Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Friday, January 26th, 2007, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:20]

Smirnov:

anyone here use cable boxes with firewire

[00:02:04]

hads:

CanadianMan__: What isn't working?

[00:03:39]

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[00:04:50]

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[00:07:54]

CanadianMan__:

had anyone worked with LIRC and the MCE ver 2 remotes?

[00:08:46]

kormoc:

yes

[00:09:00]

Smirnov:

yep

[00:09:19]

hads:

Yes

[00:11:19]

CanadianMan__:

b4 i couldn't get irw to give me a pause like it would just return a command prompt right after it but now when i do irw it at least stops but when i press buttons on the remote nothing is displayed like the key codes or w/e

[00:16:15]

CanadianMan__:

i've seen someone list the usb devices and when i do it i get

[00:17:18]

CanadianMan__:

is something going on with my usb receiver

[00:19:12]

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[00:19:14]

|Torg|:

what? yu mean the fact it dosnt know about the trancever?

[00:20:00]

kormoc:

CanadianMan_, you have lirc_mceusb2 loaded?

[00:20:20]

squish102:

can someone do a 'ffmpeg --version' on a working mythtv and let me know what version it is... just the first line pls?

[00:20:22]

CanadianMan__:

i guess i really don't know, i'm just throwing out possible problems and seeing if anyone says "oh yeah thats not right"

[00:20:27]

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[00:20:37]

CanadianMan__:

yes i'm loading lirc_mceusb2

[00:21:05]

kormoc:

and you have a proper /etc/lircd.conf file setup?

[00:21:28]

|Torg|:

squish102 its -version not --

[00:21:35]

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[00:21:52]

kormoc:

squish102, I don't have ffmpeg installed on my mythbox

[00:21:58]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, yes i got the one from https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Install_Lir . . . b18db14ad2be

[00:21:58]

Smirnov:

anyone here using firewire with a cable box? I have some questions that i cant find the answer on the wiki

[00:21:59]

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[00:22:21]

squish102:

|Torg| huh? i am running FC6 with atrpms, and a working ffmpeg, but xris's nuvexport complains

[00:22:27]

|Torg|:

I have it, but I doubt the informtion is usefull to you

[00:22:37]

|Torg|:

its ffmepg -version not ffmepg --version

[00:23:11]

|Torg|:

ffmpeg SVN-rUNKNOWN

[00:23:15]

|Torg|:

does that help any?

[00:23:20]

squish102:

ok so u running svn

[00:23:25]

xris:

squish102: complains how?

[00:23:28]

kormoc:

CanadianMan_, there's no lircd.conf for mceusb2 just mceusb, which is different

[00:23:37]

xris:

Smirnov: I am

[00:23:46]

Smirnov:

xris, do you have comcast

[00:23:49]

squish102:

[mythtv@linux2 ~]$ ffmpeg -version

[00:23:50]

squish102:

FFmpeg version 0.4.9–19_r7407.fc6.at

[00:23:59]

squish102:

This version of nuvexport requires either the cvs or svn version of ffmpeg.

[00:24:18]

kormoc:

squish102, and what's wrong with getting a svn version?

[00:24:35]

xris:

Smirnov: yeah. seattle (which is relevant because comcast is a franchise and thus different "companies" in different areas)

[00:24:45]

Smirnov:

xris, ok

[00:24:47]

squish102:

kormoc, i have been down that road for the last 4 days, and never got a working ffmpeg with all the right codecs

[00:24:54]

Smirnov:

xris, so i think i have a firewire plug in my box.

[00:24:59]

xris:

squish102: blech.. annoying axel who uses his own string format.

[00:25:06]

Wiedi:

Hi, i downloaded the mac osx frontend 0.20-fixes_20070121.dmg from padilla.net, after starting it the setup comes up. But after finishing the setup the fe silently quits. Backend is running on a linux box and is tested to work. I also tried an older version from that site with the same effect. Any ideas i could try?

[00:25:14]

xris:

squish102: please file a bug at svn.mythtv.org and include that string. I'll fix it.

[00:25:15]

Smirnov:

xris, first off, does it stream the compressed or the decompressed data over the firewire? and how does channel changing work?

[00:25:21]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, If you are using a MCEUSB or MCEUSB2 based remote, here is a lircd.conf for your remote. should i not be using what they are telling me here?

[00:25:32]

squish102:

if the version is ok, i was going to remove the check... ok xris

[00:25:35]

kormoc:

Wiedi, run it in a console and see what it spits out

[00:25:44]

xris:

squish102: it should be fine. but please still submit a bug. :)

[00:25:51]

squish102:

will do

[00:25:52]

Wiedi:

kormoc, nothing – tried that already

[00:26:04]

xris:

Smirnov: data comes in as mpeg-ts, which is the raw stream. channel changing depends on the hardware. if you have a motorola 6xxx box, it happens right over the firewire.

[00:26:07]

kormoc:

CanadianMan_, well, this is what I use for my remote, https://www.kormoc.com/stuff/lirc/lircd.conf

[00:26:11]

xris:

svn will even power on the box if it's off

[00:26:30]

kormoc:

Wiedi, might need to talk to the place that made the package

[00:26:41]

Smirnov:

xris, the same raw stream you get from the cable company?

[00:27:09]

Smirnov:

xris, and for channel changing this means it doesnt matter if im in some sort of special menu screen?

[00:27:38]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, will and incorrect lircd.conf prevent irw from outputting my button presses on the remote?

[00:28:37]

kormoc:

yes

[00:28:53]

kormoc:

I think irw is the one that reads the lircd.conf at least

[00:29:28]

xris:

Smirnov: I've never done QAM, so I can't confirm that 100%, but yes, it's the exact same stream that the box tunes. not modified.

[00:29:43]

Smirnov:

QAM?

[00:29:54]

xris:

Smirnov: firewire only gets the raw data. the menus, etc. are local to the box, not the stream.

[00:30:12]

xris:

QAM is the protocol used by the cable box.. like ATSC for broadcast.

[00:30:14]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, ok i'm loading your lircd.conf file now

[00:30:42]

Smirnov:

xris, ok so you bypass the box pretty much and get the stream?

[00:31:17]

xris:

Smirnov: the cable box passes the stream through to the mythbox, unless channels are encrypted, in which case you get no data.

[00:31:55]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc kormoc kormoc. . . . . . . . .

[00:32:13]

** kormoc blinks **

[00:32:23]

CanadianMan__:

you are a king among men

[00:32:24]

Smirnov:

xris, sounds pretty nice

[00:32:34]

Smirnov:

xris, how does it handle on-demand?

[00:32:58]

xris:

Smirnov: no clue. never tried. I doubt it works, though

[00:33:03]

kormoc:

CanadianMan_, if you replace lircd.conf with lircrc, you'll get how I have it setup for myth

[00:33:08]

Smirnov:

i figured as much, though not really worried about that :P

[00:33:21]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, i've been working on this for at least 2 weeks and it's finally working with your config file

[00:33:31]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, thank you so much

[00:33:41]

CanadianMan__:

kormoc, i really can't thank you enough

[00:33:44]

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[00:34:02]

squish102:

xris when i use my email on a ticket, will it email me if anything happens?

[00:34:13]

** xris reminds kormoc that he was supposed to submit his changes to mythtv trac. **

[00:34:15]

squish102:

opps i forgot to put my nuvexport version

[00:34:43]

xris:

squish102: yes, but beware of spam harvesters.. trac still doesn't have any obfuscation, so I'd recommend using a gmail acct or something with good spam protection.

[00:34:45]

squish102:

ok, not sure how to get the version i have

[00:34:59]

squish102:

i used hotmail

[00:35:10]

squish102:

may as well send microsoft all my spam

[00:35:28]

xris:

heh

[00:36:13]

xris:

squish102: can you include the output from `ffmpeg -version`, too?

[00:36:19]

kormoc:

CanadianMan_, you're quite welcome

[00:36:24]

squish102:

ok will do

[00:36:24]

xris:

that's what nuvexport checks against. you just gave the package names.

[00:38:12]

xris:

thx

[00:38:28]

squish102:

opps the newlines seemed to have gone missing

[00:38:36]

squish102:

in the paste

[00:39:37]

xris:

squish102: you have to wrap in {{{ }}} to get preformatted stuff.. that's fine, though, I can dig through it.

[00:48:55]

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[00:51:00]

toad_:

how do i rename a program? update recorded set subtitle="new name" where subtitle="old name" and title="old title" ?

[00:51:35]

GreyFoxx:

or just do it from the Watch recordings menu

[00:51:46]

toad_:

what do i press to do that?

[00:51:56]

GreyFoxx:

Can't remember specifically

[00:52:02]

GreyFoxx:

one of the option under I or M

[00:52:20]

toad_:

not under I

[00:52:24]

toad_:

maybe under M

[00:55:55]

Wiedi:

thank you, works perfectly now :)

[00:55:56]

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[00:59:56]

monkeyBox:

Does anyone here have any experience w/ the pcHDTV card & QAM?

[01:00:05]

monkeyBox:

I'm not sure how to tell for sure if my cable company broadcasts QAM (time warner in dallas-area, TX)

[01:00:58]

GreyFoxx:

If they do digital cable, you can pretty much guarantee it's QAM

[01:01:30]

monkeyBox:

GreyFoxx, I've subscribed to basic cable though, but I have cable internet. Will that matter?

[01:01:48]

GreyFoxx:

it could

[01:01:52]

monkeyBox:

hmm

[01:01:53]

GreyFoxx:

they could have afilter on your line

[01:02:03]

monkeyBox:

that would suck :-p

[01:02:49]

briand:

the way to tell for sure would be to hook up the card and see if you get any channels.

[01:02:52]

monkeyBox:

although, isn't it mandated for them to give free-and-clear HDTV?

[01:02:58]

briand:

no

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[01:03:27]

briand:

it is mandated that local broadcast stations be available without encryption on the digital service.

[01:03:47]

monkeyBox:

briand, but HD, right?

[01:03:54]

briand:

they do -not- have to, necessarily, be HDTV. They can be Standard Definition and still digital.

[01:04:03]

monkeyBox:

hmm

[01:04:32]

squish102:

xris, actually there may be a bigger problem.. if i comment out the check i get an error when using ffmpeg Xvid with ffmpeg had critical errors:

[01:04:36]

squish102:

ffmpeg: unrecognized option '-4mv'

[01:05:11]

squish102:

so maybe i should rasie a bug on axel's bugzilla

[01:07:19]

monkeyBox:

I'm just hoping to find someone here who knows something about the pcHDTV card. I can't quite figure it out. I'm using the programs it came with dtvscan and dtvsignal, and i'm getting a channels list w/ scan, but no signal info. Also, I'm curious if my other PVR-x50 cards are conflicting with anything...

[01:11:29]

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[01:12:06]

Smirnov:

xris, forgot to ask you.. do you need any tuner cards for the firewire stuff to work?

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[01:26:49]

xris:

Smirnov: no. that's the point of firewire

[01:30:03]

Smirnov:

xris, cool thats what i thought.. is it 1 channel at a time or ?

[01:30:24]

kormoc:

1 at a time

[01:30:30]

Smirnov:

how do you get 2

[01:30:39]

kormoc:

get a second box

[01:30:46]

Smirnov:

do they give you more boxes?

[01:30:54]

kormoc:

if you rent them, usually

[01:31:02]

Smirnov:

is it ridiculously more expensive though

[01:31:20]

kormoc:

$10/mo per extra box is usually around the cost

[01:31:32]

Smirnov:

oh thats reasonable

[01:31:49]

Smirnov:

ill have to try it on my parents cable when i visit home..:)

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[02:07:01]

Eradan:

ARGH !.... spdif passthrough in ubuntu = PITA ...

[02:09:00]

kormoc:

could have left it at "ubuntu = PITA ..."

[02:09:18]

hads:

Nasty

[02:09:27]

Eradan:

kormoc : aggre'd :(

[02:09:30]

Eradan:

i'm

[02:09:37]

Eradan:

i'm about to install deb again ...

[02:09:41]

hads:

works for me

[02:09:59]

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[02:10:21]

Eradan:

so for some reason ... analog passthrough just stopped working ...

[02:10:34]

Eradan:

digital works fine (dts, dd , ac3

[02:27:46]

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[02:32:42]

Smirnov:

anyone here using MythGame

[02:32:51]

Smirnov:

i cant for the life of me figure out how to make snes9x full screen, its not even letting me have that -fs option

[02:33:28]

H00chster:

haven't got around to it, but it is coming soon, want to get a joystick working for the kiddies heh

[02:34:42]

Smirnov:

yeah i got 2 snes-like joysticks ordered, but i need to set it up before then :)

[02:37:18]

Smirnov:

running pure 64-bit ubuntu is definitely a pain sometimes.. like not being able to use zsnes cause its only 32bit

[02:39:14]

dvbs-htpc:

is a p4 2.8540 pesscott a 64 bit cpu?

[02:41:16]

Smirnov:

is there a way to specify the size of a window when launching a program via command line?

[02:42:14]

kormoc:

if you can, most of the time it -geometry ###X###

[02:43:17]

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[02:44:30]

GreyFoxx:

Smirnov: I use it, but I use zsnes

[02:44:49]

Smirnov:

yeah... zsnes has a sad habit of not working on 64bit

[02:45:40]

GreyFoxx:

I'm sure I've done snes9x fullscreen from acommandline before

[02:45:48]

GreyFoxx:

I don;t have it installed right now to test it

[02:46:34]

Smirnov:

its supposed to be -fs but that option is disabled for me

[02:54:49]

defaultro:

firewire question, is GUID implemented now?

[03:02:05]

adante:

hey guys

[03:02:25]

adante:

is there anywhere in the recorded table (or any other table) which will tell me which of my cards recorded a program?

[03:07:05]

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Anduin:

adante: You can look at the backend log

[03:11:37]

Smirnov:

so... i got no emulator choice besides zsnes (no 64-bit), snes9x (no fullscreen), xe (doesnt even make) ?

[03:16:36]

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mishehu:

bah.

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[03:25:57]

isses:

hi

[03:28:01]

isses:

realtime priority?, still getting "Realtime priority would require SUID as root." -rwsr-xr-x 1 root root 1404296 Jan 25 23:16 /usr/bin/mythfrontend and /etc/security/limits.conf..whats going wrong?

[03:29:03]

mishehu:

hmm... when I run `tcprobe -i /path/to/a/file/recorded/from/firewire` I get the following output: [tcprobe] MPEG transport stream (TS) (ts_reader.c) Pids: 0xa00 0xa01 0x0 0x38 [tcprobe] summary for ./vidtemp/2008_20070124233000.mpg, (*) = not default, 0 = not detected no audio track: use "null" import module for audio

[03:29:27]

mishehu:

I find it odd that it cannot detect what format the audio stream is...

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defaultro:

that's sourceforge ip address and cvs server

[03:39:47]

defaultro:

or can you try this please, cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net :/cvsroot/avisynth2 login

[03:40:59]

defaultro:

i tried from another site, it still failed. Disregard folks

[03:41:53]

Eradan:

What causes a frontend to get that warning about ringbuf(xxx) waiting for data to become available ?

[03:41:59]

Milosch:

defaultro: i have cvs setup there, and i am able to do a diff, etc

[03:42:41]

Milosch:

defaultro: but mine isn't anon...

[03:43:40]

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[03:46:33]

defaultro:

hi Milo

[03:46:40]

defaultro:

where you able to grab it?

[03:47:54]

defaultro:

Milosch, I tried it from 3 locations, it failed

[03:50:42]

defaultro:

how do I use ssh?

[03:51:15]

Milosch:

only works if you have cvs write access, anyway it might be a bit ot

[03:51:52]

defaultro:

ok

[03:52:01]

defaultro:

i don't know why I can't download it too

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Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[04:07:05]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[04:12:08]

Sembiance:

Well my new MythTV box boots!

[04:12:17]

Milosch:

sa-weet

[04:12:25]

Sembiance:

After a crazy fight with my BIOS and a kernel panic, I've gotten it to boot :)

[04:12:40]

Sembiance:

6 500GB hard drives await my install :)

[04:13:02]

Sembiance:

along with two PVR-250's and two HD HomeRun HDTV tuner boxes (total 4 HDTV tuners)

[04:13:15]

kormoc:

(pvr 250's are not HD tuners)

[04:13:19]

Sembiance:

should be an interesting week or two getting it all set up

[04:13:35]

Sembiance:

kormoc: yes, I know. I have two HD HomeRun boxes, each box has 2 HDTV tuners in it

[04:13:41]

kormoc:

ooh, nifty

[04:13:56]

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[04:13:57]

Sembiance:

yes, they are nice, hook up via RJ45 too so I don't have to worry about taking up PCI slots

[04:14:28]

Sembiance:

What I need to figure out, is how to get Myth to automatically convert that the HDTV recording it makes from the HD boxes, into 720p

[04:14:57]

kormoc:

autotranscode

[04:15:14]

kormoc:

you'll have to convert it into mpeg-4, but it should resize fine

[04:15:37]

Sembiance:

yah, I need to figure that out

[04:15:50]

Sembiance:

I've been running MythTV for several years now. Up until now, it has been with *5* PVR 250 cards

[04:15:57]

Sembiance:

I never bothered transcoding, didn't need too

[04:16:05]

Sembiance:

but now that I've moved to an area where I can HD signals...

[04:16:23]

Sembiance:

does Myth do transcoding on a schedule? or does it attempt to do it live?

[04:16:42]

kormoc:

Sembiance, it will run after the recording is done

[04:16:48]

Sembiance:

It's possible the box may be recording four HD streams at once. I'd think if it attempted to transcode those live, ANY CPU would be maxxed

[04:16:51]

Sembiance:

all cool

[04:16:55]

Sembiance:

kormoc: thanks for all your help :)

[04:17:00]

kormoc:

you're welcome

[04:17:18]

defaultro:

Milo?

[04:17:34]

Sembiance:

Tommorow I'll work on installing Gentoo. Saturday I'll work on copying all my files from all my other drives onto my new system

[04:17:47]

Sembiance:

Sunday I plan on using to set up Mythbackend and get transcoding working, etc.

[04:18:02]

Sembiance:

I'll cya all around, gonna go get some sleep. thanks again kormoc!

[04:18:08]

** kormoc waves **

[04:18:10]

kormoc:

enjoy!

[04:18:15]

defaultro:

can you ssh to avisynth and download this file for me, circular_buffer_v3.7.tar.bz2? This file is inside one of the directories

[04:18:23]

defaultro:

kormoc, how GUID

[04:18:28]

defaultro:

how is GUID?

[04:18:34]

kormoc:

it's fine?

[04:18:47]

defaultro:

can I try ith with mythtv?

[04:18:55]

kormoc:

it's sitting in trunk

[04:18:59]

defaultro:

ok

[04:19:24]

defaultro:

can I patch release just for that?

[04:19:31]

kormoc:

likely not

[04:19:35]

defaultro:

k

[04:19:46]

kormoc:

you could go over the changelogs and see for yourself

[04:21:31]

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[04:21:40]

Milosch:

defaultro: pretty sure i do not have permissions for their stuff

[04:22:13]

defaultro:

ok

[04:22:20]

defaultro:

that's the only file i'm missing

[04:22:31]

defaultro:

and am having a hardtime finding it

[04:22:46]

** kormoc wonders why you would ssh to a website rather then say, browsing it **

[04:23:03]

defaultro:

it's a cvsserver

[04:23:07]

defaultro:

cvs anon is failing

[04:23:41]

Milosch:

I found out why I should NOT schedule an ntpdate time update with myth running

[04:23:43]

kormoc:

yeah, and it's a SF box, so it's rather restrictive on who can ssh to it...

[04:23:49]

Milosch:

however, my clock is way off otherwise

[04:24:23]

kormoc:

Milosch, heh, I run ntpdate on boot and keep ntpd running 24x7 so clock skew is very low

[04:24:24]

defaultro:

ok

[04:24:31]

defaultro:

don't know why their cvs is down right now

[04:24:39]

Milosch:

kormoc: I also have ntpd running...

[04:24:52]

Milosch:

but it was still off

[04:25:11]

kormoc:

Milosch, likely it's not talking right... let me see if I can find the commands to see what's going on

[04:25:58]

Smirnov:

Anyone here using zsnes?

[04:27:01]

kormoc:

defaultro, you could just download it from their website you know

[04:27:26]

Milosch:

kormoc: I see in syslog that it is adjusting time, but it was 8 minutes off when the cronjob ran to reset it manually...

[04:27:34]

Milosch:

I took that out, btw

[04:28:07]

kormoc:

hrm

[04:28:31]

kormoc:

Milosch, ntpq -c readvar | grep stratum

[04:28:41]

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[04:28:45]

kormoc:

Milosch, is your stratum=3?

[04:29:04]

Milosch:

hrm, no ntpq

[04:29:16]

kormoc:

hrm, that should come with ntpd

[04:29:40]

kormoc:

defaultro, http://avisynth2.cvs.sourceforge.net/*checkou . . . sion=1.1.2.3

[04:29:51]

Milosch:

ubuntu uses openntpd, and a search found no ntpq...

[04:30:55]

kormoc:

Milosch, heh, well, I don't know any other way to check that your ntp is syncing correctly... perhaps there's some ubuntu specific stuff out there

[04:32:29]

defaultro:

thanks

[04:32:34]

defaultro:

i will try

[04:32:53]

defaultro:

failed :(

[04:37:20]

Milosch:

kormoc: Ok, i found the correct alternative packages, stratum is 16

[04:37:52]

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[04:38:41]

Milosch:

we'll see how this one goes

[04:38:52]

Smirnov:

YES

[04:38:56]

Smirnov:

i got zsnes to work under chroot

[04:38:57]

Smirnov:

success

[04:39:20]

hads:

ntp 4.2.2.p4+dfsg-1ubuntu2 on my Edgy system has ntpq

[04:40:54]

Milosch:

yes, i finally found it, i searched for ntpq itself at first

[04:43:57]

kormoc:

Milosch, stratum of 16 means you're not talking with the ntp servers

[04:43:59]

Milosch:

and earlier i had searched for ntpd, which is why i had openntpd installed (no more)

[04:46:02]

kormoc:

Milosch, this is what I've used to set it up before: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_NTP#Checking_ntp

[04:46:52]

kormoc:

defaultro, well, you can always use the cvs to check out that specific revision

[04:48:05]

kormoc:

notice the (dead) after it

[04:48:19]

defaultro:

what should I type

[04:48:47]

defaultro:

yep, i saw it, it's dead

[04:49:06]

Milosch:

kormoc: ok, looks like it will take awhile before stratum 3 is acheived

[04:49:17]

defaultro:

it says, it was added to av3 but it's not there

[04:49:25]

kormoc:

Milosch, aye, takes mine around 2.5 hours or so

[04:49:27]

Milosch:

ntpq -c pe is good

[04:49:31]

kormoc:

nifty

[04:49:35]

Milosch:

thanks, bub

[04:49:39]

defaultro:

hey bro, thanks for taking time for this :) I really appreciate it

[04:49:42]

kormoc:

you're quite welcome

[04:50:38]

kormoc:

defaultro, -r 1.1.2.3 *should* do it

[04:51:24]

defaultro:

i'm not familiar with that, what should I type exactly

[04:51:25]

mishehu:

hmm... this mpeg2ts from the firewire recorded by mythtv has approximately -500 ms audio shifting on it, and avidemux doesn't autodetect it. :-/

[04:51:46]

kormoc:

defaultro, just add that onto the cvs command line you were using to check it out

[04:51:52]

defaultro:

ok

[04:51:57]

kormoc:

defaultro, it says to grab that specific revision

[04:51:57]

mishehu:

it's fricking giving me a headache. :-/

[04:52:05]

kormoc:

ick

[04:52:48]

defaultro:

kormoc, cvs won't work for me, it's telling me, no route to host. It also didn't work for Milo

[04:53:01]

kormoc:

defaultro, ooh, might have to wait then

[04:53:12]

defaultro:

k

[04:55:11]

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[04:55:16]

defaultro:

I got it

[04:55:25]

Milosch:

works now?

[04:55:29]

defaultro:

http://avisynth2.cvs.sourceforge.net/avisynth . . . amp;view=log

[04:55:54]

defaultro:

it's the same link that kormoc gave

[04:55:58]

defaultro:

but it works now

[04:56:14]

defaultro:

God is listening to me :)

[04:56:33]

Milosch:

with any luck, i won't be recording the second half of the daily show anymore ;)

[04:56:46]

Milosch:

rather only the second half...

[05:02:58]

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[05:06:51]

psm321:

i'm getting a whole bunch of these in dmesg

[05:06:55]

psm321:

[848539.219549] ivtv-enc: page allocation failure. order:4, mode:0xd0

[05:07:07]

psm321:

(along with a bunch of other info)

[05:07:25]

psm321:

any idea what could cause that? I have plenty of free memory

[05:08:20]

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[05:09:48]

psm321:

http://pastebin.ca/328938

[05:09:56]

psm321:

that's the entire message

[05:10:15]

psm321:

(i have no idea how to decipher it)

[05:11:16]

_Vile:

why would a video stream be off by 500ms from an audio stream?

[05:11:31]

_Vile:

give or take

[05:11:53]

psm321:

i get that problem when i have buffering errors, etc

[05:11:59]

psm321:

does it always happen?

[05:12:32]

_Vile:

I haI have to assume so, yes, dunno, not asking for me

[05:13:23]

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[05:18:03]

kormoc:

psm321, that's about kernel reserved memory, not system memory. Try updating/downgrading kernel/ivtv

[05:18:21]

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[05:22:51]

sandeen_:

kormoc, there's not that much difference really... he's out of memory either way

[05:23:40]

psm321:

kormoc: yeah i found a post on the ivtv list, i'm going to try upgrading ivtv right now

[05:24:00]

psm321:

sandeen_: theres no way i'm out of overall memory

[05:24:18]

psm321:

kormoc: any way to get ivtv to rmmod? (i think i'm going to have to reboot)

[05:24:30]

sandeen_:

psm321, actuallly looking closer it could be that it needed a large contiguous allocation and you didn't have it

[05:24:56]

kormoc:

psm321, rmmod should do it, there's is a force option (man rmmod will have more info on it)

[05:25:21]

Captain_Murdoch:

there may be another module using ivtv, if so you have to remove that first.

[05:25:35]

kormoc:

sandeen_, kernel modules tend to have a area of memory that is explicitly mapped for them, so even if system ram is free, it still can fail to grab memory

[05:25:51]

kormoc:

psm321, aye, Captain_Murdoch is quite correct. lsmod should show if it's currently being used

[05:26:09]

sandeen_:

there's also the problem that it wants a 4th order allocation, I think that's 2^4 pages, that's 16 contiguous pages

[05:26:14]

Jymmmm:

Wtih standard TV out, what is the font face/size that mythtv uses for the menuing?

[05:26:14]

psm321:

kormoc: the list reply said something about them dropping dynamic allocation in cvs because it was causing problems

[05:26:15]

sandeen_:

so fragmentation could be a problem too

[05:26:28]

psm321:

its not being used by any module but has a use count of 1

[05:26:31]

sandeen_:

hmm but that's still only 64k

[05:26:34]

** kormoc nods **

[05:26:35]

psm321:

and mythbackend is closed

[05:26:42]

Captain_Murdoch:

psm321: what card?

[05:26:52]

kormoc:

psm321, you can pass in a module param to disable dynamic allocation

[05:27:06]

kormoc:

Captain_Murdoch, I've had this issue with a m179 on ivtv 0.7.1

[05:27:06]

** sandeen_ shuts up ;) **

[05:27:14]

psm321:

i will try that if the upgrade doesnt work

[05:27:27]

psm321:

Captain_Murdoch: an old pvr-350

[05:28:24]

Captain_Murdoch:

with my pvr-150, there as some module starting with cx I think that I had to remove before I could remove ivtv. if yours is a 350 it might not be the same then, my m179 doesn't either.

[05:28:26]

kormoc:

sandeen_, you could be quite correct tho, if the dynamic buffers fragment the reserved, there could be a case where there is not 16 contiguous pages, but I'm not sure how to check such a theory :P

[05:28:48]

defaultro:

kormoc, finally, i really got the cvs working

[05:29:19]

defaultro:

from this one, cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net :/cvsroot/avisynth2 login

[05:29:29]

defaultro:

to this one, cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@avisynth2.cvs.sourceforge.net :/cvsroot/avisynth2 login

[05:29:36]

psm321:

ok, i'm going to reboot

[05:29:44]

defaultro:

i prepended avisynth2 before .cvs

[05:29:59]

sandeen_:

xfs had trouble w/ allocating big chunks of memory for large extent maps for fragmented files... trying to remember how large "large" was

[05:30:22]

sandeen_:

but here:

[05:30:23]

sandeen_:

Normal: 4760*4kB 632*8kB 510*16kB 122*32kB 0*64kB 0*128kB 1*256kB 0*512kB 0*1024kB 0*2048kB 0*4096kB = 36416kB

[05:30:28]

sandeen_:

there are no 64kb contiguous chunks

[05:31:07]

kormoc:

sandeen_, but the 1*256kB would imply 4*64kb no?

[05:31:44]

sandeen_:

yeah just saw that... not sure whether the allocator will break that up... would think so

[05:31:52]

sandeen_:

the VM is not my forte :)

[05:32:13]

kormoc:

heh, understandable :)

[05:32:47]

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[05:48:16]

tripppy:

i need help getting mythfiulldatabase working in brisbane/australlia

[05:50:43]

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[05:56:01]

siXy:

tripppy, whats the problem?

[05:58:29]

MikeyMan:

Hello everybody

[05:58:51]

MikeyMan:

I have a problem with the skip forward function.

[05:59:08]

siXy:

what problem?

[05:59:09]

MikeyMan:

If I am watching live TV and pause it long enough that the next program has begun,

[05:59:28]

MikeyMan:

When I press the skip forward button it skips all the way to the start of the next program instead of only skipping ahead 30 seconds

[05:59:47]

siXy:

yep it does that.

[06:00:06]

MikeyMan:

OK, it didn't do that before, so it seems like I've changed something?

[06:00:18]

MikeyMan:

Is there a config option somewhere or a different key that I should be using instead?

[06:00:36]

siXy:

hang on. the right arrow will always skip ahead a small amount.

[06:00:55]

siXy:

ther are several other skip functions – the largest increment will skip to next file if there is one

[06:01:06]

MikeyMan:

Ahh, so I am using the wrong key.

[06:01:06]

tripppy:

siXy, when it looks up the info for brisbane free SD channels it doesn't get the guide info

[06:01:50]

siXy:

if its the small skip thats doing that, youve changed something, either in your remotes key config (~/.mythtv/lircrc) or in myths internal key config menu

[06:02:28]

MikeyMan:

I just looked up my .lircrc file and it is configured for "Right"

[06:02:40]

siXy:

tripppy, im afraid im gonna need more info than that :) perhaps you could post the output of mythfilldatabase to rafb.net?

[06:02:40]

MikeyMan:

However it also specifies a repeat of 2, perhaps that's my problem?

[06:02:53]

siXy:

nah ignore the repeat field for now

[06:02:58]

tripppy:

siXy, kk. booting it now

[06:03:12]

MikeyMan:

Thanks for your attention siXy.

[06:03:23]

siXy:

no problem :)

[06:03:54]

siXy:

can you check myths internal keybindings? (options>something)

[06:04:09]

MikeyMan:

I'm looking at the keybindings via mythweb, will that work?

[06:04:25]

siXy:

it *might* but i really wouldnt reccomend it

[06:04:29]

MikeyMan:

Or is it better to check them via mythfrontend?

[06:04:33]

MikeyMan:

OK mythfrontend it is

[06:04:53]

siXy:

use the forntend. changing settings via the web interface causes problems, and if you have this might be what the issue is

[06:04:58]

MikeyMan:

Let me see if I can find it... seems like I've been through these screens a million times and I don't remember seeing that option.

[06:05:39]

MikeyMan:

Actually I don't have mythcontrols installed so I don't believe I'll see that screen will I?

[06:06:24]

MikeyMan:

And no I haven't changed keybindings via MythWeb at all. It used to skip ahead 30 seconds no matter what; at some point in the last month or two it started doing this.

[06:06:43]

MikeyMan:

So I must have messed it up somehow.

[06:10:01]

siXy:

ok. in that case log in to mysql on your backend

[06:10:21]

siXy:

you will need to login with the command mysql -u root -p

[06:10:27]

siXy:

and then enter your mysql root pw

[06:10:36]

MikeyMan:

OK I am in

[06:10:40]

siXy:

then type the following lines:

[06:10:46]

siXy:

use mythconverg

[06:11:13]

MikeyMan:

Yup, don't forget the ';' ;)

[06:11:29]

siXy:

you dont need a ; for a use command.

[06:11:42]

siXy:

SELECT * FROM keybindings WHERE keylist = "Right";

[06:11:47]

MikeyMan:

I stand corrected... I put one on out of habit. :)

[06:12:01]

siXy:

:)

[06:12:10]

MikeyMan:

OK, got 14 rows

[06:12:12]

siXy:

then paste the output of that to rafb.net

[06:12:39]

siXy:

you might wanna drag your term window so that a row only takes one line – makes it a whole lot easier to read

[06:13:00]

siXy:

thats interesting – i get 15 rows

[06:13:56]

MikeyMan:

The frontend where this isn't working is hostname 'mythtv'.

[06:14:12]

MikeyMan:

The other frontends I've not used for quite a while so I don't know if they would have this problem or not.

[06:15:41]

siXy:

hmm. that looks normal.

[06:17:01]

siXy:

you havent changed video accleration method or anything?

[06:17:43]

MikeyMan:

I recently upgraded the nvidia driver I was using, and I have been experimenting with turning XvMC on and off.

[06:17:59]

MikeyMan:

Due to audio sync issues I've been having (that's a whole different problem unfortunately)

[06:18:32]

MikeyMan:

I have one channel in particular where the audio always seems to be ahead of the video by a split second.

[06:18:43]

MikeyMan:

Other channels seem fine though. It's very strange.

[06:18:52]

siXy:

well im pretty stumped im afraid. thre doesnt appear to be anything wrong with your setup. its either a bug or an issue with your video/audio drivers

[06:18:55]

MikeyMan:

But I'll worry about that problem later.

[06:19:38]

MikeyMan:

Hmm, OK, I do appreciate you at least taking a look at my configuration. I'm pretty stumped too.

[06:19:54]

MikeyMan:

I have had a hard time coming up with a good query for Google on this too.

[06:20:04]

siXy:

im going to go get a drink. if something occurs to me i will let you know :

[06:20:33]

siXy:

well juski will be on soon – he might be able to help – although its a pretty strange issue

[06:30:04]

MikeyMan:

Yeah I am starting to think maybe it is time to wipe this machine and re-install.

[06:30:21]

MikeyMan:

This audio sync issue on a single channel is really weird too.

[06:30:39]

MikeyMan:

All of the other channels seem to be fine except for channel 5.

[06:30:54]

MikeyMan:

Maybe my system gas gremlins living in it.

[06:36:10]

MikeyMan:

Well thanks again siXy, I'm going to head to bed. I'll drop back in here another time to see if anybody else has any ideas.

[06:52:27]

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[06:55:59]

isses:

station here sometimes telecasts with sync problems.

[07:05:41]

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[07:09:23]

tripppy:

can someone help with tv_grab_au_reg script and getting it working?

[07:26:28]

tripppy:

siXy, http://pastebin.com/867696 when i try to run the script

[07:26:28]

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[07:26:48]

Fooker:

Hey all. Anyone know what directory the user jobs are normally run in? /tmp ?

[07:35:18]

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[07:37:21]

siXy:

tripppy, are you running myth as root??

[07:41:23]

Fooker:

Running commercial flagging creates a cutlist, yes?

[07:41:50]

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[07:42:30]

tripppy:

siXy, yeah i find that if in doubt run as root.

[07:42:38]

tripppy:

but i did as user and same problem

[07:43:04]

dgoodlad:

If I start messing around in the 'channel' table, removing channels that I don't want, is this going to break much in myth? do I need to do anything afterwards?

[07:43:41]

siXy:

dgoodlad, as long as you do it right it will be fine. youmay have to restart the backend, but that is all

[07:44:13]

dgoodlad:

siXy: by 'do it right', are you implying that I have to remove guide data etc for those channels etc?

[07:44:39]

dgoodlad:

I just don't want to leave stale data floating around, so am unsure what the accepted way of going about this ight be

[07:44:58]

dgoodlad:

doing it manually in mythtv-setup sucks – I've got hundreds of channels

[07:45:46]

siXy:

you can remove any row you want from the channel table. changing a row needs to be done with care however.

[07:46:14]

siXy:

stop the backend, edit – start the backend is what ive done in the past and that works fine

[07:47:02]

dgoodlad:

ok cool; I don't really plan to edit much at all (maybe commercial-free flags, that's it), mainly just deleting useless (to me) channels

[07:48:37]

siXy:

yeah thats pretty much what ive done – and its always worked just fine here. as long as you know what your are doing with sql its hard to go too badly wrong

[07:49:11]

siXy:

tripppy, it sounds like your grabber is incorrrectly configured. run mythtv-setup again, as the user you run the backend as.

[07:49:28]

dgoodlad:

Yeah, I've been digging around a bit today and it's a fairly simple schema

[07:49:39]

dgoodlad:

although I don't like the naming of some of the tables... whatever :)

[07:50:17]

siXy:

well if thats your biggest problem... :D

[07:54:28]

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[09:24:51]

stuarta:

morning all

[09:25:07]

jduggan:

bore da

[09:25:23]

jduggan:

thats morning also, i believe

[09:25:26]

jduggan:

in welsh

[09:29:09]

juski:

morning

[09:29:36]

juski:

got that Friday feeling today :)

[09:30:16]

jduggan:

oh god

[09:30:20]

jduggan:

its friday

[09:30:32]

jduggan:

and i have an empty diary all weekend

[09:30:40]

jduggan:

wonderful :)

[09:31:11]

stuarta:

we have our work christmas party tonight! woohoo!

[09:31:42]

jduggan:

erm

[09:31:55]

jduggan:

either you're incredibly early, or quite incredibly late?

[09:31:56]

jduggan:

heh

[09:32:58]

jduggan:

my partner had hers like 2weeks ago, but that was because people were either ill or away during the christmas period.. you're almost in february :P

[09:34:19]

stuarta:

technically it's the "end of year party"

[09:35:37]

stuarta:

since we're in retail, functions at Christmas time are a no go

[09:35:45]

stuarta:

we're too busy

[09:39:52]

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[10:07:37]

juski:

hahaha 'awesome' has become a banished word in Lake Superior State University's list

[10:07:59]

stuarta:

that's a good one.

[10:08:21]

purserj:

anyone here attend linux.conf.au?

[10:08:39]

stuarta:

heard yesterday that things like "itv play" should be considered gambling and thus regulated :)

[10:08:41]

Zider:

juski: why?

[10:09:19]

qu0zl:

because the word awesome was making up over 15% of the typical freshman's essay

[10:09:27]

juski:

Zider: it's way over-used these days & no longer means something that inspires awe. I mean if Ubuntu is 'awesome' ffs what hope is there?

[10:09:45]

Zider:

true ;)

[10:09:56]

juski:

coversation in #ubuntu

[10:09:59]

juski:

awesome!

[10:10:02]

juski:

awesome

[10:10:03]

juski:

awesome

[10:10:11]

qu0zl:

lol, juski lurks in #ubuntu!

[10:10:21]

qu0zl:

careful Juski, it's a slippery slope ;)

[10:10:34]

juski:

yeah next thing I know I'll be advocating people use it

[10:10:38]

Zider:

sloppery sleep

[10:10:52]

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[10:13:44]

juski:

is regulating stupid gameshow channels enough? Just ban em

[10:14:07]

stuarta:

it's a start

[10:14:18]

Zider:

the beginning of the end

[10:15:00]

juski:

I'd have said the very startup of such channels was the beginning of the end

[10:15:49]

juski:

bring back Equinox, the proper Horizon & Panorama

[10:16:48]

juski:

non-tabloid investigative journalism in Dispatches too.. way too much bloody scaremongery going on

[10:21:16]

stuarta:

finally got around to watching the doco about the potters bar rail crash

[10:21:29]

stuarta:

that was well done, just went through what happened

[10:27:33]

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[10:28:34]

juski:

jees. 204 programs, using 388 GB (8 days 19 hrs 21 mins) out of 458 GB (34 GB free).

[10:28:57]

Zider:

hm?

[10:30:05]

Ruleke:

:D

[10:31:56]

Ruleke:

I've made my recording partition small intentionally

[10:32:19]

juski:

sod it I'll delete the xmas lectures

[10:32:58]

stuarta:

mostly movies awaiting *offloading*

[10:33:06]

Zider:

oh, tv programs

[10:36:14]

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[10:37:25]

juski:

tempting to wipe out 200GB of 'bad girls' just on taste grounds

[10:37:57]

juski:

not like she's ever gonna watch em again

[10:39:51]

quicksilver:

just symlink them all to like 1 or 2 chosen episodes

[10:39:56]

quicksilver:

she'll never notice that

[10:39:57]

stuarta:

just set autoexpire = 1 and recpriority = -20 and let them vanish

[10:40:30]

stuarta:

btw. i use weighted autoexpire so the recpriority modifies what gets removed first

[10:42:28]

juski:

I'll copy em off the box for now

[10:42:49]

juski:

edit / transcode later

[11:02:35]

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[11:19:32]

stuarta:

offhand anyone know the expected release date for RHEL5 ??

[11:19:39]

stuarta:

it's not obvious on the redhat site.

[11:56:03]

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[12:06:45]

Ruleke:

stuarta: only got a beta copy this week

[12:07:54]

stuarta:

Ruleke: okay thanks, at a guess then it'll be Mar/Apr

[12:08:53]

Ruleke:

let me dig up the mail

[12:10:01]

Ruleke:

no date, but it will be a while

[12:10:16]

Ruleke:

only beta2 now with the paravirt stuff now

[12:10:24]

stuarta:

there's only talk of a change freeze starting end of the month on the cluster mailing list

[12:10:43]

Ruleke:

yeah that's only for the DLM part

[12:11:04]

Ruleke:

ah well

[12:11:17]

Ruleke:

I still have a few RHEL3 ones I need to upgrade anyway :)

[12:14:55]

stuarta:

i'm just planning new stuff, so i may as well insist on rhel5

[12:16:26]

Ruleke:

I wouldn't tbh

[12:16:33]

Ruleke:

but maybe my environment is different

[12:17:25]

Ruleke:

opello is starting to be a tad annoying :)

[12:18:44]

juski:

ignore them then ;)

[12:25:28]

imperfect-:

the frontend would cause my Xorg server to segfault

[12:25:33]

imperfect-:

It's starting to drive me nuts.

[12:43:29]

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[13:10:43]

Ruleke:

/ignore opello

[13:10:47]

Ruleke:

meh

[13:10:54]

stuarta:

doh!

[13:17:17]

Beirdo:

looks like opello's connection's even worse than mine

[13:18:06]

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[13:19:17]

stuarta:

at least you are currently at the other end of yours

[13:20:36]

Beirdo:

heh

[13:21:01]

Ruleke:

great information for the logs too ? :)

[13:21:22]

Beirdo:

but my connection to the proxy goes up and down like a cheap whore. Useless ISP

[13:21:58]

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[13:22:16]

** Beirdo wanders off to make the day's coffee and walk the puppy **

[13:22:46]

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[13:22:58]

Ruleke:

don't mix em up Beirdo

[13:23:21]

Freman:

My 0.20 backend keeps dying at between 11pm and 2am every day

[13:23:40]

Freman:

http://paste-bin.com/2475 <- That's what I've got in my mythbackend.log – I suspect it isn't going to help

[13:24:40]

Freman:

Interestingly enough these issues seem to happen when it's recording

[13:25:36]

stuarta:

commflag can throw those

[13:26:04]

Freman:

commflag shouldn't be running tbh – I turned off all "jobs" on this box

[13:27:19]

Freman:

it isn't running

[13:27:44]

Freman:

I don't get anything in my messages log, and the mythbackend.log is essentially useless

[13:27:47]

Freman:

it just 'goes'

[13:30:59]

** imperfect- cries **

[13:31:02]

imperfect-:

I can't watch TV no mo!

[13:31:15]

imperfect-:

Its breaksmy heart

[13:34:00]

Freman:

heh, I don't care if I can't watch tv... just that it stops recording the one or two shows I want to watch

[13:52:22]

juski:

wooyeah yet another dvd writer that doesn't work out of the box in our kit. god I love software

[14:01:42]

Ruleke:

juski: whu ?

[14:06:20]

juski:

writes cds just fine, but not dvds.. software to blame

[14:07:33]

Honk:

http://pastebin.ca/329143 <-- backtrace of a segfault while playing music :P

[14:07:42]

Honk:

any clue what might be causing that? :P

[14:08:07]

juski:

stop playing music – solves the problem :)

[14:08:12]

Honk:

good idea

[14:08:44]

stuarta:

there's an open ticket about that

[14:11:56]

Honk:

oh.. i didnt find that, last time i searched

[14:11:58]

Honk:

ta :)

[14:12:18]

Honk:

i'll keep an eye on it =)

[14:12:41]

stuarta:

it's been closed, reopened, fiddled with....

[14:15:00]

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[14:15:47]

Honk:

having a bug i can watch is all i need :P the problem doesnt occur that often :]

[14:17:43]

Honk:

and: is there some kind of functionality in mythtv that'd allow me to set auto-expiry times for records depending on their priority? (i.e. delete all removable priority 0 movies after 2 weeks, priority 1 after 3 weeks etc.)

[14:18:21]

GreyFoxx:

sig11? Normally that's a hardware failure

[14:18:30]

Honk:

or a software failure

[14:18:33]

GreyFoxx:

cpu instruction error or bad ram

[14:18:44]

GreyFoxx:

I said "normally", not only :)

[14:19:05]

Honk:

it tends to be a hardware failure if you get it in more than one program :P

[14:19:18]

GreyFoxx:

it depends on the cause

[14:19:23]

Honk:

(geesh, i really thought my server was fried, when i got it in mythmusic (as usual) and some other program at once :P)

[14:19:40]

Honk:

't was just a problem with the ebuild of the other program though *g*

[14:19:47]

GreyFoxx:

I've had machines where only specific apps would fail cause they were the only ones trying to access a certain part of ram or using a certin cpu instructionset

[14:20:02]

Honk:

never happened to me luckily :)

[14:25:32]

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[14:26:17]

Honk:

mkaaay, my question was kinda stupid.. i didnt look at the options properly :P

[14:26:50]

Honk:

buuut: is there a way to have all old files autoexpire after a certain time, instead of expiring only if my hd is full? =)

[14:30:25]

GreyFoxx:

Honk: No there is nothing like that in there

[14:32:45]

Honk:

that'd be a nice feature to be able to tell how full my hd really is :)

[14:32:57]

Honk:

without having to check the mythtv status page in 2 different spots :]

[14:35:52]

stuarta:

i'm just waiting for the expiry list to be available easily through mythweb

[14:53:08]

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[14:53:30]

mothas:

Is there a good place to go for hardware guidance for a large-ish system? Looking for specs for back end(s) to handle 2 pcHDTV5500's, an FM tuner, & one or two sat dish boxes, and serve it out to 8 front-ends, 3 of which do HDTV.

[14:54:29]

Ruleke:

sounds pretty standard except for the many frontends. depends if they need to be used at the same time I guess...

[14:54:47]

Milosch:

sounds like a system for a sports bar

[14:54:53]

Ruleke:

if you need 8 (3 HD) reading from 1 backend it will be tricky maybe :)

[14:55:13]

mothas:

At least 2 HDTV's will be going most of the time – sometimes all 3.

[14:56:12]

Milosch:

crazy doctor maybe? ;)

[14:56:24]

mothas:

Doctor married to a physicist.

[14:56:28]

Milosch:

heh

[14:56:57]

Ruleke:

trying to take over the world ? ;)

[14:57:09]

mothas:

You got it. :-)

[14:57:50]

Ruleke:

what hardware guidance would you need then ?

[14:58:29]

quicksilver:

to be honest I would *think* that would be OK

[14:58:39]

quicksilver:

with standard commodity hardware

[14:58:49]

quicksilver:

get decent hard disks, get gig ethernet

[14:58:56]

quicksilver:

(decent cabling in house required)

[14:59:52]

mothas:

Trying to figure out what kind of back-end could serve all of that.

[15:00:19]

Ruleke:

well if it's not all 8 at the same time it should be ok

[15:00:27]

mothas:

I'm pretty sure the cabling is up to it. Have coax for sound, gig ethernet everywhere it's needed.

[15:01:08]

mothas:

The most likely scenario is 1 HDTV + all others doing audio.

[15:02:40]

quicksilver:

can't see a problem

[15:02:51]

quicksilver:

I don't have bandwidth numbers at my fingertips but HD isn't that huge

[15:03:08]

mothas:

Good

[15:03:10]

stuarta:

HD=20mb/s

[15:03:13]

Ruleke:

22Mbit around here for some

[15:03:37]

quicksilver:

getting 60mb/sec out of your hard disks and your gig ethernet shouldn't be a problem

[15:04:15]

** Ruleke thinks about recording 2 HD streams and playing back 2 at the same time **

[15:04:59]

quicksilver:

well 'recording' just means 'streaming an mpg to disk'

[15:05:04]

quicksilver:

that is not a serious cpu load

[15:05:13]

quicksilver:

and playing is only a CPU load on the front-end, not the backend

[15:05:39]

quicksilver:

so the only question is can your hard disks manage 40mb/sec read and 40mb/sec write at the same time

[15:05:51]

qu0zl:

problem with playing/recording multiple streams is that the harddrive heads jump all-over the place so you get a fraction of the throughpyut you'd get reading or writing 1 large file

[15:05:52]

Ruleke:

I was thinking disk

[15:05:52]

quicksilver:

now I've never tried to test that but I'd be surprised if it was a big problem

[15:06:11]

mothas:

Better figure more like 40mb/sec write & 60mb/sec read.

[15:06:11]

Ruleke:

yep

[15:06:32]

Ruleke:

well you could always split the backend

[15:06:33]

Ruleke:

:)

[15:06:56]

Ruleke:

or build yourself a raid or so

[15:06:57]

qu0zl:

i'm assuming the storage group stuff in svn will help? Hopefully it lets you round-robin recordings between disks, i haven't looked at it yet

[15:07:01]

qu0zl:

raid doesn't fix the problem

[15:07:07]

qu0zl:

you still have heads jumping allover the place

[15:07:09]

mothas:

Does Myth load-balance multiple backends?

[15:07:25]

quicksilver:

mothas: no, the backend service the tuners they have installed

[15:07:25]

qu0zl:

so writing 2 files to a raid of 2 disks is way slower than writing 2 files, 1 each to seperate drives

[15:07:26]

fryfrog:

keep in mind when you say 22mb / sec that is mega-bits

[15:07:30]

fryfrog:

which is like 2MB/sec

[15:07:46]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: raid still improves the situation

[15:07:51]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: you're getting better bandwidth

[15:07:54]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: no, that isn't true

[15:07:56]

quicksilver:

(well depending what kind of raid)

[15:08:04]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: some raid can slow it down a *lot* for writing

[15:08:08]

** quicksilver nods **

[15:08:09]

mothas:

I think raid is a given anyway.

[15:08:09]

fryfrog:

actually, most raid

[15:08:11]

qu0zl:

not really quicksilver, when most of the time is lost due to the heads jumpingaround

[15:08:27]

fryfrog:

Now that they have the "multiple" dir thing, i'd probably *not* use raid for myth

[15:08:27]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: the relative loss due to headskipping doesn't get better

[15:08:43]

mothas:

Don't want to do SCSI if I don't have to though – but it would help the head jumping problem.

[15:08:45]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: but at least you have more actual spindles

[15:08:51]

fryfrog:

writing to a raid array is slow because it has to verify writes to multiple drives

[15:09:05]

qu0zl:

but the loss due to headskipping does get better with recording each file to a seperate disk

[15:09:26]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: but that only works if you know the pattern of recording/viewing

[15:09:45]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: nothing to stop the user recording two files to the same disk and chooising to play files from that same disk, by bad luck

[15:10:06]

qu0zl:

i would hope that the recording groups allows round-robining in chosing where to record to?

[15:10:17]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: the playing problem still applies

[15:10:17]

qu0zl:

i don't know if it does though, i've not looked at it

[15:10:19]

mothas:

That'd be the reason to do raid – spread the load over multiple spindles.

[15:10:41]

qu0zl:

yep quicksilver but that'll be a much smaller problem as long as the recordings are spread out.

[15:10:48]

Dagmar:

That is a dim way to spread the load across spindels

[15:10:52]

qu0zl:

it may not be perfect but it's much better than just a raid

[15:10:53]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: no, it's a smaller chance of the problem happening

[15:11:04]

Dagmar:

If you want to do that, do that. Which means you will use RAID striping.

[15:11:05]

qu0zl:

exactly, and is that an argument against doing it and going with raid?

[15:11:05]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: but when the problem does occur, it will be as bad as the single disk case

[15:11:07]

Ruleke:

fryfrog : I'm spoiled with H/W battery-backed caching cards

[15:11:18]

quicksilver:

the raid solution will be more predictable

[15:11:25]

qu0zl:

predictably bad

[15:11:27]

quicksilver:

it will tend to perform similarly

[15:11:32]

Dagmar:

More importantly, the RAID solution will actually work *all the time*

[15:11:34]

quicksilver:

'bad' may be good enough

[15:11:35]

qu0zl:

yes, awful, always quisksilver

[15:11:39]

qu0zl:

don't be ridiculous

[15:11:46]

quicksilver:

'awful' isn't 'awful' if it happens to work

[15:11:49]

** quicksilver shrugs **

[15:11:56]

qu0zl:

my point is i don't believe it will for his situation

[15:12:03]

qu0zl:

which is why i'm providing another opinion

[15:12:03]

quicksilver:

if the OS can cache enough data to keep the frontends live, then its fine

[15:12:05]

Dagmar:

quicksilver: On general principle, you *don't* count on side-effects to give you a performance consideration.

[15:12:13]

Dagmar:

You do a thing right or not at all basically.

[15:12:41]

Dagmar:

Doing the filesystem as raid is also the least intrusive way to go about spreading the disk load around

[15:12:48]

quicksilver:

I think my only thesis is that striping will not be worse than only have a single disk

[15:12:58]

quicksilver:

it may not be much better but I suspect it will be slightly better

[15:13:01]

quicksilver:

and it won't be worse

[15:13:01]

fryfrog:

RAID0 is > single disk

[15:13:05]

fryfrog:

but you lose data

[15:13:07]

qu0zl:

that's a pretty simplethesis quicksilver that i haven't seen anyone argue with yet

[15:13:13]

quicksilver:

right

[15:13:20]

Dagmar:

I'll argue with it

[15:13:32]

Dagmar:

Generalyl raid striping gets you 80% more throughput, even on it's worst days

[15:13:37]

fryfrog:

RAID0 will be *faster* for read and write!

[15:13:40]

qu0zl:

Dagmar, raid doesn't help with the fact that if you record multiple files the heads will skip between the semi random locations of the disks where each file is being appendded to

[15:13:47]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: right

[15:13:49]

fryfrog:

in all cases

[15:13:51]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: isn't that what I said?

[15:13:52]

Dagmar:

...because the physical disks are a whole crapton slower than the busses we put them on

[15:13:56]

qu0zl:

dagmar you're agreeing with his thesis :)

[15:13:57]

mothas:

So raid5 would be worse than concatenation? Sorry for my ignorance.

[15:13:58]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: striping...will not be worse

[15:14:08]

quicksilver:

mothas: raid5 is worse because of calculating checksums

[15:14:12]

Dagmar:

"it may not be much better but I suspect it will be slightly better"

[15:14:16]

fryfrog:

that all said!

[15:14:21]

Dagmar:

80% is not "slightly better". It's "almost twice as good"

[15:14:25]

fryfrog:

I have a raid5 array of 5x 320G drives on SATA

[15:14:28]

mothas:

don't most raid cards do out-of-order disk access?

[15:14:36]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: ok, you agree with me but you're being more optimistic, is all

[15:14:36]

fryfrog:

and I can write *FOUR* HD streams to it, 2 in system and 2 over network

[15:14:39]

Dagmar:

Raid5 is not worse, either

[15:14:43]

Dagmar:

Do any of you guys even USE raid?

[15:14:56]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: qu0zl appeard to be trying to tell me that raid would make things worse than single-disk

[15:15:08]

Dagmar:

A five-disk RAID 5 is going to stomp the crap out of a single disk solution

[15:15:10]

qu0zl:

quicksilver, i DID NOT say that

[15:15:16]

quicksilver:

RAID5 is worse than single-disk

[15:15:20]

quicksilver:

is not what I meant

[15:15:21]

qu0zl:

if you can't argue with my actual argument don't try and make a straw man attack

[15:15:27]

quicksilver:

I meant: RAID 5 is worse than pure striping

[15:15:30]

juski:

god not this again

[15:15:31]

Ruleke:

heck I stopped typing a while ago, I'll wait for someone to look up some raid design strategy facts before doing so again.. sigh

[15:15:46]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: it's not a deliberate straw man, feel free to explain yourself better if I misunderstood

[15:15:46]

Dagmar:

fryfrog: No, it's not.

[15:15:57]

mothas:

Pure striping would mean losing a lot of data periodically – I don't think that's a viable solution, even if it would handle the load.

[15:15:58]

qu0zl:

re-read it please quicksilver

[15:16:33]

quicksilver:

15:11 < qu0zl> predictably bad

[15:16:33]

quicksilver:

15:11 < quicksilver> it will tend to perform similarly

[15:16:37]

quicksilver:

15:11 < quicksilver> 'bad' may be good enough

[15:16:37]

quicksilver:

15:11 < qu0zl> yes, awful, always quisksilver

[15:16:37]

quicksilver:

15:11 < qu0zl> don't be ridiculous

[15:16:54]

qu0zl:

qu0zl> but the loss due to headskipping does get better with recording each file to a seperate disk

[15:16:55]

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[15:17:06]

qu0zl:

i never suggested using one disk over a raid array

[15:17:10]

quicksilver:

qu0zl: but you can't do that reliably

[15:17:15]

quicksilver:

your disks may get separately full

[15:17:24]

quicksilver:

and most importantly you don't know which disk the user is going to read from

[15:17:31]

qu0zl:

i suggested that the more disks you have, if you can round-robin between them, then that will provide much better performance than a raid array

[15:17:42]

juski:

meanwhile back in #mythtv-users....

[15:17:49]

Dagmar:

qu0zl: Dude, that's still incorrect.

[15:17:56]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: mythbackend picks which "drive" to use intelligently

[15:17:58]

Ruleke:

you can't predict the read pattern when distributing files accross volumes most of the time, the user might want to play back the two that are on the same disk, but hey

[15:18:04]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: it can't predict the user's reading patter though

[15:18:05]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: if drive 1 is in use, it writes to drive 2

[15:18:18]

qu0zl:

aye Ruleke but you can make it so that there's neve rmore than one writer to a disk at a particular time

[15:18:19]

fryfrog:

doing a signle read/write at the same time is *nothing* even to a single disk

[15:18:25]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: and then when a third recording comes in, it can guess wrong

[15:18:26]

Dagmar:

For one thing, you shoudln't have to put the task of round-robin into even _more_ software, since the machine can do it more reliably at the OS level

[15:18:28]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: it doesn't matter

[15:18:28]

qu0zl:

so while you can't limit the playbacks you can make sure to limit the writers

[15:18:45]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: first recording (long) to disk 1, second recording disk 2, third recording, disk 1

[15:18:50]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: a hard drive now a days will have 20–30mb / sec read and write speed *easy*

[15:18:57]

qu0zl:

Dagmar, the OS doesn't round-robin at the file level though, through raid it'll onlyround-robin at the disk write level, that's not functionally equivalent

[15:18:59]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: now recording two finishes

[15:19:03]

fryfrog:

and i mean 20–30 MEGABYTES (MB)

[15:19:08]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: and now recordings 1 and three are both writing

[15:19:17]

fryfrog:

an HD stream is *only* 2–3MB/sec!

[15:19:22]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: then the user tries to watch two files which by bad luck also happen to be on that disk

[15:19:24]

fryfrog:

its *nothing* to a hard drive

[15:19:30]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: and bingo, we've degraded to the one disk case

[15:19:45]

quicksilver:

that's my only point

[15:19:46]

fryfrog:

omg, so you are writing 4MB / sec and reading 2MB / sec

[15:19:50]

fryfrog:

cry me a river

[15:19:57]

Dagmar:

qu0zl: It's functionally better to do it at the OS level with striping because it will *always* distribute the load evenly across all the disks in the array, (and this is the important part) no matter how many i/o streams you have going

[15:20:04]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: that's a totally different argument

[15:20:12]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: it may be that this is all moot because HDs are fast enough

[15:20:17]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: I simply don't know (personally)

[15:20:18]

Milosch:

raid 6?

[15:20:28]

fryfrog:

no, its saying that the fact that you are recording 2 streams and playing back 1 is not *even* an argument because it isn't a problem

[15:20:28]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: but that has NOTHING to do with whether round robin is better than raid

[15:20:39]

quicksilver:

recording 2 and playing 2

[15:20:39]

juski:

ok boys. can we say that's enough now?

[15:20:51]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: that's still not the point

[15:20:58]

mothas:

So.. recording 2 and playing 3 HD streams should be doable without heroic measures, is what you're saying, fryfrog?

[15:20:59]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: you'll probably served equally well by using RAID0 or myth's built in

[15:21:00]

juski:

this could (and WILL) go on all bloody weekend

[15:21:01]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: the point is: round-robin or raid?

[15:21:15]

quicksilver:

mothas: that's my gut feeling too

[15:21:18]

qu0zl:

it'll take more money to get the raid solution to work well normaly than for the round-robin hd solution to

[15:21:35]

Ruleke:

mothas: probably

[15:21:38]

quicksilver:

the round-robin HD solution has a reasonably high chance of worst-casing to the single disk case

[15:21:41]

Dagmar:

LVM does striping and it's free

[15:21:41]

quicksilver:

the raid will never do that

[15:21:44]

fryfrog:

mothas: I have seen my system do 4 recordings and 1 playback at the same time

[15:21:55]

quicksilver:

if the single disk case is ok, then there is no problem anyway

[15:22:10]

fryfrog:

mothas: when its doing that, I am *careful* not to cause a lot of disk IO on the server though

[15:22:13]

fryfrog:

just in case

[15:22:44]

fryfrog:

quicksilver: I'd go with RAID5 for redundancy and space. I hate having multiple drives :)

[15:22:49]

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[15:23:29]

Dagmar:

Again LVM is free.

[15:23:46]

Dagmar:

You can't really get away from LVM since we're running this stuff on Linux.

[15:23:46]

mothas:

I think if I go raid, I'd put LVM on top of it anyway.

[15:23:48]

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[15:24:25]

Ruleke:

It's what I do

[15:24:26]

mothas:

Let's me add more disk later

[15:24:32]

Dagmar:

mothas: If you bought a hardware raid card then there would't be any point in using LVM.

[15:24:35]

qu0zl:

aye LVM is great

[15:24:37]

juski:

be a foo not to use raid with lvm

[15:24:37]

Dagmar:

er LVM for RAID

[15:24:45]

Ruleke:

except on Hp-Ux where I let lvm do the mirroring for internal disks ;)

[15:24:56]

Sembiance:

Isn't EVMS better than LVM?

[15:25:01]

Ruleke:

I love how the linux lvm copied the commands from hpux, makes it so easy :)

[15:25:04]

plb:

Is there anyway to use wide themes on 4:3 aspect?

[15:25:16]

juski:

plb: yeah

[15:25:19]

juski:

just use them

[15:25:24]

Dagmar:

Semblance: Sure, if you like less-tested code managing your bulk data stores.

[15:25:33]

plb:

the one I tried acted strange

[15:25:34]

juski:

plb: YMMV

[15:25:40]

Dagmar:

plb: It automatically rescales themes depending on your display size

[15:25:44]

plb:

hrm

[15:25:59]

mothas:

Dagmar: wouldn't using lvm on top of a hardware raid array still let you expand the storage (albeit, not within the raid)?

[15:26:09]

juski:

I run blootubelite-wide on my frontend at 720x576

[15:26:10]

Dagmar:

Although frankly I think Myth could maybe stand to not show you both options if a theme has both 4:3 and 16:9 formats. It should just use the one that's approprite

[15:26:21]

juski:

sod that

[15:26:32]

Dagmar:

mothas: You can generally expand volumes in the hardware with no problem, either.

[15:26:38]

juski:

I need myth to run the 16:9 theme skew-wiffy

[15:26:38]

fryfrog:

I don't even see the point of LVM

[15:26:45]

fryfrog:

I just have my RAID5, format it with xfs

[15:26:55]

plb:

hrm lemme try a different theme

[15:26:58]

fryfrog:

and if i add another drive i can expand the raid5 and then grow the xfs

[15:27:02]

Dagmar:

fryfrog: LVM is free, so if you dont buy a raid card it's handy stuff

[15:27:10]

fryfrog:

i can't *shrink* it, but big deal

[15:27:14]

fryfrog:

but LVM isn't *RAID*

[15:27:32]

Dagmar:

fryfrog: So, how am I doing striping with LVM?

[15:27:47]

fryfrog:

okay,. so it can do striping

[15:27:49]

juski:

limiting wide themes to 16:9 resolutions would piss me off a considerable amount

[15:27:52]

Ruleke:

lvm on top of raid rids you of those pesky partitions :)

[15:27:53]

fryfrog:

just raid0

[15:28:07]

Dagmar:

fryfrog: It can DEFINITELY do RAID1 man

[15:28:08]

fryfrog:

ah, but i only have one partition :)

[15:28:10]

fryfrog:

oh?

[15:28:17]

Ruleke:

ah you're 'one of those' ;)

[15:28:22]

Dagmar:

I *started* my two-drive array as a spanned volume

[15:28:24]

mothas:

The reason for LVM would be to like use my ancient 3com raid card with 4 PATA disks, and be able to add more space later.

[15:28:26]

fryfrog:

I though tyou had to run LVM on *top* of a kernel raid?

[15:28:38]

Ruleke:

Dagmar: raid 0 you mean ?

[15:28:54]

fryfrog:

Okay, but LVM *can't* do RAID5?

[15:29:02]

Dagmar:

...and one of the options I screwed up initially caused me to freaking blow a hour or so figuring out I'd told it to reconstruct a mirrored volume

[15:29:10]

Ruleke:

I doesn't do raid1 afaict

[15:29:43]

stuarta:

fryfrog: no, you do lvm over the top of raid5

[15:29:44]

mothas:

As I read it, LVM can't do any raid – not what it does. You can do raid with LVM volumes, or you can include raid arrays in an LVM volume. Am I wrong?

[15:30:08]

fryfrog:

that is what i thought too

[15:30:08]

Dagmar:

mothas: Read the URL I jsut posted

[15:30:16]

mothas:

Dagmar: 'k

[15:30:19]

quicksilver:

right

[15:30:28]

quicksilver:

but the kernel md driver can do RAID0,1,4,5,6

[15:30:29]

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[15:30:33]

quicksilver:

and then you run LVM on top

[15:30:39]

Ruleke:

Dagmar: no mirror anywhere on that page :P

[15:30:47]

quicksilver:

or you use EVMS which is primarily just a frontend to those tools

[15:30:50]

quicksilver:

in a unified place

[15:31:04]

quicksilver:

fryfrog: one advantage to linux software raid is that you aren't limited to fixed disk sizes

[15:31:28]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: I'm in the middle of building a new MythTV backend. It has 6 500GB drives. I figured one would be the main OS, one would be for recording shows, then I would RAID5 the other 4 with EVMS or LVM.

[15:31:51]

Ruleke:

Dagmar ??

[15:31:58]

Zider:

500GB for the os..?!

[15:32:00]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: The reason I won't be recording to the RAID array is because I'm worried about the slowdown since it'll be software RAID

[15:32:04]

Dagmar:

Ruleke: it's on page 2 of the article

[15:32:14]

fryfrog:

Sembiance: that sounds silly!~

[15:32:15]

Dagmar:

Zider has a huge point there

[15:32:17]

Ruleke:

Dagmar: that's software raid, lvm on top

[15:32:17]

quicksilver:

Sembiance: raid5 the whole lot

[15:32:31]

quicksilver:

Sembiance: no reason not to (except for not trusting the software raid layer, if you don't, but that's daft)

[15:32:38]

Dagmar:

You might as well span your "recorded programs" volume across most of the first drive and all of the second

[15:33:05]

Dagmar:

Then you're at least not looking at a 500Gb volume limit and about, oh, 450Gb of unused disk on the OS drive

[15:33:09]

quicksilver:

if you raid5 everything then you get redundancy everywhere

[15:33:21]

quicksilver:

then you have 2.5 TB of space to allocate dynamically between partitions

[15:33:24]

quicksilver:

whenever you feel like it

[15:33:38]

Ruleke:

"(16:27:52) Dagmar: fryfrog: It can DEFINITELY do RAID1 man", you even shouted it hehe

[15:33:39]

quicksilver:

(actually you have to keep a small bit RAID1 for booting)

[15:33:44]

Dagmar:

quicksilver: Well, booting from a LVM volume is kinda a bitch

[15:33:49]

Ruleke:

now apologize to fryfrog :)

[15:33:49]

Milosch:

seems like a stripe or mirror of a couple of raid 5's would be best

[15:33:56]

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[15:34:04]

quicksilver:

Milosch: why not just one big one? what's the point

[15:34:12]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: yes, small raid1 boot volume

[15:34:17]

Dagmar:

Ruleke: For implying that LVM tools are what you use to control your raid setup?

[15:34:23]

mothas:

I'd RAID5 the lot – no down side I can see.

[15:34:30]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: but 1G is enough for a boot volume, just chip 1G off the beginning of the disks

[15:34:36]

Ruleke:

lvm != dm

[15:34:40]

quicksilver:

not really noticeable

[15:34:44]

Sembiance:

I'll be having the potential of *four* HDTV streams and *two* standard def streams being recorded to disk at the same time.

[15:34:51]

Milosch:

speed, plus you can only lose one drive per raid 5, it's a gamble that 2 may fail, one in each 5

[15:35:06]

quicksilver:

Milosch: stupid

[15:35:14]

Sembiance:

I really don't want to tax RAID5 that much. Nor do I need the redudancy of data for just recorded TV shows

[15:35:15]

quicksilver:

Milosch: you need 2 to fail AT THE SAME TIME for it to matter

[15:35:25]

Milosch:

10 drives in a single raid5, 2 drives fail and it all crashes, right?

[15:35:28]

quicksilver:

Milosch: otherwise you replace the failed one and you're fine

[15:35:32]

quicksilver:

right

[15:35:42]

quicksilver:

but the chances of 2 drives failing at the same time is low

[15:35:51]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: For spanning part of drive 1 and all of drive 2, do you advise LVM?

[15:35:51]

Milosch:

it's not stupid, it's fairly common in larger systems

[15:35:53]

fryfrog:

Milosch: if they fail at the same time

[15:36:01]

seth|laptop:

with 10 drives, make a 5 disk raid 5 and mirror it

[15:36:10]

fryfrog:

nah

[15:36:14]

Milosch:

for instance, in broadcast television video servers

[15:36:24]

Zider:

just have one extra drive in a drawer in case one of the raided drives would die, in 5 years or so ;)

[15:36:24]

quicksilver:

Milosch: in massive expensive system-critical systems yes

[15:36:30]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: I don't advise using LVM so much as I challenge you to figure out how to span the disks without using lvmtools

[15:36:31]

seth|laptop:

yeah. better choice

[15:36:31]

quicksilver:

Milosch: but we're talking about home systems here

[15:36:32]

fryfrog:

they don't do 10 disk raid5 :)

[15:36:35]

Milosch:

the earlier ones came with LOTS of disks in single raid 5

[15:36:38]

Ruleke:

seth|laptop: yeah , these days I prefer raid6 though

[15:36:46]

quicksilver:

Milosch: it would only matter if you beleive 2 disks can fail before you have the chance to plug in your hotspare

[15:36:46]

fryfrog:

they'll prolly have some netapp that does like raid6 adn mirroring and shit

[15:36:59]

seth|laptop:

Ruleke: I agree raid 6 and hot spares, better choice

[15:37:03]

quicksilver:

bear in mind that the chance of two drivers failing in the same day is very low

[15:37:08]

Dagmar:

fryfrog: We've one of those at the office that's about as tall a I am

[15:37:19]

quicksilver:

if, e.g., there is 1 in 1000000 chance of a drive failing in any one day

[15:37:27]

quicksilver:

then there is a 1 in 1000000000000 chance of two failing

[15:37:27]

Dagmar:

I'm so glad they figured out one of the cabinets was broken

[15:37:30]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: EVMS :)

[15:37:40]

Dagmar:

I got a little tired of trying to get engineers to replace a drive every week or so

[15:37:57]

quicksilver:

(and if you care that much about failure, put hot spares in)

[15:38:10]

Dagmar:

sebian: I've not bothered with evms because it would have meant another pakcage to build, and figuring out lvm was easy enough

[15:38:13]

Ruleke:

quicksilver: only if the disk is from a different batch :-/

[15:38:27]

mothas:

Failure chances are a bit higher really – corellation.

[15:38:33]

quicksilver:

good point

[15:38:33]

Milosch:

growing a single raid 5 too far beyond the minimum of 3 is more of a risk than having two raid 5, once you get to 6 disks

[15:38:36]

quicksilver:

still, it's low

[15:38:43]

Ruleke:

quicksilver: it depends on array size mostly, it's not "at the same time" so much as "within replace and reconstruct time"

[15:38:44]

quicksilver:

Milosch: obviously it's more of a risk

[15:38:49]

quicksilver:

Milosch: but it's still a tiny risk

[15:38:51]

Dagmar:

The documentation is kind of suck because there's a forest-for-the-trees thing going on there, but if you just follow their instrux the first time it'll become transparent how the various pieces fit together

[15:39:01]

quicksilver:

it's more of a risk for each drive you aid

[15:39:03]

quicksilver:

(fairly clearly)

[15:39:07]

Milosch:

it's not always the disk itself ;)

[15:39:10]

quicksilver:

but the risk remains very low

[15:39:28]

quicksilver:

well perhaps you're using two arrays on separate controllers

[15:39:32]

quicksilver:

in case the controller fails

[15:39:36]

Ruleke:

you increase the time to reconstruct, so even with a hotspare you risk failing a second disk during the reconstruct window

[15:39:38]

quicksilver:

that is sensible, but that's solving a different problem

[15:39:44]

quicksilver:

Ruleke: absolutely true

[15:39:44]

mothas:

I've had hardware raid cards die, taking out 2 disks with them. Same for power supplies.

[15:40:02]

Sembiance:

Hardware raid is $$$$$$$$

[15:40:15]

Dagmar:

mothas: Yeah but the failure rate on the cards is like comparing a gnats eyelash to a bowlful of chili

[15:40:23]

quicksilver:

All those good points being understood, and good, I think a 6-volume RAID5 is perfectly safe for home use

[15:40:27]

qu0zl:

exactly mothas , whatever killed 1 drive may kill the 2nd in close proximity

[15:40:35]

Dagmar:

Disks die a LOT more often than controllers do

[15:40:41]

qu0zl:

like too high temperatures because your case fan failed

[15:40:41]

Ruleke:

quite

[15:40:43]

qu0zl:

or whatever

[15:41:14]

Milosch:

i think you'd get better performance from a stripe of 2 3-disk raid 5's while not necessarily increasing the risk

[15:41:15]

Dagmar:

I have to agree with quick there

[15:41:18]

mothas:

My point about correlation. I have 2 upstream providers, odd how often both get blown away by something at the same time.

[15:41:37]

Ruleke:

quicksilver: yeah, just as long as you have backups for stuff you want to keep :)

[15:41:47]

mothas:

Dying electronics often takes its friends with it – but it's still better than a single drive.

[15:41:52]

Dagmar:

mothas: You can't consider all failure rates equal. In that way lies madness and the adoption of Microsoft enterprise solutions.

[15:41:54]

Milosch:

of course a mirror of the two raids would be safer...

[15:42:11]

mothas:

Death first.

[15:42:12]

Ruleke:

seems the weak points in PC systems these days are the harddrive and PSU... some PSUs still don't have overvolt protect on some rails.. crazy

[15:42:25]

quicksilver:

Milosch: a stripe of two 3-disks only gives you 4 disks worth of space

[15:42:32]

quicksilver:

Milosch: I mean, that's fine

[15:42:34]

quicksilver:

but that's the trade-off

[15:42:40]

Milosch:

yep

[15:43:06]

quicksilver:

a mirror of two 3-disks gives you 2 disks of space, and that's crazy talk :P

[15:43:17]

Ruleke:

hehe

[15:43:18]

Milosch:

now that we have the raid lesson out of the way ;)

[15:43:20]

Dagmar:

Ruleke: I blame those temperature sensitive voltage regulator chips

[15:43:29]

Dagmar:

...and communism.

[15:43:36]

Milosch:

forgot to mention it kills bugs dead

[15:43:38]

Ruleke:

terrorism you mean

[15:43:48]

Ruleke:

keep up with the current Mccarthy-ism :P

[15:44:03]

Sembiance:

Also I'd like it to transcode it frmo 1080p to 720p

[15:44:14]

Dagmar:

Nah, I can't buy into blaming terrorism for everything. Not when lately The Establishment spreads more fear than the actual terrorists.

[15:44:14]

stuarta:

Sembiance: that'll be how it's broadcast

[15:44:33]

Dagmar:

Communism, tho'... now that's a bugaboo you can get behind and push like the dickens. :)

[15:44:38]

Scopeuk (Scopeuk!n=Scope@dyn237207.shef.ac.uk) has quit ("If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you")

[15:45:31]

Sembiance:

stuarta: Right, but like when I download a HDTV video from the internet, it's nicely formatted with no extra bars or anything. I was just wondering if Myth could crop the recordings for me, or if I need to write a script to do it myself

[15:45:43]

Dagmar:

Plus, communists will own up to it now. :)

[15:46:11]

Dagmar:

I always had so much fun joking aroudn with the guys at the red theatre in SF.

[15:47:40]

Dagmar:

You go up to them and say "Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Communist party?" and they'll say "Why, yes... yes I am!"

[15:48:12]

** Sembiance is convinced nobody in this channel ACTUALLY records and watches HD broadcast streams. **

[15:48:32]

Zider:

I don't

[15:48:33]

** stuarta suspects they spend too much time dicussing RAID & LVM **

[15:48:34]

Sembiance:

I've asked the crop/transcode question loads of times, but nobody ever has an actual answer. Just hypotheticals and conjecture :)

[15:48:35]

qu0zl:

i don't even watch tv

[15:48:47]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: THere are. They might not be on right now but there's plenty of people on the other side of the clock doing it

[15:49:12]

qu0zl:

Sembiance, if you really want to you can use vlc to crop/transcode whatever you like

[15:49:14]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: Probably because most of the answers are entirely dependent on what form of stream you're getting in the first plac4e

[15:49:54]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: If you say, "how do I transcode my HD stream into something smaller?" you're going to get conjecture and theory.

[15:50:18]

daum:

anyone here ever have their entire tv guide be off by two channels?

[15:50:20]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: If you say "How do I transcode my MP4 stream from my HD-2000 to somethign smaller?" you'll get specific answers

[15:50:37]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: Then I'm almost certain at this point I'll have to write a script myself to automatically crop and encode what MythTV outputs into something nicer

[15:50:38]

Ruleke:

I never transcode anything

[15:50:58]

Sembiance:

I've never heard anyone ever speak about cropping as something that MythTV can do :)

[15:51:00]

stuarta:

Sembiance: the point is Myth only outputs what the broadcaster sends

[15:51:17]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: I'd say you're right on that one. Part of the problem is that the transcoding tools are in serious flux still becuse the two most popular tools for it (ffmpeg and mencoder) keep changing their APIs

[15:51:33]

daum:

Anyone able to help me out here...my tvguide is all off by two channels(as in it what in reality is channel 39 is channel 41 on it)...i'm looking at the Zap2it and it has the correct stations

[15:51:42]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: You can ask xris how many times he's had to change nuvexport in the last year if you want to see him freak out and start twitching

[15:52:00]

jams:

if needed, sometimes I will change the aspect/zoom mode for hd broadcasts

[15:52:05]

Milosch:

daum: probably have multiple entries for each channel

[15:52:13]

Sembiance:

jams: Where is that set at?

[15:52:17]

daum:

Milosch, let me see i don't think so

[15:52:24]

jams:

Sembiance- it's in the osd menu

[15:52:36]

Milosch:

daum: not sure how that would happen, either

[15:52:46]

Sembiance:

jams: is that a 'front end' setting or a 'recording' setting?

[15:52:54]

Sembiance:

sounds like a display thing ;)

[15:52:59]

daum:

Milosch, what is weird is all the channels are named "Adding Channel"

[15:53:06]

Sembiance:

Dagmar, stuarta, jams: thanks for your help :)

[15:53:07]

daum:

is that normal?

[15:53:08]

jams:

frontend

[15:53:21]

Milosch:

daum: that's from a scan instead of from zap2it

[15:53:37]

daum:

hrm how should i work on fixing that

[15:53:52]

daum:

since this is killing my recording of walker

[15:53:59]

Milosch:

daum: delete the channels and run mythfilldatabase again might work

[15:54:04]

Dagmar:

Sembiance: I recommend finding some canned tool for using mencoder/ffmpeg, trying it, and if it doesn't work, coax it into telling you what options it *tried* to use, and then go look all those up and see what you can get away with tossing out and which things you have to specify differently now. It will at least get you halfway home in one round.

[15:54:13]

Milosch:

assuming you have zap2it setup in there as well

[15:54:14]

daum:

Milosch, how do i delete the channels please?

[15:54:19]

daum:

Milosch, i do

[15:54:30]

Milosch:

daum: mythtv-setup?

[15:54:31]

Sembiance:

Dagmar: cool. thanks

[15:54:45]

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[15:55:02]

Milosch:

daum: final menu item i think

[15:55:21]

Dagmar:

Milosch is right IIRC

[15:55:44]

Dagmar:

...although I usually just tell people to delete channels in zap2it's site, this is a different problem

[15:55:49]

Milosch:

right but not right-wing ;)

[15:55:51]

plb:

hm this mepo theme is pretty interesting...too bad it doesn't have a matching osd

[15:56:29]

Dagmar:

plb: URL

[15:56:30]

Dagmar:

?

[15:56:50]

plb:

http://home.comcast.net/~zdzisekg/

[15:56:55]

Dagmar:

Danke

[15:56:57]

plb:

it's also on the mythtv wiki

[15:57:25]

Dagmar:

Wow that's almost painfully cute

[15:57:31]

Sembiance:

oh, and I'll be writing my own Myth front end because I think the current one sucks :)

[15:57:31]

plb:

lol

[15:57:47]

** Dagmar bumps up the priority on a CuteOverload theme **

[15:58:00]

jams:

used it for about 10 minutes, then got bored with it

[15:58:24]

plb:

I like blootube the best so far

[15:58:29]

plb:

of all the ones I used

[15:58:45]

** Sembiance see's these themes and realizes maybe MythFrontEnd doesn't suck so bad afterall ;) **

[15:58:46]

daum:

Milosch, you rock its all fixed

[15:58:53]

Milosch:

cool

[15:59:58]

daum:

Now one more question there anyway to like somehow have mythtv write to multiple HDs? Since my hard drives each only have around 80 gigs

[16:00:13]

stuarta:

daum: Storage Groups. in current svn

[16:00:16]

GreyFoxx:

daum: In SVN you can have storage groups

[16:00:24]

** stuarta SNAP! **

[16:00:27]

GreyFoxx:

;P

[16:01:20]

daum:

hrm i'll have to learn to set that up

[16:01:24]

Dagmar:

daum: Thta depends. Do you just want to be able to manually file recording in two volumes, or do you just want to "write it and not worry about where"?

[16:01:39]

daum:

Dagmar, the latter

[16:01:50]

Dagmar:

daum: That would be volume-spanning courtesy of LVM you'd want for that then

[16:02:01]

Dagmar:

Disadvantage: You have to wipe the drives to set it up

[16:02:10]

Dagmar:

...or at least wipe the space you're going to be using

[16:02:12]

daum:

Dagmar, ah not gonna happen

[16:02:13]

daum:

hrm

[16:02:18]

GreyFoxx:

Well, with storage groups he wouldn't hav e to worry either if he's running svn

[16:02:34]

Dagmar:

GreyFoxx: He'll still have a hard partition in the middle to deal with

[16:02:35]

GreyFoxx:

it will keep track of what space is left on each part of the group, and where the files is placed

[16:03:10]

Dagmar:

Storage volumes is going to be good stuff for people who have various fileservers scattered around the house tho

[16:03:15]

Dagmar:

iSCSI is not fun

[16:03:27]

stuarta:

iSCSI is fun

[16:03:35]

GreyFoxx:

plus those who don't wanna wipe their current ones, just pop in a new drive, add it to the group and go

[16:04:27]

Dagmar:

Yeah but once you're over that initial "preparing the volume" stage, adding drives is just as easy with one as it is the other

[16:04:32]

GreyFoxx:

A coworker here is always talking about wanted to use AoE, at least for playing with

[16:04:44]

Dagmar:

AoE? Like what you kill frogloks with?

[16:04:51]

daum:

Dagmar, EQ

[16:04:54]

Dagmar:

heheh

[16:04:58]

daum:

Dagmar, what server

[16:05:06]

Dagmar:

daum: Used to be Quellious, long time ago

[16:05:12]

daum:

ah

[16:05:18]

daum:

bluebies=)

[16:05:25]

Dagmar:

I think I may have been one of the first people to ever use genocidal tactics against the mobs in EQ

[16:05:29]

daum:

Aye anyone with a brain got out of EQ

[16:05:35]

daum:

hahaha

[16:05:59]

Dagmar:

Seriously. I got some level 16's together and went down to the swamp caves during the first month of release

[16:06:21]

Dagmar:

Some troll came in during the middle of it, declared us all crazy and fled

[16:07:34]

adante:

any 24 watchers – what is the best season?

[16:07:42]

adante:

ie if i were to watch only 1 season which one should i watch

[16:07:48]

Dagmar:

daum: I'd really like to check out Vanguard, but I've dour enough opinions about what Sony will eventually do to it that it's not going to happen unless that exploration somehow becomes free

[16:08:01]

daum:

haha

[16:08:05]

adante:

and to think i was afraid of going OT in this channel – here you guys are talking everquest

[16:08:26]

daum:

Dagmar, Vanguard was eh..too much like WoW for me...was somewhat interesting

[16:08:36]

daum:

adante, haha

[16:08:39]

Dagmar:

daum: You say thta like it's a bad thing

[16:08:52]

daum:

Dagmar, i hate wow..never got into it don't like the style

[16:08:56]

Dagmar:

No one should ever be asked to "play" a game by sitting and doing nothing for 36 hours.

[16:09:09]

daum:

but vanguard is a lot closer to the up to velious ages of eq

[16:09:30]

daum:

Dagmar, but that buitl the community the long ass shitty hours where all you did was autoattack then just talk and laugh with your group

[16:09:32]

Dagmar:

daum: Oh you mean the time when all the wizards quit playing because they had been nerfed to the usefulness in battle of a q-tip?

[16:10:08]

Dagmar:

I was stubborn and stuck it out until they added the moon.

[16:10:28]

Dagmar:

...and then I just spent a month trying to get banned. :)

[16:10:55]

daum:

well nah i mean just general leveling up was that

[16:11:09]

daum:

it sucked but you just did stupid stuff with your group to make up for the lame time

[16:11:16]

daum:

nah Pvp was where the game was at

[16:11:20]

Dagmar:

Pfft.

[16:11:31]

Dagmar:

"PVP: Because fair fights only happen to other people."

[16:11:38]

daum:

Dagmar, the fact that people would like cry during taunting and what not was amazing

[16:12:10]

Dagmar:

Not once did I ever see PvPers in that game with any sort of honor

[16:12:12]

daum:

Dagmar, haha...I was never near the best in my level rank but still loved it

[16:13:28]

jduggan:

anyone ever done software raid 1 in debian installer?

[16:13:36]

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[16:13:41]

jduggan:

i create a partition on both disks as raid

[16:13:58]

jduggan:

hmm wait

[16:14:42]

Dagmar:

You don't really create partitions

[16:15:01]

Dagmar:

You just use lvmtools to flag the drives as raided

[16:15:17]

jduggan:

okay

[16:15:27]

jduggan:

well in debian i dont get a configure raid option

[16:15:32]

jduggan:

when both disks have empty partitions

[16:15:39]

jduggan:

i have to set create physical volume for raid

[16:15:41]

Dagmar:

You *can* put the volumes in partitions, but that's about as useful as partitioning a floppy disk

[16:16:13]

jduggan:

on the empty space

[16:16:15]

jduggan:

of both

[16:16:34]

Dagmar:

Yes, and then you light that up and put your partitions in the virtual disk that's created

[16:16:41]

qu0zl:

i have jduggan

[16:17:07]

qu0zl:

you can raid 2 matching partitions on the disks or raid the whole disks

[16:20:49]

qu0zl:

jduggan, i think there was a problem with grub1 not being able to read raid partitions so the debian installer didn't let you just raid the whole disks now that i think about it

[16:21:56]

jduggan:

Dagmar: ive tried creating a partition on each disk which is full size and using 'create physical volume for raid'

[16:22:10]

jduggan:

when i create md devices it says no devices or space

[16:22:58]

Dagmar:

juduggan: You might want ot just go through the LVM HOWTO section by section then

[16:23:09]

jduggan:

i dont want lvm

[16:23:15]

jduggan:

i want raid 1 between two disks

[16:23:19]

jduggan:

in software heh

[16:23:37]

jduggan:

prolly easier if i do it post install

[16:24:21]

qu0zl:

jduggan, i setup a debian with 2 disks raided, but not full disks. two same sized partitions on each disk raided together, and the swap partitions seperate on each

[16:24:36]

qu0zl:

the debian installer should let you do that, that good enough?

[16:24:56]

Dagmar:

jduggan: Google is your friend. http://ianfirla.com/index2.php?option=com_con . . . =1&id=12

[16:25:28]

stuarta:

i did the same thing. works a treat

[16:25:29]

Dagmar:

"This HOWTO is written for the purpose of creating a software RAID 1 (mirroring) array on a Debian GNU/Linux computer with two identical hard drives."

[16:26:03]

Ruleke:

qu0zl: seperate partitions ? lose the swap in case of drive failure ?

[16:26:06]

Dagmar:

The last update to it was in Feb 2005, but it should still be current enough

[16:26:17]

qu0zl:

there's swap on both drives Ruleke

[16:26:26]

Ruleke:

I mean the contents of it

[16:26:44]

qu0zl:

yep, that's the danger alright, tehre won't be anything of value in it though

[16:26:59]

Dagmar:

Just um, what the kernel expects to be using as slow-access memory

[16:27:00]

Ruleke:

except if you want to stay up

[16:27:05]

Ruleke:

:P

[16:27:14]

Dagmar:

Me, I just buy more RAM

[16:27:16]

qu0zl:

true :)

[16:27:38]

Ruleke:

well if you prefer downtime, that's fine

[16:27:48]

Ruleke:

I didn't get an hotplug cabinet to go down though

[16:28:01]

qu0zl:

heh, i don't have a hotplug cabinet sadly

[16:28:02]

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[16:28:02]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v juski

[16:28:14]

juski:

has the subject changed yet?

[16:28:21]

qu0zl:

yep juski

[16:28:27]

stuarta:

somewhat

[16:28:27]

Ruleke:

yeah we released 0.21 :P

[16:28:27]

juski:

thank gawd for that

[16:28:36]

qu0zl:

we're back to talking about MythTWii

[16:28:38]

Dagmar:

Ruleke: What?

[16:28:38]

stuarta:

!trout Ruleke bullshit

[16:28:39]

** MythLogBot slaps Ruleke with a bullshit trout on behalf of stuarta... **

[16:28:40]

Dagmar:

Damnit

[16:28:41]

Ruleke:

hehe

[16:28:42]

qu0zl:

the port of mythfrontend to the Wii

[16:28:45]

Dagmar:

Whew

[16:28:56]

Dagmar:

I was just like, damnit I just built a new set of packages yesterday

[16:29:00]

Ruleke:

hehe

[16:29:30]

juski:

I ported mythfrontend to the wii this morning. I'm not releasing it though

[16:29:35]

qu0zl:

heh

[16:29:38]

Ruleke:

hold your wii

[16:29:49]

juski:

hold your wii for a wii

[16:29:56]

Dagmar:

I've got the whole thing scripted now but it's still annoying to hvae to check the recording schedule to make sure I'm not going to be shutting down the backend for an hour or two that's needed

[16:30:01]

Ruleke:

then die

[16:30:24]

Ruleke:

silly contest that

[16:30:26]

Dagmar:

Yep

[16:30:31]

Dagmar:

Any good hacker would have pwned them

[16:30:38]

juski:

yeah that contest took the pii ;)

[16:30:47]

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[16:30:53]

Ruleke:

hehe

[16:32:03]

juski:

hell I've really hit a brick wall with this .org redesign. wish I'd never lost my original works :(

[16:32:06]

Dagmar:

If you can't hold at least a liter in your bladder yet, you're not spending enough time doing code-a-thons

[16:32:17]

jduggan:

No Unused Partitions of the Type 'Linux Raid Autodetect' is the error i get when i try to create the md device (during debian install).. i dont even get an option to create a partition by that name, i have two identical partitions of the same size on both disks as 'physical volume for raid'

[16:32:41]

juski:

/filter raid

[16:33:36]

Ruleke:

debian installer ?

[16:33:40]

jduggan:

yea

[16:33:56]

Ruleke:

strange it worked before

[16:34:04]

jduggan:

eff it, i'll do it post install

[16:34:13]

Ruleke:

you can try applying the changes after you created those partitions, then returnign to the raid setup

[16:35:34]

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[16:50:19]

Dagmar:

I wonder how long it will be ebfore someone makes a Wii driver for Linux that acts as an xorg mouse pointer

[16:50:53]

Dagmar:

Cuz like, I can see some ways a wiimote would be handy for Myth

[16:50:54]

Dagmar:

:)

[16:51:13]

Dr_willis:

heh

[16:51:19]

Dagmar:

Push the mouse pointer against the right hand side of the screen to scroll forward in the program guide and so forth

[16:51:21]

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[16:51:28]

Dr_willis:

im waiting for all the lawsuits to get settled..

[16:51:43]

Dr_willis:

gotta love when a iovation gets sued..

[16:51:46]

Dr_willis:

innovation

[16:52:04]

Dagmar:

I'm expecting Nintendo to make some public commentary to the effect of Americans are too clumsy to be allowed to play with a Wiimote, personally

[16:53:15]

Dagmar:

I hear that in Japan, if someone sells you something, and you use it improperly and break your own stuff, you're just SOL.

[16:53:22]

Dagmar:

I like that.

[16:53:32]

GreyFoxx:

Hell yeah

[16:53:40]

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[16:54:27]

Dagmar:

People have no, and I mean absolutely NO call for screwing up with the Wiimote, particularly with Wii Sports.

[16:54:50]

Dagmar:

Most nagware for Windows doesn't pester you with little messages as much as Wii Sports does

[16:55:48]

mothas:

Just a quick question – do any of the current US sat TV providers have a receiver you can control more reliably than with an IR blaster ?

[16:56:29]

Dagmar:

Even Zelda treats you to a screen reminding you to put the strap on your wrist, stay out of arm's reach of other people, and to not let go of the remote before you start it

[16:57:07]

Dagmar:

mothas: Some have an actual hardline cable that goes into a 1/8" jack

[16:57:42]

Dr_willis:

i was refering to the lawsuit against Nintindo on the forcefeedback/remote patents by that other company.. i forget the name.. that has a mouse similer to it.

[16:57:42]

Dagmar:

I don't know that anyone's done any work on that serial protocol for Linux tho

[16:57:59]

Dagmar:

Dr_willis: Oh they're bound to lose that one

[16:58:07]

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[16:58:17]

Dr_willis:

Dagmar, or they will get paid to shut up...

[16:58:29]

Dr_willis:

which is sort of the point these days with lawsuits.

[16:58:50]

mothas:

Dagmar: thanks – guess I'll have to look into it further then.

[16:59:25]

Dagmar:

mothas: If you're having blaster problems, just tape the thing to the sensor with black electrical tape

[16:59:30]

Dr_willis:

:)

[16:59:44]

Dr_willis:

put both ends in a little black box.

[17:00:04]

Dagmar:

Then you're basically making a very crude optocoupler, but with no other IR in it's line of sight, it should eliminate issues

[17:00:31]

Dr_willis:

wife was using her remote the other day – to change the Neighbors tv... :)

[17:01:08]

mothas:

Dagmar: OK. I haven't tried it yet, but remember some pain with my TiVo IR blaster. Just wondered.

[17:02:24]

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[17:02:25]

Dagmar:

i.e., too much noise

[17:03:21]

mothas:

In my case it was that the sat box didn't change channels reliably – sometimes it would balk, so you either got a message screen saying there was an error (which blocked any further channel changes until it was cleared) or just got the wrong channel.

[17:03:34]

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[17:03:58]

Dagmar:

Well, you've got a lot of leeway with what you can tell lirc to do, so any problems you encounter should be fixable with some tweaks or electrical tape

[17:04:21]

plb:

does the guy who created mepo ever come in here?

[17:04:36]

Dagmar:

...and it's doubtful that your Myth box is likely to be as low on CPU power as the TiVo was

[17:05:00]

mothas:

True.

[17:05:27]

mothas:

I guess what would have fixed matters is if the box could have detected the error and re-tried the channel change.

[17:05:56]

Dagmar:

one way protocol. No joy there.

[17:06:16]

mothas:

I suppose something could be done in the case of HD channels.

[17:06:50]

Dagmar:

You could just aim for a box that uses firewire

[17:07:31]

mothas:

How is firewire better than IR ?

[17:07:31]

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[17:07:41]

Dagmar:

mothas: It's a decent protocol, for one thing

[17:08:39]

Dagmar:

Firewire can't mysteriously miss commands, like IR

[17:08:44]

Dagmar:

er like IR is prone to

[17:09:04]

Dagmar:

Otherwise there'd be a lot of really furious digital video camera owners out there

[17:09:42]

mothas:

Hmmm sounds like that's an improvement anyway – I guess I'll ask about it when the telemarketers call again later today.

[17:10:29]

Dagmar:

You ask telemarketers questions?

[17:10:52]

mothas:

Normally not – just hang up on them, but if I do talk, I never let them do their script.

[17:10:55]

Dagmar:

I generally just limit myself to telling them things that will make them wake up in the middle of the night screaming.

[17:10:58]

Aurelius:

i ask them questions sometimes

[17:11:08]

Aurelius:

I ask them about their sex life

[17:11:10]

Freman:

you talk to telemarketers?

[17:11:13]

Aurelius:

if they are gay

[17:11:13]

** Freman hugs perl and asterisk **

[17:11:14]

Dagmar:

BellSouth had people going door-to-door here a few months back

[17:11:17]

mothas:

I used to have a little script taped to the wall, all the questions they're legally required to answer.

[17:11:31]

Aurelius:

i just annoy them

[17:11:37]

Aurelius:

i don't care if they are required to answer

[17:11:42]

Dagmar:

I enjoyed the hell out of asking the guy a few questions and then walking back inside saying "Your technology still uses copper wires?!?! HAHAHAHA!"

[17:11:44]

Aurelius:

i don't get many if any callsa nymore

[17:12:14]

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[17:12:17]

mothas:

I'm looking at doing asterisk later, just to get rid of these guys. The 'do-not-call' list is useless.

[17:12:26]

Aurelius:

i'm serious

[17:12:32]

Dagmar:

mothas: You have a land-line phone, man

[17:12:32]

Aurelius:

ask them invasive questions

[17:12:41]

Aurelius:

they put you on their own dnc list

[17:12:42]

Aurelius:

heh

[17:12:48]

Dagmar:

I've been using a cell phone only now for about a decade

[17:13:15]

Dagmar:

Well, cell-phone ONLY has been since about 2000, but only *once* has a telemarketer screwed up and called my cell phone

[17:13:17]

mothas:

Dagmar: yes – kind of have to at the moment – 911, etc.

[17:13:33]

Aurelius:

you have to have a home phone for 911?

[17:13:36]

Dagmar:

mothas: E911 means when you dial 911, your phone gives them GPS coordinates

[17:13:57]

mothas:

True.

[17:13:58]

Dr_willis:

I dont have a home phone any more.

[17:14:01]

Dagmar:

Who would have thought that the way to get everyone to carry a personal GPS tracking device was to make it a value-add proposition.

[17:14:19]

** Aurelius has already disabled such features. **

[17:14:35]

Dagmar:

I don't trust that the thing isnt' able to be polled at any time... no matter what they're saying about it.

[17:14:46]

** Aurelius ponders building a gps jammer **

[17:14:55]

Dagmar:

In part because I could never get Motorola to fess up as to why when you sim-locked a phone and then dialed it, it would act as a bug.

[17:15:05]

Dagmar:

It wouldn't ring, it would just pick up and make the microphone live

[17:15:13]

mothas:

There was a recent case – on groklaw, maybe, but anyway yes – the feds can do that.

[17:15:46]

Dagmar:

...although it is a little handy to be able to turn your cell phone into a bug.

[17:15:47]

Dagmar:

Erm.

[17:15:50]

Dagmar:

Although not legal.

[17:16:02]

mothas:

That was why it made the news.

[17:16:12]

Aurelius:

depends on who does it.. and who's there

[17:16:24]

Dagmar:

I dont' know of any states that have a no-party consent rule

[17:16:35]

Dagmar:

Maybe in Antiqua or something they allow that but not in the US

[17:16:41]

quicksilver:

it would also drain the batteries of most phones like nothing else

[17:16:47]

quicksilver:

so it wouldn't be that effective as a bug

[17:16:53]

Dagmar:

quicksilver: Actually no more than regular use

[17:16:56]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: right

[17:17:03]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: but most phones don't have that much talk time

[17:17:03]

Dagmar:

It's only in bug mode when you've dialed it up and connected to it

[17:17:10]

** quicksilver nods **

[17:17:19]

quicksilver:

but a normal 'bug' is listening 24/7

[17:17:35]

quicksilver:

whereas my personal phone would die after 1h, and even the good ones would die after 4–5h

[17:17:42]

Dagmar:

let's say you know your unlock code and you have access to a conference room before a meeting is held...

[17:17:46]

** quicksilver nods **

[17:17:50]

quicksilver:

oh yes, I'm not saying it's useless

[17:17:54]

Dagmar:

You can go in there, sim-lock your phone, and leave

[17:18:00]

quicksilver:

just that it wouldn't be a great surveillance device in general

[17:18:15]

Dagmar:

..and then later <text removed because it blatantly explains illegal acts>

[17:19:00]

Dagmar:

I kinda would have thought such a "feature" would have been better hidden personally.

[17:19:08]

Dagmar:

We found out about it completely by accident

[17:19:27]

Dagmar:

I screwed up and simlocked my phone while a housemate was trying to dial me

[17:20:55]

Dagmar:

That's just _too_ industrial-espionage friendly for comfort.

[17:21:15]

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[17:21:16]

Dagmar:

Especially considering it worked on every tri-mode phone we tested it on

[17:21:17]

Fooker:

sim lock?

[17:21:43]

Dagmar:

Fooker: Yes. You know the SIM cards in a lot of cell phones? You can put a passcode on them that's required to use the phone.

[17:22:03]

Dagmar:

If you enter the code wrong x number of times, as an anti-theft deterrent it becomes "sim-locked" and then will refuse to work anymore

[17:22:34]

Dagmar:

Excecpt these Motorolas would still answer incoming calls without ringing, silence the earpiece, display nothing, and put the microphone into speakerphone mode.

[17:22:48]

** quicksilver wonders vaguely if some bright spark devised this feature as a way to collect information about phone thieves **

[17:23:08]

Dagmar:

You call up your cell provider and they will generally tell you the sim unlock code for your phone so they dont have to have you come in to see a service rep

[17:23:25]

Dagmar:

quickxilver: If they did I've never heard of it being used for that

[17:23:34]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: UK phones have something called a 'PUK' code

[17:23:38]

Dagmar:

Motorola acted like I was asking about the man behind the curtain when I started calling them.

[17:23:39]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: which is printed on the box

[17:23:51]

quicksilver:

Dagmar: and you can use than when it's locked to unlock it

[17:24:14]

quicksilver:

at least I think it's called PUK. Certainly it's one of the numbers on the box

[17:25:53]

Dagmar:

http://www.phonescoop.com/glossary/term.php?gid=285says it's called that

[17:26:08]

Dagmar:

Nice that they just give it to you

[17:26:31]

Dagmar:

...since most people aren't likely to carry that box around for cell phone theives to take

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[17:42:50]

Beirdo:

the best way to block GPS tracking of your phone (should you have a phone)... go somewhere where GPS is fubar

[17:42:57]

Beirdo:

like in mountains, or underground :)

[17:43:25]

xris:

Beirdo: or just turn it off.

[17:43:29]

Beirdo:

if yer phone can't see the satellites, it can't be tracked, basically

[17:43:32]

CanadianMan_:

it's the reason i built my bomb shelter

[17:43:44]

Beirdo:

yeah, or put it under the tire of your car and drive over it a few times

[17:43:46]

slowone:

beirdo how does that stop someone from useing cell towers to triangulate your position?

[17:43:54]

Aurelius:

it doesn't

[17:44:05]

slowone:

Beirdo: if you want to be that parranoid why carry a phone?

[17:44:09]

Beirdo:

heh

[17:44:24]

Beirdo:

triangulation off cell towers doesn't work terribly well

[17:44:34]

Beirdo:

in spite of what TV says

[17:44:50]

slowone:

it works well enough to know where you are +/- a few hundred feet, more then enough to make you go boom

[17:44:51]

Aurelius:

but it gets you ni a very small area compared with "somewhere in california"

[17:44:57]

Beirdo:

especially in areas that are covered by two towers if you are lucky

[17:45:07]

Aurelius:

where the hell do you live? :)

[17:45:19]

xris:

Beirdo: TRIangulation generally requires three.....

[17:45:30]

slowone:

xris you can do it with too

[17:45:32]

slowone:

two

[17:45:39]

Aurelius:

actually, 2 will get you enough to narrow it decently

[17:45:43]

Beirdo:

anywhere that's NOT suburbia or urban will have massive troubles with triangulation, and that's the majority of North America

[17:45:50]

xris:

slowone: actually, but definition, that wouldn't be triangulation.

[17:46:06]

slowone:

definition != actualality

[17:46:06]

Beirdo:

you can't triangulate with 2, just get an area of possibility which can be quite large

[17:46:18]

qu0zl:

you get 2 areas of possibility with 2 sources

[17:46:32]

Beirdo:

go talk to some ham operators that do fox hunts

[17:46:42]

slowone:

most cell towers have 3 anttena.... 2 towers + doplor affect is enough to get an aprox location.

[17:46:50]

qu0zl:

ahh, interesting

[17:46:53]

Aurelius:

Beirdo: me are ham operator who does fox hunts :P

[17:46:56]

xris:

slowone: you can do SOMETHING with two towers.. it's just not triangulation...

[17:47:22]

Beirdo:

ummm, 3 antennas in one place won't give enough dispersion of angle to tell you where signal's coming from

[17:47:36]

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[17:47:54]

Beirdo:

you can narrow it down to an area, but who cares if someone can find that you are in a half-mile area?

[17:47:58]

Aurelius:

hehe

[17:48:02]

Aurelius:

some aren't going to like this:

[17:48:04]

Aurelius:

n 1: a trigonometric method of determining the position of a

[17:48:05]

Aurelius:

fixed point from the angles to it from two fixed points

[17:48:05]

Aurelius:

a known distance apart; useful in navigation

[17:48:05]

Beirdo:

unless that area's in the middle of Area 51 or some shit

[17:48:06]

slowone:

and sufficently large bomb ;p

[17:48:09]

slowone:

any

[17:48:11]

Aurelius:

BOOM

[17:48:15]

quicksilver:

it's also not 'just' triangulation

[17:48:22]

quicksilver:

since they can factor in the signal strength

[17:48:26]

Aurelius:

the TRI in triangulation includes the destination

[17:48:32]

Aurelius:

signal strength is not reliable

[17:48:45]

Beirdo:

true that

[17:48:55]

quicksilver:

surely phones are quite consistent in the power output of their little transmitter?

[17:48:59]

Beirdo:

yeano

[17:49:00]

Aurelius:

too many factors

[17:49:04]

Aurelius:

body fade

[17:49:05]

Aurelius:

ground loss

[17:49:12]

xris:

Aurelius: you win. :)

[17:49:18]

Beirdo:

no, not at all, they change power due to what the system says too, depending on technology

[17:49:22]

Aurelius:

xris: i do? :)

[17:49:23]

Aurelius:

what do i get?

[17:49:24]

Aurelius:

hehehe

[17:49:24]

quicksilver:

ah

[17:49:27]

quicksilver:

interesting

[17:49:32]

xris:

Aurelius: kudos.. but not the candy-bar kind.

[17:49:35]

Beirdo:

CDMA is horrible for that

[17:49:37]

slowone:

can also change broadcast power of certian phones....

[17:49:38]

** Aurelius is a ham who does fox hunts sometmies **

[17:49:48]

Aurelius:

so i'm well aware of how rf behaves

[17:49:52]

Beirdo:

Aurelius, fun ain't it?

[17:49:55]

Aurelius:

especially at low powers

[17:50:08]

Aurelius:

i'm also an engineer with a tv station, so i know how rf behaves at much higher power ;)

[17:50:12]

Beirdo:

but still, there are many places that are barely covered by two towers which are far apart

[17:50:22]

Beirdo:

like anywhere rural

[17:50:23]

Beirdo:

:)

[17:50:27]

slowone:

turn your phone off beirdo!

[17:50:28]

Aurelius:

Beirdo: which atcually gives you quite a bit of information

[17:50:35]

Aurelius:

if tower a and b can see your phone

[17:50:37]

Aurelius:

but tower c can't

[17:50:42]

Aurelius:

and they are in a triangular shape

[17:50:49]

Aurelius:

it's HIGHLY likely you are between a and b

[17:50:55]

Aurelius:

AWAY from c

[17:50:56]

Beirdo:

somewhere, yes :)

[17:50:56]

Aurelius:

:)

[17:51:06]

Aurelius:

but see, if you are in a rural area

[17:51:09]

Aurelius:

that really narrows it down

[17:51:32]

Aurelius:

it's actually when you get into the more urban areas

[17:51:33]

Beirdo:

but if the angle from A points at B, and the angle of B points at A (along a line between the towers), you only know it's directly between the towers.

[17:51:42]

Beirdo:

other than the signal strength

[17:51:48]

Aurelius:

it gets more difficult to DF

[17:51:50]

Beirdo:

hence the desire for 3 sources

[17:52:01]

Beirdo:

yeah, the multi-fade and reflections can kill ya

[17:52:07]

Beirdo:

same for mountains ;)

[17:52:09]

Aurelius:

we had a signal we were tracking here

[17:52:14]

Aurelius:

we have a mix of urban and mountains

[17:52:14]

** Beirdo looks out the window at a mountain **

[17:52:17]

Aurelius:

(sf bay area)

[17:52:21]

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[17:52:23]

Beirdo:

ah, fun

[17:52:31]

Aurelius:

we were hearing the signal from the NE of our starting location

[17:52:40]

Aurelius:

it turned out to be coming from the SE

[17:52:50]

Aurelius:

it was going up the canyon behind mt diablo

[17:52:57]

Beirdo:

ain't big buildings and canyons fun?

[17:52:58]

Aurelius:

and reflcting out over willow pass

[17:54:26]

Beirdo:

anyways, why would I care if someone wants to track my phone? I'm pretty much always at home or at Sam's Club or something

[17:54:56]

Beirdo:

it's not like I go to the seedy underbelly of town and don't want to get caught :)

[17:55:40]

Beirdo:

and to effectively track a cell phone it has to be transmitting, which they don't do often in "normal" use when you're not talking

[17:55:57]

Beirdo:

unless the FBI or someone gets the provider to tell it to

[17:55:58]

Beirdo:

:)

[17:56:08]

slowone:

i dunno about you phone mine regurlary talks to the towers once a minute

[17:56:12]

slowone:

your*

[17:56:26]

daviey:

;)

[17:56:31]

Beirdo:

a little burst once a minute isn't very useful to triangulate something quickly

[17:56:36]

slowone:

place it next to my shitty computer speakers and i can hear it when it opens a communication line

[17:56:38]

Beirdo:

you can do it, but if it's moving....

[17:57:12]

Beirdo:

if it's stationary, sure, but if it's moving, a lot tougher

[17:57:13]

slowone:

they dont need to triangulate quickly ;) when my phone doesnt move through out the cource of a work day

[17:57:31]

Beirdo:

heh

[17:57:47]

Beirdo:

then all they need to do is ask Social Security where ya work and go get ya

[17:58:00]

SeaWeed:

hello All

[17:58:13]

slowone:

well ya but that might require them to get a court order or something more official

[17:58:30]

Beirdo:

heh, perhaps :)

[17:58:35]

slowone:

wire tapping (and hence triangulation) is um according to mr bush free for him to do when ever

[17:58:35]

psm321:

stupid lirc

[17:58:36]

slowone:

;p

[17:58:42]

slowone:

if were to be paranoid

[17:59:07]

Beirdo:

yeah well. Gotta propogate the myth somehow

[17:59:18]

Aurelius:

Beirdo: actually, short bursts are useful

[17:59:23]

Aurelius:

as long as you are prepared

[17:59:48]

Beirdo:

I guess like a radar sweep?

[18:00:34]

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[18:00:44]

SeaWeed:

got a Quick Question Some 1 May can answer

[18:00:46]

SeaWeed:

Im useing this command to backup my database ( mysqldump -u mythtv -pmythtv mythconverg -c > mythtv_backup.sql ) and useing this command to restore ( mysql -u mythtv -pmythtv mythconverg < mythtv_backup.sql )

[18:00:57]

SeaWeed:

my problem seem to be The database restore only seems to work 1 out of 10 try's am i missing some thing ??

[18:00:57]

Beirdo:

OMG, someone's trying to be on topic?

[18:02:02]

psm321:

what happens when it doesnt work?

[18:02:23]

SeaWeed:

it want me To Go through a Toltal Setup all over

[18:02:34]

SeaWeed:

i loose all setting

[18:02:51]

SeaWeed:

channel / cards / every thing

[18:03:06]

SeaWeed:

if i keep trying it may work 1 out of every 10 trys

[18:03:17]

Eradan:

Anyone here have duel HD tuners ?...

[18:03:30]

SeaWeed:

but realy pain to try restore every thing

[18:03:42]

psm321:

are you restoring on a different system?

[18:03:46]

SeaWeed:

yes

[18:04:06]

psm321:

did you create the db first?

[18:04:06]

SeaWeed:

Diff system / same hardware

[18:04:15]

SeaWeed:

yes i shure did

[18:04:16]

psm321:

does mysql complain about anything?

[18:04:21]

SeaWeed:

nope

[18:04:24]

SeaWeed:

no error's

[18:04:30]

xris:

Eradan: sort of. firewire cable boxes.

[18:04:33]

psm321:

ok then i have no idea, maybe someone else can help

[18:04:47]

SeaWeed:

lol well thanks for the Try

[18:04:52]

psm321:

maybe it has something to do with hostname?

[18:04:59]

psm321:

but that wouldnt explain why it works 1/10

[18:05:05]

SeaWeed:

i kinda Thought that my self

[18:05:22]

SeaWeed:

but i try to edit hostname

[18:05:37]

SeaWeed:

would different ip cause a Corrupt issue

[18:05:38]

SeaWeed:

?

[18:06:00]

psm321:

no idea

[18:06:03]

SeaWeed:

ok

[18:06:04]

RacerX2oo3:

Does MythTV store the CC information in the recorded video?

[18:07:00]

SeaWeed:

i thought maybe it was getting corrupted in transfer between the 2 pc's i try ( tar ) file up that was no help

[18:07:57]

SeaWeed:

also seen database get corrupted on a ( hard drive ) back up useing ( acronis ) but that seem to be very rare

[18:08:21]

psm321:

RacerX2oo3: yes (although it may be an option somewhere, i dont remember)

[18:09:00]

psm321:

SeaWeed: wait, does it work 1/10 on the same dump file, or you redump each try?

[18:09:15]

SeaWeed:

redump each time

[18:09:40]

psm321:

did you try diff'ing the dump files?

[18:09:43]

Eradan:

xris: I"m trying to get a guage on my IO load .. comparing it to someone that has a similar setup

[18:09:51]

psm321:

between one that works and one that doesnt

[18:09:59]

SeaWeed:

(psm321) no i have not

[18:10:16]

psm321:

i would try that, unless someone else has a different idea

[18:10:23]

SeaWeed:

ok

[18:10:28]

SeaWeed:

thanks for Help

[18:10:34]

xris:

Eradan: I'm probably not much help, then.

[18:10:41]

SeaWeed:

i will look into it and keep trying

[18:11:08]

Eradan:

xris: Probably not ... but kinda IO waits do you have on a vmstat while recording from both boxes ?

[18:11:36]

Eradan:

xris: which i know has allot of variance based on system specs :) ... but i'm just curious ....

[18:11:36]

xris:

no clue. never checked.

[18:11:42]

Eradan:

xris: ah :) ...

[18:17:28]

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[18:18:00]

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[18:21:46]

Fooker:

Does anyone know, is the cutlist stored in the mysql database or somehow in the actual files?

[18:22:31]

Beirdo:

in the database,

[18:22:43]

Aurelius:

LIES

[18:22:49]

Beirdo:

it's in the recordings table last I saw

[18:22:49]

Aurelius:

;)

[18:23:03]

Beirdo:

nah, not lies... statistics... aka DAMN lies :)

[18:23:23]

Aurelius:

nah

[18:23:26]

** Beirdo tries to wrap his little brain around how much more MUD code needs to be redone **

[18:23:31]

Aurelius:

There are lies, damn lies, and then there're statistics.

[18:23:36]

Beirdo:

oops

[18:23:36]

Aurelius:

which mud?

[18:23:49]

Beirdo:

you are so right

[18:23:49]

Beirdo:

HavokMUD

[18:23:55]

Beirdo:

I'm rewriting it completely, and making it to be threaded

[18:24:05]

Beirdo:

with MySQL for data storage, etc

[18:24:10]

xris:

Beirdo: in svn (and maybe .20), it's in the recordedmarkup table

[18:24:18]

Beirdo:

it got moved?

[18:24:20]

Beirdo:

ick

[18:24:28]

Beirdo:

OK, but still in the database :)

[18:24:52]

xris:

Beirdo: got moved so that cutlists could be applied to other types of recordings (mythvideo).

[18:24:56]

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[18:25:05]

Beirdo:

I REALLY need a second cable box or something, it's getting to piss me off that I can't run myth :)

[18:25:24]

xris:

seek tables got moved into recordedseek, and recorded.cutlist became true/false, with the actual data in recordedmarkup.

[18:25:40]

sebrock|a:

hello everybody

[18:25:41]

Beirdo:

another week before they "might" have some, and even then, they want to send a technician to install it

[18:25:42]

xris:

Beirdo: no analog cable?

[18:25:50]

Beirdo:

nope, all digital

[18:26:02]

xris:

wow.. odd that not even the basic analog stuff is there.

[18:26:03]

Beirdo:

oooh, seek tables in a separate table, I like THAT

[18:26:04]

Beirdo:

:)

[18:26:16]

Beirdo:

channel 1 is VOD...

[18:26:19]

Beirdo:

heh

[18:26:29]

Beirdo:

it's all digital, AFAIK

[18:26:39]

xris:

have you tried to tune analog?

[18:26:47]

Beirdo:

I think we may well go with Dish soon

[18:26:48]

xris:

you DO still have your pile of pvr-x50 cards, no>

[18:26:55]

Beirdo:

yeah

[18:26:58]

Aurelius:

what are the seek tables?

[18:27:06]

Beirdo:

I could just put the cable into the TV and try

[18:27:26]

Fooker:

I could never go digital...

[18:27:33]

Beirdo:

I never wanted to

[18:27:41]

Beirdo:

but you gotta go with what you can get

[18:27:53]

Fooker:

It would kill my wallet – I have 8 TVs in my house...

[18:28:03]

Beirdo:

heh

[18:28:32]

Fooker:

Well, OK, truthfully, I have 4 TVs... but my laptop has 2 TV tuners and my myth box has 2...

[18:29:27]

Beirdo:

Hmmmm, what to break next

[18:29:53]

sebrock|a:

fooker :P

[18:30:41]

sebrock|a:

anyone knows if H/W decoding on the Hauppauge 1300 will be supported soon? Last time i checked it was "under development"

[18:31:07]

Beirdo:

I love using find. :)

[18:31:17]

Beirdo:

find . -type f -exec mplayer {} ;

[18:31:28]

Beirdo:

great on my mp3 mount :)

[18:31:29]

Aurelius:

heh.

[18:32:15]

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[18:32:32]

Beirdo:

now if only NFS over wireless would stop glitching

[18:32:41]

gardengnome:

no it won't.

[18:32:51]

Beirdo:

!trout gardengnome

[18:32:52]

** MythLogBot slaps gardengnome with a trout on behalf of Beirdo... **

[18:32:52]

sebrock|a:

which nVidia drivers should one use? got the integrated 6150...

[18:32:56]

Beirdo:

:)

[18:33:06]

gardengnome:

;)

[18:33:40]

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[18:34:19]

Beirdo:

Let's try with wsize/rsize of 8k instead of 32k

[18:34:35]

gardengnome:

heya kayelem

[18:35:06]

hatlevip:

sebrock|a, the normal nvidia drives should work with that

[18:35:56]

sebrock|a:

hatlevip the ones that comes with FC6?

[18:36:49]

hatlevip:

sebrock|a, sorry, no experience with fedora, i just dl from nvidia.com but i assume the packaged drivers that come with your distro should be fine

[18:36:56]

Fooker:

Hmmm... nuvexport is sitting at 0 frams running at 0fps.... been sitting like that for almost a minute. Is that normal?

[18:37:47]

Fooker:

And now the whole system is running slower than a 386 thats not plugged in....

[18:38:20]

sebrock|a:

hatlevip no they suck :| do you know what version you have?

[18:39:19]

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[18:39:39]

Fooker:

Christ, how good of a box does nuvexport expect? If this machine is getting bogged down this much, I can't even imagine what a regular machine would be like at this point

[18:39:52]

Beirdo:

it will use whatever CPU is there

[18:40:07]

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[18:40:16]

Beirdo:

as will anything that's a CPU hog. blame ffmpeg and transcode (depending on which you are using)

[18:40:34]

Beirdo:

video processing is not a low-CPU activity

[18:40:40]

hatlevip:

sebrock|a, i'm using the latest from nvidia.com 9746

[18:40:51]

Fooker:

Is there any way to nice it? Or at least hold it back a bit? I can't even use X

[18:40:57]

Honk:

Fooker: sure.. nice it

[18:41:03]

Honk:

:]

[18:41:05]

hatlevip:

sebrock|a, but if you dl then you gotta compile against your kernel

[18:41:21]

Fooker:

If a parent process is niced, will the child processes be niced as well?

[18:41:26]

Honk:

sure

[18:41:28]

hatlevip:

sebrock|a, what's wrong with the version that comes with fc6?

[18:41:30]

gardengnome:

Fooker: it's probably consuming all your memory. use free -m to find out

[18:41:47]

Honk:

and i dont notice any slowdown at all on my system :P

[18:41:51]

Fooker:

Yeah, its using close to the full 2gig.

[18:42:05]

Honk:

Fooker: check again :P

[18:42:09]

Honk:

second row, not first

[18:42:15]

Beirdo:

then you got other issues :)

[18:42:27]

Honk:

dma disabled *g*

[18:42:28]

Fooker:

2025140k used

[18:42:38]

Honk:

Fooker: -m

[18:42:43]

Beirdo:

yeah, that's for the system

[18:42:47]

sebrock|a:

hatlevip no I'll download them with yum, making life easier :)

[18:42:55]

Fooker:

I'm not using free -m, I'm getting this from top

[18:43:02]

gardengnome:

Fooker: are you looking at the second line, the one starting with -/+ buffers/cache:?

[18:43:03]

Honk:

Fooker: ...

[18:43:06]

Beirdo:

yeah, sort by memory :)

[18:43:06]

Honk:

top is lying

[18:43:11]

Beirdo:

what's using the memory

[18:43:17]

Honk:

Beirdo: i know, i know

[18:43:18]

sebrock|a:

what mobo do you run? I have problems with sound (as usual)... Realtek HD Audio 5.1

[18:43:26]

Honk:

the cache

[18:43:27]

Beirdo:

Honk, no it isn't, it uses the same interface as free :)

[18:43:27]

Fooker:

82.1% is in use by mythtranscode

[18:43:50]

Beirdo:

OK, you have a problem, something's not taking the output of mythtranscode properly

[18:44:02]

Honk:

top is telling me i've got 2.6gb mem in use

[18:44:05]

Honk:

free says 600mb

[18:44:12]

Honk:

who's telling the truth? :P

[18:44:25]

Beirdo:

I think yer on crack :)

[18:44:32]

Honk:

huh?

[18:44:36]

Beirdo:

heh

[18:44:37]

Honk:

top doesnt substract the cache

[18:44:40]

Honk:

free does

[18:44:45]

Honk:

free is right, top is not

[18:44:52]

Honk:

cache doesnt count as used memory

[18:44:53]

sebrock|a:

gah, lame... why must i register to send PMs...

[18:45:03]

Honk:

Fooker: just paste free -m on a pastebin

[18:45:15]

Beirdo:

whatever. system cache is memory that is being used by the system

[18:45:26]

Beirdo:

so top is not incorrect, your interpretation is :)

[18:45:31]

Fooker:

Honk: Already killed it

[18:45:34]

Honk:

Beirdo: you need like 30mb of cache to have a responsive system

[18:45:46]

Honk:

Fooker: what's your memory consumption now? :P

[18:45:53]

Fooker:

315mb in use

[18:45:59]

Honk:

Beirdo: cache will be freed as needed

[18:46:14]

Beirdo:

I know, silly.

[18:46:27]

Honk:

Fooker: cheers, then free would've reported a full ram too :P

[18:46:46]

Honk:

last time i exported something, i exported to nuv and sql files and did the transcoding manually ;)

[18:47:11]

Honk:

nuvexport is a bitch about running on a remote system :P

[18:47:13]

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[18:47:17]

Beirdo:

huh?

[18:47:20]

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[18:47:20]

Beirdo:

works fine here

[18:47:27]

Honk:

not for me :P

[18:47:29]

Honk:

*shrug*

[18:47:40]

Honk:

(obviously a problem with my setup, but i cba to fix it)

[18:47:43]

** Beirdo coughs "pebcak" **

[18:47:50]

Honk:

that's what i just said :P

[18:48:31]

Fooker:

It appears that the problem is with ffmpeg... it sits at frame 0 even after mythtranscode has been running for several minutes.

[18:48:39]

Beirdo:

you know, a puppy chewing a squeak toy ain't so cute when you're on the phone

[18:48:51]

Honk:

You need mythtranscode in order to use nuvexport.

[18:48:52]

Honk:

=)

[18:48:59]

Honk:

really not working well :P

[18:49:07]

Fooker:

If I'm thining correctly, it should start processing video right after mythtranscode starts, no?

[18:49:15]

Beirdo:

it should, yes

[18:49:16]

Honk:

yepp

[18:49:36]

Fooker:

So what would cause ffmpeg to not start right away?

[18:49:51]

Beirdo:

crappy compile of ffmpeg? dunno

[18:50:14]

Beirdo:

ffmpeg is one of those rapidly moving targets that's sometimes hit or miss

[18:50:46]

Fooker:

Looking back at logs, yuvnoise is running – so maybe its not outputing to ffmpeg properly?

[18:51:11]

Honk:

yuvnoise? adding extra noise to your movie, are you? :P

[18:51:22]

Beirdo:

try it without denoising to see

[18:51:45]

amrit|zzz is now known as amrit|wrk

[18:52:21]

Fooker:

This is why open source software isn't getting anywhere. Exporting from mythtv to a DVD should be basic functionality that is done at the click of a button. </rant>

[18:52:36]

gardengnome:

Fooker: mytharchive.

[18:52:44]

Beirdo:

it practically is if you have a PVRx50 and record at DVD resolutions

[18:52:56]

gardengnome:

that's why open source isn't getting anywhere. too many users not paying attention. :)

[18:53:00]

Beirdo:

just remux and master

[18:53:28]

Fooker:

Beirdo: How does one switch the resolutions? I'm using a PVR-150 so in theory I should be able to record to a DVD compat file, but no ones ever known *how*

[18:54:04]

Beirdo:

in the recording profiles, set the resolution to a DVD resolution

[18:54:24]

Beirdo:

if NTSC: 720x480, 704x480, 352x480, 352x240

[18:55:01]

Beirdo:

if PAL: 720x576, 704x576, 352x576, 352x288 (IIRC)

[18:55:19]

gardengnome:

Fooker: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Mytharchive

[18:55:25]

Beirdo:

480x480 and 640x480 SUCK if you are gonna make DVDs

[18:55:39]

Beirdo:

with or without mytharchive, which should make it easier :)

[18:55:53]

Fooker:

gardengnome: Mytharchive is way to user-intensive

[18:56:52]

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[18:57:07]

sebrock|a:

anyone knows how to get the Realtek HD Audio to work in FC6?

[18:58:10]

gardengnome:

GreyFoxx: did you ever get around to trying IEGD 6.1?

[19:00:02]

Fooker:

Ok, so I've switched so that all new recordings will be recorded at 720x480 – how do I best go about getting all my previous recordings to this resolution?

[19:01:12]

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[19:01:38]

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[19:02:05]

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[19:02:22]

Beirdo:

ummm, nuvexport? :)

[19:02:25]

kslater:

Fooker – if it's really necessary you'd have to use transcode or ffmpeg or soemthing

[19:02:32]

kslater:

nuvexport even

[19:04:04]

kslater:

do you really intend to make DVD's out of a lot of existing recordings?

[19:04:06]

Fooker:

Beirdo: Considering nuvexport isn't working :P

[19:04:11]

Fooker:

kslater: Yes

[19:04:24]

Fooker:

kslater: I've got something like 70 recordings I want to put onto DVD

[19:04:28]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[19:04:41]

kslater:

Beirdo – won't MythArchive do the transcode on the fly?

[19:04:54]

kslater:

or in the process or getting it ready for burning at least

[19:05:03]

Beirdo:

think so, using ffmpeg, which might be his issue

[19:05:15]

gardengnome:

kslater: yes, but fooker really doesn't want to use mytharchive because it's "way to user-intensive"

[19:05:30]

kslater:

come again?

[19:05:47]

Fooker:

I want something command line I can script, not something I have to go through 5 menu's for every 2 shows.

[19:06:19]

gardengnome:

then you'll have to work something out. write a user job or something, that could work.

[19:06:23]

kslater:

ok. and nuvexport is out. I guess you're going to need to learn how to drive transcode, ffmpeg or something similar

[19:06:34]

gardengnome:

or fix nuvexport/mythtranscode

[19:06:36]

kormoc:

Fooker, so use the raw command line tools, growiso + cdrecord + ffmpeg or similar

[19:06:54]

gardengnome:

it should also be possible to run mythburn.py manually

[19:08:03]

Fooker:

I have an ffmpeg job that gets the files into a DVD compat format quite easily, but then I have no way to do commercial cutting. Can mythcommflag somehow be configured to actually remove the commercials instead of just flagging them?

[19:09:01]

kslater:

mythcommflag flags – mythtranscode to losslessly cut chunks out of your mpeg2 recordings

[19:11:56]

Fooker:

Found something on a wiki, thanks

[19:14:29]

kslater:

Fooker – started down that road, but decided it was easier to just do them a little at a time inside myth

[19:15:04]

kslater:

I have one that I can't do that way – a 720p HD recording that I want to transcode down to DVD and preserve the 5.1 dolby stream.

[19:15:56]

Eradan:

kslater: you fitting a 1hr 720p show intact on a DVD ?

[19:16:01]

Eradan:

w/o going DL-DVD ? ....

[19:16:34]

kslater:

I have a nice shiny new DL-DVD burner

[19:17:06]

kslater:

but I don't intend to keep the recording in 1280 x 720 res, I'll down convert to 720 x 480

[19:17:14]

kslater:

that's my thinking anyway

[19:18:04]

Eradan:

kslater: gotcha.

[19:18:26]

Eradan:

kslater: i have a DL burner as well ... it's the damn media that kills me.

[19:18:51]

kslater:

really?

[19:18:56]

kslater:

what problem with media?

[19:19:50]

Eradan:

price ...

[19:20:33]

kslater:

ah

[19:20:34]

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[19:20:49]

kslater:

what's the ticket on a DL+R disc?

[19:23:24]

kslater:

how much?

[19:25:21]

kslater:

staples has a deal on 25 Sony DL+R for $35. that's not terrible.

[19:27:25]

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[19:27:49]

Honk:

mhh.. is it normal that the osd starts flickering when i use bob deinterlacing? =)

[19:28:20]

gardengnome:

yep

[19:28:35]

gardengnome:

works fine with XvMC here, though

[19:29:20]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris

[19:29:23]

Honk:

that's what i use

[19:29:53]

Honk:

the image quality of the movie itself is pretty good though :]

[19:31:55]

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[19:34:33]

Beirdo:

anyone want to guess what temperature it is here today? Anyone in here in Alaska?

[19:34:36]

Beirdo:

hehe

[19:35:14]

Beirdo:

100.2F / 37.9C at 37% humidity. Gotta love this.

[19:35:57]

Beirdo:

that's measured about 10 miles from here, but still

[19:37:05]

hatlevip:

Beirdo, where is that?

[19:37:24]

Beirdo:

Puerto Rico

[19:37:26]

Beirdo:

:)

[19:38:57]

Beirdo:

betcha the thermometer at that station's in sunlight, and it's actually only about 85F

[19:39:02]

Beirdo:

but sweet anyways

[19:39:10]

gardengnome:

that's way too hot

[19:39:37]

Beirdo:

never

[19:39:38]

Beirdo:

:)

[19:40:19]

gbee:

says Beirdo as he spontaneously combusts

[19:40:45]

Beirdo:

OK, what language uses: ?

[19:41:34]

gbee:

language language or computer language?

[19:42:04]

Beirdo:

human language... with an r with an accent

[19:42:32]

gbee:

maybe I should point out, that you could have posted a really odd character but all I see is ": ?"

[19:42:46]

Beirdo:

I missed the e, and hit r and it created the letter, now I'm curious as to what uses it

[19:42:49]

Beirdo:

ooooh

[19:42:49]

Beirdo:

sorry

[19:43:00]

Beirdo:

stupid UTF-challenged IRC :)

[19:43:06]

gbee:

heh

[19:43:22]

Beirdo:

r-acute accent

[19:43:32]

Beirdo:

to be exact :)

[19:44:21]

Beirdo:

most languages I know have accents mainly on vowels, with the exception of a few cases

[19:44:32]

Beirdo:

like n~ in spanish, c, in french...

[19:45:02]

gbee:

hmm, east european would be my guess

[19:45:18]

Beirdo:

Hungarian or something maybe...

[19:45:19]

gardengnome:

my IRC $stuff should display UTF-8 properly. äöü :)

[19:45:31]

Beirdo:

or Finnish... it's a strange language too

[19:46:35]

Beirdo:

anyways...

[19:46:39]

Beirdo:

what to break....

[19:48:00]

Beirdo:

hmm, wonder if anything not completely sucky is on TV

[19:49:32]

gbee:

thanks for the laugh

[19:49:48]

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[19:49:49]

Beirdo:

any time

[19:50:14]

Beirdo:

I think I'll go watch my 72 channels of crappy digital TV, had enough MUD code hacking for now

[19:50:38]

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[19:55:10]

Beirdo:

yo, gardengnome... what's the compose-blah-blah keystroke in linux to get a euro symbol?

[19:57:10]

gardengnome:

Alt Gr + q for me

[19:57:15]

gardengnome:

that was not very helpful :)

[19:57:38]

Beirdo:

heh, nope

[19:58:00]

Beirdo:

silly german keyboard setup

[19:58:01]

Beirdo:

;)

[19:58:34]

gbee:

Alt Gr + $ for me

[19:59:03]

** gbee bashed at the keyboard until it appeared **

[20:00:27]

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[20:00:28]

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[20:08:25]

janneg:

Beirdo: I found compose – '-' – 'e' in my compose file which seems logical but doesn't work

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[20:19:35]

gnome42:

xris: [12650] seems to have done it, thanks. :)

[20:21:46]

janneg:

Beirdo: for iso8859–15 it is 'C=', '=C', 'e=' and 'E='. iso8859–1 doesn't have it

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[20:28:47]

Beirdo:

€

[20:28:52]

Beirdo:

there it goes

[20:29:03]

Beirdo:

thanks :)

[20:35:58]

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[20:40:05]

tonyb2006:

if i wanted a remote reciever that'd work with LIRC for under $23 what would i do

[20:40:13]

tonyb2006:

thats USB

[20:40:18]

zigovr3:

hi all, do you have a solution to exit from a game with mythgame using the remote ?

[20:41:08]

zigovr3:

tonyb2006: one good solution is to get a capture card with a remote , it's a bit more expensive though but not a lot, and you have an extra capture card

[20:41:24]

tonyb2006:

well my 'mythtv box' is just a laptop sitting on my desk

[20:41:35]

tonyb2006:

pci cards don't really 'fit'

[20:41:36]

zigovr3:

then, an usb one

[20:41:54]

zigovr3:

you don't have an extra usb port ?

[20:41:57]

tonyb2006:

thats not under $23

[20:42:00]

tonyb2006:

i have USB

[20:42:03]

tonyb2006:

lots of it

[20:42:17]

zigovr3:

then for example, winfast dtv dongle has an IR remote

[20:42:32]

zigovr3:

however you'll need a patch to have the keycodes

[20:42:38]

zigovr3:

other models might work out of the box

[20:42:48]

tonyb2006:

whats winfast dtv?

[20:43:02]

zigovr3:

a leadtek dvb-t usb device

[20:44:01]

tonyb2006:

is ther dvb in the us?

[20:44:06]

tonyb2006:

besides ASTC

[20:44:14]

zigovr3:

no idea about how it works in the US

[20:44:52]

zigovr3:

anyway, a lot of usb device have a remote

[20:45:04]

zigovr3:

so just choose one that is well supported

[20:45:52]

tonyb2006:

what if i wanted JUST ir? would an IrDa dongle work well from like 5 ft away

[20:46:27]

zigovr3:

I'm not sure it's possible with an irda device

[20:52:17]

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[20:53:48]

Techboy74:

Hey all, having trouble with audio when using my analog capture card in myth, Cap card is SAA7134. Audio is connected to line in on sound card direct from source (Cable STU) much googling hasn't turned up anything. difficulty is the sound is very low quality, It's like the sample rate is very very low. I have mucked around with the sample rate in the cap card profile – no difference

[20:53:51]

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[20:53:52]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v juski

[20:54:10]

Techboy74:

sound card is nvidia nforce 4

[20:54:22]

juski:

it's not, just fyi. consumer IR != IrDA

[20:57:49]

Eradan:

faught the damn audio buffer underruns last night ...

[20:57:54]

Eradan:

come to find out it was my recordings ... :(

[20:58:15]

tha_toadman:

tonyb2006: what system are you using as your frontend?

[20:59:23]

tonyb2006:

mythfrontend?

[21:00:00]

tha_toadman:

yeah – your ? regarding how to get out of mythgame with a remote

[21:00:19]

tonyb2006:

not me

[21:00:38]

tha_toadman:

oh sorry – i just noticed, my bad

[21:00:46]

tonyb2006:

btw my laptop supposedly has Consumer IR, but i haven't been able to find anything as to using it

[21:00:59]

tha_toadman:

it was zigovr3

[21:01:41]

tha_toadman:

i need an honest opinion from the crowd here...

[21:02:02]

tha_toadman:

do i get a $92 mediaMVP or a $99 used xbox (w/dvd kit) ?

[21:02:09]

tha_toadman:

as my frontend

[21:06:18]

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[21:12:06]

Hellaenergy:

OK....

[21:12:41]

Hellaenergy:

What is the best hardware setup to run MythTV on? I'm looking to put together a box from scratch and need hardware advise.

[21:13:14]

** Hellaenergy presses play **

[21:13:32]

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[21:14:14]

slowone:

Hellaenergy: if you get pvr or dvb type cards, you really just need disk ;) and a newer decent videocard for output to tv...

[21:14:45]

Hellaenergy:

slowone, what about mobo's cases etc.

[21:14:49]

Hellaenergy:

how much mem

[21:15:03]

slowone:

all of that is personal prefrance...

[21:15:28]

slowone:

pvr/dvb cards handle all the encodeing (or just copying existing) mpeg2 streams

[21:16:02]

slowone:

so you just need something that decodes that well (any current generation nvidia card is great)

[21:16:02]

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[21:16:15]

slowone:

case/mobo is entirely your personal preferance

[21:16:28]

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[21:16:49]

Hellaenergy:

But my personal preference is to have a nice, quite, solid box.

[21:17:25]

Hellaenergy:

What I mean by solid is it runs without error.

[21:17:46]

Hellaenergy:

slowone, what do you have for a setup?

[21:17:52]

gammelmark:

hello – I am trying to get MythMusic working – but in MythTV config, the audio device dropdown is empty, and no device is specified, how do I make it use my alsa pcm? what do I write?

[21:18:01]

hads:

I think that would be everyones preference Hellaenergy

[21:18:10]

** Hellaenergy nods **

[21:18:27]

Hellaenergy:

hads, is that not a realistic expectation?

[21:18:30]

slowone:

my front end is an old p4 2.4ghz with 256meg of ram, 20gig disk, and a nvidia 6200

[21:18:55]

Hellaenergy:

slowone, that sits right by your TV?

[21:18:59]

slowone:

ya

[21:19:03]

slowone:

that sits under my tv

[21:19:28]

hads:

My current master backend and frontend is an Athlon XP1500 with an nvidia 5600 and 400GB disk

[21:20:04]

hads:

Yeah, I have another 600GB via NFS for movies/music etc

[21:20:15]

slowone:

1.5tb disk, 1gig ram, 2.8ghz smithfeild...

[21:20:45]

slowone:

mounted nfs on the frontend

[21:22:54]

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[21:23:23]

slowone:

someday i plan to build a new gameing box for myself, and take my shuttle sb86i and use that for my frontend... with a fanless videocard in it that box is silent ;)

[21:33:13]

zigovr3:

tonyb2006: you have a solution to quit the game in mythgame ? I'm using mupen64 for the moment but I plan using snes9x too

[21:33:36]

tonyb2006:

no...

[21:33:38]

tonyb2006:

why me?

[21:34:20]

zigovr3:

I don't know someone mentionned my name earlier :)

[21:34:21]

kormoc:

zigovr3, try pressing the key combo to quit?

[21:34:39]

zigovr3:

kormoc: ah, you know of any key combo in mupen64 ?

[21:34:42]

kormoc:

zigovr3, it's bad form to randomly address people

[21:34:50]

kormoc:

zigovr3, no, check the mupen64 docs

[21:35:15]

zigovr3:

kormoc: I didn't adress him randomly, my name came up in a conversation between him and another guy :)

[21:36:09]

** kormoc sighs. **

[21:36:27]

zigovr3:

anyway, it might be a useful addition in mythgame, mythgame should know the pid of the game process, so it's could kill it when we press "back" on the remote for example

[21:36:52]

kormoc:

the fact of the matter is you likcy confused him, and you limited who likely would attempt to answer your question

[21:37:02]

kormoc:

zigovr3, patches would be welcome

[21:37:47]

zigovr3:

yeah I guess

[21:37:51]

zigovr3:

I'll look into that

[21:41:09]

Fooker:

mythtranscode errors with error code 247 – anywhere I can lookup this error code to see what it really means?

[21:51:43]

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[21:54:50]

Sembiance:

I have four 500GB SATA drives. I need to decide between LVM and EVMS for RAID5. Any opinions?

[21:57:54]

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[22:18:28]

xris:

Sembiance: um, lvm isn't raid

[22:19:50]

Sembiance:

xris: um, I got my answer somewhere else. thanks though, I guess

[22:20:36]

xris:

and I think that evms is just the manager, not the underlying architecture

[22:21:12]

xris:

Sembiance: as long as you got a good answer. just wanted to make sure that you knew that you wouldn't get raid5 if you used lvm.

[22:21:24]

xris:

at least, not in linux.

[22:22:33]

Sembiance:

I was informed that I didn't need LVM nor EVMS just to make a RAID5 array

[22:22:45]

Sembiance:

mdadm I was pointed at :)

[22:22:49]

xris:

which is correct.

[22:23:44]

Sembiance:

I just wonder if I have all the options turned on in my kernel that I need

[22:23:50]

Sembiance:

I think I do :)

[22:26:31]

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[22:34:54]

fryfrog:

does mythtv still </3 beryl/compiz/composite?

[22:35:30]

juski:

probably still doesn't

[22:36:50]

fryfrog:

hehe

[22:37:18]

fryfrog:

i don't want TV on spinning cube, but my master backend is almost always *not* running myth

[22:37:25]

fryfrog:

so its nice to have pretties to play with!

[22:38:29]

juski:

I think the problem with nvidia & that fancy 3d stuff was sorted out

[22:38:53]

juski:

was an issue outside of mythtv though IIRC

[22:44:46]

psm321:

tv on a spinning cube would be neat

[22:48:33]

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[22:52:24]

juski:

if by 'neat' you mean pointless, then yeah :)

[23:12:54]

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[23:39:18]

juski:

time for some mood lighting. I might find my creative spark again

[23:42:06]

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[23:45:56]

SlicerDicer-:

anybody run mini-itx computers as frontends?

[23:47:06]

jmblack256:

I am able to telnet <ip of backend> 6543, and the frontend is able to list the recordings so Im unsure of how to troubleshoot from here

[23:47:14]

SlicerDicer-:

kormoc: fryfrog or xris are any of you here?

[23:47:24]

juski:

SlicerDicer-: yeah. epia m10000

[23:47:32]

juski:

minimyth <8

[23:47:33]

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[23:48:12]

SlicerDicer-:

:)

[23:51:01]

fryfrog:

SlicerDicer-: i am now i spose, why?

[23:52:28]

juski:

jmblack256: let me guess... the frontend has the same hostname as the backend

[23:54:14]

jmblack256:

nope

[23:54:20]

xris:

SlicerDicer-: ?

[23:54:41]

SlicerDicer-:

nvm fryfrog and xris haha I got it taken care of :)

[23:54:47]

jmblack256:

remote frontend is named 'livingroom' 9and has been sence initial install. the server is 'mythtvserver1' and has been sence initial install

[23:54:49]

SlicerDicer-:

just a fiahwhire thing :)

[23:54:53]

jmblack256:

way before I installed myth on them

[23:55:56]

jmblack256:

Im specifying IP addresses not hostnames in mythtv-setup and in the various mythfrontend setup screens (as I gather than some of those places dont like hostnames)

[23:56:10]

jmblack256:

and both the frontend and backend are hardcoded IP addresses and do not use DHCP

[23:56:30]

jmblack256:

I thought I simplified the setup to eliminate problems like this and yet here I am ;(

MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

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