| Tuesday, August 6th, 2013, 00:08 UTC | ||
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| [06:56:22] | lux_2: | hi |
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| [10:17:23] | lux_2: | hi |
| [10:18:07] | lux_2: | is it possible to run mysqld+2 recordings+watching one recording on a single 5400rpm hdd? or will i run into problems because the hdd is too slow? |
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| [11:21:49] | sphery: | lux_2: it's possible, though you may have I/O issues that may result in playback glitches (very likely) and/or corruption of parts of the recordings |
| [11:22:47] | sphery: | especially if you use certain file system configurations, such as about any file system with barriers enabled |
| [11:23:44] | lux_2: | i'd use ntfs, because i can read this with windows |
| [11:24:37] | lux_2: | what would you recommend as the disk for linux+mysqld? seems it's impossible to get small hdds nowadays |
| [11:25:33] | lux_2: | wanted to get a hdd for linux+mysql but the smallest hdd with a reasonable price starts at 50–60€ :/ |
| [11:25:42] | lux_2: | (1.5tb) |
| [11:26:22] | lux_2: | and a hdd with 1.5tb for linux+mysql is way too large, what should i get for this? |
| [11:28:02] | MilkBoy_: | get an SSD? =) |
| [11:29:30] | lux_2: | MilkBoy_: the many write cycles of mysql might wear it out too quickly. plus they are quite expensive, a hdd would still be cheaper i guess |
| [11:30:17] | MilkBoy_: | true... |
| [11:33:22] | MilkBoy_: | running one backend on a Seagate Momentus 7200.4 500GB |
| [11:33:41] | MilkBoy_: | it can at least handle 3 recording + 1 watching |
| [11:33:52] | MilkBoy_: | and the database |
| [11:34:38] | MilkBoy_: | only tried SD recordings though... |
| [11:34:43] | lux_2: | but a 5400rpm drive can't handle it? |
| [11:38:56] | MilkBoy_: | no idea =/ |
| [11:39:22] | MilkBoy_: | probably depends a bit in the rest of the hardware (and file system).. |
| [11:47:28] | sphery: | lux_2: you can get a 1.5TB, then partition it... Have a partition for the root and mysql data and another for recordings, then use the recordings area as an "archive" Storage Group, so that MythTV never actively writes to the partition |
| [11:48:51] | lux_2: | sphery: what recordings are moved to archive storage group? and how do i set it up as archive? in mythtv-setup? |
| [11:49:34] | sphery: | lux_2: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/535888#535888 |
| [11:51:16] | sphery: | then just move recordings to the file system on that "archive" partition whenever your system isn't busy |
| [11:52:02] | sphery: | and feel free to ignore the partition when you aren't in need of its space |
| [11:53:36] | lux_2: | so i set a watch-but-dont-record group in mythtv and when the machine is idle i move recording files with "mv" to this folder? |
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| [11:53:56] | lux_2: | or can i do that within mythtv? |
| [11:55:32] | sphery: | you'd move with mv or some file manager or something |
| [11:55:47] | lux_2: | ok |
| [11:56:05] | lux_2: | or can i use mythexport to export old recordings to mythvideo? |
| [11:56:19] | sphery: | and, yeah, it's just a custom storage group with the directory on that file system and you don't put that directory into any other storage group and never specify that storage group in any recording rules |
| [11:56:33] | sphery: | so it will never record to the directory, but it will be able to play recordings from the directory without problem |
| [11:56:39] | lux_2: | can videos archived in mythvideo be accessed from the network(mythbackend) or do i have to share them with samba/nfs? |
| [11:57:05] | sphery: | you could move the recordings to mythvideo, too, and just have Videos Storage Group on that partition |
| [11:57:10] | lux_2: | sphery: how's that storage group called? |
| [11:57:46] | lux_2: | can mythvideo recordings be accessed via mythbackend->frontend or only via samba->frontend |
| [11:58:10] | sphery: | but that's more useful if you're going to keep the recording long term--i.e. not necessarily worth moving the recording to Videos, deleting it from Watch Recordings, getting metadata for the video, ... if you're just going to watch it in a couple days and delete it |
| [11:58:30] | sphery: | Video Library (formerly mythvideo) uses Storage Groups |
| [11:58:39] | sphery: | (at least in properly configured 0.26+) |
| [11:59:10] | sphery: | and you can call the storage group whatever you want |
| [11:59:26] | sphery: | Archive, Read-Only, Garbage, ... |
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| [12:03:28] | lux_2: | sphery: so i have to configure video storage group on mythtv-setup and mythtv frontend->watch videos will display them? |
| [12:04:20] | sphery: | yep, once you scan for changes |
| [12:04:46] | sphery: | and make sure you remove any "local" videos directories in mythfrontend setup under Videos |
| [12:05:42] | lux_2: | if i delete the livetv folder from storage groups, livetv will be saved in the recordings dir, right? |
| [12:06:42] | sphery: | in one of the directories in the Default Storage Group |
| [12:07:07] | sphery: | and, really, there's no good reason to have a Live TV Storage Group in 99.9999% of cases |
| [12:07:16] | lux_2: | ah yeah, default group |
| [12:07:45] | sphery: | and I'd say when someone needs a Live TV Storage Group, they have a bad system design |
| [12:08:03] | sphery: | I only have Default and DB Backups and the various Videos-related groups |
| [12:08:26] | sphery: | the only other one I'd even consider is an Archive-type group, like I mentioned |
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| [12:09:18] | lux_2: | i have a problem with mythvideo. it takes awfully long to open a video or skip forward when playing it |
| [12:10:06] | lux_2: | and when i exit a playing video mythfrontend crashes in 2/3 cases(windows) |
| [12:11:00] | sphery: | no idea what could cause that |
| [12:11:12] | sphery: | (the crashing) |
| [12:11:40] | lux_2: | is my network too slow(100mbit)? but that doesn't explain why it works fine in frontend recordings |
| [12:11:58] | sphery: | 100Mb should be fine, though gigabit can give slightly better performance |
| [12:12:23] | sphery: | not the difference between "aufully long" and not |
| [12:13:22] | lux_2: | it's also very slow when accessing the recordings via samba |
| [12:13:51] | awalls: | Netbios name lookup problem? |
| [12:13:52] | sphery: | yeah, SMB/CIFS isn't ideal (but if you're going to use one, make sure you use CIFS) |
| [12:13:58] | sphery: | could be something like that |
| [12:14:36] | awalls: | I know linux smb clients will try DNS along with Netbios name look-ups. DNS timeouts are long. |
| [12:14:47] | lux_2: | what's netbios? i'm accessing the samba share from windows |
| [12:15:32] | awalls: | Ancient services and protocols SMB/CIFS relies upon for name resolution. |
| [12:15:53] | awalls: | Run wireshare on your network and you'll see. |
| [12:16:03] | awalls: | *wireshark |
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| [12:16:43] | awalls: | But it might have nothing to do with your current problem. |
| [12:16:56] | awalls: | Just a guess from a random person on IRC. :) |
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| [12:18:06] | lux_2: | yeah that smb problem doesn't explain why it's slow in mythvideo too. or does mythvideo use samba components? |
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| [12:21:11] | esperegu: | Hi. I would like to run to instances of mythfrontend on a pc. Is it possible to dedicate a control device (wireless mouse/remote) to each of the instances somehow? |
| [12:22:23] | esperegu: | I just started two instances on my destop by starting mythfrontend.real by 2 different users (with different hostname in config.xml) and pointing one to the monitor 0 and the other to 1. |
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| [12:36:21] | AndyCap: | esperegu: depending on your graphics card I guess you could run two X servers |
| [12:38:15] | esperegu: | AndyCap: I read everywhere that you cannot run two X servers on one graphics card? |
| [12:38:53] | esperegu: | (I am the standard integrated GPU of an intel cpu by the way) |
| [12:39:05] | lux_2: | sphery: on the machine of the backend mythvideo works fine. weird, i wonder what causes the issues on windows :/ |
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| [12:51:17] | sphery: | lux_2: sounds like you've improperly configured Video Library |
| [12:51:35] | sphery: | and it's always scanning the file systems for new stuff? |
| [12:52:12] | lux_2: | nope, it hasn't scanned at all |
| [12:52:15] | sphery: | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/519758#519758 |
| [12:52:51] | sphery: | specifically "Browse Library" versus "Browse Filesystem" |
| [12:53:11] | sphery: | if that's not it, it's an SMB/CIFS misconfiguration (i.e. outside MythTV) |
| [12:53:30] | sphery: | so, you'd want to first look at things like name resolution, as awalls mentioned |
| [12:53:35] | lux_2: | what does mythvideo have to do with samba? |
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| [12:54:34] | lux_2: | and awalls talked about linux samba clients having problems, but i use a windows client |
| [12:55:08] | awalls: | Right, but if something about your samba set up isn't making Windows happy, you could get long delays |
| [12:55:23] | awalls: | as name look ups fail and time out. |
| [12:55:45] | awalls: | Easiest way to get a fell for network problems is to run wireshark on you bakcend. |
| [12:55:51] | lux_2: | what should i search for? "samba name look ups time out"? |
| [12:55:52] | awalls: | *feel |
| [12:56:10] | lux_2: | ok i'll install wireshark |
| [12:56:27] | awalls: | The way I would run the experiment: |
| [12:56:55] | awalls: | 1. get the network traffic as "quiet" as possible: ie. not doing a lot of stuff on the network |
| [12:57:16] | awalls: | 2. fire up wireshark or tcpdump on the backend |
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| [12:57:41] | awalls: | 3. Start the client application (mythvideo?) on the machine that is having the problem. |
| [12:58:13] | awalls: | 4. After problem symptoms have run their course, stop wireshark capture |
| [12:58:26] | awalls: | 5. Analyze what went on on the network. |
| [12:59:43] | awalls: | Look for long delays between timestamps in packet exchanges between server and client. |
| [13:00:36] | awalls: | Wireshark color codes DNS look-ups in light cyan, Netbios name lookups in bright yellow. |
| [13:01:05] | awalls: | Aborted TCP connections are color coded red on black. |
| [13:01:08] | awalls: | etc. |
| [13:01:35] | sphery: | fwiw, Video Library (and MythTV in general) don't use any SMB/CIFS stuff... However, if you have SMB/CIFS-mounted file systems in MythTV storage groups, when MythTV accesses those directories, you're using SMB/CIFS |
| [13:01:44] | awalls: | yup. |
| [13:02:13] | sphery: | lux_2: and, even though Video Library uses Storage Groups, MythTV will /always/ choose to read a "local" copy of the file if it's available |
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| [13:02:27] | awalls: | sphery: Does MyhtTV do UPnP stuff as well? |
| [13:03:14] | sphery: | so, for example, if you have the file on a file system on your master backend system, *and* you CIFS-mount the same file system in the same location on a remote frontend, Video Library will play the video without using MythTV streaming--meaning it will use the CIFS mounted file system |
| [13:03:24] | sphery: | it has some upnp stuff in it |
| [13:04:28] | lux_2: | awalls: i have quite a few aborted tcp connections here |
| [13:05:57] | lux_2: | source port: microsoft-ds(445) dest port 35232 <- is that samba? |
| [13:06:05] | awalls: | lux_2: That can happen when the other end doesn't respond quickly enough, or when the other end forcible closes the tcp connection without waiting |
| [13:06:19] | awalls: | 445 is netbios ns, IIRC |
| [13:06:25] | awalls: | nameservice |
| [13:06:42] | awalls: | no wait... |
| [13:06:43] | lux_2: | so not mythtv, ok |
| [13:06:47] | lux_2: | what? |
| [13:06:47] | ** awalls googles ** | |
| [13:08:33] | awalls: | "Direct hosted "NetBIOS-less" SMB traffic uses port 445 (TCP and UDP)." |
| [13:08:40] | awalls: | http://support.microsoft.com/kb/204279 |
| [13:09:07] | awalls: | TCP RSTs on port 445 probably indicate a samba misconfiguration |
| [13:11:03] | lux_2: | what could be wrong in my smb.conf? |
| [13:11:44] | awalls: | In wireshark, you can select a TCP packet and then select a "follow conversation" or "analyze" option on one of them menus to see the conversation. |
| [13:11:57] | awalls: | *the |
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| [13:12:34] | awalls: | Is there anything else with long query-response delays in the packet capture? |
| [13:12:45] | lux_2: | awalls: follow tcp stream? |
| [13:12:54] | awalls: | yeah. |
| [13:13:06] | awalls: | It makes it easy to look at the timestamps on that one stream IIRC. |
| [13:14:37] | lux_2: | can't see anything exceot the port445/35232 aborted tcp connections |
| [13:15:48] | awalls: | Is the machine on port 445 the samba server? |
| [13:16:35] | lux_2: | nope, port 445 is the windows client |
| [13:19:32] | awalls: | Hmm. I know for samba servers I have to open up these ports: 137/udp 138/udp 139/tcp 445/tcp |
| [13:21:07] | awalls: | Not sure why samba is trying to contact port 445 on the client. |
| [13:21:56] | awalls: | If you believe from looking at the packet capture, that SMB/CIFS problems are the reasons for your delays, then you're in the wrong IRC channel at this point. |
| [13:22:03] | awalls: | I'm no samba expert. |
| [13:22:26] | lux_2: | i don't really think samba is the issue |
| [13:22:50] | lux_2: | samba+mythvideo is slow over the network, so it's not just samba |
| [13:23:20] | lux_2: | and even on the backend seeking in videos is slower in mythvideo |
| [13:23:57] | lux_2: | as long as the recordings are in "watch recordings" it's fine but in mythvideo it's slow |
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| [13:31:39] | lux_2: | is it possible to view the full filename in mythvideo? i have trouble with files named $name-date-episode, i only see name-date or just name :/ |
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| [13:38:18] | sphery: | lux_2: seeking will be slower in Video Library (there's no mythvideo, anymore :) than in Watch Recordings if you don't create seek tables for your recordings |
| [13:38:27] | sphery: | er, videos, that you put in there |
| [13:39:05] | sphery: | lux_2: but if you have an SMB/CIFS mount on your frontend system that puts the Video Library videos in place, you're using SMB/CIFS |
| [13:39:43] | sphery: | lux_2: and, fwiw, to move recordings to Video Library, you'd want to use mythvidexport.py and not mythexport |
| [13:40:06] | sphery: | AIUI, mythexport is some *buntu provided transcoder thing |
| [13:40:31] | lux_2: | no i'm not using a smb mount on the frontend for video library. i only use the smb mount with samba |
| [13:41:28] | lux_2: | hum, mythexport might be interesting if it can encode to mp4/h264 |
| [13:41:46] | sphery: | no, transcoding shouldn't be interesting at all |
| [13:42:03] | sphery: | only reason to transcode is if you have some limited-capability device that needs some specific video format |
| [13:42:40] | sphery: | and for some reason, you want to watch your recordings on your 3.5" iphone screen instead of your 55" HDTV |
| [13:43:20] | sphery: | (don't transcode to "save space"--it's a waste, because space is cheap and the electricity you burn transcoding will likely cost more than the space savings) |
| [13:44:52] | sphery: | not to mention the fact that transcoding necessarily reduces the quality due to the decompress/recompress using lossy compression |
| [13:45:31] | lux_2: | encoding is pretty quick and produces good results with h264 i think. and seeking is faster in video library with mp4/h264 files |
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| [13:59:15] | sphery: | lux_2: seeking would be fast in video library with mpeg-2 and seek tables |
| [13:59:31] | sphery: | lux_2: and encoding H.264 is /very/ processor intensive |
| [13:59:52] | sphery: | decoding is less processor intensive, but still challenging for a CPU at high bitrate |
| [14:00:49] | sphery: | and decoding H.264 is /significantly/ more processor intensive than decoding "similar-quality" MPEG-2 |
| [14:01:11] | sphery: | (for a CPU, that is--not necessarily for a decidated decoder chip) |
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| [14:59:30] | lux_2: | if i define 2 directories in the default storage group, can i move files between these 2 dirs and mythtv still finds them? |
| [14:59:45] | lux_2: | for example if i record to directory a and then move the recording to directory b will mythtv find it? |
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| [15:10:50] | sphery: | lux_2: re-read that post I linked about the archive SG |
| [15:11:36] | sphery: | that's the whole basis for the idea... MythTV will look in every directory of every storage group (regardless of host) to find a file for playback |
| [15:12:22] | sphery: | the only meaning of the storage group in the recording's metadata is the storage group to which it was /originally/ recorded |
| [15:12:28] | sphery: | it has nothing to do with where it currently exists |
| [15:13:21] | sphery: | so, really, you can move recordings between directories within the same storage group (i.e. Default) or between directories in /different/ Storage Groups (from Default to Archive) without any problems |
| [15:14:09] | sphery: | the only requirement is that the original recording host must be able to see the recording after you move it (so you can't move it from a remote backend to a master backend if the remote backend can't access the master's directory--i.e. without NFS or CIFS mounts or whatever) |
| [15:15:49] | lux_2: | if i define 2 dirs in the default storage group, mythtv will by default record to the first one i specified, right? |
| [15:16:22] | lux_2: | (unless it's full or unavailable, then it jumps to the second dir) |
| [15:16:32] | sphery: | no, mythtv will choose a directory to use based on the Storage Group Disk Scheduler you've selected |
| [15:16:44] | sphery: | http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Storage_Groups + http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Storage_Groups#Sto . . . sk_Scheduler |
| [15:17:08] | sphery: | and there's a 4th implementation, now, Balanced Percent Free Space |
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| [15:18:31] | lux_2: | what's the default scheduler? |
| [15:19:31] | sphery: | a bad one |
| [15:19:40] | lux_2: | which one? |
| [15:19:44] | sphery: | IMHO, you should use either Combo or Balanced Disk I/O |
| [15:20:33] | lux_2: | i don't want balanced i/o, because i want 2 recordings going to the same disk, rather than 2 diskds |
| [15:20:37] | lux_2: | disks* |
| [15:20:50] | sphery: | I think Balanced Free Space is default |
| [15:20:58] | sphery: | that's bad because it causes bad fragmentation |
| [15:21:05] | sphery: | not to mention heavy seeking |
| [15:21:28] | sphery: | ideally, you'll use combo or balanced i/o and have at least 1 file systemer per concurrent recording |
| [15:21:30] | lux_2: | i rarely record 2 shows at once, once a day only, so i guess it's ok |
| [15:22:10] | sphery: | also, if you use autoexpire and have generally full file systems, Balanced *Free Space is a terrible choice |
| [15:22:33] | sphery: | because it could record 2 shows at 8pm, then start a new show at 9pm and expire one of the 8pm shows to make room |
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| [15:23:21] | lux_2: | but there's no other choice than balanced free space if i want it to record 2 shows to a single disk? |
| [15:25:04] | lux_2: | or should i use weighting then? |
| [15:25:45] | sphery: | if you don't want it to record to a disk, don't put any directories in any file systems on that disk into the storage group |
| [15:26:27] | sphery: | and, no, generally you shouldn't ever use weighting |
| [15:26:59] | lux_2: | ok then i think i'll put a second dir in there when i need it |
| [15:27:17] | sphery: | you can put the other dir in the Archive group if you like |
| [15:27:33] | sphery: | just don't put it in Default or any other SG you've specified in a recording rule if you don't want mythtv to record to it |
| [15:27:35] | lux_2: | thing is, i want to record to an external drive, but sometimes unplug it but still be able to record. that's when i need the internal disk for recording |
| [15:28:00] | sphery: | and there's no sense putting the directory into /any/ Storage Group if you don't want MythTV recording to it and you don't have any recordings inside it |
| [15:28:55] | sphery: | you're probably better off recording to a "proper" directory on a always on file system and then copying or moving recordings to the external drive later |
| [15:29:25] | sphery: | but if you do your SG's properly, MythTV will not use any unmounted file systems |
| [15:29:43] | lux_2: | the internal disk doesn't have enough space for recording often |
| [15:29:51] | sphery: | to make that work you must /never/ specify a file system's root directory in any directory list in any Storage Group |
| [15:30:22] | sphery: | i.e. if you mount your file system at /srv/mythtv/tv , then use /srv/mythtv/tv/recordings as the directory in the storage group |
| [15:30:45] | sphery: | that way, when you don't mount /srv/mythtv/tv , the directory /srv/mythtv/tv/recordings doesn't exist, so MythTV won't use it*** |
| [15:30:53] | lux_2: | can i mount it to /media/recordings/ and then symlink it from /mnt/recordings to /media/recordings/recordings ( i'll create a dir on the filesystem) |
| [15:31:02] | sphery: | *** assuming you're not using Balanced *Free Space Storage Group Disk Scheduler |
| [15:31:31] | lux_2: | ah ok i get it |
| [15:31:38] | sphery: | but if you put /srv/mythtv/tv into one of the Storage Group directory lists and you mount the file system at /srv/mythtv/tv, that directory /will/ exist, even when the file system isn't mounted |
| [15:31:46] | sphery: | but it will be a directory on the parent file system |
| [15:31:49] | lux_2: | so i should use /media/recordings/recordings/ as storage group dir |
| [15:32:09] | lux_2: | yeah |
| [15:32:12] | sphery: | you're better off putting the /media/recordings/recordings (or whatever) directly into the storage group, rather than using a symlink |
| [15:32:17] | sphery: | yeah |
| [15:33:08] | lux_2: | then i'll create on both disks a directory i point mythtv to and unmount the disks when i don't need/use them |
| [15:33:54] | lux_2: | can i continue using balanced free space? the balanced io won't be of benefit if i don't have 2 disks |
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| [15:39:59] | sphery: | don't use balanced *free space (either normal or percent) if you're going to have unmounted directories |
| [15:40:14] | sphery: | there's a bug where it will still try to write to the directory, which doesn't exist, so it will fail |
| [15:40:19] | sphery: | and you'll miss the recording |
| [15:40:55] | sphery: | the only way you can make it work with balanced *free space is if you /only/ put real directories that are always there in the Default SG (and others specified in recording rules) |
| [15:41:13] | sphery: | and only put the "sometimes there" directories into an Archive SG or something (that's never referenced from a recording rule) |
| [15:41:31] | sphery: | lux_2: ^^^ |
| [15:41:52] | sphery: | if you use combo or balanced i/o, it will work properly, even with missing dirs |
| [15:43:32] | lux_2: | ok thanks for the tip. then i think i'll use combo |
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| [15:46:44] | lux_2: | hum i can't find the storage group scheduler settings. it should the in setup->general right? what page is it? |
| [15:48:08] | lux_2: | ah ok i found it it's on page 3 |
| [15:48:44] | lux_2: | there's also balanced free space in percent, does that have the bug, too? |
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| [16:33:31] | sphery: | lux_2: yes, balanced free space and balanced percent free space both have the bug |
| [16:34:00] | sphery: | (I'm pretty sure, at least) |
| [16:34:17] | sphery: | but if you only have one directory in your Default SG, it makes no difference |
| [16:34:29] | sphery: | which one you select |
| [16:36:48] | lux_2: | yeah but i have 2 dirs and one goes away so i need a setting without the bug ( i selected combo) |
| [16:41:31] | lux_2: | i just read there once was a mythrename.pl script that altered recording names to something human-readable in the filesystem and database. what happened to it? |
| [16:43:34] | lux_2: | and is it possible to convert mythtv recordings to "standard" mpeg2 files that my tv can read and that i can burn to dvd(but mainly i want to be able to play them on my tv) is that possible without reencoding the entire recording? |
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| [16:48:42] | awalls: | A plain old MPEG-2 PS is slightly different than the MPEG-2 PS stream for a DVD, (The CX23416 and CX23418 chips can generate the DVD type stream if requested). |
| [16:49:19] | awalls: | IIRC dvdauthor is a util for converting MPEG-2 PS's into form suitable for DVD. |
| [16:49:45] | lux_2: | i want to be able to play recordings with my tv. how can i do that? |
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| [17:07:27] | sphery: | lux_2: mythlink.pl creates human-readable symlinks to the mythtv-generated file names... you can then copy to a file with the link's name |
| [17:07:55] | sphery: | lux_2: we don't support changing the names of recording files... if you want to control the file name, you need to move the recording to Video Library, which is the location for user-managed video |
| [17:09:19] | sphery: | and any recording MythTV creates using any useful capture device (DVB, ATSC, ivtv, or HD-PVR) will be "normal" MPEG... the only way you get not-normal is if you a) use a piece of junk framegrabber for capture (making MythTV actually encode it to MPEG-4 ASP in NuppelVideo container) or b) transcode it using mythtranscode (which you should never do) |
| [17:09:38] | sphery: | but normal MPEG isn't necessarily playable by your TV |
| [17:09:48] | lux_2: | i might want to plug the disk with the recordings to a windows machine and then i can't see the $name-$episode. links dont work on windows :/ |
| [17:10:21] | sphery: | and most TV's can only read drives formatted in stupid file systems (such as FAT32) with stupid file system limits (like no files > 4GB) that make it not very useful |
| [17:11:05] | sphery: | lux_2: again why you should let mythtv write to a real directory, and only use the external drive as a place to copy or move recordings for use elsewhere |
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| [17:11:29] | lux_2: | only the external hdd is large enough for my recordings |
| [17:12:04] | sphery: | you can record to a real directory, then use mythlink.pl to create links, then use rsync -av --copy-links to copy the recording to the external drive with a useful name |
| [17:12:28] | lux_2: | i thought mythtv puts everything in a nuppelvideo container? if it's standard mpeg2 why can't my tv play it? |
| [17:12:56] | sphery: | because when you unplug the external drive, all recordings will go to the internal storage, and it will expire recordings from that file system, meaning you could lose the show you just recorded before you watch it |
| [17:13:26] | sphery: | if your tv can't play it it's because your TV manufacturer wanted to save about $1 – $6 on a license for MPEG-2 |
| [17:13:31] | sphery: | what capture device? |
| [17:13:36] | sphery: | type |
| [17:13:48] | lux_2: | hauppauge nova-td |
| [17:13:51] | sphery: | (and note, I said, normal "MPEG", not "MPEG-2") |
| [17:14:14] | sphery: | for a nova-td, you're probably getting MPEG-4 AVC (H.264), assuming UK OTA DVB-T |
| [17:14:28] | lux_2: | i thought it doesn't work because my tv doesn't support nuppelvideo container |
| [17:14:46] | sphery: | so it's likely an MPEG-TS container with MPEG-4 AVC video inside |
| [17:14:57] | sphery: | mythtv only uses nuppelvideo if you do something stupid :) |
| [17:14:57] | lux_2: | afaik it's only mpeg2, the files are quite large |
| [17:15:10] | sphery: | i.e. use an analog framegrabber card |
| [17:15:14] | lux_2: | ah ok, then it's my tvs fault :/ |
| [17:15:15] | sphery: | or transcode using mythtranscode |
| [17:15:48] | sphery: | but note that some players can play MPEG video (MPEG-2 and/or MPEG-4) inside MPEG-PS containers and don't have support for MPEG-TS |
| [17:16:08] | sphery: | TS = transport stream = safe for unreliable transport (such as OTA broadcast or cable/satellite) |
| [17:16:22] | lux_2: | vlc says my recordings have the codec mpeg1/2 video (mpgv) |
| [17:16:29] | sphery: | PS = program stream = should only be used for reliable storage (i.e. hard drives or optical media) |
| [17:16:30] | lux_2: | guess mpeg2 then |
| [17:16:42] | sphery: | yeah, likely mpeg-2 |
| [17:16:57] | sphery: | and many devices choose not to pay the MPEG tax for MPEG-2 |
| [17:17:11] | sphery: | including Xbox 360 and many TVs (most I've seen) |
| [17:17:23] | lux_2: | but there's no tax for mpeg4? because my tv can play mpeg4 afaik |
| [17:18:05] | sphery: | AIUI, MPEG-4 requires licensing, but H.264 (the AVC variant of MPEG-4) can be decoded without paying a license |
| [17:18:16] | sphery: | because the MPEG consortium wanted to fight Free with free |
| [17:18:51] | sphery: | i.e. they didn't want Ogg Theora or VP-8 (aka Google's "patent-free" WebM video format) |
| [17:18:56] | lux_2: | ah ok alright, guess it only supports h264 then :( |
| [17:19:01] | sphery: | "patent-free" being their words, not mine |
| [17:19:09] | lux_2: | :) |
| [17:19:10] | sphery: | it's really only patent-uncontested |
| [17:19:37] | sphery: | though there has since been some contestation--and Google payed a bit to make WebM and one future version royalty free |
| [17:20:02] | sphery: | which means VP-8+2 (where they're actually testing VP-9 right now, the one future successor that's royalty free) will likely become someone else's problem |
| [17:20:08] | lux_2: | yeah i heard about that too i think |
| [17:20:22] | sphery: | i.e. if a vendor supports WebM, they'll end up paying a license fee to MPEG in the future |
| [17:20:47] | sphery: | anyway, device support for video formats tends to be spotty at best |
| [17:21:24] | sphery: | you're probably more likely to have good luck by running something like ps3mediaserver (which isn't limited to use with PS3) on a system and using it to play the videos with UPnP |
| [17:21:41] | sphery: | you could try the built-in-to-MythTV UPnP server, but it's, er, in need of TLC |
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| [17:22:01] | sphery: | or, even better, get a useful client that can take advantage of all the features of MythTV |
| [17:22:09] | sphery: | i.e. mythfrontend |
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| [17:22:14] | lux_2: | what's TLC? |
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| [17:22:34] | sphery: | if you're not using the features of MythTV, there's likely a /lot/ of other DVRs that are easier to set up/maintain/use |
| [17:22:39] | sphery: | TLC = tender loving care |
| [17:22:52] | lux_2: | i tried to access the builtin upnp server from my tv, but it doesn't support the videos :/ |
| [17:23:03] | sphery: | i.e. needs rewritten (or, better, ripped out and replaced with a standard UPnP library, such as Plantinum UPnP) |
| [17:23:09] | sphery: | yeah |
| [17:23:13] | sphery: | then use ps3mediaserver |
| [17:23:18] | sphery: | it will transcode to supported formats |
| [17:23:37] | lux_2: | ah ok, thanks for the tip. i hope it's in the ubuntu repos |
| [17:23:51] | sphery: | granted, that uses lots of CPU--and you have to have a fast enough processor to transcode in real time--but it will allow you to use the limited-capability player in the TV |
| [17:23:59] | sphery: | or just set up a nice mythfrontend :) |
| [17:24:05] | sphery: | anyway, gotta go |
| [17:24:08] | sphery: | good luck with your stuff |
| [17:24:26] | lux_2: | hum i need to find ps3mediaserver for ubuntu :/ |
| [17:24:33] | lux_2: | ok, thanks |
| [17:24:38] | sphery: | and note that even though it should work if you keep in mind what I've described, we don't really support taking file systems offline |
| [17:25:07] | sphery: | so things might fail if you add and remove the external file system during normal use |
| [17:25:26] | lux_2: | most of the time it'll be online, i think i'll take its storage away only rarely |
| [17:25:28] | sphery: | http://www.ps3mediaserver.org/ fwiw |
| [17:28:07] | mengo: | I have a question, I asked it yesterday but I don't know if someone replied while I was afk at work |
| [17:29:04] | mengo: | when I run a transcode on some dvb-t recordings it all works fine, other times it runs at a really low (1 or 2) fps and I think it crashes my server that runs mythbackend |
| [17:30:03] | mengo: | example, I just recorded a 4 part tv show on BBC1, episode 1 and 4 have re-encoded fine, but 2 and 3 seem to be a no go |
| [17:30:11] | sphery: | mengo: if you want to see if someone replied, check the irc logs at http://irc.mythtv.org/ircLog/ |
| [17:30:27] | mengo: | good point! thanks |
| [17:30:37] | sphery: | so, for example, you can click #mythtv-users , then click "Daily chat history" and then get the list |
| [17:30:44] | sphery: | and check what days you want |
| [17:30:52] | sphery: | but no one replied to you on that question |
| [17:30:54] | mengo: | I put my bnc in here but you guys spoke too much and filled the buffer ;-) |
| [17:31:01] | sphery: | the best answer is "don't ever use mythtranscode to transcode" |
| [17:31:12] | mengo: | what should I use? |
| [17:31:41] | sphery: | mythtranscode takes useful file formats (standards like MPEG) and outputs NuppelVideo, which no one else uses |
| [17:31:48] | mengo: | if its non dvb-t and it has no commercials I do sometimes use avidemux but when it is dvb-t or with ads m too lazy |
| [17:32:03] | sphery: | and it reduces quality, too |
| [17:32:12] | mengo: | I've not had that problem |
| [17:32:13] | sphery: | you can use mythtranscode for lossless cutting of MPEG-2 video |
| [17:32:21] | sphery: | but don't ever use it to transcode |
| [17:32:22] | trumee: | that fintek ir device is finally working. |
| [17:32:44] | sphery: | "it reduces quality" = /any/ transcoding--not just mythtranscode |
| [17:32:58] | mengo: | yup, for mpeg2 I use lossless and then re-encode with mencoder |
| [17:33:04] | sphery: | so, really, you should only use mythtranscode as a lossless mpeg-2 cutter |
| [17:33:11] | trumee: | which is good since it seems that it is the most popular chip for ir devices in china atm |
| [17:33:18] | sphery: | and any transcoding should be done with a real transcoder, such as handbrake or avidemux |
| [17:33:50] | sphery: | though the best bet is to never transcode (and don't waste time cutting, either, unless you're actually archiving it long term) |
| [17:34:00] | sphery: | and just take advantage of the cheap storage available today |
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| [17:34:32] | mengo: | well, this is for archiving and when I'm removing pre show and post show stuff |
| [17:34:41] | mengo: | and removing ads |
| [17:34:53] | sphery: | yeah, but for mythtv, you don't need to actually remove it--just use the editor to create a cut list |
| [17:35:31] | sphery: | anyway, mythtranscode--even the lossless cutter--needs some serious work to be reliable |
| [17:35:50] | mengo: | yup, I do that but then when I want to archive it off mythtv I need to export the video so I can re-encode it |
| [17:35:59] | sphery: | so, if it doesn't work on some videos, you're likely out of luck until someone decides to fix that particular issue with the code |
| [17:36:28] | mengo: | well, it seems to work on some videos from the same tv series fine, but not others |
| [17:36:36] | sphery: | meaning you'll have to either find something else to cut and/or transcode or fix mythtranscode's code yourself or just don't transcode |
| [17:37:01] | mengo: | I must admit, I found some info that may mean mythtranscode may not be at fault |
| [17:37:17] | sphery: | let's just say that real world video is an ugly mess of mostly-non-compliant-with-standards data, so how it fails/when it fails is very unpredictable |
| [17:37:53] | sphery: | and mythtranscode doesn't work in some situations that are standards compliant (such as changing resolution/fps/...) |
| [17:37:58] | mengo: | its a shame, for the most part it works really well for me, just a few issues here and there |
| [17:38:08] | sphery: | like I said, if it doesn't work, you'd have to use something else or don't transcode or fix it yourself |
| [17:38:18] | mengo: | well, these episodes all appear to be in the same resolution etc |
| [17:38:25] | mengo: | yup, I understand, thanks :) |
| [17:38:32] | sphery: | but on the bright side, with cheap storage, you shouldn't ever need to use it :) |
| [17:38:39] | sphery: | anyway, gotta go for real this time |
| [17:38:43] | sphery: | later and good luck |
| [17:39:09] | mengo: | well, cheap storage or not, I'm too lazy to keep all the stuff I don't want in my recordings, |
| [17:39:22] | mengo: | thanks, if I find a 'fix' I'll let people know, somehow ... |
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| [19:25:15] | Moeabm: | Im running 0.26 and am working on UPnP clients. I can see mythtv from VLC on the backend but no on network computers. however, I can see Mythtv from WMP on network computers. Anyone have ideas on why VLC cannot see the UPnP server on the same machine that sees it from WMP? |
| [19:28:56] | mengo: | sure, firewall options |
| [19:29:20] | mengo: | don't ask me which though, or whether it is on the client or server |
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| [19:30:17] | mengo: | reason why I say this, I have had a similar experience to that your experiencing |
| [19:31:30] | mengo: | I'm about to have my dinner, when I get back I can try and help figure out what ports etc to open |
| [19:32:37] | Moeabm: | ok. UPNP supposedly uses 1900 (UDP) and 2869 (TCP) but those ports are not blocked by my firewall |
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| [19:33:00] | mengo: | yup, I have just tried those 2 ports too but its something more ... |
| [19:33:27] | mengo: | not sure if its the route you may / may not need to add |
| [19:34:25] | Moeabm: | both machines are on same subnet. I dont think my proplem is a routing issue |
| [19:34:29] | mengo: | http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/UPnP << scroll down to trouble shooting |
| [19:34:51] | mengo: | I think its to do with the way upnp broadcasts to the network |
| [19:35:01] | mengo: | btw I'm no mythtv expert, just another user |
| [19:35:04] | mengo: | be back later |
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| [19:44:01] | Moeabm: | the more brains on it the faster we can figure it out :] |
| [19:44:32] | Moeabm: | 6544 seems to be the streaming port |
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| [20:00:59] | mengo: | back |
| [20:01:53] | mengo: | where does it appear in vlc? is it under upnp? I don't remember |
| [20:05:12] | mengo: | brb, going to reboot to windows |
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| [20:08:46] | mengoshmink: | right, lets see if I can make it appear |
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| [20:18:17] | Moeabm: | Playlist->Local Network->Universal Plug 'n Play |
| [20:18:45] | mengoshmink: | thanks, I wanted to make sure it didn't appear somewhere unexpectd |
| [20:21:01] | mengoshmink: | hmm, I'm not having much luck |
| [20:22:55] | Moeabm: | Me either. Ive done TCPDUMP and can see 1900 and 2869 ports opening to the remote client so I dont think its an issue with those ports specifically. |
| [20:23:39] | mengoshmink: | well, I have shut my mythbackend fw off, because I want to see it in windows, then slowly open ports to try and work out which ones are required |
| [20:24:09] | mengoshmink: | but mythtv is not appearing in the upnp playlist like it used to |
| [20:27:25] | Moeabm: | i added that route from the Wiki. Not sure what else to try from here |
| [20:27:46] | mengoshmink: | I had it working, I wish I remember what my setup was back then |
| [20:28:13] | mengoshmink: | I used it for an evening once, so I know it does work |
| [20:28:26] | mengoshmink: | admittedly its not very good but it did / does work |
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| [20:32:25] | Moeabm: | :/ yeah Im not sure how much time i have for this. I'm going to test some media streamers (live tv, ps3, etc.) and come back to this. Thanks for your help and ill post any progress i make. |
| [20:32:58] | mengoshmink: | well, there is sort of other ways, minidlna was one I used |
| [20:33:43] | mengoshmink: | thanks and good luck :) |
| [20:34:48] | mengoshmink: | ooooh got vlc displaying the upnp server on my router |
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