| Tuesday, April 13th, 2010, 00:01 UTC | ||
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| [00:03:52] | nichos: | Hi all, ive been using myth for a few days now and had some questions – first, can myth be set to grab any tuner to record rather than bothering me while I'm watching something on that tuner? |
| [00:04:13] | wagnerrp: | recording is the primary task |
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| [00:04:21] | wagnerrp: | you can set livetv to 'avoid conflicts' |
| [00:04:26] | nichos: | so it goes on the "primary" receiver |
| [00:04:29] | wagnerrp: | in which case it will pull the bottom most tuner |
| [00:04:33] | wagnerrp: | rather than the topmost |
| [00:05:23] | nichos: | wagnerrp: what do you mean by set liveTV? |
| [00:06:02] | wagnerrp: | you are watching something straight off a tuner... livetv |
| [00:06:16] | kormoc: | nichos: it's a option you can set |
| [00:06:18] | wagnerrp: | there is an option to tell 'livetv' mode to record off the recorder at the bottom of the list |
| [00:06:32] | nichos: | oh ok, gotcha |
| [00:06:33] | wagnerrp: | while scheduled recordings will always pull off the top of the list |
| [00:06:38] | nichos: | i'll play with that |
| [00:07:01] | nichos: | 2nd, my tuners are 4 & 5, is that an issue (rather than 0 and 1)? I'm not sure how it happened |
| [00:07:07] | nichos: | probably when I was setting things up:) |
| [00:07:31] | kormoc: | not a problem |
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| [00:07:41] | wagnerrp: | only matters to you, mythtv doesnt care |
| [00:07:48] | wagnerrp: | if you want to reset that to make it 'cleaner' |
| [00:07:58] | wagnerrp: | you have to 'delete all tuners' in mythtv-setup |
| [00:08:06] | nichos: | hehe, ok, not worth it:) |
| [00:08:50] | nichos: | FINALLY, when i switch inputs in the menu (using m) it works fine, that key is bound to "C" but pressing that, only displays the current input, does not swap between the 2 inputs |
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| [00:23:48] | sphery: | nichos: no, C is something else |
| [00:24:29] | sphery: | C is NEXTINPUT and only switches inputs on the same card |
| [00:24:40] | nichos: | sphery: OK |
| [00:24:41] | sphery: | nichos: you need to map a key to NEXTCARD if you want to switch cards |
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| [00:25:16] | nichos: | sphery: it's the hauppauge 2250, 1 input, 2 tuners |
| [00:25:29] | nichos: | let me try that... |
| [00:25:43] | sphery: | nichos: no, the 2250 is 2 cards, according to MythTV |
| [00:25:47] | sphery: | 2 cards, each having one input |
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| [00:25:56] | iamlindoro: | (logically speaking) |
| [00:26:02] | sphery: | yes, logically |
| [00:26:07] | sphery: | though not real-worldily :) |
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| [00:30:22] | nichos: | sphery: sure enough that works |
| [00:30:38] | nichos: | it didn't seem to work when card 4 was recording |
| [00:31:29] | nichos: | it works when they're both "live" |
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| [00:42:57] | sphery: | nichos: yeah, it will only go to an unused card--LiveTV can never share a card |
| [00:43:35] | nichos: | can i jump to the recording tuner some how/ |
| [00:43:39] | sphery: | (where card means "virtual" card) |
| [00:44:00] | sphery: | You'd have to go to Watch Recordings and then play the recording in progress |
| [00:44:10] | nichos: | ok |
| [00:44:17] | sphery: | should be able to do that with Jump to Recording |
| [00:44:19] | sphery: | In MENU |
| [00:44:24] | sphery: | maybe |
| [00:44:29] | sphery: | (I don't know Live TV) |
| [00:44:32] | nichos: | i'll check that out next recording time:0 |
| [00:44:40] | nichos: | thank you for your help |
| [00:44:43] | sphery: | y/w |
| [00:44:44] | sphery: | enjoy |
| [00:44:56] | nichos: | :) |
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| [01:58:29] | mazda01: | after setting storage group directories for banners, fanarts, coverart, etc. do I have to run mythfilldatabase? it's weird, I jsut ran fill_mythvideo_metedata.pl on my main backend, and it actually removed every single movie from my database. I have to enter mythfrontend again, and hit M to search for changes. am i doing something wrong? |
| [01:58:40] | wagnerrp: | MFD is for guide data only |
| [01:58:52] | wagnerrp: | nothing to do with mythvideo, or the storage groups it uses |
| [01:59:15] | wagnerrp: | additionally, fill_mythvideo_metadata.pl is probably outdated, and will not properly work |
| [01:59:28] | iamlindoro: | And was never a supported script to begin with |
| [02:09:41] | mazda01: | iamlindoro, ok, sorry. can you suggest a mass updater for my library then since I just whiped out all my metadata and videos from the database. i'd hate to haev to hit W on every single tv show, and movie I own. i checked out jamu but it stalled everytime when it was excluding some old .cue and .bin files I have in the video storage group locations. there are about 5 folders within the videos storage group, all frontends have nothing |
| [02:09:41] | mazda01: | entered for all the locations because I thought that's what I am suppose todo |
| [02:10:07] | wagnerrp: | mazda01: you dont have a backup? |
| [02:10:30] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, yes I do. i use the script provided with .22 |
| [02:10:38] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, backup script i meant |
| [02:10:49] | wagnerrp: | you cant just pull the necessary tables from there? |
| [02:11:34] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, but a lot of my movies and i never had my tv shows in there before. haveing to hit W on all those newly added tv episodes i just figured there'd be a moer efficient mass update way |
| [02:11:47] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, i dont know mysql that well to pull and replace tables |
| [02:11:52] | wagnerrp: | you can try JAMU |
| [02:12:31] | wagnerrp: | what version of mythtv are you running? |
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| [02:14:14] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, .23-fixes. i get this when running jamu from main backend. ! Warning – Failed to connect to backend at 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:14:25] | mazda01: | ! Error: Jamu must be run on a MythTV backend. Local host (dell) is not a MythTV backend. |
| [02:14:42] | wagnerrp: | well... are you running JAMU on your backend? |
| [02:15:12] | mazda01: | yes |
| [02:15:25] | wagnerrp: | and your backend is running? |
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| [02:15:30] | wagnerrp: | at that address? |
| [02:15:51] | mazda01: | i checked out the config.xml located in my users .mythtv folder and all is good in it. i have checked out the wiki and followed it to the "T". http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Jamu#Steps_to_perf . . . _Mass_Update |
| [02:15:55] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, yes |
| [02:16:06] | mazda01: | inet addr:192.168.0.5 |
| [02:16:22] | wagnerrp: | and your backend is set to listen on that address? |
| [02:16:36] | wagnerrp: | rather than localhost (127.0.0.1)? |
| [02:16:43] | mazda01: | yes, I am at the main backend via SSH and the ip is 192.168.0.5. yes, the main backend per the my.cnf is bind to 192.168.0.5 |
| [02:16:54] | wagnerrp: | my.cnf is a mysql config file |
| [02:16:59] | wagnerrp: | has absolutely nothing to do with mythtv |
| [02:17:07] | mazda01: | bind-address = 192.168.0.5 |
| [02:17:17] | wagnerrp: | still absolutely nothing to do with mythtv |
| [02:17:30] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, sorry, what conf file would you like me show you? |
| [02:17:41] | mazda01: | config.xml? |
| [02:17:44] | wagnerrp: | first page, first option, mythtv-setup |
| [02:18:29] | wagnerrp: | or, you can just change your config.xml to point to 127.0.0.1 |
| [02:18:32] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, correct, it has 192.168.0.5 listed. i can connect just fine from all my frontends, |
| [02:18:45] | wagnerrp: | well then it should be able to connect |
| [02:19:01] | wagnerrp: | open python, and run 'import MythTV; be=MythTV.MythBE()' |
| [02:19:16] | mazda01: | that's what I am so confussed about and was trying to run that other mass updater fill_mythtvideo_metadata.pl |
| [02:19:43] | mazda01: | with the single quotes? |
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| [02:20:20] | wagnerrp: | on, you run what is in the quotes from inside the python interpreter |
| [02:20:27] | wagnerrp: | s/on/no/ |
| [02:21:51] | mazda01: | it says it's using the config.xml located within my user's .mythtv directory and also this: Python Backend Connection: Couldn't connect to backend 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:22:03] | wagnerrp: | thats all? |
| [02:22:17] | mazda01: | File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> |
| [02:22:24] | mazda01: | File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/MythTV/MythBase.py", line 1345, in __init__ |
| [02:22:31] | wagnerrp: | import MythTV; MythTV.MythLog._setlevel('all'); be=MythTV.MythBE() |
| [02:22:33] | mazda01: | self.be = MythBEConn(backend, type, db) |
| [02:22:35] | wagnerrp: | and pastebin the results |
| [02:22:43] | mazda01: | File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/MythTV/MythBase.py", line 1240, in __init__ |
| [02:22:52] | mazda01: | raise MythBEError(MythError.PROTO_CONNECTION, self.host, self.port) |
| [02:23:00] | mazda01: | MythTV.MythBase.MythBEError: Failed to connect to backend at 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:23:18] | wagnerrp: | please dont paste large chunks of text in here either |
| [02:23:20] | wagnerrp: | two lines maximum |
| [02:24:10] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, sorry. >>> import MythTV; MythTV.MythLog._setlevel('all'); be=MythTV.MythBE() |
| [02:24:10] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.192 Python Database Connection: Using connection settings from /home/daniel/.mythtv/config.xml |
| [02:24:10] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.192 Python Database Connection: Loading existing connection — {'DBUserName': 'mythtv', 'DBPort': 3306, 'SecurityPin': 0, 'DBPassword': 'qWDt7YiQ', 'DBName': 'mythconverg', 'DBHostName': '192.168.0.5'} |
| [02:24:11] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.193 Python Database Connection: Using connection settings from /home/daniel/.mythtv/config.xml |
| [02:24:14] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.193 Python Database Connection: Loading existing connection — {'DBUserName': 'mythtv', 'DBPort': 3306, 'SecurityPin': 0, 'DBPassword': 'qWDt7YiQ', 'DBName': 'mythconverg', 'DBHostName': '192.168.0.5'} |
| [02:24:17] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.193 Python Backend Connection: Connecting to backend 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:24:19] | mazda01: | 2010-04–12 21:23:13.193 Python Backend Connection: Couldn't connect to backend 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:24:21] | mazda01: | Traceback (most recent call last): |
| [02:24:21] | wagnerrp: | gah... i told you to pastebin |
| [02:24:23] | mazda01: | File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> |
| [02:24:25] | mazda01: | File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/MythTV/MythBase.py", line 1345, in __init__ |
| [02:24:27] | mazda01: | self.be = MythBEConn(backend, type, db) |
| [02:24:29] | mazda01: | File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/MythTV/MythBase.py", line 1240, in __init__ |
| [02:24:31] | mazda01: | raise MythBEError(MythError.PROTO_CONNECTION, self.host, self.port) |
| [02:24:32] | wagnerrp: | mythtv.pastebin.ca |
| [02:24:33] | mazda01: | MythTV.MythBase.MythBEError: Failed to connect to backend at 192.168.0.5:6543 |
| [02:24:35] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, I am SO SORRY. I copied the pastebin link |
| [02:24:39] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, i did copy the pastebin link and thought it would paste that |
| [02:24:47] | mazda01: | http://pastebin.com/pjSNFh8G |
| [02:25:02] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, I am sorry |
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| [02:25:31] | wagnerrp: | i wouldnt have minded if you redacted your database password either |
| [02:25:44] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, oh well. |
| [02:26:01] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, so am i missing something easy? |
| [02:26:11] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, cause all that info is spot on |
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| [02:27:09] | wagnerrp: | it should have logged more than that |
| [02:27:16] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, nope |
| [02:27:16] | wagnerrp: | database queries, socket information |
| [02:27:57] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, i wish i knew more. that's all it spit out |
| [02:31:11] | wagnerrp: | those lines work as intended on my end |
| [02:31:18] | wagnerrp: | no idea why it wouldnt be logging more |
| [02:31:39] | mazda01: | cause it's failing connection to database i am guessing |
| [02:31:55] | wagnerrp: | it connected to the database just fine |
| [02:32:07] | wagnerrp: | otherwise it wouldnt know where your backend was to try to connect to it |
| [02:33:48] | mazda01: | wagnerrp, i don't know what was up but I entered the mythtv-setup again, and for some reason the password was changed to default mythtv, i chnged it back to my real password and now all is well with jamu. thanks |
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| [02:42:56] | mag0o: | yay, refurb revo 1600 + 3 hdmi cables for $195 from amazon |
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| [03:03:07] | sphery: | clever / skd5aner : You'll want to update to r24110 or higher. Just fixed preview generation. |
| [03:03:39] | sphery: | skd5aner: If it turns out that [24110] fixes http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8341 , please add an update to the ticket so we can close it. Thanks. |
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| [03:10:18] | mrand: | sphery: with your push to get people to stop touching their own database, I'm sure this will make you happy http://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.ph . . . eb0c5b25608b |
| [03:11:23] | sphery: | ugggh!!! |
| [03:11:54] | mrand: | If that isn't motivation for improved channel scanner instructions, I don't know what is. |
| [03:12:13] | sphery: | we need to get the scanner working better/better documented/more intuive |
| [03:12:21] | sphery: | /more idiot-proof |
| [03:12:25] | sphery: | oops... did I send that |
| [03:12:29] | mrand: | ^^^^ true. |
| [03:12:42] | wagnerrp: | the web_lineup doesnt provide sufficient data for tuning |
| [03:13:28] | mrand: | I use a cable box + SD, so I do'nt know the first thing about channel scanning/import – which makes me near useless on this topic. |
| [03:13:36] | wagnerrp: | how can i just delete this whole thing? |
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| [03:13:52] | mrand: | And I don't know where to point people. |
| [03:14:13] | mrand: | wagnerrp: /quit ;-) |
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| [03:15:09] | wagnerrp: | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGpyLsKVgho... see 2:26 in |
| [03:15:43] | sphery: | wagnerrp: the only time I could see that being sufficient is for analog recorders--where you shouldn't be scanning, anyway |
| [03:16:02] | wagnerrp: | nor should you be using a HDHR |
| [03:16:13] | sphery: | ah, yeah, hdhr wouldn't be analog |
| [03:16:18] | sphery: | no idea what they're doing |
| [03:16:49] | sphery: | wagnerrp: getting a not available |
| [03:16:57] | sphery: | did you just upload it or something? |
| [03:17:40] | wagnerrp: | that would be a 'g' for the first character, not 'q' |
| [03:17:55] | sphery: | ah, it's wagnerrp DRM :) |
| [03:18:58] | wagnerrp: | protecting your from your content, by mistyping the youtube hashes since 2005 |
| [03:19:49] | clever: | it was more likely the ... |
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| [03:50:16] | coop: | I've been looking at the hd-pvr and see the obvious benefits...what drawbacks may I not be seeing? |
| [03:50:38] | [R]: | coop: its got issues... tons of people talk about it on the mailnig lists |
| [03:50:48] | [R]: | coop: for the most part its awesoeme |
| [03:51:33] | coop: | [R]: issues with support in myth, or otherwise? Yeah, it looks great on paper |
| [03:51:47] | wagnerrp: | coop: cost, and high requirements for decoding |
| [03:52:13] | [R]: | coop: issues with the hardware itself |
| [03:52:18] | [R]: | linux and myth it works great |
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| [03:52:44] | coop: | wagnerrp: due to h.264 I'm assuming? |
| [03:53:06] | wagnerrp: | due to fairly high bitrate single sliced h264 |
| [03:53:16] | wagnerrp: | that single slice means you cant use multiple cores/processors to help out |
| [03:53:47] | coop: | right...does vdpau alleviate the stress at all? |
| [03:53:54] | wagnerrp: | which puts you at maybe 2.3GHz Core-i, 2.5GHz Core2, or 3GHz AMD64 |
| [03:53:56] | coop: | my planned frontend is an ion build |
| [03:54:01] | wagnerrp: | vdpau can offload processing completely |
| [03:54:10] | [R]: | my ion works perfectly with hdpvr content |
| [03:54:31] | coop: | ahh good to hear, that's what I had read as well |
| [03:55:11] | coop: | [R]: in terms of hardware issues – anything besides overheating? |
| [03:55:44] | wagnerrp: | there is some bug with certain STBs |
| [03:55:59] | [R]: | sometimes it just dies |
| [03:56:02] | [R]: | and has to be reset |
| [03:56:16] | wagnerrp: | that they send bad audio/video before actually tuning a channel |
| [03:56:19] | wagnerrp: | causing the hdpvr to lock up |
| [03:56:34] | coop: | I see, guessing I won't know until I plug it in... |
| [03:56:43] | [R]: | if my backend stays on for too long, eventually my hdpvr lcoks up... as long as my backend shuts down, i generally dont have any prloblems |
| [03:57:10] | wagnerrp: | its a shame all the remote power devices ive managed to find want to run full web servers and cost $100+ |
| [03:58:14] | coop: | nightly reboots then, [R]? |
| [03:58:21] | [R]: | coop: my backend shutds down when its idle |
| [03:58:42] | [R]: | wagnerrp: i managed to find some usb thing for $30 |
| [03:58:48] | coop: | very nice |
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| [03:58:55] | wagnerrp: | [R]: and youre using that to power it down? |
| [03:58:58] | [R]: | wagnerrp: nah |
| [03:59:04] | [R]: | wagnerrp: my hdpvr stays on all the time |
| [03:59:06] | wagnerrp: | i assume it doesnt just power itself down when the host disconnects |
| [03:59:15] | wagnerrp: | ah, you just do it manually as needed |
| [03:59:55] | [R]: | i havnet had to in a long while though |
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| [04:27:52] | sphery: | so, it turns out that, in fact, typo's are the mother of invention... From one of my recent wiki changes: "OK, since I made a typo on the page name, it's easier to actually do the TODO to make this a real Perl script than to rename the page." |
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| [04:33:20] | [R]: | surround sound really freaks me out |
| [04:33:27] | [R]: | i always think one of my neighbors is playing loud music |
| [04:36:29] | Beirdo: | hheh |
| [04:36:59] | [R]: | it was REALLY bad when my friends were over and we were playing rock band |
| [04:37:09] | [R]: | cuz i thought my neighbors had turned up their music because ours was so loud |
| [04:37:10] | Beirdo: | muhahahah |
| [04:37:10] | sphery: | hehe: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7883#comment:1 |
| [04:37:20] | sphery: | translation of close message: "You could have been using MythTV for the last 3 months if you asked for help in the right place." |
| [04:37:30] | Beirdo: | heh |
| [04:37:38] | Beirdo: | on a roll are we? |
| [04:38:04] | sphery: | iamlindoro is |
| [04:38:15] | sphery: | I think he's single-handedly finished 0.24 |
| [04:38:20] | Beirdo: | cool |
| [04:38:27] | Beirdo: | saved us the trouble? |
| [04:38:41] | sphery: | if we ever release 0.23, we can just follow it up with 0.24 about 2 min later |
| [04:38:45] | [R]: | lol |
| [04:39:03] | Beirdo: | hehe |
| [04:39:21] | Beirdo: | 0.23 and 0.24rc1 on the same day? |
| [04:39:22] | wagnerrp: | s/if you asked for help in the right place/if you purchased IVTV/ |
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| [04:39:59] | wagnerrp: | im perfectly content with no official release |
| [04:40:06] | Beirdo: | or "if you weren't stupid"? |
| [04:56:40] | Beirdo: | I find myself searching for game shops in Seattle |
| [04:56:42] | Beirdo: | heh |
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| [05:03:58] | sphery: | [mythtv-users] warper program for userjobs |
| [05:04:02] | sphery: | warper? |
| [05:04:07] | [R]: | wraper? |
| [05:04:10] | [R]: | wrapper* |
| [05:04:20] | ** Beirdo warps the luser ** | |
| [05:04:23] | [R]: | lol |
| [05:04:26] | sphery: | is there a warper program that can take standard out from a program and update the mythtv's data base like mythtranscode or mythcomflag? |
| [05:04:32] | sphery: | double typo, it seems |
| [05:04:34] | [R]: | lol |
| [05:04:43] | [R]: | maybe he wants to warp the data |
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| [05:08:14] | sphery: | Maybe it's just that I don't speak Australian. |
| [05:08:26] | sphery: | Might make more sense after a Fosters or 6. |
| [05:08:30] | wagnerrp: | from what program? |
| [05:08:44] | wagnerrp: | what good is a wrapper if you dont have the program you are intending to design it for? |
| [05:08:56] | sphery: | all he said was the subject and the one line I pasted |
| [05:09:05] | wagnerrp: | yeah... i see that |
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| [05:09:10] | wagnerrp: | just... befuddled |
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| [05:09:55] | sphery: | yeah... if it is wrapper, there's definitely info missing |
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| [05:21:38] | ** wagnerrp has responded to said thread ** | |
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| [05:26:33] | wagnerrp: | thought i would join in with the ticket triage fun... |
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| [05:28:48] | klk: | so I just upgraded my machine from .20.2 to .22, and now every time I start mythfrontend, it wants to upgrade my Video database |
| [05:29:14] | wagnerrp: | have you let it do so? |
| [05:29:17] | klk: | yes |
| [05:29:24] | wagnerrp: | and there were no errors? |
| [05:30:21] | klk: | well now that you mention it |
| [05:30:39] | klk: | mythfrontend starts automatically and i wasnt looking at the logs |
| [05:30:58] | klk: | i get an error about "Table 'mythconverg.videocountry' doesn't exist" |
| [05:31:24] | wagnerrp: | so for some reason, your database does not actually match what the schema would suggest |
| [05:32:25] | klk: | yeah, i just found alot of stuff in the list archives about it |
| [05:33:03] | wagnerrp: | do you have a lot of TV series? |
| [05:33:07] | wagnerrp: | or is it all movies? |
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| [05:39:09] | sphery: | klk: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/406462#406462 is my recommendation |
| [05:39:24] | sphery: | if any part of your schema is broken, your best bet is to recreate it from scratch |
| [05:39:28] | wagnerrp: | flush all and start fresh? |
| [05:39:33] | sphery: | yeah |
| [05:39:35] | wagnerrp: | yep |
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| [05:39:37] | sphery: | all mythvideo stuff |
| [05:39:40] | klk: | yeah thats what I'm doing |
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| [05:39:49] | ** wagnerrp points sphery back at the 'warper' thread ** | |
| [05:39:50] | klk: | I really don't have alot in there anyway so its not a big deal |
| [05:40:05] | sphery: | klk: I can guarantee that the procedure at that particular post works properly |
| [05:40:10] | sphery: | don't know about all the others |
| [05:40:36] | sphery: | wagnerrp: heh, perfect |
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| [07:14:03] | tv-freak: | I have a second hard disc (xfs filesystem) mounted to /media/videos in fstab (noatime,nodiratime,logbufs=8,allocsize=512m). Should MythTV be able to record to it? Permissions was drwxrwxr-x (=0775), owner 1000, group plugdev. |
| [07:14:46] | wagnerrp: | sounds like you screwed up permissions there |
| [07:14:54] | wagnerrp: | its owned by a user that doesnt exist |
| [07:15:12] | wagnerrp: | and i cant think of any sensible reason to have a directory owned by the plugdev group |
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| [07:18:22] | tv-freak: | Ok, do you have suggestions? I really have changed user ids after doing the mount with fstab (because of using the same hd to make backups from other compter). I have changes the owner of /media/videos to my user "1001". |
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| [07:18:43] | wagnerrp: | you have no user 1000, you have no user 1001 |
| [07:18:49] | wagnerrp: | thats why you see a number |
| [07:18:52] | tv-freak: | I hava 1001 |
| [07:18:59] | wagnerrp: | if there were such a user, it would give you the name of the user |
| [07:19:10] | tv-freak: | Is it gives. |
| [07:19:12] | wagnerrp: | unless your user is actually named '1001' |
| [07:19:16] | tv-freak: | Yes it gives. |
| [07:19:19] | wagnerrp: | which is just messed up |
| [07:19:26] | tv-freak: | a name |
| [07:19:37] | tv-freak: | What about the group? |
| [07:19:50] | wagnerrp: | what user runs mythbackend? |
| [07:21:13] | wagnerrp: | ps aux | grep mythbackend | awk '{ print $1 }' |
| [07:21:29] | tv-freak: | mythtv |
| [07:21:48] | wagnerrp: | so the user and group 'mythtv' should own the recording folder |
| [07:22:01] | wagnerrp: | furthermore, you should never record to the root of a mount |
| [07:22:10] | wagnerrp: | you have mounted the disk to /media/videos? |
| [07:22:21] | tv-freak: | yes |
| [07:22:31] | wagnerrp: | then you should record to something like /media/videos/recordings |
| [07:22:43] | tv-freak: | I read about that, but did not understand the reason. |
| [07:22:57] | wagnerrp: | the idea being that if for whatever reason, the disk does not mount |
| [07:23:11] | wagnerrp: | mythtv will simply not find that directory, and subsequently not try to record to it |
| [07:23:20] | wagnerrp: | rather than record to a partition you dont want it to |
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| [07:24:23] | tv-freak: | You mean mythtv could try to record to /media and fill my root? |
| [07:24:59] | wagnerrp: | mythtv has no way of knowing what partition/disk you actually want to record to |
| [07:25:06] | wagnerrp: | it will simply record to whatever directory you give it |
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| [07:30:07] | wagnerrp: | the directory '/media/videos' must exist on your root filesystem in order to be able to mount a disk to it |
| [07:30:33] | wagnerrp: | and mythtv will not check to make sure that /media/videos is a new filesystem, rather than part of root |
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| [07:32:00] | tv-freak: | OK, I try to mkdir /media/videos/recordings and chown mythtv:mythtv to it, thanks! |
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| [07:37:17] | tv-freak: | :) Yes, I'm proceeding. Thanks again. |
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| [08:26:54] | justinh: | heh don't forget to mount yer disks |
| [08:28:17] | ** justinh does the timeWRAP ** | |
| [08:28:34] | justinh: | warper program for userjobs. lol |
| [08:34:25] | justinh: | blimmin eck. here's somebody on an automated home forum, in a 3 bedroomed house.. with 27TB storage, EIGHT xboxes running XBMC.. 13 cctv cameras... WTH?! |
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| [08:35:06] | justinh: | 3x 'Duel 2.4Ghz Opteron servers'. Duel?! |
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| [08:37:44] | justinh: | one server for 'streaming' another for 'storage' and the other for 'automation'. Sheesh if you need 'duel' opterons for ANY kind of home server duty like that... then you're erm... weak of mind |
| [08:41:07] | justinh: | then again.. if they're running Windows.. maybe |
| [08:41:29] | spiffydudex (spiffydudex!~123@66.185.68.122) has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) | |
| [08:41:41] | justinh: | used to work with a guy who used windows on an automation PC.. it would sometimes takes 30 seconds to switch a light on |
| [08:41:58] | justinh: | if he was 'torrenting', even longer |
| [08:42:07] | justinh: | never heard of WAF, apparently |
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| [09:00:39] | ** justinh goes shopping for QProx ICs ** | |
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| [09:52:11] | dfletcher: | hmm I don't want my master backend to have any tuners on it. so do I set up video sources just on the machines that are attached to a tuner? |
| [09:53:50] | dfletcher: | the client PC that's going near my TV doesn't come till tomorrow, setting up my closet server as a bunch of big disks and it'll run mythweb |
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| [10:11:54] | dfletcher: | hrm alright well I went ahead and added my schedules direct account to the master backend, I can always nuke it if it's not needed |
| [10:14:42] | jduggan: | justinh: crazy, eight xboxes? loudness :D |
| [10:16:56] | justinh: | loudness and ugliness |
| [10:17:28] | justinh: | but I thought hang on.. 3 bedrooms.. 8 xboxes... that's like an xbox for every room. bleugh |
| [10:18:35] | justinh: | and 27TB file storage.. erm... that's a teensy bit excessive IMHO |
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| [10:30:54] | jduggan: | yea |
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| [10:49:18] | justinh: | oh no. I just realised something. I could do my whole house audio with one cat5 cable per room.. use 4x SPDIF & just select the source on the amp |
| [10:49:35] | justinh: | 4x stereo signals on one cat5 cable :) |
| [10:50:05] | justinh: | wonder how much cpu 4x USB soundcards would use at once |
| [10:50:24] | jarle: | I have a daily recording that both the frontend and mythweb displays as two identical recordings, however I can only see *ONE* entry for it in the recorded table in the db. How is that possible?? |
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| [10:56:15] | justinh: | shouldn't *be* possible |
| [10:57:16] | jarle: | justinh: thats why I was expecting to see two entries in recorded when I went looking trying to debug this. |
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| [11:37:31] | mazda01: | sometimes my tuner cards show up and sometimes they don't. must be an irq conflict. is there any command i can run after booting into system to re-probe the video card? |
| [11:39:01] | justinh: | erm... irq conflict? in this day & age? :-O |
| [11:39:31] | justinh: | more likely is your tuner devices come up in a different order to how mythbackend expects to see them |
| [11:40:01] | mazda01: | its an ancient dell so yeah, then bios is probably 10 years old |
| [11:40:31] | mazda01: | justinh: well, i am talking about if i show output of ls -l /dev/ | grep video, my pvr-350 isn't there. |
| [11:40:40] | justinh: | ruh? ouch |
| [11:41:07] | justinh: | in my world modules either get loaded or they don't. no *maybe* |
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| [11:44:31] | mazda01: | justinh: well your world isn't v very nice |
| [11:46:17] | justinh: | you think? where you expect stuff to just work & it does? I call that nice |
| [11:47:01] | justinh: | if you have another system you can try the pvr card in I'd do that |
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| [11:47:13] | justinh: | or maybe try a different slot |
| [11:47:29] | justinh: | it might just be time to put the 350 card in the bin :) |
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| [11:47:57] | mazda01: | how do i probe it again, you don't know? |
| [11:48:00] | justinh: | because if it's not being enumerated every time the machine boots, there's something gravely amiss |
| [11:48:31] | justinh: | mazda01: that's the thing. I DO know, but I don't think it'll help in the slightest |
| [11:48:50] | justinh: | because if you don't have to probe it when it works, then doing it after the fact when it doesn't work won't help |
| [11:49:06] | mazda01: | ok |
| [11:49:10] | mazda01: | thanks anyway |
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| [11:49:52] | justinh: | unless you're loading the module in your own script of course.. and something is preventing the script from running |
| [11:50:11] | justinh: | ach well. who cares anyways |
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| [12:05:44] | justinh: | whoah. 12 channel dimmer pack, 400W per channel.. way under £100 |
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| [12:11:46] | GrahamIRC: | Where from Justin? |
| [12:14:24] | justinh: | made by NJD, available from loads of places under £70 |
| [12:14:39] | justinh: | http://www.njd.co.uk/product.aspx?prod=nj942 |
| [12:15:46] | justinh: | that's only a little more than 2 X10 modules costs :) |
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| [12:27:22] | justinh: | oops. 4 amps per channel not 4000W |
| [12:27:26] | justinh: | 400W even |
| [12:27:37] | justinh: | 920W per channel :) |
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| [12:43:24] | Azelphur: | Hi, I'm using MythTV with a hauppage NOVA-S card, It scans fine, it finds alot of channels, but there are alot of channels that are missing |
| [12:43:36] | Azelphur: | Such as BBC News, and a few other free to air channels it should be finding |
| [12:43:54] | Azelphur: | The hardware setup is good because I can plug the same satellite cable into the back of a set top box and it picks up BBC News and such |
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| [12:53:04] | jarle: | Azelphur: try scanning using kaffeine or scan from dvb-utils and see if it works better.. |
| [12:53:23] | Azelphur: | jarle: scan from dvb-utils picks up bbc news and sky news, etc |
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| [12:54:27] | jarle: | Azelphur: 28.8 ? |
| [12:54:42] | Azelphur: | ? |
| [12:54:55] | jarle: | Azelphur: which sat? |
| [12:55:06] | Azelphur: | Astra-28E |
| [12:55:17] | Azelphur: | Just hijacked the cable from the back of my sky box |
| [12:55:44] | justinh: | ahh |
| [12:55:47] | justinh: | minidish |
| [12:55:52] | justinh: | not all tuners are made equal |
| [12:55:58] | Azelphur: | huh? |
| [12:56:16] | Azelphur: | justinh: it can't be hardware – my sky box can pick up these channels |
| [12:56:18] | justinh: | also, scanning dvb-s relies on you putting the right initial transponder details into mythtv-setup |
| [12:56:27] | justinh: | it CAN BE HARDWARE |
| [12:56:32] | Azelphur: | justinh: I've been importing channels.conf |
| [12:56:34] | justinh: | Sky box != dvb-s tuner card |
| [12:56:41] | Azelphur: | ok |
| [12:56:41] | justinh: | stop importing channels.conf |
| [12:56:59] | jarle: | Azelphur: I tune to that sat from Norway and have no problems getting any of those channels in mythtv.. |
| [12:57:08] | Azelphur: | justinh: I tried doing a scan too with numbers I found on the web, but after that didn't get me BBC news and such I've been trying channels.conf |
| [12:57:34] | Azelphur: | *so I've been trying channels.conf, rather |
| [12:57:38] | justinh: | numbers you (cough) found on the web,,, |
| [12:57:39] | Azelphur: | jarle: cool :) |
| [12:57:47] | justinh: | lyngsat ? |
| [12:57:55] | justinh: | or just some clueless bloke's blog page? ;-) |
| [12:58:02] | Azelphur: | I'll take option 2 |
| [12:58:09] | Azelphur: | :x |
| [12:58:16] | justinh: | take the former. more chance of being correct |
| [12:58:41] | jarle: | Azelphur: http://www.lyngsat.com/28east.html |
| [12:59:18] | Azelphur: | ty |
| [12:59:31] | GrahamIRC: | Those dimmers look the biz JustinH |
| [13:00:07] | justinh: | GrahamIRC: yeah only snag is the rewiring necessary to use em |
| [13:00:51] | jarle: | Try scanning on transponder 11954000 Horisontal 27500000 and you should be all set for BBC News |
| [13:01:05] | Azelphur: | jarle: ok :) |
| [13:01:17] | GrahamIRC: | true but I've been thinking that bringing everything back to a central point is the way to go anyway |
| [13:01:36] | GrahamIRC: | never liked the idea of control units burried under floors / in ceilings |
| [13:01:40] | justinh: | GrahamIRC: aye I've just gone structured with my network cables |
| [13:01:49] | Azelphur: | jarle: what should FEC be set to? |
| [13:02:00] | justinh: | Azelphur: try AUTO |
| [13:02:13] | GrahamIRC: | plus if you move it's easy to strip it all out and hardwire it all |
| [13:02:21] | justinh: | or try RTFM in the wiki re 28.2 Astra |
| [13:02:23] | GrahamIRC: | a mate of mine has X10'd his house |
| [13:02:29] | justinh: | X10 is teh suck |
| [13:02:38] | GrahamIRC: | and the units seem to blow from time to time |
| [13:02:38] | justinh: | 10 bits per sec. CFL messes it up |
| [13:02:51] | GrahamIRC: | ok for him cos he lives in a bungalow |
| [13:03:13] | GrahamIRC: | yeah and I also dont like the lack of feedback on x10 |
| [13:03:24] | GrahamIRC: | If I set something I want to know it's set |
| [13:03:27] | justinh: | no feedback on DMX either |
| [13:03:39] | justinh: | but you can send it that many more times than X10 in the same period |
| [13:04:10] | GrahamIRC: | not familiar with DMX |
| [13:04:31] | GrahamIRC: | but I figured if I have centralised wiring then I have many more control options |
| [13:04:37] | GrahamIRC: | and hardwired control options |
| [13:05:08] | jarle: | Azelphur: Auto works just fine, or you could have a look at http://www.lyngsat.com/28east.html, search for 11954. If you look a bit right of BBC you see that the transponder uses 2/3 FEC |
| [13:05:42] | justinh: | GrahamIRC: yeah but I'd be tempted to go with something embedded, NOT PC |
| [13:05:43] | jarle: | Azelphur: You'll learn a lot of stuff about the transponders by looking at lyngsat |
| [13:05:54] | Azelphur: | jarle: cool, yea I'm learning alot just by looking at this page :) |
| [13:06:23] | justinh: | wow. user learns by reading. Shock |
| [13:06:27] | GrahamIRC: | very true – with embedded you can leave it to do it's funky stuff |
| [13:06:46] | Azelphur: | I'm letting a normal full tuned scan complete from 10714 then I'll scan any other transponders it doesn't get, starting with 11954 with BBC News |
| [13:06:47] | GrahamIRC: | I see the sarcasm gland is in full production today Justin lol |
| [13:07:05] | jarle: | Azelphur: but just selecting one of the listed transponders for mythtv to scan for channels should let mythtv find the rest of the transponders by itself.. |
| [13:07:06] | Azelphur: | justinh: yea we do, that's why I came here looking for help / reading material, it's called a support channel bro :) |
| [13:08:21] | Azelphur: | jarle: weird, as I say I'm doing another scan now on 10714000 horizontal 22000000 5/6 and I'm getting most channels but not all |
| [13:08:56] | justinh: | bro? |
| [13:08:58] | justinh: | pfft |
| [13:08:59] | jarle: | Azelphur: however I am not very impressed by mythtv's 0.22 channel scanner, you might end up with a lot of duplicate channels to sort through. (but guess this was not a big problem for Astra I seem to recall... |
| [13:09:23] | Azelphur: | jarle: that's probably why it's missing certain bands actually, if I'm setting the scanner manually to scan 22000000 and 5/6, it's probably missing the transponders that arn't configured in that way |
| [13:09:34] | Azelphur: | so I will have to fire them off with the correct settings afterwards, that makes sene |
| [13:09:38] | Azelphur: | sense* |
| [13:10:36] | justinh: | try the 'tune to other transports' tickbox IIRC |
| [13:11:09] | justinh: | so if one transponder is broadcasting details of alternative transponders, one scan should get em all |
| [13:11:17] | justinh: | in theory |
| [13:11:51] | justinh: | but then it's not likely anybody has updated the astra wiki page at wiki.mythtv.org. darned user contributed docs |
| [13:11:59] | Azelphur: | justinh: don't see a box like that :P |
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| [13:13:14] | justinh: | is astra the one at 28.2 E? aaanyway whatever |
| [13:13:23] | GrahamIRC: | yes |
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| [13:14:30] | GrahamIRC: | Astra 2A-2D and Eurobird 1 I think |
| [13:14:40] | justinh: | don't see / not looking.. same difference |
| [13:15:14] | justinh: | there IS a box which says something like that which DOES enable looking up other transponders from one initial scan |
| [13:15:15] | jarle: | Azelphur: you are using a Full Scan (Tuned), right? |
| [13:15:40] | justinh: | whether it'll work in the context of freeshat or not.. who knows |
| [13:15:56] | Azelphur: | jarle: yup |
| [13:16:18] | jarle: | justinh: I think the button you are talking about is not on the Full Scan scree, only on scan a single transport |
| [13:16:40] | jarle: | Azelphur: Full Scan is where you should be, you're in the right spot |
| [13:17:40] | justinh: | oh dear |
| [13:17:52] | jarle: | some screenshots here: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/DVB-S#MythTV_Setup |
| [13:18:10] | clever: | *** glibc detected *** mythfrontend: corrupted double-linked list: 0x09e7e2e8 *** |
| [13:18:13] | clever: | thats new |
| [13:18:14] | justinh: | ach well. not staying around to see the blind leading the clueless |
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| [13:19:54] | GrahamIRC: | some people are just plain rude |
| [13:20:03] | GrahamIRC: | and there's really no need for it |
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| [13:20:39] | clever: | he's always like that |
| [13:21:16] | GrahamIRC: | I know |
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| [13:21:22] | Azelphur: | jarle: this is correct, right? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/mythtvscan.png |
| [13:21:54] | GrahamIRC: | a little sarcasm is funny but there's really not need to be rude just cos you know more than someone else about something – I thought that was the point of this room |
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| [13:22:11] | jarle: | GrahamIRC: You'll just have to turn your justinh filer on, then you only see the good part of the conversation :) |
| [13:22:36] | GrahamIRC: | lol |
| [13:22:49] | GrahamIRC: | but we have some good convo's sometimes |
| [13:23:00] | jarle: | GrahamIRC: but then you'll only see 50% of justinh's comments :) |
| [13:23:07] | GrahamIRC: | lol |
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| [13:25:19] | GrahamIRC: | well it's time I went and enjoyed the sun – bye for now |
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| [13:27:34] | Azelphur: | jarle: yea, with the above setup I get no bbc news, sky news, S4C, so on |
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| [13:28:37] | Azelphur: | jarle: if I try to scan the BBC transponder (11954) I get failed to find any channels |
| [13:28:45] | clever: | http://pastebin.com/QkB6awxV ok got a backtrace for my above crash |
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| [13:30:57] | jarle: | Azelphur: try using Kaffeine to see if you can scan and tune to the channel. This way you'll know if it is a mythtv problem or not.. |
| [13:31:56] | Azelphur: | oh god 116 packages *cries* |
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| [13:52:25] | Azelphur: | jarle: Kaffeine picks up BBC News :) |
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| [13:54:32] | Azelphur: | along with all the other "missing" channels :( |
| [13:55:22] | jarle: | Azelphur: which version of mythtv are you running? |
| [13:55:45] | Azelphur: | 0.23+fixes (the version shipped with MythTV) |
| [13:55:50] | Azelphur: | Mythbuntu, I mean >.< |
| [13:57:05] | jarle: | Azelphur: I'm still at 0.22-fixes, might be a bug in 0.23's channel scanner? |
| [13:57:12] | Azelphur: | maybe |
| [13:58:18] | jarle: | Azelphur: you could try posing to the mailing list and see if somebody is able to help you debug. |
| [13:58:55] | Azelphur: | ok |
| [13:58:59] | Azelphur: | thanks :) |
| [13:59:42] | jarle: | Azelphur: you could have look at the console output from mythtv-setup to see if there is anything obvious while scanning missing transports... |
| [14:01:35] | Azelphur: | doing that now |
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| [14:29:44] | Azelphur: | jarle: what should I be doing with the off-air channels? |
| [14:29:49] | Azelphur: | delete all, set all invisible, ignore all? |
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| [14:30:42] | dmz: | hey, anyone have a quick url on how to change key bindings? I am trying to use mythbrowser via vnc & vnc doesn't send F1 |
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| [14:31:02] | pelandrit: | hello folks |
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| [14:34:39] | Azelphur: | jarle: I did Ignore all, still no BBC News :( |
| [14:34:39] | pelandrit: | trying to configure my remote with irrecord i get the error "could not init hardware (lirccd running? --> close it, check permissions)" in mythbuntu 9.10 but when y try to make sudo /etc/init.d/lirc stop i only get "fail" |
| [14:35:09] | clever: | pelandrit: does the user running irrecord have perms to /dev/lirc0 ? |
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| [14:38:33] | pelandrit: | clever: now i really strange, in hardware.conf i have REMOTE_DEVICE="/dev/lirc0" but i seems that file doesn't exist and remote works but only some buttons |
| [14:39:14] | clever: | lirc0 is created by udev when you load the kernel driver |
| [14:39:18] | clever: | stoping it via the init.d script may unload that, and remove lirc0 |
| [14:40:55] | pelandrit: | well, perhaps the lirc daemon stoped that but how can i have /dev/lirc0 to use with irrecord without daemon? |
| [14:41:26] | clever: | find the name of your kernel driver and sudo modprobe -v it |
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| [14:41:43] | clever: | its probly in hardware.conf |
| [14:41:55] | pelandrit: | no, it isn't |
| [14:42:20] | clever: | what receiver is it? |
| [14:42:33] | pelandrit: | hauppauge hvr-1110 |
| [14:42:43] | clever: | no idea about that one |
| [14:43:53] | pelandrit: | well perhaps a diff between lsmod after and before load daemonshould show that? |
| [14:43:59] | clever: | sure |
| [14:44:06] | pelandrit: | thanks |
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| [14:51:22] | pelandrit: | clever: even more strange, remote still working in mythtv (only some buttons) after daemon stop and /dev/lirc0 doesn't exist |
| [14:51:34] | clever: | weird |
| [14:52:01] | pelandrit: | and there is no diff in lsmod after and before daemon stop |
| [14:52:23] | pelandrit: | altought the command stops gives fail |
| [14:52:27] | clever: | maybe its one of those receives that acts like a usb keyboard |
| [14:53:21] | pelandrit: | is a cable attached to the dvb-t card with a microjack connector |
| [14:53:46] | devinheitmueller: | If I recall, the hvr-1110 is a saa7134 card. |
| [14:53:58] | pelandrit: | devinheitmueller: yes |
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| [14:55:48] | devinheitmueller: | If I recall, the saa7134 provides its RC via an inputdev device, so in theory lircd isn't actually required. |
| [14:56:11] | devinheitmueller: | ... for example, even without lircd running if you open a text editor and whack the "1" button on the remote, you will see it appear in the editor. |
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| [14:57:04] | clever: | that would explain why it still works without lirc running |
| [14:57:10] | pelandrit: | devinheitmueller: well, and how can i configure the buttons? |
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| [14:57:51] | devinheitmueller: | You can bind lirc to an inputdevice and do the remapping. |
| [14:58:10] | devinheitmueller: | It's amazing how painful IR support continues to be. :-/ |
| [14:58:34] | devinheitmueller: | You trying to use the stock Hauppauge remote that comes with the board? |
| [14:58:54] | pelandrit: | devinheitmueller: yes |
| [14:58:57] | clever: | devinheitmueller: i know, i never got ir blasting to work on my pvr150 and ir recieving broke more with each dist-upgrade |
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| [14:59:56] | devinheitmueller: | pelandrit: the process should pretty much be the same as discussed in the following: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Remote_controllers-V4L |
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| [15:00:50] | devinheitmueller: | I really should write a HOWTO on what was needed to get mine working. |
| [15:02:35] | pelandrit: | thanks devinheitmueller, gonna read |
| [15:03:37] | devinheitmueller: | pelandrit: rest assured, you're not crazy or dumb or anything. I have actually written the drivers for a number of these tuners, and it took me an entire Sunday afternoon to get the remote working with my PCTV 800i card. |
| [15:04:23] | pelandrit: | please, don't scare me :( |
| [15:04:49] | devinheitmueller: | pelandrit: well, I actually documented the horror story here: http://www.kernellabs.com/blog/?p=1355 |
| [15:04:56] | skd5aner: | ha |
| [15:04:58] | skd5aner: | you would |
| [15:05:03] | skd5aner: | ;) |
| [15:05:24] | devinheitmueller: | Yes, I would. |
| [15:05:36] | devinheitmueller: | Only when we bring to light how bad this situation is will it come to be fixed. |
| [15:05:45] | skd5aner: | I know, j/k |
| [15:05:58] | devinheitmueller: | ... or when I become sufficiently pissed off that I just kill a weekend and do it myself. |
| [15:07:10] | JohnnyJboss: | i just wish the pages as http://lirc.org/ didn't have that hard to read background image |
| [15:07:47] | JohnnyJboss: | i always click and highlight the text on the pages so I can read it better |
| [15:08:16] | devinheitmueller: | Mauro is doing some heavy rework of the in-kernel IR subsystem, but I am not confident it will make the situation much better for MythTV users. |
| [15:08:43] | ** devinheitmueller doublechecks the room list to make sure mchehab wasn't logged in. ** | |
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| [15:14:28] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, I noticed that you said you have the 800i card? |
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| [15:15:37] | jamiem: | hello |
| [15:16:25] | jamiem: | I have two Hauppauge Nova-T 500 Dual DVB-T but I kept getting 0 length recordings |
| [15:16:32] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: yes, I do own an 800i. |
| [15:16:47] | devinheitmueller: | (among others) |
| [15:16:54] | jamiem: | I have four channels per tuner (so 16 in total) |
| [15:17:59] | jamiem: | I set up a script to e-mail me when it found zero length files and I notice that "encoder 1" is showing (L__) Partial Lock, but oddly I can use Switch Input to another 'channel' on the same card and it works fine |
| [15:18:06] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, the remote that you mention in your blog is it the remote that came with the card? I have the same thing and have never got that little guy to work. |
| [15:18:17] | pelandrit: | well now i'm running irrecord but when i try to write a name for a button i always get "is not in the name space", what the hell is that? |
| [15:18:27] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: I recompiled the kernel and switched it over to a Hauppauge grey remote. |
| [15:19:13] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: (although in theory the PCTV remote should work fine as well) |
| [15:22:05] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, I could never get anything to come out of IRW so i assumed that either the remote doesnt work, or the reciever was bad. |
| [15:22:22] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: are you on Ubuntu by any chance? |
| [15:22:55] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, yep....9.10 using .23 with the latest version of trunk. |
| [15:23:03] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: I'm asking because I know that they have the cx88 IR input blacklisted in their hald configuration. |
| [15:23:06] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: you need to add the --ignore-namespace argument (check the man page for specific syntax) |
| [15:23:48] | JohnnyJboss: | "-n" – i believe |
| [15:24:24] | pelandrit: | thanks JohnnyJboss, i already dit it but now i see the buttons aren' recorded, the file generated don't mention the buttons i pressed |
| [15:24:27] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: see /usr/share/hal/fdi/preprobe/20thirdparty/lirc.fdi |
| [15:24:48] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: I documented how to remove it from the blacklist here: http://www.kernellabs.com/blog/?p=1309 |
| [15:25:05] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: were you running irrecord using another conf file as an input to it? if so, a second file is created |
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| [15:25:28] | iamlindoro: | We at the MythTV project accept no blame whatsoever for the sorry state of remote controls in linux ;) |
| [15:25:56] | j-rod: | well, I do |
| [15:25:57] | iamlindoro: | with the possible exception of it would be nice if we just handled the key events directly and could cut LIRC out of the loop :) |
| [15:26:05] | j-rod: | YES PLEASE |
| [15:26:09] | devinheitmueller: | iamlindoro: well, you are partly to blame. Fix MythTV's support for inputdev so that keys like "CHANNEL_UP" just work. |
| [15:26:27] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: no, i used the same line first and second time, only adding "--ignore-namespaces" |
| [15:26:31] | j-rod: | I didn't get very far trying to fix that. I hate Qt, and its input crap is… lame. |
| [15:26:36] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, yep its there... |
| [15:26:39] | JohnnyJboss: | once lirc is working it's not that bad |
| [15:26:41] | iamlindoro: | I do my part ;) |
| [15:26:45] | devinheitmueller: | j-rod: yeah, I hear you. Me neither. |
| [15:27:26] | j-rod: | I'm going to start converting the mceusb driver to work via the input layer RSN too |
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| [15:27:27] | devinheitmueller: | I've been too buried in other projects to dig into it further. Like most people, once I got it working I don't have the incentive to mess with it. |
| [15:28:12] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: what was your entire command? |
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| [15:28:50] | og01: | hey when editing the menu xml files for the local user – is it possible to change the picture displayed when that menu item is selected? |
| [15:28:54] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: is solved, i deleted the file and now it works |
| [15:29:07] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: that works too! |
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| [15:30:07] | og01: | I see that <type> changes the image, but where are the types defined? can i define them inside my menu xml files? or are they purely part of the theme? |
| [15:30:20] | iamlindoro: | og01: They are part of the UI theme, not the menu theme |
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| [15:30:32] | iamlindoro: | So yes, you can change them, but that means changing the menu-ui.xml of the theme itself |
| [15:31:03] | og01: | iamlindoro: can i override this file in ~/.mythtv ? |
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| [15:31:38] | iamlindoro: | With a copy of the theme there, yes, you should be able to |
| [15:32:54] | ** JohnnyJboss is looking forward to upgrading from .22-fixes to .23-fixes this friday ** | |
| [15:33:31] | og01: | ok still its a bit of a pain, i know that all themes can be done differently, but an option in the xml to override the image would make sense to me, since the menu layout itself is definable/overridable it would make sense to be able to define the image in the same file |
| [15:34:18] | iamlindoro: | og01: It would make no sense-- menu themes are a "map", UI themes are a layout |
| [15:34:41] | iamlindoro: | putting layout elements in the map wouldn't make any sense, especially as watermarks in different themes will have different sizes, layout, and location |
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| [15:36:32] | og01: | yes i see that, and i suspect that the themes would all have to be brought into line inorder for this to work. but the ability to override parts of the theme inside the layout map, sould be handy to the end user |
| [15:37:23] | iamlindoro: | where "brought into line" would mean standardizing layout and appearance, which is the very last thing we want |
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| [15:38:40] | iamlindoro: | The whole point of the new UI is to allow the themer to produce unique and previously unthought of experiences in myth-- The fewer rules, the better. And the average end user isn't trying to override watermakrs, and of the few that do, most don't whine about which file they have to do it in |
| [15:39:01] | iamlindoro: | In short, thanks for your opinion, but we disagree and it's never gonna happen :) |
| [15:39:41] | og01: | i must admit i havnt looked at the how the themes are done. however i dont mean that in anyway... simply bring in some sort of standardization to the names of common theme elements. which then would be able to take advantage of being overridable in the standard menu xml |
| [15:40:08] | iamlindoro: | The names *are* standardized. The layout, size, location, alpha, etc. are not |
| [15:40:09] | skd5aner: | theme elements are standardized |
| [15:40:13] | iamlindoro: | thus a single override will *never* work |
| [15:40:37] | dewman: | devinheitmueller, so you just remove those two lines,reboot and pray? =) |
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| [15:41:05] | devinheitmueller: | dewman: yeah, once you do that you should be able to run something like gnome-lirc-configure |
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| [15:41:17] | iamlindoro: | Or rather, the override will need to take into account the specific conditions that exist in the individual theme precisely because they afford the themer such flexibility |
| [15:41:29] | iamlindoro: | Thus, the override needs to be theme specific-- and it is. |
| [15:43:34] | og01: | well... i cant really complain, i havnt the time to look at this project in detail, in my mind i dont see any roadblocks to allowing such overrides, but then i havnt looked at either the code or the themes, in any case thanks for pointing me in the right dirrection |
| [15:44:48] | dewman: | devinheitmueller,thanks...=) |
| [15:44:56] | devinheitmueller: | np |
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| [15:49:17] | ThisOtherGuy: | hi all |
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| [15:50:04] | ThisOtherGuy: | my cable company recently swapped two channels (471 & 473), schedules direct has been updated, but mythfilldatabase didn't swap the channels – is that something that mythfilldatabase should do? |
| [15:52:02] | iamlindoro: | ThisOtherGuy: See mythfilldatabase --help, specifically --do-channel-updates |
| [15:52:12] | iamlindoro: | and do read it and don't just run with --do-c-u :) |
| [15:52:19] | iamlindoro: | because it explains why it's not on by default |
| [15:52:31] | ThisOtherGuy: | k – thanks |
| [15:53:01] | iamlindoro: | In short, if you have other custom channel info you want to preserve, the "safest" way may be to just open the channel editor in mythweb, swap the XMLTVids, swap the callsigns and names, and save |
| [15:53:17] | iamlindoro: | But if you are pretty much "stock", -d-c-u should be fine |
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| [15:55:27] | ThisOtherGuy: | yeah – I just deleted the channels/programs and then ran mythfilldatabase --refresh-all and it worked, I guess I should have read the --help – thanks >:-0 |
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| [15:57:33] | iamlindoro: | np |
| [15:58:28] | pelandrit: | well, now i can see and already published on this french forum (http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/viewtopic.php?id=252754) lircd.conf there im using for my remote matches exactly with the codes i obtain with irrecord, now the question is, why only work some keys of the remote in mythtv? |
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| [15:59:09] | iamlindoro: | Presumably you don't have a properly configured lircrc |
| [15:59:33] | JohnnyJboss: | i love ubuntu's user community – there's so much already documented |
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| [15:59:57] | iamlindoro: | JohnnyJboss: And only 60+% of it is outright wrong |
| [16:00:11] | iamlindoro: | Though admittedly their wikis seem to be better than their horrid, horrid forums |
| [16:00:38] | iamlindoro: | Their forums are like the blind leading a blind through a swordfight in traffic |
| [16:01:22] | pelandrit: | for what i've seen the best documented distro is gentoo, althought isn't a distro for normal users |
| [16:01:28] | JohnnyJboss: | iamlindoro: yes – the wiki's can get outdated pretty quick |
| [16:01:47] | JohnnyJboss: | i try to update them if I'm a victim of that |
| [16:02:16] | gbee: | gentoo is a distro for the criminally insane |
| [16:02:25] | gbee: | there, I said it |
| [16:02:32] | iamlindoro: | Pfft, could have fooled me on gentoo, many of their users are just as substandard as any other distro's users |
| [16:02:38] | iamlindoro: | ha, gbee beat me to it |
| [16:03:14] | wagnerrp: | its the same thing with any distro |
| [16:03:24] | wagnerrp: | you have a good deal of experienced knowledgable users |
| [16:03:24] | JohnnyJboss: | "normal" is a setting on a washing machine – and I prefer 'delicate; |
| [16:03:34] | wagnerrp: | and a good dlea of those who have no clue about what theyre doing |
| [16:03:49] | ** JohnnyJboss didn't mean to start a distro war ** | |
| [16:03:55] | wagnerrp: | the problem with gentoo is that its a lot easier to get yourself into trouble if youre in the latter group |
| [16:04:15] | clever: | wagnerrp: even a simple -Os in CFLAGS can break the entire system |
| [16:04:38] | wagnerrp: | and then we frequently see those users who have screwed something up in a manner we can easily recognize as 'bad configuration by gentoo user' |
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| [16:04:43] | clever: | it caused gunzip to silently fail and act more like cat, it just output the stream exactly as it was input |
| [16:04:45] | iamlindoro: | Say what you will about Ubuntu (and lord knows I do), I at least admire them for moving the ball forward on certain usability elements in linux (and yes, they screw up as much as they succeed sometimes) |
| [16:05:00] | clever: | so then portage itself broke because it couldnt unpack any files |
| [16:05:03] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: do you mean ~/mythtv/lircrc? |
| [16:05:09] | ** iamlindoro cues gbee for his obligatory "Madriva has been doing that for years." ** | |
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| [16:05:17] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: yes |
| [16:05:18] | iamlindoro: | er Mandriva |
| [16:05:30] | pelandrit: | thanks, gonna check it |
| [16:05:38] | wagnerrp: | thats pretty special if you managed to break gzip... |
| [16:05:59] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: or ~/.lirc/mythtv |
| [16:06:00] | ThisOtherGuy: | I found Gentoo a good way to learn, and Ubuntu a good way to just go |
| [16:06:20] | clever: | wagnerrp: i know |
| [16:06:20] | clever: | i should see if it still breaks and maybe post a ticket |
| [16:08:24] | clever: | i also think tv_play.cpp needs to break up alot more |
| [16:08:30] | clever: | the damn thing has been compiling for 20 minutes |
| [16:08:34] | JohnnyJboss: | to me it all resolves down to rpm vs dpkg/apt – which is a non contest (sorry j-rod) |
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| [16:12:58] | j-rod: | I've had this argument way too many times. the packaging format doesn't matter one bit. |
| [16:13:18] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: if I ran mythconverg_backup.pl and it created a legible gzipped backup file, is that all i should do prior to upgrading to .23-fixes? |
| [16:13:19] | j-rod: | its the depsolvers atop them that users actually see |
| [16:13:34] | j-rod: | and you can use the exact same depsolver atop rpm if you want to |
| [16:13:59] | wagnerrp: | JohnnyJboss: yep |
| [16:14:16] | wagnerrp: | technically, mythbackend will do that for you prior to update anyway |
| [16:14:30] | ** j-rod heads out the door to kick things ** | |
| [16:14:42] | JohnnyJboss: | j-rod: i was not aware – i've had 'rpm -i' bork up dependencies on me several times |
| [16:14:54] | j-rod: | yeah, don't do that |
| [16:15:45] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: how can i know what must i have in the "remote" lines in lircrc? |
| [16:15:54] | JohnnyJboss: | wagnerrp: so just make and install the .23-fixes ( i use svn ) and then when I startup the backend it wil convert the db? |
| [16:16:20] | wagnerrp: | correct |
| [16:17:01] | clever: | JohnnyJboss: i also backup the binarys/libs before doing that |
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| [16:17:10] | clever: | so i can quickly downgrade without having to recompile |
| [16:17:41] | ** wagnerrp just snapshots ** | |
| [16:17:43] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: right, that's really all you need... Just make sure it's not a 0-byte backup file or anything. |
| [16:18:21] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: indeed – I zless'd it and it's got table data and everything as I'd expect a mysqldump |
| [16:18:29] | clever: | wagnerrp: that works too if youve planned ahead and didnt install mythtv to a 500gig drive like i did |
| [16:18:52] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: then you're ready for upgrade |
| [16:19:01] | jarle: | wagnerrp: snapshot using which software? |
| [16:19:10] | wagnerrp: | ZFS |
| [16:19:33] | jarle: | wagnerrp: frebsd server? |
| [16:19:36] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: it's sort of subjective – what are you wanting to be able to do with the remote? |
| [16:19:37] | wagnerrp: | uh huh |
| [16:19:57] | wagnerrp: | jarle: and gentoo frontends |
| [16:20:44] | clever: | i should have a look at seeing what i can do with a tiny gentoo frontend |
| [16:20:44] | clever: | ulibc maybe |
| [16:20:46] | pelandrit: | only use it as remote command in mythtv, nothing sexual XD |
| [16:20:54] | jarle: | wagnerrp: some of these days I need to give freebsd a try... |
| [16:21:36] | wagnerrp: | jarle: ive got all my frontends booting off iscsi, so i can snapshot before an upgrade, and roll back to a previous image if it doesnt work |
| [16:22:09] | clever: | wagnerrp: sounds like zfs is lvm, raid, and a filesystem all rolled into one |
| [16:22:15] | jarle: | wagnerrp: sounds like a great setup... |
| [16:22:18] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: ok, noted – the ~.lirc/mythtv will map remote key presses to keyboard keypresses for mythtv. |
| [16:22:34] | wagnerrp: | clever: basically |
| [16:22:47] | wagnerrp: | clever: thats why it wont get ported to linux |
| [16:23:03] | wagnerrp: | its doing too much to comply with its desire for separation of levels |
| [16:23:18] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: i aks because in my lircrc file i have a "remote = hauppauge_pvr" line in every section but in examples i see on internet there is no such line |
| [16:23:21] | clever: | yeah, id prefer to keep those things all seperate |
| [16:23:27] | pelandrit: | ask* |
| [16:23:46] | clever: | pelandrit: that limits which remote the entry will react to, without it, it will react to every configured remote |
| [16:23:59] | clever: | normaly, you only have 1 remote configured, so it doesnt matter |
| [16:24:10] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: the name ofo the "remote = blah" is determined by what your lircd.conf calls that remote on your system |
| [16:24:23] | wagnerrp: | clever: separation is nice, but the problem with separation is that those components can do more if they are aware of each other |
| [16:24:40] | JohnnyJboss: | i'm trying to post my conf files as example |
| [16:24:47] | clever: | wagnerrp: yeah, if you want to use lvm on raid well, you need to inform lvm of what the raid stripe sizes are |
| [16:25:01] | clever: | wagnerrp: and then manualy inform the FS itself of the same thing, and pray you never pvmove it around |
| [16:25:28] | wagnerrp: | ZFS doesnt have stripe sizes |
| [16:25:57] | clever: | since its also controling the 'raid' part, it can randomly scatter the duplicates across 3 drives and still work |
| [16:26:44] | wagnerrp: | the 'stripe size' on zfs is one file |
| [16:26:50] | clever: | sounds like it would also handle loosing half of the array and not borking the entire FS |
| [16:26:59] | clever: | just bork the files that where actualy on that half |
| [16:27:16] | clever: | since the FS itself is aware of the seperation of the block devices |
| [16:27:23] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrt: http://pastebin.com/QxWmTTbd – you'd have to replace my 'remote = Hauppauge_350' to match your system |
| [16:27:35] | JohnnyJboss: | and you might not have red, blue, green and yellow keys |
| [16:27:56] | wagnerrp: | the strip size is dynamic, so anything above a certain size gets its own dedicated stripe (or multiple) |
| [16:28:02] | clever: | pelandrit: all depends on what you called them in lircd.conf |
| [16:28:07] | wagnerrp: | anything smaller gets mirrored between multiple drivers |
| [16:28:08] | ** JohnnyJboss is being paged to do actual work ** | |
| [16:28:11] | JohnnyJboss: | brb |
| [16:28:25] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, that's strange because only some buttons work althought the name is wrong in the ~/.mythtv/lircrc and is the only lircrc file in all my system |
| [16:29:17] | pelandrit: | i mean should not work at all but only some buttons work |
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| [16:29:49] | pelandrit: | i'm starting to get crazy |
| [16:30:21] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: don't forget when editing these files you must restart the lirc daemon and then restart mythtv |
| [16:30:30] | wagnerrp: | clever: or you can do things like mirroring only certain files |
| [16:30:43] | clever: | wagnerrp: do you have http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_deduplication enabled too? |
| [16:30:47] | wagnerrp: | you mark a file as wanting X number of duplicates |
| [16:30:58] | clever: | that could be usefull for the database |
| [16:31:06] | clever: | to give the DB files extra protections |
| [16:31:21] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, thats another funny thingm when i try to stop/start/restart /etc/init.d/ lirc i only get "fail" |
| [16:31:22] | clever: | while recordings would only have 1 copy |
| [16:31:40] | wagnerrp: | zfs has transparent compression, but does not include deduplication yet |
| [16:31:41] | pelandrit: | but i can restart the entire system and see |
| [16:31:47] | wagnerrp: | deduplication is not what you think it is |
| [16:31:52] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: on my system ~/.mythtv/lircrc is a pointer to ~/.lirc/mythtv |
| [16:31:53] | clever: | wagnerrp: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZFS#Deduplication |
| [16:32:18] | wagnerrp: | ah... well it hasnt been added to the freebsd version yet |
| [16:32:22] | clever: | it looks like compression thru finding identical segments and sharing those amung files with COW |
| [16:32:33] | wagnerrp: | correct, what could would that do for a database? |
| [16:32:41] | wagnerrp: | s/could/good/ |
| [16:32:43] | clever: | instead of the more normal compression that represents long bit paterns with short codes |
| [16:32:58] | clever: | might be better for the backend logs |
| [16:33:13] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, i'm using mythbuntu 9.10 and the only lircrc file that "find" command finds is in ~/.mythv |
| [16:33:16] | clever: | if it can work on things as small as 10–20 bytes |
| [16:33:18] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: 'sudo /etc/init.d/lirc restart' should not return FAIL |
| [16:33:22] | wagnerrp: | normal compression works just fine for backend logs |
| [16:33:34] | wagnerrp: | deduplication is for things like setting up virtual machines |
| [16:33:45] | clever: | yeah, would need to play around more to see how it performs |
| [16:33:46] | wagnerrp: | say you have multiple installs of windows, which are all largely the same files |
| [16:33:47] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: but it does |
| [16:33:55] | wagnerrp: | deduplication will recognize that, and delete the duplicats |
| [16:34:00] | clever: | wagnerrp: in that case, id think clones would work better |
| [16:34:02] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: cd into ~/.mythtv and run 'ls -al' |
| [16:34:21] | clever: | though deduplication would help to re-merge the clones if you install SP3 on all of them seperately |
| [16:34:30] | gbee: | wagnerrp: or commercial scale document storage |
| [16:34:30] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: we need to see why the lirc daemon is failing then |
| [16:35:20] | wagnerrp: | correct, merging after-the-fact is what deduplication gets you |
| [16:35:24] | clever: | ok, this is ridiculus, ive been compiling tv_play.cpp for 40 minutes now |
| [16:35:25] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, anyway somebody said that lirc daemon isn't neccesary with my card |
| [16:35:42] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: then I wouldn't know how to help you |
| [16:35:49] | clever: | who's idea was it to make a 364kb .cpp file |
| [16:36:05] | wagnerrp: | you swapping? |
| [16:36:11] | clever: | yeah |
| [16:36:27] | JohnnyJboss: | although I'm running Mythbuntu 9.10 with lirc |
| [16:36:32] | clever: | 42% of my ram to cc1plus and almost half my swap is gone |
| [16:36:56] | pelandrit: | [16:55:50] <devinheitmueller> If I recall, the saa7134 provides its RC via an inputdev device, so in theory lircd isn't actually required. |
| [16:37:42] | wagnerrp: | should get more ram |
| [16:37:50] | clever: | let me re-try it on the 512mb ubuntu |
| [16:38:05] | wagnerrp: | youre running on less than 512MB right now? |
| [16:38:12] | clever: | ~256mb |
| [16:38:20] | pelandrit: | i think my sistem is ignoring all the usual configuration files |
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| [16:38:42] | wagnerrp: | yeah... you havent been able to compile mythtv properly on that for as long as i can remember |
| [16:39:10] | clever: | i updated it recently but now i'm getting alot of corrupt double linked lists and free()'s, so ive cleaned it and started over |
| [16:39:33] | clever: | lol, stupid distcc |
| [16:39:35] | wagnerrp: | i remember back on 0.21, having to add a bit of swap to a 1GB machine, because with -j2 i would OOM at one point |
| [16:39:43] | clever: | it distcc'd it to the 256mb box:P |
| [16:39:44] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: i'm checking the lirc website for the saa7134 to see which driver that is |
| [16:40:08] | wagnerrp: | i cant imagine anything with 256MB would ever be worth running distcc on |
| [16:40:17] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: do you see your hardware on this page: http://lirc.org/html/table.html |
| [16:40:41] | wagnerrp: | the overhead it would cause would take longer than just compiling one the bigger machine directly |
| [16:40:45] | clever: | wagnerrp: i was distccing it between a pair of 256mb systems, which shared /, so there would be no problems at all with diff gcc's |
| [16:42:32] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: no, my card is hauppauge hvr-1110 and isn't in that list but i can assure you i'm using the saa7134 module |
| [16:43:06] | pelandrit: | and livetc works like a charm |
| [16:43:17] | pelandrit: | livetv* |
| [16:43:38] | sphery: | wagnerrp: I'm waiting for your reply to the warper thread |
| [16:43:43] | clever: | wagnerrp: looks better, the cpu is actualy maxed out now |
| [16:44:26] | sphery: | clever: did you notice my message about needing to update for your preview gen? |
| [16:44:28] | wagnerrp: | sphery: whoops, i didnt realize i didnt hit send on that |
| [16:44:45] | sphery: | heh, I figured something was up |
| [16:44:50] | sphery: | you're usually so fast |
| [16:44:51] | clever: | sphery: yeah, ive updated to 24115 now |
| [16:45:26] | sphery: | clever: also, the remote preview gen is "broken" (not really--it works, but it causes ugly error messages that make it look like it doesn't--I have to figure that out/fix it next) |
| [16:46:06] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: did you review this http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=496452 ? |
| [16:46:13] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Thank you for the response to #6878 |
| [16:46:33] | clever: | i think my compile is broken right now, getting alot of '*** glibc detected *** mythfrontend: corrupted double-linked list: 0x09665068 ***' |
| [16:46:49] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: np :) |
| [16:47:16] | sphery: | iamlindoro: I was just about to say the same |
| [16:47:27] | iamlindoro: | too slow |
| [16:47:28] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: when I perform the make install of the .23-fixes from svn, are there any libs directories I should clear out as a precaution? |
| [16:47:37] | sphery: | skd5aner: that response means that when the OP doesn't respond in 30 days, we can close it with a little less guilt |
| [16:47:57] | iamlindoro: | Or, that iamlindoro can/has already closed it |
| [16:48:06] | skd5aner: | sphery, iamlindoro: I accept mutliple thank you's. My quota has not been reached for the day :D |
| [16:48:12] | ** iamlindoro is a merciless ticket overlord ** | |
| [16:48:38] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: I recommend: ls -l /usr/{,local/}lib/{mythtv,libmyth*} /usr/{,local/}include/mythtv |
| [16:48:39] | iamlindoro: | tickets didn't get under 500 by being friends! |
| [16:48:51] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: and an rm of anything that's there... If you're self compiling |
| [16:49:04] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: if you had a packaged install, though, use the package manager to uninstall everything /first/ |
| [16:49:28] | sphery: | iamlindoro: your approach is better. |
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| [16:49:43] | sphery: | we hold too many of them open waiting for replies that never come |
| [16:49:43] | skd5aner: | I'd like to thank JYA, MarkSpieth, and others who have put time into the digital audio rewrites... I can tell you that's near the top of my lists of things I loved in .23 |
| [16:49:44] | clever: | JohnnyJboss: i beleive the 'proper' way with svn is to 'make uninstall' before you 'svn up' |
| [16:50:34] | sphery: | clever: yeah, that's a good way, too |
| [16:50:47] | skd5aner: | my wife is extremely happy that she can start watching some of her shows in 1.3 again after they switched from SD to HD |
| [16:50:59] | sphery: | 1.3? |
| [16:50:59] | clever: | sphery: the only problem i have with that method, is that it completely breaks the system until your fully done compiling |
| [16:51:06] | iamlindoro: | tiestretch |
| [16:51:07] | skd5aner: | 1.3x – timestretch |
| [16:51:07] | sphery: | lots of subwoofers and a mono channel? |
| [16:51:10] | iamlindoro: | and timestretch |
| [16:51:10] | sphery: | oh |
| [16:51:23] | iamlindoro: | heh, 3x subs |
| [16:51:34] | iamlindoro: | Sounds like a college dorm room in the 70s |
| [16:51:44] | iamlindoro: | one sexy mono channel, baby |
| [16:51:46] | skd5aner: | ha, exactly |
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| [16:51:57] | sphery: | Yeah, I've been back on my 1.25–1.75x kick |
| [16:52:12] | skd5aner: | who says bass channels are omnidirectional... stereo bass is where it's at! |
| [16:52:14] | gandalfcome (gandalfcome!~gandalfco@mithrandir.anu.edu.au) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | |
| [16:52:18] | iamlindoro: | [mythtv-commits] #8600 – 1.3 audio no longer works in .24 |
| [16:52:23] | skd5aner: | ha |
| [16:52:31] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, that's not exactly the same card, mine is hvr-1110 not hvr-1100 |
| [16:52:32] | kormoc_afk is now known as kormoc | |
| [16:53:45] | skd5aner: | I watch Colbert in 1.4x always – since he's been on (for like 4–5 years). Anything at normal speed sounds... very wrong |
| [16:54:17] | iamlindoro: | Heh, Seagate selling a 500 GB drive for $100. Comes with 20 paramount movies, all DRM'd, and only accessible with the DRM/playback software installed |
| [16:54:32] | skd5aner: | Reality TV is best watched at 1.3x+ |
| [16:54:36] | iamlindoro: | Just in case you want your drive a) way too expensive and b) pre-loaded with DRM and rootkits |
| [16:54:40] | skd5aner: | why waste more time than you have to? |
| [16:55:27] | ** skd5aner is staring at his 2TB drive UPS just dropped off, realizing he might not have an extra SATA cable laying around :P ** | |
| [16:56:15] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: as i read here http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Remote_controllers-V4L perhaps i need make definitions for my card in saa7134-cards.c file |
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| [16:58:13] | sphery: | iamlindoro: yeah, you have to love those--20 movies for $5 each sounds good on paper, until you realize that there's only 3 you actually care to have |
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| [16:58:48] | iamlindoro: | and that they will only work on Windows, have poor bitrate, and are encumbered by the worst kind of lock-in/DRM/spyware |
| [16:58:56] | sphery: | skd5aner: I have about 67 extra SATA cables... I'll ship you one for $28 S&H. :) |
| [17:00:11] | sphery: | iamlindoro: yeah... likely also require server auth, so when Microsoft drops the Plays-For-Sure program so that they can release their own Zune which doesn't support their own "standard" DRM, you're out of luck. Oh wait, that already happened. |
| [17:00:33] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: sounds like you're making progress – sorry I'm not more familiar with that card. |
| [17:00:39] | sphery: | (this time, it would be when Paramount drops their server, you lose your movies) |
| [17:01:31] | JohnnyJboss: | pelandrit: there's mention of it here too – https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lirc/+bug/301115 |
| [17:01:45] | pelandrit: | JohnnyJboss: well, what i¡m reading is a so hard proccess there i'm starting to think in fed up |
| [17:04:02] | JohnnyJboss: | hang in there / take a quick break – this can be frustrating but at least we're all here to help |
| [17:06:40] | sphery: | there's also the option of using a different remote control receiver/transmitter... you don't have to use the one built into your capture card |
| [17:06:48] | ** sphery has never used the ones in his capture card ** | |
| [17:08:32] | npm (npm!~npm@cpe-76-169-12-237.socal.res.rr.com) has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | |
| [17:08:32] | sphery: | the downside is you have to get a different remote device. The upside is that you only have to figure out how to make it work once--even if you change/upgrade/add/move capture cards around. |
| [17:08:45] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: and be pre-loaded with crap |
| [17:08:54] | wagnerrp: | those 20 movies only consume the first 50GB |
| [17:09:16] | wagnerrp: | thats acceptable for a DVD rip at best |
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| [17:10:40] | sphery: | heh, so Verizon did it... They validated Skype with the free Skype-to-Skype via your mobile phone (assuming your bandwidth is free). |
| [17:10:53] | wagnerrp: | if they took up the entire 500GB drive, it might be worth looking into |
| [17:11:05] | sphery: | wonderful that a proprietary standard that's less useful than the open standard wins, again |
| [17:12:07] | wagnerrp: | open standard being? |
| [17:13:59] | sphery: | the asterisk thing? |
| [17:14:10] | wagnerrp: | IAX or SIP? |
| [17:14:18] | wagnerrp: | SIP is intended for device-to-device |
| [17:14:24] | wagnerrp: | IAX is more for trunking |
| [17:14:42] | wagnerrp: | HOWEVER, SIP was never designed for the consumer IP4 world |
| [17:14:44] | sphery: | ok, then openwengo/qutecom/... |
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| [17:14:55] | wagnerrp: | it contains the sender IP address in the packet |
| [17:14:59] | sphery: | (and GNOME's uses it and ...) |
| [17:15:13] | wagnerrp: | meaning it requires weird finagling to work through NAT |
| [17:15:14] | sphery: | hmmm... Apache JIRA got hacked. |
| [17:15:39] | clever: | wagnerrp: like ftp? |
| [17:15:49] | wagnerrp: | clever: active ftp anyway... |
| [17:15:52] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: what did they do to it? |
| [17:16:08] | wagnerrp: | XSS attack, passwords compromised |
| [17:16:13] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: credential-capturing login page |
| [17:16:18] | sphery: | yeah, so update your passwords |
| [17:16:39] | clever: | wagnerrp: active/passive, its just a matter of wether the client or servers NAT needs to muck around with it |
| [17:16:59] | sphery: | wagnerrp: So, Qutecom uses SIP, but it "features" NAT traversal. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuteCom |
| [17:17:08] | sphery: | "standard SIP" that is |
| [17:17:59] | wagnerrp: | sphery: basically meaning it has to autodetect your real external IP, and play some games with the firewall states |
| [17:18:19] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: https://blogs.apache.org/infra/entry/apache_org_04_09_2010 |
| [17:20:25] | sphery: | So, isn't JIRA proprietary, anyway? If so, wonder why Apache (who's so focused on FOSS that they feel Sun/Oracle Java is evil) is using it... |
| [17:20:30] | wagnerrp: | sphery: im not arguing FOR skype.... more that SIP has its own flaws in the current architecture |
| [17:20:43] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah, I understand |
| [17:21:22] | wagnerrp: | i think there are some hardphones that support IAX though |
| [17:21:26] | sphery: | just wish that other people actually used something that didn't require garbage closed-source code from Skype to work |
| [17:22:47] | AndyCap: | sphery: yeah, but I think java people really like jira/atlassian and it's probably free of charge like bitkeeper. P |
| [17:22:49] | sphery: | I'd even learn to live with Skype if they'd just open the protocol/not make it a violation of ToS to /use/ a reverse-engineered version of the protocol on "their network" |
| [17:23:57] | AndyCap: | wagnerrp: got a craptastic ATA with IAX support, not sure how many chips actually support it, but haven't looked in a year or two |
| [17:28:02] | sphery: | Ekiga is the GNOME one |
| [17:28:14] | wagnerrp: | sphery: there is no advertising or anything on their client is there? |
| [17:28:28] | wagnerrp: | so the only income they get is from users calling to/from POTS? |
| [17:28:29] | sphery: | whose? Skypes? Only ads for Skype on there. |
| [17:28:35] | sphery: | yeah |
| [17:28:41] | sphery: | still not making money, TTBOMK |
| [17:28:59] | sphery: | though they may make more if they get a bunch of cell providers to offer the service |
| [17:29:56] | sphery: | the ads for skype, though wouldn't generally count as ads... just a lot of places you can click that take you to places on their website where you can sign up for services |
| [17:30:09] | AndyCap: | through something evil like iskoot? |
| [17:30:38] | skd5aner: | ooooh, I hope Mark comes back with an updated patch for #6569, I experienced that problem last night. |
| [17:30:58] | skd5aner: | Receiver had to be set to -15dB for playback of a digital show, and then my wife turned on a SD show, and it was so loud scared us to death, she had to turn it down to -38dB |
| [17:31:15] | iamlindoro: | That's different |
| [17:31:18] | sphery: | AndyCap: not sure... http://verizonwireless.com/skypemobile |
| [17:32:02] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: You are talking about digital versus analog sources, versus #6569 is about 2 channel digital AC3 compared to 5.1 channel AC3. |
| [17:32:21] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: ohhhhhhh |
| [17:32:27] | skd5aner: | yea, I see now |
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| [17:32:37] | skd5aner: | still, that's annoying too |
| [17:32:43] | Jonny0stars: | Hello |
| [17:33:06] | sphery: | cross-audio-source normalization will be a /very/ difficult problem to solve |
| [17:33:15] | Azelphur: | Don't suppose anyone can help me with missing channels in mythtv? http://www.mythtvtalk.com/forum/installation- . . . hannels.html |
| [17:33:28] | sphery: | so much so that I think the best solution is a volume button on the remote and a brain connected to a pair of ears |
| [17:33:46] | clever: | sphery: sometimes its not even channel related, i find stargate sg1 (dvd's and on tv) need the volume VERY high |
| [17:33:48] | sphery: | Azelphur: did you look under the couch cushions? |
| [17:33:54] | Azelphur: | sphery: yes :-( |
| [17:33:58] | Jonny0stars: | Does anyone know where I can find the line in nuvexport which terminates a transcode when mencoder dies early |
| [17:34:11] | sphery: | clever: yeah, they have a different source for their audio :) |
| [17:34:18] | Jonny0stars: | I have greped the files for the error message but no luck |
| [17:34:18] | iamlindoro: | Azelphur: Erm, are you using DVB-S to capture your sky channels? |
| [17:34:27] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: yes |
| [17:34:43] | Jonny0stars: | Its frustrating because the video and audio are fine it just means i can export a whole series in one go |
| [17:34:50] | iamlindoro: | Azelphur: and thus are using a CAM? |
| [17:34:55] | sphery: | clever: that's why I said "audio source" as opposed to just source... MythMusic, MythVideo, recordings from different inputs, channels, receivers, ... all have differences |
| [17:34:56] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: no, this is freesat |
| [17:35:02] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: sky and freesat run off the same dish |
| [17:35:16] | Azelphur: | same satellite, I should say, they are both Astra 28E |
| [17:35:20] | iamlindoro: | OK, so are you trying to tune Sky channels, or freesat channels? |
| [17:35:29] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: freesat channels such as BBC News |
| [17:35:32] | wagnerrp: | sphery: im just wondering why they would want to keep their protocol closed |
| [17:35:37] | wagnerrp: | unless its just a case of lock-in |
| [17:35:45] | clever: | sphery: its a problem even outside of myth, just a plain dvd player with stargate or stargate on plain old livetv, i have to crank it up alot |
| [17:35:54] | sphery: | wagnerrp: yeah, seems opening it would make sense |
| [17:35:55] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: as the post says scan and kaffeine can see them but myth can't |
| [17:36:07] | sphery: | wagnerrp: /especially/ if they opened the parts that allowd the for-pay services |
| [17:36:14] | wagnerrp: | they dont want people to open up tunnels to allow non-subscribers call in |
| [17:36:35] | wagnerrp: | or potentially provide competing POTS service on their netowkr |
| [17:36:46] | sphery: | clever: yeah... even just show versus commercials (especially when channels switch from 5.1 to 2 channel for commercials and similar) |
| [17:36:53] | clever: | that too |
| [17:36:57] | sphery: | even with plain TV and no myth |
| [17:37:09] | clever: | comercials are always louder to make you buy the crap |
| [17:37:26] | skd5aner: | there is a legislative act to change that... |
| [17:37:38] | clever: | a TV in one hotel i was at, had 2 volume levels |
| [17:37:40] | skd5aner: | I believe it's call the CALM act |
| [17:37:45] | clever: | and could swap between them at the push of a button |
| [17:37:53] | skd5aner: | http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h6209/show |
| [17:37:58] | clever: | so you could have 1 level for the show and 1 for the comercials |
| [17:38:11] | skd5aner: | CALM – "Commercial Advertisement Loudness Mitigation" Act |
| [17:38:14] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: if you actually read the article, it seems that drive is $100 for the 500GB drive and Star Trek |
| [17:38:27] | wagnerrp: | even though it contains 19 other movies, you dont purchase the rights to them |
| [17:38:38] | wagnerrp: | and you have to pay $15 a pop online to unlock them |
| [17:38:49] | sphery: | oh, that's so ... evil |
| [17:39:15] | wagnerrp: | so youre being charged $100 for a $50 hard drive and a digital copy of a $15 movie |
| [17:39:28] | AndyCap: | yay |
| [17:39:28] | wagnerrp: | but its a 'special promotional price' |
| [17:39:28] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: I just used channels.conf in mplayer, I'm actually watching BBC News in mplayer right now |
| [17:39:34] | sphery: | is it at least a 2.5" drive |
| [17:39:43] | Azelphur: | iamlindoro: so it's really just mythtv that isn't seeing these channels for some reason :( |
| [17:39:55] | wagnerrp: | doest say |
| [17:41:26] | skd5aner: | it's probably 4200 RPM |
| [17:41:37] | highzeth: | Azelphur: tried to set the FEC instead of AUTO? |
| [17:41:39] | sphery: | Azelphur: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7546 , perhaps? |
| [17:41:53] | wagnerrp: | well a 500GB laptop drive is $120 at bestbuy, but its only $75–80 online |
| [17:42:04] | wagnerrp: | at least if that were the case, their claimed prices would make sense |
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| [17:42:34] | Azelphur: | highzeth: don't think it's the same, I get ITV HD, and when I try to scan the correct transponder I get no channels found |
| [17:42:42] | Azelphur: | highzeth: yea, I have :( |
| [17:42:55] | sphery: | Azelphur: guess it's not #7546 |
| [17:43:01] | highzeth: | I havent said anything about ITV, but ok? |
| [17:43:12] | Azelphur: | highzeth: sorry, I meant sphery |
| [17:43:33] | sphery: | I got your meaning :) |
| [17:43:40] | wagnerrp: | Star Trek Starter Kit (bluray + 3' HDMI cable)... WTF? |
| [17:43:40] | highzeth: | Azelphur: that said, I have had scans that didnt pick up channels unless FEC has been said, why I asked |
| [17:43:48] | Azelphur: | hehe |
| [17:43:59] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Some of these changesets you're putting in the release notes are still *really* trivial |
| [17:44:10] | sphery: | clever: a laptop touchpad paste accident? been there myself. |
| [17:44:12] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: eg, when I change two words in an error message, it doesn't have to make the release notes ;) |
| [17:44:29] | clever: | sphery: na, the alt+1 missed, so i wound up in the wrong window |
| [17:44:34] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: I know, honestly I've started to put some of them in the discussion board. Right now, I don't want to lose track of them as I go through, and plan on "reviewing" them along the way... |
| [17:44:38] | sphery: | oh |
| [17:44:50] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: the more trivial ones will either fall back to discussion, or be removed entirely |
| [17:45:09] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Seems like you'd save a lot of effort by simply never putting them there ;) |
| [17:45:15] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: to clean it up so the more important ones stand out and don't get burried |
| [17:45:32] | iamlindoro: | "Changed kph to km/h [23992]" |
| [17:45:33] | iamlindoro: | etc. |
| [17:45:36] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: maybe, but I don't mind honestly :) |
| [17:45:43] | Azelphur: | highzeth: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/2010-04-13-18 . . . 00_scrot.png is another example of settings I tried to get BBC news |
| [17:46:04] | Azelphur: | which should be correct, got that information from http://www.lyngsat.com/28east.html |
| [17:46:05] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Going to become unreadable/useless very quickly if it stays that way-- appreciate the effort very much, would just prefer if it were a little more discerning |
| [17:46:07] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: haha, yea, the weather one from Beirdo was a bit extensive, I wasn't quite sure how to trim it down much |
| [17:47:16] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: understood, I've started to make steps towards that, (re: discussion page for lesser important changes) and I think you'll see as time goes by where I'll start to consolidate, remove any duplicates, "trim the fat" etc |
| [17:47:20] | iamlindoro: | anyway, just something to bear in mind |
| [17:47:30] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: appreciate the feedback! |
| [17:47:47] | highzeth: | Azelphur: not gonna open a 1920x1200 screenshot on a 3" screen ;) |
| [17:48:03] | Azelphur: | highzeth: lmao |
| [17:48:24] | meshe: | "Removes PVR-350 output support" :( |
| [17:48:41] | skd5aner: | what are your thoughts on attribution and credit in the release notes/changelog? I was debating that the other day, but sometimes it can be difficult for someone who didn't actually review the patch to assign proper credit |
| [17:49:28] | skd5aner: | obviously the commit will sometimes give credit, as well as the ticket... |
| [17:49:44] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: A page for patch contributors is something I've often considered |
| [17:49:47] | devinheitmueller: | meshe: join the 21st century and spend $20 on an Nvidia card with s-video output. |
| [17:49:58] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: That way people would update it with changesets/tickets they wrote when they get applied |
| [17:50:02] | meshe: | lol |
| [17:50:03] | devinheitmueller: | meshe: or stay where you are and don't upgrade to 0.23. |
| [17:50:07] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: And it would make it easier for us to keep track of who is doing good work |
| [17:50:25] | meshe: | actually i don't use myth's output on the one box that uses that, i use X's support for it |
| [17:50:46] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: yea, a seperate page seems like a decent idea, probably per release "0.23 contributors", "0.24 contributors", etc |
| [17:50:56] | meshe: | that box needs to be rebuilt anyway (thanks comcast) |
| [17:51:05] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: I don't think it needs to be per-release |
| [17:51:14] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: We don't get nearly enough patches to justify it |
| [17:51:34] | iamlindoro: | And I'd rather track someone's overall contributions than have to hunt across pags |
| [17:51:39] | iamlindoro: | pages |
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| [17:52:20] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: I wonder if that has to do with the fact that in the past (I know this is changing), patches that were submitted were often left to get stale for months and years, and then a request to "update against current trunk" or simply closed |
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| [17:52:42] | skd5aner: | I'm glad to see that patches are now getting reviewed in a more timely fashion, it appears, now |
| [17:52:52] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Anything would be speculation, so better just to improve going forward |
| [17:53:20] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: true (about hunting for contributions across pages) |
| [17:53:24] | iamlindoro: | Yes, I/we are attempting to do so, some are more apt to do so that others but I think we are trying to improve a number of concerns with both our process and our project |
| [17:53:57] | iamlindoro: | We still don't do feature requests, but I do believe people deserve at least a prompt response to their work, even if the answer is no |
| [17:54:11] | skd5aner: | yea, I always hated to follow -commits and see someone submit something cool, useful, new, etc... then 2 years later a dev close it because it's 2–3 releases out of date :( |
| [17:54:34] | iamlindoro: | It doesn't help that in several key areas we have absolutely nobody doing work |
| [17:54:40] | skd5aner: | not saying that every patch submitted is perfect as is and should be accepted :) |
| [17:54:43] | iamlindoro: | perfect example is the uPnP server |
| [17:54:52] | iamlindoro: | No, in fact we should be much braver about denying patches |
| [17:54:55] | skd5aner: | what happened to dblain? I thought UPnP was his baby? |
| [17:55:07] | iamlindoro: | half of the applied tickets should never have gotten in there |
| [17:55:52] | iamlindoro: | He hasn't been very active in a long time, and there's no secondary dev for uPnP, really |
| [17:57:11] | skd5aner: | Would myth devs ever consider a more "formalized/approved" feature request system? Something like http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/ so that the devs can see feedback from the community about how they use (or would like to) use myth? |
| [17:57:54] | skd5aner: | Not so much as a list of "these are the priorities that the devs should consider", but maybe nothing more than to get the pulse of the community when it comes to the popularity of wants and desires of feature requests? |
| [17:58:09] | GreyFoxx: | It's not really required |
| [17:58:14] | GreyFoxx: | there are few enough devs |
| [17:58:15] | skd5aner: | I find the wiki feature request page to basically be a cluster free for all, I don't know how any dev would enjoy reading through that? |
| [17:58:22] | GreyFoxx: | most of which are on -usres and in here to already see it |
| [17:58:26] | iamlindoro: | We already can't get what *we* want done, we're not at a loss for things to do :) |
| [17:58:59] | iamlindoro: | There's a mistaken impression that certain things aren't done becuase they haven't occurred to us/we don't know they're important-- nothing could be further from the truth |
| [17:59:15] | iamlindoro: | And a formal feature request system would only be helpful if there were any spare cycles at all |
| [17:59:20] | skd5aner: | GreyFoxx: but even if there was one Dev, I can see where it would be nice to see what floats to the top. |
| [17:59:36] | sphery: | feature requests are more useful for users who are looking for something to do |
| [17:59:45] | GreyFoxx: | yeah |
| [17:59:52] | skd5aner: | Obviously myth has thousands of users, all of whom have their own thoughts and opinions, and that groupthink could be interesting and potentially useful |
| [17:59:58] | sphery: | since, as iamlindoro said, all of the devs have TODO lists a mile long |
| [18:00:06] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Sorry, disagree :) |
| [18:00:23] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: remember, open source is not a democracy |
| [18:00:24] | skd5aner: | yea, I know those TODO lists rarely get shorter |
| [18:00:27] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Groupthink is how we ended up with pantloads of twiddly options and features that are essentially useless/poorly implemented/etc. |
| [18:00:41] | iamlindoro: | It's like cancer |
| [18:00:49] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yup, agreed – I figured it be more as a feedback channel rather than legislation :) |
| [18:00:53] | JohnnyJboss: | pantloads – that's not metric is it? |
| [18:01:01] | skd5aner: | no worries, just throwing a thought I had a few months ago out there |
| [18:01:06] | iamlindoro: | And the only way to cure it is to a) excise the cancer, and b) develop with a clear direction |
| [18:01:28] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: We hate feedback. our users are jerks. |
| [18:01:34] | iamlindoro: | Well, I should say "I" |
| [18:01:45] | sphery: | agreed |
| [18:01:54] | meshe: | lol |
| [18:01:55] | iamlindoro: | Not *all* of them, mind you, but as a mob, they are ungrateful, crude, thoughtless, rude jerks |
| [18:02:22] | sphery: | Getting rid of the useless settings is a /real/ chore because it's not a matter of just getting rid of a little code--it's completely reimplementing the feature the way it /should/ have been implemented in the first place. |
| [18:02:31] | meshe: | I would like to take this moment to say that I appreciate all the work that has gone into myth and the devs have done a wonderful job :) |
| [18:02:36] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: id say youve gotten far more than your fair share of complaints |
| [18:02:46] | skd5aner: | haha – I just know a few times a year, I think "Oh man, that would be cool if myth had %FEATURE_X%", but I rarely bring it up for fear of the old motto "For Devs, By Devs" that used to be thrown around years ago... |
| [18:02:47] | sphery: | meshe: you're such a jerk ;) |
| [18:02:57] | skd5aner: | ... and having it burried in the wiki, just gets lost with all the cruft |
| [18:03:06] | meshe: | sorry sphery, i'll dissapear for a few more months |
| [18:03:13] | sphery: | wait, no, please! |
| [18:03:13] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: where's the link you sent the mailing list to the project tracking website that shows the hours spent on mythtv as a project? |
| [18:03:19] | sphery: | we need your Perl skillz! |
| [18:03:22] | meshe: | heheh |
| [18:03:22] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Pre-.22 I went and implemented about a dozen features from the feature request list for MV |
| [18:03:30] | skd5aner: | but, I *DO* understand that there's negative cycles that the devs have, and have 0 expectations for them to act upon a user's idea unless they had the same idea to begin with |
| [18:03:33] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: I implemented all the ones that weren't bat-crap crazy |
| [18:03:35] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: http://www.ohloh.net/p/mythtv |
| [18:03:41] | JohnnyJboss: | thanks |
| [18:03:42] | iamlindoro: | so yeah, they get read, and sometimes even acted upon |
| [18:03:56] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: more interesting from a "what's happening in development" perspective is http://svnsearch.org/svnsearch/repos/MYTHTV/search |
| [18:04:05] | meshe: | i see the MV hashing function got added, sweet |
| [18:04:08] | iamlindoro: | Woo, #10! |
| [18:04:13] | skd5aner: | now to take time to stop typing and try to catch up on the plethora of your comments/responses :D |
| [18:04:24] | sphery: | iamlindoro: congrats! |
| [18:04:28] | iamlindoro: | ha |
| [18:04:33] | sphery: | iamlindoro: you've always been #10 in my book |
| [18:04:39] | iamlindoro: | Don't I know it |
| [18:04:45] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: the problem with a lot of those feature requests is that they are done with very little knowledge of mythtv's internals |
| [18:05:07] | meshe: | sphery: in binary thats #2 :P |
| [18:05:15] | sphery: | meshe: heh |
| [18:05:34] | wagnerrp: | so what they are recommending, while perhaps useful, is either done in completely the wrong manner, or is not feasible under the current architecture |
| [18:05:46] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: i think she just called you crap |
| [18:06:28] | meshe: | moi? |
| [18:06:34] | iamlindoro: | #2 |
| [18:06:36] | iamlindoro: | heh |
| [18:06:43] | meshe: | never |
| [18:06:46] | wagnerrp: | #2... poop... fecal matter... |
| [18:06:49] | sphery: | wagnerrp: exactly... lots of things like "make it so I can watch Live TV without recording so there's no delay"--which just can't work with the distributed architecture |
| [18:07:07] | iamlindoro: | Blah, it just occurred to me that I could be building Myth on Mac OS X on my old lappy |
| [18:07:14] | iamlindoro: | Maybe I should clear some of these OS X tickets |
| [18:07:17] | meshe: | wagnerrp: you're mind is hiding in a place is shouldn't be :) |
| [18:07:42] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yea, I can understand that... it's also probably not always straight forward to filter out the few educated myth users from the plethora of newbies or people who don't dive into the effort |
| [18:07:47] | sphery: | iamlindoro: closed/invalid -> "Use a real OS." |
| [18:08:16] | wagnerrp: | sphery: can i run mythtv on plan9> |
| [18:08:17] | wagnerrp: | ? |
| [18:08:23] | sphery: | lol |
| [18:08:52] | skd5aner: | so, no brainstorm.mythtv.org in the near-future – got it ;) |
| [18:09:36] | skd5aner: | my brainstorm idea about brainstorm was a bad idea... to brainstorm with you all |
| [18:10:00] | skd5aner: | ok, now I can stop using that word for another few months |
| [18:10:00] | dfletcher: | brainstorms just make brain rain! |
| [18:10:05] | iamlindoro: | The project currently just doesn't have the direction or leadership needed to take on any large initiative, being realistic |
| [18:10:21] | wagnerrp: | i thought brainstorms lead to seizures |
| [18:10:21] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: that is a coll way to view the svn data – thanks |
| [18:10:37] | iamlindoro: | We are *slowly* developing a stronger project ethos, but it's going to take time and a lot of cleanup ahead of us first |
| [18:10:45] | dfletcher: | yeah lightning bolts in the brain can't be good wagnerrp :) |
| [18:11:08] | skd5aner: | Has Issac formally laid out a direction for the project? I know he still makes executive decisions, but obviously his direct involvement with the development of mythtv is basically non-existent (at least from a commit persepctive) |
| [18:11:37] | iamlindoro: | He provides no real leadership, his only real involvement in the recent past is to weild a veto |
| [18:11:45] | iamlindoro: | wield |
| [18:12:08] | iamlindoro: | Which is not to lay blame, he has a new baby, a wife, and a busy career |
| [18:12:18] | iamlindoro: | it's just where the status of our leadership is right now |
| [18:13:11] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: going through my old e-mails in -users folder... haven't forgotten your "Record only HD or prefer HD over SD" example clause for custom edit... Just haven't gotten to it, yet (and might hold it until the custom edit page is fixed--when we have multiline textedits in mythui) |
| [18:13:40] | skd5aner: | also, is anyone going to be able to communicate to the community at least *something* about what's behind the .23 release delay? |
| [18:13:59] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: Doesn't seem to be any inclination to do so |
| [18:14:12] | skd5aner: | I mean, I can put a few pieces of the puzzle together from a few comments in IRC, but beyond that it's a bit cryptic |
| [18:14:13] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: If it makes you feel any better the developers have been largely in the dark as well |
| [18:14:25] | skd5aner: | apparently, I'm guessing something to do with legal issues |
| [18:14:29] | sphery: | skd5aner: you likely know as much as we do |
| [18:14:30] | iamlindoro: | s/the developers/the rank and file developers/ |
| [18:14:34] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: if it makes you feel any better, official releases are really only there for the benefit of packagers |
| [18:14:42] | wagnerrp: | we dont recommend anyone actually use them |
| [18:14:49] | meshe: | legal issues? |
| [18:14:51] | sphery: | yeah, 0.23-fixes is good |
| [18:15:05] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: yea, but it could mean future impact to the overall project... obviously I don't care, I'm on .23-fixes, it's a release for me |
| [18:15:27] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: 0.22 came after almost two years of development |
| [18:15:34] | wagnerrp: | no one was expecting another release so soon anyway |
| [18:16:17] | skd5aner: | meshe: all I can do is speculate, but I think IJR recieved a packages regarding MPEG licensing, it was just 1 line in IRC a few weeks ago, and I think that FFMPEG is involved too, so... other than that, I don't want to spread rumors |
| [18:16:37] | iamlindoro: | heh, "other than these rumors, I don't want to spread rumors." |
| [18:17:13] | mag0o: | go vp8 :) |
| [18:17:29] | sphery: | I heard that MythTV got bought by Microsoft, so there won't be a 0.23--it will turn into Windows MCE 8. |
| [18:17:32] | iamlindoro: | Would be simple if we all dropped back to framegrabbers |
| [18:17:32] | mag0o: | and make the whole frontend html5 compatible |
| [18:17:39] | skd5aner: | eh, it was what was said on a public channel, it happened |
| [18:17:40] | sphery: | Of course, it won't run on Windows. |
| [18:17:55] | wagnerrp: | mag0o: vp8 for recordings would be great.... erm, i use hardware encoders.... down with framegrabbers! |
| [18:17:57] | kormoc: | or safari or chrome or ie or opera... |
| [18:18:00] | meshe: | sphery: damn, i hope you devs got stock |
| [18:18:33] | sphery: | I'm now a 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00001% owner of Microsoft. |
| [18:18:48] | kormoc: | mag0o: there is no single video format all html5 browsers support, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTML5_video#Browser_support |
| [18:18:51] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro needs some folks in his MKV camp for the container ;) |
| [18:18:52] | meshe: | you're rich!!!!!!! |
| [18:18:55] | wagnerrp: | sphery: is that the margin of error of some system? |
| [18:19:01] | sphery: | kormoc: http://newteevee.com/2010/04/12/google-to-ope . . . html5-video/ |
| [18:19:10] | sphery: | there's hope that it will be chosen |
| [18:19:17] | sphery: | but since devices don't really support it... |
| [18:19:18] | mag0o: | yeah, that ^^ |
| [18:19:32] | kormoc: | it won't make html5 spec |
| [18:19:46] | kormoc: | it's long past that deadline for changes |
| [18:20:03] | iamlindoro: | well, html5 spec doesn't specify any specific codec, right? |
| [18:20:03] | sphery: | wagnerrp: had to use arbitrary-precision arithmetic to calculate it. gmp was barely able to handle it. |
| [18:20:05] | kormoc: | and apple and microsoft don't want a standard video format and they're both on the html5 board |
| [18:20:08] | kormoc: | iamlindoro: correct |
| [18:20:20] | sphery: | kormoc: exactly |
| [18:20:42] | iamlindoro: | Right, so if Google open sources VP8, simultaneouly announces Youtube will go VP8, and the availableility of patches for Firefox, things could end up good :) |
| [18:20:47] | meshe: | the author of the html5 spec dropped any mention of codecs |
| [18:20:50] | wagnerrp: | kormoc: sure... but they make youtube use it for anything beyond 240p, and it will quickly end up the de-facto standard |
| [18:21:08] | sphery: | kormoc: btw, since I promised this ages ago, I should make good on my promise to pass something on to you: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/418363#418363 |
| [18:21:19] | kormoc: | wagnerrp: I don't think they would |
| [18:21:42] | kormoc: | that's playing with anti-trust fire if they have the only browser that can play youtube videos |
| [18:21:52] | sphery: | they want apple users... they'll continue to support MPEG-4 <whichever> as long as iPad/iPhone only support that |
| [18:22:07] | sphery: | but Firefox will support it |
| [18:22:09] | iamlindoro: | kormoc: Why would it be? Minimally Firefox and Chrome could have it added in a matter of hours |
| [18:22:13] | wagnerrp: | no, you could play low resolution videos with flash |
| [18:22:24] | sphery: | according to the article they'll announce support for it when Google announces it |
| [18:22:33] | ** sphery wonders if there's any real clues in the repo ** | |
| [18:22:37] | kormoc: | sphery: we just set it on 0.22+ non-conditionally |
| [18:22:58] | kormoc: | sphery: but there's a chance that error is during php engine startup and thus there's no way other then adding it to the php.ini file to get it to shut up |
| [18:23:20] | kormoc: | iamlindoro: I was fairly sure firefox stated they won't use ffmpeg/etc and had to write their own codecs for inclusion |
| [18:23:25] | kormoc: | huh |
| [18:23:30] | kormoc: | perhaps they reversed that then |
| [18:23:31] | sphery: | kormoc: OK, I'll assume he was either on 0.21-fixes or he was using the version before the time zone check conditional was fixed |
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| [18:24:17] | sphery: | kormoc: since we haven't heard any more of it... |
| [18:24:27] | dfletcher: | so if I'm doing a brand new installation right now 23-fixes is the recommended installation? |
| [18:24:52] | meshe: | oooh, sphery, i have a question for the fix broken myth db guy :) what tables do i need to import from a 21-fixes to a 23-fixes to bring my recordings over? |
| [18:25:07] | meshe: | and recorded history |
| [18:25:33] | wagnerrp: | meshe: you run gentoo? |
| [18:25:44] | meshe: | ubuntu |
| [18:26:04] | sphery: | meshe: use the script and a --partial_restore flag... http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . base_Restore + http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . _of_a_backup + http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . ading_MythTV |
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| [18:26:19] | sphery: | meshe: but note that there's no benefit to doing that over just bringing over the /entire/ database |
| [18:26:21] | wagnerrp: | the common database issues only occurred among users running their sql server on a stock gentoo machine |
| [18:26:29] | sphery: | meshe: especially if you keep the same hostname after the upgrade |
| [18:26:37] | wagnerrp: | meshe: what specific error are you having? |
| [18:26:49] | wagnerrp: | its very likely your problem is in converting the tables you need for recordings |
| [18:26:59] | sphery: | dfletcher: officially, not necessarily, but /I/ recommend 0.23-fixes |
| [18:27:21] | meshe: | i'm not, i set up a fresh system new db, just want to know which tables i need to extract rows from for recording metadata and recording history |
| [18:27:33] | meshe: | i have a full mysqldump of the old system |
| [18:27:37] | sphery: | meshe: your best bet is definitely a full restore |
| [18:27:48] | wagnerrp: | meshe: the problem with that is those tables have changed |
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| [18:28:02] | wagnerrp: | you would have to manually walk those tables through the schema changes before you could merge them in |
| [18:28:15] | sphery: | if you change hostname, restore the DB, then run http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . d_or_backend for each old hostname you want converted to a new hostname |
| [18:28:16] | meshe: | that's not a big deal |
| [18:28:34] | meshe: | i can quickly massage the data into the new structure |
| [18:28:38] | sphery: | wagnerrp: there's info on how to properly do a partial restore when upgrading in the wiki |
| [18:28:44] | sphery: | http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . ading_MythTV |
| [18:29:02] | dfletcher: | sphery, hmm it's that or the Ubuntu packages. tempted just because newer == sexier ;) |
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| [18:29:29] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: ubuntu provides packages for 0.23-fixes |
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| [18:29:39] | wagnerrp: | at least under 10.04 |
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| [18:29:55] | sphery: | basically, you need to upgrade your 0.21-fixes DB to 0.23-fixes, then backup, then drop db, then create new DB, then run mythtv-setup, then exit mythtv-setup, then partial restore of the upgraded, complete 0.23-fixes DB, then run mythtv-setup, then configure everything from scratch, then start mythbackend, then run mythfrontend, then configure everything from scratch |
| [18:30:04] | sphery: | or, just do a full restore and upgrade and enjoy |
| [18:30:17] | sphery: | there is /absolutely/ no benefit to doing a partial restore |
| [18:30:18] | iamlindoro: | Tough call |
| [18:30:25] | iamlindoro: | They both sound so nice |
| [18:30:45] | sphery: | It does /not/ make the DB smaller. It does /not/ make the DB faster. It does /not/ make the DB worth $6M. |
| [18:30:54] | dfletcher: | ah wagnerrp I'm still on 9.10. but I'll be running on multiple machines, I wonder if it'll be easier to keep everything synced *outside* any package managers |
| [18:31:02] | wagnerrp: | but you may pass go and collect $200 |
| [18:31:17] | sphery: | dfletcher: http://www.mythbuntu.org/auto-builds |
| [18:31:30] | meshe: | sphery: my paths are all different now, everything is using storage groups |
| [18:31:33] | justinh: | sphery: oh I dunno, if somebody has had years of randomly named frontends on their network... ;-) |
| [18:31:40] | sphery: | dfletcher: they have 0.23-fixes for 9.10, unless I'm completely mistaken |
| [18:31:40] | meshe: | not sure that a full restore will do what i need |
| [18:31:53] | dfletcher: | oh hey neat sphery and yes I want to do development and keep up to date. that's neat. |
| [18:31:54] | sphery: | justinh: the settings tables are a negligible size different |
| [18:31:59] | sphery: | difference |
| [18:32:40] | wagnerrp: | sphery: oh, but it looks so dirty when youre tinkering inside the database... :P |
| [18:32:41] | justinh: | dfletcher: doesn't mean you can do development – you still need to build mythtv from svn yourself |
| [18:32:50] | sphery: | meshe: for mythvideo, clearing things out may be useful, but I'd do that after a full restore with: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/406462#406462 |
| [18:33:14] | dfletcher: | justinh, well the auto builds feature seems nice for keeping up to the minute |
| [18:33:25] | justinh: | fwiw, I wouldn't |
| [18:33:37] | wagnerrp: | meshe: yeah, if you have any TV series in mythvideo, those should be flushed and rescanned |
| [18:33:40] | dfletcher: | oh? heh yeah I should probably run somthing more stable in the living room :) |
| [18:33:53] | justinh: | if 'up to the minute' means 'developers disabled a feature I really need every day' |
| [18:34:01] | sphery: | dfletcher: though I recommend using auto-builds of the -fixes branches... Not trunk. If you run trunk you /need/ to subscribe to, read, and keep up with everything on the mythtv-commits and mythtv-dev mailing lists |
| [18:34:02] | meshe: | what about the paths for recordings? or will the storage group handle that? |
| [18:34:20] | wagnerrp: | what do you mean? |
| [18:34:29] | sphery: | dfletcher: otherwise when we knowingly break things, we get tons of invalid tickets that just prevent us from getting things done. |
| [18:34:42] | wagnerrp: | mythtv doesnt care where your recordings are, as long as it can find them on the same machine name in the same storage group |
| [18:34:51] | sphery: | meshe: storage groups will handle that... just use mythtv-setup to change the path one time in the SG and you're set |
| [18:34:53] | meshe: | ahh, ok |
| [18:34:57] | iamlindoro: | justinh: their auto-builds are just -fixes |
| [18:34:59] | meshe: | sweet |
| [18:35:06] | dfletcher: | sphery, cool thanks. I really want to get more involved in this community. I tried building my own PVR and could only take it so far on my own :) heh yeah auto update on fixes sounds good for my main system |
| [18:35:10] | iamlindoro: | they have packages for trunk, but configured properly, the user is just getting updates to -fixes |
| [18:35:20] | sphery: | meshe: the *only* disclaimer is that MythTV does not handle hostname changes automatically... Thus http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Database_Backup_an . . . d_or_backend |
| [18:35:21] | justinh: | hmmm. there be the rub then |
| [18:35:25] | justinh: | configured properly ;-) |
| [18:35:51] | dfletcher: | OMG WOO! this never happens! my newegg order arrived a whole day early! media PC is HERE!!! :D |
| [18:35:53] | iamlindoro: | Pretty tough to screw up, just have to *not* tell it to upgrade you to trunk |
| [18:35:57] | sphery: | meshe: though the best option is to use the same hostname (and IP) for each logical component of your myth install--same hostname/IP for master backend, for each frontend, ... |
| [18:35:58] | meshe: | sphery: thanks |
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| [18:36:15] | meshe: | hopefully i can catch it before it records more tonight :S |
| [18:36:23] | dfletcher: | mmmm just look at this sexy beast :) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500036 |
| [18:36:47] | iamlindoro: | shame about the atom processor |
| [18:37:01] | iamlindoro: | Maybe next time you can get a proper computer ;) |
| [18:37:15] | dfletcher: | hehe it'll be fine for a frontend |
| [18:37:20] | dfletcher: | great I bet |
| [18:37:24] | justinh: | myers. |
| [18:37:33] | iamlindoro: | So long as all you do can be handled by viddypoo |
| [18:37:33] | wagnerrp: | youre not intending to use that wireless are you? |
| [18:37:39] | iamlindoro: | if not, well... nice knowing ya |
| [18:37:43] | dfletcher: | no wagnerrp that was just on there |
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| [18:38:10] | dfletcher: | the rear video connecters and nvidia ION were the two main selling points for m |
| [18:38:11] | dfletcher: | e |
| [18:39:07] | iamlindoro: | ION is firmly established as our next VIA EPIA |
| [18:39:16] | sphery: | yeah |
| [18:39:23] | iamlindoro: | In six months when we upgrade the UI and it can't keep up, oh the laughter |
| [18:39:39] | wagnerrp: | you dont think it would handle it? |
| [18:39:49] | justinh: | there is, has never been and never will be *any* substitute for CPU grunt for media playback duties |
| [18:39:54] | npm: | my $30.01 PVR500 from ebay works (in 'smplayer') .. now onto getting mythtv to not claim "all tuners are in use" ... |
| [18:40:00] | sphery: | not to mention what happens when nvidia decides to stop supporting the GPU's with their drivers |
| [18:40:05] | gbee: | oh the tears, even I'll be crying the day my atom netbook can't handle the UI |
| [18:40:13] | justinh: | npm: hint: don't use livetv. ever :) |
| [18:40:20] | wagnerrp: | npm: chances are you havent configure mythtv properly |
| [18:40:31] | npm: | what's the "dont use livetv" mean |
| [18:40:39] | justinh: | npm: I mean don't use livetv |
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| [18:40:48] | npm: | from myth or directly off the board? |
| [18:40:51] | justinh: | I dunno what could be so hard to understand |
| [18:40:54] | npm: | and why? |
| [18:41:19] | justinh: | sigh. |
| [18:41:23] | GrahamIRC (GrahamIRC!~GrahamIRC@93-97-162-128.zone5.bethere.co.uk) has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | |
| [18:41:31] | justinh: | anyway there are loads of reasons you could be getting that error |
| [18:41:33] | npm: | can;'t tell if you're joking, or if that's actually information i should take note of |
| [18:41:46] | justinh: | npm: livetv is just SO last century. and I'm not joking |
| [18:42:16] | npm: | it allows me to rate my ebay transaction as to whether the board works or not |
| [18:42:18] | iamlindoro: | npm: It's pretty much a unanimous agreement among experienced Myth users that liveTV is both unnecessary and to be avoided |
| [18:42:35] | JohnnyJboss: | too mad i can't convince my other half of that |
| [18:42:54] | GreyFoxx: | My wife HATES livetv and refuses to watch it :) |
| [18:42:58] | justinh: | if mythtv thinks all your tuners are in use a probable cause is that mythfrontend crashed or was unceremoniously killed while you were watching 'live tv' |
| [18:42:59] | npm: | i like live tv -minus twenty minutes |
| [18:43:03] | iamlindoro: | npm: And if the board works in mplayer, don't hold the poor ebay seller hostage to whether you can properly configure it in myth-- it works. |
| [18:43:04] | meshe: | Live TV == Tuner Tester |
| [18:43:05] | npm: | then i can skip the commercials |
| [18:43:12] | npm: | duh |
| [18:43:14] | JohnnyJboss: | god help me if a star trek marithon ties up a recorder when he want's to livetv |
| [18:43:31] | npm: | of course i'm not holding anybody hostage... the point of testing w/ livetv was to see if board works |
| [18:43:38] | npm: | next step is to properly add it to myth |
| [18:43:43] | justinh: | doesn't every trek fan have like every since dvd box set ever already? :-O |
| [18:43:52] | npm: | i've worked through that error message before... no worries |
| [18:43:53] | justinh: | s/since/single/ |
| [18:44:09] | npm: | now if you all would quit bidding up the prices on a 9500GT |
| [18:44:12] | npm: | :-) |
| [18:44:38] | justinh: | npm: like you've been told – it's either a misconfig issue, or all tuners really are still being used for some reason like a recording still in progress |
| [18:44:49] | justinh: | and yeah 'watch tv' is a recording |
| [18:44:56] | npm: | it's a misconfig |
| [18:45:21] | justinh: | I've even taken to stop using 'watch tv' for testing tuners |
| [18:45:41] | sphery: | misconfig's are best fixed by starting over... usually easiest to just reconfigure than to figure out what's misconfigured: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/264034#264034 |
| [18:45:50] | justinh: | schedule a bunch of simultaneous test recordings & off I go :) |
| [18:46:21] | npm: | yeah, i did start over... after having to delete all my tuners etc. |
| [18:52:26] | npm: | btw, for vdpau usage, does it matter if a graphics card (like 9500gt) is 512M or is 1G better? |
| [18:53:54] | wagnerrp: | no difference |
| [18:54:37] | npm: | yeah, i figure it probably doesn't even make use of anywhere close to the 512M for vdpau |
| [18:55:05] | iamlindoro: | That's a mistaken impression |
| [18:55:11] | npm: | but memory speed probably does make a difference (e.g. ddr3 vs ddr2) |
| [18:55:20] | iamlindoro: | 256 causes major issues with VDPAU, 512 is pretty much the bare minimum |
| [18:55:33] | npm: | interesting. |
| [18:55:34] | wagnerrp: | memory speed is typically not an issue |
| [18:55:51] | wagnerrp: | the only time ive heard it causing problems is with onboard video, and shared system memory |
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| [18:56:08] | wagnerrp: | if the chip downclocks itself due to lack of activity, it may starve the GPU |
| [18:56:26] | iamlindoro: | And when we start to do GL compositing/etc. at the same time as VDPAU decode and pulling the video in as a surface, more memory may become useful, or even required |
| [18:56:36] | highzeth: | iamlindoro: what major issues? Ive run with 256 and not had a single issue |
| [18:56:52] | npm: | well it's running a bunch of DSP ops over memory so it's gotta be somewhat dependent on mem speed... but phaps not the bottleneck |
| [18:57:17] | wagnerrp: | npm: modern graphics cards have gobs of memory bandwidth |
| [18:57:25] | wagnerrp: | far more than is necessary for video decoding |
| [18:57:53] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: Inability to create the VDPAU surfaces/start the renderer with certain video encodings-- if you've had no troubles, you're the exception rather than the rule |
| [18:57:57] | wagnerrp: | the only issue ive ever heard of was when using the shared 'turbocache' |
| [18:58:20] | npm: | yes, that's why vdpau works.. but i guess the baselevel membandwidth 10g/s is prob fast enough |
| [18:58:20] | cleith: | Hello, is it OK to ask some newbie questions here? |
| [18:58:39] | iamlindoro: | cleith: yes |
| [18:58:45] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: is that only a problem with the opengl renderer? and not one with vdpau itself? |
| [18:59:08] | highzeth: | iamlindoro: ok, then its something magical with the revo3600 then, out 3 have been flawless on 720p/1080i =) |
| [18:59:09] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp: what, the 256 MB one? No, think that was squarely on VDPAU |
| [18:59:24] | highzeth: | s/out/our/ |
| [18:59:28] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: Unlikely, more likely that you simply only watch video that doesn't trigger the issue |
| [18:59:37] | wagnerrp: | i remember way back in early 2009 issues with the 256MB cards working in mplayer, but not mythtv... but i thought that got resolved |
| [19:00:14] | cleith: | I don't quite get recording profiles. I have a hdpvr and my profiles (Default, LiveTV, etc) all specify low, med and high resolutions. How do I actually specify that I would like LiveTV to use high res for ex? |
| [19:00:25] | iamlindoro: | That was (and is) to do with all our OSD compositing, etc. |
| [19:00:42] | wagnerrp: | cleith: you cannot specify the recording resolution of the HDPVR |
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| [19:00:45] | iamlindoro: | cleith: The HD-PVR records at the resolution it is fed-- you don't specify it at all |
| [19:00:51] | wagnerrp: | it simply uses whatever resolution your STB give s it |
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| [19:01:05] | iamlindoro: | cleith: The three are there so that there are bitrates to choose from it it is fed 480, 720, or 1080 material |
| [19:01:30] | highzeth: | iamlindoro: that might be, odd tho with the bouquet of channels & providers we receive. Im not complaining tho |
| [19:01:39] | iamlindoro: | So in each Hd-PVR recording profile, you set bitrates for all three and it will choose the appropriate one based on the resolution of the recording. |
| [19:01:48] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: just wondering what my problem could have been a couple weeks ago when the ogl renderer refused to play some file |
| [19:02:01] | wagnerrp: | i dont remember off hand how much memory i allocated to my 8200 |
| [19:02:09] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: That's not odd at all, all the channels from a single provider are going to benefit from a similarity of encoding |
| [19:02:38] | cleith: | OK, how does that jive with settings I can change via v4l2-ctl? Does myth override? |
| [19:02:52] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: Basically, you're comparing the behavior or like-encoded channels, versus the next guy's provider might flip an encoder flag and bring that hardware to its knees at 256 |
| [19:03:04] | iamlindoro: | cleith: v4l2-ctl is transient |
| [19:03:13] | highzeth: | iamlindoro: I said bouquet of channels *and* providers, 1w, 5e, 13e, 15e, 19.2e & 28.2e.. |
| [19:03:21] | cleith: | iamlindoro: ? |
| [19:03:22] | iamlindoro: | it's just a command line tool for accessing the api-- anything you set there will be overriden by any v4l capture application |
| [19:03:33] | cleith: | OK |
| [19:03:41] | highzeth: | there are more differences in the providers/companies here in euro than you seem to think ;) |
| [19:04:18] | cleith: | Would it be silly to max out the bitrate for all profiles if I thought I had decent hardware otherwise? |
| [19:04:27] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: Could do without the smugness, I've spent the last year triaging and dealing with the bug reports-- if you're happy, that's great, but your experience isn't an expression of how the whole world works |
| [19:05:09] | highzeth: | there was no smugness in my respons, merely underlining my prev comment |
| [19:05:51] | iamlindoro: | highzeth: implying that I "seem to think" something was more than a little smug and offensive, especially as I'm only attempting to accurately answer the questions you are asking |
| [19:06:07] | iamlindoro: | cleith: No, though aa fair amount of the bitrate would be wasted at lower resolutions/framerates |
| [19:07:04] | cleith: | Other than larger files I suppose, would the quality of the lower res be improved? |
| [19:07:32] | highzeth: | "<iamlindoro> highzeth: Basically, you're comparing the behavior or like-encoded channels, versus the next guy's provider might flip an encoder flag and bring that hardware to its knees at 256" I replied to your assumtion that the diff euro providers use the same profiles & encoding techniques. But I'll zip it, see no point in discussing when you dont care to read what I say. pz |
| [19:07:50] | iamlindoro: | cleith: not beyond a certain bitrate |
| [19:08:29] | iamlindoro: | cleith: At lower resolutions there is a point of diminishing returns that (for example) at 480p will come after 4–6 Mbit... so cranking it to 13.5 won't gain you anything but a larger hard drive bill |
| [19:09:04] | wagnerrp: | highzeth: hes saying that certain broadcasters can and do transmit in formats not usable by 256MB cards, the fact that you can play all your channels means that your broadcasters do not (hence like-encoded) |
| [19:09:11] | cleith: | OK, thanx iamlindoro |
| [19:10:16] | iamlindoro: | np |
| [19:10:55] | cleith: | anyone using firewire to change channels on a dct6200 (I assume that is the way to go over IR blasting)? |
| [19:11:16] | ThisOtherGuy: | Hi All (again) |
| [19:11:22] | iamlindoro: | cleith: Lots of people are, but 6200 != 6200 != 6200 |
| [19:11:33] | ThisOtherGuy: | Can anyone help me understand what happened in http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8343 ? |
| [19:11:39] | iamlindoro: | cleith: Meaning my experience in my market could be absolute heaven... and you might get nothing in yours on the same box |
| [19:11:46] | ** j-rod has a qip-6200 ** | |
| [19:12:14] | j-rod: | J-e-f-f-A: you were asking about what I could still record off my cable box w/fios, right?... |
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| [19:12:18] | iamlindoro: | cleith: Just as with firewire capture, so regrettably is channel change sometimes-- though channel change tends to work more often for people |
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| [19:13:05] | j-rod: | J-e-f-f-A: didn't do an exhaustive check, but it seems I can still record everything I could before and still not record the things I couldn't before. |
| [19:13:07] | iamlindoro: | ThisOtherGuy: Your system had run completely out of memory. The kernel will attempt to protect itself by killing processes, including Myth |
| [19:13:31] | iamlindoro: | meaning some process had filled memory completely, and there's nothing there to indicate it was myth |
| [19:13:37] | dfletcher: | hah nice this mobo's letting me install OS over a USB DVD. this may be the easiest installation of any machine I've ever owned :) |
| [19:13:59] | cleith: | OK, well I sort of have it working, but is there any way to control which node the STB gets associated with? |
| [19:14:13] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: obviously youve never used PXE |
| [19:14:30] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, hah lies |
| [19:14:35] | dfletcher: | sure client side that's easy |
| [19:14:37] | tzanger: | pxe or etherboot rox muh sox |
| [19:14:39] | dfletcher: | settting it up is a PAIN :P |
| [19:14:40] | iamlindoro: | cleith: No, just use the GUID instead of port or node number |
| [19:14:52] | ThisOtherGuy: | iamlindro: thanks – I'm not running anything other than supporting services (window manager, sshd, etc) – any idea how this could have happened or what I can do next time to get more information? |
| [19:14:52] | iamlindoro: | cleith: run plugreport, get the guid of the box |
| [19:14:52] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: only the first use |
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| [19:15:11] | wagnerrp: | after that, you just flip a couple things in the BIOS to allow it |
| [19:15:16] | Christoph_vW: | is there any special trick to get EIT working? |
| [19:15:18] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, heh well this was like – screw in mobo, plug in memory, plug in hd, plug in USB DVD.. install :) |
| [19:15:18] | iamlindoro: | cleith: Then go 6200ch -g PutTheGUIDHere SomeChannelNumber |
| [19:15:20] | wagnerrp: | and let your automated install run |
| [19:15:43] | wagnerrp: | your scenario, you have to have a USB DVD drive, and you have to do each machine one-at-a-time |
| [19:15:45] | iamlindoro: | ThisOtherGuy: No way to speculate |
| [19:15:55] | cleith: | OK, so 6200ch will always search all nodes if you use -g even though it starts at 1 by default? |
| [19:16:02] | wagnerrp: | thats no fun even if youre only setting up a couple of machines |
| [19:16:05] | Christoph_vW: | I enabled EIT in backend setup but I only get "Unknown (Unkown)" in guide |
| [19:16:18] | iamlindoro: | cleith: Not exactly, but the same end result |
| [19:16:20] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, well I'm only doing one machine so meh :P |
| [19:16:36] | iamlindoro: | cleith: namely that the box can be connected to any port/node and channel changing will work |
| [19:16:40] | cleith: | Any particular reason it starts at node 1 and not 0? |
| [19:17:14] | iamlindoro: | cleith: It doesn't "start" at anything, really |
| [19:18:10] | cleith: | OK, but with -g it will always find the STB no matter where it sits, yeah? |
| [19:18:16] | iamlindoro: | in theoruy |
| [19:18:19] | iamlindoro: | theory |
| [19:18:56] | dfletcher: | iamlindoro, so btw what's the trouble you're seeing with ION? I don't get your Epia reference. |
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| [19:19:05] | ThisOtherGuy: | iamlindro: do you know of anything I can do the next time? |
| [19:19:14] | dfletcher: | I know the propriatery drivers stink. so do all other video systems :P |
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| [19:20:00] | cleith: | How important is it to set the n_p2p_connections=1? If it is important, I still have to do some scripting to figure out which node the STB magically gets associated with? How are others handling this? |
| [19:20:38] | iamlindoro: | dfletcher: It's a mad dash to buy hardware that is underpowered and which only has application to specific codecs and material, at the expense of a usable general purpose processor-- meaning it will quickly become outdated. The exact same thing happened when everyone bought Via EPIA systems. The only difference in this case is that the ION boxes don't support some common codecs already, and that the turnover is likely to be even faste |
| [19:20:46] | iamlindoro: | cleith: For channel changing? Not at all |
| [19:21:10] | iamlindoro: | cleith: For channel changing (and indeed, for most instances of capture) you shouldn't need to touch any of that at all |
| [19:23:06] | cleith: | OK, the wiki for mythtv/firewire made it sound like that was a must. |
| [19:23:13] | dfletcher: | aha I see iamlindoro. heh PCs should just have a couple huge FPGAs for a north bridge :P |
| [19:23:52] | dfletcher: | then we could all install the codec of the moment on it |
| [19:24:00] | justinh: | pfft. |
| [19:24:16] | meshe: | isnt' that what an OS and cpu do? |
| [19:24:18] | justinh: | assuming the fpga had enough gates to cope with the complexity of the codec, sure |
| [19:24:27] | sphery: | I completely agree with iamlindoro . IMHO, the frontend should be the most-powerful CPU in the system. |
| [19:24:35] | dougt_: | cleith: what I did was created a wrapper around 6200 that took the guid and changed that into the node for the firewire box. then in myth setup, my channel changer was "/path/to/wrapper/6200.sh GUID " |
| [19:24:43] | dougt_: | cleith: the script looks like: http://pastebin.org/149502 |
| [19:25:03] | sphery: | I have Athlon XP 2400+ and 2000+ for backends and have an Athlon X2 6000+ for frontend (and only because it's an old frontend). |
| [19:25:25] | dfletcher: | justinh, well I was assuming it would have embedded CPU(s), not a fully embedded codec really. the FPGA would just have useful subroutines done up in hardware |
| [19:25:27] | wagnerrp: | that 2000+ is good enough without XvMC? |
| [19:25:47] | sphery: | Granted, if I were buying today, I'd buy for lower-power usage, but /without/ paying the premium Intel is charging for "low-power usage" name--Atom--and instead get a nice low-TDP Core 2 or Athlon II X2 |
| [19:26:21] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: none of that is necessary |
| [19:26:23] | sphery: | dfletcher: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/25w-performance-pc,2551.html , though you can do fine with http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-e7200-g31,2039.html and may want to read http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-ato . . . cy,2069.html |
| [19:26:29] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: it was for me. |
| [19:26:32] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: 6200ch already takes guid as a parameter |
| [19:26:54] | dougt_: | oh, really? |
| [19:26:56] | iamlindoro: | yes |
| [19:26:58] | iamlindoro: | -g |
| [19:27:07] | dougt_: | ah. cool. |
| [19:27:18] | cleith: | thanx dougt_ |
| [19:27:26] | dougt_: | cleith: what iamlindoro said. |
| [19:27:29] | sphery: | dfletcher: Atom is just a processor that's low-power usage because Intel said it's so. When you factor in chipset and system usage, you can get a /very/ competitive (power-usage) system with a real CPU |
| [19:27:36] | sphery: | and without the limitations of the Atom |
| [19:27:54] | dfletcher: | sphery, I wasn't talking about the Atom. I was talking about the "fancy" ION north bridge |
| [19:27:56] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: have you ever had problems daisy chaining firewire boxes? |
| [19:28:06] | meshe: | after having owned an atom, i would never buy one again |
| [19:28:17] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: No, though admittedly I don't have them daisy chained presently, though not because I ever had trouble |
| [19:28:23] | sphery: | dougt_: and feel free to take ideas from things like: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/sa4250_ch_guid and to create wiki pages with explanations, etc. |
| [19:28:28] | iamlindoro: | I have done so in the past without issue here, though |
| [19:28:53] | sphery: | dfletcher: but since ION means Atom + nvidia chipset, you're still stuck with Atom |
| [19:29:25] | wagnerrp: | i really wish someone made cheap mini-itx socketed boards |
| [19:29:33] | dfletcher: | sphery, yes well the main thing I was addressing was the fact that the codecs built into ION get outdated. nothing else. |
| [19:29:44] | sphery: | IMHO, AMD is (and has always been) correct in their statement that there's absolutely no reason for Atom to exist. A properly-designed system can give similar power-usage without using a compute-challenged CPU. |
| [19:29:52] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: yeah, i got another box from comcast last night, plugged it in, and myth lost its marbles. |
| [19:29:55] | sphery: | dfletcher: true |
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| [19:30:08] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: need to figure out what is going on with it when I get some time. |
| [19:30:08] | dfletcher: | and I actually like coprocessors |
| [19:30:11] | sphery: | and you're stuck with whatever support you get from nvidia |
| [19:30:20] | dfletcher: | the lighter the CPU load, the more responsive the whole system is |
| [19:30:25] | sphery: | so if you get something their drivers don't handle, chances are the atom won't let you play it in software |
| [19:30:50] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: Are you using P2P or Broadcast Mode? My firewire bus will *only* work properly in broadcast mode, and I *think* it might be required if you daisy chain (but I'm not sure) |
| [19:30:50] | sphery: | yeah, using nvidia with a nice Core 2 or Athon II is not a bad thing |
| [19:30:55] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: pervasive multithreading does just a good a job at keeping the system responsive |
| [19:31:28] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, it's nothing like a fast nvidia. run Crysis on your CPU for example :P |
| [19:31:35] | dfletcher: | GL |
| [19:31:41] | wagnerrp: | but it seems were only recently coming back to what BeOS started in the 90s |
| [19:31:53] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: p2p..... interestingly, firewire_tester never has worked for me. ever. even though I am currently using firewire to record right now. |
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| [19:32:15] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: thats nothing to do with responsiveness, only computing capacity |
| [19:32:31] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: The alternative, of course, is just to drop a $10 firewire card in for a second port and call it a day :) |
| [19:32:53] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: the card I have has two ports on it. |
| [19:33:07] | iamlindoro: | there ya go, then maybe just use that |
| [19:33:12] | dfletcher: | what wagnerrp? if you ran just about any 3d app in the old Mesa software OpenGL implementation, it was *extraordinaly unresponsive* |
| [19:33:27] | dougt_: | iamlindoro: yeah. same problem since its the same host adaptor. |
| [19:33:47] | iamlindoro: | dougt_: So back to my original suggestion then :) |
| [19:33:59] | dougt_: | newegg ftw |
| [19:35:07] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: performance has nothing to do with responsiveness |
| [19:35:19] | wagnerrp: | just because the CPU was too slow to perform the rendering |
| [19:35:35] | wagnerrp: | doesnt mean the application has to ignore any input while it is waiting for the animation to complete |
| [19:36:34] | gbee: | I strongly suspect that Hauppauge are deliberately keeping the number of DVB-S2 cards in the supply chain low because it keeps the price high :/ They always seem to be in low stock and unreasonably priced, and this is before any DVB-S2 services have even launched in the UK, if I dare to wait until Freesat switches I expect prices to double or even triple :( |
| [19:37:12] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, of course it has to wait. the CPU is being completely hogged by 3d rendering |
| [19:37:28] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: only because the application allows it |
| [19:37:30] | dfletcher: | so input is slower, everything is |
| [19:37:31] | gbee: | absolutely nothing in the second hand market either, which isn't too surprising |
| [19:37:53] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, the point is that there is no reason to be doing all that multiplication on my CPU |
| [19:37:55] | wagnerrp: | theres no reason why you have to allow the 3d render to bogart the CPU until it is complete |
| [19:37:56] | dfletcher: | *that* is wasteful |
| [19:38:12] | wagnerrp: | im not saying it isnt wasteful |
| [19:38:15] | dfletcher: | and it takes up resources I could be browsing with or writing a CD or whatever |
| [19:38:32] | wagnerrp: | im saying that co-processors and moar powah are not the way to achieve responsiveness |
| [19:38:35] | wagnerrp: | proper programming is |
| [19:38:38] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: So looks like we have a rpm build failure and some pre-requisites that need updating in the rpm spec/build script, dunno if you want to review those/have me apply anything/whatever |
| [19:38:49] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, I think it's a combination of both |
| [19:38:53] | wagnerrp: | i dont |
| [19:38:56] | dfletcher: | else you are COMPLETELY cpu bound |
| [19:39:00] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: #7090 is the ticket, I think |
| [19:39:03] | gizmobay (gizmobay!~gizmobay@ip98-165-206-1.ph.ph.cox.net) has quit (Quit: Leaving) | |
| [19:39:06] | JohnnyJboss: | rpm strikes again ! |
| [19:39:10] | ** JohnnyJboss is ducking ** | |
| [19:39:18] | dfletcher: | which pfft, a co processor can completely kick the CPUs butt at specific things |
| [19:39:39] | wagnerrp: | correct, because it is a co-processor, dedicated to a specific task |
| [19:39:50] | iamlindoro: | JohnnyJboss: Just as broken as the debian build stuff is in trunk, as far as I know ;) |
| [19:39:52] | wagnerrp: | hence the term Application Specific Integrated Circuit |
| [19:39:56] | wagnerrp: | ASIC |
| [19:40:12] | iamlindoro: | JohnnyJboss: Except the rpm users have provided patches, and the ubuntu users are suspicously silent ;) |
| [19:40:19] | ** JohnnyJboss puts his fingers in his ears and says: I'm not listening... ** | |
| [19:40:33] | JohnnyJboss: | ubuntu users silent?? |
| [19:40:38] | JohnnyJboss: | that'll be the day ! |
| [19:40:56] | justinh: | they have forums to whine on |
| [19:40:58] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, you're arguing that good programming is more important than coprocessors – and I'm saying some things you can do with a coprocessor make the CPU extremely slow. why are you disagreeing? |
| [19:41:12] | iamlindoro: | Well they have slav^H^H^H packagers to answer to their every whim, what would they need to provide patches for? ;) |
| [19:41:38] | JohnnyJboss: | hey whats the kfce4 auto session started program that responds to input events? |
| [19:41:39] | justinh: | s/whim/forum\ or\ blog\ post/ |
| [19:41:53] | JohnnyJboss: | i had to disable it for my remote and now I don't rememember it's name |
| [19:41:56] | iamlindoro: | I actually like Ubuntu quite a lot and use it all over the place (use Fedora too) but there has been a tendency to try to turn every bugtracker into a launchpad whinefest since the rise of the distro :) |
| [19:41:59] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: im arguing that proper programming is necessary to responsiveness of a program |
| [19:42:08] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, well DUH |
| [19:42:09] | wagnerrp: | and it has nothing to do with how much or little power a system has |
| [19:42:17] | wagnerrp: | coprocessors or not |
| [19:44:10] | wagnerrp: | look at one of the UI changes that went in just prior to 0.22 |
| [19:44:47] | wagnerrp: | threading was put in that allowed metadata and image grabs to into the background in mythvideo, returning control to the user |
| [19:45:02] | wagnerrp: | the image downloads and scaling still took several seconds |
| [19:45:16] | wagnerrp: | and no processor or coprocessor in the world could change that |
| [19:45:22] | iamlindoro: | actually, that stuff has been threaded for ages |
| [19:45:32] | wagnerrp: | but the user had control back, and thats all that mattered |
| [19:45:35] | iamlindoro: | It was image scaling/loading that was threaded, not download |
| [19:45:39] | wagnerrp: | ah |
| [19:46:33] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, proper programming is just good because it's proper :P all I'm saying is – the less busy the CPU is, the quicker it responds to me. maybe not in your ideal OS in your head, but in real ones, yes it matters bigtime |
| [19:46:41] | justinh: | man, still nobody is selling reasonably priced cat5 a/v sender stuff |
| [19:47:26] | gbee: | justinh: wasn't that what you bought just the other day? |
| [19:47:40] | justinh: | gbee: only single channel video |
| [19:47:45] | wagnerrp: | justinh: are you talking about custom protocols and hardware? or simple balanced baluns? |
| [19:47:54] | justinh: | baluns of course |
| [19:48:02] | j-rod: | iamlindoro: looking now... |
| [19:48:03] | dfletcher: | boinc is a perfect example. I allow it to take a big chunk of my CPU a lot of times. because of this it can make windows a bit choppy. good/bad programming whatever, it's just realism here |
| [19:48:10] | justinh: | converting to IP & back for 20–30 metres is a bit stupid ;-) |
| [19:48:30] | justinh: | dfletcher: so don't run it then |
| [19:48:38] | dfletcher: | but if someone made a "boinc" card it would not slow me down |
| [19:48:44] | justinh: | save the planet. keep your CPU idle longer |
| [19:48:46] | j-rod: | iamlindoro: oh, yeah, new files. |
| [19:48:48] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: Should be the last two patches, I think-- One is a fix for a build failure, the other adds the MNV pre-requisites |
| [19:48:57] | wagnerrp: | dfletcher: you are running that at idle priority, right? |
| [19:49:01] | dfletcher: | justinh, heh I'll save the planet by letting my machine fold proteins :) |
| [19:49:03] | j-rod: | I've already fixed all of that in the spec I use |
| [19:49:11] | j-rod: | but I suck, and neglected to commit it to mythtv svn |
| [19:49:16] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: heh |
| [19:49:21] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, yeah. it still sucks up resources. |
| [19:49:28] | wagnerrp: | the only reason it should make your computer slower is if it sucks down a lot of ram, and causes your stuff to swap |
| [19:49:37] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: Well, you are the boss of RPMs, just figured I would bring it up since I've been consolidating the RPM tickets into one |
| [19:49:56] | j-rod: | iamlindoro: ew. that Requires: flash-plugin thing is NOT going in there. :) |
| [19:50:16] | j-rod: | well, at least, not in any rpm fusion specs |
| [19:50:16] | iamlindoro: | j-rod: Heh, OK, but it does if you want MNV to do anything :) |
| [19:50:20] | dfletcher: | wagnerrp, "should" sure fine. but in 20 years experience with computers, I can tell you that 100% CPU = choppy response |
| [19:50:29] | iamlindoro: | though admittedly it will run... I think. |
| [19:50:37] | j-rod: | iamlindoro: aren't there any html5 sites it supports?… ;) |
| [19:50:53] | iamlindoro: | nope! (and don't think Qt Webkit will do HTML5 yet either) |
| [19:50:56] | j-rod: | main issue is that flash-plugin isn't redistributable |
| [19:51:23] | j-rod: | er, that might not be quite right |
| [19:51:39] | j-rod: | its not in any fedora repo but adobe's own, anyway |
| [19:51:42] | justinh: | flash-plugin hates freedom, man |
| [19:51:50] | j-rod: | plus, it sucks balls |
| [19:52:11] | j-rod: | I care less about the freedom part and more about the fact it sucks |
| [19:52:19] | justinh: | heh |
| [19:52:24] | justinh: | me too |
| [19:52:34] | justinh: | eats memory. leaks memory. mmm crashy |
| [19:52:49] | wagnerrp: | we should sick Udo on them |
| [19:52:51] | ** j-rod is a realist, will use proprietary stuff when its the best tool for the job, no problem ** | |
| [19:53:05] | iamlindoro: | Actually looks like Qt's webkit has some degree of HTML5 support already-- wonder how it would handle a HTML5 video site |
| [19:53:12] | justinh: | but.. teh freedomz :-\ |
| [19:53:17] | iamlindoro: | can't imagine that would work without codecs |
| [19:53:37] | j-rod: | but, ogg theora! and vp8! |
| [19:53:51] | iamlindoro: | Anyway, I'm all for a VP8-playin, HTML5-lovin MNV... but stuff just ain't there yet :) |
| [19:54:18] | wagnerrp: | i imagine it uses gstreamer for playback |
| [19:54:27] | justinh: | vp8? another new codec? meh |
| [19:54:28] | janneg: | iamlindoro: I think it uses phonon. qtwebkit has at least a phonon dep on gentoo |
| [19:54:41] | iamlindoro: | ah, I see |
| [19:54:42] | j-rod: | I've got a batch of package-related things I need to update now... |
| [19:54:42] | wagnerrp: | VP8 is another codec from sorenson |
| [19:54:45] | iamlindoro: | makes sense |
| [19:55:06] | j-rod: | vp8 was purchased by teh google, and they're reportedly about to open-source it |
| [19:55:13] | wagnerrp: | much more recent derivative of the codecs originally used for flash and quicktime |
| [19:55:14] | janneg: | wagnerrp: no, vpX are from On2 |
| [19:55:17] | justinh: | ahh.. no viddypow fer it then |
| [19:55:22] | justinh: | meheheheh |
| [19:55:38] | wagnerrp: | hmm... nevermind that then |
| [19:55:38] | j-rod: | speaking of vdpau… my 9600GT just hates me. |
| [19:55:39] | iamlindoro: | Anyway, I'm all for switching the grabbers to pull from HTML5 equivalents once the APIs, browser, etc. support it |
| [19:56:15] | j-rod: | flawless playback of my mpeg2 hdtv recordings using software decode |
| [19:56:23] | j-rod: | artifacts galore w/vdpau |
| [19:56:29] | gbee: | justinh: vp8 is the successor to the old vp3 which on2 opensourced and was subsequently the basis for Theora |
| [19:56:39] | justinh: | ahh. |
| [19:56:50] | j-rod: | and its not deinterlacer-specific either |
| [19:56:53] | ** justinh is not down with current tech. it's all a bit.. mmmmmm ** | |
| [19:57:17] | j-rod: | need to triple-check that the ion is still playing back the same stuff using vdpau just fine |
| [19:57:26] | iamlindoro: | Though from what I understand the only things VP8 and VP3 share is two letters |
| [19:57:30] | wagnerrp: | so easy to get all these things confused |
| [19:57:53] | j-rod: | then apparently, yell at nvidia to fix things on my 9600gt, or, more likely to result in good results sooner, just buy a different card (thinking GF220-ish) |
| [19:57:56] | sphery: | VP8, making it hard to keep up with The(ora) Jones's |
| [19:58:08] | gbee: | no-one has really played with vp8 to my knowledge, but it has the potential to stand up to H.264 and therefore a valuable addition to the patent-free (well unenforced) codecs |
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| [19:58:39] | wagnerrp: | gbee: i saw some article actually claiming better compression efficiency than h264 |
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| [19:58:53] | sphery: | gbee: yeah, you have to wonder how much of it is actually unencumbered by other tiny patents like those that plague MPEG/MP3/... |
| [19:59:26] | wagnerrp: | sphery: is mp3 still under any patents? |
| [19:59:32] | sphery: | it's not like there's just one patent holder for all of MPEG-2... It's actually so complex that a company was created /just/ to sell patent coverage |
| [19:59:36] | gbee: | the suggestion is that Google bought and opensourced it just to end the HTML5 codec war, and kill MPEG-LAs plan to cash in |
| [19:59:37] | iamlindoro: | parts of it are |
| [19:59:39] | sphery: | wagnerrp: sure, just ask Sisvel |
| [19:59:41] | devinheitmueller: | Yeah, the whole "patent-free" assertion is going to fail miserably. Just because the owners of the standard are making it available without patents doesn't mean that it doesn't already infringe on fifty other companies' patents. |
| [19:59:42] | iamlindoro: | until 2014 I think |
| [19:59:59] | wagnerrp: | i thought mp3 was release in 1991 |
| [20:00:00] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: agreed |
| [20:00:13] | devinheitmueller: | I suspect if VP8 sees any traction, MPEG-LA will go after them for infringing on H.264 patents. |
| [20:00:26] | iamlindoro: | devinheitmueller: At least google is a big boy and can fight that fight |
| [20:00:49] | sphery: | patent free is a great idea, but thanks to the sorry state of US patent law (and the fact that they allow software patents), it's impossible in today's world for any non-trivial application of software |
| [20:00:53] | iamlindoro: | versus just picking off the comparably weak open source projects with licensing demands |
| [20:00:57] | gbee: | sphery: reason Google bought an established codec was only because no patent suits had been filed, if there were any patent issues then you'd expect someone to have filed aginst ON2 long before now |
| [20:01:09] | devinheitmueller: | Sure, if they go after Google. They may very well just go after the people who use it though (like Apple is going after HTC instead of Google) |
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| [20:01:33] | sphery: | not that I'm saying I try to infringe patents--I will actually change code so it doesn't--but I'm sure you can find violations in any software you investigate closely enough |
| [20:01:40] | dougt_ (dougt_!~dougt@nat/mozilla/x-airyxijqridankaa) has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) | |
| [20:01:58] | devinheitmueller: | Yes. I'm sure MythTV like most projects probably infringes on hundreds of patents. |
| [20:02:27] | sphery: | lack of patent suits doesn't mean a lack of patent violations--only that the company with the CODEC didn't have deep enough pockets to make it worthwhile |
| [20:02:28] | gbee: | devinheitmueller: Google would have to support anyone affected by such suits, they can't expect anyone to use the codec without such a guarentee |
| [20:02:34] | sphery: | now that Google is the pockets... |
| [20:02:35] | devinheitmueller: | For example, it works with ATSC, hence infringes all sorts of patents related to the PSIP standard. |
| [20:03:28] | sphery: | gbee: which is exactly why I don't ever see HTML5 video tags being useful in the real world |
| [20:03:37] | gbee: | and Google wants everyone to use it, because they don't want to pay MPEG-LA for H.264 in Chrome |
| [20:03:42] | sphery: | because no one will ever stop suing people |
| [20:03:59] | devinheitmueller: | ... and now that I've said it in a public forum, you're all now guilty of willful infringement! |
| [20:04:21] | ** kormoc sticks his fingers in his ears and goes LALALALALALALA ** | |
| [20:04:25] | devinheitmueller: | Google already has a license for H.264 for Chrome. |
| [20:04:26] | iamlindoro: | "No, your honor, we just access data that those naughty LinuxTV devs give us. They told us it was all ok!" |
| [20:04:30] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: I have a -users list post that says otherwise... and the guy /will/ be a lawyer in August. |
| [20:04:37] | ** kormoc modifies the timestamp so he did that a few hours ago and hasn't stopped ** | |
| [20:04:58] | ** sphery hacks Beirdo ** | |
| [20:05:06] | sphery: | s website to show he logged out before this conversation |
| [20:05:27] | sphery: | gotta get a keyboard with a better-placed Enter key |
| [20:05:34] | JohnnyJboss: | hate that |
| [20:05:50] | kormoc: | JohnnyJboss: you hate better placed enter keys? |
| [20:05:57] | wagnerrp: | i just hate when they mess with my pipe and delete keys |
| [20:06:00] | kormoc: | that's an odd hatred |
| [20:06:03] | iamlindoro: | You eat pieces of crap for breakfast? |
| [20:06:05] | JohnnyJboss: | i hate the keyaboards that have them all wonky |
| [20:06:08] | gbee: | MPEG-LA waived the license for a period of 4 years for anyone using H.264 for HTML5, you have to wonder why google would choose to pay anyway? |
| [20:06:10] | devinheitmueller: | iamlindoro: hey, the LinuxTV stuff is just a "series of tubes" which moves data from the hardware to the application. |
| [20:06:14] | JohnnyJboss: | like where the | should be |
| [20:06:35] | iamlindoro: | devinheitmueller: Right, and we're a series of tubes that moves stuff from the disk to the eyeballs ;) |
| [20:06:37] | kormoc: | devinheitmueller: but they're not common carrier tubes! |
| [20:06:56] | sphery: | gbee: was that for /en/coding as well as /de/coding? |
| [20:07:28] | gbee: | sphery: decoding only I imagine |
| [20:07:58] | devinheitmueller: | gbee: they waived the *fees* for producing content. You still need a license to consume the content though. |
| [20:08:37] | wagnerrp: | well then we just move to all VDPAU |
| [20:08:43] | wagnerrp: | let nvidia pay 'the man' |
| [20:08:46] | devinheitmueller: | The Mozilla guys gave a pretty good overview of the situation in their argument for why they chose not to license it: http://www.osnews.com/story/22787/Mozilla_Exp . . . License_h264 |
| [20:09:14] | sphery: | devinheitmueller: so the decoder in the browser requires a license, but the encoder on YouTube doesn't |
| [20:09:17] | gbee: | devinheitmueller: that's not what I read, but maybe the news item was wrong |
| [20:09:36] | devinheitmueller: | sphery: they almost certainly already have a licensed encoder. They just don't have to pay royalties to use it. |
| [20:09:58] | sphery: | oh, they waived the "pay per view" fee... |
| [20:10:01] | sphery: | wow |
| [20:10:01] | devinheitmueller: | Also, redistribution of the software is very different from redistribution of content. |
| [20:10:07] | wagnerrp: | devinheitmueller: i had heard they were just using x264 for encoding |
| [20:10:12] | sphery: | I didn't realize they were considering that |
| [20:10:23] | devinheitmueller: | The whole situation is a mess. |
| [20:10:30] | sphery: | agreed |
| [20:10:41] | sphery: | software patents are a mess and should be totally nullified |
| [20:10:51] | sphery: | software is /not/ an invention |
| [20:11:02] | JohnnyJboss: | hack the holobands! |
| [20:11:03] | gbee: | devinheitmueller: looking at the date of that article and the bit where it says "the current fee exemption for free-to-the-viewer internet delivery is only in effect until the end of 2010." I suspect we're talking about different things |
| [20:11:07] | sphery: | it's copyrightable, not patentable, IMHO |
| [20:11:09] | devinheitmueller: | As much as I hate patent trolls, I can only hope that their existence will drive the major players to push for patent reform. |
| [20:11:18] | sphery: | yeah, me too |
| [20:11:35] | wagnerrp: | sphery: does MPEG-LA actually patent software? or just the algorithms and formats used by their specifications? |
| [20:11:36] | devinheitmueller: | gbee: after the article they did extend the deadline. |
| [20:11:51] | devinheitmueller: | wagnerrp: the algorithms and formats. |
| [20:12:21] | devinheitmueller: | Nothing MPEG-LA licenses is relevant to the implementation itself (although the specs and such that they distribute are copyrighted) |
| [20:12:52] | devinheitmueller: | hence, even if you write your own implementation from scratch, you're totally screwed without paying a royalty. |
| [20:13:01] | sphery: | gbee: http://css.dzone.com/articles/h264-royalty-free-until-2016 |
| [20:13:21] | sphery: | wagnerrp: whether software or algorithms, it's not an invention... it's an idea |
| [20:13:40] | JohnnyJboss: | i gotta say i was pleasantly surprised how much content is on newsgroups as x264 encoded |
| [20:13:42] | sphery: | copyrights are for IP, patents are for inventions |
| [20:13:51] | sphery: | you can't patent mathematical formulae, so... |
| [20:13:52] | wagnerrp: | software, no, not an invention... algorithm, thats arguable |
| [20:13:56] | iamlindoro: | Heh, tonight is the first time in ages I will have three QAM tuners in action at once |
| [20:14:00] | JohnnyJboss: | since my FE is revo i'm dependant on vdpau |
| [20:14:10] | iamlindoro: | (plus two HD-PVRs) |
| [20:14:36] | JohnnyJboss: | iamlindoro: what's on tonight? |
| [20:14:55] | wagnerrp: | 90210, Melrose Place, ... |
| [20:14:56] | gbee: | sphery: thanks, guess I either misread or someone got it backwards in the article I read |
| [20:14:56] | sphery: | heh, we should just switch Myth to only supporting VDPAU decoding and no encoding, then we're using only a licensed decoder and not encoding. |
| [20:15:24] | sphery: | gbee: I hadn't read that yet, so I was just quoting the one I recently saw... |
| [20:15:57] | iamlindoro: | V, Glee, Lost, Justified, Daily Show/Colbert, a cooking show, Good Wife, Parenthood |
| [20:16:06] | j-rod: | sphery: I actually kinda like that idea... |
| [20:16:19] | sphery: | j-rod: oh, yeah, and of course Crystal, too |
| [20:16:34] | iamlindoro: | I'd been meaning to talk to sphery about his Crystal problem |
| [20:16:41] | JohnnyJboss: | ha ha |
| [20:16:44] | JohnnyJboss: | ZING! |
| [20:16:45] | sphery: | It's just a method of dealing with things |
| [20:16:46] | iamlindoro: | drugs are bad, mkay? |
| [20:16:51] | j-rod: | woo, got a shipment of goodies from monoprice today... |
| [20:16:57] | sphery: | things like stupid patents |
| [20:17:05] | trumee (trumee!~nobody@cpc2-cmbg15-0-0-cust1000.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com) has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | |
| [20:17:56] | sphery: | iamlindoro: and if we do switch to VDPAU only, we can completely drop Xv and XvMC and ... |
| [20:18:09] | sphery: | and only opengl painters |
| [20:18:11] | iamlindoro: | viddypoo, myyyy heeeerooooo |
| [20:18:21] | sphery: | heh |
| [20:18:36] | sphery: | hey, if we can use it to achieve my own personal agenda, it's a good tool |
| [20:18:37] | gbee: | "The last patent in the H.264 portfolio doesn't expire until 2028" << Software patents are one thing, and I'm firmly against them, but more than that it's the length of the patent terms which really bothers me |
| [20:18:43] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: did it just save you from drowning? |
| [20:18:58] | sphery: | gbee: exactly, 20 years in software is forever |
| [20:18:59] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp: deinterlaced me right out of the water |
| [20:19:44] | dustybin: | heh |
| [20:20:02] | wagnerrp: | well now hes pissed off, he was having a great time in the hottub with h264 |
| [20:20:24] | gbee: | if you can't make back your investment in 2–5 years then your business model was flawed in the first place |
| [20:20:40] | wagnerrp: | he calls her sloane |
| [20:20:42] | sphery: | heh, tell that to YouTube :) |
| [20:20:47] | iamlindoro: | VP8 is a dirty girl |
| [20:20:56] | dustybin: | iamlindoro: Play Nice |
| [20:21:04] | iamlindoro: | she says she's not patent encumbered, but I've seen the way she looks at H.264 |
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| [20:22:40] | gbee: | sphery: most '2.0' sites have no business model at all, they just bleed investors dry and someday soon the inevitable collapse will occur, of course no-one really remembers the last time it happened even if it was just a few years ago |
| [20:23:13] | ** sphery crosses his fingers and waits ** | |
| [20:23:24] | iamlindoro: | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1452898 |
| [20:23:25] | iamlindoro: | sigh |
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| [20:23:44] | iamlindoro: | "I had it on my acer revo and it was VERY unstable. I did however like the internet video plugin and the fact that mythweather works in the UK again. Apart from that, I see little difference and I have removed it for now until it is a bit more established. I wife on maternity leave that can't watch telly because something has screwed up is not a pretty site..." |
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| [20:23:56] | dustybin: | anybody recommend a good website for movie reviews? |
| [20:23:56] | sphery: | iamlindoro: #2... annoying |
| [20:24:10] | sphery: | as that's all misconfigured system |
| [20:24:19] | iamlindoro: | Translation: I screwed up the install, wrote a bunch of packages over my existing ones, and MythTV didn't handle it gracefully! |
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| [20:24:53] | sphery: | heh, waiting for 0.23-fixes to be more established than 0.22-fixes... |
| [20:24:58] | iamlindoro: | dustybin: I'd recommend asking in another channel, I bet I could just about punt you to another network from here |
| [20:25:00] | gbee: | iamlindoro: so reply with that |
| [20:25:21] | sphery: | it's already more stable and less buggy (I'm pretty sure on that), so "more established" only means installed on more systems than 0.22? |
| [20:25:23] | iamlindoro: | gbee: I'm trying to get into fewer arguments with strangers ;) |
| [20:25:35] | iamlindoro: | and yeah, .23 is definitely about a mile ahead of .22 |
| [20:26:05] | iamlindoro: | also could have everything to do with the fact that the guy probably upgraded his entire distro and have nothing at all to do with myth |
| [20:26:22] | wagnerrp: | i didnt think you could use Sky with a DVB-S card |
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| [20:26:36] | iamlindoro: | Not lawfully, AIUI |
| [20:26:45] | wagnerrp: | i thought they had their own encryption, and you had to use their box |
| [20:27:02] | sphery: | wagnerrp: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/UK_Television , please fix the web page warnings |
| [20:27:13] | sphery: | I would love to but don't know enough about it to do so |
| [20:27:16] | sphery: | Image:Warning.png Warning: Accessing Sky Digital services via a DVB-S card and NDS Cam is of questionable legality. |
| [20:27:38] | sphery: | IMHO, shouldn't be written as a "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" |
| [20:27:55] | gbee: | wagnerrp: you can't, they use NDS or something, no cams available |
| [20:28:17] | sphery: | or gbee , feel free to edit if you know enough about it... http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/UK_Television#DVB-C and below |
| [20:28:30] | sphery: | though I'll understand if you guys have other things going on |
| [20:28:36] | wagnerrp: | wondering in response to http://www.mythtvtalk.com/forum/installation- . . . hannels.html |
| [20:28:55] | sphery: | (as you both do contribute sufficient time already) |
| [20:29:06] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp: Same guy was in here earlier (and is still present) |
| [20:29:08] | gbee: | only legal way to record Sky is capture |
| [20:29:14] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp: Claimed he was referring only to freesat |
| [20:29:22] | sphery: | wagnerrp: think it's Azel phur |
| [20:29:25] | iamlindoro: | (when I asked basically exactly that) |
| [20:29:26] | wagnerrp: | may as well cut him off there too before someone else helps him |
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| [20:31:16] | gbee: | sphery: I don't know enough to speak with authority on the legality, it may just be a ToS or contract violation rather than a breach of criminal law |
| [20:32:11] | sphery: | yeah... I'm in the same boat |
| [20:32:25] | sphery: | just feels like it's almost encouraging people to do bad things |
| [20:33:11] | gbee: | probably best to scrap the existing text and just point to a section on capture |
| [20:33:23] | sphery: | that sounds like a good plan |
| [20:36:44] | stoth (stoth!~stoth@ool-18bfe0d5.dyn.optonline.net) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | |
| [20:37:32] | wagnerrp: | well i didnt accuse him of anything, just said the 3rd party modules were buggy and wholly unsupported, and to use analog capture |
| [20:38:13] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: you do realize that EXECTV will tie up a capture card, right? |
| [20:38:30] | JohnnyJboss: | no way – really? |
| [20:38:40] | iamlindoro: | yup |
| [20:38:40] | sphery: | yeah |
| [20:38:42] | wagnerrp: | if you just want to run an external call, use EXEC |
| [20:38:57] | sphery: | it checks one out so that you can use it for tvtime or whatever |
| [20:39:00] | wagnerrp: | EXECTV is intended for calling external video applications which use the tuner |
| [20:39:20] | JohnnyJboss: | but if you don't send it a tuner in the args list... |
| [20:39:30] | sphery: | yeah, he was using it to get the screensaver poking going while using Hulu Desktop |
| [20:39:31] | iamlindoro: | Then it'll pick one for you :) |
| [20:39:47] | sphery: | yes, the old behavior didn't allow you to specify the tuner |
| [20:39:55] | sphery: | there was a hack added so you could |
| [20:40:13] | JohnnyJboss: | yikes |
| [20:40:26] | JohnnyJboss: | like i said, i dropped HULU.... |
| [20:40:34] | ** JohnnyJboss crawls back in his hole ** | |
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| [20:40:37] | sphery: | yeah, that's the best approach, I think |
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| [20:44:49] | gbee: | aww, just noticed that the monitor I received under warrenty replacement has a couple of dead pixels, bastards |
| [20:46:19] | iamlindoro: | JohnnyJboss: Well, now it's on the users list as "good advice" for all the ages ;) |
| [20:46:30] | dustybin: | gbee: there are wayts to bring those pixels back to life, google |
| [20:46:30] | JohnnyJboss: | im working on it... |
| [20:46:35] | gbee: | more than two in fact, when you start looking |
| [20:47:50] | iamlindoro: | JohnnyJboss: It can go in the pantheon with "editing your database directly is FINE, I do it all the time," and "MythTV is broken because gentoo users are having a hard time upgrading" and "MythVideo can be replaced with this handy bash script" :) |
| [20:50:52] | JohnnyJboss: | i've updated my reply |
| [20:51:07] | JohnnyJboss: | ...should fit right in... |
| [20:51:41] | JohnnyJboss: | 9-) |
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| [20:57:11] | kisak: | hello, today I'm trying to get mythtv 0.22 r23069 to use data dvds |
| [20:57:35] | justinh: | today I'm trying to make the voices in my head shut up |
| [20:57:47] | kisak: | good luck justinh |
| [20:58:22] | justinh: | kisak: perhaps you just need to automount dvds to a dir accessible with mythvideo .. |
| [20:58:32] | justinh: | or make a symlink... |
| [20:58:39] | iamlindoro: | The best way to make Myth .22 do anything is to turn it into Myth .23 |
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| [20:59:43] | kisak: | iamlindoro: I'm hearing that quite a bit from you ... I'm still going to wait until some other gentoo users have fallen into the pitfalls |
| [20:59:59] | iamlindoro: | I'm hardly the only one expressing it ;) |
| [21:00:08] | iamlindoro: | The move from .22 to .23 is much less jarring than from .21 to .22 |
| [21:00:23] | skd5aner: | barely jarring, if at all |
| [21:00:24] | ** JohnnyJboss will hold you to that ** | |
| [21:00:36] | iamlindoro: | Think of .23 as a much more polished .22 with a few new features |
| [21:00:42] | iamlindoro: | all in all, much more stable |
| [21:01:33] | iamlindoro: | That said, it's gentoo and gentoo users, so for all I know it might open a singularity and plunge us all into a centuries-long conflict with evil lizard people |
| [21:01:52] | kisak: | iamlindoro: that would be fun |
| [21:02:51] | JohnnyJboss: | where's my +1 hat |
| [21:02:56] | sphery: | agreed 0.23-fixes is in a good state |
| [21:03:02] | sphery: | or maybe 50 of them |
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| [21:03:14] | kisak: | that being said ... do data dvd's play easily on 0.23? |
| [21:03:19] | iamlindoro: | and probably some provinces |
| [21:03:39] | iamlindoro: | Play as easily as on .22, just probably with many fewer playback bugs |
| [21:03:49] | justinh: | you'd still have to mount them to somewhere you can find with mythvideo though |
| [21:03:49] | iamlindoro: | Justin's approach is the correct way to set it up |
| [21:04:00] | sphery: | I hear they're running Gentoo at the Large Hadron Collider, so it /might/ do all that |
| [21:04:01] | iamlindoro: | mount it somewhere in your mythvideo dirs, turn on file browse mode |
| [21:04:08] | sphery: | (joke--I don't know what they're actually running) |
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| [21:04:34] | sphery: | but I'm sure that the Windows EULA says not to use it there (it also says not to use Windows for Nuclear Power Plants) |
| [21:04:52] | JohnnyJboss: | i love W 4 NPP |
| [21:04:59] | justinh: | sphery: probably colliderbuntu |
| [21:05:15] | sphery: | exherbo! |
| [21:05:18] | JohnnyJboss: | nukebuntu |
| [21:05:39] | iamlindoro: | Exherbo, because if you aren't smart enough to run a large hadron collider, you'BOOOOOOOOOOM |
| [21:05:40] | JohnnyJboss: | i can see the cogs / electron pattern now |
| [21:05:43] | justinh: | ubuntu hadron heron LTS? |
| [21:05:44] | kisak: | well ... what it boils down to is the question, how can I automount a data dvd and have mythtv see the files? |
| [21:06:00] | justinh: | kisak: google data dvd automount $yourdistro ? |
| [21:06:06] | iamlindoro: | kisak: I feel like we keep telling you |
| [21:06:12] | iamlindoro: | iamlindoro: mount it somewhere in your mythvideo dirs, turn on file browse mode |
| [21:06:25] | iamlindoro: | And yeah, mounting your disk is outside the scope of myth |
| [21:06:27] | skd5aner: | I run pico hadron colliders (tiny boom) |
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| [21:06:43] | sphery: | http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source . . . amp;gs_rfai= shows the first result saying, "with new operating system (but only if you have the 3GS model)", so it seems they're using iPhones |
| [21:06:43] | kisak: | justinh, iamlindoro: fair enough |
| [21:07:26] | justinh: | ahhh that must be why the experiment spends so much time shut down. recharging batteries |
| [21:07:31] | sphery: | lol |
| [21:07:52] | sphery: | http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/l . . . ed_gnu_linux |
| [21:08:04] | justinh: | still, at least using iPhones, there's not gonna be any flash |
| [21:08:06] | meshe: | sphery: they actually say that it's Java that shouldn't be used at a nuclear power plant, due to it's lack of fault tolerance :P |
| [21:08:25] | sphery: | CERN's choice of GNU/Linux is no one off. ... CERN's solution was Globus, open-source middleware that interfaces between software applications and different operating systems too. Globus was released initially under a BSD-style licence after careful consideration. It was considered less viral than the GPL. Globus later migrated to the Apache 2.0 licence. I have the distinct feeling Eben Moglen would have preferred the GPL and ... |
| [21:08:31] | sphery: | ... he discussed it in an interview with The Globus Consortium Journal |
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| [21:09:02] | sphery: | meshe: and Windows, here's a Win 98 one: http://proprietary.clendons.co.nz/licenses/eu . . . 8se-eula.htm |
| [21:09:09] | sphery: | search for nuclear |
| [21:09:30] | sphery: | and IE: http://www.microsoft.com/msdownload/ieplatform/ie/license.txt |
| [21:09:38] | wagnerrp: | why is there SO... MUCH... categorized wrong on the feature wishlist? |
| [21:09:40] | meshe: | it's in the java section |
| [21:09:47] | justinh: | what about nookular subs though? |
| [21:09:48] | meshe: | on both licences |
| [21:09:53] | wagnerrp: | backend options put in the frontend section, frontend options put in the backend section |
| [21:09:56] | iamlindoro: | Nuklear wessels? |
| [21:10:00] | sphery: | meshe: heh, I never noticed that |
| [21:10:03] | wagnerrp: | plugin requests put everywhere |
| [21:10:10] | meshe: | MS's little burn on Java |
| [21:10:11] | justinh: | it's NOOK-U-LAR |
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| [21:10:17] | sphery: | yeah |
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| [21:10:27] | wagnerrp: | some random UPNP garbage copied verbatim to every wishlist |
| [21:10:40] | sphery: | but .NET is perfect... .Nuclear-Efficient-Technology |
| [21:10:42] | justinh: | doesn't the wiki block UPNP? ;-) |
| [21:11:08] | wagnerrp: | its not even a 'feature request' |
| [21:11:18] | wagnerrp: | its just a thousand words of random information about UPNP |
| [21:11:26] | iamlindoro: | http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/6813#comment:2 |
| [21:11:27] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: because the wiki wishlist is a wasteland |
| [21:11:30] | iamlindoro: | gbee: ^^ EW |
| [21:12:23] | wagnerrp: | the audio upconvert in 0.23 handles prologic now, right? |
| [21:12:26] | gbee: | eww indeed |
| [21:12:30] | iamlindoro: | ew ew ew ew ew |
| [21:12:35] | iamlindoro: | Now I'm actually reading the patches |
| [21:12:39] | iamlindoro: | and not just the horrible idea |
| [21:13:06] | sphery: | patch # 194... makes you wonder what all the others are |
| [21:13:37] | iamlindoro: | All he's doing is displaying it? My not just expand programdetails if that's what he wants? |
| [21:13:44] | iamlindoro: | Then you don't even need four ugly named textareas |
| [21:13:55] | skd5aner: | oh sure, give him what he wants, that'll teach him |
| [21:13:57] | gbee: | iamlindoro: isn't that a bit like learning what actually goes into Haggis? I mean you know it looks bad, but when you actually learn what it's made of ... |
| [21:13:58] | ** sphery needs to fix program details to be themed/use state types ** | |
| [21:14:06] | iamlindoro: | gbee: haha |
| [21:14:15] | iamlindoro: | s/My not/Why not/ |
| [21:14:29] | ** justinh realises he's totally lost his todo list ** | |
| [21:14:40] | skd5aner: | todo: find todo list |
| [21:14:45] | justinh: | ahh well. they were prolly never gonna happen anyway :) |
| [21:14:51] | sphery: | we can start a new TODO for you justinh |
| [21:14:58] | justinh: | oh yeah |
| [21:15:04] | justinh: | I'll do it in my lunch break |
| [21:15:08] | sphery: | heh |
| [21:15:10] | iamlindoro: | and it incorporates sphery's favorite thing, random number keys to toggle views |
| [21:15:18] | sphery: | I /love/ that |
| [21:15:19] | justinh: | lol |
| [21:15:35] | meshe: | s/love/despise/ |
| [21:15:35] | sphery: | and /especially/ since they have no key bindings |
| [21:15:46] | sphery: | it's perfect designe |
| [21:15:58] | gbee: | oh that is wrong in so many ways, I thought iamlindoro was exaggerating |
| [21:16:00] | wagnerrp: | sphery: sbcglobal users are a bit far for justinh to go beat on his lunch break |
| [21:16:04] | justinh: | I *do* wanna take a look at the custom rule stuff at some point, but even what I have in mind is probably going to be a nightmare |
| [21:16:10] | iamlindoro: | gbee: Sadly not |
| [21:16:16] | meshe: | pressing the number 1 on my remote right now kills MFE |
| [21:16:24] | sphery: | (I really am going to completely redo all the "overloaded" keys to have their own key bindings... It will likely be about 1000 DB updates, but it /will/ be done.) |
| [21:16:35] | wagnerrp: | meshe: i guess that means you dont use mythmusic |
| [21:16:59] | meshe: | possibly, it's a new install |
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| [21:17:08] | meshe: | i think 2 and 3 were doing it too |
| [21:17:08] | iamlindoro: | See, now here's a great example of the kind of patch that would generally became truly archaeological before anyone touched it, because we've been so hesitant to say no before |
| [21:17:09] | sphery: | meshe: is it a big red button under a little flip-up cover? |
| [21:17:11] | gbee: | I really hate to be so harsh about the code of a fledgling developer, but that isn't even trying to be pretty |
| [21:17:16] | justinh: | new theme... willi ? |
| [21:17:22] | sphery: | next to the words, "Do Not Press" |
| [21:17:24] | wagnerrp: | meshe: mythmusic uses number keys 1–5 for various things |
| [21:17:31] | iamlindoro: | justinh: Where theme == the PBB and the menu |
| [21:17:42] | justinh: | heheh |
| [21:17:47] | justinh: | it's not awful though |
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| [21:17:51] | iamlindoro: | It's not? |
| [21:17:52] | meshe: | wagnerrp: ahh, good to know |
| [21:17:56] | gbee: | wagnerrp: but may not do so for much longer, we're trying to get away from that sort of overloading |
| [21:18:14] | sphery: | gbee: yeah, the hard part is remapping keys to work the same |
| [21:18:17] | sphery: | db update for each |
| [21:18:17] | justinh: | iamlindoro: the pbb isn't awful.. but the menu.. |
| [21:18:48] | meshe: | sphery: i may have to remap them, having MFE die because you bump one of them is kinda problematic |
| [21:18:54] | sphery: | my next trick will be removal of the "System Exit key" setting |
| [21:19:03] | meshe: | especially when there's no keyboard and mouse hooked up |
| [21:19:14] | sphery: | heh, yeah |
| [21:19:15] | gbee: | Willi – almost as ill-considered as the Wii |
| [21:19:54] | justinh: | I *still* don't get all this full screen use stuff where they use fanart backgrounds. at least in arclight/graphite the textareas aren't as dominant & you can actually see the art behind |
| [21:20:55] | gbee: | justinh: the theme is called 'Willi'? |
| [21:21:02] | iamlindoro: | yep |
| [21:21:04] | justinh: | yeah apparently |
| [21:21:16] | justinh: | free willi ? |
| [21:21:22] | gbee: | ok, cue juvenile jokes such as "Justin likes Willi" |
| [21:21:46] | justinh: | thank dawkins they didn't call it cochs |
| [21:23:05] | justinh: | and hey I didn't say I liked it. I said it wasn't awful |
| [21:23:33] | iamlindoro: | I clearly saw you stroking his Willi |
| [21:23:57] | meshe: | "I'll never smoke weed with Willi again..." |
| [21:24:54] | justinh: | aaanyway... what happened to 'family friendly' ? |
| [21:25:43] | iamlindoro: | I'm just talking about a theme, whatever you're thinking of makes you a very sick person, weirdo |
| [21:25:46] | iamlindoro: | ;) |
| [21:25:55] | gbee: | innuendo isn't family friendly? |
| [21:26:04] | meshe: | i was reminded of a country song... |
| [21:27:09] | justinh: | heh. weirdo. you flatter me |
| [21:29:21] | iamlindoro: | Maybe this week I'll finally put cast in programinfo :) |
| [21:34:40] | pheld (pheld!~heldal@cl-5.osl-01.no.sixxs.net) has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | |
| [21:34:59] | janneg: | is converter box a common term for ATSC STBs? |
| [21:36:20] | wagnerrp: | gbee: this 'when you hit the record button when livetv has paused past the end of the show, record the show that has paused, not the show that is currently being recorded' |
| [21:36:25] | wagnerrp: | on the frontend wishlist |
| [21:36:27] | skd5aner: | Converter box I believe usually refers to when cable companies shut down their analog channels, switch to digital, and provide a "converter box" to allow folks to use older TVs without an STB to access their programming |
| [21:36:33] | wagnerrp: | you said its a bug, and to report to trac |
| [21:36:44] | wagnerrp: | that was 3yrs ago... did it ever get reported/fixed? |
| [21:38:54] | janneg: | more context here http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/6663 I'm trying to guess the EIT sandard in use |
| [21:40:23] | janneg: | skd5aner: http://www.dtv.gov/ |
| [21:40:35] | iamlindoro: | janneg: Yes, commonly used since the transition |
| [21:40:40] | iamlindoro: | for OTA |
| [21:40:56] | iamlindoro: | (as well as cable) |
| [21:42:34] | skd5aner: | ohh, yes... definitely what that is refering too... never got (asked for) my $40 coupon! |
| [21:43:27] | oobe (oobe!~thingo@insidiousramblings.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) | |
| [21:43:36] | wagnerrp: | iamlindoro: the mythvideo storage groups are listed as default groups in mythtv-setup, right? |
| [21:43:51] | iamlindoro: | yes |
| [21:44:08] | wagnerrp: | so if a user doesnt have those listed, theyre way back on 0.21.... |
| [21:44:19] | gbee: | wagnerrp: I don't remember a ticket being opened and if the bug was fixed, it will have been because the code was re-factored and not because anyone set out to fix it |
| [21:44:39] | wagnerrp: | gbee: ok, thanks... just left it on there for now |
| [21:44:53] | wagnerrp: | its been there for three years at least, whats a bit more... |
| [21:44:55] | iamlindoro: | wagnerrp: yeah |
| [21:44:56] | skd5aner: | $25 to the first dev that commits a (working) patch to get streaming working for .iso's on SGs! |
| [21:45:09] | gbee: | I guess it could be an easy one to track down if someone wants to give it a few minutes |
| [21:45:14] | iamlindoro: | pfft, $25 for how many thousand dollars worth of billable hours... you spoil us |
| [21:45:24] | JohnnyJboss: | sphery: i've read the mythcontext::exec_program_tv_cb – i see the 'hack' that allows you to specify a tuner |
| [21:45:30] | wagnerrp: | skd5aner: do you want an address to mail to? |
| [21:45:36] | JohnnyJboss: | in theory, one could setup a fake tuner for this |
| [21:45:38] | skd5aner: | hehe, way better than the $0 that 99.99999% of users donate |
| [21:45:52] | skd5aner: | wagnerrp: mythfuse? |
| [21:45:52] | wagnerrp: | or would you prefer paypal? |
| [21:45:59] | wagnerrp: | s/fuse/fs/ |
| [21:46:15] | sphery: | JohnnyJboss: yeah, but then you'd likely have myth trying to use that tuner--unless you also have a fake input and fake video source |
| [21:46:24] | iamlindoro: | skd5aner: $0 that 100% donate, we don't take donations (as a project, anyway, contract work is sometimes done) |
| [21:46:27] | skd5aner: | yea – but I wouldn't consider that to really be out-of-the-box type of functionality |
| [21:46:40] | wagnerrp: | there were no stipulations to the request... :P |
| [21:46:42] | sphery: | but it's all just a lot of work when it's probably easier to have a script just disable then re-enable the screensaver--like with xdg-screensaver :) |
| [21:46:43] | JohnnyJboss: | way more work than it's worth – out of scope |
| [21:46:46] | sphery: | yeah |
| [21:46:51] | wagnerrp: | it... works... i think :P |
| [21:47:04] | skd5aner: | iamlindoro: yes, I know – just my minor enticement for the one feature that's at the top of my wishlist :) |
| [21:47:13] | jams: | sphery- so i keep seeing more mention of xdg...whats going on with that? |
| [21:47:14] | janneg: | sigh, three ticket changes just to change the assignment of a 'request info' ticket |
| [21:47:28] | janneg: | this trac workflow sucks |
| [21:47:29] | wagnerrp: | it mounts a single file fine, but ive never bothered to write up a script to point mplayer/xine at it and test it |
| [21:47:32] | gbee: | GreyFoxx: easy $25 to be had ^^ |
| [21:47:33] | sphery: | jams: I finally found a sucker^H^H^H^H^H^Huser to implement it for me |
| [21:47:37] | jams: | hehe |
| [21:47:38] | sphery: | jams: JohnnyJboss is working on it |
| [21:47:43] | jams: | ah cool |
| [21:47:52] | sphery: | yeah, granola bars to him |
| [21:47:57] | jams: | no kidding |
| [21:48:42] | JohnnyJboss: | ok – i gotta run – ciao |
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| [21:48:59] | meshe: | you scared him away |
| [21:49:17] | sphery: | nice one jams |
| [21:49:24] | sphery: | :) |
| [21:49:29] | jams: | always seems like an uninteresting yet fairly simple thing to put in place. |
| [21:49:53] | jams: | i figured it's the uninteresting portion that would scare him away before i did |
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| [21:50:11] | sphery: | jams: yeah... it's really not /that/ much code... It was more the testing/figuring out the intricacies (and shortcomings) of xdg-screensaver I was dreading |
| [21:50:23] | sphery: | but he's doing a great job of it |
| [21:50:45] | sphery: | he's also working with my big-picture design, so it should make reviewing the patch relatively easy |
| [21:51:38] | jams: | is it going to call xdg directly? |
| [21:51:44] | sphery: | yeah |
| [21:51:49] | jams: | i see |
| [21:52:26] | sphery: | but--unlike the xscreensaver/gnome-screensaver ones that poke every 50s, it will just suspend when we want it off and resume when we want it back on |
| [21:53:30] | sphery: | it handles the "resume if the window disappears" part of the crash for us, so the only time we've got a problem is the app locks but doesn't die issue |
| [21:53:37] | sphery: | but, meh, it's just a screen saver |
| [21:53:44] | jams: | right..for whatever reason I was thinking of having myth call -> some_shell-> call xdg |
| [21:53:57] | jams: | to make custom things easier..but it doesn't really matter much |
| [21:54:54] | cleith: | thanx all |
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| [21:55:07] | jams: | using xdg..it's far easier to say contact freedesktop it's their problem |
| [21:55:11] | sphery: | yeah... it would be possible to "shadow" xdg-screensaver with a shell script earlier in the PATH than the binary, but I doubt many would need that |
| [21:55:22] | sphery: | that's definitely a nice thing, too |
| [21:55:33] | jams: | right not many..but for those that need it |
| [21:55:35] | sphery: | and means we don't have to add YASS to the list |
| [21:56:12] | jams: | suppose it's possible to just replace xdg with your own program but it's just one extra thing to remember for system updates |
| [21:56:12] | meshe: | mv xdg-screensaver xdg-screensaver.dontrun |
| [21:56:13] | meshe: | done |
| [21:56:14] | meshe: | :) |
| [21:56:23] | sphery: | that works, too |
| [21:56:57] | Azelphur: | wagnerrp: I replied to you :) |
| [21:57:14] | sphery: | export PATH=/home/mythtv/bin:$PATH ; mythfrontend (and have xdg-screensaver script in ~mythtv/bin) |
| [21:57:29] | meshe: | when i want to save my screen i turn off my tv, but that's just me |
| [21:58:01] | jams: | sphery- good point |
| [21:58:14] | sphery: | that was what I meant with shadowing |
| [21:58:22] | jams: | for some reason I was thinking xdg-screensaver was going to be hardcoded |
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| [21:58:56] | wagnerrp: | Azelphur: so in other words, you are in fact NOT using Sky |
| [21:59:05] | wagnerrp: | youre just using FTA satellite with a DVB-S card |
| [21:59:10] | Azelphur: | wagnerrp: yea, I'm using FreeSat with sky hardware |
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| [21:59:21] | wagnerrp: | s/sky hardware/a DVB-S card/ |
| [21:59:32] | Azelphur: | wagnerrp: yea |
| [21:59:49] | wagnerrp: | has anyone actually recorded RTJPEG off a framegrabber in here recently? |
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| [22:00:27] | Azelphur: | wagnerrp: so any ideas on how I might get the missing channels to show up? they show up in kaffeine and mplayer fine, but not mythtv :( |
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| [22:01:10] | wagnerrp: | Azelphur: no idea, in my response i was implying that the only way to legally record SKY was through analog capture |
| [22:01:20] | wagnerrp: | but since thats not what youre trying to do, i have no experience with using DVB-S |
| [22:01:24] | Azelphur: | ok |
| [22:02:13] | gbee: | Azelphur: which channels are missing? |
| [22:02:32] | Azelphur: | gbee: there's a list here http://www.mythtvtalk.com/forum/installation- . . . ml#post51465 BBC news, BBC Parliment, BBC Alba, and more |
| [22:03:13] | Azelphur: | got that list by going to wikipedia and looking through a list of freesat channels, then comparing it to channels.conf, kaffeine and mythtv |
| [22:03:26] | Azelphur: | all those channels show up in channels.conf from scan, and kaffeine, but not myth :( |
| [22:03:34] | MartinJT (MartinJT!~martin@109.170.141.132) has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) | |
| [22:04:35] | jarle: | gbee: And I get the channels fine on mythtv 0.22-fixes, might be a bug in 0.23? |
| [22:05:51] | gbee: | jarle: maybe, last scan I did on DVB-S was a few months back, at that time it included all the channels or at least all of the channels which I wanted |
| [22:06:24] | Azelphur: | hehe I have most of the channels I want, I'm mainly missing BBC news and CNN, the rest I could live without |
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| [22:07:55] | jarle: | Azelphur: If you haven't come too far setting up your system you could always try installin mythtv 0.22-fixes to see if it makes any difference. |
| [22:08:29] | jarle: | Azelphur: if it works there, but not in 0.23 is sure to be a mythtv bug. |
| [22:08:31] | gbee: | jarle: thing is, I can't think of any relevant changes which might have broken DVB scanning |
| [22:08:35] | Azelphur: | could do :) |
| [22:08:49] | gbee: | and only for a couple of mux |
| [22:10:08] | jarle: | gbee: can't see how Azelphur should be able to mess up his setups so it will not include the channels either... |
| [22:10:30] | jarle: | gbee: as long as Kaffeine and scan works his HW is ok.. |
| [22:10:48] | gbee: | Azelphur: did you try increasing the signal timeouts by a second or two? |
| [22:11:00] | Azelphur: | gbee: nope, I don't know how to do that |
| [22:11:03] | gbee: | jarle: yeah, I don't think it's HW related |
| [22:11:14] | gbee: | Azelphur: screen where you configured the card |
| [22:11:34] | ** Azelphur will take a look ** | |
| [22:12:35] | gbee: | we pick best guess defaults, it's a compromise between waiting long enough in most cases to find the channels and the scan taking forever because it waits for a lock on signals which aren't there |
| [22:14:06] | gbee: | debugging DVB scanner issues isn't really my area of expertise, maybe janneg can suggest something |
| [22:15:36] | dfletcher: | lol I went totally crazy and installed a full compiz and myth front/back ends and they didn't play so nice. kaboom! :) I'll skip compiz :P |
| [22:16:17] | dewman: | dfletcher, I went totally crazy once to...I got married...I will never do that again... |
| [22:16:20] | ** dfletcher wanted a button on his remote control that spun the cube. no real reason :P ** | |
| [22:16:25] | Azelphur: | gbee: signal timeout is currently set to 7000, what should I change it to? |
| [22:16:35] | dfletcher: | dewman, ahahaha I did that too. I'm just full of mistakes :) |
| [22:16:38] | meshe: | dfletcher: didn't play nice how? i've had compiz and myth behaving on the same box |
| [22:16:56] | Azelphur: | I'm ok with the scan taking a while, it's a dedicated box and it's 11am here, so it can scan all night if it likes :P |
| [22:17:15] | gbee: | Azelphur: well for the sake of testing increase it to 10000, you might want to bring it back down if that doesn't help |
| [22:17:25] | dfletcher: | meshe, donno what I did exactly. I mean, new Ubuntu 9.10 install, software manager, pick nviida, compiz, myth... restart .. black nothing, ctrl-alt-bksp doesn't even kill X |
| [22:17:46] | dfletcher: | oh heh not quite "nothing" it had the clock |
| [22:18:05] | meshe: | oh, go get the nvidia drivers from nvidia.com |
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| [22:18:14] | dfletcher: | oh heh ok |
| [22:18:39] | meshe: | they're closed source, but they work the best |
| [22:19:03] | meshe: | just remember you'll need to rerun the install script every time you upgrade the kernel |
| [22:19:14] | Azelphur: | gbee: I tried to tune to 11954000 which contains all the BBC stuff I'm missing |
| [22:19:27] | Azelphur: | gbee: it straight away just said failed to find any channels, certainly didn't wait 10 seconds |
| [22:20:09] | jarle: | Azelphur: and you do not see any signal quality bars at the top of the screen? |
| [22:20:13] | gbee: | Azelphur: give me a minute, I'll double check the freq against my installs |
| [22:20:18] | dfletcher: | meshe, yep I've done that before, I just thought Ubuntu was doing it for me this time |
| [22:20:28] | Azelphur: | jarle: yea, just goes straight to failed to find any channels |
| [22:20:33] | dfletcher: | or is this some OSS Nvidia driver? |
| [22:20:45] | jarle: | Azelphur: is this a dvb-s2 card? |
| [22:20:56] | Azelphur: | nope, it's a Hauppage Nova-S-Plus |
| [22:21:19] | meshe: | dfletcher: OSS |
| [22:21:25] | dfletcher: | aha |
| [22:21:49] | meshe: | you can get a "closed" one in ubuntu, but the one right from nvidia has always been a better driver |
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| [22:23:17] | meshe: | i've had myth running full screen on one monitor and other stuff running on another on 2 separate cubes, works perfectly |
| [22:23:24] | jarle: | Azelphur: can you confirm that you are using 11954000 Horizontal 27500000 and FEC 2/3? |
| [22:23:31] | Azelphur: | jarle: yup |
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| [22:24:27] | Azelphur: | jarle: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/2010-04-13-23 . . . 00_scrot.png |
| [22:25:00] | gbee: | Azelphur: try 11953500 |
| [22:25:11] | jarle: | Azelphur: try scanning at 11953500 instead, yeah... |
| [22:25:25] | jarle: | Azelphur: the other settings the same |
| [22:25:46] | jarle: | Azelphur: that's the transponder I have BBC news at for some reason.. |
| [22:25:55] | Azelphur: | still the same, no channels found |
| [22:26:47] | Azelphur: | http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/2010-04-13-23 . . . 00_scrot.png |
| [22:27:48] | Azelphur: | it definitely isn't waiting for that signal timeout though, it's literally instant that it gives up |
| [22:29:17] | meshe: | wouldn't you get logs in the console for an error in the scan? |
| [22:29:51] | jarle: | meshe: yes |
| [22:30:38] | meshe: | Azelphur: are you running this from console or a menu? |
| [22:30:58] | Azelphur: | menu, I just started it from console now |
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| [22:32:06] | Azelphur: | meshe: no errors that I can see, is there some param I have to pass to make it inform me of things? |
| [22:32:44] | meshe: | i don't have a myth setup here, -v all maybe, check --help |
| [22:33:19] | gbee: | -v channelscan |
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| [22:34:38] | Azelphur: | mythtv -v channelscan didn't print anything out either |
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| [22:34:58] | meshe: | mythtv-setup? |
| [22:35:30] | Azelphur: | sorry yea, mythtv-setup |
| [22:35:37] | Azelphur: | and it doesn't have a --help or a -h option either |
| [22:35:48] | Azelphur: | or a manual entry |
| [22:35:49] | meshe: | what distro? |
| [22:35:55] | Azelphur: | mythbuntu 10.04 |
| [22:36:05] | meshe: | mythtv-setup.real -v channelscan |
| [22:36:24] | Azelphur: | ah |
| [22:36:40] | meshe: | mythtv-setup, mythfrontend, mythbackend are all wrappers in ubuntu |
| [22:37:05] | clever: | sounds like the wrappers need more "$*" |
| [22:38:36] | Azelphur: | http://pastebin.com/sa7xidg6 |
| [22:38:45] | Azelphur: | gbee / jarle there |
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| [22:39:49] | Azelphur: | 2010-04–13 23:38:02.664 DVBChan(1:/dev/dvb/adapter0/frontend0) Error: Tune(): Setting Frontend tuning parameters failed. eno: Invalid argument (22) |
| [22:39:51] | Azelphur: | looks interesting |
| [22:43:05] | gbee: | aye, I've just referred it to the dev who wrote the scanner, but it looks like he's busy so it might be a while before I have an answer for you |
| [22:43:28] | Azelphur: | yea that's fine, no hurry, just throw me a highlight if there are any ideas :) |
| [22:43:31] | iamlindoro: | kormoc, Do you know where the array size for numprogramlines lives in mythweb? |
| [22:43:38] | iamlindoro: | should be 47 or so right now |
| [22:43:39] | janneg: | Azelphur: please retry with -v channel,record,chanscan |
| [22:43:45] | Azelphur: | janneg: kk |
| [22:44:24] | Azelphur: | unknown argument for -v/--verbose "chanscan" |
| [22:44:38] | iamlindoro: | he may mean siparser |
| [22:44:38] | Azelphur: | ah, probably channelscan |
| [22:44:43] | iamlindoro: | or that |
| [22:45:08] | ** meshe is now out of her depth :) ** | |
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| [22:45:54] | janneg: | yes, channelscan. sorry |
| [22:45:54] | Azelphur: | janneg: http://pastebin.com/edMwJgT0 |
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| [22:47:53] | gbee: | janneg: 2203500Khz < ummm |
| [22:47:59] | gbee: | kHz |
| [22:48:26] | gbee: | so it takes a frequency of 11953500 and somehow turns that into 2203500 |
| [22:48:37] | janneg: | Azelphur: I always forget which multiplier the frequency for DVB-S uses, can you try 11953 and 11953500000 |
| [22:48:47] | Azelphur: | janneg: yup |
| [22:48:56] | kormoc: | http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/browser/trunk/myth . . . kend.php#L26 |
| [22:48:59] | kormoc: | iamlindoro: ^^ |
| [22:49:01] | janneg: | gbee: that's caused by the lnb |
| [22:49:11] | iamlindoro: | kormoc, perfect, thanks a lot |
| [22:49:23] | kormoc: | np |
| [22:49:37] | Azelphur: | janneg: I'm pretty sure it's correct because 10714000 finds stuff |
| [22:50:00] | Azelphur: | but 11953500 / 1195400 doesn't |
| [22:50:19] | janneg: | Azelphur: I think you're right |
| [22:51:26] | Azelphur: | here's 11953 http://pastebin.com/ZxWvnUYN |
| [22:53:08] | Azelphur: | here's 11953500000 http://pastebin.com/gzUMMLzR it wouldn't scan, said error parsing parameters. |
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| [22:53:41] | gbee: | janneg: guess there are some things I don't really know about DVB-S |
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| [22:54:49] | janneg: | Azelphur: yes, multiplier was correct |
| [22:55:21] | Azelphur: | :) |
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| [22:57:25] | darkdrgn2k: | Hey guys, any one here have an sharp AQOS tv? |
| [22:58:18] | janneg: | the problem is that 2203500 is higher than .frequency_max (= 2150000) for your frontend |
| [22:58:36] | gbee: | Azelphur: I've just checked, I have no problem scanning that multiplex with 0.23, so it's something unique to your system/hardware |
| [22:58:40] | janneg: | but 2150000 is the stanbdard value for DVB-S frontends |
| [23:00:26] | Azelphur: | so what should I do, change that value? |
| [23:00:36] | janneg: | so it's either a bug in our code for the calculation of the intermediate freq |
| [23:01:03] | janneg: | or your configuration is wrong |
| [23:01:43] | janneg: | +diseqc |
| [23:01:54] | Azelphur: | hmm, baring in mind I don't know what an earth I'm talking about it could well be that my configuration is wrong |
| [23:03:09] | meshe: | are you getting any other channels off that tuner? |
| [23:03:18] | Azelphur: | meshe: yes, everything but a select few |
| [23:03:32] | Azelphur: | janneg: here's my diseqc setup http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/2010-04-14-00 . . . 00_scrot.png |
| [23:06:35] | gbee: | Azelphur: there's your problem, it's not a Single LNB,it's a universal LNB |
| [23:08:03] | Azelphur: | still doesn't tune to that transponder :( |
| [23:08:24] | janneg: | Azelphur: new log |
| [23:09:18] | gbee: | Azelphur: Universal (Europe)? Should have a Switch of 11700, Low of 9750 and High of 10600? |
| [23:10:33] | gbee: | Universal LNBs are the standard for Sky/Freesat in the UK, so I very much doubt it's anything else |
| [23:10:53] | Azelphur: | hmm, it doesn't seem to want to stay changed |
| [23:11:14] | Slim-Kimbo (Slim-Kimbo!~Kimbo@host86-142-187-174.range86-142.btcentralplus.com) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:11:15] | gbee: | but if all else fails the diagnostic/service menus on your sky box might tell you something about it |
| [23:11:35] | Azelphur: | if I change it to universal (europe) then come out of capture cards, go back in again, it's back at single |
| [23:11:35] | gbee: | Azelphur: are you pressing Esc or Next? |
| [23:11:39] | Azelphur: | finish |
| [23:11:48] | MartinJT (MartinJT!~martin@109.170.141.132) has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) | |
| [23:11:57] | gbee: | err, finish |
| [23:12:41] | gbee: | try deleting the lnb by pressing D in the Diseqc menu then creating it from scratch |
| [23:12:47] | Azelphur: | yup, now it's scanning |
| [23:12:48] | Azelphur: | yay \o/ |
| [23:13:02] | dewman: | if I re-install lirc, does it re-write lirc.fdi? |
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| [23:23:26] | darkdrgn2k: | hey |
| [23:23:45] | darkdrgn2k: | whats the diff between Optical and digital COAX ? |
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| [23:30:19] | dewman: | darkdrgn2k, one of the differences is an optical cable needs to have the signal converted to light pulses and the coaxial cable will pass along the digital signal without any conversion. |
| [23:31:24] | darkdrgn2k: | dewman: k, but what about sound quality |
| [23:31:45] | darkdrgn2k: | IE: why would one choose optical over coax |
| [23:33:28] | dewman: | darkdrgn2k, from what I understand optical has more bandwith... |
| [23:33:49] | darkdrgn2k: | dewman:ok but thats for PCM no? digital is digital.. |
| [23:34:25] | MartinJT (MartinJT!~martin@109.170.141.132) has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) | |
| [23:34:27] | iamlindoro: | optical is less bandwidth |
| [23:34:29] | iamlindoro: | coaxial is higher |
| [23:34:35] | iamlindoro: | sound quality, hoever, is identical |
| [23:34:38] | iamlindoro: | however |
| [23:34:59] | darkdrgn2k: | iamlindoro: so whats the point of optical? |
| [23:35:10] | iamlindoro: | better connectors than coaxial |
| [23:35:22] | iamlindoro: | RCA is the worst connector in the world |
| [23:35:25] | gbee: | and zero interference |
| [23:35:33] | iamlindoro: | and that |
| [23:35:42] | darkdrgn2k: | but digital is digital... |
| [23:35:55] | iamlindoro: | digital can still be interfered with, and can still have signal error |
| [23:36:02] | gbee: | sure, but digital doesn't mean zero errors |
| [23:36:16] | darkdrgn2k: | hmm... |
| [23:36:24] | darkdrgn2k: | intersting... |
| [23:36:31] | darkdrgn2k: | dnot think i ever noticed a differnce.. |
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| [23:36:45] | darkdrgn2k: | im just mad my AQOS tv doesnt support Optiocal Passthorugh :'( |
| [23:37:02] | dewman: | the "man" can probably also send some sort of drm over the optical channel if they really wanted to |
| [23:37:26] | iamlindoro: | The man could DRM any channel |
| [23:37:35] | iamlindoro: | no difference between optical and coaxial in that regard |
| [23:37:38] | darkdrgn2k: | dewman: they coudl do that via digita coax to no? |
| [23:38:40] | dewman: | darkdrgn2k, better stick with talking to iamlindoro... =) |
| [23:38:51] | edomeda: | hey guys, I may be missing something, but when I set the font sizes and/or the scale % (-30) nothing changes, even after restarting the FE... Using 0.23 |
| [23:39:11] | iamlindoro: | edomeda, Those settings have no effect, if you want to change the UI font sizes you will need to edit or author your own theme |
| [23:39:36] | edomeda: | iamlindoro, what are they for then? |
| [23:39:48] | iamlindoro: | strictly speaking they have an effect on non-MythUI screens, but there are so few screens left like that as to be essentially none |
| [23:39:53] | iamlindoro: | because they are legacy settings |
| [23:40:06] | iamlindoro: | And we're glad to see them go |
| [23:41:41] | edomeda: | Ok, maybe you can tell me how I can scroll (or set to auto-scroll) buttons/items that are too wide, I can't tell the difference between things like "record any on all ..." or buttons that have movie tiles "My Movie: ..." |
| [23:42:12] | iamlindoro: | What theme are you using, and at what resolution? |
| [23:42:22] | edomeda: | even my schedule/program guide shows 1... instead of 10. (odd to replace one char with 3) |
| [23:43:01] | edomeda: | 2560x1500, graphite |
| [23:44:02] | edomeda: | I'd use 2560x1600 but there is a bug with compiz and the FE that panels are over the buttons/FE window. |
| [23:44:10] | iamlindoro: | Graphite is a 16:9 theme and your screen isn't 16:9... that said, some strings are very difficult to fit in the space allotted |
| [23:44:16] | edomeda: | I doubt the extra 100px on height would matter. |
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| [23:44:33] | iamlindoro: | It would make it worse :) |
| [23:44:39] | iamlindoro: | since then it would be even less 16:9 |
| [23:44:47] | edomeda: | my screen is 16:10 |
| [23:45:07] | iamlindoro: | right. Not 16:9. And neither resolution quoted above is 16:9 |
| [23:45:24] | edomeda: | so actually it's closer to 16:9 |
| [23:45:29] | iamlindoro: | to see a theme as its intended, if it has low tolerances for change, you need to be using the aspect ration at which it was designed |
| [23:45:54] | iamlindoro: | 1560/1500 = 1.70 |
| [23:45:57] | iamlindoro: | er 2560 |
| [23:45:59] | edomeda: | 16/10 = 1.6, 16/9 = 1.77, so 2560/1500 = 1.70 |
| [23:46:08] | edomeda: | so it's better then full screen. :p |
| [23:46:37] | iamlindoro: | still not 16:9 |
| [23:46:41] | edomeda: | I get that, but replacing 10 with 1... ? |
| [23:46:48] | meshe: | edomeda: to fix the panel issue open compizconfig settings maanger, choose utility, workarounds, make sure Legacy Fullscreen Support is checked |
| [23:46:51] | iamlindoro: | that's just how cutdown works |
| [23:47:31] | edomeda: | and how do you read all the buttons/selection fields with "..." in them? |
| [23:47:38] | iamlindoro: | you don't |
| [23:48:26] | edomeda: | how do you suggest that I tell the difference between duplicate checking, etc.? |
| [23:49:37] | iamlindoro: | I suggest you use the theme at it's proper aspect ratio, that you get us a patch that allows reverse cutdown so that you can read the end instead, or that you use a theme that is more tolerant to being squished about |
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| [23:52:21] | edomeda: | 2560x1440 (16:9) makes no difference, still does the same thing |
| [23:52:41] | iamlindoro: | Guess you should ask for a refund then ;) Use a different theme |
| [23:53:21] | edomeda: | What theme "works" then? |
| [23:53:41] | iamlindoro: | You tell us :P |
| [23:56:02] | edomeda: | what them is "official?" |
| [23:56:21] | iamlindoro: | Anything you got with your install is likely official |
| [23:56:41] | iamlindoro: | Terra, Graphite, Arclight, Mythbuntu, MythCenter, MythCenter-wide |
| [23:56:48] | iamlindoro: | etc. |
| [23:57:36] | dougt_ (dougt_!~dougt@nat/mozilla/x-qyylwtkndzztggay) has quit (Quit: dougt_) | |
| [23:58:07] | edomeda: | well arclight does it too |
| [23:58:31] | iamlindoro: | Guess we'll have to take the theme author out back and beat the living piss out of him |
| [23:58:33] | mazda01 (mazda01!~daniel@cpe-173-89-33-87.wi.res.rr.com) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:59:47] | gilles_ (gilles_!~chatzilla@70.99.171.254) has joined #mythtv-users | |
| [23:59:52] | edomeda: | what is your deal? You tell me to "TELL US" and find another theme, blame me picking a bad resolution, but won't say that just maybe, it's something that needs to be thought out a bit better in mythtv? |
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