Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Friday, February 9th, 2007, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:02]

adante:

jasoncohen01: like i said, people transcode to batwierd resolutions like 480x480 and still rescale for 4:3 or 16:9 or whatever

[00:00:21]

adante:

jasoncohen01: mplayer reports VIDEO: MPEG2 720x576 (aspect 3) 25.000 fps 10000.0 kbps (1250.0 kbyte/s)

[00:00:25]

jasoncohen01:

adante: but it's stupid. You're losing so many vertical lines

[00:00:41]

jasoncohen01:

aspect 3?

[00:00:48]

_mike3:

F9 and F12 won't mute

[00:00:50]

_mike3:

anyone know why

[00:01:08]

jasoncohen01:

adante: what's PAR?

[00:01:11]

adante:

jasoncohen01: yeah i'm trying to figure out what that is now

[00:01:14]

kormoc:

_mike3, cause you're not putting your fingers in your ears when you press them

[00:01:15]

adante:

jasoncohen01: pixel aspect ratio

[00:01:33]

_mike3:

kormoc: no

[00:01:36]

jasoncohen01:

adante: ah, so they just squish the pixels :)

[00:01:37]

adante:

jasoncohen01: and i'm not commenting on how clever/stupid it is i'm just saying that's how it is

[00:01:51]

clever:

?

[00:02:00]

adante:

jasoncohen01: for instance you have some plasma tvs which are native 640x640

[00:02:00]

jasoncohen01:

adante: 10 mbit SD stream?

[00:02:05]

SarahEmm (SarahEmm!n=sarahemm@bas4-toronto63-1096693296.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:02:16]

** SarahEmm wavies **

[00:02:17]

jasoncohen01:

adante: um...i haven't seen any

[00:02:38]

jasoncohen01:

all the plasmas i've seen are 16:9

[00:02:50]

adante:

jasoncohen01: no, i mean they are 16:9 physically, but their resolution is square

[00:03:00]

adante:

jasoncohen01: i suggest you google eg "plasma 1024x1024"

[00:03:02]

jasoncohen01:

adante: yeah, i know

[00:03:20]

adante:

jasoncohen01: ok so the point i make is that yes it may be crazy or whatever but its done

[00:03:30]

kormoc:

nonsquare pixels are quite common

[00:03:45]

jasoncohen01:

adante: the plasmas i've seen are 1280x720, 1366 x 768, or 1920x1080

[00:04:01]

** W6SN pixels jasoncohen **

[00:04:06]

adante:

jasoncohen01: as i am (not yet) supreme ruler of earth, or even south queensland, and i'm unable to force the tv stations to broadcast PERFECTLY SQUARE PIXELS, i will just have to make do with non-square pixels :]

[00:05:12]

SarahEmm:

does myth have any feature where i could specify certain search criteria and it would record anything that it finds with that in it?

[00:05:31]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: but, why make non-square pixels?

[00:05:54]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, some video feeds come in non-square, and well, it's cheaper to make

[00:05:59]

adante:

clearly it is a ploy by The Man to keep us down

[00:06:14]

adante:

SarahEmm: yep

[00:06:36]

cheeseboy16:

http://pastebin.ca/345994

[00:06:49]

cheeseboy16:

how do i fix it?

[00:07:17]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, just maybe start mysql?

[00:07:27]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: wouldn't a screen that had a pixel resolution of 1280x720 and a 16:9 physical aspect ratio be better than one that was 1024x1024 with a 16:9 AR quality wise as you don't have better video quality?

[00:07:31]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, erm, or use the right password?

[00:07:42]

cheeseboy16:

i did

[00:07:43]

SarahEmm:

adante: how do i accces such? :)

[00:07:54]

cheeseboy16:

didnt change it

[00:08:08]

cheeseboy16:

let mythtv use the defult

[00:08:29]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, depends on the signal going in, sometimes with square pixels and a non-square source, you have some square pixels that have two halfs of the ones in the source, and thus gets muddied to a middle color

[00:08:32]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, what distro?

[00:08:54]

adante:

SarahEmm: sorry, not in front of a frontend atm :] someone else might be able to help

[00:09:32]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: I guess i wrongly assumed all HD broadcasts were 720p or 1080i which use square pixels

[00:09:55]

cheeseboy16:

kormoc, ubuntu edgy

[00:10:29]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, ubuntu 'helpfully' randomizes the default password for you automatically on install, check the wiki, it should have instructions for finding what it was set to

[00:10:57]

adante:

SarahEmm: mythweb has a custom recording schedules interface, where you can search to record by title, day etc

[00:11:34]

SarahEmm:

adante: but you can leave it in place perminantly, so anything with the word 'ostrich' in the description at any time gets recorded?

[00:11:45]

adante:

SarahEmm: i'm pretty sure that is the case, yes

[00:11:45]

kormoc:

yes

[00:12:01]

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[00:12:22]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, in mythweb, the custom recording schedule

[00:12:51]

SarahEmm:

cool. will take a look :) thanks!

[00:12:55]

cheeseboy16:

kormoc, link? please

[00:13:06]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, link to what?

[00:13:32]

cheeseboy16:

wiki instructions

[00:13:46]

SarahEmm:

is mythweb painfully slow for everyone, or is this just me? takes 1–2 minutes to pull up any page on it

[00:14:01]

kormoc:

cheeseboy16, the wiki link is in the channel topic, and there's a search field on the page

[00:14:12]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, it's rather speedy for me for most of the pages

[00:14:17]

jasoncohen01:

SarahEmm: it's snappy for me

[00:14:18]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, he's on ubuntu. it's different

[00:14:22]

SarahEmm:

hrm. i'm thinking i need to build a whole new install from scratch

[00:14:34]

SarahEmm:

this has been running since ~2002 and i'm having issues with performance...

[00:14:41]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, have you optimized your tables lately?

[00:14:49]

SarahEmm:

optimized my tables?

[00:14:54]

SarahEmm:

no....

[00:15:03]

adante:

(i think he's coming on to you)

[00:15:05]

cheeseboy16:

jasoncohen01, no

[00:15:07]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: it is? I'm on Debian Sarge and i followed that guide. I also installed on ubuntu 5.04 using that guide.

[00:15:08]

SarahEmm:

lol adante!

[00:15:21]

cheeseboy16:

http://parker1.co.uk/mythtv_ubuntu.php, these

[00:15:22]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, there's a script in the contrib directorys that will optimize your tables and might help

[00:15:25]

Milosch:

SarahEmm: fwiw, i had a serious performance issue due to a bad entry in one table, a program with a channel id in the millions

[00:15:33]

SarahEmm:

oooh

[00:15:37]

** SarahEmm investimagates **

[00:15:40]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, if you install via ubuntu's packages, it randomizes the mysql password automatically

[00:15:52]

Milosch:

not sure if that script would fix that, probably was my fault ;0

[00:16:05]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/browser/trunk/myth . . . ze_mythdb.pl

[00:16:06]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: oh, i wasn't aware he installed from a deb package. I always install via source. My mistake.

[00:16:07]

The_Gree1:

jasoncohen01: thanks for the help, i got it

[00:16:22]

jasoncohen01:

The_Gree1: great, so was that the problem?

[00:16:30]

SarahEmm:

part of my performance issues is also likely that i'm on a celeron 1.7GHz doing softencoding

[00:16:36]

jasoncohen01:

The_Gree1: heh, i was told to do a complete re-install. I'm glad i didn't give up.

[00:16:44]

The_Gree1:

yeah

[00:16:58]

jasoncohen01:

SarahEmm: what's cpu usage like when it's encoding?

[00:17:19]

SarahEmm:

jasoncohen01: when watching live TV it's *almost* maxing out the CPU. doing something like a backup at the same time causes framedroppage.

[00:17:41]

jasoncohen01:

SarahEmm: are you using playback filters?

[00:17:49]

jasoncohen01:

SarahEmm: they can take a lot of cpu

[00:18:04]

** kormoc blinks and wonders what jasoncohen01 is after **

[00:18:07]

SarahEmm:

nope jasoncohen01

[00:18:09]

jasoncohen01:

SarahEmm: you can get a pvr-150/250 to lower cpu usage

[00:18:36]

SarahEmm:

jasoncohen01: last i heard the 150 doesn't support captioning at all, and the 250 only very very recently supports it, and it's not well tested

[00:18:46]

SarahEmm:

jasoncohen01: so i'm sticking with software encoding for now unfortunately

[00:18:51]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: i use a denoise and de-interlace filter on the frnotend which uses 25% cpu on my amd 2700+

[00:19:01]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, SarahEmm is no stranger to the channel, she's been in here for at least a year off and on

[00:19:03]

jasoncohen01:

over what it needs for regular playback

[00:19:09]

SarahEmm:

kormoc: couple years. :)

[00:19:17]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: sorry, i didn't know that

[00:19:43]

SarahEmm:

been using myth since sept. 2003 :)

[00:19:49]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, didn't ivtv 0.9.something add cc for 150's and 500's? I thought I heard it did, but perhaps not

[00:19:51]

jasoncohen01:

i haven't been here for over a year, heh

[00:20:08]

jasoncohen01:

before last week

[00:20:24]

SarahEmm:

kormoc: it's possible, i haven't kept 100% up to date on that lately.. i'll have to investigate :) i'd love to move to a -500 if possible, but i really like being able to understand what's going on ;)

[00:20:59]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: do you know anything about the mythrename or myth.rebuilddatabase filters from contrib?

[00:21:21]

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[00:22:02]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, what bout them?

[00:22:21]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, yeah... my m179 is getting CC's now, but it's only 1 out of 10 or so, not so hot

[00:22:29]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: I got an error while running myth.rebuilddatabase and i was wondering if you could help.

[00:22:36]

jasoncohen01:

let me get the pastebin link

[00:22:40]

SarahEmm:

kormoc: yeah, that's fairly useless for me :) i need it as reliably as what i have now before i'd switch

[00:23:41]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: here's the output of ./myth.rebuilddatabase – http://pastebin.ca/345923

[00:24:47]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, you need the time perl module

[00:25:23]

jasoncohen01:

ah

[00:25:32]

jasoncohen01:

any idea what it's called in debian? there are so many perl packages.

[00:26:47]

W6SN:

Time::HiRes?

[00:26:51]

W6SN:

i dunno that script

[00:26:51]

W6SN:

heh

[00:27:41]

Dagmar:

Duh

[00:27:51]

jasoncohen01:

found it- libtime-modules-perl

[00:27:55]

Dagmar:

Dude, as root, type `cpan` and hit enter

[00:28:11]

W6SN:

oh, that

[00:28:14]

Dagmar:

Answer it's little questions about mirrors, and then type "install Time::Hires"

[00:28:17]

Dagmar:

Done.

[00:28:24]

Dagmar:

Seriously.

[00:28:43]

Dagmar:

Perl can update itself as well as any package manager could dream of

[00:30:07]

Dagmar:

From seeing the "Time/Format.pm" string, the way CPAN is you could search by that.

[00:30:31]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: done, thanks

[00:30:36]

Dagmar:

There's even a twisted and sick `use CPAN;` still I think, which can, once CPAN has been enabled, make a program download and install *all* it's dependencies

[00:30:52]

Dagmar:

I remember using it with the early builds of perl5

[00:32:04]

Dagmar:

There were also some very irresponsible things you could do with Data::Dumper and %main then as well

[00:32:39]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: just "exit' when it's done installing?

[00:32:42]

Dagmar:

I wrote a bizarre little library for invoking fork's across ssh

[00:32:48]

Dagmar:

yep.

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[00:32:54]

Ediehow:

Milosch: hi

[00:32:56]

Ediehow:

any ideas today?:)

[00:33:04]

Dagmar:

jasoncohen01: perl is *very* easy to upgrade

[00:33:15]

Dagmar:

jasoncohen01: Doesn't really matter what platform you're using it on, including Windows.

[00:33:20]

jasoncohen01:

same error after installing Time::HiRes

[00:33:26]

Dagmar:

One sec then

[00:33:27]

jasoncohen01:

Time::HiRes is up to date.

[00:33:40]

Ediehow:

help, i can't control volume in myth

[00:34:03]

Dagmar:

Doh.

[00:34:08]

** Dagmar smacks his forehead. **

[00:34:21]

Dagmar:

The package is actually Time::Format

[00:34:30]

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[00:34:31]

Dagmar:

Current version is 1.02, CPAN knows about it

[00:34:37]

jasoncohen01:

installing

[00:34:54]

Dagmar:

I feel stupid I didnt' say "just change the slash to a colon and chop off the '.pm'" because as dumb as that is, it seldom fails

[00:35:30]

jasoncohen01:

It worked!

[00:35:33]

jasoncohen01:

yay

[00:35:36]

Dagmar:

Here's the really deranged thing about perl. There's actually a perl module to build a mirror of the site

[00:35:40]

jasoncohen01:

time to figure out what these shows are

[00:37:24]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: if i use the mythname script to give human readable names to files, will mythtv still be able to play the files?

[00:37:35]

Dagmar:

It's a smart script.

[00:37:37]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, it only makes links to them, so yes

[00:37:38]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: thanks for the help

[00:37:47]

Dagmar:

No problem.

[00:37:49]

kormoc:

or does it actually rename now? I forget

[00:38:04]

Dagmar:

Last I checked there was a rename option that rejiggered the database

[00:38:21]

jasoncohen01:

rejiggered?

[00:38:23]

jasoncohen01:

heh

[00:38:29]

Dagmar:

Yes, I am aware of how ming-bogglingly technical that term is.

[00:38:32]

Dagmar:

;)

[00:38:34]

jasoncohen01:

is there some way to make mythtv use human readable names?

[00:38:56]

Dagmar:

Isn't that what the script you just installed was for?

[00:39:27]

SarahEmm:

alright, DB repaired and optimized.

[00:39:50]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: no the script i am using now repairs the database to add orphaned videos

[00:40:05]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: videos recorded by mythtv that were dropped from the DB for whatever reason

[00:40:54]

Dagmar:

Ohhh...

[00:41:06]

Dagmar:

Look in mythtv/conrib

[00:41:13]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: i'm there

[00:41:19]

Dagmar:

mythrename.pl

[00:41:23]

Dagmar:

That does renaming

[00:41:31]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: mythrename.pl says "Renames mythtv recordings to more human-readable filenames"

[00:41:38]

SarahEmm:

not a big speed difference if any. still, can't hurt to have run that.

[00:41:39]

jasoncohen01:

so, the question is, will it work in mythtv after renaming

[00:41:41]

Dagmar:

0.20-fixes SVN version from about four days ago has the default behaviour of flat out changing the filenames.

[00:41:47]

Dagmar:

Linking is optional with --link

[00:41:54]

Dagmar:

It's supposed to.

[00:42:02]

Dagmar:

xris wrote it so it's pretty straightforward

[00:42:17]

Dagmar:

Run `mythrename.pl --help`

[00:42:19]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: can you have mythtv automatically use human-readable filenames for all new shows recorded?

[00:42:34]

Dagmar:

Umm... Possibly if you invoked mythrename as a user job after a recording is done

[00:43:12]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: if i dont' use the link option, will it still work?

[00:43:20]

Dagmar:

As far as I know it will

[00:43:29]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: my goal is to be able to see the names in windows using explorer via samba

[00:43:43]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: winmyth is shit so this is the next best thing

[00:44:05]

jasoncohen01:

dsmyth allows you to see info about a nuv file, but all my shows are recorded as .mpg

[00:44:24]

Dagmar:

Just use MythWEb.

[00:44:28]

Dagmar:

Much less work.

[00:44:43]

** xris wrote what? **

[00:44:48]

Dagmar:

Another thing xris wrote

[00:45:04]

xris:

oh. contrib scripty things.

[00:45:10]

Dagmar:

xris: You wrote mythrename.pl, right? Or at least, it's in the Author: field

[00:45:48]

jasoncohen01:

xris: if i run mythrename, will the files still play in mythtv? (if i don't use the --link option)

[00:45:55]

xris:

Dagmar: in svn, that's the last person who committed changes.. but yeah, I wrote most of that.

[00:46:00]

xris:

jasoncohen01: they should, yeah.

[00:46:01]

SarahEmm:

i assume 'find time' on the 'custom recording schedules' screen is the time of day every week it executes this search?

[00:46:11]

Dagmar:

jasoncohen01: Look at http://www.mythtv.org/modules.php?name=MythFeatures about halfway down

[00:46:12]

kormoc:

yes

[00:46:17]

jasoncohen01:

mythweb uses HTTP to download shows

[00:46:21]

SarahEmm:

kormoc: is that yes to me?

[00:46:24]

xris:

I think there are occasionally issues with non-english characters if your db and myth aren't running in the same charset, though.

[00:46:58]

Dagmar:

jasoncohen01: You can use other transports with it

[00:47:00]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, aye

[00:47:02]

jasoncohen01:

the only way for me to open a show w/o downloading the whole thing in firefox is to copy the URL and play in VLC

[00:47:07]

jasoncohen01:

Dagmar: samba?

[00:47:20]

SarahEmm:

kormoc: cool, thanks :) seems awfully silly i have to specify *seconds* or it complains and rejects it heh

[00:47:26]

Dagmar:

jasoncohen01: I don't see why you can't have it give out smb: urls

[00:47:33]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01, mythweb has ASX streaming

[00:48:12]

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[00:48:32]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, heh, yeah, I just use the default it picks for me

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[00:48:43]

SarahEmm:

it didn't, it was blank...

[00:48:58]

kormoc:

SarahEmm, if you save it while blank it autopicks I believe

[00:49:34]

SarahEmm:

ahh okay :)

[00:49:49]

SarahEmm:

how do i see ones that are already set up? are they supposed to show up under 'recording schedules' ?

[00:50:13]

kormoc:

Aye, they're just in that list

[00:50:23]

SarahEmm:

hrm.

[00:50:27]

SarahEmm:

didn't work then :/

[00:50:41]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: how do i set that?

[00:50:42]

SarahEmm:

what goes under 'search phrase' ?

[00:50:50]

jasoncohen01:

kormoc: ASX streaming

[00:51:11]

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[00:54:26]

jasoncohen01_:

anyone know why firefox 2.0 tries to download the entire file when you use "open" whereas IE just loads the program and streams it

[00:55:01]

jasoncohen01_:

if i could get firefox to just open in windows media player or media player classic it would be fine with HTTP

[00:56:12]

adante:

jasoncohen01_: asx streaming is enabled by default in latest svn mythweb, just need to fiddle with some settings as per the install guide

[00:57:11]

jasoncohen01_:

is there a way to change firefox's behavior to not download the entire file

[00:57:21]

jasoncohen01_:

adante: that would require upgrading mythtv to SVN as well, right?

[01:00:04]

adante:

jasoncohen01_: most probably yeah

[01:00:24]

SarahEmm:

ahhhhh now i understand. :)

[01:00:52]

jasoncohen01_:

huh, even in IE, it won't load correctly in WMP or media player classic

[01:02:45]

jasoncohen01_:

if i play the stream via samba it works. If i play it via mythweb in IE i get this – http://pastebin.ca/346047

[01:03:18]

jasoncohen01_:

adante: is the SVN version stable?

[01:03:55]

adante:

jasoncohen01_: seems stable to me, yes

[01:04:27]

adante:

and yeah, mythweb streaming before asx remained an open mystery to me

[01:05:24]

jasoncohen01_:

xris: Does the entire mpeg file need to be downloaded before MPC, WMP will play it? Opening in IE gives http://pastebin.ca/346047. The only program that will play it is VLC using the HTTP URL.

[01:07:54]

GreyFoxx:

the one time I used IE to try that under mythweb back in 0.20 WMP starting playing right away

[01:08:16]

GreyFoxx:

but That was a long time ago, so I have no idea what combination of IE/WMP settings would affect it

[01:08:53]

jasoncohen01_:

GreyFoxx: and with firefox?

[01:09:00]

GreyFoxx:

no idea

[01:09:21]

GreyFoxx:

I don't use mythweb as a gateway to play videos, nor do I run windows to try it :)

[01:10:12]

kslater:

just noticed a strange scheduling thing – A show is scheduled a week out for 3 tapings across 2 tuners (1 on SD, 2 on HD) in a single timeslot

[01:10:17]

kslater:

I don't get it.

[01:10:41]

kslater:

:-/

[01:11:22]

hjohnson:

i just wish that myth worked better for recording radio off of cable as well as video..

[01:12:12]

GreyFoxx:

radio as in digital radio channels?

[01:14:32]

xris:

jasoncohen01_: you need the svn version of mythweb to fake streaming via an asx file.

[01:15:18]

jasoncohen01_:

xris: i figured as much. Thanks for the answer.

[01:15:43]

jasoncohen01_:

i'll wait until i get my HD card to upgrade. I might as well since i have to upgrade the OS anyways then.

[01:16:54]

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[01:21:46]

jasoncohen01_:

mythrename worked great

[01:21:53]

jasoncohen01_:

and i restored the lost videos

[01:22:28]

hjohnson:

why not stream via h.264 or mpeg2?

[01:24:59]

jasoncohen01_:

huh, those are file formats? what do you mean stream via h.264?

[01:25:26]

jasoncohen01_:

the files are just mpeg-2. The problem is that they won't play correctly until they've been completely downloaded and they're 3.2 GB.

[01:27:18]

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[01:27:56]

Perdignus:

Hellow – How can I delete all my recording schedules from within mysql via the console?

[01:28:22]

xris:

Perdignus: clearing out the record table will usually do it.

[01:28:29]

xris:

not sure if it leaves extraneous data around, though

[01:29:16]

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[01:29:57]

Perdignus:

I know this isn't right but is it close? --> drop * from record ;

[01:30:24]

kormoc:

Perdignus, TRUNCATE record;

[01:31:03]

xris:

Perdignus: or DELETE FROM record;

[01:31:10]

Perdignus:

Very nice, that did it, thanks, it was taking for ever from MythWeb

[01:31:36]

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[02:00:06]

adante:

jasoncohen01_: to answer prev question, the reason firefox/ie tries to download the entire file before streaming it is because it is just treating it as a regular file

[02:00:25]

livingtm:

id knoppmyth support a different channel?

[02:01:14]

livingtm:

hello?

[02:01:47]

livingtm:

cesman, you around?

[02:03:05]

Ediehow:

help, i can't control volume in myth

[02:04:27]

Milosch:

still?

[02:05:29]

Perdignus:

Would it be ill advised to upgrade from SVN 0.20.20061213–1 to today's SVN?

[02:05:40]

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[02:06:51]

xris:

Perdignus: sv is usually pretty stable

[02:07:28]

adante:

Ediehow: possible permissions problem?

[02:07:42]

Perdignus:

I'm not having any issues really, just looking for something to do or something new and shiny ;)

[02:08:30]

Ediehow:

adante: on what?

[02:08:41]

Ediehow:

adante: i can control it in every application outside of myth

[02:08:44]

Ediehow:

that's what is so confusing to me

[02:09:29]

adante:

Ediehow: oh right.. in that case no idea

[02:09:54]

adante:

checked the audio settings?

[02:12:29]

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[02:17:41]

Ediehow:

adante: on what?

[02:17:51]

stormy|:

My pcHDTV 5500 card doesn't detect signals on any channels. I have confirmed that the cable that is connected is getting signal, and i'm running AMD64 Ubuntu 6.06 LTS, anyone have experience with this?

[02:18:03]

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[02:18:39]

adante:

Ediehow: on the frontend

[02:18:50]

Ediehow:

it's the same machine

[02:19:00]

Ediehow:

i mean, as far as i know audio settings are OK

[02:19:09]

Ediehow:

it's just moving volume up and down has no effect

[02:19:38]

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[02:20:09]

Ediehow:

in addition, mute does nothing

[02:21:23]

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[02:31:03]

adante:

Ediehow: oh, hm

[02:31:11]

Ediehow:

i don't know what to do

[02:31:35]

stormy|:

nobody in here has used a pcHDTV 5500 card before? lol

[02:32:11]

hads:

stormy|: Why does that make you Laugh Out Loud?

[02:32:29]

stormy|:

hads, what is the point of you asking that question? It is a habit.

[02:32:51]

hads:

That's quite an annoying habit you have there.

[02:32:54]

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[02:34:18]

stormy|:

So, is there anyone who is not idle who has actually used that card?

[02:34:18]

quink:

hello

[02:34:20]

stormy|:

hi

[02:35:13]

quink:

is there a simple way to change a system setting in mythtv if i can't run myth-setup but can drop into mysql?

[02:37:50]

stormy|:

I dont know, sorry. It doesn't seem that the channel is very active :(.

[02:38:02]

quink:

whats your problem?

[02:39:15]

stormy|:

I'm trying to get a pcHDTV 5500 card working....

[02:39:24]

stormy|:

It doesn't detect any streams whatsoever

[02:39:29]

quink:

oh. i don't have hdtv yet.

[02:39:55]

stormy|:

that's okay :)

[02:41:27]

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[02:41:33]

nothingman:

hi, all

[02:41:51]

nothingman:

having trouble setting up mysql from a backup

[02:42:04]

nothingman:

that is, the backup seems to have worked, but I can't log in as mythtv, even from the main box

[02:42:53]

adante:

log in as in into the mythconverg database?

[02:43:36]

nothingman:

right

[02:44:05]

nothingman:

I type mysql -u mythtv -p mythconverg and it gives me the password prompt, where I type the password and then I'm rejected

[02:44:08]

opello_ is now known as opello

[02:44:24]

quink:

nothingman: did you add the mythtv users to mysql?

[02:45:03]

nothingman:

no, quink, I didn't

[02:45:07]

nothingman:

how do I?

[02:45:10]

quink:

thats probably your problem.

[02:45:15]

quink:

um i forgot let me look it up

[02:45:26]

nothingman:

couldn't find anything in the mysql* man pages that seemed to do it

[02:45:38]

quink:

http://www.bigbold.com/snippets/posts/show/1876

[02:45:43]

adante:

yeah it's a little.. estoeric

[02:45:59]

quink:

though you probably want to just give priveleges just for the mythtv database to the user.

[02:46:26]

quink:

any of you use vlc to stream video?

[02:47:13]

adante:

nothingman: are you able to access mythconverg as root user (eg mysql mythconverg) ?

[02:47:15]

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[02:47:39]

nothingman:

adante: yes, I am

[02:48:11]

stormy|:

hm.. I may have figured out my problem :)

[02:49:56]

adante:

nothingman: so sounds like that user entry is mucked up

[02:50:08]

nothingman:

adante: how to fix?

[02:50:32]

adante:

nothingman: have you tried accessing it remotely?

[02:51:02]

Ediehow:

isn't there a script to fix the sql for myth?

[02:51:08]

nothingman:

adante: trying to enable it to be accessed throughout the network

[02:51:55]

nothingman:

adante: I have been able to access it locally from a term window and remotely from SSH (which I assume to mysql is the same) as root user

[02:52:20]

adante:

nothingman: right, but are you able to test it from a remote box on the subnet, directly (not via ssh)?

[02:52:49]

nothingman:

adante: since I'm on Ubuntu (both machines) I wouldn't be sure how to do that

[02:54:04]

adante:

nothingman: from the remote box, mysql --host=mythbbox -umythtv -p mythconverg

[02:54:07]

adante:

i *think*

[02:54:08]

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[02:54:21]

nothingman:

adante: tried it

[02:55:02]

nothingman:

whoops

[02:55:06]

nothingman:

guess I didn't really

[02:55:17]

nothingman:

that worked

[02:57:41]

nothingman:

OK

[02:57:58]

nothingman:

since mythtv-database didn't install correctly, how do I set up mythtv-database on that comp?

[02:59:07]

adante:

mmm, setting up remote frontends is beyond my experience, sorry

[02:59:38]

ender_EE:

you don't install a database on frontend-only machines

[02:59:41]

adante:

at a guess you should be able to follow the docs and run mythtv-setup

[03:02:28]

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[03:24:11]

Mazz:

anyone know why when i go to mythvideo in mythweb and click something it says "not found" ?

[03:24:48]

hads:

That's the entire message?

[03:25:52]

Mazz:

wait trying one thing

[03:27:15]

Mazz:

seams to be setup for wrong directory

[03:27:27]

Mazz:

The requested URL /mythweb/data/video/Movies/******************** was not found on this server.

[03:27:30]

kormoc:

Mazz, it mythweb on the same host as your frontend?

[03:28:09]

Mazz:

you mean like frontendackend?

[03:28:13]

Mazz:

ifso Yes.

[03:28:30]

Ediehow:

hi kormoc

[03:28:33]

Ediehow:

can you help me?

[03:28:52]

kormoc:

Mazz, then yes, it could be the wrong path. just link the movie's folder in your mythweb dir to your mythvideo's dir

[03:28:54]

Mazz:

dont seam to see a setting to change directory

[03:29:02]

kormoc:

Ediehow, with what?

[03:29:07]

Mazz:

:O

[03:29:10]

Mazz:

o ok

[03:29:25]

hads:

Mazz: There should be a link in the mthweb data dir

[03:30:11]

Mazz:

??

[03:30:39]

Ediehow:

i can't control volume in myth

[03:30:43]

Ediehow:

but i can in every other application

[03:31:00]

kormoc:

did you compile myth yourself?

[03:35:15]

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[03:35:37]

Ediehow:

no

[03:35:41]

Ediehow:

it used to work, i am not sure what is wrong

[03:35:51]

Ediehow:

i mean, i can control it from every other application, including aumix

[03:36:03]

Ediehow:

currently aumix -W 50% works, for instance

[03:36:23]

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[03:36:27]

kormoc:

strange

[03:36:39]

jasoncohen01_:

adante: So, is IE programmed to stream video files (mpg, wmv, avi) rather than download them completely beforehand?

[03:36:49]

Ediehow:

kormoc: i can't figure out what to do:(

[03:36:55]

Ediehow:

no one on forums knows, either, apparently

[03:37:03]

Ediehow:

does anyone remember that script you can run to fix myth mysqldb?

[03:37:40]

hads:

mysqlcheck -u $USER [-p] --auto-repair mythconverg

[03:38:41]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: i have the same problem

[03:38:48]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: changing the volume in mythtv does nothing

[03:38:50]

Ediehow:

jasoncohen01_: ?

[03:38:56]

Ediehow:

jasoncohen01_: does it work in other programs?

[03:39:12]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: yeah, i've never had an issue setting the volume in other programs

[03:39:52]

Ediehow:

jasoncohen01_: did myth just start doing this?

[03:40:00]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: but isn't the volume in mythtv only for myth. It doesn't affect the system.

[03:40:13]

Ediehow:

well, it's using pcm

[03:40:15]

Ediehow:

or whatever

[03:40:16]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: i don't remember it ever working. Mute doesn't work either, if I recall correctly.

[03:42:10]

Ediehow:

same for me

[03:42:13]

Ediehow:

both used to work fine

[03:42:15]

Ediehow:

i have no idea what to do

[03:44:42]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01_, there's a toggle to set myth to use the system volumn or it's own, you want it set to use the system volumn

[03:44:59]

Ediehow:

i tried both

[03:45:08]

Ediehow:

it still won't change the volume

[03:45:38]

Ediehow:

hads: seeing as i forgot my root password for mysql, can i execute an sql statement to repair db?

[03:46:02]

kormoc:

REPAIR TABLE blah;

[03:46:05]

Ediehow:

ok

[03:46:09]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: i set it to system volume and tested with PCM and MASTER

[03:46:12]

jasoncohen01_:

neither did anything

[03:46:34]

Ediehow:

kormoc: that's a table, not a db?

[03:46:45]

kormoc:

it could be that the version of alsa myth was packaged with and the version you have in your kernel are mismatched

[03:46:55]

kormoc:

Ediehow, yes, need to run it for each table;

[03:47:58]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: are you using internal volume controls or not?

[03:48:32]

Ediehow:

jasoncohen01_: i tried both:O

[03:53:14]

hads:

Or mysqlcheck will do a REPAIR TABLE for a whole database for you.

[03:53:33]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: i'm having the same issue as you

[03:53:44]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: i tried with and without, with PCM and with MASTER, and used different audio devices

[03:54:11]

Ediehow:

hads: right, but i forgot my root password

[03:54:42]

hads:

So you can't do either then. Google mysql reset root password

[03:55:11]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: you think it has something to do with the myth db?

[03:55:37]

Ediehow:

hads: well, it's already placed in some other apps:O

[03:55:38]

Ediehow:

:)

[03:55:48]

Ediehow:

or wait, can my myth user repair the db?

[03:55:54]

Ediehow:

jasoncohen01_: i have no idea

[03:56:14]

hads:

jasoncohen01_: No, it doesn't.

[03:56:29]

hads:

Ediehow: It depends what permissions your mythtv user has, possibly.

[03:57:14]

jasoncohen01_:

hads: any idea what is causing the sound issue?

[03:57:16]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: me too

[03:57:26]

jasoncohen01_:

Ediehow: if you set the wrong sound device, you get nothing- obviously :)

[03:57:38]

Ediehow:

well, i use ALSA:default

[03:57:40]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: i tried setting it to /dev/dsp1 to see what would happen. I got silence

[03:57:53]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01_, have you tried setting it to a alsa device?

[03:59:49]

hads:

ALSA:default

[03:59:50]

Ediehow:

ALSA:default

[04:00:04]

hads:

And default for the mixer

[04:00:32]

Ediehow:

i wish i could get some debug junk

[04:00:36]

Ediehow:

to see if perhaps i can do it that way

[04:00:41]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: i don't see ALSA:default

[04:00:56]

hads:

So type it...

[04:00:56]

kormoc:

jasoncohen01_, you need to type it in by hand

[04:00:58]

Mazz:

ok

[04:01:00]

Mazz:

got it

[04:01:01]

Mazz:

nvm all

[04:01:43]

Ediehow:

right now i have audio output device ALSA:default, passthrough output device Default, and no boxes checked under that

[04:01:47]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: ah, ok

[04:03:47]

Ediehow:

kormoc: is there any reason that would be a bad audio setup for me?

[04:04:07]

Ediehow:

would aggressive sound card buffering fix anything related to that?

[04:04:34]

kormoc:

doubtful

[04:04:49]

Ediehow:

i am running mythtv as root right now, volume changes still doing nothing

[04:07:04]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: tried with Alsa:default, Default, internal sound countrol, /dev/mixer with PCM and with MASTER

[04:07:08]

jasoncohen01_:

i also tried with /dev/mixer1

[04:07:18]

jasoncohen01_:

i got sound in every case, but i couldn't change the volume

[04:07:34]

kormoc:

welp, you've heard what I think it is

[04:08:23]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: how would i check for a mismatch in alsa versions?

[04:08:45]

kormoc:

you can't really

[04:09:25]

Ediehow:

kormoc: what do you think it is?

[04:10:06]

Mazz:

is v0.21 mythvideo going to have a streaming app built in?

[04:10:12]

Mazz:

*mythweb

[04:10:13]

kormoc:

Mazz, no

[04:10:27]

kormoc:

if you write it, perhaps

[04:10:44]

jasoncohen01_:

any ETA on 0.21?

[04:10:50]

Mazz:

naw

[04:10:54]

hads:

When it's ready

[04:11:25]

Ediehow:

kormoc: ?

[04:11:26]

kormoc:

Mazz, no, xris said there's some planned changes for 0.21 that would allow it much easier, but that's all waiting if they go in or not

[04:12:55]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: are you referring to the ASX streaming in the SVN release?

[04:13:23]

kormoc:

no, I'm talking about auto transcoding/flash video playback in mythweb

[04:14:00]

Mazz:

ah ok

[04:14:12]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc: oh, that would be cool

[04:14:17]

jasoncohen01_:

thanks for clarifying

[04:14:28]

Ediehow:

kormoc: you said you said what you think it is, what do you think it is?

[04:14:29]

Ediehow:

in my case?

[04:14:44]

jasoncohen01_:

kormoc> it could be that the version of alsa myth was packaged with and the version you have in your kernel are mismatched

[04:14:55]

kormoc:

Ediehow, alsa mismatch between what myth was compiled with and what your kernel is using

[04:16:01]

Ediehow:

kormoc: but wouldn't i be able to get around that if i told myth not to use alsa?

[04:16:16]

kormoc:

Ediehow, maybe, maybe not

[04:16:36]

kormoc:

depends on the oss emulation layer being active and working correctly and all that jazz

[04:16:46]

Ediehow:

sheesh

[04:16:48]

Ediehow:

what am i supposed to do?

[04:16:55]

Ediehow:

i've never had this problem before in myth

[04:17:01]

Ediehow:

not for the several years i've used it

[04:17:14]

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[04:18:43]

Ediehow:

SHEESH

[04:18:54]

Ediehow:

and the same stupid thing

[04:21:50]

Delemas:

The new firmware update (in the last two weeks) supposedly allows Rogers cable customers to access the firewire port of HD cable boxes. Anyone got recording working with MythTV?

[04:22:20]

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[04:27:56]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[04:31:27]

Mazz:

http://jochensserver.dyndns.org/mythweb/video

[04:31:27]

Mazz:

wow.

[04:31:29]

Mazz:

not mine

[04:31:32]

Mazz:

but lol.

[04:31:50]

Mazz:

thats the mythstreamTv guys

[04:33:56]

Mazz:

ill email him and let him know its open

[04:35:29]

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[04:44:31]

Agrajag-:

good of you to paste it here

[04:44:49]

autojack:

I've got one tv show that consistently gets false commercial flags added to it. it has no commercials ever (PBS show) so I've turned off flagging for it. is there any way I can disable the flags in existing episodes I have recorded?

[04:45:01]

autojack:

they're really annoying to watch with it skipping legit content.

[04:45:08]

autojack:

can't find anything about this on the mailing list

[04:45:19]

Agrajag-:

oh.. hah.. i see why you pasted it now

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[05:09:04]

hads:

The last post in this thread may be of interest to those that couldn't get Alsa volume control working; http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/92256

[05:11:52]

hads:

My desktop (which I test with occasionally) couldn't control volume and the reason was the same as that last post, no Master channel.

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[05:38:15]

WZ__:

anyone using mythgame? i have romdb data in my db but i can never get it to recognize any game information for my roms.

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[05:51:27]

madCoder`:

anyone know how to fix a problem with crackling audio on DVB/ATSC HD sources? It only happens in mythfrontend — I can schedule it to record, and play the mpeg file via mplayer with no problems, and I can play directly via mplayer dvb://CHANNEL_NAME, with no problems.

[05:51:48]

madCoder`:

it happens when playing back the same recording that mplayer can handle, or when viewing LiveTV

[05:53:48]

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[05:54:08]

WZ__:

i get pausing when viewing HD LiveTV from dvb but it usually only happens in the first 15 seconds

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[06:15:11]

madCoder`:

WZ__, how bad? mine is not viewable

[06:15:40]

madCoder`:

and no matter how long i let the recorded HDTV play, its always crackling

[06:16:10]

madCoder`:

i recompiled with a higher interrupt frequency to see if that would help, and at 1000Hz, its still the same

[06:16:16]

madCoder`:

(the kernel that is)

[06:16:43]

WZ__:

acceptable and no audio cracking

[06:16:55]

WZ__:

maybe try another sound card?

[06:17:10]

madCoder`:

would that affect it? even though it plays fine in mplayer?

[06:17:25]

WZ__:

yeah thats weird :)

[06:17:35]

WZ__:

you try all of the mythtv-setup audio options?

[06:18:15]

madCoder`:

not all of them, i've played with a few, but i'm not sure which ones to target specifically

[06:19:25]

madCoder`:

i'm not sure if its audio or video related for that matter... but since i can at least see some skewed version of a picture, and i get no resemblance of audio that i can understand, i'd guess that it's audio related

[06:19:50]

madCoder`:

but again, in mplayer, the video and audio both sound fine.

[06:20:54]

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[06:21:13]

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[06:21:50]

WZ__:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/ . . . layer;#97932

[06:33:50]

amrit|afk is now known as amrit

[06:35:52]

WZ__:

alright! only took 3 days to figure out why my mame games wouldnt scan. stupid permissions problem

[06:36:18]

Ediehow:

i wish i could figure out why i can't control the volume in mythtv

[06:38:39]

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[06:40:06]

hads:

Ediehow: I posted a link for you to look at earlier

[06:40:22]

Ediehow:

hads: i must have missed it:(

[06:40:43]

hads:

The last post in this thread may be of interest to those that couldn't get Alsa volume control working; http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/92256

[06:40:47]

WZ__:

edie: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/ . . . trol;#241060

[06:42:54]

hads:

The gist of that post is that Also output doesn't seem to work if your soundcard doesn't have a Master channel.

[06:43:06]

hads:

erm s/Also/Alsa/

[06:43:31]

Ediehow:

so what is the solution?

[06:43:51]

hads:

You won't get spoon fed, read the link.

[06:44:17]

madCoder`:

WZ__, that's a similar situation, except that it only happens with hdtv sources – that thread is mostly about sd recordings (minus one post about hd)

[06:44:26]

Ediehow:

hads: i did

[06:44:38]

Ediehow:

it's dealing with ALSA:default specifically

[06:45:12]

madCoder`:

i'm able to get a nice smooth video playback when i use xvmc, but the audio is still nothing but basically constant stutter. its not like its distorting the audio, its just a repetitive "cracking" sound

[06:45:23]

Ediehow:

YAY!

[06:45:24]

Ediehow:

i got it

[06:45:37]

madCoder`:

with prebuffering pause messages to the console

[06:46:06]

madCoder`:

the Playback settings say that enabling extra audio buffering should fix that, but it doesn't

[06:46:10]

Ediehow:

thanks hads

[06:46:15]

Ediehow:

ALSA:default for mixer fixed it

[06:46:43]

hads:

NO! That wasn't the solution. And besides, that was suggested hours ago.

[06:46:50]

Ediehow:

no, that wasn't suggested for the mixer

[06:46:55]

Ediehow:

that was suggested for the device

[06:47:05]

Ediehow:

hads: that was the solution for me, captain

[06:47:12]

hads:

Yes, it was. Mixer should be "default" not "ALSA:default"

[06:47:27]

Ediehow:

hads: it just started working after I put ALSA:default for mixer, sir

[06:47:46]

hads:

Yes, it may have, but it's still incorrect. It should be default.

[06:47:47]

Ediehow:

and i have to do master not pcm

[06:48:30]

Ediehow:

ok, "Default" does not work

[06:49:01]

Ediehow:

ok, "default" works, too

[06:49:11]

Ediehow:

but not "Default"

[06:49:47]

Ediehow:

the main thing is Master instead of PCM

[06:51:21]

hads:

15:00:31 < hads> And default for the mixer

[06:51:40]

hads:

That was nearly 4 hours ago :)

[06:51:42]

Ediehow:

hads: as i mentioned

[06:51:47]

Ediehow:

PCM was also an issue

[06:51:50]

Ediehow:

PCM used to work

[06:51:59]

Ediehow:

now you must put Master

[06:52:12]

hads:

No, now *you* must put Master

[06:52:22]

Ediehow:

uhh

[07:01:37]

madCoder`:

it seems to be only AC3 audio

[07:01:48]

madCoder`:

and i just haven't seen mythtv play any ac3 audio stream successfully yet

[07:02:41]

Ediehow:

hads: no, you!

[07:07:46]

WZ__:

how can you tell if the current channel uses ac3? i can check to see if any of mine use it

[07:08:31]

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[07:10:31]

madCoder`:

WZ__, when in mythfrontend, and i go to play back a stream, it says:

[07:10:33]

madCoder`:

AFD: Opened codec 0x820e070,

[07:10:33]

madCoder`:

id(MPEG2VIDEO_XVMC) type(Video)

[07:11:07]

madCoder`:

(that's printed to the console)

[07:12:19]

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[07:12:25]

madCoder`:

the wiki suggests NvAGP 1 or 2. would that have any effect? from what i can tell, it has nothing to do with video, because the video playback looks great, even in mythtv (now)

[07:12:50]

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[07:13:15]

madCoder`:

but mythtv's audio codec simply isn't putting out anything intelligible

[07:13:46]

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[07:16:11]

WZ__:

my HD chans use AC3

[07:16:46]

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[07:18:46]

madCoder`:

hmm

[07:19:03]

madCoder`:

just ran across a forum message saying he disabled ac3 and dts passthrough... /me checks

[07:21:41]

madCoder`:

wow, that was it :D

[07:21:58]

madCoder`:

WZ__, thanks for trying :)

[07:23:06]

** madCoder` puts this on the wiki ;x **

[07:28:24]

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[07:47:39]

juski:

morning all

[07:50:40]

hads:

lo juski

[07:50:56]

juski:

!trout hads

[07:50:56]

** MythLogBot slaps hads with a trout on behalf of juski... **

[07:51:08]

juski:

hahaha my bad

[07:51:17]

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[07:51:33]

hads:

:)

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[08:12:15]

justinh:

bah! not a good start to the day

[08:14:16]

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[08:18:47]

IamEthos_:

is there anything for mythtv that will help myth descramble analog cable channels that are scrambled?

[08:19:24]

hads:

No, naughty.

[08:19:58]

IamEthos_:

hads, well, I'm more interested in watching the Sopranos and Entourage for free

[08:20:07]

hads:

No, naughty.

[08:20:41]

IamEthos_:

hads, yeah, you said that.

[08:21:23]

justinh:

IamEthos_: change the subject, pronto please

[08:21:54]

IamEthos_:

justinh, no problem. Is that something that's absolutely not to be discussed here?

[08:22:00]

IamEthos_:

should be in the topic.

[08:22:07]

visit0r:

IamEthos_: it's illegal to discuss that kind of stuff in US

[08:22:08]

justinh:

discussing illegal stuff is *absolutely* off-topic allowed in here

[08:22:15]

justinh:

eh?

[08:22:20]

justinh:

it's off-limits

[08:22:25]

justinh:

and it'

[08:22:27]

visit0r:

oh, that too :)

[08:22:30]

IamEthos_:

visit0r, I don't know if it's illegal to discuss it

[08:22:33]

justinh:

it's in the FAQ if you care to read it

[08:22:37]

IamEthos_:

may be illegal to do it

[08:22:52]

justinh:

IamEthos_: just drop it

[08:23:01]

IamEthos_:

justinh, it's dropped.

[08:23:23]

visit0r:

oh, I thought there was some kind DMCA thing in US which they also try to push to us in EU

[08:23:57]

justinh:

no, it's just that mythtv doesn't support illegal descrambling methods

[08:24:13]

IamEthos_:

justinh, and that's understandable

[08:24:17]

justinh:

if you want to unscramble pay-tv, do it with the proper *hardware*

[08:24:19]

visit0r:

yep

[08:25:05]

IamEthos_:

I mean, with the big media companies already coming after products like myth, and more importantly the hardware that makes it useful, you guys have to play ball on somethings.

[08:25:18]

visit0r:

that is true

[08:25:39]

justinh:

as a consumer *you* have a legal obligation to obey the laws of your own country

[08:25:51]

justinh:

and we do nothing to encourage illegal activity

[08:26:58]

IamEthos_:

would the myth project simply dissolve if suddenly recording television, even for personal backup, became illegal?

[08:27:16]

justinh:

who can possibly say

[08:27:27]

justinh:

that's very unlikely though

[08:27:30]

IamEthos_:

(shrug) you seem to speak for Myth

[08:27:34]

IamEthos_:

well, I hope so

[08:27:52]

visit0r:

well I think mythtv at its current state breaks some software patent law, at least in US, not sure about that though... :I

[08:27:53]

IamEthos_:

though there are plenty of companies that would love to see that.

[08:28:16]

IamEthos_:

visit0r, no, I'm pretty sure mythtv is 100% legal in the us

[08:28:18]

justinh:

visit0r: not at all

[08:28:42]

visit0r:

are you sure?

[08:29:12]

IamEthos_:

visit0r, I don't know if my professor would allow mythtv to be a part of a class project I'm doing if it wasn't.

[08:29:14]

justinh:

playing dvds in linux is technically illegal everywhere, but there's nothing in the mythtv source that allows playing back encrypted DVDs

[08:29:30]

IamEthos_:

justinh, wait, really?

[08:29:38]

IamEthos_:

you can't play DVDs in Linux?

[08:29:44]

IamEthos_:

(legally)?

[08:29:45]

justinh:

nor MP3s

[08:29:50]

IamEthos_:

that's pretty much horse shit

[08:29:53]

hads:

Encrypted DVD's that is.

[08:29:55]

justinh:

some linux distros pay their dues

[08:29:57]

IamEthos_:

justinh, MP3s, too?

[08:30:01]

justinh:

yep

[08:30:09]

IamEthos_:

wow

[08:30:09]

justinh:

mp3 is patented

[08:30:12]

IamEthos_:

yay for OGG

[08:30:20]

visit0r:

how about mpeg2 patents etc?

[08:30:26]

justinh:

fuzzy

[08:30:28]

visit0r:

mp3 patents?

[08:30:30]

IamEthos_:

justinh, and the patent says "no using mp3 with linux"?

[08:30:43]

justinh:

the patent says pay a licence fee or don't use it

[08:30:47]

IamEthos_:

how long does that mp3 patent have left?

[08:31:00]

justinh:

it's not *that* old

[08:31:05]

visit0r:

hmm isn't decoding/encoding those part of ffmpeg included in mythtv sources?

[08:31:11]

IamEthos_:

justinh, I thought that the fee was only required to build the codec into your application?

[08:32:21]

justinh:

well, think about it this way – you buy some software from a company, then decide to give it away to people for free... that'd be naughty

[08:32:25]

hads:

I don't have a good understanding of patents in an International sense.

[08:32:47]

justinh:

why do you think ubuntu doesn't play dvds or mp3s out of the box ?

[08:33:21]

visit0r:

hmm I thought this was only for DVDs, that mp3s work..

[08:33:25]

justinh:

this isn't getting around the fact that software patents are evil, though

[08:33:38]

visit0r:

anyways ffmpeg contains quite many codec implementations which contain software patents

[08:33:40]

IamEthos_:

justinh, maybe not evil

[08:33:45]

visit0r:

justinh: couldn't agree more

[08:33:46]

justinh:

yes evil

[08:33:52]

IamEthos_:

but they should be under much different terms than regular patents

[08:33:59]

IamEthos_:

20 years in software is an eternity

[08:34:02]

hads:

No, they shouldn't exist

[08:34:11]

IamEthos_:

3 years might be reasonable

[08:34:24]

IamEthos_:

hads, why do you say that?

[08:34:28]

justinh:

you shouldn't be able to patent anything under such a vague description

[08:35:07]

IamEthos_:

I think that software patents have some inconsistencies that need to be addressed

[08:35:17]

hads:

I'm not going to get into such politics though, especially in this channel and on a Friday night here.

[08:35:23]

justinh:

heh

[08:35:23]

IamEthos_:

it you patent a device, you need to tell everyone how it works so that they can learn from it

[08:35:40]

justinh:

IamEthos_: that's why people have to pay licence fees

[08:35:54]

IamEthos_:

with software, no one holds the companies responsible for providing the source for users to learn from

[08:36:10]

IamEthos_:

I think that patents are acceptable if you provide the source code

[08:36:21]

justinh:

it's not even about whether the software is closed source or not

[08:36:29]

IamEthos_:

closed source software should not be allowed to be patented

[08:36:59]

IamEthos_:

because there is no way for me to tell exactly how something is accomplished based on a binary executable

[08:36:59]

justinh:

I've seen one example of how a codec should be patented – it's called Dirac

[08:37:14]

hads:

I'm think I might get a beer. Oo, maybe I should patent that idea.

[08:37:41]

visit0r:

I'm not going to pay licensing fees for breaking that patent later today ;-)

[08:39:16]

justinh:

what the BBC have done with Dirac is patent it to protect it from commercial exploitation

[08:39:42]

justinh:

but kept it open source & free to use

[08:40:13]

justinh:

all with the intention of making it widely used & accepted – IMHO a brilliant idea

[08:40:38]

visit0r:

that's better, but still not perfect as it still limits its wide use... totally unpatented would be better (like Vorbis, etc.)

[08:41:00]

justinh:

no, because I could come along & patent the ideas behind ogg vorbis

[08:41:24]

visit0r:

not really, I think it's called prior art or something

[08:41:35]

justinh:

yeah but you need money to fight to prove prior art

[08:41:45]

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[08:41:48]

visit0r:

that's true... :I

[08:41:57]

justinh:

he with the most powerful lawyers wins

[08:42:04]

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[08:42:12]

justinh:

that's why software patents are so wrong in so many cases

[08:42:52]

justinh:

the little guy in the back room can't afford to fight the big multinational who came along & patented what he started doing 5 years ago

[08:43:58]

visit0r:

well the whole justice system is wrong if we look it like this, fortunately it's not so far here in Finland at least (money=more 'justice')

[08:44:29]

justinh:

and IIRC, Europe has chosen the sensible route

[08:45:09]

justinh:

ooo it looks like my mythvideo patch might be working! :)

[08:45:20]

visit0r:

what did you add?

[08:45:20]

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[08:45:45]

justinh:

something to add a background screen to the gallery view in mythvideo

[08:46:12]

visit0r:

ok, I use the filesystem view

[08:46:22]

justinh:

it built first time, and with the new theme element it complains a file is missing – which means it's trying to load it

[08:46:30]

justinh:

:)

[08:46:55]

justinh:

I deliberately made the filename it looks for one that doesn't exist

[08:47:07]

IamEthos_:

my group is doing a home media center project that's going to rely on myth a bit.

[08:47:20]

IamEthos_:

also some other things

[08:47:48]

justinh:

other things?

[08:48:15]

IamEthos_:

our idea is a powerful media management system that makes music and video accessible easily from within the home network and over the internet.

[08:48:38]

IamEthos_:

myth will be used to control the home televisions, and for in home media

[08:48:59]

IamEthos_:

and then we are looking for streaming solutinos for when users are off of the home network

[08:49:12]

justinh:

I wonder how many commercial enterprises pay their licence fees to fraunhofer & macrovision

[08:49:29]

justinh:

the ones selling ready-made mythboxen ...

[08:49:43]

justinh:

IamEthos_: sounds er... legally contentious

[08:49:55]

IamEthos_:

justinh, contentious?

[08:50:04]

justinh:

'over the internet'

[08:50:41]

IamEthos_:

what's wrong with that/

[08:50:59]

IamEthos_:

if I'm in class using my laptop, my music on my personal server at home should be available to me still

[08:51:20]

justinh:

plenty. funny thing, but broadcasters & media companies might not want their content streamed to all & sundry

[08:51:37]

cesman:

you should be paying attention to class

[08:52:07]

IamEthos_:

justinh, well I agree that it should be done in a way that is secure

[08:52:12]

justinh:

placeshifting is only deemed as ok up to now I think, because nobody has contested it

[08:52:35]

IamEthos_:

requiring at least some sort of authentication to access the streams

[08:53:06]

IamEthos_:

cesman, what about when I'm waiting at the airport?

[08:53:19]

IamEthos_:

or hanging out at a boring family party

[08:53:34]

cesman:

I see nothing wrong w/ your argument

[08:53:54]

justinh:

nor do I, but content providers might view it differently

[08:54:09]

IamEthos_:

I have free wireless internet access on campus, what if I want access to several gigs of my music from my PDA?

[08:54:15]

cesman:

_your_ media should be available to you, where ever you want it

[08:54:20]

** justinh rushes off to patent this idea **

[08:54:24]

justinh:

muhahahaha

[08:54:31]

** IamEthos_ kills justinh **

[08:54:43]

IamEthos_:

cesman, I agree

[08:54:56]

** justinh demands a one-off licence fee of $50,000 plus $5.00 per unit **

[08:55:11]

IamEthos_:

I'm waiting for an internet based television provider so that I can even take my television provider along with me.

[08:55:36]

cesman:

mythtv + mythstreamtv

[08:55:38]

cesman:

problem solved

[08:55:40]

cesman:

hads:

IPTV?

[08:56:54]

cesman:

lets face it, no media company/provider is going to get it right

[08:57:23]

IamEthos_:

uggh

[08:57:25]

cesman:

it is up to the individual

[08:57:28]

justinh:

there just isn't enough constant bandwidth in most scenarios yet

[08:57:46]

IamEthos_:

another one of my class projects is killing me tonight.

[08:57:55]

cesman:

thankfully, projects like MythTV exist

[08:59:13]

IamEthos_:

I just want to live in a world where I have access to my devices, and my data no matter where I am, wirelessly

[08:59:57]

IamEthos_:

I don't like the idea of wired internet access, it bugs me

[09:00:36]

IamEthos_:

unless it's for a server or something that never moves

[09:00:47]

** cesman doesn't care so long as he has high speed access **

[09:03:19]

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[09:07:36]

hads:

Heh, pricey; http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=959056

[09:18:16]

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[09:18:29]

justinh:

yeah well bitty, slow & generally crap networks bug me, so no wireless for me :)

[09:19:08]

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[09:19:08]

doc_:

hi there

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[09:45:04]

justinh:

morning rsdvd

[09:45:21]

rsdvd:

Mornign justinh : how are you today?

[09:45:39]

justinh:

in very good fettle, thanks. you?

[09:46:06]

justinh:

trying to see if my mythvideo hack is worky or not

[09:46:20]

rsdvd:

Hung over :-) a freind was 'snowed in' yesterday...so we went to the pub for lunch....and left at 10:00 :-)

[09:46:34]

justinh:

hahah

[09:46:44]

justinh:

I need some of that but I'm skintos

[09:46:51]

rsdvd:

so am i now :-)

[09:48:19]

rsdvd:

I am completing on a house sale today – so I need to sober up ;-(

[09:48:26]

hads:

heh

[09:49:25]

rsdvd:

justinh : I still cannot get the S100 to start..........I cannot understand how it can suddenly 'die'

[09:50:22]

justinh:

hrm

[09:50:24]

justinh:

not good

[09:51:42]

rsdvd:

No – all I did was move it from the desk to the floor...then back again. Now it 'chrips' and don't do anything

[09:52:14]

rsdvd:

:-)

[09:52:38]

justinh:

"Image needs a name" – eh?

[09:52:47]

justinh:

hmm must be my patch needing some tweaking

[09:53:10]

justinh:

it's drawn something though

[09:53:20]

rsdvd:

what is the patch?

[09:53:41]

justinh:

to show a background element in the gallery view inside mythvideo

[09:54:39]

rsdvd:

ok :-) still no wiser but hey

[09:55:17]

justinh:

if you look at mepo-wide, you'll notice the thin line at the top of the screen underlining the screen titles, yes?

[09:55:53]

justinh:

the gallery view in mythvideo doesn't allowa themer to specify the background to maintain a consistent look

[09:56:03]

justinh:

but it soon might :)

[09:56:21]

rsdvd:

ok – I understand now! I think I need to install mepo-wide...never got round it it

[09:56:44]

justinh:

I still haven't

[09:56:50]

rsdvd:

:-)

[10:00:25]

justinh:

oh noes! I have to see if bittorrent works at work

[10:00:53]

rsdvd:

lol.....shhh don;t mention torrents in here

[10:02:58]

justinh:

only for downloading vmware images

[10:03:06]

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[10:03:32]

rsdvd:

:-)

[10:04:26]

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[10:05:32]

stuarta:

Merlin83b: morning!

[10:05:38]

Merlin83b:

Good morning :)

[10:06:19]

justinh:

mornign stuarta, Merlin83b. Happy friday!

[10:06:37]

Merlin83b:

Yay Friday :)

[10:06:42]

Merlin83b:

Counting down to beers...

[10:06:44]

stuarta:

morning!

[10:06:53]

Merlin83b:

All so enthusiastic today!

[10:06:55]

** stuarta is having a week or so off alcohol **

[10:07:13]

** justinh has hacked the mythvideo code & it compiled first time **

[10:07:21]

stuarta:

hehe :)

[10:07:34]

justinh:

not even a warning

[10:07:42]

justinh:

and no I didn't just change a comment ;)

[10:07:48]

clever:

[5]+ Bus error mythfrontend (wd: ~)

[10:07:50]

Merlin83b:

Heh, ncie one :)

[10:07:51]

stuarta:

finally got the bbc series link stuff committed last night

[10:07:54]

clever:

now what?:P

[10:07:55]

Merlin83b:

I like that kind of coding.

[10:08:06]

justinh:

YES!

[10:08:08]

stuarta:

clever: wait for another bus?

[10:08:09]

Merlin83b:

Wow, they're doing series link stuff already?

[10:08:11]

Merlin83b:

Awesome.

[10:08:12]

clever:

lol

[10:08:13]

** justinh dances around loudly **

[10:08:24]

Merlin83b:

(And more importantly, so is stuarta!)

[10:08:25]

clever:

i think it got upset because i was upgrading mythmusic thru make install

[10:08:30]

justinh:

ooo double YES!

[10:08:30]

clever:

while mythmusic was running

[10:08:34]

justinh:

nice one stuarta!

[10:08:42]

Merlin83b:

I'm svn updating now to try those db things we talked about. If I get that too, so much the better!

[10:08:43]

stuarta:

clever: that'll be the problem

[10:08:45]

justinh:

the gallery view now has a background element!!!!!

[10:08:48]

stuarta:

justinh: thanks,

[10:08:58]

stuarta:

also thanks to david who wrote the stuff...

[10:09:08]

clever:

stuarta: most linux programs open there files and use them and wont notice when i delete and put a new file in place

[10:09:17]

Merlin83b:

Thanks david, whoever you are :)

[10:09:33]

clever:

make install could have overwriten a file without changing its inode though which may have edited the mmaped area

[10:09:40]

stuarta:

clever: unless the pages required from a shared lib are on disk and you change the on disk copy

[10:09:49]

clever:

yeah

[10:10:08]

clever:

but if make install removed then installed it would make a new inode

[10:10:18]

clever:

and the old one wont actualy disapear till the file is closed

[10:10:26]

** stuarta celebrates justinh's first code!!! **

[10:10:41]

stuarta:

clever: it's about lazy lib loading

[10:11:08]

clever:

but id think they would have allready been loaded because it was mid song when it crashed

[10:11:22]

stuarta:

*shrug*

[10:11:32]

clever:

fixed now:)

[10:11:35]

** stuarta goes back to celebrating... **

[10:11:39]

clever:

lol

[10:11:59]

stuarta:

friday morning. time for happiness

[10:12:09]

clever:

yeah i didnt notice the day

[10:12:14]

hads:

Friday night actually :)

[10:12:26]

clever:

time flyes when your up all night and it messes up your internal clock:P

[10:12:39]

quicksil1er:

clever: make install won't overwrite files without changing inodes

[10:12:41]

clever:

its 6am on friday here

[10:12:43]

quicksil1er:

(FYI)

[10:13:10]

clever:

it would mainly depend on how it actualy installs the files

[10:13:20]

clever:

im guessing thru the install program

[10:13:35]

quicksil1er:

You can be confident I'm right

[10:13:37]

clever:

which could easily be modifyed to fix that in every install script

[10:13:40]

justinh:

there's a little bug-ette in my code – I've put the function call in the wrong place

[10:13:47]

quicksil1er:

I have never heard of an install program which does that, clever

[10:13:50]

quicksil1er:

it would be insane

[10:13:51]

quicksil1er:

(and slow)

[10:13:58]

clever:

yeah it would be slow

[10:14:00]

quicksil1er:

they always copy new files in place

[10:14:03]

justinh:

but it's proof of concept, which is making me pretttty ecstatic

[10:14:16]

justinh:

and as I said, it'll be about 20 lines of patch

[10:14:18]

** clever does some tests **

[10:15:03]

clever:

made 2 files and looked at the inodes

[10:15:09]

clever:

copyed 1 over the other

[10:15:12]

clever:

inodes didnt change:)

[10:15:40]

clever:

that would also keep hardlinks intact

[10:16:25]

quicksil1er:

erm it should keep the old inode

[10:16:25]

clever:

also getting these randomly

[10:16:26]

clever:

X Error: BadWindow (invalid Window parameter) 3

[10:16:35]

quicksil1er:

'inodes didn't change' could mean two things

[10:16:47]

clever:

i touched /tmp/a and /tmp/b

[10:17:02]

clever:

a was 1518082 and b was 1518457

[10:17:09]

clever:

i copyed b over a

[10:17:12]

clever:

and neither inode changed

[10:17:28]

quicksil1er:

hmm *thinks*

[10:17:32]

clever:

used ls -li to see the inodes

[10:17:34]

quicksil1er:

ok inodes are the wrong level of abstract

[10:17:41]

quicksil1er:

cp doesn't modify files in place

[10:17:48]

quicksil1er:

it links the old inode to the new file

[10:17:52]

quicksil1er:

hard links will not be intact

[10:18:02]

clever:

i was thinking that the mmap is linked to the inode more then the path

[10:18:10]

quicksil1er:

clever: neither

[10:18:16]

quicksil1er:

clever: it's mapped to the actual file

[10:18:28]

clever:

when i delete a file thats open

[10:18:35]

clever:

how does it know how to access the data?

[10:18:43]

clever:

id think it would go by the inode

[10:18:52]

clever:

and clean the inode up once its open 0 times

[10:19:11]

quicksil1er:

hmm I'm wrong about hard links

[10:19:12]

quicksil1er:

odd

[10:19:18]

quicksil1er:

I thought I understood this, now I'm confused

[10:19:27]

clever:

hardlinks have the same inode on the files

[10:19:36]

clever:

i think the filenames are linked to an inode

[10:19:51]

clever:

then the inode has the perms and mod times and points to the data

[10:20:44]

** quicksil1er shrugs **

[10:20:59]

quicksil1er:

I'm totally confused. I thought I understood it but I clearly don't. Don't have time to straighten it out in my head now though :)

[10:21:10]

clever:

lol

[10:21:19]

clever:

im going by logic and guesswork mainly

[10:21:57]

quicksil1er:

I was sure that cp a b was equivalent to rm b; cp a b

[10:22:06]

quicksil1er:

and I've seen a backup system which worked on that principle

[10:22:13]

quicksil1er:

so I must have got confused somewhere

[10:22:20]

clever:

or cp was changed

[10:23:18]

clever:

when i strace'ed cp it opened the files

[10:23:22]

quicksil1er:

hmm. I think that cp is reusing old inode numbers

[10:23:24]

clever:

then read/write'ed the data over

[10:23:48]

clever:

its just opening the existing file and inode for writing

[10:23:54]

clever:

then write()'ing the data in

[10:24:20]

quicksil1er:

yes, it opens it with O_TRUNC

[10:24:32]

quicksil1er:

odd, that' not what I thought it did

[10:25:11]

clever:

how would i compare a pair of mp3 files to see if they match?

[10:26:02]

clever:

my last idea was to decode and compare the raw wav tracks

[10:26:20]

clever:

posibly round the data off slightly to make up for encoding and decoding quality loss

[10:36:31]

** justinh dances again **

[10:36:50]

justinh:

gets funny looks from co-workers

[10:36:59]

stuarta:

cause england have remembered how to play cricket?

[10:37:29]

Scopeuk:

funny looks from co workers are normal

[10:37:30]

justinh:

cause I just got my code change to do exactly what I wanted it to do :)

[10:37:39]

stuarta:

woot!

[10:38:20]

justinh:

nothing special I don't think – since I only really copied & pasted. no major understanding of stuff took place

[10:38:26]

clever:

i sometimes write a large chunk of c++ and manage to get the thing to work and compile on the first try

[10:38:48]

Scopeuk:

clever its awsome when that happens whatever the language

[10:38:57]

quicksil1er:

clever: when that happens to me I have to sit down for a little while

[10:39:05]

quicksil1er:

have a glass of water

[10:39:14]

clever:

some of the programing languages dont have compile errors

[10:39:18]

** Scopeuk admits to only havigndone resonable amoutns of programmign in php and java **

[10:39:19]

clever:

some of them cant seg fault

[10:39:19]

quicksil1er:

(actually it happens notably more often of late, maybe I'm getting the hang of this)

[10:39:30]

clever:

mirc script is extremely easy for me now

[10:39:39]

Scopeuk:

quicksil1er sittin down and drinking water?

[10:39:46]

justinh:

this might be the start of something

[10:39:48]

quicksil1er:

Scopeuk: :)

[10:39:48]

clever:

i can write some complex stuff in it without looking at it and get it to work a good deal of the time

[10:40:01]

clever:

php is also easy

[10:40:08]

clever:

c++ is one of the more complex/harder languages i know

[10:40:16]

Scopeuk:

all i know is its musign when you write a piece of code for an examination in less than a 1/4 the time allocated it compiles and functions poperly first time

[10:40:20]

justinh:

put your epenises away guys

[10:40:21]

clever:

perl i learned then forgot

[10:40:41]

clever:

Scopeuk: lol

[10:41:01]

clever:

i spent what must have been 2 months on 1 program

[10:41:05]

clever:

but that might have been the 50mhz cpu's fault

[10:41:14]

clever:

qbasic 3d rendering program

[10:41:42]

clever:

takes sets of xyz cords and draws it on the 2d grey scale lcd panel

[10:41:51]

Scopeuk:

only ever used basic on anythign slower than a 2 ghz celeron

[10:42:01]

clever:

and optionaly connects the dots with lines or even fills them in with a set color

[10:42:04]

Scopeuk:

and that was on an 80's amstad

[10:42:14]

Scopeuk:

clever harder than t sounds

[10:42:46]

clever:

just filling in the things with a color was hard

[10:43:08]

clever:

had to make a formula to convert the xyz to xy and scale it properly based on my current xyz and screen res

[10:43:25]

clever:

then use that to get a set of xy's for drawing the lines between

[10:43:31]

clever:

make the lines in color a

[10:43:42]

clever:

then find the avg x and avg y

[10:43:48]

clever:

which should be roughtly centered

[10:44:02]

Scopeuk:

oh yeh its a dificult piece of code by comparison

[10:44:05]

clever:

then run the fill function on there using color b with the edges marked by color a

[10:44:26]

clever:

then redraw the edges in another color so they dont mess up the next polygon

[10:45:02]

clever:

i think it only supported 4 sided polygons

[10:45:17]

clever:

and nowadays thats all done in the gpu by i think firmware or directx drivers

[10:46:25]

clever:

my code didnt even support textures when i 'finished' it

[10:46:41]

clever:

each polygon was a single solid color

[10:47:01]

clever:

didnt even get arround to allow rotation

[10:47:06]

clever:

camera was stuck at a static angle

[10:47:23]

Scopeuk:

this is hte problm with coding now days creting something impressive is quite dificult its why there arnt as many young coders as there could be

[10:47:48]

clever:

i made the 3d rendering over the summer

[10:47:59]

justinh:

cp /usr/local/share/mythtv/themes/neon-wide/video-ui.xml /media

[10:48:01]

clever:

mostly at night when i should have been sleeping

[10:48:04]

justinh:

bum

[10:48:19]

Scopeuk:

clever doign somethign else whilst yo ushould be sleeping is normall

[10:48:26]

clever:

:P

[10:48:29]

clever:

its 6am right now

[10:48:33]

clever:

been up most of the night

[10:48:33]

justinh:

clever: so you're just the guy to rewrite the UI. be our guest

[10:48:54]

clever:

i wake up at 2pm-7pm some days

[10:49:05]

quicksil1er:

nod sure if we want a static angle solid colour 3D interface :P

[10:49:14]

clever:

lol

[10:49:22]

clever:

i got the theory on how to rotate

[10:49:34]

clever:

but the number variables in qbasic couldnt handle things that large

[10:49:44]

clever:

it could bearly square 3 numbers and sum them

[10:50:12]

clever:

using the depth and x i can find an x angle

[10:50:20]

clever:

then add/subtrack the camerys x angle

[10:50:35]

clever:

then a bit more math to convert it to an x based on its depth

[10:50:55]

clever:

would need to cover both points behind and infront though doubling the data it needs to process

[10:51:05]

clever:

since rotating can put points on the other side

[10:51:29]

justinh:

too much noise

[10:51:31]

clever:

and most of the programing languages i know arent good for graphics

[10:51:50]

clever:

php and gd would give horible frame rates

[10:51:56]

Scopeuk:

chuck all your data in a matrix trans and multiply thourgh bythe rotation matrix then re translate everythgn back to hwere it was

[10:52:10]

quicksil1er:

justinh: there are /commands to solve that :)

[10:52:10]

clever:

lol

[10:52:21]

clever:

/ignore?

[10:52:58]

Trentster (Trentster!n=Trike@dsl-243-187-07.telkomadsl.co.za) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:53:09]

Trentster:

hey all, Ive got the haupauge 150 and the silver remote, watching movies no volume control etc but I can skip forward and back and pause.....do I need to change default player to xine from mplayer

[10:53:41]

clever:

can you see dht stdout from xine?

[10:54:00]

clever:

its normaly going to the same place as the stdout of mythfrontend

[10:55:23]

Trentster:

clever, I dont know?

[10:55:33]

clever:

how are you starting mythfrontend?

[10:55:57]

rsdvd:

justinh : how much did you pay four S100 – I think I might need to buy another :-(

[10:55:57]

hads:

Yay for Internal player

[10:57:04]

Trentster:

clever, is that for me..or a previous convo?

[10:57:15]

clever:

Trentster:

[10:57:31]

Trentster:

clever, its autostarting on bootup...

[10:57:44]

clever:

are you redirecting it to any log files?

[10:58:09]

Trentster:

no

[10:58:28]

clever:

then you might not be seeing the error messages which could be usefull in fixing it

[10:58:36]

Trentster:

clever, sorry, maybe i should have mentioned i am using knoppmyth

[10:59:01]

clever:

i havent used that yet

[10:59:09]

hads:

What version of myth?

[11:00:01]

Scopeuk:

Trentster which version of knopmyth e50?

[11:00:10]

Trentster:

R5D1

[11:00:22]

Scopeuk:

ok d1 is 19.somthing

[11:00:35]

Scopeuk:

.19.something*

[11:01:38]

Trentster:

should I change default player to xine? its currently set to mplayer in the mythsetup

[11:02:01]

hads:

Mmm, upgrade, go Internal :)

[11:02:11]

Scopeuk:

upgradign knopmyth is trivial

[11:02:36]

Scopeuk:

use backup in knoppyth menu download latest iso burn and put inpc click upgrade

[11:04:01]

clever:

thats alot easyer compared to what i did with the source:P

[11:04:22]

Scopeuk:

any way gotta run lecture

[11:05:33]

Trentster:

I tried latest version did not work,, i think there is some conflict with my rig and xorg.... locks up when checking nvidia driver after install..

[11:05:42]

Trentster:

had to go to R5D1

[11:07:41]

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[11:08:16]

justinh:

rsdvd: about 30 squids apiece

[11:09:04]

rsdvd:

justinh : I have just fixed it :-) It was the DoM for some reason – without it it works fine

[11:09:32]

justinh:

plugged in the wrong way?

[11:09:39]

rsdvd:

justinh : although I might buy another anyway if I can get minmyth working :-)

[11:09:53]

rsdvd:

justinh : not suer – I think it only goes in one way

[11:10:12]

justinh:

don't think so – pretty sure it's justa pin header on the main board

[11:10:48]

rsdvd:

No – it has a lug on one side so it will only go in one way round

[11:11:02]

justinh:

gonna need to relearn how to use diff to make a patch file

[11:11:10]

stuarta:

svn dif

[11:11:12]

stuarta:

svn diff

[11:11:32]

hads:

Yeah, svn makes it easy

[11:11:52]

clever:

would svn diff also show updates i havent made yet?

[11:12:08]

clever:

so i could review the changes before doing svn update

[11:12:13]

hads:

Like, the future?

[11:12:22]

clever:

i mean ones allready commited by others

[11:12:32]

clever:

that i havent updated to my box yet

[11:13:30]

justinh:

http://www.pastebin.ca/346428

[11:14:31]

stuarta:

nice

[11:15:33]

justinh:

well not *all* other ones – just ones in mythtv & myththemes

[11:15:46]

clever:

you could modify the code to check that its missing

[11:15:51]

clever:

and if its missing not draw a bg

[11:16:06]

clever:

so the unpatched themes wont crash it

[11:17:01]

stuarta:

looks like it already does that, line 56....

[11:17:08]

stuarta:

and 57

[11:17:19]

clever:

ahh

[11:17:28]

clever:

im assuming get/set returns null on error then:)

[11:22:50]

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[11:23:05]

justinh:

ah so no nasty segfaults if it's missing :)

[11:23:19]

justinh:

seen some plugins do that when elements are omitted

[11:23:32]

clever:

lol

[11:23:50]

stuarta:

well hopefully, i'm also guessing that the function will return null if the element isn't there..

[11:23:51]

clever:

mythmusic and mythvideo segfault alot if i havent initialized the playlists

[11:26:05]

stuarta:

bugger. England beat Australia in the 1st final

[11:26:24]

clever:

ive just had a look at how the rating is set in mythmusic and im thinking if it was just a thumbs up/down button/option it might be simpler to use

[11:27:55]

rsdvd:

justinh : have you ever got the S100 to network boot using F12 ?

[11:32:08]

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[11:49:52]

justinh:

rsdvd: never tried it

[11:51:20]

rsdvd:

justinh : it just does nto seem to even send a dhcp req.....my dhcp server don;t even see it

[11:51:50]

quicksil1er is now known as quicksilver

[11:52:00]

** justinh tests the patch without the theme element present **

[11:52:13]

justinh:

I predict a segfault

[11:52:31]

gbee:

justinh: managed to add the background?

[11:52:42]

rsdvd:

justinh : what were yuo intending to use to boot minimyth?

[11:53:04]

gbee:

justinh: depends, some areas get that a theme element is present before trying to use it, others don't

[11:53:19]

justinh:

gbee: yeah it works :)

[11:53:31]

gbee:

if they don't check, then a segfault is the likely outcome :)

[11:53:32]

justinh:

rsdvd: a bootloader that then mounts an nfsroot

[11:53:43]

rsdvd:

but which bootloader?

[11:54:07]

justinh:

rsdvd: *a* bootloader

[11:54:44]

rsdvd:

LILO and Grub cannot boot off a network server (as far as I know)

[11:57:26]

justinh:

ooo yes they can

[11:57:31]

justinh:

grub can

[11:58:05]

rsdvd:

i did not know that – I was going to use etherboot etc

[11:58:41]

justinh:

it's just about as simple as changing the root mount point to an nfs one IIRC

[11:59:23]

justinh:

it depends on the kernel you're using having nfsroot built into it, obviously ;)

[11:59:50]

rsdvd:

It will be the NFS version of the miniyth I built earlier this week

[12:02:10]

justinh:

I'd imagine that has nfsroot in its kernel

[12:02:40]

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[12:03:19]

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[12:06:06]

justinh:

doesn't segfault :)

[12:06:27]

stuarta:

woot

[12:06:57]

justinh:

someone can look forward to seeing my patch!

[12:07:41]

stuarta:

ticket it and see what happens :)

[12:09:15]

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[12:09:28]

GreyFoxx:

what does the opatch do ?

[12:09:53]

justinh:

huh? I thought I had to have an account for trac to create a ticket.. and I thought I had an account

[12:09:53]

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[12:10:19]

dverzolla:

I'm getting sound sync problem with pvr-150. Has some option in mythtv where I can set audio parameters?

[12:10:25]

justinh:

GreyFoxx: allows a background theme element for the gallery view in mythvideo

[12:10:32]

GreyFoxx:

ahhh

[12:10:39]

justinh:

I've wanted it for ages, so it's on its way

[12:11:15]

justinh:

was either this or wear out my shoes stomping my feet til somebody wrote it :-P

[12:11:18]

dverzolla:

justinh: You know how to solve audio sync problem?

[12:12:03]

gbee:

if any of you lot are the ones outbidding me on Ebay for a Nova-T, please stop! :p

[12:12:27]

justinh:

dverzolla: you shouldn't get out of sync audio, ever – so no, no idea

[12:12:28]

clever:

lol

[12:12:30]

clever:

what is it?

[12:12:35]

clever:

the nova-t

[12:12:43]

gbee:

a DVB card

[12:12:48]

clever:

ahh

[12:13:04]

dverzolla:

justinh: You use pvr?

[12:13:05]

clever:

i only have 1 input card and its a frame grabber

[12:13:29]

justinh:

dverzolla: yes

[12:13:47]

justinh:

why the hell does my name keep being the one people use to ask direct questions in channel?!

[12:14:00]

gbee:

it's only worth £30 new – so I think 50–70% is a fair price second hand, but everyone else seems to think 125% is the right level

[12:14:09]

dverzolla:

justinh: you record audio from hauppauge input?

[12:14:10]

justinh:

gbee: arghhh

[12:14:13]

justinh:

dverzolla: yes

[12:14:14]

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[12:14:34]

dverzolla:

justinh: hmm.

[12:14:49]

dverzolla:

justinh: and your audio in syncronized?

[12:15:19]

gbee:

suppose I should do some input or DVB related work, then people would be offering me the cards free ;)

[12:15:25]

dverzolla:

justinh: when you record...

[12:19:36]

justinh:

I feel all nice & bouncy today

[12:19:57]

justinh:

dverzolla: I have never seen out of sync audio in mythtv

[12:20:03]

** stuarta accuses gbee of wishful thinking... **

[12:20:13]

dverzolla:

justinh: hm, I have a Pentium Duo with two pvr-150's

[12:20:39]

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[12:20:47]

justinh:

it's not unreasonable to assume that manufacturers / suppliers would give out free product – I mean mediaportal gets free stuff donated

[12:20:49]

** gbee pleads guilty but begs for a suspended sentence **

[12:21:00]

dverzolla:

sux :|

[12:21:56]

** stuarta orders gbee be pummelled with snowballs for 5 minutes **

[12:22:00]

gbee:

justinh: devs quite regularly get offered cards and hardware, but it's mostly those in North America who are working on that end of the code

[12:22:42]

gbee:

just the other day a guy was offering up two cards he no longer needed

[12:22:55]

justinh:

"this plugin is brought to you by spammerco, purveyors of hardware at rip-off prices since 1983"

[12:23:03]

Merlin83b2:

There should be a page on the wiki with what devs are working on what and what they need to do so.

[12:23:13]

justinh:

upnp hardware!

[12:23:25]

gbee:

I don't want to give the impression that I'm looking for handouts! It's just a joke born out of my frustration with ebay :)

[12:23:44]

Merlin83b2 is now known as Merlin83b

[12:24:18]

justinh:

I can shut my nx session down now

[12:24:49]

gbee:

Merlin83b2: yeah, unfortunately not much hardware is needed to test changes to mythmusic, mythfilldatabase or mythfrontend so I'd be out of luck there :p

[12:25:36]

justinh:

omg, this forum user was on about using a linux box as a firewire disk box for his windows laptop. I asked what's wrong with SAMBA & he replied "who?". tsck

[12:25:50]

justinh:

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzztttttttttt! goes the cattleprod

[12:26:55]

gbee:

hehe

[12:27:18]

** stuarta smacks his head against the table with the sheer lunacy of it... **

[12:28:49]

justinh:

dunno about hardware but we could do with some more cluebats over here

[12:29:09]

** Merlin83b donates cluebats to #mythtv-users **

[12:30:12]

** justinh hammers nails through the cluebats to make them better at making recipients more idea-absorbent **

[12:30:54]

** gbee ponders the footprints in the snow outside which look like Long John Silver passed by in the night **

[12:31:17]

gbee:

oh sorry, wandering off the subject there

[12:31:33]

stuarta:

topic wot topic?!?!?

[12:31:36]

justinh:

I feel very satisfied today in that I now officially practise what I preach

[12:31:47]

justinh:

[12:33:34]

dverzolla:

justinh: What bitrate you use for your recordings?

[12:33:40]

gbee:

oops, looks like I left my mp3 player on overnight, battery is dead

[12:40:11]

dverzolla:

justinh: When I set my bitrate to max, My sync problem is solved

[12:41:02]

justinh:

can't remember what bitrate I use – probably just the defaults

[12:42:56]

justinh:

I really should have read that ticket subject back more than once

[12:43:31]

gbee:

at least everyone knows you're referring to mythvideo

[12:43:37]

justinh:

lol

[12:43:54]

justinh:

my enthusiasm is not in question ;)

[12:48:02]

Agrajag-:

hmm.. anyone any idea why mytharchive is only creating ~675MB iso's instead of 4 gig.. i've tried both SP and HQ, both gave me ~675meg isos

[12:48:56]

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[12:50:24]

stuarta:

justinh: next time you should attach the diff with a .diff extension.

[12:50:33]

stuarta:

then it does pretty highlighting :)

[12:51:13]

justinh:

ahh

[12:51:20]

justinh:

cheers for that nugget

[12:51:55]

justinh:

probably mentions that somewhere I read a long time ago

[12:53:50]

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[13:01:41]

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[13:03:20]

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[13:03:42]

kambei:

If there are any Myth+HD users about, I am wondering what hardware you use for HD content.

[13:05:01]

gbee:

Agrajag-: probably a silly question, but what size is the source material?

[13:23:13]

dilano:

hey all, I have a issue , I am trying to install the svn myth, and keep running into the "cannot find lmysqlclient".. I have it installed.... any suggestions?

[13:25:56]

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[13:26:44]

stuarta:

dilano: you would be missing the headers. ie. installed the -dev or -devel version of the libs

[13:27:49]

dilano:

hmm, not as far as I know... looking in /usr/lib, I'm not even seeing the libmysqlclient.....

[13:29:11]

dilano:

looking, I have mysql-devel-5.0.21–1.fc6.i386 installed

[13:32:26]

dilano:

hmmmmmmm.....

[13:33:13]

dilano:

maybe reboot will cure the problem.. as I did install it after the first error

[13:34:03]

dilano:

thx for the reply stuarta

[13:34:09]

stuarta:

reboot won't help

[13:34:15]

dilano:

ohh

[13:34:18]

dilano:

damn

[13:34:21]

dilano:

ohs well

[13:34:27]

stuarta:

that's the windows solution

[13:34:31]

dilano:

so its missing the headers for mysql then?

[13:34:50]

stuarta:

in theory you should have them

[13:35:03]

stuarta:

rpm -q --list mysql-devel

[13:35:10]

stuarta:

should tell you where they all are.

[13:35:31]

dilano:

in theory communism should work.. in theory

[13:35:37]

stuarta:

btw. don't post the output...

[13:35:43]

dilano:

I won't :)

[13:37:24]

dilano:

hmm. usr/lib/mysql/libmysqlclient.so... thats what I need, correct?

[13:37:41]

dilano:

sym link it to usr/lib/lmysqlclient?

[13:38:03]

stuarta:

to me lmysqlclient looks like a typo

[13:38:20]

stuarta:

which version are you trying to compile?

[13:38:31]

dilano:

myth, latest svn

[13:38:33]

gbee:

run ldconfig?

[13:38:37]

dilano:

12759

[13:38:51]

stuarta:

gbee: you ever seen lmysqlclient? it's libmysqlclient...

[13:39:33]

gbee:

lmysqlclient is just the var name

[13:39:51]

dilano:

I had a error like that with lXxVU or something like that earlier with the mythtv compile....

[13:39:59]

gbee:

it should still be looking for libmysqlclient -

[13:40:26]

dilano:

turned out to be lookingn for just XxVU... or something along those lines

[13:41:09]

dilano:

didn't have the package installed.. after I installed, compiled just fine

[13:41:49]

dilano:

now with this problem.. no matter what I install... still a no go

[13:43:09]

gbee:

I'm not actually sure where it's pulled in, it's a QT dependancy isn't it?

[13:47:05]

gbee:

dilano: check the path to libmysqlclient is in /etc/ld.so.conf, run ldconfig, re-run ./configure and then compile

[13:47:38]

gbee:

if that doesn't work make clean (or even distclean) and try again

[13:50:30]

dilano:

actually no, it isn't.. just gives me: .../mysql/libmysqlclient.so.15 -> libmysqlclient.s.o.15.0.0

[13:52:18]

dilano:

looking at ld.so.conf.. I don't have any paths in there except /usr/local/lib

[13:52:36]

dilano:

and then one for my graphics card

[13:55:54]

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[14:12:12]

Dagmar:

That's all you need in there.

[14:12:21]

Dagmar:

You do not need libmysqlclient in your ld.so.conf

[14:12:55]

Dagmar:

Qt will pull it in, when needed, directly from the plugins directory.

[14:14:09]

dilano:

hmmm....

[14:14:15]

Dagmar:

Note that I say Qt will pull it in. Nothing from the qt/plugins directory is anything the _system's_ linker ever needs trouble itself with.

[14:14:43]

dilano:

so, would I be missing any QT packages then?

[14:15:10]

Dagmar:

Checking something

[14:15:12]

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[14:15:34]

dilano:

it seems to error out around the mythzoneminder package

[14:15:48]

dilano:

I believe that is new, correct?

[14:16:31]

Dagmar:

Okay, I got a bit mixed up there. You still don't need to manually touch /usr/lib/mysql/libmysqlclient.so. It should already have symlinks in /usr/lib

[14:16:44]

Dagmar:

We need to know what the specific error message is

[14:16:59]

** stuarta suggests disabling zoneminder plugin **

[14:18:13]

Dagmar:

Amazing how quiet some people get when you ask for specific error messages.

[14:18:36]

dilano:

so, the link needs to be in /usr/lib/lmysqlclient.so -LINKED-TO- /usr/lib/mysql/libmysqlclient.s.o.15.0.0 correct?

[14:18:46]

Dagmar:

I'm not saying shit until I see some specific error messages

[14:18:51]

dilano:

gotcha

[14:18:53]

dilano:

one sec

[14:19:06]

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[14:19:15]

** stuarta puts his fingers in his ears **

[14:19:23]

Dagmar:

Having just scrolled up I'd say at least half the problem has come from making people guess at the real issues

[14:19:35]

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[14:19:46]

dilano:

1st line: /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lmysqlclient

[14:19:52]

Dagmar:

pastebin.ca

[14:20:06]

dilano:

collect2": ld returned 1 exit status

[14:20:07]

** stuarta remembers saying the dev libraries weren't installed **

[14:20:18]

Dagmar:

stuarta would have been right

[14:20:56]

stuarta:

or not installed properly

[14:21:26]

Dagmar:

/usr/lib/libmysqlclient.so.14.0.0 and probably /usr/lib/libmysqlclient_r.so.14.0.0 should exist and should be pointing to actual libraries in /usr/lib/mysql, if things were installed properly.

[14:21:43]

dilano:

1 already installed 0 upgraded 0 removed

[14:21:44]

Dagmar:

If these files are missing, or their symlinks are missing, your package manager is crap

[14:21:53]

dilano:

doing a install mysql-devel

[14:21:59]

dilano:

using yum

[14:22:15]

Dagmar:

IF you "think" you have the devel packages in, that is

[14:22:44]

dilano:

well, also looking at add/remove packages I see mysql-devel is installed

[14:23:29]

Dagmar:

find /usr -name "libmysqlclient.so.*"

[14:24:10]

Dagmar:

By the way, just because it says "-lmysqllcient" does not mean there's any file named "lmysqlclient" involved.

[14:24:50]

Dagmar:

...and manually making symlinks in order to attempt to solve missing library problems is almost ALWAYS the wrong answer.

[14:25:13]

Dagmar:

We are talking lottery winning odds that it would be the right thing to do

[14:25:19]

dilano:

sorry

[14:25:31]

Dagmar:

No need to be sorry.

[14:25:54]

Dagmar:

There's no shame in not knowing something (ignorance)--only in refusing to know something (stupidity) is there shame.

[14:26:12]

dilano:

#1 thing I was told fomr day one when I asked on here about ANY problem, was F%^&ing google it.. we are not here to walk you step by step

[14:26:35]

dilano:

so when I googled, I came across a site that says it had to have sym link

[14:26:42]

dilano:

thats when i added one

[14:26:48]

Dagmar:

You must have misinterpreted what it said

[14:27:22]

Dagmar:

Yes, there should be a symlink from /usr/lib pointing to the actual library in /usr/lib/mysql (if MySQL was installed "normally"), but it's not something you yourself should have to make

[14:27:23]

dilano:

but when I did a find, it came to /usr/lib/mysql/libmysqlclient.so.15, and a mysqlclient.so.15.0.0

[14:27:53]

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[14:28:12]

Dagmar:

OKay, so here's more 'useful clue'. If you type `ldconfig -v`, then ldconfig will also list out the inventory of libraries the system linker now knows about.

[14:28:12]

dilano:

gotcha

[14:28:35]

Dagmar:

So if you issue an `ldconfig -v | grep libmysqlclient` you generally find out real fast if something is being detected or not

[14:29:02]

Dagmar:

ldconfig itself will make all necessary symlinks when it actually "sees" a library, too.

[14:29:30]

Dagmar:

So, you have mysql 5 installed then, yes?

[14:30:07]

dilano:

ok, upon doing, it points:/usr/lib/mysql: to libmysqlclient.so.15 -> libmysqlclient.so.15.0.0, and also the _r

[14:30:13]

Dagmar:

I'm using 4.1.somethingorother, which is why I've been saying .14 instead of .15

[14:30:23]

dilano:

figured so

[14:30:30]

Dagmar:

Yeah, those symlinks inside the /usr/lib/mysql directory are quite normal

[14:30:31]

dilano:

maybe I should down-grade to 14 then?

[14:30:34]

Dagmar:

There should have been some in /usr/lib

[14:30:48]

Dagmar:

The only reason to downgrade would be if Qt was built against mysql 4

[14:30:55]

dilano:

lemme check, as it is not in alphabetical order

[14:31:00]

Dagmar:

Lemme see if I can find a quick way to determine that

[14:32:10]

dilano:

ok, nothing

[14:32:15]

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[14:32:24]

Dagmar:

Bleh I've no idea

[14:32:30]

dilano:

did a find for anythign mysql related.. only found in /usr/lib/mysql, not in /usr/lib

[14:32:37]

Dagmar:

Nothing what? no symlinks in /usr/lib? Hrmm...

[14:32:41]

Dagmar:

Lemme check somethin

[14:32:45]

dilano:

gotcha

[14:32:52]

dilano:

thanks for trying to help me

[14:33:21]

Dagmar:

Okay, here's where you should probably get angry at the person who made the mysql package you're using.

[14:33:33]

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[14:33:34]

Dagmar:

Mysql *makes* those symlinks in /usr/lib pointing into /usr/lib/mysql

[14:33:42]

dilano:

**shakes fist at ATRPMS**

[14:33:53]

Dagmar:

If the package manager didn't catch them, then the rpm should be considered broken

[14:34:01]

dilano:

gotcha

[14:34:06]

Dagmar:

...which actually doea make this a lottery condition.

[14:34:09]

dilano:

is this gonna mean a compile by hand?

[14:34:20]

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[14:34:34]

dilano:

by that you mean???

[14:35:24]

dilano:

i should consider myself lucky that i was actually able to obtain these errors.. cause its a once in a blue moon shot?? ;)

[14:35:37]

Dagmar:

No, it means you go into /usr/lib and type `ln -s mysql/* .`

[14:35:51]

Dagmar:

...and then write a note to the person who made the package telling them their kung fu is weak.

[14:36:28]

Dagmar:

Manually making symlinks in /usr/lib is something people should almost never ever have to do unless someone screwed up

[14:36:53]

Dagmar:

Remember I mentioned that this being the actual solution was about the same odds as winning a lottery

[14:37:10]

Dagmar:

Once you've done that, if you type `ldconfig -v | grep mysql` they should show up

[14:37:41]

Dagmar:

You should see libmysqlclient.so.14 -> libmysqlclient.so.14.0.0 appear as well as a line for the _r library

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[14:39:33]

Dagmar:

Man the more I think about it the more I should get on the stick and start completing that freaking updater for Slackware

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[14:42:00]

justinh:

seen as it's Friday, anyway....

[14:42:04]

justinh is now known as Weebl

[14:42:14]

stuarta is now known as fred_basset

[14:42:16]

Dagmar:

Feeling wobbly today?

[14:42:51]

dilano:

ln -s mysql/* .

[14:42:55]

Weebl:

feeling a bit :D today actually

[14:43:00]

dilano:

and it returned nothing

[14:43:30]

Dagmar:

dilano: Okay, basically earlier when I said the odds that doing an ln in /usr/lib is the correct solution are about the same odds as winning the lottery.... that's what I meant by this is a lottery condition

[14:44:01]

dilano:

hmm.. not good...

[14:44:02]

Dagmar:

dilano: If you don't have those symlinks, and the mysql RPM package is correctly installed and you have the libraries in /usr/lib/mysql, then the RPM package is broken and it would actually be the correct solution

[14:44:24]

Dagmar:

So going into /usr/lib and typing ln -s mysql/* . should generate the symlinks in /usr/lib

[14:44:33]

dilano:

nope

[14:44:37]

Dagmar:

THen you can run ldconfig -v | grep mysql and see that they are known by the system linker

[14:44:38]

dilano:

none :(

[14:44:48]

Dagmar:

Is the linker still not picking them up or do you not have the libs?

[14:45:35]

dilano:

ohh, no, was saying none earlier

[14:45:38]

Dagmar:

If I get this stupid slackware thing working I'm just going to start recommending people that don't care what distro they use, use my slackware mods

[14:45:53]

dilano:

on that last command, I got all the links to usr/lib/mysql

[14:46:05]

Weebl:

I never care so long as it works & stays that way

[14:46:15]

Weebl:

ubunut continues to lose favour

[14:46:16]

Dagmar:

Okay, so you should not be seeing anything complaining about not finding libmysqlclient anymore

[14:46:26]

Dagmar:

Weebl: Truly.

[14:46:35]

Dagmar:

More people who build packages actually need to test them on a clean system

[14:46:51]

Dagmar:

More often than not, I'm keeping /usr mounted read-only

[14:47:10]

dilano:

one thing I did notice though.. it says "Can't sta /usrlib: NSFOD" how did that get in there, and could that be a problem?

[14:47:24]

dilano:

*stat

[14:47:25]

Dagmar:

It said that _exactly_?

[14:47:36]

Dagmar:

You didn't drop a slash from /usr/lib?

[14:47:38]

dilano:

well, No Such File Or Directory

[14:48:03]

Dagmar:

NSFOD is a good enough acronym

[14:48:15]

Dagmar:

"/usrlib" != "/usr/lib"

[14:48:29]

dilano:

yeah.. how did it get in there?

[14:48:31]

Dagmar:

What was the "it" in your statement

[14:48:34]

dilano:

I never added it

[14:49:04]

dilano:

it?

[14:49:13]

Dagmar:

"it says 'Can't stat /usrlib: [...]"

[14:49:23]

dilano:

sbin/ldconfig

[14:49:32]

Dagmar:

You must have /usrlib in /etc/ld.so.conf

[14:49:36]

dilano:

hmmm

[14:49:54]

Dagmar:

You don't need /lib or /usr/lib listed in /etc/ld.so.conf because the linker will always look in those directories last

[14:50:13]

dilano:

gotcha

[14:50:15]

Dagmar:

Trivia of Ire: For about two years the default was to look in /usr/lib and /lib *first*

[14:50:18]

gbee:

*should*

[14:50:27]

Dagmar:

No, it *will*

[14:50:37]

dilano:

I should remove then?

[14:50:40]

Dagmar:

ldconfig has looked in /usr/lib and /lib all the time for about a decade now

[14:50:44]

Dagmar:

dilano: Yeah

[14:50:58]

dilano:

should I remove /usr/local/lib too?

[14:51:04]

Dagmar:

dilano: Under certain conditions, having /usr/lib or /lib listed in /etc/ld.so.conf can make very painful things happen

[14:51:08]

gbee:

heh, no – at least one distro used a modified version which was looking elsewhere

[14:51:11]

Dagmar:

dilano: nope. You want /usr/local/lib in there

[14:51:15]

dilano:

or better question, what should I really have in there?

[14:51:29]

Dagmar:

gbee: People who screw around with glibc had better be on the devel list for it imho

[14:51:52]

Dagmar:

dilano: Well, basically you don't need much of anything in there

[14:51:59]

dilano:

I'll go down list (very short)

[14:52:14]

Dagmar:

dilano: Unless you've built some things yourself by hand and stuck them in /usr/local then you need /usr/local/lib in there

[14:52:17]

dilano:

usr/lib/nvidia*****

[14:52:28]

dilano:

points to graphocs driver

[14:52:32]

dilano:

*graphics

[14:52:39]

Dagmar:

If you have qt installed and it was built into /opt (stupid, but common) then you need a dir for it in there

[14:52:49]

dilano:

then a include ld.so.conf.d/*.conf

[14:53:15]

Dagmar:

dilano: Yeah, that means you get to look in /etc/ld.so.conf.d/*.conf as well

[14:53:33]

Dagmar:

I still think that was a pointless mod for them ot have made to ldconfig

[14:53:55]

Dagmar:

I can think of exactly two cases in which that would be useful, both would only affect a small minority of users

[14:55:10]

Dagmar:

If you installed the nVidia driver as a package then you probably need the /usr/lib/nvidia entry

[14:55:38]

Dagmar:

You wouldn't need it if you had installed the driver from nVidia's website

[14:56:17]

dilano:

I used the easier package... but sometimes easier isn't always easier :)

[14:56:45]

Dagmar:

Some amateur package makers unfortunately suffer from the mistaken idea that you should sort /usr/lib into lots and lots of subdirectories, so presumably someone could manually go into /usr/lib and manually delete or add files.

[14:57:16]

Dagmar:

This is about as smart as saying an engine motor should only crank as fast as someone can easily adjust the timings by hand while it's running.

[14:57:36]

Dagmar:

We have computers to reduce complex tasks like picking three files out of a thousand easy things

[14:58:17]

Dagmar:

It's freaking dumb to make a decision like "we need more subdirs in /usr/lib" based on the refusal to even use shell utilities intelligently

[14:58:24]

opello:

who is to say that organization is bad, or that any particular granularity of organization is bad?

[14:59:07]

opello:

if $distro and $packager have that policy, and are intelligent enough to make everything work well within it, and $user chooses that distro ...

[14:59:16]

Dagmar:

ldconfig has to look in more places for one thing

[14:59:24]

dilano:

hmm.. for future refrence.. what did we do Dagmar.. cause it just compiled

[14:59:34]

opello:

see your comment about computers being smart enough to do such things

[14:59:40]

Dagmar:

dilano: We fixed something that the stupid mysql package you installed did not do, but should have

[14:59:44]

opello:

it probably wouldn't have a conf if it wasn't meant to be used ...

[14:59:54]

dilano:

which was... so I may make mental note

[15:00:04]

Dagmar:

opello: The other side of the coin, goign manually into /usr/lib and removing things... this is a BAD practice

[15:00:09]

Dagmar:

People make mistakes.

[15:00:14]

Dagmar:

Package managers, unless they have bugs, do not.

[15:00:18]

opello:

indeed

[15:00:41]

Dagmar:

You should always use a package manager to install and remove files from the operating system, and it does *not* need subdirs in /usr/lib

[15:01:22]

opello:

but if the distro/packagers choose that level of organization, as a reasonable tradeoff for accountability, or whatever reason, it's not necessarily horrible

[15:01:27]

Dagmar:

Now this is going to sound nitpicky, but "best practices" are "best practices" for a reason

[15:01:44]

opello:

'best' is subjective, though

[15:01:56]

opello:

'best' != 'most efficient' or 'most organized'

[15:02:05]

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[15:02:09]

Dagmar:

The syntatic use of the word is, but "best practices" are very much not subjective

[15:02:27]

clever:

what needs to be done to add a transcode to the job queue?

[15:02:27]

opello:

and the symantic meaning of the phrase ...

[15:02:28]

Dagmar:

They are practices which are intended to work as broadly as possible

[15:02:45]

clever:

on the programing side of the work

[15:02:48]

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[15:02:50]

Dagmar:

i.e., it's supposed to be at least NOT incorrect, everywhere

[15:03:28]

Dagmar:

Keep the package manager aware of what's going on, and it can be used to verify that something horrible didn't go wrong after a disk crash

[15:03:34]

opello:

and in that instance, best is being defined as most compatible

[15:03:38]

Dagmar:

It's when you have to fix a genuine problem that best practices pay off

[15:04:00]

dilano:

Darmar, I would like to say thanks for the help

[15:04:28]

Dagmar:

Using the pakcage manager to add and remove files also means that unless you've been getting packages from, well, people who can't build their way out of a paper bag, you get to leverage their expertise

[15:04:39]

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[15:05:28]

Dagmar:

Here we go

[15:05:40]

Dagmar:

I had to go get my spiral bounds to find this

[15:05:53]

Dagmar:

It was the subject of a LONG discussion in a very geeky bar in San Francisco one night

[15:06:27]

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[15:06:27]

opello:

heh

[15:06:51]

opello:

i still maintain that 'best practices' are subjective, and depend on the goal

[15:06:59]

Dagmar:

There's several facets in the various file heirarchy standards that imply that packages which need to place more than two files in a given directory may make a subdirectory to assure the uniqueness of their names.

[15:07:15]

Dagmar:

This would be required in /usr/share, and acceptable in /var and /etc

[15:07:25]

Dagmar:

In /usr/lib, it's completely not useful and can lead to bigger problems.

[15:07:44]

Dagmar:

If you're putting things in /usr/lib, it's to basically present them to the system linker

[15:07:56]

Dagmar:

The system linker works based on sonames INSIDE libraries, and not their filenames.

[15:08:17]

Dagmar:

So you can have two libraries which have matching sonames, and different filenames...

[15:08:26]

Dagmar:

...which will cause EVIL problems for one set of people.

[15:08:55]

Dagmar:

i.e., the people who made the thing with the matching soname, whichever one was read by ldconfig last

[15:09:27]

Dagmar:

So you WANT sonames to match filenames, and to know immediately if there's going to be a collission because someone sucked at coming up with a reasonably unique name for their libraries

[15:09:52]

Dagmar:

It's not the business of a package manager to read the contents of files, so it wouldn't be reasonable to make it able to read sonames, but it CAN easily detect filename collisions

[15:09:57]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: occasionally people might put something in /usr/lib/<subdir> because it is architecture-dependent, but not intended to be loaded by the systemlinker in the normal way

[15:10:05]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: such as, mod_foo.o in /usr/lib/apache

[15:10:13]

Dagmar:

quicksilver: Ding.. Not read by the system linker

[15:10:20]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: *agreed*

[15:10:21]

Dagmar:

At leat not in the normal way

[15:10:28]

Dagmar:

That's where the ld.so.conf.d comes in handy

[15:10:34]

Dagmar:

But it's about the only tihng

[15:10:50]

Dagmar:

Most peoplea ren't going to have arch-incompatible libraries in /usr/lib

[15:10:57]

Dagmar:

Only developers would, and not that many of them either.

[15:11:45]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: well it's mainly stuff like custom dynamic loading schemes. You might use software which has a custom dynamic loading scheme without being a developer yourself. I do agree it's the exception not the rule

[15:12:13]

Dagmar:

Yeah you can, but in those situations, you're using one platform.

[15:12:37]

Dagmar:

So you don't actually need to have that sort of decision making going on anywhere near runtime

[15:13:47]

Dagmar:

I can see where it could almost be useful if you were doing remote /usr mounts for two almost similiar arch set of clients (like x86 and amd64)

[15:14:12]

Dagmar:

...but in other cases it would mean you're likely installing files to the OS that it's never going to use.

[15:14:14]

Dagmar:

That's abd.

[15:14:18]

Dagmar:

er bad

[15:14:36]

Dagmar:

More parts == more potential things to break

[15:16:24]

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[15:17:58]

Dagmar:

It also adds problems that aren't wanted to how one goes about validating the filesystem

[15:18:41]

Dagmar:

...which you don't see until you try to lay out a specification for determining the trustedness of a filesystem

[15:18:55]

Dagmar:

No better way to make IT security managers jump off buildings.

[15:19:15]

Dagmar:

Ker-splat.

[15:19:22]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: actually my point about arch was simply this:

[15:19:34]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: dynloadable modules can't live in /usr/share because they're arch-dependent

[15:19:43]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: while the traditional definition of share forbids that

[15:19:47]

Dagmar:

Yep.

[15:19:52]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: that's all I was referring to

[15:20:04]

quicksilver:

can't live in /var/lib cos they don't change

[15:20:15]

quicksilver:

so /usr/lib/<packagename> is probably best

[15:20:16]

Dagmar:

OKay, but I'm saying arch-dependent files for normal, production machines, should either apply to that arch or not be installed at all

[15:20:22]

quicksilver:

agreed 100%

[15:20:25]

Dagmar:

The key being "production machines"

[15:21:05]

Dagmar:

I've had to maintain rigorous separation between production and devel environments at a few different places.

[15:21:21]

Dagmar:

Being a bastard about it is is the only way to nearly guarantee 100% lack of screwups on the production side

[15:21:51]

Dagmar:

LIke for medical management outsourcing apps, you never ever want a screwup of any kind to hit the production environment.

[15:22:12]

Dagmar:

...not one stemming from going from devel to production.

[15:22:22]

Dagmar:

Genuine bugs are not considered to be part of that problem.

[15:22:25]

clever:

my dad repairs and installs xray machines for philips medical systems

[15:22:44]

clever:

the latest machine thats been sold is made up of 4 or 5 XP boxes

[15:22:47]

Dagmar:

Genuine code bugs are a separate problem with a separate set of procedures for dealing with

[15:22:50]

clever:

and the main system

[15:23:01]

clever:

each of the xp boxes has several cpu's and several gig of ram

[15:23:07]

Dagmar:

clever: So they're likely doing the cool image enhancement stuff then

[15:23:11]

clever:

yeah

[15:23:13]

clever:

cat scan

[15:23:15]

Dagmar:

Oh yes

[15:23:22]

Dagmar:

Soooo processor hungry

[15:23:25]

clever:

yeah

[15:23:32]

clever:

1 box is just for the raid discs

[15:23:35]

Dagmar:

...but incredibly useful for being power hungry

[15:23:46]

clever:

another is just for the fiber optic inputs

[15:23:55]

clever:

then 1 for processing the images

[15:23:58]

Dagmar:

That lets them find anomalies that otherwise they wouldn't stand a chance of spotting

[15:23:58]

clever:

a 4th for controling the entire thing

[15:24:13]

clever:

and an optional 5th for a doctor to view things while the rest is in use

[15:24:15]

clever:

brb phone

[15:24:43]

clever:

back

[15:24:55]

clever:

1800 with no person at the other end

[15:25:01]

Dagmar:

Having been a recipient of the benefit of enhanced x-ray imagery twice now, I think that stuff is very very nice

[15:25:17]

Dagmar:

I'd be walking with a cane probably otherwise

[15:25:25]

clever:

my dad was checking the viewing station a little while ago

[15:25:32]

clever:

and there was something odd in the image

[15:25:36]

clever:

a 2nd spine

[15:25:46]

clever:

so i asked him to load up the 3d view

[15:25:56]

clever:

which lets you see the skeleton alone in full 3d

[15:26:13]

Dagmar:

The friction planes in my knees are kind of crumbly but 3D tomography (?) of the legbone made it very easy to see the problem, where you just couldn't see crap on a standard x-ray

[15:26:15]

clever:

guess what the 2nd spine was?

[15:26:32]

Dagmar:

Someone's tribal tattoo

[15:26:37]

clever:

a baby

[15:26:39]

Dagmar:

Ah

[15:26:49]

clever:

pregnant woman

[15:27:07]

clever:

i also blew my knee last month

[15:27:13]

Dagmar:

Meniscus?

[15:27:15]

clever:

have yet to go to the hospital for it

[15:27:25]

clever:

i blew it back on jan 3rd

[15:27:33]

Dagmar:

Bones or cartilege problem?

[15:27:34]

clever:

dont even notice it now so it seems to have healed

[15:27:41]

clever:

dont know exactly what it was

[15:27:44]

Dagmar:

Be very careful with it then

[15:27:50]

clever:

but it gave off a loud crunch and hurt alot:P

[15:27:56]

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[15:28:00]

Dagmar:

Reinjury of a not-quite-healed tendon is the best way to create permanent problems.

[15:28:11]

Dagmar:

Probably ground up some of the cartilege IN the knee.

[15:28:19]

clever:

yeah could have

[15:28:33]

clever:

i just avoided any angle of the knee which caused pain

[15:28:44]

Dagmar:

If you have the thing lock up on you or feel like there's something wedged inside the knee, head to the doctor

[15:28:55]

clever:

and the angles that caused pain slowly reduced as days went by

[15:28:55]

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[15:29:13]

clever:

i was able to move it right after it went crunch

[15:29:18]

Dagmar:

Well, yeah

[15:29:21]

clever:

but it hurt like hell to put any weight on it

[15:29:42]

clever:

but after the first day or 2 i was able to walk on it aslong as i didnt try to fully extend my leg

[15:29:45]

Dagmar:

Sounds more and more like the crunch was you damaging the cartilegde pads inside the knee

[15:29:55]

clever:

aslong as i didnt compress the front half of the joint it was fine

[15:30:05]

clever:

but i had to walk with my leg half bent to do that

[15:30:17]

Dagmar:

Provided they heal right you will be okay, but if you reinjure the thing while it's halfway healed you're doing to dramatically increse the chance that surgery will be *required* to fix it

[15:30:44]

Dagmar:

The surgery to fix that isnt' really that big of a deal, and they can even clone cartiledge now

[15:30:55]

clever:

at first i couldnt get my knee fully straight

[15:30:56]

Dagmar:

Teh stuff they did to me was just sadistic

[15:31:02]

Milosch:

i just have the bastard tendinitis

[15:31:05]

Dagmar:

32 holes drilled in the end of the femur

[15:31:07]

clever:

but now i can push my knee right to its normal limit like the other one

[15:31:19]

clever:

and not get any pain

[15:31:25]

Dagmar:

More pain than most people would believe had they not been shot or something

[15:31:55]

clever:

ive had pain to the point of it knocking me off my feet befor

[15:31:57]

clever:

e

[15:32:14]

Dagmar:

I got a giggle out of the fact that the last time I had that surgery, when I went back to the doctor for the first checkup after surgery, there was a rugby player in the waiting room who'd been worked on right after me who was about losing his mind./

[15:32:17]

clever:

several years ago i ramed the same knee into a post by mistake and must have crushed something in the knee cap

[15:32:37]

Milosch:

you're just determined to lose that knee, he

[15:32:40]

Milosch:

s/he/eh

[15:32:42]

clever:

lol

[15:33:08]

clever:

the time i blew it was an mistake also:P

[15:33:12]

clever:

i ran down the stairs

[15:33:16]

clever:

looked out the window

[15:33:25]

clever:

then with just my right foot on the floor

[15:33:26]

Dagmar:

It made me feel proud that I only looked a little worn out, while the rugby player (who was used to breaking bones) was sheet white, sweating profusely, and having this ten-thousand-mile stare thing giong on like "oh god when will the pain stop"

[15:33:32]

clever:

i spun 180 to my left

[15:33:37]

Dagmar:

YES fun

[15:33:52]

Dagmar:

You shredded tendons

[15:33:57]

clever:

then with my ankle+knee+hip+spine about 10 twisted

[15:34:04]

clever:

i tryed to jump up the stairs

[15:34:13]

Dagmar:

That will usually heal okay if they weren't too severely injured, but you should at least get it checked out

[15:34:18]

clever:

and it didnt normaly go crunch

[15:34:31]

Dagmar:

If they were too severely injured, you will have a permanent weakness there. This can be fixed.

[15:34:46]

Dagmar:

It can actually be fixed fairly easily with some rather minor orthoscopic surgery

[15:34:49]

clever:

my dad doesnt think i need to go if i think its healing

[15:35:02]

clever:

some friends on the internet incist i go because its free health care:P

[15:35:04]

Dagmar:

You should at least get that checked out

[15:35:12]

clever:

canada

[15:35:18]

Dagmar:

Seriously.

[15:35:27]

Dagmar:

If you've half torn one of those, the next time you could snap it

[15:35:35]

clever:

1 person insisted i dial 911

[15:35:39]

Dagmar:

...and "the next time" might involve a lot less strain

[15:35:47]

Dagmar:

Bah you're not in danger of dying

[15:35:55]

clever:

lol

[15:36:01]

Dagmar:

They have to do a bit more if you've snapped the thing

[15:36:07]

clever:

i can run about the house like i normaly did before now

[15:36:30]

clever:

at first i was bearly able to walk but i dont notice a thing with it anymore:)

[15:36:44]

Dagmar:

See, that right there tells me you probably very severely injured it.

[15:36:51]

Dagmar:

If it's not going to cost anything, get it checked.

[15:36:57]

Dagmar:

Not doing so would be kinda silly

[15:37:10]

clever:

dad is at the hospital today

[15:37:15]

Dagmar:

This is the sort of problem that unattended can become MUCH worse

[15:37:18]

clever:

about a 2–3 hour drive away

[15:37:19]

clever:

working

[15:37:25]

Dagmar:

Oh you're not in any kind of serious time bind on it

[15:37:37]

Dagmar:

Anytime 1–2 weeks after to get it looked at should be fine, but sooner is better than later

[15:37:38]

clever:

i asked to come with him

[15:37:45]

clever:

so i could look for parts for a lirc receiver

[15:37:55]

clever:

and he said its not bring your kid to work day

[15:38:08]

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[15:41:10]

clever:

how would i set a recorded file to be transcoded in mythweb?

[15:42:49]

Dagmar:

I'm not sure you can

[15:43:09]

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[15:43:18]

clever:

then how is it added to the job queue and what php file shows the info on a recorded file?

[15:43:33]

Dagmar:

php file?

[15:43:36]

Dagmar:

You just click on links

[15:43:41]

clever:

yeah

[15:43:47]

Dagmar:

Dont' worry about what php file

[15:43:47]

clever:

but what if i wanted to add a link to the code

[15:43:55]

clever:

to add support for what i want

[15:43:59]

Dagmar:

Then you'd know where to add it

[15:44:13]

clever:

mod_rewrite is masking the url of what i want

[15:44:30]

clever:

/mythweb/tv/list doesnt exist

[15:44:46]

clever:

so i cant tell which file needs to be edited to affect that

[15:45:16]

clever:

odd

[15:45:20]

clever:

under modules i do see tv

[15:45:26]

clever:

and under tv i see recorded.php:P

[15:45:41]

clever:

which im guessing is for mythweb/tv/recorded

[15:46:25]

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[15:53:34]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : -v jams

[15:56:12]

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[15:57:02]

gandalfcome:

GreyFoxx: I got an s100 now (zenega) now do you know if theres a support fourm

[15:57:16]

gandalfcome:

GreyFoxx: i mean irc channel

[15:58:09]

Merlin83b2:

He left, gandalfcome.

[15:58:26]

Merlin83b2:

(as in the support forum for t100s left ;-)

[15:58:35]

gandalfcome:

Merlin83b2: to bad

[15:58:47]

Merlin83b2:

He'll be back later or tomorrow I@d imagine.

[15:59:05]

gandalfcome:

Merlin83b2: thanks man do you use a zenega as a frontend client?

[15:59:21]

Merlin83b2:

No, but I know a man who does :)

[16:00:32]

Merlin83b2:

lol, he's takes the pages down in a fit of rage if that helps you guess who it is :)

[16:08:43]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot

[16:08:48]

opello:

heh

[16:11:12]

batdog|gone is now known as batdog

[16:11:56]

Beirdo:

Ahhh, more RAM is a good thing

[16:12:22]

qu0zl:

that linode.com Beirdo?

[16:12:24]

opello:

free?

[16:12:28]

qu0zl:

i've had one of them for a couple of years, love it

[16:12:54]

Beirdo:

aye, they did a RAM increase mid-January, I missed the announcement

[16:13:02]

qu0zl:

hmm, me too

[16:13:06]

Beirdo:

and a disk increase mid December

[16:13:07]

qu0zl:

time for a reboot i take it

[16:13:09]

opello:

ah, just had to reboot to get it?

[16:13:12]

Beirdo:

yup

[16:13:15]

opello:

snazzy

[16:13:23]

Beirdo:

I now have 192MB instead of 150MB

[16:14:12]

opello:

just for your irc and mythlogbot? or does it do other stuff?

[16:14:21]

qu0zl:

heh kick ass, me too in 2 minutes Beirdo

[16:14:28]

qu0zl:

not that i really need the ram tbh

[16:14:39]

Dagmar:

I don't want to know how you managed 150Mb

[16:15:27]

qu0zl:

it's UML linux so he could sell it in 150 mb chunks if he was mad enough ;)

[16:15:33]

Dagmar:

Ahhh...

[16:15:54]

qu0zl:

i think you're right though, probably was 148 or something slightly sane

[16:16:34]

Dagmar:

I was mainlya afraid he was using the badram module

[16:16:50]

qu0zl:

:)

[16:17:08]

Beirdo:

mine does irc, the log bot, mucho web stuff, etc

[16:17:12]

Dagmar:

It works, but jesus, people should occasionally just throw out bad hardware

[16:17:24]

qu0zl:

or give it to someone they don't like Dagmar

[16:17:29]

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[16:17:30]

Dagmar:

That works, too

[16:17:48]

clever:

i have a working 50mhz laptop

[16:17:56]

clever:

it runs fine

[16:18:12]

clever:

and i was using it to run an entire irc network until i got into linux

[16:38:37]

fryfrog:

what was it running *before*?

[16:38:42]

fryfrog:

windows?

[16:38:50]

clever:

win 95

[16:38:57]

Weebl:

my ears burned though my name wasn't mentioned.. ;)

[16:38:58]

fryfrog:

KRIKEY!

[16:39:03]

clever:

and i still have yet to get linux to install on that 50mhz

[16:39:15]

fryfrog:

i just doodies in my pants :)

[16:39:21]

clever:

lol

[16:39:26]

clever:

it had 20mb of ram

[16:39:27]

fryfrog:

have you tried a minimal distro meant for that kind of stuff?

[16:39:27]

Weebl:

I wondered what that smell was

[16:39:35]

clever:

win98 refused to install there

[16:39:36]

fryfrog:

maybe ipcop or freesco?

[16:39:39]

fryfrog:

or uh

[16:39:42]

fryfrog:

humm

[16:39:48]

fryfrog:

pebble linux, or something

[16:39:49]

clever:

it doesnt have a cd drive

[16:39:58]

fryfrog:

floppy?

[16:39:58]

Weebl:

I thought it was only homicidal astronauts who did doodoos in their pants

[16:40:02]

clever:

so id need either a net install or a floppy install

[16:40:03]

fryfrog:

freesco comes on a floppy :)

[16:40:10]

** J-e-f-f-A|work uses freesco on a 266mhz PII laptop... ;-) **

[16:40:13]

clever:

and the net install would need a boot lfoppy

[16:40:26]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i have redhat9 on a 133mhz desktop

[16:40:32]

clever:

that replaced the 50mhz for the irc network

[16:40:38]

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[16:40:40]

asperon:

hi guys

[16:40:44]

fryfrog:

i suspect the *best* use of a 50mhz laptop with 20mb of ram would be as a "does this survive bullets" test :)

[16:40:50]

asperon:

is it possible to create a video playlist in myth?

[16:41:03]

clever:

fryfrog: i have a toughtbook laptop

[16:41:10]

clever:

and ive seen images of it on the web where it took a bullet and stoped it

[16:41:13]

fryfrog:

is it the 50mhz one?

[16:41:17]

clever:

diff laptop

[16:41:18]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: I've got a basement full of PII and PIII boxes ready to get trashed... 400mhz tops...

[16:41:20]

fryfrog:

ah

[16:41:24]

Weebl:

asperon: with mythvideo? if you make a playlist file & associate it with a player, yeah

[16:41:39]

asperon:

Weebl: i was thinking via mythvideo

[16:41:43]

Weebl:

mythtv & mythvideo != xbmc

[16:41:53]

asperon:

ok, make a playlist for mplayer or xine then

[16:41:57]

Weebl:

mythtv & mythvideo >>>>>> xbmc

[16:42:03]

clever:

asperon: mplayer can take a playlist where each line is a full path

[16:42:22]

asperon:

ok, ill give that a try then

[16:42:26]

clever:

then you can store those in maybe a .playlist

[16:42:38]

clever:

and set the player to be mplayer -..... -playlist

[16:43:49]

asperon:

thnx

[16:43:51]

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[16:44:22]

clever:

the 50mhz laptop would probly be good for gps naviagtion

[16:44:50]

clever:

gps software shouldnt take that much power enless its got complex maps

[16:45:13]

clever:

and if i damage it from bumps on the road

[16:45:19]

** Weebl laughs at the pure engrishness of this: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/02/09/ebay_trashes_english/ **

[16:45:20]

clever:

do you think i will care?:P

[16:46:51]

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[17:17:16]

qu0zl:

clever you should turn the 50mhz laptop into a gps navigation watch

[17:17:16]

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[17:17:18]

qu0zl:

all you need is duct tape and some weight-training

[17:17:18]

clever:

lol

[17:17:18]

clever:

the batery is long gone

[17:17:18]

clever:

and the thing takes raw 120 in

[17:17:18]

clever:

power suply in between the hinges of the lcd panel

[17:17:18]

clever:

puts out 18v directlly into a plug on the motherboard

[17:17:18]

qu0zl:

just put some car batteries in a rucksack

[17:17:18]

clever:

it doesnt run on 12

[17:17:18]

clever:

it runs on 18

[17:17:18]

qu0zl:

ahh well, another perfectly good plan ruined :(

[17:17:18]

qu0zl:

there's always one minor flaw

[17:17:18]

clever:

and last year i had a 10 disc cd changer in my bookbag

[17:17:18]

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[17:17:20]

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[17:17:20]

clever:

running off a 12v batery in my pocket

[17:17:20]

fryfrog:

maybe 1.5 car battries? :)

[17:17:20]

clever:

transmiting into a fm/mp3 player

[17:17:20]

** clever hands fryfrog a 12v batery and a hack saw **

[17:17:20]

clever:

i got it running once with multiple partialy dead baterys

[17:17:20]

clever:

which totaled up to 18v

[17:17:20]

clever:

but it only ran for about 10 seconds before using up the allready empty baterys

[17:17:20]

fryfrog:

hehe

[17:17:20]

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[17:17:21]

clever:

and that plug is hard wired to the internal power suply

[17:17:21]

clever:

which ive measured at 18 dc

[17:17:21]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: So get yourself one of those small 75w power inverters... and run it with a 12v battery that way...

[17:17:21]

clever:

i have a pair of 75w ones and 300 and 400 watt inverter

[17:17:21]

clever:

the 75 watt was the first but after a while it began to shut itself off when running my dell laptop

[17:17:21]

clever:

which caused high cpu usage

[17:17:21]

clever:

it would shut itself off

[17:17:21]

clever:

then back on just a second later

[17:17:21]

clever:

causing the acpid to run the power on/off scripts contantly

[17:17:21]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Was it plugged into a running car, or just a 12v (13.8v) car battery?

[17:17:21]

clever:

running car

[17:17:21]

clever:

but the usage of the laptop was over the 75watt limit

[17:17:21]

clever:

causing it to overheat slightly

[17:17:21]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: So the 75w is just a wee bit too small.

[17:17:21]

clever:

so we got a new 300watt inverter

[17:17:21]

clever:

which came with a 75watt

[17:17:21]

clever:

and acording to the manual it cant do 300 for extended times

[17:17:21]

clever:

it can do 300 max for a short time

[17:17:21]

clever:

i think 275 was the max for extended times

[17:17:21]

clever:

then dad closed the van door on the 300's power plug

[17:17:21]

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[17:17:21]

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[17:17:25]

clever:

and we got the 400

[17:17:47]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: So you're running Myth from your car? ; -)

[17:17:54]

clever:

lol nope:P

[17:18:05]

clever:

the master be and fe are a desktop in the house

[17:18:17]

clever:

but the spare fe laptop is the laptop i use in the van alot

[17:18:27]

clever:

but i wouldnt have a connection to the mysql or master be

[17:20:19]

clever:

also

[17:20:23]

clever:

when i had first got the 75 watt

[17:20:29]

clever:

i tryed running a desktop off it

[17:20:30]

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[17:20:44]

clever:

it would cut out the instant i pluged the atx box into it

[17:20:52]

clever:

before i even tryed to turn it on

[17:20:54]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: I've got a 300w inverter that had been used to run a Commodore 1084 monitor, VCR, DVD, X-Box and laptop on trips... Now I use a polaroid 15" lcd tv... ;-)

[17:21:05]

clever:

LOL

[17:21:10]

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[17:21:14]

clever:

i have a comodore 64 in the garage

[17:21:23]

clever:

and once

[17:21:28]

clever:

i ran 2 laptops at once in the van

[17:21:30]

clever:

networked

[17:21:41]

clever:

linux was running apache2 to serve manga

[17:21:43]

** J-e-f-f-A|work also owens a few Amigas!!! ;-) **

[17:21:48]

clever:

and the win2k was running win2k

[17:21:55]

clever:

because it was easyer to flip thru using IE

[17:22:06]

clever:

ive now found comix which is python based and even better

[17:23:14]

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[17:23:26]

clever:

i have a dialup modem for my c64

[17:23:35]

clever:

and ive heard of how to get it on the web also

[17:24:26]

clever:

nice

[17:24:34]

clever:

and my grandfather is into ham radios

[17:24:46]

clever:

and he used to have a c64 setup for i think morse code over the ham radio

[17:25:12]

clever:

ive also found pages on the web explaining how to hack into a bbs

[17:25:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: i've got a buddy that keeps nagging me to get my ham license... There isn't even a morse code requirement anymore... (go figure!) So it's not that hard to get now...

[17:25:20]

clever:

trouble is finding one to hack into:P

[17:26:14]

clever:

lol

[17:26:22]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: (And that 40MB was USED — it cost me $400 for it!!!)

[17:26:27]

clever:

LOL

[17:26:43]

MrGandalf:

any diseqc users here who have tried using diseqc through a tone switch?

[17:26:52]

clever:

my newest pc was 2.9ghz and it came with a 75gig drive

[17:27:07]

clever:

it was i think 100$

[17:28:29]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: My newest pc is my new backend (not 100% setup yet though) — AMD Athlon 64 x2 4600+ w/2GB DDR400 dual-channel, 300GB SATA II OS disk and 3x500GB SATAII LVM for Myth... ;-) Cost a few $$$ more than $100! — approx $850 as equipped...

[17:28:50]

clever:

lol

[17:29:48]

clever:

checking my total free space

[17:29:52]

clever:

and total used

[17:30:09]

clever:

09 13:30:02 <@clever[rev]> Total: 340.35GB Used: 296.28GB Free: 40.55GB

[17:30:18]

clever:

theres a new 30gig xfs not counted in that

[17:30:33]

clever:

and a 1.4gig+115mb in the redhat9

[17:31:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: My current be has 4x200GB for Myth – 759GB formatted — and has 11GB free atm... ;-)

[17:31:05]

clever:

and a pair of 40gig's not counted

[17:31:15]

clever:

lol

[17:31:28]

clever:

i bearly even have 400gig put together between every box in the house

[17:32:03]

clever:

and my dad is complaining that im using 20gig on his C drive

[17:32:29]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: you'd die with my setup.. 100G storage for mythv... 80G or so used. :)

[17:32:39]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: My 'main' pc (running winblows) has a 250, two 160's and a 40GB... I was doing a bunch of 'dishrips' from my dish 7100 before I started using myth... ;-)

[17:32:46]

clever:

i had 20gig free on my backend when i started

[17:33:07]

tank-man:

J-e-f-f-A, is that space for sd or hd content?

[17:33:16]

clever:

my backend is down to 8.5gig free now

[17:33:17]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: You'd get about 2 hours of HD with 20GB... ;-)

[17:33:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tank-man: both. ;-)

[17:34:14]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tank-man, clever: My current BE has 3x SD tuners and 1x HD tuner. My new backend will have 3x SD and 3x HD.

[17:34:21]

clever:

my main winblows server crashed on dec 31st when i tryed to put more ram in it

[17:34:26]

clever:

oddly it looks like bad sectors

[17:34:46]

clever:

i put the ram in

[17:34:48]

clever:

turned it on

[17:34:59]

** cesman thought he was in teh mythtv users channel.... **

[17:35:02]

clever:

the onboard sound card yelled about bad ram and cpu speed settings

[17:35:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

cesman: You are, but it's quiet atm...

[17:35:35]

clever:

brb

[17:36:37]

** clever is back from signing for a ups package **

[17:36:51]

clever:

odd

[17:37:03]

clever:

theres special instructions saying no sig req'd

[17:37:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

eveb

[17:37:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

even

[17:37:09]

clever:

and yet i just signed for it:P

[17:37:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Maybe the driver can't read english?

[17:37:37]

clever:

lol

[17:37:43]

clever:

its from the leasing company

[17:37:50]

clever:

my dad gets a 'free' company van

[17:38:01]

clever:

and its replaced every few years or x km

[17:39:50]

xris:

cesman: you know we're never on topic.

[17:40:12]

xris:

cesman: btw, what will you do with any leftover CDs from scale?

[17:40:36]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: I picked up a book on php 5 and mysql... I like what I'm reading... ;-)

[17:40:43]

cesman:

I don't know if we'll have leftovers

[17:41:12]

cesman:

if we do, they will be obsolete in a few weeks :)

[17:43:29]

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[17:43:30]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xirs: I've done tons of SQL at work, but on the Tandem platform... It's not that huge of a learning curve, but the book is pretty good. I've probably only read 40 pages of it so far (approx 300 iirc), but it's looking to be a good resource so far.

[17:43:40]

xris:

clever: http://forevermore.net/bookmarks.php

[17:43:47]

xris:

scroll down to the "php" entry

[17:44:01]

clever:

i learned php and mysql at the same time

[17:44:43]

clever:

looks like a tool for using a search engine on another site

[17:45:14]

clever:

but if you open php.net/fopen

[17:45:17]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: I've been saying it for weeks/months, but I've got to get the SVN basics down too, so I can start creating some mythweb themes to contribute to THE BEST PVR EVER!!! ;-)

[17:45:23]

clever:

the 404 handler automaticaly does a search of the site

[17:45:31]

clever:

and redirects to the best match

[17:45:53]

clever:

ive seen a page somewhere before sudjusting that 404 handlers do that more often

[17:46:10]

clever:

www.mysql.com/select does the same thing

[17:46:15]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: you may want to hold off on that (for one, mythweb doesn't have themes)... I'm completely redesigning the template/skin stuff.

[17:46:20]

seth|laptop:

mythweb question, what would cause a "Database Setup Error" when trying to access it through a browser?

[17:46:27]

onewheelskyward:

It's a very nice interface idea. Don't give your users dead ends.

[17:46:29]

justinh:

J-e-f-f-A|work: mythweb theme? yay!

[17:46:46]

clever:

xris: do you know how mythtv manages the job queue?

[17:46:55]

xris:

seth|laptop: depends on what the rest of the error says.

[17:47:00]

xris:

clever: not really

[17:47:07]

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[17:47:10]

clever:

was wondering if i could add a button to mythweb

[17:47:16]

clever:

to transcode a recording on demand

[17:47:18]

** cesman gets ready to pack up for SCALE **

[17:47:30]

justinh:

hey cesman good luck this weekend :)

[17:47:31]

xris:

seth|laptop: it's probably a database setup error, though.. incorrect db info in .htaccess, or incorrect apache settings preventing mythweb from reading them (the error will tell you)

[17:47:37]

cesman:

xris: I'll be right between Dell and IBM

[17:47:45]

cesman:

justinh: thanks!

[17:47:45]

seth|laptop:

it talks about the "included .htaccess file" which I have modified to point at the mysql db on another host (currently the master backend)

[17:47:56]

xris:

clever: should already be a ticket open about it... it'll be in .21

[17:47:57]

justinh:

cesman: knock em dead.. and the commercial folks... just swat em away ;)

[17:48:00]

xris:

cesman: awesome

[17:48:06]

clever:

ahh nice:)

[17:48:19]

clever:

xris: im allready on the svn source

[17:48:21]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris, justinh: Humm... Oh, I know why I was thinking mythweb had themes already... Ive got another network media player that uses 'swisscenter' on Linux... that's got themes... But I'd love to see that for mythweb! ;-)

[17:48:21]

xris:

clever: .21 will have a "recording details" page with options like that.

[17:48:23]

xris:

ah, ok

[17:48:28]

cesman:

the last 2 years were good!

[17:48:38]

clever:

xris: have you started on it yet?

[17:48:50]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: mythweb has templates (and will only ever have two: lite and default), and css skins.

[17:48:51]

cesman:

there were times our booth was busier than thecommercial folks

[17:48:55]

justinh:

I might really live to regret saying I might never exhibit again

[17:49:05]

cesman:

it will be interesting being between the big boys

[17:49:09]

xris:

clever: not that particular one, no. I've been redesigning the channel icon lookup stuff for mythtv itself lately

[17:49:18]

clever:

ahh:)

[17:49:26]

cesman:

they both have two booths and there we are in the middle :)

[17:49:40]

xris:

justinh: we'll see how the linusfest northwest one goes in april.. Captain_Murdoch says he might even be in the area.

[17:50:10]

justinh:

xris: if a promo video is needed give me a yell about it

[17:50:40]

justinh:

I enjoy flexing the ole editing muscle

[17:51:34]

xris:

justinh: if you wanted to make me one, I wouldn't turn you down. I figured we'd just be playing some HD recordings of broadcast tv (should be able to get the plasma from work, so we'll have a nice 42" display :)

[17:51:36]

justinh:

and remember – if anybody asks you to be interviewed for a webcast, be prepared!

[17:52:13]

** xris likes his typo... Linus was *supposed* to be at linuxfest.. but I think he cancelled. **

[17:53:00]

justinh:

xris: heheh. nobody is worthy?

[17:53:02]

** cesman wonders who the surprise guest in booth 32 will be **

[17:53:04]

cesman:

http://www.socallinuxexpo.org/scale5x/layout.php

[17:53:30]

justinh:

be funny if it was MS showing Vista

[17:53:36]

** J-e-f-f-A|work now wishes he still lived in CA... ;-) He would like to go to SCALE, but it's a long drive from BOSTON!!!! **

[17:53:46]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: themes got renamed to "templates" in .20... I don't really want to have to deal with users creating more templates, since they require too much interaction with the code. There are currently css skins for controlling color and some layout things, but I want to redesign that so colors can be selected by the users themselves... which will require redesigning all of that sort of stuff.

[17:56:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: So you're working on converting all the pages to use a 'common' css skin file for all pages then, right?

[17:57:07]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: it's mostly all there in .20... but I'll be needing to split the color settings out of that file and put them into something else.

[17:57:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: So instead of embedding the css code in each page, you'll be calling in a file that all of the pages will use.

[17:58:34]

xris:

it does that already in .20

[17:59:00]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: kewl. I haven't looked too much on my new (.20) backend...

[17:59:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Does the uPnP stuff use http at all?

[17:59:25]

xris:

separating the color stuff will just mean using auto-generated css files that only contain color information.

[17:59:29]

xris:

yes

[17:59:30]

justinh:

oo yeah I should have a look at svn mythweb now my dev box is back in play

[17:59:33]

xris:

that's how it works. xml over http

[17:59:40]

xris:

heh

[17:59:52]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: So is that incorporated with mythweb, or kinda a seperate entity?

[18:00:20]

xris:

J-e-f-f-A|work: nothing, yet... but if I can pull this off, there would be a color preferences setting in mythweb.

[18:01:30]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: I bought a Buffalo LinkTheatre DVD (HD network media player), and can seem my .20 backend with it, but it's basically just a directory brower interface atm... I'd love to work on getting that to somewhat emulate a frontend-looking interface...

[18:02:17]

xris:

you'd want to talk to cdev about that. he's usually in #mythtv.

[18:02:20]

clever:

just made a pair of scripts for updating mythtv

[18:02:23]

xris:

he's doing all of the upnp stuff.

[18:02:33]

clever:

./update will cd into all 3 folders and svn update them

[18:02:38]

xris:

however, you'll really want to upgrade to svn for that. there've been a LOT of changes to the upnp stuff.

[18:02:40]

clever:

./make will run make on them

[18:02:57]

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[18:03:05]

justinh:

<parrot voice> who's a clever boy then? </parrot voice>

[18:03:14]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

xris: Thanks. I'll touch base with him. Kudos to him for getting it working in the first place!

[18:03:38]

** xris laughs just in case clever is actually a girl **

[18:04:06]

** clever is male:P **

[18:04:26]

justinh:

well, anybody could be anything, this is IRC after all

[18:04:33]

clever:

yeah

[18:04:44]

justinh:

IRC, where the boys are boys, the girls are boys and the kids are cops

[18:05:03]

clever:

close

[18:05:14]

clever:

i have the original version of that line in my log files

[18:05:24]

xris:

justinh: we do have the occasional girl in here.

[18:05:32]

xris:

actual girls, that is.

[18:05:34]

justinh:

xris: yeah I know :)

[18:05:50]

clever:

./freenode/#ubuntu.log:08:38 -!- mkey [n=mkey@pD9E35EF7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [""Welcome to IRC; Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents!""]

[18:06:15]

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[18:06:22]

clever:

<+Thundercross> *WB(chestnuts)WB* – <MasterO> <Majin_Raiha> *WB(div)WB* – Welcome to IRC, where men are men, women are men, and little girls are fbi agents. <-- and where Dythim makes jokes about the FBI <- so little girls shut down the site?

[18:06:27]

justinh:

.. and all the random 'babe' messenger popups are bots

[18:06:51]

clever:

i mainly get pm spam about a poker site

[18:07:19]

clever:

once a little while ago

[18:07:25]

clever:

i got a convincing looking email

[18:07:28]

clever:

from 'ebay'

[18:07:51]

clever:

explained that my account has been locked down because it may have become a security risk and was being abused

[18:08:01]

clever:

please goto the link below and login to fix it....

[18:08:17]

clever:

the link looks like an ebay one

[18:08:30]

justinh:

oh yeah *how* convincing? (snicker)

[18:08:35]

clever:

but its more <a href=www.passwordstealer.com>http://ebay.com</a>

[18:08:54]

clever:

i could tell just by putting my mouse over the link that it was fake

[18:08:55]

justinh:

plain text seperates them out nicely. nothing beats it

[18:09:00]

clever:

and went there just for fun

[18:09:09]

clever:

my outlook wasnt in plain text mode:P

[18:09:22]

justinh:

outlook? you deserve everything you get

[18:09:24]

clever:

but it still showed the real target in the status bar when i hover the link

[18:09:47]

clever:

im still using winblows mainly for my isp email adr

[18:10:04]

clever:

using 'mail' and a smtp server i run for most of my other email adr's

[18:10:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: I occasionally click on those and type something like : User name: f*you password: get*lost ...etc... ;-)

[18:10:19]

clever:

the site was down when i opened it

[18:10:24]

clever:

probly allready shutdown

[18:10:40]

clever:

also ive had a bot failing away and waisting my cpu on sshd before

[18:10:43]

clever:

i port scan him

[18:10:51]

clever:

and tryed to login to his ssh as f*you:P

[18:11:01]

clever:

which should show up in his log files

[18:11:15]

clever:

then i closed my port 22:)

[18:12:41]

clever:

crap

[18:12:51]

cesman:

ahhh thunderbird

[18:12:51]

cesman:

kmail

[18:12:52]

cesman:

pine

[18:12:52]

clever:

pizza pocket was in the over for atleast an hour

[18:13:04]

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[18:13:09]

clever:

my linux main viewer is text mode

[18:13:13]

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[18:13:18]

clever:

my linux main viewer is text mode

[18:13:20]

clever:

and wb

[18:13:39]

clever:

your modified host is gone

[18:13:41]

clever:

i saw your ip:P

[18:14:49]

cesman:

mine?

[18:14:55]

clever:

yes

[18:15:12]

cesman:

should I worry?

[18:15:22]

clever:

why else would you have it hidden?:P

[18:15:48]

cesman:

it is hidden by freenode as I've donated

[18:16:00]

clever:

ahh

[18:16:06]

cesman:

I'd only worry if I were running another OS :P

[18:16:07]

clever:

something you didnt exactly ask for

[18:16:19]

clever:

yeah linux is secure:)

[18:16:29]

clever:

i have a router so even the winblows's are mostly protected

[18:16:40]

justinh:

routers have vulns too

[18:16:49]

clever:

linksys router

[18:16:57]

cesman:

PoS

[18:17:07]

justinh:

thankfully mine just poos its pants & crashes whenever some script kiddie gets over-zealous

[18:17:11]

clever:

it reboots randomly if i use up all its ram

[18:17:44]

clever:

and each tcp connection uses ram

[18:17:52]

clever:

im planing on replacing it with a linux box

[18:18:19]

fryfrog:

you tried a custom firmware on your linksys?

[18:18:25]

clever:

not yet

[18:18:30]

fryfrog:

i use sveasoft on mine (though i think he is a gpl violating asshat)

[18:18:38]

clever:

and the dlink wifi router is even worse crap for its port forwarding

[18:19:02]

clever:

so if i fry the linksys i wont have anything to keep the house together

[18:19:32]

clever:

lol

[18:19:36]

clever:

i mean the pc's in the house

[18:19:47]

clever:

also

[18:19:48]

clever:

09 14:19:42 <@clever[rev]> I am 19.889149 years old. (I'll be 20 in 5wks 5days 11hrs 40mins 17secs.)

[18:19:50]

fryfrog:

ah ewhw

[18:19:55]

cesman:

that is if the insurance company doesn't bend you over a barrel

[18:20:14]

fryfrog:

that'd kind of suck if your router was the linchpin of holding our house together :)

[18:20:50]

clever:

lol

[18:21:18]

clever:

im running an ircnetwork and several other services

[18:21:44]

clever:

got any tips for how to use pppoe on linux?

[18:23:14]

clever:

when i use winscp on windows

[18:23:15]

justinh:

jasoncohen01: I don't care ;)

[18:23:20]

jasoncohen01:

heh

[18:23:28]

clever:

it maxes the cpu out long before maxing the 100mbit

[18:23:34]

jasoncohen01:

clever: yeah, same here

[18:24:12]

clever:

if i push out to a smbfs mount on linux

[18:24:18]

clever:

it will go at full speed

[18:24:26]

clever:

but if i trigger an int too much

[18:24:35]

clever:

like using the mouse/keyboard or alt+tab'ing

[18:24:42]

clever:

it up and fully halts for a random time

[18:24:49]

jasoncohen01:

currently i'm copying files from a linux smb file share to windows

[18:24:55]

clever:

like a packet got lost and the timeout is expiring

[18:25:22]

jasoncohen01:

i'm planning to upgrade my systems to gigabit ethernet, but I'm wondering how much of a performance gain that'll give me in windows.

[18:25:23]

clever:

i dont use smb to pull files into windows

[18:25:31]

jasoncohen01:

clever: what do you use?

[18:25:31]

clever:

cant get the smb server to work on linux

[18:25:46]

clever:

i mainly use winscp to get files out of linux

[18:26:03]

clever:

but im shifting most of my drives to a linux pc where i can nfs them from linux

[18:26:05]

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[18:26:10]

jasoncohen01:

gigabit ethernet should be limited by the HDD speed- so 40–50 MB/sec

[18:26:10]

justinh:

xris: wow! really like the new mythweb :)

[18:26:11]

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[18:26:22]

clever:

i dont have a gigabit card

[18:26:27]

xris:

justinh: thx. :) and it's not even done yet.

[18:26:32]

clever:

but i have a single gigabit switch with nothing to fill it

[18:26:39]

justinh:

divide by zero error in the status page

[18:26:46]

justinh:

I've not made any recordings yet ;)

[18:27:26]

justinh:

jees how fast does the listings page load now?!?!?!? this is amazing

[18:27:45]

clever:

my mythweb takes forever to load if im watching livecd

[18:27:48]

clever:

livetv*

[18:27:48]

xris:

status page gets that? that's straight from the backend.

[18:28:03]

xris:

clever: problems creating thumbnails, maybe?

[18:28:10]

clever:

any page

[18:28:16]

clever:

not just ones with thumbnails

[18:28:30]

clever:

but i have 3 apache servers in the house

[18:28:45]

clever:

i can just copy it over and bypass the cpu bottleneck

[18:29:01]

justinh:

sorry xris – stats page, not status ;)

[18:29:09]

justinh:

Percent of time spent recording:

[18:29:10]

justinh:

Error at /var/www/mythweb/modules/stats/tmpl/default/stats.php, line 74: Division by zero

[18:29:37]

jasoncohen01:

clever: what is your system's cpu usage during playback?

[18:29:47]

clever:

over 90

[18:29:52]

clever:

also i think i had make running also

[18:30:12]

clever:

its 19% used running an avi in mplayer

[18:30:44]

clever:

watching a prerecorded file its at 29%

[18:30:49]

clever:

sometimes 30%

[18:30:51]

xris:

justinh: ahh. yell at kormoc for that one (whenever he shows up)

[18:31:16]

justinh:

xris: really like the new settings pages too. I'm tempted to even say 'awesome' ;)

[18:31:20]

clever:

and when on 'livetv' its at

[18:31:46]

xris:

thanks. :) the really cool thing about the settings stuff is that it's all controlled from the module.

[18:31:46]

clever:

Cpu(s): 60.7% us, 11.3% sy, 0.0% ni, 22.6% id, 1.0% wa, 0.0% hi, 4.3% si

[18:32:00]

xris:

so if someone rewrites something like mythstreamtv, it will control its own settings sections, etc.

[18:32:01]

clever:

thats with it on livetv without make running

[18:32:02]

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[18:33:09]

justinh:

I must remember to try & fix mythstreamtv's css so that the 'visit www.mythtv.org' doesn't get misplaced on the menu pages

[18:33:18]

justinh:

it's annoying

[18:34:30]

clever:

hmmm

[18:34:43]

clever:

if i clip a pair of jumper wires to the IR led in a remote

[18:34:46]

clever:

without removing it

[18:34:52]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

justinh: Yep, I concur on that... ;-)

[18:35:00]

clever:

would it damage the remote?

[18:35:02]

clever:

and wire it up for use in a lirc ir blaster

[18:35:05]

justinh:

ooo 'the money programme' is all about the lunch of Vister

[18:35:37]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: just go to radio shack and pay $2 for an IR led...

[18:35:46]

clever:

no car

[18:35:51]

clever:

and they got renamed to the source

[18:36:01]

clever:

and dad isnt home

[18:36:05]

justinh:

clever: you could well damage the remote, so beware

[18:36:29]

** clever looks for a remote i can rape for parts **

[18:38:19]

clever:

yeah

[18:38:19]

justinh:

oo my ticket didn't get rejected out of hand, that's a good sign

[18:38:28]

clever:

now that i think of it

[18:38:39]

clever:

i saw the ir port on my laptop when i had it appart a few days ago

[18:39:00]

clever:

and theres a laptop in the basement which has a damaged hdd controler that eats hdd's

[18:39:00]

justinh:

clever: that'd be IrDA, which you can't use for being an IR blaster without some serious work

[18:39:16]

clever:

its a combination of the transistor and led

[18:39:40]

justinh:

it isn't if it's an IrDA module – how old is the laptop?

[18:39:42]

clever:

and i know its irda but it might be 'less' work then trying to get the lirc to work with it in the pc

[18:39:51]

clever:

several years

[18:39:59]

clever:

less then 10 years old

[18:40:02]

clever:

gateway

[18:40:16]

** clever looks for it **

[18:40:28]

justinh:

all the IrDA modules I've ever seen just take power & data, then modulate the IR emitter themselves internally

[18:40:54]

clever:

seems to be missing

[18:41:10]

clever:

is there an ic inside?

[18:41:22]

clever:

or is it just an led wired to the pins sticking out of the casing?

[18:41:31]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

justinh: He's looking to 'gut' it for the IR led.

[18:41:34]

Eradan:

Will mythvideo handle video_ts folder playback ?

[18:41:50]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i might also want the ir trans also for receiver

[18:41:56]

justinh:

clever: it's all in one niftily encapsulated unit usually

[18:42:14]

clever:

i'll just rape the old cheap universal remote i found

[18:42:49]

clever:

lol it still has baterys

[18:43:05]

clever:

and it still works

[18:43:12]

** clever trys programing it just for fun:P **

[18:43:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: If you need a nice, clean drawing for a simple ir blaster — check out the pic I drew about a year ago... http://jartz.homeip.net:8008/files/ir_blaster.jpg

[18:43:28]

amrit is now known as amrit|wrk

[18:43:48]

clever:

i found one on the lirc site

[18:43:52]

clever:

2 components

[18:44:00]

clever:

not counting the com port plug

[18:44:09]

clever:

yep thats allmost identical:)

[18:44:16]

clever:

but it even has pinouts:D

[18:44:46]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Well, catually 3... Diode, resistor, and ir led. It is the same, just a 'prettier' version for the electronically challenged. ;-)

[18:44:46]

onewheelskyward:

Does anyone know offhand the default path ivtv uses to look for firmware?

[18:45:00]

clever:

yeah

[18:45:09]

justinh:

/lib/firmware maybe ?

[18:45:12]

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[18:45:15]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i made a device for listening to a phone before

[18:45:18]

clever:

2 compents

[18:45:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

onewheelskyward: It's distribution-dependent iirc, but I think it's /lib/firmware or /lib/hotplug/firmware ...

[18:45:35]

clever:

a filter cap and a unmodyfied pair of headphones

[18:45:46]

onewheelskyward:

justinh: That's where the firmware files are, but ivtvi s complaing that it can't find them. I'll try the hotplug dir.

[18:45:51]

clever:

touch 1 leg of the filter cap to the headphone plug

[18:46:01]

clever:

other leg to 1 side of the phone line

[18:46:13]

clever:

and tip of the headphone plug to the other side of the phone line

[18:46:22]

clever:

now you can hear all phone convoes

[18:46:37]

clever:

and the caller id signal sounds like dialup connecting

[18:46:59]

clever:

signal*

[18:47:02]

clever:

also be carefull because the ringing sound is i think 90v ac

[18:48:17]

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[18:50:49]

** J-e-f-f-A|work oops... lost ssh tunnel... **

[18:50:58]

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[18:52:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

onewheelskyward: On my FC4 backend, I've got the firmware in both /etc/firmware and /usr/lib/hotplug/firmware/

[18:52:54]

onewheelskyward:

aah, another path to check, thanks.

[18:53:46]

onewheelskyward:

You know, hotplug isn't even installed on my system. I'll get on that.

[18:54:15]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

onewheelskyward: I'm not sure 100% which one it's using — and my system's been running for 25 days, so it's not in the dmesg output anymore...

[18:55:49]

onewheelskyward:

I'll do one at a time and see if I can figure it out.

[18:56:16]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

onewheelskyward: As a matter of fact, my dmesg output is 'cdrom: This disc doesn't have any tracks I recognize!" — so I must have put in a blank DVD to export from myth, and forgot to kick off 'mythdvd'... oops!

[18:56:32]

onewheelskyward:

hehe

[18:56:47]

onewheelskyward:

geez...it doesn't help that I forgot to run my syslog on startup.

[18:56:58]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[18:59:31]

clever:

lol

[18:59:36]

clever:

theres nothing in this remote

[18:59:38]

clever:

1 board

[18:59:40]

clever:

1 ic

[18:59:48]

clever:

a normal and a filter cap

[18:59:54]

clever:

a diode

[18:59:59]

onewheelskyward:

Remotes have been around for a while, makes sense that they'd be pretty simple these days.

[19:00:03]

clever:

pair of resistors and a transistor

[19:00:18]

clever:

and a few other tiny parts i dont know

[19:00:29]

clever:

i also have a giant OLD remote

[19:00:36]

clever:

which doesnt even have number keys on it

[19:00:41]

clever:

and runs off a 9v batery

[19:00:50]

clever:

that one aint going to be as skiny:P

[19:01:38]

clever:

also that jpg you linked doesnt show the internal part of the led which can also reveal which side is cathod

[19:02:16]

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[19:03:12]

onewheelskyward:

Oh, a channel up channel down clicker?

[19:03:21]

clever:

yeah but i think it also has power and vol

[19:03:24]

** clever fetches it **

[19:03:24]

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[19:03:59]

clever:

wait this one has numbers:P

[19:04:07]

onewheelskyward:

tease

[19:04:15]

clever:

but its got atleast 2 seperate boards in it

[19:04:43]

clever:

whoa

[19:04:48]

clever:

pair of ir led's:D

[19:04:54]

sebrock|a:

anyone using partimage?

[19:05:50]

onewheelskyward:

J-e-f-f-A|work: It turns out that the /lib/firmware path is fine — I needed to install hotplug.

[19:06:06]

clever:

lol

[19:06:18]

clever:

yeah i had to build and install hotplug once before

[19:06:25]

clever:

getting wifi drivers on a livecd

[19:06:32]

clever:

just to test the pc's card and linux

[19:07:28]

GreyFoxx:

ls

[19:07:31]

GreyFoxx:

oops

[19:07:42]

onewheelskyward:

I do that all the time. :)

[19:07:59]

clever:

i allmost did it 5 times in this room today

[19:08:11]

clever:

using screen and a split so its tricky to tell which split has focus

[19:08:19]

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[19:09:12]

kormoc:

su

[19:09:18]

kormoc:

Imnotthatstupid

[19:09:20]

kormoc:

:P

[19:09:31]

clever:

LOL

[19:10:09]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

onewheelskyward: cool... I would fix it on my system, but it's gonna get 'retired' soon anyways... (in the midst of putting my new backend together)

[19:10:13]

GreyFoxx:

I do it all the time when sending something to the wrong channel

[19:10:30]

GreyFoxx:

but In almost 16 years on IRC I've never send my password to the open channel :)

[19:10:48]

GreyFoxx:

But that just means I'm due

[19:10:59]

clever:

lol

[19:11:05]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

GreyFoxx: I did that once a few months ago... Before I setup my irc pw to be automatic...

[19:11:17]

clever:

mines allready automatic

[19:11:23]

GreyFoxx:

I open a query to nickserv before I send a password :)

[19:11:40]

onewheelskyward:

I just send them in the server status window.

[19:11:46]

clever:

authserv often complains because i just sent it to 'authserv'

[19:11:49]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

GreyFoxx: That's what I do now when I'm not on my backend... ;-)

[19:12:01]

clever:

you need to sent it to auhserv@services.....net

[19:12:08]

clever:

but /as also works:)

[19:12:27]

clever:

thats mainly so i cant go on a network without nickserv and /nick nickserv

[19:13:10]

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[19:15:21]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i just had an idea on recording ir signals

[19:15:29]

clever:

without a ir trans

[19:15:51]

clever:

wire the ir led of the remote directly into the com port:P

[19:17:42]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: You *might* be able to do that, but if you get it wrong, you'll fry your comm port. What is it you're trying to do? Learn a remote so you can 'blast' from myth?

[19:17:59]

clever:

yeah

[19:18:17]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: What's the device you want to control?

[19:18:25]

clever:

dct2000 cable box

[19:18:38]

clever:

serial port isnt enabled but i havent tryed to get it enabled yet

[19:19:14]

clever:

my dad doesnt see the point in making the tv more complex

[19:19:21]

clever:

so he isnt going to call in to get it enabled

[19:19:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: There's probably a config file on the web. — And to get the serial port enabled, I've heard it's often as easy as calling your cable co and telling them you want to use it with a tivo via the serial port.

[19:19:40]

onewheelskyward:

Isn't the dct2000 well documented in lirc's remote database?

[19:19:59]

clever:

yeah i think i saw a file for it

[19:20:07]

clever:

id like to also control the pc too later on with the remote

[19:20:21]

clever:

i know how to program the aux button as a second tv/cable box

[19:20:25]

clever:

and i can put it on its own code

[19:20:35]

onewheelskyward:

That would be cool. I have my PVR-350's remote for that. I had it working a couple of incarnations ago, it was really nice.

[19:20:36]

clever:

so the real cablebox wont hear it

[19:21:07]

clever:

something else i thought of

[19:21:14]

clever:

take a remote for the cable box

[19:21:23]

clever:

mod it so theres a headphone plug in it

[19:21:26]

clever:

the switched type

[19:21:34]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Yeah, but if you're controling it with Myth, you don't want the cable box to be controlled by anything *but* myth...

[19:21:35]

clever:

if nothing is pluged in the remote works as normal

[19:21:50]

clever:

if you plug the computer into the side of the remote

[19:21:59]

clever:

it detaches half the cable box remote

[19:21:59]

clever:

and borrows its led

[19:23:06]

clever:

right now im having to tell myth to change the channel

[19:23:11]

clever:

then i tell the cable box the same

[19:23:37]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: It's much easier to just buy an IR led... And alot less 'clunky'... Here's a pic of my home-made blasters, as well as my current backend and 3 sat boxes: http://jartz.homeip.net:8008/files/my_ir_blasters.jpg

[19:23:44]

onewheelskyward:

If you have to plug your remote into your computer, doesn't that defeat the whole 'remote' thing?

[19:24:00]

clever:

the remote would be the transmitter

[19:24:13]

kormoc:

I just use the MCE remote and blaster combo, it's usb and dirt simple for lirc setup

[19:24:14]

clever:

it would sit beside the pc pluged in and the board detached from its led

[19:24:34]

onewheelskyward:

aah I see.

[19:24:39]

kormoc:

also supports the MCE keyboard/mouse which rocks too

[19:24:39]

clever:

and when i unplug

[19:24:46]

clever:

the switched headphone plug reconnects the led

[19:25:06]

onewheelskyward:

I think you need a remote that controls myth, and then leave the transmitter in place.

[19:25:13]

clever:

yeah

[19:25:20]

clever:

id need a second remote with my idea

[19:25:50]

clever:

odd

[19:25:53]

clever:

1 hour tv show

[19:25:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Although that's a 'clever' idea, I don't think it's very practical... just buy an IR led!!!!

[19:25:59]

clever:

starting at :25

[19:26:18]

clever:

wait i paused livetv for 25mins :P

[19:26:32]

clever:

i hit pause when fetching a remote and forgot to unpause it:P

[19:26:40]

** J-e-f-f-A|work thinks "What is LiveTV" ?!? ;-) **

[19:27:02]

clever:

its no longer live:P

[19:27:19]

** clever sets it to 1.2 speed **

[19:27:32]

clever:

should catch up in a bit:)

[19:34:05]

akaias (akaias!n=akaias@c-76-16-18-102.hsd1.il.comcast.net) has quit (Remote closed the connection)

[19:34:40]

clever:

i got a old remote taken appart that i can probly rape for its led

[19:35:02]

clever:

i can use its diode also

[19:35:11]

clever:

but then i'll need to search for a resistor

[19:37:52]

justinh:

can we change the channel name to #clever please?

[19:38:00]

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[19:38:03]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v j-rod

[19:39:35]

GlemSom:

I'm having a bit trouble with some DVD's since mplayer does not support DVD menues... So I was wondering if there's a player out there that supports DVD menues? (and ofcause AC3 and all that stuff)

[19:39:45]

justinh:

Internal supports menus

[19:39:53]

justinh:

as does xine, ogle, vlc ....

[19:40:11]

justinh:

even mplayer does in some revisions :-P

[19:40:15]

clever:

yeah

[19:40:25]

clever:

i think the mplayer menu's are in beta

[19:40:51]

clever:

how many of those support lirc?

[19:41:11]

justinh:

xine does, I know for sure. ogle probably does

[19:41:27]

clever:

mplayer gives errors connecting to lirc on startup

[19:41:30]

justinh:

any that don't, you can bodge-fix with irexec

[19:41:32]

clever:

because i dont have lirc going

[19:41:51]

clever:

yeah

[19:42:02]

clever:

wraper script to kill irexec when they close too

[19:43:32]

justinh:

GlemSom: you might end up patching whatever player you choose so you can still avoid the annoying trailers & other messages that some players won't let you skip

[19:45:39]

gbee (gbee!n=gbee@cpc1-derb5-0-0-cust840.lei3.cable.ntl.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:46:32]

justinh:

evening gbee

[19:47:12]

gbee:

anyone tell me if the hauppauge remotes operate on the standard remote frequency? I'm wondering if I can use one with my homemade IR receiver :)

[19:47:17]

gbee:

evening justinh

[19:47:42]

cesman:

the car is packed!

[19:48:09]

justinh:

gbee: shouldn't be any problem

[19:48:35]

gbee:

hmm, might bid on it then

[19:48:40]

justinh:

cesman: just out of interest, what are you taking?

[19:48:57]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gbee: I believe they're using 38khz carrier.

[19:50:01]

gbee:

someone is selling the remote without the card and I've wanted a better remote (all my cards are the older models without remotes)

[19:50:42]

cesman:

Dragon 2.0, 37" Aquos, diskless Via frontend, systemto demo install, N800 to serve has quadi-frontend

[19:50:48]

gbee:

J-e-f-f-A|work: ok thanks

[19:51:26]

justinh:

cesman: cool :)

[19:51:38]

cesman:

should be enough to steal attend from Dell and IBM :)

[19:51:40]

** gbee goes to remind himself whether 38khz will actually work as it's been a while since he knew what the different frequencies actually are **

[19:52:35]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gbee: Most IR receivers will work up to 40khz... 38khz is the most common frequency. Some of the obscure stuff it 56khz... but not much.

[19:52:36]

gbee:

cesman: very nice

[19:52:48]

justinh:

gbee: most IR receivers.. er what J-e-f-f-A|work said

[19:53:08]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

justinh: hehe

[19:53:09]

justinh:

hrm mythvideo isn't displaying poster images on my dev box

[19:53:11]

gbee:

J-e-f-f-A|work: again thanks – saves me the leg work (or finger work)

[19:53:33]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

cesman: Knock 'em dead!

[19:53:47]

gbee:

one of those facts which I learnt when it mattered, but forgot a week later

[19:54:09]

justinh:

d'oh of course..

[19:54:17]

justinh:

I need to do some mysql-fu

[19:55:14]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

cesman: Back in 1991 I participated in a 'computer show' in a mall... I represented my local Amiga user's group. I was playing a few animations, and people kept asking where the VCR was... It was like watching a saturday morning cartoon, but was generated in 'real time' by the Amiga... ;-) I had 10 people around my 'boot' continuously... Hopefully it will be the same for you at your booth cesman ...

[19:55:32]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

s/boot/booth/ ...

[19:55:43]

** cesman misses his Amiga **

[19:55:52]

cesman:

the last two years, KnoppM

[19:56:01]

cesman:

the last two years, KnoppMyth has had a booth at SCALE

[19:56:12]

cesman:

both years, we've been really busy

[19:56:15]

** J-e-f-f-A|work still loves his Amiga so much, he hasn't sold it yet, even though he hasn't used it in over a year!!! **

[20:15:38]

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[20:15:49]

justinh:

is mythvideo/mythmusic ever likely to be built into mythfrontend do you reckon?

[20:16:13]

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[20:16:43]

justinh:

i.e. just pull it all under a 'media' umbrella so to speak

[20:17:46]

gbee:

it's something I'd advocate – in fact I was only thinking about it today

[20:18:53]

justinh:

whenever I get to thinking about the ui improvements I've had ideas for it makes much more sense to have it all over the interface

[20:19:09]

gbee:

we've already talked of and basically agreed in principal to merging mythdvd into mythfrontend and that was before it was merged into mythvideo – so merging mythvideo seems a logical step

[20:19:31]

janneg:

I wouldn't like that. A commen make file which builds first mythtv and then the plugins would be good idea

[20:19:32]

gbee:

then as you say, merging mythmusic as the other 'media' plugin becomes more likely

[20:19:48]

hads:

Cleaning the interface would be one advantage to having them integrated

[20:20:18]

hads:

Not that it's dirty as such.

[20:20:20]

justinh:

janneg: I see your point. I mean how long a configure line can we cope with? ;)

[20:20:45]

gbee:

the other option (IMHO) would be to split mythplugins into two new groups, media plugins and information plugins

[20:20:46]

hads:

Heh, you should see the configure for OppenPBX.org

[20:22:12]

kormoc:

justinh, 32k worth :P

[20:22:17]

gbee:

I'm not sure you'd bother with configure options to enable/disable mythmusic and mythvideo, you'd just have an option in the setup to hide the menu entries

[20:22:25]

justinh:

gbee: I think that's a good idea

[20:22:34]

justinh:

kormoc: ?

[20:22:47]

kormoc:

justinh, that's the max size commandline bash can handle :P

[20:22:48]

justinh:

ahhh nm

[20:22:56]

janneg:

gbee: I think we agreed that dvd viewing should go into the frontend but transcoding should stay in mythvideo after the merge

[20:23:38]

gbee:

yeah, thanks for reminding me

[20:23:39]

janneg:

kormoc: 65384 characters

[20:24:21]

justinh:

well, time for me to kick back & enjoy some telly. don't want my braincell to get all burnt out

[20:24:32]

kormoc:

janneg, ooh? thought it was half that, my mistake

[20:25:54]

janneg:

unsigned/signed maybe? I think the kernel can handle much longer command line. the autohell check can't

[20:28:57]

kormoc:

perhaps

[20:30:20]

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[20:32:41]

cheeseboy16:

http://pastebin.ca/347948

[20:32:49]

cheeseboy16:

how do i fix it?

[20:33:32]

gbee:

restart mysql

[20:33:41]

cheeseboy16:

how?

[20:33:53]

hads:

Ug

[20:34:43]

gbee:

depends on the distro, but assuming it uses an init script you can try – /etc/init.d/mysqld restart

[20:35:54]

crazyhair (crazyhair!n=user@p57B95ACC.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))

[20:36:17]

cheeseboy16:

its ubuntu edgy command didn't work

[20:37:38]

** gbee contemplates switching off his machine and doing something less soul destroying **

[20:37:49]

hads:

:)

[20:38:29]

hads:

cheeseboy16: People won't spoon feed you here, you need to help people help you by searching around and trying to figure things out for your self.

[20:38:40]

gbee:

cheeseboy16: I can't help you, unless you help yourself

[20:38:51]

hads:

Also, reports better than "didn't work" are a requirement.

[20:40:33]

cheeseboy16:

is it supposed to say anything when i use the command?

[20:41:54]

hads:

I imagine it will say something like "Restarting Mysql server"

[20:42:01]

gbee:

it'll print out some stuff about mysqld stopping and then being started again OR an error saying the file couldn't be found

[20:42:02]

hads:

You will need to be root

[20:42:31]

gbee:

important detail that

[20:42:46]

cheeseboy16:

Errors were encountered while processing:

[20:42:46]

cheeseboy16:

mythtv-database

[20:42:46]

cheeseboy16:

mythtv

[20:42:46]

cheeseboy16:

E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)

[20:42:56]

cheeseboy16:

just updated and got that

[20:43:07]

hads:

That's lovely.

[20:44:59]

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[20:53:44]

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[20:57:50]

gizmobay:

Anyone know where I can find other movie streams like desync.com for mythstream?

[20:58:10]

ShiftyPowers (ShiftyPowers!n=Shifty@mail.franciscopartners.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[21:04:24]

cheeseboy16:

Access denied for user 'mythtv'@'%' to database 'mythconverg'

[21:04:31]

cheeseboy16:

why am i gettin that now?

[21:05:55]

gizmobay:

you have a permmission issue

[21:07:12]

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[21:07:27]

cheeseboy16:

how do i fix it?

[21:07:57]

gizmobay:

which distro?

[21:08:03]

Fifth5:

when you re-encode commercials out, do you need to generate a cutlist even if you already had them flagged for commercials automatically?

[21:08:48]

tank-man:

yes

[21:09:05]

Fifth5:

Kk

[21:09:05]

cheeseboy16:

ubuntu

[21:09:13]

tank-man:

you can copy the skip list to the cut list easily

[21:09:30]

tank-man:

mythcommflag --gencutlist

[21:10:14]

Fifth5:

tank-man, oh ok so the --gencutlist uses the skip list?

[21:10:37]

tank-man:

copies the skip list ot the cut list

[21:10:38]

tank-man:

yes

[21:11:25]

Fifth5:

ok cool thanks

[21:13:01]

gizmobay:

mysql -u root mythconverg

[21:13:24]

gizmobay:

UPDATE user SET Password=PASSWORD('mythtv') WHERE user='mythtv';

[21:13:37]

gizmobay:

FLUSH PRIVILEGES;

[21:13:47]

gizmobay:

then restart mysql

[21:14:04]

cheeseboy16:

ERROR 1045 (28000): Access denied for user 'root'@'localhost' (using password: NO)

[21:14:08]

hads:

Last one isn't nessecary

[21:14:19]

tank-man:

add -p

[21:15:13]

cheeseboy16:

ERROR 1049 (42000): Unknown database 'mythconverg'

[21:15:31]

tank-man:

did you install mythtv ?

[21:15:36]

gizmobay:

did you create the database?

[21:15:36]

cheeseboy16:

yes

[21:15:42]

cheeseboy16:

dunoo

[21:15:54]

gizmobay:

you install from a repo?

[21:15:59]

gizmobay:

or compile?

[21:16:04]

cheeseboy16:

i was just follwing instructions and ran into an error

[21:16:04]

Fifth5 is now known as Fifth

[21:16:13]

cheeseboy16:

i used apt-get

[21:16:34]

tank-man:

broken package

[21:16:39]

tank-man:

:/

[21:17:27]

gizmobay:

find / -name 'mythconverg' -print

[21:18:29]

cheeseboy16:

um. i don't have a printer

[21:18:54]

gizmobay:

lol

[21:19:02]

gizmobay:

print means print to screen

[21:19:11]

tank-man:

cheeseboy16, try installing from source

[21:20:27]

Fifth:

LOL

[21:20:29]

Fifth:

thats great

[21:20:55]

cheeseboy16:

http://pastebin.ca/348019

[21:21:23]

gizmobay:

you have no database

[21:21:40]

Fifth:

cheeseboy16, now execute the command as root

[21:22:18]

gizmobay:

yeah do the find as root

[21:22:47]

cheeseboy16:

does nothing

[21:23:04]

gizmobay:

takes you back to the command prompt

[21:23:07]

hads:

THere's those useful responses again.

[21:23:12]

Fifth:

lol

[21:23:17]

Fifth:

cheeseboy16, it means it wasn't found

[21:23:23]

clever:

having trouble with a /dev/video0 device

[21:23:35]

cheeseboy16:

ok..

[21:23:42]

gizmobay:

do this

[21:23:44]

clever:

no video when testing in xawtv

[21:24:00]

gizmobay:

mysql -u root -p

[21:24:06]

gizmobay:

enter password

[21:24:11]

gizmobay:

then

[21:24:30]

cheeseboy16:

k

[21:24:33]

gizmobay:

create database mythconverge;

[21:24:43]

gizmobay:

then

[21:24:44]

gizmobay:

exit

[21:24:53]

cheeseboy16:

ok

[21:25:44]

gizmobay:

now do

[21:25:52]

gizmobay:

mysql -u root -p < /usr/share/doc/mythtv-0.20/database/mc.sql

[21:26:17]

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[21:26:19]

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[21:26:20]

gardengnome:

re

[21:27:33]

cheeseboy16:

bash: /usr/share/doc/mythtv-0.20/database/mc.sql: No such file or directory

[21:28:21]

gizmobay:

as root

[21:28:31]

tank-man:

he probably doesnt have that file

[21:28:36]

gizmobay:

find / -name 'mc.sql' -print

[21:28:38]

clever:

or its in a diff place

[21:28:44]

clever:

id try locate mc.sql

[21:28:44]

hads:

locate may work

[21:28:45]

clever:

first

[21:29:02]

kormoc:

gizmobay, that will take forever, locate would be a much faster first attempt

[21:29:07]

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[21:29:12]

gizmobay:

your right

[21:29:15]

gizmobay:

do

[21:29:25]

gizmobay:

locate mc.sql

[21:29:59]

cheeseboy16:

usr/share/mythtv/sql/mc.sql

[21:30:07]

cheeseboy16:

w/ / before

[21:30:35]

gizmobay:

mysql -u root -p < /usr/share/mythtv/sql/mc.sql

[21:31:00]

gizmobay:

mysql -u root -p mythconverg < /usr/share/mythtv/sql/mc.sql

[21:31:34]

cheeseboy16:

both of those said nothing

[21:31:54]

gizmobay:

did it give you an error?

[21:31:56]

gardengnome:

hashbang: hey there. i've *finally* finished my vga->rgb cable :)

[21:31:57]

cheeseboy16:

no

[21:32:16]

cheeseboy16:

greg@greg-desktop:~$ mysql -u root -p < /usr/share/mythtv/sql/mc.sql

[21:32:16]

cheeseboy16:

Enter password:

[21:32:16]

cheeseboy16:

greg@greg-desktop:~$ mysql -u root -p mythconverg < /usr/share/mythtv/sql/mc.sql

[21:32:16]

cheeseboy16:

Enter password:

[21:32:16]

cheeseboy16:

greg@greg-desktop:~$

[21:33:04]

gizmobay:

type mythtv-setup

[21:33:04]

hashbang:

gardengnome: yay! well done!

[21:33:09]

hashbang:

gardengnome: happy with it?

[21:33:17]

tank-man:

cheeseboy16, you should have backed up the database before updating

[21:33:33]

gizmobay:

he didn't have one

[21:33:43]

gardengnome:

hashbang: yes, very so :)

[21:33:55]

hashbang:

gardengnome: good, glad you're as happy as I am.

[21:33:56]

tank-man:

he says he got that error after updating

[21:34:07]

gardengnome:

hashbang: i'll need to tweak my modeline a bit but that was to be expected.

[21:34:28]

gizmobay:

he did a search and there was no mythconverg found

[21:35:07]

hashbang:

-vsync

[21:35:11]

hashbang:

seems to work for me

[21:35:18]

hashbang:

YMMV, naturally

[21:37:53]

timtimred:

heya

[21:37:53]

cheeseboy16:

can't get it to work :(

[21:37:56]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: How long is the cable?

[21:38:09]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: 1.50 metres approximately

[21:38:31]

gizmobay:

what's it doing?

[21:38:43]

hashbang:

heh, I just priced up a Dell E520 vs. the bits to build an equivalent system

[21:38:56]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: You'll probably be ok then... It would be a 'cleaner' signal with shielded cat5 or real coax, but that's pretty sort.

[21:39:16]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: yeah, i figured it wouldn't hurt too much.

[21:39:39]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i can still re-do it for a third time. i just needed a proof of concept ;)

[21:40:34]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: What's the device you're connecting to?

[21:40:38]

bipolar:

I'm running .20 on ubuntu edgy. I'm using bashpodder to download my video and audio podcasts. Is there a command I can run to add these downloaded items to my media and music lists?

[21:41:02]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: it's an old (>10years) CRT tv.

[21:41:05]

bipolar:

myth doesn't use inotify does it?

[21:41:07]

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[21:41:41]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: Ah, so you've got a 'scart' connector on the CRT tv, and made an HD15 -> Scart adapter, no?

[21:42:00]

clintar (clintar!n=clintar@66.236.89.136.ptr.us.xo.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[21:42:03]

jalex:

is there a place for thoughts on video/transcoding on freenode?

[21:42:06]

cheeseboy16:

it doesnt like my video card

[21:42:23]

cheeseboy16:

tuner card*

[21:42:51]

gizmobay:

did it detect it?

[21:42:56]

cheeseboy16:

yes

[21:42:56]

gizmobay:

in mythtv-setup

[21:43:26]

gizmobay:

did you setup a video source?

[21:43:34]

cheeseboy16:

yes

[21:43:44]

cheeseboy16:

says failed to open the card

[21:43:58]

gizmobay:

what kind of card?

[21:44:18]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: Yep — converted the seperate sync to composite. — If you find that your adapter isn't clear enough, or has some 'bleeding', then take the VGA cable from an old monitor and lop it off at the monitor end, then put your scart connector on there, and the little composite sync adapter inside the scart hood.. ;-)

[21:44:20]

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[21:44:40]

cheeseboy16:

happuage bt878

[21:45:06]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: will do :) i can see me build some more of these nifty things ;)

[21:45:19]

hads:

Do yourself a favour and get a PVR* card

[21:45:39]

cheeseboy16:

im poor

[21:46:07]

tank-man:

then you are rich enough for lots of hard drive space? or cpu power?

[21:46:15]

tank-man:

cause thats what you need

[21:46:29]

tank-man:

if you use one of those cards

[21:46:41]

tank-man:

they make videos that take a lot of space

[21:46:48]

cheeseboy16:

i don't need so save videos

[21:46:52]

tank-man:

ok

[21:47:08]

tank-man:

i think then mythtv is overkill for you then

[21:47:12]

cheeseboy16:

can't actually 6ig hd

[21:47:27]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: the only problem with CAT5 is that there are only 8 wires. i'm using a battery attached to the scart connector now to switch my TV into RGB mode ;)

[21:47:30]

hads:

6G?

[21:47:36]

cheeseboy16:

gig*

[21:48:03]

cheeseboy16:

my good hd died

[21:48:27]

tank-man:

he said he doesnt want to save videos

[21:48:33]

tank-man:

mythtv is overkill for him

[21:48:45]

hads:

6G isn't enough to watch TV

[21:48:54]

tank-man:

yea it is

[21:49:12]

tank-man:

those bttv cards work good enough

[21:49:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: I think there's a pin on the scart connection that provides power — you could probably just jumper that to the right pin instead of using a battery...

[21:49:29]

clever:

i got a 3gig file on a 1 hour show

[21:49:44]

clever:

aslong as you dont try to watch a 2 hour show in 1 sitting it would work

[21:49:46]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: (I'm in the US, so our TV's don't have that nice RGB connector on them!)

[21:49:51]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: true. i'll just rebuild it properly, that'll be the best solution

[21:50:01]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: how do you know this stuff then?

[21:50:01]

hads:

So, if the OS is on that HDD as well then you might be able to watch a 1 hour show if you're lucky :)

[21:50:08]

cheeseboy16:

what should i use instead?

[21:50:20]

gardengnome:

hashbang: do you still have to deinterlace?

[21:50:26]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: im in canada and i have component in svid in and compositein on my tv

[21:50:31]

tank-man:

cheeseboy16, try xawtv

[21:50:52]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: I was looking for a seperate sync -> composite sync adapter for an old video projector I have (Sony VPH-1030i) — so I could feed it composite sync.

[21:50:53]

clever:

or tvtime

[21:51:06]

cheeseboy16:

it doesnt look right on tvtime

[21:51:08]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: ah

[21:51:28]

clever:

what part of it doesnt look write?

[21:51:39]

** gizmobay is back **

[21:51:47]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: Very similar to a scart connection — just BNC connectors instead of a scart plug... ;-) And I read tons of pages about 'vga -> Scart' adapters in the process...

[21:51:52]

** gizmobay is back **

[21:51:57]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i went from composite video straight to RGB because my TV doesn't support s-video. i'm flabbergasted

[21:51:57]

jalex:

I saw a Sony projector that used some wireless video thing where you send the video over wifi...wonder what the performance on that is

[21:52:44]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

jalex: The only ones I've heard of were only good for low-bandwidth powerpoint stuff at about 15 frames per second max... No good for video...

[21:52:59]

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[21:53:04]

clever:

component==rgb?

[21:53:18]

hads:

There's a couple of standards in the works to do wireless video at the moment I think

[21:53:38]

hads:

So maybe in a year or two

[21:53:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: No. Component is an 'encoded' version of rgb.

[21:53:50]

clever:

ahh

[21:53:56]

jalex:

J-e-f-f-A|work, That makes more sense.. It's probably possible to do video someday, but without a built-in decoder, I can't see how the projector could do it over wireless

[21:54:27]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

jalex: It's kinda like a VNC session – at least the current incarnation of those wireless video adapters...

[21:54:51]

clever:

you could just stick a pair of rabit ears on it and broadcast over plain tv freq at normal tv framerates:P

[21:55:11]

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[21:55:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: Your TV may support s-video thru the scart connector. But you'll be much happier with the RGB quality...

[21:55:28]

jalex:

clever, that would be clever =)

[21:55:28]

clever:

cant be that hard to make/design a projector which can take raw cable in and just stick an antena on it

[21:55:46]

ServerSage:

So, if I do any kind of drive IO on my backend system (a du for example) I get ivtv DMA errors, and livetv gets very choppy.

[21:56:39]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

ServerSage: Sounds like IRQ conflicts... Have you tried moving the tuner to a different PCI slot?

[21:57:16]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: i've tried s-video through SCART but it doesn't work. and i'm indeed very happy with RGB. it's just annoying that almost no-one sells prebuilt circuits

[21:57:20]

ServerSage:

J-e-f-f-A|work: Yeah, I just got done moving it and my 3ware cards in every combo of PCI slot I could. Same results every time.

[21:57:30]

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[21:58:05]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

ServerSage: Was it working previously, or is this a new system?

[21:58:47]

ServerSage:

It's a new system, the pvt250 and the 3ware card are from my old mythtv box. I upgraded from a single proc to a dual.

[21:59:06]

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[22:02:01]

justinh:

gardengnome: evening :) so you eventually got that VGA – scart adapter worky then?

[22:02:23]

gardengnome:

justinh: yeppers

[22:02:38]

gardengnome:

justinh: i was actually looking for you but didn't recognize your nick name ;)

[22:03:07]

justinh:

I did something good today :)

[22:03:23]

ServerSage:

J-e-f-f-A|work: Am I to assume it's a bad motherboard?

[22:03:48]

gardengnome:

justinh: uh-uh. (?)

[22:04:38]

justinh:

gardengnome: ticket 3068

[22:05:09]

gardengnome:

justinh: cool stuff :)

[22:06:03]

justinh:

yeah thanks. it compiled 1st time and did what I wanted it to do 2nd time :D

[22:07:04]

justinh:

off to watch some more mythtv. bashing webpage graphics tomorrow I hope

[22:11:09]

dilano:

anyone know a quick and easy way of "deleting" a BUNCH of transports?

[22:11:54]

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[22:15:30]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

ServerSage: No, it's probably not a bad motherboard — You can probably re-distribute the IRQ's in the bios.

[22:15:35]

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[22:25:22]

tcpsyn:

is anyone using dual monitors and a TV?

[22:25:55]

tcpsyn:

I want the card that has the tv out to use 1280x1040 on the monitor and 1024x768 for the tvout.

[22:25:59]

tcpsyn:

is that possible?

[22:26:31]

tcpsyn:

I was just using XRandR to change the resolution when I wanted to watch TV... but xinerama disables that.

[22:26:57]

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[22:28:42]

xris:

tcpsyn: should be fine. you just need to set the resolution differently on each "screen" in x

[22:30:42]

tcpsyn:

in X or in xorg.conf?

[22:30:58]

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[22:31:17]

Zider:

X uses xorg.conf :P

[22:32:53]

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[22:34:04]

tcpsyn:

Right.. but is it a change that I can make in X, or does it have to be straight in the conf file?

[22:34:39]

tcpsyn:

or in the nvidia settings

[22:35:17]

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[22:41:25]

tcpsyn:

I can't seem to get the tv to work independantly, it's just a clone of the monitor.

[22:41:35]

tcpsyn:

And it only works when I swap into 1024x768

[22:41:45]

tcpsyn:

but my monitor looks like crap in 1024x768

[22:44:00]

tcpsyn:

I'd like to be able to watch myth on the tv and still use the monitor.

[22:44:09]

Zider:

what card do you have?

[22:44:21]

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[22:44:21]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: It depends on the video card — if it's only got a single display chip, the tv out shares the same output...

[22:44:42]

tcpsyn:

gefoce 6200

[22:44:46]

tcpsyn:

geforce rather

[22:45:05]

Zider:

ah, nvidia is easy

[22:45:20]

Zider:

just make two devices in the config, one for the monitor and one for the tv

[22:45:41]

Zider:

it's all described in the README for those that bothers to read ;P

[22:45:43]

tcpsyn:

I also have a tnt2 that I'm using on a different monitor

[22:45:46]

tcpsyn:

so I need 3 devices.

[22:46:00]

tcpsyn:

with 3 different resolutions

[22:46:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: Yes.

[22:46:36]

tcpsyn:

Zider, which readme.

[22:46:44]

Zider:

for the nvidia drivers ofcourse

[22:47:44]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: So you want to clone 'screen 2' (monitor) to 'screen 3' ( tv) using different resolutions? Zilder — is that possible?

[22:48:28]

Zider:

it's possible, but the smaller screen would be scrolling the big screens image

[22:48:31]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

er... make that Zider ^^^

[22:48:56]

tcpsyn:

so I need two devices and three screens?

[22:49:24]

** gizmobay is back **

[22:49:25]

Zider:

three Device sections and three Screen sections

[22:49:47]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: Do you really want the same output on your TV as your 2nd monitor? Or do you just want Myth to be on the TV?

[22:49:47]

Zider:

add "Screen 0" and "Screen 1" to those that are on the same card

[22:50:15]

clever:

i have my tvout as :0.1 and myth on it

[22:50:20]

tcpsyn:

I want myth to use just the tv.

[22:50:23]

clever:

but its a bit of a bother

[22:50:29]

clever:

i need the mouse on the tvout side of the screen to use myth

[22:50:45]

clever:

would work a little more seamlessly if i had a seperate :1.0 for myth

[22:50:59]

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[22:51:11]

clever:

but i dont want to fully seperate the tvout since i still use it for other stuff

[22:51:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: So then you would setup a 3rd screen that's just the TV at 1024x768, then run mythfrontend on that screen.

[22:52:04]

tcpsyn:

I don't understand how I can make two seperate devices out of one card.

[22:52:16]

** clever gets his xorg.conf **

[22:52:33]

Zider:

tcpsyn: it's explained in the readme and on tons of sites

[22:52:50]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: The card is capable of producing two disticts outputs... As Zider says — it's in the readme...

[22:53:00]

clever:

1st device has a identified a driver a busid and a screen set to 0

[22:53:03]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

s/distic??/distinct/

[22:53:14]

clever:

second device section is identical except for the screen setting

[22:53:21]

xris:

tcpsyn: it's not separate really separate devices.. pseudo-device for each video-out port.

[22:53:23]

clever:

and its identifier was renamed a little

[22:54:05]

** clever copys his xorg.conf to a site **

[22:54:16]

[1]Jack3 is now known as Jack3

[22:54:22]

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[22:54:36]

clever:

posibly a x restart:S

[22:55:11]

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[22:55:14]

clever:

wb

[22:55:16]

tcpsyn:

hrm.

[22:55:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: The card's got 3 connectors, right — probably a HD15 VGA, a S-Video and a DVI connector...

[22:55:43]

tcpsyn:

yes.

[22:55:45]

clever:

my card has 3 connectors but the svideo and composite share the same screen

[22:56:07]

tcpsyn:

I'm using an svideo->composite adapter

[22:56:22]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

tcpsyn: It's capable of outputting two signals at once — VGA & DVI or VGA & TV or TV & DVI ... etc... Or even internally 'cloning' one to the other...

[22:56:32]

clever:

http://clever.mine.nu:82/paste/xorg.conf

[22:56:55]

clever:

that shows how i got 2 screens out of my card

[22:57:08]

clever:

continuing the patern you can get 3

[22:57:15]

clever:

or even 10 if you had the cards:P

[22:57:57]

clever:

wait copy failed because it allready existed i think

[22:58:01]

** clever overwites it **

[22:58:04]

tcpsyn:

you've only got one device, one screen, and one monitor

[22:58:23]

clever:

thats a diff xorg.conf

[22:58:26]

clever:

and i got perm denied overwriting:P

[22:58:43]

clever:

http://clever.mine.nu:82/paste/xorg.conf.2

[22:59:02]

clever:

didnt know i allready stuck one of my conf files there before

[22:59:20]

tcpsyn:

ah.

[22:59:23]

hashbang:

gardengnome: no, because that modeline is interlaced, so you just display the two fields simultaneously for 1/25s and you get two frames out of a single image.

[22:59:26]

clever:

lol good think i did get a perm denied

[22:59:28]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Ah — I was going to say "ATI???

[22:59:35]

clever:

xorg.conf is a symlink to my real xorg conf

[22:59:44]

clever:

allmost scp'ed over my laptops xorg.conf

[22:59:54]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

gardengnome: And if you're going to a TV, you WANT it interlaced.

[23:00:19]

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[23:00:30]

clever:

i havent played with any interlacing settings on my tvout

[23:00:56]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: You don't want to. TV's are interlaced.

[23:01:01]

clever:

and i only notice the interlacing if mythtv freezes up mid frame and i wind up with the image split up

[23:01:06]

gardengnome:

hashbang, J-e-f-f-A|work: alright, that's what i fugred. now i've got to make it work :) i still get interlacing artefacts

[23:01:08]

hashbang:

gardengnome: you can pull the SCART RGB switch voltage from pin 9 of most VGA cards. Just use a 100 ohm resistor to limit the current drawn.

[23:01:34]

clever:

J-e-f-f-A|work: my tv has a button which causes it to draw the image widescreen on the normal tube

[23:01:37]

gardengnome:

J-e-f-f-A|work: it's a bit different if a tv-out encoder is involved, though. it's likely it'll mess up field order or something which will result in interlacing artefacts

[23:01:41]

gizmobay:

Anyone use mythmkmovie?

[23:01:42]

hashbang:

gardengnome: I think that's unavoidable to a certain extent

[23:01:46]

clever:

it just makes the image shorter

[23:01:50]

hashbang:

gardengnome: e.g. on side-scrolling credits

[23:01:55]

clever:

and doesnt project anything to the top/bottom edges

[23:02:07]

charles_a:

how does commercial flagging work? (I'm not asking how to enable it, just asking how it is implemented)

[23:02:15]

clever:

and using a option on my video player to force the moniters aspect ratio it matches the tv

[23:02:26]

gizmobay:

Is it only command line or does it give you a menu choice in the frontend?

[23:03:09]

gardengnome:

hashbang: i know i can use pin 9 to get 5V, i just don't have any spare wires to get it to m TV. i'll use a different cable next time

[23:03:19]

hashbang:

gardengnome: ah, right. Fair enough. :-)

[23:03:32]

hashbang:

gardengnome: I think I ended up having to use 25w cable, or something.

[23:03:40]

hashbang:

20 way

[23:03:45]

** hashbang checks the parts receipt **

[23:04:35]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

hashbang: That's a bit overkill... you really only need 3x coax (for r,g,b), and a handful of signal lines... I think 3 or 4 would do it! ;-)

[23:04:51]

gardengnome:

hashbang: your modeline works well, btw. except for my interlacing problems, of course – it looks like the whole picture is chopped into vertical stripes, each being 10 or 20 pixels high. looks interesting :)

[23:05:18]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: I had audio in/out and composite out from the SCART to a phono, too

[23:05:30]

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[23:05:53]

clever:

gardengnome: i get my image split into chunks x pixels WIDE every now and then

[23:06:02]

clever:

with the colors from several chunks merging and mixing up

[23:06:06]

hashbang:

gardengnome: got a digicam to capture it?

[23:06:20]

gardengnome:

hashbang: nope, sorry. but i think xvidtune can do screen captures.

[23:06:24]

clever:

and thats with the lcd panel on my laptop:P

[23:06:25]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

hashbang: Well, that's two more lines... preferrably coax, but probably not that big of a deal if the whole cable is shielded. I'd say the best cable is one cut off of an old monitor, then a scart cable fitted to the cut end...

[23:06:45]

hashbang:

gardengnome: not if you're using Xv, and besides, that should show a perfect picture.

[23:07:01]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: no, 2x3=6 lines

[23:07:18]

gardengnome:

hashbang: i was told xvidtune can indeed do screen captures of Xv content.

[23:07:22]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: no old monitors, sorry. :-)

[23:07:36]

clever:

i got many moniters in the garage that are half working

[23:07:40]

hashbang:

gardengnome: yeah, but it sounds like what you're experiencing is a hardware/timing bug

[23:07:44]

gardengnome:

hashbang: you're right, though, software screen captures won't do any good.

[23:07:48]

clever:

theres even 1 in the car tent covered in ice

[23:07:57]

clever:

could just lop the cord off and mail it to ya:P

[23:07:58]

gardengnome:

hashbang: yep. it's possible the modeline will need some adjusting

[23:08:20]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

hashbang: Yes, if you're using regular wires... if you're using a monitor cable (or a cable for RGB use), it's got at least three little coax cables in it... center & shield...

[23:08:51]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

hashbang: Or if an off-the-shelf cable is purchased, they're known as "Triple Shielded"...

[23:08:51]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: I had to go with what I could find in Maplin.co.uk

[23:09:02]

clever:

im using a composite+audio(3 rca lines) for my component video and i dont notice any quality diff

[23:09:11]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: it works fine, so I'm happy

[23:09:23]

clever:

and the cable isnt that large and doesnt seem to be sheilded much

[23:09:36]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: the only thing that tends to happen is if the CPU is busy (I think), the picture can get a bit unstable.

[23:09:44]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: most noticeable when using emulators

[23:09:58]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: The best resolution you can expect to be able to read for that is about 640x480 though... fine for video, very bad for shells!

[23:10:36]

clever:

the only think i have that puts out composite is my dvd player

[23:10:40]

clever:

i mean component

[23:10:46]

RasQulec:

is mythtv able to automaticly switch resolutions for the video format? [such as for 4:3 videos do 480p and for 16:9 do 720 or 1080]

[23:11:19]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Does your TV have a scart input with RGB?

[23:11:28]

clever:

dont think so

[23:11:33]

clever:

input 1 is composite+aud

[23:11:44]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: So you're in the US?

[23:11:45]

clever:

2 is component+composite+aud

[23:11:54]

clever:

and 3 is composite+aud

[23:11:58]

clever:

and im in canada

[23:12:06]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Using NTSC?

[23:12:08]

GreyFoxx:

RasQulec: It can using xrandr assuming your driver supports it. I don't use it personally so I can;t tell you how to configure it :)

[23:12:10]

clever:

yeah ntsc

[23:12:24]

clever:

im using input 2 for both the dvd and the compute

[23:12:26]

clever:

r

[23:12:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: And does your TV have S-Video too, or just composite (yellow rca jack, just like the audio)

[23:12:41]

clever:

the tv can show either 2's composite or 2's component

[23:12:50]

clever:

theres also svideo

[23:12:53]

clever:

which im using on input 1

[23:13:04]

clever:

im feeding it 3 things thru 2 inputs

[23:13:10]

RasQulec:

GreyFoxx: Ah well if its possible to do I suspect I can find out how to do it

[23:13:24]

clever:

its a complex setup

[23:13:35]

clever:

my dad refuses to even try to use mythtv

[23:14:09]

clever:

the video from the digital box leaves thru both composite and svideo

[23:14:12]

GreyFoxx:

My father begged me to install one for him when he saw mine :)

[23:14:15]

clever:

the svideo goes right to the tv

[23:14:22]

clever:

the composite goes out to the pc

[23:14:33]

clever:

then comes back in when using mythtv and into input2 on the tv

[23:14:45]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Mine's complex too, but I made it simple for my wife — the monitor is hooked up to the sterio which has a video switcher. Whatever the sterio is set to, that's what's on the TV and comes out the speakers... VCR, DVD, Sattelite, Myth, etc...

[23:14:59]

clever:

i have 2 audio cards in my myth box

[23:15:12]

clever:

and i configured both mythtv and mplayer to default to the tv's audio card

[23:15:21]

hashbang:

J-e-f-f-A: yes, wife/gf-acceptance-factor is an issue. :-)

[23:15:23]

clever:

so most sounds come out of the pc speakers

[23:15:26]

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[23:15:32]

clever:

but tv comes out the 2nd audio card and into the tv

[23:15:44]

clever:

no need to hit a switch to change the speaker lines over:)

[23:16:09]

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[23:16:16]

clever:

ahh

[23:16:33]

clever:

my frontend is also the backend and a linux pc i use at the desk

[23:16:43]

clever:

dont want its audio to allways come from the t

[23:16:44]

clever:

v

[23:17:17]

tcpsyn:

I hope that's not what you're talking about.

[23:17:22]

clever:

if you goto http://clever.mine.nu:81/ and click laptop youll see some pics of my tv using the tvout

[23:17:24]

tcpsyn:

Because that tells me just about nothing :)

[23:17:27]

clever:

and the laptop in peices

[23:18:35]

clever:

the irc that you can see on the tv in a few pics

[23:18:41]

clever:

is running off the laptop which is in peices

[23:18:51]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: what'd you do, remove the LCD all together?

[23:18:57]

clever:

yes

[23:19:14]

clever:

i can easily pull the lcd panel off while its running

[23:19:22]

clever:

it also doubles the batery life when on batery

[23:19:48]

clever:

also in further pics youll see the keybard remoed

[23:20:02]

clever:

i had irssi running on the laptop

[23:20:04]

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[23:20:10]

clever:

then i ssh'ed in from what is now the mythtv box

[23:20:22]

clever:

and stuck the ssh client on the tvout

[23:20:34]

clever:

letting me use the irc client in the laptop as i take the laptop appart

[23:20:41]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: That reminds me... I've got an old PIII 650Mhz laptop I could use as a SD frontend... Humm....

[23:21:04]

clever:

3 of my laptops have tv out

[23:21:22]

clever:

i could easily rip the lcd panel off and slip it in beside the tv

[23:21:29]

clever:

and it would be very compact

[23:21:47]

clever:

thin frontend case:P

[23:23:22]

clever:

that reminds me

[23:23:26]

clever:

the gateway eats hdd's for lunch

[23:23:36]

clever:

what if i made it into a netbooting frontend:D

[23:23:57]

clever:

id need to find it first though:P

[23:24:00]

RasQulec:

wee netboot

[23:24:13]

clever:

also it doesnt have a net card built in

[23:24:18]

RasQulec:

hm

[23:24:22]

clever:

id need to find my pcmcia card

[23:24:27]

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[23:24:43]

** clever goes looking for parts and cameras **

[23:26:53]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: Or just get an IDE-44 to Compact Flash adapter, and a small CF card. Then boot off the CF, and continue booting off a network share...

[23:27:16]

clever:

the harddrive controler in the laptop causes bad sectors somehow

[23:27:40]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

clever: It may just be heat... it could just be a poor design...

[23:27:41]

clever:

i can just shove the floppy drive in and use a floppy to get the kernel pulled in

[23:27:56]

RasQulec:

write the CF and then make it read only

[23:28:00]

RasQulec:

in hardware

[23:28:03]

clever:

i put a perfectly good hard drive in that laptop

[23:28:12]

clever:

and it began eating it and filling it with bad sectors

[23:28:21]

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[23:28:23]

clever:

damaged a perfectly good win 3.11 install

[23:28:37]

GreyFoxx:

there is no such thing

[23:28:47]

RasQulec:

does it corrupt any other media? or just hds?

[23:28:53]

clever:

the driver file for audio got corupt

[23:29:08]

clever:

and the whole system locks up for 30 sec any time i open control pannel or try to play audio

[23:29:23]

clever:

and scandisk detects it as bad sectors

[23:29:26]

Milosch:

did you mean to say UNinstall?

[23:29:36]

clever:

lol no

[23:29:45]

Milosch:

;)

[23:29:48]

clever:

and i still have that installed on the now damaged drive

[23:30:17]

Milosch:

i finally got around to remounting an old drive here, and recovered some 7 year old emails

[23:30:39]

** Scopeuk is sad that hes ran out of firefly **

[23:30:46]

clever:

lol

[23:30:50]

RasQulec:

can you get the disk manufacturers utilities? sometimes they can initiate a lowlevel format and that might possibly help if its not physicly damaged

[23:30:52]

Scopeuk:

but happ about the snow fueny how thigns ballance out

[23:31:11]

clever:

RasQulec: ive heard of that before

[23:31:22]

clever:

but havent been able to find any yet that do that

[23:31:26]

RasQulec:

hrm

[23:31:40]

clever:

the gateway ate 2 harddrives before it got replaced

[23:31:41]

Milosch:

have not tried in awhile, but they used to have them available, RasQulec

[23:31:59]

Milosch:

clever: hmm, any Packard Bell in your past as well?

[23:32:12]

clever:

dont think i have any computers from them

[23:32:18]

Milosch:

good

[23:32:22]

clever:

3 toshiba's

[23:32:25]

clever:

an acer

[23:32:26]

clever:

2 dell's

[23:32:27]

Milosch:

or eMachines

[23:32:32]

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[23:32:37]

clever:

a 1.6ghz p4 from i forget

[23:32:48]

clever:

many random <500mhz pc's

[23:32:49]

Milosch:

all my computers are built by us

[23:32:59]

Milosch:

except for the thinkpas

[23:33:03]

Milosch:

pad, even

[23:33:05]

clever:

you could say this laptop was built by me:P

[23:33:11]

clever:

i tore it appart a few days ago

[23:33:14]

Milosch:

i missed the pic

[23:33:17]

RasQulec:

a couple of years ago I used one from western digital to mark bad sectors

[23:33:22]

clever:

had several of the heatsinks off

[23:33:24]

RasQulec:

relocate bad sectors*

[23:33:32]

clever:

i could see the video board

[23:33:37]

Milosch:

RasQulec: that was the same brand i used, back in the 540M days, to fix one

[23:33:41]

clever:

and could have easily removed the video board from the laptop

[23:33:42]

Scopeuk:

the drive firmware should skip over bad sectors if you zero it out

[23:33:51]

clever:

but the power button ran thru the video board

[23:33:53]

RasQulec:

westerndigital seems to make good drives and supports them

[23:34:08]

Scopeuk:

just aoid the deathstars

[23:34:08]

Milosch:

ymmv, i have usually had good luck with them

[23:34:12]

clever:

i think the drives firmware will detect the bad sectors on its own

[23:34:16]

clever:

and work arround them

[23:34:18]

Scopeuk:

deskstars*

[23:34:18]

Milosch:

i keep them so long they get really noisy

[23:34:24]

clever:

and when you start to pick the bad sectors up

[23:34:35]

clever:

then its allready f*cked and can no longer work arround them

[23:34:39]

Scopeuk:

clever it should but it tris to hold on if it thinsk there migtbue data you want there

[23:34:44]

Milosch:

there's one in my backend now, still pretty quiet

[23:34:45]

RasQulec:

I have a raptor [10K rpm drive] that I have / and my games on

[23:34:51]

RasQulec:

very fast :3

[23:35:05]

clever:

Scopeuk: i think the firmware would read what it can and save elsewhere

[23:35:06]

Milosch:

'luck-y'

[23:35:49]

clever:

clever@theP4:/var/lib/mythtv$ dd if=1045_20070209130001.nuv of=/dev/null bs=1M

[23:35:53]

J-e-f-f-A|work:

bye guys... heading home... ttyl....

[23:35:54]

clever:

3.7gig nuv file

[23:36:00]

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[23:36:00]

Scopeuk:

clever thats just bassed on my understanding which is pretty limited at low level with hardwaqre

[23:36:34]

Milosch:

pretty sure they build them over spec, then map good sectors into what the drive spec is

[23:36:35]

clever:

alot of what i know i learned peices of from others and peiced to gether

[23:36:43]

RasQulec:

they are supposed to be able to do it on the fly, but the utilities will scan the whole drive for them and really verify that its bad

[23:36:44]

clever:

and used guesswork and logic to fill the gaps in

[23:36:56]

Milosch:

so, ime, i was able to remap and regain full space on the drive

[23:37:22]

Milosch:

but that was YEARS ago

[23:37:38]

Milosch:

a friend of mine worked at IBM for awhile, but has also been gone many years

[23:37:42]

clever:

yeah i havent heard any1 think of low level formating for years also

[23:38:07]

clever:

was back when 100mhz was one of our main computers:P

[23:38:10]

Milosch:

possibly the cpu on the new drives is more than what i had on my whole machine the last time i used one of those utils

[23:38:22]

clever:

lol

[23:38:27]

Milosch:

well, maybe not

[23:38:33]

clever:

my comodore 64 computer

[23:38:35]

kormoc:

low level formatting is just zeroing the drives, which I do all the time, via dd

[23:38:42]

clever:

has as much computing power as its disk drive

[23:38:44]

Milosch:

486DX33, ah those were the days

[23:38:45]

RasQulec:

on my new computer, the video card is faster then the cpu of my old one

[23:39:01]

Milosch:

RasQulec: hehe

[23:39:03]

clever:

kormoc: if you dd nulls to the whole drive

[23:39:09]

Milosch:

funny what happens when you stick around awhile

[23:39:15]

clever:

wont the drive just try writing those nulls to the bad sectors?

[23:39:26]

clever:

3919659086 bytes (3.9 GB) copied, 188.757 seconds, 20.8 MB/s

[23:39:29]

Milosch:

first hd on a machine i owned was 120M...

[23:39:34]

clever:

20mb/sec drive:)

[23:39:35]

kormoc:

clever, sure, it'll try

[23:39:44]

kormoc:

clever, you can tell it to continue on errors

[23:39:45]

Milosch:

not super small, but pretty small

[23:39:50]

clever:

kormoc: and it probly wont fix the problem

[23:40:03]

clever:

with the comodore c64 floppy's

[23:40:09]

clever:

there was inter sector data

[23:40:19]

Milosch:

clever: you have a floppy drive? lucky

[23:40:26]

clever:

which labled which sector it was and there was also a gap between the sectors

[23:40:29]

Zider:

first hdd I had was 20MB

[23:40:33]

Milosch:

maybe that doesn't work on the VIC20

[23:40:40]

clever:

i have 3 c64 floppy drives and several x86 floppy drives

[23:40:41]

Milosch:

Zider: sorry about that

[23:40:48]

clever:

and i think 2 c64 tape drives

[23:41:01]

Zider:

Milosch: why?

[23:41:12]

Milosch:

i did work at compaq for about 6 months 20 years ago, and remember installing a 300M drive in a couple of machines

[23:41:16]

hashbang:

kormoc: no, low-level formatting /used/ to be used for RLL and MFM drives, and included laying down the servo tracks (IIRC). These days, there's no way to do that. The closest would be the SCSI/ATA FORMAT_UNIT command.

[23:41:28]

Milosch:

was at least ide anyway

[23:42:20]

Milosch:

lol

[23:42:21]

clever:

see:P

[23:42:39]

Milosch:

you could do some serious scratching

[23:42:46]

clever:

but it could also be used to access the floppys in a non standard method

[23:42:47]

hashbang:

clever: if you dd a drive with 'failed' blocks, if there's a soft error, the 'failed' block will be successfully written and perfectly usable. If it's a hard error, the drive's firmware will remap to a spare block. If there are no spare blocks left, the write will fail, and the drive should be binned once any data has been salvaged.

[23:43:01]

clever:

once you have custom firmware into the drive you could insert 5 extra tracks if you wanted

[23:43:01]

Zider:

my first harddrive had the step-motor axis sticking out the side :)

[23:43:12]

clever:

it may have a higher risk of loosing data but you could do it

[23:43:26]

Milosch:

clever: kind of like custom floppy formatting circa 7–10 years ago

[23:43:28]

hashbang:

clever: yup, the 1541's on-board CPU was faster than the c64's IIRC.

[23:43:36]

clever:

LOL

[23:43:42]

Milosch:

wow, 1541 actually sounds familiar

[23:43:43]

clever:

i thought they whre identical cpu's:P

[23:44:01]

Milosch:

i guess i had one, now all i have is a cassette drive and a vic20

[23:44:04]

clever:

i have a foldout i used to look at when in school

[23:44:12]

clever:

and no it wasnt a 5 page naken woman

[23:44:21]

Milosch:

and some crappy game cartridges

[23:44:22]

clever:

scematic for the entie c64 computer

[23:44:39]

Milosch:

i guess that's... awesome

[23:44:50]

hashbang:

eek, a 90 quid Amazon basket. :-/

[23:44:53]

clever:

i could trace down every line in the system and see where they all go

[23:45:01]

clever:

and figure out what pin on the user port went where

[23:45:05]

Milosch:

clever: i remember seeing one, yes

[23:45:09]

clever:

a few of the pins went directly to the cpu

[23:45:10]

RasQulec:

my amiga 500 has one of those

[23:45:18]

Milosch:

was trying to fix a commodore 16 i used to have

[23:45:35]

clever:

the power suply in our c64 died within the last 5 years

[23:45:44]

Milosch:

bummer, fix it!

[23:45:49]

clever:

and we got a whole new c64 and supply at a store in halifax

[23:45:57]

clever:

the entire supply is filled with epoxy

[23:45:57]

Milosch:

wish i had a 64, but really still want a PET

[23:46:09]

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[23:46:10]

Milosch:

oh, replace it!

[23:46:10]

Milosch:

;)

[23:46:11]

clever:

they sealed the entire transformer and wiring in epoxy

[23:46:14]

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[23:46:22]

clever:

so you cant open it up and fix it

[23:46:27]

clever:

its 1 solid block

[23:46:36]

Milosch:

isn't it just +/- 5V?

[23:46:47]

clever:

it also had a few other voltages

[23:46:49]

Milosch:

maybe 12 for the video...

[23:46:53]

Milosch:

not sure

[23:46:58]

clever:

and an ac line for something else

[23:47:09]

clever:

i think the ac may also be used for a 60hz source for the video

[23:47:31]

** clever goes to find the foldout **

[23:47:35]

clever:

should be in my room

[23:48:03]

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[23:48:07]

Milosch:

+5 and 9V ac external on that one

[23:50:00]

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[23:50:12]

Milosch:

anyway

[23:50:26]

clever:

went thru about 3 tree's worth of paper notes and printouts

[23:50:32]

clever:

havent found it yet:P

[23:50:53]

Milosch:

i have a box like that...

[23:50:58]

Milosch:

only one thankfully

[23:53:02]

Milosch:

this stupid sound card is too quiet

[23:53:10]

clever:

still havent found it:P

[23:53:59]

clever:

lol that gif is one of the pages:P

[23:54:32]

Zider:

are there any plans to add support for theora in mythvideos internal player

[23:54:35]

Zider:

?

[23:54:35]

clever:

with that userport it looks alot easyer from the machine lang side to control each put

[23:55:08]

clever:

you write a byte to the userports address and you get that exact byte out the port

[23:55:25]

Milosch:

we had a trs-80 in my computer class...

[23:55:31]

clever:

its even using one of those userport chips to scan thru the keyboard rows/cols

[23:55:36]

Milosch:

and my dad had the rca tv that looked just like it

[23:56:32]

clever:

i have a pc out in the garage

[23:56:36]

clever:

which is 'new' to me

[23:56:45]

clever:

its more of a mac shape

[23:56:48]

clever:

pc and moniter in 1

[23:56:59]

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[23:57:11]

clever:

i carryed it home from the curb where i found it

[23:57:22]

clever:

and could bearly lift my arms over my head for a week after that

[23:57:53]

clever:

i have a vt100 terminal

[23:58:03]

clever:

not a terminal emulator:P

[23:58:10]

Milosch:

right

[23:58:12]

clever:

green and black screen

[23:58:19]

hjohnson:

clever: cute.

[23:58:20]

Milosch:

those are great, wish i had one

[23:58:29]

clever:

i cant get it working atm

[23:58:33]

clever:

need a null modem connector

[23:58:39]

hjohnson:

hah

[23:58:40]

clever:

it has a pair of com ports

[23:58:44]

clever:

but there the size of lpt ports

[23:58:48]

hjohnson:

gah, my throat is scratchy.

[23:58:56]

clever:

i had it working on my laptop once

[23:58:56]

hjohnson:

clever: that's the other standard serial port size.

[23:59:01]

clever:

i know

[23:59:06]

hjohnson:

DE-9 and DB-25

[23:59:06]

clever:

just dont know its name:P

[23:59:12]

clever:

ahh thats it:)

[23:59:13]

Milosch:

i remember when they all came with one of each

[23:59:32]

clever:

lol

[23:59:46]

Milosch:

hmm, i actually built some of the last 386 machines that compaq came out with...

[23:59:51]

clever:

i have multiple addapters chained to get it to work

[23:59:52]

Milosch:

or helped to

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