MythLogBot@irc.freenode.net :: #mythtv-users

Daily chat history

Current users (195):

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Wednesday, September 15th, 2010, 00:00 UTC
[00:00:05] elmojo: IIRC, used to just hit 'i' and then it was in the menu
[00:01:06] yatesy: w is the default to download metadata in release, unsure whether it's changed in trunk
[00:01:20] elmojo: that's not on my remote :)
[00:01:44] Beirdo: also mapped to zoom style during playback
[00:01:54] Beirdo: if it's w
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[00:05:59] elmojo: RDV_Linux, iamlindoro: do you know what happened to metadata download via the 'i' menu in MythVideo?
[00:07:43] RDV_Linux: elmojo: All downloaded metadata should work the same. I thought "w" was just a great shortcut versus going through the menu
[00:08:17] Beirdo: muuuch better
[00:12:56] Beirdo: iamlindoro: do you end up with the green bar at the bottom of previews of 1080i HDPVR as well?
[00:13:46] Beirdo: my fixola worked
[00:14:04] wagnerrp: yatesy: trunk still does an individual scrape with the 'w', but there is also a menu option to run all unprocessed content in batch manner
[00:20:54] Beirdo: mythbackend menu?!
[00:20:57] Beirdo: huh?
[00:21:06] wagnerrp: ?
[00:21:16] Beirdo: #8934
[00:22:07] wagnerrp: i like the keywords he put in there
[00:22:52] wagnerrp: mythtv-setup?
[00:24:12] Beirdo: maybe
[00:24:18] Beirdo: but he attached a backend log
[00:24:39] Beirdo: or does he mean the backend chooser in frontend the first time you set things up?
[00:24:42] Beirdo: I dunno
[00:24:57] wagnerrp: there is no backend chooser if youre using loopback
[00:28:07] sphery: someone is stepping on my changes
[00:29:31] wagnerrp: Beirdo: his previous ticket were 'closed, invalid' and 'closed, still invalid'
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[00:29:47] bwallen: Can Windows Media Center be used as a frontend?
[00:29:49] wagnerrp: bwallen: that processor will be marginal for ATSC
[00:30:04] wagnerrp: if youve got lower bitrate broadcasts, the Atom can usually handle it in software
[00:30:16] wagnerrp: but if youre running full 18–19mbps stuff, it will choke hard
[00:30:36] elmojo: heh, looks like all the menu items got their name changed from Metadata to Details -> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/24980
[00:30:43] wagnerrp: its generally not good to purposefully purchase a processor that close to the minimum
[00:30:48] Beirdo: wagnerrp: yeah, but he could come up with a gem eventually
[00:30:56] bwallen: wagnerrp: do you know if it's common that stuff is broadcast at 18–19Mbps?
[00:30:58] sphery: Beirdo: yay on #7438
[00:31:20] sphery: I'm pretty sure #8934 is the backend selection prompt
[00:31:25] wagnerrp: youll probably get stuttering as a low as 15–16mbps, which is very common
[00:31:32] sphery: at least, now it is :)
[00:31:48] Beirdo: sphery: yeah, nigel doesn't do IRC, but he does answer email :)
[00:32:01] sphery: yeah, he's very good at that
[00:32:25] wagnerrp: Beirdo: werent there recently some patches for improving MCE UPNP?
[00:32:34] wagnerrp: bwallen: XP? Vista? 7?
[00:32:40] sphery: whereas I tend to mark some of then unread thinking, "I'll get to that later," then 3 weeks later I think, "well, probably too late to reply" :)
[00:32:46] bwallen: wagnerrp: 7
[00:32:50] wagnerrp: oh, MCE, not WMP
[00:32:54] wagnerrp: dont know about MCE
[00:33:15] wagnerrp: WMP can be used as a 'upnp' frontend
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[00:33:17] sphery: if you have mythtv, why would you run mce?
[00:33:37] wagnerrp: but rather than follow mythtv's transmitted menu format, they decide to reformulate the videos on their own
[00:33:40] wagnerrp: so its all screwy
[00:33:40] sphery: seems very inefficient scheduling wise
[00:34:06] bwallen: sphery: my client wants a DVR that plays Netflix and is low power. I was thinking about a mythbackend to satisfy the DVR component and Windows Media Center for the others.
[00:34:10] wagnerrp: better would be to just use mythlink.pl/mythfs.py and access the recordings through the file system
[00:34:32] sphery: bwallen: ah, yeah, Netflix client is tough
[00:34:44] bwallen: sphery: tell me about it... fucking silverlight
[00:34:46] sphery: stupid Windows-only DRM
[00:34:47] wagnerrp: netflix can only be done on windows and osx, no linux support
[00:34:52] sphery: bwallen: language please :)
[00:34:53] wagnerrp: please watch the language
[00:36:44] sphery: I think the best bet is a real MythTV backend/frontend, and a separate Roku/Wii/XBox 360 (plus XBox Live subscription)/Playstation 3/... and a setup that automatically switches inputs on the TV when appropriate
[00:37:27] sphery: that way you'd get the best of MythTV, and can still use something that's designed for Netflix streaming when you want to sell your soul to the devils of DRM
[00:37:51] bwallen: That doesn't sound half bad
[00:37:51] sphery: either that or just go with Windows MCE only
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[00:38:30] bwallen: sphery: I might. I have to find out if he wants a whole computer sitting underneath his TV though
[00:38:43] bwallen: I don't think MCE supports frontends and backends like myth does
[00:39:00] wagnerrp: it does support media center extenders
[00:39:09] wagnerrp: but its not as capable as myth's setup
[00:39:12] sphery: wouldn't be too hard to set up LIRC to send a signal to the TV to switch inputs when you hit a remote button or a menu button (EXEC in a menu XML file) and possibly even turn on the Roku or whatever for Netflix streaming
[00:39:36] wagnerrp: or just have them buy Harmony's or something similar, and switch activities
[00:39:47] sphery: ah, yeah, smart remotes work, too
[00:39:51] bwallen: I think he's got a Harmony
[00:39:55] bwallen: those things are great
[00:39:56] ** sphery likes having the smarts in his computer **
[00:40:05] sphery: and dumb remotes with lots of buttons
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[00:47:23] achew22: Does anyone have any clue if the HDHomerun Prime or the PCI-e cable card product will be able to get the schedule information off the cable line?
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[00:49:08] wagnerrp: im going to say is not going to be worth dropping schedules direct over
[00:49:47] iamlindoro: Neither will change how schedule information will be obtained
[00:53:02] Beirdo: iamlindoro: my previews no longer have green underline (1080i H.264 only from HDPVR, BTW)
[00:53:20] Beirdo: if you have the same issue, you are welcome to play with the patch
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[00:56:58] Beirdo: oooh, reappearance of HD and HD1080i icons! woohoo
[01:01:22] Beirdo: OK, time to go home.
[01:01:41] achew22: Beirdo: do you have a working myth install at work or was this mythweb that has the icons?
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[01:15:20] darkdrgn3k: is the cover/info grabbers broekn in trunk
[01:15:38] wagnerrp: no, should be working fine
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[01:16:27] darkdrgn3k: doesnt seem to be working for me
[01:16:31] darkdrgn3k: 2010-09–14 21:16:30.017 Running Grabber: /usr/local/share/mythtv/metadata/Movie/tmdb.py -l en -M Apocalypto
[01:16:31] darkdrgn3k: 2010-09–14 21:16:31.346 No results found for Apocalypto 0 0
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[01:17:16] darkdrgn3k: it returns 30 entried though
[01:19:07] darkdrgn3k: http://pastebin.ca/1941008
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[01:22:25] darkdrgn3k: i know it was working before the 62 version bump
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[01:32:18] iamlindoro: Not only does it work here, that specific example works too
[01:32:24] iamlindoro: sounds like you have python bindings issues
[01:33:08] darkdrgn3k: iamlindoro: any idea why it would work at version 61 and stop now?
[01:33:13] iamlindoro: ie, you're running new script against old bindings
[01:33:21] darkdrgn3k: hmm
[01:33:24] darkdrgn3k: how can i correct that?
[01:33:29] iamlindoro: install current bindings
[01:33:45] iamlindoro: let's see the console output of your search
[01:33:52] iamlindoro: not myth logs, actually running the search from a console
[01:35:03] wagnerrp: whoops
[01:35:14] wagnerrp: trying to figure out why i couldnt get it working on my system
[01:35:25] wagnerrp: turns out ive got the settings pointed to an old version of the grabber
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[01:36:03] iamlindoro: wagnerrp, That shouldn't be, unless you manually manipulated them-- move and TV grabbers use new settings values in trunk (ie, they're not hooked up to the metadata settings window)
[01:36:06] wagnerrp: im trying to parse xml from a string of '1579:Apocalypto (2006)\n...'
[01:36:24] wagnerrp: iamlindoro: no, its because of my funky mythtv install
[01:36:24] iamlindoro: yes, that's what I expect darkdrgn2k3's output to look like
[01:36:30] iamlindoro: versus: http://pastebin.ca/1941014
[01:36:57] wagnerrp: my backend is in a chroot-like folder
[01:37:00] darkdrgn3k: you mean run mythfrontend from console and see what happens?
[01:37:08] wagnerrp: but i still have an old mythtv install on my main root
[01:37:20] wagnerrp: it as pulling the old script from the old install
[01:37:25] iamlindoro: darkdrgn2k3, no, I mean run the command you pastebinned from a console
[01:37:30] darkdrgn3k: oh
[01:37:36] darkdrgn3k: yeh i get a list of results.. no problem
[01:37:44] iamlindoro: No, let's see it
[01:38:07] darkdrgn3k: kilhttp://pastebin.ca/1941016
[01:38:16] darkdrgn3k: http://pastebin.ca/1941016
[01:39:22] iamlindoro: wrong
[01:39:26] darkdrgn3k: ?
[01:39:31] iamlindoro: so, as previously mentioned, old bindings
[01:39:43] iamlindoro: you messed up your last update and didn't install up to date bindings
[01:39:48] iamlindoro: See my pastebin, comapre to yours
[01:40:10] darkdrgn3k: oo hml :-P
[01:40:15] darkdrgn3k: xml
[01:40:15] iamlindoro: not HTML
[01:40:21] iamlindoro: yes
[01:40:33] darkdrgn3k: hmm wonder why it didnt install?
[01:40:39] darkdrgn3k: its mythplugins right
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[01:40:55] iamlindoro: bindings, and the metadata scripts are both in core myth
[01:41:10] darkdrgn3k: hmm wonder why they didnt install
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[01:43:09] larzen1: Folks – has anyone experienced a problem where after upgrading both mythtv and mysql to latest version, mythtv cannot connect to mysql ?
[01:43:22] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: qt4?
[01:43:54] kormoc_afk is now known as kormoc
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[01:44:01] larzen1: mysql Ver 14.14 Distrib 5.1.50, for pc-linux-gnu (x86_64) using readline 5.1; Library API  : 0.22.20091023–1
[01:44:09] larzen1: QT Version  : 4.6.2
[01:44:23] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: what your previous version of myth using qt3?
[01:44:39] larzen1: you know – I am not sure?
[01:44:52] darkdrgn3k: if so you may be missing qt4's mysql components
[01:44:54] iamlindoro: that's not remotely close to the latest Myth version
[01:44:57] larzen1: i do know, however, that mythtv is the ONLY thing that uses QT on my server.
[01:45:09] larzen1: iamlindoro: i know – that's the latest in gentoo portage
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[01:45:26] larzen1: portage-stable that is =)
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[01:46:06] larzen1: so now I am wondering what's going on. I can log in as mythtv:mythtv and list the tables just fine
[01:46:20] larzen1: i also enabled old_password('mythtv') just in case that was required...
[01:46:27] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: check if oyu have QT4 mysql
[01:47:18] larzen1: so when I run mythfilldatabase AS mythtv:mythtv it asks me for db info.. but here is what it says:
[01:47:22] darkdrgn3k: i once didnt have that package.. and myth just said it cant connect :-P
[01:47:55] larzen1: 2010-09–14 19:47:28.932 Using localhost value of home | QSqlDatabase: QMYSQL3 driver not loaded | QSqlDatabase: available drivers: QSQLITE
[01:48:09] darkdrgn3k: "QMYSQL3" <- sounds like qt3
[01:48:16] wagnerrp: no, its not
[01:48:18] iamlindoro: larzen1, As darkdrgn2k3 said, that means you don't have Qt4 Mysql modules installed
[01:48:19] iamlindoro: no
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[01:49:00] larzen1: ok – so then I run the same command as root and here is what I get: QSqlDatabase: QMYSQL3 driver not loaded | QSqlDatabase: available drivers: QSQLITE QMYSQL3 QMYSQL
[01:49:23] darkdrgn3k: iamlindoro: i just a make install AGAIN after removing the tmdb.py file... it still doing the same thing
[01:49:30] darkdrgn3k: -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 28780 2010-09–12 11:56 programs/scripts/metadata/Movie/tmdb.py
[01:49:30] larzen1: the command being "mythfilldatabase"
[01:49:33] iamlindoro: darkdrgn2k3, Then you have an install issue
[01:49:45] iamlindoro: darkdrgn2k3, The script is fine, your *bindings* are not updating
[01:49:46] skd5aner: what table is recording rules stored in?
[01:49:54] iamlindoro: skd5aner, record
[01:49:57] darkdrgn3k: iamlindoro: ok i guess im not clear what bindings ARE
[01:50:12] skd5aner: iamlindoro: thanks
[01:50:15] iamlindoro: python bindings for mythtv and the metadata services
[01:50:21] larzen1: iamlindoro / darkdrgn3k : any ideas?
[01:50:37] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: install qt4 mysql
[01:51:18] kormoc: larzen1, revdep-rebuild is clean?
[01:51:26] skd5aner: Somehow one of my power search custom rules is gone, I must have deleted it accidently but have no clue hw
[01:51:28] skd5aner: how
[01:51:44] darkdrgn3k: good old ./setup.py install
[01:52:09] larzen1: kormoc: good point. Running it now.
[01:52:37] larzen1: [ 34% ] * broken /usr/lib/qt4/plugins/sqldrivers/libqsqlmysql.so (requires libmysqlclient_r.so.15)
[01:52:40] larzen1: ahhh =)
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[01:53:05] skd5aner: the rule is in my backup from a few days ago... but isn't in my database currently
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[01:53:29] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: sorry i donno gentoo too much :)
[01:54:06] skd5aner: is it possible to restore the record table from a backup or could that cause unknown consequences with only restoring that specific table?
[01:54:24] larzen1: iamlindoro: and kormoc were right. Issue with the Qt mysql driver
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[01:54:44] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: sure ignore me :-P
[01:54:56] wagnerrp: darkdrgn2k3: yeah, i had the same problem a couple days ago
[01:54:57] larzen1: darkdrgn: oh its not like that =)
[01:55:05] wagnerrp: mysql library updated beyond the qt-sql package
[01:55:17] darkdrgn3k: larzen1: haha im just toying :-P
[01:55:28] darkdrgn3k: wagnerrp: i know i know... i was just bugging him...
[01:56:05] skd5aner: eh, I just recreate it...
[01:56:54] darkdrgn3k: iamlindoro: as always you are the master of all things.. bindings fixed.. covers fixed
[02:01:54] knightr: kormoc: I seem to be having problems with MythWeb's lite template, is the problem only on my PC?
[02:03:33] kormoc: knightr, what type of problems?
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[02:04:36] knightr: I had an issue with set_channels.php that I fixed but now it doesn't seem to find the welcome screen... Did something got messed up on my install?
[02:05:04] kormoc: hrm
[02:05:40] knightr: kormoc: the settings welcome screen, not the main one...
[02:05:57] knightr: Warning at /var/www/html/mythweb/modules/settings/tmpl/lite/welcome.php, line 29:
[02:05:57] knightr: !!NoTrans: Invalid argument supplied for foreach()!!
[02:06:01] kormoc: ahh, that's likely just not written
[02:06:13] kormoc: non-default templates are hardly complete
[02:07:26] knightr: kormoc: ok.. I fixed set_channels.php though, want me to open you a ticket for it? I haven't check the problem for the welcome screen though, I thought my install was messed up...
[02:08:37] kormoc: Sure
[02:09:10] knightr: kormoc: ok, making a diff and make a ticket in a few minutes... Thanks!
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[02:13:13] kormoc: Thank you :)
[02:14:18] knightr: kormoc: I can you wondered why I used lite it's because I wanted to try a patch I made to fix some strings before the freeze... I hope I'll be able to send it to you in time and that you will have the time to commit it...
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[02:14:22] knightr: kormoc: np
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[02:17:10] [R]: the HDCP leak doesn't seem to be as monumental as the hddvd leak was
[02:18:02] wagnerrp: its not
[02:18:20] wagnerrp: at least not until they start deactivating analog outputs
[02:18:45] [R]: so i saw somethign in one of the ml posts
[02:18:51] [R]: am i to tkae it hdfury is using a stolen key?
[02:19:05] wagnerrp: currently, no
[02:19:14] [R]: someone said its using the same key as someone else
[02:19:15] wagnerrp: technically, it is a perfectly valid device
[02:19:18] [R]: that was the logical assumption
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[02:19:36] wagnerrp: its not violating any HDCP licensing rules
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[02:19:51] wagnerrp: but theres nothing saying their key could not be arbitrarily revoked
[02:20:16] wagnerrp: so it has the ability to be flashed with whatever key you wish
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[02:24:50] kormoc: wow, I fail at grammer
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[02:26:35] Beirdo: and speeling :)
[02:26:44] kormoc: Bah
[02:26:46] kormoc: I fail today
[02:27:37] Beirdo: tis OK
[02:27:44] Beirdo: we all have days like that
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[02:33:48] knightr: kormoc: Argh, my patch depends on the strings fix one... Don't apply it right now please...
[02:35:11] kormoc: kk
[02:38:40] Beirdo: heh
[02:38:54] Beirdo: Bones: "Stop, or I'll kick you in the testicles"
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[02:47:01] knightr: kormoc: r26323 broke it... I'll update it but not tonight...
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[02:50:38] Baylink: QUERY: I've learned tonight (don't ask why I didn't know it already) that BTSC television had a TAP channel, used for IFB and such, in addition to the SAP audio. Does A/52 digital television also have this, can a HDHomeRun tune it, and can MythTV cause it to do so? Or wrap both subchannels in the MPEG as alternate audio tracks and just record them?
[02:51:20] Beirdo: TAP?
[02:51:59] Baylink: Tertiary Audio Program; also called the PRO channel
[02:52:10] Beirdo: oh, and what type of capture? OTA or QAM over cable?
[02:52:50] Beirdo: actually, I'd bet the answer would be the same... if it's in the stream, I'm sure teh HDHomerun will be capturing it
[02:52:56] wagnerrp: it should record all of it, and just make it available in the TS
[02:53:26] wagnerrp: i was looking through one of my recordings last week, and there were some half dozen different streams in there
[02:53:38] Beirdo: interesting
[02:53:40] Baylink: Hmm. So if I had a homerun, and I don't yet, then Switch Audio Stream would be how I got to SAP anyway?
[02:53:47] Beirdo: what tool did ya use, wagnerrp?
[02:53:58] wagnerrp: ffmpeg
[02:53:58] Beirdo: I would think so, Baylink
[02:54:08] Beirdo: ahh, so ffmpeg -i?
[02:55:28] Baylink: Cool. Of course, playing back the main audio *and* the PRO in the stock FE will probably be troublesome.
[02:55:34] wagnerrp: video, english, spanish, some unknown data stream, two tv guide streams
[02:55:41] Baylink: Eeek.
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[02:55:59] Baylink: So if you record a program on an HDHR, do you get *all* the video streams, then?
[02:56:11] Baylink: Or does it tune the mux?
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[02:56:55] Beirdo: I think it tunes to the multiplex and then filters
[02:56:59] bobboau: is anyone alive?
[02:57:06] Baylink: Nope, we're all dead.
[02:57:09] kormoc: bobboau, no
[02:57:16] Beirdo: which is why you can do multi-recording on the same multiplex
[02:57:17] wagnerrp: im living dead
[02:57:21] wagnerrp: kormoc there is undead
[02:57:21] bobboau: cool, I need some zombies
[02:57:22] Beirdo: bobboau: we are all zombies here
[02:57:30] Baylink: So I'm gonna get the DTV subchannel I ask for and it's associated audio streams. Got it.
[02:57:32] kormoc: I'm dead on the inside
[02:57:35] ** kormoc gets all emo **
[02:57:43] ** kormoc needs to dye his hair **
[02:57:49] wagnerrp: down the street, not across the tracks
[02:57:59] ** Beirdo would have to grow his out to dye it **
[02:58:21] kormoc: Beirdo, the problem is you're so emo your hair cuts itself
[02:58:26] Baylink: One last question, Beirdo, cause you're around a lot and I'm not; anyone who wants to dive in, though: is anyone working on being able to record multiple programs on one RF channel with the same digital tuner, still?
[02:58:44] Baylink: bobboau: Come to Necronomicon 10, then.
[02:58:46] kormoc: multirec? done
[02:59:07] Beirdo: and it wokrs :)
[02:59:12] Beirdo: works rather
[02:59:43] bobboau: I have a fresh mythbuntu box sitting before me with two hvr-1600s in it, when I have one in it it seems to boot to console at least, but with two I get a bunch of errors and it reboot's it's self, I have tried both cards and either will work on it's own, one of them seems slightly diferent in that one has a FM tuner and the other does not. how I fix this?
[02:59:52] Baylink: Really. Do HDHRs know how to deal with it? Cause that sounds counter to what you were saying earlier.
[03:00:44] Beirdo: 2010-09–14 20:00:06.228 Player(1): Timed out waiting for free video buffers.
[03:00:47] Beirdo: gah
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[03:00:56] Beirdo: ummm, yah it does.
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[03:00:58] Awli: Hi all :)
[03:01:17] Beirdo: it filters out the parts of the mux that you need for the recordings
[03:01:27] Beirdo: at least that was my understanding
[03:01:39] Beirdo: but it does work (at least on mine)
[03:02:00] kormoc: Baylink, I donno about the HDHR, but generic digital tuners have it and it's called multirec
[03:02:01] Beirdo: oooh, look, it has two recording lights on right now.
[03:02:14] Baylink: Cool.
[03:02:15] Beirdo: HDHR does multirec. I've used it
[03:02:58] Beirdo: although you do need to limit how many "channels" to record so you don't overrun your network with just too much video at once
[03:03:03] Baylink: Not that I'll be doing any of that on a AthlonXP 1600 with 2 250s and a 500 that spikes to 7 starting up 4 recordings at the same time.
[03:03:08] Beirdo: virtual tuners...
[03:03:10] Baylink: It *succeeds*, mind you...
[03:03:21] Baylink: Are the HDHRs gigE?
[03:03:33] wagnerrp: no
[03:03:35] Baylink: Ok.
[03:03:43] wagnerrp: nor do they need to be
[03:03:51] Baylink: by the time I care I'll have a mobo with 2xgig, and I'll put the tuners on their own switch.
[03:03:52] wagnerrp: the most they could ever see is 78Mbps
[03:03:59] Beirdo: wagnerrp: PER tuner
[03:04:03] Baylink: Yeah.
[03:04:09] Beirdo: which > 100Mbps
[03:04:10] wagnerrp: 39Mbps per tuner
[03:04:14] Beirdo: oooh
[03:04:16] Baylink: I forgot: twistedpair isn't bussed.
[03:04:21] Beirdo: duh, right
[03:04:24] Beirdo: heheh
[03:04:34] Beirdo: I was doubly multiplying. I suck
[03:04:41] Baylink: So you can't actually get 2x1080p out of one...
[03:04:42] Baylink: ?
[03:04:50] bobboau: maybe I should just try to reinstall again...
[03:04:50] Baylink: Oh.
[03:04:51] Baylink: Nvm
[03:04:54] Baylink: I see it too.
[03:05:42] Beirdo: 78Mbps is pushing 100Mbps ethernet fairly hard though
[03:05:48] wagnerrp: no its not
[03:06:00] wagnerrp: even my ancient laptop can handle that without a sweat
[03:06:13] Beirdo: heh
[03:06:40] Beirdo: some NICs could have issues... but they suck
[03:06:55] Beirdo: but for GOD's sakes, don't try it on a hub.
[03:07:02] Baylink: It's not pushing *one* link, no...
[03:07:23] Baylink: If you tried to put tuners on a hub, though, with*out* a GigE uplink, you would have problems.
[03:07:33] Baylink: The HDHR splits RF internally, right?
[03:07:38] Beirdo: if you put anything on a hub...
[03:07:46] Beirdo: it has two inputs
[03:07:46] wagnerrp: no
[03:07:56] Baylink: Separate inputs? Hmmm.
[03:08:07] wagnerrp: yeah, so you may need an amp
[03:08:11] Baylink: Well, saves a combiner if you have antenna farms in 2 directions, I guess.
[03:08:14] Beirdo: unless your hub is full-duplex, 78Mbps will topple it :)
[03:08:17] Baylink: I have 4 tuners now; I need an amp.
[03:08:22] Beirdo: switches only, please :)
[03:08:43] Baylink: And to clarify, "hub" always means switch unless someone makes a point of it, particularly at 100 and above.
[03:08:43] wagnerrp: woo boy! iperf rates my laptop at 4.31 Gbits/sec
[03:08:49] wagnerrp: ... i think something may be broken
[03:08:57] Baylink: youc
[03:08:59] Baylink: h
[03:08:59] Beirdo: Baylink: you CAN get 100 hubs
[03:09:11] Beirdo: why anybody would, I dunno
[03:09:13] Baylink: Yeah, I've held one in my hand.
[03:09:17] Baylink: Almost burned it.
[03:09:25] Beirdo: they are good for chucking at passing cars
[03:09:28] Beirdo: I guess
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[03:10:41] Baylink: In fact, I was going to volunteer our old NT 4.5/Exchange 5.5/Seagate Elite 5.25" HDD mailserver as an anchor for the boss's boat, but I got laid off first.
[03:10:54] Baylink: remember Seagate Elites?
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[03:11:14] Baylink: I think these were 4x18GB in RAID 1
[03:11:17] Beirdo: hehe
[03:11:19] Beirdo: OMG
[03:11:25] Baylink: Maybe 4x36 in RAID 10.
[03:11:38] Baylink: It was a really old box. P2–300?
[03:11:53] Beirdo: OK, right now I'm pulling two channels (two separate tuners) from my HD Homerun OTA
[03:12:03] Baylink: Took a Core2Quad with 2G ram to run the Zimbra server I replaced it with...
[03:12:12] wagnerrp: HAHAHAHA
[03:12:14] Beirdo: 15Mbit/s is what cacti's reporting
[03:12:24] wagnerrp: i ran iperf in a terminal i had open on my laptop
[03:12:30] Baylink: Of *course* you're running Cacti at home...
[03:12:38] wagnerrp: which just happened to be ssh'd to the machine i was running as the other endpoint
[03:12:39] Beirdo: well, duh :)
[03:12:51] wagnerrp: so apparently i was measuring 4.3gbps over loopback
[03:13:00] Beirdo: 1400 pps
[03:13:14] Beirdo: oy! that's a few packets ;)
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[03:18:37] Baylink: And indeed, PPS is what separates the amateur equipment from the professional gear.
[03:18:55] Baylink: Anyone can move bytes. If you can move them 43 at a time, then you can take your hat off.
[03:18:59] wagnerrp: here we go... 93–94mbps to my laptop
[03:19:03] wagnerrp: thats much more reasonable
[03:22:03] Beirdo: heh, yeah
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[03:29:56] Awli: Can anyone offer me a gentle clue for compiling under Win XP with the win32-packer.pl? :) I'm getting stuck at compiling options.o after a warning about qatomic_windows.h ... It just goes nowhere from there... CPU activity drops to nothing again..
[03:31:26] Awli: It doesnt bomb out, its just not doing anything at all..
[03:37:58] Awli: (and doesnt seem like a normal compile pause [its on a quadcore p4]
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[03:38:44] wagnerrp: no such thing
[03:38:56] Awli: a compile delay? :)
[03:39:04] wagnerrp: a quad core P4
[03:39:40] Awli: Core 2 Quad CPU.. :)
[03:39:58] wagnerrp: that wasnt a p4 last time i checked
[03:40:17] Awli: Ok then.. :)
[03:41:52] Awli: Well, its a Core 2 Quad CPU at 2.40ghz..
[03:42:23] Awli: I just wouldnt have thought there'd be long periods of time with no CPU activity and no script movement..
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[03:45:02] kormoc: depends, if it's IO bound on a linking stage
[03:46:42] Awli: <nods> True.. :) If this is normal compile behaviour, I'll sit back and wait :)
[03:47:30] Awli: My housemate thought he was doing 'the right thing' by updating the Mythbackend.. Now its a scramble to try and build an appropriate win32 frontend.. <laughs>
[03:47:32] kormoc: I have no idea if it's normal or not, but I'd start reading over the log looking for clues
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[03:47:59] Awli: There's nothing standing out in the logs unfortunately..
[03:48:24] Awli: Its literally like its just paused...
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[03:59:25] [R]: Awli: are you in the regular command prompt? is something sele43cted?
[04:00:24] bobboau: ok, I just reinstalled mythbuntu 10.04, I didn't have any cards in the system when I did the install, it boots up fine when I have either of the two hvr-1600s in it, but if I have both it dies with a bunch or errors
[04:01:38] Awli: I've kicked off the compile with perl -w win32-packager.pl -k -r HEAD -b ... Its gone through and created the Makefile for mythtv.. right now I've got a gcc line and a flashing cursor underneath..its still running...
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[04:03:43] wagnerrp: bobboau: mythtv? or ubuntu?
[04:05:11] bobboau: ubuntu, I never get to the login screen.
[04:05:28] bobboau: I get a panic
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[04:07:41] bobboau: the last line I see is
[04:07:43] bobboau: [drm:drm_fb_helper_panic] *ERROR* panic occurred, switching back to text console
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[04:09:54] bobboau: above that a ways I see
[04:09:55] bobboau: Pid: 0, comm:swapper Tainted G M 2.6.32-24-generic #42-Ubuntu
[04:11:08] bobboau: line above that is
[04:11:10] bobboau: Kernel panic – not syncing: fatal machine check
[04:13:48] Beirdo: still not sure why wrestling crap is on SyFy
[04:13:55] [R]: Beirdo: why not!?
[04:14:04] Awli: Its pure fantasy :) :)
[04:14:13] Beirdo: it has nothing to do with SciFi
[04:14:30] Beirdo: and it already pollutes TNT and TBS
[04:14:51] Beirdo: I wanted Warehouse 13, dangit!
[04:14:56] Awli: I just want a scifi channel without Buffy (in Australia)
[04:15:01] bobboau: money is why
[04:16:26] Beirdo: should put in a preroll of -6min
[04:16:29] Beirdo: jeez
[04:17:26] bobboau: but anyway, any ideas as to what I should do to get my tuners working? is there some known problem with haveing two of the same tuner in the system? the two seem to be of slightly different version.
[04:17:38] Beirdo: no clue
[04:17:48] Awli: That looks like a resource conflict..
[04:18:14] Awli: You could try loading the modules for it manually and assigning them different resources..
[04:19:02] bobboau: how would I go about doing that?
[04:19:24] Awli: On Mythbuntu?
[04:19:30] bobboau: yeah
[04:19:53] Awli: Not sure, but the Ubuntu help channel will be able to tell you..
[04:20:14] [R]: Beirdo: it does have nothing to do with scifi... hence why the cahnenl isn't called SciFi anymore
[04:20:40] Awli: Fox8 carries the wrestling here :) I can avoid it easily :)
[04:21:19] Beirdo: heh
[04:21:51] Awli: bobboau – Under gentoo, I use udev and compile the required kernel drivers as modules... Ubuntu should have similar..
[04:22:42] Beirdo: the channel was renamed, apparently, for trademark reasons
[04:22:55] Beirdo: as they can't trademark SciFi being to generic
[04:22:57] Awli: (gives stalled compile a suspicious kick)
[04:23:52] [R]: Beirdo: thats what they want you to think
[04:23:58] Beirdo: heh
[04:24:02] Beirdo: anyways...
[04:24:05] [R]: Awli: and nothing is selected in the console?
[04:24:13] Beirdo: stupid idiotic WWE can eat me
[04:24:37] Awli: [R] – Nah, its just a msys window under dos..
[04:24:47] [R]: msys?
[04:24:58] Awli: Oh, sorry.. :)
[04:25:08] [R]: if its the regular windows command prompt window
[04:25:08] Awli: Perl window command prompt
[04:25:11] [R]: selecting something will make it pause
[04:25:18] [R]: so like i said... make sure nothing is selected
[04:25:20] Awli: Ooooh!!!!!
[04:25:24] Awli: selected like that..
[04:25:25] Awli: <laughs>
[04:25:29] Awli: No.. nothing's selected..
[04:25:33] [R]: you sure?
[04:25:35] [R]: try hitting enter
[04:25:37] [R]: or esc
[04:25:47] Awli: Sorry, I thought you meant a menu select ala gui or ncurses..
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[04:25:57] Awli: Nah, nothing selected..
[04:26:23] Awli: Hasnt twitcted in near on 30 mins..
[04:28:30] Awli: I'm pondering aborting it and adding the flag to apply patches..
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[04:53:10] Awli: rebooting.. brb!
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[05:13:24] Beirdo: time to watch Weeds
[05:15:14] Captain_Murdoch: little boxes
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[05:21:58] Baylink: Night'chall.
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[06:05:50] dlh2729: I've installed Mythtv 0.23.1 and MySQL 5.1.5 on a MacPro using an HDHomerun. I was able to find the HDhomerun, add channels and complete the configuration. However, MythtvBackend won't start. I've combed the wiki and other resources and can't find a solution that works. Has anyone run into this problem??
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[06:07:29] wagnerrp: cant help without logs
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[06:15:04] dlh2729: That is also a problem, there are no backend entries in /var/log/system.log
[06:15:43] wagnerrp: mythbackend logs to the terminal by default
[06:16:04] wagnerrp: it would only show up in a log if you called it with the '-l <file>' argument, or if you redirected it to a file manually
[06:18:07] dlh2729: OK, I have a log, it's an awful lot to post here. is there a better way?
[06:18:17] wagnerrp: see the topic
[06:18:22] wagnerrp: mythtv.pastebin.com
[06:28:21] wagnerrp: when you paste them in there, you do have to post the link in here
[06:29:52] ** Beirdo yawns **
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[07:02:23] justinh: watch out for plain language errors in the log – they catch out many a new user with their almost unbelievable stand-outishness
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[07:10:22] justinh: arghhhhhhh just kill mythcenter already guys (re the ML posts about it lately)
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[07:29:00] Beirdo: justinh: you got us new themes yet? :)
[07:29:09] Beirdo: you could call one "Baby Puke"
[07:29:10] Beirdo: :)
[07:30:55] [R]: what is "descriptive video"?
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[07:35:43] justinh: Beirdo: I'm seriously considering starting my new one from scratch
[07:36:07] justinh: then seeing how far I can go with it. Annoying that I feel so motivated & yet have so little time now
[07:38:00] justinh: saying that, I've got a couple of free days coming up & my wife is going up North to visit relatives & friends for a while to help null her cabin fever
[07:38:22] Beirdo: cool
[07:38:43] Beirdo: inspiration with no time is rather frustrating at times
[07:39:15] justinh: I dunno how she does that all day.. I get in from work feeling wide awake & not tired.. 3 hours later.. OOOF!
[07:39:49] justinh: haven't yet worked out just what it is that's so draining about seeing to a baby.. it's not as if it's physically hard work ;-)
[07:40:31] justinh: it's one of the great taboos I think.. you're not allowed to talk about the times you really don't enjoy. Screw that!
[07:40:41] Beirdo: bebe
[07:40:44] Beirdo: hehe even
[07:40:49] Beirdo: stupid fingers
[07:41:42] justinh: uploaded a video I took just before his bedtime at the weekend. my parents have been showing it off to all & sundry – apparently he's very advanced for his age. Gawd help us
[07:43:00] justinh: might very well be time to act on my plan to do something about those parental controls in mythtv ;-)
[07:48:15] Beirdo: you have a few months yet :)
[07:50:01] justinh: yeah but remember those 'rental controls are gonna be best served by multi-user fun-ness ;-)
[07:50:19] justinh: then the plot thickens somewhat
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[07:51:00] justinh: you think "hmmm, prettyu simple idea really.. just need to do X, Y & Z... ".. and realise "in about a zillion places"
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[07:53:48] Awli: Hi all :)
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[08:05:49] Beirdo: heh
[08:06:00] Beirdo: justinh: yea, it balloons quickly
[08:14:43] Beirdo: bed time for my sorry carcass
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[08:27:31] Awli: This Win32 build is doing my head in... :(
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[10:01:48] justinh: heh just read the descriptive video ML post. looks like somebody's discovered in-vision signing
[10:02:25] justinh: if only there was a setting to disable that
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[10:24:42] justinh: Boxee box to go into worldwide launch mode next month. Yawn. Why is there such a rush to deliver low quality video to people's livingrooms?
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[10:31:21] anykey__: because people don't care for quality anymore, it seems
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[10:36:57] banksy: Any suggestions on how to play an internet radio stream ( .m3u ) using mythtv?
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[10:54:49] justinh: banksy: there's currently no way to do it
[10:55:10] justinh: or rather, no way to do it directly
[10:55:36] justinh: a few people have hacked menu entries together to execute mplayer "pathto.m3u" ... meh
[10:56:57] banksy: I've been reading about various hacks (until the mythmusic patch gets accepted). I'm going to try the hacked menu idea – do you think it will work?
[10:57:14] banksy: or should I look at the mythvideo custom file type hack?
[10:57:35] justinh: what mythmusic patch? the one from way way back?
[10:57:37] banksy: I am only after 4 or 5 specific stations
[10:57:58] justinh: a few people use the menu hack approach..but it's a hack & as such I consider it nasty
[10:58:02] banksy: from Micah – http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7868
[10:59:05] justinh: ooo didn't know that was in there
[10:59:52] justinh: looks quite sane too
[10:59:56] banksy: it's been untouched for 8 months though
[10:59:59] deegan: Is anyone here using XBMC to playback live-tv from a MythTV backend? Not talking about the pythonscript but since the function went native after version 8.10.
[11:00:10] justinh: deegan: we don't support that here
[11:00:29] justinh: banksy: nah, it was updated 5 weeks ago
[11:00:41] deegan: justinh: Oh i'm just asking i'm not looking for support on it, but i am planing on using it like that. Just wondering if you have any pros and cons. :)
[11:01:09] justinh: yeah there are cons... xbmc can theoretically break your mythtv database
[11:01:26] justinh: because it lies about protocol & db schema compatibility
[11:03:00] deegan: Ok looking at it the other way around, using mythtv instead of xmbc to watch stuff i have on my fileserver is that like equal the experience of using xbmc?
[11:03:27] justinh: dunno. depends if you value UI animation over features
[11:03:47] deegan: Extra clockcycles for a wobbly window, no thanks. :)
[11:04:05] justinh: IMHO, XBMC can't hold a candle to mythtv in terms of functionality
[11:04:17] deegan: So then no. maybe i should just try it out. I dont have to setup a mythtv connection to the backend just to get the mythtv-client running right?
[11:04:27] justinh: oh yes you do
[11:04:56] justinh: I'll put it this way – if you're not gonna be recording teevees for the most part, look elsewhere
[11:05:30] justinh: if you just want a front end to watch live tv & media from your network... mythtv may not be for you right now
[11:07:06] deegan: hmm, well I'm gonna have to test it out anyway just to make sure. :)
[11:07:43] deegan: I still havent gotten my new satelite dish etc. so it's 1–2 week away before i can try it but it never hurts to be proactive. :)
[11:07:56] banksy: justinh: I think it was just reassigned. Any sites/ tips you recommend for the button hack?
[11:08:39] deegan: and for the record i'm not just jumpin into this, i have been back and forth between what the hell to use for TV, atm i have a crapy analogue signal with even worse choice of channels.
[11:09:12] justinh: well, what we tend to notice with mythtv users is that they start out watching most things live but soon come round to the 'right' way of thinking :-)
[11:09:27] justinh: why be tied to TV schedules?
[11:09:43] justinh: why ever need to see adverts? ;-)
[11:10:13] justinh: why waste precious time watching shows which go too slowly? get em over quicker with mythtv's time compression :D
[11:10:20] deegan: I know what youre saying and i too enjoy watching stuff when it suits me and thats part of the reason why i think myhtv could be the right choice.
[11:11:14] deegan: but right now i watch a lot of stuff using XBMC so you know the natural choice would be to add to XBMC rather then finding a replacement for it, but if mythtv has no problems streaming stuff from my fileserver like hd-movies etc then it's really a no brainer. :)
[11:12:00] deegan: i have been using xbmc for like 8 years by now, back when it was xbmp, so it's a habbit rather then "the new thing" i do. :)
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[11:17:40] waxhead: I miss too many shows now because I don't see the adverts for them
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[11:34:38] sgr_: waxhead:I find that too, even on channels with no adverts which for me is probably the ones I watch the most. Not sure what a solution is. Keep meaning to have a look and see if there any websites that give recommendations of new programmes based on what you say you like
[11:35:36] waxhead: I'm resisting starting a 'ritual' of getting the free weekly guide and marking out the show of interest...
[11:35:56] waxhead: but it seems if I want to catch the good shows I'm going to have give it a try...
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[11:51:54] dapper-daniel: hej!
[11:52:11] dapper-daniel: I have problems with mythtv and pulseaudio
[11:52:19] dapper-daniel: volume control doesn't work
[11:52:34] dapper-daniel: what are the right mixer settings?!
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[11:55:25] rileyp: is the 256 nvidia driver all good for mythtv and xbmc
[11:55:47] rileyp: or are there stil problems Im using 195 at the moment
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[12:12:44] justinh: dapper-daniel: the problem is pulseaudio :)
[12:12:52] justinh: get rid of PA & all will be well
[12:13:10] justinh: rid the whole world of PA & we'll all thank you :D
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[12:14:57] justinh: ok maybe not people who use bluetooth headsets but who really gives a care about them?
[12:15:27] stuartm: BT headsets don't work without PA?
[12:16:15] justinh: ok then .. people who like to switch audio configs on the fly
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[12:20:52] justinh: eeh. my friend at the BBC didn't like my comment about banning the BBC from promoting commercial websites (Facebook, Twitter et al)
[12:21:24] justinh: well.. doesn't the BBC charter forbid promoting one commercial entity over another? could've sworn it once did
[12:22:12] stuartm: yeah, BBC has moved into the advertising business, they spend as much time promoting trendy devices such as the iphone and social networking companies such as twitter as they do covering international news
[12:23:40] justinh: they can't really argue they're only covering a 'popular' device either – since further coverage actively furthers its popularity
[12:24:30] Awli: Hey all :)
[12:24:33] justinh: not that FB or twitter is actually worth any money in real terms yet.. but that isn't the point
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[12:29:00] stuartm: justinh: exactly, they should steer well clear of endorsing anything, whether it's a product, service or celebrity, they're wrong when they say that people are interested in news coverage of extra long queues outside the Apple store, people only watch what's put in front of them
[12:30:56] dapper-daniel: i'm very happy with pulseaudio
[12:31:03] justinh: the album launches they promote too... it's almost endless maybe they're gearing up for actually going commercial
[12:31:37] dapper-daniel: i can forward my music from my laptop to my mythtv pc with surround sound for example
[12:31:42] justinh: dapper-daniel: well, apart from mythtv audio not working with it very well.. and if it does work properly you'll likely be in a minority and no, it's not mythtv's fault
[12:32:02] dapper-daniel: hmm
[12:32:20] dapper-daniel: is there no way for a proper setup with pulseaudio?
[12:32:50] justinh: some headway was made in trunk recently I believe, but even that isn't guaranteed to get you good results
[12:33:03] dapper-daniel: hmm
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[12:33:14] justinh: dapper-daniel: btw you could already do that freaky forwarding stuff with JACK etc
[12:33:36] justinh: PA grabbed the limelight, somewhat prematurely IMHO
[12:33:38] dapper-daniel: (btw playing dvds doesn't work... maybe this is since i use pulse...)
[12:33:53] justinh: define 'doesn't work'
[12:33:54] stuartm: album launches, concert tours, the winners of the latest loser reality TV competitions e.g. Big Brother, X-Factor, Strictly Come Dancing, it's all junk news and/or promotion
[12:34:00] dapper-daniel: mythtv crashes
[12:34:12] justinh: when exactly ?
[12:34:14] dapper-daniel: sometimes it just doesnt want do do anything
[12:34:28] dapper-daniel: sometimes the dvd menu apears
[12:34:43] dapper-daniel: when i then want to play the film... crash
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[12:34:57] stuartm: it fills huge gaps in their 24 hour news coverage because apparently their news teams just cannot be bothered anymore
[12:34:59] dapper-daniel: that is what happend the day before yesterday
[12:35:32] dapper-daniel: tried it 2 times... always crash
[12:35:32] justinh: from your IRC nick I'm guessing you're not running mythtv 0.23 :)
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[12:35:40] dapper-daniel: ;-)
[12:35:43] dapper-daniel: well i do
[12:35:49] dapper-daniel: i use lucid
[12:36:01] dapper-daniel: put dapper fits to my name
[12:36:20] dapper-daniel: and i hope i get longtime support with my nick ;-)
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[12:39:07] justinh: blah blah blah what I usually rattle on about crashes/bugs is that they will never get fixed if people don't report them properly. Get log output, grab the debug builds of the mythtv packages or build from source & get backtraces.. create a ticket... yada yada
[12:40:14] justinh: a good place to start is to run mythfrontend from a terminal with mythfrontend -v playback -l $somefilename then look in the $somefilename file for clues, or drop the whole thing in a pastebin & let somebody here take a look
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[12:41:52] dapper-daniel: ok i will try later... i gota work now
[12:41:59] dapper-daniel: thanks anyway
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[12:43:03] Awli: Can anyone offer some help with a win32 build??I cant seem to get a sucessful compile done.. The compile is appearing to stall and go no further... Shortly after building the mythtv makefile...
[12:43:36] justinh: Awli: as always,let's see some output in a pastebin
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[12:44:14] Awli: Justinh – Well thats the thing.. There's no output, there's no logs.. Its just stalled.. Its sitting there looking like its at mid-compile..
[12:44:43] Awli: I'm after some clues for getting some information out it too :) :)
[12:44:50] Awli: out of it even..
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[12:45:51] Awli: The compile doesnt actually fail.. It just never comes back to life..
[12:46:12] justinh: weird
[12:46:55] Awli: I can take a screenshot if it'll help.. I'm pulling my hair out.. :(
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[12:47:54] justinh: dunno, never compiled anything on windows in my life! :-)
[12:48:11] Awli: Initially I thought I might've just not been patient enough, but I've left it for 30 mins and its still no different.. no CPU activity, nothing..
[12:48:14] Awli: <laughs> I wish I never had! :)
[12:49:04] Awli: My housemate updated our Mythbuntu backend breaking the compatibility with all the Win32 frontends (prebuilts)..,, Building the updated frontend is proving nearly impossible.. <laughs>
[12:49:47] justinh: hmmm. time to go find a nice big old carpet or rug, some quick drying concrete... a big knife or gun...
[12:50:10] justinh: that should stop the updates happening for a while ;-)
[12:50:36] Awli: <laughing> I've seriously considered it.. I've been trying to build it since last night... The compile environment was easy.. its killing me!!
[12:51:12] justinh: well, no output.. not much anyone here can do for you to help AFAIK
[12:51:23] Awli: I've already copped the "I thought you said this was better than media player..." from the other half.. <laughs>
[12:51:49] justinh: almost anything is better than Media Player
[12:51:59] justinh: heck, even Nero Showtime
[12:52:07] Awli: justinh – <nods> I'm after clues for how to ramp up the logging or something to try and squeeze some information out of it.. And to check I'm running the right win32-packager script :)
[12:52:31] Awli: <laughs> Doesnt help when all she gets is a "Wrong version" error and there's 90210 to watch :) :)
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[12:53:10] Awli: Then its a mission critical app and its alllllll my fault.. :)
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[12:55:28] Awli: Its stalled dead at the QTCore compile...
[12:58:50] gavinp: Well, my short recording problem was NOT my "networking application"
[12:58:55] gavinp: or at least, it reproduces without it
[12:59:15] gavinp: as well, I had a very exciting stop of media NOT in the first fifteen seconds of recording.
[12:59:40] gavinp: I'll stop by the Coop today and get an ethernet cable to replace the one connecting the HDHomeRun. Otherwise, I'm at a real loss.
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[13:06:20] banksy: Anyone here done any theming? I'm trying to add a new menu to the main menu but mythui is doing my head in
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[13:08:31] Captain_Murdoch: banksy, it's not that hard. just create a new <button> with an <action> of "MENU your_menu_file.xml"
[13:09:05] Captain_Murdoch: then create your_menu_file.xml with appropriate buttons and actions.
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[13:11:23] banksy: captain_murdoch: I'm sure it's not. I'm using 0.23.1 mythbuntu with mythcenter theme. I'm confused about which file to edit – mainmenu.xml (which one?) or mythcenter's menu-ui.xml
[13:11:48] Captain_Murdoch: mainmenu.xml for whatever menu theme you're using.
[13:11:53] justinh: doing your head in? have I seen you on the popular East End soap opera? ;-)
[13:12:24] justinh: here, have a cuppa tea
[13:12:48] Awli: <laughs> 'Doing my head in
[13:12:57] Awli: ' is the perfect description for things for though :)
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[13:13:14] banksy: it's closer to beer o clock round here, but I must stay focused! How do I determine which mainmenu.xml to edit?
[13:13:25] justinh: I disagree. start from noob with gentoo stage one. *THAT* will do your head in
[13:13:55] Awli: <laughs> (has done it)
[13:14:07] Awli: But then I started on Debian :)
[13:14:19] justinh: banksy: anyway don't you have a bridge to deface or something -rather than menu xml? ;-)
[13:14:41] banksy: deface? It's art thanks
[13:14:54] justinh: the mainmenu.xml you need to edit depends on which menu theme you use
[13:15:06] justinh: the default one is called ummm... 'default'
[13:15:28] banksy: I'm using mythcenter, but there's no mainmenu.xml in /usr/share/mythtv/themes/mythcenter/
[13:15:34] justinh: oops. 'defaultmenu'
[13:15:45] justinh: ah – see there are a few types of themes
[13:16:09] justinh: menu themes decide what goes in which of the menu screens
[13:16:28] justinh: e.g. mainmenu.xml is the main menu
[13:16:57] justinh: fwiw you'd be better putting a copy in your home directory & editing that
[13:17:00] banksy: well there you go – that's the piece of logic I was missing – not everything under /themes is equal
[13:17:17] justinh: pretty sure it's all documented now
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[13:20:34] banksy: it's making more sense now. I do wish the themes directory had menu, ui (and osd?) as the next level down though
[13:21:27] justinh: not really fussed about that. I only edited menu themes to do away with the 'watch tv' option anyway
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[13:50:20] banksy: justinh: menu is taking shape – thanks for that. Next hurdle is getting a command line that works. EXEC mplayer http://stream.m3u is hanging (although works from command line)
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[14:00:44] Awli: Banksy – Is it exec-able by the mythtv user?
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[14:03:39] banksy: Awli: yes seems to be. I think the problem is actually sound related – I switched from EXEC mplayer to EXEC vlc and vlc launches, but I can't hear the stream. Currently reading about pulseaudio or something?
[14:04:12] Awli: Ahhh.. Ok.. pulse is outside my knowledge :)
[14:04:30] gavinp: yup, i'm still getting these crazy short recordings
[14:04:33] gavinp: this is killing me!
[14:04:56] Awli: brb!
[14:05:00] banksy: Awli: and I think I use ALSA
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[14:05:50] Awli: Never used Pulse myself.. My ALSA always seems to just work thankfully :)
[14:06:16] gavinp: oh. my. god.
[14:06:18] gavinp: i foudn it.
[14:06:19] gavinp: i think.
[14:06:22] gavinp: ha-ha.
[14:06:37] gavinp: I have another backend running with some partial old schedule information that's interfering.
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[14:10:13] ** stuartm hates people calling him sunshine **
[14:10:37] CyberKnet: how about sport?
[14:11:09] banksy: Awli: getting closer – EXEC mplayer -ao alsa http://stream.m3u is giving me the sound. next problem is that it is hanging the myth interface
[14:11:42] Awli: banksy – Add a & to the command :)
[14:12:29] Awli: It might be waiting for mplayer to return after it finishes the stream..
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[14:14:28] justinh: stuartm: ouch. put that in the same bag as 'mate' from people I don't know
[14:14:47] bjd_: "bruv"
[14:14:48] bjd_: :/
[14:14:50] banksy: Awli: thanks – that's the one. If you just to & the menu.xml refuses to load, but &amp; seems to have worked. Now need to add a menu item to stop playing
[14:15:42] r0se: is mythstreamtv working with 0.23?
[14:16:54] justinh: r0se: I very much doubt it
[14:18:01] justinh: the date of the last file update on their sourceforge page was 425 days ago
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[14:18:49] Awli: Its built into mythweb anyways isnt it?
[14:19:24] justinh: don't think so
[14:19:50] Awli: well essentially anyway.. You set something to record and then watch it from the detail page...
[14:20:20] r0se: hmm I'd like to be able to stream live tv and watch it with VLC
[14:20:45] justinh: so use VLC
[14:20:52] justinh: VLC does all that
[14:21:21] r0se: can I set that up within mythtv somewhere?
[14:21:27] Awli: I just prefer a native frontend :)
[14:22:12] justinh: r0se: no
[14:22:18] gavinp: I feel pretty dumb!!!
[14:22:34] justinh: if you want to use VLC to stream $stuff, you set that up with VLC
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[14:27:43] ThisOtherGuy: hey all – does anyone know if crystalhd should work in trunk?
[14:28:02] gavinp: iamlindoro, wagnerpp?
[14:28:04] gavinp: *ping*
[14:28:18] justinh: I know there's ongoing VAAPI work..nothing crystalhd related just yet
[14:28:20] justinh: AFAIK
[14:28:39] ThisOtherGuy: justinh there's an --enable-crystalhd configure flag now
[14:28:53] justinh: search trac then, you lazy ass :-)
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[14:29:39] ThisOtherGuy: I've been following the commit logs and it seems preliminary – I was hoping for some more details (e.g. what version of the driver, etc)
[14:31:19] justinh: so you already know the answer to the question you asked
[14:31:27] justinh: it *might* work in trunk :-)
[14:31:30] justinh: YMMV
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[14:35:04] ThisOtherGuy: k
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[14:37:56] rileyp: is the 256 nvidia driver all good for mythtv and xbmc or are there still problems? I'm using 195 at the moment
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[14:42:13] wagnerrp: gavinp?
[14:42:22] gavinp: wagnerrp, problems solved
[14:42:34] gavinp: if anyone has my symptoms again: ask them if they might accidentally have another backend somewhere
[14:42:53] gavinp: upgrading my computers somehow got a backend on to my frontend machine, which had previously been fe/be.
[14:43:31] gavinp: it had a local database, and some ancient, ancient rules. it dutifully got in touch with schedules direct, and started trying to record; but it didn't have write access to its PG
[14:43:42] gavinp: and it was a slower computer, so it took 10–15 seconds longer than my new BE to try and tune
[14:43:45] gavinp: !!!
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[14:44:19] gavinp: the logs on the ghost BE show it wrecking all the records that were no good.
[14:45:38] banksy: thanks for all your help today team – most invaluable
[14:45:45] CyberKnet: mostly
[14:46:06] CyberKnet: some of us you could value fairly easily... at quite the low end.
[14:46:51] CyberKnet: So who saw the new Zotac ZBOX HD-ID34? Anyone want to collaboratively drool about it?
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[14:47:58] CyberKnet: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856173007
[14:48:50] CyberKnet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24jEyaGYNzw
[14:49:07] CyberKnet: That's a bit more plasma than I have to sell though.
[14:51:16] jams: nice looking
[14:51:17] wagnerrp: its got no power
[14:52:15] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: on account of it being ATOM?
[14:52:21] wagnerrp: uh huh
[14:52:47] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: It apparently decodes and displays bluray 1080p in windows without issue via PureVideo. I was rather hoping VDPAU would oblige.
[14:53:00] wagnerrp: VDPAU will
[14:53:45] CyberKnet: What do I want power for then?
[14:54:19] wagnerrp: the ability to not have to make huge sacrifices
[14:54:48] wagnerrp: were right back at the old VIA systems
[14:55:00] wagnerrp: people touted them as the perfect thing years ago
[14:55:04] wagnerrp: and look where that got them
[14:55:20] CyberKnet: typical.
[14:55:46] CyberKnet: fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion.
[14:56:10] wagnerrp: hardware decoding is a crutch
[14:56:14] wagnerrp: its great to use if available
[14:56:23] wagnerrp: its better to not have to use it
[14:56:31] wagnerrp: to have the choice
[14:57:26] CyberKnet: I agree – VDPAU was horrible when I tried it last night on a freshly built system. I figure that I have something not set up right, but I'm glad that I had the option to go back to CPU+.
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[14:57:51] wagnerrp: chances are you didnt have something set up right
[14:57:57] CyberKnet: very likely.
[14:58:08] wagnerrp: for now, it works great for most recordings mythtv makes (framegrabbers not included)
[14:58:23] CyberKnet: Yes, my recordings are from a PVR-500 and a HVR-2250.
[14:58:24] gavinp: I have had great luck with vdpau on my asrock ion frontend.
[14:58:42] gavinp: downloaded video from the web? it's less good at that, and sometimes stumbles.
[14:58:59] CyberKnet: Yeah, my myth box doesn't even have ripped DVD content on it.
[14:59:08] wagnerrp: flash is currently all CPU, no VDPAU help there
[14:59:08] CyberKnet: just recordings that MythTV makes.
[14:59:31] wagnerrp: assuming thats what you mean by web video
[14:59:40] gavinp: no, it wasn't.
[14:59:46] gavinp: i meant downloaded video files
[14:59:50] gavinp: placed in my video directory
[15:00:02] gavinp: sometimes they have formatting errors etc.. that make them not play great in vdpau. *shrug*
[15:00:28] CyberKnet: Some time I'll look into getting VDPAU working nicely. I'd really like the CPU offload.
[15:01:09] wagnerrp: gavinp: discussion of such topics is not permitted in here
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[15:01:21] gavinp: wagnerrp, err, sorry.
[15:01:25] wagnerrp: and its very easy to encode something in h264 that VDPAU will outright barf on
[15:01:33] gavinp: yeah, and that's presumably what's happening
[15:01:58] wagnerrp: set the wrong level, use too many reference frames, use a funky b-frame structure, or unsupported macroblock sizing, or...
[15:02:19] wagnerrp: VDPAU does its best, and that best is pretty good
[15:02:27] wagnerrp: but its a hardware decoder, static
[15:02:36] wagnerrp: it will never do anything more or less than it currently does
[15:02:41] gavinp: so i think we're in some weird kind of violent agreement.
[15:02:59] wagnerrp: so for the life of that machine, youre saying 'this is all i ever want to do with this machine'
[15:03:13] iamlindoro: ThisOtherGuy: CrystalHD should be functional, albeit with some bugs
[15:03:14] wagnerrp: no adaptability
[15:03:23] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: I do not think anyone is disagreeing with you there.
[15:03:23] wagnerrp: because you have no CPU muscle behind it to support it
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[15:04:03] skd5aner: well, my mbe has been up for 18 now with my backup PSU – so I'm chalking up the crashing to the PSU, which is fairly good news :)
[15:04:11] skd5aner: s/18/18 hours
[15:04:38] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: At some level though, you do that with every machine you buy. Because even the AM2+ micro-atx motherboard in my front end right now has a limit to its fsb, and what freq processor I can buy for it since it is so old. The difference here is that the freq is a known quantity at the outset, versus waiting until socket EOL.
[15:05:49] wagnerrp: the difference is you have an infinitely adaptable CPU, which can be made to do whatever you want assuming you have enough FLOPS/IOPS for the task
[15:06:11] wagnerrp: VDPAU can only be made to do what was baked into it at the FAB two years ago
[15:06:40] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: Correct. You're buying a known quantity.
[15:06:44] CyberKnet: well, you aren't
[15:06:52] CyberKnet: but someone buying that machine would be.
[15:06:59] Beirdo: wagnerrp: not necessarily... they could extend it with Cuda if tehy wanted :) but they won't
[15:07:16] wagnerrp: Beirdo: technically they did once already
[15:07:29] Beirdo: heh
[15:07:54] wagnerrp: everyone using 'feature set A' implements the HDDVD entropy decompressor in CUDA, or maybe they just do it on the CPU
[15:08:02] wagnerrp: either way, its handled transparently by the driver
[15:08:09] wagnerrp: rather than directly in the video decoder
[15:08:13] Beirdo: right. it is technically extendible, and those GPUs are more powerful than a CPU for some tacks.. BUT that doesn't mean it will ever be coded
[15:08:37] Beirdo: tasks
[15:08:56] Beirdo: stupid fingers... I'm turning into a moron in m typing, I tell ya
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[15:10:06] gavinp: It's interesting seeing how web browsers are starting to use the GPU
[15:10:12] gavinp: for composing, and in some cases, rendering
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[15:10:19] gavinp: (esp of the html5 <canvas> element)
[15:10:39] CyberKnet: anyways. shame they couldn't put a core2 processor in there at least. but I still think it is an interesting option. Doesn't really matter though – couldn't afford it if I wanted it anyway.
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[15:11:36] wagnerrp: CyberKnet: they can, its called a mac mini
[15:11:54] wagnerrp: uses laptop guts
[15:12:09] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: Negative. There is no bluray drive in a mac mini.
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[15:12:34] CyberKnet: Yes, I know there's no bluray support in myth.
[15:12:39] wagnerrp: however with a bit of planning, you can get a system with desktop parts with maybe double the base power consumption
[15:12:46] wagnerrp: meaning ~30W instead of 15E
[15:12:47] iamlindoro: There's plenty of Blu-ray support in Myth
[15:12:48] wagnerrp: W
[15:12:52] gavinp: cyberknet, sure, but you could use a macos frontend, and put a bluray player in the menu
[15:13:00] gavinp: iamlindoro, oh?
[15:13:02] CyberKnet: iamlindoro: corrected.
[15:13:09] wagnerrp: yep, added a couple months ago
[15:13:13] ** iamlindoro spent this entire release cycle writing it, so I should hope so **
[15:13:18] gavinp: neat!
[15:13:20] CyberKnet: iamlindoro: thanks ;)
[15:13:34] wagnerrp: works with anything libbluray can decrypt
[15:13:43] wagnerrp: which currently limits you to AACS-only content
[15:13:47] iamlindoro: It's not completely full featured yet, but it's pretty darn good for what it is
[15:14:25] gavinp: Does it handle AACS or BD+ at all, or is an external player still a good bet for that?
[15:14:28] iamlindoro: But chapter handling, multi-angle, decryption of AACS titles, playing off the disc, multiple title navigation, multi-language and subtitle, playing BDMV structures in Mythvideo, etc., all work
[15:14:59] iamlindoro: It handles AACS if you have libaacs installed and properly configured, and have keys for your titles in the key db
[15:15:12] iamlindoro: and will handle BD+ when libbdplus is made public
[15:16:02] gavinp: thanks! i may well buy myself a bluray player now.
[15:16:10] wagnerrp: ROM?
[15:16:26] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: ?
[15:16:27] wagnerrp: those drives you stick in your computer? those arent bluray players
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[15:17:22] gavinp: I meant to say: "I will investigate the purchase an apparatus which may be installed in my computing contraption for the purpose of using iamlindoro's abovedescribed new myth features."
[15:17:24] Jog: I have not yet figured out how to compile libaacs. Theres no help file or guidelinies. Does anyone know how to compile it?
[15:17:39] CyberKnet: gavinp: lol :)
[15:18:01] wagnerrp: its not like the old CD-Rom that were actually players
[15:18:14] iamlindoro: Jog: We can't really provide you with help with that in here, since legality depends greatly on locale
[15:18:17] wagnerrp: you couldnt plug into the headphone jacks and hit the play button
[15:18:24] gavinp: wagnerpp is right; I used a wrong word.
[15:18:26] iamlindoro: Jog: But it compiles fine
[15:18:34] gavinp: Write down the date, everyone.
[15:18:45] Jog: iamlindoro: I like the bluray section. Very nice :-) but it takes awhile to start the first time (at least on my rig).
[15:19:06] iamlindoro: Jog: I assume since you are running trunk that you are closely following commits
[15:19:26] gavinp: anyway, and with that, i'm wandering off. thank you everyone for putting up with my whining over the past few days about my truncated video problems, and especial thanks to wagnerpp and iamlindoro for your help.
[15:19:31] iamlindoro: Jog: in which case you should already know that there are reasons that BDMV-via-SG is very slow, and that we are working on optimizing it
[15:19:32] Jog: iamlindoro: Ok :-) it's just that usually theres at least a text file that tells you which compiler/tools to use
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[15:21:23] Jog: iamlindoro: Hehe, if I see it the patch, I probably don't understand what's been said
[15:22:46] Jog: iamlindoro: it's only slow the first time. Playing another file start almost right away.
[15:23:22] wagnerrp: Jog: its issues with trying to handling caching on multiple files, and tuning it for read patterns of the playback libraries
[15:24:44] wagnerrp: simonckenyon: for future reference, if you want something deleted, blank the page and add '{{ready for deletion}}'
[15:25:00] Jog: Even if it can't be optimized anymore I would like to thank you for the work you've already done :-)
[15:25:11] simonckenyon: ok – sorry about the mess
[15:25:21] wagnerrp: no worries
[15:25:44] simonckenyon: the wiki could sure do with some love
[15:26:04] wagnerrp: check the changelog, ive been trying... :)
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[15:27:38] simonckenyon: so you have!
[15:27:42] wagnerrp: what is this page for? http://mythtv.org/wiki/Dutch_translation
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[15:29:55] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: It appears to be for a dutch translation.
[15:29:57] skd5aner: wagnerrp: it says right at the top of the page :P
[15:29:58] skd5aner: ;)
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[15:30:57] wagnerrp: but... its just a page to hold a single command?
[15:31:18] wagnerrp: the big diff they use to make the translation patch?
[15:31:19] CyberKnet: don't make me go captain obvious on you...
[15:31:21] CyberKnet: :P
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[15:38:31] kenni: wagnerrp: The page is linked from http://mythtv.org/wiki/Translation – put in there by the Dutch translators
[15:39:11] wagnerrp: kenni: right, but it only exists to store that command for later use?
[15:39:23] kenni: wagnerrp, no idea :)
[15:40:05] kenni: the command is new, AKAIR
[15:40:20] iamlindoro: AKAIR?
[15:40:31] kenni: yep, it is...8th and 15th of September
[15:40:49] iamlindoro: Don't think we need a page just to tell people to run svn diff, though
[15:41:05] iamlindoro: Plus, the command is just plain wrong, too
[15:41:29] kenni: i think it was meant to be a list of common translations
[15:41:47] kenni: but they only added one word
[15:41:54] iamlindoro: That would be more topical, I think
[15:43:03] kenni: iamlindoro: I might be missing something, but why is the command plain wrong?
[15:43:55] iamlindoro: kenni: Because it specifies a small subset of plugins/files rather than diffing the whole tree-- when the user (or another translator) adds new translations, it will be immediately out of date
[15:45:19] kenni: if he did a diff on the whole tree, he would get all .ts files included in the diff
[15:45:32] iamlindoro: all nodified ts files, yes
[15:45:34] iamlindoro: er modified
[15:45:39] iamlindoro: and that would be what he would want
[15:45:47] iamlindoro: since he's only translating one language
[15:45:56] kenni: ?
[15:46:00] iamlindoro: ?
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[15:46:26] kenni: all ts files (for all languages) will be modified, since they get updated automatically when running lupdate
[15:46:41] iamlindoro: kenni: translators should not be running lupdate
[15:46:51] iamlindoro: *we* should be, regularly
[15:47:23] kenni: no, but they are ATM
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[15:47:32] iamlindoro: kenni: And that is wrong
[15:47:44] wagnerrp: you dont need to run lupdate to the new files into the compiled version for testing?
[15:48:05] iamlindoro: kenni: The command line is also wrong because what happens when someone translates mythnetvision? It's immediately out of date
[15:48:19] iamlindoro: that is, the command line is
[15:48:39] iamlindoro: You cannot put such a specific svn diff command into instructions like that-- it will be wrong more often than it is right
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[15:50:23] kenni: if we run lupdate, lets say monthly, then we'll constantly have problems with translators with merging problems
[15:51:04] iamlindoro: kenni: I don't care how they do it-- the svn diff command is all I'm concerned with, and it's wrong
[15:51:25] iamlindoro: because it gives the impression that you can simple vut and paste it and upload the resulting diff file, and you can't
[15:51:28] iamlindoro: er cut
[15:52:09] iamlindoro: because it misses a chunk of the plugins that can and should get translated, and misses any future added plugins, etc.
[15:52:31] iamlindoro: It just plain does not need to be there. Link to a man page for svn diff if one must, but listing a static set of files is *wrong*
[15:52:45] iamlindoro: especially when it's not even all the plugins that exist *now*
[15:52:50] ThisOtherGuy: iamlindoro: do you know what version of the crystalhd driver I should use? I get a weird overlay when I try to use the crystalhd decoder
[15:53:09] iamlindoro: ThisOtherGuy: no, I don't use it-- just know that multiple people have been using it with success
[15:53:30] kenni: I'm absolutely not blessing having such a specific command in there, but I really can't see any alternative which will be better than this
[15:53:48] iamlindoro: kenni: link to an svn diff tutorial
[15:54:40] ThisOtherGuy: iamlindoro: do you know anyone I could ping about it?
[15:55:11] iamlindoro: ThisOtherGuy: you could try asking jarod, or posting to the dev list
[15:55:17] iamlindoro: the latter being the more polite approach
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[15:56:48] iamlindoro: kenni: Alternately, could do "svn diff|grep Index|grep _ts" to get a list of files, and svn diff those, if you really want to get that specific with them-- but if they can't figure out how to diff specific files, the whole process is likely above their heads
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[15:58:27] kenni: iamlindoro: ahh, so you're not against using svn diff against specific files, only against having a complete command including all the specific files, since this will get out of date in no time?
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[15:58:40] iamlindoro: kenni: as repeatedly said, yes ;)
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[15:59:07] kenni: ok, sorry if I was too slow ;)
[15:59:17] iamlindoro: Of course they should use svn diff- they just shouldn't list a command that everyone will copy and paste that will be wrong more often than right
[15:59:29] kenni: sure
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[16:01:58] wagnerrp: why would the frontend crash because the filesystem is full?
[16:02:09] ** iamlindoro wonders where all the israeli users who were bugging us about UTF-8 database issues went, and why none of them have ever done a translation **
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[16:05:13] CyberKnet: hmm... I bet my vdpau issues could have been caused by the bios only allocating 128mb to video memory
[16:05:34] wagnerrp: mythtv struggles on as low as 256MB
[16:05:37] AndyCap: iamlindoro: because broken utf-8 in descriptions suck while native translation of a ui isn't always an improvement? :P
[16:05:38] wagnerrp: 512MB is preferred
[16:05:56] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: I was just reading the wiki to see what might be the problem and came across that information, yeah.
[16:06:38] iamlindoro: AndyCap: Can't see why one wouldn't prefer to use a program in their native language (and there was nothing wrong with the descriptions, they were broken/unupgraded databases)
[16:06:44] wagnerrp: note that some boards require 2GB installed for you to give 512MB to the video card
[16:06:56] iamlindoro: I particularly wouldn't want to use a UI in on LTR language with descriptions in a RTL one
[16:07:15] iamlindoro: Would make my head hurt, but hey, I don't care if they want migraines
[16:07:25] CyberKnet: wagnerrp: that's an awesome tip, thanks.
[16:07:39] wagnerrp: iamlindoro: it lets them read in a zig-zag pattern
[16:07:41] wagnerrp: more efficient
[16:07:46] wagnerrp: :)
[16:07:47] CyberKnet: I was just trying to remember how much ram is in that machine. I think it's 2G.
[16:07:48] iamlindoro: heh
[16:07:51] AndyCap: ah, right, they write the other way.
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[16:08:44] kenni: iamlindoro: I've seriously been thinking a lot about how to handle the whole lupdate and lrelease thing in an optimal way...I think it would be nice to keep the ts files at least somewhat up to date, minimizing the risk of conflicting patches as well as making the patches easier to review. But on the other hand, every time we update the ts files in SVN, we can cause serious issues for the translators with no developer skills. Completely taking
[16:08:49] AndyCap: but when a ui is designed for "TV" "Fjernsyn" doesn't look quite as good in the same space. :P
[16:08:58] iamlindoro: kenni: optimally, it would just be done as part of the build process
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[16:09:12] iamlindoro: kenni: We've discussed it, and it's even been agreed upon... just that nobody has done the work
[16:09:29] iamlindoro: kenni: If you were interested, though, you could revive the discussion and probably succeed in getting it done
[16:09:50] kenni: do you have a pointer (eg. approx date)
[16:10:01] iamlindoro: kenni: It was in #mythtv, which is not logged, so no
[16:10:08] kenni: ok
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[16:11:10] iamlindoro: kenni: If I recall correctly at least stuartm, me, janne, sphery, and reynaldo more or less agreed upon it as an approach, with most people not caring one way or another
[16:11:16] CyberKnet: whoa. My myth box is actually getting into swap :|
[16:11:17] wagnerrp: iamlindoro: per the ML discussion, i could add that into the post-commit hook
[16:11:19] iamlindoro: Think it was reynaldo who suggested we do so
[16:11:52] wagnerrp: add another keyword that pulls the repository, runs the command, and commits the subsequent changes
[16:12:01] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: Would that have some advantage over simply doing it as part of the build process?
[16:12:23] wagnerrp: probably not, just fishing for ideas to do with it
[16:13:14] kenni: iamlindoro: ok, right now (for the 0.24 release), on the lrelease part, I think knightr and I will commit the relevant qm files each time we update a translation. In addition to this, we'll be generating all (eg. the non-updated ones) prior to the release of RC1, RC2 and the final release
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[16:13:20] iamlindoro: I've seen a fair number of projects do it in their build, so we would at least be treading well work ground-- but if there's a reason to do it in trac... *shrug*...I don't have a dog in the fight
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[16:13:35] iamlindoro: er well worn
[16:13:53] iamlindoro: kenni: Yes, for .24 at least we are stuck with our normal approach
[16:14:10] jannau: iamlindoro: Nigel said that lupdate/lrelease are not included in the precompiled mac os x (or windows) qt packages
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[16:14:38] iamlindoro: jannau: That's false at least for windows
[16:14:45] iamlindoro: all included there
[16:14:51] iamlindoro: Might be true for OS X, I dunno
[16:15:00] jannau: otherwise I would have added it to the build
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[16:16:39] iamlindoro: Still, if it's not available for OS X, the question is is it worth dealing with the ongoing pain versus the momentary pain for modifying the build script to also get/build those tools
[16:16:49] kenni: can't we just add the relevant QT package as a dependency on the Mac build? Or doesn't it exist in a precompiled form at all :)
[16:23:39] iamlindoro: jannau: on OS X we are downloading qt-everywhere-opensource-src-4.6.0, which includes (and builds) lrelease and lupdate
[16:23:54] iamlindoro: .osx-packager/src/qt-everywhere-opensource-src-4.6.0/tools/linguist
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[16:24:16] iamlindoro: I was also using linguist on Windows the other day, installed via the build script
[16:24:40] iamlindoro: Would likely require some adjustment to both build scripts, but the tools are there
[16:25:38] kenni: btw, the string freeze...are we are pushing it, or? stuartm said he could use some more time for the theme stuff
[16:25:51] kenni: otherwise, it's today
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[16:26:17] iamlindoro: kenni: We're not used to having a firm string freeze-- don't think there is any concrete agreement on pushing it off (nor has any agreement been sought)
[16:26:24] iamlindoro: so I personally would consider it to be today
[16:28:09] kenni: ok, should probably check with him before updating themestrings, etc
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[16:45:47] Gibby: i might be missing he it, but i don't see if i select play folder for videos, how do i skip to next file?
[16:48:24] wagnerrp: hit escape
[16:48:34] wagnerrp: or stop
[16:48:41] wagnerrp: something to exit playback of the current video
[16:49:47] Gibby: ahh ok let me try that
[16:49:56] Gibby: but then how do i exit all the way?
[16:50:16] Gibby: ahh ok let me try that
[16:50:30] wagnerrp: exit a second time, within a few seconds of the second file starting
[16:50:48] Gibby: hmm ok, tried that, keeps going to the next video, i have about 20 or so
[16:51:17] wagnerrp: i thought that patch got committed, maybe not
[16:51:30] wagnerrp: mythvideo will get proper playlist sometime before 0.25
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[16:58:26] Gibby: when did that patch get committed? i might not be at the latest, within a week or so though
[16:59:07] Gibby: when did that patch get committed? i might not be at the latest, within a week or so though
[16:59:09] wagnerrp: i thought before 0.23
[16:59:35] stuartm: wagnerrp: shame no-one copy/pasted the existing playlist stuff from watch recordings :(
[16:59:37] Gibby: oh ok
[17:00:13] wagnerrp: stuartm: thats basically going to happen automatically shortly after 0.25 development starts
[17:00:27] wagnerrp: part of the whole videofile rework
[17:00:49] stuartm: wagnerrp: I'd rather see proper, gapless playback for 0.25, i.e. treat playlists just like the livetv chain
[17:01:11] kenni: stuartm: any updates on the string freeze? Will you be able to get your things done in time for the freeze, or what do we do?
[17:01:14] stuartm: in fact you'd just re-use/re-task the livetv chain
[17:02:15] stuartm: kenni: not a hope that I'll get it don't before then, but I wouldn't hold up the translations, if a few strings get translated at the last minute or go untranslated it won't be the end of the world
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[17:07:44] kenni: stuartm: ok, let's see how it goes...it would however be nice not to have any untranslated strings, as the statistics at http://www.insidethex.co.uk/mythtv/translation-status/trunk/ (a motivation factor for the translators :) ), turns yellow if you're missing even a single string. Most active languages aims for the green block
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[17:09:32] stuartm: anything missed in the initial release will definitely be in -fixes and the first point release
[17:10:25] Jog: <- wonders what language the last 1% is for EN (GB) in that link :-)
[17:10:44] Jog: 2% for 26295
[17:11:07] stuartm: dunno, I updated the translation just a couple of days ago, at that time there were no untranslated strings
[17:12:32] kenni: strings move fast in trunk
[17:12:40] Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v xris
[17:12:45] kenni: moves
[17:13:01] stuartm: kenni: you were right the first time
[17:13:12] kenni: ohh
[17:13:20] kenni: :-P
[17:13:41] kenni: glad I'm not doing the GB translation, then
[17:13:59] kenni: or US
[17:14:11] stuartm: He moves. They move. The car moves. The cars move.
[17:14:34] wagnerrp: caur
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[17:17:05] kenni: stuartm: you committed the GB updates in 26315, the statistics were last updated at 26295
[17:17:42] wagnerrp: so.. some county sheriffs dept in some po-dunk town halfway between LA and SF has decided to take it upon themselves to stop pedobear
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[17:22:03] iamlindoro: Heh, SLO isn't exactly po-dunk
[17:22:22] Beirdo: heh
[17:22:23] iamlindoro: Big college town-- and I'm pretty sure they got the joke
[17:22:37] wagnerrp: ok, ill go with college town
[17:22:52] wagnerrp: not sure if i would consider it big
[17:22:57] wagnerrp: only 44k peopel
[17:23:48] Beirdo: but does that include the students? :)
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[17:24:04] wagnerrp: doesnt say, that was the census
[17:24:56] Beirdo: never did make it that far... I stayed mostly in SB when I was in the general area
[17:25:01] wagnerrp: seems the town has a history of bear playing with children... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MissionBear . . . Panorama.jpg
[17:25:12] wagnerrp: *bears
[17:26:23] Beirdo: hmmm, crap
[17:26:44] Beirdo: Amazon has SOME of the parts, but not the case, and not the new version of the mobo
[17:27:03] Beirdo: they have -A-E. newegg has -C-E which has USB3
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[17:29:15] Beirdo: Well, let's see how far over Newegg wants to bend me for shipping
[17:29:50] wagnerrp: oh for the old days, when just about everything on newegg was free fedex airmail
[17:30:06] Beirdo: heh
[17:30:08] Beirdo: yeah.
[17:30:24] Beirdo: UPS Guaranteed 3 Day on the case and mobo only... $17.32
[17:30:59] Beirdo: UPS 2nd Day (which is what I get with Amazon Prime pretty much)... $40.71
[17:31:06] Beirdo: screw THAT
[17:31:08] Beirdo: ;)
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[17:34:34] Beirdo: wonder if someone has made a table comparing the -a-e and -c-e models
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[17:34:42] Beirdo: if it's only USB3, meh
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[17:36:14] Gibby: sweet, got a usb ir blaster into, going to figure it out now... using it hopefully with a directv STB
[17:36:43] Beirdo: This new unit is a refresh of the H55ITX-A-E, and the primary additions here are support for Intel Core i7–800 processors and a revised power delivery system that features passive heatsinks.
[17:36:48] Beirdo: boooo
[17:37:13] Beirdo: OK, I want the -C-E. My planned processor is i7–800 series
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[17:37:47] Gibby: *meant just got it in the mail, to many IM's going on
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[17:44:36] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: I think there may be a legit problem with bindings install-- mine doesn't complain either and I had to update with setup.py install a day or so ago, and another report of same last night, and now another on the mailing list
[17:44:43] iamlindoro: perhaps Makefile changes?
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[17:44:47] wagnerrp: yeah, looking at it now
[17:45:02] wagnerrp: i saw sphery's response, but not the original email
[17:45:12] peitolm: when transcoding, I have the profile set to automatic, it's chosed 'MPEG2', but how do I find out which it's using, i'm after a lossless transcode, but with just the commercials cut out.
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[17:48:47] sphery: iamlindoro: yeah, I think the Perl one could be the switch from installing to where Perl says is right to installing to where --prefix shows
[17:48:56] sphery: no idea about Python bindings, though
[17:49:19] sphery: (so, for Perl, the guy now has 2 copies--likely the old one at /usr and the new one at /usr/local)
[17:49:47] wagnerrp: sphery: even if you define a prefix, the python bindings will still decide where within that prefix is the proper location, and make the folders as necessary
[17:50:01] Gibby: ok i am following this http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Using_an_IR_Blaster_with_MythTV it "nstructions in the HOWTO links show you how to make a channel change script" I searched the them and don't see any
[17:50:05] wagnerrp: but if he does use --prefix
[17:50:07] sphery: wagnerrp: so the python bindings /are/ installed to prefix?
[17:50:16] sphery: as opposed to Python deciding where to install them?
[17:50:17] wagnerrp: hes going to have to know specifically what hes doing
[17:50:30] wagnerrp: and how to inform python that he actually wants to use the stuff at that prefix
[17:50:56] sphery: you're talking about --prefix, which defaults to /usr/local , right?
[17:51:04] sphery: not some python-specific configure argument?
[17:51:19] wagnerrp: --prefix gets passed to the python package installer
[17:51:21] Beirdo: well, if I buy all of this stuff from newegg, shipping is $19.25 for 3-day
[17:51:25] wagnerrp: and the installer does as it wants with it
[17:51:35] wagnerrp: so its still python placing it where it wants
[17:51:36] Beirdo: which translates to... Monday?
[17:51:42] wagnerrp: its just now doing it within the given prefix
[17:51:56] sphery: I didn't remember mine going to /usr/local
[17:52:25] sphery: where in general do python modules go?
[17:52:44] sphery: like perl is PREFIX/lib/perl5/...
[17:53:43] wagnerrp: from distutils.sysconfig import get_python_lib; get_python_lib(prefix=<whatever>)
[17:54:18] wagnerrp: usually $PREFIX/lib/python<major>.<minor>/site-packages/
[17:54:47] wagnerrp: theres some funkiness with ubuntu, and i think maybe all debian stuff, that it gets put in dist-packages
[17:55:31] peitolm: hmm, does anyone know how to stop jobqueue from killing my manual mythtranscode jobs?
[17:56:05] wagnerrp: jobqueue wont forcefully kill mythtranscode
[17:56:09] sphery: Yeah, on my systems, I install MythTV to /usr/local. However, on my 0.23-fixes system, the MythTV python bindings install to where Python knows is the correct location under /usr (i.e. the --prefix for installing MythTV doesn't override the smarts of Python)
[17:56:21] wagnerrp: the /most/ it will do is change a flag in the database
[17:56:32] sphery: did you change it on trunk to install to the prefix specified for MythTV install?
[17:56:35] wagnerrp: which mythtranscode checks every so often, and if set, will terminate
[17:56:50] wagnerrp: well it /should/ follow --prefix
[17:56:53] sphery: (I personally don't like that the Perl bindings do that, but it seems I'm the only one who does)
[17:57:06] peitolm: 92010-09–15 18:56:07.794 Transcoding stopped by JobQueue
[17:57:36] wagnerrp: the only reason the jobqueue would terminate a transcode is if you deleted the file
[17:57:50] peitolm: I want to compare the run times, to see if the mpeg2tompeg2 is being obeyed
[17:58:04] wagnerrp: do you have an mpeg2 output file?
[17:58:41] peitolm: http://pastebin.com/F7AhDjJH
[17:58:46] wagnerrp: is it taking more than 10 minutes to transcode?
[17:58:47] sphery: wagnerrp: anyway, it's the fact that we changed where the Perl bindings get installed that I think broke his Perl bindings.
[17:59:28] peitolm: wagnerrp: yes, it is taking more than 10 mins,
[17:59:44] peitolm: everything seems to suggest it's not doing a lossless copy
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[18:00:46] Beirdo: !trout newegg "Answer the dang phone"
[18:00:46] ** MythLogBot slaps newegg with a "Answer the dang phone" trout on behalf of Beirdo... **
[18:03:26] wagnerrp: sphery: --prefix works for me with the python bindings
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[18:04:46] sphery: wagnerrp: well, IMHO, it works for me, too--it puts the python bindings in the right place instead of a place that Python won't be able to use
[18:05:08] sphery: the perl bindings, on the other hand, get installed to a place that they can't be used
[18:05:27] wagnerrp: it will not automatically adjust the module search path for python
[18:05:46] sphery: all that's fine--I'm not complaining
[18:05:49] sphery: it's doing the right thing
[18:06:07] sphery: it's smarter than Perl bindings
[18:06:36] kth1: sphery: well whats the problem in unicode support of mythlink.pl ?
[18:06:37] sphery: (where, technically, the Perl bindings install /was/ smart, but then we decided to change the installer to tell it /we're/ smarter than Perl, and that broke my Perl)
[18:07:44] sphery: kth1: will you please pastebin the output of: locale
[18:07:55] peitolm: wagnerrp: any ideas?
[18:08:02] sphery: from any terminal
[18:08:22] wagnerrp: no, i dont know why the jobqueue would arbitrarily terminate a job
[18:08:28] Gibby: google search returns the same link...
[18:08:48] wagnerrp: yes i do, i know whats going on there
[18:09:08] wagnerrp: youre running a pre-existing, terminated job
[18:09:14] Beirdo: Total Amount: $691.20
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[18:09:18] wagnerrp: the job already has the 'STOP' flag set
[18:09:20] kth1: sphery: just a moment :) i've to wake up my mythbox :)
[18:09:27] Beirdo: no HVR-2250 yet
[18:09:30] sphery: Gibby: learn by example? http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Channel_Change_Scripts
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[18:09:34] wagnerrp: so the transcode starts up, starts running, polls the database and sees the STOP
[18:09:35] wagnerrp: so it stops
[18:09:39] peitolm: wagnerrp: any ideas why a profile which has the 'Lossless transcoding' flag set, doesn't seem to pass --mpeg2 to mythtranscode
[18:09:52] peitolm: wagnerrp: ah, right that's solves that problem
[18:10:02] wagnerrp: peitolm: because it doesnt need to
[18:10:16] Gibby: that is the page i was looking for, thanks sphery
[18:10:20] peitolm: wagnerrp: it should be nice and quick though, shouldn't it?
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[18:10:20] wagnerrp: when you run mythtranscode with the -j flag, it pulls everything it needs to from the database
[18:10:43] Gibby: it is not listed under the how to page
[18:10:49] wagnerrp: it probably ignores everything else you give it on the command line
[18:11:44] peitolm: wagnerrp: o.k. so ignoring the manual run for now, how long would you expect a mpeg2mpeg lossless transcode to take with say 5 cuts in,
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[18:12:08] peitolm: i'm epexcting it to rattle through the file until the first cut-scene, but it seems to be taking an absolute age
[18:12:08] kth1: sphery: well alright here is it : http://mythtv.pastebin.com/J3p36Sah
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[18:12:58] wagnerrp: peitolm: it should take however long it takes to copy the file
[18:13:05] wagnerrp: because its doing little more than that
[18:13:12] peitolm: that's what I would expect
[18:13:28] wagnerrp: there is a minimal amount of processing around the cutpoints, and then it updates the timecodes
[18:13:32] peitolm: plus a bit of overhead for the recode of the keyframs around the cutpoints
[18:13:40] peitolm: right, let me time this copy
[18:13:49] sphery: Gibby: I think it was referencing http://www.mythtv.org/docs/mythtv-HOWTO-singlehtml.html#ss11.3 , but it's out of date (thanks for making me notice--I'll get it fixed)
[18:14:01] iamlindoro: remember that the entire thing is demuxed and remuxed, regardless
[18:14:08] iamlindoro: so don't use a copy as your baseline expectation
[18:14:21] peitolm: iamlindoro: wouldn't that still be quick though?
[18:14:31] iamlindoro: relative to a lossy transcode, yes
[18:14:43] wagnerrp: peitolm: how large are your files?
[18:14:49] peitolm: 8gig
[18:14:58] peitolm: well, 7–9
[18:15:00] iamlindoro: If it's taking a long long time, then in all likelihood you are not actually doing lossless, or your source material isn't MPEG-2
[18:15:03] wagnerrp: i would expect it to take somewhere around 1GB/min
[18:15:05] Gibby: sphery, np, looks like mine is not listed, i found a lirc config for mine but i think i have to install lirc first
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[18:15:17] peitolm: iamlindoro: that's my concern
[18:15:25] wagnerrp: that includes the initial clipping, plus re-doing the seektable afterwards
[18:15:33] iamlindoro: peitolm: Where is your content coming from? What are you capturing with?
[18:15:39] iamlindoro: and in what locale?
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[18:16:46] sphery: kth1: out of curiosity, if you do the following, does it help? export LC_ALL="de_DE.UTF-8" ; mythlink.pl
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[18:17:38] peitolm: ok. 3mins 43 seconds to do 4.6% of the file
[18:17:44] peitolm: according to the lof
[18:17:55] ** iamlindoro points at all the questions above **
[18:18:01] peitolm: iamlindoro: pvr-[2|3]50 stored on NFS, over gigE
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[18:18:27] peitolm: locale=en_GB
[18:18:38] iamlindoro: And are you sure your transcode profile is set to lossless?
[18:18:51] kth1: sphery: it does not
[18:19:21] peitolm: iamlindoro: let me try and check the db, but yes, i believe so
[18:19:34] sphery: kth1: this is exactly the reason that mythrename.pl (which attempted to actually change file names) no longer exists
[18:19:38] iamlindoro: unless you know what the values in the DB should be, don't check the DB-- use the UI
[18:19:42] peitolm: 1.2Gig copied in 4.3mins
[18:19:43] sphery: there are just oo many pieces involved to make it work reliably
[18:19:57] peitolm: iamlindoro: the gui says it is
[18:20:11] sphery: kth1: still looking at a couple of things
[18:20:15] kth1: sphery: are there any other tools that do the job?
[18:20:54] wagnerrp: peitolm: an 8GB IVTV recording?
[18:21:10] wagnerrp: what is that, 3–4hrs?
[18:21:18] wagnerrp: sporting event?
[18:21:27] Beirdo: anyone know if the HVR-2250's FM tuner is supported in Linux? :)
[18:21:30] peitolm: wagnerrp: nope, a 1 hour one at max quality
[18:21:31] iamlindoro: would have to be, doesn't IVTV top out at ~12 Mbit?
[18:21:38] peitolm: 16mbit/s
[18:21:40] wagnerrp: yes
[18:21:54] sphery: kth1: what file system type?
[18:22:08] peitolm: see line 19 on http://pastebin.com/F7AhDjJH
[18:22:10] iamlindoro: peitolm: You realize that's about 2x the point at which quality changes become invisible to the human eye, right?
[18:22:23] peitolm: iamlindoro: :P
[18:22:29] iamlindoro: ie 8 Mbit at that resolution on ivtv will be perceptually indistinguishable from 16
[18:22:38] kormoc: iamlindoro, he sits 1.2mm away from the screen
[18:22:47] iamlindoro: Heh, even then
[18:22:50] peitolm: kormac 30cm, but yes
[18:23:08] wagnerrp: thats awfully close, even for a computer monitor
[18:23:16] kth1: sphery: the recording directories are on ntfs but when i let mythlink.pl choose an other dir on the base system to get correct links the problem is also there
[18:23:26] peitolm: anyhoo
[18:23:39] wagnerrp: why are your recordings on ntfs?
[18:23:50] kormoc: wagnerrp, blind as a bat from sitting to close to the screen manes he needs to sit closer to the screen. Vicious circle and all
[18:24:01] sphery: kth1: also, what do you get from: zcat /proc/config.gz | grep CONFIG_NLS_DEFAULT
[18:24:16] iamlindoro: That pastebin is functionally useless since you are trying to run a jobqueue job at the command line and glomming commands on it that will be ignored
[18:24:39] kth1: wagnerrp: because of the fact that this machine still has an windows 7 media center (which currently doesnt run often)
[18:24:51] peitolm: actually, it's only at 16mbit/s because i have lots of diskspace, and because i didn't want to sacrifice quality for later transcoding
[18:24:56] iamlindoro: Need to see the backend output of a real attempted job, not some attempt to run a backend job from the command line
[18:25:12] peitolm: iamlindoro: we estabilished that, but it answered your bitrate question
[18:25:29] iamlindoro: peitolm: saying 16 Mbit was more than enough
[18:25:34] kth1: sphery: config.gz doesnt exists there
[18:26:10] sphery: cat /usr/src/linux-`uname -r`/.config | grep CONFIG_NLS_DEFAULT
[18:26:15] peitolm: iamlindoro: it was already pastebinned
[18:26:27] iamlindoro: sigh
[18:26:30] iamlindoro: k, good luck
[18:26:37] peitolm: iamlindoro: i'm just getting a log for you
[18:27:42] sphery: kth1: also, please check to see if you're using the utf8 mount option for your ntfs file systems and not using uni_xlate mount option
[18:28:11] kth1: sphery: cat: /usr/src/linux-2.6.34-020634-generic/.config: No such file or directory – nls=utf8 for ntfs
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[18:29:45] sphery: kth1: I'm out of ideas... it's possible there's a problem in the mythlink.pl script, but this is why our file names /always/ just use ASCII characters (because then it always just works)
[18:30:15] sphery: if you do find an issue in mythlink.pl , please post a patch to http://svn.mythtv.org/
[18:30:39] wagnerrp: i half expect using a native linux filesystem would fix the issue
[18:30:55] wagnerrp: kth1: do you have a separate root filesystem? something not running ntfs?
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[18:32:39] kth1: sphery: problem is that mythlink.pl make use of perl api method format_name in object of MythTV::Recording so i don't know where to find this method code – rootfs is ext4
[18:32:49] kth1: wagnerrp: rootfs = ext4
[18:32:50] peitolm: iamlindoro: http://pastebin.com/Qni1UfAh
[18:33:17] sphery: kth1: MythTV::Recording is in the Perl bindings (in mythtv/bindings/perl directory of source distribution)
[18:34:07] kth1: sphery: ok i'll take a look – but my perl knowledge isn't as good as it should be for this task ;)
[18:34:08] wagnerrp: kth1: can you try pointing mythlink at something on the root filesystem instead?
[18:34:34] wagnerrp: see if the links made on an ext4 filesystem behave properly?
[18:34:46] kth1: wagnerrp: i can but same problem – i'll try it once again
[18:34:51] sphery: kth1: and my locale/character-encoding/file system/etc knowledge isn't as good as it should be for this task :)
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[18:35:18] sphery: kth1: the root file system /is/ ext4 (versus ntfs?)
[18:35:28] Beirdo: can any wise person here confirm that a PCIe 1X card (in particular HVR-2250) is usable in a PCIe 16X slot?
[18:35:47] wagnerrp: an x1 card, yes... dont know about a 2250 specifically
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[18:36:04] wagnerrp: ive got a 1250 sitting in one currently
[18:36:05] kth1: wagnerrp: its the same problem in my homedir on rootfs(ext4)
[18:36:07] Beirdo: OK. They say it's an x1 card
[18:36:13] Beirdo: Good enough :)
[18:36:31] Beirdo: I just want to make sure I'm not about to set myself up for a "duhhh!" moment
[18:36:42] Beirdo: it should work, basically
[18:37:01] kth1: sphery: yes rootfs / and /home are ext4 /windows is ntfs and storage group for myth recordings are on /windows/..
[18:37:58] Beirdo: HVR-2250 one-clicked from Amazon:)
[18:38:23] wagnerrp: wow... according to the python profiler, im using some 9k function calls to get a DBData class auto-configure itself
[18:38:24] sphery: I one-clicked bought by accident once
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[18:38:39] wagnerrp: and a subsequent 300 calls to actually pull data from the database afterwards
[18:38:39] peitolm: doesn't it depend more on the motherboard, some manuf assume that the x16 is for graphics, and don't like it if you put things like storage cards in there
[18:38:42] wagnerrp: that cant be right...
[18:38:42] sphery: was very annoyed--but very fortunate that I was actually buying that for myself
[18:38:46] Beirdo: sphery: I one-click buy most of my stuff :)
[18:38:51] sphery: I hate it
[18:39:00] peitolm: you can turn off 1-click you know
[18:39:03] sphery: Amazon can have their worthless "patent" on that
[18:39:06] Beirdo: you have 30min to cancel too
[18:39:18] sphery: peitolm: yeah, I keep it off, but I accidentally turned it on in my session one time
[18:39:22] wagnerrp: peitolm: only if theyre a worthless manufacturer
[18:39:34] Beirdo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811999192
[18:39:36] Beirdo: mmmmmm
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[18:40:13] Beirdo: must confirm linux support before purchasing for frontend replacement
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[18:40:22] kth1: sphery: are there at this time any actual java bindings through mythtv ? or ruby ?
[18:40:38] Beirdo: kth1: no and no
[18:40:38] sphery: kth1: no
[18:40:50] Beirdo: Ruby is on my "TODO some decade" list
[18:41:01] Beirdo: Java. blech :)
[18:41:11] sphery: kth1: in the future, making them may be easier, as we're abstracting data access and potentially moving it and the protocol to use protobuf
[18:41:16] Beirdo: that can be on someone else's list
[18:41:18] wagnerrp: yes, and no
[18:41:33] kth1: sphery: protobuf would be very nice ;)
[18:41:34] wagnerrp: there are a set of 3rd party java bindings floating around somewhere
[18:41:41] wagnerrp: but they probably havent been updated in several years
[18:42:20] wagnerrp: http://sourceforge.net/projects/mythtvj/
[18:42:27] wagnerrp: they support protocol 40, were currently on 62
[18:42:38] sphery: so, 2/3 complete?
[18:42:43] sphery: ;)
[18:43:03] Beirdo: wow, even older than the mythical support in XBMC
[18:43:05] wagnerrp: we also have 'php bindings', but someone would have to first strip them out of mythweb before they could be used
[18:43:05] kth1: sphery: but there is a c++ api which could do the job instead of mythlink.pl ? (well ok have to write a c++ program which does but when there are some api functions to get the needed information that should be possible)
[18:43:39] ** Beirdo punts "Red Green Show" to the PVR250 **
[18:43:56] sphery: kth1: if you want to work with Java, use MythXML to request program information (in XML), then parse it and create your symlinks
[18:43:58] Beirdo: no point in recording 480i and hogging the HDPVR for that
[18:44:16] wagnerrp: kth1: nearly all of the behavior of mythlink is duplicated in the python bindings
[18:44:20] sphery: kth1: though Java doesn't have symlink support, per se, so you'd likely be running a command-line program, meaning you get the same problems the perl script is having, right?
[18:44:32] wagnerrp: i could probably whip up a replacement in 20 minutes... but then we already have a mythlink
[18:44:38] wagnerrp: better to repair the one we already have
[18:44:39] sphery: kth1: or, if you know Python, just use the Python bindigns to ...
[18:44:47] sphery: do what wagnerrp said he could do in 20mins
[18:44:58] Beirdo: python... pish :)
[18:44:59] Beirdo: hehe
[18:45:20] sphery: wagnerrp: then again, I wouldn't mind replacing mythlink.pl with a python implementation since the perl bindings are so out of date in comparison :)
[18:45:29] wagnerrp: oh?
[18:45:31] Beirdo: but seriously, wagnerrp has done a great job making Python bindings to be quite useful
[18:45:32] ** wagnerrp gets to it **
[18:45:42] Beirdo: !trout sphery
[18:45:42] ** MythLogBot slaps sphery with a trout on behalf of Beirdo... **
[18:45:44] Beirdo: hey!
[18:45:46] Beirdo: hehe
[18:45:51] sphery: wagnerrp: might want to check with the PTB, though (mainly xris)
[18:45:55] Beirdo: but go nuts
[18:46:06] Beirdo: I doubt anyone would care
[18:46:20] sphery: wagnerrp: the perl bindings use ln to create the link
[18:46:31] sphery: does Python itself support "native" symlink creation?
[18:46:38] wagnerrp: yes
[18:46:40] sphery: s/perl bindings/perl script/
[18:46:44] sphery: really... cool
[18:46:59] kth1: sphery: i thought about using db direct connection to get information through java at first XD :)
[18:47:00] Beirdo: Whaaa?
[18:47:07] Beirdo: it shells out?!
[18:47:11] Beirdo: that's retarded
[18:47:35] sphery: wagnerrp: heh, I stand corrected... symlink $show->{'local_path'}, "$dest/$name"
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[18:47:45] Beirdo: oh that's better
[18:47:46] Beirdo: :)
[18:47:53] sphery: didn't know perl had a symlink command
[18:48:01] Beirdo: yup :)
[18:48:06] Beirdo: perl++
[18:48:12] kth1: but thinking twice thats not good at all because when sometime the db changed ive to fix the implementation :)
[18:48:15] sphery: kth1: use MythXML... Much nicer, and it will keep working as we change the DB
[18:48:19] sphery: exactly
[18:48:47] kth1: sphery: there are documentation about MythXML ?
[18:49:18] wagnerrp: yes, on the wiki, and in a 'MythXMLTest' test web application
[18:49:55] ** Beirdo needs more mythcoffee **
[18:50:06] kth1: ok maybe i should take a look at MythXML :)
[18:50:08] Gibby: ok, so i got the correct configuration script, think i have the right device, however irsend is not working... is there a debug or verbose option somewhere i can see what is going on?
[18:50:17] sphery: kth1: MythXML is easy to use... http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/323174#323174 has a little info (but focused on getting listings info)
[18:50:33] wagnerrp: sphery: would you actually want a mythlink.py?
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[18:50:55] Beirdo: or a mythlink.sh?
[18:50:57] ** Beirdo runs **
[18:50:58] sphery: wagnerrp: I would. But xris may not agree. He's the one to ask
[18:51:19] sphery: Beirdo: better idea--few people have systems without a shell
[18:51:29] wagnerrp: may as well ping xris again for good measure
[18:51:30] kth1: wagnerrp: i would use it ^^ :)
[18:51:32] sphery: though those poor suckers with only a csh will be out of luck
[18:51:35] wagnerrp: xris!
[18:51:57] wagnerrp: sphery: hey now... freebsd has upgraded to tcsh
[18:52:13] Beirdo: hehe
[18:52:45] sphery: kth1: as far as using MythXML's other functions, see mythtv/contrib/development/MythXML for a "web app" that exercises the various functions
[18:52:58] Beirdo: to the end user, .pl, .py, .sh makes not a bit of difference as long as the requisite language is there
[18:53:11] sphery: wagnerrp: heh... I only installed tcsh because a couple of brain dead programs require it for their build environment
[18:53:21] sphery: *cough*OpenOffice.org*cough*
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[18:54:10] kth1: Beirdo: its not a difference when all have no bugs and equal functions :)
[18:54:12] ** Beirdo slaps his backend **
[18:54:44] sphery: wagnerrp: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/unix-faq/shell/csh-whynot/
[18:55:01] Beirdo: it decided that since my HD Homerun was busy... use the PVR250, not the second channel on the HD Homerun
[18:55:29] Beirdo: I want Chuck in HD, you miserable machine!
[18:55:34] sphery: But then again, it's not like the people who use BSD are programmers. I mean, not programmers like the Debian team.  :)
[18:56:01] Beirdo: yay!
[18:56:23] sphery: Beirdo: sounds like your input connections are out of order?
[18:56:29] Beirdo: yeah
[18:56:33] kth1: are there any plans to support ip power socket or something like this? :)
[18:56:42] Beirdo: I think we should STOP relying on bogus orders.
[18:56:50] Beirdo: but I don't know of a better way :)
[18:57:01] sphery: yeah, if we don't rely on them, how do we allow users to control it?
[18:57:08] sphery: another setting?  :)
[18:57:08] Beirdo: some other way
[18:57:14] sphery: order works well
[18:57:14] Beirdo: yes
[18:57:19] Beirdo: sometimes
[18:57:21] sphery: always
[18:57:26] Beirdo: umm, no
[18:57:27] sphery: just need to configure properly :)
[18:57:35] Beirdo: failback is complex sometimes
[18:57:53] sphery: we allow you to choose the order you use inputs for recording /and/ separately control the order you use cards for Live TV
[18:57:57] Beirdo: i.e. HD Homerun 1 -> HD Homerun 2 -> HDPVR -> PVR250 in some cases
[18:58:08] Beirdo: but not in all cases
[18:58:15] sphery: well, schedule comes into play
[18:58:20] sphery: because not all shows end at the same time
[18:58:33] Beirdo: different channels can require different failback
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[18:58:44] sphery: so when the 6-hr Martian Chronicles is recording on HDHR 2, then Chuck gets pushed to HDPVR or something
[18:58:48] Beirdo: but yeah, order is a good start, and works most of the time
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[18:58:56] Beirdo: like 90%+
[18:59:07] Beirdo: Basically, I need to reorder
[18:59:12] sphery: if different channels require different fallback, you likely need to adjust your video sources and/or channels
[18:59:24] Beirdo: HD Homerun, then HDPVR then PVR250
[18:59:25] sphery: but, yeah, it /is/ very complex how it works
[18:59:39] Beirdo: but I'll do that once I have the new backend with a 2250 in it
[18:59:40] sphery: and it's not something anyone would just guess
[18:59:46] sphery: so new users are out of luck
[18:59:47] Beirdo: yeah
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[19:00:01] Beirdo: I'm good with what we have mostly
[19:00:02] kth1: there are no plans to intellegence power up/down control? :)
[19:00:02] sphery: but fortunately, most new users have only a single video source and multiple identical cards
[19:00:07] Beirdo: but what would be nice is...
[19:00:18] sphery: kth1: power up/down, meaning shut off?
[19:00:23] Beirdo: when we add a new input, to be able to reorder them as we do so
[19:00:31] Beirdo: without removing all and restarting
[19:00:33] sphery: kth1: if so, we have support for that for all systems (frontends, remote backends, master backend)
[19:01:04] kth1: sphery: meaning shut off and before that telling an ip power device when to wake up next
[19:01:05] Beirdo: let you shift the input order in setup and have it fix it all
[19:01:17] sphery: Beirdo: I say Delete all capture cards, then re-creating the capture cards and re-connecting inputs in 30s is /much/ more efficient than writing the code to "fix" it for the user
[19:01:19] Beirdo: however, taht's all gonna be reimplemented soon, so who knows
[19:01:39] Beirdo: efficient for whom?
[19:01:43] Beirdo: not for the user
[19:01:45] Beirdo: :)
[19:02:10] Beirdo: and it takes a lot longer than 30s when you get a lot of inputs involved
[19:02:13] sphery: kth1: the master backend can shut down remote backends when not needed, the master backend can shut itself down and schedule a later wakeup
[19:02:22] Beirdo: but I'll live with it
[19:02:32] Beirdo: certainly nothing to be changed now...
[19:02:42] Beirdo: something to keep in mind during rework though
[19:02:47] sphery: kth1: and, ttbomk, it's all done using scripts, so you can just make it provide a message to your always-on whatever device to wake it when appropriate
[19:03:26] sphery: Beirdo: I do 4 inputs on 4 cards on 2 different hosts in less than 30s
[19:03:44] Beirdo: you aren't a normal user
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[19:03:47] sphery: since you don't need to do anything with channels or video sources or rules, it's not very time consuming
[19:03:48] Beirdo: neither am I :)
[19:04:04] sphery: agreed, but it's still not a long or difficult job
[19:04:17] Beirdo: hmmm, and... the Input Preference... would be nice to be a list (per-show)
[19:04:23] Beirdo: for instance...
[19:04:26] Beirdo: A-Team.
[19:04:30] wagnerrp: sphery: theres really a lot of options in this thing...
[19:04:38] kth1: sphery: hm hehe ok well thats nearly what i'm actually using (some ruby script which looks for the next recording and informs an avm fritzbox when to wake up using WOL) problem is wake up using wol doesnt work everytime
[19:04:52] Beirdo: I get it OTA, and on DirecTV, but on DirecTV, I want to capture SD, not HD
[19:04:58] sphery: wagnerrp: yeah... again, you should ask someone with the power to decide before spending any time on it
[19:05:02] Beirdo: as there's really no point using hte HDPVR
[19:05:09] sphery: wagnerrp: though many of those options could likely be reconsidered
[19:05:17] wagnerrp: yeah, fair enough
[19:05:44] Beirdo: maybe a preference to record in SD? :)
[19:05:50] Beirdo: but again, more settings. blech.
[19:06:16] sphery: Beirdo: we do have a per-rule input preference, and an HDTV preference and stuff
[19:06:38] Beirdo: but do we have an anti-HDTV preference?
[19:06:42] Beirdo: :)
[19:06:44] sphery: yes
[19:06:56] kth1: sphery: how do you wake up your masterbackend server? or does it run the whole time?
[19:07:02] Beirdo: really? cool. How to get to it from mythweb, I wonder
[19:07:06] sphery: or even a create a rule for HDTV only, then a separate (differently prioritized) rule for SDTV
[19:07:53] sphery: The HDTV preference requires a custom rule, which is possible through mythweb, but I really recommend using mythfrontend
[19:08:08] Beirdo: hmmm, ugh
[19:08:09] sphery: if nothing else, mfe gives you the list of example clauses (which include the HDTV options)
[19:08:27] Beirdo: yeah, I can fiddle when at home, I guess
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[19:08:40] sphery: but, IMHO, none of these things should be "generic" options on recording rules because it's already complex enough to create "normal" recording rules
[19:08:49] Beirdo: the joy of mythweb being to setup the recording rules
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[19:09:01] sphery: especially when 99% of the time, users just want "Any time/any channel", maybe set a recording group, and set a priority
[19:09:09] Beirdo: they could be in the advanced options though
[19:09:11] sphery: yet we ask them 40 questions or so?
[19:09:25] Beirdo: input preference is heavily used by me :)
[19:09:27] Beirdo: win 9
[19:09:30] sphery: they /are/ in advanced options (read "Power Recording Rules") :)
[19:09:31] Beirdo: dangit
[19:09:49] Beirdo: no, I mean where it says "Advanced Options" in mythweb
[19:11:21] Beirdo: the dangit was for my win 9 fail, BTW :)
[19:12:14] sphery: yeah, but name a single MythTV user who doesn't think, "Oh, /I'm/ advanced, so I better show that."
[19:12:18] Beirdo: anyways... maybe a way to get to the power recording rules from the schedule detail screen for a recording rule? I dunno
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[19:12:58] sphery: even the newbies will... "Well, I've been using Lie-nux for almost 2 years, now, so I'm an advanced user."
[19:13:16] Beirdo: very good point
[19:13:17] sphery: What I'd like to do is add support for recording rule "templates" so to speak
[19:13:40] Beirdo: that would be cool
[19:13:47] Beirdo: anyways, better run to lunch.
[19:13:52] Beirdo: have to interview a dude at 1
[19:14:02] sphery: so users can just set up their default rule options, then it gets used all the time, or they can make a couple of other named ones (Movies, News, ...) and select them from a list
[19:14:06] sphery: anyway, later.
[19:14:18] Beirdo: I really like that idea, BTW
[19:14:35] wagnerrp: sphery: are you talking about advanced among the 'real' linux crowd? or the 'fashionable' linux crowd?
[19:14:37] sphery: I still think, though, that the "esoteric" options do /not/ belong in "simple" rules--they belong in Power Recording Rules a.k.a. Custom Rules
[19:15:00] sphery: wagnerrp: I'm mainly talking about advanced in ones own mind
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[19:15:03] iamlindoro: I think we should also align recording rules dupe and filtering between the FE and mythweb
[19:15:09] iamlindoro: I think the language in mythweb is much better
[19:15:23] sphery: yeah, the fact that it's broken out separately in mythweb and not in the frontend makes it confusing
[19:15:30] Beirdo: be back later
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[19:15:57] sphery: the hard part is the whole design of those screens that kind of require putting the entire text into a button
[19:16:00] sphery: (which doesn't fit)
[19:16:01] iamlindoro: And in fact, even the language in MythWeb could be clearer since New versus Non Repeat is unclear
[19:16:14] sphery: yeah
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[19:17:47] sphery: iamlindoro: hard part is explaining this clearly: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/12433
[19:17:49] stuartm: I wish there had been more coordination on some of the osd stuff, in PBB we have 'videoprops' with states of "hd1080, hd720, hdtv, widescreen" and in the osd we have 'videodescrip' with states of "HD_1080_P, HD_1080_I, HD_720_P, SD"
[19:18:08] stuartm: I expect the audio channel stuff is the same :(
[19:18:26] sphery: especially explaining it clearly within the text of a button
[19:18:43] iamlindoro: stuartm: They are fed by different information, however, and the OSD is both more correct and more specific
[19:19:00] sphery: I do think the recording rule creation pages in mythfrontend could use a reworking by a UI-savvy dev
[19:19:01] stuartm: Mark's not around, so not much chance of reaching a concensus before 0.24
[19:19:20] stuartm: iamlindoro: doesn't really matter, they should both be the same whatever the source
[19:19:25] iamlindoro: videoprops is the overall average guessed resolution, and has no notion of interlaced versus progressive
[19:19:40] iamlindoro: videodescrip is the momentary value, and gets interlacing right
[19:19:52] iamlindoro: as well as handling the two specific common SD values
[19:20:14] iamlindoro: audio channel stuff in the OSD is also far more specific
[19:20:31] sphery: stuartm: so the official word is that we should set milestone appropriately after closing tickets?
[19:20:33] iamlindoro: OSD covers channels as one state and codec as another-- PBB is a screwed up hodgepodge of both
[19:20:43] stuartm: iamlindoro: yeah, that SD stuff is going to fail hard in the UK, many channels use a lower res
[19:20:56] sphery: I skipped it primarily to avoid an extra e-mail to the list, but would be happy to set it in the future
[19:21:27] stuartm: sphery: not official, I'm trying to reach an agreement one way or the other, so far no-one has given it a thumbs up or down
[19:21:30] sphery: though getting it in the commit hook would be wonderful
[19:21:46] wagnerrp: sphery: i think the 'proper' thing to do is to accept and set a milestone when you start working on a bug
[19:22:02] wagnerrp: or at least put it on your list of things to do
[19:22:10] wagnerrp: that way, its already there when you go to close it
[19:22:17] sphery: yeah, unfortunately, for me, milestones tend to be decided by when I happen to find time to work on it :(
[19:22:53] sphery: so by the time I know it will be fixed for a specific release, it's within a couple days of the commit at most
[19:23:38] wagnerrp: so back to the email i posted about the post-commit hook stuff
[19:24:00] sphery: I need to catch up on the list
[19:24:03] stuartm: iamlindoro: I don't disagree, but at the very least there names chosen, should show some consistency, this is the kind of crap that the old UI did and I was trying to get away from it
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[19:24:31] stuartm: it's just a little late now to sort it out, I'll have to do it after 0.24 and then break a bunch of themes
[19:26:37] sphery: wagnerrp: and, yes, I do want that post-commit hook stuff in there... I think a little file or even just a variable in the script that specifies the current trunk milestone would be fine.
[19:27:18] sphery: and, yeah, it means backports would be changed to trunk milestone, then changed again to -fixes milestone--but that would be fine (as long as devs actually /back/port instead of forward-porting)
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[19:27:54] wagnerrp: sphery: no, i have it set to only set that stuff on a 'fixes', not a 'refs'
[19:28:31] sphery: ah, yeah, so if you only "fix" it once, it's good
[19:28:38] sphery: though I have double-fixed some :)
[19:28:49] sphery: I can be careful in the future
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[19:35:51] |simonckenyon|: did i misunderstand something – a SBE will not stream videos to a FE when using SGs – the MBE has to be able to access the files
[19:36:16] iamlindoro: That's not the case
[19:36:18] wagnerrp: no, the frontend will always try to access the backend which recorded the video
[19:36:22] iamlindoro: yep
[19:36:25] wagnerrp: unless you have that master backend override set
[19:37:19] |simonckenyon|: is that a setting for the FE, the MBE or the SBE?
[19:38:30] stuartm: ah screw it, I'll rewrite the osd later :(
[19:38:57] wagnerrp: i believe its a frontend global
[19:42:38] sphery: wow, you mention one thing in IRC, and it grows into a long thread on the list :)
[19:42:53] sphery: |simonckenyon|: btw, thanks for putting that on the wiki
[19:44:05] sphery: I /think/ what you now need to do is scan on the SBE and let it find your remote backend's list of videos
[19:44:26] sphery: though, with current scanner, it would remove the master backend ones, that time, wouldn't it
[19:44:37] |simonckenyon|: the "master backend override" setting is configured on the MBE with mythtv-setup
[19:44:49] sphery: so, yeah, you may need NFS for the videos if you want videos on multiple hosts
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[19:44:58] iamlindoro: sphery: Video scan is global
[19:44:59] sphery: that said, I don't know the video stuff, so there may be a better approach
[19:45:07] iamlindoro: it scans all available backends
[19:45:17] sphery: so it should work without nfs, then?
[19:45:20] |simonckenyon|: note that mythtv-setup bleats on exit when it cannot access the SBE videos
[19:45:26] sphery: and it will detect which backend has which videos?
[19:45:28] iamlindoro: yes, though I didn't write the SG scanner
[19:45:57] sphery: iamlindoro: and it works properly with SG fallback (i.e. each host inherits the SG definition from the mbe)?
[19:46:14] iamlindoro: sphery: I really doubt it does
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[19:46:23] sphery: I'll look at it
[19:46:32] iamlindoro: and by doubt, I mean, no, it doesn't
[19:46:43] sphery: I may be able to fix it up
[19:47:03] sphery: hard part is figuring out which remote backends we have
[19:47:12] sphery: guess maybe just check BackendServerIPs
[19:47:30] |simonckenyon|: if the MBE can't access the files – then it won't serve them up to a FE
[19:47:52] |simonckenyon|: just lost all the metadata for the videos on my SBE – the price of progress
[19:48:08] sphery: simonckenyon: on the bright side, w is quick :)
[19:48:13] wagnerrp: sphery: i honestly dont know if the bindings scanner handles fallthrough (and i wrote it)
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[19:48:15] wagnerrp: checking now
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[19:48:20] sphery: so, yeah, in the meantime, you'll need NFS
[19:48:36] iamlindoro: The MBE doesn't need to be able to access them
[19:48:52] iamlindoro: It's just that each BE with Videos *does* need a definition for the folders
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[19:49:13] wagnerrp: no, the bindings scanner only scans each storage group specifically on the hostname it is defined for
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[19:49:24] wagnerrp: and if it cannot connect to that hostname, it simply ignores it
[19:49:29] sphery: yeah, unfortunately, the SGs were written in such a way that they work extremely well for TV, but when they were extended at later times for different purposes, rather than extending the SG class, other code added its own SG code
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[19:49:41] |simonckenyon|: iamlindoro: so do i need to define the SG for the SBE videos on the SBE?
[19:49:42] sphery: so we have different usage/requirements/assumptions for the non-TV stuff
[19:49:50] iamlindoro: |simonckenyon|: ATM, yes
[19:49:52] wagnerrp: so if you have a Videos group defined on the MBE for /srv/videos, the bindings will only scan on the MBE
[19:49:54] sphery: simonckenyon: that would work, too
[19:49:59] wagnerrp: it will not fall through to each SBE
[19:50:04] sphery: for TV you shouldn't, though
[19:50:08] iamlindoro: That is the use case the original author presumed when he wrote it
[19:50:12] iamlindoro: (for videos)
[19:50:17] sphery: wagnerrp: yeah, that's what needs fixing
[19:50:17] |simonckenyon|: i had better update the wiki – it is all wrong
[19:50:23] iamlindoro: unfortunately it doens't jive with the expectation for recordings
[19:50:33] sphery: plus the implementation that was used for MythVideo
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[19:50:45] sphery: which is way old...
[19:50:51] wagnerrp: sphery: so SBE-defined SGs should remain the same
[19:50:58] wagnerrp: but the handling of MBE defined ones should change?
[19:51:28] sphery: wagnerrp: basically, you can only defined an SG on the master backend--all you do on the remote backends is override the directory list you inherit from the master backend
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[19:51:39] sphery: the problem is the bindings and MV usage don't properly handle the inheritance, yet
[19:51:51] sphery: i.e. they assume that things are set up wrongly
[19:51:53] sphery: :)
[19:52:49] wagnerrp: i dont know...
[19:53:06] wagnerrp: IMHO, your way results in less work, but is going to confuse the hell out of new people
[19:53:28] |simonckenyon|: well i'm old people – and i'm confused
[19:54:02] wagnerrp: sphery: so a couple scenarios...
[19:54:25] wagnerrp: 1. ive got the single SG on the MBE... i scan all available hosts for content?
[19:54:54] wagnerrp: 2. ive got one SG set up on the MBE, and one on the SBE.... do i scan the MBE's paths on the SBE? or just the one defined for the SBE?
[19:55:38] |simonckenyon|: when you say "one SG" – do you mean one directory defined in the Video SG?
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[19:56:13] iamlindoro: |simonckenyon|: OK if I correct the note box you added?
[19:56:18] iamlindoro: (that information is not correct)
[19:56:24] wagnerrp: i mean one or more entries on that machine for that group name
[19:56:59] |simonckenyon|: sure – i was just warning people that the description in the rest of the page was not correct – still not sure what it should be – so please updat eit
[19:57:10] |simonckenyon|: s/ e/e /
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[19:57:53] iamlindoro: fixed
[19:59:21] |simonckenyon|: iamlindoro: will test now to see if my experience matches the description
[20:02:43] wagnerrp: iamlindoro: im just going to follow your lead on this one
[20:02:57] wagnerrp: leave as is? fix for 0.25? fix for 0.24? backport later?
[20:03:35] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: I'm not changing anything for now, I think the real fix is going to take some time and possible be invasive
[20:03:35] Beirdo: OK, no interview
[20:03:53] iamlindoro: I think the note in the documentation that Video paths must be defined on each BE is more than enough (IMO)
[20:04:21] wagnerrp: ok, the only thing 'invasive' i see about the 'proper' behavior
[20:04:24] iamlindoro: I personally think the "SBEs are overrides" is totally counterintuitive
[20:04:34] wagnerrp: is that we currently have no way of telling what backends are connected
[20:04:46] wagnerrp: so you have to pull all possibles from the database
[20:04:52] wagnerrp: test them all for connectivity...
[20:04:55] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: The MythVideo scanner does that
[20:05:11] iamlindoro: tests connectivity to each host, and does not delete any files from missing hosts
[20:05:21] wagnerrp: for everything? or only those that have storage groups listed for them?
[20:05:33] iamlindoro: For those w/ Storage Groups listed
[20:05:44] wagnerrp: right, the bindings behave the same way
[20:05:56] wagnerrp: im saying the 'proper' behavior would be to check everything regardless
[20:06:03] |simonckenyon|: i can confirm that the SG for videos on the MBE has only the dirs local to it and the SG for videos on the SBE has only the local dirs to it and all seems to work
[20:06:19] iamlindoro: |simonckenyon|: I get one right every now and again ;)
[20:06:35] wagnerrp: and if youve got cruft from old hostnames or offline backends in your database, that can cause a long wait for that stuff to timeout
[20:06:46] trumee is now known as zzztrumee
[20:07:15] wagnerrp: for stuff that likely doesnt have any video content anyway
[20:07:26] iamlindoro: yep
[20:07:41] iamlindoro: Like I said, I'm not crazy about making the video SG behavior conform-- because I think the original behavior is wrong
[20:08:03] wagnerrp: perhaps the best solution is to just wait for MFSW to perform the scan automatically
[20:08:14] iamlindoro: MFSW is basically a non starter, though
[20:08:19] iamlindoro: you can't watch enough directories
[20:08:30] iamlindoro: so it's likely never to be used for MythVideo
[20:08:37] wagnerrp: its not recursive?
[20:08:44] iamlindoro: correct
[20:08:58] Beirdo: ouch
[20:08:59] iamlindoro: It could be, but each subdir would be a watched dir
[20:09:07] iamlindoro: And you run out of watchable nodes too fast
[20:09:18] Beirdo: well, it's better than what happened with the UPnPMediaScan
[20:09:22] iamlindoro: Most average sized music collections would exhaust the number of watchables
[20:09:40] Beirdo: it's recursive and by funky circumstances... would recurse to current dir.
[20:09:43] wagnerrp: ah, didnt know the system it was using was limited in such a fashion
[20:09:43] Beirdo: kaBOOM
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[20:11:35] |simonckenyon|: i'm watching my FE spam my MBE with SendReceiveStringList(QUERY_SG_FILEQUERY,sanfrancisco...) – is this because i lost my SBE metadata?
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[20:12:19] wagnerrp: |simonckenyon|: those calls are usually for artwork
[20:12:21] Beirdo: oooh, log spew
[20:12:29] wagnerrp: it checks the file to see if it exists, before pulling it off the backend
[20:13:26] Beirdo: I assume that was turned on by default for debugging?
[20:13:48] iamlindoro: It's something daniel wants to nag people into removing, so he put it in default verbosity
[20:14:03] Beirdo: ah
[20:14:04] iamlindoro: It's not a bug, or even anything to be concerned about, and is necessary in mythvideo
[20:14:18] iamlindoro: We moved it to anotehr verbosity in .23, and are likely to do it once we branch .24 too
[20:14:31] Beirdo: it's lovely log spew, was just curious as to the reasoning.
[20:14:36] iamlindoro: Basically it's querying folder contents to do image hunt
[20:14:46] iamlindoro: (SG folder contents)
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[20:15:06] iamlindoro: so basically it's not a misconfiguration, or a bug, just a personal crusade ;)
[20:15:07] sphery: wagnerrp: sorry, phone call
[20:15:13] Beirdo: I'll be moving myth_system log spew into another verbosity for 0.24 as well
[20:15:35] Beirdo: around RC2
[20:15:54] wagnerrp: sphery: nevermind, sine its going to be staying as-is for now
[20:15:58] wagnerrp: since
[20:15:59] sphery: have to catch up, then I'll answer (but the short answer is yes, and no (because the SBE just /overrides/ the directory list from the MBE)
[20:16:03] |simonckenyon|: it's calmed down now
[20:19:11] wagnerrp: anyone else use thunderbird?
[20:19:25] iamlindoro: wagnerrp: As little as I can, but yes
[20:19:27] sphery: wagnerrp: yeah
[20:19:46] zzztrumee is now known as trumee
[20:19:54] wagnerrp: have you noticed strange behavior when trying to prune empty lines when replying to email?
[20:20:05] sphery: wagnerrp: yeah, the new version has some issues with it
[20:20:06] wagnerrp: instead of just deleting the blank line
[20:20:15] sphery: deletes blocks it shouldn't
[20:20:16] wagnerrp: it arbitrarily decides it wants to delete the entire block of text
[20:20:21] wagnerrp: yeah
[20:20:26] sphery: all because of that "it's HTML, but you can't see the HTML" garbage
[20:20:34] Gibby: do i choose the lirc or lircd from /dev for lirc?
[20:20:39] wagnerrp: even if i force it into plain text mode, it does it
[20:20:48] sphery: also, mine has been putting a blank space before the first character on the first line
[20:20:51] sphery: don't know why...
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[20:21:18] sphery: so if I only reply to others, it's not a problem, but if I type anything on the first line, it gets bumped over
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[20:45:22] Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v MythLogBot
[20:46:11] ** Beirdo gives MythLogBot the evil eye **
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[20:46:42] Beirdo: anyone have a fave RSS reader for Linux desktop use? :)
[20:46:59] Beirdo: i_is_cat: snow in Edmonton yet?
[20:47:07] Gibby: Beirdo: Thunderbird
[20:47:35] jarle: Beirdo: for actual reading, or for podcasts?
[20:47:50] Beirdo: reading
[20:48:13] Beirdo: I don't need no stinking podcasts, I have my iPhone for that :)
[20:48:28] kormoc: Beirdo, google reader
[20:48:58] Beirdo: hmm, yeah, I guess that would work :)
[20:51:01] Beirdo: I had somehow forgotten about Google Reader
[21:04:42] sphery: Beirdo: thunderbird--using rss2email (though that script is not ideal, it works--but if you know of a better one)
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[21:10:04] Beirdo: I could probably make one.
[21:10:29] sphery: heh, if you do make a better one, I'd love to get a copy
[21:10:37] dustybin: Beirdo: snownews
[21:10:50] sphery: http://www.allthingsrss.com/rss2email/ is where it's from, btw
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[21:30:11] iamlindoro: kenni: Personally would have said "if you upload your translation *before* the dates mentioned above" ;)
[21:30:31] iamlindoro: Since you can never tell what time of day any of those releases will go out, or in what TZ
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[21:35:48] kenni: iamlindoro: You're right :) ...but we still have 48 hours minus the TZ, so we should be good to go. It should also minimize spam to the commit list, if all translations are done on these dates :)
[21:37:28] kenni: hopefully people will upload correct patches right away, otherwise they will probably run into a time issue
[21:37:51] kenni: oh, well, let's see how it goes
[21:38:26] Gibby: i am getting permission denied for ircsend, if i use sudo i get connection refused ...... I have searched through the wiki and forums and nothing has worked yet
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[21:38:45] kormoc: Gibby, make sure lircd is running?
[21:38:50] Gibby: yep
[21:39:27] Gibby: i am using the device listed in the output of ps -ef|grep lirc
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[21:39:52] kormoc: lirc != lircd
[21:40:09] Gibby: lircd shows the --device of lirc
[21:40:35] kormoc: okay then...
[21:41:34] Gibby: also a ls -al /dev/lirc* shows /dev/lirc0 which i am using... i am confused on /dev/lircd pointing to /var/run/lirc/lircd
[21:41:57] kormoc: like I said, lirc != lircd
[21:42:27] kormoc: one is a socket to a daemon that handles interactions including sending of commands (lircd) and one is a raw interface to a device
[21:44:28] Gibby: lirc0=raw interface and lircd is the daemon socket right?
[21:44:38] kormoc: yes
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[21:46:21] Gibby: my /etc/lirc/hardware.conf lists my blaster as TRANSMITTER_DEVICE="/dev/lirc0" which is the raw device.... if i use that as my --device in irsend i get those errors... if i use /dev/lircd for --device in irsend it returns nothing so i thought it was working however it does not change the channels so i checked the blaster with a camera and it is not doing anything
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[21:53:13] lenswipe|debian: hey guys
[21:53:25] darkdrgn2k: hey, where do you configure the VIDEO output (ie: OpenGL etc)
[21:53:28] lenswipe|debian: can someone help me? im running setup mythtv backend and when it opens everything is so small i cant see it
[21:53:33] lenswipe|debian: like tiny
[21:56:14] darkdrgn2k: lenswipe|debian: fonts missing?
[21:56:48] darkdrgn2k: are they part of the TV playback profiles?
[21:57:52] lenswipe|debian: idk
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[21:58:01] lenswipe|debian: idk
[21:58:10] lenswipe|debian: how do i check to see if the fonts are installed
[22:01:45] Gibby: kormoc: it helps if i plug the blaster in and not the receiver.....
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[22:28:02] lenswipe|ill: heyguys im back
[22:28:16] lenswipe|ill: remember i said everythiong was small when i went into mythtv backend config?
[22:28:16] lenswipe|ill: http://imagebin.ca/view/gXhB7uqK.html
[22:28:17] Gibby: ok, so i got it so it is now sending the signal and i see the ir flash when it transmits just have to get the configuration right i guess
[22:28:18] lenswipe|ill: thats what i mean
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[22:36:32] lenswipe|ill: guys?
[22:36:33] sphery: lenswipe|ill: youneed to update your version
[22:36:34] lenswipe|ill: everything is tiny
[22:36:39] lenswipe|ill: sphery, hmm?
[22:36:41] lenswipe|ill: how?
[22:36:41] sphery: which distro?
[22:36:50] lenswipe|ill: debian
[22:36:58] lenswipe|ill: this one was grabbed from debian-multimedia.org
[22:37:05] sphery: please pastebin the output of: mythbackend --version
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[22:37:57] lenswipe|ill: http://pastebin.com/EEmk9spi
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[22:40:53] sphery: lenswipe|ill: yeah, that's a (known-broken) pre-0.23-release version.
[22:41:33] lenswipe|ill: right
[22:41:40] lenswipe|ill: so where can i grab a stable version for debian?
[22:41:57] sphery: lenswipe|ill: oh, wait, that doesn't have the version info
[22:42:08] lenswipe|ill: i dont want to build from the tarball because that opens a whole new can of worms
[22:43:29] sphery: it says 0.23.1, which probably implies revision 25397, which implies you have the fix for that issue
[22:44:38] lenswipe|ill: right
[22:44:46] lenswipe|ill: so how do i fix this then?
[22:44:55] lenswipe|ill: because i cant read any of the mythtv GUI
[22:45:03] lenswipe|ill: its the same on all my other machines
[22:45:07] lenswipe|ill: they have this issue too
[22:48:05] sphery: fix the code that's causing MythTV to set a font size to 0 (the one that's causing all those errors in your log that say you can't set the font size to 0)
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[22:48:39] lenswipe|ill: what?
[22:48:41] lenswipe|ill: fix the code?
[22:48:44] lenswipe|ill: ?!?
[22:48:48] sphery: that's the only way to fix the problem
[22:48:51] lenswipe|ill: right
[22:49:08] lenswipe|ill: so because the coders of mythtv made a bollocks of it i have to absorb that?
[22:49:09] lenswipe|ill: screw that
[22:49:25] sphery: no, you're welcome to choose not to use MythTV
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[22:49:40] sphery: or you're welcome to fix it since it seems to be a bigger concern for you than for me
[22:50:05] lenswipe|ill: i just dont see the logic behind releaseing a product (mythtv) that doesnt work
[22:50:09] lenswipe|ill: it seems like a complete waste of time
[22:50:15] sphery: or you're welcome to be patient until someone who is spending a significant portion of his free time writing this code /and/ letting you use it for free to get around to fixing it
[22:50:24] sphery: lenswipe|ill: yes, it is a complete waste of my time
[22:50:29] sphery: and thanks for the reminder
[22:50:42] lenswipe|ill: ....?
[22:50:42] sphery: really encourages me to go fix *your* problem
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[22:50:53] lenswipe|ill: sphery, im not criticising you
[22:50:55] lenswipe|ill: im just sayin
[22:51:05] lenswipe|ill: it seems pointless to release something that doesnt work
[22:51:06] sphery: well, a) MythTV is /not/ a product
[22:51:12] lenswipe|ill: well what is it then
[22:51:14] sphery: b) it's all done by people who are doing it for fun
[22:51:23] lenswipe|ill: sphery, you mis-understand me
[22:51:31] sphery: c) the source code is available so if someone finds a problem, they can fix it themselves
[22:51:45] sphery: but then again, I'm not in a good mood right now, so feel free to ignore me
[22:51:52] lenswipe|ill: im just expressing lack of understanding for why "people who are doing it for fun" are releasing something that doesnt work
[22:52:02] lenswipe|ill: and im not in the best mood either
[22:52:05] lenswipe|ill: so same applies here
[22:52:08] iamlindoro: It works just fine for those working on it
[22:52:16] lenswipe|ill: ...right
[22:52:24] lenswipe|ill: seemingly thats the best way to code
[22:52:26] iamlindoro: Fringe cases occur, adn the beauty of open source is that those people can then submit patches for their issues
[22:52:32] lenswipe|ill: i gotta remember that in my next web app :)
[22:52:35] iamlindoro: for the greater good of us all
[22:52:46] lenswipe|ill: "yes i know <<clients name>> it doesnt work for you, but it works for me and thats whats important"
[22:53:02] iamlindoro: lenswipe|ill, Well what answer would make you happy? We can only fix bugs we see/get detailsed reports about
[22:53:10] lenswipe|ill: so how do i submit a bug report?
[22:53:21] kormoc: lenswipe|ill, svn.mythtv.org/trac
[22:53:24] lenswipe|ill: ty
[22:53:26] sphery: lenswipe|ill: when I start to receive your paycheck for the time I put into MythTV, I promise to be more professional about my customer service :)
[22:53:33] iamlindoro: svn.mythtv.org. Read the ticket howto carefully, and then submit a report as described in it
[22:53:52] iamlindoro: Then promptly respond to all requests for information
[22:54:07] iamlindoro: bearing in mind that the guy you just ran your mouth off to would have been the most likely guy to fix it
[22:54:27] sphery: (someone even booted his dev box to look into it)
[22:54:58] iamlindoro: sphery, That said, this isn't worth a bug report
[22:55:10] iamlindoro: since this is yet again the broken theme install nonsense
[22:55:15] iamlindoro: ie, user/packager error
[22:55:15] sphery: lenswipe|ill: in the mean time, just create a config.xml or mysql.txt that properly points to your database
[22:55:23] iamlindoro: same as the last guy with debian multimedia
[22:55:33] lenswipe|ill: hmm
[22:55:46] lenswipe|ill: you recon id be better getting a theme from the offical mythtv site?
[22:56:19] sphery: the problem is likely that it's popping up the pre-theme backend/database configuration prompt, but because there's no theme, the UI is not properly displayed
[22:56:20] lenswipe|ill: i grabbed this from debian-multimedia.org
[22:56:30] lenswipe|ill: right...yeah
[22:56:33] sphery: so if you just create a config.xml or mysql.txt file that points to your DB, all will work
[22:56:47] lenswipe|ill: okay
[22:56:52] lenswipe|ill: how do i go about doing that?
[22:56:55] lenswipe|ill: and where do i put it?
[22:57:30] xris: kenni: yeah. though it was Pedersen before my great grandfather moved to the US
[22:57:45] xris: he changed the spelling so people would pronounce it properly
[22:58:11] kenni: hehe, we have tons of both Pedersen and Petersen around here
[22:58:28] lenswipe|ill: kenni, i know a petersen
[22:58:43] xris: yeah. I had a long layover in copenhagen about 12 years ago and it was the first time I was ever in a foreign country where everyone looked just like me.
[22:59:03] kenni: hahahahahaaa
[22:59:18] kenni: looking good in other words
[22:59:26] xris: walked into a bakery looking VERY american (shorts and ratty tshirt on a cold day, since I was coming from Israel and was expecting a very short layover).. and the gal still spoke to me in danish
[22:59:54] kenni: that's quite funny
[22:59:58] xris: I thought so..
[23:00:21] xris: it's good that I speak enough german to get the basics, read menus, etc. and most people in europe speak english.
[23:00:25] kenni: and if it was your great grandfather it still a few generations
[23:00:47] lenswipe|ill: sphery, so how do i go about creating that config file?
[23:01:15] xris: yeah, but my dad's side is all danish descent.
[23:01:36] kenni: but your dad was born in the US?
[23:01:46] xris: yeah, and grandparents
[23:03:22] xris: still seems like a nice country to go back to and learn more about. or settle.. would be nice to live outside of the US again
[23:03:40] sphery: lenswipe|ill: can you first pastebin the setup.log from: mythtv-setup 2>&1 | tee ~/setup.log
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[23:07:07] lenswipe|ill: sphery, i think i might have just found the error
[23:07:08] lenswipe|ill: Access denied for user 'mythtv'@'localhost' (using password: YES)
[23:07:37] lenswipe|ill: sphery, http://pastebin.com/nweA33Yd
[23:07:37] lenswipe|ill: bu
[23:07:42] lenswipe|ill: but theres the whole thing incase not
[23:08:12] sphery: lenswipe|ill: yeah, if the issue is what I expect, it will only occur when a) you don't have a DB config file (mysql.txt or config.xml) and b) your DB is not running at localhost (or uses a non-default username/password)
[23:09:10] lenswipe|ill: my db is running at localhost and does use the default username/password
[23:09:14] sphery: I just deleted my database and am attempting to reproduce (but am being very deliberate in my steps so I don't break my production database)
[23:09:21] lenswipe|ill: okay
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[23:10:10] sphery: (though I"m pretty sure the dev box can't break the real database--because my MySQL security prevents it--but it's still a bit nerve wracking :)
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[23:10:45] sphery: lenswipe|ill: and you go the same broken UI that time, right (when you made that log file)?
[23:11:30] sphery: this is also worrying: #
[23:11:31] sphery: 2010-09–16 00:06:40.286 get_ip: No address associated with hostname
[23:11:34] kenni: xris: Well, it's kinda cold most of the year, but except from that, I'm quite pleased with staying here. Where have you lived outside of the US?
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[23:12:01] kenni: (I'll have to go to bed in a few minutes, though, it's night over here)
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[23:12:58] sphery: xris: Did you see the discussion earlier about mythlink.pl? Seems that a user in Germany who's running in a de_De.utf8 locale is getting corruption of the non-ASCII characters in the filenames created by the Perl symlink command. Do you know of some issue with Perl that would cause that or ...?
[23:13:59] sphery: lenswipe|ill: :( I'm having a hard to reproducing it
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[23:15:19] lenswipe|ill: hmmm
[23:15:19] lenswipe|ill: :/
[23:15:46] lenswipe|ill: sphery, where do i create the database configuration file?
[23:15:49] lenswipe|ill: and how
[23:15:56] lenswipe|ill: im gonna try making one of those and see if that helps
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[23:16:18] sphery: lenswipe|ill: can you do me a favor and see if you have the Terra theme installed? probably in /usr/share/mythtv/themes/Terra (maybe in /usr/local, instead)
[23:16:44] lenswipe|ill: okay
[23:17:19] kenni: xris: I'm off for today, talk to you some other day :)
[23:17:22] lenswipe|ill: sphery, i dont see a folder called Terra
[23:17:34] lenswipe|ill: oh wait
[23:17:35] lenswipe|ill: yeah i do
[23:17:38] lenswipe|ill: yeah i have it
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[23:19:53] sphery: lenswipe|ill: something like: http://mythtv.pastebin.com/6e1XZNDE (but fix DB hostname/username/password, as appropriate). Put it in $HOME/.mythtv for *every* user that runs MythTV applications
[23:20:18] sphery: I'm thinking this bug doesn't exist in trunk and may require my compiling and switching my dev box to 0.23-fixes
[23:20:46] lenswipe|ill: okay
[23:20:58] lenswipe|ill: i can link you to where i got the download if you like
[23:21:16] sphery: no, that's ok... I'll need to compile it to test fixes, anyway
[23:21:17] sphery: thanks, though
[23:21:52] lenswipe|ill: ok
[23:22:45] lenswipe|ill: sphery, do i need to create the mythtv mysql user and stuff?
[23:22:49] lenswipe|ill: or does it do that for me?
[23:23:54] sphery: your packages probably created the database, but I can't tell you what user/password it's using
[23:24:08] sphery: the mythtv/mythtv/mythconverg are the defaults we use
[23:24:27] sphery: but it's likely you have a different password--I just don't know where you'll find it
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[23:24:30] lenswipe|ill: sphery, well it asked for the mysql root password
[23:24:44] sphery: what did?
[23:24:44] lenswipe|ill: sphery, i gave it said password and it took it and went away quite happily
[23:24:50] lenswipe|ill: sphery, the mythtv installer
[23:25:09] sphery: ah, ok, so the package-installer-thingy did
[23:25:25] sphery: yeah, that means it likely created the database and some user for it
[23:25:30] lenswipe|ill: yeah
[23:25:33] lenswipe|ill: lemme check..
[23:25:39] sphery: now it's just a matter of figuring out which user/password :)
[23:26:10] lenswipe|ill: sphery, it created one called mythconverg
[23:26:10] xris: sphery: didn't hear discussion of that particular bug. only thing I can think of is perl not being configured to create the symlinks in utf8 mode.
[23:26:12] lenswipe|ill: is that the one i need
[23:26:25] lenswipe|ill: theres no database called mythtv though
[23:26:26] xris: sphery: as in db returns data in latin1, perl writes in latin1...
[23:26:37] xris: but if wagnerrp wants to rewrite it in python, I don't care...
[23:26:38] sphery: lenswipe|ill: as a first guess, I'd recommend trying your (non-root) user system password with: mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg
[23:27:02] lenswipe|ill: my non root system password?
[23:27:08] lenswipe|ill: you mean like the login for my user account
[23:27:41] sphery: xris: yeah, he has an almost direct re-implementation of the name-formatting mechanism in python bindings, already, so it's just the rest of the options, etc., and the actual looping/link creation code he'd be working
[23:27:47] lenswipe|ill: sphery, nope its not my system password
[23:28:02] lenswipe|ill: lmao
[23:28:04] lenswipe|ill: its mythtv
[23:28:05] sphery: I just thought that since the Python bindings are in a pretty good state and tend to be very well maintained right now, switching to Python may make sense
[23:28:15] sphery: lenswipe|ill: strange--since that's the deafult
[23:28:15] lenswipe|ill: ERROR 1045 (28000): Access denied for user 'mythtv'@'localhost' (using password: YES)
[23:28:17] lenswipe|ill: ...or not
[23:28:52] sphery: lenswipe|ill: does the mysql command line client approach I mentioned work with mythtv? mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg
[23:28:56] wagnerrp: xris: i have no /need/ to
[23:28:59] sphery: then typing in mythtv
[23:29:10] lenswipe|ill: sphery, it asks for a password – i input mythtv it rejects it
[23:29:12] wagnerrp: i was just implying it would be fairly easy, most of it is implemented directly in the bindings
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[23:29:54] lenswipe|ill: sphery, where?
[23:30:00] lenswipe|ill: sphery, for the password?
[23:30:03] lenswipe|ill: yeah i tried that
[23:30:04] sphery: wagnerrp: are you pretty certain you could make it use non-ASCII characters on properly-configured systems? If not, it's mostly a sideways project
[23:30:04] lenswipe|ill: it rejects it
[23:30:21] sphery: but if you can, it would save figuring out why it's not working with Perl
[23:30:25] wagnerrp: i have no idea, to be honest
[23:30:33] wagnerrp: right now, i assume it would
[23:30:49] sphery: then again, it's possible that the user's system was misconfigured (and it's /very/ likely I have no clue where else you need to configure things since I just use ASCII chars in mine)
[23:30:54] wagnerrp: i could strip all the command line options, and have something basic working in ~5min to test
[23:31:00] sphery: your call
[23:31:18] sphery: either that or just write a quick python command to create some symlink with a hardcoded name
[23:31:30] sphery: finding a good tester may be the big challenge :)
[23:31:43] wagnerrp: it should be in your .cshrc or .bashrc
[23:32:20] sphery: that's just the LC_ALL/LANG type stuff, right?
[23:32:29] wagnerrp: LANG="en_US.UTF-8"
[23:32:37] sphery: yeah, he had that set properly
[23:32:40] wagnerrp: that should set everything else
[23:32:43] sphery: I actually checked that first
[23:32:51] sphery: (using the locale command)
[23:33:41] sphery: I think the kernel can be compiled such that the file systems use different char encodings, too
[23:33:58] sphery: CONFIG_NLS_ stuff
[23:34:03] lenswipe|ill: sphery, is this my bug you're discussing?
[23:34:09] sphery: no, different one, now
[23:34:14] lenswipe|ill: ah
[23:34:24] lenswipe|ill: any thoughts on this bug?
[23:34:35] sphery: yours seems to be down to needing to find the password the package-installer-thingy used :)
[23:34:59] lenswipe|ill: ah right so if i change the database password that should work?
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[23:35:37] sphery: your options are to a) find someone who knows the debian installer and ask them, b) read any upgrade notes, package info the packager provides and hope it says, c) just change the GRANTs in mysql, d) other things I haven't considered?
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[23:41:20] lenswipe|ill: sphery, ok thats it working
[23:41:52] lenswipe|ill: sphery, btw how do i get mythtv to scan my computer and populate the databse with my music?
[23:41:55] sphery: lenswipe|ill: so, once you had the proper DB connection info, it didn't do the bad UI thing?
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[23:42:08] lenswipe|ill: sphery, nope
[23:42:10] lenswipe|ill: that fixed it
[23:42:12] lenswipe|ill: thanks
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[23:42:32] sphery: great... so that confirms my hypothesis... Now if I can just reproduce it so I can test the fix for it
[23:42:39] lenswipe|ill: heh
[23:44:15] sphery: seems deleting my DB isn't enough...
[23:44:36] kormoc: sphery, try removing the grant
[23:44:37] sphery: or it's just 0.23-fixes...
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[23:45:10] sphery: kormoc: it's times like these when I think my policy of no one (not me and not my computer) knowing the MySQL root password is annoying :)
[23:45:30] kormoc: hehe
[23:46:02] sphery: so, do I need to do a REVOKE (which requires identical privilege/host/username info, right?) or can I just delete from users
[23:46:18] kormoc: just delete from users and flush perms;
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[23:46:31] kormoc: and you can restart mysql with --skip-grant-tables and get root perms
[23:47:51] sphery: yeah, I just use an --init-file that does SET PASSWORD
[23:49:34] wagnerrp: bah... stupid thing keeps failing on code that is bypassed and isnt even supposed to run
[23:49:42] sphery: ok, so now a 1045 error, like his, instead of a 1049
[23:49:43] wagnerrp: stupid interpreter doing syntax checking
[23:50:08] lenswipe|ill: sphery, its asking me to create a recordings directory or somethig
[23:50:14] lenswipe|ill: sphery, whats it asking for exactly?>
[23:50:34] sphery: OK, so still can't repro, so I'm guessing it's 0.23-fixes only (and, likely, stuartm fixed it in trunk with the Locale chooser)
[23:50:56] sphery: lenswipe|ill: the directory to which you plan to have MythTV write all TV recording files
[23:51:00] sphery: (or directories)
[23:51:14] sphery: just create a Default storage group and list one or more directories in it
[23:51:16] wagnerrp: oh wow... these are some old bindings ive got installed on this machine
[23:51:28] lenswipe|ill: sphery, im not gonna make recordings can i get away without making one
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[23:51:31] sphery: and make sure those directories aren't mount point directories
[23:52:03] lenswipe|ill: how about just
[23:52:06] lenswipe|ill: mythtv/stuff
[23:52:08] sphery: lenswipe|ill: you'll still need a Default storage group with one valid/writable directory in it for things to work properly, so just point it to some directory on a file system with some space
[23:52:17] lenswipe|ill: okay
[23:52:27] lenswipe|ill: if the directory doesnt exist will mythtv create it?
[23:52:32] sphery: lenswipe|ill: for MythVideo stuff, see http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythVideo (it will talk you through setting that up)
[23:52:55] sphery: no, it doesn't create it... You'd need to do that yourself (setting owner/group, and permissions appropriately)
[23:53:03] drindt (drindt!~drindt@89.204.137.64) has joined #mythtv-users
[23:53:08] sphery: also, check if your system already has a /var/lib/mythtv directory
[23:53:26] sphery: it might have something like /var/lib/mythtv or /var/lib/mythtv/recordings that the package set up for you
[23:53:48] sphery: (pretty sure debian uses /var/lib --if not, might want to check /srv/mythtv )
[23:54:00] lenswipe|ill: okay
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[23:54:14] lenswipe|ill: sphery, so do the owner and group perms need to be me?
[23:54:44] lenswipe|ill: sphery, if i told you what i was trying to do, maybe youd better understand my problem
[23:55:00] lenswipe|ill: sphery, i have a machine that has all my music on it, i want it to run as a media server
[23:55:00] ** Beirdo yawns mightily **
[23:55:02] sphery: lenswipe|ill: the directory should be readable and writable by the users running mythfrontend and mythbackend
[23:55:11] lenswipe|ill: i want to connect to it with another machine and stream stuff
[23:55:17] sphery: the music stuff is done through mythfrontend setting
[23:55:19] lenswipe|ill: i dont want to do any recording or TV watching
[23:55:34] lenswipe|ill: sphery, right but i have to configure mythbackend on the media server
[23:55:41] aSingularity (aSingularity!~bj@c-98-235-217-22.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) has left #mythtv-users ("Leaving")
[23:55:48] Beirdo: then mythtv really isn't the right match
[23:56:19] Beirdo: there are UPnP servers out there that would make a much closer match for your described use
[23:56:27] sphery: that's very true
[23:56:52] sphery: but basically what I meant is that the configuration you're doing now won't affect or be affected by the music needs
[23:57:04] Beirdo: it would be kinda like buying a Porsche 911 and using it as a golf card
[23:57:08] Beirdo: cart rather
[23:57:37] sphery: and MythMusic is currently undergoing a major rewrite, and the old version probably leaves a bit to be desired
[23:58:03] JJ1 (JJ1!~jjensen@jeffjensen.dsl.visi.com) has joined #mythtv-users
[23:58:29] wagnerrp: woo! mythlink.pl (partially) rewritten in 17 lines
[23:58:50] lenswipe|ill: Beirdo, so what UPnP servers are there out there?
[23:58:55] kormoc: wagnerrp, if it was perl, it could be done in one command line! (one very long command line)
[23:58:56] lenswipe|ill: that would serve my needs that is
[23:59:08] Beirdo: !url lmgtfy upnp linux
[23:59:08] MythLogBot: lmgtfy: http://lmgtfy.com?q=upnp%20linux
[23:59:16] kormoc: http://www.fireflymediaserver.org/ is common
[23:59:36] Beirdo: there are so many out there with varying capabilities
[23:59:41] sphery: good news, all... My testing didn't affect my production DB or backend (in spite of the UPnP hitting the production backend)
[23:59:56] wagnerrp: woo! mythlink.pl (partially) rewritten in 630 characters

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