| Tuesday, October 26th, 2010, 20:12 UTC | ||
| [20:12:43] | skd5aner: | !seen xris |
| [20:12:43] | MythLogBot: | xris is here and has been idle for 11 seconds |
| [20:12:45] | xris: | speaking of irc.. anyone know if we've had progress getting our cloak? |
| [20:13:00] | iamlindoro: | stuarta was on that, I think, but last I heard he'd heard nothing |
| [20:13:21] | Beirdo: | there we go |
| [20:13:28] | iamlindoro: | Beirdo: /6 ? |
| [20:13:41] | iamlindoro: | yes, apparently :) |
| [20:13:46] | Beirdo: | yeah, we had -bsp and -theming, etc in there |
| [20:13:50] | Beirdo: | and a couple test ones |
| [20:13:59] | iamlindoro: | yeah, I was extrapolating, hadn't seen a messafge |
| [20:14:01] | duerF (duerF!~tommi@heima.tommi.org) has joined #mythtv | |
| [20:14:05] | skd5aner: | !url logs |
| [20:14:05] | MythLogBot: | No match for keyword logs |
| [20:14:18] | Beirdo: | the url stuff is per channel |
| [20:14:24] | Beirdo: | !notice |
| [20:14:24] | MythLogBot: | This channel (#mythtv) is logged — http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/6 |
| [20:14:31] | iamlindoro: | !trout skd5aner lets not turn people against the bot in the first ten minutes please |
| [20:14:31] | ** MythLogBot slaps skd5aner with a lets not turn people against the bot in the first ten minutes please trout on behalf of iamlindoro... ** | |
| [20:15:01] | skd5aner: | heh – I probably just used bot commands more in the last 10 mins than I have in the last 10 months – it's out of my system now ;) |
| [20:15:10] | Beirdo: | good |
| [20:16:36] | stuartm: | if people start abusing it in here then maybe we can disable certain features on a per-channel basis? |
| [20:17:23] | Beirdo: | I would need to code it that way, but in the mean time, if stuff gets abused, I have no problems with disabling it for all channels until I can code it |
| [20:18:28] | xris: | yeah, could always make some commands available only to people with +v, etc... of course then we'd have to set that up for ourselves in the channel itself. |
| [20:18:54] | xris: | we need to adjust founder-level access for some people, too... I think I'm missing stuff here and in -users |
| [20:19:52] | stuartm: | xris: apparently getting the cloak could take months, or even years, there is a _massive_ backlog and we only get priority if we need to regain control of channels that should belong to the group |
| [20:20:22] | Beirdo: | if I see a staffer in -users again, I will have to pounce on them |
| [20:20:45] | xris: | gotcha |
| [20:20:50] | iamlindoro: | It's astonishing that it's *that* hard to create a cloak that they could end up with a months-long backlog |
| [20:21:04] | stuartm: | I thought that meant -users (Oscar is AWOL) but stuarta seems to think not |
| [20:21:27] | Beirdo: | we still have ops control over -users |
| [20:21:40] | sphery: | especially when they do a per-user unaffiliated cloak on request (and they only suggest that you donate to get one--they don't require it) |
| [20:22:07] | stuartm: | iamlindoro: group cloaks are awarded to validated groups, that means they have to process a form nominating a contact, phone that contact to make sure the details etc are correct |
| [20:22:40] | Beirdo: | we sent in said form like 3 months ago or so, i think |
| [20:23:11] | stuartm: | the process is meant to ensure that some random user can't seize control of the MythTV group and by extension the channel, cloaks and anything else they'd have rights to |
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| [20:23:34] | iamlindoro: | stuartm: makes sense |
| [20:25:38] | stuartm: | Beirdo: aye, their blog states that some groups have been waiting for years ... |
| [20:26:15] | Beirdo: | that is just ridiculous |
| [20:26:37] | stuartm: | and we've just been pushed to the back of the queue because they've now prioritised groups who need to gain control of their channels |
| [20:26:51] | stuartm: | http://blog.freenode.net/ – "Group Registration Form verifications" |
| [20:27:19] | Beirdo: | wonder if they prioritize us if we threaten to move to oftc.net |
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| [20:28:15] | stuartm: | Beirdo: they'd probably treat it the same way we would if a user threatened to switch to MCE or XBMC |
| [20:28:17] | Beirdo: | pretty sure the response time there would be far better... but it would be such a pain to move and redirect |
| [20:28:31] | Beirdo: | heh, quite likely so |
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| [20:38:36] | stuartm: | Beirdo: the nickname colour is entirely random right? I shouldn't read anything into the fact that it's chosen pink for me? |
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| [20:42:46] | dekarl1: | evening, I'm just going through the xmltv bugs and am now trying to figure out how mythfilldatabase handles time offsets, localtime vs. utc, etc. |
| [20:42:50] | dekarl1 is now known as dekarl | |
| [20:43:36] | dekarl: | it seems the default setting is to ignore the explicit time offset returned by xmltv and replace it with the offset to the backends localtime |
| [20:43:59] | dekarl: | aka, Global Setting TimeOffset defaults to "none" (is this correct?) |
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| [20:45:10] | dekarl: | this would needlessly break using guide data from other timezones, while the correct behaviour can be achieved with the "auto" setting. (guess local timezone and go from guide tz via utc to local tz) |
| [20:45:18] | dekarl: | Is this analysis correct? |
| [20:58:49] | Beirdo: | as far as I know, it's randomized |
| [20:59:21] | sphery: | dekarl: Default setting is to put the exact time value returned by the grabber into the DB--which is perfect for any provider that presents times in local time. Users who have providers that provide data using some other time zone will need to configure it. Auto will actually break some setups. |
| [20:59:23] | Beirdo: | with some heuristic, but I don't recall what we used |
| [20:59:28] | Beirdo: | anyways, meeting time |
| [21:00:00] | sphery: | dekarl: if you want to change the default, you'd need to provide compelling evidence that more people need auto than need none (i.e. that more people get listings whose times are specified in some other time zone) |
| [21:00:06] | dekarl: | sphery: so default is none? |
| [21:00:10] | sphery: | yes |
| [21:00:40] | dekarl: | sphery: but won't that break all guide data that is collected before DST switchover but relates to programs past DST switchover? |
| [21:01:02] | dekarl: | basically it's dropping the correct offset and replacing it with current localtime offset |
| [21:01:22] | sphery: | dekarl: depends on how the provider provides the times |
| [21:01:51] | dekarl: | the xmltv provider interface is very explicit about that :) |
| [21:02:01] | sphery: | if they provide times before the switch in, say, DST and after in non-DST, then it works fine |
| [21:02:51] | dekarl: | but that's a very good example for things that the specific provider adapter (the xmltv grabber) is supposed to handle |
| [21:03:22] | sphery: | Anyway, it's a setting so that users can choose the right value for their particular grabber/provider. If you have some stats or whatever to support that things should be different, please provide them on the mailing list so that a decision can be made. We won't change the default "just because." :) |
| [21:04:04] | dekarl: | well, that would be "just because ... it's wrong" ;) |
| [21:04:08] | sphery: | and if XMLTV is changing/clarifying/improving things, then please mention it on the list so that those with a vested interest can make a decisoin |
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| [21:05:07] | sphery: | but, all the people in the past who though, "Well, Auto sounds smarter than None, so I'll just change the default" and then ended up with double-applied offsets won't agree that the current default is wrong. |
| [21:05:18] | dekarl: | ok, I got what I needed from here (confirmation that "None" is default) so I can post something to the lists, tanks. btw, #8217 has some fix for DST switchover in "Auto" setting |
| [21:06:10] | dekarl: | I'd rather target a "no setting needed" way. |
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| [21:07:29] | sphery: | the setting is primarily there for people who use listings from some other time zone--usually because they're on the edge of a zone |
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| [21:07:53] | sphery: | I was under the impression that the default worked properly for most people around the world. |
| [21:08:28] | stuartm: | we've had no complaints lately about the way it works, and I can't remember the way that it works since I've not looked at it in years |
| [21:08:45] | dekarl: | the default will work if TZ of guide source matches local TZ, so it's broken for everyone who live in a foreign country and wants to watch tv from home (other tz) and current location |
| [21:08:46] | stuartm: | uk_rt handles the BST transition just fine |
| [21:09:24] | dekarl: | in the example I'm looking at that's someone from RO living in NL (one hour off) |
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| [21:18:30] | tlhiv_laptop: | is there a command line utility (without actually running mythtv) that will allow me to "capture" video from my set top box to my PC via firewire? |
| [21:20:47] | iamlindoro: | wrong channel, see topic |
| [21:21:05] | iamlindoro: | Beirdo: Oooh, we can have an *actual* topictrout now! |
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| [21:24:24] | tlhiv_laptop: | sorry |
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