Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Friday, June 24th, 2011, 00:06 UTC

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JEDIDIAH__:

transcode? Turbo button? My graphics prof in college did his dissertation in the 70s. I shudder to think what his rendering process involved.

[00:11:31]

JEDIDIAH__:

audio conversion was painful enough in the 486 days.

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[00:38:26]

kisak:

wagnerrp: the ebuild I pastebin'd to you earlier checks out as being as good as 20110524

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[00:50:32]

kisak:

so I'm left with a frontend which has a playback problem and some of the menus do not render, including playback settings, there's nothing proactive to help in the log and audio does play. The screen sits at Please wait ...

[00:50:49]

kisak:

that frontend has an ATi Radeon 5450

[00:51:12]

kisak:

I am running 0.25 from today

[00:52:41]

sphery:

kisak: markk said he had varying results with different drivers

[00:53:59]

SporkD2:

im running a 5450

[00:54:05]

kisak:

Also, mythtv renders on other virtual desktops, blocking all other content

[00:54:40]

kisak:

SporkD2: are you running 0.25 newer than 2011-05–24?

[00:54:40]

sphery:

kisak: see thread at http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/482381#482381 and http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/ . . . 83433#483433

[00:54:59]

SporkD2:

ummmmm

[00:55:03]

SporkD2:

i just updated

[00:56:15]

SporkD2:

no im not running .25

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sphery:

SporkD2: which drivers areyou using?

[00:57:05]

kisak:

that is not the same rendering problem sphery, it appears to be playing content behind the Please wait ... load screen

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kisak:

(as far as I can tell)

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SporkD2:

i installed the 3rd party drivers

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SporkD2:

fglx

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SporkD2:

basically the ones ubuntu prompts you for

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sphery:

kisak: well, there were about 10 different bug reports and threads and from them I basically got, "with different drivers, you may have different results"

[00:58:18]

sphery:

but then again, I've pretty much written off the AMD GPUs as "swimming upstream" when it comes to MythTV

[00:58:41]

sphery:

(which is why 10 systems in my house have AMD GPUs and only my mythfrontend boxes have nvidia

[00:58:44]

kisak:

I wonder what happened 5 weeks ago that broke mythtv 0.25 on systems using fglrx

[00:59:09]

sphery:

let's just say that there were a flurry of commits regarding opengl on non-nvidia

[00:59:20]

sphery:

likes 10's of commits

[00:59:54]

kisak:

well, it's the only non-nvidia frontend here

[01:00:57]

sphery:

if you really want to look through history and bisect to find out which commit caused problems for you, that would probably help markk figure out what's happening

[01:01:13]

sphery:

or just get an nvidia video card for $8-$30 and enjoy life :)

[01:01:31]

** sphery got his GT220 for $7.96 including shipping **

[01:03:08]

kisak:

if I wasn't poor, the card would have been ordered already

[01:03:43]

sphery:

yeah, I watched the sales closely 'til I found a deal I liked

[01:04:07]

sphery:

unfortunately, the friend of mine who runs mythtv didn't watch his cell phone or IM clients that day

[01:04:41]

sphery:

(but at least the one I wanted him to replace is an nvidia GF7200)

[01:08:27]

eddytv:

Is there a huge difference between the GT210 and GT220? I picked up a GT210 because it only took up a single slot space (no room for a double-wide card) plus it was fanless.

[01:09:09]

sphery:

others know better than me, but the impression I got was it's not a big deal, but may have an effect on which deinterlacers it can keep up with

[01:09:39]

sphery:

of course, I wasn't as enamoured with the vdpau deinterlacers as some of the people on list were

[01:10:10]

sphery:

so if you're like me, that difference probably isn't worth a lot of money (or compromises for fan/double-wide, etc.)

[01:10:34]

sphery:

I did get a fanless 220, but I wouldn't have minded a fan since my frontend computer is in a different room

[01:12:13]

eddytv:

Thanks for the insight. I was hoping it wasn't too huge of a difference.

[01:14:15]

sphery:

there was a (way too long) thread on -users about all the various GT* cards and which one was best and why

[01:14:24]

sphery:

I didn't read it... maybe I can link it for you.

[01:15:18]

eddytv:

If you have it handy, it might be worth perusing, but definitely don't waste time searching for it

[01:15:54]

sphery:

or, better, read this reply from a guy who's normally here, and whom I trust – http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/464417#464417

[01:17:53]

sphery:

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/473645#473645 has some nice arguments (but hard to tell who knows what they're talking about--so I'd just trust the guys I know from in here)

[01:18:36]

sphery:

nice arguments meaning "tons of people making different claims" (versus "well-thought-out arguments")

[01:18:55]

eddytv:

OK, sounds good. That reply explains the preference for the GT220 over the 210.

[01:19:09]

sphery:

and I think this was the long thread: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/480190#480190

[01:19:20]

sphery:

yeah, and like I said, it's not that great

[01:19:40]

sphery:

the deinterlace capabilities seem very much oversold on those cards

[01:20:24]

sphery:

either that or the people who are gushing about them don't actually pay attention to the TV shows--they just play them and inspect individual pixels

[01:21:36]

eddytv:

haha :) in the photography world, we call those people "pixelpeepers"

[01:22:06]

eddytv:

because they always zoom in and look at everything at 100% and ignore everything else

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sphery:

heh

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kisak:

and you don't look at everything at native resolution?

[01:39:18]

kisak:

I'm going to slam a fanless 7600 GT into that ATi frontend and just brute-force render everything

[01:42:01]

iamlindoro:

Given mark's hard work on the GL renderer of late, it's at least worth a ticket

[01:43:13]

iamlindoro:

Granted, you'll have a much smoother experience with nVidia, but if you open a ticket about a legitimate issue, especially when it comes to video rendering, it's quite likely to get fixed

[01:43:50]

iamlindoro:

just include screenshots, -v playback logs, and --version output, be detailed in your ticket description, and see what happens. Make sure to explain which GPU and which exact versions of video drivers you are using

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wagnerrp:

sphery: why would anyone want to compile with --disable-hdhomerun?

[02:00:17]

iamlindoro:

There are plenty of people who think they should be explicitly deleting anything they don't use, though one wonders what it is they think they gain--- it's not speed or really, disk space

[02:00:25]

sphery:

no idea, but if we have the option, it needs to work

[02:00:33]

sphery:

that said, I'm all for ripping out the option

[02:00:41]

wagnerrp:

yeah, if it doesnt work, we should rip it out

[02:01:17]

sphery:

would mention that to jya, but he's not in channels

[02:01:31]

jya:

I am

[02:01:36]

sphery:

oh, he is

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jya:

I heard "bip, and the icon is bouncing"

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jya:

so here I am

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sphery:

heh, I must have misspelled jy when I tried the autocomplete :)

[02:02:15]

sphery:

we were discussing the --disable-hdhomerun, and is there any particular reason to keep that configure option at all?

[02:02:27]

sphery:

or is it one we could just get rid of?

[02:02:29]

jya:

I have no idea ...

[02:02:58]

jya:

but I did miss using a using_mheg configure option before adding -lmythfreemheg

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Nigel_ is now known as G

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jya:

ausing_hdhomerun for linking with libmythhdhomerun

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sphery:

well, it sounds like you know exactly what the fix is for the --disable-hdhomerun, so we could just fix it for now and discuss whether to rip out the option

[02:04:06]

jya:

yeah, I only needed to added using_hdhomerun: in front of the LIBS += line

[02:04:18]

jya:

at least, that's my guess

[02:04:57]

jya:

I even believe this is only required for macos x build, but as I can't explain why ...

[02:11:44]

sphery:

yeah, it's definitely weird

[02:12:05]

sphery:

I'll admit I don't have a clue what's going on with it :)

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jya:

hum... a new error in mythmusic... wasn't there before

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jya:

pls.cpp: In member function ‘void CfgReader::parse(const char*, int)’:

[02:34:47]

jya:

pls.cpp:88: error: ‘string’ is not a member of ‘std’

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[04:00:35]

sphery:

Beirdo: looks like I'll need to do a git pull and then start a recompile when I go to bed tonight if I want to be able to work on MythTV tomorrow

[04:00:46]

sphery:

Beirdo is the ccache killer!

[04:01:48]

Beirdo:

hehehe

[04:01:51]

Beirdo:

sorry!

[04:02:11]

Beirdo:

I only changed... like 330 files

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sphery:

heh

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Beirdo:

almost all were one-line changes

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Beirdo:

poor ccache

[04:02:57]

Beirdo:

the powerbook will make sure that my apartment doesn't get too cool

[04:03:04]

sphery:

you're just one of these guys who likes to see your name next to every single file in the repo when browsing on github or your cgit or whatever

[04:03:15]

sphery:

you're a file hog

[04:03:16]

Beirdo:

hardly

[04:03:17]

Beirdo:

;)

[04:03:25]

Beirdo:

it just seems that way

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sphery:

heh

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[06:51:01]

slacker-:

Hi guys

[06:51:50]

slacker-:

I'm having some trouble with live tv with my 2nd frontend, which runs remotely from the backend.

[06:51:57]

slacker-:

livetv on the backend works

[06:52:04]

slacker-:

i'm getting this error

[06:52:16]

slacker-:

2011-06–24 16:49:22.517 GetEntryAt(-1) failed.

[06:52:17]

slacker-:

2011-06–24 16:49:22.532 EntryToProgram(0@Thu Jan 1 10:00:00 1970) failed to get pginfo

[06:52:20]

slacker-:

2011-06–24 16:49:22.533 TV Error: HandleStateChange(): LiveTV not successfully started

[06:52:50]

slacker-:

I can watch recordings alright

[06:53:56]

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slacker-:

all asleep?

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[07:05:11]

sphery:

slacker-: and the times are identical on both system (both running ntp, ideally)

[07:06:07]

wagnerrp:

ugh

[07:06:14]

wagnerrp:

ISP changed my internal IP again

[07:06:20]

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[07:09:31]

slacker-:

sphery: times are identical, yes

[07:09:55]

slacker-:

sphery: I rescanned the channels on the backend if that matters

[07:10:12]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: yeah, I noticed the lack of FreeBSD building there :)

[07:10:18]

slacker-:

even fixed the default channel setting for the 2nd frontend

[07:11:17]

wagnerrp:

ive got 6 external addresses, which they map to a 10.180/29, which i then map to various things inside my network

[07:11:24]

slacker-:

I'm only running mythfrontend -v general. maybe i'll increase verbosity a little

[07:11:27]

wagnerrp:

they changed my allotted internal /29

[07:11:39]

wagnerrp:

which screwed up all my firewall configuration

[07:11:49]

Beirdo:

hehe, it would for sure

[07:12:09]

wagnerrp:

especially considering i have no way to know when that is going to happen

[07:12:18]

wagnerrp:

since i must configure each of those addresses manually

[07:15:13]

slacker-:

sphery: this is the GetEntryAt(-1) failed:

[07:15:19]

slacker-:

2011-06–24 17:12:57.698 MSqlQuery::exec(DBManager0) SELECT chanid, starttime, endtime, discontinuity, chainpos, hostprefix, cardtype, channame, input FROM tvchain WHERE chainid = 'live-krikkit-2011-06–24T17:12:56' ORDER BY chainpos; <<<< Returns 0 row(s)

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[07:17:42]

sphery:

slacker-: yeah, that's why I thought the times might disagree

[07:17:47]

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[07:17:56]

sphery:

unfortunately, I don't have a 2nd guess

[07:18:14]

sphery:

I know a couple others have had similar issues on the list, but I haven't seen a fix/workaround/...

[07:20:30]

slacker-:

I synced time against the backend and it adjusted by -0.069421s. see if it made a difference

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[07:21:21]

slacker-:

no :(

[07:21:53]

sphery:

yeah, would have to be seconds or more for time to be the issue

[07:24:19]

slacker-:

any sql digging I can do?

[07:24:24]

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[07:24:47]

slacker-:

should there be anything in the tvchain db when no playback is running?

[07:24:53]

slacker-:

livetv playback

[07:26:30]

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[07:27:10]

slacker-:

sphery: any way I can reset the database for the host?

[07:27:13]

sphery:

you could have stuff there, but it will eventually get cleaned up

[07:27:23]

sphery:

won't hurt new sessions, though

[07:27:39]

slacker-:

hm, tvchain is empty atm

[07:28:07]

sphery:

empty when trying to start live tv?

[07:28:19]

sphery:

if so, the backend may not be starting the recording properly

[07:28:21]

slacker-:

no, this was a manual query

[07:28:39]

slacker-:

just reading back in the logfile to see if it tried putting something in before

[07:28:45]

sphery:

yeah, ideally, it's always empty except when you're watching live t

[07:29:01]

sphery:

but sometimes some garbage gets left behind, but it will eventually be cleaned up

[07:29:12]

sphery:

(within a day)

[07:29:57]

sphery:

technically, if timing works out exactly wrong, it could be as much as 1 day, 3hrs, 59min

[07:30:41]

slacker-:

there is no mention of the tvchain db before that select, so how can it expect to find anything?

[07:30:56]

sphery:

anyway, I'd check the backend log for indicators that recording is failing

[07:31:04]

sphery:

other than that, I'm not sure what to check

[07:32:10]

slacker-:

oh, you're right

[07:32:11]

slacker-:

2011-06–24 17:29:39.758 DVBChan(1:/dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend0) Error: SetChannelByString(7): CheckChannel failed.

[07:33:16]

slacker-:

so it's not the DefaultTVChannel entry in the mythtv settings that needs fixing?

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slacker-:

where do I set the default channel for the frontend? is that in myth-setup as well?

[07:38:51]

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[07:40:19]

slacker-:

uh, that was it

[07:45:50]

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[07:46:24]

slacker-:

Is there any way to encourage the backend to fetch the EIT data for a particular channel? I thought it would just do it if the card has been idle for a minute

[07:46:35]

slacker-:

but it's been hours since I rescanned and it's still missing some

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k-man:

what is the current suggested way to make a rule for recording movies?

[09:44:11]

hashbang:

k-man: "record one showing of this title" works for me.

[09:45:14]

k-man:

I was meaning a generic rule to find and record movies

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stuartm_:

all movies?

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[13:58:47]

eddytv:

Is there any way to have MythVideo "Scan for changes" on a schedule? (Even something I could set up manually to fire off from cron?)

[13:59:48]

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wagnerrp:

why would you need to?

[14:11:54]

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[14:13:56]

stuartm:

surely you'd know when you'd just ripped a DVD?

[14:20:45]

sid3windr:

haha

[14:21:01]

sid3windr:

you guys play sarcasm it so well ;>

[14:21:29]

eddytv:

Why should I have to?

[14:22:09]

wagnerrp:

because it should be a rare operation, and when you do add a dvd, you would want to ensure metadata got added properly

[14:22:14]

sphery:

k-man: You want a Custom/Power Recording Rule. See the frontend Custom Rule editor's example clauses, "Category Type", "Limit movies by the year of release", "Minimum star rating (0.0 to 1.0 for movies only)", "Sci-fi B-movies (complete example)", "Movie of the Week (complete example – use FindWeekly)".

[14:22:56]

eddytv:

It would be much nicer if it was just always up-to-date, automatically. I'd rather have it listed and then be able to correct the metadata rather than forgetting to fire up a front-end and go through the motions of scanning for new content.

[14:22:57]

sphery:

k-man: note, though, that category is provided by your listings provider (and not editable), so you'd have to view your listings to find out what to use (could be film or ..., depending on where you're from)

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[14:23:45]

stuartm:

eddytv: to answer your question, no there is no such mechanism

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[14:25:05]

stuartm:

there was a plan to have mythvideo et al auto-detect additions/changes but that's stalled since the various file monitoring APIs offered under linux aren't actually suitable, they are limited to a very small number of files/directories and therefore unsuitable for our requirements

[14:25:17]

eddytv:

Dang, I was hoping there was something available via MythProtocol and/or MythWeb that could trigger it.

[14:25:45]

eddytv:

Then I could just cURL the appropriate mythweb URL from cron once a night.

[14:25:46]

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[14:25:58]

stuartm:

well if there is, I never heard of it before now

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[15:21:45]

Memphis:

How do I force the scheduler to tape every instance of a show on a certain channel?

[15:21:46]

Memphis:

I'm in Australia; there is a music show "Rage", that is split into a few different segments, back to back, that run for a bout an hour each.

[15:21:46]

Memphis:

Naturally the scheduler only wants to tape the first one, saying the others are duplicates, how can I force the scheduler to tape all occurences of this program?

[15:22:16]

wagnerrp:

so your guide data is incorrect

[15:22:26]

sphery:

Memphis: you can disable duplicate detection if the listings don't provide enough info to distinguish unique episodes

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[15:22:32]

stuartm:

Memphis: "Record at any time on this channel" then under the "Schedule Options", select "Don't Match duplicates" from the duplicate matching list

[15:22:46]

Memphis:

ok

[15:23:08]

wagnerrp:

note that that will disable ALL duplicate detection, so all recordings all the time will be recorded

[15:23:15]

wagnerrp:

even when they are legitimately duplicates

[15:23:30]

Memphis:

wow, that was really simple

[15:23:30]

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[15:23:32]

Memphis:

cheers

[15:23:41]

Memphis:

yeah, not really a problem

[15:23:48]

Memphis:

they don't provide enough guide data to distinguish

[15:24:11]

Memphis:

and for some reason have decided to split it into 3–4 segments. Usually 4–5 hours, followed be a few 1 hour segments

[15:24:19]

Memphis:

even though logically it follows through from start to finish

[15:24:29]

Memphis:

it's just a music videos show

[15:24:33]

Memphis:

so not horribly important

[15:24:42]

Memphis:

but fun to have recorded none the less

[15:25:47]

Memphis:

yeah, it's fixed now

[15:25:53]

Memphis:

got all the upcoming recordings

[15:28:18]

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[15:28:59]

sphery:

great, enjoy!

[15:31:28]

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[15:39:19]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: is there any reason for the application to manage verbose strings directly?

[15:39:27]

wagnerrp:

should that be done directly in the command line parser?

[15:39:28]

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[15:52:46]

eddytv:

Hrm, I just noticed mythbackend crashed on me last night a few seconds after starting a couple recordings. I noticed it while looking at mythweb's "Recorded Programs" — there are two entries with the little "commercial flagging" flag, and the file size column just says "B".

[15:53:24]

wagnerrp:

are you sure the backend crashed, and the recordings didnt just fail?

[15:53:38]

eddytv:

*** glibc detected *** /usr/bin/mythbackend: double free or corruption (!prev): 0x00007ff5d401c430 ***

[15:53:45]

eddytv:

QMYSQLResult::cleanup: unable to free statement handle

[15:53:51]

wagnerrp:

yeah... thats a crash

[15:54:02]

wagnerrp:

have a core dump?

[15:55:13]

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[15:55:28]

eddytv:

where would it store the core file? (Ubuntu 11.04 running the mythbuntu-0.24.1 packages)

[15:55:36]

wagnerrp:

no clue

[15:56:14]

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[15:57:31]

eddytv:

I doubt there's a core — I just checked 'limit' shows 'coredumpsize 0kB'

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[16:24:21]

sphery:

wagnerrp: Can you make anything of: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/483936#483936 ? Is it a similar "backend fails to delete" (maybe because of using CIFS/SMB mounts)?

[16:25:39]

sphery:

eddytv: can set it up to allow cores so you can grab a backtrace next time. You'll want to install debug symbols before getting the backtrace (any distro should have a package for it, assuming you're using packaged builds--otherwise, you'll need to recompile before getting the core): http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Debugging (see, also, the section on core files)

[16:26:45]

wagnerrp:

it would be nice if the user had run with a standard screen width

[16:26:48]

wagnerrp:

so it didnt wrap

[16:27:38]

sphery:

could the wrapping have been from the email client?

[16:28:17]

wagnerrp:

could be

[16:31:32]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: I don't think that the application should be messing with the verbose mask setting at all after startup, except by a "change verbosity" message, which I think we do support

[16:31:44]

sphery:

yeah, we have a proto command for that

[16:31:49]

sphery:

but it only works for the master backend, IIRC

[16:31:54]

sphery:

which makes it less than useful

[16:32:03]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: i mean move the verbosity parsing into the command line parser

[16:32:18]

wagnerrp:

so it is automatically performed if an application requests it

[16:32:24]

wagnerrp:

rather than have the application do it itself

[16:32:33]

Beirdo:

hmmm

[16:32:41]

Beirdo:

I dunno

[16:33:02]

Beirdo:

there's a lot of common code that we do at startup that could be put into a function perhaps

[16:33:09]

Beirdo:

that being just part of it

[16:33:31]

Beirdo:

anyways, I gotta run to the bus stop... I'll be back in a bit

[16:36:31]

sphery:

would be nice if they had some kind of public transportation to take you to the bus stop... save making you run there.

[16:44:22]

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[16:48:45]

sphery:

wagnerrp: In the Python bindings, who's pulling the list of recordings? Is it bindings code or the XML/Services API stuff? Could it be that the problem with running find_orphans.py twice too quickly is just because it's not checking for recorded.deletepending ?

[16:49:12]

wagnerrp:

theres a deletepending?

[16:49:30]

wagnerrp:

shouldnt matter anyway

[16:49:36]

sphery:

ok

[16:49:40]

wagnerrp:

the recording metadata should be deleted near instantly

[16:49:46]

wagnerrp:

the problem is the files that are being deleted

[16:49:54]

sphery:

ah, I see

[16:49:56]

wagnerrp:

even when not using slow deletes

[16:50:05]

sphery:

wasn't sure what race we were having here

[16:50:06]

wagnerrp:

the delete threads block and run at a reduced rate

[16:50:17]

wagnerrp:

they dont all run through instantly

[16:50:17]

sphery:

and, yeah, that makes sense

[16:50:29]

wagnerrp:

15 recordings would take a second or two to process through

[16:50:38]

wagnerrp:

while the file list is returned in a few dozen milliseconds

[16:50:55]

sphery:

second or two... with what magical file system? ;)

[16:50:58]

wagnerrp:

the files still exist, there is still no metadata for them, so they are marked as orphaned

[16:51:05]

wagnerrp:

anything but ext3?

[16:51:08]

sphery:

hehe

[16:52:30]

sphery:

considering doing a commit for you today... recordedfile schema tables (won't actually be using them, but they'd be in place)

[16:53:35]

wagnerrp:

well if theyre not in use, it will at least give me something to experiment with

[16:53:57]

sphery:

right, that's what I figured

[16:54:22]

sphery:

would let you start designing the gallery tables that link gallery metadata to mediafile

[16:55:15]

sphery:

maybe I'll do that and the db initialization rollup (practice run before repeating it just before release)

[17:05:36]

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[17:15:45]

Beirdo:

cool

[17:15:49]

Beirdo:

gallery tables?

[17:16:10]

Beirdo:

I thought we just read the gallery stuff on the fly... certainly not the best way :)

[17:16:18]

wagnerrp:

we do

[17:16:46]

Beirdo:

so you're thinking of caching it as part of the move to putting it into SG on the backend?

[17:16:49]

Beirdo:

cool

[17:17:10]

wagnerrp:

cache it, along with all the EXIF data

[17:17:18]

Beirdo:

sweet

[17:17:58]

Beirdo:

for use with external galleries (which is a future addition), we need to make sure we can display pictures with no metadata as well, but I really like that idea

[17:19:05]

sphery:

and make it usable remotely, too

[17:19:14]

Beirdo:

aye

[17:19:37]

Beirdo:

the gallery hopefully will get some work in the next release cycle

[17:21:09]

sphery:

heh, I'm doing a ccache -C figuring after Beirdo's changes, most of what's there is probably not that useful :)

[17:22:07]

Beirdo:

hehe

[17:22:15]

Beirdo:

rm -rf ~/.ccache

[17:22:16]

Beirdo:

heh

[17:22:20]

Beirdo:

might as well

[17:22:21]

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[17:43:41]

sphery:

Beirdo: heh, I'm down to 1428--was over 1500 a month ago

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[17:44:24]

Beirdo:

wow, you've been watching a few

[17:44:25]

Beirdo:

heh

[17:44:25]

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[17:44:34]

sphery:

granted, going through the complete-series-so-far backlog of The Middle and Modern Family (both half-hour shows) has made it easier to whittle down the number (along with 1.5x timestretch)

[17:45:03]

Beirdo:

I don't do timestretch, and only half-watch while coding usually

[17:45:26]

Beirdo:

and forget to skip the commercials much of the time as I'm hands on on the keyboard

[17:45:28]

sphery:

I've tried to do the half-watch while coding thing, but it always distracts me

[17:45:45]

sphery:

I can only do it on shows I've actually seen (which is why it worked on Jaws a couple weeks ago)

[17:45:46]

Beirdo:

I should archive my many many concerts

[17:46:01]

sphery:

with a concerted effort, you could make that happen!

[17:46:05]

Beirdo:

well, for things like my backlog of Without A Trace...

[17:46:21]

Beirdo:

I can just let it play and only half-follow, and I'm happy

[17:46:43]

sphery:

yeah, I've tried it on some of the "almost-interesting" cancelled shows, but almost is close enough to interesting to distract me

[17:46:58]

sphery:

I'm not good with talking in the background--only music

[17:47:27]

sphery:

(which is much of the reason why I disparage the "Live TV in the background" approach that many people like)

[17:47:39]

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[17:48:02]

sphery:

anyway, 3 computers compiling MythTV... time to get some non-computer stuff done while they work.

[17:48:28]

Beirdo:

nice

[17:48:37]

Beirdo:

oooh, I have a Mariners game tomorrow

[17:48:41]

Beirdo:

I forgot all about it

[17:48:58]

Beirdo:

Mariners vs Marlins (with Marlins as home team, but in Seattle)

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[17:56:26]

Beirdo:

OMG

[17:56:35]

Beirdo:

I bought level 1 ticket for that game?

[17:59:31]

Beirdo:

ahh

[17:59:50]

Beirdo:

that makes more sense. front row, left field bleacher

[18:00:22]

Beirdo:

and I have no glove... will need to be paying attention :)

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[18:23:37]

thecardsmith:

is it possible to use the remote that comes with a hauppauge PVR (version 1212) instead of an MCEUSB remote? or lieu of an MCEUSB remote. Just curious if it's feasible (I'm just sorta in the planning phase of mythtv box)

[18:24:03]

thecardsmith:

of building an* mythtv box

[18:24:14]

wagnerrp:

an mythtv box?

[18:24:18]

Beirdo:

you mean the HDPVR

[18:24:29]

thecardsmith:

you got, an HDPVR

[18:24:34]

thecardsmith:

you got it*

[18:24:44]

thecardsmith:

(I am not officially allowed to type today with all these typos, thanks for the patience)

[18:24:44]

Beirdo:

yes, but it's not really suggested. The HDPVR IR stuff is a bit flaky at times under Linux, IIRC

[18:25:01]

Beirdo:

you're better off with MCEUSB if you want things to be more stable :)

[18:25:11]

thecardsmith:

ok, that's good to know :) any suggestions on a remote that's available on the market / easier to find?

[18:25:22]

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[18:25:30]

Beirdo:

MCEUSB

[18:25:33]

Beirdo:

:)

[18:25:41]

Beirdo:

they are easy to find

[18:25:48]

eddytv:

sphery: I installed 'mythtv-dbg' (from the mythbuntu repos) and reconfigured /etc/security/limits.conf to set the default core dump size to 'unlimited'. So hopefully if the backend crashes again, I'll get a core and a useful backtrace.

[18:26:01]

devinheitmueller:

thecardsmith: how old is your HD-PVR?

[18:26:10]

thecardsmith:

devinheitmueller: i just bought it two days ago

[18:26:12]

JEDIDIAH__:

I have a personal preference for the streamzap remote. they are easy enough to find. mind have to buy mail order though.

[18:26:20]

devinheitmueller:

The IR receiver probably works ok then.

[18:26:41]

thecardsmith:

thanks devinheitmueller — maybe i'll give it a shot before i run off and buy an mceusb remote

[18:26:44]

devinheitmueller:

That said, the mceusb is the "sure thing" answer.

[18:26:44]

Beirdo:

cool, that's been fixed? :) IIRC there were some fun issues with I2C bus, etc.

[18:26:59]

Beirdo:

glad to know it's getting better.

[18:27:32]

devinheitmueller:

Beirdo: it's a tricky problem and I cannot discuss it in too much detail. But put simply, there was a change in the hardware design which should make the IR receiver less likely to have problems.

[18:27:43]

Beirdo:

yeah, with mceusb, you basically have 0 chance of unexpected interactions between your IR receiver and recordings

[18:27:48]

eddytv:

JEDIDIAH__: is the StreamZap Remote MCE-compatible?

[18:27:56]

Beirdo:

devinheitmueller: sweet.

[18:28:07]

thecardsmith:

the last kind of unknowns for me are all IR — blasting and receiving. but i'll find out :) it's been fun to research and get my ducks in a row.

[18:28:27]

devinheitmueller:

Oh, if you want blasting, then an MCEUSB is *way* easier.

[18:28:48]

devinheitmueller:

The HD-PVR blasting does work, but it's much more of a PITA to get configured.

[18:28:50]

Beirdo:

I did use the IR transmitter on my HDPVR for a while too... yeah, much simpler with mceusb, but it is there on the HDPVR :)

[18:28:53]

Beirdo:

aye

[18:29:35]

devinheitmueller:

I'm hoping to improve that situation in the future, but nobody should hold their breath.

[18:29:51]

Beirdo:

I wish you luck :)

[18:29:57]

thecardsmith:

these are good things to know, cause honestly... the seeming price for an mceusb is so low, maybe it's worth the lack of the hassle.

[18:30:02]

sphery:

eddytv: excellent... if you get a crash/backtrace, feel free to mention it here or on the lists and we can take a look at it

[18:30:03]

thecardsmith:

for example... would say: http://tinyurl.com/mceusbtigerdirect work

[18:30:08]

devinheitmueller:

thecardsmith: exactly

[18:30:09]

thecardsmith:

that's a lucky search on good products for mceusb

[18:30:18]

thecardsmith:

google* products

[18:30:34]

devinheitmueller:

My HD-PVR didn't cost me anything, and I was still more than willing to drop $20 and buy an MCEUSB rather than deal with that BS.

[18:31:04]

thecardsmith:

man I am glad I asked before I got deep into the belly of the beast

[18:31:08]

thecardsmith:

thanks guys :)

[18:31:10]

devinheitmueller:

np

[18:33:19]

JEDIDIAH__:

the streamzap doesn't have a blaster and uses it's own driver.

[18:33:34]

eddytv:

ok.

[18:35:00]

eddytv:

Guess I'll stick with the URC-WR7 + USB MCE receiver for now. It's not an ideal layout, but inexpensive, usable, and it's backlit

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[18:37:43]

eddytv:

(I wanted a remote that could control TV volume / power / mute directly, without having to switch "modes" for maximum usability by wife and guests, and the WR7 does that well, as long as they don't hit one of the other device buttons at the top... needs to be on the AUX device to send MCE signals.)

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[18:49:36]

wagnerrp:

why does everyone and their uncle have mythtv install guides?

[18:50:20]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: because of a history of crappy installation experiences and individuals trying to communicate what worked for them in an effort to avoid others having the same problems?

[18:50:34]

DeviceZer0:

very well said

[18:50:35]

DeviceZer0:

lol

[18:50:42]

wagnerrp:

most common distros have a wiki, in addition to the mythtv wiki

[18:50:59]

DeviceZer0:

but there is such a variation in hardware and cards.

[18:51:01]

wagnerrp:

if the users had problems with crappy installation experiences, why not fix the respective wikis

[18:51:11]

DeviceZer0:

i know i keep a "Mythtv.txt" in my Saved folder hehe

[18:51:31]

devinheitmueller:

Sure, but a wiki doesn't adequately describe *my* environment. My particular version of Linux and video card and tuner card and signal type.

[18:51:34]

DeviceZer0:

mine is mainly gibberish to others.

[18:51:35]

wagnerrp:

if there were variations in hardware and cards, mention as such and branch out into individual pages (or better yet, link to pages on the linux tv wiki)

[18:51:55]

DeviceZer0:

straight commands i used for my system and snippets of my own thoughts.

[18:52:05]

devinheitmueller:

It's really hard to normalize that sort of information into a generic form.

[18:52:14]

DeviceZer0:

i agree

[18:52:25]

wagnerrp:

which is why we are left with crappy documentation

[18:52:41]

devinheitmueller:

Just look at the hardware page for most cards. It describes how the user got it to work with a particular kernel version, OS distro, and often contains unrelated info about video cards and other issues.

[18:53:01]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: *good* documentation is nontrivial to create. It requires alot of forethought and a structured approach.

[18:53:12]

wagnerrp:

(no offense to r. rulagowski, whose work goes largely unknown by probably 90% of the user base)

[18:53:26]

devinheitmueller:

It doesn't lend itself well to crowdsourcing unless someone is there orchrestrating the effort.

[18:53:44]

DeviceZer0:

just my 2 cents. Most ppl who are new to mythtv have a very hard time installing it...by the time they get it working they are burnt out and do not feel like spending another hour making a wiki page.

[18:54:04]

DeviceZer0:

and by the time they have motivation too...its not fresh in the memory

[18:54:05]

devinheitmueller:

And most users don't fully understand what information is generic, what is specific to their environment or distro or hardware.

[18:54:26]

sphery:

devinheitmueller: definitely true--but I'll agree that having /wrong/ install guides on random blogs doesn't improve the situation

[18:54:32]

devinheitmueller:

Unless you've installed several different tuners, or several versions of Myth, or have multiple distros, can you really understand what info is "generic".

[18:54:45]

sphery:

i.e. "this worked for me" (but it turns out it will break 95% of installs--possibly in ways that the user won't notice for years)

[18:54:48]

wagnerrp:

if you install from source, yes

[18:55:13]

wagnerrp:

and our wiki documentation is for installing from source

[18:55:17]

sphery:

and, in many cases, it /didn't/ work for the blogger--they just haven't yet seen the results of the ticking timebomb they set

[18:55:24]

wagnerrp:

specific documentation on distros would be on their own wikis

[18:55:42]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: Not necessarily. Sure that's true from a mythtv source perspective, but people are assembling *solutions*, which include hardware, drivers, and other processes like LIRC or other OS provided features.

[18:55:47]

sphery:

I do agree that good documentation is /very/ difficult to create (which is why it's so expensive and so hard to find in any FOSS project)

[18:55:59]

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[18:56:22]

devinheitmueller:

99% of all users will never install Myth from source. Does that mean that the MythTV wiki is useless?

[18:56:25]

devinheitmueller:

;-)

[18:56:39]

wagnerrp:

for about the first half of installation, yes

[18:57:01]

sphery:

and I agree that most users don't understand the architecture, design, system issues, ... well enough to figure out how to document things properly (which is also why there are so many wrong blogs out there)

[18:57:57]

devinheitmueller:

Version drift is definitely a problem. What was valid on some blog two years ago got fixed six months ago and is now completely invalid.

[18:58:17]

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[18:58:28]

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[18:59:30]

sphery:

yeah, and unfortunately, Google still thinks the completely wrong page at http://www.mythpvr.com/mythtv/tips/migrate-recordings.html is the best result for anything involving mythtv, migrate, and/or new server

[18:59:45]

sphery:

and it's about 6 years out of date

[18:59:58]

wagnerrp:

well you do keep linking to it

[19:00:01]

devinheitmueller:

sphery: who owns mythpvr.com? Just change the robots file?

[19:00:03]

sphery:

heh

[19:00:09]

sphery:

it's not our site

[19:00:16]

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[19:00:46]

wagnerrp:

like the front page having a video for mythdora 5?

[19:00:48]

** devinheitmueller issues DDOS takin mythpvr.com offline. **

[19:00:50]

sphery:

unfortunately, google doesn't even see our "migrate" page on our wiki

[19:00:57]

sphery:

and, really, I can't find it myself using our wiki search

[19:01:21]

wagnerrp:

thats back from about the time i started using mythtv

[19:01:39]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, MediaWiki's search in general is pretty crappy. We have the same issue over on LinuxTV.org where you cannot even find articles on particular tuners even by typing in their model number.

[19:01:41]

sphery:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Backend_migration

[19:01:52]

sphery:

any SEO gurus who can help us get that to the top?

[19:02:16]

devinheitmueller:

I've had cases where I had to *really* search in order to find articles that I wrote myself (so I knew ahead of time they existed)

[19:02:30]

sphery:

yeah, I'm not a fan of wikimedia's search

[19:03:00]

sphery:

I usually end up doing a google with site:http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/ after failing with the wiki's search

[19:03:02]

wagnerrp:

sphery: done

[19:03:08]

sphery:

wagnerrp: how did you done it?

[19:03:10]

sphery:

nice

[19:03:40]

sphery:

we need to get them to index on migrate, as well as migration, too

[19:07:25]

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[19:13:04]

sphery:

heh, I shut down one of my systems, and a term with an ssh to a different system got a broadcast "The system is going down for system halt NOW!" message... Couldn't figure out how halting one machine would cause another to halt--then figured out I must have accidentally ssh'ed to the one I was shutting down before ssh'ing to the one that's not shutting down.

[19:14:28]

devinheitmueller:

sphery: Come on, who hasn't typed "rm -rf /" in the wrong terminal window before?

[19:15:25]

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[19:16:05]

sphery:

heh, I did an rm -rf /path/to/dir ** <some other command> when it was supposed to be rm -rf /path/to/dir && <some other command>

[19:16:22]

devinheitmueller:

Also bad.

[19:16:26]

sphery:

lost my entire archive of personal files on my file server (as I was in my home dir)

[19:16:50]

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[19:16:50]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v iamlindoro

[19:16:54]

sphery:

got a few errors about how file ls (or whatever the command was) didn't exist, but it happily did away with the rest

[19:17:12]

sphery:

actually, must not have gotten the errors because of -f

[19:18:09]

sphery:

anyway, * and & were swapped because my right hand lost its home keys and I wasn't actually watching what I typed

[19:18:42]

Slasher`:

is there a recommended list of tv cards?

[19:18:57]

Slasher`:

i may ask for a refund on this one and get a different one if i can find one, rather than faffing waiting for a replacement

[19:19:00]

wagnerrp:

!url tuners

[19:19:00]

MythLogBot:

tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information

[19:19:05]

Slasher`:

thanks

[19:19:22]

wagnerrp:

still trying to do analog standard definition capture?

[19:19:36]

sphery:

So, anyone else actually offended by the Nortel patent sale? IMHO, if a company that owns a patent goes out of business, that patent should become public domain--rather than allowing them to sell it to someone else. After all, patents are supposed to provide a monopoly for the inventor to encourage his innovation.

[19:19:46]

Slasher`:

yeah

[19:19:58]

wagnerrp:

then you want a PVR-150/500

[19:20:04]

wagnerrp:

or a newer hauppauge mpeg encoder card

[19:20:05]

Slasher`:

i got a pvr-150 but we distinguished that the s-video thingy is knackered

[19:20:16]

sphery:

what's the PAL (with SCART) version of HVR-1600?

[19:20:32]

sphery:

it would have the same PVR-150 type encoder, but it's still in production

[19:20:33]

wagnerrp:

1500 i think

[19:21:00]

wagnerrp:

and i believe they use different encoders

[19:21:29]

Slasher`:

1500 seems to be an express card

[19:21:33]

Slasher`:

for laptops

[19:22:00]

sphery:

wonder if there's a better page to link in linuxtv... the "Video via PCI" makes sense, but it links to a page with "Bttv devices", "cx18 devices", etc... which users don't care about

[19:22:25]

sphery:

they just want a higher-level list of "what works and what doesn't, and what standards, etc. are supported by the working cards"

[19:22:31]

Slasher`:

^

[19:22:37]

Slasher`:

that's what i wanted pretty much

[19:22:40]

sphery:

so you need pci?

[19:22:47]

Slasher`:

low profile pci

[19:22:56]

Slasher`:

really limits things doesn't it

[19:23:04]

devinheitmueller:

Correct, HVR-1500 is an expresscard design.

[19:23:05]

sphery:

guess if you go into it via the formats/standards, the list is good

[19:23:09]

sphery:

like click on ATSC cards

[19:23:14]

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[19:23:15]

wagnerrp:

sphery: you mean something like this? http://mythtv.org/wiki/Analog_Hardware_Encoder_Cards?

[19:23:18]

sphery:

(which aren't approprite for you, Slasher` )

[19:23:22]

devinheitmueller:

sphery: Slasher` is in Europe.

[19:23:35]

Slasher`:

UK to be percice

[19:23:38]

Slasher`:

i can't spell that, sorry

[19:23:38]

wagnerrp:

HVR-1300 it seems

[19:23:47]

wagnerrp:

precise?

[19:23:47]

devinheitmueller:

The 1300 isn't low profile

[19:23:51]

sphery:

yeah, just saying that if he chooses whichever standard, he'd get a list of "what works"

[19:24:00]

sphery:

so, DVB-*

[19:24:03]

wagnerrp:

the 2200 is low profile, but doesnt currently work

[19:24:44]

Slasher`:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Analog_Hardware_Encoder_Cards? that list seems better than the other

[19:24:54]

sphery:

http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV-HVR-1300 is the 1300

[19:25:07]

sphery:

DVB-T + analog encoder on PCI

[19:25:20]

sphery:

heh, "# MythTV cannot scan DVB-T channels with this card at all. MythTV developers claim this is a driver bug. "

[19:25:28]

Slasher`:

lol

[19:25:39]

Slasher`:

not overly fussed about DVB

[19:25:50]

Slasher`:

so long as it has s-video/composite in or similar

[19:25:54]

sphery:

at least they ref'ed http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8074

[19:25:56]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, it's a driver bug. A 1300 actually just showed up at my doorstep yesterday.

[19:26:07]

sphery:

ooh, nice

[19:26:22]

Slasher`:

yeah someone got annoyed with it and dumped it there? :P

[19:26:22]

sphery:

so now you just need to get Hauppauge to send you that ticket to London

[19:26:31]

devinheitmueller:

heh.

[19:26:44]

devinheitmueller:

sphery: I have a DVB-T generator under my desk, so no airlline trip needed.

[19:26:50]

sphery:

heh, nice

[19:27:44]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: ive got a DVB-T generator sitting in a drawer somewhere

[19:27:59]

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[19:28:02]

sphery:

I have a VGA card sitting in a drawer

[19:28:07]

sphery:

( http://bellard.org/dvbt/ )

[19:28:09]

wagnerrp:

heh, thats the one

[19:28:11]

devinheitmueller:

The board arrived for an unrelated analog problem, but while I have it I will probably take a look at the DVB-T scanning issue too (and bring up the Zilog as well)

[19:28:21]

wagnerrp:

sphery: i actually have that specific card though

[19:28:29]

wagnerrp:

(or at least did at some point in the past)

[19:28:39]

sphery:

really--that would make it easier

[19:28:42]

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[19:28:55]

sphery:

not that I'd try it even with the same hardware :)

[19:29:15]

devinheitmueller:

The ability to do things like change the target frequency or bandwidth is pretty useful though, and you cannot do that with Bellard's hack.

[19:29:34]

devinheitmueller:

(e.g. if you want to test 6/7/7 MHz bandwidths for example)

[19:29:45]

sphery:

heh, yeah

[19:29:54]

Slasher`:

i have a lifeview flydvb-t card laying around that we distinguished was useless

[19:30:19]

wagnerrp:

sure you can, you just have to acquire his unreleased code and generate a new static image

[19:30:22]

sphery:

and testing with a hack isn't ideal--testing with something that's actually certified to be compliant is a much better idea

[19:30:37]

wagnerrp:

breaking into his system and acquiring his unreleased code is left as an exercise to the user

[19:30:47]

devinheitmueller:

Yup. More than once I've been in a position where I had to question whether the problem was the equipment under test or the testing tool itself.

[19:33:41]

sphery:

wagnerrp: nice page... maybe we need to get Beirdo to add some new links for !analog_encoders ( http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Analog_Hardware_Encoder_Cards ) and !digital_tuners ( http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Digital_Tuner_Cards )

[19:34:16]

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[19:35:32]

devinheitmueller:

Would be nice if it dictated "No" from "n/a"

[19:35:56]

wagnerrp:

what do you mean?

[19:36:03]

devinheitmueller:

For example, the PVR-350 doesn't support component, but thats because the hardware doesn't have it. It's not a limitation of the software or anything.

[19:36:11]

Beirdo:

sphery: email or something or remind me later? :)

[19:36:15]

wagnerrp:

as in, not supported by the drivers, versus not physically available?

[19:36:31]

devinheitmueller:

I would think "No" would be for cases where the hardware supports something, but the software does not for some reason, and "N/A" would be the hardware simply isn't capable of it.

[19:37:06]

devinheitmueller:

I guess part of it is because of the fact that "No" is in red, which suggests "bad", when in fact the hardware simply doesn't provide a certain feature.

[19:37:52]

Beirdo:

devinheitmueller: you need a "is the user a moron" field too, it seems

[19:38:08]

sphery:

oooh, flow charts!

[19:38:15]

devinheitmueller:

The other problem with this organization is that it doesn't handle hybrid cards very well. For example, if I want a tuner that does both analog and digital, which page do I look at?

[19:38:29]

Beirdo:

hehe, true

[19:38:48]

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[19:38:49]

Beirdo:

unless both cross-link, it's hard to say

[19:38:58]

sphery:

devinheitmueller: just do like on CSI, "find all overlaps on these 2 lists"

[19:39:06]

devinheitmueller:

Sure, no problem!

[19:39:23]

wagnerrp:

clickity clickity

[19:39:35]

sphery:

you do have one of those CSI operators actually handling the keyboard/mouse for you, right?

[19:39:38]

sphery:

or is that just me

[19:39:42]

wagnerrp:

mouse? what mouse?

[19:40:02]

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[19:40:05]

wagnerrp:

real CSI people use keyboards and cludgy 'table' interfaces

[19:40:16]

devinheitmueller:

The ATSC is a little better. For example, look at the IR column. The blank fields presumably mean that it simply doesn't have IR, compared to devices where it is present but not supported.

[19:40:19]

Beirdo:

and gestures on touchscreens

[19:40:22]

sphery:

oh, yeah, touch-sensitive MS Surface table and see-through glass display with gesture support

[19:40:36]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: the blank fields mean I didnt know when i populated the table

[19:40:43]

sphery:

anyone else think those see-through glass displays would be annoying

[19:40:52]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, that should *probably* be more explicit, like "unknown".

[19:41:12]

sphery:

oh, then we'll need an "explicit content" warning...

[19:41:14]

Beirdo:

sphery: yeah, no kidding... how are ya supposed to put naughty pics up with that?

[19:41:22]

sphery:

heh

[19:41:23]

devinheitmueller:

I guess it's personal/subjective, but when I see red I think "broken/bad/screwed up"

[19:42:02]

wagnerrp:

id rather have yellow for hardware support, but no driver support

[19:42:04]

sphery:

maybe yellow for "hardware supports it but software/drivers don't"?

[19:42:07]

wagnerrp:

maybe a key at the top of the page?

[19:42:07]

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[19:42:11]

sphery:

too slow, again

[19:42:44]

devinheitmueller:

For the cases where it's unknown, I would probably just have the field "?"

[19:42:59]

devinheitmueller:

That also indicates that information is needed, as opposed to being blank by accident.

[19:43:21]

wagnerrp:

we do have a Template:Unknown for that

[19:43:41]

sphery:

OK, so having replaced all my extremely loud fans and PSUs on my systems, my wake-on-lan isn't so helpful, anymore--I keep walking into the other room to verify it "took"

[19:43:52]

Beirdo:

heheh

[19:44:06]

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[19:44:12]

wagnerrp:

cant ping do that?

[19:44:42]

sphery:

not until it's up and running--you assume I have more patience than I do

[19:44:43]

Beirdo:

in my living room... I have what... 5 computers and 2 laptops running, and it's not QUITE silent, but a lot quieter than you'd expect

[19:44:49]

Beirdo:

oh, plus my firewall

[19:45:07]

Beirdo:

oh, missed one. 6

[19:45:07]

sphery:

ah, but the firewall is only a single atom, so how loud /could/ it be

[19:45:10]

wagnerrp:

sphery: my patience is dictated by my laziness, and the fact the machines are two floors down

[19:45:16]

Beirdo:

it's a dual-core atom :)

[19:45:19]

wagnerrp:

five?

[19:45:28]

sphery:

Beirdo: so that's like a Helium atom?

[19:45:55]

Beirdo:

mythbe, mythfe, freebsd (for fileserver), old devel box, new devel box, new box for GPU coding

[19:45:56]

wagnerrp:

or deuterium

[19:46:10]

sphery:

does a neutron count as a core?

[19:46:10]

wagnerrp:

its positively radiant

[19:46:11]

Beirdo:

they are going to be moved into the office, but aren't there quite yet :)

[19:46:34]

Beirdo:

and then my ripper box in the office, plus another laptop

[19:46:42]

sphery:

I mean, it can't really even push electrons...

[19:46:44]

Beirdo:

I have positively too many dang computers

[19:46:58]

wagnerrp:

clearly you need to virtualize

[19:47:06]

Beirdo:

didn't count the little ARM board connected to the sensors for the kegerator either

[19:47:15]

wagnerrp:

stuff everything onto that Atom

[19:47:25]

wagnerrp:

if you use virtual machines, it can handle it

[19:47:28]

Beirdo:

hehe, don't tempt me (not on the atom)

[19:47:37]

sphery:

Beirdo: I actually have 9 computers set up + 1 laptop, but I spread them out to random rooms in the house for the air conditioning

[19:47:48]

Beirdo:

I can't afford VMWare ESX for home, thanks

[19:47:51]

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[19:47:57]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: well freebsd for a test/build box is one of my acceptable uses of VMs

[19:47:59]

sphery:

though it's a single-story, so easy enough to walk room to room

[19:48:29]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: oh? but we have a bunch of users who seem to manage to get their hands on a copy

[19:48:33]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: yeah, test/build/packaging is a good use for virtualization at the home level

[19:49:01]

Beirdo:

I've considered running KVM on the new devel box

[19:49:13]

Beirdo:

Core2 Duo at 2.66GHz currently

[19:49:22]

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[19:49:43]

Beirdo:

get me more buildserver capability, testing various distros or whatever

[19:51:20]

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[19:52:19]

Captain_Murdoch:

Beirdo, what's not to afford about ESXi? It's 'free' and can be run indefinitely with a free downloadable license.

[19:52:44]

sphery:

wagnerrp: with mythwikiscripts, I got, "Loading took 62.95 seconds" but never got the: print "This script parses the wiki, and may take several minutes." Any ideas what could cause that?

[19:52:46]

Beirdo:

Hmm, maybe it was another of their setups I was thinking of

[19:52:59]

wagnerrp:

sphery: old version?

[19:53:40]

jams:

esxi isn't free. They changed the name of the free version to vsphere hypervisor

[19:53:46]

sphery:

wagnerrp: that would be it... now why isn't it installing the new one correctly

[19:54:08]

jams:

esxi is now the embedded version..and esx is on it's way out the door in the near future

[19:54:26]

sphery:

wagnerrp: ah, it's sticking it in the wrond dir

[19:54:44]

wagnerrp:

it should be sticking it in ~/bin/

[19:54:47]

sphery:

putting it in /usr, even though mythtv is in /usr/local (but python itself /is/ in /usr...)

[19:55:01]

wagnerrp:

oh, the build script

[19:55:03]

sphery:

yeah

[19:55:06]

Captain_Murdoch:

jams, it's the same code, just a different license.

[19:55:09]

wagnerrp:

odd

[19:55:11]

sphery:

I really don't know which to consider correct

[19:55:16]

Beirdo:

jams: ahhh, that's it

[19:55:29]

sphery:

my python is /usr, so python eggs(?) go there, but mythtv is in /usr/local...

[19:55:46]

Beirdo:

I coulda asked them at the USENIX conference, but I didn't bother... just took their schwag and went to the sessions

[19:55:48]

jams:

oh i know..but you get yelled at by the vmware folks if you say esxi is the free version. While that was the case it's not anymore as they shuffled the names around

[19:55:57]

Captain_Murdoch:

and esx never had a freely downloadable license. that started with esxi.

[19:56:03]

Captain_Murdoch:

yeah, them and their names. :)

[19:56:21]

jams:

they even put crap on the vcp test

[19:56:22]

wagnerrp:

how dare you not keep up to date with our marketing department!

[19:56:32]

Beirdo:

anyways, if I were to use their stuff at home, I'd still want the bare-metal hypervisor

[19:56:42]

** Captain_Murdoch was waiting for the next name change with 5.x. **

[19:57:14]

Captain_Murdoch:

Beirdo, that's the one that's free. the old 'server' wasn't bare metal and it was also 'free'.

[19:57:19]

sphery:

but esxi would be es 11, right?

[19:57:44]

Captain_Murdoch:

www.vmware.com/go/get-free-esxi

[19:57:55]

jams:

Was never really impressed with vmware-server. workstation outclassed it in just about every respects (other then the price)

[19:58:59]

Beirdo:

I think I'll mostly stick with KVM

[19:59:46]

Beirdo:

work is planning on doing both

[20:00:07]

Beirdo:

vmware esx of some sorts for the windows side, KVM for the Linux side

[20:00:36]

jams:

why the split?

[20:00:41]

Beirdo:

I should get them to "donate" a chassis full of blades for my home use

[20:00:46]

Beirdo:

support

[20:01:03]

jams:

i see

[20:01:08]

Beirdo:

not my idea, but they want someone to point the finger to when the windows crap goes sideways, I guess

[20:01:21]

jams:

if your buying esx, might as well use it for all the vm's

[20:01:28]

Beirdo:

meh

[20:01:39]

Beirdo:

then it comes down to cost

[20:01:50]

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[20:01:54]

jams:

true

[20:01:55]

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[20:02:03]

Beirdo:

I dunno, I'm not involved with the planning on that ;)

[20:02:48]

Captain_Murdoch:

unless KVM gives you centralized management that you have to pay for with vSphere vCenter, then it has the same cost as vSphere Hypervisor on the free license.

[20:03:26]

** Captain_Murdoch doesn't like the fact that the don't have a low-end 'just for central management' license anymore. **

[20:03:59]

jams:

least they got rid of the license server!

[20:04:43]

jams:

well got rid of the stand-alone LS..they just moved it to vsphere

[20:05:25]

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[20:06:51]

Captain_Murdoch:

yeah, I wasn't a fan of the previous license server design.

[20:07:19]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I love the new mythwikiscripts

[20:07:58]

jams:

flexlm should be avoided any time it's possible

[20:07:59]

wagnerrp:

i still need to fix an issue with the caching

[20:20:23]

skd5aner:

wagnerrp: I've finally had time to update the 0.24.1 wiki page, I think it can be locked now

[20:20:41]

skd5aner:

wagnerrp: it should be up to date with all changes that make up that release

[20:22:01]

sphery:

nice work

[20:22:29]

wagnerrp:

ok, will do

[20:22:30]

wagnerrp:

thanks

[20:25:05]

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[20:33:13]

stuartm:

just when I started to think that the US really were producing really good quality TV, we suddenly have a series like Castle inflicted upon us, wtf?

[20:33:30]

sphery:

what? I'm loving Castle

[20:33:40]

wagnerrp:

i assume hes being sarcastic

[20:33:56]

wagnerrp:

as in most of the crap coming out of the US recently has been worthless tripe

[20:34:05]

sphery:

of course, I may be blinded to reality by Stana Katic...

[20:34:42]

sphery:

I lost the season premiere and ep 2 of this season in my great HDD crash... trying to decide whether to wait to see if they re-air this summer or to just push ahead

[20:35:09]

Shadow__X:

wagnerrp: i have to say thanks about mentioning zfs and raidz a while back

[20:35:16]

JEDIDIAH__:

Sturgeons Law always applies

[20:35:21]

stuartm:

Murder She Wrote for a new decade

[20:35:32]

sphery:

if it weren't the season premiere, I'd just press on, but since it needs to fix the cliffhanger from season finale...

[20:35:53]

sphery:

stuartm: heh, but did Angela Lansbury ever dress up as a space cowboy for Halloween?

[20:36:40]

JEDIDIAH__:

she probably dressed in some goofy outfit that was goofy in a gender corresponding way.

[20:36:53]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: well it's not all been that bad, there have been some rough gems, but Castle is clearly not aimed at me – awful premise, dire dialogue and plots that you'd really only find in fiction

[20:37:00]

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[20:37:30]

JEDIDIAH__:

truth is strange than fiction... much stranger.

[20:37:39]

stuartm:

if it helps, I really hate CSI etc as well

[20:38:04]

JEDIDIAH__:

isn't csi just a bad copy of a tired idea that was beaten to death before csi ever aired?

[20:38:06]

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[20:38:35]

wagnerrp:

JEDIDIAH__: but they enhanced it

[20:38:36]

stuartm:

I think I've been spoilt by stuff like The Wire :(

[20:38:51]

JEDIDIAH__:

with "electrolytes"

[20:39:28]

sphery:

it's what plants crave

[20:39:28]

wagnerrp:

actually, i was referring to their ridiculous ability to enhance photos and video

[20:39:43]

sphery:

which tired idea did csi come from?

[20:40:02]

JEDIDIAH__:

that idea is nothing new or particular to CSI.

[20:40:09]

JEDIDIAH__:

Isn't CSI just juiced up law & order?

[20:40:31]

wagnerrp:

law and order is the cops, and to a lesser extent the lawyers, doing investigation

[20:40:39]

sphery:

JEDIDIAH__: heh, I was wondering if you meant that one

[20:40:40]

wagnerrp:

csi is the forensics people doing the investigation

[20:41:02]

sphery:

wagnerrp: and, in Miami, especially, doing the policing

[20:41:16]

wagnerrp:

yeah, i dont get miami

[20:41:17]

sphery:

they do the raids and all...

[20:41:21]

JEDIDIAH__:

oh noes?! It's a pathologist with a gun!

[20:41:28]

sphery:

heh

[20:41:36]

wagnerrp:

the trained people you have in the lab are not the people you want out in the line of fire

[20:41:58]

JEDIDIAH__:

yup

[20:42:09]

wagnerrp:

especially if their vision is hindered by sunglasses

[20:42:52]

sphery:

yeah, at least on Flash Point, they /just/ do raids

[20:42:53]

stuartm:

btw, do scientists in the US _really_ perform the duties of detectives? Including carrying badges, guns and carrying out arrests?

[20:43:10]

wagnerrp:

theyre also not the people you have doing interviews/interrogations

[20:43:20]

wagnerrp:

stuartm: nope, lab techs stay in the lab

[20:43:31]

wagnerrp:

or perhaps go to crime scenes under guard from police

[20:43:45]

sphery:

right--after they've been cleared, they'd show up to do collections

[20:43:48]

stuartm:

right, so the same as everywhere else in the world then

[20:44:02]

wagnerrp:

and there really arent such large volumes of lab techs that they have multiple dedicated to a single case for several days

[20:44:47]

sphery:

or a huge glass building that houses only the lab

[20:45:30]

wagnerrp:

hey now, every geek wants to be put on display in a glass cubicle

[20:45:43]

sphery:

I guess the reason I like Castle (and why I still watch CSI) is because TV is my escape from reality--I /want/ it to be completely unreal

[20:45:59]

sphery:

well, not as unreal as reality TV, but unreal scripted

[20:46:19]

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[20:47:19]

kormoc:

Now, there are the front line scientists that do field work, but they only go in after the scene has been cleared/etc

[20:48:07]

stuartm:

sphery: yeah, I guess I just can't suspend my disbelief to the extent that I'll overlook something that is so completely unrealistic – I like at least some realism to anchor the story

[20:49:08]

wagnerrp:

how come the medical examiners never have guns?

[20:49:25]

stuartm:

fwiw, I did enjoy Flashpoint, it was fun and since I've no idea how a real SWAT unit operates the lack of realism didn't matter so much

[20:49:25]

wagnerrp:

doesnt A&E have some show where the medical examiners solve the crimes?

[20:49:52]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: Quincy?

[20:49:58]

wagnerrp:

could be

[20:50:01]

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[20:50:22]

wagnerrp:

no, theres a much more recent one

[20:50:24]

sphery:

stuartm: yeah, it does seem the Flashpoint is more realistic than most of the US dramas

[20:50:26]

wagnerrp:

like 2000s

[20:50:36]

stuartm:

sphery: it's Canadian, no?

[20:50:41]

wagnerrp:

yes

[20:51:01]

stuartm:

ok, just checking that we're not talking about a US remake of the Canadian series :)

[20:51:06]

sphery:

stuartm: and I think it's my lack of knowledge of SWAT that allows me to enjoy it in spite of the fact that it's not so far removed from reality

[20:51:25]

wagnerrp:

until they start to get into the character back stories

[20:51:39]

sphery:

so I guess choosing a topic that no one knows about is a great way to get the "likes to keep it real" and the "needs the escape" people to both enjoy the show :)

[20:52:14]

sphery:

wagnerrp: thinking of Body of Proof (but that's ABC, I think)

[20:52:32]

wagnerrp:

no, this is a couple years old

[20:52:35]

sphery:

haven't started watching it, but I know it's centered on a medical examiner

[20:52:45]

wagnerrp:

A&E may have gotten it in syndication

[20:52:45]

stuartm:

there was a similar US series about hostage negotiators + swat, it wasn't too bad but IIRC it was cancelled or something

[20:53:29]

sphery:

stuartm: Standoff?

[20:53:33]

sphery:

that was a pretty good show

[20:53:48]

sphery:

I like Ron Livingston, though

[20:53:48]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: the other one which comes to mind is Crossing Jordan, I've only seen a handful of episodes of that

[20:54:14]

wagnerrp:

stuartm: yeah, thats the one

[20:54:21]

JEDIDIAH__:

if you know anything about it, chances are that you can't watch it on TV or the news because writers and journalists get everything wrong.

[20:54:32]

sphery:

heh, there was a 1976 tv series called S.W.A.T., and now A&E has a TV series called S.W.A.T.

[20:54:46]

JEDIDIAH__:

You're either SWAT or you're not...

[20:54:47]

stuartm:

sphery: aye, that was it, I preferred Rosemarie DeWitt if I'm honest ;)

[20:55:14]

sphery:

heh, yeah, she's a good actress, too

[20:55:30]

stuartm:

JEDIDIAH__: that tagline makes it sound like a street gang ;)

[20:55:52]

sphery:

Ron Livingston just always reminds me of Office Space

[20:55:55]

JEDIDIAH__:

I don't think that comparison is a bad one really...

[20:56:04]

sphery:

(which didn't really help him sell the character in Defying Gravity)

[20:56:33]

stuartm:

Defying Gravity had issues, but I'd still have liked to see where it was going :(

[20:57:07]

sphery:

yeah... it was good--and I think the network made a good decision to not air the final couple episodes (where they stopped made a better end than the last episode)

[20:57:57]

sphery:

stuartm: this is a good read if you enjoyed Defying Gravity: http://cliqueclack.com/tv/2009/10/29/how-defy . . . the-creator/

[20:58:17]

sphery:

plus the linked http://cliqueclack.com/tv/2010/10/28/how-defy . . . nal-chapter/

[20:58:47]

sphery:

though I'd rather have seen it on screen :)

[20:59:02]

wagnerrp:

uh oh... there are zombies just south of me

[20:59:08]

wagnerrp:

http://www.local12.com/News/Local/story/Sign- . . . Yd_RAMw.cspx

[20:59:36]

sphery:

wow

[21:00:19]

kormoc:

You guys have a much better EZWS (Early Zombie Warning System) then we do in WA

[21:04:33]

jams:

wagnerrp, kormoc any thought on how the smolt data for audio and database will be used/reported on?

[21:05:01]

wagnerrp:

id ask jya about the audio stuff

[21:05:12]

jams:

I'm calling out those two specificly because the data isn't a single value

[21:05:25]

jams:

k

[21:05:41]

wagnerrp:

database, i would just do what percentages are running what verion

[21:05:49]

wagnerrp:

and what percentages have what database engines installed

[21:06:27]

jams:

ok

[21:07:18]

jams:

i did some rewriting of the client to be it's own "distro" like gentoo. Now i'm working on the server side bit

[21:07:21]

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[21:51:34]

momelod:

greetings channel

[21:53:34]

momelod:

I'm experiencing a problem with mythtv running under compiz. Not sure what its called but when the picture is panning i see streaks across the screen. for example during a pan the top most part of the picture seems to pan ever so slightly faster than the bottom part of the screen. this causes a line or streak in the picture

[21:53:52]

wagnerrp:

tearing

[21:53:58]

momelod:

thank you

[21:54:03]

momelod:

is this common?

[21:54:13]

wagnerrp:

its because the video framebuffer is being updated at the same time as it is being pushed to the display

[21:54:31]

momelod:

is it fixable ?

[21:54:32]

wagnerrp:

so have of the video is on the next frame, while half is still on the previous

[21:54:46]

wagnerrp:

usually fixed by enabling opengl v-sync

[21:55:19]

wagnerrp:

but since compiz decouples opengl from the card and output, it tends to cause problems

[21:55:25]

wagnerrp:

why are you running mythtv under compiz?

[21:55:49]

momelod:

i use the cube to switch between the front-end, a browser, my music player..

[21:55:57]

wagnerrp:

the cube....

[21:56:05]

momelod:

compiz cube

[21:56:08]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: compiz animation

[21:56:12]

momelod:

workspace switcher

[21:56:13]

wagnerrp:

yes yes... inknow

[21:56:31]

wagnerrp:

when alt-tab just isnt flashy enough

[21:57:09]

momelod:

thats a whole other issue.. i have a remote with no alt-tab

[21:57:29]

wagnerrp:

and yet your remote has a 'spin on a box' button?

[21:57:42]

momelod:

it has a windows-super key, and a right left key.

[21:58:47]

stuartm:

if only there were web browsing or music playing plugins for mythfrontend

[21:59:03]

momelod:

and yeah, as lame as it sounds i like the flash. especially when showing off myth to windows-media users.

[21:59:15]

momelod:

stuartm, agreed.

[21:59:24]

stuartm:

momelod: the problem here is compiz, I don't know of any workarounds, the usual answer is 'stop using compiz'

[21:59:30]

momelod:

usable ones anyways.

[22:00:02]

stuartm:

heh, mythmusic may not be pretty but I wouldn't call it unusable

[22:00:02]

wagnerrp:

they are both perfectly usable, if perhaps mythmusic could use a ui revamp

[22:00:18]

momelod:

stuartm, when i switch to metacity the picture is much clearer and i don't see tearing. but the picture stutters/freezes every few seconds..

[22:00:59]

momelod:

wagnerrp, agreed. I wish someone would write a mythplugin to control an mpd backend.

[22:01:38]

wagnerrp:

why control mpd, rather than just use an internal player?

[22:01:51]

wagnerrp:

the only purpose to connecting to mpd is if you want to control some remote device

[22:02:26]

momelod:

yes, exactly and to be able to control the music from your phone for example.

[22:02:31]

momelod:

or a webfrontend

[22:02:38]

momelod:

its just more flexible

[22:02:44]

wagnerrp:

so why not mythmusic the backend

[22:02:54]

momelod:

u can install mpd on either your myth-frontend or backend

[22:02:58]

wagnerrp:

and add an mpd-like interface so other mpd frontends could access it

[22:03:11]

momelod:

why reinvent the wheel?

[22:03:32]

momelod:

it also lets u have it on a remote device as you said. its more flexible

[22:03:51]

wagnerrp:

the remote device would be... another pc sitting somewhere

[22:04:03]

wagnerrp:

but you already have that PC connected to your tv and stereo system

[22:04:12]

momelod:

sure, connected to another speaker system if u wanted..

[22:04:15]

wagnerrp:

so why bother having two pcs connected to that hardware

[22:04:21]

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[22:04:34]

momelod:

u may want to watch tv, and play music someplace else..

[22:04:49]

momelod:

through a different reciever..

[22:04:56]

wagnerrp:

so you would want it for multi-zone capability

[22:05:01]

momelod:

yes

[22:05:32]

momelod:

the beauty is it can go either way. its the flexibility i like.

[22:06:18]

wagnerrp:

does MPD support http streams?

[22:06:28]

momelod:

yes, both in and out

[22:06:47]

momelod:

stream from the net, or stream out and create your own station.

[22:07:02]

momelod:

its very full featured and light weight.

[22:07:03]

wagnerrp:

well this would be... streams from the backend for remote access to music

[22:07:18]

wagnerrp:

since the frontend would not have file access

[22:07:29]

wagnerrp:

and would instead be expected to access music over mythproto

[22:07:38]

momelod:

the mpd daemon runs on wherever u have your music files.

[22:07:53]

wagnerrp:

no, the mpd daemon runs on whereever you PLAY your music files

[22:08:01]

wagnerrp:

as does the frontend

[22:08:04]

momelod:

that's the mpc

[22:08:15]

momelod:

mpc is the client or frotnend to mpd the daemon

[22:08:21]

wagnerrp:

i thought the mpc was the thing to control playback on the mpd

[22:08:27]

momelod:

it is

[22:08:33]

momelod:

but the music lives on the mpd server..

[22:08:38]

momelod:

streams to the mpc client

[22:08:47]

momelod:

its very slick, check it out

[22:09:07]

wagnerrp:

now im completely confused

[22:09:15]

wagnerrp:

i thought mpd was just a network controlled media player

[22:09:29]

momelod:

it is, with the capability to stream to remote clients

[22:09:39]

momelod:

or u can play to your local sound card..

[22:09:43]

momelod:

either way.

[22:10:01]

wagnerrp:

in any case, we would not use mpd

[22:10:06]

momelod:

:(

[22:10:20]

wagnerrp:

at closest, we would implement its language to allow mpc clients to interface with it

[22:10:34]

momelod:

u can control it over telnet..

[22:11:00]

wagnerrp:

so it cant handle files with unicode characters?

[22:11:43]

momelod:

that's over my head. it can handle anything u have libs for.. mp3, ogg, flac..

[22:11:52]

wagnerrp:

the filenames

[22:12:00]

wagnerrp:

it cant handle anything with unicode characters

[22:12:12]

wagnerrp:

like umlauts, or accented characters

[22:12:17]

momelod:

gimme a filename. ill rename an mp3 and try it if u like

[22:12:20]

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[22:12:35]

wagnerrp:

it you interface using telnet, telnet is an ascii protocol

[22:12:42]

wagnerrp:

meaning you can only use characters <127

[22:12:51]

wagnerrp:

no extended ascii, no unicode

[22:12:54]

momelod:

*if* your using telnet..

[22:13:26]

wagnerrp:

or is it not actually telnet, but rather a raw socket text interface

[22:13:41]

wagnerrp:

superficially similar to telnet, but without the control codes

[22:14:59]

momelod:

again, to technical for me. sorry.

[22:17:33]

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[22:21:38]

momelod:

wagnerrp, i should say i wouldn't be apposed to improving the existing myth-music plug either.

[22:22:02]

wagnerrp:

well basically, mythtv is in the process of migrating everything over to storage groups

[22:22:19]

wagnerrp:

where the backend manages all storage of video, recordings, music, photos

[22:22:23]

wagnerrp:

and streams it to the frontend

[22:22:33]

wagnerrp:

there are already protocols set up to handle it

[22:22:46]

wagnerrp:

and switching music over to mpd instead would just throw a wrench in the works

[22:22:59]

wagnerrp:

which is why i said we would not do it

[22:23:11]

wagnerrp:

however, implementing the control scheme in the frontend/backend

[22:23:38]

wagnerrp:

to allow mpd clients to control playback on the frontend, or stream content from the backend, would be perfectly workable

[22:24:22]

momelod:

if i could still use mpDroid to control music i would be happy as a pig in sh*t.

[22:24:50]

momelod:

mpdriod is an andriod mpc

[22:24:57]

wagnerrp:

right

[22:27:35]

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[22:30:17]

wagnerrp:

there is apparently this... https://github.com/mackers/mythmpd

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[22:35:26]

momelod:

awesome. ill try it out.

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[23:26:18]

Dassu:

Has anyone here tried to play h264 720p with p4 3Ghz. If so, was the playback smooth?

[23:26:30]

wagnerrp:

can say

[23:26:38]

wagnerrp:

need more information than '720p' provides

[23:27:07]

wagnerrp:

my 1GHz P3 laptop will play '720p h264' smoothly if i want it to

[23:27:24]

wagnerrp:

s/can/cant/

[23:29:12]

Dassu:

Well, let's say 24.00 FPS and default mythtv settings (ffh264 as a codec)

[23:29:36]

sphery:

what bitrate?

[23:29:40]

wagnerrp:

24fps is a framerate, not what im looking for

[23:29:57]

wagnerrp:

bitrates, cabac/cablc, macroblock structures

[23:30:26]

wagnerrp:

considering this is 24fps content, that means its not a DVB recording

[23:30:48]

wagnerrp:

and since bluray and hddvd content doesnt come in 720p

[23:31:03]

wagnerrp:

that means you almost certainly encoded it

[23:36:21]

Dassu:

4457 kbps as bitrate

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[23:37:00]

wagnerrp:

you should be fine

[23:37:17]

Dassu:

ok, thanks

[23:37:48]

wagnerrp:

i would expect that to top out closer to 7mpbs CABAC, or maybe 10mbps CAVLC

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[23:56:22]

Twiggy2cents:

If I wanted to upgrade to .25 when it is official but didnt want to upgrade distros, If I uninstall mythtv does my database stay intact? If so, will building from source update the schema to the current?

[23:56:39]

wagnerrp:

that depends entirely on your distro

[23:56:52]

wagnerrp:

although ive not seen a package manager that deletes user defined content when it deletes packages

[23:56:54]

Twiggy2cents:

The be is ubuntu

[23:57:32]

wagnerrp:

note that it is generally not considered safe to do binary migration of mysql databases

[23:57:38]

wagnerrp:

minor versions are usually fine

[23:57:48]

wagnerrp:

but major versions, or across different architectures

[23:57:54]

wagnerrp:

youre looking for trouble

[23:58:00]

Twiggy2cents:

How do you safely upgrade then?

[23:58:12]

Twiggy2cents:

I did it a while back but I dont remember what I did to keep the db

[23:58:20]

wagnerrp:

if youre just upgrading mythtv

[23:58:23]

wagnerrp:

then it doesnt matter

[23:58:27]

Twiggy2cents:

major upgrade

[23:58:29]

wagnerrp:

because mythtv and mysql are completely independent

[23:58:49]

wagnerrp:

if youre upgrading the whole thing, do a backup to a text file, and then restore afterwards

[23:59:07]

Twiggy2cents:

so you are saying export and import?

[23:59:29]

wagnerrp:

if you want to use those terms instead

[23:59:45]

Twiggy2cents:

llol

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