qman:

it's small to me, but I'm used to dealing with mid towers and bigger

[06:30:47]

xris:

2u == low profile, 3u == full height, 4u == full + headroom

[06:30:59]

qman:

this is 3u

[06:31:05]

qman:

just big enough for full size cards

[06:31:07]

xris:

I'm used to dealing with rackmount gear, if you couldn't tell. heh

[06:31:56]

qman:

found the specs

[06:31:57]

qman:

5.8" x 13.5" x 14.5" (WxHxD)

[06:32:00]

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[06:32:05]

xris:

yeah, somewhere in the 3u range

[06:32:12]

qman:

smaller than I thought

[06:32:36]

qman:

I'm really pleased with the case though, I was reluctant at first to spend extra money on something so small

[06:32:51]

qman:

but it's got a really good design, and all the extra stuff like thumb screws

[06:33:35]

xris:

I don't mind that. I just want quiet, with enough room for some future expansion if I ever have to drop firewire

[06:33:46]

Tanthrix:

Is there any downside to using OSS emulation over ALSA for a dedicated myth system just doing stereo out? Getting "WriteAudio: buffer underrun" when using ALSA, possibly fixed with the aggressive sound card buffer

[06:33:59]

Tanthrix:

Just concerns me since I'm using a brand new fast system

[06:34:00]

qman:

well, this is the case if you're interested: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811190057

[06:34:53]

qman:

I run a dual core opetron in mine, and I've never had heat issues

[06:34:54]

Tanthrix:

(And when I get that ALSA error sometimes after skipping around it garbles the video output as well and I have to restart mythfrontend)

[06:35:16]

qman:

running dnet, no less

[06:37:13]

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[06:39:41]

mchou:

xris: drop firewire?

[06:39:52]

xris:

mchou: like if I move somewhere that doesn't have it

[06:40:05]

xris:

or comcast decides to no longer encrypt their qam

[06:40:36]

mchou:

still good even fo ota

[06:40:42]

mchou:

for*

[06:40:48]

Dagmar:

not a bad looking case, but mini tower... yuck

[06:40:52]

xris:

mchou: but not worth $10/month when I can get a card for $80

[06:40:53]

Dagmar:

They are a BITCH to work in

[06:40:58]

qman:

not this one

[06:41:05]

qman:

everything folds or slides out of the way

[06:41:08]

xris:

Dagmar: ?

[06:41:11]

someninjamaster:

amen

[06:41:13]

qman:

it was the easiest small form factor build I've ever done

[06:41:14]

mchou:

xris: $10, should only be $5

[06:41:25]

Dagmar:

This http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811190057 that was just cited

[06:41:27]

xris:

mchou: box == $5, hd upgrade == $5

[06:41:29]

xris:

I have 2 boxes

[06:41:39]

Dagmar:

*mini* towers are infuriatingly tight to work in

[06:41:42]

qman:

the CD-ROM tray flips up, and both hard drive bays slide out the front

[06:41:50]

someninjamaster:

it took me 3 and a half hours to get everything in and situated

[06:42:00]

mchou:

xris: what the hell is the HD "upgrade?"

[06:42:13]

xris:

mchou: it's what you pay to get an HD box instead of an SD box

[06:42:24]

mchou:

xris: not over here

[06:42:25]

xris:

you get one SD box free with subscription. $5/month to upgrade that to HD.

[06:42:26]

qman:

I've had mid towers harder to work on than that mini

[06:42:40]

xris:

qman: that case doesn't look so bad

[06:42:46]

xris:

I could probably handle another mini tower

[06:43:01]

mchou:

xris: you can return the SD box

[06:43:03]

Dagmar:

It's nice lookin' but I *really* got tired of banging my knuckles on everything in mini towers

[06:43:14]

mchou:

xris: save $5

[06:43:14]

xris:

Dagmar: I don't muck around in mine very often

[06:43:20]

xris:

mchou: I don't have an HD box

[06:43:23]

xris:

I have two HD boxes

[06:43:26]

qman:

even if you do, the design is really intuitive

[06:43:39]

xris:

I pay $5/month to upgrade one to HD, and another $10 for the second HD box

[06:43:41]

qman:

stuff folds/slides out of the way with very little hassle

[06:43:55]

qman:

and yeah, they rip you off if you want HD

[06:44:17]

mchou:

xris: that's my point. the 1st HD STB box cost $5/mo.

[06:44:23]

xris:

mchou: yes.

[06:44:25]

qman:

it ends up costing my family about another $25/month after you add it all up

[06:44:28]

xris:

and I have two

[06:44:38]

mchou:

maybe the 2nd HD box costs $10

[06:44:45]

xris:

mchou: that's exactly what I said.

[06:44:54]

xris:

$5 for a second SD box, and $5 for each HD upgrade

[06:45:10]

mchou:

xris: dude, there is no SD box

[06:45:18]

xris:

mchou: that's their pricing scheme

[06:45:23]

mchou:

nope

[06:45:29]

xris:

if you pay $5, you get an sd box, if you pay $10, you get an hd box

[06:45:32]

qman:

I thought about buying one or two of those pcHDTV cards, but I don't know if my cable is encrypted or if I could decode it

[06:45:35]

xris:

$5 + $5 == 10

[06:45:36]

mchou:

at least its not over here

[06:46:00]

mchou:

here I pay $5 to get 1st HD STB

[06:46:01]

xris:

qman: I borrowed one from work to test, and mine unfortunately is all encrypted except the local stations

[06:46:06]

Tanthrix:

xris: By the way, don't know if I told you, but like you, I cannot get any of my QAM channels (besides the OTA stuff) even though they all work via firewire

[06:46:11]

mchou:

no bona fide SD

[06:46:13]

xris:

mchou: yes. because you get the first SD equivalent free

[06:46:14]

Tanthrix:

Disappointing to say the least

[06:46:19]

qman:

I've got Charter, not Comcast, though

[06:46:28]

xris:

"one box included" ($5 fee).. so to upgrade to HD, it's $5

[06:46:38]

qman:

that's okay, though, for non-HD, my winTV gets the job done fairly well

[06:46:48]

xris:

qman: comcast is a franchise, anyway. pricing, encryption, etc. all vary by region

[06:46:51]

mchou:

no, it's only $10 for the 2nd box

[06:47:05]

xris:

mchou: you're repeating what I'm saying

[06:47:09]

mchou:

and that has nothing to do with HD or SD

[06:47:11]

qman:

yeah

[06:47:12]

xris:

and trying to argue

[06:47:20]

Dagmar:

but universally suck

[06:47:21]

qman:

it's $5 per box, $5 more per HD

[06:47:36]

xris:

mchou: on the billing plan, they call it $5 per additional box, and if you want HD, it's $5 more

[06:47:43]

mchou:

qman: not over here it isn't

[06:47:51]

xris:

not $5 for SD, $10 for HD... but that's how the prices end up looking.

[06:47:55]

xris:

it's called an upgrade.

[06:48:01]

qman:

then if you want a DVR, oh boy, it's even more

[06:48:12]

xris:

qman: dvr is $10 on top of the $5 extra-box fee

[06:48:15]

mchou:

no, here it's called 2nd STB price

[06:48:32]

mchou:

or actually rental

[06:48:34]

xris:

mchou: yes... and unless you spend the $5 upgrade fee, it'll be an sd box.

[06:48:46]

mchou:

$5 for 1st, $10 for 2nd and beyond

[06:48:54]

Fnc:

does anyone happyen to know a good way to transcode avi to vobs, im trying to go from pal to ntsc, and well it doesnt look as good....

[06:49:00]

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[06:49:14]

qman:

for a non-HD DVR, they charge $10, 5 for the basic and 5 for the DVR upgrade

[06:49:22]

Dagmar:

Fnc: www.vcdhelp.com

[06:49:25]

qman:

but somehow, the HD DVR goes all the way up to $20

[06:49:39]

mchou:

xris: you cant get an SD box here if you wanted one. They are all DCT62xx

[06:49:44]

qman:

and it's a real junker of a box, too

[06:49:58]

xris:

mchou: but we're not talking about your "here".. I was talking about seattle.

[06:50:07]

xris:

and then you decided to argue about how things work up here.

[06:50:24]

xris:

and since I'm a masochist, I decided to keep arguing.

[06:50:39]

qman:

that's why I looked into building an HTPC in the first place

[06:50:49]

mchou:

I doubt seattle would have any SD only STBs either

[06:50:53]

qman:

the menu system on our box is awful, it's slow, and it doesn't have very much hard drive space

[06:51:12]

xris:

mchou: they have tons

[06:51:26]

mchou:

xris: tell them to get rid of them

[06:51:26]

qman:

there's tons of SD boxes around me, too

[06:51:30]

xris:

I had to ask special for HD

[06:51:33]

qman:

they still give them out

[06:51:38]

qman:

HD is an extra

[06:52:30]

qman:

heck, I still know some people who have those old channel changing boxes from the 80s

[06:53:05]

qman:

active service, and they haven't upgraded them

[06:53:05]

mchou:

that's what you get for living in a depresed area like michigan

[06:53:17]

mchou:

depressed*

[06:53:31]

qman:

no, that's what you get when there's only one cable company

[06:53:48]

qman:

they've got a complete monopoly over TV and broadband service

[06:54:01]

Fnc:

Dagmar: any recomendations, was hopeing to keep in in linux... so far transcode using mpeg2enc, hasnt turned out anything im extremely pleased with

[06:54:11]

mchou:

qman: there is only one cable company virtually everywhere.

[06:54:31]

qman:

but there are also DSL/dish compaines

[06:54:37]

qman:

we can get dish TV, but not DSL

[06:54:52]

mchou:

charter is hardly a cableco that's doing well

[06:54:58]

qman:

they're awful

[06:55:34]

qman:

they just started offering 5 meg service like a month ago

[06:56:08]

qman:

and it never operates at full bore, you're lucky to get half

[06:56:51]

qman:

with no alternative, they can be as crappy as they want

[06:57:04]

qman:

and our cable bill is like $130 a month

[06:57:14]

mchou:

the reason there is no competition in MI is because it's depressed. not profitable for competitors to step in

[06:57:31]

qman:

true

[06:57:37]

mchou:

you dont see verizon installing fios there :)

[06:57:44]

qman:

wish they would

[06:58:11]

mchou:

not when half the state is deployed to Iraq :)

[06:58:21]

qman:

dish TV is far better than cable around here, but then there's no alternative for broadband internet

[06:58:29]

mchou:

a la Michael Moore :)

[06:58:46]

qman:

I hate that guy

[06:59:03]

mchou:

no, but what he says about MI is true

[06:59:27]

mchou:

kids with no future going into the military

[06:59:41]

mchou:

getting killed in iraq

[06:59:43]

qman:

no it isn't

[06:59:53]

qman:

very few kids go into the military

[07:00:04]

qman:

and the ones that do are cut out for it, to say the least

[07:00:17]

qman:

it's all propoganda

[07:00:29]

mchou:

propaganda for what?

[07:00:42]

qman:

against the war

[07:00:53]

qman:

media ammunition

[07:01:15]

mchou:

it's no secret that poorer families are beaaring a disportionate of the costs of the war in Iraq

[07:01:22]

qman:

I'm not saying I'm necessarily for the war, but I hardly condone their tactics

[07:01:23]

mchou:

bearing*

[07:01:36]

Sid`:

all militaries prey on the lower socio/economic strata

[07:01:52]

qman:

with or without the war, those kids would be joining the military

[07:02:01]

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[07:02:02]

mchou:

Sid`: only if it's volunteer

[07:02:19]

qman:

either they really want to join in the first place, or they really have no other option

[07:02:24]

Sid`:

mchou: 'volunteer', yes. sociologists refer to the phenomonon as 'the poverty draft'

[07:02:26]

qman:

if you don't have any money, you don't have any money

[07:02:37]

Sid`:

that said, there ARE a lot of people who join the military cos they want to blow shit up

[07:02:43]

Sid`:

or have some kind of idea that they're making the world better

[07:02:49]

mchou:

qman: and then Michael Moore was right about MI

[07:03:01]

Sid`:

but there's an awful lot of poorer kids who join the military simply because they get suckered into it

[07:03:09]

mchou:

DEPRESSED*

[07:03:22]

qman:

the poor state of our economy is directly the fault of our state government

[07:03:26]

** juski came here expecting to see #mythtv-users not #politics **

[07:03:30]

Tanthrix:

IRC Public Service Announcement: Please do not feed the trolls, nor get stuck in irellevent and simplistic political bickering. Thank you and enjoy the rest of your evening.

[07:03:50]

qman:

MI is depressed, there's no question there

[07:04:03]

Tanthrix:

(Also: It's a trap!)

[07:04:26]

qman:

jobs are disappearing, people are emigrating, etc...

[07:04:30]

mchou:

Toyota is kicking MI ass

[07:04:41]

qman:

no, they aren't

[07:04:53]

qman:

GM is moving most of their stuff to Mexico

[07:04:58]

qman:

because of taxes and unions

[07:05:04]

hads:

Shut it. Talk about MythTV

[07:05:21]

qman:

not because of Toyota

[07:05:30]

qman:

and, last year, Toyota recalled more vehicles than they built

[07:05:39]

mchou:

Toyota still has plants in the US

[07:05:41]

qman:

hardly a success

[07:05:45]

Dagmar:

No one cares about your penis car.

[07:05:53]

qman:

besides

[07:06:02]

qman:

the automotive industry isn't to be relied on like it was

[07:06:09]

qman:

the government forced us into this situation

[07:06:25]

juski:

talk about mythtv or at least something vaguely related to mythtv

[07:06:35]

mchou:

well, that's what happens to a state that relies only on one industrial sector

[07:06:43]

juski:

other than the fact you're too poor to buy a decent tuner card!

[07:06:55]

qman:

thanks to small business tax, personal property tax, increasing minimum wage, etc...

[07:07:22]

Dagmar:

God forbid people actually be given enough money to eat

[07:07:27]

mchou:

cars manufacturers are hardly small business

[07:07:35]

qman:

minimum wage does nothing but fuel inflation

[07:07:40]

Dagmar:

Bullshit

[07:07:54]

Dagmar:

Work at minimum wage for a few years

[07:07:58]

qman:

by increasing minimum wage, you're forced to increase all wages

[07:07:59]

** juski wishes he'd never given up his badge again **

[07:08:09]

Dagmar:

No you're not.

[07:08:13]

qman:

by increasing all wages, companies have more costs

[07:08:18]

Dagmar:

Get a clue and take this to #offtopic or something

[07:08:19]

mchou:

we dont need no stinkin' badges!

[07:08:21]

qman:

increased costs means need for more income

[07:08:25]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Futility alert!

[07:08:38]

qman:

stuff costs more money, and we're back as square one, with a less valuable currency

[07:08:43]

qman:

at

[07:08:59]

juski:

mchou: yeah but slaps could be liberally applied to get the channel serious back on-topic

[07:09:05]

Dagmar:

Yeah, i guess this is proof of clue-resistance if he thinks labor of people paid minimum wage figures into the costs of anything to *any* noticeable degree

[07:09:48]

Lo_Pan:

dont forget hitler

[07:09:54]

mchou:

lol

[07:09:59]

otwin:

lol

[07:10:03]

juski:

ffs

[07:10:24]

mchou:

what's hitler got to do with price of cheese? :)

[07:10:28]

qman:

I still hold that increasing minimum wage is the worst possible thing to do to a dying economy

[07:10:34]

Dagmar:

Godwin's Law

[07:11:03]

mchou:

qman: dude, that barn is already been burned

[07:11:09]

qman:

even if prices don't go up, open jobs close

[07:11:27]

qman:

money doesn't grow on trees, and businesses have to make a profit

[07:11:36]

Dagmar:

Give it up already

[07:11:51]

mchou:

qman: you ever heard of the term "micro-credit?"

[07:12:00]

juski:

qman: what's all this in aid of btw? can't get mythtv working?

[07:12:06]

Dagmar:

Miniumum wages doesn't even get people to what is considered _poverty level_

[07:12:42]

Dagmar:

Food might grow on trees, but not in areas where people are being paid minimum wage.

[07:12:52]

juski:

there are poor people. they sometimes die. never mind. life sucks then you die!

[07:13:02]

qman:

I earn less than minimum wage

[07:13:08]

mchou:

lol

[07:13:09]

qman:

but it's under the table

[07:13:21]

Dagmar:

Then you are completely insane.

[07:13:28]

mchou:

talk about voting against your own self interests :)

[07:13:33]

Dagmar:

...or you're still living with your parents.

[07:13:34]

juski:

the #1 rule of capitalism – it won't work if you start caring about others too much!

[07:13:48]

qman:

I actually make more money than I would with a taxable minimum wage job

[07:13:58]

** juski realises he's been drawn into the mire. shit! **

[07:14:09]

mchou:

qman: that's bullshit

[07:14:30]

qman:

that's the michigan tax system

[07:14:32]

qman:

bullshit

[07:14:41]

mchou:

minimum wage job means at least you have some protection like worker's comp

[07:15:00]

mchou:

you get paid under the table you get shit

[07:15:06]

Dagmar:

It also means not worrying about what happens when they find out you've been evading taxes.

[07:15:10]

Dagmar:

they *do* send you to jail for that

[07:15:11]

mchou:

zip protection

[07:15:29]

qman:

I don't make as much as my tuition costs

[07:15:47]

mchou:

Dagmar: IRS is not gonna spend dollars to go after pennies

[07:16:10]

juski:

boo hoo. I'm sorry, but that's capitalism. next, we go back to #mythtv-users

[07:17:04]

juski:

I don't make as much as the guy who sits next to me. that sucks but I can live with it

[07:17:15]

qman:

oh, I wasn't complaining

[07:17:24]

juski:

not fucking much you weren't!

[07:17:25]

qman:

just making a point, that there's nothing to be taken

[07:17:46]

Dagmar:

mchou: Actually, they really don't have to do much but shuffle some papers and an arrest warrant gets issued

[07:17:54]

mchou:

qman: yes you were, you were complaining about minimum wasge causing inflation

[07:18:11]

qman:

that was in regard to this statement

[07:18:14]

qman:

<qman> I don't make as much as my tuition costs

[07:18:25]

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[07:18:27]

qman:

I should have been more clear

[07:18:51]

mchou:

qman: you could have joined the military and gotten free education :)

[07:19:05]

mchou:

provided you didnt get killed

[07:19:11]

mchou:

or maimed

[07:19:16]

qman:

I know several people who attempted that

[07:19:21]

qman:

you don't get a degree

[07:19:26]

qman:

you never get a degree

[07:19:46]

qman:

what they don't tell you is that you have to fit it in on your own time

[07:20:08]

mchou:

gee, that's funny, I know plenty of ppl who took advanage of GI bills and became lawyers and doctors

[07:20:19]

qman:

oh, you can if you're a veteran

[07:20:27]

qman:

once you're done with your tour, if you still have benefits, no problem

[07:20:41]

qman:

but those deals where they tell you you can earn a degree while you work in the military for 4 years, forget it

[07:20:42]

** Tanthrix cracks open the ALSA docs **

[07:21:03]

mchou:

qman: that is the point (poor kids) of serving in the military, no?

[07:21:39]

mchou:

qman: as a vet you go to school, have moe options than just being poor

[07:21:46]

qman:

yes

[07:22:05]

qman:

if you otherwise couldn't pull it off, then it's a good option

[07:22:10]

qman:

but last resort, at most

[07:22:20]

qman:

you can't possibly expect to have a degree by the end of your duty

[07:22:41]

mchou:

qman: so why are you complaining you cant make enough to cover education?

[07:22:57]

mchou:

I just illustrated it's possible :)

[07:23:10]

qman:

that wasn't a complaint, it was a mere statement; even if I filed for taxes on my income, there's nothing to take

[07:23:20]

qman:

that's all I meant by it

[07:24:09]

** Tanthrix doesn't see Realtek listed at all in the supported sound card chipset list.. **

[07:24:29]

qman:

should they decide to audit or investigate me, after all the numbers are crunched, I wouldn't owe a dime

[07:24:38]

qman:

so there's no danger in not filing

[07:24:39]

juski:

Tanthrix: I've got a realtek card somewhere & it was supported IIRC

[07:24:41]

mchou:

qman: so if minimum wage cause infalation, wouldn't joing the military cause even MORE inflation?

[07:24:47]

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[07:24:51]

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[07:24:52]

mchou:

joining*

[07:24:53]

juski:

better supported than my AWE32

[07:24:59]

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[07:25:02]

qman:

I don't see where you draw that conclusion

[07:25:04]

Tanthrix:

juski: Yah mine seems to work..mostly, as well, just can't find it in the list – ALC888

[07:25:17]

hads:

qman: Shut up. Are you here to talk about MythTV or what?

[07:25:37]

mchou:

qman: considering the military reduces the "free" labor supply and gives away free education (GI Bill)?

[07:25:38]

qman:

sure, my mythtv box has audio issues

[07:25:58]

hads:

So talk about that, not random unrelated subjects.

[07:25:59]

Sid`:

Tanthrix: yeah, from memory the ALC888 needs a rather new version of ALSA tho

[07:26:11]

Sid`:

was a complete prat getting that to work on FC6

[07:26:36]

qman:

mchou: that doesn't make much sense, and it's a far, far stretch at best

[07:26:52]

mchou:

qman: how does that not make much sense?

[07:27:16]

qman:

mchou: it's a job like any other, if some other employer opened up, it would be just the same

[07:27:17]

Tanthrix:

Sid`: I've got 1.0.14rc2 from the looks of it, 2 release candidates away from 14

[07:27:20]

mchou:

are you saying that the military doesnt reduce the availability of workers?

[07:27:41]

Sid`:

Tanthrix: that's newer than what I used from memory, so it should work fine

[07:27:47]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Second release candidate

[07:27:54]

Dagmar:

Not "two releases away"

[07:28:11]

mchou:

qman: military reduces labor supply, drives up labor costs

[07:28:39]

qman:

mchou: not at a rate worth noting, there is plenty of available labor

[07:28:57]

Tanthrix:

Sid`: Getting "WriteAudio: buffer underrun" when using ALSA in myth – mainly when skipping back and fourth. Gets bad enough to mess up the video with the need to restart the frontend.

[07:29:18]

Sid`:

messes up the VIDEO !?

[07:29:48]

juski:

Tanthrix: I see loads of that on my frontend. never gets so bad it's crashy, generally

[07:29:52]

Tanthrix:

Sid`: Yah, it actually gets distorted. And if I exit a recording, go back in, I get a grey screen or more garbledyness until restarting.

[07:29:55]

mchou:

qman: 100,000 ppl over in Iraq is not a blip :)

[07:30:13]

Sid`:

hm

[07:30:22]

mchou:

it's not a blip on the labor supply

[07:30:25]

qman:

mchou: with the amount of available jobs versus workers in michigan, it is

[07:30:29]

juski:

so just stick with oss emulation then?

[07:30:46]

qman:

mchou: which, I assume, we are still talking about michigan's economy

[07:30:47]

Tanthrix:

Well, I'd like to know what the problem is

[07:30:59]

mchou:

qman: of course.

[07:31:33]

mchou:

qman: but all those 100,000 ppl dont all come from MI

[07:31:50]

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[07:32:43]

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[07:32:49]

qman:

mchou: of course not, but even if 10,000 were, that's hardly enough to affect the current situation...the economy here really is that bad

[07:33:30]

Tanthrix:

Meh, to hell with it. I'll just use OSS and not care about it for now.

[07:33:32]

mchou:

qman: maybe. but not if you ask McD

[07:33:34]

mchou:

:)

[07:34:17]

mchou:

Yo Slicer!

[07:34:26]

mchou:

where you been man?

[07:35:37]

mchou:

qman: those (hyothetical) 10,000 ppl effective raise McD's labor costs in MI

[07:36:40]

mchou:

qman: fewer consumers for Big Macs and fries too

[07:37:13]

mchou:

qman: a real double whammy on MI economy no matter which way you slice it

[07:37:15]

qman:

mchou: maybe, but those particular factors don't affect it by much; the rest of the economy factoring in has more to do with it

[07:37:22]

Dagmar:

That shit raises the cost of a Big Mac all of 3 cents, if that much

[07:37:32]

mchou:

lol

[07:39:48]

Dagmar:

This is why the whole argument of raising the minimum wage hurts the consumer is a load of crap

[07:40:07]

Dagmar:

The companies that are paying their employees minimum wage have those labor costs down to a ludicrous minimum.

[07:40:28]

Dagmar:

You could double the wages at any given walmart and not have to raise prices 10%

[07:40:34]

mchou:

yeah, let's talk about how much the CEO of McD gets paid

[07:40:42]

mchou:

lol

[07:41:31]

qman:

it hurts small businesses far more

[07:41:32]

mchou:

sometimes ppl dont see the forest from the trees

[07:41:52]

qman:

say, a company with 8 minimum wage employees, previously around five bucks an hour

[07:42:01]

qman:

now they can only afford 5, at 8 bucks an hour

[07:42:08]

mchou:

qman: the point still stands

[07:42:40]

mchou:

the owner of the business (generally) makes much much more than the workers

[07:43:11]

vandebo_:

I can't get mythdvd to rip dvd's. When I hit 0 to start the processing (either on perfect, or other quality setting), the 0 button flashes, but nothing else happens. mtd is running and even with -v all, there's nothing interesting in the log

[07:43:15]

mchou:

so the whole minimum wage argument has quite a number of holes

[07:43:17]

qman:

the owner of the business also (generally) has a lot more expenses

[07:43:47]

Dagmar:

The employee has rent to pay, which goes up steadilly each year.

[07:43:53]

mchou:

qman: I'm talking about bottom line, no revenue

[07:44:00]

Dagmar:

The employee has to get to work, which means gas, which goes up about 5 cents a week lately.

[07:44:01]

mchou:

not*

[07:44:05]

Dagmar:

The employee has to EAT.

[07:44:16]

Dagmar:

Minimum wages have not changed in 10 years.

[07:44:19]

hads:

*yawn*

[07:44:29]

Dagmar:

So get over it already.

[07:45:46]

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[07:45:49]

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[07:46:08]

mchou:

the small business argument about minimum wage holds no water at all

[07:46:54]

mchou:

if they are really that poor, it's not as if they could have hired more workers anyway even if the minimum wage did not go up

[07:47:31]

qman:

most small businesses aren't run by rich people

[07:47:48]

qman:

they're run by people with average incomes, trying to get ahead

[07:48:04]

mchou:

I've never seen small business lay off ppl because the minimum wage went up

[07:48:22]

qman:

you've obviously never been in michigan

[07:48:25]

qman:

it happens all the time

[07:48:40]

mchou:

qman: I never said small business owners were "rich"

[07:48:44]

qman:

"sorry, we can't afford to pay you, so you're laid off until further notice"

[07:49:07]

Dagmar:

So the business isn't viable.

[07:49:29]

mchou:

qman: that's bullshit. large companies (who pay way above minimum) say that too :-)

[07:49:44]

Dagmar:

Let's make it simple. What's the highest monthly rent payment someone can sign a lease on, if they make minimum wage?

[07:49:44]

qman:

it was before minimum wage increased, but that extra cost adds up

[07:50:11]

juski:

Dagmar: depends how much they spend a week on heroin

[07:50:36]

Dagmar:

qman: It means the business isn't viable. Too bad.

[07:50:46]

qman:

although sarcasticm juski brings up a good point

[07:51:06]

Dagmar:

Do the math. I'm not kidding.

[07:51:08]

qman:

most people who earn minimum wage smoke

[07:51:08]

hads:

I doubt there's been any good points here for quite some time.

[07:51:11]

Dagmar:

Heroin has nothing to do with it.

[07:51:14]

qman:

if they'd quit smoking, they could make their rent

[07:51:26]

Dagmar:

Minimum wage is _far_ from sufficient in metropolitan areas.

[07:51:37]

Dagmar:

it's not a matter of "making rent" monkey boy

[07:52:10]

qman:

cigarettes cost $6 a pack here

[07:52:18]

hads:

Name calling surely makes your point

[07:52:27]

Dagmar:

A lease is a formal instrument of financial liability, which means it's governed by law.

[07:52:45]

Dagmar:

You can't even *sign* a lease legally that exceeds 1/3 of your annual, pre-tax income in most areas.

[07:52:50]

Dagmar:

So do the math.

[07:53:04]

hads:

Depends where you live

[07:53:17]

qman:

I've never encountered such law

[07:53:29]

Dagmar:

You're still living with your parents, apparently.

[07:53:36]

qman:

though, even with that considered

[07:53:52]

juski:

aren't all people on minimum wage crack heads or alcoholics anyway?

[07:53:59]

mchou:

Dagmar: I doubt if that's true

[07:54:04]

juski:

that's what Daddy told me, so it must be twue

[07:54:06]

mchou:

the 1/3 law

[07:54:11]

Dagmar:

In Tennessee, it's true.

[07:54:15]

mchou:

lol

[07:54:19]

qman:

40 hours a week at minimum wage is just under 17 grand a year

[07:54:23]

mchou:

another depressed place

[07:54:28]

hads:

Not here it's not.

[07:54:31]

Dagmar:

it's also not so bright to sign a lease that makes up more than 1/3 of your income anyway

[07:54:45]

qman:

that comes out to around $460 a month

[07:54:56]

mchou:

Dagmar: no, I never suggested it was "wise"

[07:55:03]

qman:

if 1/3 of a single minimum wage income goes to rent

[07:55:28]

Dagmar:

So do the math

[07:55:40]

qman:

I just did

[07:55:53]

Dagmar:

$minwage * 40hrs * 50 wks / 12mo / 3

[07:56:24]

qman:

it's right about $460

[07:56:46]

Dagmar:

What the hell is the minimum wage in your area?

[07:57:02]

mchou:

lol

[07:57:12]

mchou:

who's on first?

[07:57:20]

Dagmar:

8.28 is the *new* standard

[07:57:29]

Dagmar:

...or might be, if people are lucky

[07:57:29]

qman:

7.80 something? I rounded it to 8

[07:57:38]

qman:

they're progressively increasing it

[07:57:50]

qman:

by next year it'll be over 8

[07:58:23]

Dagmar:

Most states it's $5–6, man.

[07:58:30]

qman:

it used to be 5.25

[07:58:37]

qman:

about a year ago

[07:59:00]

qman:

mabye two

[07:59:03]

Dagmar:

So that's $210/week, or roughly $10,500 a year.

[07:59:24]

Dagmar:

...which means they can afford about $291/month for rent.

[07:59:29]

Dagmar:

Try and find an apartment for that.

[07:59:40]

Dagmar:

...that's not probably on fire, or buried in sewage.

[07:59:52]

mchou:

or a crack house :)

[07:59:55]

qman:

working 40 hours a week is for the privileged

[07:59:57]

Dagmar:

Pretty much.

[08:00:10]

Dagmar:

Working 80 hours a week is what slaves do.

[08:00:27]

qman:

yes, but 60 isn't so bad

[08:00:36]

Dagmar:

It is if you intend to have a life and friends.

[08:01:04]

Dagmar:

...but hey, if you were wondering why some people can't find the time to vote...

[08:01:18]

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[08:01:43]

Dagmar:

...and hey, no one seems to think it's any big deal for management types to only work one job and 40 hours a week

[08:02:19]

** juski works 37.5 per week, officially **

[08:02:20]

qman:

the job requires more responsibility, and usually, a degree

[08:02:32]

qman:

therefore, pays more

[08:02:41]

juski:

qman: your tears are getting tiring now. stop it

[08:02:57]

Dagmar:

qman: You clearly grew up in a moneyd family and have no damn clue what you're talking about.

[08:03:14]

qman:

my family has legally been in the poverty income level for the last ten years

[08:03:23]

qman:

I know what I'm talking about

[08:03:33]

mchou:

sigh....

[08:03:44]

qman:

I see it every day

[08:03:48]

mchou:

just move the hell away from MI

[08:03:53]

Dagmar:

And you've been clearly skirting working legally for quite some time

[08:03:59]

mchou:

it's a cesspool

[08:04:00]

qman:

the way things are going, I'll have to if I plan to find a decent job

[08:04:08]

Dagmar:

Try and live on *legally obtained* wages for a year or two

[08:05:34]

qman:

it's a shame too, it used to be a nice place to live

[08:05:46]

Dagmar:

Gee... I wonder why it's gone to pot

[08:06:21]

qman:

the state made some very awful decisions riding on GM and the auto industry

[08:06:41]

qman:

and they won't adapt to not having that huge income

[08:06:45]

** juski remembers when his family went without electricity for 2 years just so we could EAT, but hey.. **

[08:07:06]

juski:

I don't come in here moaning about it

[08:07:11]

Dagmar:

Yes, decisions which gave all the money to the corporations and kept minimum wages nice and oppressively low, so the area was slowly sapped of wealth to the near-exclusive benefit of the corporations.

[08:07:16]

Dagmar:

Learn about economics.

[08:08:12]

qman:

no, decisions that taxed small businesses to death, pushed the steel industry away, and forced us to be wholly reliant on the auto industry

[08:08:29]

Dagmar:

Did you even read what you just typed?

[08:08:32]

qman:

it was going to collapse eventually, yet they did nothing to stop it

[08:09:12]

Dagmar:

You basically just said the cited the exact same scenario as I did, but you don't even see it.

[08:09:18]

Dagmar:

s/said the//;

[08:09:23]

mchou:

that's the point. MI did nothing to diversify their economy

[08:09:37]

juski:

I blame China. they'll be the cause of many an ex-employee of greedy companies' redundancy

[08:09:44]

Dagmar:

They pretty much handed everything to the automaker corps

[08:10:43]

mchou:

now MI is shit-canned cause GM can't compete

[08:10:47]

hads:

I blame IRC

[08:11:12]

qman:

GM became so bloated over the years that it's not able to downsize appropriately

[08:11:17]

mchou:

nor can any other US car manufacturer, for that matter

[08:11:40]

qman:

and the unions aren't helping the situation

[08:11:52]

Dagmar:

...they became addicted to the huge profit margins, and can't reduce them without damaging "stockholder interests" which means executives would be out of jobs and they can't have that,

[08:12:27]

Dagmar:

I learned about how *that* particular evil works during the dot-com boom/bust

[08:12:50]

Dagmar:

Companies leverage "goodwill" and their own stock valuation to get credit from banks.

[08:12:53]

qman:

they have too many layers of management, too much bureaucracy

[08:12:53]

juski:

damn those evil shareholders, demanding their guaranteed income

[08:13:06]

qman:

they pay people a ton of money to do nothing

[08:13:23]

Dagmar:

If they were to actually do something that reduced profits enough to devaluate their stocks more than a small amount, they can actually wind up being in automatic default because they used their own stock valuation as collateral

[08:13:39]

Dagmar:

meaning suddenly the company *has* to go into bankruptcy

[08:13:50]

juski:

I mean far be it from me to even suggest a big corp passes on profits to its employees rather than its shareholders. muhahahaha

[08:13:50]

qman:

instead of firing people who don't do a good job, they promote them

[08:13:51]

Dagmar:

...even though they're sitll making money, just less than before.

[08:14:00]

qman:

just to get them out of the way

[08:14:05]

juski:

qman: LIFE SUCKS, get on with it

[08:15:35]

gbee:

guys, enough of the politics for today

[08:16:48]

juski:

we need somebody to op somebody's ass :)

[08:17:28]

vandebo_:

I can't get mythdvd to rip dvd's. When I hit 0 to start the processing (either on perfect, or other quality setting), the 0 button flashes, but nothing else happens. mtd is running and even with -v all, there's nothing interesting in the log

[08:18:30]

juski:

vandebo_: has it occured to you to verify the destination dir is writable ? ;)

[08:19:04]

vandebo_:

mtd is running as root -> writable

[08:19:39]

juski:

yeah that is if the dir exists ;0

[08:19:52]

vandebo_:

it does, the log file goes to the same place

[08:21:39]

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[08:24:41]

vandebo_:

I don't want to shoot down all your suggestions. I'd love for you to point out some stupid, obvious thing that I've forgotten, because then it will work, but you haven't hit upon it just yet ;-)

[08:27:02]

juski:

I'm all out of ideas, not having ever been a user of mtd

[08:30:14]

Anduin:

What is the problem?

[08:31:59]

gbee:

vandebo_: I can't get mythdvd to rip dvd's. When I hit 0 to start the processing (either on perfect, or other quality setting), the 0 button flashes, but nothing else happens. mtd is running and even with -v all, there's nothing interesting in the log

[08:32:31]

Anduin:

ah, same as last night

[08:34:48]

gbee:

does it require decss2? Would it complain it weren't installed?

[08:35:31]

juski:

well yeah – first question would be .. "does the dvd play in linux ok?"

[08:35:32]

Anduin:

It requires it if you want it to work for css encoded stuff

[08:35:32]

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[08:35:40]

tcpsyn:

anyone get that mythweather hack working?

[08:36:00]

juski:

what mythweather hack? the one where you need to look outta the window? works here

[08:36:36]

tcpsyn:

really? you can see the weather for the weekend by looking out the window?

[08:36:47]

tcpsyn:

impressive.

[08:36:51]

juski:

pretty much

[08:37:02]

hads:

As much as the forcasters can :)

[08:37:07]

tcpsyn:

save the cheerleader, save the world.

[08:37:16]

juski:

in manchester, if it's not currently raining, it's going to rain

[08:37:22]

tcpsyn:

heh

[08:37:41]

juski:

the final episode of Heroes was poo btw

[08:37:47]

tcpsyn:

agreed

[08:37:56]

tcpsyn:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/265547

[08:37:59]

tcpsyn:

that's what I'm talking about

[08:38:02]

juski:

cop-out )

[08:38:02]

tcpsyn:

mythweather-revamp

[08:38:17]

juski:

I don't think it's been agreed how to best fix the problem has it?

[08:38:33]

juski:

i.e. whether to continue doing the dodgy screen scraping & inviting litigation or not

[08:38:48]

gbee:

mythweather-revamp works – but it's a PITA to setup

[08:39:02]

hads:

Last I saw a useable global source was still being looked for.

[08:39:07]

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[08:39:18]

Dagmar:

Hell, good luck trying to even find a domestic source in the uS

[08:39:19]

gbee:

it is

[08:39:23]

juski:

just have local scripts IMHO – then we could make use of the BBC's rss feed

[08:39:46]

hads:

But I don't use it so I haven't really paid much attention.

[08:39:51]

juski:

or the metoffice.gov.uk is they have an rss feed

[08:39:55]

tcpsyn:

it's the only plugin I ever really used.

[08:39:56]

juski:

s/is/if

[08:39:58]

gbee:

Dagmar: mythweather-revamp has a domestic source for the US – but not a global source we can use as the default

[08:40:03]

Dagmar:

For some reason there's several companies in the US that seem to feel that even though NOAA collects all their data, and is paid for by taxpayers, that no one should have access to it but them so that they can make money off it.

[08:40:29]

Dagmar:

Ya might as well set up a business selling the peppermints most restaurants give away

[08:40:41]

gbee:

juski: we will have local scripts, thats the point of the revamp, but we really need a replacement global source too

[08:40:47]

Dagmar:

...as in going and grabbing handfuls of them and selling them

[08:41:04]

gbee:

Dagmar: iirc it uses NOAA directly

[08:41:08]

Dagmar:

Yay

[08:41:34]

Dagmar:

GnomeWeather does that, and there's been actual pushes *against* making METAR entirely machine-parsable.

[08:41:41]

Dagmar:

...which pisses me off.

[08:42:06]

Dagmar:

I figured it would wind up using the METAR-based info from NOAA

[08:42:38]

Dagmar:

I've been down to the local weather station talking to those guys about it

[08:42:57]

Dagmar:

'cuz well, they're nice guys and basically, they'll talk at length to anyone who shows up and shows an interesst

[08:43:07]

Dagmar:

THeir jobs are actually more boring than mine.

[08:43:40]

Dagmar:

Except maybe in the spring here when tornadoes are a pretty regular visitor

[08:44:27]

Dagmar:

When I was in SF I pulled the same stunt, and those guys are downright paranoid because since they don't really have _weather_ over there, no one *ever* shows an interest

[08:46:54]

juski:

isn't the bbc site good for worldwide?

[08:48:57]

Dagmar:

Do they allow scraping?"

[08:49:21]

tcpsyn:

none of them svn mythplugins compile

[08:49:22]

tcpsyn:

lame

[08:49:41]

Dagmar:

0.20-fixes compiles

[08:49:48]

Dagmar:

head has no such guarantee

[08:49:59]

tcpsyn:

-fixes?

[08:50:03]

juski:

Dagmar: don't think they have a statement specifically forbidding it

[08:50:15]

juski:

and they provide rss feeds anyway

[08:50:17]

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[08:50:24]

Dagmar:

I'd check for it and then maybe even email them and ask them what their policy is

[08:50:34]

Dagmar:

Oh, well no need to scrape if you can read the RSS feed

[08:50:47]

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[08:50:51]

tcpsyn:

damn birds are loud

[08:50:53]

Dagmar:

That would satisfy pretty much any definition of "implied permission"

[08:51:09]

juski:

e.g. http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/weather/feeds/rss/5day/world/6403.xml

[08:51:10]

Dagmar:

...since RSS feeds are designed to be machine-parsable

[08:52:06]

tcpsyn:

your just using the rss news feed for the weather?

[08:53:29]

gbee:

no plugins compile in SVN???

[08:53:46]

tcpsyn:

not on my box. I'm probably missing some dependency.

[08:53:50]

Dagmar:

tcpsyn: That feed Juski cited is *just* weather forecasts

[08:53:58]

gbee:

you must be, they all compile fine here

[08:54:33]

tcpsyn:

I can compile them against the regular gentoo myth ebuild right?

[08:54:38]

tcpsyn:

should be able to anyway..

[08:57:58]

gbee:

juski: to me it looks like a good source, don't think anyone has seriously considered it before – might be worth mentioning it on the dev list

[08:58:30]

Dagmar:

There definitely needs to be a 'data source credit' field to the interface tho for that sort of thing

[08:58:35]

Dagmar:

Gotta give props to the Beeb

[08:59:55]

Dagmar:

Yep

[09:00:03]

Dagmar:

qt4 is not going to work

[09:00:09]

tcpsyn:

mythfrontend works.

[09:00:21]

Dagmar:

...although personally I think they should port to Gtk+ instead of Qt4. ;)

[09:00:24]

tcpsyn:

and all the ebuilds work

[09:00:25]

Dagmar:

Better rendering options, by far

[09:00:43]

tcpsyn:

wonder what's gonna break when I downgrade it

[09:00:54]

Dagmar:

They *should* be parallel-installable

[09:01:06]

Dagmar:

I s'pose it depends on how bright the build script is

[09:01:11]

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[09:01:36]

tcpsyn:

I don't think I can do that with emerge, but I can try grabbing the source

[09:01:43]

gbee:

Dagmar: that's not a problem, what we couldn't do was what the weather.com license required which was to put three hyperlinks to their website on every page using the weather data

[09:01:49]

Dagmar:

tcpsyn: Unless you want pain, you should probably go for pulling 0.20-fixes, not SVN head

[09:02:02]

tcpsyn:

I'm only pulling mythweather

[09:02:09]

tcpsyn:

everything else is fine

[09:02:33]

tcpsyn:

you still suggest 0.20-fixes?

[09:02:59]

tcpsyn:

my backend is a different box

[09:03:28]

gbee:

nah, svn plugins are fine – but you'll need svn mythtv installed (libs)

[09:03:44]

tcpsyn:

that's why it's not working for me.

[09:04:06]

tcpsyn:

Eh, might as well just deal with it. I can live without the weather I suppose.

[09:04:47]

Dagmar:

Oh those are _pearls_ he's calling htem now

[09:04:52]

Dagmar:

Most people just flush them

[09:05:18]

Dagmar:

Oh wait, I thought you were talking about Uwe Boll heh

[09:06:26]

Dagmar:

Dibblah: Someone should tell him that he needs to use the word "thoughtlessness" if he's going to pretend English

[09:06:33]

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[09:07:19]

Dibblah:

He seems to pick a theme word for every email, which is always entertaining.

[09:07:37]

Dagmar:

It's probably not helping his credibility when he uses Engrish tho'.

[09:08:41]

tcpsyn:

juski, new project grayhem is nice

[09:09:06]

tcpsyn:

it's a little messed up I think

[09:09:13]

tcpsyn:

but all in all, damn nice.

[09:10:05]

tcpsyn:

The background on the Watch Recordings page is kinda borked

[09:20:57]

juski:

a litle messed up?!

[09:21:09]

juski:

quality that please

[09:21:37]

juski:

*qualify* that I mean

[09:23:46]

juski:

I tested it as much as I could before unleashing it.. what's messed up?

[09:24:07]

tcpsyn:

first. When initially loading the progress bar shadows itself... er. I'll try to get you screenshots.

[09:24:29]

Dagmar:

xwd -xy -root -o snap.xwd I think

[09:24:36]

juski:

screenshots don't just help. they take you where words fail!

[09:24:39]

Dagmar:

Maybe without -root

[09:25:14]

juski:

I don't give a monkey's arse what the progress bar looks like when it's loading

[09:26:10]

juski:

the whole bit where the little popup comes up using the theme background is lame & can't easily be worked around without supplying another graphic. wasted space

[09:26:50]

Dagmar:

You can cheat it

[09:28:36]

tcpsyn:

hey I'm not ripping on it, I'm just letting you know, in case you didn't.

[09:29:09]

juski:

I know – I'm just saying

[09:30:21]

juski:

if that's the only thing, it;s the same as the original gheyhem was :)

[09:30:21]

tcpsyn:

www.lukemacneil.com/watchrecordings.gif

[09:30:38]

tcpsyn:

the dotted background is a bit messed up on the left

[09:30:54]

tcpsyn:

and the top looks like it's probably not what you intended.

[09:30:57]

juski:

clear your themecache fella

[09:31:08]

tcpsyn:

eh?

[09:31:17]

tcpsyn:

www.lukemacneil.com/progressbar.gif

[09:31:26]

juski:

rm -rf ~/.mythtv/themecache

[09:31:31]

juski:

then restart mythfrontend

[09:32:09]

juski:

not worrying about the progressbar thing – really

[09:32:29]

juski:

and a friendly word – please don't use 256 colour images for screenshots :)

[09:32:29]

tcpsyn:

looks like the themecache thing fixed it anyway

[09:32:50]

tcpsyn:

although the progress bar starts gray and ends green, which I can't figure out..

[09:32:56]

juski:

maybe I should put a word in my site about the themecache thing

[09:32:57]

tcpsyn:

but it still looks cool as hell

[09:33:04]

juski:

yeah I really like it

[09:33:18]

juski:

thanks. somebody liked it enough to donate real money too

[09:33:34]

tcpsyn:

themecache didn't fix the watch recordings screen though.

[09:34:24]

juski:

what res are you running it at?

[09:34:42]

juski:

get me a full colour screenshot please. I can't make head nor tail of that gif

[09:35:03]

tcpsyn:

that is a full color screenshot.

[09:35:12]

tcpsyn:

I'm running 1024x768

[09:35:14]

tcpsyn:

on that monitor

[09:35:31]

juski:

gif is 256 colour

[09:35:43]

tcpsyn:

you want jpg?

[09:35:44]

tcpsyn:

or png

[09:35:49]

juski:

either but not gif

[09:35:54]

juski:

please – gif is lame

[09:35:55]

tcpsyn:

heh. I never knew that

[09:36:17]

tcpsyn:

that image you got for music tools is slick

[09:36:23]

tcpsyn:

badass

[09:36:33]

juski:

funny – it's from neon-wide

[09:36:39]

juski:

all the watermarks are from there now

[09:36:46]

juski:

easier work, for me :)

[09:37:15]

juski:

I started out updating the watermarks – ended up reworking the whole thing

[09:37:26]

tcpsyn:

yeah, the neon stuff looks nice on the dark background

[09:37:38]

juski:

anyway -I think that watch recordings screen has the wrong background anyway

[09:37:49]

directhex|work:

gif is a palette-based format, to a maximum of 256 colors (and the file size gets exponentially larger as you add more colors)

[09:38:03]

juski:

directhex|work: what I said... lame :)

[09:40:37]

tcpsyn:

www.lukemacneil.com/watchrecording.png

[09:41:32]

juski:

hm

[09:41:59]

tcpsyn:

I'm not crazy right.. it's actually not right...

[09:42:00]

tcpsyn:

right?

[09:42:07]

juski:

yeah it's wrong

[09:42:13]

juski:

lemme see here

[09:44:42]

tcpsyn:

and I know you don't care, but the progress bar thing came back the next time I started myth

[09:45:36]

juski:

I must have some files on my box that aren't in svn

[09:45:54]

tcpsyn:

I'm not running svn

[09:46:01]

tcpsyn:

and I got that from your website

[09:46:08]

directhex|work:

yay, /me starts a LUG flamewar

[09:46:11]

juski:

no I mean not in my svn server at home

[09:48:19]

juski:

it's weird.. I sorted that screen out ages before any other

[09:48:29]

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[09:48:41]

juski:

I'm not worried about the startup progress bar thing & likely never will be, but this watch recordings screen thing is a biggie

[09:49:58]

tcpsyn:

aye

[09:50:16]

tcpsyn:

anyone else running it notice the same thing

[09:50:19]

tcpsyn:

maybe it's just me

[09:52:41]

juski:

checking my copy here

[09:52:57]

Dagmar:

directhex|work: Could be worse.

[09:53:09]

juski:

tcpsyn: mine def. looks different!

[09:53:16]

Dagmar:

directhex|work: NLUG is probably going to die because no one's even showing up to meetings anymore

[09:53:38]

Dagmar:

Which MIGHT have SOMETHING to do with the fact that presenters keep doing presentations on OPENBSD using their damn MACS

[09:53:39]

tcpsyn:

anything else that I might try deleting on my end?

[09:54:06]

Dagmar:

I may be the only person who _always_ did my stuff for them exclusively in Linux

[09:54:11]

juski:

tcpsyn: www.juski.co.uk/new/Image8.png is how mine looks

[09:54:11]

tcpsyn:

I love linux and all.. but LUGs seem awful boring.

[09:54:19]

Dagmar:

They are

[09:54:22]

juski:

tcpsyn: and that's how I intend it to look

[09:54:48]

tcpsyn:

oh yeah.

[09:54:49]

Dagmar:

What's worse is that you know how people are all "Reeding hurtz mah brane" on IRC?

[09:54:51]

tcpsyn:

that's a lot different

[09:55:10]

Dagmar:

F*ckers will show up to a high-level presentation on security, and ask the presenter to stop and explain routing tables.

[09:55:23]

tcpsyn:

heh.

[09:55:51]

Dagmar:

I probably refused to answer 2/3 of the questions as below the bar last time

[09:56:15]

juski:

tcpsyn: I'm confuzzled now!

[09:57:51]

Dagmar:

If they don't terminate the group this month, I'll probably do a presentation on creating a package manager next month

[09:57:59]

juski:

tcpsyn: ahh.. it should be loading a file called trans-background.png

[09:58:24]

Dagmar:

Trance isn't just for background music you know

[09:58:41]

SiD3WiNDR:

:)

[09:58:43]

Dagmar:

*sjit-eating grin*

[09:58:46]

tcpsyn:

/home/luke/.mythtv/themecache/ProjectGrayhem.1024.768/trans-background.png

[09:58:46]

directhex|work:

Dagmar, i started the flame war by essentially calling someone both offtopic and stupid for wanting to buy a new Â£4k sparc solaris workstation

[09:58:50]

juski:

tcpsyn: filesize of trans-background -s 3177 bytes here

[09:59:14]

juski:

Dagmar: I know. trance music is shite

[09:59:19]

Dagmar:

directhex|work: Heh. Sad thing is you appear to be right on both counts

[09:59:20]

tcpsyn:

4902

[09:59:21]

Dagmar:

BLASPHEMER

[09:59:54]

Dagmar:

Not that I'm into "epic trance" but without it, what would gays bois listen to in their CRX's?

[10:00:05]

tcpsyn:

mines bigger.

[10:01:32]

juski:

tcpsyn: myerrs, but mine is 800x600 – yours is 1024x768

[10:01:38]

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[10:01:42]

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[10:01:53]

tcpsyn:

aye

[10:02:06]

juski:

tcpsyn: what I could do is tar up the dir & upload it as is, not the svn export

[10:02:30]

tcpsyn:

you want me to toss trans-background up for you to compare first?

[10:02:54]

juski:

no no it's ok

[10:02:58]

tcpsyn:

ok

[10:03:06]

juski:

this is *weird*

[10:03:13]

juski:

I know a workaround

[10:03:44]

juski:

look for the playback section in ui.xml, find the background.png – call it something else like tvplay-back.png say

[10:04:01]

juski:

then rename trans-background to trans-tvplay-back.png

[10:04:28]

juski:

I hate this undocumented part, how you specify a file & it goes off & looks for a trans- counterpart

[10:05:03]

juski:

just out of interest – are you using opengl or qt?

[10:05:06]

Dagmar:

Is that for people to use jpg with transparency?

[10:05:16]

juski:

Dagmar: no idea.

[10:05:22]

juski:

I'd love to kill it off

[10:05:49]

Dagmar:

I vaguely remember seeing it and assuming it was an alpha-channel kludge for people too dim to use png

[10:06:08]

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[10:14:05]

juski:

tcpsyn: try renaming trans-background.png to trans-playbackground.png

[10:15:02]

tcpsyn:

whoah wait

[10:15:04]

tcpsyn:

I was afk

[10:15:21]

tcpsyn:

alright. ui.xml

[10:15:37]

tcpsyn:

I'm using GL

[10:15:38]

juski:

tcpsyn: that done, edit ui.xml and change line 1617 to say playbackground.png from background.png

[10:16:00]

juski:

not trans-playbackground.png mind – just playbackground.png

[10:16:21]

juski:

funny thing is it won't complain about not being able to find playbackground.png!

[10:17:02]

juski:

it'll just go straight for trans-playbackground.png

[10:17:06]

juski:

fscking annoying

[10:17:29]

tcpsyn:

ok. tha's done.

[10:17:42]

juski:

tcpsyn: if that still doesn't help, try changing to qt painter & see if you see what's in Image8.png then

[10:17:59]

juski:

I'll nail it at some point today whatever happens

[10:18:11]

tcpsyn:

That made a difference.

[10:18:14]

tcpsyn:

But it didn't make it right

[10:18:30]

tcpsyn:

it made a big difference actually

[10:18:40]

juski:

how's it look now?

[10:19:16]

tcpsyn:

exactly like the main screens

[10:19:23]

juski:

huh?

[10:19:38]

tcpsyn:

its the exact same background as the top level menu

[10:19:49]

juski:

ok then try switching to the qt painter for a bit

[10:19:56]

juski:

see if it ends up looking right

[10:19:59]

juski:

I have another idea

[10:20:33]

tcpsyn:

painter didn't make a difference

[10:21:02]

juski:

ok then

[10:21:03]

tcpsyn:

lemme get you a screenshot

[10:21:16]

juski:

did you restart mythfrontend after changing painter type?

[10:21:21]

tcpsyn:

yea

[10:21:24]

juski:

ok

[10:21:29]

juski:

right – don't alter ui.xml

[10:21:36]

tcpsyn:

I already did

[10:21:38]

tcpsyn:

heh

[10:21:46]

juski:

no I mean don't change it anymore

[10:21:49]

tcpsyn:

ok

[10:22:03]

juski:

rename trans-playbackground.png to playbackground.png

[10:22:19]

juski:

then copy or symlink playbackground.png to trans-playbackground.png

[10:22:27]

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[10:22:31]

juski:

that *should* fix it proper

[10:22:41]

juski:

if not, clear your themecache & try again

[10:22:51]

juski:

and then if not, I'm sorry!

[10:22:53]

Dagmar:

Umm... isn't the PNG already transparent?

[10:23:11]

tcpsyn:

mv: cannot stat `trans-playbackground.png': No such file or directory

[10:23:28]

juski:

you missed something then

[10:23:42]

juski:

is it still called trans-background.png ?

[10:24:12]

juski:

tcpsyn: are you using svn?

[10:24:22]

tcpsyn:

I'm using the tar from your website

[10:24:28]

juski:

tcpsyn: are you using svn?

[10:24:31]

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[10:24:32]

juski:

svn mythtv ?!

[10:24:37]

tcpsyn:

no

[10:24:41]

juski:

ok

[10:24:58]

juski:

so you've got afile in ProjectGrayhem called trans-background yeah?

[10:25:00]

tcpsyn:

I'm using the stable gentoo ebuild

[10:25:06]

tcpsyn:

yeah.

[10:25:09]

juski:

right

[10:25:16]

tcpsyn:

trans-background.png

[10:25:26]

juski:

rename that to the thing you changed ui.xml to reflect – i.e. playbackground.png

[10:25:46]

juski:

then cp or ln playbackground.png to trans-playbackground.png

[10:26:31]

tcpsyn:

same thing. It's the main menu background.

[10:26:55]

juski:

clear the themecache again

[10:27:11]

juski:

it can't POSSIBLY be loading the wrong image

[10:27:15]

juski:

not now

[10:27:17]

juski:

no chance

[10:28:10]

juski:

look at the playbackground file in GIMP or whatever – it should look like the Image8.png shot's background

[10:28:15]

tcpsyn:

it is :)

[10:28:17]

tcpsyn:

same thing

[10:29:05]

juski:

and line 1617 in ui.xml – the one in ProjectGrayhem.. it says ?

[10:29:16]

tcpsyn:

playbackground.png is correct

[10:29:26]

juski:

did you save the file?

[10:29:42]

tcpsyn:

<filename>playbackground.png</filename>

[10:29:52]

tcpsyn:

anywhere else it might be caching?

[10:29:54]

juski:

sorry I just can't grasp how that background is _still_ wrong

[10:30:01]

gbee:

juski: where is the menu text stuff defined? Can't find it

[10:30:11]

juski:

just the themecache dir, tcpsyn

[10:30:23]

juski:

gbee: theme.xml AFAIK

[10:30:36]

tcpsyn:

I removed that dir and restarted myth.. but still get the wrong bg

[10:30:38]

tcpsyn:

hrm.

[10:30:42]

tcpsyn:

maybe it's perms

[10:31:12]

juski:

tcpsyn: but then you'd get errors from mythfrontend saying it can't access the file – which'd have given you clues ;)

[10:31:24]

tcpsyn:

boggling.

[10:32:41]

tcpsyn:

even in the themecache dir the playbackground.png file is correct.

[10:33:21]

juski:

gbee: will you do me a favour please & try the new ProjectGrayhem? grab the tar from my site please

[10:33:29]

gbee:

juski: sure, no

[10:33:36]

gbee:

s/no/np/

[10:33:42]

hads:

heh

[10:33:43]

tcpsyn:

ah.

[10:33:44]

tcpsyn:

wait

[10:33:51]

tcpsyn:

but trans-playbackground.png isn't

[10:33:53]

juski:

see if the watch recordings screen looks like juski.co.uk/new/Image8.png please

[10:34:29]

juski:

tcpsyn: just cp playbackground.png to trans-playbackground.png

[10:34:51]

juski:

in the actual theme dir, not the themecache

[10:35:25]

juski:

I could kill whoever did all this trans- load of bollocks!

[10:35:30]

juski:

I really could

[10:35:56]

juski:

there's no point using jpegs for theme images anyway since they all get uncompressed into 32-bit bitmaps

[10:36:22]

gbee:

heh, old preview screenshot

[10:36:31]

juski:

gbee: well spotted!

[10:36:39]

tcpsyn:

juski, same deal bro

[10:36:50]

tcpsyn:

it's gotta be a different line in ui.xml

[10:37:05]

juski:

tcpsyn: search for 'playback' from the top of the file

[10:37:13]

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[10:37:13]

juski:

then it's the first .png

[10:37:42]

juski:

line 1617 here

[10:38:08]

gbee:

juski: looks identical to your screenshot

[10:38:14]

juski:

gbee: thanks!

[10:38:19]

juski:

I thought I was going mad

[10:38:22]

gbee:

'cept wider

[10:38:27]

juski:

dunno wth you're doing tcpsyn

[10:38:39]

tcpsyn:

yeah, that's right.

[10:38:46]

tcpsyn:

same line, first png after playback

[10:38:51]

tcpsyn:

playbackground.png

[10:39:06]

juski:

I'll verify it by renaming my theme dir & I'll untar the tarball I download fresh

[10:39:25]

juski:

gbee: wider?

[10:39:28]

** gbee takes a tour of the new PG **

[10:39:47]

gbee:

juski: widescreen monitor

[10:39:53]

juski:

phew!

[10:40:03]

gbee:

;)

[10:41:07]

gbee:

tcpsyn: you haven't got two copies of the theme installed in different places somehow? i.e. ~/.mythtv/themes and /usr/local/share/mythtv/themes ?

[10:41:59]

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[10:42:22]

tcpsyn:

nope.

[10:42:29]

GreyFoxx:

wow XBMC took like 10 minutes to compile in a vm heh

[10:42:43]

tcpsyn:

and one of the changes we made earlier in /usr/local/share/mythtv/themes significantly affected things.

[10:42:51]

tcpsyn:

hrm.

[10:42:56]

tcpsyn:

I do have one weird thing though.

[10:43:06]

juski:

tcpsyn: rm -rf /usr/local/share/mythtv/themes/ProjectGrayhem & untar the tarball fresh

[10:43:22]

juski:

then wipe the themecache dir out again

[10:43:35]

juski:

just to be _absolutely_ sure

[10:43:51]

tcpsyn:

same tarball?

[10:44:04]

juski:

when did you download it btw?

[10:44:09]

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[10:44:12]

juski:

download it again to be 100% sure

[10:44:13]

tcpsyn:

this morning.

[10:44:28]

tcpsyn:

I was using the old project grayhem

[10:44:31]

juski:

heh should be ok then

[10:44:36]

tcpsyn:

and this morning I downloaded the new one

[10:44:44]

juski:

maybe I should be recommending people wipe the old dir out first

[10:45:24]

juski:

see there's always the possibility I miss committing a file to my subversion server & exporting the project misses that

[10:45:40]

juski:

I can't be bothered to check every time

[10:46:05]

juski:

maybe from now on I'll just copy the whole dir to a new dir & tar that up minus the .svn dirs

[10:46:14]

juski:

just to remove the ambiguity

[10:47:18]

tcpsyn:

no man. It came out exactly the same as when we started.

[10:47:20]

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[10:47:26]

tcpsyn:

the first screenshot I sent you

[10:49:14]

gbee:

from that screenshot it looks like it's not drawing the watch recordings page background over the top of the base background

[10:49:32]

tcpsyn:

it's a completely different background

[10:49:38]

tcpsyn:

well.

[10:49:55]

juski:

it's using the main menu background instead of trans-background.png

[10:49:56]

tcpsyn:

it's the main menu background but covered in black in some spots.

[10:50:10]

tcpsyn:

and if we change that in ui.xml, it fixes the black spots

[10:50:22]

tcpsyn:

but still the wrong background

[10:50:22]

tcpsyn:

heh

[10:52:16]

juski:

I've reverted mine back – still ok

[10:52:55]

tcpsyn:

could it be because I am not using svn myth?

[10:53:13]

juski:

nope

[10:53:18]

gbee:

you've checked that it's loading trans-background.png ok? i.e. that it's not choking on that one for any reason?

[10:53:19]

juski:

I'm using -fixes here

[10:54:06]

juski:

I tried it on my dustbin too – the dev machine

[10:55:49]

tcpsyn:

gbee, we physically replaced trans-background.png with the correct image

[10:56:59]

juski:

right I renamed ProjectGrayhem dir to something else, downloaded the tarball & untarred it

[10:57:24]

juski:

and the watch recordings dir is as it is in Image8.png

[10:57:26]

tcpsyn:

The main background is what I'm getting for everything

[10:57:40]

juski:

tcpsyn: just in watch recordings or every screen?

[10:57:42]

tcpsyn:

system status..

[10:57:46]

tcpsyn:

every screen.

[10:58:04]

tcpsyn:

that was just the most noticable

[10:58:09]

tcpsyn:

everything else looks like it belongs

[10:58:20]

tcpsyn:

er. not so much the news feeds

[10:58:26]

juski:

that sounds pissed

[10:58:37]

tcpsyn:

the program guide is different

[10:58:41]

tcpsyn:

that looks correct.

[10:58:51]

tcpsyn:

and the program finder

[10:59:02]

tcpsyn:

searches.

[10:59:25]

tcpsyn:

Upcoming Recordings is correct

[10:59:37]

tcpsyn:

Set prioritys is correct

[10:59:49]

tcpsyn:

previously recorded is right

[10:59:57]

tcpsyn:

delete recordings is borked

[11:00:09]

tcpsyn:

watch videos is borked

[11:00:36]

tcpsyn:

Listen to music is the main screen.. Not sure if thats intended, but it looks cool.

[11:00:51]

tcpsyn:

news and system status are borked

[11:01:22]

tcpsyn:

Video Manager borked

[11:01:59]

tcpsyn:

hrm. I think that's about it

[11:02:10]

juski:

well – nobody can say I haven't bent over backwards to help :)

[11:02:21]

hads:

I can :)

[11:02:30]

hads:

I'd be lying, but I could :)

[11:02:34]

tcpsyn:

Oh man, I don't care. It all looks cool to me. I was just trying to help you fix it.

[11:02:47]

tcpsyn:

heh.

[11:02:50]

juski:

and I care, I do, but I'm stumped!

[11:02:55]

tcpsyn:

aye.

[11:03:14]

juski:

I hope I didn't break my svn server by renaming that dir though

[11:03:18]

tcpsyn:

wonder what happens with the wide one

[11:04:20]

juski:

Performance issues, or why MythTV hates Oprah.. lol

[11:05:18]

juski:

just MythTV? I don't think so ;)

[11:05:53]

juski:

we should have a plugin called mythtaste just for laughs

[11:06:02]

tcpsyn:

now the wide theme has the right background

[11:06:18]

juski:

certain myth users would be able to access it & secretly prevent recordings

[11:07:15]

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[11:07:16]

tcpsyn:

the wide one has the right images, but the spacing is off. probably because I don't have a wide screen. The recording list starts up in the gray header area

[11:07:38]

juski:

I'm not going to take something like that seriously tbh

[11:07:57]

juski:

running a wide theme on a 4:3 res. your milage could vary lots :)

[11:09:34]

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[11:11:27]

tcpsyn:

do you have a neon that's not wide?

[11:11:44]

tcpsyn:

hah

[11:11:45]

tcpsyn:

nm

[11:11:47]

tcpsyn:

I just read it

[11:11:52]

tcpsyn:

don't yell at me

[11:12:10]

juski:

heheh

[11:12:19]

juski:

can you spell never? ;)

[11:12:28]

tcpsyn:

lets see how it renders

[11:12:55]

juski:

if you pardon me for saying, I think I do enough theming related work :)

[11:13:42]

tcpsyn:

got anything better?

[11:13:55]

Dagmar:

o.O

[11:14:53]

tcpsyn:

er, sorry, read that wrong.

[11:14:54]

juski:

if I'd not just been handed a very generous gratuity for my theme work, I think I'd be throwing one of my customary strops right in your face

[11:15:40]

Dibblah:

How's the laptop fund?

[11:15:41]

tcpsyn:

eh, it's all good. I appreciate what you do and that you're here.

[11:15:53]

tcpsyn:

I just get excited when I find a bug.

[11:16:18]

juski:

got anything better?

[11:16:27]

juski:

so what was that about then?

[11:16:55]

juski:

oyay! oyay! http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/05/31/dr_who_axe_plan/

[11:17:27]

Dibblah:

Yay?

[11:17:28]

tcpsyn:

I thought you said that's enough theming related work, like you wanted to go back to talking about the weather.

[11:17:51]

juski:

ah

[11:17:54]

Dibblah:

It's scary to say that's one of the better things on TV at the moment :(

[11:17:54]

tcpsyn:

and neon renders perfectly in 4:3 here btw.

[11:17:59]

juski:

Dibblah: indeed yay

[11:18:26]

juski:

tcpsyn: all I was saying (YMMV) is that 16:9 themes aren't designed for 4:3 res. so don't come crying to me ;)

[11:18:51]

tcpsyn:

neon is slick too.

[11:19:04]

juski:

that's the general idea

[11:19:11]

tcpsyn:

they're both better than bluetoob, and bluetoob is badass.

[11:19:19]

Dagmar:

juski: You know The Register runs news items that are completely bullshit from time to time don't you?

[11:20:58]

Dibblah:

And we all know how pro-who they are :)

[11:21:08]

Dagmar:

OMG BATBOY IS REAL?!?

[11:21:38]

juski:

Dagmar: RTD & his ghey storylines.. maybe I take it too seriously & fail to suspend my disbelief

[11:22:04]

Dibblah:

juski: Could be worse. You could be subjected to CSI.

[11:22:16]

juski:

I don't watch channel 5

[11:23:08]

tcpsyn:

it's funny that you can put parental control on the videos.

[11:23:13]

tcpsyn:

parents hiding their pr0n

[11:23:14]

Dagmar:

juski: You were much less jaded when Tom Baker was The Doctor, apparently.

[11:24:35]

juski:

Dagmar: he was the better doc IMHO

[11:24:47]

gardengnome:

vay

[11:24:58]

juski:

the FX & sets are miles better than they were in the past but the stories are poo

[11:25:03]

gardengnome:

ssh on my palm

[11:25:32]

gardengnome:

god this is tiny

[11:26:20]

Dagmar:

gardengnome: Using pssh? There's a font that's _even smaller than the default_

[11:26:35]

Dagmar:

Only useable if you have a T|X or Cleo or something with a high-res display

[11:26:39]

gardengnome:

yes. pssh

[11:28:01]

juski:

nice – a program name you already know how to pronounce :)

[11:28:06]

Dagmar:

I can almost get 80x60 out of it

[11:28:07]

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[11:28:11]

juski:

not like "Zorg!"

[11:28:20]

gardengnome:

i have a treo

[11:28:28]

Dagmar:

...which is pretty horrifying considering the screen is a whole two inches across

[11:28:59]

gardengnome:

(and i'm paying 19 cent for 10kb at the moment, which makes this rather expensive)

[11:29:02]

Dagmar:

I make the grafitti area go away and use "whole screen scribble" mode

[11:29:06]

Dagmar:

ouch

[11:29:36]

gardengnome:

i'm already using that small 4x6 font

[11:30:23]

gardengnome:

Dagmar: i dont use grafitti at all. the treo has a small keyboard

[11:33:32]

Dagmar:

I use graffiti because if I can use proper punctuation and spelling while doing *that*, then other people have no excuse.

[11:36:26]

gardengnome:

heh

[11:37:02]

gardengnome:

i wonder how you can use the ALT key. irssi is not much fun without it

[11:37:55]

Dagmar:

Use the on-screen keyboard it has

[11:38:02]

Dagmar:

..the app has it's own

[11:39:13]

frink_:

use

[11:39:17]

frink_:

/win n

[11:41:12]

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[11:41:52]

blackest:

hi anyone got a script to keep the backend up on ubuntu edgy?

[11:42:11]

chuk:

why does it go down?

[11:42:22]

gbee:

blackest: you've filed a bug report I hope?

[11:44:13]

blackest:

I don't know why to be honest or how to find out why

[11:44:38]

Dagmar:

You should proabbly start by installing Fisty

[11:45:24]

blackest:

well I did try on feisty problem is other software wouldnt run so i had to go back to edgy

[11:45:41]

Dagmar:

Looks like you have a hard decision to make then

[11:46:06]

directhex|work:

blackest, dvb-t?

[11:46:40]

blackest:

yes it is , when it is working it is fine

[11:48:04]

blackest:

how do i check the backend status other than having the frontend saying it cant connect ?

[11:48:22]

blackest:

i have ssh session open now to that box

[11:48:23]

directhex|work:

bad reception?

[11:48:35]

Dagmar:

ps -ef | grep mythbackend

[11:49:14]

blackest:

reception is ok john 7976 7957 0 12:48 pts/1 00:00:00 grep mythbackend

[11:49:42]

Dagmar:

Or, if you want to be all specific about it, `ps -C mythbackend`

[11:50:34]

blackest:

that returns PID TTY TIME CMD

[11:50:58]

blackest:

so that means it died ?

[11:51:13]

Dagmar:

Do you see it running in the list?

[11:51:33]

blackest:

thats the list so i guess its dead again

[11:53:44]

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[11:54:14]

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[11:57:03]

tcpsyn:

I want to transcode dvds on my frontend but mtd is complaining. Which mysql.txt am I supposed to edit to get mtd talking to my backend?

[11:57:46]

Dagmar:

There can be only one.

[11:57:48]

gbee:

blackest: if you want to know why it died, the first place to look would be the backend log (assuming you have got logging turned on)

[11:58:11]

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[11:58:12]

lisa_:

hi

[11:58:14]

directhex|work:

Dagmar, there can be one in ~/.mythtv and one in /etc/mythtv

[11:58:14]

** gbee lops off Dagmar's head **

[11:58:22]

lisa_:

i get a mistake wenn i start Watch TV like this "If you want to watch live TV, cancel one of the in-progress recordings from the delete menu

[11:59:06]

Dagmar:

directhex|work: No, that's the way you fuck it all up.

[11:59:17]

gbee:

lisa_: means that myth is already using all the tuners to record a scheduled recording

[11:59:23]

directhex|work:

Dagmar, well, sure. but there CAN be!

[11:59:36]

lisa_:

and what can i do do watch tv now?

[11:59:38]

blackest:

gbee where does it log too?

[11:59:45]

gbee:

lisa_: stop the recording

[11:59:58]

lisa_:

i donÂ´t have started andy recording this is a new system

[12:00:01]

gbee:

blackest: no idea, it varies depending on the distro/packager

[12:00:09]

Dagmar:

directhex|work: Okay then... There can be only seven.

[12:00:44]

directhex|work:

and a half!

[12:01:07]

lisa_:

gbee, what can i do?

[12:01:15]

blackest:

probably var/log/mythtv/ i will check once its rebooted

[12:01:23]

gbee:

lisa_: restart the backend (unless you've not configured any tuner cards?)

[12:01:39]

lisa_:

how can i configure my tuner card?

[12:02:22]

blackest:

have you got your tuner card working already lisa ?

[12:02:40]

lisa_:

no it doesent work now

[12:03:21]

blackest:

its digital card ?

[12:03:32]

gbee:

lisa_: mythtv-setup

[12:03:35]

lisa_:

no its a analog Win TV PVR 150

[12:04:16]

blackest:

have you tried using it with xawtv ?

[12:04:38]

lisa_:

no i tryed it only with mythtv

[12:04:51]

blackest:

or tvtime (point is to make sure its got a working driver)

[12:04:53]

lisa_:

the remote is working very well

[12:06:50]

lisa_:

ok thanks

[12:09:51]

blackest:

it's easiest to test the card first with a simple application like xawtv or tvtime before hitting mythtv setup

[12:14:15]

Dagmar:

Yepyep

[12:16:15]

Dagmar:

Well, except that I havne't ever used tvtime or xawtv with a PVr card

[12:16:37]

Dagmar:

I think the ivtv docs suggest using mplayer to test after setting the tuner with ivtv-tune.pl

[12:17:25]

Dagmar:

*all* the Hauppauge PVR-xx0 cards are hardware-accellerated mpeg encoder cards, meaning you get a quite reasonable mpeg stream out of /dev/video[0–9]*

[12:19:17]

blackest:

so essentially it works as a digital card then?

[12:20:37]

lisa_:

ok i test it now

[12:20:56]

Dagmar:

I guess you could say that.

[12:21:09]

Dagmar:

It's an analog tuner, but it doesn't operate like a framegrabber (thank god)

[12:21:48]

blackest:

ok lisa listen to dagmar he knows the card , i'm shutting up now

[12:23:35]

Dagmar:

Those framegrabbers work for recording due to equal parts raw speed and equal parts luck.

[12:23:59]

Dagmar:

Basically, the card turns each frame into a digital image, which it flat out copies into a region of memory shared with the video card

[12:33:59]

blackest:

hmm i think i've found the problem with my backend it seems to have lost the tuner :(

[12:34:09]

planktonboy:

hi all

[12:34:13]

janneg:

can mythmusic play audio cds?

[12:34:32]

gbee:

janneg: yes

[12:35:38]

gbee:

Press 3 to go to the playlist editor and you can add CD tracks to the playlist

[12:35:43]

planktonboy:

hi gbee

[12:35:47]

gbee:

hi

[12:36:25]

planktonboy:

that is on the router firewall

[12:39:22]

Dagmar:

wtf kind of tunnel are you using?

[12:39:35]

planktonboy:

ssh tunnel

[12:39:38]

gbee:

planktonboy: can be any port you want, but just make sure ssh is configured to use it

[12:39:41]

Dagmar:

Specifically

[12:40:02]

Dagmar:

You can't exactly say `ssh http://mythbox.foo`

[12:40:26]

gbee:

Dagmar: heh, suggest you read up on ssh tunnelling

[12:40:47]

planktonboy:

Dagmar http://mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/MythWeb_ssh_tunnel_howto

[12:40:47]

Dagmar:

I know it backwards and forwards is the problem

[12:40:58]

planktonboy:

that was what I was going to try

[12:41:20]

Dagmar:

The question itself is what's baffling me

[12:41:27]

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[12:41:27]

planktonboy:

a lot easier than setting up certificates it seems

[12:41:37]

Dagmar:

Oh definitely

[12:41:53]

planktonboy:

gbee, ok thanks

[12:41:54]

Dagmar:

If you can ssh *normally* to the remote machine, you're done.

[12:42:05]

planktonboy:

ok

[12:42:26]

planktonboy:

just wanted to try it from my mums this afternoon while |I was over there

[12:42:39]

Dagmar:

Everything gets tunneled through as if it were a "normal" ssh login session, which in a way, it is.

[12:42:42]

gbee:

Dagmar: I assumed from the question that he was looking to change the port used by ssh

[12:42:57]

planktonboy:

sure

[12:43:08]

planktonboy:

it works within my LAN

[12:43:19]

Dagmar:

It'll work anywhere you can ssh to normally.

[12:43:27]

planktonboy:

but that is a bit pointless here where is only me on it

[12:43:36]

planktonboy:

ok

[12:43:42]

gbee:

planktonboy: you don't *need* to change the port, but may people do to avoid the zombies beating at the door all the time

[12:43:48]

Dagmar:

It's like scp. It's just a wrapper that looks like something special

[12:43:55]

planktonboy:

so I just need to allow router firewall ssh access

[12:44:01]

planktonboy:

yeah

[12:44:01]

gbee:

planktonboy: yeah

[12:44:05]

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[12:44:09]

planktonboy:

gbee, yup understood :)

[12:44:46]

blackes1:

anyone know who should own dev/video0?

[12:45:01]

Dagmar:

What it amounts to is that instead of making a connection to the other end, spawning a shell, and attaching it to the tty you're typing on, it binds a port you specify on the local machine, and then opens a connection to the remote sshd and connects to the port on the remote machine from there, and anything that hits the port it bound locally gets relayed through the ssh tunnel and passed to the remote port

[12:45:02]

gbee:

everyone knows what port ssh listens on, so all the attack scripts target it – you can get some relief (although not extra security) by changing the port used

[12:45:09]

Dagmar:

I think that's about as simply as I can explain it

[12:45:31]

planktonboy:

LOL...you know what I mean :)

[12:45:35]

Dagmar:

gbee: Pfft. Better not to use retarded passwords and maybe just drop in some hosts_access action

[12:45:48]

Dagmar:

You know what works better for Jehova's Witnesses?

[12:45:51]

gbee:

blackes1: put it in the video group, but with root as the owner

[12:46:02]

Dagmar:

Coming to the door naked, covered in sweat, with an erection and a bottle of chocolate sauce.

[12:46:09]

planktonboy:

Dagmar, yup I will set up htaccess first

[12:46:24]

planktonboy:

Dagmar, LOL

[12:46:31]

planktonboy:

yes I guess that would work

[12:46:39]

Dagmar:

It *did* work.

[12:46:39]

blackes1:

thanks gbee

[12:46:49]

Dagmar:

They came to my door early Saturday morning just one too many times.

[12:46:50]

gbee:

Dagmar: I've used port knocking before now to hide my ssh port – just got tired of logs full of muppets trying dictionary attacks

[12:46:53]

planktonboy:

I prefer the butchers apron and a chopper drenched in blood

[12:47:05]

Dagmar:

blood for odin?

[12:47:09]

planktonboy:

or the other way round

[12:47:34]

Dagmar:

I know of a rennie who wound up doing that to them. I was told one of the JW's apparently wet themselves fleeing

[12:47:48]

gbee:

I also setup blocks on a bunch of Asian and South American IP blocks, of course it's also key only – no passwords allowed

[12:48:08]

planktonboy:

hahaha

[12:48:16]

Dagmar:

He was butchering venison, had just shorts and a leather apron on because it was hot. He came to the door and shouted "BLOOD FOR ODIN!" while waving a butchers cleaver around.

[12:48:47]

Dagmar:

gbee: I have a very simple solution acutally. Any host with more than one connection per 15 seconds gets denied.

[12:48:47]

planktonboy:

LOL

[12:48:58]

Dagmar:

It kills those brute force attacks dead.

[12:49:19]

Dagmar:

ANything stubborn enough to keep at it gets a mirror masquerading rule on the sixth attempt

[12:49:19]

planktonboy:

Dagmar, thats a good idea

[12:49:27]

planktonboy:

how did you set that up

[12:49:35]

planktonboy:

just a rule?

[12:49:43]

planktonboy:

will have to look into that

[12:49:44]

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[12:50:05]

planktonboy:

might have to set up a

[12:50:08]

Dagmar:

I had to fish it out of a Google cache when the DLG wiki went tits up on us

[12:50:08]

planktonboy:

thanks

[12:50:13]

planktonboy:

will check that out

[12:50:17]

Dagmar:

I did not *choose* the colorizing. ;)

[12:50:21]

adante:

howdy

[12:50:26]

janneg:

gbee:

[12:50:30]

janneg:

thanks

[12:50:44]

adante:

so i'm sure this has already been discussed but, what are the thoughts about the xbmc port?

[12:50:53]

Dagmar:

That it has nothing to do with us.

[12:51:07]

gbee:

janneg: np, take it you don't use mythmusic that often? :)

[12:51:22]

adante:

hm ok

[12:51:47]

gbee:

I'm also guessing this is a linuxtag visitor question?

[12:52:02]

adante:

i understand the projects are seperate, but you don't think there are some sort of implications, perhaps tenuous, between the two?

[12:52:34]

Dagmar:

Nope

[12:52:56]

gbee:

Dagmar: I like the colours, reminds me of "Refreshers"

[12:54:28]

Dagmar:

adante: For one, MythTV doesn't violate any licence agreements. Check the one that applies to the X-box.

[12:55:17]

Dagmar:

I try *not* to use it

[12:55:19]

gbee:

never tried it

[12:55:22]

planktonboy:

ah

[12:55:23]

Dagmar:

It's interface is asstastic.

[12:55:45]

planktonboy:

Dag, yeah not so great interface

[12:55:55]

adante:

Dagmar: right, i'm not familiar with licensing or whatever, all i know is that my experience with friends xbmc setups has been really pleasant

[12:56:16]

planktonboy:

but it comes in handy for the gf when she wants to watch some Thai channels over the net

[12:56:46]

adante:

anyway, just checking the backlog, it seems like there are others who think there are possible implications so i'll take it up this discussion with them

[12:57:46]

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[12:58:11]

planktonboy:

I think it might be a prob with the database structure. Have uninstalled it now though and will try to recompile it sometime again

[12:59:02]

gbee:

Dagmar: wrt your flashing orange/white stuff in the theme, do you know about <colourcycle start="#FFFFFF" end="#FF0000" steps="10">yes</colorcycle> ?

[12:59:17]

Dagmar:

Simpler: "Oh you lazy lazy woman! Why you want watch TV when my house need cleaning!"

[12:59:46]

planktonboy:

anyway, better go get ready to go out

[12:59:46]

Dagmar:

gbee: Nope, I haven't seen that before. I'm guessing that's SVN head stuff

[12:59:48]

planktonboy:

bbl

[13:00:18]

planktonboy:

Dagmar, gbee, thanks for the help :)

[13:00:28]

gbee:

Dagmar: afaik it was added with mythui so should be in -fixes

[13:00:29]

planktonboy:

cya

[13:01:26]

Dagmar:

Hmmm...

[13:01:38]

gbee:

Dagmar: applies to textareas

[13:01:41]

Dagmar:

Odd that I missed it as I've been spelunking the source code to figure out what I can get away with

[13:01:46]

Dagmar:

Ahh...

[13:01:58]

Dagmar:

That would be why I dind't bother remembering it then since it's not a textarea I want blinkin

[13:03:56]

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[13:04:02]

gbee:

right, just thought it might be useful for something

[13:04:27]

Dagmar:

I'll remmeber it for when it comes time to make a theme to cause juski's head to explode

[13:06:06]

Dagmar:

Wow Atlanta hasn't seen this much smoke since Sherman came to town

[13:08:25]

tcpsyn:

juski, I don't know why.. but all of a sudden, it started displaying correctly.

[13:08:33]

gardengnome:

scorched earth++

[13:09:06]

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[13:10:18]

gbee:

Dagmar: make sure to use the drop shadows and alphapulse too then ;)

[13:12:11]

Dagmar:

It's gonna look like a cross between cuteoverload and a nine Inch Nails video

[13:12:59]

directhex|work:

juski'll love this. divx now has its own container format (dmf) to add to the party, and no players understand the container :)

[13:13:14]

gbee:

<outlinesize>10</outlinesize> << Don't know what that is supposed to be, but it's not pretty :)

[13:13:41]

Dagmar:

It makes an outline around the text. It's in G.A.N.T. I think

[13:14:55]

gbee:

hmm, doesn't look so bad set to a lower value, like 5 but still looks a little odd

[13:15:53]

gbee:

got my time pulsing between white and orange, with a drop shadow, bold 26pt font

[13:18:06]

Dagmar:

Now if we could just fontsizepulse

[13:18:10]

Dagmar:

Juski would *love* that

[13:19:21]

directhex|work:

gbee, now, make the code time-sensitive so it can pulse once per second :D

[13:20:01]

Dagmar:

[13:20:17]

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[13:23:39]

Dagmar:

In case no one got that, it was a inflamed, pulsing colon joke

[13:23:39]

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[13:29:43]

gbee:

color pulsing uses a bit more cpu than it really should

[13:29:46]

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[13:30:51]

Dagmar:

It's because it's not dealing with palette-based video

[13:31:23]

directhex|work:

gbee, how much cpu is that?

[13:33:00]

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[13:33:59]

juski:

gbee: that's a great deterrent!

[13:34:28]

juski:

colour pulsing.. jesus h feck!

[13:34:31]

gbee:

17% on a Turion MT-30

[13:34:40]

juski:

see how tasteless you can possibly make a theme!

[13:34:54]

Dagmar:

One composed entirely of scrotums

[13:35:01]

gbee:

juski: good news is that the drop shadows use none :D

[13:35:13]

juski:

drop shadows I like

[13:35:51]

TSCHAKWerk:

techno-bouncing pulsing menu items I like

[13:35:54]

** TSCHAKWerk runs!!! **

[13:35:56]

directhex|work:

pulsing scrotums with drop shadows?

[13:36:09]

TSCHAKWerk:

*boom-tschh-boom-tschh*

[13:37:19]

juski:

anyway, tcpsyn is well & truly off my xmas card list now

[13:37:37]

juski:

all that bollocking about, & nothing was actually wrong! pfft

[13:38:31]

juski:

you know the whole thing I feel about colour pulsing? it's 2007 ;)

[13:38:40]

** directhex|work throws SUSE in a barrel of bleach **

[13:38:57]

juski:

directhex|work: you'll only make it more repugnant

[13:39:37]

directhex|work:

juski, their update licensing thing is broken beyond comprehension

[13:41:02]

TSCHAKWerk:

well, i've read the published agreement, and it seems to support novell's position....

[13:41:14]

gbee:

hmm, textarea justification seems broken?

[13:41:27]

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[13:42:49]

Dagmar:

I didn't do it

[13:42:58]

juski:

gbee: blame dagmar, or congratulate him.. or badger somebody to commit his patch

[13:44:20]

gbee:

I could just be being stupid – it's been known to happen

[13:44:40]

Dagmar:

My patch couldn't break it. It doesn't actually touch the pre-existing mechanism

[13:46:05]

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[13:46:40]

juski:

I hope my brain melting patch gets committed – the one I did last night :)

[13:46:49]

gbee:

it's not even the same area of code and his patch was applied a month ago

[13:46:50]

juski:

my 25 lines or whatever

[13:47:52]

blackes1:

here's a question for you how do see if mercurial includes support for a particular card

[13:48:07]

directhex|work:

ask #linuxtv

[13:48:15]

blackes1:

ok

[13:49:09]

** TSCHAKWerk listens to Stockhausen — Kontakte **

[13:49:15]

gbee:

not broken, I just can't add up so I was positioning the textarea wrong

[13:49:54]

juski:

heh

[13:50:06]

gbee:

juski: one problem with right aligning the clock, it moves as the time changes

[13:50:16]

gbee:

unless you use a fixed width font I suppose

[13:50:16]

juski:

I imagine it would

[13:50:28]

juski:

unless you're using arabic or something :)

[13:51:06]

blackes1:

make it hex ;)

[13:51:34]

juski:

make it binary!

[13:51:36]

juski:

:-|

[13:52:04]

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[13:52:34]

blackes1:

hex would stay a fixed width

[13:53:13]

blackes1:

dunno if i could figure out the minutes thou:)

[13:53:58]

gbee:

right, well I think my only remaining question is whether we should be getting the date/time format from the theme, or from the users date format preferences

[13:54:11]

Dagmar:

I have an idea.

[13:54:15]

juski:

the latter IMHO

[13:54:23]

Dagmar:

Use format string tokens, just like some of the other stuff does

[13:54:46]

Dagmar:

If nothing has been specified for <format></format> then pull from the system's default

[13:55:17]

Dagmar:

That'll let people specify on a per-theme basis to their twisted little hearts' content, or allow the system to deal with it

[13:55:25]

Dagmar:

%%TOKEN%% stuff

[13:56:24]

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[13:57:28]

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[13:59:03]

Dagmar:

Some folks might find zero-padded 24h clocks to be appropriate

[13:59:20]

Dagmar:

Some might want AM/PM right there and so on

[14:01:56]

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[14:12:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

a5benwillis: Ping

[14:24:48]

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[14:38:31]

juski:

yeah a5benwillis – send me yer address & I can fwd you a case badge

[14:38:50]

juski:

I need spokespeople :P

[14:39:23]

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[14:40:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

a5benwillis: I received my new tuner card yesterday. I haven't done much with it yet. Also picked up a Plextor ConvertX PX-M402U ...

[14:50:49]

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[15:25:57]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

Anyone else here using a Plextor ConvertX?

[15:32:18]

juski:

doesn't sound like you're using it yet J-e-f-f-A|work ;)

[15:33:53]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: I've got it installed, and the firmware downloads, but it doesn't show up as a device in /dev/video_ ... ;-)

[15:34:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: I'm close... ;-)

[15:35:12]

juski:

maybe just needs a udev rule, or alias or summink

[15:35:54]

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[15:40:15]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Yeah... I'm a complete N00B again... There's a udev rule that downloads the firmware, but I don't see a /dev/video device — probably needs some tweaking or entries in the modprobe.conf... So far the only 'howtos' are for Ubuntu, and I'm running FC6. I haven't worked it out yet...

[15:42:21]

juski:

not on mr wilson's mythology pages?

[15:42:31]

juski:

the convertx is a bit older than ubunut

[15:43:20]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Ya know, I haven't checked... ;-) I found a message in the archives from "Nathan" – I wonder if he frequents the irc channel... (and what his nic is...)

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J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Nope, Jarod doesn't have anything on his page for the PX-M402U (Yet)

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J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: When I get mine working in FC6 I'll be sure to make a wiki page for it... ;-)

[15:49:28]

jams:

pretty sure htat thing works with mythdora

[15:49:57]

jams:

J-e-f-f-A|work- that was for you

[15:50:13]

juski:

anyway.. time to vamoos

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[16:22:14]

RyeBrye:

Anyone install FC7 yet? I'm wondering if there are any issues with FC7 and the SVN trunk of MythTV

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[16:28:05]

xris:

RyeBrye: there's no such thing as fc7

[16:28:21]

xris:

but I'll probably be installing F7 tonight

[16:30:10]

vandebo_:

I can't get mythdvd to rip dvd's. When I hit 0 to start the processing (either on perfect, or other quality setting), the 0 button flashes, but nothing else happens. Viewing DVDs works fine, mtd is running and even with -v all, there's nothing interesting in the log

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[16:32:32]

Disconnect:

is there a simple way to tell mythtv not to record the same show on 2 tuners? its grabbing stuff OTA and from firewire, especially when there's no episode data. (and its usually hidef, so 2–5 gigs at a pop)

[16:32:51]

Disconnect:

I still want 'record from any time/channel' on, since it handles conflicts

[16:33:14]

xris:

Disconnect: you can "exclude generic" or other stuff like that.

[16:33:44]

Disconnect:

then it won't record any, there's hardly ever guide data for most of these (eg cops or 3/4 of whats on MPT)

[16:34:08]

Disconnect:

i just want to say "if 2 of them start on the same callsign at the same time, and end at the same time, and have the same title, its probably the same"..

[16:34:27]

Disconnect:

(same callsign is optional, i'll happily accept "record no more than 1 at a time")

[16:36:19]

Dagmar:

Assign it tuner affinity then

[16:36:26]

Disconnect:

then i lose conflict resolution

[16:37:04]

Disconnect:

unless i can say "record from firewire when possible, if not then try OTA"

[16:37:07]

Dagmar:

If it's _generic reruns_, 1) why would you care

[16:37:30]

Dagmar:

...and 2) if you have another tuner, it's going to be free and won't really matter

[16:37:58]

gbee:

I was under the impression that same callsign meant they we assumed the channel was the same – thus it would record from only one :/

[16:38:32]

Dagmar:

That's what I thought as well, that it considered them overlap

[16:39:02]

Disconnect:

hmm. i wonder if fios is offering up the same callsigns. (they're "the same" but maybe not identical, eg WETADT vs WETA-DT..) that'd be a kick in the face :)

[16:39:15]

Dagmar:

ouch yeah that would kinda suck

[16:41:19]

Disconnect:

if i rename them from mythweb, is that gonna screw anything up? (leaving the xmltvid and such all the same)

[16:41:35]

Dagmar:

Only one way to find out

[16:41:39]

Disconnect:

lol

[16:42:13]

gbee:

you might want to trigger a reschedule after doing it

[16:45:25]

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[16:46:57]

RyeBrye:

xris – when you install F7, are you going to do an upgrade or are you going to start from scratch?

[16:47:12]

xris:

I never upgrade fedora. it always breaks

[16:47:17]

xris:

and is about 4x slower than a clean install

[16:47:40]

RyeBrye:

Makes sense, I've never done an upgrade install before

[16:47:56]

RyeBrye:

I was just hoping that someone else had done one successfully so I would have the courage to try :)

[16:49:20]

xris:

RyeBrye: I've done upgrades before, but they usually take a couple of hours for anaconda to do its thing. it's faster for me to copy everything to /old and do a clean install, copying prefs/etc back over manually

[16:50:08]

opello:

kind of silly for it to be that much slower, isn't it?

[16:50:30]

xris:

opello: yup

[16:50:48]

Disconnect:

and yah, for the record (and the logs) it looks like I'm getting stuff like "WJLA HD"/"WJLA-HD" or "WETAHD"/"W26HD" .. still no solution (I suspect?) for "WJLA" ("analog"/firewire) vs "WJLA SD" (digital OTA) but at least getting these renamed will help with most of the dupes

[16:50:51]

xris:

lot of dependency calculation with unknown versions, etc... complicated by the fact that I have non-fedora packages installed (things like nvidia drivers)

[16:52:01]

xris:

man, this fedora download is going slow.

[16:52:14]

xris:

maybe I should find ftp instead of torrent

[16:52:38]

RyeBrye:

xris – you should get it from stanford

[16:52:41]

RyeBrye:

They aren't listed on the main page

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[16:52:59]

RyeBrye:

but I just downloaded from them at around 1100Kb/sec – (towards the end it tailed down to 600 KB/sec)

[16:53:40]

xris:

got a link?

[16:53:48]

RyeBrye:

http://mirror.stanford.edu/fedora/linux/releases/7/Fedora/

[16:54:21]

RyeBrye:

The speed I ended at was 615 Kb/sec according to opera's transfer window.

[16:55:16]

RyeBrye:

That's my favorite mirror. I was very happy to not see it listed on that page of F7 mirrors this morning, because I knew that would mean it would be much faster for me :)

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[16:55:30]

IronEag1e:

hi there. i've got a question about mythtv and upnp. do i have to configure upnp on the backend? my clients cant see the mythtv server via upnp, and there is no upnp port open on the backend server (system is gentoo with mythtv-0.20.1_p13344)

[16:59:37]

xris:

RyeBrye: thx, that's much better...

[16:59:49]

RyeBrye:

np :)

[17:00:04]

xris:

IronEag1e: you may have to enable a use flag or something...

[17:00:31]

xris:

I know that most of the good upnp stuff is only available in svn trunk, too. only rudimentary support went into .20

[17:01:15]

xris:

RyeBrye: kormoc has a nice mirror he uses for most downloads (local, he can pull 5Mbit from them over his FIOS), but he's apparently still asleep (and no idea if they'd have the isos)

[17:01:18]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: You'll only be able to access your recordings btw... The music support is not working properly atm.

[17:02:41]

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[17:03:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: So your network video player will work (no commercial skipping, etc), but not a music player, or the music player options on a network video player.

[17:06:35]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/UPnP

[17:09:16]

RyeBrye:

I'm thinking of working on adding FM radio support to MythTV – but I don't know how much interest other people would have in that feature

[17:09:24]

RyeBrye:

FM radio from my PVR 500 at leats

[17:10:17]

Dagmar:

I'd be interested, but here's the problem

[17:10:27]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: Just remember that using the FM tuner on the PVR-500 is effectively using that video device...

[17:10:31]

Dagmar:

The thing can't currently tell if the FM tuner is in use

[17:10:37]

RyeBrye:

Oh, really?

[17:10:42]

Dagmar:

...and having the FM tuner going _blocks_ TV tuning

[17:10:52]

RyeBrye:

Yeah, I know it uses the TV tuner

[17:10:53]

Dagmar:

People have actually looked at this before

[17:10:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

So you can't record a video on /dev/video0 if you're using that tuner for FM.

[17:11:11]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

Exacly... (Dagmar)

[17:11:13]

RyeBrye:

Does it return an error when you try, or does it just hang?

[17:11:24]

Dagmar:

It gets an error from the v4l layer

[17:11:52]

RyeBrye:

Would that error be enough to test if it was in use or is it too generic?

[17:12:05]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: If you want to persue it., I'd go down the road of a dedicated FM tuner (either PCI or USB)...

[17:12:11]

Dagmar:

Just causing the error would be a bad idea

[17:12:15]

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[17:12:34]

Dagmar:

...because for the error to _occur_ the backend has to have already made the decision to try to record

[17:12:35]

RyeBrye:

So it's not something that can be handled gracefully like an exception or something

[17:12:43]

RyeBrye:

gotcha

[17:13:03]

Dagmar:

Exactly

[17:13:05]

RyeBrye:

So work on the IVTV side would have to be done to get it to have some kind of status for FM being active?

[17:13:29]

Dagmar:

Something _deep_ in the code has to be forked in order for Myth to be aware that one of the tuners and the FM radio function are mutually exclusive as well as independent data sources

[17:13:33]

** xris wonders if he should use LAMP in a job description.... **

[17:13:48]

Dagmar:

RyeBrye: Nope. Just in the backend

[17:13:53]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Looking?

[17:14:06]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: hiring

[17:14:25]

xris:

given how many listings on craigslist use it, I'd say that I should

[17:16:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

Dagmar: That change would be nice for tuners with two inputs to Myth too... IE: If you had a cablebox with firewire, and 1/2 the channels are in-the-clear on firewire, but 1/2 are not... You could setup two 'tuners', and if either one was in use, they both would be considered busy... firewire stuff would record on that, and 'sd' stuff would record on the SD tuner card...

[17:16:45]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: kewl. I got an offer for a position in Seattle recently... Since I'm in Boston and not able to move atm, I turned it down...

[17:17:06]

RyeBrye:

Yeah, it would be a major PITA to get it to work, but I'm pretty motivated to do it... We'll see how much time I get to look into it

[17:17:20]

RyeBrye:

My local college football team has a crappy TV commentator but great FM commentators

[17:17:31]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: seattle's a nice place.

[17:17:50]

Dagmar:

Dude if you could make it go that would be pretty damn awesome

[17:17:54]

RyeBrye:

so my endgame is to get the thing setup where I can set up a feature to have it use both tuners – one capture FM to an mp3 and one capture the video, and then let me adjust the timeshift between the broadcasts

[17:17:56]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: So I hear... ;-)

[17:18:19]

Dagmar:

I don't think you'd need to timeshift that much actually

[17:18:23]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: And the climate is probably virtually the same as New England...

[17:19:02]

RyeBrye:

Probably not muhc – but maybe a few seconds either direction. People have tried to listen to the FM along with the live broadcast, but there are usually delays. I think the FM usually leads the broadcast

[17:19:29]

RyeBrye:

if the FM lagged it, it would be easy enough to just get the FM up on a little radio, mute the TV, and delay the MythTV playback manually (kind of ghetto, but it would work)

[17:19:36]

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[17:20:14]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: it's 10 AM and 64 degrees at the moment. been sunny and 80s all week.

[17:20:20]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Is that position available for tellecomutters? ;-)

[17:20:22]

xris:

global warming is both good and bad up here.

[17:20:23]

xris:

sorry.

[17:20:27]

xris:

local only.

[17:20:31]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

:-(

[17:20:36]

xris:

but why can't you move?

[17:20:56]

Dagmar:

RyeBrye: If you wanted to get creative you could just increase the bucket size on one or the other to get it lagged

[17:21:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Well, my son is a Sophmore (soon to be Junior) in an awesome Tech school out here... Plus lots of family and personal ties here... I'd at least like to stay within 500 miles or so...

[17:23:12]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: yeah i've read that i can watch only the recordings via upnp. but since xbmcmyth doesnt work at all its better than nothing

[17:23:15]

xris:

ahh

[17:23:20]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: And I doubt I'm qualified for your open postion anyways... I've got about this much | | Linux experience, and this much | | Tandem(HP NonStop) experience... ;-) (Plus pc's and stuff...)

[17:23:28]

RyeBrye:

xris, what kind of hiring are you doing?

[17:23:47]

RyeBrye:

I'm not looking at the moment, but just curious

[17:23:55]

xris:

RyeBrye: http://www.siliconmechanics.com/i3290/careers/php-developer.php

[17:24:10]

xris:

well, that's what *I* am hiring for. we're actually hiring in pretty much all departments

[17:24:13]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: Is that a 'regular' Xbox (non-360)? If so, why not just install Linux and get a fully-functional (although non-hd) frontend...

[17:24:25]

RyeBrye:

it would probably be a lot more interesting if you added an "e" in your name... ;)

[17:24:31]

RyeBrye:

(after the "n")

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[17:25:13]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: yeah, a old xbox. i've not yet looked into installing a full linux distro – most likly candidate would be gentooX, but i cant find any documentation about which mythtv version is included there

[17:25:41]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: and for the hdtv in the living room i've built a real HTPC, the xbox is for the small tv in the bedroom

[17:25:54]

RyeBrye:

I'm more java + postgres :( Oh well...

[17:25:55]

RyeBrye:

:)

[17:26:05]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: I setup mine with Xebian about 1–1/2 years ago... There's a howto on the web that made it pretty easy. (Even when I didn't know linux that well...)

[17:26:14]

xris:

RyeBrye: believe me, we get plenty of misspellings.

[17:26:27]

xris:

most people just call us SiMech (which we may move to officially someday)

[17:26:40]

RyeBrye:

Ah, makes sense

[17:26:45]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: the performance is ok? 64 megs of ram sounds like bad performance

[17:27:44]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: Its a little slow booting (about 2 minutes), and the menus are a little sluggish, but it plays SD video perfectly, and skips commercials with minimal lag.. (approx 1 sec)...

[17:28:04]

Dagmar:

So, it runs about as crappily as an xbox

[17:29:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Well, I'm about 1/2 qualified for your open position... I've been working with SQL for about 5 years now, but only MySQL since Myth... I've got the HTML, and have some CSS under my belt... Just getting much more active in Javascript, PHP and Ajax... ;-)

[17:29:31]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: hm... too bad that xbmcmyth doesnt work at all, would be the perfect way for the xbox to become a frontend

[17:29:51]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: You probably couldn't match my salary here though... (I've been here 16 years if that's a hint...)

[17:30:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: If it does UPnP, then it should work, at least for videos.

[17:31:04]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: yeah, I have little doubt about that. (we generally pay less than average, although I'm hoping that trend will change as we grow)

[17:31:28]

xris:

I was employee #5. we were 30-something people in january, and will probably hit 100 in the next month and a half

[17:31:52]

vandebo_:

Arg! My problem was that I didn't have mythvideo installed. Silly ubunutu doesn't have a dependancy from mythdvd to mythvideo

[17:32:06]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: xbmcmyth is somewhat of a real frontend, but it fails to connect to the mysql database of the backend. funny though, i dont even see a single packet with tcpdump on the backend

[17:32:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Yeah, I'm one of only 3 or 4 left that have been here more than about 12 years...

[17:32:22]

IronEag1e:

J-e-f-f-A|work: other clients like my htpc work just fine

[17:33:01]

Disconnect:

J-e-f-f-A|work: fyi people in/near DC are always hiring stuff like that

[17:33:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IronEag1e: Ah – xbmc*myth* — I missed the 'myth' part of it before — wasn't aware of that!!!

[17:34:04]

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[17:34:12]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

Disconnect: Yeah, I just updated my R* on Monster, and I've got 20 consulting job calls in the last 10 days or so... My title here is "Technical Consultant", even though I'm a permanent full-time employee...

[17:35:22]

xris:

Disconnect: well, *if* he works in that boston office, I think he'd be in that 12+ year crowd.

[17:35:31]

Disconnect:

cool

[17:35:40]

xris:

similar industry, kid about the same age (a little older).

[17:35:49]

xris:

lucky guy is moving to AU to live with his gf, though

[17:36:14]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Well, we're 250+ people now... when I started in 1990, it was about 70... I've been in MIS for 90% of that time...

[17:36:48]

xris:

lame. my fedora download got slow...

[17:37:47]

RyeBrye:

xris – what did it slow down to?

[17:38:12]

xris:

RyeBrye: 70ish

[17:38:22]

xris:

or going between 70 and 100

[17:38:27]

xris:

down from 500+

[17:38:42]

gardengnome:

500+ is slow

[17:38:43]

gardengnome:

;)

[17:38:55]

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[17:39:11]

RyeBrye:

Ouch

[17:39:18]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: I just read more of your description — "Our softball team is really bad. If you can play, that would be great" — that's great — a sense of humor!!! ;-)

[17:40:49]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: unfortunately it'll probably get taken out

[17:41:14]

xris:

need to remove the Rockstar comment, too, since they don't buy that anymore (got too expensive at about $1.50 each).

[17:41:21]

xris:

espresso tastes better, anyway

[17:41:28]

juski:

arghhH!

[17:41:43]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Have you tried the chocolate-covered expresso beans? Yippee!!!

[17:41:52]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: I *do* live in seattle... :)

[17:42:08]

** J-e-f-f-A|work takes a step back in case juski blows... ;-) **

[17:42:14]

juski:

anybody ever had a pc that wouldn't boot – it prints the CPUID onscreen in POST, then just sits there.. no beeps, nothing else

[17:42:34]

juski:

had all the cards out, reseated the RAM, tried a different PSU, reset CMOS..

[17:42:39]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: You don't have any usb keys or disks plugged in, do you ?

[17:42:52]

juski:

it did a memtest once,....

[17:43:06]

juski:

er...

[17:43:22]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Can you get into the bios?

[17:43:23]

juski:

lemme try withough

[17:43:30]

juski:

no

[17:43:34]

juski:

wait!

[17:43:36]

juski:

wtf?!

[17:43:44]

juski:

it's trying to boot now

[17:44:26]

juski:

since when would it try to boot a usb disk when I'

[17:44:36]

juski:

ve never set it to do that?

[17:44:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Some MB's are screwy like that....

[17:44:49]

gardengnome:

cheap BIOS *shrug*

[17:44:59]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: I've experience the same flustration... That's why I remember so well....

[17:45:17]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: I have owned this board for donkey's years, keep usb stuff plugged in all the time

[17:45:24]

juski:

never seen it – not once

[17:45:34]

gardengnome:

my laptop won't boot if my USB hub is plugged in. <3

[17:45:45]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Maybe it's the first time you had that specific key or whatever in during a cold-boot?

[17:45:55]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: nope

[17:45:59]

juski:

it's my CF reader

[17:46:11]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Strange... *shrugs* ...

[17:46:17]

juski:

verily!

[17:46:42]

juski:

it was weird though.. USB device hanging the bios before even a RAM TEST..

[17:47:41]

gpd:

where should I look for the meaning of L, P, R etc. in the recording status? I know 1 and C(conflict), R (repeat)...

[17:47:59]

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[17:48:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Only in my case, I was working on my XP box, shut it down, turned it on the next day to have it boot up to the dreaded "FILE IS MISSING OR CORRUPT – SYSTEM HALTED" screen... And after cursing and re-booting 10 times, I realized i had a friend's XP disk in an uSB enclosure, and it was trying to boot off of that...

[17:49:22]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: I also have an LCD panel that the PC won't even POST if it's plugged in via DVI... But if I un-plug the DVI cable for 1 second, it will boot right up... Strange...

[17:49:57]

RyeBrye:

is there a page that lists of what people are working on for the Summer of code?

[17:50:30]

gardengnome:

RyeBrye: there's no SoC for mythtv this year.

[17:50:32]

juski:

RyeBrye: ROFLMAO

[17:50:59]

juski:

gpd: press F1 or 1

[17:51:32]

RyeBrye:

ah, gotcha

[17:51:42]

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[17:51:43]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gpd: Or pull up mythweb, and it's shown clearly on there... ;-)

[17:51:47]

RyeBrye:

I thought I saw something on the dev mailing list about some feature being worked on by SOC people

[17:51:58]

RyeBrye:

must have been old stuff

[17:52:14]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: I would think so...

[17:52:30]

gbee:

gpd: P – Previously Record, L – Recording Later Showing

[17:52:39]

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[17:52:49]

gbee:

Previously Recorded ...

[17:53:03]

juski:

bit of a poor show, lasy year's SoC effort

[17:54:07]

juski:

phew. nice to get back on a decent keyboard :)

[17:54:35]

RyeBrye:

MythTV is becoming my main production DVR now, as I just moved this past weekend.

[17:54:40]

Disconnect (Disconnect!n=dis@c-68-48-132-97.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has left #mythtv-users ("Bailed")

[17:54:41]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: What were you using, one of those 'natural' keyboards? (Yuck!)

[17:54:41]

gpd:

Ok – P and L now make sense thanks gbee

[17:54:55]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: no, cheap one at an unnatural angle

[17:55:04]

RyeBrye:

Now I've got to build my Mac OS X frontend from svn to use one of my old laptops as a frontend in another room

[17:55:27]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: It's been my DVR for 2+ years now... I still have a DishPlayer, but only as a tuner for myth now! ;-)

[17:55:51]

juski:

been my only video recorder for more than 2 years. nothing even comes close

[17:56:00]

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[17:56:24]

juski:

I don't think I'd go to shows to rave about some freeview PVR in a box I got from Argos ;)

[17:56:37]

gpd:

does anyone watch Andromeda? I just say it for the first time...

[17:56:41]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: BTW: What do you use to produce your videos? I even transcoded the myth demo to my IPod... (Hope that was ok! ;-) )

[17:56:57]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: Sony Vegas – when it's not crashing

[17:57:32]

kslater:

one feature I'm appreciating more is the ability to extend a show that you've scheduled to record before it finishes recording

[17:57:37]

juski:

I need more than the 1GB ram I have I think though.. rendering very big mpegs always gives me trouble

[17:57:42]

kslater:

like if a sports event is running late

[17:57:57]

gardengnome:

juski: RAM is Ã¼bercheap atm

[17:58:00]

juski:

kslater: or a show after a sporting event is running late

[17:58:08]

juski:

gardengnome: yeah but not whatever ram this box takes

[17:58:10]

kslater:

exactly

[17:58:25]

kslater:

dunno if that's on other pvr's but that ability kills

[17:58:35]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

kslater: Yeah, that's a great feature. It didn't work on-the-fly in .19 ... I'm glad they fixed that! (Even though I don't watch much sports...)

[17:58:48]

juski:

I thought for one horrible moment I was going to have to recycle this box & put a new board, CPU & RAM inside :)

[17:59:26]

kslater:

or like the other night i was watching a recording and remembered that I forgot to schedule something. No worry I can do from within the playback. Too cool.

[17:59:49]

juski:

need a sub Â£200 way to blow the current Athlon XP 2800 1GB RAM machine to smithereens

[17:59:57]

RyeBrye:

Kslater – there is a plugin that will automatically extend sports events for you

[18:00:02]

juski:

something with AGP or onboard graphics

[18:00:02]

RyeBrye:

Myth Recording Extender Ithink

[18:00:15]

juski:

RyeBrye: no such thing

[18:00:34]

RyeBrye:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Myth_recording_extender& nbsp;?

[18:00:36]

kslater:

sorta automatically

[18:00:40]

juski:

there's hype on the dev mailing list about a 'myth sports API' but at the moment it's BS

[18:00:45]

RyeBrye:

Oh, yeah

[18:00:48]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

kslater: Another great feature of .20 was the ability to start recording a program from 'live tv', and have it go back to the start of the program (or at leas when you changed the channel) instead of when you hit the record button. (But who watches "Live TV" anymore... ;-) )

[18:00:49]

kslater:

monitors a website

[18:00:53]

RyeBrye:

yeah, true

[18:01:25]

juski:

I wouldn't call that a plugin

[18:01:31]

kslater:

J-e-f-f-Alwork – my kids do

[18:01:43]

juski:

kslater: get em reprogrammed :)

[18:01:50]

RyeBrye:

I would think making kids watch only recorded and comflagged stuff would be wise :)

[18:02:01]

juski:

if anybody is going to start wising up against the schedulers soon it should be kids first

[18:02:07]

RyeBrye:

Those kids commercials are insane

[18:02:13]

kslater:

we have 1 sat feed and they use it from the basement tv + mythbox to be able to watch tv down there

[18:02:28]

juski:

RyeBrye: in a "BUY ME NOW BUY ME NOW BUY ME NOW!!!" kinda way yeah they are ;)

[18:02:41]

kslater:

oh well, you're totally on target there

[18:02:49]

RyeBrye:

Yeah – or in a "TELL YOUR PARENTS TO BUY ME NOW OR THEY DON"T LOVE YOU" way :)

[18:02:59]

kslater:

I could plot the lenght of the Christmas lists to the amount of commflagged shows watched

[18:03:09]

juski:

pff

[18:03:10]

RyeBrye:

:)

[18:03:11]

kslater:

and I'm not kidding

[18:03:17]

RyeBrye:

That's funny

[18:03:37]

kslater:

most of the stuff we watch is commercial free. They didn't know what they needed last Christmas

[18:03:40]

gardengnome:

i get sick from watching commercials these days. or livetv in general. *shiver+

[18:03:50]

RyeBrye:

Yeah, live TV sucks

[18:03:54]

juski:

we get commercials at the cinema now

[18:04:01]

kslater:

true that

[18:04:14]

RyeBrye:

A dish network guy came to my door to try to get me to sign up with Dish Network yesterday – he was using the free "2-room DVR" as a selling point

[18:04:20]

RyeBrye:

My wife told me after the fact I was rude to him

[18:04:22]

kslater:

live tv to me means the show started at least 15 minutes ago.

[18:04:25]

juski:

though occasionally the ads are better than the films

[18:04:32]

RyeBrye:

I told him flat out that I've used one of those, and considered it to be absolute trash

[18:04:34]

juski:

Spiderman..

[18:05:02]

kslater:

my whole family has the concept of "time in the bank" in their vocabulary

[18:05:06]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

I like it when somebody asks me "Have you seen that commercial where..." I just say "What are commercials?" and SMILE! ;-)

[18:05:24]

juski:

my wife is forever saying how the girls at work are jealous of her these days

[18:05:47]

kslater:

watching hour shows in 42 minutes is good too

[18:06:06]

juski:

they all feel they 'have' to watch soaps, just for something to yak about methinks.. anyway.. my wife watches em at 1.5x, skipping the ads. saves hours a week

[18:06:21]

juski:

hours which are spent.. erm.. doing more erm.. other .. erm.. things :D

[18:06:25]

RyeBrye:

For superbowl, I might set it up to record and then reverse the first comflag point so it only has commercials

[18:06:31]

RyeBrye:

other than that, I wont really watch commercials

[18:07:16]

kslater:

RyeBrye – I had a chance to catch a few aussie beer commercials. US beer commercials are like US beer to those.

[18:07:59]

kslater:

which is to say, swill for the most part

[18:08:05]

juski:

Bud!

[18:08:07]

juski:

lol

[18:08:12]

kslater:

not beer

[18:08:18]

juski:

you say swill I say Bud

[18:08:19]

kslater:

corn byproduct

[18:08:38]

juski:

or Coors.. or er.. yeah..

[18:08:54]

kslater:

Coors is a carbonated water byproduct

[18:09:00]

juski:

or is Coors Canadian?

[18:09:06]

juski:

anyhow

[18:09:08]

kslater:

Miller is a preservative byproduct

[18:09:14]

juski:

Michelob?

[18:09:39]

kslater:

it's A-B so it's probably mostly corn syrup

[18:09:50]

juski:

I'm one of these uncultured bastards who drink only to get drunk

[18:09:53]

kslater:

with some hops passed over the tank

[18:10:01]

juski:

if it tastes OK that's a good side effect

[18:11:04]

gbee:

heretic!

[18:11:41]

juski:

maybe that'll change now my tastebuds are online – I might actually be able to spot the subtleties of various ales

[18:11:48]

** kslater back to slogging some code **

[18:12:04]

kslater:

juski did you start smoking or stop?

[18:12:23]

juski:

I just remember being given a pint of guiness & having to wretch every sip down

[18:12:32]

juski:

kslater: been quit for a month today :)

[18:12:38]

kslater:

well done

[18:12:53]

xris:

juski: I don't see the attraction of guiness when there are so many better stouts out there.

[18:12:57]

juski:

kslater: even more so because I didn't kill anybody, or myself in the process

[18:13:01]

kslater:

seems lots and lots of chefs smoke and I don't get that, but some say it enhances flavor

[18:13:13]

juski:

kslater: believe me it really doesn't

[18:13:27]

juski:

remember the 1st time you tasted a really tender juicy steak?

[18:13:37]

kslater:

I'll take your word for it. Never saw the thinking in inhaling smoke from burning crushed leaves

[18:13:38]

xris:

nope. :)

[18:13:41]

juski:

that's a steak after you've given up smoking

[18:13:55]

Tanthrix:

xris: This is weird...So that recording from last night: According to Myth it's 1:42 long, but when I open it in say, winamp (using ffmpeg) it reports as almost exactly 2 hours long.

[18:13:59]

juski:

it's like you can taste stuff all of a sudden

[18:15:00]

Tanthrix:

xris: But it appears to all be there. If I skip to 101 minutes via winamp, it shows me what's wat 85 minutes on myth.

[18:15:17]

juski:

kslater: that's not saying anything about the physical advantages to being a non smoker either

[18:15:55]

juski:

I might have to sample a pint of O.P again soon. I used to like that like there was no tomorrow

[18:16:27]

juski:

gotta be better than the taste of burnt wood

[18:16:32]

juski:

(Guiness)

[18:16:45]

Tanthrix:

xris: And 1:42 lines up perfectly with 1:59 – maybe the recordings are fine and this is just something weird with myth calculating the length, maybe by using 24fps when infact it switches to 30fps or something?

[18:16:57]

xris:

Tanthrix: I think I've seen that before.. timecodes get messed up or something.. like if the first few frames captured are at a different res/bitrate/framerate, myth assumes the whole recording is at that pace.

[18:17:00]

gbee:

juski: never much liked Guiness either – but I do appreciate a good traditional ale

[18:17:32]

gbee:

as for something like John Smiths – tastes like dish water

[18:17:49]

xris:

I get the opposite of that with recordings on the travel channel. They always seem "longer" than they should be as far as commflag goes .. (it finds the correct number of commercials, but they're all squeezed toward the start of the recording... with 80% of actual being 100% of the commercials

[18:17:50]

juski:

god yeah

[18:17:53]

xris:

or so

[18:17:59]

Tanthrix:

xris: Now the question is, does myth ever not allow you to access the end of a file because of that? (I stupidly deleted Jaws so I cannot be sure about it) Or does it just make the numbers wrong, but proportionally it's all alright

[18:18:02]

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[18:18:05]

juski:

Caffreys == chemicals

[18:18:12]

xris:

Tanthrix: not seeing the end is an issue.

[18:18:23]

xris:

I've sent recordings to Isaac to look at, but he hasn't been doing any dev work lately.

[18:18:30]

xris:

anyway, I need to head to work. Will be back online later.

[18:18:36]

Tanthrix:

Righto, thanks.

[18:18:40]

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[18:19:08]

juski:

marvellous. crashy firefox

[18:19:31]

gardengnome:

yay

[18:19:33]

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[18:19:40]

gardengnome:

used to have that every day

[18:19:54]

juski:

I can move it around but it's leaving trailhttp://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Myt . . . ing_extender

[18:19:55]

gardengnome:

i love how stable "linux" is sometimes.

[18:20:06]

juski:

ddfsafjkdsfhdjksa

[18:20:08]

juski:

arghh!

[18:20:08]

RyeBrye:

The mac OS x packager perl script thing rocks -

[18:20:31]

RyeBrye:

It downloads and builds QT 3.3.6 for me – which is nice since I was trying to do it myself and it wasn't quite working

[18:20:50]

RyeBrye:

I just wish it would use ccache on the os x packager

[18:21:03]

RyeBrye:

since I will probably have to rebuild my os x frontend a lot as I upgrade by backend a lot

[18:21:12]

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[18:26:09]

NewCastleScott:

Hello all,I have ran a debugger with my myth setup and it seems there is seg faults from "/usr/lib/libmysqlclient.so.15" (I know its not directly related to myth)does anyone know how I can resolve this?Im on gentoo

[18:27:14]

TSCHAKWerk:

NewCastleScott: compile everything with -O2

[18:27:18]

gardengnome:

you remove your -Omgoptimizations from your CFLAGS and rebuild?

[18:27:26]

TSCHAKWerk:

NewCastleScott: get rid of -funroll-loops etc

[18:27:27]

NewCastleScott:

it is

[18:27:35]

NewCastleScott:

whare is that?

[18:27:43]

TSCHAKWerk:

CFLAGS in make.conf

[18:27:47]

gardengnome:

um

[18:27:56]

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[18:27:56]

TSCHAKWerk:

and if you didn't know that to begin with...um....

[18:27:57]

NewCastleScott:

do you want to see my make.conf?

[18:28:02]

TSCHAKWerk:

you shouldn't be running gentoo.

[18:28:05]

NewCastleScott:

lol

[18:28:05]

gardengnome:

TSCHAKWerk: no, it's ok. relax.

[18:28:19]

TSCHAKWerk:

hummm

[18:28:25]

TSCHAKWerk:

maybe it's a gentoo-related patch

[18:28:25]

NewCastleScott:

no doubt Im a 4 month linux user...I know gentoo is trickey but its the best

[18:28:32]

TSCHAKWerk:

i do agree

[18:28:35]

TSCHAKWerk:

it offers lots of control

[18:28:49]

TSCHAKWerk:

but people tend to become ricers before learning what can break.

[18:29:04]

TSCHAKWerk:

gentoo is also notorious for overpatching things sometimes..

[18:29:23]

NewCastleScott:

I just added -ggdb I think it is to cflags it is somthing like march athalon -O2 -pipe -ggdb

[18:29:48]

NewCastleScott:

I havent ran -e system or world sence change is it needed to get full effect?

[18:30:24]

NewCastleScott:

I foolishly neaver used local use flags so Im trying to sort that out as well...

[18:30:27]

TSCHAKWerk:

hmmm maybe the debugging flags are causing weird things.

[18:30:39]

NewCastleScott:

I just added it

[18:30:44]

TSCHAKWerk:

hmmmm

[18:30:50]

NewCastleScott:

I have debug global use

[18:31:33]

** juski buries the newly killed double-glazing salesman in the garden **

[18:31:57]

TSCHAKWerk:

juski: eh, everybody knows that's what pig farms are for :-P

[18:32:04]

TSCHAKWerk:

:-)

[18:32:12]

juski:

dunno where my nearest one is

[18:32:16]

TSCHAKWerk:

just be sure to pick out the teeth first.

[18:32:17]

TSCHAKWerk:

hehehe

[18:32:22]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

TSCHAKWerk: yeah, Salesmen and Lawyers... ;-)

[18:32:23]

juski:

I hate cold callers

[18:32:34]

juski:

if I want something I go looking

[18:32:50]

TSCHAKWerk:

J-e-f-f-A|work: lawyers get special treatment... a piranha tank. :-D

[18:32:55]

juski:

or I at least shop around.. the buggers

[18:32:58]

nospam312:

hello

[18:33:01]

juski:

TSCHAKWerk: too quick

[18:33:19]

TSCHAKWerk:

it's either that, or death by Fran Drescher

[18:33:39]

juski:

plastic bag, cable tie..

[18:33:42]

nospam312:

does anyone have time to help with a quick ticket query (technical)?

[18:33:47]

juski:

nospam312: just ask

[18:33:54]

TSCHAKWerk:

juski: :-)

[18:33:57]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

nospam312: olleh

[18:34:43]

juski:

nobody had time to answer questions about whether anybody has time for stuff around here ;)

[18:34:52]

nospam312:

It is about http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/2664. Been discussing it on the mailing list but I think there is still a problem but do not wish to reopen ticket if I should create a new one – what should I do?

[18:35:01]

TSCHAKWerk:

if we had time, would we be here?!

[18:35:02]

TSCHAKWerk:

oh wait

[18:35:03]

TSCHAKWerk:

:-P

[18:35:47]

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[18:35:59]

TSCHAKWerk:

J-e-f-f-A|work: just think, a favoured method of dispatch in roman times would involve throwing the lawyer into a bag with a snake, a dog, and a monkey, and throwing it all underwater :-P

[18:36:24]

juski:

nospam312: if you sincerely think it should be reopened & you have evidence, reopen it

[18:36:36]

juski:

key point there being _evidence)

[18:37:02]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

... or just avoid recording on multiplex "A"... ;-)

[18:37:32]

nospam312:

I have backend log files showing the problem and it seems to be reproducible – on my setup anyway :)

[18:37:51]

nospam312:

last post here – http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/270831

[18:38:10]

juski:

nospam312: it's your word against theirs, so find more people with the problem

[18:38:16]

juski:

me – I don't record from C5

[18:38:38]

NewCastleScott:

have you debugged Im getting segfaults from mysql myself Im dealing with now...

[18:38:51]

NewCastleScott:

or is this not rel;ated...

[18:38:56]

juski:

not related

[18:39:00]

juski:

even slightly

[18:39:07]

NewCastleScott:

ahhh

[18:39:17]

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[18:39:20]

nospam312:

Unfortunately I record from C5 and abc1 quite a bit and would probably record from Five US if I had a multiple tuner PVR.

[18:39:48]

nospam312:

Everything else seems to be working it is just Mux A causing the problems.

[18:41:34]

gbee:

record enough from C5, never had a problem on any card (Nova-T, Nova-T 500, LR6550)

[18:41:59]

nospam312:

gbee – I am beginning to think it is transmitter related – which transmitter are you using?

[18:42:09]

gbee:

Nottingham

[18:42:28]

gbee:

Which is a repeater iirc for Sutton Coldfield

[18:42:55]

Riblet is now known as Ribs

[18:44:24]

nospam312:

I have tried using the aerial into my settop box and it is fine so aerial is unlikely. So it is either the cards are not liked anymore or specific to transmitter.

[18:45:06]

nospam312:

I would like to provide a segfault report. Does anyone know if there are instructions for this somewhere?

[18:45:18]

gardengnome:

nospam312: yes, they are in the official docs

[18:45:45]

juski:

nospam312: "I have tried using the aerial into my settop box and it is fine so aerial is unlikely. So it is either the cards are not liked anymore or specific to transmitter.

[18:45:49]

juski:

"

[18:46:11]

juski:

nospam312: I think that statement is slightly flawed. proving it works on a STB is not proof the signal is fine

[18:46:29]

nospam312:

okay thanks – I think I used them to compile the latest trunk version so I will check them out.

[18:46:48]

juski:

you could try using tzap to zap a channel on mux A, watch it in mplayer or whatever & keep an eye on the stats

[18:47:06]

juski:

be on the look out for UNC greater than 0, high BER etc

[18:47:43]

NewCastleScott:

what does the lcd build switch add?

[18:47:54]

juski:

NewCastleScott: support for lcdproc

[18:47:56]

gbee:

I doubt you are seeing the same issue as was fixed in trunk, which is why running with normal logging levels does not help – but you should only even run with normal levels to start with

[18:48:20]

** gbee wonders why so many people are seemingly running with silly logging levels **

[18:48:24]

juski:

emmerdull failed to record last night :)

[18:48:28]

NewCastleScott:

nice thanks

[18:48:39]

gbee:

juski: oh dear, you must be heartbroken!

[18:48:51]

juski:

gbee: :)

[18:49:17]

nospam312:

yes I agree probably doesn't prove signal is fine but suggests Mythtv could be a bit more forgiving if the signal is at fault. I will try to work out tzap. My main problem is not being a linux expert :)

[18:49:19]

juski:

1st recording with B file size in a long long long long time

[18:49:39]

juski:

nospam312: you should already be familiar with tzap to some extent

[18:49:57]

juski:

by rights – it's part of testing your hardware works before stepping out with mythtv

[18:50:20]

juski:

but then – so few howtos tell anybody to do stop properly these days it's no big surprise :)

[18:51:25]

juski:

OMG! " David Hyde Pierce reveals he is gay" !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[18:51:43]

juski:

thanks for that 'news', digitalspy.

[18:52:36]

fysa:

thanks for helping me get through the day, juski.

[18:52:45]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: I never would have guessed! ;-)

[18:53:51]

gbee:

nospam312: your STB only has to deal with the idiosyncrasies of one broadcast network, myth has to deal with dozens of them in networks around the world – being forgiving on one means breaking another, so it's fairly difficult to balance

[18:55:30]

fysa:

don't forget the dozens of projects that myth itself relies on that aren't directly under our influence. ;)

[18:56:24]

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[18:58:33]

nospam312:

i will look at tzap to try to put together more evidence in the hopes someone knows if its fixable. i agree its a balancing act i just hope my problem is simple enough to fix without any knock on problems. i would feel better if all mux's has the problem but just one mux is annoying especially as I thought things were working i never thought of having to test all mux's/channels seperately for many minutes to ensure I've got a

[18:58:33]

nospam312:

reliable system :)

[18:59:28]

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[19:01:02]

fysa:

nospam312, tzap? you're trying to get OTA/QAM?

[19:01:33]

gbee:

nospam312: the problem you're having is interesting in so far as the fact that none of the UK users I know, nor any of the UK devs are experiencing it – the backtrace will help though

[19:02:01]

nospam312:

they are qam based I think. I have never used tzap so I will do a search and see if i get any of these unc / ber errors.

[19:02:24]

nospam312:

gbee – there have been recent posts on the mailing list from other people. 2 or 3 – its not just me. I can post the links if you like.

[19:04:30]

gbee:

nospam312: They are only relevant if they are users from the UK, seeing the crash with the same multiplex – if that's the case then you may be onto something

[19:06:08]

gbee:

whatever the route cause, the segfault needs to be fixed – but a fix for that may not mean handling the problems in the stream

[19:06:19]

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[19:06:42]

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[19:07:32]

gbee:

avoiding a segfault is usually pretty easy, but often it just means aborting what we are doing rather than implementing a way to handle the problem

[19:07:45]

nospam312:

...

[19:08:19]

gbee:

either way, backtrace first – then we'll know what we are dealing with

[19:09:19]

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[19:09:43]

nospam312:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/262898 (there are 10 messages gossamer is only showing some of them).

[19:09:58]

gbee:

and get the backtrace without normal verbosity settings, there is a known segfault issue with the pat to string code which isn't relevant so it will cloud the results

[19:10:34]

nospam312:

I know the ticket 2664 has fixed something as when using the 13500 revision is output crc errors in the log which previously would have caused it to crash. it is just the special of 0x0 / 0xffffff causes the crash now – on my setup anyway.

[19:10:40]

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[19:13:49]

nospam312:

thanks for help everyone.

[19:15:04]

juski:

could just be mythtaste in action, preventing recordings of CSI

[19:15:34]

Ribs:

haha

[19:17:03]

gbee:

gah, user in that thread who said they reverted to -fixes because of the bug, but who never thought to report it

[19:18:26]

gbee:

and no-one says they have tried the suggested fix of re-scanning their channels

[19:18:34]

juski:

even if there's a real bug I'd never have seen it anyway

[19:18:53]

gbee:

I would, but I haven't

[19:19:43]

** RyeBrye hates trying to get qt3.3.* to compile on his mac... **

[19:20:03]

Dagmar:

Someone REALLY needsto document scanning of channels in the wiki

[19:20:17]

gbee:

I'll accept that there is a bug (at least the segfault)- the rest we'll see after some proper debugging information is posted to trac

[19:20:37]

Dagmar:

RyeBrye: one word... fink

[19:21:06]

RyeBrye:

I know, but even after it's installed from fink, the osx-packager.pl downloads and recompiles it

[19:21:09]

juski:

Dagmar: it's pretty much a no-brainer

[19:21:29]

RyeBrye:

the standard setup scripts don't work because my ppc fails the endian test or something

[19:21:40]

gbee:

I'm puzzled why users latch onto an unrelated bug though and claim it must be the same as theirs even though they are told it's not

[19:21:59]

juski:

gbee: nobody knows why users are so much like users – they just are!

[19:23:49]

a5benwillis:

J-e-f-f-A: Pong

[19:26:16]

gbee:

shouldn't stereotype, we're users after all and yet we don't behave the same way

[19:26:20]

gbee:

... or do we?

[19:26:33]

juski:

gbee: there are users & there are users IMHO

[19:27:06]

juski:

there's "how do I get my patch to compile/work" and "how do I download a theme?"

[19:28:42]

Dagmar:

I tell 'em "You ask a grown-up for help."

[19:28:59]

gbee:

hmm, like editing themes – the instant results make a nice change from wasting time compiling

[19:29:27]

juski:

I always feel daft asking for help for schoolboy stuff like the ticket I did last night with Anduin's help

[19:29:56]

juski:

gbee: it wears you down after a bit. replacing naff graphics with new ones feels nice but tweaking sucks

[19:30:02]

gbee:

juski: yeah, the latter question I can accept – but not knowing something as basic as how to write a patch!

[19:30:03]

juski:

tweak, save, quit, reload

[19:30:39]

RyeBrye:

Yeah. I installed Mythtv on a friend's machine – and even compiled it from the firewire branch for him so he could get the latest firewire fixes (this was a couple months ago).

[19:31:03]

gbee:

better than tweak, save, compile ......... *compile error*, tweak, save, compile ......................................................................., load

[19:31:17]

RyeBrye:

He ultimately switched back to Windows Media Sh*tter edition because he didn't like how HD wouldn't playback on his MythTV when he used his Radeon card

[19:31:39]

RyeBrye:

Of course, Windows MCE is SD only on his setup, so he could have just only captured SD

[19:31:42]

RyeBrye:

but...

[19:31:46]

J-e-f-f-A:

a5benwillis: Hey man... ;-)

[19:31:51]

juski:

RyeBrye: nvidia 5200 is cheaper than XP MCE

[19:31:54]

RyeBrye:

Yeah, I know

[19:32:00]

RyeBrye:

He already had a license for MCE though

[19:32:05]

juski:

people are funny

[19:32:17]

RyeBrye:

I was kind of glad when he switched over

[19:32:32]

RyeBrye:

He thought I was some kind of god just by knowing how to do crap on the command line like "ifup eth0 or something"

[19:32:33]

juski:

I wanna go to PC world & say gimme a pc.. then ask how muchthey'll knock off if I say I don't want Windows on it

[19:32:35]

a5benwillis:

J-e-f-f-A: PM

[19:33:06]

J-e-f-f-A:

a5benwillis: Sure will – let me start a real irc client though... on min...

[19:33:31]

juski:

a5benwillis: while you're here.. can't send you spiffy case badge wihout yer address!

[19:33:58]

gbee:

RyeBrye: I don't recommend software to people generally unless they really seem to know what they are doing, otherwise I always end up being the one they call to fix things or to ask "How do I .... ?"

[19:34:26]

RyeBrye:

gbee – yeah, I realized that... I'm actually glad he switched back

[19:35:18]

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[19:35:44]

juski:

my dad is always asking me stuff about his conscooter. I'm damn glad he's not on linux

[19:36:24]

juski:

though half the time it's something to do with IE.. and I just yell "INSTALL FIREFOX NOW!!" at him – to no avail

[19:36:48]

RyeBrye:

IE sucks

[19:36:54]

Anduin:

IE is pretty

[19:38:07]

juski:

IE7 is nasty

[19:38:49]

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[19:39:44]

Dagmar:

IE kills puppies

[19:40:15]

Dagmar:

...and rapes nuns on alternating Tuesdays.

[19:41:17]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

IE7 sux!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[19:41:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

;-)

[19:41:31]

** gbee hasn't seen IE7 **

[19:41:42]

gbee:

well not up close and personal

[19:42:03]

gardengnome:

i once touched a vista box when i was in a computer shop. i felt dirty afterwards :(

[19:43:18]

juski:

I once touched a vista box at work! It was a hooky copy somebody'd brought in! I went MAD

[19:43:19]

Dagmar:

Get to a clinic and get tested.

[19:44:40]

juski:

woooo

[19:44:52]

juski:

looking at a sheet of case badges laid out on my desk :)

[19:44:56]

juski:

shiny things!

[19:45:10]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: blue? ;-) (Can you post a pic?)

[19:45:26]

juski:

www.juskic.co.uk has a pic

[19:45:35]

juski:

er $mynick.co.uk

[19:45:50]

juski:

all phingers & phumbs tonight

[19:46:42]

gbee:

"(note actual badge colour may differ from the above graphic due to the printing process). An actual photo of the badge is shown below:"

[19:46:50]

juski:

bum

[19:46:53]

juski:

I moved it

[19:46:56]

gbee:

'cept the photo is above and there is no graphic ;)

[19:47:56]

juski:

mmyers quite

[19:48:08]

juski:

the photo is pretty representative

[19:48:23]

juski:

as close as I can get with a coolpix 775 PoS

[19:48:57]

RyeBrye:

can the gcc on i386 cross compile to ppc? I wonder if I can run the osx-packager.pl on my x86 linux box...

[19:50:31]

gbee:

patched and compiled so many times that I'm no longer sure where I'm up to or what I was doing

[19:51:10]

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[19:51:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Looks pretty good... ;-)

[19:52:32]

juski:

the last uns went like hot cakes & being frank about it they sucked compared to these

[19:53:05]

juski:

it's fer a good cause – sending 3 guys to LRL to er.. Evangelise MythTV

[19:53:41]

juski:

well er.. keeping those 3 guys from going thirsty

[19:53:46]

gbee:

juski: at the time I thought they were excellant, but in comparison these look much better :) Probably look better still in person

[19:54:58]

juski:

first ones ever were better than the last lot. these ones are better than the first :) I think it makes all the difference meeting your printer dude in person

[19:55:13]

gbee:

after all that work on the clock stuff, I've now gone back over it and trimmed the code down to almost nothing

[19:56:03]

gbee:

doesn't seem worthwhile when you've spent a few hours working on something and the finished product is little over 100 lines

[19:58:05]

gbee:

"Sorry, your request has been denied due to abuse from your address (or because of a shared proxy which was abused, and I apologize for being wrong about that). Access will be permitted in 14 mins."

[19:58:09]

gbee:

BUGGER

[20:01:09]

gpd:

am I right in thinking that there is no file browser / text file display plugin for myth?

[20:01:18]

juski:

gbee: yup

[20:01:20]

gpd:

or should i look harder / write one?

[20:01:27]

juski:

gpd: yup

[20:01:28]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gbee: Sure it does... Just means the code is probably more efficent/ better coded. It's a testament of your skill.. ;-)

[20:02:04]

juski:

gpd: why do you need to view text files in myth ?

[20:02:24]

gpd:

i have lots of things in text files – and it would be nice to display them

[20:02:33]

gpd:

eg. recipes – the recipe plugin looks too fancy

[20:02:33]

juski:

gpd: what sort of things?

[20:02:33]

gbee:

J-e-f-f-A|work: heh, more like I don't really know what the hell I'm doing so it takes me that long to get it right ;)

[20:03:03]

juski:

gbee: you say you don't know what you're doing.. you think what I did last night was any more than cut & paste & tweak?

[20:03:12]

gbee:

right, well pastebin.ca is broken

[20:03:41]

juski:

gpd: myth has a kind of file browser, in mythvideo

[20:03:58]

juski:

'managed tree list' viewer.. kind of icky

[20:04:09]

gpd:

juski: so i could add .txt as a video type – and hack a display for it?

[20:04:24]

juski:

gpd: yeah you could have it do that

[20:04:29]

juski:

'play' a txt file

[20:04:36]

gpd:

hmm

[20:04:37]

juski:

but EEEEEEEEEEEEW!

[20:05:13]

juski:

might not be too hard to put up a Qtextbox or whatever

[20:05:26]

gpd:

i don't suppose you can code plugins in python

[20:05:31]

juski:

nope

[20:05:48]

juski:

mythtv has no python bindings, and I don't think I'm alone in hoping it never gets em

[20:06:03]

gpd:

too slow? or general hatred of python?

[20:06:14]

RyeBrye:

What bindings does it have? perl and what else?

[20:06:15]

juski:

I've seen freevo

[20:06:21]

juski:

perl and perl

[20:06:29]

juski:

oh and perl

[20:06:33]

gpd:

and perl is good?

[20:06:41]

** gpd scratches head **

[20:06:50]

** RyeBrye scratches his camel **

[20:07:01]

juski:

I can just see people writing messy plugins in python somehow

[20:07:14]

RyeBrye:

I'd like java bindings :) :) :)

[20:07:16]

gpd:

and *not* in PERL...

[20:07:38]

juski:

gpd: perl is too unweildy to use for writing a plugin :)

[20:07:49]

juski:

RyeBrye: NO. please god NO

[20:08:11]

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[20:08:12]

gpd:

how bad is freevo? I've never tried

[20:08:30]

juski:

freevo is a system of menus which calls a bunch of scripts

[20:08:45]

juski:

you could argue that mythtv is too, but it just doesn't seem as messy

[20:09:23]

juski:

what python might be really good for is little things

[20:09:31]

juski:

like making a youtube viewing thing

[20:09:32]

gardengnome:

like ubiquity?

[20:10:30]

RyeBrye:

Isn't someone working on a streaming flash video plugin?

[20:10:33]

RyeBrye:

for mythweb?

[20:10:38]

juski:

RyeBrye: already in svn

[20:11:07]

RyeBrye:

Oh, does that use flash? I've got the svn loaded but the video didn't play back for me

[20:11:14]

RyeBrye:

I saw the little play box

[20:11:27]

RyeBrye:

I didn't test it very thoroughly

[20:11:36]

RyeBrye:

just saw it and thought "cool" – clicked play, nothing happened, moved on

[20:11:55]

RyeBrye:

do you have to run a transcode job for that, or does it transcode on the fly?

[20:12:27]

gpd:

Is it an essential part of my myth pedigree to install freeview, hate it, then poke merciless fun at it?

[20:12:29]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: I believe it transcodes on the fly, like "MythStreamTV" did/does...

[20:13:24]

GreyFoxx:

RyeBrye: It currently requires ffmpeg to be installed on your box and available in aspecific location

[20:13:45]

RyeBrye:

ok, ok

[20:18:35]

juski:

RyeBrye: putting my dustbin online for ya to have a looksy

[20:19:16]

RyeBrye:

cool

[20:20:21]

juski:

RyeBrye: http://jusftp.no-ip.org:8080/

[20:20:41]

RyeBrye:

is the login the same one I use for your online banking

[20:20:45]

RyeBrye:

err... I mean what's the login ;)

[20:20:57]

juski:

RyeBrye: http://jusftp.no-ip.org:8080/mythweb/

[20:21:06]

RyeBrye:

oh, ok

[20:21:06]

RyeBrye:

:)

[20:24:09]

juski:

oh no! what's happened to 'what else is on at this time' ?

[20:26:23]

juski:

just thought I'd better change the main user password on that box since it's on the internet now

[20:26:53]

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[20:26:58]

RyeBrye:

The TeleTubbies and the other programming on that box seem like an interesting mix :)

[20:27:10]

RyeBrye:

I think the problem was this box I am on doesn't have flash 9 on it

[20:27:53]

juski:

RyeBrye: like I said it's my dustbin

[20:28:01]

RyeBrye:

:)

[20:28:11]

RyeBrye:

i'm not judging :)

[20:28:18]

juski:

I left it unprotected for days on end.. nobody deleted a recording or scheduled anything weird

[20:28:23]

juski:

or pwned it

[20:28:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: just 1 tuner, eh? ;-)

[20:28:37]

RyeBrye:

that's cool

[20:28:43]

juski:

ironic since I left it unprotected as an experiment

[20:28:49]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: just the one in this box

[20:28:51]

gardengnome:

http://jusftp.no-ip.org:8080/mythweb/remote/keys

[20:29:02]

gardengnome:

yay, i can control juski's mythfrontend

[20:29:11]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

haha!

[20:30:13]

RyeBrye:

esc esc esc esc esc esc up enter

[20:30:16]

RyeBrye:

;)

[20:30:52]

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[20:30:59]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Looks like mythfilldatabase hasn't run for a month... ;-)

[20:31:08]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: don't need it to :)

[20:31:24]

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[20:31:42]

gardengnome:

juski: it cleans your DB

[20:31:42]

juski:

we were having a laugh a while ago about stress testing mythtv

[20:31:55]

juski:

hitmeh!

[20:32:35]

RyeBrye:

stress tests are for things that cost money

[20:32:48]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: So did you disable the 'remote control'

[20:32:50]

juski:

oh and FYI the 10 min free view won't work with flash streaming for some reason

[20:32:53]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: nope

[20:32:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

... on your 'real' system yet?

[20:33:04]

juski:

real?

[20:33:27]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

Did you see RyeBrye's comment above... or was he just playing with ya?

[20:33:36]

RyeBrye:

I was just playing

[20:33:40]

RyeBrye:

about the esacpe thing

[20:33:48]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

RyeBrye: It was still funny! ;-)

[20:34:14]

RyeBrye:

I actually memorized the specific up / down controls to get to the theme menu to change a theme

[20:34:23]

RyeBrye:

'cause for some rason a lot of themes have absolutely no text on my machine

[20:34:30]

RyeBrye:

and I would keep switching to ones like that accidently

[20:35:34]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: So are you pulling your listings right off the sat tuner?

[20:35:42]

juski:

hahaha I know the girl doing the v/o on this xxx channel

[20:36:04]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: that'd be DVB-T, not Sat – and they call that EIT :)

[20:36:51]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Ah, this is all terrestrial? over-the-air?

[20:36:56]

juski:

yup

[20:37:06]

RyeBrye:

ota porn?

[20:37:09]

RyeBrye:

you in europe?

[20:37:11]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Damn you guys have it good... lots of channels...

[20:37:19]

juski:

it just happens to work in mythtv

[20:37:22]

juski:

no hacking

[20:38:04]

juski:

the silly feckers broadcast it unencrypted right – but obscure it with a MHEG interactive screen. disable MHEG interactive in mythfrontend and voila!

[20:38:14]

juski:

it's lame though

[20:38:15]

RyeBrye:

Ah

[20:38:23]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Wow... I've gotta pay $50/month to get 180 channels... I only get the major networks with an antenna... ABC/CBS/FOX etc...

[20:39:01]

juski:

J-e-f-f-A|work: we used to pay Â£25 a month ($50 ish) to get that many channels. bugger all worth watching

[20:39:11]

juski:

on cable

[20:39:23]

juski:

all you see on that web address is what we get FTA

[20:39:28]

** gbee listens to mp3s off juski's machine **

[20:39:35]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

juski: Yeah, I only watch like 10 maybe... Your FTA list is incredible...

[20:39:58]

gpd:

juski: is that virgin cable? or just freeview?

[20:40:12]

juski:

gpd: that mythbox is just freeview

[20:40:26]

juski:

do what you like – it's my dev/test box

[20:40:59]

juski:

it's not on a DMZ so I'm pretty safe

[20:41:09]

juski:

all you got is 8080

[20:42:38]

gbee:

cool, some Ash stuff I haven't heard

[20:43:38]

gpd:

damn we need tivo-style suggestions :(

[20:43:56]

juski:

gpd: you're the main man for that patch! we'll all thank you

[20:44:24]

juski:

actually it keeps getting dragged up every once in a while. nobody wants to lose their privacy

[20:44:29]

gpd:

juski: you said before there were patent issues

[20:44:36]

gpd:

and lack of servers

[20:44:38]

gbee:

Hanson?

[20:44:43]

gpd:

and lack of coders... i suppose

[20:44:46]

juski:

gbee: allsortsofshite

[20:44:54]

juski:

gpd: and people who like their privacy

[20:45:14]

gpd:

you mean not wanting to let ppl know they watch 10 min free shows ;)

[20:45:33]

gpd:

or worse: QVC!

[20:45:48]

juski:

gpd: I mean I heard the rumour it worked without a hack so I tried it for laughs

[20:46:23]

gpd:

is that hack you talk of just for channel 97?

[20:46:26]

gbee:

I don't want the world to know that I watch Ugly Betty

[20:46:55]

juski:

gpd: it's not a hack

[20:47:06]

juski:

you just disable the red button rubbish & it just works

[20:47:15]

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[20:47:33]

gpd:

ok – now i see why the mythweb was said to explain the P/E/R/C – but my theme just has letters

[20:47:47]

gpd:

juski: which channels? and where is the disable?

[20:48:02]

juski:

gbee: take it you've not found the Don Estelle or Vera Lynn !

[20:48:12]

gbee:

tv settings somewhere (enable interactive tv)

[20:48:14]

juski:

gpd: Television X & tv playback settings

[20:48:35]

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[20:48:48]

gbee:

juski: heh

[20:49:04]

scurb:

Anyone got a recommendation for the "best" tv-tuner card .. for use with analog tv-signals in Europe..

[20:49:06]

juski:

gbee: that's just a dump or link to my unfiltered mp3 collection

[20:49:13]

scurb:

is it the hauppauge mce500 with dual tuners?

[20:49:18]

juski:

scurb: pvr150 or pvr500 from hauppauge

[20:49:34]

scurb:

juski.. that's what I thought..

[20:49:49]

scurb:

is the remote control unit worth the extra money?

[20:50:06]

juski:

scurb: depends what you want

[20:50:14]

gbee:

juski: currently poking around for stuff I've not heard for a while or at all :) Kick me off when you want your bandwidth back

[20:50:23]

Como|Lappy:

i need to mount an ntfs drive as writable. I'm pretty sure this box has ntfs write support, how do i specify that i want to mount it R/W

[20:50:24]

juski:

gbee: you're fine for now

[20:50:37]

RyeBrye:

The dual tuners are worth the money

[20:50:40]

RyeBrye:

don't know about the rmote

[20:50:42]

scurb:

juski, .. yeah.. have some other remote control, connected by a usb-ir-receive.. guess that'll do it..

[20:50:43]

juski:

gbee: everything from my DJing days (CD wise) is there

[20:50:59]

juski:

well the stuff which had cddb info anyway

[20:51:03]

scurb:

another question than.. lcd-displays to connect to myth.. any recommendations ;)?

[20:51:25]

scurb:

RyeBrye, ok.. will go for a 500..

[20:52:11]

scurb:

using an older hauppauge card today (old bttv878-based).. quality sucks ;)

[20:52:29]

RyeBrye:

$130 USD is what I've seen the 500's going for

[20:52:38]

RyeBrye:

somewhere around $130usd at least

[20:52:44]

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[20:52:48]

juski:

weird

[20:52:49]

gbee:

at least I can now say I'm glad I didn't buy a couple of albums

[20:52:58]

juski:

where the hell is my music mounted?

[20:53:07]

RyeBrye:

will mythtv run against QT 4.0.1 or does it require 3.3?

[20:53:13]

juski:

QT3 !

[20:53:16]

juski:

or busted!

[20:53:34]

RyeBrye:

ok. The osx-packager.pl has some crap for QT4 in it,but it's commented out

[20:53:35]

juski:

normally I'd just use some mysql to find out where my music lives but this thing has a stupid password

[20:54:18]

RyeBrye:

I was wondering if I could get it to use that, since QT wont build for me

[20:54:26]

RyeBrye:

regardless of what version of gcc I use :(

[20:54:49]

juski:

only one thing for it.. mythfrontend here I go

[20:55:06]

juski:

duh

[20:55:10]

scurb:

anyone here using their xbmc as frontend with the perl-script?

[20:55:19]

juski:

scurb: I did. it sucked

[20:55:26]

juski:

the xbox is fugly & noisy

[20:55:35]

gbee:

QT4 is destined to have a slow takeup, they changed a little too much so converting over is a PITA

[20:55:54]

juski:

and the _python_ scripts for mythtv are only really good for playing recordings

[20:55:56]

scurb:

juski, .. hehe ok : ) I'm trying.. but wont get any video to be played.. all settings are corret, and database connects successful.. think my xmbc may be too old.. :/

[20:56:09]

scurb:

yeah.. python it is.. sorry ;)

[20:56:13]

juski:

scurb: you need to export your recordings dir over samba

[20:56:20]

scurb:

yes.. done that as well..

[20:56:58]

scurb:

frontend for recordings and live tv is working with other frontend-systems... so i blame mplayer for the lack of encoder for .nuv-files :)

[20:58:21]

gbee:

bah, this later Ash stuff is nowhere near their early work

[20:58:29]

juski:

gbee: true

[20:58:48]

scurb:

I'm thinking of putting together an IVR-script for the asterisk.. does anyone know if such a thing exists already? To be able to control and add recordi.

[20:58:55]

juski:

Sometimes was great, almost Girl From Mars quality, but that was as far as it went

[21:00:19]

juski:

so er.. anyway how comes mythmusic in mythweb uses .m3u yet er..

[21:00:20]

juski:

?

[21:01:53]

gpd:

juski: AutoCommercialFlag 1 – does that work in UK?

[21:02:07]

juski:

gpd: not really

[21:02:29]

juski:

works best on channels with logos that get removed for breaks

[21:02:44]

gpd:

not workt hte hassle on my old box

[21:02:48]

juski:

and ironically there's FA worth recording on those anyway

[21:02:52]

gpd:

on some channels they are exactly 4 minutes anyway

[21:03:01]

juski:

gpd: most channels actually :)

[21:03:02]

splAt1 is now known as splat1

[21:03:05]

juski:

4 >

[21:03:07]

juski:

:D

[21:03:08]

gpd:

works well :D

[21:03:36]

gbee:

yeah just listened to Sometimes and it seemed pretty decent, but everything else I've heard off that album was, well not

[21:03:42]

gpd:

i take it that your mythweb is the svn – or is it just a different theme?

[21:03:49]

juski:

gpd: svn

[21:04:06]

juski:

I need to get skinning mythweb sometime

[21:04:25]

gbee:

maybe it's got something to do with the memories which go with the early Ash, rather than the music itself

[21:04:29]

gpd:

ok – i didn't get anywhere with the svn one as my myth was too old

[21:04:29]

juski:

gbee: Shining Light is rather nice

[21:04:54]

juski:

and I was bought about 15 pints for playing "girl from mars" at a Rag bash in Cardiff many moons ago

[21:05:18]

juski:

gpd: you cannae mix & match plugins & crap

[21:06:16]

gbee:

Shining Light was on Free All Angels? .. huh – would have said it was the album before that, I've got it as an mp3 but now I'm not sure where it came from ;)

[21:06:26]

juski:

hahaha listening to Shining Light reminds me I need to try & fix the channel phasing

[21:07:19]

juski:

gbee: you might've liked the 'Jus drinks half a bottle of vodka & plays Indie' night I used to do every Tuesday

[21:07:51]

gbee:

hmm, just looking at what else was on there – There's A Star was ok too and again I would have said it was from an earlier album – but I can't quite understand how those tracks came to be on the same album as World Domination or Submission

[21:08:13]

** gbee shrugs **

[21:08:20]

gbee:

juski: sounds like it

[21:08:24]

juski:

I dunno where they came from, how they got there or where the originals are anymore

[21:09:05]

** gpd ponders switching from sshfs to nfs/samba for mp3/video to desktop **

[21:09:13]

juski:

ahh fond memories of vodka-hazed nights lying on the floor, getting up only to change tracks

[21:09:30]

juski:

total professionalism

[21:10:16]

juski:

wonder what it's like for teenies these days – what with their mobile porn cameras, myspaz & youtube

[21:10:32]

juski:

I think I might actually be jealous

[21:10:52]

gbee:

feck me, just rediscovered a Cast track that I haven't heard since I was ~15

[21:11:24]

juski:

shining star?

[21:11:46]

juski:

heh. typical. not on my box

[21:12:35]

juski:

seems people had discovered my box

[21:12:37]

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[21:13:17]

gbee:

Shining Star was Ash

[21:13:28]

juski:

WHO PLAYED FIVE?

[21:13:34]

juski:

I can find your IP address & shame you!

[21:13:43]

gbee:

this was Sandstorm – pretty sure I once owned the album, but can't find it now

[21:15:03]

gpd:

is there a file sharing protocol that will sit well with one machine being turned off regularly?

[21:15:10]

gbee:

but brought up memories

[21:17:56]

gpd:

^ nobody know – or nobody care?

[21:18:36]

juski:

either or – does it matter? ;)

[21:19:18]

juski:

jesus my b/w is taking a pounding :)

[21:19:44]

gpd:

what isp do you have?

[21:19:49]

juski:

NTL

[21:19:54]

juski:

er.. virgin

[21:20:11]

Fony_Vaio:

i know this isn't a myth specific question, but is it possible to run mythtv-setup remotely from X on another machine?

[21:20:20]

juski:

Fony_Vaio: course it is

[21:20:30]

Fony_Vaio:

juski: aren't they introducing bw limiting for "heavy users"?

[21:20:46]

juski:

Fony_Vaio: apparently

[21:20:50]

Fony_Vaio:

if you dl a certain amount within certain times, i've heard they may cap your bw for 24 hours or something. just what i've heard.

[21:21:18]

juski:

I dunno why the f. they won't just cap the idiots who download too many DVDs worth a day

[21:21:23]

gbee:

juski: in case you want to test the clock in menu stuff – http://pastebin.ca/526583

[21:21:54]

Fony_Vaio:

juski: just killing off the main p2p ports would do the trick, methinks... all the fools you leave limewire running in the background all the time their pc is on.

[21:22:10]

gpd:

juski: do you have a DVB-C card for the virgin? or not available?

[21:22:22]

Fony_Vaio:

s/you/who/

[21:22:23]

juski:

gpd: against Virgin T&Cs

[21:22:39]

Fony_Vaio:

lol

[21:23:01]

gpd:

juski: i'll take that as a yes then ;P

[21:23:06]

juski:

gpd: plus to get encrippled channels you'd need to hack – and that's a teensy weensy bit naughty

[21:23:15]

Fony_Vaio:

i just wish they'd hurry up with HD content on freeview

[21:23:18]

juski:

gpd: I wouldn't take that as a yes, NO WAY

[21:23:44]

jduggan_:

Fony_Vaio: you'll be waiting

[21:23:46]

jduggan_:

for uhm

[21:23:47]

jduggan_:

..ever

[21:23:49]

jduggan_:

:|

[21:23:56]

gpd:

juski: how can they detect what you are connecting to? is there phone uplink?

[21:23:59]

juski:

gpd: the unencrippled stuff can be had on freeview anyway, so the expense of DVB-C cards would be a waste

[21:24:16]

gpd:

juski: ok, fair play

[21:24:42]

Fony_Vaio:

lol

[21:24:42]

juski:

I'd have dumped Virgin already if $ly were a viable alternative

[21:24:46]

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[21:25:10]

Fony_Vaio:

jduggan_: what about the freeview dvb-s services coming out? they might have some HD content, surely?

[21:25:27]

juski:

Fony_Vaio: Freesat – not all of it is free to air!

[21:25:40]

Fony_Vaio:

yah, but is any of it HD/

[21:25:42]

juski:

Fony_Vaio: ITV/C4/C5 are encrippled

[21:25:46]

juski:

and no HD for free

[21:26:09]

Fony_Vaio:

wow, that's worse than freeview, and more expensive and more of a pita to set up

[21:26:27]

juski:

it has way more religion & shopping / gameshow channels though!

[21:26:51]

juski:

it's free to watch, but you need a card from $ly

[21:27:16]

Fony_Vaio:

meh

[21:27:16]

juski:

which means you need a CAM of dubious legality to use with PC tuners

[21:27:43]

juski:

when I say 'dubious' I mean 'illegal & unlicenced'

[21:27:45]

Fony_Vaio:

i think i'll stick with freeview.. missus hasn't complained about lack of content yet, not that we watch that much.

[21:27:52]

jduggan_:

er, there are even cams that can read sky cards?

[21:28:08]

juski:

jduggan_: apparently so. but they're illegal

[21:28:28]

RyeBrye:

Illegal? Bah. What's the law between friends, right?

[21:28:28]

gbee:

and don't forget the Sky sales calls!

[21:28:53]

juski:

gbee: $ly ring up if you get a freebie card off of em?

[21:29:06]

juski:

that's $ly !

[21:29:07]

juski:

;)

[21:29:43]

juski:

if I could see their subscriber base going up & costs coming _down_ or staying static I might consider em

[21:30:28]

juski:

$ly as in, evil, money grabbing robbing conniving c****

[21:30:42]

juski:

owned by fat c****

[21:30:43]

gbee:

juski: no idea, but judging from the number of purely sales calls they make to existing customers and ex-customers I would certainly expect them to try it on

[21:31:03]

gpd:

ya – but only 26/mo! [terms and condistions apply]

[21:31:05]

juski:

oh wait.. 'cat' doesn't have 5 letters

[21:31:25]

juski:

nor does c*** come to think.. nm

[21:31:35]

gpd:

oh – and 10/mo for sky+

[21:31:42]

juski:

gpd: nah not anymore

[21:31:49]

juski:

they got rid of that

[21:31:59]

gpd:

only if you have 2 premiums?

[21:32:04]

gbee:

once you've given them your details for the 'free' card, they'll see that as a foot in the door and push to get those people 'upgraded' to one of their packages

[21:32:08]

juski:

imagine charging people for a box that sometimes loses all the recordings

[21:32:26]

juski:

imagine charging people for a box that sometimes won't let you watch your recordings because there's some weather in the sky

[21:33:02]

juski:

gbee: I think ofcom are pushing for the encrippled freebies to be put in the clear

[21:33:47]

juski:

if you could buy a dvb-s tuner & a cam from $ly, I _might_ consider them. but you can't, so I won't

[21:34:07]

juski:

you get their box or else, and it ain't fair

[21:34:38]

juski:

I don't care if I'm the last person in the country to get Sky – I ain't having it

[21:34:38]

gbee:

juski: makes me laff that Virgin radio is sponsored by sky, with adverts and plugs for Sky+ all over, yet even the DJs moan on air about how their Sky+ boxes "stopped working again" but "the nice people at Sky replaced it within 24 ours"

[21:34:53]

juski:

gbee: o rly? hahaha

[21:35:07]

gpd:

but you seem to be no better off with virgin... wrt that?

[21:35:28]

juski:

gpd: Branson is harder to hate

[21:35:38]

juski:

and their cable broadband is ace with knobs on

[21:35:39]

gpd:

he is very smiley – i'll give you taht

[21:35:40]

Fony_Vaio:

my 'rents have terrible problems with their V+ pvr

[21:35:45]

juski:

cap or no cap

[21:36:17]

juski:

I dont know anybody personally who likes thjeir ADSL

[21:36:21]

gpd:

Democracy player gets $100k from mozilla...

[21:36:36]

juski:

last.fm sold to CBS !

[21:36:57]

gpd:

last.fm – UK '3 lads'

[21:37:04]

jduggan_:

i like my adsl

[21:37:07]

jduggan_:

;)

[21:37:13]

jduggan_:

but having control over the endpoint

[21:37:15]

jduggan_:

makes a difference :P

[21:37:18]

xris:

gpd: it's too bad that they advertise illegal file sharing via bittorrent as a benefit, since that keeps it out of mythtv.

[21:38:32]

Fony_Vaio:

really? that's a shame

[21:38:33]

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[21:38:35]

gpd:

xris: true – and makes you wonder why mozilla wants the association

[21:38:55]

Fony_Vaio:

maybe part of the deal with moz is they drop the illegal stuff?

[21:39:24]

gpd:

what would myth do with $100k ?

[21:39:28]

juski:

like youtube is pulling all copyrighted clips to leave only the vids of Emo self harming?

[21:39:29]

gpd:

fix the weather plugin?

[21:39:35]

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[21:40:19]

juski:

gpd: lol. fix the fscking pesky whiny theme developer

[21:40:19]

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[21:40:45]

juski:

gimme $1000 & I'll go away for good :D

[21:41:29]

opello:

juski: hey, want to sell me some more case badges, sans ebay-tax? :)

[21:41:52]

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[21:42:01]

juski:

opello: I tried that for a few days but nobody bit, hence the ebay thing now

[21:42:07]

opello:

oh, i missed it :(

[21:42:28]

juski:

missed the great song & dance I made? hehehehe

[21:42:33]

opello:

lol, apparently

[21:42:50]

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[21:43:37]

gbee:

gpd: with $100k? Reappear in a South American country six months later with a small Villa and some sort of drink with an umbrella in it

[21:43:39]

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[21:44:03]

Fony_Vaio:

the only thing i think that would make myth better, and that i miss about mce, is the ability to quickly maximise / minimise, use the mouse if i want for some things, start music playing in one section and then go browse pictures in another

[21:44:04]

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[21:44:33]

Fony_Vaio:

if myth could do that i'd never think of mce again :P

[21:46:10]

gbee:

Fony_Vaio: give it time, reckon everything on that list will happen eventually

[21:46:46]

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[21:46:48]

Fony_Vaio:

gbee: I bet it will, which is why i'm willing to support myth and run it long term

[21:47:32]

Fony_Vaio:

tbh all those things are kinda similar, in terms of the ui's ability to multitask and switch focus / resize, etc

[21:50:34]

Fony_Vaio:

i just built a new htpc 'cause i got a 1080p panel, thought i'd end up dual booting 'doze. But running myth on ubuntu is pretty amazing, imho. Everything just works, even stuff like the bluetooth keyboard / mouse, the mce remote, etc... all so easy.

[21:52:50]

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[21:57:01]

gpd:

Fony_Vaio: if you haven't done it – setup the subpixel fonts as per: http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty much nicer

[21:58:18]

Fony_Vaio:

gpd: yeah, did already thanks. Looks great at native res :D

[21:58:34]

jduggan_:

Ubuntu:Feisty much nicer

[21:58:34]

jduggan_:

From

[21:58:35]

jduggan_:

(There is currently no text in this page)

[21:58:58]

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[21:59:22]

Fony_Vaio:

i think the nvidia binary driver messed up the screen font dpi, though.... at logon and in myth the fonts were _huge_. I added the dpi lines back into xorg.conf and it was fine.

[22:00:04]

simcop2388-tv:

no big deal

[22:00:29]

juski:

whee time for bed

[22:00:38]

simcop2388-tv:

night juski

[22:00:44]

juski:

g'night everlybodilies

[22:00:48]

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[22:01:03]

Fony_Vaio:

wide open space

[22:01:12]

gpd:

I too am in a wide open space

[22:01:12]

Fony_Vaio:

knew i'd heard that line somewhere before

[22:01:28]

gpd:

I'm drifting...

[22:01:43]

gpd:

the trance remix on euphoria is quite special :)

[22:01:52]

Fony_Vaio:

heh

[22:02:32]

gpd:

meanwhile... /me snoozes

[22:02:34]

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[22:02:51]

Fony_Vaio:

introduced the missus to the original northern exposure (sasha & digweed) last night, knowing that she doesn't like trance... she loved it. :D

[22:03:07]

gpd:

hah – that goes back a bit

[22:03:21]

gpd:

check out freshlymixed.com if you like that stuff

[22:03:31]

Fony_Vaio:

yah, some of the old stuff is the best

[22:04:02]

Fony_Vaio:

she likes a couple of the old gabriel & dresden mixes, too... gotta find more that she'll like

[22:04:08]

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[22:06:16]

mortal5:

does anyone here know if you still change channels with ivtv using ivtv-tune -c #?

[22:06:51]

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[22:07:06]

Anduin:

mortal5: you could, though if you are using myth let it change channels

[22:07:12]

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[22:07:15]

Fony_Vaio:

gpd: sounds like a plan

[22:07:50]

mortal5:

Anduin, I was just wondering if they had changed anything

[22:08:15]

mortal5:

i know the ivtvctl software is now some v4 something

[22:08:23]

Anduin:

v4l2-ctl

[22:08:47]

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[22:09:16]

NewCastleScott:

Hello all,Im back

[22:09:27]

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[22:11:48]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: read the how to debug section again (you should be ignoring SIGPIPE)

[22:12:32]

NewCastleScott:

the app crashes and I get loged out...

[22:13:04]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: not from SIGPIPE

[22:13:17]

NewCastleScott:

then how can I log the crash

[22:13:39]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: are you running gdb in -batch?

[22:13:54]

NewCastleScott:

I dont know about -batch

[22:13:58]

NewCastleScott:

how does it work

[22:15:03]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: Just a question, doesn't mean you should be using it, if you are not going to ignore SIGPIPE you should be hitting 'c' when you get one (or really, reading the "how to make a backtrace" section in the docs)

[22:17:13]

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[22:17:44]

Anduin:

NewCastleScott: ask about a specific line in the docs that is unclear

[22:19:10]

mortal5:

Anduin, what do you have your bitrate set to?

[22:20:08]

NewCastleScott:

sorry,when I run gdb /command to start the frontend I cant add the geomatry flag to it so it takes over the whole screen and I cant access the term. to start bt

[22:20:15]

Anduin:

mortal5: I have several, depending on the recording profile.

[22:20:27]

mortal5:

Anduin, normal tv

[22:20:54]

mortal5:

I used to have mine set to 4000000 or something, just having trouble remembering the number of zeros

[22:21:18]

mortal5:

at least ivtvctl used to print out it's settings for you...

[22:21:41]

Anduin:

mortal5: I think mine is vbr 4–6, and v4l2-ctl still prints it out

[22:22:48]

Anduin:

v4l2-ctl -l will list all controls, among them the bitrate and bitrate peak

[22:22:56]

mortal5:

o0o

[22:22:57]

mortal5:

ty

[22:25:58]

mortal5:

I was very pleased to see the driver automatically in the kernel in this latest release

[22:26:15]

mortal5:

all i had to do was go out and grab the utils

[22:26:44]

RyeBrye:

oh, v4l is in the kernel now?

[22:27:16]

mortal5:

well, yes, but that's been there

[22:27:27]

mortal5:

i'm talking specifically about the ivtv driver

[22:27:31]

RyeBrye:

Oh, gotcha

[22:28:07]

RyeBrye:

cool

[22:29:44]

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[22:30:16]

ubuntuEdgy:

hi

[22:30:39]

mortal5:

thanks Anduin I'll probobly be back later

[22:31:20]

RyeBrye:

Fony_Vaio – I usually just use VNC

[22:31:39]

Fony_Vaio:

RyeBrye: hrm, didn't really wanna install X on my server, tbh...

[22:31:53]

RyeBrye:

You can always remove it when you are done

[22:32:01]

ubuntuEdgy:

i have somehow managed to loose all my guide data ,any one know how to get it back ?. i have already run mythfill but it didn't work

[22:32:14]

ubuntuEdgy:

i use dvb-t to get my guide data

[22:32:16]

RyeBrye:

Oh, wait – you were going to forward X but not have X run on the server?

[22:32:43]

Fony_Vaio:

RyeBrye: yah

[22:33:10]

RyeBrye:

Oh. I have no clue how to do that

[22:33:19]

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[22:33:42]

RyeBrye:

has anyone here gotten mythfrontend to compile for OS X

[22:33:42]

RyeBrye:

?

[22:33:46]

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[22:34:14]

RyeBrye:

I try using the ./configure and it craps out because of the endian test – and I try using the osx-packager.pl script but that craps out because QT sucks and doesn't compile

[22:35:45]

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[22:54:57]

Scuzzle:

Fony_Vaio: Do you not need to make sure xauth is installed on the backend server too?

[22:55:26]

Fony_Vaio:

Scuzzle: ah, i will check

[22:56:50]

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[23:12:49]

Pogonip:

Can someone tell me what happens when the Play Music button on musicmenu.xml is pushed ?

[23:15:01]

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[23:21:43]

xris:

Pogonip: I'm going to venture a guess that music (the current playlist) will start playing.

[23:23:12]

squish102:

has anyone notived when using mytharchive and you get to the first dvd menu, u have to wait for the music to stop before you can select a show?

[23:23:32]

squish102:

in your dvd player

[23:24:07]

kash:

has anyone used Orb?

[23:33:58]

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[23:34:36]

Dagmar:

Hrm... Something made commflagging quit. Not fun

[23:35:57]

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[23:37:12]

Dagmar:

Meh. Nevermind. POwerfailure earlier killed that table

[23:37:20]

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[23:37:21]

Dagmar:

I'm gonna KILL me some electrical contractors

[23:37:23]

TSCHAK:

hey guys

[23:37:36]

TSCHAK:

who here knows how to remove an optical drive faceplate?

[23:37:56]

TSCHAK:

the case i am using has a replacement

[23:38:35]

Anduin:

TSCHAK: it depends, usually just plastic tabs that give with force (or a tool stuck in to help)

[23:39:05]

TSCHAK:

Anduin, this is a liteon

[23:39:13]

TSCHAK:

Anduin, i figured that was generic enough

[23:39:19]

TSCHAK:

Anduin, but i can't remove it.

[23:40:36]

Aquahallic:

Evenin' folks

[23:41:27]

Dagmar:

Fuuun... bugs in 0.20-fixes. *snif*

[23:42:00]

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[23:45:33]

Aquahallic:

anyone ever seen the ivtv error... ivtv0: Cause: the application is not reading fast enough.

[23:45:45]

Anduin:

Aquahallic: all the time

[23:46:13]

Anduin:

Aquahallic: it isn't really a problem unless it isn't around show start/stops

[23:46:34]

Fony_Vaio:

anyone know what the tuning delay should be on a philips chipset nova-t?

[23:46:38]

Aquahallic:

well my livetv is a tad bit jerky

[23:47:22]

Aquahallic:

would this possibly be related to that latency error I've read about?

[23:48:30]

Anduin:

Aquahallic: would need more context, if you mean PCI latency probably not

[23:49:00]

Anduin:

Aquahallic: you should be able to get something as good as running mplayer /dev/video0

MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

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