MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

Daily chat history

Current users (179):

adante, alan`, aloril, And4713, Anduin, AndyCap, anykey_, at0m, Azelphur, baffle, bbee, Beirdo, benc_, biffhero, BLZbubba, bobgill, boshhead, brfransen, Caeles, caelor, cafuego, Caliban, Captain_Murdoch, carmony_, castlec, castlec1, cattelan, chainsawbike, ChanServ, christ_, clever, ColdFyre, Computer_Czar, ComradeHaz`, Cougar, cromag, CyberKnet, cynicismic, dagar, dansushi, Dave123, dibbz__, Digdilem, dlblog, dmb_, dmz, drindt, dustybin, elmojo, Elshar, eNeRGi, eyeoh, felipe`, FinnTux, Floppe, GadgetWisdomGuru, ghoti, Gibby, gpd, gregL, GreyFoxx, grokky_, grumpydevil, hackman_, hadees, hednod, Heliwr, high-rez, hobiga, iamlindoro, ikevin, ikonia, J-e-f-f-A, jams, jannau, jarle, jbrett, jduggan, JEDIDIAH__, jpabq, jpabq-, jstenback, justdave, justinh, justpaul, jya, k-man, KaZeR, kc, keith4, kenni, kha, kloeri, knightr, kormoc, KraMer, kurre, k_ross, LabMonkey, larrikin, LedHed, leprechau, Linkeroo, lofidellity, lotia, Lt_Dan, M0nk3Ee, mag0o, mcl0vin, Metoer, mhentges, mikeones, mrec, MythLogBot, mzb, npm_, nutron, oobe, ozatomic, Patina, paul-h, peterpops, pheld, PhoenixWing, pigeon, PointyPumper, poodyp, Prost, psycodad, purserj, quicksilver, RDV_Linux, Rebecca_, rhpot1991, RobertLaptop, Roedy, rooaus, ruskie, russell5, RyeBrye, sgsax, Shadow__X, sid3windr, sidh, simcop2387, skd5aner, Slim-Kimbo, sphery, Splat1, squidly, sraue, stuartm, sturebror, sulx, tank-man, tgm4883, thefRont, ThisNewGuy, tomaw, tomimo, toorima, tris, troyt, Twigger, twoten210, ubIx, wagnerrp, Waterman, weta, Wicked, xand, XChatMav, XLV, xris, yatesy, zand, zuixro, zzpat, _charly_
Monday, December 6th, 2010, 00:00 UTC
[00:00:35] jya: does trac when lodging a ticket knows how to link to git commit ?
[00:00:55] jya: like you could do with r12345 or [12345] or [12345–12348]
[00:01:05] [R]: i asked that already
[00:01:06] [R]: :)
[00:01:08] wagnerrp: yeah, beirdo mentioned how to do that last night
[00:01:13] wagnerrp: let me check
[00:01:19] jya: ah, let me gou back in time then
[00:01:32] [R]: he just told me it was borked
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[00:02:00] wagnerrp: nevermind then
[00:02:27] [R]: [03:53:13] [R] Beirdo: are tickets going to be tied to git commits?
[00:02:34] [R]: [03:53:58] +Beirdo it's supposed to do that, yes
[00:02:34] [R]: [03:54:09] +Beirdo it's borked (the github plugin for trac)
[00:03:02] k-man: has anyone got an updated make script for building mythtv from the new git repository?
[00:03:56] [R]: compiling hasn't changed...
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[00:04:15] wagnerrp: apparently githubs strategy for that is 'SHA: <hash>'
[00:04:40] k-man: [R]: ah, ok
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[00:06:03] Beirdo: wagnerrp: the closes #12321 doesn't work in the plugin, it seems
[00:06:08] Beirdo: at lease didn't last night
[00:08:03] [R]: i love legally blonde
[00:08:09] [R]: "you're breaking up with me because my boobs are too big?"
[00:09:13] wagnerrp: Beirdo: is that possibly because of the workflow stuff?
[00:11:14] [R]: lirc support udp
[00:11:16] [R]: thats interesting...
[00:11:20] Beirdo: the hook hits the github plugin in trac
[00:11:30] Beirdo: but it doesn't seem to do anthting to trac
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[01:02:09] Beirdo: let's try this
[01:02:19] Beirdo: blah blah blah [27300]
[01:02:19] MythLogBot: mythtv:master/58edeb15
[01:02:23] Beirdo: :)
[01:03:05] [R]: lol
[01:03:17] [R]: so stupid question
[01:03:29] [R]: isn't it possible for 2 hashes to start with the same characters?
[01:09:38] Beirdo: try again...
[01:09:42] Beirdo: or in common use, [14324]
[01:09:42] MythLogBot: SVN 14324: mythtv:fixes/0.20/a5836b30
[01:09:49] Beirdo: that's more like it
[01:09:59] Beirdo: yes, but mathematically not likely
[01:10:07] wagnerrp: [R]: yes, its a one-in-two-billion chance
[01:10:07] [R]: than why are they so big?
[01:10:13] ** [R] refrains **
[01:10:24] Beirdo: to make it so
[01:10:31] Beirdo: they are 160bits long
[01:10:36] wagnerrp: err... 8 is four billion
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[01:11:04] wagnerrp: 7 is... 256 million?
[01:11:19] wagnerrp: yeah
[01:11:22] Beirdo: mathematically, you extremely unlikely to get a collision until you have 2**80 items
[01:11:43] [R]: i hate math
[01:11:59] Beirdo: at 8 characters, that is 32 bits, givin us until 2**16 before likely collision
[01:12:20] Beirdo: or 65536
[01:12:32] wagnerrp: which really isnt a whole lot
[01:12:33] Beirdo: which is why (for now) I used 8.
[01:12:41] wagnerrp: only using 8 characters is a bit dangerous
[01:12:52] Beirdo: it uses 40
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[01:13:03] wagnerrp: yes, but the shortened versions
[01:13:05] Beirdo: we shorten to 8, and if they collide, it will tell us
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[01:13:40] Beirdo: I am going to change the revision number in version.sh to to 8
[01:13:46] Beirdo: rather than the default 7
[01:13:51] Beirdo: likewise the emails
[01:14:01] skd5aner: Beirdo: so... any way to convert the existing svn changeset numbers on the wiki to the new git SHA # yet? ;)
[01:14:14] Beirdo: sigh
[01:14:17] skd5aner: r22000
[01:14:21] Beirdo: yeah, go in and edit em
[01:14:21] skd5aner: [22000]
[01:14:21] MythLogBot: SVN 22000: mythtv:master/8f812050
[01:14:38] Beirdo: heh
[01:14:41] skd5aner: Well, I think it's cool that mythlogbot can spit them out, just figured it was the next logical question ;)
[01:14:57] Beirdo: the same data can be used for other things
[01:15:09] Beirdo: I have it as a big CSV, and as a mysql dump
[01:15:13] wagnerrp: the next logical step is to write a bot to programmatically change all entries in the wiki
[01:15:39] [R]: can't you just setup forwards in apache
[01:15:43] [R]: so leave the links alone
[01:15:55] skd5aner: [R] the links do forward...
[01:16:08] [R]: than why do you have to convert anything
[01:16:19] wagnerrp: or yes, we could make a local page that redirects to git for all the existing changelogs
[01:16:27] skd5aner: [R]: the issue is that the svn number is part of the link instead of the new git SHA hash
[01:16:51] [R]: skd5aner: ?
[01:17:20] Beirdo: skd5aner: so go and change them :)
[01:17:30] Beirdo: or find someone else to do it ;)
[01:17:54] Beirdo: anyways, if there's a nice way to wrap it, we can do that
[01:18:14] Beirdo: but at the exact second, my brain isn't up to more coding
[01:18:33] sphery: Gibby: RGB24 is already in there... It's the MP_RGB24 = 4 that's already there. AFAIU, the problem is that the fix is not the correct fix--it's using some incorrect criterion to change the bit order of the colors. Your challenge is to find the right criteria.  :) Knowing nothing about ZM, I'd say see the commit where support was added for the V4L2 color representation (as it's more likely along those lines--though not that). ...
[01:18:40] sphery: ... http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/ . . . 39589#439589
[01:18:42] Beirdo: no reason I couldn't make a little web app that would redirect
[01:19:01] skd5aner: [R]: so, there's a few problems... so to speak... first, there are mulitple repos in GIT, unlike SVN which basically had a heirarchy under the same parent structure... so before the SVN revision number basically was consistent in trac
[01:19:18] skd5aner: [R]: in git, they could be under mythtv, mythweb, nuvexport, etc
[01:19:40] [R]: well how does Beirdo's script do it?
[01:19:41] skd5aner: so, a single {{changeset|SHA#}} won't work like it did before...
[01:19:50] Beirdo: it's not a script :)
[01:19:51] skd5aner: [R]: great question :D
[01:19:54] Beirdo: it's C code
[01:19:58] [R]: lol
[01:20:09] [R]: skd5aner: if all the old changesets have been mapped, than thers no problem
[01:20:12] Beirdo: heh, but anyways, I have a database of repo, branch, git sha1, svn rev
[01:20:35] Beirdo: that I pulled out of the imported repo details
[01:20:40] skd5aner: [R]: agreed, I had asked basically the same stuff a few nights ago (if mapping/redirecting was possible, or a find/replace)
[01:21:00] Beirdo: short term, we can make a redirector
[01:21:10] Beirdo: but long-term, you will want to just fix the wiki
[01:21:13] skd5aner: [R]: I was just pleased to see that Beirdo's bot was smart enough to do the mapping here in IRC, maybe that same logic could help "fix" the wiki :)
[01:21:41] Beirdo: it can
[01:22:02] Beirdo: but I need more inspiration :)
[01:22:13] Beirdo: it won't be hard to implement a redirector
[01:22:17] skd5aner: Beirdo: I'm in no hurry, you're pumping out solutions fast enough as it is
[01:22:35] Gibby: sphery i follow that link to https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/25061 which doesn't exist....
[01:22:38] Beirdo: I'll work on it soon, just not today, I'm a bit... fried
[01:23:15] Beirdo: the idea would be to have a redirector on our server that will get you where you need to go
[01:23:26] sphery: [25061]
[01:23:26] MythLogBot: SVN 25061: mythtv:master/a6bf4d04
[01:23:33] sphery: Gibby: ^^^
[01:23:35] Beirdo: but that will take a couple hours to put together, and I'm... tired
[01:23:36] sphery: thank Beirdo
[01:23:38] skd5aner: [R]: here's where a current link goes, with the existing {{changeset|####}} template and svn numbers- https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/{{svn r#}} – https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/24170
[01:23:47] Beirdo: Hmm
[01:24:01] Beirdo: sphery: you think I should just make that a github commit URL?
[01:24:04] sphery: Gibby: it's basically the same change--just using a different criteron
[01:24:14] skd5aner: Beirdo: Hey, I don't care if it takes you a few weeks... I'm not pushing you, I'm just happy you're on the trail :)
[01:24:17] [R]: skd5aner: huh?
[01:24:19] sphery: Beirdo: I have a feeling it will be used more to get a commit URL
[01:24:35] Gibby: hmm ok sorry, i was watching faith on the opening of sunday night football :)
[01:24:51] Beirdo: agreed
[01:24:54] Beirdo: let's tweak that
[01:24:56] sphery: that said, I like how it gives all useful info for us (repo, branch, sha1)
[01:25:01] skd5aner: [R]: the {{changeset|}} template on the wiki – just showing an example of how it's "broken" today after the git transition
[01:25:15] skd5aner: [R]: wasn't sure if you had seen it or not
[01:25:26] [R]: skd5aner: oh is there some sort of template?
[01:25:26] sphery: Beirdo: so I guess you could say I'm on the fence :)
[01:25:52] sphery: Beirdo: though, really, it's not so hard for me to click it to get the info I need and since more will likely need URL...
[01:25:58] [R]: skd5aner: well like Beirdo said... a redict can be done now, and in the future they can be changed
[01:26:27] skd5aner: [R]: yea, made it real easy to reference changesets when editing wiki articles. So when I was doing the release notes, I could always append them with {{changeset|12345}} and it'd link directly to the commit in trac
[01:26:31] Gibby: any other zoneminder users out there?........ need a troubleshooting/discussion buddy
[01:27:02] Beirdo: [25641]
[01:28:42] Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot
[01:28:43] Beirdo: [25641]
[01:29:59] Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot
[01:30:28] Beirdo: no no
[01:30:28] Beirdo: it only works when the bot's running
[01:30:28] sphery: oh, only works when it's logged in
[01:30:28] sphery: heh
[01:30:28] sphery: say [25061] and then say [25641]
[01:30:28] MythLogBot: SVN 25061: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/a6bf4d04
[01:30:29] MythLogBot: SVN 25641: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/c9b2f021
[01:30:29] Beirdo: try that again
[01:30:31] sphery: cool
[01:30:40] sphery: nice
[01:30:40] Beirdo: :) Regexps FTW
[01:30:51] Beirdo: it also does
[01:30:54] Granier21: anyone know if mythmusic can do look ups using musicbrainz instead freedb.org?
[01:30:54] Beirdo: !svn 4
[01:30:54] MythLogBot: No match for SVN revision 4
[01:30:58] Beirdo: !svn 6
[01:30:58] MythLogBot: SVN 6: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/84103e00
[01:31:07] sphery: what happened to 4?
[01:31:07] Beirdo: heh, I would pick one that doesn't exist
[01:31:12] Beirdo: I dunno
[01:31:20] sphery: you guys must have lost it in the switch! 8-|
[01:31:21] Beirdo: filtered out
[01:31:24] sphery: heh
[01:31:26] sphery: just joking
[01:31:32] Beirdo: hehe :)
[01:31:38] [R]: wagnerrp: you there?
[01:31:43] Beirdo: like we care THAT far back
[01:31:53] Beirdo: yeah, more useful with the URL
[01:31:54] sphery: no joke
[01:32:08] sphery: and it's not like you could have lost it in such a way that it unapplied the change, anyway
[01:32:31] sphery: I'm sure it had something to do with the cvs->svn conversion
[01:32:31] skd5aner: Granier21: No, mythmusic currently can't use musicbrainz for lookups, but it's a feature that's strongly being considered as part of the rewrite (future)
[01:32:56] sphery: or for which we'd love a patch!
[01:33:16] Beirdo: this should make it easier to support users still using SVN
[01:33:26] Granier21: skd5aner: you know where in the code mythmusic does freedb lookup?
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[01:33:28] Beirdo: BTW, it should work in privmsg to the bot too
[01:33:46] skd5aner: !svn 23000
[01:33:46] MythLogBot: SVN 23000: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/1f6c05b0
[01:33:53] Granier21: skd5aner: I mean can't I just change that to use the mb-freedb gateway?
[01:33:53] skd5aner: [23000]
[01:33:53] MythLogBot: SVN 23000: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/1f6c05b0
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[01:34:13] [R]: [1]
[01:34:13] MythLogBot: SVN 1: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/ce7a5f62
[01:34:18] skd5aner: Granier21: perhaps, I haven't tried and you'd be on your own
[01:34:30] Beirdo: interesting... the regexp doesn't behave in privmsg
[01:34:34] wagnerrp: [R]: yeah, whats up?
[01:34:40] Granier21: skd5aner: being on my own is not an issue
[01:35:07] skd5aner: Granier21: np, just saying that I don't know... you could play around and see how it works – I've not heard of anyone trying it personally
[01:35:08] [R]: wagnerrp: so i disabled dpms... your points were valid... and i this logitech harmony software is too smart for its own good... it wouldn't let me configure a DVR activity w/o a device that it thought was a DVR
[01:35:09] Granier21: skd5aner: you have a decent music collection?
[01:35:38] Granier21: Granier21: I mean what doe you use to compile your music library?
[01:35:43] Granier21: do*
[01:35:51] skd5aner: Granier21: I suppose so
[01:36:02] Beirdo: I think that was intentional on my part earlier
[01:36:03] ** wagnerrp doesnt remember what his points were **
[01:36:15] ** wagnerrp 's neck really hurts **
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[01:36:37] skd5aner: Granier21: well, every one of my tracks has been tagged via picard tagger and musicbrainz
[01:37:01] Granier21: skd5aner: you happen to like classical music?
[01:37:06] skd5aner: [R]: heh, yea – I've had a few harmony remotes in my day – they always think they know what's best ;)
[01:37:09] Beirdo: so in privmsg, you need "svn 1234"
[01:37:19] [R]: wagnerrp: about just turning off the tv... i usually do that, and its always annoying to ahve eto wake it up from dpms sleep
[01:37:30] Granier21: skd5aner: cause classical music using freedb is a bit looney, to say the least
[01:37:30] skd5aner: Granier21: yes
[01:37:33] [R]: skd5aner: but i beat it into submission
[01:38:03] skd5aner: [R]: show logitech who's boss
[01:38:14] [R]: lol
[01:38:24] Granier21: skd5aner: I'm hoping building a classical music lib makes more sense with musicbrainz
[01:38:47] [R]: skd5aner: and than i wanted a watch videos activity with an icon of a cassette and it woud'lnt let me do it w/o a vcr device
[01:38:47] skd5aner: Granier21: well, classical music is always tough
[01:39:08] [R]: i heart musicbrainz... i use picard for all my music
[01:39:09] skd5aner: Granier21: having the actual album it was ripped from makes it drastically easier
[01:39:10] ** wagnerrp wonders if its a bad thing that he now has access to the wiki **
[01:39:11] Granier21: skd5aner: there's no doubt about that
[01:39:41] Granier21: skd5aner: what do you mean? I have all albums
[01:39:49] skd5aner: Granier21: musicbrainz is was better for organizing classical imho than most other options
[01:40:11] Granier21: skd5aner: right, that's why I wanna use mb
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[01:40:30] Granier21: freedb makes no sense
[01:40:34] skd5aner: Granier21: meaning that If you look at it from a track perspective, a classical track is on a gazillion different compilations albums
[01:40:39] Granier21: too freaking 'random'
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[01:41:02] skd5aner: for example, How many albums do you think contain Beethoven's "Ode to Joy" – probably no less than 10,000+
[01:41:18] Granier21: skd5aner: bah
[01:41:28] Granier21: that's hardly the issue in my case
[01:41:47] wagnerrp: skd5aner: if you start off from the CD, you shouldnt have any problem
[01:42:00] wagnerrp: unless freedb simply doesnt have the information for those IDs
[01:42:01] Granier21: I think the one to many mapping is overblown
[01:42:02] skd5aner: wagnerrp: which is what I was saying
[01:42:10] skd5aner: wagnerrp: yea, but freedb blows
[01:42:17] skd5aner: wagnerrp: imho ;)
[01:42:33] Granier21: freedb does blow for classical music
[01:42:45] Granier21: next to useless
[01:42:54] Granier21: nothing is "normalized"
[01:42:55] skd5aner: Try getting a common spelling of Tchaikovsky in freedb
[01:43:03] wagnerrp: anyone know if freenode has a limit to the number of connections allowed per IP?
[01:43:07] Granier21: skd5aner: prokofiev
[01:43:13] Beirdo: skd5aner: that isn't in cyrillic :)
[01:43:37] Beirdo: wagnerrp: not sure, but it's > 1
[01:43:41] skd5aner: Борис Александрович Чайковский – better?
[01:43:52] wagnerrp: looking at an irc client for the wiki
[01:43:58] Beirdo: ahhh
[01:44:06] wagnerrp: seems to be ajax based, meaning it would run on the server
[01:44:07] Beirdo: you really want to do that? :)
[01:44:10] wagnerrp: i dont know
[01:44:17] wagnerrp: just considering options
[01:44:33] ** Beirdo watches the average IQ drop even lower **
[01:44:42] wagnerrp: or we could add a link to freenode's java client
[01:44:51] Beirdo: there ya go
[01:44:54] Granier21: skd5aner: you use a dlna frontend for your classical music?
[01:45:04] wagnerrp: Beirdo: well it would be linked to from the 'proper IRC behavior' page
[01:45:14] skd5aner: oh, sorry – wrong tchaikovsky ;) Пётр Ильич Чайковский
[01:45:18] wagnerrp: hopefully, it would raise things a notch or two
[01:45:25] Beirdo: all ????? to me
[01:45:33] Beirdo: UTF-8 and IRC does not mix
[01:45:36] wagnerrp: i see russian
[01:45:51] skd5aner: Granier21: no, I play everything via iTunes as my primary player (yes I know... but I like it alright) and directly in MythMusic as well
[01:45:51] Beirdo: IRC is by its definition 7-bit ASCII
[01:46:05] [R]: Beirdo: most modern clients and mordern servers support it
[01:46:05] skd5aner: hmmm, shows up in my client?
[01:46:11] skd5aner: http://musicbrainz.org/artist/9ddd7abc-9e1b-4 . . . 6bc8be9.html
[01:46:13] Beirdo: the fact that other people insist on breaking the RFC doesn't mean squat
[01:46:21] [R]: Beirdo: lol
[01:46:32] [R]: no one follows the rfc anymore
[01:46:38] Granier21: skd5aner: screw itunes (and steve jobs)
[01:46:41] skd5aner: Beirdo: I was suggesting !rules the other day
[01:46:43] Beirdo: there's no standard way of negotiating character set for IRC
[01:46:50] Beirdo: !url – list
[01:46:50] MythLogBot: down faq google linuxtv lmgtfy log logs nocablecard overscan tuners upnp vdpau wiki
[01:47:00] Beirdo: !url faq
[01:47:00] MythLogBot: faq: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/IRC
[01:47:02] skd5aner: Granier21: You won't hear me arguing on either of those
[01:47:04] [R]: !url nocablecard
[01:47:04] MythLogBot: nocablecard: http://mythtv.org/wiki/Recording_Digital_Cable
[01:48:00] skd5aner: Granier21: but I've been using it since 2003... and my playcounts have been there since 2004, and most of my playlists are dynamic built off of playcounts – so I don't let iTunes manage my library,but I do use it for playlist, playback, and iPod support
[01:48:27] Granier21: skd5aner: that's ok
[01:48:44] skd5aner: Granier21: and I've got an airport express which is hooked to my receiver with optical output, and can control iTunes playback with my android device ;)
[01:48:59] Granier21: bah
[01:49:05] skd5aner: so... all in all, I hate apple but still can't get away from iTunes ;)
[01:49:45] ** skd5aner reminises about the days when all he used was winamp in the late 90's and early 2000s **
[01:49:58] Granier21: skd5aner: I've hacked my seagate dockstar to be dlna
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[01:50:28] Granier21: umm, dlna media server
[01:50:50] ** wagnerrp still uses winamp **
[01:51:06] Granier21: didn't anticipate the freedb f-up
[01:51:06] ** wagnerrp even got his dad using winamp to manage his ipod **
[01:51:19] skd5aner: wagnerrp: I quit before that whole forking thing with winamp 2/3 and the AOL aquisition days
[01:51:47] wagnerrp: i never used 3, but 5 is pretty good
[01:51:58] wagnerrp: and AOL has really kept hands off for the most part
[01:52:02] Granier21: skd5aner: I still don't understand what you mean about having original discs
[01:52:12] skd5aner: I remember my first ipod came with MusicMatch I believe to manage the ipod – before itunes for windows existed
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[01:52:37] Granier21: skd5aner: you don't want to re-rip if the db is messed up
[01:52:55] skd5aner: Granier21: sorry, not necessarily the "original discs", but just trying to tag against an album, versus looking up individal tracks from classical artists
[01:53:47] skd5aner: also, my first iPod is still to this day way more responsive to input than any I've ever owned/used since
[01:55:00] skd5aner: Granier21: good luck – if you make it work, and it works well, let us know
[01:55:17] skd5aner: I'm stepping away for the evening
[01:55:32] Granier21: skd5aner: ok, thx for the tips
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[02:09:03] k-man: any idea where to find the droid sans fonts for debian?
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[02:10:55] Beirdo: !url lmgtfy droid sans fonts for debian
[02:10:55] MythLogBot: lmgtfy: http://lmgtfy.com?q=droid%20sans%20fonts%20for%20debian
[02:11:48] k-man: Beirdo: i have been googleing it thanks
[02:11:56] Beirdo: hehe
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[02:12:27] Beirdo: to the cloud...
[02:12:41] ** Beirdo beats MS with a baseball bat **
[02:12:45] k-man: there is a debian package but it appears to be in unstable only
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[02:17:21] sphery: Beirdo: heh, I just had to skip quickly over a to-the-cloud commercial
[02:18:13] kormoc: Huh
[02:18:28] kormoc: Marc Allan Feldman from Openivo called me wanting to know if I'd help with a project
[02:18:50] Shadow__X: kormoc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lel3swo4RMc&feature=channel
[02:19:01] Shadow__X: thats what they are referring to
[02:19:20] Shadow__X: oh whoops you werent reffering to the commercial
[02:19:23] Shadow__X: sorry about that
[02:19:30] kormoc: I was kinda confused there :P
[02:19:53] wagnerrp: that some sort of tivo hacking project?
[02:20:06] kormoc: http://groups.google.com/group/mythtv-contrac . . . e9eaadf91cbd
[02:20:20] skd5aner: I believe it was the thing that I saw a few folks making fun of last month around these parts
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[02:20:36] wagnerrp: heh, i havent looked at that group in months
[02:21:00] sphery: does it have google backing (based on http://www.openivo.com/ )
[02:21:10] skd5aner: no, I think it's just a google site
[02:21:13] sphery: if so, much harder to make fun of
[02:21:26] sphery: yeah, I don't know what a google site is
[02:21:34] skd5aner: Google Web hosting
[02:21:37] kormoc: I wonder if other devs got calls from him or if I'm special
[02:21:38] sphery: ahh
[02:21:43] skd5aner: http://www.google.com/sites/help/intl/en/overview.html
[02:21:53] sphery: kormoc: even if others got calls, you're /still/ special
[02:22:00] skd5aner: I think it might have emerged from google groups?
[02:22:03] kormoc: Woo!
[02:22:13] wagnerrp: kormoc: youre special... in that youre the only one of us with a published phone number
[02:22:15] wagnerrp: :P
[02:22:20] sphery: heh
[02:22:23] sphery: that too
[02:22:24] ** kormoc laughs **
[02:22:53] kormoc: Yeah, not hard. "This guy named kormoc commits a lot... hrm... first hit for kormoc on google has a resume with a phone number...."
[02:23:25] sphery: I just hope it's the right kormoc
[02:23:37] ** kormoc shifty eyes **
[02:24:01] skd5aner: so, what is openivo?
[02:24:13] wagnerrp: i thought it was a misspelling of opentivo
[02:24:22] skd5aner: and what kind of help was he looking for?
[02:24:42] kormoc: "I had an idea to build a managed network of internet-connected set-top personal computers with tv tuners running dvr software heavily or completely subsidized with directed advertising and e-commerce tie-ins. The system is now patent pending. I also have a day job."
[02:24:57] kormoc: Basically a hulu box without hulu
[02:25:40] sphery: kormoc: Well, hey, when you type kormoc into the location bar in Firefox, Google sends you to https://www.kormoc.com/ , and my browser is smart enough to say, "This Connection is Untrusted."
[02:25:56] ** kormoc double shifty eyes **
[02:26:03] wagnerrp: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/348486
[02:26:17] wagnerrp: i vaguely remember that post
[02:26:21] sphery: really strange, though, that the "I'm feeling lucky" for kormoc is the https
[02:26:49] kormoc: sphery, for years I had it hosted on a FIOS line that had 80 inbound blocked but 443 inbound clear
[02:27:22] sphery: wagnerrp: that explains the top blog entry at http://openivo.blogspot.com/
[02:27:27] kormoc: that said, I thought I had a https->http rule
[02:27:53] sphery: kormoc: yeah, you do--but until I added an exception for the https, it didn't trigger
[02:28:34] wagnerrp: kormoc: kinda wondering why an MD is pursuing this...
[02:28:54] kormoc: huh, I bet cause my ssl cert is invalid, it no longer trusts my 301 redirect to http
[02:29:00] kormoc: wagnerrp, yeah
[02:29:33] [R]: the movie Antitrust is so ridiculous
[02:29:46] sphery: [R]: the plot is not the reason to watch that movie
[02:29:47] kormoc: Yes... rediculous
[02:29:51] wagnerrp: didnt lindows try to do ad subsidized computers?
[02:29:55] ** kormoc does Mr. Burn's hands **
[02:30:01] kormoc: wagnerrp, aye, they did
[02:30:05] [R]: sphery: than what is the reason?
[02:30:08] sphery: RLC
[02:30:15] wagnerrp: meaning that would be prior art to that patent?
[02:30:23] [R]: sphery: rlc?
[02:30:26] kormoc: wagnerrp, yes
[02:30:32] sphery: Rachael Leigh Cook
[02:30:43] sphery: (Claire Forlani is another reason)
[02:30:47] [R]: oh
[02:30:49] [R]: lol
[02:31:00] wagnerrp: sphery: im pissed they got rid of her on Psych
[02:31:06] kormoc: The real trick is subsidized computers now are pointless. buy in decent bulk a ion platform.
[02:31:29] sphery: I was really upset when Claire and Det. Taylor didn't hit it off (meaning she was no longer on CSI: NY)
[02:31:43] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, now I have to watch Psych
[02:32:07] kormoc: Maggie Lawson > Rachael Leigh Cook
[02:32:07] castlec: jya, you available
[02:32:09] castlec: ?
[02:32:48] wagnerrp: nah...
[02:33:15] sphery: kormoc: had you said Kaylee, I'd have agreed, but I have to disagree about Maggic
[02:33:18] sphery: er, Maggie
[02:33:52] wagnerrp: sphery: shes also a recurring guest on robot chicken
[02:34:12] sphery: wagnerrp: quite possible that the tv advertising part is what separates the patent from that prior art
[02:34:18] wagnerrp: but.. i dont think thats really relevant
[02:34:46] wagnerrp: sphery: but its not tv advertising
[02:34:55] wagnerrp: its target advertising based off the tv viewing habits
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[02:35:30] sphery: well, I'm basing it only on "Home computers subsidized with targeted television advertising", since I don't read patents
[02:35:41] sphery: (until a lawyer makes me :)
[02:35:43] wagnerrp: in which case i bet its something tivo does
[02:35:59] wagnerrp: i know they do show their own ads
[02:36:00] kormoc: sphery, Kaylee > *, but Maggie is pretty damn cute and charming
[02:36:03] kormoc: whoops
[02:36:26] sphery: kormoc: I have to admit I haven't seen Psych, so Maggie may win me over when I do
[02:36:27] wagnerrp: and i know they sell data about viewing habits
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[02:36:39] wagnerrp: and use it for their own recommendation purposes
[02:36:39] Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +o kormoc
[02:36:48] kormoc has been kicked from #mythtv-users by kormoc!~kormoc@unaffiliated/kormoc (Bad words are bad!)
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[02:36:58] sphery: heh
[02:37:04] sphery: I was trying to figure out the whoops
[02:37:09] sphery: had to re-read that way too many times
[02:37:18] kormoc: hehe
[02:37:23] sphery: (and really, the kick was the only reason I got it)
[02:37:37] wagnerrp: you could have said she was dam cute
[02:37:56] wagnerrp: but im not sure if saying someone has the attributes of a block of cement would be a compliment
[02:38:13] sphery: or "a cute dame" (or would that be not PC)
[02:38:27] castlec: so jya put together a wiki on the audio framework, http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Audio_Framework, If I understand it correctly, I have to do some codec specific work to use it..... as in, I have to calculate frame sizes based upon the format. Is that right? Anyone have any comments?
[02:39:18] sphery: castlec: sorry, I can't help... I don't know any of the audio stuff
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[02:39:43] kormoc: sphery, I own a fedora. I can use Dame
[02:39:54] sphery: heh
[02:40:15] wagnerrp: you can also whip people
[02:40:18] castlec: it's actually the czech for a woman
[02:40:27] castlec: rather, it's plural
[02:40:29] castlec: women
[02:41:22] sphery: there's a ton of hits for define:dame
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[02:43:41] wagnerrp: if you call a woman a 'great dame', is she likely to misunderstand your words and slap you?
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[02:54:49] knightr: kormoc, are you still there?
[02:56:23] kormoc: Aye
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[02:57:24] knightr: kormoc, I have a small question for you... How does MythWeb persist information between each call in the OO parts of its...
[02:57:31] knightr: s/its/it
[02:57:44] knightr: the cache?
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[03:24:59] jya: castlec: I'm back..
[03:25:07] castlec: great :)
[03:25:14] castlec: i just happen to be back
[03:25:28] castlec: did you see my question?
[03:25:32] jya: I did
[03:25:45] jya: the audio framework takes raw PCM audio in
[03:25:55] castlec: aha
[03:25:57] jya: so you have to do the decoding first...
[03:26:13] jya: actually, more acurately
[03:26:25] jya: it takes whatever audio ffmepg decoding will output
[03:26:42] castlec: got it. I was thinking i'd be able to give it the encoded stream and tell it what it was and be done withit
[03:26:48] jya: that is U8, S16, S24, S23LE, S32 and FLOAT
[03:27:18] jya: decoding audio with ffmpeg is quite simple really..
[03:27:31] castlec: that's where I was just going
[03:27:32] jya: but no, you can feed it mp3 or whatever
[03:27:38] castlec: that I needed to use ffmpeg
[03:27:42] jya: a frames must have a constant size
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[03:28:15] castlec: can you point me at code to look at to see how to do all of that?
[03:28:21] jya: if you want to change any of the audio parametres, like sample format, number of channels, sampling rate etc... you need to call Reconfigure from the audio framework
[03:28:32] jya: look at mythplugin
[03:28:51] jya: they use ffmpeg directly without using the myth avdecoding code
[03:29:23] castlec: just grep for ffmpeg in the directories?
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[03:30:07] jya: http://www.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg-doc.html
[03:30:29] castlec: :) no, lmgty?
[03:30:33] jya: no, typically, ffmpeg routine, for the decoding is av_ something
[03:30:55] jya: there are two steps you need to perform before you get decoded raw audio
[03:31:22] jya: 1- read the container and extra the encoded audio data. This is done by libavformat
[03:31:36] jya: s/extra/extract
[03:31:57] jya: 2- once you have the data, you use libavcodec to decode it
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[03:32:16] jya: actually the link there is useless
[03:32:23] jya: it's for the ffmpeg binary documentation
[03:32:35] castlec: no matter. i know what I'm looking for now
[03:32:40] castlec: thanks again
[03:33:03] jya: http://www.inb.uni-luebeck.de/~boehme/using_libavcodec.html
[03:33:19] castlec: pandora by new year's; i promise
[03:33:34] jya: pretty complete example there
[03:33:47] castlec: great
[03:33:58] jya: decoding audio or video is identical from a coding perspective
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[03:34:03] xris: though in this case, you're probably better off going to rpmfusion or fedora, or wherever you get your packages/yum setup
[03:34:04] fordy760: hello
[03:34:10] xris: fordy760: ^^^
[03:34:48] wagnerrp: fordy760: several of the metadata grabbers use the mythtv python bindings
[03:34:58] wagnerrp: and the mythtv python bindings require python 2.5 or 2.6
[03:35:14] jya: castlec: you parse the container, find the audio stream (anything that has codec_type == CODEC_TYPE_AUDIO)
[03:35:15] wagnerrp: 2.7 will not work due to a deficiency in the mysql libraries used
[03:35:38] jya: once you have the audio sream, you call avcodec_decode_audio on it..
[03:35:48] fordy760: so am i out of luck with fedora 14 then?
[03:36:01] jya: careful with ffmpeg, avcodec_decode_audio (or decode_video) changes over time and become deprecated
[03:36:11] jya: right now you want to use avcodec_decode_audio3
[03:36:15] wagnerrp: fordy760: unless you can revert to python 2.6, the metadata grabbers for mythvideo and mythnetvision will not work
[03:36:38] jya: what is fedora 14 shipping with?
[03:36:38] wagnerrp: nor will any third party utilities that use the python bindings
[03:36:45] wagnerrp: 2.7 apparently
[03:37:00] wagnerrp: someone was in here complaining about this a few days ago
[03:37:13] knightr: 2.7 and it's not apparently... :)
[03:37:16] jya: 2.7 isn't backward compatible with 2.6 ?
[03:37:36] wagnerrp: jya: the bindings themselves work just fine on 2.7, the problem is the MySQLdb module
[03:37:44] wagnerrp: it will not run on 2.7
[03:38:07] wagnerrp: trunk currently has experimental support for oursql, which is usable for 2.7 and 3.x
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[03:38:22] wagnerrp: but im waiting on some patch that has been committed, but not yet released
[03:38:38] wagnerrp: beyond the fact that i dont think it is in any package managers yet
[03:39:32] knightr: wagnerrp, haven't tested it yet but I got the bindings to compile...
[03:39:47] knightr: (had other things to do...)
[03:40:06] knightr: (and it takes forever to compile on my frontend...)
[03:40:08] wagnerrp: ah, right... you were complaining about it
[03:40:19] wagnerrp: anyway, the bindings dont 'compile', they just tokenize
[03:40:34] wagnerrp: unless you were talking about oursql
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[03:41:11] wagnerrp: jya: how much of that did you catch?
[03:41:40] xris: wagnerrp: really? (re python 2.7).. guess I should hold off on upgrading to f14
[03:41:54] knightr: the oursql part got converted by cpython...
[03:42:04] wagnerrp: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8768
[03:42:13] knightr: tokenize, you mean it's bytecode?
[03:42:14] wagnerrp: tracking ticket for the migration to oursql
[03:42:23] knightr: (for the python part...)
[03:42:53] wagnerrp: knightr: not for optimization, just to speed up subsequent imports
[03:43:05] knightr: ah, thanks...
[03:43:09] wagnerrp: its a lot faster to load a .pyc than a .py
[03:43:13] wagnerrp: but no faster to run
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[03:43:34] knightr: hmm, interesting...
[03:44:54] knightr: xris, I have F14 and installed oursql today (because of Python 2.7) but I haven't yet had a chance to test...
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[03:45:40] fordy760: does anyone have mythtv working from repo packages on fedora 14 then?
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[03:45:47] wagnerrp: xris: anyway, trunk works just fine with oursql and the relevant patch (as far as i know)
[03:46:01] wagnerrp: but im a bit leery of backporting it to 0.24
[03:46:02] jya: wagnerrp: was doing a testing on the network
[03:46:08] jya: got disconnected for about 10s or so
[03:46:36] jya: mysqldb hasn't updated for more recent python ?
[03:46:38] wagnerrp: it 'works for me', but ive not heard of any outside testing
[03:46:40] knightr: fordy760, can't say, I compile from source...
[03:46:43] wagnerrp: jya: nope
[03:46:48] jya: though, I would have thought that 2.6 was by far the most popular version
[03:47:09] jya: don't see the need to upgrade to 3.0 myself, breaks too much stuff
[03:47:16] jya: that's one peev I have with python
[03:47:25] jya: how could they break backward compatibility like that
[03:47:34] xris: wagnerrp: gotcha.. that's fine, then. plus, it'll take me awhile to get the packaging stuff updated..
[03:47:57] [R]: jya: you can't have forward advancement w/o it
[03:48:04] wagnerrp: i pinged j-rod yesterday, see what he could do about getting oursql in their package system
[03:48:05] [R]: jya: look at the crap that is windows because you can still run windows 3.1 programs
[03:48:07] jya: [r
[03:48:26] jya: [R] ...I don't buy that argument
[03:48:30] [R]: lol
[03:48:31] wagnerrp: the other option would be bringing in our own copy of it like ffmpeg
[03:48:48] [R]: jya: i've dealt with backwards compatibility hacks at my job
[03:48:50] jya: .Net has had massive updates, it hasn't broken backward compatibility, nor did C++ , java or other language
[03:48:50] fordy760: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/cxdEzi5N
[03:49:01] [R]: jya: haha
[03:49:09] xris: wagnerrp: adding packages is easy.. j-rod and I are both friends with the fedora build mgr
[03:49:16] [R]: but wasn't there radical changes to the langauge itself with python 3.0?
[03:49:37] wagnerrp: [R]: changes yes, but not particularly radical
[03:49:42] jya: stating that a language need to break backward compatibility to "progress" is nonsense, I see it more as a complete denial of their existing userbase
[03:49:43] [R]: hrm
[03:50:07] wagnerrp: there is some conversion tool which is supposed to do most of it for you
[03:50:08] [R]: well i'm sure no one is going to seriously migrate to 3.0 for a while
[03:50:34] wagnerrp: theres some syntactical niceties, but most of the new features have been backported to 2.6 and 2.7
[03:50:47] jya: I have a few code (originally written for 2.4) that worked fine in 2.5
[03:50:52] jya: didn't work after that
[03:50:57] jya: converting to 2.6 was easy
[03:51:04] jya: but 3.0 is going to take a while
[03:51:05] xris: jya: with perl, it's a new language.. there's "perl" and then there's "perl6". well, there will be. maybe by the end of the universe.
[03:51:44] jya: xris: I don't classify perl as a language anymore :) more some kind of slang that once you've written it, you can't read it anymore
[03:51:45] jya: oh shit
[03:51:53] jya: I forgot to pick up my daughter
[03:51:57] wagnerrp: whoops
[03:51:58] jya: again... going to be fined $50
[03:52:02] wagnerrp: fined?
[03:52:05] jya: yeah
[03:52:11] jya: the school fines us if we're late
[03:52:19] xris: jya: no wonder everyone thinks perl is a bad language... people stop treating it as such and write crappy code.
[03:52:23] jya: I carry a fifty with me now :)
[03:52:23] wagnerrp: really...
[03:52:26] xris: ouch
[03:52:49] [R]: that's ridiculous
[03:52:52] wagnerrp: at my school, we could hang around until 5pm
[03:53:02] wagnerrp: after that, they didnt care where we went, but we couldnt stay there
[03:54:11] [R]: i really hate this movie
[03:54:15] [R]: "he doenst understand what open source means"
[03:54:16] [R]: haha
[03:54:30] wagnerrp: why are you watching it?
[03:54:44] [R]: cuz theres nothing else on
[03:54:45] [R]: lol
[03:54:48] GreyFoxx: What movie ?
[03:54:48] [R]: and i just need background noise
[03:54:54] [R]: GreyFoxx: antitrust
[03:55:07] GreyFoxx: ahhh
[03:55:08] ** xris recommends some pavarotti for "background noise" **
[03:55:28] [R]: i like one song by andrea bocelli
[03:55:33] [R]: but aside from that... not a fan of that kind of music
[03:55:49] xris: I try to like everything. except rap. and country.
[03:56:00] wagnerrp: c...rap?
[03:56:08] xris: or whatever they call rap these days.. like beastie boys.
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[03:57:53] wagnerrp: c'mon, you know you like to bust mad rhymes
[03:58:03] [R]: wagnerrp: so i know what the evil company was doing was illegal... but wasn't hijacking the satellites and releasing the code also illegal?
[03:58:03] wagnerrp: 80% success rate or better qualifies as ill
[03:58:49] wagnerrp: [R]: seriously? its been like a decade since i watched that movie, and i've intentionally blocked the details and plot from my memory
[03:59:03] [R]: ROFL
[03:59:17] [R]: i waas having a discussion with a friend a few weeks ago
[03:59:26] [R]: is tehre any hollywood hacking movie that isn't totally ridiculous?
[03:59:33] wagnerrp: sneakers
[03:59:35] wagnerrp: great movie
[03:59:45] GreyFoxx: Awesome movie
[03:59:53] GreyFoxx: One of my alltime fav's
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[04:00:35] wagnerrp: the concept of the 'black box' is a bit iffy, but the movie is pretty sound besides that
[04:01:14] GreyFoxx: now I feel like watching it... maybe tomorrow night
[04:01:15] wagnerrp: basically, the guy solved the P/NP problem, hardwired it into a box, and thats as deep as they go
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[04:02:10] wagnerrp: oh, and Die Hard 4, that like totally happened last year
[04:02:38] [R]: haha
[04:03:17] [R]: i'm watching the hosue bunny now
[04:03:21] [R]: much better movie
[04:03:22] [R]: haha
[04:05:53] wagnerrp: oh colin hanks, how could you shame yourself with that
[04:06:21] [R]: colin hanks?
[04:06:36] wagnerrp: tom hanks' kid
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[04:08:04] Dashkal: Success! For kernel 2.6.36 there's a regression that breaks sounds on the Hauppauge PVR-350 (or anything else with the msp3400 chip). Patched my kernel and the sound issue is gone.
[04:13:02] sphery: heh, heard something about a problem with ivtv on some kernel versions
[04:13:09] sphery: guess that's it
[04:17:54] ** wagnerrp suspects he should backup the wiki database before performing this extension install **
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[04:31:54] xris: wagnerrp: trac? just back up the whole thing
[04:32:03] wagnerrp: no, adding a wiki extension
[04:32:22] Beirdo: on mediawiki?
[04:32:35] rileyp: FF and REw speeds are not shown on screen in graphite in 0.24
[04:32:45] wagnerrp: some thing to give admins more information on users
[04:33:01] wagnerrp: IP/username mapping for dealing with spam
[04:33:26] wagnerrp: needed to add two tables for its logs
[04:33:28] Beirdo: ahh
[04:35:17] xris: cool
[04:35:21] wagnerrp: that shouldnt need a restart... should it?
[04:35:26] xris: no
[04:35:29] wagnerrp: am i even on the real wiki server?
[04:35:32] xris: not of the
[04:35:33] xris: db
[04:35:34] xris: maybe of apache
[04:36:18] wagnerrp: no, the wiki has not been migrated
[04:36:56] wagnerrp: that, or i edited the wrong directory
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[04:40:31] xris: wiki lives on the new box... just go to code.mythtv.org/wiki
[04:40:34] xris: or new.mythtv.org
[04:40:37] xris: DNS just hasn't moved
[04:40:51] xris: however.... I'll be doing a db refresh on that stuff before the actual dns move
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[04:45:56] wagnerrp: well it works... just not on the real server
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[05:40:06] wagnerrp: kormoc: seems that guy 'just needs a programmer' for his grandiose ideas
[05:40:10] wagnerrp: http://www.cs.uni.edu/~wallingf/blog/archives . . . 15_45_40.htm
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[05:51:47] Beirdo: kormoc: the new server's having issues sending mail to your domain
[05:52:55] wagnerrp: hehe
[05:53:21] wagnerrp: 'a terrible idea with a beautifully executed development goes no where'... 'really? try telling that to whoever invented farmville'
[05:54:20] Beirdo: heheeh
[05:56:56] [R]: who is R.D. Vaughan?
[05:57:03] [R]: wrote the netvision grabbers
[05:57:10] wagnerrp: RDV
[05:57:17] [R]: is he on irc?
[05:57:23] wagnerrp: currently? yes
[05:57:49] [R]: RDV_Linux_: you there?
[05:58:19] wagnerrp: looking to write one for s.p.studios?
[05:58:28] [R]: i'm almost done
[05:58:35] [R]: i just wanted to tell him how kickass the framework is
[05:58:45] Beirdo: ...
[05:59:00] Beirdo: heh, I hope you checked TOS?
[05:59:08] [R]: Beirdo: they were too long
[05:59:17] [R]: Beirdo: i'm still on the fence about releasing it
[05:59:31] Beirdo: !trout [R]
[05:59:31] ** MythLogBot slaps [R] with a trout on behalf of Beirdo... **
[05:59:34] [R]: lol
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[06:06:08] [R]: so close
[06:06:16] [R]: the xml looks fine, but i get nothing when i do an update
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[06:28:11] [R]: woohoo
[06:28:14] [R]: the grabber runs on the frontend
[06:28:16] [R]: lol
[06:28:26] wagnerrp: the grabber runs on the backend
[06:28:38] [R]: not according to my failed tests
[06:29:05] wagnerrp: grabbers are called through mythxml
[06:29:19] [R]: than why was it failing?
[06:29:34] wagnerrp: how was what failing?
[06:30:14] [R]: in mythnetvision, i was hitting 'update site maps'... i saw in the frontend log that it was processing an update request for the grabber... but nothing happened... once i put the grabber on the frontend... it worked and it said it was running the actual script
[06:32:52] wagnerrp: http://yourbackend:6544/MythGetInternetSources
[06:34:14] [R]: yeah
[06:34:16] [R]: tahts what i said
[06:34:22] [R]: oh wait
[06:34:23] [R]: i dintd say it
[06:34:24] [R]: haha
[06:34:27] wagnerrp: thats the backend
[06:34:42] [R]: that query is just for the list of grabbers
[06:34:44] [R]: not the grabber data
[06:35:21] [R]: specifically... that query runs all the grabbers with -v
[06:35:25] [R]: which gets their name and descrption
[06:36:20] wagnerrp: http://yourbackend:6544/Myth/GetInternetSearc . . . k&Page=1
[06:36:43] Beirdo: wagnerrp: part of it runs on the frontend
[06:37:01] Beirdo: that I know from the mythsystem rewrite
[06:37:21] [R]: if the xml supports it... maybe the code just hastn' been updated for it
[06:38:17] [R]: wagnerrp: also, tahts for searches
[06:38:22] [R]: wagnerrp: i'm doing Tree, not search
[06:38:25] Beirdo: I don't recall which part works where, but I remember seeing it in the frontend logs as well as I tested
[06:39:05] wagnerrp: tree mode? i dont know... dont have that implemented in the bindings
[06:39:10] Beirdo: unless I'm getting confused with something else, which is a possibility
[06:39:19] wagnerrp: i had assumed that ran in a loop in the background on the backend
[06:40:13] wagnerrp: if it didnt run on the master backend, there would be conflicts as multiple frontends kept refreshing the same data
[06:41:00] [R]: well i dont know how the auto update mechanism works
[06:41:03] [R]: i'm using the manual update
[06:41:16] [R]: i actually have auto updated disabled
[06:50:38] [R]: i love the mythweb remote
[06:51:32] [R]: sweet
[06:51:36] [R]: looks like its working great
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[06:55:22] wagnerrp: Beirdo: have you seen this one? http://www.youtube.com/v/jlzQq3nOj5c?f=videos . . . p;autoplay=1
[06:55:54] wagnerrp: i knew he was a pilot, but thats just absurd
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[06:59:12] Beirdo: yeah, I saw that one :)
[06:59:33] Beirdo: he got it deep crap with the cops for drifting right through an airport
[06:59:45] wagnerrp: i can imagine
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[07:02:46] wagnerrp: the bond music is a nice touch
[07:03:12] wagnerrp: if only they had ducted the fan, and gave it proper inlets along the sides
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[07:41:29] [R]: HAHA
[07:41:38] [R]: you can't watch the super best friends ep of south park online
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[07:49:28] Beirdo: "Peppermint Ice OS"?!
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[08:06:28] rileyp: Application binary version (0.24.20101124–1) does not match libraries (0.24.20101129–1)
[08:06:41] rileyp: This application is not compatible with the installed MythTV libraries. Please recompile after a make distclean
[08:06:49] rileyp: how do I do that?
[08:07:54] Beirdo: how do you do what?
[08:09:58] [R]: "Okay..running Peppermint Ice OS on my laptop...want to set up MythTV...where do I start?"
[08:09:58] [R]: ROFL
[08:10:25] Beirdo: you start by reading the documentation
[08:10:48] Beirdo: then if your chosen distro doesn't make it easy, you likely switch distros :)
[08:11:14] [R]: hrm... mythnetvision doesn't appear to be making the backend download these thumbnails
[08:11:19] [R]: unless i have something configured wrong...
[08:13:02] Beirdo: hahahah
[08:13:12] Beirdo: I see the bug in upnp now
[08:13:14] Beirdo: hehe
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[08:15:07] Beirdo: OMG, that is insane
[08:15:21] Beirdo: llBytes -= (offset – llStart);
[08:15:38] Beirdo: that works fine the first time, but if you don't adjust llStart in that loop...
[08:15:51] Beirdo: the first time it subtracts the 2G it sent
[08:16:00] Beirdo: the second time it subtracts 4G
[08:16:39] Beirdo: and stops sending early, or decides it's done as there are negative number of bytes to send
[08:16:42] Beirdo: nice logic.
[08:16:45] Beirdo: let's fix that
[08:17:07] ** Beirdo is watching TV on a upnp client in the bedroom... it stops at 4G into the file **
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[08:20:05] Beirdo: if this fixes it, I will be happy :)
[08:21:34] Beirdo: this is doubtless part of what cdev is fixing
[08:22:27] Beirdo: but now I have to wait an hour almost to find out if it does
[08:22:48] Beirdo: as I need to play a file > 4G to test it
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[09:02:09] Beirdo: yay, it worked
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[09:24:25] Beirdo: on that note, I think I shall get some sleep
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[10:26:57] k-man: i have this problem with the screen setup wizard, each time i run it, it incrrectly makes the screen about 1/3 smaller than it should be
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[11:35:27] ExElNeT: whats the 0.24 git version of svn 27419 ?
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[11:46:42] stuartm: Beirdo: there's an idea, how about a new bot command which translates the old svn commit number into a git hash and vice-versa?
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[11:55:29] ExElNeT: that would be cool...
[11:55:47] ExElNeT: or... in which file is the network protocol number stored?
[11:55:59] ExElNeT: I might find a compatible version that way...
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[12:02:38] ExElNeT: https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commits/fixe . . . ythversion.h
[12:04:30] ExElNeT: this might be the right time to generate a new version from all of the protocol version... network protocol, databaseschema, ...
[12:04:40] ExElNeT: if one changes the version changes
[12:06:37] ExElNeT: this would also allow users to get the latest fixes for their protocol version
[12:07:07] ExElNeT: a bitmask would be an easy way
[12:07:58] ExElNeT: or seperator or whatever, but git revs are a bit hard to remember...
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[12:46:07] rileyp: All themes in o.24 show ff and rw speed except graphite my favorite.... Im heart broken. How can I fix it?
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[13:10:36] rileyp: graphite no ff or rw speeds diplayed I suppose i should report it.
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[14:14:26] Captain_Murdoch: rileyp, for 0.24 open a ticket. if it was trunk you'd have to email the author of the theme since Graphite is no longer in trunk.
[14:14:46] Captain_Murdoch: s/trunk/master/g since we're not in subversion anymore, we're in git. :)
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[14:17:24] rileyp: Captain_Murdoch, thanks was thnking bout doing exactly that
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[15:53:17] knightr: [27344[
[15:53:22] knightr: [27344]
[15:53:22] MythLogBot: SVN 27344: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/7844eea4
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[15:58:16] stuartm: Beirdo: nice
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[16:03:41] J-e-f-f-A: Well, I'm happy to report that my 0.24-fixes upgrade went great, aside from having to use SVN for my frontends as git was 'not behaving' (wouldn't let me switch to the fixes/0.24 branch). And the 'prebuffer pause' I was getting on my backend when using it as a frontend on h.264 1080i material is gone now... ;-)
[16:06:04] J-e-f-f-A: Oh, and I applied the "Alternative to the 200-line kernel speedup", and my myth box is MUCH more responsive when commflag jobs are running on h.264 1080i content... Very pleased about taht!!!
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[16:07:20] J-e-f-f-A: "that' even... doh!  ;-)
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[16:15:24] Spida: what graphics-card do I need for hd content playback? would an ati hd4350 be enough?
[16:18:40] sphery: Spida: An ATI graphics card will do absolutely nothing for video playback, other than basic scaling (through Xv or, at least with proprietary drivers, OpenGL).
[16:19:06] sphery: Spida: if you want the GPU to help with decoding and display, you want VDPAU = nvidia GPU with nvidia proprietary drivers
[16:19:11] cesman: Spida: get card w/ n nvidia based chipset that supports VDPAU
[16:19:38] sphery: otherwise, your CPU is doing all the work and the GPU is, mostly, irrelevant
[16:19:41] Spida: ok, that doubles the tdp
[16:19:52] sphery: (at least while we still support Xv--eventually, you'll need good OpenGL)
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[16:20:23] Spida: is vdpau the only requirement?
[16:20:40] sphery: vdpau isn't a requirement--but it is the only way to get the gpu to help
[16:21:03] sphery: you can do just fine with a sufficiently powerful (real) CPU (meaning not Atom) and a "dumb" GPU
[16:21:32] sphery: sufficiently powerful is dependent on what you plan to decode (i.e. high-bitrate H.264 is quite the challenge)
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[16:22:01] sphery: Spida: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/VDPAU has some info on vdpau
[16:22:47] sphery: Spida: IMHO, though, even if you get a vdpau-capable GPU, you should also have a good, real CPU
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[16:25:52] Spida: cpu is an dual core 2.2GHz
[16:26:39] Spida: requirements are PCI-E, HDMI, single slot, and very quite (passively cooled, if possible)
[16:26:51] sphery: that will work just fine for high-resolution, high-bitrate MPEG-2 playback. It will need some help (from vdpau) for high-bitrate H.264, though, so if you have any such content (whether from, say, DVB or BluRay rips), you'll need vdpau.
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[16:28:02] sphery: Many users are getting the GeForce 210/220/240 graphics cards (which can be had for $18 – $45 or so and can be found in fanless versions--though single slot fanless may be more challenging)
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[16:34:40] JEDIDIAH__: one wrinkle on this whole vdpau thing is that nvidia cards seem to do better dealing with TVs. nvidia cards just seem better suited for HTPC use on Linux in general.
[16:36:34] JEDIDIAH__: 2 of my TVs generate EDID information that my intel based boxes can't seem to cope with.
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[16:39:50] Spida: http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B002SK3NL8/re . . . QY5A9BE01EI0 <- that seems like it may fit my needs
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[16:42:49] elmojo: sphery: so do you have your .ssh set to 0x700 permissions
[16:43:51] Spida: sphery: thanks.
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[16:57:12] wagnerrp: WTF... peppermint ice os? is that a troll?
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[17:02:09] sphery: elmojo: yeah
[17:02:12] stuartm: no spearmint variant?
[17:04:36] sphery: wagnerrp: seems real based on http://distrowatch.com/stats.php?section=popularity
[17:05:24] wagnerrp: sphery: real enough that one of their users could find the webpage and the mailing list signups, but not manage to find the all the documentation?
[17:05:42] stuartm: http://peppermintos.com/2010/07/peppermint-ic . . . -the-clouds/
[17:06:04] sphery: heh
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[17:08:42] obengdako: hi guys anyone got usb tvbox by trident with vendor id 6000 product id 0001 to work in linux?
[17:09:11] wagnerrp: obengdako: we dont do driver support... see #linuxtv
[17:09:31] obengdako: thanks i'll head there wagnerrp
[17:09:46] sphery: wonder where peppermint fits in the GNU/Linux Distribution Timeline ( http://futurist.se/gldt/ ). I'd have guessed it was a branch off Mint, but don't see it
[17:10:53] wagnerrp: another ubuntu clone
[17:11:10] wagnerrp: using mozilla's prism tech, whatever that is
[17:11:24] wagnerrp: cloud based applications
[17:11:25] elmojo: sphery: I ran ssh -vvv and it's compaining about the id_rsa not the id_rsa.pub
[17:11:37] elmojo: says its doesn't recognize the type
[17:12:13] wagnerrp: elmojo: ssh reads from id_rsa, sshd reads from id_rsa.pub to see if it matches the information from id_rsa provided by the client
[17:12:18] elmojo: "debug3: Not a RSA1 key file /home/username/.ssh/ide_rsa"
[17:12:26] wagnerrp: how did you create the file?
[17:12:36] elmojo: with the instruction on github
[17:12:36] sphery: does it say ide_rsa?
[17:12:40] sphery: or it that a typo
[17:12:45] elmojo: no typo
[17:12:51] sphery: strange...
[17:13:17] sphery: and file ~/.ssh/ide_rsa gives (should be ASCII text)
[17:13:21] elmojo: "debug2: key_type_from_name: unknown key type '-----BEGIN'
[17:14:03] wagnerrp: sphery: there it is, split off from Lubuntu
[17:14:11] elmojo: so ~/.ssh/id_rsa has the first line with "-----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY-----'
[17:14:13] wagnerrp: about a year old
[17:14:14] stuartm: "-----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY-----"
[17:14:35] elmojo: but is says it doesn't know what type it is... very weird
[17:14:42] elmojo: driving me crazy
[17:15:12] clever: debug3: Not a RSA1 key file /home/clever/.ssh/id_rsa.
[17:15:12] clever: debug2: key_type_from_name: unknown key type '-----BEGIN'
[17:15:22] elmojo: I'm generating the key with "ssh-keygen -t rsa -C "username@mythtv.org "
[17:15:24] clever: that message appears to be normal, it happens for my own private key which still works
[17:15:51] sphery: heh, clever--I wouldn't have thought to see if that error appeared on my known working ones... thanks
[17:15:52] clever: look elsewhere in the logs for something else
[17:15:55] elmojo: it appeared that Mark couldn't get this to work either
[17:16:00] elmojo: so I don't think I'm alone
[17:16:15] clever: one problem i have seen
[17:16:23] clever: if any user on the system can read the key, it will refuse to work
[17:16:25] sphery: and I get it, too
[17:16:29] clever: because then its no longer a private key
[17:16:33] stuartm: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/27344
[17:16:38] stuartm: ![27344]
[17:16:42] stuartm: !27344
[17:16:48] stuartm: ![27344[
[17:16:56] stuartm: knightr: ok, give us a clue
[17:17:21] stuartm: [27344[
[17:17:38] sphery: elmojo: yeah, in addition to ~/.ssh being 700 perms, the ~/.ssh/id_rsa should be 600 (and the ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub shoudl be 644)
[17:17:42] stuartm: oh wait, my auto-replace is probably getting in the way
[17:17:56] clever: stuartm: and the perms for /, /home, and /home/whatever
[17:18:04] sphery: [27344]
[17:18:06] MythLogBot: SVN 27344: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/7844eea4
[17:18:07] stuartm: [27344]
[17:18:07] MythLogBot: SVN 27344: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/7844eea4
[17:18:08] sphery: stuartm: ^^^
[17:18:11] clever: everything up to root must be secure, or somebody could chmod ~/.ssh/
[17:18:12] sphery: heh, you just got it
[17:18:23] stuartm: sphery: yeah, my auto-replace was changing [27344] for the url
[17:18:23] MythLogBot: SVN 27344: (branch master) https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv/commit/7844eea4
[17:18:58] stuartm: i.e. it became http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/27344
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[17:19:13] stuartm: guess I don't need the auto-replace now
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[17:19:54] elmojo: sphery: I'm testing this with my username for github " ssh -vvv username@github.com " does that work for you?
[17:20:20] clever: one other argument i use on ssh is -i
[17:20:22] clever: ssh clever@theP4 -i ~/beep_key
[17:20:30] clever: it lets me manualy give a path to a private key file
[17:22:00] wagnerrp: heh... a single avast license sold to a 14-user firm in arizona was used 775k times
[17:22:31] wagnerrp: appropriate name too
[17:22:32] sphery: elmojo: you use git@github.com (literally--no replacements)
[17:22:44] sphery: elmojo: ssh git@github.com
[17:22:59] sphery: it's a special test account they set up
[17:23:14] stuartm: "ERROR: Hi stuartm! You've successfully authenticated, but GitHub does not provide shell access"
[17:23:21] sphery: right--that's success
[17:23:27] sphery: means your auth is set up properly
[17:23:37] wagnerrp: rather, its the account they use for git, they just give you an error message to say its working properly
[17:23:41] sphery: but you're not allowed ssh access--because you don't need it
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[17:23:51] stuartm: which is a shocking revelation having made several commits already ;)
[17:23:57] clever: sounds like the default shell for the git user runs that 'error' message, and it then uses your public/private key to decide what user you are
[17:23:59] sphery: stuartm: heh
[17:24:08] wagnerrp: clever: about right
[17:24:11] elmojo: sphery: still get Permission denied (publickey)
[17:24:32] sphery: when you try that with the verbose argument, do you see anything?
[17:24:34] clever: elmojo: did you give github your public key?
[17:24:42] stuartm: elmojo: did you copy your private key or public key to your github account settings?
[17:24:46] sphery: clever: yeah, he did
[17:24:56] elmojo: stuartm: my public key
[17:24:57] sphery: using the xclip approach on http://help.github.com/linux-key-setup/
[17:25:00] elmojo: id_rsa.pub
[17:25:11] elmojo: I did it manually then used xclip
[17:25:11] sphery: I did it by manually copying, but ...
[17:25:24] stuartm: I used copy/paste :)
[17:25:28] elmojo: neither made a difference
[17:25:29] sphery: elmojo: is it still trying to use an ide_rsa.pub?
[17:25:37] clever: ooo, that xclip thing looks neat
[17:25:39] elmojo: yes manually mean copy/paste :)
[17:25:42] sphery: and if so, does that file exist
[17:25:46] clever: its basicaly just auto copy
[17:25:56] sphery: command-line copy, right?
[17:26:01] elmojo: sphery: id_rsa.pub not ide_rsa.pub
[17:26:27] clever: elmojo: you could try puttygen for making the keys
[17:26:28] sphery: hmmm
[17:27:03] stuartm: what, you mean that sphery didn't type the whole thing out?
[17:27:29] sphery: stuartm: heh, I actually used the mouse for that... I'm lazy.  :)
[17:28:00] clever: elmojo: this page might give some more info, http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/sourceforge/ . . . ration:PuTTY
[17:28:03] sphery: I have no idea what could be the problem with elmojo's config... But when we do find it, it's something that's likely to help a lot of people
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[17:29:39] clever: elmojo: could you pastebin most of the ssh -vvvv output?
[17:29:44] sphery: elmojo: any chance your /etc/ssh/ssh_config is set up to not allow key-based auth? (i.e. RSAAuthentication no)
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[17:30:23] sphery: elmojo: or maybe it has "RhostsRSAAuthentication yes"--in which case you should set that to no
[17:31:14] sphery: (though the RhostsRSAAuthentication is ssh1 only, so probably not relevant)
[17:31:22] wagnerrp: obengdako: specifically...
[17:31:24] wagnerrp: !url tuners
[17:31:24] MythLogBot: tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information
[17:31:41] sphery: elmojo: also, are you using some kind of key agent?
[17:31:53] obengdako: thanks wagnerrp
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[17:32:16] wagnerrp: also, the other channel is the development channel
[17:32:17] clever: sphery: i think ssh-agent is mainly for password protected private keys
[17:32:27] wagnerrp: discussion is to be limited to specific development of mythtv
[17:32:27] clever: and if ssh-agent doesnt have the info, it just asks stdin
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[17:34:07] sphery: clever: yeah, but it asks stdin for the key password--but if you're creating a new key, you'd have to ssh-add it
[17:34:25] sphery: clever: and, FWIW, /I/ have a password-protected key I'm using for github
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[17:35:04] sphery: (and I'm not using ssh-agent for it so that I /have/ to specify a password to commit--so I don't accidentally commit garbage I don't want to commit)
[17:35:23] wagnerrp: you dont need a password to commit
[17:35:34] sphery: elmojo: easiest way to check is: ssh-add -l
[17:35:43] sphery: wagnerrp: I do, since my key is password-protected
[17:36:03] wagnerrp: no, committing does not require a password, or an RSA key, or even access github
[17:36:10] sphery: ok, push
[17:36:11] sphery: whatever
[17:36:15] wagnerrp: :)
[17:36:17] sphery: heh
[17:36:28] ** sphery still has to get used to git terms **
[17:37:59] clever: on some of my systems, theres a gnome ssh agent, which asks for the pw once (gui) and then remembers it
[17:38:13] clever: most though dont, but ssh-agent and ssh-add get the same effect
[17:38:43] wagnerrp: gnome-ssh-agent is just a GUI for the command line version
[17:38:48] clever: yeah
[17:38:58] clever: and being gui, it can pop up a question when it needs to
[17:39:07] clever: ssh-agent is a headless daemon, so thats not as easy
[17:39:16] clever: so the question must be done when ssh-add is ran
[17:39:59] wagnerrp: but git is a command line application
[17:40:08] wagnerrp: you have a terminal, you dont need to pop up a new window
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[17:40:37] sphery: yeah, I admit to knowing nothing about gnome-ssh-agent (other than I hate programs that require it), but it sounds like ssh-add -l would still say whether an agent is in use, right?
[17:41:05] sphery: heh, one git/quilt integration program is called "guilt"
[17:41:11] sphery: http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/jsipek/guilt/man/
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[17:42:51] clever: sphery: yeah, you run ssh-agent, and it prints 2 lines of bash code
[17:43:01] clever: then you eval that (or copy/paste to a shell)
[17:43:15] clever: ssh/ssh-add will then use those 2 env variables to contact it
[17:43:36] clever: ssh-add by itself adds the default keys (id_rsa) and asks for the password
[17:43:50] clever: ssh-add -l seems to list all registered keys
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[17:44:52] sphery: right, and ssh-add -l will say that it can't contact a key agent if you're not using one
[17:45:15] clever: Could not open a connection to your authentication agent.
[17:49:11] clever: ah thats handy, you can give it a command and it wraps it for you
[17:49:19] clever: for example, 'ssh-agent gnome-session'
[17:49:39] clever: then gnome-session is ran with the right env variables, and when it exits, ssh-agent dies
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[17:54:51] elmojo: sphery: ssh-add yields something
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[17:57:06] sphery: elmojo: then maybe you need to ssh-add your new key?
[17:57:47] clever: it checks the default files in .ssh automaticaly when just ran as 'ssh-add'
[17:58:03] clever: clever@ramboot2:~$ ssh-add
[17:58:04] clever: Enter passphrase for /home/clever/.ssh/id_rsa:
[17:58:04] clever: Identity added: /home/clever/.ssh/id_rsa (/home/clever/.ssh/id_rsa)
[17:58:35] sphery: you forgot to tell us your password...
[17:58:39] sphery: :)
[17:58:50] clever: it turns echo off :P
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[19:09:33] dan__t: Hi.
[19:09:47] sphery: hello
[19:11:01] dan__t: I've been using XBMC for a long time now, and I'm interested in using MythBox to be able to do the whole live TV thing under XBMC, using MythTV's supporting backend. Apparently MythBox only works with 0.23. That being said, am I going to be hard pressed to find support and/or a good time when trying to set up and use 0.23?
[19:12:29] sphery: well, you won't get support for fixing bugs in 0.23 or below (but you can create and apply your own patches or try to backport patches that we include in future versions)
[19:12:41] dan__t: understood.
[19:13:00] sphery: and many of your "it doesn't seem to work on my 0.23 system" questions will likely be answered with, "It works great on my 0.24 system."  :)
[19:13:16] sphery: that said, I highly recommend using mythfrontend as a frontend to MythtV and not using XBMC
[19:13:17] wagnerrp: note that xbmc has never been recommended for use accessing mythtv
[19:13:21] dan__t: Last time I hacked on MythTV, it didn't work well for streaming live tv on my lan, I was pretty disappointed. Granted, this was some time ago.
[19:13:32] wagnerrp: as it does not follow the rules regarding protocol access
[19:13:37] dan__t: I'm sure. I was hesitant to even mention xbmc.
[19:13:39] sphery: Live TV is not the primary reason to use MythTV
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[19:13:45] dan__t: I know its not.
[19:13:48] wagnerrp: namely, that you only access those versions that it was programmed to
[19:13:50] sphery: if you only want Live TV, you likely don't want MythTV
[19:13:56] dan__t: I foudn that out after spending a week and hardware on it.
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[19:13:58] wagnerrp: it will blindly access any version it can find
[19:14:11] dan__t: I read that, wagnerrp.
[19:14:13] wagnerrp: its like trying to access an HTML5 page with mosaic
[19:14:19] dan__t: heh
[19:14:43] dan__t: So moving forward, are there any plans or even discussion on the subject of making MythTV more suitable for live TV?
[19:14:50] sphery: actually, with 0.24, it's worse--it's like trying to access an HTML5 page with HyperCards
[19:14:55] sphery: (i.e. we moved data around)
[19:14:58] dan__t: i've not been able to find much support on that, so I'm going with "no".
[19:15:19] sphery: so what meant one thing in earlier versions means something completely different in 0.24
[19:15:20] dan__t: MythTV is awesome at what it does, it just doesn't do what I do – live tv :)
[19:15:24] wagnerrp: actually, with 0.24, its better... since 0.24 will outright refuse it
[19:15:24] dan__t: Understood.
[19:15:29] dan__t: haha
[19:15:35] sphery: dan__t: so MythTV may not be the app for you
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[19:15:50] dan__t: Understood. No worries.
[19:16:00] wagnerrp: dan__t: livetv as in... dont record, just watch?
[19:16:06] sphery: AFAIU, there are lots of other programs designed for showing (and/or streaming) live TV
[19:16:23] dan__t: Well, watch and record, do whatever I normally would do with my cableco stb/dbr
[19:16:29] sphery: everything from tvtime/xawtv (for displaying) to VLC (for streaming) to ...
[19:16:33] wagnerrp: thats exactly what mythtv is for
[19:16:41] dan__t: ...except the live tv part.
[19:16:49] dan__t: It works, I got it to work, it was neat, just wasn't what I was expecting.
[19:16:52] wagnerrp: it does 'live tv' just as well as your cableco DVR
[19:17:02] dan__t: And I feel like an ass for even bringing this up, I don't want anyone to think that I'm bagging on their work -e ver.
[19:17:14] dan__t: That wasn't my experience.
[19:17:15] wagnerrp: note the implication that your cableco dvr doesnt actually do livetv either
[19:17:18] sphery: so, as I see it, the real problem here is that you're watching TV without recording rules :)
[19:17:18] dan__t: Like I said, I'll give it another go.
[19:17:23] dan__t: Sure, it does not.
[19:17:33] sphery: just use real recording rules and then there's no Live TV involved
[19:17:36] dan__t: But its presented as live TV, I can watch TV in realtime without the jitters.
[19:17:39] dan__t: right.
[19:17:55] dan__t: I'll give it another go.
[19:17:57] sphery: you can watch a recording in progress in "realtime" without jitters, too
[19:18:22] wagnerrp: if you have jitters, either you have not set things up properly, or you have hardware that isnt well supported in linux (ATI video cards)
[19:18:36] sphery: IMHO, there's no reason not to use a recording rule for whatever you're watching (other than lack of dynamic playlists, which I hope we'll fix soon)
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[19:20:56] dan__t: ok.
[19:21:27] sphery: my thoughts: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/387302#387302
[19:21:48] sphery: that said, Live TV in MythTV works best with the official mythfrontend client program
[19:22:00] sphery: TTBOMK, XBMC support for Live TV is, er, less than ideal
[19:22:44] dan__t: Right, so, I've said a few times that I've done it before.
[19:23:00] dan__t: I went through the process, I'm familiar.
[19:23:12] dan__t: By no means really good with MythTV but I got it working. It was neat.
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[19:24:19] dan__t: Well, thanks for the chat and info, I'll give MythTV another whirl tonight for sure.
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[19:29:29] wagnerrp: seems intel/nvidia may finally be settling their dispute
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[19:45:23] sphery: anyone know if Espen hangs out here? http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/387033#387033
[19:46:25] sphery: heh, now MythTV is on the Green hate list... http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2010 . . . /304740.html
[19:47:11] sphery: MythTV causes global warming! And water-supply contamination. And ...
[19:47:45] sphery: if only the MythTV devs weren't too lazy to support XvMC and libmpeg2--then the world wouldn't die
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[19:53:25] Beirdo: hehe
[19:53:36] ** Beirdo upgrades with the help of a trebuchet **
[19:54:26] sphery: heh, when you factor in everything that should be considered when deciding whether to use old or new equipment, that may not be that much worse than continuing to use old, inefficient systems
[19:55:04] sphery: (and especially when you realize that many of the computer equipment "recycling" processes don't really work the way they claim)
[19:55:06] Beirdo: just fling the old POC into the nearest polluted river
[19:55:12] sphery: yeah
[19:55:15] Beirdo: easy to do in Philly or NYC
[19:55:36] sphery: heh, then we could rename the East River the PC River
[19:55:43] Beirdo: heh
[19:55:45] awalls: The biggest power saving comes from having the backend shutdown when no shows are being recorded
[19:55:50] awalls: :)
[19:55:53] sphery: awalls: +1
[19:55:55] Beirdo: pfft
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[19:56:04] awalls: I do that with my machine, since the BIOS alarm actually works
[19:56:11] ** Beirdo saves power by not caring ;) **
[19:56:23] sphery: I save power in rechargeable batteries
[19:56:40] Beirdo: sorry, but my electricity bill is dang low, I really don't care
[19:56:56] sphery: I have to keep saving power, though, because I keep using my banked power
[19:57:02] awalls: Beirdo: If you cared more, the heat from you caring could warm the air around you, reducing your heating bill. ;)
[19:57:11] Beirdo: my heating bill is 0
[19:57:20] Beirdo: as in, I don't turn on the heat
[19:57:24] awalls: Florida?
[19:57:28] Beirdo: Seattle
[19:57:34] mrvanes: I need a little help (git) cloning 0.24-fixes, anyone around to help me out?
[19:57:38] sphery: he's leeching off the guys in the adjacent apartments
[19:57:45] sphery: :)
[19:57:52] Beirdo: I just happen to like it a wee bit chilly, and the morons below me... don't
[19:58:04] kormoc: sphery, I don't think leeching is the word when they force heat to radiate into yours
[19:58:12] mrvanes: I do: git clone git://github.com/MythTV/mythtv.git
[19:58:16] sphery: kormoc: heh, stupid thermodynamics!
[19:58:27] awalls: In this house we ...
[19:58:29] kormoc: they should insulate better!
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[19:58:38] mrvanes: and have a fresch 'mythtv' dir after a while... so then?
[19:58:46] awalls: .. obey the laws of thermodynamics!
[19:58:54] Beirdo: my heat is generated by my computers, TV, fridge and stove
[19:59:05] Beirdo: and lights (occasionally) and the dryer
[19:59:05] Beirdo: hehe
[19:59:14] Beirdo: mrvanes: OK, so you have it cloned?
[19:59:16] sphery: I spend most of my money trying to get rid of the heat generated by my computers, TV, fridge and stove
[19:59:19] sphery: (I am in FL)
[19:59:20] Beirdo: git checkout fixes/0.24
[19:59:20] awalls: So we can say your fridge is running more efficiently. :)
[19:59:34] awalls: /efficienty/effectively/
[19:59:36] mrvanes: I think so, then I did a git checkout fixes/0.24
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[19:59:46] wagnerrp: ... trying to get rid of the heat generated by your stove?
[19:59:52] Beirdo: then you should be good to go
[19:59:52] wagnerrp: dont you /want/ your stove to generate heat?
[19:59:54] mrvanes: but then not much happened...
[20:00:12] mrvanes: So, how does my "clone" magically become 0.24 fixes then?
[20:00:28] J-e-f-f-A: Doesn't he need to do a "git pull" after that?
[20:00:30] Beirdo: the checkout told it to switch branches
[20:00:32] Beirdo: no
[20:00:38] wagnerrp: mrvanes: because when you 'clone' git, you have EVERYTHING in the repository
[20:00:43] wagnerrp: all branches and all revisions
[20:00:44] J-e-f-f-A: ah.
[20:00:46] Beirdo: the clone (and pulls) actually pull EVERYTHING
[20:01:00] Beirdo: well, pulls, you can be more selective
[20:01:04] wagnerrp: mrvanes: the 'checkout' merely tells git to shift some files around
[20:01:04] Beirdo: but generally...
[20:01:08] mrvanes: So, the actual files I see then magically are different ones after the git checkout?
[20:01:11] sphery: mrvanes: the main reason I invited you here is because these conversations can become long, and many of us try to read everything in #mythtv, so it's easier to keep stuff not directly related to changes to MythTV code out of that channel. Your question was closer to topic than most, which is why I just invited you here, rather than saying: /topic (you want #mythtv-users)
[20:01:17] sphery: so thanks for coming in
[20:01:24] mrvanes: Man... this is SOO different from svn ;)
[20:01:27] awalls: Beirdo: git remote update pulls down everything's updates
[20:01:32] sphery: and you have found help from /the/ git man
[20:01:38] wagnerrp: mrvanes: it really is
[20:01:39] awalls: 'git remote update'
[20:02:00] ** Beirdo wanders off to get lunch **
[20:02:13] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: I couldn't get my frontend to switch to 'fixes/0.24' Saturday – git returned: "error: pathspec 'fixes/0.24' did not match any file(s) know to git." – so I 'fell back' to using SVN to update my frontends – what was I doing wrong?
[20:02:32] mrvanes: so, I really have 0.24-fixes after checkout, and can do the hula I used to do?
[20:02:32] J-e-f-f-A: bummer, he's wandered off! doh! ;-)
[20:03:37] J-e-f-f-A: hula? You don't need Myth to do that – they sell hula-hoops at most department stores...  ;-) hehehehe
[20:03:39] sphery: the long answer to why/how you have everything in the repo: http://tom.preston-werner.com/2009/05/19/the-git-parable.html
[20:03:43] mrvanes: sphery: yw, and thanks for inviting me
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[20:04:36] sphery: basically, it's stored in a space-efficient format that allows you to keep a personal repo with everything--allowing even offline development on/against any branch
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[20:05:15] mrvanes: Sounds 'magic' but I don't _need_ everything, so there's a little waste on my side to say the least?
[20:05:31] sphery: not too much
[20:05:37] sphery: and likely less than with svn
[20:05:50] mrvanes: Ok, so GIT is perfect I guess? :)
[20:06:03] sphery: SVN stored basically 2 copies of everything you checked out in your working copy
[20:06:08] wagnerrp: my local SVN clone was several times larger than the GIT clone
[20:06:19] sphery: so you could do a revert without hitting the network
[20:06:25] mrvanes: Even if you checked out only 1 branch?
[20:06:45] sphery: mrvanes: heh, I'm not arguing perfection--I'm still reading/forming opinions
[20:07:10] awalls: git stinks over dial-up or other low-bw links
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[20:07:19] awalls: at least the inital clone of a repo
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[20:08:00] wagnerrp: mrvanes: a single svn checkout of a full branch was around 250MB, when you include core, plugins, themes, and anything else
[20:08:15] wagnerrp: the current full clone of git is 350MB
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[20:08:47] wagnerrp: there has been a lot removed from there, moved into other repositories
[20:08:54] wagnerrp: but the end result, its really not all that much larger
[20:09:24] mrvanes: I'm afraid I compiled latest master (head?) on my frontend, should I expect much trouble downgrading to 0.24-fixes?
[20:09:35] wagnerrp: currently? no
[20:09:38] mrvanes: compile+install
[20:09:46] mrvanes: Ok
[20:09:49] mrvanes: we'll see ;)
[20:09:50] wagnerrp: trunk systems will not work with 0.24 systems due to the protocol bump
[20:09:58] wagnerrp: but the schema is the same, so you can revert without issue
[20:09:59] awalls: wagnerrp: +1 for whomever made the decision to have themes, extras, etc. into separate repos.
[20:10:16] wagnerrp: the biggest problem with git is that you cannot checkout and work on a subdirectory
[20:10:27] sphery: schema is about to change, too
[20:10:31] wagnerrp: i cant have several 200KB copies of the python bindings
[20:10:35] sphery: (once I am suffiently well-read)
[20:10:38] ** awalls nods **
[20:10:38] wagnerrp: i have to have several full 350MB checkouts
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[20:10:52] wagnerrp: s/checkouts/clones/
[20:11:07] wagnerrp: or, i have to spawn off a bunch of branches in my own repository
[20:11:08] awalls: wagnerrp: you can do every thing with one clone and local branches
[20:11:11] wagnerrp: and only have one open at a time
[20:11:16] ** awalls nods **
[20:11:27] mrvanes: at what level should I "git checkout fixes/0.24"?
[20:11:28] awalls: It's easy to delete the brnaches though
[20:11:41] awalls: if you don't want them to hang around.
[20:12:04] mrvanes: in the new mythtv dir or above, at git clone level?
[20:12:30] awalls: in any directory inside the clone
[20:12:41] mrvanes: ok
[20:14:48] mrvanes: once I switched branch, I can do a git pull at any moment to keep up with the fixes?
[20:15:48] wagnerrp: mrvanes: yes
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[20:19:24] mrvanes: Everybody thanks for the headstart, I'm off compiling 0.24-fixes (I hope) :)
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[20:24:17] skd5aner: sphery: still wrapping my brain around these 4k sector drives :)
[20:24:58] skd5aner: sphery: Looks like a lot of people are just using fdisk and starting the first partition at the 64'th block which should keep the sectors aligned
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[20:25:11] skd5aner: sphery: how/why is that different than the advice you saw/used?
[20:26:21] sphery: because with that approach, your partition may end in a partial cylinder, which is an error with some tools (like cfdisk)
[20:26:29] sphery: then you can never use cfdisk
[20:27:15] sphery: basically, if you're using 63spt, your CHS addressing (which is basically made up) can't always (won't usually?) line up with the physical sectors
[20:27:21] sphery: 56spt works
[20:27:24] sphery: on all disks
[20:27:40] sphery: 512B sectors, 4kiB sectors, HDD, SSD, Flash, ...
[20:28:00] sphery: I'm using it for all HDDs with 4kiB sectors
[20:28:30] twoten210: hello, I've set up mythtv for the first time and when I hit Watch TV, there is a pause and it says Please W... then it returns to the main menu and nothing has happened
[20:29:02] wagnerrp: twoten210: generally indicates an improperly set up backend
[20:29:05] wagnerrp: check your backend logs
[20:29:23] skd5aner: sphery: k, thanks... this whole 4k deal has made me realize that I'm a lot more ignorant about HD tech than I previously believed :s
[20:29:31] twoten210: okay, can I do that thru front end?
[20:29:55] wagnerrp: ... by going into a terminal or file manager and opening the backend logs
[20:30:15] sphery: skd5aner: heh, well, my partitioning/re-partitioning my 3 disks a total of 9 times has taught me much more than I cared to know
[20:30:34] wagnerrp: there are database logs accessible through the frontend, but they are not very helpful
[20:30:36] sphery: (3 disks that use 4kiB sectors, that is)
[20:30:39] wagnerrp: more for information purposes only
[20:31:01] skd5aner: sphery: some info regarding your method here – I'm going to try to read up more after my meeting starting now
[20:31:04] skd5aner: thanks
[20:31:06] skd5aner: http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread. . . . 8&page=3
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[20:37:25] twoten210: ok, in /var/log/mythtv/mythtvbackend.log I see TuneTo(): Error, failed to find channel
[20:37:54] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, "savage them for spare parts"--how apt
[20:38:18] wagnerrp: hammers are faster than screwdrivers
[20:38:24] sphery: heh, true
[20:38:35] twoten210: I had successful channel scans in backend setup, and I got an account with schedule direct
[20:39:26] twoten210: I think that my source > tuner connection is bad
[20:40:23] twoten210: I have a Hauppauge 500 and analog cable, should I describe that as a V4Lin analog device or mpeg-2 encoder?
[20:40:35] wagnerrp: mpeg2
[20:40:40] wagnerrp: specifically, two of them
[20:40:52] twoten210: that's how I have it, 2 of them
[20:41:38] twoten210: I can watch TV but I have to change channels thru a terminal with ivtv, a real pain'
[20:45:40] wagnerrp: are you recording directly? or capturing off a cable box?
[20:46:12] wagnerrp: if you are using the tuner, you dont need to scan, you can just pull a lineup from your SD account
[20:46:26] wagnerrp: if you are using video capture, you cannot scan, you must pull a lineup from your SD account
[20:46:36] twoten210: oh
[20:47:27] sphery: twoten210: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/264034#264034
[20:47:56] sphery: best way to clean up messed-up input connections (or to redo them to make sure they're not messed up)
[20:48:57] twoten210: Ok, so I delete my video source then remake it with a pulled down lineup and no scanning
[20:49:06] sphery: yeah
[20:49:15] sphery: ideally you'd Delete all video sources
[20:49:45] sphery: it will ensure they're renumbered from 1 and get rid of any additional ones that you may not know about that could cause problems today or 6months from now
[20:50:04] twoten210: gotcha
[20:50:35] sphery: in other words, the editor may not show some broken video sources/video source data
[20:50:47] sphery: so you couldn't delete it directly--but delete all will get rid of it
[20:51:32] twoten210: get er deleted and recreated with the SD lineup
[20:52:19] twoten210: my input connections are gone so I will recreate them
[20:53:00] sphery: right, after deleting video sources, your input connections and channels will also be gone
[20:53:34] twoten210: so instead of scanning I will choose Fetch channels from listing source
[20:53:40] sphery: so you delete all video sources, then recreate video source(s), then connect inputs, then Fetch channels
[20:53:43] sphery: yeah
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[20:55:56] twoten210: nothing seemed to happen when I hit the fetch channel button, should there have been some feedback?
[20:56:21] sphery: it's possible your channels are seen as being ATSC channels, in which case they won't be added
[20:56:47] twoten210: oh, well the channel editor shows a full deck so I guess it worked
[20:56:59] sphery: oh, cool
[20:57:13] sphery: was just about to get the command you need if you have the video source connected to a digital input
[20:57:30] sphery: if it's only an analog input, it's much easier (then the Fetch button works)
[20:57:43] twoten210: back to mythfilldatabase and away she goes
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[21:01:07] twoten210: Oh my god! It looks great! a big schedule and a little preview video – wow!
[21:01:11] sphery: Beirdo: thoughts about putting a readme in https://github.com/MythTV/mythtv ? Just so github doesn't yell at us.  :)
[21:01:48] sphery: twoten210: preview video? what screen?
[21:01:57] sphery: or do you mean using the frontend channel editor?
[21:02:33] ** wagnerrp wonders if we should get justinh to chime in on how its a shame were getting people to replace their old VIAs **
[21:02:42] twoten210: I guess, I'll keep at it, the girlfriend will be really happy
[21:02:54] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, I'm surprised he hasn't taken the chance to do it already
[21:03:05] sphery: twoten210: congrats
[21:03:06] sphery: enjoy
[21:04:15] wagnerrp: http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2010 . . . /304760.html
[21:04:47] sphery: heh
[21:05:05] wagnerrp: so were scrapping machines that were slow when mythtv came out in 2002
[21:05:10] sphery: yeah, at least he's now admitting that it's the user who's scrapping, not the devs causing the user to scrap, the hardware
[21:05:19] n0tk (n0tk!~n0tk@216.160.42.30) has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[21:06:16] twoten210: Damn, I seem to have broken it, all channels show static, it says Not Recording
[21:07:04] Beirdo: sphery: feel free to commit a README :)
[21:07:57] sphery: heh... I'm working my way up to committing/pushing stuff
[21:08:05] sphery: been reading about git all day
[21:08:54] sphery: anyone know what quilt.git is?
[21:08:56] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: hehehe... ;-)
[21:08:59] sphery: http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/quilt.git
[21:09:24] sphery: in true bad form for a GNU project (even an alpha), it has no README
[21:09:35] sphery: and their git viewer doesn't yell at them :)
[21:09:37] skd5aner: sphery: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/libra . . . -Disksdth-LX
[21:10:08] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: It could be worse,it could be a README that just contained "This is the quilt.git project"  ;-) hehehehehe
[21:10:57] sphery: skd5aner: cool... "As to -H 224 -S 56, the key point is that if the number of sectors per track (set via -S) is a multiple of 8, then partitions will be aligned on 8-sector boundaries. The maximum legal value is 63, and the largest multiple of 8 that's less than 63 is 56. Setting -H 224 is not really critical by this analysis, at least not for Advanced Format drives; however, it does ensure that all but the first partition will ...
[21:11:03] sphery: ... be aligned to 128KiB boundaries, which helps with some types of RAID arrays and flash storage devices."
[21:11:06] sphery: didn't know that about the RAID
[21:11:14] sphery: though I use 0 RAID, so not critical for me
[21:11:33] sphery: J-e-f-f-A: yeah, you're right--that would be worse
[21:12:16] skd5aner: sphery: yup, I usually like IBM technical articles like that one
[21:12:25] sphery: yeah, they tend to be good
[21:12:26] skd5aner: very detailed (usually)
[21:13:34] sphery: Yeah. Used to be a lot of them written by Daniel Robbins (of Gentoo), too
[21:13:45] sphery: don't know if he's an IBM employee or what
[21:14:18] skd5aner: I seem to recall seeing artciles by contributors, not necessarily employees (if I recall correctly)
[21:14:34] sphery: yeah, there are some non-employee articles, too
[21:15:01] sphery: just that there were lots from him, so I thought he may be an employee or have some other special affiliation
[21:15:48] wagnerrp: sphery: i wonder if it would be a good or bad idea to tell people to fork if they want updated mythtv with old hardware
[21:15:57] wagnerrp: s/old/ancient/
[21:16:11] Beirdo: quilt.git would be how you checkout quilt from git
[21:16:48] J-e-f-f-A: wagnerrp: you could tell them to 'fork off'... woops, almost broke the channel rules... doh!
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[21:17:42] skd5aner: I would just ignore them... honestly, I don't get the hang up...
[21:17:45] Beirdo: well, if they fork, they better do so before yesterday's commit
[21:18:00] twoten210: Whew , well I got my picture back, it seems that one tuner works while the other shows only static
[21:18:03] sphery: Beirdo: so something you'd use if you wanted to dev quilt, versus something you'd use to dev with quilt?
[21:18:23] Beirdo: well, yeah, or if you want the bleeding edge version
[21:18:53] stuartm: someone is threatening to fork now?
[21:19:06] sphery: Beirdo: so that page name "quilt.git" is just a cgit-ism that results in a bad page name for the Quilt git repo viewer?
[21:19:11] sphery: http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/quilt.git
[21:19:30] skd5aner: ... basically, I want mythtv to evolve, be innovative, and contain as many leading edge features as possible – and if that means dropping support for something that only sorta worked, on one codec, and would only paint the OSD in black in white, on video cards not made in the last 4 years... then yay!
[21:19:32] twoten210: Damn, now they both show static, it was when I typed in a direct channel number
[21:20:14] Beirdo: sphery: no... our clone url also ends in .git
[21:20:15] Beirdo: :)
[21:20:18] twoten210: i typed in 3 and got them both back
[21:20:19] sphery: stuartm: there's a lot of people on -users complaining that we're destroying the environment by /forcing/ them to throw away perfectly functional hardware since we're too lazy to support XvMC and libmpeg2
[21:20:33] sphery: Beirdo: yeah, but our page has a useful title
[21:20:34] skd5aner: MythTV hasn't sold itself as something to throw on old hardware since like 2005 (pre-hd)
[21:20:41] Beirdo: that URL looks like it's for cgit (a viewer) rather than the clone URL though
[21:20:47] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: Are you going through a cable box into your PVR-500?
[21:21:14] biffhero: "hardware since we're too lazy to support XvMC and libmpeg2" <<< "since they are too cheap to pay you to develop it."
[21:21:26] sphery: Beirdo: yeah, it seems to be just some bad page design by cgit
[21:21:34] sphery: thanks for letting me know it's just quilt, though :)
[21:21:37] twoten210: no, but my output goes from a vga to s-video translater
[21:21:47] skd5aner: I really see 0 reasons why people are begging for XvMC support to stick around... good riddens
[21:21:54] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: that doesn't matter – that's your display device...
[21:21:59] Beirdo: more like a bad config by the quilt people
[21:22:01] sphery: searching for quilt and git leads you to many places that aren't what I was interested in
[21:22:11] sphery: ah, yeah, that's quite possible, too :)
[21:22:25] Beirdo: http://www.beirdo.ca/git/mythtv/
[21:22:31] Beirdo: that is also using cgit
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[21:22:36] sphery: skd5aner: good 3500-line riddance
[21:22:53] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: Are you sure the analog channels are actually still there? Most cable companies have worked hard to eliminate Analog channels...
[21:23:04] sphery: Beirdo: I apologize for unfairly disparaging cgit.  :)
[21:23:06] skd5aner: XvMC has always sucked... I tried so many times to use it pre-vdpau, and it was never worth it
[21:23:15] Beirdo: hehe :)
[21:23:22] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: Oh, and you're not feeding your cable through a VCR or something before your tuner card, are you?
[21:23:26] Beirdo: it's actually a great viewer app
[21:23:32] sphery: cool, I'll keep it in mind
[21:23:43] Beirdo: but, as always, you can config it nicely.. or like a putz
[21:24:34] J-e-f-f-A: skd5aner: The only time I used XvMC was on a PIII 1Ghz machine – it played back 720p ATSC near-perfectly when the OSD was not on the screen... That was YEARS ago...
[21:24:48] twoten210: with a little clicking I found that numbers above 13 switch to static, but my analog TV connected right to cable receives them all
[21:25:11] sphery: ttbomk, nvidia has practically removed (or completely removed?) all xvmc support from their drivers, right?
[21:25:14] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: Then you've got your channel frequency table set to "Broadcast" instead of "Cable"
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[21:25:31] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: Change that for both tuners, and you should be good.
[21:25:37] Beirdo: thanks, J-e-f-f-A... I was in the middle of typing pretty much the same thing :)
[21:25:55] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: ;-)
[21:25:58] sphery: twoten210: or, better, change it once as the global TV Format setting, and leave the tuners set to default
[21:26:12] sphery: twoten210: it's in mythtv-setup--global is under General, IIRC
[21:26:35] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: There ya go ... ;-) Forgot about that.
[21:26:53] sphery: J-e-f-f-A: heh, yeah, way too many settings to remember
[21:27:19] Beirdo: unless you are super-sphery :)
[21:27:24] sphery: heh
[21:27:28] stuartm: sphery: oh is that all? I thought it was a real threat – if there were people out there with the experience and time to supporting XvMC then we'd not be dropping it, it's an empty threat to suggest a fork
[21:27:48] sphery: yeah, I don't think they've actually threatened
[21:27:51] twoten210: excellent, you guys are great
[21:28:06] Beirdo: pfft, they can go ahead if they want, but they'll have a lot of merging and fixing to do
[21:28:12] sphery: stuartm: closest was someone saying /we/ should create a "long-term-maintenance" version of 0.24 that works with all future versions of mythbackend
[21:28:24] Beirdo: hahahahh
[21:28:24] stuartm: rofl
[21:28:29] Beirdo: OMG, that's a good one
[21:28:37] sphery: at least they've mostly dropped the arguments about libmpeg2
[21:28:43] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: yeah, that was a laugh... jeepers...
[21:28:45] sphery: (which will disappear once git quits scaring me)
[21:28:55] Beirdo: soon... soon
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[21:29:38] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Did you see my question about git just before you split for lunch? I couldn't figure out why it wasn't letting me switch to the 'fixes/0.24' branch...
[21:30:10] ** sphery pictures a comic with a "silly, incompetent, stupid, annoying, or childish person" yelling "boo" as I walk through a doorway **
[21:30:21] stuartm: sphery: git ain't that bad, I've only lost two fingers and a toe so far
[21:30:36] Beirdo: J-e-f-f-A: not sure, I didn't see it though
[21:30:41] sphery: Oh, I should admit--my fear of git is only because I'm still learning. It has nothing to do with git
[21:30:53] Beirdo: anyways, my head needs to get into Asterisk land here
[21:30:56] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: 15:02 my time, 12:02 for you... ;-)
[21:31:01] sphery: stuartm: heh, well, at least you have 8 other fingers and 9 other toes
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[21:31:22] Beirdo: who knows, he may have 10 other toes :)
[21:32:06] J-e-f-f-A: I wouldn't say I'm 'fearful' of git, just frustrated since it didn't behave for me on a couple of my frontends... doh!
[21:32:39] Beirdo: what version of git
[21:33:11] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Good question – both of those frontends are still on FC11 – so it's probably old.
[21:33:26] Beirdo: not sure, but it could be a versioning thing
[21:33:35] J-e-f-f-A: (I'm not @ home now, and the machines aren't on, so I can't check right now.)
[21:35:16] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Cool, thanks. I'll probably upgrade their OS's to FC13 or 14 then. ;-) Or can I simply rcp the /usr/src/mythtv git directory to the frontends off of my backend? (which is working right)
[21:35:52] Beirdo: well, if you have an older version of git, your best bet would be to somehow upgrade to a newer version of git.
[21:36:06] Beirdo: 1.7.x is what you'd be looking for
[21:36:11] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Ok. Thanks. ;-)
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[21:36:37] Beirdo: then if it's STILL being odd, we can try to figure out what its issues are :)
[21:37:08] stuartm: sphery: 6 fingers, 2 thumbs
[21:37:56] J-e-f-f-A: wagnerrp: btw – I decided to try the U320 PCI-X card in the PCI slot with a SINGLE drive for the DB. It does not quite perform at U320 speeds, but is faster than the SATA 1 drive I was using, and latency is 1/2 that of the sata drive according to the Benchmark utillity.
[21:38:19] sphery: stuartm: heh, I stand corrected
[21:38:42] sphery: really, would have been better for you to have lost a thumb--since either thumb works equally well for spaces
[21:38:45] J-e-f-f-A: wagnerrp: i don't think I'd dare put 4 drives in a Raid10 on it... it would totally flood the PCI bus...
[21:39:06] sphery: though I'd have to re-learn space without my right thumb
[21:40:17] Shadow__X: hey J-e-f-f-A just a fyi. I did not forget about the streaming project. I have just been extremely busy but in about 2 weeks i am going to be looking into it and seeing what i can do
[21:40:35] sphery: streaming?
[21:40:39] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: cool. ;-) Yeah, I haven't had time either.
[21:42:27] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: Shadow__X and I had talked about the old hack un-official 'mythstreamtv' 'plugin' — that worked quite well for me back in the 0.19/0.20 days – to allow real-time transcoding to [among other things] cell phones...
[21:42:32] Shadow__X: sphery: yeah J-e-f-f-A mentioned a project to me that used vlc to do on the fly streaming of recordings
[21:42:40] sphery: ahh
[21:43:11] wagnerrp: Shadow__X: yeah, dont think its worked in several versions
[21:43:13] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: the good news is that i know someone that has a similar project and is willing to help me out to get this working. So i am really looking forward to getting that up and running
[21:43:15] wagnerrp: maybe 0.20 or 0.21
[21:43:24] sphery: if you re-animate that project, maybe you could use a different name--since mythstream and mythstreamtv always confused users
[21:43:29] wagnerrp: it was a pretty intensive modification to the core backend protocol
[21:43:37] wagnerrp: including encryption and authentication support
[21:43:44] Shadow__X: hmm
[21:43:46] J-e-f-f-A: Yeah, the last "official" working version was for 0.19 – quite a hack – I had it working on 0.20, but not since.
[21:44:08] wagnerrp: it was designed for true remote frontends
[21:44:20] wagnerrp: i.e. mythfrontend over the internet
[21:44:24] Shadow__X: i have worked with another project that has had on the fly streaming working on .22 i believe
[21:44:26] sphery: I stream my recordings to a removeable HDD and carry it with me
[21:44:49] sphery: that allows me to have full-bitrate/full-resolution/full-quality recordings on the road :)
[21:45:02] stuartm: well I've now read that -users thread and I'm pleasantly surprised that the reaction is mostly pretty positive, no serious overreactions, only a couple of people arguing the changes and doing without a leg to stand on
[21:45:10] Shadow__X: so if i cant use anything from that project thats ok because i have confidence me and the author of the other project can get something working
[21:45:13] stuartm: doing so
[21:45:20] sphery: stuartm: yeah, could have been much worse
[21:45:36] sphery: I don't think it even raised my blood pressure
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[21:58:29] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: The old 'mythstreamtv' "plugin" was nothing more than adding a few php screens to mythweb that would kick off a vlc transcoding process.
[21:59:13] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: It never made it as an 'official' plugin, as it was pretty hacky, and required a speically-compiled version of VLC that included mp3 encoding. (Plus the auther didn't work with the core devs from what I understand...)
[22:00:19] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: oh ok yeah
[22:01:08] Shadow__X: my baseline goal is to be able to transcode recordings on the fly
[22:01:14] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: so in theory, it would be quite simple to replicate. I just haven't taken the time to do so. [I need that Delorean, darn it!]
[22:01:48] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: And could probably be done with ffmpeg nowadays... (I'm not sure if it has streaming capabilities like VLC though...)
[22:01:51] Shadow__X: then from there i want to be able to pause and resume where you left off, seek recordings,use comm cut list
[22:02:12] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: i know there are some projects for ios that use ffmpeg to do transcoding on the fly
[22:02:43] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: yeah, the old project would yet you pause IIRC, but not seek. You could seek from the vlc http control interface, but it was pretty crappy... [and lots of lag]
[22:02:45] Shadow__X: so i want something like that for mythtv. Once i get a baseline going i can go from there
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[22:05:18] justinh: rats. mythbackend isn't grabbing eit data for radio channels anymore. haven't changed any settings & yet there's no new data after 7pm tonight
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[22:06:12] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: i was thinnking of trying to build a last known working mythtv on a dev box and setting up mythstreamtv there and seeing how it injects itself and what worked
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[22:06:54] justinh: set the backend to log eit events & see what happens
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[22:08:09] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: He basically cloned the 'Recorded Programs" php and made it kick off a VLC stream with the filename of the recording, and the streaming attributes (bit rates, frame rates, etc) you selected on an intermediate screen.
[22:08:53] justinh: WTF? Has somebody been into my backend when I wasn't looking? dvb_eitscan is set to 0 on all tuners
[22:08:58] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: yeah i was looking at the screenshots. We shall see how much progress i make when i actually get to it
[22:09:32] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: I had 'modified' it by tweaking my 'Recorded Programs' php code to have a couple of 'LQ Stream' and 'HQ Stream' buttons that would kick off 'preset' bitrates, to skip over the 2 or 3 intermediate pages he had configured.
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[22:11:12] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: Because there was no 'seek' functionality, on thing that was great is that you could kick off a stream, and watch it from more than one remote location. (I streamed a couple of baseball games and nascar races for co-workers this way back then... ;-) )
[22:14:09] Shadow__X: ah
[22:14:24] sphery: knightr: there are no minor devs!
[22:15:14] skd5aner: sphery: when I do the mkfs, do I need to specify a block or sector size?
[22:15:21] skd5aner: sphery: (for xfs)
[22:15:32] wagnerrp: sphery: you dont know that
[22:15:33] sphery: knightr: Also, just figured I should let you know... Remember how I owed you a timeout on the miscellaneous status scripts? Well, I got my underlings to do it for us. It's in wagnerrp and Beirdo's mythsystem rewrite branch
[22:15:47] wagnerrp: some of our devs may be quite young
[22:16:09] J-e-f-f-A: Shadow__X: I would experiment from a command line with vlc – using an actual myth recording as input, sreaming to a port. Then on a remote pc, open the stream. In this case, it was port 8001 by default, and see what works/what doesn't. Then build a PHP page around it, or work to integrate it into mythweb – either the Recorded Programs page, or the detail page, or ??? ;-)
[22:16:09] sphery: skd5aner: in theory, it will get all the information it needs to make the right choices from the partition table
[22:16:13] sphery: though I don't know xfs
[22:16:25] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, true
[22:16:35] sphery: I'm sure we have minor users
[22:16:37] skd5aner: well, I believe xfs defaults to a 4k block size and 512b sector size
[22:17:09] Shadow__X: J-e-f-f-A: yeah i wanted to get the poc working before i put it into the actual recordings page
[22:18:12] sphery: some days Google's "auto-correcting" my searches really makes me mad--twice today, it's autocorrected to a completely incorrect query
[22:18:45] sphery: and it doesn't even do the "We think you're an idiot, so this is what we searched for, but if you really want what you searched for, click here" links
[22:18:49] Beirdo: then you should search for what THEY want you to search for, duh.
[22:18:57] sphery: heh, yeah
[22:19:04] sphery: Sorry, Eric Schmidt!
[22:19:07] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: they know better than you... you should know that! ;-)
[22:19:19] sphery: "We know what you want to search for before you want to search for it...
[22:19:33] Shadow__X: thats progress
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[22:20:06] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: I was troubleshooting an issue with a friend's pc years ago – the wintel box would always go to "http:///" no matter what page you went to... Guess where a google search for that got me???
[22:20:08] sphery: i.e. a query that has AFT and file system is /not/ the same as a query for FAT file system
[22:20:26] Beirdo: hehe
[22:22:48] justinh: how the heck did I have EIT data up til 5pm today when dvb_eitscan was set to 0 on all cards anyway? Confused
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[22:28:56] skd5aner: yay – TWC rate hikes :P
[22:29:22] sphery: all over or just your area?
[22:29:35] justinh: waggled the bit to high again & restarted the backend.. tada. got EIT data back
[22:29:44] justinh: still doesn't answer how the heck the setting got changed
[22:29:53] jamesd2: yeah over the air digital broadcasts... 30 channels free and $0 a month for cable or satelite.
[22:29:53] wagnerrp: they got another cable provider pushed out of the area, so they can raise rates
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[22:30:01] skd5aner: Well, not sure – but just opened my bill and they included an extra page with all the old and new service fees for all their services
[22:30:06] sphery: jamesd2: +1
[22:30:36] sphery: skd5aner: ahhh... fun
[22:30:43] skd5aner: Dang... not cool, it's like a 5–10% increase across the board :/
[22:31:01] sphery: like Homer said, "And someday, someone will invent TV. And it will be free. And then they will charge for it."
[22:31:27] J-e-f-f-A: skd5aner: and I'll bet your Boss won't give you a 5–10% increase to match!!!
[22:31:35] skd5aner: sphery: heh, saw that last night ;)
[22:31:57] skd5aner: J-e-f-f-A: aww... shucks
[22:32:04] sphery: yeah, it was an uncharacteristically good episode for such a late season
[22:32:29] jamesd2: i occausionally think ah just maybe i can get cable or at&t uverse, its only a few dollars more than my current DSL/broadband, then i add in $10 HD tv charge, $5 premium channel hdtv charge, DVR and Cable tuner rental, installation.. and think what the hell was i thinking...
[22:32:40] justinh: price increases? phone them up & ask them what they know about CHURN
[22:32:59] sphery: it's how I make my butter!
[22:33:03] skd5aner: They're more than happy to offer my DOCSIS 3.0 capabilities now though... for a bunch more money!
[22:33:18] skd5aner: s/my/me
[22:33:59] skd5aner: sphery: Moe went down on Katy Perry
[22:34:01] sphery: jamesd2: not to mention the taxes and fees on the extra cost
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[22:34:45] wagnerrp: Cannibalistic Humanoid Underground Roach Nurturers?
[22:34:49] sphery: skd5aner: and it was a reference to the whole Katy Perry on Sesame Street "scandal"
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[22:34:58] skd5aner: yup
[22:35:04] skd5aner: loves me some good parody
[22:35:08] sphery: yeah
[22:36:05] skd5aner: They so graciously bumped up my Road Runner "Turbo" service from 10 to 15 Mbps FOR FREE
[22:36:34] skd5aner: that said, all the standard Road Runner users got bumped up from something like 3 Mbps to 10 Mbps, so :P
[22:36:40] sphery: heh, I'm supposed to have the 7.5Mbps service, but it seems they're actually giving me a 10Mbps service
[22:37:06] skd5aner: also... my uplink is still crappy at 324k even though I'm supposed to be paying for 512 :P
[22:37:08] ** wagnerrp wishes they would get moving along with this fios rollout **
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[22:37:11] skd5aner: grrr, I hate TWC
[22:37:34] sphery: At least the brighthouse website says that if you use Earthlink high-speed cable internet over Brighthouse's cables, they give you 7.5Mbps, but if you go with Brighthouse, you pay $10/mo more and get 10Mbps.
[22:38:05] J-e-f-f-A: skd5aner: Hopefully their network can handle net bandwidth... when i was on cumcast, they bumped it up from 2 to 6 to compete with FiOS, and it slowed to a crawl...
[22:38:18] skd5aner: well, speed test right now says I'm getting 18.36 down
[22:39:05] skd5aner: Up at .29Mb :P
[22:39:07] J-e-f-f-A: wagnerrp: yep, I jumped ship from c*cast as soon as fiber was laid in my neighborhood... I was about the 10th person to get it in my city...
[22:39:13] jamesd2: i wonder how much time they spend setting QOS on all the speed test sites.
[22:39:33] skd5aner: jamesd2: yea, I just assume it's all cached or something
[22:39:35] sphery: actually, they're now not even mentioning that you can choose to get cable internet by Earthlink for less than going direct through Brighthouse
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[22:39:39] ** Beirdo bashes his head on his desk **
[22:39:50] Beirdo: **BONK** **BONK**
[22:40:07] J-e-f-f-A: Beirdo: Dont' do that – you're the only one that knows git well!  ;-) doh!
[22:40:44] Beirdo: nah, there are others :)
[22:40:48] Beirdo: **BONK**
[22:40:50] Beirdo: hehe
[22:40:51] stuartm: just learnt that the 1MB upstream 'upgrade' that was promised for Virgin customers won't happen in my area until June next year :(
[22:40:54] ** J-e-f-f-A laughs... doh! **
[22:40:57] skd5aner: sphery: hmmmmm – http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.file-sy . . . eneral/34107
[22:41:01] Beirdo: stupid $#%#@ing sipp
[22:41:20] Beirdo: I need to go get more coffee, this is ridiculous
[22:42:15] jamesd2: stuartm, they are hoping that all the virgins loose their status over winter vacation.
[22:42:45] stuartm: hur-hur
[22:43:26] justinh: I never used to care about upload speed much, but since starting to be a prodigious video maker er..
[22:44:22] J-e-f-f-A: Gee, either Verizon's feeling generous, or their throttling mechanism is broken – I pay for 35/35 and just did a speed test and got 56.8/10.4 ... u/l is 'low' compared to what I pay for, but d/l is huge...
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[22:45:10] stuartm: it will be useful when uploading video samples for others to test, but I've not much use for it otherwise
[22:45:39] stuartm: nor faster downstream, 10Mbps seems enough for now
[22:46:11] sphery: woah, the 10Mbps service direct from brighthouse is $77.95/mo and the 7.5Mbps service Earthlink over Brighthouse (that seems to give 10Mbps speeds) is $41.95/mo
[22:46:15] J-e-f-f-A: wt* ? a test to NYC yielded 56.8/10.4 — to Washington DC yielded 70.8/21.2 ??? makes no sense to me! NYC is much closer to Boston than DC!
[22:46:38] sphery: ah, no, that was the 15Mbps service
[22:46:51] jamesd2: J-e-f-f-A, its not the distances its the size and utilization of the pipe.
[22:47:19] skd5aner: you see... it's a series of tubes
[22:47:25] skd5aner: and you're a dump truck driver
[22:47:38] justinh: rang em up to downgrade our speed a while ago. they knocked money off instead.. permanently :D
[22:48:04] stuartm: justinh: what were/are you on then?
[22:48:29] J-e-f-f-A: jamesd2: wow... I'm still amazed that they don't seem to be capping me at 35... last time I checked (just after upgrading) – I got something like 27/14...
[22:48:54] skd5aner: sphery: eh, I'm going to go ahead and run mkfs.xfs -s size=4096 -b size=4096
[22:48:57] skd5aner: don't think it can hurt
[22:49:35] justinh: stuartm: I think they call it 'M' now.. the slowest speed they do
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[22:49:44] justinh: I didn't realise it at the time
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[22:50:15] sphery: skd5aner: makes sense
[22:50:35] sphery: on mine, they all use 4kiB blocks because they're large partitions on ext3
[22:50:51] stuartm: justinh: L is the slowest they do now, 10Mbit
[22:51:01] stuartm: they dropped M
[22:51:02] sphery: but I think a small partition would likely choose a smaller block size
[22:51:16] jamesd2: speaking of which i can't wait till the 15th, i will be moving and get a new dsl modem or cable broadband router and my connection will once again be stable... this 12 year old dsl modem needs viagara to stay up lately.
[22:51:28] stuartm: I can't get any satisfaction from Virgin's customer support, they are just lucky that their product is the best available otherwise I'd have walked – recently complained that my package is ~£3.40 more than it would cost if I were a new customer (ignoring the introductory discount period), all I got was a 'so what' type response
[22:52:41] russell5: probally a stupid question but could the myth database cause problems with lirc?
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[22:53:17] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: Only if the value for the lirc path is wrong.
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[22:53:38] twoten210: I have 2 tuners with PIP enabled, am I able to choose which quadrant the little picture appears in?
[22:53:59] russell5: under the front end settings you mean right?
[22:54:05] twoten210: yes
[22:54:12] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: yes
[22:54:39] twoten210: was that my answer?
[22:54:48] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: I don't think you can dynamically move it IIRC – but can select where from the frontend settings. [I don't use PIP or LiveTV, so take that for what it's worth...]
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[22:57:20] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: In Settings/General – 9th Page "Remote Control" — "LIRC daemon socket:" – most recent distributions it's moved to "/var/run/lirc/lircd"
[22:59:23] russell5: yeah its pointed /dev/lircd which is a link to /var/run/lirc/lircd
[22:59:25] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: On the frontend: Settings -> TV Settings -> Playback – page 2 "PIP video location"
[22:59:54] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: run irw from a shell and push buttons – are they recognized by lirc?
[23:00:03] sphery: wagnerrp: you should claim your commits at ohloh
[23:00:05] russell5: no its not.
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[23:00:09] russell5: so its a lirc problem
[23:00:23] russell5: or remote
[23:00:38] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: Right, you've got the wrong lircd.conf file for your remote.
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[23:01:03] J-e-f-f-A: russell5: ... or a general lirc setup issue – wrong receiver type, etc.
[23:01:13] twoten210: wow this stuff is complicated
[23:02:10] J-e-f-f-A: twoten210: It can be, but that's what makes it so flexible. Beats the pants off of everything else, especially in cost. ;-)
[23:02:38] knightr: sphery, sorry, I had not noticed your reply... If we base that on age alone then no I am unfortunately no longer minor and by a long shot... :) (ok, maybe not that much... :) )
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[23:03:17] sphery: russell5: run mode2 and see if you get anything when pressing buttons... mode2 shows raw input received from LIRC device, but irw shows buttons as defined in /etc/lircd.conf
[23:03:28] knightr: sphery, hmm, good memory (about the miscellaneous status script)... ROTFL... :) :) :)
[23:03:41] sphery: knightr: heh, I'm guessing you're missing a minor by a shorter shot than I
[23:03:42] J-e-f-f-A: sphery: ah, good idea. ;-)
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[23:05:04] knightr: sphery, you might be surprised... If I base myself on the pictures of some of us I appear to be older than quite a few...
[23:05:30] sphery: heh, I'm 38--I feel /very/ old compared to most people I know
[23:05:56] russell5: mode2 wont run. cant find /dev/lirc
[23:05:58] stuartm: knightr: Daniel's picture is misleading, he isn't six years old ;)
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[23:06:16] skd5aner: sphery, reads and writes on my F4 are faster than on my F3 ;)
[23:06:27] sphery: skd5aner: nice...
[23:06:41] knightr: sphery, I'm older than you (not by much though) and I'll be even older tomorrow...
[23:06:44] sphery: skd5aner: maybe they should have called it the F40
[23:07:03] skd5aner: or tagged "phantom" on the end of it ;)
[23:07:05] sphery: knightr: wow, congrats!
[23:07:26] sphery: knightr: in case you were wondering, I already sent your gift--it's in the mail...
[23:07:36] knightr: stuartm, ah, you mean people use misleading pictures? :)
[23:08:04] knightr: sphery: Thanks! and LOL... :)
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[23:09:18] russell5: its odd i had it working before i restored the database.
[23:10:02] sphery: russell5: mode2 --device=/var/run/lirc/lircd
[23:10:42] russell5: i tried mode2 -d /dev/lircd but i will try that one too
[23:11:21] russell5: mode2: refusing to connect to lircd socket
[23:11:36] stuartm: sphery: I had no idea you were sooo old ;)
[23:11:49] sphery: stuartm: heh, IIRC, you're right about the same...
[23:12:08] sphery: russell5: maybe you have to shut down lircd first
[23:12:39] russell5: stopped lirc service same error.
[23:13:08] sphery: hmmm.... that's about as far as I can go with lirc stuff
[23:13:16] russell5: thanks :)
[23:13:43] stuartm: sphery: not that close, 30
[23:13:51] sphery: wow, now I do feel old
[23:13:55] russell5: i am getting a haupauge 2250 wiht a remote in a day so hopefully that remote works better.
[23:13:56] sphery: guess I was thinking of Beirdo
[23:14:39] stuartm: I'm probably one of the youngsters in the group
[23:15:03] sphery: yeah--explains why no one can keep up with you
[23:15:18] sphery: mr man-of-a-million-good-changes
[23:16:05] stuartm: heh, I just don't have a family to keep me busy ;)
[23:16:44] sphery: heh, that makess 2 of us, so I need a different excuse
[23:17:04] stuartm: and although I thank you for the kind words, I've not been very prolific lately
[23:17:44] sphery: maybe not as much as in your mythui heyday, but still getting a lot done
[23:20:44] ** skd5aner had 20+ tabs open related to 4k AFT drives :/ **
[23:20:57] skd5aner: GO AWAY AND DON'T COME BACK!
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[23:21:46] skd5aner: and, speaking of having a family to keep me busy, I'm happy to report that I'll be a Daddy this coming summer :)
[23:21:47] sphery: I'm down to my last 3 tabs of git docos
[23:22:08] sphery: 2 tabs, now
[23:22:59] ** knightr is confused, it's not tomorrow it's the day after tomorrow... guess that bad cold is playing tricks on me (or is it my Alzheimer?) **
[23:23:06] skd5aner: ... so, any remaining free time I might have had, will be gone come June
[23:24:16] sphery: knightr: heh, when I was 34, I went for 8 months telling people I was a year younger than I really was without realizing it
[23:24:50] skd5aner: Don't everyone congratulate me at once, lol
[23:24:54] skd5aner: ;)
[23:25:01] sphery: new baby?
[23:25:05] sphery: if so, congrats!
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[23:25:10] skd5aner: yes :)
[23:25:11] knightr: sphery, I'm not sure I can beat that....
[23:25:11] stuartm: skd5aner: yeah, congrats
[23:25:17] skd5aner: First baby :)
[23:25:19] knightr: skd5aner, Congratulations!!!
[23:25:31] skd5aner: lol, thanks guys... haha
[23:25:44] stuartm: seems everyone has become a father around here lately, 3/4 devs this year alone
[23:26:15] stuartm: so many I can't keep track
[23:26:32] skd5aner: stuartm: yea, I noticed that... odd the way those things work out sometimes
[23:26:46] kormoc: .75 devs? :P
[23:27:02] skd5aner: Seems many of my friends have todders and newborns running around
[23:27:23] stuartm: kormoc: :P 3 or 4
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[23:28:08] skd5aner: 75% would have been more than a coincidence I would suppose, something suspicious going on there
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[23:28:36] stuartm: stuarta, justinh, Isaac, Chris (was that this year, or end of last?)
[23:28:47] sphery: jya, too
[23:28:57] skd5aner: definitely withing a 12 mo period either way I believe
[23:28:57] stuartm: so at least 5
[23:29:19] skd5aner: was there some developer retreat in Maui or something?
[23:29:23] jya: stuartm: yep, had one end of november last year
[23:29:28] stuartm: skd5aner: I deny all knowledge ;)
[23:29:36] skd5aner: heh
[23:30:04] skd5aner: Well, the wife and I are excited to be joining the club
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[23:31:07] stuartm: we've never had a dev get together, I don't think any more than 3 of us have ever met up at once, certainly no transatlantic get togethers
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[23:31:35] skd5aner: I guess closest would be the SD folks and people who might go to CES and meet up
[23:32:00] skd5aner: I wonder if I could convience my boss to let me go to CES this year... hrmmmmmmm
[23:32:07] stuartm: I've met up with stuarta & justinh twice, cesman on one of those occassions too
[23:32:23] skd5aner: How close are all you guys over there?
[23:32:54] skd5aner: forgive my lack of geographical knowledge of the UK sans a few exceptions (Manchester, London)
[23:32:58] stuartm: I won't be attending a CES gathering or any US based gathering unless someone sponsors it :)
[23:33:20] skd5aner: compromise and meet in Greenland ;)
[23:34:00] stuartm: skd5aner: well UK ain't that big, but I'm about 2 hours from Manchester (mountains get in the way, it's not far as the crow flies) and about the same distance from London even though it's much further away
[23:35:09] stuartm: and when I say mountains, I mean large hills by most standards aka the Peak District
[23:35:44] jya: I can't believe the extent people go for when talking about removing what is essentially something no one use these days
[23:35:50] jya: (re: XvMC)
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[23:38:48] stuartm: skd5aner: just so happens that justinh is in Manchester (well Salford which is pretty much a suburb these days) and stuarta is down near Croydon (a borough on the edge of London)
[23:39:16] stuartm: I'm currently in Derby, through a pin at the exact centre of England and that's Derby
[23:39:57] stuartm: a little south and east of Manchester, a lot North and west of London
[23:41:29] stuartm: skd5aner: have you ever been to London?
[23:47:50] J-e-f-f-A: stuartm: I grew up in Ashford – Manchester was just a few towns away... Oh wait, that was in Connecticut, not the on your side of the pond! doh!  ;-)
[23:48:55] ** J-e-f-f-A runs out the door as he didn't realize it's 6:48pm!!! doh!  ;-) **
[23:49:01] kormoc: I think I've only meet 4 devs, Isaac, Xris, Beirdo, and Jarod
[23:49:15] stuartm: heh, I know of an Ashford in Surrey and and Ashford in Kent, but I was about to say I've never heard of one near Manchester ;)
[23:49:32] kormoc: Ooh, I ran into cesman at SCaLE
[23:49:54] stuartm: curse America for stealing so many of our placenames ;)
[23:50:08] kormoc: hehe
[23:50:54] stuartm: seems so many American (and Australian) towns and cities were named after the villages and towns that their founders were born in
[23:50:56] jya: So to save what you're currently working on in git, you do git stash, then git checkout to switch to another branch, do your thing, git checkout branch ; and to restore the stash thing ?
[23:51:20] stuartm: my best friend at school lived in Washington (Sussex)
[23:51:35] stuartm: I live a couple of miles from Melbourne (Derbyshire)
[23:52:18] twoten210: Toronto Canada here
[23:52:20] stuartm: ok, Washington was named after the man, but his name undoubtedly come from where his family had roots
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[23:58:36] wagnerrp: sphery: oof... im ranked 372604
[23:58:54] kormoc: stuartm, too bad we didn't all just call them New TownName
[23:59:49] sphery: wagnerrp: when you claim your commits, your kudos go to 1, then your rank becomes basically "tied for last" until the next day
[23:59:49] stuartm: J-e-f-f-A: being from Connecticut you'll appreciate this one, the village I consider 'home' where I spent half my childhood was Hartford :) The literal origin of the name would be that of point where deer crossed the river and that was the emblem on the village crest, a white hart crossing the river, but another explanation is that King Richard II crossed the river there – his crest featured a White Hart (deer)

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