Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Wednesday, May 23rd, 2012, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:07]

wagnerrp:

its not like it has to be efficient, it just has to work

[00:00:15]

wagnerrp:

its not going to get run often

[00:02:27]

sphery:

wagnerrp: ok, wait, I'm confused, again

[00:02:58]

sphery:

trying to find where we have a map and where we have a bytearray

[00:03:16]

wagnerrp:

it gets parsed as a bytearray

[00:03:38]

wagnerrp:

it remains that way until QApplication has been init, and something requests that value

[00:03:54]

wagnerrp:

at which point it is converted, marked as converted, and passed to whatever wanted it

[00:06:30]

fryguy (fryguy!~fryguy@bryanalves-1-pt.tunnel.tserv4.nyc4.ipv6.he.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:07:08]

Squirrely:

ello all.

[00:08:09]

knightr (knightr!~knightr@mythtv/developer/knightr) has quit (Quit: Leaving)

[00:08:10]

Squirrely:

anyone experienced with the ceton pcie tv tuner and mythtv? I've seen some documentation on it on the wiki but it hasn't said if it's supported and if there are any limitations with it.

[00:08:47]

knightr (knightr!~knightr@mythtv/developer/knightr) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:08:53]

wagnerrp:

no, yes, can only access 'copy freely' channels

[00:09:05]

Squirrely:

as for example i know using a stb and firewire works in my area just fine...but that is only one tuner.

[00:09:30]

Squirrely:

does the copy freely flag depend what area you are in?

[00:09:59]

Squirrely:

and does it copy the mpeg2 ts stream directly like firewire?

[00:10:17]

wagnerrp:

you are capturing using firewire right now?

[00:10:29]

Squirrely:

well i used to. not anymore.

[00:10:45]

sphery:

wagnerrp: so *iter is the value in the map, meaning the = should change it... I say ask Beirdo

[00:10:54]

wagnerrp:

anything you could capture using firewire, you could capture using an infinitv

[00:11:05]

wagnerrp:

and it will be the raw data as it was with firewire

[00:11:08]

wagnerrp:

who is your provider?

[00:11:11]

Squirrely:

cox

[00:11:13]

sphery:

Squirrely: see, also, http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/CableCARD

[00:11:27]

Squirrely:

ooh thanks.

[00:11:34]

Squirrely:

yeah i'ma do some more reading here and there.

[00:11:57]

sphery:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Recording_Digital_ . . . leCard_Tuner , too

[00:12:02]

Squirrely:

it is only allowed to access those shows the tuner deems as DRM-free. << ah ha, must of skipped over that.

[00:15:27]

Squirrely:

yeah i have a DCX-3200M as a stb. set it up using ptp. i set it up a long while ago when i didn't really know what i was doing though, hah. But I do remember that I could get most channels (at least the ones i'm interested in)

[00:15:43]

gigem (gigem!~david@mythtv/developer/gigem) has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7)

[00:16:50]

Squirrely:

so is 5C and the drm copy freely flag one in the same? Well I know they aren't exactly the same but if one is not marked copy freely will it be 5C encrypted over firewire?

[00:17:03]

gigem (gigem!~david@pool-71-123-128-97.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:17:03]

gigem (gigem!~david@mythtv/developer/gigem) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:17:03]

gigem (gigem!~david@pool-71-123-128-97.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) has quit (Changing host)

[00:17:13]

wagnerrp:

more or less

[00:17:27]

wagnerrp:

5C is just something tacked on by the cable box over firewire

[00:17:43]

Squirrely:

mmmk

[00:17:45]

wagnerrp:

but triggered by the same things that would result in mythtv not being able to record from a cablecard tuner

[00:18:08]

wagnerrp:

in theory... it could be enabled all the time, arbitrarily, by the firmware

[00:18:18]

Squirrely:

are premium channels usually only marked non copy freely? (ie hbo)

[00:18:31]

wagnerrp:

depends on the provider

[00:18:41]

wagnerrp:

verizon and comcast, only the premiums are not copy-freely

[00:18:48]

Squirrely:

ahh makes sense.

[00:18:53]

wagnerrp:

time warner, near everything is copy protected

[00:19:09]

Squirrely:

do you cap via firewire or a cablecard tuner?

[00:19:09]

wagnerrp:

cox... not enough information to give a blanket statement

[00:19:27]

wagnerrp:

neither

[00:19:40]

Squirrely:

yeah, and i do not have a cablecard tuner or my firewire stb rig set up to test.

[00:20:11]

Squirrely:

ah :P

[00:21:16]

Squirrely:

what container type does mythtv throw a recording into from a cablecard tuner? or it just records the plain transport stream?

[00:21:46]

fryguy:

speaking of ceton cablecard, i'm thinking about building a backend node with one of those and a couple of frontends. what's reasonable frontend hardware nowadays that supports both 1080p x264 playback and live 720p playback from. ion?

[00:23:57]

wagnerrp:

nothing supports x264 playback

[00:24:25]

** sphery thinks you mean H.264 **

[00:24:30]

Squirrely:

h264 playback is a dfferent story though ;)

[00:24:33]

wagnerrp:

x264 is just an encoder

[00:24:55]

Squirrely:

x264 is just an amazing encoder*

[00:24:56]

Squirrely:

fixed

[00:25:05]

fryguy:

k, so h.264

[00:25:10]

wagnerrp:

the only place youre going to find 1080p h264 is either bluray, or stuff youve encoded yourself

[00:25:21]

wagnerrp:

or the rare publicly released video

[00:25:27]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: or stuff i've downloaded that's encoded

[00:25:39]

wagnerrp:

right, the rare publicly released video

[00:25:42]

sphery:

I'm not going to answer the "reasonable frontend hardware" question because my answer is unpopular

[00:25:52]

fryguy:

sphery: what's the answer

[00:25:56]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: sure, we'll go with that

[00:26:10]

fryguy:

anyone have hardware suggestions besides ion?

[00:26:16]

wagnerrp:

a real CPU

[00:26:22]

sphery:

for me, it's "a real computer, like a core i or Athlon II, coupled with an nvidia video card that supports vdpau"

[00:26:31]

sphery:

i.e. not a toy, like an atom

[00:26:46]

fryguy:

is > atom actually necessary for just playback if i'm getting vdpau from ion though?

[00:27:14]

sphery:

wagnerrp has/had? a nice core i3-based low-power-usage-at-idle-but-plenty-of-head-room system spec'ed out

[00:27:57]

sphery:

vdpau is necessary if you have a toy (Atom) instead of a CPU, because it means you won't/can't use the CPU for anything useful

[00:27:58]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: its nice to have a real cpu in the event you ever want to do something that cannot be handled by the hardware ASIC

[00:28:10]

sphery:

so, it's kind of the opposite of the way you put it

[00:28:11]

fryguy:

the main concern here is upfront cost of the frontends, and power usage. I don't mind spending to get a beefy backend box, and I have plenty of centralized storage available. i'm just trying to get as efficient as possible for the frontends

[00:28:35]

sphery:

remember that Atom is /not/ power efficient

[00:28:40]

sphery:

Atom is power-constrained

[00:29:06]

sphery:

it has no appreciable idle power savings, either, so it's using almost the same power whether busy or idling

[00:29:35]

sphery:

whereas you can make a nice Core i3 system that idles at less than Atom power usage, but still has headroom to process, when required

[00:29:51]

sphery:

hard part, now, though is getting one with nvidia graphics, since nvidia got out of the x86 chipset business

[00:30:01]

wagnerrp:

https://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWish . . . ber=22474747

[00:30:20]

sphery:

FWIW, this is my manifesto: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/448321#448321

[00:30:24]

fryguy:

sphery: wouldn't have a problem just adding an nvidia card to an existing box. mini-itx isn't a requirement

[00:30:42]

wagnerrp:

https://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWish . . . ber=18671552

[00:30:45]

sphery:

most important in that link I gave is the links to "See, also, these (old) articles"

[00:31:00]

sphery:

which show how to build systems that are more power efficient than atom

[00:31:01]

wagnerrp:

actually, that first one would never work... CPU and board were incompatible

[00:32:00]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: the general issue is that you may know exactly what you want right now, and you may know that everything will absolutely be covered by VDPAU

[00:32:10]

wagnerrp:

but five minutes from now, you want to try out something that isnt, and youre screwed

[00:32:16]

fryguy:

what about full remote control (including from fully powered off). I don't actually need a remote, i'll be using a harmony 1

[00:32:29]

wagnerrp:

if you buy an atom, either you go without, or you replace the hardware

[00:32:32]

sphery:

and, in truth, atom-based systems /are/ slow in the mythfrontend UI

[00:33:06]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: any examples of such things?

[00:33:16]

wagnerrp:

anything flash

[00:33:23]

wagnerrp:

recordings with errors

[00:33:28]

sphery:

including Hulu, Amazon Instant, ...

[00:33:36]

sphery:

seeking in normal recordings

[00:33:41]

wagnerrp:

video encoded with unsupported parameters

[00:33:58]

sphery:

displaying images in the UI (including lots of preview images in watch recordings or whatever)

[00:34:03]

fryguy:

ok

[00:34:10]

fryguy:

so i3 it is then

[00:34:49]

sphery:

but you'll get lots of "it's perfect" from those who spent money on ION boxes--mainly because they've learned to settle/decided to settle so they don't have to admit that ION isn't perfect :)

[00:34:57]

fryguy:

what about IR options? I'd like to be able to fully control the box from a logitech harmony

[00:35:06]

fryguy:

including powering on from full-off

[00:35:28]

sphery:

at this point, it's possible that the Sandy Bridge processors may be easier to come by/cheaper than low-power i3

[00:35:41]

fryguy:

which i'm assuming means I can't really do USB dongles for IR

[00:35:51]

sphery:

I don't have any recent Intel on processors :)

[00:36:18]

sphery:

I /think/ some mobos have "wake on usb" support, but I've never tried to get it working

[00:36:44]

sphery:

I know some people have figured out ways to wake their systems with their remotes, but not sure how

[00:37:04]

fryguy:

i _COULD_ live with having to manually power it on for the few times it wouldn't be in suspend mode, but it HAS to be at least wakeable from suspend with the remote

[00:37:17]

sphery:

and, btw, good man--the fact that you're saying this implies you'll be shutting the system down when not in use, which is the right thing for anyone to do if they're serious about power savings

[00:37:39]

sphery:

yeah, it's quite possible that the ones who are doing it are using wake from suspend

[00:37:55]

sphery:

there were some posts on mythtv-users list, and I'm sure there are some in here that have done it

[00:38:05]

fryguy:

I guess after it's up and running, it'll just go in and out of suspend whenever I want

[00:38:14]

sphery:

if you want to search the lists: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/

[00:38:16]

wagnerrp:

sphery: you ever see any of that wiki nonsense about the guy wanting to run a local BOINC server as an alternate jobqueue for some clustered video encoding scheme?

[00:38:26]

sphery:

wagnerrp: hehe, only saw your mention of it

[00:39:17]

sphery:

definitely far more work than I'd go to (especially when I'm not a fan of transcoding at all :)

[00:39:25]

fryguy:

how much horsepower do I need for a backend node? the backend node will just be doing livetv stuff with the ceton cablecard tuner.

[00:40:08]

wagnerrp:

the power you need in your backend depends entirely on the scheduler

[00:40:21]

fryguy:

actually starting to wonder if maybe it just makes more sense to put a ceton card into each frontend (i'll have 2, MAYBE 3), instead of building a backend

[00:40:25]

sphery:

and on how much transcoding and commercial detection you do, and how fast you want them to complete

[00:40:39]

wagnerrp:

which in turn depends on how many channels worth of guide data you have, how many recording rules you have querying them, and how many tuners you have to schedule on

[00:40:52]

wagnerrp:

general rule of thumb, and standard desktop dual core will suffice

[00:40:55]

sphery:

and how much recording history you have

[00:41:05]

sphery:

agreed

[00:41:05]

wagnerrp:

avoid Atoms (as always), and dont even consider ARMs

[00:41:06]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: so again, probably fine with an i3?

[00:41:11]

sphery:

dual core desktop = good

[00:41:20]

wagnerrp:

easily sufficient

[00:42:15]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:42:31]

fryguy:

4 tuners, like 100ish hd channels, commercial detection don't really care about much speed wise, probably recording like, do want to be able to quickly rewind/etc on livetv streams

[00:42:51]

fryguy:

would it make more sense to just build i3 boxes and put the ceton card in them instead of building another backend?

[00:43:11]

fryguy:

since i'm going to have legit hardware in the frontends for it anyway?

[00:44:37]

wagnerrp:

you need space for tuner cards and hard drives in your backend(s)

[00:44:45]

fryguy:

hard drives will be over nfs

[00:44:51]

wagnerrp:

if youre sticking these things next to TVs, you probably wont want to do that

[00:45:11]

wagnerrp:

if youre sticking these things in other rooms, or basements, or attics, or whatever... and running cables through the walls, thats not a problem

[00:45:23]

fryguy:

so i just need room for the tuner card, which shouldn't be a big deal with micro-atx

[00:45:26]

sphery:

main reasons to have dedicated backends: a) to put tons of storage/HDDs out of the way in some non-viewing room (which you can still do with it in a frontend by running cables through/around walls to the TV/speaker/remote receiver), b) having space for tuner cards, c) being able to do what you want with/on the frontend boxes without ever affecting recording (including power off, reboot, use as a desktop, ...)

[00:45:44]

wagnerrp:

you have an existing NFS server? why not just shove the tuner cards in there and make that your backend?

[00:45:53]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: the nfs server is running freebsd :(

[00:46:00]

wagnerrp:

so?

[00:46:08]

sphery:

FWIW, I highly recommend micro-atx and putting the box in a different room/closet/cabinet and running cables through the wall or whatever

[00:46:12]

fryguy:

ceton doesn't have drivers for freebsd to my knowledge

[00:46:33]

wagnerrp:

AIUI, its using a generic network card protocol

[00:46:41]

sphery:

saves you tons of money over trying to design for "small, pretty, and quiet" and you get benefits for cooling and such

[00:46:42]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:46:48]

wagnerrp:

or maybe thats just the DCR-2650

[00:47:07]

wagnerrp:

well you can always get an HDHomeRun Prime

[00:47:12]

wagnerrp:

three tuners rather than four

[00:47:16]

wagnerrp:

and will work just fine on freebsd

[00:47:35]

fryguy:

hrmm

[00:48:45]

fryguy:

so, homerun prime in freebsd server, run myth backend there, and then just do frontends. so i only have to buy like one piece of hardware to prove the concept, the ceton card

[00:48:46]

wagnerrp:

anyway, all the cablecard tuners are nothing more than network devices

[00:48:54]

tank-man (tank-man!1000@S010600121729c6a1.vc.shawcable.net) has quit (Quit: :q!)

[00:49:21]

fryguy:

and then i could build a cheap frontend, and a better frontend (one of these is going ot be going in a bedroom and it clearly won't have any use other than as a TV tuner

[00:50:32]

wagnerrp:

it might be worth contacting them

[00:50:43]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: any resources for people running homeruns on freebsd?

[00:50:53]

wagnerrp:

a look at this driver tarball seems to indicate its more for implementing the communications protocol than the network interface itself

[00:51:05]

wagnerrp:

none needed... it "just works"

[00:51:25]

wagnerrp:

its a network device, so whether youre using it on freebsd, or linux, or osx... it works exactly the same

[00:51:27]

fryguy:

really? doesn't need drivers or anything?

[00:51:41]

wagnerrp:

mythtv natively supports the communications protocol

[00:51:54]

wagnerrp:

its like how you dont need http drivers to run a web browser

[00:52:06]

wagnerrp:

just network access

[00:52:38]

sphery:

So, yesterday, AMC Entertainment, Inc announced that they're selling AMC's 5,048 screens in 347 theaters in the US and Canada to the Chinese conblomerate, Dalian Wanda Group.

[00:52:55]

sphery:

rumor has it you'll now be able to movies at AMC theaters weeks before they're released

[00:53:09]

mersault (mersault!~mersault@home.nullpointer.ca) has joined #mythtv-users

[00:53:12]

sphery:

(bad joke from Tonight Show with Jay Leno)

[00:53:55]

wagnerrp:

im more of a Showcase man myself

[00:54:06]

wagnerrp:

or whatever that brand is

[00:54:18]

sphery:

I like the Rave Theaters--mainly because there's one less than a mile from home :)

[00:54:42]

wagnerrp:

well this is like 10 miles from home (the AMC one is much closer)

[00:54:44]

wagnerrp:

but its free

[00:54:54]

sphery:

seems Showcase is a National Amusements brand

[00:55:01]

sphery:

cool

[00:55:15]

wagnerrp:

and I AM able to view movies weeks before they're released

[00:55:19]

sphery:

is that some school-related thing? or how exactly is it free?

[00:55:27]

gregL (gregL!~greg@cpe-74-76-125-87.nycap.res.rr.com) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[00:55:43]

wagnerrp:

college friends with one of the managers

[00:55:57]

sphery:

hehe

[00:56:11]

wagnerrp:

whenever they splice together a real, someone has got to watch it to check for errors

[00:56:17]

sphery:

ah, nice

[00:56:28]

sphery:

will be bad when they go all digital

[00:56:32]

wagnerrp:

for unknown reasons, that includes digital reals

[00:56:35]

wagnerrp:

reels

[00:56:37]

sphery:

really?

[00:56:38]

sphery:

wow

[00:56:54]

wagnerrp:

well, likely just because they can, i never asked

[00:56:56]

sphery:

I still remember going to a movie that melted in the projector

[00:57:01]

wagnerrp:

although they put restrictions on those things

[00:57:04]

sphery:

pretty sure that one wasn't digital

[00:57:14]

wagnerrp:

the decryption keys are only good for a certain time frame

[00:57:44]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: still trying to determine how a cablecard tuner runs without any drivers at all

[00:57:45]

wagnerrp:

they might get the movie (comes on a hard drive in a hotswap caddy) weeks ahead of time

[00:57:56]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: its a network card

[00:58:07]

wagnerrp:

theyre all nothing more than network cards

[00:58:13]

wagnerrp:

and mythtv accesses them over the network

[00:58:25]

sphery:

http://www.silicondust.com/products/hdhomerun/prime/ being the easiest to picture example of network card

[00:58:38]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: the network card in my box right now has a driver for it, why doesn't this need a driver for it

[00:58:41]

sphery:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Silicondust_HDHomeRun_Prime

[00:59:04]

sphery:

if you use HDHR Prime, the driver /is/ the driver for your NIC

[00:59:06]

wagnerrp:

the USB and PCIe devices are network cards, with an internal network, connected to a SoC running linux that runs the actual tuner

[00:59:39]

fryguy:

so why are linux drivers provided

[00:59:41]

fryguy:

what do they do

[00:59:57]

wagnerrp:

presumably network drivers

[01:00:07]

fryguy:

wouldn't I need those for freebsd

[01:00:14]

wagnerrp:

although there is some amount of video specific stuff in there

[01:00:16]

wagnerrp:

which is odd

[01:00:42]

wagnerrp:

the DCR-2650 (HDHR Prime over USB) is a generic USB network interface device

[01:00:59]

wagnerrp:

it needs no drivers, as the drivers already ship with linux

[01:01:04]

tank-man (tank-man!john@S010600121729c6a1.vc.shawcable.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:01:10]

wagnerrp:

the infinitv USB may operate in the same manner

[01:01:15]

wagnerrp:

i dont know about the infinitv PCIe

[01:01:37]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[01:02:18]

fryguy:

might just get a homerun then

[01:03:14]

fryguy:

it's only a few dollars more

[01:03:25]

wagnerrp:

and one less tuner

[01:03:36]

wagnerrp:

only three, rather than four

[01:03:43]

fryguy:

yah that's not an issue

[01:03:52]

fryguy:

if it WERE an issue, could I buy a second one and get 6 tuners?

[01:04:11]

wagnerrp:

or theres a rackmount unit that basically does exactly that

[01:04:18]

wagnerrp:

two units in a frame with a shared power supply

[01:04:33]

fryguy:

i'll just start with 3 tuners, it's unlikely i'll need more than that

[01:05:01]

fryguy:

and my NFS server is plenty beefy for this, so i won't have to upgrade hardware I hope (6-core AMD with 16gb of ram)

[01:05:08]

wagnerrp:

usually cable content gets replayed several times, and you can pick up repeats

[01:05:19]

wagnerrp:

the only trouble is network tv

[01:05:28]

fryguy:

i have other sources for recorded content if I need to

[01:05:32]

wagnerrp:

but if that becomes a problem, you can always pick up a cheaper clearqam tuner

[01:05:39]

fryguy:

i'm much more concerned about watching livetv than recording

[01:05:41]

wagnerrp:

or just prop up an antenna

[01:05:56]

wagnerrp:

mythtv is generally the opposite

[01:06:14]

wagnerrp:

record it when available, watch later at your leisure

[01:06:45]

fryguy:

is mythtv smart enough to determine which tuner to use in cases of conflict when some tuners get some channels (OTA HD) and other tuners get more channels?

[01:07:17]

wagnerrp:

if configured properly, it will attempt to reschedule to record as much as possible

[01:07:32]

fryguy:

what about while watching?

[01:07:37]

fryguy:

live

[01:08:14]

wagnerrp:

if a recording needs a tuner in use by livetv, it will ask the user for it with an onscreen prompt

[01:08:18]

fryguy:

like, let's take an example where I have 1 cablecard tuner, and 1 OTA tuner. I am watching ABC on box 1, and all of a sudden somebody turns on box 2 and wants to watch ESPN. Will the backend know how to switch tuners to support something like this?

[01:08:40]

fryguy:

or can I just switch tuners on the frontend?

[01:08:57]

wagnerrp:

no, you would have to manually switch tuners on the frontend using it

[01:09:04]

wagnerrp:

one livetv instance cannot preempt another

[01:09:30]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: but you CAN switch it on the frontend right?

[01:09:43]

wagnerrp:

yes

[01:09:46]

fryguy:

k

[01:10:24]

fryguy:

do you happen to know if the hd homerun functions at all without a cablecard in it?

[01:10:31]

fryguy:

like, will still tune clearqam or anything

[01:10:40]

fryguy:

(would like to prove the concept before renting stuff from provider)

[01:11:58]

gregL (gregL!~greg@cpe-74-76-125-87.nycap.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:12:15]

fryguy:

nevermind, googling is finding some posts by you that answer this :)

[01:14:10]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: do you yourself have a homerun connected to a freebsd box?

[01:19:17]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:19:17]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:19:17]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:19:17]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:19:17]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:19:18]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:21:22]

dekarl_zZz (dekarl_zZz!~dekarl@p4FE85369.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)

[01:21:27]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:21:27]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:21:28]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:21:28]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:21:28]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:21:28]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:25:15]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:25:15]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:25:15]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:25:15]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:25:16]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:25:16]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has quit (*.net *.split)

[01:26:37]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:29:35]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: yes, just a standard unit, not a prime

[01:30:27]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:30:27]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:30:27]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:30:28]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:30:28]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:30:28]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:31:36]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: so, does it show up as a network device in ifconfig?

[01:31:50]

wagnerrp:

why would it?

[01:32:40]

wagnerrp:

its a server that sits off on my network

[01:32:59]

Gumby (Gumby!~gumby@unaffiliated/gumby) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:33:16]

wagnerrp:

i was saying the DCR-2650, USB version of the HDHR Prime, operates using a generic USB network device profile that can function without special drivers

[01:33:52]

wagnerrp:

but when the HDHR is already on the network, there is no reason for it to appear as a network device

[01:33:59]

wagnerrp:

as it is not directly connected to the machine

[01:35:19]

Gumby:

hi all, is there a way to figure out why a recording was deleted? I came home today and a bunch of my recordings are gone. I see in mythbackend.log that autoexpire.cpp was called but I am trying to figure out why as I hadnt watched the program yet nor had I deleted it via mythweb

[01:38:57]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: ugh, i'm an idiot. I assumed the homerun was the same connectivity as the ceton. So it (can) function as a standalone box, and I can just plug ethernet into my router and I'm done?

[01:39:11]

wagnerrp:

yes

[01:39:31]

wagnerrp:

well.. you would want to plug it into a switch, not a router

[01:39:38]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: well, yah

[01:39:40]

wagnerrp:

it needs to be on the same network for autodetection to function

[01:39:52]

fryguy:

yah, i know networking, that part isn't a problem

[01:40:13]

fryguy:

i thought it connected only via usb, like the ceton did, which is why i was getting confused about what you were talking about before

[01:40:30]

wagnerrp:

the DCR-2650 is a 2-tuner USB version of the Prime

[01:40:52]

fryguy:

this seems like a MUCH better choice for me if I plan on actually using freebsd as the backend

[01:41:45]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: are you just using the mythtv port, or did you end up compiling yourself?

[01:42:15]

wagnerrp:

ive always compiled myself

[01:42:27]

wagnerrp:

technically, using the port is compiling yourself too

[01:42:44]

fryguy:

yah, but you know what i mean

[01:42:48]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@220-245-190-74.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:42:48]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:42:48]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@220-245-190-74.static.tpgi.com.au) has quit (Changing host)

[01:42:54]

fryguy:

is the port very out of date or missing anything notable?

[01:43:30]

wagnerrp:

really dont know much about it

[01:43:44]

wagnerrp:

!seen decke

[01:43:44]

MythLogBot:

decke was last seen 555 days 5 hours 24 minutes 9 seconds ago

[01:43:51]

wagnerrp:

he would know more

[01:44:46]

fryguy:

well, i'm definitely happy i ended up here and asked some questions. This made my path a lot more straightforward. being able to reuse my fileserver is a big win

[01:47:22]

fryguy:

next stupid question. Can i do anything with an xbox360 in any of my proposed setups?

[01:47:33]

mycosys:

hey guys :) wondering what the status of VAAPI is, is it working well? what does it work well with under myth?

[01:48:44]

wagnerrp:

for the most part, it works wellish with a bunch of hardware that doesnt need VAAPI anyway

[01:48:51]

wagnerrp:

meaning i3s and i5s

[01:49:00]

mycosys:

x4500HD?

[01:49:20]

mycosys:

(which doesnt need it either lol)

[01:49:21]

wagnerrp:

should support it, dont know if anyone is actually using it

[01:49:33]

wagnerrp:

but yeah... thats a higher end Core2 in that board

[01:49:43]

[R] ([R]!~rbox@unaffiliated/rbox) has joined #mythtv-users

[01:49:45]

mycosys:

not necessarily

[01:50:01]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: mythtv supports streaming its recordings over UPnP, in the format they were recorded in

[01:50:12]

wagnerrp:

its up to the device whether or not it can use that

[01:50:25]

wagnerrp:

specifically, MPEG2 video, AC3 audio, in a TS container

[01:50:26]

mycosys:

was thinkin about popping an e5400 onto the g45 board

[01:50:45]

mycosys:

which technically isnt even a core2 lol

[01:51:10]

mycosys:

prettly lil dell studio slim

[01:51:29]

wagnerrp:

its not?

[01:51:38]

mycosys:

pentium technically

[01:51:54]

mycosys:

tho is just marketing

[01:52:20]

wagnerrp:

its second gen Core2

[01:52:41]

wagnerrp:

just with slightly less memory

[01:52:48]

mycosys:

it uses the same architecture

[01:53:07]

wagnerrp:

its a Core2 in all but name

[01:53:08]

mycosys:

as i said – technically they sold it as a pentium

[01:53:20]

mycosys:

hence 'technically'

[01:54:14]

mycosys:

really – the main q was for the i5, fater in law wants to use it, tho i have told him a lot there is no real reason to

[01:54:32]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: how important is ram on frontends?

[01:54:40]

mycosys:

not

[01:54:47]

mycosys:

they need stuff all

[01:54:53]

fryguy:

i'm probably going to just go with 4gb+ anyway since ram is cheap as hell, but curious

[01:54:55]

wagnerrp:

fryguy: not at all... considering its pointless to build any system these days with less than 4GB

[01:55:19]

wagnerrp:

~1GB is a recommended minimum

[02:03:00]

dekarl (dekarl!~dekarl@p4FCEFE37.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:06:24]

NightMonkey (NightMonkey!~NightrMon@pdpc/supporter/professional/nightmonkey) has quit (Quit: Body blow! Body blow!)

[02:14:10]

fryguy:

wagnerrp: hrmm, do you think the 2650 is a better deal than the homerun prime?

[02:21:43]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[02:22:19]

kmcorbett (kmcorbett!~kmcorbett@173-9-35-41-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:34:30]

kmcorbett (kmcorbett!~kmcorbett@173-9-35-41-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has quit (Quit: Quit)

[02:36:55]

tlhiv_laptop (tlhiv_laptop!~foo@c-69-254-218-89.hsd1.al.comcast.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)

[02:38:04]

SmallR2002:

does it take a while for files to get deleted via myth?

[02:40:34]

[R]:

what version

[02:40:54]

SmallR2002:

0.25

[02:41:20]

SmallR2002:

i just deleted a bunch of stuff but don't see a change on df -H

[02:41:23]

[R]:

in 0.25, when you hit delete, it moves it to the deleted group

[02:41:31]

[R]:

and after a few minutes (configurable i berlive), it actually deltes it

[02:41:42]

SmallR2002:

oh, ok

[02:41:59]

SmallR2002:

doesn't bother me much, just trying to free up some space

[02:42:51]

SmallR2002:

trying to put off buying another hdd to add to the raid

[02:49:50]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:49:51]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:49:51]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:49:51]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:49:51]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:49:51]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has quit (*.net *.split)

[02:52:46]

ikevin (ikevin!~kevin@2a01:240:fe76:1::1) has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)

[02:53:01]

ikevin (ikevin!~kevin@2a01:240:fe76:1::1) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:07]

kwmonroe (kwmonroe!~kwmonroe@32.97.110.58) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:07]

anykey_ (anykey_!~anykey@46-126-245-147.dynamic.hispeed.ch) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:07]

Cougar (Cougar!~cougar@kkk.version6.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:07]

Dave123-road (Dave123-road!someone@cpe-74-74-202-129.rochester.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:08]

lotia (lotia!~lotia@l.monkey.org) has joined #mythtv-users

[02:55:08]

jbrett (jbrett!brett@nat/hp/x-kcetwmmhjluqavkl) has joined #mythtv-users

[03:05:24]

sphery:

SmallR2002: Time to retain deleted recordings (days): Determines the maximum number of days before undeleting a recording will become impossible. A value of zero means the recording will be permanently deleted between 5 and 20 minutes later. A value of minus one means recordings will be retained until space is required. A recording will always be removed before this time if the space is needed for a new recording.

[03:06:16]

sphery:

I think it's in the main General settings in mythfrontend

[03:10:30]

tlhiv_laptop (tlhiv_laptop!~foo@c-69-254-218-89.hsd1.al.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[03:30:55]

Gumby:

sphery: when did this "Time to retain deleted recordings" option come about? I can't seem to find it in stock mythbuntu (0.25.0+fixes.20120410). And where is the default storage location for deleted recordings?

[03:31:19]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)

[03:33:11]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[03:34:41]

tgm4883:

Gumby, Setup > Video > General Page 2

[03:35:21]

Gumby:

ah "video"

[03:35:52]

Gumby:

I never think recordings/tv when I see "video" in mythtv for some reason

[03:35:56]

Gumby:

thank you

[03:36:22]

tgm4883:

yw

[03:43:53]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)

[03:44:25]

sphery:

ah, sorry, had the wrong General

[03:44:30]

sphery:

should have looked in the code

[03:44:50]

sphery:

too many Generals on the battlefield

[04:21:28]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

[04:22:42]

Guierrmo (Guierrmo!~Guierrmo@c-69-248-64-78.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)

[04:38:17]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[04:50:19]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)

[05:20:13]

mersault_ (mersault_!~mersault@home.nullpointer.ca) has joined #mythtv-users

[05:21:00]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[05:21:57]

mersault (mersault!~mersault@home.nullpointer.ca) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[05:21:57]

mersault_ is now known as mersault

[05:29:28]

pheld (pheld!~heldal@cl-5.osl-01.no.sixxs.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[05:44:44]

JoshTriplett (JoshTriplett!~josh@unaffiliated/joshtriplett) has joined #mythtv-users

[05:46:11]

lapion (lapion!~axion@axion.xs4all.nl) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[05:46:34]

lapion (lapion!~axion@axion.xs4all.nl) has joined #mythtv-users

[05:48:33]

JoshTriplett:

Ever since upgrading to 0.25, I get a large number of what look like buffer underruns.

[05:48:42]

JoshTriplett:

On the frontends I get messages like "CoreContext mythplayer.cpp:2079 (PrebufferEnoughFrames) Player(b): Waited 6475ms for video buffers AAuAAAAAALAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUP"

[05:48:47]

JoshTriplett:

and "Decoder ringbuffer.cpp:1085 (WaitForAvail) RingBuf(myth://192.168.0.42:6543/2251_20120522223534.mpg): Waited 0.2 seconds for data #012#011#011#011to become available... 22350 < 32768".

[05:49:06]

JoshTriplett:

And on the backends, messages similar to the latter.

[05:49:19]

JoshTriplett:

(but with paths to files instead of myth:// URLs.)

[05:50:21]

JoshTriplett:

I'm trying to figure out the source of this problem (which is seriously impacting family acceptance factor since the upgrade), and I'd appreciate any suggestions for things to check for.

[05:51:15]

wagnerrp:

did you upgrade? or reinstall?

[05:51:19]

dekarl:

SmallR2002: actually you should be able to just start using the space with something outside mythtv and have recordings deleted automatically to make room. The only downside is that you might get unbalanced deletions on one filesystem while the others are left alone. (aka there's no automatic shuffling recordings around to only delete in the preferred order)

[05:51:54]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Upgrade.

[05:51:58]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: From 0.22.

[05:52:40]

wagnerrp:

so youre still running an old ext3 or xfs OS partition?

[05:53:04]

JoshTriplett:

So far, I've come across the messages from mythfrontend complaining about an inability to set the ALSA prebuffer size, which I fixed by manually setting it, and that helped somewhat with audio issues but didn't eliminate the problems entirely.

[05:53:05]

JoshTriplett:

Checking...

[05:53:21]

JoshTriplett:

Yeah, I'm still running everything on ext3. I've been meaning to upgrade to ext4.

[05:58:19]

JoshTriplett:

On a note of unknown relatedness, I'm also observing mythbackend leaking quite a lot of memory (as in, after a handful of days it has 1.5GB virt, much of which gets swapped out, compared to the very small amount of memory it uses when first launched).

[05:58:24]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: ^

[06:00:57]

wagnerrp:

virtual memory is just that, virtual

[06:01:10]

wagnerrp:

it has no direct bearing on how much is actually being consumed

[06:02:48]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I'm aware. On the other hand, when mythbackend's memory usage grows continuously, and starts consuming all of RAM and all of swap until eventually I have to restart it or reboot, that *does* have a direct bearing on how much is actually consumed. :)

[06:03:50]

JoshTriplett:

It currently has 619M resident and hundreds more swapped out.

[06:04:43]

JoshTriplett:

(And before I put a swapfile on this system, it would eventually fill up 90+% of RAM and leave almost no room for disk cache, leading to massive performance problems.)

[06:06:20]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: In any case, I don't know if the performance problems we currently see relate to the memory usage or to some problem I don't know about yet.

[06:07:01]

JoshTriplett:

I'm poking at dstat and iotop, and dstat had some strangely high iowait numbers earlier (as in, up to 50% iowait, which seems quite excessive).

[06:07:39]

mag0o (mag0o!20001@slackhost.lynchmv.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)

[06:11:56]

kormoc (kormoc!~kormoc@mythtv/developer/kormoc) has quit (Quit: kormoc)

[06:16:47]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:17:16]

Goga777 (Goga777!~Goga777@2.95.14.175) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:22:56]

** wagnerrp postulates a theory of solder as a living, hating, lifeform **

[06:24:31]

wagnerrp:

it behaves in a manner that can only be explained by a conscious entity, actively working against my efforts as it despises my constant probing with a soldering iron

[06:24:35]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I'm fond of that theory.

[06:25:03]

Shadow__X:

which logs do i check when Mythvidexport fails? Mythbackend.log just tells me that it fails

[06:25:17]

wagnerrp:

the mythvidexport logs

[06:26:19]

wagnerrp:

JoshTriplett: check around the mythbuntu forums, there should be a thread about experimentally forcing the scheduler's temporary tables to use myisam, rather than a very poorly configured innodb

[06:26:31]

Shadow__X:

i did not find one in the mythtv log folder

[06:26:46]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Seriously? Normally I'd expect that to be the other way around.

[06:26:47]

wagnerrp:

then it is not configured properly

[06:26:55]

JoshTriplett:

What do you mean by a "very poorly configured innodb"?

[06:27:16]

wagnerrp:

JoshTriplett: innodb can be much higher performance than myisam, if configured properly

[06:27:29]

wagnerrp:

but the configs that nearly (if not) all distros ship with are junk

[06:27:35]

wagnerrp:

it]s one of the

[06:27:49]

wagnerrp:

reasons for the push towards an embedded database

[06:27:58]

JoshTriplett:

That plan certainly seems like a good one to me.

[06:27:58]

wagnerrp:

where we would control the settings, and use proper ones

[06:28:51]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: In the meantime, if you have an idea of proper innodb settings, I'll happily fix up mysql to use them. I've changed mysql to use innodb for all tables (after some nasty corruption issues with myisam a while back), and I'd love to just fix any junk I still have.

[06:29:19]

wagnerrp:

eew...

[06:29:32]

wagnerrp:

if youre using innodb, and youve not given mysql a proper configuration

[06:29:48]

wagnerrp:

that could very understandably be cause for high IO load

[06:30:00]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Oh? What kinds of proper configuration do you have in mind?

[06:31:06]

wagnerrp:

http://dev.mysql.com/tech-resources/articles/ . . . ON0001500000

[06:31:07]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: At the moment, I run Debian's stock mysql configuration, with just two changes: bind-address = 0.0.0.0 (so that the frontends can connect) and default-storage-engine=innodb (so that I don't get massive database corruption any time the frontend shuts down improperly).

[06:31:28]

wagnerrp:

im using the my-large.cnf example config, with a number of the sizes halved

[06:32:19]

wagnerrp:

i only changed that a few months back, when tinkering with getting trac running through mysql rather than sqlite

[06:32:19]

JoshTriplett:

I'll take a look at that. Or, if you have a known-good configuration you could pastebin, I'll happily use that. :)

[06:32:34]

** JoshTriplett doesn't run anything except mythtv through mysql. **

[06:32:40]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: What'd you use before that?

[06:33:00]

wagnerrp:

previously, i hit around 30 minutes trying to transfer the trac sqlite database into mysql, using the default settings, before giving up

[06:33:15]

wagnerrp:

i dont actually know how much longer it would have run before finishing

[06:33:22]

Shadow__X:

ah i am running 0.7.2 and i see there is 0.7.3

[06:33:44]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I definitely saw mysql doing oddly large amounts of reading and writing.

[06:33:49]

wagnerrp:

after loading the halved my-large.cnf in place of the compiled in defaults (i had no cnf file in place)

[06:33:50]

JoshTriplett:

In the MB/s range.

[06:34:02]

wagnerrp:

memory consumption jumped about 8–10x what it previously was

[06:34:13]

wagnerrp:

and the operation completed in about 100 seconds

[06:35:01]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Why the halving?

[06:35:08]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Trying to use less memory?

[06:35:17]

wagnerrp:

yeah, bit too large for my taste

[06:35:38]

wagnerrp:

wth... "THIS API HAS BEEN DISABLED. Please use Pastebin's new API"

[06:35:50]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: mysql-large claims to be tuned for a system with 512MB, and I have 2GB...

[06:36:01]

wagnerrp:

yes

[06:36:16]

wagnerrp:

it is tuned for a system with 512MB, where the only thing it does is serve mysql data

[06:36:21]

JoshTriplett:

Fair enough.

[06:37:04]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I assume you uncommented some of the settings for innodb?

[06:37:04]

wagnerrp:

anyway, i think it was stabilizing at around 350MB usage

[06:37:25]

wagnerrp:

http://pastebin.com/R7zEZiVR

[06:37:33]

wagnerrp:

now... take this with a bit of trepidation

[06:37:40]

wagnerrp:

i have exactly zero idea what im doing

[06:37:52]

wagnerrp:

im just poking around in the dark, and hoping for the best

[06:37:55]

JoshTriplett:

I'm well into the "can't hurt" phase of debugging. ;)

[06:38:16]

JoshTriplett:

Considering that the feedback I'm currently getting on MythTV is somewhere between "major regression" and "unusable".

[06:38:51]

wagnerrp:

note that if you converted mythtv's tables over to innodb, expect to have troubles in the future during schema updates

[06:39:20]

wagnerrp:

not that you will necessarily, just that youre no longer running the expected

[06:39:36]

wagnerrp:

and so what is supposed to happen, and what does happen during testing, may not happen on a different storage engine

[06:42:33]

JoshTriplett (JoshTriplett!~josh@unaffiliated/joshtriplett) has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)

[06:42:58]

JoshTriplett (JoshTriplett!~josh@unaffiliated/joshtriplett) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:42:58]

JoshTriplett:

Sorry, got disconnected.

[06:43:17]

wagnerrp:

!url logs

[06:43:18]

MythLogBot:

logs: http://irc.mythtv.org/ircLog/channel/1

[06:43:33]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I did see the last thing you said.

[06:43:39]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Thanks for the pointer to the logs.

[06:43:53]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Are you using the configuration you pastebinned with your MythTV setup, or just with Trac?

[06:44:05]

JoshTriplett:

(Kinda making the assumption that those aren't running on the same server. :) )

[06:44:16]

wagnerrp:

yes, same server

[06:44:43]

JoshTriplett:

code.mythtv.org is your MythTV backend too?

[06:44:54]

wagnerrp:

no, just testing

[06:44:57]

JoshTriplett:

Ah.

[06:45:02]

JoshTriplett:

That makes more sense. :)

[06:45:08]

JoshTriplett:

Separate server for production?

[06:45:16]

wagnerrp:

looking to see what it would take

[06:45:17]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[06:45:22]

wagnerrp:

because sqlite sucks

[06:45:34]

wagnerrp:

(for large, parallel web applications)

[06:45:42]

JoshTriplett:

Agreed, and agreed with the caveat.

[06:45:45]

JoshTriplett:

It's nice for embedded.

[06:46:11]

JoshTriplett:

(And would probably be a sensible choice for MythTV apart from the massive porting effort that would be required to move from MySQL to a different SQL database.)

[06:46:27]

wagnerrp:

we used to have problems where trac would stall for several minutes at a time and become unresponsive, waiting for some mutex in sqlite to time out

[06:46:47]

wagnerrp:

someone looked at it ages back, decided it was too simplistic

[06:47:19]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: It has become much more sophisticated, though it still isn't a "real" database.

[06:48:48]

lis0r:

meh, mysql insufflates a huge bag of dicks, even if it does so through a very refined gold plated diamond encrusted straw

[06:49:31]

wagnerrp:

and then theres always the "mysql sucks, use postgres" crowd... :P

[06:49:55]

lis0r:

heh, never actually tried postgres

[06:50:39]

lis0r:

just overly familiar with butting heads with mysql whenever the TV/server decides to Linux itself

[06:51:25]

lis0r:

(Linux: verb, to render oneself inoperable in a manner that requires at least a days worth of swearing, with little than "ert+yr6p" as an error message to go on)

[06:51:25]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I'm going to avoid kicking that particular hornet's nest myself.

[06:52:42]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I'm a big fan of PostgreSQL given a choice of databases, but that doesn't mean I'd advocate porting an application heavily dependent on MySQL to use it without a good reason and a massive transition plan.

[06:53:12]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Honestly, the embedded database idea seems preferable to me at this point, particularly given the notion of killing off all non-mythbackend SQL access in favor of the new APIs.

[06:53:14]

wagnerrp:

yeah, thats always been the big reason not to

[06:53:38]

wagnerrp:

all the little gotchas that result from slightly different SQL syntax

[06:53:39]

JoshTriplett:

*That* seems preferable to any system built on the idea that every mythfrontend and mythbackend should chat SQL with the master DB.

[06:53:42]

wagnerrp:

but big changes are easy

[06:53:50]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:53:54]

wagnerrp:

its the little things that would cause problems for several versions down the line

[06:54:21]

wagnerrp:

the question of embedding is how youre going to manage the data

[06:54:45]

wagnerrp:

do you make the transition whole hog, and require all plugins to be split with frontend and database/backend components

[06:55:10]

wagnerrp:

or do it slowly, and allow proxying through the internal protocol for some amount of time

[06:55:30]

wagnerrp:

proxying is easier, but with the risk that no one will ever bother to rewrite it properly, as it works well enough as is

[06:57:18]

wagnerrp:

and of course theres going to be the wailing and gnashing of teeth among the users when their tinkering sql interface is gone

[06:57:41]

wagnerrp:

theyre going to have to write code, compile it, and load it into the master backend anytime they want to issue raw sql

[06:57:54]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Assuming that no debugging proxy interface exists.

[06:58:32]

wagnerrp:

well the key term there is debugging, not tinkering

[06:58:38]

hpeter (hpeter!~hpeter@zux221-184-024.adsl.green.ch) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:58:40]

JoshTriplett:

Right.

[06:58:47]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: You could always have a pure-text proxy protocol, so that humans can use it but no sane programmer would attempt to use it.

[06:58:55]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: (Not that there aren't insane programmers out there...)

[06:59:06]

RyanC (RyanC!~chatzilla@office.lmp.co.uk) has joined #mythtv-users

[06:59:08]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Effectively, something more like the mysql text prompt.

[06:59:27]

wagnerrp:

formatting and all?

[06:59:46]

Shadow__X:

http://pastebin.com/W0QNJsu1 I copied the neweest Mythvidexport.py but i still do not see a log being created

[06:59:52]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: To the extent you want to implement it, but in any case intended for human and not programmatic consumption.

[07:00:02]

Shadow__X:

i am using .25 fixes

[07:00:04]

JoshTriplett:

(Human or shell-script-level tooling at most, anyway.)

[07:00:07]

** wagnerrp just imagines awk one-liners being passed around the mailing list for people to embed in their scripts **

[07:00:23]

wagnerrp:

Shadow__X: the one from the wiki? or the one from my github repo?

[07:00:32]

Shadow__X:

wiki

[07:00:44]

Shadow__X:

is that the wrong one?

[07:00:55]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I'd tend to say dive into the transition at the start of a development cycle, and make sure all the frontend and plugin code you care about gets converted by the end of that cycle.

[07:01:19]

wagnerrp:

https://github.com/wagnerrp/mythtv-scripts/ma . . . videxport.py

[07:01:40]

wagnerrp:

also, youll want to change the user job to "mythvidexport.py %VERBOSEMODE% %JOBID%"

[07:02:08]

wagnerrp:

yeah, thats sphery's position, and hes the one who has really been pushing for it the last year or two

[07:02:44]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: is this the right one https://github.com/wagnerrp/mythtv-scripts/bl . . . videxport.py ? the link you gave me didnt work

[07:02:59]

wagnerrp:

probably

[07:03:03]

wagnerrp:

i typed it in manually

[07:03:13]

Shadow__X:

ah ok thanks i really appreciate it

[07:03:14]

wagnerrp:

copy/paste doesnt seem to work too well over synergy over xpra

[07:03:22]

faichele_ (faichele_!~quassel@p4FCCFEEB.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:03:29]

wagnerrp:

s/too well/at all/

[07:04:37]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[07:05:09]

spamjunkie (spamjunkie!~spamjunki@c-68-46-29-108.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:06:22]

Guierrmo (Guierrmo!~Guierrmo@c-68-37-236-30.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:06:38]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:08:07]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: do you use xpra to have persistent xchat sessions?

[07:08:21]

wagnerrp:

yes

[07:08:31]

Shadow__X:

ah ok neat

[07:09:59]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)

[07:11:58]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:12:01]

Shadow__X:

ok using the mythvidexport you linked to and now the error i get is dict object has no attribute job

[07:12:12]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Wow. I had no idea that mythtv had logging to the DB enabled; I have a fairly huge logging table.

[07:12:29]

wagnerrp:

it expires after two weeks

[07:12:48]

JoshTriplett:

Then apparently I get 143312 logging messages in 2 weeks. :)

[07:13:04]

wagnerrp:

and if an excessive backlog builds up, it is automatically squelched until the log rate dies back down

[07:13:44]

JoshTriplett:

This would be an interesting vicious cycle, if the backend was too busy writing out "can't get data fast enough" messages to provide data fast enough. ;)

[07:14:10]

JoshTriplett:

In any case, it seems slightly redundant that I'm currently logging to three different places.

[07:14:23]

JoshTriplett:

(console, syslog, and database)

[07:14:33]

[R]:

so turn 1 2 or 3 of them off

[07:14:37]

wagnerrp:

well console doesnt really log anywhere

[07:14:44]

wagnerrp:

other than memory buffer

[07:14:59]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: .xsession-errors on frontends. I know because .xsession-errors filled up a frontend's disk the other day. :)

[07:15:14]

JoshTriplett:

Probably nowhere on backends, sure.

[07:15:22]

JoshTriplett:

(Assuming a system not running a stdout-to-syslog bridge.)

[07:15:30]

JoshTriplett:

Which mine doesn't.

[07:15:49]

wagnerrp:

which WOULD be redundant, when mythtv can log directly to syslog itself

[07:15:54]

pepsiman (pepsiman!~mparsons@secure.linguamatics.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:16:32]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Or, alternatively, would be redundant since mythtv wouldn't have to.

[07:16:46]

JoshTriplett:

But either way, yeah.

[07:17:10]

wagnerrp:

well there is a log viewer built into the backend web page

[07:17:18]

wagnerrp:

allowing you to view logs independently of the filesystem

[07:17:36]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: True, when the backend is working. :)

[07:17:38]

wagnerrp:

and the smolt hardware profiler uses the database logs to track scheduler runs

[07:18:01]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Sometimes I'm looking at the logs because the backend *isn't* working, in which case syslog is wildly useful. :)

[07:18:07]

wagnerrp:

providing a metric as to how many people are running marginal hardware (or decent hardware with poor settings)

[07:18:46]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Just to make sure, what version of mysql did you write this config file for?

[07:18:49]

wagnerrp:

actually, now im curious as to what that has collected, as it is not yet being displayed

[07:19:00]

wagnerrp:

5..... 2?

[07:19:00]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: I have 5.1 here, and some of the options seem to have different names.

[07:19:02]

wagnerrp:

.1 or .2

[07:19:30]

wagnerrp:

5.1.42

[07:20:30]

JoshTriplett:

Huh.

[07:20:46]

JoshTriplett:

Looks like the option names are just fine, actually; it's the system my.cnf that has older names for them.

[07:20:46]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: should i post the log?

[07:20:48]

JoshTriplett:

How odd...

[07:21:10]

wagnerrp:

pastebin would be fine

[07:21:39]

ServerSage:

I don't understand why so many people use MythTV to watch live tv. It seems like there is a live tv related question on the mailing list at least once a week.

[07:21:49]

octavsly (octavsly!~octavsly@static.ip-80-255-245-177.signet.nl) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:22:20]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Why do you find it so mystifying?

[07:22:33]

[R]:

livetv is so 1980s

[07:22:55]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: Yeah, what [R] said.

[07:23:19]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: It makes a bit of sense in a few cases.

[07:23:25]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: Name one.

[07:23:38]

cocoa117:

ServerSage, liveSports?

[07:23:49]

ServerSage:

cocoa117: Can't record live sports? Next.

[07:24:00]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: News. Weather.

[07:24:06]

rsiebert_ (rsiebert_!~quassel@g225063129.adsl.alicedsl.de) has joined #mythtv-users

[07:24:13]

[R]:

i recorded the news last night

[07:24:16]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Live event of any kind, assuming you'd rather actually see it when it happens.

[07:24:16]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: Oh, right. Forgot, can't record news and weather. Guess I'm doing it wrong.

[07:24:35]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: http://pastebin.com/Vx2RvLn9 thanks again for the help

[07:24:37]

[R]:

it was about ron jeremy wanting to move to phoenisx

[07:24:38]

rsiebert (rsiebert!~quassel@g229053226.adsl.alicedsl.de) has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)

[07:24:39]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Yes, you *can* record them (or in those two cases, get them from better sources), but not if you want them live. ;)

[07:24:39]

cocoa117:

ServerSage, don't have space to record?

[07:24:51]

[R]:

cocoa117: myth is always recording

[07:24:57]

ServerSage:

cocoa117: You do realize livetv is recording, right?

[07:25:02]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Shockingly, some people do seem to care about the current news and current weather.

[07:25:17]

[R]:

people seriously watch tv for weather?

[07:25:18]

[R]:

lol

[07:25:19]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: I watch the news every night. I haven't watched it live in 10 years.

[07:25:37]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: And they find it easier to go to "Watch TV" and pick the weather or news channel than to mark it to record and play it back.

[07:25:39]

ServerSage:

I really just dno't get it.

[07:25:59]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: See, laziness might be a reason.

[07:26:15]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: I personally don't watch TV news or weather either; I don't have the patience for them compared to getting both from the Internet. That doesn't mean I can't understand why others would prefer TV sources.

[07:26:33]

wagnerrp:

yikes...

[07:26:49]

wagnerrp:

1205 matches, with an average scheduler runtime of 538 seconds

[07:27:02]

[R]:

isn't that a few minutes too long?

[07:27:02]

** JoshTriplett goes back to setting up this new my.cnf **

[07:27:11]

JoshTriplett:

Sounds about 537 seconds too long.

[07:27:13]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett:I just think live tv support should take a back seat, back of the bus, etc... No reason it should even be supported.

[07:27:30]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Why, given the new mechanisms to treat it almost identically to a recording?

[07:27:47]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: It's just a special-purpose interface to say "go start recording this channel, mark it as autoexpire, and watch it".

[07:32:17]

ServerSage:

Those mechanisms aren't there by magic, just think of where myth would be if people just woke up and smelled the coffee. You know, LEAPED into the year 2000 and recorded stuff instead of watching it live.

[07:32:50]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: What do you think MythTV could do differently by dropping live TV support?

[07:33:43]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)

[07:34:17]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: Any one of the gajillion things on the wish-list, to-do list, and bug list. *shrug* Like I said, I just don't understand it. Wasn't trying to start a flame war, more looking for a reason. And it appears there really isn't one.

[07:34:55]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: I could easily understand removing the support if doing so would allow some awesomeness that would otherwise not work. It just doesn't seem like a net win to remove it if not.

[07:35:53]

ServerSage:

JoshTriplett: I never said drop support. My point was one of "Why do people do this", not "Why do the devs focus on this".

[07:36:04]

JoshTriplett:

Ah.

[07:36:09]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Fair enough.

[07:36:21]

ServerSage:

Why have MythTV if you want to watch TV like my 89 year old Grandma. lol

[07:36:42]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: I think you might have just answered your own question. And pull it forward one generation, too. :)

[07:36:55]

ServerSage:

lol

[07:37:03]

JoshTriplett:

Most things are best watched recorded. Some things still get watched live. :)

[07:38:08]

ServerSage:

But WHY do they get watched live? lol. I mean, is it just a mind set that you HAVE to see it as it happens? If so, it's moderately ignorant since most TV, even *live* TV, is delayed by 5 seconds.

[07:39:38]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Don't think of it as "must get watched live".

[07:39:52]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Think of it as "I don't want to set up a regular recording rule for this, I just want to watch it".

[07:40:13]

[R] ([R]!~rbox@unaffiliated/rbox) has quit (Quit: Leaving)

[07:40:55]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: I'm not talking about regularly recording the evening news; I'm talking about "I'm sitting here and I'd like some news right now". Or in the case of weather, "I'd like to flip to the weather channel for 2 minutes before going out".

[07:41:12]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: How would that fit with a "record everything" model?

[07:42:10]

ServerSage:

Perhaps living in silicon valley has tainted my outlook. For news and weather NOW I just use one of 80 different ways to get it, other than the TV.

[07:42:17]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: So do I.

[07:42:26]

JoshTriplett:

ServerSage: Now, the key question: how old are you? :)

[07:42:41]

ServerSage:

Old enough to tell the kids to get off my lawn.

[07:42:59]

JoshTriplett:

Significantly older than 27? :)

[07:43:52]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: do i still need to edit out parts of Video::get_meta() on mythvidexport?

[07:43:53]

JoshTriplett:

Because I can vouch for there existing a generational difference here.

[07:44:12]

wagnerrp:

i believe ive fixed that in the bindings

[07:44:12]

JoshTriplett:

(With exceptions, I'm sure.)

[07:44:16]

wagnerrp:

but ive not tested it

[07:44:26]

ServerSage:

Nah, just old enough to be crabby. 34. But I'm not sure age has anything to do with it. My father and mother (different house holds) don't watch live TV. Honestly, the ONLY people I know who watch Live TV are those without cable, and my grand mother. lol

[07:44:38]

Shadow__X:

what that be cuasing the issue that i am experiencing?

[07:45:08]

ServerSage:

Those without cable are the ones that don't care about TV, it's just background noise. They'd be just as happy with a DVD playing, or even just a radio.

[07:45:28]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: OK, this is exciting: "mysqld: InnoDB: Error: log file ./ib_logfile0 is of different size 0 5242880 bytes" "mysqld: InnoDB: than specified in the .cnf file 0 67108864 bytes!"

[07:46:02]

** JoshTriplett hopes he doesn't have a dump and reload ahead. **

[07:46:13]

ServerSage:

That seems like a un-fun error.

[07:46:46]

wagnerrp:

still got your old my.cnf?

[07:47:40]

wagnerrp:

put the old cnf file back in place

[07:47:43]

wagnerrp:

start the server up

[07:47:54]

wagnerrp:

perform a "safe termination", whatever that means

[07:48:01]

wagnerrp:

and start back up with the new cnf

[07:48:20]

wagnerrp:

apparently the default behavior is to perform a fast or "unsafe" termination

[07:48:32]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: In my case, I did a safe system shutdown and reboot.

[07:48:33]

wagnerrp:

which means it must scan those log files on startup, rather than shutdown

[07:48:37]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Sigh.

[07:48:40]

wagnerrp:

not system, mysql

[07:48:44]

JoshTriplett:

Yeah, I know.

[07:48:53]

JoshTriplett:

I guess I'd hope that /etc/init.d/mysql stop would do a safe shutdown.

[07:48:55]

JoshTriplett:

Guess not.

[07:49:26]

wagnerrp:

someone who actually knows what they're doing might be able to give a better explanation

[07:49:54]

JoshTriplett:

Found what I needed.

[07:49:55]

JoshTriplett:

https://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.1/en/innod . . . uration.html

[07:50:11]

JoshTriplett:

https://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.1/en/innod . . . ast_shutdown

[07:57:05]

CiaranG (CiaranG!~CiaranG@fsf/member/CiaranG) has quit (Quit: Leaving.)

[07:59:42]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: any ideas>

[07:59:44]

wagnerrp:

sphery: some interesting, if not particularly meaningful, data...

[08:00:03]

wagnerrp:

http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=pEtYrS00

[08:00:25]

wagnerrp:

thats duration and variation in scheduler runes

[08:00:42]

wagnerrp:

however note, there is no guarantee these measurements are actually on the CPU listed

[08:01:05]

wagnerrp:

Shadow__X: you ever post the traceback?

[08:02:01]

Shadow__X:

is this it? http://pastebin.com/Vx2RvLn9

[08:02:36]

wagnerrp:

eew....

[08:02:54]

wagnerrp:

i need to figure out a cleaner way of posting a traceback to syslog

[08:03:35]

wagnerrp:

why is that a dict...

[08:06:50]

wagnerrp:

Shadow__X: do you have a jobid for this handy?

[08:07:28]

Shadow__X:

it was userjob 5467

[08:08:09]

wagnerrp:

run 'mythpython', and 'import lxml

[08:08:47]

Shadow__X:

ok then exit?

[08:08:53]

wagnerrp:

then... print lxml.etree.tostring(Recorded.fromJob(Job(5467)).exportMetadata().toXML(), pretty_print=True)

[08:09:09]

wagnerrp:

there should be a block of people/person

[08:09:19]

wagnerrp:

do the person elements have a job attribute?

[08:09:31]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Most of the problem there is the various instances of #012 that should become newlines. :)

[08:09:31]

** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/012 **

[08:09:53]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: You really want to take each line separately and send it to syslog.

[08:10:16]

wagnerrp:

JoshTriplett: i know, mythtv's logger does the same thing

[08:10:17]

JoshTriplett:

The same goes for other non-traceback bits, which frequently have #012 and #011.

[08:10:17]

** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/012 **

[08:10:17]

** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/011 **

[08:10:21]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Yup.

[08:10:24]

wagnerrp:

its showing up all over various logs

[08:10:33]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)

[08:12:02]

Shadow__X:

this is what comes up http://pastebin.com/kDxPkY19

[08:12:54]

Shadow__X:

ah yeah they have job=actor executive producer

[08:13:22]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:18:10]

Goga777 (Goga777!~Goga777@2.95.14.175) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[08:18:58]

** wagnerrp heads to bed **

[08:19:21]

Shadow__X:

gn wagnerrp

[08:19:23]

** wagnerrp suggests Shadow__X update **

[08:19:47]

Shadow__X:

thank you again have a good night

[08:20:18]

wagnerrp:

jya: im assuming youre done with this jail?

[08:20:26]

JoshTriplett:

wagnerrp: Thanks for all the help.

[08:20:29]

wagnerrp:

you dont appear connected any longer

[08:20:49]

wagnerrp:

im killing it

[08:21:30]

wagnerrp:

its still around and can be started back up if needed, but is currently offline

[08:23:11]

CiaranG (CiaranG!~CiaranG@fsf/member/CiaranG) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:30:26]

JoshTriplett (JoshTriplett!~josh@unaffiliated/joshtriplett) has left #mythtv-users ()

[08:30:51]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:32:52]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)

[08:36:22]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:37:18]

MissionCritical (MissionCritical!~MissionCr@unaffiliated/missioncritical) has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)

[08:42:29]

Mission-Critical (Mission-Critical!~MissionCr@unaffiliated/missioncritical) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:45:46]

croppa (croppa!~stuart@CPE-120-146-137-99.static.nsw.bigpond.net.au) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:54:25]

mag0o (mag0o!20001@slackhost.lynchmv.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[08:58:15]

Mission-Critical is now known as MissionCritical

[09:13:07]

MaverickTech (MaverickTech!~MaverickT@111.86.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) has joined #mythtv-users

[09:13:27]

jya:

wagnerrp: I am yes...

[09:13:31]

jya:

for this time

[09:13:34]

mrt2k10 (mrt2k10!~quassel@charybdis.ani.univie.ac.at) has joined #mythtv-users

[09:13:47]

mrt2k10:

hi, i cant connect to my mythtv backend if the frontend is on another computer. more precisely, i can connect, but when i want to watch tv, nothing happens

[09:13:58]

mrt2k10:

i don't see any errors in mythbackend.log

[09:14:04]

mrt2k10:

ip addresses are correct, the service is listening on the necessary interfaces...

[09:17:39]

faichele_ (faichele_!~quassel@p4FCCFEEB.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)

[09:22:19]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)

[09:34:02]

Curly060 (Curly060!~Miranda@194.25.111.26) has joined #mythtv-users

[09:39:51]

mrt2k10:

With verbose output on the backend: GetChannelData() failed because it could not find channel number '30703' in DB for source '1'.

[09:43:49]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[09:46:27]

faichele (faichele!~quassel@d16-77.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de) has joined #mythtv-users

[09:47:20]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[09:49:59]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[09:53:35]

seeker (seeker!~seeker@unaffiliated/seeker) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:00:57]

dekarl (dekarl!~dekarl@p4FCEFE37.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)

[10:05:03]

Guest95830 (Guest95830!~mike@c-98-232-220-158.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[10:05:52]

45PAAK4HL (45PAAK4HL!~mike@c-98-232-220-158.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:10:44]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[10:11:29]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:35:56]

emmanuelux (emmanuelux!~emmanuelu@2a01:e35:2e4d:9010:21d:60ff:fe0e:b818) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:40:12]

slysir (slysir!~quassel@pool-173-64-7-213.bflony.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[10:54:12]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has joined #mythtv-users

[11:25:46]

mrt2k10 (mrt2k10!~quassel@charybdis.ani.univie.ac.at) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[11:35:25]

seeker (seeker!~seeker@unaffiliated/seeker) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[11:35:57]

seeker (seeker!~seeker@unaffiliated/seeker) has joined #mythtv-users

[11:40:23]

seeker (seeker!~seeker@unaffiliated/seeker) has quit (Client Quit)

[12:03:59]

croppa (croppa!~stuart@CPE-120-146-137-99.static.nsw.bigpond.net.au) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[12:31:18]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)

[12:33:59]

russell5 (russell5!~russell5@pool-173-48-62-218.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[12:42:15]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:44:26]

slysir (slysir!~quassel@pool-173-64-7-213.bflony.fios.verizon.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[12:45:14]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:50:48]

russell5 (russell5!~russell5@pool-173-48-62-218.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:52:13]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:57:01]

lukeo1 (lukeo1!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:57:03]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[13:02:55]

devinheitmuell-1 (devinheitmuell-1!~devinheit@pool-108-41-38-203.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[13:09:19]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[13:09:20]

lukeo1 (lukeo1!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[13:23:09]

jarle (jarle!~jarle@70.84-234-133.customer.lyse.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)

[13:24:49]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[13:26:31]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[13:28:49]

dmz (dmz!~dmz@67.216.138.246.pool.hargray.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[13:28:49]

dmz (dmz!~dmz@unaffiliated/dmz) has joined #mythtv-users

[13:28:49]

dmz (dmz!~dmz@67.216.138.246.pool.hargray.net) has quit (Changing host)

[13:38:18]

RyanC (RyanC!~chatzilla@office.lmp.co.uk) has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.0.17/2009122204])

[14:03:05]

Easy_Rider9999 (Easy_Rider9999!~Miranda@pD9E5E958.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:06:43]

devinheitmueller (devinheitmueller!~dheitmue@ool-44c12d92.dyn.optonline.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)

[14:13:40]

Jordack (Jordack!~jordack@h69-131-44-221.plmomi.dedicated.static.tds.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:21:11]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)

[14:21:42]

purserj (purserj!~purserj@hosting.collaborynth.com.au) has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

[14:22:19]

purserj (purserj!~purserj@hosting.collaborynth.com.au) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:25:54]

troyt (troyt!~troyt@2001:1938:240:3000::3) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:32:06]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:34:06]

andreax (andreax!~andreaz@p54BF32E5.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:36:12]

streeter (streeter!streeter@nat/redhat/x-gnditlmgfsczyzvs) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:37:32]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[14:37:50]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:50:57]

zombor_ (zombor_!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[14:54:49]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)

[14:56:22]

zombor_ (zombor_!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[14:56:49]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:09:04]

Curly060 (Curly060!~Miranda@194.25.111.26) has quit (Quit: It's gonna be a glorious day!)

[15:17:57]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[15:18:50]

zombor_ (zombor_!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:19:14]

tank-man (tank-man!john@S010600121729c6a1.vc.shawcable.net) has quit (Quit: Leaving)

[15:19:36]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[15:20:12]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:20:24]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[15:22:03]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)

[15:22:54]

bentech (bentech!~bentech@87-194-161-211.bethere.co.uk) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:24:35]

bentech:

How well does mythtv work on the Raspberry Pi ?

[15:25:56]

devinheitmuell-1:

bentech: not at all.

[15:27:18]

wagnerrp:

looks like youre missing some letters there

[15:28:01]

devinheitmuell-1:

wagnerrp: yeah, I left the IRC window open from work, and this is apparently what Adium does when the username is already in use.

[15:28:12]

sphery:

but he got a number, and a number is worth at least 2 letters

[15:28:54]

highzeth (highzeth!~hz@hoiseth.no) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)

[15:29:51]

bentech:

aw

[15:30:12]

brfransen:

devinheitmuell-1: kernellabs seems to be down

[15:30:19]

devinheitmuell-1:

brfransen: yeah, I know.

[15:30:22]

devinheitmuell-1:

I've emailed Steve

[15:30:45]

devinheitmuell-1:

It was up last night. Something happened in the last 12 hours.

[15:33:09]

wagnerrp:

bentech: the RPi has no CPU power, so you have no choice but to fall back on the GPU for everything

[15:33:16]

wagnerrp:

and mythtv does not support the GPU for video decoding

[15:33:34]

bentech:

:(

[15:33:53]

wagnerrp:

better get to work on an OpenMAX video decoder

[15:34:00]

devinheitmuell-1:

wagnerrp: :-)

[15:34:16]

devinheitmuell-1:

If I could find a commercial backer, I would seriously consider it.

[15:34:27]

wagnerrp:

and clean up memory consumption in the UI libraries while youre at it, so mythtv can run comfortably on the <200MB of memory the RPi has available

[15:35:03]

wagnerrp:

its not a bad idea, considering its becoming the primary interface for mobile devices

[15:35:26]

devinheitmuell-1:

The memory bloat is definitely an issue. While I could have hacked in support for the video decoder pipeline for the MediaMVP-HD, the memory constraints made it essentially a non-starter.

[15:36:04]

wagnerrp:

when the average mythtv frontend is only used for mythtv, and the average pc these days has 4GB of memory

[15:36:20]

wagnerrp:

trying to not bloat has never really been a focus

[15:36:25]

sphery:

wagnerrp: what about a banana pie?

[15:36:33]

devinheitmuell-1:

wagnerrp: yup

[15:36:43]

wagnerrp:

like puttie pie?

[15:36:52]

sphery:

http://www.reghardware.com/2012/05/22/chip_ma . . . ry_pi_alike/

[15:36:57]

wagnerrp:

i havent had that in ages

[15:36:59]

sphery:

top picture

[15:37:15]

sphery:

(though I'm guessing that's even worse than a RPi in terms of hardware)

[15:37:31]

sphery:

regardless, its CPU is far from capable

[15:37:33]

wagnerrp:

banana pudding in a bowl, lined with a vanilla wafer "crust"

[15:37:51]

sphery:

hehe, yeah, haven't had that in a long time

[15:37:53]

wagnerrp:

not a real crust, since theyre just whole vanilla wafers

[15:38:29]

sphery:

what cpu is in rpi

[15:38:38]

fryguy:

last generation arm

[15:38:43]

devinheitmuell-1:

brfransen: probably worth mentioning that I *did* do some HVR-1800 debugging last night, and if the kernellabs.com site were up you could read about it. :-/

[15:38:44]

fryguy:

700mhz i think?

[15:39:00]

sphery:

ah, so the VIA's 800MHz ARM 11 CPU is basically the same?

[15:39:01]

wagnerrp:

depends on what you consider "last"

[15:39:09]

fryguy:

sphery: don't think so

[15:39:15]

fryguy:

the pi is a last gen, it's missing a bunch of stuff

[15:39:29]

wagnerrp:

the RPi's ARM11 is an ARMv6, compared to a modern ARMv7

[15:39:32]

sphery:

ARM 11 is predecessor to Cortex A-9, right?

[15:39:35]

tank-man (tank-man!1000@S010600121729c6a1.vc.shawcable.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:39:59]

wagnerrp:

but there is a big difference between last gen's Cortex A8, and current Cortex A9, and more still against Cortex A15

[15:40:22]

brfransen:

devinheitmuell-1: the headline was in my rss reader and that is how I knew kernellabs was down.

[15:40:30]

devinheitmuell-1:

brfransen: ah, ok

[15:43:11]

sphery:

ok, so arm11 preceded cortex-a; arm11 used instruction sets armv6, armv6t2, armv6z, and armv6k; cortex-a uses instruction set armv7-a

[15:43:48]

sphery:

(and cortex-a implementations include a5, a7, a8, a9 mpcore, and a15 mpcore)

[15:43:56]

wagnerrp:

ugh... this david crawford guy is back...

[15:44:28]

sphery:

didn't remember his previous thread, but he's talking about recording 18 shows concurrently?

[15:44:48]

sphery:

seems a little "other than personal dvr" to me

[15:44:49]

devinheitmuell-1:

18? that's quite a few shows.

[15:44:53]

sphery:

yeah

[15:45:12]

wagnerrp:

its not a personal dvr

[15:45:15]

sphery:

as in when would you have time to watch

[15:45:24]

wagnerrp:

hes trying to do something commercial, with subtitles

[15:45:37]

sphery:

actually, he seems to have said, "up to 20" in the OP

[15:45:40]

devinheitmuell-1:

Re-reading his thread, could be a variety of things, not just storage. For example, the driver could be crapping out with too many cards in the PC.

[15:45:52]

sphery:

ah

[15:46:25]

devinheitmuell-1:

And things like "unresponsiveness and discontinuities" is a real b***ch to debug as it can be very specific to the setup.

[15:46:38]

sphery:

devinheitmuell-1: or, perhaps power issues (I've seen hardware cause issues when it gets unclean power during use)

[15:46:41]

sphery:

?

[15:47:03]

devinheitmuell-1:

For example, I spent two weeks debugging video dropouts, only to eventually find the problem was that a floppy drive was configured in the BIOS but no drive was actually connected.

[15:47:12]

sphery:

hehe, wow

[15:47:20]

devinheitmuell-1:

(e.g. the floppy driver was polling for the hardware, stalling the entire system)

[15:47:39]

sphery:

and most mobos ship with bios setting floppy enabled, but most builders don't include floppy drives, now

[15:48:02]

wagnerrp:

sphery: if you're interested, theres a big long thread a while back, with me trying to detail how to create a python userjob to automatically run mythccextractor

[15:48:10]

** sphery considers disabling the floppy in bios on all his systems **

[15:48:19]

devinheitmuell-1:

heh

[15:48:27]

sphery:

wagnerrp: ah, that one... I didn't place the name

[15:48:31]

wagnerrp:

and him taking my effectively completely written script, in a couple line chunks, and playing python shuffle with no logic or reason

[15:48:40]

devinheitmuell-1:

Don't get me wrong – the Linux floppy driver is probably crap if it behaved that way, but the point is though that these things can be *very* difficult to isolate.

[15:48:42]

sphery:

yeah

[15:48:52]

wagnerrp:

trying to program without a concept of what a "variable" is

[15:49:05]

sphery:

devinheitmuell-1: yeah, as an outside observer, that's what I'm seeing

[15:49:28]

Easy_Rider9999 (Easy_Rider9999!~Miranda@pD9E5E958.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[15:49:41]

devinheitmuell-1:

Profiling is a time consuming and expensive process.

[15:49:48]

sphery:

devinheitmuell-1: with things like http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/10732 , where it seems mythtv is doing what it can, but something (who knows what) is causing hardware/driver issues

[15:50:09]

sphery:

and I have no idea how to even go about helping someone else to figure out what's going on

[15:51:11]

devinheitmuell-1:

I've had to have customers ship me entire servers in order for me to debug these sorts of things.

[15:51:18]

sphery:

wow

[15:51:33]

sphery:

this is why I'm glad I'm a software guy, instead of hardware/drivers/kernel stuff

[15:51:34]

devinheitmuell-1:

(the case with the floppy drive was one such case)

[15:51:49]

wagnerrp:

does Sage simply no longer exist?

[15:52:11]

sphery:

but sage isn't free, and we all know that not-free is evil

[15:52:24]

wagnerrp:

i mean they used to sell commercial units that did exactly what this guy wants

[15:52:25]

sphery:

(lack of capitalization of free was intentional)

[15:52:32]

sphery:

right

[15:52:37]

wagnerrp:

but i dont know if they still do after being bought by google

[15:53:12]

devinheitmuell-1:

I thought their whole product line got killed.

[15:53:17]

devinheitmuell-1:

(but I could be wrong)

[15:53:27]

sphery:

wagnerrp: just let google record all the tv channels on the planet and put up a search engine

[15:53:31]

sphery:

shouldn't need more than one

[15:53:57]

sphery:

yeah, their website is completely useless: http://www.sagetv.com/index.html

[15:54:26]

lapion (lapion!~axion@axion.xs4all.nl) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[15:54:41]

wagnerrp:

well thats effectively what was happening

[15:55:14]

wagnerrp:

record all the channels, rip the subtitles out of VBI, and provide a nice web application to search and clip video segments

[15:55:27]

drindt (drindt!~drindt@217.110.53.72) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:56:03]

devinheitmuell-1:

wagnerrp: Yeah, that's how "Google video" worked.

[15:56:14]

sphery:

yeah, but these days it should just be a cloud thing, because cloud is the future!

[15:56:27]

wagnerrp:

to be honest, i never much used google video

[15:56:51]

sphery:

and all the companies that sell this product to other companies can go work on something else, of course

[15:57:02]

devinheitmuell-1:

It wasn't half bad, and worked exactly as you described – they used the closed captioning data as an index for searching the video.

[15:57:29]

wagnerrp:

this is the youtube-alternative that was killed off several years back?

[15:57:37]

devinheitmuell-1:

wagnerrp: yup

[15:58:02]

wagnerrp:

they had TV broadcasts on there?

[15:58:22]

devinheitmuell-1:

At one point they did, but it was mostly oriented around news.

[15:58:28]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[15:58:36]

wagnerrp:

how did they ever manage that copyright snafu?

[15:58:38]

devinheitmuell-1:

… and the clip segments were limited in size.

[15:58:40]

devinheitmuell-1:

Fair use?

[15:59:32]

wagnerrp:

hard to tell what constitutes fair use these days

[15:59:43]

devinheitmuell-1:

indeed.

[15:59:53]

Goga777 (Goga777!~Goga777@2.95.77.87) has joined #mythtv-users

[15:59:53]

devinheitmuell-1:

The answer would be "nothing" if you ask the content providers.

[16:00:44]

wagnerrp:

personally, im a fan of "yeah, you licensed its use, but you used it too much so give us all the moneys"

[16:01:25]

octavsly (octavsly!~octavsly@static.ip-80-255-245-177.signet.nl) has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)

[16:01:26]

wagnerrp:

so bittersweet...

[16:01:41]

wagnerrp:

youre a slave to the copyright owners then you die...

[16:02:08]

devinheitmuell-1:

"Initially, the content of a number of broadcasting companies (such as ABC, NBC, CNN) was available as free streaming content or stills with closed captioning."

[16:02:11]

devinheitmuell-1:

I guess that's how they did it...

[16:03:08]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:03:23]

sphery:

I've always found it interesting that people think that if they record a TV broadcast, they "own" a copy of that show.

[16:03:39]

wagnerrp:

so a man walks into a bar with his parrot and zebra...

[16:03:52]

sphery:

that's a very interesting interpretation of copyright/contract law, considering there's no agreement between the owner of the content and the person who recorded it

[16:03:54]

wagnerrp:

the cops arrest him for driving there with a .14 BAC

[16:04:19]

sphery:

and, my interpretation of the "time shifting" fair use exclusion is that you can record it, then watch it at a later time, but you can't archive it forever/keep it

[16:04:33]

sphery:

very different from many users' opinions

[16:04:47]

wagnerrp:

sphery: amazingly, it was in iowa, not florida

[16:04:52]

sphery:

hehe

[16:05:03]

hpeter (hpeter!~hpeter@zux221-184-024.adsl.green.ch) has quit (Quit: hpeter)

[16:06:39]

wagnerrp:

i see it this way... anything that comes into my house uninvited is mine to do with as i please

[16:07:40]

wagnerrp:

copyright doesnt come into play until i try to take that information off my premises

[16:07:43]

** devinheitmuell-1 will never set foot in wagnerrp's house. :-) **

[16:07:53]

wagnerrp:

uninvited...

[16:08:00]

devinheitmuell-1:

oh, never mind then.

[16:08:03]

wagnerrp:

you break into my house, youre fair game

[16:08:30]

wagnerrp:

the broadcasts just come they were never asked for

[16:09:39]

highzeth (highzeth!~hz@hoiseth.no) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:09:44]

wagnerrp:

i never asked to receive the light my neighbor is reflecting off her glistening body out her bathroom window, so its perfectly fine for me to expose a video sensor to it...

[16:11:10]

wagnerrp:

well that certainly killed the chat... :)

[16:11:11]

lapion (lapion!~axion@axion.xs4all.nl) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:11:22]

joki (joki!~joki@p54863034.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

[16:11:36]

joki- (joki-!~joki@p54864F95.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:11:45]

joki- is now known as joki

[16:21:53]

amessina (amessina!~amessina@2001:470:1f11:a4:d6be:d9ff:fe8d:7c1e) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:27:11]

Goga777 (Goga777!~Goga777@2.95.77.87) has quit (Quit: Leaving)

[16:34:45]

RagingComputer (RagingComputer!~RagingCom@ip98-161-58-87.om.om.cox.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[16:36:06]

kyew (kyew!~kyew@c-67-182-103-18.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)

[16:41:34]

drindt (drindt!~drindt@217.110.53.72) has quit (Quit: Mary had a little segmentation fault)

[16:47:24]

kyew (kyew!~kyew@c-67-182-103-18.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:00:56]

bentech_ (bentech_!~bentech@87-194-161-211.bethere.co.uk) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:03:17]

bentech (bentech!~bentech@87-194-161-211.bethere.co.uk) has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)

[17:03:18]

bentech_ is now known as bentech

[17:07:01]

highzeth (highzeth!~hz@hoiseth.no) has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)

[17:09:27]

highzeth (highzeth!~hz@hoiseth.no) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:10:11]

sphery:

wagnerrp: btw, been meaning to ask you... on the Dragon launch, the flames/glow were markedly red/pink (with a tinge of orange) compared to the other launches I've seen. Any idea what causes that?

[17:10:35]

sphery:

doesn't show that well in the videos/pictures, but was pronounced IRL

[17:11:04]

wagnerrp:

compared to... the space shuttle?

[17:11:13]

sphery:

kerosene typically burns a more yellow color, at least in non-rocket applications

[17:11:22]

sphery:

compared to shuttle and Atlas and Delta launches

[17:12:07]

wagnerrp:

the shuttle and delta 4 are both LH2, not RP1

[17:12:35]

wagnerrp:

they basically burn clear

[17:12:58]

wagnerrp:

and the only flames youre going to see are particulate in the surrounding atmosphere heating up and glowing

[17:13:15]

wagnerrp:

of course the SRBs give off tons of crap

[17:13:35]

sphery:

yeah, I guess Atlas is kerosene/ox in first stage, but might not be as pronounced color due to solid boosters

[17:13:57]

wagnerrp:

why it would look different from the RP-1 Atlas, dont knokw

[17:15:34]

sphery:

anyway, was definitely a strange sight... yellow and orange are familiar, but the red/pink was weird

[17:16:10]

sphery:

yellow, orange, and even some white are familiar

[17:16:18]

wagnerrp:

perhaps what youre seeing on the Atlas launches is gasses from an ablative nozzle and combustion chamber

[17:16:30]

wagnerrp:

while the Falcon is regeneratively cooled

[17:16:39]

sphery:

interesting

[17:16:54]

wagnerrp:

the RD-180 on the Atlas is a russian design

[17:17:03]

wagnerrp:

and they tended to make their stuff much more simplistic

[17:17:14]

wagnerrp:

(since they didnt have the manufacturing capability to match our complex engines)

[17:19:59]

NightMonkey (NightMonkey!~NightrMon@pdpc/supporter/professional/nightmonkey) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:21:46]

jarle (jarle!~jarle@70.84-234-133.customer.lyse.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:29:18]

kormoc (kormoc!~kormoc@mythtv/developer/kormoc) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:29:18]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[17:34:02]

jarle (jarle!~jarle@70.84-234-133.customer.lyse.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[17:36:46]

jarle (jarle!~jarle@70.84-234-133.customer.lyse.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:49:47]

Twiggy2cents:

Before I hunt through the logs, is there any known issue with commercial detection not being run when the rule is marked to run it?

[17:50:34]

wagnerrp:

there is a potential issue where if you have multiple jobs set to run automatically for a single recording, they may not be

[17:50:45]

kmcorbett (kmcorbett!~kmcorbett@dhcp-140-247-179-53.fas.harvard.edu) has joined #mythtv-users

[17:50:48]

Twiggy2cents:

It only happens every so often. A manual commercial detection from the fe works fine.

[17:50:52]

wagnerrp:

ive seen a couple complaints, but no confirmation

[17:51:03]

Twiggy2cents:

The only other job I have for any of my rules is grab metadata

[17:51:04]

wagnerrp:

and skimming through the code, i dont see how that could happen

[17:51:18]

wagnerrp:

the complaints are usually that mythmetadatalookup does not get run

[17:52:13]

Twiggy2cents:

I also have an issue where mythfilldatabase runs automatically according to the mythfilldatabase.log but nothing shows up in the backend log and nothing gets inserted. Manually running it makes it work fine.

[17:52:33]

Twiggy2cents:

That is running with option --dd-grab-all. Both when manual and when automatic

[17:53:29]

wagnerrp:

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/05/09/in . . . urce-part-1/

[17:53:46]

fa2k (fa2k!~fa2k@blackhole.lan.fa2k.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[18:02:05]

Steve-Goodey (Steve-Goodey!~steve@host86-160-43-123.range86-160.btcentralplus.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[18:04:06]

spamjunkie (spamjunkie!~spamjunki@c-68-46-29-108.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[18:07:40]

sphery:

Twiggy2cents: there are rumors that jobs aren't run on back-to-back recordings

[18:07:46]

sphery:

(the 2nd of them)

[18:09:03]

sphery:

Twiggy2cents: as far as mythfilldatabase, it will log to its own file, if you start mythbackend properly... you need to look in the directory specified by --logpath or in a file as determined by your syslog configuration

[18:26:21]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[18:26:57]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[18:27:22]

zombor_ is now known as zombor

[18:27:41]

faichele (faichele!~quassel@d16-77.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de) has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)

[18:44:42]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[18:48:02]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:01:08]

NightMonkey (NightMonkey!~NightrMon@pdpc/supporter/professional/nightmonkey) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)

[19:04:14]

faichele_ (faichele_!~quassel@p4FCCFEEB.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:11:28]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)

[19:12:33]

brfransen (brfransen!~brfransen@64.179.142.146) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:18:38]

Jordack:

Question about the filldatabase issue. I get "Invalid mythfilldatabase log path: /var/log/mythfilldatabase.log is not writable." Where can I change that, and can it be done from mysql? (at work only have ssh access)

[19:18:55]

Jordack:

i guess it shoudl be /var/log/mythtv/

[19:20:26]

wagnerrp:

i dont know how you even got that error

[19:20:32]

wagnerrp:

not on 0.25 anyway

[19:20:40]

Jordack:

guess im special

[19:21:30]

Jordack:

ill add --logpath to the custom stuffe "db-grab-all line) now to fint it in the db

[19:22:50]

natanojl (natanojl!~jonatan@c83-252-237-63.bredband.comhem.se) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:26:34]

octavsly (octavsly!~octavsly@195-241-111-6.ip.telfort.nl) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:29:40]

Jordack:

or i couls cange this value MythFillDatabaseLog

[19:31:35]

wagnerrp:

i dont know what that file is

[19:32:03]

Jordack:

well ill give it a go and see if it runs tonight.

[19:33:17]

Oleg_:

why do you still add changes to 0.24 branch?

[19:33:19]

Oleg_:

Look:

[19:33:21]

Oleg_:

e12af86..fe9bd6d fixes/0.24 -> origin/fixes/0.24

[19:40:58]

Jordack:

was music moved into storage groups?

[19:41:22]

wagnerrp:

not yet

[19:41:46]

wagnerrp:

Oleg_: if its something simple that can be directly cherry picked, little reason not to

[19:44:45]

pmhahn (pmhahn!~pmhahn@2001:4dd0:ff00:8d31:219:dbff:fef2:e135) has joined #mythtv-users

[19:44:54]

nutron (nutron!~nutron@unaffiliated/nutron) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[19:46:17]

devinheitmuell-1:

brfransen: kernellabs.com is back up now.

[19:57:09]

sphery:

Jordack: yeah, you should update to 0.25-fixes, since it has much improved logging and can't get that error with mythfilldatabase

[19:58:36]

sphery:

Oleg_: that one, particularly, because the bug it fixes causes MythTV to delete new recordings when there are already-deleted old recordings still on disk

[19:58:44]

sphery:

i.e. it's a pretty major bug

[19:59:05]

sphery:

because it results in affected users losing recordings they shouldn't

[19:59:29]

Jordack:

guess i shoudl run yum update more often.

[20:02:29]

Steve-Goodey (Steve-Goodey!~steve@host86-160-43-123.range86-160.btcentralplus.com) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[20:05:20]

nutron (nutron!~nutron@unaffiliated/nutron) has joined #mythtv-users

[20:09:42]

Oleg_:

how can recordings be "deleted", but at the same time "remain on a disk"?

[20:09:56]

wagnerrp:

because they are marked as candidate for deletion

[20:09:59]

wagnerrp:

its like the recycle bin

[20:10:01]

Oleg_:

ok

[20:10:19]

wagnerrp:

default behavior is to delete within a few minutes of marking them for such

[20:10:24]

wagnerrp:

or you can have it delay a set number of days

[20:10:35]

wagnerrp:

or you can have it delay until it actually needs the free space for other recordings

[20:10:46]

discernica (discernica!~bfleming@76-10-179-162.dsl.teksavvy.com) has joined #mythtv-users

[20:16:22]

discernica:

Question on mythvideo / videometadata. Occasionally I will run a scan, but my videos folder is offline (an NFS share). mythvideo will delete all the rows from videometadata. I'm wondering if there is a setting for this behaviour? IIRC it actually used to ask first...

[20:16:47]

discernica:

I'd like this as I have parental controls and other info I want to make sure is retained

[20:20:45]

wagnerrp:

why not just run an instance of mythmediaserver on your NFS server?

[20:20:59]

wagnerrp:

or stuff those drives in your backend?

[20:21:50]

wagnerrp:

if the backend the content lives on is unavailable, that content is skipped during the scan

[20:22:37]

discernica:

things just got moved around due to space issues. have never used mythmediaserver

[20:22:55]

wagnerrp:

same as mythbackend, but with all the recording guts removed

[20:23:02]

discernica:

I put most videos on another machine, left recordings on the backend

[20:23:12]

wagnerrp:

only exists to serve up storage group content

[20:23:19]

discernica:

what if someone had a NAS or something, might have the same problem...?

[20:23:43]

wagnerrp:

i would likely tell them to pull the drives from the NAS, and shove them in their backend

[20:25:36]

discernica:

a search for mythmediaserver tells me you're biased ;-)

[20:26:07]

wagnerrp:

well then just run an instance of mythbackend, tunerless in an unsupported fashion

[20:26:21]

wagnerrp:

more or less the same thing

[20:27:06]

wagnerrp:

at the moment, there is no mechanism for the video library scanner to know content is inaccessible, rather than simply deleted

[20:27:13]

wagnerrp:

so, it removes it from the database

[20:27:37]

discernica:

do you rmember if it used to ask? something like "Can't find...Delete? Yes/No/All"

[20:27:59]

ujee (ujee!~MMlosh@2001:718:1e03:5168:a51d:d1f:6a5b:8fba) has quit (Quit: Bye...)

[20:28:00]

wagnerrp:

the only time that wont happen is when there is no accessible server for the hostname it is thought to be on

[20:28:13]

wagnerrp:

mythvideo hasnt behaved that way in years, not since 0.21

[20:28:26]

discernica:

is mythmediaserver (eventually?) intended to be a dlna thing?

[20:28:51]

wagnerrp:

currently, it is intended to serve any content internally to mythtv

[20:29:28]

wagnerrp:

any machine with static or removable storage, and no tuner cards to give reason to run a full mythbackend

[20:30:04]

dmfrey (dmfrey!~dmfrey@webdefence.cluster-h.websense.net) has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)

[20:30:05]

wagnerrp:

i intend to try to move all optical disk, removable media access, and mediamonitor stuff to that

[20:30:13]

wagnerrp:

so it is out of the frontend, and accessible to all connected frontends

[20:30:18]

discernica:

ok

[20:30:43]

wagnerrp:

as for DLNA, i assume the UPnP server is capable of proxying content from remote backends over the internal protocol

[20:31:05]

wagnerrp:

which would mean any content on a machine running a mythmediaserver instance would be accessible over DLNA

[20:31:10]

wagnerrp:

but i dont know for certain

[20:31:30]

discernica:

ya, you'd think

[20:33:16]

dekarl (dekarl!~dekarl@p4FCEFE37.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[20:34:42]

wagnerrp:

sphery: i really need to get mythbackend transitioned over to the protocol server library before 0.26

[20:35:06]

wagnerrp:

too much stuff keeps changing in mainserver.cpp, its going to be a pain to keep the behavior synchronized if they remain independent much longer

[20:36:06]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[20:55:24]

NightMonkey (NightMonkey!~NightrMon@pdpc/supporter/professional/nightmonkey) has joined #mythtv-users

[21:05:18]

discernica (discernica!~bfleming@76-10-179-162.dsl.teksavvy.com) has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)

[21:08:51]

pmhahn (pmhahn!~pmhahn@2001:4dd0:ff00:8d31:219:dbff:fef2:e135) has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)

[21:09:33]

peitolm:

wagnerrp: mythmediaserver, how do you get contents for it? just have it nfs mounted on the recorder, and it magically works out that the recordings aren't local, but are on another backend?

[21:09:42]

lukeo (lukeo!~Adium@ip98-169-58-239.dc.dc.cox.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[21:09:48]

wagnerrp:

huh?

[21:09:59]

wagnerrp:

contents for what?

[21:10:06]

peitolm:

recordings

[21:10:18]

peitolm:

s/contents for/content to/

[21:10:34]

peitolm:

s|content|content/recordings|

[21:10:44]

wagnerrp:

its not for recordings

[21:10:54]

wagnerrp:

if youre going to record, youre going to need tuners, and a full mythbackend

[21:11:06]

wagnerrp:

its only for other storage group content

[21:11:12]

wagnerrp:

which at the moment means the video library

[21:11:19]

peitolm:

ah, so it's not for recordings

[21:11:36]

wagnerrp:

or... if you are scrapping some tuners, but leaving the hard drives in place

[21:11:44]

wagnerrp:

you could simply run mythmediaserver rather than mythbackend

[21:12:41]

peitolm:

well, say my main backend has a couple of tuners, but little disk space, however i have another box with lots of disk, but no tuners, in the past I'd just export storage from the box with disk over to the box with tuners via NFS

[21:13:12]

peitolm:

recordings would sometimes stall/break if the NFS connection went

[21:13:59]

peitolm:

i'm probably trying to do stuff past the point of support, so i'll shut-up and go back to packing

[21:19:19]

Jordack (Jordack!~jordack@h69-131-44-221.plmomi.dedicated.static.tds.net) has quit ()

[21:21:15]

wagnerrp:

mythtv has no logic to know that a recording is local to a backend other than where it was recorded

[21:21:49]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: hey, What did you mean when you told me to update when you were helping me with mythvidexport

[21:22:55]

cocoa117 (cocoa117!~cocoa117@188-222-31-239.zone13.bethere.co.uk) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[21:24:14]

wagnerrp:

i meant... http://code.mythtv.org/cgit/mythtv/commit/myt . . . 0779aceb2b7d

[21:28:00]

Shadow__X:

oh ok awesome. How i apply those changes?

[21:28:57]

wagnerrp:

how do you normally install?

[21:29:08]

Shadow__X:

through the mythbuntu repos

[21:29:19]

wagnerrp:

wait for them to pick up the change, and update

[21:33:10]

Shadow__X:

ok thanks

[21:39:47]

cocoa117 (cocoa117!~cocoa117@188-222-31-239.zone13.bethere.co.uk) has joined #mythtv-users

[21:43:38]

natanojl (natanojl!~jonatan@c83-252-237-63.bredband.comhem.se) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)

[21:46:46]

bentech (bentech!~bentech@87-194-161-211.bethere.co.uk) has quit (Quit: bentech)

[21:47:28]

tlhiv_laptop (tlhiv_laptop!~foo@c-69-254-218-89.hsd1.al.comcast.net) has quit (Read error: No route to host)

[21:50:20]

CiaranG (CiaranG!~CiaranG@fsf/member/CiaranG) has quit (Quit: Leaving.)

[21:54:45]

Twiggy2cents:

sphery, it does. But I thought there would be an entry in the backend for when it inserted it. But I guess there wouldnt be since it puts them straight into the db

[21:56:33]

Twiggy2cents:

http://paste.ubuntu.com/1003791/

[21:56:46]

fa2k (fa2k!~fa2k@blackhole.lan.fa2k.net) has quit (Quit: leaving)

[21:56:53]

Twiggy2cents:

That is my mythfilldatabase log. It failed for both days in the log

[21:58:26]

octavsly (octavsly!~octavsly@195-241-111-6.ip.telfort.nl) has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

[21:59:18]

Tod4Dd (Tod4Dd!~Top4Dd@c-98-210-185-123.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[22:01:38]

Twiggy2cents:

CoreContext filldata.cpp:272 (GrabDDData) Grab complete. Actual data from Sun May 20 00:00:00 2012 to Tue Jun 5 23:59:59 2012 (UTC)

[22:01:42]

Twiggy2cents:

Is it stuck in the past?

[22:01:50]

Twiggy2cents:

That was from today when it ran

[22:02:59]

streeter (streeter!streeter@nat/redhat/x-gnditlmgfsczyzvs) has quit (Quit: Leaving)

[22:16:29]

wagnerrp:

no, it grabs a few days in the past as well

[22:17:46]

earthw0rm (earthw0rm!~earthworm@94-30-60-74.xdsl.murphx.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[22:18:00]

earthw0rm:

Hi lads, I've got some channels that aren't getting the over the air guide information for them

[22:22:01]

sphery:

Twiggy2cents: what do you mean it failed? Are you talking about the useless message in backend status that says, "no new data was inserted, this could indicate a failure" or whatever?

[22:22:23]

sphery:

both those runs seem to have worked properly

[22:24:50]

sphery:

(given the data that we received... I'm guessing that either TMS will get more data in the next day or 2 or your SD account is messed up and you need to log in to the website and "Re-add all lineups"

[22:26:37]

earthw0rm (earthw0rm!~earthworm@94-30-60-74.xdsl.murphx.net) has quit (Quit: earthw0rm)

[22:27:54]

sphery:

peitolm: let mythtv record to local storage, then have a script to move those recordings to the NFS storage: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/516083#516083

[22:40:11]

peitolm:

sphery: that's what i do at the moment, (post recording job to move file from local to remote) but i also run mythbackend on the remote

[22:40:30]

peitolm:

it's probably broken in too many ways, but it seems to work (mostly, apart from the previews for mythweb)

[22:42:35]

wagnerrp:

im not entirely certain if mythmediaserver actually supports all the necessary calls to serve recordings

[22:42:51]

wagnerrp:

ive only tested it, and only briefly, for video library content

[22:47:35]

wagnerrp:

sphery: would a 9400M even have enough power for 2x greedy?

[22:50:04]

zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has joined #mythtv-users

[22:54:47]

kormoc (kormoc!~kormoc@mythtv/developer/kormoc) has quit (Quit: kormoc)

[22:55:49]

sphery:

wagnerrp: not sure about which deinterlacers would work

[22:56:03]

sphery:

but isn't that the same gpu as used by ion?

[22:56:10]

wagnerrp:

yes

[22:56:13]

sphery:

if so, I'd think it would be good enough to make someone happy

[22:56:28]

wagnerrp:

is it possible we changed the playback profile out from under him to something that stuttered?

[22:57:09]

wagnerrp:

this bitrate viewer thing is pretty cool

[22:57:52]

tlhiv_laptop (tlhiv_laptop!~foo@c-69-254-218-89.hsd1.al.comcast.net) has joined #mythtv-users

[23:04:01]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I still think your resolution is correct--and the 108% CPU seems to indicate it is, too

[23:04:13]

sphery:

maybe it's just differences in playback profile/handling

[23:04:35]

sphery:

and/or better/more-resource-intensive processing with newer version

[23:04:40]

sphery:

but he's definitely hitting a limit

[23:04:57]

sphery:

and I don't think it's our responsibility to make ffmpeg decoding more efficient

[23:05:12]

sphery:

(decoding/deinterlacing/...)

[23:06:07]

andreax (andreax!~andreaz@p54BF32E5.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

[23:19:38]

sphery:

wagnerrp: ooh, that's a good question--the removal of cpu* means he could well be using a different one, that's not ideal (such as it switching to High Quality)

[23:20:07]

sphery:

cpu* being CPU++, CPU+, and CPU-- playback profile groups

[23:37:29]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@220-245-190-74.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #mythtv-users

[23:37:29]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@unaffiliated/mycosys) has joined #mythtv-users

[23:37:29]

mycosys (mycosys!~mycosys@220-245-190-74.static.tpgi.com.au) has quit (Changing host)

[23:46:01]

pheld (pheld!~heldal@cl-5.osl-01.no.sixxs.net) has quit (Quit: Leaving.)

[23:53:34]

kmcorbett (kmcorbett!~kmcorbett@dhcp-140-247-179-53.fas.harvard.edu) has quit (Quit: Leaving.)

[23:56:14]

faichele_ (faichele_!~quassel@p4FCCFEEB.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)

[23:58:59]

bentech (bentech!~bentech@87-194-161-211.bethere.co.uk) has joined #mythtv-users

[23:59:03]

Twiggy2cents:

sphery, yes I am talking about the useless message. Although it was correct, I had only 13 days of data. A manual run ups that back to 15. This is every time. Did you see the part about it was grabbing data from a range of 2 days ago – 2 weeks after that?

MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

Current users (168):