Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Wednesday, November 24th, 2010, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:26]

skd5aner:

btw, if anyone cares, newegg is starting a sale tomorrow at 1PM PST for a 2TB drive@ $69.99. They havne't announced which drive specifically, but...

[00:00:56]

skd5aner:

I might buy a couple, since when I last bought a 2TB drve, it was $149

[00:01:20]

** kormoc taps his foot waiting for 3tb wd blacks to be released **

[00:01:27]

wagnerrp:

stuartm: momcilo's edit

[00:01:34]

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[00:01:53]

wagnerrp:

i didnt know the blacks were out yet

[00:01:58]

wagnerrp:

ive only see the greens for sale

[00:02:17]

kormoc:

aye, tehre are no 3tb wd blacks out yet

[00:02:18]

Gibby_away:

wd raptors!

[00:02:28]

kormoc:

Gibby_away, slower then the current gen 2tb blacks

[00:02:37]

wagnerrp:

oh, released, i misread 'arrive'

[00:02:39]

Gibby_away is now known as Gibby

[00:02:46]

wagnerrp:

i thought you had ordered them

[00:02:51]

kormoc:

I wish

[00:03:06]

mofu:

getting "file for this recording cannot be found" errors for my HDHR, SD tuners are fine. Live HD is fine thru Myth

[00:03:22]

skd5aner:

and, when the 3TB ones arrive, prices for 2TB will fall not too long after :)

[00:03:29]

wagnerrp:

Gibby: there is such a discrepancy in areal density, the 2TB blacks and even 3TB greens are faster than the raptors for most of their space

[00:03:31]

sphery:

who was it? Samsung or Hitachi or ... One of them released 7500 RPM 3TBs

[00:03:42]

sphery:

don't know how that would compare to a black, but...

[00:03:56]

wagnerrp:

the advantage the raptors have is in latency and IOPS

[00:04:06]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: sorry, you've lost me

[00:04:16]

wagnerrp:

but if that is really that imperative, youre better off with SSDs

[00:04:18]

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[00:04:25]

Gibby:

from what i see the blacks are the desktop equilivent of the raptor

[00:04:38]

wagnerrp:

stuartm: wasnt my edit to put it on that page, i just made it a warning box

[00:04:41]

kormoc:

Gibby, nah, the raptors are 15k rpm, the blacks are 7200 rpm

[00:04:49]

wagnerrp:

raptors are only 10k rpm

[00:04:55]

kormoc:

whoops

[00:04:56]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: oh, the wiki, yeah ok I'm with you now

[00:05:02]

wagnerrp:

theyre 2.5" 10krpm drives

[00:05:10]

sphery:

ah, yeah, 7200rpm

[00:05:12]

sphery:

whatever

[00:05:23]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: figured you at least were familiar with the problem since you had made edits

[00:05:32]

sphery:

Hitachi was the one that released it

[00:05:43]

sphery:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/17/hitachi-de . . . -hard-drive/

[00:05:53]

Gibby:

doesn't 7200rpm equal 7200rpm?

[00:05:56]

wagnerrp:

no, comments i made were just a logical deduction

[00:06:10]

kormoc:

Gibby, wha?

[00:06:40]

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[00:06:47]

Gibby:

black is 7200rpm and raptor is 7200rpm

[00:07:07]

wagnerrp:

raptor is 10k rpm

[00:07:53]

Gibby:

re4 is 7200rpm, plus it has double the min load load cycle

[00:08:08]

wagnerrp:

load load cycle?

[00:08:18]

stuartm:

raptor == I don't care about noise or power I just like insane speed

[00:08:21]

kormoc:

Gibby, still no 3tb re4

[00:08:28]

Gibby:

true...

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[00:08:39]

skd5aner:

yea... double the "load cycle" would be the "load load cycle"... makes sense to me

[00:08:40]

wagnerrp:

the only real difference between the blacks and RE4s is the firmware

[00:08:47]

kormoc:

stuartm, it's actually not that fast in raw throughput

[00:08:49]

Gibby:

rofl, didn't mean to put load load

[00:08:49]

wagnerrp:

the RE4s are tuned for a different load pattern

[00:09:02]

stuartm:

kormoc: aye, that's the rub

[00:09:07]

Gibby:

i think the raptors have a longer warranty too

[00:09:08]

wagnerrp:

i still dont know what you mean by 'load cycle'

[00:09:21]

kormoc:

Gibby, they're all 5 years (blacks, raptors, RE4s)

[00:09:49]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, load cycle is a spin up and spin down

[00:09:59]

Gibby:

ahhhhhh, i don't see a MTBF for the blacks

[00:10:57]

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[00:10:58]

stuartm:

we're about at the limits of throughput with HDD, at least it's reached a plateau with no obvious signs of improvement on the horizon, given the fact that I can get very acceptable performance from 5400rpm drives (Samsung) I don't see any reason at all to buy 10000rpm

[00:11:41]

Gibby:

i've got the re3's and have been very impressed with them so far

[00:11:55]

Gibby:

anyone know what time the newegg deal starts tomorrow?

[00:12:15]

stuartm:

I'm just waiting for SDD prices to reach a reasonable level, at least for a workhorse drive, it's going to be a while before they are cheap enough to store my media

[00:12:28]

Gibby:

and large enough at a cheap price

[00:12:46]

kormoc:

yeah, my laptop is going to get a ssd long before my desktop monster gets 4 uber large ones

[00:12:48]

wagnerrp:

meh... i think if youre hitting load cycle limits on a hard drive, you need to redesign your storage setup

[00:13:09]

wagnerrp:

stuartm: yeah, i dont see a reason to get 10krpm drives

[00:13:17]

kormoc:

some laptops have bugs where they're load and unload hundreds of times per minute

[00:13:22]

wagnerrp:

not with SSDs down in a reasonable price range now

[00:13:27]

Gibby:

which 10krpm drives are you talking about?

[00:13:48]

stuartm:

they don't have to be that large for a root/home partition at least, but I'm still not entirely happy with the prices

[00:13:53]

kormoc:

Gibby, raptors

[00:14:06]

Gibby:

kormoc, no that is the VelociRaptor

[00:14:17]

kormoc:

Gibby, and that's a 10k rpm drive....

[00:14:28]

Gibby:

yes the raptors are 7200rpm

[00:14:32]

kormoc:

no they're not

[00:14:36]

kormoc:

we went over this already

[00:14:45]

wagnerrp:

Gibby: raptors are a 3.5" 10krpm drive, and are 37GB, 74GB, or 150GB

[00:15:00]

wagnerrp:

velociraptors are a 2.5" 10krpm drive, and are 300GB or 600GB

[00:15:08]

wagnerrp:

they are all 10k drives

[00:15:23]

kormoc:

proof, http://support.wdc.com/product/kb.asp?groupid=601&lang=en

[00:15:26]

Gibby:

no that is VelociRaptor

[00:15:30]

stuartm:

wagnerrp: with this poor WD design it seems it's possible to hit the limits in a very short period :( I've apparently exceeded the min-fail limit twiceover in just 8 months

[00:15:32]

Gibby:

http://www.wdc.com/en/products/Products.asp?DriveID=821

[00:15:38]

kormoc:

Gibby, see proof, all raptors are 10000 rpm

[00:16:22]

Gibby:

that is the old naming, see those are all 1.5Gb/s

[00:16:35]

** kormoc blinks at Gibby **

[00:16:47]

kormoc:

yes, and they're 'raptors' and 10k rpm

[00:16:52]

Gibby:

re3/re4 are just regular raptors at 7200rpm, VelociRaptor are the 10krpm

[00:17:01]

kormoc:

no they're not

[00:17:13]

kormoc:

rc3/rc4 are WD blacks with different firmware

[00:17:25]

kormoc:

(or wd blacks are re3/re4 with different firmware)

[00:17:40]

kormoc:

platter side/density are completely different between the raptors and RE's

[00:18:57]

wagnerrp:

Gibby: 10k rpm drives all use small diameter platters, and are rather low density

[00:19:25]

wagnerrp:

thats why with the velociraptor, they just went ahead and made it a 2.5" case

[00:19:56]

wagnerrp:

if you opened up one of the old raptors, the disks are probably only 2–2.2" across

[00:20:06]

Gibby:

first, the raptors re series are all 7200rpm, also they came well before the blacks..... and you are saying the velociraptor only comes in a 2.5"?

[00:20:25]

wagnerrp:

yes, the velociraptor is a 2.5" hard drive

[00:20:32]

Gibby:

http://www.wdc.com/en/products/Products.asp?DriveID=821

[00:20:48]

Gibby:

wagnerrp, ^^^ is a 3.5" velociraptor

[00:20:59]

wagnerrp:

it comes with a removable heatsink that makes it fit in a 3.5" slot

[00:21:18]

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[00:21:22]

wagnerrp:

see that big thing wrapped around it?

[00:21:22]

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[00:21:28]

kormoc:

you can see the small platter in a raptor via the raptor x, it has a window, http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/03/21/raptor_x.jpg

[00:21:31]

wagnerrp:

thats just a heatsink around a 2.5" hard drive

[00:21:34]

stuartm:

Gibby: it's a 2.5" drive in a 3.5" enclosure, as the picture illustrates very clearly

[00:22:04]

Gibby:

<<<<< my pictures are loading... but i do see it in the other one, so i do stand corrected on the size of the velociraptor

[00:22:19]

kormoc:

and here's the size of a normal platter, http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons . . . rd-drive.jpg

[00:22:25]

wagnerrp:

low latency hard drives like that are all 2.5" (internally if not externally)

[00:22:34]

kormoc:

it's much larger then the raptor X's as you can see

[00:22:40]

wagnerrp:

you do that first, due to physical constraints of that high rotational speed

[00:22:56]

wagnerrp:

and second, so that you have less angular distance that the head has to track over

[00:23:26]

wagnerrp:

all for the purposes of reducing latency at the cost of capacity and raw throughput

[00:24:07]

Gibby:

correct, but my point was only that the raptors are 7200 and velociraptor 10krpm

[00:24:36]

kormoc:

Gibby, NO!

[00:24:47]

kormoc:

Gibby, SEE THE LINK I POSTED EARLIER. THE RAPTORS ARE 10000 RPM

[00:25:15]

Gibby:

re1 is raptor 1st gen, re2 raptor 2nd gen, re3 raptor 3rd gen, re4 raptor 4th gen

[00:25:23]

kormoc:

Gibby, NO IT IS NOT

[00:25:29]

wagnerrp:

no, RE == Raid Edition

[00:25:35]

iamlindoro:

Yes, yes, but surely we can all agree that raptors are 7200 rpm and velociraptors are 10k ;)

[00:25:46]

** kormoc shoots himself **

[00:25:48]

** iamlindoro puts down the lighter fluid and backs away **

[00:25:49]

iamlindoro:

hahaha

[00:26:04]

wagnerrp:

do i see an xtranormal in the works?

[00:26:17]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, I think so

[00:26:23]

iamlindoro:

heh, it would be ideal subject matter

[00:30:36]

Gibby:

Sent the question to Western Digital should hear something back within 2 hours

[00:30:43]

iamlindoro:

oh jeez

[00:30:47]

kormoc:

oh jesus h christ

[00:30:56]

Gibby:

:)

[00:31:21]

Gibby:

i will send you each a 6 pack if i am wrong

[00:32:21]

Gibby:

can you even ship a 6 pack? how about a gift certificate to new egg instead?

[00:33:05]

kormoc:

Gibby, buy me a 2tb WD black drive?

[00:33:22]

iamlindoro:

I think you've had quite enough exposure to alcohol

[00:34:26]

kormoc:

in anycase

[00:34:48]

kormoc:

http://bit.ly/fUOwiy

[00:34:56]

kormoc:

What is the difference between Desktop edition and RAID (Enterprise) edition hard drives?

[00:34:57]

Gibby:

sorry a 6pack doesn't equal a 2tb WD black drive......no beer today just a couple shots of http://www.apsinthion.com.pl/

[00:35:24]

kormoc:

too bad it's illegal to mail beer

[00:35:51]

wagnerrp:

how do the 'wine of the month' clubs work?

[00:36:25]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, wine is not pressurized

[00:36:44]

kormoc:

it's not the alcohol, it's the pressurized container

[00:37:31]

kormoc:

it's also why you can't check beer for flights, but you can check wine

[00:37:38]

Gibby:

if you live in SC, i will deliver

[00:38:13]

kormoc:

that'd be a negative

[00:38:27]

Gibby:

ok, how about a hooters girl delivers it instead?

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[00:41:23]

Gibby:

any1 got an amd x6?

[00:44:27]

wagnerrp:

not enough memory bandwidth for the amount of processing power IMHO

[00:44:30]

wagnerrp:

its bottlenecked

[00:44:57]

wagnerrp:

of course at 1/4 the price of an i7–980... you can afford to be bottlenecked a bit

[00:45:20]

Gibby:

wish there was cheaper motherboard that could take 2 of them then $300

[00:46:02]

wagnerrp:

you do realize you cant put two Phenoms or Athlons in the same system, right?

[00:46:25]

wagnerrp:

you need full Opterons, and those are probably going to start at $600 each

[00:46:39]

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[00:47:41]

Gibby:

Tyan said you can put it in their S8236GM3NR motherboard

[00:47:51]

wagnerrp:

or not... only $200 for the low end 4170

[00:48:42]

wagnerrp:

that board is for the magny-cours, 8-way and 12-way processors

[00:49:27]

Gibby:

i read it a few months ago in one of the Tyan developer blogs.... never dug into it to much

[00:49:30]

wagnerrp:

$275 for the low end 6128 (2.0GHz)

[00:49:43]

wagnerrp:

surprisingly cheap

[00:49:56]

wagnerrp:

i thought the magny-cours stuff was all over $1K per chip

[00:50:06]

wagnerrp:

anyway, no

[00:50:12]

Gibby:

hmm bummer

[00:50:15]

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[00:50:17]

wagnerrp:

you cannot put two Athlons or two Phenoms on the same system

[00:50:40]

wagnerrp:

you /can/ put two independent systems on the same board

[00:51:02]

wagnerrp:

but the only retail one of those ive ever seen is a DFI LGA775 + Atom board

[00:51:31]

wagnerrp:

the server processors have additional hypertransport links to connect the processors directly together

[00:51:59]

wagnerrp:

since theyre not tied in through a FSB like old architectures, being able to do multi-processor relies on the availability of those HT links

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[01:21:11]

nutron:

amd is still the clear winner in my mind... but hey what do I know? The only hardware I hate, is anything VIA. They've really gone downhill.

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[01:23:15]

wagnerrp:

as far as straight price per performance, sure, AMD is a clear winner in the low end server market

[01:23:23]

wagnerrp:

but its not always so clear cut

[01:23:40]

wagnerrp:

commercial software is often licensed per thread

[01:23:56]

wagnerrp:

or per core

[01:24:07]

nutron:

Agreed, though mips isn't always a good measure. Have of the threads that run under the kernel don't care if they complete their jobs a half second later.

[01:24:16]

wagnerrp:

in which case Intel chips which are more powerful per core make more sense financially

[01:24:18]

nutron:

So I guess I'm agreeing with you :)

[01:24:25]

nutron:

wagnerrp: know much about the dummy capture card?

[01:24:29]

wagnerrp:

none

[01:26:11]

nutron:

hmm, i'm so... confused and because it touches so many small nibbly bits in the code, I'm... still confused.

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[01:57:02]

sphery:

nutron: so what are you trying to figure out?

[01:57:16]

sphery:

nutron: are you seeing an issue where it reads the file in at about 1GB/min

[01:57:23]

sphery:

or something totally different

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[02:35:44]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Is there any way to take advantage of leanback type HTML5 websites in MythTV.

[02:36:07]

wagnerrp:

leanback?

[02:36:24]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Those sites that are designed to be viewed on a TV screen

[02:37:06]

wagnerrp:

if it works in mythbrowser, you can write a grabber to use it in mythnetvision

[02:37:28]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That's the question. These sites are designed with interfaces.

[02:38:02]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Here's an example that I just saw.

[02:38:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

http://tv.revision3.com/

[02:38:16]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

There is also http://www.youtube.com/leanback

[02:38:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

And this one

[02:38:35]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

http://tv.clicker.com/

[02:42:15]

wagnerrp:

youtube and revision3 both have grabbers for MNV

[02:42:41]

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[02:42:54]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Yes. But I'm wondering about the interface.

[02:43:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

more and more sites are going to create these HTML5 interfaces for their content

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[02:50:37]

kormoc:

just setup the grabber to use the alternative interface

[02:50:57]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Interesting

[02:51:00]

iamlindoro:

alternately, if you want to use the whole interface, just use webbrowser

[02:51:04]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm going to have to look into this.

[02:51:19]

iamlindoro:

ie, create a bookmark for any of the above in mythbrowser and control it with the remote

[02:51:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I haven't read the grabber page.

[02:52:53]

wagnerrp:

i wonder who this 'anonymous' is that has been messing with the new database support in the bindings

[02:53:18]

sphery:

wow, users are sure keeping gigem busy, lately

[02:53:54]

sphery:

"When I tell MythTV to do the schedule one way, it does it. Why can't it do what I mean, not what I say?"

[02:54:59]

wagnerrp:

wait wait wait...

[02:55:21]

wagnerrp:

is this guy actually asking why the lower priority rule doesnt take precedence?

[02:55:37]

sphery:

heh, I haven't gone through the whole thread, yet

[02:56:09]

sphery:

looks like I may have a few missing e-mails that haven't percolated through after my e-mail downtime

[02:58:18]

wagnerrp:

man, the bindings rewrite tracking ticket was over 2000 tickets ago...

[03:00:31]

sphery:

wow

[03:00:33]

sphery:

time flies

[03:01:19]

wagnerrp:

and 14 months ago

[03:06:34]

sphery:

we /so/ need to drop libmpeg2 decoding in the player

[03:06:50]

sphery:

just keep it solely for the lossless transcode (at least until someone redoes that)

[03:06:52]

** wagnerrp loves it when he tells people that they need a certain patch to make something work, and they post tickets when they dont apply the patch and it doesnt work **

[03:07:03]

sphery:

more "captions don't work" issues on list

[03:07:24]

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[03:08:13]

sphery:

libmpeg2: libmpeg2 is slower on almost all processors than ffmpeg and breaks caption decoding. Use at your own risk!

[03:08:21]

sphery:

seemingly not a good enough warning for users

[03:08:24]

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[03:08:30]

wagnerrp:

its slower now?

[03:08:36]

wagnerrp:

i thought the whole point of it was it was faster

[03:08:38]

sphery:

it's only ever been faster on Athlon XP

[03:08:43]

sphery:

never on any other processor

[03:08:50]

sphery:

at least AFIUI

[03:09:05]

sphery:

the point is that few are using AXP for frontends, now

[03:09:20]

** wagnerrp raises his hand **

[03:09:54]

sphery:

heh, but you also have 2 other real frontends that don't, right?

[03:10:16]

wagnerrp:

yeah, ive got Ath64s on my two used frontends

[03:10:28]

wagnerrp:

the XP is on a test box by my desktop

[03:17:38]

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[03:22:09]

sphery:

ok, Bob's Burgers commercials are scary... I'm afraid that show will never get cancelled

[03:22:38]

wagnerrp:

bobs burgers?

[03:22:53]

sphery:

animated show on fox that premieres in january

[03:23:20]

sphery:

looks like they're trying just a bit too hard to create anothe Simpsons/Family Guy--show that pushes the envelope

[03:24:43]

wagnerrp:

futurama holiday spectacular tomorrow

[03:24:57]

iamlindoro:

tomorrow? Mine recorded last night

[03:25:06]

iamlindoro:

(And I've already watched it)

[03:27:26]

wagnerrp:

just a bunch of south park on last night

[03:27:33]

wagnerrp:

and some movie named Accepted

[03:27:49]

[R]:

wagnerrp: great movie

[03:28:11]

wagnerrp:

that the one where they start up a fake college?

[03:28:19]

[R]:

yeah

[03:33:05]

[R]:

i love seinfeld

[03:33:10]

[R]:

"you didn't commit adultery... i did"

[03:34:31]

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[03:40:23]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, Definitely odd-- was on comedy central HD for me last night

[03:40:35]

iamlindoro:

four short vignettes with an original airdate of last night

[03:41:13]

[R]:

yeah, i think i watched it last night too

[03:43:41]

wagnerrp:

here, it shows the original airdate as sunday night

[03:43:57]

[R]:

actually, i think i did watch it sunday

[03:43:59]

iamlindoro:

sorry, was sunday

[03:44:04]

iamlindoro:

but still, not tomorrow :)

[03:44:27]

wagnerrp:

yeah... backend wasnt running sunday, forgot to turn it on

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[03:55:08]

wagnerrp:

hehehe... 'feel badly'

[03:55:22]

wagnerrp:

you would think writers could get that one right

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[04:11:53]

sphery:

wonder if http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/9277 is a dup of http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8603 ? Can't tell because the new one says teletext.

[04:12:26]

sphery:

though guess not since the fix for #8603 is in 0.24

[04:16:27]

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[04:16:35]

Suit_Of_Sables:

does anyone here have a HTPC with a mini-itx FF board? I'm having a hard time finding one with onboard audio and video. I really want 8 audio channels, HDMI, and a good GPU :'(

[04:16:47]

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[04:17:08]

[R]:

Suit_Of_Sables: ff?

[04:17:23]

wagnerrp:

form factor

[04:17:27]

Suit_Of_Sables:

yep

[04:17:31]

[R]:

Suit_Of_Sables: define "good gpu"

[04:18:14]

wagnerrp:

Suit_Of_Sables: look for something with an nvidia 8200 (amd) or 9300 (intel)

[04:18:29]

Suit_Of_Sables:

anything that can handel the decoding of H.264 and mpeg-2 content I guess. I suppose I should have said 'any' and not 'good' as most are probably able to do what I described

[04:19:07]

[R]:

any ion

[04:19:57]

Suit_Of_Sables:

I read somewhere that the NVIDIA GPUs can't yet do HD audio bitstreaming like compeditors can. though this was from about 8 months ago and I'm not sure if it's still true

[04:20:30]

wagnerrp:

8 months ago, VDPAU was perfectly functional

[04:20:49]

wagnerrp:

2 years ago, VDPAU was develomental, but worked

[04:21:11]

Suit_Of_Sables:

so this preson was talking out of there ass I guess. I saw it here http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php . . . post18816470

[04:21:13]

wagnerrp:

VAAPI (intel and amd) is still not very reliable

[04:21:36]

Suit_Of_Sables:

I use vdpau on my macbook running arch linux and it works just fine

[04:22:04]

Suit_Of_Sables:

but then again I don't know a damn thing about HD audio bitstreaming. that said, I guess I should be too concerned about it

[04:22:52]

wagnerrp:

oh, misread what you were getting at

[04:22:56]

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[04:23:05]

wagnerrp:

i dont know anything about HD audio bitstreaming in graphics cards

[04:23:16]

wagnerrp:

however ALSA does not currently support bitstreaming of HD formats

[04:23:26]

wagnerrp:

and Pulse will never support bitstreaming of anything

[04:23:30]

Suit_Of_Sables:

ahh

[04:24:15]

Suit_Of_Sables:

hmm now was thier a third option in there with ALSA and Pulse? (I use alsa right now)

[04:24:42]

wagnerrp:

OSS, JACK, ESD, probably a few others

[04:24:55]

wagnerrp:

im not aware if any of them support HD bitstreaming

[04:25:02]

wagnerrp:

mythtv is designed to use ALSA

[04:25:07]

Suit_Of_Sables:

ah OSS was what I was thinking of. I've fiddled with jack as well to use ardour.

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[06:24:32]

Timrit_:

hello. i am running a mythbuntu backend using 0.23+fixes and need to pull it forward to keep up with 0.24 running on my archlinux frontend. is this possible? i tried the link to http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/ but the site is down. thanks for your help in this matter.

[06:25:09]

[R]:

just install the myhbuntu repos

[06:25:48]

Timrit_:

how does the schema get upgraded?

[06:26:19]

[R]:

when you run the backend manually, it prompts you, if you run it non interactivly i belive it does it automatically

[06:26:57]

Timrit_:

hmmm. ok. i am rebooting now due to kernel update as well. will see what version when it comes back up

[06:28:45]

Timrit_:

well it is going crazy in there.

[06:29:13]

Timrit_:

top shows mythbackend and mysqld taking alot of cpu time

[06:31:24]

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[06:32:20]

** [R] shakes his fist at midseason finale **

[06:35:24]

** wagnerrp shakes his fist at the invisible wall **

[06:40:14]

[R]:

wagnerrp: lol

[06:41:42]

wagnerrp:

never played video games?

[06:42:56]

[R]:

not much

[06:43:02]

[R]:

although i just finished lego star wars wii

[06:43:37]

wagnerrp:

the 'invisible wall' is what you get when a programmer wants to make the appearance of a vast expansive world

[06:43:45]

wagnerrp:

without actually providing a vast expansive world

[06:43:55]

[R]:

graphics makes my head hurt

[06:44:02]

[R]:

i almost failed my graphics class in school

[06:44:11]

wagnerrp:

so rather than come up with some real gameplay mechanic that prevents you from accessing an area

[06:44:17]

wagnerrp:

they simply put a clip wall there

[06:44:24]

wagnerrp:

you can see through it, you cant walk through it

[06:44:42]

wagnerrp:

so its very jarring when you see an area you should be able to go to, but are blocked by some invisible force

[06:44:55]

[R]:

that happens on lego star wars

[06:45:05]

[R]:

alot of times its a hill but sometimes its just a forest you can't go into

[06:46:31]

[R]:

why do people think it matters what they were doing when they got booted?

[06:46:37]

[R]:

on their car...

[06:46:48]

wagnerrp:

its a dense forest, too dense to fit your thick lego body through

[06:46:50]

wagnerrp:

ill buy that

[06:46:54]

[R]:

haha

[06:47:14]

wagnerrp:

when when youre walking up a hill, and suddenly you can go no further simply because the programmer doesnt want you to take that shortcut

[06:47:17]

wagnerrp:

its annoying

[06:47:42]

[R]:

on lego star wars you just slide down, you simply can't walk all the way up it

[06:47:47]

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[06:49:22]

[R]:

the woman just said if there is more than $400 she has to pay in tickets tehy can just keep the car... shes gonna get a new car for less tahn $400?

[06:52:33]

wagnerrp:

on a related note, this rifle ive got is awesome, and the AI is retarded

[06:52:35]

kormoc:

from the guy down the street

[06:52:58]

[R]:

wagnerrp: guns have artificial intelligence?

[06:53:09]

wagnerrp:

pop off a bad guy's head

[06:53:17]

wagnerrp:

the next guy in rotation comes to investigate

[06:53:24]

wagnerrp:

shoot him, the next one comes...

[06:53:35]

wagnerrp:

ive got quite a pile of bodies building up as they all fall on the last

[06:54:24]

[R]:

do i need to call the FBI?

[06:54:53]

wagnerrp:

yes, tell them ill out killing neo-Romans in 2281

[06:55:03]

wagnerrp:

s/ill/im/

[06:55:57]

[R]:

lol

[06:56:03]

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[06:56:04]

[R]:

is 2281 the zipcode?

[06:56:47]

wagnerrp:

the year

[06:56:57]

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[06:57:30]

[R]:

TIME TRAVELLER!

[06:57:41]

** [R] gets a posse together **

[06:58:25]

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[06:59:46]

wagnerrp:

heres a clever one, hes got a helmat on

[07:00:13]

wagnerrp:

<plink>

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[07:18:13]

histo:

Alright I have myuth running shareing videos perfectly to frontends? How do I share music? Does the mythmusic plugin need to be on the backend or the frontend?

[07:18:32]

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[07:18:35]

wagnerrp:

mythmusic has not been migrated to use storage groups yet

[07:18:47]

histo:

wagnerrp: What does that mean?

[07:18:49]

wagnerrp:

all content will have to be shared over NFS, and the paths defined on each frontend

[07:19:10]

wagnerrp:

as opposed to mythvideo, which can stream content from the backend

[07:19:27]

histo:

So how do I add music on the backend so the frontends can see it?

[07:19:42]

wagnerrp:

mythmusic exists only on the frontend

[07:20:03]

histo:

So there is no way to do it with uPnP then?

[07:20:03]

wagnerrp:

you need to mount the remote shares to each frontend, define the storage paths on each frontend, and then scan for music on one of the frontends

[07:20:32]

histo:

Is there a way to do it with uPnP though like the video does?

[07:20:46]

wagnerrp:

mythvideo does not use upnp

[07:20:58]

wagnerrp:

mythtv uses a custom streaming protocol

[07:21:15]

wagnerrp:

and no, mythmusic has not yet been migrated over to use it

[07:21:31]

histo:

uPnP is implemented in mythtv since version .20

[07:21:56]

wagnerrp:

as a server, for third party players

[07:22:02]

wagnerrp:

mythfrontend does not exist as a upnp client

[07:22:27]

histo:

I don't want to use the frontend as a client. Forget I asked about htat. I want the backend uPnP to show both videos and music

[07:22:49]

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[07:23:21]

wagnerrp:

then configure mythmusic on your backend, and the backend will share it out to 3rd part clients over upnp

[07:24:10]

histo:

How would I do that? It's not doing that?

[07:24:57]

wagnerrp:

you have installed the mythmusic plugin?

[07:25:06]

histo:

yes

[07:25:34]

wagnerrp:

you have run the frontend, gone into the mythmusic settings, and set the storage path?

[07:26:03]

histo:

I don't use a frontend on the machine that has the backend

[07:26:23]

wagnerrp:

but you configure mythmusic through mythfrontend

[07:26:57]

histo:

On the client or the server?

[07:27:09]

wagnerrp:

on the machine running your master backend

[07:27:39]

histo:

How would I do this without a frontend

[07:27:44]

histo:

sry without X

[07:28:14]

wagnerrp:

the same way you configured the backend using mythtv-setup

[07:28:38]

histo:

mythmusic isn't in mythtv-setup

[07:28:51]

wagnerrp:

no, but you are running a backend

[07:28:59]

wagnerrp:

which means you must have run mythtv-setup to configure it

[07:29:00]

histo:

Corrent

[07:29:05]

histo:

Yes

[07:29:17]

wagnerrp:

and how did you do that?

[07:29:18]

histo:

but you can't configure mythmusic like you are saying

[07:29:35]

histo:

I used X forwarding

[07:29:46]

wagnerrp:

so why cant you do the same for mythfrontend?

[07:30:05]

histo:

Have you tried using mythfrontend through forwarded X?

[07:30:12]

wagnerrp:

yes

[07:30:22]

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[07:30:51]

histo:

And if I do it this way the music will then work on other network clients over uPnP?

[07:30:58]

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[07:31:04]

wagnerrp:

if you configure mythmusic on the backend

[07:31:12]

wagnerrp:

the UPNP server will know where your music is

[07:31:18]

wagnerrp:

and will be able to stream it over UPNP

[07:31:31]

histo:

This sounds like a huge bug

[07:31:57]

wagnerrp:

how so?

[07:32:12]

histo:

You shouldn't have to install a frontend on the server just to configure it properly

[07:32:32]

wagnerrp:

you dont have to install a separate frontend

[07:32:39]

wagnerrp:

you cant install the backend without installing the frontend

[07:32:44]

wagnerrp:

they are one single package

[07:33:28]

wagnerrp:

mythmusic exists only on the frontends

[07:33:40]

wagnerrp:

the UPNP server was tacked on later as an afterthought

[07:33:56]

histo:

mythtv-backend-master has no frontend

[07:34:10]

wagnerrp:

however in the next version or two, music, video, and gallery are going to be moved into the core

[07:34:27]

wagnerrp:

with all their scanning and metadata libraries available to the backend and upnp server

[07:35:05]

wagnerrp:

when you 'configure; make; make install', you get the backend AND the frontend

[07:35:10]

wagnerrp:

there is no option to get one or the other

[07:35:14]

wagnerrp:

you always get both

[07:35:37]

wagnerrp:

what 3rd party packagers decide to do with those executables is up to them

[07:35:47]

wagnerrp:

but if you install from source, you cannot get one without the other

[07:37:21]

histo:

ayight ty but still sounds like a huge bug. Config should be done in backend independent of frontend. Plugins shouldn't be written that way.

[07:37:25]

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[07:38:55]

el_duerino:

hi, has anybody a hint what the problem may be, when mythfrontend randomly stops reacting on key presses of the remote control or the keyboard?

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[11:06:52]

stuartm:

I can't believe I'm even discussing Silverlight in -dev, it's surreal

[11:09:37]

stuartm:

I sometimes feel like Microsoft has managed to brainwash a whole generation of developers and I'm not just talking about the generation who fell into programming and for whom VB is the pinnacle, there seems to be a younger generation marching with the Microsoft banners apparently unaware that there is an entire world beyond their walled city

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el_duerino:

stuartm: like they are living in the matrix?

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[12:19:33]

stuartm:

more like they are living underground, they know there is /something/ above them but the light is too bright and they are too frightened to venture beyond their nice safe burrows which they know intimately

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jannau:

stuartm: don't feed the troll!

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[13:00:52]

jya:

is there any way to jump directly to entries in the recording screen? Like pressing 4 once get you to "G", another time "H", a 3rd time I etc ?

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[13:09:41]

stuartm:

no

[13:10:42]

stuartm:

and given that many lists, including my recording lists, are not in alphabetic order, that particular example wouldn't work so well

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[13:13:58]

stuartm:

1 = 10%, 2 = 20% .... 0 = 100% would be more useful, but only if utilising those bindings for lists makes sense in every context, it won't be accepted if it only works in the recordings screen but not in mythvideo etc

[13:15:33]

stuartm:

you could implement the incremental search which was present in the old ui, binding brought up a text edit dialog, as you typed into it the list moved to the first matching entries

[13:16:59]

stuartm:

not many people knew about or used the incremental search, but it could exist in mythui without conflicting with existing bindings or behaviour

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jya:

stuartm: I'm referring to the list on the left that sort the recordings per group

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jya:

cause with my remote, doing up/down takes forever...

[14:24:21]

stuartm:

jya: use pageup/pagedown?

[14:24:40]

jya:

don't have that binded on my remote

[14:25:02]

jya:

And I'm not a fan of remote requiring 500 buttons :)

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jya:

nor of the text edit form with the keyboard...

[14:28:04]

jya:

Need to find one of those :) http://james.hamsterrepublic.com/?paged=3

[14:28:14]

jya:

NmrgTech 202 Key keyboard

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Saviq:

hi all, guys can anyone please tell me how to browse my music collection? it seems I can only add stuff to the play queue for some time now...

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Saviq:

'show whole music tree' – that's it

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Twiggy|worx:

Saviq, http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythMusic

[15:17:50]

Saviq:

yeah found it now, thanks...

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neztiti:

guys i have the last svn and mythfrontend frazing after 30 seconds any help ??

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nwidger:

hi i just upgraded to 0.24 and cant get mythbackend to stay running, here is the output log when i try to run it: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/LBrcqBy5. after the last message it terminates with exit status of 1.

[15:38:01]

nwidger:

any ideas on what might be the problem?

[15:39:35]

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[15:40:51]

neztiti:

guys i have the last svn and mythfrontend frazing after 30 seconds any help ??

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[15:44:10]

iamlindoro:

nwidger: According to your log, you are trying to run a backend without capture cards. That is not a supported configuration. In .24, the backend will not run without a capture card.

[15:44:34]

iamlindoro:

To make the backend run, you will need to define a capture card

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nwidger:

iamlindoro: if i dont own a capture card, which one should i define?

[15:50:49]

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[16:03:15]

sphery:

nwidger: best bet is to get a real capture card and use MythTV for the task at which it excels--recording TV. You can try to use a demo card, but doing so may not be completely straightforward

[16:03:47]

sphery:

note that a MythTV that has a capture card and records TV is still /great/ at MythVideo (so you lose nothing and gain TV)

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[16:55:10]

Gibby:

anyone seeing issues with the new meta grabber for mythvideos?

[16:55:44]

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[16:55:51]

iamlindoro:

only those with broken packages/bindings/script installs

[16:56:06]

iamlindoro:

And it's "MythVideo"

[16:56:21]

Gibby:

hmm.... myself and another are having issues, i will do an upgrade install again

[16:56:34]

iamlindoro:

If you elaborated on the issues, it would likely save a lot of time

[16:57:26]

Gibby:

well let me make sure my packagse/bindings/script's are ok

[16:57:46]

iamlindoro:

Well why don't yuou explain your issue, and then I could likely *tell* you which it is

[16:58:06]

iamlindoro:

Since you came here first before checking those things, might as well follow through

[16:59:20]

Gibby:

ok, 1 sec, finding the entries in the log I am seeing

[16:59:40]

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[17:08:16]

Gibby:

http://pastebin.com/GKdDPyef

[17:08:45]

iamlindoro:

Now run the following from a terminal

[17:08:49]

iamlindoro:

/usr/share/mythtv/metadata/Movie/tmdb.py -l en -M "Charlie St Cloud"

[17:08:52]

iamlindoro:

and pastebin the output

[17:09:03]

iamlindoro:

from the same machine, please

[17:09:22]

Gibby:

No such file or directory

[17:11:00]

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[17:11:52]

Gibby:

ok so that might explain why it isn't working from any of the frontends but 1 once a day it will grab some of them.... does it run periodically on the backend?

[17:12:13]

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[17:12:26]

iamlindoro:

Likely you have Jamu running on the backend

[17:12:38]

iamlindoro:

So, you have broken packages that have not installed metadata grabbers

[17:12:50]

iamlindoro:

you should speak to your packager

[17:12:52]

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[17:14:11]

bbolin:

mythbuntu packages jamu in mythvideo package

[17:14:39]

bbolin:

that installs front end etc...

[17:14:51]

bbolin:

why isn't jamu available just to be installed on the back end

[17:15:06]

sphery:

yeah, the extra 10MB or HDD you waste is so useful

[17:15:16]

sphery:

do you know what they charge for 10MB of HDD space these days?

[17:15:34]

iamlindoro:

bbolin: Ask your packager. Me can only control source installs, which do everything correctly.

[17:15:59]

iamlindoro:

er We can

[17:16:12]

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[17:16:14]

RDV_Linux:

bbolin: Just last week mythbuntu for 0.24 PPA has moved Jamu to be BE only

[17:16:17]

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[17:16:21]

bbolin:

the extra 10mb or what ever isn't a show stopper, but dosen't appear to be the correct way

[17:16:40]

bbolin:

hum i'm on .24ppa

[17:17:03]

Gibby:

iamlindoro: I had jamu running in cron on my backend but i disabled it when i upgraded to 0.24

[17:17:12]

Gibby:

bbolin: join ubuntu-mythtv

[17:17:22]

iamlindoro:

Gibby: The only way myth can update metadata in the background is to be running Jamu

[17:17:26]

RDV_Linux:

bbolin: You will get your mythbuntu install details for #ubuntu-mythtv-dev ask there

[17:17:30]

iamlindoro:

So whatever you disabled, it wasn't all of it

[17:17:36]

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[17:17:48]

iamlindoro:

Since Myth is incapable of updating metadata without user interaction

[17:17:57]

Gibby:

iamlindoro: from my understanding don't recordings still use jamu?

[17:18:24]

iamlindoro:

No. Jamu can grab some artwork for recordings, but that is completely independent of myth code

[17:18:37]

iamlindoro:

Jamu does no metadata grabbing for recordings

[17:19:04]

RDV_Linux:

Gibby: FYI: With Mythbuntu there are 3 cron jobs that use Jamu

[17:19:17]

fbnts:

Hey, I'm trying to configure MythNetVision with the BBCi plugin. I have got it to create a tree of the programs however when I select one to playback I just get the preview image and a 'Click to Play' icon in the centre. The YouTube feed works fine. Is there something else I need to do the actually play the feed?

[17:19:24]

sphery:

bbolin: yeah, I agree that having it packaged in the frontend isn't ideal... though more from the standpoint that, IMHO, packagers breaking up MythTV into separate frontend and backend pieces is broken.

[17:19:37]

Gibby:

RDV_Linux: ahhh ok, i had manually put 1 in there and that is all i disabled

[17:19:38]

sphery:

i.e. it's just MythTV

[17:20:22]

RDV_Linux:

Gibby: Each cron job does a different task and is run at different intervals

[17:21:00]

Gibby:

bbolin: upgrade myth packages again

[17:21:09]

Gibby:

RDV_Linux: makes sense thanks

[17:21:12]

bbolin:

just did

[17:21:23]

bbolin:

is there a seperate jamu packages

[17:21:30]

bbolin:

will tell u in a minute

[17:21:46]

Gibby:

anyone know which metadata band of brothers falls under? tv or movie?

[17:22:13]

Saviq:

Gibby: well, it's a tv show, isn't it?

[17:22:15]

RDV_Linux:

fbnts: Click on the 'Click to Play' icon and if you are in GB the video or audio program will play. We talked to the BBC and they did not give us a way to get autoplay to work.

[17:23:01]

iamlindoro:

Gibby: Television

[17:23:27]

Gibby:

iamlindoro; ok let me try that, by default it was grabbing it as a movie

[17:23:36]

Gibby:

so it would be season 1 right?

[17:23:44]

iamlindoro:

Gibby: It was grabbing it as a movie because you have broken filenames

[17:23:57]

iamlindoro:

Yes, season 1x$partnumber

[17:24:14]

fbnts:

RDV_Linux: Pressing Ok or Play on the remote does nothing...

[17:24:22]

iamlindoro:

If you had filenames like "Band of Brothers 1x01.mpg" then it would have been properly parsed when adding and grabbed as TV

[17:24:54]

fbnts:

RDV_Linux: Also using the mouse (on Remote Desktop) does nothing

[17:25:42]

RDV_Linux:

fbnts: Mouse works for me but I do not use a remote. Maybe iamlindoro can comment ^^^

[17:26:07]

iamlindoro:

Once you have the player up, it is totally down to how that site's flash player behaves

[17:26:23]

iamlindoro:

Since you see the splash/play button, you are at the end of what MythNetvision does, and where the flash player begins

[17:26:43]

iamlindoro:

ie, we have no control over how it behaves as various players can behave differently and strangely according to location, version of flash player, version of Qt, etc.

[17:27:04]

iamlindoro:

But unfortunately, as far as we can control it, MNV has done its job and now you're into "screwy flash player" territory

[17:27:10]

fbnts:

RDV_Linux: argh, doubleclick starts to work however it then puts up an error: This content doesn't seem to be working. Try again later

[17:27:23]

fbnts:

Is that down to the BBC Site?

[17:27:33]

iamlindoro:

yes

[17:27:41]

iamlindoro:

Once you see a flash player, it is out of our hands

[17:27:53]

fbnts:

Just tried it on my desktop and its playing?

[17:28:18]

iamlindoro:

Just because it plays with another browser/etc. doesn't make it any mor something we can control

[17:28:36]

RDV_Linux:

fbnts: Try other videos. You can also try the iPlayer BBC search.

[17:28:36]

Twiggy|Worx:

i am retarded, mythfilldatabase wouldnt auto run due to it not being set to auto run... Derrrr

[17:28:51]

iamlindoro:

Since every browser will behave differently with flash, and our browser plugin is just a wrapper around Qt's browser classes

[17:28:55]

fbnts:

ah ok – is there anywhere/anyway to get the flash player to log to a file to see exactly why its not working?

[17:29:25]

iamlindoro:

Meaning what will work in Firefox will sometimes fail with *certain versions of Qt* combined with *certain versions of flash*, and the permutations are endless

[17:29:31]

fbnts:

ah I see. Is it not possible to bypass the flash player and stream the video directly?

[17:29:35]

iamlindoro:

no, don't think flash logs anything

[17:29:40]

iamlindoro:

no, it is inot

[17:29:41]

iamlindoro:

er not

[17:30:15]

bbolin:

Error: The MythTV python interface is not installed or Cannot connect to MythTV Backend. MythTV meta data cannot be updated

[17:30:40]

bbolin:

mythbuntu upgraded backend and front end. this shows up in jamu.log on front end

[17:30:44]

Gibby:

should moves have the year it was released in the filename?

[17:30:46]

bbolin:

all my metadata is gone

[17:31:09]

RDV_Linux:

fbnts: the message 'This content doesn't seem to be working' is generated by the BBC web site. I doubt it is a flash issue. Have you tried other BBC videos yet?

[17:31:30]

fbnts:

just trying now

[17:32:36]

iamlindoro:

Gibby: No. http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythVideo_File_Parsing

[17:32:45]

iamlindoro:

Your filenames need to conform to one of those

[17:32:49]

RDV_Linux:

bbolin: Talk to the mythbuntu folks. I had heard that they recently made sure the pythin bindings were installed on both the BE and FE packages

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[17:34:32]

fbnts:

RDV_Linux: tried about 5 different shows and they all do the same error

[17:35:07]

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[17:35:09]

fbnts:

not to worry for now – My backend usually records all the shows and the ones I miss I can just watch back on my desktop for now

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[17:35:34]

RDV_Linux:

fbnts: I just tried on my own set up and do not get an error.

[17:35:51]

iamlindoro:

It is almost certainly a Qt version + flash version interaction issue

[17:36:00]

iamlindoro:

(ie, it's not code we control)

[17:36:30]

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[17:36:57]

fbnts:

in my mythfrontend.log I am getting: Gdk-CRITICAL **: IA__gdk_window_get_origin: assertion `GDK_IS_WINDOW (window)' failed

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[17:37:07]

fbnts:

and Gdk-WARNING **: /build/buildd/gtk+2.0–2.22.0/gdk/x11/gdkdrawable-x11.c:952 drawable is not a pixmap or window

[17:37:10]

iamlindoro:

That is a Qt+Flash log message, not a myth one

[17:37:24]

iamlindoro:

as is the other

[17:37:30]

wagnerrp:

RDV_Linux: any decision on what you want to do with this unicode stuff?

[17:38:08]

iamlindoro:

fbnts: Seriously. This isn't a myth issue. Promise.

[17:38:26]

iamlindoro:

fbnts: It's an issue of the interaction between your version of flash and your version of Qt

[17:38:45]

fbnts:

no problem – I'll google to see if I can work it out

[17:39:10]

fbnts:

I just upgrade to mythbuntu 10.10 so its probably related to that

[17:41:37]

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[17:42:58]

fbnts:

just another error in the log which isnt a biggy but its saying: LoadScaleImage(/usr/share/mythtv//mythnetvision/icons/bbciplayer.jpg)Unable to find image file

[17:43:19]

fbnts:

Where can I specify the file as its .png in that directory not .jpg

[17:45:33]

iamlindoro:

Blame your packager, as always

[17:45:42]

iamlindoro:

it was a jpg is previous versions and is a png now

[17:46:25]

iamlindoro:

Assuming both your script and your myth are up to date, on both frontend and backend, unsubscribing and resubscribing to the feed should fix it

[17:46:34]

iamlindoro:

if it doesn't, one of your scripts is out of date/mispackaged

[17:48:28]

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[17:56:04]

wagnerrp:

people just dont seem to get that QT is more than just a GUI library

[18:07:03]

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[18:07:14]

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[18:08:13]

wagnerrp:

wait... i thought hauppauge was based in new york

[18:08:25]

wagnerrp:

http://www.ditii.com/2010/09/05/hauppauge-pct . . . uner-for-pc/

[18:12:59]

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[18:14:06]

dustybin:

mythweb, mythvideo plugin is showing 6 copies of each video for some unknown reason

[18:14:23]

dustybin:

my httpd error log says this when mythweb is creating the listing:

[18:14:24]

dustybin:

Argument "" isn't numeric in numeric lt (<) at modules/coverart/handler.pl line 112

[18:14:58]

wagnerrp:

mythvideo in mythweb is broken

[18:15:04]

dustybin:

ohhh

[18:15:36]

dustybin:

i will ignore it then

[18:16:19]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: it is. But pinnacle is germany based, and they bought pinnacle

[18:16:53]

wagnerrp:

ah

[18:19:53]

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[18:20:44]

henrik_ is now known as extasy

[18:23:02]

extasy:

Any one here who has some knoledge of the meta data fetcher?

[18:23:27]

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[18:24:18]

wagnerrp:

yep

[18:24:39]

wagnerrp:

general rule in this channel is.... dont ask to ask, just ask

[18:25:23]

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[18:25:44]

extasy:

I have some movies in video all have got the text and pics automaticly. However every night the name of the movie is changed to the english name of the movie. If I then go back in and choose to clear meta data and then choose fetch agan the swedish title is shown again.

[18:26:00]

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[18:26:25]

wagnerrp:

jamu is running and updating those entries

[18:26:25]

kormoc:

extasy, So you edit the metadata and then ask us to overwrite it and are confused when we overwrite it?

[18:26:35]

wagnerrp:

remove jamu from cron

[18:26:45]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, that's not it

[18:27:09]

kormoc:

wagnerrp, he cleared the metadata from mythvideo's ui and then re-grabbed from mythvideo's ui

[18:27:12]

extasy:

No I never edit metadata manually, I just ask it to fetch

[18:27:14]

wagnerrp:

thats what is making it change back every night

[18:27:24]

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[18:27:38]

extasy:

why does it change to the english title, the text is still in swedish

[18:27:41]

kormoc:

ooh, I see

[18:27:47]

kormoc:

yeah, disable jamu

[18:27:48]

wagnerrp:

dont know that one

[18:28:04]

kormoc:

jamu is the only auto-grabber we have

[18:28:26]

CyberKnet:

TSA Officer JAMU

[18:28:39]

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[18:29:36]

extasy:

Okej I have now # the jamu stuff in daily..

[18:29:43]

extasy:

should I change anything in weekly?

[18:30:28]

kormoc:

is jamu in weekly?

[18:30:58]

CyberKnet:

TSA Officers grab daily, not weekly. And apparently not weakly.

[18:32:10]

extasy:

I'm with mythbuntu and they have it in weekly to..

[18:33:04]

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[18:34:02]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: jamu is the only auto-grabber we have

[18:34:11]

iamlindoro:

That's actually not hte case

[18:34:27]

iamlindoro:

Since MythVideo will now do mass metadata updates all by its lonesome

[18:35:22]

iamlindoro:

(it's just that those mass grabs are still, for the moment, triggered by scanning for changes)

[18:35:53]

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[18:35:56]

kormoc:

fair 'nuff

[18:36:23]

extasy:

iamlindoro, If I do a scan for changes, it will pick up the swedish titles and text. But during the night it changes it to the english title

[18:36:34]

iamlindoro:

Yes, that's because you ahve set up Jamu

[18:36:42]

iamlindoro:

or your packager has done so for you

[18:37:05]

extasy:

okej and jamu is set to only get the english titles?

[18:37:18]

iamlindoro:

Jamu grabs the default titles

[18:37:32]

iamlindoro:

It's not language aware period

[18:38:08]

extasy:

[18:38:26]

iamlindoro:

Because the default title of that item at the metadata source is the latter, not the former

[18:38:48]

iamlindoro:

And the swedish title is listed there as an alternate title, not the primary

[18:39:13]

extasy:

okej well I need to change that then ;)

[18:39:28]

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[18:39:30]

iamlindoro:

It's not going to let you do that

[18:40:37]

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[18:42:21]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: FWIW you could probably hook mythweb up to send a SCAN_VIDEOS proto command now in place of the mythweb custom (broken) scanner

[18:43:13]

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[18:43:24]

iamlindoro:

Only tricky part would really be delaying the reload until the scan was done

[18:43:26]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, Aye, that's the plan, but the mythweb scanner has been disabled already, so it shouldn't do any harm anymore at least

[18:43:44]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, it sends an event back on finish, right?

[18:44:08]

iamlindoro:

I can set it up to send an event back (it currently does not), but it's enirely asynchronous

[18:44:23]

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[18:44:26]

kormoc:

how does the frontend know when it's done scanning?

[18:44:31]

iamlindoro:

Meaning a scan could take a long time, or only a little, and you might not want to be waiting on the event to reload... unless you can always listen for the event

[18:44:39]

iamlindoro:

frontend doesn't do its scanning via the backend

[18:44:44]

kormoc:

ahh, gotcha

[18:45:06]

iamlindoro:

I added the backend scanner last week. It doesn't do metadata/image grabbing yet, but it does, minimally, perform a scan and update the library contents

[18:45:20]

slipcon:

looking for some hardware advice... any experts?

[18:45:29]

iamlindoro:

It's the internet, everyone's an expert

[18:45:32]

iamlindoro:

on everything

[18:45:33]

slipcon:

:)

[18:45:42]

iamlindoro:

Just ask, and the "experts" will doubtless chime in

[18:45:48]

iamlindoro:

but I'll just preemptively do this

[18:45:50]

iamlindoro:

!url tuners

[18:45:50]

MythLogBot:

tuners: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hardwar . . . _Information

[18:46:30]

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[18:48:16]

slipcon:

ok. I've got a home built mythbox – its on its 2nd hardware incarnation in about 5 years, currently its a Core 2 duo with built in NVIDIA 9300 graphics – I've got a PVR-350 connected to a SD set top box, controlling channel changes via RS232, a PCI firewire card getting unencrypted video and channel changing on a HD STB, and a remote HDHomeRun... everything works reasonably well, but the machine is horribly unstable

[18:49:12]

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[18:50:06]

slipcon:

I thought it was bad memory, but I've tried swapping that with no luck – at this point I'm suspecting motherboard or CPU and I'm out of patience.... The machine has also always been very loud. I'd like to buy something as "off the shelf" as possible – I don't have the time I used to to mess with the hardware....

[18:51:44]

iamlindoro:

Depending on the weirdness of your stability issues, PSU is also a possibility

[18:52:03]

CyberKnet:

psu is rarely suspected, but often at fault for instability.

[18:52:11]

slipcon:

so any suggestions for something with nvidia graphics, firewire, and at least one PCI slot for my PVR-350 (or no firewire, but 2 PCI slots)? I'd like it to have enough horsepower to be a combined FE/BE

[18:52:42]

CyberKnet:

slipcon: I'd suggest finding something with many pci express – seems most new tuners are usb, pci express or network. rarely pci any more.

[18:53:31]

slipcon:

hm – so the PSU has been an issue in the past – unfortunately the case I bought 5 years ago has a somewhat non-standard sized PSU – it claims to be Mini ITX, and the dimensions match that, but the plug is on the wrong face, if that makes sense. I've replaced the PSU twice when it died, but both times had to buy the exact model PSU... so perhaps just a new case/PSU combo would be worth a try

[18:54:17]

slipcon:

I'm not likely to need any more tuners in the future, and I've already got the PCI PVR-350 for my last analog source. I'm pretty happy with the HdHomeRun, and clearly that is external to the problem

[18:54:35]

iamlindoro:

slipcon: P5N7A-VM is pretty small form factor, has a nVidia GPU, is LGA 775, has 2x PCI, and has a firewire bracket

[18:54:50]

iamlindoro:

I own one, have been happy with it as my dev box

[18:55:00]

slipcon:

yeah, I'm pretty sure thats the exact board I have...

[18:56:21]

slipcon:

its powered off (at home) right now because it crashed 5–6 times last night and (strange as this seems) sometimes having a little break seems to make it stay stable for a few days... prior to yesterday it had been about 3 weeks since it crashed.

[18:56:54]

slipcon:

I didn't think it had firewire on board though... I ended up getting a PCI card. Not that thats really relevant

[18:57:14]

iamlindoro:

The above has a firewire bracket, it's not on the backplane

[18:57:25]

iamlindoro:

but it came with the cable + backplane for it

[18:57:32]

iamlindoro:

er cable + bracket

[18:58:12]

slipcon:

hm. i'll have to look in my pile of stuff, I sure don't remember that... again, thats probably not the issue though.

[18:58:25]

iamlindoro:

I'd wager cooling or PSU as your potential issues

[18:58:29]

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[18:59:12]

slipcon:

yeah, I suspected cooling – set up lm_sensors and sensord and have been graphing the various sensors, the temps are pretty normal and don't change much relative to when it crashes.

[18:59:47]

slipcon:

is there any diagnostic I can try other than just trying a different power supply?

[18:59:55]

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[19:00:04]

kormoc:

not cheaply

[19:00:57]

CyberKnet:

I'd also wager on the PSU.

[19:01:30]

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[19:01:33]

CyberKnet:

If you're planning to replace it entirely... buy the new psu/case first I suppose.

[19:01:42]

CyberKnet:

save yourself some bucks if it works out.

[19:01:44]

slipcon:

certainly worth a shot... is there a current recommendation for Mini ATX cases/boards?

[19:01:49]

CyberKnet:

or alternately, mail the saved bucks to me. :D

[19:02:11]

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[19:02:17]

neztiti:

guys mythfrontend carsh for me after 30 second any help??

[19:03:30]

iamlindoro:

We can't help without a backtrace: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Debugging

[19:03:47]

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[19:03:53]

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[19:04:02]

kormoc:

and here I was going to use my magical debugging skills and venture a guess that it's a ati card with a compositing window manager

[19:04:25]

iamlindoro:

Just keep guessing causes, you have to be right eventually... like the monkeys and typewriters

[19:04:35]

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[19:05:56]

sgsax:

http://pages.cs.wisc.edu/~ballard/bofh/bofhserver.pl

[19:06:15]

sgsax:

I find that usually helps with troubleshooting

[19:06:57]

slipcon:

no recommendations on case/powersupply?

[19:07:33]

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[19:08:44]

iamlindoro:

slipcon: Not that I've ever heard. I like Antec or Corsair, 80 PLUS rated whenever possible

[19:09:00]

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[19:09:08]

jamiem:

hullo :)

[19:09:10]

iamlindoro:

for PSUs, that is-- for cases... well, my cases get hidden in closets so I got for "what holds the most drives and is sturdy" (lian li)

[19:09:12]

kormoc:

I like pc power and cooling power supplies

[19:09:34]

jamiem:

I've co trunk in order to use --enable-vaapi, is it normal that vaapi is not mentioned in the ./configure summary?

[19:10:05]

iamlindoro:

vaapi support does not exist, including trunk

[19:10:13]

jamiem:

oh.

[19:10:30]

jamiem:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/VAAPI so this is a lie?

[19:10:39]

sphery:

OK, I hate stupid web apps that accept characters in passwords that they cannot use on their login pages. Yes, I'm looking at you Ohloh.

[19:10:40]

iamlindoro:

Some work has been done to work on it, but it exists only in a patchset that likely does not even apply to current trunk

[19:11:05]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: No, there has been development towards it. It's just not a functional part of any version of myth

[19:11:27]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: I am having problems with h.264 on my Intel Mac Mini (Intel graphics) and was led to believe this would help

[19:11:31]

iamlindoro:

ie, some commits towards VAAPI support have been checked in, but it's not done, and not curently being worked on

[19:11:44]

iamlindoro:

VA-API is a disaster, having nothing to do with Myth

[19:11:44]

jamiem:

should I look into xvmc?

[19:11:57]

iamlindoro:

XvMC doesn't support H.264, so no

[19:11:59]

jamiem:

:(

[19:12:17]

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[19:12:31]

iamlindoro:

Who the hell added this "enable-vaapi" garbage?

[19:12:43]

jamiem:

dunno. I was really excited about it, too ...

[19:12:45]

iamlindoro:

jackass

[19:12:46]

iamlindoro:

I'll fix

[19:13:24]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: do I just have to live with the fact that the Intel drivers are too rubbish to deal with h.264 @ 1920x1080 ts?

[19:13:32]

kormoc:

if it's documented by a random stranger, obviously it will shame us into fixing it ASAP!

[19:13:41]

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[19:13:56]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Most likely

[19:13:58]

kormoc:

jamiem, it's less the video hardware and more the cpu

[19:14:11]

jamiem:

well; CPU is at about 175%

[19:14:26]

kormoc:

DId you toggle the deblocking filter thing?

[19:14:30]

jamiem:

but that might be the decoder not helping itself properly

[19:14:41]

** kormoc blinks **

[19:14:44]

iamlindoro:

not helping itself properly?

[19:14:57]

kormoc:

perhaps to the contents of the fridge?

[19:15:01]

iamlindoro:

175 means your decoder is working overtime and your CPU isn't cutting it

[19:15:17]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: 100% on one CPU and 75% on the other

[19:15:20]

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[19:15:40]

jamiem:

at least it was – I'm compiling 0.24 on everything atm

[19:15:40]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: What's unusual about that? H.264 takes a LOT of CPU to decode

[19:16:26]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: I was just suggesting that it's not necessarily CPU exhaustion

[19:16:33]

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[19:16:40]

iamlindoro:

For your Intel GPU to support H.264 decode, it would a) need to be supported in the hardware, which depends on which hardware your mac has, b) to be supported in drivers, which depends again on hardware, and which driver supports that hadware, and c) for there to be a mature API that supports that driver (VA-API is netiher mature nor good) and finally d) for myth to support VA-API, which it doesn't

[19:16:41]

kormoc:

jamiem, uhh... so what is it then?

[19:16:51]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: It is *exactly* that

[19:16:52]

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[19:17:06]

jamiem:

I see.

[19:17:28]

wagnerrp:

jamiem: if mythtv is using 175%, its very likely X or something else system related is going to take another 25%

[19:18:19]

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[19:18:29]

jamiem:

are these USB to DVI things up to much?

[19:18:52]

kormoc:

jamiem, won't help

[19:18:54]

wagnerrp:

not video

[19:18:56]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Whatever you're thinking, stop

[19:19:00]

jamiem:

they don't do hardware decoding?

[19:19:03]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: hehe

[19:19:06]

kormoc:

nope

[19:19:16]

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[19:19:18]

iamlindoro:

USB = 400 Mbit/s... 1080p video = 2 Gbit/s.... minimum

[19:19:23]

kormoc:

the only thing you can do is toggle the deblocking filter for h264 and see if that helps

[19:19:25]

jamiem:

yeah.

[19:19:26]

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[19:19:35]

kormoc:

or get a mac mini with nvidia hardware, which is what I have and I love it

[19:19:51]

jamiem:

kormoc: I'll try that when I have the frontends recompiled

[19:20:00]

** jamiem wonders if he should cut losses and go back to 0.23 Debian packages **

[19:20:07]

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[19:20:10]

jamiem:

kormoc: yeah; that'd be the way forward, I guess

[19:20:23]

iamlindoro:

Why would you go back to .23 packages? And Debian, the world's worst packages, at that?

[19:20:33]

** iamlindoro hopes Christian Marillat is listening **

[19:20:38]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: you're really cheering me up! :)

[19:20:38]

iamlindoro:

YOUR PACKAGES SUCK

[19:20:52]

jamiem:

fine; I'll compile 0.24 all round

[19:20:54]

iamlindoro:

Heh, not your fault they're awful

[19:21:07]

iamlindoro:

It's Christian M's fault

[19:21:23]

iamlindoro:

who uses compile options that don't exist, causing package breakage, and refuses to fix it

[19:21:35]

jamiem:

like me and --enable-vaapi

[19:22:00]

iamlindoro:

specifically, he likes to crawl into configure and use ffmpeg compile options commented out in there (since we import part of our configure from ffmpeg) which produces crashy, broken myth binaries

[19:22:06]

wagnerrp:

jamiem: not your fault, you were blindly following bad information on the wiki

[19:22:18]

iamlindoro:

We've had years-old tickets caused by broken stuff he does to his packages

[19:22:28]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: I am led to believe that ffmpeg (and other av libs) are rather broken in Debian

[19:22:43]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: We don't use system ffmpeg, we use our own internal copy

[19:22:54]

jamiem:

yes. Sounds sensible.

[19:22:55]

kormoc:

jamiem, because of horribly picked compile flags!

[19:23:10]

iamlindoro:

so their brokenness in debian isn't relevant to the issues caused by Marillat

[19:23:28]

kormoc:

./configure --enable-alpha-feature-known-to-cause-issues and then you wonder why it crashes....

[19:23:37]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, ffmpeg is debian is just as broken

[19:23:55]

CyberKnet:

./configure --cause-bug-reports && complain

[19:23:57]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: I believe it, just noting that Debian Myth package issues aren't causedby Debian ffmpeg issues

[19:24:23]

iamlindoro:

They're caused by individual obstinance and stupidity

[19:24:25]

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[19:24:54]

iamlindoro:

This weeks example was the guy for whom every BBC HD recording would cause a hard crash

[19:24:56]

jamiem:

hmm should have distcc'd

[19:25:05]

iamlindoro:

because Marillat decided to add --enable-libx264

[19:25:16]

jamiem:

hmm

[19:25:26]

jamiem:

I record BBC HD using Debian packages and seem to be okay ....

[19:25:34]

iamlindoro:

which myth doesn't use at all, but when you compile internal ffmpeg against it, causes hard segfaults on some programming

[19:25:35]

jamiem:

I just can't decode them :'(

[19:25:53]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: The crashes were during playback, and on .24 packages IIRC

[19:25:57]

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[19:26:05]

jamiem:

didn't realise there were .24 packages yet

[19:26:06]

iamlindoro:

And you sound like MArillat :P

[19:26:10]

jamiem:

fair enough: I'll avoid them!

[19:26:12]

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[19:26:17]

iamlindoro:

ie, he won't remove the wbroken options because they've never caused *him* a problem

[19:26:34]

iamlindoro:

So instead we just get to spend hours tracking down bugs that don't exist

[19:26:40]

jamiem:

so I need a new front/backend for under the TV; with similar WAF as Mac Mini

[19:26:42]

jamiem:

but I'm skint

[19:28:12]

kormoc:

a mac mini with a nvidia card?

[19:28:26]

jamiem:

kormoc: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Apple-Mini-Core-GeFor . . . /B003S9WSMI/ like this?

[19:28:45]

kormoc:

I have the 9300M mini, but should be very similar, aye

[19:29:27]

jamiem:

the 320M does okay with h.264?

[19:29:33]

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[19:29:37]

jamiem:

vdpau I take it

[19:29:43]

kormoc:

Is should do better then the 9300M does, yes

[19:30:05]

** jamiem wonders how much he can get for his old Intel Mac Mini + PPC Mac Mini **

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[19:30:34]

jamiem:

the Intel one has an SSD too

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[20:06:53]

sphery:

heh, Comedy Central (and other Viacom channels) are now blocking Google TV's use of their streaming video web content. With so many of the networks blocking the device, it may be time for a name change. Perhaps "Google (search and YouTube on your) TV"

[20:08:23]

kormoc:

rough

[20:08:36]

kormoc:

I wonder why they haven't blocked boxee

[20:09:40]

sphery:

I think it's Google's near-control of all 'net ads that's scaring the networks--not the fact that users can view the web content on their TVs

[20:10:02]

wagnerrp:

probably because boxee IDs itself as something else

[20:10:08]

wagnerrp:

technically, you can modify a GTV to pass an alternate UID, and bypass those blocks

[20:11:05]

sphery:

but the point is that the network doesn't want to support GTV

[20:11:36]

wagnerrp:

my point is they probably have no way to block boxee

[20:12:14]

sphery:

yeah, if they're sending an already-taken-by-something-supported User-Agent string, it's a much more difficult proposition to block them

[20:12:37]

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[20:15:05]

kormoc:

nah, you can do browser feature detection for fingerprinting

[20:15:55]

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[20:15:55]

kormoc:

boxee isn't a standard browser, so requiring native xpath support or similar would totally screw them for awhile

[20:16:09]

sphery:

right, thus the "more difficult proposition"

[20:16:17]

iamlindoro:

kormoc: I understood that Boxee's browser was more or less Mozilla?

[20:16:27]

wagnerrp:

theyre not pulling in webkit or xulrunner?

[20:16:44]

Gibby:

ne1 get the newegg email 2day yet?

[20:16:47]

iamlindoro:

http://www.geek.com/articles/news/boxee-ditch . . . eo-20100910/

[20:16:54]

iamlindoro:

Apparently they dump Moz for Webkit now

[20:17:09]

wagnerrp:

n0 1 d'd n0t

[20:17:26]

iamlindoro:

l0l u r l33t 4 sho

[20:17:33]

kormoc:

my understanding that they patched out the majority of DOM in gecko for their browser so they could have deeper integration hooks

[20:17:41]

sphery:

I so love how everyone says HTML5 is the future of streaming video

[20:17:46]

iamlindoro:

And now back to our regularly scheduled "speaking as though you have a fourth grade reading level"

[20:17:46]

kormoc:

but perhaps that's wrong

[20:18:09]

sphery:

I presume it's: <video drm="nolinux">...</video>

[20:20:36]

wagnerrp:

sphery: i think everyone simply wants DRM-free html5 to be the future of streaming video

[20:20:36]

stuartm:

heh, a review on Amazon of The Sopranos [HD DVD] – "Ordered Part One TWICE – both versions defect – cd's will not start so very poor quality"

[20:20:42]

sphery:

or <video drm="please-do-not-copy,pretty-please">

[20:20:56]

iamlindoro:

stuartm: heheh

[20:21:18]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I completely agree, when you defined "everyone" to mean, "excluding the networks, content owners, and content producers"

[20:21:58]

wagnerrp:

s/everyone/everyone that doesnt have a say in the matter/

[20:22:03]

sphery:

heh, yeah

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[21:05:22]

jamiem:

guess I broke something :(

[21:05:26]

jamiem:

I have audio, OSD but no video

[21:09:03]

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[21:12:14]

stuartm:

two out of three ain't bad

[21:13:51]

sphery:

will still work for the background noise many people think Live TV is good for

[21:14:23]

Gibby:

eeek, did any1 checkout the 2tb for $69 from newegg? an awful lot of 1 eggs

[21:15:17]

iamlindoro:

Cheap items are cheap, news at 11

[21:15:27]

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[21:16:52]

jamiem:

2010-11–24 21:15:03.481 VDP: Ignoring profile item 55 (renderer xv-blit is not supported w/decoder libmpeg2 (supported: null,opengl))

[21:16:53]

jamiem:

hmm

[21:16:54]

jbum:

Is gossamer-threads server down for the archived mail list? I had a question that I wanted to search through the archives before asking

[21:16:56]

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[21:17:43]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Why are you using libmpeg2?

[21:17:52]

jamiem:

I don't know :'(

[21:18:08]

jamiem:

I thought I just went with defaults

[21:18:11]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Utilities/Setup->Setup->TV Settings->Playback, page 3, swith profile to "Slim"

[21:18:15]

iamlindoro:

er switch

[21:18:18]

jamiem:

might it be picking something up from the former Debian installation?

[21:18:26]

iamlindoro:

Then hit next until you hit finish, hit finish.

[21:18:44]

jamiem:

ok

[21:19:51]

jbum:

Anyway, can you use mythtv without the use of schedules like schedules direct?

[21:19:58]

jamiem:

still just audio: 2010-11–24 21:18:50.598 AFD: Successfully opened decoder for file: "/home/mythtv/storage/default/default1/1004_20101124205400.mpg". novideo(0)

[21:20:04]

jamiem:

novideo(0) might explain it!

[21:20:04]

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[21:20:49]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: But now you're at least using a proper playback profile... but sounds like a broken recording, or a radio/audio channel

[21:21:20]

jamiem:

'video_output' mean = '39952.59', std. dev. = '7903.12', fps = '25.03'

[21:21:33]

iamlindoro:

Doesn't mean anything

[21:21:34]

jamiem:

these are recordings I know _should_ work

[21:21:59]

iamlindoro:

If you want an accurate assessment, cherry picking the logs isn't the way to get it

[21:22:15]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: sorry

[21:22:17]

iamlindoro:

It's like eating a meal a crumb at a time

[21:23:37]

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[21:23:40]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: http://pastie.org/1324036 if you're interested

[21:24:10]

iamlindoro:

what in the hell

[21:24:16]

jamiem:

:'(

[21:24:16]

iamlindoro:

what video drivers are you using?

[21:24:23]

jamiem:

um

[21:24:28]

jamiem:

where?

[21:24:31]

iamlindoro:

Whatever ones are installed are broken/wrong/bad

[21:24:35]

iamlindoro:

in linux

[21:24:37]

iamlindoro:

on your computer

[21:24:44]

jamiem:

glxgears works :'(

[21:24:53]

iamlindoro:

glxgears works in software

[21:25:10]

iamlindoro:

Whatever driver you have isntalled doesn't even support Xv

[21:25:11]

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[21:25:15]

iamlindoro:

which means it's something like VESA

[21:25:18]

jamiem:

(II) Module intel: vendor="X.Org Foundation"

[21:25:18]

jamiem:

compiled for 1.7.7, module version = 2.9.1

[21:25:18]

jamiem:

Module class: X.Org Video Driver

[21:25:22]

iamlindoro:

or... some really broken open source driver

[21:25:27]

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[21:25:37]

iamlindoro:

whatever it is, you need Xv

[21:26:05]

iamlindoro:

you can try using the gl renderer, I suppose, but the performance there is gonna STINK if the driver doesn't even support Xv

[21:26:43]

jamiem:

hmm

[21:26:59]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: when I use mplayer -vo x11 or -vo xv on a video file it plays okay in this X session

[21:27:04]

jamiem:

I think I might have compiled badly :/

[21:27:04]

jbum:

anyone?

[21:27:39]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: You would have needed to explicitly set --disable-xv

[21:27:50]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: You wouldn't do anything that batcra crazy, would you?

[21:27:53]

iamlindoro:

er batcrap

[21:28:13]

iamlindoro:

jbum: MythTV is useless without a listings source-- what's wrong with schedules direct?

[21:28:27]

jamiem:

wouldn't have thought so

[21:28:51]

iamlindoro:

I suppose in theory you could be missing some required lib to compile with Xv support

[21:29:02]

iamlindoro:

configure output will tell you if you are compiling in Xv support

[21:29:06]

jamiem:

x11 support yes

[21:29:06]

jamiem:

xrandr support yes

[21:29:06]

jamiem:

xv support no

[21:29:08]

RyeBrye:

I assume everyone who cares has already seen the 5900 RPM 2TB drives at Newegg on sale for $70 now?

[21:29:08]

jamiem:

oops.

[21:29:15]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Yeah, fix that

[21:29:17]

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[21:29:52]

jbum:

iamlindoro: I will only use mythtv as a replacement for my vcr... and used very infrequently.

[21:30:10]

jbum:

iamlindoro: so i will not really need schedule direct or anything like that

[21:30:44]

jbum:

iamlindoro: i will occasionally try to record a show based on the channel and time... i was hoping that would work in mythtv.

[21:30:51]

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[21:31:11]

sphery:

Yeah, I do the same thing. I bought a Ferrari to use as a replacement for my pickup truck, too.

[21:31:16]

** jamiem recompiles **

[21:31:49]

RyeBrye:

jbum: why even bother with mythtv? just use cron and pipes!

[21:32:06]

sphery:

RyeBrye: +1

[21:32:18]

iamlindoro:

Exactly. If you want a VCR, don't install myth

[21:32:25]

sphery:

or tvtime or vdr or whatever

[21:32:28]

iamlindoro:

myth is not well suited to just do manual recording-- there's just no point

[21:32:31]

jbum:

RyeBrye: i guess i could. it has a nice frontend that i can use for watching my video collection as well.

[21:32:43]

iamlindoro:

Use XBMC or whatever for that

[21:32:53]

RyeBrye:

or the boxee box!

[21:32:59]

jbum:

ok.. thanks for the suggestions guys.

[21:33:12]

RyeBrye:

it's got HTML5 so it has to be good

[21:33:47]

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[21:34:03]

sphery:

but the question is can you disable the 5 and just use HTML for low-spec'ed systems?

[21:34:16]

sphery:

after all, this is how software should be designed--I learned this on the -users list

[21:34:28]

sphery:

s/just use HTML/just use HTML4/

[21:34:33]

jbum:

sphery: haha... very funny. i'm new to mythtv and truly am asking for help from experience folks.

[21:34:36]

RyeBrye:

I don't know... I just hope I don't have to rebuy all my websites in HTML5 now

[21:34:40]

jbum:

sphery: didn't mean to offend anyone here

[21:34:56]

sphery:

jbum: not offended... that was an unrelated comment

[21:35:00]

RyeBrye:

MythTV is great – but it's specialty is in recording shows not recording timeslots

[21:35:48]

jbum:

sphery: no problem...

[21:36:08]

sphery:

jbum: the comparison of a VCR and MythTV to a pickup and a Ferrari, though, was for you (just to say that they're very different things for very different purposes :)

[21:36:11]

jbum:

thanks for all the suggestions. didn't know about those other alternatives but they seem more appropriate like you guys all said

[21:37:26]

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[21:37:55]

sphery:

guess I won't send my comment suggesting that actually /using/ the TV part of MythTV is another option

[21:41:10]

sphery:

Gibby: Just got my newegg e-mail 2min ago

[21:42:01]

Gibby:

sphery: i got mine 23 minutes ago, not as good as I hoped

[21:42:26]

jamiem:

iamlindoro: assuming I get this compiled properly this time – would GL rendering help with my h.264 problems?

[21:42:43]

Twiggy|Worx:

sphery, they have a crap ton of sales on it

[21:42:44]

sphery:

Gibby: guess maybe they like you better, so you're closer to the front of the list

[21:42:57]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: no

[21:43:08]

iamlindoro:

jamiem: Again, your problems are decode, not display

[21:43:12]

iamlindoro:

display is easy, decode is hard

[21:43:13]

jamiem:

ah yes

[21:43:39]

sphery:

I'm considering buying another of those Seagate 2GB HDDs to replace the 80GB HDD that died Monday. (I already have 1 of them + 2 of the older ones that had firmware issues)

[21:43:48]

kormoc:

the only help might be the deblocking filter, but I have no clue if that works with h264 from the hdpvr

[21:43:53]

sphery:

er, Seagate 2TB HDDs

[21:44:12]

jamiem:

kormoc: I'm trying to get to stage where I can try that :)

[21:44:41]

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[21:44:50]

sphery:

best way to get there may be current nvidia graphics + nvidia proprietary drivers = vdpau

[21:45:08]

kormoc:

sphery, his mac mini is a older one with intel gfx

[21:45:25]

sphery:

ah... not upgradeable video :(

[21:45:39]

Twiggy|Worx:

crap... I hate having old stuff. I upgrade to something more current and what happens. They come out with new memory.

[21:45:55]

sphery:

new memory?

[21:46:03]

kormoc:

you could also try renicing mythfrontend to -5/-10/-15 and see if that helps (if it's *close* to being right)

[21:46:54]

Twiggy|Worx:

lol new for me DDR3

[21:46:56]

Twiggy|Worx:

:)

[21:47:02]

Twiggy|Worx:

I have DDR2

[21:47:18]

sphery:

ahh

[21:47:29]

kormoc:

ddr4 started being designed in 2008 for release in 2012, so perhaps they announced ddr5?

[21:48:48]

Twiggy|Worx:

Once a new tech comes out the previously new tech stops dropping in price. Its forever frozen and the rate it was when it got replaced.

[21:49:57]

wagnerrp:

kormoc: one of the other memory manufacturers decided to design ddr5 and bypass ddr4, stealing its thunder as it were in a gross display of one-ups-manship

[21:50:06]

wagnerrp:

oh wait... that was ATI and nVIdia

[21:50:33]

kormoc:

gddr! Woo

[21:54:11]

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[21:54:47]

ekristen:

what kind of horse power do you need to record off of an HD-PVR?

[21:55:00]

wagnerrp:

ekristen: you were looking for me a couple days ago... ever get whatever it was resolved?

[21:55:08]

wagnerrp:

you need next to no horsepower to /record/

[21:55:09]

ekristen:

wagnerrp: hello

[21:55:15]

wagnerrp:

USB2.0 is about all you need

[21:55:21]

ekristen:

thats good to know

[21:55:23]

wagnerrp:

you need a /lot/ to play or commercial flag

[21:55:41]

ekristen:

a lot to commercial flag? ok

[21:56:32]

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[21:58:30]

ekristen:

wagnerrp: I was going to see what you thought was the best way to detect the backend, without trying to initialize MythDB or MythBE

[21:58:49]

ekristen:

basically want to detect the version of mythtv then load the right version of the python bindings

[21:58:54]

ekristen:

so I can support multiple versions

[21:59:09]

wagnerrp:

use the MSearch tool

[22:00:13]

ekristen:

the MSearch tool? let me google that

[22:00:38]

wagnerrp:

no, its a class in the python bindings

[22:00:47]

** ekristen goes to look **

[22:00:56]

** jamiem starts X **

[22:01:20]

wagnerrp:

you can either use it directly, to find a backend

[22:01:26]

wagnerrp:

or you can use MythXML.fromUPNP()

[22:01:33]

ekristen:

is it in all versions?

[22:02:03]

wagnerrp:

with the latter, you can then do MythXML.getSetting('DBSchemaVer') to find the version of the backend

[22:02:13]

wagnerrp:

after which you can load the appropriate bindings

[22:02:22]

wagnerrp:

however, note that the bindings overwrite previous versions

[22:02:38]

wagnerrp:

so unless you rework the setup.py install script

[22:02:45]

wagnerrp:

there will only ever be one set available to load

[22:02:58]

dustybin:

mythtvosd has stopped working :(

[22:03:16]

ekristen:

ah I am including these bindings inside an app for boxee, I don't rely on setup.py or the version on the mythbackend at all

[22:03:21]

ekristen:

I am pulling them for svn

[22:03:47]

ekristen:

right now I am looking at the 0.23.1 bindings and I am not seeing either function

[22:03:58]

wagnerrp:

yes, 0.24 and trunk only

[22:04:26]

kormoc:

bindings are tied to the backend version FYI

[22:05:00]

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[22:05:39]

ekristen:

I know they are

[22:06:07]

ekristen:

thats why I am trying to determine the backend version so I can load the the right bindings

[22:06:33]

jamiem:

hmm

[22:06:36]

wagnerrp:

also note that the bindings API is not consistent between 0.23 and 0.24

[22:06:40]

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[22:06:43]

jamiem:

kormoc: what should I be looking for?

[22:07:23]

kormoc:

a wad of money to mail to me?

[22:07:32]

ekristen:

wagnerrp: I looked at the docs, and it looks like there are only a few functions that are different yes? or was I reading the wrong docs?

[22:07:50]

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[22:07:56]

dustybin:

mythtvosd --template=alert --alert_text="Do i need to enable a setting on the frontend for this to work?"

[22:07:58]

wagnerrp:

ekristen: the functions are largely the same, but some of their behavior has been tweeked

[22:08:07]

wagnerrp:

for instance, returning an iterable instead of a list

[22:08:22]

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[22:08:30]

ekristen:

ah, gotcha

[22:08:44]

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[22:20:34]

jamiem:

why is my slave backend trying to connect to its local database when I start mythbackend?

[22:22:49]

dustybin:

mythtvosd --template=alert --alert_text="..am i right in thinking that the new MythUI is not compatible with this feature?"

[22:27:23]

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[22:28:00]

wagnerrp:

why cant you just talk like a normal person?

[22:28:06]

kormoc:

dustybin, jesus h christ

[22:28:20]

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[22:28:28]

ekristen:

lol

[22:30:58]

ekristen:

wagnerrp: you doing hd recording at all?

[22:31:05]

wagnerrp:

yes

[22:31:43]

ekristen:

how is your setup? component? hdmi?

[22:31:49]

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[22:32:05]

wagnerrp:

Rf

[22:32:47]

ekristen:

Rf?

[22:32:50]

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[22:33:02]

Gibby:

How can I figure out why in MythVideo it is not tracing down through a folder do find an image for it?

[22:35:08]

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[22:36:16]

kormoc:

Gibby, it only traces up afaik

[22:37:23]

wagnerrp:

ekristen: radio frequency, modulated digital broadcasts

[22:37:29]

ekristen:

ah, OTA?

[22:37:33]

Gibby:

hmm well 90% them are working, i have folders under folders and it finds a good clipart to use

[22:37:50]

ekristen:

wagnerrp: where you located?

[22:39:08]

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[22:46:12]

dustybin:

i have learnt something new! if you enter the ip of your backend with port 6544 it shows you lots of info on your browser! how the heck did i not know this before

[22:47:25]

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[22:49:08]

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[22:49:54]

jamiem:

kormoc: what is this deblocking filter, then?

[22:51:10]

kormoc:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/23981

[22:51:42]

iamlindoro:

Is it too late for me to kick dustybin?

[22:51:49]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, never!

[22:51:53]

iamlindoro:

I was out of the room, I can still do it, right?

[22:52:19]

kormoc:

I won't complain

[22:52:20]

jamiem:

I don't understand how h.264 decoding seems to work better when cpufreq is _on_ ?!

[22:52:46]

jamiem:

kormoc: it's a patch, is it

[22:52:53]

jamiem:

but I just finished compiling :/

[22:53:00]

kormoc:

jamiem, no, that was the changeset that added the feature. it shipped with 0.24

[22:53:13]

jamiem:

oh.

[22:53:31]

kormoc:

jamiem, I know the option exists. I don't know where. it seems absurd for me to go screen by screen though looking for it for you

[22:53:37]

jamiem:

:)

[22:53:49]

iamlindoro:

playback profiles

[22:54:53]

jamiem:

"deblocking filter"

[22:54:54]

jamiem:

I see

[22:55:17]

jamiem:

and does this work for LiveTV too?

[22:55:44]

iamlindoro:

live TV is just playback of a recording, why would it be any different?

[22:55:50]

jamiem:

of course

[22:56:46]

Gibby:

kormoc: in the wiki for MythVideo it states "myth will descend into the directory and find the first valid poster"

[22:56:56]

kormoc:

then I was wrong

[22:57:23]

iamlindoro:

MythVideo will only descend once, and only twice in certain cases

[22:57:37]

Gibby:

okk, so when does it do it twice?

[23:00:10]

iamlindoro:

When the grandparent node is the name of the show, the child node starts with "Season" and the grandchild nodes have the *exact* same metadata title as the grandparent folder name

[23:01:03]

Gibby:

ok, which i have, it goes down twice on 90% of them

[23:01:30]

iamlindoro:

It will descend twice on 100% of said cases, not 90%

[23:01:51]

iamlindoro:

There's no magic to it

[23:02:01]

Gibby:

hmm ok, how can i check the metadata title then?

[23:02:14]

iamlindoro:

by looking at the metadata displayed

[23:03:00]

Gibby:

ahhh at the top!

[23:03:02]

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[23:03:03]

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[23:04:01]

Gibby:

stupid series year is what was breaking it

[23:05:36]

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[23:06:34]

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[23:06:53]

Gibby:

I probably could have figured that out if it was in the wiki

[23:07:06]

kormoc:

so add it?

[23:08:11]

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[23:08:17]

iamlindoro:

I'll do it

[23:08:24]

iamlindoro:

otherwise I'll just end up reverting it and rewriting it anyway

[23:08:24]

jamiem:

BBC HD works much better than ITV1 HD

[23:08:25]

Gibby:

i am

[23:08:29]

Gibby:

had to confirm my email

[23:08:34]

Gibby:

ok n/m

[23:08:38]

iamlindoro:

Gibby, I maintain that page, and I wrote the code. I'll handle it.

[23:08:50]

Gibby:

ok thanks... just trying to help

[23:10:10]

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[23:14:35]

jamiem:

hmm

[23:15:28]

** jamiem admins defeat **

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[23:20:47]

Gibby:

how do you disable the fanart/clipart for when you are on a folder/file and it blows it up in the background?

[23:21:19]

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[23:22:31]

iamlindoro:

You don't

[23:23:30]

Gibby:

hmm thought i saw someone mention it a few months ago

[23:23:40]

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[23:24:03]

iamlindoro:

You didn't. Artwork displayed has always been themer controlled, not setting controlled

[23:24:17]

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[23:24:33]

Gibby:

makes sense thanks

[23:27:58]

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[23:34:06]

TM1111a:

On Mythdora 12.23, is there a way to switch to runlevel 5 without starting X? In otherwords, I would like to temporarily have runlevel 5 act like runlevel 3. I see something in the /etc/event.d directory that looks like it may control it.

[23:36:05]

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[23:37:02]

wagnerrp:

ekristen|dinner: US, using ATSC tuners

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[23:54:27]

ekristen|dinner:

ah cool

[23:54:32]

ekristen|dinner:

wagnerrp: so no cable

[23:54:36]

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