| Monday, February 13th, 2012, 00:00 UTC | ||
| [00:00:02] | sphery: | hehe, I promise I'm not stalking you |
| [00:00:35] | knightr: | :) |
| [00:00:41] | sphery: | just figured I should change that string on the wiki page since I changed it in trac (since we're no longer on SVN) |
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| [00:00:47] | npm is now known as npm__ | |
| [00:00:50] | npm__ is now known as npm | |
| [00:00:53] | sphery: | and was surprised that it was already done |
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| [00:01:10] | sphery: | (granted, I changed trac long ago, but thought I caught the comment in the ticket quickly) |
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| [00:03:34] | knightr: | sphery I'm on high alert waiting for an answer from stuartm so when I see anything related to MythTv popup I address it quickly... :) :) :) |
| [00:05:04] | sphery: | regarding the date formats? |
| [00:06:19] | sphery: | I like the idea of adding any missing formats--either with translation strings that are picked up and put into the list in setup or just coding them into setup |
| [00:06:30] | knightr: | yep... I want to keep my "promise" (OK promise might be too strong a word here) that something would be done to address the Chinese translator speacial date format... |
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| [00:12:35] | knightr: | sphery, I want to handle it using a special translation context. I am currently working on it but for some reason it doesn't work so I'll have to add some logging to debug it. If stuartm doesn't want it though I'll simply scrap what I have done... |
| [00:13:22] | sphery: | I'd say (though I'm not the guy to make the decision) that if you got a list of formats, you could just change the values in setup |
| [00:13:34] | sphery: | even without allowing for custom, translator-provided ones |
| [00:14:13] | sphery: | IMHO, that has the benefit, too, of allowing a user who grew up in one area and likes one date format to use that format even though he's now living in an area/with family that uses a different translation from his native |
| [00:14:50] | sphery: | (and I don't think that would be a new feature, so could be done after today) |
| [00:14:58] | sphery: | it's just new values for the date formats |
| [00:15:03] | knightr: | sphery, if it didn't involve special characters that would have probably been the way I would have handled it... |
| [00:15:25] | sphery: | special characters? |
| [00:15:33] | sphery: | just don't want them showing in the list? |
| [00:15:44] | sphery: | you can encode any required character into the C++ code |
| [00:16:27] | knightr: | Chinese characters, does every platform MythTV runs on has the required fonts to handle them? |
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| [00:17:57] | sphery: | not necessarily, but if a user sees an empty box on screen for one of the formats, they're likely to say, "Oh, that's some other language that I don't want" :) |
| [00:18:09] | sphery: | empty box character or whatever it displays |
| [00:19:11] | sphery: | (assuming it's empty box, because that's what we used to get when we had an old font for captions that didn't include the eighth note symbol and the captions used that to say music was playing) |
| [00:20:21] | knightr: | That's where having a format provded by the translator would help, it would only show if you have the required fonts AND they could add new formats themselves... |
| [00:22:02] | sphery: | knightr: that said, running mythfrontend -p and looking through the Country list, there are Chinese characters and Arabic and Cyrillic and Korean and ... |
| [00:22:49] | sphery: | so we're already displaying characters that may not work on some systems on there |
| [00:23:51] | knightr: | лол, ай гесс юр рит... |
| [00:24:05] | wagnerrp: | speaking russian now? |
| [00:24:26] | knightr: | nope, that's English written with Cyrillic characters... :) |
| [00:24:44] | knightr: | that was LOL, I guess you're right... |
| [00:25:53] | sphery: | hehe |
| [00:26:06] | ** knightr can read the characters but only understand a few Russian words... ** | |
| [00:26:22] | sphery: | in my client, it's all question marks |
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| [00:26:50] | sphery: | (I have a not-good-UTF-8-support setup for my terminal/IRC) |
| [00:27:02] | knightr: | |
| [00:27:10] | sphery: | ? and ?? |
| [00:27:21] | sphery: | ooh, you angered the log bot... |
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| [00:28:17] | sphery: | http://irc.mythtv.org/ircLog/channel/1/2012-02-13:00:23:51 |
| [00:28:22] | knightr: | OK, even characters that are (also) present in ISO-8859–1 are not handled by your client... |
| [00:28:25] | sphery: | (the error/details) |
| [00:28:38] | sphery: | btw, it looks good in my browser :) |
| [00:28:56] | sphery: | well, the first one does... the :27:02 one is just blank |
| [00:29:10] | sphery: | yeah, my terminal is very ascii-centric |
| [00:29:21] | sphery: | one day I should fix it |
| [00:29:31] | wagnerrp: | all that and only one complaint out of cppcheck |
| [00:29:37] | knightr: | weird, according to the link you provided it was able to handle Cyrillic fine but not accents... :) |
| [00:29:56] | sphery: | yeah, may be the iso8859–1 isn't handled well? |
| [00:30:02] | sphery: | (by the bot) |
| [00:31:33] | knightr: | sphery, yes, that seems to be it though I would have assumed anything not in US ASCII would have been considered UTF-8.... |
| [00:32:50] | sphery: | I still don't understand who in the process is supposed to do the conversions... terminal running sending irc client, sending irc client, irc server, receiving irc client, terminal running receiving irc client, or some/all of the above |
| [00:33:06] | sphery: | which is why my setup is still very "the whole world should just use ascii" :) |
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| [00:34:50] | knightr: | UTF-8 is a superset of US ASCII... The same string is encoded in exactly the same way in both character sets... |
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| [00:36:06] | tweek__: | is MythTV supposed to run as root? |
| [00:36:18] | tweek__: | I guess whoever packaged it for Fedora figured that'd be just fine |
| [00:36:23] | sphery: | ideally, no, but on some distros it has to |
| [00:36:31] | sphery: | such as any red-hat-based distro |
| [00:36:35] | knightr: | IIRC the character position in ISO-8859–1 are the same BUT the encoding is different... |
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| [00:37:51] | sphery: | tweek__: the problem in RH-based distros has something to do with devicekit/policykit/consolekit and the fact that if not run as root, it won't have permissions to devices that the "I'll just mess with device permissions whenever someone logs on" programs bork when a user logs on to the system |
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| [00:39:15] | sphery: | if it concerns you a bunch, try Mythbuntu :) |
| [00:40:06] | sphery: | knightr: yeah, it's just that everyone in the chain has to agree on what encoding to use or you get issues |
| [00:40:23] | sphery: | I really think part (most?) of my problem is my choice of font |
| [00:40:47] | sphery: | 'Bitstream Vera Sans Mono' probably isn't ideal |
| [00:41:00] | tweek__: | that's, uh, interesting |
| [00:41:06] | knightr: | could very be... |
| [00:41:40] | sphery: | wasn't there a similar font that took them and extended them for better utf-8 coverage... |
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| [00:42:16] | sphery: | I could have sworn I'd heard about that, before |
| [00:42:22] | sphery: | maybe it was just DejaVu |
| [00:42:53] | sphery: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DejaVu_fonts – "The DejaVu fonts are modifications of the Bitstream Vera fonts designed for greater coverage of Unicode..." |
| [00:42:56] | Captain_Murdoch: | wagnerrp, I think that query free space is the mythfrontend playbackbox updating the free space on a 15-second timer. PBHEventHandler::kUpdateFreeSpaceInterval is set to 15 seconds. |
| [00:44:23] | knightr: | sphery, having a feeling of "Deja vu"? (<<I could have sworn I'd heard about that, before>>) |
| [00:44:31] | sphery: | hehe, yeah |
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| [00:51:10] | sphery: | so, I really think wagnerrp wrote a backdoor in the github -> email and github -> IRC scripts that allows him to commit stuff without others knowing |
| [00:51:35] | sphery: | all his big commits are going in without any messages--except that he did a merge commit |
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| [00:52:18] | wagnerrp: | i dont get it |
| [00:52:24] | wagnerrp: | everyone else gets full commit lists on merges |
| [00:52:44] | sphery: | and now he pretends he's not being sneaky... |
| [00:52:58] | sphery: | just what a sneaky person would do |
| [00:53:53] | wagnerrp: | one might say i was... |
| [00:53:58] | ** wagnerrp puts on sunglasses ** | |
| [00:54:07] | wagnerrp: | hiding the source... of the problem... |
| [00:54:22] | sphery: | wow... |
| [00:54:58] | sphery: | suddenly I feel like watching some miami-based crime drama |
| [00:55:15] | wagnerrp: | Captain_Murdoch: seems awfully frequent |
| [00:55:23] | wagnerrp: | i guess its not like theres any significant load involved |
| [00:57:32] | wagnerrp: | do we have any template definitions anywhere? |
| [00:57:52] | sphery: | like c-style templates? |
| [00:58:19] | sphery: | I mean c++ templates |
| [00:58:24] | wagnerrp: | im considering adding a couple templates for use with ReferenceCounter |
| [00:58:35] | wagnerrp: | like... wrapping QList or QMap |
| [00:58:49] | wagnerrp: | make it automatically upref and downref as stuff gets added or removed from the list |
| [00:58:51] | sphery: | we have a couple of them--they were the hard part in updating to support Qt4.7 |
| [00:59:04] | sphery: | mythxml code, iirc |
| [00:59:38] | wagnerrp: | i was thinking about it yesterday when looking at the libmythproto stuff, and extracting lists of sockets |
| [00:59:48] | sphery: | http://code.mythtv.org/trac/attachment/ticket . . . plates.patch are a few of them |
| [00:59:54] | sphery: | guess it was libmythupnp that I was thinking of |
| [01:00:20] | sphery: | they weren't actually fixed by that--it was a broken patch--but was meant to mark them for proper converstion later |
| [01:00:29] | sphery: | but that shows you some places were have some |
| [01:00:50] | wagnerrp: | mythdeque would probably be a good place to start |
| [01:03:01] | wagnerrp: | templates are basically just fancy preprocessor sugar, right? |
| [01:03:20] | wagnerrp: | they dont do anything on their own, but expand out to real code at compile time |
| [01:04:03] | sphery: | yeah, that's my understanding |
| [01:04:31] | sphery: | preprocessor and/or compiler basically writes code for you using the template you provide |
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| [01:30:17] | wagnerrp: | no wonder my mouse has been acting increasingly glitchy the last couple weeks |
| [01:30:28] | wagnerrp: | theres like half a cat stuff up underneath the scroll wheel |
| [01:32:29] | Seeker`: | where has the other half of the cat been for the last couple of weeks? O.o |
| [01:32:50] | wagnerrp: | hasnt arrived yet |
| [01:33:07] | wagnerrp: | the first half was spontaneously evolving from an inanimate hairball |
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| [01:56:45] | sphery: | do you call it "Dust Puppy" |
| [01:57:41] | sphery: | ref to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Userfriendly#Dust_Puppy |
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| [02:01:58] | wagnerrp: | i was actually thinking i shall call it george |
| [02:02:19] | sphery: | don't squeeze it too hard |
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| [02:11:44] | wagnerrp: | now comes the hard part |
| [02:11:52] | wagnerrp: | turning a pile of clean mouse pieces into a functional mouse |
| [02:12:25] | sphery: | I still can't believe your mouse ate your cat... That's not natural. |
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| [02:23:36] | tweek__: | huh, apparently this last recording I made crashes ffmpeg within the first 100MB |
| [02:23:43] | tweek__: | whether or not I run it through Project-X first |
| [02:24:50] | tweek__: | nothing to do about that I suppose, these things will happen |
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| [04:04:10] | Tanthrix: | Anyone know a way to make the black bars visible with 4:3 content be grey? There is a setting in the playback settings, but it only works for Xv, not vdpau |
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| [04:08:37] | sphery: | pretty sure that would require code changes |
| [04:09:02] | sphery: | not sure whether those changes are possible in mythtv or if it means changing vdpau itself |
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| [04:09:46] | sphery: | do you really have a TV where it matters (didn't they solve plasma burn in like 5 years ago?) or is it just a preference? |
| [04:09:52] | Tanthrix: | makes sense...I'm posting on the nvidia linux forum now as we speak with the hopes maybe it is implemented and there is a way to fix it |
| [04:10:09] | Tanthrix: | sphery: I do have a new plasma, and unfortunately it is not fixed – just mitigated using various techniques |
| [04:10:35] | sphery: | ahhh |
| [04:11:02] | Tanthrix: | sphery: With the image shift stuff on it might not be an issue, but I don't want to tempt it. I actually bought this set used on Amazon, and it has the ESPN logo slightly visible on the bottom right |
| [04:11:04] | wagnerrp: | plasmas can burn in black? |
| [04:11:23] | Tanthrix: | wagnerrp: Actually, it's more that the 4:3 portion wears more than the black bar portion |
| [04:11:44] | wagnerrp: | stop watching old 4:3 content? |
| [04:11:46] | wagnerrp: | :) |
| [04:11:56] | Tanthrix: | wagnerrp: Hehe, I would if I could. |
| [04:12:09] | Tanthrix: | wagnerrp: Damn them for not doing 16:9 years ago for everything. |
| [04:12:49] | sphery: | could just set up your tv like all the cool hotels and bars do |
| [04:13:02] | Tanthrix: | stretchy? the horror.... |
| [04:13:14] | sphery: | have it stretch all the 4:3 content to 16:9 and enjoy thinking you're better than those fat people on TV :) |
| [04:13:28] | Tanthrix: | hehe, I didn't think about that side benefit |
| [04:13:29] | sphery: | yeah, I hate that with a passion |
| [04:13:47] | sphery: | they get all these super nice TVs and feed them garbage /and/ stretch it out of aspect |
| [04:13:56] | [R]: | SD makes me sad to begin with |
| [04:14:01] | Tanthrix: | and hook up their cable box with RCA or s-video cables |
| [04:14:23] | sphery: | yeah, that too |
| [04:14:36] | Tanthrix: | The worst part is that my new 60" set just makes bad content look that much worse |
| [04:14:43] | sphery: | so it actually gets worse, often--going back to baseband ntsc format |
| [04:14:48] | Tanthrix: | enlightenment is having a small TV or bad eyesight :P |
| [04:15:25] | sphery: | yeah, I upgraded my TV in 2006... I had >1000 SDTV recordings at the time |
| [04:15:32] | sphery: | ended up deleting >900 without watching |
| [04:15:38] | sphery: | only watched the "gotta see it" shows |
| [04:16:09] | sphery: | where SDTV recordings means old PVR-150 from a DISH box... I upgraded my TV and went to digital OTA at the same time |
| [04:17:00] | sphery: | never thought I'd become a TV snob because I'm all about the story, but it turned out there's still a part of me that's not about the story |
| [04:17:13] | G (G!njones@torea.jnet.net.nz) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [04:17:24] | Tanthrix: | hehe, I have to admit I have become a TV snob myself as well. |
| [04:17:41] | Tanthrix: | We just returned a 60" Aquos due to bad uniformity problems...look like it had huge blobs around the edges |
| [04:17:54] | sphery: | yuck |
| [04:17:57] | Tanthrix: | let that be a lesson to everyone. thin TVs == more prone to uniformity issues |
| [04:18:25] | sphery: | I'm trying to figure out how to make my current TV (and bulb) last me until a not-LCD tech comes out (and is a price I'm willing to pay) |
| [04:18:31] | Tanthrix: | This new Samsung PN59D8000 plasma is amazing though...never thought I would get a plasma, but here I am |
| [04:19:00] | sphery: | unfortunately, it's looking like OLED/"Crystal" LED is the only one that might be available in the next few years, but I still want my FED |
| [04:19:13] | sphery: | and I'm FED up with stupid patent trolls that killed it |
| [04:19:16] | Tanthrix: | yah, don't hold your breath |
| [04:19:38] | sphery: | yeah... I'm hoping that since Canon gave up that Motorola may make it work |
| [04:20:01] | Tanthrix: | I'm sure they'll find some great way to ruin it, like they have done with modern thin TVs |
| [04:20:54] | sphery: | don't they always |
| [04:21:18] | Tanthrix: | true, but going thin, doing 3d, etc.. has taken away from the research on improving black levels, contrast ratios, etc.. |
| [04:21:52] | Tanthrix: | Samsung for instance is all about pretty now – super thin bezels, gloss screens that are horrible for reflections, etc. |
| [04:22:04] | Tanthrix: | Stuff that looks great in store but not in actual use |
| [04:23:02] | wagnerrp: | wait, we have commercial 3D televisions? |
| [04:23:07] | Tanthrix: | oh, heh, thought you said "they don't always" – reading comprehension ftw |
| [04:24:16] | sphery: | yeah, I hate those reflective screens... and on laptops? so annoying when you're trying to use the laptop and just see the cold fluorescent lights behind you somewhere |
| [04:24:44] | sphery: | would be awful for TVs, too, but haven't really tried watching one like that |
| [04:24:51] | Tanthrix: | my new plasma has one unfortunately...it's not the end of the world |
| [04:25:07] | Tanthrix: | but as I understand it, that has something to do with the plasma technolgy, it's not just something they did for fun |
| [04:25:29] | Tanthrix: | that's actually one of the reasons we got the Aquos, it had a matte screen |
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| [04:27:16] | wagnerrp: | sphery: have you seen any of this 'clearblack' stuff? |
| [04:27:40] | Tanthrix: | I'm off, thanks for the help sphery et al |
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| [04:28:05] | wagnerrp: | http://www.oled-info.com/nokia-clearblack-display-cbd |
| [04:29:07] | sphery: | heard the name, but have no idea what it is |
| [04:30:13] | sphery: | sounds interesting |
| [04:30:29] | wagnerrp: | its a special sandwich of polarizing layers the is nearly un-reflective, but yields nearly as good of transmission as the glossy displays |
| [04:31:29] | sphery: | nice |
| [04:32:09] | wagnerrp: | i.e. better than matte in sunlight, and looks almost as nice as gloss in ideal conditions |
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| [05:11:07] | wagnerrp: | you know, thats twice in two days thats happened |
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| [05:12:40] | sphery: | and you just blocked my 2nd commit |
| [05:13:25] | sphery: | took me longer to prepare commit because of new files |
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| [05:35:17] | Beirdo: | awww. |
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| [12:10:15] | seeker: | Morning |
| [12:10:50] | seeker: | Aww, looks like my localised film certificate patch didn't make it in before the feature freeze |
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| [12:34:29] | wagnerrp: | there is that little issue of localized certifications not currently being available on the existing grabbers |
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| [12:35:00] | wagnerrp: | means any use of it would require a currently unavailable grabber... |
| [12:35:06] | wagnerrp: | in effect, a new feature |
| [12:35:08] | wagnerrp: | :) |
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| [12:37:30] | seeker: | wagnerrp: Look at the ticket I made for it :P |
| [12:39:02] | seeker: | 'twas submitted well before the feature freeze |
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| [12:42:16] | seeker: | Iirc, ticket 10294 |
| [12:42:25] | seeker: | But that may be wrong |
| [12:54:15] | Seeker`: | ah, no, 10240 |
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| [13:55:54] | pyrodex: | Is there anyway in the new mythmeta lookup from tvdb to adjust a show name? For example I record bizarre foods but the EPG has the show as Bizarre Foods with Andrew Zimmern and tvdb has it as Bizarre Foods. |
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| [14:19:19] | dekarl-too: | pyrodex: you should be able to simply enter the series id from thetvdb in the recording rule |
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| [14:42:30] | p01nt3r: | hello. i have mythtv running on ubuntu lucid lynx by having mythtv installed from source. the video-output is very streaky and noisy. sound is fine. if i look the cards output via "vlc /dev/video0" the video picture is fine too. my tv-card is an older analog tuner-card "hauppauge pvr-350". can anyone help me with that? |
| [14:43:50] | p01nt3r: | mythtv-version is newest stable release 0.24.2–1. |
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| [14:46:17] | p01nt3r: | what i could observe was that when i used mythtv to playback the card and then i use vlc to play it back, i have to restart for having the old good video picture with vlc. so my assumption is that mythtv changes the video-output either for the screen or for the card itself. |
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| [15:32:48] | p01nt3r: | nice channel here lol |
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| [15:52:47] | skd5aner: | anyone submitted their qam map to schedules direct? http://forums.schedulesdirect.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1214 |
| [15:53:31] | wagnerrp: | i dont see much of a point until there is actually a mechanism in place to do something with it |
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| [15:53:50] | wagnerrp: | as far as i can tell, you submit it to them and... thats it |
| [15:54:13] | wagnerrp: | i saw no way yet for applications to try to interface with it |
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| [16:04:57] | skd5aner: | yea, that's why I was wondering |
| [16:05:01] | skd5aner: | once they have it, then what? |
| [16:05:22] | skd5aner: | can mythtv import a channels.conf file anymore? |
| [16:06:11] | wagnerrp: | ideally, mythtv would pull the relevant information in XML during the guide data updates |
| [16:06:23] | wagnerrp: | updating automatically as it does the analog channels |
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| [16:14:30] | skd5aner: | yea, but I'm guessing that in my market, I'd be the only one to probably even submit a qam map... |
| [16:14:48] | skd5aner: | unless they would start leveraging the data the HDHRs submit automatically |
| [16:15:51] | wagnerrp: | we would probably have some opt-in for mythtv to submit data automatically |
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| [16:16:55] | wagnerrp: | although weve probably only got some 10k people in total running SD/mythtv/cable to do so |
| [16:17:06] | wagnerrp: | a far cry short of those running HDHRs in general |
| [16:17:36] | wagnerrp: | and unless they have an HDHRP or other similar cablecard tuner, its not something that can really be trusted as accurate |
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| [16:24:49] | ** CyberKnet wishes Cox Tulsa would mark things copy freely ** | |
| [16:31:24] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yea, but if there were some way that silicon dust could coordinate with schedules direct on the data the HDHRP automatically submits back... |
| [16:31:38] | skd5aner: | the dataset would be far larger I would imagine |
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| [16:32:21] | wagnerrp: | i wouldnt necessarily put it outside the realm of possibility |
| [16:32:29] | wagnerrp: | but i dont expect it to happen |
| [16:32:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: do the HDHR's do the submit to SD? I always thought it was the winders software. |
| [16:32:59] | skd5aner: | I believe it's the HDHRs themselves |
| [16:33:55] | skd5aner: | http://www.silicondust.com/privacy/ |
| [16:34:10] | skd5aner: | #2 there |
| [16:34:35] | CyberKnet: | interesting. |
| [16:34:48] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: It's a good product though – I have two of them for OTA stuff. I tried doing QAM scans on my FiOS service, but just came up with crappy-quality local government channels, nothing of interest to me. I didn't see any Local HD channels... |
| [16:35:01] | skd5aner: | I use it for QAM |
| [16:35:08] | skd5aner: | works well, but yea – locals only |
| [16:35:24] | skd5aner: | I've got one new-in-box, but haven't really needed to open it |
| [16:35:38] | skd5aner: | I should probably sell it and put the money towards an HDHR-Prime |
| [16:35:48] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Well, it does say "When enabled"... |
| [16:35:50] | skd5aner: | that said, I've got TWC, so I'd be no better off |
| [16:36:04] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: I think it's enabled by default |
| [16:37:14] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: do you have an HDHR? |
| [16:37:44] | wagnerrp: | anyway... if youve got the command line utility |
| [16:37:53] | wagnerrp: | its the /lineup/location stuff |
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| [16:38:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I don't remember even getting the locals on a QAM scan, so I just stuck with my roof-top antenna. I *usually* get about 70–80% signal strength, but do have a couple of hills in the way of a direct path, so I get occasional signal drops due to that. |
| [16:39:06] | wagnerrp: | looks like mine is disabled |
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| [16:39:14] | wagnerrp: | ive never explicitly enabled or disabled it |
| [16:39:14] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: what's the cli? |
| [16:39:15] | J-e-f-f-A: | grr... antennaweb.org changed their site – they don't seem to have a nice spreadsheet-style report anymore... grr... |
| [16:39:28] | wagnerrp: | hdhomerun_config <ID> get /lineup/location |
| [16:40:16] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yea, I guess mine says disabled too |
| [16:40:25] | wagnerrp: | actually no |
| [16:40:45] | wagnerrp: | you set the countrycode/postcode to "disabled" to disable it |
| [16:40:50] | wagnerrp: | it just stores a string |
| [16:40:55] | wagnerrp: | and that sets the string to an invalid option |
| [16:41:04] | wagnerrp: | there is no on/off |
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| [16:42:03] | J-e-f-f-A: | Heh, I'm 50/50 – one of mine is 'disabled', the other is enabled as US:xxxxx, where xxxxx is my zip code... |
| [16:42:26] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: did you configure it via windows or anything? |
| [16:43:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I may have... I've had the 1st one for YEARS now... added the 2nd one about 1–1/2 years ago when I switched to HD with FiOS... |
| [16:43:55] | skd5aner: | I wonder if the software within windows sets that parameter |
| [16:44:00] | skd5aner: | I'd bet that it does |
| [16:44:21] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: I wonder if it would be a good thing or not for mythtv to set that parameter too as an "opt-in" thing? |
| [16:44:56] | J-e-f-f-A: | I just disabled it on the 2nd one with "./hdhomerun_config 1013xxxx set /lineup/location disabled" ;-) |
| [16:45:22] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: more data is good |
| [16:45:33] | ** J-e-f-f-A wonders if he should have left it on... humm... didn't seem to be hurting anything! ** | |
| [16:47:59] | ** J-e-f-f-A turns it back on for the 2nd HDHR – he figures he should help support the company that supports the Myth community so well! And it doesn't seem to be hurting anything. ;-) ** | |
| [16:48:24] | skd5aner: | hurray for J-e-f-f-A's community spirit! |
| [16:49:21] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Hehehe... ;-) I may try a clear-QAM scan again at some point – even if it's with just one of the HDHR's tuners, as I don't think I ever have all 4 in use at one time. ;-) |
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| [16:49:40] | wagnerrp: | i dont see what use two responding on the same exact cable line has over one |
| [16:49:48] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: the last clear-QAM scan I did was about 18 months ago. |
| [16:50:09] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: what does it say here that you shoudl get (if anything)? http://www.silicondust.com/support/channels/ |
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| [16:57:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Well, according to that, I could get all my locals and a bunch more... humm... http://www.silicondust.com/hdhomerun/lineup_w . . . neup_8303127 |
| [16:58:29] | wagnerrp: | J-e-f-f-A: it has a virtual id there |
| [16:58:35] | wagnerrp: | which means Prime data |
| [16:59:15] | wagnerrp: | sadly, they dont seem to indicate CCI data |
| [17:00:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | Humm... so it would appear there are at least 3 folks in my city on FiOS using HDHR-Primes on FiOS? That gives me some hope... |
| [17:00:19] | wagnerrp: | no, they could be using MCE |
| [17:00:58] | wagnerrp: | not only in your city, in your specific zip code |
| [17:01:07] | wagnerrp: | i assume boston has a couple dozen of those |
| [17:01:23] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: Right, but they are using a HDHR-Prime, right? Or does MCE give you more channels than Myth/Linux with the prime due to licensing? |
| [17:01:59] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: Hehehe, my city actually has just one zip code. ;-) We're about 20 miles west of Boston. ;-) |
| [17:02:38] | wagnerrp: | the Prime itself has full access to your subscribed lineup |
| [17:02:58] | wagnerrp: | so it doesnt matter what software is being used with it |
| [17:04:10] | pyrodex-work: | is there any linux based tool to scan through a Transport stream for errors? |
| [17:04:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | wagnerrp: Ok, so that does give me hope. ;-) There's lots of premiums on that list... but then again, there's lots of premiums, but I don't see any of the 'regular' channels, such as USA network, or Discovery Channel, or TBS, etc... humm.. so maybe not so much... D'oh! |
| [17:05:45] | skd5aner: | well... |
| [17:05:47] | skd5aner: | time out... |
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| [17:06:38] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp is talking symantecs again... just because the HDHR-Prime has full access, doesn't mean that mythtv will... Windows MCE can leverage the copy once flags, wheras mythtv can only leverage the copy freely flags |
| [17:06:49] | CyberKnet: | I've wondered several times about switching to MCE to get access to all cable channels via either an HDHR-Prime or a Ceton InfiniTV ... but honestly the lack of commercial skip stops it every time. |
| [17:07:00] | CyberKnet: | eventually I'll capitulate and buy an HDPVR. |
| [17:07:09] | wagnerrp: | right, im saying the prime might update the side with the full lineup it has access to |
| [17:07:13] | skd5aner: | so, while the HDHR-Prime doesn't restrict, it's the software that either can or can't decrypt it |
| [17:07:17] | J-e-f-f-A: | CyberKnet: Hehehe... I have two. ;-) |
| [17:07:22] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yea, that's probably true |
| [17:07:22] | wagnerrp: | i see nothing on that page to indicate whether mythtv can actually access it |
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| [17:07:31] | wagnerrp: | s/side/site/ |
| [17:07:38] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: gotcha. |
| [17:07:39] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: it'd be excellent if it had the flag data there |
| [17:07:54] | wagnerrp: | supposedly they are rewriting the lineup utility |
| [17:08:05] | wagnerrp: | hopefully it will say such when they are finished |
| [17:08:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | I did notice they don't have the captured image for each channel anymore... ;-) |
| [17:09:07] | CyberKnet: | J-e-f-f-A: Glad for you that you have two :) |
| [17:09:25] | CyberKnet: | J-e-f-f-A: Jealous for me. heh |
| [17:09:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | Nevertheless, I think I'll still do a clear QAM scan to see if I can get the locals off the cable instead of the roof-top antenna. |
| [17:10:24] | J-e-f-f-A: | CyberKnet: Actually, I wouldn't have two (kinda tight $$$-wise), but I got an award at work in the form of a $750 Amazon.com gift card, so I spent it on two HD-PVRs and a 2nd HD-HR ;-) |
| [17:11:04] | J-e-f-f-A: | CyberKnet: IE: If I could have converted that into CASH, I probably would have... But it also gave me a good excuse to upgrade my MythTV system to HD. ;-) |
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| [17:15:38] | bill6502: | wagnerrp: I'm testing IPv6 and it looks like Qt is going to require that addresses be in all caps and not allow consecutive 0's to be replaced with :: (see: http://pastebin.com/RQajmMe0 .) Do you agree? |
| [17:16:22] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: it will support more traditional addresses |
| [17:16:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | RE: QAM tuning – is there a disadvantage to using clear QAM – IE: Do they move channels around from time to time, causing you to have to re-scan to get things back 'in sync'? (and thus failed/wrong recordings?) |
| [17:16:39] | wagnerrp: | but you are correct, when it prints them back out, there will be no shortening and all uppercase |
| [17:17:15] | wagnerrp: | J-e-f-f-A: occasionally, yes |
| [17:17:40] | J-e-f-f-A: | ah, in that case, I'll probably stick to the roof-top antenna for the locals.. they never change. ;-) |
| [17:17:50] | CyberKnet: | J-e-f-f-A: sounds great to me! |
| [17:18:07] | bill6502: | But I had to change the address to prevent the critical error message and to allow it to bind. |
| [17:18:26] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: oh? where at? |
| [17:18:51] | bill6502: | mythtv-setup, if that's what you mean. |
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| [17:19:17] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: one of the sanity check things? |
| [17:20:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | CyberKnet: Yeah, the HD-PVR is a great device. The only pain is that it sometimes locks up, requiring a hard-reset (via power-off) to clear – hence tools like the hdpvr-killer have been developed... |
| [17:20:19] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: yes, the cable co's do switch channels, and rescanning is a HUGGGGGGE pain |
| [17:20:37] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: the other benefit of OTA is that they never compress the signal, wherease cable-co's often do |
| [17:21:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Yeah... Considering the clear-QAM scans I did ~18 months ago took 20–30 mins each (trying each encoding method), I can certainly understand... |
| [17:21:45] | skd5aner: | the benefit of QAM is – strong signal always and not antenna |
| [17:21:52] | skd5aner: | s/not/no |
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| [17:23:10] | bill6502: | By the by, thanks for all your work on this. I think those with bindv6only=1 would have flooded the -users list. |
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| [17:23:16] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: doesn't take TOO long for me, but I get a ton of channels (maybe 80%) that are nothing, so I have to hide those... then I have to go back and re-edit the channel number, channel name, and xmltvid for all the channels I DO want to keep – and that's assuming the QAM data is descriptive enough to know which channel is which without viewing |
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| [17:24:04] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Exactly – on both notes. Except I have never seen any re-compression by FiOS... – my only motivation would be your 2nd point – strong signal. Even with my antenna up about 10' above the peak of my roof, my signal strength is high, but there are still two hills between me and the towers, resulting in small drops from time to time (usually only a second or so... and usually only during heavy rainstorms in the fall or snows |
| [17:24:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | torms) |
| [17:24:33] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: its one of those things that should have been done years ago, independent of the ipv6 issue |
| [17:24:43] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: where specifically are you seeing this issue? |
| [17:25:01] | wagnerrp: | the only two warnings i know of are the sanity check in mythtv-setup, and the initial configuration everywhere else |
| [17:25:28] | wagnerrp: | ive got a 'pretty' IPv6 address defined in my database, and am not seeing it |
| [17:28:12] | ** J-e-f-f-A has yet to delve into the world of IPv6 ... ** | |
| [17:28:36] | bill6502: | wagnerrp: It happeded when I used mythtv-setup to change my address from ::1 to a fdf9... . When I restarted the backend the error in the pasebin above printed. I couldn't get rid of it until I changed it to upper and no ::. But if you've got pretty addresses, I'll retest. |
| [17:28:58] | wagnerrp: | pastebin above? |
| [17:29:02] | ** wagnerrp goes to check for a link ** | |
| [17:29:18] | wagnerrp: | ah, so there is |
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| [17:33:19] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: the code in question is https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/blob/master/ . . . ext.cpp#L637 |
| [17:33:32] | wagnerrp: | the comparison is done as a QHostAddress, rather than a string |
| [17:33:44] | wagnerrp: | so string formatting shouldnt make a difference |
| [17:35:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I'm only physically 15 miles from the 2 or 3 towers that broadcast all the local networks... but there are two hills between me & them, so even though I have a 75-mile UHF antenna (Yagi style), I still get occasional dropouts as described above. But only on a couple of channels, so they're probably lower on the towers than the other channels that are reliable. |
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| [17:36:28] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: the 'old' antennaweb site used to allow you to enter the Antenna height manually, and I tried hights all the way up to 100' and it didn't make much of a difference... My current setup has the antenna about 25–30' off the ground (~10' above the peak of my house) |
| [17:39:35] | bill6502: | wagnerrp: Thanks, I'm off to retest (and eventually update 'my' Enable IPv6 Wiki. |
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| [17:42:25] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: some additional logging that may clear things up... http://pastebin.com/up6zR8JA |
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| [17:52:36] | pyrodex-work: | If I want to re-record a program in mythtv but it isn't due to come up soon (not in listings) how do I remove the previous recording from the DB so it will reschedule it if airs again? |
| [17:53:15] | trumee_afk is now known as trumee | |
| [17:53:24] | wagnerrp: | in watch-recordings, there is an option to allow for re-record |
| [17:53:51] | pyrodex-work: | I deleted it from there already by accident |
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| [17:54:01] | pyrodex-work: | typically I would hit "delete + re-record" |
| [17:54:04] | skd5aner: | there's another option "previously recorded" |
| [17:54:10] | wagnerrp: | in 'manage recordings' |
| [17:54:13] | skd5aner: | you can find it in there and delete all from a series or a particular episode |
| [17:54:25] | J-e-f-f-A: | pyrodex-work: and/or setup a title search recording rule. |
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| [17:55:02] | pyrodex-work: | ok thanks |
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| [18:05:43] | bill6502: | wagnerrp: I already changed to the original address AND IT WORKED. So I went back to the 1st failing log to see what I had typed, but it exactly the same (and what was in pastbin.) I have no excuse. Sorry for the noise. Take care. |
| [18:07:44] | wagnerrp: | bill6502: does that mean when you ran the logs the first time, the IP you had set was incorrect? |
| [18:08:56] | skd5aner: | random question for folks – does everyone have an issue with the last 30 seconds of sitcoms getting cut out as part of commflag? The part where usually during the credits they air a little bit more before the start of the next show... wanted to make sure it's not just me. |
| [18:09:47] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: there was some issue a while back where commflag was using the wrong frame when marking points |
| [18:09:53] | wagnerrp: | yielding poor accuracy |
| [18:11:10] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: this has been happening to me for years... just assumed everyone dealt with it because of the shortness... all NBC and CBS sitcoms exhibit this issue, since the show "ends", commercial break, continue show for 30 seconds, production slides, start next show... |
| [18:11:42] | skd5aner: | myth will commflag between the end of the show and the commercials all the way to the start of the next show |
| [18:12:13] | skd5aner: | I have a 30 or 60 second extension by default |
| [18:12:30] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: does that not happen with your sitcoms? |
| [18:13:46] | skd5aner: | I always have to manually skip back to the end of the last commercial break to catch the end of the show |
| [18:14:54] | wagnerrp: | ive not paid close enough attention to notice |
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| [18:35:10] | trumee: | i have given up on ion system and now looking for an htpc matx case and a decent motherboard. are there any recommendations? |
| [18:36:45] | bill6502: | wagnerrp: re incorrect IP, no, the addresses from mythbackend...log , sql and ifconfig all match. When I submitted my 'funky' patch in 10288, I used the existing method of comparing strings and tripped over the upper case/no:: issue, so when I saw the |
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| [18:38:25] | CyberKnet: | trumee: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Hardware |
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| [18:38:47] | bill6502: | failure I tried entering an upper case address and it worked. When I update my 'real' box, I'll try this again, otherwise, it sure looks like a type (invisible, but a typo.) |
| [18:38:53] | trumee: | CyberKnet: thanks. |
| [18:39:05] | CyberKnet: | trumee: hope it helps. |
| [18:39:08] | trumee: | Antec fusion seems nice, anybody uses that? |
| [18:39:26] | CyberKnet: | trumee: You'll find many advocates of Antec cases in here in general. |
| [18:39:32] | trumee: | CyberKnet: how about you? |
| [18:39:44] | CyberKnet: | I use an Antec twelve hundred case for my master backend |
| [18:39:54] | CyberKnet: | I use an Antec Nine Hundred for my desktop. |
| [18:40:13] | CyberKnet: | not for my frontend though ... I opted for something more ... eye candy ... for my front end. |
| [18:40:14] | trumee: | right, i need something for the tv shelf |
| [18:40:31] | CyberKnet: | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811204039 |
| [18:40:40] | CyberKnet: | that's what I'm using for my front end. |
| [18:40:55] | trumee: | CyberKnet: blimey |
| [18:40:55] | CyberKnet: | it's ... shiny. |
| [18:41:13] | trumee: | CyberKnet: is that wood? |
| [18:41:18] | CyberKnet: | Yes. |
| [18:41:26] | trumee: | CyberKnet: cool |
| [18:41:26] | CyberKnet: | The gold pieces (more of a brass color) are actually plastic. |
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| [18:41:39] | CyberKnet: | unfortunately. |
| [18:41:48] | CyberKnet: | but ... from six feet away it's alright. |
| [18:42:04] | CyberKnet: | It looks like one of those cheesy wooden "vintage" record players that walmart sells. |
| [18:42:06] | trumee: | i need a common FE/BE since only the living room has satellite cables in |
| [18:42:08] | CyberKnet: | which is the look I was going. |
| [18:42:46] | CyberKnet: | I didn't want it to be a centerpiece, but I wanted it not to attract attention. People see it, and assume it's one of those cheesy cd/record players and they don't say anything. |
| [18:42:49] | CyberKnet: | mission accomplished. |
| [18:43:02] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I have an Antec Fusion Black – it's fairly large, but is a very nice looking case. |
| [18:43:02] | CyberKnet: | The Antec cases are very nice in general trumee. I doubt you would be dissatisfied. |
| [18:44:16] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i was going after antec fusion 350, but then read that its remote and IR receiver isnt good |
| [18:44:32] | trumee: | i dont need a big case, since i will have all my disks in a NAS |
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| [18:45:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: The IR receiver in mine is just an MCE receiver... I use a Microsloth MCE remote with it. ;-) |
| [18:46:26] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I think mine was the 430, and has the LCD display with tons of icons, that are used by the frontend thanks to jarod's work some time ago. ;-) |
| [18:46:27] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: is Antec Fusion Black bigger than Antec Fusion Remote? |
| [18:47:01] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: does it need a special PSU? |
| [18:47:47] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: this is what i am after, http://www.ebuyer.com/148790-antec-fusion-rem . . . 1345-08760-5 or http://www.ebuyer.com/140998-antec-micro-fusi . . . 1345-08745-2 |
| [18:48:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | Ah, the full name is "Antec Veris Fusion Black 430" – may or may not be available anymore though... Standard PS – and was included with mine (hence the '430' – which is the wattage of the PS). |
| [18:49:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: That's the case I have, but 'black' – so the face is black instead of silver. Despite it's size, it's only MicroATX since they have the PS on the left, leaving room for only a uATX board. |
| [18:50:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Oh, the 1st link is the case I have. The 2nd one looks much smaller. |
| [18:50:45] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: yes, the second one can only take one hdd |
| [18:51:49] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i have read some moans about the reciever |
| [18:51:56] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: The description says it's an LCD, but the picture 1/2 way down seems to show the VFD. (LCD is graphic with many icons around the side – VFD is a 16x2 display IIRC with no icons) |
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| [18:52:56] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: LCD is better than VFD? and supported in linux? |
| [18:54:03] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: If it's the LCD like mine, the receiver is treated as an 'mceusb', and works with an MCE remote out-of-the-box, including turning the machine on with the Power button on the MCE remote. |
| [18:54:58] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: does the remote need to be strictly line-of-sight? |
| [18:56:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: One drawback to the LCD is that the backlight is controlled via software, and often stays 'on' when the machine is off – due to some issue with the lcdproc driver and timing with shutting down the usb bus, etc. As a result, I modded my display by adding a transistor to physically cut the power to the backlight when the 'main' power is off. (before it was powered by the 'standby' power just like the IR receiver) |
| [18:57:01] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: My box is currently about 80 degrees off-angle from my view, and it works well with my MCE remote. You have to point the remote in the 'general' direction of the box, but not *right* at it... ;-) |
| [18:57:41] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: by standby you mean suspend-to-ram S3? So the ir-receiver supports wake-on-usb? |
| [18:57:56] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: You could always get an MCE remote/receiver pair with any case, and put the reciever somewhere in plain view... |
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| [18:59:03] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: with that case, there's a connector to 'tap' into the power supply's 'standby 5v' power, and it actually connects between the power button and your MB power pins. The IR unit powers it on by simulating you pressing the power button. |
| [18:59:13] | J-e-f-f-A: | no wake-on-usb needed. |
| [18:59:50] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: also, i am still not decided on motherboard. I want something with nvidia chipset so that i dont have to stick a card in (to save power). had a lookaround and saw boards with USB3, do connectors on the boards compatible with usb3? |
| [19:00:00] | J-e-f-f-A: | You can also turn it on by pressing the power button on the front of the case. [and off that way too – the remote will *not* trigger a power button press if the machine is on.] |
| [19:00:56] | J-e-f-f-A: | the usb connectors on the front of the case are usb2 – usb3 didn't exist when this case was designed/manufactured. |
| [19:01:21] | J-e-f-f-A: | [unless they have an upgraded version, but I don't think they do] |
| [19:01:21] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: interesting. but is wake-on-usb supported, since if tomorrow the ir breaks, will it be possible to use wake-on-usb to bootup |
| [19:01:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: But it is a VERY nice looking case, and well built. |
| [19:01:55] | ** trumee is mindful of little ones being around ** | |
| [19:02:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: wake-on-usb is a function of the motherboard, not the case. ;-) I'm not sure if the built-in receiver generates a signal via USB. But since it can 'press' the power button, what's the issue? |
| [19:02:52] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: can usb3 connectors on mobo connect to these usb2 connectors? |
| [19:03:52] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I don't know, but I'm sure it'll have a USB2 header on there. ;-) As far as I know, machines still come with some USB2 ports... but I could be wrong. ;-) |
| [19:03:55] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i dont see any issue. just was wondering about wake-on-usb since i have a generic mceusb reciever/remote already |
| [19:04:27] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: what motherboard do you have in there? |
| [19:04:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Well, you *should* be able to use that remote with the built-in receiver in the Antec Fusion case – and just-in-case you can't, you can still use your MCE receiver. ;-) |
| [19:05:18] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Humm... I don't recall off the top of my head – I built that system about 3 years ago... let me see if anything in /proc will give me a clue... |
| [19:05:18] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: MCE receiver to boot up (using wake-on-usb)? |
| [19:05:59] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: woops, I can't check... I'm not on that box. ;-) it's my bedroom box and I'm not at home to power it on. ;-) |
| [19:06:49] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I don't know – that'd be a function of your motherboard I would think... and/or configuring your linux distribution to enable the wake-on-usb for it. |
| [19:08:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: But like I said, the built-in receiver has a special connection on it – you connect the front-panel Power button on it, then connect the 'power' button control from the IR receiver to the motherboard's power control. It electronically 'pushes' the power button – so no wake-on-usb required. As far as your MB is concerned, a human pushed the physical power button. |
| [19:09:18] | J-e-f-f-A: | And your physical power button is still functional. |
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| [19:10:44] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: And the 1st case (the one we're talking about) is full-height, so you can put a full-height graphics card in it. So if your MB doesn't have Nvidia gfx, or doesn't have -acceptable- graphics, you can upgrade it with a 'normal' sized card. ;-) |
| [19:11:31] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: you have sold me on it. it is as wide as my tv shelf 17.5 inch, so looks like i will have to upgrade my tv shelf |
| [19:12:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Well, the choice is yours. ;-) It is a nice case. It is BIG, but is very, very easy on the eyes. |
| [19:13:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | I have an AMD motherboard in mine, and with 'cool & quiet' enabled and the 120mm fans on the LOW setting, when I first turn it on, the CPU fan is loud for about 3 seconds, then goes down to near-silent. |
| [19:13:38] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: what do you mean easy on the eyes. for reading the lcd? and do you remember what motherboard you have? |
| [19:13:58] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I mean that it's BEAUTIFUL. ;-) It's not UGLY. ;-) |
| [19:14:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I don't remember what motherboard I have in there specifically – and it'd be about 3 years old anyways, as that's when I built the system. ;-) |
| [19:14:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Here's the manual for the case: http://www.antec.com/pdf/manuals/Fusion_430_& . . . N_manual.pdf |
| [19:15:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | humm... stupid, no pics of the inside... |
| [19:16:45] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Here ya go – can [almost always] count on tom's hardware... ;-) http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/antec-fus . . . se,1760.html |
| [19:18:38] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: that is the one with VFD |
| [19:19:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: They show both (if you're referring to Tom's hardware link) |
| [19:19:31] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: ah, the black on is LCD |
| [19:20:08] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: in 4 years time, there has not been a better case than antec fusion? |
| [19:20:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: That's ok, all those icons aren't all that useful. ;-) They're too tiny to make sense of across the room anyways. ;-) |
| [19:21:09] | ** skd5aner is blinded by dashes ** | |
| [19:21:26] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: There very may well be... I haven't really looked to tell you the truth. They all cost quite a bit though. I got mine for $160 on sale at the time, which isn't bad when you consider that it's got the LCD Display, IR receiver, 430W PS and is a beautiful case... |
| [19:21:41] | ** J-e-f-f-A shooots hyphens at skd5aner --------------------------------------- ;-) ** | |
| [19:21:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | hehehehe |
| [19:22:14] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: it is good that i will be able to use my existing ATX PSU with fusion |
| [19:22:23] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: interesting comparison, http://www.anandtech.com/show/2637 |
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| [19:23:28] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Hehehe... that bottom one – the "Antec Fusion Remote Max" is HUGE! |
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| [19:28:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: If you don't care about having a display or built-in IR receiver – I use two of these for a couple of frontends now – they're smaller than the Antec, and look pretty nice. I use MCE receivers with them. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811154087 |
| [19:28:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: But they use a small power supply – ATX Flex ... |
| [19:29:17] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: nothings comes on google shopping in UK |
| [19:29:26] | J-e-f-f-A: | They're pretty 'deep/long' though. |
| [19:29:55] | J-e-f-f-A: | |
| [19:30:07] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i wanted to buy this initially, http://www.novatech.co.uk/products/components . . . -vision.html |
| [19:30:26] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: but it seems the ir receiver may not be mceusb compatible |
| [19:30:47] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: so dropped the idea. although it is very cheap |
| [19:31:18] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Well, that's not much of an issue as you can always use your USB MCE receiver... |
| [19:32:00] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: issue is dont know if wake-on-usb will work, as it has a similar arrangement as you described about antec case |
| [19:32:16] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: it switches on if the power button on remote is pressed |
| [19:32:55] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Oh, and it doesn't have to be MCE compatible – as long as the receiver is recognized by lirc. ;-) ^^ Well, they probably loop the power button through it like on the Antec. |
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| [19:34:07] | trumee: | "Initial impressions are that this remote is terrible. The ir receiver is very slow in passing the signal on to the usb port (or the usb port doesn't have a very high priority). When there is high disk/cpu activity, it can take several seconds for the received signal (receiver light flashes straight away) to be acted on. For instance: if you press the volume control you have to wait 2–5 secs for the volume "window" to appear in WMC. |
| [19:34:09] | trumee: | You then have a few seconds to adjust the volume level before the window disappears" |
| [19:34:24] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: review for the remote isnt great, http://www.avforums.com/forums/home-entertain . . . -review.html |
| [19:35:11] | skd5aner: | hey – if a network changes names (i.e., versus --> NBC Sports Network), how is mythtv supposed to pick up that change? |
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| [19:37:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I belive if you're using Schedules Direct, you'll get the new name automagically. ;-) |
| [19:37:47] | skd5aner: | negative |
| [19:37:53] | skd5aner: | listings still show it as "Versus" |
| [19:38:15] | skd5aner: | mythfilldatabase --dd-grab-all is what i'm using, there might be a different flag or something required to pick up the change |
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| [19:39:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Does it show changed on the SD site? Did just the name change, or the programming as well? |
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| [19:40:02] | skd5aner: | yes, changed on SD |
| [19:40:26] | skd5aner: | xmltvid is the same I believe – they just renamed the network |
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| [19:40:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: Ah, gotcha. |
| [19:40:48] | wizbit: | anybody here got mceusb & lirc working on a 3.2.x kernel? |
| [19:41:19] | J-e-f-f-A: | wizbit: I almost said "yes" until you said 3.2.x ;-) |
| [19:41:27] | wizbit: | what kernel you using |
| [19:42:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | wizbit: I'm on FC13 iirc – so 2.6.something – let me check. |
| [19:42:25] | wizbit: | oh ok |
| [19:42:33] | wizbit: | mine is working on 2.6.37.6 |
| [19:42:34] | J-e-f-f-A: | wizbit: 2.6.34.9–69 |
| [19:42:43] | ** J-e-f-f-A needs to update. ;-) ** | |
| [19:42:45] | wizbit: | yep it would work on that |
| [19:43:01] | wizbit: | newer kernels can save you power |
| [19:43:33] | J-e-f-f-A: | wizbit: I usually don't do any 'major' updates until I come around to upgrading my whole system. ;-) |
| [19:43:46] | wizbit: | oh ok |
| [19:44:00] | wizbit: | i might just leave mine as it is then |
| [19:44:02] | J-e-f-f-A: | wizbit: and it's almost time to do that again – when 0.25 is released... ;-) |
| [19:44:13] | wizbit: | Linux tv-1 2.6.37.6-mythtv.pxe #3 SMP Tue Feb 7 19:53:35 GMT 2012 x86_64 Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6300 @ 1.86GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux |
| [19:44:44] | wizbit: | i will wait for the next release of slackware |
| [19:45:19] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: That case is still pretty nice looking, and very compact. If you keep the power requirements low, I don't see any issues with that. – Although, is this only a frontend, or a combined fe/be? |
| [19:45:33] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: combined BE/FE |
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| [19:46:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Well, that case seems quite small imho – remember, you need capture device(s) [ie: tuners] – which generate heat and use power. |
| [19:46:27] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i will have a NAS for storage (HP Proliant micro server) |
| [19:47:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | SD added a "QAM map"? COOL! ;-) |
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| [19:48:22] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: hmm, didnt think of tuner power consumption |
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| [19:48:37] | skd5aner: | If I do mythfilldatabase --do-channel-updates --source-id=<cable source ID> will that ignore trying to do updates to my channels associated with other sources? |
| [19:48:49] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I see what you're saying... ;-) Myth still has mine listed as "VERSUS" too, and SD has it listed as "NBCSN"... |
| [19:50:44] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I think that Novatech case would make a nice frontend – it's very 'pretty'... But may not have enough room/power/cooling for a backend – depending on what your tuner devices are [cards/usb/network]. |
| [19:52:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I didn't see any comments from Linux users if the receiver itself works in Linux or not. And the one user I saw that said the case doesn't turn on with the remote probably either didn't have the power connected properly to the front panel (needs 'standby' power that's on even when the pc is off), or had the power connector backwards on the MB. |
| [19:52:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: (with a standard switch, polarity is irrelevent, but on a transistor switch, one way will work, the other won't.) ;-) |
| [19:53:31] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i bought this, http://www.amazon.co.uk/Antec-Fusion-Remote-D . . . 6&sr=8-1 |
| [19:55:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Heh, it is a nice case. Only drawback for me was that it was only uATX and at the time I was using all PCI tuner cards. ;-) So I needed a full-size ATX for my backend. ;-) |
| [19:55:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: And the fans are triple-speed selectable – so they're pretty quiet and cool well, even on 'low' speed. |
| [19:56:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Are you electronically inclined at all? |
| [19:56:43] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: hardware mods, not really :) |
| [19:57:05] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: i need to find a motherboard for this now |
| [19:58:33] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Ok... I was going to offer to open up my system again to document my hardware mod of adding a transistor and resistor to physically power off the backlight on the LCD when the power is off – as mentioned, the lcdproc driver often doesn't get the job done... (although it may have been worked out/fixed in later versions... I haven't checked in a LONG time) |
| [19:59:32] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: perhaps once i have it going you can help mw |
| [20:01:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: sure. ;-) If I'm not at my kb, I'll answer you as soon as I get back. I'm in the US, so I'm about 5hrs behind you. ;-) |
| [20:01:25] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: shame, i cant buy ASUS M3N78-EM from a decent shop now |
| [20:01:55] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: if i can get a mob with Geforce 8300/8400 chipset, that will be nice |
| [20:02:10] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Heh... I think I've got an M2N in one of my machines. ;-) |
| [20:02:33] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: although, i do have a GeForce 8400 GS card |
| [20:02:55] | trumee: | jedix: funny thing is ASUS dont seem to produce nvidia boards |
| [20:03:12] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: seems most boards are AMD/ATI now |
| [20:03:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: If you're looking to do VDPAU, 512MB or more is best – 256MB just doesn't work well. |
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| [20:04:03] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: how can i check memory on my card? (via software) |
| [20:04:13] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: With a suitably fast CPU, you can do decoding in software anyways. Hardware decoding is great, but is quite limited. |
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| [20:04:29] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: does the channel icon downloader leverage wget or is it already integrated with mythdownloadmanager? |
| [20:04:29] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: yes, i do want cdpau |
| [20:04:58] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: also i have a AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4200+. If i can reuse that it will be awesome |
| [20:05:11] | sphery: | skd5aner: what exactly are you trying to update with --do-channel-updates |
| [20:05:37] | skd5aner: | The channel name changed "Versus" is now "NBC Sports Network" |
| [20:05:49] | skd5aner: | (and the callsign) |
| [20:06:19] | skd5aner: | but I want to avoid mfdb from impacting my lineup tied to my QAM tuners, because it'll hose everything there |
| [20:06:27] | skd5aner: | I think I got it to work with sourceid |
| [20:06:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: SD has the change – it used to be "VERSUS" and is now "NBCSN" – mine didn't change either... ;-) (but I didnt' notice) |
| [20:07:32] | sphery: | that updates callsign (which breaks "this channel" rules), name and channel number (which are just display things, so completely safe), frequency ID (which breaks tuning if it's wrong), and atsc major/minor channel numbers (which, I think, breaks things if they're wrong) |
| [20:07:46] | sphery: | i.e. it may be a bit more course-grained than you want |
| [20:08:48] | sphery: | we currently do UpdateChannelsSafe(), automatically, on every single mythfilldatabase run to update xmltvid, name, and callsign (and nothing else--meaning it won't break digital channels) |
| [20:08:51] | skd5aner: | tuning on my two sources (analog NTSC and HD-PVR/STB) doesn't matter since it uses channel #... |
| [20:09:05] | skd5aner: | tuning on my third source, does matter, but versus isn't on it... so I just wanted to ignore it |
| [20:09:05] | sphery: | but I think currently it will only do those updates for non-scannable inputs |
| [20:09:26] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I *think* the 4200x2 will handle anything you throw at it in software – even 1080i H.264 ... IIRC, one or two of my frontends are slightly slower than that an playback my HD-PVR recordings (which are up to 13Mbps 1080i H.264 recordings) perfectly. |
| [20:09:41] | skd5aner: | sphery: if that's true, it didn't work for me... |
| [20:09:46] | skd5aner: | are you saying it should have? |
| [20:09:56] | sphery: | tuning never uses channel #, btw |
| [20:10:00] | sphery: | tuning uses frequency ID |
| [20:10:25] | skd5aner: | Well, still... it's NTSC, so it's correct as-is... I don't mind if those get updated... |
| [20:10:26] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: these are using Nvidia cards with nvidia binary drivers – but I suspect would be fine with ATI too, as long as you're not using the VESA drivers. ;-) |
| [20:10:49] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: no, i dont do ATI :) |
| [20:11:09] | skd5aner: | I wanted my ATSC/QAM source to not try and pull any channel updates (ever), since it'll hose everything... |
| [20:11:37] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Yeah, I haven't either... but with ATI being owned by AMD now, it may be inevitable at some point in the future... d'oh! |
| [20:11:39] | skd5aner: | (and it doesn't have the channel in quesiton anyway) |
| [20:12:48] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ASUS-M2N68-AM-SE2-M . . . em4161d2364c |
| [20:12:49] | skd5aner: | sphery: so, is mfdb supposed to update channel names/callsigns for sources? |
| [20:12:53] | skd5aner: | (by default)? |
| [20:13:13] | sphery: | only for some sources |
| [20:13:15] | skd5aner: | sphery: if so – that does not happen for me, and apparently J-e-f-f-A either |
| [20:13:18] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: it is cheap, do you think it will be ok with discrete nvidia card |
| [20:13:24] | sphery: | depending on what those sources are connected to |
| [20:13:27] | skd5aner: | sphery: what's the determining factor? |
| [20:14:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: should be fine – it's got a PCIe x16 slot... |
| [20:14:16] | skd5aner: | sphery: I've got 3 sources... 1 is hooked to some analog NTSC cards (pvr-250/500s), 1 is hooked to my HD-PVR, and the other is hooked to my QAM tuners |
| [20:14:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: I'm on Fios, so the sources are connected to HD-PVRs. |
| [20:14:56] | skd5aner: | sphery: the channel in question is on 2 of those lineups -the one hooked to the NTSC cards, and the one hooked to my HD-PVR |
| [20:15:01] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: hmm, not much expansion and no gigabit support i guess |
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| [20:16:08] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: no decent nvidia chipset mobo on ebay :( |
| [20:16:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: any harm in changing the Callsign & Name manually using the "Channel Info" settings page in Mythweb for that channel? |
| [20:17:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: any reason why you want/need to use VDPAU? |
| [20:17:29] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: for low power consumption |
| [20:17:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Seems like your CPU would handle decoding the video just fine... |
| [20:17:41] | sphery: | skd5aner: where you see, "2012-02–12 02:37:27.265 Channels updated." in your logs is where it called UpdateChannelsSafe |
| [20:17:50] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: although, i have a discrete nvidia 8400 card |
| [20:17:55] | sphery: | so you should be seeing that on normal mythfilldatabase runs |
| [20:18:22] | skd5aner: | I see that line... but the channels don't get updated... what I'm trying to ask you is, based on what you are saying, is there a bug or misconfiguration? |
| [20:18:40] | sphery: | it doesn't update channels on sources not connected to any inputs |
| [20:18:53] | sphery: | it doesn't update if the source isn't properly connected |
| [20:19:12] | skd5aner: | neither of those are the case for me |
| [20:19:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | me either... |
| [20:20:01] | sphery: | and only on non-scannable sources (analog encoders) |
| [20:20:37] | sphery: | and only if the there's no channel with the same xmltvid in the source |
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| [20:20:58] | sphery: | meaning you could just delete the broken (non-scannable) channel, and mythfilldatabase will add it normally |
| [20:21:03] | sphery: | without potentially breaking your other channels |
| [20:21:21] | sphery: | (including, especially, digital channels) |
| [20:21:29] | skd5aner: | what do you mean "same xmltvid in the source"... |
| [20:21:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | Ah, so that's the key – if the xmltvid exists, it won't get updated? |
| [20:21:55] | sphery: | because you had a channel in the source with that xmltvid, it didn't change it--figuring that the different name/callsign is what you wanted |
| [20:22:06] | skd5aner: | so, it will only add channels, not modify existing ones |
| [20:22:10] | sphery: | yeah |
| [20:22:15] | J-e-f-f-A: | so it assumes you manually changed it? |
| [20:22:18] | sphery: | had to read all the code to figure out what it's doing |
| [20:22:21] | sphery: | right |
| [20:22:21] | skd5aner: | well, that doesn't address what I was asking at all :) |
| [20:22:31] | sphery: | well, it doesn't automatically do it |
| [20:22:46] | sphery: | it just means if you delete the broken channel, it will automatically do it without breaking any of your other channels |
| [20:22:55] | skd5aner: | so – the recommended way is to ask the user to manually update if a channel becomes rebranded? |
| [20:23:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | So is there any harm in manually changing it with Mythweb's "Channel Info" tab? |
| [20:23:21] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: no |
| [20:23:31] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: with the exception of channel name rules |
| [20:23:31] | sphery: | IMHO, the best way is to have the user just delete the channel and let it get added back, the same way it's added with Fetch channels from listings source |
| [20:23:40] | sphery: | or, just edit the data directly |
| [20:24:03] | sphery: | --do-channel-updates calls UpdateChannelUnsafe, which, as you might imagine, does some things that might not be, er, safe :) |
| [20:24:35] | sphery: | edit the data directly = use channel editor to change name/callsign/channel numbers (and/or freqid) as required |
| [20:24:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | humm, no option to force an update for a particular channel number or xmltvid, eh? ;-) |
| [20:24:58] | sphery: | anyway, I'm not a fan of --do-channel-updates because it's doing the unsafe updates |
| [20:24:59] | warped (warped!~piotro@91.189.74.10) has left #mythtv-users () | |
| [20:25:17] | sphery: | and, IMHO, in all cases where you need to change that kind of stuff, you should be deleting the video source, then re-creating it |
| [20:25:40] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: only by deleting the channel :) |
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| [20:26:01] | sphery: | which will force the update (insertion) of the new channel |
| [20:26:26] | skd5aner: | sphery: yea, playing around with it... it actually caused one of my sources to screw up and change the channum and freqid for all channels that had a duplicate SD and digital equivalent – for example channel 56 which is Discovery (SD/Analog) and 356 which is Discovery (SD/Digital) to just the Analog numbers :/ |
| [20:26:42] | skd5aner: | which is why I always backup the channels table before messing with this stuff |
| [20:27:19] | skd5aner: | so I had 2 unique chanids as before, only they both had the same channum and freqid after the update :P |
| [20:27:20] | sphery: | --do-channel-updates is not meant to update channels so much as it's meant to allow users who have firewire (or, now HDHR Prime or such, that tunes using freqid) to add channels to a digital input since Fetch channels from listings provider doesn't work for those digital channels |
| [20:27:28] | skd5aner: | (because they share an xmltvid) |
| [20:27:39] | sphery: | so it's really more of a --add-digital-channels-without-scan |
| [20:28:12] | skd5aner: | but wouldn't that kind of be the case for an HD-PVR? |
| [20:29:02] | sphery: | I think HD-PVR is considered (by mythtv code--i.e. properly identified) as an encoder, in which case Fetch channels from listings source will work |
| [20:29:14] | skd5aner: | k |
| [20:29:25] | sphery: | so no need for --do-channel-updates when initially populating the video source |
| [20:29:45] | wagnerrp: | sphery: there you go again, always forcing the insertion |
| [20:29:59] | sphery: | hehe |
| [20:31:09] | sphery: | so, seems firewire is supposed to identified as Unscanable (unscannable?), so shouldn't require --do-channel-updates |
| [20:35:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Can you give me a few pointers on troubleshooting why my backend is recording duplicate episodes? I'm stumped... |
| [20:36:05] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: you're Schedules Direct, right? |
| [20:36:15] | J-e-f-f-A: | yeah. |
| [20:36:43] | sphery: | do you understand how dup matching works, in general: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Duplicate_matching |
| [20:36:55] | J-e-f-f-A: | It's been happening for a long while – and I've kinda ignored it... but it's becoming a pain in the butt... ^^ will read. |
| [20:37:09] | sphery: | i.e. if 2 programs are compared and both have programid, programid is the only thing used to determine if it's a dup (regardless of chosen dup matching method) |
| [20:37:38] | sphery: | if programids match, they are definitively called dups |
| [20:37:47] | sphery: | unless the programid is a "generic" ID |
| [20:37:55] | sphery: | these are marked in programs using the generic flag |
| [20:38:28] | sphery: | (typically SD shows these as a very bland description of the concept of the whole series, "Homer and Marge raise kids, Bart, Lisa, and Maggie." |
| [20:38:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | I guess something's broken on my system then, because I have many dups that are not 'generic', and they all have the same programid... we're talking dozens in some cases. |
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| [20:38:48] | sphery: | if something is a generic episode, it's /always/ recorded unless you explicitly exclude it |
| [20:38:57] | sphery: | since we have no idea what episode it is--it may be new or a repeat |
| [20:38:59] | J-e-f-f-A: | grr... seems my pastebin expired, I'll paste another example. ;-) |
| [20:39:19] | sphery: | ok, that would be easiest |
| [20:40:07] | sphery: | oh, also, if you tell it not to match duplicates, it will ignore dup matching of any type (regardless of programid/generic status) |
| [20:40:31] | sphery: | are these dups primarily on one (or just a couple) series or "across the board"? |
| [20:41:09] | sphery: | often this type of problem will occur with specific series because a user has multiple recording rules matching the show, where one has dup matching disabled |
| [20:41:50] | sphery: | since our UI doesn't do a good job of showing multiple rules for an episode, you generally don't notice the "other" rule |
| [20:42:17] | sphery: | but you can find it in Manage Recordings|Recording Rules or MythWeb Recording Rules |
| [20:42:33] | sphery: | er, MythWeb Recording Schedules |
| [20:42:35] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Humm... I don't think that's the case here, because I don't have multiple recording rules... humm... seems my pastebin might not be lost, but that pastebin.ca might be offline? |
| [20:43:19] | sphery: | yeah, it's not too reliable, anymore |
| [20:43:28] | sphery: | can you paste it to pastebin.com ? |
| [20:43:29] | J-e-f-f-A: | Ok, here's an example – http://pastebin.com/mPcrjhKR |
| [20:43:56] | sphery: | if you're going off oldrecorded, you need recstatus, too |
| [20:44:01] | wagnerrp: | pastebin.ca is always offline |
| [20:44:01] | J-e-f-f-A: | If I do a select of the whole oldrecorded table like that, nearly everything comes up dup'd like that... |
| [20:44:09] | sphery: | every matching episode--including (and especially) dups--is marked in oldrecorded |
| [20:44:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Ah, can you suggest a select statement for me? ;-) thanks. |
| [20:45:01] | sphery: | just add a ,recstatus in there for the list of columns to select |
| [20:45:17] | sphery: | actually, add: ,recstatus,duplicate |
| [20:45:45] | J-e-f-f-A: | they're all -3 0 |
| [20:46:06] | sphery: | 0 means they don't count as duplicates |
| [20:46:09] | sphery: | -3 means recorded |
| [20:46:16] | wagnerrp: | wait, why would one ever want to do a do { } while(0)? |
| [20:46:37] | J-e-f-f-A: | ok, I'm confused then... ^^ infinite loop? ;-) |
| [20:46:43] | sphery: | wagnerrp: bad way of #if 0 "commenting" code? |
| [20:46:55] | wagnerrp: | no, it runs once and only once |
| [20:47:01] | wagnerrp: | since the conditional comes after the first run |
| [20:47:10] | sphery: | ah, yeah, for do while |
| [20:47:22] | Scopeuk: | wagnerrp, quick hack after unrolling a loop |
| [20:47:28] | sphery: | but it's "commenting" the loop structure, but not the body is what I meant |
| [20:47:40] | wagnerrp: | Scopeuk: hack to do what? |
| [20:47:59] | Scopeuk: | wagnerrp, remove the loop withotu having to do it properly |
| [20:48:11] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: marking a showing as duplicate 0 says "ignore this episode for duplicate matching" |
| [20:48:20] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Humm... why wouldn't they be counted as duplicates? It's clear that the episode has been recorded before... and the rule is configured to check for duplicates in "All recordings" with "Subtitle and Description" |
| [20:48:22] | wagnerrp: | i still dont understand why you need the do/while |
| [20:48:25] | wagnerrp: | if its only running once |
| [20:48:26] | Scopeuk: | I woulden't expect to see it in production code although I suppose the compiler should optimise it away |
| [20:48:30] | Scopeuk: | it doesen't |
| [20:48:37] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: this allows you to Delete and allow re-record without losing the history information saying you once recorded it |
| [20:48:38] | Scopeuk: | its completly redundent |
| [20:49:45] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: So, likely someone either did a "Delete and allow re-record" of one of the episodes, or in Watch Recordings, hit MENU|Allow this episode to re-record, or Manage Recordings|Previously Recorded, SELECT|Allow this episode to re-record or similar |
| [20:50:14] | sphery: | doing that will change all matching records in recording history to duplicate = 0 |
| [20:51:28] | J-e-f-f-A: | but the strange thing is that ALL of my recordings seem to have been changed that way... somehow... |
| [20:51:31] | wagnerrp: | sphery: #10331 is another ticket regarding duplicate recordings, if youre interested |
| [20:51:31] | sphery: | so, basically, just go into Manage Recordings|Previously Recorded, find the episode, then SELECT and Never record this episode to prevent it from recording, again |
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| [20:52:20] | Pinhole: | Any current recommendations for a USB capture card that works in linux for both analog and digital atsc and qam that works well and is inexpensive and still available for purchase? |
| [20:52:51] | pyrodex-work: | Is there plans to bring previously recorded to mythweb? |
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| [20:52:59] | wagnerrp: | !url tuners |
| [20:52:59] | MythLogBot: | tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information |
| [20:53:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: ouch. I've got 42,142 rows that match 'duplicate=0', and just 1,438 that match 'duplicate=1'... |
| [20:53:19] | wagnerrp: | Pinhole: scratch that, dont bother going there |
| [20:53:29] | wagnerrp: | if you want analog and usb, you want an HVR-1950 |
| [20:54:00] | J-e-f-f-A: | Analog? |
| [20:54:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | wow. |
| [20:54:14] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: is this master or -fixes? |
| [20:54:23] | wagnerrp: | Pinhole: considering youre tunneled and i can otherwise tell, who is your cable provider? |
| [20:54:24] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: 0.24-fixes |
| [20:54:44] | ** sphery suggests perhaps someone did some direct db editing and missed a where once, or something? ** | |
| [20:55:06] | sphery: | as there shouldn't have been (and I don't remember) any changes to -fixes that affect marking of dups |
| [20:55:30] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: I suppose I could have don that at some time – but don't remember it at all – I don't generally much around with direct updates. |
| [20:55:40] | sphery: | in theory, you could just flip them all to 1, but if you had any "allow re-records", you'll lose them |
| [20:56:30] | sphery: | if you do flip them to 1 and see them turn back to 0, later, please let me know |
| [20:56:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: I don't – so I may just do that. |
| [20:57:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Humm... the most recent rule I setup is tagged right – "The Finder" – only one entry per episode, and the 'duplicate' flag is "1"... |
| [20:57:22] | J-e-f-f-A: | I honestly have no idea how they all got flipped to '0'... |
| [20:57:22] | Pinhole: | wagnerrp, trying to generate a low cost diagnostic tool that can sit in a cable headend. It will tune through the available channels and send an alert when things are not good. |
| [20:57:45] | skd5aner: | sphery: you can search -fixes release notes to find out if it mentiones anything about scheduler or dupes |
| [20:58:10] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: well, if this has been happening for a while for you, I'm guessing the "accidentally flip duplicate to 0" happened long ago |
| [20:58:16] | sphery: | so any new recordings should be good |
| [20:58:45] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Yeah, I think so too. Thanks, man. ;-) I think I'll work like "it used to" now. ;-) |
| [20:59:08] | sphery: | again, please let me know if it unexpectedly flips, again |
| [21:00:33] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: (or if you want to search your mysql history ( ~/.mysql_history ) for any users that would have directly connected to the DB for dupliate and see if you find any smoking guns, you may be able to put our confusion to rest) |
| [21:01:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Holy *bleep*. I bounced the backend, and now my 'Upcoming Recordings' listing is MUCH cleaner... only a dozen or so programs per day! |
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| [21:01:34] | sphery: | hehe |
| [21:01:37] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Hehe, it'd only be me... but I don't remember ever having done an update on the 'oldrecord' table... |
| [21:02:13] | sphery: | well, .mysql_history tends to remember a lot of stuff (no idea how far back it goes, but... :) |
| [21:02:28] | J-e-f-f-A: | humm... let me see... |
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| [21:04:59] | sphery: | wagnerrp: btw, #10331 sounds like the known bug where 2 showings of the same program at the same time on 2 different channels with different callsigns record at the same time |
| [21:05:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: it does indeed go back a while, but no updates in there for oldrecorded... just me changing artwork directories 'globally' when I 'standardized' my artwork mounts a long time ago, and a few other misc things... So I don't know how it happened! |
| [21:05:35] | sphery: | wagnerrp: editing callsigns with channel editor to make them the same would prevent recording both episodes, but would mean that "this channel" rules would apply to both channels, regardless of source |
| [21:05:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | well, the update I just did — "update oldrecorded set duplicate=1 where duplicate=0;" is in there... but nothing else. ;-) |
| [21:05:52] | sphery: | is that the only duplicate in there? |
| [21:05:58] | skd5aner: | sphery: I get that fairly frequently... |
| [21:06:15] | sphery: | (besides the queries, today, where you checked values for duplicate) |
| [21:06:36] | sphery: | skd5aner: yeah, anyone will get that if they don't use the same callsign :) |
| [21:06:44] | skd5aner: | sphery: some rules I have will record the same showing (at the same time) on the HD and SD channel |
| [21:06:54] | skd5aner: | ESPN vs ESPNHD |
| [21:06:59] | sphery: | and do you need to use different callsigns for them? |
| [21:07:18] | sphery: | i.e. the /only/ reason to do so is to tell the scheduler, "allow me to choose one or the other for 'this channel'" rules |
| [21:07:28] | skd5aner: | I prefer to actually |
| [21:07:33] | skd5aner: | that is one reason why |
| [21:07:45] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Should I go through and clean out all the dups in the 'oldrecorded' table? There's 43,584 rows in that table, of which probably 30,000+ are dups... |
| [21:07:52] | sphery: | well, the other reason is, "I was scared to/unsure about/too lazy to change the callsign it put in automatically" |
| [21:08:01] | skd5aner: | also, just easier identification of what channel it recorded on... (HD vs non-hd) and to keep in sync with the callsign provided by schedulesdirect |
| [21:08:13] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: no, the table is cleaned up automatically |
| [21:08:23] | skd5aner: | sphery: well, I would have probably ~100 to change, so... yea... that too |
| [21:08:35] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Ah, ok. ;-) THANKS again! |
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| [21:09:23] | skd5aner: | I would say the majority of my "channel" rules have been switched to any channel rules, but there are a few times where I still prefer that |
| [21:09:46] | skd5aner: | and if the xmltvid is unique, I like the callsign to stay unique as well |
| [21:09:55] | skd5aner: | (usually, not always) |
| [21:15:07] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: power key on mce remote on Fusion put the machine in S1 or S3 state? |
| [21:15:27] | pyrodex-work (pyrodex-work!~rcrews@157.166.167.129) has quit (Quit: pyrodex-work) | |
| [21:16:57] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: this is what i am leaning towards for the motherboard, http://www.ebuyer.com/196402-gigabyte-ga-m68m . . . -ga-m68m-s2p |
| [21:18:35] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: depends on how the MB is configured. |
| [21:20:06] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: right, and you need to use hibernate-ram for putting into standby? |
| [21:20:13] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: I have mine configured for 4-second delay, so tapping the power key does an ordered shutdown. (I have it configured for 'poweroff') – note that if you're using it for a backend, and you're not going to have it on 24x7, you'll have to configure Myth to suspend/wake up to do scheduleed recordings. |
| [21:21:27] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: Others would be best to answer your questions surrounding suspend/hibernate/resume — I have a backend that's on 24x7, and my frontends are configured for full shutdown/full boot each time... They boot in <1 minute, so I can live with that. ;-) |
| [21:21:38] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: 'configured for off', is that a bios setting or software? |
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| [21:23:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: in Linux, I have it configured to power off if I tap the power button (on my Frontends) – actually, it might be configured as a default... But I'm sure you can change that like you can in winders. |
| [21:23:12] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: atm i have hooked lirc to call hibernate-ram to suspend the system. And i use wake-on-usb to bring it back up. |
| [21:24:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: That's fine – but if you're going to use the same system as a backend (which does all the scheduled recording), then you'll have to setup the system to wake itself up if it's powered off. I haven't ventured that way [yet?], so I can't guide you much in that respect. |
| [21:24:43] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: ok, seems i will need to modify acpi actions |
| [21:25:08] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: sorry, had to run for a second, but can you do: select recstatus, count(*) from oldrecorded group by recstatus; |
| [21:25:14] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: yes, i saw a guide on cmos time wakeup in the wiki |
| [21:25:19] | J-e-f-f-A: | trumee: this might be a good reference: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/ACPI_Wakeup |
| [21:26:18] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: yes, that is what i was referring too |
| [21:26:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Heh – does this look "normal"? ;-) http://pastebin.com/Parxx43n |
| [21:28:49] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: that says you've actually recorded 43K "things" (individual airings of programs)... does that sound right (even taking into account the fact that it's been recording tons of duplicates for a while)? |
| [21:29:27] | sphery: | so same episode recording multiple times (from different channels or at different times) would count as multiple things |
| [21:29:32] | J-e-f-f-A: | Yes... My system was basically recording programs non-stop all day.... very little idle time... |
| [21:29:47] | sphery: | and tons of auto-expiring? |
| [21:29:58] | J-e-f-f-A: | yes. |
| [21:30:57] | sphery: | Do you have "Re-record watched" enabled? Do you mark shows as watched or have "Automatically mark a recording as watched" enabled? |
| [21:31:00] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Here's a snippet of my 'Recordings Statistics" info: http://pastebin.com/JE3BvF6Z |
| [21:31:16] | sphery: | wow |
| [21:31:28] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Humm... I think I have it set to "Automatically mark"... let me check... |
| [21:32:05] | sphery: | if that's not set and you don't mark shows as watched manually, then any show that's autoexpired is marked to allow re-record (duplicate = 0) |
| [21:32:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Yeah, it was a b* when a series would do a 'marathon'... |
| [21:32:45] | J-e-f-f-A: | Can I do a select from the settings table instead of starting the frontend on an NX session? ;-) |
| [21:32:52] | sphery: | if that's set or you mark shows as watched manually, and you have enabled "Re-record watched", then autoexpired shows are always marked to allow re-record (regardless of watched status) |
| [21:33:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Humm... "AutomaticSetWatched" is set to "0" for all my frontends currently... |
| [21:35:04] | sphery: | and you normally let things autoexpire |
| [21:35:08] | sphery: | right? |
| [21:35:13] | J-e-f-f-A: | Yes. |
| [21:35:20] | sphery: | that's probably how everything is getting set to allow re-record |
| [21:35:26] | sphery: | so you need to fix that |
| [21:35:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | I usually have it set to keep 5, 10, or 20 episodes, depending on the show. |
| [21:35:46] | sphery: | either fix by deleting things manually (even to the deleted rec group works) |
| [21:36:00] | sphery: | or by marking as watched those shows you don't want to re-record |
| [21:36:43] | sphery: | fwiw, that's an impressive recording history, too |
| [21:37:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | So... wait a sec... because I've got "AutomaticSetWatched" set to "0", I have to manually toggle the watched status, right? --- so if I change that to "1", it will get set if I watch the program? |
| [21:37:17] | sphery: | one of the devs was looking for a big history list to use for testing performance after some scheduler changes and mine was only about 15K entries |
| [21:37:49] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: re recording history – hehehe – and that's just to 2008 – that's when I lost my raid... I started with Myth in 2004 or 2005 [can't remember...] |
| [21:38:02] | sphery: | if you enable, "Automatically mark a recording as watched," then mythfrontend (and only mythfrontend--not upnp players, etc) will mark a show as watched when you exit "near" the end |
| [21:38:18] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Ah, that' exactly what I want. ;-) |
| [21:38:27] | sphery: | "near" is relative to the recording length, but always within around 4–12min from the end of recording |
| [21:38:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: What's the proper value for that? a 1 or -1 or ? |
| [21:38:56] | sphery: | the ui sets the proper value :) |
| [21:39:06] | sphery: | (the non-mythweb ui, that is :) |
| [21:39:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | Hehehe... I knew you were going to say that. ;-) |
| [21:39:18] | sphery: | but it's a boolean, so feel free to guess |
| [21:39:34] | J-e-f-f-A: | I'll start a frontend on an NX session, change it, then change the others to match in mysql ;-) |
| [21:39:55] | sphery: | I'm just not going to help/take responsibility for it or any other "I'll just edit the db data directly" ideas that any users reading might have |
| [21:40:20] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: I hear ya. ;-) You've been a great help already. |
| [21:40:39] | sphery: | so I take it you don't delete things when you've watched them? |
| [21:41:07] | sphery: | (regardless of whether you're using Deleted recording group or not, it sounds like you just let autoexpire get rid of everything for you?) |
| [21:41:10] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: no, that's what auto-delete is for! ;-) |
| [21:41:14] | sphery: | hehe, ok |
| [21:41:19] | J-e-f-f-A: | yep. |
| [21:41:35] | J-e-f-f-A: | It's always worked in the past... and that lets me watch it at a different time than my son, etc. ;-) |
| [21:41:38] | sphery: | yeah, that's dangerous when you don't know about watched recordings and/or when you enable "Re-record watched" |
| [21:41:55] | zombor (zombor!~zombor_@kohana/developer/zombor) has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) | |
| [21:41:59] | sphery: | but now that you know how they work, together, this should fix the problems |
| [21:42:47] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Actually, you just triggered a memory – I had a time when my B/E failed recordings for about a week, and I deleted specific episodes that recorded blank or 'junk', with 'delete & re-record' from mythweb – would that have done it? |
| [21:43:28] | sphery: | that would only have affected those specific episodes |
| [21:43:54] | sphery: | but when you changed all the duplicates back to 1, it would have included those episodes (meaning if they hadn't re-recorded, already, they won't :) |
| [21:44:37] | J-e-f-f-A: | that's what I thought... but that's the only thing that I can think of that *may* have caused this... Myth had always worked perfectly in the past – some time ago [maybe a year ago, who knows], it started doing these dups for some reason, and I never got around to figuring it out... |
| [21:44:43] | J-e-f-f-A: | that is, until you helped me today! |
| [21:45:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | ok, that should be fixed now. ;-) |
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| [21:47:02] | J-e-f-f-A: | Only one other thing annoys me about the frontend – it stops about 5–10 seconds before the end of the recording with the prompt of what you want to do... I'd like to cut that down to either nothing or 1 second or something! ;-) |
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| [21:50:42] | wizbit: | at last, lirc now works |
| [21:50:43] | wizbit: | Linux tv-1 3.2.5-mythtv.pxe #4 SMP Mon Feb 13 20:28:01 GMT 2012 x86_64 Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6300 @ 1.86GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux |
| [21:51:07] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: disable the end of recording prompt :) |
| [21:51:12] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: ps: if you guys still need a big history list – I can provide a backup of my DB for you/them... it's 68MB compressed. ;-) |
| [21:51:30] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: Ah, that'll do it? Cool! |
| [21:51:55] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/6974#comment:6 |
| [21:52:50] | sphery: | you can still enable the "Action on playback exit", but you need to disable "Prompt at end of recording" to play the full recording |
| [21:55:07] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: cool. – No Milestone on that ticket, so I guess it's not slated for 0.25, eh? |
| [21:55:14] | sphery: | nope |
| [21:55:25] | sphery: | can't go into 0.25, now--past feature freeze and that's not a bug |
| [21:55:44] | J-e-f-f-A: | Gotcha. |
| [21:56:36] | sphery: | besides, you can just disable "Prompt at end of recording" if you don't like missing the last 2s (where 2s means 2s as reported by the video, which for some video types (mainly broken ones, like AVI) ends up being as much as 30–45s) |
| [21:57:20] | sphery: | but could be 4s or so for even "working" video types |
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| [21:58:08] | J-e-f-f-A: | It seems to be more than 2s for my HD-PVR recordings... I try to get the last few seconds by hitting 'back', then 'pause'... but it plays in 1/2 second chunks. ;-) |
| [21:58:39] | sphery: | besides, I don't think Mark S's patch actually changes the prompt--I think it just allows playback of a few extra frames for users who disable the prompt |
| [22:02:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | wow... it's strange to pull up an 'upcoming recordings' screen and have it show nothing recording for the next 3 hours... |
| [22:02:15] | sphery: | hehe |
| [22:03:14] | J-e-f-f-A: | If I could only get my backend to start reliably after the HD-PVRs have fully initialized... then I might just setup the suspend/resume to save power... |
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| [22:08:58] | wagnerrp: | sphery: for what its worth, 10330 is a user misconfiguration |
| [22:09:13] | wagnerrp: | at worst, its mythweb being cryptic about what the user needs to fix |
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| [22:21:35] | sphery: | wagnerrp: no, he had no recordings /scheduled/--i.e. had never created a recording rule--so when MythWeb calls Schedule::findScheduled(), it gets null, which, apparently, causes foreach to fail in PHP, then MythWeb attempted to display the error, but because MythWeb had already sent the headers and began sending page data, it was committed and couldn't change the response status code and so we also get the other warnings |
| [22:22:11] | sphery: | then he created a recording schedule (or 4) and then went into Recording Schedules in MythWeb and all worked |
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| [22:22:44] | sphery: | delete all your recording rules and go to MythWeb's Upcoming Recordings page, and you'll see :) |
| [22:23:00] | wagnerrp: | ah, ive see that error before, but generally having to do with me not configuring the backend, or using the wrong database version |
| [22:23:50] | sphery: | IMHO, though, the best fix is to change Schedule::findScheduled() so that it never returns null, but instead returns an empty array when there are no schedules (so that foreach works), but since I don't know my PHP, I've been leaving #10142 for kormoc or xris to look at |
| [22:24:42] | drac_boy: | I know I asked before and was told that the motherboard I was setting up just wasn't supported anymore but I still had to ask two other things anyway.... |
| [22:25:09] | drac_boy: | first one is, do you think a htpc should have internet connectivity even if no video streaming was planned at all? |
| [22:25:32] | wagnerrp: | do you ever intend to record television on it? |
| [22:26:04] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah, you can get the same error for other reasons, but since he had said "If there is no upcoming recordings some error appears" (which even #10142 doesn't mention, though it's the cause of #10142), I figured he had things set up right and actually diagnosed it properly |
| [22:26:17] | drac_boy: | tv...hmm I'm still trying to sort out about if theres any workable tuner pci cards anymore without having to order through usa. so I'm not sure yet |
| [22:26:53] | drac_boy: | ordering from usa = stupid custom delays plus "country tax" charge slap. got to hate that heh |
| [22:26:53] | sphery: | program listings generally require internet connection to allow download |
| [22:27:02] | wagnerrp: | if you intend to record tv, then you need guide data, and that means a guide data service.... schedules direct |
| [22:27:09] | sphery: | ideally you have internet connection to allow you to get themes/updates for the theme you're using |
| [22:27:38] | sphery: | or, since you may not be in the USA, then you probably need xmltv for guide data service :) |
| [22:28:04] | sphery: | though in some countries, you can get by with EIT data (but will have to live with the shortcomings associated with that) |
| [22:28:17] | sphery: | i.e. makes duplicate checking very unreliable/likely to fail over time |
| [22:28:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | Not to mention only ~2 days of guide data, right? |
| [22:29:20] | wagnerrp: | J-e-f-f-A: on this side of the border, theyre only required to give 12 hours |
| [22:29:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | yikes! |
| [22:29:37] | wagnerrp: | not sure what the rules are over in canada |
| [22:30:01] | sphery: | oh, sorry, I guess that means no XMLTV |
| [22:30:06] | sphery: | so it is Schedules Direct |
| [22:30:13] | sphery: | I didn't notice the ottawa |
| [22:30:39] | sphery: | (only saw the "ordering from usa = stupid custom delays plus "country tax" charge slap", and assumed Europe) |
| [22:30:43] | drac_boy: | this guide data, is it like in some text form or? |
| [22:30:54] | wagnerrp: | compressed XML |
| [22:30:59] | drac_boy: | sphery heh, sadly canada and usa seem to be much further apart than their land-locked border line suggests |
| [22:31:01] | sphery: | http://www.schedulesdirect.org/ |
| [22:31:17] | wagnerrp: | you could in theory download it manually, copy it over manually, and feed it into mythfilldatabase manually |
| [22:31:21] | wagnerrp: | but why would you want to? |
| [22:31:38] | drac_boy: | wagnerrp heh I actually asked because I was wondering what kind of internet service it would had needed |
| [22:31:39] | wagnerrp: | is this system going to be in some remote location, with no simple access to internet? |
| [22:32:06] | sphery: | $25 per year to get extremely high-quality TV listings data (same as used by TiVo and such) that works great for duplicate matching--even over a period of years, because they maintain a database and identifiers that won't change even when they change title/subtitle/description |
| [22:32:07] | drac_boy: | I guess anything even as low as 33.6k probably could had worked wouldn't it? heh |
| [22:32:18] | wagnerrp: | with over-the-air channels, youre usually looking at a couple MB compressed file |
| [22:32:19] | drac_boy: | just for the sake of the discussion that is |
| [22:32:27] | wagnerrp: | so half an hour or so on dialup |
| [22:33:06] | drac_boy: | sphery have you ever heard of Zap btw? interesting in-channel tv schedule for most cable tv services especially within apartments |
| [22:33:14] | sphery: | yeah, 1.1MiB for my (US) OTA listings with about 35 channels |
| [22:33:28] | drac_boy: | its not perfect all the times tho. eg having to wait for it to slowly scroll down to the channel you wanted to know about in question |
| [22:33:56] | sphery: | drac_boy: Zap2It is a service provided by Tribune Media Service, the company from which Schedules Direct licenses listings data for redistribution to Schedules Direct members |
| [22:34:14] | drac_boy: | ah didn't know that part |
| [22:34:48] | sphery: | long ago, we used to abuse their servers by "HTML scraping" their web site--this resulted in something like 400 page hits from my system for a day's listings on about 20 channels |
| [22:35:18] | wagnerrp: | sphery: we did? this was before labs.zap2it.com? |
| [22:35:44] | sphery: | TMS came to us and said we're killing their servers, but they didn't want to get into the web page changes/scraper changes "arms race" that so many other companies did (where they'd change the page design to break scrapers, then scrapers would change to work with the new page design) |
| [22:36:39] | sphery: | So they offered to set up a service that would allow us to access even more and better-quality listings data directly using SOAP-based approach to retrieve the listings (without page design) in XML |
| [22:37:16] | sphery: | they gave that to us for free for a few years, but when the economy got worse, they had to shut down the service (DataDirect "Labs" listings service) we were using for free |
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| [22:38:00] | sphery: | so Schedules Direct was created specifically to find a legal source of listings data, and ended up contracting with TMS (the same company that gave it to us for free, before) since they were the only provider willing to work with us |
| [22:38:03] | wagnerrp: | well no... they were giving it to us non-commercial users for free |
| [22:38:14] | wagnerrp: | while selling the same data to commercial users |
| [22:38:27] | sphery: | right, but the labs part free/shut down |
| [22:38:36] | sphery: | the commercial part kept going and wasn't free |
| [22:38:41] | wagnerrp: | so some of their commercial clients got pissed off, and set up their applications to pull from labs |
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| [22:39:20] | sphery: | yeah, well, that happened, too |
| [22:39:24] | wagnerrp: | labs was shut down due to abuse from commercial entities, not bad economy |
| [22:42:08] | drac_boy: | three stores checked...zero tuners....checking one more before I stop for now :-s |
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| [22:48:46] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah, looking back, it seems like that was the main reason |
| [22:49:38] | drac_boy: | ah lucked out I think |
| [22:50:22] | sphery: | found a tuner? |
| [22:50:25] | drac_boy: | msi digi@anywhere .... hauppauge hvr-1600, hvr-1600 mce, hvr-1150 |
| [22:50:55] | drac_boy: | now where was that hardware list to check against.....*goes off for a sec* |
| [22:52:52] | sphery: | you mean HVR-1250? |
| [22:53:02] | sphery: | is this for analog recording? If so, you want the HVR-1600 |
| [22:53:34] | sphery: | if digital only (meaning ATSC or QAM input), the HVR-1250 would work (but you shouldn't use the 1250 for analog recording) |
| [22:53:38] | drac_boy: | no its actually listed as hvr-1150 and its an odd triangle-shaped card..you know..slope down rather than a square card |
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| [22:53:54] | sphery: | ah, hadn't heard of that one, but I see it, now |
| [22:54:08] | drac_boy: | not sure what 'mce' is supposed to mean anyway? |
| [22:54:09] | sphery: | wonder if that's just a PCI version of the 1250? |
| [22:54:21] | sphery: | MCE means certified to work with Windows MCE |
| [22:54:31] | drac_boy: | sphery just so you know this tuner card is for a mini-itx that only has pci to provide anyhow |
| [22:54:32] | sphery: | generally an "MCE" kit contains a remote control and IR receiver |
| [22:54:44] | sphery: | but read the specifics to find the differences |
| [22:54:44] | drac_boy: | sphery oh that would explain the whole $10 difference between these two 1600s |
| [22:54:51] | wagnerrp: | usually it means there is no IR support, and a pair of RCA audio plugs rather than a 1/8" jack |
| [22:55:03] | sphery: | mce = no ir support? |
| [22:55:20] | wagnerrp: | they assume youre adding it to an MCE OEM system that came with an IR receiver |
| [22:55:24] | sphery: | oh |
| [22:55:28] | sphery: | so I had that backwards |
| [22:55:42] | drac_boy: | well I think I'll rather buy the non-mce one and beside the card using rca instead would actually help with not needing to use a ministereo-to-rca adapter |
| [22:55:42] | sphery: | do you know if the 1150 is basically a PCI 1250? |
| [22:55:50] | wagnerrp: | i dont know what the 1150 is |
| [22:55:57] | sphery: | http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hvr1150.html |
| [22:55:59] | sphery: | !url tuners |
| [22:55:59] | MythLogBot: | tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information |
| [22:56:17] | drac_boy: | any comment for or against the msi tho? |
| [22:56:24] | drac_boy: | it seem to be just a simple basic tuner card |
| [22:56:50] | sphery: | not listed at http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/ATSC_PCI_Cards |
| [22:57:15] | drac_boy: | oh nevermind I noticed its listed unsupported |
| [22:57:23] | drac_boy: | so guess that leaves it to only these three hauppauge models |
| [22:57:30] | sphery: | drac_boy: according to: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/ATSC_PCI_Cards : MSI Digital@nywhere-ATSC .. has been reported as being exactly the same as the KWorld ATSC 110, and gets setup as such |
| [22:57:44] | sphery: | meaning you'd likely be hacking driver code to try to make it work |
| [22:57:52] | sphery: | so, yeah, I'd recommend against it |
| [22:58:16] | sphery: | and, definitely listed as unsupported: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/MSI_Digi@nywhere_A/D |
| [22:58:42] | sphery: | anyway, the 1600 works well for analog or digital |
| [22:58:48] | drac_boy: | well the 1150 is $64 and 1600 is $89 hmm |
| [22:59:02] | drac_boy: | think I'll check the mail list later in case anyone has tried it |
| [22:59:05] | sphery: | is this digital or analog recording? |
| [22:59:46] | sphery: | i.e. ATSC or QAM vs recording analog output from a set-top box |
| [22:59:57] | drac_boy: | sphery sometimes-choppy digital to put it this way. I sure hate the silly crtc sometimes but oh well, its already done |
| [23:00:05] | drac_boy: | and its atsc yeah |
| [23:00:32] | sphery: | well, in that case, if the 1150 is basically a PCI version of the 1250, it would be good (assuming it's supported in Linux) |
| [23:00:57] | sphery: | I don't see any direct information on it at http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php?title=S . . . 50&go=Go |
| [23:01:05] | drac_boy: | oh ok |
| [23:01:25] | sphery: | there's a page for teh 1110 – http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV-HVR-1110 and 1120 – http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV-HVR-1120 |
| [23:01:48] | sphery: | but unless you have specific information, I wouldn't assume that they're the same (even from pictures) |
| [23:02:07] | sphery: | even within a single model number, many things can change (even to the point of making it not work with Linux) |
| [23:02:30] | sphery: | 1120 is DVB-T, so wouldn't work with ATSC |
| [23:02:38] | sphery: | same with 1110, it seems |
| [23:02:47] | drac_boy: | one sec, need to write down some #s so I can close these several webshop windows already :-s |
| [23:03:47] | sphery: | but 1150 does say ATSC ( http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hvr1150.html ), so I'd guess it's just not yet working with Linux |
| [23:04:02] | sphery: | or, at least, not tested/confirmed working |
| [23:06:22] | sphery: | drac_boy: also, see http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/469681#469681 and note that replies from http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/engine? . . . ;list=mythtv are ones you can definitely trust (as he's one of the guys writing drivers for these things) |
| [23:08:15] | Seeker`: | is there any concept of series metadata at the moment? |
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| [23:10:11] | J-e-f-f-A: | jeese... what kind of crap is this? I joined the #spiceworks channel to research an issue at work, and they have some stupid trivia game? that's pathetic – check it out: http://pastebin.com/8pNf11Qm |
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| [23:10:54] | J-e-f-f-A: | I'm sure glad we don't have that here!!! |
| [23:11:11] | sphery: | this a "before you enter" type thing |
| [23:11:45] | drac_boy: | sphery thanks for that forum thread..does seem promising |
| [23:11:47] | sphery: | ah, no, seems it's just something to increase the amount of traffic? |
| [23:11:51] | kormoc: | !start_start |
| [23:11:55] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: probably... |
| [23:11:59] | kormoc: | whoops, !start_trivia |
| [23:12:01] | drac_boy: | I kinda think I like the 1150 better than the 1600 since it gives a bit more space for other uses toward the front of the case |
| [23:12:05] | ** kormoc eyes MythLogBot ** | |
| [23:12:34] | J-e-f-f-A: | kormoc: maybe it only works if ! is in the first character position? |
| [23:12:42] | J-e-f-f-A: | ;-) |
| [23:12:56] | sphery: | drac_boy: note that I'm pretty sure the 1150 is one that should not be used for analog recording, though |
| [23:13:26] | drac_boy: | thats ok since its not going to be a center-for-everything htpc at all :-) |
| [23:13:29] | sphery: | that sounds like it's not a problem for you, but just wanted to make sure you go into it with appropriate expectations |
| [23:15:02] | sphery: | yeah, plus, recording ntsc video is terrible quality, anyway, so you're better off not doing analog recording--unless you use the HD-PVR to record high-definition output of copy-protected channels |
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| [23:15:31] | drac_boy: | watch movies ... view photo slides from either disc or camera media ... music cds ... and if it'll work then watching tv shows as well, maybe record at time as well |
| [23:15:34] | drac_boy: | thats about it |
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| [23:16:00] | drac_boy: | oh aside to passing the videocamera feed onto tv too. sharing on a big screen is better than sharing on a crappy 3" lcd |
| [23:16:01] | drac_boy: | :-) |
| [23:16:28] | skd5aner: | sphery: out of curiousity, do you see commflag skipping the last scene of sitcoms frequently (I was asking around here earlier but didn't get much feedback) – the part that usually is run with the credits and immediately preceeds the next show (usually about 30–60 seconds long)... happens all the time for me on NBC and CBS sitcoms |
| [23:16:29] | J-e-f-f-A: | funny thing is, the best SD recording I've ever had in Myth was off of Dish Network SD receivers – their SD was top-notch quality imho. |
| [23:17:16] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: given today's method of shrinking down the screen to half-screen and running the credits there with an 'overlap' to the next show – yes, I've seen that quite a bit. |
| [23:17:43] | drac_boy: | hm say I found something else in an odd category place on another webshop... |
| [23:17:53] | drac_boy: | pinnacle studio movieboard |
| [23:18:08] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I think one of the commercial detction schemes is 'blank frame' – but it doesn't check the *entire* frame for black, just the whole row of pixels down a side or something... so it sometimes detects stuff like that as blank frames... |
| [23:18:12] | drac_boy: | supposedly able to capture from svideo or firewire to mpeg2 |
| [23:18:25] | drac_boy: | wonder who'll ever want these tho...as they seem to lack any hdtv support |
| [23:18:31] | sphery: | wagnerrp: hehe, I stand corrected, this was the known issue, but where the difference in callsign was only in capitalization |
| [23:18:58] | J-e-f-f-A: | drac_boy: best bet for SD capture is an Hauppauge PVR-150, PVR-500 or even older cards PVR-250... |
| [23:19:13] | drac_boy: | yeah that was what I was thinking too J-e-f-f-A |
| [23:19:23] | J-e-f-f-A: | drac_boy: if half-height is a requirement, the only option is PVR-150 in HH format. |
| [23:19:24] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: yea, it's pretty much 100% of the time for me that I have to skip back a few minutes at the end of a sitcom to get the closing scene – pretty annoying, but I've not tried to adjust the commflag scheme or anything |
| [23:19:38] | sphery: | skd5aner: yeah, I've never actually used commskip at the end of the recording for exactly that reason... I just use skip forward in 30s increments to find the end |
| [23:19:49] | sphery: | been doing it that way for years because commflagger has been missing those for years :) |
| [23:19:52] | drac_boy: | anyway just asking but I guess that 120gb is enough capacity for the basic setup I was thinking of in question? with or without the tv tuner anyway |
| [23:19:53] | skd5aner: | sphery: do you not do auto skip? |
| [23:20:11] | sphery: | no, notify |
| [23:20:27] | drac_boy: | J-e-f-f-A I don't need half-height too seriously..I just don't want a very big brick that forces using a deeper case due to the overhang past the motherboard itself |
| [23:20:28] | skd5aner: | ah... yea, I default to auto |
| [23:20:31] | J-e-f-f-A: | skd5aner: I've found that commercial flagging in general is getting a bit less reliable in my area – due to stuff like that. So I've often started to change my playback 'navigation' mode to 'alert', allowing me to hit the >| button to skip the commercial... |
| [23:20:36] | drac_boy: | if you know what I'm saying |
| [23:20:47] | sphery: | auto-skip is a broken concept since we know that commercial detection isn't 100% accurate |
| [23:20:54] | skd5aner: | I wonder if there's any optimaizations that can be made in the commflagger for that purpose ( Beirdo ?) |
| [23:20:56] | sphery: | IMHO, we should remove auto-skip, do notify only |
| [23:21:04] | J-e-f-f-A: | drac_boy: the 150 is not a very big card. The 500 is dual-tuner, and is a large card. |
| [23:21:06] | sphery: | and users who want auto-skip can change flag list to cut list |
| [23:21:26] | skd5aner: | sphery: I would argue against that... it's good enough for me in everything except the occasional show + sitcoms |
| [23:21:39] | J-e-f-f-A: | sphery: it was dead-accurate for a LONG time here in the northeast... but the last couple of years has become less accurate. |
| [23:21:39] | sphery: | and we should tell them that we're doing that to emphasis that we don't expect detection results to be perfect and neither should users :) |
| [23:21:58] | drac_boy: | J-e-f-f-A I was thinking in term of a motherboard that is only 17mm deep aside to a few more mm spacing at the front. the height isn't that much of an issue except at the very front of the case due to the front i/o stuffs getting in the way |
| [23:22:09] | Beirdo: | the next step for the commflagger is a complete rewrite that I am about 3/4 done |
| [23:22:10] | sphery: | J-e-f-f-A: yeah, the switch to digital has made the number of differences among channels huge compared to what it was in analog-only times |
| [23:22:23] | J-e-f-f-A: | Especially on channels like USA network, where they'll shrink the credits down to 1/3 the screen and run commercials or overlap to the next show, also in a 1/3 format or something... |
| [23:22:36] | skd5aner: | sphery: see, when it's wrong for me, I have a few buttons mapped let me skip back to the previous/next cut... that way, I can simply see what I missed |
| [23:22:45] | sphery: | right |
| [23:23:09] | sphery: | then again, I think it's a bad thing, too, because if you're watching the show and you don't know there was a commercial there, it generally throws off the flow |
| [23:23:14] | ** J-e-f-f-A buys Beirdo a beer. ;-) ** | |
| [23:23:28] | skd5aner: | but, more often than not, I don't have to worry about it... and there are few shows that are always wrong (intervention for example) that I just turn on notify via the OSD menu |
| [23:23:33] | sphery: | you notice the wind down and wind up and it feels like you missed something (like the whole reason for wind down/up) |
| [23:23:36] | J-e-f-f-A: | (where do you want the check mailed? or paypal? ;-) ) |
| [23:23:43] | drac_boy: | hmm |
| [23:23:51] | skd5aner: | sphery: yea, true... my wife is always like "hey, good catch realizing it missed a bit of the scene there" – he |
| [23:23:52] | skd5aner: | heh |
| [23:23:58] | drac_boy: | just looking, kworld PC150-U is a bit cheap |
| [23:24:15] | sphery: | well, even when it's perfect, the flow seems strange |
| [23:24:17] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: during the re-write do you have a list of frequently wrong examples to test against? |
| [23:24:27] | sphery: | just because of how the show was written to have a commercial break there |
| [23:24:34] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: I can think of at least a few different examples that are always easy to record |
| [23:24:41] | J-e-f-f-A: | Heh, one of the shows that used to exibit issues ALL the time was 'Home Improvment' – because they'd have a short clip at the end, and then some bloopers, which the commercial flagger thought were part of the last commercial break... |
| [23:24:47] | sphery: | usually the story/dialogue is crafted specifically to allow that commercial placement |
| [23:24:58] | Beirdo: | I have some examples coming my way, yes, but if you have more, great :) |
| [23:25:03] | sphery: | (and I don't just mean jokes where they lead out with a ref to commercials) |
| [23:25:54] | drac_boy: | oh its not in either mythtv or linuxtv list hmm |
| [23:26:27] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: any sitcom on NBC and most on CBS... the last 30 seconds always gets cut off for me... another, "Intervention" on A&E, lots of black cards/scenes |
| [23:26:48] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: I'm sure there's other good ones I can't think of off the top of my head |
| [23:27:06] | J-e-f-f-A: | Heh, one example of a tough detection is a talk show (such as the Tonight Show), where they have an actor/actress on and show a clip – it often skips that as part of the commercial... But understandibly so as the logo goes away and the screen goes black for a split second... |
| [23:27:07] | sphery: | drac_boy: IME, the Hauppauge cards that are supported in Linux work great and have excellent driver support |
| [23:27:13] | J-e-f-f-A: | So that might be harder to detect... |
| [23:27:17] | sphery: | (helps that Hauppauge actually cares to support the driver developers) |
| [23:27:22] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: like J-e-f-f-A said, anything that basically has an ending with credits that run next to it... |
| [23:27:30] | skd5aner: | ... is another example |
| [23:27:51] | Beirdo: | if you could email me a list, it would probably be better so I don't lose track. |
| [23:28:11] | sphery: | drac_boy: I'm a big fan of "buy quality products that are known to work well in Linux for $20 more and save 100s of hours of grief" |
| [23:28:34] | skd5aner: | J-e-f-f-A: yea, that's true... when they try to show a clip on talk shows, it can often trigger commskip |
| [23:28:37] | sphery: | but not sure how much your time is worth to you :) |
| [23:28:51] | drac_boy: | sphery heh well 'cheap' was not the first thing I was thinking of but :-P |
| [23:28:51] | J-e-f-f-A: | Beirdo: pm me your email, and I'll try to keep track of some of them for you. ;-) |
| [23:28:55] | skd5aner: | Beirdo: yea, I'll try to remember to do so |
| [23:29:00] | skd5aner: | thx |
| [23:29:05] | drac_boy: | the PC150-U is actually somewhat toward 3/4-ish height card |
| [23:29:15] | drac_boy: | it doesn't look like its exactly lowprofile but close still |
| [23:30:10] | skd5aner: | Not to continue to dump examples here, since I know a list would be better, but I also have the oppositive problem on a few channels... ESPN for example nearly ALWAYS has the ticker at the bottom, so it never detects commercials... if the commflagger were to ignore the bottom 5% of the screen (i.e., the ticker), it might be able to tell |
| [23:30:17] | drac_boy: | tomorrow I'll check about the actual inventory level for these two hauppauge cards and see what to think from there. I might just build the htpc without that for now either way |
| [23:30:59] | Beirdo: | yeah, there will be chances to tweak such things algorithically |
| [23:31:08] | Beirdo: | without settings. |
| [23:31:09] | Beirdo: | :) |
| [23:31:45] | drac_boy: | hm I need to afk for a while, realized supper'll need a bit of improvsement :-s |
| [23:32:05] | J-e-f-f-A: | Thanks Beirdo – You've done TONS for Myth over the years, and I'm eternally greatful! ;-) [everyone else too! I <3 MythTV!] |
| [23:32:24] | Beirdo: | It's a great way to pass the time in the evenings :) |
| [23:33:34] | kinsel8 (kinsel8!~jml974@191.112.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | |
| [23:33:57] | J-e-f-f-A: | Beirdo: I'm hoping to have more time in my evenings too – working to get rid of my 'ball & chain' now... grrr... (woops, did I say that out loud?) ;-) |
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| [23:40:25] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [23:40:31] | Beirdo: | mine's gone already |
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| [23:50:00] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: my hunt for the motherboard is still on. seems like all cheap mobo have shitty drivers |
| [23:50:39] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: realtek drivers which are not in kernel or only stereo out (no 5.1/7.1) |
| [23:51:22] | trumee: | J-e-f-f-A: or only 10/100 lan |
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| [23:56:54] | drac_boy: | ok now just to wait for the pot to get my supper ready :-) |
| [23:57:53] | drac_boy: | sphery so just asking but did you want to hear the rest of the hardware I was going to use? |
| [23:58:24] | drac_boy: | oh yeah no offend meant when I say this but its not going to run mythtv, it'll still be running linux but just with a different frontend tho |
| [23:59:19] | davide (davide!~david@host70.16.intrusion.com) has joined #mythtv-users | |
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