Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Monday, March 1st, 2010, 00:08 UTC

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Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v stuarta

[00:12:59]

Beirdo:

It's good to be Canadian :)

[00:16:03]

wagnerrp:

seems your professional american hockey players were better than our professional american hockey players

[00:19:13]

Beirdo:

!trout wagnerrp

[00:19:13]

** MythLogBot slaps wagnerrp with a trout on behalf of Beirdo... **

[00:19:29]

Beirdo:

our professional CANADIAN hockey players :)

[00:19:48]

Beirdo:

but yeah :)

[00:19:48]

high-rez:

Who spend all their time training and practicing in the US with US teams.

[00:20:00]

Beirdo:

so? :)

[00:20:08]

high-rez:

You're only as good as your training.

[00:20:18]

Beirdo:

some of the American players train and play in Canada, do they not?

[00:20:43]

high-rez:

Yes, but we lost.

[00:20:44]

Beirdo:

and the Swedish, etc

[00:20:45]

high-rez:

:)

[00:21:02]

high-rez:

Congrats, you barely won at the game you were supposed to win at ;)

[00:21:03]

Beirdo:

true

[00:21:09]

Beirdo:

but ya got silver

[00:21:13]

wagnerrp:

high-rez: curling?

[00:21:17]

Beirdo:

hahah

[00:21:19]

Beirdo:

:)

[00:21:39]

Beirdo:

how did we do in curling?

[00:21:44]

high-rez:

Curling is like putin, it should stay in canada and never leave.

[00:21:46]

wagnerrp:

like half the trainers for the other countries were canadian

[00:21:52]

Beirdo:

I hate not having TV

[00:21:59]

Beirdo:

high-rez: you mean poutine

[00:22:01]

wagnerrp:

however it turned out, a canadian led them to victory

[00:22:03]

Beirdo:

putin is in Russia

[00:22:05]

high-rez:

Right, that stuff. :)

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[00:22:19]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Beirdo, what's the situation with your Myth setup?

[00:22:20]

Beirdo:

and poutine kicks butt :)

[00:22:25]

Beirdo:

hehe

[00:22:28]

sphery:

Nice. A cornucopia of bad advice for rebuilding a MythTV system: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/425270#425270 . It's amazing how many flat-out-wrong descriptions of what to do he found.

[00:22:38]

Beirdo:

I have 3 analog tuners in a box that is off...

[00:22:57]

Beirdo:

my storage array is currently being re-built... dead RAID card – new one just arrived

[00:23:11]

Beirdo:

I have digital OTA, but my air2pc card died

[00:23:21]

Beirdo:

basically, I'm screwed for the moment :)

[00:23:23]

Beirdo:

heh

[00:23:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Bad luck?

[00:23:31]

Beirdo:

bad power grid

[00:23:35]

Beirdo:

and bad luck

[00:23:44]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

One of my drives and my CPU fan died in the same week last month. I'm waiting for the next shoe to drop

[00:24:07]

Beirdo:

thankfully the replacement RAID card is working well

[00:24:40]

Beirdo:

transferring the LVM onto a 2TB external drive

[00:24:47]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

You use a RAID for recordings, or not?

[00:24:57]

Beirdo:

so I can shift junk around and put parts BACK onto the RAID

[00:24:59]

Beirdo:

yes

[00:26:21]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I use a RAID for video storage, but not for recordings. If I'm keeping it, I transcode it and move it to mythvideo quickly.

[00:26:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Or try to.

[00:26:24]

Beirdo:

so once I get the data off the RAID, I can actually run mythtv again (kinda) but no recording.

[00:26:50]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Go bleeding edge and try MythNetVision and/or go with MiroBridge?

[00:26:56]

Beirdo:

I guess I *could* record analog from the crappy little digital box

[00:27:17]

Beirdo:

nah, I'm planning a total rebuild in a month or so

[00:27:39]

Beirdo:

if budget allows, etc

[00:28:47]

Beirdo:

but right now, I have the contents of 4 different servers all on that 2TB external drive

[00:29:04]

Beirdo:

or soon will once the transfer of the RAID is finished

[00:29:08]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: Personally I use both. Right now Netvision is beta and will eventually exceed the features of MiroBridge. Right now Netvision has searching which is not in MiroBridge.

[00:29:13]

Beirdo:

transferring 800+G takes a while

[00:29:15]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I want someone to tell me how long on a really good processor it takes to transcode 720p/1080i. To take it down to 960x540, where I archive it, takes roughly 3.5–4 hours per hour of video.

[00:29:53]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, I've seen the screencasts, but I have decided to only go bleeding edge stuff if I can't live without it.

[00:30:22]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm hoping NetVision will deprecate MiroBridge. I love that it is available, but it is a script as opposed to a plugin.

[00:31:19]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: "can't live without it" is in the eye of the beholder. MiroBridge is more mature right now and is available with 0.22. It is up to you.

[00:31:31]

Chicago:

GadgetWisdomGuru... for transcoding here; instead of answering you in terms of how much time it takes... I can tell you an Intel quad-core with 12mb L2 cache @2.83GHz is more than 25% faster than 6mb L2 cache on a Xeon 2.66GHz.

[00:32:00]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, I'm using it now. It replaced mythnettv, as I like to support official products.

[00:32:31]

Beirdo:

I need to buy some MythBeer :)

[00:32:34]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Chicago, I have an Athlon X2 5600+.

[00:32:49]

Chicago:

some of the ssse3 stuff moves the data a bit faster

[00:33:04]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: I am unsure which you are using now. Just curious.

[00:33:29]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

My next rebuild is going to go intel, likely. Want a change.

[00:34:19]

Chicago:

hehe I may go AMD on my next one... there are some virtualization advantages I want to see

[00:34:34]

Beirdo:

get one of each

[00:34:34]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, I use MiroBridge.

[00:34:49]

sid3windr:

Beirdo: not to jinx anything but last time I moved data off my raid temporarily to a single drive, that drive died... :p

[00:34:51]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Chicago, my issue is power. I want the lowest power/heat I can produce.

[00:35:00]

Beirdo:

sid3windr: it's brand new

[00:35:01]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: aah and thanks for the answer.

[00:35:02]

Beirdo:

heh

[00:35:06]

sid3windr:

Beirdo: so was mine...

[00:35:11]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But, I've consistently gone with AMD, so I might stay.

[00:35:21]

Beirdo:

yeah well

[00:35:22]

Chicago:

GadgetWisdomGuru, really not the best set of limitations...

[00:35:35]

Beirdo:

I'll survive if I have o

[00:35:38]

sid3windr:

:-)

[00:35:46]

Beirdo:

that reminds me

[00:35:48]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, the pain is configuring it with my headless backend. I log in remotely and launch miro over SSH.

[00:35:54]

sid3windr:

no single drives ever again for me :p

[00:36:02]

Beirdo:

should copy my trac stuff off there soon

[00:36:15]

Beirdo:

start pushing more to github

[00:36:17]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Chicago, which is? The heat/power issue? I meant lowest I can get away with.

[00:36:47]

Chicago:

GadgetWisdomGuru... less power means smaller fans means less CPU and certainly less disks... :(

[00:37:10]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: In the 0.23 release of MiroBridge you can import a OPML file that was exported from a separate Miro installation.

[00:37:30]

Chicago:

I want the whole world to suffer like I do with ambient noise of computer fans unavoidable

[00:37:35]

Chicago:

j/k lol

[00:37:50]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Chicago, I use 120mm fans. They soothe me to sleep at night.

[00:37:56]

Chicago:

me too hehe

[00:37:59]

Chicago:

white noise

[00:38:31]

Chicago:

the alarm clock with the summer sounds and crickets is better... if they would put a sound chip into the 120mm fan that makes it sound like the wild outdoors... i'd be tempted to buy one

[00:38:34]

Beirdo:

120mm fans are nearly silent in my experience

[00:38:51]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: The import step is from the command line. You do not need to start the Miro GUI

[00:38:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, I also have date issues. I was hoping there would be an option to set the recording date to when the feed item was released instead of when it was downloaded.

[00:39:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Beirdo, the word is nearly.

[00:39:22]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Four of them make a nice soft noise

[00:39:27]

Beirdo:

heh

[00:39:42]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The system has three 120mm fans, one 140mm fan, and the CPU fan is 92mm

[00:39:49]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: What is the issue. I understand what you said but not why it is an issue.

[00:39:51]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

And I never installed a side fan.

[00:40:02]

Beirdo:

I used to have about 8 of them running... the loudest noise was the hard drives ticking as they seeked... and they are quiet drives

[00:41:01]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, preference, I suppose.

[00:42:02]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: hmm, You are the first person to make that request.

[00:43:28]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: If I remember correctly there were issues with publication date/time. I cannot really remember now.

[00:43:46]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Sometimes it isn't set properly.

[00:44:18]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Then, every so often I get random ancient feed items for no apparent reason.

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[00:46:26]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: The "random ancient feed items: is a Miro/source site issue. I noticed this long before when I used the Miro GUI. I have gotten floods especially with the TedTalk channel.

[00:48:01]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: The only way I found to stop a flood of old videos is to remove the Miro Channel in the GUI and then re-add it. Mirobridge only reflects what Miro has in its own database. It actually runs Miro as if it was the GUI.

[00:49:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, I know. But, as I said, I'm hoping MythNetVision is my go-to solution once it is out of beta. MiroBridge is fine for now.

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[00:50:17]

RDV_Linux:

GadgetWisdomGuru: cool it is all about choice and I fully support choice;)

[00:50:59]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Yes, I agree. That is the pro of open-source.

[00:58:59]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'll give anything a try once if it looks like I might enjoy it.

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[01:03:04]

Brad-D:

oooh mythnetvision looks cool

[01:03:09]

Brad-D:

i didn't realize it supported mtv.com

[01:03:11]

Brad-D:

sweet!

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[01:05:05]

RDV_Linux:

Brad-D: There is a lot of development going on in the background that will significantly increase the number of sources and add new features, Targeted at 0.24.

[01:06:32]

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[01:07:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

RDV_Linux, it is necessary. More and more stuff will be coming available online. And the ability to unify that in the same interface/controls as the recorded content is essential.

[01:09:26]

darkdrgn2k:

hi, is it just me or does fast forwarding on MVKs really suck in myth right now?

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[01:30:43]

tintin32:

GadgetWisdomGuru: you have a cm-15a by any chance?

[01:31:46]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

No, a CM11A with a serial interface.

[01:31:51]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Why?

[01:32:07]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Does the CM15A work more easily under Linux?

[01:32:20]

tintin32:

I've got a buddy who is trying to set one up is all

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tintin32:

GadgetWisdomGuru: haha, dunno, was going to ask you :)

[01:32:44]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Oh. Well, hopefully it will work out.

[01:33:29]

tintin32:

Beirdo: ping

[01:35:25]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Tintin32, I tried a lot of X10 stuff. Now Smarthome has moved to Insteon, and the pricing isn't something I'm willing to invest in.

[01:35:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It isn't practical for the dabbler anymore

[01:36:43]

tintin32:

hmm??

[01:36:53]

tintin32:

I'm not sure I understand

[01:37:18]

tintin32:

what's the relationship betw. smarthome & X10?

[01:37:20]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Tintin32, the X10 Home Automation protocol is what the CM11 and the CM15 use.

[01:37:40]

tintin32:

right, I got that

[01:37:45]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Smarthome released a line of high quality X10 stuff.

[01:38:08]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

then they superseded it by creating Insteon, a radio based home automation standard which is backward compatible.

[01:38:14]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But this is a bit off topic, I think.

[01:38:32]

tintin32:

sure, so msg me

[01:39:55]

Beirdo:

tintin32: I'm here

[01:40:06]

Beirdo:

not always completely awake though

[01:41:12]

Brad-D:

RDV_Linux: Sounds cool. Very exciting!

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tintin32:

Beirdo: pls look at pm

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[02:04:39]

Beirdo:

sorry, I'm falling asleep too often to be of much use right now

[02:05:24]

tintin32:

Beirdo, np. but pleae look at pm when you wake up :)

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[02:06:28]

fukdnscerd:

anyone have any idea why i would only have the option for widescreen themes. I do have all themes in the ubuntu repo for mythtv

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[02:27:25]

wagnerrp:

fukdnscerd: primarily because no one has yet written any full screen themes for mythtv

[02:27:55]

wagnerrp:

there is MythCenter, but thats little more than some color and the basic default configs

[02:28:13]

fukdnscerd:

hmm... i thought in previous versions there were full screen themes. or were those just scaled to fullscreen

[02:28:42]

wagnerrp:

the previous version did have a number of full screen themes

[02:29:36]

fukdnscerd:

but they don't work with the new version i take it, i understand... advancement always comes at some cost

[02:29:50]

wagnerrp:

pretty much

[02:31:10]

wagnerrp:

basically... all those people willing to spend the tens to hundreds of hours needed needed to learn the engine and write a full theme

[02:31:20]

wagnerrp:

are also willing to spend the money to buy a new tv

[02:33:11]

fukdnscerd:

thats cool, im getting a wide screen here real soon... not a new one, but hey its better than what i got

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benw:

does myth work with Time Warner Cable?

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Tanthrix:

benw: Myth doesn't care what your video source is. As long as you've got unencrypted channels or a cable box to use with firewire or an irblaster.

[02:42:31]

Tanthrix:

benw: Generally, you can't just plug your cable straight into the system to tune directly due to encryption, but you can make myth work with any cable / satellite box in existence with an irblaster.

[02:42:52]

benw:

Yeah that question was ignorant to say the least... Any recommendations on a decent tuner card?

[02:43:25]

Tanthrix:

benw: HD or not?

[02:43:48]

benw:

HD

[02:44:08]

Tanthrix:

Assuming your cable is encrypted, then the only good way to go is the HD PVR.

[02:44:25]

Tanthrix:

It records component input from your cable box, which is what tunes and decrypts the channels.

[02:44:35]

benw:

I have a shuttle small form factor with an Nvidia 512mb card

[02:44:46]

Tanthrix:

It's a USB box, so no PCI card or anything

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Tanthrix:

Downside is it's spendy, but the quality is excellent, and it's the only surefire way to actually get your HD content in HD with 100 percent reliability.

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benw:

Tanthrix I have an Sci Atlanta 8500HD from Time Warner but it's a piece of junk. Always freezing and can't hold very much.

[02:46:18]

Tanthrix:

benw: Yah, most cable DVRs are junk.

[02:46:28]

benw:

I'm sure Time Warner is encrypted.

[02:46:58]

Tanthrix:

It's a very good bet. And if it ain't today, it might be tomorrow, rendering your hardware worthless.

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[02:48:23]

benw:

It's too bad really. I hate companies that hold you hostage with monthly fees and no way to buy hardware.

[02:48:31]

Tanthrix:

Indeed.

[02:50:46]

benw:

Well thanks for our assistance. I'm guess I'll wait until I cut my cable and give Myth try in the future.

[02:51:04]

Tanthrix:

HD-PVR out of your budget, I take it?

[02:51:10]

fukdnscerd:

if i switch to svn mythtv will i lose anything that is in mythbuntu, aside from the mythbuntu setup screen

[02:52:41]

fukdnscerd:

ie.. plugins

[02:53:24]

benw:

Tanthrix I have an HD PVR through Time Warner and pay a monthly fee for it. They told me that I cannot use third-party hardware for their service so I wanted to search for an alternative. MythTV would be great but Time Warner are _____ <--- fill in the blank with a nasty phrase.

[02:53:57]

Tanthrix:

benw: I should have been a bit more clear – the HD-PVR is an actual device from Haupuage. http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hdpvr.html

[02:54:18]

benw:

looking...

[02:54:52]

Tanthrix:

benw: Basically, what you'd do, is dump your current PVR for a simple HD tuner from your cable company. Then you plug the component output of that tuner into that HD PVR device. That dumps an HD video stream into myth.

[02:55:34]

Tanthrix:

benw: Then myth changes channels using an irblaster, which basically emulates a remote. Or firewire if your tuner box supports it. The end result is access to all of your channels, guranteed.

[02:55:37]

benw:

Ah ha, very cool Tanthrix.

[02:56:30]

Tanthrix:

benw: I've actually got an high def dvr from comcast, as part of some deal. I've got my HD-PVR hooked to it, and myth changes channels via firewire.

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Tanthrix:

benw: So you could use that device with your current dvr from time warner, but usually it's cheaper to dump that and just get a basic tuner.

[02:56:59]

benw:

What remote do you use?

[02:57:24]

Tanthrix:

benw: Microsoft MCE remote. About $25 on ebay for the remote and USB reciever that includes two irblasters.

[02:57:33]

benw:

I have a Logitech Harmony One

[02:57:49]

benw:

Oh Ir Blaster is a signal catcher... I see

[02:58:14]

Tanthrix:

It's a transmitter actually. It sends an IR signal to the cable box to change channels, just as if you had pressed buttons on your remote.

[02:58:29]

benw:

I could save almost $10 a month for my HD DVR rental

[02:58:32]

Tanthrix:

That's how myth changes channels in your absense with external cable boxes. That or firewire, which some boxes support.

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[03:00:39]

benw:

oh so when I setup recordings on Myth IRBlaster changes the channels

[03:00:50]

Tanthrix:

benw: It depends. Sometimes they charge extra for an HD tuner. IE, for comcast here it's $15 a month for an HD pvr, or $6 a month for just HD tuner

[03:01:46]

Tanthrix:

benw: Yes. IE, if you start recording on channel 7 at 5pm, it will transmit "0-0–7" via the IR transmitter at that time to change your box to the right channel, then begin recording via the HD-PVR or whatever other tuner you use.

[03:01:53]

benw:

Whatever the case I'm sick of spending money simply because their business model forces their product on me.

[03:02:40]

benw:

Tanthrix you have helped me greatly. Thanks for everything.

[03:02:56]

Tanthrix:

benw: No prob. Good luck with whatever you do.

[03:03:16]

benw:

But wait... Does IRBlaster get called via Cron jobs?

[03:03:29]

cesman:

no

[03:03:37]

benw:

Or the like some Myth Daemon

[03:03:47]

cesman:

you create a channel changing script

[03:04:04]

cesman:

when you configure the tuner in mythtv, you tell it to use the script

[03:04:05]

Tanthrix:

LIRC is what does the work, you just tell myth how to talk to that.

[03:04:46]

benw:

I'm going to run Myth in a Vbox and check it out.

[03:06:43]

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[03:07:19]

benw:

Tanthrix I found a script for Time Warner's HD box. http://lirc.sourceforge.net/remotes/scientifi . . . orer_8300_HD

[03:07:21]

benw:

very cool

[03:07:58]

benw:

Again... Thanks... When I get my Myth up an running and come back and report my trials and tribulations :)

[03:08:31]

Tanthrix:

No prob – good luck!

[03:10:42]

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[03:13:28]

sphery:

wagnerrp: Well, it's official, now... If you don't accept an EULA, you can steal stuff. Now that our "soon-to-be" lawyer said it 10 times on the list, it must be true.

[03:15:44]

sphery:

1–2 mentions, it's random typing of monkeys on keyboards; 3–6 mentions, it's a rumor; 7–9 mentions, it's what "they say," and 10+ mentions, it's the hard facts

[03:16:22]

sphery:

pretty sure that's the commonly accepted scale for proving facts

[03:16:41]

wagnerrp:

oh, and you should use that guide data on a horribly underpowered frontend, on wireless

[03:17:39]

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[03:18:45]

sphery:

didn't see that thread... which one?

[03:18:58]

sphery:

oh, in general... nvm--I'm slow today

[03:19:08]

wagnerrp:

oh, and it should be run in a VM while youre at it

[03:19:10]

benw:

can mythtv run without a desktop? Is it pretty much web driven?

[03:19:31]

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[03:19:53]

wagnerrp:

benw: generally, people dont run mythtv on a desktop

[03:19:57]

sphery:

benw: the web stuff is good for scheduling recordings, but you'll want a real X GUI to allow useful playback of recordings

[03:20:01]

wagnerrp:

certainly the the backend anyway

[03:20:38]

sphery:

but not a desktop environment (GNOME, KDE)... Just use the X Window System with a Window Manager, like RatPoison or Fluxbox

[03:20:40]

tank-man:

most people use windows as a desktop

[03:20:48]

wagnerrp:

the backend is the only required piece of mythtv, and can be run on any x86 linux machine

[03:20:51]

benw:

Any particular X that works well with Myth or is that all preference?

[03:20:52]

sphery:

and don't use MS Windows :)

[03:21:04]

wagnerrp:

X is X, what do you mean?

[03:21:10]

sphery:

X.org or XFree86 should both work

[03:21:16]

wagnerrp:

Xfree or Xorg, take your pick

[03:21:20]

sphery:

but I think you're trying to ask something else

[03:21:21]

benw:

no winblows ... I only use winblows for games :)

[03:21:34]

sphery:

heh, same here

[03:21:45]

benw:

I meant flux, gnome, kde, etc

[03:21:56]

wagnerrp:

the backend doesnt use X

[03:22:02]

sphery:

games and filling out my 1040 using the IRS-provided PDF form which requires Adobe patented PDF forms support

[03:22:12]

wagnerrp:

and the frontend prefers something simple

[03:22:28]

benw:

sphery heh...

[03:22:33]

wagnerrp:

flux, e16, xfce, evilwm, ratpoison, .... the list goes on

[03:22:50]

sphery:

benw: Fluxbox is a great choice, taking something like 1MiB incremental memory (above what you'd use without it) or RatPoison, taking about 300kiB incremental memory

[03:22:58]

wagnerrp:

if youre not using this as a desktop, and youre consuming more than a couple MB of memory on your WM, youre doing it wrong

[03:23:33]

sphery:

Mythbuntu uses XFCE, which is more of a DE (GNOME, KDE) than a WM (Fluxbox, RatPoison), but it's /much/ lighter than GNOME and KDE

[03:23:59]

sphery:

it's a nice happy middle ground for those who want to use the Myth box for Myth and, occasionally, use it as a desktop

[03:24:26]

sphery:

simple is definitely good

[03:24:31]

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[03:24:53]

sphery:

I use Flux, but only because I use that everywhere else (my choice for my desktop machines), so it was easy

[03:24:56]

benw:

Deb supports Rat Poison... Debian is my distro of choice..

[03:25:49]

sphery:

if I were one of those craz^H^H^H^Hpeople who think that 1MiB of RAM is wasted on a WM, I'd use RatPoison

[03:26:18]

sphery:

but if you normally use something like GNOME or KDE, using RatPoison is a great choice

[03:26:21]

wagnerrp:

sphery: well when you're trying to run mythtv on an xbox, every little bit count

[03:26:31]

sphery:

(if you don't already have experience with Flux, that is)

[03:26:31]

benw:

I don't think memory will be an issue for me.. my box has 2gig and if all I'm running is Myth and a small win manager I should be alright.

[03:26:40]

sphery:

wagnerrp: heh, true

[03:26:53]

sphery:

yeah, 2GB is good

[03:27:33]

benw:

not like I'm going to install on netbook heh

[03:27:41]

sphery:

heh, that's good

[03:27:50]

sphery:

we've had plenty who think that's a good plan, too :)

[03:27:55]

benw:

or an Andriod phone ;)

[03:28:54]

sphery:

RatPoison is also nice in that its default config is good for Myth

[03:36:27]

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[03:39:54]

darkdrgn2k:

hey all, any one know what coudl cause PVR150 to have a bit of colour bleed?

[03:43:59]

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[03:47:59]

Beirdo:

ratpoison++

[03:48:07]

Beirdo:

it's good for killing rats, too

[03:49:05]

benw:

and getting rid of a nemesis :)

[03:49:12]

darkdrgn2k:

LOL

[03:49:25]

darkdrgn2k:

so any one have an idea about colour bleed LOL

[03:51:13]

benw:

Just read that Clash of the Titans is being remade. That is funny man. I remember seeing the original at a Drive-in theater. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0800320/

[03:57:07]

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[04:07:47]

darkdrgn2k:

Any one know why when i switch to a Double Digital stream i get "digital like" static out my sound system before it actual switches

[04:07:51]

darkdrgn2k:

(it thinkgs its PCM)

[04:09:36]

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[04:13:42]

fryfrog:

no idea, but i like the "double digital" :)

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fukdnscerd:

i got the latest release-fixes release from svn. the howto im following skews at this point do i have to configure and compile each part seperately

[04:36:36]

fukdnscerd:

nvm

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darkdrgn2k:

fryfrog

[04:41:33]

darkdrgn2k:

fryfrog :-P ha- ha -ha

[04:41:48]

darkdrgn2k:

fryfrog you need gold plated optical cables to make double digital work well

[04:42:07]

wagnerrp:

fryfrog just thought i would join in the fun

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[04:51:09]

fukdnscerd1:

i am trying to compile svn release-fixes version. It says freetype must be installed... does it need to be svn version or current mythbuntu version ok?

[04:51:34]

kormoc:

you're likely just missing freetype-dev(el?)

[04:52:17]

fukdnscerd1:

yep that was it

[04:52:54]

fukdnscerd1:

do all the requirements need to be the dev packages

[04:53:07]

kormoc:

pretty much

[04:53:12]

fukdnscerd1:

k

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[05:05:27]

fukdnscerd1:

compiling now, thanks

[05:06:22]

kormoc:

np

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[05:50:07]

sphery:

Wow, I feel so sorry for anyone who ends up procuring the services of "I'm about to be a lawyer."

[05:50:43]

sphery:

mc2xml (closed-source, proprietary) = "do it yourself" in what world?

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[05:59:27]

wagnerrp:

sphery: ive forwarded the thread to a friend of mine (a real lawyer), to see what he has to say about it in the morning

[05:59:35]

wagnerrp:

if nothing else, i imagine hell get a good laugh

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[06:02:53]

fryfrog:

double digital, its like when you rar a zip file :)

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[06:16:42]

tank-man:

what thread are you guys talking about?

[06:16:59]

wagnerrp:

'MS media center'

[06:17:13]

tank-man:

ok

[06:17:36]

kormoc:

AKA "I don't want to feel bad about stealing"

[06:17:58]

wagnerrp:

basically, its some soon-to-be lawyer claiming that because he never agreed to any terms of use for microsoft's guide data servers, he can pull all the data he wants off them

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tank-man:

... and he's a "top poster" as well. heh

[06:42:28]

tank-man:

nvm, wrong guy

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[08:57:55]

Dibblah:

And he will continue to use the scraping service because it "gives him a feeling of ownership". Uhmm... Riiiight.

[08:58:09]

Dibblah:

So does joyriding, I guess.

[09:00:16]

sid3windr:

lol =)

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[09:11:27]

Gumby:

hi all. what is the recommended way of taking a screenshot in mythfrontend?

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[09:37:58]

oobe:

Gumby, there is a in built screen shot util

[09:38:17]

oobe:

the default path is /tmp or you may need to define it

[09:38:35]

oobe:

also you need to make a keybinding for it in mythcontrols

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[10:56:14]

justinh:

oh great. our retarded CEO wants to solve a problem with a crap product by..putting a fan inside its sealed box

[10:57:40]

justinh:

sure, it'll help. for a short time. delaying the inevitable. Tip:don't put 5 codecs which each suck 3 watts in a sealed enclosure with no means of conducting heat away if said chips can't operate reliably at 100 degrees C

[10:57:40]

AndyCap:

justinh: he probably thinks the room gets cooler if you leav the fridge door open too

[10:58:34]

justinh:

these chips are on cards that are vertically mounted, like DIMMs..be a bit tricky getting even a heatpipe bonded to the top of the chip

[11:00:10]

justinh:

the real problem is, we should never have bought the company who designed these chips

[11:01:03]

justinh:

oh, and this thing has to be tested in the environmental chamber because... running it at room temperature & doing simple maths isn't good enough

[11:01:28]

justinh:

because temperature changes in this kind of scenario are never linear apparently

[11:03:35]

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[11:31:45]

Beirdo:

justinh: you can use that box to boil water for your tea :)

[11:31:46]

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[11:31:53]

Beirdo:

it's a feature!

[11:34:03]

Beirdo:

OMG, the pvmove is STILL running ;)

[11:34:05]

Beirdo:

92%

[11:37:32]

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[11:40:31]

justinh:

might aswell tow the line...I mean it's only a whole day I'll be wasting trying to prove the CEO's crackpot theory that he CAN change the laws of physics

[11:41:00]

Beirdo:

heh

[11:41:01]

justinh:

though I'm worried what'll happen if he doesn't see the results he wants to see. It'll obviously be MY fault

[11:41:39]

Beirdo:

or just get a hole-saw drill bit, cut a honking big hole in the top of one, put in some aluminum screen..

[11:42:01]

Beirdo:

and test that one too, see which one lasts longer, or lives at a lower temperature :)

[11:42:36]

justinh:

or, put a bomb in his helicopter...

[11:42:42]

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[11:43:06]

Beirdo:

now now ;) as tempting as it may be... I doubt you'd like prison much

[11:44:18]

justinh:

every time there's news of a light aircraft crash we all live in hope here

[11:45:26]

Beirdo:

heh

[11:45:37]

Beirdo:

just hope he does something to enrage Al Queda

[11:46:41]

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[11:49:08]

Beirdo:

ugh, can't believe it's Monday morning already

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[12:11:27]

Beirdo:

98%

[12:11:43]

Beirdo:

this thing might actually finish before I need to leave for work

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[12:28:23]

martin__:

icodeon_scorm_db

[12:31:16]

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[12:32:56]

Beirdo:

and it finished. YAY

[12:33:11]

martin__:

sorry about that.. Very wrong channel :)

[12:33:13]

Beirdo:

off to work I go... with the machine shut off

[13:08:39]

Dibblah:

Isn't it toe the line?

[13:11:49]

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[13:18:47]

Beirdo:

so, if all goes well, I can setup at least a tuner-less backend again tonight

[13:19:10]

Beirdo:

using my old recordings that were trapped on that RAID :)

[13:27:06]

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[13:31:09]

BinaryKhaos:

Hi. Just did a rescan in mythtv (dvb-s) and wondered what "SCTE channels" where? Is there a documentation for the supported channel types somewhere I can access?

[13:35:26]

justinh:

Dibblah: semantics. Either way our CEO is just another PHB PITA

[13:38:52]

Beirdo:

tote dat barge, lift dat bale... get a little drunk and ya land in jail...

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[14:19:18]

innatech:

is the original xbox w/xebian still a feasible front end for SD content?

[14:21:21]

Beirdo:

I can't see why not, but it's limiting you to SD only

[14:30:46]

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[14:40:26]

prupert:

Hi, hope this isn't too much of a stupid question. Just wanna check that there is no advantage in having an ION based motherboard if you are just using the system as a mythtv BackEnd? I am guessing an ION or the new Broadcom crystal HD module (when support is added) system is only useful on FrontEnd machines?

[14:41:27]

tank-man:

well, you do need some kind of computer to run the backend on

[14:43:27]

prupert:

well, yeah ;) but I have Intel D510MO (the new Atom Dual Core) motherboard, it has an expansion slot and I can bung in the new Broadcom module, but if it is just being used as a BE then I am wondering if the Broadcom module will be of any use?

[14:43:58]

sid3windr:

I think it's only used for playback

[14:44:04]

sid3windr:

though maybe for transcoding? that I don't know

[14:45:10]

prupert:

that's what I was wondering. I have read on the xbmc.org site that the ffmpeg chaps are working to support it, so does that mean it can be used to offload some of the transcoding to? I guess I'll head over to their room and see if anyone knows

[14:45:31]

prupert:

cheers btw

[14:53:10]

innatech:

Berido, thanks. The wiki for it is marked outdated, so I thought I should ask.

[14:53:38]

Beirdo:

que?

[14:54:10]

innatech:

re: xebian frontend. You answered my question a little earlier.

[14:54:20]

Beirdo:

Oh :)

[14:54:41]

Beirdo:

if you can get it running, I can't see why it couldn't still work for an SD-only frontend

[14:56:19]

innatech:

thought maybe it was unmaintained and incompatible or something. I can't seem to get live TV to work in the Tech XBMC builds, so I'd like to give it a try.

[14:57:20]

innatech:

I'll go to mini itx front ends eventually, but w/o HD sat receivers or HDTVs, this would be nice to have for now.

[14:57:45]

Beirdo:

makes sense

[14:58:14]

innatech:

yup :)

[14:58:18]

Beirdo:

if it doesn't work, at least you tried, and you can work on updating the wiki page as I doubt many people have tried in quite some time

[14:58:42]

innatech:

yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. Looks a little.....dusty.

[14:59:57]

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[15:00:27]

innatech:

I think that may be becase the native myth:// support in XBMC seems to work for recordings, and that probably satisfies most peoples' needs.

[15:01:35]

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[15:02:05]

Beirdo:

yeah, likley

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[15:33:38]

justinh:

innatech: linux on the xbox makes mythfrontend a *painful* experience

[15:33:46]

justinh:

it's fair to say it 'works' but man is it ever slow

[15:34:47]

justinh:

plus you'd have a fair battle on your hands finding a theme which'd work with 0.22 and fit in 32MB RAM :D

[15:35:08]

Dibblah:

You can technically upgrade the RAM.

[15:35:20]

innatech:

justinh: OK. I'll bear that in mind.....yeah, themes etc came to mind as elements that could cause trouble as myth leaves the xbox behind.

[15:35:27]

justinh:

well yeah. if you can technically solder fine pitch SMD stuff

[15:35:29]

Dibblah:

... On the earlier boards, etc.

[15:35:33]

innatech:

I'm not doing any of that.

[15:35:54]

Dibblah:

Good plan :)

[15:36:02]

innatech:

Heh.

[15:36:31]

justinh:

I found the xbox too fugly & noisy for general use as a frontend

[15:37:32]

innatech:

I'd tolerate it for a while, but if it's going to have poor responsiveness I might just find another solution and skip the effort.

[15:38:12]

justinh:

it's pretty unresponsive tbh

[15:38:16]

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[15:38:26]

justinh:

playback etc is fine.. it's just the time it takes to get there ;-)

[15:39:09]

innatech:

Yeah. That doesn't sound good. I just know that once I start looking at hardware for a frontend box, I'll inevitable want it to be HD capable....and then I'm into spending money.

[15:40:22]

jduggan:

not really, anything new is pretty much hd capable

[15:40:33]

justinh:

good grief man. ambient temp of 30 degrees C, the codec chip surface is 90 deg C & rising. LOL

[15:40:57]

justinh:

we rate these units to 50 degrees C in the spec (!)

[15:41:08]

wagnerrp:

innatech: basically, unless youre buying old, used parts, just about anything you get will be capable of 'HD'

[15:41:16]

justinh:

oh and these codec chips ain't military spec :D

[15:41:52]

innatech:

jduggan — everything I've seen in the sub $200 range has had mixed reviews on that. And by 'HD' I mean full 1080p. Even if most programming and content is bcast/distributed in 1080i.

[15:42:10]

justinh:

'1080p' is still fairly meaningless

[15:42:28]

wagnerrp:

there is a world of different between 1080p and 1080p

[15:42:38]

wagnerrp:

my old P3 laptop can decode 1080p

[15:42:49]

innatech:

Hmm. GMA950 boards aren't enough, I was told....those still seem to be crowding out the others.

[15:42:51]

justinh:

if you mean 'worst possible case scenario' 1080P ....

[15:42:56]

wagnerrp:

but then my 2.8GHz C2D chokes on 1080p

[15:43:08]

wagnerrp:

like justinh said, its a meaningless term

[15:43:46]

justinh:

what you *could* say instead is.. you'd like it to be able to cope with the best quality, hardest to play media you're likely to find in the wild

[15:44:02]

innatech:

Yeah, or more precisely, I'd like to be future proof for ~3 years.

[15:44:09]

justinh:

in other words cope with anything you can throw at it

[15:44:28]

wagnerrp:

well theres nothing new on the horizon that would be more difficult than what is currently available

[15:44:38]

justinh:

if said 1080P was 2mbit/sec I bet even a Via Epia could play it

[15:44:49]

justinh:

oh wait no ..maybe not but you get the idea

[15:45:06]

innatech:

yeah, see what you're getting at.

[15:45:27]

wagnerrp:

maybe if h265 gets released as expected in 2012, but nothing theres not going to be any distributed media supporting it for a long time after that

[15:45:40]

justinh:

either a way fast CPU (pretty much the norm unless you're talking silly Atom stuff), or entirely GPU assisted

[15:45:59]

innatech:

I should probably educate myself on what the new D*TV standard is going to use and target that.

[15:46:09]

justinh:

or.. fingers crossed... aided by other hardware decoders like the broadcom thingy

[15:46:20]

justinh:

what new standard?

[15:46:43]

innatech:

I'm still a little unclear, but it sounds like MPEG4 of some kind.

[15:46:44]

wagnerrp:

any old Ath64 or Core processor (besides maybe the ULV variants) can play ATSC

[15:46:51]

justinh:

innatech: where?

[15:46:52]

wagnerrp:

which is mpeg2 up to 19mbps

[15:47:35]

innatech:

justinh: hmm? Wherever DirecTV has coverage, I suppose.

[15:47:49]

justinh:

you won't be grabbing that directly anyway

[15:47:50]

wagnerrp:

you cant record directtv with mythtv

[15:48:06]

wagnerrp:

you have to record analog off your satellite receiver

[15:48:24]

justinh:

assuming they don't disable component out. Muhahahahahaha. MUHAHAHAHAHAHA

[15:48:27]

wagnerrp:

which either means a SD IVTV card (easy) or a HD HDPVR (hard)

[15:48:32]

innatech:

Oh, that's right, isn't it. You can't get a stream out of the FW or USB port.

[15:48:55]

wagnerrp:

for an HDPVR, youre going to need at least a midrange Core2, or high end Ath64

[15:49:14]

innatech:

Wagnerrp: I don't mind muscle on the backend.

[15:49:15]

justinh:

& even then the HDPVR can't do 1080P AFAIK

[15:49:26]

justinh:

innatech: no, that's for *playback*

[15:49:29]

wagnerrp:

who cares about the backend

[15:49:37]

wagnerrp:

the frontend does decoding

[15:49:40]

innatech:

yikes.

[15:49:51]

innatech:

Yeah, of course. >bonk<

[15:50:31]

innatech:

Maybe I'll just snag another couple of these HP DC5800 small form factor dual core boxes and hide them in cabinets.

[15:50:48]

innatech:

Seems like overkill, but if that's what's required.....

[15:50:58]

justinh:

I think hometime is required.

[15:51:01]

justinh:

yay!

[15:51:05]

wagnerrp:

at that price, that is overkill

[15:51:10]

Beirdo:

justinh: not too many pints :)

[15:51:32]

innatech:

I'm not exactly paying for them....kind of on permanent loan from the office.

[15:51:53]

innatech:

The utility company will love me. Heh.

[15:52:16]

wagnerrp:

why? frontends done correctly will only cost a couple $/yr

[15:52:58]

wagnerrp:

just put it into standby when not in use

[15:53:16]

innatech:

Well, this HP doesn't strike me as very economical for what is essentially supposed to be a STB. But yes, it should be on standby most of the time.

[15:53:18]

wagnerrp:

'couple' = ~$10 for several hours of use per day

[15:55:15]

innatech:

I'll wind up re-doing it with mini hardware, an htpc case and passive cooling if it bothers me enough, I suppose.

[15:56:00]

innatech:

In any case I appreciate the information. Not sure why I didn't think through the D*TV component/frontend decoder thing.

[15:56:44]

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[15:58:10]

Gorkyman:

hey guys

[15:58:24]

Gorkyman:

is mythtv better than windows 7 media center?

[15:58:39]

wagnerrp:

just think about this for a second

[15:58:51]

wagnerrp:

all of us in here are using mythtv over WMC

[15:59:04]

Gorkyman:

ok, could you tell me why?

[15:59:05]

wagnerrp:

we have already chosen that we prefer it

[15:59:22]

Gorkyman:

couse i'm buying nettop and dont know which software to choose

[15:59:33]

wagnerrp:

on a net-top? neither

[16:00:11]

Gorkyman:

its this one http://www.asrock.com/nettop/overview.asp?Model=ION%20330HT-BD

[16:00:13]

Gorkyman:

why not ?

[16:00:37]

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[16:01:04]

wagnerrp:

because youre on a small machine, limited hard drive, access only to usb tuners

[16:01:14]

Gorkyman:

I wanted to configure my own htpc... but in the end this box has all the same things

[16:01:26]

wagnerrp:

its doubtful youre going to leave it on for long periods to allow scheduled recording to work

[16:01:32]

wagnerrp:

chances are you just want to use it for livetv

[16:01:37]

Gorkyman:

i dont really need it for tv... i need it for audio/video/photo playing

[16:01:59]

wagnerrp:

if youre not going to use it for tv, mythtv is not for you

[16:02:06]

wagnerrp:

it is first and foremost, a DVR

[16:02:16]

Gorkyman:

hmm...

[16:02:36]

wagnerrp:

MCE, i dont really have any experience with

[16:02:44]

wagnerrp:

you might want to check out xbmc or boxee

[16:03:02]

Gorkyman:

so mythtv is not that good in other aspects?

[16:03:18]

wagnerrp:

mythtv is not designed to run sans tuners

[16:03:31]

wagnerrp:

the frontend complains if you try to run it without a backend

[16:03:39]

wagnerrp:

and the backend complains if you try to run it without a tuner card

[16:03:53]

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[16:03:55]

prupert:

DEFO go for XBMC is is a truly great Media Center and very easy to set up

[16:04:00]

innatech:

mythtv isn't meant to be a stand-alone media player. Try XBMC as suggested. It will do what you want.

[16:04:30]

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[16:04:44]

prupert:

a lot of people are using that very box with XBMC using XBMC Live (the Linux CD version of XBMC) you just pop it in the drive, install and off you go

[16:05:06]

Gorkyman:

ok, thanks for the tip guys

[16:05:19]

prupert:

if you have any problems, just post on xbmc.org, loads of people can help you there as they are using the same box

[16:05:39]

Gorkyman:

prupert: is xbmc better than windows 7 media player?

[16:05:50]

Gorkyman:

center*

[16:05:58]

prupert:

far better imho – supports way more formats out of the box

[16:06:09]

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[16:06:17]

prupert:

loads of lovely skins, automatic downloading of movie details including posters and fanart

[16:06:25]

prupert:

it is just pure class

[16:06:31]

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[16:06:37]

Gorkyman:

accesability ?

[16:06:48]

Gorkyman:

easy of use ?

[16:07:27]

prupert:

if you have Win7 you should be able to install xbmc on it directly – it is very easy to use, especially if you have a remote – all MCE (media center edition) remotes work fine

[16:07:51]

Gorkyman:

i have logitechs tv, which should be fine i gues :)

[16:07:55]

Gorkyman:

remote*

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[16:08:22]

prupert:

yeah, I am sure it will be fine, xbmc supports many remotes

[16:08:56]

Gorkyman:

and i gues localisation is not a problem

[16:09:01]

Gorkyman:

and i can do my own skin?

[16:09:20]

prupert:

nope, you can choose default language and there are LOADS of beautiful skins out there

[16:09:39]

Gorkyman:

what about plugin programing is it hard?... if i would want lets say connect it to picasso for pictures etc?

[16:10:21]

prupert:

well, if you know python, you can make new plugins, if you don't – hmm, it will take you a while check out here: Ω

[16:10:32]

prupert:

oops, sorry, my bad – type

[16:10:34]

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[16:10:36]

prupert:

typo

[16:10:44]

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[16:10:51]

Gorkyman:

yeah python wont be a problem

[16:11:05]

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[16:11:08]

prupert:

here for skins: http://lifehacker.com/5198009/customize-xbmc- . . . wesome-skins

[16:11:11]

Gorkyman:

so definetly xbmc over WHC?

[16:11:24]

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[16:11:33]

prupert:

most defo – it is free, just download it and give it a whirl, you have nothign to loose!

[16:12:08]

Gorkyman:

okey, thanks

[16:12:19]

Gorkyman:

althou i still have to install windows first ?

[16:12:37]

prupert:

nope, you can install XBMC Live, which comes with Linux

[16:12:55]

Gorkyman:

ql,will try that also

[16:12:56]

prupert:

but if you do that, you will be wiping the harddrive, so make sure there is nothing of importance there first

[16:13:10]

prupert:

xbmc.org/download is the place to go

[16:14:02]

Gorkyman:

ql, thanks

[16:15:11]

prupert:

no probs my man

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[16:32:08]

prupert:

sid3windr: FYI, I just spoke to the ffmpeg devs and they say that the Broadcom module will help with transcoding, by taking some load off the CPU, so it would be useful on a mythtv backend box if you use it for transcoding too (though obviously mythtranscode might need to be tweaked so it used ffmpeg in the necessary way (that is, if it uses ffmpeg at all, which I don't think it does)) but you can write your own t

[16:32:10]

prupert:

ranscode script as a userjob to use ffmpeg I guess. anyway, kewl news imho ;)

[16:33:07]

sid3windr:

:-)

[16:33:09]

sid3windr:

nice

[16:33:32]

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[16:33:35]

wagnerrp:

prupert: that assume you rewrite the transcoder/commflagger to allow alternate decoding profiles

[16:33:45]

fukdnscerd:

anyone know why you should set make to run as 2 jobs on single processor systems

[16:33:56]

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[16:34:00]

wagnerrp:

fukdnscerd: why? or how?

[16:34:22]

wagnerrp:

fukdnscerd: single processor? or single core?

[16:34:25]

oobe:

fukdnscerd, sometimes it builds slower on a single core

[16:34:33]

oobe:

if you use j2

[16:34:59]

wagnerrp:

is almost all cases, make goes off and does additional prep tasks besides compiling

[16:35:01]

fukdnscerd:

i read a tutorial on building mythtv and it said to run make with 'make -j 2' to enable it to run as two jobs. They said to raise the number on multicore/multiprocessor machines

[16:35:09]

wagnerrp:

things that take a lot of disk and not much CPU

[16:35:39]

wagnerrp:

assuming youve got the memory for it, and dont end up swapping

[16:35:39]

fukdnscerd:

ok i see, just curious because i was always told to set to number of cpus/cores

[16:35:52]

wagnerrp:

you generally want to run one more than the number of cores you have

[16:36:08]

fukdnscerd:

cool, thanks for clearing that up

[16:38:44]

wagnerrp:

be aware of your memory limits

[16:39:09]

wagnerrp:

'-j2' on mythtv will consume about 1GB of memory at some points

[16:40:36]

oobe:

i didnt know that i use the same jobs as the number of cores

[16:40:50]

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[16:40:54]

fukdnscerd:

i just ran make without the -j2, its running kinda slow anyway, bout an hour to compile mythtv of course i was watching a movie too

[16:41:00]

prupert:

wagnerrp: I personally plan to just create a bash script to do it all externally from mythtv using ffmpeg, getting the files out of mythtv via mythrename.pl, as a stop gap solution anyway

[16:41:41]

wagnerrp:

honestly, mythtranscode could stand a huge overhaul

[16:41:43]

jamesd2:

fukdnscerd, that is pretty amzing if you have a single core system, and even more so if you only have 1GB of ram

[16:42:07]

** wagnerrp has a single core system with 1GB of ram **

[16:43:12]

fukdnscerd:

actually i have 640MB ram and a 1.6Ghz single core, but it uses rambus too so the rams a bit faster

[16:43:14]

Chicago:

Out of curiousness, why isn't mythtranscode merely a collection of calls to mencoder and ffmpeg?

[16:43:34]

wagnerrp:

s/faster/slower/

[16:44:27]

jamesd2:

fukdnscerd, wow if that is really the case, mythtv is smaller than i would of guessed...

[16:44:49]

fukdnscerd:

i thought rambus was supposed to be faster than legacy ddr, You gotta give me a little credit. My machines are a bit behind the times

[16:45:30]

wagnerrp:

rambus is faster per channel

[16:45:32]

jamesd2:

i have found unless i'm doing some serious gaming, ram speed isnt that important.. disk and having enough ram is far more important.

[16:46:01]

wagnerrp:

however dual channel memory far exceeded anythign rambus was capable of at the time

[16:46:14]

wagnerrp:

dual channel boards with ddr, rather

[16:46:54]

jamesd2:

give me a box with 4GB of ddr-667 ram over a 2 GB box with 1300 ddr3 ram any day of the week.

[16:47:08]

fukdnscerd:

oic, don't have a lot of experience with different ram types. My budget has been pretty limited the last 5–10 years

[16:48:00]

fukdnscerd:

this is probably the most up to date box i have...

[16:48:04]

innatech:

Is it sane to attach two D*tv boxes to the same HVR-1600 (cx-18), one on svideo, one on channel 3 on the OTA tuner? Will mythdb understand that they are both sources for the same d*TV programming?

[16:48:27]

wagnerrp:

innatech: for what purpose?

[16:48:56]

wagnerrp:

that card can only record from one analog source at a time

[16:49:11]

innatech:

wagnerrp: ah, OK. That's what I wanted to check.

[16:49:37]

innatech:

I'll have to put the second card back in and wrestle with the PCI issues.

[16:54:22]

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[16:55:32]

innatech:

For front-ends--what do people think about this board + an E5300 [ http://www.provantage.com/aopen-91-8et10-n700~7AOPN0K8.htm ]

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[17:21:37]

oobe:

devinheitmueller, remember we were talking about a tuner that i had trouble with certain channels well i plugged it into a different antenna and it worked well for all channels but strange i plug a new tuner into the pc and it gets no reception problems using the old antenna

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[17:24:14]

devinheitmueller:

hi oobe.

[17:24:27]

devinheitmueller:

that is odd.

[17:24:32]

devinheitmueller:

which tuner is this again?

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[17:28:24]

oobe:

devinheitmueller, im using dvico dual 4 rev 1 as my main tuner

[17:28:39]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: is that cx88/s5h1411/xc5000 ?

[17:28:44]

devinheitmueller:

(I don't remember)

[17:28:45]

oobe:

the one i just plugged in is a pinnacle 310i its a cheap hybrid card

[17:28:58]

oobe:

its xcieve

[17:29:16]

oobe:

it uses xc3028-v27.fw

[17:31:37]

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[17:34:09]

oobe:

its pci card with usb device inside it doesnt show up in lspci but does in lsusb http://pastebin.ca/1817487

[17:34:46]

wagnerrp:

well thats awful

[17:35:07]

oobe:

what is

[17:35:25]

wagnerrp:

a PCI tuner card, which is actually a USB tuner card and a bridge chip

[17:35:35]

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[17:36:01]

oobe:

well its actually somthing i dont notice

[17:36:08]

oobe:

i forget

[17:36:27]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: it's not a horrible idea. It makes the design a bit more straightforward, and the drivers actually tend to be alot easier to write.

[17:36:31]

oobe:

i checked lspci and scratched my head for a second before i remembered

[17:36:56]

devinheitmueller:

Oh, ok. So this is a zl10353 based design.

[17:37:15]

devinheitmueller:

The problem could be related to some ongoing debate about how the xc3028 driver does tuning for certain frequency ranges.

[17:37:30]

devinheitmueller:

... there's been an ongoing thread on the linux-media mailing list.

[17:37:54]

devinheitmueller:

... in particular related to cards that are a combination of zl10353 and xc3028.

[17:39:41]

oobe:

are there patches to try the side that is loosing's idea

[17:40:26]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: I would have to look. There were various patches going back and forth.

[17:40:43]

oobe:

i will search the list

[17:40:57]

oobe:

just thought you might know off hand

[17:41:05]

devinheitmueller:

I've been trying to stay out of that debate, but there was an attempt to drag me into it because I have a DVB signal generator and could actually isolate the behavior.

[17:42:22]

oobe:

my tuner is actually using tuner_xc2028

[17:44:07]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: I seriously doubt that.

[17:44:20]

oobe:

im subscibed to linux-dvb@linuxtv.org is the debate going on there too or is linux-media a completly different list

[17:44:26]

devinheitmueller:

The xc2028 driver is used for both the 2028 and 3028, but only the 3028 chip supports DVB-T.

[17:44:36]

devinheitmueller:

linux-dvb is *long* deprecated.

[17:44:49]

oobe:

do you want me to paste my lsmod

[17:44:55]

devinheitmueller:

You should unsubscribe from linux-dvb and subscribe to linux-media, since that's were essentially *all* the traffic is.

[17:45:27]

devinheitmueller:

I beileve that you're using the tuner_xc2028 driver, since that's the driver used for both the 2028 and 3028. But your board actually has an xc3028 chip.

[17:46:22]

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[17:46:40]

sphery:

wagnerrp: you'll have to let me know what your friend says about the thread.

[17:46:40]

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[17:46:51]

oobe:

ok i just subscribed

[17:48:19]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I wrote up a response last night where he said something about, "You should be happy that corporations can't control you like that," telling him that the corporation is not attempting to control *you*, but is attempting to control their property (servers) and services.

[17:48:46]

sphery:

haven't sent it, though--figured the guy won't listen and will probably say, "No, they're controlling you if you agree to their stupid terms."

[17:49:45]

sphery:

wagnerrp: oh, and thoughts on just closing #6680 and letting any issues be reported with new tickets

[17:50:41]

wagnerrp:

sphery: basically, by using the service, he acknowledges that he understands the terms of use, and will abide by them

[17:50:56]

wagnerrp:

by willfully ignoring and violating the terms, he is at fault

[17:51:46]

wagnerrp:

that, and apparently that type of access to copyrighted content on a server falls under the almighty DMCA

[17:52:05]

sphery:

wow, so the "popular misconception" he mentioned is actually not a misconception.

[17:52:08]

sphery:

amazing

[17:52:54]

Beirdo:

OMG, won't that luser ever just get bent?

[17:53:44]

sphery:

heh

[17:54:26]

wagnerrp:

he also said we dont need to be worried about such goings on on the mailing list and irc channel

[17:54:48]

wagnerrp:

since mythtv should be protected by anything anyone not connected to the project says, by the DMCA safe harbor provisions

[17:55:00]

Beirdo:

uh huh

[17:55:08]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, good luck with that.

[17:55:38]

Beirdo:

that won't protect you one bit if you get sued... you still go to court even if you eventually win due to better lawyers than that luser will ever be

[17:55:47]

Beirdo:

you still lose your shirt

[17:56:37]

sphery:

wagnerrp: yeah, my concern is the interpretation of his comments as "the general view" of MythTV users or whatever

[17:57:02]

Beirdo:

sphery: yeah, or as promoting it to newbies who don't know better as well

[17:57:05]

sphery:

I.e. I don't want people to label me a thief just because of some loud-mouthed thief on the list

[17:57:11]

sphery:

that, too

[17:57:35]

sphery:

his messages did seem to be promoted as legal "almost-advice"

[17:57:36]

iamlindoro:

yeah, the average new person hearing "Well, you can pay $20, or you can TOTALLY LEGALLY AND I'M NEARLY A LAWYER take these listings from microsoft and stick it to the man!"

[17:57:51]

wagnerrp:

sphery: but youre not paying for cable, obviously you must be stealing it

[17:58:05]

wagnerrp:

how else would you get those magical broadcast channels

[17:58:27]

Beirdo:

he said he's not giving legal advice... he's giving legal facts.

[17:58:29]

Beirdo:

heh

[17:58:33]

Beirdo:

whatever.

[17:58:45]

wagnerrp:

there is no such thing as a fact in law

[17:59:02]

Beirdo:

unless he's several supreme court judges, he's in no position to dictate what the law means

[17:59:24]

wagnerrp:

its all just interpretations based off precedence

[17:59:28]

Beirdo:

yup

[18:00:07]

Beirdo:

after a long drawn out court battle, he could prove to be right

[18:00:11]

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[18:00:18]

Beirdo:

but I don't want to be involved with said battle

[18:00:39]

sphery:

wagnerrp: shhhh.... don't want people to know about my secret source of "free" TV

[18:01:22]

sphery:

Beirdo: I truly hope he gets to have that court battle--as a defendant who's paying for the legal representation

[18:01:34]

Beirdo:

yeah.

[18:02:07]

Beirdo:

to a lawyer who repeatedly trouts him for being so dumb :)

[18:03:50]

Beirdo:

I think he forgets that in a lawsuit, it's also about what is deemed reasonable to a jury. It's not reasonable to expect that that data is meant to be taken for free, etc.

[18:04:06]

sphery:

agreed

[18:04:37]

sphery:

and he's blatantly ignoring all the copyrighted data that /is/ present--the descriptions, potentially the programid's, ...

[18:04:47]

sphery:

seriesid's

[18:05:18]

Beirdo:

yeah

[18:05:35]

Beirdo:

and the potential licensing fees that TMS may have to pay the networks too

[18:05:39]

wagnerrp:

sphery: i went ahead and closed both of those

[18:05:40]

sphery:

yeah

[18:05:43]

Beirdo:

that MS has to pay TMS

[18:05:50]

sphery:

wagnerrp: thx... Just helps clean up the backlog

[18:06:05]

sphery:

even if it gets pushed, it's still one more ticket "weighing us down" :)

[18:06:56]

wagnerrp:

why is '2/28/10' 18 hours from now?

[18:07:15]

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[18:07:16]

Beirdo:

ummm

[18:07:18]

wagnerrp:

is that actually 18 hours past?

[18:07:27]

Beirdo:

that sounds more likely

[18:07:32]

wagnerrp:

and trac isnt set up to handle negatives

[18:08:21]

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[18:09:17]

Beirdo:

seems that way

[18:09:35]

Beirdo:

we planning another BSP soon?

[18:10:16]

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Mode for #mythtv-users by iamlindoro!~iamlindor@unaffiliated/iamlindoro : -q #mythtv-users!*@*

[18:28:33]

Mode for #mythtv-users by iamlindoro!~iamlindor@unaffiliated/iamlindoro : -q mchou!*@*

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[18:28:37]

iamlindoro:

behave

[18:28:41]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : -o iamlindoro

[18:28:46]

mchou:

iamlindoro: shut up

[18:28:57]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +o iamlindoro

[18:28:59]

Mode for #mythtv-users by iamlindoro!~iamlindor@unaffiliated/iamlindoro : +b *!*quassel@*unaffiliated/mchou

[18:28:59]

mchou has been kicked from #mythtv-users by iamlindoro!~iamlindor@unaffiliated/iamlindoro (mchou)

[18:29:02]

iamlindoro:

bye!

[18:29:06]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : -o iamlindoro

[18:29:29]

iamlindoro:

Can't say I didn't tru

[18:29:30]

iamlindoro:

try

[18:29:35]

iamlindoro:

Beirdo, ^^

[18:29:57]

Beirdo:

heh

[18:30:19]

iamlindoro:

And if he's bugging you I an genuinely sorry for that

[18:30:22]

iamlindoro:

am

[18:30:36]

Beirdo:

oh jeez, way to blow his chances

[18:30:57]

iamlindoro:

didn't take him long

[18:31:03]

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[18:32:48]

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[18:33:25]

sphery:

yeah, that was fair

[18:35:00]

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[18:35:11]

sphery:

if the first thing he says when he gets back is "shut up," he's not learned anything

[18:35:38]

iamlindoro:

just don't get that guy

[18:36:31]

sphery:

I guess some believe that IRC is a right, not a privilege

[18:36:39]

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[18:40:01]

Beirdo:

yeah, a "sorry, I had a bad day" would have gone a long way

[18:40:08]

iamlindoro:

yup

[18:43:36]

Beirdo:

the fit-pc2 is in the mail :)

[18:43:39]

Beirdo:

muhahahah

[18:43:54]

Beirdo:

now I need something HDMI/DVI-D to display it on

[18:44:12]

AndyCap:

btw has the US introduced any database protection in their copyright law. if so I guess the TMS data would be even more protected.

[18:44:54]

Beirdo:

it wouldn't surprise me

[18:44:55]

sphery:

good question

[18:44:58]

Brad-D:

that's how got to be an all time record for throwing away a second chance

[18:44:59]

AndyCap:

Ah. I guess not. http://www.iusmentis.com/databases/us/

[18:45:01]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap, I don't know for sure, but for me the crux of it is in the descriptive data, which is without a doubt protected

[18:45:03]

Brad-D:

haha

[18:45:09]

Brad-D:

errr that has to be

[18:45:24]

Beirdo:

just like it's potentially a crime to access other people's servers without permission, especially when they DO have stated ToS

[18:45:25]

AndyCap:

iamlindoro: yeah. if it's an original work I guess that would be accurate.

[18:45:43]

iamlindoro:

AndyCap, yeah, TMS employs writers to write them all

[18:45:57]

Brad-D:

plus schedules direct is like $20 a year, geeeeez

[18:45:59]

Brad-D:

cheap much?!?!

[18:46:05]

sphery:

no joke

[18:46:08]

Beirdo:

be cool to have that job... get to watch the shows weeks before they are out

[18:46:12]

Brad-D:

if someone needs to steal to feed their family or something.. then fine

[18:46:26]

AndyCap:

Brad-D: Hehe yeah, it's not exactly a kings ransom

[18:46:29]

Brad-D:

but to get a luxury high end dvr system, and not willing to pay pennies a day for it to work?

[18:46:34]

Brad-D:

good riddance!

[18:46:52]

iamlindoro:

There's a lot of misconception out there that Myth is a bargain basement option

[18:47:06]

jamesd2:

i guess the whole opensource movement, free as in beer has that effect on mythtv's user base.

[18:47:06]

iamlindoro:

ie, that Myth is for saving money rather than greater features/flexibility

[18:47:19]

Beirdo:

not able would be one thing... but if you can't afford $20/yr, you shouldn't be using a PVR anyways

[18:47:31]

** dustybin is saving up for a proper HTPC system **

[18:47:31]

AndyCap:

Would have been nice to have SD available here too. or some other quality data source. the EPG data aren't very good

[18:47:35]

sphery:

yeah, people's confusing free as in beer for Free is really annoying to me

[18:47:52]

Brad-D:

yeah the other misconception i originally had about mythtv, was that it was appliance-level

[18:47:59]

Beirdo:

AndyCap: where's "here"? I forget

[18:48:08]

Brad-D:

i set one up, and it was so cool.. my parents wanted one, so i set it up for them too.. what a disaster!

[18:48:19]

Beirdo:

Brad-D: ouch

[18:48:20]

Brad-D:

every time anything went wrong i had to drive 60 minutes to fix it for them

[18:48:20]

sphery:

Beirdo: agreed... cost of hardware + electricity + cable/satellite subscription makes the $20/yr negligible.

[18:48:20]

Brad-D:

haha

[18:48:20]

AndyCap:

Beirdo: tiny country in the cold north. :P Norway

[18:48:29]

sphery:

Beirdo: I spend more than $20/mo just powering my myth boxes

[18:48:45]

Beirdo:

Ah yes. :) Congrats on your country's success in the oolympics

[18:48:48]

sphery:

especially when I'm doing MythTV dev and boot up that 4th box

[18:48:56]

Beirdo:

yeah

[18:48:59]

AndyCap:

Beirdo: and yours too. :P

[18:49:03]

Brad-D:

to me, myth is a hobby.. if you are willing to put the time, effort, and money into it.. you will get something exceptional

[18:49:04]

jamesd2:

people dont' get even if you do get most of your beer for free, its okay to buy a round once and a while and tipping the serving wench is always a good thing.

[18:49:09]

Brad-D:

if you aren't willing.. go buy a tivo

[18:49:10]

Beirdo:

if $20/yr is too much, you should be spending it on food, not TV

[18:49:28]

sphery:

Brad-D: exactly--I've told a lot of people who liked my system the same

[18:49:42]

AndyCap:

Brad-D: I heard the curling final was a little boring, but didn't get to see it.

[18:49:45]

Beirdo:

yup. Or a Dish PVR, etc

[18:49:48]

sphery:

and I've only found one person who actually was compatible with the requirements

[18:49:50]

AndyCap:

gah, tab expansion fail

[18:50:13]

Beirdo:

yeah, I didn't get to see any curling at all

[18:50:22]

Beirdo:

stupid PR television

[18:50:53]

Beirdo:

people here don't even know what curling is, barely know what hockey is

[18:51:33]

AndyCap:

Oh, and the public broadcaster chose the olympics to introduce gloriuous 720p broadcasts, in the clear even.

[18:52:48]

Beirdo:

that's cool

[18:53:45]

AndyCap:

Still waiting from them to come out with some API for their net streaming stuff. they promised it a little while ago after taking some heat for a Windows MCE only solution

[18:54:13]

Beirdo:

go throw snowballs at the excutives

[18:54:16]

AndyCap:

But they try. Even make a number of productions available via torrent. :P

[18:54:33]

AndyCap:

Like say a 7 hour train trip across the country.

[18:54:39]

Beirdo:

oh

[18:55:05]

Beirdo:

you must be way in the boonies :)

[18:56:05]

Beirdo:

I'd love to visit the land of many fjords... sometime in the summer

[18:57:18]

AndyCap:

Hehe. yeah, I'd think the summer is best. even though it's been an excellent winter now.

[18:58:15]

Beirdo:

yeah, but you're as far north as Baffin Island, pretty much. I don't think people realize how far north Norway really is

[18:58:59]

AndyCap:

Heh. Not sure how far north Baffin is. but I'm in the south though. 59 degrees.

[18:59:29]

Beirdo:

it's funny when the "south" is nearly at the Arctic Circle

[18:59:34]

AndyCap:

Yeah, Baffin is much closer to the arctic circle. Way too dark there.

[18:59:53]

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[19:00:24]

Beirdo:

south tip of Baffin Island's about even with Lillehammer

[19:00:35]

AndyCap:

which reminds me, a new season of 71 degrees north is about to begin. :P

[19:00:36]

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[19:01:28]

Beirdo:

anyways :)

[19:01:46]

Beirdo:

I'd also like to stay at the Ice Hotel in Sweden some winter

[19:02:09]

AndyCap:

Yeah, that does look cool.

[19:02:46]

Beirdo:

literally :)

[19:04:48]

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[19:19:59]

oobe:

devinheitmueller, i decided to hide the channels that dont work on the dvico board and use the other tuner instead to record them i been googleing a bit but cant find anything related to my issue so this will work for now

[19:20:34]

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[19:22:21]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: it's under the thread with subject line: DViCO FusionHDTV DVB-T Dual Digital 4 (rev 1) tuning regression

[19:22:55]

devinheitmueller:

... which in retrospect I'm now realizing may actually be about the exact same board you have.

[19:24:28]

oobe:

it is the exact same board wow thanks

[19:24:33]

devinheitmueller:

np

[19:24:49]

devinheitmueller:

Not sure it's actually of any help, but at least now you know you're not alone. :-)

[19:24:54]

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[19:25:07]

oobe:

i was looking at another thread but that was to do with the dreaded bulk message fails

[19:25:28]

oobe:

which i worked around but i did find a patch that is supposed to work

[19:25:52]

devinheitmueller:

which USB bridge did that board have?

[19:26:50]

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[19:27:17]

AndyCap:

devinheitmueller: did micronas have a change of heart or is the drx-d a completely different design?

[19:27:55]

devinheitmueller:

AndyCap: There has been no change in Micronas's stance I can speak of. The drx-d code is a much older design, and it turns up the code in question was released a couple of years ago under the GPL but I didn't know about it.

[19:28:26]

AndyCap:

Ah. ok. well, well.

[19:28:28]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: Oh, this is dib0700? You should definitely install the latest v4l-dvb code if you're having issues with USB performance.

[19:28:58]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: I put in a fix a few weeks ago which should significant help those sorts of issues.

[19:29:12]

oobe:

i did but dib0700 is the rev2 board same name

[19:29:22]

devinheitmueller:

AndyCap: OTOH, I'm very happy to see that stuff merged, since the drx-d is used in two very popular products.

[19:29:37]

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[19:29:40]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: Oh, what chip does it have then?

[19:29:51]

oobe:

xc3028

[19:30:07]

devinheitmueller:

oobe: The xc3028 is the tuner chip. I am asking what the bridge chip is.

[19:30:20]

oobe:

sorry i made a mistake dib7000p 16260 1 dvb_usb_cxusb

[19:30:40]

devinheitmueller:

Well the demod is dib0700p. The bridge in this case is cxusb. Ok.

[19:30:45]

oobe:

there is a rev2 board with completly different compenents though

[19:31:09]

devinheitmueller:

Wait, how the hell can it have a 7000p *and* a zl10353?

[19:31:27]

devinheitmueller:

Stop looking at the lsmod output. It is misleading since it loads all the possible drivers associated with dvb-usb.

[19:31:37]

devinheitmueller:

You would need to yank the board and actually look at what it has.

[19:33:04]

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[19:33:18]

AndyCap:

devinheitmueller: hehe, yeah, always good with moar hardware support

[19:33:38]

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[19:48:07]

** kormoc rejoices a bit late about the new found silence in the channel **

[19:48:25]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, catch the backlog?

[19:48:30]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: Aye

[19:48:46]

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[19:48:49]

iamlindoro:

You can lead a horse to water...

[19:48:49]

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[19:49:14]

kormoc:

Indeed

[19:49:31]

justinh:

you can also lead a horse to a glue factory

[19:49:45]

Beirdo:

and hand them the revolver too

[19:50:26]

justinh:

mmm Le Chevalerie :D

[19:50:29]

Beirdo:

ah well

[19:50:35]

iamlindoro:

since kormoc is here, he can probably testify that pretty much the same thing about mchou shopping his complaints around to other ops happened last time he quieted him

[19:50:45]

high-rez:

What was the horse that needed the water?

[19:50:48]

kormoc:

Yup

[19:51:10]

kormoc:

he went to pretty much everyone he hasn't actively provoked into action

[19:51:25]

Beirdo:

even if he HAD a point, he sure didn't know how to go about inspiring others into helping him

[19:52:27]

high-rez:

I clearly don't have a large enough scrollback buffer :(

[19:52:34]

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[19:52:42]

justinh:

high-rez: we have a log

[19:52:55]

oobe:

devinheitmueller, i just tested the first patch from that thread and it works thanks

[19:53:09]

Beirdo:

just for the record: it's quite tough to operate a channel by committee, but I think overall it's worked well here

[19:53:10]

AndyCap:

This? http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1/2010-02-26

[19:53:18]

oobe:

strange how this tuner still got better reception through the other antenna

[19:53:41]

oobe:

maybe i can get channel 31 if i move the pc to the other room

[19:53:51]

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[19:54:13]

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[19:54:17]

Beirdo:

http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1/2010 . . . -03-01:14:30

[19:54:24]

oobe:

thats a community analogue station with poor transmission

[19:54:27]

Beirdo:

I think is the one

[19:54:30]

sphery:

nice... I didn't know about the link-to-times

[19:54:58]

high-rez:

Oh is this the guy that was pissed off about having to pay for schedules direct and somehow wanted to rip the guide data from MCE?

[19:55:02]

Beirdo:

yeah, that's how the search outputs

[19:55:21]

Beirdo:

no, just someone who wanted to argue about it

[19:55:31]

Beirdo:

in spite of being asked to can it

[19:55:46]

sphery:

high-rez: no, he was someone who frequently overstepped the lines for the channel rules

[19:55:48]

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[19:55:48]

Beirdo:

and who had in the past antagonized newbies, etc

[19:55:53]

justinh:

he'd argue the sky was purple if he saw fit. one very annoying bloke

[19:56:06]

sphery:

his arguing for the guy on the list who wants to steal the listings was just the latest

[19:56:44]

sphery:

for him, the actual argument (and his point in the argument) seemed far less important than who he was arguing with

[19:57:06]

Beirdo:

yup

[19:57:45]

justinh:

I often wondered if those really nasty emails I used to get about dropping support for some of my themes were anything to do with him. there's nobody else I've ever come close to crossing online to that extent

[19:58:10]

Beirdo:

yikes

[19:58:18]

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[19:58:27]

justinh:

heh & people called ME a cancerous spot on the face of OSS

[19:58:43]

Beirdo:

at least you put out something useful :)

[19:59:04]

justinh:

and FWIW helped a not inconsiderable amount of people here in my time

[19:59:08]

Beirdo:

you've had yer grouchy days, but who hasn't

[19:59:11]

iamlindoro:

All told, the moderate amount of abuse has been worth ridding the channel of Dagmar and mchou

[19:59:29]

justinh:

Beirdo: LOL. grouchy days.

[19:59:44]

Beirdo:

:)

[19:59:46]

iamlindoro:

people can think whatever they like about me, I still honestly believe we're better off at this point

[19:59:52]

justinh:

grouchy life. mellowing out these days though

[20:01:20]

justinh:

why wouldn't the channel be better off? if situations get so untenable folks have to get their backsides opped, so be it

[20:01:23]

Beirdo:

I look forward to gettin mythtv limping back to life from my old recordings dir... still no tuner action though. Sigh

[20:01:59]

Beirdo:

just for those innocents... not to worry, you behave, you can live here for a LONG time

[20:02:17]

justinh:

in other words, play your cards right & there's no escape

[20:02:49]

justinh:

pity the ML can't be similarly moderated

[20:02:58]

Beirdo:

treat others with a modicum of respect and nobody is likely to object :)

[20:03:07]

Beirdo:

oh jeez

[20:03:08]

Beirdo:

yeah

[20:03:22]

Beirdo:

I guess he COULD get unsubscribed

[20:03:23]

Beirdo:

heh

[20:03:28]

Beirdo:

and even filtered out

[20:03:38]

wagnerrp:

'why am i no longer getting any emails from the list???'

[20:03:40]

Beirdo:

but then he'd likely get a new gmail account and start all over

[20:03:42]

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[20:04:23]

Beirdo:

Is he emailing from his university account?

[20:04:31]

Beirdo:

I didn't really notice

[20:04:55]

justinh:

gmail

[20:05:03]

Beirdo:

dang

[20:05:23]

Beirdo:

if it was his university email, we could likely get him in deep crap with the university

[20:05:48]

wagnerrp:

no, but he all but said who he was

[20:05:54]

Beirdo:

he wants to flaunt AUP and ToS... bye bye university account for doing so with THEIR email

[20:06:03]

wagnerrp:

we got a name, major, and graduation date

[20:06:39]

Beirdo:

Wonder if Google's AUP would warrant a spanking?

[20:07:05]

justinh:

MS might be interested too... heheheh

[20:07:16]

Beirdo:

yeah. No doubt

[20:07:46]

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[20:07:47]

justinh:

be a shame if they had to encrypt their data

[20:07:49]

Beirdo:

but if he's posting from gmail, he could lose his gmail for breaking THEIR AUP (which I can't read from work)

[20:07:51]

justinh:

muhahahahhaa

[20:08:16]

Beirdo:

he thinks he's above ToS... well, yer not.

[20:08:52]

dubstar_04:

and you wonder why no one wants to get involved with mythtv. shame on you all.

[20:09:21]

Beirdo:

muh?

[20:09:36]

Beirdo:

shame on us? I guess you aren't on the mailing list

[20:09:48]

justinh:

dubstar_04: so frowning on people stealing data is bad why?

[20:09:50]

dubstar_04:

no but i wish i was now.

[20:10:47]

Beirdo:

holding people responsible for their reckless disregard for others' intellectual property is bad. OK then

[20:11:18]

justinh:

dubstar_04: ever noticed the *copyright* notices in OSS project stuff hmm?

[20:11:21]

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[20:11:46]

Beirdo:

and BTW... according to ohloh, mythtv is one of the most active and largest OSS projects in existance

[20:12:09]

justinh:

approaching zillion bazillions of lines of code last time I looked

[20:12:09]

Beirdo:

so I don't know how you think "no one wants to get involved" :)

[20:12:44]

Beirdo:

many people aren't able to get involved on that side due to lack of coding skills

[20:12:44]

justinh:

dubstar_04: btw, nice move of the BBC to implement flash authentication for iplayer eh

[20:12:47]

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[20:12:57]

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[20:13:20]

justinh:

basically making using iplayer streams very dodgy anywhere the DMCA applies :-\

[20:14:08]

dubstar_04:

justinh: don't even go there with the bbc, i sent them a rather heated email this week regarding license fees and freedom of choice and what not

[20:15:01]

justinh:

their hands are tied by the people who sell them content. it's no more complicated than that

[20:15:34]

justinh:

from their own point of view.. it even works in a browser on linux boxes, so who cares?

[20:15:49]

Beirdo:

isn't most of the beeb content from the beeb?

[20:15:59]

justinh:

not really

[20:16:05]

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[20:16:07]

Beirdo:

not any more?

[20:16:09]

Beirdo:

awww

[20:16:15]

** AndyCap is thinking Anglia, Thames, LWT **

[20:16:16]

AndyCap:

:P

[20:16:35]

justinh:

the bbc commissions a lot of it, but the majority of output is independently produced

[20:16:46]

Beirdo:

ahh

[20:17:08]

justinh:

rights-wise they prolly own most of that too, but there's quite a bit they buy in

[20:17:18]

dubstar_04:

does virgin pay the beeb for content through their interface?

[20:17:35]

Beirdo:

they are kinda the Walmart of broadcasters?:)

[20:17:47]

justinh:

Beirdo: wouldn't quite go that far

[20:17:53]

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[20:18:06]

Beirdo:

they just wish they were, I bet

[20:18:07]

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[20:18:27]

justinh:

maybe if walmart had their own factories which indy producers rent ;)

[20:18:30]

fukdnsce1d:

is there anyway to compile just one plugin at a time

[20:18:39]

oobe:

did Dagmar and mchou get banned from here?

[20:18:47]

kormoc:

just mchou

[20:18:48]

wagnerrp:

'--disable-all --enable-<whatever>'

[20:18:59]

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[20:19:09]

fukdnsce1d:

wagnerrp thanks

[20:19:10]

wagnerrp:

dagmar got kicked a while back, and just hasnt returned

[20:19:24]

justinh:

wonder whatever happened to directhex

[20:19:25]

oobe:

oh ok

[20:19:30]

wagnerrp:

no, i guess he is banned

[20:19:34]

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[20:19:56]

Beirdo:

don't let the door hit yer butt on the way out.

[20:19:56]

kormoc:

huh

[20:20:06]

Beirdo:

SLAM

[20:20:36]

kormoc:

it's like it's going to be civil in here!

[20:20:37]

kormoc:

amazing

[20:20:39]

Beirdo:

be a shame to have to clean the door

[20:20:47]

iamlindoro:

directhex left in a huff a year or so ago

[20:20:53]

iamlindoro:

it was odd

[20:20:55]

kormoc:

ooh?

[20:20:56]

Beirdo:

let's hope it is, kormoc

[20:21:15]

kormoc:

I don't recall him being that sorta person

[20:21:17]

** kormoc shrugs **

[20:24:03]

oobe:

heh atlest i got an extra tuner out of this for all my troubles

[20:24:10]

AndyCap:

Thu Aug 20 2009, but hasn't said anything since 3rd of feb 2009

[20:24:35]

iamlindoro:

!seen directhex

[20:24:35]

MythLogBot:

directhex was last seen 314 days 11 hours 8 minutes 55 seconds ago

[20:24:46]

iamlindoro:

almost nailed the a year ago thing :)

[20:25:44]

AndyCap:

bot must be b0rked. :P

[20:26:12]

AndyCap:

!seen directhex|bsp

[20:26:12]

MythLogBot:

directhex|bsp was last seen 193 days 12 hours 6 minutes ago

[20:26:17]

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[20:26:39]

Beirdo:

tis not borked

[20:26:42]

Beirdo:

:)

[20:26:45]

AndyCap:

yeah, I noticed.

[20:26:48]

Beirdo:

you gotta get the nick right :)

[20:26:49]

Beirdo:

hehe

[20:26:55]

Beirdo:

!seen SlicerDicer

[20:26:55]

MythLogBot:

SlicerDicer was last seen 82 days 15 hours 12 minutes 13 seconds ago

[20:27:05]

Beirdo:

that's fairly recent

[20:27:25]

Beirdo:

different person though

[20:27:52]

Beirdo:

!seen Brains

[20:27:52]

MythLogBot:

Brains was last seen 1092 days 15 hours 43 minutes 36 seconds ago

[20:27:56]

Beirdo:

heheh

[20:27:59]

Beirdo:

dangit

[20:28:04]

iamlindoro:

Mmm... brains... mmmm

[20:28:04]

wagnerrp:

!seen booger

[20:28:04]

MythLogBot:

booger has not been seen here

[20:28:10]

Beirdo:

!seen civility

[20:28:10]

MythLogBot:

civility has not been seen here

[20:28:14]

Beirdo:

there we go

[20:28:30]

AndyCap:

!seen Rick_Astley

[20:28:30]

MythLogBot:

Rick_Astley has not been seen here

[20:28:42]

dubstar_04:

anyone got any goo ideas for plugins?

[20:28:42]

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[20:28:51]

AndyCap:

Kai's PowerGoo!

[20:28:52]

dubstar_04:

*good

[20:30:07]

dan4dm:

dubstar_04: how about a plugin that fires off a strongly-worded letter to the bbc?

[20:30:31]

wagnerrp:

dubstar_04: you can always check the feature wishlist on the wiki

[20:30:45]

wagnerrp:

no one is saying there are any good ideas on there

[20:30:55]

dubstar_04:

dan4dm: what like every half a second or so?

[20:30:56]

wagnerrp:

but it might spur something else

[20:30:59]

Beirdo:

dan4dm: it should do that every time you start up your computer

[20:31:02]

Beirdo:

minimum

[20:31:03]

dan4dm:

dubstar_04

[20:31:37]

dan4dm:

yep

[20:32:22]

justinh:

are there ever any good ideas on the wishlists? :-O

[20:32:29]

AndyCap:

Running on Casio fx7000G? ooh. I guess that's in this category http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/p . . . n-stick.html

[20:33:14]

wagnerrp:

my god... why are they still running the bachelor

[20:33:14]

justinh:

I want mythtv to walk my dog!

[20:33:35]

Beirdo:

heh

[20:33:37]

justinh:

wagnerrp: because some people are too fat & are incapable of reaching for their remote :P

[20:33:37]

wagnerrp:

justinh: you need some robo-trousers for that

[20:33:39]

fukdnsce1d:

I want it to cook me dinner and clean my house!

[20:34:15]

Beirdo:

justinh: or the remote is wedged so far up their butt?

[20:34:23]

justinh:

not using livetv means if I fall asleep watching something I don't have the trauma of waking up during some Katie Price show or other

[20:34:41]

Beirdo:

I get the same thought every time I stumble across (Country) Idol

[20:35:07]

Beirdo:

or Survivor for that matter these days

[20:35:09]

dubstar_04:

why are internet streaming services such a disappointment? iplayer, seesaw, itv, 4od, joost .....

[20:35:12]

Beirdo:

bleh

[20:35:20]

justinh:

dubstar_04: because them use flashies?

[20:35:38]

justinh:

and flashies no play viddies proper on some boxen

[20:35:53]

Beirdo:

s/some/most/

[20:36:00]

justinh:

and internet streamings are erm.. sub-broadcast quality :)

[20:36:13]

justinh:

i.e. they ain't the great big panacea people paint them as

[20:36:20]

Beirdo:

they're not Scottish

[20:36:37]

Beirdo:

and if they're not Scottish... they're crrrrap!

[20:36:41]

AndyCap:

Ourrr Slogan is

[20:36:41]

justinh:

give us all 100Mbit internet with no contention.. THEN.. maybe then...

[20:36:49]

dubstar_04:

i am willing tp trade quality for convenience!!

[20:36:59]

justinh:

sigh

[20:37:04]

justinh:

just another sheep, then IMHO

[20:37:06]

AndyCap:

justinh: or a multicast enabled internet. haha

[20:37:19]

justinh:

quality went down the toilet when we kissed analogue goodbye

[20:37:51]

justinh:

I for one embrace our new macroblocky overlords. Not

[20:37:55]

sphery:

Beirdo: heh, Willie

[20:39:04]

justinh:

as much as people want IPTV to be the next great thing to replace traditional TeeVees.. it ain't. Not for a *long* while yet. Thank $deity

[20:39:42]

justinh:

cos when it does, it'll be so crippled with DRM & other restrictions we'll rue the day we ever hoped it'd happen

[20:40:20]

Beirdo:

yeah, I want analog back :)

[20:40:26]

Beirdo:

and digital

[20:40:36]

justinh:

unless of course we're one of Murdoch's loyal subscribers. See that yellow thing in the sky shining down so bright? That comes from Robert's posterior!

[20:40:51]

justinh:

</cynical git>

[20:41:03]

Beirdo:

actually, why not just give me a network connection to the braodcast servers and let me grab the .mpg file directly

[20:41:30]

justinh:

because then you could, like er.. play it however you like

[20:41:38]

justinh:

and that's just not on!

[20:41:40]

Beirdo:

OMG, no!

[20:41:57]

AndyCap:

or you'd upload it on the internets

[20:41:58]

iamlindoro:

Heck, broadcasters could make a killing by making broadcast shows available for-pay when production is done on them

[20:42:06]

Beirdo:

yeah

[20:42:10]

iamlindoro:

ie, watch it for free when it airs, or download it a month early and pay $5 an episode

[20:42:17]

iamlindoro:

or whatever

[20:42:20]

Beirdo:

I think I'd rather pay the broadcaster than cable

[20:42:24]

iamlindoro:

not saying it would be nice to pay $5 :)

[20:42:26]

justinh:

not sure I'd pay that much, but I agree

[20:42:37]

Beirdo:

cut out the middle man and let me download shows directly

[20:42:41]

justinh:

I'm dying to see the new season of Chuck.. and 24

[20:42:59]

Beirdo:

but I'm sure that will never happen without massively crippling DRM

[20:43:05]

justinh:

prolly have to rent 24 on DVD when it's out

[20:43:30]

justinh:

I really like our cable on demand stuff right now

[20:43:47]

justinh:

but it's not too far a stretch for them to insert ads & make it impossible to skip them

[20:43:59]

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[20:44:19]

AndyCap:

the dvd vendors are there already. :(

[20:44:42]

justinh:

not if you've got a decent DVD player they ain't :)

[20:45:02]

justinh:

one way a manufacturer ignoring the spec is actually a good thing.. hahaha

[20:45:21]

justinh:

it'll happen to bluray eventually too I expect

[20:45:24]

AndyCap:

The TOS? :>

[20:45:32]

AndyCap:

*cough*

[20:45:33]

Beirdo:

shhh, they might have to recall it to make the movie industry happy

[20:45:57]

justinh:

AndyCap: AFAIK even some multiregion 'proper' players aren't to spec

[20:45:59]

** AndyCap has a blu-ray here with annoying trailers in front of it **

[20:46:18]

AndyCap:

not outright unrelated ads yet though

[20:46:18]

justinh:

made by big names part of the DVD alliance too

[20:46:26]

Beirdo:

last I heard, it was illegal in NZ for DVD players to NOT be multi-region :)

[20:46:33]

AndyCap:

justinh: still wink wink, nudge nudge though

[20:46:51]

justinh:

oi, no pointing at the elephant in the room

[20:47:01]

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[20:48:46]

AndyCap:

If only sony had made the PS3 region-free

[20:48:58]

** Beirdo feeds the elephant some peanuts in hopes that he takes a dump on something interesting. **

[20:49:04]

justinh:

if only sony were more like canonical

[20:49:07]

justinh:

lol

[20:49:22]

Beirdo:

if only Canonical were more like RedHat

[20:49:23]

Beirdo:

:)

[20:49:48]

justinh:

I don't blame any company for inventing new ways to screw users

[20:49:56]

justinh:

I probably would too

[20:50:08]

Beirdo:

I do. Mainly when it's Microsoft

[20:50:41]

justinh:

in some ways it's good there isn't a massive list of OSes though

[20:50:53]

AndyCap:

justinh: probably would, aren't you working in a company that can invent new ways?

[20:50:56]

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[20:50:57]

Beirdo:

I dunno ;)

[20:51:04]

justinh:

I still remember what it was like in the 1980s

[20:51:14]

Beirdo:

you need to drink more

[20:51:17]

justinh:

heheh

[20:51:19]

** Beirdo hands justinh a pint **

[20:51:49]

justinh:

ok fine.. give the world zillions of OS to choose from, but everybody has to agree on standard file formats... whoops

[20:51:52]

AndyCap:

I hear oracle has it down to an art.

[20:52:19]

Beirdo:

you can use whatever OS you want... as long as it's Solaris

[20:52:49]

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[20:53:04]

justinh:

oh no. another 'dispatches' about muslim/islamic/blah issues. always trying to stir up the fear

[20:53:36]

Beirdo:

insert your boss' name into the dispatch and copy it on

[20:53:41]

Dibblah:

justinh: You have to have an enemy, otherwise people start getting antsy.

[20:54:02]

justinh:

we do. it's called the government :-)

[20:54:08]

Beirdo:

hehe

[20:54:14]

Beirdo:

you SURE you aren't American?

[20:54:39]

justinh:

yeah, but I'm not sure our govt. ain't

[20:54:46]

justinh:

;)

[20:54:47]

Beirdo:

hehe

[20:55:03]

justinh:

actually I take that back.. they're mostly Scottish

[20:55:08]

Beirdo:

yeah. You need the War of Dependence...

[20:55:28]

AndyCap:

Rule Britannia!

[20:55:52]

** Beirdo avoids the obvious sheep joke **

[20:56:19]

justinh:

next election we basically have a choice between scottish MPs who vote for UK taxpayers to pay for Scots to have nice social perks we don't get.. and blue blood public school nancies

[20:56:19]

Beirdo:

Mmm, scotch.

[20:56:28]

Beirdo:

wish I could get some single malt here

[20:56:47]

Beirdo:

justinh: move to Glasgow then

[20:56:57]

Beirdo:

why fight it?

[20:58:22]

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[20:58:56]

Beirdo:

if the Scots are getting extra privileges, become a Scot :)

[20:59:10]

Beirdo:

just leave the kilt out of the picture... thanks

[21:00:05]

jduggan:

justinh: nick griffin

[21:00:18]

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[21:05:07]

sphery:

gnome42: if you're bored and feel like reading a bit on -users, someone at http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/424556#424556 is working on some changes to MythTV virtual tuner handling and multirec and LiveTV and could probably use your input on a) figuring out what MythTV should support today and b) figuring out whether they're going down the right path with their patch. (They're developing it on 0.21-fixes and ...

[21:05:13]

sphery:

... plan to forward-port to 0.22-fixes, and I think they're redeveloping some functionality that 0.22-fixes already has.)

[21:06:15]

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[21:06:32]

jolaren:

Gah, I had to upgrade a few packets on my srv and I lost the patch a Swede helped me with here to view SVT HD

[21:06:38]

jolaren:

Does anyoen know how-to?

[21:07:22]

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[21:08:46]

Beirdo:

do you remember who helped?

[21:09:10]

jolaren:

Not one of the regular guys, he had [something]

[21:09:15]

jolaren:

He was a Swede

[21:09:28]

Beirdo:

the only [] I can think of is [R]

[21:09:37]

Beirdo:

but I dunno if he's a Swede or not :)

[21:10:26]

Beirdo:

once you find the person, ya might wanna put the patch somewhere...

[21:10:30]

Beirdo:

:)

[21:10:55]

jolaren:

THat wasn't him :P the name was longer

[21:11:09]

Beirdo:

there's a [Peter] in the channel now...

[21:11:22]

Beirdo:

do you remember when he was on?

[21:11:32]

jolaren:

oh yeah

[21:11:38]

jolaren:

that's him

[21:11:41]

jolaren:

[Peter],

[21:11:58]

Beirdo:

K. He's here in the channel, might be away though

[21:12:09]

jolaren:

Yer, he's away

[21:12:11]

jolaren:

I pmed him anyway

[21:12:13]

jolaren:

thanks Beirdo

[21:12:19]

Beirdo:

no problem

[21:17:53]

Beirdo:

omg.

[21:18:25]

Beirdo:

my mysql that handles this bot... 3.3B update requests!

[21:18:30]

Beirdo:

40M inserts

[21:18:36]

Beirdo:

that seems so wrong

[21:19:07]

Beirdo:

and 3.6B key reads

[21:19:34]

wagnerrp:

the bot stores in a database? not just some flat file?

[21:19:48]

Beirdo:

I gotta be reading it wrong :)

[21:19:49]

Beirdo:

yes

[21:19:51]

Beirdo:

mysql

[21:20:00]

Beirdo:

by design... and clucene for searching

[21:20:09]

Beirdo:

although I need to perfect that a bit

[21:20:10]

Beirdo:

hehe

[21:21:53]

Beirdo:

I think I'm reading the wrong numbers

[21:21:55]

Beirdo:

whew

[21:22:20]

Beirdo:

although... received 736MB traffic, sent 2.7GB. In 73 days

[21:22:53]

Beirdo:

stats are fun

[21:23:02]

wagnerrp:

well... four months and ive got 18MB of logs, probably an average of 80 characters per line

[21:23:07]

wagnerrp:

since it has a timestamp and a name

[21:23:14]

Beirdo:

I should graph the querys/s, etc.

[21:23:19]

Beirdo:

hehe

[21:23:36]

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[21:23:44]

Beirdo:

irclog: 3,881,546 records for 558.9MB

[21:23:56]

wagnerrp:

215k lines of chat since last november

[21:24:20]

wagnerrp:

40M seems about an order of magnitude too high

[21:24:30]

Beirdo:

plus the clucene which is roughly 300MB

[21:24:56]

Beirdo:

got a lot of data :)

[21:26:07]

Beirdo:

gotta keep google search fed with our blather :)

[21:26:19]

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[21:26:20]

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[21:26:41]

Beirdo:

nickhistory: 680,952 records for 32.4MB

[21:26:51]

Beirdo:

that tracks people coming and going

[21:26:55]

Beirdo:

so !seen works

[21:27:21]

Beirdo:

and so the log pages can show who was in channel

[21:27:24]

gnome42:

sphery: hehe, that topic has been beaten to death, much mis-information. Too silly :)

[21:28:52]

justinh:

ruh? wonder how many FlashForwards I've not seen. Note I'm not saying 'missed'

[21:28:55]

sphery:

gnome42: yeah, I didn't know for sure what the LiveTV options do, but I thought there was one that allowed MythTV to change capture cards if the channel you wanted wasn't available on the current mux

[21:29:32]

sphery:

gnome42: but, it sounds like it will eventually be a ticket, so feel free to push them in the direction you want now or wait until later :)

[21:30:23]

gnome42:

I'm not going for another round of that discussion, but I think the info is out there for people.

[21:30:30]

sphery:

OK.

[21:30:31]

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[21:31:12]

justinh:

hmm ten shown, ten in oldrecorded. so I must've seen all 10. Meh

[21:32:05]

Beirdo:

10 in deleted

[21:32:46]

sphery:

has that been cancelled, yet?

[21:34:36]

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[21:35:26]

justinh:

it's coming back

[21:35:40]

justinh:

18th march

[21:35:46]

sphery:

strange... I didn't realize they ever did that for new non-reality series.

[21:36:03]

sphery:

seems any I watch get cancelled

[21:37:14]

justinh:

I remember the last one was unutterably, annoyingly awful though

[21:38:32]

wagnerrp:

i just never grew to like _any_ of the characters

[21:45:11]

justinh:

oh I dunno, I quite liked the semi-psychotic scientist bloke

[21:49:02]

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[21:50:17]

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[21:57:09]

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[21:57:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I have something of conceptual question

[21:58:33]

kormoc:

my answer will require some assembly

[21:58:44]

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[21:59:01]

kormoc:

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ

[21:59:12]

kormoc:

Some components might be used more the once or not at all

[21:59:40]

** Beirdo chuckles **

[21:59:53]

Beirdo:

GadgetWisdomGuru: go ahead and ask said conceptual question

[22:00:10]

Beirdo:

you may get a conceptual answer, but unless you ask, you'll never know

[22:01:21]

** justinh wonders if 'V' will ever make it to the UK **

[22:01:36]

kormoc:

justinh: isn't it a UK show?

[22:01:37]

Beirdo:

you only have 25 letters?

[22:02:32]

wagnerrp:

justinh: ill admit i appreciate the character who will state technological advancement is worth sacrificing lives over

[22:02:42]

wagnerrp:

but i wont claim to actually like that character

[22:03:34]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I want to run Skype on a MythTV frontend, but MythTV disabling Pulseaudio creates something of a problem for me. I'm trying to figure out a good design to run the two

[22:03:44]

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[22:03:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The fact I turn the frontend off when not in use is also a problem.

[22:04:01]

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[22:04:16]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

And for some reason, the Skype beta is now not working without Pulseaudio. Go figure. The thing is a tremendous pain in the neck

[22:04:29]

Beirdo:

heh

[22:04:38]

Beirdo:

I would just dump Skype and use SIP

[22:04:49]

Beirdo:

but that's just me :)

[22:05:01]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Didn't we abandon the SIP plugin for MythTV?

[22:05:17]

justinh:

IIRC you had nothing to do with the decision ;-)

[22:05:17]

wagnerrp:

yes

[22:05:24]

Beirdo:

they've actually made a Skype extension for Asterisk.

[22:05:25]

Captain_Murdoch:

EXEC xtensoftphone

[22:05:34]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: yeah, but its not cheap

[22:05:39]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Yes.

[22:05:42]

Beirdo:

so you can do both :)

[22:05:47]

Beirdo:

nothing's cheap, alas

[22:05:50]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But the reason I'm using Skype is because of why I started using it.

[22:06:12]

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[22:06:18]

wagnerrp:

dont use the skype beta?

[22:06:24]

justinh:

well, time to go out & kill pulseaudio

[22:06:26]

justinh:

somebody should

[22:06:47]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Justinh, I find it a tremendous pain in the neck, as I said, but every major distribution uses it

[22:07:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Until someone at Fedora, Ubuntu, et al kills it, it is still a standard.

[22:07:05]

Beirdo:

use a minor distribution? ;)

[22:07:10]

justinh:

myth can be made to work with PA, but YMMV

[22:07:11]

Beirdo:

I dunno

[22:07:18]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I don't need MythTV to work with it.

[22:07:19]

kormoc:

I like point distributions

[22:07:23]

justinh:

don't shoot me if the audio playback is laggy

[22:07:30]

kormoc:

GadgetWisdomGuru: so what are you after?

[22:07:50]

wagnerrp:

he wants myth to keep pulseaudio open whenever it is not actively using the audio outputs

[22:07:53]

sphery:

justinh: s/made to work with PA/made to run in spite of PA being enabled/

[22:07:55]

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[22:07:56]

Beirdo:

I personally would rather use skype on my iPhone, and over wireless until they update it to use 3G finally

[22:08:17]

wagnerrp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: your only options will be to close the frontend, or get a version of skype that works without pulse

[22:08:42]

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[22:08:42]

justinh:

or hack mythfrontend to only kill pulseaudio for actual audio playback

[22:08:43]

Beirdo:

or use two different computers?

[22:08:49]

sphery:

and skype works fine without pulse if you just--don't run the Pulse server/don't use alsa-pulse

[22:09:01]

wagnerrp:

justinh: *gasp* do actual programming?

[22:09:03]

sphery:

s/works fine/works as well as Skype ever works/

[22:09:08]

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[22:09:23]

sphery:

Skype must die

[22:09:30]

Beirdo:

oh wow, look at the time

[22:09:35]

sphery:

unfortunately, now Verizon seems to be latching on to it

[22:09:38]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Sphery, more complicated issue

[22:09:42]

** Beirdo turns into a pumpkin. Seeya on the other side **

[22:09:48]

** kormoc waves **

[22:09:58]

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[22:10:01]

justinh:

I used Skpe a while ago. sadly my parents got onto it & went crazy ringing me at all kinds of annoying times. it had to go

[22:10:06]

kormoc:

GadgetWisdomGuru: so explain?

[22:10:12]

wagnerrp:

i can understand wanting to interface your phone system with skype

[22:10:28]

wagnerrp:

but i cant imagine why a phone carrier would ever want to use skype

[22:10:50]

wagnerrp:

they provide nothing but a user base

[22:10:52]

justinh:

wagnerrp: prolly some deal where you'd pay skype, only they'll pay skype for you & charge you more

[22:11:18]

sphery:

justinh: I didn't start my parents using it until after they got unlimited cell phone minutes to me--after which it's not actually easier than calling with a real phone

[22:11:34]

wagnerrp:

i thought skype was free unless you wanted to access the POTS system

[22:11:50]

justinh:

it is

[22:12:00]

wagnerrp:

so why would anyone have to pay them

[22:12:12]

justinh:

oh I dunno

[22:12:26]

justinh:

who'd even wanna be tied to using a computer to make a frickin phone call anyway

[22:12:29]

sphery:

wagnerrp: it's called evolution, you neanderthal: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20100223- . . . dlinesEurope

[22:12:29]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Kormoc, I meant whether Skype should die or not.

[22:12:55]

sphery:

I apologize to all the neanderthals for my recent comment. It was wrong of me to say that.

[22:13:10]

** kormoc storms off to his cave **

[22:13:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The truth is, I dislike the design of Skype, but the relatives who have discovered the wonder of video nagging me are using it.

[22:13:22]

sphery:

wagnerrp: gotta love how they say, "The deal struck by Verizon Wireless with the Web-calling service Skype last week reflects an evolution in the mobile-phone business toward the openness that already exists on the Internet."

[22:13:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

So, I want to figure out a design to make it play nice with Myth

[22:13:30]

justinh:

good excuse to stop using it if you ask me :)

[22:13:32]

sphery:

Open? Right. That ain't Skype.

[22:13:33]

kormoc:

GadgetWisdomGuru: sounds like you have a technical reason why you can't!

[22:13:49]

** wagnerrp cant see the article **

[22:13:53]

wagnerrp:

its blank

[22:14:17]

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[22:15:10]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I thought about hooking it into my headless backend. But that creates a control issue.

[22:15:20]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Anyway, I thought someone might have an idea that eluded me.

[22:15:23]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: evolve some eyes?

[22:15:25]

justinh:

freenx :)

[22:15:44]

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[22:16:09]

sphery:

wagnerrp: yeah, I just read the teaser

[22:16:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But, most of you agree with me that Skype is a pain and probably there isn't any good solution.

[22:16:35]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I wish MythTV had some sort of alert system. I know there were proposals for revamping that aspect of it

[22:16:36]

** J-e-f-f-A <3 freenx... ;-) **

[22:16:43]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm not sure whatever came of it.

[22:16:50]

kormoc:

mythosd?

[22:17:00]

kormoc:

the one that pops up a notice on the screen?

[22:17:01]

wagnerrp:

set up an asterisk box, and have anyone you want to call hook into it

[22:17:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Yes. I remember reading discussions of extending it into the non-playback modes

[22:17:20]

wagnerrp:

or set up a trunk to some SIP provider

[22:17:32]

kormoc:

GadgetWisdomGuru: patches welcome!

[22:17:34]

wagnerrp:

or peer into other friends' asterisk boxen

[22:18:05]

** J-e-f-f-A recommends staying away from the SIP provider his company currently uses — Broadvox... eewwww... **

[22:20:19]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Kormoc, agreed. But someone was discussing it. I was wondering if there could have been a reason why the plan never came to fruition that would effect me, an admittedly novice programmer, trying to figure out how to do it.

[22:21:14]

kormoc:

I believe the thread ended with 'Patches welcome' and never heard from him again

[22:21:56]

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[22:22:03]

wagnerrp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: the migration to the new UI has just not been completed yet

[22:22:13]

wagnerrp:

there are a number of planned 'widgets' that have not yet been written

[22:22:43]

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[22:25:49]

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[22:26:26]

AndyCap:

the last skype + cell phone carrier thing I read about was pretty slimy.. You dial their cell > skype gateway and pay cell charges and any skype charges. :) everybody wins, except you

[22:26:31]

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[22:27:12]

AndyCap:

ah. iSkoot was the name

[22:28:26]

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[22:30:35]

highzeth:

I SIP, skype I retired long ago, I have little to no desire to show my sleepy face to anyone.

[22:31:25]

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[22:31:26]

wagnerrp:

not to mention you can pump video over SIP anyway

[22:32:24]

highzeth:

sure

[22:34:00]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wagnerrp, that was what I was thinking...that anything I might try should wait until that.

[22:34:12]

highzeth:

hmm what was their audio codec again? SILK?

[22:34:30]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wagnerrp, I'm not assuming my elderly relatives can figure out anything complicated.

[22:34:41]

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[22:35:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

They bought a new computer because I couldn't talk them through removing Malware from their Windows based computer from 2000 miles away

[22:35:16]

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[22:35:19]

wagnerrp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: they dont have to SIP and IAX softphones are available

[22:35:26]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

They want video

[22:35:28]

AndyCap:

and hardphones.

[22:35:32]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Anyway, this is off topic

[22:35:34]

highzeth:

I sent my closest family ATA's that was pre-conf'd to connect to my pbx, win-win for all

[22:36:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Highzeth, that is a good idea. The mailing them the ATAs

[22:37:14]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Still, video is a problem. But as I said, my question was on how to make something play nice with MythTV. Anything else I may take to another forum

[22:37:17]

highzeth:

yeah, cheap way to get everyone up & running

[22:37:41]

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[22:37:41]

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[22:38:18]

AndyCap:

GadgetWisdomGuru: something like http://www.grandstream.com/products/gxv_serie . . . gxv3005.html but yeah I guess #asterisk is better suited for it. :P

[22:38:20]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

And I may wait until more MythUI stuff is finalized in version 0.23–0.24 to see. Because I'd really like to be able to send text or even audio alerts from other pieces of software to the screen while I'm watching or not watching video.

[22:38:23]

wagnerrp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: as mentioned a while back, just use the older release program for skype, if the beta version requires Pulse

[22:38:41]

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[22:39:19]

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[22:39:49]

mzb:

GadgetWisdomGuru: audio alerts are dead easy, text alerts can be done with mythosd or xosd

[22:40:12]

mzb:

that might be mythtvosd

[22:40:35]

kormoc:

mythosd only works in a PBB (playback box)

[22:41:15]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Kormoc, exactly.

[22:41:35]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'd script a bunch of different integrations. I just need a pipe.

[22:42:13]

mzb:

hasn't mythosd been brought up to mythui yet? I seem to remember that was on the cards.

[22:42:16]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I do very little C programming. But I can certainly script some useful things

[22:42:40]

mzb:

I've found audio alerts to be easiest

[22:42:44]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Mzb, that was one thing I was curious about. Reading the dev and user mailing lists, I haven't seen anything about it in a while.

[22:43:04]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Mzb, how do you do an audio alert during playback? Myth takes over the whole sound system.

[22:43:23]

mzb:

eg: I have doors wired up so that (insert a few computers in the middle) the loungetv (can) announce the event

[22:43:41]

mzb:

I also have a "drip" sound when the rain-tipper triggers

[22:43:55]

mzb:

let me just check how I did it ... something to do with alsa

[22:46:44]

high-rez:

So, if I start doing optical/coax out – will myth be able to pass all of the different formats? E.g. pcm, dolby digital, DTS-HD, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD Master Audio ?

[22:47:00]

mzb:

it was something like this: .asoundrc http://openpaste.org/en/19646/

[22:47:16]

sphery:

heh, http://www.tv.com/losts-12-most-terrible-pare . . . ag=spfeats;2 "Lost's 12 Most Terrible Parents

[22:47:20]

mzb:

and then to use it: aplay -q -D announce

[22:47:23]

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[22:48:13]

mzb:

I basically had it setup so the output from my tts script was piped into aplay

[22:49:09]

mzb:

however (to cut a really long story short)

[22:49:49]

mzb:

it turns out that the route_policy was unnecessary

[22:50:30]

mzb:

and I've removed it ... iirc everything still works although I've not been testing it lately as I've been working on my BBQ

[22:50:54]

mzb:

(which is also going to be giving me popups/text and audio alerts!;))

[22:51:57]

mzb:

ie: this http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/Smoker/ . . . ual_mode.jpg

[22:52:13]

mzb:

is going to be controlled with: http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/Smoker/ . . . to_mount.jpg

[22:52:40]

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[22:53:14]

mzb:

and send RF updates (snmp, etc) to this: http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/mythtv/ . . . loungetv.jpg

[22:53:36]

mzb:

make sense?

[22:54:05]

mzb:

ah well, bored you all to sleep I guess

[22:54:20]

high-rez:

You sure did

[22:54:25]

high-rez:

I have no idea what I'm looking at.

[22:54:26]

mzb:

:)

[22:54:36]

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[22:54:46]

high-rez:

Those are big speaker boxes though.

[22:54:58]

high-rez:

I'm getting ready to 'upgrade' my sound system soon.

[22:55:06]

mzb:

a BBQ with a microcontroller-controlled servo which controls the air intake

[22:55:23]

high-rez:

Spending way too much time researching the right speaker/amp combo in my price range.

[22:55:31]

high-rez:

mzb: Nice. Cold or hot smoke?

[22:55:40]

mzb:

either

[22:55:51]

mzb:

currently doing 110C/230F

[22:55:51]

high-rez:

I did a lot of cold smoking this winter.

[22:56:05]

mzb:

yeah, bought those boxes for au$80 about 25 years ago ... have replaced every driver about 3 times, and rebuilt the boxes twice

[22:56:10]

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[22:56:36]

mzb:

2 days ago: http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/Smoker/ . . . 03_2.5hr.jpg

[22:56:45]

mzb:

~3.5 hours total

[22:56:58]

mzb:

(feeding 10)

[22:57:19]

high-rez:

I'm going between building my boxes myself (e.g. the sealed tritrix method), or going with a HTIB (the 9100thx for $900) or going with behringer 2031P's and a nice receiver (which seems like the best option).

[22:57:30]

high-rez:

What theme is that?

[22:57:41]

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[22:57:45]

mzb:

err ... blue-abstract I think

[22:58:01]

high-rez:

Nice. My ribs are almost black when they're done.

[22:58:04]

mzb:

iirc I modified the recordings page for fanart

[22:58:15]

mzb:

is that a good thing? :)

[22:58:16]

high-rez:

we cold smoke, and then the wife frys them up. Sounds weird, I know – but they're absolutely awesome.

[22:58:29]

high-rez:

the theme looks nice

[22:58:32]

mzb:

ah, I see

[22:58:51]

mzb:

yeah, ${SHE} likes it :)

[22:59:15]

high-rez:

${SHE} is a macro for your wife?

[22:59:28]

mzb:

yep :)

[22:59:30]

mzb:

makes visitors sit back with wide eyes, too ;)

[23:00:00]

mzb:

except for the smart-alecs who say the screen isn't big enough ;)

[23:00:14]

high-rez:

Hmm, that themse isn't included in svn is it?

[23:00:21]

mzb:

not afaik

[23:00:36]

mzb:

they do get a bit confused with the wii-remote and ps3-remote though ;)

[23:00:42]

** kormoc wonders what $(SHE) expands to **

[23:00:55]

** high-rez will hold his joke **

[23:01:01]

mzb:

:)

[23:01:19]

mzb:

yep, blue-abstract-wide

[23:01:22]

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[23:04:53]

mzb:

looks like I should get around to updating it

[23:04:53]

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[23:05:08]

mzb:

nm, time to shovel gravel. bbl

[23:05:41]

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[23:20:30]

Beirdo:

bleh

[23:20:31]

Beirdo:

OK

[23:20:42]

Beirdo:

time to work on re-deploying myth :)

[23:20:43]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Why the bleh?

[23:20:48]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Oh

[23:20:49]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Good luck

[23:21:45]

Beirdo:

/dev/mapper/optData_barrel-video 400G 380G 21G 95% /media/video

[23:21:48]

Beirdo:

yay

[23:21:50]

Beirdo:

:)

[23:22:16]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Only having 21G available is good?

[23:22:27]

Beirdo:

newest recording: 20070819210000

[23:22:40]

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[23:22:43]

wagnerrp:

hehe... my oldest is from about then

[23:22:57]

wagnerrp:

oldest recording anyway

[23:23:05]

wagnerrp:

ive got decade-old DVD rips

[23:23:20]

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[23:24:10]

Beirdo:

hey, that one's HD

[23:24:12]

Beirdo:

?!

[23:24:35]

Beirdo:

I think it might be one I managed to pull down with the air2pc back when it was alive

[23:24:35]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Why haven't you recorded anything in 3 years?

[23:24:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I know you said your system was broken, but for that long?

[23:24:54]

Beirdo:

our cable provider wouldn't give us a second cable box

[23:25:06]

Beirdo:

because they are retards

[23:25:17]

Beirdo:

and thought we wanted to give it to our neighbors

[23:25:37]

Beirdo:

Hmm, maybe we just have 2 TVs, idiots

[23:25:50]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Odd

[23:25:54]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

They lock those thingsin

[23:25:59]

Beirdo:

yep

[23:26:03]

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[23:27:20]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

What cable company is this?

[23:27:32]

Beirdo:

Liberty Cablevision

[23:28:22]

Beirdo:

they are stoooopid

[23:28:27]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

PR?

[23:28:27]

Beirdo:

anyways...

[23:28:31]

Beirdo:

yes

[23:28:43]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I should pat myself on the back for guessing that

[23:28:50]

Beirdo:

heh

[23:28:57]

Beirdo:

not much liberty to be had

[23:29:00]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm in Time Warner territory. Very difficult people.

[23:29:05]

Beirdo:

they suck as an ISP too

[23:29:11]

Wicked:

is there any websites around that keep track of what ota channels are avalible in certain areas? i found one called antenaweb.org i think...but i put in my area and it only had 1 single channel....and recomended some antenas...but im not looking into doing antenas...im just looking to do clearqam...ie just plug the cable in to the card

[23:29:25]

Beirdo:

umm

[23:29:30]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wicked, try tvfool. Better rep than antennaweb

[23:29:30]

Beirdo:

OTA is all about antennas

[23:29:49]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Also, SiliconDust maintains a database of what its users find on scans

[23:29:50]

Beirdo:

if you are plugging in a CABLE it's not OTA, it's cable TV

[23:29:51]

Wicked:

Beirdo, maby i using the wrong terminology...what am i talking about?....

[23:29:54]

kormoc:

Wicked: OTA is "Over The Air"

[23:30:15]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But, I'll agree with Beirdo, if you are doing QAM, it isn't OTA

[23:30:17]

kormoc:

Wicked: but as GadgetWisdomGuru said, try silicon duct's website (and products)

[23:30:18]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

You want ClearQAM

[23:30:23]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Try Silicondust's channel lineup

[23:30:26]

Wicked:

hmm ok. well i know ota is over the air..but i thought that free qam channels where refered to as ota channels

[23:30:28]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

If someone has one in your zip code..

[23:30:30]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

No.

[23:30:34]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

OTA is Over the Air

[23:30:40]

Wicked:

ok. my bad

[23:30:46]

Beirdo:

they are different :)

[23:30:47]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Often the only thing that cable companies don't encrypt are broadcast channels

[23:30:49]

Beirdo:

not a problem

[23:30:51]

Wicked:

yea

[23:30:54]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Broadcast channels are often only available OTA

[23:31:02]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That's probably where the confusion set in

[23:31:02]

Beirdo:

and often the music only channels

[23:31:08]

Beirdo:

i.e. no video

[23:31:29]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

For 2 months, the local headend left HBO2 open

[23:31:31]

Wicked:

i currently have a pvr-150 that im capturing from my cable box via svideo...been thinking about getting a better card..thinking about the hvr2250..i think thats the card

[23:31:32]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That was a fun month

[23:31:41]

Beirdo:

some providers stream them unencrypted, and some even if you don't have a subscription (if they are dumb enough)

[23:31:50]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I used to do the PVR-150, I switched to the Silicondust and HDPVR

[23:32:16]

Wicked:

i dont have a hdtv yet...so i dont want to go full hdpvr

[23:32:31]

Wicked:

though...its somethign i may want to invest in...so when im ready...it will be ready

[23:32:41]

kormoc:

invest in?

[23:32:42]

Wicked:

but i do hear that mythtv and hdpvr is still pretty unstable

[23:32:49]

Wicked:

yea. im poor lol

[23:32:50]

kormoc:

Wicked: works great here

[23:32:55]

devinheitmueller:

Wicked: the HVR-2250 does not have analog support in the driver. Do not buy that card if you plan to hook it to the s-video output of your cable box.

[23:33:00]

Wicked:

poor unemployed college kid :)

[23:33:03]

kormoc:

meh

[23:33:09]

kormoc:

it's not a investment, it's a time sync

[23:33:17]

kormoc:

*time and money sink

[23:33:31]

Beirdo:

TV is a time and money sink :)

[23:33:46]

Beirdo:

all of it :)

[23:33:49]

Beirdo:

read books

[23:33:59]

kormoc:

books are a time and money sink!

[23:34:00]

Beirdo:

!trout Beirdo old fogie

[23:34:00]

** MythLogBot slaps Beirdo with a old fogie trout on behalf of Beirdo... **

[23:34:05]

Wicked:

devinheitmueller, yea. i had heard something like that...was thinking about getting that card for clearqam for now...and keep my pvr150....then when support is built in for analog ill have a extra card

[23:34:10]

Beirdo:

not if you use a library :)

[23:34:14]

devinheitmueller:

Wicked: ok.

[23:34:19]

kormoc:

Beirdo: paid for by your tax money!

[23:34:31]

devinheitmueller:

Wicked: it's worth warning you that there are no plans to do analog support currently scheduled.

[23:34:34]

Beirdo:

and yours :)

[23:34:35]

Beirdo:

hehe

[23:34:36]

devinheitmueller:

(for the hvr-2250)

[23:34:36]

Wicked:

is there a similar card thats better?

[23:34:39]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wicked, not under 0.22. It is very stable.

[23:34:48]

Wicked:

devinheitmueller, oh damn. that is *very* good to know...

[23:35:01]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, lots of people want it, but it's a *huge* piece of work.

[23:35:17]

Wicked:

damn...i figured it wouldnt be that bad

[23:35:30]

devinheitmueller:

No, it's easily 100 hours worth of work (if not more)

[23:35:50]

devinheitmueller:

Doing analog support on a PCI/PCIe bridge is a very significant undertaking.

[23:35:55]

Wicked:

your taling about linux support for analog...not support in mythtv for the card right ?

[23:35:59]

Beirdo:

I already have bitten off enough, I don't wanna take it on :)

[23:36:15]

devinheitmueller:

Correct, I'm talking specifically about the Linux driver (independent of MythTV)

[23:36:22]

Wicked:

ok

[23:36:24]

Wicked:

well.

[23:36:24]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But Analog is on its way out

[23:36:29]

Beirdo:

no it's not

[23:36:31]

Beirdo:

heh

[23:36:33]

Wicked:

any card you all would recomend?

[23:36:48]

devinheitmueller:

Wicked: do you have digital cable?

[23:37:07]

Wicked:

yea. from comcast...and i also have some premium channels like hbo...

[23:37:08]

Beirdo:

devinheitmueller: is the card technically capable of simultaneous digital & analog capture, do you know?

[23:37:17]

Wicked:

which ill need a stb to record

[23:37:18]

devinheitmueller:

Then get an HD-PVR. That will let you capture even the HD channels.

[23:37:28]

devinheitmueller:

(since the HD-PVR captures on the component outputs)

[23:37:33]

Wicked:

right

[23:37:44]

Wicked:

i wish the hdpvr was cheaper :)

[23:37:56]

devinheitmueller:

Beirdo: that's a tricky question. It *can* capture one of each, using each of the two tuners.

[23:38:12]

devinheitmueller:

Beirdo: In other words, you can do two digital, two analog, or one analog and one digital.

[23:38:13]

abqjp:

Amazon occasionally has the hdpvr for ~$201

[23:38:24]

Beirdo:

nice.

[23:38:42]

Wicked:

yea. my *budget* is like 100 hehe

[23:38:50]

Beirdo:

but yeah, until someone does the large chunk of work... no analog from it for a while

[23:38:57]

devinheitmueller:

yup.

[23:39:02]

Wicked:

so the hdpvr works good now under linux?

[23:39:02]

devinheitmueller:

wish I had a better answer.

[23:39:10]

devinheitmueller:

Wicked: yes. Many people use it.

[23:39:13]

Wicked:

i had heard its not very stable and crashes

[23:39:25]

Wicked:

and a while ago..u had to set everything to one resolution

[23:39:31]

devinheitmueller:

It's pretty much the *only* solution for capturing HD from a cable box (other than firewire)

[23:39:31]

abqjp:

Only with live tv. If you want to use LiveTV, why are you using Myth.

[23:39:43]

iamlindoro:

Has worked rock-solid for me for almost two years

[23:39:53]

Wicked:

abqjp, there are not many other solutions for tv under linux

[23:40:03]

Wicked:

im aware there are other options...

[23:40:19]

jolaren:

I wonder what's so special with SVT HD that makes it lag in myth

[23:40:21]

Wicked:

but mythtv seems to be one unified way to manage your tv from one interface

[23:40:25]

devinheitmueller:

Avermedia has a box coming out in the next couple of months, but it's not out yet and there is no driver support.

[23:40:38]

iamlindoro:

and it's in a few ways inferior to the HD-PVR

[23:40:44]

iamlindoro:

(ie stereo only audio)

[23:40:53]

abqjp:

Wicked: there are patches which make the HD-PVR work most of the time with LiveTV, but they are poorly maintained.

[23:41:01]

Beirdo:

devinheitmueller: I'd love to volunteer, but it's not really an option right now, got way too many things on the go

[23:41:21]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wicked, I still set to 720p. But that's fine with me

[23:41:22]

devinheitmueller:

iamlindoro: there are some cases where it might be considered "better". For example, the HDMI output would let you connect the device to a TV for playback.

[23:41:25]

Wicked:

abqjp, ah. i myself dont watch alot of live tv...but i certainly dont want to rule out live tv for others

[23:41:40]

devinheitmueller:

Beirdo: even if you were willing to volunteer, you wouldn't be able to get the datasheets.

[23:41:53]

Beirdo:

yeah, not surprising

[23:42:07]

devinheitmueller:

In fact, I haven't even seen them myself.

[23:42:20]

Beirdo:

it would be a LOT of work without them, but still should be technically possible

[23:42:22]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Last time I tried 1080i and 720p it didn't quite work the way I wanted to.

[23:42:25]

devinheitmueller:

(Steven got them under NDA before KernelLabs was founded)

[23:42:34]

abqjp:

How well the HD-PVR works has a LOT to do with the STB it is hooked up to. How clean the STB puts out AC3, and how quickly the STB handles output resolution changes when changing channels.

[23:42:37]

Beirdo:

ahh

[23:42:41]

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[23:42:47]

devinheitmueller:

Beirdo: without special debugging hardware, reverse engineering a PCIe bridge is not practical.

[23:43:03]

iamlindoro:

What abqjp says is definitely true-- some sat subscribers and FiOS users seem to have the hardest luck

[23:43:05]

devinheitmueller:

(I've done significant research into the topic)

[23:43:08]

Beirdo:

heh.

[23:43:12]

Beirdo:

Fair enough

[23:43:30]

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[23:43:48]

Beirdo:

having dealt with an annoyingly bad PCI-PCI bridge (non-transparent), I have some idea how many spontaneous reboots would be involved

[23:43:53]

kormoc:

yeah, I get corrupt hdpvr recordings from time to time, but it's not that often

[23:43:58]

devinheitmueller:

heh

[23:44:16]

Beirdo:

some Intel piece of junk... we had it on an embedded IXP1200 card

[23:44:31]

abqjp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: The HD-PVR does not like to be told to "record" when the STB is not putting out a clean audio/video stream. To fix that, most people have to put a sleep at the end of their channel-change scripts, so the HD-PVR is not told to "record" too soon. All comes down to how fast the STB changes channels.

[23:44:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I have an older SA3250HD. Probably the reason

[23:44:54]

devinheitmueller:

Nailing down obscure edge cases like "99% of all recordings work fine" is why my job is so time consuming.

[23:45:07]

Beirdo:

turns out Intel's datasheet was dead wrong on a couple points, and when I started (out of frustration) selectively assuming they were wrong... it magically started to work

[23:45:20]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'll give extra sleep. Good idea

[23:45:22]

abqjp:

Other piece of the puzzle, is how well your system can playback H.264 material. Deinterlacing H.264 1080i material takes a LOT of horsepower (or VDPAU).

[23:45:35]

Beirdo:

after about a month of daily pounding my keyboard in frustration

[23:45:56]

Wicked:

what about those new pci cards that you can offload hd content too?

[23:46:14]

Wicked:

i forget the name of them...clearhd? crystalhd?

[23:46:17]

abqjp:

Wicked: no Myth support — YET.

[23:46:29]

Beirdo:

OK, now where in the world did libresolv go in bind9?

[23:46:33]

kormoc:

such an angry yet

[23:46:36]

abqjp:

They are not much cheaper than a decent VDPAU card anyway.

[23:46:41]

Wicked:

ah. i have a nvidia card with vdpau...so no worries...but those things seem like a good idea

[23:46:50]

Wicked:

true

[23:46:52]

Beirdo:

my code does not use lwres

[23:46:56]

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[23:46:57]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

How long a sleep do you think for the HD-PVR?

[23:46:58]

Wicked:

there like what...40$ or so

[23:47:16]

abqjp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: depends on the STB. With my Directv H20 STB, I have 2 seconds.

[23:47:28]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I love VDPAU

[23:47:37]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm adding an extra 2 seconds

[23:47:48]

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[23:48:01]

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[23:48:35]

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[23:48:43]

Wicked:

can you tell myth to use a specific card for livetv?

[23:48:45]

abqjp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: The Directv H20 STB changes channels pretty quick, if the resolution does not change — but takes an extra couple of seconds when the resolution does change.

[23:49:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It takes too long, in my experience.

[23:50:08]

abqjp:

I don't really care how long it takes, as long as I don't miss more than a few seconds from the beginning of the recording.

[23:51:12]

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[23:51:22]

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[23:51:48]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Abqjp, good point. I always tell it to record an extra minute on either side, unless I have back to back recording.

[23:51:58]

Beirdo:

oh BAH

[23:52:10]

Beirdo:

libresolv.a is part of libc6, not bind

[23:53:25]

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[23:54:17]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Beirdo, another problem? Sorry.

[23:54:33]

Beirdo:

this is for beirdobot... trying to compile it in cygwin

[23:54:36]

Beirdo:

heh

[23:54:51]

jams:

interesting little keyboard http://www.satechi.net/satechi-item.php?item= . . . mp;cat=&

[23:56:19]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I like it. But I don't like the price for how little I keyboard.

[23:57:18]

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