Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Tuesday, August 18th, 2009, 00:04 UTC

[00:04:45]

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[00:14:10]

sphery:

Trying to decide if I should watch the 2 Better Off Ted's that recorded while I was traveling last week or to wait a while longer so I can savor the anticipation.

[00:14:20]

kormoc:

ooh, they're awesome

[00:14:28]

sphery:

I'm sold.

[00:14:41]

sphery:

(I chew my hard candies, too...)

[00:14:56]

** kormoc loves the fire squirrel **

[00:15:13]

sphery:

now I have no choice but to watch them to find out what a fire squirrel is all about

[00:15:29]

Gav8in:

I am savoring the anticipation of my mythtv box.

[00:15:47]

Gav8in:

It's going into the post today. I finally convinced my wife to cancel our (somewhat proprietary) satellite two weeks ago.

[00:15:54]

sphery:

yeah, the Myth box changes your TV viewing habits so muhc

[00:16:12]

Gav8in:

I have a PVR right now, but Myth seems like an improvement. If only there were good chinese language programming in Boston.

[00:16:17]

sphery:

I can't imagine ever going back to "uncivilized" LiveTV

[00:16:42]

Gav8in:

We're right now experimenting with different options for Chinese programming. We had satelite basically for my hockey, and her chinese miniseries.

[00:17:08]

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[00:17:11]

sphery:

Well, in Boston, you guys have WGBH... Fortunately for me, they share a lot of their stuff with other PBS stations. :)

[00:17:28]

sphery:

Not that Norm Abrams does any Chinese-language broadcasts...

[00:18:30]

Gav8in:

We might buy a proprietary IPTV device from gektv.com. I like this, because it's very good chinese coverage, including movies that I like

[00:18:39]

unimaginative:

sphery, which of these seem to "fit" my missing dependancy the best? http://pastebin.ca/1533195

[00:18:41]

Gav8in:

and also because it gives me a wife-approved excuse to get a faster DSL

[00:19:03]

Gav8in:

WGBH is very good TV. We have excellent public radio & TV in Boston/Cambridge, yeah.

[00:19:11]

sphery:

kormoc: ah, the Veridian commercials are the best part

[00:19:14]

unimaginative:

Gav8in, you can always buy one of those behemoth dishes you have to put out in the pasture

[00:19:36]

Gav8in:

unimaginative, hard in a rented three-decker apartment on a TINY footprint in cambridge

[00:19:38]

unimaginative:

then you can get chinese programming *from china*

[00:19:44]

kormoc:

sphery, yeah, epic awesome :)

[00:19:59]

Gav8in:

my landlord was extremely unimpressed with the 20" dish that I installed late one night while he was out

[00:20:04]

sphery:

unimaginative: dev-perl/DateTime-Format-DateParse

[00:20:17]

Gav8in:

he spent about three months telling me i had to move it to the roof, then when i kept asking to borrow his ladder to do that, he decided it was fine on my front deck

[00:20:55]

unimaginative:

Hmm, that one is the one I installed earlier. I'm still getting what appears to be the same error message

[00:21:02]

unimaginative:

let me pastebin the current error message

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[00:21:19]

unimaginative:

Gav8in, grats on the southern skyview from your deck :)

[00:21:19]

sphery:

there are tons of different deps

[00:22:18]

unimaginative:

http://pastebin.ca/1533200

[00:22:38]

kormoc:

sphery, you did hear that they renewed better off ted right?

[00:22:41]

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[00:22:41]

sphery:

you got Date/Parse, now you need Time/Format.pm

[00:23:20]

sphery:

http://search.cpan.org/~roode/Time-Format-1.1 . . . me/Format.pm

[00:23:48]

sphery:

unimaginative: basically, the contrib scripts are a maze of dependencies

[00:24:06]

sphery:

packagers haven't really worked them out for users, either

[00:24:11]

sphery:

so it's all manual effort

[00:24:13]

iamlindoro:

http://www.fecitfacta.com/dynamictvmovie.png

[00:24:14]

unimaginative:

heh

[00:24:15]

iamlindoro:

MwaHAHAHAHA

[00:24:20]

sphery:

kormoc: hadn't heard that, but now I'm so happy

[00:24:30]

iamlindoro:

For those who don't know what I've been working on, that's all generated dynamically from metadata :)

[00:24:33]

unimaginative:

I appreciate you helping me out with these deps, I don't have much perl experience at all

[00:24:39]

kormoc:

sphery, 18 more episodes starting this January :)

[00:24:43]

iamlindoro:

dumped those files in a single dir and Myth built that browse mode :)

[00:24:50]

sphery:

nice

[00:25:04]

** unimaginative patiently waits for the third season of Chuck **

[00:25:30]

sphery:

was Secrets and Lives the last this season?

[00:26:02]

kormoc:

Better off Ted is really the highlight of the tv decade

[00:26:04]

kormoc:

sphery, aye

[00:26:43]

sphery:

:( Night time comes too early and January comes too late.

[00:26:51]

sphery:

(for those Dream Theater fans out there!)

[00:26:54]

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[00:27:20]

kingkaeru:

anyone here use mythstream with their cellphones?

[00:27:33]

unimaginative:

sphery, grr. How do you install perl deps via CPAN?

[00:27:33]

kingkaeru:

any recommendation on a cellphone to get (Sprint) to do this?

[00:27:43]

unimaginative:

portage is pissing me off

[00:27:53]

kingkaeru:

I know sliingbox streams to WinMo phones

[00:28:22]

sphery:

unimaginative: I'll leave it to you to look up how to break your system's package management :)

[00:28:57]

unimaginative:

haha, point taken. however, most of the perl deps in portage are masked anyway No matter where I get it, it'll still experimental

[00:29:02]

sphery:

iamlindoro: nice!

[00:29:16]

kormoc:

That's cause the perl portage maintainers are idiots

[00:29:33]

unimaginative:

I've already got dev-perl/TimeDate installed

[00:29:38]

sphery:

unimaginative: Google MCPAN and you'll get what you need

[00:29:46]

iamlindoro:

sphery, Now the question is do I commit knowing that it exposes a MythUI bug

[00:29:53]

kormoc:

unimaginative, just echo "lang-perl/package-name" >> /etc/portage/package.keywords

[00:30:03]

sphery:

but /I/ am not responsible for the results :)

[00:30:24]

unimaginative:

kormoc, I know. I'm just trying to find the correct cryptic dep for what myth.rebuilddatabase.pl needs

[00:30:25]

kormoc:

ooh, it's dev-perl

[00:30:32]

kormoc:

unimaginative, what's it asking for?

[00:30:33]

wagnerrp:

kingkaeru: you misunderstand what mythstream is...

[00:30:33]

sphery:

iamlindoro: one that causes segfaults?

[00:30:39]

iamlindoro:

sphery, yep

[00:30:41]

wagnerrp:

mythstream is for playing internet streams on mythtv

[00:30:48]

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[00:30:50]

wagnerrp:

not streaming your content to other devices

[00:30:51]

iamlindoro:

sphery, as described in #mythtv

[00:30:54]

unimaginative:

kormoc, currently, Can't locate Time/Format.pm

[00:31:19]

kingkaeru:

thanks wagnerrp

[00:31:35]

sphery:

iamlindoro: sounds a lot like the easter eggs on DVD's...

[00:31:39]

kingkaeru:

i thought it was the other way around

[00:31:48]

kingkaeru:

so...with that misunderstanding cleared up

[00:32:08]

iamlindoro:

sphery, only in list view, but works great in all the other views, so I'm pretty sure it's a MythUI bug and not myth list building

[00:32:19]

sphery:

iamlindoro: I'd recommend holding the commit 'til that's worked out for your own sanity's sake--will be easier to support if it all works

[00:32:22]

kingkaeru:

what would be the proper solution to stream the video feeds from my tuners to the internet/cellphones

[00:32:27]

iamlindoro:

sphery, yeah, I agree

[00:32:30]

kormoc:

unimaginative, and it's a cpan package on my box...

[00:32:45]

unimaginative:

kormoc, so I'm on the right track ?

[00:32:58]

kormoc:

yeah, none of the ebuilds will provide it afaik

[00:33:03]

unimaginative:

awesome

[00:33:05]

unimaginative:

Win!

[00:33:06]

iamlindoro:

sphery, still... it's pretty awesome to drop all the files in a single dir and have myth organize them into something sane :)

[00:33:25]

sphery:

kingkaeru: you were thinking of the (old and dead) MythStreamTV

[00:33:27]

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[00:33:34]

sphery:

kingkaeru: which is /not/ MythStream

[00:33:50]

kingkaeru:

ah that's probably where i got it

[00:34:01]

kingkaeru:

did any project come about that replaces mythstreamtv?

[00:34:20]

sphery:

kingkaeru: best solution is UPnP.

[00:34:25]

kormoc:

unimaginative, I'm verifying, so if you want to wait a few minutes...

[00:34:34]

wagnerrp:

upnp wouldnt do anything for a cellphone

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[00:34:49]

sphery:

ah...

[00:34:54]

unimaginative:

kormoc, okay, thanks – it's appreciated

[00:34:56]

kormoc:

Who in their right mind would want to watch tv on a cell phon... oh... whoops

[00:35:11]

unimaginative:

I hope I never have to upgrade the system on this box.

[00:35:38]

** kormoc rebuilds a pile of perl modules incase a perl update broke the package-file link **

[00:35:44]

unimaginative:

kormoc, Installing /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.8/Time/Format.pm

[00:35:48]

unimaginative:

Sound right?

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[00:35:50]

kormoc:

aye

[00:35:54]

kormoc:

what package?

[00:35:59]

sphery:

kingkaeru: oh, for external streaming, you're very limited by a) upstream bitrate and b) the system's ability to transcode on the fly

[00:36:06]

iamlindoro:

Here's something hilarious: MythStream, MythStreams, MythNetStreamTV

[00:36:09]

iamlindoro:

all different!

[00:36:19]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, you missed MythStreamTV

[00:36:23]

iamlindoro:

and that!

[00:36:25]

iamlindoro:

wheeeee!

[00:36:26]

unimaginative:

I just did 'install Time::Format'

[00:36:35]

kormoc:

ahh, yeah, cpan :)

[00:36:42]

kormoc:

just *don't* have cpan do a world update

[00:36:47]

unimaginative:

haha

[00:36:48]

kormoc:

it will *destroy* the perl install

[00:36:53]

sphery:

kingkaeru: such that--IMHO--the limitations make the idea of streaming stuff externally so useless that it's not worth working on the idea

[00:36:56]

unimaginative:

thanks for the advice

[00:37:05]

unimaginative:

CPAN said that an update was available

[00:37:10]

kingkaeru:

sphery: i dont understand why those would be limitations

[00:37:10]

kormoc:

yeah, don't do it

[00:37:12]

unimaginative:

I figured I'd leave it alone if it wasnt broken

[00:37:23]

kingkaeru:

i have the upstream for it

[00:37:41]

unimaginative:

bwahaha

[00:37:44]

kingkaeru:

and my system has the power to transcode on the fly (theorhetically)

[00:37:47]

kormoc:

I ended up actually doing a for package in `equery l -i | grep perl`; do emerge -1 =$package; done

[00:37:49]

unimaginative:

now it says it' can't connect to the database

[00:37:58]

kormoc:

to restore perl to working

[00:38:27]

unimaginative:

http://pastebin.ca/1533214

[00:39:18]

sphery:

unimaginative: you need some command-line args

[00:39:44]

unimaginative:

I thought the only arg I needed was --ext, I need to do some more reading

[00:40:29]

sphery:

kingkaeru: until I can do HDTV-quality (19Mbps MPEG-2) upload with good QOS across the wild Internet, it's not good enough for me--especially when I can just use rsync to copy stuff over to a HDD to take with me

[00:41:08]

sphery:

kingkaeru: but if you'd like to work on something to replace MythStreamTV, I know a lot of people would be happy to see it.

[00:41:30]

sphery:

kingkaeru: note, also, there's the proof-of-concept MythWeb flash streaming, too

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Wicked:

hello all. i have a xvid backup of a movie i made a while back and i now trying to play it with mythvideo...and im getting this: http://pastebin.com/m64083cbe

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[01:20:10]

Wicked:

the movie will start to play but then it just freezes up. if i try to play the same video in vlc or mplayer it plays fine.

[01:20:55]

sphery:

Looks like you get to back it up again--this time using different/supported(-by-Myth's-Internal-player) encoding options

[01:21:49]

Wicked:

hmm. its weird. its austin powers goldmember..i had backed up the whole boxset of the movies..but this is the only one doing this.

[01:22:13]

Wicked:

and other players seem to not have issues with it.

[01:23:35]

Wicked:

im wondering if it was something with avidmuex....a few months ago i combined the two halves of the movies....as i was originally gonna back up all the movies to cdr....but that never happened.

[01:25:11]

sphery:

The easiest solution is probably just to re-rip it

[01:25:18]

Wicked:

yea.

[01:26:03]

Wicked:

im trying to see if still have the movie in the original 2 parts...though im pretty sure i erased them when i merged them

[01:26:57]

Wicked:

woohoo. they where still in the temp dir!

[01:27:27]

sphery:

Should still be on the DVD in 1 part, too

[01:27:36]

Wicked:

...thats alot easier then going to the storage place and digging through boxes ;0

[01:27:48]

Wicked:

yea. dvds are not in house.

[01:28:15]

Wicked:

im gonna go test these originals with mythtv video..then ill know if it was avidmeux

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[01:36:37]

Wicked:

well that was less then fun. it started playing the file fine...i then hit the skip button to make it skip forward 30 seconds...then all hell broke loose lol.....it actually locked this computer up. i had to do the alt+printscreen+relsub to reboot it :(

[01:36:48]

Wicked:

i was able to take a picture of the error though. let me upload it

[01:39:23]

Wicked:

http://picpaste.com/pics/mythtv-error1.1250559556.jpg

[01:39:27]

clever:

it should be rseiub i think

[01:39:53]

Wicked:

oh hmm i just saw relsub a while back on some blog and wrote it down

[01:39:56]

Wicked:

ill add the i

[01:39:58]

Wicked:

:)

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clever:

raising skinny elephants is utterly boring

[01:40:45]

wagnerrp:

i dont even know what key that would be

[01:41:02]

Dagmar:

So buy the expansion pack

[01:41:11]

clever:

[423407.440556] SysRq : HELP : loglevel(0–9) reBoot Crashdump terminate-all-tasks(E) memory-full-oom-kill(F) kill-all-tasks(I) saK show-backtrace-all-active-cpus(L) show-memory-usage(M) nice-all-RT-tasks(N) powerOff show-registers(P) show-all-timers(Q) unRaw Sync show-task-states(T) Unmount show-blocked-tasks(W) dumpZ-ftrace-buffer

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[01:42:14]

ekristen:

anyone know how often the mythtv upnp server beacons out?

[01:42:17]

Wicked:

hmm so i wonder whats up with this file. seems to be possessed!

[01:42:51]

Wicked:

bah crap! it was recording when it crashed

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[01:44:27]

Dagmar:

ekristen: The "normal" amount actually

[01:44:56]

Dagmar:

ekristen: I take it you've got devices that are looking for it and not finding it?

[01:45:05]

ekristen:

yup

[01:45:14]

ekristen:

however they find it when I restart the backend

[01:45:26]

Dagmar:

THat's weird

[01:45:28]

ekristen:

about 3–5 seconds after I restart the backend it shows up in the client

[01:45:31]

ekristen:

yuppers

[01:45:39]

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[01:45:50]

Dagmar:

It's not dependent on advertisement. Machines generally query and it'll respond

[01:45:59]

ekristen:

also I have the recordings show up under the "music" tab in my xbox 360, did some googling, doesn't look like anyone has found a solution yet to that

[01:46:26]

ekristen:

I suppose multicast isn't getting to it for some reason

[01:46:29]

Dagmar:

Probably an error on the Xbox's part there

[01:46:57]

Dagmar:

ekristen: Yeah I suspect perhaps you have a firewall rule lurking about

[01:47:19]

Dagmar:

Lemme check something

[01:47:23]

Dagmar:

I vaguely remember a routing issue

[01:48:32]

ekristen:

added a route already to the mythbackend

[01:49:01]

Dagmar:

ekristen: That's not what was causing hte problem

[01:49:11]

Dagmar:

http://pastebin.com/m3d66aaa

[01:49:19]

Dagmar:

You need a route to the 239 netblock

[01:49:37]

ekristen:

yup

[01:49:40]

ekristen:

got it

[01:49:46]

ekristen:

on the mythbackend box

[01:49:50]

Dagmar:

...and it still doesn't work? Weird

[01:50:05]

wagnerrp:

all the upnp/mdns howtos i find online says you need that route

[01:50:12]

Dagmar:

Yeah you would

[01:50:13]

wagnerrp:

ive never seemed to need it

[01:50:26]

wagnerrp:

on freebsd or gentoo at home, or suse at work

[01:50:35]

ekristen:

depends on how your network is setup to be honest

[01:51:04]

Dagmar:

YOu should need it tho unless you're using a gateway that's set in promiscuous mode

[01:51:30]

Dagmar:

ANything going to 239 will get directed to the gateway, which depending on how it's configured *may* just drop the packet

[01:51:44]

Dagmar:

...unless you have a route saying basically "it's on this network"

[01:53:30]

ekristen:

it is multicast traffic right?

[01:53:48]

juski:

ekristen: is mythbackend running on 127.0.0.1 or the real LAN IP ?

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juski:

oops your xbox wouldn't even see it if that was the case (127.0.0.1)

[01:54:25]

ekristen:

should be on the real IP since I have a remote mythfrontend, but I can check if I can remember how

[01:54:35]

ekristen:

yeah I am pretty sure that is setup right

[01:54:45]

juski:

nah the xbox wouldn't even have seen it. you're right

[01:54:45]

Dagmar:

YEah the UPNP won't work at all if it's set to 127.0.0.1. That's the slightly insane code I mentioned

[01:55:07]

Dagmar:

I'm gonna have to make time to sit down and beat the crazy out of that

[01:55:33]

ekristen:

see mythbackend should regularly broadcast itself

[01:55:38]

ekristen:

I am not seeing it do that

[01:56:11]

Dagmar:

Do ou have any firewall rules at all?

[01:56:24]

ekristen:

no on my backend

[01:56:31]

Dagmar:

Hmm...

[01:56:36]

ekristen:

I have a firewall on my network

[01:56:48]

ekristen:

but that shouldnt matter

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[01:58:32]

ekristen:

ive been tcpdumping for 239/8 and absolutely nothing from mythbackend

[01:58:36]

ekristen:

I think it be broken

[02:01:05]

Dagmar:

So tell it to dump everthing that hosts sends

[02:01:13]

Dagmar:

...by it's MAC address.

[02:01:31]

Dagmar:

It's not like it's going to flood you

[02:02:06]

ekristen:

I am on the backend dumping all 239/8 traffic, if the upnp service was working correctly I would see the traffic there

[02:03:35]

sphery:

you do know that the xbox won't be at all useful for watching TV recordings through UPnP, right?

[02:03:41]

sphery:

(assumign XBox 360)

[02:03:53]

ekristen:

why is that?

[02:03:55]

GreyFoxx:

simcop2387:03:46.689314 IP 192.168.0.184.2020 > 239.255.255.250.1900: UDP, length 320

[02:03:55]

GreyFoxx:

simcop2387:03:49.385308 IP 192.168.0.184.53724 > 239.255.255.250.1900: UDP, length 127

[02:04:02]

GreyFoxx:

Works great here :)\

[02:04:18]

Dagmar:

It's missing hte codecs

[02:04:24]

GreyFoxx:

ekristen: The xbox will NOT play mpeg2 content unless it is wrapped in a MS drm container

[02:04:29]

simcop2387:

GreyFoxx?

[02:04:31]

GreyFoxx:

wont even display it in the video player

[02:04:39]

sphery:

because recordings are either NUV (not supported on XBox 360) or MPEG that has to be put ... what he said

[02:04:40]

ekristen:

GreyFoxx: my mythbackend isn't broadcasting at all

[02:04:48]

Dagmar:

ekristen: With respect to the tcpdumping, never assume that your match is correct when there's something strange afoot

[02:04:58]

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[02:05:22]

Dagmar:

ekristen: There's always a chance something really weird is going on, and in this case since you're trying to listen to messages coming from a particular host... you might as well tell tcpdump exactly that

[02:05:38]

GreyFoxx:

or just watch all port 1900

[02:05:40]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx, http://www.fecitfacta.com/dynamictvmovie.png

[02:05:46]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx, Build dynamically :)

[02:05:47]

iamlindoro:

er built

[02:06:16]

GreyFoxx:

as in live from the drive ?

[02:06:22]

GreyFoxx:

With no rescan?

[02:06:33]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx, No, I mean as in the structure built from metadata

[02:06:37]

GreyFoxx:

ahhh heh

[02:06:41]

iamlindoro:

GreyFoxx, That's with all the files in one dir :)

[02:06:46]

ekristen:

watching port 1900

[02:06:48]

GreyFoxx:

nice

[02:06:50]

GreyFoxx:

nice

[02:06:52]

Dagmar:

Long years of failing repeatedly with tcpdump have taught me to tell it to spam as much as I can take

[02:06:58]

GreyFoxx:

That\s cool

[02:07:07]

Dagmar:

You can always ^c the thing and change the match it's using

[02:07:09]

GreyFoxx:

Dagmar: Yeah and narrow down

[02:07:12]

ekristen:

still same thing, nothing, except my firewall talking on upnp which is normal

[02:07:20]

ekristen:

mythbackend is running silent

[02:07:33]

** simcop2387 wonders if his client did something really weird, what did everyone else see when GreyFoxx started talking and mentioned the IPs, udp and everything else.... **

[02:07:51]

GreyFoxx:

ekristen: Back is not set to run on 127.0.0.1 only? And you aren't passing any weird parameters ?

[02:07:52]

Dagmar:

ekristen: OKay, so login to the backend, su to root (or sudo this if you're skeered) and run `netstat -tunap`

[02:08:07]

Dagmar:

You should see mythbackend listed as listening to two things for port 1900

[02:08:19]

ekristen:

GreyFoxx: that is correct

[02:08:33]

Dagmar:

255.255.255.255:1900 and 239.255.255.250:1900

[02:08:34]

ekristen:

I have remote frontends

[02:09:02]

ekristen:

Dagmar: yes

[02:09:04]

sphery:

simcop2387: I think he pasted lines with s\t that his client autocompleted to simcop2387

[02:09:24]

sphery:

or maybe just \t at the beginning of the line

[02:09:26]

simcop2387:

sphery: i wondered, because my nick there made absolutely no sense to me

[02:09:28]

Dagmar:

ekristen: OKay so that pretty much leaves something in the setup menus that's setweird

[02:09:40]

Dagmar:

...or a bizarre-ass bug in whatever build you're using

[02:10:04]

unimaginative:

so, myth.rebuilddatabase.pl has a learning curve. I think it would be best if I copied these video files into the recordings directory, and *then* added them to the database. it apparently won't copy them automaticaly

[02:10:22]

ekristen:

ok any ideas?

[02:10:25]

ekristen:

of where to look?

[02:10:38]

ekristen:

Version: 0.21.20080304–1

[02:10:44]

sphery:

unimaginative: or just dump them in MythVideo

[02:10:44]

simcop2387:

sphery: whats even funnier is that i was JUST sitting down when it happened, which seem to happen to me a lot

[02:11:10]

sphery:

simcop2387: must have been your Spidey sense

[02:11:14]

Dagmar:

I haven't checked mine again since the last upgrade I did, but I don't really see mine beaconing (although unless it's now broken I know it works)

[02:11:26]

Dagmar:

I've had a sniff going for hte last few minutes

[02:12:02]

ekristen:

normal upnp servers you should see something a broadcast a least every couple minutes if not every minute or so

[02:12:12]

Dagmar:

It's not needed tho

[02:12:19]

Dagmar:

I've sat down and read the spec on uPnP

[02:12:35]

Dagmar:

I had to find out about the "no uPnP for 127/8" issue the hard way

[02:12:37]

unimaginative:

sphery, my MythVideo folder is HUGE

[02:12:44]

Dagmar:

...went all over hte net trying to figure out WTF was going on

[02:12:56]

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[02:13:03]

Dagmar:

I even went so far as to track down a uPnP debugging tool that would let me send arbitrary uPnP messages

[02:13:08]

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[02:13:15]

sphery:

unimaginative: you can fix that with a tool called rm

[02:13:17]

sphery:

:)

[02:13:21]

ekristen:

well I think I have two problems

[02:13:23]

unimaginative:

sphery, but, but, but

[02:13:27]

unimaginative:

haha

[02:13:28]

ekristen:

1) mythbackend isn't advertising itself

[02:13:40]

Dagmar:

Services which broadcast without a reasonable expectation that something else cares ar ebad

[02:13:42]

ekristen:

2) not all multicast traffic is being broadcasted out ...

[02:13:46]

ekristen:

properly

[02:13:49]

Dagmar:

I'd say ignore #1

[02:14:00]

Dagmar:

#2 could be a problem tho

[02:14:14]

sphery:

3) once you get it working, the XBox 360 will be useless for all TV recordings :)

[02:14:33]

ekristen:

sphery: and whats the reason for that again? wrong codec?

[02:15:05]

Dagmar:

ekristen: The only time mine broadcasts is when I restart it

[02:15:15]

sphery:

ekristen: because recordings are either NUV (not supported on XBox 360) or MPEG that has to be put in a MS drm container

[02:15:21]

Dagmar:

Anytime after that my PS3 has always been reliant on it responding to polling

[02:15:31]

sphery:

and Myth doesn't DRM them

[02:15:47]

Dagmar:

SOmething might well have broken since it just spammed out about 100 packets when I resdtarted it

[02:15:55]

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[02:16:00]

sphery:

only thing you might be able to use is some MythVideo videos

[02:16:06]

Dagmar:

sphery: It won't play videos without DRM?

[02:16:06]

ekristen:

that sucks

[02:16:09]

sphery:

very dependent on style

[02:16:17]

sphery:

s/style/encoding

[02:16:38]

ekristen:

hrm ok

[02:16:44]

ekristen:

why can't shit just work together

[02:16:54]

Dagmar:

ekristen: Well, for one thing, uPnP is a toy protocol

[02:16:59]

GreyFoxx:

Because then you wouldn't choose other MS products such as MCE

[02:17:02]

Dagmar:

It's not all that well fleshed-out

[02:17:09]

sphery:

ekristen: what do you want? some kind of Univeral thing that's Plug 'n Play?

[02:17:42]

ekristen:

lol

[02:17:43]

sphery:

ekristen: http://blogs.msdn.com/xboxteam/archive/2007/1 . . . ack-faq.aspx

[02:17:57]

** iamlindoro thinks sphery has that link on his speed dial **

[02:18:00]

Dagmar:

ekristen: THere's another approach you can take, assuming that possibly the backend host is somehow not seeing the broadcast queries

[02:18:25]

Dagmar:

...run a sniff on both the backend and "some other host" for port 1900 while you have your media device search the network for uPnP sources

[02:18:43]

sphery:

Dagmar: by DRM, I'm not saying encrypted so much as "container format with the 'approved by a Microsoft Windows device' data/flags/... in it"

[02:18:52]

Dagmar:

sphery: Ah okay

[02:18:57]

Dagmar:

I know the PS3 isn't real picky

[02:19:16]

Dagmar:

So long as I transcode the recordings before I try to access them (it cleans them up a bit) it'll play just about anything I throw at it

[02:19:43]

sphery:

yeah, PS3 is actually much more useful than 360 for UPnP with Myth

[02:20:17]

ekristen:

Dagmar: the backend isn't seeing the broadcast requests from my client

[02:20:33]

Dagmar:

Okay, THAT is a good sign

[02:20:41]

Dagmar:

Well, it's a sign of progress anyhoo

[02:20:52]

Dagmar:

Are they just not reaching it's interface?

[02:21:06]

Dagmar:

I don't think I've ever seen a switch so damn cheap it wouldn't relay broadcasts

[02:21:32]

Dagmar:

Wait doh... These are both connected to a switch and not a router, right?

[02:21:33]

sphery:

now I'm wondering if the HD-PVR MPEG-4 or some of the UK HDTV MPEG-4 would work with a 360...

[02:21:49]

ekristen:

yes

[02:21:54]

ekristen:

they are both connected to a switch

[02:21:57]

Dagmar:

Hmm...

[02:21:57]

ekristen:

well sorta

[02:22:03]

Dagmar:

A shame you can't run tcpdump on the xbox

[02:22:04]

ekristen:

the backend is directly to a switch

[02:22:07]

Dagmar:

DO you have a hub around? :)

[02:22:21]

ekristen:

my mac is via wireless and the wireless ap is connected to the switch

[02:22:33]

sphery:

hmmm... "10 Mbps with resolutions of 1920 x 1080 at 30fps"... that may be too low for HD-PVR/UK HDTV

[02:22:39]

ekristen:

though I wonder if the ddwrt I have runnin in AP mode is messing with the multicast

[02:22:57]

unimaginative:

is myth.rebuilddatabase.pl for verifying filenames or verifying database metadata?

[02:22:58]

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[02:23:08]

Dagmar:

I can't thnk of any reason why a swich wouldn't relay those broadcasts, since they're sent to FF:FF:FF:FF:FF

[02:23:24]

GreyFoxx:

My xbox360 is behind a linksys wireless game adapter I had laying around, talking to a linksys router running openwrt

[02:23:31]

ekristen:

yeah I know its a little frustrating

[02:23:37]

GreyFoxx:

much cheaper than buying the xbox wireless adapter :)

[02:23:56]

Dagmar:

Might be time to dig a hole in the backyard to bury that switch in

[02:24:01]

unimaginative:

GreyFoxx, I just bit the bullet and ran cat5 everywhere

[02:24:24]

GreyFoxx:

unimaginative: I use to feed it via cat5but I moved it and didn\t feel like running another cable :)

[02:24:26]

ekristen:

alright well its time for be to jet ... thanks for the help and the thoughts and ideas ... will play with it some more

[02:24:29]

ekristen:

try and figure it out

[02:24:49]

ekristen:

I would be fine with not using my 360 if netflix would work on linux :P :)

[02:25:05]

kormoc:

ekristen: google moonlight

[02:25:05]

ekristen:

wish we could get netflix in a mythtv module :)

[02:25:05]

unimaginative:

ekristen, DING DING DING

[02:25:25]

ekristen:

last I read moonlight wasn't up to version2

[02:25:31]

ekristen:

which is required for netflix

[02:25:46]

kormoc:

boxee on linux is getting it working somehow iirc

[02:25:47]

ekristen:

and besides I would have to use a browser which means keyboard and mouse :P :) ..

[02:25:54]

ekristen:

hrm interesting

[02:25:55]

Dagmar:

oh ffs ubuntu doesn't install bsdgames by default

[02:25:58]

ekristen:

good to know

[02:26:47]

ekristen:

night

[02:26:52]

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[02:28:43]

unimaginative:

how can I check for orphaned metadata in the recordings database?

[02:28:55]

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[02:52:19]

kormoc:

sphery: FIRE SQUIRREL!

[02:52:59]

iamlindoro:

Ahhh Veridian

[02:53:37]

sphery:

oop

[02:53:40]

sphery:

wrong window

[02:55:00]

sphery:

there, now it's deleted, so people who try to click on it might think it was related to dev

[02:55:08]

kormoc:

hehe

[02:55:48]

kormoc:

I like the explanation on what went wrong with them :)

[02:55:58]

sphery:

yeah

[02:56:07]

sphery:

and how the project got fast-tracked

[02:56:20]

kormoc:

Yeah totally

[02:56:34]

kormoc:

"We're missing a page?"

[02:57:28]

sphery:

I just think it would be better with another page."

[03:01:15]

kormoc:

Best tv show of the past decade

[03:01:26]

iamlindoro:

Heh

[03:01:30]

sphery:

I do love it

[03:01:33]

iamlindoro:

I'm liking Defying Gravity a lot

[03:01:36]

sphery:

but I don't know that I'd go that far

[03:01:37]

iamlindoro:

it's so very doomed

[03:01:46]

kormoc:

*other then any show with Miss Jewel

[03:02:06]

sphery:

kormoc is going to love the upcoming Defying Gravity episode "Bacon"

[03:02:11]

kormoc:

Ooh!

[03:02:13]

Dagmar:

Oooh

[03:02:20]

Dagmar:

I forgot that aired

[03:02:24]

sphery:

I don't think it has Miss Jewel, though

[03:02:28]

kormoc:

it's true

[03:02:46]

Dagmar:

Oh shucks

[03:02:47]

kormoc:

but if a show had Bacon and Miss Jewel, the world would implode in a flash of awesome

[03:02:51]

Dagmar:

Bacon is next week apparently

[03:03:02]

kormoc:

although, I for one would be fine with such an end

[03:04:34]

iamlindoro:

I really want for "The Pacific" to hurry up and be here already

[03:05:08]

sphery:

don't you just have to look West

[03:05:33]

sphery:

or do you mean you're anticipating the rising sea level due to global warming?

[03:05:42]

iamlindoro:

If I keep driving around, it'll get here ;)

[03:06:25]

sphery:

I've gotta respect a man with a cause he believes in it--and willing to do something about it

[03:06:37]

sphery:

d/it/

[03:07:09]

sphery:

s/bad grammar/good grammar/

[03:07:23]

iamlindoro:

Also, FlashForwad looks good

[03:07:23]

kormoc:

that's my defense when I get arrested for following my 'Go Die in a fire' stimulus plan

[03:07:29]

iamlindoro:

FlashForward, that is

[03:07:43]

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[03:13:05]

sphery:

I want thetvdb.com to have notes and trivia and allusions and the like

[03:17:25]

iamlindoro:

I want a pony

[03:17:53]

sphery:

I don't get the allusion

[03:18:04]

** kormoc blinks **

[03:18:11]

iamlindoro:

Let me give you some notes about it ;)

[03:18:17]

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[03:18:25]

kormoc:

and perhaps some trivia?

[03:21:38]

wagnerrp:

is there any limit on the size of a mysql blob?

[03:22:28]

sphery:

I think if it gets too large, Steve McQueen will come after it

[03:22:47]

wagnerrp:

obviously with a motercycle, or muscle car

[03:22:55]

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[03:23:50]

wagnerrp:

anyway, should i have any problem passing arbitrary data back and forth to a job using the 'args' field in jobqueue?

[03:24:08]

sphery:

LONGBLOB, LONGTEXT – L + 4 bytes, where L < 2^32

[03:24:12]

sphery:

http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/storage-requirements.html

[03:24:55]

wagnerrp:

so once i hit 4GB, im in trouble....

[03:24:58]

wagnerrp:

good to know

[03:25:01]

iamlindoro:

sphery, It'd have to be chad mcqueen, now

[03:25:11]

iamlindoro:

sphery, But he's busy beating up Daniel LoRusso

[03:26:04]

sphery:

if thetvdb.com had notes, I'd probably know what you're talking about

[03:26:15]

iamlindoro:

Chad McQueen = Son of Steve

[03:26:19]

iamlindoro:

Chad = Bad guy from Karate Kid

[03:26:23]

sphery:

oh....

[03:26:24]

iamlindoro:

(a) bad guy, anyway

[03:26:32]

sphery:

didn't know that

[03:26:47]

iamlindoro:

now you know what I was alluding to

[03:26:57]

sphery:

and a useful piece of trivia

[03:27:04]

iamlindoro:

indeed, remember to take note

[03:27:04]

wagnerrp:

oddly enough, hes steve mcqueens father as well

[03:27:18]

iamlindoro:

he's a time traveler!

[03:27:19]

sphery:

is this a Frye kind of thing?

[03:27:37]

wagnerrp:

so wait... he was 24 in that movie?

[03:28:18]

wagnerrp:

well apparently Larusso was 23

[03:28:28]

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[03:28:33]

wagnerrp:

bunch of old guys acting as teenagers

[03:28:36]

iamlindoro:

OK someone has gone all google on me

[03:28:47]

iamlindoro:

Sheesh, actual trivia is worthless thanks to the Goog

[03:29:00]

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[03:31:06]

wagnerrp:

in other news Miyagi is still staring in films four years after his death

[03:32:04]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, You should be watching Three Sheets, by the way

[03:35:24]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: I already do :)

[03:35:31]

** kormoc gives a drink to his monkey **

[03:35:35]

iamlindoro:

I do so love that show

[03:35:42]

iamlindoro:

Though I hate that it's now in SD :(

[03:35:59]

wagnerrp:

sounds like one of those channels i dont get

[03:36:25]

iamlindoro:

You get hulu :)

[03:38:44]

sphery:

I don't

[03:38:58]

sphery:

requires too much processor

[03:39:37]

kormoc:

so you do, you just don't good enough equipment ;)

[03:40:47]

wagnerrp:

well it destroys the C2 2.4s at work when you try to full screen it

[03:40:59]

sphery:

well, anything that needs more than an Athlon X2 6000+ (2x3GHz w/ 1MB L2 cache) is just crazy

[03:41:07]

kormoc:

hrm

[03:41:19]

kormoc:

I full screen it just fine on my itty bitty macbook pro ;)

[03:41:28]

sphery:

I'm sure it's better on "approved" OS's

[03:41:34]

wagnerrp:

thats cause its itty bitty

[03:41:50]

wagnerrp:

flash cant handle more manly screens

[03:41:55]

sphery:

I can't even play back in not full screen without serious tearing

[03:42:07]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: just hooked up to a 30" monitor

[03:42:09]

sphery:

which gives me serious tearing up of the eyes

[03:42:35]

wagnerrp:

its working without problem on a 30"?

[03:42:39]

kormoc:

yeah

[03:42:43]

wagnerrp:

well then... erm... blame windows

[03:43:05]

sphery:

so it doesn't work for you on Windows?

[03:43:16]

sphery:

wow... I figured it was a Linux Flash thing

[03:43:45]

sphery:

I can use the CBS website's player at full screen with no issues, but Hulu's just doesn't work

[03:44:12]

wagnerrp:

C2D 2.4GHz running flash full screen at QWXGA fails hard under windows

[03:45:38]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, Hurry up and get the auto-fill patch committed, I've got Three Sheets to watch ;)

[03:45:48]

iamlindoro:

need to get that baby in in time for .22 :)

[03:46:02]

sphery:

contender for the world's most annoying website, but yay for the news! http://tv.ign.com/articles/100/1009858p1.html

[03:46:16]

iamlindoro:

Saw that coming

[03:46:43]

iamlindoro:

Figured the threat was just that

[03:47:30]

sphery:

yeah, but a jaded person might just expect the worst

[03:47:42]

** kormoc expected the worse **

[03:48:07]

sphery:

Well, we /are/ talking about Fox, here, so many of us did.

[03:48:21]

iamlindoro:

I'm glad Glee is coming, I liked the preview

[03:48:44]

kormoc:

I didn't care for it

[03:48:49]

kormoc:

way too... highschoolish

[03:49:02]

iamlindoro:

*shurg* To each his own

[03:49:03]

sphery:

I haven't watched it, but I can guarantee that I won't like it as much as I liked T:TSCC

[03:49:05]

iamlindoro:

shrug

[03:49:26]

wagnerrp:

ive not been one for musicals in general

[03:49:34]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: the first season is on hulu btw

[03:49:38]

iamlindoro:

It's not a musical, not really

[03:49:39]

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[03:49:42]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, First season of?

[03:49:46]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: glee

[03:49:52]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, erm... the whole thing?

[03:49:57]

kormoc:

yeah

[03:50:04]

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[03:50:06]

wagnerrp:

and it hasnt aired yet?

[03:50:07]

kormoc:

least it was, I watched it a few months ago

[03:50:08]

iamlindoro:

How'd they manage that? It doesn't come to TV until the 19th of Sept

[03:50:33]

kormoc:

erm, they started on one network, aired the pilot, pulled the plug, was sold to another network, but already did the full first season

[03:50:36]

sphery:

on talk like a pirate day?

[03:50:45]

kormoc:

so they released it on hulu before it was sold

[03:51:11]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, Wait, that's not right-- They aired a preview on Fox, and it's still coming to fox

[03:51:19]

kormoc:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/73740/glee-pilot

[03:51:22]

kormoc:

there's the pilot

[03:51:28]

sphery:

you sure you watched on hulu.com and not some other website in some dark corner of the 'net?

[03:51:29]

kormoc:

looks like they pulled the other episodes

[03:51:44]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, it's only ever been slated to be on fox

[03:51:45]

kormoc:

Airdate 5/19/2009

[03:52:06]

** kormoc shrugs **

[03:52:07]

iamlindoro:

yeah, that was the preview... on fox

[03:52:16]

iamlindoro:

I recorded it on my mythbox :)

[03:53:18]

kormoc:

Weird

[03:53:27]

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[03:53:52]

kormoc:

I have Glee: Showmance, Preggers, The Rhodes not taken, Hairography, Once upon a mattress and Sectionals in my hulu history

[03:54:09]

** kormoc shrugs **

[03:54:30]

iamlindoro:

Heh, weird

[03:54:42]

iamlindoro:

Oh well, guess I'll have to catch it starting in September :)

[03:56:03]

sphery:

wow... those are really the episode titles: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glee_(TV_series)#Season_1

[03:56:14]

** sphery wonders if ep 13 is really called "TBA" **

[03:56:28]

sphery:

which would be really funny in that particular table

[03:56:31]

kormoc:

you know

[03:56:37]

iamlindoro:

It's part of a non-consecutive four parter ;)

[03:56:56]

kormoc:

If I watched them out of order, that might be part of why I had no clue what was going on

[03:57:36]

sphery:

well, that is Fox's MO

[04:02:06]

sphery:

I really want to know where the dove goes

[04:02:16]

kormoc:

:)

[04:02:39]

wagnerrp:

well even the dove doesnt know, its blindfolded

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[04:14:10]

wagnerrp:

will the jobqueue terminate a job? or is the job supposed to watch for changes in the status flag?

[04:17:20]

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[04:29:35]

sphery:

pretty sure the job is supposed to check

[04:29:43]

sphery:

don't think jobqueue ever kills a job

[04:29:56]

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[04:30:11]

kormoc:

it could send a seg(hault?wait?pause?suspend?)

[04:30:25]

kormoc:

whatever the one is that pauses it rather then kills it

[04:31:09]

[R]:

i read somewhere that playing back HD content from a haupauge hd pvr uses only 1 thread... is that true? also... i'm thyinking about the hardware i'm gonna get for a new box for use with an hd pvr and i tried using vdpau on my desktop and it seemed to make it use more cpu than with just xv (i was using mplayer)... anyone have any thoughts on that?

[04:31:32]

wagnerrp:

the HDPVR only outputs single sliced h264 content

[04:31:49]

wagnerrp:

as such, the version of libavcodec that mythtv uses can only use one thread for decoding

[04:32:18]

wagnerrp:

if you used more than a couple percent CPU, you werent using VDPAU

[04:32:26]

[R]:

mplayer said it was using vdpau output device

[04:32:30]

[R]:

i thought something was wrong

[04:33:14]

wagnerrp:

you can use VDPAU as an output device, without using it as a decoder

[04:33:16]

iamlindoro:

likely using the renderer and not the decoder

[04:33:27]

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[04:33:39]

wagnerrp:

allows you to do things like using the hardware deinterlacers

[04:33:40]

[R]:

oh hrm

[04:34:18]

[R]:

lemme try again, i found something on google

[04:35:41]

[R]:

ah

[04:35:43]

[R]:

much better

[04:35:59]

[R]:

so when using vdpau, you do'nt really need a super powerful cpu then?

[04:36:12]

wagnerrp:

you need enough CPU to decode your audio

[04:36:15]

iamlindoro:

assuming you only care about watching material supported by VDPAU

[04:36:28]

wagnerrp:

and manage any data IO you have

[04:36:43]

[R]:

well my only input would be an hdpvr

[04:36:54]

[R]:

and i plan on using passthrough for the audio

[04:37:11]

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[04:37:11]

[R]:

OR... myabe i could stick an atsc tuner in it

[04:37:17]

[R]:

also

[04:37:22]

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[04:37:28]

** [R] ponders **

[04:38:17]

wagnerrp:

anything ATSC would be handled by VDPAU as well

[04:38:31]

wagnerrp:

assuming you get a clean signal, no errors

[04:38:43]

[R]:

i *really* want to ditch my cable dvr

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[06:27:39]

juski:

arghh. kicked off the server. hope I didn't miss anything in #mythtv

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[06:31:02]

sphery:

juski: just a discussion about the fact that the MythMainWindow::screenShot() stuff is still too broken to fix the MythWeb "visual remote control" (which shows you shots of what the UI looks like) and a wrong channel ... nothing too interesting

[06:31:59]

juski:

cool :)

[06:32:07]

juski:

nothing about my last commits, then

[06:32:14]

sphery:

nope

[06:32:18]

sphery:

no complaints so far :)

[06:32:30]

sphery:

(same as mine--I'll keep my fingers crossed for both of us)

[06:32:38]

juski:

I always worry about committing changes to the code, even really minor ones

[06:33:12]

sphery:

before today, I never did

[06:33:17]

sphery:

(worry /or/ commit :)

[06:33:20]

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[06:33:33]

juski:

heh. oh the power! ;-)

[06:34:04]

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[06:34:28]

juski:

I still submit patches though, when I'm fiddling with things well outside my remit. Like changing menus around

[06:35:14]

juski:

congrats on getting privs btw, been a long time coming

[06:38:54]

sphery:

thx

[06:39:31]

sphery:

Yeah, I plan to do patches/tickets for all those things I do in all those areas I don't know.

[06:40:06]

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[06:40:09]

sphery:

My only commits so far are fixes to code I wrote, so I know I'm not breaking someone else's code/plans with them. :)

[06:42:21]

juski:

can't wait to finish tidying things up for 0.22. Dying to pick up the painter stuff I was doing

[06:43:16]

sphery:

yeah, I'd love to see a lot of fancy effects available for themes

[06:44:04]

sphery:

as long as we have at least a few people around, like you, who'd use them responsibly (as opposed to the whole Compiz-like "just because you can" approach)

[06:44:10]

juski:

I keep having a sneaky look at the redraw code to see if I can figure out how the negative positioning issues can be fixed

[06:44:29]

sphery:

iamlindoro would love your fixing that

[06:44:31]

juski:

so far nothing though

[06:44:40]

juski:

so would gbee I bet – one less thing to do

[06:45:01]

sphery:

speaking of areas I don't know... the whole of MythTV UI qualifies

[06:46:00]

juski:

I could always shove a whole load of VERBOSE in there, make a new xml & see what's actually going on

[06:47:34]

juski:

sphery: there's a lot less to the painters than I first thought. when iamlindoro suggested my image rotate effect would have to be put in the painters or it prolly wouldn't stand a chance of being included I was dreading it

[06:47:36]

sphery:

yeah, saving gbee some work is a good thing... the man has done far more than his share and it seems that people just expect him to fix most any UI-related issue, now

[06:48:24]

juski:

no idea how to put that in the vdpau painter though. need to see the API for clues there

[06:48:29]

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[06:49:07]

juski:

though last time I looked it appeared as if at least some things in the vdpau painter are being drawn with qt first

[06:49:29]

sphery:

I will admit that the one thing I did in the UI (making a new Manage Recordings screen for #5759 ) was enough to convince me that the new mythui code is /much/ more elegant than the old garbage. I was amazed at how much simpler the code was than before the port.

[06:49:55]

juski:

yeah having ready-made widgets for every eventuality helps :)

[06:50:01]

sphery:

yeah, coding for 3 painters is probably annoying, too

[06:50:14]

sphery:

but I can see the benefits

[06:50:28]

juski:

if it was up to me, I'd say gl all the way over qt

[06:50:38]

sphery:

well, theoretical benefits that is

[06:50:48]

sphery:

I like GL, too

[06:51:11]

sphery:

much more capability and relatively easy to come by

[06:51:17]

sphery:

and a nice standard

[06:51:38]

juski:

yeah and they're not always updating the API in a non-backwards compatible way

[06:51:45]

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[06:51:46]

sphery:

though within myth, we could consider qt a standard (since it works on all cards)

[06:51:52]

juski:

see that, qt? see that, clutter? ;-)

[06:51:57]

sphery:

heh

[06:52:14]

sphery:

wonder what ever happened to that "new frontend for MythTV" done in clutter

[06:52:27]

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[06:53:01]

juski:

it got about as far as it could get with a one man band I think

[06:53:11]

sphery:

seems to be on Google Code, now. http://code.google.com/p/gloss-mc/

[06:53:21]

sphery:

heh, he even mentions "some serious breakage that occurred in the move to the Clutter 0.8.x API"

[06:53:34]

juski:

yeah loads of apps using it do

[06:53:40]

sphery:

Yeah, that was definitely a tall order for one person

[06:54:00]

juski:

at least doing it ourselves, as much of a PITA as it can be, we are masters of our own destiny

[06:54:39]

sphery:

so clutter is specifically a python frontend for OpenGL?

[06:54:49]

juski:

and by the time we've got more fx, animation & whatnot the ui engine will wee on xbmc from a great height

[06:55:03]

sphery:

sounds great

[06:55:05]

juski:

clutter is just a general purpose UI API AFAIK

[06:55:45]

juski:

it can leverage SDL, opengl... there's probably even a qt painting thing for it

[06:56:03]

juski:

though I've not been overly impressed by any SDL based apps I've seen

[06:56:17]

juski:

sitting there hogging my CPU

[06:56:30]

sphery:

ah, yeah, just happens to be Python bindings for it

[06:56:48]

juski:

XBMC is ridiculous. just the main menu screen with the scroller going eats up 50% of one core

[06:56:56]

sphery:

wow

[06:57:11]

juski:

they must be redrawing the whole screen – least I hope they are or something is very wrong

[06:57:14]

sphery:

clutter even has bindings for vala

[06:57:24]

sphery:

which--I've been told--is the next big thing

[06:57:57]

juski:

bah. must be a mindset thing. I could just about read c++ (ok not very complex c++) from day one

[06:57:58]

sphery:

Guess since Vala is the next big thing, someone should tell kormoc so that he can stop the MythWeb Python port and start working on the MythWeb Vala port.

[06:58:06]

juski:

even now I look at python and think "WHUT?!"

[06:58:35]

juski:

they try & sell it on the 'anyone can pick it up' angle but I'm not buying that

[06:58:43]

sphery:

yeah, my parser just doesn't get the concept of indentation as a language element

[06:59:05]

juski:

c++ might look a mess if you don't indent it properly but hell..

[06:59:33]

sphery:

exactly--if the language specifies an indentation requirement, then you have no choice on style

[06:59:35]

juski:

nobody should ever have taken python seriously if whitespace is so important to syntax

[06:59:43]

sphery:

and we might be stuck with stupid things like end-of-line braces

[07:00:10]

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[07:00:22]

sphery:

gotta say, though, that the MythTV Python bindings are currently putting the MythTV Perl bindings to shame (thanks to work from wagnerrp)

[07:00:35]

juski:

I wouldn't care so much if the stuff actually looked like plain english ;-)

[07:01:16]

juski:

maybe I'm still corrupted from my life with BASIC :P

[07:01:25]

sphery:

can't do this with C++, though: http://xkcd.com/353/

[07:02:41]

juski:

lol

[07:03:31]

juski:

oo still need to revisit the variable width button code too. when gbee said sometimes you can stare at a problem & get hung up on doing it the wrong way.... I had a flash of inspiration

[07:03:48]

sphery:

cool

[07:04:04]

sphery:

I find I do my best work when I'm not actually working on the problem

[07:04:09]

juski:

heh

[07:05:27]

kormoc:

Huh, who would have known porting mythweb to python was as simple as 'import mythweb'

[07:05:46]

sphery:

wow, you're finally donw

[07:05:49]

sphery:

done

[07:05:54]

sphery:

now to start on the Vala port

[07:06:02]

juski:

thanks, xkcd :)

[07:06:20]

juski:

I really wanna see XKCD Media Center

[07:06:24]

sphery:

Guess I'd be remiss in quoting a single xkcd python comic and forgetting http://xkcd.com/413/ + http://xkcd.com/409/

[07:08:38]

kormoc:

heh

[07:08:45]

juski:

chuckle

[07:08:55]

kormoc:

what's an omni wheel?

[07:09:12]

sphery:

wow... Perl is dead, now...

[07:09:16]

kormoc:

ooh?

[07:09:36]

sphery:

well, back in 2006 it was dying, so it must be dead now

[07:09:44]

kormoc:

nah, it's like BSD

[07:09:47]

juski:

blog that it is, then it will be

[07:09:51]

sphery:

http://www.perlmonks.com/?node_id=561229 + http://perlmonks.org/?node_id=563050 + http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp/blog/2007/08 . . . ve_perl.html

[07:11:18]

juski:

hahaha http://xkcd.com/ the latest one

[07:12:30]

sphery:

so do you read the mouse-over extra before or after reading the strip?

[07:12:45]

kormoc:

after

[07:12:52]

juski:

there's a mouseover?!

[07:12:54]

juski:

:-O

[07:12:58]

kormoc:

yeah!

[07:13:24]

kormoc:

Every single one has a quip if you hover over it :)

[07:13:31]

sphery:

I try to do it after, but often read it first

[07:14:03]

sphery:

I can't decide if I prefer going into the comic with a bit of foresight or getting blindsided by its genious

[07:14:41]

kormoc:

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/BSD_is_Dyi . . . ft_Weighs_In

[07:14:49]

** kormoc likes a surprise so goes for the blindside **

[07:15:41]

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[07:43:53]

juski:

oh ffs somebody wants mirrored images in MythCenter now?

[07:47:11]

juski:

if people want whizzbang theme stuff, tell them to upgrade their telly to 16:9

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[07:51:37]

juski:

iamlindoro: I saw no harm adding it to mythcenter-wide when I did it. putting the effect on dynamic images has a performance hit just the same as static ones – i.e. if it's not already done & cached, it'll need to be done

[07:52:49]

juski:

I dunno how much aggregate screen real estate would have to be effected before performance is noticably affected on a reasonable system

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[07:54:04]

juski:

when I put the reflect effect in mythcenter-wide I was testing it on my athlon 800 dev box & didn't notice any slowdown ;-)

[07:59:33]

juski:

just had a thought. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwE_UIHSWnY is all done with qt's bui;t-in painter & QImage – if it's fast enough for that many images .. and it looks like they're doing the reflection by drawing it pixel by pixel (!) Jesus

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[08:00:23]

juski:

can't see how that could possibly be faster than painting a translated image with alpha

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[08:46:13]

juski:

heh qt 4.6 is gonna have a declarative animation system. a bit late

[08:48:29]

juski:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXS3xKV-UM0&NR=1 pretty cool. I should do some work

[08:58:07]

linxeh:

that is cool

[09:05:01]

juski:

some numpty on the mythtvtalk forum wants to build mythtv without support for libavcodec

[09:11:33]

juski:

I smell $product

[09:13:07]

janneg:

jarod wilson asked that too for inclusion into the main fedora repo

[09:13:08]

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[09:17:42]

juski:

for mythtv to be of use to most people it needs to support propriatary codecs, so you end up using 'illegal' libs anyway

[09:26:00]

janneg:

just using vdpau for broadcast would work

[09:26:40]

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[09:27:03]

juski:

what about audio decoding?

[09:27:22]

janneg:

digital out only

[09:27:41]

juski:

heh

[09:29:13]

juski:

I suppose that'd be a boon for anybody looking to make a mythtv STB

[09:29:27]

janneg:

not saying it's a good solution, since it's not really a solution: our vdpau still requires libavcodec and the necessary bits for h264 parsing for the vdpau decoder probably still violates some patent

[09:30:00]

juski:

interesting though :)

[09:31:12]

sid3windr:

patent schmatent

[09:31:53]

gbee:

and no mythmusic without it

[09:32:29]

janneg:

no timestretch either

[09:32:29]

gbee:

in fact you'd loose so many features and require a complete re-write

[09:32:49]

janneg:

as I said not really a solution

[09:34:20]

juski:

gbee: after tidying up mythmusic default themes, anything else I can take a peek at? Had a breeze around looking for keybinding consistency issues – nothing that leapt out

[09:35:31]

gbee:

proper solution would involve the invalidation of those codec/software patents which are apparently violated by ffmpeg

[09:35:57]

juski:

I'd pay good money for that, gbee ;-)

[09:35:57]

gbee:

juski: let me think about it

[09:36:47]

gbee:

juski: oh great, well I'd estimate it taking a few million, so you'll be good for what? Half .... two thirds maybe?

[09:36:56]

juski:

hahaha

[09:37:00]

juski:

sure

[09:37:01]

sid3windr:

I think with all the profit from his themes and case badges

[09:37:04]

sid3windr:

95% should be doable

[09:37:20]

juski:

minus what I spent on Jack Daniels at all those expos...

[09:37:22]

sid3windr:

I'll sell my wittyness for the other 5%

[09:37:52]

gbee:

juski: oh, so you're broke then?

[09:38:01]

juski:

back to wondering if there's ANY UK linux expo this year

[09:38:09]

sid3windr:

oh, did that say "percent" ? I meant "cents"

[09:38:10]

juski:

neglecting LRL. That doesn't count

[09:38:19]

juski:

gbee: almost ;-)

[09:43:43]

juski:

linuxworldexpo is now opensourceworldexpo, colocated with loadofbollocksexpo and cloudexpo

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[09:53:00]

juski:

wtf? virginmedia's dns, upon not being able to resolve a site name, looks it up on yahoo

[09:59:50]

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[10:07:04]

gbee:

really?

[10:08:41]

juski:

yup

[10:10:21]

janneg:

sitefinder resurrected, german isp are started doing it too but they at least an option to turn it off

[10:14:38]

gbee:

can't reproduce

[10:15:30]

juski:

maybe it's not national yet

[10:15:44]

gbee:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/18/virgin_advanced/

[10:17:32]

gbee:

well at least you can opt out

[10:17:55]

gbee:

https://my.virginmedia.com/advancederrorsearch/settings

[10:18:08]

juski:

I mostly do anyway, by using opendns on my main machines

[10:18:22]

quicksilver:

opendns itself offers such a feature

[10:18:26]

quicksilver:

although it lets you turn it off.

[10:18:36]

quicksilver:

our ISP uses opendns IIRC.

[10:22:16]

juski:

they probably sent me an email about it ages ago

[10:22:23]

juski:

I've not used POP mail for a long time

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[11:04:14]

gbee:

might have been mentioned in their regular newsletter, I just ignore those

[11:05:14]

gbee:

nothing special that I remember, a particular email with the subject "We're breaking the internet to bring you adverts"

[11:14:54]

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[11:50:13]

juski:

pity nobody's tempted to ressurrect mythtube innit

[11:53:16]

juski:

gbee: any comment about when I was looking at this morning? I had a look at the code for that pictureflow widget that uses qt. I can't see how doing the reflection pixel by pixel (rather than using QPaint itself) would be better in performance terms

[11:53:23]

juski:

s/when/what

[11:55:40]

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[11:58:34]

gbee:

when was this?

[11:58:52]

juski:

about 8am-ish

[11:59:30]

juski:

was being inquisitive. the demo video looked really nippy, the comments said they'd optimised it some & I went for a look to see how

[12:00:38]

juski:

looks like they're doing most operations on the images on a pixel level – the blur effect prolly needs it cos qt doesn't have one yet but the reflection could've been a couple of lines using the painter

[12:02:13]

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[12:03:50]

gbee:

oh that thing, yeah saw it a couple of months back

[12:05:24]

gbee:

oops wrong video, the earlier one I saw last year

[12:05:30]

juski:

looked snazzy & they're messing with a lot of images. maybe doing a reflect pixel by pixel is faster

[12:06:01]

juski:

seen as I can't do any code I'm looking for tips on doing effects at the mo

[12:06:07]

gbee:

juski: only way to know is to compare both

[12:06:14]

juski:

yeah I figured that

[12:06:47]

juski:

looking for something like a gaussian blur in gl. there may not be such a thing

[12:07:15]

gbee:

might be something to be learnt from that, the speed really is interesting, is it using QT's opengl stuff, are they caching the images, what resolution, what original image size etc

[12:07:39]

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[12:07:47]

juski:

gbee: nah just plain ole qt

[12:07:56]

juski:

works with 2 & up they reckon

[12:08:30]

juski:

there's a demo of it running on a phone at 320x240 with a 200Mhz cpu & it seems nippy still

[12:08:39]

gbee:

4.2 and up, or QT 2 and up?

[12:08:55]

gbee:

juski: anything can be nippy at 320x240 :)

[12:09:40]

juski:

think they said qt 2.something

[12:09:46]

gbee:

but still I'm not dismissing it, but I don't have the time to do anything with it myself

[12:09:53]

juski:

anyway was definitely 3.x & 4.x

[12:10:06]

juski:

gbee: I might, though :)

[12:10:39]

gbee:

juski: ok, well the image reflection stuff I think is pretty new, so might explain why they went with their own implementation

[12:10:58]

juski:

good point

[12:11:32]

juski:

ooo shine a light. blurring in gl probably requires shader programming

[12:11:34]

juski:

eeeeek

[12:13:07]

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[12:15:43]

** juski bookmarks http://mierendo.com/software/3d_filter_blurring/ **

[12:16:50]

guysoft42 (guysoft42!n=guysoft@93-173-252-111.bb.netvision.net.il) has joined #mythtv-users

[12:17:14]

guysoft42:

hi all, i got mythv working with dvb-t. but i can't seem to be able to play anything with sound

[12:17:35]

guysoft42:

i can use only vlc. it seems there is a codec missing

[12:18:34]

juski:

audio might be.. ruh-roh... aacs ?

[12:19:13]

juski:

cat a stream to a file, then run ffmpeg -i $filename on it

[12:19:32]

juski:

or VLC should be able to tell you what audio codec is used

[12:19:56]

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[12:20:24]

mindoms1:

maybe there is just the wrong audio-output selected in the settings?!

[12:20:59]

juski:

there was a patch for that non-mpeg1 audio codec on DVB services – don't think it was ever backported to -fixes

[12:21:09]

juski:

mindoms1: unlikely the default is wrong

[12:21:19]

mindoms1:

okay

[12:21:46]

juski:

and dvb services where guysoft42 is are very new, so probably use a better codec than mpeg1 layer 2

[12:22:32]

mindoms1:

at least ac3 works fine for me here

[12:22:58]

guysoft42:

juski, the broadcast in our country is on mpeg 4

[12:23:17]

juski:

figures :)

[12:23:27]

juski:

guysoft42: what does VLC say the audio codec is?

[12:26:37]

guysoft42:

juski, stream1: h264, aac extention SBR+PS . stream2: mp4a audio

[12:27:04]

guysoft42:

juski, i can even record from mythtv, and hear it on vlc

[12:27:10]

juski:

no doubt

[12:27:17]

guysoft42:

.. and its on a computer that does not have pulseuadio

[12:27:23]

guysoft42:

juski, no doubt what?

[12:27:33]

juski:

mythtv just records the streams

[12:27:43]

juski:

it's only the frontend which isn't giving you audio

[12:28:02]

juski:

the log would probably mention something about an unsupported codec when you try to play it back

[12:28:21]

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[12:29:14]

mindoms1:

what about pressing "+" when playing back to change audio stream. maybe the other one works ? ... (sry, if stupid...)

[12:29:58]

juski:

guysoft42: mythfrontend --version should tell you what codec support you've got compiled in there

[12:30:20]

juski:

or at least whether or not AAC (which I *think* is mpeg4 audio) is enabled

[12:35:52]

guysoft42:

Options compiled in:

[12:35:53]

guysoft42:

linux profile using_oss using_alsa using_pulse using_arts using_jack using_backend using_dbox2 using_dvb using_firewire using_frontend using_hdhomerun using_iptv using_ivtv using_joystick_menu using_libfftw3 using_lirc using_opengl_vsync using_opengl_video using_v4l using_x11 using_xrandr using_xv using_xvmc using_xvmcw using_xvmc_vld using_glx_proc_addr_arb using_bindings_perl using_bindings_python using_opengl using_ffmpeg

[12:35:53]

guysoft42:

_threads using_libavc_5_3 using_live

[12:36:05]

guysoft42:

MythTV Branch : branches/release-0-21-fixes ythTV Version : exporté

[12:36:11]

juski:

use a pastebin

[12:36:17]

juski:

for the umpteenth time!

[12:36:37]

guysoft42:

juski, http://pastebin.com/m64134dab

[12:36:43]

juski:

too late

[12:36:46]

guysoft42:

ump?

[12:36:58]

juski:

you already pasted it in here

[12:37:10]

guysoft42:

juski, sorry, dont mean to flood, its empty anyway

[12:37:19]

juski:

that's not the point

[12:37:32]

juski:

looking like using_aac is missing. maybe that's the key

[12:37:56]

guysoft42:

juski, ... empty argument. at least if someone googles, he will find your answer not in the irc archive, with the version numbre :-)

[12:38:13]

juski:

I don't make the rules here

[12:38:27]

juski:

and the rule is, more than 3 lines, use a pastebin

[12:38:31]

guysoft42:

juski, hmm, that means i need to recompile? :-( .. this build is from debian-multimedia.org

[12:38:47]

guysoft42:

justdave, it was 4 :-/

[12:38:50]

guysoft42:

anyway..

[12:38:52]

juski:

and your argument about the logs is pointless. never once met anybody who searched the channel logs before asking anything

[12:39:08]

guysoft42:

juski, i get them on google sometimes..

[12:39:28]

guysoft42:

... is there anything simpler than recompiling now?

[12:39:29]

juski:

yes it means you have to compile it yourself, or else otherwise find a build with aac enabled

[12:39:38]

Gav8in:

juski, that's because those people don't ask questions!

[12:40:05]

juski:

hmm what's libavc ?

[12:40:28]

juski:

ah libavcodec

[12:40:39]

guysoft42:

juski, any build for debian you might know of?

[12:40:44]

juski:

yeah I think you need aac

[12:40:48]

juski:

nope

[12:40:52]

juski:

I build everything myself

[12:41:03]

juski:

*mythtv related

[12:41:19]

guysoft42:

juski, seeing that you are giving support on the channel, i did not think any less of you :-)

[12:41:33]

guysoft42:

juski, are you at least aware of any builds?

[12:41:37]

juski:

it's easy with apt-get build-dep – neatly grabs everything you need to build stuff, dependency-wise

[12:41:40]

juski:

nope

[12:41:55]

juski:

god, why are people so scared of compiling things themselves?

[12:42:15]

juski:

I started doing it to get a predictable outcome

[12:42:37]

juski:

sidestepping anything package management scripts can do behind your back ;-)

[12:43:37]

guysoft42:

juski, i recompiled v4l and edited code for it to work.. i thought that was enough for DVB...

[12:43:51]

guysoft42:

juski, and we did compile once mythtv where worked... i can do it

[12:44:09]

juski:

anybody can do it if they set their mind to it :)

[12:44:17]

guysoft42:

but i rather work with the distro.. its important

[12:44:36]

juski:

so badger the package maintainer to include aac support

[12:44:45]

juski:

I'm surprised they didn't, actually

[12:45:00]

guysoft42:

juski, i am now on .: #debian-multimedia ..

[12:45:14]

guysoft42:

juski, why work by yourself, when you can fix the source :-)

[12:45:16]

juski:

is this trunk or -fixes ?

[12:45:37]

juski:

-fixes. sorry

[12:45:42]

juski:

it is ^^^

[12:45:56]

guysoft42:

.. and debian of course dont hold mythtv.. allergic to non-free codecs

[12:46:24]

juski:

yeah AFAIK you still need using_aac – unless there was a backport of an ffmpeg sync which included it

[12:46:26]

guysoft42:

juski, although, since the dvb comes from the goverment, it should work with free codecs

[12:47:00]

juski:

there was some other audio standard for DVB in europe, trying to remember what it was called

[12:47:07]

juski:

mythtv needed to be patched to include it

[12:47:15]

guysoft42:

juski, hmm, i can add the source package..

[12:47:18]

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[12:47:41]

juski:

guysoft42: better to just install svn & build the most recent -fixes

[12:47:43]

** guysoft42 has only 200 MB at this point **

[12:47:56]

guysoft42:

juski, link?

[12:47:59]

guysoft42:

svn command?

[12:48:04]

juski:

svn.mythtv.org

[12:48:22]

guysoft42:

juski, does the svn support at least pulsaudio?

[12:48:25]

juski:

if you only have 200MB free that's probably not enough for everything you need to compile it

[12:48:28]

guysoft42:

.. then my laptop could do it :)

[12:48:29]

juski:

nope

[12:48:33]

guysoft42:

juski, ill compile on another drive

[12:48:34]

juski:

pulseaudio support has been removed

[12:48:36]

guysoft42:

juski, :(

[12:48:41]

guysoft42:

juski, why removed?

[12:48:47]

guysoft42:

it exists!

[12:48:47]

juski:

it's a piece of crap, is why

[12:49:01]

guysoft42:

juski, of course it is, but its KDE's default

[12:49:13]

juski:

latency issues is the real reason

[12:49:20]

juski:

there's no way to minimise latency

[12:49:33]

guysoft42:

juski, and artsd in the new kernel goes zombie on intel cards, i carn't use it

[12:49:39]

juski:

as a result, audio & video can wind up way out of sync

[12:49:55]

guysoft42:

juski, so what do kde uses do when running mythtv

[12:49:55]

guysoft42:

?

[12:50:02]

juski:

I don't care :)

[12:50:17]

juski:

stop pulseaudio & just use alsa I guess

[12:50:24]

guysoft42:

juski, well, that closes you must be a gtk user ;-)

[12:50:36]

juski:

I don't run a DE on my frontend

[12:50:42]

guysoft42:

juski, does not work, as i said, bugs in the new kernel

[12:50:52]

guysoft42:

juski, aalib?

[12:50:59]

juski:

could be

[12:51:02]

guysoft42:

or just plain X

[12:51:05]

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[12:51:13]

juski:

can't remember now

[12:51:23]

juski:

whatever mythbuntu uses. I hacked it

[12:51:26]

guysoft42:

you must know if its aalib :)

[12:51:48]

juski:

aalib-dev, you mean

[12:52:02]

guysoft42:

juski, maybe, is there another mythtv frontend you can recommend? i tried boxee, but it wont do the job,

[12:52:16]

juski:

nope

[12:52:25]

juski:

I can't recommend any other, and I've tried them all

[12:52:40]

juski:

xbmc sucks, boxee sucks more than xbmc...

[12:52:54]

guysoft42:

juski, can you at least give me one that works on a basic level? so we know its the codec?

[12:53:13]

juski:

and elisa.. well.. that's used to be bad but they went & made it completely unusable

[12:53:33]

juski:

it's the codec

[12:53:57]

guysoft42:

oh. thats installed, lets remove it and get space!

[12:54:00]

juski:

guysoft42: put it this way, get an mpeg2 file, or a video with mp3 audio & play it with 'mythtv $filename'

[12:54:07]

guysoft42:

before let me see if its really unusable

[12:54:33]

juski:

playing a non-Italian DVB-T file will rule out the audio setup on your machine

[12:54:50]

guysoft42:

juski, yes. unusable..

[12:55:19]

guysoft42:

juski, as a python developer, i have no idea why so many python-based apps that work on video just dont work

[12:55:47]

juski:

I have no idea why so many media centre apps have UIs which just plain suck

[12:56:27]

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[12:57:47]

juski:

xbmc has a good little music player there, but beyond that. oh dear. and I like the visual theme of boxee, hwo they stylised it – but nothing else :)

[12:59:32]

guysoft42:

juski, reply from #debian-multimedia: <xtophe> iirc there is a free aac decoder in avcodec

[12:59:46]

guysoft42:

(on aac) <xtophe> one has patent prolem and the other license problem iirc

[13:00:15]

juski:

guysoft42: yes but mythtv would have to be built against *that* version of avcodec

[13:00:24]

guysoft42:

juski, i talked to the founders a few times. boxee is ain israeli company.. just a shame all the content that they serve is only playable in the us

[13:00:46]

guysoft42:

.. still i think its the best open source media center so far..with content support. only if it got mythtv working..

[13:01:06]

juski:

nah. anything where they can harvest viewing stats is bad blood in my book

[13:01:28]

** guysoft42 is acting as a irc transport protocol **

[13:01:34]

guysoft42:

... just passed it over to OFTC net..

[13:02:11]

juski:

for playing mythtv recordings you'll never be able to beat a mythtv frontend

[13:02:25]

juski:

and for everything else, we're catching them up fast

[13:02:41]

guysoft42:

juski, vlc just did for me :-P

[13:02:49]

guysoft42:

juski, because its the one with aac at the moment..

[13:02:57]

guysoft42:

juski, but lets see if we can fix that..

[13:03:06]

juski:

you could have built it yourself by now

[13:04:13]

guysoft42:

juski, i am removing space

[13:04:32]

guysoft42:

.. i mean .. oh well

[13:05:16]

juski:

with xbmc et al wanting to include support for mythtv, none of them are good at grouping recordings, or can display the EPG. they're missing the point :)

[13:05:18]

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[13:07:32]

AlanBell:

I am struggling a bit with a frontend that won't talk to the back end

[13:07:56]

juski:

is the backend still configured bound to 127.0.0.1?

[13:07:59]

AlanBell:

it was this morning, but then it broke. This is a mythbuntu install with the front end PXE booting from the back end

[13:08:08]

juski:

is the database configured to allow access from non-localhost machines?

[13:08:15]

juski:

ah

[13:08:23]

AlanBell:

yes, it seems to be

[13:08:26]

juski:

has its hostname changed?

[13:08:36]

juski:

the frontend I mean

[13:08:39]

AlanBell:

using IP address not host name

[13:08:52]

AlanBell:

and I don't think either end has changed

[13:08:53]

juski:

no, has the frontend's hostname changed?

[13:09:18]

juski:

can you access the database from the frontend?

[13:09:42]

juski:

e.g. mysql -h $ip.add.re.ss -u mythtv -p$thepassword mythconverg

[13:10:01]

AlanBell:

oh hang on!

[13:10:14]

AlanBell:

for some reason it had started mythfrontend twice

[13:10:29]

AlanBell:

one on a different virtual workspace

[13:11:09]

juski:

still, surely both should've been able to access the backend though

[13:12:35]

AlanBell:

seems not. the one one the workspace that is active on bootup is asking for a language, the one on the other workspace is straight in

[13:14:21]

juski:

no mysql.txt is probably why

[13:14:30]

juski:

ahem config.xml in ~/.mythtv/

[13:14:33]

juski:

well, either or

[13:14:36]

juski:

or both

[13:15:22]

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[13:15:32]

juski:

the very first time you run mythfrontend as $user on a machine it'll ask for language preferences, then ask where the database lives. Then it'll find the master backend

[13:15:43]

yfwork:

Hi all. Can someone recommend a good DVB-C card? Thanks

[13:15:59]

juski:

yfwork: any listed in the wiki at linuxtv.org

[13:16:09]

juski:

any listed as *supported* anyway ;-)

[13:16:36]

juski:

none have CA slots, not that you can get CA modules for irish cable TV anyway

[13:17:05]

guysoft42:

brb

[13:17:07]

yfwork:

juski : Thanks

[13:17:14]

anykey_:

juski: there are DVB-C cards with CI...

[13:17:30]

juski:

try buying one ;-)

[13:17:38]

anykey_:

juski: I have 3 CI

[13:18:02]

CoreDump|home is now known as CoreDump

[13:18:57]

juski:

reliable in linux?

[13:19:14]

juski:

moot point anyway since there are no CAMs available for UK/Ireland cable TV

[13:19:24]

anykey_:

juski: yeah, just not with the viaccess cam

[13:19:35]

** yfwork does not know what a CAM or CI is! **

[13:19:47]

anykey_:

yfwork: a CI fits in a CAM where your smartcard fits in

[13:19:48]

juski:

yfwork: conditional access module

[13:19:57]

anykey_:

err, a CAM fits in a CI

[13:20:05]

anykey_:

and the smartcard fits in the CAM

[13:20:17]

yfwork:

ah right. So I would still need to keep the box from the cable company

[13:20:21]

juski:

CI == common interfgace

[13:20:24]

juski:

yup

[13:20:32]

anykey_:

yfwork: IF they allow the use of a CAM

[13:20:40]

yfwork:

I was just hoping to get rid of my PVR150s recording out from the box

[13:20:43]

juski:

anykey_: they don't

[13:20:45]

anykey_:

yfwork: local cable company here does not

[13:21:17]

juski:

cards are locked to STBs, users are (or were) forbidden from connecting their own gear

[13:21:27]

juski:

and they don't provide CAMs

[13:21:39]

anykey_:

same here

[13:22:04]

janneg:

same here but nobody cares

[13:22:31]

yfwork:

I thought that was against euro law. To restirct services to a certain STB. hink Sky sneakily got around it

[13:22:31]

janneg:

well the smart cards are not (yet) paired to receivers

[13:22:40]

juski:

I wouldn't care either, but there's FA worth having on pay TV anyway

[13:22:47]

anykey_:

janneg: ours are

[13:23:23]

yfwork:

There should still be free channels available though I guess.

[13:23:27]

Essobi_:

morning.

[13:23:33]

yfwork:

Anykey: What card do you use?

[13:23:35]

juski:

don't do sports, and if I wanted to see 3rd-rate movies I'd go to the cinema more often

[13:23:51]

anykey_:

yfwork: for cable 3 KNC1 TV Station

[13:24:12]

yfwork:

thx

[13:24:31]

anykey_:

yfwork: can confirm that those work with Conax, didn't try anything else

[13:26:01]

yfwork:

Anykey : I will do some research with that as my fall back :-)

[13:26:46]

anykey_:

yfwork: I once had two cable boxes and a PVR-500, very ugly...

[13:27:27]

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[13:38:48]

josh_ is now known as unimaginative

[13:38:50]

unimaginative:

Eww!

[13:39:09]

unimaginative:

3 valid recordings, 0 missing recordings

[13:39:16]

unimaginative:

100 unknown files using 301.0GB not fixed, check above and use --dodelete to clean up if the above output is accurate

[13:39:57]

unimaginative:

There's just something that seems -odd- about that.

[13:42:12]

juski:

ahh that old unsupported script

[13:42:23]

juski:

stop using it

[13:46:02]

unimaginative:

Oh really?

[13:46:10]

unimaginative:

Is there a newer version?

[13:46:27]

juski:

nope

[13:46:42]

unimaginative:

I guess I could try and build my own, but it would be nowhere near as intuative as that

[13:46:47]

juski:

and the answer is: you're not *supposed* to lose recordings by accident

[13:47:06]

unimaginative:

juski, agreed, but it does happen!

[13:47:12]

juski:

no it doesn't :)

[13:47:19]

unimaginative:

Tell that to my myth box.

[13:47:36]

juski:

gimme the login details & I will :D

[13:47:43]

unimaginative:

Raid5 volume composed of 6 disks, and still recordings are lost.

[13:47:57]

unimaginative:

I'm sure the files are there, somewhere

[13:48:00]

juski:

you have big problems in that case

[13:48:09]

juski:

files do not just 'go missing'

[13:48:18]

juski:

recordings fail, sure

[13:48:38]

unimaginative:

No, these are recordings that *used* to work perfectly fine

[13:49:11]

juski:

I never let a file browser near my recordings SG

[13:49:11]

unimaginative:

but now when even browsing over them in the recorded programs menu causes the frontend to lag when they're browsed

[13:49:27]

juski:

lag what?

[13:49:59]

unimaginative:

let's see..

[13:50:46]

unimaginative:

i should be able to do a 'select basename from recorded;

[13:51:07]

unimaginative:

that gets me my list of files that are in the database

[13:51:43]

juski:

but not where they live

[13:51:55]

unimaginative:

I only have one folder for recordins

[13:52:10]

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[13:52:10]

unimaginative:

so they're either in there or gone completely

[13:52:21]

juski:

sounds like your FS is screwed

[13:52:42]

unimaginative:

I don't know if that is true or not

[13:52:49]

unimaginative:

this is just the first step

[13:53:18]

unimaginative:

I'm thinking the files are actually there, just not with the filename that is in the database (I don't know how, it's just a guess)

[13:53:54]

unimaginative:

So, how can I use the output from taht select query to give me just a list of files

[13:54:00]

unimaginative:

something that bash can use

[13:54:03]

unimaginative:

hmm

[13:54:03]

juski:

how on Earth would that happen?

[13:54:25]

unimaginative:

(I don't know how, it's just a guess)

[13:54:34]

juski:

a for loop would be a good place to start :)

[13:54:37]

unimaginative:

I'm just seeing if I have orphaned files at the moment

[13:54:53]

unimaginative:

juski, I dont know how to get the output from the mysql prompt into bash

[13:55:17]

juski:

mysql -u mythtv -p$thepassword mythconverg -e "thequery;"

[13:55:28]

unimaginative:

ahh, nice

[13:55:41]

unimaginative:

is the $ necessary between -p and "thepassword" ?

[13:56:06]

juski:

where $thepassword == the actual password

[13:56:11]

unimaginative:

okay

[13:56:18]

juski:

no space, no dowwah

[13:58:39]

unimaginative:

That's better, but it still gives me the fancy table graphic

[13:59:02]

juski:

grep/sed ?

[14:00:28]

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[14:01:22]

AlanBell:

is there any information on using mythtv commercially?

[14:01:30]

AlanBell:

like in a hotel or B&B

[14:03:10]

wagnerrp:

AlanBell: mythtv is free to use commercially, but make sure you understand the GPL, and what is needed for making code changes available

[14:03:28]

wagnerrp:

i believe as long as it is not distributed, youre free to do whatever you please

[14:03:51]

AlanBell:

I grok the GPL, software freedom rocks :-)

[14:04:08]

wagnerrp:

also, Schedules Direct (listings provider in the US) is only available for non-commercial users

[14:04:20]

juski:

as is XMLTV in the UK

[14:04:25]

AlanBell:

ok, interesting point

[14:04:36]

wagnerrp:

commercials users need to make their own contract with TMDS

[14:04:48]

AlanBell:

ok, that can be done

[14:05:06]

unimaginative:

It's expensive, IIRC.

[14:05:08]

juski:

I will personally kill anybody who violates RadioTimes T&Cs by misusing it

[14:05:27]

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[14:05:34]

wagnerrp:

juski: afraid of it getting shut down like our Zap2It?

[14:05:39]

juski:

too right

[14:06:47]

AlanBell:

it would also need a commercial TV license or whatever the live feed was

[14:07:17]

AlanBell:

on the media serving side of things is there any nice report on usage

[14:07:25]

juski:

nope

[14:07:32]

wagnerrp:

i dont know about that, never really looked at my cable contract

[14:07:57]

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[14:08:22]

wagnerrp:

AlanBell: there is no reporting of people watching feeds, but it would be fairly simple to add a bit of code to add a line to a database whenever someone starts or stops playback

[14:08:25]

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[14:08:36]

wagnerrp:

similarly, you could scan the logs to do that

[14:08:58]

wagnerrp:

or run a script to scan the frontend socket interface every couple minutes to see what it is doing

[14:09:21]

wagnerrp:

also understand that mythtv has no concept of security

[14:09:39]

wagnerrp:

any user can delete any content

[14:09:54]

AlanBell:

depends how it is mounted

[14:09:58]

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[14:10:00]

juski:

nope

[14:10:05]

juski:

any user can delete recordings

[14:10:09]

wagnerrp:

not if its streamed from the backend

[14:10:20]

wagnerrp:

the backend does deletion of recordings

[14:10:22]

clever:

wagnerrp: they can ask the backend to delete it :P

[14:10:22]

juski:

each frontend just tells the backend to delete.

[14:10:32]

juski:

and the backend obviously has privileges to do that :P

[14:10:33]

AlanBell:

oh, recordings of live TV, OK

[14:10:45]

wagnerrp:

and now mythvideo as well

[14:10:47]

juski:

if there are no write privs, the backend won't run

[14:10:51]

AlanBell:

but videos could be mounted read only couldn't they?

[14:11:23]

wagnerrp:

they could

[14:11:40]

wagnerrp:

but you would have to play some games with mysql permissions to prevent users from deleting the metadata

[14:11:49]

AlanBell:

ick

[14:12:38]

iamlindoro:

or just hack the code and remove the delete option from menus

[14:13:09]

juski:

or just not bother & be a normal, boring hotel

[14:13:12]

AlanBell:

iamlindoro: now that sounds very doable. need to prune the menus anyway

[14:13:28]

AlanBell:

it isn't a hotel, but it is close enough

[14:13:34]

AlanBell:

it floats

[14:13:40]

iamlindoro:

juski, But *tons* of people want to waste their vacation learning how to use a mythbox! :)

[14:13:43]

wagnerrp:

youll have to lock down those machines so they can only ever access mythfrontend, and never gain a terminal

[14:14:19]

juski:

anyway, what 'videos' ?

[14:14:45]

AlanBell:

appropriately licensed DVDs

[14:15:01]

juski:

oil rig?

[14:15:06]

wagnerrp:

are you going to let all users access everyone's recordings and livetv?

[14:15:18]

iamlindoro:

offshore prison

[14:15:20]

AlanBell:

no, posh gin palace

[14:15:29]

AlanBell:

money is not an issue

[14:15:51]

wagnerrp:

or are you just going to record primetime shows, news and such... and let users choose between them?

[14:15:56]

AlanBell:

this is just a proof of concept/prototype/study at the moment

[14:16:24]

AlanBell:

don't mind giving users access to all recordings

[14:16:31]

AlanBell:

subject to parental controls

[14:16:53]

AlanBell:

so some rooms might not get porn, but others might :-)

[14:17:57]

juski:

you need the MythSwing plugin

[14:18:07]

AlanBell:

are the parental controls relatively solid?

[14:18:12]

juski:

nope

[14:19:29]

unimaginative:

juski, MythKeyParty?

[14:22:25]

AlanBell:

can different front ends have different parental levels?

[14:23:04]

wagnerrp:

yes, its all controlled by pin numbers

[14:23:09]

wagnerrp:

but its not very robust

[14:23:43]

wagnerrp:

its robust as far as mythfrontend goes

[14:24:01]

wagnerrp:

but those PINs are relatively easy to find by any user with terminal access

[14:24:02]

juski:

no differente levels on frontends

[14:24:31]

AlanBell:

well that might be sufficient

[14:24:33]

wagnerrp:

oh? entering the pin on one frontend unlocks them all?

[14:24:49]

juski:

no

[14:24:51]

wagnerrp:

ive never actually used those controls

[14:25:02]

wagnerrp:

oh, your saying everyone has the same pin

[14:25:04]

wagnerrp:

right

[14:25:04]

juski:

entering a PIN unlocks a parental level on each machine

[14:25:37]

AlanBell:

Ideally I would like to say from the back end, room 1 gets U ratings, room 2 gets up to age 15, room 3 can see whatever they want

[14:26:05]

juski:

that's 3 of thr 4 levels used up :)

[14:26:14]

unimaginative:

This would be so much easier if mysql would strip the table graphic from the results of the select query

[14:26:24]

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[14:26:30]

AlanBell:

4 levels is fine

[14:26:53]

AlanBell:

U, 15, 18, X

[14:27:06]

AlanBell:

PG/12 would be nice

[14:27:53]

AlanBell:

they might not draw a distinction between 18 and X, not sure

[14:28:00]

Hoxzer_:

Does anybody here experience on Suspending to ram with Geforce TNT ?

[14:28:01]

juski:

or are there 5 levels? anyway...

[14:28:18]

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[14:28:43]

AlanBell:

even 2 levels would be workable.

[14:29:14]

wagnerrp:

Hoxzer_: youre probably not going to find anyone in here who still remembers their experiences running on 10yr old hardware

[14:29:18]

unimaginative:

(PORN) and (NOTPORN)

[14:29:22]

unimaginative:

Good luck with that lawsuit

[14:29:24]

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[14:30:45]

juski:

time to go home

[14:31:02]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: I'm having hard time finding any bad things in using Old graphic card except video encoding boost

[14:31:14]

Hoxzer_:

as long as I use VGA

[14:31:30]

quicksilver:

AlanBell: I think it probably wouldn't be particularly difficult to adapt mythtv to your needs, but you would need to be a programer.

[14:31:33]

wagnerrp:

there is no video encoding boost

[14:31:44]

wagnerrp:

there is a video decoding boost, but only on very recent nvidia drivers

[14:31:49]

Hoxzer_:

Yeah.

[14:31:52]

Hoxzer_:

I knew it

[14:31:53]

quicksilver:

AlanBell: that is, there will absolutely be customisation to do.

[14:31:55]

wagnerrp:

s/drivers/cards/

[14:31:58]

Hoxzer_:

>_< Aargh.

[14:32:06]

Hoxzer_:

That's what I meant anyway

[14:32:53]

wagnerrp:

anyway, the issue is that they are no longer supported by drivers

[14:33:06]

wagnerrp:

and the old drivers may not support Xv or modern kernels

[14:33:21]

wagnerrp:

alternatively, you may have no choice but the OSS drivers which may not support Xv

[14:33:42]

wagnerrp:

you may have an old AGP bus not supported by modern hardware

[14:33:46]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: At least I had no problem with GF2 and Xv

[14:34:00]

wagnerrp:

you may have a PCI bus, in which case you cannot really do HD

[14:34:15]

Hoxzer_:

eh...

[14:34:53]

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[14:34:58]

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[14:35:32]

Hoxzer_:

Well. as for PCi it is no go and I can check support for XV. Pretty sure it is there

[14:37:00]

wagnerrp:

720p is probably doable on PCI, 1080p will not be

[14:37:30]

wagnerrp:

and remember, youre sending the video resolution over the bus, not the display resolution

[14:37:35]

wagnerrp:

scaling is done by Xv

[14:37:46]

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[14:37:59]

Hoxzer_:

okies. Checked hmm. TNT2 has problems with rez larger than 800x600 so it's no go :-/. Damn I would have gotten it for free

[14:38:02]

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[14:38:31]

Hoxzer_:

Guess I have to just wait till I visit my dad and get my GF2.

[14:38:32]

j-rod:

TNT2?!? I think I got rid of one of those when it was already obsolete, like 4 years ago...

[14:38:36]

wagnerrp:

the graphics card is not really something you need to skimp on

[14:38:49]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: Eh.

[14:38:54]

wagnerrp:

considering modern adequate graphics cards are ~$30

[14:39:01]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: dude. I used GF2 for very long period and I had no problem with it

[14:39:30]

wagnerrp:

you can often get by on old hardware

[14:39:44]

wagnerrp:

im saying its not going to be a significant cost towards your myth setup

[14:40:09]

Hoxzer_:

Anyways GF2 composite/s-video output sucks. VGA is gr8

[14:40:43]

j-rod:

does nvidia actually ship a driver for that anymore that compiles on any recent kernel/X ?

[14:41:03]

quicksilver:

I'm quite fond of my old radeon 9200.

[14:41:04]

wagnerrp:

the modern drivers only run the 5-series cards and up

[14:41:11]

quicksilver:

works on the open-source drivers. Works fine.

[14:41:17]

quicksilver:

opengl painter, TV-out, etc.

[14:41:18]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: Naah. My mythSetup has been almost free and I like to keep it that way. My current video card Geforce6800le@6800 has broken (or it is the MB) so need a new one. :-)

[14:41:21]

quicksilver:

not fast, but I'm only SD.

[14:41:37]

wagnerrp:

i had to use the legacy 97.x line for my GF4

[14:41:51]

wagnerrp:

i dont know how far back you have to go for the GF2 and TNT lines

[14:42:05]

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[14:43:36]

guysoft42:

um, anyone here from japan? they use aac too

[14:44:20]

AlanBell:

quicksilver: sure there would be customisation to do which is fine (and would be GPL)

[14:44:30]

wagnerrp:

that reminds me, has anyone else been having trouble playing videos with AAC in the last couple weeks of trunk?

[14:44:40]

AlanBell:

just looking at how close it is and where the major gaps are

[14:44:41]

wagnerrp:

neither of my frontends can play that content anymore

[14:45:02]

Hoxzer_:

wagnerrp: Nah, Gave up with TNT because of its inability to do 720p

[14:45:36]

wagnerrp:

well the TNT is probably just not capable of running arbitrary widescreen resolutions

[14:45:53]

wagnerrp:

i know i used to run one at 1280x1024

[14:45:54]

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[14:50:11]

sebrock:

my mythweb can't access /data/cache/ but the owner is right, it can access /mythweb/data/cache though

[14:50:27]

sebrock:

so my satellite image will not show...

[14:54:10]

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[15:10:00]

Hoxzer_:

Hmm. wagnerrp it appears that I can also get G450 for free. :-/ At least some people have used it with MythTV

[15:12:41]

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[15:13:09]

wagnerrp:

a matrox?

[15:13:16]

Hoxzer_:

yeah

[15:13:24]

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[15:14:30]

sebrock:

mmm anyone knows how I can tidy up the DB from old stuff? I had a crash and the recorded files etc are no longer to be found

[15:15:03]

wagnerrp:

if you cant find the recordings after a crash, you have some fixing to do besides messing with the DB

[15:16:23]

sebrock:

well, everything else works. Just logs are flooded with cant find messages

[15:16:41]

wagnerrp:

did you check to see if your recording disk is mounted?

[15:16:59]

sebrock:

it is

[15:19:24]

sebrock:

err, cant watch live tv either... says permission denied and that the dir is no where to be found, it is as permissions are set

[15:19:58]

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[15:20:04]

sebrock:

utoExpire: ERROR: Filesystem Info cache is empty, unable to determine what Recordings to expire

[15:21:25]

superdug:

so ... call me converted ... NX is pretty spiffy

[15:22:02]

sebrock:

2009-08–18 17:21:13.236 SG(Default) Error: FindNextDirMostFree: '/var/lib/mythtv/recordings' does not exist!

[15:22:17]

sebrock:

how is that possible, it does exist and is chmod 777 right now

[15:23:24]

sebrock:

also: 2009-08–18 17:21:13.256 TFW, Error: Opening file '/var/lib/mythtv/recordings/1010_20090818172112.mpg'. eno: Permission denied (13)

[15:25:43]

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[15:26:02]

tank-man:

have you run fsck on your partitions ? you said you had a "crash", whatever that means

[15:26:11]

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[15:27:07]

sebrock:

tank-man, the crash was on system disk, the recordings are on a separate XFS disk

[15:27:15]

sebrock:

no problems there

[15:27:26]

wagnerrp:

crash? like a head crash?

[15:27:28]

wagnerrp:

dead hard drive?

[15:27:36]

sebrock:

yes dead hd

[15:28:13]

sebrock:

I had DB backups, it is these backups that I am using now

[15:28:33]

sebrock:

so almost everything works except anything with livetv/recordings

[15:29:29]

sebrock:

music from the very same disk works fine

[15:30:29]

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[15:32:27]

sebrock:

and mythweb says it is 0 B free

[15:32:43]

sebrock:

??

[15:34:27]

tank-man:

makes sense cause earlier you pasted that it can't find '/var/lib/mythtv/recordings'

[15:34:45]

sebrock:

right, now I need to solve it somehow

[15:35:11]

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[15:35:14]

tank-man:

can you make a temp file in that directory?

[15:35:25]

tank-man:

manually

[15:35:52]

sebrock:

yes

[15:36:10]

sebrock:

I found somehting in mythweb

[15:36:24]

sebrock:

UPnP/UDN/MasterMediaServer

[15:36:37]

sebrock:

etc. these are mapped with UIDs, and these have now changed

[15:36:49]

tank-man:

try changing the location of your recordings temporaraly

[15:37:25]

sebrock:

ok but what about these UUIDs stuff

[15:37:43]

sebrock:

some UPnP stuff

[15:41:05]

tmkt:

anyhone see district 9 yet?

[15:41:19]

GreyFoxx:

I saw it Saturday, it was very interesting

[15:41:27]

tmkt:

yeah does look good

[15:41:37]

GreyFoxx:

a different kind of space alien story :)

[15:41:52]

tmkt:

debating between that,and the Dasterdly Bastards

[15:42:21]

GreyFoxx:

never heard of that :)

[15:43:09]

tmkt:

inglourious basterds even

[15:43:19]

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[15:43:20]

tmkt:

brad pitt/quentin terentino

[15:43:25]

tmkt:

tarantino

[15:43:52]

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[15:45:04]

wagnerrp:

covert group goes into germany during ww2, with the only order to kill nazis

[15:46:26]

wagnerrp:

someone decided the redeeming feature of the Indiana Jones movies was watching nazis turn to goo

[15:46:30]

wagnerrp:

so they made a movie around it

[15:47:25]

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[15:51:45]

Gav8in:

in the latest indiana jones movies, it was reds that were dying

[15:51:45]

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[15:51:53]

Gav8in:

not nazis

[15:52:36]

iamlindoro:

singular, one movie

[15:52:44]

Gav8in:

yes, sorry

[15:53:00]

Gav8in:

but nevertheless, no nazis were harmed during that movie

[15:53:01]

iamlindoro:

One which the rest of us would prefer to pretend never happened

[15:53:14]

Gav8in:

But come on! The boy is really his son!

[15:53:20]

Gav8in:

that was a big surprise!

[15:53:35]

Gav8in:

Me, I just like looking at Iguazu Falls.

[15:55:23]

JEDIDIAH__:

oh... come on... indy was always a cheesefest

[15:55:40]

JEDIDIAH__:

indy 2 was cheese vinaloo

[15:55:44]

JEDIDIAH__:

indy 2 was cheese vindaloo

[15:57:04]

meshe:

"`i've never had a prawn vindaloo, i've never read a .... book "

[15:59:06]

GreyFoxx:

JEDIDIAH__: yeah, but it wasn't ancient aliens cheese

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[16:19:16]

sebrock:

will mythbackend delete entires where there is no corresponding file?

[16:19:20]

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[16:19:21]

sebrock:

recordings that is

[16:19:41]

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[16:25:52]

Captain_Murdoch:

sebrock, only if you force it to via mythfrontend or mythweb.

[16:26:32]

GreyFoxx:

yeah, otherwise if you start the be before rmembering to mount the recordings dir you would have adisaster on your hands

[16:26:35]

Captain_Murdoch:

we don't do it by default in case the storage isn't mounted for some reason, we don't want the expirer to delete all the DB entries trying to free up space on your root filesystem when you don't have your video directory mounted.

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[16:36:23]

guysoft42:

juski, i checked out release-0-21-fixes/.. where is the compilation dir?

[16:36:41]

wagnerrp:

compilation dir?

[16:36:44]

GreyFoxx:

cd to mythtv and run configure

[16:36:45]

juski:

wagnerrp: muh, but you totally miss the point! OSS stuff is all about using free stuff – and that happens to mandate donated hardware :-P

[16:37:02]

guysoft42:

found it..

[16:37:03]

guysoft42:

neverminf

[16:37:07]

guysoft42:

nevermind*

[16:37:14]

juski:

somebody still needs to read some docs methinks

[16:38:01]

wagnerrp:

juski: sure, now go back and rewrite your painter patches in python

[16:38:39]

juski:

import whizzbang-UI-FX

[16:38:40]

juski:

done

[16:38:49]

juski:

that was too easy

[16:39:09]

wagnerrp:

that was partially for kormoc's benefit, although it appears he is not here

[16:39:30]

juski:

it was appreciated by anybody who's ever seen python & recoiled in horror

[16:39:48]

wagnerrp:

no, someone told him he has to rewrite mythweb in python

[16:39:53]

juski:

yeah I know

[16:39:53]

wagnerrp:

because thats just how OSS works

[16:40:04]

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[16:40:06]

wagnerrp:

ah

[16:40:19]

juski:

user requests JUMP, any dev says "how high *sir* ?"

[16:40:27]

juski:

don't get me started

[16:40:45]

wagnerrp:

if only mario physics applied

[16:40:59]

juski:

though, I've certainly lightened up on that score since I became more erm.. invisible to the wingeing masses

[16:41:05]

GreyFoxx:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTlFY5pHfvg

[16:41:09]

GreyFoxx:

jump dev, dev

[16:42:00]

juski:

who the hell would name themselves after a US state is what I wanna know

[16:42:25]

juski:

finkin 'R&B'. meh

[16:42:58]

wagnerrp:

would you prefer Alpa Chino?

[16:43:26]

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[16:43:58]

juski:

no idea who that is. I is not down wit da kidz innit

[16:44:15]

wagnerrp:

fake R&B star in Tropic Thunder

[16:44:30]

wagnerrp:

he had his own line of energy drink, Booty Sweat

[16:44:39]

juski:

ah. another movie on my 'CBA to ever see' list

[16:45:07]

juski:

damn, I've got to diagnose a problem with my house alarm now

[16:45:58]

iamlindoro:

Tropic Thunder was a funny film, worth seeing

[16:46:33]

sebrock:

GreyFoxx, maybe you can help me out. I get this:

[16:46:34]

sebrock:

2009-08–18 18:03:40.489 AutoExpire: ERROR: Filesystem Info cache is empty, unable to calculate necessary parameters.

[16:46:34]

sebrock:

2009-08–18 18:03:40.495 AutoExpire: ERROR: Filesystem Info cache is empty, unable to determine what Recordings to expire

[16:47:06]

wagnerrp:

sebrock: do the files actually exist?

[16:47:36]

sebrock:

no, nothing exists on the drive, its a new backend with a backed up DB in it

[16:47:50]

wagnerrp:

if you have no recordings, you have nothing to lose

[16:47:56]

wagnerrp:

wipe the database, and start from scratch

[16:48:27]

juski:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTlFY5pHfvg

[16:48:28]

wagnerrp:

shouldnt take more than 10–15 minutes to get everything running from that point

[16:48:49]

juski:

wha? didn't mean to paste that. meh

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[16:51:14]

wagnerrp:

anyone know of a way to pull the serial off a hard drive from the command line?

[16:51:29]

Josh_Borke:

hdparm -I

[16:51:34]

Josh_Borke:

i think it is

[16:52:47]

sebrock:

It's all the settings from frontend, I really really dont want to manually sit and restor all that

[16:53:27]

wagnerrp:

Josh_Borke: that works, thanks

[16:53:50]

wagnerrp:

just looking for a way to uniquely identify a disk across machines

[16:54:01]

juski:

so just dump the frontend settings from the db you restored with select * from settings where hostname="frontendhostname"; :)

[16:54:04]

Josh_Borke:

don't think it works for raided drives though

[16:54:13]

wagnerrp:

not worried about RAID

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[16:55:08]

wagnerrp:

i want to maintain a list of data that would get exported to a device, in this case an individual external hard drive

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[17:00:29]

sphery:

gbee: re: #6137 (and the mess of calling udev*), I've heard that HAL is being replaced by devicekit, so we'd actually need DBUS code for using both HAL and devicekit code.

[17:03:49]

sphery:

gbee: but I definitely agree that using udev* is a bad hack

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[17:07:47]

guysoft42:

hey, is there a list of the packages required to build mythtv in debian anywhere?

[17:08:30]

sphery:

maybe in the debian deb files for myth?

[17:08:45]

sphery:

definitely a list of most of them in mythtv's configure--just not easy to read :)

[17:11:46]

juski:

apt-get build-dep mythtv might work

[17:12:00]

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[17:12:04]

juski:

will probably miss a couple of easy to resolve things

[17:12:04]

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[17:12:20]

juski:

like libmp3lame0-dev or so

[17:12:37]

juski:

and your precious libaac or whatever ;-)

[17:15:09]

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[17:17:27]

guysoft42:

sphery, i tried doing build-dep on the debian-multimedia.org repo. but it wont do it..

[17:17:56]

juski:

so stop using it? ;-)

[17:18:32]

juski:

and were the deb-multimedia guys really worrying about patents & crap when you talked to them earlier about them enabling aac in their mythtv packages?

[17:18:49]

juski:

considering they ship a fully enabled ffmpeg & mp3 I'd say they were being cheeky

[17:18:55]

guysoft42:

juski, ah! ok, got it

[17:19:09]

guysoft42:

dono, it seems something was worng in the source repo before

[17:19:12]

wagnerrp:

havent the mp3 patents run out yet?

[17:19:21]

guysoft42:

juski, you know how debian people are ;-)

[17:19:25]

juski:

didn't have sources set up for that repo hmm?

[17:19:31]

guysoft42:

i asked them, they say its a problem

[17:19:40]

kormoc:

Sound like Yoda you do hmm?

[17:19:47]

guysoft42:

juski, no.. i had, but i changed mirrors just now

[17:20:01]

juski:

so tell them they shouldn't be shipping ffmpeg or libmp3lame binaries either!

[17:20:21]

guysoft42:

juski, they were talking about that

[17:20:27]

juski:

then again I suspect you need to speak to the organ grinder, as opposed to the monkeys

[17:20:39]

guysoft42:

juski, you are welcome to go telling them too on OFTC #debian-multimedia.

[17:20:51]

juski:

if I cared I might

[17:20:59]

guysoft42:

maybe if there will be more than 11 usres there

[17:21:15]

guysoft42:

juski, well, if i get this working, i will contribute code..

[17:21:20]

guysoft42:

i want to get this working for israel

[17:21:35]

juski:

bit rich of them to be twitchy about legal stuff when their whole repo exists for the propriatary stuff debian won't touch itself :-\

[17:21:59]

guysoft42:

... debian won't touch itself thats sure..

[17:22:11]

kormoc:

So... use a distro that doesn't break things? Compile it yourself?

[17:22:29]

guysoft42:

kormoc, i am.. i just did build-dep

[17:22:40]

juski:

I'd never bothered enabling aac audio until I needed it.. which wasn't til I'd converted some dvds with handbrake

[17:22:52]

guysoft42:

... i know debian people can be strange.. but i got to give it to them, the system's package management is the best

[17:23:15]

juski:

everybody's package management is the best. They all say so :P

[17:23:31]

guysoft42:

juski, whats your best then?

[17:23:42]

juski:

whatever :)

[17:23:46]

guysoft42:

and dont say you compile all from scrach :-)

[17:23:57]

juski:

god, I used to. no patience these days

[17:24:09]

juski:

I use ubuntu. Because it's there

[17:24:11]

guysoft42:

juski, i compiled big parts.. but not at once

[17:24:33]

juski:

I've built minimyth a few times. that wasn't fun on a single core CPU of < 2Ghz

[17:24:48]

guysoft42:

juski, did a lot of ubuntu developing last year.. they has so many bugs we had such a laugh.. they hide them well thaugh

[17:25:37]

** guysoft42 compiled kernels, wine, big parts of kde, cinelerra.. big projects take so long.. **

[17:25:47]

guysoft42:

well.. one adding to the list in a few seconds

[17:26:04]

guysoft42:

what flags do you recommend if i want dvb-t on mythv and aac?

[17:26:57]

guysoft42:

--dvb-path=HDRLOC ?

[17:27:32]

guysoft42:

juski, ^ ..

[17:28:24]

** guysoft42 did ./configure --enable-proc-opt --enable-opengl-video **

[17:28:46]

guysoft42:

juski, i am on a 2Ghz cpu..

[17:29:04]

guysoft42:

strange, it said: cc1: warning: -funit-at-a-time is required for inlining of functions that are only called once

[17:31:16]

** iamlindoro has a bad feeling this is DVB w/ AAC LATM **

[17:31:26]

gbee:

sphery: well whether it's hal or devicekit underlying it, dbus still seems like a much better approach, no more active monitoring of devices etc

[17:33:25]

wagnerrp:

apparently some Verizon tech went postal on a customer during a support call

[17:33:51]

sphery:

gbee: yeah... just an inopportune time for them to be switching from one to another

[17:34:10]

sphery:

means we'll need code to support both with an appropriate fallback

[17:34:23]

sid3windr:

wagnerrp: oh? youtube! url! slashdot! digg! wav file!

[17:34:23]

sid3windr:

:)

[17:34:58]

kormoc:

sid3windr, www.lmgtfy.com/?q=verizon+tech+attacked

[17:35:07]

guysoft42:

juski, http://pastebin.com/m4ae69e4e

[17:35:53]

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[17:36:07]

sid3windr:

kormoc: now now.

[17:36:15]

cityLights:

hi all , any gentoo users here?

[17:36:20]

kormoc:

there's a few

[17:36:21]

wagnerrp:

sid3windr: the first item on the list is the one im referring to

[17:36:27]

sid3windr:

;)

[17:36:33]

sphery:

well, the -users list is now recommending ION-based systems for combined frontend/backend Myth box (running MySQL server and, likely, Apache/MythWeb, too, I'd assume) — in http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/392784#392784 (though the 2 posts saying, "It's a good thing" (by people who aren't doing it) aren't yet in the archive)

[17:36:36]

cityLights:

I want to try to run trunk and 0.21 fixes on the same system

[17:36:51]

kormoc:

cityLights, you don't

[17:37:08]

cityLights:

hi kormoc

[17:37:10]

sphery:

cityLights: a separate physical machine is /much/ easier

[17:37:16]

wagnerrp:

cityLights: you can, but if you should be doing it, you would already know how

[17:37:37]

wagnerrp:

it is not a trivial process

[17:37:45]

cityLights:

0.21 offer "all works" trunk offer utf

[17:37:45]

wagnerrp:

and not something someone in here is going to walk you through

[17:37:46]

sphery:

cityLights: it can be done (but the 2 can /never/ talk to each other and cannot run at the same time), but it's a lot of work and /very/ dangerous (as you can break your "production" system)

[17:38:01]

kormoc:

cityLights, 0.21 supports utf-8 just fine

[17:38:12]

sphery:

cityLights: if you're having problems with character encoding it's because your system is misconfigured

[17:38:20]

sphery:

cityLights: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Fixing_Corrupt_Database_Encoding

[17:38:59]

sphery:

cityLights: though if you have data that's partially corrupt, that won't fix it (it will just invert the corruption--corrupt the good stuff and uncorrupt the bad stuff)

[17:39:37]

AlanBell:

if I make a media file on one mythtv installation what do I need to do to copy it to another one?

[17:39:43]

sphery:

cityLights: note, also, that 0.21-fixes uses UTF-8, too: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Fixing_Corrupt_Dat . . . ter_encoding

[17:39:50]

juski:

share it via nfs

[17:39:54]

AlanBell:

along with artwork, and metadata

[17:40:05]

juski:

share it via nfs

[17:40:05]

kormoc:

<juski> share it via nfs

[17:40:13]

sphery:

or CIFS :)

[17:40:19]

** kormoc tars sphery **

[17:40:21]

gbee:

sphery: we'll see, I actually expect they'll have a compatibility layer rather than break all those dbus apps which depend on HAL

[17:40:22]

sphery:

(or AFS or Coda or ...)

[17:40:31]

** kormoc feathers sphery **

[17:40:37]

juski:

add it to mythvideo on one frontend & it will appear as if by magic on all frontends which mount the share to the same path

[17:40:53]

cityLights:

thanks for all the replaies

[17:40:54]

AlanBell:

no, different scenario. I want to rip on one and then distribute to lots of very remote and often totally disconnected back ends

[17:40:58]

sphery:

AlanBell: exact same absolute path being the key

[17:41:05]

cityLights:

I am writing as I think I do have a point to make

[17:41:11]

kormoc:

AlanBell, we don't support that configuration

[17:41:18]

juski:

AlanBell: manually rsync them then

[17:41:28]

AlanBell:

I am contemplating wrapping them up in .deb packages

[17:41:28]

sphery:

provided you have a license to distribute them, that is

[17:41:51]

juski:

and erm.. *distributing* ripped video? are you serious?

[17:41:52]

cityLights:

sphery , yes 0.21 does have utf, but when I ask myth to record a show with only hebrew charecters in the title

[17:42:01]

cityLights:

it fails to do so

[17:42:04]

sphery:

cityLights: you're on Gentoo, right?

[17:42:08]

cityLights:

yes

[17:42:09]

AlanBell:

licensing is a separate issue, lawyers can deal with that bit

[17:42:16]

AlanBell:

and money can deal with that bit

[17:42:20]

cityLights:

and I fixed mysql as you suggested

[17:42:22]

sphery:

cityLights: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Fixing_Corrupt_Database_Encoding (read it all)

[17:42:23]

AlanBell:

I am just doing technical stuff

[17:42:30]

juski:

your funeral ;-)

[17:42:39]

sphery:

cityLights: if you did fix it, you shouldn't be having any problems

[17:42:48]

cityLights:

can I post the sed part so you can see I am ok?

[17:43:09]

AlanBell:

this will all be licensed content, or free content

[17:43:10]

cityLights:

sphery , I asked here a while back about this issue

[17:43:17]

sphery:

cityLights: we'd have to actually see the log files around the not-happening recording to figure out what's going on, but if your DB is properly configured, it's not character encoding issues

[17:43:20]

cityLights:

I was told that I need to wait for 0.22

[17:43:45]

sphery:

cityLights: can you post the output of: echo 'status;' | mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg

[17:43:51]

kormoc:

AlanBell, the only help you'll get here is nuvexport can export metadata for individual recordings, outside of that, we don't support it nor talk about it

[17:43:56]

cityLights:

yet if I do find a bug – no one will fix it , as all effort is in to 0.22

[17:44:10]

cityLights:

and this is why I think I should upgrade to trunk

[17:44:12]

cityLights:

but

[17:44:21]

sphery:

AlanBell: there's a difference between having a license to use content and having a license to /distribute/ content

[17:44:28]

AlanBell:

yes, I know

[17:44:41]

Gav8in:

we're surely not lawyers here

[17:44:45]

AlanBell:

non-theatrical licenses and all that jazz

[17:44:52]

kormoc:

Gav8in, it's channel policy

[17:44:59]

Gav8in:

oh, sorry. /

[17:45:07]

cityLights:

sphery: http://dpaste.com/82285/

[17:45:13]

sphery:

AlanBell: and since it's /very/ difficult to get the latter, we don't help people who do have such a license do so as that would also be helping people without the license to steal copyrighted media

[17:45:33]

AlanBell:

this is a technical feasibility study, which would lead to lawyers talking about how much money changes hands

[17:45:38]

guysoft42:

sphery, i was looking at ION boards, the problem is the cheepest i got was 300&$, they just cost money.. it needs to go down

[17:45:41]

cityLights:

yet 0.22 can't scan frequencies in v4l now

[17:46:04]

wagnerrp:

guysoft42: you get full systems for $300some

[17:46:11]

sphery:

AlanBell: but if we help you out, anyone reading the channel archives online would have a nice description of how to illegally distribute their recordings and videos that they don't have a license to distribute

[17:46:12]

wagnerrp:

ION boards can be had for $150-$200

[17:46:23]

AlanBell:

it might be used for bespoke safety videos and so on

[17:46:28]

guysoft42:

wagnerrp, 300$ is not cheep..

[17:46:37]

kormoc:

AlanBell, as long as you have the bandwidth, it's fine

[17:46:47]

AlanBell:

sphery: ok, that is a reasonable point.

[17:46:49]

sebrock:

why does this happen: 2009-08–18 19:45:43.840 SG(Default) Error: FindNextDirMostFree: '/var/lib/mythtv/recordings' does not exist!

[17:46:52]

sphery:

cityLights: that looks good, so there's something else going on

[17:46:59]

sebrock:

if the dir does exist and has 777

[17:47:01]

wagnerrp:

guysoft42: mythtv has never been claimed as the 'cheap' solution

[17:47:01]

cityLights:

right

[17:47:10]

sphery:

sebrock: you need to fix your storage groups configuration

[17:47:19]

Gav8in:

complete ion systems are ~ $350

[17:47:21]

cityLights:

sphery: can you help me report it?

[17:47:28]

cityLights:

is there a chance to fix it?

[17:47:48]

sphery:

cityLights: we'd have to figure out what's actually causing it before reporting or fixing it :)

[17:47:54]

guysoft42:

wagnerrp, well, the hardware should keep up soon, i hope

[17:48:00]

highzeth:

guysoft42: I bought 2x Acer Revo 3600 for 320USD a piece here in Norway. I cant really complain about that price

[17:48:00]

sebrock:

sphery, there is nothing wrong with it... thats the funny part... /var/lib/mythtv/recordings is a symlink to a 500GB disk mount. Is that not allowed?

[17:48:07]

guysoft42:

Gav8in, there is an acer thing for 300

[17:48:13]

sphery:

sebrock: no symlinks in the dir list

[17:48:26]

Gav8in:

oh yeah? neat!

[17:48:26]

cityLights:

sphery: got 10 min for this/

[17:48:34]

cityLights:

I will do what ever you tell me

[17:48:47]

sphery:

sebrock: also, /all/ symlinks have 777 permissions because they "pass through" access rights to the linked object

[17:48:48]

guysoft42:

Gav8in, http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_trkparms=65%253A . . . 00&gbr=1

[17:48:51]

cityLights:

this allways happens

[17:48:59]

Gav8in:

i'm eagerly awaiting my Asrock Ion machine, but it did cost $348.99, and with a remote, tuner etc... I'm closer to $550

[17:49:01]

sphery:

sebrock: but just put the actual directory into the storage groups dir list

[17:49:06]

guysoft42:

highzeth, i can .. i am israeli :)

[17:49:20]

guysoft42:

high-rez, it should be cheaper.

[17:49:27]

guysoft42:

highzeth, **

[17:49:32]

cityLights:

guysoft42: you too?

[17:49:34]

wagnerrp:

guysoft42: see 'http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp . . . StoreType=0'

[17:49:57]

wagnerrp:

four ION boards for $140-$190

[17:49:59]

highzeth:

guysoft42: understood, still, its one sweet box, and everything works. Hibernate, audio via hdmi etcetc. And its quiet, that helps on the WAF

[17:49:59]

sebrock:

sphery, symlinks are not allowed for storage groups or what did you mean by "dir list"

[17:50:07]

guysoft42:

cityLights, hi hi :)

[17:50:19]

cityLights:

o atom...

[17:50:25]

guysoft42:

hmm, did not run my irc-search-for-israeli script today..

[17:50:26]

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[17:50:31]

sebrock:

sphery, that was a question sorry :D

[17:50:32]

Dagmar:

Since when are symlinks not allowed there?

[17:50:32]

wagnerrp:

sebrock: symlinks work just fine for storage groups

[17:50:34]

sphery:

cityLights: so are you /positive/ you've identified when recordings work and when they don't? Is it if any hebrew characters exist in there or if it's all hebrew?

[17:50:52]

Dagmar:

it would actually be annoying extra code to make it ignore symlinks

[17:50:52]

cityLights:

wagnerrp: isnt there a new nvidia based chipset to do this better?

[17:50:59]

guysoft42:

cityLights, did you build some mythtv configuration here?

[17:51:03]

sebrock:

apparently not for me :P

[17:51:10]

cityLights:

guy: yes I did

[17:51:14]

sphery:

sebrock: a storage group is a logical name associated with a list of directories (dir list), so you cannot put symlinks into the list of directories for a named storage group

[17:51:19]

sebrock:

the link point is aslo 777 and still not working

[17:51:20]

wagnerrp:

cityLights: the ION systems are ALL nvidia chipsets

[17:51:33]

cityLights:

right/////

[17:51:36]

guysoft42:

cityLights, what bidi problem do you have? because i used to work in a company that fixed RTL stuff in mythtv

[17:51:43]

sphery:

i.e. a storage group is not a directory or a bunch of directories, but a mapping between a logical name and a list of directories

[17:51:57]

sphery:

thus the dynamic nature of SG's--allowing moving recordings around

[17:52:05]

Dagmar:

i.e., "a storage group name is not a filename"

[17:52:06]

cityLights:

I am so happy so many members here are willing to help me

[17:52:07]

cityLights:

ok

[17:52:27]

sphery:

sebrock: yeah, even if the directory to which the link points is 777, it won't work since we don't allow symlinks in the directory list

[17:52:28]

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[17:53:16]

cityLights:

if I put in an advance rule to record a program which title has only hebrew letters , this rule is never executed

[17:53:30]

cityLights:

so I never get any files from that rule

[17:54:10]

cityLights:

if the title of the show I want to record has english or numbers , the rule does work

[17:54:15]

cityLights:

and I do get files

[17:54:19]

sphery:

but if it has some hebrew letters and some not hebrew it works?

[17:54:19]

Dagmar:

So what charset does your database use?

[17:54:31]

sphery:

it's latin1--seems correct for 0.21-fixes

[17:54:37]

cityLights:

shery: yes mix works

[17:54:44]

sphery:

however, that's assuming the data in the database is correct, too

[17:54:58]

Dagmar:

...and yet latin1 has no mappings for hebrew glyphs.

[17:55:00]

Dagmar:

Case solved.

[17:55:05]

cityLights:

tell me how to show you

[17:55:16]

cityLights:

ha?

[17:55:23]

wagnerrp:

its a shame you cant get a dual core zotac without wireless

[17:55:26]

sphery:

Dagmar: and yet Myth requires latin1 DB config but writes UTF-8 to it and UTF-8 has mappings for hebrew characters

[17:55:28]

kormoc:

Dagmar, doesn't matter, we convert the UTF-8 string to binary and shove it into the latin1 column in 0.21

[17:55:41]

kormoc:

or rather, we don't but the database does

[17:55:45]

sphery:

Dagmar: the MySQL database for 0.21-fixes is just plain dumb storage

[17:55:54]

Dagmar:

Well, if that's working then his listings source must be broken

[17:55:55]

sphery:

it doesn't know what the values are

[17:56:23]

cityLights:

now here is another clue

[17:56:26]

guysoft42:

juski, i got Fribidi formatting no .. and i have freebidi-dev package installed..

[17:56:28]

sphery:

cityLights: I can't think of any reason that it would fail to work if all characters were hebrew, but would work fine if some (but not all) were hebrew

[17:56:31]

guysoft42:

juski, any idea why?

[17:56:41]

kormoc:

hrm

[17:56:50]

cityLights:

after a put in the rule, I click to see what shows in the coming week with be recorded

[17:56:54]

sphery:

guysoft42: the RTL stuff is not yet supported

[17:56:56]

kormoc:

sphery, if they're *all* hebrew, it might have the r2l indicator on it

[17:56:58]

cityLights:

it does show hits

[17:57:04]

guysoft42:

sphery, there is initial stuff, no?

[17:57:06]

sphery:

kormoc: r2l?

[17:57:10]

Dagmar:

RTL

[17:57:11]

sphery:

oh RTL

[17:57:11]

kormoc:

sphery, Right to Left

[17:57:25]

sphery:

got it... hadn't ever written it that way so took a moment

[17:57:25]

guysoft42:

yep, we write from the right side ;)

[17:57:26]

Dagmar:

Since when does RTL get stored with strings tho?

[17:57:29]

kormoc:

RIGHT TO LIFE! BABABOOEY BABABOEY!

[17:57:39]

sphery:

Baba Riley?

[17:57:39]

Dagmar:

That's a display-time issue

[17:57:47]

kormoc:

Teenage wasteland!

[17:57:52]

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[17:57:54]

kormoc:

They're all wasted!

[17:57:58]

sphery:

kormoc: so there's actually a character signifying RTL?

[17:57:58]

guysoft42:

Dagmar, utf8 has information about it.. also, you since you store the chars, then the application should know how to parse it correctly

[17:58:01]

sphery:

if so, that's likely the issue

[17:58:09]

kormoc:

sphery, afaik there was, but I could be misremembering

[17:58:15]

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[17:58:19]

Dagmar:

GuySoft: Being that I read the spec for it last week, don't bother explaining it to me

[17:58:27]

kormoc:

http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

[17:58:30]

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[17:58:38]

sphery:

"Puts U+200E (LTRM) after each RTL character"

[17:58:42]

sphery:

hmmm...

[17:58:52]

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[17:58:57]

cityLights:

min

[17:58:58]

** guysoft42 compiling **

[17:59:02]

cityLights:

pls dont lose me

[17:59:08]

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[17:59:21]

Dagmar:

I'm saying i've never seen that actually invoked before

[17:59:23]

Dagmar:

I know it exists

[17:59:27]

guysoft42:

sphery, i think there is in certain systems, but its uncommon mostly

[17:59:28]

sphery:

cityLights: if I'm understanding this correctly, on the bright side, it's unlikely to work even with trunk, so no reason to upgrade, yet :)

[17:59:31]

cityLights:

guy: can you schedule a rule to record HDASOT writen only in hewbrew?

[17:59:46]

guysoft42:

cityLights, yes

[18:00:05]

cityLights:

so if it works for guy, y not me?

[18:00:25]

cityLights:

shoould I show yu a line of what is stored?

[18:00:34]

guysoft42:

cityLights, i spent hours yesterday configuring it.. that could be a reason

[18:00:54]

guysoft42:

i hope no one will disagree here that mythtv is one of the most complex programs to configure

[18:01:13]

sphery:

cityLights and guysoft42 : compare your recording rules with: SELECT * FROM record WHERE title LIKE '%<some title>%';

[18:01:21]

GreyFoxx:

GuySoft: That's a very highly subjective

[18:01:33]

GreyFoxx:

but for the average user who has never done TV/video under linux it would be daunting

[18:01:37]

sphery:

I found configuring my sendmail server to be /much/ worse than configuring Myth

[18:01:50]

GreyFoxx:

custom sendmail rules are much more annoying

[18:02:01]

Dagmar:

They're easy

[18:02:05]

Dagmar:

Don't edit your cf file.

[18:02:08]

GreyFoxx:

heh

[18:02:11]

sphery:

I'm not saying Myth was easy, but configuring my mail server (and doing so without making an open relay or ...) was much worse

[18:02:29]

GreyFoxx:

I stopped using sendmail 9 years ago. It was too annoying

[18:02:34]

Dagmar:

You write seven to ten lines of mc stuff, process it, and you're done.

[18:02:38]

kormoc:

I thought myth was rather simple personally

[18:02:39]

cityLights:

sphery: right myth is easy compared to mail servers

[18:02:50]

sid3windr:

it is? :|

[18:03:04]

Dagmar:

mail servers are easier

[18:03:06]

sid3windr:

compared to anything but openldap I found myth to be a bit of a nightmare.

[18:03:10]

sphery:

the problem with sendmail was that there were hundreds of valid configurations each with different benefits/disadvantages, so you had to explore them all and figure out which to use. With Myth, there's generally only one way to configure it to get it to work (and all other config is just user preference, so doesn't matter in operation).

[18:03:21]

Dagmar:

No you don't.

[18:03:26]

sid3windr:

the problem with sendmail is that it exists.

[18:03:27]

GreyFoxx:

kormoc: Same here. my first myth install back in 0.7/0.8 took about 2 hours including compiling... but then I had been using tv cards under linux for a long time

[18:03:37]

Dagmar:

Am I really the only person here who uses mc fragments to generate their sendmail.cf or what?

[18:03:37]

guysoft42:

sphery, i am compiling now! nothing, will, stop, me!

[18:03:46]

GreyFoxx:

but put a cowoker of mine in front of it and they have a meltdown :)

[18:03:49]

guysoft42:

... apart from a syntax error..

[18:03:51]

** kormoc watches gcc coredump **

[18:03:59]

guysoft42:

and a missing lib..

[18:04:10]

cityLights:

oh you all talk, and I can;t keep up

[18:04:11]

sphery:

or a nice power surge

[18:04:11]

cityLights:

ok

[18:04:13]

GreyFoxx:

Dagmar: I had to deal with some instances where mc was not available (and I know that sounds ridiculous)

[18:04:18]

guysoft42:

or a bad compile flag...

[18:04:24]

guysoft42:

... or a power cut..

[18:04:33]

sphery:

cityLights: the key to keeping up in IRC is not reading what others write

[18:04:34]

cityLights:

sphery: I will try to tell you what we find

[18:04:34]

guysoft42:

sphery, beat me to it :)

[18:04:34]

Dagmar:

GreyFoxx: m4 is always available

[18:04:40]

GreyFoxx:

but then I literally left sendmail behind 9 years ago. Postfix is an absolute dream in comparison

[18:04:53]

sphery:

seems most users in here do very well at ignoring what others write when they're asking questions :)

[18:04:56]

guysoft42:

sphery, oh! so thats why it looks like that!

[18:04:58]

cityLights:

I should tell festival to read my irc

[18:05:03]

Dagmar:

Plus there's no reason why you can't process the mc files on just any old host and punt the resulting sendmail.cf over to the host machine

[18:05:06]

cityLights:

then i may keep up

[18:05:06]

GreyFoxx:

Dagmar: I had to deal with several preinstalled machine which did not have it available and I was forbidden from installing anthing

[18:05:31]

GreyFoxx:

It was enough to make me bitter enough to hate it from then on

[18:05:35]

Dagmar:

GreyFoxx: Then you, as a consultant, get to say "Well, if I can't install anything write me the check and I'll go home"

[18:05:38]

guysoft42:

cityLights, you can, but make sure its not in a public place.. you might get lynched

[18:05:52]

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[18:06:03]

GreyFoxx:

Dagmar: I wasn't the consultant, the company was. I was a peon shovelling the poo from pile to pile at the time :)

[18:06:12]

guysoft42:

the thing about compiling is. that you never know when its done.. i think cmake had a progress bar, i like that..

[18:06:21]

guysoft42:

juski, how log did it take you on a <2Ghz?

[18:06:26]

sphery:

cmake... ughhh.

[18:06:58]

guysoft42:

sphery, i know, its lines are discussing.. but, the you run it and go "ooo, highlight"

[18:07:03]

Dagmar:

Either way, handwritten cf files are fail

[18:07:22]

guysoft42:

.. and if its a big project with small files, you can have an epileptic attack

[18:07:26]

cityLights:

right camek is nicer

[18:07:28]

Dagmar:

Very conversation-oriented, those lines.

[18:07:40]

sphery:

Dagmar: mc fragments are what I do, too

[18:07:48]

sphery:

still not quite intuitive

[18:08:46]

guysoft42:

gtg in a few mins i am afraid

[18:08:52]

guysoft42:

i think i might leave this compiling..

[18:08:52]

sphery:

cityLights: how are you creating your recording rule? Are you typing in the title? If so, I think that's the problem--because you're probably lacking some characters that are in the title (the RTL stuff).

[18:09:51]

sphery:

cityLights: that would mean that title search won't work for those shows and custom recording rules won't work (without some, er, modification)

[18:10:39]

Dagmar:

THis is why having it keep that as binary data breaks it

[18:11:23]

sphery:

cityLights: Can you do me a favor and do a DB backup of your system and make it available to me (along with a mention of some of the affected titles)? If so, I might be able to fix the issue (or at least see if it will be an issue in trunk/0.22).

[18:11:34]

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[18:11:59]

Dagmar:

sphery: So mysql is what's doing the work of searching for strings in the listings data, right?

[18:12:24]

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[18:12:30]

sphery:

Dagmar: yes, but that works fine--as long as the the data is identical

[18:13:00]

Dagmar:

Yeah, so unless mysql is actually aware that the data is _text_ then it's not going to do charset-aware things

[18:13:03]

sphery:

Dagmar: the problem seems like it may be that the listings encode special characters into some of the data that Myth doesn't support

[18:13:10]

Dagmar:

Kormoc was saying it's storing those strings as binary

[18:13:11]

cityLights:

min pls

[18:13:26]

sphery:

Dagmar: and--even with trunk, which uses UTF-8 directly--it won't work because we're not putting those characters into the data

[18:13:36]

Dagmar:

You really shouldn't have to afaik

[18:13:47]

sphery:

Dagmar: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Fixing_Corrupt_Dat . . . ter_encoding

[18:13:56]

cityLights:

thnsks sphery

[18:14:03]

cityLights:

I am away to get water

[18:14:07]

cityLights:

brb

[18:14:57]

sphery:

it's storing the data in MySQL but MySQL is not interpreting it correctly (because we lied about the encoding--but for good reasons as we were supporting MySQL 3.23 until 0.21)

[18:15:22]

Dagmar:

Yeah

[18:15:24]

sphery:

so, basically a 2-byte UTF-8 character is simply treated as 2 latin-1 characters, which isn't a problem because they will /always/ be identical

[18:15:34]

sphery:

and a 3-byte UTF-8 char is 3 characters and ...

[18:15:38]

Dagmar:

Until such time as RTL gets involved

[18:15:53]

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[18:15:56]

sphery:

(actually, I don't think we're supporting 4-byte UTF-8--I know we're not in trunk since MySQL doesn't)

[18:16:15]

sphery:

might have actually worked in 0.21-fixes, though, funny enough

[18:16:20]

Dagmar:

...because RTL stuff could easily be a.p.p.l.e. or eRlRpRpRaR, dig?

[18:16:22]

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[18:16:43]

sphery:

Dagmar: right, so where were you about 8 years ago to a) mention that and b) find a way that actually worked with MySQL 3.23

[18:17:11]

Dagmar:

sphery: Hanging around not really giving a crap about RTL

[18:17:12]

Dagmar:

heh

[18:17:19]

sphery:

exactly--me too

[18:17:29]

gbee:

oh feck, this is why you should never edit your database directly folks, I just overwrote my entire settings table thanks to a typo ;)

[18:17:41]

Dagmar:

I just know I had to write a big-ass medical app once and we very carefully avoided ever taking any responsibility for codepage stuff for that very reason

[18:17:51]

sphery:

because I have /never/ encountered the issue that a "show this as RTL" character causes, I had no motivation to fix it

[18:18:09]

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[18:18:16]

Dagmar:

So long as the bits that need to know the correct charset, things should generally "just magically work" or it's the problem of the person who wrote the charset handler

[18:18:20]

sphery:

now I do have a motivation (because a) I now know it may be an issue and b) it's an interesting learning experience and c) it makes Myth a better app)

[18:18:22]

Dagmar:

The app worked with mandarin

[18:18:42]

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[18:19:00]

Dagmar:

You could just say "It's a mysql bug, can't fix it" if mysql weren't all lovin' on latin1

[18:19:27]

gbee:

sphery: thought about a --table arg for mythconverg_restore? So we can restore only one table?

[18:20:49]

cityLights:

min

[18:20:54]

cityLights:

hi gbee

[18:21:15]

sphery:

gbee: I actually had considered it--it would be about a 10-line change. I just wasn't sure it was "proper" (i.e. was afraid we'd have people restoring channel without restoring video source and/or cardinput and/or capturecard and expecting things to all mesh up properly)

[18:21:39]

sphery:

gbee: though I have seen at least 10 cases where it would have been useful

[18:21:42]

gbee:

sphery: well a hidden option would solve that :)

[18:21:50]

sphery:

maybe I'll put it in and just put an appropriate warning about its use

[18:21:57]

sphery:

I can probably do that today

[18:22:09]

gbee:

but it would have been nice to just fire off that script to fix my messed up table :)

[18:22:18]

gbee:

sphery: next 5 minutes maybe?

[18:22:19]

gbee:

:P

[18:22:20]

sphery:

gbee: btw, did you have any other concerns/recommendations for #5759 ?

[18:22:40]

sphery:

gbee: probably could if you really want it (depending on how long my dev box takes to boot)

[18:24:03]

gbee:

sphery: just joking, though maybe you can suggest an easier way to just restore the settings table than hand editing the backup sql to remove the other tables?

[18:27:19]

sebrock:

sphery, I have all my recordings within one dir which is the "Default"

[18:27:31]

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[18:27:51]

cityLights:

waht do I get acess denied when doing

[18:27:55]

cityLights:

echo 'SELECT * FROM record WHERE title LIKE '%קאמ%';' |mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg

[18:28:09]

sebrock:

this default is a symlink /var/lib/mythtv/recordings -> /var/500GB/recordings

[18:28:44]

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[18:28:45]

clever:

cityLights: did you type in the pw when it asked?

[18:28:51]

cityLights:

yes

[18:29:02]

clever:

i think the table is 'recorded' also

[18:29:04]

cityLights:

oh I got it

[18:30:19]

cityLights:

ERROR 1064 (42000) at line 1: You have an error in your SQL syntax; check the manual that corresponds to your MySQL server version for the right syntax to use near '%קאמ%' at line 1

[18:30:29]

cityLights:

echo 'SELECT * FROM record WHERE title LIKE '%קאמ%';' |mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg

[18:30:38]

cityLights:

why oh why

[18:30:47]

sphery:

gbee: the HOWTO's approach ( http://www.mythtv.org/docs/mythtv-HOWTO-23.html#ss23.7 ) will work as long as you a) modify table names and b) also include the SET NAMES. Where b is not as critical for trunk, but can be done with: grep "40101 SET NAMES " mythtv_backup.sql > restore.sql

[18:31:11]

sebrock:

so I still don't see why this would not work, symlinks should be accepted I'm told

[18:31:20]

Gav8in:

[18:31:24]

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[18:31:39]

sphery:

cityLights: one question mark

[18:33:29]

sphery:

cityLights and you need to properly shell escape your single quotes or restructure, as: mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg -e 'SELECT * FROM record WHERE title LIKE "%?%";'

[18:34:37]

sphery:

cityLights: though, really, those 3 question marks were your hebrew character not displaying properly because of my (latin-centric :) IRC client config :)

[18:34:56]

gbee:

sphery: yeah, that should be easier, though not sure what you mean by "modify table names"?

[18:35:25]

sphery:

cityLights: unfortunately, though, you can't use the hebrew character since that's now how it's store in the db--you'd have to use the latin1 equivalent of the 3 bytes for the character :(

[18:36:01]

sphery:

gbee: just meant, instead of grep "INSERT INTO \`record\` " change record to the table you want :)

[18:36:14]

sphery:

which I'm sure you actually would have known if I didn't mention it :)

[18:36:32]

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[18:36:32]

sphery:

just too used to writing out all my thoughts when figuring out how to do something

[18:37:47]

gbee:

oh, thought you meant something more than that because that seemed kinda obvious ;)

[18:37:58]

cityLights:

well

[18:37:58]

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[18:38:00]

cityLights:

ok

[18:38:07]

cityLights:

tell me is you need anything

[18:38:21]

cityLights:

I really need to get studing for calculus

[18:38:22]

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[18:38:24]

sebrock:

sphery, you mind helping me some with my recordings dir?

[18:38:33]

cityLights:

guy: you must know calculus well – right?

[18:38:49]

cityLights:

I got this odd limit ,and can;t solve it

[18:39:04]

cityLights:

sebrock: can I help?

[18:39:11]

sebrock:

maybe :D

[18:39:20]

cityLights:

go a head

[18:39:38]

sebrock:

I keep seeing this in my backend log

[18:39:39]

sebrock:

2009-08–18 19:45:43.840 SG(Default) Error: FindNextDirMostFree: '/var/lib/mythtv/recordings' does not exist!

[18:40:09]

sebrock:

that path IS a working symlink to a directory with all permissions to 777

[18:40:10]

sphery:

sebrock: did you change it so that the directory path given in the Storage Groups configuration in mythtv-setup is an actual directory and not a link to a directory?

[18:40:34]

sebrock:

sphery, I was told symlinks should work just fine?

[18:40:55]

kormoc:

sebrock, well, rather, we expect they would be it's a untested/unsupported setup

[18:40:57]

gbee:

sphery: thanks for the help

[18:41:27]

cityLights:

gbee: are you the guy that writes docs?

[18:41:34]

cityLights:

cause I want in

[18:41:53]

iamlindoro:

in to what?

[18:42:18]

sebrock:

sphery, kormoc no difference....

[18:42:24]

cityLights:

to help write stuff

[18:42:30]

iamlindoro:

cityLights: In Hebrew?

[18:42:31]

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[18:42:35]

cityLights:

:-)

[18:42:42]

cityLights:

English

[18:42:47]

kormoc:

cityLights, wiki.mythtv.org

[18:42:52]

sebrock:

now says that dir does not exist

[18:42:52]

cityLights:

right

[18:42:55]

kormoc:

create an account, enjoy

[18:43:06]

gbee:

cityLights: not me

[18:43:16]

cityLights:

ok

[18:43:23]

cityLights:

ok, in other issue

[18:43:31]

iamlindoro:

But please don't edit anything you don't understand completely-- not that help w/ documentation wouldn't be a great thing, but it needs to be clear, grammatically correct, and factually right

[18:43:33]

cityLights:

does anyone here uses pulse audio and mythtv?

[18:43:44]

gbee:

official docs, just make the changes and supply a patch using svn diff

[18:43:45]

kormoc:

no, we don't support pulse audio

[18:43:53]

sphery:

sebrock: QDir checkDir("");\ncheckDir.setPath(m_dirlist[curDir]);\nif (!checkDir.exists()) {\nVERBOSE(VB_IMPORTANT, LOC_ERR + QString("FindNextDirMostFree: '%1' does not exist!").arg(nextDir));\n}\n + http://doc.trolltech.com/4.4/qdir.html#exists-2 ("Returns true if the directory exists; otherwise returns false. (If a file with the same name is found this function will return false)." says that a symlink won't work

[18:44:06]

sphery:

sebrock: or, the short story, a symlink /won't/ work

[18:44:18]

gbee:

cityLights: pulse is problematic with myth because it's too high latency for video

[18:44:26]

sebrock:

sphery, I've changed it to the actual path, still does no work

[18:44:31]

sebrock:

same message

[18:44:35]

cityLights:

0.22 will support alsa, thus allow pulse audio to live in peace

[18:44:38]

sphery:

sebrock: you can have symlinks within a recordings directory that refer to recordings files elsewhere, but the directory specified in the storage group must be a directory

[18:44:57]

kormoc:

cityLights, 0.21 supports ALSA output already

[18:45:07]

cityLights:

gbee even on current systems?

[18:45:08]

gbee:

he might mean capture

[18:45:22]

kormoc:

gbee, I didn't know 0.22 had alsa capture support?

[18:45:28]

iamlindoro:

did the ALSA capture patches get applied? Didn't think they had

[18:45:31]

gbee:

cityLights: even on the very fast machines of some devs, it's slow as hell

[18:45:34]

sphery:

sebrock: run the program that's getting that error with: -v important,general,file and please pastebin the log (i.e. mythbackend -v important,general,file )

[18:45:34]

cityLights:

I mean alsa for recording

[18:45:41]

gbee:

kormoc: patch in trac

[18:45:45]

kormoc:

ahh

[18:45:58]

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[18:46:04]

gbee:

but only relevant if using old software encoders/framegrabbers

[18:46:18]

cityLights:

right

[18:46:18]

iamlindoro:

cityLights: Those patches are pretty old and probably don't even apply cleanly any more-- I wouldn't count on them making it in for .22

[18:46:31]

kormoc:

what's wrong with oss emulation?

[18:46:32]

cityLights:

too bad

[18:46:55]

sphery:

doesn't current 0.21-fixes also disable pulse on audio startup (if compiled with pulse support) or refuse to run if pulse is runnign and myth is compiled without pulse support?

[18:47:00]

cityLights:

I wan to ditch oss , as I read

[18:47:10]

sphery:

cityLights: OSS is just an API within the code we write

[18:47:21]

kormoc:

cityLights, using ALSA with oss emulation has no drawbacks afaik

[18:47:25]

sphery:

is makes /no/ difference whatsoever to what you install

[18:47:34]

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[18:47:35]

cityLights:

ok ok

[18:47:47]

cityLights:

I can use oss emulation in pulse

[18:47:58]

kormoc:

there's oss emulation in the kernel, no need for pulse

[18:48:14]

sphery:

It's like saying, "Too bad Myth uses Qt because I like GTK apps on my KDE desktop" (i.e. you need Qt for KDE, so it makes no difference that Myth uses Qt)

[18:48:16]

kormoc:

sphery, doesn't look like the pulse disable made it to 0.21 from a quick glance

[18:48:28]

sphery:

yeah, was just about too look

[18:48:31]

gbee:

myth think's it's using OSS but in reality on 99% of modern distros it's actually using Alsa

[18:48:50]

sphery:

now I'm longing for good OSS4 support, again

[18:48:57]

kormoc:

cityLights, so when 0.22 comes along, one of two things will happen. 1. Myth will refuse to run, 2. Myth will disable pulse and you still won't be able to get sound

[18:49:08]

gbee:

because Alsa is pretending to be OSS

[18:49:34]

sphery:

and ALSA's OSS emulation is actually better than the in-kernel's OSS

[18:49:44]

gbee:

kormoc: thought we were looking at disabling pulse while myth runs, which apparently is the official preferred method

[18:49:46]

cityLights:

playing out using pulse is the way I use mytht

[18:49:47]

iamlindoro:

Or we could just toss out the old framegrabbers and get a beer instead

[18:49:49]

sphery:

I.e. ALSA is a better OSS than the OSS in the kernel

[18:49:55]

sphery:

But OSS4 is better than the above

[18:50:13]

cityLights:

so I can use my bluetooth headphones when I am told to be quite

[18:50:16]

kormoc:

gbee, we try... but if pulse isn't compiled in, we just refuse to run

[18:50:19]

cityLights:

quiet

[18:50:32]

Dagmar:

cityLights: "quite crappy"? Was that the word you were looking for?

[18:50:50]

Dagmar:

Bluetooth audio tends to run the gamut from 'slightly bad' to 'completely shit quality'

[18:51:23]

cityLights:

have you tried a2dp?

[18:51:30]

cityLights:

I use it most often

[18:51:36]

cityLights:

you may have tried hsp

[18:51:38]

Dagmar:

When you get irritated about the lag causing the video and audio to be out of sync, remember to ask in #ubuntu-mythtv not here

[18:51:39]

gbee:

for watching TV I don't think I'd really care too muhc

[18:52:00]

cityLights:

nm

[18:52:16]

cityLights:

I think myth should move on to use alsa

[18:52:29]

Dagmar:

cityLights: Good thing it uses alsa then

[18:52:42]

cityLights:

without oss emulation

[18:52:44]

sebrock:

whoohooo sphery by a miracle it works again

[18:52:44]

cityLights:

anyway

[18:52:53]

sphery:

kormoc: it looks like pulse-disabling support /is/ in current -fixes: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/browser/branches/r . . . opulseutil.h

[18:52:55]

cityLights:

sphery: thanks

[18:52:59]

sphery:

sebrock: cool... what was the issue

[18:53:24]

Dagmar:

cityLights: It works without OSS emulation

[18:53:37]

cityLights:

pls buzz if you want me to test any patch

[18:53:47]

juski:

so, apparently nothing wrong with my house alarm, the sensor on zone 6 is allegedly fine. If it wakes me up at silly o'clock again I'll kill it

[18:53:48]

cityLights:

Dagmar: in fixes?

[18:53:57]

Dagmar:

cityLights: YES

[18:54:13]

Dagmar:

I've been using ALSA with 0.21-fixes for AGES now

[18:54:15]

juski:

since routing the cables is the only thing I didn't do myself I'll prolly redo them

[18:54:20]

cityLights:

I can set it to ALSA:card1 ?

[18:54:35]

Dagmar:

\You can set it to whatever the hell you told ALSA to recognize as a device name

[18:54:38]

sphery:

only if you define a logical device in ALSA called card1

[18:54:58]

sphery:

usually, you set audio /output/ device to ALSA:default

[18:55:01]

sebrock:

sphery, no it doesnt... It did work when I started it up manually though

[18:55:20]

cityLights:

I am well aware alsa output works

[18:55:26]

sphery:

note, though, that you can /not/ use ALSA anything for audio /input/ device--gotta use /dev/dsp (whatever) unless you patch Myth

[18:55:31]

cityLights:

I am reffering to alsa recording

[18:55:58]

cityLights:

does /dev/dsp support dnsnoop?

[18:56:02]

cityLights:

I think not

[18:56:02]

sphery:

sebrock: sounds like a user-permissions issue, then (assuming you have a directory and not a symlink)

[18:56:30]

cityLights:

so is another process uses /dev/dsp , then myth can't

[18:56:33]

sphery:

sebrock: and, even if you have 777 perms, it's possible you may not have permission to use it (if your system uses ACL's or whatever)

[18:56:51]

sphery:

cityLights: for /input/ you can't multiplex

[18:57:08]

sebrock:

sphery, it does, however starting it from /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend my storage is gone

[18:57:24]

sebrock:

starting with sudo mythbackend from terminal everything is OK

[18:57:25]

sphery:

cityLights: it makes sense to allow multiple apps to use an audio device for output and mix the audio in, but not to mix some other apps audio in for input

[18:57:27]

iamlindoro:

cityLights: It's really irrelevant focusing any effort towards framegrabber inputs-- it's obsolete technology

[18:57:40]

sphery:

sebrock: this is mythbuntu?

[18:57:59]

cityLights:

:-(

[18:58:07]

sphery:

sebrock: might want to ask in #ubuntu-mythtv since they'd know better how their distro is configured/how that script works

[18:58:41]

sebrock:

it is taken from ubutnu repo yes

[18:58:56]

iamlindoro:

Well that was an adequately vague answer

[19:00:13]

sphery:

kormoc: oh, though the pulse stuff went into -fixes, I should mention that you wouldn't know that from a quick glance since those commits didn't reference any of the pulse-related tickets :) (So only reason I found it was because I was 99.9% positive it was in there, so I just looked for the code.)

[19:00:48]

sebrock:

Ok, another question: can I delete everything connected to any recording ever made direclty in mySQL? All these things are old an does not exist on this system just in DB

[19:01:14]

sphery:

sebrock: the right answer is no

[19:01:51]

sebrock:

so there is no way of cleaning all these old things up?

[19:02:01]

sphery:

sebrock: if you want to delete all recordings, go into Watch Recordings in the All Programs list (highlight All Programs), then MENU|Add this group to the Playlist then MENU|Playlist Options|Delete

[19:02:19]

sphery:

it will delete everything nicely (unless you have metadata for which there are no files)

[19:02:48]

sebrock:

the latter is true, I need to get rid of metadata also

[19:02:54]

sphery:

then if you still have recordings files on disk when it's done deleting, you can rm them on the filesystem (i.e. for those files where metadata was missing)

[19:02:54]

sebrock:

and no files :P

[19:03:18]

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[19:03:57]

sphery:

if you then have metadata left in the DB, run: mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg -e "SELECT CONCAT('touch ', basename) FROM recorded;" | tail -n+2 > touch_files

[19:04:20]

sphery:

then go to any recordings directory and: sh touch_files

[19:04:31]

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[19:04:44]

sphery:

then go back to watch recordings and put all recordings in a playlist and delete

[19:04:51]

sphery:

but that will delete /everything/

[19:05:17]

sphery:

if you are deleting everything and know that there are missing files, you can do the mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg -e "SELECT CONCAT('touch ', basename) FROM recorded;" | tail -n+2 > touch_files

[19:05:21]

sphery:

first

[19:05:51]

sphery:

then it will delete one of the recordings files for those that now have dups (because they were in a different dir)

[19:06:09]

sphery:

but when you rm the recordings files it will fix that

[19:06:33]

sphery:

I should really say: mysql -umythtv -p mythconverg -e "SELECT CONCAT('touch ', basename) FROM recorded;" | tail -n+2 > $HOME/touch_files

[19:06:45]

sphery:

then I can say to execute sh $HOME/touch_files

[19:06:54]

sphery:

and directories aren't a problem

[19:07:50]

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[19:09:07]

sebrock:

I checked before and now everything in recorded is empty

[19:09:23]

sebrock:

maybe I managed to delete this anyway, or it cleaned up

[19:10:02]

sebrock:

chcked the startup script from ubuntu and everything is run by user mythtv

[19:10:21]

sebrock:

changing ownership of "recordings" didnt do anything

[19:10:34]

sebrock:

I find it really strange this

[19:11:32]

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[19:13:19]

sebrock:

infact, starting as anything but user mythtv seems to work lol

[19:14:58]

sphery:

sounds like the mythtv user account has problems

[19:18:06]

sebrock:

yup

[19:18:44]

sebrock:

but I can't find anything strange with it

[19:21:23]

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[19:41:29]

sphery:

iamlindoro: that would explain the number of users with broken DB's who "missed" updates to MV schema...

[19:41:35]

iamlindoro:

yeah

[19:41:42]

iamlindoro:

Dunno how that was missed for so long

[19:45:17]

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[19:45:57]

sphery:

well, since MV schema really hasn't changed much until just recently... ;)

[19:46:34]

iamlindoro:

Have it half fixed right now, but no way to test for a while

[19:50:15]

sphery:

could just walk out of work

[19:51:43]

janneg:

who's working on exporting recordings to mythvideo?

[19:52:23]

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[19:53:00]

sphery:

iamlindoro was (is?)

[19:53:10]

sphery:

don't know if the current approach is the external script or what

[19:53:53]

iamlindoro:

janneg: I was, but closed my own ticket on it because it was a messy way to do it, and Captain_Murdoch has something planned that will make it as simple as changing one field in the DB

[19:55:00]

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[19:55:31]

sphery:

so the current approach is that new script (from wagnerrp, right?)

[19:55:50]

wagnerrp:

thats what it says in the changeset

[19:56:00]

iamlindoro:

Yes, the script should work nicely for now

[19:56:08]

wagnerrp:

ive since updated the database tables so it aligns with the one iamlindoro used

[19:56:25]

Captain_Murdoch:

will be a little more complicated with the latest proposed schema. I'm also debating what to do about it. if libmythtv manages recorded -> recordedfile -> videofile, and MythVideo manages videometadata -> videopart -> videofile, then one or the other (MythTV vs MV) needs to know about the other in order to move a recording inbetween.

[19:56:33]

wagnerrp:

s/tables/lines/

[19:57:23]

sphery:

Captain_Murdoch: complicated isn't a problem-- iamlindoro loves a challenge :)

[19:57:34]

** iamlindoro gulps **

[19:57:38]

wagnerrp:

im fine with anything that doesnt block the interface during the file move

[19:58:33]

wagnerrp:

that was really the only motivation of making that script instead of iamlindoro's code

[19:58:48]

** kormoc waits for iamlindoro to have a beautiful mind moment, when the walls are covered in myth source code with random scribbling on them **

[19:58:56]

Captain_Murdoch:

iamlindoro, also need to put a little more though into the ProgramInfo refactor that Daniel is working on. ProgramInfo doesn't know about recorded, but it will need to know about seektable and metadata tables unless that code is kept in RecordingInfo. If it is kept in RecordingInfo, then that means we can't share the lookup/update code between MythVideo and MythTV because libmythtv isn't shared.

[19:59:40]

** iamlindoro rocks gently **

[20:01:02]

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[20:01:07]

Captain_Murdoch:

so we'd need a VideoInfo class in MV to read/write MV seektables. if we kept that logic in libmyth/ProgramInfo, then there would need to be a libmyth/dbcheck.cpp to maintain the videofile, videoseek, and videomarkup tables.

[20:01:45]

Captain_Murdoch:

letting MV access libmythtv sounds better to me as the days go by.

[20:02:22]

iamlindoro:

yeah

[20:02:56]

gbee:

Captain_Murdoch: certainly a lot simpler

[20:03:10]

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[20:04:49]

Captain_Murdoch:

otherwise we'd have to have a new schemaver for libmyth and have it start managing some tables or we split out the shared DB code in ProgramInfo into the new RecordedInfo and a new mythplugins/mythvideo/videoinfo.cpp

[20:04:57]

gbee:

I don't know what Daniel has in mind, but I always envisioned mythvideo using ProgramInfo as a way to cut down on code duplication and to get some symmetry between mythvideo and recordings, having to put video stuff in it's own class defeats the point as I see it

[20:05:16]

Captain_Murdoch:

gbee, that's what I'm thinking as well.

[20:06:05]

Captain_Murdoch:

I'm thinking we should just add a version # to libmythtv and let plugins use it.

[20:08:43]

gbee:

we can combine recorded and file markup tables if we create a another table or two to store filenames/starttime/chanid with a file id, I'm not certain that's the best approach, but it's a possibilty

[20:09:07]

kormoc:

(Database schema layout, it's a much better approach)

[20:10:04]

gbee:

kormoc: oh that much I know and it would have been done years ago but for the fact that Isaac didn't want a rationalised schema when I first raised it

[20:10:21]

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[20:10:28]

** kormoc blinks **

[20:10:45]

gbee:

I think because he didn't want the massive changes that a schema re-write would require, but you'd have to ask him

[20:10:48]

kormoc:

fair... nuff...

[20:10:49]

cityLights:

sphery: ?

[20:11:29]

sphery:

gbee: I think Captain_Murdoch's plan was to replace the chanid/starttime key with an autoincrement rowid type thing in recordedmarkup and recordedseek

[20:11:34]

gbee:

it would certainly require a lot of code changes and therefore the possibility of new bugs

[20:12:20]

sphery:

cityLights: I haven't had a chance to look at it, yet... it will be a while

[20:12:32]

gbee:

sphery: I saw him mention it, though it would probably be an auto-increment in the recorded table rather than recordmarkup, with a cross referencing column

[20:12:54]

sphery:

er, yeah... that too :)

[20:13:18]

gbee:

create a fileid column in recorded which is then used for recordedprogram, recordedmarkup, recordedseek – would save a lot of space

[20:13:28]

sphery:

I'm writing perl code again, so my language skills are low

[20:14:02]

sphery:

though his code will allow multiple files per recording, so recordedid or something, probably

[20:14:02]

gbee:

but do the same for mythvideo and you can then merge the tables and simply do lookups by fileid

[20:14:09]

sphery:

then in recordedfile a fileid

[20:14:30]

gbee:

yeah, forgot about recordedfile

[20:14:47]

sphery:

yeah, the table that's been unused for longer than any other was :)

[20:15:33]

Captain_Murdoch:

gbee, http://www.bc2va.org/chris/tmp/videofile.schema

[20:16:01]

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[20:16:55]

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[20:17:26]

Captain_Murdoch:

uses a common seek and a common markup, and adds ability for recordings to have multiple files (HD, SD, flv, etc.) and videos to have multiple files (part 1, part 2, etc.) without having to resort to childid.

[20:17:40]

gbee:

Captain_Murdoch: sorry, I should know that you were already two steps ahead :)

[20:17:49]

Captain_Murdoch:

I posted that the other night when you were asleep. :)

[20:17:58]

gbee:

heh

[20:19:35]

Captain_Murdoch:

thought was that a 'file' could be visible in both MythTV and MythVideo at the same time as well, and if deleted from either, it would only delete their own metadata unless the other was not using the file. we could use the isRecording and isVideo flags for that or delete them and use the existence of records in recordedfile and videopart as the flag to not delete the actual file if the other was using the file.

[20:20:55]

Captain_Murdoch:

moving a recording to MV is as simple as creating videometadata and videopart entries and deleting the recorded and recordedfile entries.

[20:21:39]

Captain_Murdoch:

another thought was that ProgramInfo's insert_program or StartedRecording could even insert those MV records itself at record time if the user wanted MythTV recordings to show up in MythVideo.

[20:21:41]

sphery:

meaning the dual-location things would likely be easy, too

[20:21:56]

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[20:22:14]

sphery:

just means making sure that the code that cleans up cleans up both locations for all files

[20:25:21]

Captain_Murdoch:

sphery, I'd prefer it to be common code. think Recording() and DeleteVideo() with both calling a common DeleteVideoFile() that could handle the "don't delete the file if it's still in use" logic.

[20:25:39]

Captain_Murdoch:

sorry, DeleteRecording().

[20:25:47]

Captain_Murdoch:

editted my comment before hitting enter and deleted too much. :

[20:26:09]

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[20:26:25]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: the scte65scan page is set up to automatically sort that table

[20:26:28]

sphery:

yeah, that's what I was trying to say

[20:26:53]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: No. It's set up to *allow* you to sort the table.

[20:26:54]

sphery:

so the code that cleans up cleans up both locations whether it's a recording or a videofile

[20:27:03]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: That entry was at the bottom, out of order by default.

[20:27:11]

iamlindoro:

but thanks for the correction

[20:33:33]

Captain_Murdoch:

sphery, yep, theoreticaly the ProgramInfo/RecordingInfo split could still happen, but if we want things like allowing MythTV to auto-insert a video, then there would be code in RecordingInfo that inserted into videometadata and videopart when it populates the recorded table.

[20:34:08]

Captain_Murdoch:

who's taking notes so we can send them to Daniel for comment? :)

[20:34:16]

** Captain_Murdoch looks around... **

[20:34:24]

** iamlindoro ducks **

[20:34:32]

** kormoc gooses **

[20:34:35]

** Captain_Murdoch clicks 'save buffer' on the menu. **

[20:34:58]

Captain_Murdoch:

and notices it's now called 'save text'

[20:41:35]

juski:

how do you reset the play speed in mythmusic?

[20:43:45]

iamlindoro:

ctrl-alt-bkspc ;) Resets it to 0

[20:44:06]

juski:

ahahahaha

[20:44:26]

juski:

looks like the progress bar is broken with timestretch turned on

[20:44:55]

iamlindoro:

We need to get you to commit your rotate stuff before this progress bar eats your soul :)

[20:45:23]

juski:

it was prolly broken when the timestretch stuff was done

[20:45:36]

juski:

ahem. or maybe I really am incompetent

[20:46:11]

iamlindoro:

They have diapers for that

[20:46:20]

iamlindoro:

oh... inCOMPetent

[20:46:25]

iamlindoro:

;)

[20:46:38]

cityLights:

today I met a prof. in the chemestry dept.

[20:46:55]

cityLights:

me: you can use WPA which is safe

[20:47:10]

cityLights:

him: do you want me to show you how to factor that?

[20:47:17]

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[20:47:20]

juski:

okay what did somebody set as the play speed setting name?

[20:47:20]

cityLights:

me: what you can crack that

[20:48:07]

cityLights:

so I will try not to mess aournd with any chemestry prof. in the future

[20:50:17]

cityLights:

does anyone here gets network issues from google?

[20:50:21]

Captain_Murdoch:

wagnerrp, for the file move between MythTV and MV, I'd probably do that using the internal migration job in the JobQueue. with the ability to copy a file using one read RingBuffer and write using another, it's fairly simple.

[20:50:43]

juski:

heh it's not a permanent setting. phew

[20:50:48]

Captain_Murdoch:

s/the internal migration/an internal migration/ (I have a patch but would tweak it to use RingBuffers)

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[20:59:56]

kormoc:

Captain_Murdoch, wagnerrp raised an interesting point, it would suck if that migration locked the UI

[21:00:18]

iamlindoro:

If it's in the jobqueue, though, it shouldn't

[21:00:28]

kormoc:

whoops

[21:00:31]

kormoc:

missed that detail

[21:00:39]

iamlindoro:

:)

[21:01:01]

Captain_Murdoch:

:)

[21:01:33]

Captain_Murdoch:

and since the SG read search code falls back, you'd still be able to read the file during the migration.

[21:01:51]

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[21:03:24]

Captain_Murdoch:

I think my original idea was to have the JobQueue update the SG in the DB once the file was moved, so we shouldn't be looking in the wrong place to begin with.

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[21:13:49]

juski:

this thing is just frickin mocking me now

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[21:30:38]

gbee:

someone ported webkit to GTK? *sigh*

[21:31:20]

juski:

this is not supposed to happen

[21:31:23]

sphery:

So how long do you think it will be after Drizzle comes out that users start trying to run Myth on Drizzle instead of MySQL?

[21:31:44]

sphery:

(Drizzle = lightweight fork of MySQL that removes many of the heavy-weight features of MySQL 5.0)

[21:31:48]

juski:

maxTime=89, sensible. used remains 0. W T F

[21:32:07]

wagnerrp:

i want to run my mythtv database on the cloud!

[21:32:14]

sphery:

gbee: now someone just needs to port webkit to XUL :)

[21:32:15]

wagnerrp:

it will improve speed and reliability

[21:32:29]

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[21:32:30]

wagnerrp:

the voices in my head told me so

[21:32:50]

sphery:

heh, isn't MythTV on the cloud just illegal downloading of pirated video? ;)

[21:33:25]

iamlindoro:

sphery, wagnerrp: Then we can finally have that distributed commflagging we've all been dying for!

[21:33:31]

wagnerrp:

no, thats mythtv in the bay

[21:34:22]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: that cluster of IONs might actually manage real time commflagging

[21:34:29]

iamlindoro:

Heh

[21:34:50]

iamlindoro:

I was depressed to see that someone referred to 40% realtime commflagging on ION as acceptable

[21:34:58]

iamlindoro:

but I guess people are inclined to believe what they wish

[21:35:17]

kormoc:

sphery, about last week? *pokes at drizzle.kormoc.com:3306*

[21:35:40]

juski:

oh ffs I give up on this

[21:35:49]

juski:

it's *simple* frigging code

[21:36:01]

juski:

yet it's just not doing what it's sposed to do

[21:36:04]

kormoc:

juski, what's the types?

[21:36:09]

juski:

ints

[21:36:39]

juski:

it was working before I put the if > 0 bit

[21:36:55]

juski:

but even after reverting that, it's not working damnit

[21:36:56]

sphery:

Heh, true in a nutshell is good... Hadn't seen that before.

[21:36:59]

kormoc:

maxtime>0 bit?

[21:37:14]

juski:

hang on I'll pastebin it

[21:38:19]

juski:

http://pastebin.ca/1534343

[21:38:20]

sphery:

kormoc: you're not really using Drizzle with myth are you?

[21:38:51]

kormoc:

sphery, my test drizzle database does hold a copy of my myth database and mythweb has been run against it

[21:39:03]

kormoc:

it's not a live run, but it's been poked at

[21:39:37]

sphery:

I would have thought that--espeically now that we're including MySQL 5 stuff in queries--it wouldn't work.

[21:39:57]

kormoc:

I don't know bout the backend, but a majority of mythweb runs fine

[21:40:18]

sphery:

well, I'm sure we'll find out how well it works before long

[21:40:59]

iamlindoro:

someone can start their own repos and we can troubleshoot for people running 0.22-drizzle

[21:41:09]

kormoc:

sphery, I don't honestly know of any drizzle changes that would have broken anything to be honest

[21:41:17]

wagnerrp:

fo shizzle

[21:42:05]

kormoc:

http://drizzle.org/wiki/MySQL_Differences#Objects_Removed

[21:42:09]

kormoc:

it's not that many changes

[21:42:29]

sphery:

really?

[21:42:38]

sphery:

and it's still a lot more lightweight?

[21:42:47]

iamlindoro:

Don't we need prepared statements?

[21:42:48]

kormoc:

it's not /that/ lightweight

[21:42:52]

kormoc:

iamlindoro, nope

[21:42:54]

wagnerrp:

aside from scheduling, what sql access is there that really takes much time?

[21:43:08]

sphery:

we use prepared statements a lot, but it's possible that the driver could fake them

[21:43:14]

iamlindoro:

mythfilldb is a bucket of hurt

[21:43:20]

sid3windr:

fo drizzle my nizzle

[21:43:56]

wagnerrp:

yeah, but who cares how long mythfilldb takes, because it is not interactive

[21:44:05]

sphery:

kormoc: now this was a bold move: Commands Removed: REPAIR TABLE

[21:44:29]

kormoc:

sphery, not when you read that they made myisam a temp only table and innodb/xtradb is the default engine

[21:44:39]

sphery:

we do use some SHOW stuff for the MySQL version and DB checks

[21:44:52]

kormoc:

that is the main issue I've had with mythweb stuff is the now innodb and it's quarks

[21:45:49]

sphery:

ah, so if no myisam, not a problem

[21:46:08]

sphery:

(or no "real" myisam)

[21:46:22]

kormoc:

exactly

[21:46:52]

sphery:

"There is no Windows version" :)

[21:46:57]

juski:

christ on a bike. I've made distclean on the whole lot, rebuilt mythtv, redone the plugins. I just don't get it

[21:47:03]

iamlindoro:

ExherbSQL

[21:47:23]

kormoc:

sphery, the real 'lightness' so far has come from code removal and consolidation, not really on resources/speed (yet)

[21:47:30]

juski:

it's like currentTime isn't ever being updated at all

[21:47:47]

kormoc:

and a lot of revising mysqlisms and changing them to standards/rethinking if they're valid or not/etc

[21:47:49]

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[21:48:35]

sphery:

kormoc: ah... I can see how removing all those storage engines could be helpful--though most servers probably have the majority of those disabled, anyway

[21:48:46]

kormoc:

you'd be surprised

[21:49:22]

sphery:

I got the impression it was being billed as lightweight at runtime, so I was wondering how they were doing that with the changes they list

[21:49:24]

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[21:49:49]

kormoc:

sphery, they plan to make it more lightweight at runtime later, right now is spring cleaning before the renovation

[21:50:04]

juski:

what? currentTime IS incrementing.. so why? arghhh. cry

[21:51:10]

kormoc:

juski, I'd give http://pastebin.ca/1534358 a try if I was you :)

[21:52:37]

juski:

me & my schoolboy errors

[21:52:51]

juski:

doesn't answer the question of why this was working earlier

[21:53:04]

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[21:53:22]

kormoc:

does that work?

[21:53:44]

juski:

nope

[21:53:48]

kormoc:

sad

[21:54:15]

juski:

hrm

[21:54:16]

kormoc:

what's the values we're dealing with, 0 to 6450?

[21:54:35]

juski:

need to deal with more ideally

[21:54:43]

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[21:54:50]

itay:

Hi,

[21:54:50]

itay:

I managed to install my DVB-T USB TV STICK (af9015 chipset) on ubuntu jaunty and it works fine with vlc media player. But I want to use mythtv to watch TV since it ables to record, pause and many more. I configured mythtv with mythtv-setup command and then launched mythfrontend. I could see only video and no audio. Mythtv uses "ALSA:default" as the audio output device, and "ALSA:default" as the mixer device. Morever, I couldn't play an

[21:54:50]

itay:

mp3 file with the mythmusic plugin.

[21:54:50]

itay:

Another issue with mythtv is that when switching channels mythtv freezes with a message that I have gotten a channel lock, and then a video error message. Nothing like this happens to me on vlc.

[21:54:51]

kormoc:

a hour?

[21:54:52]

itay:

Any ideas would be very appreciated !

[21:55:00]

** kormoc blinks **

[21:55:08]

juski:

kormoc: an hour would be sufficient I reckon

[21:55:11]

kormoc:

I think I was just text assaulted

[21:55:14]

juski:

brain is fuddled

[21:55:30]

kormoc:

juski, and it's in seconds right?

[21:55:35]

juski:

yeah

[21:56:09]

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[21:57:23]

juski:

how on earth was this ever working? confused now

[21:57:57]

sphery:

itay: verify that your volumes are set properly--i.e. not muted for PCM and Master. If you have one of these fancy new "High Definition Audio" chipsets, you may actually have the problem that there is no PCM and no Master channel, in which case you either have to create one or use /dev/dsp and /dev/mixer rather than ALSA:default

[21:58:15]

sphery:

using /dev/dsp stuff requires loading the ALSA OSS compatibility modules

[21:58:51]

sphery:

itay: and the "shoudl have gotten a lock" means you likely need to increase your timeouts in mythtv-setup

[21:58:58]

itay:

sphery: the volumes of the two mixers are 100% and I have PCM and Master Channel in alsa

[21:59:25]

itay:

oh ok thanks about the lock sphery, how about 2 seconds for signal timeout, is it ok ?

[21:59:26]

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[22:00:39]

sphery:

itay: whatever it currently is is not enough :)

[22:00:42]

kormoc:

juski, I got it

[22:00:47]

sphery:

itay: make sure, also, that your channels aren't muted

[22:01:01]

itay:

ok sphery, I have already checked that ...

[22:01:22]

itay:

sphery: do you have any other suggestions about the audio problem? do you need some outputs ?

[22:01:56]

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[22:02:01]

sphery:

itay: you should read the frontend logs to see why it says you're not getting audio

[22:02:17]

sphery:

itay: if there are no errors, that likely means you are getting audio, but aren't hearing it

[22:02:19]

kormoc:

juski, http://pastebin.ca/1534370

[22:02:37]

sphery:

(for one reason or another--i.e. the plumbing between mythfrontend and the speakers isn't working)

[22:02:50]

sphery:

could be any of the software/drivers/hardware between the two

[22:03:28]

itay:

I get now this message sphery: 2009-08–19 01:02:35.790 NVP: Disabling Audio, params(0,-1,-1)

[22:03:36]

itay:

why is that sphery ?

[22:03:55]

kormoc:

juski, Here's the POC, http://pastebin.ca/1534373

[22:04:00]

sphery:

becaues of the error that appears in the log right before that

[22:04:08]

itay:

I can't find it

[22:04:24]

sphery:

please pastebin the logs ( http://pastebin.ca/ or equivalent)

[22:04:29]

sphery:

frontend log

[22:06:00]

itay:

here it is shpery, http://pastebin.com/m42c053e0, and thanks for your time !

[22:06:32]

juski:

kormoc: ah, so that it ever worked was a fluke

[22:06:41]

juski:

thanks! :)

[22:07:51]

juski:

not done much maths in c++

[22:07:54]

juski:

obviously

[22:09:25]

juski:

I think I understand *why* it didn't work now. types & rounding

[22:09:43]

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[22:11:04]

sphery:

juski: kormoc's first one was /very/ close but he had an extra 100 in there: percentplayed = currentTime * 100 / maxTime;

[22:11:31]

itay:

well sphery, the timeout thing did the trick, thanks !

[22:11:37]

itay:

now just the audio problem

[22:11:39]

sphery:

juski: i.e. don't multiply the denominator by 100

[22:12:10]

juski:

still doesn't answer why it was working before though

[22:12:37]

juski:

not installing it would be one way, but I *had* done that

[22:14:14]

itay:

sphery, do u have any last ideas ?

[22:14:32]

sphery:

itay: either your ALSA configuration is broken (and you haven't configured it to allow 44.1kHz audio) or the version of Myth you're using doesn't have support for the audio type used in your MPEG-4 video

[22:14:37]

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[22:14:42]

sphery:

itay: I don't know much of anything about MPEG-4

[22:14:47]

sphery:

others here can help you more with that

[22:15:01]

itay:

how do I configure it to allow 44.1kHz audio ?

[22:15:20]

itay:

in .asoundrc ?

[22:15:36]

sphery:

itay: also, you should change your playback profile group from CPU+ to Slim (3rd page of TV Playback settings)

[22:15:49]

itay:

I use CPU--

[22:16:12]

sphery:

well, that one isn't ideal, either

[22:16:20]

sphery:

if your system can support software decoding, use Slim

[22:16:28]

sphery:

if not... best of luck?

[22:16:49]

gbee:

juski: essentially you had might end up with 0.xxx since it's an int we ignore everything after the decimal place, leaving just zero

[22:16:51]

itay:

I cannot, because I need the progressive video scan which as I understand, can be set under CPU--

[22:17:16]

kormoc:

sphery, doh, I was pondering if I needed both or not, but didn't actually scribble down any numbers

[22:17:20]

sphery:

and, yeah, configuring ALSA means modifying an ALSA config file (either /etc/asound.conf or ~/.asoundrc), but the default definitions used for default should do proper conversion for all sound cards now

[22:18:17]

sphery:

kormoc: need to get the numerator much higher than the denominator so that the result is > 1 , and since we want a percent (* 100), we can do that by just multiplying the numerator first

[22:18:26]

kormoc:

yeah

[22:18:57]

itay:

sphery, I still cannot understand why vlc can play sounds and mythtv cannot

[22:19:02]

sphery:

you had the right problem identified, but making the denominator bigger meant that we were going back to <1

[22:19:19]

kormoc:

yeah

[22:19:26]

juski:

anyway it works brilliantly now. and that means I can get back on the theme train tomorrow :)

[22:19:28]

sphery:

itay: different code used to play back doing different things and using different configurations :)

[22:19:42]

juski:

tested resuming playback.. no nasty errors now.

[22:20:10]

juski:

gbee: still getting the occasional seek error from the flac files but I guess that's the fault of the ffmpeg libs

[22:20:19]

juski:

nothing audible, just log output

[22:20:39]

juski:

I mean the seek error doesn't manifest as an audible problem, just log output

[22:20:50]

itay:

oh :( ok thanks for your help, I will try to google more (about another 6 hours) and then I will probably eventually despair

[22:21:11]

sphery:

itay: make sure that your version of Myth has support for the codec you're using

[22:21:16]

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[22:21:22]

itay:

sphery: what codec ?

[22:21:36]

juski:

I think itay has the same problem as guysoft42

[22:21:39]

sphery:

itay: I think it's likely not the rate issue since that shouldn't be a problem on a modern system unless you have edited and broken your ALSA config

[22:21:51]

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[22:22:00]

itay:

sphery: I am using the latest version 0.21 and I didn't touch my alsa configuration

[22:22:24]

sphery:

itay: since you're doing H.264, chances are you're using some HD audio format like AAC that you need Myth built a specific way to use

[22:22:27]

juski:

sphery: I think dvb-t in italy is using mpeg4 audio.. which IIRC needs AAC

[22:22:38]

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[22:22:59]

juski:

and guess what – the debian multimedia repo version of 0.21 isn't built with it

[22:23:00]

sphery:

juski: thanks... I know nothing about it except that it's likely his Myth doesn't have support for the audio his streams have

[22:23:09]

itay:

sphery: OK I'll try that, I meant to compile mythtv anyway, so I'll do it, thanks again

[22:23:16]

juski:

oh wait. isn't mythbuntu built with everything now, even libfaac ?

[22:23:27]

sphery:

itay: if you hang around here, you can find someone else who knows more about it

[22:23:29]

juski:

I forgot about that earlier today

[22:25:04]

sphery:

gbee: looks like the qFatal() has a line in the bt, so you can follow the address to Thread1 and see more details

[22:25:34]

sphery:

gbee: though you may well know that and be disappointed that you get MythUIButtonTree::SetTreeState at /usr/include/QtCore/qlist.h:395 type stuff

[22:26:24]

juski:

right. and that as they say, makes it time for bed. night all

[22:27:27]

sphery:

night

[22:28:32]

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[22:40:20]

itay:

sphery, from googling it seems that this problem is common among users of the fixes mythtv branch

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[22:59:09]

gbee:

sphery: yeah it's the "at qlist.h:395" that I was disappointed by, normally that breakpoint yields better info, that said the type of error and the variables listed suggested only one possibility, I just couldn't initially see how the route list would come to be empty

[23:01:28]

gbee:

strangely the original backtrace gave just as much info, so I'm wondering if something has changed in QT which might explain why that breakpoint isn't nearly as useful as it once was

[23:01:55]

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[23:01:58]

gbee:

maybe they've started printing out more useful errors, I should have ask iamlindoro for the log

[23:02:41]

iamlindoro:

You'll get it anyway this time :)

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[23:04:55]

gbee:

if I'm right the patch will fix it and I won't need it :)

[23:05:19]

iamlindoro:

you need it ;)

[23:05:27]

iamlindoro:

Though I don't think it will help much

[23:05:53]

iamlindoro:

http://mythtv.pastebin.ca/1534440

[23:06:13]

iamlindoro:

So the last three lines are odd

[23:06:41]

sphery:

that's mathematically impossible... up to 2 of the last 3 could be odd... ;)

[23:06:55]

iamlindoro:

because after selecting Season 1, it shoudl select the item node... but it doesn't... each of the last three lines corresponds to a press of the right arrow

[23:07:01]

sphery:

I'll be quiet now

[23:07:40]

iamlindoro:

so you see an unselected list of the movie items in the middle, then it's alone on the left, then (then you would have nothing at all), segfault

[23:08:23]

iamlindoro:

So the "directory" nodes get selected, but once I get as deep as the "item" ones, they don't

[23:08:27]

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[23:09:07]

iamlindoro:

Note that I can select the items in the "Movies" node, that works perfectly

[23:09:20]

iamlindoro:

so it doesn't *seem* like it's in how I build the list, but in how deep the items are

[23:09:55]

gbee:

can you reproduce with a standard directory browse?

[23:10:05]

josh_:

I only have one analog tuner on my backend. Is it possible to set the priority level of a recording schedule so that it won't interrupt if someone is watching liveTV, but it will record if the tuner is not being used?

[23:11:37]

gbee:

iamlindoro: I've created trees 12 items deep and it works fine

[23:11:38]

iamlindoro:

gbee, ugh, no.

[23:11:39]

sphery:

josh_: nope

[23:11:54]

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[23:11:57]

iamlindoro:

gbee, Can't see what I'm doing wrong, though, adding items to both root nodes the exact same way

[23:12:04]

iamlindoro:

gbee, one works, the other doesn't

[23:12:31]

sphery:

josh_: Myth assumes that recordings where you said "I want to watch this" are always higher priority than LiveTV. The best solution is more capture cards.

[23:12:32]

gbee:

iamlindoro: tomorrow I'll play with the patch installed and see what I can find

[23:12:48]

iamlindoro:

okay, thanks

[23:13:04]

josh_:

sphery, Sounds good, figured it was worth asking :)

[23:13:30]

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[23:13:39]

sphery:

josh_: you might have more options with digital capture depending on where you live, but generally without at least 2 capture cards, it won't always work.

[23:13:58]

josh_:

sphery, I've actually got another dual tuner card, I just need to free up a PCI slot on my backend.

[23:14:01]

sphery:

this is how our MythTV systems become such wonderfully huge monsters... we keep adding to them.

[23:14:12]

josh_:

sphery, digital is a sore subject in my area

[23:14:21]

sphery:

even just replacing the single-tuner card with the dual would help :)

[23:14:37]

sphery:

really? Even in the USA.

[23:14:48]

sphery:

I'm guessing it's because of that comcast...

[23:14:49]

josh_:

sphery, mythtv-setup only "finds" about 10 channels, hdhomerun_config finds about 50

[23:14:53]

josh_:

sphery, ding!

[23:15:00]

josh_:

weit

[23:15:02]

josh_:

wait

[23:15:10]

sphery:

have you tried scte65scan ?

[23:15:17]

josh_:

I've never heard of that.

[23:15:57]

sphery:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Comcast_Users_And_scte65scan

[23:16:04]

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[23:16:05]

sphery:

don't know that it helps as I don't feed the cable monsters

[23:16:16]

josh_:

Before the "epic conversion of 2009", I had manually added all my digital channels to the database. It worked until Comcast restructured their channel lineup

[23:16:23]

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[23:16:27]

josh_:

sphery, you do everything over broadcast?

[23:16:32]

sphery:

OTA ftw!

[23:17:01]

sphery:

I'd rather not be able to watch a channel--even one with some good stuff like NGC--than pay for encrypted cable TV

[23:17:24]

sphery:

I do like The Universe, but I may just buy it on DVD :)

[23:17:25]

josh_:

I'm seriously considering setting up one of my digital tuners on an OTA antenna.

[23:17:42]

josh_:

Not sure if that would make things more complicated than they already are though

[23:17:52]

sphery:

I figure if I save $40/mo on cable TV subscription for basic cable, I can then spend $480/yr on DVD sets of TV shows

[23:18:02]

sphery:

(or blu-ray, but I'm not feeding that monster, either :)

[23:18:37]

sphery:

and since most of cable seems to be garbage, I'm actually coming out way ahead

[23:18:57]

kormoc:

sphery, you should look into connections sometime :)

[23:18:59]

sphery:

(especially compared to some of my friends who pay $60 or $80 for the cable TV portion of their cable bill)

[23:19:00]

gbee:

heh, new PS3 uses only 1/3 the power of the old one and is also 1/3 the size, with twice the standard diskspace

[23:19:19]

josh_:

sphery, I'm only interested in a few channels being HD. Sadly, I have to subscribe to a "package" full of channels I dont want/need

[23:19:29]

sphery:

kormoc: that actually sounded interesting... Might have to buy the series

[23:19:55]

sphery:

gbee: nice... A friend was just about to buy a new one, but waited because of that one's near-term release

[23:19:56]

kormoc:

sphery, amazing, but alas the series is quite costly

[23:20:15]

josh_:

sphery, I think it's quite funny

[23:20:20]

sphery:

josh_: yeah, that's why I have some friends paying $80 or so for their TV

[23:20:21]

kormoc:

$150ish per set

[23:20:39]

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[23:20:46]

mattwj2002:

hi guys

[23:20:49]

josh_:

during the broadcast analog/digital conversion, comcast was advertising "our customers don't need to do a thing"

[23:20:49]

mattwj2002:

I need help

[23:20:57]

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[23:20:59]

josh_:

but apparently now they're switching to digital also

[23:21:26]

sphery:

kormoc: wow... pretyy costly, but still only 4mos of cable for the cheap $40/mo (before taxes and fees) basic cable

[23:21:34]

mattwj2002:

first off how can I tell what WINTV card I have without opening up my box?

[23:22:06]

mattwj2002:

I think it is a PVR-350

[23:22:16]

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[23:22:27]

kormoc:

sphery, donno if these are the ones you are thinking of, but: http://www.amazon.com/Connections-1-James-Bur . . . 7&sr=8-2

[23:22:27]

sphery:

mattwj2002: if you want to tell if it's a worthwhile one (i.e. Hauppauge WinTV PVR-x50 or PVR-500), just look at what module is loaded. ivtv = good

[23:22:50]

sphery:

mattwj2002: if you know it's ivtv and want to know which one, check the dmesg output after loading the module (often in some log file)

[23:23:15]

sphery:

kormoc: yeah, that's the one

[23:23:18]

gbee:

sphery: almost tempted, but then I have to wonder when I'd have the time to play games, it would suck my time like nothing else and then I think at least the time I spend on MythTV is productive, I have something to show for it

[23:23:29]

sphery:

that is expensive

[23:23:35]

kormoc:

sphery, so sadly, there's 10 sets, but I've only managed to find the first three :(

[23:23:35]

sphery:

all 3 for $405, though :)

[23:23:39]

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[23:23:39]

mattwj2002:

correction

[23:23:45]

mattwj2002:

it is a PVR-500

[23:23:55]

mattwj2002:

anyways here is the problem

[23:24:10]

sphery:

gbee: and far more importantly, /we/ have something to show for your time on MythTV... :) (Big thanks for your time, BTW.)

[23:24:23]

sphery:

now I'm feeling guilty for having an XBox 360

[23:24:32]

mattwj2002:

I can't adjust the volume on live tv

[23:24:33]

mattwj2002:

:(

[23:24:50]

sphery:

mattwj2002: chances are there's an error message in your frontend log

[23:24:55]

mattwj2002:

I turn the volume up and down on the remote and it stays the same

[23:24:56]

josh_:

sphery, I've a 360 that hasnt even been plugged in for 6 months now

[23:24:58]

** kormoc gasps **

[23:25:00]

mattwj2002:

okay

[23:25:19]

sphery:

mattwj2002: either something about a non-existent device (like /dev/dsp whatever) or missing controls (like Master and/or PCM)

[23:25:19]

josh_:

mattwj2002, irw showing correct output when the keys are pressed?

[23:25:23]

kormoc:

who could dare defy the volume control!

[23:25:45]

gbee:

I just threw out my original xbox, it had been gathering dust in a corner for, well years

[23:25:52]

sphery:

josh_: I have my 3rd 360--just got a replacement back after RRoD #2 (and only 6-mos before the end of my 3-yr warranty)

[23:26:04]

sphery:

so this will likely be my last

[23:26:08]

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[23:26:17]

mattwj2002:

one momemt I'll check

[23:26:33]

josh_:

sphery, ewww. Lucliky I havent had any issues with mine. I just don't use it. Know of anything interesting I can use it for without having it modded?

[23:26:36]

josh_:

other than games, of course

[23:26:53]

sphery:

kormoc: wow... didn't realize that connections 1 was 1978

[23:27:02]

kormoc:

josh_, so... just perhaps the lack of issues is from the lack of use?

[23:27:08]

mattwj2002:

irw recongizes the keys

[23:27:22]

josh_:

kormoc, sounds logical :)

[23:27:23]

kormoc:

sphery, yeah! I grew up on them, oh how I miss them

[23:27:29]

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[23:27:55]

kormoc:

"Breaking News, Microsoft has the answer to the RRoD problem. Stop using your xbox and it won't break"

[23:27:56]

sphery:

josh_: I only do games... It's basically useless for video playback with content that Myth records (it won't do MPEG-2 without special "approved by MS Windows" wrapper-ing)

[23:29:02]

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[23:29:47]

sphery:

kormoc: seems this one is /much/ cheaper, though (only $16.49 & eligible for free shipping): http://www.amazon.com/Connections-James-Burke . . . 4&sr=8-3

[23:29:53]

mattwj2002:

hey guys

[23:29:56]

mattwj2002:

I found this

[23:30:01]

sphery:

kormoc: can't find the Myst-style game for sale, though

[23:30:05]

kormoc:

sphery, hehe :)

[23:30:16]

mattwj2002:

ALSA lib control.c:909:(snd_ctl_open_noupdate) Invalid CTL /dev/mixer

[23:30:20]

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[23:30:47]

sphery:

mattwj2002: when using ALSA:default for audio output device you must use ALSA:default for Mixer device

[23:30:54]

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[23:31:01]

mattwj2002:

nice

[23:31:04]

mattwj2002:

:)

[23:31:07]

kormoc:

sphery, ooh? http://www.amazon.com/Myst-10th-Anniversary-D . . . 6&sr=1-1

[23:31:39]

sphery:

kormoc: now I have to get this too: http://www.amazon.com/Day-Universe-Changed-Ja . . . 4&sr=8-8

[23:31:45]

kormoc:

yeah!

[23:31:57]

kormoc:

James Burke++

[23:34:18]

sphery:

kormoc: I have the Myst game Riven, still. The big problem with it is it uses QT2 (yes, version 2) and newer QT won't work with it. I wonder if they updated it for the collection to use newer. (Fortunately, if you install new QT, then QT2, it works--they don't stomp over each other's stuff. If you install QT2 then QT-current, QT-current removes/replaces QT2 for you.)

[23:34:35]

kormoc:

ouch

[23:34:49]

mattwj2002:

it works!

[23:34:50]

mattwj2002:

:D

[23:34:50]

sphery:

that took way too long to figure out when I wanted to use it

[23:36:01]

josh_:

sphery, It doesnt seem as though scte65scan will "find" any more channels, is that correct? It just seems to properly identify the ones that already exist?

[23:37:04]

kormoc:

sphery, http://www.amazon.com/Connections-box/dp/B000 . . . 9&sr=1-1

[23:37:46]

** kormoc ponders **

[23:37:52]

kormoc:

It's too bad it's not on steam

[23:39:50]

sphery:

$0.71? What's the choice?

[23:39:58]

sphery:

(Oh, yeah, the $20 S&H :)

[23:40:01]

** kormoc laughs **

[23:40:58]

sphery:

josh_: that's probably true, but it's definitely worth trying it out

[23:41:10]

sphery:

assuming they have deployed scte65 in your area

[23:41:57]

** sphery can't figure out why the recording previews in MythWeb aren't working for a few users on -users list **

[23:43:00]

kormoc:

nor can I

[23:43:54]

sphery:

have you been following the thread (at least the preview part of it--I'm ignoring the rest)

[23:44:30]

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[23:46:20]

wagnerrp:

sphery: thats the big problem with buying HDDVDs

[23:46:31]

wagnerrp:

often the S&H is more than the disk itself

[23:46:43]

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[23:46:50]

acidchild:

hello, :-) i havea AVertTV HD A180, follow pretty much all documentation i can find on google and on the website. xawtv works but when i go to watch tv in mythtv, it just flashs to the wallpaper then back to the menu

[23:46:55]

acidchild:

ps2 and cable shows up if i use the red/white/yellow cables.

[23:47:04]

acidchild:

any ideas? i have Digita cablebox -> AUX -> A180

[23:47:33]

wagnerrp:

acidchild: you should not be using a cablebox in-line with a digital tuner

[23:48:18]

wagnerrp:

and you should not be using the A180 for analog video

[23:48:27]

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[23:48:48]

acidchild:

its a digital HD cable box. should i just run the cable coax from the digital box to the back of the PCI card?

[23:49:17]

wagnerrp:

you connect a digital tuner directly to the antenna, or directly to the input line

[23:49:30]

wagnerrp:

you do not have another box (aside from an amplifier) in line with the tuner

[23:49:59]

acidchild:

;s i dunno what an amplifier in relation to this is.

[23:50:14]

wagnerrp:

amplifier, something that amplifies the signal

[23:50:17]

acidchild:

i just got a Rogers cable box that has everything from DVI to S-video out.

[23:50:27]

wagnerrp:

usually you use one if you have more than a couple devices on your cable line

[23:50:28]

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[23:50:52]

wagnerrp:

beyond that, you probably havent bothered to scan for channels

[23:51:16]

sphery:

wagnerrp: heh, but still likely cheaper than buying the BD-ROM's

[23:51:21]

acidchild:

'bothered' is a harsh term, i've been at this since 9m ;x

[23:51:30]

wagnerrp:

in fact, you should not have been able to scan for channels if you were running through the cablebox

[23:51:41]

wagnerrp:

as the cablebox would be outputing its own modulated signal

[23:52:08]

wagnerrp:

and would block any passthrough digital signal you may have otherwise received

[23:52:34]

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[23:53:11]

sphery:

acidchild: you're plugging the cable line directly into the A180?

[23:53:24]

acidchild:

no, via the HD box i got from my provider.

[23:53:30]

wagnerrp:

'<acidchild> any ideas? i have Digita cablebox -> AUX -> A180'

[23:53:33]

sphery:

if you're trying to do analog capture (capture of the STB's output), you really don't want an A180

[23:53:42]

acidchild:

cable from wall -> HD digital box -> A180

[23:53:51]

acidchild:

via red/white/yellow atm, but thats not fun

[23:53:56]

wagnerrp:

according to the wiki, you cannot use the analog capture ports on the A180 under linux

[23:53:57]

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[23:54:09]

sphery:

acidchild: you really want either a Hauppauge PVR-150 or PVR-500 or an HVR-1600

[23:54:12]

acidchild:

the analog ports work best =O

[23:54:18]

acidchild:

not the cable though

[23:54:19]

wagnerrp:

whether that has changed or not, that is a framegrabber, and you dont want to use it anyway

[23:54:30]

acidchild:

okey :/

[23:54:50]

wagnerrp:

like sphery said, you need to connect the cable directly to the RF input on that card

[23:54:50]

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[23:54:54]

kormoc:

and you wasted a lot of money on the digital part if you're not going to use it

[23:54:54]

sphery:

just plug the cable into the A180 and then set it up as a digital card

[23:55:04]

wagnerrp:

you should have the card set up as a DVB tuner in mythtv

[23:55:11]

wagnerrp:

mythtv-setup

[23:55:11]

acidchild:

okey.

[23:55:17]

acidchild:

yep, i'll try that. :D

[23:55:18]

sphery:

and then you can give back your HD digital box

[23:55:26]

wagnerrp:

youre going to have to scan for channels, should be QAM-256

[23:55:28]

sphery:

and then live with whatever the cable co gives you unencrypted

[23:55:38]

wagnerrp:

and youre likely only going to get a couple channels (the rest will be encrypted)

[23:55:49]

acidchild:

urg..............

[23:55:54]

wagnerrp:

if you want the encrypted channels, get an mpeg encoder such as the PVR cards sphery mentioned

[23:55:55]

sphery:

or you can get a PVR-x50/500 or HVR-1600 and capture standard-def analog output of the HD digital box

[23:56:02]

wagnerrp:

and hook them up to the outputs on your STB

[23:56:16]

wagnerrp:

or get an HDPVR for HD analog capture

[23:56:21]

sphery:

when 0.22 is released, you can get a Hauppauge HD-PVR

[23:56:25]

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[23:56:47]

sphery:

for high def analog capture over Component (not Composite--Red/White/Yellow--but Composite) input

[23:56:54]

wagnerrp:

which is probably down to a couple weeks until release now

[23:57:49]

sphery:

wagnerrp: we must do this way too often... we're each saying the same thing in basically the same order :)

[23:58:07]

wagnerrp:

need to make a page on the wiki and just link to it...

[23:58:09]

sphery:

(though you had already described the connections before I started)

[23:58:10]

kormoc:

You're just a pair of BFFs

[23:58:47]

sphery:

kormoc: shouldn't you be fixing the broken previews on MythWeb--or converting it to Vala? ;)

[23:59:01]

** kormoc goes back to his coding cage **

[23:59:03]

xris:

he's *supposed* to be setting up the SD server. :)

[23:59:09]

kormoc:

heh, that too

[23:59:14]

sphery:

oooh... that would be nice.

[23:59:23]

wagnerrp:

Vala? thats one ive not heard of before

[23:59:45]

** xris ponders rewriting mythweb in rails... **

[23:59:53]

sphery:

wagnerrp: http://zee-nix.blogspot.com/2008/05/why-vala.html

[23:59:54]

** xris preemptively ducks **

[23:59:57]

** kormoc commits herrikarri **

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