Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Monday, July 30th, 2007, 00:00 UTC

[00:00:42]

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cesman:

btaudio is a black art and it only works w/ some cards

[00:04:48]

cesman:

it has probably been over 4 years since I've used it

[00:05:12]

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[00:05:27]

deebus_:

anyone have any experience setting up the firefly mini ir device?

[00:05:43]

deebus_:

lirc keeps telling me it's not configured, but I've made the lircd.conf file multiple times

[00:06:26]

deebus_:

ubuntu, btw

[00:06:37]

deebus_:

I've been googling a lot, but nothing seems to have worked

[00:06:57]

deebus_:

it works a little bit natively, but I want to get it fully-functional

[00:07:11]

xris:

you get any results from irw?

[00:07:18]

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[00:07:28]

xris:

are you building the lirc.conf by hand (programming it) or from some preconfigured copy of the file?

[00:07:41]

deebus_:

irw tells me connection refused

[00:07:42]

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xris:

deebus_: that would be lircd not running

[00:07:54]

deebus_:

starting lirc in non-daemon mode, and then running irw gives tells me

[00:08:24]

deebus_:

http://pastebin.ca/638645

[00:08:53]

cesman:

seems pretty clean....

[00:08:59]

cesman:

/dev/lirc doesn't exist

[00:09:24]

cesman:

odds are, you need to modify your /etc/lirc/hardware.conf

[00:09:24]

Aval0n:

anyone here using a kworld 115?

[00:09:39]

deebus_:

modify it how?

[00:09:44]

cesman:

deebus_: I guess is /dev/lirc0 instead of lirc

[00:09:48]

cesman:

vi

[00:09:57]

deebus_:

aw jeez

[00:10:07]

deebus_:

the line that reads:

[00:10:11]

deebus_:

DEVICE=""

[00:10:26]

deebus_:

should probably read: DEVICE="/dev/whatever_device", right?

[00:10:35]

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[00:10:38]

cesman:

should be something like DEVICE="/dev/lirc0"

[00:10:46]

Aval0n:

guys to run 2 front ends on 1 pc with the backend do you need to have a dual head card?

[00:10:47]

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[00:10:53]

cesman:

of course that depends on your device

[00:10:54]

Aval0n:

I guess what's better? dual head or dual card?

[00:11:03]

cesman:

is the firefly a usb device?

[00:11:31]

cesman:

Aval0n: I believe there is a write up on the MythTV wiki about that card...

[00:11:31]

xris:

Aval0n: same difference in a good confguration

[00:11:35]

deebus_:

yes, usb device

[00:11:41]

deebus_:

already made a udev rule for it

[00:11:44]

deebus_:

I feel like an retarded

[00:11:46]

Aval0n:

are matrox g450 or 550's good with muth?

[00:11:48]

Aval0n:

myth

[00:11:54]

xris:

Aval0n: dual-head frontend can be problematic, though... settings/state, etc are all handled based on hostname

[00:13:04]

Aval0n:

so you recommend dual card?

[00:13:12]

hads:

Same issue.

[00:13:23]

Aval0n:

so what's problematic?

[00:13:23]

hads:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Running_MythTV_Dual_Headed

[00:13:33]

cesman:

deebus_: then the device might be /dev/usb/hiddev0

[00:13:33]

hads:

What xris just said...

[00:13:46]

Aval0n:

running on hostname is problematic?

[00:13:56]

deebus_:

cesman: I set it up as /dev/input/firefly-mini

[00:14:04]

cesman:

ok

[00:14:21]

deebus_:

/etc/init.d/lircd restart

[00:14:21]

hads:

Aval0n: "settings/state, etc are all handled based on hostname"

[00:14:28]

xris:

Aval0n: that page covers what you want to know.

[00:14:29]

deebus_:

irw still looks for old binding

[00:14:42]

Aval0n:

xris k thanks

[00:14:43]

xris:

you will also probably not be able to do any remote frontend control

[00:14:59]

xris:

because you'd have to fudge the hostname, and the frontends would fight for port control

[00:15:11]

hads:

Buy another PC :)

[00:15:28]

deebus_:

cesman: any idea why lircd still looks for /dev/lirc?

[00:16:02]

hatlevip:

deebus_, restart udev?

[00:16:54]

deebus_:

restart udev, restarted lircd. still says LIRC IS NOT CONFIGURED

[00:17:26]

hads:

Debian/Ubuntu?

[00:17:29]

deebus_:

ubuntu

[00:18:13]

hads:

There will be a line in /etc/lirc/something telling it it's not configured.

[00:18:44]

deebus_:

poorly written config file, you mean?

[00:19:02]

deebus_:

I've got a lot in there

[00:19:15]

deebus_:

my config should be in /etc/lirc/lircd.conf.firefly

[00:19:26]

deebus_:

should I put its contents in /etc/lirc/lircd.conf?

[00:19:34]

cesman:

yes

[00:19:54]

hads:

Have you read /usr/share/doc/lirc/html/configure.html?

[00:20:00]

deebus_:

yes

[00:20:41]

hads:

And /usr/share/doc/lirc/README.Debian

[00:20:53]

deebus_:

negatory on that one

[00:21:05]

deebus_:

restarting lircd doesn't give me the config error anymore

[00:21:53]

deebus_:

but irw just dumps me back to a command prompt

[00:22:36]

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[00:23:24]

deebus_:

lircd still looking for /dev/lirc and not /dev/input/firefly-mini

[00:26:59]

deebus_:

ugh

[00:27:00]

deebus_:

killing me here

[00:27:06]

deebus_:

calling it quits for the night

[00:27:23]

deebus_:

thanks for the help guys. got me farther than I was before I came in here

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[00:35:44]

wesssssssssssssK:

I'm having a problem getting ivtv to work

[00:36:15]

wesssssssssssssK:

somewhere, while getting my nvidia drivers installed, it was removed from the computer

[00:36:38]

wesssssssssssssK:

i tried to reinstall from the package manager, but it wont initailize

[00:37:31]

wesssssssssssssK:

from what i see, theres a conflict with the kernel, but i'm not sure what to do

[00:42:20]

wesssssssssssssK:

i'm running 2.6.20–1.2962.fc6

[00:42:22]

cesman:

not that I can help, but you need to provide greater details

[00:42:42]

cesman:

it would also help if you posted the logs to pastebin for someone to take a look at...

[00:43:41]

Aval0n:

anyone know where to get the myth install packages for ubuntu?

[00:43:59]

wesssssssssssssK:

running modprobe init creates :WARNING: Error inserting v4l1_compat

[00:44:13]

Aval0n:

that's just a warning

[00:45:10]

wesssssssssssssK:

down the line of warnings it eventually gets to: FATAL: Error inserting ivtv

[00:45:13]

hads:

Aval0n: What do you mean "where to get the myth install packages for ubuntu"?

[00:46:18]

wesssssssssssssK:

consider me a newb, but how do i post the logs to pastebin?

[00:47:01]

cesman:

http://www.google.com/search?q=ubuntu+mythtv+ . . . l&hs=qn1

[00:47:24]

cesman:

wesssssssssssssK: you go to pastebin.ca and follow the directions

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[00:47:36]

cesman:

I've not had to use it myself

[00:48:08]

wesssssssssssssK:

cesman: i'll give it a try

[00:48:31]

cesman:

me ponders if wesssssssssssssK is using Mandriva...

[00:48:34]

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wesssssssssssssK:

cesman: fedora

[00:50:24]

wesssssssssssssK:

cesman: fc6

[00:50:57]

PDM_clever:

cesman: i could tell it was fc6 from his kernel(look up)

[00:52:57]

wesssssssssssssK:

http://pastebin.ca/638699 for the errors running modprobe

[00:54:25]

cesman:

just wondering... I recall a fellow a few days back that had an issue w/ kernel and ivtv

[00:54:30]

cesman:

he was using Mandriva

[00:54:47]

hads:

wesssssssssssssK: That's a fairly obvious error.

[00:55:01]

cesman:

you need to do modprobe as root

[00:55:34]

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[00:56:00]

PDM_clever:

lol

[00:56:14]

wesssssssssssssK:

nailed me

[00:56:26]

wesssssssssssssK:

ok, as root... nothing happens

[00:56:40]

PDM_clever:

it only shows a msg when something goes wrong

[00:56:49]

PDM_clever:

often linux will 'do nothing' when it works

[00:56:58]

wesssssssssssssK:

so thats good... but it still doesnt work

[00:57:16]

PDM_clever:

do you have a /dev/video?

[00:58:17]

cesman:

after you modprobe, if you want to see anything:dmesg

[00:59:11]

wesssssssssssssK:

no, theres no "video" in /dev

[01:02:00]

wesssssssssssssK:

i basically go to mythtv setup to add the card, and it doesnt find anything

[01:02:17]

wesssssssssssssK:

it worked fine before i added my geforce4 and drivers

[01:03:31]

wesssssssssssssK:

i can add my mythbackend log, but it basically says there are no suitable devices

[01:05:45]

cesman:

no /dev/video?!

[01:05:47]

cesman:

wow!

[01:05:55]

cesman:

something is amiss w/ your setup

[01:06:02]

cesman:

sorry, I'm not a Fedora man...

[01:06:08]

cesman:

you can try making the device

[01:06:47]

cesman:

mknod /dev/video0 c 81 0

[01:06:54]

cesman:

as root of course ;)

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cesman:

http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Webcam-HOWTO/dev-intro.html may help as well

[01:07:37]

cesman:

later folks

[01:08:10]

sigger_:

anyone recommend a prebuilt myth system other than dragon or linuxtechtoys?

[01:08:21]

wesssssssssssssK:

i'm rebooting, i'll probably be back

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PDM_clever is now known as clever

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JeffATL:

so what's the state of mythtv these days compared to, oh, a year ago?

[01:32:53]

hads:

Further along.

[01:33:22]

JeffATL:

interface any more sensible?

[01:34:06]

Anduin:

No

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JeffATL:

docs any clearer?

[01:35:32]

tank-man:

what is not clear?

[01:35:48]

JeffATL:

probably too subjective a question

[01:36:32]

Anduin:

It is very likely that any issues you had, and didn't submit patches to fix, remain.

[01:36:50]

JeffATL:

noted

[01:37:34]

squish103:

but from a year ago the mythdora/knopmyth have improved

[01:42:41]

JeffATL:

squish103: i did try knopmyth; was most useful for getting a working xorg.conf started

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cesman:

JeffATL: User feedback can serve to improve KnoppMyth (and I'm sure MythDora).

[01:57:14]

cesman:

whatever issue you had, did you seek help/provide feedback in #knoppmyth or on mysettopbox.tv?

[01:58:03]

JeffATL:

it took me 3 tries to get a gentoo-based mythtv rig going, and it seemed to work for a while, but it didn't seem to be usable enough to really be able to institutionalize it – eventually it stopped recording on timer

[01:59:11]

cesman:

ahh ok

[01:59:42]

cesman:

I'll take that as a no

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JeffATL:

and that was basically undebuggable

[02:17:19]

JeffATL:

for someone not billable for it :)

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JeffATL:

and here i am, idiotically contemplating a split rig

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opello:

i've had no problems with my mythtv single box frontend/backend and i use gentoo

[02:30:19]

opello:

went along for a year or so on 0.18.1 then i finally went to 0.20 a while back and it's been happy since

[02:34:00]

JeffATL:

that's a good sign

[02:35:07]

JeffATL:

i have this compact-case weird-mobo-format box with a celeron 1.8GHz in it and it has some sort of S-VHS output in it that I might want to use as the front end

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JeffATL:

unfortunately, the only faster machine i have here is a bit of overkill – AMD64x2

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JeffATL:

but if I use it as sort of an uber-server that also handles flac/mp3/wav en/decoding, it starts making more sense

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JeffATL:

i'm just sorry that it's an off-the-shelf HP consumer box

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JeffATL:

and doesn't lend itself well to drive-stuffing

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Kernel:

hmm any ideas what could be causing my osd to display the wrong channel ie i will be one channel 8 and it will be displaying whats on channel 6

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Kernel:

in the osd it says the channel number then underneath it it says adding channel ...ive run mythfilldatabase a few times. and it still is displaying the wrong channels. im using the datadirect feature.

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JeffATL:

Kernel: perhaps you have the wrong channel population selected?

[03:55:53]

maek:

I know this is a bit generic or vauge but is there any way to make mythmusic more usable? is there a trick im missing. It just lists all my music and it takes forever to scroll down to say, the N's. thanks.

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[03:58:40]

cesman:

maek: which release are you using?

[03:59:30]

maek:

cesman: of mythtv or mythmusic?

[03:59:55]

cesman:

you have to me use the same version of music as tv

[04:00:08]

cesman:

so it doesn't really matter how you answer

[04:00:09]

Kernel:

JeffATL: its the same one ive been using.

[04:00:29]

maek:

.20

[04:00:36]

cesman:

odd

[04:01:03]

maek:

whats odd?

[04:01:15]

cesman:

cause in 0.20, I go to 'listen to music', edit the playlist > all music

[04:01:31]

cesman:

and things are broken up so it is easy to get to the 'Ns'

[04:02:04]

maek:

hmm, mine just shows a massive list

[04:02:08]

maek:

maybe i didnt set something up right

[04:02:21]

maek:

ill have to go back and muck with it before I complain again.

[04:02:44]

maek:

is there anything that is itunes ish with the album art? thats pretty slick i must say...

[04:02:53]

maek:

i guess apple specilizies in slick

[04:03:27]

juski:

nothing of the sort

[04:04:04]

maek:

juski: thanks.

[04:04:26]

maek:

cesman: did you have to create a play list persay? or just let it import all your tunes?

[04:04:43]

cesman:

no playlist

[04:04:50]

juski:

mythmusic is going to have a raft of improvements done to it – just be patient. not saying it's gonna be like apple tv's interface, but better than it is now for sure

[04:05:57]

** cesman has not see "the itunes" interface **

[04:06:07]

cesman:

guess I must be missing something...

[04:06:28]

juski:

cesman: not missing much tbh ;) it's flashy is all

[04:06:48]

juski:

and yeah Apple do know a thing or 2 about good ui design, I'll concede that

[04:07:17]

juski:

considering mythtv is designed by programmers/engineers, it ain't half bad

[04:07:26]

juski:

there are much worse UIs out there ;)

[04:08:05]

cesman:

MythTV may be missing some fancy stuff, but I see nothing wrong w/ it's interface

[04:08:06]

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[04:08:22]

juski:

actually even *not* considering who makes mythtv, it's not half bad either :)

[04:08:48]

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[04:09:07]

JeffATL:

cesman: it's just difficult to navigate without already knowing where everything is

[04:09:11]

juski:

for all the 'bugs' in it I've yet to lose all my recordings – much more than can be said for a lot of commercial PVR products

[04:09:21]

hads:

*shrug* I've never really thought of it as bad

[04:09:35]

juski:

JeffATL: such changes are easy to make. I know the menus could do with being laid out better

[04:09:53]

juski:

an example I always cite is putting the OSD settings in TV Playback, not in Appearance

[04:09:57]

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[04:10:18]

hads:

juski: Yeah, that has bugged me once or twice :)

[04:10:31]

juski:

some folks' ideas of 'logical' aren't the same as us, it seems ;)

[04:10:43]

JeffATL:

it might have been more helpful if i'd had any other input besides mouse and kbd

[04:11:05]

cesman:

JeffATL: explore

[04:11:06]

juski:

like what? Minority Report style interface? :-P

[04:11:21]

juski:

definite recipe for RSI if you ask me!

[04:11:22]

cesman:

the menu entries seem self explanitory to me...

[04:12:08]

cesman:

and doesn't make sense, there is nothing stopping someone from customizing menus in ~/.mythtv/

[04:12:22]

JeffATL:

if you're at the bottom of the tree and you need to go fiddle with something else at the bottom of the tree, you find yourself having to nav up and down – it's just a bad way to arrange a complex control interface

[04:12:30]

juski:

well other than stuff like the OSD settings cesman

[04:13:03]

juski:

JeffATL: remember it has got to be navigable with a remote control. that places a lot of restrictions on the design

[04:13:04]

cesman:

JeffATL: the source is open contribute

[04:13:21]

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[04:13:31]

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[04:13:33]

juski:

you need to change most settings so rarely it's immaterial, most of it

[04:13:47]

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[04:14:02]

cesman:

if anything, MythTV offers too much choice

[04:14:12]

juski:

I'd kill off the 'bin' structure of things like mythvideo & mythmusic given half a chance. I hate those

[04:14:28]

juski:

cesman: yeah – you can configure the ass end off it

[04:14:35]

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[04:14:52]

JeffATL:

cesman: bad answer

[04:14:57]

juski:

the one SoC project I had high hopes for was the UI rework one

[04:15:11]

juski:

JeffATL: not a bad answer. users whine, devs ignore them :)

[04:15:35]

juski:

users who contribute code, or at least suggest a real better way to do stuff – they stand more chance of being taken seriously

[04:15:50]

banyan:

How about libdts.so.0 — how do I satisfy the package requirements for it?

[04:16:13]

juski:

no point – *absolutely NO point* in saying "XYZ sucks" – it's not gonna change *anything*

[04:16:16]

JeffATL:

juski: yes; why are OSD setup screens on TVs easier to use, with just a remote

[04:16:26]

cesman:

JeffATL: really?

[04:16:39]

juski:

JeffATL: because I'll bet there aren't way over 150 different menu screens just for setup options

[04:17:16]

cesman:

if you cannot code, you can help to improve the documentation

[04:17:20]

JeffATL:

juski: then those developers are only coding for themselves, then

[04:17:25]

juski:

JeffATL: so?

[04:17:26]

hads:

Umm, yeah

[04:17:39]

juski:

we don't get paid enough to care about what you want :)

[04:18:16]

juski:

that's not to say that all user requests go ignored – far from it – but everybody has their own motivation

[04:18:32]

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[04:18:40]

JeffATL:

cesman: for starters, on this emerson LCD TV i just got, it keeps the top of the tree visible even as you nav down

[04:18:58]

juski:

I've yet to see one open source project where users say "jump" & its devs ask "how high SIR?"

[04:19:20]

hads:

They exist, but not for long.

[04:19:24]

juski:

JeffATL: there are WAY too many levels in mythtv to be able to do that

[04:19:31]

cesman:

JeffATL: what does that have to you with you helping to improve MythTV?

[04:20:08]

juski:

I've said this for a while now – mythtv's greatest strength is also it's biggest bugbear. you can configure so many options it's unbelievable

[04:20:32]

juski:

and as I said – the settings are things you rarely even have to look at once you've set everything up – so it wouldn't be a priority anyway

[04:20:52]

hads:

And pruning any would be a nightmare as I'm sure at least one person would be using every option.

[04:21:05]

juski:

if you manage to forget which setup menu you're in, I pity you :-P

[04:21:13]

JeffATL:

juski: i've got a screen that's over 27" across; I think it could hold a few layers as opposed to using the entire display to present 3 to 5 choices

[04:21:28]

hads:

Write a patch, see how it goes.

[04:21:30]

juski:

JeffATL: so rewrite the menu code. it's all there

[04:21:47]

juski:

stop whining already, let's see some *action*

[04:22:08]

juski:

I bet your TVs UI looks like crap, too

[04:22:46]

JeffATL:

juski: no, they're tack-sharp, with characters about a centimeter tall

[04:22:56]

juski:

I've yet to see any hardware device's UI that even comes close to mythtv – even its lame themes. that's one thing you don't get even with those new fangled UPnP player boxes

[04:23:18]

juski:

TV setup menus look *functional* & nothing more

[04:23:45]

juski:

anyway the point is, nobody is listening. the setup menus & their layout isn't gonna change because you said so

[04:24:04]

cesman:

The UI for the digital setup box that I can get from cable co sucks big time

[04:24:39]

juski:

maybe you should look at Elisa. Oh wait, that can't even play mpeg files without buying plugins for it

[04:25:22]

cesman:

lol

[04:25:27]

juski:

it's a big joke they call Elisa 'open source' when it depends on so many closed sorce binary blobs

[04:26:22]

juski:

JeffATL: hey maybe instead of whinging about the menu layout – if somebody took the time & made a diagram of how to navigate the UI screens..

[04:27:50]

juski:

anyway wtf am I going on about this? it's not frickin rocket science to go from one area to another – and like I keep saying – these things aren't the sort of thing you should need to be visiting often

[04:28:34]

juski:

and if you think anybody here is being harsh – take your comments to the mailing lists & see how they handle it. Oh boy

[04:28:38]

JeffATL:

when trying to get mythtv to work, one finds oneself in menus on the tv and in shells on the computer(s)

[04:28:55]

juski:

so? it's a computer program

[04:29:12]

JeffATL:

for hours

[04:29:20]

cesman:

JeffATL: want to know what I did about that?

[04:29:25]

juski:

and er.. IIRC the last time I had to go into a shell on my frontend was umm.... hmm I can't remember

[04:30:01]

JeffATL:

cesman: go ahead

[04:30:36]

cesman:

http://linuxdevices.com/articles/AT5479811400.html

[04:31:19]

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[04:31:23]

juski:

cesman: haha! didn't know you started on a CoCo2 !

[04:31:33]

cesman:

yes, I did :)

[04:32:02]

cesman:

I take it, you did as well?

[04:32:05]

JeffATL:

cesman: and you're to be commended

[04:32:28]

cesman:

there are multiple ways to contribute

[04:32:34]

juski:

I had one of those for *years* – even blew it up trying to sample audio thru a joystick port with my own 6809 assembler routine. My amplifier died, taking the analogue circuits with it

[04:33:05]

juski:

bad coincidence

[04:33:33]

cesman:

A year ago, KnoppMyth didn't work for you... You could have help by providing feedback and testing.

[04:34:24]

cesman:

You like Gentoo (?), so help with the Gentoo Myth docs

[04:34:39]

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[04:35:08]

cesman:

simply point out the shortcomings of an Open Source project when you can do something about it doesn't make sense.

[04:37:06]

JeffATL:

one thing i could do is to concisely describe the problem i perceive and a proposed solution

[04:37:25]

juski:

it ain't broke, lots will say

[04:37:38]

juski:

me being one of those 'lots'

[04:38:04]

cesman:

JeffATL: a proper bug report is contributing

[04:38:38]

juski:

yeah file a bug ticket & see how long it lasts

[04:39:03]

JeffATL:

see, it had been my hope that mythtv would make it where my wife and i could use it to record and recall programs without having to bug me

[04:39:18]

juski:

funny, mine works just like you describe

[04:39:22]

JeffATL:

now, both of them are smart girls; they can follow well-presented complex stuff

[04:39:45]

juski:

manage recordings.. hmm is that where you er.. manage recordings?

[04:39:57]

juski:

hey look – program guide – is that where the 'program guide' lives?!

[04:40:15]

juski:

recording options – wow! I can set the options for the recording here! awesome!

[04:40:44]

juski:

it's not rocket science, and if my wife can work it...

[04:41:43]

juski:

hey I wanna watch a tv show I set to record yesterday. hmmm now where can it be? media library? maybe – since recordings are like 'media'... yes! Watch recordings.. it's there

[04:43:43]

cesman:

JeffATL: it can be that simple

[04:43:55]

cesman:

My systems run without issue

[04:44:07]

juski:

you know, I sat down in front of my friend's 'Sky Plus' PVR when I visited last year. I couldn't figure out (for the life of me) how to find his recordings to watch something. They're in the programme guide ffs! Pardon me for thinking the programme guide would be *just* a guide

[04:44:26]

cesman:

while I have keyboards attached (wireless), I use nothing but a remote to control them

[04:44:58]

juski:

since I added a record button to my remote my wife has been setting her own recordings up without using mythweb

[04:45:57]

juski:

and for all she protests that "it rarely works" she raves about it to her friends. What she sees me 'fixing' is actually me doing dev work, on themes or source code. Very rarely even need to touch the frontend

[04:46:17]

juski:

so JeffATL your argument (what there was of it) is receding..

[04:46:45]

juski:

if your guys find mythtv so hard to operate I pity them. it's not that hard, honestly

[04:47:10]

Dagmar:

Those people probably wear penny-loafers for a reason.

[04:47:10]

juski:

it's much harder to programme a VCR, even these days

[04:47:43]

cesman:

I'm personally stumped when people state it is difficult to use...

[04:48:45]

juski:

I mean yeah – if you say it can be difficult to find the setting to control the amount of time the OSD stays onscreen – I might agree

[04:49:05]

juski:

but setting a recording? playing back a recording? you cannot be serious!

[04:49:24]

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[04:49:57]

juski:

unless, that is – you're using the 'dvr' menu theme. that one confused me. 'watch tv' is a 'utility' in that theme apparently :-\

[04:52:04]

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[04:52:14]

JeffATL:

it was difficult enough just trying to determine which key on the keyboard performed what menu action

[04:52:24]

juski:

dial M for menu

[04:52:29]

juski:

dial I for info

[04:52:39]

juski:

D for delete

[04:52:44]

juski:

it's SO hard

[04:52:48]

hads:

It's on the wiki

[04:52:50]

JeffATL:

juski: fine; is a key for that onscreen at all times?

[04:53:06]

juski:

hmm what's the FIRST LETTER of 'menu' ?

[04:53:21]

JeffATL:

by "key" i mean "keyboard usage decoder blurb"

[04:53:47]

juski:

JeffATL: you're just whining for the sake of it now. it's quite trollish

[04:53:56]

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[04:54:02]

hads:

juski: So stop feeding them :)

[04:54:19]

JeffATL:

hads: so, a wiki has to be called up to the side for mythtv usage? is that what you're suggesting?

[04:54:51]

banyan:

what is the way to satisfy yum on f7 re: the dependency of mplayer on libdts.so.0

[04:55:07]

** juski hands out padded helmets to all those who can't figure out that the most important mythtv functions are mapped to the first letter of the word **

[04:57:03]

JeffATL:

juski: fwiw, my wife administers >$100M contracts for a federal agency – very well. I think it's reasonable and achievable for mythtv to have a "walk up and work it" control interface.

[04:57:51]

juski:

whooyeah that God awful Rihanna has been knocked orf the top chart spot at last. 10 weeks was 10 weeks too many beeeatch

[04:57:53]

JeffATL:

it's not like it has to do everything with three buttons and a 2x32-char LCD

[05:00:16]

JeffATL:

and like i said, i'm planning to give mythtv another shot; the frontend box i'm planning to use has IR I/O right on the front panel, so, we'll see how aht goes

[05:00:23]

juski:

in the last place I worked there was Emrys, the head hardware designer. he was a bright guy – coded in 68040 & Sparc assembly code with his eyes shut. came into the rec. room one day to get a can of Coke – we had to show him how to use the machine. poor guy

[05:00:39]

varun_:

is it normal for a DVD transcode to "Excellent" compression to take 15 hours on pass 2?

[05:00:49]

juski:

varun_: on your box, maybe it is ;)

[05:01:11]

varun_:

juski: haha.........fair enough. It's a X2 5000+, 2 Gigs of RAM

[05:01:28]

hads:

Doesn't sound that normal then :)

[05:01:35]

juski:

varun_: maybe not then. even one hour would osund like a lot for that CPU

[05:01:52]

varun_:

hm....any ideas how I should go about debugging it?

[05:02:15]

juski:

you spent that much on a CPU & skimped on HDD space so you need to compress it? ouch

[05:02:23]

juski:

;)

[05:02:23]

hads:

I don't transcode so I wouldn't know sorry.

[05:02:37]

varun_:

juski: haha..........no I have a terabyte of storage........just trying to be efficient :-)

[05:03:00]

juski:

for the amount of extra screenings films get in this house – after the dvd purchase, ripping just isn't worth it

[05:03:10]

juski:

so I don't do it either

[05:03:14]

JeffATL:

perhaps emrys hadn't worked a machine similar to that before, and the machine had nothing from which one could glean its operation on the front panel?

[05:03:31]

hads:

Bah, goodbye.

[05:03:37]

varun_:

juski: hm I see what you're saying.........compression might not be that necessary

[05:03:54]

varun_:

juski: could it because i'm writing to a samba share as I rip?

[05:04:16]

juski:

varun_: maybe.. but still – 15 hours?!

[05:04:20]

JeffATL:

varun_: i wouldn't think so; unless the ripping is going over the network

[05:04:24]

hads:

That would slow it down for sure, especialy if it's putting temp files on there.

[05:04:25]

varun_:

it is

[05:04:41]

varun_:

yea I'm writing to my file server (RAID 5) over 100 MBit Ethernet

[05:05:13]

JeffATL:

varun_: but is the writing over Ethernet due to ripping?

[05:05:16]

juski:

JeffATL: it was a *Coke* machine. it had a coin slot and buttons on the front next to a picture of each product ffs. that's gotta be some kind of mental block. UIs don't get much more simple than 'press big button'

[05:05:28]

varun_:

JeffATL: due to? I

[05:05:47]

varun_:

JeffATL: I'm not sure I follow.........

[05:06:01]

JeffATL:

varun_: was the machine in question ripping from its own CD/DVD drive to its own disk drive?

[05:06:11]

juski:

it obviously wasn't complex *enough* for him to understand it!

[05:06:17]

Dagmar:

That's not a block.

[05:06:19]

Dagmar:

That's brain damage.

[05:06:34]

varun_:

JeffATL: no. I'm ripping from my DVD *to* the fileserver...........directly

[05:06:40]

hads:

Well if it's writing temp files there then it could be writing 9GB over there, reading it back and then writing it back again etc.

[05:07:01]

hads:

Like I said I have no idea about transcoding in myth really.

[05:07:02]

juski:

not even samba is that slow is it?

[05:07:03]

varun_:

the temp files are on the ripping box

[05:07:16]

JeffATL:

varun_: oh. well, in that case, yeah – esp if what hads said about temp files is true, omg

[05:07:20]

hads:

OK, that's good :)

[05:07:39]

varun_:

juski: I've heard it's slow. But it might be worth trying to rip it to the local drive and see what the ETA on that is

[05:07:53]

varun_:

JeffATL: no I'm pretty sure the temp files are on the local box

[05:08:01]

juski:

varun_: I use NFS. samba sucks

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[05:08:17]

juski:

NFS ain't perfect but it's way faster than samba IME

[05:08:21]

hads:

They both suck :)

[05:08:25]

varun_:

juski: but I need it to be samba so I can access it from my Windows box

[05:08:40]

Hoxzer:

is NFS better than sshfs ?

[05:08:41]

hads:

juski: It's not really way faster.

[05:08:58]

juski:

hads: in my experience it is, so there!

[05:09:06]

juski:

Hoxzer: apparently not

[05:09:21]

Dagmar:

hm.... someone selling a time machine on Craigslist

[05:09:21]

hads:

juski: I can accept that statement :) It's not in mine though.

[05:09:31]

juski:

though sshfs is hardly worth it on a local network

[05:09:35]

JeffATL:

varun_: you can export out the same filespace over both NFS and samba at once, but i have no feel for how usage contention on the same files would behave

[05:09:49]

juski:

Dagmar: BUY IT!

[05:09:51]

juski:

;)

[05:09:54]

varun_:

JeffATL: that's a really good point

[05:10:05]

Dagmar:

juski: I dunno man. Does it look legit to you? http://nashville.craigslist.org/ele/384936805.html

[05:10:18]

Dagmar:

I'm tempted to email and see if the chick is married tho.

[05:10:40]

juski:

ffs it's a NRS96! snap it up now! those babies rock!

[05:10:49]

Dagmar:

She's qualified to be my gf on the basis of being a wild-eyed nutjob.

[05:11:02]

Dagmar:

Not that many of them have even been wild-eyed.

[05:12:02]

juski:

once the chloroform kicks in the wildness in their eyes tends to recede, I find

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[05:13:31]

varun_:

thanks for the help guys........I'll try ripping to the local drive. If that doesn't speed it up, I'll be back!! :-)

[05:14:03]

JeffATL:

varun_: ATA *so* much faster than any ethernet

[05:14:25]

varun_:

JeffATL: no doubt. But I just figured it saved me the extra step of transferring.

[05:14:26]

juski:

you might wanna look at the rip settings for 'excellent' too ;)

[05:14:55]

varun_:

juski: yea you've made me begin to wonder if I really need all that compression

[05:15:35]

JeffATL:

varun_: it may be that the nature of the file writing (i may be puling this outta my ass, so bear with me) is very very poor on cifs/smb

[05:16:09]

varun_:

JeffATL: I wouldnt' be surprised. cifs+raid5 calcuations might beat the cr*p out of the speeds

[05:16:11]

JeffATL:

varun_: oh oh – if you can manipulate your packet size!!

[05:16:44]

JeffATL:

raid5 parity calc *still* >>>>> cifs/smb

[05:18:09]

varun_:

JeffATL: hm that might be another good idea............the packet size

[05:18:16]

JeffATL:

varun_: iirc, that might be an echo-numbers-to-/sys adjustment

[05:18:59]

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[05:39:13]

Hoxzer:

How do DVD's work with 4.0 Channel Surround? As I have heard they all use 5.1 sound system

[05:39:30]

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[05:39:50]

keith4_:

any idea how to change settings for mythtvosd?

[05:41:11]

juski:

keith4_: it's in the TV playback menus

[05:41:19]

juski:

utils/setup > setup > tv > playback

[05:41:40]

keith4_:

ok, not where i would have looked for it... but i'll take it

[05:42:22]

keith4_:

what's the best deinterlace algorithm?

[05:42:46]

juski:

depends. if you use xvmc, use only 'bob2x'

[05:42:56]

juski:

otherwise just use what you think looks best for you

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[05:44:29]

keith4_:

ok thank you

[05:45:57]

juski:

I'd like to see that setting moved to the appearance menu – might see what I can do about that in future. last time I looked at the code it didn't seem like any kind of picnic though

[05:46:04]

juski:

at least, not for me ;)

[05:46:08]

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[05:46:11]

keith4_:

i believe it

[05:46:11]

k-man:

hello

[05:46:40]

k-man:

i heard about a pvr where they implemented a binary search for skipping past adverts

[05:46:53]

keith4_:

is the size of the mythnotify window controlled by the xml file that's sent to it?

[05:46:56]

k-man:

has anyone thought of doing that in mythtv?

[05:47:05]

juski:

keith4_: yes

[05:47:12]

keith4_:

damn

[05:47:17]

k-man:

in fact, i was even thinking that it might be implementable through lirc

[05:47:26]

juski:

k-man: it already does do image analysis

[05:47:36]

keith4_:

http://www.mythpvr.com/mythtv/how-commercial-flagging-works.html

[05:47:47]

k-man:

juski, it doesn't work over here

[05:47:56]

k-man:

in australia

[05:47:56]

juski:

k-man: over where?

[05:48:00]

k-man:

and anyway

[05:48:02]

keith4_:

works pretty well for me

[05:48:04]

juski:

doesn't work too well in the uK either

[05:48:04]

k-man:

its cool

[05:48:07]

keith4_:

some channels confuse it

[05:48:21]

keith4_:

and certain shows, too

[05:48:26]

juski:

too many channels don't obey mythtv's rules for advert detection :-P

[05:48:40]

keith4_:

it's at least as good as tivo, i think

[05:48:42]

k-man:

even if its for forwarding to any point in a show – not necessarily past adverts, its cool to have a binary search

[05:48:45]

juski:

we very rarely see fades to black before & after advert breaks

[05:48:57]

juski:

k-man: what do you mean by 'binary search' ?

[05:50:16]

k-man:

juski, a friend told me about it, but i haven't tried it personaly, but basicaly, as long as you keep pressing forward, it skips by 3 minutes...

[05:50:27]

juski:

duh!

[05:50:29]

k-man:

then when you press backwards, it goes 1.5 minutes back

[05:50:29]

juski:

mythtv has that

[05:50:37]

juski:

very easily set up too

[05:50:48]

keith4_:

default is 30 seconds forward, 5 back?

[05:50:48]

k-man:

and it halves each time you go forward or backward from there

[05:50:50]

keith4_:

something like that

[05:50:53]

juski:

you do know you can just hit a number & then an arrow key, yes?

[05:50:55]

k-man:

thereby implementing a binary search

[05:51:06]

juski:

k-man: that's not what I'd call a binary search

[05:51:21]

k-man:

well, that's what I would call a binary search

[05:51:30]

k-man:

it halves the distance away from the target each time

[05:51:43]

keith4_:

more like exponential decay

[05:51:44]

juski:

I just hit 4 then right arrow. bye bye ads

[05:52:03]

varun_:

so ripping to local disk is 48 minutes

[05:52:08]

varun_:

I guess it was the cifs

[05:52:15]

juski:

varun_: hahahah dump the samba shite then :)

[05:52:37]

k-man:

anywya

[05:52:41]

k-man:

i think its a cool idea

[05:52:41]

varun_:

juski: that is the plan! maybe just ftp while I sleep or something

[05:52:48]

juski:

varun_: if your server has nfs, use that to export it to the linux box, and keep samba for the win ;)

[05:53:04]

k-man:

so my question is, do you think it could be done in lirc alone? using lirc modes??

[05:53:09]

juski:

k-man: NO

[05:53:15]

juski:

k-man: sounds like big changes to mythtv code

[05:53:23]

varun_:

juski: I was thinking of that. I think Jeff suggested that – simultaneous share

[05:53:31]

k-man:

juski, no, i think it would be small changes

[05:53:37]

k-man:

but anyway

[05:53:38]

juski:

k-man: no way. big changes

[05:53:43]

k-man:

i didn't think lirc could do it either

[05:53:55]

juski:

sounds like a crap idea anyway IMHO

[05:54:17]

k-man:

juski, you are entitled to your opinion

[05:55:11]

juski:

I like myth's arbitrary skip/jump the way it is

[05:55:32]

k-man:

juski, i wasn't saying it should be replaced

[05:55:40]

k-man:

it could be added as an alternative

[05:55:47]

juski:

but think about it – you'd have to replace it

[05:55:48]

keith4_:

is there any decent documentation on myth notify anywhere?

[05:55:52]

keith4_:

google is failing me

[05:55:55]

juski:

keith4_: wiki ?

[05:56:04]

keith4_:

pretty sparse

[05:56:24]

juski:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Setting_up_MythNotify

[05:56:25]

hads:

keith4_: myth notify?

[05:56:39]

keith4_:

juski: yah, i'm reading that

[05:57:05]

juski:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Little_Gems

[05:57:06]

keith4_:

the general idea is "mythudprelay will take an xml file, apply an xsl, and broadcast it"

[05:57:08]

juski:

see mythtvosd

[05:57:15]

hads:

Hmm, sounds like mythtvosd

[05:57:20]

keith4_:

exactly

[05:57:28]

keith4_:

it feeds to mythtvosd

[05:57:34]

juski:

hads: mythnotify is a daemon that feeds mythtvosd

[05:57:43]

hads:

Ah, never heard of it :)

[05:57:45]

juski:

you can mangle your own script to feed mythtvosd

[05:57:57]

keith4_:

but i can't find a spec of wtf it expects for data format

[05:58:09]

juski:

keith4_: just try mythtvosd to get a feel for it

[05:58:14]

juski:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Little_Gems

[05:58:24]

juski:

it's great, that little program

[05:58:30]

juski:

anyway, time for me to head to work

[05:58:37]

hads:

mythtvosd --help has the most info about it

[05:58:43]

keith4_:

oh duh

[05:59:15]

keith4_:

udprelay just broadcasts to mythtvosd on all frontends

[06:00:43]

hads:

mythtvosd does that on a local network.

[06:01:19]

keith4_:

hmm

[06:01:37]

keith4_:

the plot thickens

[06:06:57]

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[06:12:38]

keith4_:

so what the hell is the point of having mythudprelay and mythtvosd ?

[06:12:53]

Dagmar:

For use.

[06:13:38]

hads:

I'm guessing mythudprelay relays the upd somewhere it wouldn't normally get. Dunno, I've never looked at it.

[06:13:56]

keith4_:

sorry Dagmar... should have been

[06:14:02]

keith4_:

so what the hell is the point of having mythudprelay *and* mythtvosd ?

[06:15:57]

Aval0n:

guys if I have on machine with a hdtv wonder and a pvr 150 running 2 front ends, will I be able to tune live tv on both front ends with different channels?

[06:16:02]

Aval0n:

one* machine

[06:16:13]

Dagmar:

keith4: Read a man page and find out

[06:16:35]

keith4_:

Aval0n: yes

[06:16:44]

Aval0n:

is myth live tv nice?

[06:16:49]

Aval0n:

i've never seen it in action

[06:16:57]

keith4_:

depends on your signal

[06:16:59]

hads:

As nice as the broadcast is ...

[06:17:02]

keith4_:

shit in, shit out

[06:17:08]

Aval0n:

i just mean the menus and what not

[06:17:12]

Aval0n:

my signal is fine

[06:17:19]

keith4_:

Dagmar: thanks for the help

[06:17:21]

keith4_:

No manual entry for mythtvosd

[06:17:21]

keith4_:

See 'man 7 undocumented' for help when manual pages are not available.

[06:17:49]

keith4_:

very insightful

[06:17:58]

Aval0n:

cool

[06:18:27]

Aval0n:

if I am getting the local channels in hd

[06:18:33]

Dagmar:

There is also --help

[06:18:42]

Aval0n:

can I record lossless video from them?

[06:18:57]

keith4_:

i hope you work for seagate

[06:18:59]

Dagmar:

See `man 7 notmyproblem` when the user is unable to read the wiki

[06:19:29]

keith4_:

see 'if you don't know, then don't answer the question'

[06:19:41]

hads:

keith4_: It's not worth it.

[06:19:49]

** keith4_ shrugs **

[06:22:00]

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[06:22:10]

Dagmar:

...and this is called "I don't answer stupid questions. I mock them."

[06:22:39]

Dagmar:

...because if you have to ask that, then it's clear you haven't bothered to actually look and see what both of those do.

[06:22:44]

Dagmar:

Fail.

[06:22:59]

keith4_:

it looks like mythnotify might be mythudprelay after a few years of evolution

[06:24:05]

hads:

You mean mythtvosd?

[06:24:09]

keith4_:

right

[06:24:10]

keith4_:

yes, sorry

[06:24:36]

keith4_:

because the result of using mythtvosd --template=cid is identical to using cidbcast with mythudprelay

[06:25:38]

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[06:31:53]

Aval0n:

guys I have an older hauppage card from 1998

[06:32:07]

Aval0n:

62471

[06:32:22]

Aval0n:

would that work for an analog tuner in conjuction with a ati hdtv wonder

[06:32:26]

Aval0n:

for running 2 tvs

[06:33:06]

Dagmar:

We dont' support framebuffer cards.

[06:33:07]

hads:

If it's supported in Linux it's supported in MythTV

[06:33:13]

Dagmar:

We ridicule them and their users.

[06:33:27]

Aval0n:

framebuffer cards?

[06:33:56]

Dagmar:

bttv == teh suck for recording

[06:34:16]

Aval0n:

so i'de be better suited with a hdtv wonder and a pvr 150?

[06:34:28]

Dagmar:

You'd be better off not using ATI.

[06:34:46]

Aval0n:

how about the kglobe 115

[06:34:54]

Aval0n:

errr

[06:35:12]

Aval0n:

kworld

[06:35:20]

Dagmar:

What's google say about it?

[06:35:27]

Aval0n:

the wiki says it works

[06:35:29]

Aval0n:

but it says this

[06:35:34]

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[06:36:25]

Aval0n:

It is important to note that the analog tuner of this card does not have a hardware MPEG2 encoder; it is an old fashioned frame grabber based tuner. Therefore, it is highly unrecommended for analog use

[06:36:37]

Aval0n:

that's from mythtv wiki

[06:36:47]

Aval0n:

but I thought all the hd cards didn't have mpeg2 encoders

[06:37:03]

Aval0n:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Kworld_ATSC_110

[06:37:10]

Dagmar:

The _digital_ cards don't need them.

[06:37:17]

Dagmar:

The signal is broadcast as mpeg already.

[06:37:32]

Aval0n:

I have cox standard cable

[06:37:33]

Aval0n:

no STB

[06:37:39]

Aval0n:

and am hoping to use QAM for some HD

[06:38:00]

Aval0n:

I want to run 2 front ends on 1 machine (Same machine the backend is on)

[06:38:23]

Aval0n:

would that kwolrd and the pvr 150 work well for that?

[06:38:25]

Dagmar:

You can pretty much abandon hope of doing recording of HD with analog signals

[06:38:44]

Aval0n:

?

[06:38:52]

Dagmar:

...and unless you're very well versed in Linux, you can also abandon hope of trying to run TWO frontends on one machine

[06:38:53]

Aval0n:

I can't record the QAM as true HD

[06:39:10]

Aval0n:

i can run it dual head or dual card can't i?

[06:39:22]

Dagmar:

"may" and "can" are two different words

[06:40:00]

Aval0n:

why can't I record HD?

[06:40:16]

Dagmar:

Perhaps because you've not read enough documentation yet

[06:40:17]

Dagmar:

I dunno

[06:40:38]

Aval0n:

others have said they record QAM256 chans just fine.

[06:40:38]

Dagmar:

I do know there's little chance of doing playback of two HD streams at once on one machine without some problems developing

[06:40:57]

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[06:41:10]

rhollan:

How do I get movie posters for ripped DVDs

[06:41:21]

Aval0n:

rholla

[06:41:34]

Aval0n:

is that really an appropriate question for this channel?

[06:41:37]

Dagmar:

rhollan: Google

[06:41:55]

Aval0n:

I only care about hd playback on the main TV

[06:41:58]

rhollan:

Google tells me nada. The script wants to use a movie ID. Where do I get that from,

[06:42:01]

Aval0n:

the bedroom is just a p.o.s. tv

[06:42:13]

Dagmar:

What script?

[06:42:24]

rhollan:

imdb.pl

[06:42:26]

hads:

rhollan: mythvideo has imdb scripts which do this for you

[06:42:36]

Dagmar:

You don't run the thing manually.

[06:42:42]

rhollan:

hads: yes, except they aren't working

[06:42:56]

rhollan:

I see they want a "movie ID". Where do they get that from?

[06:43:13]

hads:

Um, imdb.

[06:43:24]

Dagmar:

From IMDB.

[06:43:24]

Dagmar:

[06:43:24]

Dagmar:

[06:43:24]

Dagmar:

[06:43:33]

rhollan:

hads: no, they SEND the movie ID as part of the request to imdb

[06:43:50]

Dagmar:

...and again, you *don't* run imdb.pl yourself.

[06:43:51]

hads:

rhollan: I know how it works.

[06:44:08]

Aval0n:

can you pull QAM channels off standard coax cable without a STB?

[06:44:12]

rhollan:

Well, mythvideo isn't doing it for me

[06:44:37]

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[06:44:41]

Dagmar:

Running it manually isn't going to do you any good.

[06:44:44]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Most places these days do ADS, so if Aval0n has basic cable, and digital is available in his area, then he can get the OTA HD channels via QAM most likely

[06:45:03]

Aval0n:

tanthrix thanks

[06:45:11]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Yeah, but at the moment he doesn't appear to know which end of the coax goes in his mouth.

[06:45:13]

rhollan:

Does mythvideo add the appropriate parameter to the imdb.pl -P command? If so, WHERE does it get it from?

[06:45:32]

Aval0n:

funny

[06:45:45]

Aval0n:

just because I know nothing about myth doesn't mean I'm an idiot

[06:46:06]

hads:

rhollan: See mythplugins/mythvideo/mythvideo/scripts/README

[06:46:35]

Aval0n:

Anyway, thanks for the answers to my questions guys

[06:46:41]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Give it a rest. Your little cranky fests about the terrible, gross stupidity of the world (and those parts of it that enter here) grow tiresome. You may be very knowledgable, but you are not nearly omniscient enough to act as you do.

[06:46:44]

Aval0n:

I need to hit the sack... work tomorrow.

[06:47:01]

Tanthrix:

Aval0n: The Kworld is a decent card I believe. I've got the A180 which is the same chip, and it has worked perfectly without a hitch.

[06:47:04]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: You'd be suprised at how close to omnicient I am.

[06:47:08]

Tanthrix:

hehe

[06:47:25]

Aval0n:

maybe apathetic

[06:47:29]

Aval0n:

heh

[06:47:33]

Aval0n:

goodnight tanthrix

[06:47:40]

Tanthrix:

Aval0n: (Assuming the Kworld is supported just as well as the A180, which I believe it is. In any case, I haven't had a single hitch with it since I started using it, and it only took about 15 minutes to go from box to working.)

[06:47:57]

Aval0n:

oh! i had one last question

[06:48:18]

Aval0n:

someone was telling me that there is a myth pre packaged for ubuntu

[06:48:22]

Aval0n:

anyone know where I can find that?

[06:48:22]

Dagmar:

Someone's got to encourage these people to try using that new Google thing.

[06:48:26]

Dagmar:

ffs

[06:48:52]

Tanthrix:

Aval0n: I think it's just part of the default package repositories, or maybe a third party one. I don't use Ubuntu so I'm not sure.

[06:48:57]

Dagmar:

http://www.google.com/search?q=ubuntu+mythtv

[06:49:10]

Aval0n:

dagmar if you had the choice to go fishing in the ocean for food, and fish all day before you get a bite, or throw some tastey bate in a bucket full of fish...

[06:49:12]

Aval0n:

which would you do

[06:49:13]

Aval0n:

:P

[06:49:22]

Dagmar:

I'D LEARN TO FISH.

[06:49:33]

Aval0n:

assuming you know how to fish

[06:49:45]

Dagmar:

...because knowing how to fish means THE HEADHUNTERS DON'T EAT YOU WHEN YOU TAKE THEIR BAIT.

[06:50:08]

Aval0n:

http://www.google.com/search?q=correct%20spelling%20of%20I'de

[06:50:20]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Yes, because this chan is just so bustling that a person asking a question that can be answered elsewhere (likely, every single question concievable short of a few originals) causes the entire channel implode upon itself...

[06:50:30]

Dagmar:

Hey look, you *can* use Google.

[06:50:56]

Dagmar:

Now stop being a lamer.

[06:51:01]

rhollan:

hads: yes, I know this, but WHERE in the ripped DVD does mythvideo find the movieid to pass to imdb.pl -P ?

[06:51:24]

Dagmar:

The FIRST DAMN LINK from Google said not only where the MythTV binaries for Ubuntu could be obtained, but also had detailed instructions on how to set it up

[06:51:26]

Aval0n:

http://www.google.com/search?q=pot%20calling%20kettle%20black

[06:51:34]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: I'd wager that the amount of time people spend complaining in here about users asking simple (to us) questions is probably not to far outside of the same league as the amount of time the said users take to ask their questions...

[06:51:58]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: So basically, you're proposing that at certain times of day, really stupid "I'm too lazy to Google, you do it for me" questions can be asked

[06:52:10]

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[06:53:03]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Guess what... Unless someone's retarded, you only have to tell them to Google 5–6 times before they start actually thinking they might be smarter than a sponge and can use it.

[06:53:15]

** Tanthrix sighs **

[06:53:19]

Dagmar:

...but if you put up with being used as a search engine proxy, the questions NEVER stop.

[06:53:29]

Dagmar:

...so your theory falls flat.

[06:53:44]

Dagmar:

10s to type "use Google" x 5 = 50s

[06:53:58]

Dagmar:

10s to answer dumb questions x 1,000,000 == ?

[06:54:06]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Then don't fucking answer them! Just keep your damn mouth shut. You act as if there is a great scourage on your livelihood or something....

[06:54:15]

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[06:54:19]

Dagmar:

No, I don't. You're the one making this into some kind of high drama.

[06:54:42]

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[06:54:55]

Aval0n:

it's a user support channel dagmar, it's going to attract noobs

[06:55:04]

Aval0n:

I found this channel from google

[06:55:12]

Dagmar:

At *least* I went and checked the search terms as well as the top three hits before I pasted http://www.google.com/search?q=ubuntu+mythtv

[06:55:34]

Dagmar:

...instead of just making up some passive aggressive pedantic crapola URL.

[06:55:44]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: You don't? That's a laugh. I'd wager that the amount of time you do complaining around here is nearly three times your comments that are actually directed towards answering questions.

[06:56:00]

Dagmar:

You'd lose that wager.

[06:56:05]

Aval0n:

I tend to agree

[06:56:24]

Dagmar:

So basically, you object to me posting a link that takes someone straight to the answer to their damn question

[06:56:25]

Aval0n:

even when you answer the questions, you do it snidley

[06:56:32]

Dagmar:

Touch.

[06:56:37]

Dagmar:

s/Touch/Tough/;

[06:56:48]

Dagmar:

Stop insulting people by asking them to do your "grunt work"

[06:56:57]

Aval0n:

I never asked you to do anything

[06:56:59]

Dagmar:

At least _try_ to push a query into Google.

[06:57:07]

Aval0n:

I typed generic questions directed at the entire channel

[06:57:15]

Aval0n:

you're just the one that piped up

[06:57:27]

Tanthrix:

Meh, this is going nowhere.

[06:57:32]

Aval0n:

i need to get to sleep

[06:57:39]

Dagmar:

If you have a problem with it, go tell a grown-up.

[06:57:42]

Aval0n:

thanks for the help everyone

[06:57:45]

Aval0n:

goodnight

[06:57:47]

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[06:58:03]

Dagmar:

Most people don't get all that bent out of shape by being shown that indeed, the answer they seek ARE within Google.

[06:58:56]

Dagmar:

...and http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Category . . . apture_cards is just really hard to find in the wiki

[06:59:15]

Aval0n:

that's where I found the kworld...

[06:59:21]

Aval0n:

0_o

[06:59:27]

Aval0n:

anyway

[06:59:28]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: If you would really like to understand my point of view (which is not the strawman-esque objection you stated) I would be happy to PM it to you, but otherwise I'd like to end our fun little argument in the main chan.

[06:59:28]

Aval0n:

goodnight

[06:59:41]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Then stop whining.

[06:59:58]

** Aval0n sigh **

[07:00:55]

rhollan:

not getting posters is driving me nuts

[07:01:24]

Dagmar:

rhollan: IMDB may well have changed their website man.

[07:01:34]

rhollan:

I know imdb.pl is supposed to get a movieid parameter to the -P option, but where does mythvideo get it from?

[07:01:46]

Aval0n:

the stereotypical arrogant attitude, conjured from people that belive they possess a greater magnitude of intelligence by crowing to people to 'google it' or 'RTFM'

[07:01:46]

Dagmar:

rhollan: from the search function of IMDB

[07:01:59]

Dagmar:

Aval0n: No, I just happen to *have* a higher intelligence.

[07:02:07]

Aval0n:

lol

[07:02:18]

Aval0n:

I didn't know you were a comedian too

[07:02:24]

Dagmar:

...and I am telling you point blank that throwing questions at people that Google can readily answer is _counterproductive_

[07:03:00]

Dagmar:

It makes the people who would otherwise be ready and willing to help you when you DON'T have a stupid question, very hesitant to even bother.

[07:03:17]

Aval0n:

http://www.google.com/search?q=conceded

[07:03:19]

Dagmar:

http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

[07:03:45]

Dagmar:

http://www.google.com/search?q=passive+aggressive+bullshit

[07:03:56]

Aval0n:

lol

[07:04:25]

Dagmar:

Seriously man.

[07:04:31]

Dagmar:

I don't bear you any ill will.

[07:04:49]

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[07:04:59]

Dagmar:

I just know for a fact that people get a lot more out of their technology from doing the things most of us "testy" people are telling them to do

[07:05:00]

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[07:05:14]

Aval0n:

do you realize that the amount of time or energy you've spent on telling me how I I'm counterproductive by not using google, is actually conterproductive for you?

[07:05:15]

Dagmar:

I know your time is just as limited as everyone else's.

[07:05:24]

Dagmar:

No, because I've got time to kill right now.

[07:05:36]

Aval0n:

riigh

[07:05:38]

Aval0n:

t

[07:05:39]

Dagmar:

However, if I blow 10 minutes bitching at you and it starts saving you 5 minutes a day...

[07:05:51]

Aval0n:

ble

[07:05:54]

Dagmar:

...of course it can only save you time if you _pay heed_

[07:05:55]

Aval0n:

time to sleep

[07:05:56]

Aval0n:

later lol

[07:06:36]

Aval0n:

arguing on irc is light running in the special olympics, even if you win.. you're still retarded

[07:06:40]

rhollan:

Dagmar: O.K. What does it search on?

[07:06:49]

Dagmar:

rhollan: Mainly the filename

[07:06:59]

rhollan:

Dagmar: and how is that passed to imdb.pl?

[07:08:46]

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[07:08:56]

rhollan:

Dagmar: sorry, all I see in the source to imdb.pl is that it already expects an IMDB movie id

[07:09:01]

rhollan:

no search

[07:09:19]

Ribs:

Does mythtv compile on ppc64 ?

[07:09:25]

Ribs:

or should I use ppc32?

[07:09:54]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: You take the whole mission to end stupid questions within a hair's width trolling. (As it stands now you just come off as a extremely bitter, stereotypical Aspergers-esque geek- I would have put you in ignore years ago if I didn't like you. In any case, I do agree with some of what you're saying, I just think you take it overboard. Humans are social creatures. Most like speaking with other like minded people instead of

[07:10:24]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: See, GENERALLY I don't have assholes dragging this argument out forever, which is the bulk of why this argument is still going on

[07:11:31]

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[07:11:36]

Dagmar:

rhollan: Well, something's looking up the IMBD number using the filename, because I've used it enough times to recognize the lists that come back from IMDB on vague names for what they are, but I still say IMDB has most likely finally changed their site to prevent scraping of posters

[07:11:53]

Dagmar:

...because they've been making incremental changes here and there for weeks now

[07:12:16]

Dagmar:

...and their site terms of service pretty much explicitly forbids the sort of scraping that MythTV does

[07:12:21]

Tanthrix:

Nothing for the better, for sure.

[07:12:40]

rhollan:

Dagmar: O.K. I see where it tries to map the title to the movieid.

[07:12:52]

rhollan:

it uses $movieid for both

[07:13:01]

Tanthrix:

They have the biggest bloody database of movies on the planet, and I still can't say "Show me all the movies from 1990–2007 that are sci-fi and have a rating of 6.0 or above"

[07:13:16]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: It would be a massive load on their servers

[07:13:46]

Dagmar:

...plus, that's kind of counter to the way advertisers and media pimps think.

[07:13:55]

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[07:14:10]

Dagmar:

They figure if you can tunnel straight in to find exactly what you want, then that's time lost they could spend trying to sell you more crap.

[07:14:35]

Dagmar:

Most of IMDB's information basically exists at the pleasure of law firms not suing them into oblivion.

[07:14:58]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: I'm not sure I buy the burden on their servers argument, but the rest I do unfortunately. It's just a shame.

[07:15:20]

Dagmar:

Think for a moment how many crappy science fiction movies have been produced in that time frame.

[07:15:39]

Dagmar:

...or, more accurately, how many movies have been produced in that timeframe.

[07:16:02]

Dagmar:

There's several hundred megabytes of info right there

[07:16:18]

Dagmar:

...now multiply that by a few hundred times a second.

[07:16:39]

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[07:16:57]

Tanthrix:

I think their severs can handle it. They can handle this quite easily: http://imdb.com/list

[07:17:15]

Dagmar:

IMDB's site has steadily been becoming more and more grown-over with ads just to keep up with the care and feeding of the equipment that is a requisite of their own popularity

[07:17:21]

Tanthrix:

Though, that's a different ball of wax considering the search that it is.

[07:17:37]

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[07:18:23]

Dagmar:

Not to bust your chops, but it appears that you CAN do that very search you wanted.

[07:18:59]

Dagmar:

...which is probably why their site is reaching the "annoys the crap out of me" point with bouncing, jiggling, flashing, ad-hackery

[07:19:02]

Tanthrix:

Unfortunately not – see number 1.

[07:19:16]

Tanthrix:

Gotta enter some search terms. (Which is why that kind of search is easier than the one I'd like to do)

[07:19:17]

tjcarter:

I'd like to see Myth integrate with tv.com

[07:19:30]

Dagmar:

Dude, I just did that query.

[07:19:32]

hads:

tjcarter: Go for it! :)

[07:19:53]

Dagmar:

"Here are the 1779 matching titles:"

[07:19:58]

tjcarter:

hads: MySQL is still voodoo to me =(

[07:20:22]

Dagmar:

I didn't have to enter any search terms in

[07:20:32]

tjcarter:

hads: And I'm more worried at present about a build system so I can produce Mac MythFrontend that doesn't blow ;)

[07:20:49]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: You're right. I guess it never occured to me to try it anyway. I'm so used to forms bitching and moaning about leaving stuff out.

[07:20:55]

rhollan:

AH HA

[07:21:05]

tjcarter:

there's one posted to a blog, but it's almost a year old now.

[07:21:09]

rhollan:

www.imdb.com/List?words=<title?

[07:21:19]

tjcarter:

well, 9 months

[07:21:23]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Ahh... now I see how they're pulling that off. I completely forgot they're owned by Amazon now

[07:21:50]

tjcarter:

it's kinda slow, pukes occasionally without reason, and can't adjust aspect

[07:22:12]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Don't see a way to sort out stuff that as below X number of votes. I don't care to sort through the thousands of uber obscure out there that 4–5 people really loved.

[07:22:19]

Tanthrix:

Still, better than I had previously thought.

[07:22:24]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Look in section 4.

[07:22:26]

Tanthrix:

Oh damn it.

[07:22:31]

Dagmar:

heh

[07:22:50]

tjcarter:

haha

[07:23:21]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Well, cool! Thanks – this will give me a new outlet to find movies. I've pretty much seen all the stuff on the top 250 lists that look interesting to me, but there's quite a few things in the 6.0–7.0 range that I miss out on.

[07:23:42]

Tanthrix:

Not that I only see movies based on the often flawed imdb ratings, but it's usually better than nothing.

[07:23:44]

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[07:24:05]

Dagmar:

Do you begin to see the utility in telling people unequivocally that they CAN search things?

[07:24:57]

Dagmar:

It's when I'm _answering_ lame questions readily that people should be offended.

[07:25:06]

Tanthrix:

I never said such a thing was bad. It's the often attached attitude that I find so annoying and unuseful.

[07:25:12]

Dagmar:

That's a sure sign I've become convinced they've suffered brain damage.

[07:25:39]

Dagmar:

If people get mad and use Google to spite me, I'll still be happy about it.

[07:25:56]

** hads nods in agreement with Tanthrix **

[07:26:44]

Dagmar:

If there's no grumpiness involved, people ignore it, or find it suspicious

[07:26:56]

hads:

Bollocks

[07:27:01]

Tanthrix:

With a capital B.

[07:27:02]

Dagmar:

...and rather frequently people will assume that you're being sarcastic when you're being nice

[07:27:19]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: So it's better to make sure they know that you are? hehe

[07:28:10]

** Tanthrix makes sweet love to the imdb search engine **

[07:28:44]

Dagmar:

See http://www.lifehack.org/articles/lifestyle/th . . . younger.html

[07:29:26]

Dagmar:

Specifically "Most of it doesn.t matter", "The loudest noise in the world is the sound of people whining", and especially "Trying to please other people is largely a futile activity"

[07:30:17]

** Tanthrix laughs at the irony of it all **

[07:30:27]

Dagmar:

Rather a lot of corrollary action with Augustine's Laws in there

[07:30:36]

Dagmar:

...but those are a much more gnomic read

[07:32:08]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Hey if they're mad at me, then they're too busy being mad at me to get discouraged because they've been acting a git

[07:32:22]

Dagmar:

I got *no* problem being the man wielding the rolled up paper.

[07:32:39]

Dagmar:

...because it generally means no one's going to have to weild the brickbat later.

[07:33:25]

hads:

It's pretty boring to watch.

[07:34:03]

Dagmar:

Well, we could always start engaging in personal attacks against the newbs, and drive them back to TiVo-space

[07:34:10]

Dagmar:

...but I don't think that would be very productive.

[07:35:23]

Dagmar:

Of course, if someone comes in here asking for help compiling Myth on SCO Unix... for those people we should pull out all the stops.

[07:35:33]

Tanthrix:

I wish I could find some greeting card software that wasn't designed for 2 year olds.

[07:35:53]

Dagmar:

I know 10-year olds that can use Adobe Illustrator

[07:36:42]

Tanthrix:

I know enough to get around in Illustrator, but it's still a mystery to me. I'll take photoshop anyday – just wish it had better vector support.

[07:36:53]

Tanthrix:

Been meaning to pick up a book or two to fix that.

[07:36:54]

Dagmar:

Ya pick an italic font, you paste a picture of a flower upside down on the upper right, and some sappy aphorism in the lower left, print, and fold up

[07:37:07]

Dagmar:

I use Inkscape

[07:38:27]

Tanthrix:

Dagmar: Well, there's always that route.

[07:38:59]

Dagmar:

The best part about using Inkscape is that you can stuff $100 in your next four cards and then no one cares if they look crappy or not

[07:39:03]

juski:

muhahahah "You can rarely, if ever, please, placate, change, or mollify an asshole"

[07:39:30]

Dagmar:

Someone's familiar with Norman Augustine

[07:42:56]

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[07:45:09]

juski:

roflmao. an anagram of my real name.. "Jobs Shit Runny"

[07:47:34]

tjcarter:

juski: that's a good quote.

[07:50:18]

juski:

Tanthrix: don't you like Fisher Price "my 1st ever XYZ program" packages? :-P

[07:50:29]

Dagmar:

linuxpackages.net?

[07:50:30]

Tanthrix:

hehe

[07:50:49]

juski:

I loved Ulead software so much the first time I used it I went out & bought Sony Vegas

[07:51:01]

Dagmar:

How drunk were *you*?

[07:51:15]

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[07:51:20]

juski:

oh did I say loved? oops

[07:51:36]

juski:

forgot the quotes around it :-P

[07:51:45]

Tanthrix:

Writing bereavement notes is tricky. I hate to use any of those annoying touchy feely cliche stuff, but it seems hard to avoid

[07:52:16]

juski:

"at this terrible time, a few words of comfort... yada yada yada,, special person, puke"

[07:52:33]

Tanthrix:

Aye.

[07:53:02]

juski:

or "I couldn't summon the words to say to you in person or on the phone, so I copped out & bought this card"

[07:54:17]

Tanthrix:

Letter writing is a lost art I'm afraid to say.

[07:54:35]

juski:

I hate buying cards. In the North of the UK, we tend to say "Mam" a term for 'mother' yet there've been no cards that say it. There's the poofy 'mum' but ever more prevalent (EEK!) is 'MOM'.

[07:55:01]

juski:

Tanthrix: handwriting is a lost art ;)

[07:55:29]

Dagmar:

So, you could just say "mother"

[07:55:33]

Tanthrix:

Well, I'm afraid my romance for the past ends there. My handwriting is terrible, and I've always been a little cranky about it.

[07:55:39]

juski:

iz it coz i iz tlkn txt spk? u btr lrn how 2 gt it

[07:55:41]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Use crayons.

[07:55:44]

Tanthrix:

(Cranky that it has such value attached to it in some places)

[07:55:58]

juski:

Dagmar: 'mother' sounds poofy too

[07:55:58]

Dagmar:

Crayons & Glitter.

[07:56:06]

Dagmar:

They'll think you're being kitchy

[07:56:27]

Dagmar:

juski: Well, seems to me you guys think every term of address for your mothers is poofy

[07:56:45]

Dagmar:

Perhaps "Mah biatch" will work and be masculine enough

[07:56:55]

juski:

Dagmar: Mam will do

[07:57:06]

Dagmar:

...but it's short for madam.

[07:57:14]

Tanthrix:

juski: That's interesting, never heard of that before.

[07:57:15]

juski:

we don't go round saying MOM that's for sure

[07:57:58]

juski:

I can't stand the Americanization (sic) of the UK

[07:58:19]

Tanthrix:

juski: Then again, I was *astonished* that the world-US pronouces the letter Z as "zed" instead of "zee"

[07:58:23]

Dagmar:

juski: ...apparently it's having it's effect on you.

[07:58:54]

Dagmar:

You didn't type 'Americanisation'

[07:59:15]

Dagmar:

...or 'Colonialification'.

[07:59:16]

juski:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic

[07:59:18]

Dagmar:

;)

[08:00:08]

juski:

small thing I know but mythtv's British translations made using the program much more bearable for me

[08:00:51]

Tanthrix:

Oooo. Maybe I'll switch mine over to UK English so I can feel all special.

[08:01:05]

Dagmar:

Tanthrix: Note that the rest of the world can write well enough that you can distinguish between their 2's and their Z's.

[08:01:29]

Dagmar:

...so we don't need the fruity crossbar that apparently makes a z into a eurotrash zed.

[08:01:54]

Tanthrix:

heh

[08:02:34]

Tanthrix:

(And for the record, I learned about the zed bit from Stargate Atlantis – TV is oh so educational sometimes.)

[08:03:38]

juski:

Tanthrix: yeah, like Sesame Street :D

[08:04:07]

Tanthrix:

Bah Sesame Street. Mr. Rogers and Reading Rainbow were far superior, and less annoying by far.

[08:04:18]

juski:

now that's done it. I've got one of those "1 2 3 4 5, 6 7 8 9 10, 11 12" songs in my head now. argghh!

[08:05:13]

Tanthrix:

juski: How's this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Mhd8Xk8ojU

[08:05:43]

juski:

Tanthrix: can't watch it. no youtube allowed here

[08:05:58]

Tanthrix:

At work?

[08:06:00]

juski:

we got surfpatrol back

[08:06:34]

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[08:06:38]

Tanthrix:

Shame. Robot Chicken Sesame Street spoof.

[08:07:29]

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[08:09:10]

Dagmar:

Bummer.

[08:09:14]

Tanthrix:

And damn that's annoying. Treat adults like children, and children are what you will get.

[08:09:23]

Dagmar:

I'm having no luck pulling up a non-YouTube version of "Read A Book" by Armah

[08:09:35]

Tanthrix:

(And the opposite is true quite frequently.)

[08:09:37]

Dagmar:

It's good for washing all sorts of pop nonsense out of the brain.

[08:11:29]

Tanthrix:

That's the best rap song I've heard, probably ever. (Though, in fairness, that's not hard to do)

[08:12:05]

Dagmar:

I agree.

[08:12:10]

Dagmar:

It is full of win.

[08:12:32]

Dagmar:

I keep it on my PDA so I can blast it at people sometimes.

[08:12:46]

Dagmar:

...especially when they have spinners.

[08:13:00]

Tanthrix:

Spinners?

[08:13:09]

Dagmar:

"Buy some land, buy some land... F**K SPINNIN' RIMS!"

[08:17:04]

Tanthrix:

Man, if I ever get annoyed at comments on slashdot, all I need do is read some youtube ones for about a quarter of a second to be snapped back into reality.

[08:20:35]

Dagmar:

Read at +3

[08:23:33]

Tanthrix:

I finally gave in and did that recently

[08:23:54]

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[08:24:08]

Dagmar:

I wonder if they realize more people would meta-moderate if it meant eventually being able to post at +3

[08:25:23]

Tanthrix:

Meta-moderating is for suckers!

[08:34:26]

Dagmar:

Someone has to do it

[08:34:38]

Dagmar:

Otherwise, those fuckers POSTING will do all the meta-moderation.

[08:47:55]

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[08:59:50]

hads:

Language

[09:00:14]

juski:

lamngoooage, timmothay!

[09:00:47]

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juski:

laga: forums are way badly down!

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[10:21:17]

rooaus:

!seen xris

[10:21:17]

MythLogBot:

xris was last seen 3 hours 36 minutes 40 seconds ago

[10:22:35]

gbee:

would anyone with a KDE bugzilla account care to help me abuse the voting process by voting for this bug: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=145773 ?

[10:23:58]

gbee:

not that I think it will help, seems the dev in charge is asleep

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[10:42:10]

Dagmar:

Any of you ubuntu people able to tell me what the version of pam_keyring you have installed is?

[10:46:14]

pat_:

http://packages.ubuntu.com/

[10:46:22]

pat_:

search for the file and distribution there

[10:46:30]

pat_:

you'll be able to tell the package revision

[10:47:08]

Dagmar:

Hm.... This might be useful

[10:47:10]

pat_:

(I couldn't find pam_keyring on dapper (which I run))

[10:48:17]

Dagmar:

Yeah, their search engine is a little screwey. libpam-keyring will turn it up

[10:48:33]

Dagmar:

I'm in the middle of trying to get this module built for Dropline

[10:52:29]

Dagmar:

Looks like they're using 0.0.8–6

[10:55:01]

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[11:14:07]

lexs:

hm, would a 2.0ghz intel e4400 c2d be able to playback hd dvt-b and play 720p content?

[11:14:21]

lexs:

*dvb-t even :)

[11:15:33]

juski:

lexs: if it's mpeg2, sure

[11:16:26]

lexs:

but if its x264?

[11:16:35]

juski:

good luck!

[11:16:54]

lexs:

my 2.4ghz e6600 can play 720p x264 with 30% cpu

[11:16:54]

quicksilver:

when someone releases a working dual-threaded x264 decoder, it probably will

[11:17:25]

juski:

lexs: in linux? I still say good luck

[11:17:27]

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[11:17:32]

lexs:

yes, in linux

[11:17:35]

lexs:

with mplayer

[11:18:45]

lexs:

uh, give me a hardware x264 decoder

[11:18:56]

Dagmar:

Nope

[11:18:58]

juski:

pfffffffffffft

[11:20:36]

lexs:

hm, maybe i should get a e6600 for my htpc then

[11:20:42]

lexs:

or even use the one in this comp :)

[11:20:59]

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[11:21:43]

juski:

why? it's not like you can offload decoding h.264 to the GPU

[11:23:13]

lexs:

because this computer can play x264?

[11:23:49]

juski:

x264 isn't the name of the format anyway

[11:24:12]

lexs:

s/x264/h264

[11:43:35]

sege:

looking for an rf remote, any suggestions?

[11:44:06]

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[11:45:29]

laga:

sege: i've got an ati remote first generation. i don't like it very much, it's not very good quality

[11:46:06]

sege:

ok, i've read about others not being too happy about it either. sounds bad, then i dont want that one =)

[11:46:38]

juski:

wooo. the leisure group I used to work for now has venues in manchest-uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[11:48:33]

quicksilver:

has anyone had a weird problem where button presses on their remote doesn't wake up dpms anymore?

[11:48:37]

quicksilver:

it used to work fine

[11:48:49]

quicksilver:

I think it's to do with how I start mythtv, but I haven't quite worked it out

[11:49:29]

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[11:56:30]

Dagmar:

joy

[11:58:43]

laga:

woohoo. i broke my frontend install on my usb stick and deleted the backup.

[11:59:42]

juski:

nice going laga!

[12:00:29]

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[12:00:42]

lexs:

how big is a typical mythtv install, including OS?

[12:01:25]

juski:

my frontend fits in under 128MB

[12:02:09]

laga:

lexs: 1–2GB

[12:02:16]

juski:

you can easily get a regular distro down to < 1GB

[12:02:25]

lexs:

so a 4gig CF card would be enough :)

[12:02:41]

juski:

don't ponce around with CF cards. go diskless :)

[12:03:10]

lexs:

na, its a backend/frontend machine

[12:03:30]

laga:

where are you going to store your recordings?

[12:04:24]

lexs:

on a disk in the machine

[12:05:11]

lexs:

500gb is cheap these days

[12:05:33]

lexs:

btw, can you record directly over the network?

[12:06:02]

lexs:

or can you record to a local disk and then automatically transfer them to a NAS?

[12:06:24]

juski:

just record over the network. the latter option would be lame

[12:06:38]

lexs:

but how would timeshift work then?

[12:06:47]

lexs:

cant work very good over network can it?

[12:06:49]

juski:

storage is storage

[12:07:09]

juski:

even HDTV doesn't amount to much bandwidth

[12:07:29]

juski:

like maybe 18Mbits/sec

[12:07:59]

RaYmAn-Bx:

seriously? SOmeone really should make online HDTV available (for cash)

[12:08:05]

lexs:

hm, ill think ill stick to a local disk for now, i dont even have a NAS yet

[12:08:14]

lexs:

thats in the future

[12:09:16]

juski:

RaYmAn-Bx: of course, seriously

[12:09:32]

juski:

,man, what's wrong with everybody today? wear their brains out over the weekend or something?

[12:09:44]

RaYmAn-Bx:

quite so.

[12:14:12]

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[12:35:25]

fryfrog:

I've recorded via NFS, it is no big deal

[12:35:46]

dererk:

Morning

[12:35:54]

fryfrog:

think about it... SD content is like 1–2mb/sec, max. This is *nothing* for a 100mbit network and 1000mbit don't care either

[12:36:02]

dererk:

juski, hi. I could set my mythtv run :D

[12:36:02]

fryfrog:

you could *almost* do it on 10mbit :)

[12:36:14]

dererk:

juski, I've just minors problems, but, it's working atm

[12:36:23]

fryfrog:

and HD over network isn't bad either, though its a bit harder.

[12:36:43]

fryfrog:

oh, humm i think i had my SD figure mixed up with HD. HD is usually ~19mbit/sec, which is 1–2mb/sec

[12:36:46]

fryfrog:

so SD is way lower

[12:39:30]

laga:

aptitude is confusing.

[12:39:52]

fryfrog:

in what way?

[12:40:03]

fryfrog:

oh, you mean the ncurses gui?

[12:40:18]

fryfrog:

i always use it as cmdline, i agree the gui is confusing :)

[12:40:32]

laga:

i don't really understand how it resolves dependencies. it kept trying to remove gdm when run in GUI mode. in cli mode, it didn't try to resolve any dependencies like it usually does

[12:40:35]

laga:

yep

[12:40:46]

laga:

now i told it to keep all packages. it's pulling in firefox now..

[12:40:53]

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[12:41:14]

fryfrog:

I always just use "sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude dist-upgrade" seems to work okay for me

[12:41:23]

laga:

juski: do you want an image for the s100 or not?

[12:41:27]

laga:

fryfrog: yup.

[12:41:33]

fryfrog:

(i'm still pointed at a feisty repo, not to gutsy or anything)

[12:41:46]

fryfrog:

or sudo aptitude install <whatever>

[12:41:54]

laga:

i was on gutsy, but it seems agpgart is broken there for my chipset (corner case i suppose)

[12:41:57]

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[12:42:09]

fryfrog:

ah

[12:42:17]

fryfrog:

you downgrading to feisty from gutsy?

[12:42:24]

fryfrog:

or just trying to deal with gutsy?

[12:42:31]

laga:

no, i just reinstalled feisty ;)

[12:42:36]

fryfrog:

ah

[12:42:38]

laga:

it's quite fast with debootstrap

[12:42:47]

fryfrog:

*de*bootstrap?

[12:42:52]

laga:

yes.

[12:43:10]

laga:

mkdir target; sudo debootstrap feisty target/

[12:43:17]

fryfrog:

debootstrap is used to create a Debian base system from scratch, without requiring the availability of dpkg or apt. It does this by downloading .deb files from a mirror site, and carefully unpacking them into a directory which can eventually be chrooted into.

[12:43:21]

laga:

wait a few minutes, install kernel & bootloader, be happy.

[12:43:32]

fryfrog:

ah, interesting

[12:43:34]

juski:

laga: wouldn't say no to a -fixes stick :)

[12:43:52]

fryfrog:

*kind* of like a gentoo install, where you are running another distro and doing all your work on a mounted disk

[12:43:57]

laga:

well, it's a bit more complicated than that, but it's easy if you have done a few gentoo installs.

[12:44:00]

laga:

yes.

[12:44:15]

fryfrog:

crazy :)

[12:44:18]

laga:

juski:you get an image and do the aptitude install ubuntu-mythtv-frontend yourself :)

[12:44:24]

fryfrog:

you can do it over-top of an existing install?

[12:44:34]

laga:

fryfrog: i have set up a few remote servers like that. scary as hell ;)

[12:44:41]

fryfrog:

yeah, i imagine!

[12:44:46]

laga:

fryfrog: um. i doubt it's supported. i've always used empty directories

[12:44:49]

fryfrog:

i'm afraid to do a kernel upgrade remotly :)

[12:44:54]

laga:

heh

[12:45:02]

fryfrog:

laga: ah, i guess i didn't quite get it then but sounds need

[12:45:14]

laga:

fryfrog: it's ok if you have a remote console

[12:45:39]

fryfrog:

*if* you have a remote console :)

[12:45:44]

laga:

heh

[12:46:00]

laga:

or a rescue system, although that's more annoying than a serial console

[12:46:02]

fryfrog:

usually at work at like 9 or 10am I think "oh, my home server will come back up if i do the kernel upgrade!"

[12:46:19]

fryfrog:

it is at *that* point that i have to go w/o my ssh/irc all day :p

[12:46:19]

laga:

this hoster i'm using now gives me a serial console over ssh. that's neat.

[12:46:26]

laga:

heh

[12:46:32]

fryfrog:

if I wait till 4–5pm, then of course it goes fine :)

[12:46:39]

fryfrog:

ah, we have a bunch of those for our sun boxes

[12:46:49]

fryfrog:

but not setup for our linux ones

[12:47:01]

laga:

i assume they're expensive

[12:47:01]

fryfrog:

I'd like a tcp/ip kvm for the windows/linux boxes

[12:47:13]

fryfrog:

i doubt they are *that* expensive

[12:47:24]

fryfrog:

it is just a little thing with a bunch of serial ports

[12:47:27]

laga:

i just want a normal kvm. unplugging the monitor/keyboard all the time is annoying

[12:47:38]

laga:

fryfrog: it could just be an old box with a lot of serial ports.

[12:47:41]

fryfrog:

mmm, <3 my Cybex Autoboot Comander 4 :)

[12:48:03]

fryfrog:

laga: probably not, these rack mount serial console devices are pretty standard datacenter gear

[12:48:21]

laga:

yes, but "old linux box" sounds cheaper ;)

[12:48:26]

fryfrog:

ahha

[12:48:41]

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[12:49:03]

laga:

we pay like 20 EUR/month for this server. you can't expect a lot of fancy geatr

[12:49:32]

BCMM:

should a WinTV PVR USB 2 be setup as an analogue v4l capture card or as a mpeg-2 encoder card?

[12:49:44]

fryfrog:

holey crap, $800 – $3000 is a quick google search

[12:49:59]

fryfrog:

whelp, time to shower

[12:50:00]

laga:

BCMM: mpeg-2 hardware encoder

[12:50:34]

BCMM:

laga: that isn't on the menu do you mean mpeg-2 encoder card?

[12:50:42]

laga:

BCMM: yes

[12:50:51]

BCMM:

laga: thanks

[12:50:52]

laga:

sorry for the confusion

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[13:02:38]

Aval0n:

guys, if I have a kworld 115 HD card, and a pvr 150. Assuming in my main room I want HD and good analog, Can I use the HD tuner from the kworld and the analog tuner from the pvr150 in the main room and then the kworlds analog encoder for the bedroom?

[13:03:27]

Aval0n:

cause I hear that none mpeg-2 cards (most HD cards) suck for recording analog

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[13:22:07]

juski:

I wouldn't use a framegrabber for wiping my backside

[13:22:33]

juski:

or to put it another way, I wouldn't touch a framegrabber with *yours*, mate

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[13:37:55]

Dagmar:

Aval0n: I could swear we went over this last night. For HD content, unless your rig is getting a digital stream that's already MPG2, there's *no hope* of you actually framegrabbing HD content without a ludicrous amount of CPU (we're talking 4.5Ghz+)

[13:38:28]

Dagmar:

SD content works out just like the HOWTO says, but it's still the worst possible use of CPU power.

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[14:08:26]

madmoses1:

hi, i installed mythbuntu and make a dist-upgrade, after this i started mythtv and i cant see the fonts off mythtv in the menu, why?

[14:08:33]

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[14:11:44]

juski:

argghhh god I wish you lot wouldn't even bother trying a dist-upgrade

[14:12:39]

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[14:13:51]

juski:

like hey I upgraded my distro to something completely different & now stuff is borked :-O

[14:13:59]

juski:

incredible!

[14:14:35]

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[14:17:32]

laga:

madmoses1: try #ubuntu-mythtv

[14:18:37]

Dagmar:

Could be worse.

[14:18:56]

Dagmar:

You could have had it strip out all the MythTV stuff and convert the box to Debian Stable.

[14:18:59]

juski:

hey! I just had a labotomy. should I install mythtv now?

[14:19:07]

laga:

debian stable is not that bad for mythtv

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[14:45:11]

keith4:

i run myth on debian stable

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[15:21:32]

snarkster:

hi there, I built a mythtv box and during my testing phase I found that i had internet radio functionality, but after I finsihed my testing and breaking it I rebuilt it but now I dont have internet radio anymore.. what did I do wrong?

[15:21:52]

snarkster:

is that a package that I didnt install?

[15:21:56]

jarle_:

On my myth-backend tv_grab_no returns "no 'id' attribute in channel at /usr/share/perl5/XMLTV.pm line 2309", but it works fine on my desktop machine. Both machines running same version of ubuntu-linux. Any hints?

[15:23:58]

gbee:

snarkster: just guessing, but it sounds like you had a package with eskil's shoutcast patch applied

[15:24:42]

snarkster:

hmm im running mythdora 4 and i reinstalled with the same setting as the first time.. wonder why it doesnt work now.

[15:25:48]

Dibblah:

Mmmm... Core2Duo mobile. 40w from-the-wall draw. With a not so great PSU.

[15:25:49]

gbee:

internet radio isn't an official part of mythtv/mythmusic at the moment, although I'd like to integrate eskil's patch at some point

[15:25:55]

snarkster:

i thought i saw something about mythstreams is that a real package?

[15:26:22]

gbee:

http://home.kabelfoon.nl/~moongies/streamtuned.html

[15:26:26]

gbee:

unofficial

[15:27:40]

Dibblah:

That's power consumption in a real board, at BIOS, with no throttling, I'd guess.

[15:29:16]

gbee:

heh, from the FAQ on that page – "Second issue is that the MythTV developers do not want mplayer at the core. I do not know why. Unfortunately, my questions to MythTV developers remain unanswered."

[15:29:36]

snarkster:

whats the matter with mplayer?

[15:29:49]

snarkster:

i use xine only because thats how it came to me.

[15:29:59]

gbee:

why does everyone want mythtv to use mplayer, xine, vlc or some other player instead of the internal one?

[15:30:12]

snarkster:

no clue

[15:30:25]

snarkster:

i didnt know there was an internal one

[15:30:27]

gbee:

snarkster: shouldn't need either xine or mplayer with 0.20

[15:30:28]

Dagmar:

gbee: Maybe he wants to wake up and realize that it's not such a safe thing having a screenshot labeled "recording stream" with an RIAA-signed artist in the box

[15:31:28]

gbee:

snarkster: the internal player is the default from 0.20 for new installs (and if I get my way, the only available choice from 0.21)

[15:31:49]

snarkster:

hmm are there updates??

[15:31:50]

gbee:

to use it, replace the xine/mplayer commands with "internal" (no quotes)

[15:31:59]

snarkster:

maybe i should just run yum update

[15:34:03]

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[15:34:18]

snarkster:

see that sounds so easy, but where are the xine/mplayer commands found?

[15:34:29]

snarkster:

is that in the video setup section?

[15:35:18]

snarkster:

uses ffmpeg i bet right?

[15:35:48]

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[15:37:59]

snarkster:

wow I issued the yum update command about 5 minutes ago.. its just now finisheing up

[15:38:46]

snarkster:

yah alot of updates

[15:39:02]

snarkster:

hmm has mythweather been fixed? :)

[15:39:25]

gbee:

no, mythweather is dead ... long live mythweather-revamp

[15:39:59]

gbee:

snarkster: depends if you are running -fixes or trunk

[15:40:20]

snarkster:

is mythweather-revamp active?

[15:40:27]

gbee:

snarkster: the internal player uses ffmpeg libs yes, although it's a modified version

[15:40:41]

gbee:

mythweather-revamp has replaced mythweather in trunk

[15:40:46]

snarkster:

to be honest i got mythtv because of watching movies and the weather system.

[15:41:06]

Dagmar:

Ouch

[15:41:19]

snarkster:

yah tellme about it

[15:42:03]

snarkster:

never did get mythmusic to work

[15:42:10]

snarkster:

maybe thatll be easier in .2

[15:42:28]

gbee:

0.20

[15:42:36]

snarkster:

yes sorry

[15:42:42]

gbee:

it's twenty, not two ;)

[15:43:45]

snarkster:

wow i just cant believe how long its taking.. Ive been very lax on taking care of this box. shame on me.

[15:44:41]

juski:

truth is, mythstreamtv can be made to work with 0.20 – I have minimyth with 0.20 & mythstreamtv which is included works just fine most of the time

[15:45:53]

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[15:45:54]

GreyFoxx:

We should grab the source used for that

[15:45:54]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v j-rod

[15:46:22]

snarkster:

the update just failed claiming it needs libupnp.so.2 and gecko-libs.. when i try to install those it says nothing to do

[15:46:23]

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[15:49:56]

snarkster:

after upgrading do i need to restart?

[15:50:28]

juski:

why the big fuss that mythstreamtv can record anyway? it's not as if it's hard to record online streams if you really want to

[15:52:20]

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[15:52:40]

juski:

it might even all be academic anyway, since the whole future of internet radio is in question

[15:53:06]

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[15:55:04]

Dibblah:

"internet radio" as it exists at the moment is a limited proposition, compared to how it _should_ be.

[15:55:35]

Dagmar:

A cash cow for marketing directors to triple their profit margins with.

[15:55:50]

Dibblah:

ie single action required to say "I like and would like to purchase the track I just heard".

[15:56:14]

Dibblah:

No adverts – Nothing odd.

[15:56:21]

Dagmar:

..which will cost only a few cents more than just listening to the track once and only once, with extra fees if you listen with both ears.

[15:56:22]

Dibblah:

Just a _sales pitch_.

[15:56:30]

juski:

it still amazes me anybody even buys anything in the current top 40 – such is the heavy rotation they get on commercial radio

[15:57:15]

juski:

like the #1 we just got shot of – the abominable 'Umbrella' – 10 weeks. who the hell was buying it? there was no escape from it

[15:57:40]

Dibblah:

Could be worse. Could be the berk with the apple on his head again.

[15:57:51]

Dibblah:

Bryan Adams.

[15:58:15]

juski:

true. Or Wet Wet Wet, I spose

[15:59:03]

juski:

anyway it's still a mystery why people buy singles

[15:59:32]

Dibblah:

I don't believe I'm doing this again. I'm about to start following the Gentoo handbasket for Core2 :(

[15:59:58]

tank-man:

cause their ipods do not have fm tuners, thats why they buy top40 singles on itunes

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[16:03:01]

Dibblah:

s/handbasket/handbook/

[16:03:06]

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[16:04:57]

r10:

can any help me, I have problems with compilign mythtv abd says it is missing LAME even do that I have installed it..

[16:05:28]

Hoxzer:

Do you have -dev package installed ?

[16:05:44]

juski:

liblame-dev or similar is needed

[16:05:54]

Dagmar:

Source of problem: User doesn't actually know how to compile anything

[16:06:23]

juski:

if you're on ubuntu it's pretty easy to get all the build dependencies: apt-get build-dep mythtv mythplugins should suck most of them up

[16:06:31]

Dibblah:

Dagmar: Source of animosity: unknown.

[16:06:39]

r10:

ohh, just the normal version (the fix the error massage, it tells me that I need LAME, NOT the DEV version...

[16:07:19]

juski:

you should uninstall any packages of mythtv you had installed before you started building from source btw

[16:07:39]

juski:

nasty things can happen otherwise. bad brokenness

[16:08:18]

Dibblah:

Many chickens needed to fix.

[16:08:45]

xris:

r10: might it be that program names (lame) and package names (liblame, lame, lame-dev, lame-devel, etc) are different? packagers often split programs up into lots of pieces.

[16:09:28]

snarkster:

hmm i just yum installed mythplugins and its only 18k..

[16:09:31]

tank-man:

r10, did you install lame from source or package?

[16:09:33]

juski:

and different packagers like to call programs & libraries different things, for reasons best known to themselves

[16:09:37]

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[16:10:57]

juski:

so basically, the compiler should be omniscient & work out which bits are missing according to whatever the local distro calls them :-\

[16:11:08]

juski:

not a tall order at all :)

[16:12:49]

xris:

or just give up. :)

[16:15:52]

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[16:24:12]

juski:

well, I *was* gonna be continuing my new theme tonight, but I just can't be bothered

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[16:29:54]

Dagmar:

I think the compiler isn't vindicive enough

[16:30:08]

Dagmar:

If it thinks something is missing, it should delete a few more files to teach the user a lesson for wasting it's time.

[16:36:00]

opello:

heh, teach them to use version control anyway

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[16:44:57]

zntneo:

OK i have a setup question, i want 2 be able to record 4 things at the same time. What woudl be the best setup? all 4 in 1 comp, with maybe the storage on another comp. I have 3 comps i can use. and lots of hard drives

[16:46:34]

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[16:48:19]

gbee:

all four in one machine along with the storage, no sense wasting the other machines

[16:48:45]

zntneo:

oh the comps are just sittign around doing nothing

[16:48:57]

zntneo:

so it won't be a waste

[16:49:00]

gbee:

zntneo: what type of cards? so long as they are hardware encoders or dvb/atsc then there is no cpu overhead

[16:49:04]

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[16:49:13]

zntneo:

all pvr 500s

[16:49:24]

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[16:49:26]

zntneo:

what about card to harddrive?

[16:49:26]

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[16:50:41]

zntneo:

meaning how will the performance be if i had all 4 tuners. With a box with lots of hard drives.

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[16:53:09]

gbee:

no idea, but unless it's a cheap motherboard I don't think you'd have any performance problems

[16:53:22]

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[16:53:31]

juski:

zntneo: do the maths. you could consider 8mbits/sec to be a very high bitrate for SDTV. so take 4 * 8mbits/sec = 32mbits/sec = 4MB/sec (approx) – shouldn't even break into a sweat

[16:54:00]

Mr__Grieves:

anyone know of a way to delete transcoding profiles?

[16:54:10]

juski:

if the motherboard can't handle that kind of IO, it'd be from PC Chips :-P

[16:54:35]

gbee:

your more likely to see power problems with four PVR 500s and several drives

[16:54:37]

juski:

Mr__Grieves: you can't

[16:55:06]

gbee:

juski: thanks for reminding me, been meaning to fix that

[16:55:20]

zntneo:

how much cpu does the transcoding take?

[16:55:46]

juski:

zntneo: as much as you want it to

[16:55:50]

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[16:56:16]

juski:

zntneo: unless you plan to keep shedloads I wouldn't recommend transcoding – mostly a waste of time – even more so if you want to archive to dvd later

[16:56:28]

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[16:56:43]

zntneo:

well, i have to make it so that quicktime will read the vid

[16:56:49]

juski:

ugh!

[16:56:52]

zntneo:

yea i know

[16:56:55]

juski:

why?

[16:57:12]

juski:

anyway won't quicktime play mpeg2?

[16:57:25]

zntneo:

you have to buy something to get it to play

[16:57:36]

juski:

so use VLC. it's available for most platforms

[16:57:38]

Mr__Grieves:

ok. Everytime I try to do a manual transcode, it fails and the backend log says I need to set recording profiles for the transcoder. I've gone to the recording profile setup menu and selected transcoders and set some options in there, but it still fails. Any other ideas?

[16:57:55]

zntneo:

not eveyone who's goign to be watching this will even know what vlc is

[16:58:12]

gbee:

I use lossless transcoding to remove adverts, which probably is a waste of time with ~300Gb of recording space :)

[16:58:27]

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[16:59:02]

zntneo:

i also wantto be able to use idvd with these vids

[16:59:37]

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[16:59:48]

gbee:

Mr__Grieves: make sure there are options set for the "AutoDetect from" profiles

[17:00:28]

gbee:

iirc, those are the ones which get used for manual transcoding, otherwise I've no ideas

[17:00:46]

juski:

zntneo: so what formats can that crappy quicktime PoS play out of the box, other than apple rubbish?

[17:00:57]

zntneo:

mpeg4 works

[17:01:09]

zntneo:

thats what i'd prefer if possible

[17:01:33]

RaYmAn-Bx:

it certainly doesn't play divx/xvid formats out of the box..at least not on mac

[17:01:43]

juski:

myth can't transcode to 'proper' mpeg4 by default out of the box IIRC

[17:01:57]

zntneo:

yea, i'm thinking of using nuvexport to do that

[17:01:58]

gbee:

juski: it can't? huh

[17:02:08]

Dagmar:

It can only do mpeg3.999

[17:02:49]

gbee:

well I just learnt something new

[17:03:18]

zntneo:

i was thinking of setting up a user job that encodes using nuvexport to mpeg4

[17:03:18]

juski:

least I don't think it's regular ole mpeg4

[17:03:42]

juski:

zntneo: my recently submitted ipod script could do the biz with a teeny bit of tweaking

[17:03:50]

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[17:04:00]

Mr__Grieves:

gbee: I'm selecting job options from the "watch recordings" screen, then transcode > low quality. I think the problem may be that in the recording profile setup, there are about 7 entries named "Low Quality"...same with medium and high.

[17:04:03]

zntneo:

could i make that into a user job so it runs after every recording

[17:04:09]

juski:

zntneo: yeah easy

[17:04:09]

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[17:04:18]

zntneo:

says you :P

[17:04:31]

gbee:

zntneo: well that's definately not right :)

[17:04:35]

juski:

zntneo: but that way you need to get myth to keep the untranscoded recording AFAIK

[17:04:53]

gbee:

Mr__Grieves: err, well what I just accidently said to zntneo

[17:04:54]

zntneo:

to use nuvexport?

[17:05:15]

zntneo:

@juski sorry

[17:05:34]

Dagmar:

Secret: Don't _dare_ attempt to rename the transcoding profiles

[17:05:34]

juski:

zntneo: don't use nuvexport – it can be very difficult to set up to run as a user job

[17:05:42]

Dagmar:

Bad things will hapen

[17:05:46]

zntneo:

i see

[17:05:57]

juski:

aww Dagmar you're spoiling your own fun now

[17:05:58]

snarkster:

hmm still no internet streams..

[17:05:59]

zntneo:

so juski got a link to that script?

[17:06:02]

snarkster:

how do i install that

[17:06:08]

Mr__Grieves:

gbee: :) I can't figure out what happened there. possibly from using svn and reinstalling somewhat frequently? I guess I need some mySQL voodoo to fix the entries

[17:06:16]

Dagmar:

They are called for _by name_ and everything assumes they are still named the defaults

[17:06:53]

juski:

zntneo: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/14056

[17:07:13]

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[17:08:19]

zntneo:

any ideas on what i need to change?

[17:08:52]

juski:

zntneo: the ffmpeg line : $command = "nice -n19 ffmpeg -i $filename -vcodec xvid -b 300 -qmin 3 -qmax 5 -bufsize 4096 -g 300 -acodec aac -ab $bitrate -s $size -aspect $aspect '$newfilename' 2>&1";

[17:09:18]

juski:

zntneo: basically change the -vcodec & -acodec to a format quack-time supports

[17:09:44]

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[17:09:49]

juski:

should support aac out of the box, I'd hope ;)

[17:10:12]

zntneo:

hehe i like the quacktime. My coworker is an apple fanboy so he basically loves the program

[17:10:13]

juski:

actually shouldn't quacktime play the same formats the iPoo supports anyway?

[17:10:21]

zntneo:

i would think so

[17:10:28]

zntneo:

yea so i shouldn't need to change it

[17:10:36]

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[17:10:42]

zntneo:

maybe the resolution that you have. If it is diferent

[17:11:05]

juski:

default is 320x240. see the doc here: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Ipod_export

[17:13:12]

zntneo:

trying to decide if doing 4 of these jobs at once would be to hard on my machine. Any ideas juski?

[17:13:22]

ger_3d:

hello juski, did you get my e-mail today, Gerhard

[17:13:36]

juski:

ger_3d: yeah I did. I don't do MSN ;)

[17:14:38]

juski:

I like the format of those screenshots/mockups – but a couple of things: 1. the reflections could be more transparent. 2. the perspective of the icons should be the same if possible ;)

[17:14:45]

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[17:16:02]

ger_3d:

That's easy to fix

[17:16:30]

juski:

anyway, did you enjoy LRL as much as I did *not* enjoy it?

[17:17:24]

ger_3d:

I did, should have been there on saturday though

[17:17:30]

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[17:17:54]

juski:

didn't miss much. well not on the mythtv stand anyway

[17:18:49]

ger_3d:

you are going to be there next year?

[17:19:14]

juski:

definitely not

[17:19:34]

ger_3d:

why not

[17:19:37]

juski:

they can beg, they can scrape, they can pay me. i won't go again

[17:19:40]

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[17:19:53]

juski:

because.. how to best put this in a logged channel..

[17:20:22]

ger_3d:

sorry dont understand

[17:20:34]

juski:

it's not fun trying to preach to the converted

[17:21:02]

juski:

spending all that time & money to convince maybe 3 or 4 people to try mythtv.. just isn't worth it

[17:21:19]

ger_3d:

I know what you mean

[17:21:22]

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[17:21:42]

ger_3d:

anyway, how are we going about the new theme then

[17:22:09]

juski:

gimme some graphics & I'll see what I can do about getting the menus to work first ;)

[17:23:32]

ger_3d:

are the buttons for the main screen enough to get started?

[17:23:43]

juski:

should be. and maybe some watermarks.

[17:24:13]

ger_3d:

hmm, what kind

[17:24:16]

juski:

we should keep an option open to use a vertical menu too. horizontals really don't work too well right now

[17:24:33]

juski:

ger_3d: button icons I mean ;)

[17:25:01]

jarle_:

How does other users browse and organize the channels. I feel that I am overwhelmed in number of channels and I do not have a very good way of navigating through them. Is the epg "m" the best way of browsing the channels?

[17:25:21]

juski:

jarle_: browse mode. or give up using live tv altogether

[17:25:58]

ger_3d:

I'll send you some stuff tomorrow

[17:26:02]

juski:

in the time I've saved since giving up channel surfing, I've managed to roll out no less than 8 themes & help countless users. and yell a lot :-P

[17:26:09]

jarle_:

[17:26:24]

juski:

ger_3d: cool :)

[17:27:35]

juski:

ger_3d: I've started on yet another theme too – working title is aeroic-wide – see www.juski.co.uk – the idea is a very lightweight theme which will work with a variety of backgrounds ;)

[17:27:41]

gbee:

jarle_: 0.21 or 0.22 will include a channel grouping function, where you can arrange channels however you want, although I imagine most people will chose to group them by content (news, sport, radio, entertainment, documentary etc)

[17:27:44]

ger_3d:

do you think its possible to get horizontal scrolling working

[17:28:02]

juski:

ger_3d: I'll have a go at that. wanted to make it better for a long time

[17:28:55]

jarle_:

gbee: being able to jump to channels starting with the letter <x> in the epg would be a good start imho.

[17:29:23]

juski:

jarle_: and how do you type 'x' with a remote?!

[17:29:55]

jarle_:

like the dreambox does it. (the same way as on a cellphone)

[17:30:02]

juski:

bleugh

[17:30:09]

iamlindoro:

Juski-- new theme: sexy.

[17:30:10]

ger_3d:

the main reason i would like a theme as my mockup is because I think when you scroll vertical your main focus is on the text. Making the graphics just eye candy

[17:30:23]

gbee:

jarle_: you can currently jump using the channel number, jumping by the letter isn't very remote friendly and unless channels are sorted alphabetically the behaviour might be confusing

[17:30:57]

ger_3d:

My idea is to let the buttons explain themselv and just have text on the one highlighted

[17:31:16]

juski:

ger_3d: I realise that. I'll have a go at making the horizontal menu code work as it *should*

[17:31:17]

gbee:

jarle_: if number keys are used to enter letters, how would you enter numbers or move to the third channel starting with X?

[17:31:50]

juski:

gbee: press M to bring up yet another options menu to change from alpha to numeric :-P

[17:31:58]

juski:

like on the Dreambox I bet

[17:32:37]

jarle_:

gbee: the "1" key cycles though "abc1"

[17:32:46]

jarle_:

through...

[17:33:19]

juski:

the dreambox programmers are hardly experts in UI design either...

[17:34:05]

juski:

this is going nowhere. It's time I started cooking some food anyway

[17:34:38]

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[17:34:42]

gbee:

jarle_: yeah and so you'd press it three times to jump to the first channel beginning C, what about the second or fifteenth channel beginning C? Remembering that channels are ordered by number and not name? Or the poor sods who now have to press the one key 16 times, just to jump to channel 1111?

[17:34:55]

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[17:35:08]

** jarle_ loves his dreambox, but is considering mythtv for the ability to display HD-content and have multiple tuners.. **

[17:36:46]

jarle_:

gbee: this input method is only done in the channel list. from normal watching TV you just enter the channel number.

[17:37:10]

jarle_:

gbee: I only want this functionality in the epg, not in the normal zapping.

[17:37:17]

gbee:

jarle_: but currently in the channel list you can jump to a channel using it's bymber

[17:37:21]

gbee:

number

[17:37:41]

gbee:

bymber, I've just invented a new word and I kind of like it :D

[17:38:19]

jarle_:

gbee: How does a channel get its number BTW?

[17:38:45]

gbee:

jarle_: depends on the source, with dvb/atsc it's assigned by the broadcaster

[17:38:48]

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[17:39:06]

ger_3d:

juski: http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/1770/3dgreen2yg.png I got inspired by this theme

[17:39:48]

gbee:

for analogue manually or in order that they are scanned

[17:40:12]

gbee:

possible that zap2it also provides proper channels numbers

[17:40:27]

jarle_:

gbee: that explains why I have so many "strange" channel numbers, I have dvb-s as input.

[17:41:13]

iamlindoro:

One could give a channel any number scheme they wanted if they wrote their own channels.conf and used that, though, no

[17:41:15]

iamlindoro:

?

[17:41:23]

iamlindoro:

for dvb, that is

[17:42:07]

jarle_:

gbee: and it would be a good thing to be able to store the radio channels in a separate list

[17:42:40]

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[17:42:47]

gbee:

iamlindoro: you can change the numbering to whatever you like after scanning, but the numbers initially used are those which a commercial STB would use

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[18:07:25]

visit0r:

mythtv seems to flag commercials even for channels flagged 'commercial free' with r13849 trunk. has this been fixed lately/everyone noted the same issue?

[18:10:20]

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[18:18:11]

immolo:

anyone know a good site for buying hd monitors in the uk?

[18:24:17]

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[18:30:16]

cythrault:

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[18:35:04]

juski:

ger_3d: I prefer your mockups. there's a single MP skin that doesn't suck IMHO

[18:35:59]

ger_3d:

I got inspired of it. never intendet to copy it

[18:36:22]

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[18:36:51]

ger_3d:

which MP skin doesn't suck?

[18:37:22]

juski:

oops. meant to say *not* a single one :)

[18:37:33]

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[18:39:15]

ger_3d:

have you got any links to skins, screenshots that you think look good

[18:42:23]

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[18:43:23]

juski:

outside of mythtv there's only the AppleTV interface I like the look of – and that's only for the way it works

[18:44:55]

juski:

ger_3d: did you see Elisa being demoed at LRL? that thing really sucks hard IMHO

[18:45:57]

jams:

welcome ger_3d

[18:46:17]

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[18:47:08]

ger_3d:

I tried Elias, and I think the UI is a joke an completely uesless

[18:48:27]

juski:

I liked how it found all my mythtv recordings in a few clicks. didn't like being told I needed to buy a plugin to play them though

[18:49:04]

ger_3d:

is the ui code GPL?

[18:49:29]

juski:

yes but they depend a lot on some weird libraries

[18:49:48]

juski:

pigment

[18:50:01]

ger_3d:

something we can use?

[18:50:05]

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[18:50:18]

juski:

I wouldn't

[18:50:32]

ger_3d:

would be nice to use more opengl effects though

[18:50:51]

juski:

though it has to be said to spruce up the mythtv UI we'd really need to bring in external libs to make life easier

[18:51:08]

juski:

I say 'we' – that's *way* about what I can do

[18:51:13]

juski:

s/about/above

[18:51:47]

ger_3d:

which means more dependencies which is not very popular

[18:51:55]

juski:

I can't make up my mind about flashy graphics. One minute I think it'd be cool, the next I hate the idea & believe it'd only slow things down

[18:52:05]

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[18:52:10]

janneg_:

gbee: do you still see disconnects with the nova-t 500?

[18:52:17]

juski:

I don't use the GL painter as it is – hate those fades

[18:53:17]

ger_3d:

depends, I had a look at VISTA and the effects are way to slow, smal 0.25 second animations could make the ui more organic without slowing it down

[18:54:06]

juski:

the ui fades right now go as fast as the code allows IIRC

[18:55:01]

subx:

i use nova-t 500 dual tuner, the only time i suffer with disconnect is when i first get my channel listings on mythtv setup

[18:55:05]

ger_3d:

the fades have no function, and therfor pointless

[18:55:05]

juski:

anyway when I said I'd take a look at making the horizontal menu work properly, I didn't mean I plan to do any animations

[18:56:33]

juski:

ger_3d: nah that's what I'd say about alphapulse ;)

[18:57:05]

ger_3d:

if the horizont. works like the vert. would be enough for the moment.

[18:57:21]

juski:

I've seen classes for scrollable items in the ui code – just dunno how to do anything with them yet

[18:57:49]

ger_3d:

a slight alphapuls on the highlightet button would be nice

[18:57:57]

gbee:

janneg_: saw one the other night with 2.6.21, two zero byte recordings

[18:58:06]

juski:

I don't like hacking on uitypes.cpp etc – have to rebuild the whole of mythtv just about

[18:58:10]

ger_3d:

perhaps you figure it out, I have no idea

[18:58:49]

ger_3d:

hopefully you do

[18:58:54]

juski:

ger_3d: the hard part might be making it work without breaking other themes

[18:59:23]

juski:

I've had enough hassle with folks breaking themes with their patches :-p

[18:59:24]

ger_3d:

hmm that would be bad

[19:00:07]

juski:

I've still not finished fixing up what some mythmusic changes broke, yet

[19:00:20]

ger_3d:

anyway, I'll send you some stuff tomorrow to play with

[19:00:44]

juski:

okees cool :)

[19:00:54]

ger_3d:

I have a lot of buttons to make and that will take some time. plus .21 does not seem to be out soon

[19:01:11]

juski:

be lucky to see it this side of September IMHO

[19:01:22]

ger_3d:

doubt it

[19:01:24]

gbee:

janneg_: is there a newer fix? I'm running the drivers in the kernel at the moment, just about to upgrade to 2.6.22 but if there are newer fixes I'll install those

[19:02:43]

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[19:05:03]

malocite:

I just installed mythtv and got my remote working for it, but the remote doesnt seem to work when a video is running

[19:05:28]

gbee:

malocite: video? mythvideo? external player?

[19:05:50]

malocite:

I think its mplayer that runs the videos

[19:06:03]

malocite:

its a video file yes, I dont have a tv tuner

[19:06:17]

janneg_:

gbee: Patrick just released a fixed firmware and driver. you need following hg tree for it http://linuxtv.org/hg/~pb/v4l-dvb/

[19:06:21]

gbee:

change the video player command from "mplayer" to "internal"

[19:06:34]

gbee:

janneg_: cheers

[19:07:08]

malocite:

that easy huh? :)

[19:07:14]

janneg_:

I'm too lucky to really test it. I had only one disconnect in the last two months

[19:07:30]

gbee:

malocite: which version btw and what type of video (mpeg2, mpeg4, wmv etc)

[19:07:49]

malocite:

divx

[19:07:49]

malocite:

avi

[19:08:04]

gbee:

malocite: if the videos you want to watch will play with the internal player, then yes, it really is that easy

[19:09:00]

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[19:09:01]

gbee:

malocite: the internal player didn't previously support some formats, which is why mythvideo used mplayer/xine and mplayer/xine require their own LIRC setup

[19:09:24]

malocite:

avi and divx play in the internal player?

[19:09:28]

gbee:

the internal player is the same one used for playing recordings made in mythtv and uses the same lirc config

[19:09:47]

gbee:

malocite: does in the development version of the internal player, but I'm not sure about 0.20

[19:09:55]

gbee:

I can't remember

[19:10:45]

gbee:

if they don't then you'll need to setup mplayer to work with lirc seperately, it's a seperate application and can't be controlled through mythtv to any great degree

[19:10:51]

malocite:

gbee: when I select internal and try to play a video nothing happens

[19:11:05]

malocite:

gbee: So maybe not then

[19:11:19]

juski:

argghh the menu code will not make it easy to have a horizontally scrollable menu list. I can see this needing a new class

[19:11:20]

gbee:

the command is just "internal"? (no arguments)

[19:11:43]

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[19:11:58]

ger_3d:

would that break the other themes?

[19:12:07]

gbee:

malocite: you can try running "mythtv path/to/video.avi" as a test to see if the internal player can play them

[19:12:09]

malocite:

gbee: Thats what I typed in

[19:12:24]

juski:

ger_3d: a new class with a new xml tag wouldn't, no. but it'd be a lot of work

[19:12:31]

jams:

juski- correct about the scrolling

[19:13:02]

gbee:

ah well, you can either upgrade to trunk or look on the wiki for instructions on setting up lirc for mplayer (http://wiki.mythtv.org/)

[19:13:28]

gbee:

divx/avi work for me with the development version

[19:13:50]

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[19:14:04]

ger_3d:

hmm, cant help you there I dont kn ow anything about programing, sorry

[19:14:26]

malocite:

yeah

[19:14:26]

malocite:

that worked

[19:14:35]

malocite:

gbee: that worked, but how do I get it to do that within myth itself?

[19:15:02]

ger_3d:

would be nice though if we could get it working, maybe some of the developer could help out.

[19:16:20]

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[19:17:00]

juski:

ger_3d: it might not be beyond my ability.. who knows ;)

[19:19:25]

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[19:19:42]

Cardoe:

so I need a way to edit a channel's xmltv ID...

[19:19:52]

GreyFoxx:

ger_3d: get what working ?

[19:19:53]

gbee:

malocite: err, try internal with a capital I (Internal)

[19:19:59]

Cardoe:

since my cable company, Cox, just says 100.1, 100.2, and 108.1

[19:20:00]

GreyFoxx:

it is a Capital I

[19:20:13]

Cardoe:

but MythTV isn't mapping that to ABC, CBS, and Fox

[19:20:14]

GreyFoxx:

though it's a silly requirement

[19:20:16]

jams:

GreyFoxx- proper horizontal menu support

[19:20:16]

gbee:

Cardoe: do you have mythweb installed?

[19:20:19]

Cardoe:

gbee: sure

[19:20:21]

GreyFoxx:

jams: ahhh

[19:20:34]

jams:

as in scrolling left and right

[19:21:09]

juski:

with the highlighted button item being in the centre

[19:21:17]

jams:

right

[19:21:20]

gbee:

Cardoe: you can edit xmltvids through mythweb, it's under the settings section, "channel info" or something like that

[19:21:22]

GreyFoxx:

That would be nice

[19:21:26]

jams:

yes it would

[19:21:28]

Cardoe:

gbee: cool

[19:21:42]

juski:

maybe it'd also be cool to change the vertical menu to do the same

[19:21:43]

gbee:

Cardoe: it can also be done through mythtv-setup, but mythweb is a little easier

[19:21:55]

Cardoe:

gbee: yeah I'd agree mythweb is easier

[19:22:01]

jams:

maybe i can convnice geckofiend to finish it =) he should be calling in a couple hours

[19:22:07]

Cardoe:

gbee: I was about to crack out mysql

[19:22:09]

gbee:

and you might need to restart the backend afterwards

[19:22:15]

ger_3d:

that would make sense and wold look a lot better

[19:22:17]

juski:

jams: ?

[19:22:17]

GreyFoxx:

juski: I would prefer that too

[19:22:33]

jams:

juski- he's the one who did the horzonatl theme support in the first place

[19:22:39]

juski:

oh right!

[19:22:41]

juski:

:)

[19:22:51]

jams:

he should be calling me in a few hours

[19:22:54]

malocite:

gbee: To fix that problem, for future refference, simply go to file types > un check default player and don't type in anything under command

[19:22:59]

juski:

if opengl is enabled, chuck in a smooth scroll too ;)

[19:23:00]

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[19:23:03]

malocite:

gbee: then it defaults to the internal, works great

[19:23:03]

gbee:

wasn't Internal made the default player for 0.20?

[19:23:13]

jams:

gbee- yes it was

[19:23:17]

gbee:

malocite: ahh, well at least it works now

[19:23:46]

janneg_:

Cardoe: or you can edit the xmltvids in mythfrontend while tuned to that channel with 'e'

[19:23:56]

juski:

hahahaha I just set 'visible rows' to '1' in minimalist-wide & well & truly broke it!

[19:24:07]

gbee:

jams: cool, thought so because I think I was the one who suggested it, but sounds like it could be made even easier

[19:24:24]

gbee:

janneg_: heh, yeah, forgot that

[19:24:27]

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[19:24:41]

Cardoe:

janneg_: cool. I'm playing in mythweb right now but that'll be the backup plan

[19:24:42]

ger_3d:

I tried that too, aslo with alpha puls and endet up with no buttons

[19:24:45]

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[19:24:46]

malocite:

gbee: Just wanted to let you know, you were like super close, thats all that you have to do other than that

[19:24:50]

Cardoe:

I hate using mythtv-setup since you have to stop the backend generally

[19:25:17]

juski:

eew! HOW many button images does minimalist-wide have missing?!

[19:25:36]

ger_3d:

I think most of them

[19:25:41]

jams:

heh

[19:25:55]

gbee:

yeah, Daniel edited a full channel details editor to mythfrontend so you can edit the details for the on-screen channel

[19:25:57]

juski:

arghh damn my attention to other themes details

[19:25:58]

janneg_:

gbee: to my experience from LinuxTag I'm the only one who knows that

[19:26:32]

juski:

first I found out about the channel editor was when I did my last OSD theme :)

[19:26:54]

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[19:27:11]

gbee:

I tend to forget about it, even though I've brought it up accidently a few times when trying to 'edit' livetv ;)

[19:27:27]

jams:

had no clue it was present

[19:27:41]

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[19:28:01]

janneg:

the only current problem is that the backend caches the channums

[19:28:54]

GreyFoxx:

cd ../mythplugins

[19:28:55]

GreyFoxx:

doh

[19:29:46]

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[19:29:57]

Cardoe:

so.. how do I figure out the xmltv id for a source?

[19:30:22]

ger_3d:

Cordoe: for what grabber

[19:30:27]

Cardoe:

datadirect

[19:30:45]

GreyFoxx:

In my case when I added some QAM scanned channels I was lucky enough to already have those channels/callsigns in my system for my pvr cards

[19:30:50]

malocite:

which file in myth do you specify which directories you want it to scan for content?

[19:30:59]

GreyFoxx:

so I used the mythweb channel editor and filled them in

[19:31:09]

GreyFoxx:

malocite: It's stored in the database

[19:31:21]

GreyFoxx:

use the frontend gui to set the pathes

[19:32:05]

jams:

GreyFoxx- ever get a chance to look at the local website, and other advanced features?

[19:32:18]

malocite:

and you use a semi colon between different directories right?

[19:32:23]

ger_3d:

Cardoe: sorry cant help you there

[19:32:27]

GreyFoxx:

that machine has sat completely powered down since my move to the new house

[19:32:31]

jams:

hehehe

[19:32:36]

Cardoe:

GreyFoxx: do I just need to match up the callsigns?

[19:32:41]

jams:

k no big deal

[19:32:56]

GreyFoxx:

malocite: You can yeah. Personally I just point mythvideo at 1 root video directory and symlink the others under it

[19:33:04]

GreyFoxx:

symlink/mount

[19:33:19]

malocite:

greyfoxx: Still thinking like a windows user I am :)

[19:33:35]

GreyFoxx:

Cardoe: I matched the callsigns and xmltvid since I had the info from my existing datasource

[19:33:57]

GreyFoxx:

hmmmm I wonder if there is a big map of xmltvid's somewhere a user can use

[19:34:13]

GreyFoxx:

cause it was/is annoying filling them in

[19:35:43]

Cardoe:

where does mythfilldatabase download the data to?

[19:35:55]

Cardoe:

cause I could parse it by hand

[19:36:21]

GreyFoxx:

stored in /tmp/ temporarily

[19:36:26]

GreyFoxx:

random filenames

[19:37:09]

malocite:

the only other thing I need to figure out now is how to make myth start on boot without needing a login and password for x

[19:37:54]

Cardoe:

malocite: use mingetty

[19:37:58]

Cardoe:

c8:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty --autologin mythtv tty8

[19:38:09]

GreyFoxx:

malocite: I just added a line to my rc.local to launch X as my myth user. Then X auto starts IceWM, which then auto starts mythfrontend

[19:39:16]

GreyFoxx:

tmpPostFile = makeTempFile(tmpDir + "/mythtv_post_XXXXXX");

[19:39:27]

malocite:

when you add things in rc.local do they execute as if they had ROOT ? Like is that where I can tell linux to mount a remote drive using mount host:/directory /mnt/drive

[19:39:30]

Cardoe:

then I just have an .xinitrc in my home directory

[19:39:48]

GreyFoxx:

Cardoe: you could likely comment out a single line in libs/libmythtv/datadirect.cpp to have it not delete the tmp file

[19:40:07]

GreyFoxx:

malc: I tell it to run as mythtv from there

[19:40:19]

GreyFoxx:

if ! grep noautologin /proc/cmdline 1> /dev/null 2> /dev/null ; then

[19:40:19]

GreyFoxx:

echo "Launching XWindows"

[19:40:19]

GreyFoxx:

su – mythtv -c "bash -l startx — -dpi 100" &

[19:40:19]

GreyFoxx:

fi

[19:40:28]

GreyFoxx:

starts X as the mythtv user

[19:40:41]

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[19:40:51]

GreyFoxx:

and my .xinitrc runs nvidia settings for some tweaking and then starts my window manager

[19:41:12]

GreyFoxx:

I add the noautologin bit so that I can override it at boot if I want to manually boot the machine and not start X

[19:41:44]

malocite:

greyfoxx: Alright, I'll try that, myth is just scanning my 15 gigs of mp3s right now, so its taking its time :)

[19:42:19]

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[19:42:25]

Cardoe:

GreyFoxx: similar to Gentoo out of the box

[19:42:31]

Cardoe:

but I consider rc.local for starting X kinda bleh

[19:42:37]

Cardoe:

so I went with the autologin route

[19:42:52]

Cardoe:

also, it allows it to auto restart the frontend when the frontend dies

[19:43:15]

Cardoe:

without using a while loop

[19:43:22]

Cardoe:

or constantly polling via cron

[19:43:24]

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[19:43:26]

keith4:

is there any sort of watchdog to automatically restart the backend if it dies?

[19:43:34]

sphery:

Cardoe: didn't read the whole scrollback, but you can use tv_grab_na_dd to get the raw DD XML file

[19:43:47]

sphery:

(sounds like that may be what you're looking for)

[19:43:52]

GreyFoxx:

Cardoe: I want any restarts (in my case) to be done either manually or in ascripted while loop so I can auto grab backtraces and such

[19:43:58]

Cardoe:

sphery: that could work

[19:44:19]

sphery:

there's a cmd-line argument for that

[19:44:55]

Cardoe:

GreyFoxx: you're not running it via gdb, so you won't get a backtrace.

[19:45:40]

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[19:46:16]

Cardoe:

if I need to restart the frontend I simply do "killall mythfrontend"

[19:46:18]

Cardoe:

and it restarts

[19:46:43]

GreyFoxx:

Cardoe: my combo backend/frontend runs it in a gdb loop

[19:46:58]

GreyFoxx:

my diskless frontends are a regular while loop

[19:47:04]

Cardoe:

GreyFoxx: fair enough, not something an everyday user is gonna use however.

[19:47:29]

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[19:47:41]

Cardoe:

GreyFoxx: the while loop is what I aim to skip, because your processor won't step itself down to a lower freq

[19:47:57]

GreyFoxx:

I never use any of that stuff myself :)

[19:48:42]

GreyFoxx:

Though eventually I'm going to look at a new frontend and suspend to disk

[19:48:52]

GreyFoxx:

so I'm not sure how I'll setup that one

[19:50:09]

Cardoe:

how come even after deleting channels via mythtv-setup, I still have all of them in the dtv_multiplex table?

[19:51:14]

GreyFoxx:

I've never looked in there really. Is it tied to the video source or to the card? Maybe have to remove the video source to clear that ?

[19:54:08]

janneg:

Cardoe: dtv_multiplex doesn't hold channels but multiplexes

[19:54:32]

Cardoe:

well I can nuke the unused crap

[19:54:42]

janneg:

mythtv-setup has an transport editor to edit that table

[19:54:43]

Cardoe:

since I only get 3 digital channels over QAM

[19:55:46]

Cardoe:

well I have 2 mplexid's

[19:55:49]

Cardoe:

and 3 channels.

[19:55:56]

Cardoe:

so 2 channels share the same freq?

[19:57:50]

janneg:

yes

[20:04:20]

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[20:05:06]

NightMonkey:

keith4: You could use something like Monit, but it might be a bit overkill for your needs.

[20:06:28]

Cardoe:

wish I could tune regular digital cable over QAM

[20:06:30]

Cardoe:

like TNTHD

[20:06:32]

NightMonkey:

keith4: Nagios could probably do the same.

[20:06:37]

Cardoe:

Dunno why you can't..

[20:06:50]

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[20:08:53]

jarle_:

what might cause the frontend not to be able to show liveTV like this: http://pastebin.ca/639696 ?

[20:11:57]

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[20:12:27]

juski:

jarle_: the backend log would be much more illuminating

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[20:13:36]

jarle_:

juski: which logfile should I look at?

[20:15:55]

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[20:17:05]

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[20:18:25]

r10:

is the some on there can help me, I keep getting "libmythtv-0.20.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory" and I have it in /usr/local/lib

[20:19:09]

Anduin:

r10: and /usr/local/lib is searched?

[20:19:20]

jarle_:

hmmmm... what is the name of the mythbackend process, isn't it mythbackend?

[20:19:36]

Anduin:

jarle_: it is

[20:19:45]

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[20:20:38]

jarle_:

running "ps aux|grep mythbackend" at the backend does not give me any results, however trying to restart mythbackend tells me it is already running?

[20:20:50]

r10:

Anduin: yes it is searched and I can't start mythbacked I get the same error

[20:21:18]

Anduin:

jarle_: It is probably failing

[20:21:41]

Anduin:

r10: So if you ldd `which mythbackend` it finds things?

[20:21:48]

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[20:21:58]

jarle_:

Anduin: but how come I can't see the process?

[20:22:10]

dbkr_:

anyone know how to rename a recording in mythtv?

[20:22:27]

Anduin:

jarle_: Because it is failing after it started, the init scrip is only going to know the fork worked, look at the backend log

[20:22:34]

keith4:

NightMonkey: I think we have a nagios box... but I didn't know it can manage services

[20:23:14]

keith4:

NightMonkey: looks like monit might be perfect, thanks

[20:23:18]

jarle_:

Anduin: which logfile?

[20:23:37]

Cardoe:

any special format a channels.conf file from dvbscan has to be in?

[20:23:43]

Cardoe:

mythtv-setup doesn't seem to like my channels.conf

[20:23:59]

Anduin:

jarle_: depends, different startup scripts put it in different places

[20:24:35]

r10:

Anduin: it can't find libmythXXX it can find all others

[20:25:27]

Anduin:

r10: Then /usr/local/lib isn't being searched, check your /etc/ld.so.conf

[20:27:09]

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[20:27:22]

jarle_:

Anduin: the last line of my backend log: 2007-07–30 22:11:35.506 TVRec(1): RingBufferChanged() (no sign of a crash...)

[20:27:46]

Anduin:

jarle_: run it manually

[20:30:05]

r10:

Anduin: how do I reloade ld.so.conf ?

[20:30:38]

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[20:30:44]

Anduin:

r10: ldconfig

[20:30:46]

jarle_:

backend error: http://pastebin.ca/639719

[20:32:09]

r10:

Anduin: thanks

[20:32:13]

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[20:33:41]

Anduin:

jarle_: Not really enough information there

[20:34:18]

jarle_:

the backend keeps outputting a LOT of "2007-07–30 22:32:59.481 Program #4126 not found in PAT!" Is this something I need to look into?

[20:35:57]

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[20:36:23]

gbee:

jarle_: when was the last time you ran a scan?

[20:36:55]

gbee:

that error can mean that the information mythtv has about the available channels is out of date

[20:37:43]

jarle_:

gbee: I ran a scan about a week ago

[20:39:17]

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[20:41:18]

jarle_:

gbee: I will try to delete all channels and and to a new scan now to see if it fixes it (and also omit the radio channels as they only seem to cludder my program listing...

[20:42:02]

dbkr_:

[21:22] <dbkr_> anyone know how to rename a recording in mythtv?

[20:42:23]

dbkr_:

the answer is to edit the 'recorded' table if it's finished recording, otherwise the 'record' table

[20:42:50]

dbkr_:

data duplication at its finest

[20:44:05]

fryfrog:

did datadirect do anything funky in the last day or two?

[20:44:50]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: I think they did the Electric Slide, IIRC.

[20:44:58]

iamlindoro:

ha

[20:45:16]

fryfrog:

holey crap, all of my channels are unticked in my line up

[20:45:29]

fryfrog:

damnit, what a pain in the ass :/

[20:45:48]

Cardoe:

fryfrog: fail

[20:45:49]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Wow, that sucks. Now I have to check... :|

[20:45:59]

Cardoe:

fryfrog: check "select all"

[20:46:13]

fryfrog:

I don't want *all* of them :(

[20:46:19]

Cardoe:

fryfrog: that's what being a ubuntu user gets you

[20:46:24]

NightMonkey:

Whew. Mine are fine.

[20:46:25]

Cardoe:

god smites you

[20:46:30]

opello:

lol

[20:46:31]

Cardoe:

NightMonkey is a Gentoo user

[20:46:32]

fryfrog:

ahahhahaha

[20:46:41]

Cardoe:

fryfrog: ;)

[20:46:55]

fryfrog:

I didn't get it for being an Ubuntu user, I got it for *leaving* Gentoo :)

[20:47:03]

fryfrog:

she is one hell of a dirty, low down ex :)

[20:47:22]

subx:

debian etch ruleZ

[20:47:24]

NightMonkey:

What did I do to get an outing?

[20:51:59]

NightMonkey:

Yeah, I've seen more lineup discrepancies than average (for my listings, that is) since the announcement. I'd reccomend that zap2it users print out their channel lineups.

[20:52:18]

fryfrog:

that isn't a bad idea :/

[20:52:29]

NightMonkey:

(the "Details" page on labs.zap2it.com)

[20:53:20]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: You probably can "reverse-engineer" your subscriptions from your myth DB.

[20:53:35]

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[20:54:29]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Did you purge your DB of deleted channels when you explicitly deleted them from labs.zap2it.com?

[20:55:33]

fryfrog:

I'm not sure, but I've a pretty good idea of the channels I had selected. I'm already done, doing a --refresh-all right now

[20:55:58]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Ah, good good.

[20:56:19]

fryfrog:

i haven't messed with my line up in a *long* time, except once I hit the "Details" page to figure out what some channel numbers/names were

[20:57:35]

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[20:58:12]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Scary.

[20:58:21]

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[20:58:47]

fryfrog:

prolly just trying to shake off some users :p

[21:00:13]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: ;)

[21:04:56]

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[21:06:23]

fryfrog:

Humm, is there any chance that mythfilldatabase could clear a lineup? It just core dumped on me, and *that* does run nightly

[21:06:39]

fryfrog:

holey frick

[21:07:23]

fryfrog:

Somehow, myth is doing it

[21:09:41]

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[21:12:51]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Hrm. You re-selected your channels, did a mythfilldatabase, and then they were unselected again?

[21:14:44]

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[21:16:28]

fryfrog:

NightMonkey: I think I figured it out. I had two lineups bound to the same listing, if you know what I mean

[21:16:39]

fryfrog:

I just un-did that and re-ran the fill and it didn't do any crazy nuking

[21:16:53]

fryfrog:

the reason I think that was the cause is that the *only* channel in common was the *only* channel with listings data

[21:17:41]

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[21:19:21]

NightMonkey:

fryfrog: Ah, wow. Do you have two TV providers?

[21:19:53]

fryfrog:

Now, I was monkeying around with 2x PCI QAM cards vs. 2x firewire tuners

[21:20:30]

fryfrog:

each one has the same *channels*, so i thought i'd create two linups, with the same datadirect listing

[21:20:46]

fryfrog:

but i *think* i just need one line up with one listing, bound to both types of input

[21:20:51]

fryfrog:

(after a channel scan)

[21:22:58]

fryfrog:

testing mah theory now

[21:23:03]

fryfrog:

glad to know it was *my* fault

[21:25:57]

Led-Hed:

Zap2It is stopping its Guide service?

[21:26:11]

fryfrog:

welcome to last month's latest news! :)

[21:26:29]

Led-Hed:

lol, Sorry, I only drop in from time to time

[21:26:33]

gbee:

feels like last years new

[21:26:36]

gbee:

s

[21:26:58]

fryfrog:

hehe

[21:27:07]

fryfrog:

"they" are worlking on a replacement

[21:27:32]

Led-Hed:

so when Sept 1 comes around will there be a new version of MythTV out?

[21:27:47]

fryfrog:

why would there be another version of mythtv?

[21:27:54]

Led-Hed:

to support "Schedules Direct"?

[21:27:59]

fryfrog:

it is a new listings service we need

[21:28:02]

fryfrog:

ah, gotcha that

[21:28:35]

fryfrog:

i suspect they'll make the new service "compatible" so there is minimal work

[21:29:13]

Led-Hed:

ya, though I wouldnt mind trying MythTV 0.21

[21:29:28]

fryfrog:

is 0.21 out?

[21:29:34]

fryfrog:

or, you mean that'd be the version

[21:29:35]

Led-Hed:

I dont think so

[21:29:46]

fryfrog:

I suspect they'd just fix it in -fixes (and svn head) and release a 0.20.2

[21:30:06]

Led-Hed:

ya

[21:30:13]

fryfrog:

You use your distro's version? I think I recongize your nick, Gentoo?

[21:31:12]

Led-Hed:

right now I have a FC4 backend, 1 FC4 Frontend, 1 MiniMyth (PXE Boot) frontend and 2 Umbuntu frontends

[21:31:30]

Led-Hed:

sp – Ubuntu

[21:32:08]

Led-Hed:

fryfrog, so thats a yes in the case of my MiniMyth frontend

[21:32:13]

fryfrog:

Ah, no Gentoo at all :)

[21:32:17]

fryfrog:

oh, that is Gentoo?

[21:33:20]

Led-Hed:

I dont know that it is. LOL. I just set it up 2 weeks ago. (Best distro for MythTV I've used thus far)

[21:33:33]

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[21:34:20]

murray_:

any suggestions – dvb-t, works with scan/tzap, setup finds all the channels, but running mythfrontend just says "No Lock" for everything

[21:34:38]

murray_:

svn update ; make ; sudo make install

[21:34:48]

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[21:35:07]

murray_:

I've got full logging on, but can't see anything that indicates what the problem is

[21:35:34]

murray_:

I'm utterly stuck for ideas on how to proceed ...

[21:36:12]

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[21:39:16]

fryfrog:

murray_: make clean && ./configure again maybe?

[21:39:28]

fryfrog:

i don't spose this is coming from some encrypted cable or something?

[21:39:40]

fryfrog:

dvb-t is euro stuff with an aereal, right?

[21:40:52]

murray_:

fryfrog : thanks, I'll try make clean now

[21:41:29]

murray_:

dvb-t : over the air, digital, there are encrypted channels, but the majority/main ones are not, and it's the un-encrypted ones I'm having problems with.

[21:41:42]

murray_:

or rather, I've not even looked at the encrypted ones

[21:41:43]

fryfrog:

ah

[21:41:43]

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[21:41:46]

gbee:

europe, australia and asia

[21:42:01]

fryfrog:

there is *encrypted* OTA stuff?

[21:42:07]

gbee:

fryfrog: yeah

[21:42:20]

fryfrog:

how do they... uh, do that?

[21:42:30]

fryfrog:

i mean, do people have to get a "cable box" for their arial?

[21:42:47]

murray_:

there are special set top boxes, that can take a card

[21:42:52]

fryfrog:

ahhh, i see

[21:42:55]

murray_:

kinda like a sim card in a cell

[21:43:02]

gbee:

fryfrog: er, yeah or a settop box as it's generically known

[21:43:11]

fryfrog:

so are they typically all by one company?

[21:43:12]

murray_:

quite how the encryption works, I have no idea – I think you can crack it if you try hard enough

[21:43:25]

fryfrog:

ie, you get one card and it decrypts all the channels?

[21:43:28]

gbee:

http://www.radioandtelly.co.uk/freeviewboxes.html

[21:43:37]

murray_:

there are only a couple of encrypted channels – virtually nobody bothers with them, so I don't think there is much of a business model

[21:43:46]

murray_:

all the pay stuff here is on satellite

[21:43:47]

gbee:

fryfrog: there is only one providor of encrypted content here in the UK

[21:43:51]

murray_:

here = uk

[21:44:25]

fryfrog:

ahhhhhh

[21:44:27]

gbee:

http://www.topuptv.com/

[21:44:52]

gbee:

but I don't think they are doing too well atm

[21:45:11]

murray_:

does anyone know anyone who's ever used the encrypted freeview channels? (spot the oxy-moron)

[21:45:17]

fryfrog:

I had no idea there was OTA encrypted stuff anywhere :)

[21:46:01]

fryfrog:

so does that mean they make dvb *pci* cards with the uh, decrypter card slots?

[21:46:09]

bill2or3:

not exactly.

[21:46:09]

fryfrog:

i mean, is it "legal" to do it there?

[21:46:28]

fryfrog:

ie, in the US if you did it with sat/cable, it wouldn't be legal even if you paid for it

[21:46:43]

gbee:

the vast majority of the channels (50+) are free

[21:46:46]

murray_:

I've never seen a PCI / USB dvb-t kit with decryption card slots

[21:46:51]

fryfrog:

ah

[21:46:57]

murray_:

not looked too hard – just set top boxes

[21:47:10]

laga:

murray_: look harder ;)

[21:47:22]

murray_:

laga – I'm sure :)

[21:47:22]

gbee:

fryfrog: they might, but I can't see why anyone would really bother, the channels aren't worth it

[21:47:31]

laga:

and yes, they make DVB PCI cards with common interfaces ;)

[21:47:47]

fryfrog:

ah, so they are totally suck unlike say HBO or what ever

[21:48:03]

gbee:

basically

[21:48:28]

murray_:

okay, so "stop front & backend ; make clean ; make ; make install; start back & frontend" ...

[21:48:35]

murray_:

...still "No Lock" on teh frontend#

[21:48:39]

gbee:

at least in my opinion, but I guess some people think it's worth it

[21:48:52]

gbee:

paying for, that is

[21:49:13]

murray_:

I think if you wanted to pay, you'd do better with Sky (satellite). Much more choice

[21:49:23]

gbee:

murray_: you don't need to stop the frontend and backend before make, just before make install

[21:49:30]

gbee:

reduces downtime

[21:49:44]

gbee:

or cable

[21:49:50]

murray_:

gbee : it would, if I could ever get myth to tune into a channel

[21:50:17]

murray_:

as it is, I had a perfectly working setup, moved house, scan/tzap works fine, but myth refused to tune into channels

[21:50:37]

murray_:

when I run scan ... > channels.conf, I get two entries with different frequencies for most channels.

[21:50:51]

murray_:

the tzap route typically works for one set, but not the other.

[21:51:17]

murray_:

mythtv-setup appears determined to pick the other set, although I'm not entirely sure that is what is going on.

[21:51:45]

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[21:52:12]

murray_:

in any event : tuner card works – provable. mythtv-set finds channels when scanning. mythfrontend says "cannot tune to channel".

[21:52:14]

gbee:

right, so you're receiving a signal from two transmitters and mythtv is using the lower power set

[21:52:36]

murray_:

I'm not expert, but if I had to gamble, that would be my bet.

[21:53:06]

murray_:

I'm entirely open to ideas, patches, anything.

[21:54:18]

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[21:54:22]

gbee:

trying to think, but it's been a long day and I'm tired

[21:54:43]

murray_:

thanks :)

[21:55:45]

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[21:57:01]

gbee:

channels.conf input should work if you remove the bad entries, although EIT won't function – it's a possible temporary solution until you can get a better suggestion

[21:57:32]

murray_:

gbee : that would be 0.20, which I was using previously and it behaved exactly as you describe – tv viewing worked, no EIT.

[21:57:42]

murray_:

so I upgraded to svn head/trunk

[21:57:47]

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[21:58:01]

gbee:

murray_: ahh, tend to assume that most people in here are using 0.20

[21:58:03]

murray_:

now, you give it a channels.conf, it looks at it, blinks, and scans anyway.

[21:58:23]

gbee:

really? umm, ok ... that's news to me

[21:58:37]

murray_:

which seems a little daft – or at least, a little mis-leading given your in the "use my channels.conf" option ;)

[21:58:49]

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[21:59:29]

murray_:

don't quote me : just observed behaviour

[21:59:39]

gbee:

guess we're scanning based on the transport data in the channels.conf in order to get the informaton necessary for EIT to work

[21:59:45]

murray_:

it appears to do some sort of scanning after uploading my own channels.conf

[21:59:58]

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[22:00:34]

murray_:

I'm more than happy to run some tests if it might help...

[22:02:56]

gbee:

murray_: if you haven't had any help by tomorrow, I'll try and figure it out, right now I need to get an early night

[22:03:10]

murray_:

okay, thanks gbee – much appreciated

[22:03:28]

murray_:

is there anywhere better to ask than the mythtv-users irc/mailing list?

[22:03:43]

** bill2or3 goes home. **

[22:03:44]

murray_:

Reiver2003: multiple transmitters and picking the wrong one?

[22:03:50]

gbee:

sorry I can't be of more help, just that I can barely keep my eyes open at the moment

[22:03:59]

murray_:

:) kk.

[22:04:16]

murray_:

^ s/Reiver2003/re:/

[22:04:38]

murray_:

thanks for trying.

[22:06:32]

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[22:10:11]

murray_:

|Torg| regular Freeview DVB-T channels ... BBC One, Channel 4, Five etc

[22:10:33]

|Torg|:

they dont have encrypted PIDs or TIDs?

[22:10:42]

murray_:

scan /usr/share/doc/dvb-utils/examples/scan/dvb-t/uk-Craigkelly > /home/murray/.tzap/channels.conf

[22:11:02]

murray_:

I'm not sure what a PID or TID is I'm afraid.

[22:11:04]

|Torg|:

is this via a single LNB?

[22:11:13]

murray_:

LNB?

[22:11:25]

|Torg|:

Program ID, Table ID, the part of the transport that tells what chanels are in what transport stream

[22:11:30]

murray_:

the above scan produces a channels.conf with 2 entries for most channels

[22:11:45]

murray_:

one set has guard interval = 1/4, the other set = 1/32

[22:11:49]

|Torg|:

did you verify it with lyngsat?

[22:12:04]

murray_:

tzap & dvbstream on the command line can tune into the guard interval = 1/4 set no problems

[22:12:11]

murray_:

the 1/32 set appears to produce nothing

[22:12:34]

murray_:

when I poke in the dtv_multiplex mysql table, it looks to me like it's picked all the 1/32 multiplexes

[22:12:46]

murray_:

however, I am no expert here, so I may be mis-reading the data

[22:13:18]

|Torg|:

when you tune to a transponder, any, on a satelite it is *suposed* to tell you about all the transponders it has

[22:13:18]

murray_:

this is over the air digital tv, not satellite

[22:13:36]

murray_:

uk, dvb-t aka freeview

[22:13:37]

|Torg|:

unfortunatly they get changed on some and the enginners "forget" to update that list

[22:14:01]

|Torg|:

some, I know only of US ones, simply spit out everything they *could* do, not necessarily *can* do

[22:14:15]

|Torg|:

so its common to have unused and untunable transports, at least for me

[22:14:58]

|Torg|:

I dont know what you mean by guard interval tho, I have error correction rates (FEC) and inversion

[22:15:09]

murray_:

okay, but surely when mythtv scans, and populates the dtv_multiplex table, it would be better if it picked the ones that actually produced results with tzap, rather than the set that don't

[22:15:10]

murray_:

?

[22:15:10]

|Torg|:

other then that its freq, rate and polarity

[22:15:17]

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[22:15:38]

|Torg|:

mythtv has no way of telling what channels are on that sat, you need to give it starting info

[22:15:47]

|Torg|:

first you tell it what transponders are there

[22:15:54]

|Torg|:

then it tunes to each and scans them

[22:16:08]

|Torg|:

the result, should be, a complete list of all channels on the satalite you tuned to

[22:16:17]

|Torg|:

that transponder settting is called a transport

[22:16:24]

|Torg|:

and you can list them via lyngsat

[22:16:31]

murray_:

here are two lines from my channels.conf:

[22:16:33]

murray_:

BBC ONE Scot:570000000:INVERSION_AUTO:BANDWIDTH_8_MHZ:FEC_2_3:FEC_AUTO:QAM_16:TRANSMISSI ON_MODE_2K:GUARD_INTERVAL_1_4:HIERARCHY_NONE:201:202:4220

[22:16:33]

murray_:

BBC ONE Scot:570166670:INVERSION_AUTO:BANDWIDTH_8_MHZ:FEC_3_4:FEC_3_4:QAM_16:TRANSMISSIO N_MODE_2K:GUARD_INTERVAL_1_32:HIERARCHY_NONE:201:202:4220

[22:17:00]

murray_:

if I delete all the lines with GUARD_INTERVAL_1_4 (about 50%), and test with tzap, it won't tune into anything.

[22:17:18]

murray_:

if I repeat, deleteing all the GUARD_INTERVAL_1_32 lines instead, it works.

[22:17:27]

|Torg|:

what does tzap produce when you have legitimate channels

[22:17:42]

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[22:17:52]

murray_:

dtv_multiplex has a 'guard_interval' column, which appears to be all set to 1/32

[22:17:58]

|Torg|:

the differnce between my setup and yours is probbly the type of satleite, my channels.conf look quite differnt

[22:18:23]

murray_:

tzap, with legit channels, and the 1/32 lines removed, produces full working TV

[22:18:31]

murray_:

I can tune to all channels

[22:18:36]

murray_:

works lovely.

[22:19:03]

murray_:

perhaps, and the fact I'm not using satellite :)

[22:19:11]

|Torg|:

ok my guard intervals are all set to NULL

[22:19:28]

|Torg|:

like I said tho, its probbaly a differnt in the satts we use

[22:19:35]

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[22:19:54]

|Torg|:

if yoou can get myth to tune by editing the guard intervals, why not do that?

[22:20:03]

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[22:20:38]

murray_:

I am NOT able to get mythtv to work, regardless of what I do – it insists on using 1/32 as far as I can see.

[22:20:51]

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[22:20:56]

murray_:

I can change the values in the DB, but that doesn't improve anything

[22:21:11]

murray_:

my point about guard intervals ...

[22:21:40]

murray_:

... was just that tzap works with one set, and not with the other, and that mythtv insists on picking the broken set (as far as I can see)

[22:21:55]

murray_:

I don't think it is the guard intervals themselves that are the only problem here

[22:21:58]

murray_:

just a symptom

[22:22:22]

murray_:

however, I'm no expert.... happy to be proved wrong.

[22:22:39]

murray_:

I have tried changing the DB values, but it is hard to know what is a good change, and what isn't

[22:22:50]

|Torg|:

well like I said I use a totaly differnt set of satalites then you do, so I cant be sure

[22:24:18]

murray_:

|Torg| you use a totally different Layer 1 transport ;) You are using satellites from space, I'm using terrestrial radio waves from ground based transmitters ;)

[22:24:38]

|Torg|:

actually I use both :)

[22:24:54]

|Torg|:

I have qpsk sat cards, and atsc bcast cards

[22:25:06]

murray_:

I didn't think DVB had made it to the US? My apologies :)

[22:25:09]

|Torg|:

but I know my atsc is not the same as what you use either

[22:25:34]

|Torg|:

in fact my atsc is damn near empty for a mpexid, most of the columns are set to null

[22:26:21]

|Torg|:

sorry there 8vsb cars, but the system is called atsc

[22:28:30]

murray_:

bah, I give up for tonight. thanks for your help :)

[22:28:48]

|Torg|:

dont know if I helped, but your welcome anyway

[22:28:57]

murray_:

more searching for the needle in the haystack tomorrow ;)

[22:29:04]

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[23:08:28]

floppy12:

hello

[23:08:41]

Chicago:

In mythfrontend, while editing the Player Settings for video, I have the default DVD Player Command which is "Internal"... can I pass an argument to "internal" which results in the DVD not being viewed in fullscreen and zoomed... i.e. play it on my screen in it's native resolution in a window?

[23:09:36]

floppy12:

is there a way, to controll mythtv over ethernet? ive installed mythtvweb, but this only control recording and not viewing

[23:09:54]

kormoc:

floppy12, see the telnet interface section of the wiki

[23:10:26]

floppy12:

hmmm

[23:10:31]

kormoc:

and there's the telnet interface in mythweb as well

[23:10:42]

kormoc:

which sends keypresses to frontends

[23:10:48]

floppy12:

thank you

[23:15:11]

jedix:

*** glibc detected *** /usr/local/bin/mythbackend: double free or corruption (out): 0x981580e0 ***

[23:15:28]

jedix:

that seems uncool

[23:16:20]

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[23:16:55]

Chicago:

Also, is the Internal DVD player a xine derivative? I have my realtime-lsm module configured and working for regular videos. Will the Internal DVD player use the realtime priority as long as my /usr/bin/mythfrontend is chmodded g+s for the realtime group?

[23:18:49]

k-man:

how can I get more debugging info from the mythtv backend?

[23:19:03]

k-man:

i get some record failures and also some random crashes and I'd like to investigate why

[23:19:31]

kormoc:

Chicago, internal video player is myth's, using libavcodec, which mplayer also uses

[23:19:33]

Chicago:

Type mythbackend -v help

[23:19:45]

kormoc:

Chicago, but it's not a derivative

[23:21:08]

k-man:

Chicago, thanks

[23:21:34]

Chicago:

kormoc: Well, I am happy to know mplayer uses the realtime-lsm module because in the console log I see Realtime is active. How can I know for the Internal player... at this point the video and audio come off as extremely well synchronized. I'd like to know if the realtime module is being used or not and then play with my server polling rate (which is at 300Hz which is a good multiple of the 30fps). Is realtime being used?

[23:24:02]

kormoc:

Chicago, run the frontend in a window and it should output a timing method, that's the one it's using, and you can change it in the frontend's settings. Now, I'm not sure if RT is an option or not, but that's where it's set

[23:25:08]

kormoc:

Chicago, see the RT section of the offical docs as well, http://www.mythtv.org/docs/mythtv-HOWTO-5.html#ss5.4

[23:26:13]

Chicago:

kormoc: Okay, thanks. I'll look for possible arguments I can send to "Internal". Also, how about xvmc. I'm using xvmc and the nvidia card. Is the NVIDIA Linux Kernel Driver going to be getting scheduled slower then the mythfrontend process?

[23:27:43]

fryfrog:

Anyone watch much in the way of science/documentary shows?

[23:27:57]

fryfrog:

How It's Made, Modern Marvels, MythBusters, etc?

[23:29:31]

k-man:

sometimes programs fail to record for me, and it says the file is invalid or does not exist (iirc, i didn't write down the message)

[23:29:34]

Chicago:

fryfrong: I have regularly watched Modern Marvels and MythBusters in the past but have never seen or heard of "How It's Made".

[23:29:48]

k-man:

do you think the record debug messages would be enough to pick that up?

[23:30:14]

k-man:

or shall I just go "all" debug messages?

[23:30:26]

Chicago:

k-man: Look for quota or permission errors.

[23:30:37]

k-man:

Chicago, no, plenty of space

[23:30:51]

k-man:

Chicago, and i don't use quotas, and most recordings work

[23:31:15]

fryfrog:

k-man: firewire or what?

[23:31:31]

k-man:

fryfrog, i have 2 pci and 1 dual usb capture card

[23:31:33]

fryfrog:

I'm just looking for some good "science" or "documentary" type shows, looking for recomendations

[23:31:38]

fryfrog:

k-man: ah :/

[23:31:49]

k-man:

fryfrog, not sure how to determine if its always one device that fails

[23:32:09]

k-man:

is there a way to determine which tuner it tried to record on?

[23:32:09]

fryfrog:

k-man: you could stick your mythbackend in "-v all" or "-v important" mode and then when you get an error, find that portion of time in your logs

[23:32:21]

k-man:

fryfrog, yeah, i might try that

[23:32:33]

kormoc:

Chicago, personally, I think you're going way overboard here... the nvidia driver's schedule rate actually isn't related to it's display ability, as the phyical card is doing the drawing and myth is writing to a memory location. XvMC on the other hand changes that a tad, but not enough to really matter

[23:32:37]

fryfrog:

I think mine is always running in "-v important" and I just use log rotate to keep only a weeks worth of logs

[23:32:49]

k-man:

fryfrog, yeah, thats a good idea

[23:32:54]

k-man:

fryfrog, i might try that

[23:33:25]

fryfrog:

man, mythweb in svn head is quite awesome

[23:33:35]

fryfrog:

remind me to tell that to uh... xris?

[23:33:42]

fryfrog:

xris: mythweb in svn head is teh awesome :)

[23:35:51]

floppy12:

what a scat

[23:36:16]

floppy12:

my X will not run

[23:36:16]

fryfrog:

you mean, someone who likes having poop on them?

[23:36:23]

fryfrog:

oh, i guess not

[23:37:05]

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[23:46:08]

Chicago:

kormoc: Okay, thanks for your response. I agree these concerns are overboard. Hopefully those I can focus on them over time and squeeze the grape as much as possible. At the moment, my xorg-x11 platform is only detecting half the available VRAM on my VGA Controller and the MTRR settings I added to help correct acceleration still need work. So, I'm pleased the Internal DVD playback is excellent... but also thrilled to learn

[23:46:08]

Chicago:

howto push my possible configuration to the limit.

[23:46:36]

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[23:47:57]

kormoc:

Chicago, newer nvidia drivers use PAT rather the MTRR (still need MTRR support, but expands beyond it), so be careful with MTRR 'optimizations' with newer drivers

[23:48:57]

Chicago:

kormoc: This particular GeForce4 MX 460 is using the nvidia-legacy-drivers and does also use PAT. I'm unable to find out much about it though and don't know much about kernel arguments for memory mapping in general.

[23:50:36]

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[23:54:59]

fryfrog:

Does anyone make much use of recording groups?

[23:55:04]

fryfrog:

(or any?)

[23:58:35]

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