Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Sunday, October 2nd, 2011, 00:03 UTC

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[00:14:38]

k-man:

someone once pointed me to a link that explained how to switch between fixes and master, specifically maintaining 2 databases. I can't find the page now, anyone know where it is?

[00:16:07]

[R]:

in the config in ~/.mythtv

[00:16:10]

[R]:

it says the name of the db to use

[00:18:12]

k-man:

there was a good link that explained how to set up wrapper scripts so you could easily run fixes or master

[00:18:15]

k-man:

oh well

[00:19:08]

wagnerrp:

just change to a different $HOME

[00:19:33]

wagnerrp:

new home means new ~/.mythtv directory, and new config files pointing at the database

[00:20:11]

[R]:

isn't there some env variable it looks at to find ~/.mythtv?

[00:20:19]

[R]:

aside from $HOME i mean

[00:20:37]

wagnerrp:

there used to be, i dont think it still works

[00:20:40]

[R]:

ah

[00:24:08]

k-man:

ah, foind the link: http://www.squashedfrog.net/article.php?story=20080615193047206

[00:24:15]

k-man:

s/foind/found

[00:25:01]

wagnerrp:

ah, right... setting up PATH and LD_LIBRARY_PATH too

[00:25:07]

wagnerrp:

forgot about those

[00:25:16]

k-man:

in my case, I'm not going to have master and fixes installed at the same time, so what I really want to do is have a way to start the backend/frontend using 2 different dbs

[00:25:37]

wagnerrp:

huh?

[00:25:52]

k-man:

like mythcoverg for master and mythconverg24 for .24fixes

[00:26:18]

wagnerrp:

so you would have 0.24 and 0.25 installed at the same time

[00:26:42]

k-man:

if I want to work on .24, I'll uninstall master first (rather than have them both installed in parallel)

[00:27:10]

wagnerrp:

is stuff other than mythtv installed on this system?

[00:27:36]

k-man:

wagnerrp, it is my mac notebook. this is just for dev purposes, not a production machine

[00:28:28]

k-man:

maybe I can make 2 .mythtv directories, one for .24 one for master, and simply swap them around when switching between the versions

[00:31:19]

k-man:

yes, that seems to work ok

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dcg_:

justinh: if you really don't want to recieve mail from *ANY* cron job add a single line

[00:54:39]

dcg_:

MAILTO=""

[00:54:46]

dcg_:

to each cron config file

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dcg_:

incidentally this can also be used to specify a list of one or more comma seperated addresses if you want mail to go somewhere specific

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[02:12:24]

jya:

looking at getting a more reliable solution for blurry playback… Was wondering if running a windows virtual machine on the fronted with any-dvd is a usable solution

[02:15:50]

wagnerrp:

if you want blurry playback, just run your display at a non-native resolution

[02:16:06]

** wagnerrp ducks **

[02:17:14]

jya:

ahah

[02:17:18]

jya:

blu-ray

[02:17:39]

** jya thanking mac os lion for correcting stuff as I'm writing **

[02:18:13]

wagnerrp:

well the final plan for optical access is to route it all though the backend/mediaserver

[02:18:18]

jya:

I think iamlindoro is running a similar system

[02:18:25]

wagnerrp:

remove local access from the frontend completely

[02:18:32]

wagnerrp:

so any frontend can access any optical drive

[02:18:44]

wagnerrp:

if we get that working, and working on windows

[02:18:56]

wagnerrp:

decryption using anydvd would "just happen"

[02:19:06]

jya:

wagnerrp: yeah, but that mean I have to get up, go to a room opposite the house, insert the disk, come back to my living room, start watching

[02:19:25]

wagnerrp:

well in theory, you could run a VM running windows on the local machine

[02:19:29]

wagnerrp:

and give it access to the disk

[02:19:47]

wagnerrp:

i think a while back, someone tried something simlar but shared the optical drive over windows file sharing

[02:20:03]

wagnerrp:

using the existing bluray folder structure support in mythfrontend for playback

[02:20:08]

wagnerrp:

it worked... very poorly

[02:20:48]

jya:

when I've been using mythavtest bd:// on disk myth could decrypt

[02:20:51]

jya:

I had very good result

[02:21:13]

jya:

at least for my intent: watching the movie uninterrupted and the bonus it starts immediately

[02:21:58]

jya:

actually, my primary aim wasn't to watch the bluray here, as I have a standalone player

[02:22:15]

jya:

but being able to check if my audio handle all the new audio format

[02:22:42]

jya:

got bitten in the arse yesterday and one case I hadn't tested failed poorly

[02:23:05]

jya:

why do you say it worked very poorly ?

[02:23:20]

wagnerrp:

performance was too low

[02:23:42]

jya:

I had tried that a while back, it failed using windows sharing.. I had to get iSCSI to work

[02:23:51]

wagnerrp:

either the VM couldnt run anydvd in real time, or there was funky IO interaction with the VM, or funky network issues with the VM

[02:23:56]

jya:

then it was working okay. but iSCSI is damn hard to setup

[02:24:34]

wagnerrp:

a windows iscsi target?

[02:24:51]

wagnerrp:

didnt know anyone wrote a target server for windows

[02:25:04]

jya:

there is

[02:25:17]

jya:

but I was doing the other way round there

[02:25:28]

jya:

bluray was on linux host

[02:25:36]

jya:

shared disk over iSCSI

[02:25:51]

wagnerrp:

oh, you were sharing the raw disk device over iscsi, and letting anydvd handle it on windows

[02:26:08]

jya:

then used the iSCSI client on windows (3rd party, microsoft built in one kept crashing) and used PowerDVD to watch the movie on the pc

[02:26:32]

jya:

no, I used power dvd hd

[02:26:39]

jya:

that came with the bluray disk

[02:26:57]

jya:

bluray drive to be more precise

[02:30:59]

jya:

hum… could always reuse the BD drive in my myth backend, export it using iSCSI, on my iMac with VMware and win xp, mount the iSCSI drive, export with anydvd hd, remount the shared disk on the backend

[02:31:04]

jya:

how is that for complicated?

[02:31:46]

wagnerrp:

not complicated enough... need to add a smart switch and vlans

[02:32:00]

wagnerrp:

or at least operation over multiple subnets and a router

[02:32:06]

jya:

that's easy, I have a level 3 managed gigabit switch :)

[02:32:24]

jya:

could surely create a vlan

[02:32:49]

jya:

would need to get the new LCD screen from apple with an extra gigabit interface, so I get two ethernet port on my imac

[02:33:56]

wagnerrp:

as in... its a thunderbolt device with a gigabit phy included?

[02:34:46]

jya:

yes, the new 27" screen

[02:35:38]

jya:

it has a firewire 800, gigabit ethernet and usb from the TB interface

[02:35:40]

jya:

pretty cool

[02:35:44]

wagnerrp:

did they ever get rid of that 3/4" fat cable coming straight out the back of their monitors?

[02:36:50]

jya:

the 27" I have (previous model) the cable coming out (no thicker than your average DVI cable), provides the display port cable, USB to connect to the iMac, and a magsafe connector to charge a mac laptop

[02:37:16]

jya:

i don't know how thick the new cable is...

[02:37:46]

wagnerrp:

the 30" studios we bought at work a couple years ago have a big fat cable, hardwired to the back of the monitor

[02:37:53]

jya:

the old 23" cinema display I had was using quite a fat cable, wasn't even DVI but their own connector (I had seen those on the back of HP professional gear)

[02:37:56]

jya:

was like DVI + power

[02:38:04]

wagnerrp:

going to a power supply with DVI, firewire400, and usb

[02:38:26]

jya:

ah yes, that's the one

[02:38:31]

jya:

haven't seen those in years...

[02:38:38]

wagnerrp:

the cable is so fat and non-flexible, you cant get the monitor within six inches of the wall, even were you to remove the stand

[02:38:53]

jya:

this box was only required if you were using the screen with a non apple gear

[02:38:54]

wagnerrp:

plus theres the whole absurdity of a giant 30" monitor with an external power supply

[02:39:10]

jya:

the mac pro were providing the power directly, you didn't need a power supply

[02:39:16]

[R]:

wagnerrp: that's what she said?

[02:39:34]

wagnerrp:

and they didnt have good blacks, they had purples

[02:39:47]

wagnerrp:

viewing angle was poor for an IPS

[02:39:57]

jya:

how many years ago was that?

[02:39:59]

jya:

8 years?

[02:40:05]

wagnerrp:

maybe 5?

[02:40:12]

jya:

my 23" cinema display was pretty good

[02:40:16]

jya:

it is still working today

[02:40:33]

wagnerrp:

its still working just fine

[02:40:46]

wagnerrp:

but the 30" HPs we bought in the same time frame were much better monitors

[02:40:55]

wagnerrp:

and at the time, ~30% cheaper

[02:41:17]

jya:

but you didn't need a power supply when using with a macpro

[02:41:45]

wagnerrp:

yes you did, because the big fat cable was hardwired to both the monitor and the power supply

[02:41:52]

wagnerrp:

you could not disconnect one from the other

[02:42:42]

jya:

ah, that's different to what I had with my cinema display

[02:43:07]

jya:

how did we get to talk about apple 30" screen when all I wanted was how to watch bluray on my myth frontend ?

[02:43:08]

wagnerrp:

these things also drew around 120W, the mac pro could push that much power?

[02:43:18]

wagnerrp:

i was complaining about apple monitors

[02:43:31]

jya:

that's why the cable was so thick

[02:43:51]

wagnerrp:

yeah, because it was running 10A through the thing

[02:43:52]

[R]:

that's what she said?

[02:44:05]

wagnerrp:

as opposed to a measly 1A 120VAC

[02:44:28]

wagnerrp:

thats why we do intelligent things like putting the power supply in the monitor...

[02:44:28]

wagnerrp:

:)

[02:44:38]

dcg_:

I have seen things like external powersupplies where a product was designed and manufactured, then an issue was found where (for example) the PSU was inadequate and there was no space in the case to solve the problem. so an external unit is attached

[02:45:12]

wagnerrp:

so they were designed poorly

[02:45:31]

dcg_:

not designed porly so much as tested poorly

[02:45:40]

wagnerrp:

no, this was planning from the start to have an external monitor

[02:45:52]

wagnerrp:

because apple has an aversion to cables coming out of their hardware

[02:45:59]

dcg_:

I am talking about the external powersupply

[02:46:08]

wagnerrp:

they have ads on how few cables come out of their hardware

[02:46:35]

wagnerrp:

s/monitor/power supply/

[02:46:40]

dcg_:

:)

[02:46:51]

jya:

is there any vmware product running on a linux host ?

[02:47:03]

[R]:

workstation

[02:47:09]

jya:

is that it?

[02:47:09]

dcg_:

jya: yes all of them I think

[02:47:13]

jya:

not cheap

[02:47:18]

[R]:

server

[02:47:19]

[R]:

thats free

[02:47:22]

dcg_:

jya: I tend to use vmplayer

[02:47:34]

jya:

vmware player is for windows only by the look of things

[02:47:39]

[R]:

no

[02:47:44]

[R]:

theres a linux client

[02:47:46]

dcg_:

is free and recent versions alow you to create vm's as well

[02:48:05]

dcg_:

I run player on about 20 machines, mine and customers

[02:48:19]

dcg_:

all linux

[02:48:33]

jya:

I guess they don't want you to easily find it on their web site...

[02:48:46]

jya:

I imported the vmware disk in virtual box

[02:48:47]

dcg_:

use it to enable customers to run those pesky accounting apps

[02:49:00]

jya:

when it boots it gets stuck right after loading the agp440.sys driver

[02:49:07]

dcg_:

jya, www.vmware.com at the bottome there should be a link to player

[02:49:28]

wagnerrp:

dcg_: WINE wont do it?

[02:49:52]

jya:

wagnerrp: would anydvd hd works over wine ?

[02:50:03]

jya:

dcg_: http://downloads.vmware.com/d/info/desktop_do . . . e_player/3_0

[02:50:09]

wagnerrp:

not a chance

[02:50:12]

jya:

all I can see there is 3.1.4

[02:50:15]

jya:

that's for windows

[02:50:25]

wagnerrp:

it requires too low level access to the windows APIs than WINE can provide

[02:51:06]

dcg_:

click on download free trial, then in a panel on the right "download free products" there is a link to player

[02:51:11]

jya:

hence, why I'm trying vmware

[02:51:37]

jya:

ah yeah.. I had to register...

[02:51:38]

jya:

cool

[02:51:52]

wagnerrp:

jya: was talking to dcg_, using vmware to run accounting applications

[02:52:03]

jya:

ah ok

[02:52:12]

wagnerrp:

which shouldnt have any reason to access windows on such levels that it would need a full VM

[02:52:13]

jya:

never had good luck with wine

[02:54:35]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: some versions of some accounting apps will work with wine, but many combinations just flat out won't work.

[02:54:37]

jya:

all right, I'll go and get the star wars BD set, and will try to play that thing on myth

[02:55:26]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: also I recommend running any accounting app, on any platform, in a vm anyway.

[02:55:43]

wagnerrp:

jya: unlikely to work with mythtv directly, unless you decrypt it and access the BDMV folder from the filesystem

[02:56:00]

jya:

wagnerrp: hence why I started this chat earlier ...

[02:56:24]

wagnerrp:

dcg_: often machine crashingly unstable?

[02:56:45]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: basically the idea is that you would regularly backup the entire VM, which has nothing except the OS and app installed, then if your hardware fails, drop the latest VM backup in another machine and restore your latest data.

[02:56:56]

dcg_:

under 10 minutes to a working accounting system

[02:57:17]

wagnerrp:

not sure why you couldnt do that otherwise

[02:57:20]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: often the app just won't start at all, in many cases won't even install

[02:57:35]

wagnerrp:

on windows... sure

[02:57:49]

wagnerrp:

but on linux/wine, just share HOME among all the various machines

[02:58:42]

wagnerrp:

theyve got some thing in the engineering labs at school where the applications are served up from a shared filesystem, but installed on each machine locall

[02:58:42]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: many accounting apps require you to install, then install several years of "update disks" then you need to contact the vendor with a code, who then return a validation key.

[02:58:49]

wagnerrp:

not sure how they rigged that up

[02:59:15]

wagnerrp:

dcg_: yeah, we do use VMs for that purpose at the lab

[02:59:20]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: I am not talking about running on multiple machines, I am talking about recovery from machine failure

[02:59:27]

wagnerrp:

software gets validated against the VM

[02:59:35]

wagnerrp:

so you can use the VM where ever you want

[02:59:39]

wagnerrp:

and the license remains valid

[02:59:43]

dcg_:

yep

[03:00:00]

wagnerrp:

its a horrible cludge... but not much else you can do if they dont offer a license server

[03:00:12]

dcg_:

some of my customers even send a copy of the VM to their accountant, rather than just the data

[03:01:03]

wagnerrp:

horray for usable software design practices

[03:01:10]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: not really a cludge, why would a single license user want to run a license server

[03:01:59]

wagnerrp:

for hardware tolerance

[03:02:11]

dcg_:

an advantage of sending the vm to an accountant, is you have the correct software version to match the data version, accounting packages can be horrid for mangling data if there are version mismatches

[03:03:22]

dcg_:

the same applies after a reinstall, miss just 1 patch or update, and you could cause sutble errors in your data

[03:03:40]

dcg_:

MYOB has been know to do this in the past :(

[03:04:58]

dcg_:

many small (and not so small) businesses I have delt with only have 1 computer, so if you loos the machine you would also loose the license server!

[03:05:01]

wagnerrp:

so the VM is a crutch to make up for poorly written software

[03:05:04]

wagnerrp:

a horrible cludge

[03:05:33]

jya:

wagnerrp: I can perfectly see the advantage of using a VM

[03:05:51]

jya:

spreading the right working environment is so much easier with a VM

[03:06:07]

jya:

and on any host at that

[03:06:10]

wagnerrp:

i see the advantage when running linux systems, and needing to use windows software

[03:06:16]

wagnerrp:

(assuming WINE doesnt work)

[03:06:24]

dcg_:

other advantages are stability, the OS that the accounting ap is running on only has essential elements installed/activated.

[03:06:35]

jya:

wagnerrp: our windows development environment is a VMWare image

[03:06:44]

jya:

all the tools are in there, you're up and running in minutes

[03:06:47]

jya:

instead of days

[03:07:12]

jya:

and you can take it with you easily

[03:07:22]

dcg_:

even on a windows machine, the accounting app is in a more stable environment, ie: there are no games installing wierd libraries that bork things

[03:08:18]

dcg_:

another advantage is that you can disable networking to the vm (unless you need to update something) so the system is relatively immune to attacks as well

[03:09:07]

wagnerrp:

so its a poor mans version of the application packages OSX uses

[03:09:55]

wagnerrp:

all the executable, libraries, data files, stored in a one big 'app' that gets mounted specifically to run that application

[03:10:02]

wagnerrp:

such that it doesnt interfere with anything else

[03:10:02]

jya:

the application packages on a mac, doesn't contain all its history, 3rd party apps and isn''t fully self contained

[03:10:07]

dcg_:

with windows 7 for the forseeable future I belive VM's are even more critical, as there are lots of older apps, and hardware that can only be supported with something like an XP vm

[03:10:08]

jya:

preferences are stored elsewhere etc

[03:11:20]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: I defy you to take a 10 year old application package and run it un altered on a current OSx

[03:11:31]

dcg_:

with a VM this is the norm

[03:12:12]

wagnerrp:

if it doesnt need special hardware access, like a specific version of directx

[03:12:18]

wagnerrp:

that should not be hard to pull off

[03:12:38]

dcg_:

the api

[03:13:23]

wagnerrp:

has been intentionally backwards compatible for a long time

[03:13:45]

wagnerrp:

microsoft has been intentionally unwilling to make such breaks

[03:13:56]

dcg_:

oops....the api's, libraries, etc will all have significantly changed, and even options for core OS utils will likely have drifted. think libc5 vs libc6

[03:14:50]

dcg_:

even on the iPhone, many apps had to be updated to work with iOS4 it didn't happen automatically

[03:15:13]

wagnerrp:

on any posix system, you can simply chroot into another environment if you need different libraries

[03:15:34]

wagnerrp:

so long as you dont need access to special kernel interfaces that are no longer available

[03:16:12]

dcg_:

that is true, if you have access to all of the required libraries and associated binaries, the time and knkowledge to build the chroot, and the time to debug when it doesn't work

[03:17:21]

dcg_:

wagnerrp: in short, anything is possible in a posix env. under windows not so easy. but a VM makes it trivial for even the novice to get a working result in minutes every time

[03:17:54]

dcg_:

heck, that is why most commercial servers are now all run as VM's of one sort or another

[03:19:06]

wagnerrp:

commercial servers run VMs for isolation, not for the virtualization part

[03:19:32]

wagnerrp:

it just happens that the virtualization vendors are the only ones selling integrated products providing isolation and management

[03:19:43]

wagnerrp:

no one does the same things with jails, containers, or vservers

[03:20:02]

dcg_:

only partially, virtualization allows them to run different environments on the same physical hardware.

[03:20:16]

wagnerrp:

different kernels

[03:20:18]

dcg_:

also allows hardware independence.

[03:20:25]

wagnerrp:

isolation allows different environments

[03:22:07]

dcg_:

no service provider (think internet) wants to have a piece of hardware fail that needs to be replaced with newer model stuff, require that they reinstall an entire suit of virtual services from scratch to get things back online.

[03:22:50]

dcg_:

with virtualisation they can just install the virtualisation environment (which should pretty much work out of the box, then restor all of the virtual servers.

[03:23:20]

dcg_:

a matter of minutes instead of hours or days

[03:23:21]

wagnerrp:

ive got my dns and dhcp servers running in jails on a little 500MHz 32-bit geode

[03:23:50]

wagnerrp:

i wanted to update it, so i straight copied those files to a dual core Opteron, and started them up in under a minute

[03:24:09]

wagnerrp:

completely different architectures, completely different software, no virtualization needed

[03:24:54]

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[03:25:10]

wagnerrp:

if you have such different hardware architectures that you cannot do that, it is going to be very inefficient to do so with a VM

[03:25:11]

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[03:25:20]

wagnerrp:

or, its a software limitation

[03:25:21]

dcg_:

that is an elegant solition, for your particular needs

[03:27:06]

dcg_:

there are a lot of very knowledgeable people out there that all agree (and have written extensively about) that Virtualisation is a better solution for commercial use.

[03:27:39]

wagnerrp:

its a crutch

[03:27:42]

dcg_:

I have to go and do some work, I will be back in about 7 hours

[03:27:54]

wagnerrp:

for software written in such a manner that it is not easily portable

[03:28:33]

wagnerrp:

its no different from the issues people have had in the past when they tried to move to limited user accounts on windows

[03:28:48]

wagnerrp:

only to find the software did not behave correctly without administrator priveleges

[03:29:07]

wagnerrp:

even though it was for tasks that had no reason to ever need adminiatrator privileges

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wagnerrp:

Beirdo: another 34 episodes queued up to run overnight

[06:46:29]

wagnerrp:

well see if any of those fail

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[08:26:17]

justinh:

wow. rhythmbox is quite nice isn't it?

[08:26:30]

justinh:

apart from the obligatory music store bit I mean

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dcg_:

justinh: I am fairly sure you can disable that in plugins

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craigd:

dcg_: You there?

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[11:51:19]

jya:

wagnerrp: VMWare running on the linux backend, running win7 home edition + AnyDVD HD and the disk folder shared then mounted on my remote frontend, plays perfectly fine using mythavtest

[11:52:24]

jya:

I added an entry in the optical theme that starts a script, that remount the shared BD cifs drive (I've noticed errors occurring if it had cached an old disk).. It's now easy to watch a bluray anywhere

[11:53:19]

laga_:

jya: .. no ripping needed?

[11:53:23]

jya:

I read about some people starting BD playback directly from mythvideo, adding the BD share to the storage group. IS it something only available in master or that can be done in 0.24 too ?

[11:53:35]

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[11:53:54]

jya:

laga_: nope.. not at all… it takes about 5s for AnyDVD to make the decrypted disk available

[11:54:36]

laga_:

jya: that's lovely.

[11:54:41]

jya:

AnyDVD isn't cheap though, 79 euros

[11:54:58]

jya:

I can get a BD player for that price

[11:55:05]

laga_:

well, that's the price of freedom

[11:55:19]

jya:

$59 with PowerDVD for a USB external bluray drive

[11:55:22]

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[11:55:58]

jya:

the best thing is how fast playback starts.. within 10–15s I have video playing. compare to over a minute with the panasonic

[11:56:28]

jya:

now it would be nice to have a bit of info in regards to the disk being played, I wonder if it's something that can be done from mythvideo

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[12:00:14]

TLE:

Hallo everyone, I have a problem connecting to the mysql database from a dedicated frontend to a dedicated backend. In mythtv it says Cannot connect and when I try manually I get: ERROR 2003 (HY000): Can't connect to MySQL server on '192.168.0.14' (111)

[12:00:24]

TLE:

Does anyone know how to fix this?

[12:02:17]

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[12:06:57]

jarle:

TLE: http://www.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&am . . . amp;oe=utf-8

[12:07:48]

jarle:

TLE: guess you need to configure the mysql server to allow connections from the clients IP...

[12:09:55]

TLE:

ok, so that is this bind-adress option? so on the server I should change that to the client IP

[12:10:55]

jarle:

TLE: you should change it to the external IP of the server, the IP that the client will use to contact it...

[12:12:30]

TLE:

ok

[12:12:46]

TLE:

do I need to restart mysql or something, for these things to take effect?

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[12:21:05]

TLE:

jarle: it was the restarting of the service that was missing, because I had actually found that thread before, thanks

[12:21:41]

jarle:

TLE: good you got it working

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ureds:

dcg_: you there?

[12:59:57]

ureds:

ready to go at the tbs install..

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[13:19:27]

justinh:

hahaha. get yourself talked into a walkthrough?

[13:21:01]

justinh:

dcg_: yeah I disabled the stupid stores. And then dumped rhythmbox cos the albumart downloader plugin was arse

[13:21:23]

justinh:

still though, gives some ideas about how a music playing interface can work well

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dcg_:

ureds: yes, but a bit tied up atm, will yell when available

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[16:01:11]

johnf1912:

HD-PVR 1080i question

[16:01:19]

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[16:01:27]

johnf1912:

I have an HD-PVR, STB is set to passthrough received content

[16:01:31]

johnf1912:

720p and 480i are fine

[16:01:39]

johnf1912:

but I get stuttery playback on 1080i content

[16:01:58]

johnf1912:

I have GT430 passive in my frontend

[16:02:07]

johnf1912:

it should be able to do advanced 2x on 1080i content

[16:02:21]

johnf1912:

however, I see the following message in my frontend log when I play back the content

[16:02:30]

johnf1912:

Video sync method can't support double framer

[16:02:31]

johnf1912:

ate (refresh rate too low for 2x deint)

[16:02:50]

johnf1912:

it looks like it thinks it's 60fps content, and not 60 interlaced frames

[16:02:58]

johnf1912:

I also see

[16:03:04]

johnf1912:

2011-10–02 10:08:21.107 [h264 @ 0x7f6b69649580]sps_id out of range

[16:03:04]

johnf1912:

2011-10–02 10:08:21.107 [h264 @ 0x7f6b69649580]non-existing SPS 15 referenced in buffering period

[16:03:07]

johnf1912:

2011-10–02 10:08:21.107 [h264 @ 0x7f6b69649580]non-existing PPS referenced

[16:03:08]

johnf1912:

but not always

[16:03:26]

johnf1912:

I have some other 1080i content which doesn't show the deinterlace warning

[16:03:32]

johnf1912:

but is still stuttery

[16:03:37]

johnf1912:

I played with vdpaubuffersize a bit

[16:03:44]

johnf1912:

anyways, any advice anyone can offer would be most welcome

[16:03:58]

wagnerrp:

vdpaubuffersize is only used to compensate for out-of-spec videos

[16:04:24]

wagnerrp:

ones with too many buffer frames for what the card is supposed to handle

[16:04:24]

johnf1912:

ah, some people had said it helped with hd-pvr recorded content

[16:05:16]

wagnerrp:

it shouldn't make any difference

[16:05:29]

johnf1912:

hmm, ok

[16:05:37]

johnf1912:

well, it didn't ;)

[16:05:55]

johnf1912:

any ideas otherwise ?

[16:06:37]

wagnerrp:

nope

[16:07:16]

johnf1912:

regretable

[16:08:06]

johnf1912:

I should probably rejoin the mailing list and write it up in greater detail

[16:12:10]

johnf1912:

I'll bbl, but I'll be checking my scrollback

[16:12:17]

johnf1912:

if anyone else has any suggestions please let me know

[16:12:26]

johnf1912:

any recommendations on nvidia drivers for vdpau?

[16:13:02]

johnf1912:

currently NVIDIA-Linux-x86_64–275.19

[16:20:31]

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[16:45:54]

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[16:46:14]

_fjh_:

Hi, I cannot delete channels in mythweb anymore. I found some vague references to suhosin.ini via goole, but the file I have has only comments inside.

[16:46:26]

_fjh_:

How do I need to configure mythweb/apache2?

[16:48:40]

_fjh_:

Or is there another tool to delete lots of channels?

[16:51:16]

dcg_:

_fjh_: Hi there....( your nick is a pain by the way, having to type _ before being able to hit tab for nick completion ). in backend setup you can delete all channels at once, I think it is "d" in the chanel editor screen

[16:51:36]

dcg_:

the manual should tell you for sure

[16:54:21]

_fjh_:

dcg_: I did not know about nick completion! I want to keep 40 channels out of my 400–600 list.

[16:55:33]

dcg_:

*that* could be hard.

[16:56:44]

dcg_:

it may be easier to delete them all, then re add the ones you want. having said that I am sure there is a better way, and I think a good look around backend setup is what you need. I can't at the moment as my system is in use

[16:59:18]

_fjh_:

dcg_: I tried that, but adding them one by one is _really_ uncomfortable.

[16:59:19]

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[17:00:24]

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[17:00:30]

dcg_:

try searching for this file on your system "keys.txt.gz" (you can search with "locate keys.txt.gz")

[17:00:55]

dcg_:

it contains a list of keys and what they do for different parts of myth.

[17:01:08]

dcg_:

there are other docs in the same directory

[17:01:19]

_fjh_:

dcg_ I think I found the php configuration problem now: In a file "user.log" (I looked in the apache logs) there was a "ALERT – configured POST variable limit exceeded"

[17:02:28]

dcg_:

that would do it :)

[17:02:34]

tank-man:

I found an interesting story about website scrapping ... http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/10/02/143720 . . . es-copyright

[17:03:22]

dcg_:

btw the keys.txt file is focused on frontend stuff, I thought it had both front and backend in it. other docs in that dir should though

[17:03:41]

_fjh_:

dcg_: Thank you for the ideas!

[17:05:10]

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[17:09:13]

dcg_:

_fjh_: no problem. I seem to recall that one of the backend setup screens allows to "enable/disable" channels and possibly delete selected channels too. don't quote me on that though

[17:10:14]

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[17:11:29]

Ankhwatcher:

Hey

[17:17:44]

Ankhwatcher:

Does this mean it's not working: DVB-S IF freq is 1853850

[17:17:44]

Ankhwatcher:

WARNING: filter timeout pid 0x0011

[17:17:44]

Ankhwatcher:

WARNING: filter timeout pid 0x0000

[17:17:44]

Ankhwatcher:

WARNING: filter timeout pid 0x0010

[17:20:19]

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[17:21:02]

[R]:

Ankhwatcher: "it"?

[17:21:51]

Ankhwatcher:

scan -x0 /usr/share/dvb/dvb-s/Astra-28.2E | tee channels.conf

[17:22:24]

[R]:

scan isn't a myth program

[17:22:27]

Ankhwatcher:

on this http://www.tbsdtv.com/english/product/8920.html

[17:22:32]

[R]:

thats not a myth website

[17:23:05]

Ankhwatcher:

[R]: do myth make their own hardware?

[17:23:18]

[R]:

no, myth is software

[17:24:15]

Ankhwatcher:

[R]: then myth needs to run hardware made by other people. How does myth interface with this hardware?

[17:24:28]

[R]:

it depends on what the hardware is

[17:25:15]

Ankhwatcher:

[R]: no it does not. Myth must interface with an OS

[17:25:18]

[R]:

what?

[17:25:38]

** [R] is wondering where the point is... **

[17:26:22]

Ankhwatcher:

http://parker1.co.uk/mythtv_freesat.php

[17:26:40]

wagnerrp:

mythtv doesnt care what your OS is, as long as it looks like POSIX

[17:27:42]

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[17:27:49]

Ankhwatcher:

ah my scan is doen

[17:27:50]

Ankhwatcher:

done

[17:27:57]

Ankhwatcher:

and it found nothing

[17:28:04]

Ankhwatcher:

I have a driver issue

[17:28:10]

wagnerrp:

which scan? that 'scan' program or mythtv's?

[17:28:48]

Ankhwatcher:

that scan

[17:29:10]

Ankhwatcher:

appears to be part of the os, but it could just be part of mplayer

[17:29:21]

wagnerrp:

its neither

[17:29:43]

wagnerrp:

its an application written by the LinuxTV project, that came in 'dvb-apps'

[17:32:03]

wagnerrp:

it is used to interface with the DVB driver subsystem

[17:32:09]

wagnerrp:

but then that is part of the kernel, also not part of the OS

[17:43:56]

dekarl:

tank-man: the story is about copyright, not about scraping... it would be the same story if someone would take the reviews and pictures from a database.

[17:47:15]

tank-man:

not about web scrapping? but thats what one company was doing to another in that story

[17:47:54]

tank-man:

i thougth it might be interesting to some here because they do that for the tv listings

[17:48:29]

dekarl:

they took copyrighted texts and pictures from other websites.

[17:48:53]

dekarl:

if you take only time and title, that's not copyrighted

[17:49:06]

dekarl:

as in "facts cannot be copyrighted"

[17:49:13]

tank-man:

facts/data that is organized is copyrighted

[17:49:23]

tank-man:

look up stories on people copying phone books

[17:49:36]

dekarl:

no they are not.

[17:50:02]

dekarl:

some countries have additional protection for "the way that stuff is organized/collected" e.g. database protection

[17:50:27]

tank-man:

im not a lawyer, so i do not continue this argument

[17:50:44]

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[17:51:28]

dekarl:

me neither, but it's been reviewed when the channels started to monetize their guide assets ;)

[17:52:17]

tank-man:

theres a reason schedulesdirect service got started

[17:52:35]

dekarl:

been reading some judgement yesterday from a german court. it's not that different

[17:53:13]

dekarl:

sure, but that's another topic

[17:59:11]

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[18:02:16]

dekarl:

tank-man: see e.g. the terms of service for mtv guide feed over here http://translate.google.de/translate?hl=de&am . . . v.de/node/53

[18:02:16]

dekarl:

No scraping involved but still no free of charge guide. Sure, you can write your own texts, some people are doing that but in the end somebody has to do real work (and is unlikely to work for free)

[18:02:20]

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[18:25:20]

justinh:

I do wish certain howto guides would die

[18:25:29]

justinh:

scan foo > channels.conf. NO

[18:25:34]

justinh:

NO NO NO NO

[18:27:01]

dekarl:

justinh: how else would you test your hardware before beginning the mythtv configuration?

[18:27:31]

justinh:

some howtos are still saying to try & import the .conf

[18:28:00]

dekarl:

indeed, but not the guide that was mentioned last...

[18:29:45]

dekarl:

it nicely describes the scan with "enter the details for one transport and it (the mythtv channel scanner) will find the rest"

[18:29:58]

justinh:

ah well that's the proper way to do things

[18:31:08]

dekarl:

but some howto for setting up the current state of mythtv would be greatly appreciated

[18:31:55]

justinh:

for dvb-s especially. in the *wiki*

[18:32:07]

justinh:

or submitted as proper documentation

[18:32:20]

justinh:

not on somerandomguysblog.wordpress.com

[18:37:52]

iamlindoro:

You mean kind of like it's been on the DVB-S page on the wiki for years?

[18:38:37]

iamlindoro:

I understand that most people would never think to search the term, but... ;) http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/DVB-S

[18:39:42]

dekarl:

... http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/User_Manual:Settin . . . or_satellite ...

[18:40:40]

justinh:

it's still not 'start to finish' enough for most of the people who come in here, as evidenced by what we see

[18:41:08]

iamlindoro:

justinh: What would you say is missing from the DVB-S page?

[18:42:26]

justinh:

hmmm now I've re-read the diseqc section when I'm awake it makes a lot more sense

[18:42:36]

dekarl:

the guides could use a do-over. E.G. why is the DVB-S part talking about DVB-CI? that's relevant to DVB-C/T, too.

[18:43:22]

wagnerrp:

well... the guides could use a do-over by a european

[18:43:24]

iamlindoro:

dekarl: Get to work, then

[18:43:37]

wagnerrp:

not much we can do on this side of the pond with hardly any use for the stuff

[18:43:38]

dekarl:

the references to "theres some unsupported script that might be better then mythtv" should die :)

[18:43:40]

justinh:

I dunno how somebody coming to mythtv with a multiport switch & stuff would go on though. that stuff terrified me

[18:43:52]

justinh:

oh and 'run mythtv-setup as root'

[18:44:06]

wagnerrp:

why is saying to run mythtv-setup as root?

[18:44:09]

dekarl:

I've started with the parts that I know about... but that's not much

[18:44:36]

** iamlindoro managed to write the DVB-S setup page with no programming in that format on the entire continent **

[18:44:44]

justinh:

wagnerrp: prolly cos whoever wrote it isn't a member of the right group

[18:44:55]

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[18:44:56]

wagnerrp:

s/why/what/

[18:45:03]

wagnerrp:

the wiki is?

[18:45:17]

iamlindoro:

The user manual page

[18:45:26]

justinh:

'run mythtv setup as root, then later discover when mythbackend runs as the right user, that the permissions on the tv recordings SGs are incorrect when all your recordings fail"

[18:46:13]

wagnerrp:

probably this Loki character

[18:46:44]

justinh:

oh yeah that reminds me.. who was the guy who had problems the other day & found that changing his video standard affected his ability to add an LNB to his card?

[18:46:49]

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[18:47:18]

justinh:

I tried chasing him up about that, because I've seen the code in there & AFAIK it doesn't have anything to do with that – just the card type etc

[18:47:32]

wagnerrp:

what does that setting even do anyway?

[18:47:40]

justinh:

but if by some weird circumstance it *was* because of that.. it needs fixed

[18:47:41]

wagnerrp:

i mean it seems like thats something that should be per-card

[18:47:56]

wagnerrp:

but its a global option over the whole system

[18:48:08]

justinh:

wagnerrp: different video standards per card? not likely it'll ever be needed IMHO

[18:48:21]

justinh:

but it'd be simple enough to put right I suppose

[18:48:40]

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[18:48:43]

justinh:

you have a point though.. what *does* it affect anyway?

[18:49:02]

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[18:49:15]

wagnerrp:

if anything, it should be automatically detected at time of recording

[18:49:24]

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[18:49:52]

justinh:

frequency table.. sure. that has a bearing

[18:51:12]

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[18:52:20]

Ankhwatcher:

Hey, how do I set up the myth database?

[18:52:28]

laga_:

yes.

[18:52:35]

wagnerrp:

page 6 on the official documentation

[18:52:59]

justinh:

just grepped the source for "Video Standard"... not much came out

[18:54:16]

justinh:

duh. "TV Format"

[18:54:19]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: It allows the "default" to function in a multicard environment

[18:54:47]

iamlindoro:

(as default is the erm, default value)

[18:55:33]

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[18:57:10]

justinh:

anyway this guy said he changed tv format to pal-60 & suddenly he could add an LNB. not sure I go for that

[18:57:26]

justinh:

I don't even think anywhere in europe uses pal-60

[18:59:10]

Ankhwatcher:

Why I run the myth backend setup it doesn't show any language options

[19:01:18]

dekarl:

isn't PAL-60 for watching produced for NTSC content on PAL devices? (and play console games)

[19:01:22]

justinh:

it only does that the first time

[19:01:40]

justinh:

dekarl: it's used somewhere proper too AFAIK. Brazil maybe

[19:01:54]

justinh:

well PAL-M.. 60Hz PAL

[19:02:36]

justinh:

anyway, unless something is really backwardsly screwed in mythtv-setup the TV format shouldn't have a bearing on being able to set a DVB-S diseqc tree. Only the device type

[19:04:04]

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[19:06:51]

Ankhwatcher:

rory@ZUBUNTU:~$ mysql < mc.sql

[19:06:52]

Ankhwatcher:

bash: mc.sql: No such file or directory

[19:07:28]

[R]:

lol

[19:11:02]

Ankhwatcher:

how the hell do you set up this ... database?

[19:11:23]

wagnerrp:

where did you get mythtv from?

[19:11:33]

Ankhwatcher:

synaptics

[19:11:41]

wagnerrp:

which is... what distro?

[19:11:54]

Ankhwatcher:

synaptics package manager

[19:11:59]

Ankhwatcher:

I'm running kubuntu

[19:12:20]

wagnerrp:

the mythbuntu packages set the database up for you automatically

[19:12:39]

justinh:

and not mythbuntu? for why? mythbuntu would be by far the easiest way to get going.. because (FANFARE) it does some tricky stuff for you. If you follow the onscreen prompts properly you can't really fail

[19:13:05]

Ankhwatcher:

no I have a configured operating system

[19:13:16]

Ankhwatcher:

I'm not blowing it out to run a piece of software

[19:13:21]

justinh:

mind, a mythtv install on *any* *buntu system is pretty much foolproof these days thanks to the mythbuntu effort – especially database configuration

[19:13:51]

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[19:15:25]

Ankhwatcher:

What does no UPnP backends found, mean?

[19:15:29]

justinh:

you've really got to go through the whole thing with your eyes shut for stuff like the db creation to go wrong

[19:15:38]

justinh:

it means.. no UPnP backends found

[19:15:48]

Ankhwatcher:

fanfuckingtastic

[19:15:59]

Ankhwatcher:

what do I need to do about that?

[19:16:01]

justinh:

in other words it's nothing to worry about

[19:16:15]

Ankhwatcher:

terrific

[19:16:15]

justinh:

it's an autodiscovery type thing

[19:16:32]

justinh:

and for the record, watch your language in here please

[19:16:42]

wagnerrp:

it allows subsequent backends and frontends to autodiscover the master backend, once you have it set up and running

[19:16:52]

wagnerrp:

for configuration of the master backend itself, it does nothing

[19:18:09]

justinh:

btw this bit is important: don't skip any steps in mythtv-setup or there will be pain

[19:18:45]

wagnerrp:

Ankhwatcher: mc.sql is a file that comes in the database directory of the official source

[19:19:01]

wagnerrp:

if you are using third party packages, it is entirely possible they do not install that fine anywhere

[19:19:18]

justinh:

if you're using ubuntu packages, it *should* do the db install for you

[19:19:27]

wagnerrp:

correct

[19:19:44]

Ankhwatcher:

it really hasn't[6~

[19:19:50]

justinh:

hence my point the other day about people erroneously following the mythtv.org docs when they're using fancy packaged stuff

[19:19:53]

Ankhwatcher:

mysql server wasn't even installed

[19:19:58]

justinh:

what?

[19:20:03]

justinh:

that shouldn't even be possible

[19:20:16]

wagnerrp:

specifically what mythtv package did you install?

[19:20:19]

Ankhwatcher:

I don't get how it wasn't a prerequisite for mythtv-backend

[19:20:29]

justinh:

it most certainly is

[19:20:59]

Ankhwatcher:

ERROR 2002 (HY000): Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.sock' (2)

[19:21:11]

wagnerrp:

so the database simply isnt running

[19:21:33]

Ankhwatcher:

wasn't

[19:21:36]

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[19:21:45]

Ankhwatcher:

now that it is I think all the settings I have created are screwed up

[19:21:50]

notlistening:

Hey still having mythweb issues

[19:21:54]

Ankhwatcher:

where do I delete them from?

[19:22:02]

wagnerrp:

delete what?

[19:22:07]

iamlindoro:

if the db wasn't up, there are no settings

[19:22:09]

justinh:

OMG. he's right

[19:22:25]

justinh:

apt-rdepends mythtv-backend |grep mysql – there is no mysql-server mentioned in that

[19:22:28]

notlistening:

all the files including the softlink are owned and group of root I can imagine that is wrong right?

[19:22:41]

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[19:22:44]

wagnerrp:

justinh: does it pull it in with a mythtv-commons or something?

[19:22:49]

justinh:

ah but.. the 'mythtv' package... it's there

[19:23:17]

dmfrey:

i am trying to get mythfilldatabase to update new channels for an hdhomerun prime, but they do not get added

[19:23:33]

wagnerrp:

dmfrey: that is correct, read the related page on the wiki

[19:24:06]

wagnerrp:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Configuring_MythTV_for . . . omeRun_Prime

[19:24:20]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: stop. install the 'mythtv' package. that should get you rolling on a guided setup where the server etc is set up nicely for you. mysql user created (with random password if you want, it'll tell you) .. and it'll create the actual mythtv user.. and save you some time

[19:24:44]

Ankhwatcher:

justinh: sounds promising, will do.

[19:24:47]

dmfrey:

wagnerrp: thanks, I was looking at that but missed that one box, i will give that a shot

[19:25:02]

justinh:

'mythtv' depends on 'mythtv-backend'.. why the hell mythtv-backend doesn't have the dependency on mysql-server I don't know

[19:25:24]

wagnerrp:

justinh: because you can run the backend against a remote mysql server

[19:25:34]

justinh:

heh. yeah I suppose so

[19:25:49]

justinh:

oh well, they maybe didn't figure on anybody trying to outsmart them ;-)

[19:26:20]

Ankhwatcher:

it's a server... I want it to serve

[19:27:34]

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[19:27:39]

Ankhwatcher:

so has anyone looked at the Raspberry Pi?

[19:27:50]

wagnerrp:

for what purpose?

[19:28:07]

Ankhwatcher:

http://www.raspberrypi.org/

[19:28:08]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: yeah. I looked at it. useless little thing

[19:28:14]

justinh:

no use for mythtv, certainly

[19:28:16]

Ankhwatcher:

Mythtv client maybe?

[19:28:18]

justinh:

128MB RAM...

[19:28:19]

wagnerrp:

it has no CPU, meaning any decoding would have to be done on the decoder

[19:28:21]

justinh:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[19:28:26]

wagnerrp:

meaning support for the decoder would have to be written

[19:28:31]

dmfrey:

wagnerrp: tried it and it still isn't pulling in the new channels

[19:28:40]

wagnerrp:

it has too little memory to run the frontend well

[19:28:57]

Ankhwatcher:

bummer

[19:28:58]

justinh:

sure it could run mythfrontend. without any graphics

[19:29:24]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: You need to start over from scratch. You've likely damaged the video source with the missteps

[19:29:41]

justinh:

but hey it's been shown running Quake3, a game from like 20 years ago. So it must ROCK, right?

[19:29:44]

wagnerrp:

it would require a substantial amount of rewriting of existing code, and addition of new code, to make the frontend run on such a device

[19:29:50]

Ankhwatcher:

so it could run ubuntu, but it's not good enough to run myth? http://www.raspberrypi.org/?page_id=11

[19:29:55]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: Create a brand new video source, attach it to the demo tuner, and go from there. Also *don't* worry about the "starting channel" box being filled

[19:30:09]

iamlindoro:

By the time you connect the source to the prime tuners, the channels will be populated

[19:30:13]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: no way. never will be without a) a proper CPU and b) > 512mb ram

[19:30:25]

wagnerrp:

Ankhwatcher: running ubuntu doesnt require any significant amount of power, or support for special hardware

[19:30:44]

dmfrey:

iamlindoro: ok, i will drop the one currently in there and redo it

[19:30:55]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: Just need to perform all the steps from scratch, as specified, and have faith that it's working-- don't worry about whether you think it's working or not ;)

[19:31:03]

wagnerrp:

if you want to play video, either you need enough CPU power to decode the video (which it doesnt have), or you need a hardware decoder and support for said hardware decoder (which mythtv doesnt have)

[19:31:29]

Ankhwatcher:

mythtv-setup now gives language options but still complains that it has no database connection

[19:31:32]

justinh:

it'd be the same story for XBMC on the pi too

[19:31:43]

wagnerrp:

if someone wants to write support for its decoder, then were about a quarter of the way there

[19:31:46]

Ankhwatcher:

I probably need to manually add it as a user to mysql

[19:31:50]

dmfrey:

iamlindoro: it worked fine when I originally set up the prime, but SD was missing channels from my cable company, so now I need to add them in there

[19:31:55]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: you shouldn't.

[19:31:55]

wagnerrp:

there are still significant memory issues that need to be resolved

[19:32:08]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: the package wrapping should have done that, and set permissions etc

[19:32:15]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: OK, all the more reason to start from a fresh source

[19:32:33]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: The "fetch channels from listings source" will just stop if it detects it would be overwriting existing channels

[19:32:56]

dmfrey:

ok

[19:34:01]

Ankhwatcher:

what's the best way to point to localhost? localhost 127.0.0.1 or ZUBUNTU

[19:34:43]

wagnerrp:

neither, use a network accessible address

[19:35:39]

Ankhwatcher:

yeah 127 worked

[19:35:49]

iamlindoro:

It's a server, you want it to serve

[19:35:52]

wagnerrp:

yes, but use a network accessible address

[19:35:56]

iamlindoro:

which is won't do if you point it at localhost

[19:36:09]

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[19:37:18]

justinh:

btw about the only thing I find attractive about the raspberrypi thing is the price. if it ever makes it to market at the projected cost

[19:37:29]

justinh:

be a nifty thing to mess about with

[19:37:34]

Ankhwatcher:

this TV format in General should that be PAL?

[19:37:42]

justinh:

if you live in a PAL country, yes

[19:38:06]

Ankhwatcher:

Freesat

[19:38:49]

justinh:

you live in Freesat? Cool. Do they speak English in Freesat? :-P

[19:39:00]

iamlindoro:

Wonder how they got recognized by the UN before Palestine

[19:39:51]

Ankhwatcher:

well if ireland was NTSC and Britain was PAL I would want PAL not ntsc

[19:39:55]

Ankhwatcher:

because of freesat

[19:40:07]

justinh:

yes PAL

[19:40:11]

Ankhwatcher:

#UnitedStatesOfFreesat

[19:40:23]

justinh:

and NO I'm not prepared to walk anyone through a freesat installation

[19:43:06]

dmfrey:

iamlindoro: they are updating now :)

[19:43:20]

Ankhwatcher:

you mean setting it to pull the listings from that radio channel?

[19:43:41]

wagnerrp:

radio channel.... radiotimes?

[19:43:43]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: great, glad to hear it

[19:44:03]

justinh:

sigh

[19:44:04]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: and with RCN should behave pretty nicely

[19:44:24]

Ankhwatcher:

wagnerrp: freesat sends its listings out through one of the channels broadcast as a radio channel

[19:44:27]

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[19:44:27]

dmfrey:

it does, almost everything is open for recording

[19:44:32]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: no it doesn't

[19:44:44]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: Beats setting ClearQAM XMLTVids ;)

[19:45:24]

dmfrey:

iamlindoro: haha, tell me about it, i still have the original hdhomerun hooked up on the netowrk, but haven't added it back to the master backend yet

[19:45:24]

iamlindoro:

Sigh, documenting the new API will be the death of me

[19:45:48]

dmfrey:

not sure I am gonna add it back either

[19:45:52]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: Still worth keeping it around, though, in case any of your channels (pay close attention to CBS, CW, and Fox) and CGMS protected

[19:46:06]

Ankhwatcher:

what does the fill myth database fill the myth database with?

[19:46:27]

dmfrey:

doing pretty good with the prime and hdpvr1212 for those times when hbo or something gets recorded

[19:46:53]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: CGMS is the infamous "broadcast flag" which ClearQAM tuners ignore, but if your cable company leaves CCI set to "none" on the otherwise-clearQAM channels, the Prime is obliged to fall back to obeying it

[19:47:03]

iamlindoro:

and CBS (who in turn owns CW) tends to turn it on

[19:47:10]

dmfrey:

i haven't had any problems with not being able to tune those channels, but I will keep an eye on them

[19:47:16]

iamlindoro:

yep, just keep eyes open

[19:47:18]

dmfrey:

right

[19:47:36]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: you don't need mythfilldatabase if you're only going to be using over the air EPG data

[19:47:58]

dmfrey:

if I find any that do that, i just mark them as not visible in the mythweb,and let them default back to the hdpvr1212

[19:48:18]

dmfrey:

that is what I do with the hbo channels

[19:49:15]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: That works too, though it bums me out to lose the quality and ability to cut the commercials and archive

[19:49:17]

justinh:

Ankhwatcher: http://parker1.co.uk/mythtv_freesat.php might come in handy

[19:49:52]

dmfrey:

yeah, but luckily, hbo has no commercials :)

[19:49:58]

iamlindoro:

CBS and CW do :)

[19:50:14]

wagnerrp:

but thats what the hdhomerun is for

[19:50:21]

dmfrey:

which cable company?

[19:50:33]

iamlindoro:

It's not a cable company thing, the acble company doesn't put CGMS there

[19:50:55]

iamlindoro:

they just pass through the flag when the local franchise enables it-- and it's a CBS corporate directive that their franchises do so

[19:51:18]

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[19:51:22]

iamlindoro:

IF your local broadcaster doesn't add it, you are in the minority and lucky-- and should cross fingers that they don't when your SO wants something recorded :)

[19:51:25]

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[19:52:16]

wagnerrp:

are the cable companies getting a different stream from what is broadcast?

[19:52:25]

iamlindoro:

no

[19:52:31]

iamlindoro:

They just pass it through

[19:52:37]

wagnerrp:

so theyre broadcasting the illegal broadcast flag?

[19:52:44]

dmfrey:

ah, i see, i didn't realize there was another signal they could put in there besides the broadcast flag

[19:52:48]

iamlindoro:

No, the broadcast flag is legal

[19:53:08]

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[19:53:08]

dmfrey:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CGMS-A

[19:53:12]

iamlindoro:

It's doing something with it on an ATSC tuner that's not

[19:53:16]

iamlindoro:

CGMS-A is analog

[19:53:21]

iamlindoro:

This is similar, though not the same

[19:53:33]

dmfrey:

says it is different than the broadcast flag, which is for digital broadcasts

[19:53:44]

iamlindoro:

-A = analog

[19:53:52]

justinh:

why can't it just cover *any* flag which is broadcast? :D

[19:53:54]

dmfrey:

ah, yeah

[19:54:03]

wagnerrp:

so ive recovered around 300GB of storage just from clipping the past year of recordings

[19:54:04]

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[19:54:22]

iamlindoro:

The CGMS in the digital stream has to do with the ATSC redistribution control descriptor

[19:54:27]

justinh:

oh wait that'd probably outlaw the station closedown sequence too ;)

[19:54:37]

iamlindoro:

which has the same basic levels as CCI-- none, copy free, copy none, etc.

[19:54:50]

iamlindoro:

ATSC tuners ignore the descriptor

[19:55:13]

iamlindoro:

CableLabs, which certifies CableCard devices, mandate that when CCI = None, and the CGMS RCD is there, that it must be obeyed

[19:55:16]

dmfrey:

gotcha

[19:55:42]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: are you planning on doing anything with the grabber definitions today?

[19:55:50]

wagnerrp:

if not, ill have a go at it

[19:56:05]

iamlindoro:

So fi you're getting CBS/CW/etc. there are two possibilities-- That the local broadcaster is bucking the corporate policy, or the cable company is actively adding the CCI flag

[19:56:16]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: Not planning on it, just remember to do the DB update if you do

[19:56:34]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: either way it benefits you, but also worth remaining aware of in case it changes

[19:56:35]

wagnerrp:

right, to clip the prefix from existing settings?

[19:56:40]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: yeah

[19:56:59]

iamlindoro:

which may be tricky since one host won't necessarily know what the prefix for another is

[19:57:05]

dmfrey:

iamlindoro: cool, thanks, i will keep it in mind

[19:57:15]

dmfrey:

i haven't had any issues with CBS

[19:57:19]

wagnerrp:

right

[19:57:34]

dmfrey:

haven't really recorded anything on CW since Smallville went off the air

[19:57:44]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: That said, I suppose you could find "/share/mythtv" and clip backwards

[19:57:59]

dmfrey:

they are sister companies, so if it stops working cbs, its a good bet cw won't work either

[19:58:14]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: yep, and generally broadcast by the same company in a given market

[19:58:21]

wagnerrp:

thats what i was thinking

[19:59:29]

dmfrey:

on a cable box on the service menu for a channel, you can see the cci, does it also tell you the cgms code as well?

[19:59:38]

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[20:00:04]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: I've never gone looking for it-- presumably it's in the menus somewhere but I can't say for sure

[20:00:10]

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[20:00:18]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: The prime will tell you, just navigate to that tuner's summary page with the channel tuned

[20:00:26]

dmfrey:

i see it on the prime web server

[20:00:31]

dmfrey:

turn on a channel

[20:00:43]

dmfrey:

then go to the ip address for the prime

[20:00:53]

iamlindoro:

The tuner status page gives a line for CCI, and the one just below it is CGMS

[20:00:54]

dmfrey:

then go to status menu

[20:01:04]

dmfrey:

and click the turner that is playing

[20:01:04]

iamlindoro:

Summary->Tuner #

[20:01:06]

iamlindoro:

right

[20:01:13]

dmfrey:

cci and cgms protections are listed

[20:01:21]

iamlindoro:

echo

[20:01:21]

iamlindoro:

echo

[20:01:22]

iamlindoro:

echo

[20:01:23]

iamlindoro:

;)

[20:01:41]

Ankhwatcher:

justinh: that's the set of instructions i was trying to follow when I came in here. I wish my MythTV setup was all pretty and blue like his.

[20:02:12]

justinh:

I wish everybody would stop whining

[20:02:18]

iamlindoro:

I wish I had a pony

[20:02:43]

dmfrey:

most i've checked are either none/none or none/unrestricted

[20:02:46]

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[20:03:13]

iamlindoro:

dmfrey: That's good. It means the broadcaster isn't putting the CGMS in-- it's not *as* good as the cable company putting in a CCI of copy freely, but it will work

[20:03:25]

Ankhwatcher:

I've scanned several times and I can't find any channels. When I used that scan command parker1 recommended it found the full list for me.

[20:03:29]

Ankhwatcher:

Ideas?

[20:03:38]

Ankhwatcher:

I've only the one input card.

[20:03:40]

iamlindoro:

Since if the cable co were putting in CCI for the broadcast channel, then it would still work even if the broadcaster decides to be a pain

[20:05:02]

dmfrey:

i wonder if you would find them in the timewarner areas, they seem to want to be as much of a pain as possible. i see them getting their broadcasters to add it in just to be a pain :)

[20:05:32]

iamlindoro:

poor TWC bastards

[20:05:45]

Ankhwatcher:

justinh: that guide says that when he clicks on Scan For Channels it asks him for details. Mine just runs and fails.

[20:06:21]

Ankhwatcher:

oh I've got it

[20:06:22]

Ankhwatcher:

nvm

[20:08:05]

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[20:14:01]

iamlindoro:

One service down... 6 to go... sigh

[20:14:39]

iamlindoro:

Maybe I'll do the Content Service since that one is at least fun

[20:24:13]

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[20:39:58]

Ankhwatcher:

My capture card is working for dvb-apps but not for Myth

[20:43:19]

Ankhwatcher:

wait a sec, what is lnb?

[20:44:17]

wagnerrp:

low noise block downconverter

[20:44:50]

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[20:45:00]

wagnerrp:

thats the thing that sticks out in front of your dish

[20:45:04]

Ankhwatcher:

ahhh

[20:45:23]

Ankhwatcher:

I was ignoring diseq because I don't have a moving dish

[20:45:35]

Ankhwatcher:

I think it's working now

[20:45:51]

Ankhwatcher:

yep it's found some channels

[20:46:14]

Ankhwatcher:

also by closing the setup and opening it again I got from the ugly brown interface to the pretty black interface

[20:46:17]

Ankhwatcher:

not sure why

[20:49:18]

Ankhwatcher:

What does "Invalid Inversion, falling back to auto" mean?

[20:49:43]

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[20:50:13]

iamlindoro:

It means you provided invalid information for inversion, and it's trying to work around the information with which is was provided

[21:00:33]

Ankhwatcher:

thats odd, inversion should have been auto

[21:02:36]

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[21:18:35]

jya:

what is the status of master overall? useable enough to be used as a main system?

[21:41:29]

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[22:34:54]

jya:

iamlindoro: to play a BD disk, is there any dependencies on an external library ? I'm trying to play on two machines where I built from source, but it tells me "Couldn't find an A/V decoder for:..."

[22:36:11]

iamlindoro:

jya: That suggests that libaacs is not installed, or the KeyDB.cfg is not configured right

[22:37:11]

iamlindoro:

No external dependencies to *play* a disc, but libaacs is the requirement for decrypting one-- it's dlopened

[22:37:55]

iamlindoro:

And that in turn relies on a properly configured ~/.mythtv/KEYDB.cfg with Processing Keys new enough to handle the disc in question

[22:38:13]

iamlindoro:

(and of course, also requires that the disc not be BD+)

[22:39:29]

iamlindoro:

But ISTR you have a decryption-via-VM thing going, so if the disc is otherwise decrypted, then it's probably a matter of setting the Blu-ray mountpoint properly in Video Player settings

[22:42:33]

jya:

iamlindoro: using anydvdhd … think I found the problem, somehow anydvd has stopped working so I had to restart it

[22:42:54]

iamlindoro:

ah, ok

[22:43:38]

jya:

was trying to play on the mac :)

[22:44:05]

jya:

working in vmware running ubuntu, but it cuts out a lot…

[22:44:55]

iamlindoro:

Depending on the version of myth and what discs, you can also set MYTHTV_HDMV=1 and even get full menus, assuming you have any BDMV-menu discs

[22:45:16]

iamlindoro:

(versus the manu discs whose menus are BD-J)

[22:45:16]

jya:

it's working !!! and perfectly too… Startwars on my mac :)

[22:45:24]

iamlindoro:

er many

[22:45:33]

iamlindoro:

Ah, yeah, Star Wars is bound to be BD-J menus

[22:45:41]

iamlindoro:

but you can at least watch the film

[22:46:05]

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[22:46:19]

jya:

quality is perfect …. and I just ordered a USB BD drive for the mac.. maybe I don't even need one and share the one on the backend instead

[22:48:06]

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[22:48:47]

jya:

that movie hasn't aged...

[22:50:52]

jya:

iamlindoro: is there a good source of information about BD, such as comparing BDMV-menu vs BD-J

[22:51:24]

jya:

need to write a 6.1 -> 7.1 upmixer right now it's downmixing to 6 channels

[22:51:42]

iamlindoro:

This site is good, but doesn't get that specific: http://www.blu-raystats.com/

[22:51:51]

iamlindoro:

specifically: http://www.blu-raystats.com/Stats/Stats.php

[22:52:23]

jya:

i was more referring to technical references

[22:53:46]

iamlindoro:

Just the blu-ray spec itself, and the many related documents

[22:54:28]

jya:

you're using AnyDVD yourself aren't you?

[22:55:26]

iamlindoro:

I don't, generally speaking-- I don't have any discs which are BD+, and now that the Processing Keys for everything to date are available, I don't need to use AnyDVD for anything at the moment-- I still have it in case I run into something I can't get at on Linux, though

[22:55:27]

jya:

I wonder how they legally get around stuff

[22:55:59]

jya:

libaacs will handle BD+ disks?

[22:56:21]

iamlindoro:

no, just AACS

[22:56:48]

iamlindoro:

BD+ discs are largely just Fox discs, the majority of discs are AACS only

[22:57:15]

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[22:57:19]

iamlindoro:

But AACS Processing Keys for all versions of MKB to date are now public, so I can decrypt all my discs in linux

[22:58:39]

jya:

What would starwars use? do you think there would be a way to watch it with myth without having to resort to anydvd ?

[22:58:52]

iamlindoro:

Star Wars uses v25

[22:59:04]

iamlindoro:

And PKs for v25 are available

[22:59:11]

iamlindoro:

but Star Wars is also a Fox disc and thus also BD+

[22:59:21]

iamlindoro:

or at least, very likely to be

[23:00:17]

jya:

I bought a few disks yesterday: one is Mao's last dancer .. didn't play on my machine locally

[23:00:29]

iamlindoro:

Do you have the newest processing keys?

[23:00:40]

jya:

probably not...

[23:00:56]

jya:

haven't touched my config in month (since last I had discussed with you)

[23:01:11]

iamlindoro:

http://ysk.orz.hm/BD/DeviceKey_MediaKey/

[23:01:19]

iamlindoro:

The new keys are from this month

[23:01:47]

** iamlindoro goes afk **

[23:02:00]

jya:

I'm a bit lost with the terms… So v25 refers to the encryption type ? in which case what is BD+ ?

[23:02:31]

iamlindoro:

v refers to the version of AACS MKB utilised

[23:02:43]

iamlindoro:

BD+ is an altogether different type of encryption layered on top of AACS

[23:03:03]

jya:

I see

[23:03:08]

iamlindoro:

All Bluray discs are AACS encrypted. Some Blu-ray discs are BD+ encrypted

[23:03:24]

iamlindoro:

Predominantly those put out by Fox, as Fox is the major backed of BD+

[23:06:05]

jya:

with libaacs, would I be able to export the disk via a samba share like I do with anydvd ?

[23:06:14]

jya:

or it needs physical access to the disk?

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