MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv

Daily chat history

Current users (74):

aloril_, amessina, andreaz, Anssi, caelor, Captain_Murdoch2, Casper0082, cesman, Chutt, clever, coling, Cougar, dblain, dekarl, dreamcat4, dumnut_, eee-blt, ElmerFudd, fetzerch, FrankD_Work, Gibby, gigem, gregL, GreyFoxx_, J-e-f-f-A, jams_, jarle, jarryd, jheizer__, joki, jpabq, jpharvey, jwhite, knightr, kormoc, kurre2, kwmonroe, mad_enz, moparisthebest, MythBuild, MythLogBot, nephyrin, nyloc, peper03, poptix-, purserj, RedPenguin, rhpot1991, robink, rsiebert, ryan_turner|MTW, Seeker, seld, Sharky112065, sheedy-away, sl1ce_1g, sphery, sraue, stuarta, stuartm, superm1_, taylorr, tgm4883_, toeb, tonsofpcs, tris, unforgiven512, wagnerrp, Warped, wseltzer, XDS2010_, xris, zentec, _charly_
Saturday, July 12th, 2014, 00:10 UTC
[00:10:16] dblain: stuartm: I'm used to windows programming where int & long are both 32bits. It should be able to be changed safely to an int.
[00:12:02] ** dblain sometimes is stuck in the past... 16bit ints & 32bit longs :( **
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[02:31:07] jpabq: stichnot: I will apply your patch tomorrow and let you know how it works for me.
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[06:15:11] stichnot: jpabq: thanks.
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[06:39:02] dekarl: stuartm, wanted to point k-man over in #mythtv-users to the Frontend service wsdl, but that is missing /xslt/service.xslt. How does that end up in the backend web frontend? I see it in /html/xslt/service.xslt, do we have a /html-frontend or something?
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[06:39:54] dekarl: opening http://the-frontend:6547/Frontend/wsdl just gives me "Error loading stylesheet: A network error occurred loading an XSLT stylesheet: http://the-frontend:6547/xslt/service.xslt"
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[06:50:06] dekarl: found it in mythtv/libs/libmythupnp/htmlserver.cpp, no I'm wondering if the frontends should just point at the master backend or if we should have two trees with shared files being copied around by the Makefiles
[06:50:13] dekarl: s/no/now/
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[09:04:48] stuartm: dekarl: those are questions best directed at dblain, I was under the impression that the wsdl was created at compile or runtime
[09:24:45] dekarl: stuartm, aye the wsdl is, but the xslt is not :/
[09:26:41] dekarl: basically the FE is telling the browser to render using these two files https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/tree/master/mythtv/html/xslt
[09:29:03] stuartm: they should be able to use the same xslt
[09:29:07] dekarl: and these refer to /css/wsdl.css and /images/mythtv.png
[09:29:43] dekarl: I agree, but how?
[09:33:06] stuartm: too busy to figure that out just now :) I made the bright decision to have a small part of the upnp code use QtXml instead of crafting xml by hand – that was hours ago and I'm still struggling to make it work
[09:33:17] stuartm: I hate QtXml
[09:43:52] dekarl: tbh I hate everything in QT that I took a closer look at... time handling, containers, data types...
[10:15:51] dekarl: ^- tgm4883_, superm1_ https://github.com/MythTV/packaging/blob/mast . . . .install#L10 breaks the frontend web service properly showing the wsdl pages due to missing shared files
[10:16:11] dekarl: it appears as if usr/share/mythtv/html should go into common
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[10:17:55] dekarl: I can test it later, but I'm not sure how to fix it so that upgrades work well (moving the directory from backend to common package)
[10:19:31] dekarl: looks like everything works when the backend package is installed... doh
[10:28:29] stuartm: qt is not all bad, but sometimes you run into stuff where it was clearly designed from one perspective ignoring other use cases
[10:28:41] stuartm: and then it can be a real bastard
[10:31:17] stuartm: the xml stuff assumes you'll construct your xml in a very linear way
[10:34:05] stuartm: the problem is that it's still ultimately a better way of doing it, since you guarantee that the xml will be properly formatted and everything will be escaped correctly (not currently the case)
[10:34:06] dekarl: so basically it is more SAX then DOM oriented?
[10:39:07] stuartm: basically you need to completely define a node before it's added to the tree, you can't maintain a reference/pointer to it and amend or add to it afterwards without a degree of pain, it's Document centric, the assumption being that you'll be creating a full document instead of a fragment to stick inside a SOAP envelope
[10:40:26] stuartm: at least that's my experience, maybe I'm missing something, but I'm deep down a hole atm finding my way by trial and error (lots of error)
[10:40:58] stuartm: lots of stuff just isn't working how I expect it to work from the documentation
[10:43:15] dekarl: aye, that was what I was trying to say... its the streaming XML API, you are looking for the "whole data in memory for easy manipulation" API
[10:44:05] dekarl: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_API_for_XML vs http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Document_Object_Model
[10:51:32] dekarl: stuartm, according to http://qt-project.org/doc/qt-4.8/qtxml.html they also provide a DOM interface
[10:52:22] stuartm: almost, it's DOM on the surface and you can manipulate the tree but it's all copies rather than direct reference and in practice I'm finding you still need to do stuff in a specific order unless you want to greatly increase the work
[10:53:17] stuartm: i.e. it's DOM written by someone who has only ever worked with SAX
[10:54:17] stuartm: but I may still be using it all wrong – failed to find any usage examples that deal with the scenario we've got
[10:55:20] dekarl: strange https://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials/QtDOM_Tutorial says "The Qt implementation of DOM uses explicit sharing (...), so that whenever you change the QDomNode (...), all copies are changed (since they point to the same data in memory)."
[10:56:00] stuartm: that is strange, since the code I wrote which did exactly that just didn't work
[10:56:52] stuartm: I hope I'm wrong, because I'd like to use this for all the XML produced by libupnp, it would help to eliminate some errors and prevent future ones creeping in
[10:58:44] stuartm: nope, still not f***ing working ... think I'll give up for now and just manually fix up the escaping instead
[11:25:49] stuartm: would create a node (QDomElement), assign attributes etc, that would show up fine in the resulting xml – but any child nodes added to it are missing
[11:27:16] stuartm: will come back to the QtXML approach another day, faster to just fix the immediate issue which started this whole thing in the first place
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[16:30:20] MythBuild: build #895 of master-win8-msvc-2010–32bit is complete: Failure [4failed Configure and Build] Build details are at http://code.mythtv.org/buildbot/builders/mast . . . t/builds/895 blamelist: Stuart Morgan <smorgan@mythtv.org >
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[16:42:28] stuartm: failing because QT5 dropped a method from QUrl, but the replacement isn't backwards compatible with QT4.8
[16:43:37] stuartm: and it's not even included in the compatibility layer
[16:45:14] stuartm: well that sucks for anyone building on QT5, but we're still officially targeting QT4 and since the point of the change was to make it harder to break the upnp stuff, not sure I want to add ifdefs
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[17:39:15] stuartm: hope nobody has a problem with me dropping XBox 360 Media Sharing support (which has been allegedly broken for years)
[18:29:54] dblain: stuartm: the comment about xbox 360 not supporting upnp/dlna is false. It supports it just fine and I've used it in the past. The main complaint is that it won't stream mpeg video using upnp. The mediacenter protocol is completely seperate and not relevant to upnp support in the xbox 360.
[18:31:34] dblain: (the ps3 & xbox 360 were the first clients I coded the upnp support for)
[18:35:07] dblain: stuartm: as for Qt5 dropping support for a method and it breaking the win32 build. Are you going to address that or do I need to downgrade to Qt4.8?
[18:38:04] dblain: Also, if it's a Qt5 issue, why wouldn't the Fedora Qt5 build slave be failing also?
[18:49:29] dblain: pushing change to enable compatility layer for libmythupnp. Hoping it will fix the Qt5 issue.
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[19:31:58] stuartm: dblain: I was misinformed then, given that can we remove all the XBox 360 related hacks from the code?
[19:32:48] stuartm: dblain: the hacks all seem related to the media sharing stuff, e.g. hardcoded container ids
[19:33:18] stuartm: if the XBox supports UPnP then none of those are required
[19:35:38] stuartm: found this which suggests that it does indeed support UPnP (with a software update) and also supports MPEG 2 – http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-360/system/playto-setup
[19:41:23] dblain: the xbox supports mpeg2 but just not when using upnp.
[19:41:58] stuartm: fwiw, it's likely that any inability to play mpeg video is down to the lack of encoding information in our res tags which is required by DLNA, I plan to add that for 0.28 but to do it properly is not a trivial patch
[19:42:15] dblain: The container id hacks are unfortunately needed if you want to have the media displayed in the correct way on the xbox.
[19:43:17] dblain: they may have enhanced the dlna support, but 5 years ago when I research it, they delibrately disabled mpeg support in the upnp support.
[19:44:03] stuartm: right, sorry to be pedantic then, but it doesn't support UPnP if it requires hacks to display the content of the server? As I said in my comment on that ticket, it supports a bastardised version of it (which is the Media Share protocol, as evidenced in the Media Share documentation)
[19:45:12] stuartm: that said, the link above suggests that they've updated it to provide DLNA compliant support – Media Share documentation explicitly notes that it's based on UPnP but not DLNA compliant
[19:45:46] dblain: IIRC, if we remove the hard coded container ids the content will still show, but won't be in the correct categories. It looks like it was created with windows Media Player being the only expected upnp server (the container id's match what media player uses).
[19:46:03] stuartm: if we target DLNA compliance and remove all device specific hacks it sounds like we should be OK
[19:46:31] stuartm: but I don't have an XBox to test with
[19:46:43] dblain: If we want a pure version, it should be ok. It just means xbox 360 users won't have an nice experiance.
[19:47:16] stuartm: they will if it's DLNA compliant :)
[19:47:39] stuartm: but we'll see what happens
[19:47:50] dblain: Not completely true... I've seen many DLNA clients that don't work correctly due to implementation specific issues.
[19:48:02] stuartm: I can leave it alone for now, but the ticket suggests it was broken anyway
[19:48:45] stuartm: dblain: DLNA doesn't seem to leave any leeway on implementation at all
[19:48:48] dblain: I have little to no say in any of this since I haven't been actively maintaining it. If you feel a clean start is best... go for it.
[19:49:51] dblain: stuartm: just going on my past experience with testing various clients. I has been a while so maybe it's gotten better.
[19:51:25] MythBuild: build #897 of master-win8-msvc-2010–32bit is complete: Success [3build successful] Build details are at http://code.mythtv.org/buildbot/builders/mast . . . t/builds/897
[19:52:20] stuartm: I think it's easier to know if our core code is working properly with all clients if we don't have instances of device specific hacks, many of which aren't doing the right thing anyway, case in point the Sony hacks which are both right and wrong
[19:53:47] dblain: agreed. back in the day, I was trying to think of a way to externalize the device specfic differences in a way that end users could easily add/change them... I never did get to implement it.
[19:55:09] dblain: I lost my job a little over a week ago (moved it out of state and didn't want to move the family). thought I would finally have time to work on MythTv, but the honey-do list is so long, I haven't had a chance.
[19:55:55] stuartm: in some cases, if not most of them, it's not that the devices are really different, it's just some are stricter than others about what they expect – Sony devices require the encoding details for each file but internally they don't care about the difference between PAL and NTSC, whereas Panasonic devices do
[19:55:59] dblain: stuartm: when I do find time, what would you like me to work on first? (servicesenums support, complex parameters, etc...)
[19:57:28] stuartm: dblain: services enum stuff would be great, it will enable us to get the Services API to a relatively stable state
[19:57:36] dblain: yes, I also notices (at least 5+ years ago), that there were only a handful of upnp client implementations around and unrelated devices would use one of them.
[19:58:31] dblain: ok. I'm taking a few weeks off before starting to look for a job, so if I can get the chores done, I will would on enums.
[19:58:47] dblain: work on... :/
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[20:18:10] dblain: stuartm: when you have time (don't need it right away), could you please recap what you need/expect the enhanced enum support to consist of?
[20:23:57] stuartm: dblain: sure
[20:28:13] caelor: stuartm: I have an xbox360, and can test (currently against 0.27, but once I find time I'm intending to move from fedora packages onto my own master based compiles)
[20:28:50] caelor: fwiw, every time I've tried using the xbox to access any upnp content, I've never really had any success
[20:32:47] stuartm: dblain, caelor: might start by disabling the 360 specific hacks but allowing them to be enabled via an env var, that will allow testers to compare behaviour
[20:34:58] caelor: sounds fair. I can't promise timescales on moving onto master though – first I need to wrap my head around the fedora package build process (and how the rpmfusion packages I currently use differ from the fedora packaging scripts)
[20:35:23] stuartm: there's plenty I need to do to improve upnp generally first
[20:35:51] caelor: ok, hopefully the timescales should match up.
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[21:39:29] stuartm: dblain: surprised that enabling compat worked since the QT 5 docs indicated that particular method wasn't included in the compat layer
[22:34:30] dblain: It's more of a "enable depricated functions" thing than a comapt layer.
[22:35:14] dblain: stuartm: I guess linux enables it by default, but windows doesn't
[22:37:24] stuartm: in the QT4 docs, anything which was previously available in QT3 but now only available in the compat mode was listed as such, in the QT5 docs they again have the list of 'Compat' methods/classes, but that one wasn't there, instead it appeared in a list of obsolete methods
[22:37:48] stuartm: and 'Compat Layer' is their term, not mine :)
[22:38:30] stuartm: https://qt-project.org/doc/qt-5/qurl-compat.html
[22:38:58] stuartm: vs https://qt-project.org/doc/qt-5/qurl-obsolete.html
[22:40:05] stuartm: I've just noticed the bit at the top there where it says "They are provided to keep old source code working." ... so they've kept the 'obsolete' stuff in after all
[22:41:37] dblain: I looked at the header and saw the #ifdef around it, so that pointed me to the define I enabled.
[23:46:42] stuartm: heh, yeah, that's the quick way

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