| Tuesday, June 21st, 2011, 00:00 UTC | ||
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| [00:48:19] | Beirdo: | bah and also.. humbug |
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| [00:50:24] | iamlindoro: | That's the spirit |
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| [00:51:09] | Beirdo: | almost 6pm, and I'm still at work... and the one task I needed to do today I can't because the person who needs to show me the process... is sick. |
| [00:51:12] | Beirdo: | wunderbar |
| [00:54:09] | Beirdo: | Oooh, I think I just found the process on the internal wiki. sweet. |
| [00:55:42] | wagnerrp: | kormoc_afk: been drinking the moby again? |
| [00:55:59] | wagnerrp: | you know what happened last time |
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| [01:25:26] | Twiggy2cents: | how come on my ps3, all my myth music shows up as unsupported? |
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| [01:25:52] | Twiggy2cents: | its mp3 btw |
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| [01:35:07] | wagnerrp: | is the content accessible by your backend? |
| [01:36:28] | Twiggy2cents: | hmmm |
| [01:36:30] | Twiggy2cents: | Well |
| [01:37:04] | Twiggy2cents: | It is stored on the frontend, but it shows a huge long list on the upnp. I just added the music to my frontends mythmusic |
| [01:37:16] | wagnerrp: | the list comes from the database |
| [01:37:27] | wagnerrp: | but if the backend cannot access the music where the database says it will be |
| [01:37:36] | wagnerrp: | then it cannot stream it to the PS3 over UPNP |
| [01:37:46] | wagnerrp: | and your content will be 'unsupported' |
| [01:37:52] | Twiggy2cents: | I tried setting up a media server on my frontend and I cant seem to get that to work right either. It shows folders of music but no music(that is with gmediaserver though) |
| [01:38:12] | wagnerrp: | we dont support gmediaserver |
| [01:38:30] | Twiggy2cents: | Okay so I have permission stuff. I know, but I thought they might be related until you cleared that up for me |
| [01:38:42] | Twiggy2cents: | they being the concern |
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| [01:42:37] | Twiggy2cents: | how would I go about letting the backend access the music? |
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| [01:45:10] | wagnerrp: | move the music to the backend |
| [01:45:51] | Twiggy2cents: | hmm is that the only option? |
| [01:45:55] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: surely he wants to record ALL of dvb |
| [01:46:13] | wagnerrp: | thats the sensible option |
| [01:46:43] | Twiggy2cents: | damn junky mythtv. It is so unrefined. I want my DVR to do everything! |
| [01:46:51] | Twiggy2cents: | Just in case.... That was sarcasm |
| [01:47:08] | wagnerrp: | well once we get mythmusic migrated over to storage groups, and you run mythmediaserver on your frontend |
| [01:47:14] | wagnerrp: | it will work how you want |
| [01:47:32] | Twiggy2cents: | Awesome |
| [01:48:10] | Twiggy2cents: | Truth be told, I dont really care. Its just the fact that I have the option so I really want it. I mean, my fe is connected to the same tv as the ps3.. |
| [01:48:38] | Twiggy2cents: | The ps3 recording playback sucks compared to myth. Where is the comm skip button! |
| [01:48:51] | wagnerrp: | L4 and L4 |
| [01:49:08] | Twiggy2cents: | It isnt commercial skip is it? |
| [01:49:12] | wagnerrp: | sure |
| [01:49:14] | Twiggy2cents: | Wait is L4 even a button? |
| [01:49:19] | Twiggy2cents: | heh I think I get it |
| [01:49:26] | wagnerrp: | you trigger those by blinking left or right |
| [01:49:51] | Twiggy2cents: | Man... I need the ps eye add on |
| [01:51:03] | Twiggy2cents: | Does anybody actually use the arcade add on? |
| [01:51:10] | wagnerrp: | arcade? |
| [01:51:15] | Twiggy2cents: | mame? |
| [01:51:17] | Twiggy2cents: | The games |
| [01:51:22] | wagnerrp: | mythgame? |
| [01:51:26] | Twiggy2cents: | yeah |
| [01:51:34] | wagnerrp: | yeah, a handful |
| [01:51:48] | wagnerrp: | theres people popping up every few months wanting help getting it working |
| [01:52:30] | Twiggy2cents: | Really, pretty soon myth* will be a fragmented term with all the options and addons that you guys put in |
| [01:52:47] | wagnerrp: | pretty soon it will be much less fragmented |
| [01:53:00] | wagnerrp: | mythvideo is now core functionality |
| [01:53:16] | wagnerrp: | with music, gallery, and maybe browser to follow suit |
| [01:53:50] | wagnerrp: | were branching out into mythbackbend, mythrecorder, mythmediaserver, mythjobqueue, myth--- |
| [01:53:54] | wagnerrp: | but you wont actually run those |
| [01:54:01] | wagnerrp: | you run a management daemon |
| [01:54:07] | Twiggy2cents: | Is that considered good? For example what if I didnt want the myth music, gallery, or the browser. Would I have the option to remove the options from the frontend? |
| [01:54:15] | wagnerrp: | which then decides based off database configuration what further applications to run |
| [01:54:21] | wagnerrp: | sure, you edit the menu xml |
| [01:54:46] | Twiggy2cents: | So it I dont see it, it's not there? :) |
| [01:55:02] | wagnerrp: | out of sight, out of mind |
| [01:55:55] | Twiggy2cents: | Not that they take up any room or resources. I dont mind all the extra options. I use them for impressing people when I show them my open source dvr that costs $20 a year. |
| [01:56:51] | Twiggy2cents: | I never use anything but the recordings and videos. Myth music needs an overhaul on the gui(I think) it is too hidden and primitive |
| [01:57:06] | wagnerrp: | it hasnt yet been updated to the new mythui |
| [01:57:16] | wagnerrp: | although one of the devs has been working on a rewrite for some time |
| [01:57:52] | Twiggy2cents: | mythmusic has been a wip for a long time hasnt it? |
| [01:58:08] | Twiggy2cents: | Moreso than the rest of the actively developed myth |
| [01:58:09] | JEDIDIAH__: | after having actually used an Apple TV rather than just hacking it and running Linux on it, I am far less criticial of mythmusic. |
| [02:10:43] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot | |
| [02:10:43] | wagnerrp: | were deciding that currently |
| [02:10:43] | Twiggy2cents: | OTA signals ftw! |
| [02:10:45] | k-man: | wagnerrp: deciding how its coming along? |
| [02:11:14] | wagnerrp: | deciding what we want included in 0.25, so we can figure out how long it will take for us to get there |
| [02:11:22] | k-man: | ah i see |
| [02:11:36] | wagnerrp: | there are several ambitious projects in the works |
| [02:11:42] | wagnerrp: | that are not progressing as quickly as hoped |
| [02:11:49] | k-man: | which ones are the ambitious ones? |
| [02:12:49] | Beirdo: | which ones aren't? :) |
| [02:13:07] | ** iamlindoro hopes to correct the spelling of Disc ** | |
| [02:13:11] | wagnerrp: | backend setup rework (web instead of application), schema rework for all media content followed soon after by using that to migrate mythmusic and mythgallery into the database and onto the backend, jobqueue rewrite to remove the user job limit and add a proper scheduler |
| [02:14:02] | Beirdo: | iamlindoro: yer fighting a losing battle there.. :) DVD = Digital Video Disc even |
| [02:14:08] | wagnerrp: | plus a upnp client, although i believe much of that is already implemented and just not activated |
| [02:14:20] | iamlindoro: | Digital Versatile Disc ;) |
| [02:14:35] | Beirdo: | yeah, duh. Brain fart :) |
| [02:14:46] | wagnerrp: | Digital Versatile Disk |
| [02:14:52] | Beirdo: | wagnerrp: no. |
| [02:14:55] | Beirdo: | it is Disc |
| [02:14:57] | wagnerrp: | disk... disk... DISK! |
| [02:15:05] | ** wagnerrp hides from Jon Worfin ** | |
| [02:15:07] | Beirdo: | as defined by those who created CD and DVD both |
| [02:15:16] | iamlindoro: | BIGBOOTAY |
| [02:15:26] | Beirdo: | and LaserDisc... and MiniDisc |
| [02:15:27] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [02:15:46] | Beirdo: | And... Blu-ray Disc |
| [02:15:50] | wagnerrp: | not another word from you bootie |
| [02:15:53] | Beirdo: | we lose :) |
| [02:16:14] | wagnerrp: | Beirdo: do you throw those discs? |
| [02:16:35] | Beirdo: | see: http://www.blu-raydisc.com/ |
| [02:16:49] | Beirdo: | sorry man... |
| [02:17:08] | Beirdo: | it's even part of the official trademark |
| [02:17:20] | Beirdo: | they could theoretically sue you for spelling it with a k |
| [02:17:22] | wagnerrp: | if you throw them, you can use the classical great entomology, discus |
| [02:17:22] | Twiggy2cents: | disk drive! |
| [02:17:35] | wagnerrp: | if not, then they are the traditional english spelling of disk |
| [02:17:42] | Twiggy2cents: | floppy disk |
| [02:17:43] | Beirdo: | wrong |
| [02:17:48] | wagnerrp: | unless youre talking about a trademarked product name |
| [02:17:52] | Beirdo: | the traditional spelling is disc |
| [02:18:00] | wagnerrp: | such as DVD, or Bluray, or CD |
| [02:18:03] | Beirdo: | the Americanized spelling is disk |
| [02:18:04] | wagnerrp: | but we dont use any of those |
| [02:18:08] | wagnerrp: | we use 'optical disk' |
| [02:18:37] | Beirdo: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_disc |
| [02:18:38] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [02:18:39] | ** wagnerrp takes wikipedia as gospel, as it promotes his standpoint ** | |
| [02:18:44] | Beirdo: | I think you are outvoted |
| [02:18:57] | Beirdo: | wikipedia even says it's "optical disc" |
| [02:19:07] | Twiggy2cents: | does this pertain to mythui text? |
| [02:19:19] | Beirdo: | and I searched with the k :) |
| [02:19:37] | wagnerrp: | Twiggy2cents: someone created a ticket complaining about the misspelling of 'disk' |
| [02:19:53] | Twiggy2cents: | wow... what a ticket. |
| [02:20:01] | wagnerrp: | so i said we need to create a new closure status, 'user is a tool' |
| [02:20:08] | Twiggy2cents: | On top of that that, you guys are discussing what to do about it |
| [02:20:22] | Beirdo: | nah we are just being pedantic and silly |
| [02:20:26] | wagnerrp: | nah, we are mocking it in jest |
| [02:20:53] | Beirdo: | I guess hard drives are American as "hard disk" seems to be correct |
| [02:21:03] | Beirdo: | I guess optical discs are meant to be frisbees |
| [02:21:06] | wagnerrp: | Beirdo: thank IBM for that one |
| [02:21:13] | Twiggy2cents: | You should close it with something like ln -s disk disc |
| [02:21:15] | k-man: | i remember when they were called Winchesters |
| [02:21:16] | Twiggy2cents: | fixed |
| [02:21:17] | k-man: | hah! |
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| [02:22:28] | k-man: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_magnetic_disk_drives#IBM_3340 |
| [02:23:02] | k-man: | so called after the Winchester 30–30 rifle apparantly |
| [02:23:14] | Beirdo: | either way, "Won't Fix – user is a tool" is appropriate on such a ticket |
| [02:23:27] | wagnerrp: | what were called winchesters? |
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| [02:23:33] | Beirdo: | hard disks |
| [02:23:40] | wagnerrp: | why? |
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| [02:25:38] | Beirdo: | The IBM 3340 Direct Access Storage Facility, code-named Winchester, was introduced in March 1973 for use with IBM System/370. |
| [02:25:45] | Beirdo: | wikipedia to the rescue |
| [02:25:49] | Korny1 (Korny1!~Korny@174-30-211-69.mpls.qwest.net) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [02:25:55] | Beirdo: | I do remember them being known generically as that |
| [02:26:07] | wagnerrp: | not for any real reason, that was just the code name? |
| [02:26:18] | Beirdo: | Early on the design was focused on two removable 30 megabyte modules. Because of this 30/30 configuration, the code name Winchester was selected after the famous Winchester 30–30 rifle;[18] subsequently the capacities were increased, but the code name stuck. |
| [02:26:29] | ** Beirdo channels wikipedia :) ** | |
| [02:26:54] | Beirdo: | and finally: |
| [02:26:57] | Beirdo: | The name stuck in the USSR, Hungary and possibly other countries as an umbrella term for all hard drives; it is still in wide use today. |
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| [02:27:25] | Beirdo: | anyways, all from the link above. |
| [02:27:37] | Beirdo: | an interesting read for someone with spare time |
| [02:28:10] | Korny1: | Evening, just wondering if anyone in here has used a sagetv exender and if running a network boot myth front end would have similar lag when viewing movie walls? |
| [02:28:29] | wagnerrp: | movie walls? |
| [02:28:40] | Beirdo: | someone said the "s" word |
| [02:28:42] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [02:29:01] | Beirdo: | anyways, I'm gonna head home so I can commit some mysql handling cleaning code |
| [02:30:03] | Korny1: | The S word hehe, well the S word made me quite unhappy selling themselves out to google :/ |
| [02:31:22] | Korny1: | So I'm looking to switch to myth since my server runs ubuntu at the moment and I'm quite happy with it |
| [02:31:22] | wagnerrp: | did the sage 'video wall' actually have a wall of motion videos? |
| [02:31:26] | wagnerrp: | or was it just a gallery? |
| [02:31:29] | Korny1: | Gallery |
| [02:31:39] | iamlindoro: | Korny1, You'll need to explain what you mean by movie walls, that's not a term we use. Regarding using Sage TV extender hardware, it's more or less yet anotehr Sigma decoder box, so while it's theoretically possible to run Myth on it, there's no public API we could use to take advantage of it's video decode hardware |
| [02:31:48] | iamlindoro: | ah, he means MythVideo ;) |
| [02:31:56] | wagnerrp: | you will have lag the first time you generate the thumbnails for your theme and resolution |
| [02:31:58] | iamlindoro: | Myth-formerly-video, anyway |
| [02:32:05] | wagnerrp: | but after that, it should be rather quick |
| [02:32:13] | Korny1: | Even on a network boot? |
| [02:32:29] | Korny1: | or would I be better off using a flash drive? |
| [02:32:30] | wagnerrp: | why wouldnt it? |
| [02:32:46] | k-man: | Beirdo: that's interesting that the term is still in use in some places |
| [02:33:29] | wagnerrp: | the worst youre talking about is a few hundred KB image for the coverart |
| [02:33:44] | k-man: | wjat S word? |
| [02:33:51] | Korny1: | Do most dual core atoms with ion2 work for a frontend? |
| [02:33:53] | k-man: | s/wjat/what/ |
| [02:34:02] | wagnerrp: | and even as a 1920x1080 png, youre only looking at tens of milliseconds over wired ethernet |
| [02:34:23] | iamlindoro: | Korny1, Yes, generally speaking they are acceptable frontends so long as the content you wish to watch is covered by VDPAU decode |
| [02:34:27] | wagnerrp: | the individual coverart for each movie will be in the tens of KB range |
| [02:34:46] | iamlindoro: | Korny1, ie, standard profiles of MPEG-2, VC-1, or H.264 |
| [02:34:51] | Korny1: | I'm mainly looking at normal profile MKVs |
| [02:34:59] | wagnerrp: | Korny1: however it is still recommended you buy hardware with sufficient power to handle your content in software |
| [02:35:01] | iamlindoro: | MKV is a container, not a codec |
| [02:35:03] | wagnerrp: | normal profile mkvs...? |
| [02:35:12] | Korny1: | H264 sorry |
| [02:35:27] | k-man: | btw, i like mkv |
| [02:35:38] | wagnerrp: | codec is not sufficient, we need encoding options, bitrates, resolutions |
| [02:35:59] | wagnerrp: | VDPAU is only designed for normal and high 4.1 or lower |
| [02:36:08] | wagnerrp: | and there are some other gotchas that x264 offers that it cannot handle |
| [02:36:20] | Korny1: | typically nothing more then 5000–6000 bitrate for HD mostly 720p |
| [02:36:27] | iamlindoro: | let's not belabor the point, however, yes, it's likely fine |
| [02:36:42] | Korny1: | Standard handbrake options |
| [02:37:08] | wagnerrp: | what profile? some of the packaged profiles use too many reference frames |
| [02:37:20] | wagnerrp: | for 720p, you should be able to handle like 10 reference frames |
| [02:37:24] | JEDIDIAH__: | you can easily sort the issue out for yourself by putting a comparable video card in a machine you already have. |
| [02:37:36] | Korny1: | whatever profile it defaults too(handbrake that is) |
| [02:37:45] | wagnerrp: | yeah, any nvidia 8-series or better will be VDPAU capable |
| [02:37:51] | wagnerrp: | (not including the original 8800s) |
| [02:38:03] | JEDIDIAH__: | I bought a 8400 the moment I heard about vdpau. |
| [02:38:13] | wagnerrp: | grab a copy of vdpau-enabled mplayer, and give it a try |
| [02:38:20] | iamlindoro: | Korny1, We've learned to use an abundance of caution as there are always gotchas and we prefer not to have people come back in with "BUT YOU SAID...!" Generally speaking, anything you can decode in hardware in windows will generally work okay in linux/MythTV as well |
| [02:38:28] | JEDIDIAH__: | ...or just play around with mythtv proper. |
| [02:38:40] | wagnerrp: | well mythtv proper requires a proper setup |
| [02:38:48] | wagnerrp: | mplayer could be managed in a few minutes |
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| [02:39:10] | JEDIDIAH__: | yeah but it would still be NonMyth. |
| [02:39:15] | JEDIDIAH__: | yeah but it would still be NotMyth. |
| [02:39:34] | ** wagnerrp heads out for a bit ** | |
| [02:39:35] | Korny1: | is 2 gigs of ram overkill? |
| [02:39:54] | wagnerrp: | 2GB is a good recommended minimum |
| [02:39:56] | iamlindoro: | Korny1, No, it's a reasonable amount |
| [02:39:58] | JEDIDIAH__: | that amount of RAM is handy for onboard video |
| [02:40:32] | JEDIDIAH__: | 2G is usually what you need for the onboard GPU to get allocated a civilized amount of RAM. |
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| [02:41:02] | Korny1: | 4 isn't THAT much more though] |
| [02:41:21] | Korny1: | Since I'm only buying single sticks not pairs |
| [02:42:55] | Korny1: | I take that back, it is quite a bit more lol |
| [02:43:45] | JEDIDIAH__: | 4G won't benefit the GPU but can likely be used for other things, especially if you have a combo fe/be system. |
| [02:44:01] | Korny1: | Nah I got a 6core AMD sitting on my closet :/ |
| [02:44:16] | Korny1: | running 12 TB at the moment |
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| [02:44:54] | JEDIDIAH__: | you might find yourself to be the shorter man in these parts. |
| [02:45:16] | Korny1: | hehehe its not that big of an array I know :) |
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| [03:11:35] | context: | is it possible to use hdmi audio out with mythtv ? |
| [03:11:47] | wagnerrp: | in a manner of speaking |
| [03:11:50] | context: | ? |
| [03:11:54] | wagnerrp: | mythtv outputs through alsa |
| [03:12:08] | context: | kk. so if i can get alsa outputing through it |
| [03:12:12] | context: | then myth obviously can |
| [03:12:12] | wagnerrp: | and modern graphics cards expose audio outputs through the alsa HDA drivers |
| [03:12:32] | context: | shouldn't really have a problem getting 5.1 sound i imagine ? |
| [03:12:41] | context: | does tv even send surround sound :x |
| [03:13:22] | wagnerrp: | digital broadcasts are often in surround |
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| [03:14:09] | wagnerrp: | ATSC (north american) broadcasts will be AC3 |
| [03:14:19] | wagnerrp: | DVB (everyone else) can be AC3 or AAC |
| [03:15:00] | wagnerrp: | youre masked, so i dont know where youre located |
| [03:18:38] | context: | iowa. US |
| [03:18:52] | context: | wagnerrp: i'm assuming mythtv can pull scheduling directly from the cable ? |
| [03:19:08] | wagnerrp: | not really |
| [03:19:21] | wagnerrp: | it can pull whatever scheduling is available, but that is not very much |
| [03:19:50] | wagnerrp: | cable channels, you wont see anything at all |
| [03:20:09] | wagnerrp: | broadcast channels, the stations arent mandated to provide more than 12 hours |
| [03:20:44] | context: | wagnerrp: oh. so you just schedule based on time ? |
| [03:21:32] | wagnerrp: | no, we used to use the free zap2it service |
| [03:21:41] | wagnerrp: | but that got abused by commercial concerns and shut down |
| [03:21:46] | context: | :/ |
| [03:21:53] | context: | so any recommendations for getting scheduling ? |
| [03:21:58] | wagnerrp: | so mythtv and several projects set up schedules direct to license the content directly |
| [03:22:10] | wagnerrp: | $20/yr gets you two weeks of data |
| [03:22:18] | k-man: | say you wanted to record 4 HD channels simultaneously, and watch another recording at the same time. could that be too much bw for the hard disks? |
| [03:22:25] | context: | how does the tv receiver the cable company gives you do it |
| [03:22:39] | context: | k-man: depends on the disks.... |
| [03:22:46] | sphery_: | $20/yr gets you two weeks of data all year long :) |
| [03:22:55] | k-man: | context: could cpu grunt also be a factor? |
| [03:22:58] | wagnerrp: | the cable company sends it to their cable boxes encrypted |
| [03:23:04] | wagnerrp: | in a manner mythtv cannot access |
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| [03:24:12] | context: | k-man: uhhh, cpu, memory, disk .... |
| [03:24:13] | context: | everything ? |
| [03:24:22] | context: | wagnerrp: ahh gotcha |
| [03:24:25] | Jester (Jester!~jesse@23.sub-174-252-152.myvzw.com) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [03:24:32] | context: | wagnerrp: any pages i can check out on getting scheduling ? |
| [03:25:15] | [R] ([R]!~rbox@unaffiliated/rbox) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [03:25:34] | context: | schedules direct i want ? |
| [03:26:59] | Jester: | anyone know if the current (HD) digital boxes TWC is using have firewire? |
| [03:27:19] | [R]: | Jester: that most likely depends on your locale |
| [03:27:28] | [R]: | Jester: but by law they are supposed to |
| [03:27:44] | Jester: | interesting.. |
| [03:27:52] | Jester: | so I may not need to buy a PVR1212 |
| [03:28:03] | [R]: | wtf is a pvr1212? |
| [03:28:03] | wagnerrp: | context: anyone in north america should use schedules direct for guide data |
| [03:28:06] | sphery_: | k-man: a single ATSC recording is going to be < 19Mbps (probably 14Mbps), so 4 are < 80Mbps (probably < 60Mbps). For ease of calculations, 80Mbps is only 10MB/s, which is nothing to a modern HDD. That said, seeking could cause problems--which is why we recommend having as many disks as you want concurrent recordings. |
| [03:28:22] | wagnerrp: | Jester: that firewire mandate was repealed |
| [03:28:27] | [R]: | wagnerrp: WTF?! |
| [03:28:40] | [R]: | wagnerrp: they realized it was useless garbage? |
| [03:28:56] | Jester: | [R], http://lmgtfy.com/?q=pvr+1212 ;) |
| [03:28:57] | wagnerrp: | and there is nothing specifying how cable boxes are supposed to handle copy-freely content over firewire |
| [03:28:57] | sphery_: | Jester: you mean an HD-PVR |
| [03:29:21] | context: | can 1 card only record 1 show at most at a time? (ie: id need 4 coax cables plugged into 4 cards to record 4 shows?) |
| [03:29:32] | wagnerrp: | so even if you have a firewire enabled box, it may not be usable with mythtv |
| [03:29:35] | sphery_: | 1212 is a model number, not the name of the product – http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hdpvr.html |
| [03:29:48] | ** [R] smacks hauppauge for such a faux paux ** | |
| [03:29:53] | wagnerrp: | context: physical digital channels contain multiple virtual channels |
| [03:30:00] | context: | i bought an hvr-1600 today |
| [03:30:12] | wagnerrp: | one digital tuner can record up to five virtual channels at once |
| [03:30:18] | context: | wagnerrp: oh nice. |
| [03:30:25] | context: | my disks come in wednesday |
| [03:30:29] | sphery_: | wagnerrp: btw, I'm getting: sphery #mythtv-theming Cannot change nickname while banned on channel |
| [03:30:31] | context: | just need to decide on a video card |
| [03:30:35] | sphery_: | gotta love our difficult channel |
| [03:30:37] | Jester: | I just ordered TWC |
| [03:30:44] | context: | gonna be using 5x 2TB drives for backup/storage/myth |
| [03:31:03] | Jester: | either need to be able to capture someway from the cable box or.. get the HDhomerun Prime when its out in late july |
| [03:31:13] | sphery_ is now known as sphery | |
| [03:31:26] | wagnerrp: | sphery: i dont have ops on that channel |
| [03:31:38] | [R]: | Jester: the hdhomerun prime is only gonna give you the copy freely channels... |
| [03:31:49] | Jester: | I have (3) 2TBs for storage of movies, music, etc and (1) 1TB and (2) 500GB for recordings |
| [03:32:16] | Jester: | [R], I realize this.. I'll need to see what all channels that entails.. I've heard some areas that means most :-\ |
| [03:32:24] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah, I'm not really banned--it's just the thing it does after a while (I think because it didn't see my disconnect earlier or something?) |
| [03:32:25] | [R]: | in most areas that means crap |
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| [03:32:40] | Jester: | hmm |
| [03:32:57] | Jester: | so most likely i should just buy the HD-PVR? |
| [03:33:09] | Jester: | or are there other cards/devices out there now? |
| [03:33:32] | [R]: | hdpvr is the only device as of now that is supported and allows you to capture everything hd from your cable box |
| [03:33:42] | Jester: | ok |
| [03:33:52] | Jester: | would you suggest just IR blasting the STB? |
| [03:34:01] | [R]: | i use firewire |
| [03:34:04] | [R]: | but if you dont have that |
| [03:34:07] | [R]: | ir is kinda the only way to do it |
| [03:34:20] | Jester: | yeah.. I'm just curious about its accuracy |
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| [03:34:36] | Jester: | I used it a while back with an analog cablebox and it was something to be desired |
| [03:35:18] | Jester: | for w/ reason it didnt blast the number 3 right |
| [03:35:42] | Jester: | so when it was flipping to 35 to record scrubs i'd get channel 5 which was some cooking show lol |
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| [03:38:31] | context: | anyone here use myth with zfs-fuse ? |
| [03:38:45] | wagnerrp: | i use myth with zfs |
| [03:38:51] | [R]: | context: that sound failtastic |
| [03:39:03] | context: | [r]: why? |
| [03:39:10] | context: | wagnerrp: get good performance out of it ? |
| [03:39:11] | [R]: | fuse is awful |
| [03:39:34] | wagnerrp: | zfs works great, but i dont use it for performance |
| [03:40:06] | context: | well. id be running freebsd if myth worked on it :/ |
| [03:40:13] | context: | and i cant currently get native-zfs running |
| [03:40:32] | wagnerrp: | i run myth on freebsd, booting natively from a ZFS mirror |
| [03:42:32] | Jester: | anyone know where you can get a HDPVR for less than $180 |
| [03:42:46] | context: | wagnerrp: hmmm. what tuner card? |
| [03:42:47] | wagnerrp: | thats a rather specific price |
| [03:42:54] | wagnerrp: | context: hdhomerun |
| [03:42:57] | context: | ahh |
| [03:43:09] | slacker- (slacker-!~giggel@io.ee.uwa.edu.au) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [03:43:11] | context: | and i was reading you cant do hdmi audio on freebsd :/ maybe you can though |
| [03:43:12] | [R]: | Jester: steal it? |
| [03:43:13] | slacker-: | hi guys |
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| [03:43:22] | Jester: | yes wagnerrp i've found it for 181 lol |
| [03:43:36] | wagnerrp: | i dont know, freebsd is only my backend |
| [03:43:50] | wagnerrp: | ive got diskless gentoo frontends |
| [03:43:53] | slacker-: | I'm missing a config.xml file, which is required for jamu. Any idea where to get a new one from? |
| [03:43:54] | context: | my backend is gonna be my frontend |
| [03:43:54] | context: | :/ |
| [03:44:21] | context: | maybe ill eventually make it a dedicated backend |
| [03:44:32] | context: | make some mini-itx machines for frontends or something |
| [03:45:27] | slacker-: | I can't find any documentation about it unfortuantely |
| [03:45:58] | wagnerrp: | slacker-: config.xml is produced by any mythtv frontend or backend |
| [03:46:06] | wagnerrp: | it lists where the database can be found |
| [03:46:21] | wagnerrp: | if you have upnp autodetection, jamu can automatically generate one as well |
| [03:46:30] | Jester: | anyone know about this capture card.. http://cgi.ebay.com/Hauppauge-Colossus-PCI-Ex . . . em2c5d6f63f5 |
| [03:46:40] | wagnerrp: | not usable by mythtv |
| [03:46:52] | sphery: | a colossus waste of money at this point |
| [03:46:57] | [R]: | HAHA |
| [03:46:57] | Jester: | haha |
| [03:47:00] | Jester: | hahahah |
| [03:47:02] | slacker-: | oh, hang on |
| [03:47:11] | Jester: | why isn't it usable via myth? |
| [03:47:24] | wagnerrp: | because it isnt usable via linux |
| [03:47:24] | sphery: | because it's not usable in GNU/Linux |
| [03:47:40] | ** wagnerrp throws up the victory horns ** | |
| [03:47:46] | sphery: | and, rumor has it, it may never be |
| [03:48:00] | sphery: | wagnerrp: on my screen, I was first! |
| [03:48:10] | [R]: | i'm an impartial judge |
| [03:48:13] | [R]: | [08:47:23] +wagnerrp because it isnt usable via linux |
| [03:48:13] | [R]: | [08:47:23] sphery because it's not usable in GNU/Linux |
| [03:48:28] | sphery: | I want microseconds! Recount! |
| [03:48:34] | [R]: | lol |
| [03:48:48] | slacker-: | wagnerrp: what's the difference to mysql.txt then? |
| [03:49:01] | Korny1: | lol, just get an HDpvr...... |
| [03:49:14] | sphery: | mysql.txt is the old way of doing things that's being replaced by config.xml |
| [03:49:17] | wagnerrp: | Jester: basically, the hauppauge linuxtv people cant develop open source drivers due to NDA issues |
| [03:49:17] | Jester: | yes but why isn't the chipset usable i'd assume its about the equivalent hardware to the HDPVR1212 |
| [03:49:21] | slacker-: | ic |
| [03:49:40] | Korny1: | different chipset |
| [03:49:44] | [R]: | Jester: well you assumed incorrectly |
| [03:49:47] | wagnerrp: | and while the HDPVR (no 1212) had the same issue, it was much easier to reverse engineer the protocol from the USB driver |
| [03:49:48] | Jester: | haha |
| [03:50:00] | Jester: | ohh |
| [03:50:04] | slacker-: | sphery: is there a config.xml template I can use? |
| [03:50:26] | wagnerrp: | slacker-: you are running jamu on your backend, correct? |
| [03:50:31] | slacker-: | yes |
| [03:50:33] | Jester: | alright well then Im stopping buy bestbuy tomorrow and buying an "HD-PVR" |
| [03:50:40] | [R]: | at worstbuy? |
| [03:50:41] | wagnerrp: | then your config.xml is already configured |
| [03:50:42] | [R]: | for serious? |
| [03:50:49] | slacker-: | wagnerrp: it's empty |
| [03:50:55] | wagnerrp: | and if jamu is not picking it up, it means you are running jamu as the wrong user name |
| [03:50:59] | Jester: | I want to be able to take it back to a store if it fails |
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| [03:51:18] | wagnerrp: | as it should be run under the same user that the backend is run as |
| [03:51:53] | slacker-: | wagnerrp: it is |
| [03:52:00] | Jester: | think i could pick much up on a dishnet sat dish? |
| [03:52:06] | [R]: | they had credit cards in the 50s!? |
| [03:52:09] | Jester: | FTA that is |
| [03:52:19] | [R]: | Jester: like 2 channels |
| [03:52:19] | wagnerrp: | nope |
| [03:52:27] | wagnerrp: | not anything of real worth anyway |
| [03:52:45] | Jester: | depending on the two channels it may be interesting to try just for the sake of it |
| [03:52:51] | Jester: | you can buy cheap FTA boxes on ebay |
| [03:52:55] | sphery: | NASA channel and maybe one or 2 others, right? |
| [03:53:01] | sphery: | that's all a person needs |
| [03:53:04] | [R]: | i wonder if they still have that list |
| [03:53:16] | Jester: | i could put it on my boat lol |
| [03:53:19] | sphery: | and NASA channel should be getting /really/ exciting--what with the cancellation of the US government space program and all |
| [03:53:30] | Jester: | haha |
| [03:53:40] | Jester: | they had to fund the channel somehow sphery ;) |
| [03:53:42] | slacker-: | wagnerrp: so should I just delete the empty file and restart the frontend, which is also runnign on the backend, and see what happens? |
| [03:54:03] | context: | mmm |
| [03:54:11] | context: | wednesday is gonna be a real enlightenment |
| [03:55:05] | Jester: | well im out good night all |
| [03:55:06] | Jester: | thanks |
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| [03:58:39] | wagnerrp: | sphery: you know more about the config.xml generation stuff than me |
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| [04:00:48] | sphery: | slacker-: that should be fine--delete the empty one and start mythfrontend (or mythtv-setup) |
| [04:00:48] | slacker-: | interesting |
| [04:01:01] | sphery: | then answer the questions and it will create one |
| [04:01:17] | slacker-: | sphery: had to delete config.xml and mysql.txt |
| [04:01:18] | sphery: | ip address/db info questions that is |
| [04:01:30] | sphery: | right, if you have a mysql.txt, it will override config.xml |
| [04:01:37] | slacker-: | sphery: put in the info from mysql.txt in the database config of frontend |
| [04:01:54] | context: | are there different types of frontends for myth? |
| [04:01:58] | slacker-: | it says it can't ping the database but if I connect manually to the database it works |
| [04:02:03] | slacker-: | with the same details of course |
| [04:02:33] | wagnerrp: | different types of frontend? |
| [04:02:34] | slacker-: | do I have to provide a port in the db config of the frontend |
| [04:02:35] | slacker-: | ? |
| [04:02:41] | sphery: | check the box to say don't ping the database server |
| [04:02:47] | sphery: | you've likely got a firewall that's blocking pings |
| [04:02:50] | context: | wagnerrp: like a web frontend or to watch on iphone? |
| [04:03:02] | sphery: | and, no, you don't want to provide a port for the db server |
| [04:03:06] | sphery: | use the default |
| [04:03:22] | sphery: | (which is what the default value for it--empty? or 0?--says to do) |
| [04:03:23] | k-man: | sphery: ah, thanks for the pointers re hdds |
| [04:03:38] | slacker-: | sphery: after unticking the ping box it still says "cannot find (ping) database host on" |
| [04:03:47] | slacker-: | sphery: looks like it's not getting the info |
| [04:04:07] | slacker-: | maybe it can't write the file ... |
| [04:04:21] | sphery: | do you see the file? |
| [04:04:29] | sphery: | I think it only writes it after successfully connecting |
| [04:04:37] | k-man: | sphery: a friend of mine is having problems with random short pauses mostly when recordings begin and end – i was thinking it could be due to hdd bandwidth issues. and your comment regarding seeking might fit in to when recordings start |
| [04:04:50] | k-man: | err.. .when recordings start or when you start playing a recording |
| [04:04:56] | sphery: | slacker-: try shutting down the frontend, delete any mysql.txt or config.xml that's there, now, and then restart |
| [04:05:18] | sphery: | k-man: if it's 0.24 or above, it's a known issue and is being worked on for 0.25 |
| [04:05:59] | k-man: | sphery: oh... interesting – can you point me to a ticket that describes it? |
| [04:06:22] | sphery: | when the recording list changes (recordings start or stop or are deleted), we process some events which take too long, so we end up with some short pauses |
| [04:06:41] | sphery: | don't remember the ticket number, but there are a few for this |
| [04:07:25] | sphery: | k-man: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/480789#480789 |
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| [04:07:32] | slacker-: | sphery: so user, who is running the frontend is writing the config.xml file or the backend? |
| [04:07:47] | slacker-: | because, they're different users |
| [04:07:47] | k-man: | thanks sphery |
| [04:08:01] | sphery: | slacker-: frontend will write it when you start mythfrontend and there's none there |
| [04:08:13] | slacker-: | hm, right, have to cheat permissions then |
| [04:08:14] | sphery: | slacker-: which distro? |
| [04:08:20] | slacker-: | ubuntu |
| [04:08:22] | slacker-: | ehm |
| [04:08:29] | slacker-: | 10.04 |
| [04:08:44] | sphery: | most distros put the config.xml elsewhere (like /etc/mythtv) and then put a link in every $HOME/.mythtv back to the /etc/mythtv/config.xml ) |
| [04:10:06] | slacker-: | yes, that's the way it's done |
| [04:10:15] | slacker-: | wait a sec. I'm done cheating |
| [04:10:29] | sphery: | k-man: oh, and ignore the videobuffersize thing in that post (see http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/481569#481569 ) |
| [04:11:31] | k-man: | thanks sphery |
| [04:12:44] | slacker-: | right, now my frontend config looks different |
| [04:13:09] | sphery: | different from what's in /etc/mythtv ? |
| [04:13:28] | slacker-: | ah, had to restart again |
| [04:13:34] | slacker-: | ok, now I have a config.xml |
| [04:13:35] | ectospasm: | is there a way to launch the Internal video player from a script? I have written a script to loopback mount a BD ISO, and I just need to pass the mount point to the Internal player (or some other player) |
| [04:13:36] | slacker-: | grand |
| [04:13:46] | slacker-: | see if mythvideo runs happy now |
| [04:14:47] | slacker-: | I mean mythvideo cronjob |
| [04:15:38] | slacker-: | ok, better |
| [04:15:40] | slacker-: | thanks sphery |
| [04:15:55] | ectospasm: | I know I can do it with VLC, but I'm told the Internal player is "better" |
| [04:16:22] | sphery: | slacker-: enjoy |
| [04:16:35] | slacker-: | ah, conveniently, it also recreated the mysql.txt file |
| [04:16:49] | sphery: | ectospasm: we don't really have a way of doing that--mythtv isn't designed to be run from the command line |
| [04:17:19] | sphery: | ectospasm: there is network control, which you can use to send a command to start blu-ray playback |
| [04:17:43] | slacker-: | bye |
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| [04:17:51] | ectospasm: | I need to initiate the command from within mythtv. |
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| [04:18:20] | sphery: | and if you specify your blu-ray drive device to mythtv as a path that's a symlink, you can have your script replace that symlink with one pointing to the loop-mounted blu-ray iso |
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| [04:18:30] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v iamlindoro | |
| [04:18:40] | sphery: | then when the script exits, have it put back the symlink pointing to your real blu-ray device |
| [04:18:59] | ectospasm: | I guess that leads me to the question: can I even specify a script in the alternative player? |
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| [04:20:15] | ectospasm: | sphery: your suggestion still doesn't tell me how to mount the ISO and update the symlink |
| [04:20:55] | ectospasm: | I know how to mount the ISO outside of the mythtvfrontend |
| [04:21:14] | ectospasm: | ...and I can pass the mount point to VLC |
| [04:21:25] | sphery: | well, you have many different options |
| [04:22:52] | sphery: | if you want to have metadata and an item in mythvideo to select, create some file like The_Best_Movie.bdiso, then create a file type for .bdiso that runs your script and passes the name of the file to play |
| [04:23:33] | ectospasm: | passes the name of the file to play to what? The Internal player? That sounds like my current plan, actually. |
| [04:24:10] | ectospasm: | ...well, VLC insstead of the internal player |
| [04:25:12] | sphery: | then in that script, do the loop mounting of the file whose name was passed to the script, create a symlink, use netcat to send a command to start playback of the blu-ray, and then exit the script so mythtv pays attention to remote commands while watching |
| [04:26:25] | sphery: | cleanup would be the hard part--but you could actually handle that through a System Event script that triggers on Playback stopped ( http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythTV_System_Events ) |
| [04:27:03] | wagnerrp: | ectospasm: the 'alternate player' is any executable file you want |
| [04:27:31] | wagnerrp: | that includes executable scripts |
| [04:28:03] | sphery: | have it run a script that uses losetup -a to see if any file systems are loop mounted, and if so, if the blu-ray device link is referring to a loop-mounted BD ISO, unmount, losetup -d, then fix the symlink to point to the real blu-ray |
| [04:28:32] | sphery: | ectospasm: that said, I'm guessing that you're going about this the hard way |
| [04:28:51] | sphery: | because I'm pretty sure the guy who added blu-ray support doesn't do anything nearly this complex |
| [04:29:05] | sphery: | and if it were this complex, he'd likely have made MythTV do more of the work :) |
| [04:29:40] | ectospasm: | ...well, I've already got about 14 BD ISOs already ripped |
| [04:30:44] | ectospasm: | ...could I simply point the blu-ray player at the ISO and be done with it? |
| [04:31:30] | wagnerrp: | the internal player does not currently support ISOs, locally or over storage groups |
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| [04:32:53] | Captain_Murdoch: | s/ISOs/BD ISOs/ and that's a limitation of the BD lib. |
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| [04:33:25] | wagnerrp: | right |
| [04:33:40] | ectospasm: | libbluray? |
| [04:33:44] | wagnerrp: | for now, the preferred method is to simply store the BDMV files, not in an ISO |
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| [04:37:31] | ectospasm: | wagnerrp: that's unacceptable. |
| [04:37:57] | ectospasm: | ...no need to extract them when I can mount the ISO |
| [04:38:34] | wagnerrp: | which works now, but may not in the future |
| [04:38:53] | wagnerrp: | it will at least work through 0.25 |
| [04:38:55] | ectospasm: | how would it stop working? |
| [04:39:42] | wagnerrp: | the use of local files is removed, the option of an external player is removed |
| [04:40:13] | ectospasm: | that seems to severely limit one's choices. |
| [04:40:35] | ectospasm: | Don't be like Apple |
| [04:40:49] | wagnerrp: | yes, but will likely be unavoidable with a move to storage groups |
| [04:41:11] | ectospasm: | Oh, so no option to not use storage groups? Lame. |
| [04:41:51] | wagnerrp: | the alternative is to continue using storage defined in both the frontend and backend |
| [04:41:57] | wagnerrp: | which is confusing to the end user |
| [04:42:41] | ectospasm: | I dunno, I always thought of MythTV as a DIY PVR/MC, so reducing the choices makes it distasteful |
| [04:42:45] | ectospasm: | Again, don't be Apple. |
| [04:43:46] | wagnerrp: | mythtv is an anomaly for actually allowing users to configure external players |
| [04:44:34] | wagnerrp: | at the very least, external players will be required to understand the myth:// URIs |
| [04:44:46] | wagnerrp: | or have a wrapper script that otherwise does so |
| [04:45:25] | sphery: | don't be like Apple, the company that came from nowhere and increased its market cap to greater than that of MS + Intel combined |
| [04:45:41] | sphery: | (and, yes, I really mean that Apple was nowhere a few years ago) |
| [04:45:58] | sphery: | after all, a company that's making that much money must be doing /everything/ wrong :) |
| [04:46:46] | sphery: | reducing choices makes MythTV usable |
| [04:47:03] | sphery: | especially when the choices are choices the user shouldn't be making (i.e. we'll make the right choice /for/ them :) |
| [04:47:55] | sphery: | but most importantly, changing MythTV to fit the vision we've been discussing makes MythTV far more capable than it currently is |
| [04:48:15] | sphery: | so you lose something that's not that important and gain a lot more than you lose |
| [04:48:59] | ectospasm: | sphery: it depends on what your target audience is. My view, it's DIY-types. You should be making it for others to make plug and pray systems based on MythTV if you want end-user zeroconf |
| [04:49:33] | ectospasm: | and I didn't think MythTV was in the business of making money |
| [04:50:08] | wagnerrp: | no, were in the business to survive |
| [04:50:11] | iamlindoro: | You may want to start looking for something else, then |
| [04:50:15] | wagnerrp: | in order to survive, we need developers |
| [04:50:26] | iamlindoro: | Since what is described by sphery and wagnerrp, both Myth devs, is our project ethos and focus |
| [04:50:31] | wagnerrp: | in order to get prospective developers, we need to attract new users |
| [04:50:40] | sphery: | ectospasm: wouldn't a DIY type just write his own DVR |
| [04:50:51] | sphery: | I mean, it would only take like 1473 lines of perl code |
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| [04:51:27] | wagnerrp: | so its in (almost) everyone's benefit to make mythtv more approachable |
| [04:51:59] | wagnerrp: | at this point, the only purpose to use external players is to work around deficiencies in the internal player |
| [04:52:31] | wagnerrp: | so rather than develop code that would allow external players to access content over storage groups |
| [04:52:49] | wagnerrp: | it would be better to improve the internal player to handle the content that would otherwise need an external player |
| [04:53:52] | sphery: | oh, wait, 1731 lines of perl (but still can't find the link) |
| [04:54:34] | sphery: | ah, there... the 1731 lines of Perl post: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/187428#187428 |
| [04:54:47] | ectospasm: | sphery: it depends on what your definition of DIY type is. Mine is someone who doesn't want to write code if the framework is already out there. |
| [04:55:10] | Captain_Murdoch: | just search for "soap box derby mythtv" |
| [04:55:41] | sphery: | and, yeah, the point is that we want to fix our player to do everything you need it to do so you don't need hacks like I've described with the script that's replacing a symlink to a device and another script that cleans up after playback |
| [04:55:58] | sphery: | Captain_Murdoch: heh, yeah, I should be able to remember that search |
| [04:56:17] | Captain_Murdoch: | can make the bot remember it and kick out the url. :) |
| [04:56:33] | sphery: | heh, we should... !soapbox |
| [04:59:56] | wagnerrp: | mythtv was never intended as a 'framework', but a unified system |
| [05:00:24] | wagnerrp: | its DIY in the sense that you buy your own hardware and build your own system, composed of one or more computers |
| [05:00:36] | wagnerrp: | rather than an off the shelf unit with a monthly subscription |
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| [06:01:21] | Big_D_271: | on Mythweb, how can I force mobile view? when I view from my Android, I get the desktop experience?! |
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| [08:51:14] | wagnerrp: | Beirdo: so im looking through #9859, running a profiler on the script |
| [08:51:42] | wagnerrp: | it just... takes 80 seconds to run, and gives no explanation as to why |
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| [12:20:02] | henkpoley: | Are there any known problems going from 0.23.1 to 0.24.1 ? The latest upgrades have been pretty smooth, but still good to ask. |
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| [13:13:58] | bohan_h: | hi, is there a channel for development |
| [13:14:17] | bohan_h: | according the the website, it is #mythtv |
| [13:14:37] | bohan_h: | but in chatzilla, I cannot find that channel |
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| [13:14:45] | bohan_h: | am I doing something wrong? |
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| [13:17:24] | iamlindoro: | Why would you need to "find" a channel? /join #mythtv |
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| [16:27:18] | Gibby: | anyone using a dish network duo STB? |
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| [16:35:42] | wagnerrp: | duo, as in two tuners? |
| [16:36:25] | Gibby: | yeah in 1 stb, looking at getting 2 of them, each one can do 1 hd and 1 sd at the same time, switching from directv |
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| [16:38:22] | wagnerrp: | seems you would just be needlessly complicating things |
| [16:38:31] | wagnerrp: | are they cheaper than just using four tuners? |
| [16:38:42] | sphery: | Gibby: FWIW, about 5yrs ago when I was using Dish, they had a dual-tuner STB, but it used IR or RF for changing channels on one tuner and RF /only/ for changing channels on the 2nd tuner. Therefore, there was no good way of changing channels on the 2nd tuner. |
| [16:39:02] | sphery: | if that's still the case, you'd be better off with 2x single tuner stbs |
| [16:39:16] | sphery: | (or 2x 2x single tuner to get your four :) |
| [16:39:20] | Gibby: | wagnerrp, like getting 2 hd and 2 sd tuners instead? |
| [16:39:47] | Gibby: | sphery, i knew that 1 used rf, but i didn't know if it was able to be switched to ir.... |
| [16:39:57] | Gibby: | guess in need to call dish back and check |
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| [16:41:10] | wagnerrp: | do you really need four tuners? |
| [16:41:27] | Gibby: | yeah... we have 4 right now, 2 direct and 2 ota |
| [16:41:36] | wagnerrp: | cable and satellite tend to rebroadcast stuff a lot |
| [16:41:43] | wagnerrp: | meaning you can get by with fewer tuners |
| [16:41:57] | Gibby: | especially now since nascar is on TNT and not fox..... |
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| [16:48:03] | LedHed: | I was just reading about the Silicon Dust HDHR Prime. Says it works with MythTV for "Access controlled copy-freely channels" |
| [16:48:37] | LedHed: | How can you tell if the channels are Copy-Freely? |
| [16:49:01] | wagnerrp: | sphery: at least the guy is using netcat rather than telnet |
| [16:49:10] | sphery: | heh, yeah |
| [16:49:29] | sphery: | he's the guy who was in here last night, I'm pretty sure--and I specifically mentioned netcat in my general description |
| [16:50:03] | sphery: | LedHed: generally the diagnostic screen of your STB will tell you (you can find out how to get to that screen for your particular STB on the 'net) |
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| [16:50:09] | sphery: | places like avsforum |
| [16:50:28] | LedHed: | sphery, I dont have a STB |
| [16:50:42] | sphery: | wagnerrp: if he's not the same guy, someone else came up with the same ugly hack I suggested to the other guy last night :O |
| [16:51:09] | LedHed: | I do have 2 HDHR's (not prime) will that be able to tell from the stream? |
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| [16:51:12] | sphery: | LedHed: well, then you'll need to find a friend or neighbor with one :) |
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| [16:51:22] | LedHed: | humm |
| [16:51:45] | sphery: | I don't know of any way to pull the info off the stream with a QAM tuner and existing *nix tools |
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| [16:51:56] | LedHed: | so this is why people have friends. :) |
| [16:52:09] | sphery: | there's probably a way, but you'll need to learn a /lot/ about QAM and streams and tools and ... |
| [16:52:13] | wagnerrp: | sphery: why not call mythavtest instead? |
| [16:52:40] | sphery: | (i.e. I think the alternative to using an STB to tell you is to read the raw data in the stream and interpret it yourself) |
| [16:52:47] | sphery: | wagnerrp: because it's mythav*test* :) |
| [16:52:57] | sphery: | I will never suggest anyone use our debug application |
| [16:53:05] | LedHed: | thanks sphery I'll look into it |
| [16:53:18] | sphery: | someone else is free to do so, but I see it as unsupported and won't suggest its use for anything other than debug |
| [16:53:46] | Gibby: | sphery: dish says they can all be IR now |
| [16:53:56] | sphery: | Gibby: cool, then it should be possible to do that |
| [16:54:15] | Gibby: | i think i will order 2 hd-pvrs and see how it goes |
| [16:54:19] | sphery: | and dish is good about having 16 channels available, so it's easy to control all 4 tuners with one IR blaster |
| [16:54:27] | sphery: | (you don't need separate IR transmitters for each) |
| [16:54:37] | Gibby: | sweet |
| [16:54:38] | sphery: | 16 IR remote channels |
| [16:54:48] | Gibby: | i am having issue with 2 ir blasters now with Directtv |
| [16:55:00] | sphery: | same code for both? |
| [16:55:08] | wagnerrp: | wont calling playback from the control socket cause it to drop back to the main menu on exit? |
| [16:55:25] | sphery: | wagnerrp: could be |
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| [16:55:36] | Gibby: | yep same code, even tried blocking them off with cardboard and crap |
| [16:56:35] | sphery: | yeah, and especially with an IR blaster, that's the hard way |
| [16:56:50] | sphery: | with a simple non-blasting IR transmitter, it's much more likely to succeed |
| [16:57:18] | sphery: | I liked having multiple "channels" on my dish box since I used one blaster and just sent the right codes depending on which I wanted to change |
| [16:58:05] | Gibby: | ahhh and just have it pointed at all of them? |
| [17:00:32] | sphery: | well, technically, I didn't point it since it's a blaster |
| [17:00:51] | sphery: | it blasts a very bright signal that can actually bounce off walls and ceiling and find its way to the IR receiver |
| [17:01:07] | LedHed: | anyone here using a HDHR Prime? |
| [17:01:29] | Gibby: | your blaster must be better than mine lol |
| [17:02:14] | wagnerrp: | LedHed: that would be a bit hard |
| [17:02:24] | wagnerrp: | SD has not fulfilled any pre-orders yet |
| [17:02:35] | LedHed: | oh? |
| [17:02:42] | LedHed: | Newegg is selling them |
| [17:02:49] | LedHed: | NM |
| [17:02:55] | LedHed: | listed as Pre-Order |
| [17:02:55] | wagnerrp: | they only got permission for production a couple weeks ago |
| [17:03:32] | wagnerrp: | athough theproduct was developed and ready over a year ago |
| [17:05:00] | LedHed: | I guess I need to upgrade my myth |
| [17:05:09] | LedHed: | still running .22 |
| [17:11:27] | Gibby: | since I am going to use 2 hd-pvr's, can i still use just 1 blaster? of 1 blaster off of each hd-pvr? |
| [17:13:29] | wagnerrp: | do you have two different STBs that take different IR codes? |
| [17:13:32] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yay, FF5 is here! I guess that Makes FF4 the Windows Vista of Firefox for me (since I seem to have skipped 4 completely) |
| [17:14:04] | Gibby: | ff5 already.....hmmm |
| [17:14:19] | LedHed: | WTF? |
| [17:14:20] | Gibby: | i will have 2 different stb's that will take 4 different ir codes it looks like |
| [17:14:32] | sphery: | Gibby: if it's a blaster (i.e. has a non-negligible range and sends a signal strong enough to reach all receivers), and if all the STBs accept different IR codes, you can use a single blaster |
| [17:14:59] | sphery: | if you have an IR transmitter--with a small range and/or directionality--you may need multiple |
| [17:15:17] | Gibby: | hmm ok, what does the hd-pvr come with? |
| [17:15:40] | devinheitmueller: | The HD-PVR blaster is not designed to blast to multiple devices. |
| [17:16:32] | Gibby: | ok, so i can just use a different blaster than instead of the one with the hd-pvr's? |
| [17:16:57] | devinheitmueller: | In theory, a system should be able to handle the blaster for two different HD-PVRs. That said, Jarod hasn't tried it and one person did report having a problem with the driver. |
| [17:16:59] | sphery: | Yes, I contend there's a difference between an IR blaster and an IR transmitter (where all blasters are transmitters, but not all transmitters are blasters). This is why they used Ion blasters in Star Wars, rather than using Ion transmitters (where you'd die before you got close enough to hit the droid) |
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| [17:17:20] | Gibby: | rofl |
| [17:17:38] | sphery: | Gibby: I used http://www.lirc.org/improved_transmitter.html |
| [17:17:45] | Gibby: | guess will order 2 hd-pvrs and 2 dish duo's and see how it goes, the worst that can happened is it just doesn't work lol |
| [17:18:05] | devinheitmueller: | If it doesn't work, mention it to j-rod. |
| [17:18:13] | devinheitmueller: | Better yet, tell j-rod about the results either way. |
| [17:18:27] | sphery: | Gibby: another option is to order one dish duo to start with--to make sure you can get both tuners to work |
| [17:18:40] | sphery: | (or at least ask on the -users list to find if anyone is successfully using them with IR control and all) |
| [17:19:16] | sphery: | in other words, I'm not sure I'd completely trust the dish representative's knowledge of whether you can use IR for both tuners :) |
| [17:19:24] | Gibby: | I will document as much of it as I can |
| [17:19:48] | Gibby: | I found in the manual of the duo, that both can be IR, even states that it would be used with 2 tv's in the same room |
| [17:20:01] | sphery: | ah, ok |
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| [17:20:39] | Gibby: | only concern is having 4 in the same room, but since dish has 16 channels for their remotes, that shouldn't be a problem, |
| [17:21:05] | Gibby: | what about if someone is trying to change the channel on 2 different IR channels at the same time, can 1 ir blaster handle that? |
| [17:21:16] | sphery: | it needs to be serialized |
| [17:21:24] | sphery: | I did it through a simple bash "locking" script |
| [17:21:57] | sphery: | mythtv used to always do channel changes sequentially, but now that external channel changers are run in the signal monitor, that may not be the case |
| [17:22:11] | sphery: | so it makes sense to do the same kind of locking |
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| [17:25:11] | beadle: | Hello all. I have a fedora 14 system. When I transcode I use the --mpeg parm. I now need MPEG4 format and thought that I'd get that if I didn't use that parameter. It ignores the profile and switches back to mpeg2. Any help would be much appreciated! |
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| [17:26:47] | sphery: | beadle: mythtranscode always transcodes to NUV container with MPEG-4 or RTJPEG video inside, or if the source is MPEG-2, it can do a "lossless" cut where it just cuts out frames and so you go from MPEG-2 to MPEG-2 |
| [17:27:22] | sphery: | if you want anything else, you need to use something other than mythtranscode--such as nuvexport or some other transcoder that's not related to MythTV |
| [17:27:46] | wagnerrp: | beadle: why do you need mpeg4? |
| [17:28:07] | sphery: | or, put another way, why are you transcoding in the first place? Do you really need to? |
| [17:28:20] | beadle: | sphery: thanks! I think I understand better now. I am using a roku box |
| [17:28:44] | sphery: | ah, so transcoding to a specific format to make the video usable by a non-MythTV device |
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| [17:29:11] | wagnerrp: | mythtranscode will not output mpeg4 in a format capable of being played on a roku |
| [17:29:14] | sphery: | that's really the only reason that transcoding makes any sense (though setting up a real mythfrontend box may make more sense :) |
| [17:29:58] | beadle: | well, I like having mythtv channel right along-side the netflix channel :) |
| [17:30:38] | wagnerrp: | the roku will also not play any mpeg4 file transcoded by an open source encoder |
| [17:30:41] | beadle: | wagnerrp: I'm using handbrake currently |
| [17:30:54] | wagnerrp: | it requires wmv9 specifically |
| [17:31:45] | beadle: | it provides 'iPhone & iPod Touch' preset which seems to work very nicely |
| [17:32:21] | wagnerrp: | thats h264, which is very much different from the mpeg4asp that mpeg4 usually refers to |
| [17:32:31] | wagnerrp: | h264 is mpeg4avc |
| [17:32:33] | beadle: | the input file has to be transcoded first. I presume that's to make the TS into PS |
| [17:32:41] | beadle: | ah |
| [17:33:01] | wagnerrp: | mythtranscode does mpeg4asp |
| [17:33:29] | wagnerrp: | but the roku only uses the wmv9 blend of it |
| [17:33:30] | beadle: | any chance of mythtranscode doing mpegavc? |
| [17:34:32] | beadle: | mpeg4avc |
| [17:35:41] | sphery: | nope, but nuvexport does |
| [17:36:41] | LedHed: | I just spoke with Charter, all their channels are Copy Freely except PPV (Copy Never) and Premium (Copy Once) |
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| [17:38:31] | LedHed: | I dont ever subscribe to PPV or Premium channels |
| [17:39:29] | beadle: | sphery: the 'mp4 or iPod' option? I'm looking at mythtv wiki about nuvexport and it doesn't show the needed flags there but I can find that stuff out. it would work with the roku? |
| [17:40:58] | Beirdo: | wagnerrp: 80s? interesting |
| [17:41:02] | Gibby: | what is the best deal on a hd-pvr? 170–180 ish? |
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| [17:41:59] | epsolon77: | Does myth TV support central DVR capabilities distributed to multiple endpoints? |
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| [17:42:32] | wagnerrp: | epsolon77: mythtv has split frontends and backends, and supports multiple of each |
| [17:42:40] | wagnerrp: | http://mythtv.org/wiki/Executive_Overview |
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| [17:43:02] | epsolon77: | thanks wagnerrp, do you know how long ago that was implimented by chance? |
| [17:43:20] | wagnerrp: | in... 2002? |
| [17:44:04] | wagnerrp: | it was one of the core design principles in mythtv since initial creation |
| [17:44:32] | epsolon77: | ...I muse have compleatly missed that when I was looking at it three years ago... |
| [17:46:16] | epsolon77: | as I understand it MythTV won't handle Blu Ray correct? |
| [17:46:27] | epsolon77: | but that is not so much a MythTV thing as a Linux DRM thing... |
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| [17:47:00] | wagnerrp: | not exactly |
| [17:47:18] | wagnerrp: | mythtv has support for bluray video content, and bluray folder structures |
| [17:47:46] | wagnerrp: | it can play directly from the disk, within the limits of open source decryption capability |
| [17:48:03] | wagnerrp: | which means AACS using older master keys |
| [17:48:24] | wagnerrp: | or with a using your own keys generated by a hacked ROM firmware |
| [17:49:00] | sphery: | beadle: wiki may be out of date, too... I haven't kept up (since I don't transcode), but I'm pretty sure nuvexport now does H.264 |
| [17:49:22] | sphery: | don't know if it's only in unstable or if 0.24-fixes has support for it, too (I was thinking 0.24-fixes had it, but might be wrong) |
| [17:49:30] | epsolon77: | I've been out off the -computers for anything other than work- for too long |
| [17:50:08] | Gibby: | Anyone try the colossus yet? |
| [17:50:29] | beadle: | sphery: thanks. it seems to be an interactive operation and I'd want it scripted. |
| [17:50:35] | wagnerrp: | Gibby: there is no work in progress currently to make it work on linux |
| [17:50:52] | Gibby: | j/w |
| [17:51:05] | epsolon77: | is linuxMCE dead? |
| [17:51:14] | sphery: | beadle: could just get a real mythfrontend box and enjoy recordings without the pain and inefficiency (both time and power) of transcoding :) |
| [17:51:35] | wagnerrp: | pluto is gone, but linuxmce still has a few devs |
| [17:51:50] | wagnerrp: | do note that linuxmce is home automation stuff wrapped around mythtv |
| [17:51:56] | epsolon77: | hmm their wiki does't have an updated build since 09 |
| [17:52:06] | epsolon77: | that is correct I do understand |
| [17:52:17] | sphery: | they've always been way behind MythTV |
| [17:52:30] | epsolon77: | several years ago when I "planned" my home network I was going to use linuxMCE, but I'm not so sure now |
| [17:52:42] | sphery: | as they're taking MythTV, then making changes that allow them to completely bypass our UI and create theirs on top |
| [17:52:59] | sphery: | and it takes a long time to rework the code with each release |
| [17:53:55] | beadle: | sphery: I hear ya man. I'm interested in what the roku can do to so that's my itch right now ;) |
| [17:54:19] | sphery: | heh |
| [17:54:37] | sphery: | it can do netflix streaming, which MythTV won't ever be able to do, so there's that |
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| [17:54:46] | stuartm: | and in the process they are re-inventing the wheel, taking an existing application then throwing away the UI just to start from scratch on their own UI which does the same thing |
| [17:54:49] | epsolon77: | and the question of the hour that I already know the awnser too...How well do those cable cards work with mythtv? |
| [17:55:16] | wagnerrp: | theyve worked with mythtv for over a year nowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww |
| [17:55:26] | wagnerrp: | agh... |
| [17:55:56] | sphery: | stuartm: and, well, at least last I saw, their new UI wasn't really a work of art |
| [17:55:59] | epsolon77: | yeah but do they actually work |
| [17:56:10] | epsolon77: | yeah I wasn't that impressed stuartm |
| [17:56:23] | epsolon77: | but integrating phone and homea utomation sounded nice at the time |
| [17:56:27] | stuartm: | sphery: heh, that's putting it nicely, what I saw was just awful |
| [17:56:33] | stuartm: | and not TV friendly at all |
| [17:56:34] | wagnerrp: | silicon dust added support for their hdhomerun prime back in last april |
| [17:56:47] | sphery: | and, IIRC, not themable, yet |
| [17:57:03] | wagnerrp: | however they did not get authorization from cable labs until last month |
| [17:57:26] | epsolon77: | woudl ya'll recomend cable cards or provider boxes? |
| [17:57:31] | wagnerrp: | and units should begin to ship in a few days |
| [17:57:32] | stuartm: | a lot of what has been done to MythTV in the last 18 months makes dropping in automation scripts to be triggered by mythtv events trivially easy |
| [17:57:35] | wagnerrp: | or weeks |
| [17:57:37] | epsolon77: | and are ya'll devs or just know that damned much |
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| [17:58:02] | iamlindoro: | both |
| [17:58:12] | wagnerrp: | since we do not support DRM, we will only be privy to the 'copy freely' channels |
| [17:58:28] | sphery: | stuartm: exactly--the system events can allow a lot of the home-automation hooks |
| [17:58:40] | context: | so linux mce is pretty much just remaking mythfrontend to talk to myth-backend ? |
| [17:58:46] | stuartm: | s/do not support/cannot support/ |
| [17:58:47] | sphery: | and, really, if someone were to concentrate on porting the other features of LMCE to MythTV, everyone would benefit |
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| [17:59:09] | sphery: | (things like the "follow me" and such) |
| [17:59:56] | epsolon77: | wagnerrp: your saying that the cable cards would not support encrypted content right? |
| [18:00:00] | epsolon77: | aka paid channels |
| [18:00:06] | wagnerrp: | no, not at all what im saying |
| [18:00:13] | stuartm: | context: basically, with some other stuff badly integrated with that, you could probably do the same thing with MythTV plugins but without needing to write your own frontend |
| [18:00:26] | epsolon77: | sorry it's been forever and a day since I'f done the media thing |
| [18:00:26] | wagnerrp: | shows are flagged as 'copy freely', 'copy once', and 'copy never' |
| [18:00:34] | wagnerrp: | and that has no bearing on whether they are encrypted or not |
| [18:00:44] | epsolon77: | ohok your talking about individual shows not channels |
| [18:00:56] | sphery: | encryption is access control, copy flags are copy control |
| [18:01:12] | epsolon77: | aka, discovery HD is encrypted by the cable provider, and that encryption works, but only shows that are labled as copyable will be viewed |
| [18:01:14] | wagnerrp: | generally, copy protection does not change from show to show |
| [18:01:20] | sphery: | cablecards provide access authorization, but you still can't copy what you're not allowed to copy |
| [18:01:29] | wagnerrp: | correct |
| [18:01:40] | wagnerrp: | if you know anyone with a series 3 tivo, they will know all about this |
| [18:01:54] | wagnerrp: | as only the 'copy freely' shows can be viewed outside that specific unit |
| [18:01:54] | sphery: | however with an HDPVR and a set-top box that does analog output, you can record whatever your STB will output |
| [18:02:01] | stuartm: | I should qualify my remarks by saying that I am biased towards MythTV because I'm a developer and that I've not seen the latest version of LMCE (at least I don't think I have, unless it's really true that they've not released anything since 2009) |
| [18:02:03] | epsolon77: | I worked with the old TIVO's back when I worked for Comcast Cable, and it was a nightmare |
| [18:02:12] | wagnerrp: | and the 'copy never' shows must be watched within a rolling 90 minute window of recording |
| [18:02:39] | epsolon77: | That's what the wiki said |
| [18:02:57] | epsolon77: | wow lots of south american's int eh Citrix Master class today... |
| [18:03:32] | epsolon77: | so we could use mythTV to view copy never shows live? |
| [18:03:49] | sphery: | not through cablecard |
| [18:03:49] | wagnerrp: | no |
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| [18:03:57] | epsolon77: | oh ok |
| [18:03:58] | sphery: | but yes through analog output from an STB |
| [18:04:04] | sphery: | (and can even record it to watch later) |
| [18:04:05] | wagnerrp: | mythtv does not support drm, so it is not privy to access to anything but the 'copy freely' content |
| [18:04:15] | wagnerrp: | it cannot endure it will delete the content |
| [18:04:19] | sphery: | copy freely content or analog output from an STB |
| [18:04:22] | wagnerrp: | so the cablecard tuners will not give us that content |
| [18:04:29] | wagnerrp: | ensure |
| [18:04:35] | epsolon77: | ok so what about HD alalong inputs |
| [18:04:40] | epsolon77: | any recomendations? |
| [18:04:53] | wagnerrp: | for that, you need an HDPVR (hauppauge product) |
| [18:04:57] | sphery: | and even if we added code to follow the rules, since MythTV is FOSS, anyone could change their own copy, so we /can't/ ever get access to the other content |
| [18:05:52] | epsolon77: | such a shame...I hate DRM |
| [18:06:05] | beadle: | ditto |
| [18:06:10] | epsolon77: | I actually have to bypass MS Office DRM in order to use their software on Citrix |
| [18:06:57] | epsolon77: | so where should I put my power, if you don't miind me being more of a pain here... |
| [18:07:12] | epsolon77: | for the frontends, would a dual core atom with a decent video card be good enough? |
| [18:07:12] | wagnerrp: | ideally, everywhere |
| [18:07:43] | epsolon77: | oh yeah, and can the database reside on the backend server? |
| [18:07:43] | wagnerrp: | an atom with nvidia graphics is 'good enough' for a frontend |
| [18:07:57] | beadle: | you should never ask a bunch of people who lived through the 60's that question.... ;) |
| [18:08:00] | wagnerrp: | but the ideal frontend is one that can provide all your decoding needs in software on the CPU |
| [18:08:09] | epsolon77: | 512k what? |
| [18:08:50] | wagnerrp: | a modern dual core athlon/phenom II or core-i will be plenty for anything all the way through bluray content |
| [18:09:00] | epsolon77: | excellent |
| [18:09:12] | epsolon77: | how big should the back end be? |
| [18:09:29] | Slasher`: | hey all, my tv card arrived (the 150 thingy), customs charged me an arm and a leg, but it's here now and fitted... i've tried to configure it for the s-video input so i can have my digibox plugged in... i'm just getting green and red fuzz atm though on the s-video1 input and composite1 input – any ideas? |
| [18:09:47] | sphery: | good enough for now is probably a better way of qualifying an Atom + nvidia ION box |
| [18:09:48] | wagnerrp: | figure the same requirements for that too |
| [18:10:03] | wagnerrp: | the biggest issue for the backend is the scheduler, which needs to run rather fast |
| [18:10:07] | JEDIDIAH__: | don't skimp on the CPU if you are going for CPU decoding. |
| [18:10:18] | wagnerrp: | anything over a minute, and youre going to have problems with recordings |
| [18:10:30] | epsolon77: | I found a ncie server, that's a touch expensive, but 2 4core opterons with 16 gigs of ram and hardware raid....That's probably a bit over kill? |
| [18:10:45] | wagnerrp: | dont expect an Atom to manage more than a couple tuners on a smaller cable lineup |
| [18:11:14] | LedHed: | epsolon77, overkill is relative |
| [18:11:23] | wagnerrp: | beyond that same dual core athlon/phenom/core-i, your needs are up to you |
| [18:11:24] | epsolon77: | ledhed: while that may be true..... |
| [18:11:25] | sphery: | epsolon77: I highly recommend dual-core Athlon II or Core i (not Phenom II, and generally, not top-end i7), as it's powerful but will also do great for power usage at idle |
| [18:11:31] | wagnerrp: | based off software raid, commercial flagging, transcoding, etc... |
| [18:11:45] | LedHed: | my backend is a Dual Core E6750 w/ 2GB RAM and 3TB of storage (Soft RAID) |
| [18:11:59] | sphery: | if you get a Phenom II, you're getting a high-TDP processor that's idles at higher power usage and it's not really helping |
| [18:12:04] | epsolon77: | how many tuners and frontends do you manage ledhed? |
| [18:12:22] | epsolon77: | great point sphery |
| [18:12:27] | LedHed: | 6 |
| [18:12:30] | JEDIDIAH__: | MythTV can use all of the CPU and storage that you can throw at it. Depending on what you're doing. |
| [18:12:31] | epsolon77: | btw, anyone here play minecraft? |
| [18:12:37] | sphery: | as far as backend, you'll find that the biggest challenge is getting enough HDDs and PCI(e) slots |
| [18:12:52] | sphery: | so usually you have multiple backends when you run out of space for HDDs or capture cards |
| [18:12:53] | LedHed: | sphery, why do you need PCI slots? |
| [18:13:05] | wagnerrp: | LedHed: tuners? |
| [18:13:06] | epsolon77: | tuners |
| [18:13:07] | zombor: | i use a 35W i3, and it works great for a htpc |
| [18:13:13] | JEDIDIAH__: | tuners. extra sata cards. |
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| [18:13:22] | LedHed: | humm |
| [18:13:26] | sphery: | in other words, you will likely run out of physical connections long before you run out of ability to serve frontends or to manage concurrent recordings |
| [18:13:36] | LedHed: | are there CableCARD PCI cards? |
| [18:13:42] | epsolon77: | man I really like this motherboard, but I think you all are right, I need to downside...it's wasted money |
| [18:13:42] | wagnerrp: | no |
| [18:13:45] | JEDIDIAH__: | PCIe |
| [18:13:48] | sphery: | zombor: yeah, 35W i3 would be ideal (is that a mobile i3?) |
| [18:14:05] | zombor: | sphery: nope, it's a desktop chip |
| [18:14:07] | epsolon77: | ledhed: yeah I actually saw one, maybe pcie though |
| [18:14:13] | zombor: | i have it running with a fanless heatsink |
| [18:14:18] | sphery: | LedHed: or even NIC cards (if you're using a bunch of HDHRs) |
| [18:14:21] | LedHed: | Just go with the Prime when it comes out. |
| [18:14:31] | zombor: | dual 2.5GHz |
| [18:14:42] | epsolon77: | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?It . . . 01-_-Product |
| [18:14:44] | LedHed: | sphery, you connect the HDHR's directly to the Backend? |
| [18:14:46] | wagnerrp: | sphery: why would you need a NIC? |
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| [18:14:58] | sphery: | zombor: they actually make a 35W i3 desktop? or did you undervolt/underclock it? |
| [18:15:08] | zombor: | sphery: yeah, it's stock |
| [18:15:30] | zombor: | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116394 |
| [18:15:42] | zombor: | all of the T line i procs are low power |
| [18:15:47] | sphery: | wagnerrp: because you can only fit so many 19Mbps channels on a single NIC (especially if you have a 100Mbps NIC)? |
| [18:15:55] | zombor: | there's a i5 T series, but i think it's oem only |
| [18:16:06] | zombor: | only to dell, etc |
| [18:16:13] | sphery: | cool, didn't realize they had 35W desktop ones |
| [18:16:15] | wagnerrp: | sphery: if you still have a 100mbps nic, you shouldnt be using that system |
| [18:16:22] | sphery: | guess that's new with the Sandy Bridge |
| [18:16:27] | zombor: | yeah |
| [18:16:33] | LedHed: | I used to have 3 PVC-500's. then it was 4 Firewire cards. |
| [18:16:41] | eddytv: | zombor: do you have a link to the motherboard you're using as well as the fanless heatsink? |
| [18:16:43] | LedHed: | I love the HDHR, no more PCI slots |
| [18:16:44] | zombor: | it replaced my atom/ion nettop ;) |
| [18:16:50] | zombor: | eddytv: yeah, hold on |
| [18:16:52] | sphery: | wagnerrp: for me, I'd get separate nics so that I can connect HDHR directly to the backend, so I don't have a network switch as a point of failure |
| [18:16:53] | wagnerrp: | even my old Athlon XP system from 2004 has gigabit onboard |
| [18:17:24] | LedHed: | sphery, I guess that makse sense |
| [18:17:35] | sphery: | after all, why should my recording fail if I have a problem elsewhere on the network |
| [18:17:37] | wagnerrp: | if your network switch fails, you have bigger problems than losing recordings |
| [18:17:57] | zombor: | eddytv: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130570 |
| [18:17:57] | zombor: | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835220032 |
| [18:18:04] | sphery: | well, I've designed my systems to be standalone operable |
| [18:18:08] | sphery: | and it's been great |
| [18:18:10] | epsolon77: | wagnerrp yeah but for little no no extra cost it's a great way to keep recordings move |
| [18:18:13] | sphery: | and it has been beneficial |
| [18:18:20] | zombor: | with this case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163158 |
| [18:18:23] | LedHed: | my next Myth setup will use a small SAN |
| [18:18:23] | epsolon77: | I like that idea sphery |
| [18:18:41] | eddytv: | thanks zombor |
| [18:18:48] | sphery: | I had a network switch get taken out by lightning, but my MythTV box kept recording for the next 5 days until I returned home :) (granted, I wasn't using HDHR, but if I were :) |
| [18:18:52] | zombor: | i couldn't be more happy with all of it |
| [18:19:13] | zombor: | the cpu temps are a little high, but it's not bad for a fanless system |
| [18:19:20] | epsolon77: | my wife is not convinced the mythtv system will be nice for her |
| [18:19:33] | LedHed: | the wife factor |
| [18:19:36] | LedHed: | lol |
| [18:19:50] | JEDIDIAH__: | buy her favorite show and put it in mythvideo. |
| [18:20:03] | epsolon77: | thankfully I'm buying this with money my grandmother left to me in her estate, so she doesn't get to tell me no :-D |
| [18:20:12] | LedHed: | I dealt with that initially. but now she hates anything but MythTV w/ MythCenter Theme |
| [18:20:27] | epsolon77: | nah I bought her a 17.3 inch 8gb i7q laptop with a purple cover |
| [18:20:36] | JEDIDIAH__: | ...can't even change the theme lest the WAF rears it's ugly head. |
| [18:20:48] | epsolon77: | hahahaha love it jed |
| [18:21:17] | JEDIDIAH__: | so all of that spiffy theme work that's been going on lately kind of passed our house by completely. |
| [18:21:29] | epsolon77: | new citrix xenserver now has true GPU passthru |
| [18:21:30] | epsolon77: | awesome |
| [18:22:15] | sphery: | uggghhh... MythCenter theme |
| [18:22:33] | epsolon77: | man ya'll are an EXCELLENT resource |
| [18:22:45] | epsolon77: | how many of you actually have your hands in the code? |
| [18:22:45] | wagnerrp: | LedHed: a SAN? WTH for? |
| [18:22:53] | JEDIDIAH__: | you moan but it is simple and functional. |
| [18:23:19] | LedHed: | wagnerrp, for MythTV storage, along with Xen storage for VM's |
| [18:23:54] | epsolon77: | I wish I had 10 grand to spend on computers.....soooo many idea's |
| [18:24:06] | epsolon77: | that and a 65 inch monitor wouldn't hurt ;-) |
| [18:24:12] | LedHed: | yes it would |
| [18:24:22] | LedHed: | neck cramp from turning your head |
| [18:24:31] | epsolon77: | LedHed what do you use Xen for at home? |
| [18:24:37] | epsolon77: | or is myth in your office |
| [18:24:39] | wagnerrp: | insanity |
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| [18:25:26] | LedHed: | I have a Web server, Windows Domain Controller, and Myth Backend at home |
| [18:25:30] | wagnerrp: | if you run your own SAN, along with a server farm to run Xen with HA, just to record tv |
| [18:25:38] | wagnerrp: | thats it, game over |
| [18:25:48] | LedHed: | by Virtualizing them I escape lots of noise and heat |
| [18:25:54] | epsolon77: | I have a xen set at home for the game servers I run |
| [18:25:57] | LedHed: | and save money on utilities |
| [18:26:11] | epsolon77: | you've got to get a performace hit though |
| [18:26:21] | epsolon77: | especially on the Disk IO |
| [18:26:43] | wagnerrp: | no, by virtualizing them, you spend a bunch of extra power on the overhead, increasing your utilities cost as opposed to just running the programs natively |
| [18:26:51] | beadle: | yeah |
| [18:26:52] | epsolon77: | I have a xen setup with xendesktop at the office off an openfiler storage system |
| [18:27:08] | epsolon77: | wagnerrp I have to disagree |
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| [18:27:25] | epsolon77: | if you have multiple things to run it's way more efficient to virtualize all of them |
| [18:27:28] | epsolon77: | one machine vs 4 |
| [18:27:38] | LedHed: | epsolon77, not really. |
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| [18:27:48] | wagnerrp: | no, it is way more efficient to just run those four things on one machine, sans virtualization |
| [18:27:57] | Slasher`: | does anyone have a link to a tutorial for setting up s-video on a pvr-150 by any chance please |
| [18:28:18] | sphery: | wow, these apples are a lot redder than these oranges! |
| [18:28:30] | LedHed: | lol |
| [18:28:41] | wagnerrp: | the only reasons to run virtualization is if you need to run different kernels, you need to abstract things for HA migration and cant alter the program to do it internally, or you are doing development testing on another platform |
| [18:29:07] | beadle: | or you want to spin-up newer deployments |
| [18:29:12] | sphery: | (i.e. comparing virtualization vs running separate physical systems is not the same as comparing virualization versus using the same single system to run the programs without the VM) |
| [18:29:40] | LedHed: | I like the SAN for redundancy and Xen for recovery. Being able to snapshot my Servers is nice. |
| [18:30:03] | epsolon77: | snapshot is a nice saftey net |
| [18:30:05] | wagnerrp: | xen for recovery? |
| [18:30:10] | epsolon77: | oh god yeah |
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| [18:30:16] | epsolon77: | snapshot and your gtood |
| [18:30:27] | wagnerrp: | why do you need xen for snapshotting? |
| [18:30:27] | sphery: | wagnerrp does snapshots without the VM |
| [18:30:35] | LedHed: | and while I agree that running apps natively uses less overhead. Its also bad to put all your eggs in one basket |
| [18:31:02] | sphery: | LedHed: versus putting all your baskets in one computer? |
| [18:31:12] | LedHed: | sphery, no. |
| [18:31:13] | LedHed: | 2 |
| [18:31:15] | epsolon77: | I'm not saying Xen is for everythign, but it is nice in a lot of the tasks I do |
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| [18:31:53] | epsolon77: | I'm in the "master class " on the beta version of Citrix Xenserver now and it's looking nice |
| [18:31:57] | wagnerrp: | epsolon77: im saying Xen (and virtualization) is not for most things, but vmware had a great marketing department |
| [18:32:09] | LedHed: | and honestly its more like putting all my computers in one piece of hardware. |
| [18:32:14] | epsolon77: | epsecially for Heterogenious enviorments, HA and high graphics capabilities |
| [18:32:20] | LedHed: | but that hardware is disposable |
| [18:32:44] | epsolon77: | wagnerrp: VMWare to me was too constricting |
| [18:32:44] | LedHed: | if it dies, I just replace the hardware, VM's fire right back up |
| [18:32:55] | epsolon77: | NICE 10.04 i supported on the new citrix |
| [18:33:03] | wagnerrp: | epsolon77: im just saying vmware really started the whole virtualization craze |
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| [18:33:22] | epsolon77: | wagnerrp: I agree, but Xen and linux did it better |
| [18:33:25] | epsolon77: | to me at least |
| [18:33:50] | sphery: | if it's good for major business, it must be good for the home user... this is why I've started building my data center to house my millions of servers in the backyard (using the lake for cooling) |
| [18:33:53] | LedHed: | I wont be happy with XenServer till FreeBSD is supported |
| [18:34:34] | beadle: | sphery: you could gain a few micropercent by investing a few millions to replace the lake with geothermal.... |
| [18:34:38] | LedHed: | sphery, lol |
| [18:35:28] | sphery: | heh, yeah, I'll have to consider that--though here in FL, geothermal isn't as effective (average ground temps of around 76F) |
| [18:35:41] | beadle: | lol |
| [18:35:52] | beadle: | I'm in Iowa.... |
| [18:35:59] | wagnerrp: | sphery: but it beats the air temperature in the 90s, and humidity |
| [18:36:04] | sphery: | true |
| [18:36:33] | epsolon77: | nah just use a jet engine to cool the servers! |
| [18:36:43] | wagnerrp: | huh? |
| [18:36:47] | sphery: | and would keep the environmentalists (and neighbors) off my back if I don't kill all the fish and alligators in the lake by heating it too much |
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| [18:37:15] | wagnerrp: | a jet engine to cool the servers? |
| [18:37:34] | epsolon77: | jet engines can be rigged to pull fuel and air fast enough to cause an extream cooling effect |
| [18:37:49] | LedHed: | wagnerrp, ya the jet turbine turns a compressor, and it creates AC. |
| [18:37:57] | LedHed: | :) |
| [18:38:17] | beadle: | sphery: OT but I thought ground temp was pretty consistant in the temperate zone, say under about 10 ft or so |
| [18:38:17] | wagnerrp: | LedHed: then youre not cooling the computers with a gas turbine, youre powering the AC with a gas turbine |
| [18:38:28] | LedHed: | true |
| [18:38:33] | epsolon77: | http://www.asciimation.co.nz/beer/ |
| [18:38:34] | LedHed: | he didnt specify how |
| [18:38:55] | LedHed: | I have a portable AC unit in my closet. |
| [18:39:38] | wagnerrp: | epsolon77: little issue with using decompression from atmospheric to cool things, the loss of air density really limits the effectiveness |
| [18:40:12] | epsolon77: | yeah but the cooling is harnesed and then moved to the server farm |
| [18:40:14] | wagnerrp: | you would be better off bleeding air off the compressor, running it through an intercooler, and then decompressing it to atmospheric |
| [18:40:26] | epsolon77: | and withe a big enough jet engine you can slow the day (or night) |
| [18:40:38] | LedHed: | an intercooler is just a radiator |
| [18:40:54] | LedHed: | if you want serious cooling, just use amonia |
| [18:41:03] | LedHed: | its way more effective |
| [18:41:33] | LedHed: | or on a small scale you could use water and a Pelt |
| [18:41:47] | wagnerrp: | oh? theres good reason why we switched to freon and r134 over the old evaporative ammonia systems |
| [18:42:03] | LedHed: | when did we do that? |
| [18:42:21] | LedHed: | Our entire facility is run on amonia |
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| [18:42:31] | epsolon77: | it's been a while Led |
| [18:42:44] | LedHed: | maybe on a small scale |
| [18:42:46] | wagnerrp: | you can find closed loop ammonia systems on a lot of mobile and camping refrigeration units, because its simple, reliable, and only requires a heat source |
| [18:43:08] | wagnerrp: | but compressor driven heat pumps are considerably more efficient |
| [18:43:09] | LedHed: | but industrial freezers stull largely use ammonia refrigeration |
| [18:43:41] | sphery: | beadle: I'm definintely not an expert, but am going by things like http://www.greencastonline.com/SoilTempMaps.aspx + http://wellowner2.org/2009/index.php?option=c . . . mp;Itemid=51 |
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| [18:45:11] | wagnerrp: | the only reason i can think of using ammonia is if you want something with no moving parts, or if you want to operate without electricity |
| [18:45:18] | beadle: | sphery: me either. it does say "shallow" ground water though... sorry for the bother |
| [18:45:45] | LedHed: | wagnerrp, all large frozen food manufactures use Ammonia |
| [18:46:39] | LedHed: | I know. I've drawn many P&ID's for Kraft, Dole, Birds Eye, Green Giant. |
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| [18:47:45] | ** Slasher` explodes ** | |
| [18:47:48] | wagnerrp: | did they get away from ammonia coolers due to toxicity? |
| [18:47:59] | LedHed: | nope |
| [18:49:00] | LedHed: | though ammonia mixed with the right concentrations of O2 are very explosive |
| [18:49:46] | wagnerrp: | and if you breach one of those ammonia camping coolers in a closed space, it is very often fatal |
| [18:50:21] | LedHed: | I'm not saying Ammonia is right for consumers. |
| [18:50:47] | beadle: | I did look for an answer to this but.... does mythbackend expose a port that would provide the current recording being saved? |
| [18:50:50] | LedHed: | but large scale, its still the most widely used and cost effective method of refrigeration |
| [18:51:12] | LedHed: | Lunch. BBL |
| [18:55:52] | beadle: | does that make sense at all? |
| [18:59:47] | eddytv: | zombor: what are you using for video in your setup? |
| [19:00:08] | zombor: | eddytv: h264 (if thats what you mean) |
| [19:00:13] | eddytv: | sorry, I wasn't clear |
| [19:00:25] | eddytv: | I meant video card out to your display |
| [19:00:36] | eddytv: | are you using the on-board video supplied by the i3? |
| [19:00:38] | zombor: | ah, just the cpu video, hdmi out |
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| [19:00:50] | zombor: | intel HD 2000 i think it is |
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| [19:01:07] | zombor: | i915 driver |
| [19:01:35] | eddytv: | ok, thanks again. |
| [19:01:53] | zombor: | np |
| [19:02:03] | jams: | beadle- 6544 provides a webpage that might have the info you want |
| [19:02:09] | epsolon77: | any recomendations on an analog HD card? |
| [19:02:35] | kormoc: | epsolon77, there is no such thing? |
| [19:02:35] | sphery: | beadle: yeah, http://geoheat.oit.edu/pdf/tp32.pdf is specifically about heating/cooling and uses 75F for FL (both for water and ground temp in the 5–100' range). And http://cipco.apogee.net/geo/gdgbtem.asp + http://cipco.apogee.net/geo/gdgbtem6.asp show around 72–77. |
| [19:02:48] | epsolon77: | no such thing? |
| [19:03:21] | devinheitmueller: | epsolon77: the only device which can capture analog HD which is supported under Linux is the HD-PVR. |
| [19:03:29] | beadle: | jams: thank you. I don't know what you mean by 6544 though. sorry. |
| [19:03:45] | epsolon77: | devin: thank you I understand now |
| [19:04:02] | jams: | beadle- you asked for a port..thats the port number |
| [19:04:14] | jams: | http://mythbacked.ip:6544 |
| [19:04:20] | devinheitmueller: | I can only assume that kormoc was suggesting that there were no "cards" meaning internal cards such as PCI/PCIe, as opposed to USB. |
| [19:04:31] | kormoc: | devinheitmueller, correct |
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| [19:04:54] | epsolon77: | so what's the best way to tie my hd cable channels into mythtv |
| [19:04:58] | epsolon77: | through the PVR? |
| [19:05:48] | kormoc: | epsolon77, for comcast? You can first try firewire, and if that doesn't work, the hdpvr and using a cable box is a good solution |
| [19:06:31] | epsolon77: | firewire directly from the HD box to the system? Are the firewire ports active on the Comcast Motorola firmware? |
| [19:06:35] | beadle: | sphery: interesting. we have a fair amount of green going on here and it's a small town. I didn't know the difference tho... |
| [19:06:58] | beadle: | jams: I was interested in getting access to the data being saved in some kind of stream. |
| [19:08:52] | jams: | it would still be over that port, but you have to speak mythproto to get the info you want. Have a look at mythweb. |
| [19:09:05] | beadle: | ahh |
| [19:11:12] | wagnerrp: | jams, beadle: actually, you can access the recordings through the web interface |
| [19:11:22] | wagnerrp: | its used for UPNP clients |
| [19:11:34] | jams: | that it true |
| [19:12:51] | jams: | i forget upnp is there as i have it disabled |
| [19:13:34] | wagnerrp: | you specifically disable it on the command line? |
| [19:13:39] | jams: | yes |
| [19:13:47] | wagnerrp: | why? |
| [19:17:45] | beadle: | I guess I was thinking more in terms of mythfrontend playing live tv. while that is now file based, it still is 'streamed' to the client. I was wondering about a raw stream from the backend over a port. |
| [19:18:09] | kormoc: | beadle, mythproto handles that |
| [19:18:10] | beadle: | maybe I'm just mis-guided.... ;) |
| [19:18:21] | wagnerrp: | beadle: yes, you can get the raw stream either by pulling the proper page on the backend web server, or by learning to speak mythproto |
| [19:18:23] | jams: | upnp has never played nice in my setup. having it enabled causes major network delays for some machines |
| [19:18:39] | ** wagnerrp wonders where the bug is for that.... :) ** | |
| [19:18:46] | wagnerrp: | s/big/ticket/ |
| [19:19:12] | beadle: | mythproto. ok. I'll take a quick search. thanks folks! |
| [19:20:33] | eddytv: | Anybody use a Hauppauge 2250 PCIe dual-tuner card? I've got it working fine... BUT it always shows 0% signal strength and a 2.5dB S/N in the OSD, which is kind of a bummer. |
| [19:22:51] | zombor: | eddytv: ive got the same card, same thing, i never really thought about it |
| [19:24:49] | wagnerrp: | sphery: apparently microsoft is dumping silverlight |
| [19:25:13] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: the issue is different devices report the SNR in different formats. |
| [19:25:18] | eddytv: | I wanted to tweak the aiming of my antenna, but I can't find a way to get any sort of "signal strength" to display. Was hoping it was just something missing in regards to the 2250 card... |
| [19:25:30] | devinheitmueller: | In the case of the 2250, just mulitply by 10. (e.g. an SNR of 2.5dB is actually 25) |
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| [19:25:40] | devinheitmueller: | ... and 25 is pretty good for ATSC. |
| [19:25:45] | zombor: | maybe it's a firmware thing |
| [19:25:45] | devinheitmueller: | (the cap is 30) |
| [19:25:57] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: it's *always* 2.5 on the display though, it never changes |
| [19:26:19] | devinheitmueller: | Then Myth has some sort of bug then. |
| [19:26:36] | zombor: | could be, i dont use the tuner with any other apps |
| [19:26:40] | devinheitmueller: | You can run azap to see the SNR being reproted by the tuner. |
| [19:26:48] | sphery: | wagnerrp: really... interesting--I'd heard rumors, but MS kept denying it |
| [19:26:58] | eddytv: | since the 2250 is a video4linux based driver, are there any other tools that I could try to read the signal strength from the card? |
| [19:27:08] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: what is azap from? |
| [19:27:23] | devinheitmueller: | There *is* a general problem with how SNR is reported differently from different drivers, and in fact MythTV made an assumption that it's in a format different than what that card reports. But it shouldn't be *stuck* at 2.5. |
| [19:27:30] | devinheitmueller: | azap is a command line tool for tuning. |
| [19:27:34] | sphery: | zombor: what display? are you using the signal monitor (Alt-F7, IIRC) |
| [19:27:36] | zombor: | right, from what package |
| [19:27:42] | devinheitmueller: | varies by distro. |
| [19:27:46] | zombor: | sphery: no, from the OSD when changing channels |
| [19:27:46] | devinheitmueller: | typically something like dvb-utils. |
| [19:27:54] | stuartm: | devinheitmueller: I've always wondered why the drivers can't adjust the figures to a standard metric, at least in those cases where enough is known to perform that conversion |
| [19:28:11] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: Oh, don't get me started on that again. It's *so* f**king infuriating. |
| [19:28:12] | zombor: | media-tv/linuxtv-dvb-apps |
| [19:28:13] | sphery: | zombor: that's useless since it's not actually monitoring it (just gives a value--which may be before the card reports anything useful) |
| [19:28:19] | sphery: | zombor: use the signal monitor |
| [19:28:28] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: if you're *really* wondering, you can read the threads on linux-media on the topic. |
| [19:28:36] | eddytv: | The values I'm talking about (0% signal strength) are what shows up in the OSD when you tune a channel |
| [19:28:52] | zombor: | right, i get the same thing as eddytv, i just never cared l( |
| [19:28:54] | zombor: | ;) |
| [19:28:55] | stuartm: | devinheitmueller: heh, ok, it seemed unlikely that I was the first to ask that question ;) |
| [19:29:02] | devinheitmueller: | The signal strength indicator doesn't work for the 2250 driver at all. You can only use the SNR reading. |
| [19:29:30] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: no, you are not. I've pushed for it several times, and this is a true example of a combination of "design by committee" and "perfect is the enemy of good" |
| [19:29:35] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: is the lack of signal stength a bug in the driver for the 2250, or is the card not capable of providing that info? |
| [19:30:03] | devinheitmueller: | It's not a *bug*, it was never implemented in the driver because it was unknown how to compute it with that particular chip. |
| [19:30:09] | Muzer: | I assume MythTV doesn't support RTMP except through the flash plugin in the browser...? |
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| [19:30:27] | devinheitmueller: | There is a bug in that it reports the SNR in the strength field instead of returning -EINVAL. |
| [19:30:27] | sphery: | wagnerrp: wonder what Netflix will do... Flash? |
| [19:30:28] | epsolon77: | "It's not a bug, it's a feature!" |
| [19:30:46] | wagnerrp: | dont know |
| [19:30:54] | devinheitmueller: | That said though, even if the driver returned -EINVAL, MythTV would still report it as a strength of 0. |
| [19:31:04] | Muzer: | (I mean the media player, whatever that may be) |
| [19:31:04] | jams: | webgl! |
| [19:31:08] | beadle: | yeah that's what I was looking for I think. http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Myth_Protocol/Guide thanks again! |
| [19:31:33] | stuartm: | devinheitmueller: well we can fix that latter, I'd rather not report values at all than report meaningless/invalid ones |
| [19:31:35] | wagnerrp: | beadle: before you proceed, what are you intending to do? |
| [19:31:41] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: agreed. |
| [19:31:46] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: if something like azap can get it, why not myth? |
| [19:32:05] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: azap just shows the raw hex value. You can take that and convert to decimal, then multiply by ten to get the SNR. |
| [19:32:20] | zombor: | ah, you are talking about SNR, not signal strength |
| [19:32:25] | devinheitmueller: | Using azap will just tell you if the driver actually is returning 25 dB or if there is some other MythTV bug. |
| [19:32:28] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: correct. |
| [19:32:28] | zombor: | azap cant get the strength either then |
| [19:32:40] | zombor: | fair enough |
| [19:32:54] | zombor: | again, its not a big deal to me, i get like 40 channels over the air ;) |
| [19:33:01] | zombor: | no problems |
| [19:33:06] | devinheitmueller: | In the demod in question, both the strength and snr fields get populated with the SNR, which *is* a bug. That said though, we wouldn't know what to put into the strength field even if we fixed that. |
| [19:33:13] | epsolon77: | no one cares about signal strength, only the SNR matters |
| [19:33:39] | eddytv: | I'm having trouble with one channel "blocking up", so was hoping to see if some antenna tweaking could make it better |
| [19:33:40] | beadle: | wagnerrp: truthfully I'm hoping to manage the mpeg2 to h264 conversion over the stream, probably using GPU or other specific hardware, so that live TV can be made available to the roku channel. |
| [19:34:01] | devinheitmueller: | Nothing will get you the strength without changes to the driver (and in this case, nobody knows what the changes actually are). But you can see the SNR with azap, and assuming azap returns 25, then MythTV isn't showing garbage values. |
| [19:34:28] | epsolon77: | from my old cable days, the signal level is not as important as the SNR. if you increase signal, but you ingrease the noise just as much it doesn't help, so really the SNR is the only important number |
| [19:34:38] | wagnerrp: | theres already some guy working on a roku frontend for mythtv |
| [19:35:30] | eddytv: | Steven Toth wrote the initial SAA7164 driver for linux; has it been touched much since he released his stuff back in Sep 2009? |
| [19:35:32] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: i'd try azap, but im not sure what to put in for <channel name> |
| [19:35:38] | beadle: | wagnerrp: MythRokuPlayer ? I've got that working tho I did subst php activerecord for some of the dba code |
| [19:36:18] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: you would have to do a channel scan first with /usr/bin/scan. |
| [19:36:28] | wagnerrp: | were you planning on writing your own application to pull off this real time transcode? |
| [19:36:33] | devinheitmueller: | You can read up in the LinuxTV wiki for more info on using those tools. |
| [19:36:35] | wagnerrp: | or were you just going to wrap ffmpeg? |
| [19:36:44] | zombor: | yeah, i used them about a year ago |
| [19:36:51] | devinheitmueller: | My bet is that the SNR really is 25. Yank the cable out of the device and see if the SNR drops. |
| [19:37:08] | zombor: | im not home, id be doing this from ssh ;) |
| [19:37:40] | zombor: | would seem odd that every channel is 25 at all times though |
| [19:38:49] | devinheitmueller: | it's possible that it's some sort of rounding error in MythTV, where 2.5 is the lowest value it can display (e.g. even if the value is 21 dB, Myth shows it as 2.5). |
| [19:39:01] | devinheitmueller: | Hence why I suggested trying azap. |
| [19:39:39] | zombor: | yeah, have to find the <channel name> first |
| [19:39:56] | zombor: | i can get it with w_scan, eh? |
| [19:40:00] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: Yeah, others have worked on the driver in question, including myself (in this case it's the s5h1411 demod driver that provides the signal stats, not the 7164) |
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| [19:41:24] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: how would you feel if I gave you a list of demodulators and you jammed a table into MythTV that had the reporting format? |
| [19:41:27] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: gotcha. Well thanks for your efforts in supporting that card. Too bad about not knowing how to get the "signal strength" value (even if it's not important, it would still be "nice" to have a valid value displayed.) |
| [19:41:48] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: that would allow the GUI to show the right SNR for known demods, including essentially all cards sold in the United States. |
| [19:42:35] | beadle: | wagnerrp: probably would require dedicated hardware. since I know now that I can get the stream I'll want to find out what is available. maybe higher-end GPU's... otherwise some dedicated card. |
| [19:42:42] | devinheitmueller: | stuartm: almost every currently shipping product in the United States uses one of five demodulators, and 4/5 of them all use the 0.1 dB format for the SNR field. |
| [19:42:50] | wagnerrp: | beadle: no... |
| [19:42:54] | beadle: | ? |
| [19:43:04] | wagnerrp: | i mean were you going to use an existing application, or write your own around some library |
| [19:43:47] | wagnerrp: | if you were writing your own application to manage the transcode |
| [19:43:57] | wagnerrp: | it may be more worthwhile to just develop the capability straight into mythtv |
| [19:44:12] | beadle: | wagnerrp: the converted h264 stream would be exposed as a roku channel. or do I still not understand your question? sorry, I've been up since about 10 hrs ago |
| [19:44:33] | wagnerrp: | it would certainly be more accessible to the userbase |
| [19:44:53] | wagnerrp: | ability to transcode in-flight to UPNP clients is something that has been requested for some time |
| [19:44:54] | beadle: | yeah I was thinking that some middle tier piece would be the host for the conversion. |
| [19:45:06] | beadle: | but I agree with your observation |
| [19:45:58] | beadle: | in my case the PVR box is typically a cast-off of older hardware. adding a card to it would not impact. adding load to mythtvbackend would... |
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| [19:46:35] | wagnerrp: | if mythbackend could use the card to transcode the file, how would that be any different from what you propose |
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| [19:46:45] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v Beirdo | |
| [19:46:51] | wagnerrp: | in fact, such capability is something beirdo has had planned for about five years now |
| [19:47:13] | beadle: | heh heh heh... no cut on any of you but that's funny. |
| [19:47:31] | beadle: | not much different except I/O I suppose |
| [19:47:32] | wagnerrp: | yeah, it hasnt progressed very far... :) |
| [19:48:53] | wagnerrp: | using CUDA or OpenCL would be very interesting for transcoding |
| [19:49:07] | beadle: | the client to the coversion stream needs to be able to index it's place. that's maybe a req that myth folks wouldn't consider high importance. just guessing... |
| [19:49:08] | wagnerrp: | and the power efficiency it would provide would make transcoding actually worthwhile for space savings again |
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| [19:49:20] | wagnerrp: | however do note that no open source project has yet accomplished it |
| [19:49:27] | wagnerrp: | there are a couple closed source programs |
| [19:49:28] | beadle: | yeah I was thining of CUDA too |
| [19:51:14] | sailerboy (sailerboy!sailerboy@sailerboy.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) | |
| [19:51:17] | Beirdo: | wagnerrp: hehe, it's on my short list for post 0.25 release :) |
| [19:51:27] | wagnerrp: | if youre interested though, the x264 project would probably welcome someone looking to port some or most of the processing over to a GPU language |
| [19:51:53] | wagnerrp: | right now, its almost entirely x86 optimized (and very much so at that) |
| [19:52:06] | Beirdo: | meanwhile, I got some niggling fun crap to wrap up for release |
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| [19:53:50] | beadle: | my background is corporate and I find myself recently available to explore options. The roku box caught my interest. I've been using mythtv for awhile now. I can now play my recordings on my roku. I look forward, always.... ;) |
| [19:54:18] | beadle: | perhaps I should take Beirdo's release work... ;) |
| [19:55:09] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: yeah, i made a channels.conf, but azap keeps saying it cant find the channels in channel lisrt |
| [19:55:16] | Beirdo: | tonight it's propagating logpath to programs called from the code |
| [19:55:44] | Beirdo: | and perhaps fixing commflag's no-db mode |
| [19:55:58] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: did you copy the channels.com to ~/.azap/channels.conf ? |
| [19:55:58] | wagnerrp: | s/fixing/removing/? |
| [19:56:03] | zombor: | yep |
| [19:56:25] | devinheitmueller: | Uh, you're doing it wrong? |
| [19:56:27] | zombor: | sample line from it: WITI-DT;(null):587000:M10:A:0:49:52=eng;52:0:0:3:0:0:0 |
| [19:56:29] | devinheitmueller: | ;-) |
| [19:56:37] | devinheitmueller: | Oh, you used w_scan. |
| [19:56:41] | zombor: | yeah |
| [19:56:50] | devinheitmueller: | w_scan puts out a file in a different format than the zap tools expect. |
| [19:57:02] | devinheitmueller: | Check the w_scan args. There is an option to put out a channels.conf formatted file. |
| [19:57:03] | zombor: | google said w_scan can make a channels.conf :( |
| [19:57:09] | devinheitmueller: | It can, if you specify the right args. |
| [19:57:19] | jams: | zombor- fox 6 now! |
| [19:57:21] | zombor: | -M mplayer output instead of vdr channels.conf |
| [19:57:31] | zombor: | that lead me to think it makes standard channels.conf |
| [19:57:49] | zombor: | or do i need tzap format? |
| [19:58:39] | zombor: | jams: heh |
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| [19:59:45] | sphery: | think the thread "[mythtv-users] how do I change max recordings?" is going for the record number of extremely-complex answers to questions that aren't what the OP was asking |
| [19:59:54] | jams: | they are way to proud of having so much local news |
| [20:00:11] | zombor: | jams: all local news is |
| [20:00:24] | Scopeuk is now known as Scopeuk-AFK | |
| [20:00:34] | Beirdo: | sphery: why give a simple answer when an overly complicated one will suffice? |
| [20:00:38] | epsolon77: | hey does something like the Colossus card work in Myth TV? Or better yet is there a HCL? |
| [20:00:41] | jams: | yeah..that station really jumps out though..at least to me |
| [20:00:43] | sphery: | so far it seems only one person figured out the actual question and why the user wasn't understanding how things work, but may not have been obvious enough in the answer |
| [20:01:09] | devinheitmueller: | epsolon77: no, Colossus isn't supported under Linux. |
| [20:01:12] | sphery: | (the user is trying to figure out why changing maximum number of (jobqueue) jobs won't let him record more concurrent recordings) |
| [20:01:33] | Beirdo: | !url tuners |
| [20:01:34] | MythLogBot: | tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information |
| [20:01:35] | devinheitmueller: | Isn't this like the third time today somebody has asked if Colossus works under Linux? |
| [20:01:45] | Beirdo: | that's as close to an HCL as we have currently |
| [20:01:45] | jams: | yeah it's very odd |
| [20:02:03] | epsolon77: | thanks Beirdo |
| [20:02:08] | zombor: | urghf, "ERROR: error while parsing modulation (syntax error)" |
| [20:02:13] | devinheitmueller: | zombor, probably the tzap format is what you want. |
| [20:02:16] | epsolon77: | devin, I haven't been paying attention to the feed all day unfortunatly |
| [20:02:18] | zombor: | i dont even care about this SNR crap lol |
| [20:02:33] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: heh, yeah, colossus is getting a lot of talk, today |
| [20:02:38] | eddytv: | zombor: LOL |
| [20:02:45] | eddytv: | I'm trying to figure out how to run 'scan' |
| [20:03:00] | wagnerrp: | HCL? |
| [20:03:00] | devinheitmueller: | I can say for 98% certainty that the driver is doing exactly what it is supposed to in terms of the SNR reporting. |
| [20:03:07] | eddytv: | 'scan -a 1 -f 0 -t 1' isn't cutting it |
| [20:03:08] | wagnerrp: | oh |
| [20:03:10] | devinheitmueller: | wagnerrp: "Hardware Compatibility List". It's a windows term. |
| [20:03:30] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: just run the regular scan, not w_scan. |
| [20:03:35] | sphery: | Here I thought it was Hydrogen Chloride ;) |
| [20:03:36] | eddytv: | I'm trying |
| [20:03:44] | zombor: | arghf, i dont need azap |
| [20:03:47] | zombor: | i need szap |
| [20:03:48] | epsolon77: | actually HCL is a enterprise term |
| [20:03:48] | eddytv: | it just keeps giving me usage |
| [20:03:59] | epsolon77: | sphery that would be HCl |
| [20:04:24] | zombor: | eh, im done with this |
| [20:04:29] | zombor: | dont care |
| [20:04:29] | jams: | woah.my pci expansion chassis is due to arrive today. that was some fast shipping |
| [20:04:32] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: azap is for ATSC/ClearQAM, which is what the HVR-2250 uses. If you've got some other card, then it's not appropriate for you. |
| [20:04:51] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: well, neither work |
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| [20:05:14] | Beirdo: | I got my box o' disks today. Tonight should be fun |
| [20:05:15] | epsolon77: | jams newegg? |
| [20:05:23] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: depends on what type of card you have. tzap is for DVB-T, szap is for satellite, azap is for ATSC/Clearqam. |
| [20:05:30] | zombor: | i have atsc |
| [20:05:39] | devinheitmueller: | Then azap should work fine. |
| [20:05:51] | zombor: | it says "ERROR: error while parsing modulation (syntax error)" |
| [20:05:59] | devinheitmueller: | What scan file are you passing it? |
| [20:06:27] | zombor: | azap -c .azap/channels.conf WTMJ-DT |
| [20:06:34] | jams: | epsolon77- yeah |
| [20:06:39] | devinheitmueller: | Pardon, I mean what file for scan. Chances are your channels.conf does not conform to azap's standard (because you used w_scan with the wrong args) |
| [20:06:43] | jams: | shipped from IL instead of CA |
| [20:06:58] | zombor: | WTMJ-DT:557000000:VSB_8:65:68:1 |
| [20:07:02] | epsolon77: | jams I love them, I'm in MD and when they ship from NJ it's almost always next day |
| [20:07:16] | zombor: | i used "-X tzap/czap/xine output instead of vdr channels.conf" |
| [20:07:17] | devinheitmueller: | Oh yeah, w_scan is broken. |
| [20:07:17] | epsolon77: | which makes me laugh at the ads for "FREE 2 Day shipping" that some company has there |
| [20:07:23] | devinheitmueller: | Run /usr/bin/scan /usr/share/doc/dvb-utils/examples/scan/atsc/us-ATSC-center-frequencies-8VSB |
| [20:07:29] | epsolon77: | I nearly always get my stuff next day |
| [20:07:36] | zombor: | i dont have scan, and im not sure what package provides it |
| [20:07:38] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: the author of w_scan is not in the US, and made some changes which broken ATSC/ClearQAM scanning. |
| [20:07:40] | jams: | normally order from provantage for that very reason. but newegg had the better deal and i'm in no hurry |
| [20:07:42] | devinheitmueller: | dvb-utils |
| [20:07:54] | zombor: | no, it's not in the same package that azap came in |
| [20:08:01] | epsolon77: | so I never got a straight awnser, does the colossus card work? I'm taking it as a no |
| [20:08:15] | jams: | epsolon77- it doesn't work in linux |
| [20:08:18] | devinheitmueller: | mkrufky made the necessary fixes to w_scan to make it work again with ATSC here: http://kernellabs.com/hg/~mkrufky/w_scan-2011/ |
| [20:08:26] | Beirdo: | epsolon77: you did get a straight anser |
| [20:08:28] | wagnerrp: | epsolon77: there are no linux drivers |
| [20:08:31] | devinheitmueller: | epsolon77: the question has been answered three times today. No. |
| [20:08:37] | NewBuntu81: | So ClearQAM is broken for HVR 2250's currently? (Mine sporadically works and I was about to ask) |
| [20:08:38] | wagnerrp: | thats a straight an answer as you can get |
| [20:08:47] | Beirdo: | 16:01 < devinheitmueller> epsolon77: no, Colossus isn't supported under Linux. |
| [20:09:02] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: There are no known issues with ClearQAM and the 2250 at this time. |
| [20:09:08] | eddytv: | I'm currently running this: 'scan -a1 -f0 -t1 /usr/share/dvb/atsc/us-ATSC-center-frequencies-8VSB' |
| [20:09:14] | sphery: | woah, why is Beirdo on EDT when he's on the west coast? |
| [20:09:18] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: the discussion here was related to how to use azap to see the SNR. |
| [20:09:27] | NewBuntu81: | ok thanks devin. |
| [20:09:35] | Beirdo: | I'm not |
| [20:09:37] | Beirdo: | I'm on ADT |
| [20:09:39] | eddytv: | and it is now scanning away. (the missing thing for me was the file on the end giving it the frequencies to tune.) |
| [20:09:40] | Beirdo: | err |
| [20:09:41] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: it's `dvbscan` on gentoo |
| [20:09:41] | Beirdo: | AST |
| [20:09:45] | sphery: | heh |
| [20:09:52] | sphery: | still not PDT :) |
| [20:09:56] | Beirdo: | my linode is still set as if it were in Puerto Rico |
| [20:10:05] | sphery: | heh, makes sense |
| [20:10:06] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: fricking gentoo. |
| [20:10:11] | Beirdo: | the next timezone change for it will be to GMT |
| [20:10:19] | devinheitmueller: | (assuming dvbscan really is scan and not something similarly named) |
| [20:10:30] | zombor: | yeah, it looks like scan |
| [20:10:33] | wagnerrp: | im pretty sure theres a 'scan' on gentoo as well |
| [20:10:39] | wagnerrp: | at least there was last time i used that package |
| [20:10:49] | epsolon77: | appologies all, I must have missed it |
| [20:10:58] | zombor: | wagnerrp: well, it's not in media-tv/linuxtv-dvb-apps |
| [20:11:17] | zombor: | dvbscan looks like the same output as normal scan, iirc |
| [20:11:38] | sphery: | gentoo does a manual instal and renames scan to dvbscan |
| [20:11:42] | devinheitmueller: | zombor: alternatively, you can just edit your file to change all references to VSB_8 to be "8VSB". That's the bug. |
| [20:11:55] | ** Beirdo wonders where the OpenCL HCL is ** | |
| [20:11:57] | zombor: | it's almost done |
| [20:12:34] | ** devinheitmueller should give paid seminars on "how to tune your tuner under Linux" ** | |
| [20:12:45] | zombor: | my tuner works fine ;) |
| [20:12:53] | Beirdo: | but you can't tuna fish. |
| [20:13:15] | sphery: | see line 56: http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/ . . . ;view=markup |
| [20:13:30] | NewBuntu81: | Is it possible to have an IRQ or Com conflict in Linux (such as with Windows)? Since I've installed my two PCI pvr-150's, my hvr-2250 sporadically records. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. It isn't related to channel. |
| [20:14:04] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: Thanks for the tips about 'scan' and 'azap'. I now have 'azap' running! |
| [20:14:18] | devinheitmueller: | ok |
| [20:14:27] | zombor: | "status 1f | signal 012c | snr 012c | ber 00000000 | unc 00000000 | FE_HAS_LOCK" |
| [20:14:28] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: if you look at the SNR column, you will see a value in hex. |
| [20:15:06] | eddytv: | The SNR is definitely varying, anywhere from 00aa to 0140. |
| [20:15:12] | devinheitmueller: | 0x012c = 300 decimal = 30.0 dB. |
| [20:15:17] | zombor: | mine is always 012c |
| [20:15:34] | devinheitmueller: | 30.0 is the max SNR for ATSC with that demod. |
| [20:15:51] | zombor: | yep, and i always get that same 2.5 on the myth OSD |
| [20:15:52] | devinheitmueller: | Unscrew the cable a bit, and you should see the SNR drop. |
| [20:16:09] | devinheitmueller: | Ok, so if the SNR is moving around in azap, but stuck at 2.5 in MythTV, then it's a MythTV issue. |
| [20:16:14] | eddytv: | mine just printed some lines without "FE_HAS_LOCK" and a BER of 1715 |
| [20:16:30] | eddytv: | SNR dropped to 007d |
| [20:16:32] | devinheitmueller: | The SNR value is garbage if you don't have FE_HAS_LOCK |
| [20:17:19] | eddytv: | My SNR is all over the place :-/ |
| [20:17:33] | beadle: | NewBuntu81: not a mythtv question but.... I think it is possible. IRQ are handled by the hardware. it might be better to ask around on more hardware oriented channels. but you can use lspci to examine the runtime status and I use hardware lister and rescuecd in such cases... |
| [20:17:40] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: do you have a signal lock? |
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| [20:17:46] | eddytv: | Most of the time, yes |
| [20:17:52] | Cardoe (Cardoe!~Cardoe@gentoo/developer/Cardoe) has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) | |
| [20:17:52] | devinheitmueller: | ... because like I said, the value will jump around if there is no lock. |
| [20:18:13] | devinheitmueller: | If you're losing lock, then you're probably on the hairy edge in terms of signal quality. |
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| [20:18:20] | zombor: | devinheitmueller: ill verify the 2.5 issue when i get home, and file a bug if it's how i remember |
| [20:18:26] | devinheitmueller: | ok. |
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| [20:19:05] | eddytv: | it drops lock for 4–5 lines every once in a while, but when it has lock, the SNR is printing anywhere from 0140 to 00aa |
| [20:19:43] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: Is this over-the-air or QAM? |
| [20:19:47] | devinheitmueller: | (cable) |
| [20:19:48] | eddytv: | This is OTA |
| [20:20:03] | devinheitmueller: | Weird, I thought we had the 1411 driver cap out at 30 db for OTA. |
| [20:20:12] | devinheitmueller: | (0x140 = 32.0 dB) |
| [20:20:44] | devinheitmueller: | But yeah, an SNR of 17.0 is definitely very bad. |
| [20:20:52] | devinheitmueller: | You probably need to reorient your antenna. |
| [20:20:57] | eddytv: | The 0140 definitely looks like an anomaly; I never see any other 01xx values |
| [20:21:07] | devinheitmueller: | ... or the signal just isn't good enough for you to receive that station. |
| [20:23:25] | Beirdo: | OK, that's it. Time to get food |
| [20:27:15] | NewBuntu81: | Is there a way to "test" in mplayer for ClearQAM frequencies? For normal cable, we'd use this for Channel 3--v4l2-ctl -d /dev/video0 --set-freq=61.250, mplayer /dev/video0. Is there a list of frequencies for ClearQAM? |
| [20:27:29] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: any idea why it would be just this ONE channel that is acting so goofy? I just checked 4 other channels (so far) and they are all reporting a *solid* 0x0122–0x012c SNR, unlike the widely-varying values I get on the one station. |
| [20:27:54] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: It's terrestrial television. Chances are the broadcaster for that particular channel is further away. |
| [20:28:15] | devinheitmueller: | Remember, this stuff is coming from big antennas on top of buildings (if you're in a city), and not always from the same direction. |
| [20:29:15] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: after you do a channel scan, you can run "azap -r <whatever>" and then run mplayer against /dev/dvb/adapter0/dvr0 |
| [20:30:49] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: and yes, the frequency list is provided with the scan package. It's usually in /usr/share/dvb. |
| [20:31:22] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: look for a file called us-Cable-Standard-center-frequencies-QAM256 |
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| [20:32:17] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81, eddytv: this is actually a pretty reasonable tutorial: http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Talk:OnAir_USB_HDTV_Creator |
| [20:32:51] | NewBuntu81: | thanks devin. I found the file you mentioned. |
| [20:33:09] | NewBuntu81: | It's weird that sometimes it records, sometimes it doesn't. |
| [20:33:40] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: make sure if you have analog configured for your 2250 that you have the analog and digital sides of each tuner in the same MythTV recording group. |
| [20:33:49] | devinheitmueller: | (to ensure that the analog and digital don't get used simultaneously) |
| [20:34:49] | NewBuntu81: | Ok, i have both tuners using DVB. That shouldn't be a problem, correct? (I used to use both as analog, until Comcast digitized channels) |
| [20:35:07] | devinheitmueller: | NewBuntu81: just make sure you have removed the v4l2 devices from mythtv-setup. |
| [20:35:31] | devinheitmueller: | Correct though, you can indeed have both tuners using dvb. |
| [20:36:13] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: I'm just trying to get the channels in green... http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper& . . . 1b800187d67e |
| [20:37:04] | eddytv: | They are all in the same general direction, and all are (except one) are <20 miles away |
| [20:37:22] | eddytv: | And only one is giving me reception fits |
| [20:37:42] | devinheitmueller: | Reboot into Windows. I would expect you would see the same results there assuming you have the same antenna placement. |
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| [20:38:03] | devinheitmueller: | If you get different results, report back. Otherwise it's just your crappy antenna and reception. |
| [20:39:36] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: no windows to boot in to... honestly, I don't think I have a crappy antenna and/or reception. I appreciate your time though. I do have one other question, then I'll quit bugging you... is it possible the signal is TOO strong? |
| [20:39:51] | devinheitmueller: | Very unlikely for OTA. |
| [20:39:59] | devinheitmueller: | Signal overdrive is typically a problem with cable. |
| [20:40:01] | wagnerrp: | unless youre sitting right under the broadcast tower, not likely |
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| [20:40:24] | devinheitmueller: | wagnerrp is correct (to be fair, I actually do live directly under a broadcast tower, and have recreated this condition) |
| [20:42:03] | devinheitmueller: | eddytv: Also, any chance the "one station giving you reception fits" is the one that is > 20 miles away? |
| [20:42:37] | eddytv: | OK. I've tested all the other channels and they have a consistent SNR from 011d-0122 and never fall out of "lock". But the other one varies all over the place, from 00aa to 00d7... and loses lock. |
| [20:42:59] | eddytv: | No, it's the 2nd one on the list (NBC) |
| [20:43:42] | eddytv: | it's also the one that occasionally shows 0140 as the SNR |
| [20:44:04] | devinheitmueller: | Well, at 18 miles you definitely don't have a "signal too strong" condition. |
| [20:45:32] | devinheitmueller: | Oh crap. It's frigging Southfield. You're like five miles from my house. |
| [20:45:43] | eddytv: | Here's some sample azap output: http://pastebin.com/XikFYmqG |
| [20:45:44] | ** devinheitmueller looks back to see if he said anything to p**s off eddytv. ** | |
| [20:46:11] | eddytv: | devinheitmueller: LOL :) |
| [20:46:37] | devinheitmueller: | Imagine my shock when I put the LAT/LONG into for the station, and my own street was on the same map. |
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| [20:47:12] | eddytv: | I can see how that would be pretty freaky |
| [20:49:20] | devinheitmueller: | Frankly, I should have recognized the damn callsigns. I have a tuner locked to WMYD nearly 24/7 for testing. |
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| [20:51:03] | eddytv: | It's just odd that it's only 4.1 causing me problems. I have two 2250's in my backend and they both behave the same way, so it's not a bad card. |
| [20:51:53] | eddytv: | Plus, I'd think I should be getting signals in 0x11x+ range like I do for all the other locals. |
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| [20:52:34] | devinheitmueller: | Could be some sort of multi-pathing issue (e.g. reflections off of buildings, etc). |
| [20:52:46] | devinheitmueller: | Or interference on that frequency from electronics, etc. |
| [20:53:55] | eddytv: | the antenna is in the attic, well away from anything that should be putting out RFI, but I suppose it could be some sort of multi-pathing issue. |
| [20:54:57] | devinheitmueller: | Yeah hard to say. It looks similar enough to adjacent frequencies that I cannot see any reason why it would be have differently. |
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| [20:55:46] | devinheitmueller: | Of course, the tvfool output is based on zipcode, so perhaps your orientation relative to the broadcaster actually is significantly different than the other towers. |
| [20:55:50] | eddytv: | Well I really appreciate your time, and the insight in to using 'azap' to get SNR info |
| [20:56:09] | devinheitmueller: | You might want to plot the location on google maps, and see where it is relative to you for a couple of other towers. |
| [20:57:08] | epsolon77: | hey eddytv what channels in that output were you looking for |
| [20:57:40] | epsolon77: | was it 126–130? |
| [20:58:15] | epsolon77: | well line 126–130 |
| [20:58:31] | epsolon77: | oh nvm this is feed from one channel |
| [20:58:37] | eddytv: | lines 126–130 are where the tuner card lost lock — that whole paste is just the tuner status for one channel |
| [20:58:41] | epsolon77: | have you checked your connectors? |
| [20:58:53] | epsolon77: | on the coax from the antenna |
| [20:59:00] | bobgill: | I just tried to record a program to test my mythtv as the last few recordings since rebooting the backend have been 50kb .nuv files, and I get this: http://pastebin.com/U05Jc5it |
| [20:59:32] | eddytv: | yeah, every other channel is rock solid with SNR in the 011d-0122 range! only this one channel behaves like the paste shows |
| [20:59:50] | epsolon77: | I used to see this kind of thing all the time on the closed coax system, you'd get a burst of uncorrectable errors and lose lock for a second and it was usually caused by a bad connector or a cut int he wire causing a narrow band reflection |
| [21:00:27] | epsolon77: | funny thing about coax, depending on how deep a cut is it can cause a standing wave inside the cable, essentailly causing a resistance block or trap for a specific channel band |
| [21:01:04] | epsolon77: | i think if you looked at the frequency just above and just below this you might see a BER burst at the same time, but that it is correctable.... |
| [21:01:22] | epsolon77: | I'm not an antenna guy, but it might be a good place to start |
| [21:01:59] | epsolon77: | an easy toolless way to check would be to unplug the antenna and terminate that end, then tune in to channel 96–98 and listen for radio stations |
| [21:02:09] | Scopeuk-AFK is now known as Scopeuk | |
| [21:02:16] | epsolon77: | that's a great way to see if you system has ingress |
| [21:02:37] | eddytv: | well at least that gives me something to look in to |
| [21:03:35] | epsolon77: | yeah but QAM is a funny animal. If the system isn't nice and tight ingress can play funny games with the Digital signal |
| [21:04:12] | epsolon77: | it's a little bit of a long shot, but worth a look see |
| [21:04:40] | devinheitmueller: | epsolon77: he's on VSB. |
| [21:06:46] | epsolon77: | wll concept is close enough |
| [21:07:08] | epsolon77: | any signal traveling on a coax wire will follow the same basic principal |
| [21:07:34] | NewBuntu81: | Do you have to save your channels into channels.conf after doing the scan when using the mythtv setup GUI for channel scans? I don't seem to have a channels.conf file. |
| [21:07:56] | wagnerrp: | mythtv does not use a channels.conf |
| [21:08:15] | wagnerrp: | channels are stored in the database, like literally every other bit of data mythtv contains |
| [21:09:44] | eddytv: | NewBuntu81: to use 'azap', you do have to run 'scan' and save the output at the end to ~/.azap/channels.conf |
| [21:09:56] | NewBuntu81: | Right, I was trying to get it to show using the azap command. (azap -r 15_1) |
| [21:10:00] | NewBuntu81: | Ah, thanks eddytv |
| [21:10:26] | eddytv: | This link devinheitmueller gave earlier is a good reference: http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Talk:OnAir_USB_HDTV_Creator |
| [21:11:07] | bobgill: | I just tried to record a program to test my mythtv as the last few recordings since rebooting the backend have been 50kb .nuv files, and I get this: http://pastebin.com/U05Jc5it I just checked my mythfrontend TV Settings > Recorder profiles as indicated in the linked log, and I haven't changed anything, all is same as has been when working so don't know what is wrong |
| [21:13:33] | wagnerrp: | bobgill: what card do you have? |
| [21:13:56] | bobgill: | wagnerrp: pvr-150 (2 of them) |
| [21:14:07] | wagnerrp: | then you configured your card improperly |
| [21:14:19] | wagnerrp: | you should not be getting nuvs out, you should be getting mpeg files |
| [21:14:30] | wagnerrp: | you configured it as a V4L tuner, while it should be configured as an MPEG tuner |
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| [21:19:45] | bobgill: | wagnerrp: thanks! That was it, had set it as v4l, switched to mpeg and tested and works. Gracias. |
| [21:20:00] | epsolon77: | woo hoo wagnerrp!!!! |
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| [21:33:20] | Muzer: | if you give MythTV an RTMP stream, can it play it with its video player? Or must you use an external tool like rtmpdump first? |
| [21:35:04] | wagnerrp: | no, mythtv does not support rtmp |
| [21:35:20] | wagnerrp: | although for what its worth, is there anyone that actually uses rtmp and doesnt encrypt it? |
| [21:36:01] | epsolon77: | apperently Muzer, but for what it's worth, I dunno what your talking about :-D |
| [21:36:54] | Muzer: | hmm... not sure about the encryption part, but there's an XBMC plugin for TVCatchup written in obfuscated python that I've unobfuscated, and managed to write a simple bash script to play it via rtmpdump and mplayer |
| [21:38:33] | Muzer: | so I was wondering about making a Myth plugin – for personal use, probably, not sure that I'd want to release it, not without talking with TVCatchup and possibly re-obfuscating it |
| [21:39:04] | Muzer: | (the XBMC plugin is official) |
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| [21:39:40] | wagner_: | bleh... |
| [21:39:46] | wagner_: | epsolon77: rtmp is a streaming protocol used by adobe flash, and as i understand it, the only people to bother using it are using rtmpe (e for encrypted) |
| [21:39:53] | wagner_: | everyone else just uses http downloads and obfuscated links |
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| [21:40:24] | wagner_: | Muzer: considering they bothered obfuscating their code, chances are they have no desire to allow code reuse |
| [21:40:39] | wagner_: | there is probably licensing wording specifically stating that |
| [21:41:01] | Muzer: | wagner_: which is why I'm not planning on releasing it without giving it to them, and them possibly re-obfuscating my plugin first |
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| [21:47:35] | sphery: | the question is whether the XBMC plugin was theirs (in which case you should read section 4.5 of http://www.tvcatchup.com/terms.html ) or whether some XBMC user violated section 4.5 to create an unofficial plugin |
| [21:48:15] | sphery: | ah, I see you said it's official |
| [21:48:30] | sphery: | definitely need permission from them to do anything with yours |
| [21:49:20] | Muzer: | sphery: Exactly – I was planning on developing it if possible, then speaking to them and getting them to obfuscate it (or doing it myself if they'll allow it), then finally releasing the version approved by them (or not releasing it at all if they didn't approve anything) |
| [21:49:43] | wagner_: | mythtv doesnt support python plugins for them to be obfuscated |
| [21:51:05] | Muzer: | wagner_: ah... I sort of assumed it did. Probably not python, then... |
| [21:51:11] | wagner_: | nor does it support bash plugins for that matter |
| [21:51:38] | Muzer: | "Members may not provide links to this site" :o |
| [21:51:54] | Muzer: | have they actually read their own terms and conditions? :P |
| [21:52:19] | sphery: | heh, yeah, I was wondering if they'll sue me for posting a link to their terms :) |
| [21:52:33] | wagner_: | sphery: youre not a member |
| [21:52:34] | context: | hmm is tvcatchup limited to UK residents ? |
| [21:52:37] | sphery: | heh, true :) |
| [21:53:16] | sphery: | context: looks that way--they do territorial restrictions based on the address you provide (which their terms requires to be your real address) |
| [21:53:31] | Muzer: | er |
| [21:53:36] | Muzer: | you don't provide an address IIRC... |
| [21:53:36] | sphery: | though BBC is going to open up their iPlayer stuff to non-UK with a $10 subscription |
| [21:53:38] | Muzer: | but they do IP filtering |
| [21:53:54] | Muzer: | and apparently they take active efforts to block VPNs and proxies |
| [21:54:23] | Muzer: | I don't remember providing an address when I signed up, at least – but perhaps I did :P |
| [21:54:38] | Muzer: | if that's the case it may well be for TV licensing purposes... |
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| [21:55:07] | Muzer: | anyway, the plugin for XBMC (and, therefore, my hypothetical one for MythTV) requires you to have an account |
| [21:55:19] | context: | kk |
| [21:55:24] | sphery: | ah, I didn't try to sign up, but based on Territorial limitations and Data protection sections, it sounded like they were going off address |
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| [21:55:55] | sphery: | glad their blocking proxies--too many people are stealing services with them |
| [21:56:08] | Muzer: | yeah |
| [21:56:19] | sphery: | and making good things, like Tor, into tools of thievery |
| [21:56:27] | Muzer: | indeed |
| [21:56:38] | iamlindoro: | !trout sphery they've got your their there |
| [21:56:38] | ** MythLogBot slaps sphery with a they've got your their there trout on behalf of iamlindoro... ** | |
| [21:57:01] | Muzer: | what?: P |
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| [21:57:18] | iamlindoro: | Proper grammar waits for now man |
| [21:57:21] | iamlindoro: | har har |
| [21:57:26] | iamlindoro: | "no man" |
| [21:57:34] | iamlindoro: | "glad their blocking proxies" |
| [21:57:56] | sphery: | anyway, this is an interesting service |
| [21:58:18] | sphery: | iamlindoro: you're mis-reading that... you're missing the implied "they are using" |
| [21:58:38] | sphery: | glad (they are using) their blocking (of) proxies |
| [21:58:57] | sphery: | ok, actually I think I'd rather take the blame for mis-typing my they're |
| [21:59:27] | iamlindoro: | heh |
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| [22:00:00] | sphery: | to tvcatchup is basically UK's Hulu? |
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| [22:00:22] | wagner_: | seems that way |
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| [22:00:42] | sphery: | that's good--maybe they'll figure out how to make money so Hulu can copy them |
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| [22:07:05] | Muzer: | sphery: they have advertisements before you can start watching in the flash app (but not in the XBMC plugin) |
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| [22:11:19] | wagner_: | and this is their official xbmc app? |
| [22:12:07] | Muzer: | yes |
| [22:12:41] | Muzer: | I don't think they're actually getting much in the way of permission to do what they do, btw |
| [22:12:50] | Muzer: | I hear they're in legal troubles with most of the major broadcasters in this country :P |
| [22:13:19] | wagner_: | so they dont actually have contracts with the shows theyre rebroadcasting? |
| [22:14:01] | Muzer: | I don't know for sure, but I don't believe so |
| [22:14:09] | sphery: | maybe that's what Hulu is doing wrong--they're actually securing contracts to distribute the content |
| [22:14:12] | Muzer: | they certainly didn't when they first launched – they had an online-based PVR function |
| [22:14:15] | Muzer: | and they got shut down |
| [22:14:27] | Muzer: | they probably came to a casual agreement oslt |
| [22:14:27] | sphery: | (which, it sounds like, will no longer be "co-exclusive" very soon) |
| [22:15:35] | Muzer: | I mean, they broadcast the original channels verbatim, complete with original adverts, and it's still only being broadcast to this country, so tbh I don't see why the broadcasters are caring... surely it's more profitable if anything, they're getting more coverage for free! |
| [22:20:30] | Muzer: | hmm |
| [22:21:23] | Muzer: | from reading around, it looks like the only way they'll win is on a legal loophole (the law is about broadcasting, and what they're doing isn't broadcasting) |
| [22:21:42] | eddytv: | Is there a way to display the "SIGNALMON" (which defaults to Alt+F7) while still showing live TV? Whenever I press that key, live TV stops updating, but the S/N and BE values in the OSD update. Not until I press Alt+F7 again does the video start displaying again. |
| [22:21:58] | wagner_: | that sounds like a bug |
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| [22:27:14] | Muzer: | is there some way for MythTV to sleep or even turn off the system and schedule itself to wake up a few minutes before a recording? |
| [22:27:33] | Muzer: | The BIOS looks like it could support such a thing, if it even exists... |
| [22:28:10] | eddytv: | Muzer: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/ACPI_Wakeup |
| [22:28:15] | Muzer: | ah, thanks |
| [22:28:29] | Muzer: | I couldn't get the search terms right for some reason in Google :P |
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| [22:29:09] | Slasher`: | hey all, my tv card arrived (the 150-pvr i think it was), customs charged me an arm and a leg, but it's here now and fitted... i've tried to configure it for the s-video input so i can have my digibox plugged in... i'm just getting green and red fuzz (see http://bitpic.bitboxes.co.uk/images/735Screenshot_8.png) though on the s-video1 input and composite1 input – any ideas? |
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| [22:47:29] | sphery: | eddytv: are you sure your playback profile is set up properly? you should be using either Slim or one of the VDPAU ones--definitely not CPU+ or any of the other CPU <whatever> ones |
| [22:50:53] | eddytv: | I'm using "VDPAU Normal" |
| [22:51:02] | sphery: | strange |
| [22:51:06] | sphery: | should be able to keep up, then |
| [22:51:54] | eddytv: | It's not like it stutters or anything — as soon as I hit the "SIGNALMON" key, the screen freezes, and only the OSD updates, until I press the SIGNALMON key again |
| [22:52:07] | eddytv: | Then the OSD fades away and live video resumes |
| [22:52:09] | sphery: | Slasher`: and you've set it up as an IVTV MPEG-2 encoder in MythTV? |
| [22:52:14] | sphery: | have you tested it outside MythTV |
| [22:52:34] | sphery: | eddytv: it may be due to changes to the way we're drawing the OSD that went in for 0.24 |
| [22:52:43] | Slasher`: | IVTV let me just check |
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| [22:53:05] | sphery: | it and video decode are now in the same thread, so if the OSD drawing monopolizes the time, we may not be able to decode/display video |
| [22:53:19] | sphery: | I haven't tested on my system... |
| [22:53:59] | Slasher`: | ok it wasn't setup as IVTV but i'm sure i've tried that, should i set it to IVTV, make the default input "svideo1" and re-do all my inputs etc? |
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| [22:56:41] | sphery: | eddytv: yeah, that's the problem... seems that in 0.24+ you don't actually get to see the video when using the signal monitor--probably just one of those cases that mar kk didn't get around to (or didn't know to) test |
| [22:56:48] | Slasher`: | ok, done that, getting this now – http://bitpic.bitboxes.co.uk/images/217Screenshot_9.png |
| [22:57:14] | sphery: | Slasher`: Try "Delete all capture cards", then try to set it up, again |
| [22:57:25] | Slasher`: | that was what i did |
| [22:57:28] | Slasher`: | tell you what, i'll clear the lot |
| [22:57:46] | sphery: | after Delete all capture cards, create your new capture card, then connect the (already existing) video source to the right input |
| [22:57:50] | Slasher`: | i appreciate your help by the way, thank you :) |
| [22:57:52] | Slasher`: | okies |
| [22:57:53] | sphery: | you are plugging in to the S-Video input, right? |
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| [22:58:07] | eddytv: | sphery: Thanks for checking in to that |
| [22:58:08] | Slasher`: | yeah |
| [22:58:08] | sphery: | and connecting the video source to the S-Video input |
| [22:58:12] | Slasher`: | yeah |
| [22:58:19] | Slasher`: | it's weird though |
| [22:58:23] | Slasher`: | there's 2 s-video inputs |
| [22:58:27] | sphery: | and you've set the appropriate TV format, right (NTSC or PAL) |
| [22:58:28] | Slasher`: | yet theres only one on the card? |
| [22:58:41] | sphery: | yeah, use the lower-numbered of the 2 |
| [22:58:56] | Slasher`: | yeah i set it to PAL, the card is NTSC but i was told s-video is region free |
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| [23:00:08] | sphery: | try setting the format to NTSC (for this particular card) |
| [23:00:23] | Slasher`: | ok hold on |
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| [23:01:09] | sphery: | eddytv: if you'd like to submit a bug report at http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ , that would be wonderful--just say that video playback stops when you start the signal monitor (Alt-F7) though the signal monitor OSD continues to work fine |
| [23:01:36] | sphery: | (that way, I won't feel guilty for mentioning what will likely be another bug that gets put on mar kk's list :) |
| [23:02:31] | Slasher`: | ok with ntsc i just get green and red, none of the pink across the bottom lol |
| [23:02:47] | sphery: | eddytv: oh, and feel free to mention that the same behavior occurs with Xv, OpenGL, and VDPAU rendering |
| [23:02:51] | Slasher`: | i do wonder if its my cable or something but i dont have any other way to test it |
| [23:03:18] | sphery: | Slasher`: might want to test it outside mythtv and get video working that way |
| [23:03:30] | sphery: | can use v4l2ctl to set format and change channels |
| [23:03:59] | sphery: | then use cat /dev/video0 > test.mpg |
| [23:04:11] | sphery: | ah, no need to change channels with s-video |
| [23:04:16] | sphery: | so set format and input |
| [23:04:21] | sphery: | then cat |
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| [23:04:42] | Slasher`: | hmm ok let me read how to do this lol |
| [23:04:48] | sphery: | I did at one time have a PAL PVR-150 (and I'm in NTSC land), but I never actually plugged it in |
| [23:05:13] | Slasher`: | i paid a fortune for this on recommendation from someone in here |
| [23:05:24] | Slasher`: | well, they were like ouch at the price, but i figured it'd be worth it in the long run |
| [23:05:41] | sphery: | PVR-150 is a good analog SDTV encoder... just don't know how to make it work "cross format" |
| [23:05:58] | sphery: | definitely better than any frame grabber |
| [23:06:03] | sphery: | (and should be easier) |
| [23:06:36] | Slasher`: | well listed under s-video is --- Standard: 0x0000000000FFFFFF ( PAL NTSC SECAM ) |
| [23:06:43] | Slasher`: | so i assume it can do PAL |
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| [23:07:07] | sphery: | Slasher`: also, might want to try a cold boot after setting up mythtv to use the IVTV MPEG-2 encoder card type... it's possible that using the v4l encoder type could have put it in a bad state and power off, wait for 30s, then power on could allow it to reset properly |
| [23:07:17] | sphery: | so you don't have to figure out what to undo to make it work right |
| [23:07:35] | sphery: | yeah, it /should/ work fine--I just don't know details of whether there are any gotchas |
| [23:08:09] | Slasher`: | do you know the command off hand for setting the format etc? |
| [23:08:14] | Slasher`: | i've worked out its -i 1 for input |
| [23:08:28] | Slasher`: | and for some reason i have to use v4l2-ctl not v4l2ctl |
| [23:09:00] | Slasher`: | oh hang on |
| [23:10:56] | Slasher`: | HMM |
| [23:10:58] | Slasher`: | oops -caps |
| [23:11:11] | Slasher`: | the test.mpg shows red and green too, i should maybe power off and back on as you say |
| [23:11:32] | sphery: | yeah, v4l2-ctl sounds right... I was just guessing at the name :) |
| [23:11:38] | Slasher`: | ahh okies |
| [23:11:52] | Slasher`: | right, brb, hopefully this works – thanks again btw! |
| [23:12:13] | sphery: | good luck |
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| [23:19:08] | Slasher`: | no go :( |
| [23:19:15] | Slasher`: | http://pastebin.com/7ysRYwtZ getting that if it helps? |
| [23:19:56] | sphery: | ok, looks like you may need to adjust your recording profile |
| [23:20:23] | Slasher`: | yeah i've no idea what that's all about lol |
| [23:20:33] | sphery: | try using 720x576 (if you have it set to PAL) or 720x480 (if you have it set to NTSC) with 48kHz audio |
| [23:20:51] | Slasher`: | do i do that from the frontend itself or from mythtv-setup? |
| [23:20:55] | sphery: | also, set the external channel change script to /bin/true |
| [23:21:03] | sphery: | frontend, IIRC |
| [23:21:11] | Slasher`: | ok i'll go look, thanks |
| [23:21:13] | sphery: | /bin/true in mythtv-setup |
| [23:21:23] | Slasher`: | okies |
| [23:23:44] | Slasher`: | hmm |
| [23:23:52] | Slasher`: | it won't let me set the height higher than 480 |
| [23:24:03] | sphery: | you've likely got it set to NTSC, then |
| [23:24:12] | sphery: | so 480 would be right |
| [23:24:15] | sphery: | try it that way |
| [23:24:23] | sphery: | if it doesn't help, set it back to PAL and try 576 |
| [23:24:25] | Slasher`: | ok |
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| [23:26:42] | Slasher`: | 2011-06–22 00:25:43.835 format_to_mode() does not recognize V4L1 <--hmm what's that about? |
| [23:26:58] | iamlindoro: | You are running a too-old version of .24 on a 2.6.38 kernel |
| [23:27:21] | knightr (knightr!~knightr@mythtv/developer/knightr) has quit (Read error: Operation timed out) | |
| [23:27:23] | iamlindoro: | if you are using Ubuntu, you should add their ppa and update to current .24-fixes |
| [23:27:39] | Slasher`: | that might explain it |
| [23:27:47] | Slasher`: | do you know where i'll find the ppa? |
| [23:27:54] | Slasher`: | please :) |
| [23:27:57] | iamlindoro: | http://www.mythbuntu.org/repos |
| [23:28:07] | Slasher`: | ooh thanks |
| [23:28:11] | iamlindoro: | np |
| [23:28:16] | Slasher`: | hey were you the one who recommended the 150 to me? |
| [23:28:49] | iamlindoro: | Don't know, we all recommend that device to a lot of people |
| [23:28:57] | Slasher`: | ahh fair do's |
| [23:29:07] | Slasher`: | i had to get it shipped from the USA |
| [23:29:25] | iamlindoro: | But no ivtv device will work under your current config, so you'll need to get to current .24-fixes |
| [23:29:27] | Slasher`: | royal fail (mail) ripped me off on handling charges, then import tax on top too, i got stung a bit lol |
| [23:29:31] | iamlindoro: | and then things should work swimmingly |
| [23:30:01] | Slasher`: | installing them now |
| [23:30:03] | wagner_: | you couldnt find on ebay.co.uk? |
| [23:30:28] | Slasher`: | nope |
| [23:30:36] | Slasher`: | only american sellers and they wouldnt list as a gift |
| [23:30:38] | iamlindoro: | and reading the backlog, you've also configured it as a v4l device-- you've going to need to go back to mythtv-setup and fix that |
| [23:30:43] | iamlindoro: | (once you've updated) |
| [23:30:53] | iamlindoro: | you need to change the card type to ivtv MPEG-2 encoder |
| [23:31:13] | Slasher`: | yeah i did that, that's why i asked why it was saying something about v4l1 |
| [23:31:23] | Slasher`: | i'll install the updates and check it all over |
| [23:31:29] | Slasher`: | i would never have known to do that |
| [23:31:30] | iamlindoro: | ivtv is still a subset of v4l |
| [23:31:35] | kisak (kisak!~kisak@pool-72-70-187-188.hrbgpa.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:31:43] | iamlindoro: | so yeah, good, just making sure that you've set the right type |
| [23:31:45] | Slasher`: | ahh that'll be why then |
| [23:31:46] | Slasher`: | okies |
| [23:31:47] | Slasher`: | thanks |
| [23:32:20] | iamlindoro: | in that case you're probably configured right, just need updated myth to work around the kernel issue |
| [23:32:40] | Slasher`: | the joys of a slow connection |
| [23:32:54] | sphery: | heh, I felt your pain Sat – Mon |
| [23:33:06] | sphery: | (until they replaced my cable modem) |
| [23:33:08] | Slasher`: | 150kb/s |
| [23:33:18] | Slasher`: | 162kb/s now |
| [23:33:24] | sphery: | I was getting 50–100kbps (on a 10Mbps service) |
| [23:33:25] | Slasher`: | hate living out in the sticks |
| [23:33:29] | Slasher`: | wow ouch |
| [23:33:56] | sphery: | yeah, but at least for me it was only 3 days--one of which I was out doing other things |
| [23:34:18] | Slasher`: | i tend to take my netbook to work and hammer their internet connection if i need something |
| [23:34:47] | Slasher`: | hmm the digibox is being a nice foot warmer |
| [23:35:38] | sphery: | so are you using some kind of scart -> s-video adapter or something? |
| [23:35:45] | Slasher`: | yeah |
| [23:35:54] | Slasher`: | i'll show you the exact one |
| [23:36:00] | sphery: | is it a homebrew or one you bought? |
| [23:36:06] | Slasher`: | bought |
| [23:36:18] | Slasher`: | although they might have made it up |
| [23:36:37] | Slasher`: | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt . . . TRK:MEWAX:IT |
| [23:36:59] | sphery: | I don't have experience with those, but I've had lots of problems with S-Video to composite or composite to s-video adapters |
| [23:37:21] | sphery: | heh, now I know what a scart connection looks like |
| [23:37:46] | Slasher`: | well yeah, i was just linking you to it incase i bought the wrong thing or something and it only went one way |
| [23:38:01] | sphery: | it sounds like it's the right thing |
| [23:38:06] | iamlindoro: | All bets are off until he's on current -fixes, since he's on the known-broken-v4l version right now |
| [23:38:18] | sphery: | if they had said s-video to scart, I'd have worried, though |
| [23:38:22] | iamlindoro: | so no point analyzing the output of video as we know it will be broken in the "released with 11.04" version |
| [23:38:38] | Slasher`: | a bit silly on ubuntu's behalf that |
| [23:39:16] | sphery: | well, it wasn't really their fault--we didn't support 2.6.38+ based systems until after 11.04 came out |
| [23:39:40] | sphery: | they just had a patch that made it compile, but didn't really do all the right things |
| [23:39:50] | Slasher`: | ah i see |
| [23:39:53] | Slasher`: | i take that back then |
| [23:40:28] | Slasher`: | should i reboot after they have installed just for extra measure? |
| [23:40:29] | sphery: | anyway, you definitely need upated mythtv if you're on Ubuntu 11.04 |
| [23:40:51] | sphery: | wouldn't hurt, though it shouldn't be necessary |
| [23:41:01] | sphery: | but could save a few minutes of confusion |
| [23:41:24] | kisak: | so, iamlindoro has rightfully bumped me over to this channel. I have a gentoo frontend (0.25 from 2011-05–24) running ontop of gnome and using an ATi Radeon HD 5450 and there's trouble with playback, and sections of the menu do not render, or render behind the current content. The logs lack anything obvious and when you try to play episodes, the sound does run and the logs report the video was initialized |
| [23:41:47] | sphery: | kisak: which video renderer? |
| [23:41:56] | sphery: | or which playback profile group |
| [23:42:08] | sphery: | utilities/setup|setup|tv settings|playback, 3rd screen |
| [23:42:20] | iamlindoro: | kisak, 5–24 was a month ago, there are a ton of GL fixes since then, can you update? |
| [23:42:34] | iamlindoro: | including fixing a ticket with that exact issue IIRC |
| [23:42:35] | kisak: | sphery: I can't get into those menus to tell you |
| [23:42:50] | kisak: | also, that is the current gentoo ebuild in the overlay |
| [23:43:06] | iamlindoro: | kisak, http://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/9770 |
| [23:43:09] | iamlindoro: | fixed two days ago |
| [23:43:18] | iamlindoro: | you'll need to get to a newer version |
| [23:43:52] | kisak: | it doesn't render black, it shows Please wait... |
| [23:44:04] | sphery: | yeah, it does sound like the recently reported issues |
| [23:44:08] | Slasher`: | hmm i'm getting moaned at that it can't connect to the database now |
| [23:44:22] | sphery: | Slasher`: did you reboot? |
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| [23:44:41] | Slasher`: | good point no i didnt |
| [23:44:52] | Slasher`: | brb |
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| [23:45:08] | Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v sphery | |
| [23:45:09] | iamlindoro: | kisak, That is more or less the same issue, which is fixed |
| [23:45:24] | sphery: | Slasher`: yeah, probably best to try a reboot, just in case |
| [23:45:42] | Slasher`: | will do, thanks |
| [23:45:49] | iamlindoro: | kisak, Given the dozens of GL related playback fixes in the last two weeks, you *need* to update for us to be able to do anything to help you if the issue still exists |
| [23:46:19] | bohan_h (bohan_h!~bohan_h@204.40.70.115.static.exetel.com.au) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | |
| [23:46:29] | kisak: | ok, so I'll just casually wait for kormoc to push the next ebuild |
| [23:46:37] | sphery: | kisak: also, out of curiosity, which drivers are you using with your radeon? proprietary or other? |
| [23:46:53] | kisak: | it's proprietary |
| [23:47:02] | sphery: | kisak: I /think/ you can just update the ebuild to use a newer rev... wagner_ probably knows |
| [23:47:11] | kisak: | (aka I'm lazy and don't feel like pain) |
| [23:47:20] | sphery: | the dev formerly known as wagnerrp |
| [23:47:42] | sphery: | yeah, you'll probably have better luck with proprietary, anyway--when it comes to OpenGL performance |
| [23:48:03] | wagner_: | what do they need to be updated to include? |
| [23:48:07] | kisak: | wagnerrp is a dev formerly known as a rockstar formerly known as a sheep? |
| [23:48:31] | Slasher`: | ok rebooted and it's lost all it's mysql settings etc |
| [23:48:41] | sphery: | wagner_: the recent OpenGL fixes for ATI |
| [23:48:52] | sphery: | this is the master branch, btw |
| [23:50:55] | ** Beirdo bashes his head against the wall repeatedly ** | |
| [23:51:04] | wagner_: | want some help? |
| [23:51:08] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [23:51:18] | ** wagner_ gets MythLogBot ready ** | |
| [23:51:20] | Beirdo: | nah, I think I got it well covered |
| [23:51:26] | sphery: | Beirdo: don't use bash, use a real language |
| [23:51:35] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [23:52:03] | Beirdo: | I'm so *BLEEP*ing tired of stupid coworkers that don't do their jobs when we rely on them |
| [23:55:53] | pizzledizzle (pizzledizzle!~pizdets@pool-98-113-194-183.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:56:05] | NewBuntu81: | i'd take stupid if i could get rid of the drama coworkers |
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