Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Friday, April 20th, 2012, 00:05 UTC

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[00:27:32]

wagnerrp:

gah... NBC did a news cut in right after the start of the show, rather than right after the end of the commercial

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[00:48:26]

sphery:

why are so many people still running (and just now upgrading from) 0.21?

[00:48:40]

wagnerrp:

no idea

[00:48:53]

wagnerrp:

but hey... at least we wont be caught so off guard next time

[00:49:21]

sphery:

hehe, yeah

[00:49:26]

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[00:49:34]

kelli:

Hi everyne

[00:49:35]

sphery:

we'll know they're still running 0.25 in 2016

[00:49:47]

sphery:

hello

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[00:50:02]

kelli:

Is everyone in favor of the ION vs AMD's E-350s?

[00:50:12]

kelli:

Im guessing most are since vpdau

[00:50:17]

wagnerrp:

trick question?

[00:50:53]

kelli:

wagnerrp, Just a preference I presume..

[00:51:13]

wagnerrp:

erm... pass?

[00:51:24]

kelli:

I'm looking to add some mini itx boxes behind my TVs

[00:51:30]

kelli:

To serve as frontends

[00:52:23]

sphery:

I'd recommend core i3 mini itx's?

[00:53:01]

kelli:

With a gt520 or something?

[00:53:14]

kelli:

Im looking to go at a max of 250$

[00:53:21]

sphery:

(neither Atom nor E-350 can do much in the way of software decode of video--maybe some low-bitrate SDTV, so you haven't any headroom when you need it)

[00:53:40]

kelli:

The IONs looks to perform fairly well with VPDAU support

[00:53:42]

sphery:

gt520 or gt430 or gt220 or gt210 should work...

[00:53:49]

wagnerrp:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186211

[00:53:57]

wagnerrp:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116407

[00:54:27]

sphery:

though some may/may not be able to use the best/most-resource-intensive deinterlacers for some 60fps material

[00:54:38]

wagnerrp:

i3–2100T would give you a bit more headroom, at significantly higher cost

[00:55:17]

kelli:

wagnerrp, The only issue I think Id have with some of the core i3's are the fans

[00:55:38]

wagnerrp:

something like a G850/G860 would be better, but theyre 65W parts, as opposed to those 35W parts

[00:57:26]

wagnerrp:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185174

[00:58:33]

kelli:

That's a big fan. Should be a lot quieter then most. But for 50$ that seems a bit pricey. I guess I could go diskless/thin and save $$ there

[01:00:39]

wagnerrp:

you could probably use the stock HS, and strap one of these to the inside of the case vent http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185163

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[01:01:54]

kelli:

wagnerrp, Yeah, I'm debating on some of the zotac nano's. Im just looking at size / performance for the $$

[01:02:06]

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[01:02:08]

wagnerrp:

personally, i would just cut the top vent off and leave the heatsink exposed

[01:02:28]

wagnerrp:

stuff it in some internal corner of a cabinet so you cant see it

[01:02:38]

red_one:

if i installed mythbuntu 11.10 and do a apt-get upgrade, will i get mythtv 0.25?

[01:02:48]

wagnerrp:

or forgo the case entirely and bolt it to the inside of the cabinet

[01:03:42]

kelli:

wagnerrp, Actually – I could throw this downstairs in the central rack

[01:03:52]

kelli:

I have spare inputs opened on my hdmi cat6 matrix

[01:03:56]

red_one:

i've got the dreaded "error opening jump program file" issue

[01:03:57]

red_one:

le sigh

[01:03:58]

wagnerrp:

or that, i do that one one of my machines

[01:04:05]

kelli:

red_one, OMG me too!!

[01:04:16]

wagnerrp:

big old beige case on a wire shelf in the basement

[01:04:23]

kelli:

wagnerrp, I do need a VEAS mount for the bedroom though

[01:04:34]

red_one:

kelli: oh?

[01:04:34]

kelli:

We just got one of those track ceiling mounts for our TV

[01:04:35]

wagnerrp:

HDMI cable run up through the floor for audio/video, USB for remote

[01:05:57]

red_one:

what's the most common cause of "error opening jump program file"? google was no help

[01:06:25]

kelli:

red_one, I cant get rid of my jump file error. It was working for the longest time, then livetv just died with that error.

[01:06:34]

kelli:

wagnerrp, sounds like a really nice setup

[01:07:03]

wagnerrp:

red_one: livetv or recorded?

[01:07:07]

red_one:

live

[01:07:29]

kelli:

I currently have to record a show – just so I can watch it.

[01:07:35]

wagnerrp:

usually means the backend failed to record

[01:07:40]

wagnerrp:

need to look at backend logs, not frontend

[01:07:52]

sphery:

"old bug whereby Mythtv shows the space free on the root filesystem rather than on the filesystem where recordings are kept"???

[01:07:57]

red_one:

seriously, the mythtv devs need to improve their error codes

[01:08:21]

wagnerrp:

sphery: yeah, not one ive ever heard of

[01:08:41]

wagnerrp:

having rewritten all that code in the past year, its not one that i saw as a potential issue

[01:09:23]

sphery:

red_one: you do want to upgrade to 0.25-fixes if you're getting that error

[01:09:37]

kelli:

sphery, I'm on 0.25-fixes and Im having the same issue.

[01:09:47]

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[01:10:06]

sphery:

just saying that there's no hope of a fix if you're not on 0.25

[01:10:08]

red_one:

sphery: ah ok. will an apt-get update on my mythbuntu 11.10 give me 0.25-fixes?

[01:10:19]

sphery:

on 0.25, there has been a lot of work on live tv stuff

[01:10:23]

red_one:

ok

[01:10:26]

red_one:

i'll try that tonight

[01:10:52]

sphery:

and some work still continuing for what might be the last issue

[01:10:55]

sphery:

(possibly what you're seeing)

[01:11:00]

sphery:

at least last /major/ issue

[01:11:18]

sphery:

I'll leave it to someone else to help with Ubuntu stuff--I don't know my 'buntu

[01:11:43]

kelli:

25.0+fixes.20120418

[01:11:52]

red_one:

ok.

[01:11:58]

kelli:

And liveTV is broken with that error.

[01:12:04]

kelli:

Used to work for like 2–3 weeks. Then it just died.

[01:12:34]

red_one:

ah

[01:12:35]

red_one:

ha

[01:12:39]

red_one:

so you're using the latest 0.25

[01:12:43]

red_one:

and it's broken for you too?

[01:12:47]

red_one:

that's funny

[01:12:49]

kelli:

red_one, Yes.. :-(

[01:12:56]

red_one:

and by funny

[01:12:58]

red_one:

i mean !@#$

[01:13:26]

kelli:

wagnerrp, So you have a mini itx box tucked away in the closet. Does your case have IR or did you use a USB receiver?

[01:15:17]

wagnerrp:

no, one big beige box hidden in the basement, another hidden behind a big entertainment center with homemade sound dampening

[01:15:44]

red_one:

god i wish mythtv was easier to set up. i'm trying to sell it to my parents. le sigh.

[01:16:07]

red_one:

i wish it had a "ive detected your tv tuner, and used a bunch of defaults, here's a tv channel i found!"

[01:16:13]

red_one:

option.

[01:16:14]

red_one:

heh.

[01:16:25]

kelli:

red_one, I just want liveTV back :-(

[01:16:32]

red_one:

yes, me too.

[01:16:37]

red_one:

s/back/at all/

[01:17:00]

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[01:17:03]

kelli:

I just have to record the channel on the guide, then go back and watch the recording as it streams. Works fine that way

[01:19:17]

red_one:

ouch

[01:20:00]

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[01:20:42]

sphery:

red_one: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/514549#514549

[01:21:25]

red_one:

sphery: ok, so i'll dist-upgrade it then

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[01:27:57]

map7:

I've just started getting the error 'Tuner X has an error' on an old MythTV 0.23 machine. I've got many tuners and they all show up as errors.

[01:28:04]

map7:

Can anyone help?

[01:28:08]

kelli:

0.23

[01:28:14]

** kelli cuts wrists **

[01:28:18]

wagnerrp:

need to see more than that

[01:33:30]

SmallR2002:

-*- kelli cuts wrists | <wagnerrp> need to see more than that

[01:33:32]

SmallR2002:

:/

[01:34:17]

map7:

wagnerrp, I'm trying to find the error in a log file such as mythbackend.log or something. Should I run mythfrontend in debug mode?

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wagnerrp:

SmallR2002: seppuku or it doesnt count!

[01:43:08]

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[01:43:08]

kelli:

I wonder how hard it would be to integrate a system with XBMC and Myths EPG over the new .25 http api

[01:44:40]

kelli:

mythbox is alright .. but its not pretty.

[01:45:30]

jya:

finally… after years of appeals.. http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/more-news/hi . . . 226334200625

[01:45:32]

RagingMind:

kelli, try a new theme?

[01:46:10]

kelli:

RagingComputer, Suggestions for mythbox?

[01:46:21]

jya:

for the background, iiNet (Australia #3 ISP) was sued because it failed to pass on customer details when asked.

[01:46:21]

** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/3 **

[01:46:43]

kelli:

lol poor bot.

[01:47:06]

kelli:

7 years ago

[01:47:14]

RagingMind:

kelli, with so much variation in personal taste I suggesting loading up the theme browser and going through all of them to see what you think

[01:47:28]

jya:

the film companies also wanted iiNet to suspend of terminate user accounts

[01:47:36]

kelli:

Mythbox has themes? RagingComputer

[01:47:45]

kelli:

Bah RagingMind ^

[01:48:13]

map7:

kelli, Have you tried: https://github.com/tsp/xbmc/tree/master/xbmc/ . . . mythtv-cmyth

[01:48:29]

map7:

I've been using this version of xbmc as a front end to a 0.25 machine

[01:49:06]

map7:

It integrates LiveTV, EPG & recordings nicely into xbmc without the need for mythbox

[01:49:19]

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[01:49:56]

kelli:

map7, wow I have not

[01:49:59]

kelli:

looks ver y nice

[01:50:03]

kelli:

I may try this tonight

[01:50:33]

kelli:

map7, How long does it take for a channel to tune in?

[01:50:40]

kelli:

Right now im at about 1–2 seconds if that

[01:50:49]

map7:

the same amount

[01:50:49]

wagnerrp:

please say they scrapped cmyth...

[01:50:58]

wagnerrp:

and thats just coincidentally the same name

[01:51:28]

kelli:

map7, Does this work with remote backends?

[01:51:49]

map7:

kelli, I haven't tried that

[01:52:13]

map7:

in the config you can enter an IP address so I don't see why not

[01:52:55]

wagnerrp:

if its the same old cmyth as before, it should not be used

[01:53:19]

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[01:53:23]

map7:

wagnerrp, what's up with cmyth?

[01:53:55]

wagnerrp:

cmyth was one of the big offenders of just parroting back the backend's protocol version to force a connection

[01:54:04]

RagingComputer:

:-/

[01:54:34]

wagnerrp:

mythbox did a proper version check, leaving content streaming up to cmyth

[01:54:49]

wagnerrp:

and that behavior hasnt changed in a long time, so while bad, was relatively harmless

[01:55:14]

kelli:

So long as its pretty and functional in the front end idc ;-)

[01:55:18]

wagnerrp:

if cmyth is now handling all protocol communication....

[01:56:56]

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[02:00:52]

map7:

wagnerrp, I can see the adapters in /dev/dvb/adapterX

[02:02:46]

wagnerrp:

map7: are you able to use the tuners in any other application like vlc?

[02:02:55]

wagnerrp:

are there any errors reported in dmesg?

[02:04:40]

map7:

yes VLC will play from my HDHomeRun network dual tuner

[02:05:26]

wagnerrp:

why would you have device nodes for an HDHomeRun?

[02:06:26]

map7:

I have three tuners, 1 x HVR2200 PCI-E, 1 x USB, 1 x HDHomeRun all of which are showing errors in mythtv

[02:07:02]

map7:

I'll just try the HVR2200 in vlc

[02:07:36]

wagnerrp:

cant really do anything with "Tuner X has an error"

[02:07:42]

wagnerrp:

with no context, thats completely meaningless

[02:08:02]

wagnerrp:

and i doubt any effort will be made to correct bugs in a 2yr old release

[02:08:13]

wagnerrp:

especially when there have been two more since

[02:08:30]

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[02:08:49]

wagnerrp:

there were issues with the HDHomeRun libraries back then, that required you use the autodetection

[02:08:50]

map7:

wagnerrp, is it easy to upgrade to mythtv 0.25 from 0.23?

[02:09:03]

wagnerrp:

if you tried to use the IP address directly, you would only be able to access the first tuner

[02:09:09]

wagnerrp:

but besides that, it should work

[02:09:25]

map7:

I tried the IP directly on the first tuner and got the same error

[02:09:43]

wagnerrp:

again, cant do anything without some context

[02:09:59]

wagnerrp:

not some excerpt from some line

[02:11:15]

map7:

This is a friends computer so I don't know what they have changed in the last week or two to break things. The HVR2200 & USB tuners were working happily a few weeks ago

[02:16:51]

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[02:17:11]

map7:

wagnerrp, I might upgrade it then.

[02:44:52]

** red_one waits for mythbuntu 12.04rc1 to be uploaded **

[02:51:12]

tgm4883:

red_one, uploaded where?

[02:52:03]

red_one:

cdimages :P

[02:52:50]

tgm4883:

red_one, that is something particular to you then?

[02:52:57]

tgm4883:

cause I'm not uploading any ISOs

[02:53:01]

red_one:

what?

[02:53:27]

tgm4883:

I'm not uploading RC1 to cdimages.mythbuntu.org

[02:53:39]

red_one:

oh

[02:53:49]

red_one:

i misread that emai

[02:53:50]

red_one:

l

[02:53:57]

red_one:

"no more uploading ISOs that aren't releases#

[02:54:16]

tgm4883:

you mean superm1's email?

[02:54:46]

tgm4883:

he should have linked to http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/mythbuntu/daily-live/current/

[02:54:59]

tgm4883:

we don't do big RC releases anymore

[02:55:14]

tgm4883:

after beta release, we just do daily images

[02:55:37]

red_one:

yuh

[02:55:41]

red_one:

i'll just grab that one

[02:55:42]

red_one:

and go

[02:55:48]

tgm4883:

sounds good

[02:58:56]

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[03:00:20]

bcgrown:

okay, maybe i'm blind... but with the DVR Service API, when I send a GetRecordedList, is there a unique ID for each recording? Is this what ProgramID is for, or does that ID come from the schedule?

[03:00:35]

bcgrown:

or should I just use the filename?

[03:00:55]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, I think you get episodeID don't you?

[03:01:36]

bcgrown:

tgm4883: not that I can see

[03:01:42]

tgm4883:

sec

[03:02:13]

bcgrown:

I get ProgramID: <ProgramId>SP002564610000</ProgramId>

[03:02:26]

tgm4883:

yea programID should be unique I believe

[03:02:42]

bcgrown:

ok

[03:02:52]

sphery:

programid is listings-provider ID for an episode (not a showing)

[03:02:53]

bcgrown:

is that generated or passed on from the schedule source?

[03:03:11]

sphery:

chanid/starttime is unique key for a program in listings

[03:03:17]

bcgrown:

oh, so it won't be unique if there are two recordings of the same episode (which would be dumb, but, y'know)

[03:03:30]

sphery:

won't be unique

[03:03:35]

sphery:

it's used for dup matching

[03:03:40]

tgm4883:

oh yea, didn't think about that

[03:03:48]

sphery:

i.e. each rerun is same programid

[03:04:14]

bcgrown:

wouldn't it be better to use programID+start time rather than chanid+start time?

[03:04:17]

tgm4883:

it uniquely would identify a show from another show, but not if you had two recordings of the same show

[03:04:19]

sphery:

currently we use chanid/starttime as unique key

[03:04:48]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, I don't think there would be a difference

[03:05:07]

sphery:

programid + starttime wouldn't be good because

[03:05:11]

sphery:

a) not everyone gets programid

[03:05:33]

sphery:

b) would bbe dups when you have same channel on multiple sources

[03:05:37]

bcgrown:

ah okay

[03:05:58]

tgm4883:

sphery, I stand corrected

[03:06:03]

tgm4883:

I think I'll go back to packing

[03:06:06]

sphery:

hehe

[03:06:41]

sphery:

we support lots of complex configurations that make it less than intuitive

[03:06:57]

sphery:

in most cases, though, you would be right

[03:07:38]

bcgrown:

now, next question... is there supposed to be some sequential numbering in the response to GetRecordedList (or any other lists for that matter), or is that simply left for the client to figure out?

[03:08:28]

tgm4883:

it's chronological order

[03:08:35]

sphery:

likely recordedlist is ordered by starttime

[03:08:39]

tgm4883:

by record date I think

[03:08:43]

sphery:

yeah

[03:09:08]

bcgrown:

correct, and it gives the recording count at the beginning, but there is no sequential numbering of recordings. i suppose that would be trivial for a client to handle

[03:09:10]

tgm4883:

since all programs would have that and and maybe not original airdate

[03:09:49]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, IDK, I just handle everything in the list

[03:09:57]

tgm4883:

it would be pretty trival to do a count on that though

[03:10:06]

bcgrown:

btw sorry if these are dumb questions. not exactly an expert coder

[03:10:09]

tgm4883:

there might be another API you could query for recording count

[03:10:24]

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[03:10:41]

bcgrown:

i kinda want to make a mobile-friendly mythweb type thing using the new API. is there anyone already working on anything like that?

[03:10:49]

bcgrown:

don't want to reinvent the wheel

[03:10:59]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, IDK

[03:11:20]

bcgrown:

flowplayer sucks... well.. doesn't work at all on my phone. and definitely not on iOS

[03:11:24]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, IIRC there is an android client in development by one of the mythtvcast guys

[03:11:46]

tgm4883:

iOS has a tablet app, IDK about phone

[03:11:55]

bcgrown:

tgm4883: there is a mythfrontend in the play store but i don't think it uses the api

[03:12:04]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, it doesn't

[03:12:11]

bcgrown:

it also doesn't work, for me

[03:12:13]

tgm4883:

IIRC it only works with 0.23 and 0.24

[03:12:21]

tgm4883:

API was added in 0.25

[03:12:23]

bcgrown:

yeah, didn't work with 0.24 either

[03:12:58]

tgm4883:

rhpot1991, are you doing anything with mythexport and android?

[03:20:13]

bcgrown:

if i start a transcode job in mythweb, and then AddLiveStream with the API, will the API request have to wait for the first transcode to finish before it will start streaming?

[03:20:33]

bcgrown:

or for any other jobs to finish for that matter

[03:23:24]

rhpot1991:

tgm4883: mythexport will produce video files that work with android

[03:23:51]

tgm4883:

rhpot1991, were you working with the mythtvcast guy?

[03:24:58]

rhpot1991:

tgm4883: last I checked he had not started any development yet, his plan was to create a library that would interface with the service apis

[03:28:54]

bcgrown:

i just get an error when I try to GetFile my live stream :(

[03:29:49]

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[03:29:55]

bcgrown:

VLC says it can't open the file... what am i doing wrong?

[03:30:10]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, what exactly are you feeding VLC?

[03:30:26]

bcgrown:

this URL: 192.168.1.150:6544/Content/GetFile?StorageGroup=Streaming&FileName=1214_2012 0419195900.mpg.960x544_600kV_40kA.m3u8

[03:30:41]

bcgrown:

(with an http:// in the front of course)

[03:30:51]

tgm4883:

I'm assuming you have a streaming storage group?

[03:30:56]

bcgrown:

hmm

[03:31:04]

bcgrown:

i didn't notice that. probably not.

[03:31:22]

bcgrown:

unless there is one by default

[03:31:28]

tgm4883:

nope

[03:31:32]

tgm4883:

there is a Default one

[03:31:32]

bcgrown:

then... nope

[03:31:33]

bcgrown:

haha

[03:32:01]

bcgrown:

i just copypasted from the wiki, so I assume i need to add the stream to the default storage group instead?

[03:32:02]

tgm4883:

I haven't used the transcoding portions yet, I'm building that into v2 of my unity scope

[03:32:17]

tgm4883:

but I just finished v1, so that isn't being worked on yet

[03:34:55]

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[03:35:36]

bcgrown:

it seems like it wants to put my live stream in the Streaming storage group, even though I don't have one

[03:35:39]

rhpot1991:

bcgrown: did you get a pm from me?

[03:36:01]

bcgrown:

rhpot1991: yes, didn't notice til you pointed it out though...

[03:37:12]

bcgrown:

i sent: http://192.168.1.150:6544/Content/AddLiveStre . . . leRate=22050

[03:37:37]

bcgrown:

but the returned RelativeURL and AbsoluteURL have StorageGroup=Streaming

[03:37:47]

tgm4883:

hmm

[03:38:48]

bcgrown:

is that the intended behaviour? I could just add a Streaming group I guess... but not right now, don't want to stop my recordings

[03:39:37]

tgm4883:

bcgrown, IDK, I haven't played with that before.

[03:39:41]

tgm4883:

sphery might know

[03:40:52]

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[03:45:01]

bcgrown:

sphery: does sphery know?

[03:53:34]

bcgrown:

meh, hot tub time

[03:53:37]

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[04:02:26]

jya:

wagnerrp: is there a particular command for python, or environment variable where you can configure where to look for extra python modules?

[04:02:37]

wagnerrp:

sys.path

[04:02:42]

wagnerrp:

or PYTHON_PATH

[04:02:52]

wagnerrp:

might be without the underscrote

[04:02:54]

wagnerrp:

score

[04:03:20]

jya:

I'm trying to check on how I could add the myth python bindings to the mac standalone applications

[04:03:37]

jya:

are the perl bindings used within myth or only the python ones?

[04:03:57]

wagnerrp:

at the moment, only the python

[04:04:09]

jya:

great.. so I only have to bother about those

[04:04:13]

wagnerrp:

it was more out of convenience than anything else

[04:04:28]

wagnerrp:

doug wanted to use his tmdb and ttvdb libraries for mythnetvision grabbers

[04:04:47]

wagnerrp:

so they were stuffed in the bindings to eliminate the need for duplicate code

[04:05:11]

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[04:42:28]

FLeiXiuS:

anyone gettijng the jump file error?

[04:42:43]

FLeiXiuS:

When watching LiveTV

[04:42:52]

FLeiXiuS:

0.25-fixes

[04:43:01]

[R]:

whats livetv

[04:43:02]

** [R] snickers **

[04:43:13]

FLeiXiuS:

[R], AH

[04:45:43]

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[06:02:39]

jya:

FLeiXiuS: this issue is being actively worked on..

[06:07:05]

FLeiXiuS:

jya, Thanks – any idea what the causeis/

[06:07:12]

FLeiXiuS:

Perhaps I can remedy it on my side immediately

[06:07:16]

jya:

#10490

[06:07:16]

** MythLogBot http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/10490 **

[06:07:37]

** wagnerrp baits a pirate on the wiki **

[06:07:54]

[R]:

wagnerrp: what kind of lure do you use?

[06:08:03]

wagnerrp:

ignorance

[06:08:07]

[R]:

lol

[06:08:18]

wagnerrp:

"what is this 'sample' folder youre talking about?"

[06:08:20]

jya:

FLeiXiuS: if you want to try and apply the changes on fixes/0.25 … that would help tremendously

[06:08:41]

FLeiXiuS:

jya, I'll see what happens.

[06:09:38]

wagnerrp:

[R]: user wants to be able to add a file to a folder that would mark its contents as to be ignored in mythvideo

[06:09:48]

jya:

http://code.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/0349883 . . . e65ae/mythtv should apply to fixes/0.25

[06:10:10]

wagnerrp:

with the reason being he doesnt want his "sample" folders to show up, but he needs them if he is to keep the torrent going in the same place

[06:10:28]

wagnerrp:

because keeping two copies of it would just be wasteful

[06:10:30]

[R]:

ROFL

[06:11:19]

** wagnerrp waits for the request for playback of content within multi-part archives **

[06:12:07]

[R]:

haha

[06:12:43]

wagnerrp:

you think anyone actually knows the new mythmusic well enough to go through this mythmusic feature request list, and mark off stuff it now does?

[06:13:02]

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[07:18:20]

JackWinter:

anyone know if the TeVii S471 is well supported in recent kernels, or would i be better off buying the S470 instead?

[07:22:28]

[R]:

the linuxtv website has all the information on that, seeing as myth has nothig to do with drivers

[07:25:26]

JackWinter:

[R]: just wanted to verify if it works well since i google some users claiming problems

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dinamic|screen:

gday folks

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wagnerrp:

gah!

[13:05:18]

wagnerrp:

i knew i should have banned him

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locuse:

on the mailing list i read: "we only support one DBType, and that value has never, ever, done anything (so will be dropped when we drop mysql.txt)." iiuc, in mythtv 0.25 I see that BOTH mysql.txt and config.xml are supported/read. so, if we use only config.xml should we consider that mysql.txt has been "dropped", and that DBType should NOT be specified in config.xml?

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[15:49:20]

wagnerrp:

chances are no one is going to bother changing either until such time as the database is embedded in the master backend, and config.xml is used to point to the backend rather than the database

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locuse:

wagnerrp: hi. so, for the current situtation — do I need to edit config.xml to contain DBType? out-of-the-box, it seems not to. leave as is?

[16:29:12]

wagnerrp:

you shouldnt need to edit either of those files

[16:29:38]

wagnerrp:

they get autogenerated by the database selection mechanisms when you start mythfrontend/mythbackend/mythtv-setup

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[16:34:28]

locuse:

wagnerrp: so, leave as is. thanks.

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[17:23:13]

squidly:

wagnerrp: is it possible to have a .24 frontend watch from a .25 backed?

[17:24:06]

wagnerrp:

no, never has been in the past, and likely never will be in the future

[17:24:35]

squidly:

wagnerrp: didnt think so.

[17:32:52]

justdave:

yeah, I made the mistake of upgrading one of my frontends to Ubuntu 12.04b2

[17:32:58]

justdave:

.25 doesn't talk to a .24 backend either :)

[17:33:15]

justdave:

spent last night upgrading the backend and the other two frontends to match

[17:33:25]

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[17:33:31]

wagnerrp:

so downgrade it?

[17:33:45]

wagnerrp:

the frontend will not upgrade the database schema

[17:33:53]

justdave:

nah, upgrade was mostly painless

[17:34:00]

justdave:

just took a while

[17:34:27]

justdave:

except my backend usually runs headless and the new Ubuntu is too smart for its own good.

[17:34:39]

justdave:

doesn't bother to fire up X11 if you don't have a monitor connected

[17:35:14]

justdave:

ssh into it and started mythtv-backend manually and it works though.

[17:35:20]

wagnerrp:

if you have no monitor connected, how would it?

[17:35:29]

justdave:

it always did before

[17:35:32]

wagnerrp:

the backend does not need a monitor or X server

[17:35:50]

justdave:

I always just VNCed into it when I needed to do something

[17:35:55]

wagnerrp:

however an X server does need a monitor, unless youre feeding it some virtual framebuffer like VNC

[17:36:15]

justdave:

yeah, I used VNC with it before

[17:36:16]

wagnerrp:

in which case your VNC X server has nothing to do with your system X server

[17:37:00]

wagnerrp:

unless youre using one of the non-standard mirroring mechanisms, VNC runs with its own dedicated X server on a virtual screen

[17:37:12]

justdave:

well, it was the system X server in lucid, it just said it couldn't figure out what the monitor was and started up a failsafe X

[17:37:34]

justdave:

it was the screen-sharing within the desktop that I was actually using before

[17:38:08]

justdave:

but like you said, it doesn't really matter because mythtv-backend runs fine without it anyway

[17:38:39]

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[17:38:43]

justdave:

only reason the box had it to begin with is because it started life as a combined backend/frontend

[17:39:11]

justdave:

haven't had the frontend installed on it for years now

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[17:40:37]

justdave:

only thing I really did via VNC was run the package manager to pull updates every so often

[17:41:17]

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[17:41:32]

lautriv:

hello, i upgraded my myth (debian) to 0.25pre and got a message about the init. looks like my /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend does not match the changed syntax. is there actually something known ?

[17:41:50]

wagnerrp:

sounds like you need to revise your logging

[17:43:37]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, that is the smaller problem but it tells me about a bunch new/other options and i wonder if there is something worth to tune.

[17:48:06]

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[17:48:58]

wagnerrp:

recommended is to just use --logpath

[17:49:12]

wagnerrp:

and give it a path the user running mythbackend as write access to

[17:50:14]

lautriv:

fu*** fixed and restarted without problems but now i hav a blank page on mythweb :(

[17:50:51]

wagnerrp:

did you not update mythweb

[17:50:52]

wagnerrp:

?

[17:51:19]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, i did a dist-upgrade and so ith should have upgraded anything.

[17:51:48]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, there was an issue with newer php which i already fixed.

[18:06:16]

justdave:

my mythweb seems to be working fine

[18:06:24]

justdave:

didn't think to check that before :)

[18:14:27]

lautriv:

so i found the relevant files (anything in /usr/share/mythtv ) are owned by root. i suppose they need mythtv for the backend and www-data for the mythweb ?

[18:22:22]

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[18:22:27]

lautriv:

could anyone (preferably on debian) paste ls -alR /usr/share/mythtv ?

[18:22:40]

wagnerrp:

what files? the php bindings?

[18:22:57]

wagnerrp:

those are just loaded by the php interpreter

[18:23:05]

wagnerrp:

they only need to be readable by whatever user runs apache

[18:23:15]

wagnerrp:

they do not need to be owned or writable

[18:23:21]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, -alR is recursive to see if/how my new files has to be re-owned

[18:23:39]

wagnerrp:

but they dont

[18:23:55]

wagnerrp:

you can check on your own system if they are readable by the user running apache

[18:24:01]

wagnerrp:

anything beyond that doesnt matter

[18:24:07]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, but it is strange that whole dir is owned by root

[18:24:15]

wagnerrp:

why?

[18:24:37]

wagnerrp:

no one should need to be writing to it, besides the user that installs packages (root)

[18:24:56]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, it contains not only mythweb and i didn't check all links to see if something fails by permission.

[18:25:20]

wagnerrp:

mythweb isnt installed to /usr/share/mythtv, unless those are some mighty funky packages

[18:25:24]

wagnerrp:

only the php bindings do

[18:26:42]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, my apache points to /var/www/mythweb which is a symlink to /usr/share/mythtv/mythweb

[18:27:21]

wagnerrp:

have the directory definitions in your httpd.conf been altered to reflect that?

[18:34:02]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, sorry was afk...........i changed nothing, all is where it should be . instead of /etc/apache2/httpd.conf i have /etc/apache2/conf.d/mythweb.conf which matches ( points to /var/www/mythweb which is this link )

[18:36:31]

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[18:40:53]

lautriv:

ok, had a look at apache's access.log and it tells me 403

[18:43:04]

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[18:45:32]

EvilGuru:

As much as I hate to repost phoronix links: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article . . . y2&num=1 — glad I never held out hope for mainstream VAAPI support

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[19:00:54]

skd5aner:

I am the 1%!

[19:01:13]

skd5aner:

... of mythtv users with a database 7–8 years old

[19:02:13]

skd5aner:

jams: another metric that might need changed... database age ends about "between 8 and 9" – what happens when someone tops 9?

[19:02:41]

skd5aner:

also, why are the min. db ages that are negative?

[19:02:42]

wagnerrp:

i think mine is about to reach 6

[19:03:16]

skd5aner:

wrong system clock or something?

[19:03:50]

skd5aner:

heh – lots of one-off themes hiding out there

[19:04:13]

wagnerrp:

right now, age is determined by the time since the oldest entry in oldrecorded

[19:04:20]

wagnerrp:

i dont know if there is a better method

[19:04:35]

wagnerrp:

specifically, the starttime

[19:04:59]

wagnerrp:

if youve never actually recorded something, and your only entry in oldrecorded is a show scheduled to record in the future

[19:05:18]

wagnerrp:

that could produce a negative age of as much as a few hundred thousand seconds

[19:05:23]

jams:

skd5aner- those groups are generated on the fly, so it will auto-add 10–11

[19:05:28]

skd5aner:

what about putting in some logic to only process those dates that have occured in the past

[19:05:32]

skd5aner:

jams: ah, cool

[19:05:40]

wagnerrp:

i could, would be very simple

[19:05:44]

wagnerrp:

didnt think about it at the time

[19:06:03]

wagnerrp:

i wouldnt even bother with that, just truncate it at zero

[19:06:49]

** wagnerrp wonders how there are 106 users living in berlin, and yet somehow 56 of them manage to do so from outside germany **

[19:07:13]

skd5aner:

I am a jelly donut

[19:07:25]

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[19:07:36]

wagnerrp:

seems there is no love for LCARS

[19:08:04]

skd5aner:

I'm surprised more people aren't usning TintedGlass – it's prett good

[19:08:25]

wagnerrp:

115 people with no source

[19:08:28]

skd5aner:

and I used MythCenter-wide the other day, and realized I hadn't been missing anything

[19:08:34]

wagnerrp:

that absolutely makes no sense

[19:08:40]

wagnerrp:

you cant run the backend without a source

[19:08:47]

wagnerrp:

and you can do much in the frontend without a backend

[19:09:26]

wagnerrp:

i guess well see what happens to those mid-summer when they start expiring

[19:14:30]

wagnerrp:

jams: anything built in to get stddev out of this stuff?

[19:16:04]

wagnerrp:

jams: also, there was interest in the 'database.engines' stuff

[19:16:08]

jams:

there might be something within sqlalchemy

[19:16:13]

jams:

but i'm unsure

[19:16:20]

wagnerrp:

percentages of users that have support for innodb and such

[19:16:54]

jams:

right, thats easy enough to add. When I did a manual check last week it was at 100%

[19:17:05]

jams:

for innodb

[19:17:15]

wagnerrp:

really?

[19:17:25]

wagnerrp:

there was a lot of concern over distros disabling it arbitrarily

[19:17:37]

jams:

one moment while i doublecheck

[19:17:46]

EvilGuru:

It is uncommon, but you do sometimes find older MySQL installs without Innodb support

[19:17:46]

wagnerrp:

"max tuner per cluster: 30"

[19:18:02]

wagnerrp:

i wonder if that is before or after i added the fix to properly detect virtual tuners

[19:18:07]

jams:

before

[19:18:08]

EvilGuru:

Saying that, I think parts of mythweather do/did request Innodb tuners

[19:18:30]

wagnerrp:

EvilGuru: they do

[19:18:52]

wagnerrp:

although poor default tuning has been holding mythtv back from switching over to it completely

[19:20:15]

wagnerrp:

oh yeah, scheduling times!

[19:20:24]

wagnerrp:

i completely forgot i put that in there

[19:20:36]

EvilGuru:

Debian still ship with 64 open tables by default; way less than Myth creates

[19:21:01]

jams:

wagnerrp- 616 with Inodedb 1 without

[19:21:22]

wagnerrp:

heh

[19:21:33]

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[19:21:43]

wagnerrp:

sphery: was it you who was interested in that value?

[19:21:56]

jams:

5.1.61–0ubuntu0.11.10.1 <= mysqlversion of the person without it

[19:23:35]

EvilGuru:

What kind of increase in db size can we expect?

[19:23:52]

wagnerrp:

increase for what?

[19:24:06]

EvilGuru:

If Innodb is used more extensively in myth

[19:24:22]

wagnerrp:

no idea

[19:24:41]

wagnerrp:

likely whatever the temporary cache parameters are set to

[19:25:08]

EvilGuru:

Most of my DB usually ends up as recordedseek

[19:25:32]

wagnerrp:

commonly true

[19:25:35]

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[19:25:46]

EvilGuru:

~8m rows is not uncommon

[19:25:56]

Seeker`:

what is the advantage of innodb?

[19:26:01]

Seeker`:

My DB-fu is weak :(

[19:26:22]

wagnerrp:

performance and transactions (when configured properly)

[19:26:27]

EvilGuru:

Seeker`: Generally: it is a real storage engine with transactions, foreign key constraints that are enforced, halfway decent scaling, ...

[19:26:32]

EvilGuru:

For mythtv I am unsure

[19:26:48]

wagnerrp:

most distros ship with pretty poor tuning parameters, resulting in innodb actually being slower than myisam

[19:27:22]

Seeker`:

I mean what will the relative advantage be? 1.8 seconds instead of 1.9 for scheduling?

[19:27:26]

Seeker`:

Or something more drastic?

[19:27:29]

clever:

ive also encountered a query on my own setup, that was over 10x slower on innodb, but it wasnt using any index

[19:27:31]

wagnerrp:

slow, as in multiple orders of magnitude difference from stock settings to good ones

[19:27:35]

clever:

so it was hitting millions of rows

[19:27:46]

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[19:28:12]

clever:

once i rewrote the query and made a proper index, it went from minutes to unmeasurable (0 seconds)

[19:28:20]

Seeker`:

wagnerrp: I mean myisam to well-configured innodb

[19:29:22]

wagnerrp:

depends on the volume of data, and quality of the schema

[19:29:54]

clever:

of course, i was testing on one of my slower systems, to force minor performance gains to give bigger improvements

[19:29:56]

wagnerrp:

for the scheduler, ideally you could configure it so it pulls all the data at once into memory, and uses temporary tables from there

[19:30:28]

wagnerrp:

it would basically negate any kind of "barrier" complication for that operation

[19:31:14]

clever:

i would think that the innodb buffer pool would handle that just fine, and you may wind up using extra cpu cycles copying to a temp table

[19:32:36]

clever:

um, i dont think i had lircd on bootup!, lol

[19:32:45]

clever:

time to double-check all recent recordings....

[19:33:50]

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[19:35:04]

clever:

ah good, no recent that i can see

[19:35:49]

clever:

2012-04–20 16:03:01.203775 I Canceled recording (Recorder Failed): Curiosity:"Expedition Alaska": channel 1731 on cardid 1, sourceid 1

[19:37:48]

clever:

and livetv just made 3 0 byte files :S

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[21:18:11]

justinh:

Seeker`: scheduler queries are affected by all kinds of things, mostly the number of channels & tuners. 15 tuners makes the scheduler take about 1.5x longer than 6 tuners IME

[21:18:29]

justinh:

I was seeing the scheduler take about 10 secs

[21:19:39]

justinh:

also longer descriptions can increase the scheduler run time. I was using xmltv before but went to EIT only – now about 2 lines instead of lots more. That also improved the scheduler time

[21:20:17]

justinh:

keeping fewer records in the oldrecorded table would help too, but then myth would be less able to spot repeat showings

[21:21:39]

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[21:38:17]

lautriv:

"GET /mythweb/ HTTP/1.1" 500 403 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:10.0.3) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/10.0.3 Iceweasel/10.0.3" on a fresh install of mythweb ? (symlinks and apache's dir matching and read for apache is given)

[21:39:36]

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[22:02:58]

lautriv:

anybody ?

[22:10:22]

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[22:15:32]

likwid-:

fark. im moving to a time warner supplied cable area :( anyone wanna buy an hdhomerun prime?

[22:16:21]

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[22:19:21]

k-man:

is there any way to compile the whole of mythtv and its plugins prior to installing?

[22:25:09]

wagnerrp:

nope

[22:25:36]

wagnerrp:

you might be able to force it by giving -I and -L parameters, but thats about it

[22:29:11]

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[22:30:10]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, any idea why i could get those 403 with proper perms everywhere ?

[22:30:30]

wagnerrp:

nope

[22:31:04]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, you are on 0.25 ?

[22:31:08]

wagnerrp:

never used debian, nor for that matter have i ever used some elses packaged web application framework

[22:31:11]

wagnerrp:

yes, works fine here

[22:31:36]

wagnerrp:

only difference i had to make between 0.24 and 0.25 was to install the php bindings

[22:33:31]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, never had any problem related to debian ( beside that bad thing about vulnerable keys ) however there must be something wrong what i didn't catch. ( and i have php bindings also)

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[22:35:31]

lautriv:

HA! found something (php related)

[22:35:46]

lautriv:

PHP Fatal error: Call-time pass-by-reference has been removed in /usr/share/mythtv/bindings/php/MythBase.php on line 50

[22:36:00]

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[22:36:06]

wagnerrp:

you need to update to php 5.3

[22:37:35]

lautriv:

i'm already on 5.4.1

[22:37:58]

wagnerrp:

you need to downgrade to php 5.3

[22:38:09]

wagnerrp:

whatever you do, get php 5.3

[22:38:23]

lautriv:

dependencies will probably stop this attempt

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[23:04:47]

jk90090:

jya: you awake out there?

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[23:05:03]

jya:

i've been awake for hours ...

[23:05:06]

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[23:05:11]

jk90090:

howdy

[23:05:19]

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[23:05:33]

jk90090:

did you go crazy on the airplay the other day?

[23:05:37]

jya:

beauty of having young kids… you get to learn what getting up too early means

[23:05:44]

jk90090:

anything you'd like me to test?

[23:05:57]

jk90090:

ha, my cousin just had his first

[23:06:04]

jya:

jk90090: i started working on it… however, found out there's a strong limitations to the shairport stuff

[23:06:15]

jk90090:

oh?

[23:06:27]

jya:

his first? then he will learn what it is to have no sleep at all

[23:06:57]

** jk90090 laughs **

[23:06:58]

jya:

yeah, the shaiport project will only work well for audio only. it doesn't handle timestamps and sync at all…

[23:07:30]

jya:

so if you play video on your iphone and audio on myth for example, you'll have a a/v sync delay of over 2s

[23:07:34]

jya:

unusable

[23:07:42]

lautriv:

wagnerrp, patched..... works with 5.4.1 :P

[23:07:46]

jk90090:

ouch

[23:08:03]

jk90090:

speaking of out of sync, I just got around to trying the HTTP streaming

[23:08:14]

jk90090:

and it suffers from audio sync issues

[23:08:28]

jya:

now the existing one in myth handles timestamp, but i believe it does so incorrectly in that it drops packets too early and as such never get the missed packet that he asked retrieval for

[23:08:39]

jk90090:

video lags audio on the first recording I tried it on

[23:09:03]

jk90090:

jya: that would make sense on what I have been experiencing

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[23:09:18]

jk90090:

I also picked up a new Asus 5ghz router now

[23:09:53]

jya:

right now, with both implementations the limitation seems to be : either you buffer well and then you get bad (e.g. none) a/v sync. or less latency but dropped packet

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Mode for #mythtv-users by asimov.freenode.net : +v Beirdo

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[23:12:06]

jya:

i'd like to at least sort out why itunes can't connect to myth… but i don't know if a full rewrite is easier than finding the cause in a code that I ultimately want to rewrite

[23:12:47]

jk90090:

hah, a full rewrite on a new function

[23:12:56]

jk90090:

love it!

[23:14:10]

jya:

you can do it if you prefer!

[23:14:18]

jk90090:

I've yet to get video to playback

[23:14:35]

jk90090:

it claims it's doing it, but nothing changed on the screen

[23:16:05]

jk90090:

but audio plays back a bit better on the new wireless router

[23:16:23]

jk90090:

quite better actually, and the 4/17 codeset

[23:16:46]

jk90090:

still the occasional dropout

[23:17:19]

jya:

jk90090: you'll have to go back to the old router so you can test if the changes fix anything

[23:17:39]

jk90090:

new router is in AP mode

[23:18:19]

jk90090:

the other one is still in place, and will remain in place, so it's an easy switch to the other network

[23:18:41]

jk90090:

So I'm ready anytime you're ready

[23:20:14]

jk90090:

oh, I just got video to work

[23:21:11]

jk90090:

and that seems to be flawless, in case that datapoint helps

[23:25:06]

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[23:30:32]

wagnerrp:

jya: i still dont understand why one would want to record to a symlink

[23:30:58]

wagnerrp:

i mean if his storage structure is changing sufficiently frequently that there is reason to make it flexible in that manner

[23:31:09]

wagnerrp:

it seems like his storage structure is poorly thought out

[23:31:10]

jya:

wagnerrp: if you had heard me posting, you would have noticed the very sarcastic tone

[23:31:21]

wagnerrp:

yep

[23:35:34]

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[23:38:53]

jk90090:

jya: you, sarcastic, never

[23:39:32]

jk90090:

(based on your prior posts)

[23:40:01]

jk90090:

Raymond, seriously though, does it really matter? If it's a symlink, it really should handle it properly

[23:40:58]

jk90090:

perhaps they moved disks around, and rather than changing the storage group settings, it's much easier to just create a symlink

[23:41:12]

wagnerrp:

slightly so

[23:41:21]

jk90090:

who knows, I use symlinks all the time though

[23:41:28]

wagnerrp:

as do i

[23:41:40]

jk90090:

I mean, where relevant of course, like when I move recordings off my main storage group

[23:41:50]

jk90090:

but that's a different situation of course

[23:42:12]

wagnerrp:

why not update the reference in the database to point it at the new storage group?

[23:42:24]

wagnerrp:

or just... not, since the backend will fall through to trying all storage groups anyway

[23:42:40]

wagnerrp:

as long as its on the same host, the backend will find it

[23:43:26]

jk90090:

true, but that wasn't always the case, maybe he/she doesn't realize that

[23:43:49]

wagnerrp:

fairly good guess that "mark" is a he

[23:44:06]

jk90090:

ha, I didn't pay that much attention to the thread

[23:44:19]

jk90090:

I barely even skimmed that thread

[23:45:06]

jk90090:

I was resist banging my head re: some of Ash's questions… why don't these guys use google first before posting?

[23:45:07]

wagnerrp:

well jya's sarcastic reply was the mention that he's maintaining hundreds of little patches against mythtv, yet none of them have made it to trac

[23:45:27]

jk90090:

I mean, I always try to 'fish' before bugging people

[23:46:24]

wagnerrp:

which of course the wonderful website...

[23:46:27]

wagnerrp:

!lmgtfy

[23:46:33]

wagnerrp:

!lmgtfy blah

[23:46:42]

wagnerrp:

!url lmgtfy

[23:46:42]

MythLogBot:

lmgtfy: http://lmgtfy.com?q=%s

[23:46:46]

wagnerrp:

there it is

[23:47:04]

jk90090:

jya: neat new trick with my iPhone . I interrupted my video playback stream to mythtv but cycling the wireless for a split second

[23:47:23]

jk90090:

the result is the video kept playing, BUT on my iPhone, the video shows as paused

[23:47:38]

jk90090:

and no longer air playing to the myth

[23:48:16]

jk90090:

but I can hit play and it plays on the iPhone now, while still playing, after a different position, on the mythtv. Bizarro time

[23:48:40]

jk90090:

wagnerrp: haha

[23:49:19]

jk90090:

I'll send that out next time

[23:50:49]

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